Ibogaine List Archives – 2004-11

From: Patrick K. Kroupa <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sacrament of Transition
Date: November 30, 2004 at 11:29:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The Sacrament list has been open for over a year at this point, but not completely on.  As of last week, it is fully operational.  You can sign onto it by sending email to:

sacrament-subscribe@mindvox.com

The list is provided by Sacrament of Transition, which is a registered religion in the country of Slovenia.  I think it’s highly cool, but then, I’m somewhat biased, being a higH Priest.  All that being said, the sacrament is much better than those white wafer things — please pass the guilt — they always gave me before I got thrown out of parochial skoOl.

The list itself does not focus on any particular religion.  We’ve got pretty much everybody here from the Bwiti to born-again Christians, and everybody is welcome to take part.

The focus is on the spiritual aspects of ibogaine.  SPIRITUALITY not RELIGION.  Please do not feel compelled to hammer your particular brand of dogma down other people’s throats; somebody could choke on all that and then turn around and sue you.

I don’t think anybody is searching for the ONE TRUE ANSWER — but just in case you are, I’m sure that half a dozen people swathed within the soothing glow of their messianic complex in full bloom, will be happy to share all of life’s answers…  Uhm, I meant to say: please try to be respectful of other people, their belief systems, and opinions.

And, if at all possible, just be aware that the ibogaine EVERYTHING forum, is right HERE.  Try not to drag war stories, junkie coffee talk, and politics, into the sacrament area.

Thanks,

Patrick / Sacrament of Transition

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From: Patrick K. Kroupa <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] The Ibogaine List
Date: November 30, 2004 at 11:24:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Nov 27, 2004, at 4:54 AM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

Kirsty, grass skirts and dirt huts? Man that sounds good. I know your kidding but everyone down south in the states goes barefoot and has a straw in their mouth and we won’t talk about the sheep. That is a joke. Sometimes I get misunderstood. Anyway, as they say in the rooms “we need em all”. Words of wisdom or reminders of what not to do we need them all. From now on I will think of the penguins Preston sent to us and try and refrain from verbal barbs. We ought to ask Patrick what he thinks ought to be on the list. I think I already know. He’s as twisted as most of here and I love him for it. O MY GOD. Help, I’m a Patrick groupie. I won’t screw him but I will twist up a fat one and hold a gun to his head and make him smoke it. Blueberry. I joke but what the hell, we all could use a laugh every once in a while. This list has been my saving grace. I think that is what Patrick has in mind. For me and you and everyone else who stumbles upon it.     Randy

The purpose of the list is to allow people with an interest in ibogaine to communicate with one another, in whatever manner they see fit to do so.

Over the years it has grown tremendously; the topics are rearranged, the content changes, the positive/negative energy ebbs and flows … and a huge influx of new faces keeps arriving.

The dynamic is remarkably consistent, it goes through cycles which repeat themselves — but the overall tone and vibe, is a highly positive one.  People who come here looking for help, get help.  Those searching for community or support, find it.  Individuals who want to cause problems and argue with everybody, don’t have any trouble obtaining what they want either.

I wrote the introduction/summary for the Ibogaine List, many years after we opened it.  I didn’t write it, and then things somehow magically conformed to my wishes.  I just wrote what IS.

What you find here is entirely dependent on what you’re looking for.

Anything, everything, nothing,

Patrick

p.s., Randy and Sean: love you both, and rock the fuck out.

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: sub
Date: November 30, 2004 at 11:20:24 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

3yrs, i’m a weary public defender who’s 54yobup 0.3mg 4x a day 3yrs fir pain management. it’s got a jones
—– Original Message —– From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 6:59 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: sub

The great thing about Ibogaine Ron is that it gives us hope.  How long
have
you been on the Bup?  Check out the detox forum I mentioned.  If you post
your details there like how much you take and for how long there’s people
there who can give you first hand advice on tapering the Bup if you need
it,
or just support.  Do remember that they ain’t Doctors though, the best
thing
they say is ‘let your body guide you’.  Good luck with your taper-remember
to take it one day at a time.  What’s your career?  Do you enjoy it?

Love Hannah

—– Original Message —– From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: sub

thanks hannah, i think i’m screwed. been on bup im 1.2 mg per day..liquid
amps.  i’m trying to taper that and benzos.  i’ll probably lose my career
and everything else before it’s over.  i’m in my 50’s now and drugs quit
being fun when i was in my 20’s.  addiction is a powerful thing. ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 30, 2004 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: sub

> Hi Ron,
>
> So far I’ve never been off my Sub apart from when I was using so I
> can’t
> answer that.  I’ve been on it 9 months though so I’m not looking
> forward
> to
> it.  My Doctor etc here in the UK all say that Sub is not addictive and
> that
> you should not suffer at all as long as you taper off it.  However I’ve
> heard plenty of tales that disagree.  I guess I’ll have to wait and
> see.
> How long have you been taking it?  What’s your dosage?  There’s an
> opiate-detox forum with a bit all about Buprenorphine so you could go
> there
> and read people’s posts for info.  (There’s a Bup forum and an info one
> that
> I think has some details too)  But I’ve never got a solid answer out of
> it.
> Look for a guy called ‘Bup4pain’ if he’s still about-he really knows
what
> he’s talking about.
>
> http://64.226.201.78/Forum/default.asp
>
> I’m no Doctor but surely you have to deal with one addiction at a time?
> Benzos or Sub?  I feel for you with the benzo WD.
>
> Have you read up on Ibogaine?  If not definately check out The ibogaine
> Dossier for info.  The others will know better-can you use Ibo to knock
> both
> Sub and Benzos on the head?  I’m hoping to do Ibogaine very very soon
> so
> I’ll let you know how it works with the sub.
>
> Love Hannah
>
>
> —– Original Message —– > From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
> To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
> Sent: Saturday, October 30, 2004 2:47 PM
> Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: sub
>
>
>> any problem coming off sub?
>> —– Original Message —– >> From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
>> To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>> Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 2:30 PM
>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Little ol’ me
>>
>>
>> >I take 4mg when I feel I really need to.  I had stabilised on 4mg
>> >back
>> > before.  Today and yesterday I took 12mg.  I expect to be back down
to
> 4mg
>> > by the end of the week but I’ll see how it goes.
>> >
>> > I hear what you’re saying about my friend.  Can’t we just both try
> harder?
>> > I really could never leave him on th street-then he’d be straight
back
>> > into
>> > it.  I have got meaner with him and told him he CANNOT keep doing it
at
> my
>> > flat and must have respect for my efforts.  I’m just as bad as he is
>> > though-before its been him that did well and ME who fucked things up
>> > for
>> > HIM.  Give us a couple of weeks an see.  He needs to sort out a
>> > place
>> > anyway-he will just get more depressed if he doesn’t start working
> towards
>> > a
>> > goal.  I will be stronger.  I’m sorry everyone-I know it looks
>> > simple
>> > to
>> > you
>> > but I’d rather be a junkie for the rest of my life than be
responsible
> for
>> > hurting anyone else.  And I really think throwing him out would
really
>> > hurt
>> > him.
>> >
>> >
>> > —– Original Message —– >> > From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
>> > To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>> > Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 8:01 PM
>> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Little ol’ me
>> >
>> >
>> > Sorry Hannah, but it is you or your friend.  Your call.
>> >
>> > What dose of subutex are you taking?
>> >
>> > Howard
>> >
>> > In a message dated 10/29/04 1:04:25 PM, hannah.clay@ntlworld.com
>> > writes:
>> >
>> >>Hi everyone,
>> >
>> >>I’m feeling sorry for myself so I thought I’d write.  I’ve really
>> >>messed
>> >>up.
>> >>I was a H addict for 4yrs doing a bit of evrything else too at
>> >>times.
>> >>I
>> >>
>> >>tried to detoc lots of times.  Then I was put on Subutex and was
clean
>> >>for
>> >>
>> >>like a month (the longest I’;ve ever been clean) I keep trying
though.
>> >> Then
>> >>
>> >>my old partner in crime got chucked out onto the streets so I said
>> >>he
>> >>could
>> >>
>> >>stay with me.  But we’re etrrible influences on each other-if one’s
> being
>> >>
>> >>good then the other always seems to want to be bad.  Anyway recenty
we
>> >>got
>> >>
>> >>into Snowballs (H&Crack IV) which I’ve done lots before but never
>> > regularly.
>> >>
>> >>I love that high.  I wish I could feel like that all the time!  Now
>> > detoxing
>> >>
>> >>and just staying on my Subbies is even harder.  They don’t make me
feel
>> >>
>> >>better anymore.  I can’t tell anyone cuz they’ll chuck me off my
>> >>script.
>> >> I
>> >>
>> >>had got my life back a bit and now I’m losing what little I gained
cuz
>> >>I’m
>> >>
>> >>always sick.  Todays only Day 2 (again) with just Subbies and I feel
so
>> >>
>> >>awful 🙁  I’ve mainly slept for the past 48hrs I can’t stop shaking
>> >>and
>> >>
>> >>crying.  I’m not being sick or needing the loo too much which is a
> godsend
>> >>
>> >>(I do try to feel grateful for that) but I just feel so CRAP!  My
>> >>friend
>> >>is
>> >>
>> >>being good too though he keeps moaning and begging me to score (does
he
>> >>
>> >>think I’m made of cash?  I spent over £200 on H and rock on tues and
>> >>wed
>> >>
>> >>easy) And my dealers won’t stop ringing me.  My phones on silent now
>> >>cuz
>> >>I
>> >>
>> >>don’t feel like talking to anyone.  Sorry if my spellings bad but my
> hands
>> >>
>> >>won’t stop shaking.  Even if I scored I wouldn’t be able to get
> myself-my
>> >>
>> >>hands are so sore and swollen from missing.
>> >
>> >>Ok That’s my moaning out the way.  I guess I’ll just go back to bed.
I
>> >>just
>> >>
>> >>wanna feel good.  I never did Snowballs in company cuz I like to
really
>> >>FEEL
>> >>
>> >>it.  My n my friend meditate on it breathing deeply ooooh…… stop
>> >>
>> >>talking.  I’ve been clean before though n life was boring.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>I’m not really expecting replies I just wanted to vent.  Basically
just
>> >>
>> >>feeling sorry for myself.  I just feel like this will never end.
I’ll
>> >>never
>> >>
>> >>feel good again without drugs of one sort or nother.
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>I’ll stop now.  I’m gonna make a hot sweet cup of tea.  I’d have a
> shower
>> >>
>> >>but I think i’d collapse.  Now I think about it I haven’t eaten
>> >>since
>> >>
>> >>Wednesday anyway n hardly drtunk anything.  That’s probably why I
feel
>> >>so
>> >>
>> >>weak!  I’ll try eat some soup or summat easily digestable.
>> >
>> >>Thanks for listening.
>> >>
>> >>Hannah
>> >
>> >
>> >
>> >
>
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 30, 2004 at 11:17:03 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

getting clean is not about good intentions or wil power. Hijacked brain by chemical terrorist.
Pray for the willingness and get a good comfortable detox. If you are not dependant and still want to boot up, then maybe you have to hit a bottom. Yet, the elevator stop at many floors. You don’t have to take it to the basement.

hang in there man. Just throw it away again. keep trying one day at a time. program or no program. Each time you don’t use even though you want to, the urge will leave quicker and you will get your personal power back.

From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801
Date: November 30, 2004 at 10:59:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You love walking guilty people?  I’m not impressed.  Do you also like to sentence innocent people?

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801
Date: Tue, 30 Nov 2004 21:11:14 -0600

i am cyber moron. pen ball era. low on the curve. pre pac man and hi tech stuff, put me in a courtroom and i shine. i love walking guilty people when the judge and govt are convinced there’s a guilty coming down and they dbl team me. perverse?  you bet   i do have morals though. i d/n understand computers but am trying to learn    . i have a long ways to go. video games were something that d/n produce enough endorphins.  rather mtn bike ron sky diver , scuba cave certified.adddict—– Original Message —– From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 10:01 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801

On Nov 26, 2004, at 11:08 PM, Ron Davis wrote:

no program to open
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 10:06 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801

Ron … just to ask a crazy question, why are you signed up for the digest and the list, simultaeneously — like, all at once for instance…  If you really do want TwicE tHe FuN, and double the joy, far be it from me to argue.

When you doubleclick the digest, whatever box you are using — I’m gonna guess Windoze — does not know what to open it WITH.  It’s just a plain text file; throw it on any text editor like Notepad or whatever, and then it’ll associate that app with the digests, in the future — unless it doesn’t… In which case it won’t work at all, or partially, and only once.  After that, the only other way to get it to work is to put on magickIcaL RubY reD slipPerz and click your heels together three times and say, “I believe!”

Photoz plZ

Patrick

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_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801
Date: November 30, 2004 at 11:01:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

mountain biking is way better than geeking on the computer anyhow, Ron.

the first time i used a computer it freaked me out so bad it took me 6-7 more years to attempt it again. Now i can’t get away from ’em.

certified_cyber_junkie,
_.dh

On Tuesday, November 30, 2004, at 05:11 PM, Ron Davis wrote:

i am cyber moron. pen ball era. low on the curve. pre pac man and hi tech stuff, put me in a courtroom and i shine. i love walking guilty people when the judge and govt are convinced there’s a guilty coming down and they dbl team me. perverse?  you bet   i do have morals though. i d/n understand computers but am trying to learn    . i have a long ways to go. video games were something that d/n produce enough endorphins.  rather mtn bike ron sky diver , scuba cave certified.adddict

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801
Date: November 30, 2004 at 10:11:14 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i am cyber moron. pen ball era. low on the curve. pre pac man and hi tech stuff, put me in a courtroom and i shine. i love walking guilty people when the judge and govt are convinced there’s a guilty coming down and they dbl team me. perverse?  you bet   i do have morals though. i d/n understand computers but am trying to learn    . i have a long ways to go. video games were something that d/n produce enough endorphins.  rather mtn bike ron sky diver , scuba cave certified.adddict—– Original Message —– From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 10:01 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801

On Nov 26, 2004, at 11:08 PM, Ron Davis wrote:

no program to open
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 10:06 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801

Ron … just to ask a crazy question, why are you signed up for the digest and the list, simultaeneously — like, all at once for instance…  If you really do want TwicE tHe FuN, and double the joy, far be it from me to argue.

When you doubleclick the digest, whatever box you are using — I’m gonna guess Windoze — does not know what to open it WITH.  It’s just a plain text file; throw it on any text editor like Notepad or whatever, and then it’ll associate that app with the digests, in the future — unless it doesn’t… In which case it won’t work at all, or partially, and only once.  After that, the only other way to get it to work is to put on magickIcaL RubY reD slipPerz and click your heels together three times and say, “I believe!”

Photoz plZ

Patrick

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From: “” <thethird@myway.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] To Jasen
Date: November 30, 2004 at 9:58:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen, Do you feel like sharing the details of your experience? I love reading about other people’s visions and when you have enough energy I wondered if you’d want to type it all out. I am glad that I typed up and saved the details of my experience because it helps me to remember what I saw. If it’s too personal though, I understand. I want to work with people who are using Ibogaine to kick and I want to find out some of the best things to do after the experience to make the most out of it. If you think of anything during the next few weeks that you think helped you get more out of what you went through, whether it be sitting and trying to re visualize certain parts of your visions or drawing pictures of what you saw or anything you can come up with, i would really be grateful if you would tell me what it was that helped you. Congratulations on a successful journey!

No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding.
Make My Way your home on the Web – http://www.myway.com

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] To Miss Iboga (Julie)
Date: November 30, 2004 at 6:07:44 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Giving me hope,
Keep the stories rolling on in please
Love to all on your various stages of your journies.
Big Reiki Bubbles coming to you.
Kirk
From: Jeffgd1@aol.com [mailto:Jeffgd1@aol.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, 1 December 2004 5:57 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] To Miss Iboga (Julie)

In a message dated 11/30/04 11:39:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:
As with other methods of detox, TIME is the only way
to truly recover…don’t worry, Fake Placebo: if your
TIME hasn’t come yet, it will soon…

cheers,
Julie
it sure does time is moving so so slow i have ahard time believing that relief is in sight  but i don’t crave getting high on dope and will NEVER go back on Methadone it would be a life sentence At 45 i know that this is my last shot
Iboga is simply a miracle gods gift the ancient cure thgat was waiting
feeling pretty weak still but nothing like 2 weeks ago so that aint bad
freak freely!
Jeff

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 30, 2004 at 6:02:54 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen, I wish that taking Iboga was an option here, I for one would like to do some research on the differences. I think it is a problem of logistics for the reason to use Ibogaine. Hcl. doesn’t take up that much room therefore it is easier to conceal. Did you take Indra or root bark? I sure would like to see Sara at work.      Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) new book contract
Date: November 30, 2004 at 5:57:19 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all, as I just posted (in slightly different form) on Jules Siegel’s awesome journalism list
Newsroom-L:

Because I consider everyone here compatriots and fellow travelers and even some of you good friends of mine whether we’ve met face to face or not (even if you’re not a druggie or an addict or even all that interested in anything I’m doing personally, you’re subscribed here so you rate- and I’ve always found it a bit weird this internet thing, in how I can make friends I never see face to face all over the world, much more readily that ever could be done with simply old fashioned mail, right?), I have to let loose here with a wee little bit of crowing-

I signed a new book contact today! YAAAAAAA!

I know, it sound like I’m bragging but I’m not, but I am very excited and thrilled and happy and ecstatic and overjoyed and all the rest of the emotions that come from obtaining an official contact and meager advance. (Can’t wait ’til I get one of those infamous 6 digit advances I’ve read about here and there- but don’t see that coming anytime soon anyway, darn it.)
It hasn’t a single thing to do with anything I’m known for writing and researching, like drugs or prohbition say, but it’s a topic(s) I love and have been working very hard on already these past couple of weeks (so how in the heck I can be going through the irritating hassles I’ve been putting myself as noted on the ibogaine list is beyond me still- but I’m making plans and trying to arrest my undevelopement as soon and fast as possible, including being extremely open with V again, contrary to what I wrote on the ibo list recently- if anyone on DrugWar wants more details ask and I might fill you all in).
So, if anyone here has knowlege of ancient lost civilizations, technologies and/or mysteries, I’d be more than happy to read any submissions anyone cares to submit to me between now and March 15, 2005. The book, tentatively titled “Mysterious Roots- the Disinformation Guide to Lost Civilizations, Technologies and Mysteries,” is slated for release next Fall, 2005.
Ok, thanks for letting me crow a bit here, and carry on all.
(So Paula, is this happy enough news for you? ;-)) )

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Breathing
Date: November 30, 2004 at 5:51:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I want to see the FACTS. Going on supposition doesn’t cut it with me. I’ve been a junkie or an alcoholic almost all of my life I think I know there are unscrupulous people in the world. I’ve been reading this list and everything else I can find about Ibogaine for a year and a half. Do I act like I don’t have the capacity to retain facts or something? I can’t cosign bullshit for anybody.           Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] War Storiez
Date: November 30, 2004 at 5:25:48 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

egad Dave.
I love you.
You are an inspiration to me, and the more I read about you, the more I think, “well, maybe it’s/I’m not hopeless afterall.”
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 4:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] War Storiez

getting loaded behind the wheel… reminds me of copping and firing up, then driving back north in the suicide lane the the golden gate bridge, nodding out behind the wheel and plowing thru the flimsy dividing  pylons into oncoming traffic, narrowly averting head-ons. Not exactly  fun, or thoughtful. Vista point was my landing zone, if I made it there  I was safe. obviously i did, many a time. I don’t know how or why, it  was as if I were in a bullet proof bubble.

Then there was the time i went to cop from a junkie in a hotel in the tenderloin. I just had a baby habit, and was only smoking my dope on foil. I had instructions to go to the 6th floor, room 602 and knock 5 times softly. When the door opened i was horrified at what lay beyond. Piles of dirty laundry, beer cans and cigarette buts and ashes everywhere, blood stains on the wall and ceiling and it stank of detox sweat and cum and beer and cigarettes. There was a path that went from the door to the bed, and from the bed to the sink in the corner. The  rest was piled knee-waist high with junk. I was appalled anyone could  live like that. eventually, I would stay to get loaded, and when I  became homeless I crashed there. I sank lower than this person, because  I couldn’t even get it together to have a pad of my own. I would steal  his dope in a heartbeat, yet this person would lie sick for 3 days  waiting for someone to come by and send him out to cop so he could get  well. He had the integrity of a saint, which amazed me. This was a  junkie with ethics, don’t ever steal, don’t ever get off till you are  home and safe. Any bathroom or alleyway would do for me, the sooner the  better.

In the end I would scour the floor for dropped balloons when his back  was turned, and I eventually discovered he would drop thick, black  cottons between the bed and the wall for “rainy” days. I would pick  these cottons up, brushing away cock roaches and ashes and rat shit and  slam that thick black goo into my arm.

He died 4 years ago of hepC, and amazingly, after sharing the same cottons and spoons, I am hepC Free.

Oh yes, I am living on borrowed time.

_.dh

On Tuesday, November 30, 2004, at 10:47 AM, Preston Peet wrote:

yeah, getting off in traffic was (almost) always fun too, although I  was usually in the back of a cab. Oh goodness, one time I did my  speedball, then had a complete psychotic breakdown, with huge  cockroaches streaming from the trash on the floor, which due to the  stormy rainy day outside was full of a puddle. So I freaked out,  trying to grab all the bugs from off my face while feeling them  storming up the insides of my pants and sweater sleeves. That wasn’t  fun at all. I tried to get indignant when we pulled into our stop and  my rig was sitting in plain sight on the floor, floating in  aforementioned puddle. “That’s awful, why don’t you clean you cab man?  I coulda been stabbed!”
He glared at me and said, “That’s yours and get outta my cab.”
Oh well.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

Hi Preston, I read of the thrill you received doing speedballs in the Diner,
I understand. My favorite place was on the freeway in 5 o’clock rush
hour-speedway traffic, to see if I could “keep-it-together, I had a fast car
at the time and could get a vein with out too much challenge.
brad

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 8:02 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA
+ ? Hannah

Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in  blood
crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally  against H.
My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog  shit and
old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am
I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
and what I consider normal now.
Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.<

This is EXACTLY what I was writing about earlier, the notes like this one
Hannah. I can totally and completely empathize and am really heartily
wishing you well, sending you strength and courage. You are how old please,
if you don’t mind my asking? I think you mentioned it just the other day
(23?- because I remember responding to someone noting that age here  and
think it mighta been you) but I’m not sure. Regardless, as bad as it seems
now, it can get worse, and it can definitely get better. I’m sure you know
that, irregardless of how awful it can seem when sitting there trying to get
a vein (oh my god, I can remember doing what you’ve described here,  but not
only in the privacy of someone’s apartment or squat but also, more often
than not actually, doing this exact same vein hunt in stairwells, allyways,
parkbenches, behind garbage cans, cafe bathrooms, diner tables, etc, etc. I
mean, there were times I’d have a great vein, usually a teeny one  that I’d
managed to find just the right angle to hit it with, making shooting  up in
public, at diner tables as mentioned (one of my very favorite places  to
shoot up used to be in very public places like diners, right at the table,
as that gave me that extra adrenaline boost. Of course, it was often  an
interesting experience in that when speedballing, I’d feel the cocaine
first, so would be sitting there first witht that roaring in my ears, then
bugs all over me while trying to figure out which person in the diner was
NOT a cop.
Boy oh boy, what fun that was!

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Hannah

I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking
Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now
on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X  and I’ve
been on a few.  Its a bummer.

I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m
23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation,  well I
live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the
more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re
putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!

Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me  luck! I
want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear.
I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to  just help
me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like  the
music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are
travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always  know where
the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the  clubs are
all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.

The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but  it
isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it
with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was
the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But  the pills
just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if
you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m  fucked I’ll
still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.

I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.

Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as  I woke
up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer
and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came
over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it  takes
hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my  artery so
my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends
were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I  felt like
a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to
muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear  the past
week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins
just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give
blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong
profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to
myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours  covered in
blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in  lumps. I
remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally  against H.
My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking  what am I
doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
and what I consider normal now.

Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort  myself out.
I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep  doing
this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs  I had
improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months
I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I  had to
go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I
kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like
that definition of insanity, I am insane.

But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….

Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
Hannah

PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far  more
partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Hannah

Hannah,

you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
gay guys know how to party !!

I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
is!!

I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
refer to the last sentence of the previous
paragraph…

love Julie 🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Oslo
Date: November 30, 2004 at 5:24:08 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

no but I lived in Bergen for almost a year (where I was first introduced to speed- but though thye people who introduced me were shooting it I was not- my needle use came later, although I had experience from hospitalization with lots and lots and lots of needles already, perhaps being a major reason why I took so long to pick one up myself), and was married to a Norweigan woman for a couple of years. (Thank god she left me, or who knows where and with whom I’d be today.)
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Dana Beal
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 4:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Oslo

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-heroin29nov29,0,2616070.story?coll=la-home-headlines

Anyone on this list from Norway??

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From: “booker w” <swbooker@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Low dose Ibogaine Sessions
Date: November 30, 2004 at 4:57:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Lee.  I am interested in experimenting with low-dose eboga and am wondering what a low-dose session is typically like.  Do you still find the need to lay down and be perfectly still and does it consume the whole day, etc.  You mentioned low doses at around 5 mg/kg, but at that dose I feel like I’ve taken a “big dose.”  They say women are often more sensitive to ibogaine, and I feel that that is certainly true for me. I would probably take far smaller amounts.  Anyway, any answers appreciated…
Best, Sandy
PS – Randy I think you are spot-on about Ms. Mash.  When I experienced some physical symptoms after my third ibo session I talked to her and she of course tried to convince me that it must not’ve been real ibogaine, and why would I take the chance in the “underground!”  I think she tries to discredit anyone but her own place, which spells dollars for her, and certainly goes against the spirit of Eboga I think too.  The idea that someone was left for dead in a hotel by an ibogaine provider sounds utterly ludicrous to me.  Hope someone does write the LA Times…

>From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>

>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?

>Date: Mon, 29 Nov 2004 14:47:09 +0000 (GMT)

>

>Dear “not so slow” Slowone

>

>Thank you very much for your reply. Very interesting indeed.

>

>In my own case (apart from 3 therapeutic MDMA sessions after my first eboga experience) I have based the past 6 years of my journey on the sacramental use of eboga to travel the inner recesses of my psyche and encounter the hidden demons of my past. I have unlocked practically every door (I am presently aware of) within me and have experienced nothing short of miraculous recovery. I eagerly look forward to completing the 3 books I am working on to share all the details of what I have experienced.

>

>So I have not felt any need to enter the world of ayahuasca. However from what you write it is definitely something I will explore at some stage. Forgive me if I say (what some may take as heresy) but I find eboga to be a complete cure when used with the right intention, a sufficiently discerning mind and a heart that seeks as its ultimate goal a deep experience of love. Why?

>

>Because it is very much spiritually guided and events in one life fall into place to move the process along if one is willing to undergo the changes and take the risks.

>

>I like what you say about eboga and how it brings you in contact with specific deep issues. (I assume we are talking about low doses here) It confirms exactly what I am trying to promote in my writings: the use of eboga to resolve childhood trauma and abuse and to advance ones spirituality via the growth of consciousness which ensues.

>

>There is absolutely no doubt that ongoing use of eboga is both surprising and humbling. It is also wonderfully liberating.

>

>The part I find interesting for myself is how I went from a scientific agnostic to a believer & admirer of the God and the Goddess. Two great kind (non imposing) and generous entities in my opinon. You could say the perfect parents. And yet with them I sense a humility which accepts me lovingly as I am and allows me to grow from there. Its almost like a growing friendship.

>

>Good idea to use as an adjunct to therapy.

>

>One observation I would make on the healing action of eboga is this. A particular emotion such as abandonment, loss of a loved one etc can be resolved (when the time is right) by an experience of accelerated healing with eboga. By that I mean, the concentration of all the pain is oosed out of the psyche like the puss from a boil and that is something which conventional therapy imo cannot do. That is why I recommend to anyone who is interested in full recovery to invest time and trust in its healing ways. It has many miracles to offer.

>

>Love & Peace

>

>Lee

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] War Storiez
Date: November 30, 2004 at 4:30:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

getting loaded behind the wheel… reminds me of copping and firing up, then driving back north in the suicide lane the the golden gate bridge, nodding out behind the wheel and plowing thru the flimsy dividing pylons into oncoming traffic, narrowly averting head-ons. Not exactly fun, or thoughtful. Vista point was my landing zone, if I made it there I was safe. obviously i did, many a time. I don’t know how or why, it was as if I were in a bullet proof bubble.

Then there was the time i went to cop from a junkie in a hotel in the tenderloin. I just had a baby habit, and was only smoking my dope on foil. I had instructions to go to the 6th floor, room 602 and knock 5 times softly. When the door opened i was horrified at what lay beyond. Piles of dirty laundry, beer cans and cigarette buts and ashes everywhere, blood stains on the wall and ceiling and it stank of detox sweat and cum and beer and cigarettes. There was a path that went from the door to the bed, and from the bed to the sink in the corner. The rest was piled knee-waist high with junk. I was appalled anyone could live like that. eventually, I would stay to get loaded, and when I became homeless I crashed there. I sank lower than this person, because I couldn’t even get it together to have a pad of my own. I would steal his dope in a heartbeat, yet this person would lie sick for 3 days waiting for someone to come by and send him out to cop so he could get well. He had the integrity of a saint, which amazed me. This was a junkie with ethics, don’t ever steal, don’t ever get off till you are home and safe. Any bathroom or alleyway would do for me, the sooner the better.

In the end I would scour the floor for dropped balloons when his back was turned, and I eventually discovered he would drop thick, black cottons between the bed and the wall for “rainy” days. I would pick these cottons up, brushing away cock roaches and ashes and rat shit and slam that thick black goo into my arm.

He died 4 years ago of hepC, and amazingly, after sharing the same cottons and spoons, I am hepC Free.

Oh yes, I am living on borrowed time.

_.dh

On Tuesday, November 30, 2004, at 10:47 AM, Preston Peet wrote:

yeah, getting off in traffic was (almost) always fun too, although I was usually in the back of a cab. Oh goodness, one time I did my speedball, then had a complete psychotic breakdown, with huge cockroaches streaming from the trash on the floor, which due to the stormy rainy day outside was full of a puddle. So I freaked out, trying to grab all the bugs from off my face while feeling them storming up the insides of my pants and sweater sleeves. That wasn’t fun at all. I tried to get indignant when we pulled into our stop and my rig was sitting in plain sight on the floor, floating in aforementioned puddle. “That’s awful, why don’t you clean you cab man? I coulda been stabbed!”
He glared at me and said, “That’s yours and get outta my cab.”
Oh well.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

Hi Preston, I read of the thrill you received doing speedballs in the Diner,
I understand. My favorite place was on the freeway in 5 o’clock rush
hour-speedway traffic, to see if I could “keep-it-together, I had a fast car
at the time and could get a vein with out too much challenge.
brad

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 8:02 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA
+ ? Hannah

Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood
crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.
My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am
I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
and what I consider normal now.
Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.<

This is EXACTLY what I was writing about earlier, the notes like this one
Hannah. I can totally and completely empathize and am really heartily
wishing you well, sending you strength and courage. You are how old please,
if you don’t mind my asking? I think you mentioned it just the other day
(23?- because I remember responding to someone noting that age here and
think it mighta been you) but I’m not sure. Regardless, as bad as it seems
now, it can get worse, and it can definitely get better. I’m sure you know
that, irregardless of how awful it can seem when sitting there trying to get
a vein (oh my god, I can remember doing what you’ve described here, but not
only in the privacy of someone’s apartment or squat but also, more often
than not actually, doing this exact same vein hunt in stairwells, allyways,
parkbenches, behind garbage cans, cafe bathrooms, diner tables, etc, etc. I
mean, there were times I’d have a great vein, usually a teeny one that I’d
managed to find just the right angle to hit it with, making shooting up in
public, at diner tables as mentioned (one of my very favorite places to
shoot up used to be in very public places like diners, right at the table,
as that gave me that extra adrenaline boost. Of course, it was often an
interesting experience in that when speedballing, I’d feel the cocaine
first, so would be sitting there first witht that roaring in my ears, then
bugs all over me while trying to figure out which person in the diner was
NOT a cop.
Boy oh boy, what fun that was!

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Hannah

I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking
Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now
on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X and I’ve
been on a few.  Its a bummer.

I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m
23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation, well I
live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the
more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re
putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!

Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!  I
want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear.
I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to just help
me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like the
music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are
travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always know where
the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the clubs are
all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.

The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but it
isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it
with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was
the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But the pills
just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if
you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m fucked I’ll
still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.

I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.

Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as I woke
up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer
and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came
over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it takes
hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my artery so
my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends
were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I felt like
a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to
muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear the past
week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins
just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give
blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong
profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to
myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in
blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.
My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I
doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
and what I consider normal now.

Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort myself out.
I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep doing
this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs I had
improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months
I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I had to
go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I
kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like
that definition of insanity, I am insane.

But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….

Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
Hannah

PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far more
partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Hannah

Hannah,

you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
gay guys know how to party !!

I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
is!!

I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
refer to the last sentence of the previous
paragraph…

love Julie 🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Oslo
Date: November 30, 2004 at 4:19:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/world/la-fg-heroin29nov29,0,2616070.story?coll=la-home-headlines

Anyone on this list from Norway??

From: Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] special problems in treating for crystal
Date: November 30, 2004 at 3:58:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

We were addressing three questions regarding treatment of stimulants with ibogaine::

Any difference from an treatment for opiates as regards dose size or regimen?

What special aftercare if any?

What was the success rate?

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 30, 2004 at 3:47:32 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yeah, getting off in traffic was (almost) always fun too, although I was usually in the back of a cab. Oh goodness, one time I did my speedball, then had a complete psychotic breakdown, with huge cockroaches streaming from the trash on the floor, which due to the stormy rainy day outside was full of a puddle. So I freaked out, trying to grab all the bugs from off my face while feeling them storming up the insides of my pants and sweater sleeves. That wasn’t fun at all. I tried to get indignant when we pulled into our stop and my rig was sitting in plain sight on the floor, floating in aforementioned puddle. “That’s awful, why don’t you clean you cab man? I coulda been stabbed!”
He glared at me and said, “That’s yours and get outta my cab.”
Oh well.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Brad Fisher” <brad.fisher@guaranty.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 10:11 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

Hi Preston, I read of the thrill you received doing speedballs in the Diner,
I understand. My favorite place was on the freeway in 5 o’clock rush
hour-speedway traffic, to see if I could “keep-it-together, I had a fast car
at the time and could get a vein with out too much challenge.
brad

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 8:02 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA
+ ? Hannah

Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood
crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.
My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am
I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
and what I consider normal now.
Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.<

This is EXACTLY what I was writing about earlier, the notes like this one
Hannah. I can totally and completely empathize and am really heartily
wishing you well, sending you strength and courage. You are how old please,
if you don’t mind my asking? I think you mentioned it just the other day
(23?- because I remember responding to someone noting that age here and
think it mighta been you) but I’m not sure. Regardless, as bad as it seems
now, it can get worse, and it can definitely get better. I’m sure you know
that, irregardless of how awful it can seem when sitting there trying to get
a vein (oh my god, I can remember doing what you’ve described here, but not
only in the privacy of someone’s apartment or squat but also, more often
than not actually, doing this exact same vein hunt in stairwells, allyways,
parkbenches, behind garbage cans, cafe bathrooms, diner tables, etc, etc. I
mean, there were times I’d have a great vein, usually a teeny one that I’d
managed to find just the right angle to hit it with, making shooting up in
public, at diner tables as mentioned (one of my very favorite places to
shoot up used to be in very public places like diners, right at the table,
as that gave me that extra adrenaline boost. Of course, it was often an
interesting experience in that when speedballing, I’d feel the cocaine
first, so would be sitting there first witht that roaring in my ears, then
bugs all over me while trying to figure out which person in the diner was
NOT a cop.
Boy oh boy, what fun that was!

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Hannah

I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking
Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now
on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X and I’ve
been on a few.  Its a bummer.

I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m
23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation, well I
live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the
more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re
putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!

Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!  I
want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear.
I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to just help
me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like the
music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are
travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always know where
the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the clubs are
all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.

The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but it
isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it
with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was
the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But the pills
just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if
you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m fucked I’ll
still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.

I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.

Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as I woke
up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer
and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came
over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it takes
hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my artery so
my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends
were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I felt like
a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to
muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear the past
week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins
just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give
blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong
profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to
myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in
blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.
My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I
doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
and what I consider normal now.

Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort myself out.
I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep doing
this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs I had
improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months
I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I had to
go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I
kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like
that definition of insanity, I am insane.

But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….

Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
Hannah

PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far more
partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Hannah

Hannah,

you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
gay guys know how to party !!

I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
is!!

I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
refer to the last sentence of the previous
paragraph…

love Julie 🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jasen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Date: November 30, 2004 at 3:13:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/30/04 1:24:05 PM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

We have known each other before
Julie,I say this with the utmost respect,I feel I know
Randy,Sean,Howard,Martee,preston and wife and others on this list it’s
quite
odd.
Will talk soon Smiles Jasen.

Well Jasen,

We could all say we have been waiting for you. Now is this a religious
epiphany or just a science fiction scenario?  mmmmmm?

Have you checked out Amsterdam as Dave suggested?  One of the art museums
could be a really interesting tour.

I would love to have some idea of your visions though email is fine if they
are too personal and that is not rare at all.

Howard

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From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] To Miss Iboga (Julie)
Date: November 30, 2004 at 11:56:39 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/30/04 11:39:51 AM Eastern Standard Time, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:
As with other methods of detox, TIME is the only way
to truly recover…don’t worry, Fake Placebo: if your
TIME hasn’t come yet, it will soon…

cheers,
Julie
it sure does time is moving so so slow i have ahard time believing that relief is in sight  but i don’t crave getting high on dope and will NEVER go back on Methadone it would be a life sentence At 45 i know that this is my last shot
Iboga is simply a miracle gods gift the ancient cure thgat was waiting
feeling pretty weak still but nothing like 2 weeks ago so that aint bad
freak freely!
Jeff

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Date: November 30, 2004 at 11:40:43 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen,

Glad to hear you are well.  You know, it’s
weird…I’ve kinda lost track of time.  I couldn’t
tell you exactly how long it has been since my
treatment!  I know it was about 2-3 weeks after Randy,
so maybe it’s 6 weeks, maybe 8.  The big physical
transformation from ‘sick’ to ‘well’ occurred between
the 3rd and 4th week-ironically, it was around this
time that all the damned methadone was FINALLY out of
my system!

Jasen, this next week is going to provide you with
revelations you won’t believe.  As soon as you feel
well enough, go explore a new country- hell, you could
even chill in Amsterdam for a bit.  Scarf some french
fries with mayonnaise(yummy!), check out some of the
sex museums or hash bars…the world’s your oyster.

I’m interested to hear some of your insights…when
you’re ready, send me a note, and we can swap some
stories….

love Julie 🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] To Miss Iboga (Julie)
Date: November 30, 2004 at 11:26:50 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi FP,

Hi, How are you?  In short, I feel great.  Still
haven’t touched any opiates, and have no real desire
to do so.  However, I believe that is due only in part
to the noribogaine that may or may not be floating
around my system- I really wanted to quit.  My
body/mind was tired, dare I say DISGUSTED, by the
whole scene, and I believe this realization is making
opiate abstinence quite easy right now.

I had energy/fatigue problems for the first 2-3 weeks,
but my body has since normalized, and I feel pretty
good overall.  Sleep issues are a whole different
story altogether- I STILL have sleep disturbances.  My
doc told me it can take months to normalize (something
about opiates acting on the area of the brain that
regulates sleep.

In terms of personality changes, I feel a lot more,
um, RAW- nothing is filtered out anymore.  Every
beautiful situation, every annoying and ugly one- I
embrace each and every moment with the naivete of a 5
year old.

I would say I also stick up for myself more now,
without the aid of rose-tinted, opiated glasses.  I
have an aunt who used to send me the most ridiculous,
right-wing, Christian fundamentalist propaganda,
almost on a daily basis.  It annoyed the fuck out of
me.  Well, needless to say, I critically ‘dissected’
the last piece of clap-trap, and LO AND BEHOLD: no
more Christian, exclusionist dogma forwarded to my
Inbox.

As with other methods of detox, TIME is the only way
to truly recover…don’t worry, Fake Placebo: if your
TIME hasn’t come yet, it will soon…

cheers,
Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Date: November 30, 2004 at 10:55:49 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Julie,
Yes you are righ, 12 to 15 days I started to get more energy.
I am booked to go home on the 12th of December.
HOW DO YOU FEEL NOW Julie,how long has it been?

I would love to go to Greece or Italy I will wait and see what the energy is
like,how I FEEL.It was great getting a long email of you.
When I get home I will be able to write better emails of my computer.
The relavations I have had are so clear,some I don’t dare mention on the
web.
We have known each other before
Julie,I say this with the utmost respect,I feel I know
Randy,Sean,Howard,Martee,preston and wife and others on this list it’s quite
odd.
Will talk soon Smiles Jasen.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Verzonden: zaterdag 27 november 2004 16:01
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine]
Jasen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Jasen,

How are you, kiddo???  It’s so great that you’re up
and around…how ya feelin’?  Day 12 is great- just to
let you know, it was around day 12-15 that I started
to come out of the thick of it.  I know time may seem
like it’s passing excruciatingly slow, but don’t
worry…the next thing you know, a whole month will
have passed, and you’ll be catching a train to Paris
or Barcelona.  If you hit Spain, make sure you check
out Gaudi’s architecture- it’ll blow your mind.

I second your idea about detoxing from heroin/short
acting opiate…methadone is a real heinous entity to
detox from- I mean, how can you truly feel better when
that shite lingers in your body for so long?  You’re
so lucky you have Sara to take care of you, as I
believe she really knows what she’s doing.  She has
given me a few excellent suggestions and healing
techniques.

Have you decided when you will venture out into the
world?  Europe is so lovely…if I were you, I would
head to the southern parts- there is nothing as awful
as shivering from the cold weather, when you are
‘shivering’ on the inside, if you know what I mean.

If you’re feeling really adventurous, why not venture
to somewhere exotic and gorgeous like Morocco?  You
can catch a ferry across the Gibraltar strait, and
boom- you’re in Northern Africa!!!  When I was in
Lisboa(which is also incredibly gorgeous), the only
thing keeping me from making the trek was my slim,
exhausted pocketbook…Do it Jasen, this is a perfect
time for you to travel…your mind is fresh,
unfettered, unencumbered by the haze of opiates..

Or how about Greece?  Filo pastry and flaming Ouzo
make for a lovely distraction…BTW, how much longer
are you planning to stay in Europe?  Do you have any
work deadlines?  When do you return to Aus?

My thoughts are with you on your journey.  The first
2-3 weeks are the hardest, but it DOES get better,
don’t worry.  Take care of your body and your mind…
And please drop me a line when you find the time….

love Julie 🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen unbored
Date: November 30, 2004 at 10:40:22 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Howard,
Thanks for the call it was good to hear your kind voice.
I plan to Feng Shui Sara’s,I even brought my compass.
At the moment however I am too mentally,emoitionaly,physically and
spiritually exhausted,though better than a few days ago.

Explaining what I mean by boredom.
Wanting to do something and not having the mental or physical energy to do
it.Being in a forien country by myself,missing home.I understand it is a
part of it however to me it is,”wanting to jump out of my skin at times then
it passes.Time is going 4 times as slow,1 hour feels like 4.I miss
company,especially female,not meaning sexual,just company,flirting laughing.

Hey, I over the worst of it. Smiles Jasen

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: zaterdag 27 november 2004 19:53
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] Jasen unbored

Jasen,

Why don’t you unbore yourself by feng shuiing sara’s place.  Is her house
feng shui?  Will Sara let you do it?  Great tasks await great men and women.

Howard

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 30, 2004 at 10:28:14 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Randy,
Thanks for the feedback
Planning to get very busy with work when I get back home. I tell you what,I am home sick.
It would be interesting to hear if the people that reported being raped and or sacrificed whilst under this
Treatment to see if It was only with the ibogaine. and not Iboga.Because at the risk of sounding like I’m off my head,I had strong revelations about a few things,one of being,If you want to disrespect the spirit of eboga and think you can improve on what god has already perfected,then just by taking the one ‘working element”;I think you rape the plantby taking the Ibogaine and sacrificing the rest. and sacrifice the whole for a part of what was made wholly by alfa and omega,I believe the whole plant should be taken,otherwise it is a sacrilidge and you won’t get the full benefit.If only natural and scientific docters could work together respecting each others knowing. Wow ,could you Imagine a clinic set up by a few of you together, Science and natural medicine working together.THIS IS DAY 15, I am still fatigued and a bit scrambelled,low energy,though better than a few days ago. I thought I was dying,like seriously,, I tell you what.it frightened me. .
Low blood pressure,I think,but then maybe that is nessecarry so to take blood pressure tablets could affect the effect of the Iboga.

Getting tired,mentally tired. Love you guys Smiles Jasen.
Van: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Verzonden: zondag 28 november 2004 18:01
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: RE: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Hi from Jasen, he has no energy to write , but he likes to thanks everyone for being so kind and thinking of him.

Sara

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zaterdag 27 november 2004 16:29
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen, If I had the cash I’d be right there with you. Someday soon. What have you got planned when you get back down under? I’d sure like to see Australia sometime. You being bored is a good sign. Life awaits you my friend. Kick it’s …. you know what I mean. Be ready, cause I found it hard sometimes because people I knew didn’t know how to take the clean and positive Randy. It is already better for me. The ones who matter think Ibogaine is a miracle. I’ve never gone this long without court pressure and the people who care about me are pretty much amazed. It takes a little while for them to get used to it. Remember, your the one who changed. Give them time to get used to it and don’t freak out like I did. You are most definitely the man now. Run with it. Peace and much love.     Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] received message & Treatment
Date: November 30, 2004 at 10:16:06 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

lee:
thanks for the note and compasssion expressed in it. my goal is to b treated by aan md on an outpatient basis that understands benzos.  from what i hear, ibo is not the magic bullet b/c of the different receptors involved.  i’m no expert and simply recount my readins and info obtained from others more knowlegeable than me in this field.  i’ve done it all over the yrs. but this benzo thing is spooky..w/ds can kill you.  all the other stuff just made me wish i were dead.
so, i am hesistant.  i may have stumbled across someone , much  more knowledgeable than i who can help.  i appreciate all the support from people on the list. wishing you a peaceful path, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 9:03 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] received message & Treatment

Ron,

I imagine internet servers (which route emails) do all kind of weird and wonderful things. Clearly you are receiving messages and sending. If some are bounced it probably doesn’t make a lot of difference as they keep reappearing anyway. Unles there is a specific message you are looking for?

Forgive me if I ask and I ask with all due respect. Have you made a full action plan for yourself yet? I did read somewhere where you were attempting to taper. Hows that going? Where do you go from there?

From what i have read you have received pretty much all the advice anyone can give you here on the list. So the best this list can do for you right now is to send words of support your way.

If I were in your shoes I would decide whether or not to be treated and then I would probably contact Sara (who has the most open ended & creative treatment available) and who can take care of you even if the treatment is not successful. (You wrote once you would get on a plane tomorrow if you thought the treatment would be successful). Amsterdam has got to be the one place in the world where you can receive practically any kind of drug related assistance necessary. So you are not going to die from the lack of a fix – if it comes to that.

Sara also has pure ibogaine – as far as I know.

So how about it? You have nothing to lose.

I keep my fingers crossed that you decide to go for it and get on that plane and get out of the scary corner you seem to be living in – which it seems is paralysing you from acting on your own behalf.

Love & Light to You

Lee

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
i do not know what bouncing means.  does it mean someone is reading my email? i have security.  please clue me in.  i know very little about computers and what all this means.  i here looking for a way to get and stay straight and save my life.  please help me understand what’s going on.  ron..at work today

http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality.

From: “Brad Fisher” <brad.fisher@guaranty.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 30, 2004 at 10:11:41 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston, I read of the thrill you received doing speedballs in the Diner,
I understand. My favorite place was on the freeway in 5 o’clock rush
hour-speedway traffic, to see if I could “keep-it-together, I had a fast car
at the time and could get a vein with out too much challenge.
brad

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 8:02 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA
+ ? Hannah

Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood
crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.
My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am
I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
and what I consider normal now.
Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.<

This is EXACTLY what I was writing about earlier, the notes like this one
Hannah. I can totally and completely empathize and am really heartily
wishing you well, sending you strength and courage. You are how old please,
if you don’t mind my asking? I think you mentioned it just the other day
(23?- because I remember responding to someone noting that age here and
think it mighta been you) but I’m not sure. Regardless, as bad as it seems
now, it can get worse, and it can definitely get better. I’m sure you know
that, irregardless of how awful it can seem when sitting there trying to get
a vein (oh my god, I can remember doing what you’ve described here, but not
only in the privacy of someone’s apartment or squat but also, more often
than not actually, doing this exact same vein hunt in stairwells, allyways,
parkbenches, behind garbage cans, cafe bathrooms, diner tables, etc, etc. I
mean, there were times I’d have a great vein, usually a teeny one that I’d
managed to find just the right angle to hit it with, making shooting up in
public, at diner tables as mentioned (one of my very favorite places to
shoot up used to be in very public places like diners, right at the table,
as that gave me that extra adrenaline boost. Of course, it was often an
interesting experience in that when speedballing, I’d feel the cocaine
first, so would be sitting there first witht that roaring in my ears, then
bugs all over me while trying to figure out which person in the diner was
NOT a cop.
Boy oh boy, what fun that was!

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Hannah

I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking
Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now
on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X and I’ve
been on a few.  Its a bummer.

I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m
23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation, well I
live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the
more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re
putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!

Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!  I
want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear.
I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to just help
me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like the
music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are
travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always know where
the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the clubs are
all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.

The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but it
isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it
with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was
the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But the pills
just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if
you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m fucked I’ll
still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.

I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.

Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as I woke
up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer
and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came
over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it takes
hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my artery so
my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends
were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I felt like
a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to
muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear the past
week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins
just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give
blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong
profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to
myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in
blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.
My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I
doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
and what I consider normal now.

Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort myself out.
I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep doing
this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs I had
improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months
I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I had to
go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I
kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like
that definition of insanity, I am insane.

But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….

Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
Hannah

PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far more
partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Hannah

Hannah,

you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
gay guys know how to party !!

I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
is!!

I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
refer to the last sentence of the previous
paragraph…

love Julie 🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Breathing
Date: November 30, 2004 at 8:53:04 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I agree.  I was trying to differentiate that all “providers” are not created equal to randy.  The death thing was just part of the scenario.  Your rationale is correct.  I think there is a time and a place for martyrdom and that ain’t it!  I was also trying to put things in perspective re: Mash a little, I’m not on her biggest fan list, however, I couldn’t do what she’s doing and within controversial topics will be more controversey.
You do make an extremely valid distinction and I would have to say were it me  I would leave. Were it me being treated I would want them to leave as well.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 30, 2004 1:47 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Breathing

I’m not sure that one would need to be motivated by greed to
abandon a corpse in a hotel room. Imagine treating an addict who
for some unknown reason keels over – maybe that person did heroin
to avoid an issue brought up by the eboga and OD’d at their normal
dose due to a reset tolerance, maybe there were unknown or lied-
about medical complications, maybe their spirit just went to the
light. In any case, death has occurred, and now you are facing any
number of criminal and civil charges if you turn yourself in. Plus
if you do, it’s another black mark against ibogaine. People have
all sorts of value systems and reasons for treating people, and
siting with a corpse could throw these into unexpected relief.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] misc
Date: November 30, 2004 at 8:41:57 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for posting that. Lee

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
I came across this:

http://www.entheogenreview.com/Resources/Sample%20Issue.pdf

which includes the only other case I’ve seen of a person quitting
marijuana after an ibogaine session (I stopped for 2 years a while
back). It is a sampler edition of the Entheogen Review. Articles
include “THOUGHT-SUCKING ENTITY”, “WILD CUCUMBER?”, “SEXY TOAD
VENOM”, and most interesting to me, “Myron Stolaroff Speaks…” in
which the author of The Secret Chief says,

“I have to say that the misunderstanding of psychedelics is
one of the great tragedies of our current time, because these
are such remarkable tools. And I’ll just try to say in a nutshell
why they are important and also why they are held in
such disrepute. First of all they are important because, as far
as I can tell—and this is after 40 years of work—the main
thing that they do is open the door to the unconscious mind.
And that includes just a fantastic array of stuff. But the first
part that’s uncovered is our repressed material. We push a
lot of stuff into the unconscious because we simply do not
want to know it; we don’t want to acknowledge it. This is
often very painful stuff: betrayals, hurts, things that have
made us feel inferior, and all the kinds of things that make
up what Jung calls “the shadow.” So all of this stuff is in the
unconscious. But then when we go deeper, we begin to find
some of our more valuable assets, such as intuition, creativity,
and what Jung called “the archetypes.” Eventually you go
beyond all of this into the transpersonal areas where you can
actually discover that the core of your being is divinity, which
is an amazingly wonderful, fruitful thing to discover. And
what I’ve found—and I think what most of the people who
reach this level find—is that the universe is created in incredible
love.”

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality.

From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] To Miss Iboga (Julie)
Date: November 30, 2004 at 5:33:57 AM EST
To: “Summary” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Julie,
I treated by Iboga 14th. of september; also you treated in those days like me. I wander that how do you feel? Could you able to get your power?What about sleeping? And last: have you ever experienced personality changes on you?

Thank you already
Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Breathing
Date: November 30, 2004 at 1:47:05 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m not sure that one would need to be motivated by greed to
abandon a corpse in a hotel room. Imagine treating an addict who
for some unknown reason keels over – maybe that person did heroin
to avoid an issue brought up by the eboga and OD’d at their normal
dose due to a reset tolerance, maybe there were unknown or lied-
about medical complications, maybe their spirit just went to the
light. In any case, death has occurred, and now you are facing any
number of criminal and civil charges if you turn yourself in. Plus
if you do, it’s another black mark against ibogaine. People have
all sorts of value systems and reasons for treating people, and
siting with a corpse could throw these into unexpected relief.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: [Ibogaine] misc
Date: November 30, 2004 at 1:26:37 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I came across this:

http://www.entheogenreview.com/Resources/Sample%20Issue.pdf

which includes the only other case I’ve seen of a person quitting
marijuana after an ibogaine session (I stopped for 2 years a while
back). It is a sampler edition of the Entheogen Review. Articles
include “THOUGHT-SUCKING ENTITY”, “WILD CUCUMBER?”, “SEXY TOAD
VENOM”, and most interesting to me, “Myron Stolaroff Speaks
” in
which the author of The Secret Chief says,

“I have to say that the misunderstanding of psychedelics is
one of the great tragedies of our current time, because these
are such remarkable tools. And I’ll just try to say in a nutshell
why they are important and also why they are held in
such disrepute. First of all they are important because, as far
as I can tell—and this is after 40 years of work—the main
thing that they do is open the door to the unconscious mind.
And that includes just a fantastic array of stuff. But the first
part that’s uncovered is our repressed material. We push a
lot of stuff into the unconscious because we simply do not
want to know it; we don’t want to acknowledge it. This is
often very painful stuff: betrayals, hurts, things that have
made us feel inferior, and all the kinds of things that make
up what Jung calls “the shadow.” So all of this stuff is in the
unconscious. But then when we go deeper, we begin to find
some of our more valuable assets, such as intuition, creativity,
and what Jung called “the archetypes.” Eventually you go
beyond all of this into the transpersonal areas where you can
actually discover that the core of your being is divinity, which
is an amazingly wonderful, fruitful thing to discover. And
what I’ve found—and I think what most of the people who
reach this level find—is that the universe is created in incredible
love.”

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Breathing
Date: November 30, 2004 at 1:20:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee, ya know I did that breathing thing one time and got the biggest rush. Ha, I’ve never felt better. I’m just very passionate about whatever I put my head into, errr so to speak. I just want to see the facts on this and I think what was said was a bit out of line. Bodies? Plural? I heard about one and the jury is still out on exactly what happened. Yea, it is inevitable there are going to be unscrupulous people anywhere money is involved but, I think that can be dealt with. How about the gov. getting their cut by taxing it and then have it sold in a pharmacy to people who are licensed to provide the treatment. Picture ID and all the other red tape shit they can think of. Just get the Ibogaine out to the people who need it. I’ve said all along that if someone would take care of my fellow addicts on the street I would quit worrying and talking about it. That just isn’t going to happen in the near future. I also said about a year and a half ago on this list that if this stuff works like you say it does I won’t shut up about it until my brothers and sisters in the KY area get it or at least know where to go to get it. It worked and I meant what I said. They don’t have a clue down there. I aim to change that. I’m getting the word out down there from here. Remember Power To The People? I grew up with that in my head. Being clean is one of the most powerful feelings I have experienced to date. I feel like I have to spread the word or lose what I have.      Randy

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 30, 2004 at 1:06:54 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Mon, 29 Nov 2004 06:47:09 -0800 Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
(apart from 3 therapeutic MDMA sessions after my
first eboga experience)

I forgot to mention that some friends I shared an ayahuasca analog
with described it as like MDMA without the speed. (I have never
taken MDMA.)

I have based the past 6 years of my
journey on the sacramental use of eboga to travel the inner
recesses of my psyche and encounter the hidden demons of my past.
I have unlocked practically every door (I am presently aware of)
within me and have experienced nothing short of miraculous
recovery.

Thanks for your story. I think that eboga is great at giving a safe
place to unravel trauma and patterns of thought and behavior. It
may tell more about me and my circumstances than about these
substances, but with eboga alone I was more enthralled with my own
story, while with ayahuasca I find myself developing a moment-by-
moment appreciation of life. A spiritually-inclined friend once
asked when I told her about eboga, “Where would you be without your
story?” It’s now a year later, and I’m still digesting that one.

🙂

I eagerly look forward to completing the 3 books I am
working on to share all the details of what I have experienced.

So I have not felt any need to enter the world of ayahuasca.
However from what you write it is definitely something I will
explore at some stage. Forgive me if I say (what some may take as
heresy) but I find eboga to be a complete cure when used with the
right intention, a sufficiently discerning mind and a heart that
seeks as its ultimate goal a deep experience of love. Why?

Because it is very much spiritually guided and events in one life
fall into place to move the process along if one is willing to
undergo the changes and take the risks.

I like what you say about eboga and how it brings you in contact
with specific deep issues. (I assume we are talking about low
doses here) It confirms exactly what I am trying to promote in my
writings: the use of eboga to resolve childhood trauma and abuse
and to advance ones spirituality via the growth of consciousness
which ensues.

There is absolutely no doubt that ongoing use of eboga is both
surprising and humbling. It is also wonderfully liberating.

The part I find interesting for myself is how I went from a
scientific agnostic to a believer & admirer of the God and the
Goddess. Two great kind (non imposing) and generous entities in my

opinon. You could say the perfect parents. And yet with them I
sense a humility which accepts me lovingly as I am and allows me
to grow from there. Its almost like a growing friendship.

Good idea to use as an adjunct to therapy.

One observation I would make on the healing action of eboga is
this. A particular emotion such as abandonment, loss of a loved
one etc can be resolved (when the time is right) by an experience
of accelerated healing with eboga. By that I mean, the
concentration of all the pain is oosed out of the psyche like the
puss from a boil and that is something which conventional therapy
imo cannot do. That is why I recommend to anyone who is interested

in full recovery to invest time and trust in its healing ways. It
has many miracles to offer.

Love & Peace

Lee

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
On Sun, 28 Nov 2004 05:38:59 -0800 Lee Albert
wrote:
It sounds as though (from what you write) ayahuasca by its nature

is more rewarding in the group experience?

For me it has been.

Yet I would not make
the same observation about eboga – perhaps at a certain stage it
could be something to explore – as the experience tends to be
highly personal – for the most part.

My solo eboga experiences have been mixed. Immediate issues such
as
obsessive blocked anger have been resolved nicely, and sometimes I

have gotten insights into deeper problems, but it seems that eboga

in sufficient dose ultimately draws me to a trauma which I cannot
handle. Maybe someday.. meanwhile I can work on building a better
me. A mere taste on the tongue before therapy is my main use at
this point.

I certainly agree that any experience has its own optimum set &
setting.

For ibogaine I believe that could be a group of caring and
compassionate people who would welcome the person into the world
and compensate for all the pain and neglect that may have been
suffered at the hands of others. The baby physical helplessness of

the ibogaine experience is a wonderful opportunity to learn to
depend on others, for those of us who have been Gollum-ized by
this
world.

Economics dictate that this would either be a church or a group
treatment and therapy setting.

In the meantime, the better integration with aftercare, the
better.

I am curious what you mean by deep body learning?

Long tedious absorption of the vine, with little or none of the
DMT
‘light’ to take the mind elsewhere, followed by some weeks of
feeling more grounded and having insights comparable to post-
eboga.
Possibly it could be like noribogaine if one could take that
directly.

What do you see as its (ayahuasca) ongoing benefits?

Briefly, strength and love, if used for that purpose.

If you read the literature, and the experience reports on erowid
and elsewhere, you will find that the cultures and personal
experiences are all over the map.

Are you located in Holland?

No.

Hope I am not bombarding you with too many questions. Its an area

I no little about but am curious to understand better. What I
have

read has not really enlightened me much.

From my reading, ibogaine and secondarily ayahuasca stood out as
entheogens that lead to deep learning about oneself that can lead
to real personal change. In both cases personal experience has
been
surprising and humbling.

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 04:15:16 -0800 Lee Albert
wrote:
Similarly I am not a great fan of DMT from what I have read as I

think its a shortcut to spiritual dimensions best reserved for
those whose souls have been prepared for the experience.
Otherwise

the combination of ones own inner demons coupled with the doors
which are been opened can lead to serious problems afterwards
imo.

In my experience, the container is all-important. So far the best

one for me is group singing in a church setting, which is what I
started with. The first time I did my own homebrew, the message
was, “why are you doing this alone, your path is to connect with
people,” and the church has been my satisfaction and growth ever
since. (I also learn in free-form group singing without the
religious or entheogenic aspects.) Plus with ayahuasca there is
the
vine, which on its own can take one on a slow unhallucinogenic
path
of deep body learning. It is all work, the hardest and deepest
that
one is capable of, no shortcuts I thoroughly agree.

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 29, 2004 at 11:24:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/29/04 10:24:58 PM, Schmoolyboy@aol.com writes:

<< does anybody have the article in question.? I can figure out what this is
about but I have never seen the article..

someone please send. >>

————————————————————————
http://www.latimes.com/features/printedition/magazine/la-tm-ibogaine48nov28,0,
775349.story?coll=la-home-magazine

The Magical Mystery Tour

Drug and alcohol addicts are going abroad in search of the purported miracle
treatment called ibogaine. But will the drug industry embrace a substance that
causes a hallucinatory high?
By Vince Beiser
Special to The Times

November 28, 2004
The hallucinations are coming fast and vivid. Faces, shapes, colors rush
toward him, melting and swirling into each other, sometimes coalescing into more
concrete visions. He sees himself floating underwater. By turns, his four
children drift by. Sometimes they blow bubbles and float happily up to the surface;
sometimes they sink straight down, disappearing into darkness. Then there are
three ships, coming in to dock at three tubes; he knows, somehow, that they
are building a bomb, and if all three dock successfully it will explode. He
tries to direct them away, but can’t. The final ship enters the final tube. A
titanic explosion collapses everything into darkness.

Then it all starts again.

While Craig’s mind reels through this visual cacophony, his body lies quietly
in a darkened room in a house near Tijuana, deep in the grip of a powerful
psychedelic drug. His wife, his children and his upper-middle-class home in Salt
Lake City are all far, far away.

Craig is not some crystal-collecting spiritual seeker on a Carlos Castañeda
trip. He is a prosperous, respected restaurant owner, age 50. He is friendly
with the mayor and active in mainstream charities. Other than family vacations
to the Bahamas and Mazatlan, Mexico, this is the only time he has been outside
of the United States.

Craig is here because he is desperate. He is addicted to
painkillers—OxyContin, Lortab and other illegally obtained prescription opiates. His habit is
costing him $1,500 a month, and he knows he must stop. Conventional detox programs
have failed to help, so he has slipped over the border to try a treatment
that is as much an urban myth as a scientifically proven medication—and is as
illegal as heroin in the United States.

