Ibogaine List Archives - 2004-03

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 9:17:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 4/1/04 12:57:29 AM, bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:

Howard,

“Not to say yes or no but, would you provide a citation.”

I came across these if it is of help but I would have to search.

See

“promising potential for derivatives such as nor-ibogaine as very effective,
less toxic anti-craving agents”

and

“Ibogaine produces whole body tremors and, at high doses (=”
src=”http://www.annalsnyas.org/math/ge.gif”
border=0>100 mg/kg), cerebellar damage; 18-MC does not produce these effects.
Ibogaine, but not 18-MC, decreases heart rate at high doses”

Brett

http://www.botanicalpreservationcorps.com/Audio_1.htm

106 Julie Staley [for Deborah Mash]: Ibogaine: Historical Overview, Clinical
Development and Future Directions
Here is a complete presentation of the state of research into the use of
iboga and ibogaine for heroin and cocaine dependency, the risks involved,
the pharmacology and metabolic mechanisms, duration, effects and the
promising
potential for derivatives such as nor-ibogaine as very effective, less
toxic anti-craving agents. 1 tape, $10*

http://www.annalsnyas.org/cgi/content/abstract/914/1/369?ijkey=b38c499ea5826c
0629b78098c16b538d9e6209f9&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha

Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences 914:369-386 (2000)
© 2000 New York Academy of Sciences
18-Methoxycoronaridine (18-MC) and Ibogaine: Comparison of Antiaddictive
Efficacy, Toxicity, and Mechanisms of Action STANLEY D. GLICKa, ISABELLE
M. MAISONNEUVE and KAREN K. SZUMLINSKI
Department of Pharmacology and Neuroscience, MC-136, Albany Medical College,
Albany, New York 12208, USA

aAddress for correspondence: Stanley Glick, Department of Pharmacology
and Neuroscience, MC-136, Albany Medical College, Albany, NY 12208. Tel.:
(518) 262-5303; fax: (518) 262-5799.
e-mail: glicks@mail.amc.edu

18-MC, a novel iboga alkaloid congener, is being developed as a potential
treatment for multiple forms of drug abuse. Like ibogaine (40 mg/kg), 18-MC
(40 mg/kg) decreases the intravenous self-administration of morphine and
cocaine and the oral self-administration of ethanol and nicotine in rats;
unlike ibogaine, 18-MC does not affect responding for a nondrug reinforcer
(water). Both ibogaine and 18-MC ameliorate opioid withdrawal signs. Both
ibogaine and 18-MC decrease extracellular levels of dopamine in the nucleus
accumbens, but only ibogaine increases extracellular levels of serotonin
in the nucleus accumbens. Both ibogaine and 18-MC block morphine-induced
and nicotine-induced dopamine release in the nucleus accumbens; only ibogaine
enhances cocaine-induced increases in accumbal dopamine. Both ibogaine
and 18-MC enhance the locomotor and/or stereotypic effects of stimulants.
Ibogaine attenuates, but 18-MC potentiates, the acute locomotor effects
of morphine; both compounds
attenuate morphine-induced locomotion in morphine-experienced rats. Ibogaine
produces whole body tremors and, at high doses (=”
src=”http://www.annalsnyas.org/math/ge.gif”
border=0>100 mg/kg), cerebellar damage; 18-MC does not produce these effects.
Ibogaine, but not 18-MC, decreases heart rate at high doses. While 18-MC
and ibogaine have similar affinities for kappa opioid and possibly nicotinic
receptors, 18-MC has much lower affinities than ibogaine for NMDA and sigma-2
receptors, sodium channels, and the 5-HT transporter. Both 18-MC and ibogaine
are sequestered in fat and, like ibogaine, 18-MC probably has an active
metabolite. The data suggest that 18-MC has a narrower spectrum of actions
and will have a substantially greater therapeutic index than ibogaine.

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 3/31/04 9:22:35 PM, bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:

Ibogaine is actually far more toxic than nor-ibogaine

Not to say yes or no but, would you provide a citation.

Thanks

Howard

Brett,

According to Glick not a single dose of 18-mc has been administered to a
human subject and according to Mash not a single dose of noribogaine has been
administered to a human subject. Glick reports lack of neurotoxicity and
cardiovascular effects in animal model for 18-mc. 18-mc is not noribogaine. I had
thought that Baumann and Mash I reported noribogaine to be less neurotoxic than
ibogaine but, in a brief review I really can’t find the hard data indicating
that. Possibly, Patrick or someone with science background will comment.
Mash indicates that “ibogaine” is not neurotoxic at therapeutic doses in the
monkey and administers ibogaine and not noribogaine at her treatment facility. Xu
and Ali with work in part accomplished at an FDA laboratory, the national
center for toxicological research indicate that there is no neurotoxicity of
ibogaine in the rat at therapeutic doses in man, 25mg/kg.

Further on the administration of noribogaine I haven’t seen any published
research indicating that noribogaine is long lasting. Glick and Hough indicate
that ibogaine is sequestered in fat and released over time rather than
noribogaine being a long lasting metabolite. The liver converts the released ibogaine
to noribogaine at higher levels than ibogaine. I do not believe any research
has been published demonstrating the administration of noribogaine is longer
lasting than ibogaine. My understanding is that Mash indicates that
noribogaine would be administered via a patch that would release it over time. I have
not seen studies indicating the administration of noribogaine that shows it to
be long lasting. By the way Glick has identified the primary 18-MC
metabolite as nor 18-MC.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 7:56:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,
“Not to say yes or no but, would you provide a citation.”

I came across these if it is of help but I would have to search.

See

“promising potential for derivatives such as nor-ibogaine as very effective, less toxic anti-craving agents”

and

“Ibogaine produces whole body tremors and, at high doses (100 mg/kg), cerebellar damage; 18-MC does not produce these effects. Ibogaine, but not 18-MC, decreases heart rate at high doses”

Brett

http://www.botanicalpreservationcorps.com/Audio_1.htm

106 Julie Staley [for Deborah Mash]: Ibogaine: Historical Overview, Clinical Development and Future Directions
Here is a complete presentation of the state of research into the use of iboga and ibogaine for heroin and cocaine dependency, the risks involved, the pharmacology and metabolic mechanisms, duration, effects and the promising potential for derivatives such as nor-ibogaine as very effective, less toxic anti-craving agents. 1 tape, $10*

http://www.annalsnyas.org/cgi/content/abstract/914/1/369?ijkey=b38c499ea5826c0629b78098c16b538d9e6209f9&keytype2=tf_ipsecsha

Annals of the New York Academy of Sciences 914:369-386 (2000)
Š 2000 New York Academy of Sciences
18-Methoxycoronaridine (18-MC) and Ibogaine: Comparison of Antiaddictive Efficacy, Toxicity, and Mechanisms of Action
STANLEY D. GLICKa, ISABELLE M. MAISONNEUVE and KAREN K. SZUMLINSKI
Department of Pharmacology and Neuroscience, MC-136, Albany Medical College, Albany, New York 12208, USA
aAddress for correspondence: Stanley Glick, Department of Pharmacology and Neuroscience, MC-136, Albany Medical College, Albany, NY 12208. Tel.: (518) 262-5303; fax: (518) 262-5799.  e-mail: glicks@mail.amc.edu
18-MC, a novel iboga alkaloid congener, is being developed as a potential treatment for multiple forms of drug abuse. Like ibogaine (40 mg/kg), 18-MC (40 mg/kg) decreases the intravenous self-administration of morphine and cocaine and the oral self-administration of ethanol and nicotine in rats; unlike ibogaine, 18-MC does not affect responding for a nondrug reinforcer (water). Both ibogaine and 18-MC ameliorate opioid withdrawal signs. Both ibogaine and 18-MC decrease extracellular levels of dopamine in the nucleus accumbens, but only ibogaine increases extracellular levels of serotonin in the nucleus accumbens. Both ibogaine and 18-MC block morphine-induced and nicotine-induced dopamine release in the nucleus accumbens; only ibogaine enhances cocaine-induced increases in accumbal dopamine. Both ibogaine and 18-MC enhance the locomotor and/or stereotypic effects of stimulants. Ibogaine attenuates, but 18-MC potentiates, the acute locomotor effects of morphine; both compounds attenuate morphine-induced locomotion in morphine-experienced rats. Ibogaine produces whole body tremors and, at high doses (100 mg/kg), cerebellar damage; 18-MC does not produce these effects. Ibogaine, but not 18-MC, decreases heart rate at high doses. While 18-MC and ibogaine have similar affinities for kappa opioid and possibly nicotinic receptors, 18-MC has much lower affinities than ibogaine for NMDA and sigma-2 receptors, sodium channels, and the 5-HT transporter. Both 18-MC and ibogaine are sequestered in fat and, like ibogaine, 18-MC probably has an active metabolite. The data suggest that 18-MC has a narrower spectrum of actions and will have a substantially greater therapeutic index than ibogaine.

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 3/31/04 9:22:35 PM, bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:

>Ibogaine is actually far more toxic than nor-ibogaine

Not to say yes or no but, would you provide a citation.

Thanks

Howard

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 7:42:38 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have taken in excess of a full mg. of lsd (on zero tolerance = > 1 month since the last dose.) I don’t know what is or was considered a ‘therapeutic’ dose but IMO less than 500 mcgs is a “party” dose of lsd. In my experience lsd doesn’t really become “therapeutic” untill you take enough to scare the piss out of yourself. And you never get used to it–at least I never do.

Same thing with mescaline. I’ve taken more than two grams and it is only at the higher ‘heroic doses’ that I feel a sustained long lasting benefit. 500 mg of mescaline is… fun.

I’m not looking for “fun.” The main reason I keep taking these brutal doses of various entheogens is the sustained anti-depressent effect I get in the days and weeks that follow. Believe me, if experience hadn’t already taught me that subjecting myself to such a brutal ordeal would reward me with several weeks of feeling “normal” then I would never put myself through it. No-one in their right mind would take 1 mg.+ of lsd just for the fun of it.

I’ve had a life-long problem with depression. I’ve tried just about every pharmaceutical anti-depresant as well as therapy, yoga, re-birthing, and well… pretty much everything I could think of. So far nothing works like entheogens.

That’s why I’m interested in ibogaine. What I’ve read makes me think that ibo might have a more sustained effect than anything else I’ve ever tried. If I have to do the full ‘initiatory’ dose of ibo once a month for the rest of my life I would be happily willing to do so if that meant I could just feel normal for the rest of the days of the month.

Scott

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 3:30:16 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

Scott,

The ibogaine doses in the 60s by weight were equivalent to the dose of
mescaline, both at that time considered full therapeutic doses as was the dose of
200mcg of lsd. As to the 1000mg dose of ibogaine I was projecting a theoretical
dose as I anticipate would be required of current ibogaine manufacturing.
So, in my opinion the matter of actual weight is not as important as that of
dose anticipated to provide full effect. I mean you are not going to take 500mgs
of lsd are you? mgs = milligrams, mcg = micrograms

Howard

In a message dated 3/31/04 8:45:53 PM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

>Ah, I see you already answered my question before I even asked!

>So, anyway you are talking about smaller relative doses of lsd and mescaline
>
>and a larger relative dose of ibogaine.
>
>
>
>
>
>I think what you said about people needing more ibogaine now than in the
>60
>
>s is absolutely fascinating. I’ve got no theory on that, but I have heard
>
>that westerners in general are often more tolerant of certain substances
>
>than the indigenous people who traditionally used the substance. Studies
>
>done on the traditional ayahuasca brews made by the shamans in the amazon
>
>showed levels of DMT that I would barely feel, but the natives apparently
>
>feel it QUITE strongly. Quite a tantalizing mystery!
>
>
>
>
>
>——-Original Message——-
>
>
>
>
>
>From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>
>
>Date: 3/31/2004 7:31:13 AM
>
>
>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>
>
>Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
>
>
>
>
>
>In a message dated 3/31/04 8:23:48 AM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:
>
>
>
>
>
>>”By how much?”
>
>
>>
>
>
>>That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
>
>
>>But it is an individual test for each person.
>
>
>>
>
>
>>The use of Syrian rue can be helpful after Ibo.
>
>
>>For some psychological side effects. It can give a happy high and extra
>
>
>>energy in a very natural way,M mushrooms can do that too as well as Aya.
>
>
>>And probably plenty of other plants.
>
>
>>
>
>
>>Ibo.
>
>
>>Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
>
>
>>For that reason save the rainforests.
>
>
>>
>
>
>>Sara
>
>
>
>
>
>>—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
>
>
>>Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
>
>
>>Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
>
>
>>Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>
>
>>Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
>
>
>>
>
>
>>
>
>
>>In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:
>
>
>>
>
>
>>>I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
>
>
>>>by how much?
>
>
>>
>
>
>>My only experience with ibogaine combinations were with ibogaine and lsd
>
>
>>or
>
>
>>mescaline.  With each combination the effect for me was being effected
>
>
>>by
>
>
>>ibogaine watching myself being effected by lsd or mescaline.  just me.
>
>
>>Ibogaine
>
>
>>dominated but, was distinct.
>
>
>>
>
>
>>Howard
>
>
>
>
>
>If you mean by how much did ibogaine dominate the experience, I cannot
>
>
>provide a percentage but, only to say that I interpreted the experience
>as
>
>an
>
>
>ibogaine experience during which I observed the actions of an lsd or
>
>mescaline
>
>
>experience.  That would be with 200mcg of lsd or 500mgs of mescaline.
>
>However, in
>
>
>the 60s for whatever reasons all persons needed only half the amount of
>
>
>ibogaine to reach the full therapeutic effect then they to today, across
>
>
>manufacturer and form (HCl, base, tannate, sulfate).  Therefore the actual
>
>experiences I
>
>
>was talking about were combinations of 500mg ibogaine with 500mgs mescaline
>
>or
>
>
>200mcg lsd.  500mgs of ibogaine produced effects during the 1960s ibogaine
>
>
>period that now require 1000mgs of ibogaine.  Anyone that can resolve that
>
>
>mystery is welcome. Those were my experiences and may be quite distinct
>for
>
>others.
>
>
>The 60s vs 80s/90s/2000 ibogaine experience the dosage issue was across
>many
>
>
>individuals and not my response alone.
>
>
>
>
>
>Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/
____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 7:26:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 4/1/04 12:17:07 AM, bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:

I do not have a citation for an observation.

What are the criteria for your observations? Anticipating you were not
running pharmacokinetic studies how do you make a determination of ibogaine or
noribogaine availability?

Howard

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 7:14:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,

I do not have a citation for an observation.

Brett

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 3/31/04 9:22:35 PM, bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:

>Ibogaine is actually far more toxic than nor-ibogaine

Not to say yes or no but, would you provide a citation.

Thanks

Howard

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] grant available. hahahahahaha calling dr kronkreit or eric taub and a phd assistant
Date: March 31, 2004 at 6:43:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE Media Contact: SAMHSA Press Office 301-443-8956

March 23, 2004
www.SAMHSA.gov

$2.5 Million Available for Peer-to-Peer Recovery Support Services

The Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration (SAMHSA) today
announced availability of FY 2004 funds for grants to deliver and evaluate
peer-to-peer recovery support services. The Recovery Community Services Program
will help prevent relapse and promote sustained recovery from alcohol and drug
use disorders for people with a history of alcohol and/or drug problems who
are in or seeking recovery, along with family members and significant others
who will be both the providers and recipients of recovery support services.

It is expected that approximately $2.5 million will be available to fund up
to 7 awards. The annual award amount is expected to be $350,000 for up to 4
years. The actual award amount may vary, depending on the availability of
funds. The grants will be awarded by SAMHSA’s Center for Substance Abuse Treatment
(CSAT).

WHO CAN APPLY: Eligible applicants are domestic public and private non-profit
entities, including state, local or tribal governments, public or private
universities and colleges, community-and faith–based organizations, and tribal
organizations. This program is not designed to fund professional services.
Eligible services are those delivered by peers to help prevent relapse and
promote long-term recovery, or to reduce the effects of relapse by providing early
intervention and referral to treatment, where necessary.

HOW TO APPLY: Application for No. TI 04-008, are available by calling
SAMHSA’s clearinghouse at 1-800-729-6686, or by downloading from the SAMHSA web site
at www.samhsa.gov. Click on “grant opportunities.”

APPLICATION DUE DATE: May 18, 2004

ADDITIONAL INFORMATION: Applicants with questions on program issues should
contact

Catherine D. Nugent at (301) 443-2662 or e-mail to cnugent@samhsa.gov. For
questions on grant management issues, contact Kathleen Sample at (301) 443-9667
or e-mail to ksample@samhsa.gov.

SAMHSA, is a public health agency within the U.S. Department of Health and
Human Services. The agency is responsible for improving the accountability,
capacity and effectiveness of the nation’s substance abuse prevention, addictions
treatment and mental health service delivery system.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 6:30:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/31/04 9:22:35 PM, bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:

Ibogaine is actually far more toxic than nor-ibogaine

Not to say yes or no but, would you provide a citation.

Thanks

Howard

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 6:28:31 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Scott,

Howard

In a message dated 3/31/04 8:45:53 PM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

Ah, I see you already answered my question before I even asked!

So, anyway you are talking about smaller relative doses of lsd and mescaline

and a larger relative dose of ibogaine.

I think what you said about people needing more ibogaine now than in the
60

s is absolutely fascinating. I’ve got no theory on that, but I have heard

that westerners in general are often more tolerant of certain substances

than the indigenous people who traditionally used the substance. Studies

done on the traditional ayahuasca brews made by the shamans in the amazon

showed levels of DMT that I would barely feel, but the natives apparently

feel it QUITE strongly. Quite a tantalizing mystery!

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Date: 3/31/2004 7:31:13 AM

To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 8:23:48 AM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

“By how much?”

That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.

But it is an individual test for each person.

The use of Syrian rue can be helpful after Ibo.

For some psychological side effects. It can give a happy high and extra

energy in a very natural way,M mushrooms can do that too as well as Aya.

And probably plenty of other plants.

Ibo.

Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.

For that reason save the rainforests.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–

Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]

Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04

Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so

by how much?

My only experience with ibogaine combinations were with ibogaine and lsd

mescaline. With each combination the effect for me was being effected

ibogaine watching myself being effected by lsd or mescaline. just me.

Ibogaine

dominated but, was distinct.

Howard

If you mean by how much did ibogaine dominate the experience, I cannot

provide a percentage but, only to say that I interpreted the experience
as

ibogaine experience during which I observed the actions of an lsd or

mescaline

experience. That would be with 200mcg of lsd or 500mgs of mescaline.

However, in

the 60s for whatever reasons all persons needed only half the amount of

ibogaine to reach the full therapeutic effect then they to today, across

manufacturer and form (HCl, base, tannate, sulfate). Therefore the actual

experiences I

was talking about were combinations of 500mg ibogaine with 500mgs mescaline

200mcg lsd. 500mgs of ibogaine produced effects during the 1960s ibogaine

period that now require 1000mgs of ibogaine. Anyone that can resolve that

mystery is welcome. Those were my experiences and may be quite distinct
for

others.

The 60s vs 80s/90s/2000 ibogaine experience the dosage issue was across
many

individuals and not my response alone.

Howard

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 6:11:37 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

lol! You’re welcome.

But remember to be careful–the idea is not to take a dose of syrian rue and then a normal dose of mushrooms or mescaline–the idea is to take a dose of syrian rue and then take a much smaller than normal dose of mushrooms or mescaline and thus achieve the same effects with lower toxicity and lower cost.

Also remember the dietary restrictions. Although harmaline and harmine are very short acting maoi’s there is still some danger. The best bet is not to eat anything starting a couple hours before taking the rue and continuing until at least 4 hours after.

Note: even if you eat a big hunk of cheese while on the harmaline you will probably be fine. Even on pharmaceutical long term maoi’s most people never experienced the ‘tyramine allergy.’ But why take the chance? Why risk getting an agonizing headache which could even possibly lead to death–and particularly why risk going through that while on mushrooms or mescaline? Talk about a ‘bad trip!’

Scott

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 12:28:27 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

Thanks for the info.
Sara
Van: Scott [mailto:scottmarkwell@toast.net]  Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 22:07 Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com Onderwerp: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

The reason I asked is that harmaline makes psilocybin about three times more potent. This is because psilocybin is partially broken down in the stomach by MAO–a small dose of syrian rue 15-30 minutes before inhibits MAO from breaking it down and thus allows the full amount of alkaloid to enter the bloodstream from the stomach. Also everyone knows that an MAO inhibitor is absolutely necessary to get any effect from oral DMT (Aya).

I’ve also heard from reliable sources that harmaline has a similar effect on mescaline–makes it 2-3 times stronger by preventing MAO from breaking any of it down in the stomach–though I have no experience with that combination.

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 12:24:13 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

“By how much?”

That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
But it is an individual test for each person.

The use of Syrian rue can be helpful after Ibo.
For some psychological side effects. It can give a happy high and extra
energy in a very natural way,M mushrooms can do that too as well as Aya.
And probably plenty of other plants.

Ibo.
Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
For that reason save the rainforests.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

>I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
>by how much?

My only experience with ibogaine combinations were with ibogaine and lsd or
mescaline. With each combination the effect for me was being effected by
ibogaine watching myself being effected by lsd or mescaline. just me.
Ibogaine
dominated but, was distinct.

Howard

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From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 4:41:04 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Brett,

That is disappointing to hear, but ah well. But I actually wasn’t looking for a way to increase the ibogaine so much as I was looking for a way to decrease the dose and still get the same effects. As you know, the stuffs expensive so it would have been nice if I could have achieved similar effects by taking 1/2 to 1/3 as much. Oh well.

Scott

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 1:22:31 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

Scott

Harmaline will have no such effect on ibogaine. In effect you seem to be looking to increast the amount of ibogaine, this isn’t exactly something you might really want to do. Ibogaine is actually far more toxic than nor-ibogaine, the primary metabolite of ibogaine – which (nutshell) stays bound to receptors (and wherever else it may be) for long periods of time afer dosing. You jack up the ibogaine say by dosing with a bunch of tylenol (or whatever) along with the ibo (and interfere with metabolism), you get more ibogaine floating in your blood, this can be a bad thing. 1 out of 10 people are poor metabolizers of ibgaine, they tend to get awfully hard (one clinic refuses to treat them), fast metabolizers don’t trip as hard but make a bunch of nor-ibogaine quickly. Typically ibogaine is out of the blood in 6 hours from peek (if I recall correctly), or about 8 hours after taking it. This seems to be what is causing the visions and is right in line with the time frame – a WAG on my part of what is happening. Ibogaine trips are NOT FUN, it is after that is fun. So every now and then you get someone TRIPPING on ibogaine for several days, or real TRIPPING – normally it ain’t nothing like a “trip”. I suppose you could take a drug to speed metabolism of ibogaine to nor-ibogaine and reduce the trip some.

Be careful what you mix MAOIs or ibogaine with.

Brett

Scott <scottmarkwell@toast.net> wrote:
The reason I asked is that harmaline makes psilocybin about three times more potent. This is because psilocybin is partially broken down in the stomach by MAO–a small dose of syrian rue 15-30 minutes before inhibits MAO from breaking it down and thus allows the full amount of alkaloid to enter the bloodstream from the stomach. Also everyone knows that an MAO inhibitor is absolutely necessary to get any effect from oral DMT (Aya).

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 12:24:13 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

“By how much?”

That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
But it is an individual test for each person.

Ibo.
Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
For that reason save the rainforests.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

>I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
>by how much?

Howard

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From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 4:20:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Scott

Be careful what you mix MAOIs or ibogaine with.

Brett

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 12:24:13 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

“By how much?”

That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
But it is an individual test for each person.

Ibo.
Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
For that reason save the rainforests.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

>I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
>by how much?

Howard

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From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 3:28:47 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ah, I see you already answered my question before I even asked!

So, anyway you are talking about smaller relative doses of lsd and mescaline and a larger relative dose of ibogaine.

I think what you said about people needing more ibogaine now than in the 60’s is absolutely fascinating. I’ve got no theory on that, but I have heard that westerners in general are often more tolerant of certain substances than the indigenous people who traditionally used the substance. Studies done on the traditional ayahuasca brews made by the shamans in the amazon showed levels of DMT that I would barely feel, but the natives apparently feel it QUITE strongly. Quite a tantalizing mystery!

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 7:31:13 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 8:23:48 AM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

>”By how much?”
>
>That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
>But it is an individual test for each person.
>
>The use of Syrian rue can be helpful after Ibo.
>For some psychological side effects. It can give a happy high and extra
>energy in a very natural way,M mushrooms can do that too as well as Aya.
>And probably plenty of other plants.
>
>Ibo.
>Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
>For that reason save the rainforests.
>
>Sara

>—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
>Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
>Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
>Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
>
>
>In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:
>
>>I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
>>by how much?
>
>My only experience with ibogaine combinations were with ibogaine and lsd
>or
>mescaline. With each combination the effect for me was being effected
>by
>ibogaine watching myself being effected by lsd or mescaline. just me.
>Ibogaine
>dominated but, was distinct.
>
>Howard

If you mean by how much did ibogaine dominate the experience, I cannot
provide a percentage but, only to say that I interpreted the experience as an
ibogaine experience during which I observed the actions of an lsd or mescaline
experience.  That would be with 200mcg of lsd or 500mgs of mescaline.  However, in
the 60s for whatever reasons all persons needed only half the amount of
ibogaine to reach the full therapeutic effect then they to today, across
manufacturer and form (HCl, base, tannate, sulfate).  Therefore the actual experiences I
was talking about were combinations of 500mg ibogaine with 500mgs mescaline or
200mcg lsd.  500mgs of ibogaine produced effects during the 1960s ibogaine
period that now require 1000mgs of ibogaine.  Anyone that can resolve that
mystery is welcome. Those were my experiences and may be quite distinct for others.
The 60s vs 80s/90s/2000 ibogaine experience the dosage issue was across many
individuals and not my response alone.

Howard

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 3:25:17 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the info.
Sara
Van: Scott [mailto:scottmarkwell@toast.net]  Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 22:07 Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com Onderwerp: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 12:24:13 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

“By how much?”

That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
But it is an individual test for each person.

Ibo.
Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
For that reason save the rainforests.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

>I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
>by how much?

Howard

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From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 3:18:53 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve never enjoyed harmaline for its own sake, but I know that a small (sub-psychoactive) dose of harmaline strongly potentiates several other substances because it is an MAO inhibitor. Harmaline (or harmine) is necessary for Aya and I know for certain it makes mushrooms 2-3 times stronger and I’ve heard from reliable sources it similarly potentiates mescaline.

I guess the real question is does MAO in the stomach interfere with ibogaine as it does other tryptamine like substances? If it does then harmaline should strongly potentiate it. If ibogaine is not effected by MAO then harmaline should make no difference.

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 7:09:53 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

Harmaline is similar in structure and effect (if there is anything) to ibogaine. Ibogaine however ibogaine is ibogaine, IMO there really isn’t anything to add to it to make it more ibogaine or better ibogaine. You can do harmaline for the harmaline, not to make the ibogaine better or make more ibogaine/cheaper ibogaine. I am not sure “potentiates” is the word I would use, more like mixing 2 similar drugs. What I got when I tried it was strange ibogaine, I didn’t care for it. What I hear when people talk trying to make the iboga better/cheaper by doing something to it (creative) they almost invariably make it worse. I would STRONGLY suggest nixing that idea till you are experienced with the substance and then very carefully, maybe on a smaller scale to see what happens and not a full-blown iboga trip. Iboga is a hand-full as it is, things can go wrong (like lack of heart beat and breathing), it is extremely long and arduous, I am not sure I would want anyting like potentiating and I don’t think it is necessary or desirable – for me. If anything it is too much, just an enormous amount of information, thoughts and feelings to process. Anyway, no it didn’t “potentiate” it, like I said, strange iboga, it did seem to add to the effect though negatively in my case or that time (I was none too healthy).

Brett

Scott <scottmarkwell@toast.net> wrote:
I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so by how much?

Thanks,
Scott

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From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 3:09:15 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Just out of curiosity– what were the relative doses? (If you can remember… if not it is just idle curiousity.)

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/30/2004 10:05:22 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

>I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
>by how much?

Howard

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From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 3:07:11 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/31/2004 12:24:13 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

“By how much?”

That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
But it is an individual test for each person.

Ibo.
Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
For that reason save the rainforests.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

>I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
>by how much?

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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<)[%]

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From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 2:50:09 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

in the 60s for whatever reasons all persons needed only half the amount of
ibogaine to reach the full therapeutic effect then they to today

I wonder if MSG could be the explanation – wasn’t it put in
processed food in those days? Or some other food additive that
was discontinued.

Bill

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Forward
Date: March 31, 2004 at 2:06:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

erik@zoneedit.com wrote:

N-acetylcysteine in high doses cures cocaine addiction.

Anyone know about this?

Dana/cnw

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 10:29:46 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/31/04 8:23:48 AM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

“By how much?”

That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
But it is an individual test for each person.

Ibo.
Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
For that reason save the rainforests.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
by how much?

My only experience with ibogaine combinations were with ibogaine and lsd
or
mescaline. With each combination the effect for me was being effected
by
ibogaine watching myself being effected by lsd or mescaline. just me.
Ibogaine
dominated but, was distinct.

Howard

If you mean by how much did ibogaine dominate the experience, I cannot
provide a percentage but, only to say that I interpreted the experience as an
ibogaine experience during which I observed the actions of an lsd or mescaline
experience. That would be with 200mcg of lsd or 500mgs of mescaline. However, in
the 60s for whatever reasons all persons needed only half the amount of
ibogaine to reach the full therapeutic effect then they to today, across
manufacturer and form (HCl, base, tannate, sulfate). Therefore the actual experiences I
was talking about were combinations of 500mg ibogaine with 500mgs mescaline or
200mcg lsd. 500mgs of ibogaine produced effects during the 1960s ibogaine
period that now require 1000mgs of ibogaine. Anyone that can resolve that
mystery is welcome. Those were my experiences and may be quite distinct for others.
The 60s vs 80s/90s/2000 ibogaine experience the dosage issue was across many
individuals and not my response alone.

Howard

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 10:08:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brett

Scott <scottmarkwell@toast.net> wrote:
I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so by how much?

Thanks,
Scott

____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

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Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] ?? Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 31, 2004 at 10:06:25 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

lol, i wasn’t even on-line last night. Perhaps i’ll update my anti-virus. A chew : )
-Jason

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 31, 2004 at 7:45:57 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ethnogarden – I thought it was obvious…

A-

—– Original Message —–
From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 6:41 AM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine]First Timer

Who are you talking about AG?

—–Message d’origine—–
De : AG [mailto:adamg@013.net.il]
Envoyé : jeudi 1 avril 2004 01:12
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

–side note — about half a year ago I got in touch with them, after they
posted here how they were once more about to offer rootbark- and that’s
after the extensive quality-testing that their new supply was at the time
undergoing – and I asked for price breaks- their reply was something
outrageous- ie I’d have to dish out $CAN 150,000 to get a discount and a
pretty miserable one at that… all of which really said; they keep the
really good shit for themselves…

A-

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 4:47 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

I also heard they were reputable but it is difficult to get a good
supply
of
rootbark, and maintain it, and the stuff does go off. www.vegetaux.com
sound
like they have great contacts but are more expensive.

Is there anyone from Ethnogarden on the list who would care to comment,
perhaps?

Nick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 31, 2004 at 9:41:46 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Who are you talking about AG?

—–Message d’origine—–
De : AG [mailto:adamg@013.net.il]
Envoyé : jeudi 1 avril 2004 01:12
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

A-

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 4:47 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

I also heard they were reputable but it is difficult to get a good supply
of
rootbark, and maintain it, and the stuff does go off. www.vegetaux.com
sound
like they have great contacts but are more expensive.

Is there anyone from Ethnogarden on the list who would care to comment,
perhaps?

Nick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

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From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 31, 2004 at 6:11:59 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A-

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2004 4:47 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

I also heard they were reputable but it is difficult to get a good supply
of
rootbark, and maintain it, and the stuff does go off. www.vegetaux.com
sound
like they have great contacts but are more expensive.

Is there anyone from Ethnogarden on the list who would care to comment,
perhaps?

Nick

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 31, 2004 at 7:47:47 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I also heard they were reputable but it is difficult to get a good supply of
rootbark, and maintain it, and the stuff does go off. www.vegetaux.com sound
like they have great contacts but are more expensive.

Is there anyone from Ethnogarden on the list who would care to comment,
perhaps?

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 9:19 PM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine]First Timer

Ethnogarden in Canada…many said they were quite reputable, and I got
50g just to make sure 🙁

Hi Brooke
Where did you get your Iboga from and what quantity, are you sure it
was
Rootbark?

—–Message d’origine—–
De : Brooke [mailto:brooke@blue.netnation.com]
Envoyé : dimanche 28 mars 2004 08:03
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves
of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

I really don’t want to think of this undertaking as a ‘wasted’
experience…I was so hoping to have some serious revelations and
emotional breakthroughs…I’m trying my best not to be disappointed –
maybe someone out there can tell me a similar story of iboga
frustration???

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE DOPE
FOR
BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of
that!
Callie

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] slavery
Date: March 31, 2004 at 3:58:41 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sh’lach Et Ami! Let My People Go!

During this Passover season as Jews around the globe celebrate their escape from slavery in Egypt, we should take special note that, sadly, slavery is not history, that indeed there are people in bondage, real bondage, on every continent. Every year during this time, Jews retell their exodus from Egypt to remember their own enslavement, and, therefore think of those people who are still in the worst of circumstances.
The commandment of pid’yon shivu’im – of freeing captives – is one of the highest mitzvot in Jewish in law. It is a call for us to rise up against slavery and tyranny in our own time.
Most people don’t know that slavery still exists. But it does. From Khartoum to Calcutta, from Brazil to Bangladesh, men, women, and children live and work as slaves or in slave-like conditions. There are as many as 30 million people in bondage – more than any other point in history.
If, at your seder, you wish to recognize those who remain in bondage, leave an empty chair again this year. And on this holiday when Jews are commanded to relive the bitter experience of slavery, place a fourth matzah with the traditional three and read this prayer written by Rabbi Joel Soffin of Temple Shalom in Succasunna, NJ.
Holding the Fourth Matzah
“We raise this fourth matzah to remind ourselves that slavery still exists, that people are still being bought and sold as property, that the Divine image within them is yet being denied. We make room at our seder table and in our hearts for those in southern Sudan and in Mauritania who are now where we have been.

We have known such treatment in our own history. We have suffered while others stood by and pretended not to see, not to know. We have eaten the bitter herb; we have been taken from our families and brutalized. We have experienced the horror of being forcibly converted. In the end, we have come to know in our very being that none can be free until all are free.
And so, we commit and recommit ourselves to work for the freedom of these people. May the taste of this ‘bread of affliction’ remain in our mouths until they can eat in peace and security. Knowing that all people are Yours, O G-d, we will urge our government and all governments to do as You once commanded Pharaoh on our behalf: ‘Shalach et Ami! Let MY People Go!’
For more Passover resources and materials, visit www.iabolish.com/passover

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 3:22:57 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“By how much?”

That’s a new way of thinking, Hum… There are ways to find that out.
But it is an individual test for each person.

Ibo.
Dominates. It’s the tree of life and knowledge.
For that reason save the rainforests.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 31 maart 2004 8:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
by how much?

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 31, 2004 at 1:03:36 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/31/04 4:05:23 AM, scottmarkwell@toast.net writes:

I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so
by how much?

Howard

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] tryptophan
Date: March 30, 2004 at 11:55:01 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Banning tryptophan because of one bad batch from Japan makes about as much sense as it would make to ban apple juice because of what happened at Odwalla, or to ban all beef products because of past e-coli incidents or because of mad-cow disease. I think the FDA saw an opportunity to ban a natural supplement that competes with expensive pharmaceuticals and took that opportunity out of loyalty to the pharmaceutical companies.

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/27/2004 2:02:01 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] tryptophan

> The bad batch from Japan did indeed give l-tryptophan a bad name.

“L-tryptophan was pulled from the market in 1990 after a contaminated
form of the product, made in Japan, was associated with nearly 1,500
cases of eosinophilia myalgia (EMS), a rare and occasionally deadly
blood disease. More than 30 deaths occurred. ”
http://www.cnn.com/HEALTH/9808/31/tryptophan/

Here’s an FDA page on the subject (from google on tryptophan japan):

http://vm.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/ds-tryp1.html

The liver-cleanse site says l-ornithine is good for sleep – I
certainly slept well on it when liver cleansing, haven’t tried
it otherwise.

Bill

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Harmaline potentiation
Date: March 30, 2004 at 11:04:11 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve heard the harmaline potentiates ibogaine–is that true? and if so by how much?

Thanks,
Scott

____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 25, 2004 at 10:26:58 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

To All,
This effects more people then you would think. Weither or not Marc wanted to be arrested, I don’t know, I don’t know his motives or any of that.

What I do know is nobody on this list was willing to do ANYTHING for me before I met Marc and he did treated me FOR FREE (paging Dr. Mash) which nobody on this list would have nor will they do.

But I’m sure that you all have moral authority and high ground on this issue.

The more important thing to me is if money that would have gone to help people at the ibogatherapyhouse now has to be reallocated to legal fees…again who knows. Sometimes I think I’m the most selfish person in the world, then I read this list and feel much better.
-Jason Bursey
—–Original Message—–
From: Carla Barnes [mailto:carlambarnes@yahoo.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004, 8:05 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan

LMAO!!!! 🙂 Thanks Sara, I know it’s not funny but
that was very funny!

I think Marc is a great guy but I also don’t
understand what is the difference between this arrest
and all his other arrests? Doesn’t it just mean that
he’ll have more chances to talk to the press? Isn’t
that what all of this is about in the first place??
He’s arrested again for something to do with pot,
which is what Marc is always arrested for. It’s not
like he held up someone with a gun or is facing
charges that are any different then the ones he is
usually arrested for.

‘Marc Emery arrested for pot! For the 100th time!’
Maybe Marc should get a award? 😉

Marc if you’re reading this, love to you! Think what
you do is great and I’ll cc that to that huge list
too! Why not!

Forgive me if this is somehow serious and I’m having a
hard time taking it seriously!

Callie very sorry to hear about your insurance! I
would at least do what Howard suggested, he knows a
lot about methadone maintence and how it all works!

Carla B

— Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
Oh yes, there is a difference, before he was
aressted smoking a bong not
passing a joint.
A Bong is made mostly of glass and a joint of
rolling papers.RIGHT?

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Vector Vector
[mailto:vector620022002@yahoo.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 24 maart 2004 3:28
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of
Pot” arrested in
Saskatchewan

I don’t mean to sound insensitive which is what
everyone always says
right before they are right 😉 I know sometimes I
have the tendency to
think of a group of people on this list as these
cool maniacs who do
crazy things, Marc is for sure in that category with
Patrick, Preston,
Dave Hunter, all the rest. I forget sometimes or a
lot of the time that
there are people behind all that.

Let me ask what I mean to say, is this a big deal or
something? I mean
doesn’t Marc get himself arrested 5 or 10 times a
year, mostly on
purpose? When he is arrested I have the idea that
there are always a
army of lawyers and at least a few camera crews
there too.

Is this bust somehow different?

Not being obnoxious, only curious. Is this serious
in some special way
that makes it different then the last 5 times Marc
got busted?

.:vector:.

— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
HI all,
Bad news. I wish the best for Marc and the others.
Peace,
Preston

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Sources for rootbark?
Date: March 30, 2004 at 10:19:25 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I had been planning on purchasing some rootbark from ethnogarden but after reading about Brooks experience I’m having doubts. Has anyone had any good experiences with their product?

What about vegetaux.com? Does anyone know anything about them?

Thanks,
Scott
____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: March 30, 2004 at 10:10:40 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks–I think I sort of get it… at least as well as I possibly can until I’ve had the experience myself.

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/30/2004 12:07:52 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

mind you, I’ve only had one ibo experience, so my description can only account for that, which isn’t really a well designed comparison. It’s just been my experience so far and on that note, it isn’t really much of a description for an experience that has affected me as profoundly as it has.

and to be honest, i really didn’t feel so much scolded as i was directly guided to looking at some deeper issues that i needed to focus on and understand. ibo seemed to also have a cryptic, symbolic language that takes time to integrate and so does aya but the way they represent themselves in my experience seem different somehow.

– visions were different (ibo more like vivid dreams and aya more patterned, geometric and futuristic)

– body sensations were different (ibo felt slightly out of bodied & flowing, aya more electrified and travelling through various circuits in the body like lightpulses)

– sounds very acute and crystalline on ibo, on aya more acute on the internal dialogue level, but i also had the pleasure of having beautiful music played and sung (icaros during the aya) on both journeys that made the whole experience very grounding and guided by it, in a sense.

in short, you’re right: everybody is different

and all experience is valid.

~inflowe~

—– Original Message —–
From: “Scott”
Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:54:22 -0800 (Pacific Standard Time)
To:
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

This is fascinating that both you and Steven experience Aya as more ‘maternal’ because that’s not how I experience Aya, but maybe I should mention I’ve never done the actual Cappi vine, I’ve only done analogs with Syrian Rue (extract of 2-3 grams) and Jurema Preta (extract of 8+ grams.) (I’m about 140 lbs.)

But I have noticed that on 5 grams of Jurema it is much more “warm and fuzzy–” about like 2 grams of very good mushrooms or a couple hundred mcgs. of lsd, only of course very different in it’s ‘charector.’ On a lower dose it can feel very ‘maternal,’ but unfortunately I’ve never found lower doses to be of that much benefit (maybe I don’t need mothering?).

On 8+ grams of Jurema the experience could well be described as big daddy in the sky grabbing you by the scruff of the neck and shaking you violently for six hours while lecturing you on things that… just make a WHOLE lot of sense. At least that’s my experience, and I know everyone is different.

Is a lower dose of Ibo more maternal, or is it always paternal?

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/29/2004 11:54:30 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

aya/ibo

new school/old school

futurshapes/ancient past

When on aya, I asked her about my work with iboga and she said to me: ‘yes, i know iboga’ and showed me this vision of a caricature which popped up out of a cylindrical portal kinda dealio looking much like a smiley carved wooden voodoo doll that was very distinctly different from any other aya vision/landscape that surrounded it. It made me laugh pretty hard actually, as I had always had a heavy sense about Iboga and it helped me to lighten this up a little. The sense I got was that aya and ibo are old friends, they just work in different ways.

I agree with the mama’s embrace/papa’s schoolin’ comparison.

Both had beautiful things to show me and were very good at also scolding me for the things I needed to look at or do. Just in different ways…

—– Original Message —–
From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 16:11:24 -0800
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

> Ayahuasca/Iboga
>
> mother/father
>
> _________________________________________________________________
> Get reliable access on MSN 9 Dial-up. 3 months for the price of 1!
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>
>
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>

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Opiate Addiction News: Scotland, Malaysia, US, Netherlands & more
Date: March 30, 2004 at 9:40:17 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thought you all might like to see this. Many of you probably received this e-mail today as I did.
Callie

O P I A T E A D D I C T I O N R X,
March 2004 Ref:122

———————————————–
SPOTLIGHT:
———————————————–

USA: METHADONE TURNS 40

This year marks an important milestone in
methadone treatment history. Forty years
ago, Drs. Nyswander and Dole initiated methadone studies with 22 “subjects” on a closed research unit at Rockefeller University. Today there are an estimated half-million patients treated with this medication in almost 50 countries around the world (see below), and many tens of thousands more being treated with other opiate agonists.

———————————————–
NEWS FROM AROUND THE WORLD:
———————————————–

METHADONE AVAILABLE FOR OPIATE DEPENDENCE TREATMENT IN 47 COUNTRIES, according to a report by INDRO e.V. Deputy Director Ralf Gerlach, Muenster, Germany. This website welcomes corrections, additions, deletions that readers feel should be made to this compilation. For the report,
http://www.indro-online.de/nia.htm

NETHERLANDS: CONSERVATIVE CDA GOVERNMENT
SUPPORTS EXPANSION OF “FREE HEROIN PROGRAM”

The Rotterdam newspaper De Volksrant of March 5, 2004, reports that the Dutch parliament has voted not only to continue, but to markedly expand (from 300-1,000) the two-year pilot program providing free heroin to users. The director of the program, Dr. Wim Van den Brink, cited major improvements in physical and mental health of participants, as well as a sharp drop in criminal activities. For more information:
http://stopthedrugwar.org/chronicle/328/heroin.shtml

SCOTLAND: GLASGOW FACES CRISIS
IN METHADONE SERVICE

BBC reports (March 26) that a proposal to rely on “programs” rather than GPs for methadone treatment threatens the continued care of “huge numbers” and a resultant crime wave. Currently some 5000 of the 6000 patients receiving methadone in Glasgow receive their care from GPs in their private offices. For full story : http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/scotland/3570073.stm

MALAYSIA: GOVERNMENT BEGINS OPIATE
SUBSTITUTION TREATMENT

In recognition of the high risks of relapse and the spread of bloodborne diseases among injecting opiate addicts returning to the community from prison, the Malaysian government has agreed to provide methadone maintenance treatment to ex-offenders in a
community-based setting. For more information:
http://opiateaddictionrx.info/whatsnew.asp?id=541

USA: FEDERAL GOVERNMENT ISSUES
STATEMENT: “Methadone Deaths Not Linked to
Misuse of Methadone from Treatment Programs” The conclusions reached in May, 2003, by an expert panel convened by the key government agency responsible for drugs were finally released in February, 2004. Bottom line: when it comes to diverted methadone contributing to overdose deaths, maintenance patients treated for opioid dependence “are not the culprits.” In the interim, increasing controls (e.g., on take-home “privileges”) were implemented that affect a great many patients; nothing suggests that those steps, taken in response to what is now considered a non-problem, will be reversed.

For the official statement accompanying release of the panel’s findings:
http://www.samhsa.gov/news/newsreleases/040206nr_deaths.htm

NORWAY: UPDATE – STILL NOT GOOD!

Opiate dependent Norwegians desperately
seeking methadone maintenance continue
to face waiting periods of 1-2 years. Those who undertook the travel to neighboring Denmark in search of care are now facing the elimination of that option as well. For more information:
http://opiateaddictionrx.info/whatsnew.asp?id=537

SEND US YOUR OPINION
meoconnor@chpnet.org

———————————————–
UPCOMING CONFERENCES:

15th International Conference on the
Reduction of Drug Related Harm
April 20-24, 2004
Melbourne, Australia
http://www.ihra.net

International Symposium on HIV & Emerging Infectious Diseases
June 3-5, 2004
Toulon, France
http://www.avps.org/2003/hiv.htm

Ethnicity & Addiction
16th International Congress on Addiction
September 8 – 10
Vienna, Austria
http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/vienna.pdf

The Third International Conference on
Substitution Treatment and Rehabilitation
of Drug Addiction
September 28-30, 2004
Katowice, Poland Web site coming soon

American Association of Treatment of
Opioid Dependence
October 16-20, 2004
Orlando, Florida, USA

AATOD Homepage

VI European Conference
European Opiate Addiction Treatment Association
November 1-3, 2004
Paris, France
http://www.europad.org

Fifth National Harm Reduction Conference
November 11-14, 2004
New Orleans, Louisiana, USA
http://www.harmreduction.org/conf2004

———————————————–
Maureen O’Connor
Project Director, Web Site
International Center for the
Advancement of Addiction Treatment
http://www.OpiateAddictionRx.info
212-523-8398

From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] getting ibogaine information out
Date: March 30, 2004 at 3:51:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Howard,

It was precisely thru newsgroups that i first discovered ibogaine, while
surfing the alt.hard.drugs news groups, loaded out of my gourd. it took
me a week of seeing the link before i actually clicked on it and opened
my life to this brave new whirled that i live in.

life will never be the same and it is all Howards fault. :^)

-dh

On 3/29/2004, “HSLotsof@aol.com” <HSLotsof@aol.com> wrote:

I’m one of the few people who posts to newsgroups about ibogaine and
deartheo@ziplip.com is one of the few people writing government officials about
ibogaine. How about some fifty or a hundred of the five thousand people on this
list taking to newsgroups and posting and responding to ibogaine related issues
and another fifty or a hundred writing to government officials. You can
anticipate you will receive sophisticated misinformation from many of the
government sources. Actually, it will most likely all come from NIDA as all of your
elected representative and appointed government officials will refer to them.

Newsgroups are a good place to initiate and enter into ibogaine discussions.
Pick a newsgroup and begin an ibogaine discussion.

Howard

From: “sandra .” <windforme@graffiti.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: March 30, 2004 at 3:04:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

– visions were different (ibo more like vivid dreams and aya more patterned, geometric and futuristic)

– body sensations were different (ibo felt slightly out of bodied & flowing, aya more electrified and travelling through various circuits in the body like lightpulses)

in short, you’re right: everybody is different

and all experience is valid.

~inflowe~

—– Original Message —–
From: “Scott”
Date: Mon, 29 Mar 2004 13:54:22 -0800 (Pacific Standard Time)
To:
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

Is a lower dose of Ibo more maternal, or is it always paternal?

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/29/2004 11:54:30 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

aya/ibo

new school/old school

futurshapes/ancient past

I agree with the mama’s embrace/papa’s schoolin’ comparison.

Both had beautiful things to show me and were very good at also scolding me for the things I needed to look at or do. Just in different ways…

—– Original Message —–
From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 16:11:24 -0800
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

Ayahuasca/Iboga

mother/father

_________________________________________________________________
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating
Date: March 30, 2004 at 8:08:13 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

aww, heck Carla, call me optimistic.
Or a dreamer.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Carla Barnes” <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 10:04 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating

Preston how could you think that something Dana wrote
is less then perfectly accurate? 😉

It’s: Ib0ga!nE

Just ask Patrick 😉

Love all of you, only kidding!

Carla B

— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Thanks to everyone who responded. I thought it was
supposed to be only
capitalized at the beginning of a sentence, but due
to Dana’s long time
involvement with promoting ibogaine, I thought
perhaps he knew something
about spelling it that I didn’t.
Oh well.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating

LOL,

Ibogaine gets capitalized at the beginning of a
sentence, anywhere else it
is ibogaine, unless you want to yell “IBOGAINE”,
then they are all caps.

Brett

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Hi all,
I’m editing an article Dana gave me, in which Dana
has spelled ibogaine
as “ibogaine” and “Ibogaine” throughout, with no
rhyme nor reason to it at
all, in completely arbitary fashion.
Would someone please let me know, as soon as humanly
possible, if it is
supposed to be capitalized or not, please?
Thanks.
Peace,
Preston

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating
Date: March 29, 2004 at 10:04:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston how could you think that something Dana wrote
is less then perfectly accurate? 😉

It’s: Ib0ga!nE

Just ask Patrick 😉

Love all of you, only kidding!

Carla B

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating

LOL,

Ibogaine gets capitalized at the beginning of a
sentence, anywhere else it
is ibogaine, unless you want to yell “IBOGAINE”,
then they are all caps.

Brett

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating
Date: March 29, 2004 at 8:56:05 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks to everyone who responded. I thought it was supposed to be only
capitalized at the beginning of a sentence, but due to Dana’s long time
involvement with promoting ibogaine, I thought perhaps he knew something
about spelling it that I didn’t.
Oh well.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating

LOL,

Ibogaine gets capitalized at the beginning of a sentence, anywhere else it
is ibogaine, unless you want to yell “IBOGAINE”, then they are all caps.

Brett

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Hi all,
I’m editing an article Dana gave me, in which Dana has spelled ibogaine
as “ibogaine” and “Ibogaine” throughout, with no rhyme nor reason to it at
all, in completely arbitary fashion.
Would someone please let me know, as soon as humanly possible, if it is
supposed to be capitalized or not, please?
Thanks.
Peace,
Preston

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating
Date: March 29, 2004 at 8:12:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LOL,

Ibogaine gets capitalized at the beginning of a sentence, anywhere else it is ibogaine, unless you want to yell “IBOGAINE”, then they are all caps.

Brett

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Hi all,
I’m editing an article Dana gave me, in which Dana has spelled ibogaine
as “ibogaine” and “Ibogaine” throughout, with no rhyme nor reason to it at
all, in completely arbitary fashion.
Would someone please let me know, as soon as humanly possible, if it is
supposed to be capitalized or not, please?
Thanks.
Peace,
Preston

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] getting ibogaine information out
Date: March 29, 2004 at 8:09:33 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Newsgroups are a good place to initiate and enter into ibogaine discussions.
Pick a newsgroup and begin an ibogaine discussion.

Howard

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] dictionary ibogaine
Date: March 29, 2004 at 7:35:05 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

3 entries found for ibogaine.

i·bo·ga·ine ( P ) Pronunciation Key (-bg-n, -n)
n. An alkaloid, C20H26N2O, that acts as a dopamine blocker and mitigates depression and the symptoms of withdrawal from narcotics, cocaine, and heroin.
[French ibogaïne, from New Latin (Tabernanth) iboga, species name of shrub in whose root it is found, from Myene (Bantu language of Gabon).]

[Download or Buy Now]
Source: The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition
Copyright © 2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company.
Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.

ibogaine

( P ) ibogaine: log in for this definition of ibogaine and other entries in Merriam-Webster Medical Dictionary, available only to Dictionary.com Premium members.

ibogaine

ibogaine: in CancerWEB’s On-line Medical Dictionary

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] irritating
Date: March 29, 2004 at 7:32:43 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

well, it is a noun so I would only capitalize it if it was the first word in a sentence.
The Bwiti may feel it is a proper noun though.
Callie

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] irritating
Date: March 29, 2004 at 7:19:18 PM EST
To: <hslotsof@aol.com>, <dana@cures-not-wars.org>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
I’m editing an article Dana gave me, in which Dana has spelled ibogaine
as “ibogaine” and “Ibogaine” throughout, with no rhyme nor reason to it at
all, in completely arbitary fashion.
Would someone please let me know, as soon as humanly possible, if it is
supposed to be capitalized or not, please?
Thanks.
Peace,
Preston

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: March 29, 2004 at 4:54:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is a lower dose of Ibo more maternal, or is it always paternal?

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/29/2004 11:54:30 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

aya/ibo

new school/old school

futurshapes/ancient past

I agree with the mama’s embrace/papa’s schoolin’ comparison.

Both had beautiful things to show me and were very good at also scolding me for the things I needed to look at or do. Just in different ways…

—– Original Message —–
From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 16:11:24 -0800
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

—
_______________________________________________
Graffiti.net free e-mail @ www.graffiti.net
Check out our value-added Premium features, such as an extra 20MB for just US$9.95 per year!

____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 29, 2004 at 3:19:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ethnogarden in Canada…many said they were quite reputable, and I got
50g just to make sure 🙁

Hi Brooke
Where did you get your Iboga from and what quantity, are you sure it
was
Rootbark?

—–Message d’origine—–
De : Brooke [mailto:brooke@blue.netnation.com]
Envoyé : dimanche 28 mars 2004 08:03
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE DOPE
FOR
BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of
that!
Callie

/]=——————————————————————
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[%](> Further Information & List Commands:
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From: “sandra .” <windforme@graffiti.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: March 29, 2004 at 1:08:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

aya/ibo

new school/old school

futurshapes/ancient past

I agree with the mama’s embrace/papa’s schoolin’ comparison.

Both had beautiful things to show me and were very good at also scolding me for the things I needed to look at or do. Just in different ways…

—– Original Message —–
From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 16:11:24 -0800
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

Ayahuasca/Iboga

mother/father

—
_______________________________________________
Graffiti.net free e-mail @ www.graffiti.net
Check out our value-added Premium features, such as an extra 20MB for just US$9.95 per year!

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] (OT) Re: [ibogaine] The John Kerry Special on MTV Tuesday Night
Date: March 29, 2004 at 2:34:53 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <vox@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
I watched Kerry’s June 1971 debate with John O’Neill on the old Dick
Cavett show last night on C-Span and was really depressed to think that this
eloquent, sincere, nice sounding man turned around years later and voted
“yes” for the war on Iraq, to the extent that he’s today saying how we
cannot simply “get out” of Iraq since we’re there now and must stay the
course. How sad that someone who seemingly saw things so clearly in 1971 is
now not seeing things so clearly at all, or so it appears to me.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: drugwar@mindvox.com ; ibogaine@mindvox.com ; vox@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 1:50 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] The John Kerry Special on MTV Tuesday Night

The John Kerry Special
Tune in to MTV on March 30th at 10:30 p.m.when Presidential hopeful John
Kerry talks to MTV.

MTV will hopefully discuss issues with Kerry issues that are important to
voters under 60!
I think it will be a program worth watching!
Callie

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] quote of the day
Date: March 29, 2004 at 2:30:29 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I . . . who took the money? Who took the money away? I,i,i . . . it’s always show time Here at the edge of the stage. I, i, i, wake up and wonder What was the place?
What was the name? We want to wait
but here we go again…  I . . . takes over slowly But doesn’t last very long.
I,i,i . . . no need to worry Everything’s under control.
O – u – t
but no hard feelings. What do you know?
take you away. We’re being taken for a ride again. I got a girlfriend that’s better then that She has the smoke in her eyes. She’s moving up, going right through my heart She’s going to give me surprise Better than this,
know that it’s right. I think you can if you like. I got a girlfriend with bows in her hair And nothing is better than that
(is it?)  Down, down in the basement We hear the sound of machines. I, i, i, i’m driving in circles. Come to my senses sometimes.
Why, why, why, why start it over? Nothing was lost, everything’s free. I don’t care how impossible it seems.  Somebody calls you but you cannot hear Get closer to be far away. Only one look and that’s all that it takes Maybe that’s all that we need.
All that it takes,
all that it takes All that it takes,
all that it takes
I got a girlfriend that’s better than that She goes wherever she likes.
(there she goes…)
Now everyone’s getting involved.
As we get older
And stop making sense
You wont find her waiting long.

Stop making sense
Stop making sense
Stop making sense
Making sense

I got a girlfriend thats better then that.
And nothing is better then this.
(or is it?)

—– Original Message —–
From: Suzanne Wills <suzwills@SWBELL.NET>
To: DPFT-L@listserv.tamu.edu
Sent: 29 Mar 04, 11:06 AM
Subject: Think Tank Says U.N. Drug Policies Fueling Terrorism
This has been posted, but it’s interesting that it made this treatment providers’ list.
*****************************************************
http://www.jointogether.org/sa/news/summaries/reader/0%2C1854%2C570049%2C00.html

-Suzy

“Who would believe that a democratic government would pursue for eight decades a failed policy that produced tens of millions of victims and trillions of dollars of illicit profits for drug dealers, cost taxpayers hundreds of billions of dollars, increased crime and destroyed inner cities, fostered widespread corruption and violations of human rights – and all with no success in achieving the stated and unattainable objective of a drug free America?”
Milton Friedman, winner of 1976 Nobel Memorial Prize for economic science

“You can get over an addiction but you can never get over a conviction.”
Jack Cole, Retired undercover police officer
www.dpft.org

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] The John Kerry Special on MTV Tuesday Night
Date: March 29, 2004 at 1:50:25 PM EST
To: drugwar@mindvox.com, ibogaine@mindvox.com, vox@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The John Kerry Special
Tune in to MTV on March 30th at 10:30 p.m.when Presidential hopeful John Kerry talks to MTV.

MTV will hopefully discuss issues with Kerry issues that are important to voters under 60!
I think it will be a program worth watching!
Callie

From: “Contact vegetaux.com” <contact@vegetaux.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 29, 2004 at 8:44:49 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Brooke,
I’m The webmaster of AfricaPhyto International: www.vegetaux.com, we’re a
selling real Tabernanthe Iboga Rootbark, we harvest it in the cameroonian
rainforest. We harvest our plants ourself and the one we buy from the
villagers are bought only with fruits and leaves because we want to be sure
it is Iboga. There are a lot of swindlers on this market. I know from who
most of the websites get there Iboga and this is not a good source. We might
be expensive but this is because we are selling quality. We opened for a
month and we don’t have a name yet, but I’m sure the quality we have will
speak for itself.

Best

AfricaPhyto

—–Message d’origine—–
De : Brooke [mailto:brooke@blue.netnation.com]
Envoyé : dimanche 28 mars 2004 08:03
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE DOPE
FOR
BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of that!
Callie

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 29, 2004 at 11:24:13 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 01:30:57 EST

In a message dated 3/28/04 6:20:27 AM, dave@phantom.com writes:

>
>
>>Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories.
> What
>>caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS “INCREDIBLY
>>VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological
>>effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of suggests
>>that all repressed truma or emotion has been removed at this stage by
>the
>>ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.
>>
>
>> This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was wondering
>>if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how
>had
>>that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict
>>background would gain more from the experience due to being less blocked
>by
>>drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.
>>
>
>>Luke
>
>
>
>I know of someone who has taken ibogaine in various forms 14-15 times,
>and from their report, the visuals did not diminish. It is worth noting
>that the individual did not take it for addiction, but in a therapuetic
>shaman guided setting for spiritual growth over a period of 8 years or
>so. Also worth noting is the iboga[ine] was often administered in
>combination with other psychoactive substances, such as lsd, yage,
>mushrooms and mescaline. Of these combos, The supplemental substances
>paled in comparison to the iboga “full tilt boogie” potency and
>duration. To my knowledge, these experiences have not been written
>about, but i’d have loved to be a fly on the cerebral vortex walls of
>Those trips.
>
The data is mixed and not well organized. Some individuals appear to cease
visualizing after 4 or 5 ibogaine administrations and if we can believe
reports, others do not. What is needed is an organized study of no less than one
hundred patients to be dosed seven
times at full therapeutic doses and to have their pharmacokinetic levels
tracked and reports on visualization monitored. If running the hundred individu
als is not conclusive we may have to run 500 subjects. Possibly, 500 opioid
dependent subjects and 500 non-dependent controls.

Howard

It seems that if ibogaine allows a person to work through and process lifes traumas that there should be, theoretically at least, an end to visions as there must indeed be a finite amount of material to deal with.

Luke

_________________________________________________________________
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From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 29, 2004 at 10:12:39 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I did a fair bit of lsd years ago and I have always had a very visual experience with ibogaine.
For me there seemed to be an increasing amount of visions of childhood memories and my
family in each experience. Only in my first experience I didn’t experience any visions that
had deep relevance to my emotionaly or spiritual being, at least that’s how it seemed to
me. There wasn’t really any emotional content, though I think that we probably guide
ourselves unconsiously to some extent to allow ourselves see what we feel ready for. I
felt quite dissapointed in myself at the time because I think I panicked a bit and fought
against whatever was to appear.

Luke

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 12:27:05 +0100

—- Original Message —–
From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 9:44 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?

> On [Sun, Mar 28, 2004 at 05:53:25AM -0000], [D H] wrote:
>
> | >Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories.
What
> | >caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS
“INCREDIBLY
> | >VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological
> | >effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of
suggests
> | >that all repressed truma or emotion has been removed at this stage by
the
> | >ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.
> | >
> | > This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was
wondering
> | >if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how
had
> | >that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict
> | >background would gain more from the experience due to being less
blocked by
> | >drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.
> | >
> | >Luke
>

I seem to remember noting, once before, that people who’d done a lot of
other tryptamines, notably lsd, seemed more likely to get visuals with
ibogaine. I haven’t done acid in 20 years and rarely got any full visuals
with ibo. My brother did a lot, he had visuals.

The only time I got visuals was in Africa after taking a massive initiatory
dose. I was out of it for 6 + days, unaware of who I was, and roughly half
of the time was spent in varying different dreamstates. At the time I took
them as reality as I had lost my recollection of this reality, so had
nothing to refer to and thus call them dreamstates. What struck me later,
when I came down, was that the dreams had taken me away from where I was
emotionally. I’d hit all the usual anxiety coming up in the back of the
temple and then when the full effect really hit me (I was eating rootbark
slowly to start with and then took some big doses of “automatique”) it was
too much and I just got spun out somewhere else for a week.

So, my interpretation of my own experience was that the visual states, for
me, actually took me away from re-experiencing emotions and trauma, they
were a kind of protection.

Nick

> This is gonna be one of the shortest messages I’ve ever written; gotta
> bounce, but just wanted to set this down prior to having procmail
> automagically disappear this thread into my ibogaine list mailbox, and
> then spacing it.
>
> I’ve done “therapeutic” doses of ibogaine 8 times in the last 4.5 years
> (i.e., I’m not countin’ bioassays and eXperiments with dose ranges below
> the 10mg/kg threshold). Last 6 times were not for drug dependence. Still
> gettin’ visuals. Richer than before if anything. <Shrug> 6 tr1pS on
> HCl, 2 on Carl’s extract — the “Indra” materials — highest I’ve gone so
> far is 22mg/kg of HCl.
>
> Patrick
>
>
>
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>
>
>

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Thanks for the responses
Date: March 29, 2004 at 9:59:37 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A.A. taught me to stick with the winners. It seems to me that this list has a lot of winners on it. I have read this list for three months before I made a post in the hopes that I wouldn’t say something disrespectful or out of line. It seems that I have done
both. I apologize if something I said was taken as disrespectful. I need as much
help as I can get and I don’t want to ostracize myself from obviously intelligent people
who have the facts and experience I need to get King Kong off of my back.

I am a 46 year old man who is egotistical with an inferiority complex. ’bout as fucked
up as it gets, emotionally. You know that a higher power gave the world Bill W. and
the big book. A higher power also gave us Howard Lotsof and the Ibogaine that he
brought with him to give to people who need it. I see big parallels between the two
and I hold them in the highest regard.

Randy Faulconer

Free Your Mind and Your Ass Will Follow (George Clinton)

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] Libby, friends, a question and some answers Re: [drugwar] I think we hit a nerve
Date: March 29, 2004 at 9:13:38 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hey all, this is sorta off topic, but still interesting I imagine so I post
it in case anyone here can and wants to catch the debate.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Richard Lake” <rlake@mapinc.org>
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2004 8:25 AM
Subject: [drugwar] Libby, friends, a question and some answers Re: [drugwar]
I think we hit a nerve

Question: What is CN8, a broadcast station, cable, what? I see it is part
of The Comcast Network which is received (how?) in Mid-Atlantic and New
England states as shown at http://www.cn8.tv/

Yes, there is supposed to be a real dust up debate on medical cannabis on
the Lynn Doyle show Monday evening at 9 PM Eastern. Their senior producer
wrote our team: “we have already promoted it and will only change if there
is some extreme breaking news.”

Yesterday I started working with our team, the good guys, for this debate,
making sure they knew where all the good short answers were so they could
print them out and be ready, and letting them know what to read about the
bad guys, so our team could be ready for the bad guys.

Our team:

Jim Miller – http://www.mapinc.org/people/Jim+Miller

Philippe Lucas – http://www.mapinc.org/people/Philippe+Lucas

The bad prohibitionist team:

Terry Farley, First Asst Prosecutor, Ocean County, NJ and Director of the
Ocean Co. Narcotics Strike Force and attorney David Evans, Counsel For the
Legal Foundation Against Illegal Drugs.

I will be sending out a note about the show to other appropriate lists
Sunday.

Here is what I sent in way of background materials to our team:

————–

I am unsure if Farley and Jim Miller have actually met, but they sure have
battled it out in the media.

Here are six LTEs and an OPED that clearly spell out what a prohibitionist
Farley is, and should give you a good view of the position he will take.

http://www.mapinc.org/author/Terrence+Farley

David Evens, like Farley, makes his living supporting prohibition. In the
OPED “High Court Was Right To Nix Medicinal Pot” the paper’s note reads:

Note: David G. Evans, counsel for the Legal Foundation Against Illegal
Drugs, submitted a brief on behalf of 50 individuals and drug prevention
organizations in the Supreme Court case. He grew up in Bergen County and
practices in Pittstown, N.J.

His writings are the first seven at:

http://www.mapinc.org/author/David+Evans

His Legal Foundation does not have a website, but guess what, he is also:

David G. Evans, Esq., Executive Director, Drug-free Schools Coalition

Read This! http://drugandhealthinfo.org/page03.php?ID=60

and http://www.estreet.com/orgs/dsi/Editorials/DrugTestinginSchools.html

The extreme lack of material on the web about either Evans organizations –
and no web sites – leads me to suspect they are largely smoke and mirror
groups with little real substance (not MAP like, for sure).

Since Feburary of 1984 the ABA position has been:

Marijuana. Support federal legislation to remove prohibitions against the
treatment of patients with marijuana under the supervision of a physician
with controls adequate to prevent improper use. 2/84

See page 49 of their positions document at
http://www.abanet.org/poladv/legiss.pdf In general their position on drugs
has been to support treatment over punishment for users but it is fair to
say they have not supported marijuana decrim as a specific policy. Their
medical cannabis position is really their strongest position on the
cannabis issue.

I have always found this list “Organizations Supporting Access to
Therapeutic Cannabis” useful. You may want to print it out and highlight
for quick reference the organizations who’s positions are most telling
http://www.medicalcannabis.com/PDF/Grouplist.pdf

I also consider these two pages must reads for anyone going to debate
medical cannabis in the US because they contain quick facts:

http://www.drugwarfacts.org/medicalm.htm

http://www.drugwardistortions.org/distortion9.htm

All I can think of right now. I hope this helps.

Richard

——————

Any other suggestions of reading material I could pass along to our side?

Oh, I hope we get at least a couple of folks to make good sharp VHS copies
of the show so they can be sent to the person who is ready to process it
for the web so we all can see it.

Richard

At 10:32 PM 3/26/04, Libby wrote
I just saw an ad for a Lynn Doyle show on CN8 on
medicinal marijuana that said, Medmj, canadian
pharmacies will be dispensing it, could it happen
here, some medical society says YES.

It’s the middle of all these Law and Order reruns that
I have running for white noise. 10;30 on a Friday
night is pretty good placement.

Is it me, or did we really bring med mar into the
political discourse in this election? I think we are
making a difference. By November I hope neither
candidate will be able to ignore it.

Libby

=====
Libby Spencer
Northampton, MA 01060
Publisher: Last One Speaks
http://lastonespeaks.blogspot.com/

email: baystatebar@yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: Methadone deaths in western Va. occur at twice the rate of New York City (fwd)
Date: March 29, 2004 at 9:04:29 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Doug McVay” <dmcvay@patriot.net>
To: <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 10:57 PM
Subject: Methadone deaths in western Va. occur at twice the rate of New York
City (fwd)

Hi Preston,
I thought this story might be of interest.
BTW, I have a news page on methadone & substition treatment on the
CommonSense site at
http://www.csdp.org/news/news/handmmt.htm
if you want to check it out.
Peace out,
Doug

Newshawk: Doug McVay http://www.CommonSenseDrugPolicy.org/
Methadone deaths in western Va. occur at twice the rate of New York City
By the Associated Press
March 28, 2004
from the Hampton Roads Daily Press at

http://www.dailypress.com/news/local/virginia/dp-va–fataloverdoses0328mar28,0,3081638.story?coll=dp-headlines-virginia

Methadone deaths in western Va. occur at twice the rate of New York City

ROANOKE, Va. — There were 85 deaths from methadone overdoses in western
Virginia last year–a per-capita rate that is at least twice the rate
for New York City, according to state crime lab figures.

Deaths from the prescription drug, developed during World War II as an
alternative to morphine, have increased by 600 percent in the region in
the past five years.

Fatal overdoses from other prescription drugs have also risen sharply,
said Dr. William Massello of the state Medical Examiner’s Office for
Western Virginia.

Last year, there were 213 drug deaths in the western half of the state.

“My God, that’s three-and-a-half times what we used to have just eight
years ago,” Massello said.

Fatal overdoses were up last year in four categories of opium-based
prescription drugs. In addition to the methadone deaths, 47 involved
hydrocodone, 44 ocycodone and 21 fentanyl.

Of all the drugs abused in the Roanoke Valley, methadone is perhaps the
most controversial.

A proposed methadone clinic in Northwest Roanoke has generated
widespread opposition from residents who fear it will bring crime to
their neighborhood. A similar proposal in Southwest Roanoke County was
withdrawn in the face of ardent community resistance.

Opponents worry that methadone will be sold on the street. However,
police and medical examiners say virtually all of the methadone
overdoses involved the pill or wafer form of the drug, which is
prescribed by doctors as a painkiller, and not the liquid form, which is
dispensed by the clinics.

As fatal overdoses from prescription drugs have risen sharply in western
Virginia, so has the amount of painkillers prescribed by the region’s
doctors.

From 1998 to 2002, when methadone deaths went from six to 62, the
volume of the drug prescribed increased by 500 percent, according to
Drug Enforcement Administration figures. The figure does not include the
liquid form of the drug.

Oxycodone prescriptions for the region increased by about 210 percent
from 1998 to 2000. Prescriptions of hydrocodone increased by 107 percent
over five years.

From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 29, 2004 at 8:56:51 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

test

—–Message d’origine—–
De : iboga_planteur [mailto:iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr]
Envoyé : lundi 29 mars 2004 15:33
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : RE: [ibogaine]First Timer

Hi Brooke
Where did you get your Iboga from and what quantity, are you sure it was
Rootbark?

—–Message d’origine—–
De : Brooke [mailto:brooke@blue.netnation.com]
Envoyé : dimanche 28 mars 2004 08:03
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE DOPE
FOR
BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of that!
Callie

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 29, 2004 at 8:32:30 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Brooke
Where did you get your Iboga from and what quantity, are you sure it was
Rootbark?

—–Message d’origine—–
De : Brooke [mailto:brooke@blue.netnation.com]
Envoyé : dimanche 28 mars 2004 08:03
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE DOPE
FOR
BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of that!
Callie

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: (First Timer)
Date: March 29, 2004 at 2:47:26 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: (First Timer)
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 16:12:58 EST

It seems that alot of people are having fun with Ibogaine. For me, this
is
hopefully going to be a life saving experience. IF, I could ever get a
reply
from some of the Iboga houses I have tried to get a hold of! Would it
help
if I
had Hundred dollar bills to throw at them? Well I’m not rich, just a
junkie
needing some serious help. This is my first post. I would appretiate any
help
that I can get from anyone.

Thanx,
Randy

Hi Randy,

Well the first thing you need is some fucking respect. You’re not rich
because you don’t want to be rich. You’re a junkie because you want to be a
junkie. Accepting where you are might be nice. No one OWES you an iboga
session, least of all the plant itself.

I like it that you ask for help. That’s a good start.

Nick

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 29, 2004 at 2:43:12 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooke, where did you get the iboga from? It’s good to say because if it’s not good enough, and a lot out there isn’t, this info will help the general iboga community locate a good source of rootbark, something that’s been difficult for years. I’m not advocating “Name ’em and Shame ’em” merely trying to raise awareness. It’s a serious drag not being able to get good quality material.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: Brooke Burgess
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004 2:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

Thanks to all for lifting my spirits…I was really starting to think that I wasn’t ‘worthy’ of the experience for some reason. Obviously my main hurdle to overcome for the ‘real’ session to come.

Much love

Brooke

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 4:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

“Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal :(”

Yes, “sadly”. This is the main reason I would rather see people with an extract such as Indra or HCL, it is a known quantity. Getting quality root bark west of the Atlantic is about as likely as getting premium tea in a Lipton bag, or so it seems. It is bad enough for those seeling psychic/spiritual reasons but should not be sold or used for addiction treatment by do it yourselfers – IMO the merchant should be able to tell someone the iboga is X, XX or XXX quality, that a given amount (say 30 gms for XXX) will generally put someone over the treetops – and should equal roughly a gm of HCL in strength or 5-6gms of Indra if it is XXX quality.

No Brooke, it wasn’t wasted. You did learn a few things and get through anxiety over it, less to get through for next time…

Brett

Brooke <brooke@blue.netnation.com> wrote:
Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

>
> Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
> I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE DOPE
FOR
> BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of that!
> Callie
>
>

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: March 29, 2004 at 2:21:38 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’s very paternal. A stern father. None of this give yourself a hug stuff.

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 17:44:50 -0800 (Pacific Standard Time)

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/28/2004 4:12:50 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

>Ayahuasca/Iboga

>mother/father

_________

Interesting. I’ve always experienced aya as decidedly masculine (as opposed
to Salvia for instance, which seems very feminine to me.) Are you saying
iboga is even more ?
________________________________________________________

_________________________________________________________________
Get tax tips, tools and access to IRS forms all in one place at MSN Money! http://moneycentral.msn.com/tax/home.asp

/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
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From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: (First Timer)
Date: March 29, 2004 at 12:57:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy and welcome to the ibogaine list! I don’t
think the word “fun” is anything near the right word
to describe ibogaine. I wouldn’t say anyone is doing
it for fun, but there are lots of other reasons to use
ibogaine besides only drug addiction. A lot of the
people here used it for addictions and use it at other
times for spiritual insight or to be reminded of what
it is that got them clean!

I’m sure throwing hundred dollar bills at anyone would
get their attention! I don’t think it’s needed to get
treatment though. What is needed as far as I can see
is to fill out the forms, get medicals and sign up.
Complaining about it doesn’t look like it helps much!
To be honest it’s a lot easier to accept everything
now when I’ve been clean for a much longer time. It’s
not like anyone gave me heroin, methodone or anything
else either. Same effort that went into all of that,
needs to go into getting clean!

Carla B

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
It seems that alot of people are having fun with
Ibogaine. For me, this is
hopefully going to be a life saving experience. IF,
I could ever get a reply
from some of the Iboga houses I have tried to get a
hold of! Would it help if I
had Hundred dollar bills to throw at them? Well I’m
not rich, just a junkie
needing some serious help. This is my first post. I
would appretiate any help
that I can get from anyone.

Thanx,
Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Brooke
Date: March 28, 2004 at 11:57:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/28/2004 7:57:51 PM Central Standard Time, brooke@brokensaints.com writes:

Much love

Brooke

Brooke, I am so sorry your night did not go as you hoped. Also sorry that I called you a practicing junkie! As soon as I read your post I remembered your stated reasons for the Ibogaine.
I truly believe “nothing, absolutely nothing happens in God’s world by mistake” (AA Big Book How It Works. lol! One of the few statements from 12 step material that did have impact on me!)
I feel it was not meant to be last night, for whatever reason.
Glad to see you are taking your disappointment so well! At least you have a few days off work to enjoy! ;>)
Callie

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 10:10:01 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The last time I took a major dose I had no visuals/visions/dreams. That was the only time that happened, the only time I got sick, the only time I had no addictions to fight off, no major demons left..It was more than I needed to take and felt like it shut down, a black velvet curtain was pulled. That was a while ago now, prior to that have always had visions of some sort starting at 3 gms of Indra or 10mg/kg, lots of times. For the future, I don’t know, I do know some lessons were learned, some I still struggle with so maybe next time.

Brett

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 8:46:01 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Much love

Brooke

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 4:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

“Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal :(”

No Brooke, it wasn’t wasted. You did learn a few things and get through anxiety over it, less to get through for next time…

Brett

Brooke <brooke@blue.netnation.com> wrote:
Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 8:44:50 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: 3/28/2004 4:12:50 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?

>Ayahuasca/Iboga

>mother/father

_________

Interesting. I’ve always experienced aya as decidedly masculine (as opposed to Salvia for instance, which seems very feminine to me.) Are you saying iboga is even more ?
________________________________________________________

____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 7:52:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal :(”

No Brooke, it wasn’t wasted. You did learn a few things and get through anxiety over it, less to get through for next time…

Brett

Brooke <brooke@blue.netnation.com> wrote:
Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 7:11:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ayahuasca/Iboga

mother/father

_________________________________________________________________
Get reliable access on MSN 9 Dial-up. 3 months for the price of 1! (Limited-time offer) http://join.msn.com/?page=dept/dialup&pgmarket=en-us&ST=1/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Re: (First Timer)
Date: March 28, 2004 at 6:39:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

Welcome! Plenty of former junkies here who can help you out. Some entertaining nut-cases as well.

It’s actually not ‘fun.’ It’s an ass whooper. I was so excited to be tripping and BAM “YOU STUPID FUCK!”

Get in touch with all the providers. Somewhere around there is a list of them all. Take into account travel costs. Most of them have sliding scales and are here to help you. Negotiate. We all know that Ibogaine Therapy House is free, but there can be a wait. Figure in the cost of doing smack for few months while waiting. Call all of them – don’t be afraid to talk price. It’s the medicine which is strong. Certain providers have various strengths and are better suited to various personalities, but keep in mind that this very powerful medicine – it will work the same. Some places provide extract and some ibogaine hcl – research the difference.

Have a plan in place for after. If you do nothing different and go back to the same old same old, chances are the Dark Master will visit again. Read this for help after the ibogaine: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/KeepingClean.html
I’ve come to think of iboga as this great gift given to us, junkies in particular. You have a few months after the iboga to really do some serious changes and get your shit together, be thankful for this gift and repay in goodness.

We will all be rooting for you, let us know what happens.

Kick ass dude!

Steve Anker.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: (First Timer)
Date: Sun, 28 Mar 2004 16:12:58 EST

It seems that alot of people are having fun with Ibogaine. For me, this is
hopefully going to be a life saving experience. IF, I could ever get a reply
from some of the Iboga houses I have tried to get a hold of! Would it help if I
had Hundred dollar bills to throw at them? Well I’m not rich, just a junkie
needing some serious help. This is my first post. I would appretiate any help
that I can get from anyone.

Thanx,
Randy

_________________________________________________________________
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/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
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From: “Scott” <scottmarkwell@toast.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Ayahuasca/Iboga comparisons?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 6:03:50 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello all–

I am wondering if there is anyone on this list who is experienced with both ayahuasca and iboga? If so, I am curious as to what are the similarities and differences.

I am very experienced with ayahuasca, but not iboga. I have read many ‘trip reports’ on iboga and already know some of the obvious differences–obviously iboga is a much longer experience, but I am particularly interested in hearing a comparison form someone who has significant experience with large doses of both.

Thanks,
Scott
____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Only Slightly OT
Date: March 28, 2004 at 4:47:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I just like Joycelyn Elders. Maybe Kerry will give her her job back.

–Dana

Source: Providence Journal, The (RI)
Copyright: 2004 The Providence Journal Company
Contact: letters@projo.com
Website: http://www.projo.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/352
Author: Joycelyn Elders

MYTHS ABOUT MEDICAL MARIJUANA

THE RHODE ISLAND General Assembly is now considering legislation to
permit the medical use of marijuana by seriously ill patients whose
physicians have recommended it.

This sensible, humane bill deserves swift passage. The evidence is
overwhelming that marijuana can relieve certain types of pain, nausea,
vomiting and other symptoms caused by such illnesses as multiple
sclerosis, cancer and AIDS — or by the harsh drugs sometimes used to
treat them. And it can do so with remarkable safety. Indeed, marijuana
is less toxic than many of the drugs that physicians prescribe every
day.

But right now, Rhode Island law subjects seriously ill patients to the
threat of arrest and jail for simply trying to relieve some of their
misery. There is no good reason that sick people should face such treatment.

Still, foes of the medical-marijuana bill keep raising objections. So
let’s look at their arguments, one by one:

“There is no evidence that marijuana is a medicine.” The truth: The
medical literature on marijuana goes back 5,000 years. In a 1999 study
commissioned by the White House, the Institute of Medicine reported,
“nausea, appetite loss, pain and anxiety . . . all can be mitigated by
marijuana.” In its April 2003 issue, the British medical journal The
Lancet reported that marijuana relieves pain in virtually every test
that scientists use to measure pain relief.

“The medical community doesn’t support this; just a bunch of drug
legalizers do.” The truth: Numerous medical and public-health
organizations support legal access to medical marijuana. National
groups include the American Academy of Family Physicians, the American
Public Health Association and the American Nurses Association.
Regional groups include the New York State Association of County
Health Officials, the California Medical Association and the Rhode
Island Medical Society.

I know of no medical group that believes that jailing sick and dying
people is good for them.

“Marijuana is too dangerous to be medicine; it’s bad for the immune
system, endangering AIDS and cancer patients.” The truth: Unlike many
of the drugs we prescribe every day, marijuana has never been proven
to cause a fatal overdose. Research on AIDS patients has debunked the
claim of harm to the immune system: In a study at San Francisco
General Hospital, AIDS patients using medical marijuana gained
immune-system cells and kept their virus under control as well as
patients who received a placebo. They also gained more needed weight.

“There are other drugs that work as well as marijuana, including
Marinol, the pill containing THC (the main psychoactive chemical in
marijuana).” The truth: These other drugs don’t work for everyone. The
Institute of Medicine noted: “It is well recognized that Marinol’s
oral route of administration hampers its effectiveness, because of
slow absorption and patients’ desire for more control over dosing.”
Inhalation gives a more rapid response and better results. For some
very sick people, marijuana simply works better.

“Smoke is not medicine; no real medicine is smoked.” The truth:
Marijuana does not need to be smoked. Some patients prefer to eat it,
while those who need the fast action and dose control provided by
inhalation can avoid the hazards of smoke through simple devices
called vaporizers. For many who need only a small amount — such as
cancer patients trying to get through a few months of chemotherapy —
the risks of smoking are minor.

“Medical-marijuana laws send the wrong message to kids, encouraging
teen marijuana use.” The truth: That fear, raised in 1996, when
California passed the first effective medical-marijuana law, has not
come true. According to the official California Student Survey, teen
marijuana use in California rose steadily from 1990 to 1996, but began
falling immediately after the medical-marijuana law was passed. Among
ninth graders, marijuana use in the last six months fell by more than
40 percent from 1995-96 to 2001-02 (the most recent available figures).

It is simply wrong for the sick and suffering to be casualties in the
war on drugs. Let’s get rid of the myths and institute sound
public-health policy. The Rhode Island General Assembly should pass
the medical-marijuana bill immediately.

——

Dr. Joycelyn Elders was U.S. surgeon general in 1993-94 and is
Distinguished Professor of Public Health at the University of Arkansas
School of Medicine.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: (First Timer)
Date: March 28, 2004 at 4:12:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It seems that alot of people are having fun with Ibogaine. For me, this is hopefully going to be a life saving experience. IF, I could ever get a reply from some of the Iboga houses I have tried to get a hold of! Would it help if I had Hundred dollar bills to throw at them? Well I’m not rich, just a junkie needing some serious help. This is my first post. I would appretiate any help that I can get from anyone.

Thanx,
Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 4:03:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 6:27:05 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Sun, Mar 28, 2004 at 05:53:25AM -0000], [D H] wrote:

| >Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories.
What
| >caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS
“INCREDIBLY
| >VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological
| >effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of
suggests
| >that all repressed truma or emotion has been removed at this stage by
the
| >ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.
| >
| > This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was
wondering
| >if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how
had
| >that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict
| >background would gain more from the experience due to being less
blocked by
| >drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.
| >
| >Luke

So, my interpretation of my own experience was that the visual states, for
me, actually took me away from re-experiencing emotions and trauma, they
were a kind of protection.

Nick

This is gonna be one of the shortest messages I’ve ever written; gotta
bounce, but just wanted to set this down prior to having procmail
automagically disappear this thread into my ibogaine list mailbox, and
then spacing it.

I’ve done “therapeutic” doses of ibogaine 8 times in the last 4.5 years
(i.e., I’m not countin’ bioassays and eXperiments with dose ranges below
the 10mg/kg threshold). Last 6 times were not for drug dependence. Still
gettin’ visuals. Richer than before if anything. <Shrug> 6 tr1pS on
HCl, 2 on Carl’s extract — the “Indra” materials — highest I’ve gone so
far is 22mg/kg of HCl.

Patrick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 4:39:21 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2004 8:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

In a message dated 3/27/04 6:49:05 PM, nicks22@onetel.com writes:

What if I don’t come back? What if there’s only me?

What if you don’t come back and What if there’s only you? As I am sure
you
know these are very universal questions.

Regards,

Howard

Hi Howard,

They only seem to come up for me when I’m on ibogaine. The notion that I
might be the only person in the world is hard to get into when I’m around
people so much in my daily life. It only comes up when I go “further back
down the pipe”, so to speak, on ibogaine – before the first beat of the
Bwiti’s mobakaka.

I had to hang out with enlightened people and do satsang to understand where
it comes from and thus lessen my fear. What I learned from them was that the
mind only learns to identify with the body, the feelings and thoughts at the
age of around 1 year. Prior to this there’s no distinction – existence is
simply a big Wow with no concept of this being “me” and this being “not me.”
As the “I thought” commences though, at about 12 months, so there arrives
self-conscious awareness in which the mind believes that this body is “me,”
and that these thoughts and feelings are “mine.” And in this state of
identification the overwhelming majority of the world’s population continue
to exist.

At some point the process of identifying starts to unravel though, in some
people, and the core assumptions that the mind made from the age of 1 begin
to be challenged. This wasn’t really happening for me until I took iboga
back in early ’99. When the drug started to try and take me back to the
bornless state of blissful pre-existence so suddenly I was overwhelmed with
fear because the notion that there was no “I” was so alien to me. My mind
(the mind) had been merrily defending it’s core assumption – that it has
personal identity – from apparently hostile attacks for decades, so to be
suddenly confronted with the reality that the thing it had been defending so
well for so long didn’t actually exist of course brought up much fear.

To the Bwiti it’s about the three guys who bang the obaka – the big wooden
stick placed horizontally in the temple. They have to do it all at exactly
the same time or things are a bit fucked up. The sound of the bang is called
the mobakaka and it symbolizes the beginning of creation (see
http://www.iboga.org/us/einganga.htm for good info). If they hit it a bit
off there will be a lot of fear when you are called back to the bornless
state (this in the great ceremony where you are called into being not in the
initiation ritual though of course it’s also important there.)

Next time I do iboga, probably at Beltane in early May, I’ll have a
therapist friend of mine with me to try and guide me through this fear.
Maybe then I’ll be free of the effects of a discordant mobakaka and I can
hang out properly in dissumba a little.

Nick

From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 4:39:17 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooke, hate to say it but you either got bunk iboga or did something
wrong in all those preperations you listed. why not do a real dose of
HCL?

Peace out,
Curtis

On Sat, 27 Mar 2004 22:03:11 -0800 Brooke <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
wrote:
Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I

have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect
has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves
of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable

stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major

nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

1) The batch I received was weak…therefore not my fault.
2) I’m have a natural immunity to this type of poison, since I’ve

been taking good care of myself the last few months (and the liver

cleanse maximized my detoxing capability)
3) The Bwiti felt that I wasn’t in need of ‘judgment’ at this time
–
that I’m ‘where I need to be’ right now

I really don’t want to think of this undertaking as a ‘wasted’
experience…I was so hoping to have some serious revelations and

emotional breakthroughs…I’m trying my best not to be disappointed
–
maybe someone out there can tell me a similar story of iboga
frustration???

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE
DOPE
FOR
BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of
that!
Callie

/]=———————————————————–
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[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]
\]=———————————————————–
———-=[/

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From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 4:37:30 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bro, I’m not sure if you count! You also have hppd ‘hallucinogen persisting
perceptual disorder’

Links from Erowid

http://www.stormloader.com/hppd/what.htm
http://www.stormloader.com/hppd/help.htm
http://www.stormloader.com/hppd/causes.htm

There are too many quotes from you, Mash, others, to list out but the
one of yours that I remember is ‘it’s been a lot of years since i’ve
seen a white wall or a dark room’. You followed up ibogaine by eating
a sheet of lsd in thailand. Doing 10MG of LSD has to be one of the highest
doses anyone has ever done. That is 100 times a regular dose. If you
ever were, you don’t exactly count as being a normal human being anymore

I’m on ibo 3 HCL, highest so far is 16mg. kg. I’m still tripping too.
Know a few people in the bay area who are well past ibo number 10 and
nobody has said they’ve stopped having visuals though I think everyone
has had one of the ibogaine dark trips where they don’t see anything
at all but everyone who has done it again after that once or twice has
gone back to tripping.

Would be interesting to know what causes the no visuals and then makes
them come back in the same person 🙂

Peace out,
Curtis

On Sun, 28 Mar 2004 00:44:38 -0800 “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
wrote:

This is gonna be one of the shortest messages I’ve ever written;
gotta
bounce, but just wanted to set this down prior to having procmail
automagically disappear this thread into my ibogaine list mailbox,
and
then spacing it.

I’ve done “therapeutic” doses of ibogaine 8 times in the last 4.5
years
(i.e., I’m not countin’ bioassays and eXperiments with dose ranges
below
the 10mg/kg threshold). Last 6 times were not for drug dependence.
Still
gettin’ visuals. Richer than before if anything. <Shrug> 6 tr1pS
on
HCl, 2 on Carl’s extract — the “Indra” materials — highest I’ve
gone so
far is 22mg/kg of HCl.

Patrick

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 3:44:38 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Sun, Mar 28, 2004 at 05:53:25AM -0000], [D H] wrote:

| >Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories. What
| >caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS “INCREDIBLY
| >VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological
| >effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of suggests
| >that all repressed truma or emotion has been removed at this stage by the
| >ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.
| >
| > This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was wondering
| >if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how had
| >that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict
| >background would gain more from the experience due to being less blocked by
| >drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.
| >
| >Luke

Patrick

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 4:04:26 AM EST
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 28, 2004 7:03 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Brooke, man, you’ve been sold duff gear. With good quality rootbark you get
around 4% ibogaine base + the other iboga alkaloids. You can get buzzing in
the ears with a dose as low as 3g. To get nothing at 30g, well the stuff
just has to be crap, possibly very old iboga root not rootbark. I’d be
disappointed as hell.

About natural immunity, I haven’t heard of that before. An old friend of
mine, “Undertaker” Chris, took 600mg of tested ibogaine HCl once and said he
experienced nothing. He was a state registered narcoleptic who basically
lived in a dreamstate, so I figured this ruled him out as a normal subject.
About the Bwiti, they’re here to help. If you knock on the door, they’ll
answer.

No, you’ve been sold stuff that doesn’t work, assuming the extraction went
ok. Who did you get it from?

Commiserations

Nick

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 12:43:01 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Brooke,

Sorry to hear that… it happened to me too and consequently to friends of
mine as well..

I would however rule out possibilities 2 and 3, since everything you did,
your investment,
should have payed off big-time, not the other way round. And there aren’t
really any accounts
of people taking verified doses and being left on the tarmac, so to speak.
Some may bitch and
and ask for their money back, but I always got the impression that there
were other issues at hand
with such cases….

This attempt wasn’t meant to be, alas, please just accept it and the fact
that iboga is ‘love’ applied,
and yes, tough love for most of us, but love and healing nonetheless and it
didn’t, nor ever will, reject
you or any one of us.

By the way, not sure this is a great idea but one thing that can indicate
whether this was iboga at all,
ie, low in alkaloids but the real thing, is smoking a fattie…. I found
that even when I didn’t feel anything
when taking the dud-batch, smoking a joint 2 days later brought about a
whole range of iboga-related
sensations… and although I probably only tuned-in because of past
encounters, there is a definite and
very positive ‘grounding’ as opposed to the uncomfortableness/weirdness that
you were mentioning…

peace,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2004 10:03 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 1:41:17 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/28/04 6:03:55 AM, brooke@blue.netnation.com writes:

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

1) The batch I received was weak…therefore not my fault.
2) I’m have a natural immunity to this type of poison, since I’ve
been taking good care of myself the last few months (and the liver
cleanse maximized my detoxing capability)
3) The Bwiti felt that I wasn’t in need of ‘judgment’ at this time –
that I’m ‘where I need to be’ right now
I really don’t want to think of this undertaking as a ‘wasted’
experience…I was so hoping to have some serious revelations and
emotional breakthroughs…I’m trying my best not to be disappointed –
maybe someone out there can tell me a similar story of iboga
frustration???

Much love to all, and thanks for the support
Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Brooke,

It sound like you are dealing with less than 1% ibogaine content that would
yield 300mg. Two percent that is quite normal would yield 600 mg total dose.
You are looking at an effective dose of no less than 12mg/kg and a preferred
dose of at least 15mg/kg. There is also the possibility you received
adulterated material or another botanical product rather than t. iboga. Too bad. Try
extract or HCl from a reputable supplier next time.

Keep us informed.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 1:30:57 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/28/04 6:20:27 AM, dave@phantom.com writes:

Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories.
What
caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS “INCREDIBLY
VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological
effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of suggests
that all repressed truma or emotion has been removed at this stage by
the
ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.

This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was wondering
if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how
had
that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict
background would gain more from the experience due to being less blocked
by
drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.

Luke

I know of someone who has taken ibogaine in various forms 14-15 times,
and from their report, the visuals did not diminish. It is worth noting
that the individual did not take it for addiction, but in a therapuetic
shaman guided setting for spiritual growth over a period of 8 years or
so. Also worth noting is the iboga[ine] was often administered in
combination with other psychoactive substances, such as lsd, yage,
mushrooms and mescaline. Of these combos, The supplemental substances
paled in comparison to the iboga “full tilt boogie” potency and
duration. To my knowledge, these experiences have not been written
about, but i’d have loved to be a fly on the cerebral vortex walls of
Those trips.

The data is mixed and not well organized. Some individuals appear to cease
visualizing after 4 or 5 ibogaine administrations and if we can believe
reports, others do not. What is needed is an organized study of no less than one
hundred patients to be dosed seven
times at full therapeutic doses and to have their pharmacokinetic levels
tracked and reports on visualization monitored. If running the hundred individu
als is not conclusive we may have to run 500 subjects. Possibly, 500 opioid
dependent subjects and 500 non-dependent controls.

Howard

From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 28, 2004 at 12:53:25 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories. What
caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS “INCREDIBLY
VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological
effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of suggests
that all repressed truma or emotion has been removed at this stage by the
ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.

This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was wondering
if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how had
that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict
background would gain more from the experience due to being less blocked by
drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.

Luke

-dh

From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]First Timer
Date: March 28, 2004 at 1:03:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Actually Callie, I’m taking iboga for psychic/spiritual reasons (I
have addictions, but they’re of an emotional nature)…

Sadly, even with careful preparation, ritual centering, liver
cleansing, and a dose in excess of 30g of rootbark…the effect has
been minimal 🙁

I ingested the mixture approx 6 hours ago, and have had small waves of
emotional sensation and flashes of memory…along with a noticeable
stiffening of my extremeties. But I have yet to experience the major
nausea, ear buzzing, or deep internal ‘searching’.

My watcher has kindly suggested 3 possibilities to dampen my
frustrations:

Much love to all, and thanks for the support

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE DOPE
FOR
BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of that!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] my son and his fish!
Date: March 27, 2004 at 11:59:46 PM EST
To: vox@mindvox.com, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My son and his bass!
http://www.ratemyfish.com/?action=ssp&pid=1237
both are good looking, huh? give him a good rating!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: March 27, 2004 at 9:52:18 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Guess Brooke is getting his massage about now!
I am hoping him all the best. I find it very exciting! NO MORE DOPE FOR BROOKE! only another junkie can understand the significance of that!
Callie

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Costs of ibogaine vs. cost of treatment
Date: March 27, 2004 at 5:46:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Marc! Welcome back from jail! Are you ok?

Love

Carla B

— Marc Scott Emery <marc@cannabisculture.com> wrote:
The cost of ibogaine per patient is about $300 CN,
but the 4 full time
staff and facility and food and utilities makes the
cost per patient
over 5 days about $2,500 – $3,000, so ibogaine is
only 10 – 15% of the
total cost of our treatment here at
ibogatherapyhouse.org

Marc Emery

—–Original Message—–
From: Marko [mailto:marko@mindvox.com]
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 8:42 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of
Pot” arrested in
Saskatchewan

Sorry, I can’t talk about others, it’s their
business what they do and
how they do it.

Here is an interesting part of conversation between
me and Matt
(cryellow@cox.net); I received this on March 11:

////////////////////////////
Marko,

__________________________________
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Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] ASUD, Fabrice
Date: March 27, 2004 at 5:39:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard:

This is great. I tried contacting these folk before our very small
ibogaine conference in Paris in December, 2002. I am gratified to see
it has finally come to their attention. Now perhaps there can be a
French conference on Iboga involving a more representative array or
French activists, doctors and researchers. The reason the 2002 event
didn’t jell is that there was not quite enough money, and the
organizing was not sufficiently exhaustive on the outreach.

Dana/cnw

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: [ibogaine] tryptophan
Date: March 27, 2004 at 5:01:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The bad batch from Japan did indeed give l-tryptophan a bad name.

Here’s an FDA page on the subject (from google on tryptophan japan):

http://vm.cfsan.fda.gov/~dms/ds-tryp1.html

The liver-cleanse site says l-ornithine is good for sleep – I
certainly slept well on it when liver cleansing, haven’t tried
it otherwise.

Bill

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: March 27, 2004 at 1:03:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you, Steven…and to everyone else that has been so warm and
supportive.

I’m taking my test does in approx 8 hours. Wish me luck…

Brooke

—– Original Message —–
From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 27, 2004 1:22 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!

Brooke,

May the Bwiti be with you. I’ll light a candle for you. Best…

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:00:26 -0800

Thanks for sharing Callie!

I’m doing ibogaine (soaked rootbark version) tomorrow night…and I’m
fairly excited. Right now, I’m cleaning my home extensively so I’ll have
something fresh to return to on Sun or Mon (body willing). I’m also on
the
tail end of a liver cleanse, so my guts are in knots and energy level’s
pretty high. My watcher had prepared my space for tomorrow, and a good
friend is coming over tonight to give me a massage and a guided
meditation.

I promise to share my results with everyone…here’s hoping that
positivity
prevails!

Brooke

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 7:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!

I am new here too and I am hoping to do Ibogaine in the next few
months.
I have officially started my methadone detox! lol! Only 2mg a week for
awhile. I really never thought I would start a detox but I am in control.
I
can stop and even go back up if I get too scared! lol! I am hoping to at
least get down to 50mg before doing the Ibogaine.
I live in Tennessee so I have to save some $$ to travel for Ibo
treatment.
Well, enough about me!
How about you? Please share about yourself! When did you do Ibo? Were
you successful?
Later, Callie

_________________________________________________________________
All the action. All the drama. Get NCAA hoops coverage at MSN Sports by
ESPN. http://msn.espn.go.com/index.html?partnersite=espn

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] french drug users groups reports on ibogaine
Date: March 27, 2004 at 4:28:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As many of you may know my involvement with ibogaine is not exclusive and I
am involved with drug users rights and drug user organizations. Recently I was
in contact with ASUD, a french drug users organization. There web page now
has a brief article on iboga/ibogaine and the second page of the article a
great ibogaine graphic.

http://www.asud.org/pages/iboga.htm

http://www.asud.org/pages/temoignage_iboga.htm

The author of the article has in fact joined the mindvox ibogaine list so let
me say welcome.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 27, 2004 at 2:12:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/27/04 6:49:05 PM, nicks22@onetel.com writes:

What if I don’t come back? What if there’s only me?

What if you don’t come back and What if there’s only you? As I am sure you
know these are very universal questions.

Regards,

Howard

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 27, 2004 at 1:46:23 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 7:56 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

What I also liked about ibogaine, as opposed to acid, is that there’s
usually a happy ending. If you get torture, hey, it’s feels great
afterwards! I mean, real elation. And then you know it, you know what it
looks like to go through that doorway. You get awareness. And awareness
always diminishes fear. Horror trips on ibo always pass and afterwards I
usually just feel my connection with everything and everybody.

Thanks very much Nick (and everyone else too) for relating your
experiences.

What you just said in that paragraph there makes me feel a lot better
about the idea of doing iboga.

While my experience ON acid was extremely horrific, it was really the
AFTEReffects that were so problematic. The panic attacks, the fear of
being insane, the fear that at any moment the world around me could
crumble into hell. These persisted for years after my bad trips.

I think I could deal with a grueling psychedelic experience if the fear
and and mental anguish doesn’t persist on and on after the trip. From what
you’ve said, it sounds like this isn’t likely to happen with iboga…

With fear I find personally that understanding can help a lot. When the mind
is overwhelmed you need to give it something. My experience with ibogaine is
that the drug is just a vast, cosmic reset button. It does this with
dependence traits, it does it with environmental and social conditioning,
and it does it with life itself. The drug always tries to drag me back to a
bornless state, pre physical existence. It’s a pool of bliss, or so I’m
told, I don’t get to experience it with iboga because before I hit that
space fully the fear comes in. To hit that pure primal space with iboga, my
feeling is that everything in the way needs to be got out of the way. So the
drug shows you what is in the way – in my case fear, the fear of letting go
totally without any need for identity, without knowing if I can come back. I
can go there now with under 5g of rootbark these days, on account of having
done such big doses in the past. About one hour in and my mind will just
take off into that space – God looking up at creation commencing, cracks of
light in the sky around my head, the realization that the word “I” is God,
then suddenly the fear, What if I don’t come back? What if there’s only me?

I’m developing a strategy to deal with it next time.

Nick

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: March 27, 2004 at 1:36:30 PM EST
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 9:49 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks

The thing to remember about anger is that it is basically a GOOD THING.
The mind is socially conditioned into believing that it is a BAD THING, that
this God-given agent of healing is in some way a BAD THING – that it is
dangerous to experience anger and certainly not something to show to others.

You don’t have to “work through” your anger like it’s some kind of penance,
Luke man. Anger is fine. Sure, you can’t just go around the place screaming
and attacking people, you have to find the right kind of place and people
where you can get into it. But when you do, you can use these feelings to
expand yourself massively. A drug like ibogaine attempts to reintegrate you.
All the compression that takes places in one’s whole body-mind through the
suppression of feelings, ibogaine will attempt to undo. It’s good to know
this, that a lot of reintegration, at a BODILY level, may have to take place
after using ibogaine. When you know this it’s easier.

During that particular ibogaine session i was overcome with anger and rage
and as this happened I saw hundereds of scenes in which I fought with my
parents particularly my mother. The moved so fast it’s hard to remember
how
many there were but after this session I felt much more easy going and for
some time I felt like I couldn’t even get angry if I tried and from time
to
time I still feel that way although I still feel that there is a deeper
anger that hasn’t been addressed yet.

I find your ideas about reiki very interesting. I’m not that familiar
with it but a friend of mine was going out with a woman who was a reiki
master. She was very tempremental. He used to say how he felt effected
by
her engery while he was around her.

Yeah, it sounds like her mind is still stuck with a lot of judgements about
feelings and anger. It’s normal in the West. Feelings arise and the mind
says “Whoa, hold on a moment there, I don’t want to feel this. I need to
find something so I don’t have to feel this and certainly don’t have to show
it.” From this central mis-processing by the mind, all sorts of avoidance
strategies commence. There’s nothing wrong with Reiki, it’s great. But to
use it to try and avoid feelings, or to create vast mental systems involving
chakras, meridians, whatever, to avoid actually just feeling is just
pointless. The fundamental premise of the mind that the emotion being felt
is unacceptable is the problem, not the emotion itself. And, of course,
chances are that it will just keep on arising again and again until it is
felt and processed.

Nick

Luke

but
this is not true. That someone experiences anger shows that their body is
healthy and that it is trying to reintegrate after a period of having its
boundaries crossed.

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 22:23:55 -0000

—– Original Message —–
From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 6:05 PM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks

Hi Jon, Sandy,
I think i can relate to Sandys experiences in that
ibogaine
can ‘break’ open your head and leting out some very painfull feelings.
I
feel very ‘cracked’ open after several ibogaine sessions with alot of
physicall feelings. I was under the impression through my experiences
and
what I’ve read about the nature of repressed trauma is that this is
what
psychadelics do. They can open your minds defences and allow repressed
traumas or emotions to surface. I think this seems to cause a lot of
stress
and anxiety.
I think there’s a great difference between ibogaine
and
LSD
in that ibogaine tends to bring an understanding of issues that
arrise.
Though it can also leave you with unresolved feelings rising to
consiousness. I still take anti-depressants every day to keep my
stress
levels down. Perhaps that’s why they say that multiple sessions are
more
beneficial. It’s hard to tell as everyone is different. I ended up
feeling much worse after my second ibogaine session I came out of it
with
a
lot of anger from childhood being released and ended up falling out
with
my
girlfriend. I was still drining heavily then and didn’t really have
enought
awareness of the fact that I was taking out my anger towards my
parents
on
other people. I managed to let go of much of that anger in a
subsequent
session. I think it’s would be very helpfull to have loving and
supportive
friends and your lifes cicumstances are important.

Hi Luke,

Yes, friends are what will get you through.

When I hear you say things like “letting go of anger,” warning
bells sounds. My experience, and that of many others, is that you usually
have to wrestle a little with the anger first. Before you can forgive
your
parents you have to really let yourself hate them first. Then the loving
comes naturally – “I forgive my parents for not being perfect.” It’s
easy.
But you have
to allow yourself to go into the hatred first.

Buddhists, Reiki and healing people, and affirmation or NLP fans will
tell
you you can let go of anger just through a few
little exercises or meditation. It’s bullshit. It’s sounds good. It
convinces the mind (especially when the fear of really feeling is high)
but
it’s bullshit. Over the last few years I’ve been in a hundred groups with
just about every Buddhist, Reiki artist and NLP practitioner you could
imagine. And every one I’ve seen reduced to chaos
rapidly through the fact that they are each, without exception in my
experience,
holding down enough anger to kill a bull elephant. Every single one, man.
They’re terrified of feeling it and they’ve allowed their mind to seduce
them away from feeling and expression what’s actually going on inside.

You can’t rationalize feelings away. It won’t work, they resurface and
will
drag your physical body down.

As for Reiki, hands-on healing and all this stuff – very little use
either
for anger. (useful for other things). All this stuff can do here is heal
on
a superficial level, like a sticking plaster. I live in a new age
centre in the UK and am surrounded by healers. I can see the energy
fields
around the bodies they’re working on and all the energy usually does is
close the throat chakra – blocking expression, blocking feeling. You feel
light, you feel spiritual, you think it’s great, but actually God has
just
shut
your circuits down for a while cause you were overloading, and in too
many
feelings to function.

Affirmations and NLP have their place in therapy but you can’t use them
for
anger properly. Anger management, yes. But not actually to give you what
anger will give you when you express it.

The body experiences anger when it’s been invaded. It’s natural and
healing.
When that anger couldn’t be expressed, because you were too young,
because
it wasn’t appropriate, or because you’d been conditioned out of allowing
it,
it goes inside the body and resurfaces when something triggers it. This
is
healthy. Alan Lowen, father of bioenergetics, calls anger the healing
emotion. It restores the body on a physical level after it’s been
invaded.
The feeling of anger is totally healthy, it shows that your body and your
emotions are working properly. If you just try to meditate it away,
rationalize it, chant it out, affirm it away, then you miss. You miss the
reintegration of the body that has to follow invasion. The anger comes up
again and you forgive people left, right and centre, and you miss again.
So
on and so forth until finally the body becomes host to illness because it
has never actually been allowed to heal the way it’s designed to.

So, my advice to you is, find yourself a safe, supportive environment and
SCREAM your guts out. THEN you can forgive people, affirm away, or repeat
endlessly “I am not angry” and it will work.

Nick

The thing is is that the painfull/traumatizing/anxiety
feelings are always going to be there unless they’re resolved. That’s
why
we
use alcohol/pain-killers/meds to reduce these feelings. Whether
ibogaine
can relsove all that is another story but it will bring these thingss
to
consiousness. Personnaly I found it very rewarding but it has been a
very
difficult time emotionally
Luke

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Costs of ibogaine vs. cost of treatment
Date: March 27, 2004 at 12:44:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Marc,
What kind of bird don’t fly? ;>)
Callie

glad you’re home!

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: March 27, 2004 at 11:47:52 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Damn! That is so great! A year clean?! Blows me away! And you were on Methadone two times as long as me!
I am truly inspired. I was convinced before but I LOVE hearing more success.
The USA needs to wise up and seriously look into Ibogaine! It might just change the lives of our addicted citizens!
I know I am not waiting for the FDA. I want this fucking gorilla off my back!
Callie

From: “Greg Douglass” <gregdouglass@covad.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: March 27, 2004 at 11:24:03 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the note, Callie, and I hope your detox goes well. I got down to 24 mg. before going in for the treatment. I had been on methadone for close to 15 years prior to my ibogaine treatment, and frankly didn’t feel all that great for about a month (mostly due to the lack of sleep), but I was still well enough to travel to San Francisco for 4 days of intense all-day rehearsal immediately following my 5-day stay at the facility in Mexico. I was snorkeling in Hawaii a month later, and there’s no way I would have been doing that I had quit cold turkey.
I took ibogaine on March 2, 2003, at the Ibogaine Therapy clinic in Rosarito Beach, Baja CA Mexico. I have stayed clean for over a year now…for the first time in 3 decades!…and I have the joyous belief that the changes in me are permanent. While I felt very tired after treatment and experienced some minor withdrawal symptoms, the main change was in my thinking about dope; it just didn’t seem like a very good idea anymore, no matter how crappy I felt. Ibogaine took me beyond the immediate “need” that all junkies cave in to time and time again and made me see the big picture, where the repetitive taking of drugs was just plain insane. It was a profoundly revelatory experience for my old junkie ass, and I’m generally not the kind of guy to use “relevatory” in a sentence! You, or anyone else who’s interested, can read my story at http://www.ibogaine-therapy.net/testimonials.html . Scroll down to “Greg’s Story”.
Props up to my homeboys Steve and Marcus Malone! I did indeed co-write the Steve Miller hit “Jungle Love”, but, honest, it wasn’t me who put those stupid whistles at the beginning and end.
It has been an amazing year. I’ll write more later.
Looking forward to hearing about Brooke’s stroll with Iboga. This is a great group; thanks for the turn-on, Mr. Anker!
Greg in San Diego
—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 7:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!

I am new here too and I am hoping to do Ibogaine in the next few months.
I have officially started my methadone detox! lol! Only 2mg a week for awhile. I really never thought I would start a detox but I am in control. I can stop and even go back up if I get too scared! lol! I am hoping to at least get down to 50mg before doing the Ibogaine.
I live in Tennessee so I have to save some $$ to travel for Ibo treatment.
Well, enough about me!
How about you? Please share about yourself! When did you do Ibo? Were you successful?
Later, Callie

From: “ann b mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Costs of ibogaine vs. cost of treatment
Date: March 27, 2004 at 10:06:47 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You’re free!! Hooray!

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Marc Scott Emery” <marc@cannabisculture.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 6:50 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Costs of ibogaine vs. cost of treatment

The cost of ibogaine per patient is about $300 CN, but the 4 full time
staff and facility and food and utilities makes the cost per patient
over 5 days about $2,500 – $3,000, so ibogaine is only 10 – 15% of the
total cost of our treatment here at ibogatherapyhouse.org

Marc Emery

Sorry, I can’t talk about others, it’s their business what they do and
how they do it.

Here is an interesting part of conversation between me and Matt
(cryellow@cox.net); I received this on March 11:

////////////////////////////
Marko,

Without getting into details, someone else who has this exact same
Ibogaine
has offered it for far, far less. This person knows you and speaks very
highly of you, but states that the Ibogaine you suppy and that person
supplies are the same. We confirmed this because that person supplies a
major clinic (this has been confirmed).

I just wanted to give you a chance to match this deal. No offense, but
I
now know how much you are marking this up. Great for you, but if you
can
see your way clear to marking it up a lot less (for everyone), I bet you
would make more money in volume in the long run. We are told you are
marking this up something like ninefold (buying for about one hundred
U.S.
selling for about nine hundred U.S.).

You are a businessperson and entitled to mark up whatever you like, but,
again, maybe you would make more money through increased volume if you
marked up 50% or even 100% instead of 800%. If we are mistaken as to
your
markup, then we have been misled and I apologize.

Cheers,
Matt
///////////////////////////////////

As you can see, I’m a businessperson; not only that, I’m one of the
worst
capitalists, marking up 800% (whooops, I mean something like ninefold!).

That’s highly cool!!

Now you can understand how am I able to give HCl away for free – but
(unfortunately) only to local people.

This will change when The Temple will be on-line (as I already said);
we’ll have sort of contest and a reasonable amount of HCl will be sent
to
the winner (not to countries where it’s not legal, of course!)

In the meantime, I suggest that you (and everyone else who wants IBO)
ask
Matt where you can get decent price; I’m sure he’ll be more than
helpful,
and his “person” will be delighted to broaden the business…

Marko

(BTW, I accepted Matt’s apologise; but in next E-mail he said: “So, how
about it, are you willing to make less than 800% profit? :-)”

laughing again>

On Fri, 26 Mar 2004 deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:

Thank you for correcting me on that and thank you for your efforts. I
didn’t send that e-mail again, I think it’s like the 2nd or 3rd one that
has been re-sent a few days after…strange.

I was, of course, in this below e-mail, speaking from my own,
admittedly limited, experience. For the help of those seeking treatment
on the list…who are the other 3? How would people qualify?, I looked
allot but apparently not enough, so if you know, it’s would seem better
to keep info like that outside of your back pocket, if you know.
-Jason Bursey
—–Original Message—–
From: Marko [mailto:marko@mindvox.com]
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004, 6:00 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in
Saskatchewan

Marc gave you a free treatment

but I know of at least 3 other IBO providers who give free
treatments; not
to you, obviously, but to others.

And when our Temple will be online, we’ll offer free IBO, too. Not
to
anyone, of course.

Marko

On Thu, 25 Mar 2004 deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:

What I do know is nobody on this list was willing to do ANYTHING
for me
before I met Marc and he did treated me FOR FREE (paging Dr. Mash)
which
nobody on this list would have nor will they do.

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Costs of ibogaine vs. cost of treatment
Date: March 27, 2004 at 5:39:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/27/04 9:02:43 AM, marc@cannabisculture.com writes:

Hi Marc,

Welcome home/out.

Howard

From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: March 27, 2004 at 4:22:00 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooke,

May the Bwiti be with you. I’ll light a candle for you. Best…

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 20:00:26 -0800

Thanks for sharing Callie!

I’m doing ibogaine (soaked rootbark version) tomorrow night…and I’m fairly excited. Right now, I’m cleaning my home extensively so I’ll have something fresh to return to on Sun or Mon (body willing). I’m also on the tail end of a liver cleanse, so my guts are in knots and energy level’s pretty high. My watcher had prepared my space for tomorrow, and a good friend is coming over tonight to give me a massage and a guided meditation.

I promise to share my results with everyone…here’s hoping that positivity prevails!

Brooke

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 7:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!

I am new here too and I am hoping to do Ibogaine in the next few months.
I have officially started my methadone detox! lol! Only 2mg a week for awhile. I really never thought I would start a detox but I am in control. I can stop and even go back up if I get too scared! lol! I am hoping to at least get down to 50mg before doing the Ibogaine.
I live in Tennessee so I have to save some $$ to travel for Ibo treatment.
Well, enough about me!
How about you? Please share about yourself! When did you do Ibo? Were you successful?
Later, Callie

_________________________________________________________________
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/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 27, 2004 at 4:11:12 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tryptophan is the “active” ingredient in milk and turkey that makes one
sleepy, it is also the precoursor of serotonin (l-tryptophan, not turkey).<

That’s where I’ve heard this before. Thanks Brett, much obliged. And thanks
Ann too.

Peace,
Preston
—– Original Message —–
From: ann b mullikin
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 8:23 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

The story I heard was all this happened about the same time the SSRI’s were
offered
to the public by the pharmaceutical companies. Tryptophan was a substance
which competes with the anti-depressants in that both affect the amount of
serotonin
found at the synapses in the CNS. The pharmaceutical companies have a lot
of clout!!
It is in their best interest that Tryptophan be banished from the market
place. Never
mind that Tryptophan is one of the natural amino acids found in the body.

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 8:09 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Preston,

l-tryptophan isn’t dangerous. We got a bad batch from Japan a while back and
they outlawed it in the USA, cept it is OK in baby food – to help babies be
quiet (the babyfood lobby cries awfully loudly) . Tryptophan is the “active”
ingredient in milk and turkey that makes one sleepy, it is also the
precoursor of serotonin (l-tryptophan, not turkey).

Brett.

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
You can get 5htp (5 Hydroxytryptophan) in a healthfood store, drug store,
pharmacy or grocery. Real l-tryptophan is much too dangerous to put in
anything but baby food (in the USA) or by prescription.<

How so, “dangerous” Brett? What does it do? What would be the purpose of
taking it in the first place, despite this possibly being a slightly
dumb-like question?
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 12:33 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

You can get 5htp (5 Hydroxytryptophan) in a healthfood store, drug store,
pharmacy or grocery. Real l-tryptophan is much too dangerous to put in
anything but baby food (in the USA) or by prescription.. qhi.co.uk sells
real l-tryptophan, it is legal to import for personal use.

“but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.”

I don’t notice any difference one way or the other, before, during or after
using l-tryptophan. dl-phenylalanine seems to speed recovery, so does
chicken soup…

Brett

Jon Ludlam wrote:
Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
I just bought some tryptophan to help me get some soothing rest the
following week – I read this was helpful, but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.

Any word?

Where can you find tryptophan??

Jon Ludlam

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Marc Scott Emery <marc@cannabisculture.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Costs of ibogaine vs. cost of treatment
Date: March 26, 2004 at 6:50:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Marc Emery

Sorry, I can’t talk about others, it’s their business what they do and
how they do it.

Here is an interesting part of conversation between me and Matt
(cryellow@cox.net); I received this on March 11:

////////////////////////////
Marko,

Cheers,
Matt
///////////////////////////////////

As you can see, I’m a businessperson; not only that, I’m one of the
worst
capitalists, marking up 800% (whooops, I mean something like ninefold!).

That’s highly cool!!

Now you can understand how am I able to give HCl away for free – but
(unfortunately) only to local people.

Marko

(BTW, I accepted Matt’s apologise; but in next E-mail he said: “So, how
about it, are you willing to make less than 800% profit? :-)”

laughing again>

On Fri, 26 Mar 2004 deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:

Thank you for correcting me on that and thank you for your efforts. I
didn’t send that e-mail again, I think it’s like the 2nd or 3rd one that
has been re-sent a few days after…strange.

Marc gave you a free treatment

but I know of at least 3 other IBO providers who give free
treatments; not
to you, obviously, but to others.

And when our Temple will be online, we’ll offer free IBO, too. Not
to
anyone, of course.

Marko

On Thu, 25 Mar 2004 deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:

What I do know is nobody on this list was willing to do ANYTHING
for me
before I met Marc and he did treated me FOR FREE (paging Dr. Mash)
which
nobody on this list would have nor will they do.

/]=———————————————————————
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http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]

\]=———————————————————————
=[/

/]=———————————————————————
=[\
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\]=———————————————————————
=[/

/]=———————————————————————
=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————
=[/

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: March 26, 2004 at 11:00:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for sharing Callie!

I’m doing ibogaine (soaked rootbark version) tomorrow night…and I’m fairly excited. Right now, I’m cleaning my home extensively so I’ll have something fresh to return to on Sun or Mon (body willing). I’m also on the tail end of a liver cleanse, so my guts are in knots and energy level’s pretty high. My watcher had prepared my space for tomorrow, and a good friend is coming over tonight to give me a massage and a guided meditation.

I promise to share my results with everyone…here’s hoping that positivity prevails!

Brooke

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 7:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!

I am new here too and I am hoping to do Ibogaine in the next few months.
I have officially started my methadone detox! lol! Only 2mg a week for awhile. I really never thought I would start a detox but I am in control. I can stop and even go back up if I get too scared! lol! I am hoping to at least get down to 50mg before doing the Ibogaine.
I live in Tennessee so I have to save some $$ to travel for Ibo treatment.
Well, enough about me!
How about you? Please share about yourself! When did you do Ibo? Were you successful?
Later, Callie

From: “sandra .” <windforme@graffiti.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what about Melatonin? post Ibo
Date: March 26, 2004 at 11:36:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

At ITH we have found that 100mgs of 5htp taken 1 hour befroe bedtime can sometimes be helpful, but as everyone is different it does not work for everyone. We have also tried Valerian root and Melatonin but have not tried any of these in conjunction. Has anyone else tried 5htp and Melatonin in conjunction to work effectively?

—– Original Message —–
From: “Greg Douglass”
Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:58:40 -0800
To:
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what about Melatonin? post Ibo

When I went through the ibogaine detox last year (coming off of several years of methadone & opiate use), a cocktail of l-tryptophan and melatonin about 30 minutes before bed really helped me to go to sleep and get those first few precious hours of blissful shut-eye before inevitably waking up about 3-4 hours later (at least for the first month). I would sometimes take more after waking up to go back to sleep, with varying results. But it really helped for those first crucial hours of restorative REM sleep.
The bad batch from Japan did indeed give l-tryptophan a bad name. It, and melatonin, are both naturally occurring substances in the human body, and are quite safe.
By the way, new member here. I was turned on to this list by a fellow Bwiti. Interesting idea!
Greg
—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 6:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what about Melatonin? post Ibo

Anyone have any say about Melatonin? A couple of tablets (3mg) sure will help me fall off to sleep when I am keyed up.
Back in the early 80’s when I worked alcohol detox, we handed out 1000 mg of L-tryptophan nightly to patients for rest.
I did not know it was now considered unsafe.
Callie
Content-ID: <001201c413a7$6873c420$f79efea9@g4t7a4>

—
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From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what about Melatonin? post Ibo
Date: March 26, 2004 at 11:08:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey everyone,

Welcome Greg! Greg is the shit, very cool people.

Greg, sorry but I just have to tell everyone: Greg wrote the song “Jungle Love” and, like, he’s really found it now after all those years. Get it? Jungle Love…

Steve.

From: “Greg Douglass” <gregdouglass@covad.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what about Melatonin? post Ibo
Date: Fri, 26 Mar 2004 18:58:40 -0800

_________________________________________________________________
Free up your inbox with MSN Hotmail Extra Storage. Multiple plans available. http://join.msn.com/?pgmarket=en-us&page=hotmail/es2&ST=1/go/onm00200362ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]Welcome Greg!
Date: March 26, 2004 at 10:52:46 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am new here too and I am hoping to do Ibogaine in the next few months.
I have officially started my methadone detox! lol! Only 2mg a week for awhile. I really never thought I would start a detox but I am in control. I can stop and even go back up if I get too scared! lol! I am hoping to at least get down to 50mg before doing the Ibogaine.
I live in Tennessee so I have to save some $$ to travel for Ibo treatment.
Well, enough about me!
How about you? Please share about yourself! When did you do Ibo? Were you successful?
Later, Callie

From: “Greg Douglass” <gregdouglass@covad.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what about Melatonin? post Ibo
Date: March 26, 2004 at 9:58:40 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what about Melatonin? post Ibo
Date: March 26, 2004 at 9:12:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: “ann b mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 26, 2004 at 8:23:17 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The story I heard was all this happened about the same time the SSRI’s were offered
to the public by the pharmaceutical companies. Tryptophan was a substance
which competes with the anti-depressants in that both affect the amount of serotonin
found at the synapses in the CNS. The pharmaceutical companies have a lot of clout!!
It is in their best interest that Tryptophan be banished from the market place. Never
mind that Tryptophan is one of the natural amino acids found in the body.

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 8:09 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Preston,

l-tryptophan isn’t dangerous. We got a bad batch from Japan a while back and they outlawed it in the USA, cept it is OK in baby food – to help babies be quiet (the babyfood lobby cries awfully loudly) . Tryptophan is the “active” ingredient in milk and turkey that makes one sleepy, it is also the precoursor of serotonin (l-tryptophan, not turkey).

Brett.

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
>You can get 5htp (5 Hydroxytryptophan) in a healthfood store, drug store,
pharmacy or grocery. Real l-tryptophan is much too dangerous to put in
anything but baby food (in the USA) or by prescription.<

How so, “dangerous” Brett? What does it do? What would be the purpose of
taking it in the first place, despite this possibly being a slightly
dumb-like question?
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 12:33 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

“but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.”

I don’t notice any difference one way or the other, before, during or after
using l-tryptophan. dl-phenylalanine seems to speed recovery, so does
chicken soup…

Brett

Jon Ludlam wrote:
Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
>I just bought some tryptophan to help me get some soothing rest the
following week – I read this was helpful, but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.

Any word?

Where can you find tryptophan??

Jon Ludlam

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 26, 2004 at 8:09:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston,

l-tryptophan isn’t dangerous. We got a bad batch from Japan a while back and they outlawed it in the USA, cept it is OK in baby food – to help babies be quiet (the babyfood lobby cries awfully loudly) . Tryptophan is the “active” ingredient in milk and turkey that makes one sleepy, it is also the precoursor of serotonin (l-tryptophan, not turkey).

Brett.

How so, “dangerous” Brett? What does it do? What would be the purpose of
taking it in the first place, despite this possibly being a slightly
dumb-like question?
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 12:33 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

“but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.”

I don’t notice any difference one way or the other, before, during or after
using l-tryptophan. dl-phenylalanine seems to speed recovery, so does
chicken soup…

Brett

Any word?

Where can you find tryptophan??

Jon Ludlam

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 26, 2004 at 6:44:30 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

How so, “dangerous” Brett? What does it do? What would be the purpose of
taking it in the first place, despite this possibly being a slightly
dumb-like question?
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004 12:33 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

“but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.”

I don’t notice any difference one way or the other, before, during or after
using l-tryptophan. dl-phenylalanine seems to speed recovery, so does
chicken soup…

Brett

Jon Ludlam <seraphina@compuserve.com> wrote:
Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
I just bought some tryptophan to help me get some soothing rest the
following week – I read this was helpful, but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.

Any word?

Where can you find tryptophan??

Jon Ludlam

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Weah, hello! 🙂 = Virus “W32.Beagle@mm!zip” found
Date: March 26, 2004 at 4:02:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Virus “W32.Beagle@mm!zip” found
Not a good idea to download.
Brett

jfreed1@umbc.edu wrote:
Argh, i don’t like the plaintext 🙂

password for archive: 71888

> ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=Document.zip
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: jfreed1@umbc.edu
Subject: [ibogaine] Weah, hello! 🙂
Date: March 26, 2004 at 3:33:15 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Argh, i don’t like the plaintext 🙂

password for archive: 71888
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 26, 2004 at 12:33:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You can get 5htp (5 Hydroxytryptophan) in a healthfood store, drug store, pharmacy or grocery. Real l-tryptophan is much too dangerous to put in anything but baby food (in the USA) or by prescription.. qhi.co.uk sells real l-tryptophan, it is legal to import for personal use.

“but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.”

I don’t notice any difference one way or the other, before, during or after using l-tryptophan. dl-phenylalanine seems to speed recovery, so does chicken soup…

Brett

Jon Ludlam <seraphina@compuserve.com> wrote:
Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
>I just bought some tryptophan to help me get some soothing rest the
following week – I read this was helpful, but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.

Any word?

Where can you find tryptophan??

Jon Ludlam

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Marko <marko@mindvox.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 26, 2004 at 11:41:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry, I can’t talk about others, it’s their business what they do and
how they do it.

Here is an interesting part of conversation between me and Matt
(cryellow@cox.net); I received this on March 11:

////////////////////////////
Marko,

I just wanted to give you a chance to match this deal. No offense, but I
now know how much you are marking this up. Great for you, but if you can
see your way clear to marking it up a lot less (for everyone), I bet you
would make more money in volume in the long run. We are told you are
marking this up something like ninefold (buying for about one hundred U.S.
selling for about nine hundred U.S.).

You are a businessperson and entitled to mark up whatever you like, but,
again, maybe you would make more money through increased volume if you
marked up 50% or even 100% instead of 800%. If we are mistaken as to your
markup, then we have been misled and I apologize.

Cheers,
Matt
///////////////////////////////////

As you can see, I’m a businessperson; not only that, I’m one of the worst
capitalists, marking up 800% (whooops, I mean something like ninefold!).

That’s highly cool!!

Now you can understand how am I able to give HCl away for free – but
(unfortunately) only to local people.

This will change when The Temple will be on-line (as I already said);
we’ll have sort of contest and a reasonable amount of HCl will be sent to
the winner (not to countries where it’s not legal, of course!)

In the meantime, I suggest that you (and everyone else who wants IBO) ask
Matt where you can get decent price; I’m sure he’ll be more than helpful,
and his “person” will be delighted to broaden the business…

Marko

(BTW, I accepted Matt’s apologise; but in next E-mail he said: “So, how
about it, are you willing to make less than 800% profit? :-)”

laughing again>

On Fri, 26 Mar 2004 deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:

Thank you for correcting me on that and thank you for your efforts. I didn’t send that e-mail again, I think it’s like the 2nd or 3rd one that has been re-sent a few days after…strange.

I was, of course, in this below e-mail, speaking from my own, admittedly limited, experience. For the help of those seeking treatment on the list…who are the other 3? How would people qualify?, I looked allot but apparently not enough, so if you know, it’s would seem better to keep info like that outside of your back pocket, if you know.
-Jason Bursey
—–Original Message—–
From: Marko [mailto:marko@mindvox.com]
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004, 6:00 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan

Marc gave you a free treatment

but I know of at least 3 other IBO providers who give free treatments; not
to you, obviously, but to others.

And when our Temple will be online, we’ll offer free IBO, too. Not to
anyone, of course.

Marko

On Thu, 25 Mar 2004 deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:

What I do know is nobody on this list was willing to do ANYTHING for me
before I met Marc and he did treated me FOR FREE (paging Dr. Mash) which
nobody on this list would have nor will they do.

From: Jon Ludlam <seraphina@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 26, 2004 at 10:58:12 AM EST
To: “INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
I just bought some tryptophan to help me get some soothing rest the
following week – I read this was helpful, but want to double check that
this
is a good post-ibo idea.

Any word?

Where can you find tryptophan??

Jon Ludlam

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 26, 2004 at 10:11:03 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you for correcting me on that and thank you for your efforts. I didn’t send that e-mail again, I think it’s like the 2nd or 3rd one that has been re-sent a few days after…strange.

I was, of course, in this below e-mail, speaking from my own, admittedly limited, experience. For the help of those seeking treatment on the list…who are the other 3? How would people qualify?, I looked allot but apparently not enough, so if you know, it’s would seem better to keep info like that outside of your back pocket, if you know.
-Jason Bursey
—–Original Message—–
From: Marko [mailto:marko@mindvox.com]
Sent: Friday, March 26, 2004, 6:00 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan

Marc gave you a free treatment

but I know of at least 3 other IBO providers who give free treatments; not
to you, obviously, but to others.

And when our Temple will be online, we’ll offer free IBO, too. Not to
anyone, of course.

Marko

On Thu, 25 Mar 2004 deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:

What I do know is nobody on this list was willing to do ANYTHING for me
before I met Marc and he did treated me FOR FREE (paging Dr. Mash) which
nobody on this list would have nor will they do.

From: Marko <marko@mindvox.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 26, 2004 at 6:44:01 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Marc gave you a free treatment

but I know of at least 3 other IBO providers who give free treatments; not
to you, obviously, but to others.

And when our Temple will be online, we’ll offer free IBO, too. Not to
anyone, of course.

Marko

On Thu, 25 Mar 2004 deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:

What I do know is nobody on this list was willing to do ANYTHING for me before I met Marc and he did treated me FOR FREE (paging Dr. Mash) which nobody on this list would have nor will they do.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine question
Date: March 25, 2004 at 8:53:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/25/04 5:51:28 PM, think@francomm.com writes:

My son experimented with switching Buprenorphine for
Methadone. It made him sick. Don’t know what the problem
is. We are working towards Ibogaine treatment.

The transfer point is at 30mg/day or less of methadone for switching to
buprenorphine. The buprenorphine has to be dose adjusted carefully during the
first few days not to precipitate withdrawal.

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 25, 2004 at 2:05:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

my fermented rootbark

Note that fermentation is not a part of the extraction processes
posted to date.

If the location is noisy you could try playing recorded music,
perhaps drumming, sounds of nature, Pygmies.. not pop with words.

Bill

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 25, 2004 at 1:10:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Tom – greatly appreciated.

My only concern right now is the possibility of distraction. My watcher
originally had a quiet location, but that feel through. And my hope was to
embark on Saturday night, but if I were to do it at my apartment, I have a
feeling that I’d hear the regular weekend revellers making noise into the
wee hours possibly ruining my trip.

Can anyone tell me how ‘perfect’ the surroundings need to be audio/visually
in order to facilitate the journey. I only have a window of a few days with
my fermented rootbark, so please let me know asap.

Thanks as always to everyone for your continued support.

B
—– Original Message —–
From: <tomo7@starband.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 9:52 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Brooke

In line with what Bill Ross was describing re: concerns about Serotonin
toxicity, a better preparatory coolout for rest and anti-anxiety would be
4 grams of L-Glycine. The tryptophan and 5-htp are in the pathway of
serotonin, which can trigger cortisol and other stress hormones if out of
whack. The glycine is in line for serine, which will help you get to more
comfortable landscapes. A source of neuroactive Magnesium, like a citrate
or aspartate would complement all that, so a capsule of it, around 200mg.
would accompany the 4 gr. Glycine every 4 hours a few times before travel
with Bwiti, I would estimate.

The Ibo will work with what you bring to the table, so to speak, so trust
that and fear not.

Dr. Tom

If you are going to take ibogaine while on effexor, or any other
antidepressant for that matter, definately do a small test dose of
the ibogaine before you do it for real.

Beyond this, taking a series of smaller doses and waiting for
each to take effect (an hour?) before taking more would lessen
the chances of serotonin poisoning and limit its severity if
it did occur. A small test dose will not tell you that a full
dose would be safe as far as serotonin poisoning is concerned,
since more ibogaine might mean more serotonin until the limit
of safety is reached.

Bill

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From: <tomo7@starband.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 25, 2004 at 12:52:26 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooke

The Ibo will work with what you bring to the table, so to speak, so trust
that and fear not.

Dr. Tom

If you are going to take ibogaine while on effexor, or any other
antidepressant for that matter, definately do a small test dose of
the ibogaine before you do it for real.

Bill

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From: “ann b mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine question
Date: March 25, 2004 at 12:50:54 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My son experimented with switching Buprenorphine for
Methadone. It made him sick. Don’t know what the problem
is. We are working towards Ibogaine treatment.

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 11:58 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine question

Does anyone have experience with kicking buprenorphine via ibogaine?

_________________________________________________________________
All the action. All the drama. Get NCAA hoops coverage at MSN Sports by
ESPN. http://msn.espn.go.com/index.html?partnersite=espn

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From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine question
Date: March 25, 2004 at 11:58:05 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Does anyone have experience with kicking buprenorphine via ibogaine?

_________________________________________________________________
All the action. All the drama. Get NCAA hoops coverage at MSN Sports by ESPN. http://msn.espn.go.com/index.html?partnersite=espn

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From: Jeff Penfield <PenfieldJ@jae.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 25, 2004 at 11:44:09 AM EST
To: “‘ibogaine@mindvox.com'” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I need to be taken off this list. My boss is getting mad. Thanks
—–Original Message—–
From: Paul MacLennan [mailto:leisure1@xtra.co.nz]
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 6:58 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas

Thanks for the advice, I appreciate it.

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 2:07 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas

Paul,

“I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?”

Absolutely NOT. No drugs including opiates when doing ibogaine, no speed, no cocaine, no alcohol, pretty much no anything. This is pretty serious stuff, taking ibogaine and opiates together can cause an overdose. Typically wait 24 hours (more if you can) after the last methadone dose or about when withdrawal starts before taking the tester dose, then the main dose. The lower the amount of drugs in your system when doing the iboga the better the outcome. Typically there will be little or no withdrawal when taking iboga/ibogaine for addiction, mileage varies.

Please read ibogaine.org/manual.html.(serveral times) and take it very seriously.

Brett

Paul MacLennan <leisure1@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?

—– Original Message —–  From: “Luke Christoffersen”  To:  Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 11:53 PM Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas   > It maybe that cognitave/memory enhancers intensify ibogaines effects. > Perhaps the increase blood flow to the brain does it. I don’t know if it > would be wise to use these during the peak phase of iboga. I find the > ibogaine intense enough. I once ate Baby Woodrose seeds. they’re similar to > LSD, while I was using ginko biloba and had fairly panicy time for an hour > or so. > > >From: CallieMimosa@aol.com > >Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com > >To: ibogaine@mindvox.com > >Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas > >Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:37:59 EST > > > >In a message dated 3/23/2004 12:13:01 PM Central Standard Time, > >lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes: > > > > > One guy I did my treatments with gave me the brain drug ‘piracetum’ > >when > > > the visions began to subside. It’s supposed to increase the flow of > >blood > > > between the two brain hemisphers. This brought them back again with a > > > certain clarity. > > > > > > >How very interesting! > >I do elderly and end of life care and some of my patients take piracetum to > >help with Alzheimers and a few that have Parkinsons take it. > >It does not have any really outstanding effect on the patients but no long > >term studies have been done either. I think the feeling is that it does not > >hurt > >and may help so use is continued! > > _________________________________________________________________ > MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* > http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus > > > /]=———————————————————————=[\ > [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%] > \]=———————————————————————=[/ > >   /]=———————————————————————=[\  [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%] \]=———————————————————————=[/
Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 25, 2004 at 10:51:43 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Boaz
2.5 grams. Is that’s very high dose. I was just wondering whether you would atribute the results you got to the higher dosage? It must have been very tough.

Luke

From: “wachtel” <wachtel@shani.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 18:38:51 +0200

As someone who digested 2.5 grams of Ibogaine HCL (all at once), while
“only” addicted to Nicotine, I must say that Ibogaine only did me good
in many respects. Although the “trip” was unpleasant to say the least,
it did me wonders In-terms of psychological maturity and enhanced the
value I attributed to life/love/friendship and health. It also made me
humble and my relations with people and the importance of nature
strengthened dramatically.
If you consider psychological stability a positive phenomena, (and many
do), I must say I was relatively stable before Ibogaine. But Ibogaine
allowed me to dive into my self consciousness and see the hang-ups and
the faults I have ignored. I other words, it was like pressing 10 years
of psychotherapy into 24 hours. Later, I slowly digested the info for a
long time thereafter.

I have treated over 5o people with Ibogaine HCL since 1988. In terms of
psychological problems, I have not encountered people who complained of
flips and lost of direction. On the contrary, the vast majority, even
those who had multiple conditions, said that they felt Ibogaine was
constructive for their psychic.

Boaz wachtel

—–Original Message—–
From: Nick Sandberg [mailto:nicks22@onetel.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 1:09 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 10:51 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

> I have tried to express similar fears…the few ‘darker’ trips I’ve
had
> have been incredibly terrifying, and the sensation of death of
> general ‘evil’ have pushed me very close to the brink.
>
> I know that much of this has to do with repressed guilt and a general
> sense of anger with life and myself – manifesting as the demons and
> torment in my visions – but I’m concerned that by reliving all of my
> horrible choices and deeds at once, I may just ‘lose’ it, no matter
how
> supportive and clarifying my watcher is.
>
> I’ve always been a bit of a high-strung guy…while the rest of the
> laid-back west coast population can smoke a ton of weed and ‘chill’
and
> giggle for hours, I have a tiny puff and things get very wonky – VERY
> quickly. My thoughts and perception of stimuli are fairly profound
> with a ‘clear’ head – when I’m on a mild psychadelic, it’s only
> compounded exponentially.
>
> Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
> somehow survived the experience
> mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?
>
> b
>
>

Hi Brooke,

I come from a multi-trauma’ed background – separation from birth
parents,
abuse, hospitalization – pretty much a horror trip (or so therapists
will
tell you). And I’ve had acutely negative experiences on acid, resulting
in
me not touching it for nearly 20 years.

I took some rootbark last night and had my usual “mild horror trip” – a
lot
of fear around being alone, underlying existential fears about waking up
and
finding I was the only person alive, and fear of encounters with
repressed
sides of my personality, wandering around my psyche like demons. But,
basically, it was a benign and learning experience. The drug just gives
me
the chance to see where I’m holding myself back and how I can direct
myself
in life and therapy. And, basically, I have always been attracted to the
dark side as well as the light. It’s ok to check out the torture
chambers
occasionally. Like this you get to really know yourself.

Ibo’s really not like acid – acid just lays its trip on you whether you
want
it or not. Ibogaine has intelligence. It shows you what you need to grow
–
maybe the mind judges stuff it experiences as “bad”, maybe “good.” But
that’s just the judgments. What I would advise is that you do it with
someone you know (who’s not taking it) and hold their hand on the
experience
til you feel safe. Might sound childish but any level of contact with
another human will help you feel more secure in a new environment. Also,
of
course, be aware how fear can just suck you in to its little mind game
and
go for directing the experience a little if it feels good. You also need
to
be secure inside yourself before you start that this is something YOU
actually want to do, not something others think would be good for you,
peer
pressure whatever. And, if it isn’t, don’t bother and don’t beat
yourself up
for it.

All the best

Nick

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: Blood levels of buprenorphine. The science matches clinical experience.
Date: March 25, 2004 at 10:01:26 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
I just got this note today from Andrew Byrne, who notes that “is
worrying that the American FDA has approved the marketing of the combination
product even
before research of this nature had been established. One wonders if they
have different standards for drugs used in the treatment of addiction.”
He’s talking about lessons learned giving test patients in a study
“high-dose buprenorphine following single administration of sublingual
tablet formulations in opioid naïve healthy male volunteers under a
naltrexone block,” and you gotta read below to see what they are Still
Learning about this concoction.
But what troubles me is that my pain specialist’s partner gave me a
pamphlet for exactly this shit last month, the incident I posted about here,
all angry and offended, when he asked if I were selling my pills (and the
flier I have for the stuff specifically warns that buprenorphine is
something doctors should be careful about prescribing as it is prime for
diversion to the streets) and other assorted commentary.
When I just now read news brief below this to my girlfriend, she
immediately said, “so that guy is trying to make you a fucking guinea pig”
which it appears is pretty much the case. How did the FDA approve this stuff
for marketing, (I Have the corporation’s pamphlet still, making sure to hold
on to it) without knowing this stuff still about the drugs and what happens
when they are combined in human patients? Btw, I told my own doctor there
was no way I was going to take the stuff, as the flier (“Important
information for patients- what you need to know about your treatment”) also
have an entire page of warning signs letting you know a doctor’s office
visit might be due as you liver is probably mushified and leaking from
whatever handy orifice it was can find- failing or suffering serious
life-threatening effects (as someone else noted recently, what “side”
effects? Those are Effects, period!) in other words
Egad, this is ridiulous and seems, oh I don’t know, somewhat wrong?
Opiates are bad, and one shouldn’t be on them too long no matter what the
reason, so we better get you taking This Stuff instead, cause it ain’t of
the earth and we won’t have any fears of your enaging in genuine
communication with the essenses of the planet herself in any way, we prefer
you engage in pure synthetic chemical flatness, no contact with the voices
of nature that she supplies us, those are not good and we wouldn’t want you
in touch with them. Hell, and we like you in a bit of pain anyway, cause
then we control you. Opiates work, and everyone can grow those. Bad, in
other words, and all the derivitives too, bad!
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 12:07 PM
Subject: Blood levels of buprenorphine. The science matches clinical
experience.

Pharmacokinetics of high-dose buprenorphine following single
administration of sublingual tablet formulations in opioid naïve healthy
male volunteers under a naltrexone block. McAleer SD, Mills RJ, Polack
T, Hussain T, Rolan PE, Gibbs AD, Mullins FGP, Hussein Z. Drug Alc
Depend (2003) 72; 1:75-83

Dear Colleagues,
At last we have some real data on buprenorphine half lives, absorption
and effects from healthy volunteer studies. These researchers, who were
working for the manufacturers, have taken 35 healthy males and given
substantial doses of buprenorphine after 50 -150mg naltrexone ‘block’.
They then measured clinical and blood parameters at regular intervals
for up to 3 days in an in-patient setting. Techniques for measuring
blood levels of buprenorphine are still being developed and are not
generally available in clinical practice. This makes patient history and
clinical observation even more important than otherwise. A liquid
chromatographic tandem mass spectrometric (LC–MS/MS) assay was developed
by these researchers and it was validated for the measurement of
buprenorphine and nor-buprenorphine, its metabolite, in blood.

Mean half life was found to be 26 hours with a wide range from 9 to 69.
Interestingly, these authors have confirmed some observations in
clinical practice including highly variable half lives and the
‘bi-exponential’ decay sometimes reported by patients. Some had a
‘secondary peak’ at about 10 hours from dosing. The authors report that
some had higher levels following meals and propose ‘entero-hepatic
recirculation’ in some cases. Maximum or ‘peak’ levels occurred between
30 minutes and 3 hours.

The addition of naloxone in the sublingual preparation made no
difference to blood levels. The time taken for the tablets to dissolve
were similar for all dose levels from 2 to 16mg (range 6–12 min) and
were no different for the combination product. It is worrying that the
American FDA has approved the marketing of the combination product even
before research of this nature had been established. One wonders if they
have different standards for drugs used in the treatment of addiction.

A weakness of the study was that it did not examine levels in on-going
treatment, but just individual single doses. Thus is it more relevant to
the initiation period, which is still a major problem for some patients.
There were no opioid effects using the naltrexone block at between 50
and 150mg doses prior to opioid administration.

comments by Andrew Byrne ..

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 24, 2004 at 10:24:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LMAO!!!! 🙂 Thanks Sara, I know it’s not funny but
that was very funny!

‘Marc Emery arrested for pot! For the 100th time!’
Maybe Marc should get a award? 😉

Marc if you’re reading this, love to you! Think what
you do is great and I’ll cc that to that huge list
too! Why not!

Forgive me if this is somehow serious and I’m having a
hard time taking it seriously!

Callie very sorry to hear about your insurance! I
would at least do what Howard suggested, he knows a
lot about methadone maintence and how it all works!

Carla B

— Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
Oh yes, there is a difference, before he was
aressted smoking a bong not
passing a joint.
A Bong is made mostly of glass and a joint of
rolling papers.RIGHT?

Is this bust somehow different?

Not being obnoxious, only curious. Is this serious
in some special way
that makes it different then the last 5 times Marc
got busted?

.:vector:.

— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
HI all,
Bad news. I wish the best for Marc and the others.
Peace,
Preston

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From: Anbmonkee403@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Anbmonkee403@aol.com
Date: March 24, 2004 at 10:06:43 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

please take me off this list

From: Anbmonkee403@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] cancell
Date: March 24, 2004 at 10:01:50 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

please take me off this list

From: “Paul MacLennan” <leisure1@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 24, 2004 at 9:57:40 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the advice, I appreciate it.

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 2:07 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas

Paul,

“I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?”

Please read ibogaine.org/manual.html.(serveral times) and take it very seriously.

Brett

Paul MacLennan <leisure1@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 24, 2004 at 5:40:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I just bought some tryptophan to help me get some soothing rest the
following week – I read this was helpful, but want to double check that this
is a good post-ibo idea.

Any word?

b
—– Original Message —–
From: “Bill Ross” <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 1:08 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

If you are going to take ibogaine while on effexor, or any other
antidepressant for that matter, definately do a small test dose of the
ibogaine before you do it for real.

Bill

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] No pay insurance
Date: March 24, 2004 at 5:09:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

oh man…. i’m really sorry to hear that, callie…

i’m afraid i don’t have any advice to offer you, but i just wanted to let
you know that i really feel for ya…

health insurance in this country just simply sucks ass…

I was handed notice at Methadone clinic last week that my insurance has
decided I do not need Methadone Maintenance anymore. Reason given was
“According to
the records your provider sent to us, our Doctor feels Methadone
Maintenance
is no longer needed.”
I of course got angry…….then filed an appeal. My Tenncare made me an
appointment to have an assessment done which I had today.
It took grand total of 15 minutes. 10 of those minutes was the MSSW
telling
me how she did not believe in Methadone Maintenance and that she could not
recommend that my treatment be continued. She said she feels 6 years is
long
enough and that ‘we’ should try something else. I asked her what she had
in mind
for ‘us’ to do since I have has inpatient treatment 7 times with no
success and
she said “you have not had intensive outpatient treatment”.
To make a long story short, I am fighting a losing battle I think. I will
continue my methadone no, matter if insurance pays or not but I am
fortunate
enough to have a job where I can continue by paying.
There are a LOT of other folks on TennCare who will not be able to keep
their
Methadone if the insurance quits paying.
We are so behind here in the South!
Do any of you west or east coast folks have any wise words to share on how
we
can enlighten these ignorant folks?
When my insurance started paying they told me I had to keep my urines
clean
to keep them paying. Well, I finally have for the past 9 months. Now they
say
that since I have not used in 9 months I am cured, so to speak. It’s a
lose,
lose situation.
Just venting helped! Thanks for listening and any suggestions will be
considered and appreciated.
Callie

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: March 24, 2004 at 4:34:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nick,

I just wanted to say I really agree with what you’ve said here, and I
think you said it very well. People are so afraid of anger.. especially
“new agey” sort of people…

and it’s really quite unhealthy…. because all they’re really doing is
supressing their feelings, not getting rid of them…

the only way to get rid of anger is to accept it and go with it. if you’re
angry, you’re generally angry for a reason. and that’s good and healthy.

its keeping the anger bottled up inside and letting it rot you from the
inside out that’s unhealthy.

Yes, friends are what will get you through.

When I hear you say things like “letting go of anger,” warning
bells sounds. My experience, and that of many others, is that you usually
have to wrestle a little with the anger first. Before you can forgive your
parents you have to really let yourself hate them first. Then the loving
comes naturally – “I forgive my parents for not being perfect.” It’s easy.
But you have
to allow yourself to go into the hatred first.

Buddhists, Reiki and healing people, and affirmation or NLP fans will tell
you you can let go of anger just through a few
little exercises or meditation. It’s bullshit. It’s sounds good. It
convinces the mind (especially when the fear of really feeling is high)
but
it’s bullshit. Over the last few years I’ve been in a hundred groups with
just about every Buddhist, Reiki artist and NLP practitioner you could
imagine. And every one I’ve seen reduced to chaos
rapidly through the fact that they are each, without exception in my
experience,
holding down enough anger to kill a bull elephant. Every single one, man.
They’re terrified of feeling it and they’ve allowed their mind to seduce
them away from feeling and expression what’s actually going on inside.

You can’t rationalize feelings away. It won’t work, they resurface and
will
drag your physical body down.

As for Reiki, hands-on healing and all this stuff – very little use either
for anger. (useful for other things). All this stuff can do here is heal
on
a superficial level, like a sticking plaster. I live in a new age
centre in the UK and am surrounded by healers. I can see the energy fields
around the bodies they’re working on and all the energy usually does is
close the throat chakra – blocking expression, blocking feeling. You feel
light, you feel spiritual, you think it’s great, but actually God has just
shut
your circuits down for a while cause you were overloading, and in too many
feelings to function.

Affirmations and NLP have their place in therapy but you can’t use them
for
anger properly. Anger management, yes. But not actually to give you what
anger will give you when you express it.

The body experiences anger when it’s been invaded. It’s natural and
healing.
When that anger couldn’t be expressed, because you were too young, because
it wasn’t appropriate, or because you’d been conditioned out of allowing
it,
it goes inside the body and resurfaces when something triggers it. This is
healthy. Alan Lowen, father of bioenergetics, calls anger the healing
emotion. It restores the body on a physical level after it’s been invaded.
The feeling of anger is totally healthy, it shows that your body and your
emotions are working properly. If you just try to meditate it away,
rationalize it, chant it out, affirm it away, then you miss. You miss the
reintegration of the body that has to follow invasion. The anger comes up
again and you forgive people left, right and centre, and you miss again.
So
on and so forth until finally the body becomes host to illness because it
has never actually been allowed to heal the way it’s designed to.

So, my advice to you is, find yourself a safe, supportive environment and
SCREAM your guts out. THEN you can forgive people, affirm away, or repeat
endlessly “I am not angry” and it will work.

Nick

The thing is is that the painfull/traumatizing/anxiety
feelings are always going to be there unless they’re resolved. That’s
why
we
use alcohol/pain-killers/meds to reduce these feelings. Whether
ibogaine
can relsove all that is another story but it will bring these thingss to
consiousness. Personnaly I found it very rewarding but it has been a
very
difficult time emotionally
Luke

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 24, 2004 at 4:26:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>
> Sounds like we have similare ‘issues’. I forgot to mention I’m on
> Effexor
> aswell-would I really have to stop it before I took the Iboga?That scares
> me.
>
In a word, absolutely. Also give yourself a little time after before going back on (if you do) and start with a lower dose. Ibogaine boosts serotonin, more isn’t better.

Brett

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 24, 2004 at 4:08:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If you are going to take ibogaine while on effexor, or any other
antidepressant for that matter, definately do a small test dose of the
ibogaine before you do it for real.