The treatment is a dose of a powerful hallucinogen called ibogaine. It is
derived from the roots of a shrub called Tabernanthe iboga that grows in Africa.
Local tribespeople have used it as a peyote-like sacrament for generations.
Since the 1960s, it has circulated on the margins of Western drug culture,
sustained by its reputation as a potent healer. A single daylong trip on ibogaine,
lore has it, can help break an addiction to heroin, cocaine, alcohol or even
cigarettes.

Other hallucinogens such as Ecstasy have purported to be helpful in treating
addiction, but interest in ibogaine seems to be approaching critical mass. The
increasing number of anecdotal success stories has attracted the attention of
researchers. Although there is no rock-solid proof, scientific consensus is
growing that this drug may indeed possess potent addiction-thwarting properties.

Regardless of what science says, faith is flourishing. A devoted community
has grown up around ibogaine—a motley congregation of former junkies,
envelope-pushing academics and drug-reform zealots helping to spread awareness and use
of the drug. There reportedly are at least two underground activists in the
U.S. who will provide it to seekers illegally. But taking ibogaine doesn’t have
to involve breaking laws, because it’s legal in many countries. As a result,
clinics are popping up from the Caribbean to Pakistan, offering ibogaine
treatment for a few thousand dollars to well over $10,000.

The clinic near Tijuana is, relatively speaking, among the most reputable. It
was opened in 2001 by Martin Polanco, a Mexican doctor who was impressed with
how ibogaine—obtained at an underground U.S. clinic—had helped one of his
relatives beat cocaine addiction. Polanco’s facility, known as the Ibogaine
Association, has administered more than 350 treatments and currently has 10 to 15
new patients a month, says program director Randy Hencken.

Hencken, a gangly 28-year-old with curly hair and little studs in each ear,
was one of Polanco’s first patients. He had dropped out of college at 21 to
devote himself to cocaine and, eventually, heroin. Over the years, he tried
everything from 12-step programs to methadone to get clean, but nothing worked. He
discovered ibogaine on the Internet, made his way to Polanco’s facility, and
returned with his addiction broken. He has since embraced the cause with a
convert’s zeal, taking a job as the association’s main organizer.

On the summer day Craig is to begin his ibogaine experience, Hencken is
padding around a San Diego apartment that doubles as the association’s U.S. office.
The place fits naturally in the beachside slacker-student-surfer
neighborhood. The front room is furnished with worn couches and a computer emblazoned with
a Jane’s Addiction sticker. A bike and surfboards hang on hooks in the
kitchen.

Hencken, dressed in a black T-shirt and pants, hops into an unmarked van and
drives to a dingy airport motel. Waiting in the parking lot is Craig, a trim,
compact man wearing loafers, khakis and a Nike T-shirt.

“I’ve got to admit this is a little weird,” says Craig, who flew in from Salt
Lake the night before. “I feel like we’re doing a drug deal.” Which, in a
sense, they are. Craig gets in the van and they roll south.

Craig is highly motivated to undertake this bizarre journey. He was an
alcoholic for years, with the smashed cars and nights in jail to show for it. He
quit drinking 16 years ago and has stayed sober. But a few years ago he was
prescribed painkillers for a knee injury and discovered that he liked them. He
began downing fistfuls of pills daily, scoring them from one of his employees. “At
first it was recreational,” he recalls. “But then you find yourself doing
them just to get from point A to B and you know it’s a problem.”

Last year, he checked himself into a rehab center and went cold turkey. “It
was horrible,” he says. “You hurt from your bones in. I couldn’t sleep. I cried
like a baby. I’d take hot baths all day and eat ibuprofen like candy.” He
stayed clean for six weeks and then fell off the wagon.

“I can’t stop myself. But I know I can’t go down that road again like I did
with alcohol,” he says. “But when you’re on opiates, it really hurts to stop.”
So when his dealer, who had been scouring the Internet for unconventional ways
to kick drugs, told Craig about the Ibogaine Association, he decided he had
little to lose.

“I just need to get this stuff out of my system,” he says, “and I’m looking
for an easier, softer way.”

Ibogaine, as even its most ardent supporters say, is not a cure for drug
dependence; however, it apparently can play a potent role as an
addiction-interrupter. The drug has two powerful addiction-fighting effects. The first is
biochemical: It seems to act on serotonin and opiate systems in the brain,
physically nullifying a person’s craving for drugs and smoothing their withdrawal
symptoms. That’s a huge boon for those addicted to heroin and other opiates, many
of whom shrink from the physical pain of detox.

“It has been proved to alleviate the pain and physical discomfort of drug
withdrawal with animals,” says Dr. Stanley Glick, a neuropharmacologist at Albany
Medical Center in New York who has researched the drug for years. “And there
are lots of reports of it doing the same with humans. You hear the same story
a few thousand times, you’ve got to believe there’s something there.”

After a few weeks, this craving-blocking effect generally fades. But by then,
users have been able to detox relatively painlessly, and then have a month or
more free of drug cravings in which to do whatever it takes to stay clean.

“One dose of ibogaine is not a magic bullet,” says Dr. Deborah Mash, a
neurology professor at the University of Miami who has done the most extensive
research on ibogaine’s effects on human beings. “But it can be a powerful first
step on the road to recovery.”

The second effect is less tangible and more controversial. In many users,
ibogaine induces hours of staggering hallucinations while the patient appears to
be sleeping. Many ibogaine users say they gained profound insights from this
experience, which helps them to understand why they became addicts.

Greg Douglass, a former guitarist with the Steve Miller Band, credits a
session last year at the Ibogaine Association with helping him to kick methadone.
Douglass had visions of himself as a terrified child, of his still-living
father in a coffin, of fantastic animals tearing each other apart in a red sea.
Over the next several weeks, he says, he gradually came to understand some of the
messages encoded in the visions.

“I’d be tying my shoes and suddenly have a little epiphany—’Aha, that’s what
that meant.’ ” The visions, he says, “showed me the potential for myself as a
human being.”

Beth Giuliano, a sturdy 25-year-old from New York, had been in and out of
rehab programs for years trying to kick heroin before she found her way to the
Ibogaine Association in February. “I saw my mother holding an infant,” she says,
describing her hallucinations. “I realized that was me. I felt the pain of
what it would be like to have a child who becomes a drug addict. I’d always felt
guilty about my family, but I never really understood their pain until I did
ibogaine.

“I woke up the next day seeing things a completely different way. I’d never
felt so positive,” she says. “I felt like the person I was when I was little or
like a whole new me.” She says she’s done heroin twice since her treatment,
but didn’t enjoy it and has stayed clean for four months.

But there are plenty of people who discount the supposed wonder treatment.
For some, the visions are harrowing and the treatment is a failure. “It’s like
acid times one million,” writes an anonymous naysayer on one of the many web
sites devoted to ibogaine. “I saw God alright—I talked to him. And I was so sure
it was real. But it wasn’t…. It was someone who [messed] with me and scared
the [daylights] out of me.” This person’s account says that others who took the
treatment at the same time saw themselves being crucified or raped. “It
didn’t work for me, and it didn’t work for anyone else that I personally met who
took it,” the writer concludes.

Everyone agrees that ibogaine is no fun. It’s often emotionally unsettling,
mentally exhausting and physically stressful. Its side effects can include
nausea, vomiting, loss of coordination and a potentially dangerous reduction in
blood pressure and heart rate.

There have been several documented deaths in connection with the drug. But
because the ibogaine was not taken in a clinical setting, the cause of death was
never firmly established. Some fatalities may have been caused by preexisting
heart conditions made lethal by ibogaine’s effects. Mash is confident that
there are more that have gone unreported. “There are some pretty unethical
people” giving clandestine treatments, she says. “They just leave patients for dead
in hotel rooms.”

“That’s why ibogaine needs to be legal and available in safe settings,”
Hencken says. “It needs to be in the hands of someone who can judge your health,
your dosage and provide a safe environment.”

The Ibogaine Association requires clients to submit a medical history as well
as undergo testing before treatment can begin. A doctor administers the drug.
Still, the procedure seems remarkably casual.

From San Diego, Craig is brought to the association’s treatment facility, a
rented house on a well-kept residential street near Tijuana. Only the dining
room, which has been converted into a medication-equipped office, and the oxygen
tanks under the stairs indicate that it is a medical establishment, of sorts.

The doctor treating Craig is Francisco Cañez, a calm, round-faced man who
splits his time between the association and a hospital emergency room. Craig sits
with his arms crossed, looking more than a tad nervous as Cañez reviews his
file and calculates his ibogaine dosage. From a small jar, he shakes out three
gelatin capsules filled with white powder and hands them to Craig.

Craig looks speculatively at the first pill, which he’ll take to make sure he
doesn’t have an allergic reaction. “Well, I’ve put all kinds of things in my
body,” he says, shrugging. Half an hour later, having evinced no untoward
initial responses, he swallows the other two pills.

Cañez then takes him into a bedroom, where sheets of Styrofoam cover the
windows and a CD softly plays rainforest sounds, and attaches him to a heart
monitor next to the bed. The monitor’s graph flutters peacefully as the ibogaine
gradually pulls Craig away. After a while, he just lies there silently, engulfed
in a hallucinogenic hurricane.

After several hours, the visions gradually start to subside. Craig sits up,
nauseated and dizzy. “That was a wild ride,” he mutters. Though he hasn’t had a
painkiller in several days, he finds he doesn’t crave one now. He lies down
again and drops back into his head for another hour. Finally, he revives enough
to be moved to another house where he will spend the next day recovering. He
totters out to the van with small, jittery steps.

Ibogaine’s addiction-fighting potential was discovered only recently, and
accidentally. It was sold as a stimulant in France during the middle decades of
the last century, and an American psychologist and a psychiatrist dabbled with
it in the 1950s and ’60s. So little was known about it that it could not even
be considered a curiosity.

But in 1962, Howard Lotsof, a 19-year-old New York student with a heroin
habit and an appetite for other pharmacological kicks, scored some powder that he
was told would give him a 36-hour trip. Lotsof and some of his junkie pals
experimented with it and, to their astonishment, found that it knocked out their
heroin craving.

Mightily impressed, Lotsof tried to drum up street interest, and a little
cash for himself in the process. It never caught on in a big way, but it did find
a place in counterculture lore—and got banned by the federal government in
1970. It was memorably cited by gonzo journalist Hunter S. Thompson, who
speculated that “a bad ibogaine frenzy” was the likely explanation for Democrat Ed
Muskie’s oddly emotional behavior in the 1972 presidential campaign.

Ibogaine’s legend grew as a constant trickle of adventurous addicts tried it.
In the mid-’80s, Lotsof managed to patent ibogaine as an anti-addiction
palliative, and set up a company to try to bring it to market. An early series of
treatments in the Netherlands looked promising, although there were a couple of
ibogaine-related deaths elsewhere in Europe.

Lotsof continued his crusade. In the early ’90s, he and other activists
persuaded a federal agency to cough up several million dollars for ibogaine
research. He recruited Mash and the two began working together. (They have since
parted ways.) By 1993, Mash had won FDA approval to begin testing ibogaine on
human subjects. But then one of Lotsof’s informal patients in the Netherlands
died. In 1995, the National Institute on Drug Abuse decided not to proceed to
clinical studies.

“Committee members were not all that impressed with its efficacy, but the
safety issue stopped them in their tracks,” says Frank Vocci, a federal
researcher who has followed ibogaine’s progress. “What you have are a lot of
interesting, colorful anecdotes. But the plural of anecdotes is not scientific data.”

A number of researchers around the country, however, have become sufficiently
intrigued to continue experimenting with animals. Dozens of articles have
appeared in scientific journals, most of them reporting promising results that
buttress the anecdotal evidence.

Mash is doing her own part to advance the cause. In 1996 she helped to launch
an ibogaine clinic on the Caribbean island of St. Kitts. During the next five
years, she gathered data on more than 300 patients who sought treatment
there—the largest body of serious clinical research on ibogaine ever collected.

Mash presented her findings at a medical conference last fall in San
Francisco. Granted, her sample wasn’t representative of America’s drug users: Most
were white men between 20 and 40 years old, the sort of addicts who can afford to
spend several weeks and several thousand dollars detoxing in the Caribbean.
Still, she declared that her research proves that ibogaine can be administered
safely and does help break addictions. “We saw people with big methadone
habits lose their cravings after just a single dose of ibogaine,” she says. “One
month later, both cocaine and opiate addicts reported cravings were
significantly lower. And at one year, drug use was significantly down among testees.”

At this point, perhaps the major obstacle to Ibogaine’s mainstream acceptance
is its scrofulous image. This isn’t a medicine developed by white-coated
scientists; its anti-addictive properties were discovered by a junkie, and some of
its promoters are folks who may be of more interest to the attorney general
than the surgeon general.

One of ibogaine’s most energetic boosters is Marc Emery, founder of a
Vancouver, Canada, clinic. Emery is a verbose, middle-aged man with bushy hair and
corporate-casual clothes. You’d never guess that he heads the British Columbia
Marijuana Party and is, by his reckoning, one of the world’s largest sellers of
pot seeds. It is his personal mission to bring ibogaine to the masses,
because the drug helped his adopted son kick methadone and heroin. Until this
spring, Emery offered free treatment in the Iboga Therapy House, a clinic that
consists of a plush one-bedroom apartment in a Vancouver high-rise. With his cash
flow crimped by business and legal troubles (he just spent two months in a
Saskatchewan jail for passing a joint at a gathering), he has stopped funding the
clinic, putting its program on hold, but he remains supportive. “It was a very
worthwhile investment,” he says. “The improvements I saw in our patients were
significant and astonishing.”

Still, Emery’s enthusiasm is unlikely to change the minds of skeptics such as
Dr. Herbert Kleber, head of the substance abuse division at Columbia
University’s school of medicine. “I’m in favor of anything that works, but there needs
to be proof that it does, and that it doesn’t endanger patients,” he says.
“I’ve been in this field 35 years, and I’ve seen a lot of magic bullets. They
often turn out to be worse than the disease.”

Getting that kind of proof requires controlled experiments on human subjects,
which is what Mash is working toward. She has isolated a molecule called
noribogaine, which is produced in the body as it metabolizes ibogaine, and which
she believes is the key agent that blocks drug cravings. She is trying to get
FDA approval to start human testing. On a parallel track, Stanley Glick has
synthesized a chemical cousin of ibogaine dubbed 18-MC, which he also hopes to
market.

Both Mash and Glick think their ibogaine derivatives will give users the
drug-blocking effect without the hallucinations—something both believe is
necessary if the FDA is to approve their products.

But would eliminating ibogaine’s psychedelic side diminish its effectiveness?
No one knows. “For me, the ideal would be for people to take ibogaine in a
controlled environment, and use the experience as part of their psychotherapy,”
Mash says. “Then slap a noribogaine patch on them.”

Mash and Glick also face a more prosaic obstacle: money. Funding
comprehensive clinical trials for a new drug is colossally expensive, and so far neither
has found anyone willing to pony up the full cost. In October, a Los Angeles
philanthropist pledged to give Mash $250,000 to restart research at the
University of Miami, but that’s only a tiny fraction of what will eventually be
necessary if ibogaine is ever to be brought to market.

“The pharmaceutical industry has never wanted much to do with addiction
medicine,” Glick says. “It’s not very profitable, and it’s bad public relations.”

Though there are millions of people addicted to various substances in the
U.S., many of them don’t want, or can’t afford, treatment. Worse, from a
bottom-line standpoint, an ibogaine-based treatment drug would be used only once—a
feeble investment for companies accustomed to cash-cow refillable prescriptions.

Which leaves people like Craig knocking on doors of unregulated ibogaine
clinics in a desperate search for something that will help defeat their addictions.

“All these clinics popping up all over the world—it’s become almost a
cult-like phenomenon,” Glick says. “All the hype and politics around ibogaine just
make my job harder. It means the scientific establishment and regulatory
agencies take a dim view.”

But the ranks of the believers keep growing. Six months after his ibogaine
treatment, Craig says he’s staying clean and feeling great. “That stuff worked
just like it was supposed to,” he says. “It was so much better than the detox I
tried. I don’t understand why it’s not legal.”

*

Editor’s note:

In this article, the name of the patient seeking ibogaine treatment in
Tijuana has been changed to protect his privacy. However, the Los Angeles Times
Magazine has verified his identity and the circumstances described in the article.
If you want other stories on this topic, search the Archives at
latimes.com/archives.

Article licensing and reprint options

————————————————————————

Copyright 2004 Los Angeles Times

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] nypd drug busts on ave. d on tv NOW
Date: November 29, 2004 at 9:56:04 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

he’s not joking actually, as NYC has had this rule in effect for over a year now.
No smoking in bars whatsoever (and resaurants even longer, since the late 90s if memory serves me correctly)…unless you know bars that shirk the rules, as I do actually, but don’t drink, so what good does that do me? Plus, I can smoke as a dj (plus, there’s a rule that says if I’m on “stage” I can smoke which me and many of the performers I know take full advantage of, even though I’m not really performing on-stage per se), so I go backstage and have one when I please wherever I’m djing that night.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 7:43 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] nypd drug busts on ave. d on tv NOW

p.s., Preston, I am personally very disappointed in NYC.  First Times
Square, then the LES…  It’s all become Happy Shiny Safe & Sanitized.
The Horror!  Before you know it, they’ll ban smoking in otherwise
healthy places like bars.  “I’m sorry sir, you can’t light a cigarette
while your getting drunk inside Mars.  Don’t you know they’re bad for
you?  It’s still okay to bang up in the bathrooms, just wipe up your
own blood please and use the mop if you’re a lightweight and vomit all
over things n’ stuff.”
Nah, that’s just a bad dream; never happen.<

Heyyy don’t joke about it!!! The scum suckers that be have enforced a total
ban on smoking in bars as of 10th December!!!!! And if you chose to smoke at
those tables outside, ya won’t get served!!! Huh???? Farked if I can figure
that one out.
Suffer a walk to the bar all theee smoking sinners
Cheesh
Kirk


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
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From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jeff chgecking in…
Date: November 29, 2004 at 9:34:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello to the list and especially Jasen and Sara. Just in from a couple a days down in Philly where we went to Rachel’s moms after seeing the band that is our passion The string cheese incident an amazing scene is always there and it was a real rush to feel the energy of live music and man the lights during a drum interlude as positively Tribal as in Eboga! for me any how. It was long night but it was great to see folks who knew that I was sick lately (even if they didn’t know why) and getting many well wishes and great good hugs. I even told an old friend the entire thing he was blown away and said to me that he thought I was a very brave man to go with it. Rachel flaked a lil post show while in the midst of speaking about Eboga with another goddess who has dealt with big time husband drug stuff and it was a blast to hear she had done it as part of a Stanford experiment back in the day (60 something). She was amazed that we were able to find it as I am everyday
Multiple times a day I praise what a fucking miracle this plant is it is simply mind boggling to me that I am 3 weeks 4 days out of my methadone habit of 50 mgs a day and I NEVER SUFFERED A BIT. Not to say the first two weeks post was not terribly hard but not the same dimension as any other of my kicks. Inever once started scheming the way we do to get relief never once though about copping or even asking her the old meth is Rachy says she threw it out but I am not so sure.
This past week week 3 has been seeing improvements a step forward a step back sometimes but I am healing everyday and have been laughing and feeling bit of the spiritual vibe I felt those first two weeks I was spiritually bankrupt it felt and it was a bit disconcerting. I
I am very mush looking forward to doing a full Ibo session again as It seemed that the ibogaine was so busy scrubbing the methadone out of me that my visionsthough vivid were not particularly revealing.
Well, time for one more of my countless baths a true relief they are. Thanks for listening
Freak Freely!
Jeff

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779
Date: November 29, 2004 at 8:49:59 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779

Ron, it sounds as if your email provider may be chopping your
digest of the list short. Maybe it is seeing it as spam. Anyway,
the general public can’t help, so you may want to email

ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com

It is odd that this is the ‘From’ address in your mail. So maybe
there’s a misconfiguration in the list server.

On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 05:45:05 -0800 Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
c/n download…got the key?
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 9:29 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] To Ron From DH [was: for Ron Jim to Ron]
Date: November 29, 2004 at 8:40:23 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks, i’ll try to figure it out. i always got booted out of groups anyway, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 6:18 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] To Ron From DH [was: for Ron Jim to Ron]

Hey Ron,

Bouncing messages usually happen when the email you are sending is not going to a valid email address. or it is being sent to list such as this but you are not subscribed to it. or, maybe you are sending to someone/place/thing that has blocked your email address. or, you may be sending an email with an attachment that exceeds the mailbox quota of the recipient. I’m sure there are a couple other scenarios as well.

If you could explain in what context “bouncing messages” you are referring to, I might be able to provide a better answer.

But if Patrick sez you are subscribed to both the list and the digest, you are probably getting double email X’s 2. you may even be attempting to reply from the digest to the regular list and these messages are bouncing? maybe not.

I would unsubscribe from either the digest or the list, depending on how you want the ibogaine list to be served up to you, as this may be the source of the issues.

Or, between daily tasks 2,456,301 and 2,456,302, PATRICK will remedy the situation for you. He’s a nice guy after all, altho he is one of the busiest people i know. but he can only add or delete you from one or both of the lists. He does not do house calls, Windows tech support or troubleshooting or plumbing. But then again, I do not represent Patrick in any manner so it is entirely up to him.

Or, you can always go here for addresses on how to unsubscribe, or, to re-subscribe.

peace,
_.dh

On Monday, November 29, 2004, at 04:06 AM, Ron Davis wrote:

DH:
can you tell me what bouncing messages mean?  i’ve tried to follow protocol but must be missing something. i know little of computers.  i’ forwarding an old message from schmooly with your follow up.  i d/n want to be taken off this list, but do not know what to do to remedy it.  can you help or will you help?  many thanks, ron rwd3@cox.net

—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron

<snip>

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] received message
Date: November 29, 2004 at 8:35:33 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 10:59 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] received message

I get the ezmlm warnings every now and again too. Bouncing means that for some reason they bounce out of your mailbox and back to sender system. Not a security issue as far as I know. The serious words like warning and tracking etc., etc. make you think something is really gone awry. No big issue I think! Don’t worry…..your security or anonymity has not been breached!
Peace, Callie

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 29, 2004 at 8:20:36 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

does anybody have the article in question.? I can figure out what this is about but I have never seen the article..

someone please send.

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Fwd: [Ibogaine] To Ron From DH [was: for Ron Jim to Ron]
Date: November 29, 2004 at 7:49:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

oops:

Or, you can always go here for addresses on how to unsubscribe, or, to re-subscribe.

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] nypd drug busts on ave. d on tv NOW
Date: November 29, 2004 at 7:43:53 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

p.s., Preston, I am personally very disappointed in NYC.  First Times
Square, then the LES…  It’s all become Happy Shiny Safe & Sanitized.
The Horror!  Before you know it, they’ll ban smoking in otherwise
healthy places like bars.  “I’m sorry sir, you can’t light a cigarette
while your getting drunk inside Mars.  Don’t you know they’re bad for
you?  It’s still okay to bang up in the bathrooms, just wipe up your
own blood please and use the mop if you’re a lightweight and vomit all
over things n’ stuff.”
Nah, that’s just a bad dream; never happen.<

Heyyy don’t joke about it!!! The scum suckers that be have enforced a total
ban on smoking in bars as of 10th December!!!!! And if you chose to smoke at
those tables outside, ya won’t get served!!! Huh???? Farked if I can figure
that one out.
Suffer a walk to the bar all theee smoking sinners
Cheesh
Kirk


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Darpan facing charge of trafficking ayahuasca
Date: November 29, 2004 at 7:39:03 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh Dear, Aussies!
Most of em are cool but when it comes to those in power the red on their necks would blind ya without a welding helmet on. Can just hear em “bluddy hippies string em all up”.
Good luck to this fella, I hope it all goes really well.
Kirsty
From: Nick Sandberg [mailto:nick227@tiscali.co.uk] 
Sent: Monday, 29 November 2004 11:09 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Darpan facing charge of trafficking ayahuasca

Heard about this today. I met this guy over the summer, he’s very lovely. Could be a tough case. If anyone wants to get in touch to give legal advice or local support please mail me off list

Nick

My beloved friends and fellow travellers,
On 12/11/04 I was apprehended by
the federal police in australia for less than a litre
of ayahuasca which was found in unaccompanied baggage
sent to me from europe. Ayahuasca is not on the
restricted list in this country so I have been charged
with importation of its contents, namely harmine and
dimethyltryptamine, both of which are schedule 1
restricted substances in their chemically extracted
form. Because anything ove 0.5g is considered a
trafficable quantity, I have also been charged with
trafficking. Considering that 800mls of ayahuasca
constitutes 8 or 9 doses this is patently absurd
however the authorities are taking this very
seriously. I was kept in custody for 3 days and am now
out on $100,000 bail. The maximum sentence under these
charges include up to 20 years in jail. There is no
precedent for a case such as this in this country so
it seems I am relegated to battle this out in the
courts. I am currently seeking the best legal
representation and hope to have the charges thrown out
of court. Any assistance whether it be financial or
information on overseas precedents would be most
gratefully accepted. In any case, I would ask that you
send me your loving thoughts and prayers in these
challenging times. My connection to you, my family of
light, is what will sustain me and give me strength. I
have faith that awareness and light will be brought to
bear in this difficult situation and that ultimately,
good will come of this. I feel fully in my integrity
in facing these charges and am prepared to stand up
for what I believe is right. I am so grateful for the
gifts and blessings I have already received from the
Mother. I trust that even in this challenging
situation a beautiful and rare jewel will be revealed.
Om Shanti
Darpan

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 29, 2004 at 7:35:57 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you Randy,
I’m hangin’ today while transferring to done…and I needed a good chuckle (not the main context of your email of course, just your first comment about shooting yourself……and a coupla other comments)
So thanks mate!
Kirsty
Aka capt kirk
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Sent: Monday, 29 November 2004 10:44 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths

I have got to speak my mind. I hope I can do so without shooting myself in the dick. This is sacred ground to me. Right here. This list. I have been clean only because of the people and now friends who post here, and those who let me rant without giving me too much shit about it. This is part of my own self imposed therapy. I love the people here. This just my opinion so here goes. Who cares if Patrick and Ms. Mash have some kind of relationship. She’s good lookin’, I’d go for it too. That doesn’t mean that they agree on everything. Personally I don’t think Ms. Mash is using Ibogaine in the spirit it was intended to be used with. Seems the pygmies freely gave it to the Bwiti’s who then used it and saw the good in it. Our monetary system is starting to screw up the whole works. Money pure and simple makes the world go around. It sucks but it is true. I think Ibogaine is a gift from God. The answer to addiction is growing in the ground in Africa. God is wondering what took us so long to find it. The underground providers are doing treatments out of love. I know because they came to our house and stayed a while. Doing so just ‘aint’ cost effective. I never saw the inside of a hotel room but desperate times call for desperate measures and some people have no choice other than to take the treatment in a hotel room. To imply that my provider or any provider I have met has anything to do with the deaths gets my southern dander up. These people care about your soul. They are taking a supreme risk and they are most definitely not doing it for the money. I know the ballpark figures and they are not raking addicts over the coals for all they can get. I trusted my provider right off the bat. That’s hard for a junkie to do. I’d do it again. I just don’t think I would do that with Ms. Mash. I don’t trust her intentions. Ibogaine is here and it won’t be denied no matter the money.  Our government dictates that there will be a struggle over money and the power therein anytime more than two dollars can be made. I think that is why it is still illegal here. Nobody can figure out how to manipulate the system so as to make the majority of the cash. Meanwhile addicts suffer. It is obvious that our suffering is inconsequential to the powers that be. So we take matters into our own hands. Thank God for the underground or I would be sprung right now. I hope I didn’t piss anyone off I’m just sayin.’ (no shrug) This list rocks. Thanks Patrick     Randy

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] To Ron From DH [was: for Ron Jim to Ron]
Date: November 29, 2004 at 7:18:05 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Ron,

Bouncing messages usually happen when the email you are sending is not going to a valid email address. or it is being sent to list such as this but you are not subscribed to it. or, maybe you are sending to someone/place/thing that has blocked your email address. or, you may be sending an email with an attachment that exceeds the mailbox quota of the recipient. I’m sure there are a couple other scenarios as well.

If you could explain in what context “bouncing messages” you are referring to, I might be able to provide a better answer.

But if Patrick sez you are subscribed to both the list and the digest, you are probably getting double email X’s 2. you may even be attempting to reply from the digest to the regular list and these messages are bouncing? maybe not.

I would unsubscribe from either the digest or the list, depending on how you want the ibogaine list to be served up to you, as this may be the source of the issues.

Or, between daily tasks 2,456,301 and 2,456,302, PATRICK will remedy the situation for you. He’s a nice guy after all, altho he is one of the busiest people i know. but he can only add or delete you from one or both of the lists.  He does not do house calls, Windows tech support or troubleshooting or plumbing. But then again, I do not represent Patrick in any manner so it is entirely up to him.

Or, you can always go here for addresses on how to unsubscribe, or, to re-subscribe.

peace,
_.dh

On Monday, November 29, 2004, at 04:06 AM, Ron Davis wrote:

DH:
can you tell me what bouncing messages mean?  i’ve tried to follow protocol but must be missing something. i know little of computers.  i’ forwarding an old message from schmooly with your follow up.  i d/n want to be taken off this list, but do not know what to do to remedy it.  can you help or will you help?  many thanks, ron rwd3@cox.net

—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron

<snip>

From: “” <thethird@myway.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Panic attacks and ideas to work w/ people post-ibo
Date: November 29, 2004 at 6:57:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey knowone knowwhere, thanks for the reply to my questions. You asked about my suboxone dose, I take 12mgs a day, which I think is about the average dose, maybe a little lower, but it works for me in helping my panic attacks / cravings. I think it’s interesting that panic attacks led you to opiates also. I started getting them when I was fifteen, around the time when I first tried pot. I remember getting really stoned and it actually made me feel out of whack for a couple days. I think it had to do with feeling out of control when I got high, and I had never felt like that before and it scared me. My first panic attack happened when I was in school (of course). I was in Spanish class and not paying attention to anything that I was supposed to. If I remember correctly I hadn’t been to class in a couple days and was way behind and had no idea what everyone was saying in Spanish. Then the teacher suddenly startled me out of some daydream I was having and told me to go to the board and translate some sentence. Well, I had no idea where to start, and wham, I heard a slight roaring sound and everything started looking a little distorted with black around the edges (tunnel vision) and I was smack dab in the middle of my first panic attack. The fact I had no idea I was having a panic attack made it ten times worse because I thought I must be going crazy. After that I got panic attacks pretty often. It turns out it’s a genetic trait I share with much of my family (My Mom remembers going to the grocery store as a child and seeing my Grandma’s knuckles go white as she clenched her hands in fear because she was having a panic attack going to the market). Over the next 6 or 7 years I tried imipramine, paxil, and zoloft. I was on zoloft the longest, which was a few years. Also, for about the whole 6 or 7 years I had steady prescriptions for clonazepam (generic klonopin), which I didn’t take everyday, but only when I could use it to stop / prevent attacks. All of that took a little bite out of my panic attacks, but when I was about 23 a situation arose where I was with some people who wanted to try some china white, and so I said what the hell, let’s try it. For the first few times I felt a little sick, but I had this underlying sense of perfect calm which I had always craved since I can remember. I’ve always over-analyzed everything and had bouts of OCD. My mind just wouldn’t shut up until I did smack and finally I had some mental peace. I also realized that my panic attacks were gone. It was like a miracle. The thought of going back to life with all the anxiety and panic was unbearable. I am not the kind of person that sees heroin as evil disguised as a substance, and I didn’t want to stop doing it because it is illegal or because I thought it was morally wrong. It is just too expensive and withdrawals suck and my family didn’t like me on dope so if I wanted to maintain a relationship with them then I had to stop. Also my view of myself became lowered because I felt like a slave to it. So I eventually saw that my quality of life would be higher without it. Even though I had the best peace of mind ever while high, and that my brain chemistry seems to balance out with opiates, it just wasn’t the route that would make me happiest. So, I will go back to school, major in psychology, and hopefully one day work with other addicts who have taken Ibogaine and help them get the most from their experience. At first I was taking classes pointed toward a degree in Comp. Science (perfect for minds that over-analyze), but after all my drug and ibogaine experiences I couldn’t help but change my goal. I would be interested in hearing anyone’s ideas about the best things to do post-ibogaine to make the most of the experience. I want to learn the most I can about Ibogaine because I really would like to work with people who have used it. So, please, if anybody can tell me ways that they think would help other people post-ibogaine, (I’ve got an open mind, so I’ll listen to ALL ideas) let me know so that when I get my degree I will be armed with i nformation from people who have first hand experience.
Thanks.

No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding.
Make My Way your home on the Web – http://www.myway.com

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 29, 2004 at 4:01:17 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy,
I believe possibly the point is not about the credibility of your providers and those you have met.  The truth is that when ever there exists a way to make money off of someone elses pain, there ALWAYS exists unscrupulous individuals who are only in it for the money.  Any one who has been a junkie has definitley interacted to some degree with this type of person(usually minus a soul or conscience).  So this is just a scam of a larger scale.  Take the money, put them in a hotel, no doubt deal annonymously, and if things get tough…scram!  This is worldwide and just like any business transaction from buying fruit to homes, you have to know where to get the good stuff that is properly represented.
Anyone that’s trying to accomplish something big or that is considered a new frontier is bound to make some people uncomfortable.  I believe it is the same quality that drives a person to accomplish a monumentous feat , is also that same drive that pisses some people off.  Intense is intense.  Opposite side of the same coin.
Randy, hope you are well.  Getting pissed off is part of our reality.  However, I still feel you need to BREATHE!
Much love,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 4:43 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths

I have got to speak my mind. I hope I can do so without shooting myself in the dick. This is sacred ground to me. Right here. This list. I have been clean only because of the people and now friends who post here, and those who let me rant without giving me too much shit about it. This is part of my own self imposed therapy. I love the people here. This just my opinion so here goes. Who cares if Patrick and Ms. Mash have some kind of relationship. She’s good lookin’, I’d go for it too. That doesn’t mean that they agree on everything. Personally I don’t think Ms. Mash is using Ibogaine in the spirit it was intended to be used with. Seems the pygmies freely gave it to the Bwiti’s who then used it and saw the good in it. Our monetary system is starting to screw up the whole works. Money pure and simple makes the world go around. It sucks but it is true. I think Ibogaine is a gift from God. The answer to addiction is growing in the ground in Africa. God is wondering what took us so long to find it. The underground providers are doing treatments out of love. I know because they came to our house and stayed a while. Doing so just ‘aint’ cost effective. I never saw the inside of a hotel room but desperate times call for desperate measures and some people have no choice other than to take the treatment in a hotel room. To imply that my provider or any provider I have met has anything to do with the deaths gets my southern dander up. These people care about your soul. They are taking a supreme risk and they are most definitely not doing it for the money. I know the ballpark figures and they are not raking addicts over the coals for all they can get. I trusted my provider right off the bat. That’s hard for a junkie to do. I’d do it again. I just don’t think I would do that with Ms. Mash. I don’t trust her intentions. Ibogaine is here and it won’t be denied no matter the money.  Our government dictates that there will be a struggle over money and the power therein anytime more than two dollars can be made. I think that is why it is still illegal here. Nobody can figure out how to manipulate the system so as to make the majority of the cash. Meanwhile addicts suffer. It is obvious that our suffering is inconsequential to the powers that be. So we take matters into our own hands. Thank God for the underground or I would be sprung right now. I hope I didn’t piss anyone off I’m just sayin.’ (no shrug) This list rocks. Thanks Patrick     Randy

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 29, 2004 at 3:38:48 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jasen,
I understand the fatigue part.  I was too fatigued to be bored.  I also found a lot of what I went through during my session didn’t come to the surface and make sense until something, usually very obscure, or someones action, inuendo or verbalizations clicked something in my memory(brain or mind?) that made me understand the significance of some of my visions.  It was also about being alone with someone(self) that you’re not sure of what is your motivation, likes, dislikes, reactions to things now that it’s not thru a drug veil.  Note the difference between being alone and lonely, or solace and isolation, or time to reflect and boredom.
Getting to know you, getting to know all about you.
Getting to like you, getting to hope you like me.
Haven’t you noticed, suddenley we’re light and breezy,
Because of all the beautiful and new things I’m learning about you day by day!
I know this is Korny as hell but it just came out.  I never was a hugh fan of showtunes.  Where ever inspiration and acknowledgment comes, hey it’s all good!
Truth be told, I feel like the noribogaine has left my brain. Elvis has left the building!!  I have had some lower dips than the past few months but am still doing ok.  I guess this is the reality part.  My advice to you would be to do whatever work on yourself spiritually, emotionally, physically (to stay balanced) so you can stay healthy.  I am looking forward to starting an already long standing established Ibogaine therapy group on Thursday.  I’ll be the new kid on the block.
Jasen, I feel you are an intelligent, kind, open minded, receptive young man and I’m in your corner along with so many others and all your angels.
Sending healing energy and love your way,
Martee

—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 2:28 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

You could try singing? Drawing? Explore those vibrations and see
what further healing and messages come when you take the active
role in place of eboga, carrying on your healing. Boredom may be
just the veil your habits are throwing over the next stage. Beware
of endings that amount to dissatisfaction. 🙂

On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 02:57:33 -0800 Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl>
wrote:
THANKS randy.
I AM SOOO BORED,CANYOU GUYS COME OVER.
You are right about aftercare,there is a lot of work to be done to

heal the
world.
I realised something being over the other side of the world,your
vibratioal
frequencies tune into
Different parts of the world depending on where you are born,which

port hole
on earth through your mothers womb,life without end,..a spiral,no
beginning
and no end
So when you live away from where you were born,it can feel as if
everything
is twice as hard.Like you are going against the grain..

IT MAY BE THE ONLY WAY HOWEVER IN CAN BE DONE IN A MUCH BIGGER AND
BETTERWAY,IF GREED MOVED OVER A TRIFLE.
Sara’S is very affordable. Just fuc ing boring. SORRY sara,I do
love you and
you are a princess,the bwiti princess,her vibes hide her princess
appearances as others see her,but I KNOW BECAUSE I saw,SARA IS THE

bwiti
PRINCESS.

Eboga must be taken naturally,to be effective on every plain,to
work on
every frequency the body neads to heal.WE ARE 4 DIMENSIOAL BEINGS
and need
healing on all freqences. Science and Natural medicine must work
together.
Love you all Jasen.
_____

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com]
Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2004 12:32
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen you freakin’  ROCKKK. See. It’s the only way, huh. Tell us
more when
you can. How long are you going to be there? I’d stay as long as I

could if
I were you. Everybody was right about aftercare. It sure makes me
feel
better about everything.     Randy

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] nypd drug busts on ave. d on tv NOW
Date: November 29, 2004 at 3:18:44 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Cc: <drugwar@mindvox.com>

p.s., Preston, I am personally very disappointed in NYC.  First Times
Square, then the LES…  It’s all become Happy Shiny Safe & Sanitized.
The Horror!  Before you know it, they’ll ban smoking in otherwise
healthy places like bars.  “I’m sorry sir, you can’t light a cigarette
while your getting drunk inside Mars.  Don’t you know they’re bad for
you?  It’s still okay to bang up in the bathrooms, just wipe up your
own blood please and use the mop if you’re a lightweight and vomit all
over things n’ stuff.”
Nah, that’s just a bad dream; never happen.<

Ahh, you tourist. You gotta know where to GO to drink and smok…oh, hold on, that bad dream you’re talking about? Never mind, I don’t want to depress you any further.
;-))

How is this different from every other day — other than the camera
crew.<

How is it different? Um, well, I sat and watched it? It was right outside my door? I wasn’t being arrested? LOL, there’s LOTS of ways it’s different…this time.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Cc: <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 29, 2004 11:22 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] nypd drug busts on ave. d on tv NOW

On Nov 29, 2004, at 12:35 AM, Preston Peet wrote:

channel Discovery Times is showing drug busts on Ave. D. Remember Ave. D Patrick?

Mmmmmm, Avenue D.  HappY!  So many good memories.  HOW DARE THEY!?!??!?!?!

This SUCKS! Cops on rooftops busting people in my neighborhood, on tv. Police state central.

How is this different from every other day — other than the camera crew.

Walking through hot spots in Harlem or da glorious South Bronx — Hunts Point!  Coke, Dope & Ho’s! — there’s often a group of little kids bouncing around or sitting on car hoods, staring at some rooftop and getting Very Excited.  LooOOK!!!@#!#@#  THE MAN is PLAYING a FUN GAME! They’re gathered on Yet Another Rooftop.  They’re plaYing (ops & R0bberZ@#!@#!@#!!!!!!  2 (oOl!

Anyway, it’s on now on tv. And so far, no arrests, just attempted drug busts. I love it.

TelebiyzshuN.  The Magical Glowing boX.  Fun for All Eternity.

Patrick

p.s., Preston, I am personally very disappointed in NYC.  First Times Square, then the LES…  It’s all become Happy Shiny Safe & Sanitized. The Horror!  Before you know it, they’ll ban smoking in otherwise healthy places like bars.  “I’m sorry sir, you can’t light a cigarette while your getting drunk inside Mars.  Don’t you know they’re bad for you?  It’s still okay to bang up in the bathrooms, just wipe up your own blood please and use the mop if you’re a lightweight and vomit all over things n’ stuff.”

Nah, that’s just a bad dream; never happen.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] received message
Date: November 29, 2004 at 11:59:16 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I get the ezmlm warnings every now and again too. Bouncing means that for some reason they bounce out of your mailbox and back to sender system. Not a security issue as far as I know. The serious words like warning and tracking etc., etc. make you think something is really gone awry. No big issue I think! Don’t worry…..your security or anonymity has not been breached!
Peace, Callie

From: Patrick K. Kroupa <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] nypd drug busts on ave. d on tv NOW
Date: November 29, 2004 at 11:22:34 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Nov 29, 2004, at 12:35 AM, Preston Peet wrote:

channel Discovery Times is showing drug busts on Ave. D. Remember Ave. D Patrick?

Mmmmmm, Avenue D.  HappY!  So many good memories.  HOW DARE THEY!?!??!?!?!

This SUCKS! Cops on rooftops busting people in my neighborhood, on tv. Police state central.

How is this different from every other day — other than the camera crew.

Walking through hot spots in Harlem or da glorious South Bronx — Hunts Point!  Coke, Dope & Ho’s! — there’s often a group of little kids bouncing around or sitting on car hoods, staring at some rooftop and getting Very Excited.  LooOOK!!!@#!#@#  THE MAN is PLAYING a FUN GAME!  They’re gathered on Yet Another Rooftop.  They’re plaYing (ops & R0bberZ@#!@#!@#!!!!!!  2 (oOl!

Anyway, it’s on now on tv. And so far, no arrests, just attempted drug busts. I love it.

TelebiyzshuN.  The Magical Glowing boX.  Fun for All Eternity.

Patrick

p.s., Preston, I am personally very disappointed in NYC.  First Times Square, then the LES…  It’s all become Happy Shiny Safe & Sanitized.  The Horror!  Before you know it, they’ll ban smoking in otherwise healthy places like bars.  “I’m sorry sir, you can’t light a cigarette while your getting drunk inside Mars.  Don’t you know they’re bad for you?  It’s still okay to bang up in the bathrooms, just wipe up your own blood please and use the mop if you’re a lightweight and vomit all over things n’ stuff.”

Nah, that’s just a bad dream; never happen.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Patrick K. Kroupa <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801
Date: November 29, 2004 at 11:01:06 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Nov 26, 2004, at 11:08 PM, Ron Davis wrote:

no program to open
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 10:06 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801

Ron … just to ask a crazy question, why are you signed up for the digest and the list, simultaeneously — like, all at once for instance…  If you really do want TwicE tHe FuN, and double the joy, far be it from me to argue.

When you doubleclick the digest, whatever box you are using — I’m gonna guess Windoze — does not know what to open it WITH.  It’s just a plain text file; throw it on any text editor like Notepad or whatever, and then it’ll associate that app with the digests, in the future — unless it doesn’t… In which case it won’t work at all, or partially, and only once.  After that, the only other way to get it to work is to put on magickIcaL RubY reD slipPerz and click your heels together three times and say, “I believe!”

Photoz plZ

Patrick

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From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] received message & Treatment
Date: November 29, 2004 at 10:03:24 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron,

I imagine internet servers (which route emails) do all kind of weird and wonderful things. Clearly you are receiving messages and sending. If some are bounced it probably doesn’t make a lot of difference as they keep reappearing anyway. Unles there is a specific message you are looking for?

Forgive me if I ask and I ask with all due respect. Have you made a full action plan for yourself yet? I did read somewhere where you were attempting to taper. Hows that going? Where do you go from there?

From what i have read you have received pretty much all the advice anyone can give you here on the list. So the best this list can do for you right now is to send words of support your way.

If I were in your shoes I would decide whether or not to be treated and then I would probably contact Sara (who has the most open ended & creative treatment available) and who can take care of you even if the treatment is not successful. (You wrote once you would get on a plane tomorrow if you thought the treatment would be successful). Amsterdam has got to be the one place in the world where you can receive practically any kind of drug related assistance necessary. So you are not going to die from the lack of a fix – if it comes to that.

Sara also has pure ibogaine – as far as I know.

So how about it? You have nothing to lose.

I keep my fingers crossed that you decide to go for it and get on that plane and get out of the scary corner you seem to be living in – which it seems is paralysing you from acting on your own behalf.

Love & Light to You

Lee

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
i do not know what bouncing means.  does it mean someone is reading my email? i have security.  please clue me in.  i know very little about computers and what all this means.  i here looking for a way to get and stay straight and save my life.  please help me understand what’s going on.  ron..at work today

http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality.

From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 29, 2004 at 9:47:09 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear “not so slow” Slowone

Thank you very much for your reply. Very interesting indeed.

In my own case (apart from 3 therapeutic MDMA sessions after my first eboga experience) I have based the past 6 years of my journey on the sacramental use of eboga to travel the inner recesses of my psyche and encounter the hidden demons of my past. I have unlocked practically every door (I am presently aware of) within me and have experienced nothing short of miraculous recovery. I eagerly look forward to completing the 3 books I am working on to share all the details of what I have experienced.

So I have not felt any need to enter the world of ayahuasca. However from what you write it is definitely something I will explore at some stage. Forgive me if I say (what some may take as heresy) but I find eboga to be a complete cure when used with the right intention, a sufficiently discerning mind and a heart that seeks as its ultimate goal a deep experience of love. Why?

Because it is very much spiritually guided and events in one life fall into place to move the process along if one is willing to undergo the changes and take the risks.

I like what you say about eboga and how it brings you in contact with specific deep issues. (I assume we are talking about low doses here) It confirms exactly what I am trying to promote in my writings: the use of eboga to resolve childhood trauma and abuse and to advance ones spirituality via the growth of consciousness which ensues.

There is absolutely no doubt that ongoing use of eboga is both surprising and humbling. It is also wonderfully liberating.

The part I find interesting for myself is how I went from a scientific agnostic to a believer & admirer of the God and the Goddess. Two great kind (non imposing) and generous entities in my opinon. You could say the perfect parents. And yet with them I sense a humility which accepts me lovingly as I am and allows me to grow from there. Its almost like a growing friendship.

Good idea to use as an adjunct to therapy.

One observation I would make on the healing action of eboga is this. A particular emotion such as abandonment, loss of a loved one etc can be resolved (when the time is right) by an experience of accelerated healing with eboga. By that I mean, the concentration of all the pain is oosed out of the psyche like the puss from a boil and that is something which conventional therapy imo cannot do. That is why I recommend to anyone who is interested in full recovery to invest time and trust in its healing ways. It has many miracles to offer.

Love & Peace

Lee

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
On Sun, 28 Nov 2004 05:38:59 -0800 Lee Albert
wrote:
>It sounds as though (from what you write) ayahuasca by its nature
>is more rewarding in the group experience?

For me it has been.

>Yet I would not make
>the same observation about eboga – perhaps at a certain stage it
>could be something to explore – as the experience tends to be
>highly personal – for the most part.

My solo eboga experiences have been mixed. Immediate issues such as
obsessive blocked anger have been resolved nicely, and sometimes I
have gotten insights into deeper problems, but it seems that eboga
in sufficient dose ultimately draws me to a trauma which I cannot
handle. Maybe someday.. meanwhile I can work on building a better
me. A mere taste on the tongue before therapy is my main use at
this point.

>I certainly agree that any experience has its own optimum set &
>setting.

For ibogaine I believe that could be a group of caring and
compassionate people who would welcome the person into the world
and compensate for all the pain and neglect that may have been
suffered at the hands of others. The baby physical helplessness of
the ibogaine experience is a wonderful opportunity to learn to
depend on others, for those of us who have been Gollum-ized by this
world.

Economics dictate that this would either be a church or a group
treatment and therapy setting.

In the meantime, the better integration with aftercare, the better.

>I am curious what you mean by deep body learning?

Long tedious absorption of the vine, with little or none of the DMT
‘light’ to take the mind elsewhere, followed by some weeks of
feeling more grounded and having insights comparable to post-eboga.
Possibly it could be like noribogaine if one could take that
directly.

>What do you see as its (ayahuasca) ongoing benefits?

Briefly, strength and love, if used for that purpose.

If you read the literature, and the experience reports on erowid
and elsewhere, you will find that the cultures and personal
experiences are all over the map.

>Are you located in Holland?

No.

>Hope I am not bombarding you with too many questions. Its an area
>I no little about but am curious to understand better. What I have

>read has not really enlightened me much.

From my reading, ibogaine and secondarily ayahuasca stood out as
entheogens that lead to deep learning about oneself that can lead
to real personal change. In both cases personal experience has been
surprising and humbling.

>
>slowone@hush.ai wrote:
>On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 04:15:16 -0800 Lee Albert
>wrote:
>>Similarly I am not a great fan of DMT from what I have read as I
>>think its a shortcut to spiritual dimensions best reserved for
>>those whose souls have been prepared for the experience.
>Otherwise
>
>>the combination of ones own inner demons coupled with the doors
>>which are been opened can lead to serious problems afterwards
>imo.
>
>In my experience, the container is all-important. So far the best
>one for me is group singing in a church setting, which is what I
>started with. The first time I did my own homebrew, the message
>was, “why are you doing this alone, your path is to connect with
>people,” and the church has been my satisfaction and growth ever
>since. (I also learn in free-form group singing without the
>religious or entheogenic aspects.) Plus with ayahuasca there is
>the
>vine, which on its own can take one on a slow unhallucinogenic
>path
>of deep body learning. It is all work, the hardest and deepest
>that
>one is capable of, no shortcuts I thoroughly agree.
>
>
>
>
>
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Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] received message
Date: November 29, 2004 at 9:10:45 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i do not know what bouncing means.  does it mean someone is reading my email? i have security.  please clue me in.  i know very little about computers and what all this means.  i here looking for a way to get and stay straight and save my life.  please help me understand what’s going on.  ron..at work today

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron
Date: November 29, 2004 at 9:06:21 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

DH:
can you tell me what bouncing messages mean?  i’ve tried to follow protocol but must be missing something. i know little of computers.  i’ forwarding an old message from schmooly with your follow up.  i d/n want to be taken off this list, but do not know what to do to remedy it.  can you help or will you help?  many thanks, ron rwd3@cox.net
—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron

Tapering slowly is the only way i know of kicking benzo’s.

And Scmooleyboy has a point.

Taking responsibility for yourself is generally a pre-requisite for overcoming any sort of addiction.

then comes the action part, the “doing”.

You’re only ready when you are truly ready.

On Saturday, November 20, 2004, at 07:12 AM, Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:

Ron,
You keep blameing everyone but youyrself. Yes, most doctors suck. But there are good king knowlegable people out there who will help you. If you know what is right for you, why don’t you just do it. You can buy valium or any other benzo on the web without vere seeing a doc.

Do the teper, get a program, deal with the posy acute withdrawal that will last 3-6 months and alas—- you get your life back.

Get off the pity pot, it’s sounding old. I know this is really hard but on some level no matter how you do it, you must pay the piper.

I kinbow numerous folks who are benzo clean because they really wanted it. wanted more then anything else. They did exactly what they where told to do by qualified detox experts who had a proven track record and they made it. was it hell?–yes to some degree. was it worth it? they always say yes.

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Darpan facing charge of trafficking ayahuasca
Date: November 29, 2004 at 5:09:02 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Heard about this today. I met this guy over the summer, he’s very lovely. Could be a tough case. If anyone wants to get in touch to give legal advice or local support please mail me off list

Nick

My beloved friends and fellow travellers,
On 12/11/04 I was apprehended by
the federal police in australia for less than a litre
of ayahuasca which was found in unaccompanied baggage
sent to me from europe. Ayahuasca is not on the
restricted list in this country so I have been charged
with importation of its contents, namely harmine and
dimethyltryptamine, both of which are schedule 1
restricted substances in their chemically extracted
form. Because anything ove 0.5g is considered a
trafficable quantity, I have also been charged with
trafficking. Considering that 800mls of ayahuasca
constitutes 8 or 9 doses this is patently absurd
however the authorities are taking this very
seriously. I was kept in custody for 3 days and am now
out on $100,000 bail. The maximum sentence under these
charges include up to 20 years in jail. There is no
precedent for a case such as this in this country so
it seems I am relegated to battle this out in the
courts. I am currently seeking the best legal
representation and hope to have the charges thrown out
of court. Any assistance whether it be financial or
information on overseas precedents would be most
gratefully accepted. In any case, I would ask that you
send me your loving thoughts and prayers in these
challenging times. My connection to you, my family of
light, is what will sustain me and give me strength. I
have faith that awareness and light will be brought to
bear in this difficult situation and that ultimately,
good will come of this. I feel fully in my integrity
in facing these charges and am prepared to stand up
for what I believe is right. I am so grateful for the
gifts and blessings I have already received from the
Mother. I trust that even in this challenging
situation a beautiful and rare jewel will be revealed.
Om Shanti
Darpan

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 29, 2004 at 4:43:52 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have got to speak my mind. I hope I can do so without shooting myself in the dick. This is sacred ground to me. Right here. This list. I have been clean only because of the people and now friends who post here, and those who let me rant without giving me too much shit about it. This is part of my own self imposed therapy. I love the people here. This just my opinion so here goes. Who cares if Patrick and Ms. Mash have some kind of relationship. She’s good lookin’, I’d go for it too. That doesn’t mean that they agree on everything. Personally I don’t think Ms. Mash is using Ibogaine in the spirit it was intended to be used with. Seems the pygmies freely gave it to the Bwiti’s who then used it and saw the good in it. Our monetary system is starting to screw up the whole works. Money pure and simple makes the world go around. It sucks but it is true. I think Ibogaine is a gift from God. The answer to addiction is growing in the ground in Africa. God is wondering what took us so long to find it. The underground providers are doing treatments out of love. I know because they came to our house and stayed a while. Doing so just ‘aint’ cost effective. I never saw the inside of a hotel room but desperate times call for desperate measures and some people have no choice other than to take the treatment in a hotel room. To imply that my provider or any provider I have met has anything to do with the deaths gets my southern dander up. These people care about your soul. They are taking a supreme risk and they are most definitely not doing it for the money. I know the ballpark figures and they are not raking addicts over the coals for all they can get. I trusted my provider right off the bat. That’s hard for a junkie to do. I’d do it again. I just don’t think I would do that with Ms. Mash. I don’t trust her intentions. Ibogaine is here and it won’t be denied no matter the money.  Our government dictates that there will be a struggle over money and the power therein anytime more than two dollars can be made. I think that is why it is still illegal here. Nobody can figure out how to manipulate the system so as to make the majority of the cash. Meanwhile addicts suffer. It is obvious that our suffering is inconsequential to the powers that be. So we take matters into our own hands. Thank God for the underground or I would be sprung right now. I hope I didn’t piss anyone off I’m just sayin.’ (no shrug) This list rocks. Thanks Patrick     Randy

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 29, 2004 at 12:42:00 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I did not at all mean to hassle Dr Mash. Just tell her that some folks have questions and concerns and then she could decide if she wanted to share. If I were her I would not mind repeating what I said to reporter. If I were her and did not share with reporter there were deaths I would want to clear that up too.
I also do not think she is accountable to anyone involved in Ibogaine. We can only be accountable for ourselves and our actions.
No need to apologize,
Callie

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] nypd drug busts on ave. d on tv NOW
Date: November 29, 2004 at 12:35:13 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

channel Discovery Times is showing drug busts on Ave. D. Remember Ave. D Patrick?
This SUCKS! Cops on rooftops busting people in my neighborhood, on tv. Police state central.
Anyway, it’s on now on tv. And so far, no arrests, just attempted drug busts. I love it.
;-0)))) (But it’s early, But damnit they’re crusing my streets, and have no busted little graffitti artists for marijuana. Darn it, pigs.)

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:46:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie I wasn’t being serious I don’t get the impression that Mash is
going to chat about her opinions with anyone on the list 😉 I’m sure
Patrick has no trouble finding her, he sees her every day and he only
runs Mindvox. I’m sure Schmooly has no trouble finding her.  I’m sure
that parts of the list are read by her or even the whole list goes to
some mailbox of hers. I don’t think she has the belief thats anything
she does is accountable to anyone else involved with ibogaine.

My impressions only 🙂 I also think that hassling Mash isn’t going to
make any big positive change. Years of that and all the lawsuits in the
world havne’t done it. Maybe Patrick will get hassled for people from
Mindvox who dare to bother her 😉 That will be about it.

Her email appears all over Mindvox, all over the net, University of
Miami, she’s not hard to look up.

Sorry Patrick 😉

.:vector:.

— CallieMimosa@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 11/28/2004 8:08:30 PM Central
Standard Time,
vector620022002@yahoo.com writes:

think  the only person with the data would be
Patrick’s mom, that Dr. Mash lady 😉

anyone know how to get in touch with Mash? I think I
had her e-mail  addy at
one time but have yet to find it today. If anyone
has it, invite her to  list
to explain what she told reporter.
Think?
Callie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:17:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/28/2004 8:08:30 PM Central Standard Time, vector620022002@yahoo.com writes:
think the only person with the data would be
Patrick’s mom, that Dr. Mash lady 😉

anyone know how to get in touch with Mash? I think I had her e-mail addy at one time but have yet to find it today. If anyone has it, invite her to list to explain what she told reporter.
Think?
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Paula
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:02:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Paula,
Could or would you share about yourself? Of course, it is not necessary but you have piqued my curiosity. First with that very angry and judgmental (in my opinion) post to my friend Preston. Then again by posting all these articles in anger management.
Are you trying to redeem yourself? If so, it is not necessary. An apology never hurts but that is really not necessary unless it honestly comes from your heart.
If you have already shared about yourself, please forgive me as I must have missed it.
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 28, 2004 at 10:10:09 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/28/2004 11:32:31 AM Central Standard Time, HSLotsof@aol.com writes:
Too bad Sara and Schmoolyboy are not working together.  Then you
could have the best of both worlds.

What a treatment team a lot of you could be if you all could work together! The ‘Ibogaine Dream Team’!!!!!!!lol!
Callie

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Schmoolyboy_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 28, 2004 at 9:14:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have just read this stuff in books. They state 300 dosages in 3 years. Yet, I know people who have done more then that amount and are fine.

The crash ,,they say is serotonin depletion. They recoommend taling 20 mgs Prosac 0ne – two hours after taking X. Others say to take it the next day. Taking it while on x makes sense.

I have never felt a crash from it but have only tried it a few times.

It made me throw up at first but the sex on it was spiritual mystic great etc…

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine deaths
Date: November 28, 2004 at 9:04:25 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I don’t think this flew under the radar. These deaths have been talked
about here so many times over years of time, at least one or two of
them when they happened. I think the only person with the data would be
Patrick’s mom, that Dr. Mash lady 😉 I’m not sure the exact reaons why,
I do however think that she is recogised as the worldwide authority on
ibogaine in humans, so whenever there is a death the police invite her.
I’m sure Patrick or Howard could explain better or tell me I’m wrong 🙂
If there is any ‘real data’ I don’t think anyone is going to hand it
out 😉

.:vector:.

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

Sara, thank you for asking the obvious. I’m trying to keep a positive

attitude so I won’t rant about what was said. Why haven’t we heard
about this? Are we suddenly out of the loop? I don’t believe that we
are. Seems like someone would have heard about this. How do we know
this wasn’t self administered? Is there any post mortem blood work on

any of these people? I’d sure like to see some real data on this. If
there is any.          Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 28, 2004 at 8:12:20 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think maybe Sara might be just the person to write such a letter to the editor
don’t you?  After all, people need to be made responsible for their claims
especially when they are in a position to cause harm to those who are trying
to bring assistance to all of those in need of that help.

My two cents worth!!!

ann
think@francomm.com

Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks

In a message dated 11/28/04 5:19:18 PM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

<< How many people died in an Hotel room after they have been treated

With Ibogaine?

how many died from Heroin over dose in an Hotel room?

How is it possible to know?

Where can I get an info. About Ibogaine death in Hotel rooms? >>

Well Sara,

I would say you have to go to the source.  See quoted material below.

<<There have been several documented deaths in connection with the drug. But
because the ibogaine was not taken in a clinical setting, the cause of death
was never firmly established. Some fatalities may have been caused by
preexisting heart conditions made lethal by ibogaine’s effects. Mash is confident that
there are more that have gone unreported. “There are some pretty unethical
people” giving clandestine treatments, she says. “They just leave patients for
dead in hotel rooms.”>>

If Mash has knowledge of ibogaine fatalities and is withholding information,
that would seem pretty serious of itself.  If she doesn’t have such
information then that cetainly leaves a lot wanting for a scientist to make
unsubstantiated claims of this kind.  Possibly a letter to the editor of the LA times
might be appropriate to seek clarification.

Howard

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 28, 2004 at 7:53:36 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/28/04 5:19:18 PM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

<< How many people died in an Hotel room after they have been treated

With Ibogaine?

how many died from Heroin over dose in an Hotel room?

How is it possible to know?

Where can I get an info. About Ibogaine death in Hotel rooms? >>

Well Sara,

I would say you have to go to the source.  See quoted material below.

<<There have been several documented deaths in connection with the drug. But
because the ibogaine was not taken in a clinical setting, the cause of death
was never firmly established. Some fatalities may have been caused by
preexisting heart conditions made lethal by ibogaine’s effects. Mash is confident that
there are more that have gone unreported. “There are some pretty unethical
people” giving clandestine treatments, she says. “They just leave patients for
dead in hotel rooms.”>>

If Mash has knowledge of ibogaine fatalities and is withholding information,
that would seem pretty serious of itself.  If she doesn’t have such
information then that cetainly leaves a lot wanting for a scientist to make
unsubstantiated claims of this kind.  Possibly a letter to the editor of the LA times
might be appropriate to seek clarification.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 28, 2004 at 7:22:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara, thank you for asking the obvious. I’m trying to keep a positive attitude so I won’t rant about what was said. Why haven’t we heard about this? Are we suddenly out of the loop? I don’t believe that we are. Seems like someone would have heard about this. How do we know this wasn’t self administered? Is there any post mortem blood work on any of these people? I’d sure like to see some real data on this. If there is any.          Randy

From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] aftercare
Date: November 28, 2004 at 6:20:25 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Surprise surprise, my mother has joined the 21st
century.

We danced at String Cheese last night and it was
mostly good.  Jeff told some friends what was going
on, and it was interesting to hear and witness their
reactions.  I abandoned him in the afterblur, and
ended up talking to the Mama Prankster Goddess about
holding up one’s man whilst kickin’ and learned quite
a lot.   Like to take better care of myself!  “Ooh,
they get so CRANKY don’t they???”

Yeah… for all the stressing I did before the
treatment, preparing about his  mood changes
afterwards was not part of my outlook.  Got him some
GABA for mood stabilization and 5-HTP today at the
Whole Foods, and also a chlorophyll-oxygen liquid.

This afternoon clouds in the sky look like angels
eating Eboga or peyote over the Philadelphia Art
Museum, and a hawk flies, soaring, to land on the
copper ornamentation at the peak of the building.  We
sit on our own perch above the Schuykill River,
watching the wood detritus float and flop and turn in
the little falls.  My life feels like I am a piece of
snapped off tree branch, caught in an eddy at the
bottom of a waterfall.  Yet I can sit above on the
cliff with my arms spread out, setting sun shining
warm, and wind blowing me into another, altogether
glorious state.  Jeff warns me not to try to fly, and
I laugh sadly, wishing that jumping off the edge was
easier for me to contemplate.  His hair was blowing
wild, a mane of silver light, and very handsome.