Bill

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 24, 2004 at 3:15:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sounds like we have similare ‘issues’. I forgot to mention I’m on
Effexor
aswell-would I really have to stop it before I took the Iboga?That scares
me.

Well, I’m not a doctor, so I don’t know that you would HAVE to stop
effexor before taking ibogaine… but it seems to me that taking ibogaine
while on a medication like that could be risky.

One of my really bad acid trips nearly killed me because I was taking
prozac and lithium at the time. Well, actually it DID kill me; I was
clinically dead for a little while, and then I was in a coma for 2 days.

I’m not too keen on repeating that experience, as you might imagine…eheh.

But anyway, there’s this thing called serotonin syndrome… when you
combine certain drugs that affect the serotonin system, you basically get
too much serotonin building up, and bad things happen. Bad things like
convulsions, loss of consciousness, and death. Presumably, that’s what
happened to me when i went into that coma..

Both effexor and ibogaine affect the serotonin system, but (as far as I
know) no studies have been done to determine how they might interact, so
it would seem sensible to me to avoid being the guinea pig for that
research.

I mean, combining effexor and ibogaine may in fact have no dangerous
interactions, but they certainly conceivable could.

If you are going to take ibogaine while on effexor, or any other
antidepressant for that matter, definately do a small test dose of the
ibogaine before you do it for real. Unfortunately, many of the symptoms of
serotonin syndrome are things that happen as a result of ibogaine alone,
so it would be difficult to tell if it’s the iboga or a drug interaction
that’s causing them.

The full list of serotonin syndrome symptoms:

euphoria, drowsiness, sustained rapid eye movement, overreaction of the
reflexes, rapid muscle contraction and relaxation in the ankle causing
abnormal movements of the foot, clumsiness, restlessness, feeling drunk
and dizzy, muscle contraction and relaxation in the jaw, sweating,
intoxication, muscle twitching, rigidity, high body temperature, mental
status changes were frequent (including confusion and hypomania – a “happy
drunk” state), shivering, diarrhea, loss of consciousness and death. (The
Serotonin Syndrome, AM J PSYCHIATRY, June 1991)

Anyway, I hope this helps you somewhat…

take care

jon

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 24, 2004 at 2:56:11 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks very much Nick (and everyone else too) for relating your experiences.

What you just said in that paragraph there makes me feel a lot better
about the idea of doing iboga.

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] gem from the Kerry drugwar thread
Date: March 24, 2004 at 11:54:04 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“When they took the fourth amendment, I was silent because I don’t
deal drugs. When they took the sixth amendment, I kept quiet because
I know I’m innocent. When they took the Second Amendment, I said
nothing because I don’t own a gun. Now they’ve come for the first
amendment and I can’t say anything at all.”

–Tim Freeman

Join up:
http://forum.johnkerry.com/index.php?showtopic=11770&hl=illicit%20drugs%20terrorism&st=195

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 24, 2004 at 12:01:50 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What about Subutex and/or Effexor? These are what I’m on.

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 2:07 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas

Paul,

“I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?”

Please read ibogaine.org/manual.html.(serveral times) and take it very seriously.

Brett

Paul MacLennan <leisure1@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 24, 2004 at 9:32:52 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?

Very, Very bad idea, stop methadone AT LEAST 24 hours before dosing iboga/ine. Learn it as best you can before you take it.
http://ibogaine.org/manual.html

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 24, 2004 at 9:07:41 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Paul,

“I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?”

Please read ibogaine.org/manual.html.(serveral times) and take it very seriously.

Brett

Paul MacLennan <leisure1@xtra.co.nz> wrote:
I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?

From: “Paul MacLennan” <leisure1@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 24, 2004 at 7:26:41 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I presume its ok to be on your prescribed methadone dose when taking ibo?

—– Original Message —–
From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 24, 2004 11:53 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas

It maybe that cognitave/memory enhancers intensify ibogaines effects.
Perhaps the increase blood flow to the brain does it. I don’t know if it
would be wise to use these during the peak phase of iboga. I find the
ibogaine intense enough. I once ate Baby Woodrose seeds. they’re similar
to
LSD, while I was using ginko biloba and had fairly panicy time for an hour
or so.

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:37:59 EST

In a message dated 3/23/2004 12:13:01 PM Central Standard Time,
lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes:

One guy I did my treatments with gave me the brain drug ‘piracetum’
when
the visions began to subside. It’s supposed to increase the flow of
blood
between the two brain hemisphers. This brought them back again with a
certain clarity.

How very interesting!
I do elderly and end of life care and some of my patients take piracetum
to
help with Alzheimers and a few that have Parkinsons take it.
It does not have any really outstanding effect on the patients but no
long
term studies have been done either. I think the feeling is that it does
not
hurt
and may help so use is continued!

_________________________________________________________________
MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

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From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 24, 2004 at 6:53:04 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It maybe that cognitave/memory enhancers intensify ibogaines effects. Perhaps the increase blood flow to the brain does it. I don’t know if it would be wise to use these during the peak phase of iboga. I find the ibogaine intense enough. I once ate Baby Woodrose seeds. they’re similar to LSD, while I was using ginko biloba and had fairly panicy time for an hour or so.

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 14:37:59 EST

In a message dated 3/23/2004 12:13:01 PM Central Standard Time,
lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes:

> One guy I did my treatments with gave me the brain drug ‘piracetum’ when
> the visions began to subside. It’s supposed to increase the flow of blood
> between the two brain hemisphers. This brought them back again with a
> certain clarity.
>

How very interesting!
I do elderly and end of life care and some of my patients take piracetum to
help with Alzheimers and a few that have Parkinsons take it.
It does not have any really outstanding effect on the patients but no long
term studies have been done either. I think the feeling is that it does not hurt
and may help so use is continued!

_________________________________________________________________
MSN 8 with e-mail virus protection service: 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/virus

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From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: March 24, 2004 at 4:49:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Nick,
I think I used the wrong words when I said I ‘let go of my anger’. I agree with you in that you have to feel your hatred towards your parents or whoever to release it. What I ment was that I worked through my anger. During that particular ibogaine session i was overcome with anger and rage and as this happened I saw hundereds of scenes in which I fought with my parents particularly my mother. The moved so fast it’s hard to remember how many there were but after this session I felt much more easy going and for some time I felt like I couldn’t even get angry if I tried and from time to time I still feel that way although I still feel that there is a deeper anger that hasn’t been addressed yet.

I find your ideas about reiki very interesting. I’m not that familiar with it but a friend of mine was going out with a woman who was a reiki master. She was very tempremental. He used to say how he felt effected by her engery while he was around her.

Luke

> Hi Jon, Sandy,
>                  I think i can relate to Sandys experiences in that
ibogaine
> can ‘break’ open your head and leting out some very painfull feelings. I
> feel very ‘cracked’ open after several ibogaine sessions with alot of
> physicall feelings. I was under the impression through my experiences and
> what I’ve read about the nature of repressed trauma is that this is what
> psychadelics do. They can open your minds defences and allow repressed
> traumas or emotions to surface. I think this seems to cause a lot of
stress
> and anxiety.
>                 I think there’s a great difference between ibogaine and
LSD
> in that ibogaine tends to bring an understanding of issues that arrise.
> Though it can also leave you with unresolved feelings rising to
> consiousness. I still take anti-depressants every day to keep my stress
> levels down. Perhaps that’s why they say that multiple sessions are more
> beneficial. It’s hard to tell as everyone is different. I ended up
> feeling much worse after my second ibogaine session I came out of it with
a
> lot of anger from childhood being released and ended up falling out with
my
> girlfriend. I was still drining heavily then and didn’t really have
enought
> awareness of the fact that I was taking out my anger towards my parents on
> other people. I managed to let go of much of that anger in a subsequent
> session.   I think it’s would be very helpfull to have loving and
supportive
> friends and your lifes cicumstances are important.

Hi Luke,

Yes, friends are what will get you through.

When I hear you say things like “letting go of anger,” warning
bells sounds. My experience, and that of many others, is that you usually
have to wrestle a little with the anger first. Before you can forgive your
parents you have to really let yourself hate them first. Then the loving
comes naturally – “I forgive my parents for not being perfect.” It’s easy.
But you have
to allow yourself to go into the hatred first.

Buddhists, Reiki and healing people, and affirmation or NLP fans will tell
you you can let go of anger just through a few
little exercises or meditation. It’s bullshit. It’s sounds good. It
convinces the mind (especially when the fear of really feeling is high) but
it’s bullshit. Over the last few years I’ve been in a hundred groups with
just about every Buddhist, Reiki artist and NLP practitioner you could
imagine. And every one I’ve seen reduced to chaos
rapidly through the fact that they are each, without exception in my
experience,
holding down enough anger to kill a bull elephant. Every single one, man.
They’re terrified of feeling it and they’ve allowed their mind to seduce
them away from feeling and expression what’s actually going on inside.

You can’t rationalize feelings away. It won’t work, they resurface and will
drag your physical body down.

As for Reiki, hands-on healing and all this stuff – very little use either
for anger. (useful for other things). All this stuff can do here is heal on
a superficial level, like a sticking plaster. I live in a new age
centre in the UK and am surrounded by healers. I can see the energy fields
around the bodies they’re working on and all the energy usually does is
close the throat chakra – blocking expression, blocking feeling. You feel
light, you feel spiritual, you think it’s great, but actually God has just
shut
your circuits down for a while cause you were overloading, and in too many
feelings to function.

Affirmations and NLP have their place in therapy but you can’t use them for
anger properly. Anger management, yes. But not actually to give you what
anger will give you when you express it.

The body experiences anger when it’s been invaded. It’s natural and healing.
When that anger couldn’t be expressed, because you were too young, because
it wasn’t appropriate, or because you’d been conditioned out of allowing it,
it goes inside the body and resurfaces when something triggers it. This is
healthy. Alan Lowen, father of bioenergetics, calls anger the healing
emotion. It restores the body on a physical level after it’s been invaded.
The feeling of anger is totally healthy, it shows that your body and your
emotions are working properly. If you just try to meditate it away,
rationalize it, chant it out, affirm it away, then you miss. You miss the
reintegration of the body that has to follow invasion. The anger comes up
again and you forgive people left, right and centre, and you miss again. So
on and so forth until finally the body becomes host to illness because it
has never actually been allowed to heal the way it’s designed to.

So, my advice to you is, find yourself a safe, supportive environment and
SCREAM your guts out. THEN you can forgive people, affirm away, or repeat
endlessly “I am not angry” and it will work.

Nick

> The thing is is that the painfull/traumatizing/anxiety
> feelings are always going to be there unless they’re resolved. That’s why
we
> use alcohol/pain-killers/meds to reduce these feelings. Whether ibogaine
> can relsove all that is another story but it will bring these thingss to
> consiousness. Personnaly I found it very rewarding but it has been a very
> difficult time emotionally
> Luke
>

_________________________________________________________________
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From: Anbmonkee403@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] REMOVE FROM LISTanbmonkee403@aol.com
Date: March 24, 2004 at 3:51:13 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

REMOVE FROM LIST anbmonkee403@aol.com

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 24, 2004 at 3:46:03 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh yes, there is a difference, before he was aressted smoking a bong not
passing a joint.
A Bong is made mostly of glass and a joint of rolling papers.RIGHT?

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Vector Vector [mailto:vector620022002@yahoo.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 24 maart 2004 3:28
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in
Saskatchewan

I don’t mean to sound insensitive which is what everyone always says
right before they are right 😉 I know sometimes I have the tendency to
think of a group of people on this list as these cool maniacs who do
crazy things, Marc is for sure in that category with Patrick, Preston,
Dave Hunter, all the rest. I forget sometimes or a lot of the time that
there are people behind all that.

Let me ask what I mean to say, is this a big deal or something? I mean
doesn’t Marc get himself arrested 5 or 10 times a year, mostly on
purpose? When he is arrested I have the idea that there are always a
army of lawyers and at least a few camera crews there too.

Is this bust somehow different?

Not being obnoxious, only curious. Is this serious in some special way
that makes it different then the last 5 times Marc got busted?

.:vector:.

— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
HI all,
Bad news. I wish the best for Marc and the others.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Tim Meehan” <tim@ocsarc.org>
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>; <cmap@mapinc.org>;
<ccc-members@yahoogroups.com>;
<maptalk@mapinc.org>; <drctalk@drcnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:46 PM
Subject: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan

http://sask.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=pot040323

“Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan

SASKATOON – Marc Emery has been arrested and charged with
trafficking
and
possession of marijuana.
Emery, nicknamed the “Prince of Pot,” is the founder and president
of the
British Columbia Marijuana Party. He spoke Monday night at the
University
of
Saskatchewan. Saskatoon police say shortly before midnight, they
were
called to
the Vimy Memorial near the Bessborough Hotel, where they found
about 15
people
smoking up. In court Tuesday morning, the Crown dropped Emery’s
possession
charge. He is due back in court on Wednesday for a bail hearing.
Justin
McGowan
of Saskatoon was also charged with possession.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

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From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] quote of the day
Date: March 23, 2004 at 2:36:13 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“The dark side of public floyd” by Pink Enemy
In the ’60’s, there was much talk of a soldier gone AWOL named private Floyd. Rumour had it that this soldier learned how to grow marijuana in his armpits ,distill LSD in his bladder and harvest opium in his nostrils. This resulted in a state of intoxication so intense that individual parts of his body would suddenly detach and launch themselves into orbit around the sun. One night Pink Enemy, avid astronomers that they are, noticed a new binary system consisting of two kneecaps orbiting what appeared to be an imploded human brain. Having devined that these were indeed the mortal remnants of legendary private Floyd ,they wittily decided to name the system “public floyd”, and in tribute composed this touching elegy.
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[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] No pay insurance
Date: March 23, 2004 at 11:04:09 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks so much. I will do what you have said. Sounds like good advice!
I will keep you informed personally.
Callie

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer/panic attacks
Date: March 23, 2004 at 10:49:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“BTW, I noticed that you recommended that I don’t do the drug at home – why is that? I can probably find a relatively ‘safe’ space, but I thought that triggers in my flat might be good for the experience. Thoughts?”

Think of it this way. Iboga unsets you like it would unset cement. The idea is to reshape the cement (you) without those triggers and let it set a bit, you have to be away from them to do this. It isn’t like you or the iboga is likely to forget something, whatever is important will come up. The only time I missed something when doing iboga when I was afraid of it. I needed a 2nd dose and didn’t go far enough, I did that a couple times. It is a bit different when it is not addiction but you still want to break through to a certain level. You will know how much

Brett

AG <adamg@013.net.il> wrote:

Hey,

To Brooke and all, I’d recommend picking up a certain book for the 2-3 days prior to the trip– “The Power of Now” by Eckhart Tolle. This guy used to get panic attacks and one night woke up into a major attack which led to a breakthru of sorts…

The thing is, reading his take on ‘reality’, the NOW, our internal dialogue etc is f-ckin’ trippy as hell- I thought this was maybe just me flipping out on his words, but I’ve met others who’ve confirmed this… he pulls these zen rabbits out of his hat and lets you peak behind the veil, if ever so briefly… very empowering, lucid and in ‘plain talk’ -not like reading koans or anything….

Also, his take on things is very suited for coping with the anxiety/panic and the drama that
unfolds during an ibogaine rebirth… to recap, you’re no more your persona than you are the id card in your wallet and just observing things from a little off to the side, in the midst of it all, should help you pierce thru….

all the best,
Adam

ps I second Brett’s suggestion that you don’t do this at home.. there’s something to be said about being in another environment- it’s not just because you get to embark on a journey but you also get to journey back home.

—– Original Message —–
From: Brooke Burgess
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 11:11 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Thanks for the continued support, Brett (and everyone, really!)

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] No pay insurance
Date: March 23, 2004 at 10:29:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/23/04 11:19:10 PM, CallieMimosa@aol.com writes:

I was handed notice at Methadone clinic last week that my insurance has
decided I do not need Methadone Maintenance anymore. Reason given was
“According
to the records your provider sent to us, our Doctor feels Methadone
Maintenance
is no longer needed.”
I of course got angry…….then filed an appeal. My Tenncare made me an
appointment to have an assessment done which I had today.
It took grand total of 15 minutes. 10 of those minutes was the MSSW telling
me how she did not believe in Methadone Maintenance and that she could
not recommend that my treatment be continued. She said she feels 6 years is
long enough and that ‘we’ should try something else. I asked her what she had
in mind for ‘us’ to do since I have has inpatient treatment 7 times with no
success
and she said “you have not had intensive outpatient treatment”.
To make a long story short, I am fighting a losing battle I think. I will
continue my methadone no, matter if insurance pays or not but I am fortunate
enough to have a job where I can continue by paying.
There are a LOT of other folks on TennCare who will not be able to keep
their Methadone if the insurance quits paying.
We are so behind here in the South!
Do any of you west or east coast folks have any wise words to share on
how we can enlighten these ignorant folks?
When my insurance started paying they told me I had to keep my urines clean
to keep them paying. Well, I finally have for the past 9 months. Now they
say that since I have not used in 9 months I am cured, so to speak. It’s a
lose, lose situation.
Just venting helped! Thanks for listening and any suggestions will be
considered and appreciated.

Callie,

Request a written statement from TennCare as to their decision. You might
also want to determine if your clinic doctor will indicate in writing that you
stopping methadone maintenance is against medical advice.

Once you receive the letter of explanation from TennCare send that and a
covering letter of yours to Dr., Westley Clarke and Mr. Charles Curie at SAMHSA
informing them that this is what your state is telling you to do and you know
you are not ready and may never be ready to cease methadone maintenance. Also
copy NAMA on your letter and make sure you have a cc: NAMA at the bottom of
your letter so Clarke and Curie know that NAMA is being informed of this matter.

See if you can obtain the contact addresses for Dr. Clarke and Mr. Curie from
the SAMHSA web page, <http://www.samhsa.gov/about/contact_frame.html>. You
may have to look around a bit or just call the office of the director and get
the addresses, full titles and contact information from that office. Once you
have the letter of explanation from TennCare we can discuss this further. And
keep me informed of what is happening. You can do that by personal email.

You can also vile a grievance report with NAMA. Get a pdf for the greivance
report and a medical release from
http://www.methadone.org/grievance_report.html

Your clinic may only accept their own medical release so pick up a some of
them as you will have to authorize contact with the state, your clinic, SAMHSA
and NAMA otherwise all of the parties will not be able to communicate with each
other due to medical confidentiality issues. Then take a deep breath and
drop a dose of ibogaine. Just kidding…mmmmmm?

Regards and good luck.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
NAMA
Baord of Directors

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 23, 2004 at 9:27:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I don’t mean to sound insensitive which is what everyone always says
right before they are right 😉 I know sometimes I have the tendency to
think of a group of people on this list as these cool maniacs who do
crazy things, Marc is for sure in that category with Patrick, Preston,
Dave Hunter, all the rest. I forget sometimes or a lot of the time that
there are people behind all that.

Let me ask what I mean to say, is this a big deal or something? I mean
doesn’t Marc get himself arrested 5 or 10 times a year, mostly on
purpose? When he is arrested I have the idea that there are always a
army of lawyers and at least a few camera crews there too.

Is this bust somehow different?

Not being obnoxious, only curious. Is this serious in some special way
that makes it different then the last 5 times Marc got busted?

.:vector:.

— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
HI all,
Bad news. I wish the best for Marc and the others.
Peace,
Preston

http://sask.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=pot040323

“Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Fwd: Free Marc Emery!!!!
Date: March 23, 2004 at 9:30:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, vox@mindvox.com, drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Here is the letter I sent. Anybody else sending letters? If so, I would like to see them.
Callie
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Free Marc Emery!!!!
Date: March 23, 2004 at 9:29:17 PM EST
To: Carillon@URSU.Uregina.CA, mercury_merc1@sasktel.net (Estevan Mercury), stoneprint@sk.sympatico.ca (Grenfell Sun & Broadview Express), mcnews@sk.sympatico.ca (Maple Creek News), mlprogress_mlp@sasktel.net (Meadow Lake Progress), editor@melfortjournal.com (Melfort Journal,The), editorial@mjtimes.sk.ca (Moose Jaw Times-Herald), njournal@sk.sympatico.ca (Nipawin Journal,The), observer@sasktel.net (Observer,The), editorial@paherald.sk.ca (Prince Albert Daily Herald), mmarshall@leaderpost.canwest.com (Regina Leader-Post), sheaf.editors@usask.ca (Sheaf,The), spnews@thesp.com (StarPhoenix,The), newsroom@producer.com (Western Producer), production@weyburnreview.com (Weyburn Review), editorthisweek@sasktel.net (Weyburn This Week), herald@whitewoodherald.sk.ca (Whitewood Herald), world_spectator@sasktel.net (World-Spectator,The), w.advance@sk.sympatico.ca (Wynyard Advance Gazette), editorial@YorktonThisWeek.com (Yorkton This Week)

This is a plea to anyone who has a fair and just bone in their body.
Marc Emery is being held without bond on a marijuana charge! A marijuana offense!! Not murder, not heroin, not cocaine…..marijuana!
It is reported that there are questions about the circumstances of his arrest. No matter what these questions are it should be evident that holding this man without bond is unfair and unjust.
Also, him being charged with ‘trafficking drugs’ for passing a joint is insane! Is there no justice in the place where Marc is sitting tonight?
All Canadians, whether they support marijuana decriminalization or strongly oppose it, should be outraged that this gentle, non violent human is being treated as if he has no human rights or freedoms!

Some of you journalists and politicians should act on this! This is a serious threat to your freedom of speech rights also.

IS THERE ANYBODY OUT THERE????????!!!!!!!!!

Tammy Nix
calliemimosa@aol.com

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] please help regarding Marcs arrest
Date: March 23, 2004 at 9:07:51 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Call the Police and tell them “Free Marc Emery Now!” Saskatoon police department: 306 975 8219; Department of Corrections: 306 956 8910; Saskatoon courts: 306 933 6698.  Contact the media and tell them to “Free Marc Emery!” Carillon@URSU.Uregina.CA (Carillon) mercury_merc1@sasktel.net (Estevan Mercury) stoneprint@sk.sympatico.ca (Grenfell Sun & Broadview Express) mcnews@sk.sympatico.ca (Maple Creek News) mlprogress_mlp@sasktel.net (Meadow Lake Progress) editor@melfortjournal.com (Melfort Journal, The) editorial@mjtimes.sk.ca (Moose Jaw Times-Herald) njournal@sk.sympatico.ca (Nipawin Journal, The) observer@sasktel.net (Observer, The) editorial@paherald.sk.ca (Prince Albert Daily Herald) mmarshall@leaderpost.canwest.com (Regina Leader-Post) sheaf.editors@usask.ca (Sheaf, The) spnews@thesp.com (StarPhoenix, The) newsroom@producer.com (Western Producer) production@weyburnreview.com (Weyburn Review) editorthisweek@sasktel.net (Weyburn This Week) herald@whitewoodherald.sk.ca (Whitewood Herald) world_spectator@sasktel.net (World-Spectator, The) w.advance@sk.sympatico.ca (Wynyard Advance Gazette) editorial@YorktonThisWeek.com (Yorkton This Week)

http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-2580.html
—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: 23 Mar 04, 4:48 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Another, longer article regarding Marcs arrest
This article explains how he is charged with trafficking. Unfuckingbelievable! And no bond! Sad, sad ,sad
. Hope he knows we are thinking of him!

PRESS RELEASE

March 23, 2004

CANADA’S ‘PRINCE OF POT’ MARC EMERY JAILED IN SASKATCHEWAN AFTER NDP RALLY
DENIED BAIL: SHOW CAUSE HEARING MARCH 24 AT 10AM, SASKATOON

TORONTO AND OTTAWA – Marc Emery, President of the British Columbia Marijuana
Party, was arrested and jailed on charges of allegedly trafficking marijuana by
passing a cannabis cigarette, or ‘joint’ late last night. Emery was also denied
bail at a hearing this morning. He is being held in Saskatoon pending a show
cause hearing tomorrow at 10am CST.

Emery, often referred to as the ‘Prince of Pot’, is currently in the middle of a
coast-to-coast tour of Canadian colleges and universities to encourage young
voters to become active in the political process and, more particularly,
encourage them to vote for the Federal New Democratic Party. Emery recently sat
down with New Democratic Party leader Jack Layton who in an interview with
internet-broadcaster pot-tv.net, advocated modernizing our marijuana laws and
“creating a legal environment in which people can enjoy their marijuana in peace
and quiet … without having to worry about being criminalized.” Since this
interview, Emery has been a staunch Layton backer and proud NDP supporter
wherever he goes. His current cross-country tour is inspired by the NDP’s recent
policy declaration on modernizing Canada’s marijuana laws and a recent Stats
Canada study which shows 75% of 18-24 year olds did not vote in the 2000
election.

“According to bystanders, a group of people were peacefully assembled for an
hour before Marc Emery showed up,” said Tim Meehan, of Toronto-based Ontario
Consumers for Safe Access to Recreational Cannabis. “Many questions remain
about the circumstances of Emery’s arrest. Among them, was he targeted because
of the political nature of his speaking tour? Emery has not faced any legal
troubles at other speaking stops during his current tour.” Emery was the
primary target of police action when they arrived on the scene. Along with
Emery, local supporter Justin McGowan was also searched, detained, and charged
with cannabis possession.

Also at issue is the charge of ‘trafficking marijuana’. Under current law,
simply passing or sharing a marijuana cigarette with a friend or loved one is
defined as ‘drug trafficking’. This is a serious flaw in the current legal
system, one which has been raised repeatedly by the New Democratic Party in its
opposition to the current decriminalization legislation. Emery finds himself
ironically the victim of the laws which he is currently fighting to change, in
so far as his behaviour in sharing a marijuana cigarette with other individuals
has been characterized as ‘trafficking’ and this characterization has been used
to detain Emery in jail and deprive him of his normal rights and freedoms for
over thirty-six hours. Canadians should be reminded that even if Bill C-10, the
so-called marijuana decriminalization bill, is passed, police would still retain
the criminal power to arrest people and brand them drug dealers — for simply
sharing a joint. “Currently, even simply giving marijuana for no money (“passing
a joint”) is considered trafficking. Bill [C-10] should be amended so that
non-commercial transfers of up to 30 grams of marijuana not be considered
trafficking,” according to a New Democratic Party statement.
(http://tinyurl.com/3527d)

“[Emery] doesn’t want people to come away from this thinking ‘poor Marc’. This
is about Canadians and our marijuana laws. The misapplication of these laws and
the discretionary pretext they provide to police, as evidenced through [Emery’s]
situation, should be cause for concern to all Canadians. This whole tour has
been about raising awareness of the harmful and failed nature of our
prohibition-era laws and getting young people involved in the political
process,” said Jody Pressman, coordinator of Emery’s tour across the country in
promotion of the NDP.

Emery was scheduled to speak at the University of Alberta in Edmonton on March
24, but due to his arrest, noted medical marijuana crusader Grant Krieger will
speak in his place. Emery and his team stand committed to promoting the NDP and
their policy of removing marijuana from the criminal justice system.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] No pay insurance
Date: March 23, 2004 at 8:51:31 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Holy shit that’s fucking NUTS Callie. I feel for you. Move to NYC. YOu can
take it as long as you’d like I think- of course, you’d need different
insurance of course.
This really is nuts. Can you afford a lawyer? You really, really should get
one, fast.
Google around online and see if there is some group that focuses on this
sort of issue- I’d be willing to bet there is at least one, if not a lot
more.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 6:18 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] No pay insurance

I was handed notice at Methadone clinic last week that my insurance has
decided I do not need Methadone Maintenance anymore. Reason given was
“According to the records your provider sent to us, our Doctor feels
Methadone Maintenance is no longer needed.”
I of course got angry…….then filed an appeal. My Tenncare made me an
appointment to have an assessment done which I had today.
It took grand total of 15 minutes. 10 of those minutes was the MSSW telling
me how she did not believe in Methadone Maintenance and that she could not
recommend that my treatment be continued. She said she feels 6 years is long
enough and that ‘we’ should try something else. I asked her what she had in
mind for ‘us’ to do since I have has inpatient treatment 7 times with no
success and she said “you have not had intensive outpatient treatment”.
To make a long story short, I am fighting a losing battle I think. I will
continue my methadone no, matter if insurance pays or not but I am fortunate
enough to have a job where I can continue by paying.
There are a LOT of other folks on TennCare who will not be able to keep
their Methadone if the insurance quits paying.
We are so behind here in the South!
Do any of you west or east coast folks have any wise words to share on how
we can enlighten these ignorant folks?
When my insurance started paying they told me I had to keep my urines clean
to keep them paying. Well, I finally have for the past 9 months. Now they
say that since I have not used in 9 months I am cured, so to speak. It’s a
lose, lose situation.
Just venting helped! Thanks for listening and any suggestions will be
considered and appreciated.
Callie

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] No pay insurance
Date: March 23, 2004 at 8:44:33 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Sliding scale” clinics could be the way to go, they’re a bitch to find down here, pay clinics ‘didn’t know’ about them. Howard has posted some methadone advoc sites, I imagine they would be a good place to start if you have to start shopping around for a new clinic. I didn’t even know methadone clinics would take insurance. Good luck.
-Jason
—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: 23 Mar 04, 3:18 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] No pay insurance
I was handed notice at Methadone clinic last week that my insurance has decided I do not need Methadone Maintenance anymore. Reason given was “According to the records your provider sent to us, our Doctor feels Methadone Maintenance is no longer needed.”
I of course got angry…….then filed an appeal. My Tenncare made me an appointment to have an assessment done which I had today.
It took grand total of 15 minutes. 10 of those minutes was the MSSW telling me how she did not believe in Methadone Maintenance and that she could not recommend that my treatment be continued. She said she feels 6 years is long enough and that ‘we’ should try something else. I asked her what she had in mind for ‘us’ to do since I have has inpatient treatment 7 times with no success and she said “you have not had intensive outpatient treatment”.
To make a long story short, I am fighting a losing battle I think. I will continue my methadone no, matter if insurance pays or not but I am fortunate enough to have a job where I can continue by paying.
There are a LOT of other folks on TennCare who will not be able to keep their Methadone if the insurance quits paying.
We are so behind here in the South!
Do any of you west or east coast folks have any wise words to share on how we can enlighten these ignorant folks?
When my insurance started paying they told me I had to keep my urines clean to keep them paying. Well, I finally have for the past 9 months. Now they say that since I have not used in 9 months I am cured, so to speak. It’s a lose, lose situation.
Just venting helped! Thanks for listening and any suggestions will be considered and appreciated.
Callie
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Another, longer article regarding Marcs arrest
Date: March 23, 2004 at 7:44:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This article explains how he is charged with trafficking. Unfuckingbelievable! And no bond! Sad, sad ,sad
. Hope he knows we are thinking of him!

PRESS RELEASE

March 23, 2004

CANADA’S ‘PRINCE OF POT’ MARC EMERY JAILED IN SASKATCHEWAN AFTER NDP RALLY
DENIED BAIL: SHOW CAUSE HEARING MARCH 24 AT 10AM, SASKATOON

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] No pay insurance
Date: March 23, 2004 at 6:18:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was handed notice at Methadone clinic last week that my insurance has decided I do not need Methadone Maintenance anymore. Reason given was “According to the records your provider sent to us, our Doctor feels Methadone Maintenance is no longer needed.”
I of course got angry…….then filed an appeal. My Tenncare made me an appointment to have an assessment done which I had today.
It took grand total of 15 minutes. 10 of those minutes was the MSSW telling me how she did not believe in Methadone Maintenance and that she could not recommend that my treatment be continued. She said she feels 6 years is long enough and that ‘we’ should try something else. I asked her what she had in mind for ‘us’ to do since I have has inpatient treatment 7 times with no success and she said “you have not had intensive outpatient treatment”.
To make a long story short, I am fighting a losing battle I think. I will continue my methadone no, matter if insurance pays or not but I am fortunate enough to have a job where I can continue by paying.
There are a LOT of other folks on TennCare who will not be able to keep their Methadone if the insurance quits paying.
We are so behind here in the South!
Do any of you west or east coast folks have any wise words to share on how we can enlighten these ignorant folks?
When my insurance started paying they told me I had to keep my urines clean to keep them paying. Well, I finally have for the past 9 months. Now they say that since I have not used in 9 months I am cured, so to speak. It’s a lose, lose situation.
Just venting helped! Thanks for listening and any suggestions will be considered and appreciated.
Callie

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: March 23, 2004 at 5:48:32 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 10:23 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks

Hi Jon, Sandy,
I think i can relate to Sandys experiences in that
ibogaine
can ‘break’ open your head and leting out some very painfull feelings.
I
feel very ‘cracked’ open after several ibogaine sessions with alot of
physicall feelings. I was under the impression through my experiences
and
what I’ve read about the nature of repressed trauma is that this is what
psychadelics do. They can open your minds defences and allow repressed
traumas or emotions to surface. I think this seems to cause a lot of
stress
and anxiety.
I think there’s a great difference between ibogaine and
LSD
in that ibogaine tends to bring an understanding of issues that arrise.
Though it can also leave you with unresolved feelings rising to
consiousness. I still take anti-depressants every day to keep my stress
levels down. Perhaps that’s why they say that multiple sessions are
more
beneficial. It’s hard to tell as everyone is different. I ended up
feeling much worse after my second ibogaine session I came out of it
with
a
lot of anger from childhood being released and ended up falling out with
my
girlfriend. I was still drining heavily then and didn’t really have
enought
awareness of the fact that I was taking out my anger towards my parents
on
other people. I managed to let go of much of that anger in a subsequent
session. I think it’s would be very helpfull to have loving and
supportive
friends and your lifes cicumstances are important.

Hi Luke,

Yes, friends are what will get you through.

When I hear you say things like “letting go of anger,” warning
bells sounds. My experience, and that of many others, is that you usually
have to wrestle a little with the anger first. Before you can forgive your
parents you have to really let yourself hate them first. Then the loving
comes naturally – “I forgive my parents for not being perfect.” It’s easy.
But you have
to allow yourself to go into the hatred first.

Buddhists, Reiki and healing people, and affirmation or NLP fans will tell
you you can let go of anger just through a few
little exercises or meditation. It’s bullshit. It’s sounds good. It
convinces the mind (especially when the fear of really feeling is high)
but
it’s bullshit. Over the last few years I’ve been in a hundred groups with
just about every Buddhist, Reiki artist and NLP practitioner you could
imagine. And every one I’ve seen reduced to chaos
rapidly through the fact that they are each, without exception in my
experience,
holding down enough anger to kill a bull elephant. Every single one, man.
They’re terrified of feeling it and they’ve allowed their mind to seduce
them away from feeling and expression what’s actually going on inside.

You can’t rationalize feelings away. It won’t work, they resurface and
will
drag your physical body down.

As for Reiki, hands-on healing and all this stuff – very little use either
for anger. (useful for other things). All this stuff can do here is heal
on
a superficial level, like a sticking plaster. I live in a new age
centre in the UK and am surrounded by healers. I can see the energy fields
around the bodies they’re working on and all the energy usually does is
close the throat chakra – blocking expression, blocking feeling. You feel
light, you feel spiritual, you think it’s great, but actually God has just
shut
your circuits down for a while cause you were overloading, and in too many
feelings to function.

Affirmations and NLP have their place in therapy but you can’t use them
for
anger properly. Anger management, yes. But not actually to give you what
anger will give you when you express it.

The body experiences anger when it’s been invaded. It’s natural and
healing.

Should have put here “when its boundaries have been invaded.” I didn’t want
to imply necessarily sexual invasion

Thanks

Nick

When that anger couldn’t be expressed, because you were too young, because
it wasn’t appropriate, or because you’d been conditioned out of allowing
it,
it goes inside the body and resurfaces when something triggers it. This is
healthy. Alan Lowen, father of bioenergetics, calls anger the healing
emotion. It restores the body on a physical level after it’s been invaded.
The feeling of anger is totally healthy, it shows that your body and your
emotions are working properly. If you just try to meditate it away,
rationalize it, chant it out, affirm it away, then you miss. You miss the
reintegration of the body that has to follow invasion. The anger comes up
again and you forgive people left, right and centre, and you miss again.
So
on and so forth until finally the body becomes host to illness because it
has never actually been allowed to heal the way it’s designed to.

So, my advice to you is, find yourself a safe, supportive environment and
SCREAM your guts out. THEN you can forgive people, affirm away, or repeat
endlessly “I am not angry” and it will work.

Nick

The thing is is that the painfull/traumatizing/anxiety
feelings are always going to be there unless they’re resolved. That’s
why
we
use alcohol/pain-killers/meds to reduce these feelings. Whether
ibogaine
can relsove all that is another story but it will bring these thingss to
consiousness. Personnaly I found it very rewarding but it has been a
very
difficult time emotionally
Luke

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: March 23, 2004 at 5:30:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes, friends are what will get you through.

If you don’t have some good friends, e.g. if your everyday friends
are tv characters or people you’ve only met online, I would consider
going with a lower dose of ibo.

Bill

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan
Date: March 23, 2004 at 5:29:19 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
Bad news. I wish the best for Marc and the others.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Tim Meehan” <tim@ocsarc.org>
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>; <cmap@mapinc.org>; <ccc-members@yahoogroups.com>;
<maptalk@mapinc.org>; <drctalk@drcnet.org>
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 3:46 PM
Subject: [drugwar] “Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan

http://sask.cbc.ca/regional/servlet/View?filename=pot040323

“Prince of Pot” arrested in Saskatchewan

SASKATOON – Marc Emery has been arrested and charged with trafficking
and
possession of marijuana.
Emery, nicknamed the “Prince of Pot,” is the founder and president of the
British Columbia Marijuana Party. He spoke Monday night at the University
of
Saskatchewan. Saskatoon police say shortly before midnight, they were
called to
the Vimy Memorial near the Bessborough Hotel, where they found about 15
people
smoking up. In court Tuesday morning, the Crown dropped Emery’s possession
charge. He is due back in court on Wednesday for a bail hearing. Justin
McGowan
of Saskatoon was also charged with possession.

<]=———————————————————————–=[

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: March 23, 2004 at 5:23:55 PM EST
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jon, Sandy,
I think i can relate to Sandys experiences in that
ibogaine
can ‘break’ open your head and leting out some very painfull feelings. I
feel very ‘cracked’ open after several ibogaine sessions with alot of
physicall feelings. I was under the impression through my experiences and
what I’ve read about the nature of repressed trauma is that this is what
psychadelics do. They can open your minds defences and allow repressed
traumas or emotions to surface. I think this seems to cause a lot of
stress
and anxiety.
I think there’s a great difference between ibogaine and
LSD
in that ibogaine tends to bring an understanding of issues that arrise.
Though it can also leave you with unresolved feelings rising to
consiousness. I still take anti-depressants every day to keep my stress
levels down. Perhaps that’s why they say that multiple sessions are more
beneficial. It’s hard to tell as everyone is different. I ended up
feeling much worse after my second ibogaine session I came out of it with
a
lot of anger from childhood being released and ended up falling out with
my
girlfriend. I was still drining heavily then and didn’t really have
enought
awareness of the fact that I was taking out my anger towards my parents on
other people. I managed to let go of much of that anger in a subsequent
session. I think it’s would be very helpfull to have loving and
supportive
friends and your lifes cicumstances are important.

Hi Luke,

Yes, friends are what will get you through.

When I hear you say things like “letting go of anger,” warning
bells sounds. My experience, and that of many others, is that you usually
have to wrestle a little with the anger first. Before you can forgive your
parents you have to really let yourself hate them first. Then the loving
comes naturally – “I forgive my parents for not being perfect.” It’s easy.
But you have
to allow yourself to go into the hatred first.

Buddhists, Reiki and healing people, and affirmation or NLP fans will tell
you you can let go of anger just through a few
little exercises or meditation. It’s bullshit. It’s sounds good. It
convinces the mind (especially when the fear of really feeling is high) but
it’s bullshit. Over the last few years I’ve been in a hundred groups with
just about every Buddhist, Reiki artist and NLP practitioner you could
imagine. And every one I’ve seen reduced to chaos
rapidly through the fact that they are each, without exception in my
experience,
holding down enough anger to kill a bull elephant. Every single one, man.
They’re terrified of feeling it and they’ve allowed their mind to seduce
them away from feeling and expression what’s actually going on inside.

You can’t rationalize feelings away. It won’t work, they resurface and will
drag your physical body down.

As for Reiki, hands-on healing and all this stuff – very little use either
for anger. (useful for other things). All this stuff can do here is heal on
a superficial level, like a sticking plaster. I live in a new age
centre in the UK and am surrounded by healers. I can see the energy fields
around the bodies they’re working on and all the energy usually does is
close the throat chakra – blocking expression, blocking feeling. You feel
light, you feel spiritual, you think it’s great, but actually God has just
shut
your circuits down for a while cause you were overloading, and in too many
feelings to function.

Affirmations and NLP have their place in therapy but you can’t use them for
anger properly. Anger management, yes. But not actually to give you what
anger will give you when you express it.

The body experiences anger when it’s been invaded. It’s natural and healing.
When that anger couldn’t be expressed, because you were too young, because
it wasn’t appropriate, or because you’d been conditioned out of allowing it,
it goes inside the body and resurfaces when something triggers it. This is
healthy. Alan Lowen, father of bioenergetics, calls anger the healing
emotion. It restores the body on a physical level after it’s been invaded.
The feeling of anger is totally healthy, it shows that your body and your
emotions are working properly. If you just try to meditate it away,
rationalize it, chant it out, affirm it away, then you miss. You miss the
reintegration of the body that has to follow invasion. The anger comes up
again and you forgive people left, right and centre, and you miss again. So
on and so forth until finally the body becomes host to illness because it
has never actually been allowed to heal the way it’s designed to.

So, my advice to you is, find yourself a safe, supportive environment and
SCREAM your guts out. THEN you can forgive people, affirm away, or repeat
endlessly “I am not angry” and it will work.

Nick

The thing is is that the painfull/traumatizing/anxiety
feelings are always going to be there unless they’re resolved. That’s why
we
use alcohol/pain-killers/meds to reduce these feelings. Whether ibogaine
can relsove all that is another story but it will bring these thingss to
consiousness. Personnaly I found it very rewarding but it has been a very
difficult time emotionally
Luke

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer/panic attacks
Date: March 24, 2004 at 12:53:22 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey,

all the best,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: Brooke Burgess
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 11:11 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Thanks for the continued support, Brett (and everyone, really!)

I’ve got your contact now, so am psyching myself up for the big event. BTW, I noticed that you recommended that I don’t do the drug at home – why is that? I can probably find a relatively ‘safe’ space, but I thought that triggers in my flat might be good for the experience. Thoughts?
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 23, 2004 at 2:37:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/23/2004 12:13:01 PM Central Standard Time, lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes:

One guy I did my treatments with gave me the brain drug ‘piracetum’ when
the visions began to subside. It’s supposed to increase the flow of blood
between the two brain hemisphers. This brought them back again with a
certain clarity.

How very interesting!
I do elderly and end of life care and some of my patients take piracetum to help with Alzheimers and a few that have Parkinsons take it.
It does not have any really outstanding effect on the patients but no long term studies have been done either. I think the feeling is that it does not hurt and may help so use is continued!

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 23, 2004 at 2:29:47 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/23/2004 11:33:00 AM Central Standard Time, bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:

if someone was going to be off all unnecessary meds, eat right, got rid of the un-natural foods, sodas, coffee, cold-cuts…, be well rested, calm, take B complex, fish/flax, you can toss in dl-phenylalanie, tryptophan, lecithin… they are going to do better than if their last meal was a ham sandwich and last thing they saw was the evening news

hahahaha! sorry to take this part of Bretts statement out of context but I couldn’t help myself! I think I would feel better if I did the above stated on a daily basis!

Seriously, we are so lucky to have Brett and all you others who offer your great ideas and information so freely.
I wish you were all my neighbors! We would have one kick ass neighborhood! No one would ever want to move!

Sorry……carry on………

Callie ;>)

From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 23, 2004 at 1:11:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

One guy I did my treatments with gave me the brain drug ‘piracetum’ when the visions began to subside. It’s supposed to increase the flow of blood between the two brain hemisphers. This brought them back again with a certain clarity.
Luke

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 09:31:55 -0800 (PST)

Tomo7,

I wouldn’t mix ibogaine with anything to enhance it. Grass seems to calm it a bit/enhance it slightly, ginger tea helps with nausea, some people will take a benzo but that is about it as far as mixing anything with iboga. (harmaline has been tried). Yes, sure if the diet is right, all the nutrients are there for a full and balanced neurotransmitter system… set and setting is in place, mood is right, procedure is followed without distractions… it will have a big effect on the experience. So if someone was going to be off all unnecessary meds, eat right, got rid of the un-natural foods, sodas, coffee, cold-cuts…, be well rested, calm, take B complex, fish/flax, you can toss in dl-phenylalanie, tryptophan, lecithin… they are going to do better than if their last meal was a ham sandwich and last thing they saw was the evening news and HARD ROCK or rushed home to do the iboga after work… Iboga time is your time, if you are not going do the iboga right you are disrespecting
yourself and the iboga – it will let you know too… Knowing how to meditate, clearing the head of thoughts, relaxing, breathing and doing the 3rd eye thingie helps to break through. Simply knowing to stay calm and not agitate (get up/move about) will change the experience. You want more colorful use a more natural flavor of iboga than ibogaine HCL, or mix the 2 – that is the only mixing I would do.

Brett

tomo7@starband.net wrote:
Brett:

Thank you for your sensible suggestions for preparation and management of
an ibo experience. These are consistent with my own experience.

If one is aiming at the psycho-spiritual benefits, rather than addiction
intervention, what would you suggest for complimentary “colorizers”? In
the ayahuasca journeys, Mao inhibitors such as Syrian Rue or local herb
sources of harmaline will accomplish this.

I know that our glorious ibo metabolites are not the same biochemicals,
but would Mao inhibitors or certain nutrients be helpful? If one could
safely build up neurotransmitter levels of Acetylcholine, Dopamin, Gaba,
Serine, or others prior to hosting Bwiti within your inner mind, would
that be a Good Thing? Would an upper strain of Sativa help early phases?

When I can next revisit that experience within lucid dream time, I will
get the most milage out of every psychic micro burst if I can prep myself
intelligently. My clients will appreciate more understanding of these
preparatory techniques as well. Thanks for your advice thus far.

“Come in She said, I’ll give ya, Shelter From the Storm” -Bob Dylan

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From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: March 23, 2004 at 1:05:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jon, Sandy,
I think i can relate to Sandys experiences in that ibogaine can ‘break’ open your head and leting out some very painfull feelings. I feel very ‘cracked’ open after several ibogaine sessions with alot of physicall feelings. I was under the impression through my experiences and what I’ve read about the nature of repressed trauma is that this is what psychadelics do. They can open your minds defences and allow repressed traumas or emotions to surface. I think this seems to cause a lot of stress and anxiety.
I think there’s a great difference between ibogaine and LSD in that ibogaine tends to bring an understanding of issues that arrise. Though it can also leave you with unresolved feelings rising to consiousness. I still take anti-depressants every day to keep my stress levels down. Perhaps that’s why they say that multiple sessions are more beneficial. It’s hard to tell as everyone is different. I ended up feeling much worse after my second ibogaine session I came out of it with a lot of anger from childhood being released and ended up falling out with my girlfriend. I was still drining heavily then and didn’t really have enought awareness of the fact that I was taking out my anger towards my parents on other people. I managed to let go of much of that anger in a subsequent session. I think it’s would be very helpfull to have loving and supportive friends and your lifes cicumstances are important.
The thing is is that the painfull/traumatizing/anxiety feelings are always going to be there unless they’re resolved. That’s why we use alcohol/pain-killers/meds to reduce these feelings. Whether ibogaine can relsove all that is another story but it will bring these thingss to consiousness. Personnaly I found it very rewarding but it has been a very difficult time emotionally
Luke

From: “booker w” <swbooker@hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
CC: swbooker9@yahoo.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: Tue, 23 Mar 2004 06:53:42 +0000

Now three years or so later, yeah I’m relapsing but at a very reduced rate, and I don’t really feel all that bad about it. I don’t seem as controlled by the stuff, but I still look forward to a buzz every evening. Lastly, it’s taken about that long for the panic attacks to subside again, and other meds played a big part I think (zanex, zoloft and klonopin.) I know what you mean about finally getting stable. I would still love to do another round of ibogaine, not necessarily to get clean, but just because it definitely changed me for the better even if still using. However, I just have a REAL STRONG idea that my mind is just not up for it. I envy folks who can take it repeatedly. I really wish I could. And I hope in the future to just try some really low doses just to see if it made the opiates less appealling again. But I have a bit of rough ibo that I just took a taste of one night and that sent me into high anxiety…so I guess it’s still gonna have to wait.

Anyway, that’s my story. I sure think you have to follow your intuition rather than any external advice when it comes to psychedelics, ibogaine in particular.

Best wishes to all you ibo freaks… Sandy Watson

From: “jon” Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com To: ibogaine@mindvox.com Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:07:51 -0500 (EST)

> The ibogaine dossier treatment section > covers both positive and not > so positive patient responses. Treatment > episode was of an early st > kitts when I believe their were dose escalating up from what were > pre-therapeutic > doses. The patients was very angry and trying to get her money back. I > provided some response in defense of the treatment outcome. And, the > answer is > yes, you are always going to get some patient who is dissatisfied but, not > many.

I dunno if this is what Callie was talking about, but one of the things that has kept me from taking ibogaine thus far (apart from the cost and logistics of getting hold of it) is fear of a bad experience. Not a bad experience as in “it didn’t do what i thought/wanted it to”, but a bad experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.

I’ve had a number of very traumatising experiences on LSD; one of which left me with a pretty severe anxiety disorder (panic attacks, intense fear of going insane, etc) for a number of years afterwards. I also had a moderately traumatising experience on 2CT7; not anywhere near as severe as the LSD ones, but still something I really don’t care to repeat.

I find I’m able to use mushrooms generally without any bad shit going down, but I’ve (finally..ehe) learned that I have to be VERY careful with more powerful psychedelics.

At any rate, there’s a large part of me that really would like to try ibogaine (or maybe an iboga extract), especially because I think it could help with my cigarette addiction, but also just because it sounds so fascinating; but I’m very wary of ending back up in a psychiatric hospital.

As much as I love Syd Barrett’s music, I’m not too keen on emulating his lifestyle…ehe. I’m finally at a point in my life where I’m relatively stable (don’t use hard drugs any more, haven’t attempted suicide in years, have a decent job,etc) and part of me is really afraid to risk losing this.

And, while i’m ranting about this..ehe… another thing that has me afraid of doing ibogaine/iboga is that i’d have to stop taking my meds before hand. i’m currently taking effexor and remeron, which i think have been very useful in getting me to the reasonably stable point i’m at now. and so, in addition to being afraid that the ibogaine will make me completely flip my shit, i’m afraid that going off the meds will revert me to the suicidal lump that i was years ago…

anyway, sorry for going off there, but i’ve been needing to get that out for sometime, i think….and I’d be very interested to hear what you folks think…

thanx,

jon

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From: “booker w” <swbooker@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine and panic attacks
Date: March 23, 2004 at 1:53:42 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: swbooker9@yahoo.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey there Jon. Thought I’d chime in on this issue as I had panic attacks for 3-4 years in my 20’s. They finally went completely away at about age 30 and I never really had another one until after my third ibo experience. My first two trips were really helpful and broke my pain meds addiction (altho I gotta admit I’m a relapser again – had too many pain issues to deal with.) Anyway, my third trip really did “crack” my head open and I began to have the panic attacks along with some other health problems. I felt like humpty-dumpty who fell off the fucking wall, for real…
Now three years or so later, yeah I’m relapsing but at a very reduced rate, and I don’t really feel all that bad about it. I don’t seem as controlled by the stuff, but I still look forward to a buzz every evening. Lastly, it’s taken about that long for the panic attacks to subside again, and other meds played a big part I think (zanex, zoloft and klonopin.) I know what you mean about finally getting stable. I would still love to do another round of ibogaine, not necessarily to get clean, but just because it definitely changed me for the better even if still using. However, I just have a REAL STRONG idea that my mind is just not up for it. I envy folks who can take it repeatedly. I really wish I could. And I hope in the future to just try some really low doses just to see if it made the opiates less appealling again. But I have a bit of rough ibo that I just took a taste of one night and that sent me into high anxiety…so I guess it’s still gonna have to wait.
Anyway, that’s my story. I sure think you have to follow your intuition rather than any external advice when it comes to psychedelics, ibogaine in particular.
Best wishes to all you ibo freaks… Sandy Watson

>From: “jon”

>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

>Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:07:51 -0500 (EST)

> > The ibogaine dossier treatment section

> > covers both positive and not

> > so positive patient responses. Treatment

> > episode was of an early st

> > kitts when I believe their were dose escalating up from what were

> > pre-therapeutic

> > doses. The patients was very angry and trying to get her money back. I

> > provided some response in defense of the treatment outcome. And, the

> > answer is

> > yes, you are always going to get some patient who is dissatisfied but, not

> > many.

>I dunno if this is what Callie was talking about, but one of the things

>that has kept me from taking ibogaine thus far (apart from the cost and

>logistics of getting hold of it) is fear of a bad experience. Not a bad

>experience as in “it didn’t do what i thought/wanted it to”, but a bad

>experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.

>I’ve had a number of very traumatising experiences on LSD; one of which

>left me with a pretty severe anxiety disorder (panic attacks, intense fear

>of going insane, etc) for a number of years afterwards. I also had a

>moderately traumatising experience on 2CT7; not anywhere near as severe as

>the LSD ones, but still something I really don’t care to repeat.

>I find I’m able to use mushrooms generally without any bad shit going

>down, but I’ve (finally..ehe) learned that I have to be VERY careful with

>more powerful psychedelics.

>At any rate, there’s a large part of me that really would like to try

>ibogaine (or maybe an iboga extract), especially because I think it could

>help with my cigarette addiction, but also just because it sounds so

>fascinating; but I’m very wary of ending back up in a psychiatric

>hospital.

>As much as I love Syd Barrett’s music, I’m not too keen on emulating his

>lifestyle…ehe. I’m finally at a point in my life where I’m relatively

>stable (don’t use hard drugs any more, haven’t attempted suicide in years,

>have a decent job,etc) and part of me is really afraid to risk losing

>this.

>And, while i’m ranting about this..ehe… another thing that has me afraid

>of doing ibogaine/iboga is that i’d have to stop taking my meds before

>hand. i’m currently taking effexor and remeron, which i think have been

>very useful in getting me to the reasonably stable point i’m at now. and

>so, in addition to being afraid that the ibogaine will make me completely

>flip my shit, i’m afraid that going off the meds will revert me to the

>suicidal lump that i was years ago…

>anyway, sorry for going off there, but i’ve been needing to get that out

>for sometime, i think….and I’d be very interested to hear what you folks

>think…

>thanx,

>jon

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From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 23, 2004 at 2:11:27 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the continued support, Brett (and everyone, really!)

b
—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 4:09 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Brooke’

“but I’m concerned that by reliving all of my
horrible choices and deeds at once, I may just ‘lose’ it, no matter how
supportive and clarifying my watcher is”

That is exactly what you want to do, lose it (the horrible choices and deeds).. Anyway, it isn’t like a garbage truck comes along and dumps all your shit on your head, event by event in excrutiating and painful detail – relax! Marc Emory said something abou it being the Ghost of Christmas Past, something like that, very non-judgmental, or there are parables, or any number of visions and dialogs in different ways.

“Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
somehow survived the experience
mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?”

That is the whole point of taking iboga in the first place, to be “mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact”, that is what iboga does.

Take 3 yogic breaths, say Ohhhhmmmmmmmmm, and take the iboga. .I hate thinking about taking it also (cuz yuck), so I don’t.

Brett

Brooke <brooke@blue.netnation.com> wrote:
I have tried to express similar fears…the few ‘darker’ trips I’ve had
have been incredibly terrifying, and the sensation of death of
general ‘evil’ have pushed me very close to the brink.

I know that much of this has to do with repressed guilt and a general
sense of anger with life and myself – manifesting as the demons and
torment in my visions – but I’m concerned that by reliving all of my
horrible choices and deeds at once, I may just ‘lose’ it, no matter how
supportive and clarifying my watcher is.

I’ve always been a bit of a high-strung guy…while the rest of the
laid-back west coast population can smoke a ton of weed and ‘chill’ and
giggle for hours, I have a tiny puff and things get very wonky – VERY
quickly. My thoughts and perception of stimuli are fairly profound
with a ‘clear’ head – when I’m on a mild psychadelic, it’s only
compounded exponentially.

Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
somehow survived the experience
mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?

>
> In a message dated 3/22/2004 4:08:13 PM Central Standard Time,
> jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:
>
> > but a bad
> > experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.
> >
> >
>
> That is exactly what I am talking about.
> I have tripped on acid in past without ever having a ‘bad’ trip but I
have
> seen folks totally freak. I know Ibogaine is not acid but acid and
mescaline
> trips are the only ones I have personal experience with.
> I just think it would be terrible to start tripping on Ibogaine and
it be a
> scary, psychotic torture trip.
> I know that in order to face my personal demon and to look at the
ruin I made
> in my past will not be pleasant. I have much difficulty looking at it
with a
> somewhat clear head. I mean I really have a hard time.
> Sometimes when I think of my children being 4 and 8 when I was so
fucked up.
> I left them with their Dad (who was a great Dad BTW) and I can hardly
think of
> the pain and disappointment I caused them. That is just my kids….I
hurt my
> parents, my ex-husband, some close friends and on and on.
> I just am afraid I would go totally insane, permanently check out
mentally if
> I had to honestly relive this.
> Callie
>
>

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From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 23, 2004 at 12:29:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you so much…that is greatly encouraging.

—– Original Message —–
From: wachtel
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 8:38 AM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] First-timer

As someone who digested 2.5 grams of Ibogaine HCL (all at once), while “only” addicted to Nicotine, I must say that Ibogaine only did me good in many respects. Although the “trip” was unpleasant to say the least, it did me wonders In-terms of psychological maturity and enhanced the value I attributed to life/love/friendship and health. It also made me humble and my relations with people and the importance of nature strengthened dramatically.
If you consider psychological stability a positive phenomena, (and many do), I must say I was relatively stable before Ibogaine. But Ibogaine allowed me to dive into my self consciousness and see the hang-ups and the faults I have ignored. I other words, it was like pressing 10 years of psychotherapy into 24 hours. Later, I slowly digested the info for a long time thereafter.

I have treated over 5o people with Ibogaine HCL since 1988. In terms of psychological problems, I have not encountered people who complained of flips and lost of direction. On the contrary, the vast majority, even those who had multiple conditions, said that they felt Ibogaine was constructive for their psychic.

Boaz wachtel

—–Original Message—– From: Nick Sandberg [mailto:nicks22@onetel.com]  Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 1:09 PM To: ibogaine@mindvox.com Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 10:51 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

> I have tried to express similar fears…the few ‘darker’ trips I’ve had
> have been incredibly terrifying, and the sensation of death of
> general ‘evil’ have pushed me very close to the brink.
>
> I know that much of this has to do with repressed guilt and a general
> sense of anger with life and myself – manifesting as the demons and
> torment in my visions – but I’m concerned that by reliving all of my
> horrible choices and deeds at once, I may just ‘lose’ it, no matter how
> supportive and clarifying my watcher is.
>
> I’ve always been a bit of a high-strung guy…while the rest of the
> laid-back west coast population can smoke a ton of weed and ‘chill’ and
> giggle for hours, I have a tiny puff and things get very wonky – VERY
> quickly. My thoughts and perception of stimuli are fairly profound
> with a ‘clear’ head – when I’m on a mild psychadelic, it’s only
> compounded exponentially.
>
> Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
> somehow survived the experience
> mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?
>
> b
>
>

Hi Brooke,

I come from a multi-trauma’ed background – separation from birth parents,
abuse, hospitalization – pretty much a horror trip (or so therapists will
tell you). And I’ve had acutely negative experiences on acid, resulting in
me not touching it for nearly 20 years.

I took some rootbark last night and had my usual “mild horror trip” – a lot
of fear around being alone, underlying existential fears about waking up and
finding I was the only person alive, and fear of encounters with repressed
sides of my personality, wandering around my psyche like demons. But,
basically, it was a benign and learning experience. The drug just gives me
the chance to see where I’m holding myself back and how I can direct myself
in life and therapy. And, basically, I have always been attracted to the
dark side as well as the light. It’s ok to check out the torture chambers
occasionally. Like this you get to really know yourself.

Ibo’s really not like acid – acid just lays its trip on you whether you want
it or not. Ibogaine has intelligence. It shows you what you need to grow –
maybe the mind judges stuff it experiences as “bad”, maybe “good.” But
that’s just the judgments. What I would advise is that you do it with
someone you know (who’s not taking it) and hold their hand on the experience
til you feel safe. Might sound childish but any level of contact with
another human will help you feel more secure in a new environment. Also, of
course, be aware how fear can just suck you in to its little mind game and
go for directing the experience a little if it feels good. You also need to
be secure inside yourself before you start that this is something YOU
actually want to do, not something others think would be good for you, peer
pressure whatever. And, if it isn’t, don’t bother and don’t beat yourself up
for it.

All the best

Nick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 23, 2004 at 12:31:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tomo7,

I wouldn’t mix ibogaine with anything to enhance it. Grass seems to calm it a bit/enhance it slightly, ginger tea helps with nausea, some people will take a benzo but that is about it as far as mixing anything with iboga. (harmaline has been tried). Yes, sure if the diet is right, all the nutrients are there for a full and balanced neurotransmitter system… set and setting is in place, mood is right, procedure is followed without distractions… it will have a big effect on the experience. So if someone was going to be off all unnecessary meds, eat right, got rid of the un-natural foods, sodas, coffee, cold-cuts…, be well rested, calm, take B complex, fish/flax, you can toss in dl-phenylalanie, tryptophan, lecithin… they are going to do better than if their last meal was a ham sandwich and last thing they saw was the evening news and HARD ROCK or rushed home to do the iboga after work… Iboga time is your time, if you are not going do the iboga right you are disrespecting yourself and the iboga – it will let you know too… Knowing how to meditate, clearing the head of thoughts, relaxing, breathing and doing the 3rd eye thingie helps to break through. Simply knowing to stay calm and not agitate (get up/move about) will change the experience. You want more colorful use a more natural flavor of iboga than ibogaine HCL, or mix the 2 – that is the only mixing I would do.

Brett

tomo7@starband.net wrote:
Brett:

Thank you for your sensible suggestions for preparation and management of
an ibo experience. These are consistent with my own experience.

“Come in She said, I’ll give ya, Shelter From the Storm” -Bob Dylan

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “wachtel” <wachtel@shani.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 23, 2004 at 11:38:51 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As someone who digested 2.5 grams of Ibogaine HCL (all at once), while “only” addicted to Nicotine, I must say that Ibogaine only did me good in many respects. Although the “trip” was unpleasant to say the least, it did me wonders In-terms of psychological maturity and enhanced the value I attributed to life/love/friendship and health. It also made me humble and my relations with people and the importance of nature strengthened dramatically.
If you consider psychological stability a positive phenomena, (and many do), I must say I was relatively stable before Ibogaine. But Ibogaine allowed me to dive into my self consciousness and see the hang-ups and the faults I have ignored. I other words, it was like pressing 10 years of psychotherapy into 24 hours. Later, I slowly digested the info for a long time thereafter.

I have treated over 5o people with Ibogaine HCL since 1988. In terms of psychological problems, I have not encountered people who complained of flips and lost of direction. On the contrary, the vast majority, even those who had multiple conditions, said that they felt Ibogaine was constructive for their psychic.

Boaz wachtel

—–Original Message—– From: Nick Sandberg [mailto:nicks22@onetel.com]  Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 1:09 PM To: ibogaine@mindvox.com Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 10:51 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

> I have tried to express similar fears…the few ‘darker’ trips I’ve had
> have been incredibly terrifying, and the sensation of death of
> general ‘evil’ have pushed me very close to the brink.
>
> I know that much of this has to do with repressed guilt and a general
> sense of anger with life and myself – manifesting as the demons and
> torment in my visions – but I’m concerned that by reliving all of my
> horrible choices and deeds at once, I may just ‘lose’ it, no matter how
> supportive and clarifying my watcher is.
>
> I’ve always been a bit of a high-strung guy…while the rest of the
> laid-back west coast population can smoke a ton of weed and ‘chill’ and
> giggle for hours, I have a tiny puff and things get very wonky – VERY
> quickly. My thoughts and perception of stimuli are fairly profound
> with a ‘clear’ head – when I’m on a mild psychadelic, it’s only
> compounded exponentially.
>
> Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
> somehow survived the experience
> mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?
>
> b
>
>

Hi Brooke,

I come >from a multi-trauma’ed background – separation from birth parents,
abuse, hospitalization – pretty much a horror trip (or so therapists will
tell you). And I’ve had acutely negative experiences on acid, resulting in
me not touching it for nearly 20 years.

I took some rootbark last night and had my usual “mild horror trip” – a lot
of fear around being alone, underlying existential fears about waking up and
finding I was the only person alive, and fear of encounters with repressed
sides of my personality, wandering around my psyche like demons. But,
basically, it was a benign and learning experience. The drug just gives me
the chance to see where I’m holding myself back and how I can direct myself
in life and therapy. And, basically, I have always been attracted to the
dark side as well as the light. It’s ok to check out the torture chambers
occasionally. Like this you get to really know yourself.

Ibo’s really not like acid – acid just lays its trip on you whether you want
it or not. Ibogaine has intelligence. It shows you what you need to grow –
maybe the mind judges stuff it experiences as “bad”, maybe “good.” But
that’s just the judgments. What I would advise is that you do it with
someone you know (who’s not taking it) and hold their hand on the experience
til you feel safe. Might sound childish but any level of contact with
another human will help you feel more secure in a new environment. Also, of
course, be aware how fear can just suck you in to its little mind game and
go for directing the experience a little if it feels good. You also need to
be secure inside yourself before you start that this is something YOU
actually want to do, not something others think would be good for you, peer
pressure whatever. And, if it isn’t, don’t bother and don’t beat yourself up
for it.

All the best

Nick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] Check out “In Praise of Laudanum”
Date: March 23, 2004 at 7:56:52 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Once a year I hire a crew from the landscaper because it remains the
best-run business of its kind in town. The boss always comes by to check. He
too is clean and sober but the recovery that the professor radiates is not
available to him. Not because he wouldn’t do anything to have it, but
because abstinence is not the cure for his affliction. Treatment has helped
him find ways to cope that have enabled him finally to get the correctional
people out of his life. But I see in him deep sorrow and loss, and I despise
a piece of what I do. This man remains unwell and doubly afflicted because
though he knows exactly how to get well, the means are simply not available
to him.”

Hi all,
This above quote is from the amazing article below. It’s just too
rational though I’m afraid, for it to resonate with the people who matter,
the ones who continue to support the war in one way or a bunch of others.
Peace,
Preston
‘
—– Original Message —–
From: SherriTheWriter@aol.com
To: drugwar@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 23, 2004 6:08 AM
Subject: [drugwar] Check out “In Praise of Laudanum”

Click Here: Check out “In Praise of Laudanum” An odd source, an interesting
read….

http://www.amconmag.com/2004_03_29/article1.html

Exerpts follow:

March 29, 2004 issue
Copyright © 2004 The American Conservative

In Praise of Laudanum

For some, “addiction” may be the only cure.

By Jim Pittaway
One of the elements of dramatic tension in the wonderful Master and
Commander series of books is the relationship between the brilliant and
resourceful ship’s surgeon, Dr. Maturin, and the laudanum with which he
self-medicates. Author Patrick O’Brian is widely praised for the
authenticity of his rendering of the language, behaviors, and mores of
Napoleonic times, but here he projects contemporary issues onto his
characters and their circumstances. A real Dr. Maturin, like his
contemporary Capt. Meriwether Lewis—with his famous “melancholia”—would have
been perfectly free to medicate himself to his heart’s content without
enduring either social opprobrium or shame and self-doubt. If Rush Limbaugh
lived in any other era, we would not be having a national conversation about
his behavior and the state would never be pursuing his medical records for
evidence of crimes he may or may not have perpetrated upon himself.

Over the decade I have spent as a practitioner licensed by my state to
treat, among other things, addiction and addiction-related disorders, I have
become increasingly troubled by things other than my patients’ actual use.
As I have transitioned from in-patient addiction treatment and private
practice to working with head-injured and often severely disabled patients,
I have become less doctrinaire about use itself and more aware of
complexities of circumstance as they affect individuals. The cases causing
me the greatest concern have one common element: they involve pain
medication.

Until the great government power-grab of Franklin Roosevelt’s New Deal,
Americans were assumed competent to treat themselves for chronic or acute
pain, as well as for what we now imperfectly describe as chemical imbalances
of the brain—such as bipolar disorder—by simply stopping at a corner
apothecary and purchasing such tincture of opium as they judged appropriate
for their needs. This actually went on for centuries without generating
serious social or moral problems. Undoubtedly, many individuals became
“addicted” and the opportunity for drug “abuse” abounded, but such excesses
were the business of family and community. No tyrannical European king or
dictator even dreamed of so intruding on the private lives of individuals as
to interfere with access to pain relief and psychological equilibrium. At
least not until FDR’s Harry Anslinger, of the Bureau of Narcotics and
Dangerous Drugs, set about criminalizing vast tracts of human behavior in
his push to build a crime-fighting empire on behalf of the state whose power
he and his boss were so dedicated to expanding.
snip-

Check out the rest of the article at the above link.

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 23, 2004 at 7:36:46 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Jon

Sounds like we have similare ‘issues’. I forgot to mention I’m on Effexor
aswell-would I really have to stop it before I took the Iboga?That scares
me.

LOL Hannah

PS Hattie-I’ve only got a mobile phone at the moment n so can’t afford to
call you really,especially on your mobile.I think I’ve got your email
address off the site so I’ll have to email you for now.Thanks though 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 10:07 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

The ibogaine dossier treatment section
<http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/treatment.html> covers both positive and
not
so positive patient responses. Treatment
episode <http://ibogaine.desk.nl/experience-1297.html> was of an early
st
kitts when I believe their were dose escalating up from what were
pre-therapeutic
doses. The patients was very angry and trying to get her money back.
I
provided some response in defense of the treatment outcome. And, the
answer is
yes, you are always going to get some patient who is dissatisfied but,
not
many.

I dunno if this is what Callie was talking about, but one of the things
that has kept me from taking ibogaine thus far (apart from the cost and
logistics of getting hold of it) is fear of a bad experience. Not a bad
experience as in “it didn’t do what i thought/wanted it to”, but a bad
experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.

I’ve had a number of very traumatising experiences on LSD; one of which
left me with a pretty severe anxiety disorder (panic attacks, intense
fear
of going insane, etc) for a number of years afterwards. I also had a
moderately traumatising experience on 2CT7; not anywhere near as severe
as
the LSD ones, but still something I really don’t care to repeat.

I find I’m able to use mushrooms generally without any bad shit going
down, but I’ve (finally..ehe) learned that I have to be VERY careful
with
more powerful psychedelics.

At any rate, there’s a large part of me that really would like to try
ibogaine (or maybe an iboga extract), especially because I think it
could
help with my cigarette addiction, but also just because it sounds so
fascinating; but I’m very wary of ending back up in a psychiatric
hospital.

As much as I love Syd Barrett’s music, I’m not too keen on emulating his
lifestyle…ehe. I’m finally at a point in my life where I’m relatively
stable (don’t use hard drugs any more, haven’t attempted suicide in
years,
have a decent job,etc) and part of me is really afraid to risk losing
this.

And, while i’m ranting about this..ehe… another thing that has me
afraid
of doing ibogaine/iboga is that i’d have to stop taking my meds before
hand. i’m currently taking effexor and remeron, which i think have been
very useful in getting me to the reasonably stable point i’m at now. and
so, in addition to being afraid that the ibogaine will make me
completely
flip my shit, i’m afraid that going off the meds will revert me to the
suicidal lump that i was years ago…

anyway, sorry for going off there, but i’ve been needing to get that out
for sometime, i think….and I’d be very interested to hear what you
folks
think…

thanx,

jon

btw… Brett, if you’re reading this, I know I’ve been a shit about
keeping in touch with you… i think what i’m talking about here is part
of the reason why. to be honest, i’m not very good at keeping in touch
with people in general… but one of my psychopathologies that i’ve yet
to
really get over completely is the whole denial thing… like, if there’s
something that’s causing me some kind of stress, i have a tendency to
just
pretend it doesn’t exist. i mean, i’m definately better about it than i
was back when i was a junky, but i’m certainly far from completely
better
about it. for what it’s worth, i’m sorry.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 23, 2004 at 6:08:59 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 10:51 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

I have tried to express similar fears…the few ‘darker’ trips I’ve had
have been incredibly terrifying, and the sensation of death of
general ‘evil’ have pushed me very close to the brink.

Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
somehow survived the experience
mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?

Hi Brooke,

I come from a multi-trauma’ed background – separation from birth parents,
abuse, hospitalization – pretty much a horror trip (or so therapists will
tell you). And I’ve had acutely negative experiences on acid, resulting in
me not touching it for nearly 20 years.

I took some rootbark last night and had my usual “mild horror trip” – a lot
of fear around being alone, underlying existential fears about waking up and
finding I was the only person alive, and fear of encounters with repressed
sides of my personality, wandering around my psyche like demons. But,
basically, it was a benign and learning experience. The drug just gives me
the chance to see where I’m holding myself back and how I can direct myself
in life and therapy. And, basically, I have always been attracted to the
dark side as well as the light. It’s ok to check out the torture chambers
occasionally. Like this you get to really know yourself.

Ibo’s really not like acid – acid just lays its trip on you whether you want
it or not. Ibogaine has intelligence. It shows you what you need to grow –
maybe the mind judges stuff it experiences as “bad”, maybe “good.” But
that’s just the judgments. What I would advise is that you do it with
someone you know (who’s not taking it) and hold their hand on the experience
til you feel safe. Might sound childish but any level of contact with
another human will help you feel more secure in a new environment. Also, of
course, be aware how fear can just suck you in to its little mind game and
go for directing the experience a little if it feels good. You also need to
be secure inside yourself before you start that this is something YOU
actually want to do, not something others think would be good for you, peer
pressure whatever. And, if it isn’t, don’t bother and don’t beat yourself up
for it.

All the best

Nick

>From: “jon”

>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

>Date: Mon, 22 Mar 2004 17:07:51 -0500 (EST)

> > The ibogaine dossier treatment section

> > covers both positive and not

> > so positive patient responses. Treatment

> > episode was of an early st

> > kitts when I believe their were dose escalating up from what were

> > pre-therapeutic

> > doses. The patients was very angry and trying to get her money back. I

> > provided some response in defense of the treatment outcome. And, the

> > answer is

> > yes, you are always going to get some patient who is dissatisfied but, not

> > many.

>I dunno if this is what Callie was talking about, but one of the things

>that has kept me from taking ibogaine thus far (apart from the cost and

>logistics of getting hold of it) is fear of a bad experience. Not a bad

>experience as in “it didn’t do what i thought/wanted it to”, but a bad

>experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.

>I’ve had a number of very traumatising experiences on LSD; one of which

>left me with a pretty severe anxiety disorder (panic attacks, intense fear

>of going insane, etc) for a number of years afterwards. I also had a

>moderately traumatising experience on 2CT7; not anywhere near as severe as

>the LSD ones, but still something I really don’t care to repeat.

>I find I’m able to use mushrooms generally without any bad shit going

>down, but I’ve (finally..ehe) learned that I have to be VERY careful with

>more powerful psychedelics.

>At any rate, there’s a large part of me that really would like to try

>ibogaine (or maybe an iboga extract), especially because I think it could

>help with my cigarette addiction, but also just because it sounds so

>fascinating; but I’m very wary of ending back up in a psychiatric

>hospital.

>As much as I love Syd Barrett’s music, I’m not too keen on emulating his

>lifestyle…ehe. I’m finally at a point in my life where I’m relatively

>stable (don’t use hard drugs any more, haven’t attempted suicide in years,

>have a decent job,etc) and part of me is really afraid to risk losing

>this.

>And, while i’m ranting about this..ehe… another thing that has me afraid

>of doing ibogaine/iboga is that i’d have to stop taking my meds before

>hand. i’m currently taking effexor and remeron, which i think have been

>very useful in getting me to the reasonably stable point i’m at now. and

>so, in addition to being afraid that the ibogaine will make me completely

>flip my shit, i’m afraid that going off the meds will revert me to the

>suicidal lump that i was years ago…

>anyway, sorry for going off there, but i’ve been needing to get that out

>for sometime, i think….and I’d be very interested to hear what you folks

>think…

>thanx,

>jon

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 10:47:45 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Didn’t Tim L. talk about wondering how much information/reality the human mind can stand? How much knowledge can the human brain/mind take before it is overwhelmed? Very serious stuff to consider I guess.
I’ve had bad/panic type experiences on LSD (the person I dropped with was convinced that his was cut with poison and a few hours later when I finally got distance from them I started thinking “I took the same thing they did” and bam, panic etc. Yes, on LSD and X;, but never on natural ones like shrooms or mescal/peyote; iboga wasn’t like any of these, it definitely has it’s own character and personality–. To be honest, I was scarred shitless beforehand of going through it. Sickness is bad enough by itself, sick while tripping (takes me back to my Laam cold turkey kick (4 hours of sleep in 6 weeks–beyond unspeakable pain); so yeah, iboga lasting as long as it does…disserves not fear but respect. My biggest fear with it is biting off more then can chew then being stuck for so long in that harsh lesson; respect it, learn it, but fear it? I haven’t felt ‘out of control’ on iboga; Ego seems to be able to be present, discarded or kept at your choice…too often we put back on our armor out of habit after the experience, i went to jail afterwards and that definitely made shit worse in that regard, more hardened, less trusting…which is the direct opposite of what iboga told me was the way……Sometimes a mind blinder is just what was needed. I am a little biased in this but for me: lsd only scatters, iboga scatters then re-focus’s; it was very spiritual, but remember when I say this that the basics of Buddha:
1. All life is suffering
2. The cause of suffering is dukka (loosely trans. as desire)
3. The way to graduate from suffering is through compassion.
I would imagine a facilitator could give better information on how often people just loose it; i’d bet their aren’t many if everything is done in a respectful, non-arrogant, and teachable way.
I got hit with a bombshell today…Few weeks back had the roughest time I had yet and HAD to talk to someone….so not being experienced in international calls from Texas I call Sara (www.iboga.tk) and she was compassionate enough to talk to me for…lets see…(flipping through ‘war&piece’phone bill)….about 149 minutes…I felt much better afterwards and she didn稚 make a dime off of talking to me. I had no idea…the phone bill came today…..$750 Stuff like that will make me like SdBarrett, not iboga : ) I think Marc Emery’s Christmas Past analogy is fitting, but I知 probably a little biased to that subject too.
-Jason

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: 22 Mar 04, 4:10 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Brooke’

“but I’m concerned that by reliving all of my
horrible choices and deeds at once, I may just ‘lose’ it, no matter how
supportive and clarifying my watcher is”

“Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
somehow survived the experience
mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?”

That is the whole point of taking iboga in the first place, to be “mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact”, that is what iboga does.

Take 3 yogic breaths, say Ohhhhmmmmmmmmm, and take the iboga. .I hate thinking about taking it also (cuz yuck), so I don’t.

Brett

Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
somehow survived the experience
mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?

/]=———————————————————————=[¥
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¥]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 7:09:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooke’

“but I’m concerned that by reliving all of my
horrible choices and deeds at once, I may just ‘lose’ it, no matter how
supportive and clarifying my watcher is”

“Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
somehow survived the experience
mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?”

That is the whole point of taking iboga in the first place, to be “mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact”, that is what iboga does.

Take 3 yogic breaths, say Ohhhhmmmmmmmmm, and take the iboga. .I hate thinking about taking it also (cuz yuck), so I don’t.

Brett

Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
somehow survived the experience
mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 6:44:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie

“I know Ibogaine is not acid but acid and mescaline trips are the only ones I have personal experience with.”

Good, it isn’t anything like any of those. If you can imagine 4th dimensional dreaming, that would be a good description.

“just think it would be terrible to start tripping on Ibogaine and it be a scary, psychotic torture trip.”

OH MY GOD, THAT WOULD BE TERRIBLE!!!!!

Good thing you can open your eyes at any time or blink and change the station you are tuned into. You had me worried for a second. You are still stuck with a disgusting buzz, nausea, etc.

“I just am afraid I would go totally insane, permanently check out mentally if I had to honestly relive this.”

First, if you are not already insane ibogaine isn’t going to make you insane and no, you are not going to “check out” anywhere (that’s cheating)..

Ibogaine/iboga allows someone to re-intergrate past events. This is a helpful thing when you want the shit you did to stop keeping you from who you are, and happiness.

Iboga is peace, love, understanding and knowledge, a bit like ZEN in a pill. I remember my first time, I was ready for those demons, and there I was, they were a coming, any time now, so finally I visualized some demon looking creature and started to laugh at it. Iboga is also the truth and you will be shown, but not the way you normally see things, it is somewhat detached, matter of fact, lessons in parables that are YOU pick the answers to – it is really pretty wild, but not, it is all you. Addiction and all the things we hold onto so dearly fights like a cat being stuffed in a toilet bowl (for cleaning, it was at the suggestion of the dog, dumb dog forgot to warn me about my fingers around the edge of the lid). Anway, what I am saying is that fear keeps us stuck (wherever), ain’t nothing else better at breaking through than ibogaine. You will forgive yourself, you deserve it.

The events and issues come as they come. People tend to get what they need and can handle/process, some don’t get visions – sit there in a lit room and you will likely have none, but why?

You wil be just fine. The worst part about doing ibogaine is awfulizing about it… (stop that).. As far as you fear reliving it, perhaps that is fear of being relieved of it…

Brett

CallieMimosa@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 3/22/2004 4:08:13 PM Central Standard Time, jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:

but a bad
experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.

That is exactly what I am talking about.
I have tripped on acid in past without ever having a ‘bad’ trip but I have seen folks totally freak. I know Ibogaine is not acid but acid and mescaline trips are the only ones I have personal experience with.
I just think it would be terrible to start tripping on Ibogaine and it be a scary, psychotic torture trip.
I know that in order to face my personal demon and to look at the ruin I made in my past will not be pleasant. I have much difficulty looking at it with a somewhat clear head. I mean I really have a hard time.
Sometimes when I think of my children being 4 and 8 when I was so fucked up. I left them with their Dad (who was a great Dad BTW) and I can hardly think of the pain and disappointment I caused them. That is just my kids….I hurt my parents, my ex-husband, some close friends and on and on.
I just am afraid I would go totally insane, permanently check out mentally if I had to honestly relive this.
Callie
Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: <tomo7@starband.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Bretts Preparation Ideas
Date: March 22, 2004 at 5:57:24 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brett:

Thank you for your sensible suggestions for preparation and management of
an ibo experience. These are consistent with my own experience.

“Come in She said, I’ll give ya, Shelter From the Storm” -Bob Dylan

From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 5:51:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have tried to express similar fears…the few ‘darker’ trips I’ve had
have been incredibly terrifying, and the sensation of death of
general ‘evil’ have pushed me very close to the brink.

Can anyone here assure me that they’re of a similar mindset, and
somehow survived the experience
mentally/emotionally/psychically/spiritually intact?

In a message dated 3/22/2004 4:08:13 PM Central Standard Time,
jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:

but a bad
experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.

That is exactly what I am talking about.
I have tripped on acid in past without ever having a ‘bad’ trip but I
have
seen folks totally freak. I know Ibogaine is not acid but acid and
mescaline
trips are the only ones I have personal experience with.
I just think it would be terrible to start tripping on Ibogaine and
it be a
scary, psychotic torture trip.
I know that in order to face my personal demon and to look at the
ruin I made
in my past will not be pleasant. I have much difficulty looking at it
with a
somewhat clear head. I mean I really have a hard time.
Sometimes when I think of my children being 4 and 8 when I was so
fucked up.
I left them with their Dad (who was a great Dad BTW) and I can hardly
think of
the pain and disappointment I caused them. That is just my kids….I
hurt my
parents, my ex-husband, some close friends and on and on.
I just am afraid I would go totally insane, permanently check out
mentally if
I had to honestly relive this.
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 5:18:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/22/2004 4:08:13 PM Central Standard Time, jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:

but a bad
experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 5:07:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The ibogaine dossier treatment section
<http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/treatment.html> covers both positive and not
so positive patient responses. Treatment
episode <http://ibogaine.desk.nl/experience-1297.html> was of an early st
kitts when I believe their were dose escalating up from what were
pre-therapeutic
doses. The patients was very angry and trying to get her money back. I
provided some response in defense of the treatment outcome. And, the
answer is
yes, you are always going to get some patient who is dissatisfied but, not
many.

I dunno if this is what Callie was talking about, but one of the things
that has kept me from taking ibogaine thus far (apart from the cost and
logistics of getting hold of it) is fear of a bad experience. Not a bad
experience as in “it didn’t do what i thought/wanted it to”, but a bad
experience as in completely freaking the fuck out.

I’ve had a number of very traumatising experiences on LSD; one of which
left me with a pretty severe anxiety disorder (panic attacks, intense fear
of going insane, etc) for a number of years afterwards. I also had a
moderately traumatising experience on 2CT7; not anywhere near as severe as
the LSD ones, but still something I really don’t care to repeat.

I find I’m able to use mushrooms generally without any bad shit going
down, but I’ve (finally..ehe) learned that I have to be VERY careful with
more powerful psychedelics.

At any rate, there’s a large part of me that really would like to try
ibogaine (or maybe an iboga extract), especially because I think it could
help with my cigarette addiction, but also just because it sounds so
fascinating; but I’m very wary of ending back up in a psychiatric
hospital.

As much as I love Syd Barrett’s music, I’m not too keen on emulating his
lifestyle…ehe. I’m finally at a point in my life where I’m relatively
stable (don’t use hard drugs any more, haven’t attempted suicide in years,
have a decent job,etc) and part of me is really afraid to risk losing
this.

And, while i’m ranting about this..ehe… another thing that has me afraid
of doing ibogaine/iboga is that i’d have to stop taking my meds before
hand. i’m currently taking effexor and remeron, which i think have been
very useful in getting me to the reasonably stable point i’m at now. and
so, in addition to being afraid that the ibogaine will make me completely
flip my shit, i’m afraid that going off the meds will revert me to the
suicidal lump that i was years ago…

anyway, sorry for going off there, but i’ve been needing to get that out
for sometime, i think….and I’d be very interested to hear what you folks
think…

thanx,

jon

btw… Brett, if you’re reading this, I know I’ve been a shit about
keeping in touch with you… i think what i’m talking about here is part
of the reason why. to be honest, i’m not very good at keeping in touch
with people in general… but one of my psychopathologies that i’ve yet to
really get over completely is the whole denial thing… like, if there’s
something that’s causing me some kind of stress, i have a tendency to just
pretend it doesn’t exist. i mean, i’m definately better about it than i
was back when i was a junky, but i’m certainly far from completely better
about it. for what it’s worth, i’m sorry.

From: Hattie <epoptica@freeuk.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 4:12:11 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hannah,

As you are in the UK – you could always give me a call if you want to chat
more about it.

You can get my number off the www.ibogaine.co.uk site.

Love Hattie

Hi everyone!

I’ve never posted here before although I’ve been following your
discussions for a couple of months.I’ve had a heroin addiction for 4 years
and have tried several different detox methods without much success.I can do
the detox but its the ‘staying off’ that I seem to have a problem with.I
started Subutex a month ago.I don’t wanna bore you all with my story but I’m
really interested in Ibogaine.I’m in the UK.Would I need to buy it over that
Net?Would rootbark be better than HCl?

My two main concerns are:
I get really depressed n my heads really messed up.I worry alot….I guess
I’m trying to say I mess my own head up thinking too much n when tripping on
K or Shrooms (I’m not comparing the experience) I have put myself in a bad
place in this way.I solved this with breathing exercises n meditation but I
need to be Reminded to do this!Will I be ok?
I feel Ibogaine could help invaluably with my self-awareness and
development.I know you’ve already mentioned ‘bad trips’.None of my friends
know anything about Iboga-they think its like LSD.I need a sitter who I can
trust n this could be the ultimate problem I have.

What was the other?…
Oh,would Subutex affect it in anyway?It is an opiate blocker but as Iboga
isn’t an opioide,will it make any difference?

Thankyou all so much for your input.I’ve amassed alot of information that
will be invaluable when it comes to ‘my time’.Although I was first attracted
to Ibogaine through H detox,now I see it as more of a spiritual experience
that could finally help me become happy to be me.

Cheers!
Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 6:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

I definitely have panic attacks on ‘herb’, especially considering that
it’s
BC bud (strongest in the world) – and have often wondered how a strong
ibo
trip would compare in the breathless/out-of-control department. I
don’t
want to rely on other substances to keep me calm, but I don’t want to
have
a
heart attack either…

Hi Brooke,

Something that has helped me is remembering that iboga usually DOES
cause
anxiety as it comes on, typically about 30 minutes after taking it. Of
course, you don’t have the actual experience of this yet but it can
still be
helpful to know. Strange pulsings through the body, heightened hearing,
and
a general feeling that the body is being “cranked up” to a different
vibration are all pretty common. Fears that one is going to die are also
quite likely. The mind doesn’t like to let go and will often fight the
drug
as it feels its presence “trying to take over”. With all of these things
my
advice is to be aware that the stuff being experienced is normal, that
it
will pass, and to have a friend by your side, holding your hand is good.
15-20g max of rootbark is good for a first time experience, I’d say. You
never know how strong the stuff is so it’s good to keep it exciting but
safe. Once your body has done the drug once, it’ll know what it’s like
and
be more relaxed about going there a second time later.

This is a great time to do iboga, just after the Spring equinox,
traditionally a time when light overtakes dark, so all the signs are
most
auspicious. I’m going to do some myself later today. Can’t wait!

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good
and
bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or
not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in
my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after
dose…but 8
months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was
taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not
let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better,
exhausted
as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across
the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to
sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga,
as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the
house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there
eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga
seems
to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can
,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who
has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who
knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs
(though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to
have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of
panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always
made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They
suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to
this
lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a
opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it
dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m
not
sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are
being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

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From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root Bark or Ibogaine HCl?
Date: March 22, 2004 at 2:48:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Pink

Back to this discussion.

The short answers Yes Ethnogarden is reliable, no I have not tried their root bark or specifically now about it, the HCL is fine.

Ibogaine is the primary alkaloid in Taberhathe Iboga, the root bark being the most active part of the plant which contains a dozen ibo-like compounds, one of which is ibogaine.

Ibogaine HCL is typically extracted from tabernathe iboga, some of it is semi-sythetic or a by-product of the manufacturer of pharmacutical products (I would have to look up what) I believe Ethnogarden is natural ibogaine.

Any quality iboga product will work for addiction, the experience itself and what they are better for. Fresh root bark will have a somewhat different qualities than extracts of dried root which is a little different for HCL. They are “work” and will typically produce the most profound and lucid experences of the first order, a life changing event for sure. They are all very long, arduous and not considered fun in large doses, but well worth the effort.

If someone were using iboga for addicttion I would suggest HCL or a commercial extract, not root bark. Ibogaine HCL will come on much stronger, seems to rip into issues harder, is somewhat shorter acting (still VERY long) with shorter recovery than the Natural products. Post mood is generally better and recovery shorterr with HCL – though I have no idea how it differs from fresh root in that respect. The extracts and I assume root bark are rounder, fuller, more “spiritual”, earthy softer than HCL. When I was using ibogaine for addiction HCL worked better to break through and I felt better fater than the Indra extract I used, can’t say about root bark but it should be similar in some respects. If you can deal with the taste or quantity by making and drinking an home made extract or stuffing it in pills, you could even do a quick Turkish Iboga coffee with a coffee grinder (it is amazingly horrid stuff), then have at it.

Taking iboga/ibogaine requires a knowledge and understanding of what you are dealing with. Please read http://ibogaine.org/manual.html.

Brett
Pink Esnake <pinkesnake@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hello! Can anyone please tell me which is more
efficient, Iboga Root Bark or Ibogaine HCl? I went to
the Ethnogarden website and the HCl costs more. Does
that mean is it more pure? Has anyone ordered from
Ethnogarden? If so, how is the quality?
Thank you and have a great day!
Michelle

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 2:48:41 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi everyone!

What was the other?…
Oh,would Subutex affect it in anyway?It is an opiate blocker but as Iboga
isn’t an opioide,will it make any difference?

Cheers!
Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 11:37 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 6:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Hi Brooke,

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

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<)[%]

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<)[%]

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From: Pink Esnake <pinkesnake@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Iboga Root Bark or Ibogaine HCl?
Date: March 22, 2004 at 1:04:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello! Can anyone please tell me which is more
efficient, Iboga Root Bark or Ibogaine HCl? I went to
the Ethnogarden website and the HCl costs more. Does
that mean is it more pure? Has anyone ordered from
Ethnogarden? If so, how is the quality?
Thank you and have a great day!
Michelle

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.
http://taxes.yahoo.com/filing.html

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] 10 yrs. of heroin handouts
Date: March 22, 2004 at 12:53:41 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://www.nzz.ch/2004/01/24/english/page-synd4661691.html  ”Ten years of heroin handouts fixes drug crime”; be easier to kick then long lasting opioids? Big moral difference to some between short and long lasting I guess. Interesting harm reduction reading non the less.
-Jason
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From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Rescue Remedie
Date: March 22, 2004 at 12:40:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie,

Spell it “Rescue Remedy”, not “Rescue Remedie” when you do a search.

Go here

http://www.bachshop.com/customer/home.php

also

From;

http://www.bachcentre.com/centre/38/rescue.htm

”
Rescue  Remedy…
Rock Rose
Star of Bethlehem

…is the most famous of the remedies, but in fact is not a remedy at all, but rather a mix of five different remedies (Cherry Plum, Clematis, Impatiens, Rock Rose and Star of Bethlehem) which together help deal with any emergency or stressful event. Taking a driving test, exam nerves, speaking in public, after an accident or an argument – there are countless uses for Rescue Remedy.”
Maybe they should add “when you stop your favorite drug suddenly”.
“In an emergency Rescue Remedy can be taken neat from the bottle, four drops at a time, and as frequently as required. Otherwise put four drops in a glass of water and take frequent sips until the emotions have calmed.”
There are few natural, safe, soft products that work on addicts, I have never seen RR not work on anyone or anything (cats/dogs/children). There is nothing to “feel”, except calmer and no drug interactions. I suppose someone could be allergic to a particular flower remedy, never heard of anyone having a problem with RR – and there is another one (I forget) that is very similar made by Bac
CallieMimosa@aol.com wrote:
Tell me about this Rescue Remedie in English please. lol!
I did a search and all the info I could find is in a foreign language!
Below is an example. If someone could translate I would be grateful!
Callie

Rescue Remedie

Rescue Remedie is de eerste hulp remedie van Bach, het is verkrijgbaar in een reformhuis, natuurvoedingswinkel of new-age winkel. Tegen shock en verdoving, als middel tot integreren van de persoonlijkheid. Tegen doodsangst en paniekgevoelens. Tegen mentale stress en spanningen. Tegen de angst de (zelf) beheersing te verliezen. Tegen het gevoel van ver weg zijn dat dikwijls vooraf gaat aan bewustzijnsverlies.

Kortom bij allerlei situaties waarbij je een steuntje in de rug nodig hebt, bijvoorbeeld. bij examens, tandartsbezoek, ziekenhuisopname, ongelukken, ruzies of spanningen. Ook huisdieren en planten reageren goed op de Rescue Remedie. De Rescue Remedie kan zelfs helpen bij het afkicken van verslavingen.

Neem 4 druppels uit het voorraadflesje in een beetje water en drink dit met kleine slokjes op. Je kunt de druppels ook rechtstreeks onder de tong leggen. Bij bewusteloosheid kun je de druppels op de slapen en de polsen inwrijven. Herhaal dit net zo vaak totdat er verbetering ontstaat.

Rescue Remedie werkt absoluut niet verslavend en kan daarom zonder gevaar veelvuldig gebruikt worden.

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From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Rescue Remedie
Date: March 22, 2004 at 12:39:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tell me about this Rescue Remedie in English please.

The English spelling is “Rescue Remedy” and this will find the
correct pages on the web.

Bill

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer Rescue Remedy Preston’s cats
Date: March 22, 2004 at 12:11:58 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You aren’t injecting it in the cats are you? <

LOL, oh yeah Brett, that’s what we’re doing.
NO, seriously Brett, we aren’t inject anything into the cats, not even
Rescuse Remedy.
We give it to them as a couple of drops in water.
V told me this morning I should be doing it just the same way, which
makes sense once I stopped to actually think.
Thanks for the reply.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 8:50 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer Rescue Remedy Preston’s cats

Preston

“Hmmm. How does a
human “take” Rescue Remedy, Brett?”

You aren’t injecting it in the cats are you? Try reading the label and
following directions but the basics are drop some under the tongue or in
water. Do not take anything by mouth for an hour before or 15 minutes
after – or sumthin like that. It is pretty much like taking homeopathic
formulas.. It is about 120 proof, not a good idea to drop under the tongue
in an alcoholic, they won’t notice if it is put in water (they are tiny
drops), especially if they don’t know.

Brett

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
There is a product called Rescue Remedie by Bach Flower Remedies (health
food store), it is wonderful for anxiety, withdrawal cravings and will have
no negative effect with iboga.<

LOL, just saying, this stuff works great on cats too- no matter how unruly
of “catty” this stuff calms them right out, turns them into pussycats.
I hadn’t thought of trying it myself for withdrawals. Hmmm. How does a
human “take” Rescue Remedy, Brett?
(light bulbs going off.)
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Good Trip/Bad Trip? They are all good, they often show you the bad. My last
addiction, ibo KICKED MY ASS over smoking over and over, showed me “things
to come” if I didn’t change the beha! vior. Now that was not fun at all, but
I
quit smoking. Iboga is a teacher, it will show you things you already know
but can’t see, sometimes things you don’t know, sometimes the lessons are
hard, emotions come up, things come up…

On the way up HCL tends to, well, can be like strapped to a rocket going
inward. Indra extract and I would assume dried root bark (someone help me
out here) should be a lot calmer, smoother, softer on the way up where the
anxiety is usually produced. Even that, simple deep breathing will do the
trick, 3 in and out to the count of 4 – deep slow yogic breaths. If you like
smoke something, it does go well with iboga. There is a product called
Rescue Remedie by Bach Flower Remedies (health food store), it is wonderful
for anxiety, withdrawal cravings and will have no negative effect with
iboga. I wouldn’t worry about it, it is much easier not to. There is an
element of fear to doing iboga, even after doing it.

! Mostly it isn’t that ibogaine is a bad trip, it is a rough trip. It is
very
long, takes a lot of time to recover, there is often nausea, vomiting,
ataxia, lots of feelings, perhaps hours and hours of visions and dialog…
It is simply a HUGE amount of stuff to process and it is pretty disgusting,
long and arduous. Nobody takes ibogaine for how it feels (in tripping
amounts), they take it for what it does.

Don’t fight it, just relax into it and let it take you. If you want it to
stop, open your eyes and turn on the lights (low), breath deep and slow, in
a few minuts you will shake some of it off – literally wake up. If you want
to change a vision, blink, you don’t even have to open your eyes – better
not to. As far as tripping, open eyed the most you are likely to see is some
visual distortions, strobic magnesium flare to lights or outlines of things,
they can get intense – my first time they were pretty cool, they get old,
especially when yo! u have them at night for a couple weeks after… the
lights pick them up and you can get trails. Other times I have not had much,
every iboga session is unique as to content and often side effects.

Recovery generally goes like this. You feel crappy, like sick, well till you
start to glow, then sometimes it can even be manic for a couple days, too
too much sometimes (mostly with HCL), then it settles down. The next 10
days-2 weeks ther is still an overt feeling (often) of the iboga in you, it
is a wonderful time generally speaking.

Now, want a BAD iboga trip, don’t listen do advice, don’t follow protocol,
don’t do set/setting, don’t have a good sitter, don’t follow directions,
think you are a bad-ass (after all you took acid LOL!!!!)… That will
pretty much assure you of one hellish time, In that case good for your dumb
ass, be glad you only scared the shit out of yourself or failed at your
attempt at drug treatment.

Brett

Brooke Burgess wrote:
I definitely have panic attacks on ‘herb’, especially considering that it’s
BC bud (strongest in the world) – and have often wondered how a strong ibo
trip would compare in the breathless/out-of-control department. I don’t
want to rely on other substances to keep me calm, but I don’t want to have a
heart attack either…

—– Original Message —–
From:
To:
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8
! months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
itDidn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get! there eventually
which promises be a very long yet ! exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs (though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…y! eah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And ! he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it
dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
! [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “ann b mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Rescue Remedie
Date: March 22, 2004 at 11:51:28 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi;

Here ya go: http://www.bachcentre.com/centre/remedies.htm

If you have any problems reaching this website let me know. I actually
have a Bach book but I can’t find it!! Must have loaned it to someone.
Good luck

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 22, 2004 11:10 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Rescue Remedie

Tell me about this Rescue Remedie in English please. lol!
I did a search and all the info I could find is in a foreign language!
Below is an example. If someone could translate I would be grateful!
Callie

Rescue Remedie

Rescue Remedie werkt absoluut niet verslavend en kan daarom zonder gevaar veelvuldig gebruikt worden.

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Rescue Remedie
Date: March 22, 2004 at 11:10:59 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rescue Remedie

Rescue Remedie werkt absoluut niet verslavend en kan daarom zonder gevaar veelvuldig gebruikt worden.

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] time to do iboga
Date: March 22, 2004 at 10:49:57 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“This is a great time to do iboga, just after the Spring equinox,
traditionally a time when light overtakes dark, so all the signs are most
auspicious. I’m going to do some myself later today. Can’t wait!”
-Nick

: )

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer Rescue Remedy Preston’s cats
Date: March 22, 2004 at 8:50:44 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston

“Hmmm. How does a
human “take” Rescue Remedy, Brett?”

You aren’t injecting it in the cats are you? Try reading the label and following directions but the basics are drop some under the tongue or in water. Do not take anything by mouth for an hour before or 15 minutes after – or sumthin like that. It is pretty much like taking homeopathic formulas.. It is about 120 proof, not a good idea to drop under the tongue in an alcoholic, they won’t notice if it is put in water (they are tiny drops), especially if they don’t know.

Brett

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
>There is a product called Rescue Remedie by Bach Flower Remedies (health
food store), it is wonderful for anxiety, withdrawal cravings and will have
no negative effect with iboga.<

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Good Trip/Bad Trip? They are all good, they often show you the bad. My last
addiction, ibo KICKED MY ASS over smoking over and over, showed me “things
to come” if I didn’t change the behavior. Now that was not fun at all, but I
quit smoking. Iboga is a teacher, it will show you things you already know
but can’t see, sometimes things you don’t know, sometimes the lessons are
hard, emotions come up, things come up…

Mostly it isn’t that ibogaine is a bad trip, it is a rough trip. It is very
long, takes a lot of time to recover, there is often nausea, vomiting,
ataxia, lots of feelings, perhaps hours and hours of visions and dialog…
It is simply a HUGE amount of stuff to process and it is pretty disgusting,
long and arduous. Nobody takes ibogaine for how it feels (in tripping
amounts), they take it for what it does.

Don’t fight it, just relax into it and let it take you. If you want it to
stop, open your eyes and turn on the lights (low), breath deep and slow, in
a few minuts you will shake some of it off – literally wake up. If you want
to change a vision, blink, you don’t even have to open your eyes – better
not to. As far as tripping, open eyed the most you are likely to see is some
visual distortions, strobic magnesium flare to lights or outlines of things,
they can get intense – my first time they were pretty cool, they get old,
especially when you have them at night for a couple weeks after… the
lights pick them up and you can get trails. Other times I have not had much,
every iboga session is unique as to content and often side effects.

Brett

—– Original Message —–
From:
To:
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8
! months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get! there eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs (though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…y! eah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 22, 2004 at 6:37:07 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 6:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

I definitely have panic attacks on ‘herb’, especially considering that
it’s
BC bud (strongest in the world) – and have often wondered how a strong ibo
trip would compare in the breathless/out-of-control department. I don’t
want to rely on other substances to keep me calm, but I don’t want to have
a
heart attack either…

Hi Brooke,

Something that has helped me is remembering that iboga usually DOES cause
anxiety as it comes on, typically about 30 minutes after taking it. Of
course, you don’t have the actual experience of this yet but it can still be
helpful to know. Strange pulsings through the body, heightened hearing, and
a general feeling that the body is being “cranked up” to a different
vibration are all pretty common. Fears that one is going to die are also
quite likely. The mind doesn’t like to let go and will often fight the drug
as it feels its presence “trying to take over”. With all of these things my
advice is to be aware that the stuff being experienced is normal, that it
will pass, and to have a friend by your side, holding your hand is good.
15-20g max of rootbark is good for a first time experience, I’d say. You
never know how strong the stuff is so it’s good to keep it exciting but
safe. Once your body has done the drug once, it’ll know what it’s like and
be more relaxed about going there a second time later.

This is a great time to do iboga, just after the Spring equinox,
traditionally a time when light overtakes dark, so all the signs are most
auspicious. I’m going to do some myself later today. Can’t wait!

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and
bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or
not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8
months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted
as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to
sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the
house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there
eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems
to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs
(though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to
have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always
made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this
lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it
dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not
sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 10:57:45 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Know that you aren’t alone in your journey…and it sounds like it will be a productive one. Remember we all look up at the same stars and sun and breathe the same air, and act and react from desire and fear, what are the limitations of (fill in the blank)? …i’ll puff some buddha and exhale a blessing for your journey the night of.
cheers,
Jason
—–Original Message—–
From: Brooke Burgess [mailto:brooke@brokensaints.com]
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004, 7:27 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

sounds like naturally bravery to me…you’re blessed 😉

I’m a pretty fearful person, and hide behind myriad masks. Sad thing is I
KNOW what’s lurking behind each of them, and the nature of the tangled roots
that feed the faces from my own dark soil. I’m just hoping this helps to
make the struggle a bit more tangible in the end…like weeding the garden
in sunlight.

b
—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 7:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

lol. just don’t focus on it and you’ll be fine, remember what’s written on
the cover of the hitchickers guide to the galaxy “DON’T PANIC”, test dose
helped me to ease into the experience; which i would prefer instead of
hitting like cold water; i didn’t feel anxious during ibo, but if i did i
imagine it would of been like some inner dialoge asking why am i feeling
anxious? and a million different question/answer dialoge about it so i would
think that even if it comes up it can be used as an opportunity to find the
root and perhaps reevaluate the situation from a different perspective…I’m
not sure how well trying to avoid something ibo’s trying to show would turn
out though, i didn’t try.
-Jason
—–Original Message—–
From: Brooke Burgess [mailto:brooke@brokensaints.com]
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004, 12:10 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

I definitely have panic attacks on ‘herb’, especially considering that
it’s
BC bud (strongest in the world) – and have often wondered how a strong
ibo
trip would compare in the breathless/out-of-control department. I don’t
want to rely on other substances to keep me calm, but I don’t want to
have a
heart attack either…

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and
bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or
not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in
my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but
8
months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was
taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not
let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better,
exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across
the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to
sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the
house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there
eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems
to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who
has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who
knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs
(though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to
have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always
made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They
suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this
lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it
dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not
sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 10:19:50 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

sounds like naturally bravery to me…you’re blessed 😉

b
—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 7:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

I definitely have panic attacks on ‘herb’, especially considering that
it’s
BC bud (strongest in the world) – and have often wondered how a strong
ibo
trip would compare in the breathless/out-of-control department. I don’t
want to rely on other substances to keep me calm, but I don’t want to
have a
heart attack either…

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and
bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or
not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in
my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but
8
months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was
taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not
let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better,
exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across
the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to
sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the
house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there
eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems
to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who
has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who
knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs
(though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to
have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always
made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They
suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this
lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it
dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not
sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 10:12:03 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

lol. just don’t focus on it and you’ll be fine, remember what’s written on the cover of the hitchickers guide to the galaxy “DON’T PANIC”, test dose helped me to ease into the experience; which i would prefer instead of hitting like cold water; i didn’t feel anxious during ibo, but if i did i imagine it would of been like some inner dialoge asking why am i feeling anxious? and a million different question/answer dialoge about it so i would think that even if it comes up it can be used as an opportunity to find the root and perhaps reevaluate the situation from a different perspective…I’m not sure how well trying to avoid something ibo’s trying to show would turn out though, i didn’t try.
-Jason
—–Original Message—–
From: Brooke Burgess [mailto:brooke@brokensaints.com]
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004, 12:10 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

I definitely have panic attacks on ‘herb’, especially considering that it’s
BC bud (strongest in the world) – and have often wondered how a strong ibo
trip would compare in the breathless/out-of-control department. I don’t
want to rely on other substances to keep me calm, but I don’t want to have a
heart attack either…

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8
months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs (though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 9:56:43 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Brett – suggestions noted and appreciated. I’m trying to go in with expectations reduced, but I’m still excited and anxious…wish me luck and say a prayer if you can spare it.

b
—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 3:40 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Good Trip/Bad Trip? They are all good, they often show you the bad. My last addiction, ibo KICKED MY ASS over smoking over and over, showed me “things to come” if I didn’t change the behavior. Now that was not fun at all, but I quit smoking. Iboga is a teacher, it will show you things you already know but can’t see, sometimes things you don’t know, sometimes the lessons are hard, emotions come up, things come up…

On the way up HCL tends to, well, can be like strapped to a rocket going inward. Indra extract and I would assume dried root bark (someone help me out here) should be a lot calmer, smoother, softer on the way up where the anxiety is usually produced. Even that, simple deep breathing will do the trick, 3 in and out to the count of 4 – deep slow yogic breaths. If you like smoke something, it does go well with iboga. There is a product called Rescue Remedie by Bach Flower Remedies (health food store), it is wonderful for anxiety, withdrawal cravings and will have no negative effect with iboga. I wouldn’t worry about it, it is much easier not to. There is an element of fear to doing iboga, even after doing it.

Mostly it isn’t that ibogaine is a bad trip, it is a rough trip. It is very long, takes a lot of time to recover, there is often nausea, vomiting, ataxia, lots of feelings, perhaps hours and hours of visions and dialog… It is simply a HUGE amount of stuff to process and it is pretty disgusting, long and arduous. Nobody takes ibogaine for how it feels (in tripping amounts), they take it for what it does.

Don’t fight it, just relax into it and let it take you. If you want it to stop, open your eyes and turn on the lights (low), breath deep and slow, in a few minuts you will shake some of it off – literally wake up. If you want to change a vision, blink, you don’t even have to open your eyes – better not to. As far as tripping, open eyed the most you are likely to see is some visual distortions, strobic magnesium flare to lights or outlines of things, they can get intense – my first time they were pretty cool, they get old, especially when you have them at night for a couple weeks after… the lights pick them up and you can get trails. Other times I have not had much, every iboga session is unique as to content and often side effects.

Recovery generally goes like this. You feel crappy, like sick, well till you start to glow, then sometimes it can even be manic for a couple days, too too much sometimes (mostly with HCL), then it settles down. The next 10 days-2 weeks ther is still an overt feeling (often) of the iboga in you, it is a wonderful time generally speaking.

Now, want a BAD iboga trip, don’t listen do advice, don’t follow protocol, don’t do set/setting, don’t have a good sitter, don’t follow directions, think you are a bad-ass (after all you took acid LOL!!!!)… That will pretty much assure you of one hellish time, In that case good for your dumb ass, be glad you only scared the shit out of yourself or failed at your attempt at drug treatment.

Brett

Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com> wrote:
I definitely have panic attacks on ‘herb’, especially considering that it’s
BC bud (strongest in the world) – and have often wondered how a strong ibo
trip would compare in the breathless/out-of-control department. I don’t
want to rely on other substances to keep me calm, but I don’t want to have a
heart attack either…

—– Original Message —–
From:
To:
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8
months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs (though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 10:00:49 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There is a product called Rescue Remedie by Bach Flower Remedies (health
food store), it is wonderful for anxiety, withdrawal cravings and will have
no negative effect with iboga.<

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 6:40 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Good Trip/Bad Trip? They are all good, they often show you the bad. My last
addiction, ibo KICKED MY ASS over smoking over and over, showed me “things
to come” if I didn’t change the behavior. Now that was not fun at all, but I
quit smoking. Iboga is a teacher, it will show you things you already know
but can’t see, sometimes things you don’t know, sometimes the lessons are
hard, emotions come up, things come up…

Don’t fight it, just relax into it and let it take you. If you want it to
stop, open your eyes and turn on the lights (low), breath deep and slow, in
a few minuts you will shake some of it off – literally wake up. If you want
to change a vision, blink, you don’t even have to open your eyes – better
not to. As far as tripping, open eyed the most you are likely to see is some
visual distortions, strobic magnesium flare to lights or outlines of things,
they can get intense – my first time they were pretty cool, they get old,
especially when you have them at night for a couple weeks after… the
lights pick them up and you can get trails. Other times I have not had much,
every iboga session is unique as to content and often side effects.

Brett

—– Original Message —–
From:
To:
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8
! months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get! there eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs (though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…y! eah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 6:40:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Good Trip/Bad Trip? They are all good, they often show you the bad. My last addiction, ibo KICKED MY ASS over smoking over and over, showed me “things to come” if I didn’t change the behavior. Now that was not fun at all, but I quit smoking. Iboga is a teacher, it will show you things you already know but can’t see, sometimes things you don’t know, sometimes the lessons are hard, emotions come up, things come up…

On the way up HCL tends to, well, can be like strapped to a rocket going inward. Indra extract and I would assume dried root bark (someone help me out here) should be a lot calmer, smoother, softer on the way up where the anxiety is usually produced. Even that, simple deep breathing will do the trick, 3 in and out to the count of 4 – deep slow yogic breaths. If you like smoke something, it does go well with iboga. There is a product called Rescue Remedie by Bach Flower Remedies (health food store), it is wonderful for anxiety, withdrawal cravings and will have no negative effect with iboga. I wouldn’t worry about it, it is much easier not to. There is an element of fear to doing iboga, even after doing it.

Mostly it isn’t that ibogaine is a bad trip, it is a rough trip. It is very long, takes a lot of time to recover, there is often nausea, vomiting, ataxia, lots of feelings, perhaps hours and hours of visions and dialog… It is simply a HUGE amount of stuff to process and it is pretty disgusting, long and arduous. Nobody takes ibogaine for how it feels (in tripping amounts), they take it for what it does.

Don’t fight it, just relax into it and let it take you. If you want it to stop, open your eyes and turn on the lights (low), breath deep and slow, in a few minuts you will shake some of it off – literally wake up. If you want to change a vision, blink, you don’t even have to open your eyes – better not to. As far as tripping, open eyed the most you are likely to see is some visual distortions, strobic magnesium flare to lights or outlines of things, they can get intense – my first time they were pretty cool, they get old, especially when you have them at night for a couple weeks after… the lights pick them up and you can get trails. Other times I have not had much, every iboga session is unique as to content and often side effects.

Recovery generally goes like this. You feel crappy, like sick, well till you start to glow, then sometimes it can even be manic for a couple days, too too much sometimes (mostly with HCL), then it settles down. The next 10 days-2 weeks ther is still an overt feeling (often) of the iboga in you, it is a wonderful time generally speaking.

Now, want a BAD iboga trip, don’t listen do advice, don’t follow protocol, don’t do set/setting, don’t have a good sitter, don’t follow directions, think you are a bad-ass (after all you took acid LOL!!!!)… That will pretty much assure you of one hellish time, In that case good for your dumb ass, be glad you only scared the shit out of yourself or failed at your attempt at drug treatment.

Brett

—– Original Message —–
From:
To:
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8
months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs (though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 1:52:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I definitely have panic attacks on ‘herb’, especially considering that it’s
BC bud (strongest in the world) – and have often wondered how a strong ibo
trip would compare in the breathless/out-of-control department. I don’t
want to rely on other substances to keep me calm, but I don’t want to have a
heart attack either…

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004 9:46 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as was the experience a pleasant one or not)…I
assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my
own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8
months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken
away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to
what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let
the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted as
fuck, but better. “the only way around this shit is through”
I’d say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the
street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for
exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to sickness
it isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as
long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the house
and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there eventually
which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh
teacher, can anything that focus’s reality do any thing else but be a
sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems to
make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has
panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.)
I’ve heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs (though
wouldn’t recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to have
on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety
just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always made
them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck
cock for xanex now but they don’t panic anymore : ) Was talking to this lady
about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it dude,
you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not sure
which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just happy the cracks are being
filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 12:46:58 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie,
I think Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+ (defining good and bad not as did it cure me but as was the experience a pleasant one or not)…I assume all journey’s have lessons;
I’ve heard some say on this list iboga/ine can be a harsh teacher. in my own journey, it was a mix…stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but 8 months of diarrhea isn’t fun either : )tmi sorry,
it
Didn’t take away ALL of my sickness but

the miracle is the large majority of the vast unimaginable sick was taken away
and the important and most profound part was how my mental reaction to what’s left of the sick has changed; like unfocusing so I can refocus, unstablizing so I can become stable, and iboga very much helps to not let the persistence of sick get to me and it gradually gets better, exhausted as fuck, but better. the only way around this shit is through
Id say it’s like if I need to get from my house to the house across the street…I can get their by walking directly (if your not much for exploring; or if your already in the habit of surrendering will to sickness it isnt that difficult to switch to listening to the guide of iboga, as long as trust is there) or I can walk the opposite direction from the house and walk my own path and since the world is round I’ll get there eventually which promises be a very long yet exciting journey yet perhaps harsh teacher, can anything that focuss reality do any thing else but be a sometimes harsh teacher, some reality just isn’t pretty, and iboga seems to make face reality? Yage, I hear, is similar perhaps? Even herb can ,to some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to a non-smoker who has panic attacks and see, my money is on 1 out of 25 panic maybe, who knows.) Ive heard that xanex can be used with iboga unlike most other drugs (though wouldnt recommend it of course), but I wonder if it is a good idea to have on hand by the iboga provider if a person has a history of panic/anxiety just in case; When I fed to much herb to a panic person a xanex always made them fine in 10-20 mins. With some breath work in the meantime. They suck cock for xanex now but they dont panic anymore : ) Was talking to this lady about iboga and my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a opioid addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily “iboga didn’t do it dude, you did it!!” I don’t think either one is completely correct. I’m not sure which is filling the other’s cracks, Im just happy the cracks are being filled. Not sure if either one could have done it without the other.
-Jason

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 12:18:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/21/04 4:16:27 PM, CallieMimosa@aol.com writes:

Has anyone ever had a really bad or negative trip on Ibogaine? I have heard

nothing but good and positive things. Certainly there must be someone who
had a bad experience.
Thought I might check out the Erowid vault. They usually have some postings
both good and bad of folks experience.

The ibogaine dossier treatment section
<http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/treatment.html> covers both positive and not so positive patient responses. Treatment
episode <http://ibogaine.desk.nl/experience-1297.html> was of an early st
kitts when I believe their were dose escalating up from what were pre-therapeutic
doses. The patients was very angry and trying to get her money back. I
provided some response in defense of the treatment outcome. And, the answer is
yes, you are always going to get some patient who is dissatisfied but, not many.

Howard

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 11:15:15 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Has anyone ever had a really bad or negative trip on Ibogaine? I have heard nothing but good and positive things. Certainly there must be someone who had a bad experience.
Thought I might check out the Erowid vault. They usually have some postings both good and bad of folks experience.
Callie

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 9:33:57 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/21/04 9:28:44 AM, nicks22@onetel.com writes:

—– Original Message —–

From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 11:15 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Brooke,

“a week later, and I’m wondering if anyone
can counsel me on how ‘spacy’ I might be at this point?”

You should be fine after 20-30gm, 50gm might be a different story. There
may be some attention span deficit but a week out most people are at their
most colofrul and vibrant..

Yes, about a week afterwards is good. Certainly for me. I used to get
a feeling of being “connected” to everything around me come on about 30
hours after taking the ibo and it would last a week or two then drift away.
Rather like the boundaries around what is or isn’t me were dissolved –
extremely relaxing. I remember walking about 5 miles along the Regents
Canal in London right after coming off a session to go to a conference.
The whole experience was just a flowing ball of energy – amazing. Thoughts,
feelings, sights and sounds all coherently just flowing around. It’s a
great space to talk to a group from because you will feel the connection
between yourself and the audience stronger than usual, and this is what
turns people on when they listen to you. It’ll be great.

With a root bark extract, that had been prepared many years ago, I was
experiencing the light flash effect five to six days out. I am talking about the
little bursts of light that seem to appear everywhere and are seen by many
persons taking ibogaine/iboga. Really had me worried and thought it was going to be
permanent. Luckily it was not. Just did not want you flipping out if that
occurred.

Howard

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 21, 2004 at 4:27:39 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 11:15 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Brooke,

“a week later, and I’m wondering if anyone
can counsel me on how ‘spacy’ I might be at this point?”

You should be fine after 20-30gm, 50gm might be a different story. There may be some attention span deficit but a week out most people are at their most colofrul and vibrant..

Yes, about a week afterwards is good. Certainly for me. I used to get a feeling of being “connected” to everything around me come on about 30 hours after taking the ibo and it would last a week or two then drift away. Rather like the boundaries around what is or isn’t me were dissolved – extremely relaxing. I remember walking about 5 miles along the Regents Canal in London right after coming off a session to go to a conference. The whole experience was just a flowing ball of energy – amazing. Thoughts, feelings, sights and sounds all coherently just flowing around. It’s a great space to talk to a group from because you will feel the connection between yourself and the audience stronger than usual, and this is what turns people on when they listen to you. It’ll be great.

Nick

During iboga it goes from one vision/thought to the next, yes as Howard said, just talk as the visions evaporate rather quickly and are moving on to the next one (for hours). Sometimes for a period of time after there is a minor version of this, people can be on one thing and the mind wonders to the next and the next.

I too like iboga at night and try to have full effect come on just after dark. I also find it easier on the sitter and myself/myself and the ibonaught to not do it too late.

If you have forced air heating/cooling you might want to adjust the temp of the house a couple hours before and turn off the air while you get into it. maybe shut the fridge also. The first several hours are the most sensitive with lights/sounds/discomfort. Oddly, natural sounds like rain or thunder (or bullfrogs trying to get some) during ibogaine is not that distracting, turning the page of a book 20 feet away can be.

One of the most amazing things was my first time, going outside (full-on the ibo) and watching the stars/universe over the ocean. It felt like some kind of energy flowing right through, like a galactic wind.

Remember, move slow or better don’t move, be assisted if you need to get up. Deep breath if you get any anxiety though less likely than HCL (can be rough), open your eyes or simply blink, or with a thought to change a vision.

I like a nice hot bath first, do nothing anxiety producing, get relaxed, just a touch of incense (nag champa) and some medtation music to start.. You can drink natural fluids, tea (no caffine) ginger is a favorite, real fruit juice or water up to about 4 hours before ingesting iboga, be well hydrated but not saturated – remember, you are going to have to pee, this is typically what inspires the first vomiting, getting up to go to the bathroom. You don’t want a belly full of liquid when you take the iboga.

If you have anything special to work on, get into the iboga first, keep the mind blank, don’t try to watch for visions, they can be very subtle – if I stared at them they certainly won’t happen. Basically, make like sleeping, flat on the back is generally best than on a side or face down, sitting cross legged also works for some people.

After, vitamin B complex, eating (start easy), fluids and moving will help shake it off. Some people will be fine the next morning (I HATE THEM) or afternoon after they have eaten, others may take several days. Just take it easy, reflect, explore, see the world again for the first time,.don’t have to do anything, you may be oozy for several days, mostly in the early morning and at dusk. Artifacts (like visual disturbances) can go on for weeks, emotional stuff can bubble-up, there can be anything >from mild depression (more common in addicts) to elation, you could be a bit strange for a couple days… it will work itself out.

Oh, and of course sex is usually amazing, if you want to be with that person . On the relationship thingie, whatever it is it will generally be seen – same with yourself, you will see. One person I know ended a marrage 2 weeks after doing ibo, good decision.

Have a wonderful journey. LAST THING, come back. If you get some kind of choice to leave or come back, don’t leave, it will disturb your sitter, get in the news and stuff. We don’t want that.

Again, my experience is with extracts and ibogaine HCL, not root bark.

Brett
Brooke <brooke@blue.netnation.com> wrote:
Thanks Nick – you’ve been helpful and supportive from the beginning (as
everyone here has been) so I’m mucho appreciative.

I have the batch ‘brewing’ as you read this – plan to partake next
Saturday night, and my watcher is reading up to prepare as well. I’ll
take your advice on the food, and include it with my liver cleanse the
day before.

My only serious concern right now is how I’ll ‘be’ after the process,
functionally speaking. I just found out that I have to fly and give a
series of new media lectures a week later, and I’m wondering if anyone
can counsel me on how ‘spacy’ I might be at this point?

Thanks in advance as always. Also, to everyone that has asked, I’ll be
providing my watcher with access to the mindvox mail for the duration
of the trip, so watch your inboxes around midnight PST next saturday!

Brooke

>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Brooke Burgess”
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 1:51 AM
> Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
>
>
> > Hello all,
> >
> > Just to summarize, my name is Brooke Burgess, and I’ve posted
several
> times
> > in order to glean some of the intricacies of the process before I
> undertake
> > my first journey. I have 50g of rootbark from a reputable source,
and
> will
> > be taking off 5 days from work within the next two weeks to fully
immerse
> > myself in the experience.
> >
> > Here’s my current checklist – please feel free to make suggestions,
> > corrections, criticisms, and such – or contact me directly at
> > brooke@brokensaints.com.
> >
> > – with 190lb! s of bodyweight, and being a first-time ‘non-addict’
> > experiencer (don’t nicotine and emotional trenches count for
something?
> > 🙂 ), I will be using 15-20g of rootbark.
> > – I was referred to an online recipe to extract the vital
components,
> which
> > requires 700ml of vodka, a glass of red wine, and the juice of a
lemon to
> > allow the plant material to ferment over one week in a closed
container.
>
> Hi Brooke,
>
> I don’t know if you’re referring to the recipe posted at
> www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm but if so it’s actually just half a
bottle of
> vodka and two glasses of red wine + the lemon juice. Don’t know that
it
> makes so much difference but just to let you know.
>
>
> > After this, I will boil off the alcohol and test the remnants for
> bitterness
> > – I will prepare a quiet space with images and items ! that trigger
> emotional
> > memories and ties to serious blocks and blisses from my life.
> > – I’ll have a strong and considerate ‘watcher’ with basic medical
> training
> > and a spiritual understanding to veer me back onto ‘the path’ in
case
> things
> > go awry. Oh…and don’t forget the handy bucket by the bed for
sudden
> > movements.
> > – I’ve set aside the pre-requisite three days for a slow and
thoughtful
> > return to full mobility and reintegration with the ‘real’ world.
> > – I will detox the days leading up to dosing, and not eat for 8
hours
> > before use. As well, I will take a small sample and wait several
hours to
> > gauge its effects.
>
> For the food prior to cleansing, raw or steamed veggies + fresh fruit
would
> be the best, imo. This basic alkaline diet should smooth the
experience at
> an emotiona! l and physical level, again just my opinion.
>
> Good luck
>
> Nick
>
>
> > – I will write down everything I experience afterwards in order to
share
> it
> > with myself (at a more coherent time), and those who have supported
> > me…including the members of this board!
> >
> > That’s basically it. Am I missing anything crucial? Thoughts?
> >
> > Thanks in advance
> >
> > Brooke Burgess
> > www.brokensaints.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> /]=——————————————————————-
–=[\
> > [%](> Further Information & List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
> <)[%]
> >
> \]=——————————————————————-
–=[/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> /]=—————————————————————–
—-=[\
> [%](> Further Information & List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
> \]=—————————————————————–
—-=[/
>
>
>
>

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 20, 2004 at 6:15:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooke,

“a week later, and I’m wondering if anyone
can counsel me on how ‘spacy’ I might be at this point?”

You should be fine after 20-30gm, 50gm might be a different story. There may be some attention span deficit but a week out most people are at their most colofrul and vibrant.. During iboga it goes from one vision/thought to the next, yes as Howard said, just talk as the visions evaporate rather quickly and are moving on to the next one (for hours). Sometimes for a period of time after there is a minor version of this, people can be on one thing and the mind wonders to the next and the next.

I too like iboga at night and try to have full effect come on just after dark. I also find it easier on the sitter and myself/myself and the ibonaught to not do it too late.

After, vitamin B complex, eating (start easy), fluids and moving will help shake it off. Some people will be fine the next morning (I HATE THEM) or afternoon after they have eaten, others may take several days. Just take it easy, reflect, explore, see the world again for the first time,.don’t have to do anything, you may be oozy for several days, mostly in the early morning and at dusk. Artifacts (like visual disturbances) can go on for weeks, emotional stuff can bubble-up, there can be anything from mild depression (more common in addicts) to elation, you could be a bit strange for a couple days… it will work itself out.

Have a wonderful journey. LAST THING, come back. If you get some kind of choice to leave or come back, don’t leave, it will disturb your sitter, get in the news and stuff. We don’t want that.

Again, my experience is with extracts and ibogaine HCL, not root bark.

Brett
Brooke <brooke@blue.netnation.com> wrote:
Thanks Nick – you’ve been helpful and supportive from the beginning (as
everyone here has been) so I’m mucho appreciative.

Brooke

>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Brooke Burgess”
> To:
> Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 1:51 AM
> Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
>
>
> > Hello all,
> >
> > Just to summarize, my name is Brooke Burgess, and I’ve posted
several
> times
> > in order to glean some of the intricacies of the process before I
> undertake
> > my first journey. I have 50g of rootbark from a reputable source,
and
> will
> > be taking off 5 days from work within the next two weeks to fully
immerse
> > myself in the experience.
> >
> > Here’s my current checklist – please feel free to make suggestions,
> > corrections, criticisms, and such – or contact me directly at
> > brooke@brokensaints.com.
> >
> > – with 190lbs of bodyweight, and being a first-time ‘non-addict’
> > experiencer (don’t nicotine and emotional trenches count for
something?
> > 🙂 ), I will be using 15-20g of rootbark.
> > – I was referred to an online recipe to extract the vital
components,
> which
> > requires 700ml of vodka, a glass of red wine, and the juice of a
lemon to
> > allow the plant material to ferment over one week in a closed
container.
>
> Hi Brooke,
>
> I don’t know if you’re referring to the recipe posted at
> www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm but if so it’s actually just half a
bottle of
> vodka and two glasses of red wine + the lemon juice. Don’t know that
it
> makes so much difference but just to let you know.
>
>
> > After this, I will boil off the alcohol and test the remnants for
> bitterness
> > – I will prepare a quiet space with images and items that trigger
> emotional
> > memories and ties to serious blocks and blisses from my life.
> > – I’ll have a strong and considerate ‘watcher’ with basic medical
> training
> > and a spiritual understanding to veer me back onto ‘the path’ in
case
> things
> > go awry. Oh…and don’t forget the handy bucket by the bed for
sudden
> > movements.
> > – I’ve set aside the pre-requisite three days for a slow and
thoughtful
> > return to full mobility and reintegration with the ‘real’ world.
> > – I will detox the days leading up to dosing, and not eat for 8
hours
> > before use. As well, I will take a small sample and wait several
hours to
> > gauge its effects.
>
> For the food prior to cleansing, raw or steamed veggies + fresh fruit
would
> be the best, imo. This basic alkaline diet should smooth the
experience at
> an emotional and physical level, again just my opinion.
>
> Good luck
>
> Nick
>
>
> > – I will write down everything I experience afterwards in order to
share
> it
> > with myself (at a more coherent time), and those who have supported
> > me…including the members of this board!
> >
> > That’s basically it. Am I missing anything crucial? Thoughts?
> >
> > Thanks in advance
> >
> > Brooke Burgess
> > www.brokensaints.com
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> /]=——————————————————————-
–=[\
> > [%](> Further Information & List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
> <)[%]
> >
> \]=——————————————————————-
–=[/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
> /]=—————————————————————–
—-=[\
> [%](> Further Information & List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
> \]=—————————————————————–
—-=[/
>
>
>
>

Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Finance Tax Center – File online. File on time.

From: <tomo7@starband.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: LIFE ON THE OUTSIDE
Date: March 20, 2004 at 5:30:04 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard

I enjoy the interplay between different worlds of talent and experience
from almost everyone here.The article about prisons and others about
efforts efforts to decriminalize pot and ibo reveal what I think are
critical misperceptions about the role of addictions, medicines, and
health in this world.

Pleasure seekers and completely leashed junkies are uniquely valuable as
lab rats for the global fascist police state. We can sure hope for a
better world. But who could expect endorsement, funding, acceptance or
approval for a freely available powerful tool to escape addiction or
generic mind control?

The 20th century has seen an almost continuous global war against the
human spirit, or its most positive aspects. Our collective experience with
pharmaceutical and recreational drugs for the past several generations has
been about how to more completely limit, contain, and harness the human
spirit. And the opposition has been getting damn good at what they do.
Prozac is light years ahead of the early drugs IGFarben played with on
inmates in the Nazi camps. So is bathtub speed. People even pay money to
take these! Creating Jobs and “Prosperity”!.

Ibogaine comes along and effectively puts a pie in the face of
pharmaceutical cartels, academics and professionals involved in the
co-called “health care” professions(try “Disease Management”). It even
works! In its first social introduction into NYC with the Black Panthers
in the 60’s, the purveyors were shot. These violent tactics of
assassination by police and military spooks might have hinted at their
value of addiction as a social engineering and financial tool.

I missed that then completely. Like many hippies I wanted to get high and
stop the stupid War in Viet Nam, in about that order. The social
engineering and counterinsurgency skills being developed next door in the
Black Community using addiction, ignorance,disease, and poverty just never
got through my psychedelic doors of perception.

The methadone leash has proven its worth, and by criminalizing weed,
steroids,and psychedelics, critical profits and networks can be
maintained, and the most visionary and intelligent sectors of the
population can be permanently evicted from the political process. Just
give thousands of intellectuals and conscious younger people felony rap
sheets from staged prosecutions. Never able to own guns or vote. Sweet! In
stark levels of teutonic efficiency, lets also privatise the prisons so we
can peg wage slavery to a captive population and finally become
competitive with third-world sweat shop hourly rates. This neat twist will
bring the whole show into self-funding sustainability for decades to come.

That is, unless some moron comes along and kills the golden goose. Cures
the diseases we harvest profits from managing, breaks the addiction cycle
we have invested so much into perfecting, wakes the masses to their
original equipment intelligence, love, and human rights. Stupidity like
that. Any real threat of these outcomes coming from you or your group, and
the gloves will come off right after projectiles are launched. They have
always done so ever since the Brits started to charge Chinese for the
Opium. End of this rant.

Thanks, Howard, et al, for the manual on Ibo treatment for addiction and
the ideas for staying clean after treatment, I appreciate what I am
learning from you all for my patients. Any further tips on accessing,
processing, handling, and dosing the various forms of Ibo would be also
very welcome.

Please keep your wits about you regarding privacy, legality, and security
issues with Ibo if you live within the formerly somewhat free USA. Newly
elected Bonesman Kerry will keep the New World Order rolling, tho getting
rid of the Shrub’s peanut gallery will be a wonderful thing. Almost worth
the insipid bipartisan charade. The whole cabal needs some kind of cosmic
pest control service to step in and recycle them into petrochemicals, but
that would let us all off the hook too easily, methinks.

Meanwhile, Happy “Change Units” as our future rolls toward us.

Dr. Tom

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] LIFE ON THE OUTSIDE
Date: March 20, 2004 at 1:16:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ORIGINAL ARTICLE
*****************
Newshawk: Get Active! http://www.mapinc.org/how2.htm
Pubdate: Sun, 21 Mar 2004
Source: New York Times (NY)
Section: Sunday Book Review
Copyright: 2004 The New York Times Company
Contact: letters@nytimes.com
Website: http://www.nytimes.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/298
Author: Brent Staples
Note: Brent Staples writes editorials for The Times and is the author of
the memoir ”Parallel Time: Growing Up in Black and White.”
Bookmark: http://www.mapinc.org/people/Jennifer+Gonnerman
Bookmark: http://www.mapinc.org/prison.htm (Incarceration)
Bookmark: http://www.mapinc.org/find?199 (Mandatory Minimum Sentencing)
Bookmark: http://www.mapinc.org/find?140 (Rockefeller Drug Laws)

‘LIFE ON THE OUTSIDE’: THE OTHER LOCKUP

LIFE ON THE OUTSIDE
The Prison Odyssey of Elaine Bartlett.
By Jennifer Gonnerman.
356 pp. New York: Farrar, Straus & Giroux. $24.

The United States is transforming itself into a nation of ex-convicts. This
country imprisons people at 14 times the rate of Japan, eight times the
rate of France and six times the rate of Canada. The American prison system
disgorges 600,000 angry, unskilled people each year – more than the
populations of Boston, Milwaukee or Washington. “Thirteen million people
have been convicted of a felony and spent some time locked up,” Jennifer
Gonnerman writes in “Life on the Outside.” “That’s almost 7 percent of U.S.
adult residents.

If all of these people were placed on an island together, that island would
have a population larger than many countries, including Sweden, Bolivia,
Senegal, Greece or Somalia.”

Ex-cons are marooned in the poor inner-city neighborhoods where legitimate
jobs do not exist and the enterprises that led them to prison in the first
place are ever present.

These men and women are further cut off from the mainstream by sanctions
that are largely invisible to those of us who have never been to prison.

They are commonly denied the right to vote, parental rights, drivers’
licenses, student loans and residency in public housing — the only housing
that marginal, jobless people can afford.

The most severe sanctions are reserved for former drug offenders, who have
been treated worse than murderers since the start of the so-called war on
drugs.

The Welfare Reform Act of 1996, for example, imposed a lifetime ban on food
stamp and welfare eligibility for people convicted of even a single drug
felony. The states can opt out of the prohibition, but where it remains
intact it cannot be lifted even for ex-prisoners who live model, crime-free
lives.

Drug offenders, many of them former addicts, have been consigned to civic
purgatory with no clear route to redemption. Gonnerman, a staff writer for
The Village Voice, traces this disastrous policy back 30 years to the
presidential ambitions of Nelson Rockefeller, the Republican New York
governor who was denied his rightward-rushing party’s presidential
nomination because he was seen as too liberal.

Rockefeller sought to prove his “tough on crime” bona fides through a
widely emulated package of drug laws that has come to be his chief legacy.

The legislature rejected a Rockefeller proposal that would have required a
life sentence for the highest level drug felony, known as A-1, but adopted
a similar sanction that set the mandatory minimum sentence at 15 to life —
which meant that hard-core judges could go higher if they chose.

A sentencing policy that had once penalized petty street-corner peddlers
less severely than drug kingpins no longer considered the perpetrators’
level of involvement in the trade.

Now everything hinged on the weight of the drugs.

A conviction for selling at least two ounces of heroin or cocaine meant A-1
— which meant a long, long stay in jail. Under the law, two ounces were as
bad as two kilos.

The first-time offender who gave in to the siren song of an easy score and
the junkie selling watered-down smack to feed a habit were no different
under the law from the full-timer who moved serious weight.

Rockefeller reveled in the fact that he had passed the toughest drug law in
the country.

But as Gonnerman notes, he “had helped launch a new experiment in crime
control, one that would have repercussions in every corner of the country
for decades to come.” The states were soon competing to see who could lock
up the most people for the longest periods of time. The national prison
population skyrocketed, from a modest 200,000 in 1973 to an eye-popping two
million today, at a cost to the country of about $55 billion per year.
States were soon forced to choose between building roads and schools and
building prisons.

Mass imprisonment has not hindered the drug trade.

Indeed, drugs are cheaper and more plentiful today than ever. In addition,
many of the addicts who are held in jail for years at a cost of more than
$20,000 per inmate per year could be more cheaply and effectively dealt
with in treatment. What jumps out at you from “Life on the Outside” is the
extent to which imprisonment has been normalized, not just for adults from
poor communities but for children who visit their parents in prison.

Spending holidays and birthdays behind bars for years on end, these
children come to think of prison as a natural next step in the process of
growing up.

“Life on the Outside” tells this story through the family of Elaine
Bartlett, a young mother of four who received a sentence of 20 to life for
her first offense — selling cocaine to an undercover cop in a motel near
Albany. Bartlett was pardoned after 16 years and went on to speak publicly
about the evils of the Rockefeller drug laws. She rails against the
unfairness of the law, but she was hardly naive when she decided to carry a
package of cocaine from New York to Albany together with her boyfriend,
Nathan Brooks, a petty dealer with whom she shared an apartment.

Elaine had grown up in Harlem during the 60’s and 70’s, when the
neighborhood that has become newly fashionable today was a burned-out shell
and the epicenter of the heroin trade.

Elaine’s mother, Yvonne, had been arrested for selling heroin for pocket
money and Yvonne’s boyfriend had died of an overdose.

When Elaine took that train from New York to Albany, she was hoping for a
quick score of $2,500, perhaps to buy some furniture and hold a nice
Thanksgiving dinner for her family.

She and Nathan, however, were ensnared in a buy-and-bust and hauled before
one of the toughest drug judges in the state. While at trial, Elaine was
startled to see the man who had lured her to Albany take the stand as a
witness for the prosecution. The man was George Deets, a drug dealer and
addict who ran a drug-trafficking operation while working as an informant
for the state police.

Deets has since died of an overdose.

Even so, the story of how he maintained an intimate relationship with the
state police while freely selling large amounts of drugs — and fingering
other dealers elsewhere — merits further investigation. It also
underscores a problem with how the police have operated under the
Rockefeller system.

Gonnerman writes that Deets typically volunteered to serve as an informant
— which meant trawling for fresh meat in Harlem — whenever he was
arrested on a drug charge.

He waltzed down to New York and lured the mark up to Albany County, making
sure there was enough drug present for an A-1 bust. The mark sold the drugs
to the cops, who were grateful for the collar, and Deets lived to traffic
another day.

Elaine’s children were 10, 6, 3 and 1 when the judge sent her to jail. The
most heartbreaking scenes in “Life on the Outside” depict Bartlett huddled
with her four young children in prison visiting rooms.

The family gathered every weekend and posed for pictures taken by the
visiting-room photographer. The years wear on and the children grow up
before our eyes, suffering all of the problems that might be expected in
young people traumatized by the absence of a beloved parent.

The prison visiting rooms have become a bizarre lovers’ lane where
teenagers strike up relationships with people from other prison families or
with inmates themselves. With each generation, the families grow steadily
more accustomed to living their lives in captivity.

By the time Elaine is pardoned, her mother, who has cared for the children,
is dead, and the wreckage of her extended family is too much to bear. Most
of this moving and well-reported book deals with Elaine’s struggle to
create a life for herself outside the prison walls — by finding a job, a
place to live, and by reconnecting with her thoroughly damaged family.

This ground is familiar, but revelatory too, as when Elaine realizes that
she has exchanged the prison behind bars for the prison that awaits
ex-offenders who try to make it in the real world.

Her worst nightmare comes true when her teenage son, Jamel, who grew up in
the visiting room, follows in his mother’s footsteps and goes to jail
himself. Jamel is visited inside by a 15-year-old girlfriend who is too
young even to enter the gates but gets in with a fake ID. The girl becomes
pregnant by Jamel, who has left jail briefly only to return, and the cycle
begins anew.

From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 20, 2004 at 12:54:46 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Nick – you’ve been helpful and supportive from the beginning (as
everyone here has been) so I’m mucho appreciative.

Brooke

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 1:51 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Hello all,

Just to summarize, my name is Brooke Burgess, and I’ve posted
several
times
in order to glean some of the intricacies of the process before I
undertake
my first journey. I have 50g of rootbark from a reputable source,
and
will
be taking off 5 days from work within the next two weeks to fully
immerse
myself in the experience.

Here’s my current checklist – please feel free to make suggestions,
corrections, criticisms, and such – or contact me directly at
brooke@brokensaints.com.

Hi Brooke,

I don’t know if you’re referring to the recipe posted at
www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm but if so it’s actually just half a
bottle of
vodka and two glasses of red wine + the lemon juice. Don’t know that
it
makes so much difference but just to let you know.

After this, I will boil off the alcohol and test the remnants for
bitterness
– I will prepare a quiet space with images and items that trigger
emotional
memories and ties to serious blocks and blisses from my life.
– I’ll have a strong and considerate ‘watcher’ with basic medical
training
and a spiritual understanding to veer me back onto ‘the path’ in
case
things
go awry. Oh…and don’t forget the handy bucket by the bed for
sudden
movements.
– I’ve set aside the pre-requisite three days for a slow and
thoughtful
return to full mobility and reintegration with the ‘real’ world.
– I will detox the days leading up to dosing, and not eat for 8
hours
before use. As well, I will take a small sample and wait several
hours to
gauge its effects.

For the food prior to cleansing, raw or steamed veggies + fresh fruit
would
be the best, imo. This basic alkaline diet should smooth the
experience at
an emotional and physical level, again just my opinion.

Good luck

Nick

– I will write down everything I experience afterwards in order to
share
it
with myself (at a more coherent time), and those who have supported
me…including the members of this board!

That’s basically it. Am I missing anything crucial? Thoughts?

Thanks in advance

Brooke Burgess
www.brokensaints.com

/]=——————————————————————-
–=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=——————————————————————-
–=[/

/]=—————————————————————–
—-=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=—————————————————————–
—-=[/

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] (OT) Re: [ibogaine] dammit!
Date: March 20, 2004 at 12:01:05 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hahaha!!! Just saying they are men, 25 and 21, not boys.
Callie

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] (OT) Re: [ibogaine] dammit!
Date: March 20, 2004 at 11:51:30 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie wrote >My two men sons…<

And I ask in very friendly fashion, as opposed to what? Women sons?
;-))
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, March 20, 2004 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] dammit!

Vector, My main account is with AOL (I know, I know! but I like AOL!) but I
have another account with hotmail. It is decent. My two men sons have
accounts with hotmail and they have no complaints either. It is free too. I
had a Yahoo account but never liked it. Give hotmail a spin!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] oil
Date: March 20, 2004 at 11:43:52 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There are a lot of folks who can’t understand
how we came to have an oil shortage here in America.

Well, there’s a very simple answer:
Nobody bothered to check the oil.

We just didn’t know we were getting low.

The reason for that is purely geographical.

All our oil is in Alaska, Texas, California,
and Oklahoma.

All our dipsticks are in Washington, DC.

Peace to all and have a great weekend!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] dammit!
Date: March 20, 2004 at 11:11:22 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Vector, My main account is with AOL (I know, I know! but I like AOL!) but I have another account with hotmail. It is decent. My two men sons have accounts with hotmail and they have no complaints either. It is free too. I had a Yahoo account but never liked it. Give hotmail a spin!
Callie

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 20, 2004 at 11:03:28 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 1:51 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Hello all,

Just to summarize, my name is Brooke Burgess, and I’ve posted several
times
in order to glean some of the intricacies of the process before I
undertake
my first journey. I have 50g of rootbark from a reputable source, and
will
be taking off 5 days from work within the next two weeks to fully immerse
myself in the experience.

Here’s my current checklist – please feel free to make suggestions,
corrections, criticisms, and such – or contact me directly at
brooke@brokensaints.com.

Hi Brooke,

I don’t know if you’re referring to the recipe posted at
www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm but if so it’s actually just half a bottle of
vodka and two glasses of red wine + the lemon juice. Don’t know that it
makes so much difference but just to let you know.

After this, I will boil off the alcohol and test the remnants for
bitterness
– I will prepare a quiet space with images and items that trigger
emotional
memories and ties to serious blocks and blisses from my life.
– I’ll have a strong and considerate ‘watcher’ with basic medical
training
and a spiritual understanding to veer me back onto ‘the path’ in case
things
go awry. Oh…and don’t forget the handy bucket by the bed for sudden
movements.
– I’ve set aside the pre-requisite three days for a slow and thoughtful
return to full mobility and reintegration with the ‘real’ world.
– I will detox the days leading up to dosing, and not eat for 8 hours
before use. As well, I will take a small sample and wait several hours to
gauge its effects.

For the food prior to cleansing, raw or steamed veggies + fresh fruit would
be the best, imo. This basic alkaline diet should smooth the experience at
an emotional and physical level, again just my opinion.

Good luck

Nick

– I will write down everything I experience afterwards in order to share
it
with myself (at a more coherent time), and those who have supported
me…including the members of this board!

That’s basically it. Am I missing anything crucial? Thoughts?

Thanks in advance

Brooke Burgess
www.brokensaints.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 20, 2004 at 6:48:00 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, March 19, 2004 5:56 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?

In a message dated 3/19/04 2:47:43 PM, lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes:

Has anyone read this article on the ibogaine dossier?

http://www.ibogaine.org/speyrer.html

Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories.
What caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS
“INCREDIBLY
VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological
effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of
suggests
that all repressed trauma or emotion has been removed at this stage by
the
ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.

This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was
wondering
if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how
had that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict
background would gain more from the experience due to being less blocked
by drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.

I did ibogaine 4 times in 1999 and didn’t experience many visuals. I still
consider my eyes to “hold a lot of emotion” (usually fear, anger, passion,
or just general intensity) and will probably try and focus on this area when
I get around to doing it again, maybe soon.

The idea of emotions being “held” like this is also kind of supported by
therapies like EMDR (Eye Movement Desensitization and Reprocessing) where
the client is guided into accessing repressed feelings by being asked to
move his or her eyes in a certain way (upwards and to the left, etc). It’s
generally reckoned to work pretty good, from what I hear, so I’ve no doubt
there’s a lot of the truth in the theoretical side. From my experience of
being involved in month-long marathon groups, and similar processes intended
to open participants up emotionally, I remember that eye infections develop
very easily. It’s often seems related to someone “not wanting to see
something” or “not wanting to look at an issue.” (In fact, the whole body is
a mirror of the unconscious, as explored in kinesiology)

So, personally, I hope I get more desensitization in the eyes next time I do
ibo. It would be interesting to hear what Eric himself thinks about the idea
that ibogaine can remove repressed trauma from the eyes.

Nick

Luke,

I believe I may have been the first to perceive that ibogaine
visualization
ceased after x number of ibogaine treatments but, this still remains
hypothetical as there is not enough data to determine whether it is true
or not and
then, for what percentage of the patients.

It appears that some ibogaine providers believe that the effects of
ibogaine
on non-drug dependent individuals would be greater than on drug dependent
individuals but, I think that is still open to discussion also.

Too bad there is not some universally accepted criteria for what
determines
gain. On the other hand, I believe that all providers believe that
multiple
treatments over time are generally more effective than single treatments.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] opitical illusion
Date: March 20, 2004 at 12:50:01 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A great optical illusion.

http://www.michaelbach.de/ot/mot_mib/index.html

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] stranger than fiction
Date: March 19, 2004 at 9:48:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/19/04 9:44:50 PM, WGladstone writes:

Did you ever see the original King Kong (1933)?
If you did, you will remember the poignant final scene, with King Kong
atop the Empire State Building, fighting off the Air Corps (that was in
the days before the Air Force, obviously). He catches one plane, rips it
up, and it’s gone. The other planes, with their machine guns, wound him
fatally and he falls all the way down to 34th Street and 5th Avenue. Now,
few people know this, but “Kong”, as he was known to his friends, had drug
habit, a powerful addiction that he called “the beast”. He wanted desperately
to get the monkey off his back, so to speak.
In any event, he hits the ground very hard and creates a giant pothole
that still hasn’t been fixed properly.
The character played by Robert Armstrong (you know, the one who captured
King Kong and makes him into a star at Radio City Music Hall, training
him on the side to become a rockette), well anyway, this character makes
his through the crowd and stands by the great, motionless body. The police
sergeant says: “Well, the airplanes got him”.
And he answers what sounds like: “Oh, no. It was beauty killed the beast”.
Now, what he actually said was: “It was Bwiti killed the beast”, meaning
that Kong had been cured of his addiction, not to Fay Wray (who was really
a low-level, well, in a sense, high-level, dealer, supplying the great
ape with lots of stuff), but to the beast.

Voilà. C`est fini.

Best regards,

William Gladstone
French/English medical and pharmaceutical translator and lexicographer.

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Stern no Loss
Date: March 19, 2004 at 9:31:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

All right Howard Stern!

.:vector:.

Two mornings ago, Howard Stern turned down our expressions of support. We’re still banned from his show. I can’t tell if it’s because of the ibogaine (diverting the focus from pot jokes to something serious), and because he’s still pissed that we removed the Pope of Pot from our stage in 1994 because the cops were about to shut us down unless we had the next band on and off stage in 20 minutes, and Pope Mickey wanted to jump the queue and do a rant trashing us. I think it was the incident with the Pope.

He is absolutely against OUR freedom of speech, and worked hand-in-glove with Rudy G. to torpedo the Cures not Wars Parade in 1997. What goes around….comes around.

Dana/cnw

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: [vox] Could Stern’s anti-Bush rants shock the vote?
Date: March 19, 2004 at 8:51:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

All right Howard Stern!

.:vector:.

— Joshua Tinnin <krinklyfig@pacbell.net> wrote:

http://www.boston.com/news/globe/living/articles/2004/03/18/could_sterns_anti_bush_rants_shock_the_vote/

Could Stern’s anti-Bush rants shock the vote?
By Matthew Gilbert, Globe Staff, 3/18/2004

American liberals have been waiting for a perch on talk radio, a
medium
dominated by conservative and right-wing voices since the 1980s. And
on
March 31, the new Air America Radio network will give them a nascent
one, as
it premieres in the New York, Los Angeles, and Chicago markets. Just
as “The
Daily Show” brings an openly lefty spin to TV news, Air America will
fly in
the face of the right wing with hosts including Al Franken, Janeane
Garofalo, and Marty Kaplan.

But wait a minute: Is “shock jock” Howard Stern — stripper
aficionado,
champion of misfits everywhere, all-purpose radio provocateur —
already
giving liberals a voice on the airwaves? And is that voice powerful
enough
to affect the upcoming presidential election?

Since the FCC crackdown on media “indecency” in the wake of Janet
Jackson’s
Nipplegate incident, Stern has transformed his morning variety show
into a
rabidly anti-Bush talk forum. Every weekday, he has been devoting
hours of
his broadcast (locally on WBCN-FM, 104.1) to impassioned criticism of
President Bush and support of Senator John Kerry. Railing tirelessly
against
the president, Stern has been attacking Bush’s yoking together of
church and
state, the legitimacy of his National Guard service, his use of Sept.
11
imagery in his campaign ads, his stances regarding First Amendment
rights,
his handling of Iraq, and his stands on gay marriage and stem-cell
research.

“Join me and friends of this show who are outraged,” Stern said on
the air
last Friday. “Vote out every Republican you can find.” He has also
been
urging his listeners to send money to Kerry’s campaign, calling him
“a good
man” and praising his record in Vietnam as well as his later
criticism of
the Vietnam War.

“With all the talk of liberal talk radio,” says Michael Harrison, the
editor
and publisher of Talkers magazine, “we’re seeing emerging from the
ranks of
‘shock jocks’ one of the most potent and articulate liberal talkers
we’ve
seen in years.”

Harrison calls Stern’s recent crusade “historic.” “Anytime you have
somebody suddenly igniting political interest with an audience who
has the
kind of loyalty factor Stern has, it could turn an election.” A large
percentage of Stern’s listeners — some 8 1/2 million a week — were
leaning
in favor of Bush, Harrison says. “If Stern could turn several million
Bush
supporters away from Bush, that has even more impact than Rush
Limbaugh,
who’s preaching to the choir. So this is pivotal to what is shaping
up to be
a close election.”

“On a national level, I don’t know how much influence Stern could
have,”
says Chuck Todd, editor of The Hotline, a Washington-based daily
briefing on
politics. “But we assume too little at our own peril when it comes to
Stern
and talk radio in general. . . . Does Bush really need to worry about
him?
If New York were a swing state, we definitely would take this more
seriously. Is Stern’s popularity as devoted outside of New York? We
only
know it is ratings-wise.”