It’s good to be not in New York, and out of that
fucking apartment.  Even if my mom thinks he has
anemia and I hate having to lie to her.

Anyway,  love to all, especially the bitches, as I
showed myself to be a royal one last night.  xo Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Get it on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/maildemo

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From: “Vigilius Haufniensis” <thehatefulnerd@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 28, 2004 at 7:21:15 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Where can I get an info. About Ibogaine death in Hotel rooms?Sara

VMANN:  try here:
http://scholar.google.com/
vigilius haufniensis

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 28, 2004 at 5:17:56 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,

How many people died in an Hotel room after they have been treated
With Ibogaine?
how many died from Heroin over dose in an Hotel room?
How is it possible to know?

Where can I get an info. About Ibogaine death in Hotel rooms?

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ann B. Mullikin [mailto:think@francomm.com]
Verzonden: zaterdag 27 november 2004 21:48
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks

Thank you very much for taking the time and trouble to put this up!!!!

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 2:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks

————————————————————————

http://www.latimes.com/features/printedition/magazine/la-tm-ibogaine48nov28,
0,
775349.story?coll=la-home-magazine

The Magical Mystery Tour

Drug and alcohol addicts are going abroad in search of the purported
miracle
treatment called ibogaine. But will the drug industry embrace a substance
that
causes a hallucinatory high?
By Vince Beiser
Special to The Times

November 28, 2004
The hallucinations are coming fast and vivid. Faces, shapes, colors rush
toward him, melting and swirling into each other, sometimes coalescing
into more
concrete visions. He sees himself floating underwater. By turns, his four
children drift by. Sometimes they blow bubbles and float happily up to the

surface;
sometimes they sink straight down, disappearing into darkness. Then there
are
three ships, coming in to dock at three tubes; he knows, somehow, that
they
are building a bomb, and if all three dock successfully it will explode.
He
tries to direct them away, but can’t. The final ship enters the final
tube. A
titanic explosion collapses everything into darkness.

Then it all starts again.

While Craig’s mind reels through this visual cacophony, his body lies
quietly
in a darkened room in a house near Tijuana, deep in the grip of a powerful
psychedelic drug. His wife, his children and his upper-middle-class home
in Salt
Lake City are all far, far away.

Craig is not some crystal-collecting spiritual seeker on a Carlos
Castańeda
trip. He is a prosperous, respected restaurant owner, age 50. He is
friendly
with the mayor and active in mainstream charities. Other than family
vacations
to the Bahamas and Mazatlan, Mexico, this is the only time he has been
outside
of the United States.

Craig is here because he is desperate. He is addicted to
painkillers—OxyContin, Lortab and other illegally obtained prescription
opiates. His habit is
costing him $1,500 a month, and he knows he must stop. Conventional detox
programs
have failed to help, so he has slipped over the border to try a treatment
that is as much an urban myth as a scientifically proven medication—and is

as
illegal as heroin in the United States.

The treatment is a dose of a powerful hallucinogen called ibogaine. It is
derived from the roots of a shrub called Tabernanthe iboga that grows in
Africa.
Local tribespeople have used it as a peyote-like sacrament for
generations.
Since the 1960s, it has circulated on the margins of Western drug culture,
sustained by its reputation as a potent healer. A single daylong trip on
ibogaine,
lore has it, can help break an addiction to heroin, cocaine, alcohol or
even
cigarettes.

Other hallucinogens such as Ecstasy have purported to be helpful in
treating
addiction, but interest in ibogaine seems to be approaching critical mass.

The
increasing number of anecdotal success stories has attracted the attention

of
researchers. Although there is no rock-solid proof, scientific consensus
is
growing that this drug may indeed possess potent addiction-thwarting
properties.

Regardless of what science says, faith is flourishing. A devoted community
has grown up around ibogaine—a motley congregation of former junkies,
envelope-pushing academics and drug-reform zealots helping to spread
awareness and use
of the drug. There reportedly are at least two underground activists in
the
U.S. who will provide it to seekers illegally. But taking ibogaine doesn’t

have
to involve breaking laws, because it’s legal in many countries. As a
result,
clinics are popping up from the Caribbean to Pakistan, offering ibogaine
treatment for a few thousand dollars to well over $10,000.

The clinic near Tijuana is, relatively speaking, among the most reputable.

It
was opened in 2001 by Martin Polanco, a Mexican doctor who was impressed
with
how ibogaine—obtained at an underground U.S. clinic—had helped one of his
relatives beat cocaine addiction. Polanco’s facility, known as the
Ibogaine
Association, has administered more than 350 treatments and currently has
10 to 15
new patients a month, says program director Randy Hencken.

Hencken, a gangly 28-year-old with curly hair and little studs in each
ear,
was one of Polanco’s first patients. He had dropped out of college at 21
to
devote himself to cocaine and, eventually, heroin. Over the years, he
tried
everything from 12-step programs to methadone to get clean, but nothing
worked. He
discovered ibogaine on the Internet, made his way to Polanco’s facility,
and
returned with his addiction broken. He has since embraced the cause with a
convert’s zeal, taking a job as the association’s main organizer.

On the summer day Craig is to begin his ibogaine experience, Hencken is
padding around a San Diego apartment that doubles as the association’s
U.S. office.
The place fits naturally in the beachside slacker-student-surfer
neighborhood. The front room is furnished with worn couches and a computer

emblazoned with
a Jane’s Addiction sticker. A bike and surfboards hang on hooks in the
kitchen.

Hencken, dressed in a black T-shirt and pants, hops into an unmarked van
and
drives to a dingy airport motel. Waiting in the parking lot is Craig, a
trim,
compact man wearing loafers, khakis and a Nike T-shirt.

“I’ve got to admit this is a little weird,” says Craig, who flew in from
Salt
Lake the night before. “I feel like we’re doing a drug deal.” Which, in a
sense, they are. Craig gets in the van and they roll south.

Craig is highly motivated to undertake this bizarre journey. He was an
alcoholic for years, with the smashed cars and nights in jail to show for
it. He
quit drinking 16 years ago and has stayed sober. But a few years ago he
was
prescribed painkillers for a knee injury and discovered that he liked
them. He
began downing fistfuls of pills daily, scoring them from one of his
employees. “At
first it was recreational,” he recalls. “But then you find yourself doing
them just to get from point A to B and you know it’s a problem.”

Last year, he checked himself into a rehab center and went cold turkey.
“It
was horrible,” he says. “You hurt from your bones in. I couldn’t sleep. I
cried
like a baby. I’d take hot baths all day and eat ibuprofen like candy.” He
stayed clean for six weeks and then fell off the wagon.

“I can’t stop myself. But I know I can’t go down that road again like I
did
with alcohol,” he says. “But when you’re on opiates, it really hurts to
stop.”
So when his dealer, who had been scouring the Internet for unconventional
ways
to kick drugs, told Craig about the Ibogaine Association, he decided he
had
little to lose.

“I just need to get this stuff out of my system,” he says, “and I’m
looking
for an easier, softer way.”

Ibogaine, as even its most ardent supporters say, is not a cure for drug
dependence; however, it apparently can play a potent role as an
addiction-interrupter. The drug has two powerful addiction-fighting
effects. The first is
biochemical: It seems to act on serotonin and opiate systems in the brain,
physically nullifying a person’s craving for drugs and smoothing their
withdrawal
symptoms. That’s a huge boon for those addicted to heroin and other
opiates, many
of whom shrink from the physical pain of detox.

“It has been proved to alleviate the pain and physical discomfort of drug
withdrawal with animals,” says Dr. Stanley Glick, a neuropharmacologist at

Albany
Medical Center in New York who has researched the drug for years. “And
there
are lots of reports of it doing the same with humans. You hear the same
story
a few thousand times, you’ve got to believe there’s something there.”

After a few weeks, this craving-blocking effect generally fades. But by
then,
users have been able to detox relatively painlessly, and then have a month

or
more free of drug cravings in which to do whatever it takes to stay clean.

“One dose of ibogaine is not a magic bullet,” says Dr. Deborah Mash, a
neurology professor at the University of Miami who has done the most
extensive
research on ibogaine’s effects on human beings. “But it can be a powerful
first
step on the road to recovery.”

The second effect is less tangible and more controversial. In many users,
ibogaine induces hours of staggering hallucinations while the patient
appears to
be sleeping. Many ibogaine users say they gained profound insights from
this
experience, which helps them to understand why they became addicts.

Greg Douglass, a former guitarist with the Steve Miller Band, credits a
session last year at the Ibogaine Association with helping him to kick
methadone.
Douglass had visions of himself as a terrified child, of his still-living
father in a coffin, of fantastic animals tearing each other apart in a red

sea.
Over the next several weeks, he says, he gradually came to understand some

of the
messages encoded in the visions.

“I’d be tying my shoes and suddenly have a little epiphany—’Aha, that’s
what
that meant.’ ” The visions, he says, “showed me the potential for myself
as a
human being.”

Beth Giuliano, a sturdy 25-year-old from New York, had been in and out of
rehab programs for years trying to kick heroin before she found her way to

the
Ibogaine Association in February. “I saw my mother holding an infant,” she

says,
describing her hallucinations. “I realized that was me. I felt the pain of
what it would be like to have a child who becomes a drug addict. I’d
always felt
guilty about my family, but I never really understood their pain until I
did
ibogaine.

“I woke up the next day seeing things a completely different way. I’d
never
felt so positive,” she says. “I felt like the person I was when I was
little or
like a whole new me.” She says she’s done heroin twice since her
treatment,
but didn’t enjoy it and has stayed clean for four months.

But there are plenty of people who discount the supposed wonder treatment.
For some, the visions are harrowing and the treatment is a failure. “It’s
like
acid times one million,” writes an anonymous naysayer on one of the many
web
sites devoted to ibogaine. “I saw God alright—I talked to him. And I was
so sure
it was real. But it wasn’t…. It was someone who [messed] with me and
scared
the [daylights] out of me.” This person’s account says that others who
took the
treatment at the same time saw themselves being crucified or raped. “It
didn’t work for me, and it didn’t work for anyone else that I personally
met who
took it,” the writer concludes.

Everyone agrees that ibogaine is no fun. It’s often emotionally
unsettling,
mentally exhausting and physically stressful. Its side effects can include
nausea, vomiting, loss of coordination and a potentially dangerous
reduction in
blood pressure and heart rate.

There have been several documented deaths in connection with the drug. But
because the ibogaine was not taken in a clinical setting, the cause of
death was
never firmly established. Some fatalities may have been caused by
preexisting
heart conditions made lethal by ibogaine’s effects. Mash is confident that
there are more that have gone unreported. “There are some pretty unethical
people” giving clandestine treatments, she says. “They just leave patients

for dead
in hotel rooms.”

“That’s why ibogaine needs to be legal and available in safe settings,”
Hencken says. “It needs to be in the hands of someone who can judge your
health,
your dosage and provide a safe environment.”

The Ibogaine Association requires clients to submit a medical history as
well
as undergo testing before treatment can begin. A doctor administers the
drug.
Still, the procedure seems remarkably casual.

From San Diego, Craig is brought to the association’s treatment facility,
a
rented house on a well-kept residential street near Tijuana. Only the
dining
room, which has been converted into a medication-equipped office, and the
oxygen
tanks under the stairs indicate that it is a medical establishment, of
sorts.

The doctor treating Craig is Francisco Cańez, a calm, round-faced man who
splits his time between the association and a hospital emergency room.
Craig sits
with his arms crossed, looking more than a tad nervous as Cańez reviews
his
file and calculates his ibogaine dosage. From a small jar, he shakes out
three
gelatin capsules filled with white powder and hands them to Craig.

Craig looks speculatively at the first pill, which he’ll take to make sure

he
doesn’t have an allergic reaction. “Well, I’ve put all kinds of things in
my
body,” he says, shrugging. Half an hour later, having evinced no untoward
initial responses, he swallows the other two pills.

Cańez then takes him into a bedroom, where sheets of Styrofoam cover the
windows and a CD softly plays rainforest sounds, and attaches him to a
heart
monitor next to the bed. The monitor’s graph flutters peacefully as the
ibogaine
gradually pulls Craig away. After a while, he just lies there silently,
engulfed
in a hallucinogenic hurricane.

After several hours, the visions gradually start to subside. Craig sits
up,
nauseated and dizzy. “That was a wild ride,” he mutters. Though he hasn’t
had a
painkiller in several days, he finds he doesn’t crave one now. He lies
down
again and drops back into his head for another hour. Finally, he revives
enough
to be moved to another house where he will spend the next day recovering.
He
totters out to the van with small, jittery steps.

Ibogaine’s addiction-fighting potential was discovered only recently, and
accidentally. It was sold as a stimulant in France during the middle
decades of
the last century, and an American psychologist and a psychiatrist dabbled
with
it in the 1950s and ’60s. So little was known about it that it could not
even
be considered a curiosity.

But in 1962, Howard Lotsof, a 19-year-old New York student with a heroin
habit and an appetite for other pharmacological kicks, scored some powder
that he
was told would give him a 36-hour trip. Lotsof and some of his junkie pals
experimented with it and, to their astonishment, found that it knocked out

their
heroin craving.

Mightily impressed, Lotsof tried to drum up street interest, and a little
cash for himself in the process. It never caught on in a big way, but it
did find
a place in counterculture lore—and got banned by the federal government in
1970. It was memorably cited by gonzo journalist Hunter S. Thompson, who
speculated that “a bad ibogaine frenzy” was the likely explanation for
Democrat Ed
Muskie’s oddly emotional behavior in the 1972 presidential campaign.

Ibogaine’s legend grew as a constant trickle of adventurous addicts tried
it.
In the mid-’80s, Lotsof managed to patent ibogaine as an anti-addiction
palliative, and set up a company to try to bring it to market. An early
series of
treatments in the Netherlands looked promising, although there were a
couple of
ibogaine-related deaths elsewhere in Europe.

Lotsof continued his crusade. In the early ’90s, he and other activists
persuaded a federal agency to cough up several million dollars for
ibogaine
research. He recruited Mash and the two began working together. (They have

since
parted ways.) By 1993, Mash had won FDA approval to begin testing ibogaine

on
human subjects. But then one of Lotsof’s informal patients in the
Netherlands
died. In 1995, the National Institute on Drug Abuse decided not to proceed

to
clinical studies.

“Committee members were not all that impressed with its efficacy, but the
safety issue stopped them in their tracks,” says Frank Vocci, a federal
researcher who has followed ibogaine’s progress. “What you have are a lot
of
interesting, colorful anecdotes. But the plural of anecdotes is not
scientific data.”

A number of researchers around the country, however, have become
sufficiently
intrigued to continue experimenting with animals. Dozens of articles have
appeared in scientific journals, most of them reporting promising results
that
buttress the anecdotal evidence.

Mash is doing her own part to advance the cause. In 1996 she helped to
launch
an ibogaine clinic on the Caribbean island of St. Kitts. During the next
five
years, she gathered data on more than 300 patients who sought treatment
there—the largest body of serious clinical research on ibogaine ever
collected.

Mash presented her findings at a medical conference last fall in San
Francisco. Granted, her sample wasn’t representative of America’s drug
users: Most
were white men between 20 and 40 years old, the sort of addicts who can
afford to
spend several weeks and several thousand dollars detoxing in the
Caribbean.
Still, she declared that her research proves that ibogaine can be
administered
safely and does help break addictions. “We saw people with big methadone
habits lose their cravings after just a single dose of ibogaine,” she
says. “One
month later, both cocaine and opiate addicts reported cravings were
significantly lower. And at one year, drug use was significantly down
among testees.”

At this point, perhaps the major obstacle to Ibogaine’s mainstream
acceptance
is its scrofulous image. This isn’t a medicine developed by white-coated
scientists; its anti-addictive properties were discovered by a junkie, and

some of
its promoters are folks who may be of more interest to the attorney
general
than the surgeon general.

One of ibogaine’s most energetic boosters is Marc Emery, founder of a
Vancouver, Canada, clinic. Emery is a verbose, middle-aged man with bushy
hair and
corporate-casual clothes. You’d never guess that he heads the British
Columbia
Marijuana Party and is, by his reckoning, one of the world’s largest
sellers of
pot seeds. It is his personal mission to bring ibogaine to the masses,
because the drug helped his adopted son kick methadone and heroin. Until
this
spring, Emery offered free treatment in the Iboga Therapy House, a clinic
that
consists of a plush one-bedroom apartment in a Vancouver high-rise. With
his cash
flow crimped by business and legal troubles (he just spent two months in a
Saskatchewan jail for passing a joint at a gathering), he has stopped
funding the
clinic, putting its program on hold, but he remains supportive. “It was a
very
worthwhile investment,” he says. “The improvements I saw in our patients
were
significant and astonishing.”

Still, Emery’s enthusiasm is unlikely to change the minds of skeptics such

as
Dr. Herbert Kleber, head of the substance abuse division at Columbia
University’s school of medicine. “I’m in favor of anything that works, but

there needs
to be proof that it does, and that it doesn’t endanger patients,” he says.
“I’ve been in this field 35 years, and I’ve seen a lot of magic bullets.
They
often turn out to be worse than the disease.”

Getting that kind of proof requires controlled experiments on human
subjects,
which is what Mash is working toward. She has isolated a molecule called
noribogaine, which is produced in the body as it metabolizes ibogaine, and

which
she believes is the key agent that blocks drug cravings. She is trying to
get
FDA approval to start human testing. On a parallel track, Stanley Glick
has
synthesized a chemical cousin of ibogaine dubbed 18-MC, which he also
hopes to
market.

Both Mash and Glick think their ibogaine derivatives will give users the
drug-blocking effect without the hallucinations—something both believe is
necessary if the FDA is to approve their products.

But would eliminating ibogaine’s psychedelic side diminish its
effectiveness?
No one knows. “For me, the ideal would be for people to take ibogaine in a
controlled environment, and use the experience as part of their
psychotherapy,”
Mash says. “Then slap a noribogaine patch on them.”

Mash and Glick also face a more prosaic obstacle: money. Funding
comprehensive clinical trials for a new drug is colossally expensive, and
so far neither
has found anyone willing to pony up the full cost. In October, a Los
Angeles
philanthropist pledged to give Mash $250,000 to restart research at the
University of Miami, but that’s only a tiny fraction of what will
eventually be
necessary if ibogaine is ever to be brought to market.

“The pharmaceutical industry has never wanted much to do with addiction
medicine,” Glick says. “It’s not very profitable, and it’s bad public
relations.”

Though there are millions of people addicted to various substances in the
U.S., many of them don’t want, or can’t afford, treatment. Worse, from a
bottom-line standpoint, an ibogaine-based treatment drug would be used
only once—a
feeble investment for companies accustomed to cash-cow refillable
prescriptions.

Which leaves people like Craig knocking on doors of unregulated ibogaine
clinics in a desperate search for something that will help defeat their
addictions.

“All these clinics popping up all over the world—it’s become almost a
cult-like phenomenon,” Glick says. “All the hype and politics around
ibogaine just
make my job harder. It means the scientific establishment and regulatory
agencies take a dim view.”

But the ranks of the believers keep growing. Six months after his ibogaine
treatment, Craig says he’s staying clean and feeling great. “That stuff
worked
just like it was supposed to,” he says. “It was so much better than the
detox I
tried. I don’t understand why it’s not legal.”

*

Editor’s note:

In this article, the name of the patient seeking ibogaine treatment in
Tijuana has been changed to protect his privacy. However, the Los Angeles
Times
Magazine has verified his identity and the circumstances described in the
article.
If you want other stories on this topic, search the Archives at
latimes.com/archives.

Article licensing and reprint options

————————————————————————

Copyright 2004 Los Angeles Times

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…
Date: November 28, 2004 at 4:40:56 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh wow, that would be awesome!
Wee ways to go yet… but this has given me a boost, a well needed one. A piece of the puzzle perhaps?
Kirsty
I look forward to more contact :o)
From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com [mailto:ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com] 
Sent: Monday, 29 November 2004 5:14 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…

Kirsty,
            I’ve been and continue to go to different countries to train people to do sessions and treatments with ibogaine.  Usually if there are a few people interested in receiving the experience for various intentions, and a person or two who are interested in coordinating things and who want to be trained, it is very possible.  I’m interested in having the expenses covered i.e. the cost of the ibogaine and the traveling only.  If you e-mail me your number off list, if you prefer, i will call you. I would very much like to honor your vision.  I have very few prerequisites.  One is a person is clean from opiates, etc. for a few month period.  
            I hope you are in touch with me.
                                                                                                                
                                                                                                                                     Franscesco

On Sun Nov 28 2:13 , ‘Capt Kirk’ <captkirk@free.net.nz> sent:
Oh WOW,. I just had a vision of a possible future for myself! There is nobody here in NZ, at least not that I have found…. Who has done Ibogaine, or provides any sort of support, backup, therapy etc. I have completed one year Naturopathy and am Reiki 3, so maybe, just maybe, I could be trained to be an Iboga support person?? All going well of course.
Thank you
I’ve been really lost lately, but this seems feasible to me.
Kirsty
From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com [mailto:ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com] 
Sent: Sunday, 28 November 2004 5:16 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…

Randy,
             Thank your for reply.  If you still feel as you do a few months from now, i would like you to receive training so you can continue the work in the area you like.
             My hope is in the next few years there will be treatments available in dozens of cities across your country with referal networks for transpersonal therapists, acupuncturists, and other practitioners of aftercare modalities located in all these areas.  There is a lot to do and i see the possibilities because there is a new, energised generation of ibogaine assistants coming onto the scene.  Any person who has become clean and remains so for several months has, as an option this service to perform.

                                                                                                                                 Franscesco   

On Tue Nov 23 6:51 , BiscuitBoy714@aol.com sent:
Frank, it has been my experience that the majority of old timers in AA don’t want hear about Ibogaine. The philosophy and the steps apply to any addiction so I go there to reinforce what I have already learned and accomplished. I am also an alcoholic so I am lucky enough to know first hand how much help is in the rooms. My sponsor is well aware of my situation and thinks Ibogaine is a great tool for recovery. He is rare. We have become pretty close over the years and he just wants me to be clean no matter what it takes. So my advice to anyone going to AA is to go to meetings and talk about your recovery just don’t try and win anyone over to Ibogaine. (YET) It is coming. I figure I will let the ones know who are addicts too after meetings and by just being clean and answering questions. I’ve already done this a few times. It is a little too much for some of the newly clean to handle sometimes so I watch and talk to the ones I think can handle it. I don’t know if I am qualified to do this or not but I will not stop until Ibogaine is available to those who need and want it. I feel like it is up to me to bring all of my efforts into a workable program. AA, therapist, the list and prayer are what I am going on now. The list is the most important part for me but that may change. All I know is I’m clean and I love it. You are forever in my heart and I will be indebted to you for your help the rest of my life. Thank you for your efforts in bringing Ibogaine out in the open in the US. As far as I know there is no one doing Ibogaine treatments in the KY,Tenn., West Virginia, southern Ohio area. They need help and I want to be there for them.     Randy
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 28, 2004 at 4:30:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 14:12:10 -0800 Hannah Clay
<hannah.clay@ntlworld.com> wrote:
On of the first things I’m gonna
concentrate on is walking my dog more and sleeping proper hours
(I’m nocturnal at the moment)

That sounds good – plus nourishing your body and spirit, working
from the inside out to build strength. One day at a time – such a
cliche but so true, it’s life itself.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 28, 2004 at 4:28:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Sun, 28 Nov 2004 05:38:59 -0800 Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
It sounds as though (from what you write) ayahuasca by its nature
is more rewarding in the group experience?

For me it has been.

Yet I would not make
the same observation about eboga – perhaps at a certain stage it
could be something to explore – as the experience tends to be
highly personal – for the most part.

My solo eboga experiences have been mixed. Immediate issues such as
obsessive blocked anger have been resolved nicely, and sometimes I
have gotten insights into deeper problems, but it seems that eboga
in sufficient dose ultimately draws me to a trauma which I cannot
handle. Maybe someday.. meanwhile I can work on building a better
me. A mere taste on the tongue before therapy is my main use at
this point.

I certainly agree that any experience has its own optimum set &
setting.

For ibogaine I believe that could be a group of caring and
compassionate people who would welcome the person into the world
and compensate for all the pain and neglect that may have been
suffered at the hands of others. The baby physical helplessness of
the ibogaine experience is a wonderful opportunity to learn to
depend on others, for those of us who have been Gollum-ized by this
world.

Economics dictate that this would either be a church or a group
treatment and therapy setting.

In the meantime, the better integration with aftercare, the better.

I am curious what you mean by deep body learning?

Long tedious absorption of the vine, with little or none of the DMT
‘light’ to take the mind elsewhere, followed by some weeks of
feeling more grounded and having insights comparable to post-eboga.
Possibly it could be like noribogaine if one could take that
directly.

What do you see as its (ayahuasca) ongoing benefits?

Briefly, strength and love, if used for that purpose.

If you read the literature, and the experience reports on erowid
and elsewhere, you will find that the cultures and personal
experiences are all over the map.

Are you located in Holland?

No.

Hope I am not bombarding you with too many questions. Its an area
I no little about but am curious to understand better. What I have

read has not really enlightened me much.

From my reading, ibogaine and secondarily ayahuasca stood out as
entheogens that lead to deep learning about oneself that can lead
to real personal change. In both cases personal experience has been
surprising and humbling.

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 04:15:16 -0800 Lee Albert
wrote:
Similarly I am not a great fan of DMT from what I have read as I
think its a shortcut to spiritual dimensions best reserved for
those whose souls have been prepared for the experience.
Otherwise

the combination of ones own inner demons coupled with the doors
which are been opened can lead to serious problems afterwards
imo.

In my experience, the container is all-important. So far the best
one for me is group singing in a church setting, which is what I
started with. The first time I did my own homebrew, the message
was, “why are you doing this alone, your path is to connect with
people,” and the church has been my satisfaction and growth ever
since. (I also learn in free-form group singing without the
religious or entheogenic aspects.) Plus with ayahuasca there is
the
vine, which on its own can take one on a slow unhallucinogenic
path
of deep body learning. It is all work, the hardest and deepest
that
one is capable of, no shortcuts I thoroughly agree.

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 28, 2004 at 2:58:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

To the bitch who calls herself Paula. Don’t ever speak for anyone but yourself when responding to a letter. Some of us, maybe many not only love Burroughs but also I don’t think Preston was in a “bad” place and I also in the same place and am quite pleased.  Preston, you are only human and sometimes it is difficult to ignore things people say but Paula is exaclty one of the type people Burroughs was referring to so try and ignore her and enjoy this time as you can.

Regards

Julian

From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amazing Grace ebook Free Download to list members
Date: November 28, 2004 at 12:36:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Howard,
I opened it in PDF and yes could save it using the disk icon.
You learn something new every day.

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 11/28/04 10:07:31 AM, myeboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:

>I will leave the link active for the next 7 days. After that, anyone on
>the list who wishes to download, please email me off list and I will see
>to it you get a copy.

>Remember: RIGHT CLICK with the MOUSE button on the link below and SAVE
>to a folder. If you click directly it will open in PDF but you won’t be
>able to save a copy of the PDF as Explorer doesn’t allow it – Opera does.

>http://www.my-eboga.com/AmazingGrace-ebook.pdf

Hi Lee,

My version of explorer allows me to save the pdf. I just go to the toolbar
at the top of the window and click on the icon of a disk and that is a save as
command.

Howard

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Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Treatment Report
Date: November 28, 2004 at 12:06:39 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Fakeplacebo,

Congratulation!  God bless you!
it could be good for you to take a Turkish bath and drink a lot of water 2xweek.

All the best,

Sara

Van: FakePlacebo [mailto:fakeplacebo@hotmail.com] 
Verzonden: zondag 28 november 2004 14:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Treatment Report

Dear Randy,

I priciate for your valuable advices.Here in Turkey there is no good threapist who is specialist about drug dependency. They are very ignorant about this kind of problems. I tried to go to therapist but it did not worked. I think I can help myself better than others can.

This mailing list and friends from Iboga list are best for me. for example; you, Mr. Howard, Sara, Julie. Believe me your Iboga treatment is couraged and motivated me.

Thank You
Your Friend
FakePLacebo

—- Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Treatment Report

M, I am loving this. I was very glad to see that you had Sara’s help. See, the most loving and beautiful people in the world are out to help mankind no matter the cost. Sleep comes. I think you are doing great. Keep it up. Are you planning on getting a therapist? Some kind of aftercare is very important. It sure helps me.          Randy

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 28, 2004 at 12:03:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/28/04 11:36:20 AM, rwd3@cox.net writes:

LIST:

trying to find a definitive answer as i am getting wires crossed.  does
ibo work on benzo w/d/? been thru everything else, now this stuff.  i’m
suffering, the traditional rehab will kill me, i can’t move to the uk.
please help?  many thanks, ron

Ron you are not getting a definitive answer because there is not a difinitive
answer yet.  Some providers say no.  Some providers say yes and some
providers say maybe.  Welcome to the world of experimental medicine/shamanism.

The answer at this time is yes in some patients when administered by some
providers.  Too bad Sara and Schmoolyboy are not working together.  Then you
could have the best of both worlds.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 28, 2004 at 12:01:18 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi from Jasen, he has no energy to write , but he likes to thanks everyone for being so kind and thinking of him.

Sara

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zaterdag 27 november 2004 16:29
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen, If I had the cash I’d be right there with you. Someday soon. What have you got planned when you get back down under? I’d sure like to see Australia sometime. You being bored is a good sign. Life awaits you my friend. Kick it’s …. you know what I mean. Be ready, cause I found it hard sometimes because people I knew didn’t know how to take the clean and positive Randy. It is already better for me. The ones who matter think Ibogaine is a miracle. I’ve never gone this long without court pressure and the people who care about me are pretty much amazed. It takes a little while for them to get used to it. Remember, your the one who changed. Give them time to get used to it and don’t freak out like I did. You are most definitely the man now. Run with it. Peace and much love.     Randy

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amazing Grace ebook Free Download to list members
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:56:43 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/28/04 10:07:31 AM, myeboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:

I will leave the link active for the next 7 days. After that, anyone on
the list who wishes to download, please email me off list and I will see
to it you get a copy.

Remember: RIGHT CLICK with the MOUSE button on the link below and SAVE
to a folder. If you click directly it will open in PDF but you won’t be
able to save a copy of the PDF as Explorer doesn’t allow it – Opera does.

http://www.my-eboga.com/AmazingGrace-ebook.pdf

Hi Lee,

My version of explorer allows me to save the pdf.  I just go to the toolbar
at the top of the window and click on the icon of a disk and that is a save as
command.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Wild Divine About the Game
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:52:02 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

biofeedback game, helps with lowering stress etc. Might help some of us lower the stress that comes….Paula

http://www.wilddivine.com/Game/
/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Silent Symphony
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:49:50 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

make’s the atmosphere a little brighter thru the dreary days of winter…Paula

http://www.solar-world.com/silent.htm
/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] EFT Manual The Basic Steps to Your Emotional Freedom
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:48:16 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

nice pictoral, maybe a good place to start…Paula

http://www.mercola.com/forms/eftcourse.htm
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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Self help for misdirected anger, aggression, and violence.
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:47:12 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

might be a procedure for helping after ibogaine good pictures of the procedure, some similarity to emdr…Paula

http://www.redirectingselftherapy.com/anger.html
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:35:27 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LIST:
trying to find a definitive answer as i am getting wires crossed.  does ibo work on benzo w/d/? been thru everything else, now this stuff.  i’m suffering, the traditional rehab will kill me, i can’t move to the uk. please help?  many thanks, ron
—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 1:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen,

maybe take the train to amsterdam and see the museums, have some dutch french fries (the best) or some pankoecken, appleflap, toasties and a  hot cup of tea. yum. then walk along the canals or rent a bike and  pedal around the city, if it’s not too cold.

_.dh

On Saturday, November 27, 2004, at 09:28 AM, <slowone@hush.ai> wrote:

You could try singing? Drawing? Explore those vibrations and see
what further healing and messages come when you take the active
role in place of eboga, carrying on your healing. Boredom may be
just the veil your habits are throwing over the next stage. Beware
of endings that amount to dissatisfaction. 🙂

On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 02:57:33 -0800 Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl>
wrote:
THANKS randy.
I AM SOOO BORED,CANYOU GUYS COME OVER.
You are right about aftercare,there is a lot of work to be done to

heal the
world.
I realised something being over the other side of the world,your
vibratioal
frequencies tune into
Different parts of the world depending on where you are born,which

port hole
on earth through your mothers womb,life without end,..a spiral,no
beginning
and no end
So when you live away from where you were born,it can feel as if
everything
is twice as hard.Like you are going against the grain..

IT MAY BE THE ONLY WAY HOWEVER IN CAN BE DONE IN A MUCH BIGGER AND
BETTERWAY,IF GREED MOVED OVER A TRIFLE.
Sara’S is very affordable. Just fuc ing boring. SORRY sara,I do
love you and
you are a princess,the bwiti princess,her vibes hide her princess
appearances as others see her,but I KNOW BECAUSE I saw,SARA IS THE

bwiti
PRINCESS.

Eboga must be taken naturally,to be effective on every plain,to
work on
every frequency the body neads to heal.WE ARE 4 DIMENSIOAL BEINGS
and need
healing on all freqences. Science and Natural medicine must work
together.
Love you all Jasen.
_____

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com]
Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2004 12:32
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen you freakin’  ROCKKK. See. It’s the only way, huh. Tell us
more when
you can. How long are you going to be there? I’d stay as long as I

could if
I were you. Everybody was right about aftercare. It sure makes me
feel
better about everything.     Randy

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…
Date: November 28, 2004 at 11:14:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kirsty,
I’ve been and continue to go to different countries to train people to do sessions and treatments with ibogaine.  Usually if there are a few people interested in receiving the experience for various intentions, and a person or two who are interested in coordinating things and who want to be trained, it is very possible.  I’m interested in having the expenses covered i.e. the cost of the ibogaine and the traveling only.  If you e-mail me your number off list, if you prefer, i will call you. I would very much like to honor your vision.  I have very few prerequisites.  One is a person is clean from opiates, etc. for a few month period.
I hope you are in touch with me.

Franscesco

On Sun Nov 28 2:13 , ‘Capt Kirk’ <captkirk@free.net.nz> sent:

Oh WOW,. I just had a vision of a possible future for myself! There is nobody here in NZ, at least not that I have found…. Who has done Ibogaine, or provides any sort of support, backup, therapy etc. I have completed one year Naturopathy and am Reiki 3, so maybe, just maybe, I could be trained to be an Iboga support person?? All going well of course.
Thank you
I’ve been really lost lately, but this seems feasible to me.
Kirsty
From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com [mailto:ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com] 
Sent: Sunday, 28 November 2004 5:16 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…

Randy,
             Thank your for reply.  If you still feel as you do a few months from now, i would like you to receive training so you can continue the work in the area you like.
             My hope is in the next few years there will be treatments available in dozens of cities across your country with referal networks for transpersonal therapists, acupuncturists, and other practitioners of aftercare modalities located in all these areas.  There is a lot to do and i see the possibilities because there is a new, energised generation of ibogaine assistants coming onto the scene.  Any person who has become clean and remains so for several months has, as an option this service to perform.

                                                                                                                                 Franscesco   

On Tue Nov 23 6:51 , BiscuitBoy714@aol.com sent:
Frank, it has been my experience that the majority of old timers in AA don’t want hear about Ibogaine. The philosophy and the steps apply to any addiction so I go there to reinforce what I have already learned and accomplished. I am also an alcoholic so I am lucky enough to know first hand how much help is in the rooms. My sponsor is well aware of my situation and thinks Ibogaine is a great tool for recovery. He is rare. We have become pretty close over the years and he just wants me to be clean no matter what it takes. So my advice to anyone going to AA is to go to meetings and talk about your recovery just don’t try and win anyone over to Ibogaine. (YET) It is coming. I figure I will let the ones know who are addicts too after meetings and by just being clean and answering questions. I’ve already done this a few times. It is a little too much for some of the newly clean to handle sometimes so I watch and talk to the ones I think can handle it. I don’t know if I am qualified to do this or not but I will not stop until Ibogaine is available to those who need and want it. I feel like it is up to me to bring all of my efforts into a workable program. AA, therapist, the list and prayer are what I am going on now. The list is the most important part for me but that may change. All I know is I’m clean and I love it. You are forever in my heart and I will be indebted to you for your help the rest of my life. Thank you for your efforts in bringing Ibogaine out in the open in the US. As far as I know there is no one doing Ibogaine treatments in the KY,Tenn., West Virginia, southern Ohio area. They need help and I want to be there for them.     Randy

Msg sent via @Mail v4 – http://atmail.com/ /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/
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From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Amazing Grace ebook Free Download to list members
Date: November 28, 2004 at 10:05:53 AM EST
To: Ibogaine List <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,

I know I am very late in saying this but Happy Thanksgiving to you all. Its a very special day for many on the list (regardless of its political origins) and I hope that many of you enjoyed it surrounded by your loved ones.

So, as a very late Thanksgiving Day gift I want to make available to anyone on the list who is interested, a digital copy of the book Amazing Grace, which has just recently been publish. It is an eclectic piece of work. So I am sure there will be something in it to interest everyone.

I will leave the link active for the next 7 days. After that, anyone on the list who wishes to download, please email me off list and I will see to it you get a copy.

Remember: RIGHT CLICK with the MOUSE button on the link below and SAVE to a folder. If you click directly it will open in PDF but you won’t be able to save a copy of the PDF as Explorer doesn’t allow it – Opera does.

http://www.my-eboga.com/AmazingGrace-ebook.pdf

Hasta la Proxima,

Lee

http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!

From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Treatment Report
Date: November 28, 2004 at 8:54:28 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Randy,

I priciate for your valuable advices.Here in Turkey there is no good threapist who is specialist about drug dependency. They are very ignorant about this kind of problems. I tried to go to therapist but it did not worked. I think I can help myself better than others can.

This mailing list and friends from Iboga list are best for me. for example; you, Mr. Howard, Sara, Julie. Believe me your Iboga treatment is couraged and motivated me.

Thank You
Your Friend
FakePLacebo

—- Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 28, 2004 3:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Treatment Report

M, I am loving this. I was very glad to see that you had Sara’s help. See, the most loving and beautiful people in the world are out to help mankind no matter the cost. Sleep comes. I think you are doing great. Keep it up. Are you planning on getting a therapist? Some kind of aftercare is very important. It sure helps me.          Randy

From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 28, 2004 at 8:38:59 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It sounds as though (from what you write) ayahuasca by its nature is more rewarding in the group experience? Yet I would not make the same observation about eboga – perhaps at a certain stage it could be something to explore – as the experience tends to be highly personal – for the most part.
I certainly agree that any experience has its own optimum set & setting.
I am curious what you mean by deep body learning?
What do you see as its (ayahuasca) ongoing benefits?
Are you located in Holland?
Hope I am not bombarding you with too many questions. Its an area I no little about but am curious to understand better. What I have read has not really enlightened me much.

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 04:15:16 -0800 Lee Albert
wrote:
>Similarly I am not a great fan of DMT from what I have read as I
>think its a shortcut to spiritual dimensions best reserved for
>those whose souls have been prepared for the experience. Otherwise

>the combination of ones own inner demons coupled with the doors
>which are been opened can lead to serious problems afterwards imo.

In my experience, the container is all-important. So far the best
one for me is group singing in a church setting, which is what I
started with. The first time I did my own homebrew, the message
was, “why are you doing this alone, your path is to connect with
people,” and the church has been my satisfaction and growth ever
since. (I also learn in free-form group singing without the
religious or entheogenic aspects.) Plus with ayahuasca there is the
vine, which on its own can take one on a slow unhallucinogenic path
of deep body learning. It is all work, the hardest and deepest that
one is capable of, no shortcuts I thoroughly agree.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Treatment Report
Date: November 28, 2004 at 8:30:20 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

M, I am loving this. I was very glad to see that you had Sara’s help. See, the most loving and beautiful people in the world are out to help mankind no matter the cost. Sleep comes. I think you are doing great. Keep it up. Are you planning on getting a therapist? Some kind of aftercare is very important. It sure helps me.          Randy

From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Treatment Report
Date: November 28, 2004 at 7:50:40 AM EST
To: “Summary” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear list,

I started to treatment 14th of this month at the one of my friends house who is medical doctor. My care giver was good boy and he was very helpfull but my treatment started with the very bad things.

30 hours after my last took of oppiates I gone in totaly withdrawal; started rolling on the ground. I asked him to start Iboga treatment and finaly he gave me half grams of Ibogain (to see what is going on). After two hours later and after many discussions he gave me two grams more. I asked him the dose that I decided before (8 grams). four hours later I asked him to call Sara and after phone call he gave me 3 grams more. I said to him this is foolish. In the 12 hours time period I took totaly 10 grams of Iboga. (by the permission of Sara on the phone). I experienced no visualisation but also I never experienced withdrawal. During the first 12 hours of period I puked many times.

3 days later I could be availble for drink something or eat. I was so weak and I never sleep deep or more than 2-3 hours after Iboga treatment. 12 days after treatment I experienced some personality changes on me. After Iboga I go anger very quickly with anger I feel power ( dangerous one). I feel myself very sensetive for everything. For example light, sweet, cold weather etc..

In spite of first few day’s weakness for two days I feel so instigated and angry.

But I’m happy because first time I feel that I can realy quit oppiates.

Iboga is magic plant

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…
Date: November 28, 2004 at 7:50:35 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Franscesco, I feel like everything I have done up until now has been training for the rest of my life. I truly care about people and I want to give back to society what was given to me. The person who treated me was one of the most warm hearted and loving individuals I have ever met. I strive to emulate that. My compadre’s in KY are paying up to 100 dollars for an 80mg. oxycontin. They see no way out, no alternative. I’d like to change that. Maybe it is my AA indoctrination. It doesn’t really matter. All I know is I feel compelled to want to help and I will go to any length to do so. I think that it is up to us to do what the government is afraid to do. The right thing. I have never been one to conform to what the government dictates and I won’t start now. Thank you for your kind words of encouragement and for helping to bring Ibogaine out in the open where it belongs. I’m proud of where I come from. There are some really good people down there. I, like most people in the South, am loyal to the end. You lead and I will follow until we don’t have to be underground anymore. I’d like to see Ibogaine offered in every methadone clinic in America. It should be an option sanctioned by the government and the Dr.’s responsible for all those methadone prescriptions should be versed on Ibogaine and it’s effects. It is the only way out of insane addictions for most of us. Peace and love to you and yours.       Randy

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…
Date: November 28, 2004 at 2:13:45 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh WOW,. I just had a vision of a possible future for myself! There is nobody here in NZ, at least not that I have found…. Who has done Ibogaine, or provides any sort of support, backup, therapy etc. I have completed one year Naturopathy and am Reiki 3, so maybe, just maybe, I could be trained to be an Iboga support person?? All going well of course.
Thank you
I’ve been really lost lately, but this seems feasible to me.
Kirsty
From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com [mailto:ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com] 
Sent: Sunday, 28 November 2004 5:16 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…

Randy,
             Thank your for reply.  If you still feel as you do a few months from now, i would like you to receive training so you can continue the work in the area you like.
             My hope is in the next few years there will be treatments available in dozens of cities across your country with referal networks for transpersonal therapists, acupuncturists, and other practitioners of aftercare modalities located in all these areas.  There is a lot to do and i see the possibilities because there is a new, energised generation of ibogaine assistants coming onto the scene.  Any person who has become clean and remains so for several months has, as an option this service to perform.

                                                                                                                                 Franscesco   

On Tue Nov 23 6:51 , BiscuitBoy714@aol.com sent:
Frank, it has been my experience that the majority of old timers in AA don’t want hear about Ibogaine. The philosophy and the steps apply to any addiction so I go there to reinforce what I have already learned and accomplished. I am also an alcoholic so I am lucky enough to know first hand how much help is in the rooms. My sponsor is well aware of my situation and thinks Ibogaine is a great tool for recovery. He is rare. We have become pretty close over the years and he just wants me to be clean no matter what it takes. So my advice to anyone going to AA is to go to meetings and talk about your recovery just don’t try and win anyone over to Ibogaine. (YET) It is coming. I figure I will let the ones know who are addicts too after meetings and by just being clean and answering questions. I’ve already done this a few times. It is a little too much for some of the newly clean to handle sometimes so I watch and talk to the ones I think can handle it. I don’t know if I am qualified to do this or not but I will not stop until Ibogaine is available to those who need and want it. I feel like it is up to me to bring all of my efforts into a workable program. AA, therapist, the list and prayer are what I am going on now. The list is the most important part for me but that may change. All I know is I’m clean and I love it. You are forever in my heart and I will be indebted to you for your help the rest of my life. Thank you for your efforts in bringing Ibogaine out in the open in the US. As far as I know there is no one doing Ibogaine treatments in the KY,Tenn., West Virginia, southern Ohio area. They need help and I want to be there for them.     Randy

Msg sent via @Mail v4 – http://atmail.com/ /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/
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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Theanine
Date: November 27, 2004 at 11:15:07 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Dr. Tom !!

I was reading about the effect of thea nine and I found  something about
Theanine to fight nicotine addiction . Could you share your experience with
this product in fighting addictions ?
Kindest regards
Francis

—– Original Message —–
From: <tomo7@starband.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Cc: “John Dore” <dorejj@aol.com>; <pacificozonecompany@yahoo.com>;
<sara119@xs4all.nl>; <tom@mapsltd.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 6:34 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Frank’s call for aftercare suggestions

Frank

I look forward to whatever suggestions or links you acquire from this
community. Better results and greater success in beating addiction seems
to hinge on better use of and awareness of all of these tools.

Here is a links page on a drug rehab site that might provide a resource
for ibonauts and providers looking for better tools and results.

http://www.drugrehabcenter.com/natural-health1.html

Lately words have been exchanged as if we have differences between pro
drugs or anti-drugs, or pro some drug users or anti other drug users. I
enjoy these binary dualities like everyone. Intellectual shorthand is
handy. I get nostalgic for younger days when party drugs were so damn fun,
but that was when youthful adrenal glands could rise from the wreckage far
easier. I think most of us are pro-life and existence, anti-death and
anti-annihilation, although that set of colors was stolen by the abortion
or not crowd.

I encourage experienced users to please share the specifics of what works
and what doesn’t, here.  Please tend your reply subject-lines to help us
survey everyone’s content for the more time challenged participants. I
really appreciate the experienced professionals among us helping to keep
terminology and medical details accurate and understandable. The Goddess
has to be giving you points for the help.

For the delicate neurotransmitter balancing act of recovering from
pharmacological or recreational patterns of overuse, addiction or
habituation, I am getting more impressed over time with L-Theanine, as a
200mg. dose taken 2 or 3 times a day away from a protein meal(by an hour).
Google and read up on it. The benzo and SSRI promotional teams will be
jealous when more of you start to learn of it and teach others. I’ve had
clients not need a booster dose of Ibo after using this steadily for a few
weeks.

Cheers.

Dr. Tom

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…
Date: November 27, 2004 at 11:16:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,
Thank your for reply.  If you still feel as you do a few months from now, i would like you to receive training so you can continue the work in the area you like.
My hope is in the next few years there will be treatments available in dozens of cities across your country with referal networks for transpersonal therapists, acupuncturists, and other practitioners of aftercare modalities located in all these areas.  There is a lot to do and i see the possibilities because there is a new, energised generation of ibogaine assistants coming onto the scene.  Any person who has become clean and remains so for several months has, as an option this service to perform.

Franscesco

On Tue Nov 23 6:51 , BiscuitBoy714@aol.com sent:

Frank, it has been my experience that the majority of old timers in AA don’t want hear about Ibogaine. The philosophy and the steps apply to any addiction so I go there to reinforce what I have already learned and accomplished. I am also an alcoholic so I am lucky enough to know first hand how much help is in the rooms. My sponsor is well aware of my situation and thinks Ibogaine is a great tool for recovery. He is rare. We have become pretty close over the years and he just wants me to be clean no matter what it takes. So my advice to anyone going to AA is to go to meetings and talk about your recovery just don’t try and win anyone over to Ibogaine. (YET) It is coming. I figure I will let the ones know who are addicts too after meetings and by just being clean and answering questions. I’ve already done this a few times. It is a little too much for some of the newly clean to handle sometimes so I watch and talk to the ones I think can handle it. I don’t know if I am qualified to do this or not but I will not stop until Ibogaine is available to those who need and want it. I feel like it is up to me to bring all of my efforts into a workable program. AA, therapist, the list and prayer are what I am going on now. The list is the most important part for me but that may change. All I know is I’m clean and I love it. You are forever in my heart and I will be indebted to you for your help the rest of my life. Thank you for your efforts in bringing Ibogaine out in the open in the US. As far as I know there is no one doing Ibogaine treatments in the KY,Tenn., West Virginia, southern Ohio area. They need help and I want to be there for them.     Randy

Msg sent via @Mail v4 – http://atmail.com/ /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Frank’s call for aftercare suggestions
Date: November 27, 2004 at 10:22:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DOREJJ@aol.com, pacificozonecompany@yahoo.com, sara119@xs4all.nl, tom@mapsltd.net
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dr.Tom, what if someone takes L-Theanine before Ibogaine treatment? Anything on that? Is it important to keep a level before or after?       Randy

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Well said Dr Tom
Date: November 27, 2004 at 8:38:00 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well said, I agree totally,
With the parts to be agreed with !
I know what I mean lol
Kirk


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.801 / Virus Database: 544 – Release Date: 11/24/2004

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: <tomo7@starband.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Frank’s call for aftercare suggestions
Date: November 27, 2004 at 6:34:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Cc: “John Dore” <dorejj@aol.com>, <pacificozonecompany@yahoo.com>, <sara119@xs4all.nl>, <tom@mapsltd.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Frank

I look forward to whatever suggestions or links you acquire from this
community. Better results and greater success in beating addiction seems
to hinge on better use of and awareness of all of these tools.

Here is a links page on a drug rehab site that might provide a resource
for ibonauts and providers looking for better tools and results.

http://www.drugrehabcenter.com/natural-health1.html

Lately words have been exchanged as if we have differences between pro
drugs or anti-drugs, or pro some drug users or anti other drug users. I
enjoy these binary dualities like everyone. Intellectual shorthand is
handy. I get nostalgic for younger days when party drugs were so damn fun,
but that was when youthful adrenal glands could rise from the wreckage far
easier. I think most of us are pro-life and existence, anti-death and
anti-annihilation, although that set of colors was stolen by the abortion
or not crowd.

I encourage experienced users to please share the specifics of what works
and what doesn’t, here.  Please tend your reply subject-lines to help us
survey everyone’s content for the more time challenged participants. I
really appreciate the experienced professionals among us helping to keep
terminology and medical details accurate and understandable. The Goddess
has to be giving you points for the help.

For the delicate neurotransmitter balancing act of recovering from
pharmacological or recreational patterns of overuse, addiction or
habituation, I am getting more impressed over time with L-Theanine, as a
200mg. dose taken 2 or 3 times a day away from a protein meal(by an hour).
Google and read up on it. The benzo and SSRI promotional teams will be
jealous when more of you start to learn of it and teach others. I’ve had
clients not need a booster dose of Ibo after using this steadily for a few
weeks.

Cheers.

Dr. Tom

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Hannah
Date: November 27, 2004 at 6:33:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hannah,

I stopped going to raves when I was 22, largely
because I felt old, especially considering the average
age at a rave is 16-20.  I felt like a fucking
grandma…

Hannah, I went through the same thing at 23…let me
tell you something: YOU ARE NOT OLD!!!  I only wish I
would have realized that before writing off my life at
22/23.  Please enjoy those years, cuz once they’re
gone, they’re gone forever.

I just turned 27 this weekend, and I feel the effects
of aging already.  At 23, the only thing you should
feel is FABULOUS!!!

love Julie
BTW, heroin use really made me feel old and washed up.
My friends comment on how I look younger than I did
at 24- less stress, less hassle, outta the
game….it’s fucking brilliant.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 27, 2004 at 5:52:37 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Preston, it’s good to know I’m not alone in this craziness. And yeh, I’m 23….but I feel really OLD.
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 4:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

> >Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood
> >crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
> >remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.
> >My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
> >old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
> >breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am
> >I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
> >and what I consider normal now.
> Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.<
>
> This is EXACTLY what I was writing about earlier, the notes like this one
> Hannah. I can totally and completely empathize and am really heartily
> wishing you well, sending you strength and courage. You are how old please,
> if you don’t mind my asking? I think you mentioned it just the other day
> (23?- because I remember responding to someone noting that age here and
> think it mighta been you) but I’m not sure. Regardless, as bad as it seems
> now, it can get worse, and it can definitely get better. I’m sure you know
> that, irregardless of how awful it can seem when sitting there trying to get
> a vein (oh my god, I can remember doing what you’ve described here, but not
> only in the privacy of someone’s apartment or squat but also, more often
> than not actually, doing this exact same vein hunt in stairwells, allyways,
> parkbenches, behind garbage cans, cafe bathrooms, diner tables, etc, etc. I
> mean, there were times I’d have a great vein, usually a teeny one that I’d
> managed to find just the right angle to hit it with, making shooting up in
> public, at diner tables as mentioned (one of my very favorite places to
> shoot up used to be in very public places like diners, right at the table,
> as that gave me that extra adrenaline boost. Of course, it was often an
> interesting experience in that when speedballing, I’d feel the cocaine
> first, so would be sitting there first witht that roaring in my ears, then
> bugs all over me while trying to figure out which person in the diner was
> NOT a cop.
>     Boy oh boy, what fun that was!
>
>
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: Hannah Clay
> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
> Hannah
>
>
> I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking
> Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now
> on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X and I’ve
> been on a few.  Its a bummer.
>
> I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m
> 23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation, well I
> live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the
> more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re
> putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!
>
> Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!  I
> want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear.
> I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to just help
> me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like the
> music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are
> travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always know where
> the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the clubs are
> all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.
>
> The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but it
> isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it
> with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was
> the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But the pills
> just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if
> you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m fucked I’ll
> still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.
>
> I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.
>
> Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as I woke
> up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer
> and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came
> over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it takes
> hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my artery so
> my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends
> were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I felt like
> a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to
> muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear the past
> week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins
> just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give
> blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong
> profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to
> myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in
> blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I
> remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.
> My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and
> old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and
> breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I
> doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself
> and what I consider normal now.
>
> Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort myself out.
> I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep doing
> this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs I had
> improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months
> I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I had to
> go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I
> kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like
> that definition of insanity, I am insane.
>
> But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….
>
> Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
> Hannah
>
> PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far more
> partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
> To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
> Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
> Hannah
>
>
> > Hannah,
> >
> > you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
> > some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
> > Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
> > Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
> > notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
> > gay guys know how to party !!
> >
> > I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
> > interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
> > taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
> > by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
> > just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
> > answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
> > is!!
> >
> > I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
> > reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
> > think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
> > high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
> > refer to the last sentence of the previous
> > paragraph…
> >
> > love Julie 🙂
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > __________________________________
> > Do you Yahoo!?
> > The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
> > http://my.yahoo.com
> >
> >
> >
> > /]=———————————————————————=[\
> >  [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> > [%]
> >
> > \]=———————————————————————=[/
> >
> >
> >
>
>
>   /]=———————————————————————=[\
>  [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>   \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Hanna
Date: November 27, 2004 at 5:33:11 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey you moved me now Randy.  No I haven’t tried Ibogaine, I’ve never had any money and no one here knows or seems interested i it.  I like to go to Sara’s if I could afford it and come back and show everyone round here that there is hope.  Sure, write a song, I’d love to hear it, especially if its got a happy ending! 😉

Loads of love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 8:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Hanna

Hanna, I don’t know you but I read what you post and fantasize about being in England. I was reading what you said about trying to find a vein and it hurt me. Brought tears to my eyes. Your 23 and I’m 47 and I have to tell you that it doesn’t get any better. I first shot heroin on my 16th birthday and fell immediately in love with it. I have shot every drug I could find that I thought might remotely be like heroin and screwed my veins up in the process. I have to tell the nurses where to get blood or do it myself. Have you tried Ibogaine? I can’t remember if you said you have or not. Nothing else has stopped me for this long before. It changed my way of thinking. Your young and you sound like a beautiful person. Let me lay a little Nashville on ya. “Please don’t do the things I done”. “Don’t go out on another long run”. Can I write a song about you? I won’t use your name. I’m trying to complete a whole album of Ibogaine/recovery/addiction songs. I’ve almost got all the songs I need, but a story like yours has to told. I want it to have a happy ending. Please make it that way so I don’t have to feel bad every time I play it. You have moved me and inspired me to write.   Randy

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_ Hannah
Date: November 27, 2004 at 5:14:15 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry Martee-I clicked Change instead of Ignore when running through Spell Check and mis-spelt your name!
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 1:23 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_ Hannah

Hannah,
The shape you’re in right now has many many similiarities of where I was 4 months ago. The insanity of intellectually knowing you could be one shot from losing a limb or having a heart attack or checking out and still diving right in without so much as a glance back.  The morning after when I would do guilt and shame and regret over the damage I had physically done to my arms and hands as well as having to get up after 2 hours sleep to work a 10 hour day.  Also the guilt over all the money spent the night before and the complete waste of time and of a human life!  I would then go to work, have more cash and repeat the whole drama.  DRIVEN…..by something not of this world.  There were also some wedding pix I just got from my brothers wedding last June.  I was pretty much at my worse then.  First of all I am not even recognizable as the same person in the pix.  There was one picture of me sitting at a table in his backyard where I was in a nod.  It brought me back to remember that I stayed up all night shooting speedballs one after the other(as usual) and got only 2 hours (maybe) sleep before going to the airport at 6:00am with my mother.  I rationalized I would sleep on the plane.  The meet the other side of the family b-b-q was that same day at dinnertime.  I plan on blowing up that picture and putting it maybe on the wall inside my closet.  The rest of the pix at the wedding and reception (which were absolutely unique and soulful)  reminded me of how every second, minute, hour of that visit was socially,emotionally and physically gruelling for me. Having to wear long sleeves in 95 degree weather.  Having to go to my room for a nap when everyone else was at the pool.  Just in general feeling out of place and uncomfortable as a member of the human race.
As I mentioned in one of my previous posts, Someone was living this life for the last 20+ years but it doesn’t even remotely feel like it was me!!!
All I can say to you is Eboga, Eboga, Eboga. My heart goes out to you. I pray the universe intervenes for you as it did for me. You are 23, I can only imagine the possibilities.
I don’t know what subtex is, however I know H is the easiest to come off of or low doses of methedone.  Do what you feel you need to maintain some sanity today as I totally understand.  It’s what usually drives people to the programs to begin with.  What’s keeping you from doing a session?
I wish for you some clarity and a sense of purpose to inspire a course of action that is unencumbered by doubt, fear and an inacurate sense of self.
Call in your angels.  You never know,
Sincerely,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X and I’ve been on a few.  Its a bummer.

I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m 23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation, well I live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!

Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!  I want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear.  I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to just help me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like the music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always know where the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the clubs are all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.

The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but it isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But the pills just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m fucked I’ll still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.

I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.

Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as I woke up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it takes hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my artery so my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I felt like a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear the past week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.  My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself and what I consider normal now.

Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort myself out.  I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep doing this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs I had improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I had to go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like that definition of insanity, I am insane.

But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….

Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
Hannah

PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far more partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

> Hannah,
>
> you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
> some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
> Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
> Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
> notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
> gay guys know how to party !!
>
> I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
> interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
> taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
> by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
> just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
> answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
> is!!
>
> I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
> reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
> think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
> high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
> refer to the last sentence of the previous
> paragraph…
>
> love Julie 🙂
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
> http://my.yahoo.com
>
>
>   /]=———————————————————————=[\
>  [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>   \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 27, 2004 at 5:12:10 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks so much Callie for the support.  I seem to be doing this every week at the moment and its really hard not to just give up giving up.  I didn’t even manage to start today.  My boyf went out for a drink last night straight after work and said he wouldn’t be that late and although I wanted to see him I didn’t want to seem like an awful person to his workmates.  Anyway he doesn’t come home.  I call someone I know was out with him to see if he’s with him but he’d left Paul in the pub 3 hours ago.  No one else answers their phones and Paul’s is switched off.  So like an idiot I’m worrying just cuz he had to walk home through town (our tiny town!;-)).  My friend’s telling me not to worry, he can look after himself.  I ended up sitting up all night caning my gear and begging my dealer to serve me really early.  I know Paul gets really drunk and I worry that I’m being silly for worrying.  His mate who was with him that night calls to wake him up for work and I try to say coolly that Paul didn’t come home.  So he rings off and 20min later I get a call from confused, still drunk Paul saying he fell asleep on the sofa of this girl we know (I note to myself that she’s very very beautiful and always looks gorgeous where as I have only got dressed when I’ve had to score for the past couple (or is few?) weeks.  He’s been helping her cuz she’s a single mum doing odd-jobs.  God that sounds dodgy but then on the other hand my boyf is the most sweet, forgiving, amazing man and I trust him when he says nothing happened….I hope I’m right, I wouldn’t blame him for leaving me the state I’ve let myself get in.  Thanks so much for your response Marti-I’m so disgusted with myself and its good to know both that I’m not the only person that did this to themselves and that it comes from someone I really admire and like!

We (my ‘houseguest’ and I) had our last hit early evening so let’s see how far we get this time.  No, I am trying to make this time different.  I’ve admitted to my clinic that I’m having problems again and I see my Doc Thursday.  The want to up my dose-they seem to put people on huge amounts here-36mg is common and then they just leave you on it cuz they don’t think its addictive (they will obviously use a taper if you want to (and can convince them to) stop using it.  I wish they’d just give me a few Valium so I felt I had something I could take and I could feel it calming me down.  I get very tense and panicky when I’m coming off and Valium has helped when I’ve managed to get hold of it.  Anyway, I just wanted to kind of announce my detox to the list so I had some witnesses and it kind of helped make it seem real.  I figure if I try really hard I’ll be starting to feel better by my Birthday (24th Dec) and Christmas and all the associated parties!  I’ve got to give my body chance to heal.  There’s so many other drugs at these parties will be hard cuz I love the nights we have but the days after are such hell-y’know ‘when the lows outweigh the highs’.

Anyway, so I said it.  On of the first things I’m gonna concentrate on is walking my dog more and sleeping proper hours (I’m nocturnal at the moment)  I hope my boyf still loves me.  He’s put up with so much I wouldn’t blame him for loosing faith in me.  He’s the only one who thinks I can do it but even he’s seemed tired of it all recently.  We argue now where he used to hold me and we’d talk about it.

Right so tomorrow is Day 1-great start! 😉
Thanks Callie and Martee, it meant alot.
Love Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 6:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

In a message dated 11/26/2004 5:53:05 PM Central Standard Time, hannah.clay@ntlworld.com writes:
Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!

Good luck to you Hannah and I will say a little prayer for you and add you to my mental prayer list.
Keep reminding yourself that you may have to deal with a little discomfort, physical and mental. I just hate mental discomfort! lol! Guess all of us opiate addicts hate it or we wouldn’t be addicted.
I have never tried Subutex. I am a Methadone Maintenance lifer I guess. I have finally decided that it is okay to be a lifer as long as it does not start being a problem.
Anyway…..back to you. I really hope you the best! If I were you I would start walking for exercise tomorrow too. Make it part of your Subutex treatment. Walking helps me a LOT! It is the only ‘exercise’ I do but it is very helpful with my depressions and lack of energy.
Keep us posted. This list is great support. Some awesome folk that reply!
Peace and Starry nights,
Callie

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 27, 2004 at 4:33:09 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you’re an unseen friend, i’m tooo afraid to be angry. getting conflicting info on ibo and benzos. peace to you brother, i have a lot on my plate right now and none is good. please write off list if possible as i c/n keep up with everyone.  it appears cliquish, although i know it’s not.many thanks for your concern. ron
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 3:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Ron, listen to Eric. I know for a fact he is way versed on this. He made me feel a lot better before I did the Ibogaine and he was dead on with his information. Just about every major person in the Ibogaine world is talking to you. Listen to them. They got me the recovery that I have. It won’t be easy but you can do it. Ibogaine providers really care about people. Their souls included and I think all of the other modes of rehab forget about that. Except for 12 step programs which I highly recommend post Ibogaine. Just don’t talk about Ibogaine to a room full of old timer alcoholics. Although I think Bill W. would have loved this. It seems like it is almost time to make a move. I’m here for ya, drop me a line if I pissed you off. I really didn’t mean to.                   Randy

From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 27, 2004 at 3:48:12 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you very much for taking the time and trouble to put this up!!!!

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —– From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 27, 2004 2:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks

————————————————————————
http://www.latimes.com/features/printedition/magazine/la-tm-ibogaine48nov28,0,
775349.story?coll=la-home-magazine

The Magical Mystery Tour

Drug and alcohol addicts are going abroad in search of the purported miracle
treatment called ibogaine. But will the drug industry embrace a substance that
causes a hallucinatory high?
By Vince Beiser
Special to The Times

November 28, 2004
The hallucinations are coming fast and vivid. Faces, shapes, colors rush
toward him, melting and swirling into each other, sometimes coalescing into more
concrete visions. He sees himself floating underwater. By turns, his four
children drift by. Sometimes they blow bubbles and float happily up to the surface;
sometimes they sink straight down, disappearing into darkness. Then there are
three ships, coming in to dock at three tubes; he knows, somehow, that they
are building a bomb, and if all three dock successfully it will explode. He
tries to direct them away, but can’t. The final ship enters the final tube. A
titanic explosion collapses everything into darkness.

Then it all starts again.

While Craig’s mind reels through this visual cacophony, his body lies quietly
in a darkened room in a house near Tijuana, deep in the grip of a powerful
psychedelic drug. His wife, his children and his upper-middle-class home in Salt
Lake City are all far, far away.

Craig is not some crystal-collecting spiritual seeker on a Carlos Castañeda
trip. He is a prosperous, respected restaurant owner, age 50. He is friendly
with the mayor and active in mainstream charities. Other than family vacations
to the Bahamas and Mazatlan, Mexico, this is the only time he has been outside
of the United States.

Craig is here because he is desperate. He is addicted to
painkillers—OxyContin, Lortab and other illegally obtained prescription opiates. His habit is
costing him $1,500 a month, and he knows he must stop. Conventional detox programs
have failed to help, so he has slipped over the border to try a treatment
that is as much an urban myth as a scientifically proven medication—and is as
illegal as heroin in the United States.

The treatment is a dose of a powerful hallucinogen called ibogaine. It is
derived from the roots of a shrub called Tabernanthe iboga that grows in Africa.
Local tribespeople have used it as a peyote-like sacrament for generations.
Since the 1960s, it has circulated on the margins of Western drug culture,
sustained by its reputation as a potent healer. A single daylong trip on ibogaine,
lore has it, can help break an addiction to heroin, cocaine, alcohol or even
cigarettes.

Other hallucinogens such as Ecstasy have purported to be helpful in treating
addiction, but interest in ibogaine seems to be approaching critical mass. The
increasing number of anecdotal success stories has attracted the attention of
researchers. Although there is no rock-solid proof, scientific consensus is
growing that this drug may indeed possess potent addiction-thwarting properties.

Regardless of what science says, faith is flourishing. A devoted community
has grown up around ibogaine—a motley congregation of former junkies,
envelope-pushing academics and drug-reform zealots helping to spread awareness and use
of the drug. There reportedly are at least two underground activists in the
U.S. who will provide it to seekers illegally. But taking ibogaine doesn’t have
to involve breaking laws, because it’s legal in many countries. As a result,
clinics are popping up from the Caribbean to Pakistan, offering ibogaine
treatment for a few thousand dollars to well over $10,000.

The clinic near Tijuana is, relatively speaking, among the most reputable. It
was opened in 2001 by Martin Polanco, a Mexican doctor who was impressed with
how ibogaine—obtained at an underground U.S. clinic—had helped one of his
relatives beat cocaine addiction. Polanco’s facility, known as the Ibogaine
Association, has administered more than 350 treatments and currently has 10 to 15
new patients a month, says program director Randy Hencken.

Hencken, a gangly 28-year-old with curly hair and little studs in each ear,
was one of Polanco’s first patients. He had dropped out of college at 21 to
devote himself to cocaine and, eventually, heroin. Over the years, he tried
everything from 12-step programs to methadone to get clean, but nothing worked. He
discovered ibogaine on the Internet, made his way to Polanco’s facility, and
returned with his addiction broken. He has since embraced the cause with a
convert’s zeal, taking a job as the association’s main organizer.

On the summer day Craig is to begin his ibogaine experience, Hencken is
padding around a San Diego apartment that doubles as the association’s U.S. office.
The place fits naturally in the beachside slacker-student-surfer
neighborhood. The front room is furnished with worn couches and a computer emblazoned with
a Jane’s Addiction sticker. A bike and surfboards hang on hooks in the
kitchen.

Hencken, dressed in a black T-shirt and pants, hops into an unmarked van and
drives to a dingy airport motel. Waiting in the parking lot is Craig, a trim,
compact man wearing loafers, khakis and a Nike T-shirt.

“I’ve got to admit this is a little weird,” says Craig, who flew in from Salt
Lake the night before. “I feel like we’re doing a drug deal.” Which, in a
sense, they are. Craig gets in the van and they roll south.

Craig is highly motivated to undertake this bizarre journey. He was an
alcoholic for years, with the smashed cars and nights in jail to show for it. He
quit drinking 16 years ago and has stayed sober. But a few years ago he was
prescribed painkillers for a knee injury and discovered that he liked them. He
began downing fistfuls of pills daily, scoring them from one of his employees. “At
first it was recreational,” he recalls. “But then you find yourself doing
them just to get from point A to B and you know it’s a problem.”

Last year, he checked himself into a rehab center and went cold turkey. “It
was horrible,” he says. “You hurt from your bones in. I couldn’t sleep. I cried
like a baby. I’d take hot baths all day and eat ibuprofen like candy.” He
stayed clean for six weeks and then fell off the wagon.

“I can’t stop myself. But I know I can’t go down that road again like I did
with alcohol,” he says. “But when you’re on opiates, it really hurts to stop.”
So when his dealer, who had been scouring the Internet for unconventional ways
to kick drugs, told Craig about the Ibogaine Association, he decided he had
little to lose.

“I just need to get this stuff out of my system,” he says, “and I’m looking
for an easier, softer way.”

Ibogaine, as even its most ardent supporters say, is not a cure for drug
dependence; however, it apparently can play a potent role as an
addiction-interrupter. The drug has two powerful addiction-fighting effects. The first is
biochemical: It seems to act on serotonin and opiate systems in the brain,
physically nullifying a person’s craving for drugs and smoothing their withdrawal
symptoms. That’s a huge boon for those addicted to heroin and other opiates, many
of whom shrink from the physical pain of detox.

“It has been proved to alleviate the pain and physical discomfort of drug
withdrawal with animals,” says Dr. Stanley Glick, a neuropharmacologist at Albany
Medical Center in New York who has researched the drug for years. “And there
are lots of reports of it doing the same with humans. You hear the same story
a few thousand times, you’ve got to believe there’s something there.”

After a few weeks, this craving-blocking effect generally fades. But by then,
users have been able to detox relatively painlessly, and then have a month or
more free of drug cravings in which to do whatever it takes to stay clean.

“One dose of ibogaine is not a magic bullet,” says Dr. Deborah Mash, a
neurology professor at the University of Miami who has done the most extensive
research on ibogaine’s effects on human beings. “But it can be a powerful first
step on the road to recovery.”

The second effect is less tangible and more controversial. In many users,
ibogaine induces hours of staggering hallucinations while the patient appears to
be sleeping. Many ibogaine users say they gained profound insights from this
experience, which helps them to understand why they became addicts.

Greg Douglass, a former guitarist with the Steve Miller Band, credits a
session last year at the Ibogaine Association with helping him to kick methadone.
Douglass had visions of himself as a terrified child, of his still-living
father in a coffin, of fantastic animals tearing each other apart in a red sea.
Over the next several weeks, he says, he gradually came to understand some of the
messages encoded in the visions.

“I’d be tying my shoes and suddenly have a little epiphany—’Aha, that’s what
that meant.’ ” The visions, he says, “showed me the potential for myself as a
human being.”

Beth Giuliano, a sturdy 25-year-old from New York, had been in and out of
rehab programs for years trying to kick heroin before she found her way to the
Ibogaine Association in February. “I saw my mother holding an infant,” she says,
describing her hallucinations. “I realized that was me. I felt the pain of
what it would be like to have a child who becomes a drug addict. I’d always felt
guilty about my family, but I never really understood their pain until I did
ibogaine.

“I woke up the next day seeing things a completely different way. I’d never
felt so positive,” she says. “I felt like the person I was when I was little or
like a whole new me.” She says she’s done heroin twice since her treatment,
but didn’t enjoy it and has stayed clean for four months.

But there are plenty of people who discount the supposed wonder treatment.
For some, the visions are harrowing and the treatment is a failure. “It’s like
acid times one million,” writes an anonymous naysayer on one of the many web
sites devoted to ibogaine. “I saw God alright—I talked to him. And I was so sure
it was real. But it wasn’t…. It was someone who [messed] with me and scared
the [daylights] out of me.” This person’s account says that others who took the
treatment at the same time saw themselves being crucified or raped. “It
didn’t work for me, and it didn’t work for anyone else that I personally met who
took it,” the writer concludes.

Everyone agrees that ibogaine is no fun. It’s often emotionally unsettling,
mentally exhausting and physically stressful. Its side effects can include
nausea, vomiting, loss of coordination and a potentially dangerous reduction in
blood pressure and heart rate.

There have been several documented deaths in connection with the drug. But
because the ibogaine was not taken in a clinical setting, the cause of death was
never firmly established. Some fatalities may have been caused by preexisting
heart conditions made lethal by ibogaine’s effects. Mash is confident that
there are more that have gone unreported. “There are some pretty unethical
people” giving clandestine treatments, she says. “They just leave patients for dead
in hotel rooms.”

“That’s why ibogaine needs to be legal and available in safe settings,”
Hencken says. “It needs to be in the hands of someone who can judge your health,
your dosage and provide a safe environment.”

The Ibogaine Association requires clients to submit a medical history as well
as undergo testing before treatment can begin. A doctor administers the drug.
Still, the procedure seems remarkably casual.

From San Diego, Craig is brought to the association’s treatment facility, a
rented house on a well-kept residential street near Tijuana. Only the dining
room, which has been converted into a medication-equipped office, and the oxygen
tanks under the stairs indicate that it is a medical establishment, of sorts.

The doctor treating Craig is Francisco Cañez, a calm, round-faced man who
splits his time between the association and a hospital emergency room. Craig sits
with his arms crossed, looking more than a tad nervous as Cañez reviews his
file and calculates his ibogaine dosage. From a small jar, he shakes out three
gelatin capsules filled with white powder and hands them to Craig.

Craig looks speculatively at the first pill, which he’ll take to make sure he
doesn’t have an allergic reaction. “Well, I’ve put all kinds of things in my
body,” he says, shrugging. Half an hour later, having evinced no untoward
initial responses, he swallows the other two pills.

Cañez then takes him into a bedroom, where sheets of Styrofoam cover the
windows and a CD softly plays rainforest sounds, and attaches him to a heart
monitor next to the bed. The monitor’s graph flutters peacefully as the ibogaine
gradually pulls Craig away. After a while, he just lies there silently, engulfed
in a hallucinogenic hurricane.

After several hours, the visions gradually start to subside. Craig sits up,
nauseated and dizzy. “That was a wild ride,” he mutters. Though he hasn’t had a
painkiller in several days, he finds he doesn’t crave one now. He lies down
again and drops back into his head for another hour. Finally, he revives enough
to be moved to another house where he will spend the next day recovering. He
totters out to the van with small, jittery steps.

Ibogaine’s addiction-fighting potential was discovered only recently, and
accidentally. It was sold as a stimulant in France during the middle decades of
the last century, and an American psychologist and a psychiatrist dabbled with
it in the 1950s and ’60s. So little was known about it that it could not even
be considered a curiosity.

But in 1962, Howard Lotsof, a 19-year-old New York student with a heroin
habit and an appetite for other pharmacological kicks, scored some powder that he
was told would give him a 36-hour trip. Lotsof and some of his junkie pals
experimented with it and, to their astonishment, found that it knocked out their
heroin craving.

Mightily impressed, Lotsof tried to drum up street interest, and a little
cash for himself in the process. It never caught on in a big way, but it did find
a place in counterculture lore—and got banned by the federal government in
1970. It was memorably cited by gonzo journalist Hunter S. Thompson, who
speculated that “a bad ibogaine frenzy” was the likely explanation for Democrat Ed
Muskie’s oddly emotional behavior in the 1972 presidential campaign.

Ibogaine’s legend grew as a constant trickle of adventurous addicts tried it.
In the mid-’80s, Lotsof managed to patent ibogaine as an anti-addiction
palliative, and set up a company to try to bring it to market. An early series of
treatments in the Netherlands looked promising, although there were a couple of
ibogaine-related deaths elsewhere in Europe.

Lotsof continued his crusade. In the early ’90s, he and other activists
persuaded a federal agency to cough up several million dollars for ibogaine
research. He recruited Mash and the two began working together. (They have since
parted ways.) By 1993, Mash had won FDA approval to begin testing ibogaine on
human subjects. But then one of Lotsof’s informal patients in the Netherlands
died. In 1995, the National Institute on Drug Abuse decided not to proceed to
clinical studies.

“Committee members were not all that impressed with its efficacy, but the
safety issue stopped them in their tracks,” says Frank Vocci, a federal
researcher who has followed ibogaine’s progress. “What you have are a lot of
interesting, colorful anecdotes. But the plural of anecdotes is not scientific data.”

A number of researchers around the country, however, have become sufficiently
intrigued to continue experimenting with animals. Dozens of articles have
appeared in scientific journals, most of them reporting promising results that
buttress the anecdotal evidence.

Mash is doing her own part to advance the cause. In 1996 she helped to launch
an ibogaine clinic on the Caribbean island of St. Kitts. During the next five
years, she gathered data on more than 300 patients who sought treatment
there—the largest body of serious clinical research on ibogaine ever collected.

Mash presented her findings at a medical conference last fall in San
Francisco. Granted, her sample wasn’t representative of America’s drug users: Most
were white men between 20 and 40 years old, the sort of addicts who can afford to
spend several weeks and several thousand dollars detoxing in the Caribbean.
Still, she declared that her research proves that ibogaine can be administered
safely and does help break addictions. “We saw people with big methadone
habits lose their cravings after just a single dose of ibogaine,” she says. “One
month later, both cocaine and opiate addicts reported cravings were
significantly lower. And at one year, drug use was significantly down among testees.”

At this point, perhaps the major obstacle to Ibogaine’s mainstream acceptance
is its scrofulous image. This isn’t a medicine developed by white-coated
scientists; its anti-addictive properties were discovered by a junkie, and some of
its promoters are folks who may be of more interest to the attorney general
than the surgeon general.

One of ibogaine’s most energetic boosters is Marc Emery, founder of a
Vancouver, Canada, clinic. Emery is a verbose, middle-aged man with bushy hair and
corporate-casual clothes. You’d never guess that he heads the British Columbia
Marijuana Party and is, by his reckoning, one of the world’s largest sellers of
pot seeds. It is his personal mission to bring ibogaine to the masses,
because the drug helped his adopted son kick methadone and heroin. Until this
spring, Emery offered free treatment in the Iboga Therapy House, a clinic that
consists of a plush one-bedroom apartment in a Vancouver high-rise. With his cash
flow crimped by business and legal troubles (he just spent two months in a
Saskatchewan jail for passing a joint at a gathering), he has stopped funding the
clinic, putting its program on hold, but he remains supportive. “It was a very
worthwhile investment,” he says. “The improvements I saw in our patients were
significant and astonishing.”

Still, Emery’s enthusiasm is unlikely to change the minds of skeptics such as
Dr. Herbert Kleber, head of the substance abuse division at Columbia
University’s school of medicine. “I’m in favor of anything that works, but there needs
to be proof that it does, and that it doesn’t endanger patients,” he says.
“I’ve been in this field 35 years, and I’ve seen a lot of magic bullets. They
often turn out to be worse than the disease.”

Getting that kind of proof requires controlled experiments on human subjects,
which is what Mash is working toward. She has isolated a molecule called
noribogaine, which is produced in the body as it metabolizes ibogaine, and which
she believes is the key agent that blocks drug cravings. She is trying to get
FDA approval to start human testing. On a parallel track, Stanley Glick has
synthesized a chemical cousin of ibogaine dubbed 18-MC, which he also hopes to
market.

Both Mash and Glick think their ibogaine derivatives will give users the
drug-blocking effect without the hallucinations—something both believe is
necessary if the FDA is to approve their products.

But would eliminating ibogaine’s psychedelic side diminish its effectiveness?
No one knows. “For me, the ideal would be for people to take ibogaine in a
controlled environment, and use the experience as part of their psychotherapy,”
Mash says. “Then slap a noribogaine patch on them.”

Mash and Glick also face a more prosaic obstacle: money. Funding
comprehensive clinical trials for a new drug is colossally expensive, and so far neither
has found anyone willing to pony up the full cost. In October, a Los Angeles
philanthropist pledged to give Mash $250,000 to restart research at the
University of Miami, but that’s only a tiny fraction of what will eventually be
necessary if ibogaine is ever to be brought to market.

“The pharmaceutical industry has never wanted much to do with addiction
medicine,” Glick says. “It’s not very profitable, and it’s bad public relations.”

Though there are millions of people addicted to various substances in the
U.S., many of them don’t want, or can’t afford, treatment. Worse, from a
bottom-line standpoint, an ibogaine-based treatment drug would be used only once—a
feeble investment for companies accustomed to cash-cow refillable prescriptions.

Which leaves people like Craig knocking on doors of unregulated ibogaine
clinics in a desperate search for something that will help defeat their addictions.

“All these clinics popping up all over the world—it’s become almost a
cult-like phenomenon,” Glick says. “All the hype and politics around ibogaine just
make my job harder. It means the scientific establishment and regulatory
agencies take a dim view.”

But the ranks of the believers keep growing. Six months after his ibogaine
treatment, Craig says he’s staying clean and feeling great. “That stuff worked
just like it was supposed to,” he says. “It was so much better than the detox I
tried. I don’t understand why it’s not legal.”

*

Editor’s note:

In this article, the name of the patient seeking ibogaine treatment in
Tijuana has been changed to protect his privacy. However, the Los Angeles Times
Magazine has verified his identity and the circumstances described in the article.
If you want other stories on this topic, search the Archives at
latimes.com/archives.

Article licensing and reprint options

————————————————————————

Copyright 2004 Los Angeles Times

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 27, 2004 at 2:48:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 04:15:16 -0800 Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
Similarly I am not a great fan of DMT from what I have read as I
think its a shortcut to spiritual dimensions best reserved for
those whose souls have been prepared for the experience. Otherwise

the combination of ones own inner demons coupled with the doors
which are been opened can lead to serious problems afterwards imo.

In my experience, the container is all-important. So far the best
one for me is group singing in a church setting, which is what I
started with. The first time I did my own homebrew, the message
was, “why are you doing this alone, your path is to connect with
people,” and the church has been my satisfaction and growth ever
since. (I also learn in free-form group singing without the
religious or entheogenic aspects.) Plus with ayahuasca there is the
vine, which on its own can take one on a slow unhallucinogenic path
of deep body learning. It is all work, the hardest and deepest that
one is capable of, no shortcuts I thoroughly agree.

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 27, 2004 at 2:41:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen,

maybe take the train to amsterdam and see the museums, have some dutch french fries (the best) or some pankoecken, appleflap, toasties and a hot cup of tea. yum. then walk along the canals or rent a bike and pedal around the city, if it’s not too cold.

_.dh

On Saturday, November 27, 2004, at 09:28 AM, <slowone@hush.ai> wrote:

You could try singing? Drawing? Explore those vibrations and see
what further healing and messages come when you take the active
role in place of eboga, carrying on your healing. Boredom may be
just the veil your habits are throwing over the next stage. Beware
of endings that amount to dissatisfaction. 🙂

On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 02:57:33 -0800 Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl>
wrote:
THANKS randy.
I AM SOOO BORED,CANYOU GUYS COME OVER.
You are right about aftercare,there is a lot of work to be done to

heal the
world.
I realised something being over the other side of the world,your
vibratioal
frequencies tune into
Different parts of the world depending on where you are born,which

port hole
on earth through your mothers womb,life without end,..a spiral,no
beginning
and no end
So when you live away from where you were born,it can feel as if
everything
is twice as hard.Like you are going against the grain..

IT MAY BE THE ONLY WAY HOWEVER IN CAN BE DONE IN A MUCH BIGGER AND
BETTERWAY,IF GREED MOVED OVER A TRIFLE.
Sara’S is very affordable. Just fuc ing boring. SORRY sara,I do
love you and
you are a princess,the bwiti princess,her vibes hide her princess
appearances as others see her,but I KNOW BECAUSE I saw,SARA IS THE

bwiti
PRINCESS.

Eboga must be taken naturally,to be effective on every plain,to
work on
every frequency the body neads to heal.WE ARE 4 DIMENSIOAL BEINGS
and need
healing on all freqences. Science and Natural medicine must work
together.
Love you all Jasen.
_____

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com]
Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2004 12:32
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen you freakin’  ROCKKK. See. It’s the only way, huh. Tell us
more when
you can. How long are you going to be there? I’d stay as long as I

could if
I were you. Everybody was right about aftercare. It sure makes me
feel
better about everything.     Randy

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 27, 2004 at 2:32:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen! I am so fuckin’ proud of you! Honestly I am envious too! Life changing experience huh? You just keep on keepin’ on!
Callie

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 27, 2004 at 2:28:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You could try singing? Drawing? Explore those vibrations and see
what further healing and messages come when you take the active
role in place of eboga, carrying on your healing. Boredom may be
just the veil your habits are throwing over the next stage. Beware
of endings that amount to dissatisfaction. 🙂

On Sat, 27 Nov 2004 02:57:33 -0800 Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl>
wrote:
THANKS randy.
I AM SOOO BORED,CANYOU GUYS COME OVER.
You are right about aftercare,there is a lot of work to be done to

heal the
world.
I realised something being over the other side of the world,your
vibratioal
frequencies tune into
Different parts of the world depending on where you are born,which

port hole
on earth through your mothers womb,life without end,..a spiral,no
beginning
and no end
So when you live away from where you were born,it can feel as if
everything
is twice as hard.Like you are going against the grain..

IT MAY BE THE ONLY WAY HOWEVER IN CAN BE DONE IN A MUCH BIGGER AND
BETTERWAY,IF GREED MOVED OVER A TRIFLE.
Sara’S is very affordable. Just fuc ing boring. SORRY sara,I do
love you and
you are a princess,the bwiti princess,her vibes hide her princess
appearances as others see her,but I KNOW BECAUSE I saw,SARA IS THE

bwiti
PRINCESS.

Eboga must be taken naturally,to be effective on every plain,to
work on
every frequency the body neads to heal.WE ARE 4 DIMENSIOAL BEINGS
and need
healing on all freqences. Science and Natural medicine must work
together.
Love you all Jasen.
_____

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com]
Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2004 12:32
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen you freakin’  ROCKKK. See. It’s the only way, huh. Tell us
more when
you can. How long are you going to be there? I’d stay as long as I

could if
I were you. Everybody was right about aftercare. It sure makes me
feel
better about everything.     Randy

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] visions
Date: November 27, 2004 at 2:12:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

visions i have had

On Saturday, November 27, 2004, at 01:03 AM, knowone knowwhere wrote:

visions have Anyone else ??

—  <thethird@myway.com> wrote:
Anyone else have visions
similar and any ideas that you get from them?

I did Ibogaine about a year and a
half ago. I had a big trip w/ lots of visuals,

<^> inspiring ones first
(i.e. this is what the world is
really about, now stop shooting dope and become one
with the world),
: ) <cherry flavored mind pops> : )
and then the fun house madness hit
(or madhouse fun) which was mixed with apathetic
speedy visions of humans doing all their worst
traits.
What didya see?

I went from shooting smack daily to being
totally clean for a month or two. But I still had
some crRav3nGgs and kidz knew that if I didn’t do
something
I’d be shooting up again and agin and agn.

Their is that something/ That ‘if I don’t do
something’ something.

I wanted to go on suboxone
(buprenorphine/naloxone mix) but the closest clinic
had a doctor that was almost but not quite
certified. So I went on methadone for a few months
at a low dose of 35 Mg’s, and then switched to
suboxone once the doc was certified, which I’ve been
on for over a year.

What dose?   Was the switch difficult?

At times I feel I failed because
I didn’t totally rewrite my addictive tendencies
after Ibogaine,

itz still better then nothing.  Their may or may not
be shades of gray between ‘failed’ and ‘success’.  I
personally don’t think you have failed, but I’m a
crazy person who’s current form of avoidance is the
on’line version of ‘hugging a stranger’.  But no, I
don’t think you have failed. (place product
advertisement here)

even though it brought about a major
change and helped me get to a life that could
actually be called a life.
it brought about a major
change and helped me get to a life that could
actually be called a life.  helped me get to a life

what made it life?   may not be as out of reach as
appears

I have panic attacks and
the suboxone helps with those, and the panic attacks
get worse
when
I am in
situations
where

I have to

speak
in front of a crowd.

That’s about as normal as you can get.  Non-judgmental
people are out in audience too.  They’re like rooting
you on and stuff.  They are ‘on stage’ with you, they
just don’t realize it.  “All the world is a stage” and
all that.
Panic attacks are yucky, they are one of the main
reasons I started Heroin in the first place.  Did you
have them before ibo too?  It takes some work, like
working out I guess but what I try to do in response
to that is work on learning how to rest during rest
time (relax time/let go time or whatever)_or… when
fear over takes logic, deep breaths can be nice, not
in a ‘oh g-d oh g-d I’ve got to breathe deep, I’m
having a panic attack’ way, but in a “At least SOME of
that which is beyond my 5 senses ISN’T out to get me.”
way. Almost to the point that G-d loves me or hates
me, before I realize that G-d has a few more important
matters to deal with, Why else wouldn’t s/he post?

—>   When I am going to school   <—
*that is a good thing

is when I have the worst bouts of panic attacks, and
I am getting ready to go back and finish my degree,

Give yourself some credit following through with that.
what are you getting your degree in?

so I think suboxone will help with that,

oh, I thought you were already on it.

but I don’t believe I want to be on it for life.

: )Going to live in the moment forever: )

So I am
thinking about how I should come off the suboxone.

<Paging Dr. Lotsof>

I’m interested in hearing anyone’s adventures with
doing follow-up Ibogaine treatments.

I had a intense dark hcl dose then a smaller extract
few months after to help grow out of the fear from the
previous, it helped.  I had plenty of benzo’s ready if
I needed them (I didn’t, but just knowing they were
there if needed made me feel more at ease), small
dose, no “dream”.

My first trip
was so intense that I don’t know if I could convince
myself to do it again, but I am definitely thinking
about it. Also, it’s been over a year since my first
trip and I find myself forgetting some of it.

Yeah I’m “quick to forget” too
<play sound of bong bubbles>

Does
anybody have a way to help remember the trip?

(refer to previous sound)

Another thing I wondered about was the
visuals/feelings in other people’s trips.

me too.

I know a
lot of people see the spiritual good stuff about why
we should stop doing drugs and start our life, but
how many of you guys saw bad aspects of humanity?

The two were connected.

I saw a small part of reality.  The story is still
being written, until…  But it can still be a life.
But yeah, life is perishable “unless it’s not”.

I
saw

people doing the
basest animalistic things,

Damn it!! everyone went to New Orl but me : )

things that when an
animal does them,

don’t seem as bad,

but because the
humans have the capability for higher emotions the
scenes were devastating.

Please, do tell…you really have me curious,
hmmm….where did I put that machine.

Also, the bad feeling I got
watching these visions was much worse than if I
wasn’t hallucinating.

Your right they do seem to have a bigger effect seeing
things that way, but I think seeing those things is an
opportunity to motivate to do our part to try to help
balance it out a little.

It’s like the sad feeling I
would get if I really saw some of that stuff happen
was highly amplified.
sometimes Avoidance=battery charger

Anyone else have visions
similar and any ideas that you get from them?

and any ideas that you get from them?
Sorry
about all the Pretty questions.? Pretty nosy for a
question!

I am just very interested in Ibogaine and

am excited
to find a place with people who like to talk about
it!
: ) me too.
—————————————

Jasen, A white candle burning now in Dallas for
wellness for you and all receiving this

Sean,   I think Less harm is good.

Callie,  : ) I don’t see anything wrong with it
either.

Randy, I think Bill W would have liked ibo.  But can’t
chat ’bout that, too busy drilling oil w/ JR and dem.
Drilling oil and Political redistricting, that’s all
we do round these parts…now lets go to the library
and rent us some movies.: )

Schoolboy, sincere thank you for the good info, it is
very much appreciated.

Lee,   You are very much an Amazing person who
deserves Grace.  You and ALL have my respect.

Oh and Re: Thanksgiving,
last year I was digesting an ibo session in jail with
leftover ‘done withdrawals.
This Thanksgiving, before going to a wonderful meal
enjoyed by family including two new baby’s, I started
the day with our sacred circle jerk and found
Preston’s post (that made me laugh out loud as I
hadn’t read that WSB [or heard it] in so long) was one
of many totally fucking awesome posts that morning
(not to say they aren’t always totally awesome
but…well yeah, I’m saying that.  I thought it was a
GREAT way to start off the day…but to each their own
I guess.  Now where did I put that machine? and what
the fuck did you do with my script pad?

_______________________________________________
kNow kidding.
Make home >  -11

___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 27, 2004 at 2:06:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/27/04 11:47:21 AM, HSLotsof@aol.com writes:

The long awaited LA Times article on ibogaine just appeared on their web
page.

http://www.latimes.com/features/printedition/magazine/la-tm-ibogaine48nov28,0
,
775349.story?coll=la-home-magazine

The Magical Mystery Tour
Drug and alcohol addicts are going abroad in search of the purported miracle

treatment called ibogaine. But will the drug industry embrace a substance
that
causes a hallucinatory high?

Try

http://www.latimes.com/features/printedition/magazine/la-tm-ibogaine48nov28,0,
775349.story?coll=la-home-magazine

Thanks

Howard

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 27, 2004 at 2:01:11 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

————————————————————————
http://www.latimes.com/features/printedition/magazine/la-tm-ibogaine48nov28,0,
775349.story?coll=la-home-magazine

The Magical Mystery Tour

Drug and alcohol addicts are going abroad in search of the purported miracle
treatment called ibogaine. But will the drug industry embrace a substance that
causes a hallucinatory high?
By Vince Beiser
Special to The Times

November 28, 2004
The hallucinations are coming fast and vivid. Faces, shapes, colors rush
toward him, melting and swirling into each other, sometimes coalescing into more
concrete visions. He sees himself floating underwater. By turns, his four
children drift by. Sometimes they blow bubbles and float happily up to the surface;
sometimes they sink straight down, disappearing into darkness. Then there are
three ships, coming in to dock at three tubes; he knows, somehow, that they
are building a bomb, and if all three dock successfully it will explode. He
tries to direct them away, but can’t. The final ship enters the final tube. A
titanic explosion collapses everything into darkness.

Then it all starts again.

While Craig’s mind reels through this visual cacophony, his body lies quietly
in a darkened room in a house near Tijuana, deep in the grip of a powerful
psychedelic drug. His wife, his children and his upper-middle-class home in Salt
Lake City are all far, far away.

Craig is not some crystal-collecting spiritual seeker on a Carlos Castañeda
trip. He is a prosperous, respected restaurant owner, age 50. He is friendly
with the mayor and active in mainstream charities. Other than family vacations
to the Bahamas and Mazatlan, Mexico, this is the only time he has been outside
of the United States.

Craig is here because he is desperate. He is addicted to
painkillers—OxyContin, Lortab and other illegally obtained prescription opiates. His habit is
costing him $1,500 a month, and he knows he must stop. Conventional detox programs
have failed to help, so he has slipped over the border to try a treatment
that is as much an urban myth as a scientifically proven medication—and is as
illegal as heroin in the United States.

The treatment is a dose of a powerful hallucinogen called ibogaine. It is
derived from the roots of a shrub called Tabernanthe iboga that grows in Africa.
Local tribespeople have used it as a peyote-like sacrament for generations.
Since the 1960s, it has circulated on the margins of Western drug culture,
sustained by its reputation as a potent healer. A single daylong trip on ibogaine,
lore has it, can help break an addiction to heroin, cocaine, alcohol or even
cigarettes.

Other hallucinogens such as Ecstasy have purported to be helpful in treating
addiction, but interest in ibogaine seems to be approaching critical mass. The
increasing number of anecdotal success stories has attracted the attention of
researchers. Although there is no rock-solid proof, scientific consensus is
growing that this drug may indeed possess potent addiction-thwarting properties.

Regardless of what science says, faith is flourishing. A devoted community
has grown up around ibogaine—a motley congregation of former junkies,
envelope-pushing academics and drug-reform zealots helping to spread awareness and use
of the drug. There reportedly are at least two underground activists in the
U.S. who will provide it to seekers illegally. But taking ibogaine doesn’t have
to involve breaking laws, because it’s legal in many countries. As a result,
clinics are popping up from the Caribbean to Pakistan, offering ibogaine
treatment for a few thousand dollars to well over $10,000.

The clinic near Tijuana is, relatively speaking, among the most reputable. It
was opened in 2001 by Martin Polanco, a Mexican doctor who was impressed with
how ibogaine—obtained at an underground U.S. clinic—had helped one of his
relatives beat cocaine addiction. Polanco’s facility, known as the Ibogaine
Association, has administered more than 350 treatments and currently has 10 to 15
new patients a month, says program director Randy Hencken.

Hencken, a gangly 28-year-old with curly hair and little studs in each ear,
was one of Polanco’s first patients. He had dropped out of college at 21 to
devote himself to cocaine and, eventually, heroin. Over the years, he tried
everything from 12-step programs to methadone to get clean, but nothing worked. He
discovered ibogaine on the Internet, made his way to Polanco’s facility, and
returned with his addiction broken. He has since embraced the cause with a
convert’s zeal, taking a job as the association’s main organizer.

On the summer day Craig is to begin his ibogaine experience, Hencken is
padding around a San Diego apartment that doubles as the association’s U.S. office.
The place fits naturally in the beachside slacker-student-surfer
neighborhood. The front room is furnished with worn couches and a computer emblazoned with
a Jane’s Addiction sticker. A bike and surfboards hang on hooks in the
kitchen.

Hencken, dressed in a black T-shirt and pants, hops into an unmarked van and
drives to a dingy airport motel. Waiting in the parking lot is Craig, a trim,
compact man wearing loafers, khakis and a Nike T-shirt.

“I’ve got to admit this is a little weird,” says Craig, who flew in from Salt
Lake the night before. “I feel like we’re doing a drug deal.” Which, in a
sense, they are. Craig gets in the van and they roll south.

Craig is highly motivated to undertake this bizarre journey. He was an
alcoholic for years, with the smashed cars and nights in jail to show for it. He
quit drinking 16 years ago and has stayed sober. But a few years ago he was
prescribed painkillers for a knee injury and discovered that he liked them. He
began downing fistfuls of pills daily, scoring them from one of his employees. “At
first it was recreational,” he recalls. “But then you find yourself doing
them just to get from point A to B and you know it’s a problem.”

Last year, he checked himself into a rehab center and went cold turkey. “It
was horrible,” he says. “You hurt from your bones in. I couldn’t sleep. I cried
like a baby. I’d take hot baths all day and eat ibuprofen like candy.” He
stayed clean for six weeks and then fell off the wagon.

“I can’t stop myself. But I know I can’t go down that road again like I did
with alcohol,” he says. “But when you’re on opiates, it really hurts to stop.”
So when his dealer, who had been scouring the Internet for unconventional ways
to kick drugs, told Craig about the Ibogaine Association, he decided he had
little to lose.

“I just need to get this stuff out of my system,” he says, “and I’m looking
for an easier, softer way.”

Ibogaine, as even its most ardent supporters say, is not a cure for drug
dependence; however, it apparently can play a potent role as an
addiction-interrupter. The drug has two powerful addiction-fighting effects. The first is
biochemical: It seems to act on serotonin and opiate systems in the brain,
physically nullifying a person’s craving for drugs and smoothing their withdrawal
symptoms. That’s a huge boon for those addicted to heroin and other opiates, many
of whom shrink from the physical pain of detox.

“It has been proved to alleviate the pain and physical discomfort of drug
withdrawal with animals,” says Dr. Stanley Glick, a neuropharmacologist at Albany
Medical Center in New York who has researched the drug for years. “And there
are lots of reports of it doing the same with humans. You hear the same story
a few thousand times, you’ve got to believe there’s something there.”

After a few weeks, this craving-blocking effect generally fades. But by then,
users have been able to detox relatively painlessly, and then have a month or
more free of drug cravings in which to do whatever it takes to stay clean.

“One dose of ibogaine is not a magic bullet,” says Dr. Deborah Mash, a
neurology professor at the University of Miami who has done the most extensive
research on ibogaine’s effects on human beings. “But it can be a powerful first
step on the road to recovery.”

The second effect is less tangible and more controversial. In many users,
ibogaine induces hours of staggering hallucinations while the patient appears to
be sleeping. Many ibogaine users say they gained profound insights from this
experience, which helps them to understand why they became addicts.

Greg Douglass, a former guitarist with the Steve Miller Band, credits a
session last year at the Ibogaine Association with helping him to kick methadone.
Douglass had visions of himself as a terrified child, of his still-living
father in a coffin, of fantastic animals tearing each other apart in a red sea.
Over the next several weeks, he says, he gradually came to understand some of the
messages encoded in the visions.

“I’d be tying my shoes and suddenly have a little epiphany—’Aha, that’s what
that meant.’ ” The visions, he says, “showed me the potential for myself as a
human being.”

Beth Giuliano, a sturdy 25-year-old from New York, had been in and out of
rehab programs for years trying to kick heroin before she found her way to the
Ibogaine Association in February. “I saw my mother holding an infant,” she says,
describing her hallucinations. “I realized that was me. I felt the pain of
what it would be like to have a child who becomes a drug addict. I’d always felt
guilty about my family, but I never really understood their pain until I did
ibogaine.

“I woke up the next day seeing things a completely different way. I’d never
felt so positive,” she says. “I felt like the person I was when I was little or
like a whole new me.” She says she’s done heroin twice since her treatment,
but didn’t enjoy it and has stayed clean for four months.

But there are plenty of people who discount the supposed wonder treatment.
For some, the visions are harrowing and the treatment is a failure. “It’s like
acid times one million,” writes an anonymous naysayer on one of the many web
sites devoted to ibogaine. “I saw God alright—I talked to him. And I was so sure
it was real. But it wasn’t…. It was someone who [messed] with me and scared
the [daylights] out of me.” This person’s account says that others who took the
treatment at the same time saw themselves being crucified or raped. “It
didn’t work for me, and it didn’t work for anyone else that I personally met who
took it,” the writer concludes.

Everyone agrees that ibogaine is no fun. It’s often emotionally unsettling,
mentally exhausting and physically stressful. Its side effects can include
nausea, vomiting, loss of coordination and a potentially dangerous reduction in
blood pressure and heart rate.

There have been several documented deaths in connection with the drug. But
because the ibogaine was not taken in a clinical setting, the cause of death was
never firmly established. Some fatalities may have been caused by preexisting
heart conditions made lethal by ibogaine’s effects. Mash is confident that
there are more that have gone unreported. “There are some pretty unethical
people” giving clandestine treatments, she says. “They just leave patients for dead
in hotel rooms.”

“That’s why ibogaine needs to be legal and available in safe settings,”
Hencken says. “It needs to be in the hands of someone who can judge your health,
your dosage and provide a safe environment.”

The Ibogaine Association requires clients to submit a medical history as well
as undergo testing before treatment can begin. A doctor administers the drug.
Still, the procedure seems remarkably casual.

From San Diego, Craig is brought to the association’s treatment facility, a
rented house on a well-kept residential street near Tijuana. Only the dining
room, which has been converted into a medication-equipped office, and the oxygen
tanks under the stairs indicate that it is a medical establishment, of sorts.

The doctor treating Craig is Francisco Cañez, a calm, round-faced man who
splits his time between the association and a hospital emergency room. Craig sits
with his arms crossed, looking more than a tad nervous as Cañez reviews his
file and calculates his ibogaine dosage. From a small jar, he shakes out three
gelatin capsules filled with white powder and hands them to Craig.

Craig looks speculatively at the first pill, which he’ll take to make sure he
doesn’t have an allergic reaction. “Well, I’ve put all kinds of things in my
body,” he says, shrugging. Half an hour later, having evinced no untoward
initial responses, he swallows the other two pills.

Cañez then takes him into a bedroom, where sheets of Styrofoam cover the
windows and a CD softly plays rainforest sounds, and attaches him to a heart
monitor next to the bed. The monitor’s graph flutters peacefully as the ibogaine
gradually pulls Craig away. After a while, he just lies there silently, engulfed
in a hallucinogenic hurricane.

After several hours, the visions gradually start to subside. Craig sits up,
nauseated and dizzy. “That was a wild ride,” he mutters. Though he hasn’t had a
painkiller in several days, he finds he doesn’t crave one now. He lies down
again and drops back into his head for another hour. Finally, he revives enough
to be moved to another house where he will spend the next day recovering. He
totters out to the van with small, jittery steps.

Ibogaine’s addiction-fighting potential was discovered only recently, and
accidentally. It was sold as a stimulant in France during the middle decades of
the last century, and an American psychologist and a psychiatrist dabbled with
it in the 1950s and ’60s. So little was known about it that it could not even
be considered a curiosity.

But in 1962, Howard Lotsof, a 19-year-old New York student with a heroin
habit and an appetite for other pharmacological kicks, scored some powder that he
was told would give him a 36-hour trip. Lotsof and some of his junkie pals
experimented with it and, to their astonishment, found that it knocked out their
heroin craving.

Mightily impressed, Lotsof tried to drum up street interest, and a little
cash for himself in the process. It never caught on in a big way, but it did find
a place in counterculture lore—and got banned by the federal government in
1970. It was memorably cited by gonzo journalist Hunter S. Thompson, who
speculated that “a bad ibogaine frenzy” was the likely explanation for Democrat Ed
Muskie’s oddly emotional behavior in the 1972 presidential campaign.

Ibogaine’s legend grew as a constant trickle of adventurous addicts tried it.
In the mid-’80s, Lotsof managed to patent ibogaine as an anti-addiction
palliative, and set up a company to try to bring it to market. An early series of
treatments in the Netherlands looked promising, although there were a couple of
ibogaine-related deaths elsewhere in Europe.

Lotsof continued his crusade. In the early ’90s, he and other activists
persuaded a federal agency to cough up several million dollars for ibogaine
research. He recruited Mash and the two began working together. (They have since
parted ways.) By 1993, Mash had won FDA approval to begin testing ibogaine on
human subjects. But then one of Lotsof’s informal patients in the Netherlands
died. In 1995, the National Institute on Drug Abuse decided not to proceed to
clinical studies.

“Committee members were not all that impressed with its efficacy, but the
safety issue stopped them in their tracks,” says Frank Vocci, a federal
researcher who has followed ibogaine’s progress. “What you have are a lot of
interesting, colorful anecdotes. But the plural of anecdotes is not scientific data.”

A number of researchers around the country, however, have become sufficiently
intrigued to continue experimenting with animals. Dozens of articles have
appeared in scientific journals, most of them reporting promising results that
buttress the anecdotal evidence.

Mash is doing her own part to advance the cause. In 1996 she helped to launch
an ibogaine clinic on the Caribbean island of St. Kitts. During the next five
years, she gathered data on more than 300 patients who sought treatment
there—the largest body of serious clinical research on ibogaine ever collected.

Mash presented her findings at a medical conference last fall in San
Francisco. Granted, her sample wasn’t representative of America’s drug users: Most
were white men between 20 and 40 years old, the sort of addicts who can afford to
spend several weeks and several thousand dollars detoxing in the Caribbean.
Still, she declared that her research proves that ibogaine can be administered
safely and does help break addictions. “We saw people with big methadone
habits lose their cravings after just a single dose of ibogaine,” she says. “One
month later, both cocaine and opiate addicts reported cravings were
significantly lower. And at one year, drug use was significantly down among testees.”

At this point, perhaps the major obstacle to Ibogaine’s mainstream acceptance
is its scrofulous image. This isn’t a medicine developed by white-coated
scientists; its anti-addictive properties were discovered by a junkie, and some of
its promoters are folks who may be of more interest to the attorney general
than the surgeon general.

One of ibogaine’s most energetic boosters is Marc Emery, founder of a
Vancouver, Canada, clinic. Emery is a verbose, middle-aged man with bushy hair and
corporate-casual clothes. You’d never guess that he heads the British Columbia
Marijuana Party and is, by his reckoning, one of the world’s largest sellers of
pot seeds. It is his personal mission to bring ibogaine to the masses,
because the drug helped his adopted son kick methadone and heroin. Until this
spring, Emery offered free treatment in the Iboga Therapy House, a clinic that
consists of a plush one-bedroom apartment in a Vancouver high-rise. With his cash
flow crimped by business and legal troubles (he just spent two months in a
Saskatchewan jail for passing a joint at a gathering), he has stopped funding the
clinic, putting its program on hold, but he remains supportive. “It was a very
worthwhile investment,” he says. “The improvements I saw in our patients were
significant and astonishing.”

Still, Emery’s enthusiasm is unlikely to change the minds of skeptics such as
Dr. Herbert Kleber, head of the substance abuse division at Columbia
University’s school of medicine. “I’m in favor of anything that works, but there needs
to be proof that it does, and that it doesn’t endanger patients,” he says.
“I’ve been in this field 35 years, and I’ve seen a lot of magic bullets. They
often turn out to be worse than the disease.”

Getting that kind of proof requires controlled experiments on human subjects,
which is what Mash is working toward. She has isolated a molecule called
noribogaine, which is produced in the body as it metabolizes ibogaine, and which
she believes is the key agent that blocks drug cravings. She is trying to get
FDA approval to start human testing. On a parallel track, Stanley Glick has
synthesized a chemical cousin of ibogaine dubbed 18-MC, which he also hopes to
market.

Both Mash and Glick think their ibogaine derivatives will give users the
drug-blocking effect without the hallucinations—something both believe is
necessary if the FDA is to approve their products.

But would eliminating ibogaine’s psychedelic side diminish its effectiveness?
No one knows. “For me, the ideal would be for people to take ibogaine in a
controlled environment, and use the experience as part of their psychotherapy,”
Mash says. “Then slap a noribogaine patch on them.”

Mash and Glick also face a more prosaic obstacle: money. Funding
comprehensive clinical trials for a new drug is colossally expensive, and so far neither
has found anyone willing to pony up the full cost. In October, a Los Angeles
philanthropist pledged to give Mash $250,000 to restart research at the
University of Miami, but that’s only a tiny fraction of what will eventually be
necessary if ibogaine is ever to be brought to market.

“The pharmaceutical industry has never wanted much to do with addiction
medicine,” Glick says. “It’s not very profitable, and it’s bad public relations.”

Though there are millions of people addicted to various substances in the
U.S., many of them don’t want, or can’t afford, treatment. Worse, from a
bottom-line standpoint, an ibogaine-based treatment drug would be used only once—a
feeble investment for companies accustomed to cash-cow refillable prescriptions.

Which leaves people like Craig knocking on doors of unregulated ibogaine
clinics in a desperate search for something that will help defeat their addictions.

“All these clinics popping up all over the world—it’s become almost a
cult-like phenomenon,” Glick says. “All the hype and politics around ibogaine just
make my job harder. It means the scientific establishment and regulatory
agencies take a dim view.”

But the ranks of the believers keep growing. Six months after his ibogaine
treatment, Craig says he’s staying clean and feeling great. “That stuff worked
just like it was supposed to,” he says. “It was so much better than the detox I
tried. I don’t understand why it’s not legal.”

*

Editor’s note:

In this article, the name of the patient seeking ibogaine treatment in
Tijuana has been changed to protect his privacy. However, the Los Angeles Times
Magazine has verified his identity and the circumstances described in the article.
If you want other stories on this topic, search the Archives at
latimes.com/archives.

Article licensing and reprint options

————————————————————————

Copyright 2004 Los Angeles Times

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen unbored
Date: November 27, 2004 at 1:53:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen,

Why don’t you unbore yourself by feng shuiing sara’s place.  Is her house
feng shui?  Will Sara let you do it?  Great tasks await great men and women.

Howard

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Randy
Date: November 27, 2004 at 1:23:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy!!!!! No!!!!!! Don’t you dare think that! I felt I let you down by chickening out! You are precious and I did not mean to hurt you! I am so happy you are doing well.
I got mad at myself for not having the guts to follow through. Lots of reasons I backed off….NONE of them had anything to do with you.
Much love and respect
Callie

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] LA Times ibogaine article breaks
Date: November 27, 2004 at 11:46:28 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The long awaited LA Times article on ibogaine just appeared on their web page.

http://www.latimes.com/features/printedition/magazine/la-tm-ibogaine48nov28,0,
775349.story?coll=la-home-magazine

The Magical Mystery Tour
Drug and alcohol addicts are going abroad in search of the purported miracle
treatment called ibogaine. But will the drug industry embrace a substance that
causes a hallucinatory high?

Enjoy.

Howard

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 27, 2004 at 11:01:45 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H. My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself and what I consider normal now.
Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.<

This is EXACTLY what I was writing about earlier, the notes like this one Hannah. I can totally and completely empathize and am really heartily wishing you well, sending you strength and courage. You are how old please, if you don’t mind my asking? I think you mentioned it just the other day (23?- because I remember responding to someone noting that age here and think it mighta been you) but I’m not sure. Regardless, as bad as it seems now, it can get worse, and it can definitely get better. I’m sure you know that, irregardless of how awful it can seem when sitting there trying to get a vein (oh my god, I can remember doing what you’ve described here, but not only in the privacy of someone’s apartment or squat but also, more often than not actually, doing this exact same vein hunt in stairwells, allyways, parkbenches, behind garbage cans, cafe bathrooms, diner tables, etc, etc. I mean, there were times I’d have a great vein, usually a teeny one that I’d managed to find just the right angle to hit it with, making shooting up in public, at diner tables as mentioned (one of my very favorite places to shoot up used to be in very public places like diners, right at the table, as that gave me that extra adrenaline boost. Of course, it was often an interesting experience in that when speedballing, I’d feel the cocaine first, so would be sitting there first witht that roaring in my ears, then bugs all over me while trying to figure out which person in the diner was NOT a cop.
Boy oh boy, what fun that was!

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X and I’ve been on a few.  Its a bummer.

I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m 23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation, well I live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!

Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!  I want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear. I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to just help me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like the music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always know where the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the clubs are all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.

The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but it isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But the pills just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m fucked I’ll still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.

I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.

Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as I woke up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it takes hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my artery so my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I felt like a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear the past week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H. My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself and what I consider normal now.

Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort myself out. I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep doing this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs I had improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I had to go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like that definition of insanity, I am insane.

But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….

Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
Hannah

PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far more partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

Hannah,

you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
gay guys know how to party !!

I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
is!!

I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
refer to the last sentence of the previous
paragraph…

love Julie 🙂

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 27, 2004 at 10:28:55 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen, If I had the cash I’d be right there with you. Someday soon. What have you got planned when you get back down under? I’d sure like to see Australia sometime. You being bored is a good sign. Life awaits you my friend. Kick it’s …. you know what I mean. Be ready, cause I found it hard sometimes because people I knew didn’t know how to take the clean and positive Randy. It is already better for me. The ones who matter think Ibogaine is a miracle. I’ve never gone this long without court pressure and the people who care about me are pretty much amazed. It takes a little while for them to get used to it. Remember, your the one who changed. Give them time to get used to it and don’t freak out like I did. You are most definitely the man now. Run with it. Peace and much love.     Randy

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 27, 2004 at 10:15:27 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/27/04 6:03:11 AM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

Just fuc ing boring.

Hi Jasen,

I can share some thoughts that is all.  What is boring.  Go to the center of
boring and tell us what it is.  Then tell us what is not boring?  I might be
able to answer these questions but then they would be my answers.

Howard

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s
Date: November 27, 2004 at 10:15:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen, it is sooo cool to see the Ibogaine in your writings. Before Ibogaine I used to read things like that and think “yea right.” Now I can read what you say and be right back there. Beautiful isn’t it? Your right about heroin. It’s just that the government and most people see that word ‘Heroin” and think it is the root of all evil. Methadone is the root of all evil. I’d say there is too much money involved to let them do the right thing. Our group is growing. Sooner or later we can’t be denied.        Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?
Date: November 27, 2004 at 10:14:27 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks Hannah.
I’m ok, and working on feeling better. We’ll see how things go. It’s going to be much more expensive this time that it was last time I think, if I do end up having the privilege of an ibo experience again. I would like to have it sooner than later, so keep your fingers crossed please.

I was gonna post about my
situation but I won’t now-I don’t want to be accused of bringing others
down.<

Please don’t do that Hannah, that would not be cool at all, to let others’ opinions on what should and shouldn’t be posted, for whatever reason they feel that at whatever given moment. That’s something I appreciate from this list a lot, like I’m sure many (if not many here) get from -A meetings- the knowlege that I’m not the only one who goes through the bologna I put myself through, that others do it to themselves too and have for as long as people have been people as near as I can tell. But knowing this and being reminded of it every day are different things, and this list definitely reminds me each and every day that no matter how bad I think I’m feeling, there’s always going to be someone somewhere who knows exactly how I’m feeling and can commisserate or sympathize or empathize or tell me to soak my head…errr, no, that’s not it, who can help by simply writing a reply on this list.
So please, again, take your own words to heart and keep on posting what you will. As I’d be willing to bet you would anyway despite your noted hesitation.
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 3:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Please keep posting Preston cuz I for one love your posts.  We’re not all in
the same situation as Paula-the great thing about this list is that there
are no rules on what you can and cant post!  I was gonna post about my
situation but I won’t now-I don’t want to be accused of bringing others
down.  I don’t know who Mickey Z?  I love both Burroughs work.  How are you
anyway?

Loads of love Hannah
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 2:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Hi there Paula and happy Thanksgiving right back attacha.
I don’t know who you are, never seen you post before, and I am really
irritated you bothered to post this reply to my post.
Who are you? Why are you bothering being a bitch to me personally?
What’s up with that?
So, you know what Paula? Please simply delete my messages from here on out
and put my email address in your “delete unread” folder so I don’t have to
worry about your bitchy, snotty, come outta nowhere replies.
Thanks kindly and have a great evening.
To the rest of you, peace and love, sincerely. I appreciate this list a
lot
and most of its participants- whom I consider for the most part my
compatriots and “companions” not to mention even a bit of a support group.
(And btw, do you even know who William S. Burroughs is Paula? How ’bout
Mickey Z.? Do you care? Or do you simply blurt out nastiness from
lurkerville at strangers on line for a hobby?) The lurkers who come outta
nowhere though, egad, what’s up with that personal animosity and
negativity?
Who is this person? Should I care?

Again, Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

> You know what you really need to lighten up….please…if your > downward
> spiral into despair requires companions I don’t think the rest of us
want
> to
> go there…we are trying to come up not drive ourselves deeper…use
some
> brain cells next time assuming there are a few left
> Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
> To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
> Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
> Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
>
>
>> Hi guys,
>>     A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just
>> sent
>> me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time >> idols
>> btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most
> positive,
>> happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on
>> anyway,
>> as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like >> it
> is,”
>> instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the
Bush
>> crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
>> Peace and love,
>> Preston
>>
>>
>> —– Original Message —–
>> From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
>> To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
>> Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer
>>
>>
>> “Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
>> destined to be shit out
>> through wholesome American guts.
>> Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
>> Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
>> Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
>> leaving the carcasses to rot.
>> Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
>> Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the
bare
>> lies shine through.
>> Thanks for the KKK.
>> For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
>> For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil
> faces.
>> Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
>> Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
>> Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
>> Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
>> Thanks for a nation of finks.
>> Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
>> You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
>> Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of
> human
>> dreams.”
>>
>> –William S. Burroughs (1988)
>>
>> (I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this
³prayer.²
> To
>> read it, please click here:
>> http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)
>>
>> And now for the bad news:
>> http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm
>>
>>
>> Peace and love,
>> Preston Peet
>>
>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
often
>> mistaken for madness”
>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>
>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>> Columnist New York Waste
>> Etc.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] more on visions while ibo’d
Date: November 27, 2004 at 10:06:37 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
I admit to a love of action movies, one that are high budget with lot of explosions and sci-fi spaceships and lasor fights and cool, unrealistic monsters (the psycho/slasher type flicks starring “monsters” who could be living right next door in real life- and other slasher/screamers too-  I HATE with a passion and won’t watch them ever), and spacetravel and adventure are my favorites.
With this in mind, I rented “The Chronicals of Riddick” yesterday, having been a “fan” of that bald guy, what’s his name, oh yeah, Vin Diesel, since playing his recent Riddick videogame (a great game btw, for those into videogames).
My jaw dropped when the opening 5 to 10 minutes of the movie played, more even, what with the attackers first destroying a planet, then the story moved on to the next threatened planet, with the citizens all discussing the forthcoming attack and potential death to all, including the whole durned universe.
Many of the actual scenes, not to mention the friggin’ plot itself, was right out of my first ibogaine voyage to the holodeck. The scenes of stars in space, multi-colored and ever so vast, totally jangled my ibo-nevers, setting off a distinct vibration as I watched the film, me feeling the ever so slight ibogaine buzz suddenly. This happens to me every so often, with films, and other things too, music and other sounds in particular, setting me off, both reminding me of certain feelings, sensations, and visions while on ibogaine and bringing forth a slight ibo vibration, a physical manifestation of the ibogaine experience. This is, as noted, very slight, but very real.
I just wanted to put that out there. That Chronicals flick totally was taken from one of my ibogaine visions. I mean it, it was startling just how similar the scenes playing (and the plot too as I’ve mentioned) were to what I saw and heared while traveling.
Have a great day all. I’d love to read some feedback on this.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
Date: November 27, 2004 at 10:01:24 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen,

How are you, kiddo???  It’s so great that you’re up
and around…how ya feelin’?  Day 12 is great- just to
let you know, it was around day 12-15 that I started
to come out of the thick of it.  I know time may seem
like it’s passing excruciatingly slow, but don’t
worry…the next thing you know, a whole month will
have passed, and you’ll be catching a train to Paris
or Barcelona.  If you hit Spain, make sure you check
out Gaudi’s architecture- it’ll blow your mind.

I second your idea about detoxing from heroin/short
acting opiate…methadone is a real heinous entity to
detox from- I mean, how can you truly feel better when
that shite lingers in your body for so long?  You’re
so lucky you have Sara to take care of you, as I
believe she really knows what she’s doing.  She has
given me a few excellent suggestions and healing
techniques.

Have you decided when you will venture out into the
world?  Europe is so lovely…if I were you, I would
head to the southern parts- there is nothing as awful
as shivering from the cold weather, when you are
‘shivering’ on the inside, if you know what I mean.

If you’re feeling really adventurous, why not venture
to somewhere exotic and gorgeous like Morocco?  You
can catch a ferry across the Gibraltar strait, and
boom- you’re in Northern Africa!!!  When I was in
Lisboa(which is also incredibly gorgeous), the only
thing keeping me from making the trek was my slim,
exhausted pocketbook…Do it Jasen, this is a perfect
time for you to travel…your mind is fresh,
unfettered, unencumbered by the haze of opiates..

Or how about Greece?  Filo pastry and flaming Ouzo
make for a lovely distraction…BTW, how much longer
are you planning to stay in Europe?  Do you have any
work deadlines?  When do you return to Aus?

My thoughts are with you on your journey.  The first
2-3 weeks are the hardest, but it DOES get better,
don’t worry.  Take care of your body and your mind…
And please drop me a line when you find the time….

love Julie 🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 27, 2004 at 9:56:42 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Paula wrote >But maybe a few limericks in between the burrough’s just
as a kind guesture to the frail personality I inhabit<

LOL,
Ok, yer right Paula, that would have been a good idea I guess (although I might have put them after or before), adding some lighthearted limericks or at least adding something cheerful because for sure the two links that came with the depressing angry poem weren’t that cheerful either. That said, I think I would have felt weird changing anything the master…errr, I mean, that darned drugaddled Burroughs had written. I’m not worthy.
;-))
Seriously, I apologize for reacting angrily to your note. It’s something I “swore” I’d work on constantly when first comingout of Ibogaine, feeling strongly the notion that I am the one that controls my reactions and how I deal with the world…hmmm, as I write this I remember this.
So, it comes back to self-kicking when I realize I had been thinking and feeling this so strongly not so long ago and now find myself right back in the hole of “should I, shouldn’t I, can I shoot it now, should I wait, should, should I should i…..” (I must say I’m not nearly doing the rates and amounts I was previously, and I’m having an inner argument each and everytime I do it unlike the total focus on shooting I was in before ibogaine.) I confuse myself a lot of the time and am not always in firm control as much as I’d like to be. So I do allow myself to get angry and upset and to feel other unnesseary and draining emotions and response that I would rather I not do.
Peace.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 3:27 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath

Thank you I’m not a lurker, I see you in my mind’s eye as a eurdite not sure
of the spelling there in a smoking jacket, dark hair, cravat, opium
pipe,fireplace, old fashion-typewriter kind of guy. the raven from edgar
allen poe…anyway did’nt mean to upset you but just the end of my week with
people that put themselves above the needs of my clients…and the first few
lines triggered a response that was more for the work I do than for your
post I apologize….But maybe a few limericks in between the burrough’s just
as a kind guesture to the frail personality I inhabit….Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 7:56 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath

Thanks Rachel,
Yes, I did miss her (the friendly and supportive Paula) introducing
herself to the list here.
I didn’t miss her extra-unfriendly and unsupportive note of yesterday
though, and as I had apparently missed her previous post(s) I did think
her
a lurker (but now see she’s a drinker, and from my own personal experience
find many -not all- drinkers the least friendly people I know, at least
when
they are “problem” drinkers, so perhaps I can put her oh-so friendly and
supportive response to my Burroughs note down to that). Thanks kindly for
setting me straight.
I wasn’t on a “tear” nor have I been on a “tear” in quite some time.
My
use patterns don’t involve “tears” (well, depending on how one prounounces
that word, as I do at time, more often than I care to, experience awfully
wet tears) or at the least haven’t involved “tears” as I myself would use
the term for almost 8 years now. I may very well have been “oblivious” but
when dealing with hundreds of emails every single day (no exaggeration
whatsoever), seeing as my “job” entails my being online all day every day
reading emails and other stuff too, I do occasionally miss a missive here
and there, so I apologize to you and to Paula for mislabling her a
“lurker.”
How about “new subscriber” or “new member of the ibogaine list” or “just
arrived recently to this list and doesn’t know me or many people here at
all
so far as I know so attacking me for posting a fairly normal, regular,
uncontroversial note considering the usual fare here is unusual and took
me
aback.” Does that fit better Rachel?
I also sincerely wish Paula luck and good vibes in her travails with
that nurse putting off her ibogaine treatment. But now I’m really
confused-
was Paula giving us a happy tale, or what? I mean, was her report about
the
ibogaine postponement somehow a happy, positive note, along with that
“depressing” 12-step relapse meeting mention?
I understand that people, myself included, can sometimes fly off the
handle and write really mean notes to strangers online, it being very easy
for some to do so what with the anonymity inherent in emailing others (and
for others who are simply mean people at heart), but I didn’t appreciate
her
little missive to me at all, and found myself really hurt by the
surprising
attack on me from someone I still consider a stranger. Why I let it hurt
me
so much I don’t know- perhaps I was simply tired and sore and in pain and
not at my best.
And now I feel really bad, in that I’ve now searched and found other
notes from Paula (a grand total of 4), and am very surprised and more
hurt,
in that she posted that really cool (and totally off-topic note- two out
of
4 posts are off topic? LOL! That’s helpful in my own quest for a better
life
and happier times) note the other day about the Nuclear Kittens needing
homes, the note I sent out to family and friends and fellow cat lovers all
over the world (having 9 of the little rescued beasties sharing our teeny
LES apartment here- so yes, that post was certainly helpful in my own
personal quest towards happiness and joy), and laughed very hard at when
first seeing. I had a real soft spot for the person that sent that,
automatically feeling real kinship towards anyone who posts positive or
funny notes about cats, but not knowing it was Paula who has done so, it
didn’t color my reaction to her nasty note of yesterday, and now that I
know
it’s the same person, I’m really bummed out that someone I actually had
been
thinking loving, friendly thoughts towards until yesterday has now totally
changed the impression I had of her, with just . Out of the four notes
she’s
so far posted that I can find in my box, one was a gripe about how
miserable
she is, one was an attack note towards me, one was that very funny and
appreciated kittens note previously mentioned, and now the “what the
bleep”
advert in which she makes some crack about brain cells. So as near as I
can
tell, to Paula it’s Paula who is important and the rest (well, that’s not
really true, it’s so far just me as near as I can tell) who have the gall
to
post something not so positive can take a hike, or something. I think it
very funny that two of her four notes to the ibogaine list so far posted,
replying directly to my own posts, have contained cracks about thinking
(one
directly and one obliquely) at me, a guy who uses his braincells for a
living. What is up with that?
I’m not that impressed at all.
But I do still wish her, very sincerely as hard as it might be for me
to
do so at the moment as irritated as I’ve let myself get over her notes and
attitude towards me personally, positive thoughts, best of luck in kicking
that alcohol habit, finding a room or help that won’t bum her out and will
give her the positive vibes she apparantly desperately needs, and genuine
love of the most friendly sort. Why she felt (and apparently still feels)
the need to attack me personally perhaps she’ll say, but it appears she
isn’t going to, but rather will make more cracks and snips at me instead
of
writing, “hey, you know what, I was feeling irritable so I lashed out and
I
apologize Preston,” or something along those lines. Instead she’s changing
the subject with a totally off-topic advertisment and continuing in her
unfriendly tone towards me.
Ahh, why am I bothering wasting my time and energy with this? Why do I
care what Paula thinks? I don’t actually, at least not much, but don’t
enjoy
meaness or hatred or anger either, so would like to resolve this little
disagreement and move on.
BTW, how is Jeff doing? I have been and still am sending him strong
thoughts and vibes, knowing how hard his current situation can be and
feeling for him all the way. He is to be commended and honored for taking
this step and deserves all the kudos he can take for having done this.
That
goes for you as well Rachel, in that anyone who stands by their loved one
through thick and thin, despite what we’re told we’re to feel about
druggies
and addicts by the mainstream prohibitionist types, is honorable and
beautiful and has my respect.