Stern is frequently dismissed, by liberals and conservatives alike,
as a
sexist, a racist, and a narcissist. But he is one of the most
influential
entertainers in America, particularly among the much-sought-after
18-to-25-year-old male demographic. His show is a critical stop for
actors
plugging youth-market movies, and his skits serve as the blueprint
for many
reality TV concepts. Last month, in an effort to borrow some of
Stern’s
mojo, Jay Leno hired Stern sidekick “Stuttering John” Melendez to be
an
announcer and correspondent on “The Tonight Show.”

Harrison says that Stern’s audience is broader than most people
realize.
“They’re not just 18-year-old, beer-drinking yahoos. They’re 20- and
30- and
40-something professionals. They’re mainstream American citizens who
are
well-educated and affluent and socially active and politically
interested,
though not politically active. But they’re being motivated. Wouldn’t
that be
amazing if millions of people vote who otherwise wouldn’t, because of
this
issue?”

“Some people will dismiss Stern not because they don’t believe he has
a
following, but because they believe his listeners don’t vote,” Todd
says. “I
would argue that a swing voter is just that; they swing between not
voting
and voting, not between the two parties. So if he brings some
nonvoters to
the polls, then that’s a big impact.”

Over the years, Stern has occasionally taken political positions. In
the
1994 New York gubernatorial election, he briefly ran as the
Libertarian
Party candidate, before withdrawing and endorsing Republican George
Pataki.
“One could argue that he had an effect on that New York governor’s
race,
that he was an impact player,” Todd says. And until recently, Stern
was
supportive of Bush and the decision to go to war in Iraq. But Stern
has
never come out so relentlessly for or against a politician, and he is
best
known as someone who would just as soon joke about flatulence and
prostitution as take on the government. His anti-Bush push began in
earnest
after the FCC crackdown on “indecency” inspired Clear Channel —
which he
calls “Fear Channel” — to remove his show from six cities the week
of Feb.
23. While those markets form a relatively small portion of his
audience, the
punitive action threw Stern for a loop. And his outrage has boiled to
a head
with news that Congress is currently considering a radical increase
in the
amount of FCC indecency fines (from a maximum of $27,500 to
$500,000).

“It’s over,” Stern said on the air Tuesday. “When the Senate passes
that
bill, it’s over. The show is over. . . . We can’t do a radio program
that’s
cutting edge . . . if the government keeps second-guessing everything
we
do.”

Stern is also maintaining that Clear Channel dropped him last month
not
because of indecency but because of some of his Bush criticism
earlier in
the year. “There’s a real good argument to be made that I stopped
backing
Bush and that’s when I got kicked off Clear Channel,” he said on the
air
earlier this month.

“When he takes that FCC persecution mantle and wraps it around his
political
views,” says Mark Walsh, CEO of Air America, “and when he implies
that it
wasn’t until he started to criticize this president that he really
started
getting nailed for ‘immorality’ and ‘obscenity,’ he throws gasoline
on the
fire.

“If he says, ‘I’m being stifled because I have the temerity to
challenge
this president,’ and ‘Remember a year and a half ago when
entertainers were
chastised for questioning the war and now I’m getting nailed for the
same
thing,’ if he starts pounding that drum, I would contend that a
significant
portion of his listenership will take that as gospel truth.”

“He is self-aggrandizing if he thinks he’s being singled out here,”
says
Jeffrey Chester, executive director of the Center for Digital
Democracy, a
Washington-based advocacy organization. “Congress is engaging in this
kind
of witch hunt generally. I don’t think they’re singling out Stern for
his
alleged critical comments against the Bush administration.”

Whether or not he is being censored for putting down Bush, the First
Amendment issues at stake in his case remain incendiary. How much is
America
willing to let politicians determine what is “decent” and “indecent”?

“It has been this bubbling issue that unites liberals and
conservatives,
this free speech stuff,” says Todd. “And it could pop under the right
circumstances. It probably needs a linchpin, the way gay marriage got
its
linchpin thanks to the mayor of San Francisco suddenly issuing
marriage
licenses. It will need a seminal moment. Is Stern getting thrown off
the air
that moment for this FCC issue? I don’t know.”

“I’m no fan of Howard Stern or Rush Limbaugh and what I think is the
tabloid-esque domination of radio and a great deal of television,”
says
Chester. “But Congress is stampeding to censor a whole range of
speech.”
Chester says it is unclear whether Kerry will indeed be Stern’s
“savior,”
and that “what Stern really should be doing is trying to get Kerry to
be
public and accountable on this.”

One thing does seem clear, however. If Stern loses this battle, his
cause
will take on added vigor. “Take Stern off the air because of the
government?” says Harrison. “Take a guy that’s a beloved icon and
turn him
into a beloved martyr.”

Matthew Gilbert can be reached at gilbert@globe.com.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: [vox] Fw: Act Now To Oppose Dangerous Drugged Driving Legislation
Date: March 19, 2004 at 8:52:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Great, smoke a joint and be guilty up to a month later 🙁

.:vector:.

—– Original Message —–
From: “NORML Alerts” <letters@norml.org>
To: “NORML Alerts” <norml_news@mail.norml.org>
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 10:43 AM
Subject: Act Now To Oppose Dangerous Drugged Driving Legislation

To unsubscribe, follow the instructions at the bottom.

Take Action Now!
http://capwiz.com/norml2/issues/alert/?alertid=5384696&type=CO

Friends:

NORML needs your help convincing Congress to reject a pair of bills
that
would criminally punish marijuana smokers for “drugged driving”
simply if
inactive marijuana metabolites are detected in their bodily fluids
– even
if the individual is neither under the influence nor impaired to
drive.

H.R. 3907, sponsored by Rep. Jon Porter (R-NV), demands that state
legislatures amend their DUID (driving under the influence of
drugs) to
enact mandatory minimum penalties for anyone convicted of driving
under
the influence of illegal drugs. Under the proposal, states have
until
2006 to pass and enforce DUID laws “approved by the Administrator
of the
National Highway Traffic Safety Administration,” or lose portions
of their
federal highway funding.

H.R. 3922, sponsored by a bipartisan coalition of legislators
including
Reps. Robert Portman (R-OH), Sander Levin (D-MI), Steven LaTourette
(R-OH), Mark Souder (R-IN) and Jim Ramstad (R-MN), seeks to impose
so-called “model” DUID legislation upon all 50 states – demanding
they
enact statutes sanctioning anyone who operates a motor vehicle
“while any
detectable amount of a controlled substance is present in the
person’s
body, as measured in the person’s blood, urine, saliva, or other
bodily
substance.”

These bills represent an all out federal assault on the marijuana
smoking
community. Because inactive marijuana metabolites (inert compounds
indicative of past drug use) remain detectable in the blood, and
particularly urine, for days and sometimes weeks after past use,
this
legislation seeks to define sober drivers as if they were
intoxicated.
Someone who smokes marijuana is impaired as a driver at most for a
few
hours; certainly not for days or weeks. To treat all marijuana
smokers as
if they are impaired, even when the drug’s effects have long worn
off, is
illogical and unfair.

At a minimum, laws targeting drug drivers should identify “parent
drugs”
(i.e., THC), not simply inactive drug metabolites, and have
scientifically
sound cut-off levels similar to those that exist for drunk driving.
“Zero
tolerance” laws are neither a safe nor sensible way to identify
impaired
drivers; they are an attempt to misuse the traffic safety laws in
order to
identify and prosecute marijuana smokers per se.

Please take two minutes to contact your member of the House of
Representatives and tell them that these proposed per se laws are
neither
fair nor sound public policy by visiting:
http://capwiz.com/norml2/issues/alert/?alertid=5384696&type=CO

With your help, we can turn back or amend these dangerous and
unfounded
proposals.

Sincerely,

Keith Stroup
Executive Director
NORML

####################
NORML Media Watch
NORML was featured prominently in several media outlets this week,
including The Chicago Tribune, The Village Voice and The San
Antonio
Express-News. To read these articles or about other NORML media
appearances, check out “NORML in the Media” at:
http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=5481

Smokers vote in 2004! Check out the candidate’s updated positions
on
marijuana policy. If you have not already done so, register to
vote or
change your voter registration address at:
http://www.norml.org/index.cfm?Group_ID=5916
####################

—> leave-norml_news-109803L@mail.norml.org

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam
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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: [vox] PKD, the Unicorn, and Soviet Psychotronics
Date: March 19, 2004 at 8:53:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@Mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

— Vigilius Haufniensis <nerdmann@new.rr.com> wrote:
http://www.alphane.com/moon/PalmTree/unicorn.htm

PKD, the Unicorn, and Soviet Psychotronics

Adam Gorightly

I tried to tell all this to the checkers at Trader Joe’s, the food
store where we shop, and they cancelled my check-cashing privilege.

PKD, Selected Letters 1977-1979

Philip K. Dick and Ira “the Unicorn” Einhorn, sixties radical
activist turned seventies New Age networker cum fugitive ax murderer,
began a correspondence in early February of 1978 centered around
Dick’s firmly held belief that the Russians were beaming psychotronic
(RF signal) transmissions via satellite into his already
somewhat-disturbed mind.

__________________________________
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Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam
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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] dammit!
Date: March 19, 2004 at 8:55:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@Mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If anyone wrote me personal email in the last week please resend it!
Sorry sorry sorry. I hate yahoo!!! It is throwing everything into bulk
and then I hit delete when I notice some names from this list and click
back and it’s gone.

How is hushmail? A lot of people look like they’ve moved to it, is it
decent?

Getting sick enough of yahoo to go buy a real account on hush or
mindvox? 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

.:vector:.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 19, 2004 at 12:56:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/19/04 2:47:43 PM, lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes:

Has anyone read this article on the ibogaine dossier?

http://www.ibogaine.org/speyrer.html

Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories.
What caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS
“INCREDIBLY
VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological
effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of suggests
that all repressed trauma or emotion has been removed at this stage by the
ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.

This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was wondering
if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how
had that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict
background would gain more from the experience due to being less blocked
by drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.

Luke,

I believe I may have been the first to perceive that ibogaine visualization
ceased after x number of ibogaine treatments but, this still remains
hypothetical as there is not enough data to determine whether it is true or not and
then, for what percentage of the patients.

It appears that some ibogaine providers believe that the effects of ibogaine
on non-drug dependent individuals would be greater than on drug dependent
individuals but, I think that is still open to discussion also.

Too bad there is not some universally accepted criteria for what determines
gain. On the other hand, I believe that all providers believe that multiple
treatments over time are generally more effective than single treatments.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fw: What’s in a name? ‘Patient’ or ‘client’? View from the consumer.
Date: March 19, 2004 at 11:22:09 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Does Anyone Care about Names? How Attendees at Substance Misuse Services
Like to Be Addressed by Health Professionals. Keaney F, Strang J et al.
European Addiction Research (2004) 10;2:75-79

I always kinda thought “client” was a bit ridiculously PC….

I definately prefer “patient” myself…

From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Do Ibo visuals cease after a number of sessions?
Date: March 19, 2004 at 9:13:42 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi,
Has anyone read this article on the ibogaine dossier?

http://www.ibogaine.org/speyrer.html

Eric Taub talks about ibogaines ability to release repressed memories. What caught my eye was in the paragraph titled ‘THE EXPERIENCE IS “INCREDIBLY VISUAL”. Here he states that ibogaine ceases it’s visual/psychological effects after it’s been taken a 4th, 5th or 6th time. It kind of suggests that all repressed truma or emotion has been removed at this stage by the ibogaine or that somehow there is a deffence against the ibogaine.

This seems very impressive and would be truly amazing but I was wondering if anyone has had experience of this. I haven’t read about anyone how had that many ibo experiences. Perhaps a person coming from a non-adict background would gain more from the experience due to being less blocked by drugs or alcohol? It’s an interesting thought all the same.

Luke

_________________________________________________________________
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From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 19, 2004 at 6:24:50 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi All,
I’d like to say thanks to everyone for their advice and encouragment. It’s nice to talk to people who understand the whole experience of ibogaine. It’s been about 2 years since my first ibogaine treatment and it’s been rewarding and at the same time very difficult. I feel changed radicaly inside and it’s been very confusing to let go of my old self. I’ve gone from seriously abusing alcohol and varius stimulants and now feel like I’m in a stage of limbo were I’m starting to feel stong desires to do something fullfilling with my life but have yet to figure out what I want.
For me it feels like having to relearn who I really am and now that my feelings and values about life are changing. At times this has been a bit disconcerting as I feel extremly open emotionaly and felt alienated at times. There are times now that I feel fantastic though and most of my body feels much lighter and supple i think. I find that much of my memories are coming back as the months go by and seems so amazing but also sad to be able to remember my childhood. I’d been to psychotherapy many times but when asked about my childhood I could remember very little.
I’m trying to find a therapy bassed on emotional expression but I live in Ireland and I’m having a lot of difficulty finding such a therapy. I found a guy who does Rolfing in Dubling so I’m thinking of doing that. I also found a site that deals with breathwork in Ireland. I’m not familiar with breathwork though, so I’ll have to look into it more. I might also do another ibogaine session a year after the last. I find ibogaine very tough though.
Thanks
Luke

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: Fri, 12 Mar 2004 09:08:48 -0000

—– Original Message —–
From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 5:39 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine

> Hi Howard,
>
> It’s been about 8 months since I last took ibogaine.
>
> I wasn’t aware of tension in my neck before ibogaine, although a
> chiropracter had once commented on how tense my neck was before ibogine.
I
> didn’t notice it myself.
>
> As for anger, I mostly only feel that way when I’m in a situation I feel
> stressed, or under pressure like at work. It seems more extreem than
> before.
>
> In my last ibogaine experience I had visions of birth and felt the
sensation
> of my head being squashed and it felt like very deep tension was being
> released. I had an incredible anger in me as a child and I remember that
I
> always supressed my emotions. it feels like there are alot of feelings
> pushing to be resolved.
>
> Luke
>

Hi Luke,

The drug is opening your body up. This is GOOD! Previously you weren’t aware
of the tension now you are. This is GOOD! Previously you were suppressing
your anger, now you feel it. This is GOOD! Basically, you’re doing great!
Now you need to get yourself into some regular therapy groups where you can
talk about issues and feelings and also resolve them physically – ie.
through emotional expression, breathwork, bioenergetics, or similar. Primal
groups or rebirthing are great for womb and childhood stuff. Check out the
net and media for what is available to you locally.

Like Bill says, cleansing is also good. A liver cleanse would be great,
energetically a lot of anger can be held in the liver. With the one he
suggests it’s good to drink a litre of apple juice a day (organic and
pressed if you can afford it) for at least ten days before actually taking
the epson salts and the oil/juice/black walnut tincture mix. It’ll will help
all the liver stones get out. A good strong colon cleanse will also help a
lot, such as the Arise and Shine 28 day one – check www.ariseandshine.com
(cleanse guide pdf) for details. And, whilst were on the subject, an
alkaline diet will probably help your body also with moving away from anger.
Acid food (ie normal western diet) drags down blood pH, raising stress and
the leaves us very open to experiencing primal feelings in low level stress
situations – the woman in the grocers short changes you and you have a
strong urge to kill her. If you move to a more alkaline diet the body will
be able to comfortably deal with daily stress without it starting to react
as if threatened.

Frankly, what I’d do is as much of the above as I could afford. It’ll be
great. Plenty of people in groups take years to even feel anger! You’re
blessed!

Nick

_________________________________________________________________
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/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: [drugwar] Legal Drugs Pose Greatest Health Threat, WHO Says
Date: March 19, 2004 at 6:19:37 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Joshua Tinnin” <krinklyfig@myrealbox.com>
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 10:15 PM
Subject: [drugwar] Legal Drugs Pose Greatest Health Threat, WHO Says

http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&cid=594&ncid=594&e=6&u=/nm/20040318/hl_nm/health_drugs_dc

Legal Drugs Pose Greatest Health Threat, WHO Says
Thu Mar 18, 3:33 PM ET
By Axel Bugge

BRASILIA, Brazil (Reuters) – The health threat from legal drugs like
alcohol
and tobacco is much greater than that from illegal narcotics, the World
Health Organization (news – web sites) said on Thursday.

The first report of its kind by the global body found that dependence on
alcohol and cigarettes has a much greater cost for societies than illegal
drugs like cocaine and crack.

The Neuroscience of Psychoactive Substance Use and Dependence report said
that drug addiction is a growing problem, especially in poor countries
which
have rising rates of alcohol consumption and smoking.

There are about 200 million illegal drugs users worldwide, or 3.4 percent
of
the world population, it said. Illegal drugs contributed 0.8 percent to
global ill health in 2000, while alcohol accounted for 4.1 percent and
cigarettes 4 percent.

The percentages are based on a measurement used by WHO which gauges the
burden that premature deaths and years lived with disability impose on
society.

The “main global health burden is due to licit rather than illicit
substances,” the report said.

Men in rich countries are especially vulnerable to suffer from alcohol-
and
cigarette-related bad health.

“Health and social problems associated with use and dependence on tobacco,
alcohol and illicit substances require greater attention by the public
health community,” WHO Director-General Dr. Lee Jong-Wook said in a
statement.

The report also found that it may not be possible to fully cure drug
dependence because of long-term changes to the way the brain works.

Health experts need to consider a range of factors in treating drug
dependence because it is a disorder caused by genetic disposition, as well
as psychological and cultural factors, it said.

“Like major psychiatric disorders, substance dependence may not be curable
but improved effectiveness of available treatment has contributed
significantly to recovery,” said Dr. Catherine Le Gales-Camus,
assistant-director general of noncommunicable diseases and mental health
at
WHO.

The global launch of the report took place in Brazil, a country with
spiraling drug-related violence, which has in the past led to rough
treatment of drug users.

Any person can become a drug addict and that dependence is a disorder,
making it crucial to eradicate the stigma suffered by drug users that can
make treatment more difficult, the report said.

<]=———————————————————————–=[

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] qu(Gl)ick mind blender h-i.q.
Date: March 19, 2004 at 2:42:48 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I & IBOGA
For lack of a better word
The rats look bizarre

On the subject of high dose(200+) methadone cold turkey (nothing at all) kicks: a few questions if anyone knows….

How long did your ‘sickness’ last?
When answering this, how are you defining sickness?…
is the subsiding of some physical symptoms (both medically measurable and non-medically measurable) while other physical symptoms persist still considered sickness? does sickness end when opioid is no longer present in the system?, or does ‘sickness’ last until all endorphin, etc. levels are back to normal? does physical normal feel like the physical normal on methadone? does physical normal feel like physical normal before opioids?
I’m a bit curious to see so I can compare my experience. Oh and does anyone know if higher doses of long lasting opioids make the sickness last longer then lower doses or do they stay about the same regardless of dose size?

-Jason

From: ethnoelf@ziplip.com <ethnoelf@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Ethnogarden
Date: March 19, 2004 at 1:06:15 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello all,

Yes we are still around and in business as usual.
We had to send all mailing lists to a new e-mail account for viewing when we have time as 300 e-mails a day on top of customer e-mails is a little much to handle.

Hope you all are well,
Brett please drop us a line @ admin@ethnogarden.com when you have a chance.

—–Original Message—–
From: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004, 4:29 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ethnogarden

In a message dated 3/12/04 1:03:57 AM, brooke@blue.netnation.com writes:

Does anyone know if Ethnogarden is still in business ??

http://www.ethnogarden.com/ibogabark.htm

Their web page is up. Other than that I cannot say.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: What’s in a name? ‘Patient’ or ‘client’? View from the consumer.
Date: March 18, 2004 at 10:51:15 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, March 18, 2004 6:54 PM
Subject: What’s in a name? ‘Patient’ or ‘client’? View from the consumer.

Does Anyone Care about Names? How Attendees at Substance Misuse Services
Like to Be Addressed by Health Professionals. Keaney F, Strang J et al.
European Addiction Research (2004) 10;2:75-79

Dear Colleagues,

At last somebody has asked drug addicts/users in treatment what they
would like to be called. “Patients” is the consensus, at least in
London. According to these authors, the use of ‘client’ to refer to a
patient dates back to at least 1970, when the nursing faculty at Wichita
State University considered the term ‘patient’ inappropriate for the
healthy seeking health-maintenance advice or going for an annual
physical examination. The authors quote Wing: “The recent trend to refer
to people seeking health care as “clients” implies to me a component of
human interaction that I would expect in the business world rather than
in a trusting helping relationship”. ‘Patients’ also have a status and
traditional rights which pre-date modern consumer laws.

In a survey of 150 mixed dependency patients, ‘service user’ was the
least popular term, identified as the preferred term by only 5% of
subjects. “Patient” was preferred by 66% of alcoholics, 52% of opioid
users but only 47% of smokers in treatment. “Client” was only preferred
by 24% of alcoholics, 46% of illicit drug users and 41% of smokers in
treatment.

While only a minority considered that they personally had a ‘mental
illness’ (38%), most considered that ‘substance misuse problems’ formed
a category of mental health illness (59%). The authors state: ‘Commonly
used pejorative terms such as ‘alki’ or ‘junkie’ prejudice appropriate
care and add to stigmatisation’.

Thus the majority here preferred the term ‘patient’, going against
current trends in dependency treatment services for the wider use of the
term ‘client’.

They conclude: “In a culture of ‘user involvement’ in substance misuse,
the results of this study should prompt reconsideration and revision of
our verbal and written communications with patients”.

Comments by Andrew Byrne ..

From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine Manual thanks to Patrick
Date: March 18, 2004 at 7:59:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nice addition, printing it out now. Thanks 🙂

Destroying all the green ink in the printer but that’s what it’s there
for I think 😉

Peace out,
Curtis

On Tue, 16 Mar 2004 16:47:46 -0800 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
Patrick suggested the Manual for Ibogaine Therapy be available as
a pdf
document. Thanks to his suggestion and the cooperation of the National
Alliance of
Methadone Advocate’s Vice President Walter Ginter, the PDF file
is now
available for download. It has active links and feel free to copy
it to a CD for
convenient carrying.

It is available from the What’s new section of the Ibogaine Dossier
(self
promotion).

http://www.ibogaine.org/whatsnew.html

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/whatsnew.html

Thanks and enjoy.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Curtis
Date: March 18, 2004 at 7:58:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Callie, always gladly accepted 🙂

Not sure what msg you’re talking about, the only rant I’ve had lately
was about the Dana Beal messages a while ago, Patrick switched from ‘Darth
Vader on acid’ to Buddha somewhere around message 2 and before I read
it I posted a rant, felt stupid and got over it!

Peace out,
Curtis

On Wed, 17 Mar 2004 17:17:19 -0800 CallieMimosa@aol.com wrote:
((((((((((Curtis)))))))))))))
You seemed so angry, I thought a hug might soothe you out some!
Peace, Callie

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: Hattie <epoptica@freeuk.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] FW: Mirror Article
Date: March 18, 2004 at 5:40:29 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Another article from the UK.

If you can get the attachment great, if not the url is
http://stars.metawire.com/markwinter/markwinter.html

The daily mirror is a major tabloid over here with huge readership. And on the astrology page which is a sure read for many mirror readers.
Bit exaggerated but quite a good plug definitely.

More coming out in Observer soon I think too……

Hattie /]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Ph1ll1ps45@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 18, 2004 at 3:34:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi callie,u up 4 a chat

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] a new article at last
Date: March 18, 2004 at 2:33:47 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/18/04 6:47:54 PM, ross@cgl.ucsf.edu writes:

You might contact the author and suggest the avenue of research you
mention.

Done; added suggestion about 18-mc and noribogaine.

Exciting! Hope the work gets done and look forward to publication 18 months
or so from now.

Howard

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] a new article at last
Date: March 18, 2004 at 1:47:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You might contact the author and suggest the avenue of research you mention.

Done; added sggestion about 18-mc and noribogaine.

Bill

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ann Ardolino (or clone) Shows up on Kerry Thread
Date: March 18, 2004 at 1:20:44 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Thu, Mar 18, 2004 at 01:18:53PM -0500], [Dana Beal] wrote:

| Voletear wrote:

| >He is entitled to press any cause or venture he likes but he always
| >throws in copious condescending comments about addicts. He once
| >wrote me that he was ripped-off by a “junkie” (we resent the slight)
| >and developed animus from that. I replied that there are good

Hmmmm. I can see the problem right here. If being ripped off by a junkie
caused someone to develop Animus; well … perhaps being ripped off by a
basehead would cause them to develop Anima, thus, PERFECTLY BALANCING
everything, and realigning the whole entire universe.

There ya go. Problem solved. That’ll be $350 dollars please.

Dr. Kroupa

p.s., Anne is on MindVox. She’s been on the DrugWar list for years. I
don’t think she’s ever figured out how to actually sign up for the
ibogaine list … probably, there is a PLOT and/or CONSPIRACY to keep her
off it.

These things happen all the time.

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ann Ardolino (or clone) Shows up on Kerry Thread
Date: March 18, 2004 at 1:18:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Thu, Mar 18, 2004 at 01:18:53PM -0500], [Dana Beal] wrote:

| Voletear wrote:

There ya go. Problem solved. That’ll be $350 dollars please.

Dr. Kroupa

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Ann Ardolino (or clone) Shows up on Kerry Thread
Date: March 18, 2004 at 1:18:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Somebody should respond to this point-by-point. I don’t know if Antelope posted it, Maia Szalavitz or her boyfriend Peter, but repeats the old slander from ACT UP, that I want to throw addicts in jail so pot people can go free. All I ever did was advocate Dutch market separation, in a situation where methadone is prescribed, and pot is totally banned.

[I think I once said something like “If you take the pot cohort out of the equation (20 milllion people)–leaving hard drugs–you’re chances of getting busted for DEALING coke and heroin would go up way up”–hardly a non sequitur, that’s why Holland changed their laws in 1977.]

Where are the countless horror stories of folk whose ibogaine treatment failed? Antelope has spammed countless lists creating that impression, but there’s a lot of people on ibogaine@mindvox for whom it has worked, and no comparable list anywhere for the people who failed. And I never said I was ripped off by a junkie. The real story is more interested. I was harassed and physically assaulted for years by a junkie who claimed I OWED him money because he was smacked out and forgot to log in a payment for weed. Not only that, he got other people to denounce me as a rip-off (it was over a lousy thousand dollars) who were NOT junkies, but influential in the Yippie and HIGH TIMES scenes. AND he blew up my door with an M-80 just as Alice was answering it (she could have been blinded.) And when I responded in kind, they had me indicted on a seven year felony.

You can read about it in THE IBOGAINE STORY.

Voletear wrote:
I’m getting tired of checking out a new forum only to see Dana’s already there, trying to overpower it with his wild claims for Ibogaine. I have been on methadone for over thirty years and never once encountered someone who’s tried it. I *have* read countless horror stories of people who have tried the stuff and been ripped-off, !@%$ed over, and the damn ‘treatment’ did nothing.

He is entitled to press any cause or venture he likes but he always throws in copious condescending comments about addicts. He once wrote me that he was ripped-off by a “junkie” (we resent the slight) and developed animus from that. I replied that there are good addicts and bad addicts (just as there are good drinkers and bad drinkers) and that the good ones have survived by staying in the closet. Unfortunately that leaves the jerks and/or severely addicted (co-occuring mental disorder figures largely in the cohort) to put a face to addiction.

It’s one thing for a Bob Bennett or a Mark Souder to malign us; know us by who our enemies are. But when I see MediMar and cannabis supporters hot to throw addicts to the mob just to make their cause look one iota more palatable to the Right, it really disheartens me. We are supposed to be more progressive and charitable!
Furthermore, if you think the “lock up all the junkies but free all cannabis prisoners” tact is going to get legal cannabis one second sooner you are wrong. I think it is counter-productive. After all, you cannot say that legalizing marijuana makes sense for getting it out of the hands of gangster dealers and then deny the same connection for the other drugs – it makes your argument a non sequiter. It also has the effect of making you look like you’d do anything, say anything, to get your pot – it confirms suspicions our enemies use.

Addressing addiction progressively does not have to be an albatross around pot’s neck. The provisions for sweeping change already exist in laws written to regulate treatment with methadone and buprenorphine. The successful examples of it’s use exist and are spreading because it’s been such a success. I’m talking about lifting restrictions somewhat on which drugs can legally be used to treat and maintain an addict. The Swiss heroin trials of the late Nineties were an overwhelming success ( No, I’m not refering to the infamous Needle Park which was unregulated laissez faire and drew legions of drug tourists) and were adopted permanently in a plebiscite. The treatment is spreading across Europe, being greatly expanded in Great Britain, and soon will be trialed in three Canadian cities. It was only incredible US threats (Louie Freeh) not to purchase any of the Tasmanian poppy crop for pharmaceuticals (and a misanthropic PM), that kept Australia from moving ahead as well. We can do that here as well. There are excellent drugs for all the various addictions. We can use Ibogaine where a person wants to try it and fund more research into noribogaine – a derivative with far less side effects and potentially better outcome. The idea is to free patients from government-mandated monopolies. Currently addicts are being gouged ruthlessly by methadone clinics where there is no feasible competition. And some addicts just don’t respond well-enough to methadone.

As for the soft drugs I would suggest we legalize anything Nature has given us (because it was given to us all equally) in the form of a plant. Thus, pot, coca leaf, opium, mushrooms, etc would be legal. We could use this to save the family farm by limiting the size of plots on which these products could be grown. Tax could be levied to pay for drug treatment.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] a new article at last
Date: March 18, 2004 at 1:14:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Bill,

You might contact the author and suggest the avenue of research you mention.
Throwing 18-mc and noribogaine into the research may also provide interesting
results.

Howard

In a message dated 3/17/04 7:23:05 PM, ross@cgl.ucsf.edu writes:

Great study!

In this study, the effects of ibogaine on local cerebral glucose
utilization (LCGU) were determined in freely moving, drug-naive,
or morphine-dependent adult, male, Sprague-Dawley rats …
The rate of LCGU was determined by quantitative autoradiography
in 46 brain regions. In drug-naive animals, ibogaine produced
significant increases in LCGU in the parietal, cingulate, and
occipital cortices and cerebellum compared to controls consistent
with its activity as a hallucinogen and a tremorogen. Morphine-
dependent rats had only minor alterations in LCGU …
These findings indicate that ibogaine produces distinctly different
effects on LCGU in drug-naive and morphine-dependent rats. This
suggests that different mechanisms may underlie ibogaine’s
hallucinogenic and anti-addictive effects.

(binding sites?) involved, why does it seem as if people often need to

get over the addiction before the more ‘psychedelic’ effects can occur?

It may be that there are two mechanisms but that one inhibits the other,

perhaps by absorbing the ibogaine more readily. But then that mechanism

disappears with the addiction. In any case, it would be interesting to
compare binding site activity in these two cases of ibo administration.

… However, in morphine-dependent animals, ibogaine produced a
global decrease in LCGU that was greatest in brain regions such
as the lateral and medial preoptic areas, nucleus of the diagonal
band, nucleus accumbens shell, inferior colliculus, locus coeruleus,

and flocculus compared to morphine-dependent animals treated with saline.

I wonder if a search for the ibo/addict LCGU profile could turn up
a drug that might shed some light on the putative separate anti-
addictive receptor(s).

Also, it would be interesting to compare the ibo/drug-naive LCGU with
those of similarly drug-naive rats on LSD, DMT, mescaline, etc.

From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CSI on CD and D.A.R.E.
Date: March 17, 2004 at 11:32:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

dana
thanx for the cd. but it wont play on my mac. i have osx.2. it says quicktime doesnt have the software to play it.
any ideas?
marcus

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 18, 2004 at 8:13:10 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooke,

1.) …kiss your noggin good-bye..?

2.) I’d be preparing at least 40 grms and taking at least 15gms on the
outset with
the rest on the rebounds, ie, after the first wave of vomiting and then
again after the second
and so on… Of course, this is all in equivalency, since you’re preparing
an extract…
You might be under the impression that one is to take the ibo all at once
and be done with it.
I don’t recommend that approach, I’d say go easy but psyche yourself up to
drinking the
whole thing over, say, 6 hrs.
Once you’re under the effect, be sure to fight the urge to down alot of it
at once- this is really important- it will come back up within a minute, no
more than 2-3 gulps at any one time.. (This is really based on the african
brew, however, while the extract ought to be easier, I doubt it’s less
volatile)
If you do this correctly, you’re gonna trip harder but much, much more
comfortable than on
the outset. So don’t go by first impression… If this is the highest-grade
rootbark, you’re
looking at 2.4 gms of ibogaine (40gms x 6%) If it’s average, maybe as low as
1.2gms which
just barely accomodates a full trip… I don’t think you ought to risk not
having enough by preparing
only 20gms and you’re pretty much in the safe-zone even if you did the
entire batch… Besides, I
promise you, you’ll hear this voice that’ll tell ya to ‘take more’ and it
also told me ‘no more’.. so when
all is said and done, you’re going to be playing this by ear… uh, no pun
intended….

3.) Consider borrowing a mini-tape recorder, it is about the one thing that
one can do at almost any point in the trip… you’re otherwise not going to
hold a pen,
imo, not even the following day….

4.) Be sure to remove wristwatch and the batteries from those annoying wall
units- if I were
your watcher, you’d have no indication to the time, I would even lie to
you… As well, disconnect
the phone’s ringer, including having your watcher put his cell phone on
silent-mode….

5.) And yet another reminder- do this at night, start at night, after 10pm,
I can’t stress
this point enough and I recall Laurent Sazy and maybe Planteur mentioning
this as well…
Remember – this is your dark night of the soul….

Adam Gur

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 5:51 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer

Hello all,

Just to summarize, my name is Brooke Burgess, and I’ve posted several
times
in order to glean some of the intricacies of the process before I
undertake
my first journey. I have 50g of rootbark from a reputable source, and
will
be taking off 5 days from work within the next two weeks to fully immerse
myself in the experience.

Here’s my current checklist – please feel free to make suggestions,
corrections, criticisms, and such – or contact me directly at
brooke@brokensaints.com.

– with 190lbs of bodyweight, and being a first-time ‘non-addict’
experiencer (don’t nicotine and emotional trenches count for something?
🙂 ), I will be using 15-20g of rootbark.
– I was referred to an online recipe to extract the vital components,
which
requires 700ml of vodka, a glass of red wine, and the juice of a lemon to
allow the plant material to ferment over one week in a closed container.
After this, I will boil off the alcohol and test the remnants for
bitterness
– I will prepare a quiet space with images and items that trigger
emotional
memories and ties to serious blocks and blisses from my life.
– I’ll have a strong and considerate ‘watcher’ with basic medical
training
and a spiritual understanding to veer me back onto ‘the path’ in case
things
go awry. Oh…and don’t forget the handy bucket by the bed for sudden
movements.
– I’ve set aside the pre-requisite three days for a slow and thoughtful
return to full mobility and reintegration with the ‘real’ world.
– I will detox the days leading up to dosing, and not eat for 8 hours
before use. As well, I will take a small sample and wait several hours to
gauge its effects.
– I will write down everything I experience afterwards in order to share
it
with myself (at a more coherent time), and those who have supported
me…including the members of this board!

That’s basically it. Am I missing anything crucial? Thoughts?

Thanks in advance

Brooke Burgess
www.brokensaints.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <gboy@hush.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] important info
Date: March 17, 2004 at 9:28:05 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—–
Hash: SHA1

Warning, Site Contains: Undead, Starving, Rabid, Electrified Attack
Dogs on Speed wid Gatz

Photo please!

On Sun, 14 Mar 2004 19:34:22 -0800 Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
wrote:

I think I’m bored. Here are the results of clicking the mindvox logo
400 times. I have been nice and removed the duplicate results. How
many
of these are there? I have the feeling I could click it for days.

.:vector:.

“Alone in the Superunknown”
This is NOT the Summer of Love

‘Scuse me, gotta go … I have my Parole Officer hanging on a Meathook
in the Basement

“. . . I’m searchin’ for my mainline … I couldn’t hit it sideways
. .
.”

Made Wif Crack!
Kill For Peace
Nothing’s Shocking
” . . How Much does one Have to Pay . To Fry a Peak and Melt Away
. . ”
” … I Wonder is This Work or Play? . I’m Never Really Sure …
”

Do you Mind if I Move In Under your Sink…?

Dead Bodies Everywhere
MindVox: Where the Customer is Always Wrong
” Power Corrupts . Absolute Power is Kinda Neat ”
Say… Is there Anything Interesting in your Mom’s Medicine Cabinet?

Saturated with over 100mg/kg of Ibogaine per Inode
“… I am the needle in your vein … I am the high you can’t sustain
…”

“In the hot red light of a black and white; roses grow.”

You’re Living Proof that it Takes a Really Smart Person, to do So
Much
Stupid Shit

Symptoma Mundi

“… All my Kings have Fallen Down / Broken Heroes Feed the Ground
…”
I Will Not Fall
Symptom of the Universe
Aug 11 11:11:13 entropy mach: ttyscc0: receive error 2 (-902)
“I’ve eaten the sun and my tongue has been burned of the taste.”
“If, at first an idea is not absurd, there is no hope for it.”
“I am the Crawling Dead, a Phantom in a Box Shadow in Your Head”
“.. .Into a Psychic War … I Tear my Soul Apart and Eat it Some
More.
..”
“You cripple, you take away; my time, my peace, my empathy.”
“… And most of all, what Really Sucks, is Everything and All of
Us”
“.. I will Swallow Poison until I Grow Immune ..”
“I’ve seen everything imaginable, pass before these eyes.”

Calling All Freaks
Active Ingredients: LSD25 / Crack / Heroin / Ibogaine
Now Featuring: Downloadable Opiate Plug-In!
[DIE] Motherfucker [DIE]

Power Underneath Despair
Some Assembly Required
“So your sickness weighs a ton. And God’s name is smack for some.”
“Hate, if you want to hate. If it keeps you safe. If it makes
you
brave.”
“Sick of your religions … Full of shit opinions … So tired of
waiting to die.”

Somebody Please Help Me … I’ve Lost All My Molecules
Bad Junkie! No Fix!

“Up from the catacombs I ran into the angel again. He took the high
road, I took the low road.”

” … I Hate to Bleed . But it Heals my Pain … ”

More Human than Human
Love Kills
” . . . One More Fucking Time . . . ”
“Half of Me … Believes in You”
The Needle and The Damage Done
Welcome to the MindVox Reform School for Wayward Supermodels
2-(2-Chlorophenyl)-2-(Methylamino)-Cyclohexanone / Diacetylmorphine
/
12-Methoxyibogamine

Rituals of the Reconstruction
“Everything is Poison / Nothing is Poison”
Reality Distortion Field
Straight Outta Detox
Welcome to: Tranquillity Acres, Therapeutic Community
Space Ghost is NOT a Beta Carboline
Felons & Revolutionaries
Now Includes: Fully Integrated Messiah Complex
Psychedelic Temple of The Apocalypse
The Last Gathering of The Usual Suspects

,.wE are Transmitting from the year 2012 -^~ .n order to alter _.is
urgEnt thaT y.%,.<$

Reality is such a Malleable Concept
“I let my mind wander freely, and it didn’t come back.”
“I want to know God’s thoughts… All the rest are details.”

MindVox – Addiction (Remixed) [Version: LSD/Ibogaine/Heroin/Crack
DJ
Flatline].mp3

“…I’m Paranoid of People and it’s Starting to Show…”
Live at CBGB’s: Gweeds with Unicorn Rainbow & The Trustafarians
[cDc] Information is Junk Mail / The Tedium is The Message [cDc]
Basking within the Warm Glow of Celestial Love, Light, and that
Purple
Shit

“In the Church of my Heart, the Choir’s on Fire.”
… Epoptica & Junk the Magic Dragon wuz [HERE] …

Fade into the Night / Melt into the Light
I’m Gonna Kick Tomorrow…
All That Glitters… has a High Refractive Index
Are you High? That I Am … Watch me Fly, I’m Superman
“Wooden Jesus, I’ll cut you in, on 20% of my Future Sin.”
Releasing Mankind from The Burden of Consciousness
The Cycle Spins it Begins Again
“I’ve Worked Too Hard For My Illusions … Just To Throw Them All
Away”

Segmentation Fault (core dumped)
Erase Me Debase Me Freebase Me
You Are Exactly Where God Wants You To Be
Why do you have to be Such a Bitch?
My, what a Lovely Shooting Gallery you Live In
Are you a Junkie too?
Your Enemies are Plotting Against You
Post-human, Fully Deconstructed and Completely Incoherent
We Help People Hurt Themselves
Use Once and Destroy
Welcome Friend, Go Away we Hate You
Spreading the Disease
Today’s vocabulary word: Pedohomonecropyrobestiality
Feel it Throb … and it’s All for YOU!
Welcome to Hunt’s Point Industrial Park! Featuring: Coke, Dope &
Ho’s
I want What i Want what I want What I Want what i want whaT
It’s all Spiritual n’ Shit
.. .. Ground Control to Major Tom .. ..
Lost Boys
St. Petersburg
To All The Drugs that I’ve Done: This One’s For You
Get Down with The Sickness
Recent Scientific Studies Strongly Suggest that you’re Totally Fucked
“… I’m Near The End … I’m Wasted … and I Can’t Find My Way
Home
…”
“I’m a GENIUS! I want to dispute sentence structure with SUSAN SONTAG!”
“Human salvation lies in the hands of the creatively maladjusted.”
” . . . I Adapt to The Unknown … Under Wandering Stars I Roam
. . . ”

All Tomorrow’s Parties
Alchemists’ Lane
Idiotz ro0l
Are YOU a Psychoactive Substance…?
Memes & Paradigm Shifts: 2 for 1 Sale!

Calvary
The Dope Show
Welcome to my Nightmare

“What Kind of Creature do we Have Here…? It Feels like Love, but
Smells
like Fear”

Suicide Kings & Trauma Queens
I’m Very Sorry … Have I Done an INCORRECT THING?
MINDVOX MEAT PACKING INDUSTRIES AND WASTE DISPOSAL INTL., INC.
Now Includes: Flying UFO Stealth Blimps
“These Words I Write Keep Me from Total Madness”

In Philip K. Dick We Trust
Powered by Technology SO ADVANCED it Doesn’t Actually Exist
Welcome to the First Church of MindVox / Escort Agency
Faith
Facts only Get in The Way of Things
Further

In Vivo Neurobiological Effects of MindVox: a Short Story
. .w.iLl wrItE woRdz 4 acId…
Heart of Darkness
Eye of the Cyclone
Temple of Pain
MindVox Syringe & Crackpipe Set . Coming Soon to a Gift Shop Near
You!
POLICE LINE: DO NOT CROSS

War is Peace / Freedom is Slavery / Ignorance is Strength : Vote
Bush!
Welcome to: MindVox Theoretical Macromolecular Modeling Bioinformatics
Group, Inc.

Scar Tissue
[NOW = Won] / [Not Now = Wonton (Soup at WO Hops)]
Here to Suck and Pump your Dopamine Receptors
Driven by Hate, Consumed with Fear
Mainlining God and Freebasing Spirit
“I got a Bad Disease . Up from my Brain is Where I Bleed”
“…I’ve got the Comprehension of a World Unaware…”
“Where I go, I just don’t know . I might end up Somewhere in Mexico”
Slipping into Darkness
I Love My Hate
…[%] MindVox Reloaded [%]…
Welcome to MindVox Department of Corrections
Dear Mr. Fantasy … Fuck The Police State
“Let me Enlighten You … This is the Way I Pray”

Magic and Madness
The Body Electric
Kundalini Express
Electric Junk
Scary Monsters and Super-Freaks
Warning, Site Contains: Undead, Starving, Rabid, Electrified Attack
Dogs on Speed wid Gatz

” Fools Rush In Where Angels Fear to Tread ”

DSM-IV Simplified: (Please Select) [1] Completely Fucking Crazy,
or [2]
Full of Shit.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 17, 2004 at 9:15:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/18/04 1:53:01 AM, brooke@brokensaints.com writes:

– I will write down everything I experience afterwards in order to share
it with myself (at a more coherent time), and those who have supported
me…including the members of this board!

If the dose of iboga is significant I doubt you will be able to write. I
suggest your companion/guide have a tape recorder. I doubt you will want to say
anything after a while so you might come to an agreement in advance that
during the peak period of visualization, if such occurs, that you are asked to
state what you are seeing every five minutes or so. Don’t think about it, just
state what you are seeing. Otherwise, the images will move so fast you will be
in the next image rather than indicating what you saw in the immediate image.
Once the peak passes you will be more able to speak without prompting but, a
voice actuated recorder may make it easier for everyone. Test the recorder to
make sure it is functioning as per expectations. Ibogaine and dreaming are
very similar and you tend to forget a lot of what you experience so the
recording should prove quite interesting to you. As Planteur said, and I agree
completely, have no expectations though I think there are others with significant
experience who believe in a very directed experience. And, that is OK too.

Howard

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 17, 2004 at 8:58:54 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Brooke, My thoughts are………
I am so fucking jealous!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
kidding sort of!
I have not done Ibogaine yet. I will probably have to go to treatment center somewhere as I have no one I trust enough as a watcher.
Please keep posted after the fact. I am very excited and curious as to how this will go.
Sounds like you have given this the thought required.
I feel sure you will get great support and feedback from the wonderful people on the list!’
Happy trip! I will be thinking of you!
Callie

From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] First-timer
Date: March 17, 2004 at 8:51:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello all,

Just to summarize, my name is Brooke Burgess, and I’ve posted several times
in order to glean some of the intricacies of the process before I undertake
my first journey. I have 50g of rootbark from a reputable source, and will
be taking off 5 days from work within the next two weeks to fully immerse
myself in the experience.

Here’s my current checklist – please feel free to make suggestions,
corrections, criticisms, and such – or contact me directly at
brooke@brokensaints.com.

– with 190lbs of bodyweight, and being a first-time ‘non-addict’
experiencer (don’t nicotine and emotional trenches count for something?
🙂 ), I will be using 15-20g of rootbark.
– I was referred to an online recipe to extract the vital components, which
requires 700ml of vodka, a glass of red wine, and the juice of a lemon to
allow the plant material to ferment over one week in a closed container.
After this, I will boil off the alcohol and test the remnants for bitterness
– I will prepare a quiet space with images and items that trigger emotional
memories and ties to serious blocks and blisses from my life.
– I’ll have a strong and considerate ‘watcher’ with basic medical training
and a spiritual understanding to veer me back onto ‘the path’ in case things
go awry. Oh…and don’t forget the handy bucket by the bed for sudden
movements.
– I’ve set aside the pre-requisite three days for a slow and thoughtful
return to full mobility and reintegration with the ‘real’ world.
– I will detox the days leading up to dosing, and not eat for 8 hours
before use. As well, I will take a small sample and wait several hours to
gauge its effects.
– I will write down everything I experience afterwards in order to share it
with myself (at a more coherent time), and those who have supported
me…including the members of this board!

That’s basically it. Am I missing anything crucial? Thoughts?

Thanks in advance

Brooke Burgess
www.brokensaints.com

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] (Sorta ot) Fw: [drugwar] DRUG CONTROL POLICY: Drug czar critic…
Date: March 17, 2004 at 8:30:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/12/2004 6:57:16 PM Central Standard Time, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

Oh yeah, I remember it well, the day pot took me by the hand and lead me
>down that treacherous slippery slope to methamphetamines, which were
waiting
>at the bottom of the hill by the bus stop, wearing galoshes and skipping
>around in the puddles on a warm and rainy day…errr. wait a minute, I
think
>that was Mary Poppins actually, not methamphetamines. Sorry, nope, I only
>spent a week or two playing around with methamphetamines, while living in
>London, and it sure weren’t pot that had a single thing to do with my
>experimentation. (And it was shooting methamphetamines there in London
that
>introduced me to the phenomenon of the “dirty hit,” where one shoots a
teeny
>tiny morsel of dust, or lint, or cotton, or cut in the drugs into one’s
>vein, whereby the foreign substance enters and ends up causing migraines,
>nausea, and the wish that god would simply come and take one away as the
>pain and misery of a dirty hit is the worst feeling (one that goes on and
>on, all night long in my own case, right through til the next afternoon
when
>I was finally able to walk upright, sorta, down the street to a dealer’s
>place and cop a bag of dope- which is the surefire cure for a dirty hit by
>the way- simply do a shot of heroin and voila- not more
>headaches/crawlingskin/wish to die sensations.
> But anyway, the point is that pot never, not while smoking it, eating
>it, looking at it, thinking about it, wanting it, looking for it, etc,
never
>ever never not once made me think, “Hey, methamphetamines would sure be
fun
>now, let’s get some.”

hahahahahahahahahaha!!!!! This shit is cracking me up today!!!!!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nixon in China
Date: March 17, 2004 at 8:28:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/12/2004 9:43:46 AM Central Standard Time, stevenanker@hotmail.com writes:

I’ve always had a dream about those wild Bush twins… “That’s a cute name,
Bush.” Perhaps their addictions will get a little out of hand. They seem
perfect for St. Kitts. I think it would be fun to have hot sex with them
after ibo… and then meet the dad with that knowing look in my eye of I
fucked your daughter, sir. “May I call you dad?” Patrick, please help me
out.

hahahahahahahahaahahahahahahhaahahahahahaha!!!!!!!!!!!!
Fucking hilarious!!!!!!!!!!!!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Curtis
Date: March 17, 2004 at 8:17:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

((((((((((Curtis)))))))))))))
You seemed so angry, I thought a hug might soothe you out some!
Peace, Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CSI on CD and D.A.R.E.
Date: March 17, 2004 at 8:15:25 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Dana! Got my CD today! Thanks! I am going to sit down and watch it again and probably again!
Thanks again! Very cool of you to offer it and even cooler that you sent it so fast!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what the world needs now….
Date: March 17, 2004 at 8:11:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Tor, I am not real sure but I don’t think a video, per say, is available. The clip was online at one point, I think, but I could never get it to play. I figured it was because I was not broadband.
Someone else more in the know may be able to point you in a better direction. If they do, I will follow too cause I really have wanted to ‘see’ the kron piece.
Peace, Callie

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine pdfs
Date: March 17, 2004 at 7:28:30 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As there are so many ibogaine hits on the www these days I just decided to
see what would come up with a google.com search for “ibogaine pdf”. Among the
hits were,

Subject: USA Patriot Act Select Agent Security Requirements Date …
www.biosci.ohio-state.edu/~jsmith/safety/ Biosafety/PatriotActResearch.pdf

And Joyce Woods’s report to the Rothschild Chemical Dependency Institute on
the Invitational Conference on Drug User Activism. This was the most fun
conference I have ever attended.
www.methadone.org/downloads/namadocuments/ woods_2003_denmark_report.pdf

There was also Review of herbal ingredients for use in unlicensed herbal …

www.mca.gov.uk/ourwork/licensingmeds/ herbalmeds/herbingredientreview.pdf

That was a real laugh. Hong Kong, the home of heroin restricts ibogaine. To
Quote Callie, hahahahaha! hahahahaha! hahahahaha!

Howard

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ethnogarden
Date: March 17, 2004 at 7:28:31 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/12/04 1:03:57 AM, brooke@blue.netnation.com writes:

Does anyone know if Ethnogarden is still in business ??

http://www.ethnogarden.com/ibogabark.htm

Their web page is up. Other than that I cannot say.

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what the world needs now….
Date: March 17, 2004 at 7:13:01 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Torsten, in the future if you could please write
out what you want to say using one message instead of
5, all of which quote either huge messages or people
quoting people quoting people quoting…… until
what’s left is one really big message to which you
added a sentence! 😉

The video isn’t online anymore, I think they took it
off some days ago. Patrick are you putting it up on
Mindvox soon?

Hi to all the new people and hello david. How is life
after ibogaine did you stay clean after only the first
dose?

Carla B

— torsten2@hushmail.com wrote:
Same question, I find the kron page where it has the
whole transcript,
but no video. Is it online somewhere right now
still?

It’s not here anymore

http://www.kron.com/Global/story.asp?s=%20%201652207

Thanks

-Tor

On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:53:39 -0800
axisone@hushmail.com wrote:
Steven Anker <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
–
—-
Advocacy and yall,

Be united. Lay low on the crazy. For now… t’s
‘medicine’ and
a
‘disease.’

Be vigilant about press and media coverage. Sue
their fucking ass
if
they
are wrong. Companies understand money. Who are the
best spokespeople
for
ibo? I like Howard, Patrick and Mash. How about
you? Let the ego
go,
what is
best for the cause? Do not become right wing
zealots protesting
a work
of
art unseen. Not all publicity is good.

For the record I hate Patrick and Mash and Howard
hasn’t really
accomplished
any thing with ibogaine in who gave that figure
before, 30 years?

Howard is at least sane, unlike Dana and the whole
pot movement who
I
think nobody in legit medicine is listening to.
Great scam if your
a
drug dealer but I havent seen the whole medical
marijuana anything
manage
to even get pot a drug that has never killed
anyone, legal in the
US.
Constant mentions of ibogaine by them is not
helping anyone.

The pro-pot movement has not managed to make pot
legal, a drug which
is harmless and never killed anyone. They are
going to do something
with ibogaine???????? Never happen.

Nader is a asshole and its too bad but youre right.
Patrick and
Mash
on their own are really effective, together is more
then effective,
the
two of them in the same room are suddenly so human
and you can relate.
Its the darth vader and evil witch lovefest. When
the two of you
get
it on, do you do mother theresa and jesus or the
mom and son trip,
which
is hotter? Ignoreing what anyone else has ever
said, the two of
you have
some serious energy on camera and it’s not
scientist
and junkie.

Steve you work in hollywood and maybe are better at
seeing what
others
see when they look at the screen, but what all the
peace and love,
democratics
missed is that the person who gave the Deborah and
Patrick show
all that
exposure by putting on the front page of the drudge
report was matt
drudge.
A conservative republican who liked it so much he
has hallucinogen
that
cures addiction on page one of his site.

Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not Kerry.
A Conservative
Republican.
I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.

Howard, Patrick, Mash. or Mash, Patrick, Howard. As
long as Patrick
is
in the middle to keep Mash and Howard away from
each other 😉

No pro pot idiocy which is only going to make
everyone ignore it.
No
weird rituals in africa, no discussions about
sticking root bark
up your
ass. Medicine that cures a disease is right.

Best, Steve Anker

PS: Patrick, stop being such a hippie pussy.

Don’t encourage him. Patrick has either been
blowing his brains
out with
LSD again or having a lot of sex, he’s been calm
and zen like for
at
least two weeks. When that wears off, we get Darth
Vader on acid.

Patrick the next message you’re going to write when
you read this,
don’t.
I’m sure it will move me, sweep me away, make me
relate, make me
believe
and up your genius ante another level. But you’ve
pulled Dana’s
neck
off the chopping block a few times already, he is
making peace by
being
nutso again and burning pirated copies of CSI’s
program and offering
to give them away. I don’t want to hear it.

He may be the kooky uncle, he’s lucky to have you
on his side, but
he
is not a effective spokesperson for anything, not
even pot. He should
move to hollywood and just be himself, forget pot
and ibogaine,
Dana
is enough material all in one person he doesn’t
even need the weird
causes.

No matter what you write, it won’t change that. I’m
sure you can
write
a believable message about why black is white and
make people relate
to it, but all it proves is that you’re a great
communicator. It’s
been
proven. Shut up now and let Dana suffer some of his
own consequences
because I am so sick of the bullshit. You’re as
nuts as he is but
as
you yourself said, he has no off switch. You do. I
don’t hear deranged
rants about tripping on LSD and lights and colors
inside your head,
when
you have the camera in your face. You forget all
about that. Because
you turn it off. This is exactly what you said.
Dana can’t turn
it off.

Axis

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/]=———————————————————————=[\

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http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]

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__________________________________
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From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] OT Bush Haiku
Date: March 18, 2004 at 5:07:37 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’ll be a little bit less of a rainbow if we couldn’t…

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: Reynaldo Gonzalez
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004 2:28 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] OT Bush Haiku

Please don’t do that, remembered this forum is a big rainbow.

Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com> wrote:
This is a short poem made up entirely of actual quotations from George W.
Bush. These have been arranged, only for aesthetic purposes, by Washington
Post writer, Richard Thompson. A wonderful Haiku poem like this is too good
not to share.

MAKE THE PIE HIGHER

I think we all agree, the past is over.
This is still a dangerous world.
It’s a world of madmen and uncertainty
And potential mental losses.

Rarely is the question asked
Is our children learning?
Will the highways of the Internet
Become more few?

How many hands have I shaked?
They misunderestimate me.
I am a pitbull on the pantleg of opportunity.

I know that the human being
And the fish can coexist.
Families is where our nation finds hope,
Where our wings take dream.

Put food on your family!
Knock down the tollbooth!
Vulcanize society!
Make the pie higher!
Make the pie higher!

(Pass this on. Help cure mad Cowboy disease in the next election!)
Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam
Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam

From: Reynaldo Gonzalez <pacopaco44@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] OT Bush Haiku
Date: March 17, 2004 at 5:28:40 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Please don’t do that, remembered this forum is a big rainbow.

MAKE THE PIE HIGHER

I think we all agree, the past is over.
This is still a dangerous world.
It’s a world of madmen and uncertainty
And potential mental losses.

Rarely is the question asked
Is our children learning?
Will the highways of the Internet
Become more few?

How many hands have I shaked?
They misunderestimate me.
I am a pitbull on the pantleg of opportunity.

I know that the human being
And the fish can coexist.
Families is where our nation finds hope,
Where our wings take dream.

Put food on your family!
Knock down the tollbooth!
Vulcanize society!
Make the pie higher!
Make the pie higher!

From: <torsten2@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what the world needs now….
Date: March 17, 2004 at 4:50:25 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Same question, I find the kron page where it has the whole transcript,
but no video. Is it online somewhere right now still?

It’s not here anymore

http://www.kron.com/Global/story.asp?s=%20%201652207

Thanks

-Tor

On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 14:53:39 -0800 axisone@hushmail.com wrote:
Steven Anker <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
–
—-
Advocacy and yall,

Be united. Lay low on the crazy. For now… t’s ‘medicine’ and
a
‘disease.’

Be vigilant about press and media coverage. Sue their fucking ass
if
they
are wrong. Companies understand money. Who are the best spokespeople
for
ibo? I like Howard, Patrick and Mash. How about you? Let the ego
go,
what is
best for the cause? Do not become right wing zealots protesting
a work
of
art unseen. Not all publicity is good.

For the record I hate Patrick and Mash and Howard hasn’t really
accomplished
any thing with ibogaine in who gave that figure before, 30 years?

Howard is at least sane, unlike Dana and the whole pot movement who
I
think nobody in legit medicine is listening to. Great scam if your
a
drug dealer but I havent seen the whole medical marijuana anything
manage
to even get pot a drug that has never killed anyone, legal in the
US.
Constant mentions of ibogaine by them is not helping anyone.

The pro-pot movement has not managed to make pot legal, a drug which
is harmless and never killed anyone. They are going to do something
with ibogaine???????? Never happen.

Nader is a asshole and its too bad but youre right. Patrick and
Mash
on their own are really effective, together is more then effective,
the
two of them in the same room are suddenly so human and you can relate.
Its the darth vader and evil witch lovefest. When the two of you
get
it on, do you do mother theresa and jesus or the mom and son trip,
which
is hotter? Ignoreing what anyone else has ever said, the two of
you have
some serious energy on camera and it’s not scientist
and junkie.

Steve you work in hollywood and maybe are better at seeing what
others
see when they look at the screen, but what all the peace and love,
democratics
missed is that the person who gave the Deborah and Patrick show
all that
exposure by putting on the front page of the drudge report was matt
drudge.
A conservative republican who liked it so much he has hallucinogen
that
cures addiction on page one of his site.

Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not Kerry. A Conservative
Republican.
I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.

Howard, Patrick, Mash. or Mash, Patrick, Howard. As long as Patrick
is
in the middle to keep Mash and Howard away from each other 😉

No pro pot idiocy which is only going to make everyone ignore it.
No
weird rituals in africa, no discussions about sticking root bark
up your
ass. Medicine that cures a disease is right.

Best, Steve Anker

PS: Patrick, stop being such a hippie pussy.

Don’t encourage him. Patrick has either been blowing his brains
out with
LSD again or having a lot of sex, he’s been calm and zen like for
at
least two weeks. When that wears off, we get Darth Vader on acid.

Patrick the next message you’re going to write when you read this,
don’t.
I’m sure it will move me, sweep me away, make me relate, make me
believe
and up your genius ante another level. But you’ve pulled Dana’s
neck
off the chopping block a few times already, he is making peace by
being
nutso again and burning pirated copies of CSI’s program and offering
to give them away. I don’t want to hear it.

He may be the kooky uncle, he’s lucky to have you on his side, but
he
is not a effective spokesperson for anything, not even pot. He should
move to hollywood and just be himself, forget pot and ibogaine,
Dana
is enough material all in one person he doesn’t even need the weird
causes.

No matter what you write, it won’t change that. I’m sure you can
write
a believable message about why black is white and make people relate
to it, but all it proves is that you’re a great communicator. It’s
been
proven. Shut up now and let Dana suffer some of his own consequences
because I am so sick of the bullshit. You’re as nuts as he is but
as
you yourself said, he has no off switch. You do. I don’t hear deranged
rants about tripping on LSD and lights and colors inside your head,
when
you have the camera in your face. You forget all about that. Because
you turn it off. This is exactly what you said. Dana can’t turn
it off.

Axis

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: <torsten2@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fuck you Deborah and Patrick show
Date: March 17, 2004 at 4:49:00 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sounds fun, where is the video available online though I can’t find?

-Tor

zeke@hush.com wrote:
I’m putting this on the list after sending private email
to both
mash and patric. Mash writes me a self righteous reply and Patric
ignores
his email and doesn’t say anything no news there right.
It would be easier to write if there was a right or wrong
but
looking at the people on this list and the way they act and I do
not
mean the addicts, I’m talking about the treatment people, the most
pathetic
thing is the two of you did the best ibogaine story that’s come
out in
years. Besides this and JAMA what has been in the media about ibogaine
in the last two years is at the level of the national enquirer and
nobody
pays attention to it. I’m looking online and I see that ibogaine.net
went from being dead and having a hit rate of below 1 million to
where
it’s gone in two days, it’s at 30,000 because that ‘journalist’
who broke
the Monica Lewinsky story put ‘Hallucinogen that cures addiction’
on
the front page of his site.
Both of you are assholes. Patric you know the real story
behind
ibogaine instead of Mash’s self promotional hype but you keep on
protecting
her and lying for her. You make her look like mother Theresa. I
watch
this and I don’t believe it, instead of the ibogaine is dangerous
lady,
the two of you make each other look human and you lay on the shit
so
thick you have the reporter giving the warnings for you. I hope
both
of you end up with what you deserve and she’s using you. Go on Patric
flash your arm to the whole world and make the cash registers ring
all
over her over priced treatment. I love the links on the site, you’ve
removed any content that had any value and thrown it off the site
and
link to this
http://www.ibogaine.net/links.html
Laser hair removal, work at home businesses and treatment pimps.
When
is the used car lot coming?
It’s so funny how the man who invented the term ‘Treatment
Pimp’
is promoting it right now. Everything changes when you get paid
right?
I’ve kept almost everything I said in email out of this
message
my purpose isn’t to put even more dirt out there I think Steven
Anker
and Jerry Stahl with CSI are about to all sue each other over libel
and
slander so there’s no need. Sara maybe they need some shrooms and
to
smoke cannabis instead.
Patric I have less disappointment over you because you’ve
done
all of it, you represent who you are and the saddest thing is you
are
a incredible communicator. Writing, talking, your experience. People
are listening, especially when you flash your arm, you should have
it
framed. It’s too bad that instead of saying the truth you and Mash
have
your mutual admiration society and I won’t follow that up with everything
else I hear about the two of you but it is too bad that both of
you aren’t
more like the people you play on TV.
Patric you’re lucky that you can communicate because if
you couldn’t,
then Mash wouldn’t care about you either. Nobody who has ever had
anything
to do with her has ended up with anything except lawsuits and broken
promises, except for you. Because you never shut up and people listen
to you. Lucky you.
You’re both so full of shit, you can go exploit each other
and
ibogaine forever. Great gift to the whole world. I wish I could
find
more anger but at least she knows the science and you know the experience.
I wish I could find a better answer but there isn’t one with anyone
involved
with ibogaine, you’re all interested in the same thing, your own
egos,
Patrick and Debrah are only better at pimping themselves.
Sara it’s too bad that you’re right about so many people
and
things.
I pray Stan Glick comes through with something, because
there
is no other scientist working on anything, only a group of self
promoting
entertainers.

bye
zeke

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From: <torsten2@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana
Date: March 17, 2004 at 4:51:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Great intro to ibo. Love it!

-Tor

On Tue, 09 Mar 2004 14:13:50 -0800 “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
wrote:
Kids, KidZ, ChildrenS … I step out of the room for 5 minutes and
alla
youz are beating each other over the heyd with sledgehammers.

All I’m gonna do, is step back a few paces and take a look at the
Bigger
Picture. Have Dana’s recent actions been particularly helpful in
furthering the cause of ibogaine…? Well, prolly not. Would it
be a
good idea to occasionally roll the dice, and try to get a sanity
check…?
You bet! Is anything that is being said here going to change anything?
Fuck no. <Shrug>

Judging Dana within the context of nothing else besides his actions
in the
near-past, is not going to paint a very positive picture. Whoopsie,

shit
happens.

<Taking a few steps back — I said I was gonna do that, remember?>
… all
of ibogaine really is this very weird, sweeping, psychedelic soap
opera;
with very strange connections where the most unlikely people intersect
at
certain points in time, and synchronicity takes over.

My VERY FIRST exposure to ever hearing about this thing called “ibogaine,

”
came in 1992 or early ’93, when some person from Cures Not Wars/ACT-

UP,
who was on MindVox, splattered the ICASH Treatment thing all over
half the
conferences (most of which had absolutely nothing to do with the
subject
matter … ‘course, if they had not done this, it wouldn’t have
caught my
attention, and I never would have read it, “Why the fuck, is this
stupid
bullshit, plastered all over the 3l33t h4x0R conference!?!??!”).
And, I
read it, thought it was really interesting, and then forgot about
it;
because, I mean, who the hell would want to stop doing heroin?

A few years later, around ’94/’95 I was hanging out in shooting
galleries
on the Lower East Side with Fred Gotbetter. And Fred was basically
cool
people, and someone who had a really good heart. He was also an
absolute
fucking disaster area, “I’m rich and I have a trust fund!” Then
… why
are you a homeless person who sleeps in a cardboard box in an alley?
“By
choice man! Say, can I borrow $20 bucks!?!?!?!”

And, oddly enough, that was pretty much the truth. He had a trust
fund
which got shut down as soon as he was sprung again; he would clean
up,
stay clean just long enough for his executor to release some cash,
and get
resprung almost instantly. Fred was actually IDEAL St. Kitts material,

and really would have thrived there!

But anyway, so there’s this guy who I see sitting next to me, bangin’
up a
bundle in one shot … and then, every so often, he vanishes for
a coupla
days, and returns … without a habit.

By 94/95 my heroin use was well on it’s way to being a PROBLEM,
which I
was trying to cut loose, without much success. I hadn’t done URODs
yet,
but I’d been through pretty much every other treatment modality
that was
available. And it just didn’t make any sense. Because NOTHING
THAT
EXISTS — which I knew about — could accomplish what I was sitting
there
and seeing right in front of me … on a regular fucking basis.

I mean, it didn’t do shit for Fred in the long-term. I think the
longest
I ever saw him stay clean was about 3 weeks; but what made a TREMENDOUS
fucking impact was seeing someone strung-out as fuck, going from
that
state, into a TOTAL reset, in ’bout 72 hours.

THAT caught my attention. Everything else was like, well, whatever.
“Ibogaine is an absolute miracle! I’ve done it 27 times now and
I JUST
KNOW it’ll KEEP WORKING right around ibogaine 30 or 35, and
furthermore…” <ClunK!> Uhm … anybody got sum coke? I think
Fred OD’d
again … if nobody is holding, he may, in fact, stay dead… Eightball
anyone?

To compress what is an entire chapter, into a few paragraphs: Fred
would
do ibogaine, and then … NOTHING at all. He wouldn’t change his
clothes,
take a shower, or actually do ANYTHING to move away from drug-dependence.
I mean, sorta obviously, ‘cuz he was back in the shooting galleries
three
days later. Except he was only going to smoke pot and do nothing
else…
Which — to give him many props — lasted a few days, sometimes
a week or
two; but inevitably, he’d always get sprung again.

or
remembered it again. And the only reason I knew what it was, is
because
some fucking annoying lunatic splattered it all over our system.

I exited NYC, didn’t follow through and pursue any of it, because
I
realized I didn’t actually have a drug problem — I just had CASHFLOW
ISSUES, which I solved — wandered the Earth, and landed back in
NYC, with
a killer habit on top of 200mg of methadone. I tried to find Fred,
and
could not locate him. Using hindsight, this was due to the fact
that I
was searching in 1998, while he OD’d and stayed dead — in Pieman’s
house
in fact!!! — in 1997. @#*$&@#$ Time Machine! WRONG YEAR!

While I knew who Howard was, I didn’t KNOW him back then; called
up,
nothing much was happening, there was Panama if I wanted to wait;
I didn’t
think to ask Dana; and … I wound up talking to Bob Sisko … about
25
times. Who talked to me, and kept talking to me, and kept talking
to me,
and … didn’t have anything to sell me, yet kept talking to me,
and in
fact gave me Deborah’s phone number, and made me aware of her existence,

‘cuz in 1998, I had never heard of her.

Which is, eventually, how I landed at St. Kitts in 1999.

So, my introduction to ibogaine: some dysfunctional lunatic from
CNW/Act-Up splatters it all over MindVox; Fred Gotbetter, quite
possibly
the biggest ibogaine failure on the planet, keeps hitting a reset
in front
of me; and then Bob Sisko introduces me to Deborah.

It’s a strange world n’ shit. I’ve adapted to my environment and
become a
strange person. <Shrug>

– – – – – – – – –

So anywaze … Dana … is, a Complete Fucking Lunatic. So are
most of my
friends. This is okay. The PROBLEM is, Dana lacks an [OFF] switch,

and
usually has no outer awareness of the fact that he’s being completely
fucking crazy. But, if someone else is present, who Dana trusts,
that
just says, “Dana, you’re acting crazy again. Just chill out.”
HE DOES.

Dana HAS done a tremendous amount of good for a variety of causes.
At the
same time, he has also effectively had himself edited out of history,

because he CANNOT SHUT UP and lacks that [OFF] switch. This is a
bummer
and all.

Why does Iboga Therapy House exist…? Because Dana never shuts
up about
ibogaine, and Marc eventually listened to him, and followed through.
Why
have a large variety of events related to ibogaine seen the light
of day.
Because of Dana.

Did Dana IRREPARABLY HARM and CAUSE DAMAGE TO “The Ibogaine Movement,

Mahn!” Uhm … I don’t think such a thing is possible. Look! We
have a
HALLUCINOGEN that CURES DRUG ADDICTION!@#!@#!!!! And … many of
its
loudest proponents are Complete Fucking Lunatics. No! What’re
the
odds!?!?!?

Anywaze, when people call me up and dump all the, “Dana is RUINING
ibogaine!!!!” material into my headspace; they are sometimes disappointed
that I don’t respond with a lotta fervor and passionately agree
with ’em.
I mention I’ve already had all these conversations years ago, and
I’m not
sure anyone listens to me, or believes it. However, everything
sticks to
something on that wunnerful InterneT thing. This is ONE message
— that
survived — in a thread containing roughly 50 of ’em, where I had
the same
reaction to Dana, that people are having RIGHT NOW:

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ibogaine/message/5152

Dana is less than perfect; he does a lotta damage, he does a lotta
good.
There is a balance within all that. At the end of the day, has
he done
more good than harm…? In my own opinion, that answer is: YES.
Which, I
think, is pretty much all you can ask for. So, yeah, I guess he
is the
koOky UnclE! Why not.

And, uhm, Dana … <Removing Armor, Ego, and Testosterone> … dude.
C’mon. You’ve been talking about the Bwiti for approximately 300
years
now. Isn’t it time to meet ’em…? Philip K. Dick is hanging out,
and
discussing philosophy with Fred Gotbetter. Well, some of the time.
Fred
is sorta busy; this is Kali Yuga and he made it to minor Sainthood.
St.
Jude always needed an assistant.

Patrick

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From: <torsten2@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Everything all at Once (A Philosophical Approach to Life)
Date: March 17, 2004 at 4:55:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooke, you do Broken Saints right? Did you dose yet or are you planning
to soon?

In the same section of msgs, sorry folks for writing all at once new
here and downloaded archive from last 200 it is a little jumbled for
me to pull them out one by one.

What happened to ethnogarden? There is another msg saying the owner’s
name is Jason and he posts to this list. Where is he? Was he arrested
or did he shut it down and pack up and leave, because ethnogarden looks
like it is gone since at least some weeks now.

Has anyone been in contact with him please?

Love your msgs patrick, take your medication and pass go, collect a lot
of money, get published. You’re insane in a interesting way.

-Tor

On Sat, 06 Mar 2004 15:49:40 -0800 “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
wrote:
On [Sat, Mar 06, 2004 at 06:14:46PM -0500], [ann b mullikin] wrote:

| Sorry for not making myself clearer. I was asking a general
| question. On the average, for any givenTreatment House or Clinic,

Ann … not to talk crazy or anythin’ but this list here (which
Howard
originally posted):

Has flown by, at least 5 times in the last week. If you’re interested
in
obtaining treatment I would posit it’d be a super idea to CONTACT
the
TREATMENT PROVIDERS in question, and, well, perhaps ASK THEM.

While all of ’em are present on this list, it really isn’t their
job to
rush out and arrange everything around you. You need to contact
THEM and
MAKE ARRANGEMENTS. Unless, I mean, you just wanna chat about things
and
contemplate the possibility of doing sumthin’ about it later. Which
is
all-good too. Just sayin’

– – – – – – – – –

On [Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 06:45:01PM -0800], [Vector Vector] wrote:

| I half think that most on this list feel the same way, because
I
| haven’t seen one person from here join in, including the conspicious
| absence of the man of golden words who has said nothing. You there

| Patrick, of course you are, but you’re not adding to the Kerry
mess
| either.

Uhm, everybody needs a hobby …? This ain’t mine. There doesn’t
seem to
be much of a point in tagging up Things and Stuff onto sum forum
which is
there to give the illusion that somebody is Deeply Concerned with
your
opinions. Uhm, yeah … otay, whatever. <Shrug>

– – – – – – – – –

On [Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 06:33:53PM -0800], [Vector Vector] wrote:

| Do it!
|
| Erowid and MindVox are guilty of hate crimes and propaganda by
the way,
| making sure everyone here knows it 😉

Say whut …? Hate crimes against whom…? I don’t get it, and
there is
no URL to that thing you posted.

– – – – – – – – –

On [Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 07:52:39PM -0500], [CallieMimosa@aol.com]
wrote:

Callie, Aron will be more than happy to help you with your problem.

Aron, this is Callie … Callie, meet Pieman!

– – – – – – – – –

On [Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 05:11:09PM -0500], [Schmoolyboy@aol.com]
wrote:

| Here is one more that agrees with Nick and Randy. Personally,
I hate the
| thought of aftercare or treatment per se. Yet, anecdotally, it
seems to
| me that chronic relapsers who go to some level of organized after

| care, post Ibo, do better.

Uhm … please kill me; but … I hafta agree with this statement
too.

– – – – – – – – –

On [Fri, Mar 05, 2004 at 01:02:28PM -0500], [tomo7@starband.net]
wrote:

Tomo,

You said please, sorry, and were polite. So, okay, I just rearranged
you
for the second time in a week. Please note: there is NO customer
support,
I am not the secretary, and the instructions for how to SIGN ON,
SIGN OFF,
or MAKES CHANGES, now appear — cleverly hidden — at the bottom
of EVERY
SINGLE MESSAGE on this list.

A kloO:

[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

– – – – – – – – –

On [Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 03:53:28PM -0800], [crownofthorns@hushmail.com]
wrote:

| Bro you have had a amazing life and what you’ve done is inspirational.
| Without being a fan or kissing up, you are a major role model.
What separates
| you from everyone else isn’t only that you’ve done it and can
communicate
| but what Jon said hit home.
|
| What if Kurt Vonnegut was a junkie, or something between Hunter
Thompson
| and Thomas Pynchon. You are mad talented bro. You not only communicate

| you pull people into it and make them listen.

Thanks Curtis. You’re doing Just Super yourself. You haven’t mentioned

MotherLoveBone *once* in over a year. You’re getting better Every
Day, in
Every Way. <Handing you a SHINY GOLD STAR>

– – – – – – – – –

On [Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 01:56:34PM -0500], [jon] wrote:

| Patrick,
|
| I know many people have said this sort of thing before in various
| permutations, but i just wanted to say that your writing is really
quite
| amazing… very inspirational, without all the cheezy typical
self-help
| connotations…

Jon,

Thank you. Coming frum you, I appreciate that. I just write …
my
truth, using my words. After listening to Fluffy Vapid Recovery
Drivel
for … way too many years; all of it sorta takes on the droning,

meaningless, white-noise kinda vibe, usually reserved for elevator
music.

By which I mean ta say: nobody is listening to any of this shit.
I
certainly wasn’t. The message is — nearly always — at least half-

right.
But the delivery blows dead goats.

Why talk, if nobody hears <Shrug>.

| There aren’t many people out there who can sound so eloquent while
still
| sounding so sincere and real, and devoid of bullshit. Maybe if
kurt
| vonnegut had been a junky…

Thank you, I try not to suck. Sometimes I succeed.

| anyway, so i just wanted to say thanks..

You’re welcome. And, thanks for hangin’ out; it’s cool to have
you here.

– – – – – – – – –

On [Thu, Mar 04, 2004 at 12:21:24PM +0100], [Sara Glatt] wrote:

| A. Thank you Patrick for being tolerant. psycho or not psycho.

No worries Sara. You’re pretty tolerant yourself … ‘cept when
you’re
freaking out and acting Totally Fucking Psychotic. I *understand*
completely!

– – – – – – – – –

On [Wed, Mar 03, 2004 at 08:37:21PM -0800], [gboy@hush.com] wrote:

I’m sure the harmonic convergence is only temporary. I think one
arrives
here ’bout once a year or so. Check back in 2005.

| patrick run for office already, you should win in about 5 minutes
dog.

Whut will I win?!?!?!?!?!

| and do something to fix dana already. i would have said its impossible
| but do something. you’re responsible for him now. he doesn’t know
any
| better.

Look … I can work miracles sum of the time; but I have my limitations.
Dana just needs a few minor adjustments from Bwiti-LanD, and everything
will be EVEN BETTER than fine.

| elections are coming you know.

So … run for office.

– – – – – – – – –

Zeke: it’s all-good, thanks for calming down.

Jason: Rock out do0d! Just keep going, Take II is just over yonder
event
horizon.

– – – – – – – – –

On [Sat, Mar 06, 2004 at 02:22:29PM -0800], [Carla Barnes] wrote:

| I love these, my only problem with using any part of
| the Mindvox site is that everything is hidden all over
| the place. It’s like playing a video game for
| schizophrenics or people who’s minds are melting 😉

I don’t understand the problem… Your point wuz?

– – – – – – – – –

On [Tue, Mar 02, 2004 at 07:56:27PM -0500], [Schmoolyboy@aol.com]
wrote:

| To the group, Please excuse my poor spelling. Not knowing how
to type ( I
| took basket weaving instead of typing in High School) and being
OCD, I frequent
| send stuff off w/ spelling errors.

Spelling is for the uncreative, and that fucking underwater basket-
weaving
class is a bitch mahn. But I kept at it, and after retaking it
for the
third time, I sleazed through! And that, is what being an American
is ALL
ABOUT!!@#

I think most of the people on this list under the age of 35 or so,
prolly
just learned how to type, because … COMPUTER! It has ButTonZ!!!!
It
*does things* and stuff … INSTANTLY! Provides ImMeDiaTe
GraTifiCaysHun!@#!@#!# MMmmmmmmmm. Computer GOOD!

I dunno how to type either … or, so it has been explained to me.
“No!
You don’t use the PROPER ‘home position’ that’s COMPLETELY WRONG!”
Yeah,
but … I type twice as fast as you. “It DOESN’T MATTER. It’s
STILL
*completely wrong*!!!!”

Oh, otay.

Just keep going, before ya know it, you’ll be using all 13 fingers.

– – – – – – – – –

On [Sat, Mar 06, 2004 at 10:30:39AM -0800], [Brooke] wrote:

| Thanks for the kind words, v…to be in the company of Sandman
and
| Akira is daunting indeed.
|
| I didn’t want to pimp BS here…but it looks like you’ve done
my work
| for me. 😉 Here’s hoping that the Iboga rootbark journey stirs
up the
| strength to fuel my next creative path.
|
| B

Do0d … (artoOnZ!@#(*!@#!@!!!!!!!!

Nobody has ever arrived here before, with a whole entire Epic Fantasy
in
Flash in tow… This is a first.

Totally fucking cool. Welcome to tha machine.

S’cuse me, gotta go leech your whole entire site now.

CartoOnS!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Happy, hAPPy, HappY

Patrick

p.s., Rock ouT mahn. Broken Saints is highly neato.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: <torsten2@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] origins of the word fuck
Date: March 17, 2004 at 4:57:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This may be said as a joke, but you are very nonthreatening to the biggest
drug pushers in the world. Cigarette and coffee companies!

Ibo, gets you off heroin and crack, light a ciggy and drink starbucks.

Nice porn site too.

-Tor
On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 16:22:42 -0800 crownofthorns@hushmail.com wrote:
Patrick, bro! Great idea, get Phillip Morris and Starbucks to underwrite
ibogaine research! You’re a loyal user of both their drugs!

There could be a catchy slogan like ‘ibogaine, it gets you off heroin
and crack, which support terrorism and lets you keep chain smoking
cigarettes
and drinking coffee like a good American!’

I bet the Republicans would even get behind that one! Think big!

Maybe Phillip Morris, Starbucks and Apple, you’re a loyal user of
their
computers. ‘Ibogaine, Think Way Different!’

Here’s to you Superfreak! 🙂

Peace out,
Curtis

http://www.apple.com/thinkdifferent/

Heres to the crazy ones.

The misfits.

The rebels.

The troublemakers.

The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things differently.

Theyre not fond of rules.

And they have no respect for the status quo.

You can praise them, disagree with them, quote them,

disbelieve them, glorify or vilify them.

About the only thing you cant do is ignore them.

Because they change things.

They invent. They imagine. They heal.

They explore. They create. They inspire.

They push the human race forward.

Maybe they have to be crazy.

How else can you stare at an empty canvas and see a work of art?
Or sit in silence and hear a song thats never been written?
Or gaze at a red planet and see a laboratory on wheels?

We make tools for these kinds of people.

While some see them as the crazy ones,
we see genius.

Because the people who are crazy enough to think
they can change the world, are the ones who do.

On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:58:04 -0800 Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
wrote:

Even funnier hit from google, results page 1. Patrick talking at
a
computer security conference in Europe. 3 cups of coffee lined
up
in
front of him and chain smoking during his talk 😉

http://www.mobisux.com/album/showphoto.php?photo=18136&papass=&sort=1&thecat=502

What did you do in the old days, throw your syringes on the table
and
chop up lines? 😉 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

Go Superfreak!

I want a MindVox sticker for my laptop! 🙁

.:vector:.

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
On [Thu, Mar 11, 2004 at 03:08:21PM -0800], [gboy@hush.com] wrote:

| Patrick!!!!!!!!!!!
|
| You’ve really made the big time. No more ads for ibogaine when
you
enter
| your name into a search engine, porno sites are using YOUR
NAME
to
promote
| themselves!
|
| Congratulations! I always knew you were going places!
|
| “Origins of the word FUCK” Patrick, did you invent it?????
|
|

http://www.google.com/search?q=patrick+kroupa&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-
8&oe=UTF-

| 8&safe=off&start=50&sa=N
|
| “FUCK origin word index”

I’m deeply touched, extremely honored, and completely overwhelmed.

I would like to take this moment to individually thank everyone
on
planet
Earth.

What a wonderful site. Perhaps they’ll give me a fr33
account!#!@#!@!!!!

Rock the fuck ouT!

Patrick

p.s., aXis and gBoy … here:

http://www.textfiles.com/bbs/MINDVOX/DOCUMENTS/bufu

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] check4rain hiqu
Date: March 17, 2004 at 4:07:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Like a bartender
Giving drinks for AA chips
Sound of toilet flush.

Wake meditation.
Focus memories of dreams.
Is anything true?

Electronic hug
4 N someone’s listening
Good people birth hope….

—–Original Message—–
From: nruhtra@dsskcorp.com [mailto:nruhtra@dsskcorp.com]
Sent: Wednesday, March 17, 2004, 10:52 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] check4rain hiqu

black tar heroin
running down the tin foil
like cum on her face

love n.

Tar bait black hole land
Parallel Oneiromancy
Shout in a vacuum

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Kerry board
Date: March 17, 2004 at 3:50:36 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think Sandy is not an addict and has NO understanding of addiction or
the
different phases of recovery.
Her statement that “heroin addicts seem to be pretty well aware they’re
addicts and motivated to get off it”, is an observation a child could
make.
If desire and awareness were all that was needed to end addiction there
would
be no relapses!

ehe… that’s an excellent point.

It’s easy to rattle off a sentence or two “explaining” what “causes”
addiction, but the fact of the matter is that what causes and maintains an
addiction in an individual is a complex and subtle web of motives,
experiences, emotions, and behaviours.

Awareness is certainly an integral part of addressing an addiction, but
just being aware of a problem and motivated to fix it is only a small part
of the puzzle…

The term dual diagnosis is very over used and misunderstood.
It is like the old ‘which came first, the chicken or the egg’ saying.
Personally, when I began using I wasn’t depressed. I was young and looking
for a good time. Things just progressively got worse.
Of course I am speaking of depression as the other diagnosis in my
personal
case.
There are many schizophrenics and manic depressives that are addicts but I
feel instead of labeling them as having dual diagnosis the condition of
addiction should be separated and treated independently.

Well, in the case of dual diagnosis, I’m not sure the diagnoses should
really be treated independently, as they are often interrelated. Substance
abuse and the addiction that follows are often precipitated by an
underlying psychopathology. In my case, my heroin addiction (and drug use
in general) was largely an attempt to self-medicate my depression and
panic attacks. Until I really began addressing my emotional problems,
there was no way I was getting off dope. And until I began addressing my
dope problem, there was no way I could really approach my emotional
problems with any clarity.

I think the term dual diagnosis is used so frequently because it is quite
a common occurance. People with various psychological problems often
attempt to self-medicate, and that often leads to addiction.

While the converse is also true (that addiction leads to psychological
problems), I don’t think cases of this nature ought really be considered
dual diagnosis. If someone say, starts exhibiting symptoms of depression
after becoming addicted to heroin, I would question whether the person
should be diagnosed with a depressive disorder.

In any case, I think it is vital to determine what the order of causality
is . Otherwise, it’s very difficult, if not impossible to resolve things.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] check4rain hiqu
Date: March 17, 2004 at 3:47:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

David,

When do we get to see your film??

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

In a message dated 3/17/04 8:01:15 PM, reeldeathfilms@yahoo.com writes:

Heard it’s a great film but never seen the Black Tar film. Any more info
then please forward.

Cheers

David

David Graham Scott
Glasgow G20 6DF

From: David G Scott <reeldeathfilms@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] check4rain hiqu
Date: March 17, 2004 at 3:00:08 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Heard it’s a great film but never seen the Black Tar film. Any more info then please forward.
Cheers
David

David Graham Scott
Basement Flat
203 Wilton Street
Glasgow G20 6DF
Tel; 0141 945 1899
Mob; 07919 918 358
Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] a new article at last
Date: March 17, 2004 at 2:22:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Great study!

I wonder if a second dose of ibogaine were administered some weeks
after the first, if there would have then been normal LCGU effects
(assuming morphine was discontinued after the first ibogaine dose).
I.e. maybe the rats would have tripped once they had cleaned up, as
humans report doing. If so, and if there are indeed different mechanisms
(binding sites?) involved, why does it seem as if people often need to
get over the addiction before the more ‘psychedelic’ effects can occur?

It may be that there are two mechanisms but that one inhibits the other,
perhaps by absorbing the ibogaine more readily. But then that mechanism
disappears with the addiction. In any case, it would be interesting to
compare binding site activity in these two cases of ibo administration.

I wonder if a search for the ibo/addict LCGU profile could turn up
a drug that might shed some light on the putative separate anti-
addictive receptor(s).

Also, it would be interesting to compare the ibo/drug-naive LCGU with
those of similarly drug-naive rats on LSD, DMT, mescaline, etc.

Bill

From: nruhtra@dsskcorp.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] check4rain hiqu
Date: March 17, 2004 at 1:52:15 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

black tar heroin
running down the tin foil
like cum on her face

love n.

Tar bait black hole land
Parallel Oneiromancy
Shout in a vacuum

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Kerry board
Date: March 17, 2004 at 12:46:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think Sandy is not an addict and has NO understanding of addiction or the different phases of recovery.
Her statement that “heroin addicts seem to be pretty well aware they’re addicts and motivated to get off it”, is an observation a child could make.
If desire and awareness were all that was needed to end addiction there would be no relapses!

The term dual diagnosis is very over used and misunderstood.
It is like the old ‘which came first, the chicken or the egg’ saying.
Personally, when I began using I wasn’t depressed. I was young and looking for a good time. Things just progressively got worse.
Of course I am speaking of depression as the other diagnosis in my personal case.
There are many schizophrenics and manic depressives that are addicts but I feel instead of labeling them as having dual diagnosis the condition of addiction should be separated and treated independently.

Sandy says ”
Maybe you do an intervention and get them to do the Ibogaine treatment instead of a treatment program. But then when I read Dr. Mash’s reports, they specifically say the effects only last 30 days – 6 months. Then what? You can’t give somebody the emotional tools to deal with sobriety if their mental/emotional state is altered by Ibogaine. So like I’ve said before, what happens when the Ibogaine wears off and the person opts for their drug of choice instead of Ibogaine because it’s easier or cheaper.

This entire statement is so ridiculous! My mental/emotional state is so altered after detox I have done well to just get up and get dressed for 30 to 90 days after the last use of opiates.
You can’t ‘give’ anyone the emotional tools to deal with sobriety. Dealing with sobriety is a learned behavior.
Folks ‘opting for their drug of choice’ as she puts it is the entire problem of addiction!!!!

I just don’t think Sandy understands addiction and/or recovery at all!

Sandy says

You quoted a 70% recovery figure, that’s the same figure any decent treatment program has and is usually a monitored 1-3 year recovery figure. I don’t see any similar data on Ibogaine for a substance that has supposedly been used since the 80’s or before.

hahahahaha! I don’t know of any treatment centers that say they have a 70% recovery rate! Maybe 10 or 20 per cent!

So, Sandy…don’t know where you have got your information but I encourage you to go out and shoot drugs for a few years so you understand what is going on.

Callie

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Kerry board
Date: March 17, 2004 at 10:44:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Ke>Perhaps heroin
addiction because that’s the toughest one to break.<

Actually, tobacco beats heroin hands down, to my own experiences.

that’s my experience as well…

i kicked junk 5 and a half years ago… don’t know if i’ll ever manage to
kick cigarettes…

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] a new article at last
Date: March 17, 2004 at 10:33:04 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

After a month and a half of no new ibogaine publications on medline, we now
have #239, and from Kansas. Howard

Brain Res. 2004 Apr 2;1003(1-2):159-67.

Differential effects of ibogaine on local cerebral glucose utilization in
drug-naive and morphine-dependent rats.
Levant B, Pazdernik TL.

Department of Pharmacology, Toxicology, and Therapeutics, University of
Kansas Medical Center, Kansas City, KS 66160-7417, USA.

Ibogaine, a hallucinogenic indole alkaloid, has been proposed as a treatment
for addiction to opioids and other drugs of abuse. The mechanism for its
putative anti-addictive effects is unknown. In this study, the effects of ibogaine
on local cerebral glucose utilization (LCGU) were determined in freely moving,
drug-naive, or morphine-dependent adult, male, Sprague-Dawley rats using the
[(14)C]2-deoxyglucose (2-DG) method. Morphine-dependent rats were treated with
increasing doses of morphine (5-25 mg/kg, s.c., b.i.d.) and then maintained
at 25 mg/kg (bid) for 4-7 days. For the 2-DG procedure, rats were injected with
saline or ibogaine (40 mg/kg, i.p.). 2-DG was administered 1 h after
administration of ibogaine. The rate of LCGU was determined by quantitative
autoradiography in 46 brain regions. In drug-naive animals, ibogaine produced
significant increases in LCGU in the parietal, cingulate, and occipital cortices and
cerebellum compared to controls consistent with its activity as a hallucinogen
and a tremorogen. Morphine-dependent rats had only minor alterations in LCGU at
the time assessed in this experiment. However, in morphine-dependent animals,
ibogaine produced a global decrease in LCGU that was greatest in brain regions
such as the lateral and medial preoptic areas, nucleus of the diagonal band,
nucleus accumbens shell, inferior colliculus, locus coeruleus, and flocculus
compared to morphine-dependent animals treated with saline. These findings
indicate that ibogaine produces distinctly different effects on LCGU in drug-naive
and morphine-dependent rats. This suggests that different mechanisms may
underlie ibogaine’s hallucinogenic and anti-addictive effects.

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Kerry board
Date: March 17, 2004 at 7:09:21 AM EST
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: Dana Beal
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 2:54 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Kerry board

Anybody care to dissect this? I mean, it’s not illegal where it’s legal.

Hi Dana,

OK, I’ll have a try. My comments in blue

sandy
Posted: Mar 15 2004, 02:42 AM
Okay, try to get back in here a little bit.

Dana, I think you don’t understand my position on Ibogaine completely. As a moderator, it was my job to enforce the rules of the board. This forum cannot allow links directly to sites that promote illegal activity. The gun people cannot link to sites that explain how to illegally modify a gun, for example. They can discuss the Constitutionality of not being able to modify weapons and they can link to sites that discuss that, as long as there are no instructions or selling of the actual parts, stuff like that. That’s the line I was drawing with Ibogaine links.

Yes, all sounds pretty fair to me.

As to Ibogaine itself, you seem to be saying the Netherlands program works because of Ibogaine. At least at one point. That is not true, Ibogaine is not a routine treatment in the Netherlands. I posted an article that outlined their treatment program. Addiction treatment is too important to too many people to distort. There are some experimental programs and that’s the best you can honestly say about Ibogaine treatment.
Absolutely, couldn’t disagree with this.
Now, as to my own personal view of Ibogaine, I do not see it as a magical cure. That’s not to say it might not have a place in treatment, although I’m really having a tough time figuring out what that would truly be.

What!?!

Dear Sandy, are you truly trying to say that you are incapable of conceiving a role for a multi-dependence interrupter, that has not only been empirically demonstrated to remove the symptoms of drug withdrawal, but has further been seen to allieviate drug craving for a period of time after use, and open the user up to meaningful introspection of their drug-using behaviour? Is this really what you are trying to say? I wonder…can you see a need for umbrellas when it’s raining?

Perhaps heroin addiction because that’s the toughest one to break. And for whatever reason, heroin addicts seem to be pretty well aware that they’re addicts and motivated to get off of it.

In about one paragraph’s time you are going to write “Addicts who are fully aware of their situation That is the minority of addicts.” Whilst you don’t specify heroin use for latter, it still concerns me that, from a position of responsibility, you can write such apparently contradictory statements back to back.

In addition, as to the statement “heroin addicts seem to be pretty well aware that they’re addicts and motivated to get off of it” itself, I doubt many drug workers would agree with this. In fact, I’d say they’d shake their heads in bemusement.

Moreso than other addicts, but it’s just tough to kick. It also might be just the thing for dual diagnosis, it seems for those people the medication is sometimes worse than the illness. It might even be good for cigarette addiction for the same reason. Most smokers really don’t want to smoke, it’s just a tough addiction to break. So there could be specific scenarios where Ibogaine could be essential.

Look, I’m sorry, but you are just waffling here and seemingly attempting to “please” the ibogaine crowd by accepting some use for the drug. I put it to you that you have NO meaningful knowledge or understanding of the issues surrounding drug use and treatment. What do you say?

That’s true of any treatment. If you’re going to criticize the drug in this way you need to isolate things ibogaine is not useful for that other treatment options are. Frankly, I think you’re the one in denial – denying your complete lack of knowledge of the issues. This is not a put-down, just an observation.

Maybe you do an intervention and get them to do the Ibogaine treatment instead of a treatment program. But then when I read Dr. Mash’s reports, they specifically say the effects only last 30 days – 6 months. Then what? You can’t give somebody the emotional tools to deal with sobriety if their mental/emotional state is altered by Ibogaine. So like I’ve said before, what happens when the Ibogaine wears off and the person opts for their drug of choice instead of Ibogaine because it’s easier or cheaper.

However you get people off drugs long term abstinence is going to be difficult.

I very much doubt that ibogaine is chemically active in the body to a meaningful level much after a few weeks (meaningful as in at an agonist-antagonist level, or via subsidiary psychological effects). What keeps you off is the learning, if it’s taken place. And it won’t always. No one is responsibly suggesting that ibogaine is a “magic bullet” or a “cure,” but it would revolutionize drug treatment were it adopted more widely. I have no doubt of this.

For programmes claiming 70% – I’d check out how they’re creating data. What are the in-check criteria? How many follow-ups, over how many years, and what happens to the guys they can’t find? I doubt ibogaine gets 70%. I very much doubt anyone else is getting 70%. Data on ibogaine is inevitably limited because the stuff isn’t easily legally available. This will likely continue until it is. This isn’t a meaningful argument for not developing it. What we do know is that it most definitely is effective short term and that’s it’s likely safe to use in clinical setting – native tribespeople have been using the plant form for millenia.

Ibogaine may be useful for those who have been through the treatment process numerous times and continue to use. Addicts who are fully aware of their situation That is the minority of addicts. If Ibogaine became legal tomorrow, the vast majority of users in this country wouldn’t run to get it because they don’t see themselves as addicts in the first place.

Sandy, I don’t know if you’re a guy or a girl but you really need to check out how your mind is functioning here. One minute you’re running the stuff down in so meaningless a fashion it just makes you look stupid; the next you’re making contradictory statements; and the next you try and please people by magnaminously allowing some creedence to their view in your own disfunctional perspective.

In earnest hope of some clarity

Nick

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] check4rain hiqu
Date: March 17, 2004 at 4:46:48 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tar bait black hole land
Parallel Oneiromancy
Shout in a vacuum

From: “wachtel” <wachtel@shani.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] ibogaine tours
Date: March 17, 2004 at 2:33:21 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey howard
Nice work on the DPF and the site.
I am sending the pics from Holland to get copy into a disc. I will send u the disc soon. I want credit for the photography. I do not think the guy should have access to all the pics. We should keep some for future films and uses. If u want to put it on the web its ok by me just the question of privacy for those who are identified there.
Any news about the book?
All the best
Boaz

P.O.Box 2983 E.ven Yehuda 40500
Israel
Tel: 972-54-573679
Fax: 972-9-8996639

—–Original Message—– From: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com] Sent: Monday, March 08, 2004 1:37 PM To: ibogaine@mindvox.com Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine tours
The Ibogaine Dossier has adopted to offering Ibogaine Tours. The library has‏
reached a point of, of well, it is just too large to find anything if you are‏
only moderately interested so now you can go on a guided tour of the‏
wonderful world of ibogaine. More tours will be added on a regular basis. We will‏
continue to place new material on the Dossier as well. More on that later‏.
Author’s whose writing or art does not appear in the current series of tours‏
should anticipate that your work will appear in additional tours as they are‏
offered and they will be offered on a regular basis‏.
http://www.ibogaine.org/tours.html
http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/tours.html

Howard
Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org
/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] OT Bush Haiku
Date: March 17, 2004 at 1:15:56 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

very clever!

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] OT Bush Haiku
Date: March 17, 2004 at 10:52:06 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brett,

…Hilarious… funniest haiku ever..

-Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, March 16, 2004 8:32 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] OT Bush Haiku

This is a short poem made up entirely of actual quotations from George W.
Bush. These have been arranged, only for aesthetic purposes, by Washington
Post writer, Richard Thompson. A wonderful Haiku poem like this is too good
not to share.

MAKE THE PIE HIGHER

I think we all agree, the past is over.
This is still a dangerous world.
It’s a world of madmen and uncertainty
And potential mental losses.

Rarely is the question asked
Is our children learning?
Will the highways of the Internet
Become more few?

How many hands have I shaked?
They misunderestimate me.
I am a pitbull on the pantleg of opportunity.

I know that the human being
And the fish can coexist.
Families is where our nation finds hope,
Where our wings take dream.

Put food on your family!
Knock down the tollbooth!
Vulcanize society!
Make the pie higher!
Make the pie higher!

(Pass this on. Help cure mad Cowboy disease in the next election!)
Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] OT Bush Haiku
Date: March 16, 2004 at 11:32:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

MAKE THE PIE HIGHER

I think we all agree, the past is over.
This is still a dangerous world.
It’s a world of madmen and uncertainty
And potential mental losses.

Rarely is the question asked
Is our children learning?
Will the highways of the Internet
Become more few?

How many hands have I shaked?
They misunderestimate me.
I am a pitbull on the pantleg of opportunity.

I know that the human being
And the fish can coexist.
Families is where our nation finds hope,
Where our wings take dream.

Put food on your family!
Knock down the tollbooth!
Vulcanize society!
Make the pie higher!
Make the pie higher!

(Pass this on. Help cure mad Cowboy disease in the next election!)
Do you Yahoo!? Yahoo! Mail – More reliable, more storage, less spam

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine Manual thanks to Patrick
Date: March 16, 2004 at 10:31:48 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/17/04 2:51:00 AM, CallieMimosa@aol.com writes:

In a message dated 3/16/2004 6:48:30 PM Central Standard Time,
HSLotsof@aol.com writes:

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/whatsnew.html

very, very cool!!!!!
I have made copies for my friends!
Is that okay?

Sure,

That is what it is there for.

Howard

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine Manual thanks to Patrick
Date: March 16, 2004 at 9:49:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/16/2004 6:48:30 PM Central Standard Time, HSLotsof@aol.com writes:

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/whatsnew.html

very, very cool!!!!!
I have made copies for my friends!
Is that okay?
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] respond to methadonian orthodoxy
Date: March 16, 2004 at 9:07:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Howard! You have really given some good sites to me and the others on the list and I just want you to know that I appreciate it.
I think I may be living in the wrong country though! hahahahaha!
Callie

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Ibogaine Manual thanks to Patrick
Date: March 16, 2004 at 7:47:46 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Patrick suggested the Manual for Ibogaine Therapy be available as a pdf
document. Thanks to his suggestion and the cooperation of the National Alliance of
Methadone Advocate’s Vice President Walter Ginter, the PDF file is now
available for download. It has active links and feel free to copy it to a CD for
convenient carrying.

It is available from the What’s new section of the Ibogaine Dossier (self
promotion).

http://www.ibogaine.org/whatsnew.html

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/whatsnew.html

Thanks and enjoy.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Callie’s postulation about addiction and pain
Date: March 16, 2004 at 7:45:17 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all and Callie,
I remembered something recently, when thinking about Callie’s idea that
I was an addict before I became a pain patient. This is wrong.
I was first introduced to morphine, intravenously given for months,
after a car accident when I was 16 years old. I got very strung out, but had
only been using it for pain, and didn’t know I was strung out, and didn’t
figure it out for years. The only addiction I had experience with at that
point was tobacco, but when, years later, I first experienced kicking heroin
when deciding not to buy a bag one night in Rotterdam, I lay there trying to
figure out what was going on and where I’d felt the feelings I was feeling
before when I realized – I had felt this kicking shit when I was released
from the hospital with a bottle of darvocet and sent home, kicking cold
turkey from morphine shots given every 4 hours for the preceding 2 and a
half months given intramuscularly, after having gotten them every 2 hours
right into the IV drip for the 2 months prior to that.
So, I became addicted to morphine/opiates directly due to being a pain
patient, and tried to find that high again for years and years without
really realizing that was what I was doing for ages.
Peace,
Preston

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 16, 2004 at 5:05:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Excuse me AG, but you are false. Rootbark is what the bwitis use for
inititiations, Most of the Ibogaine is present in the root bark. As
Laurent
Sazy already said, the bwitis use the root only by boiling them and
prepare
a mixture called “pied de cochon” they drink it before inititation as a
body
cleanser.

i wonder why they called it “pig’s feet”….eheh

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine filmed
Date: March 16, 2004 at 8:44:02 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hoping to get a copy of the article from David. Don’t know if it’s online.
He told me that BBC1 are pretty much confirmed to pick up his proposed
documentary. So this will be a biggie for ibogaine if it does go ahead.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 6:18 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine filmed

Received the following email.

Howard

An interesting article in Saturday’s Glasgow Herald on filmaker David
Scott
who apparently filmed his own recovery using ibogaine for a forthcoming
television documentary:

http://www.theherald.co.uk/features/11679.html

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Kerry board
Date: March 15, 2004 at 7:36:37 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

How many medications do you have for the treatment of depression available
on the market legally?why?And then?

For the same reason you can have different ways of treating withdrawals from
Hard drugs.

Each person has the freedom of choice of, what kind of medication or
treatment is the most acceptable for them?

Do I want a drill ? Methadone? coma for three days? acupuncture? Heroine/or
synthetic opiate for free ?Or maybe Ibogaine? Or nothing ? Or Homeopathic
remedies? TAI medicine?or change blood every year?

But if you like to come off a high dose of Methadone and you are above 45
years old who is going to help you to come off?
No one methadone clinic will help,no here in Holland.
They rather make an addict believe that there is no way out and keep them
coming for the daily dose.

Sara.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: maandag 15 maart 2004 21:45
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites
from Kerry board

Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Ke>Perhaps heroin
addiction because that’s the toughest one to break.<

Actually, tobacco beats heroin hands down, to my own experiences.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Dana Beal
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 9:54 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from
Kerry board

Anybody care to dissect this? I mean, it’s not illegal where it’s legal.

sandy
Posted: Mar 15 2004, 02:42 AM

Okay, try to get back in here a little bit.

Dana, I think you don’t understand my position on Ibogaine completely. As a
moderator, it was my job to enforce the rules of the board. This forum
cannot allow links directly to sites that promote illegal activity. The gun
people cannot link to sites that explain how to illegally modify a gun, for
example. They can discuss the Constitutionality of not being able to modify
weapons and they can link to sites that discuss that, as long as there are
no instructions or selling of the actual parts, stuff like that. That’s the
line I was drawing with Ibogaine links.

Now, as to my own personal view of Ibogaine, I do not see it as a magical
cure. That’s not to say it might not have a place in treatment, although I’m
really having a tough time figuring out what that would truly be. Perhaps
heroin addiction because that’s the toughest one to break. And for whatever
reason, heroin addicts seem to be pretty well aware that they’re addicts and
motivated to get off of it. Moreso than other addicts, but it’s just tough
to kick. It also might be just the thing for dual diagnosis, it seems for
those people the medication is sometimes worse than the illness. It might
even be good for cigarette addiction for the same reason. Most smokers
really don’t want to smoke, it’s just a tough addiction to break. So there
could be specific scenarios where Ibogaine could be essential.

But, as I’m sure you know, the key to most other addictions is denial. Which
is where I have a hard time understanding how Ibogaine would be the broad
panacea you describe. As I’ve said before, breaking through the denial is
still going to be required to get someone to agree to Ibogaine in the first
place. Maybe you do an intervention and get them to do the Ibogaine
treatment instead of a treatment program. But then when I read Dr. Mash’s
reports, they specifically say the effects only last 30 days – 6 months.
Then what? You can’t give somebody the emotional tools to deal with sobriety
if their mental/emotional state is altered by Ibogaine. So like I’ve said
before, what happens when the Ibogaine wears off and the person opts for
their drug of choice instead of Ibogaine because it’s easier or cheaper. You
quoted a 70% recovery figure, that’s the same figure any decent treatment
program has and is usually a monitored 1-3 year recovery figure. I don’t see
any similar data on Ibogaine for a substance that has supposedly been used
since the 80’s or before.

Ibogaine may be useful for those who have been through the treatment process
numerous times and continue to use. Addicts who are fully aware of their
situation That is the minority of addicts. If Ibogaine became legal
tomorrow, the vast majority of users in this country wouldn’t run to get it
because they don’t see themselves as addicts in the first place.

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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] The post that set off Sandy’s Response
Date: March 15, 2004 at 4:18:11 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This was an omnibus response to several posts on the thread. Frenchy is a law enforcement officer in a small town. Broomer is a prohibitionist. Spookk is the husband of a mmj patient in Cali. Sandy is the moderator.

Frenchy wrote:

I work in a small, rural, and mostly conservative county that has some of the largest Methamphetamine production in the country. I’m not exactly surrounded by like-minded individuals!! I believe in the decriminalization of Marijuana use, and hopefully the legalization down the road. I still have concerns as to what to do about the other drugs.

I know that you may have difficulty processing this, but what would you do if you found out the government already knows about a medical cure for addiction to methamphetamine (i.e, an addiction interrupter, not a maintenance drug), as well as crack, heroin, cigarettes and alcohol; and had even developed their own, safer variant of this cure, but were not releasing it because there was no great public outcry for it–and therefore no money to do it? What if I told you the advocates of more established treatment modalities were engaged in a little concerted effort to keep this information from the American people? What if I told you that this quantum leap in treatment could tip the balance in favor of treatment vs imprisonment for real “problem” drug abusers.

Most folks in this country are not aware that Ibogaine, an alkaloid from the African rain forest has been reported to act as an addiction interrupter across a wide spectrum of abused substances, legal and illegal, in more than 200 peer-reviewed scientific papers. The unique effect of Ibogaine is the simultaneous loss of multiple addictions after as little as a single treatment. Ibogaine is the first drug used to treat addiction that eliminates both physical withdrawal and psychological cravings.

If you have doubts, check out http://www.kron.com/Global/story.asp?s=%20%201652207

In the a recent episode of the CBS crimeshow CSI, Ibogaine was portrayed primarily as a treatment for heroin addiction, and it is easy to come away with that impression, because whereas opioid maintenance (methadone) or blockers (naltexone) fail to address the underlying dopaminergic disorder (craving), Ibogaine is the first medication where, when its effects wear off, addicts are free of their addiction. But dramatic recoveries have also been seen with stimulants, and the government version of Ibogaine, 18-MC, is twice as effective for nicotine addiction.
Treatment (or re-treatment, in the event the craving for drugs re-occurs) is safe and easy, requiring no more than 2 to 4 days as an inpatient. I know I’ve gotten in trouble for pointing this out, but Ibogaine is legal in Canada and Mexico. I’m not allowed to tell you here where to send people for treatment. You have to contact me off-thread. The function of this office is to do intake and preliminary screening before we send patients on to clinics outside of the country.
Broomer wrote:

Tell me what you think is an answer to what is called the drug problem. How do we stop kids trying to get high? How do we stop people OD’ing? How do we stop guys >from burgling to get drug money? How do we stop the production of designer drugs that fry the brain?

All we can do is make more advanced medical treatments available to people who know they have a problem, and who are currently on a waiting list. Understand: they know they have a problem because they’re having brushes with the law, OD’s, lost their job (not due to a pee test, but because they couldn’t show up and do their job), etc. And while they’re waiting, they’re getting in more trouble, and turning on new users.
What we don’t need to do is put every single pothead in rehab because they’re the easiest to catch, or get rid of more benign psychedelics like acid and mescaline leaving a niche that’s inevitably going to be filled by speed and coke. In Holland, besides the coffee shops, there are also “smart shops” that purvey a variety of legal highs.

Sandy wrote:

And in this entire treatment overview, I don’t see the word Ibogaine listed once. This is not to say there is no value to Ibogaine, but it is wrong to imply Ibogaine is solving drug problems in Amsterdam. Or that Amsterdam is some sort of proof that decriminalizing all drugs is a solution.
Ibogaine has been in Amsterdam since Bob Sisko treated Nico Adriaans, founder of the Dutch Junkie Union, in 1989. You took down the website for Sara, so that people on this thread have no way of independently verifying this without doing their own research, but she has the complete authorization of Dutch authorities to do what she is doing, and she is not the only one, just the best in the Netherlands. That being said, the very attitudes working for decriminalization there have perversely worked against it’s wider acceptance, with Peter Cohen, for instance, saying he was against people HAVING to get off drugs–so that he’s much more into heroin maintenance.
Sandy wrote:

We can now take 14 beds and use them three times a week for total detox, with the person moving immediately into some kind of after-group outpatient status. Cost would be LESS than maintenance, and our success-rate, with easy access to re-treatment in cases of relapse, would be more like 70% than the 5% cited here. While younger addicts tolerate Ibogaine better, some of our best successes have been older addicts who’ve tried and failed all other modalities.

I know that you’re against promoting Ibogaine, because it’s illegal and not cannabis, for which you would make an exception. My question, Sandy, is would you advocate that Kerry bring the kind of pressure Bush and Walters are bringing against marijuana decrim, and force Canada and Mexico to criminalize Ibogaine so that you could cut off ready access for Americans to Ibogaine treatment just across the border? Would you ban it everywhere around the world (it’s only illegal in Belgium, Switzerland and the Netherlands) to bring them into compliance with U.S. law?

Spookk rote:

Recently, a cop showed up at the door, decided she had “too many” plants for her medical needs (8, 4′ tall ones, two of which were males for breeding) and that her medical recommendation was “expired” because it was over a year old (it wasn’t, and the law does NOT require yearly renewals). He then proceeded to throw her to the ground and cuff her hands behind her back, charging her with “resisting arrest” due to her inability to rise from this position upon his command. In spite of Prop 215 and SB420, the DA (an ex cop who was fired/convicted for shooting a man in the face during a traffic stop and then conspiring with his cop buddies to cover it up) keeps adding more charges against her to try and get her to plead guilty to something in order to prevent the inevitable lawsuit.

Now do any of you think any longer that I’m joking when I say that there are some cases of official abuse so egregious that we, (the public that has voted for medical marijuana in 9 states and Washington, D.C.), deserve swift enforcement of California statutes regarding misconduct under color of authority, and appropriate federal civil rights prosecutions?

So what is it going to be, crack down on Marc Emery’s free Ibogaine Clinic in Vancouver, or sadistic killer cops in California?
Dana/cnw

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Kerry board
Date: March 15, 2004 at 3:45:21 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Ke>Perhaps heroin
addiction because that’s the toughest one to break.<

Actually, tobacco beats heroin hands down, to my own experiences.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Dana Beal
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 9:54 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from
Kerry board

Anybody care to dissect this? I mean, it’s not illegal where it’s legal.

sandy
Posted: Mar 15 2004, 02:42 AM

Okay, try to get back in here a little bit.

Dana, I think you don’t understand my position on Ibogaine completely. As a
moderator, it was my job to enforce the rules of the board. This forum
cannot allow links directly to sites that promote illegal activity. The gun
people cannot link to sites that explain how to illegally modify a gun, for
example. They can discuss the Constitutionality of not being able to modify
weapons and they can link to sites that discuss that, as long as there are
no instructions or selling of the actual parts, stuff like that. That’s the
line I was drawing with Ibogaine links.

Ibogaine may be useful for those who have been through the treatment process
numerous times and continue to use. Addicts who are fully aware of their
situation That is the minority of addicts. If Ibogaine became legal
tomorrow, the vast majority of users in this country wouldn’t run to get it
because they don’t see themselves as addicts in the first place.

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] [digital@phantom.com: [digital@phantom.com: Re: Ibogaine film]
Date: March 15, 2004 at 1:37:48 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Mon, Mar 15, 2004 at 01:18:10PM -0500], [HSLotsof@aol.com] wrote:

| Received the following email.
|
| Howard
|
| >An interesting article in Saturday’s Glasgow Herald on filmaker David Scott
| >who apparently filmed his own recovery using ibogaine for a forthcoming
| >television documentary:
|
| >http://www.theherald.co.uk/features/11679.html

Yeah, David is a nice guy … just crazy. Who isn’t. He’s on the list.
Yoo Hoo, David, didja get the holes drilled in yo’ heyd…?

Patrick

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [digital@phantom.com: Re: Ibogaine film]
Date: October 24, 2003 at 4:59:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Wed, Oct 22, 2003 at 02:24:43PM -0700], [David G Scott] wrote:

| PS do you know anything about trepanning, anybody that does it and
| where it can be done?

Okay, I admit defeat. Someone is pondering an aftercare modality even
more unique than mine. David, I strongly encourage you to film the event
when you follow through on your idea — no doubt this is already your
plan. It’s an absolutely fucking brilliant idea … or sumthin’

Ibogaine list, this is my friend David. He is THIS guy:

http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v03/n1071/a07.html?183

Apparently David didn’t manage to kill himself with ibogaine and got
unsprung instead — who would believe such a thing! What’re the
odds?!?!!? — so he’s gone right ahead and is pursuing interesting new
possibilities. That’s the spirit!

David, this is the ibogaine list. It’s sorta like a combination of group
therapy and theatre of the absurd, performed in front of an audience.

Occasionally BURSTS of information will sail across the event horizon.
Sometimes it’s even accurate.

You’re gonna feel right at home.

Patrick

p.s., Yo, anybody here drilled holes in their head lately…? <Just
checking. Figure it couldn’t hurt to ask. There doesn’t seem to be a
listing for this service in the Yellow Pages.>

In conclusion: David, please remember to donate your brain to science.
Not just science in general, I mean ME in particular. I really want it.
I’m sure it’s a beautiful disaster inside there.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine filmed
Date: March 15, 2004 at 1:18:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Received the following email.

Howard

An interesting article in Saturday’s Glasgow Herald on filmaker David Scott
who apparently filmed his own recovery using ibogaine for a forthcoming
television documentary:

http://www.theherald.co.uk/features/11679.html

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] respond to methadonian orthodoxy
Date: March 15, 2004 at 12:30:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/14/04 11:58:53 PM, dana@cures-not-wars.org writes:

I was hoping you guys might respond to the various misstatements in
the post. I could do it, but I’ve never been on methadone, number
one, and I’m not living in Holland and able to give an inside view of
it like Sara would.

The approach to treatment is one primarily of low threshold
substitution rather than abstinence-oriented programs. Van Santen
said, “effective treatment is not detox and inpatient treatment but
is long-term pharmacotherapy … [to] reduce criminal behaviour,
public nuisance and disorder.” Methadone is the first choice for
substitution and is available on demand. He said it shows good
results for heroin users with a rate of 60% remission after one
year. This statistic means that users are not cut off methadone if
they test positive for continuing use of heroin or cocaine. The goal
is to find a sufficient dose over a length of time that will reduce
at first and ultimately eliminate the need for illegal narcotic use.
The health department believes this approach reduces the harm to the
community as the need to steal to finance the drug habit is reduced
and reduces the harm to the addict from the threat of disease and
overdose associated with illegal narcotic use.

Dana,

Access to methadone by heroin users in the Netherlands is as stated
available, via a low threshold, meaning that it is easily accessible. Methadone is
available through both clinics and via methadone buses with regular stops where
patients/users are provided with methadone. The National Alliance of Methadone
Advocates (NAMA) an international methadone advocacy group does however find
that the Dutch system fails to provide adequate doses of methadone and/or “low
doses” their patients. This is a patient satisfaction issue.

As to Dutch drug policy in general, let me quote a number of sections from
official Dutch government web pages. The pages themselves provide more
information.

http://www.minbuza.nl/default.asp?CMS_ITEM=MBZ454534

A. Main Points

1 What are the main features of Dutch policy on drugs?
2 Are drugs legal in the Netherlands?
3 What is the difference between hard and soft drugs?
4 Why is it not an offence to use drugs?
5 Is it true that soft drugs are a stepping stone to hard drugs?
6 What are the current trends regarding ecstasy and amphetamines?
7 Does Dutch law comply with international agreements?

1 What are the main features of Dutch policy on drugs?

Both policy and legislation make a distinction between hard drugs and soft
drugs, based on health risks to users. Possession of soft drugs (up to 30 grams)
is a minor offence. Observe strict rules (see Section C). The aim is to
protect soft-drug users from exposure to more harmful drugs and prevent them from
becoming marginalised. For instance, a client seeking to buy cannabis from an
illegal dealer may be persuaded to buy hard drugs. Providing outlets where only
soft drugs may be sold keeps people away from more harmful drugs. The law
prohibiting their possession or sale is strictly enforced.

The main aim of Dutch policy is to reduce both the demand for and supply of
drugs, and to minimise any harm to users, the people with whom they associate,
and the public in general. The authorities therefore take different approaches
to soft drugs and hard drugs. Many countries do the same in practice but
without making a formal distinction between the two categories. Section B
describes the Netherlands’ policy on law enforcement.

2 Are drugs legal in the Netherlands?

No. It is an offence to:
produce
possess
sell
import or export
either hard or soft drugs.
It is not an offence to use drugs (see A4).
See B9 for a list of drug-related offences and the maximum penalty for each.

Preventive strategies help to reduce the demand for drugs, while professional
care limits the harm they cause to users and the people they associate with.
To cut off supplies the authorities are cracking down on organised crime.
Other aims are to maintain public order and prevent drug-related nuisance.

ON MARIJUANA

http://www.minbuza.nl/default.asp?CMS_ITEM=MBZ454536#P28_362

C. Coffee Shops

1 What is a coffee shop?
2 What are the rules governing coffee shops, and how are they enforced?
3 Why are coffee shops allowed?
4 Are people who supply drugs to coffee shops prosecuted?
5 Why are fewer coffee shops operating?

1 What is a coffee shop?

A coffee shop is an establishment where soft drugs may be sold subject to
certain conditions, but no alcoholic drinks may be sold or consumed. Although the
sale of soft drugs is an offence, coffee shops are not prosecuted provided
they sell small quantities only and comply with the rules listed in C2.

Policy on law enforcement is set out in Section B. Coffee shops have been
subject to stricter controls and their number has declined over the past few
years (see C5).

2 What are the rules governing coffee shops, and how are they enforced?

Under the guidelines issued by the Public Prosecution Service on 1 January
2001, coffee shops are not prosecuted for selling soft drugs providing they
observe the following rules:
* they may not sell more than 5 grams to any one person at any one time
* they may not sell ecstasy or other hard drugs
* they may not advertise drugs
* they must ensure that there is no nuisance in their vicinity
* they may not sell drugs to persons aged under 18 or even allow them on the
premises.

The sale of soft drugs will continue to be an offence. If the rules set out
above are not observed, the premises are closed down and the owners or
management may be prosecuted. Under the official drug guidelines, coffee shops may
stock up to 500 grams of soft drugs without facing prosecution.

3 Why are coffee shops allowed?

The aim is to keep soft drugs separate from hard drugs in order to protect
soft-drug users, especially youngsters who want to try them out, from exposure
to hard drugs and the criminal elements who traffic in them.

Although the possession and sale of small quantities of soft drugs in coffee
shops are offences under the Opium Act, soft drugs do not constitute a serious
risk to health and are therefore low enforcement priorities.

4 Are people who supply drugs to coffee shops prosecuted?

Yes. The Public Prosecution Service and the police act in accordance with the
Opium Act, the official drug guidelines and the Service’s discretionary
powers. The traffic in both soft and hard drugs, which is often in the hands of
organised crime, is given the highest enforcement priority. The same applies to
the supply of soft drugs to coffee shops. All the provisions of international
agreements are observed (see A7).

5 Why are fewer coffee shops operating?

The rules can be enforced more easily (see C2). Coffee shops in certain
neighbourhoods, and in border areas where foreigners come to buy drugs, are often a
source of nuisance. Targeted action over the past few years has helped to
reduce the problem (see B7). The mayor may close down a coffee shop, whether or
not there is a nuisance problem. Closures must be consistent with the local
drug policy agreed by the mayor, the chief public prosecutor and the chief of
police (see B8).

The aim is to allow only as many coffee shops as are needed to meet local
demand. Their number has declined as a result of policy amendments in 1995/1996.
According to the most recent figures (2000), no coffee shops were operating in
435 of the country’s 538 municipalities (81 percent), representing a 31
percent decline since 1997 (see E7).

Targeted action is taken to curb the problems associated with coffee shops,
such as nuisance, the sale of all hard drugs or of export quantities of soft
drugs. [end citation]

Hope that helps.

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

Board of Directors
National Alliance of Methadone Advocates
http://www.methadone.org

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Sandy’s excuses for blocking Ibogaine websites from Kerry board
Date: March 15, 2004 at 9:54:54 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Anybody care to dissect this? I mean, it’s not illegal where it’s legal.

sandy
Posted: Mar 15 2004, 02:42 AM
Okay, try to get back in here a little bit.

Now, as to my own personal view of Ibogaine, I do not see it as a magical cure. That’s not to say it might not have a place in treatment, although I’m really having a tough time figuring out what that would truly be. Perhaps heroin addiction because that’s the toughest one to break. And for whatever reason, heroin addicts seem to be pretty well aware that they’re addicts and motivated to get off of it. Moreso than other addicts, but it’s just tough to kick. It also might be just the thing for dual diagnosis, it seems for those people the medication is sometimes worse than the illness. It might even be good for cigarette addiction for the same reason. Most smokers really don’t want to smoke, it’s just a tough addiction to break. So there could be specific scenarios where Ibogaine could be essential.

But, as I’m sure you know, the key to most other addictions is denial. Which is where I have a hard time understanding how Ibogaine would be the broad panacea you describe. As I’ve said before, breaking through the denial is still going to be required to get someone to agree to Ibogaine in the first place. Maybe you do an intervention and get them to do the Ibogaine treatment instead of a treatment program. But then when I read Dr. Mash’s reports, they specifically say the effects only last 30 days – 6 months. Then what? You can’t give somebody the emotional tools to deal with sobriety if their mental/emotional state is altered by Ibogaine. So like I’ve said before, what happens when the Ibogaine wears off and the person opts for their drug of choice instead of Ibogaine because it’s easier or cheaper. You quoted a 70% recovery figure, that’s the same figure any decent treatment program has and is usually a monitored 1-3 year recovery figure. I don’t see any similar data on Ibogaine for a substance that has supposedly been used since the 80’s or before.

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: [ibogaine] Liver Cleanser and Master Cleanser
Date: March 15, 2004 at 5:57:23 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bill and all,

A big thank you for the liver cleansing link… those pics are amazing
(especially
on my fridge)..I’m planning on trying it out myself in the next little
while…

I also thought I’d take this opportunity and share something I did a few
years ago,
it is an incredibly powerful cleansing- called the Master Cleanser by
Stanley
Burroughs, also known as the Lemonade Diet…..

How powerful? A doctor reported how an elderly patient of his had an old
operation scar open up and pus came out along with a ‘suture’ thread that
was
forgotten from an operation that took place years prior to the
cleansing…..

the following link is the entire book in a single html page (really worth
reading)

http://www.schoolofoptimumhealth.com/body/master_cleanse/master_cleanse.htm

and for those who missed Bill’s liver cleansing link-

http://www.curezone.com/cleanse/liver/

Adam

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 15, 2004 at 4:48:28 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Planteur,

Yes, that makes alot of sense and corresponds with what
actually took place…

So what you’re saying is that there’s a stem that runs down the
root, similar to the one in a carrot… and that this part is not used
at all- or perhaps used in very large quantities in the preperation of
the drink….?

Btw, this is very similar to san pedro (cactus) where the ‘skin’
is peeled off, the flesh is scraped off and the stem is discarded-
except san pedro is so neutral in taste you’d think it was Swiss….

This, btw, is not very good news… because, frankly, I think alot
of people have been under the impression that one need only
consume 20-40 grams of rootbark and that this would equate
with the much greater quantities of ‘root’ that westerners
supposedly were served in Bwiti initiations… as I said, a big bowl
of diced up root corresponds more to 400gms than to 20-40, not
to mention all the glasses that were also consumed… now I find out
that all this time this was rootbark, which means, no wonder Nick
disappeared for a whole week- if you read what he wrote, you’ll see
how he was disappointed by the ‘barkless’ root and by having to
consume so much more…..

Another point worth bringing up is that websites and vendors that
sell root are misleading potential buyers… There’s no point in buying
‘root-stems’- or am I missing something here…?

thanks,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, March 15, 2004 1:18 AM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine

Hello AG, I now understand where is the confusion. What the bwitis might
discard is the first skin of the root, a very thin skin directly in
contact
with the soil. they will scrap the root very lightly to remove this skin
and
then they will scrap the root stronger to get what they call ‘flesh’. This
is still the rootbark though. And you can do that only when the root are
very fresh, when you just pulled them from the ground. They do that just
for
hygiene reason.

Best

Planteur

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From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 15, 2004 at 6:40:17 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Maybe I can help a little. I hung out with the old woman who was preparing
the rootbark from a big fertizer sackful of roots the family had just
bought. I asked her why she was lightly scraping off the top layer of the
rootbark and she said it was unhygenic. I seem to recall she later brewed
these scrapings up and made a tea. So I figure they use the rootbark but
scrape away the very outer layer.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: “laurent sazy” <laurentsazy@free.fr>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, March 14, 2003 7:47 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine

On 15/03/04 0:16, “AG” <adamg@013.net.il> wrote:

Planteur,

You mean ‘mistaken’ not false, and Laurent mentioned “tête de cochon”(
head
of pig), not
‘feet of pig’… And I assure you, the Besala tribe/family, discard the
bark, as Nick can
attest, and eat a big bowl, I’d say some 400gms easy, of chopped-up,
barkless, root…

As for the ‘automatique’, as they called it, I would ask you and Laurent
the
following-
is the drink very black in color- not brownish black, but ink-black?
Because, maybe
our hosts just have their own tradition in this manner, the way they don’t
use either honey
or plantain in the consumption of the root…

And I consumed at least 4 full glasses of this drink…. this was the same
drink that the
congregation would pass a glass around, on previous nights, and each
member
would
take the tiniest sip and upon swallowing every one would react quite
physically to the taste.

And Laurent, for the record, our bowls did contain green, chopped-up,
leaves
of some
kind or other, not alot though, I’d say sprinkled.. at the time I wrote
about this, there was
some confirmation on the calyx list in this regard, apparently, this is
common in certain areas
while non-existent in others,

all the best,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>

Planteur

—–Message d’origine—–
De : AG [mailto:adamg@013.net.il]
Envoyé : dimanche 14 mars 2004 20:13
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine

Howard,

I’m kinda surprised by your statement ‘no one eats the roots’. That’s
exactly what the bwiti
eat- they discard the bark, as they deem it ‘filthy’ or something along
those lines… And that’s what Nick, a heroin addict from Belgium and
myself
were served.

Fresh root is ‘active’ unlike the rootbark that’s dried and then shipped
overseas… you put it in your mouth and it starts gnawing away like
microscopic tazmanian devils. Dried ‘rootbark’ becomes pretty nasty if
you
chew a small piece for a little while- and you’ll realize that the
bitterness clings on way after you rinsed your mouth a few times- but
fresh
root is so much more than that and I would say that within 3 or 4
‘swallows’, maybe 15-20 mins, you start feeling the oncoming onslaught of
psychedelic effects… And you know that this stuff is serious, because
on
one hand, it is the most vilest-tasting substance on the planet but a few
minutes after downing a spoonful or so you’re in complete awe as to how
clean your mouth is… Another thing, I cleaned out my colon in a 30
second
session- I’m not going to ever forget the time I went to the bathroom and
came out quite a bit thinner around the mid-section…. it also releases
a
lot of fumes that rise up and makes breathing extremely unpleasant.. it
felt
like Drano- stuff that unplugs the sink…

But for what its worth, I believe that even if fresh root was readily
available, it would not be appreciated- this is where journeying to
Africa
makes the difference and then, just barely…

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>

The roots are mostly wood. No one eats the roots. Rootbark, yes.
Rootbark
extract, yes. ibogaine, yes. But, it is like everything else you have
to
know
your product and what you are doing with it.

Howard

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Dear friend,

What can I say, the “tête or pieds de cochon” was brown, just iboga roots
after the iboga bark was take off and boiled in water.(that was the
morning tea during an 4 days initiations).
In Nord-gabon,the Fang mostly, drink iboga with palm wine.Probably some
Nganga put another bark or leaves in their préparation.
I don’t no about congregation!

The tradition I can talk is from south Gabon, mostly in Missoko-gonde or
Ngenza rituals.(directly coming from pygmés). They use plantain and honey
and iboga during initiation, and plantain with an another bark to purge the
body. Also they eat plantain all time in civil life also in Bwiti rituals.

(Mitsogho, puvi, simba, okande, massango, bapunu etnies….etc do
approximatly the same.
Cameroun, guinée-equato,Fang and congregations do an another Bwiti.

If dried iboga looks old, put it on the sun( some hours) to be charged and
press it in your hand.

Laurent

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From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 15, 2004 at 4:18:39 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello AG, I now understand where is the confusion. What the bwitis might
discard is the first skin of the root, a very thin skin directly in contact
with the soil. they will scrap the root very lightly to remove this skin and
then they will scrap the root stronger to get what they call ‘flesh’. This
is still the rootbark though. And you can do that only when the root are
very fresh, when you just pulled them from the ground. They do that just for
hygiene reason.

Best

Planteur

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] important info
Date: March 14, 2004 at 10:34:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think I’m bored. Here are the results of clicking the mindvox logo
400 times. I have been nice and removed the duplicate results. How many
of these are there? I have the feeling I could click it for days.

.:vector:.

“Alone in the Superunknown”
This is NOT the Summer of Love

‘Scuse me, gotta go … I have my Parole Officer hanging on a Meathook
in the Basement

“. . . I’m searchin’ for my mainline … I couldn’t hit it sideways . .
.”

Made Wif Crack!
Kill For Peace
Nothing’s Shocking
” . . How Much does one Have to Pay . To Fry a Peak and Melt Away . . ”
” … I Wonder is This Work or Play? . I’m Never Really Sure … ”

Do you Mind if I Move In Under your Sink…?

Dead Bodies Everywhere
MindVox: Where the Customer is Always Wrong
” Power Corrupts . Absolute Power is Kinda Neat ”
Say… Is there Anything Interesting in your Mom’s Medicine Cabinet?

Saturated with over 100mg/kg of Ibogaine per Inode
“… I am the needle in your vein … I am the high you can’t sustain
…”

“In the hot red light of a black and white; roses grow.”

You’re Living Proof that it Takes a Really Smart Person, to do So Much
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I Will Not Fall
Symptom of the Universe
Aug 11 11:11:13 entropy mach: ttyscc0: receive error 2 (-902)
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“If, at first an idea is not absurd, there is no hope for it.”
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Some Assembly Required
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Somebody Please Help Me … I’ve Lost All My Molecules
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,.wE are Transmitting from the year 2012 -^~ .n order to alter _.is
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MindVox – Addiction (Remixed) [Version: LSD/Ibogaine/Heroin/Crack DJ
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“In the Church of my Heart, the Choir’s on Fire.”
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Segmentation Fault (core dumped)
Erase Me Debase Me Freebase Me
You Are Exactly Where God Wants You To Be
Why do you have to be Such a Bitch?
My, what a Lovely Shooting Gallery you Live In
Are you a Junkie too?
Your Enemies are Plotting Against You
Post-human, Fully Deconstructed and Completely Incoherent
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Today’s vocabulary word: Pedohomonecropyrobestiality
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Welcome to Hunt’s Point Industrial Park! Featuring: Coke, Dope & Ho’s
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Recent Scientific Studies Strongly Suggest that you’re Totally Fucked
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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] underground titan missle silo for sale
Date: March 14, 2004 at 10:35:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2375751781

.:vector:.

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy
Date: March 14, 2004 at 6:23:38 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Dana ,

Few of my Dutch initiates were interviewed by mainline which is an addicts magazine, few were back to the methadone clinic after ibo. Treatment
To ask why wouldn’t the clinic help with ibo. Detox. They were sent out , no one wants to listen.
Sander the Dutch guy on the Cd/R from 2 years ago is still clean, he talked to many people about his success to bit his years of addictions , but
No ear that’s want to listen. there is a good reason for Dana to keep on talking about Ibogaine.
I have to thanks Dana giving me his trust and support.Which helped me help others.

Sara

Van: Dana Beal [mailto:dana@cures-not-wars.org]  Verzonden: zaterdag 13 maart 2004 23:42 Aan: Ibogaine@mindvox.com Onderwerp: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy

Hey Patrick, so Someone:

Could you write some kind of point-by-point response to the following. Now I see what’s wrong with these people–it’s like Peter Cohen at the DPA. “I’m against having them quit.” (BTW, the person who wrote the following cut off access to Sara’s website, so there’s no way for anyone else on the thread to check it out for themselves. May Sara wants to respond as well.

Dana/cnw

At 11:35 PM Mar 12 2004,, Sandy wrote:
Amsterdam does have separate laws for marijuana, which is not illegal; and other drugs which are illegal to possess or consume in public, and illegal to sell. And in this entire treatment overview, I don’t see the word Ibogaine listed once. This is not to say there is no value to Ibogaine, but it is wrong to imply Ibogaine is solving drug problems in Amsterdam. Or that Amsterdam is some sort of proof that decriminalizing all drugs is a solution.  PROGRAMS  Dr. Gerritt van Santen, chief physician for the mental health branch of the city’s health department, says his department’s specialty is “offering care for care avoiding people.” He believes that it is essential to understand addiction as a “mental disorder characterized by aninability to put intention into action. This is a consensus you need before you can develop any policy.” He said in the 1980’s the city first tried to refer addicts to traditional psychiatrists who did not want to get involved. Eventually the city gave up on this approach and set up its own system of shared care with the local general practitioners (physicians) who see the more stable addicts while the public system of integrated care sees the more difficult clients that can’t be handled by the G.P.s. Only classic dual diagnosis patients are referred to psychiatrists (i.e. schizophrenia and drug addiction). A high proportion of addicts are mental patients or have multiple illness.  Today, three units of the city’s mental health department deal with various aspects of the addict’s behaviour and care. The Ambulant Medical Team under the direction of Theo Sluijs does outreach, acts as an intermediary between drug users and hospitals, runs boarding houses and shelter beds for homeless addicts, and provides medical service and methadone in the jails for addicts at the daily request of the police. It also runs projects to provide care for addicts illegally in the country and to respond to addicts who create a noise or disturbance on the streets. The Care Coordination Unit deals with hard to handle addicts who cause problems in the community such as those who are mentally ill, refuse treatment or have multiple medical problems. This unit is “responsible to neighbours not just the patient,” according to Theo Sluijs. When neighbours call the police, for example, this unit’s responsibility is to coordinate with the police and treatment providers to develop a program to deal with the individual’s problem within three months. The third unit includes the five outpatient clinics, needle exchange program, seven safe consumption rooms and the scientific medical heroin trial program.  TREATMENT  The approach to treatment is one primarily of low threshold substitution rather than abstinence-oriented programs. Van Santen said, “effective treatment is not detox and inpatient treatment but is long-term pharmacotherapy … [to] reduce criminal behaviour, public nuisance and disorder.” Methadone is the first choice for substitution and is available on demand. He said it shows good results for heroin users with a rate of 60% remission after one year. This statistic means that users are not cut off methadone if they test positive for continuing use of heroin or cocaine. The goal is to find a sufficient dose over a length of time that will reduce at first and ultimately eliminate the need for illegal narcotic use. The health department believes this approach reduces the harm to the community as the need to steal to finance the drug habit is reduced and reduces the harm to the addict from the threat of disease and overdose associated with illegal narcotic use. About 2700 addicts are annually treated with pharmacotherapy by the department. Most receive methadone while others, particularly cocaine addicts receive another substitution drug such as benzodiazepine, librium , valium or ritalin for cocaine use.
He said there are 14 detox beds in the city with a maximum stay of five days used primarily to stabilize addicts. There are very few beds for inpatient abstinence oriented treatment. He said it is a very expensive approach that can handle very few people at a time. Their experience isonly 5% are clean and sober two years after discharge. Many of their addict population have been repeatedly through this type of treatment without success. For the younger addict who has been using for under one year he believes it can work with an intense, highly individualized program but for the older or long-term addict he believes drug use is part of a lifestyle that must be changed before abstinence based treatment will work. He said substitution deals with the craving for the drug but then you still have to deal with “the patient’s lifestyle and retarded development” and social de-integration. It is the lifestyle that the coordinated response seeks to build up so that through the combination of substitution and support the patient is less harm to himself and the surrounding community in terms of his public behaviour and criminal activity.(Further details and statistics on Amsterdam’s approach in Attachment 1)
Van Santen said most of the addicts seen in Amsterdam are heroin users with most cocaine users also using heroin so the treatment approach focuses on heroin addiction. He said many of their heroin users began as cocaine addicts and he is not sure that cocaine use is really a separate type of serious addiction. He said the average age of the city’s addicts is 40 years old and that they are not attracting new young addicts into the scene because of their highly medicalized approach and the image promoted through their education and prevention school programs that drugs are for losers. There is much greater concern about the alarming rise in alcohol use by young people. Sluijs contradicted this somewhat by saying he is alarmed at the skyrocketing trend to crack cocaine which their present treatment methods aren’t set up to deal with…”  ”For some years judges have been allowed to offer addicts convicted of crimes related to their addiction drug treatment instead of jail. Many choose jail. Police Commissioner Jules Somers said that although the drug helping system and the harm reduction approach has succeeded for many addicts there is still an intractable group who cause the most trouble. He said, “The harm reduction policy is working for the addict but not working to solve crime. The health condition of these people is good but they still commit crime… . For a certain group the methadone and health approach doesn’t work. For those that it does work, that’s O.K. for me.”  He said that a recent survey of crime in Amsterdam showed that 36,000 people committed 267,000 crimes over the past three years but 1200 of those people were responsible for 42,000 crimes in the inner city where the drug addicts are concentrated. In other words, less than two tenths of one percent (.15%) of the city population is responsible for 16% of all crime. He said because of the problems associated with this group of intractable addicts the Dutch Parliament recently passed a law to be proclaimed this fall called “SOV” (Skufrechterlijhe Ofrang Verslaufden) which means “Penal Addiction Treatment Centre”. It will force addicts who have been convicted of five or more offences in a year related to their addiction and who refuse voluntary drug treatment to go to a special prison for mandatory abstinence oriented drug treatment for two years. Somers said SOV will apply to about 5% of addicts. The police, he said, wanted it to apply to a bigger group but that it was contrary to the Dutch harm reduction policy so the criteria of five convictions and refusal of treatment was established. He said, “The way to this decision has taken a long time.” He said despite their problems he does not believe their policies have increased the number of addicts or attracted them from elsewhere.  Somers said the police concentrate their efforts on the drug dealers and there are strict penalties for dealing with sentences ranging from several months to several years in jail. Addicts found in possession of more than a small amount also get convictions and sentences, he said…”
http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/ctyclerk/c…00926/drugs.htm
From: laurent sazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 14, 2003 at 2:47:51 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On 15/03/04 0:16, “AG” <adamg@013.net.il> wrote:

Planteur,

You mean ‘mistaken’ not false, and Laurent mentioned “tête de cochon”( head
of pig), not
‘feet of pig’… And I assure you, the Besala tribe/family, discard the
bark, as Nick can
attest, and eat a big bowl, I’d say some 400gms easy, of chopped-up,
barkless, root…

As for the ‘automatique’, as they called it, I would ask you and Laurent the
following-
is the drink very black in color- not brownish black, but ink-black?
Because, maybe
our hosts just have their own tradition in this manner, the way they don’t
use either honey
or plantain in the consumption of the root…

And I consumed at least 4 full glasses of this drink…. this was the same
drink that the
congregation would pass a glass around, on previous nights, and each member
would
take the tiniest sip and upon swallowing every one would react quite
physically to the taste.

And Laurent, for the record, our bowls did contain green, chopped-up, leaves
of some
kind or other, not alot though, I’d say sprinkled.. at the time I wrote
about this, there was
some confirmation on the calyx list in this regard, apparently, this is
common in certain areas
while non-existent in others,

all the best,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>

Planteur

—–Message d’origine—–
De : AG [mailto:adamg@013.net.il]
Envoyé : dimanche 14 mars 2004 20:13
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine

Howard,

Fresh root is ‘active’ unlike the rootbark that’s dried and then shipped
overseas… you put it in your mouth and it starts gnawing away like
microscopic tazmanian devils. Dried ‘rootbark’ becomes pretty nasty if you
chew a small piece for a little while- and you’ll realize that the
bitterness clings on way after you rinsed your mouth a few times- but
fresh
root is so much more than that and I would say that within 3 or 4
‘swallows’, maybe 15-20 mins, you start feeling the oncoming onslaught of
psychedelic effects… And you know that this stuff is serious, because on
one hand, it is the most vilest-tasting substance on the planet but a few
minutes after downing a spoonful or so you’re in complete awe as to how
clean your mouth is… Another thing, I cleaned out my colon in a 30
second
session- I’m not going to ever forget the time I went to the bathroom and
came out quite a bit thinner around the mid-section…. it also releases a
lot of fumes that rise up and makes breathing extremely unpleasant.. it
felt
like Drano- stuff that unplugs the sink…

But for what its worth, I believe that even if fresh root was readily
available, it would not be appreciated- this is where journeying to Africa
makes the difference and then, just barely…

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>

The roots are mostly wood. No one eats the roots. Rootbark, yes.
Rootbark
extract, yes. ibogaine, yes. But, it is like everything else you have
to
know
your product and what you are doing with it.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Dear friend,

(Mitsogho, puvi, simba, okande, massango, bapunu etnies….etc do
approximatly the same.
Cameroun, guinée-equato,Fang and congregations do an another Bwiti.

If dried iboga looks old, put it on the sun( some hours) to be charged and
press it in your hand.

Laurent

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 14, 2004 at 2:21:31 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/14/04 9:13:34 AM, adamg@013.net.il writes:

<< Howard,

I’m kinda surprised by your statement ‘no one eats the roots’. That’s

exactly what the bwiti

eat- they discard the bark, as they deem it ‘filthy’ or something along

those lines… And that’s what Nick, a heroin addict from Belgium and myself

were served.

Fresh root is ‘active’ unlike the rootbark that’s dried and then shipped

overseas… you put it in your mouth and it starts gnawing away like

microscopic tazmanian devils. Dried ‘rootbark’ becomes pretty nasty if you

chew a small piece for a little while- and you’ll realize that the

bitterness clings on way after you rinsed your mouth a few times- but fresh

root is so much more than that and I would say that within 3 or 4

‘swallows’, maybe 15-20 mins, you start feeling the oncoming onslaught of

psychedelic effects… And you know that this stuff is serious, because on

one hand, it is the most vilest-tasting substance on the planet but a few

minutes after downing a spoonful or so you’re in complete awe as to how

clean your mouth is… Another thing, I cleaned out my colon in a 30 second

session- I’m not going to ever forget the time I went to the bathroom and

came out quite a bit thinner around the mid-section…. it also releases a

lot of fumes that rise up and makes breathing extremely unpleasant.. it felt

like Drano- stuff that unplugs the sink…

But for what its worth, I believe that even if fresh root was readily

available, it would not be appreciated- this is where journeying to Africa

makes the difference and then, just barely…

Adam >>

Adam,

I certainly cannot deny your experience but, it is distinct from my own
understanding. Don’t know what else to say but, would particularly appreciate any
comments from those with knowledge of the Bwiti rites and practices.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] respond to methadonian orthodoxy
Date: March 14, 2004 at 10:40:00 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/13/04 10:42:19 PM, dana@cures-not-wars.org writes:

>>Could you write some kind of point-by-point response to the
>>following. Now I see what’s wrong with these people–it’s like Peter
>>Cohen at the DPA. “I’m against having them quit.” (BTW, the person
>>who wrote the following cut off access to Sara’s website, so there’s
>>no way for anyone else on the thread to check it out for themselves.
>>Maybe Sara wants to respond as well.
>>
They cut off access >from their site, obviously.

I was hoping you guys might respond to the various misstatements in the post. I could do it, but I’ve never been on methadone, number one, and I’m not living in Holland and able to give an inside view of it like Sara would.

Dana/cnw

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy
Date: March 14, 2004 at 12:31:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Dana,

Ibogaine is not an official medicine in the Netherlands nor is it widely
available. But, let me provide you with some background. Charles Kaplan, provides
some insight in his article, Reaching a Stage of Wellness: Multistage
Explorations in Social Neuroscience (Kaplan, Ketzer, de Jong, de Vries) Social
Neuroscience Bulletin 6(1) 1993 <http://ibogaine.org/wellness.html>.

“Some suggestions emerge in the consideration of the results of the focus
groups with the Dutch heroin addicts. The focus groups of addicts revealed that
ibogaine was able to induce the experience of collective consciousness and a
clearing up of the mind for members of the focus group. J., one of the members,
reported a common experience, namely, that ibogaine had made her aware that
“All the information I ever got through reading or experience was registered in
my brain.” This demonstration of the brain’s capacities, which formerly was
only theoretically known, became a lived experience. Common to all members was
the production of an intense state of wakefullness. For three to four weeks
after taking the ibogaine, they slept for only three to four hours per day. After
a month they gradually returned to eight hours of sleep per day. The ibogaine
was not comfortable for the members; all had highly anxious episodes. The
state of ibogaine was described by all as a dream with full consciousness. All
felt themselves to be physically heavy, i.e. in a somnolent stage like a body in
sleep. All reported an interruption of heroin-seeking behavior for relatively
long periods of time, a state that they never thought they would reach given
their former nihilistic, depressed view of life.

From these focus groups some intriguing hypotheses have been clarified,
highlighting both exogenous and endogenous processes. The ibogaine experience
succeeded in providing a common sense of belonging to a distinct community oriented
to wellness – a European variety of the African iboga medicine society. Thus,
even, the one member who used heroin again rather shortly after the treatment
did so out of a clear decision and reported that he did not feel himself
addicted anymore. The focus group undermined a preconceived notion that, because
of its extraordinary psychopharmacological effects. Ibogaine produces a
singular, common experience. However, the members discovered in the group that each
experienced the ibogaine in a unique and different way. Does ibogaine, like the
Dalai Lama’s medicine, work to create a sense of belonging to a medicine
community that is dedicated towards reaching a state of wellness? Is this special
consensus an important exogenous mechanism culturally reframing pathological
endogenous processes?”

From the late 1980’s through the early 1990s Dutch user activists began
self-administering and providing ibogaine to other users via an organization they
established, Dutch Addict Self-Help (DASH). DASH was principally established by
the founder of the Dutch Junkies Union, the late Nico Adriaans and his
associates. There is very little available current information on the drug user use
of ibogaine in the Netherlands and a good epidemiological study would really
be in order. What is trackable is the availability of ibogaine and iboga root
products through shamanic practitioners such as Sara Glatt at Sara’s House
where drugs users are provided with ibogaine and other herbal therapies and
independently, the apparent sales of some iboga products via the internet. For the
most part both heroin users and the government of the Netherlands, as other
governments, prefers heroin and/or methadone to ibogaine. On one part, as
these are opioid substances and provide the central effects desired by opiate
dependent individuals and on the other hand, in that persons on methadone and
heroin programs are easy to track and control. Something governments like to do.
In many ways I agree with Peter Cohen that the concept of a drug problem is a
fabrication and a mechanism of societal control and if we did not view it as a
problem it would not be a problem. However, whether viewed as a problem or
not, ibogaine offers a mechanism whereby a dependent drug user has the ability
to reverse that dependence fiscally and mentally and to experience a return to
what is perceived as a preaddictive state. Whether that be for a day or a
year, the experience of returning to a non-addicted state is invaluable as it is
a state that most dependent drug users would not be able to conceive of or
experience. The knowledge of that experience offers the possibility of
recognizing once again that a non-addicted state of mind/body exists and that there is
unique opportunity to return to a that state that Kaplan describes as
“Wellness”.

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

In a message dated 3/13/04 10:42:19 PM, dana@cures-not-wars.org writes:

<< At 11:35 PM Mar 12 2004,, Sandy wrote:
Amsterdam does have separate laws for marijuana, which is not
illegal; and other drugs which are illegal to possess or consume in
public, and illegal to sell. And in this entire treatment overview,
I don’t see the word Ibogaine listed once. This is not to say there
is no value to Ibogaine, but it is wrong to imply Ibogaine is
solving drug problems in Amsterdam. Or that Amsterdam is some sort
of proof that decriminalizing all drugs is a solution.

PROGRAMS

Dr. Gerritt van Santen, chief physician for the mental health branch
of the city’s health department, says his department’s specialty is
“offering care for care avoiding people.” He believes that it is
essential to understand addiction as a “mental disorder
characterized by aninability to put intention into action. This is a
consensus you need before you can develop any policy.” He said in
the 1980’s the city first tried to refer addicts to traditional
psychiatrists who did not want to get involved. Eventually the city
gave up on this approach and set up its own system of shared care
with the local general practitioners (physicians) who see the more
stable addicts while the public system of integrated care sees the
more difficult clients that can’t be handled by the G.P.s. Only
classic dual diagnosis patients are referred to psychiatrists (i.e.
schizophrenia and drug addiction). A high proportion of addicts are
mental patients or have multiple illness.

Today, three units of the city’s mental health department deal with
various aspects of the addict’s behaviour and care. The Ambulant
Medical Team under the direction of Theo Sluijs does outreach, acts
as an intermediary between drug users and hospitals, runs boarding
houses and shelter beds for homeless addicts, and provides medical
service and methadone in the jails for addicts at the daily request
of the police. It also runs projects to provide care for addicts
illegally in the country and to respond to addicts who create a
noise or disturbance on the streets. The Care Coordination Unit
deals with hard to handle addicts who cause problems in the
community such as those who are mentally ill, refuse treatment or
have multiple medical problems. This unit is “responsible to
neighbours not just the patient,” according to Theo Sluijs. When
neighbours call the police, for example, this unit’s responsibility
is to coordinate with the police and treatment providers to develop
a program to deal with the individual’s problem within three months.
The third unit includes the five outpatient clinics, needle exchange
program, seven safe consumption rooms and the scientific medical
heroin trial program.

TREATMENT

He said there are 14 detox beds in the city with a maximum stay of
five days used primarily to stabilize addicts. There are very few
beds for inpatient abstinence oriented treatment. He said it is a
very expensive approach that can handle very few people at a time.
Their experience isonly 5% are clean and sober two years after
discharge. Many of their addict population have been repeatedly
through this type of treatment without success. For the younger
addict who has been using for under one year he believes it can work
with an intense, highly individualized program but for the older or
long-term addict he believes drug use is part of a lifestyle that
must be changed before abstinence based treatment will work. He said
substitution deals with the craving for the drug but then you still
have to deal with “the patient’s lifestyle and retarded development”
and social de-integration. It is the lifestyle that the coordinated
response seeks to build up so that through the combination of
substitution and support the patient is less harm to himself and the
surrounding community in terms of his public behaviour and criminal
activity.(Further details and statistics on Amsterdam’s approach in
Attachment 1)

Van Santen said most of the addicts seen in Amsterdam are heroin
users with most cocaine users also using heroin so the treatment
approach focuses on heroin addiction. He said many of their heroin
users began as cocaine addicts and he is not sure that cocaine use
is really a separate type of serious addiction. He said the average
age of the city’s addicts is 40 years old and that they are not
attracting new young addicts into the scene because of their highly
medicalized approach and the image promoted through their education
and prevention school programs that drugs are for losers. There is
much greater concern about the alarming rise in alcohol use by young
people. Sluijs contradicted this somewhat by saying he is alarmed at
the skyrocketing trend to crack cocaine which their present
treatment methods aren’t set up to deal with…”

“For some years judges have been allowed to offer addicts convicted
of crimes related to their addiction drug treatment instead of jail.
Many choose jail. Police Commissioner Jules Somers said that
although the drug helping system and the harm reduction approach has
succeeded for many addicts there is still an intractable group who
cause the most trouble. He said, “The harm reduction policy is
working for the addict but not working to solve crime. The health
condition of these people is good but they still commit crime… .
For a certain group the methadone and health approach doesn’t work.
For those that it does work, that’s O.K. for me.”