Peace and love to all,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 1:31 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] deep breath

> Paula is not a lurker.  Maybe you were on a tear and
> oblivous when she introduced us to her dilemma out in
> western Canada and the nurse who keeps putting off her
> ibo treatment, or the depressing 12-step group of
> relapsers.  But she is not coming out of nowhere.
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
> http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail
>
>
>
>
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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] video games!
Date: November 27, 2004 at 7:24:25 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oo oo I hear a whisper of video/pc gamers??
Well, will need something to counter the insomnia next week… what’s some good PC/PS2 games? My daughter has the latest grand theft auto but I’m an oldy, more into the Doom type games, and spewing cos I can’t afford Doom III, which looks awesome!!
Anyways, if you got any suggestions
Cheeeahhhhs
Kirk
From: Capt Kirk [mailto:captkirk@free.net.nz] 
Sent: Sunday, 28 November 2004 1:21 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s

I’m wondering then about switching to poppy seed a week or two before Iboga…..although that still leaves the question of pesticides. Cannot get heroin here, the most pure form would be opium from the plant itself…..but we turn that with AA……..
What would you others think would be the most natural substance to use before the Iboga experience?
(minus the 24-48 hour without)
Thanks!
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 11:40 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s

Hey guys,
I am still very exausted,it is day 12.
I now understand why when this Eboga is done,people don’t write much. They simply don’t have the energy.
Eboga seems to fine tune the body,to allow the body to vibrate to the same frequency as the Natural medicine,
Being Eboga.

I have been reborn,I am now all man. The eboga saves lost souls(addicted bodies) whethter the addiction is smoking,alchohol,
Drugs. Julie I miss you, we have a heartfelt connection.

Preston,for some reason,I am missing you and your misses,also Sean,and Randy.

I am so spritualy exausted.

I suggest to any one that can to go from heroin to eboga. Methadone is to much on the body,
It causes blockages in energy which in return makes you sick,Methadone is NOT natural. Heroin is.
To save the tortured souls,our souls,we need to put people on a heroin program then to eboga.

This has been 23 years for me,since I was 15,I am now 38.

Please write to me forward Sara ‘s email (TO JASEN).

I am so fuc ing bored. Julie write to me I need company,address to Sara’s.

Eboga causes you to withdraw on four plains(on four frequencies that tunes into our god self.
God save the world.

The relevations have become,rise up and claim whats yours.

You are puuuuure love you are of god.
Smiling still,Jasen.

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s
Date: November 27, 2004 at 7:20:37 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m wondering then about switching to poppy seed a week or two before Iboga…..although that still leaves the question of pesticides. Cannot get heroin here, the most pure form would be opium from the plant itself…..but we turn that with AA……..
What would you others think would be the most natural substance to use before the Iboga experience?
(minus the 24-48 hour without)
Thanks!
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 11:40 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s

Hey guys,
I am still very exausted,it is day 12.
I now understand why when this Eboga is done,people don’t write much. They simply don’t have the energy.
Eboga seems to fine tune the body,to allow the body to vibrate to the same frequency as the Natural medicine,
Being Eboga.

I have been reborn,I am now all man. The eboga saves lost souls(addicted bodies) whethter the addiction is smoking,alchohol,
Drugs. Julie I miss you, we have a heartfelt connection.

Preston,for some reason,I am missing you and your misses,also Sean,and Randy.

I am so spritualy exausted.

I suggest to any one that can to go from heroin to eboga. Methadone is to much on the body,
It causes blockages in energy which in return makes you sick,Methadone is NOT natural. Heroin is.
To save the tortured souls,our souls,we need to put people on a heroin program then to eboga.

This has been 23 years for me,since I was 15,I am now 38.

Please write to me forward Sara ‘s email (TO JASEN).

I am so fuc ing bored. Julie write to me I need company,address to Sara’s.

Eboga causes you to withdraw on four plains(on four frequencies that tunes into our god self.
God save the world.

The relevations have become,rise up and claim whats yours.

You are puuuuure love you are of god.
Smiling still,Jasen.

—
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Kirsty
Date: November 27, 2004 at 7:19:25 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I  am very much in my element here, specially when it comes to my “humour” being misunderstood. I was raised on a sheep farm, I’ve heard all dem jokes!
Once someone starts dictating what should be on a list, then it becomes “their” version of decency and not anyone elses, hmmm sounds something we’ve been fighting all our lives!!!  So far I like this list just the way it is……humour, good times, hard times, man that’s life!!
I read this in a book the other day and had a good ole chuckle:-
So, to all you philosophers out there:-
REALITY NEVER READ PHILOSOPHY!!!!!!
Keep it comin’ folks
It’s all good, bad and ugly.
(everyones ugly in real life, take a look inside anyones nostril)
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 10:55 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Kirsty

Kirsty, grass skirts and dirt huts? Man that sounds good. I know your kidding but everyone down south in the states goes barefoot and has a straw in their mouth and we won’t talk about the sheep. That is a joke. Sometimes I get misunderstood. Anyway, as they say in the rooms “we need em all”. Words of wisdom or reminders of what not to do we need them all. From now on I will think of the penguins Preston sent to us and try and refrain from verbal barbs. We ought to ask Patrick what he thinks ought to be on the list. I think I already know. He’s as twisted as most of here and I love him for it. O MY GOD. Help, I’m a Patrick groupie. I won’t screw him but I will twist up a fat one and hold a gun to his head and make him smoke it. Blueberry. I joke but what the hell, we all could use a laugh every once in a while. This list has been my saving grace. I think that is what Patrick has in mind. For me and you and everyone else who stumbles upon it.     Randy

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From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 27, 2004 at 7:15:16 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi,

Interesting topic and important in a healing context.

For me the problem with MDMA is that it opens up the heart regardless of the state of the persons inner world.

I did 3 intense MDMA journeys as part of a healing program and after the last I began to have severe depression which has now well and truely passed. It passed after I went into the details of my specific early life abuse experiences via eboga. I believe what happened is this.

I had spent a lifetime sitting on my inner history of trauma and abuse. Then I had an amazing eboga experience. Then I had the sessions with MDMA. I think, unlike eboga, MDMA indiscriminately opens us up. I think the eboga had begun to unravel me and whatever state of healing I was in (after the eboga), the MDMA cut right though me to connect with my inner self in ways I was not yet ready for (perhaps – I see it all as part of the journey now – luckily eboga was there to complete the work! I can never properly express the depth of gratitude and respect and love I have for eboga.). After, in this opened state and without the same set of defenses as before, I believe I was thrown into deep depression as I was not yet ready for the truth of what happened (and had to block it out along with the emerging pain) and at the same time I had lost my carefully constructed defenses built over a lifetime. Not to mention the depletion of serotonin in the initial stages of withdrawal from the MDMA.

Personally I caution against the use of any synthetic. I am not a big synthetic drug fan. I am however an ardent believer and user of eboga as a sacrament. It has passed the test of time (& the test of my own experience). Synthetics have not.

Yet I received incredible healing on MDMA and so believe its for the person to decide but one should be aware of its potential effects. Its certainly not good to take it repeatedly as the posts have indicated. However, judicious use with a time interval of no less than 3 months, can have minimal physical harm (I understand). It takes 3 months for the serotonin levels to return to normal from what I have read.

Similarly I am not a great fan of DMT from what I have read as I think its a shortcut to spiritual dimensions best reserved for those whose souls have been prepared for the experience. Otherwise the combination of ones own inner demons coupled with the doors which are been opened can lead to serious problems afterwards imo.

The idea that one can experience spiritual bliss without being prepared and without paying the piper is a dangerous one and one reason why many LSD heads ended up fu&/ed as they opened doors beyond their ability to close or to integrate.

Just a few thoughts….

Lee

Hannah Clay <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com> wrote:
Shit that was what I meant to say-I think it contributed to my depression and if I could change my past I wouldn’t have ever taken it due to the problems I have with depression now.  That said, I was on Antidepressants before I ever took E.  Or like Julie said I should have been careful and not taken the ridiculous amounts I did!  I wanted it cuz it made me feel so happy and that was alien to me.  Now I suffer and it could be cuz of it-now its making me sad?  Catch 22
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 10:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?

Tolerance to MDMA occurs very rapidly. The need to take more to achieve the same effect.

Taking X daily produces a mild speed effect without any of the pleasant tactile stuff the occasional X user may feel.

Chronic use of X may cause permanent depression by burning out the post synaptic seretonin receptor and/or the serotonin transporter.

I have seen several people who took X every day and they are fried for life. Years after they stopped, they appear to have no emotions. They look like early Parkinson patients.

like most drugs and like the golden rule of life… Moderation. A little can be a pleasant learning experience. A lot can take you to hell and in this case, leave you there.

PET scans of chronic X users (more then 300 dosages) show permanent brain damage similar to methamphetamine users.

http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality.

From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 27, 2004 at 6:17:04 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

: )when I’m really, really bored…I spin around in
circles with friends and kids and play drums loudly
and stomp feet : )  Good to see you writing on the
other side.  -J
— Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
THANKS randy.
I AM SOOO BORED,CANYOU GUYS COME OVER.
You are right about aftercare,there is a lot of work
to be done to heal the
world.
I realised something being over the other side of
the world,your vibratioal
frequencies tune into
Different parts of the world depending on where you
are born,which port hole
on earth through your mothers womb,life without
end,..a spiral,no beginning
and no end
So when you live away from where you were born,it
can feel as if everything
is twice as hard.Like you are going against the
grain..

IT MAY BE THE ONLY WAY HOWEVER IN CAN BE DONE IN A
MUCH BIGGER AND
BETTERWAY,IF GREED MOVED OVER A TRIFLE.
Sara’S is very affordable. Just fuc ing boring.
SORRY sara,I do love you and
you are a princess,the bwiti princess,her vibes hide
her princess
appearances as others see her,but I KNOW BECAUSE I
saw,SARA IS THE bwiti
PRINCESS.

Eboga must be taken naturally,to be effective on
every plain,to work on
every frequency the body neads to heal.WE ARE 4
DIMENSIOAL BEINGS and need
healing on all freqences. Science and Natural
medicine must work together.
Love you all Jasen.
_____

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
[mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com]
Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2004 12:32
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen you freakin’  ROCKKK. See. It’s the only way,
huh. Tell us more when
you can. How long are you going to be there? I’d
stay as long as I could if
I were you. Everybody was right about aftercare. It
sure makes me feel
better about everything.     Randy

___________________________________________________________
ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] visions
Date: November 27, 2004 at 6:03:22 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

visions have Anyone else ??

—  <thethird@myway.com> wrote:
Anyone else have visions
similar and any ideas that you get from them?

I did Ibogaine about a year and a
half ago. I had a big trip w/ lots of visuals,

<^> inspiring ones first
(i.e. this is what the world is
really about, now stop shooting dope and become one
with the world),
: ) <cherry flavored mind pops> : )
and then the fun house madness hit
(or madhouse fun) which was mixed with apathetic
speedy visions of humans doing all their worst
traits.
What didya see?

I went from shooting smack daily to being
totally clean for a month or two. But I still had
some crRav3nGgs and kidz knew that if I didn’t do
something
I’d be shooting up again and agin and agn.

Their is that something/ That ‘if I don’t do
something’ something.

I wanted to go on suboxone
(buprenorphine/naloxone mix) but the closest clinic
had a doctor that was almost but not quite
certified. So I went on methadone for a few months
at a low dose of 35 Mg’s, and then switched to
suboxone once the doc was certified, which I’ve been
on for over a year.

What dose?   Was the switch difficult?

At times I feel I failed because
I didn’t totally rewrite my addictive tendencies
after Ibogaine,

itz still better then nothing.  Their may or may not
be shades of gray between ‘failed’ and ‘success’.  I
personally don’t think you have failed, but I’m a
crazy person who’s current form of avoidance is the
on’line version of ‘hugging a stranger’.  But no, I
don’t think you have failed. (place product
advertisement here)

even though it brought about a major
change and helped me get to a life that could
actually be called a life.
it brought about a major
change and helped me get to a life that could
actually be called a life.  helped me get to a life

what made it life?   may not be as out of reach as
appears

I have panic attacks and
the suboxone helps with those, and the panic attacks
get worse
when
I am in
situations
where

I have to

speak
in front of a crowd.

That’s about as normal as you can get.  Non-judgmental
people are out in audience too.  They’re like rooting
you on and stuff.  They are ‘on stage’ with you, they
just don’t realize it.  “All the world is a stage” and
all that.
Panic attacks are yucky, they are one of the main
reasons I started Heroin in the first place.  Did you
have them before ibo too?  It takes some work, like
working out I guess but what I try to do in response
to that is work on learning how to rest during rest
time (relax time/let go time or whatever)_or… when
fear over takes logic, deep breaths can be nice, not
in a ‘oh g-d oh g-d I’ve got to breathe deep, I’m
having a panic attack’ way, but in a “At least SOME of
that which is beyond my 5 senses ISN’T out to get me.”
way. Almost to the point that G-d loves me or hates
me, before I realize that G-d has a few more important
matters to deal with, Why else wouldn’t s/he post?

—>   When I am going to school   <—
*that is a good thing

is when I have the worst bouts of panic attacks, and
I am getting ready to go back and finish my degree,

Give yourself some credit following through with that.
what are you getting your degree in?

so I think suboxone will help with that,

oh, I thought you were already on it.

but I don’t believe I want to be on it for life.

: )Going to live in the moment forever: )

So I am
thinking about how I should come off the suboxone.

<Paging Dr. Lotsof>

I’m interested in hearing anyone’s adventures with
doing follow-up Ibogaine treatments.

I had a intense dark hcl dose then a smaller extract
few months after to help grow out of the fear from the
previous, it helped.  I had plenty of benzo’s ready if
I needed them (I didn’t, but just knowing they were
there if needed made me feel more at ease), small
dose, no “dream”.

My first trip
was so intense that I don’t know if I could convince
myself to do it again, but I am definitely thinking
about it. Also, it’s been over a year since my first
trip and I find myself forgetting some of it.

Yeah I’m “quick to forget” too
<play sound of bong bubbles>

Does
anybody have a way to help remember the trip?

(refer to previous sound)

Another thing I wondered about was the
visuals/feelings in other people’s trips.

me too.

I know a
lot of people see the spiritual good stuff about why
we should stop doing drugs and start our life, but
how many of you guys saw bad aspects of humanity?

The two were connected.

I saw a small part of reality.  The story is still
being written, until…  But it can still be a life.
But yeah, life is perishable “unless it’s not”.

I
saw

people doing the
basest animalistic things,

Damn it!! everyone went to New Orl but me : )

things that when an
animal does them,

don’t seem as bad,

but because the
humans have the capability for higher emotions the
scenes were devastating.

Please, do tell…you really have me curious,
hmmm….where did I put that machine.

Also, the bad feeling I got
watching these visions was much worse than if I
wasn’t hallucinating.

Your right they do seem to have a bigger effect seeing
things that way, but I think seeing those things is an
opportunity to motivate to do our part to try to help
balance it out a little.

It’s like the sad feeling I
would get if I really saw some of that stuff happen
was highly amplified.
sometimes Avoidance=battery charger

Anyone else have visions
similar and any ideas that you get from them?

and any ideas that you get from them?
Sorry
about all the Pretty questions.? Pretty nosy for a
question!

I am just very interested in Ibogaine and

am excited
to find a place with people who like to talk about
it!
: ) me too.
—————————————

Jasen, A white candle burning now in Dallas for
wellness for you and all receiving this

Sean,   I think Less harm is good.

Callie,  : ) I don’t see anything wrong with it
either.

Randy, I think Bill W would have liked ibo.  But can’t
chat ’bout that, too busy drilling oil w/ JR and dem.
Drilling oil and Political redistricting, that’s all
we do round these parts…now lets go to the library
and rent us some movies.: )

Schoolboy, sincere thank you for the good info, it is
very much appreciated.

Lee,   You are very much an Amazing person who
deserves Grace.  You and ALL have my respect.

Oh and Re: Thanksgiving,
last year I was digesting an ibo session in jail with
leftover ‘done withdrawals.
This Thanksgiving, before going to a wonderful meal
enjoyed by family including two new baby’s, I started
the day with our sacred circle jerk and found
Preston’s post (that made me laugh out loud as I
hadn’t read that WSB [or heard it] in so long) was one
of many totally fucking awesome posts that morning
(not to say they aren’t always totally awesome
but…well yeah, I’m saying that.  I thought it was a
GREAT way to start off the day…but to each their own
I guess.  Now where did I put that machine? and what
the fuck did you do with my script pad?

_______________________________________________
kNow kidding.
Make home >  -11

___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 27, 2004 at 5:57:33 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

THANKS randy.
I AM SOOO BORED,CANYOU GUYS COME OVER.
You are right about aftercare,there is a lot of work to be done to heal the world.
I realised something being over the other side of the world,your vibratioal frequencies tune into
Different parts of the world depending on where you are born,which port hole on earth through your mothers womb,life without end,..a spiral,no beginning and no end
So when you live away from where you were born,it can feel as if everything is twice as hard.Like you are going against the grain..

IT MAY BE THE ONLY WAY HOWEVER IN CAN BE DONE IN A MUCH BIGGER AND BETTERWAY,IF GREED MOVED OVER A TRIFLE.
Sara’S is very affordable. Just fuc ing boring. SORRY sara,I do love you and you are a princess,the bwiti princess,her vibes hide her princess appearances as others see her,but I KNOW BECAUSE I saw,SARA IS THE bwiti PRINCESS.

Eboga must be taken naturally,to be effective on every plain,to work on every frequency the body neads to heal.WE ARE 4 DIMENSIOAL BEINGS and need healing on all freqences. Science and Natural medicine must work together.
Love you all Jasen.

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2004 12:32
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Jasen you freakin’  ROCKKK. See. It’s the only way, huh. Tell us more when you can. How long are you going to be there? I’d stay as long as I could if I were you. Everybody was right about aftercare. It sure makes me feel better about everything.     Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s
Date: November 27, 2004 at 5:39:43 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey guys,
I am still very exausted,it is day 12.
I now understand why when this Eboga is done,people don’t write much. They simply don’t have the energy.
Eboga seems to fine tune the body,to allow the body to vibrate to the same frequency as the Natural medicine,
Being Eboga.

I have been reborn,I am now all man. The eboga saves lost souls(addicted bodies) whethter the addiction is smoking,alchohol,
Drugs. Julie I miss you, we have a heartfelt connection.

Preston,for some reason,I am missing you and your misses,also Sean,and Randy.

I am so spritualy exausted.

I suggest to any one that can to go from heroin to eboga. Methadone is to much on the body,
It causes blockages in energy which in return makes you sick,Methadone is NOT natural. Heroin is.
To save the tortured souls,our souls,we need to put people on a heroin program then to eboga.

This has been 23 years for me,since I was 15,I am now 38.

Please write to me forward Sara ‘s email (TO JASEN).

I am so fuc ing bored. Julie write to me I need company,address to Sara’s.

Eboga causes you to withdraw on four plains(on four frequencies that tunes into our god self.
God save the world.

The relevations have become,rise up and claim whats yours.

You are puuuuure love you are of god.
Smiling still,Jasen.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Kirsty
Date: November 27, 2004 at 4:54:33 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kirsty, grass skirts and dirt huts? Man that sounds good. I know your kidding but everyone down south in the states goes barefoot and has a straw in their mouth and we won’t talk about the sheep. That is a joke. Sometimes I get misunderstood. Anyway, as they say in the rooms “we need em all”. Words of wisdom or reminders of what not to do we need them all. From now on I will think of the penguins Preston sent to us and try and refrain from verbal barbs. We ought to ask Patrick what he thinks ought to be on the list. I think I already know. He’s as twisted as most of here and I love him for it. O MY GOD. Help, I’m a Patrick groupie. I won’t screw him but I will twist up a fat one and hold a gun to his head and make him smoke it. Blueberry. I joke but what the hell, we all could use a laugh every once in a while. This list has been my saving grace. I think that is what Patrick has in mind. For me and you and everyone else who stumbles upon it.     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 27, 2004 at 4:16:59 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, listen to Eric. I know for a fact he is way versed on this. He made me feel a lot better before I did the Ibogaine and he was dead on with his information. Just about every major person in the Ibogaine world is talking to you. Listen to them. They got me the recovery that I have. It won’t be easy but you can do it. Ibogaine providers really care about people. Their souls included and I think all of the other modes of rehab forget about that. Except for 12 step programs which I highly recommend post Ibogaine. Just don’t talk about Ibogaine to a room full of old timer alcoholics. Although I think Bill W. would have loved this. It seems like it is almost time to make a move. I’m here for ya, drop me a line if I pissed you off. I really didn’t mean to.                   Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Hanna
Date: November 27, 2004 at 3:57:57 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hanna, I don’t know you but I read what you post and fantasize about being in England. I was reading what you said about trying to find a vein and it hurt me. Brought tears to my eyes. Your 23 and I’m 47 and I have to tell you that it doesn’t get any better. I first shot heroin on my 16th birthday and fell immediately in love with it. I have shot every drug I could find that I thought might remotely be like heroin and screwed my veins up in the process. I have to tell the nurses where to get blood or do it myself. Have you tried Ibogaine? I can’t remember if you said you have or not. Nothing else has stopped me for this long before. It changed my way of thinking. Your young and you sound like a beautiful person. Let me lay a little Nashville on ya. “Please don’t do the things I done”. “Don’t go out on another long run”. Can I write a song about you? I won’t use your name. I’m trying to complete a whole album of Ibogaine/recovery/addiction songs. I’ve almost got all the songs I need, but a story like yours has to told. I want it to have a happy ending. Please make it that way so I don’t have to feel bad every time I play it. You have moved me and inspired me to write.   Randy

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?
Date: November 27, 2004 at 1:59:42 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Heyyyy, if I Pole jump on my, um Moa (for those who don’t know, the Moa is a
New Zealand extinct ostrich type bird wot couldn’t fly..couldn’t run fast
enough either apparently……)we could meet up for a get together and grunt
mono syllables at each other.
I already like the people here, I don’t know anyone here really, so it’s
nice to have some company, and I’m glad to have found a chatty bunch!
Aroha (love) to all
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 3:56 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

LOL, Kirsty, We Canadians live in igloos and travel to
work by dogsled….EH!!!!!!!!!!!

Welcome to the list…there are many cool folks here,
a  conclusion which I’m sure you’ll arrive at in no
time….

cheers,
Julie

— Capt Kirk <captkirk@free.net.nz> wrote:

I’m not sure I understand what’s going on, but this
is an Ibogaine list, and
thus has Drug addicts writing on it, and double THUS
it aint all going to be
sweetness and light….which is great as far as I’m
concerned….variety is
the spice of LIFE!!!  Read what tickles ya wotsits
and what ya don’t like,
don’t read!! Is it not that simple???
Yool hafta excuse me, I’m jest a simple gal from
down under, we still wear
grass skirts and live in dirt huts!!!!
Keep it real kids
Kirsty

—–Original Message—–
From: Hannah Clay [mailto:hannah.clay@ntlworld.com]
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 9:42 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Please keep posting Preston cuz I for one love your
posts.  We’re not all in
the same situation as Paula-the great thing about
this list is that there
are no rules on what you can and cant post!  I was
gonna post about my
situation but I won’t now-I don’t want to be accused
of bringing others
down.  I don’t know who Mickey Z?  I love both
Burroughs work.  How are you
anyway?

Loads of love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 2:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Hi there Paula and happy Thanksgiving right back
attacha.
I don’t know who you are, never seen you post
before, and I am really
irritated you bothered to post this reply to my
post.
Who are you? Why are you bothering being a
bitch to me personally?
What’s up with that?
So, you know what Paula? Please simply delete my
messages from here on out
and put my email address in your “delete unread”
folder so I don’t have to
worry about your bitchy, snotty, come outta
nowhere replies.
Thanks kindly and have a great evening.
To the rest of you, peace and love, sincerely. I
appreciate this list a
lot
and most of its participants- whom I consider for
the most part my
compatriots and “companions” not to mention even a
bit of a support group.
(And btw, do you even know who William S.
Burroughs is Paula? How ’bout
Mickey Z.? Do you care? Or do you simply blurt out
nastiness from
lurkerville at strangers on line for a hobby?) The
lurkers who come outta
nowhere though, egad, what’s up with that personal
animosity and
negativity?
Who is this person? Should I care?

Again, Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for
enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation
Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’
thanksgiving/links

You know what you really need to lighten
up….please…if your downward
spiral into despair requires companions I don’t
think the rest of us
want
to
go there…we are trying to come up not drive
ourselves deeper…use
some
brain cells next time assuming there are a few
left
Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>;
<drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’
thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The
Seven Deadly Sins) just
sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is
one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it.
This isn’t the most
positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving,
but I’m passing it on
anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest
example of “telling it like it
is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by
our Boob tubes and the
Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger
pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of
challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and
to falsify until the
bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their
notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean,
pinched, bitter, evil
faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against
drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to
mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right,
let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were
a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of
the last and greatest of
human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that
incorporated this
3prayer.2
To
read it, please click here:

http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

=== message truncated ===

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 27, 2004 at 1:09:03 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/26/2004 5:53:05 PM Central Standard Time, hannah.clay@ntlworld.com writes:
Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!

Good luck to you Hannah and I will say a little prayer for you and add you to my mental prayer list.
Keep reminding yourself that you may have to deal with a little discomfort, physical and mental. I just hate mental discomfort! lol! Guess all of us opiate addicts hate it or we wouldn’t be addicted.
I have never tried Subutex. I am a Methadone Maintenance lifer I guess. I have finally decided that it is okay to be a lifer as long as it does not start being a problem.
Anyway…..back to you. I really hope you the best! If I were you I would start walking for exercise tomorrow too. Make it part of your Subutex treatment. Walking helps me a LOT! It is the only ‘exercise’ I do but it is very helpful with my depressions and lack of energy.
Keep us posted. This list is great support. Some awesome folk that reply!
Peace and Starry nights,
Callie

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 23:40:47 -0000 Issue 802
Date: November 26, 2004 at 11:09:25 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

same story
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 5:40 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 23:40:47 -0000 Issue 802

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801
Date: November 26, 2004 at 11:08:52 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

no program to open
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 10:06 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 26 Nov 2004 16:06:40 -0000 Issue 801

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 11:06:44 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks for the info, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Howard,
What i’ve heard from the few people who have come for treatment who have been doing klonapin as their primary benzo is that compared to the other benzos, klonapin didn’t give the same “kick” as the others and this may be why they were using so much more of it which may be the reason why it was more challenging to detox off during a week to ten days time.  Nowadays, and for the past few years, i keep people for several days, from seven to ten days if coming to detox from methadone.  A couple of people detoxed off of everything, cross addicted to methadone, heroin and different type of benzos, etc., and the  only drug which lingered was about half of the klonopin.  The other factor may be that my psychiatrist/shaman friend Bob believes klonopin may metabolise differently than valium and the other benzos.
I think Sara is set up to care for people for a longer time and Ron would do well to pay her and her cute and wonderful kids ( hi to you and your crew, Sara ), a visit.  I’d say, you can’t go wrong Ron..
Time for some pumkin pie,
Eric
From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.
Date: November 26, 2004 at 10:52:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i agree, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 7:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.
It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.
I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.
Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.
All the best to you and yours
Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kirsty
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 10:41:51 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

he has my respect, rwd
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 3:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Listen to Schmoolyboy Ron, he knows.         Randy

From: “” <thethird@myway.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] a few questions
Date: November 26, 2004 at 10:08:40 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I did Iboaine about a year and a half ago. I had a big trip w/ lots of visuals, inspiring ones first (i.e. this is what the world is really about, now stop shooting dope and become one with the world), and then the fun house madness hit (or madhouse fun) which was mixed with apathetic speedy visions of humans doing all their worst traits. I went from shooting smack daily to being totally clean for a month or two. But I still had some cravings and knew that if I didn’t do something I’d be shooting up again. I wanted to go on suboxone (buprenorphine/naloxone mix) but the closest clinic had a doctor that was almost but not quite certified. So I went on methadone for a few months at a low dose of 35 Mg’s, and then switched to suboxone once the doc was certified, which I’ve been on for over a year. At times I feel I failed because I didn’t totally rewrite my addictive tendencies after Ibogaine, even though it brought about a major change and helped me get to a life that could actually be called a life. I have panic attacks and the suboxone helps with those, and the panic attacks get worse when I am in situations where I have to speak in front of a crowd. When I am going to school is when I have the worst bouts of panic attacks, and I am getting ready to go back and finish my degree, so I think suboxone will help with that, but I don’t believe I want to be on it for life. So I am thinking about how I should come off the suboxone. I’m interested in hearing anyone’s adventures with doing follow-up Ibogaine treatments. My first trip was so intense that I don’t know if I could convince myself to do it again, but I am definitely thinking about it. Also, it’s been over a year since my first trip and I find myself forgetting some of it. Does anybody have a way to help remember the trip? Another thing I wondered about was the visuals/feelings in other people’s trips. I know a lot of people see the spiritual good stuff about why we should stop doing drugs and start our life, but how many of you guys saw bad aspects of humanity? I saw really depressing scenes, people doing the basest animalistic things, things that when an animal does them, don’t seem as bad, but because the humans have the capability for higher emotions the scenes were devastating. Also, the bad feeling I got watching these visions was much worse than if I wasn’t hallucinating. It’s like the sad feeling I would get if I really saw some of that stuff happen was highly amplified. Anyone else have visions similar and any ideas that you get from them? Sorry about all the questions. Pretty nosy for a newcomer! I am just very interested in Ibogaine and am excited to find a place with people who like to talk about it!

No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding.
Make My Way your home on the Web – http://www.myway.com

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 9:56:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LOL, Kirsty, We Canadians live in igloos and travel to
work by dogsled….EH!!!!!!!!!!!

Welcome to the list…there are many cool folks here,
a  conclusion which I’m sure you’ll arrive at in no
time….

cheers,
Julie

— Capt Kirk <captkirk@free.net.nz> wrote:

I’m not sure I understand what’s going on, but this
is an Ibogaine list, and
thus has Drug addicts writing on it, and double THUS
it aint all going to be
sweetness and light….which is great as far as I’m
concerned….variety is
the spice of LIFE!!!  Read what tickles ya wotsits
and what ya don’t like,
don’t read!! Is it not that simple???
Yool hafta excuse me, I’m jest a simple gal from
down under, we still wear
grass skirts and live in dirt huts!!!!
Keep it real kids
Kirsty

—–Original Message—–
From: Hannah Clay [mailto:hannah.clay@ntlworld.com]
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 9:42 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Please keep posting Preston cuz I for one love your
posts.  We’re not all in
the same situation as Paula-the great thing about
this list is that there
are no rules on what you can and cant post!  I was
gonna post about my
situation but I won’t now-I don’t want to be accused
of bringing others
down.  I don’t know who Mickey Z?  I love both
Burroughs work.  How are you
anyway?

Loads of love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 2:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Hi there Paula and happy Thanksgiving right back
attacha.
I don’t know who you are, never seen you post
before, and I am really
irritated you bothered to post this reply to my
post.
Who are you? Why are you bothering being a
bitch to me personally?
What’s up with that?
So, you know what Paula? Please simply delete my
messages from here on out
and put my email address in your “delete unread”
folder so I don’t have to
worry about your bitchy, snotty, come outta
nowhere replies.
Thanks kindly and have a great evening.
To the rest of you, peace and love, sincerely. I
appreciate this list a
lot
and most of its participants- whom I consider for
the most part my
compatriots and “companions” not to mention even a
bit of a support group.
(And btw, do you even know who William S.
Burroughs is Paula? How ’bout
Mickey Z.? Do you care? Or do you simply blurt out
nastiness from
lurkerville at strangers on line for a hobby?) The
lurkers who come outta
nowhere though, egad, what’s up with that personal
animosity and
negativity?
Who is this person? Should I care?

Again, Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for
enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation
Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’
thanksgiving/links

You know what you really need to lighten
up….please…if your downward
spiral into despair requires companions I don’t
think the rest of us
want
to
go there…we are trying to come up not drive
ourselves deeper…use
some
brain cells next time assuming there are a few
left
Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>;
<drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’
thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The
Seven Deadly Sins) just
sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is
one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it.
This isn’t the most
positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving,
but I’m passing it on
anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest
example of “telling it like it
is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by
our Boob tubes and the
Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger
pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of
challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and
to falsify until the
bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their
notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean,
pinched, bitter, evil
faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against
drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to
mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right,
let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were
a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of
the last and greatest of
human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that
incorporated this
ģprayer.ē
To
read it, please click here:

http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

=== message truncated ===

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 8:58:54 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m not sure I understand what’s going on, but this is an Ibogaine list, and
thus has Drug addicts writing on it, and double THUS it aint all going to be
sweetness and light….which is great as far as I’m concerned….variety is
the spice of LIFE!!!  Read what tickles ya wotsits and what ya don’t like,
don’t read!! Is it not that simple???
Yool hafta excuse me, I’m jest a simple gal from down under, we still wear
grass skirts and live in dirt huts!!!!
Keep it real kids
Kirsty

—–Original Message—–
From: Hannah Clay [mailto:hannah.clay@ntlworld.com]
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 9:42 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Please keep posting Preston cuz I for one love your posts.  We’re not all in
the same situation as Paula-the great thing about this list is that there
are no rules on what you can and cant post!  I was gonna post about my
situation but I won’t now-I don’t want to be accused of bringing others
down.  I don’t know who Mickey Z?  I love both Burroughs work.  How are you
anyway?

Loads of love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 2:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Hi there Paula and happy Thanksgiving right back attacha.
I don’t know who you are, never seen you post before, and I am really
irritated you bothered to post this reply to my post.
Who are you? Why are you bothering being a bitch to me personally?
What’s up with that?
So, you know what Paula? Please simply delete my messages from here on out
and put my email address in your “delete unread” folder so I don’t have to
worry about your bitchy, snotty, come outta nowhere replies.
Thanks kindly and have a great evening.
To the rest of you, peace and love, sincerely. I appreciate this list a
lot
and most of its participants- whom I consider for the most part my
compatriots and “companions” not to mention even a bit of a support group.
(And btw, do you even know who William S. Burroughs is Paula? How ’bout
Mickey Z.? Do you care? Or do you simply blurt out nastiness from
lurkerville at strangers on line for a hobby?) The lurkers who come outta
nowhere though, egad, what’s up with that personal animosity and
negativity?
Who is this person? Should I care?

Again, Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

You know what you really need to lighten up….please…if your downward
spiral into despair requires companions I don’t think the rest of us
want
to
go there…we are trying to come up not drive ourselves deeper…use
some
brain cells next time assuming there are a few left
Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just
sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most
positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on
anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it
is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the
Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the
bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil
faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of
human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this
³prayer.²
To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 8:30:55 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeh I got no problem with people enjoying drugs, it should be a human right
to experiment with their mind.
And like Preston, I just feel for those who got the monkey on their back wot
won’t get off!!  BEgone little minkey!!
Darn shame the devil had a part in creating drugs, that would be the painful
withdrawal part lol (actually I;m not a believer in heaven or hell, only the
ones we create..)
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 5:18 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?

Group, I’m sorry if I offended anyone by posting
pro-drug crap here.  I didn’t intend to set off
anyone’s triggers…just wanted to share my
metaphysical experience with people I like and care
about….<

I’m one person here who is not anti-drug Julie, not at all, I’m only anti
drug-problem. I have some suspicion that there are others here who feel
similarly to me.
;-0)))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?

Randy,

MDMA is a methamphetamine, lovey kind of drug.  It’s
virtually impossible to get physically addicted to,
but psychologically- that’s another story altogether.

Physical addiction is impossible, because each
successive XTC pill you take only has about a quarter
of the effectiveness of the previous one.  Thus, no
tolerance, no daily use is possible.  However, I have
met quite a few people who seem to be psychologically
addicted to X- they plan their whole existence around
their next roll.

I don’t intend to do a repeat of last weekend any time
soon.  I find the crash from XTC to be quite
exhausting.  I’m at the phase where casual drug use-
you know, using a drug as a ‘tool’ instead of as a
‘means’- is definitely more appealing to me.

Group, I’m sorry if I offended anyone by posting
pro-drug crap here.  I didn’t intend to set off
anyone’s triggers…just wanted to share my
metaphysical experience with people I like and care
about….

Julie

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Drugstore Cowboy
Date: November 26, 2004 at 8:26:43 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yehhhh dats the movie!! I have a terrible memory of late for names etc!!!
Thanks!
I’d have to watch it again as it’s been a few years since I saw it, and
yehhh perhaps it was some prophetic insight!
I cannae wait for my turn!
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, 27 November 2004 3:35 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Drugstore Cowboy

Kirsty,

I just watched Drugstore Cowboy a couple of days ago,
and was again struck by the line you mentioned…you
know, the Beats made some pretty crazy, yet uncannily
accurate predictions…wasn’t it Ginsberg who proposed
the cure for opiate addiction would come in the form
of a powerful, hallucinogenic type drug….?

Wonder if Burroughs ever heard about Ibogaine….??

Julie

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_ Hannah
Date: November 26, 2004 at 8:23:44 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hannah,
The shape you’re in right now has many many similiarities of where I was 4 months ago. The insanity of intellectually knowing you could be one shot from losing a limb or having a heart attack or checking out and still diving right in without so much as a glance back.  The morning after when I would do guilt and shame and regret over the damage I had physically done to my arms and hands as well as having to get up after 2 hours sleep to work a 10 hour day.  Also the guilt over all the money spent the night before and the complete waste of time and of a human life!  I would then go to work, have more cash and repeat the whole drama.  DRIVEN…..by something not of this world.  There were also some wedding pix I just got from my brothers wedding last June.  I was pretty much at my worse then.  First of all I am not even recognizable as the same person in the pix.  There was one picture of me sitting at a table in his backyard where I was in a nod.  It brought me back to remember that I stayed up all night shooting speedballs one after the other(as usual) and got only 2 hours (maybe) sleep before going to the airport at 6:00am with my mother.  I rationalized I would sleep on the plane.  The meet the other side of the family b-b-q was that same day at dinnertime.  I plan on blowing up that picture and putting it maybe on the wall inside my closet.  The rest of the pix at the wedding and reception (which were absolutely unique and soulful)  reminded me of how every second, minute, hour of that visit was socially,emotionally and physically gruelling for me. Having to wear long sleeves in 95 degree weather.  Having to go to my room for a nap when everyone else was at the pool.  Just in general feeling out of place and uncomfortable as a member of the human race.
As I mentioned in one of my previous posts, Someone was living this life for the last 20+ years but it doesn’t even remotely feel like it was me!!!
All I can say to you is Eboga, Eboga, Eboga. My heart goes out to you. I pray the universe intervenes for you as it did for me. You are 23, I can only imagine the possibilities.
I don’t know what subtex is, however I know H is the easiest to come off of or low doses of methedone.  Do what you feel you need to maintain some sanity today as I totally understand.  It’s what usually drives people to the programs to begin with.  What’s keeping you from doing a session?
I wish for you some clarity and a sense of purpose to inspire a course of action that is unencumbered by doubt, fear and an inacurate sense of self.
Call in your angels.  You never know,
Sincerely,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 6:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X and I’ve been on a few.  Its a bummer.

I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m 23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation, well I live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!

Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!  I want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear.  I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to just help me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like the music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always know where the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the clubs are all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.

The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but it isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But the pills just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m fucked I’ll still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.

I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.

Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as I woke up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it takes hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my artery so my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I felt like a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear the past week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.  My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself and what I consider normal now.

Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort myself out.  I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep doing this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs I had improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I had to go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like that definition of insanity, I am insane.

But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….

Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
Hannah

PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far more partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

> Hannah,
>
> you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
> some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
> Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
> Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
> notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
> gay guys know how to party !!
>
> I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
> interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
> taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
> by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
> just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
> answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
> is!!
>
> I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
> reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
> think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
> high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
> refer to the last sentence of the previous
> paragraph…
>
> love Julie 🙂
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
> http://my.yahoo.com
>
>
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>

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] correction
Date: November 26, 2004 at 7:03:02 PM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry I misspelled Burroughs name.  I guess I’ve been in new york too long!
Don’t mean any disrespect to the man.
Martee

From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 7:02:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Howard,
What i’ve heard from the few people who have come for treatment who have been doing klonapin as their primary benzo is that compared to the other benzos, klonapin didn’t give the same “kick” as the others and this may be why they were using so much more of it which may be the reason why it was more challenging to detox off during a week to ten days time.  Nowadays, and for the past few years, i keep people for several days, from seven to ten days if coming to detox from methadone.  A couple of people detoxed off of everything, cross addicted to methadone, heroin and different type of benzos, etc., and the  only drug which lingered was about half of the klonopin.  The other factor may be that my psychiatrist/shaman friend Bob believes klonopin may metabolise differently than valium and the other benzos.
I think Sara is set up to care for people for a longer time and Ron would do well to pay her and her cute and wonderful kids ( hi to you and your crew, Sara ), a visit.  I’d say, you can’t go wrong Ron..
Time for some pumkin pie,
Eric

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 7:00:33 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Shit that was what I meant to say-I think it contributed to my depression and if I could change my past I wouldn’t have ever taken it due to the problems I have with depression now.  That said, I was on Antidepressants before I ever took E.  Or like Julie said I should have been careful and not taken the ridiculous amounts I did!  I wanted it cuz it made me feel so happy and that was alien to me.  Now I suffer and it could be cuz of it-now its making me sad?  Catch 22
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 10:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?

Tolerance to MDMA occurs very rapidly. The need to take more to achieve the same effect.

Taking X daily produces a mild speed effect without any of the pleasant tactile stuff the occasional X user may feel.

Chronic use of X may cause permanent depression by burning out the post synaptic seretonin receptor and/or the serotonin transporter.

I have seen several people who took X every day and they are fried for life. Years after they stopped, they appear to have no emotions. They look like early Parkinson patients.

like most drugs and like the golden rule of life… Moderation. A little can be a pleasant learning experience. A lot can take you to hell and in this case, leave you there.

PET scans of chronic X users (more then 300 dosages) show permanent brain damage similar to methamphetamine users.

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 26, 2004 at 6:56:33 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I actually found a leaflet once at a rave that referred to people taking Prozac recreationally as a kind of weak MDMA (I’ll refer to it as X from now on).  Weird.  I’ve always found that ADs suppress the effects of X and I’ve been on a few.  Its a bummer.

I love going to raves but since I’ve been into H (the past 5yrs) (and I’m 23) I hardly go out at all.  Sean said something about isolation, well I live as a complete hermit at the moment and the more I don’t see people, the more I don’t want to see them.  Luckily I live with my boyf and we’re putting my partner in crime up at the moment so I have to see them!

Tomorrow will be Day 1 on Subutex and off H and crack so wish me luck!  I want to get going out again but I do find the come-downs hard without gear.  I’m trying to get hold of some Valium just so I have something to just help me chill out.  I don’t like raves without X though cuz I don’t like the music without!  On X I love Techno.  I’m lucky cuz some of my friends are travellers and know lots of squatters down London and they always know where the best free parties are 🙂  I live in a little town where the clubs are all crap ‘towny’ straight places with cheesy music.

The X powder is lovely cuz it isn’t speedy, just warm loveliness but it isn’t always great for partying cuz you just wanna sit down.  Then we mix it with speed (!).  When I first discovered X when I was 17 I thought it was the greatest thing in the world-I just couldn’t stop smiling.  But the pills just don’t do the same anymore-I don’t know if the pills are crap now or if you just get a tolerance real quick.  Then again, even when I’m fucked I’ll still claim I’m straight and need more-I’m just never satisfied.

I just wish I’d never tried H and I’d be in a VERY different position now.

Last night I did this mornings hit thinking I’d just score as soon as I woke up today.  Instead I slept all day so woke up really sick.  I call my dealer and nothing for a couple of hours so total panic.  Luckily a friend came over and sorted me out.  But my veins are non-existent so then it takes hours to get myself.  I thought I’d got it first time but hit my artery so my right hand swelled up and I was in agony.  Luckily a couple of friends were around to help but they tried for 2hrs and couldn’t get me-I felt like a pin cushion, in my hands, arms, neck, fingers, feet 🙁  I had to muscle-bang it in the end.  And since I’ve been doing rock and gear the past week I hadn’t showered or anything so was embarrassingly grubby.  My veins just wouldn’t give up any blood!  None of the women in my family can give blood cuz they can’t get blood out of us so I really chose the wrong profession!  Anyway so I’m sat there just thinking what have I done to myself?  Nowadays scoring is the easy bit-then I sit for hours covered in blood crying, I’ve got an abscess on my hand and I’m covered in lumps.  I remember sitting in this guys bedsit when I was 18 and totally against H.  My boyf at the time was doing it and the bedsit was so dirty-dog shit and old pins everywhere.  It stank so bad you had to hold your breath and breathe through your mouth.  I remember sitting there and thinking what am I doing here?  Now I am that guy.  I can’t believe what I’ve done to myself and what I consider normal now.

Anyway, it was like waking up in a nightmare.  I’ve got to sort myself out.  I just can’t believe I keep doing this to myself.  Why do we keep doing this?  I’ve hit rockbottom I really have.  And the last couple of yrs I had improved, I’d cut down and started socialising but the past couple of months I’ve been out of control.  I’ve been going in my fingers and when I had to go to A&E for my abscess the Doc told me I could easily lose my hands if I kept doing this. I can’t believe I know that and keep doing it!  Its like that definition of insanity, I am insane.

But I’m gonna try (again) to be clean.  After I’ve just had one more hit….

Love to everyone, you’re my inspiration.
Hannah

PS: Sorry Julie I’ve gone well off-topic!  Hopefully I’ll have far more partying tales in a few weeks and none of this shit. 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah

> Hannah,
>
> you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
> some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
> Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
> Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
> notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
> gay guys know how to party !!
>
> I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
> interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
> taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
> by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
> just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
> answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
> is!!
>
> I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
> reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
> think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
> high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
> refer to the last sentence of the previous
> paragraph…
>
> love Julie 🙂
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
> http://my.yahoo.com
>
>
>   /]=———————————————————————=[\
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>   \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Hannah: Re: deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 6:50:20 PM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have to admit I was taken aback by paulas response to the Boroughs poem. I saw it as an attack as it was aggressive and mean spirited. I sensed misplaced anger. I saw Prestons response more along the lines of defending off an attack, as I have never heard him like that as his primary form of communicating.
My first reaction was,”oh no she didn’t and how is she spokesman for what the “list” wants or doesn’t find acceptable?
My second reaction was to just let the two of them play it out.  Then when I saw the comment Hannah wrote re: not wanting to post her current dilema or topic because she “did not want to bring anyone down”, I knew it had gone beyond Dan Akroyd and Jane Curtin doing Point,Counterpoint.  Especially after Sean (hi) had commented on the importance and the impact this list had on him.
So Hannah please feel free to be forthcoming.  Having an opinion is different than attacking someone or trying to censor someone.  I have never known your posts to come anywhere remotely even in that same neighborhood.
There were no untruths at all in the Poem and NO I don’t believe (my personal opinion) that amusing limerics would go well in between the lines.  Lets leave editing to those who are really good at it!
Martee

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Drugstore Cowboy
Date: November 26, 2004 at 6:30:48 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

loved Drugstore Cowboy movie!

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Callie!!!
Date: November 26, 2004 at 6:29:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Awwwwww….thanks Julie! My working hours have changed until the first of year. I am here reading most posts….just not much time to reply!
Callie

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Schmoolyboy_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 5:54:08 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Schmoolyboy,

Oh my god, that is incredibly disturbing!  Personally, I could never take X everyday.  After about two days, my body/brain seem to reach a threshold, a saturation point if you will, after which ingesting more E seems pointless and redundant.  A waste of money and time.

I don’t like crystal, or tweaking at all, for that matter.  Same applies to coke- never got into the high-high-high-buzz-chatter-feel like superwoman-drink like Yeltsin- CRASH HARDCORE!!!- type of buzz.  I like drugs that make me feel warm, glowy, connected to my fellow man.  Interestingly enough, one of my friends seems to be able to achieve these feelings with methamphetamines- goes to show that individual neurochemistry and personal conditioning/imprinting has a lot to do with drug sensation.

How many years of daily use would qualify someone as a ‘chronic user’?  You said 300 tabs- but what if that amount is spread over a lifetime of usage?  Would these same stats apply?  And what of the E crash?  Serotonin depletion, or something else??

Thanks Schmoolyboy…are you a bio/chem/psych student?  It’s great having someone with so much pharmaceutical aptitude on this forum.

Julie  🙂

Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 5:14:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tolerance to MDMA occurs very rapidly. The need to take more to achieve the same effect.

Taking X daily produces a mild speed effect without any of the pleasant tactile stuff the occasional X user may feel.

Chronic use of X may cause permanent depression by burning out the post synaptic seretonin receptor and/or the serotonin transporter.

I have seen several people who took X every day and they are fried for life. Years after they stopped, they appear to have no emotions. They look like early Parkinson patients.

like most drugs and like the golden rule of life… Moderation. A little can be a pleasant learning experience. A lot can take you to hell and in this case, leave you there.

PET scans of chronic X users (more then 300 dosages) show permanent brain damage similar to methamphetamine users.

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ? Hannah
Date: November 26, 2004 at 4:37:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hannah,

you are sooooooo lucky…I’d love to get my hands on
some nice, clean powdered X…here, it’s all tabs.
Can we say cut, cut, cut, cut,..ad infinitum.
Whenever I party on Church St.(the local boyztown), I
notice I come across powder once and a while.  God,
gay guys know how to party !!

I find what you say about antidepressants+E very
interesting.  I was wondering if the SSRI I was
taking(quit 3 days ago) attributed to this experience
by prolonging the serotonin.  But, alas, I’m no doc,
just a pathetic drug enthusiast who thinks she has the
answers to everything- and then realizes how wrong she
is!!

I agree with you about “The Crash”- it’s the only
reason I wouldn’t call XTC ‘the perfect drug’.  I
think it’s related to the methamphetamine part of the
high, not the lovey, serotonin part.  But alas, please
refer to the last sentence of the previous
paragraph…

love Julie 🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:59:16 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I love MDMA though the pills in this part of the world aren’t what they used
to be (or is that just in my head?)  Unfortunately since I’ve been on
antidepressants I’ve had to take way more MDMA just to get the same effect.
We get good MDMA powder now and that seem cleaner than the pills-more luvvy
and not mixed up with speed and shit.  I have awful come-downs though and
really crave brown for the next couple of days-if I’m trying to be clean I
have to avoid MDMA totally cuz it makes my cravings so much worse,

Love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 2:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?

Randy,

MDMA is a methamphetamine, lovey kind of drug.  It’s
virtually impossible to get physically addicted to,
but psychologically- that’s another story altogether.

Physical addiction is impossible, because each
successive XTC pill you take only has about a quarter
of the effectiveness of the previous one.  Thus, no
tolerance, no daily use is possible.  However, I have
met quite a few people who seem to be psychologically
addicted to X- they plan their whole existence around
their next roll.

I don’t intend to do a repeat of last weekend any time
soon.  I find the crash from XTC to be quite
exhausting.  I’m at the phase where casual drug use-
you know, using a drug as a ‘tool’ instead of as a
‘means’- is definitely more appealing to me.

Group, I’m sorry if I offended anyone by posting
pro-drug crap here.  I didn’t intend to set off
anyone’s triggers…just wanted to share my
metaphysical experience with people I like and care
about….

Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:53:49 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m sorry your feelings were hurt by the snippy tone
to part of Paula’s post.<

LOL,
“Part?” No Rachel, Paula’s whole pithy post was snippy and rude.
But it’s over, so no worries.
Yes, I let her get to me. No I didn’t think about dominating her, I got angry and struggled not to curse her out, successfully I might add. Don’t know where that dominator thing is coming from at all, but again, that’s ok, no worries. Yes I could have reacted differently but didn’t so in my mind it’s done and now over, as noted.
Have a nice day all. Enjoy the show Rachel.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 3:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath

Hey Preston,

It was my stepson on the video game, not hubbalicious,
the Eboga-blessed ex-junkie, Jeff.

I’m sorry your feelings were hurt by the snippy tone
to part of Paula’s post.

I simply don’t like to see a dominator assert their
power over a lurker in such a way as to discourage
others in the ‘silent majority’ from sharing their
opinions.  Especially a male over a female, whatever
the transgenderality of your sexed body and its
various performances.  Someone who is articulate and
theoretically benefitting from an Eboga initiation
could easily take the higher road when it comes to
reacting.  Power over or power shared?  Buttons pushed
and putting people in “their” place??  Not a healing
maneuver, as far as I can think it out.

We’re off to go dance to some String Cheese in Camden,
NJ and travel. So probably won’t be back online until
mid-week.

One more post to the whole list and then I’m packing
for the road.

love, Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:41:42 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Please keep posting Preston cuz I for one love your posts.  We’re not all in
the same situation as Paula-the great thing about this list is that there
are no rules on what you can and cant post!  I was gonna post about my
situation but I won’t now-I don’t want to be accused of bringing others
down.  I don’t know who Mickey Z?  I love both Burroughs work.  How are you
anyway?

Loads of love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 2:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?

Hi there Paula and happy Thanksgiving right back attacha.
I don’t know who you are, never seen you post before, and I am really
irritated you bothered to post this reply to my post.
Who are you? Why are you bothering being a bitch to me personally?
What’s up with that?
So, you know what Paula? Please simply delete my messages from here on out
and put my email address in your “delete unread” folder so I don’t have to
worry about your bitchy, snotty, come outta nowhere replies.
Thanks kindly and have a great evening.
To the rest of you, peace and love, sincerely. I appreciate this list a
lot
and most of its participants- whom I consider for the most part my
compatriots and “companions” not to mention even a bit of a support group.
(And btw, do you even know who William S. Burroughs is Paula? How ’bout
Mickey Z.? Do you care? Or do you simply blurt out nastiness from
lurkerville at strangers on line for a hobby?) The lurkers who come outta
nowhere though, egad, what’s up with that personal animosity and
negativity?
Who is this person? Should I care?

Again, Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

You know what you really need to lighten up….please…if your downward
spiral into despair requires companions I don’t think the rest of us
want
to
go there…we are trying to come up not drive ourselves deeper…use
some
brain cells next time assuming there are a few left
Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just
sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most
positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on
anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it
is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the
Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the
bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil
faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of
human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this
³prayer.²
To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:27:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you I’m not a lurker, I see you in my mind’s eye as a eurdite not sure
of the spelling there in a smoking jacket, dark hair, cravat, opium
pipe,fireplace, old fashion-typewriter kind of guy. the raven from edgar
allen poe…anyway did’nt mean to upset you but just the end of my week with
people that put themselves above the needs of my clients…and the first few
lines triggered a response that was more for the work I do than for your
post I apologize….But maybe a few limericks in between the burrough’s just
as a kind guesture to the frail personality I inhabit….Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 7:56 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath

Thanks Rachel,
Yes, I did miss her (the friendly and supportive Paula) introducing
herself to the list here.
I didn’t miss her extra-unfriendly and unsupportive note of yesterday
though, and as I had apparently missed her previous post(s) I did think
her
a lurker (but now see she’s a drinker, and from my own personal experience
find many -not all- drinkers the least friendly people I know, at least
when
they are “problem” drinkers, so perhaps I can put her oh-so friendly and
supportive response to my Burroughs note down to that). Thanks kindly for
setting me straight.
I wasn’t on a “tear” nor have I been on a “tear” in quite some time.
My
use patterns don’t involve “tears” (well, depending on how one prounounces
that word, as I do at time, more often than I care to, experience awfully
wet tears) or at the least haven’t involved “tears” as I myself would use
the term for almost 8 years now. I may very well have been “oblivious” but
when dealing with hundreds of emails every single day (no exaggeration
whatsoever), seeing as my “job” entails my being online all day every day
reading emails and other stuff too, I do occasionally miss a missive here
and there, so I apologize to you and to Paula for mislabling her a
“lurker.”
How about “new subscriber” or “new member of the ibogaine list” or “just
arrived recently to this list and doesn’t know me or many people here at
all
so far as I know so attacking me for posting a fairly normal, regular,
uncontroversial note considering the usual fare here is unusual and took
me
aback.” Does that fit better Rachel?
I also sincerely wish Paula luck and good vibes in her travails with
that nurse putting off her ibogaine treatment. But now I’m really
confused-
was Paula giving us a happy tale, or what? I mean, was her report about
the
ibogaine postponement somehow a happy, positive note, along with that
“depressing” 12-step relapse meeting mention?
I understand that people, myself included, can sometimes fly off the
handle and write really mean notes to strangers online, it being very easy
for some to do so what with the anonymity inherent in emailing others (and
for others who are simply mean people at heart), but I didn’t appreciate
her
little missive to me at all, and found myself really hurt by the
surprising
attack on me from someone I still consider a stranger. Why I let it hurt
me
so much I don’t know- perhaps I was simply tired and sore and in pain and
not at my best.
And now I feel really bad, in that I’ve now searched and found other
notes from Paula (a grand total of 4), and am very surprised and more
hurt,
in that she posted that really cool (and totally off-topic note- two out
of
4 posts are off topic? LOL! That’s helpful in my own quest for a better
life
and happier times) note the other day about the Nuclear Kittens needing
homes, the note I sent out to family and friends and fellow cat lovers all
over the world (having 9 of the little rescued beasties sharing our teeny
LES apartment here- so yes, that post was certainly helpful in my own
personal quest towards happiness and joy), and laughed very hard at when
first seeing. I had a real soft spot for the person that sent that,
automatically feeling real kinship towards anyone who posts positive or
funny notes about cats, but not knowing it was Paula who has done so, it
didn’t color my reaction to her nasty note of yesterday, and now that I
know
it’s the same person, I’m really bummed out that someone I actually had
been
thinking loving, friendly thoughts towards until yesterday has now totally
changed the impression I had of her, with just . Out of the four notes
she’s
so far posted that I can find in my box, one was a gripe about how
miserable
she is, one was an attack note towards me, one was that very funny and
appreciated kittens note previously mentioned, and now the “what the
bleep”
advert in which she makes some crack about brain cells. So as near as I
can
tell, to Paula it’s Paula who is important and the rest (well, that’s not
really true, it’s so far just me as near as I can tell) who have the gall
to
post something not so positive can take a hike, or something. I think it
very funny that two of her four notes to the ibogaine list so far posted,
replying directly to my own posts, have contained cracks about thinking
(one
directly and one obliquely) at me, a guy who uses his braincells for a
living. What is up with that?
I’m not that impressed at all.
But I do still wish her, very sincerely as hard as it might be for me
to
do so at the moment as irritated as I’ve let myself get over her notes and
attitude towards me personally, positive thoughts, best of luck in kicking
that alcohol habit, finding a room or help that won’t bum her out and will
give her the positive vibes she apparantly desperately needs, and genuine
love of the most friendly sort. Why she felt (and apparently still feels)
the need to attack me personally perhaps she’ll say, but it appears she
isn’t going to, but rather will make more cracks and snips at me instead
of
writing, “hey, you know what, I was feeling irritable so I lashed out and
I
apologize Preston,” or something along those lines. Instead she’s changing
the subject with a totally off-topic advertisment and continuing in her
unfriendly tone towards me.
Ahh, why am I bothering wasting my time and energy with this? Why do I
care what Paula thinks? I don’t actually, at least not much, but don’t
enjoy
meaness or hatred or anger either, so would like to resolve this little
disagreement and move on.
BTW, how is Jeff doing? I have been and still am sending him strong
thoughts and vibes, knowing how hard his current situation can be and
feeling for him all the way. He is to be commended and honored for taking
this step and deserves all the kudos he can take for having done this.
That
goes for you as well Rachel, in that anyone who stands by their loved one
through thick and thin, despite what we’re told we’re to feel about
druggies
and addicts by the mainstream prohibitionist types, is honorable and
beautiful and has my respect.

Peace and love to all,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 1:31 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] deep breath

Paula is not a lurker.  Maybe you were on a tear and
oblivous when she introduced us to her dilemma out in
western Canada and the nurse who keeps putting off her
ibo treatment, or the depressing 12-step group of
relapsers.  But she is not coming out of nowhere.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:22:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee,

Thanks for the clarification.  This is Day 22 of the
Eboga eating process, so maybe that explains the
differing intensity.

Martee,

Could be the Zoloft getting in the way.  I think the
word was one or two days off of it before the Iboga
was enough to clear.

For now he’s gonna stick to fish oil, 5-HTP, and GABA
if we can find it.

Dancing tonight I am sure will help!  He’s started
taking the stairs instead of the elevator, and we’ll
check in with you when we get back next week.

Sean,

People love you, you have much love to spread.  I like
the “just for today” idea.  I can do something today
for 12 hours (or one hour) that if I had to imagine
doing for the rest of my life, I couldn’t handle it.
But for today I can.  Just for today.

Everyone,

Thanks for all the love and support.  We’re hitting
the road for at least a few days – String Cheese, my
mom, and our guru.

I’m no saint — used that “brain cells” line on him a
few times in the last weeks myself! — but yes I’ve
made some sacrifices for Jeff’s recovery that are
daunting – completely missed all my deadlines this
fall – no chapters finished, no articles sent out, and
no jobs or fellowships applied for.   Any of you
academics out there know what a horridly inconvenient
time this was to put all that work on the back burner.
But December is a new month.  And I feel profoundly
touched by the spirit of it all, which is energizing
in and of itself.

Thank Goddess for the sunshine today.

Blessings on all our hearts, minds, bodies, and souls,

love, Rachel

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:18:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

send me more about the one about…..always ready for humor …Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 11:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive

It makes me real nervous to be considered a success. I am 47 and my recovery is a minute by minute thing sometimes. I’ve been trying to get clean since my son was born in 85. That just ain’t successful. I am clean today because I do things on a daily basis to stay that way. If I falter I’m fucked. So here I am on the list doing what keeps me clean. The music is rocking and I dump here. It gets me by. Sometimes I send out snide remarks to those who send mean stuff to the list. It’s a short coming I must work on. But what the hell I’m still sick. Most of the time I’m trying to make someone laugh. It’s probably an ego thing. So those of you who get offended I am sorry. For those of you who get it. Have a laugh on me. I love everybody. I can look past the asshole-ishness in anybody. People do it for me. Life rocks and the music never sounded better. Did you here the one about…. never mind.   Randy

From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:07:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Preston,

It was my stepson on the video game, not hubbalicious,
the Eboga-blessed ex-junkie, Jeff.

I’m sorry your feelings were hurt by the snippy tone
to part of Paula’s post.

I simply don’t like to see a dominator assert their
power over a lurker in such a way as to discourage
others in the ‘silent majority’ from sharing their
opinions.  Especially a male over a female, whatever
the transgenderality of your sexed body and its
various performances.  Someone who is articulate and
theoretically benefitting from an Eboga initiation
could easily take the higher road when it comes to
reacting.  Power over or power shared?  Buttons pushed
and putting people in “their” place??  Not a healing
maneuver, as far as I can think it out.

We’re off to go dance to some String Cheese in Camden,
NJ and travel. So probably won’t be back online until
mid-week.

One more post to the whole list and then I’m packing
for the road.

love, Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:04:33 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/26/04 12:08:02 PM Eastern Standard Time, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:
Dear Jeff,

I’m glad to hear you’re doing well.  And guess what?
You’re going to feel incredible in a short while.  At
the 4-5 week mark, I was so energetic and elated I
could barely contain myself
Yes, yes yes I am hanging tough and am of the mind that this my last best chance OF STAYING OFF THE PROGRAM FOR THE REST MY LIFE.
it IS VERY FREEING TO THINK THAT NOW I HAVE NO HANDCUFFS ON KEEPING MY AT THE MOST A WEEK AWAY FROM MY PROGRAM i CAN NOW GO TO SOMEPLACE LUSH AND BEAUTIFUL LIKE COSTA RICA FOR A FEW MONTHS  I AM READY FOR SOME BIG CHANGES AND THANKINGYOUFOR YOUR KIND WORDS
Jeff SORRY FOR THE CAPS LOCKED FONT MY KEY BOARS ID FUCKED

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What the Bleep Do We Know! – The Movie
Date: November 26, 2004 at 2:29:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

did you really like it ..I’m hoping my poor ever-wonderful accepting husband will I am dragging him there with me tonight…I Reallly am hoping that he will feel energized after..Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: shelley krupa
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 7:46 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What the Bleep Do We Know! – The Movie

Hey Paula & list ,glad you posted about the movie & asooc books” what the bleep” .I saw this a coulpa weeks ago & it really hit the spot ,the post ibo spot!Glad to see so many people posting & in various stages of recovery.I cant emphasize how much acupuncture helps & still does post withdrawl & to keep tuned up!Its been 6 months since my last dose & been a real journey,I have used some & drank some ,but no habits or obsessions for self destrct mode ,Im so grateful to be alive & contributing to our planet, love yall -shell

Paula <paulab@shaw.ca> wrote:
I may not be a fan of burrough’s but i do have occasional use of my brain cells….here is something I thought might interested even the deep thinkers….Happy thoughts..Paula

Animation

> ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=What the Bleep Do We Know! – The Movie.url

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 2:19:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It makes me real nervous to be considered a success. I am 47 and my recovery is a minute by minute thing sometimes. I’ve been trying to get clean since my son was born in 85. That just ain’t successful. I am clean today because I do things on a daily basis to stay that way. If I falter I’m fucked. So here I am on the list doing what keeps me clean. The music is rocking and I dump here. It gets me by. Sometimes I send out snide remarks to those who send mean stuff to the list. It’s a short coming I must work on. But what the hell I’m still sick. Most of the time I’m trying to make someone laugh. It’s probably an ego thing. So those of you who get offended I am sorry. For those of you who get it. Have a laugh on me. I love everybody. I can look past the asshole-ishness in anybody. People do it for me. Life rocks and the music never sounded better. Did you here the one about…. never mind.   Randy

From: UUSEAN@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 12:19:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston and list,

Thanks for the support. One thing I do know post ibogaine is that I am never going to hide away from the world in my damn house like I was when I first got on the list. I am not going to let my using defeat me like that again. I think there was no recipe for disaster like that total isolation.  Again had I not found you all I may have killed myself.

Jeff: So glad you are feeling better and ibo treatment went so well for you. It was really cool meeting you and hanging on the Frying Pan.  And Rachel, thanks for the kind words. You are a real asset to the list.

Preston’s will get your number and thanks for the offer of help.

Julie: thanks for being there kid.

Callie:good to see you back, I think of you often.

Fake: welcome back.

Howard: you are the best.

Dana: hope to get over to Bleeker soon to talk.

The rest of you: this email will way too long if I don’t stop now.

Peace,
Sean

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 12:02:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Shelley,

Oh my god…I’ve never heard anything like that…When
I was 19, I used to party for five days straight, on a
mish-mash of crystal and MDMA…after about the fourth
or fifth tab of X, it not longer had any effect on me.
I was, in essence, just flushing my money down the
toilet.

Crystal, on the other hand, never failed to deliver
it’s crazy buzz- I could have literally tweaked for
weeks straight, had I wanted to.

I still maintain that MDMA is NOT physically
addictive.  Psychologically, ABSOLUTELY…The high is
just so incredible, it’s hard to let go of it.

I’m sorry to hear about your friend, and I hope he is
better now…

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – What will yours do?
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 11:55:52 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Jeff,

I’m glad to hear you’re doing well.  And guess what?
You’re going to feel incredible in a short while.  At
the 4-5 week mark, I was so energetic and elated I
could barely contain myself.  Don’t worry- the
lethargy and depression go away in due time….hang in
there…

Interestingly enough, the most lingering withdrawal
sensation was also in my lower legs!  I wonder why
that is…?

I wouldn’t be surprised if your urinalysis came back
positive for ‘done.  That shite can really linger,
can’t it?

I have been free from opiates for, er, a month and a
half, I think???  About two weeks behind Randy…  And
no cravings(well, for opiates, at least)!  I did
indulge this weekend a bit, but it was my birthday,
and I felt justified.

I wish you the best of luck and peace on your journey.
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 11:34:29 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/26/04 11:08:11 AM Eastern Standard Time, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:
BTW, how is Jeff doing? I have been and still am sending him strong
thoughts and vibes, knowing how hard his current situation can be and
feeling for him all the way. He is to be commended and honored for taking
this step and deserves all the kudos he can take for having done this. That
goes for you as well Rachel, in that anyone who stands by their loved one
through thick and thin, despite what we’re told we’re to feel about druggies
and addicts by the mainstream prohibitionist types, is honorable and
beautiful and has my respect.
Preston and all the list
Jeff here it is the morning after thanksgiving and my meal for the holiday was  just under 6 grams of Ibogaine. this was the third time i have done it the first being the stepping up to the major flood dose and totaled around 33 mg/kg i had avery wild sometimes nonsensical  ride it was great though it is not a good feeling i was never in any kind of withdrawals none to me this is simply mind boggling the power of this plant is ancient and is truly a gift of the oldest peoples and gods on the planet to me it felt like it was the first plant the father plant.
After the first session I did not seem to bounce back very much I was in a lot of discomfort and felt a constant level of exhaustion and withdrawals.  So we decided to do another mg 6 mg booster dose and it had virtually no effect I felt a mild body buzz but never heard the BUZZ that seems a common experience and never felt out of it or much else.
I was getting out everyday though even sitting in a restaurant was too much for me and  finally at about 2 weeks 2 days i woke up feeling way better. it was a small step but finally gave me something to grab onto. then yesterday i was feeling almost good  the love i felt for Rachel was overwhelming (and still is here) she has been a saint. being a person who has never done any powders of any kind she really has no frame of referee for it ans is still able to empathize and find it in her heart to care for me even when I was really negative a week or so after the first session.
So no I am 3 weeks and a day free of methadone but I still think there is some left in me somewhere I feel it’s presences an invading force in my calfs and I guess I will just have to deal I know the Ibo scrubbed me almost clean.
i am curious get the results of the piss test i left at my FORMER clinic who would have started me right back with 20 mgs of methadone the day we were there i simply know that this is it if i were to seek relief with methadone it would be a life sentence at 45 years old i know that to go through this again not a realistic possibility
so i am here  getting better and thanksgiving this year is one i will always remember as me gratefulest day yet. we all have so much to be thankful for being opiate free for the first time in over ten years is a miracle
praise eboga one our greatest gifts
Love all
Jeff

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 11:18:18 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Group, I’m sorry if I offended anyone by posting
pro-drug crap here.  I didn’t intend to set off
anyone’s triggers…just wanted to share my
metaphysical experience with people I like and care
about….<

I’m one person here who is not anti-drug Julie, not at all, I’m only anti drug-problem. I have some suspicion that there are others here who feel similarly to me.
;-0)))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 9:45 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?

Randy,

MDMA is a methamphetamine, lovey kind of drug.  It’s
virtually impossible to get physically addicted to,
but psychologically- that’s another story altogether.

Physical addiction is impossible, because each
successive XTC pill you take only has about a quarter
of the effectiveness of the previous one.  Thus, no
tolerance, no daily use is possible.  However, I have
met quite a few people who seem to be psychologically
addicted to X- they plan their whole existence around
their next roll.

I don’t intend to do a repeat of last weekend any time
soon.  I find the crash from XTC to be quite
exhausting.  I’m at the phase where casual drug use-
you know, using a drug as a ‘tool’ instead of as a
‘means’- is definitely more appealing to me.

Group, I’m sorry if I offended anyone by posting
pro-drug crap here.  I didn’t intend to set off
anyone’s triggers…just wanted to share my
metaphysical experience with people I like and care
about….

Julie

__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [DrugWar] Fw: New book on Drug Policy Reform
Date: November 26, 2004 at 11:14:43 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’s amazing. On one list I’m embroilled in a small flame match with someone telling me I need to think more (and kicking myself for letting it get me so riled), and yet, on my own DrugWar email list, I’m getting wonderfully warm notes like the following:

—–

Preston, I have never met you but I think I am in love with you! .

I just ordered your new book and I await it with baited breath. I am just
dying to read it!Maybe one day, if I ever have the opportunity to make the
trip I can meet you and get your autograph.

-Heather

“Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out
the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them,
and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows,
or with both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those
whom they oppress.”

From “War, Race and Elections”
By STAN GOFF
—–

Life is funny, eh? Twists, turns, and unexpected responses.
And to think I sometimes get myself so desperate and depressed that I think dark thoughts of suicide.
Egad. I’ve got to stop taking the negative types and my own worries so personally and so seriously.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Kenyanboa” <kenyanboa@pivot.net>
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 7:07 AM
Subject: Re: [DrugWar] Fw: New book on Drug Policy Reform

Preston, I have never met you but I think I am in love with you! .

I just ordered your new book and I await it with baited breath. I am just
dying to read it!Maybe one day, if I ever have the opportunity to make the
trip I can meet you and get your autograph.

-Heather

“Find out just what any people will quietly submit to and you have found out
the exact measure of injustice and wrong which will be imposed upon them,
and these will continue till they are resisted with either words or blows,
or with both. The limits of tyrants are prescribed by the endurance of those
whom they oppress.”

From “War, Race and Elections”
By STAN GOFF

—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 10:45 AM
Subject: [DrugWar] Fw: New book on Drug Policy Reform

Hi all,

Please excuse the shameless self-advertisement, or what may seem like
shameless self-advertisement, but I’m so pleased with Cliff’s reaction to
the book I just edited (which he is a contributor to btw, but I hope that
doesn’t detract from his review) I thought I’d forward it to you all.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: clifford thornton
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 5:40 AM
Subject: New book on Drug Policy Reform

Many of you have responded and said that the link provided earlier did not
work.  Well, I’m sorry about that.  Here is a new link and please if for
some reason this doesn’t work get back to me.

This book is for all people interested in injustice in this country. Most
if not all aspects of drug policy reform are represented in this book,
including race, asset forfeiture, prisons and a lot more.  I have an essay
in this book but more importantly this book provides a great cross section
of not only the argument but also many of the internal problems within the
drug reform movement.

This is for all students and teachers especially the broader public.  It
is
a great guide for students who want a full spectrum of drug policy.  It is
great as a teaching tool.  More importantly it can provide invaluable
information on the whats and hows of drug policy reform.  Teachers,
encourage your departments to bring this book to your libraries or use it
as
a core part of your curriculum. As always, you guys and gals have always
been an inspiration to me and our organization in all that we do.

Please view
http://www.disinfo.com/site/displayarticle6040.html
Under The Influence: The Disinformation Guide To Drugs :: Disinformation
::
The gateway to the underground – news, … [new window] [frame] [preview]

Clifford Wallace Thornton, Jr.

Efficacy
PO Box 1234
860 657 8438
Hartford, CT 06143
efficacy@msn.com
www.Efficacy-online.org

Working to end race and class drug war injustice, Efficacy is a non profit
501 (c) 3 organization founded in 1997. Your gifts and donations are tax
deductible

<]=———————————————————————–=[

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 11:00:40 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ahhh, I see Jeff is doing fairly well. The videogame idea was a good one for me too at time, although right after I did ibogaine I found I wasn’t at all interested, for a couple weeks at least, in sitting playing videogames. But for someone in Jeff’s position, having gone through so long a methadone habit, this is one of the better ideas for relaxing I could think of, having done exactly the same when I myself kicked methadone.
More power to you both.

Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 2:14 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive

Hey Sean, Glad to hear you’ve surfaced. Four days
clean is awesome man.  Keep it up.

Jasen, what did God’s beautiful face look like???

Fake, welcome back man.  Looking forward to more
details.

Here, Jeff’s taken another small booster – two 2.9
mg/kg an hour apart for 5.8/mg/kg total – and again
saying he’s not feeling it.  High expectations?
Dunno.  But no crickets, no buzz, nothing much.  He
knows he’s “under the influence of something” and is
quieter than he realizes after five hours.

His 18-year-old kid and I are stuffing our faces on
pumpkin bread and apple cider and glad we are 1)
playing Tony Hawk 3 (him) and 2) meditating in a room
with candles and Eboga (me) rather than struggling
with the larger family and all the traffic in Jersey.
Jeff just couldn’t deal with yawning and sneezing and
runny eyes at the table.  His mom knows something’s up
cuz we’ve been flaking on her for weeks now.  But he
knew he’d spill the beans so to speak if he went, and
doesn’t want to face that music yet.

lots of love, rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – You care about security. So do we.
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: Drug-Watch: Remote, Retroactive Intercessionary Prayer
Date: November 26, 2004 at 10:57:41 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “John French” <john.french@verizon.net>
To: <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 4:52 PM
Subject: Drug-Watch: Remote, Retroactive Intercessionary Prayer

I simply could not resist this one. I had missed it three years ago, so I am late examining the
“Effects of remote, retroactive intercessory prayer on outcomes in patients with bloodstream
infection: randomised controlled trial,” by Leonard Leibovici [BMJ 2001;323:1450-1451 (22-29
December)] The full text is on-line at:
http://bmj.com/cgi/content/full/323/7327/1450

The study leaves me almost at a loss for words. But the many Related Letters in BMJ further
down the page, and the even larger number of Rapid Responses further along renew my faith
in my God, science, and my fellow researchers.

The study randomly assigned about 3,400 decade-old case records of a certain infection at a
hospital into two groups: Intercessionary Prayer, and non-Prayer Controls. They then found
some folks (whose affiliations, religious or otherwise, were not given) to pray for the intercession
group, using their first names to personalize the process. They found significant differences
between the two groups on length of hospital stay (LOS) and length of fever. Here is what they
concluded:

“Conclusion: Remote, retroactive intercessory prayer can improve outcomes in patients with a
bloodstream infection. This intervention is cost effective, probably has no adverse effects, and
should be considered for clinical practice. Further studies may determine the most effective
form of this intervention and its effect in other severe conditions and may clarify its mechanism.”

Well…. as one letter writer pointed out, the scanty data on LOS given in Table 2 show that the
maximum time in treatment in the control group (320 day) was roughly double that for the
intercession group (165 days), thus a few anomolies undoubtedly caused serious harm to the
analysis. But the rest of the letters are gems of thoughtfulness and insight. Here’s one:

“As any student of Star Trek will tell you, the first rule of time travel is that you cannot change
the course of history, otherwise you get into an infinite regress.

“In the case of Leibovici’s study, if we accept that people can be made better by future prayer
or other intervention then [they] must have been made better at the first time of that
intervention, when they were ill.

“In which case it would then be impossible for them to be subsequently allocated to the
placebo arm of the study.

“That means this paper is not a randomised controlled trial.

“But then you knew that already !

Yours sincerely,
Dr John Hopkins”

Some other letters were more strictly scientific in their confrontations, and all make for good
reading and a good lesson in clinical research.

With this, I am going on vacation for a week, so I will not discuss a similar (but proactive) study
done by the Feds years ago of addicts in treatment, which found no significant differences,
perhaps because I prayed for the control group.

John French

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 10:56:18 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Rachel,
Yes, I did miss her (the friendly and supportive Paula) introducing herself to the list here.
I didn’t miss her extra-unfriendly and unsupportive note of yesterday though, and as I had apparently missed her previous post(s) I did think her a lurker (but now see she’s a drinker, and from my own personal experience find many -not all- drinkers the least friendly people I know, at least when they are “problem” drinkers, so perhaps I can put her oh-so friendly and supportive response to my Burroughs note down to that). Thanks kindly for setting me straight.
I wasn’t on a “tear” nor have I been on a “tear” in quite some time. My use patterns don’t involve “tears” (well, depending on how one prounounces that word, as I do at time, more often than I care to, experience awfully wet tears) or at the least haven’t involved “tears” as I myself would use the term for almost 8 years now. I may very well have been “oblivious” but when dealing with hundreds of emails every single day (no exaggeration whatsoever), seeing as my “job” entails my being online all day every day reading emails and other stuff too, I do occasionally miss a missive here and there, so I apologize to you and to Paula for mislabling her a “lurker.” How about “new subscriber” or “new member of the ibogaine list” or “just arrived recently to this list and doesn’t know me or many people here at all so far as I know so attacking me for posting a fairly normal, regular, uncontroversial note considering the usual fare here is unusual and took me aback.” Does that fit better Rachel?
I also sincerely wish Paula luck and good vibes in her travails with that nurse putting off her ibogaine treatment. But now I’m really confused- was Paula giving us a happy tale, or what? I mean, was her report about the ibogaine postponement somehow a happy, positive note, along with that “depressing” 12-step relapse meeting mention?
I understand that people, myself included, can sometimes fly off the handle and write really mean notes to strangers online, it being very easy for some to do so what with the anonymity inherent in emailing others (and for others who are simply mean people at heart), but I didn’t appreciate her little missive to me at all, and found myself really hurt by the surprising attack on me from someone I still consider a stranger. Why I let it hurt me so much I don’t know- perhaps I was simply tired and sore and in pain and not at my best.
And now I feel really bad, in that I’ve now searched and found other notes from Paula (a grand total of 4), and am very surprised and more hurt, in that she posted that really cool (and totally off-topic note- two out of 4 posts are off topic? LOL! That’s helpful in my own quest for a better life and happier times) note the other day about the Nuclear Kittens needing homes, the note I sent out to family and friends and fellow cat lovers all over the world (having 9 of the little rescued beasties sharing our teeny LES apartment here- so yes, that post was certainly helpful in my own personal quest towards happiness and joy), and laughed very hard at when first seeing. I had a real soft spot for the person that sent that, automatically feeling real kinship towards anyone who posts positive or funny notes about cats, but not knowing it was Paula who has done so, it didn’t color my reaction to her nasty note of yesterday, and now that I know it’s the same person, I’m really bummed out that someone I actually had been thinking loving, friendly thoughts towards until yesterday has now totally changed the impression I had of her, with just . Out of the four notes she’s so far posted that I can find in my box, one was a gripe about how miserable she is, one was an attack note towards me, one was that very funny and appreciated kittens note previously mentioned, and now the “what the bleep” advert in which she makes some crack about brain cells. So as near as I can tell, to Paula it’s Paula who is important and the rest (well, that’s not really true, it’s so far just me as near as I can tell) who have the gall to post something not so positive can take a hike, or something. I think it very funny that two of her four notes to the ibogaine list so far posted, replying directly to my own posts, have contained cracks about thinking (one directly and one obliquely) at me, a guy who uses his braincells for a living. What is up with that?
I’m not that impressed at all.
But I do still wish her, very sincerely as hard as it might be for me to do so at the moment as irritated as I’ve let myself get over her notes and attitude towards me personally, positive thoughts, best of luck in kicking that alcohol habit, finding a room or help that won’t bum her out and will give her the positive vibes she apparantly desperately needs, and genuine love of the most friendly sort. Why she felt (and apparently still feels) the need to attack me personally perhaps she’ll say, but it appears she isn’t going to, but rather will make more cracks and snips at me instead of writing, “hey, you know what, I was feeling irritable so I lashed out and I apologize Preston,” or something along those lines. Instead she’s changing the subject with a totally off-topic advertisment and continuing in her unfriendly tone towards me.
Ahh, why am I bothering wasting my time and energy with this? Why do I care what Paula thinks? I don’t actually, at least not much, but don’t enjoy meaness or hatred or anger either, so would like to resolve this little disagreement and move on.
BTW, how is Jeff doing? I have been and still am sending him strong thoughts and vibes, knowing how hard his current situation can be and feeling for him all the way. He is to be commended and honored for taking this step and deserves all the kudos he can take for having done this. That goes for you as well Rachel, in that anyone who stands by their loved one through thick and thin, despite what we’re told we’re to feel about druggies and addicts by the mainstream prohibitionist types, is honorable and beautiful and has my respect.

Peace and love to all,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 1:31 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] deep breath

Paula is not a lurker.  Maybe you were on a tear and
oblivous when she introduced us to her dilemma out in
western Canada and the nurse who keeps putting off her
ibo treatment, or the depressing 12-step group of
relapsers.  But she is not coming out of nowhere.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 10:48:53 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie I had a friend who did develop a tolerance to X & was doing a gram a day ,so ,guess anybodoy can go to far,intention is the ruler huh?

Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:
Randy,

MDMA is a methamphetamine, lovey kind of drug. It’s
virtually impossible to get physically addicted to,
but psychologically- that’s another story altogether.

Physical addiction is impossible, because each
successive XTC pill you take only has about a quarter
of the effectiveness of the previous one. Thus, no
tolerance, no daily use is possible. However, I have
met quite a few people who seem to be psychologically
addicted to X- they plan their whole existence around
their next roll.

I don’t intend to do a repeat of last weekend any time
soon. I find the crash from XTC to be quite
exhausting. I’m at the phase where casual drug use-
you know, using a drug as a ‘tool’ instead of as a
‘means’- is definitely more appealing to me.

Group, I’m sorry if I offended anyone by posting
pro-drug crap here. I didn’t intend to set off
anyone’s triggers…just wanted to share my
metaphysical experience with people I like and care
about….

Julie

__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What the Bleep Do We Know! – The Movie
Date: November 26, 2004 at 10:46:05 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Paula & list ,glad you posted about the movie & asooc books” what the bleep” .I saw this a coulpa weeks ago & it really hit the spot ,the post ibo spot!Glad to see so many people posting & in various stages of recovery.I cant emphasize how much acupuncture helps & still does post withdrawl & to keep tuned up!Its been 6 months since my last dose & been a real journey,I have used some & drank some ,but no habits or obsessions for self destrct mode ,Im so grateful to be alive & contributing to our planet, love yall -shell

Paula <paulab@shaw.ca> wrote:
I may not be a fan of burrough’s but i do have occasional use of my brain cells….here is something I thought might interested even the deep thinkers….Happy thoughts..Paula

Animation

> ATTACHMENT part 2 application/octet-stream name=What the Bleep Do We Know! – The Movie.url

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 9:52:57 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

For instance, I am 4 days clean now, but will most likely use this weekend.<

Suspecting I for one know exACTly what you’re going through here Sean, I can only say you are in my thoughts, and to urge you to be ultra-careful, please. I won’t make the common-sense suggestions, like, “is there anything else you can do to distract you,” or “what are you thinking?” Rather, as noted, I will only say be careful and let you know that if you need to talk, you can feel free to call me, or write, or whatever.
I think you have my number- if not, ask Mark or D. They’ll give it to you. But don’t feel obligated to call either, it’s ok and I won’t be offended if you don’t call. Just know that that option is there for you if need be.
;-)))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: UUSEAN@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 12:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive

Hi Fake and list,

I have learned a couple of things from hanging on this list, and with meeting some ibo people f2f. One is that the ibogaine community are among the kindest and accepting people I have met in a very long time.  One of the best things about doing ibogaine is the people in the ibogaine community.. Meeting Howard and his wonderful wife, Patrick, the human being form planet earth in New Orleans, the New York folk, John Freed, and the wider ibo world has changed my life.

Getting on this list changed my life as well. I was at my lowest when I found this list, and sometimes I think I would have been locked up somewhere if I had not.

Successes like are common, like Fake and Randy, and the many I have met and emailed with and chatted on the phone with for whom ibo unsprung from years of hellish dope addiction.  These folk have a real choice in their lives which was not there before.. Ibogaine really does work and work well for many people. In New Orleans I heard promising stats about how well.

For me, ibogaine has been a mixed bag.  I am not free addiction, although ibogaine has certainly reduced the some of the compulsiveness around my use. I really think that I am one though, who cannot turn to ibogaine for complete relief from craving. Craving and thoughts return real fast for me. As has been said over and over this ain’t no miracle pill, and nothing works equally well for everyone. That’s just life.

So I continue in my addiction although still greatly freed and open-minded toward change.  I have definitely reduced my harm, so ibogaine in the context of harm reduction makes great sense too. I have, though tended to withdraw somewhat form the aftercare community here in the NYC area as I still am using, and working it though more harm reduction and love and caring than with complete abstinence which still is not in my reach.

For instance, I am 4 days clean now, but will most likely use this weekend. I am reaching out though and not just giving up and isolating like I did in the past.  I do not feel hopeless.

I hope those celebrating Thanksgiving had a good one, and it still warms my heart to see the real successes on this list. As Patrick told me, though, I have a record too of how far I have come, it’s just that I have a long way to go yet.

Fake you rock, list y0u rock, and Patrick you are one cool mofo for keeping this list going.

Peace,
Sean

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 9:45:32 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

MDMA is a methamphetamine, lovey kind of drug.  It’s
virtually impossible to get physically addicted to,
but psychologically- that’s another story altogether.

Physical addiction is impossible, because each
successive XTC pill you take only has about a quarter
of the effectiveness of the previous one.  Thus, no
tolerance, no daily use is possible.  However, I have
met quite a few people who seem to be psychologically
addicted to X- they plan their whole existence around
their next roll.

I don’t intend to do a repeat of last weekend any time
soon.  I find the crash from XTC to be quite
exhausting.  I’m at the phase where casual drug use-
you know, using a drug as a ‘tool’ instead of as a
‘means’- is definitely more appealing to me.

Group, I’m sorry if I offended anyone by posting
pro-drug crap here.  I didn’t intend to set off
anyone’s triggers…just wanted to share my
metaphysical experience with people I like and care
about….

Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive- Sean
Date: November 26, 2004 at 9:38:41 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sean,

I’m so happy to hear from you….a lot of people on
this list were wondering about you and Callie, and
boom- you both show up again at the same time…

Very cool synchronicity…Don’t beat yourself up, we
all make slips now and then…Just keep reaching for
the stars(I know, that sounded cheezy), and if you
only reach the ionosphere, hey, you made it farther
than most other people!

love Julie

__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Drugstore Cowboy
Date: November 26, 2004 at 9:34:57 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kirsty,

I just watched Drugstore Cowboy a couple of days ago,
and was again struck by the line you mentioned…you
know, the Beats made some pretty crazy, yet uncannily
accurate predictions…wasn’t it Ginsberg who proposed
the cure for opiate addiction would come in the form
of a powerful, hallucinogenic type drug….?

Wonder if Burroughs ever heard about Ibogaine….??

Julie

__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Callie!!!
Date: November 26, 2004 at 9:32:35 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie,

It’s nice to see you back..quite a few people were
wondering where you were…

welcome home, baby,

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] What the Bleep Do We Know! – The Movie
Date: November 26, 2004 at 7:21:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I may not be a fan of burrough’s but i do have occasional use of my brain cells….here is something I thought might interested even the deep thinkers….Happy thoughts..Paula

Animation


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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] abstain from methadone for 72 hours
Date: November 26, 2004 at 6:35:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Rachel,
Full moon, no wonder I have been up again at 4 and 5:00 am the last few days. I thought I was past that faze of the ibogaine thing.  Glad to hear that you guys are still hanging in there.
Wasn’t it mentioned before that the antidepressant needed to be stopped 10 days before dosing.  Maybe that’s why he’s not feeling it.  As far as the intervals, I am no expert, but I remember Marc telling me when he did one of his boosters 10 days after his return from mexico, and I asked him did he have any visions, he told me he looked out of his window and saw the old city of Jerusaleum!  The sneezes lasted me a good two months.  I had to mentally reassociate the sneeze to iboga, and not to withdrawl.  Again,  for me pharmaceuticals and certain substances made me feel worse.  I think everyone is different, at this point there is no manual, and I had to take notice and personal responsibility for how my days progressed.
I had two, not too nice weeks afterwards, followed by 2 additional kick ass fatigue like I couldn’t believe weeks. But when I noticed even slight progress on a daily basis, I was ok.  Some days the progress would regress and then pick up again.
Two weeks prior to my session I went back on heroin and discontinued all methedone.  The night before my session, I felt like I literally felt the methedone drop from my brain.  I don’t know anyother way to describe it. I was given advice that this course of action may be best.  At the time I laughed and replied that physically, emotionally, legally, professionally,spiritually and most of all financially I thought I would be better off staying on the methedone.  Then I somehow decided to do this and it was no picnic. You see the convenience of having a bottle by your bedside in the am to drink and stay well vs running on that mission.
In hindsight I believe it was the best advice I could have been given. No matter what I felt went well or not in my session or recovery period, I have to say I am a million times better for.
I think at this point and time it helps to notice what personal cause and effect is being experienced and pass on the info for others so they can consider and apply it to their situation, or not.  All we have is each other in this regard.
Glad you were able to get a few cool grooves from this holiday.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 26, 2004 5:21 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] abstain from methadone for 72 hours

Is this why> I had so many problems > with residuals?
Randy, I’m wondering the same thing. But could also be
being men in their 40s with a lot of piper to pay for
all their years of phun.

Jeff are you seeing this?

Not yet, man, he’s in la-la land, finally fell asleep
eight hours after his last dose.  Wish I could do the
same, but this Full Moon energy has got me all revved
up.

__________________________________
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Yahoo! Mail – You care about security. So do we.
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From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 5:37:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel,

Sorry, I know you posted a list of Jeff’s treatment but I was wondering what has been the time lapse between the most recent ibogaine intakes as I find that too close together it starts to reduce its effectiveness significantly – in terms of the spiritual experiences at least.

The by-products of each journey suppress the effects of the next unless there is a reasonable time lapse and not too much build up of by-product from the previous session. Water, time, exercise… then another session. About 2 weeks minimum can be okay unless there is a burning issue. In which case focusing on the issue can bring it out like the puss in a boil.

The exception to all this is anger which seems to block the spiritual side of the experience to some extent but not fully.

LOL to you too

Lee

Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hey Sean, Glad to hear you’ve surfaced. Four days
clean is awesome man. Keep it up.

Jasen, what did God’s beautiful face look like???

Fake, welcome back man. Looking forward to more
details.

Here, Jeff’s taken another small booster – two 2.9
mg/kg an hour apart for 5.8/mg/kg total – and again
saying he’s not feeling it. High expectations?
Dunno. But no crickets, no buzz, nothing much. He
knows he’s “under the influence of something” and is
quieter than he realizes after five hours.

His 18-year-old kid and I are stuffing our faces on
pumpkin bread and apple cider and glad we are 1)
playing Tony Hawk 3 (him) and 2) meditating in a room
with candles and Eboga (me) rather than struggling
with the larger family and all the traffic in Jersey.
Jeff just couldn’t deal with yawning and sneezing and
runny eyes at the table. His mom knows something’s up
cuz we’ve been flaking on her for weeks now. But he
knew he’d spill the beans so to speak if he went, and
doesn’t want to face that music yet.

lots of love, rachel

__________________________________
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Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!

From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] abstain from methadone for 72 hours
Date: November 26, 2004 at 5:21:51 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is this why> I had so many problems > with residuals?
Randy, I’m wondering the same thing. But could also be
being men in their 40s with a lot of piper to pay for
all their years of phun.

Jeff are you seeing this?

Not yet, man, he’s in la-la land, finally fell asleep
eight hours after his last dose.  Wish I could do the
same, but this Full Moon energy has got me all revved
up.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 4:42:27 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, anyone who could read Burroughs and not get it is not worthy of stress. I got it. It was a poem for Gods sake. I bet she thinks Eminem is the Devil too. I think the only one who needs to lighten up is what’s her name. Stop me before I become asshole-ish and sarcastic. No don’t, this shit is too much fun. I await her next reply with a baited di…. aaaa breath. Makes me think off Ian Drury and the Blockheads for some reason. Hit meee.   Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 4:13:56 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Listen to Schmoolyboy Ron, he knows.         Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] abstain from methadone for 72 hours
Date: November 26, 2004 at 4:12:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Schmoolyboy, I only waited for 24 hours. Is this why I had so many problems with residuals? Jeff are you seeing this? What can a person do if they are already post Ibogaine and didn’t wait for 72 hours? Anything that will help with the side effects you are talking about? It is starting to look like the best route for methadone patients is to go to a short acting opiate for 2 weeks before the Ibogaine. Is this necessary? How about one week? More people could pull that off. I learn as you type.     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:53:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, I’m an old guy and I have never taken MDMA. Now back in the day I did all kinds of MDA. I did it for the Demerol or whatever opiate they used to make it. Does MDMA feel like it has an opiate in it? We called MDA the love drug because sex was great while under the influence. I may be wrong and there was more than one recipe but the stuff I was doing had Demerol, LSD, and speed in it. Does this MDMA compare with the old version? Be careful girl. If it is as fun as the old stuff I would be afraid my addiction would take over. I’ve read about it but I really don’t pay too much attention to what is said in the media about drug effects. To use a little Richard Pryor here, they told me heroin was the root of all evil and to never, ever, do it. I could not wait to do some heroin, they had been wrong about every other drug I had tried. Sick ‘aint I?               Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 3:33:43 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

M, I get on the list and the first thing I see is your post. It is so good to hear from you. I lost your Email address or I would send you a note off list. Please send it again. I would like to talk to you about your experience.  It gets better. The sleep will come. At least you don’t have to worry about getting any dope. It’s been about 2 months for me and things are so much better. Looking forward to hearing more.         Randy

From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 2:14:28 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Sean, Glad to hear you’ve surfaced. Four days
clean is awesome man.  Keep it up.

Jasen, what did God’s beautiful face look like???

Fake, welcome back man.  Looking forward to more
details.

Here, Jeff’s taken another small booster – two 2.9
mg/kg an hour apart for 5.8/mg/kg total – and again
saying he’s not feeling it.  High expectations?
Dunno.  But no crickets, no buzz, nothing much.  He
knows he’s “under the influence of something” and is
quieter than he realizes after five hours.

His 18-year-old kid and I are stuffing our faces on
pumpkin bread and apple cider and glad we are 1)
playing Tony Hawk 3 (him) and 2) meditating in a room
with candles and Eboga (me) rather than struggling
with the larger family and all the traffic in Jersey.
Jeff just couldn’t deal with yawning and sneezing and
runny eyes at the table.  His mom knows something’s up
cuz we’ve been flaking on her for weeks now.  But he
knew he’d spill the beans so to speak if he went, and
doesn’t want to face that music yet.

lots of love, rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – You care about security. So do we.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] deep breath
Date: November 26, 2004 at 1:31:39 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Paula is not a lurker.  Maybe you were on a tear and
oblivous when she introduced us to her dilemma out in
western Canada and the nurse who keeps putting off her
ibo treatment, or the depressing 12-step group of
relapsers.  But she is not coming out of nowhere.

__________________________________
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Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
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From: UUSEAN@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 26, 2004 at 12:24:36 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Fake and list,

I have learned a couple of things from hanging on this list, and with meeting some ibo people f2f. One is that the ibogaine community are among the kindest and accepting people I have met in a very long time.  One of the best things about doing ibogaine is the people in the ibogaine community.. Meeting Howard and his wonderful wife, Patrick, the human being form planet earth in New Orleans, the New York folk, John Freed, and the wider ibo world has changed my life.

Getting on this list changed my life as well. I was at my lowest when I found this list, and sometimes I think I would have been locked up somewhere if I had not.

Successes like are common, like Fake and Randy, and the many I have met and emailed with and chatted on the phone with for whom ibo unsprung from years of hellish dope addiction.  These folk have a real choice in their lives which was not there before.. Ibogaine really does work and work well for many people. In New Orleans I heard promising stats about how well.

For me, ibogaine has been a mixed bag.  I am not free addiction, although ibogaine has certainly reduced the some of the compulsiveness around my use. I really think that I am one though, who cannot turn to ibogaine for complete relief from craving. Craving and thoughts return real fast for me. As has been said over and over this ain’t no miracle pill, and nothing works equally well for everyone. That’s just life.

So I continue in my addiction although still greatly freed and open-minded toward change.  I have definitely reduced my harm, so ibogaine in the context of harm reduction makes great sense too. I have, though tended to withdraw somewhat form the aftercare community here in the NYC area as I still am using, and working it though more harm reduction and love and caring than with complete abstinence which still is not in my reach.

For instance, I am 4 days clean now, but will most likely use this weekend.  I am reaching out though and not just giving up and isolating like I did in the past.  I do not feel hopeless.

I hope those celebrating Thanksgiving had a good one, and it still warms my heart to see the real successes on this list. As Patrick told me, though, I have a record too of how far I have come, it’s just that I have a long way to go yet.

Fake you rock, list y0u rock, and Patrick you are one cool mofo for keeping this list going.

Peace,
Sean

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 11:48:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston,
Good choice in the tell it like it is dept.  Goes to show all the garbage that some are oppossed and disgusted  with is the same stuff that has been ongoing since how many hours or days was it after the original thanksgiving feast?
Creativity and expression can come from many places in us.  Have at it Preston, no matter where or what.  Freedom of expression doesn’t mean only if it’s pretty.
Respectfully,
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 9:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most positive, happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway, as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it is,” instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —– From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.² To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] borroughs
Date: November 25, 2004 at 11:13:37 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What an interesting human being that man was.  I haven’t read any of h is
stuff, just bits and pieces, although I played this weird PC game that had
his voice over in it… really out there stuff!!  And that movie he was in..
with wassis name..Matt Dyllon. That one scene when he predicted the drug war
and civil rights being taken away….onto it man, was burroughs.


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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 11:10:54 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/25/2004 8:57:42 PM Central Standard Time, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:
Instead, I’ll wish you a sincere happy holiday, and let it go.

Cool. Great reply Preston!

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 11:10:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thankx for this, Preston

I tend to agree with Borroughs.
_.dh

On Thursday, November 25, 2004, at 04:18 AM, Preston Peet wrote:

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of human
dreams.”

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 10:25:57 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Preston,
Sorry you got a negative on what sounded like a great day.  From my
experience I think it’s always easier to react to negative stuff, depending
on what we’ve learnt on the way…. usually lots of negativity, well just
look at the news to see what we are fed, which is why I don’t watch it!
I think it’s a matter of retraining ourselves…..and breaking old habits as
we ALLL Know here is hard!!
Just know you’re not the only one to react like this!
Hope you all had a good holiday….we just get Christmas here…which I feel
is more n enuff!
Luff lite n chocolate
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Friday, 26 November 2004 4:17 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Thank you Lee for the nice words.
Why is it that I at least (speaking only for myself) will see a number of
nice, positive notes, like yours, then get ONE, from someone I’ve never
heard of much less seen post, like this Paula person, and despite all the
nice words on and off list, I let the one super negative note affect me
most?
It’s like that with a lot of things in my life, the more negative, unhappy
vibes sent my way are the ones I often allow to affect me before I stop to
enjoy the positive ones. What’s up with that?
Ahh, I vent. I ate a lot more food than I have been lately, and am feeling
foggy and thick at the moment. I could use a bowl…oh, hold on, what do you

know, I just happen to have one too.
;-))

Which brings me to something which I have been experiencing in my sessions
with Eboga: War.<

I have to say this was something I too experienced a lot of visions of war
while under the influence of ibogaine.
Very scary scenes too. I didn’t think of them as much more than
generalizations of my own vibes and those of the world I live in- jnot
something that I was seeing that was “real” (other than for the scene where
I was in that battle in Najaf’s cemetary.)
Anyway, again, happy thanksgiving all, especially Faith and Paula.
;-0)))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 12:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi Preston,

Just want to say how much I enjoy some of your off topic posts.

I grew up as a boy an avid admirer of the US (Apollo / Music etc) but went
through college very much out of sympathy with the American establishment
particularly after I read about Chile and the overthrow of Allende.

However, the most recent posts (during the Presidential debate) have helped
me to distinguish between regular decent Americans and the not so decent
ones (who exist everywhere). It seems that even though the US is the richest

country in the world it is still a country with a lot of widespread
ignorance. Its a pity that education is not a priority in the US –
reflected in its budget. I guess a somewhat ignorant work force and a
consumer base is what makes the system “tick.” Not for long if your post is
anything to go by.

Which brings me to something which I have been experiencing in my sessions
with Eboga: War. I now find it appearing in my sessions from time to time.
In a recent session (while lying in my bed) I saw a soldier larger than
myself, march across my room in the midst of war. In other images I have
seen a completely wiped out city, nothing remaining but rubble, while tanks
and soldiers move slowly across this new open wasteland.

I am sorry to say but I believe things are going to get worse. I have also
seen water levels rising on low lying islands and environment destruction.

Many believe that such images are not to be taken literally. I believe it is

for the one who has them to decide whether they are to be taken literally or

not. I take them literally as either a warning or a future flash of where
things are going.

After having these images three thoughts came to mind:

1. Say “No” to war.
2. Leave the earth alone.
3. Fight the war inside before you fight the war outside.

Keep up the good work. Spreading information helps to fight disinformation.

Love & Peace

Lee

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.”
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks fo! r a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

! (I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.²
To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media
available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 10:17:19 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you Lee for the nice words.
Why is it that I at least (speaking only for myself) will see a number of nice, positive notes, like yours, then get ONE, from someone I’ve never heard of much less seen post, like this Paula person, and despite all the nice words on and off list, I let the one super negative note affect me most?
It’s like that with a lot of things in my life, the more negative, unhappy vibes sent my way are the ones I often allow to affect me before I stop to enjoy the positive ones. What’s up with that?
Ahh, I vent. I ate a lot more food than I have been lately, and am feeling foggy and thick at the moment. I could use a bowl…oh, hold on, what do you know, I just happen to have one too.
;-))

Which brings me to something which I have been experiencing in my sessions with Eboga: War.<

I have to say this was something I too experienced a lot of visions of war while under the influence of ibogaine.
Very scary scenes too. I didn’t think of them as much more than generalizations of my own vibes and those of the world I live in- jnot something that I was seeing that was “real” (other than for the scene where I was in that battle in Najaf’s cemetary.)
Anyway, again, happy thanksgiving all, especially Faith and Paula.
;-0)))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 12:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi Preston,

Just want to say how much I enjoy some of your off topic posts.

I grew up as a boy an avid admirer of the US (Apollo / Music etc) but went through college very much out of sympathy with the American establishment particularly after I read about Chile and the overthrow of Allende.

However, the most recent posts (during the Presidential debate) have helped me to distinguish between regular decent Americans and the not so decent ones (who exist everywhere). It seems that even though the US is the richest country in the world it is still a country with a lot of widespread ignorance. Its a pity that education is not a priority in the US – reflected in its budget. I guess a somewhat ignorant work force and a consumer base is what makes the system “tick.” Not for long if your post is anything to go by.

Which brings me to something which I have been experiencing in my sessions with Eboga: War. I now find it appearing in my sessions from time to time. In a recent session (while lying in my bed) I saw a soldier larger than myself, march across my room in the midst of war. In other images I have seen a completely wiped out city, nothing remaining but rubble, while tanks and soldiers move slowly across this new open wasteland.

I am sorry to say but I believe things are going to get worse. I have also seen water levels rising on low lying islands and environment destruction.

Many believe that such images are not to be taken literally. I believe it is for the one who has them to decide whether they are to be taken literally or not. I take them literally as either a warning or a future flash of where things are going.

After having these images three thoughts came to mind:

1. Say “No” to war.
2. Leave the earth alone.
3. Fight the war inside before you fight the war outside.

Keep up the good work. Spreading information helps to fight disinformation.

Love & Peace

Lee

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —– From: “Mickey Z.”
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks fo! r a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

! (I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.² To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 9:57:27 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

seriously, who the hell are you and what have you done with your life Paula? What gives with this fucked up note from you?
I’m amazed at how much power I’m giving you, but your note hasn’t done a thing to help lighten my mood at all. As a matter of fact, I’ve been feeling pretty good, having spent hours with lots of friends having lots of good vegan food for Thanksgiving, not contributing to hate, death or fear in the least bit today, but then I open up your note and allow myself to be really pissed off at you. This isn’t right, so suffice it to say I’m struggling with the urge to tell you all sorts of mean nasty ugly things but feel you are correct in that it’s no good trying to drag others down when I’m feeling angry or upset, so I won’t curse at you- even though I do really want to.
Instead, I’ll wish you a sincere happy holiday, and let it go.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

You know what you really need to lighten up….please…if your downward
spiral into despair requires companions I don’t think the rest of us want to
go there…we are trying to come up not drive ourselves deeper…use some
brain cells next time assuming there are a few left Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most
positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it
is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil
faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of
human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.²
To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT)what the fuc…?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 9:53:05 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi there Paula and happy Thanksgiving right back attacha.
I don’t know who you are, never seen you post before, and I am really irritated you bothered to post this reply to my post.
Who are you? Why are you bothering being a bitch to me personally? What’s up with that?
So, you know what Paula? Please simply delete my messages from here on out and put my email address in your “delete unread” folder so I don’t have to worry about your bitchy, snotty, come outta nowhere replies.
Thanks kindly and have a great evening.
To the rest of you, peace and love, sincerely. I appreciate this list a lot and most of its participants- whom I consider for the most part my compatriots and “companions” not to mention even a bit of a support group. (And btw, do you even know who William S. Burroughs is Paula? How ’bout Mickey Z.? Do you care? Or do you simply blurt out nastiness from lurkerville at strangers on line for a hobby?) The lurkers who come outta nowhere though, egad, what’s up with that personal animosity and negativity? Who is this person? Should I care?

Again, Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 7:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

You know what you really need to lighten up….please…if your downward
spiral into despair requires companions I don’t think the rest of us want to
go there…we are trying to come up not drive ourselves deeper…use some
brain cells next time assuming there are a few left Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most
positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it
is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil
faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of
human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.²
To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: FW: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 8:35:26 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sending again, it seemed to get lost in cyber space!
Spock, was that you messing up????
k
—–Original Message—–
From: Capt Kirk [mailto:captkirk@free.net.nz]
Sent: Friday, 26 November 2004 2:03 p.m.
To: ‘ibogaine@mindvox.com’
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ?

Hey there,
Well when I first heard about the tea, my partner and I were taking 2 and a
half cups in the morning and same at night.  We would measure out the seed
into an ice cream container, put about a  cap of concentrated lime juice on
it and mix, then boiled the jug, covered seed and rinsed twice.  It depends
on the person and their need for the high, but I was only using it to be
“normal” and not get a high. I managed to work for 4 years using the seed.
Lately though I have increased to 1 Kilo a day.  I heard of a guy who is on
4 kilo plus 80 mg of methadone a day!!! So, yeh all depends on the person.
Doing it the way we do also makes it easy to drink, the lime improves
flavor!
There’s a lot of people using the seed here in Dunedin due to a 6-9 month
waiting list for the methadone and a constant lack of any other drug.  Don’t
come to Dunedin if you’re looking for a constant supply lol.
Well, hope that helps you!
Kirsty


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.801 / Virus Database: 544 – Release Date: 11/24/2004


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.801 / Virus Database: 544 – Release Date: 11/24/2004

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 8:30:44 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

can you email me of forum on this? getting mixed info that could be dangerous, thanks for your concern and offer.\,R
—– Original Message —–
From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 11:36 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron and list,
The only substance i have not had success with treating with ibogaine so far has been with the long lasting benzos.  I have had success with detoxing off of 70 to 100 mgs.of short lasting benzos such as xanax and valium during a 2 and 3 day day protocol.  The long lasting ones are unbearable and require decreasing dosages very gradually over a couple to a few month time depending upon the quantity someone is doing.

Eric

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 8:26:50 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi paula:
hope it’s not me dragging everyone down. i’m just trying to survive . ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

You know what you really need to lighten up….please…if your downward
spiral into despair requires companions I don’t think the rest of us want to
go there…we are trying to come up not drive ourselves deeper…use some
brain cells next time assuming there are a few left Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most
positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it
is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil
faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of
human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.²
To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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[%]

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/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 8:24:15 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

god knows i need them and appreciate it. many thanks as i c/n do this alone. R
—– Original Message —–
From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 3:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hang in there. There are a lot of souls in your corner right now.

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
not far from mobile and am spending a quiet day with both parents, getting ready to shave pop now.  thanks for your concern
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
Talk to your father if possible, even if it’s seems that he cant’heard you and write to us .
Where are you located ?
God bless you
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

terrified, thanks for asking, father on death bed and ibo won’t work for a very dangerous situation i have place myself in. thank you for your concern and well wishes and prayer.  i d/n know if i will make it, peace , ron
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:16 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
How do you do now? Being praying for you.
Kindest regards
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.
It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.
I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.
Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.
All the best to you and yours
Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kirsty
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

—
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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ? Dear Kirsty
Date: November 25, 2004 at 8:08:27 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie,
See my other message for our seed recipe!!
We bought the seed originally from the supermarket, but then we got cheeky
and pretended to be a cleaning and catering outfit and bought straight from
the bakers supplier. Supermarket costs $7 per kilo whereas we were getting
it for $4 a kilo from the supplier and buying $25 kilo at a time.  Now it is
$6 a kilo.
Wow, they charge for methadone??? It’s free here!!
And yes, the withdrawal was as bad, and lasted 3 weeks also from the seed.
I’m looking at getting a homeopathic remedy for insecticide/pesticide
poisoning as this seems to be a big part of the suffering during detox.
As for benzos, well call me weird but I’ve always loved the hangovers for a
couple of days after!!  It seems to take me to a state I used to be when I
was straight…..wierd I know.  And weirder still I’ve never become addicted
to them.  They’ve just been a once in a while treat or a tool to use when
detoxing.  I guess ciggs and opiates are enough to contend with!
Kirsty

—–Original Message—–
From: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, 26 November 2004 5:10 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ? Dear Kirsty

Hi Kirsty,

Wow- you found the withdrawal from PT and
METHADONE(??) to be about the same?  Personally, I
have never found a drug that approximated the
discomfort I experienced from methadone- just the 2-3
week duration alone was too much to bear.  I wonder if
the seeds are difficult to digest, and thus get stored
in your body, taking a long time to break down and
excrete.  After 25 days of clean time, methadone was
still detected in my urine.

Most of my opiophile friends in Toronto use poppy bulb
tea, not poppy seed.  Do you use an acetyl group- like
lemon juice- to release the opiate?  What is your
recipe?  Will methadone really be cheaper than PT?  I
know here in Toronto an ounce of Papaver Somniferum
seeds retails for $3-5 dollars, while methadone ranges
from $5.50-7.25 PER DAY!

Also, benzos SUCK- I found weed more of a natural
relaxant/sleep-promoter.  There is nothing like waking
from a benzo sleep, feeling worse than you did the
night before.  Benzos interrupt your natural circadian
rhythms- it’s more like a blackout/coma than anything
approximating natural sleep.  I would rather get 3-4
hours of normal, multi-level sleep, than 8 hours of
comatose unconsciousness.

BTW, I like your handle.  My fave Star Trek has got to
be Voyager, but I dig the rest of them too.  Anyways,
greetings from Toronto, and best of luck.

luv Julie

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 8:02:51 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey there,
Well when I first heard about the tea, my partner and I were taking 2 and a
half cups in the morning and same at night.  We would measure out the seed
into an ice cream container, put about a  cap of concentrated lime juice on
it and mix, then boiled the jug, covered seed and rinsed twice.  It depends
on the person and their need for the high, but I was only using it to be
“normal” and not get a high. I managed to work for 4 years using the seed.
Lately though I have increased to 1 Kilo a day.  I heard of a guy who is on
4 kilo plus 80 mg of methadone a day!!! So, yeh all depends on the person.
Doing it the way we do also makes it easy to drink, the lime improves
flavor!
There’s a lot of people using the seed here in Dunedin due to a 6-9 month
waiting list for the methadone and a constant lack of any other drug.  Don’t
come to Dunedin if you’re looking for a constant supply lol.
Well, hope that helps you!
Kirsty


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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 7:53:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You know what you really need to lighten up….please…if your downward
spiral into despair requires companions I don’t think the rest of us want to
go there…we are trying to come up not drive ourselves deeper…use some
brain cells next time assuming there are a few left Pleeeeaaassseee…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most
positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it
is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil
faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of
human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.²
To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 5:11:40 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A friend had some 2c-i last weekend which is like a stronger 2c-b.  Its basically like E mixed with acid.  He tripped hi bollox off but said he still felt straight and in control.  It was powder form.

Sounds nice!
Hannah x
—– Original Message —–
From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 6:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?

Dear Julie,

Before I got into eboga I was interested in MDMA as a way to deal with childhood abuse. I had read that it can restore empathy in people who have become cut off. Anyway along came eboga before MDMA and so I did eboga and then by luck was introduced to an MDMA therapist in Germany with whom I did 3 guided MDMA sessions – pure MDMA about 150+mg with a 50 mg booster (off the top of my head).

I had amazing experiences. Although I found the physical after effects very tough. Mostly I drifted off somewhere ….. but I had experiences of spiritual entities and also physical healing where I saw the molecules joining together in my lower back where I had severe pain before. That area has been A ok since – if not perfect. That’s about 4 years ago.

I think the effects of MDMA depend on the set and setting and the persons motivation and where they are in that moment. Most do not report visuals.

Lee

Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi group,

I celebrated my birthday this weekend, and ended up
having a profound mystical experience. Yes, it
involved drugs; and NO, I don’t feel regret or guilt.

My boyfriend and I started by ingesting one tab of
MDMA, and ended up taking a few more over quite a few
hours, as we felt they were somewhat weak. Upon
ingesting the last pill, we retired to bed- my
boyfriend watching cartoons, and me, shutting my eyes
and relaxing.

About 20 minutes later, I started to experience some
incredible closed eye visuals, like nothing I had ever
experienced before. These were PURE neon-technicolor,
likened only to animation and possibly sunlight
filtering through stained glass. To make a long story
short, I have NEVER experienced anything like it, and
I have done my share of psychedelics. The visuals had
to be almost coerced, I had to concentrate to help
them ‘breakthrough’; but when they did, OH MI
GOD..they were so beautiful, so vivid and colourful,
that I had what could only be described as a
sensory/mind orgasm.

I’m wondering if these E’s were cut with something,
maybe MDA or 2C-B. I felt like I was tapping my
unconscious mind- like it was sending me info in
pictoral form. I had the realization that my
unconscious is, and always has been, storing ideas,
impressions and opinions in visual form (sans the
constructs of language or abstract thought), and that
this visual vocabulary somehow forms the basis of my
dreams. Some of my hallucinations seemed to strongly
favour this, but I won’t get into that right
now…Needless to say, I made peace with a few things
from my past…

Anyways, enough rambling…anyone had a psychedelic
experience on MDMA?

love Julie

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From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 4:37:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hang in there. There are a lot of souls in your corner right now.

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
not far from mobile and am spending a quiet day with both parents, getting ready to shave pop now.  thanks for your concern
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
Talk to your father if possible, even if it’s seems that he cant’heard you and write to us .
Where are you located ?
God bless you
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

terrified, thanks for asking, father on death bed and ibo won’t work for a very dangerous situation i have place myself in. thank you for your concern and well wishes and prayer.  i d/n know if i will make it, peace , ron
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:16 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
How do you do now? Being praying for you.
Kindest regards
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.
It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.
I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.
Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.
All the best to you and yours
Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kirsty
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

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From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 4:35:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie,

I am more than happy to chat off list and quite interested to get some insight into what you are experiencing in this area. I would have to go back to my notes on those experiences as I have tracked them as part of my journey for my writings.

I have to say though I am not so sure about MDMA’s effectiveness. I returned to eboga shortly after and have had very profound healing of specific abuse issues etc.via eboga. I probably do not have enough experience to pass serious judgement on MDMA but I do think all past trauma requires a deep reconnection which MDMA by its very nature (imo) excludes i.e. you dont feel the disgust of abuse on MDMA as it is very much a heart opening experience. Whereas on eboga I have felt deep disgust at what has happened to me and deep anger. Also deep pain. All very healing and liberating. With MDMA I guess it can have therapeutic benefit as it allows one to look without fear but that is not enough for a full cure imo.

Anyway, write me off list. Over the next 24 hours though I am pretty busy working with a friend.

Nice to connect with you and I enjoyed your description of death. Its nice to be able to look beyond the physical death to the continuation of the soul.

Lee
Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:
Dear Lee,

I totally agree with you! I believe MDMA(the purer,
the better) can impart to the user the ability to not
only vocalize, but also to deal with trauma. Isn’t
MAPS pushing to legalize MDMA for PTSD psychotherapy?

All I know, is that I have been somewhat afraid of
death my whole life, due to my mom dying when I was
young. This weekend, while on MDMA, I had the most
profound vision- I was immersed in a shallow pool of
mountain water, looking up at a ring of tall pine
trees, haloed by the Northern Lights. I can’t explain
how, but I knew I was dead, lying there in the water.
I felt at peace with the notion of my death for the
first time in my life. And a thought occurred to me:
Death is like a cool mountain stream that gently
passes over you..Needless to say, it blew my mind.

I have a feeling that what I ingested was NOT just
MDMA, but might have been boosted with a synthetic
psychedelic like MDA, or any of the 2-C family. My
boyfriend thinks it was MDME rather than MDMA, but I
have no clue. It was like experiencing the best of
the psychedelic experience-without the gut-rot,
paranoia, and occassional ‘creepiness’- with the calm
serenity of XTC. Brilliant!

I had many other visions, but I don’t want to bore
everyone here. I would love to hear some of your
experiences.. Wanna chat offlist?

Julie

__________________________________
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 2:31:56 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

not far from mobile and am spending a quiet day with both parents, getting ready to shave pop now.  thanks for your concern
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 12:48 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
Talk to your father if possible, even if it’s seems that he cant’heard you and write to us .
Where are you located ?
God bless you
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

terrified, thanks for asking, father on death bed and ibo won’t work for a very dangerous situation i have place myself in. thank you for your concern and well wishes and prayer.  i d/n know if i will make it, peace , ron
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:16 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
How do you do now? Being praying for you.
Kindest regards
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.
It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.
I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.
Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.
All the best to you and yours
Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kirsty
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

—
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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 2:22:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Lee,

I totally agree with you!  I believe MDMA(the purer,
the better) can impart to the user the ability to not
only vocalize, but also to deal with trauma.  Isn’t
MAPS pushing to legalize MDMA for PTSD psychotherapy?

All I know, is that I have been somewhat afraid of
death my whole life, due to my mom dying when I was
young.  This weekend, while on MDMA, I had the most
profound vision- I was immersed in a shallow pool of
mountain water, looking up at a ring of tall pine
trees, haloed by the Northern Lights.  I can’t explain
how, but I knew I was dead, lying there in the water.
I felt at peace with the notion of my death for the
first time in my life.  And a thought occurred to me:
Death is like a cool mountain stream that gently
passes over you..Needless to say, it blew my mind.

I have a feeling that what I ingested was NOT just
MDMA, but might have been boosted with a synthetic
psychedelic like MDA, or any of the 2-C family.  My
boyfriend thinks it was MDME rather than MDMA, but I
have no clue.  It was like experiencing the best of
the psychedelic experience-without the gut-rot,
paranoia, and occassional ‘creepiness’- with the calm
serenity of XTC.  Brilliant!

I had many other visions, but I don’t want to bore
everyone here.  I would love to hear some of your
experiences.. Wanna chat offlist?

Julie

__________________________________
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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 2:10:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee,

Talk about synchronicity!  My dreams, and my recent
psychedelic endeavours, have been saturated with
images of war/violence.  I think this is due in part
to the innundation of violent images on news programs.
Or, perhaps the collective unconscious is saturated
to the max with images of our fellow man being
murdered, tortured, humiliated, etc…….

Lee, I enjoy your posts too…they seem to have a lot
of heart, insight and mysticism.  Very cool…

Julie

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 1:58:46 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

spending quasi sober day with pop, shaving him, not feeling sorry for self.  grateful for the last go with him. tapering, but in layman’s methods, i.e. break a piece off periodically.  some pros got me scared of instant seizure and stroke. there’s no high for me out there. i have a tolerance for everything. thanks for responding on your day off and giving me hope.  i’m a fearful person.  you don’t have to tough love me to death, i above most others know i put myself here, am powereless and seek god’s loving prescence.  the chemicals keep me from feeling that and doing for others. right now it’s take care of folks, stay straight except for taper amount and do a good job or give my best game to clients.  thanks for your time. ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 12:13 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Man makes plans and God laughs. All will be well. Make peace with your dad- sober or not, tell him you love him, you will see him again , of that I am sure. You can help others today- right now

It will make you feel bettr and get you out of yourself.

When hings mellow out, I hope to meet you and refer you to that person who will do a very, very slow taper that you ask for.

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 1:48:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Ron
Talk to your father if possible, even if it’s seems that he cant’heard you and write to us .
Where are you located ?
God bless you
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

terrified, thanks for asking, father on death bed and ibo won’t work for a very dangerous situation i have place myself in. thank you for your concern and well wishes and prayer.  i d/n know if i will make it, peace , ron
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:16 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
How do you do now? Being praying for you.
Kindest regards
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.
It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.
I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.
Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.
All the best to you and yours
Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kirsty
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 1:16:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Please please do this… All Ibo takers should be of meth for 72 hours prior to Ibo. Switch to short acting opiates. Morphine, hydro or oxy , all work well. Dilaudid works well. You do not want any Meth on board when Noribo is around. Remember, the 1/2 life of meth is 24 hours. So 1/2 of todays dose is still there tomorro and 1/4 of 1st days dose is there on day 3.

Will Meth and nor compete for Mu and kappa sites? who knows.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 1:13:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Man makes plans and God laughs. All will be well. Make peace with your dad- sober or not, tell him you love him, you will see him again , of that I am sure. You can help others today- right now

It will make you feel bettr and get you out of yourself.

When hings mellow out, I hope to meet you and refer you to that person who will do a very, very slow taper that you ask for.

From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 1:05:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Julie,

Before I got into eboga I was interested in MDMA as a way to deal with childhood abuse. I had read that it can restore empathy in people who have become cut off. Anyway along came eboga before MDMA and so I did eboga and then by luck was introduced to an MDMA therapist in Germany with whom I did 3 guided MDMA sessions – pure MDMA about 150+mg with a 50 mg booster (off the top of my head).

I had amazing experiences. Although I found the physical after effects very tough. Mostly I drifted off somewhere ….. but I had experiences of spiritual entities and also physical healing where I saw the molecules joining together in my lower back where I had severe pain before. That area has been A ok since – if not perfect. That’s about 4 years ago.

I think the effects of MDMA depend on the set and setting and the persons motivation and where they are in that moment. Most do not report visuals.

Lee

Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi group,

I celebrated my birthday this weekend, and ended up
having a profound mystical experience. Yes, it
involved drugs; and NO, I don’t feel regret or guilt.

My boyfriend and I started by ingesting one tab of
MDMA, and ended up taking a few more over quite a few
hours, as we felt they were somewhat weak. Upon
ingesting the last pill, we retired to bed- my
boyfriend watching cartoons, and me, shutting my eyes
and relaxing.