He said that a recent survey of crime in Amsterdam showed that
36,000 people committed 267,000 crimes over the past three years but
1200 of those people were responsible for 42,000 crimes in the inner
city where the drug addicts are concentrated. In other words, less
than two tenths of one percent (.15%) of the city population is
responsible for 16% of all crime. He said because of the problems
associated with this group of intractable addicts the Dutch
Parliament recently passed a law to be proclaimed this fall called
“SOV” (Skufrechterlijhe Ofrang Verslaufden) which means “Penal
Addiction Treatment Centre”. It will force addicts who have been
convicted of five or more offences in a year related to their
addiction and who refuse voluntary drug treatment to go to a special
prison for mandatory abstinence oriented drug treatment for two
years. Somers said SOV will apply to about 5% of addicts. The
police, he said, wanted it to apply to a bigger group but that it
was contrary to the Dutch harm reduction policy so the criteria of
five convictions and refusal of treatment was established. He said,
“The way to this decision has taken a long time.” He said despite
their problems he does not believe their policies have increased the
number of addicts or attracted them from elsewhere.

Somers said the police concentrate their efforts on the drug dealers
and there are strict penalties for dealing with sentences ranging
from several months to several years in jail. Addicts found in
possession of more than a small amount also get convictions and
sentences, he said…”

http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/ctyclerk/c…00926/drugs.htm

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy
Date: March 14, 2004 at 2:21:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Dana,

From these focus groups some intriguing hypotheses have been clarified,
highlighting both exogenous and endogenous processes. The ibogaine experience
succeeded in providing a common sense of belonging to a distinct community oriented
to wellness – a European variety of the African iboga medicine society. Thus,
even, the one member who used heroin again rather shortly after the treatment
did so out of a clear decision and reported that he did not feel himself
addicted anymore. The focus group undermined a preconceived notion that, because
of its extraordinary psychopharmacological effects, ibogaine produces a
singular, common experience. However, the members discovered in the group that each
experienced the ibogaine in a unique and different way. Does ibogaine, like the
Dalai Lama’s medicine, work to create a sense of belonging to a medicine
community that is dedicated towards reaching a state of wellness? Is this special
consensus an important exogenous mechanism culturally reframing pathological
endogenous processes?” [end selection]

From the late 1980’s through the early 1990s Dutch user activists began
self-administering and providing ibogaine to other users via an organization they
established, Dutch Addict Self-Help (DASH). DASH was principally established by
the founder of the Dutch Junkies Union, the late Nico Adriaans and his
associates. There is very little available current information on the drug user use
of ibogaine in the Netherlands and a good epidemiological study would really
be in order. What is trackable is the availability of ibogaine and iboga root
products through shamanic practitioners such as Sara Glatt at Sara’s House
where drugs users are provided with ibogaine and other herbal therapies and
independently, the apparent sales of some iboga products via the internet. For the
most part both heroin users and the government of the Netherlands, as other
governments, prefers heroin and/or methadone to ibogaine. On one part, as
these are opioid substances and provide the central effects desired by opiate
dependent individuals and on the other hand, in that persons on methadone and
heroin programs are easy to track and control. Something governments like to do.
In many ways I agree with Peter Cohen that the concept of a drug problem is a
fabrication and a mechanism of societal control and if we did not view it as a
problem it would not be a problem. However, whether viewed as a problem or
not, ibogaine offers a mechanism whereby a dependent drug user has the ability
to reverse that dependence fiscally and mentally and to experience a return to
what is perceived as a preaddictive state. Whether that be for a day or a
year, the experience of returning to a non-addicted state is invaluable as it is
a state that most dependent drug users would not be able to conceive of or
experience. The knowledge of that experience offers the possibility of
recognizing once again that a non-addicted state of mind/body exists and that offers a
unique opportunity to return to the state that Kaplan describes as “Wellness”.

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

In a message dated 3/13/04 10:42:19 PM, dana@cures-not-wars.org writes:

PROGRAMS

TREATMENT

http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/ctyclerk/c…00926/drugs.htm

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Is this a for real e-mail from Ibogaine list?
Date: March 14, 2004 at 8:35:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello! I received this e-mail and wondered if it was sent out from list or from somewhere else.
Did anyone else get this?

My boyfriend is in hospital so I have not had time to respond.
Some great discussions going on though!
Hopefully he will come home Tuesday and our home will be back to normal…….well it was never normal but………

toodles!
Callie
From: ibogaine-help@mindvox.com
Subject: ezmlm warning
Date: March 10, 2004 at 12:04:04 PM EST
To: CallieMimosa@aol.com

Hi! This is the ezmlm program. I’m managing the
ibogaine@mindvox.com mailing list.

I’m working for my owner, who can be reached
at ibogaine-owner@mindvox.com.

Messages to you from the ibogaine mailing list seem to
have been bouncing. I’ve attached a copy of the first bounce
message I received.

If this message bounces too, I will send you a probe. If the probe bounces,
I will remove your address from the ibogaine mailing list,
without further notice.

I’ve kept a list of which messages from the ibogaine mailing list have
bounced from your address.

Copies of these messages may be in the archive.

To retrieve a set of messages 123-145 (a maximum of 100 per request),
send an empty message to:
<ibogaine-get.123_145@mindvox.com>

To receive a subject and author list for the last 100 or so messages,
send an empty message to:
<ibogaine-index@mindvox.com>

Here are the message numbers:

6206

— Enclosed is a copy of the bounce message I received.

Return-Path: <>
Received: (qmail 16241 invoked for bounce); 27 Feb 2004 22:36:06 -0000
Date: 27 Feb 2004 22:36:06 -0000
From: MAILER-DAEMON@serenity.mindvox.com
To: ibogaine-return-6206-@mindvox.com
Subject: failure notice

Hi. This is the qmail-send program at serenity.mindvox.com.
I’m afraid I wasn’t able to deliver your message to the following addresses.
This is a permanent error; I’ve given up. Sorry it didn’t work out.

<CallieMimosa@aol.com>:
64.12.137.184 failed after I sent the message.
Remote host said: 554-: (HVU:NR) This email is rejected for containing one or more URLs which do not follow RFC guidelines. For additional inforCODE=DL0
554 TRANSACTION FAILED

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 14, 2004 at 6:16:21 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Planteur,

You mean ‘mistaken’ not false, and Laurent mentioned “tête de cochon”( head
of pig), not
‘feet of pig’… And I assure you, the Besala tribe/family, discard the
bark, as Nick can
attest, and eat a big bowl, I’d say some 400gms easy, of chopped-up,
barkless, root…

As for the ‘automatique’, as they called it, I would ask you and Laurent the
following-
is the drink very black in color- not brownish black, but ink-black?
Because, maybe
our hosts just have their own tradition in this manner, the way they don’t
use either honey
or plantain in the consumption of the root…

And I consumed at least 4 full glasses of this drink…. this was the same
drink that the
congregation would pass a glass around, on previous nights, and each member
would
take the tiniest sip and upon swallowing every one would react quite
physically to the taste.

And Laurent, for the record, our bowls did contain green, chopped-up, leaves
of some
kind or other, not alot though, I’d say sprinkled.. at the time I wrote
about this, there was
some confirmation on the calyx list in this regard, apparently, this is
common in certain areas
while non-existent in others,

all the best,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>

Planteur

—–Message d’origine—–
De : AG [mailto:adamg@013.net.il]
Envoyé : dimanche 14 mars 2004 20:13
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine

Howard,

Fresh root is ‘active’ unlike the rootbark that’s dried and then shipped
overseas… you put it in your mouth and it starts gnawing away like
microscopic tazmanian devils. Dried ‘rootbark’ becomes pretty nasty if you
chew a small piece for a little while- and you’ll realize that the
bitterness clings on way after you rinsed your mouth a few times- but
fresh
root is so much more than that and I would say that within 3 or 4
‘swallows’, maybe 15-20 mins, you start feeling the oncoming onslaught of
psychedelic effects… And you know that this stuff is serious, because on
one hand, it is the most vilest-tasting substance on the planet but a few
minutes after downing a spoonful or so you’re in complete awe as to how
clean your mouth is… Another thing, I cleaned out my colon in a 30
second
session- I’m not going to ever forget the time I went to the bathroom and
came out quite a bit thinner around the mid-section…. it also releases a
lot of fumes that rise up and makes breathing extremely unpleasant.. it
felt
like Drano- stuff that unplugs the sink…

But for what its worth, I believe that even if fresh root was readily
available, it would not be appreciated- this is where journeying to Africa
makes the difference and then, just barely…

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>

The roots are mostly wood. No one eats the roots. Rootbark, yes.
Rootbark
extract, yes. ibogaine, yes. But, it is like everything else you have
to
know
your product and what you are doing with it.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 14, 2004 at 6:38:55 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Excuse me AG, but you are false. Rootbark is what the bwitis use for
inititiations, Most of the Ibogaine is present in the root bark. As Laurent
Sazy already said, the bwitis use the root only by boiling them and prepare
a mixture called “pied de cochon” they drink it before inititation as a body
cleanser.

Planteur

—–Message d’origine—–
De : AG [mailto:adamg@013.net.il]
Envoyé : dimanche 14 mars 2004 20:13
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine

Howard,

Fresh root is ‘active’ unlike the rootbark that’s dried and then shipped
overseas… you put it in your mouth and it starts gnawing away like
microscopic tazmanian devils. Dried ‘rootbark’ becomes pretty nasty if you
chew a small piece for a little while- and you’ll realize that the
bitterness clings on way after you rinsed your mouth a few times- but fresh
root is so much more than that and I would say that within 3 or 4
‘swallows’, maybe 15-20 mins, you start feeling the oncoming onslaught of
psychedelic effects… And you know that this stuff is serious, because on
one hand, it is the most vilest-tasting substance on the planet but a few
minutes after downing a spoonful or so you’re in complete awe as to how
clean your mouth is… Another thing, I cleaned out my colon in a 30 second
session- I’m not going to ever forget the time I went to the bathroom and
came out quite a bit thinner around the mid-section…. it also releases a
lot of fumes that rise up and makes breathing extremely unpleasant.. it felt
like Drano- stuff that unplugs the sink…

But for what its worth, I believe that even if fresh root was readily
available, it would not be appreciated- this is where journeying to Africa
makes the difference and then, just barely…

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>

The roots are mostly wood. No one eats the roots. Rootbark, yes.
Rootbark
extract, yes. ibogaine, yes. But, it is like everything else you have to
know
your product and what you are doing with it.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 14, 2004 at 2:13:02 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,

Fresh root is ‘active’ unlike the rootbark that’s dried and then shipped
overseas… you put it in your mouth and it starts gnawing away like
microscopic tazmanian devils. Dried ‘rootbark’ becomes pretty nasty if you
chew a small piece for a little while- and you’ll realize that the
bitterness clings on way after you rinsed your mouth a few times- but fresh
root is so much more than that and I would say that within 3 or 4
‘swallows’, maybe 15-20 mins, you start feeling the oncoming onslaught of
psychedelic effects… And you know that this stuff is serious, because on
one hand, it is the most vilest-tasting substance on the planet but a few
minutes after downing a spoonful or so you’re in complete awe as to how
clean your mouth is… Another thing, I cleaned out my colon in a 30 second
session- I’m not going to ever forget the time I went to the bathroom and
came out quite a bit thinner around the mid-section…. it also releases a
lot of fumes that rise up and makes breathing extremely unpleasant.. it felt
like Drano- stuff that unplugs the sink…

But for what its worth, I believe that even if fresh root was readily
available, it would not be appreciated- this is where journeying to Africa
makes the difference and then, just barely…

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>

The roots are mostly wood. No one eats the roots. Rootbark, yes.
Rootbark
extract, yes. ibogaine, yes. But, it is like everything else you have to
know
your product and what you are doing with it.

Howard

From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy
Date: March 14, 2004 at 1:54:48 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bro, no idea what you’re talking about or what that message means, or
where it is from?

All of the web pages you listed of Sara’s load with no trouble.

Peace out,
Curtis

On Sat, 13 Mar 2004 16:28:56 -0800 Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
I have no idea,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 maart 2004 1:08
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy

In a message dated 3/13/04 10:42:19 PM, dana@cures-not-wars.org
writes:

who wrote the following cut off access to Sara’s website, so there’s

no way for anyone else on the thread to check it out for themselves.

May Sara wants to respond as well.

Who cut off access to Sara’s website?

http://www.iboga.tk/

http://www.canna-lympics.org/projects/pages/latest_info.htm

They seem to be up. What page is down?

Howard

/]=————————————————————-
——–=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=————————————————————-
——–=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
https://www.hushmail.com/services.php?subloc=messenger&l=434

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https://www.hushmail.com/about.php?subloc=affiliate&l=427

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy
Date: March 13, 2004 at 7:28:56 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have no idea,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 maart 2004 1:08
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy

In a message dated 3/13/04 10:42:19 PM, dana@cures-not-wars.org writes:

Could you write some kind of point-by-point response to the
following. Now I see what’s wrong with these people–it’s like Peter
Cohen at the DPA. “I’m against having them quit.” (BTW, the person
who wrote the following cut off access to Sara’s website, so there’s
no way for anyone else on the thread to check it out for themselves.
May Sara wants to respond as well.

Who cut off access to Sara’s website?

http://www.iboga.tk/

http://www.canna-lympics.org/projects/pages/latest_info.htm

They seem to be up. What page is down?

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy
Date: March 13, 2004 at 7:08:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/13/04 10:42:19 PM, dana@cures-not-wars.org writes:

Could you write some kind of point-by-point response to the
following. Now I see what’s wrong with these people–it’s like Peter
Cohen at the DPA. “I’m against having them quit.” (BTW, the person
who wrote the following cut off access to Sara’s website, so there’s
no way for anyone else on the thread to check it out for themselves.
May Sara wants to respond as well.

Who cut off access to Sara’s website?

http://www.iboga.tk/

http://www.canna-lympics.org/projects/pages/latest_info.htm

They seem to be up. What page is down?

Howard

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: Enlightened Drug Policy
Date: March 13, 2004 at 5:41:49 PM EST
To: Ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Patrick, so Someone:

Dana/cnw

PROGRAMS

Dr. Gerritt van Santen, chief physician for the mental health branch of the city’s health department, says his department’s specialty is “offering care for care avoiding people.” He believes that it is essential to understand addiction as a “mental disorder characterized by aninability to put intention into action. This is a consensus you need before you can develop any policy.” He said in the 1980’s the city first tried to refer addicts to traditional psychiatrists who did not want to get involved. Eventually the city gave up on this approach and set up its own system of shared care with the local general practitioners (physicians) who see the more stable addicts while the public system of integrated care sees the more difficult clients that can’t be handled by the G.P.s. Only classic dual diagnosis patients are referred to psychiatrists (i.e. schizophrenia and drug addiction). A high proportion of addicts are mental patients or have multiple illness.

Today, three units of the city’s mental health department deal with various aspects of the addict’s behaviour and care. The Ambulant Medical Team under the direction of Theo Sluijs does outreach, acts as an intermediary between drug users and hospitals, runs boarding houses and shelter beds for homeless addicts, and provides medical service and methadone in the jails for addicts at the daily request of the police. It also runs projects to provide care for addicts illegally in the country and to respond to addicts who create a noise or disturbance on the streets. The Care Coordination Unit deals with hard to handle addicts who cause problems in the community such as those who are mentally ill, refuse treatment or have multiple medical problems. This unit is “responsible to neighbours not just the patient,” according to Theo Sluijs. When neighbours call the police, for example, this unit’s responsibility is to coordinate with the police and treatment providers to develop a program to deal with the individual’s problem within three months. The third unit includes the five outpatient clinics, needle exchange program, seven safe consumption rooms and the scientific medical heroin trial program.

TREATMENT

The approach to treatment is one primarily of low threshold substitution rather than abstinence-oriented programs. Van Santen said, “effective treatment is not detox and inpatient treatment but is long-term pharmacotherapy … [to] reduce criminal behaviour, public nuisance and disorder.” Methadone is the first choice for substitution and is available on demand. He said it shows good results for heroin users with a rate of 60% remission after one year. This statistic means that users are not cut off methadone if they test positive for continuing use of heroin or cocaine. The goal is to find a sufficient dose over a length of time that will reduce at first and ultimately eliminate the need for illegal narcotic use. The health department believes this approach reduces the harm to the community as the need to steal to finance the drug habit is reduced and reduces the harm to the addict from the threat of disease and overdose associated with illegal narcotic use. About 2700 addicts are annually treated with pharmacotherapy by the department. Most receive methadone while others, particularly cocaine addicts receive another substitution drug such as benzodiazepine, librium , valium or ritalin for cocaine use.

He said there are 14 detox beds in the city with a maximum stay of five days used primarily to stabilize addicts. There are very few beds for inpatient abstinence oriented treatment. He said it is a very expensive approach that can handle very few people at a time. Their experience isonly 5% are clean and sober two years after discharge. Many of their addict population have been repeatedly through this type of treatment without success. For the younger addict who has been using for under one year he believes it can work with an intense, highly individualized program but for the older or long-term addict he believes drug use is part of a lifestyle that must be changed before abstinence based treatment will work. He said substitution deals with the craving for the drug but then you still have to deal with “the patient’s lifestyle and retarded development” and social de-integration. It is the lifestyle that the coordinated response seeks to build up so that through the combination of substitution and support the patient is less harm to himself and the surrounding community in terms of his public behaviour and criminal activity.(Further details and statistics on Amsterdam’s approach in Attachment 1)

Van Santen said most of the addicts seen in Amsterdam are heroin users with most cocaine users also using heroin so the treatment approach focuses on heroin addiction. He said many of their heroin users began as cocaine addicts and he is not sure that cocaine use is really a separate type of serious addiction. He said the average age of the city’s addicts is 40 years old and that they are not attracting new young addicts into the scene because of their highly medicalized approach and the image promoted through their education and prevention school programs that drugs are for losers. There is much greater concern about the alarming rise in alcohol use by young people. Sluijs contradicted this somewhat by saying he is alarmed at the skyrocketing trend to crack cocaine which their present treatment methods aren’t set up to deal with…”

“For some years judges have been allowed to offer addicts convicted of crimes related to their addiction drug treatment instead of jail. Many choose jail. Police Commissioner Jules Somers said that although the drug helping system and the harm reduction approach has succeeded for many addicts there is still an intractable group who cause the most trouble. He said, “The harm reduction policy is working for the addict but not working to solve crime. The health condition of these people is good but they still commit crime… . For a certain group the methadone and health approach doesn’t work. For those that it does work, that’s O.K. for me.”

He said that a recent survey of crime in Amsterdam showed that 36,000 people committed 267,000 crimes over the past three years but 1200 of those people were responsible for 42,000 crimes in the inner city where the drug addicts are concentrated. In other words, less than two tenths of one percent (.15%) of the city population is responsible for 16% of all crime. He said because of the problems associated with this group of intractable addicts the Dutch Parliament recently passed a law to be proclaimed this fall called “SOV” (Skufrechterlijhe Ofrang Verslaufden) which means “Penal Addiction Treatment Centre”. It will force addicts who have been convicted of five or more offences in a year related to their addiction and who refuse voluntary drug treatment to go to a special prison for mandatory abstinence oriented drug treatment for two years. Somers said SOV will apply to about 5% of addicts. The police, he said, wanted it to apply to a bigger group but that it was contrary to the Dutch harm reduction policy so the criteria of five convictions and refusal of treatment was established. He said, “The way to this decision has taken a long time.” He said despite their problems he does not believe their policies have increased the number of addicts or attracted them from elsewhere.

Somers said the police concentrate their efforts on the drug dealers and there are strict penalties for dealing with sentences ranging from several months to several years in jail. Addicts found in possession of more than a small amount also get convictions and sentences, he said…”

http://www.city.vancouver.bc.ca/ctyclerk/c…00926/drugs.htm

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Enlightened Drug Policy
Date: March 13, 2004 at 2:48:47 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Fri, Mar 12, 2004 at 07:42:48AM -0800], [Steven Anker] wrote:

| I’ve always had a dream about those wild Bush twins… “That’s a cute name,
| Bush.” Perhaps their addictions will get a little out of hand. They seem
| perfect for St. Kitts. I think it would be fun to have hot sex with them
| after ibo… and then meet the dad with that knowing look in my eye of I
| fucked your daughter, sir. “May I call you dad?” Patrick, please help me
| out.

Steven, I’d love to. We are, after all, only here to HELP people.

Now then, just get one of your psychiatrists to do some creative writing
and submit a short story — no longer than 12 single-spaced pages —
explaining your URGENT MEDICAL NEED for this procedure. And follow it up
with a short note from your probation occifer.

Something cheerful and upbeat, like, “Steven is doing real good. He
hasn’t been arrested in months. We are all very proud of him. Steven is
allowed to travel as long as he is under the supervision of a grown-up at
all times. I want my money now.” Whoopsie, no, wait, that last sentence
goes OUTSIDE the quotes! My bad.

I must commend you on giving ample thought to your aftercare, but point
out that perhaps you haven’t thought it through COMPLETELY. It might be
EXTREMELY CATHARTIC is you also provide an urgent and immediate, medical
need for Britney Spears. I don’t think she’s a dopefiend or crackhead,
but she is obviously completely fucking crazy, and really hot too. The
only part I can’t understand is that awful noise which is always playing
in the background when she appears on teleBizshuN. But you hit the [MUTE]
button, and everything is all-good.

| PS: Patrick, stop being such a hippie pussy.

Okay … I’m confused. That’s alright because I’ve spent most of my life
living in a state of shock, in the country of confusion … but how do I
react…? Am I Extremely Honored, or Deeply Insulted…? I mean, I know
that this gets filed under, “Male Bonding,” but…

None of this is my programming. I didn’t grow up listening to Hendrix and
The Beatles mahn … I grew up in Spanish Harlem, with the whole entire
NWA Music to Kill Cops to, collection pumping down the block at volume
30…

What’s happening to me? Make it stop! Whitelight molecules seem to
ReSeT, things … and stuff. All the boundaries keep getting changed and
rearranged. Who am I? What am I? Where am I?

Asking to be lynched if I ever said any of this in my neighborhood.

Peace, love, whitelight molecules mahn! At least half the time I actually
believe this too.

Please kill me.

Pardon me, gotta go have a nervous breakdown … no worries, it happens at
least three times a week.

Patrick

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] A Student Aid Ban For Past Drug Use Is Creating A Furor
Date: March 13, 2004 at 2:37:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v04/n419/a09.html

Pubdate: Sat, 13 Mar 2004
Source: New York Times (NY)
Copyright: 2004 The New York Times Company
Contact: letters@nytimes.com
Website: http://www.nytimes.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/298
Author: Greg Winter
See: http://www.ssdp.org/ http://efsdp.org/hea/
Bookmark: http://www.mapinc.org/hea.htm (Higher Education Act)
Bookmark: http://www.mapinc.org/people/Mark+Souder

A STUDENT AID BAN FOR PAST DRUG USE IS CREATING A FUROR

Given that she had been thrown out of the house by 13 for declaring herself
a lesbian, spent her teenage years sleeping on subway trains and rotting
piers and yet still managed to get her G.E.D., Laura Melendez figured she
had kept her nose pretty clean.

Sure, there had been a few arrests for smoking marijuana, but after an
entire adolescence spent on the streets, with far more visits by the police
than by her parents, what did those offenses really amount to?

“It means I’ll be denied an education,” said Ms. Melendez, who is from the
Bronx, now 22 and applying to college.

If Ms. Melendez had been an armed robber, a rapist, even a murderer, she
would not be in the same predicament. Once out of prison, she would have
been entitled to government grants and loans, no questions asked.

But under a contentious provision of federal law, tens of thousands of
would-be college students have been denied financial aid because of drug
offenses, even though the crimes may have been committed long ago and the
sentences already served.

“It is absurd on the face of it,” said Representative Mark Souder,
Republican of Indiana.

Mr. Souder, who wrote the law, says the Clinton and Bush administrations
have both turned it on its head, taking a penalty meant to discourage
current students from experimenting with drugs and using it to punish
people trying to get their lives back on track.

“I am an evangelic Christian who believes in repentance, so why would I
have supported that?” he said. “Why would any of us in Congress?”

The aid prohibition has been a sore point since its enactment in 1998,
inciting debate and recriminations all around. Members of Congress have
accused the Clinton and Bush administrations of distorting the law’s
intent. The Education Department has fired back, saying Congress handed it
a vague and sloppy law – one referring simply to “a student who has been
convicted” of a drug offense – that the department is faithfully enforcing.

Students are equally perplexed. After serving almost 10 years in prison for
attempted murder, Jason Bell went straight to college on federal grants and
loans. Now a senior at San Francisco State University, he helps other
ex-convicts enroll in the university but often has the hardest time
assisting drug offenders whose crimes were minor, certainly a lot less
serious than his.

“It’s a form of double jeopardy,” said Mr. Bell, 32. “They do the time, but
then there are still roadblocks when they finish. I don’t believe people
should be punished twice.”

Some members of Congress say they are pushing to rewrite the law for
precisely that reason. And, for the first time since the prohibition took
effect, the president’s budget includes a commitment to revise it – not to
throw it out, but to narrow its scope so that students like Ms. Melendez
get a second chance.

“It would really take a lot off my mind,” she said. “I need to go to
school. I can’t just leave it like this.”

Yet the changes would perpetuate what some members of Congress see as the
law’s contradictions. Under President Bush’s language, anyone who violated
drug laws before going to college could get financial aid, regardless of
the offense. That would be in keeping with Mr. Bush’s philosophy, as laid
out in his State of the Union address, that “when the gates of the prison
open, the path ahead should lead to a better life.”

But those already in college when they commit a drug offense, however
small, would still be stripped of aid, for at least a year. The idea,
supporters say, is to continue trying to dissuade students from using
drugs, especially since they are being educated with taxpayer money.

The problem, detractors say, is that the law would still impose stiffer
penalties on drug use than on any other crime.

“We should abolish the whole rule,” said Representative Barney Frank,
Democrat of Massachusetts. “Not that we should encourage drug use, but you
shouldn’t single that out as being worse than rape or arson or armed robbery.”

Representative Souder doubts that the prospect of losing financial aid
would deter a murderer or a rapist, but says the same threat does a lot
when it comes to drug use. Some student counselors agree, arguing that at
times, students wrestling with substance abuse need an extra incentive to
stay clean.

Critics, however, have an additional complaint: that the proposed changes
would have the odd effect of barring some first-time, minor offenders from
getting financial aid while restoring it for more serious drug lawbreakers.

By his own count, Donald Miller, a 53-year-old freshman at York College in
Queens, was arrested 17 times for abusing drugs and occasionally selling
them, a result of what he describes as a fruitless effort to quiet his
schizophrenia. It left him homeless and addicted.

Now that Mr. Miller is sober and taking his medications regularly, he has
been confronted by the discouraging news that he is not eligible for
financial aid despite living on less than $600 a month. But under the new
rules, he almost certainly would be.

“It would mean that I could continue all the way through school,” he said.

On the other hand, there is the case of Marisa Garcia, a junior at
California State University, Fullerton. A few weeks before her freshman
year began, Ms. Garcia received a ticket for having a small marijuana pipe
in her car. (It had some ashes in it, she admits.)

That was her first and only offense. Accordingly, she paid a $415 fine. But
she also lost her federal grants and loans for a year, amounting to
thousands of dollars. Under the revised rules, her penalty would be no
different.

“It doesn’t make sense,” Ms. Garcia said. “To punish someone by taking away
their education? It’s counterproductive.”

The law does allow students to win back their aid by going through drug
treatment. But when Ms. Garcia looked into that option, all she could find
was residential counseling that cost as much as her tuition.

“If I couldn’t afford to pay for school,” she said, “then how was I
supposed to pay for these programs?”

Congressional supporters of the drug prohibition argue that students should
obey the law or surrender the privilege of financial aid. But they also
contend that the aid prohibition was never meant to punish people for bad
choices they made long ago. Given the way the law has been applied, Mr.
Souder says, students who have been denied aid because of offenses
committed before they were in college should consider suing the government.

“I know as a conservative I’m not supposed to say this, but there are
lawsuits to be had here,” he said.

The Education Department strongly disagrees, contending that the statute
Congress passed does nothing to distinguish between past and current
offenses. By clarifying it, lawmakers hope to eliminate the confusion that
has surrounded it since its inception. But others worry that as long as
financial aid forms continue to ask whether students have had a drug
conviction, many will simply assume that they are ineligible.

“There’s so much confusion about this law, and it ends up discouraging
people from moving forward with their lives,” said Michael Dean, a
substance abuse counselor in Denver. “At what point in our society do we
say that a person has paid their debt?”
– —
MAP posted-by: Jay Bergstrom

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] absinthe and ibogaine
Date: March 13, 2004 at 11:12:37 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If only ibogaine were being sold by the ton, in 75 years or so the Swiss
government might reverse its decision and allow ibogaine to be imported. Don’t
hold you breath.

Howard

ORIGINAL MESSAGE

Swiss government supports end to absinthe ban

GENEVA (AFP) – The Swiss government approved draft
legislation to end a ban on absinthe, the mythical
herbal liqueur beloved of turn-of-the-century artists
and blamed for driving some of them mad.

Political debate has been ongoing in the Alpine
country since last year over the green spirit, which
is thought to be bootlegged in moderate quantities
here but was outlawed in 1908, after a factory worker
killed his wife and two children in a bout of madness
blamed on the drink.

Absinthe was allowed back into shops in much of
western Europe in 1981 after the European Union (news
– web sites) passed a directive which overturned bans
in many countries.

Although the law was later eased in non-EU member
Switzerland, the drink nicknamed the “green fairy” has
remained outlawed in its high-proof form recognized as
real absinthe.

The federal Swiss government said in a report that the
1908 ban no longer was justified, since the quantities
of thuyone — the substance in absinthe considered
dangerous — were now clearly regulated in the drink.

Legalizing it would actually enable authorities to
control the production of the alcohol and tax its
sales, it said.

The fabled aura surrounding absinthe, immortalized in
poems by Charles Baudelaire and paintings by Edgar
Degas and Pablo Picasso, could also be dispelled if it
were no longer illegal, the government concluded.

Pro-legalization camps in Switzerland have touted the
economic benefits of the drink for the isolated Val de
Travers in the western canton of Neufchatel, which
claims to be the birthplace of the alcohol made from
wormwood.

About 15,000 litres of absinthe are thought to be
distilled illegally in the Val de Travers every year.
Most of the locals drink it diluted with water, when
it turns into a milky-white colour.

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] LollapoJohnWaltersCircusTour
Date: March 12, 2004 at 9:24:29 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The dates and locations of the meetings are:

Chicago, IL, March 16, 2004. 9am-5pm
(Radisson Hotel Schaumburg, 1725 Algonquin Road)

Fresno, CA, March 18, 2004. 9am-5pm
(Fresno Convention Center, 848 M Street)

Atlanta, GA, March 25, 2004. 9am-5pm
(Holiday Inn, 450 Capitol Avenue)

Denver, CO, April 8, 2004. 9am-5pm
(Executive Tower Hotel, 1405 Curtis Street)

You can RSVP for the summits at http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/ctt.asp?u=23625&l=21663 .

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] drudge
Date: March 12, 2004 at 8:18:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dana, the reason Matt Drudge linked the deborah and
patrick story was because it was a great story, it was
emotional and personal, but sane and did the best job
of explaining ibogaine I have seen since JAMA. Except
JAMA is something most people don’t know about and
they have to read it instead of watching TV. It was a
great story even if you don’t know what ibogaine is,
now you do. No matter what you think of Patrick and
Mash and I know Patrick is your friend so you can’t be
that upset by it, it was the best ibogaine piece I
have seen aired.

If you start harassing Matt Drudge with all the things
you do, I am sure the only result will be that he will
never, ever show any interest in ibogaine again. It’s
not going to make him put your name on the front page
of his site.

I don’t think that all you do is cause problems, I
think Patrick’s message was true and you do a lot of
good but hassling someone who has already done
something for ibogaine and making them associate
ibogaine with crazies is not helping anyone! Not even
you, because he’s not going to do a story on you or
put it on his site! Please leave him alone!

Carla B

— Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org> wrote:
Preston wrote:
Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not
Kerry. A Conservative
Republican.
I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.<

Putting aside my own belief that there really isn’t
any dif between the
Republicrats and Democans, the above is really
rather depressing, pointed
out in such blunt fashion too. But oh so true too.
Wonder what promted that
in Drudge- the titillating factor about a
hallucinoggen for addiction?
Peace,
Preston

Is there a way to ask him?

Dana/cnw

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search – Find what youre looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] (Sorta ot) Fw: [drugwar] DRUG CONTROL POLICY: Drug czar critical of marijuana initiative
Date: March 12, 2004 at 7:57:00 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
A bit of a rant for a Friday evening. Then a bit of a laugh at Walters’
expense, although he is the one with the “power” one might say, which kinda
sucks, but hey, I must take our laughs where I can get ’em.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 5:04 PM
Subject: Re: [drugwar] DRUG CONTROL POLICY: Drug czar critical of marijuana
initiative

(the article below has this quote >”I believe drug pushers would think
it’s a free-for-all if they legalize
marijuana,” Brymer said. “It’s the drug teens focus on, and it’s the drug
that leads to meth.”<

Oh yeah, I remember it well, the day pot took me by the hand and lead me
down that treacherous slippery slope to methamphetamines, which were
waiting
at the bottom of the hill by the bus stop, wearing galoshes and skipping
around in the puddles on a warm and rainy day…errr. wait a minute, I
think
that was Mary Poppins actually, not methamphetamines. Sorry, nope, I only
spent a week or two playing around with methamphetamines, while living in
London, and it sure weren’t pot that had a single thing to do with my
experimentation. (And it was shooting methamphetamines there in London
that
introduced me to the phenomenon of the “dirty hit,” where one shoots a
teeny
tiny morsel of dust, or lint, or cotton, or cut in the drugs into one’s
vein, whereby the foreign substance enters and ends up causing migraines,
nausea, and the wish that god would simply come and take one away as the
pain and misery of a dirty hit is the worst feeling (one that goes on and
on, all night long in my own case, right through til the next afternoon
when
I was finally able to walk upright, sorta, down the street to a dealer’s
place and cop a bag of dope- which is the surefire cure for a dirty hit by
the way- simply do a shot of heroin and voila- not more
headaches/crawlingskin/wish to die sensations.
But anyway, the point is that pot never, not while smoking it, eating
it, looking at it, thinking about it, wanting it, looking for it, etc,
never
ever never not once made me think, “Hey, methamphetamines would sure be
fun
now, let’s get some.”
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Tami Halphen
To: radio-free-america ; Houston NORML ; drugwar@mindvox.com ; DPFT
Sent: Friday, March 12, 2004 3:02 PM
Subject: [drugwar] DRUG CONTROL POLICY: Drug czar critical of marijuana
initiative

Friday, March 12, 2004
Copyright © Las Vegas Review-Journal
DRUG CONTROL POLICY: Drug czar critical of marijuana initiative
John Walters calls measure foolhardy
By JULIET V. CASEY
REVIEW-JOURNAL

(Picture – John Walters, director of the White House National Office on
Drug
Control Policy, speaks Thursday at the WestCare Nevada Center for Women
and
Children, where he criticized Nevada’s latest initiative to legalize
possession of marijuana. Photo by Clint Karlsen.)

The nation’s drug czar described as foolhardy Thursday the latest Nevada
initiative to legalize marijuana.
John Walters, in Las Vegas to push for a crackdown on the abuse of
prescriptions drugs, said legalizing marijuana is “not an area for
legitimate debate.”
Walters, who oversees all federal anti-drug programs and spending, said
studies have shown that 60 percent of the 7 million Americans who need
treatment for addiction are dependent on marijuana. Walters also said
people
are killing each other by driving under the influence of the drug, which
is
smoked or chewed for its euphoric effect.
“Legalizing any marijuana possession for consumption is fundamentally
detrimental,” he said. The Committee to Regulate and Control Marijuana,
established in Nevada this year by the national Marijuana Policy Project,
will try to make Nevada the first state in the nation to legalize
possession
of marijuana.
Bruce Mirken, a spokesman for the Marijuana Policy Project, contended
people
seeking treatment for marijuana addiction were forced into it.
“They were arrested for possession and offered treatment or jail,” he
said.
“It’s Orwellian to the point of being creepy, and it’s misleading to the
public.”
The 2002 campaign, called Nevadans for Responsible Law Enforcement,
qualified a petition with 110,000 signatures seeking to legalize
possession
of up to 3 ounces of marijuana. But a coalition of law enforcement and
citizens groups blocked its passage, with 61 percent of voters opposing
the
measure and only 39 percent supporting it.
The new proposal calls for legalizing possession of 1 ounce of marijuana
and
would increase penalties for vehicular manslaughter and delivery of
marijuana to a minor.
The initiative would impose penalties of up to 10 years in prison for
first-time offenders and life in prison for second-time offenders
convicted
of delivering marijuana to a minor. It also would impose a minimum penalty
of five years to life in prison for anyone convicted of vehicular
manslaughter while driving under the influence of alcohol or any
controlled
substance.
But even with the increased penalties, Clark County Sheriff Bill Young
would
oppose the measure. “Sixty to 70 percent of the crimes committed in the
county emanates from drug use or abuse,” he said.
If the initiative qualifies for the November ballot and passes, it would
have to pass again in 2006 to become part of the constitution.
Jennifer Knight, a spokeswoman for the Committee to Regulate and Control
Marijuana, said the country’s drug czar is defending a system that is
keeping marijuana use high among teens.
“Walters represents what is wrong with our current system,” she said. “He
keeps supporting current marijuana laws that don’t work. Now, he is coming
here to Nevada to tell us how to vote on a state initiative while ignoring
his own report that shows that 67 percent of teens in Nevada have tried
marijuana. Where is his solution?”
Walters, during his speech to a small gathering at the WestCare Nevada
Center for Women and Children, a nonprofit treatment facility for
substance
abusers, said his administration is working closely with the Drug
Enforcement Agency to eradicate domestic production of marijuana, much of
which is grown on public land.
He said he also is working with Mexico to stem the flow of opium, poppies
and marijuana into the country, and with Canada, where more potent
marijuana
is being grown.
But Candice Kidd, director of the WestCare women’s campus, said a greater
problem in Nevada is methamphetamine, a stimulant that increases energy
and
decreases appetite.
“Methamphetamine seems the be the drug of choice for a lot of women,” she
said, adding 90 percent of the women in her programs are addicted to the
drug.
Walters said his administration is teaming up with law enforcement
organizations to target methamphetamine mass producers, which often are
run
by organized crime, motorcycle gangs and operations in Mexico.
“We’re not so much going after people who just cook it for themselves,” he
said.
Walters said his war on drugs is about public health and safety and is
balancing measures to eradicate drugs with treatment for people addicted
to
them.
Tamara Brymer, a 26-year-old recovering methamphetamine addict at WestCare
who heard Walters speak, said she was pleased to hear he is focusing on
treatment.
As a teen she experimented with marijuana before discovering her drug of
choice.
“I believe drug pushers would think it’s a free-for-all if they legalize
marijuana,” Brymer said. “It’s the drug teens focus on, and it’s the drug
that leads to meth.”
Knight said the 2004 Marijuana Initiative will reduce teen use by taking
marijuana off the streets and regulating it. The initiative also would tax
the sale of marijuana, dedicating revenue to drug and alcohol treatment
and
education.

Tammera Halphen
http://www.radio-free-america.org
Cannabis friendly music, free speech, comedy

<]=———————————————————————–=[

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 12, 2004 at 3:58:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Has anyone tried that type of liver cleans? It looks pretty nasty.

I did, as reported in later mail:

http://www.curezone.com/cleanse/liver/default.asp

I could be mistaken (it’s been only 2 days), but the liver cleanse
seems to have helped me with some old unresolved anger. And as a
side attraction, it compares somewhat to the external aspects of
the iboga experience (1-2 weeks prep, then drinking epsom salts
and olive oil and still processing it the next day :-).

It went pretty smoothly, the epsom salts in apple juice required
a small effort but no major force of will to drink, and I was
afraid that the olive oil would be hard to drink, but it was easy
and I almost wanted more. I plan to repeat every 2 weeks until
there are no more stones (or until I conclude that the stones are
really congealed olive oil :-). My skin feels softer, and my attitude
toward life seems more flexible. I still have the sore spot in my
mid/upper spine that led a healer to suggest the cleanse (“your liver is
supported by that vertebra”), but am hopeful it will go when the
stones stop coming.

Nick wrote:
it’s good to drink a litre of apple juice a day (organic and
pressed if you can afford it) for at least ten days before actually taking
the epson salts and the oil/juice/black walnut tincture mix.

Good point about the apple juice (the pectin in it is supposed to soften
the stones for passage out of the body). Minor correction: the tincture
is taken as prep during the week or two before the cleanse, so the apple
juice would be taken during the same period. I used the ‘clarkia’ product
for the tincture after an initial period of the self-assembled version
(got tired of cleaning ground cloves from coffee grinder). Thanks for the
pointer to the intestinal cleanse (www.ariseandshine.com) – checking it
out now.

Bill

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 12, 2004 at 4:08:48 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Howard,

It’s been about 8 months since I last took ibogaine.

I wasn’t aware of tension in my neck before ibogaine, although a
chiropracter had once commented on how tense my neck was before ibogine.
I
didn’t notice it myself.

As for anger, I mostly only feel that way when I’m in a situation I feel
stressed, or under pressure like at work. It seems more extreem than
before.

In my last ibogaine experience I had visions of birth and felt the
sensation
of my head being squashed and it felt like very deep tension was being
released. I had an incredible anger in me as a child and I remember that
I
always supressed my emotions. it feels like there are alot of feelings
pushing to be resolved.

Luke

Hi Luke,

Frankly, what I’d do is as much of the above as I could afford. It’ll be
great. Plenty of people in groups take years to even feel anger! You’re
blessed!

Nick

From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 12, 2004 at 12:10:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Has anyone tried that type of liver cleans? It looks pretty nasty.

Luke

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 01:53:30 -0800 (PST)

> It is my feeling that you need another dose of Ibogaine
>
> It would get that anger , which manifest in the liver organ, to be released.
> magnesium sulphate cleansing can help that too.

Here’s a liver cleanse involving timed doses of epsom salts and olive
oil and a dramatic outcome (pictures included):

http://www.curezone.com/cleanse/liver/default.asp

Bill

_________________________________________________________________
STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
Date: March 12, 2004 at 12:02:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Don’t forget their metabolites as per what the liver will do to them.
Both
ibogaine and 18-mc have desmethylated metabolites. Most likely so do all
of
the iboga alkaloids. That gives us 24 drug profiles just as a beginning.

Oh yeah, good point…

and, as far as i know, there hasn’t been much study done on the
non-ibogaine iboga alkaloids, so some of them could conceivably be
metabolised into more than 1 active metabolite…

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] speaking of health care,
Date: March 12, 2004 at 11:46:58 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Howard,

It’s good to know that in some places people do have good health care.

You can change England and Wales , to Holland and Sweden, Or Israel and
Egypt.

Good Luck,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 maart 2004 4:57
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] speaking of health care,

Dear Sara,

I am poor (no money that is) and very thankful I live in NYC where I
received
fantastic medical care for leukemia. I am in remission approaching four
years at this time. I have always had luck with good doctors. I guess if
you are
going to get good medical care NYC is as good a place as any.

Howard

In a message dated 3/11/04 9:46:29 PM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

Wednesday March 10, 2004
The Guardian

Rich people are more likely to survive cancer than poor people in England
and Wales, and the gulf in their life chances has been steadily widening,
according to research released yesterday.

The prognosis for most cancers has been improving but an international
team
of researchers backed by Cancer Research UK revealed yesterday that it
is
the affluent who are profiting the most from today’s faster diagnosis and
better treatment, while the prospects for the poor lag years behind. If
all
cancer patients were equal, an extra 3,000 lives could be saved every five
years, they estimate.

Their analysis of data from the English and Welsh cancer registries,
published yesterday in the British Journal of Cancer, reveals the
seriousness of the health divide. While the government pointed out that
its
national cancer plan was published just after the period for which we have
survival figures, the widening of the socio-economic gulf over the previous
15 years, in spite of initiatives to address health inequalities, bodes
ill.

Most shocking was the disparity in the survival rates of men five years
after a diagnosis at some point between 1996 and 1999 of cancer of the
larynx. The gap between rich and poor was 17.2%. For men diagnosed with
cancer of the rectum, the gap was 9.4% and for women 8.3%, for women with
cancer of the colon it was 7.3% and for women with myeloma it was 7.7%.

“We have evidence of trends in survival which are, generally speaking,
very
good news,” said Michel Coleman, professor of epidem
iology at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine and leader
of
the team, “but for 28 of those 33 cancers [16 were studied in men and 17
in
women] there is a substantial difference between rich and poor and it has
been getting worse.”

It appeared from their data on 2.2 million adult patients that trends in
deprivation were linked to trends in survival. “Where survival is
increasing, deprivation is also increasing,” said Professor Coleman. In
men,
he said, “a 5% gain in survival is on average associated with a 1.5%
worsening in the deprivation gap”. In women, the gap appeared to increase
at
the slightly slower rate of 1% for every 5% improvement in survival
overall.

The reason for the lower survival rates of poorer people are not to do
with
less access to newer, more expensive drugs, say the researchers. Nor is
it
to do with access to a particular hospital, since all see a mixture of
classes. They do not know exactly what is happening, but speculate that
the
worst off are not getting diagnosed as fast or treated as well as the
affluent.

Rich people are quicker to go to the doctor when they suspect something
is
wrong and know how to demand attention.

“We don’t have hard evidence that the issue of stridency, or if you like
communication and demanding approaches to doctors, underpins differences
in
survival, but there is evidence the rich and poor do get diagnosed at
slightly different stages of disease,” Professor Coleman said.

“Maybe the firmness with which patients address the healthcare system does
have an impact.”

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 12, 2004 at 11:43:44 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara said it but from what I know: the liver produces bile, which
classically is associated with anger (it’s an old synonym for it).
Bile is stored in the gall bladder (gall being a synonym for
aggression/chutzpah) and is supposedly released to neutralize
stomach acid for digestion of oils and proteins. This according
to:

http://www.curezone.com/cleanse/liver/default.asp

thanks very much =)

i never made that association before…

another thing that’s very good for liver cleansing, and perhaps then for
dealing with pent up anger as well, is beetroot juice. it’s pretty tasty
too.. very sweet.. =)

From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Nixon in China
Date: March 12, 2004 at 10:42:48 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston wrote:
Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not Kerry. A Conservative Republican. I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.

Nor will they.

The most enlighted drug policy was under Nixon as he was under enormous strain to bring crime rates down. He was practical. Treatment on demand and methadone were all part of his policy. The irony is also that he started the drug war. Howard was on the O’Reiley Factor and Bill the fascist seemed very receptive to both Howard and ibo. The dems are scared and will probablly never be behind a powerful psychedelic for treating addiction. At least not at first. I have often felt that if change is going to happen, it’ll be from the right. Those guys care about money and some of them still believe in personal freedom. McCain anyone? Nancy Reagan could be a powerful voice, she supports stem-cell. Only because of Ronnie needing it, but still. Didn’t some of her kids have a sex and drugs and rock ‘n roll side? Yeah of course they did.

I’ve always had a dream about those wild Bush twins… “That’s a cute name, Bush.” Perhaps their addictions will get a little out of hand. They seem perfect for St. Kitts. I think it would be fun to have hot sex with them after ibo… and then meet the dad with that knowing look in my eye of I fucked your daughter, sir. “May I call you dad?” Patrick, please help me out.

_________________________________________________________________
Fast. Reliable. Get MSN 9 Dial-up – 3 months for the price of 1! (Limited-time Offer) http://click.atdmt.com/AVE/go/onm00200361ave/direct/01/

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] drudge
Date: March 12, 2004 at 6:12:52 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

drudgeI’m not in contact with him, but I think someone here might be.
Perhaps they can ask him?
I can’t remember who, but I could swear someone here noted being in contact
with Drudge. It wasn’t me, I’m sure of that, but who is was I do not recall.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Dana Beal
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 10:50 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] drudge

Preston wrote:
Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not Kerry. A Conservative
Republican.
I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.<

Putting aside my own belief that there really isn’t any dif between the
Republicrats and Democans, the above is really rather depressing, pointed
out in such blunt fashion too. But oh so true too. Wonder what promted that
in Drudge- the titillating factor about a hallucinoggen for addiction?
Peace,
Preston

Is there a way to ask him?

Dana/cnw

From: laurent sazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 12, 2004 at 3:46:31 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On 11/03/04 7:33, “AG” <adamg@013.net.il> wrote:

Hi Nick,

The tea was called ‘automatique’ and I tried twice to replicate it…
boiling a whole bunch of rootbark over a low flame for a couple of hours did
not produce anything close to the pitch-black drink we were served.. my
guess is that the bwiti used some of the plant’s leaves and/or other
ingredients because rootbark on it’s own will only produce a light-tan, very
transparent tea… of course taste-wise, again, extremely unpleasant…

Maybe Laurent Sazy or Planteur can shed some light on the topic…

I’m sorry to hear that the extract is ‘moderately horrific’… I’m also up
for another ‘Operation Clean Up Your Act/Room’… but while I don’t mind the
vomiting that ensues, I can’t stomache anymore ibo directly… so I might
opt for combining the two, ie, create the extract and use the salami-wrapper
to make little, uh, ‘water-baloons’…

I’ll be sure to post the recipe along with some pics….

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
It’s moderately horrific, but nothing compared to the bark itself or the
tea. Which, by the way, does anyone out there have instructions for? I
seem
to remember you can just boil the rootbark up for a couple of hours then
strain and drink. Can anyone confirm, I’m thinking of doing some like this
soon.

I never saw gaboneses using iboga leaves.
After taking the fresh iboga from the roots , they boiled in water iboga
roots, they call it ” tête de cochon”( head of pigs), and they drink it.
Fruits are used against sterility .

Laurent/KA

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what the world needs now….
Date: March 11, 2004 at 11:45:44 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/11/04 11:32:33 PM, axisone@hushmail.com writes:

For the record I hate Patrick and Mash and Howard hasn’t really accomplished
any thing with ibogaine in who gave that figure before, 30 years?

You mean 1981 through 1997, doesn’t count. Without those years, no mash, no
glick, no noribogaine except by its original discoverer (do your own research)
and no 18-mc. I must have don’t something right.

http://www.ibogaine.org/history.html

Howard

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 11:38:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/12/04 12:12:53 AM, vector620022002@yahoo.com writes:

The bitterness of life and all that is interesting, but have any of you
having this conversation about doing iboga roots used it for a heroin
or methadone habit? Does it still work like the hydrochloride and
extract?

The roots are mostly wood. No one eats the roots. Rootbark, yes. Rootbark
extract, yes. ibogaine, yes. But, it is like everything else you have to know
your product and what you are doing with it.

Howard

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: Ibogaine.orG Organization
Date: March 11, 2004 at 11:05:45 PM EST
To: digital@phantom.com

In a message dated 3/11/04 11:15:37 PM, digital@phantom.com writes:

I will generate a .pdf of the manual. Are you running OS/X or still on
OS
9 for the Mac? I ask because I am gonna suck it into Word, and need to
know which year’s version of .doc you can deal with.

Hi Patrick. OS 9.2

Can you include the internal and external links within the html document in
the pdf. I have seen pdfs with links so I guess it is possible.

I’ll email Bill Ross on the mail everyone project.

Howard

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
Date: March 11, 2004 at 11:01:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/11/04 9:57:18 PM, jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:

I believe 12 alkaloids have been identified in Tabernanthe iboga…
ibogaine being one of them….

Jon,

Don’t forget their metabolites as per what the liver will do to them. Both
ibogaine and 18-mc have desmethylated metabolites. Most likely so do all of
the iboga alkaloids. That gives us 24 drug profiles just as a beginning.

Howard

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] speaking of health care,
Date: March 11, 2004 at 10:56:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Sara,

I am poor (no money that is) and very thankful I live in NYC where I received
fantastic medical care for leukemia. I am in remission approaching four
years at this time. I have always had luck with good doctors. I guess if you are
going to get good medical care NYC is as good a place as any.

Howard

In a message dated 3/11/04 9:46:29 PM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

Wednesday March 10, 2004
The Guardian

Rich people are more likely to survive cancer than poor people in England
and Wales, and the gulf in their life chances has been steadily widening,
according to research released yesterday.

Rich people are quicker to go to the doctor when they suspect something
is
wrong and know how to demand attention.

“Maybe the firmness with which patients address the healthcare system does
have an impact.”

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 10:52:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/11/04 9:45:41 PM, lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes:

It’s been about 8 months since I last took ibogaine.

I wasn’t aware of tension in my neck before ibogaine, although a
chiropracter had once commented on how tense my neck was before ibogine.
I
didn’t notice it myself.

As for anger, I mostly only feel that way when I’m in a situation I feel

stressed, or under pressure like at work. It seems more extreem than
before.

In my last ibogaine experience I had visions of birth and felt the sensation

of my head being squashed and it felt like very deep tension was being

released. I had an incredible anger in me as a child and I remember that
I
always supressed my emotions. it feels like there are alot of feelings
pushing to be resolved.

Dear Luke,

Based on what you are saying ibogaine did not cause either the anger or the
tension. That was an original concern of mine as anyone working with
drugs/medications/sacraments has to be aware of what is going on. Do you think another
treatment with ibogaine would be beneficial in moderating the tension and
anger? I am not going to review email to quote Nick Sandberg, among others, but
he is an advocate of bodywork and meditation, massage, etc. that are routinely
used to relieve anger and tension. I guess those may be considered by some to
be more mundane aspects of post-ibogaine therapy but, there are civilizations
built on such practices.

As you state that a chiropractor noticed the tension but, you did not,
possibly the ibogaine is now allowing you to also notice it at this time.

Wishing you well and relief from both the anger and tension.

Howard

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] drudge
Date: March 11, 2004 at 10:50:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston wrote:
>Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not Kerry. A Conservative Republican.
I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.<

Putting aside my own belief that there really isn’t any dif between the
Republicrats and Democans, the above is really rather depressing, pointed
out in such blunt fashion too. But oh so true too. Wonder what promted that
in Drudge- the titillating factor about a hallucinoggen for addiction?
Peace,
Preston

Is there a way to ask him?

Dana/cnw

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what the world needs now….
Date: March 11, 2004 at 9:31:59 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not Kerry. A Conservative
Republican.
I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.<

Putting aside my own belief that there really isn’t any dif between the
Republicrats and Democans, the above is really rather depressing, pointed
out in such blunt fashion too. But oh so true too. Wonder what promted that
in Drudge- the titillating factor about a hallucinoggen for addiction?
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: <axisone@hushmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 5:53 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what the world needs now….

Steven Anker <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
–
—-
Advocacy and yall,

Be united. Lay low on the crazy. For now… t’s ‘medicine’ and a
‘disease.’

Be vigilant about press and media coverage. Sue their fucking ass
if
they
are wrong. Companies understand money. Who are the best spokespeople
for
ibo? I like Howard, Patrick and Mash. How about you? Let the ego
go,
what is
best for the cause? Do not become right wing zealots protesting
a work
of
art unseen. Not all publicity is good.

For the record I hate Patrick and Mash and Howard hasn’t really
accomplished
any thing with ibogaine in who gave that figure before, 30 years?

Howard is at least sane, unlike Dana and the whole pot movement who I
think nobody in legit medicine is listening to. Great scam if your a
drug dealer but I havent seen the whole medical marijuana anything manage
to even get pot a drug that has never killed anyone, legal in the US.
Constant mentions of ibogaine by them is not helping anyone.

The pro-pot movement has not managed to make pot legal, a drug which
is harmless and never killed anyone. They are going to do something
with ibogaine???????? Never happen.

Nader is a asshole and its too bad but youre right. Patrick and Mash
on their own are really effective, together is more then effective, the
two of them in the same room are suddenly so human and you can relate.
Its the darth vader and evil witch lovefest. When the two of you get
it on, do you do mother theresa and jesus or the mom and son trip, which
is hotter? Ignoreing what anyone else has ever said, the two of you have
some serious energy on camera and it’s not scientist
and junkie.

Steve you work in hollywood and maybe are better at seeing what others
see when they look at the screen, but what all the peace and love,
democratics
missed is that the person who gave the Deborah and Patrick show all that
exposure by putting on the front page of the drudge report was matt
drudge.
A conservative republican who liked it so much he has hallucinogen that
cures addiction on page one of his site.

Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not Kerry. A Conservative
Republican.
I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.

Howard, Patrick, Mash. or Mash, Patrick, Howard. As long as Patrick is
in the middle to keep Mash and Howard away from each other 😉

No pro pot idiocy which is only going to make everyone ignore it. No
weird rituals in africa, no discussions about sticking root bark up your
ass. Medicine that cures a disease is right.

Best, Steve Anker

PS: Patrick, stop being such a hippie pussy.

Don’t encourage him. Patrick has either been blowing his brains out with
LSD again or having a lot of sex, he’s been calm and zen like for at
least two weeks. When that wears off, we get Darth Vader on acid.

Patrick the next message you’re going to write when you read this, don’t.
I’m sure it will move me, sweep me away, make me relate, make me believe
and up your genius ante another level. But you’ve pulled Dana’s neck
off the chopping block a few times already, he is making peace by being
nutso again and burning pirated copies of CSI’s program and offering
to give them away. I don’t want to hear it.

He may be the kooky uncle, he’s lucky to have you on his side, but he
is not a effective spokesperson for anything, not even pot. He should
move to hollywood and just be himself, forget pot and ibogaine, Dana
is enough material all in one person he doesn’t even need the weird
causes.

No matter what you write, it won’t change that. I’m sure you can write
a believable message about why black is white and make people relate
to it, but all it proves is that you’re a great communicator. It’s been
proven. Shut up now and let Dana suffer some of his own consequences
because I am so sick of the bullshit. You’re as nuts as he is but as
you yourself said, he has no off switch. You do. I don’t hear deranged
rants about tripping on LSD and lights and colors inside your head, when
you have the camera in your face. You forget all about that. Because
you turn it off. This is exactly what you said. Dana can’t turn it off.

Axis

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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Peace now. Now, peace.
Date: March 11, 2004 at 8:56:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Steve Anker wrote:
I understand that media misquotes, but in the big picture, away from that cold and miserable city, how did protesting help the cause of ibogaine? You got an old yippie to watch the show? Preaching to the choir dude

Ex-Black Panther. Charles Barron is ex-BPP, and he’s running for Mayor–and I’m talking to him about preserving some kind of location for our work here.

Last time some one got ibogaine in the Daily News was when Giuliani tried to ban methadone–and that was only a mention, misspelled “Obogaine” in 1998. The only way anybody could get it in was in a gossip column — about entertainment. But a lot of people saw it.

You guys can diss medical marijuana, but they have a much bigger movement than your’s–got it legal in 9 states, where I’m barely getting started with the New York State Assembly. And I just talked to the MMJ coordinators for Florida, who were blown away by the CSI episode, since I’ve spent years prepping everyone in the drug reform movement to be watching for it–and I put in my email newsletter, which goes to 236 cities (some on continents where there is no CBS).

The X-Files idea was not important. What I wanted Stahl to know is that I thought he did a pretty cool job. Better than Pinchbeck, who seemed to recoil at the very idea of doing any coverage of the political dimensions of our problem of getting it approved as medicine. Stahl at least has an appreciation for the dramatic impact it could have with police and prosecutors and politicians.

So far exactly three people on the list have asked for copies of the CD, so I don’t think there’s much of an issue about that. I’ll have to really work to get anyone interested. The woman in Florida will take a tape. But she also wants an Ibogaine video. They talk to advocates of treatment of addiction “across the fence”, and she has some one who’s big in mid-Florida cause his daughter’s on crack. Republican ex-CEO who believes there is no alternative to longterm therapeutic communities.The CSI episode could change his mind. I gave her Patrick’s number. Patrick, her name is Jody James, from Melbourne, and she’s tight with Ethan and Keith and all those suits– gets them to give her grants even though she dresses and sounds like me.

Did you ever see the X-Files Ibogine episode, BTW? CSI was much more scientific. But the astral projection aspect is in the literature, and in the experiences of people I’ve talked to about it.

Dana/ncw

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nader Causes Kerry to Lose, Sez Poll
Date: March 11, 2004 at 8:13:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Aron, going through your site again 😉

Love the David Peel video. Your whole site looks like
a really awful flashback. In a good way 😉

http://www.pieman.org/pageb.html

Carla B

— ARON KAY <pieman@pieman.org> wrote:
Nader Causes Kerry to Lose, Sez Polldoes anyone
think nader should be pied
ARON KAY-http://www.pieman.org
BONGS NOT BOMBS!
NO TO DUMBYA’S RAW DEAL!
BUSH OUT THE DOOR!!! ON OR BEFORE 2004!!!
<http://www.pieman.org/>
bush and ayatollah asscroft are promoting the latest
version of
kristallnacht..we culture freex must rise to defend
our diverse cultures of race, rap, rock, rainbow
and reggae music, art and dance from the jaws of the
fascist machine-which is attempting to perpetrate a
a nation of blind obedience.
we must make sure they get the glitches in their
machine so the people will prevail

—– Original Message —–
From: Dana Beal
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, March 05, 2004 3:41 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Nader Causes Kerry to Lose,
Sez Poll

Just posted this to

http://forum.johnkerry.com//index.php?showtopic=8035&hl=drug+war+thread

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search – Find what youre looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: [ibogaine] pinchbeck & santo daime
Date: March 11, 2004 at 8:11:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Pinchbeck fans and folks interested in ayahuasca churches may
enjoy this account of his visit to some Santo Daime churches
in Brazil:

http://www.santodaime.org/community/jyoti_jurua.htm

Bill

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ethnogarden
Date: March 11, 2004 at 8:09:25 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Brooke,

The owner of Ethnogarden is on this list, I think his
name is Jason? He posted really pretty photos of some
of his plants a few months ago.

Carla B

— Brooke <brooke@blue.netnation.com> wrote:
That’s where I ordered my 50g of root from.

Still haven’t used it yet…a little nervous. Has
anyone heard about
the quality levels of Ethnogarden’s traditional
supply?

Thanks in advance, dear friends

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Does anyone know if Ethnogarden is still in
business ??

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search – Find what youre looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 8:05:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

what exactly do you mean by anger manifesting in the liver?

http://www.curezone.com/cleanse/liver/default.asp

Bill

From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ethnogarden
Date: March 11, 2004 at 7:57:01 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That’s where I ordered my 50g of root from.

Still haven’t used it yet…a little nervous. Has anyone heard about
the quality levels of Ethnogarden’s traditional supply?

Thanks in advance, dear friends

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

Does anyone know if Ethnogarden is still in business ??

From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CSI on CD and D.A.R.E.
Date: March 11, 2004 at 7:28:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dana, bro is there some invisible army of yours that read this list but
never say anything? How dare anyone disagree with what Dana did!

I’m not signing off with peace out, I’m getting sick of the endless Dana
thing and Patrick please don’t add to it, yes you’re a genius yes you’ll
make it all look good and then less then a day later Dana or some lackey
of his will post something else and it will not go anywhere. Dana should
move to hollywood because everything is all about Dana, so there he would
be normal. Don’t need the pot or the ibogaine. No excuses needed at all.

Its a very good pr move to pirate copyrighted television episodes and
start sending them out?

Curtis

On Wed, 10 Mar 2004 19:03:50 -0800 karen_tuominen@juno.com wrote:

hi dana,
what a very good pr move, especially for those that dare insult
your advocacy efforts!!!

i am still with fever and chills/aches, it FUCKING sucks – see you
as soon as i feel ok. going to bed now (again), let me know if i
get any calls, ill call them from here and im still trying to get
your reference package together

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From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] origins of the word fuck
Date: March 11, 2004 at 7:22:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Patrick, bro! Great idea, get Phillip Morris and Starbucks to underwrite
ibogaine research! You’re a loyal user of both their drugs!

There could be a catchy slogan like ‘ibogaine, it gets you off heroin
and crack, which support terrorism and lets you keep chain smoking cigarettes
and drinking coffee like a good American!’

I bet the Republicans would even get behind that one! Think big!

Maybe Phillip Morris, Starbucks and Apple, you’re a loyal user of their
computers. ‘Ibogaine, Think Way Different!’

Here’s to you Superfreak! 🙂

Peace out,
Curtis

http://www.apple.com/thinkdifferent/

Heres to the crazy ones.

The misfits.

The rebels.

The troublemakers.

The round pegs in the square holes.

The ones who see things differently.

Theyre not fond of rules.

And they have no respect for the status quo.

You can praise them, disagree with them, quote them,

disbelieve them, glorify or vilify them.

About the only thing you cant do is ignore them.

Because they change things.

They invent. They imagine. They heal.

They explore. They create. They inspire.

They push the human race forward.

Maybe they have to be crazy.

How else can you stare at an empty canvas and see a work of art?
Or sit in silence and hear a song thats never been written?
Or gaze at a red planet and see a laboratory on wheels?

We make tools for these kinds of people.

While some see them as the crazy ones,
we see genius.

Because the people who are crazy enough to think
they can change the world, are the ones who do.

On Thu, 11 Mar 2004 15:58:04 -0800 Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
wrote:

Even funnier hit from google, results page 1. Patrick talking at
a
computer security conference in Europe. 3 cups of coffee lined up
in
front of him and chain smoking during his talk 😉

http://www.mobisux.com/album/showphoto.php?photo=18136&papass=&sort=1&thecat=502

What did you do in the old days, throw your syringes on the table
and
chop up lines? 😉 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

Go Superfreak!

I want a MindVox sticker for my laptop! 🙁

.:vector:.

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
On [Thu, Mar 11, 2004 at 03:08:21PM -0800], [gboy@hush.com] wrote:

| Patrick!!!!!!!!!!!
|
| You’ve really made the big time. No more ads for ibogaine when
you
enter
| your name into a search engine, porno sites are using YOUR NAME
to
promote
| themselves!
|
| Congratulations! I always knew you were going places!
|
| “Origins of the word FUCK” Patrick, did you invent it?????
|
|

http://www.google.com/search?q=patrick+kroupa&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-

| 8&safe=off&start=50&sa=N
|
| “FUCK origin word index”

I’m deeply touched, extremely honored, and completely overwhelmed.

I would like to take this moment to individually thank everyone
on
planet
Earth.

What a wonderful site. Perhaps they’ll give me a fr33
account!#!@#!@!!!!

Rock the fuck ouT!

Patrick

p.s., aXis and gBoy … here:

http://www.textfiles.com/bbs/MINDVOX/DOCUMENTS/bufu

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
https://www.hushmail.com/services.php?subloc=messenger&l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
https://www.hushmail.com/about.php?subloc=affiliate&l=427

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 6:55:44 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks but nobody has answered my question. I am trying to be
respectfull of different cultures and people, some on this list from
other countries are very polite and some are very rude, like we are 😉

Thank you

.:vector:.

— Nick Sandberg <nicks22@onetel.com> wrote:
For me, from personal experience and listening to those of others,
I’d say
ibogaine is a bit more cerebral and iboga more earthy, hardly
surprising
really. Ibogaine can really spin you out there. There used to be a
guy on
the old list from France, Xavier, who went on some amazing wild trips
with
it. Disappeared online one day, and never heard from him again (if
anyone
knows if Xavier lives please let me know). Iboga will hold you more
on the
Earth. I had my most powerful Ibo experience with an iboga rootbark
extract
which is why I’m more inclined to use them now. About the bitterness,
I
agree with planteur, though I don’t think you necessarily need to
torture
yourself with the drug, which is again why I go for the extract – a
short
blast of horribleness as opposed to a long drawn out ritual. If you
feel you
need to really EXPERIENCE the bitterness of life then by all means
fill
yourself with raw rootbark. After you’ve done this you can then
decide if
you want to impart this experience to others based around what it did
for
you.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 1:37 AM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine

Do you think ibogaine is the only active product in Iboga? Do you
think
this
plant has those properties with no meaning? Iboga is the tree of
life,
every
single part of the plant as specific function in the body, it’s
an
holistic
therapy. As it is said in Africa, every bitter medecine is a good
medecine,
every sweet medecine is a poison. Scientist think you can extract
a
single
molecule and get the active principle, and be more
efficient…Eating
Iboga
as it is in a natural way is a proof of courage, if you have this
courage
you’ve done half the way to overcome your problems. In symbolic a
way,
you
have to accept bitterness of life to really enjoy it.

Planteur

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search – Find what youre looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] origins of the word fuck
Date: March 11, 2004 at 6:58:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Even funnier hit from google, results page 1. Patrick talking at a
computer security conference in Europe. 3 cups of coffee lined up in
front of him and chain smoking during his talk 😉

http://www.mobisux.com/album/showphoto.php?photo=18136&papass=&sort=1&thecat=502

What did you do in the old days, throw your syringes on the table and
chop up lines? 😉 🙂 🙂 🙂 🙂

Go Superfreak!

I want a MindVox sticker for my laptop! 🙁

.:vector:.

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
On [Thu, Mar 11, 2004 at 03:08:21PM -0800], [gboy@hush.com] wrote:

| Patrick!!!!!!!!!!!
|
| You’ve really made the big time. No more ads for ibogaine when you
enter
| your name into a search engine, porno sites are using YOUR NAME to
promote
| themselves!
|
| Congratulations! I always knew you were going places!
|
| “Origins of the word FUCK” Patrick, did you invent it?????
|
|

http://www.google.com/search?q=patrick+kroupa&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-
| 8&safe=off&start=50&sa=N
|
| “FUCK origin word index”

I’m deeply touched, extremely honored, and completely overwhelmed.

I would like to take this moment to individually thank everyone on
planet
Earth.

What a wonderful site. Perhaps they’ll give me a fr33
account!#!@#!@!!!!

Rock the fuck ouT!

Patrick

p.s., aXis and gBoy … here:

http://www.textfiles.com/bbs/MINDVOX/DOCUMENTS/bufu

/]=———————————————————————=[\

[%](> Further Information & List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search – Find what youre looking for faster
http://search.yahoo.com

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] origins of the word fuck
Date: March 11, 2004 at 6:01:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Thu, Mar 11, 2004 at 03:08:21PM -0800], [gboy@hush.com] wrote:

| Patrick!!!!!!!!!!!
|
| You’ve really made the big time. No more ads for ibogaine when you enter
| your name into a search engine, porno sites are using YOUR NAME to promote
| themselves!
|
| Congratulations! I always knew you were going places!
|
| “Origins of the word FUCK” Patrick, did you invent it?????
|
| http://www.google.com/search?q=patrick+kroupa&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-
| 8&safe=off&start=50&sa=N
|
| “FUCK origin word index”

I’m deeply touched, extremely honored, and completely overwhelmed.

I would like to take this moment to individually thank everyone on planet
Earth.

What a wonderful site. Perhaps they’ll give me a fr33 account!#!@#!@!!!!

Rock the fuck ouT!

Patrick

p.s., aXis and gBoy … here:

http://www.textfiles.com/bbs/MINDVOX/DOCUMENTS/bufu

From: “jon f.” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Thanks
Date: March 11, 2004 at 6:18:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In the United States alone, someone checks their email every 3 seconds….

Belle journéeMerci beaucoup = Thanks a lot for the informations about Voacanga Africana.

Good travel on the earth today !

de rien =)

From: <gboy@hush.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] origins of the word fuck
Date: March 11, 2004 at 6:08:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@MindVox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—–
Hash: SHA1

Patrick!!!!!!!!!!!

You’ve really made the big time. No more ads for ibogaine when you enter
your name into a search engine, porno sites are using YOUR NAME to promote
themselves!

Congratulations! I always knew you were going places!

“Origins of the word FUCK” Patrick, did you invent it?????

http://www.google.com/search?q=patrick+kroupa&hl=en&lr=&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-
8&safe=off&start=50&sa=N

“FUCK origin word index”

PS: Love the collegepussy site it links to, very hot.

axis get off hush you punk!

.g
—–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—–
Note: This signature can be verified at https://www.hushtools.com/verify
Version: Hush 2.3

wkYEARECAAYFAkBQ7/cACgkQxuwtmNNEJvQ8mgCfZz1QBytwANh9Zeg5BffcurMpIsYA
oKTTRggZuzhftQ+XQUmmY7thCd1M
=Fdyb
—–END PGP SIGNATURE—–

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: <axisone@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what the world needs now….
Date: March 11, 2004 at 5:53:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Steven Anker <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
–
—-
Advocacy and yall,

Be united. Lay low on the crazy. For now… t’s ‘medicine’ and a
‘disease.’

Be vigilant about press and media coverage. Sue their fucking ass
if
they
are wrong. Companies understand money. Who are the best spokespeople
for
ibo? I like Howard, Patrick and Mash. How about you? Let the ego
go,
what is
best for the cause? Do not become right wing zealots protesting
a work
of
art unseen. Not all publicity is good.

For the record I hate Patrick and Mash and Howard hasn’t really accomplished
any thing with ibogaine in who gave that figure before, 30 years?

Howard is at least sane, unlike Dana and the whole pot movement who I
think nobody in legit medicine is listening to. Great scam if your a
drug dealer but I havent seen the whole medical marijuana anything manage
to even get pot a drug that has never killed anyone, legal in the US.
Constant mentions of ibogaine by them is not helping anyone.

The pro-pot movement has not managed to make pot legal, a drug which
is harmless and never killed anyone. They are going to do something
with ibogaine???????? Never happen.

Nader is a asshole and its too bad but youre right. Patrick and Mash
on their own are really effective, together is more then effective, the
two of them in the same room are suddenly so human and you can relate.
Its the darth vader and evil witch lovefest. When the two of you get
it on, do you do mother theresa and jesus or the mom and son trip, which
is hotter? Ignoreing what anyone else has ever said, the two of you have
some serious energy on camera and it’s not scientist
and junkie.

Steve you work in hollywood and maybe are better at seeing what others
see when they look at the screen, but what all the peace and love, democratics
missed is that the person who gave the Deborah and Patrick show all that
exposure by putting on the front page of the drudge report was matt drudge.
A conservative republican who liked it so much he has hallucinogen that
cures addiction on page one of his site.

Conservative Republican. Not the Greens, not Kerry. A Conservative Republican.
I haven’t seen the Dems do anything for ibogaine.

Howard, Patrick, Mash. or Mash, Patrick, Howard. As long as Patrick is
in the middle to keep Mash and Howard away from each other 😉

No pro pot idiocy which is only going to make everyone ignore it. No
weird rituals in africa, no discussions about sticking root bark up your
ass. Medicine that cures a disease is right.

Best, Steve Anker

PS: Patrick, stop being such a hippie pussy.

Don’t encourage him. Patrick has either been blowing his brains out with
LSD again or having a lot of sex, he’s been calm and zen like for at
least two weeks. When that wears off, we get Darth Vader on acid.

Patrick the next message you’re going to write when you read this, don’t.
I’m sure it will move me, sweep me away, make me relate, make me believe
and up your genius ante another level. But you’ve pulled Dana’s neck
off the chopping block a few times already, he is making peace by being
nutso again and burning pirated copies of CSI’s program and offering
to give them away. I don’t want to hear it.

He may be the kooky uncle, he’s lucky to have you on his side, but he
is not a effective spokesperson for anything, not even pot. He should
move to hollywood and just be himself, forget pot and ibogaine, Dana
is enough material all in one person he doesn’t even need the weird causes.

No matter what you write, it won’t change that. I’m sure you can write
a believable message about why black is white and make people relate
to it, but all it proves is that you’re a great communicator. It’s been
proven. Shut up now and let Dana suffer some of his own consequences
because I am so sick of the bullshit. You’re as nuts as he is but as
you yourself said, he has no off switch. You do. I don’t hear deranged
rants about tripping on LSD and lights and colors inside your head, when
you have the camera in your face. You forget all about that. Because
you turn it off. This is exactly what you said. Dana can’t turn it off.

Axis

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From: “Allison Senepart” <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CSI on CD
Date: March 11, 2004 at 3:57:21 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I tried to access the video from the link provided but it kept stopping & wouldn’t play properly. I would really like to view it if poss. Am on Windows. Can anyone help me. Sorry if I sound thick but my computer skills are somewhat more limited than most of you guys on this site. PS Not to bring up the Hep C thingy again but would just like to say Thanks to everyone who gave advice. Have taken it all on board and am working on things. Bit late replying on that one but have been struggling to keep up with things lately & there have been so many posts to read and absorb.
Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Thursday, 11 March 2004 1:30:47 p.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] CSI on CD

Just to show that we support the artistic endeavor involved, we are
willing to send a limited number of MAC-ready CDs with the HDTV
version of the CSI episode with videoland client program to play it.
Some of you may have missed it. And even if you saw it once, you get
more out of it the second and third times.

Plus, you can use it to indoctrinate young drug reform activists,
clergy, doctors, lawyers, politicians…. With the careful
qualification that no one is doing what the guy is doing in the
episode–actually giving it out in the U.S. Of course, we NEVER,
ever, ever would do that.

Email me offlist with name and address.

Dana/cnw

____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 3:26:07 PM EST
To: Diop Anouchka <anouchkadiop@yahoo.fr>
Cc: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Thu, Mar 11, 2004 at 09:13:43PM +0100], [Diop Anouchka] wrote:

| Hello Mr Kroupa,
|
| I am a young gabonese student, at present student in the Louis Pasteur
| university of Strasbourg. I’m very interesting about all research
| concerning Iboga ( the plant) and Ibogane. I fell so on your site and I
| will like having the possibility of asking you some question in that
| case. If it is possible thank you to contact me.
|
| I thank you in advance for the interest that you will grant me.
|
| Melle Diop Awore Anouchka

Hullo,

I just added you to the ibogaine list; feel free to ask anything you want.
The address to send to is: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If you want to get off the list, the instructions are at the bottom.