About 20 minutes later, I started to experience some
incredible closed eye visuals, like nothing I had ever
experienced before. These were PURE neon-technicolor,
likened only to animation and possibly sunlight
filtering through stained glass. To make a long story
short, I have NEVER experienced anything like it, and
I have done my share of psychedelics. The visuals had
to be almost coerced, I had to concentrate to help
them ‘breakthrough’; but when they did, OH MI
GOD..they were so beautiful, so vivid and colourful,
that I had what could only be described as a
sensory/mind orgasm.

I’m wondering if these E’s were cut with something,
maybe MDA or 2C-B. I felt like I was tapping my
unconscious mind- like it was sending me info in
pictoral form. I had the realization that my
unconscious is, and always has been, storing ideas,
impressions and opinions in visual form (sans the
constructs of language or abstract thought), and that
this visual vocabulary somehow forms the basis of my
dreams. Some of my hallucinations seemed to strongly
favour this, but I won’t get into that right
now…Needless to say, I made peace with a few things
from my past…

Anyways, enough rambling…anyone had a psychedelic
experience on MDMA?

love Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 12:51:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston,

Just want to say how much I enjoy some of your off topic posts.

I grew up as a boy an avid admirer of the US (Apollo / Music etc) but went through college very much out of sympathy with the American establishment particularly after I read about Chile and the overthrow of Allende.

However, the most recent posts (during the Presidential debate) have helped me to distinguish between regular decent Americans and the not so decent ones (who exist everywhere). It seems that even though the US is the richest country in the world it is still a country with a lot of widespread ignorance. Its a pity that education is not a priority in the US –  reflected in its budget. I guess a somewhat ignorant work force and a consumer base is what makes the system “tick.” Not for long if your post is anything to go by.

Which brings me to something which I have been experiencing in my sessions with Eboga: War. I now find it appearing in my sessions from time to time. In a recent session (while lying in my bed) I saw a soldier larger than myself, march across my room in the midst of war. In other images I have seen a completely wiped out city, nothing remaining but rubble, while tanks and soldiers move slowly across this new open wasteland.

I am sorry to say but I believe things are going to get worse. I have also seen water levels rising on low lying islands and environment destruction.

Many believe that such images are not to be taken literally. I believe it is for the one who has them to decide whether they are to be taken literally or not. I take them literally as either a warning or a future flash of where things are going.

After having these images three thoughts came to mind:

1. Say “No” to war.
2. Leave the earth alone.
3. Fight the war inside before you fight the war outside.

Keep up the good work. Spreading information helps to fight disinformation.

Love & Peace

Lee

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent
me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols
btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most positive,
happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway,
as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it is,”
instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush
crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Mickey Z.”
To:
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.² To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Way, way off topic_Mystical Experience with MDMA + ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 12:31:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi group,

I celebrated my birthday this weekend, and ended up
having a profound mystical experience.  Yes, it
involved drugs; and NO, I don’t feel regret or guilt.

My boyfriend and I started by ingesting one tab of
MDMA, and ended up taking a few more over quite a few
hours, as we felt they were somewhat weak.  Upon
ingesting the last pill, we retired to bed- my
boyfriend watching cartoons, and me, shutting my eyes
and relaxing.

About 20 minutes later, I started to experience some
incredible closed eye visuals, like nothing I had ever
experienced before.  These were PURE neon-technicolor,
likened only to animation and possibly sunlight
filtering through stained glass.  To make a long story
short, I have NEVER experienced anything like it, and
I have done my share of psychedelics.  The visuals had
to be almost coerced, I had to concentrate to help
them ‘breakthrough’;  but when they did, OH MI
GOD..they were so beautiful, so vivid and colourful,
that I had what could only be described as a
sensory/mind orgasm.

I’m wondering if these E’s were cut with something,
maybe MDA or 2C-B.  I felt like I was tapping my
unconscious mind- like it was sending me info in
pictoral form.  I had the realization that my
unconscious is, and always has been,  storing ideas,
impressions and opinions in visual form (sans the
constructs of language or abstract thought), and that
this visual vocabulary somehow forms the basis of my
dreams.  Some of my hallucinations seemed to strongly
favour this, but I won’t get into that right
now…Needless to say, I made peace with a few things
from my past…

Anyways, enough rambling…anyone had a psychedelic
experience on MDMA?

love Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 25, 2004 at 12:17:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Fake Placebo,

Howard is right…sleep disorders are common among
recovering users.  My doc says it can take a few
months to normalize.  He also said that insomnia is a
driving force in returning to opiates- keep that in
perspective…

Be well, and heal thyself,

love Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 25, 2004 at 12:15:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Fake Placebo,

Glad to hear you are doing well…Ibogaine rocks, no?

Please post your experience as soon as you feel well
enough.  You’re from Turkey, right?  I’m interested in
hearing about drug use in Turkey also…

Cheers, and lots of love,

Julie, from Toronto

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 25, 2004 at 11:59:09 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/25/04 11:55:21 AM, fakeplacebo@hotmail.com writes:

Iboga realy works; I feel better day after day. But I’m steel weak and
to sleep is very dificult. I have no crawings or withdrawal. I will write
you total treatment story, it has started very bad but results are enough
good for me.

Superb!!  Always good to hear a good report.  But, then in my opinion there
are few bad reports.  Looking forward for your full report. Sleeping is often
difficult in drug dependent as well as, non drug dependent subjects.

Howard

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From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] I’m alive
Date: November 25, 2004 at 11:53:17 AM EST
To: “Summary” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey List,

Iboga realy works; I feel better day after day. But I’m steel weak and to sleep is very dificult. I have no crawings or withdrawal. I will write you total treatment story, it has started very bad but results are enough good for me.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ? Dear Kirsty
Date: November 25, 2004 at 11:09:32 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Kirsty,

Wow- you found the withdrawal from PT and
METHADONE(??) to be about the same?  Personally, I
have never found a drug that approximated the
discomfort I experienced from methadone- just the 2-3
week duration alone was too much to bear.  I wonder if
the seeds are difficult to digest, and thus get stored
in your body, taking a long time to break down and
excrete.  After 25 days of clean time, methadone was
still detected in my urine.

Most of my opiophile friends in Toronto use poppy bulb
tea, not poppy seed.  Do you use an acetyl group- like
lemon juice- to release the opiate?  What is your
recipe?  Will methadone really be cheaper than PT?  I
know here in Toronto an ounce of Papaver Somniferum
seeds retails for $3-5 dollars, while methadone ranges
from $5.50-7.25 PER DAY!

Also, benzos SUCK- I found weed more of a natural
relaxant/sleep-promoter.  There is nothing like waking
from a benzo sleep, feeling worse than you did the
night before.  Benzos interrupt your natural circadian
rhythms- it’s more like a blackout/coma than anything
approximating natural sleep.  I would rather get 3-4
hours of normal, multi-level sleep, than 8 hours of
comatose unconsciousness.

BTW, I like your handle.  My fave Star Trek has got to
be Voyager, but I dig the rest of them too.  Anyways,
greetings from Toronto, and best of luck.

luv Julie

__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 9:32:13 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I admit not hearing about strictly poppy tea alone, and am wondering how much seed it takes to make enough tea to feel. I used to drink poppy bulb tea, right after getting off methadone, and did have a problem when ending that little experiement with physical withdrawals, so understand your stress and withdrawals fears, but am curious as to that amount needed of seeds to be effective. Not that I’m even thinking of going that route myself (I hated the tea for the most part, but feeling I had to go through the bitter to get to the sweet, as it were, I continued drinking it for a good year at least) again, but could you please give us more info on this?
Thanks, and best of luck and thoughts your direction.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 2:02 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ?

Hi Rachel,
Thank you very much for your point of view, it is much appreciated. Several
reasons for switching:- cost, although not huge still big enough to matter:-
and a few months ago I had a bit of a meltdown and have been using more
seed, so I have decided to put it in the hands of the clinic and when I want
to decrease, it’s not entirely up to me to stick with it!!! Besides, I have
detoxed off both methadone and seed, there’s not much difference, and I
think that is mainly because of pesticides etc in the seed, would be an
interesting test to be drinking only organic seed, but availability and cost
would probably make this difficult!!
I have no problems with benzos so any discomfort after Ibo can be eased with
them.
I’m really looking forward to making the change from teenager to adult! I
missed that transition when I began my drug taking!
Thanks again Rachel, and all the best with you and Jeff.
Regards
Kirsty


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) fwd- burroughs’ thanksgiving/links
Date: November 25, 2004 at 9:18:35 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi guys,
A friend, Mickey Z (author of the new The Seven Deadly Sins) just sent me the following Burroughs poem, (Burroughs is one of my all time idols btw), along with the two links that follow it. This isn’t the most positive, happy note I’ve ever gotten on Thanksgiving, but I’m passing it on anyway, as it is a hard-hitting, brutally honest example of “telling it like it is,” instead of the crap we’re handed each day by our Boob tubes and the Bush crew and their supporters’ pipe dreams.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —– From: “Mickey Z.” <mzx2@earthlink.net>
To: <mzx2@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:27 PM
Subject: Burroughs: Thanksgiving Prayer

“Thanks for the wild turkey and the passenger pigeon
destined to be shit out
through wholesome American guts.
Thanks for a continent to despoil and poison.
Thanks for Indians to provide a modicum of challenge and danger.
Thanks for vast herds of bison to kill and skin
leaving the carcasses to rot.
Thanks for bounties on wolves and coyotes.
Thanks for the American dream: To vulgarize and to falsify until the bare
lies shine through.
Thanks for the KKK.
For nigger-killin’ lawmen, feelin’ their notches.
For decent church-goin’ women, with their mean, pinched, bitter, evil faces.
Thanks for “Kill a Queer for Christ” stickers.
Thanks for laboratory AIDS.
Thanks for Prohibition and the war against drugs.
Thanks for a country where nobody’s allowed to mind the own business.
Thanks for a nation of finks.
Yes, thanks for all the memoriesSall right, let’s see your arms.
You always were a headache and you always were a bore.
Thanks for the last and greatest betrayal of the last and greatest of human
dreams.”

–William S. Burroughs (1988)

(I wrote a Thanksgiving article in 2002 that incorporated this ³prayer.² To
read it, please click here:
http://www.zmag.org/content/Miscellaneous/z_givingthanks.cfm)

And now for the bad news:
http://207.44.245.159/article7364.htm

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jason, treatment report,
Date: November 25, 2004 at 6:14:06 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry Jasen, if I wrote Jason, it because it’s sounds like it.

Van: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Verzonden: donderdag 25 november 2004 9:18
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] Jason, treatment report,

Jason said:

“I kissed the face of God, and she was beautiful. Feeling fantastic, Iboga seems to concerted on addiction ,on a spiritual way,
If you withdrawn from Heroin or any other crutch an believe you are not addicted any more , there is the spiritual side to encounter,
You must be healed spiritually by Iboga,
Spiritually exhaustion.”

Blessings  to all,

Sara

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jason, treatment report,
Date: November 25, 2004 at 3:18:02 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jason said:

“I kissed the face of God, and she was beautiful. Feeling fantastic, Iboga seems to concerted on addiction ,on a spiritual way,
If you withdrawn from Heroin or any other crutch an believe you are not addicted any more , there is the spiritual side to encounter,
You must be healed spiritually by Iboga,
Spiritually exhaustion.”

Blessings  to all,

Sara

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 2:32:42 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i hear the short acting ones are most difficult to taper, e.g. xanex, ativan rd
—– Original Message —– From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2004 12:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

In a message dated 11/25/04 12:37:38 AM, IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com writes:

<< The long lasting ones are
unbearable and require decreasing dosages very gradually over a couple to a
few month
time depending upon the quantity someone is doing. >>

Hi Eric,

Which benzos are you classifying as long lasting? Thanks

Howard

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 2:30:24 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thank you for the kind words. this is my first go around with death in the family. ron
—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 10:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Dealing with the death (or pending death) of a parent is one of the toughest challenges I’ve had to face. One cannot completely prepare for the emotions and feelings that surface (with a timeline and mind of their own). My Mom passed 4 years ago, and yes addiction killed her. alcohol, pain meds and an abusive husband (the prior in response to the latter). She died of a brain hemmorage (sic) that resulted from an all out drunken tumble down the staircase, which was the finale to a 4 week bender of ingesting nothing much besides straight Vodka, painkillers and copius amounts of her blood thining medication Cumadin (sic). Her heart was also shot from several decades of drinking -thus the blood thinner and pacemaker (Vodka and Dilaudid was her favorite). The blood thinner only made the hemoraging worse.

I still find myself being very, very upset. I flew back in time to see her alive in the hospital, and it was a ghastly affair. she was a total mess. couldn’t speak, but she could see us and hear us. Unfortunately that is my lasting impression of her, all hooked up to IV’s and Monitors, one humongus bruise the entire length of her face. My father in ignorant denial, telling us she is going to be OK, she just had a little fall, the doctor standing by with no comment. Dad had his blinders on for 20 years during the worst of her drinking, unwilling to face the facts, and here he was, still completely ignorant of what had happened. Completely unaware of his hand in the situation.

So when I start to mourn her death, I try also to celebrate her life (even tho a very large part of me despises her for not leaving my father 30 years ago)… She did a lot of good for a lot of people – raised 4 kids who, on the whole, are healthy. She made the best Strawberry Shortcake in New England. She volunteered thousands of hours at the local church helping people less fortunate than she. And through her shortcomings, she taught me some valuable lessons. She always helped me when I was at my worst, even tho it was in secret, she helped me ‘get well’ many a time via western union. And most of all, she gave me this precious gift called life, for which I am extremely grateful for. Its taken me many years to be able to say that and mean it from the core of my being.

I would liked her to have stuck around to meet her granddaughter face to face, but I know she is looking over us now, and is very proud of what I have made out of a one-time shattered existence.

I know what it feels like Ron, and just wanted to say, you’re not alone. The fact that you are here seeking help/support speaks volumes.

Stay the course, you CAN make it!

_.DH

On Wednesday, November 24, 2004, at 05:46 PM, Ron Davis wrote:

terrified, thanks for asking, father on death bed and ibo won’t work for a very dangerous situation i have place myself in. thank you for your concern and well wishes and prayer.  i d/n know if i will make it, peace , ron

—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:16 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
How do you do now? Being praying for you.
Kindest regards
F

—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.

It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.

I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.

Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.

All the best to you and yours

Kia Kaha (stay strong)

Kirsty

 

<image.tiff>

From:Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl]
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

 

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME

Jasen.


Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 2:02:27 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Rachel,
Thank you very much for your point of view, it is much appreciated. Several
reasons for switching:- cost, although not huge still big enough to matter:-
and a few months ago I had a bit of a meltdown and have been using more
seed, so I have decided to put it in the hands of the clinic and when I want
to decrease, it’s not entirely up to me to stick with it!!! Besides, I have
detoxed off both methadone and seed, there’s not much difference, and I
think that is mainly because of pesticides etc in the seed, would be an
interesting test to be drinking only organic seed, but availability and cost
would probably make this difficult!!
I have no problems with benzos so any discomfort after Ibo can be eased with
them.
I’m really looking forward to making the change from teenager to adult! I
missed that transition when I began my drug taking!
Thanks again Rachel, and all the best with you and Jeff.
Regards
Kirsty


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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 1:53:35 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/25/04 12:37:38 AM, IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com writes:

<< The long lasting ones are
unbearable and require decreasing dosages very gradually over a couple to a
few month
time depending upon the quantity someone is doing. >>

Hi Eric,

Which benzos are you classifying as long lasting? Thanks

Howard

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine],to sara from ron
Date: November 25, 2004 at 12:55:31 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: donderdag 25 november 2004 5:45
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine],to sara from ron

In a message dated 11/24/04 11:36:20 PM, rwd3@cox.net writes:

<< how i envy those you help. unfortunately, according to all i’ve read and

have been told by  those smarter than i, ibo won’t work on my benzo thing.

if you hear otherwise, please tell me and i wll be on the next plane.  your

english is fine for an angel. love, ron >>

I don’t think the matter of ibogaine and benzodizepines has been resolved.
For whatever reason there is no animal model research that has been
performed
which while not perfect would be predictive of one result or another.

So Sara, what do you say from your experience?

Howard

Dear Howard,

My experience  is that Iboga does work for Benzo, only is isn’t a single
Dose of MG/kg.

But I did treat many people for zanex , klonopine, Valiums, and other benzo
without a seizure+ METHADONE AND HEROIN habit on top.

I’m very confident that it does work the way I do it.

Sara

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine],to sara from ron
Date: November 25, 2004 at 12:46:25 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net]
Verzonden: donderdag 25 november 2004 4:59
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine],to sara from ron

sara:
how i envy those you help. unfortunately, according to all i’ve read and
have been told by  those smarter than i, ibo won’t work on my benzo thing.
if you hear otherwise, please tell me and i wll be on the next plane.  your
english is fine for an angel. love, ron

Ron,

The info. Is about Ibogaine HCL, I do the treatment for Benzo and methadone
with Iboga which a
Is different kind of treatment then you can read on the Net.
There is no MG/KG dosage. But an observation treatment,
Day by day I follow you physically and mentally. Until I think
You are good, that takes at the most times,2 weeks.

Sara

Monday was a deep emotional dying day. Tuesday  a day of rebirth and
enlightenment.

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From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 12:36:21 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Ron and list,
The only substance i have not had success with treating with ibogaine so far has been with the long lasting benzos.  I have had success with detoxing off of 70 to 100 mgs.of short lasting benzos such as xanax and valium during a 2 and 3 day day protocol.  The long lasting ones are unbearable and require decreasing dosages very gradually over a couple to a few month time depending upon the quantity someone is doing.

Eric

From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Poppy tea vs. Methadone ?
Date: November 25, 2004 at 12:00:38 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, jeffgd1@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Kirsty,

I’m curious about your reasoning for the switch.  Tea
seems to me much easier to detox from than methadone,
which is very long-lasting in the system.

After two and a half weeks of basically not feeling
better, Jeff really is wishing he had decided to go
Julie’s route and switched from methadone to another
opiate *before* the Eboga detox.

We stopped by his clinic today so he could “pee in a
bottle” and check about aftercare.  They have some
acupuncture, which he hopes to take advantage of
before going back to work.  They thought he wanted to
go back on methadone, but when his awesome,
sympathetic counselor heard he *didn’t*, and I related
my spiritual experiences from just being in the room
during the treatment, she really wanted to check out
the Dossier.

He’s looking at another booster for his withdrawals,
but because the 6 mg./kg Ibogaine HCL he took last
week didn’t affect him hardly at all we are wondering
if the fact that he had restarted Zoloft might have
blocked it or something like that.

Happy American Thanksgiving everyone.  We have a lot
to be grateful for around here.

Much love,

Rachel (and Jeff)

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
All your favorites on one personal page – Try My Yahoo!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 24, 2004 at 11:50:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dealing with the death (or pending death) of a parent is one of the toughest challenges I’ve had to face. One cannot completely prepare for the emotions and feelings that surface (with a timeline and mind of their own). My Mom passed 4 years ago, and yes addiction killed her. alcohol, pain meds and an abusive husband (the prior in response to the latter). She died of a brain hemmorage (sic) that resulted from an all out drunken tumble down the staircase, which was the finale to a 4 week bender of ingesting nothing much besides straight Vodka, painkillers and copius amounts of her blood thining medication Cumadin (sic). Her heart was also shot from several decades of drinking -thus the blood thinner and pacemaker (Vodka and Dilaudid was her favorite). The blood thinner only made the hemoraging worse.

I still find myself being very, very upset. I flew back in time to see her alive in the hospital, and it was a ghastly affair. she was a total mess. couldn’t speak, but she could see us and hear us. Unfortunately that is my lasting impression of her, all hooked up to IV’s and Monitors, one humongus bruise the entire length of her face. My father in ignorant denial, telling us she is going to be OK, she just had a little fall, the doctor standing by with no comment. Dad had his blinders on for 20 years during the worst of her drinking, unwilling to face the facts, and here he was, still completely ignorant of what had happened. Completely unaware of his hand in the situation.

So when I start to mourn her death, I try also to celebrate her life (even tho a very large part of me despises her for not leaving my father 30 years ago)… She did a lot of good for a lot of people – raised 4 kids who, on the whole, are healthy. She made the best Strawberry Shortcake in New England. She volunteered thousands of hours at the local church helping people less fortunate than she. And through her shortcomings, she taught me some valuable lessons. She always helped me when I was at my worst, even tho it was in secret, she helped me ‘get well’ many a time via western union. And most of all, she gave me this precious gift called life, for which I am extremely grateful for. Its taken me many years to be able to say that and mean it from the core of my being.

I would liked her to have stuck around to meet her granddaughter face to face, but I know she is looking over us now, and is very proud of what I have made out of a one-time shattered existence.

I know what it feels like Ron, and just wanted to say, you’re not alone. The fact that you are here seeking help/support speaks volumes.

Stay the course, you CAN make it!

_.DH

On Wednesday, November 24, 2004, at 05:46 PM, Ron Davis wrote:

terrified, thanks for asking, father on death bed and ibo won’t work for a very dangerous situation i have place myself in. thank you for your concern and well wishes and prayer.  i d/n know if i will make it, peace , ron

—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:16 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
How do you do now? Being praying for you.
Kindest regards
F

—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.

It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.

I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.

Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.

All the best to you and yours

Kia Kaha (stay strong)

Kirsty

 

<image.tiff>

From:Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl]
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

 

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME

Jasen.


Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.797 / Virus Database: 541 – Release Date: 11/15/2004


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.797 / Virus Database: 541 – Release Date: 11/15/2004

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine],to sara from ron
Date: November 24, 2004 at 11:44:33 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/24/04 11:36:20 PM, rwd3@cox.net writes:

<< how i envy those you help. unfortunately, according to all i’ve read and

have been told by  those smarter than i, ibo won’t work on my benzo thing.

if you hear otherwise, please tell me and i wll be on the next plane.  your

english is fine for an angel. love, ron >>

I don’t think the matter of ibogaine and benzodizepines has been resolved.
For whatever reason there is no animal model research that has been performed
which while not perfect would be predictive of one result or another.

So Sara, what do you say from your experience?

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine],to sara from ron
Date: November 24, 2004 at 10:58:45 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

sara:
how i envy those you help. unfortunately, according to all i’ve read and have been told by  those smarter than i, ibo won’t work on my benzo thing. if you hear otherwise, please tell me and i wll be on the next plane.  your english is fine for an angel. love, ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 12:21 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jason report,

Monday was a deep emotional dying day. Tuesday  a day of rebirth and
enlightenment.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 24, 2004 at 10:46:13 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

terrified, thanks for asking, father on death bed and ibo won’t work for a very dangerous situation i have place myself in. thank you for your concern and well wishes and prayer.  i d/n know if i will make it, peace , ron
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 9:16 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?

Hi Ron
How do you do now? Being praying for you.
Kindest regards
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.
It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.
I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.
Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.
All the best to you and yours
Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kirsty
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

—
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron how are you?
Date: November 24, 2004 at 10:16:13 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Ron
How do you do now? Being praying for you.
Kindest regards
F
—– Original Message —–
From: Capt Kirk
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 8:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.
It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.
I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.
Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.
All the best to you and yours
Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kirsty
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

—
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.797 / Virus Database: 541 – Release Date: 11/15/2004

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Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.797 / Virus Database: 541 – Release Date: 11/15/2004

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.
Date: November 24, 2004 at 8:30:52 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kia Ora Jasen from New Zealand.
It has been an honour to share your journey and gives me hope for the future when I start my journey with Ibogaine.  It is so helpful to hear from others who have been thru it, and come out the other side a new person.  I am very happy for you.
I look forward to sharing my journey in the near future.
Starting on Methadone on Tuesday, stabilize and come down as much as possible, then it will be Ibogaine. As cheap as it is, the poppy seed is still a cost and I’m not working at the moment so things are tight money wise.  I’ve been on ‘done before and swore I wouldn’t do it again but with Ibogaine I feel it’s my best move at this stage.
All the best to you and yours
Kia Kaha (stay strong)
Kirsty
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 9:05 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

—
Incoming mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.797 / Virus Database: 541 – Release Date: 11/15/2004

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Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: CIA Warlord’s Son Held in Mass Murder
Date: November 24, 2004 at 7:39:37 PM EST
To: “Newsroom-L” <newsroom-l@lists.netspace.org>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh damn,
I did get that wrong.
I apologize to the lists and to Cha Vang. My extreme apologies are in
order. I don’t know how I missed that “spokesman” bit, but I did, and I
messed up royally by doing so. I very humbly apologize and feel really thick. No excuse for such sloppiness on my part.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <CERJ@igc.org>
To: <CERJ@igc.org>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 6:31 PM
Subject: Re: CIA Warlord’s Son Held in Mass Murder

On Wednesday, November 24, 2004, CERJer Betty Frandsen <bfrandse@pressenter.com> wrote:

John,

Someone says that Cha Vang is the son of the general, but later in the article, it says he is a spokesman for the Hmong community … and Chai Vang is the murderer … could you clarify this?  It sounds like someone rushed to a conclusion without reading the article.

Betty
_ _ _

Dear Betty and CERJers,

Yes, I published the articles under Preston’s suggested new ‘headline’ without careful checking of the facts.  I don’t have evidence that the shooter is the general’s son … merely similarly named.  Someone on JUSTWATCH — where I also published the same material — has corrected me as well.

Let me point out, though, that Preston did us a service by sending the material … it gives us much more knowledge about this lamentable situation — and contributing or mitigating factors — than we might have had otherwise.

— John Wilmerding

==================================
CERJ@igc.org            wilmerding@earthlink.net
——————————————-
John Wilmerding, Convener and List Manager
Coalition for Equity-Restorative Justice (CERJ)
217 High Street, Brattleboro, VT, USA
ZIP: 05301-6073         Phone: 1-802-254-2826
CERJ was founded in New York in May, 1997.
——————————————-
“Work together to reinvent justice using methods
that are fair; that conserve, restore, and even
create harmony, equity and good will in society.”
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To join (or leave) the CERJ email list, kindly send
me an email message at wilmerding@earthlink.net
or at cerj@igc.org.  I’ll need your first & last name,
your email address, and your state, province or
country of residence.  Thank you!  — John W.
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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jason report,
Date: November 24, 2004 at 9:44:43 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

J, hang in there guy. Get through this and the other side is bright and beautiful. You are in a great place to do all of your soul searching.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] thought it might interest
Date: November 24, 2004 at 9:09:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kirsty, I think we need to sic my Momma on this guy. Get ’em Momma.     Randy

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT-sorta) Fw: [DrugWar] VIN SUPRYNOWICZ: What do police departments really do?
Date: November 24, 2004 at 6:49:29 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston,
Bingo!!! Give that man a prize!  That remark you made about the “correlation” is big.  This is not about blame, but the first thing that came to my mind when you revealed your current status was, that Faith drove him to it!! This is meant as a joke but at the same time expressing a point As emotional beings we absorb and hold onto all that stuff that we are so passionate about. Hence the need for balance and perspective and lets throw in some self preservation. Your instincts are good. A deviation from all that would be healthy. Figuring out how to have that balance and deviation on an ongoing basis so as not to crash and burn is an ongoing goal . I just had some energy work last night and the guy told me I don’t give myself the opportunity to really rest.  He said to me, you have to love yourself before you can truly love others.  I remember commenting to Marc shortly after his return from mexico when it appeared he was burning himself out that if he wanted to be a beacon of light for others he had to have a steady power source from within. I don’t inundate myself with news or what I refer to as toxic people and toxic situations.  I understand you are passionate on politics and such but again, find your balance.
As usual this is all stuff I need to hear myself, so don’t take me as preaching or fingerpointing.
Preston and all, hope there is a wonderful, relaxing and introspective holiday for all.  I am thankful for this list and the opportunity it has given me. Mentally when I think of accessing this site, I refer to you all as “my people.”
I wish for you all calm, peace, and understanding.
And above all Love,
Martee

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 24, 2004 1:10 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT-sorta) Fw: [DrugWar] VIN SUPRYNOWICZ: What do police departments really do?

This is only sort of off topic I think. This is just my own opinion, and others might not agree, which is why I went ahead and placed that OT sorta in the subject heading.
I’m getting really tired of all the depressing news again. After doing ibo it took a couple of months before I started watching tv and reading news again, and it wasn’t long before I then started to fuck myself over. Hmmm. I wonder if there is a correlation there somewhere.
Anyway, my next book project, now in the very beginning stages of being put together, has nothing whatsoever (at this point) to do with illegal drug use and policies- although that may change if a couple potential contributors actually do come up with a pertinent slant on the topics they’ve proposed covered for a book about lost civilizations, technologies and ancient mysteries. We’ll see. My point I’m trying to make here is that I’ve long needed a complete change of direction, even if only a temporary one, something I can do that will not stress me out, will give me happiness and enjoyment and also help me pay my rent. Imagine that. Life can be interesting and almost smooth at times, knock loudly on lots of wooden things please.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Vigilius Haufniensis
To: drugwar@mindvox.com
Cc: new patriots ; NEWLP@yahoogroups.com ; elite_sociopath@yahoogroups.com ; cia drugs ; a political debate ; global humanity ; RM-COUNSEL@yahoogroups.com ; Evolving_Thought@yahoogroups.com ; SECULAR_HUMANIST@yahoogroups.com ; the_Lawyerdude@yahoogroups.com ; lovely lou ; projectgrasp@yahoogroups.com ; chaconstitutionalist ; ed ruthann ; Lordhighmasterofallthings ; Carnes, James ; OrgonomyMail-List@yahoogroups.com ; WilhelmReich-List@yahoogroups.de
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 11:02 PM
Subject: [DrugWar] VIN SUPRYNOWICZ: What do police departments really do?

The creation of government police forces thus did not and does not diminish crime rates, and was never expected to. In fact, the professor finds it generally increases reported crime rates. This makes sense if we stop to think what modern police forces actually do.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2004/Nov-14-Sun-2004/opinion/25230212.html
VIN SUPRYNOWICZ: What do police departments really do?

Back in August, I reported an incident out of Wisconsin that may — or may not — help us answer the question: What should you do if police ask permission to search your home?
The daily Oshkosh Northwestern reported back on July 20: “Local police still have no culprit in custody following a Saturday night shooting that left an officer wounded in a south-side Oshkosh neighborhood. …
“The ongoing search for a perpetrator continues to prove frustrating for residents of the otherwise quiet neighborhood. … Residents … had mixed things to say about the methods police used in searching homes Sunday morning in the aftermath of the shooting,” the local daily reported.
Resident Terry Wesner told reporters “a couple of shotguns and a rifle” were removed from his home by SWAT team members after he consented to a search, though officers did not tell him they removed the firearms.
Of special concern to the local ACLU was a report that residents of the house that became the focus of the police investigation refused to consent to a search without a warrant. “(A police officer) declined to say whether officers pursued the warrant because the residents refused a consent search,” the newspaper reported.
And here we thought the courts had ruled that refusal to give consent to a search could not be used as grounds to acquire a search warrant. For how can we really be said to retain any right to privacy if we can lose this right merely for invoking it?
I’ve gotten some feedback on this topic over the months. A lot of it, sadly, confirms my suspicion that many of our countrymen these days are all too willing to embrace the notion that police shouldn’t be restrained by such archaic notions as any “right to privacy,” so long as they’re pursuing “lawbreakers” in good faith.
I went to grade school in the 1950s, and remember our school reader including a tale of Officer Brown — I seem to recall him as a beaming, somewhat portly figure twirling an innocuous nightstick as he strolled down the sidewalk, tipping his hat to one and all — helping little Suzy rescue her cat from a tree.
Does anyone still believe this is what policemen actually do?
Read Stephen Davies’ excellent research on “The Private Provision of Police During the Eighteenth and Nineteenth Centuries,” in the 2002 book “The Voluntary City: Choice, Community, and Civil Society.” What professor Davies reveals is that modern government police forces were set up —  largely in a delayed response to the French Revolution — to do “social policing” of the urban working class, wading into the slums on behalf of the ruling elite, inventing new “crimes” for which they could threaten the residents with arrest, thus breaking up any incipient movement toward social revolution before it could bloom.
The creation of government police forces thus did not and does not diminish crime rates, and was never expected to. In fact, the professor finds it generally increases reported crime rates. This makes sense if we stop to think what modern police forces actually do.
Let us suppose that, magically, there were no police. You are sitting at home of an evening, quietly reading a book. Next door, behind his own locked doors, your 21-year-old neighbor, who inherited some handguns from his grandfather, is spending time with his 16- or 17-year-old sweetheart, whose family is happy to know she intends to marry him and bear his children as soon as she graduates high school. At the moment, the two of them are consuming some of the marijuana they grow in their back yard.
If you knew this, would you leap to your feet and race downtown, pounding on the door of the sleeping magistrate, insisting he swear out a warrant so you can rush back to your neighborhood, break into your neighbor’s home and arrest him?
Of course not. He’s hurting no one.
But now let us return to a present era in which we maintain large, professional police forces. Earlier this day, unbeknownst to you or your neighbor, officers busted one of your neighbor’s friends for driving a car with an out-of-date registration. (Oh, the horror.) Searching the car without a warrant, the “officers” found marijuana. Bargaining to stay out of jail, the young man tells the officers he got it from your neighbor.
As we speak, do you suppose Officer Friendly and Officer Brown are down at the station house, playing cards and waiting to see if anyone will call in any armed robberies tonight?
Of course not. Clad in full SWAT gear, with machine pistols and bulletproof vests, they are currently lurking in your neighbor’s bushes, trying to peek in his windows. Before dawn they will break down his front door with a battering ram, drag him out half-naked and in handcuffs and proceed to send him to prison for decades for 1) possessions of unregistered handguns without a license; 2) “manufacturing for purposes of sale a deadly narcotic,” that is to say, his backyard marijuana; and 3) “statutory rape” of his fiancee, regardless of whether or not their planned union has the blessing of her family.
The reported “crime rate” in your neighborhood just skyrocketed. Is this because your neighbor has hurt anyone, or has been caught doing anything that normal people have not been doing for thousands of years?
Of course not. Our great-grandparents would be astonished to learn that such “crimes” are even on the books.
The only thing that has changed is that our land is now occupied by large, professional, overlapping paramilitary “police forces” that have to keep busy, ginning up manufactured “crime waves” and filling the prisons (we now have the highest incarceration rate in the world — and many of those inmates have never hurt anyone), in order to justify their ever-burgeoning budgets.
Vin Suprynowicz is assistant editorial page editor of the Review-Journal and author of the books “Send in the Waco Killers” and “The Ballad of Carl Drega.”

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] son of cia warlord held in mass murder case
Date: November 24, 2004 at 6:18:41 AM EST
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
While it’s not fair to hold a son guilty simply for the sins of his father, now that Laotian General Vang Pao’s son has apparently murdered six other hunters in Wisconsin, itseems to me it’s a good time to look at one of the men the US government has allowed to seek refuge in our country. What with the current all-out war on terrorists AND on some drugs and users, it might leave some loyal, still flag-waving folk feeling a bit confused, but if we don’t learn from history, we are doomed to always repeat it.
Heck, I’m growing convinced as of late that it doesn’t matter, that even if we DO learn from history it won’t change anything, that enough dumbells will always buy into the calls for war, hate, death and destruction, no matter what. That said, it doesn’t mean I’m planning on hiding my head in the sand, only that I’m none too sure that calling “them” out for their sins is really going to accomplish much of anything. Still…
Peace and love to all,
Preston


son of cia warlord held in mass murder case
(my new title for the NYTimes’ “Hunter Tells Police he was Threatened”)
snip-

A group of prominent Hmong-Americans, eager to distance their community from the killings and avert a possible backlash, held a news conference here on Tuesday. “We stand before you as representatives of the greater law-abiding Hmong community to unconditionally – unconditionally – condemn these atrocities,” a spokesman, Cha Vang, said. “What happened in Wisconsin is in no way representative of the Hmong people and what they stand for.”

Cha Vang is a son of Gen. Vang Pao, probably the best-known Hmong in the United States. General Vang Pao commanded the Hmong “secret army” that the Central Intelligence Agency assembled to fight Communism in Southeast Asia in the 1960’s and 70’s.

St. Paul has about 25,000 Hmong, and many enjoy hunting. By their own accounts, more than a few have had clashes with whites whose paths they have crossed in the North Woods.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/drugs/archive/gunsdrugscia.html
snip-

For more on General Vang Pao, please see:

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/drugs/archive/gunsdrugscia.html

Guns, Drugs and the CIA

JOHN EVERINGHAM
I know as a fact soon after the army was formed the military officers soon got control of the opium trade. It helped not only them make a lot of money and become good loyal officers to the CIA but it helped the villagers. The villagers needed their opium carried out and carried over the land in a war situation that was much more dangerous and more difficult, and the officers were obviously paying a good price ‘cos the villagers were very eager to sell to the military people.

HARRY ADERHOLT, U.S. General
That’s hogwash. No way and as far as the agency ever, ever advocating that is do you think I would be in an organization where I’ve devoted my life to my country–involved in a operation like that without blowing the whistle?–absolutely not.

NARRATOR
For veterans like General Aderholt and General Secord the war in Laos is now commemorated at nostalgic reunions. Last fall they gathered at a Florida air base to talk over old times and current business.
While Vang Pao does not attend such functions, he is well remembered by his old comrades.

Frontline:
Was the agency responsible for people’s salaries, were they paying Vang Pao?

Harry Aderholt:
Of course, they were a hundred percent responsible, because Vang Pao was responding to agency requirements, even though they may have come from the highest levels of the U.S. government, yes, of course.

Frontline:
He was in the chain of command.

Harry Aderholt:
Yes.

Frontline:
Did you work with Vang Pao?

Richard Secord:
Sure, all the time.

Frontline:
What was your relationship?

Richard Secord:
I was his supplier of air, therefore he stayed in close contact with me.

Frontline:
Were you in charge of supplying Air America planes?

Richard Secord:
For the tactical air operations, yes.

NARRATOR
The movement of Air America planes say witnesses were influenced by Vang Pao’s business requirements.

Ron Rickenbach:
Vang Pao wanted control of the aircraft– sure, he would do the work that needed to be done but it would give that much more freedom and that much more flexibility to use these aircraft to go out and pick up the opium that needed to be picked up at this site or that site and to bring it back to Long Chien, and there was quite a hassle and Vang Pao won. Not only did he get control of the aircraft, but there was also a question of the operational control of the airplanes that were leaving Long Chien to go south, even into Thailand, and there was an embarrassing situation where the Americans knew that this could be exposed and it would be a very compromising situation. The way they got around that was to concede, to create for Vang Pao his own local airline, and Xieng Kouang airlines came into reality as a direct result of this compromise that was worked out, and they brought in a C-47 from the states and they painted it up nice and put Xieng Kouang airlines on it and they gave it to Vang Pao, and that aircraft was largely used for the transshipment of opium from Long Chien to sites further south.

Frontline:
Air Opium?

Ron Rickenbach:
Air opium.

Harry Aderholt:
Those airlines didn’t really belong to General Vang Pao.

Frontline:
They belonged to the agency.

Harry Aderholt:
They belonged to the agency. They were maintained by the United States government in the form of Air America or Continental, so they didn’t really own anything. It wasn’t something he could take away with him, it was something that we controlled every iota of that operation, lock, stock and barrel.

Frontline:
You know what the nickname for that airline was?

Richard Secord:
No.

Frontline:
Opium Air.

Richard Secord:
I’ve never heard that before.

NARRATOR
Back in the old days the men who flew for Air America and drank in the Purple Porpoise Bar in Vientiane were less discreet.
Most of them are long gone and far away from Laos now but one legendary CIA officer still lives across the Mekong River close to his old mountain battleground.

RON RICKENBACH
The man that was in charge of that local operation was a man by the name of Tony Poe, and he was notorious. He had been involved with the agency from the OSS days he was a World War II combat veteran and he had been with the agency from its inception and he was the prototype operations officer. They made a movie about him when they made Apocalypses Now. He was the caricature of Marlon Brando.

NARRATOR
Until now, Tony Poe has never talked publicly about the Laos operation. He saw it from beginning to end. one of Vang Pao’s early case officers, Poe claims he was transferred from Long Chien because unlike his successors, he refused to tolerate the Meo leader’s corruption.

TONY POE, Former CIA Officer
You don’t let him run loose without a chain on him. You gotta control him just like any kind of an animal or a baby. You have to control him. Hey! He’s the only guy that had a pair of shoes when I first met him–what are you talking about, why does he need Mercedes Benz, apartments and hotels and homes where he never had them in his life before. Why are you going to give it to him?

Frontline:
Plus he was making money on the side with his business?

Tony Poe:
Oh, he was making millions, ‘cos he had his own source of, uh, avenue for his own, uh, heroin.

snip-

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen at Sara’s.
Date: November 24, 2004 at 3:05:11 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Day ten;THE AWAKENING HAS BECOME
Jasen.

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jason report,
Date: November 24, 2004 at 1:21:45 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Monday was a deep emotional dying day. Tuesday  a day of rebirth and
enlightenment.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT-sorta) Fw: [DrugWar] VIN SUPRYNOWICZ: What do police departments really do?
Date: November 24, 2004 at 1:10:48 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is only sort of off topic I think. This is just my own opinion, and others might not agree, which is why I went ahead and placed that OT sorta in the subject heading.
I’m getting really tired of all the depressing news again. After doing ibo it took a couple of months before I started watching tv and reading news again, and it wasn’t long before I then started to fuck myself over. Hmmm. I wonder if there is a correlation there somewhere.
Anyway, my next book project, now in the very beginning stages of being put together, has nothing whatsoever (at this point) to do with illegal drug use and policies- although that may change if a couple potential contributors actually do come up with a pertinent slant on the topics they’ve proposed covered for a book about lost civilizations, technologies and ancient mysteries. We’ll see. My point I’m trying to make here is that I’ve long needed a complete change of direction, even if only a temporary one, something I can do that will not stress me out, will give me happiness and enjoyment and also help me pay my rent. Imagine that. Life can be interesting and almost smooth at times, knock loudly on lots of wooden things please.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Vigilius Haufniensis
To: drugwar@mindvox.com
Cc: new patriots ; NEWLP@yahoogroups.com ; elite_sociopath@yahoogroups.com ; cia drugs ; a political debate ; global humanity ; RM-COUNSEL@yahoogroups.com ; Evolving_Thought@yahoogroups.com ; SECULAR_HUMANIST@yahoogroups.com ; the_Lawyerdude@yahoogroups.com ; lovely lou ; projectgrasp@yahoogroups.com ; chaconstitutionalist ; ed ruthann ; Lordhighmasterofallthings ; Carnes, James ; OrgonomyMail-List@yahoogroups.com ; WilhelmReich-List@yahoogroups.de
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 11:02 PM
Subject: [DrugWar] VIN SUPRYNOWICZ: What do police departments really do?

The creation of government police forces thus did not and does not diminish crime rates, and was never expected to. In fact, the professor finds it generally increases reported crime rates. This makes sense if we stop to think what modern police forces actually do.

http://www.reviewjournal.com/lvrj_home/2004/Nov-14-Sun-2004/opinion/25230212.html
VIN SUPRYNOWICZ: What do police departments really do?

Back in August, I reported an incident out of Wisconsin that may — or may not — help us answer the question: What should you do if police ask permission to search your home?
The daily Oshkosh Northwestern reported back on July 20: “Local police still have no culprit in custody following a Saturday night shooting that left an officer wounded in a south-side Oshkosh neighborhood. …
“The ongoing search for a perpetrator continues to prove frustrating for residents of the otherwise quiet neighborhood. … Residents … had mixed things to say about the methods police used in searching homes Sunday morning in the aftermath of the shooting,” the local daily reported.
Resident Terry Wesner told reporters “a couple of shotguns and a rifle” were removed from his home by SWAT team members after he consented to a search, though officers did not tell him they removed the firearms.
Of special concern to the local ACLU was a report that residents of the house that became the focus of the police investigation refused to consent to a search without a warrant. “(A police officer) declined to say whether officers pursued the warrant because the residents refused a consent search,” the newspaper reported.
And here we thought the courts had ruled that refusal to give consent to a search could not be used as grounds to acquire a search warrant. For how can we really be said to retain any right to privacy if we can lose this right merely for invoking it?
I’ve gotten some feedback on this topic over the months. A lot of it, sadly, confirms my suspicion that many of our countrymen these days are all too willing to embrace the notion that police shouldn’t be restrained by such archaic notions as any “right to privacy,” so long as they’re pursuing “lawbreakers” in good faith.
I went to grade school in the 1950s, and remember our school reader including a tale of Officer Brown — I seem to recall him as a beaming, somewhat portly figure twirling an innocuous nightstick as he strolled down the sidewalk, tipping his hat to one and all — helping little Suzy rescue her cat from a tree.
Does anyone still believe this is what policemen actually do?
Read Stephen Davies’ excellent research on “The Private Provision of Police During the Eighteenth and Nineteenth Centuries,” in the 2002 book “The Voluntary City: Choice, Community, and Civil Society.” What professor Davies reveals is that modern government police forces were set up — largely in a delayed response to the French Revolution — to do “social policing” of the urban working class, wading into the slums on behalf of the ruling elite, inventing new “crimes” for which they could threaten the residents with arrest, thus breaking up any incipient movement toward social revolution before it could bloom.
The creation of government police forces thus did not and does not diminish crime rates, and was never expected to. In fact, the professor finds it generally increases reported crime rates. This makes sense if we stop to think what modern police forces actually do.
Let us suppose that, magically, there were no police. You are sitting at home of an evening, quietly reading a book. Next door, behind his own locked doors, your 21-year-old neighbor, who inherited some handguns from his grandfather, is spending time with his 16- or 17-year-old sweetheart, whose family is happy to know she intends to marry him and bear his children as soon as she graduates high school. At the moment, the two of them are consuming some of the marijuana they grow in their back yard.
If you knew this, would you leap to your feet and race downtown, pounding on the door of the sleeping magistrate, insisting he swear out a warrant so you can rush back to your neighborhood, break into your neighbor’s home and arrest him?
Of course not. He’s hurting no one.
But now let us return to a present era in which we maintain large, professional police forces. Earlier this day, unbeknownst to you or your neighbor, officers busted one of your neighbor’s friends for driving a car with an out-of-date registration. (Oh, the horror.) Searching the car without a warrant, the “officers” found marijuana. Bargaining to stay out of jail, the young man tells the officers he got it from your neighbor.
As we speak, do you suppose Officer Friendly and Officer Brown are down at the station house, playing cards and waiting to see if anyone will call in any armed robberies tonight?
Of course not. Clad in full SWAT gear, with machine pistols and bulletproof vests, they are currently lurking in your neighbor’s bushes, trying to peek in his windows. Before dawn they will break down his front door with a battering ram, drag him out half-naked and in handcuffs and proceed to send him to prison for decades for 1) possessions of unregistered handguns without a license; 2) “manufacturing for purposes of sale a deadly narcotic,” that is to say, his backyard marijuana; and 3) “statutory rape” of his fiancee, regardless of whether or not their planned union has the blessing of her family.
The reported “crime rate” in your neighborhood just skyrocketed. Is this because your neighbor has hurt anyone, or has been caught doing anything that normal people have not been doing for thousands of years?
Of course not. Our great-grandparents would be astonished to learn that such “crimes” are even on the books.
The only thing that has changed is that our land is now occupied by large, professional, overlapping paramilitary “police forces” that have to keep busy, ginning up manufactured “crime waves” and filling the prisons (we now have the highest incarceration rate in the world — and many of those inmates have never hurt anyone), in order to justify their ever-burgeoning budgets.
Vin Suprynowicz is assistant editorial page editor of the Review-Journal and author of the books “Send in the Waco Killers” and “The Ballad of Carl Drega.”

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From: “Vigilius Haufniensis” <thehatefulnerd@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: [DrugWar] (OT!) Fw: [NEWSROOM-L] Bush’s fly
Date: November 23, 2004 at 11:22:34 PM EST
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Cc: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,>     I apologize for the way off topic post here, but still…
I post this sans other comment, simply in hopes I pass on the big smile I
myself experienced when seeing this photo.
We do need laughter in this day and age of legalized murder and such grand
scales.> Peace and love to all,> Preston

VMANN:  look at PUTIN in the upper right.
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/041121/481/edb11411211850
the expression on his face (compared with that on bush’s face) is worth a
THOUSAND words.
vigilius haufniensis

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: (OT!) Fw: [NEWSROOM-L] Bush’s fly
Date: November 23, 2004 at 9:11:33 PM EST
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>

Hi all,
I apologize for the way off topic post here, but still…
I post this sans other comment, simply in hopes I pass on the big smile I myself experienced when seeing this photo.
We do need laughter in this day and age of legalized murder and such grand scales.
Peace and love to all,
Preston

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@NYC.RR.COM>
To: <NEWSROOM-L@LISTS.NETSPACE.ORG>
Sent: Tuesday, November 23, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: [NEWSROOM-L] Bush’s fly

Would Someone Tell Bush to Zip Up His Pants Before Taking a Photo with World
Leaders? 11/24
http://story.news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/041121/481/edb11411211850

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

NetSpace LISTSERV(R) software donated by L-Soft, Inc.   http://www.lsoft.com

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] MAO inhibitor or not?
Date: November 23, 2004 at 7:46:16 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
A friend sent me the following two sentence note, and I’d appreciate some responses, please.
Thanks.
—–

Ibogaine. MAO inhibitor, or not?

For a friend studying Ayahusca (I think I spelled it right.).
—–

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] thought it might interest
Date: November 23, 2004 at 6:44:54 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thought I’d send this on, I’d certainly be up in arms if it happened in NZ, look out for the Fundamentalists~!
Someone handed me a bible and told me to pray when I had PMS I’d smack em round the head with it!!!
Kirsty
From: Reiki Lady [mailto:iamthereikilady@yahoo.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, 23 November 2004 8:06 a.m.
To: Gary Cardinal
Subject: [sacred-union-network] (unknown)

URGENT – READ THIS NOW!

FYI:  Subject: Hager FDA appointment

President Bush has announced his plan to select Dr. W.David Hager to head up the Food and Drug Administration’s (FDA)Reproductive Health Drugs Advisory Committee. The committee has not met for more than two years, during which time its charter lapsed. As a result, the Bush Administration is tasked with filling all eleven positions with new members.  This position does not require Congressional approval.

The FDA’s Reproductive Health Drugs Advisory Committee makes crucial decisions on matters relating to drugs used in the practice of obstetrics, gynecology and related specialties, including hormone therapy, contraception, treatment for infertility, and medical alternatives to surgical procedures for sterilization and pregnancy termination.

Dr. Hager, the author of “As Jesus Cared for Women: Restoring Women Then and Now.” The book blends biblical accounts of Christ healing W! omen with case studies from Hager’s practice. His views of reproductive health care are far outside the mainstream for reproductive technology. Dr. Hager is a practicing OB/GYN who describes himself as “pro-life” and refuses to prescribe contraceptives to unmarried women.

In the book Dr. Hager wrote with his wife, entitled “Stress and the Woman’s Body,” he suggests that women who suffer from premenstrual syndrome should seek help from reading the bible and praying. As an editor and contributing author of “The Reproduction
Revolution: A Christian Appraisal of Sexuality Reproductive Technologies and the Family,” Dr. Hager appears to have endorsed the medically inaccurate assertion that the common birth control pill is an abortifacient.

————————————————————
Dear Mr. President,
We oppose the appointment of Dr. W. David Hager to the FDA Reproductive Health Drugs Advisory Committee. We are concerned that Dr. Hager’s strong religious
beliefs may color his assessment of technologies that are necessary to protect women’s lives or to preserve and promote women’s health.

Hager’s track record of using religious beliefs to guide his medical decision-making makes him a dangerous and inappropriate candidate to serve as chair of this committee. Critical drug public policy and research must not be held hostage by antiabortion
or any other politics. Members of this important panel should be appointed on the basis of science and medicine, rather than politics and religion.

Mixing religion and medicine is unacceptable in a policy-making position. Using the FDA to promote a political agenda is inappropriate and seriously threatens women’s health.

American women deserve no less.

Sincerely,
Everyone signed below

—————————————————————————-
Every 10th person please forward e-mail to
president@whitehouse.gov1. Susan Tannenbaum (Owings Mills,Maryland)
2. Susan Levine (Silver Spring,MD)
3. Audrey Funk (Henderson,NV)
4. Susan Lowe Shlisky (Las Vegas,NV)
5. Michelle Straub-Wilensky (Los Angeles,CA)
6. Patricia Phelan (San Francisco,CA)
7. Victoria Einhorn(san anselmo, ca)
8. Brad Einhorn (Brooklyn,NY)
9. Bethany MacMillan (Brooklyn,NY)
10. Amy Russell (Louisville,Kentucky)
11. Beverly D. Moore (Louisville,Kentucky)
12. Connie O. Byrne (Kannapolis,North Carolina)
13. Janet C. Haas (Charlotte,North Carolina)
14. Heather Vrana (Charlotte,NC)
15. Clare M. Evans (Newport,VA)
16.Kathy Chadwick17.Jim Chadwick
18.Claire Grimm Chadwick
19. Lindsay Addison (Naples,FL)
20. Peggy Addison (Naples,FL)
21. David Addison (Naples,FL)
22. Howard Schumsky (Orlando,FL)
23. Kristie Born (Orlando,FL)
24. Paul Boyd (Atlantic Highlands,NJ)
25. Lois Jensen (NYC, NY)
26. Catherine Rubenstein (Belvedere, CA)
27. AnneRubenstein (Belvedere, CA)28. Dirk Rubenstein (Belvedere, CA)
29.Barbara K. Westover (Oakland, CA)
30. Sharon Bjornson (Oakland, CA)
31.Rabbi Sue Levi Elwell (Philadelphia, PA)
32. Hana Elwell (Brooklyn, NY)
33. Jen Song (Brooklyn, NY)
34. Janet Lo (New York, NY)
35. Emily Horowitz (New York, NY)
36. Daniel Horowitz (New York, NY)
37. Josh Hyman (New York, NY)
38. Mona Goldsmith (Plainview, NY)
39. Kate Striano(Newtown, CT)
40. Elissa Gellis ( Newtown, CT)
41. Diane Thompson (SandyHook, CT)
42. LInda Parsloe (Sandy Hook, CT)
43. Judy Juracek (Darien, CT)
44. Deborah Meisels (City Island, NY)
45. P. Briggs Saroch(Greenfield, MA)
46. Diane Fisher-Katz (Northampton, MA)
47. KirstenCirincione (Florence, MA)
48. Jane Lynch (Florence, MA)
49. Kathleen Kennedy (Santa Barbara, CA)
50. Leslie Palmer (San Antonio, TX)
51. Julie Toland, Middletown, RI
52. Josie Merck,( Cos Cob, CT)
53. Elizabeth O’Neill (Boston, MA)
54. Joan O’Neill (Traverse City, MI)
55. Barba! ra Becker (Concord, CA)
56. Ken Bruckmeier (Oakland,CA)
57. Margret Elson (Oakland, CA)
58, Marsha Sherman (Portland, OR)
59. Marinell Eva (Santa Rosa, CA)
60.  Sharon Oman (Petaluma, CA
61. Adrienne Davis (Santa Rosa, CA)
62. Barbara Carlson (Santa Rosa, CA)
63. Karen Grace-Kaho (Sacramento, CA)
64. Mary Beth Love (San Francisco, CA)
65. Ruth Finnerty (Oakland, CA)
66. Rosalie Holtz67.  Kay Corlett (Albany, CA)
68.  Connie Barnes (Oakley, CA)
69.  Donna Ventura (Brentwood, CA)
70.  Nancy Herman (Lafayette,CA)
71. Shirley Chang (Berkeley, CA)
72. Nola Chavez (El Cerrito, CA)
73. Elspeth Wells (Clayton, CA)
74. Phyllis Berger (Los Angeles, CA)
75.  Joan Barnett (Boston, Ma.)
76. Phyllis Wender (New York, New York)
77. Lorraine Boyd (San Diego, CA)
78.  Karen Carpenter (San Diego, CA)
79.  Liz Woodman (New York, NY)
80. Lee Friend (Scottsdale, AZ)
81. Florence Jesser, IL
82. Manuela Hung, IL
83. Diane Giancaspro, MI84. Daniel J Fedeli  (Chicago IL)
85. Carol Forsythe (Chicago IL)
86. Deborah Wood (Evanston, IL)87. Susan Cherry (Evanston,
IL)88. Linda Leedberg (Tucson, AZ)
89. Brook Bernini-Galup (Tucson, AZ)
90.Carey Bernini Dowling (Binghamton, NY)
91. Elizabeth Buvinger  (Harrisonburg, VA)
92.  Suzanne Cox (Beloit, WI)
93. Ingrid Andersson (Madison, WI)
94. Kim Reain (Madison, WI)
95. Kate Muschlewski (Madison, WI)
96. Nikole Verde  (St.Paul, MN)
97. Ronda Conner (Madison, WI)
98. Julie Tackett (Madison, WI)
99.Margaret Grosspietsch (Minneapolis, MN)
100. Michael Menner (Minneapolis,MN)
101. Margaret Schally (St. Paul, MN)
102.  Lisa Gunther (St. Paul, MN)
103.Roseanna Stanley (Bolton, MA)
104. Ariana Gabriel (Groton, MA)
105. Dorothy Boesger (Berea, OH)
106.  Maria Sarris (Berea, OH)
107.  Cheryl Stefanik (Columbia Station, OH)
108. Pauline Munk (Columbia Station. OH)
109. Eric Lendl (Oakland, CA)
110. Alisa Dodge (Oakland, CA)
111. Kate Cook (Los Angeles, CA)
112. Marie Monique de Varennes (Los Angeles, CA)
113 Nancy Allen (Los Angeles,CA)
114 Sandi Froelich (Ridgewood, N.J.)
115. Nita Silverman Goodgal (Wyckoff, N.J.)
116. Robin B. Katz (Chicago, IL)
117. Kerry Quigley
118. Maritza Lopez (S.O., NJ)
119.  Maria T. Gonzalez (Plantation, FL)
120. Ellen L. Morrison (Holly Springs, NC)
121. Georgia Sgouros (Garner, NC)
122. Sarah Washburn (Chapel Hill, NC)
123. Ina M. Ish ( Siler City, NC)
124. Lavinia Anne Whitworth Harris (Lawton – Fort Sill, OK)


There is something you can do. The above letter is to be sent to the 
White House, opposing the placement ofHager. Please copy all the text of this email and paste it into a fresh email; then sign your name and
SEND THIS TO EVERY PERSON YOU KNOW WHO IS CONCERNED ABOUT WOMEN’S RIGHTS.Every 10th
person please forward e-mail tomailto: president@whitehouse.gov

The Reiki Lady of the South West

“I am not going to question your opinions. I am not going to meddle with your belief. I am not going to dictate to you, mine. All that I say is, examine, and inquire. Look into the nature of things. Search out the grounds of your opinions, the for and the against. Know why you believe, understand what you believe, and possess a reason for the faith that is in you.”
(Francis Wright, “Divisions of Knowledge”, 1828)

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] : Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 23, 2004 at 6:29:52 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Cheers heaps Randy,
There is some great info on the net, I’ve been studying it for 4 years now so I know all the tests to have done and no, I wouldn’t consider doing it alone! Just waiting for the right angel to appear for me!! The last time I did get ibo sent here, but it was weak form, I want the whole deal this time!
Thanks for your help.
Kirsty
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, 24 November 2004 1:18 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] : Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

Kirsty, I didn’t realize you were in New Zealand. You might look on the net for Ibogaine Hcl. I think you can have it sent to your house. There are some web sites that supply it I just am not aware of the name. Someone else with more info than me will probably chime in here, be ready for it. Don’t do it by yourself. There is an Ibogaine treatment protocol manual on the Dora Weiner Foundation site that is real good. I down loaded it and read it a lot before I did the Ibogaine and it prepared me pretty well. I still had a lot of pleasant surprises but I wouldn’t want to go through that by myself. Too many invariable problems can come up. Good luck.    Randy

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god/fear
Date: November 23, 2004 at 7:31:08 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nick, fear of the unknown kept me high and drunk for years. I stayed buttered and blindly went through what I was afraid of and missed the point. I feel like I have to face them clean now and experience the feelings and put a label on them so they are not unknown anymore. This is deep. It talks about this in the big book.        Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] : Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 23, 2004 at 7:18:00 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kirsty, I didn’t realize you were in New Zealand. You might look on the net for Ibogaine Hcl. I think you can have it sent to your house. There are some web sites that supply it I just am not aware of the name. Someone else with more info than me will probably chime in here, be ready for it. Don’t do it by yourself. There is an Ibogaine treatment protocol manual on the Dora Weiner Foundation site that is real good. I down loaded it and read it a lot before I did the Ibogaine and it prepared me pretty well. I still had a lot of pleasant surprises but I wouldn’t want to go through that by myself. Too many invariable problems can come up. Good luck.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes afte…
Date: November 23, 2004 at 6:51:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Frank, it has been my experience that the majority of old timers in AA don’t want hear about Ibogaine. The philosophy and the steps apply to any addiction so I go there to reinforce what I have already learned and accomplished. I am also an alcoholic so I am lucky enough to know first hand how much help is in the rooms. My sponsor is well aware of my situation and thinks Ibogaine is a great tool for recovery. He is rare. We have become pretty close over the years and he just wants me to be clean no matter what it takes. So my advice to anyone going to AA is to go to meetings and talk about your recovery just don’t try and win anyone over to Ibogaine. (YET) It is coming. I figure I will let the ones know who are addicts too after meetings and by just being clean and answering questions. I’ve already done this a few times. It is a little too much for some of the newly clean to handle sometimes so I watch and talk to the ones I think can handle it. I don’t know if I am qualified to do this or not but I will not stop until Ibogaine is available to those who need and want it. I feel like it is up to me to bring all of my efforts into a workable program. AA, therapist, the list and prayer are what I am going on now. The list is the most important part for me but that may change. All I know is I’m clean and I love it. You are forever in my heart and I will be indebted to you for your help the rest of my life. Thank you for your efforts in bringing Ibogaine out in the open in the US. As far as I know there is no one doing Ibogaine treatments in the KY,Tenn., West Virginia, southern Ohio area. They need help and I want to be there for them.     Randy

From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] [On List] Healing & Spirituality (List & Ron)
Date: November 23, 2004 at 6:02:48 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston,

Thank you for the thought but you don’t have to worry about reading the book on my behalf. I do not take it in anyway personal. Its a book on your shelf. Enjoy it if you see fit to.

I know the feeling of being on a rollarcoaster ride and for me I use to fear that if I didn’t keep up I would fall off and crash. Its almost like we have no choice but to keep up with the pace. Maybe thats part of the learning and how it is meant to be?
I remember after my first session I had a sense of being two people. The one still on the ride trying to carry on and in some way slow it down. In this I was committed to more business transactions which I intended to go through with and did. The other in another place waiting for the ride to end so I could get on with my real life, knowing I did not want those business transactions. Yet I went with the ride (& the business transactions) in full knowledge of what I was doing was “wrong”….was it?

I think the ego has certain needs to maintain its sanity and if the ride is abruptly stopped it can be traumatised by this. So it carries on. Yet, the other starts to creep in as the ego learns to trust it. So slowly, instead of seeking new rides, we replace that need with what the other offers. Eventually the ride slows down and we are detached from its relentless propulsion and all the addictions and compulsions that go with it.

Its part of the journey.

For me I go with the flow. If I am high and pulsing I let myself down slowly and move towards a balance over a period of time. I dont judge too harshly what is happening. I just observe it and from my center I move the balance to a better place (often with the help of eboga). Then I examine the issues though eboga, feel them deeply where appropriate, understand them and release them. Of course, I can go into a period of self pity or self hate and so on. All perfectly natural and in many ways healthy. I just am and I know why I am what I am.

The trick comes when we shift our center of being to the awareness of self, the soul and then as the ego rebels (& the Shadow) we deal with what it presents us with. Eventually the ego becomes calmer and calmer (& the Shadow becomes out friend)  and we can feel that we have arrived or are close to the end of our journey.

Undergoing a major ibogaine session is basically the beginning of a journey and you should not be surprised for what is happening to you. It is also happening to many others the same way. Its the unravelling and healing of your being and if you don’t like the journey then you have the choice to return (but do it without remorse) to your old ways and replug the bottle of self once more. Otherwise, I suggest you be aware of what you have started!