Regards,

Patrick

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 3:58:05 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

For me, from personal experience and listening to those of others, I’d say
ibogaine is a bit more cerebral and iboga more earthy, hardly surprising
really. Ibogaine can really spin you out there. There used to be a guy on
the old list from France, Xavier, who went on some amazing wild trips with
it. Disappeared online one day, and never heard from him again (if anyone
knows if Xavier lives please let me know). Iboga will hold you more on the
Earth. I had my most powerful Ibo experience with an iboga rootbark extract
which is why I’m more inclined to use them now. About the bitterness, I
agree with planteur, though I don’t think you necessarily need to torture
yourself with the drug, which is again why I go for the extract – a short
blast of horribleness as opposed to a long drawn out ritual. If you feel you
need to really EXPERIENCE the bitterness of life then by all means fill
yourself with raw rootbark. After you’ve done this you can then decide if
you want to impart this experience to others based around what it did for
you.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, March 11, 2004 1:37 AM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine

Do you think ibogaine is the only active product in Iboga? Do you think
this
plant has those properties with no meaning? Iboga is the tree of life,
every
single part of the plant as specific function in the body, it’s an
holistic
therapy. As it is said in Africa, every bitter medecine is a good
medecine,
every sweet medecine is a poison. Scientist think you can extract a
single
molecule and get the active principle, and be more efficient…Eating
Iboga
as it is in a natural way is a proof of courage, if you have this
courage
you’ve done half the way to overcome your problems. In symbolic a way,
you
have to accept bitterness of life to really enjoy it.

Planteur

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Email
Date: March 11, 2004 at 12:33:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Two notes regarding email:

[01]: Due to SOMEONE changing shit around at 4AM (EST), the mail system
was down from roughly then, until 11:30AM. Mail that was sent in or out
of here, during that time period, should just queue up, and arrive.

If for some reason your email service gives up after only 4 to 6 hours —
which is often the case with AOL — just resend it.

[02]: People who are using Yahoo mail, and saying, “I’m not getting any
mail!@#!!!! It’s BROKEN!” <– Noap, it ain’t. Yahoo appears to be in the
perpetual process of adjusting their spam filters.

If you have set your account to paranoid mode; and you are NOT receiving
email from the lists, or personal mail. Go to the folder on the left hand
side called BULK, click on it. And <Presto!> There it all is … unless
it has been automagically deleted — which Yahoo also does, I dunno how
often, or how many times you must access your account prior to this event;
I don’t use Yahoo, and have only cruised through it to test this shit.

Anywaze, when in the folder called BULK, just click the button that sez,
[This is NOT Spam] and everything will be all-good.

Or … adjust your preferences and kick the spam filtering down from
EXTREMELY PARANOID mode, to merely being aggressive.

Laters,

Patrick

From: “Martine Docin-Julien” <jardin.dj@free.fr>
Subject: [ibogaine] Thanks
Date: March 11, 2004 at 3:43:22 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Merci beaucoup = Thanks a lot for the informations about Voacanga Africana.

Good travel on the earth today !

Martine
From: GermánDC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine]To Know Iboga
Date: March 11, 2004 at 8:44:43 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I´m not german, my name is,
I´m in Argentina.
I would like to know iboga first hand in Africa.
Anybody knows some hints?

gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar

gdc

—– Original Message —–
From: Martine Docin-Julien
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 6:13 PM
Subject: [ibogaine]To Know Iboga

Hello, I guess you may contact the webmaster of this site, Uwe Maas, he is german too, living in Germany and has experienced Iboga in Africa.
And he is a friendly guy 😉

http://www.musictherapyworld.de/modules/mmmagazine/showarticle.php?articletoshow=63&language=en

Martine

To know Iboga in Africa, where to go ?
countrys, citys, seasons, airports, communities, etc.
my french is sort of rusted.
thanks
germán dc
From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
Date: March 11, 2004 at 1:00:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Do you think ibogaine is the only active product in Iboga? Do you think
this
plant has those properties with no meaning? Iboga is the tree of life,
every
single part of the plant as specific function in the body, it’s an
holistic
therapy. As it is said in Africa, every bitter medecine is a good
medecine,
every sweet medecine is a poison. Scientist think you can extract a single
molecule and get the active principle, and be more efficient…Eating
Iboga
as it is in a natural way is a proof of courage, if you have this courage
you’ve done half the way to overcome your problems. In symbolic a way, you
have to accept bitterness of life to really enjoy it.

I believe 12 alkaloids have been identified in Tabernathe iboga…
ibogaine being one of them….

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 12:55:15 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It would get that anger , which manifest in the liver organ, to be
released.
magnesium sulphate cleansing can help that too.

what exactly do you mean by anger manifesting in the liver?

From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 12:54:00 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi there,
There seems to be a lot of talk about root bark vs ibogaine. I just wanted to say that before having the full ibogaine experience I purchase some rootbark and some powdered root from the internet to test. Only a small amount. I think I took maybe 10grams of rootbark with mild effects.
When I tried the powdered root thought the effects were not pleasant. I think I swallowed between 20 and 30 grams and I felt that my blood pressure shot up and my face became visibly
red when I looked in the mirror.
I don’t know if this was the real stuff but it frightened me to think what would have happened if I had taken enough for a proper dose.

Luke

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 17:37:49 -0800 (PST)

Planteur, I do agree, my experience with iboga extract was very natural feeling indeed, and I was very aware of this, helped me see the synthetic opioids as some mad scientist venom. So I am wondering, those on this list who have done both iboga and ibogaine, does ibogaine feel synthetic or does that goodness from nature feeling still there? It’s my understanding that the ibogaine is a bit more hard core in the experience, is that true? Is it easier to overdose on ibogaine then it is with iboga? How different are the experiences of the two? Has anyone tried a main dose with one followed by a booster of the other? How did that work out? Thanks everyone in advance for any input.
Jason
> —–Original Message—–
> From: iboga_planteur [mailto:iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr]
> Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004, 4:19 PM
> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
>
> Do you think ibogaine is the only active product in Iboga? Do you think this
> plant has those properties with no meaning? Iboga is the tree of life, every
> single part of the plant as specific function in the body, it’s an holistic
> therapy. As it is said in Africa, every bitter medecine is a good medecine,
> every sweet medecine is a poison. Scientist think you can extract a single
> molecule and get the active principle, and be more efficient…Eating Iboga
> as it is in a natural way is a proof of courage, if you have this courage
> you’ve done half the way to overcome your problems. In symbolic a way, you
> have to accept bitterness of life to really enjoy it.
>
> Planteur
>
>
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>
>

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From: <thomaspi@cox.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Ethnogarden
Date: March 11, 2004 at 10:07:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Does anyone know if Ethnogarden is still in business ??

From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] D.A.R.E.
Date: March 11, 2004 at 12:16:07 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

How dare anyone question your advocacy Dana?

Why yes, Stalin.

Dissent is healthy in a democracy.

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] speaking of health care,
Date: March 11, 2004 at 4:54:22 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Wednesday March 10, 2004 The Guardian  Rich people are more likely to survive cancer than poor people in England and Wales, and the gulf in their life chances has been steadily widening, according to research released yesterday.  The prognosis for most cancers has been improving but an international team of researchers backed by Cancer Research UK revealed yesterday that it is the affluent who are profiting the most from today’s faster diagnosis and better treatment, while the prospects for the poor lag years behind. If all cancer patients were equal, an extra 3,000 lives could be saved every five years, they estimate.  Their analysis of data from the English and Welsh cancer registries, published yesterday in the British Journal of Cancer, reveals the seriousness of the health divide. While the government pointed out that its national cancer plan was published just after the period for which we have survival figures, the widening of the socio-economic gulf over the previous 15 years, in spite of initiatives to address health inequalities, bodes ill.  Most shocking was the disparity in the survival rates of men five years after a diagnosis at some point between 1996 and 1999 of cancer of the larynx. The gap between rich and poor was 17.2%. For men diagnosed with cancer of the rectum, the gap was 9.4% and for women 8.3%, for women with cancer of the colon it was 7.3% and for women with myeloma it was 7.7%.  ”We have evidence of trends in survival which are, generally speaking, very good news,” said Michel Coleman, professor of epidem iology at the London School of Hygiene and Tropical Medicine and leader of the team, “but for 28 of those 33 cancers [16 were studied in men and 17 in women] there is a substantial difference between rich and poor and it has been getting worse.”  It appeared from their data on 2.2 million adult patients that trends in deprivation were linked to trends in survival. “Where survival is increasing, deprivation is also increasing,” said Professor Coleman. In men, he said, “a 5% gain in survival is on average associated with a 1.5% worsening in the deprivation gap”. In women, the gap appeared to increase at the slightly slower rate of 1% for every 5% improvement in survival overall.  The reason for the lower survival rates of poorer people are not to do with less access to newer, more expensive drugs, say the researchers. Nor is it to do with access to a particular hospital, since all see a mixture of classes. They do not know exactly what is happening, but speculate that the worst off are not getting diagnosed as fast or treated as well as the affluent.  Rich people are quicker to go to the doctor when they suspect something is wrong and know how to demand attention.  ”We don’t have hard evidence that the issue of stridency, or if you like communication and demanding approaches to doctors, underpins differences in survival, but there is evidence the rich and poor do get diagnosed at slightly different stages of disease,” Professor Coleman said.  ”Maybe the firmness with which patients address the healthcare system does have an impact.”

Don’t give up,

Take care,

Sara

From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 12:39:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Howard,

It’s been about 8 months since I last took ibogaine.

I wasn’t aware of tension in my neck before ibogaine, although a chiropracter had once commented on how tense my neck was before ibogine. I didn’t notice it myself.

As for anger, I mostly only feel that way when I’m in a situation I feel stressed, or under pressure like at work. It seems more extreem than before.

In my last ibogaine experience I had visions of birth and felt the sensation of my head being squashed and it felt like very deep tension was being released. I had an incredible anger in me as a child and I remember that I always supressed my emotions. it feels like there are alot of feelings
pushing to be resolved.

Luke

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: Wed, 10 Mar 2004 14:44:56 EST

In a message dated 3/10/04 7:10:29 PM, lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes:

>Has anyone anyone encountered physicall or emotional difficulties after
>
>ibogaine. I found that
>I seem to get strong mood swings. Especially during times of stress or
>when
>I’m at work I sometimes feel like incredibly angry and feel alot of tension
>
>in my neck and head. I also find myself
>very confused and can have difficulty concentrating on present things as
>
>there’s so many things going through my mind.
>Thanks
>Luke

Luke,

1) How long ago did you take ibogaine?
2) Did you have any of these problems before taking ibogaine?

Thanks

Howard

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From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: [ibogaine] Howard – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 11, 2004 at 7:39:44 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>> to make little, uh, ‘water-baloons’… >>

> Whatever happened to rectal infusions or is that what you are writing of?
> Howard

Hi Howard,

Not really…

I’m going to add a few really small photos, sort of ‘show & tell’…

We got this acordion-like roll of synthetic sausage-casing, made (mostly) from
collagen, I believe, and in a sense it does what gel-caps do while accommodating a
bigger load…when wet, the casing is very smooth and it’s completely tasteless…

However, in our first experiment, we regrettably made ibo-gumballs, see pics, which
were very slow going down and somewhat painful as well (had the urge to shove a stick
and push them down) Next time ’round, we would use more length and a little less quantity,
thus make them flacid and easier to swallow…

So the water-balloons was a suggestion to using the casing with the liquid/extract, which,
like Nick said, is moderately horrific….

Adam

From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] what the world needs now….
Date: March 11, 2004 at 1:53:22 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Advocacy and yall,

Dana, Im sorry I didnt take your peace branch. Understand that the amount of times Ive had someone want to describe a script or pitch an idea is way too many. Im at a party and someone says I just wrote a script! – it just doesnt make me excited.

I do want peace and love and all that shit. You have helped people. The Buddhists say you shouldnt interfere with anothers path. You did mine. It is not cool.

You called me to get Jerry Stahls number to pitch a story as a peace offering? Dude, let me explain
since caveman time no man likes it if someone fucks with his ability to feed his family. You smeared a private email around to get your picture in paper and then you want to call Jerry to work on a film? You hurt my friendship with a man who helped keep me off dope and you want his phone number to be a movie star? Please understand that I work in a small world and personal relations mean much. I was promised by the CSI guys that they would be honest to the root
and they were. I will say your chutzpah is admirable, and Im not joking
you should pursue a career in show-biz.

You pissed me off. I posted a letter to you regarding your advocacy I wasnt going to post. I got angry.

I understand that media misquotes, but in the big picture, away from that cold and miserable city, how did protesting help the cause of ibogaine? You got an old yippie to watch the show? Preaching to the choir dude!

Anyway

Ive noticed conservatives never fight among themselves. None of this Im going to vote my conscious. No Nader fucking things up.

When I was arrested and had to face the judge, I cleaned up n wore a spiffy suite and thanked the judge for the wise and kind justice handed down. No Fuck you! Tool of the drug war. I ate shit.

We need to do the same. The ibogaine advocacy movement needs to do the following to succeed:

Be united. Lay low on the crazy. For now… t’s ‘medicine’ and a ‘disease.’

Be vigilant about press and media coverage. Sue their fucking ass if they are wrong. Companies understand money. Who are the best spokespeople for ibo? I like Howard, Patrick and Mash. How about you? Let the ego go, what is best for the cause? Do not become right wing zealots protesting a work of art unseen. Not all publicity is good.

The War on Drugs is expensive, ibo is cheaper. DPA does good work, why fight them? Money is easier to understand than morals.

Work to change ibo from schedule 1 to 2.

We need double blind studies.

Get as many addicts as possible to take ibogaine and tell their friends it works.

Prevent criminalization anywhere else in the world. Sara and Nick, do have any idea how jealous we in the States are of European drug policy?

Encourage Mash to publish.

Pray for 18-mc and nor-ibogaine to be on the pharmacist shelf.

But then again, what do I fucking know?

Im a busy guy about to go to Gabon to hang with the pygmies and then get married
What about everyone else? I know I aint the only one to think this. Lets do this!

This is important.

Best, Steve Anker

PS: Patrick, stop being such a hippie pussy.

When you got em by their balls, the hearts and minds will follow. – HST.

Aha! A manifesto!

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From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 4:53:30 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It is my feeling that you need another dose of Ibogaine

It would get that anger , which manifest in the liver organ, to be released.
magnesium sulphate cleansing can help that too.

Here’s a liver cleanse involving timed doses of epsom salts and olive
oil and a dramatic outcome (pictures included):

http://www.curezone.com/cleanse/liver/default.asp

Bill

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 11:37:10 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Has anyone anyone encountered physicall or emotional difficulties after
ibogaine. I found that
I seem to get strong mood swings. Especially during times of stress or when
I’m at work I sometimes feel like incredibly angry and feel alot of tension
in my neck and head. I also find myself
very confused and can have difficulty concentrating on present things as
there’s so many things going through my mind.

Here’s a post in an ayahuasca forum that might be of interest – the
common theme seems to be “more stuff to process”:

From: “June Collier” <june@wiredog.com>
To: <ayahuasca@yage.net>
Subject: Re: [ayahuasca] Fwd: Hello everyone!
Date: Thu, 11 Mar 2004 11:07:54 -0500

My first experience with ayahuasca was with a shaman in a private group =
setting and I had a wonderful experience during the ritual. But after =
words I had a week of emotional trauma where I went back to being 4 =
years old when my brother died and my mother went thru a very depressed =
period. I cried and emoted and screamed at my mother, who is now dead.
A month later I went to a Daime healing ritual and the first vision I =
had was of my mother who turned into the Virgin Mary and then to me and =
back again and again. I had many visions that 3 days and insights after =
that have changed me. From the first drink I felt this being/entity =
going thru my body, blood, and cells working and throwing out all the =
negative patterns. I have not drank coffee since that first drink of =
Daime and the Daime has forever changed my eating patterns for the =
better as I was out of control in this area of my life.
love light june

—

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] great collection of stories
Date: March 11, 2004 at 11:47:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Visiting ibogaine web pages can be interesting. Eric Taub has an interesting
collection of published articles on his site. They give a good understanding
of ibogaine history and development, or lack thereof.

http://www.ibeginagain.org/articles/index.shtml

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

From: karen_tuominen@juno.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CSI on CD
Date: March 10, 2004 at 10:05:36 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

sorry all, that last note was obviously only intended for dana ;).

pax,
karen

From: karen_tuominen@juno.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CSI on CD
Date: March 10, 2004 at 10:03:50 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi dana,
what a very good pr move, especially for those that dare insult your advocacy efforts!!!

i am still with fever and chills/aches, it FUCKING sucks – see you as soon as i feel ok. going to bed now (again), let me know if i get any calls, ill call them from here and im still trying to get your reference package together

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root vs. ibogaine
Date: March 10, 2004 at 8:37:49 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Do you think ibogaine is the only active product in Iboga? Do you think this
plant has those properties with no meaning? Iboga is the tree of life, every
single part of the plant as specific function in the body, it’s an holistic
therapy. As it is said in Africa, every bitter medecine is a good medecine,
every sweet medecine is a poison. Scientist think you can extract a single
molecule and get the active principle, and be more efficient…Eating Iboga
as it is in a natural way is a proof of courage, if you have this courage
you’ve done half the way to overcome your problems. In symbolic a way, you
have to accept bitterness of life to really enjoy it.

Planteur

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: [ibogaine] Brett – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 11, 2004 at 6:38:07 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hiya Brett,

Yeah, I have the goods on that form of administration, I thought of mentioning it as well…

But I swear by the ‘real’ vomiting that takes place with the fresh root and until I exhaust all my oral options I won’t be going, eh, behind my own back.. maybe someday…

Here I have to agree with Planteur, if you put yourself thru the real ‘raw deal’, you come away feeling that consecutive hcl or indra sessions are not all that wholesome… Althoughy I never tried the latter, I suspect it might compare to the difference between smoking good weed and dropping a THC pill….

And yes, I have it on record that people do rectal infusion with rootbark… you gotta grind it up real fine, add just enough water to make it soup-like and warm it up to body temp.. and there are various instruments that one can use for means of delivery…

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 3:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice

Adam,

There is one other route of administration though I am not suggeting it, only that you won’t taste it.

Ibogaine is bio-active rectally, it should work.

Brett

AG <adamg@013.net.il> wrote:
Hi Nick,

Maybe Laurent Sazy or Planteur can shed some light on the topic…

I’ll be sure to post the recipe along with some pics….

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg”
> It’s moderately horrific, but nothing compared to the bark itself or the
> tea. Which, by the way, does anyone out there have instructions for? I
seem
> to remember you can just boil the rootbark up for a couple of hours then
> strain and drink. Can anyone confirm, I’m thinking of doing some like this
> soon.

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search – Find what you’re looking for faster.

From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CSI on CD
Date: March 10, 2004 at 8:20:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

dana………
please send me a copy.
thanx
Marcus David
2506 N. Clark #134
Chicago, IL 60614

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 7:57:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Planteur,

No, I am quite certain there is more to iboga than a molecule. While I was talking a little “tongue-in-cheek” to Adam the option of rectal administration for some people is a valid point, the fact that it is being used makes it valid. In drug addiction treatment sometimes people can’t hold the ibogaine/iboga down, when supplies are VERY limited and the stomach very weak (or if there is a bleeding ulcer) rectal is sometimes considered.. I know people who have lost doses orally, that may be all the iboga they have. Sometimes it is difficult to deal with addicts – they think healthy stuff is disgusting and unhealthy stuff (like squirting things in their arms) is natural. Sometimes one has to be a little “creative”, if the addict (or other) barfs up his dose, that is all he has, refuses to re-drink it or can’t hold a 2nd dose down, well, there is another option… it does come up but not with root-bark that I have encountered.

I deeply respect Iboga and have no fear of it any longer, but it is still wreched stuff. Yeah, builds character, that is for sure.

Brett

iboga_planteur <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr> wrote:
Do you think ibogaine is the only active product in Iboga? Do you think this
plant has those properties with no meaning? Iboga is the tree of life, every
single part of the plant as specific function in the body, it’s an holistic
therapy. As it is said in Africa, every bitter medecine is a good medecine,
every sweet medecine is a poison. Scientist think you can extract a single
molecule and get the active principle, and be more efficient…Eating Iboga
as it is in a natural way is a proof of courage, if you have this courage
you’ve done half the way to overcome your problems. In symbolic a way, you
have to accept bitterness of life to really enjoy it.

Planteur

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search – Find what youre looking for faster.

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] CSI on CD
Date: March 10, 2004 at 7:30:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Email me offlist with name and address.

Dana/cnw

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 7:23:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/10/04 9:40:14 PM, adamg@013.net.il writes:

<< I’m sorry to hear that the extract is ‘moderately horrific’… I’m also up

for another ‘Operation Clean Up Your Act/Room’… but while I don’t mind the

vomiting that ensues, I can’t stomache anymore ibo directly… so I might

opt for combining the two, ie, create the extract and use the salami-wrapper

to make little, uh, ‘water-baloons’… >>

Whatever happened to rectal infusions or is that what you are writing of?

Howard

From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 7:24:44 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Do you think ibogaine is the only active product in Iboga? Do you think this
plant has those properties with no meaning? Iboga is the tree of life, every
single part of the plant as specific function in the body, it’s an holistic
therapy. As it is said in Africa, every bitter medecine is a good medecine,
every sweet medecine is a poison. Scientist think you can extract a single
molecule and get the active principle, and be more efficient…Eating Iboga
as it is in a natural way is a proof of courage, if you have this courage
you’ve done half the way to overcome your problems. In symbolic a way, you
have to accept bitterness of life to really enjoy it.

Planteur

From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 6:52:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Adam,

There is one other route of administration though I am not suggeting it, only that you won’t taste it.

Ibogaine is bio-active rectally, it should work.

Brett

AG <adamg@013.net.il> wrote:
Hi Nick,

Maybe Laurent Sazy or Planteur can shed some light on the topic…

I’ll be sure to post the recipe along with some pics….

Adam

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Search – Find what youre looking for faster.

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 10, 2004 at 6:49:53 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Luke

It is my feeling that you need another dose of Ibogaine

It would get that anger , which manifest in the liver organ, to be released.
magnesium sulphate cleansing can help that too.

Take care

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Luke Christoffersen [mailto:lchristoffersen@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 maart 2004 18:46
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine

Hi,
Has anyone anyone encountered physicall or emotional difficulties after
ibogaine. I found that
I seem to get strong mood swings. Especially during times of stress or when

I’m at work I sometimes feel like incredibly angry and feel alot of tension
in my neck and head. I also find myself
very confused and can have difficulty concentrating on present things as
there’s so many things going through my mind.
Thanks
Luke

_________________________________________________________________
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From: <mentat@hush.ai>
Subject: [ibogaine] updated information
Date: March 10, 2004 at 6:46:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Genesis 1

The Creation

1   (1) In the beginning (2) God (3) created the heavens and the earth.
2   The earth was [1] (4) formless and void, and (5) darkness was over
the surface of the deep, and (6) the Spirit of God (7) was [2] moving
over the surface of the waters.
3   Then (8) God said, “Let there be light”; and there was light.
4   God saw that the light was (9) good; and God (10) separated the light
from the darkness.
5   (11) God called the light day, and the darkness He called night.
And (12) there was evening and there was morning, one day.
6   Then God said, “Let there be an (13) expanse in the midst of the
waters, and let it separate the waters from the waters.”
7   God made the [3] expanse, and separated (14) the waters which were
below the expanse from the waters (15) which were above the expanse;
and it was so.
8   God called the expanse heaven. And there was evening and there was
morning, a second day.
9   Then God said, “(16) Let the waters below the heavens be gathered
into one place, and let (17) the dry land appear”; and it was so.
10   God called the dry land earth, and the (18) gathering of the waters
He called seas; and God saw that it was good.
11   Then God said, “Let the earth sprout (19) vegetation, plants yielding
seed, and fruit trees on the earth bearing fruit after their kind with
seed in them”; and it was so.
12   The earth brought forth vegetation, plants yielding seed after their
kind, and trees bearing fruit with seed in them, after their kind; and
God saw that it was good.
13   There was evening and there was morning, a third day.
14   Then God said, “Let there be (20) lights in the (21) expanse of
the heavens to separate the day from the night, and let them be for (22)
signs and for (23) seasons and for days and years;
15   and let them be for lights in the expanse of the heavens to give
light on the earth”; and it was so.
16   God made the two great lights, the (24) greater light to govern
the day, and the lesser light to govern the night; He made (25) the stars
also.
17   (26) God placed them in the expanse of the heavens to give light
on the earth,
18   and to (27) govern the day and the night, and to separate the light
from the darkness; and God saw that it was good.
19   There was evening and there was morning, a fourth day.
20   Then God said, “Let the waters teem with swarms of living creatures,
and let birds fly above the earth in the open expanse of the heavens.”
21   God created (28) the great sea monsters and every living creature
that moves, with which the waters swarmed after their kind, and every
winged bird after its kind; and God saw that it was good.
22   God blessed them, saying, “Be fruitful and multiply, and fill the
waters in the seas, and let birds multiply on the earth.”
23   There was evening and there was morning, a fifth day.
24   (29) Then God said, “Let the earth bring forth living creatures
after their kind: cattle and creeping things and beasts of the earth
after their kind”; and it was so.
25   God made the (30) beasts of the earth after their kind, and the
cattle after their kind, and everything that creeps on the ground after
its kind; and God saw that it was good.
26   Then God said, “Let (31) Us make (32) man in Our image, according
to Our likeness; and let them (33) rule over the fish of the sea and
over the birds of the sky and over the cattle and over all the earth,
and over every creeping thing that creeps on the earth.”
27   God created man (34) in His own image, in the image of God He created
him; (35) male and female He created them.
28   God blessed them; and God said to them, “(36) Be fruitful and
multiply, and fill the earth, and subdue it; and rule over the fish of
the sea.
29   Then God said, “Behold, (37) I have given you every plant yielding
seed that is on the surface of all the earth, and every tree which has
fruit yielding seed; it shall be food for you;
30 and (38) to every beast of the earth and to every bird of the sky
and to every thing that moves on the earth which has life, I have given
every green plant for food”; and it was so.
31   God saw all that He had made, and behold, it was very (39) good.
And there was evening and there was morning, the sixth day.

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 6:22:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I don’t mean to sound really dumb even if I do 😉 But why do any of you
want to do all this with the iboga roots? Don’t you get a much stronger
experience from the extract or hydrochloride? I guess it would depend
on the dose but why go through all this trouble playing around with the
roots, or is it something you enjoy doing and are doing it for its own
sake?

I take it none of you are doing this for addiction?

.:vector:.

— Nick Sandberg <nicks22@onetel.com> wrote:
HI Brooke,

Sent this through before but don’t think it came.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 9:46 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

Thanks Nick – but a quick couple of questions…

1) Do you throw away the root pulp/residue after you boil and
strain it?

Hi Brooke,

Yes! You can check it’s not too bitter first, (a sign that iboga
alkaloids
may still be present) but after a week it shouldn’t be. Alternately,
you
could keep it as some kind of souvenir but it shouldn’t have any more
iboga
in it anyway.

2) how much liquid do you end up with – as most of that recipe is
alcohol,
therefore most of it should burn away?

I often do multiple strainings through cloth. My feeling is that the
more
residue you can get out the less the chances of nausea, (though
vomiting is
felt my many to be part of the process, so it’s not an exact science
here).
At the end I generally have about one half pint glassful, something
like
this. Not so much of it is alcohol as wine is only about 13% and
vodka 40.
Alcohol boils about 22 degrees lower than water so you will see it
boiling
off as you heat the liquid, usually with small rapid bubbles. When
these
stop, the alcohol has gone and it’s time to let it cool.

3) out of that remaining liquid, how much do you think I should
consume
if
it was based from 50 g of Ibogaine? (remember, I’m 190lbs and
33years old
with a tendency to trip almost too fiercely on similar substances)

This is difficult without knowing the strength of the rootbark.
Assuming you
don’t have access to HPLC, you will have to rely on instinct and the
experience of yourself and the provider. Good Gabonese rootbark is
quite
consistently dark brown in colour and contains around 4% ibogaine
base +
other iboga alkaloids. For me, the colour is important. The bark of
the
plant root is darker than the root substance, and contains a lot more
of the
active ingredients, so generally darker brown is good. But there are
people
on the list with a lot more experience than me. Anyway, back to your
question and I’d probably go for about 20g of it, assuming it’s good
quality. I wouldn’t make it all up at once as my experience is that
it
starts to smell funny about 2 weeks after the extraction. Keep in a
fridge
after the boiling bit, with sealed lid. Anyway, I’d say about 20g
assuming
it’s good and your body, esp heart and liver function, are healthy.

Good luck and watch out for the Kombo (head woman), as they say in
the
Cameroun

Nick

ps – Also worth remembering that iboga itself is a very intuitive
substance.
You may find you already kind of know how much you need and which
preparation method to use. Always worth “tuning in” to it a bit when
in
doubt. It knows who you are, it knows what you need, it knows where
you
live, etc !

Thanks in advance for your reply,

B
—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 6:36 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 5:01 PM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

It’s rootbark. I’ve read different ways to prepare it, so if
you have
any advice on this, that would be wonderful.

Thanks again for your support,

Hi B,

I’ve used the simple extraction recipe posted at
www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm on quite a few occasions, both for
myself
and
others. It’s always given good results. The amount of liquid you
have to
drink is relatively small at the end, which can really keep
nausea down.
I’ve heard a lot of Bwiti groups use a similar extraction as an
alternative
to just eating it raw.

Nick

Is the root you acquired root or rootbark?
If it is rootbark 50g is more then necessary for a deep
experience.
If it is
just powdered root, it’s not much. Iboga is more active
night-time
as
the
brain functions in a different way at night. If there are
specific
topics
you want to work on, you can use material supports as photos
for
example. If
the Iboga is too much bitter you can mix it with liquid
honey. Iboga
itself
knows what you need so, just be calm, and enter in the
experience
without
too much expectations. It is possible that you vomit a lot
(Bwiti
say
you
even vomit your mother milk…) Don’t be afraid about that
it’s a
cleansing.
Take the Iboga step by step, a first spoon to test your
reaction if
an hour
later you’re OK, you can take another spoon, during the
process you
might be
able to find for yourself what is the right dose you need.

Good Work

Planteur
—–Message d’origine—–
De : Brooke Burgess [mailto:brooke@brokensaints.com]
Envoyé : samedi 6 mars 2004 08:17
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

Hello everybody,

For reasons both personal and spiritual, I’ve decided to
search
out
and
acquire a source of Ibogaine.

I was able to get 50g of the dried root mailed to me from a
reputable
source, and I’ve been researching how to safely and
effectively
process and
use it in my home environment (with a watcher, of course).

Could anyone lend some support? Advice? Anecdotes?

I’m a relatively healthy 190lb 33yr-old male.

Thanks in advance – I appreciate anything you are willing
to
share.

Brooke

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From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 10, 2004 at 6:04:02 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Luke,

Sounds like you need to SCREAM, man. Find somewhere where you can do this,
get into the “horse stance” (a martial arts pose) with both fists clenched,
thumbs on outside and scream from the belly. Contract the energy into your
pelvis as you do it. Then release and scream again. It’s bioenergetics,
it’ll release the tension and allow the body to expand. Try Osho Dynamic
Meditation in the morning, you can get the cd mail orde. Or the
Humaniversity AUM meditation if it’s available near you (some details at
http://www.zenzei.com/Program/AUM.htm) If you have a prior history of
psychotic episodes or serious mental illness then you need to get
professional advice before doing this stuff.

Basically, you can go down the whole “Why do I want to scream?” road with
psychoanalysis stuff, rationalisation essentially, but it won’t really take
you anywhere, except, at best, stimuli avoidance. Your personality is trying
to expand and to do this it needs you to release, to express emotions.
Bodywork, bioenergetics, or emotional release is best.

Hope this helps

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 5:45 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine

Hi,
Has anyone anyone encountered physicall or emotional difficulties after
ibogaine. I found that
I seem to get strong mood swings. Especially during times of stress or
when
I’m at work I sometimes feel like incredibly angry and feel alot of
tension
in my neck and head. I also find myself
very confused and can have difficulty concentrating on present things as
there’s so many things going through my mind.
Thanks
Luke

_________________________________________________________________
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From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] too noisy 1,000 yard stare
Date: March 10, 2004 at 4:37:38 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

the last stage of a send up
of a gut feeling doubtful touch down to one two forty fortran
crowbars shouting in tkie cellar
but no maybe it’s too much to wear
yes considering the fear inside the ride starting to die
baby i don’t want to cry anymore
yet anyway we escape quicker than
mechanical deaths rejuvenated for transparent transport
subjected to interpolated states
sadly gated you weight against all sidechains
fighting the crush of silence of the right hand mantle cranium alleged
even delayed uranium
burning fabric off our backs
right till we can no longer
see plus plus the fact that no rights left
meaning we’re less than apparent at a rate of complex numbers transpiring to retire
rats racing
time stranded in a stretch predicted yet unfounded in
polynomial calculations set to
have misled the walking dead
yet on awakening we may reflect death as a tool to give credibility
to reflectivity falling in slow motion cos we’re pushed at the last step

components one and two tubular reality systems in question
multiply senseless consent of inspection
prior to combustion
eternal conduction experiments once supposed disfigured immortal beings wander like stoked navigators
pretend multi functioning externals yes we brackets the menu sitting like forks point at the blue
corpse overlord

splitting opportunities
broken like back doors
ask why i don’t reply
while shoulders overlooked but retain guises
suitable for generating consent
fooled we’re none the wiser

baud rate increased as metallic apparitions manifest through

Thousand Yard Stares

look sideways into infinite parallel ports
headlong into one another
escaping velocity becomes a matter of time
compression thresholds as yet another tectonic secret unfolds
third degree burns hover
one moment above a faraday
cage exploding
in slow motion components rated electrolytic capacity
suffocated in ozone waveforms communicate a paralyzed process submerged calculus offers transient traces of illusion

subtle methods symmetry uncovered a diagonal telemetry

catastrophes deep frozen remaining moments horizontal like a stone
endless
slowing down till actions turn sidelong
still inverts to regressions
lessons unlearnt inertia presides over burnt modernist strides looking glass to stones thrown
fractions later, swan songs colliding
unpopular finding
incubated micro command shells acoustic arguments no longer specified yes this time freedom transpires wide open deserts
yet access denied
sinking in
like rotten requests from perished minds
affirmations become distant light sources pinpointing curved fragments mysterious elements time stretched incubators illuminate strange tangents electrocution integrated into
life on stretcher beds
conceived by airborne sickness
surrounded cold avenues of silence
getting to grips

preparation for long falls

staircases previously, seen only by the dead
seem to persist in times of denied states
yet returning to errors
like fools locking doors
random disintegration occurs as we await
falling forwards forever
axis discrepancy indicates hexagons beyond control anomaly mutilation colony reflects no triangular energy
asynchronous matter avoided by a diagram invisibility
subtle methods symmetry uncovered a diagonal telemetry

You’re so deluxe, you’re so divine You’re so fifty light years ahead of your time You’re a riddle you’re a ripple
Another little glitch in continuity Like you were a ripple in my memory

You are a paradox to me, a senseless maze I run around, I’m looking for you all of my days
The more that you want it,
the more that you need it  The less that it does
Run out it’s rough, too much is enough  And that’s what it was

The more that I see you, the more that I miss you  The less that I care
I know I should try to kiss you goodbye, but…  You’re never there.

I’ve got a nickname for you, I call you weakness I get a little strength out too, or is it meekness?
The more that you want it,
the more that you need it  The less that it does
You are a paradox to me, a contradiction You’re a predicament for me, and a prediction

Well we had just begun When the night came down Sweating rain on everyone Anyone who was hanging around You say there’s something strange going on I cannot see a thing And pretty soon then we’ll be drenched to the bone And my soul is freezing
And we really should decide Who’s taking who for this ride
Ride the bandwagon into the ditch Smile for the many you shocked Bless my soul and drop a stitch Strike while the irony is hot
And I don’t have much time There’s so much left to take It’d hard to know what’s genuine And what’s a genuine fake I think there’s something weird going on Something unforeseen
Ride the ghost train now into the dark
Ride it right into the ground
Up through the suburbs, graveyards and parks Going around and around
If I never see you again That will be way too soon And if I ever get over this I will be over the moon
I hope that something new comes along Something more my style I hope that someone else comes along And makes it worth my while

And it’s lust and sloth and pride That makes me want to
Ride the roller coaster for all that it’s worth Live it all up to the hilt If you can’t take it with you Away from this earth Might as well take it full tilt

Ride the old horse through gold rush town If that’s the kind of company you keep You’re getting very tired and you need to lie down I’ll see you in your sleep

You’re shivering again After all that we’ve been through Is that all you can do?
I didn’t wanna come here Now I don’t wanna go Is there some trick involved in this?  As if you would tell me so.
Our instruments have no way of measuring this feeling
Can never cut below the floor or penetrate the ceiling
In the space between our houses some bones have been discovered
Yet our procession marches on as if we have recovered
Draconian wind unforetold
One solar day suddenly you’re old
A little and below just makes me cold
Makes destination start to unfold

Our documents are useless all forged beyond believing
Page 47 is unsigned, I need it by this evening
In the space between our cities a storm is slowly forming
There’s something eating up our days, I beat it every morning.

The distance and speed have left us too weak
Destination looks kinda bleak
Our elements are burnt out, our beasts have been mistreated
I tell you it’s the only way we’ll get this road completed.
I feel this all beginning right before my eyes.
I must go back, re-examine my life.
Well, here she comes with a penetrating stare
I don’t know when but I wish I knew where
Quick calculation — there’s not nearly enough
Here she comes with her unforgiving web
Almost forever I’ve been drinking these drugs
It must be time to change our rude, crude view
Before we’re lost
Look at the map — add up the cost
Before we’re lost
Wear a gun and be proud but bare breasts aren’t allowed
In the city
Dream up a scam and then rake in the clams
Liquidity
To a wolf I’m a lamb but just half a gram
Liquidity
The face of today just a scalpel away
Restore your lost soul for two dollars plus toll
Liquidity
In reflection, I see you again
Approach me, soak me
Faith, Faith, Breathe
Cause it’s here, it’s where the air is clear
Where far-off things could be quite near
No repairs are needed
Just a Spark

I’m interested, you’ve always been a subject
That I could learn
Splendid hills, unconquerable mountains
Climb – don’t ever turn back
Seed, Seed, Grow
Cause it’s here, it’s where the air is clear
Where far-off things could be quite near
No repairs are needed
Just a Spark
Too dangerous to keep
Too feeble to let go
And you want to bite the hand
Should’ve stopped this long ago
Go now, you’ve been set free
In another month or so
Had you coiled around my arm
How could you ever know
How I loved your diamond eyes
But that was long ago
Go now, you’ve been set free
In another month or so, you’ll be poisoning me
And I should’ve believed Eve
She said we had to glow
She was the apple of my eye
It wasn’t long ago
Go now, you’ve been set free
Shaded crystal water
Bathed in by God’s daughter
A sigh, and whispers near
A new season passes here
Sensory gifts to all who come
Soak up the stars and setting sun
It’s strange and wilder
Nature’s bechilder
And the cactus sure tastes strangely sweet
As it goes down inside
But I’ll dream I’m safe
In my hotel womb
Soft and soul-made
It’s a wonderful room

A sudden voltage in the night
With a rain forest girl
As we float downstream to the Amazon river
Where the black waters swirl
I said “Why are you people wearing those masks”
I said “Can’t we be reconciled”
She says the mother of the storm has to roam the sky
Searching for her child
I’ll dream I’m safe
In my hotel womb
Soft and soul-made
It’s a wonderful room

I wish I’m back in my hotel womb
I’ll slip through the crack
To that wonderful room

Morning comes at last
And she’s lying by my side
She’s got the face of the widow that keeps following me
And the body of my bride
I said “Why are those buildings swaying like trees”
I said “Can we stop for a while”
She says “Can’t you hear the city that’s hidden in there”
“It’s just another mile”
I’ll dream I’m safe
In my hotel womb
They’d be young forever as long as they stayed in the dome But barbarians came and set fire to their home Exposed the dome dwellers to the outside They must have known it was the end
The barbarians picked through the ashes of the dome Then went on their way, continued to roam
All of their strength couldn’t save them All died inside the flood Destined to make that same old mistake The way of all flesh and blood
He can turn wine into water Mother against daughter Juggles busy deadlines Gets himself off headlines Surrounded by his minions Who never have opinions Performing little tricks for you Puts it in a fix for you

Smashes your watch with a hammer   Now the slur is fading Reality all-pervading
And he does the Indian rope trick The one that makes you seasick   And some of it’s done with mirrors And some of it’s done with scissors And some of it’s done with cables And his hands under the table
Cast a fortune for the man in the suit Who’s suffering is very acute There’s a rabbit in his hat But I thought I smelled a rat

People ’round here say you’re a witch They’re intrigued in seeing you roast They really intend to burn you my friend I think that’s the bit they like most
Wake up, the mob are on their way Howling, growling, they want your blood They’re out to get it today
You had to go and cure the mayor’s itch Then you took care of his clerk You fixed up John Green and the old bishop’s spleen Put everyone out of work
I wasn’t expecting this Now everything is destroyed Underneath us are the nothings Underneath them is a void Beyond that void is a place Where figments from bad dreams are banished Childhood nightmares all come seeking And adult logic nearly vanished
Chaos  sensing you’re high, fall in the flame, faster and down dance in desire, fall in the flames, faster and down Chaos
None of this is what I wanted I truly asked for what I got.
Bang the gavel, it’s lawlessness I can’t unravel the knot
Half this wretched town is starving While the other half are bloated
Everybody hates the bastards in power But their pill is sugar coated
I didn’t need any of this  The consequences now apparent Feeding back unchecked
Wake up open your eyes Look around you, this may be your last sunrise

Oh my ugly ducklings, nobody loves you One night your shoulders will ache But next day when you wake You’ll sprout wild wings, and fly Just like in Swan Lake

I built a house of cards Built a house of rain Built a house of love Build them all again
Built a road to reason
Built a road to fate
Built a road to the promised land
Right up to the gate

Loose change in my pocket
Future in my hand
Too many distractions
For me to understand

Understand.

Too many distractions
Got to get back home
Get into something solid
Get out of the zone
Some roads bring renewal
Some roads hide and wait
Some roads promise everything
And steal your fuel away.

“Every man think his burden is the heaviest”
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From: Maryditton@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana
Date: March 10, 2004 at 4:34:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 4:26:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The tea was called ‘automatique’ and I tried twice to replicate it…
boiling a whole bunch of rootbark over a low flame for a couple of hours
did
not produce anything close to the pitch-black drink we were served.. my
guess is that the bwiti used some of the plant’s leaves and/or other
ingredients because rootbark on it’s own will only produce a light-tan,
very
transparent tea… of course taste-wise, again, extremely unpleasant…

I don’t know that this would necessarily work for iboga, but it works for
many other herbs that don’t make good “conventional” tea (i posted it for
making kratom tea a few weeks ago).

Crush up the herb and put it in a pot. Boil gently for at least 15
minutes. Strain out the herb material, and save the liquid in a pot.

Put the strained herb back in the first pot, add more water, and again,
boil gently for at least 15 minutes. Strain it, adding this new batch of
liquid to the liquid that you saved from the previous boiling. You can
toss the herb at this point. Then boil the pot with the combined liquids
in it until only about 1/10th of the liquid remains.

If anyone happens to have some root they feel like experimenting with, I’d
be interested to hear how it turns out =)

With many herbs, you can also make the brew more potent by soaking the
herb in something cold and acidic (like lemon juice) overnight before
making the tea. Most alkaloids occur in plants in their free-base form,
and are easily damaged by heat (like, when boiling). Soaking the plant in
acid before hand turns the free-base into an acid salt, which has a much
higher boiling point.

Again, I don’t know that this would definately apply to iboga, but I would
suspect there’d be a pretty good chance it would.

From: “iboga_planteur” <iboga_planteur@yahoo.fr>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 4:24:36 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Mix Iboga and honey, you can swalow it up more easily and you won’t feel the
bitter taste that much. Yes Iboga is bitter but it’s part of it. You have to
be strong to go through it.

Good work

Planteur

From: “Martine Docin-Julien” <jardin.dj@free.fr>
Subject: [ibogaine]To Know Iboga
Date: March 10, 2004 at 4:13:42 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello, I guess you may contact the webmaster of this site, Uwe Maas, he is german too, living in Germany and has experienced Iboga in Africa.
And he is a friendly guy 😉

http://www.musictherapyworld.de/modules/mmmagazine/showarticle.php?articletoshow=63&language=en

Martine

To know Iboga in Africa, where to go ?
countrys, citys, seasons, airports, communities, etc.
my french is sort of rusted.
thanks
germán dc
From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] quick to prescribe
Date: March 10, 2004 at 3:50:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was looking over some aftercare/iboga stuff and ran across an old
school list of suggestions: one of which was a suggestion to get on
anti-depress/anti-anxiety meds to help with talk therapy etc.

I’ve seen those class of drugs do some good for some people, but they fuck
me way up, every last one of ’em.

Antidepressants can be very useful for some people (they saved my life, to
be honest), but as with many psychotropic pharmaceuticals, they are often
over-prescribed. If someone is experiencing moderate to severe depressive
symptoms, and psychotherapy isn’t affecting significant improvements, then
antidepressant therpay should be seriously considered.

And I would suspect that in some cases, antidepressant therapy would be
sensible post-ibogaine. But, only if the situation warranted it.. that is,
if the individual is experiencing significant depressive symptoms that are
getting in the way of their recovery, and that have not been responsive to
other forms of treatment.

‘Depakote [antiepileptic prescribed as anti-anxiety if I remember
correctly]’

depakote is primarily prescribed (in psychiatry) to treat the manic phase
of bipolar disorder.

‘zyprexa [use to treat schizophrenia and acute bipolar maniahow that got
in there I have no idea, if I remember correctly, their isnt like a test
you can take to see if you are bi-polar, apparently, if enough
anti-depressants and the like dont work
then your bi-polar, or at least,
your bi-polar if the bi-polar medicine (and I use the term medicine very
loosely) works]’

bipolar disorder has nothing to do with whether or not antidepressants
work. it is a mood disorder where the individual oscillates between
episodes of depression, and episodes of mania. typical symptoms of mania
include hyperactivity, reduced need for sleep, grandiose ideation (i.e.
thinking one can do things that they really can’t), flight of ideas and
pressured speech, poor judgement, and reduced inhibitions. it’s a lot like
being on coke, really.

bipolar disorder can be particularly tricky to treat, because
antidepressants can often trigger episodes of mania.

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 11, 2004 at 1:33:26 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Nick,

Maybe Laurent Sazy or Planteur can shed some light on the topic…

I’ll be sure to post the recipe along with some pics….

Adam

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 11, 2004 at 12:52:09 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

DH, Luke and all,

Just wanted to add a sidenote, the sunshine- not a great idea for the first
few days after… I did ibo in Costa Rica a few years ago and 2 days later I
took a walk on the beach for maybe 15 mins tops and I was burnt crisp,
couldn’t crack a smile nor blink- spent the next 2 weeks imitating a dead
iguana…. Only then did I recall reading somewhere that ibo has this
‘sensitivity’ side-effect…..

Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 9:57 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine

Yeah,
I can relate. If you did ibogaine to kick dope remember this… Drugs
supress emotions, or at least they give a false sense of dealing with
emotions. So now, There’s no drugs (presumably) and the emotions start
to percolate to the surface and can often take you by surprise… “eh?
whats this? I’m feeling stuff?”

This is a time for you to be very forgiving to yourself, be easy on you
and nurture yourself. It gets better over time. Take breaks as often as
you can, get outside in the sun if possible and get lots of rest. Do
something fun. I remember people telling me to smile, and it felt like
that smile would crack my face in half… I think after 9 months or so I
actually laughed whole-heartedly.

hang in there!

-dh

On 3/10/2004, “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com> wrote:

Hi,
Has anyone anyone encountered physicall or emotional difficulties after
ibogaine. I found that
I seem to get strong mood swings. Especially during times of stress or
when
I’m at work I sometimes feel like incredibly angry and feel alot of tension
in my neck and head. I also find myself
very confused and can have difficulty concentrating on present things as
there’s so many things going through my mind.
Thanks
Luke

_________________________________________________________________
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<)[%]
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 10, 2004 at 2:44:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 3/10/04 7:10:29 PM, lchristoffersen@hotmail.com writes:

Has anyone anyone encountered physicall or emotional difficulties after

ibogaine. I found that
I seem to get strong mood swings. Especially during times of stress or
when
I’m at work I sometimes feel like incredibly angry and feel alot of tension

in my neck and head. I also find myself
very confused and can have difficulty concentrating on present things as

there’s so many things going through my mind.
Thanks
Luke

Luke,

1) How long ago did you take ibogaine?
2) Did you have any of these problems before taking ibogaine?

Thanks

Howard

From: Maryditton@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana
Date: March 10, 2004 at 2:01:01 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

Could you elaborate on that. What are your insights on the patients who don’t choose to stay clean? Is there a common thread?

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 1:25:36 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 10:37 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice

Hiya Nick,

Got a few questions regarding the home-made extraction…

How much rootbark would one use with the 70cl of vodka etc..?

Hi Adam,

I can only relate what I did. About the above I don’t know how much ibogaine
alcohol can absorb, I just did enough for one dose maybe 15-20g of good
fresh bark.

Ok to pulverize the rootbark prior to, uh, vodkalizing it..?

I guess so, mine was pretty powdered anyway.

When it states ‘let the liquid stand for 12 hours’, does that mean
open-air/counter-top or sealed jar in fridge…?

I keep it sealed throughout.

Can you give a rough estimate as to how much extract/liquid would one end
up
with (single dose)?

about a half pint glassful maybe a little more.

And how neutral is the extract, taste-wise…?

It’s moderately horrific, but nothing compared to the bark itself or the
tea. Which, by the way, does anyone out there have instructions for? I seem
to remember you can just boil the rootbark up for a couple of hours then
strain and drink. Can anyone confirm, I’m thinking of doing some like this
soon.

all the best

Nick

ps – heard the Bessala family in Cameroun are all split up now and scattered
over the place after much infighting in the wake of the Grandmother’s death
last year. If anyone who knows them would like to Western Union money over I
have details for the eldest daughter, Madeleine –
http://www.ibogaine.co.uk/maso.htm

many thanks,

Adam

If anyone out there is interested in extraction, I got this link from C.
Jenks, who does not appear to be posting much these days – CHRIS!?-
anyways,
this is a link to his work in the field of ibogaine extraction…

http://www.puzzlepiece.org/ibogaine/literature/jenks2002.pdf

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>

Hi B,

I’ve used the simple extraction recipe posted at
www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm on quite a few occasions, both for myself
and
others. It’s always given good results. The amount of liquid you have to
drink is relatively small at the end, which can really keep nausea down.
I’ve heard a lot of Bwiti groups use a similar extraction as an
alternative
to just eating it raw.

Nick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 10, 2004 at 12:57:17 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hang in there!

-dh

On 3/10/2004, “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com> wrote:

Hi,
Has anyone anyone encountered physicall or emotional difficulties after
ibogaine. I found that
I seem to get strong mood swings. Especially during times of stress or when
I’m at work I sometimes feel like incredibly angry and feel alot of tension
in my neck and head. I also find myself
very confused and can have difficulty concentrating on present things as
there’s so many things going through my mind.
Thanks
Luke

_________________________________________________________________
STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE*
http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] UK ibogaine legal status
Date: March 10, 2004 at 1:06:04 PM EST
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I wrote to the UK Medicines Control Agency a couple of weeks ago regarding
the status of the recent draft proposal to schedule Tabernanthe iboga along
with about 50 other herbal medicines. Pasting below the reply I got back.
Basically not much is happening yet, though the draconian EC directive
attacking virtually all herbal and traditional remedies may effect it if it
gets through.

Nick

Dear Nick,

Thanks you for your e-mail, it has been passed to me due to my
responsibilities in the Herbal Policy Unit of the MHRA.

The review of herbal medicines continues, however several newer proposals
have superseded it to a certain extent. These include the European directive
on Traditional Herbal Medicinal products which will effect finished,
packaged products; and the review of herbal remedies made up to meet the
needs of individual patients. Details of these are available on our website
(www.mhra.gov.uk).

Please contact me again if you require any further information.

Regards,

Alexandra Williamson
Herbal Policy Officer

Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency
16-131 Market Towers, 1 Nine Elms Lane, London, SW8 5NQ
Tel: 020 7084 2970

—–Original Message—–
From: Nick Sandberg [mailto:sandberg@onetel.net.uk]
Sent: 29 February 2004 21:43
To: info@mca.gov.uk
Subject: re: Tabernanthe iboga

Dear sir,

I wonder if I might request an update from the MCA on the current status of
the following proposed legislation:

– Review of herbal ingredients for use in unlicensed herbal medicinal
products September 2001
http://medicines.mhra.gov.uk/ourwork/licensingmeds/herbalmeds/herbingredient
review.pdf

I am the owner of a website offering information on the drug ibogaine
(www.ibogaine.co.uk) which is derived from one of the plants proposed to be
restricted, Tabernanthe iboga. If could let me know of the current status of
the review and any opinion as to how it might effect ibogaine itself.
Grateful for any information. Response by email is fine.

Kind regards

Nick Sandberg (owner ibogaine.co.uk)
Thorngrove House
Common Mead Lane
Gillingham
Dorset SP8 4RE

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From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 1:07:48 PM EST
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI Brooke,

Sent this through before but don’t think it came.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 9:46 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

Thanks Nick – but a quick couple of questions…

1) Do you throw away the root pulp/residue after you boil and strain it?

Hi Brooke,

Yes! You can check it’s not too bitter first, (a sign that iboga alkaloids
may still be present) but after a week it shouldn’t be. Alternately, you
could keep it as some kind of souvenir but it shouldn’t have any more iboga
in it anyway.

2) how much liquid do you end up with – as most of that recipe is
alcohol,
therefore most of it should burn away?

I often do multiple strainings through cloth. My feeling is that the more
residue you can get out the less the chances of nausea, (though vomiting is
felt my many to be part of the process, so it’s not an exact science here).
At the end I generally have about one half pint glassful, something like
this. Not so much of it is alcohol as wine is only about 13% and vodka 40.
Alcohol boils about 22 degrees lower than water so you will see it boiling
off as you heat the liquid, usually with small rapid bubbles. When these
stop, the alcohol has gone and it’s time to let it cool.

3) out of that remaining liquid, how much do you think I should consume
if
it was based from 50 g of Ibogaine? (remember, I’m 190lbs and 33years old
with a tendency to trip almost too fiercely on similar substances)

This is difficult without knowing the strength of the rootbark. Assuming you
don’t have access to HPLC, you will have to rely on instinct and the
experience of yourself and the provider. Good Gabonese rootbark is quite
consistently dark brown in colour and contains around 4% ibogaine base +
other iboga alkaloids. For me, the colour is important. The bark of the
plant root is darker than the root substance, and contains a lot more of the
active ingredients, so generally darker brown is good. But there are people
on the list with a lot more experience than me. Anyway, back to your
question and I’d probably go for about 20g of it, assuming it’s good
quality. I wouldn’t make it all up at once as my experience is that it
starts to smell funny about 2 weeks after the extraction. Keep in a fridge
after the boiling bit, with sealed lid. Anyway, I’d say about 20g assuming
it’s good and your body, esp heart and liver function, are healthy.

Good luck and watch out for the Kombo (head woman), as they say in the
Cameroun

Nick

ps – Also worth remembering that iboga itself is a very intuitive substance.
You may find you already kind of know how much you need and which
preparation method to use. Always worth “tuning in” to it a bit when in
doubt. It knows who you are, it knows what you need, it knows where you
live, etc !

Thanks in advance for your reply,

B
—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 6:36 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 5:01 PM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

It’s rootbark. I’ve read different ways to prepare it, so if you have
any advice on this, that would be wonderful.

Thanks again for your support,

Hi B,

I’ve used the simple extraction recipe posted at
www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm on quite a few occasions, both for myself
and
others. It’s always given good results. The amount of liquid you have to
drink is relatively small at the end, which can really keep nausea down.
I’ve heard a lot of Bwiti groups use a similar extraction as an
alternative
to just eating it raw.

Nick

Is the root you acquired root or rootbark?
If it is rootbark 50g is more then necessary for a deep experience.
If it is
just powdered root, it’s not much. Iboga is more active night-time
as
the
brain functions in a different way at night. If there are specific
topics
you want to work on, you can use material supports as photos for
example. If
the Iboga is too much bitter you can mix it with liquid honey. Iboga
itself
knows what you need so, just be calm, and enter in the experience
without
too much expectations. It is possible that you vomit a lot (Bwiti
say
you
even vomit your mother milk…) Don’t be afraid about that it’s a
cleansing.
Take the Iboga step by step, a first spoon to test your reaction if
an hour
later you’re OK, you can take another spoon, during the process you
might be
able to find for yourself what is the right dose you need.

Good Work

Planteur
—–Message d’origine—–
De : Brooke Burgess [mailto:brooke@brokensaints.com]
Envoyé : samedi 6 mars 2004 08:17
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

Hello everybody,

For reasons both personal and spiritual, I’ve decided to search
out
and
acquire a source of Ibogaine.

I was able to get 50g of the dried root mailed to me from a
reputable
source, and I’ve been researching how to safely and effectively
process and
use it in my home environment (with a watcher, of course).

Could anyone lend some support? Advice? Anecdotes?

I’m a relatively healthy 190lb 33yr-old male.

Thanks in advance – I appreciate anything you are willing to
share.

Brooke

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <sandberg@onetel.net.uk>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice
Date: March 10, 2004 at 8:04:07 AM EST
To: “Ibogaine Mindvox” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI Brooke,

Sent this through before but don’t think it came.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke Burgess” <brooke@brokensaints.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 9:46 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

Thanks Nick – but a quick couple of questions…

1) Do you throw away the root pulp/residue after you boil and strain it?

Hi Brooke,

Yes! You can check it’s not too bitter first, (a sign that iboga alkaloids
may still be present) but after a week it shouldn’t be. Alternately, you
could keep it as some kind of souvenir but it shouldn’t have any more iboga
in it anyway.

2) how much liquid do you end up with – as most of that recipe is
alcohol,
therefore most of it should burn away?

I often do multiple strainings through cloth. My feeling is that the more
residue you can get out the less the chances of nausea, (though vomiting is
felt my many to be part of the process, so it’s not an exact science here).
At the end I generally have about one half pint glassful, something like
this. Not so much of it is alcohol as wine is only about 13% and vodka 40.
Alcohol boils about 22 degrees lower than water so you will see it boiling
off as you heat the liquid, usually with small rapid bubbles. When these
stop, the alcohol has gone and it’s time to let it cool.

3) out of that remaining liquid, how much do you think I should consume
if
it was based from 50 g of Ibogaine? (remember, I’m 190lbs and 33years old
with a tendency to trip almost too fiercely on similar substances)

This is difficult without knowing the strength of the rootbark. Assuming you
don’t have access to HPLC, you will have to rely on instinct and the
experience of yourself and the provider. Good Gabonese rootbark is quite
consistently dark brown in colour and contains around 4% ibogaine base +
other iboga alkaloids. For me, the colour is important. The bark of the
plant root is darker than the root substance, and contains a lot more of the
active ingredients, so generally darker brown is good. But there are people
on the list with a lot more experience than me. Anyway, back to your
question and I’d probably go for about 20g of it, assuming it’s good
quality. I wouldn’t make it all up at once as my experience is that it
starts to smell funny about 2 weeks after the extraction. Keep in a fridge
after the boiling bit, with sealed lid. Anyway, I’d say about 20g assuming
it’s good and your body, esp heart and liver function, are healthy.

Good luck and watch out for the Kombo (head woman), as they say in the
Cameroun

Nick

ps – Also worth remembering that iboga itself is a very intuitive substance.
You may find you already kind of know how much you need and which
preparation method to use. Always worth “tuning in” to it a bit when in
doubt. It knows who you are, what you need, where you live, etc !

Thanks in advance for your reply,

B
—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, March 07, 2004 6:36 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

—– Original Message —–
From: “Brooke” <brooke@blue.netnation.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, March 06, 2004 5:01 PM
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

It’s rootbark. I’ve read different ways to prepare it, so if you have
any advice on this, that would be wonderful.

Thanks again for your support,

Hi B,

I’ve used the simple extraction recipe posted at
www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm on quite a few occasions, both for myself
and
others. It’s always given good results. The amount of liquid you have to
drink is relatively small at the end, which can really keep nausea down.
I’ve heard a lot of Bwiti groups use a similar extraction as an
alternative
to just eating it raw.

Nick

Is the root you acquired root or rootbark?
If it is rootbark 50g is more then necessary for a deep experience.
If it is
just powdered root, it’s not much. Iboga is more active night-time
as
the
brain functions in a different way at night. If there are specific
topics
you want to work on, you can use material supports as photos for
example. If
the Iboga is too much bitter you can mix it with liquid honey. Iboga
itself
knows what you need so, just be calm, and enter in the experience
without
too much expectations. It is possible that you vomit a lot (Bwiti
say
you
even vomit your mother milk…) Don’t be afraid about that it’s a
cleansing.
Take the Iboga step by step, a first spoon to test your reaction if
an hour
later you’re OK, you can take another spoon, during the process you
might be
able to find for yourself what is the right dose you need.

Good Work

Planteur
—–Message d’origine—–
De : Brooke Burgess [mailto:brooke@brokensaints.com]
Envoyé : samedi 6 mars 2004 08:17
À : ibogaine@mindvox.com
Objet : [ibogaine] Iboga Root advice

Hello everybody,

For reasons both personal and spiritual, I’ve decided to search
out
and
acquire a source of Ibogaine.

I was able to get 50g of the dried root mailed to me from a
reputable
source, and I’ve been researching how to safely and effectively
process and
use it in my home environment (with a watcher, of course).

Could anyone lend some support? Advice? Anecdotes?

I’m a relatively healthy 190lb 33yr-old male.

Thanks in advance – I appreciate anything you are willing to
share.

Brooke

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Difficulties post-ibogaine
Date: March 10, 2004 at 12:45:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi,
Has anyone anyone encountered physicall or emotional difficulties after ibogaine. I found that
I seem to get strong mood swings. Especially during times of stress or when I’m at work I sometimes feel like incredibly angry and feel alot of tension in my neck and head. I also find myself
very confused and can have difficulty concentrating on present things as there’s so many things going through my mind.
Thanks
Luke

_________________________________________________________________
STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: GermánDC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: [ibogaine]To Know Iboga
Date: March 10, 2004 at 12:38:28 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

To know Iboga in Africa, where to go ?
countrys, citys, seasons, airports, communities, etc.
my french is sort of rusted.
thanks
germán dc

From: “Randy Hencken” <randyhencken@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana
Date: March 10, 2004 at 11:20:44 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am often surprised as to how many patients arive here at the IA via former patients who are not staying clean. I think it is a testament that Ibogaine works. Even people who don’t stay clean know that Ibogaine works, they just didn’t choose to continue to stay off dope.

~Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana
Date: Tue, 9 Mar 2004 21:36:16 -0500

Patrick in his wisdom scrawled to a close with >So, my introduction to
ibogaine: some dysfunctional lunatic from
CNW/Act-Up splatters it all over MindVox; Fred Gotbetter, quite possibly
the biggest ibogaine failure on the planet, keeps hitting a reset in front
of me; and then Bob Sisko introduces me to Deborah.<

To which I say, Fuck Yeah!
This is brilliant!
I’ve spoken with a number of people who complain bitterly about how ibogaine
did not help them, but I think this is the first time I’ve read that someone
else’s repeated failing using ibogaine actually turned them on to the idea
of trying it.
Whoda thunk it?
Peace,
Preston

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From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] quick to prescribe
Date: March 10, 2004 at 12:39:15 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

tetracycline [antibiotic] from 1998

Probably still good 🙂

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] quick to prescribe
Date: March 10, 2004 at 12:19:11 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was looking over some aftercare/iboga stuff and ran across an old school list of suggestions: one of which was a suggestion to get on anti-depress/anti-anxiety meds to help with talk therapy etc.

I’ve seen those class of drugs do some good for some people, but they fuck me way up, every last one of ’em.

So, anyways, I’m going through my medicine cabinet to clean out some of the way too outdated meds (the oldest being some tetracycline [antibiotic] from 1998–the last antibiotic’s I ever took (while on methadone, I was only sick (non-dope sick) like 3 maybe 4 times the 6 years I was on the red quick sand; I’ve been sick (non-dope sick) 6 times since I kicked in July03, systM still balancing itself back from black hole land). But all the others (and these are only the ones I’ve kept, I’d bet this isnt even half of all the nastiness they continued trying to prescribe without positive results…

‘Depakote [antiepileptic prescribed as anti-anxiety if I remember correctly]’

‘trileptal [antiepileptic A Promising New Mood Stabilizer ]

‘buspirone [azaspirodecanedionesanti-anxiety]’

‘imipramine(tofranil) [tricyclic antidepressantthis was prescribed after prozac, wellbutrin and
effexer all not only didnt work but actually made things worse—yuk, yuk, yuk; makes you feel like iboga tastes] ‘

‘zyprexa [use to treat schizophrenia and acute bipolar maniahow that got in there I have no idea, if I remember correctly, their isnt like a test you can take to see if you are bi-polar, apparently, if enough anti-depressants and the like dont work
then your bi-polar, or at least, your bi-polar if the bi-polar medicine (and I use the term medicine very loosely) works]’

‘trazodone [modified cyclic antidepressant] ‘

Gabitril [antiepilepsy prescribed as anti-anxiety]

All of these made shit worse, literally making me feel like Im going crazy, but Im the asshole when I dont want to try the new shiny drug that is in the same class of drugs that made shit worse
.and I have to keep paying you money I don’t have to waste to keep prescribing me this? Did I mention being a bit nervous about lack of money? Talk is a poor substitute for action.
….silly
.

Nothing to be gained here should be on the front office door.

….and that’s not including my scripts for tamazepam (useful benzo for lack of sleep post iboga) and alprozolam (not as obvious way of saying xanex)…both of which I’ve cut out of my diet a few months ago at the suggestion of Sara, no problems, it didn’t physically hurt when I stop them unlike opioids.

So I ask myself,, self what are you looking for in all these products?

Economic security?

a healthy “plush safe he think” attitude?

Calm anxiety to the point of cloning sheep?

Is anxiety not simply higher-self saying “get off your ass and act now because every breathe is sacred”.

I suppose the trick is learning how to harness those feelings to act when it is time to act but also learning how to let go of the worries, anxieties and tribulations when it is time to rest.

I think sex in a hot-tub while getting a massage is the absolute custom fit aftercare for me, every hour on the hour
doctors orders. Fuck a buncha anti-depressants.

-Jason

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana
Date: March 10, 2004 at 12:14:34 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

… where all of this fits between hard drugs, entheogens, cannabis,
then on the other side I suppose it doesn’t exactly matter!

Which is exactly why it means so much to us. 🙂

Bill

From: “jon f.” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] voacanga africana (from C. Jenks site)
Date: March 9, 2004 at 11:24:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In the United States alone, someone checks their email every 3 seconds….

But I’m under the impression that voacanga africana in its natural state has
no therapeutic or even psychedelic value….

Why (or how) is it used in traditional African rituals? Presumably they
don’t have a modern chemistry laboratory… does anyone know if they
prepare it in any special manner?

According to erowid, it’s traditionally used for “visionary
experiences”…

From: “jon f.” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine or Lobotomy? …you decide
Date: March 9, 2004 at 11:19:00 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In the United States alone, someone checks their email every 3 seconds….

yeah me too- I like my demons.

oh, and yeah… i like my demons too… =)

From: “jon f.” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine or Lobotomy? …you decide
Date: March 9, 2004 at 11:18:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In the United States alone, someone checks their email every 3 seconds….

Peace,
Preston (but apparently it has worked for some people- so who’s to judge?)

Fair enough…

you know, i mean, if someone’s derived benefit from it, that’s cool and
all..

but i think, on average, for most conditions, most people would be better
off with other procedures…

that is, with procedures that have a more solid record of effectiveness..

From: rickc@ziplip.com <rickc@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana
Date: March 9, 2004 at 10:47:18 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Wanted to say I haven’t been reading this list very long, but when I arrived here it simply looked like a lot of anger with occasional useful information. Then came the storm after KRON and CSI and somewhere between that and right now, all of you have come into focus and started to make sense to me as a large very dysfunctional family.

I’m enjoying reading all this and getting to understand more. Thanks to everyone who takes the time to be more enlightening and thanks Patrick, I enjoyed your reply to me and I appreciate you taking the time to write it. To repeat what’s been said so many times, you’re a great writer and make your material come alive. When your material are some of the people on this list, it helps to figure out who they are. What do you charge for PR and do Mash and Dana get special rates?

I still don’t know where all of this fits between hard drugs, entheogens, cannabis, then on the other side I suppose it doesn’t exactly matter!

Thank you

Rick Coster
rickc@ziplip.com

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004, 6:45 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana

—– Original Message —–
From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, March 09, 2004 5:13 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana

Kids, KidZ, ChildrenS … I step out of the room for 5 minutes and alla
youz are beating each other over the heyd with sledgehammers.

All I’m gonna do, is step back a few paces and take a look at the Bigger
Picture. Have Dana’s recent actions been particularly helpful in
furthering the cause of ibogaine…? Well, prolly not. Would it be a
good idea to occasionally roll the dice, and try to get a sanity check…?
You bet! Is anything that is being said here going to change anything?
Fuck no. <Shrug>

Judging Dana within the context of nothing else besides his actions in the
near-past, is not going to paint a very positive picture. Whoopsie, shit
happens.

<Taking a few steps back — I said I was gonna do that, remember?> … all
of ibogaine really is this very weird, sweeping, psychedelic soap opera;
with very strange connections where the most unlikely people intersect at
certain points in time, and synchronicity takes over.

My VERY FIRST exposure to ever hearing about this thing called “ibogaine,”
came in 1992 or early ’93, when some person from Cures Not Wars/ACT-UP,
who was on MindVox, splattered the ICASH Treatment thing all over half the
conferences (most of which had absolutely nothing to do with the subject
matter … ‘course, if they had not done this, it wouldn’t have caught my
attention, and I never would have read it, “Why the fuck, is this stupid
bullshit, plastered all over the 3l33t h4x0R conference!?!??!”). And, I
read it, thought it was really interesting, and then forgot about it;
because, I mean, who the hell would want to stop doing heroin?

A few years later, around ’94/’95 I was hanging out in shooting galleries
on the Lower East Side with Fred Gotbetter. And Fred was basically cool
people, and someone who had a really good heart. He was also an absolute
fucking disaster area, “I’m rich and I have a trust fund!” Then … why
are you a homeless person who sleeps in a cardboard box in an alley? “By
choice man! Say, can I borrow $20 bucks!?!?!?!”

And, oddly enough, that was pretty much the truth. He had a trust fund
which got shut down as soon as he was sprung again; he would clean up,
stay clean just long enough for his executor to release some cash, and get
resprung almost instantly. Fred was actually IDEAL St. Kitts material,
and really would have thrived there!

But anyway, so there’s this guy who I see sitting next to me, bangin’ up a
bundle in one shot … and then, every so often, he vanishes for a coupla
days, and returns … without a habit.

By 94/95 my heroin use was well on it’s way to being a PROBLEM, which I
was trying to cut loose, without much success. I hadn’t done URODs yet,
but I’d been through pretty much every other treatment modality that was
available. And it just didn’t make any sense. Because NOTHING THAT
EXISTS — which I knew about — could accomplish what I was sitting there
and seeing right in front of me … on a regular fucking basis.

I mean, it didn’t do shit for Fred in the long-term. I think the longest
I ever saw him stay clean was about 3 weeks; but what made a TREMENDOUS
fucking impact was seeing someone strung-out as fuck, going from that
state, into a TOTAL reset, in ’bout 72 hours.

THAT caught my attention. Everything else was like, well, whatever.
“Ibogaine is an absolute miracle! I’ve done it 27 times now and I JUST
KNOW it’ll KEEP WORKING right around ibogaine 30 or 35, and
furthermore…” <ClunK!> Uhm … anybody got sum coke? I think Fred OD’d
again … if nobody is holding, he may, in fact, stay dead… Eightball
anyone?

To compress what is an entire chapter, into a few paragraphs: Fred would
do ibogaine, and then … NOTHING at all. He wouldn’t change his clothes,
take a shower, or actually do ANYTHING to move away from drug-dependence.
I mean, sorta obviously, ‘cuz he was back in the shooting galleries three
days later. Except he was only going to smoke pot and do nothing else…
Which — to give him many props — lasted a few days, sometimes a week or
two; but inevitably, he’d always get sprung again.

Was Fred Gotbetter — who had a GREAT name! — an effective spokesperson
for ibogaine…? Well, in my case the answer is: fuck yeah. If I hadn’t
sat there and watched this surreal comedy routine happening right in front
of me, I dunno if I would have ever paid much attention to ibogaine, or
remembered it again. And the only reason I knew what it was, is because
some fucking annoying lunatic splattered it all over our system.

I exited NYC, didn’t follow through and pursue any of it, because I
realized I didn’t actually have a drug problem — I just had CASHFLOW
ISSUES, which I solved — wandered the Earth, and landed back in NYC, with
a killer habit on top of 200mg of methadone. I tried to find Fred, and
could not locate him. Using hindsight, this was due to the fact that I
was searching in 1998, while he OD’d and stayed dead — in Pieman’s house
in fact!!! — in 1997. @#*$&@#$ Time Machine! WRONG YEAR!

While I knew who Howard was, I didn’t KNOW him back then; called up,
nothing much was happening, there was Panama if I wanted to wait; I didn’t
think to ask Dana; and … I wound up talking to Bob Sisko … about 25
times. Who talked to me, and kept talking to me, and kept talking to me,
and … didn’t have anything to sell me, yet kept talking to me, and in
fact gave me Deborah’s phone number, and made me aware of her existence,
‘cuz in 1998, I had never heard of her.

Which is, eventually, how I landed at St. Kitts in 1999.

So, my introduction to ibogaine: some dysfunctional lunatic from
CNW/Act-Up splatters it all over MindVox; Fred Gotbetter, quite possibly
the biggest ibogaine failure on the planet, keeps hitting a reset in front
of me; and then Bob Sisko introduces me to Deborah.

It’s a strange world n’ shit. I’ve adapted to my environment and become a
strange person. <Shrug>

– – – – – – – – –

So anywaze … Dana … is, a Complete Fucking Lunatic. So are most of my
friends. This is okay. The PROBLEM is, Dana lacks an [OFF] switch, and
usually has no outer awareness of the fact that he’s being completely
fucking crazy. But, if someone else is present, who Dana trusts, that
just says, “Dana, you’re acting crazy again. Just chill out.” HE DOES.

Dana HAS done a tremendous amount of good for a variety of causes. At the
same time, he has also effectively had himself edited out of history,
because he CANNOT SHUT UP and lacks that [OFF] switch. This is a bummer
and all.

Why does Iboga Therapy House exist…? Because Dana never shuts up about
ibogaine, and Marc eventually listened to him, and followed through. Why
have a large variety of events related to ibogaine seen the light of day.
Because of Dana.

Did Dana IRREPARABLY HARM and CAUSE DAMAGE TO “The Ibogaine Movement,
Mahn!” Uhm … I don’t think such a thing is possible. Look! We have a
HALLUCINOGEN that CURES DRUG ADDICTION!@#!@#!!!! And … many of its
loudest proponents are Complete Fucking Lunatics. No! What’re the
odds!?!?!?

Anywaze, when people call me up and dump all the, “Dana is RUINING
ibogaine!!!!” material into my headspace; they are sometimes disappointed
that I don’t respond with a lotta fervor and passionately agree with ’em.
I mention I’ve already had all these conversations years ago, and I’m not
sure anyone listens to me, or believes it. However, everything sticks to
something on that wunnerful InterneT thing. This is ONE message — that
survived — in a thread containing roughly 50 of ’em, where I had the same
reaction to Dana, that people are having RIGHT NOW:

http://health.groups.yahoo.com/group/ibogaine/message/5152

Dana is less than perfect; he does a lotta damage, he does a lotta good.
There is a balance within all that. At the end of the day, has he done
more good than harm…? In my own opinion, that answer is: YES. Which, I
think, is pretty much all you can ask for. So, yeah, I guess he is the
koOky UnclE! Why not.

And, uhm, Dana … <Removing Armor, Ego, and Testosterone> … dude.
C’mon. You’ve been talking about the Bwiti for approximately 300 years
now. Isn’t it time to meet ’em…? Philip K. Dick is hanging out, and
discussing philosophy with Fred Gotbetter. Well, some of the time. Fred
is sorta busy; this is Kali Yuga and he made it to minor Sainthood. St.
Jude always needed an assistant.

Patrick

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From: Brooke Burgess <brooke@brokensaints.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice
Date: March 9, 2004 at 9:51:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for posing these questions Adam.

I too was wondering about rootbark amounts (I have 50g to work with),
measurement translations (we work in ml here in Canuckland), and how much
extract would result.

Let me know if you hear anything, or if anyone else could help. I’d like to
prepare for my ‘journey’ at the end of the month.

Best,

Brooke
www.brokensaints.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, March 10, 2004 2:37 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Nick – Re: Iboga Root advice

Hiya Nick,

Got a few questions regarding the home-made extraction…

How much rootbark would one use with the 70cl of vodka etc..?

Ok to pulverize the rootbark prior to, uh, vodkalizing it..?

When it states ‘let the liquid stand for 12 hours’, does that mean
open-air/counter-top or sealed jar in fridge…?

Can you give a rough estimate as to how much extract/liquid would one end
up
with (single dose)?

And how neutral is the extract, taste-wise…?

many thanks,

Adam

http://www.puzzlepiece.org/ibogaine/literature/jenks2002.pdf

—– Original Message —–
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nicks22@onetel.com>

Hi B,

I’ve used the simple extraction recipe posted at
www.ibogaine.co.uk/extract.htm on quite a few occasions, both for myself
and
others. It’s always given good results. The amount of liquid you have to
drink is relatively small at the end, which can really keep nausea down.
I’ve heard a lot of Bwiti groups use a similar extraction as an
alternative
to just eating it raw.

Nick

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Advocacy and Dana
Date: March 9, 2004 at 9:36:16 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com