Love & Blessings,

Lee

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
I have Amazing Grace (sorry I neglected to respond before Lee) but haven’t
had time to do more than glance through it, for which I apologize. I’ve got
a lot on my plate, and suddenly realize that I’ve been taking what spare
time I have to place big hurdles that don’t need to be there in my way.

At this point I’m not sure when I’ll have time to give it the attention it
deserves Lee, but will do so when I can.
You have a point with the following: “But there is no point to beat
ourselves up, just because we seek pain relief. Thats highly normal. We need
to take a kinder view on our behaviour. Addiction is the expression of our
unhealed state which ooses pain.”
But it’s got a lot to do, in my own case, with the effects on other(s) too,
in that I share my life with 10 other living breathing creatures who need me
as I do them. This is why I beat myself up, whether it’s valid or not. I
beat myself up because I still feel the need to hide my behaviors sometimes,
which is stupid and I should know better by now. I beat myself up because I
fight this battle in my mind over whether or not I’m “doing good” or “being
righteous” or whatnot when I find myself engaging in behavior that
ultimately can be ultra-bad for me and those around me. It’s part of the
game I suppose, the whole “beat myself up” thing, in that it gives my
“disease” an excuse to act up (I mean, it’s my disease doin’ it, right? I’m
innocent, I swear!)
;-))
Anyway, I’m feeling somewhat lighter today than in days past, but still
have a ways to go. It’s a rollercoaster ride right now, or more of one now
than the Space Mountain ride my life usually is.

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 7:28 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] [On List] Healing & Spirituality (List & Ron)

Dear List & Ron,

I won’t say, hope you are all keeping well, because I know many of you are
not. I have been reading the posts continuously (glancing). I mostly skip
over the prescription stuff, which I might add impresses me a great deal as
to the high level of pharmaceutical knowledge on the list.

I have also learned a deeper appreciation of the US and its many varieties
of people during the Presidential campaign. Its reassuring to know that many
millions of Americans do actually care. As for the drug addiction syndrom,
apart from the drug usage itself, I see much similarity in what I went
through in dealing with childhood abuse. Behind each drug habit there is a
story. Thats the real issue – not the drugs.

I do not consider myself properly versed to advise on drug interruption
treatment and I also do not believe that is my area. Yet my heart goes out
to Ron and his cries for help. From what I have read on the list, one can
taper off Benzo’s substituting with heroin rather than methadone and then
use ibogaine to come off the heroin.

But it is not just about the addiction is it? Addiction is like the scab on
the wound. Once the wound is opened it begins to flow. I know as I have
battled for the past 6 years to stop smoking and have continueously
relapsed. I am off now and hope to stay off. But there is no point to beat
ourselves up, just because we seek pain relief. Thats highly normal. We need
to take a kinder view on our behaviour. Addiction is the expression of our
unhealed state which ooses pain.

Anyone who has kicked dope in one session needs to realise they have just
put one foot on the path and the path may be very long – in fact, out of
sight. Unless you wake up to reality, you are going to live in a carefully
orchestrated fantasy. So to use a term that Jason Bursey uses, it is vital
to, Keep it Real.

Therapy on its own won’t work. Therapy is only ever a support but not a
cure. The reality is this: continuous dosing over a period of years to
uncover the issues and heal them. In this context a good therapeutic support
is useful as is a healthy attitude that turns away from the desire to abuse
oneself and others and sees the light in what love has to offer.

So I understand why Ron is so frustrated as the list gets seriously
sidetracked and even if he does get your attention, what do you tell him? Is
it enough? Or is it that the list is simple there to enable people to have
their first ibogaine experience and then relapse for the lack of any real
vision as to where to go with ibogaine & therapy?

Healing and spirituality are entertwined. How else could it be? Pain reaches
down into the very core of our being – the soul. So if you are to be healed
what branch of psychology covers soul healing? None that I am aware of
except perhaps Transpersonal Psychology or Rebirthing. So the soul can only
be healed by a spirit or spirits working to remove the negative spirits that
occupy it. In our case here this spirit is the Eboga spirit – carried by a
serpent but not the serpent. Therefore a commitment to heal becomes a
commitment to your spirtual growth also.

Supply is the problem. However, as I write I note Brazil is lifting the
crimilization of addiction. Maybe supply could come from there one day.
Africa is very problematic.

My vision is one of Network (primarily low dose treatment) – one to some –
leading to a discreet group of people who pass on the healing to those
closest to them, who in turn do the same. In time I believe huge affordable
sources of supply will be needed. That thought is with me these days. My
initial enthusiasm for healing centers has given way to a simpler and more
discreet program of “friends helping friends” in their own homes. Here
today, gone tomorrow.

So to Ron I say this. I have been where you are and nothing makes it better.
Death seems an easy option – one I often prayed for. Yet death is not an
option at all. It only hurts the soul more and then all of that still has to
be worked out in the next life. I am very sorry for your situation and pray
to God and the Goddess that you will recieve the help you need.

Whenever I was in your position my way to cope was this. I would indulge my
deepest despair until I could not depress myself any further. Then I would
set myself a goal that inspired me and filled my mind with images of light
and well being. With that and the well of despair thoroughly drunk from, I
would rise again and move to the next stage of my path. If you keep your eye
on the light, you won’t get lost in the dark.

Forgive me if I mention a word on prayer. Prayer for me is when I feel and
sense God’s or the Goddess’s or both presence, and I imagine that he or she
or both, hear what I am saying, and then I say: please help me and thank you
for all your help so far. (I also look on them as parents.) And I mean what
I say. I mention this because when we were children we were taught to pray.
And that was more to do with position of hands and string of words. We were
never taught how to pray from our souls. And that kind of prayer is the
prayer with the best chance of success. What is the soul? Its whats left
when you take away all the pretense.

It’s worth reflecting on this:
“Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a
child shall not enter it.” Mark 10:15
– as this is the state which ibogaine brings us to and where we meet God and
the Goddess.
I made it from hell to heaven (mostly for now). It is possible but don’t
fool yourself about how difficult it is. You do yourself a great disservice
if you do.

Love & Blessings,

Lee

P.S. I have upgraded the web site and added an eboga spiritual healing
network. A lot more to do but I hit a brick wall in the last few months.
Waiting for a new surge of inspiration.

http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media
available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 23, 2004 at 2:17:01 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 13:58:21 -0800 Nick Sandberg
<nick227@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
If you make the world out like “Love versus Greed,” then that’s
also an isolationist position. You have a choice to move beyond
that or you can stay in fear, fear of what’s beyond all dualisms.

Scary, isn’t it 🙂

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] God Wants George W as president – it a miracle
Date: November 23, 2004 at 12:53:10 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Guess we will have to wait and see.

Yes. I followed up with Teed Rockwell, and here is his elucidation.

Date: Sun, 21 Nov 2004 23:15:23 -0800
Subject: Cuyahoga and election fraud
From: Teed Rockwell <mcmf@california.com>
To: Voterfraud <mcmf@california.com>

I have received several messages in response to an email I
sent out
about apparent evidence of voter fraud on the Cuyahoga county
website in
Ohio.  This email has apparently been edited and posted on
several websites.
I’m glad people are doing this sort of thing, but it does mean I
should
clarify certain things that were left out of my original message.
I’ve also
learned some things which greatly alter the significance of that
data.

First of all, I did not do these tabulations myself. I received
this
information in a forwarded email.  Before I forwarded it myself,
I went to
the Cuyahoga election website myself and confirmed that several
of the
figures in the email were accurate. I think the person who did
this hard
careful work deserves credit for it, but I have not been able to
trace the
message I received back to the original source.

Secondly, the Cuyahoga election officials now claim that this
discrepancy appeared on the website because of a software glitch,
and does
not appear in the actual counted totals. The following website
contains a
plausible explanation for the glitch by someone who talked
directly to the
folks in Cuyahoga. This site has lots of other investigations of
voting
irregularities, and is well worth a visit.

http://pages.ivillage.com/americans4america/id20.html

The Cuyahoga site has apparently since revised its figures to
reflect the
official totals, so you can no longer find the discrepancies I
described in
my original post. It now seems most likely to me that the
discrepancies
originally posted on the Cuyahoga website were merely evidence of
incompetence, not fraud, and it was incompetence that apparently
had no
impact on the tabulation of votes. (Although there was a very
similar error
involving absentee ballots in Craven County, NC which did affect
the vote
tabulation. see

http://www.newbernsj.com/SiteProcessor.cfm?Template=/GlobalTemplates
/Details
.cfm&StoryID=18297&Section=Local I would not write off the
possibility that
if we had not called attention to this problem in Cuyahoga, it
might very
well have affected the final result the way it did it Craven
County.)

The original assumption of fraud was perfectly reasonable.
Everyone
acknowledges that a precinct in Franklin County gave Bush
thousands of extra
votes, which have now been officially removed from the Ohio
total. The
Franklin County discrepancy was discovered exactly the same way:
by Bloggers
who checked public records and compared registered voter totals
to final
counts. It seemed reasonable to many people that the
discrepancies on the
Cuyahoga site were the same problem, but on a greater scale. But
many
reasonable assumptions are wrong, and it looks like this was one
of them.

So where does voter fraud investigation stand now? As far as
I can tell,
we’ve got a lot of smoke, (which may mean there is fire), but no
smoking
gun. Before I give you my personal evaluation of this evidence,
however, I
think we need to make an important distinction between degrees of
proof.

1)Proof beyond a reasonable doubt.
This is what you need to convict someone of a criminal offense,
and arguably
what you need to invalidate an election. I don’t think anyone
thinks we have
that yet.

2) A preponderance of the evidence
This what is required to win a civil lawsuit. It means it is more
likely
than not that the wrongful action was performed.  I think there
is already a
preponderance of the evidence that this election should be
invalidated, but
I realize that this is a point on which honest people may differ.

3) Evidence that further investigation is warranted.
You don’t need proof or a preponderance of the evidence to
justify starting
an investigation. Otherwise there would be no need to have the
investigation. I think if you examine the evidence you will agree
that there
are facts here that must not be ignored. Careful investigation
requires
going down promising paths that often turn out to be blind
alleys, and the
discovery of a few blind alleys doesn’t invalidate any other
evidence. There
is lots of new evidence coming in every day, and it is not
surprising that
some of it may be misleading until it is more closely analyzed.
We need to
be willing to debunk the misleading evidence, because it weakens
the impact
of the substantial amount of strong evidence.

So take a look at the links and arguments below and see what you
think. If I
can find anything else that looks especially convincing, or a
good debunking
of a story which has been misleading people, I will send it your
way. I
won’t do this very often, if at all. But if you don’t want to
receive any
more posts from me on this subject, let me know and I’ll take you
off this
list.

The best centralized link site I have found so far is:

http://www.solarbus.org/stealyourelection/

Based on what I have discovered from using this site and other
sources, this
seems to be the state of the evidence.

The discrepancies between the exit polls and the final
result cannot be
dismissed by saying ‘hey, everybody knows polls aren’t accurate
all the
time’. Exit polls have proven time and time again to be accurate
to less
than 1 percent.  In countries where there is doubt about the
honesty of a
government, (such as in the former Soviet Georgia a few years
ago.)
disparities between election results and exit polls are often
used as a
basis for invalidating elections. These polls aren’t perfect, but
they
deviate from accuracy according to certain statistical laws.
According to
the Steven Freeman, a statistician at the University of
Pennsylvania, the
chances of the exit polls in Ohio, Florida, and Pennsylvania all
being this
wrong for purely statistical reasons are 250 million to one. (see
http://www.solarbus.org/stealyourelection/articles/exit-poll-
discrepancy-1110.
pdf )
This does not prove that the election was fraudulent. If just
shows
that these results cannot be explained as a purely chance
deviation. If
there were another explanation, backed by good evidence, there
would be
reason to discount the claims of fraud. But as Freeman points
out, the only
other explanation given so far is that Bush supporters might have
been less
willing to talk to pollsters than Kerry supporters. There is,
however, no
evidence supporting this claim, and lots of evidence that voter
fraud took
place. You can’t use the final vote itself as evidence; that
would be
begging the question. So given that an explanation is needed, we
must accept
the explanation with the best evidence.

Here is a small sample of the evidence for fraud:

1)The manufacturers of the voting machines  are all heavy
contributors to
the Bush campaign. The president of the Diebold voting machine
company said
in a Republican fund raising letter that he would deliver the
state of Ohio
to Bush.

2)These machines repeatedly make huge errors which benefit Bush.

A) Almost 4,000 extra votes awarded to Bush.
http://www.cnn.com/2004/ALLPOLITICS/11/05/voting.problems.ap/

B) Ohio Votes for a straight Democratic ticket are given to the
Libertarians.
http://www.indystar.com/articles/3/193880-4433-102.html

C)Members of Congress have received numerous reports from voters
in Florida
and Ohio who repeatedly tried to vote for Kerry on an electronic
machine,
and had their votes changed into votes for Bush.

http://www.house.gov/judiciary_democrats/gaoinvestvote2004ltr11504.p
df

D) In Guilford country, NC, a recount discovered 22,000 votes
which should
have gone to John Kerry.

http://www.house.gov/judiciary_democrats/gaoinvestvote2004ltr11804.p
df

E) When www.BlackBoxVoting.org<B9>s Beth Harris subpoenaed voting
records in
Volusia County, Florida, she was given copies that were not
signed by the
poll workers. She later found the signed originals in the
trashcan outside
the elections warehouse. The originals had fewer votes for Bush
than the
versions she had been given.
http://www.commondreams.org/views04/1118-22.htm

I have seen no accounts of any errors which benefited Kerry.

When you combine even these few examples with the discrepancies
in the exit
polls, there is no reason to assume that these are isolated
incidents. The
most plausible explanation is that this sort of thing happened in
all of the
swing states, and this is why the swing states had these
discrepancies in
the final results.
(http://www.berkeleydailyplanet.com/article.cfm?issue=11-19-
04&storyID=20131
)

There is also a strong correlation between states that had
electronic voting
and states that gave more votes to Bush in the final results.
http://www.bandsagainstbush.org/cgi-bin/archives/exit_poll.gif

This seems to me like a preponderance of the evidence that this
election was
fraudulent. But the evidence is still coming in, if you’re not
yet
convinced. I suggest you keep an eye on it and give money to
organizations
like  www.blackboxvoting.org which are continuing this
investigation. This
problem is too important to be ignored.

Teed Rockwell
Philosophy Department
Sonoma State University

On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 10:03:08 -0800 Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Hi Slowone,

Guess we will have to wait and see.  I have read that there is
going to be a lawsuit, I forget by who.  They have to have it by
December when the electorial college meets.  The thing is about
the 3 companies that make those black boxes, besides being
republician related companies, there is no way to do a recount, no

haning chads.  In other words we are having private companies tell

us who the president is and there is no way to challenge them.

For the record I am not Rep or Dem, I only voted three times.  I
just hate to see a coup in my country.  In fact I was considering
not sending the article in because I feel this is a drug help and
information forum rather than a political forum.

Best to ya,

– JIM

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County,
Ohio,

reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters –

at least 93,136 extra votes total ….
The Republicans are so BUSTED.

This is also on the web dated as early as Nov 11, 2004. There is
much detailed commentary by conservatives indicating that the
numbers on the page are the result of bad reporting and/or
misinterpreted; certainly the overall result on the page is 2:1
for
Kerry. Also it is not mentioned as valid in an article dated 11/20

on a heavyweight lawsuit over Cuyahoga’s election:

http://www.verifiedvoting.org/article.php?id=5324

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 07:49:36 -0800 Jim Hadey
wrote:
Hi All,

It’s a miracle, maybe we should call him Saint George.

93,136 EXTRA Votes
Found In ONE Ohio County
From Teed Rockwell
Philosophy Department
Sonoma State University
11-19-4

You may have seen the associated press story about the precinct
in

Cuyahoga county that had less than 1,000 voters, and gave Bush
almost 4,000 extra votes.

But that turns out to be only the tip of a very ugly iceberg. The

evidence discovered by some remarkably careful sleuthing would
convince any reasonable court to invalidate the entire Ohio
election.

In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County,
Ohio,

reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters –

at least 93,136 extra votes total. And the numbers are right
there

on the official Cuyahoga County Board of Elections website:

Bay Village – 13,710 registered voters / 18,663 ballots cast
Beachwood – 9,943 registered voters / 13,939 ballots cast
Bedford – 9,942 registered voters / 14,465 ballots cast
Bedford Heights – 8,142 registered voters / 13,512 ballots cast
Brooklyn – 8,016 registered voters / 12,303 ballots cast
Brooklyn Heights – 1,144 registered voters / 1,869 ballots cast
Chagrin Falls Village – 3,557 registered voters / 4,860 ballots
cast
Cuyahoga Heights – 570 registered voters / 1,382 ballots cast
Fairview Park – 13,342 registered voters / 18,472 ballots cast
Highland Hills Village – 760 registered voters / 8,822 ballots
cast
Independence – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
Mayfield Village – 2,764 registered voters / 3,145 ballots cast
Middleburg Heights – 12,173 registered voters / 14,854 ballots
cast
Moreland Hills Village – 2,990 registered voters / 4,616 ballots
cast
North Olmstead – 25,794 registered voters / 25,887 ballots cast
Olmstead Falls – 6,538 registered voters / 7,328 ballots cast
Pepper Pike – 5,131 registered voters / 6,479 ballots cast
Rocky River – 16,600 registered voters / 20,070 ballots cast
Solon (WD6) – 2,292 registered voters / 4,300 ballots cast
South Euclid – 16,902 registered voters / 16,917 ballots cast
Strongsville (WD3) – 7,806 registered voters / 12,108 ballots
cast

University Heights – 10,072 registered voters / 11,982 ballots
cast
Valley View Village – 1,787 registered voters / 3,409 ballots
cast

Warrensville Heights – 10,562 registered voters / 15,039 ballots
cast
Woodmere Village – 558 registered voters / 8,854 ballots cast
Bedford (CSD) – 22,777 registered voters / 27,856 ballots cast
Independence (LSD) – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast

Orange (CSD) – 11,640 registered voters / 22,931 ballots cast
Warrensville (CSD) – 12,218 registered voters / 15,822 ballots
cast

The Republicans are so BUSTED.

http://boe.cuyahogacounty.us/BOE/results/currentresults1.htm#top

Is the official website of the Cuyahoga county election board,
providing irrefutable evidence that the vote was off by at least
93,000.

Kerry lost Ohio by approximately 130,000, so this is not an
insignificant figure that can be ignored, particularly when there

are numerous other indications of voter fraud in Ohio and
elsewhere. I think the only possible alternative is to invalidate

the entire Ohio election, if not the entire national election.

I’d say the game’s up .America, it looks pretty much like you’ve
been had.

Sincerely,

Teed Rockwell
Philosophy Department
Sonoma State University

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] :ron to schmooly
Date: November 23, 2004 at 12:36:36 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 12:54 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] :ron to schmooly

we will pray for you
God Bless you
Francis
Don’t give up Ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re:ron to schmooly

god give me the power to handle the frieght train that’s going to smack me hard.  hope he sends someone into my lofe that can detox me off this poison so there are at least remnants of the real ron. on a personal note thanks to you and all who have wished me well.  of course it is one day at a time and i’m in the pity pot with pop dying , holiday blues and the republicans killing funding for everything that can help the people i serve
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

getting clean is not about good intentions or wil power. Hijacked brain by chemical terrorist.
Pray for the willingness and get a good comfortable detox. If you are not dependant and still want to boot up, then maybe you have to hit a bottom. Yet, the elevator stop at many floors. You don’t have to take it to the basement.

hang in there man. Just throw it away again. keep trying one day at a time. program or no program. Each time you don’t use even though you want to, the urge will leave quicker and you will get your personal power back.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778
Date: November 23, 2004 at 12:29:09 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i’m trying to get out
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 10:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778

Ron, your messages about downloading and secret handshakes are
unintelligible. If I may guess, the benzos may not be your friend
here.. it’s all pretty open, no big secrets that I know of (and
I’ve been around for a few years). Take care.

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 20:26:42 -0800 Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
cannot download. how was my “probe”? thought it felt stimulating,
but maybe
that was just benzos.
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 23, 2004 at 12:24:25 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

today’s penthouse is tomorrrows basement, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

getting clean is not about good intentions or wil power. Hijacked brain by chemical terrorist.
Pray for the willingness and get a good comfortable detox. If you are not dependant and still want to boot up, then maybe you have to hit a bottom. Yet, the elevator stop at many floors. You don’t have to take it to the basement.

hang in there man. Just throw it away again. keep trying one day at a time. program or no program. Each time you don’t use even though you want to, the urge will leave quicker and you will get your personal power back.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 23, 2004 at 12:21:19 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

the local addictionologists detox benzos w/ darvon or klonopin and basket weaving.  2 weeks, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

getting clean is not about good intentions or wil power. Hijacked brain by chemical terrorist.
Pray for the willingness and get a good comfortable detox. If you are not dependant and still want to boot up, then maybe you have to hit a bottom. Yet, the elevator stop at many floors. You don’t have to take it to the basement.

hang in there man. Just throw it away again. keep trying one day at a time. program or no program. Each time you don’t use even though you want to, the urge will leave quicker and you will get your personal power back.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for schmooly from ron
Date: November 23, 2004 at 12:16:12 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

received, i apprecaite  your expertise and concern
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 4:52 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for schmooly from ron

Sorry for your loss and I now understand more. I am sure you are fixable. We will speak again soon. hang in there. Tough times don’t last-tough people do. If you have the willingness, then you can do it. The right Doc, right detox protocol, right aftercare and a little room left for G-d to work a miracle.

If you pray to G-d to help you dig a hole,,, you better bring a shovel

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] stating the obvious
Date: November 22, 2004 at 7:32:40 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
My friend Steve Wishnia, formerly at High Times, contributor to Under the Influence, and author of the recent Cannabis Companion, sent me (and others) this today, so I thought I’d share. While it made me laugh, it also is a bit infuriating. Damned Ashcroft, who is gone anyway, so what happens now- does he remain part of the suit anyway?
—–
Steve wrote:
From court papers in Ashcroft v. Raich:
“Without cannabis, Angel’s weight can drop precipitously and
she runs the very real risk of malnutrition and starvation.
One result of starvation is death.
Death constitutes irreparable harm.”

(In all fairness, lawyers sometimes have to state the
obvious.)
—–

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: bm <bmali1@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] RE:Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes aftercare modalities..Hello from Itacare, Brasil
Date: November 22, 2004 at 5:30:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi franscesco . it will be great . i feel the same way
. i am a lurker here and  have been reading ( many
times  a simple glance through ) these posts for some
3 months . i came across the Ibo as well as the list
while searching for help for a friend . hope you
recieve all the help from people with experience and
have a decent compiled pamphlet .
good luck
badri
a question . with Lula set to change the direction of
so called drug war will it make sense to perhaps have
a place set up in Brazil ?

=====
” lord , make me chaste , but not yet ” St.Augstine of Hippo
Very bad isn’t dead (“Things can get worse.”)–Haitian Proverbs
“A truth that’s told with bad intent
Beats all the lies you can invent.” William Blake.

__________________________________
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Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 22, 2004 at 5:09:54 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

fear begat greed.

fear, is the enemy.

On Monday, November 22, 2004, at 11:58 AM, Nick Sandberg wrote:

—–Original Message—–
From: D H [mailto:dave@phantom.com]
Sent: 22 November 2004 19:54
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god

“they” are not as advanced as “others” in their soul line of spiritual
development.

Those young, arrogant souls.

karma can be a bitch tho, and the piper must be paid sooner or later.

It’s just too bad “their” greed is in the process of destroying this
planet as we know it.

The important part for me is to recognize my role in it all.

which brings the phrase to mind: will it be the red pill, or the blue
pill?

-dh

On Sunday, November 21, 2004, at 09:28 PM, Sara Glatt wrote:

It isn’t so that they don’t take it seriously, they are so blinded
By their ego, that all they can feel is “I want, and fuck the rest”.
They don’t know what is love and how to love, their greed is their
security.

It’s just fear. Placing names like love, greed, ego is just glamourizing to
me. There’s only freedom and fear. You go through the fear you get the
bliss, the freedom. It’s simple. You choose to stay in separation, then
maybe you have to reinforce that position and isolate. From there you build
up stuff which you think is yours and it makes you feel secure. It becomes a
habit, you get stuck. I don’t call it greed, just fear. It’s ok. It’s ok to
be afraid. Sometime you can also take a risk and let go of the control a
little, check it out.

If you make the world out like “Love versus Greed,” then that’s also an
isolationist position. You have a choice to move beyond that or you can stay
in fear, fear of what’s beyond all dualisms. Either option is ok.

with love

Nick

They are sick in the mind and in their heart, and they don’t even know
it.
There is no medicine for selfishness, egotism and greed , it is not
even
recognized as a sickness, that is why it is not taken seriously.
They think that if they get a way with it, that means god chose them
to see
the bliss.

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From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 22, 2004 at 4:58:21 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Original Message—–
From: D H [mailto:dave@phantom.com]
Sent: 22 November 2004 19:54
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god

“they” are not as advanced as “others” in their soul line of spiritual
development.

Those young, arrogant souls.

karma can be a bitch tho, and the piper must be paid sooner or later.

It’s just too bad “their” greed is in the process of destroying this
planet as we know it.

The important part for me is to recognize my role in it all.

which brings the phrase to mind: will it be the red pill, or the blue
pill?

-dh

On Sunday, November 21, 2004, at 09:28 PM, Sara Glatt wrote:

It isn’t so that they don’t take it seriously, they are so blinded
By their ego, that all they can feel is “I want, and fuck the rest”.
They don’t know what is love and how to love, their greed is their
security.

It’s just fear. Placing names like love, greed, ego is just glamourizing to
me. There’s only freedom and fear. You go through the fear you get the
bliss, the freedom. It’s simple. You choose to stay in separation, then
maybe you have to reinforce that position and isolate. From there you build
up stuff which you think is yours and it makes you feel secure. It becomes a
habit, you get stuck. I don’t call it greed, just fear. It’s ok. It’s ok to
be afraid. Sometime you can also take a risk and let go of the control a
little, check it out.

If you make the world out like “Love versus Greed,” then that’s also an
isolationist position. You have a choice to move beyond that or you can stay
in fear, fear of what’s beyond all dualisms. Either option is ok.

with love

Nick

They are sick in the mind and in their heart, and they don’t even know
it.
There is no medicine for selfishness, egotism and greed , it is not
even
recognized as a sickness, that is why it is not taken seriously.
They think that if they get a way with it, that means god chose them
to see
the bliss.

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 22, 2004 at 4:57:33 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Howard,
Is the Indra product reliable? Otherwise, where would one find the HCL?
Thanking you…

—–Original Message—–
From: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Sent: Tuesday, 23 November 2004 3:58 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

For list information, Jasen is talking about doses of ibogaine extract
somewhat similar to the indra product and not ibogaine HCl.  It also appears
to me
that Sara is the only provider who approaches the use of iboga/ibogaine with
no
set time limitations to patient care on a continuous dose regimen basis.
Those of you who provide ibogaine know who overwhelming the time issue can
be.
It is too bad that some government will not provide a medical facility and
support so ibogaine providers from around the world could demonstrate their
particular techniques and dose regimens for comparative evaluation and
mutual
education.

Howard

In a message dated 11/22/04 4:16:55 AM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

Dear group.
Hey Guys,

I am here at Sara’s place and it is day 8.

Wonderful experience.To think that I actually almost turned back and went
home.
When I first came over(across the other side of the WORLD),I started to
panic,..Sh t,
This is it”,,I DON’T KNOW IF I can do this.

But Sara was wonderful,I was put at ease,took the Iboga,first dose 1 gram.
A couple of hours later,another 1.8,then a little after that ,say,..2 to
3
hours later
5 grams.Then it really booted in.

I felt as if I was being wobbled, like I had 7 or 8 tribes men, either
side
of me,holding me on a rug,
,they were standing and the rug was a few feet of the floor and they were
wobbling me.

Vibrated,..as if my cells were vibrating with the melody of the
wobbling,roking,uhmmmm  uhmmmmm.

No vomiting. No nausea,…

Risdules,yes  but I tell you ,..NO ORBLEM.up to 15%,but it was not the
same
sick energy,

It seems to flow,up down,up down,relaxed

EGO,is not a,dirty word.
Ego is not dirty   dirty word.

WoW you really have to let it Go.
I tell you what?my ego was very strong.

I feel mentally exhausted.

I will right again. Saras cooking breakfeast for me,
Downstairsgo
um, Gotta go.

Smiles Jasen         🙂

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] : Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 22, 2004 at 4:41:45 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes it is criminal that something like Ibogaine is made illegal, but hardly surprising considering the $$$ involved in keeping people sick……but I won’t rant either lol…
I think I have found a good site, I tried a weaker version a couple of years ago, had to try and swallow about 130 capsules over a period of time!!!  Was going hard out from both ends for two days, but looking back I don’t remember withdrawals.  Decided to stop the process (which I do regret now) but will get a decent companion this time and diastop if necessary! I think I was just having a good clean out, I drink Poppy seed tea daily to stop getting sick, which costs me about $34 a week. Cheap habit. Not much else available here in Dunedin NZ, probably for the best… so we get creative. Used to grow our own poppies and extract from them, convert etc.
Thanks for the vote of confidence, I’m looking forward to it.
Kirsty
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Sent: Sunday, 21 November 2004 2:40 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

Kirsty, it is a slippery path we trod. Ibogaine is illegal in the US which is about the stupidest thing I ever …. I won’t rant. It’s getting cheaper all the time. Maybe you could make a deal with one of the providers out of the states, Call them. There is a link to most of them on the Mindvox homepage. All of them are good. Keep trying. It took me a year. Your lucky, things are changing fast. Ibogaine will fall in your lap if you keep looking.         Randy

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] prayer
Date: November 22, 2004 at 3:01:48 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

not to say the email was from you, but to share my state of mind with list.\ and you. thanks to all, ron

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] God Wants George W as president – it a miracle
Date: November 22, 2004 at 2:58:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

according to the editor of Truthout.org this has been debunked. or at least the ohio demo party and the Kerry campaign are accepting the explanation that the extra votes were counted in from rural districts. but I don’t believe that. the Demo’s once again rolling over to the repub agenda. friggin wus’s.

-dh

On Monday, November 22, 2004, at 08:03 AM, Jim Hadey wrote:

Hi Slowone,

Guess we will have to wait and see.  I have read that there is going to be a lawsuit, I forget by who.  They have to have it by December when the electorial college meets.  The thing is about the 3 companies that make those black boxes, besides being republician related companies, there is no way to do a recount, no haning chads.  In other words we are having private companies tell us who the president is and there is no way to challenge them.

For the record I am not Rep or Dem, I only voted three times.  I just hate to see a coup in my country.  In fact I was considering not sending the article in because I feel this is a drug help and information forum rather than a political forum.

Best to ya,

– JIM

slowone@hush.ai wrote:

>In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County, Ohio,

>reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters –

>at least 93,136 extra votes total ….
>The Republicans are so BUSTED.

This is also on the web dated as early as Nov 11, 2004. There is
much detailed commentary by conservatives indicating that the
numbers on the page are the result of bad reporting and/or
misinterpreted; certainly the overall result on the page is 2:1 for
Kerry. Also it is not mentioned as valid in an article dated 11/20
on a heavyweight lawsuit over Cuyahoga’s election:

http://www.verifiedvoting.org/article.php?id=5324

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 07:49:36 -0800 Jim Hadey
wrote:
>Hi All,
>
>It’s a miracle, maybe we should call him Saint George.
>
>93,136 EXTRA Votes
>Found In ONE Ohio County
>From Teed Rockwell
>Philosophy Department
>Sonoma State University
>11-19-4
>
>
>You may have seen the associated press story about the precinct in

>Cuyahoga county that had less than 1,000 voters, and gave Bush
>almost 4,000 extra votes.
>
>But that turns out to be only the tip of a very ugly iceberg. The
>evidence discovered by some remarkably careful sleuthing would
>convince any reasonable court to invalidate the entire Ohio
>election.
>
>In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County, Ohio,

>reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters –

>at least 93,136 extra votes total. And the numbers are right there

>on the official Cuyahoga County Board of Elections website:
>
>Bay Village – 13,710 registered voters / 18,663 ballots cast
>Beachwood – 9,943 registered voters / 13,939 ballots cast
>Bedford – 9,942 registered voters / 14,465 ballots cast
>Bedford Heights – 8,142 registered voters / 13,512 ballots cast
>Brooklyn – 8,016 registered voters / 12,303 ballots cast
>Brooklyn Heights – 1,144 registered voters / 1,869 ballots cast
>Chagrin Falls Village – 3,557 registered voters / 4,860 ballots
>cast
>Cuyahoga Heights – 570 registered voters / 1,382 ballots cast
>Fairview Park – 13,342 registered voters / 18,472 ballots cast
>Highland Hills Village – 760 registered voters / 8,822 ballots
>cast
>Independence – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
>Mayfield Village – 2,764 registered voters / 3,145 ballots cast
>Middleburg Heights – 12,173 registered voters / 14,854 ballots
>cast
>Moreland Hills Village – 2,990 registered voters / 4,616 ballots
>cast
>North Olmstead – 25,794 registered voters / 25,887 ballots cast
>Olmstead Falls – 6,538 registered voters / 7,328 ballots cast
>Pepper Pike – 5,131 registered voters / 6,479 ballots cast
>Rocky River – 16,600 registered voters / 20,070 ballots cast
>Solon (WD6) – 2,292 registered voters / 4,300 ballots cast
>South Euclid – 16,902 registered voters / 16,917 ballots cast
>Strongsville (WD3) – 7,806 registered voters / 12,108 ballots cast

>
>University Heights – 10,072 registered voters / 11,982 ballots
>cast
>Valley View Village – 1,787 registered voters / 3,409 ballots cast

>
>Warrensville Heights – 10,562 registered voters / 15,039 ballots
>cast
>Woodmere Village – 558 registered voters / 8,854 ballots cast
>Bedford (CSD) – 22,777 registered voters / 27,856 ballots cast
>Independence (LSD) – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
>Orange (CSD) – 11,640 registered voters / 22,931 ballots cast
>Warrensville (CSD) – 12,218 registered voters / 15,822 ballots
>cast
>
>The Republicans are so BUSTED.
>
>http://boe.cuyahogacounty.us/BOE/results/currentresults1.htm#top
>
>Is the official website of the Cuyahoga county election board,
>providing irrefutable evidence that the vote was off by at least
>93,000.
>
>Kerry lost Ohio by approximately 130,000, so this is not an
>insignificant figure that can be ignored, particularly when there
>are numerous other indications of voter fraud in Ohio and
>elsewhere. I think the only possible alternative is to invalidate
>the entire Ohio election, if not the entire national election.
>
>I’d say the game’s up .America, it looks pretty much like you’ve
>been had.
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Teed Rockwell
>Philosophy Department
>Sonoma State University
>
>
>
>———————————
>Do you Yahoo!?
> Meet the all-new My Yahoo! ñ Try it today!

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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<image.tiff>

Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! ñ Get yours free!

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 22, 2004 at 2:53:44 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“they” are not as advanced as “others” in their soul line of spiritual development.

Those young, arrogant souls.

karma can be a bitch tho, and the piper must be paid sooner or later.

It’s just too bad “their” greed is in the process of destroying this planet as we know it.

The important part for me is to recognize my role in it all.

which brings the phrase to mind: will it be the red pill, or the blue pill?

-dh

On Sunday, November 21, 2004, at 09:28 PM, Sara Glatt wrote:

It isn’t so that they don’t take it seriously, they are so blinded
By their ego, that all they can feel is “I want, and fuck the rest”.
They don’t know what is love and how to love, their greed is their security.
They are sick in the mind and in their heart, and they don’t even know it.
There is no medicine for selfishness, egotism and greed , it is not even
recognized as a sickness, that is why it is not taken seriously.
They think that if they get a way with it, that means god chose them to see
the bliss.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] :ron to schmooly
Date: November 22, 2004 at 2:44:07 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i hope to feel a trusting , healing prescience as i begin the most difficult struggle of my pitiful life.   all prayers are welcomed. ron
—– Original Message —–
From: The Garden
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 12:54 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] :ron to schmooly

we will pray for you
God Bless you
Francis
Don’t give up Ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re:ron to schmooly

god give me the power to handle the frieght train that’s going to smack me hard.  hope he sends someone into my lofe that can detox me off this poison so there are at least remnants of the real ron. on a personal note thanks to you and all who have wished me well.  of course it is one day at a time and i’m in the pity pot with pop dying , holiday blues and the republicans killing funding for everything that can help the people i serve
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

getting clean is not about good intentions or wil power. Hijacked brain by chemical terrorist.
Pray for the willingness and get a good comfortable detox. If you are not dependant and still want to boot up, then maybe you have to hit a bottom. Yet, the elevator stop at many floors. You don’t have to take it to the basement.

hang in there man. Just throw it away again. keep trying one day at a time. program or no program. Each time you don’t use even though you want to, the urge will leave quicker and you will get your personal power back.

From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes aftercare modalities..Hello from Itacare, Brasil
Date: November 22, 2004 at 3:01:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,
What i have experienced is people’s preoccupation with, and willingness to create a post  treatment aftercare, before and immediately after the ibogaine session is in direct accord to their staying clean.
My mentor, who introduced me to assist and provide ibogaine treatments, always has said that, in his opinion treatment with ibogaine is half of the equation and the other half involves how comprehensive an aftercare is created.  I have found this to be true as well.  Therefore, I would like if someone, or several people would help me access as many of the post treatment modalities as possible.  I may receive disagreement, but from my end, ibogaine is now available everywhere for a reasonable price through a wide sliding scale.  It’s the other half of the equation we need to catch up on so we can have the most holistic protocol available to share.  I’d like to create a pamphlet/website which specifically includes, from supplements, exercise, 12 step, transpersonal approaches, rational recovery, and yes, even medicines, living in places available in Costa Rica, dance (transpersonal or otherwise ), to share with those interested in receiving ibogaine treatment.
Please help me access whatever is already available on the internet and write all other opinions on the list, or privately, if you prefer.
Thank you very much in advance,
Franscesco
www.ibogaineproject.com

Msg sent via @Mail v4 – http://atmail.com/ /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes aftercare modalities..Hello from Itacare, Brasil
Date: November 22, 2004 at 3:01:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,
What i have experienced is people’s preoccupation with, and willingness to create a post  treatment aftercare, before and immediately after the ibogaine session is in direct accord to their staying clean.
My mentor, who introduced me to assist and provide ibogaine treatments, always has said that, in his opinion treatment with ibogaine is half of the equation and the other half involves how comprehensive an aftercare is created.  I have found this to be true as well.  Therefore, I would like if someone, or several people would help me access as many of the post treatment modalities as possible.  I may receive disagreement, but from my end, ibogaine is now available everywhere for a reasonable price through a wide sliding scale.  It’s the other half of the equation we need to catch up on so we can have the most holistic protocol available to share.  I’d like to create a pamphlet/website which specifically includes, from supplements, exercise, 12 step, transpersonal approaches, rational recovery, and yes, even medicines, living in places available in Costa Rica, dance (transpersonal or otherwise ), to share with those interested in receiving ibogaine treatment.
Please help me access whatever is already available on the internet and write all other opinions on the list, or privately, if you prefer.
Thank you very much in advance,
Franscesco
www.ibogaineproject.com

Msg sent via @Mail v4 – http://atmail.com/ /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Please heip in creating a pamphlet/website which includes aftercare modalities..Hello from Itacare, Brasil
Date: November 22, 2004 at 3:01:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,
What i have experienced is people’s preoccupation with, and willingness to create a post  treatment aftercare, before and immediately after the ibogaine session is in direct accord to their staying clean.
My mentor, who introduced me to assist and provide ibogaine treatments, always has said that, in his opinion treatment with ibogaine is half of the equation and the other half involves how comprehensive an aftercare is created.  I have found this to be true as well.  Therefore, I would like if someone, or several people would help me access as many of the post treatment modalities as possible.  I may receive disagreement, but from my end, ibogaine is now available everywhere for a reasonable price through a wide sliding scale.  It’s the other half of the equation we need to catch up on so we can have the most holistic protocol available to share.  I’d like to create a pamphlet/website which specifically includes, from supplements, exercise, 12 step, transpersonal approaches, rational recovery, and yes, even medicines, living in places available in Costa Rica, dance (transpersonal or otherwise ), to share with those interested in receiving ibogaine treatment.
Please help me access whatever is already available on the internet and write all other opinions on the list, or privately, if you prefer.
Thank you very much in advance,
Franscesco
www.ibogaineproject.com

Msg sent via @Mail v4 – http://atmail.com/ /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 22, 2004 at 2:31:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i like this, in theory. but it’s another thing to practice this in reality, altho at times i catch glimpses of it.

what he is touching on here is acceptance and forgiveness of universal free will.

people attracted to or who support war… that’s part of their karmic path. I know I’ve “been there, done that”.

of course there’s still that war waging between me ears… :^|

peace,
-dh

On Sunday, November 21, 2004, at 02:33 PM, <slowone@hush.ai> wrote:

..The very people we now see as vulgar, unenlightened, stupid, rip-
offs, insane葉hese people, when we learn to love them and all our
feelings about them, are our tickets to paradise. And that is all
we need to do様ove them.   …We must see them and love them as
they are now, for we cannot deny them the freedom to be what they
are, just as we must love ourselves as we are now.

..If we always stand facing the higher light, like looking into
the sun, our vision of the people around us will be distorted. But
if we have the light coming over our shoulders, shining through us,
we will see the beauty of others, we will be open to the light
coming through all forms, and know the glory of the creation.

/]=———————————————————————=[¥
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
¥]=———————————————————————=[/

From: CrookedEye420@aol.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction
Date: November 22, 2004 at 2:17:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I quit for a year and a half on probation and I was edgy for the first week or so, but I always feel better after smoking.  Wasn’t too bad without but I tried it and I like being stoned better…  Plus it works for all my ailments!

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones/Martee
Date: November 22, 2004 at 2:10:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,
I have never been involved with AA or NA or or any A.  I guess those 20 years of counseling and running anti victim and empowerment workshops have done some good. Truthfully though there is nothing like life to gel a few concepts in ones mind. But what a gift that you have found such a wise sponser.  See, if you’re open to receive the universe will send you what you need.  Words, thoughts and deeds are all like a form of prayer.  You can be asking in prayer formally for one thing and then in your daily ramblings complaining how nothing ever works for you. I feel that is another way to ask for stuff, whether one knows it or not. Absolutely, take one and pass it on!
Right on brother,Power to the people,
Martee

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 1:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones/Martee

Martee, I just listened to my sponser tell me what you said almost note for note before I got on here. Have you ever been involved with AA? Your both right. It’s just that I feel so good and I want to pass it on. I’ll keep an open mind and keep doing what I am doing. Sweet guy? Me? O yea I quit drinking maybe so. It just feels vulnerable to me, open for a hit. I’m still sick but it’s gettin’ betta all the time. I hope I’m never well enough to leave the Ibogaine community.             Randy

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] :ron to schmooly
Date: November 22, 2004 at 1:54:27 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

we will pray for you
God Bless you
Francis
Don’t give up Ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re:ron to schmooly

god give me the power to handle the frieght train that’s going to smack me hard.  hope he sends someone into my lofe that can detox me off this poison so there are at least remnants of the real ron. on a personal note thanks to you and all who have wished me well.  of course it is one day at a time and i’m in the pity pot with pop dying , holiday blues and the republicans killing funding for everything that can help the people i serve
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

getting clean is not about good intentions or wil power. Hijacked brain by chemical terrorist.
Pray for the willingness and get a good comfortable detox. If you are not dependant and still want to boot up, then maybe you have to hit a bottom. Yet, the elevator stop at many floors. You don’t have to take it to the basement.

hang in there man. Just throw it away again. keep trying one day at a time. program or no program. Each time you don’t use even though you want to, the urge will leave quicker and you will get your personal power back.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re:ron to schmooly
Date: November 22, 2004 at 1:21:35 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

god give me the power to handle the frieght train that’s going to smack me hard.  hope he sends someone into my lofe that can detox me off this poison so there are at least remnants of the real ron. on a personal note thanks to you and all who have wished me well.  of course it is one day at a time and i’m in the pity pot with pop dying , holiday blues and the republicans killing funding for everything that can help the people i serve
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 4:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

getting clean is not about good intentions or wil power. Hijacked brain by chemical terrorist.
Pray for the willingness and get a good comfortable detox. If you are not dependant and still want to boot up, then maybe you have to hit a bottom. Yet, the elevator stop at many floors. You don’t have to take it to the basement.

hang in there man. Just throw it away again. keep trying one day at a time. program or no program. Each time you don’t use even though you want to, the urge will leave quicker and you will get your personal power back.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones/Martee
Date: November 22, 2004 at 1:15:08 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee, I just listened to my sponser tell me what you said almost note for note before I got on here. Have you ever been involved with AA? Your both right. It’s just that I feel so good and I want to pass it on. I’ll keep an open mind and keep doing what I am doing. Sweet guy? Me? O yea I quit drinking maybe so. It just feels vulnerable to me, open for a hit. I’m still sick but it’s gettin’ betta all the time. I hope I’m never well enough to leave the Ibogaine community.             Randy

From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] God Wants George W as president – it a miracle
Date: November 22, 2004 at 1:03:08 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Slowone,

Guess we will have to wait and see.  I have read that there is going to be a lawsuit, I forget by who.  They have to have it by December when the electorial college meets.  The thing is about the 3 companies that make those black boxes, besides being republician related companies, there is no way to do a recount, no haning chads.  In other words we are having private companies tell us who the president is and there is no way to challenge them.

For the record I am not Rep or Dem, I only voted three times.  I just hate to see a coup in my country.  In fact I was considering not sending the article in because I feel this is a drug help and information forum rather than a political forum.

Best to ya,

– JIM

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
>In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County, Ohio,

>reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters –

>at least 93,136 extra votes total ….
>The Republicans are so BUSTED.

This is also on the web dated as early as Nov 11, 2004. There is
much detailed commentary by conservatives indicating that the
numbers on the page are the result of bad reporting and/or
misinterpreted; certainly the overall result on the page is 2:1 for
Kerry. Also it is not mentioned as valid in an article dated 11/20
on a heavyweight lawsuit over Cuyahoga’s election:

http://www.verifiedvoting.org/article.php?id=5324

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 07:49:36 -0800 Jim Hadey
wrote:
>Hi All,
>
>It’s a miracle, maybe we should call him Saint George.
>
>93,136 EXTRA Votes
>Found In ONE Ohio County
>From Teed Rockwell
>Philosophy Department
>Sonoma State University
>11-19-4
>
>
>You may have seen the associated press story about the precinct in

>Cuyahoga county that had less than 1,000 voters, and gave Bush
>almost 4,000 extra votes.
>
>But that turns out to be only the tip of a very ugly iceberg. The
>evidence discovered by some remarkably careful sleuthing would
>convince any reasonable court to invalidate the entire Ohio
>election.
>
>In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County, Ohio,

>reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters –

>at least 93,136 extra votes total. And the numbers are right there

>on the official Cuyahoga County Board of Elections website:
>
>Bay Village – 13,710 registered voters / 18,663 ballots cast
>Beachwood – 9,943 registered voters / 13,939 ballots cast
>Bedford – 9,942 registered voters / 14,465 ballots cast
>Bedford Heights – 8,142 registered voters / 13,512 ballots cast
>Brooklyn – 8,016 registered voters / 12,303 ballots cast
>Brooklyn Heights – 1,144 registered voters / 1,869 ballots cast
>Chagrin Falls Village – 3,557 registered voters / 4,860 ballots
>cast
>Cuyahoga Heights – 570 registered voters / 1,382 ballots cast
>Fairview Park – 13,342 registered voters / 18,472 ballots cast
>Highland Hills Village – 760 registered voters / 8,822 ballots
>cast
>Independence – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
>Mayfield Village – 2,764 registered voters / 3,145 ballots cast
>Middleburg Heights – 12,173 registered voters / 14,854 ballots
>cast
>Moreland Hills Village – 2,990 registered voters / 4,616 ballots
>cast
>North Olmstead – 25,794 registered voters / 25,887 ballots cast
>Olmstead Falls – 6,538 registered voters / 7,328 ballots cast
>Pepper Pike – 5,131 registered voters / 6,479 ballots cast
>Rocky River – 16,600 registered voters / 20,070 ballots cast
>Solon (WD6) – 2,292 registered voters / 4,300 ballots cast
>South Euclid – 16,902 registered voters / 16,917 ballots cast
>Strongsville (WD3) – 7,806 registered voters / 12,108 ballots cast

>
>University Heights – 10,072 registered voters / 11,982 ballots
>cast
>Valley View Village – 1,787 registered voters / 3,409 ballots cast

>
>Warrensville Heights – 10,562 registered voters / 15,039 ballots
>cast
>Woodmere Village – 558 registered voters / 8,854 ballots cast
>Bedford (CSD) – 22,777 registered voters / 27,856 ballots cast
>Independence (LSD) – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
>Orange (CSD) – 11,640 registered voters / 22,931 ballots cast
>Warrensville (CSD) – 12,218 registered voters / 15,822 ballots
>cast
>
>The Republicans are so BUSTED.
>
>http://boe.cuyahogacounty.us/BOE/results/currentresults1.htm#top
>
>Is the official website of the Cuyahoga county election board,
>providing irrefutable evidence that the vote was off by at least
>93,000.
>
>Kerry lost Ohio by approximately 130,000, so this is not an
>insignificant figure that can be ignored, particularly when there
>are numerous other indications of voter fraud in Ohio and
>elsewhere. I think the only possible alternative is to invalidate
>the entire Ohio election, if not the entire national election.
>
>I’d say the game’s up .America, it looks pretty much like you’ve
>been had.
>
>Sincerely,
>
>Teed Rockwell
>Philosophy Department
>Sonoma State University
>
>
>
>———————————
>Do you Yahoo!?
> Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] [On List] Healing & Spirituality (List & Ron)
Date: November 22, 2004 at 1:02:37 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks to all for the kind thoughts.  althought the list may be secular, i pray  as well.  i don’t want to die this way or continue living this way.  i want to be chemically free, that’s the bottom lone, that’s the only way i can serve others most effectively.ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 6:28 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] [On List] Healing & Spirituality (List & Ron)

Dear List & Ron,

I won’t say, hope you are all keeping well, because I know many of you are not. I have been reading the posts continuously (glancing). I mostly skip over the prescription stuff, which I might add impresses me a great deal as to the high level of pharmaceutical knowledge on the list.

I have also learned a deeper appreciation of the US and its many varieties of people during the Presidential campaign. Its reassuring to know that many millions of Americans do actually care. As for the drug addiction syndrom, apart from the drug usage itself, I see much similarity in what I went through in dealing with childhood abuse. Behind each drug habit there is a story. Thats the real issue – not the drugs.

I do not consider myself properly versed to advise on drug interruption treatment and I also do not believe that is my area. Yet my heart goes out to Ron and his cries for help. From what I have read on the list, one can taper off Benzo’s substituting with heroin rather than methadone and then use ibogaine to come off the heroin.

But it is not just about the addiction is it? Addiction is like the scab on the wound. Once the wound is opened it begins to flow. I know as I have battled for the past 6 years to stop smoking and have continueously relapsed. I am off now and hope to stay off. But there is no point to beat ourselves up, just because we seek pain relief. Thats highly normal. We need to take a kinder view on our behaviour. Addiction is the expression of our unhealed state which ooses pain.

Anyone who has kicked dope in one session needs to realise they have just put one foot on the path and the path may be very long – in fact, out of sight. Unless you wake up to reality, you are going to live in a carefully orchestrated fantasy. So to use a term that Jason Bursey uses, it is vital to, Keep it Real.

Therapy on its own won’t work. Therapy is only ever a support but not a cure. The reality is this: continuous dosing over a period of years to uncover the issues and heal them. In this context a good therapeutic support is useful as is a healthy attitude that turns away from the desire to abuse oneself and others and sees the light in what love has to offer.

So I understand why Ron is so frustrated as the list gets seriously sidetracked and even if he does get your attention, what do you tell him? Is it enough? Or is it that the list is simple there to enable people to have their first ibogaine experience and then relapse for the lack of any real vision as to where to go with ibogaine & therapy?

Healing and spirituality are entertwined. How else could it be? Pain reaches down into the very core of our being – the soul. So if you are to be healed what branch of psychology covers soul healing? None that I am aware of except perhaps Transpersonal Psychology or Rebirthing. So the soul can only be healed by a spirit or spirits working to remove the negative spirits that occupy it. In our case here this spirit is the Eboga spirit – carried by a serpent but not the serpent. Therefore a commitment to heal becomes a commitment to your spirtual growth also.

Supply is the problem. However, as I write I note Brazil is lifting the crimilization of addiction. Maybe supply could come from there one day. Africa is very problematic.

My vision is one of Network (primarily low dose treatment) – one to some – leading to a discreet group of people who pass on the healing to those closest to them, who in turn do the same. In time I believe huge affordable sources of supply will be needed. That thought is with me these days. My initial enthusiasm for healing centers has given way to a simpler and more discreet program of “friends helping friends” in their own homes. Here today, gone tomorrow.

So to Ron I say this. I have been where you are and nothing makes it better. Death seems an easy option – one I often prayed for. Yet death is not an option at all. It only hurts the soul more and then all of that still has to be worked out in the next life. I am very sorry for your situation and pray to God and the Goddess that you will recieve the help you need.

Whenever I was in your position my way to cope was this. I would indulge my deepest despair until I could not depress myself any further. Then I would set myself a goal that inspired me and filled my mind with images of light and well being. With that and the well of despair thoroughly drunk from, I would rise again and move to the next stage of my path. If you keep your eye on the light, you won’t get lost in the dark.

Forgive me if I mention a word on prayer. Prayer for me is when I feel and sense God’s or the Goddess’s or both  presence, and I imagine that he or she or both, hear what I am saying, and then I say: please help me and thank you for all your help so far. (I also look on them as parents.) And I mean what I say. I mention this because when we were children we were taught to pray. And that was more to do with position of hands and string of words. We were never taught how to pray from our souls. And that kind of prayer is the prayer with the best chance of success. What is the soul? Its whats left when you take away all the pretense.

It’s worth reflecting on this:
“Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child shall not enter it.” Mark 10:15
– as this is the state which ibogaine brings us to and where we meet God and the Goddess.
I made it from hell to heaven (mostly for now). It is possible but don’t fool yourself about how difficult it is. You do yourself a great disservice if you do.

Love & Blessings,

Lee

P.S. I have upgraded the web site and added an eboga spiritual healing network. A lot more to do but I hit a brick wall in the  last few months. Waiting for a new surge of inspiration.

http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] [On List] Healing & Spirituality (List & Ron)
Date: November 22, 2004 at 10:59:08 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have Amazing Grace (sorry I neglected to respond before Lee) but haven’t had time to do more than glance through it, for which I apologize. I’ve got a lot on my plate, and suddenly realize that I’ve been taking what spare time I have to place big hurdles that don’t need to be there in my way.

At this point I’m not sure when I’ll have time to give it the attention it deserves Lee, but will do so when I can.
You have a point with the following: “But there is no point to beat ourselves up, just because we seek pain relief. Thats highly normal. We need to take a kinder view on our behaviour. Addiction is the expression of our unhealed state which ooses pain.”
But it’s got a lot to do, in my own case, with the effects on other(s) too, in that I share my life with 10 other living breathing creatures who need me as I do them. This is why I beat myself up, whether it’s valid or not. I beat myself up because I still feel the need to hide my behaviors sometimes, which is stupid and I should know better by now. I beat myself up because I fight this battle in my mind over whether or not I’m “doing good” or “being righteous” or whatnot when I find myself engaging in behavior that ultimately can be ultra-bad for me and those around me. It’s part of the game I suppose, the whole “beat myself up” thing, in that it gives my “disease” an excuse to act up (I mean, it’s my disease doin’ it, right? I’m innocent, I swear!)
;-))
Anyway, I’m feeling somewhat lighter today than in days past, but still have a ways to go. It’s a rollercoaster ride right now, or more of one now than the Space Mountain ride my life usually is.

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 7:28 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] [On List] Healing & Spirituality (List & Ron)

Dear List & Ron,

I won’t say, hope you are all keeping well, because I know many of you are not. I have been reading the posts continuously (glancing). I mostly skip over the prescription stuff, which I might add impresses me a great deal as to the high level of pharmaceutical knowledge on the list.

I have also learned a deeper appreciation of the US and its many varieties of people during the Presidential campaign. Its reassuring to know that many millions of Americans do actually care. As for the drug addiction syndrom, apart from the drug usage itself, I see much similarity in what I went through in dealing with childhood abuse. Behind each drug habit there is a story. Thats the real issue – not the drugs.

I do not consider myself properly versed to advise on drug interruption treatment and I also do not believe that is my area. Yet my heart goes out to Ron and his cries for help. From what I have read on the list, one can taper off Benzo’s substituting with heroin rather than methadone and then use ibogaine to come off the heroin.

But it is not just about the addiction is it? Addiction is like the scab on the wound. Once the wound is opened it begins to flow. I know as I have battled for the past 6 years to stop smoking and have continueously relapsed. I am off now and hope to stay off. But there is no point to beat ourselves up, just because we seek pain relief. Thats highly normal. We need to take a kinder view on our behaviour. Addiction is the expression of our unhealed state which ooses pain.

Anyone who has kicked dope in one session needs to realise they have just put one foot on the path and the path may be very long – in fact, out of sight. Unless you wake up to reality, you are going to live in a carefully orchestrated fantasy. So to use a term that Jason Bursey uses, it is vital to, Keep it Real.

Therapy on its own won’t work. Therapy is only ever a support but not a cure. The reality is this: continuous dosing over a period of years to uncover the issues and heal them. In this context a good therapeutic support is useful as is a healthy attitude that turns away from the desire to abuse oneself and others and sees the light in what love has to offer.

So I understand why Ron is so frustrated as the list gets seriously sidetracked and even if he does get your attention, what do you tell him? Is it enough? Or is it that the list is simple there to enable people to have their first ibogaine experience and then relapse for the lack of any real vision as to where to go with ibogaine & therapy?

Healing and spirituality are entertwined. How else could it be? Pain reaches down into the very core of our being – the soul. So if you are to be healed what branch of psychology covers soul healing? None that I am aware of except perhaps Transpersonal Psychology or Rebirthing. So the soul can only be healed by a spirit or spirits working to remove the negative spirits that occupy it. In our case here this spirit is the Eboga spirit – carried by a serpent but not the serpent. Therefore a commitment to heal becomes a commitment to your spirtual growth also.

Supply is the problem. However, as I write I note Brazil is lifting the crimilization of addiction. Maybe supply could come from there one day. Africa is very problematic.

My vision is one of Network (primarily low dose treatment) – one to some – leading to a discreet group of people who pass on the healing to those closest to them, who in turn do the same. In time I believe huge affordable sources of supply will be needed. That thought is with me these days. My initial enthusiasm for healing centers has given way to a simpler and more discreet program of “friends helping friends” in their own homes. Here today, gone tomorrow.

So to Ron I say this. I have been where you are and nothing makes it better. Death seems an easy option – one I often prayed for. Yet death is not an option at all. It only hurts the soul more and then all of that still has to be worked out in the next life. I am very sorry for your situation and pray to God and the Goddess that you will recieve the help you need.

Whenever I was in your position my way to cope was this. I would indulge my deepest despair until I could not depress myself any further. Then I would set myself a goal that inspired me and filled my mind with images of light and well being. With that and the well of despair thoroughly drunk from, I would rise again and move to the next stage of my path. If you keep your eye on the light, you won’t get lost in the dark.

Forgive me if I mention a word on prayer. Prayer for me is when I feel and sense God’s or the Goddess’s or both  presence, and I imagine that he or she or both, hear what I am saying, and then I say: please help me and thank you for all your help so far. (I also look on them as parents.) And I mean what I say. I mention this because when we were children we were taught to pray. And that was more to do with position of hands and string of words. We were never taught how to pray from our souls. And that kind of prayer is the prayer with the best chance of success. What is the soul? Its whats left when you take away all the pretense.

It’s worth reflecting on this:
“Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child shall not enter it.” Mark 10:15
– as this is the state which ibogaine brings us to and where we meet God and the Goddess.
I made it from hell to heaven (mostly for now). It is possible but don’t fool yourself about how difficult it is. You do yourself a great disservice if you do.

Love & Blessings,

Lee

P.S. I have upgraded the web site and added an eboga spiritual healing network. A lot more to do but I hit a brick wall in the  last few months. Waiting for a new surge of inspiration.

http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: New book on Drug Policy Reform
Date: November 22, 2004 at 10:45:52 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,

Please excuse the shameless self-advertisement, or what may seem like shameless self-advertisement, but I’m so pleased with Cliff’s reaction to the book I just edited (which he is a contributor to btw, but I hope that doesn’t detract from his review) I thought I’d forward it to you all.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: clifford thornton
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 5:40 AM
Subject: New book on Drug Policy Reform

Many of you have responded and said that the link provided earlier did not work.  Well, I’m sorry about that.  Here is a new link and please if for some reason this doesn’t work get back to me.

This book is for all people interested in injustice in this country.  Most if not all aspects of drug policy reform are represented in this book, including race, asset forfeiture, prisons and a lot more.  I have an essay in this book but more importantly this book provides a great cross section of not only the argument but also many of the internal problems within the drug reform movement.

This is for all students and teachers especially the broader public.  It is a great guide for students who want a full spectrum of drug policy.  It is great as a teaching tool.  More importantly it can provide invaluable information on the whats and hows of drug policy reform.  Teachers, encourage your departments to bring this book to your libraries or use it as a core part of your curriculum. As always, you guys and gals have always been an inspiration to me and our organization in all that we do.

Please view
http://www.disinfo.com/site/displayarticle6040.html
Under The Influence: The Disinformation Guide To Drugs :: Disinformation :: The gateway to the underground – news, … [new window] [frame] [preview]

Clifford Wallace Thornton, Jr.

Efficacy
PO Box 1234
860 657 8438
Hartford, CT 06143
efficacy@msn.com
www.Efficacy-online.org

Working to end race and class drug war injustice, Efficacy is a non profit
501 (c) 3 organization founded in 1997. Your gifts and donations are tax
deductible

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 22, 2004 at 10:37:31 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

love your way Jasen.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 4:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.

Dear group.
Hey Guys,

I am here at Sara’s place and it is day 8.

Wonderful experience.To think that I actually almost turned back and went home.
When I first came over(across the other side of the WORLD),I started to panic,..Sh t,
This is it”,,I DON’T KNOW IF I can do this.

But Sara was wonderful,I was put at ease,took the Iboga,first dose 1 gram.
A couple of hours later,another 1.8,then a little after that ,say,..2 to 3 hours later
5 grams.Then it really booted in.

I felt as if I was being wobbled, like I had 7 or 8 tribes men, either side of me,holding me on a rug,
,they were standing and the rug was a few feet of the floor and they were wobbling me.

Vibrated,..as if my cells were vibrating with the melody of the wobbling,roking,uhmmmm  uhmmmmm.

No vomiting. No nausea,…

Risdules,yes  but I tell you ,..NO ORBLEM.up to 15%,but it was not the same sick energy,

It seems to flow,up down,up down,relaxed

EGO,is not a,dirty word.
Ego is not dirty   dirty word.

WoW you really have to let it Go.
I tell you what?my ego was very strong.

I feel mentally exhausted.

I will right again. Saras cooking breakfeast for me,
Downstairsgo
um, Gotta go.

Smiles Jasen         J

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 22, 2004 at 9:58:15 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

For list information, Jasen is talking about doses of ibogaine extract
somewhat similar to the indra product and not ibogaine HCl.  It also appears to me
that Sara is the only provider who approaches the use of iboga/ibogaine with no
set time limitations to patient care on a continuous dose regimen basis.
Those of you who provide ibogaine know who overwhelming the time issue can be.
It is too bad that some government will not provide a medical facility and
support so ibogaine providers from around the world could demonstrate their
particular techniques and dose regimens for comparative evaluation and mutual
education.

Howard

In a message dated 11/22/04 4:16:55 AM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

Dear group.
Hey Guys,

I am here at Sara’s place and it is day 8.

Wonderful experience.To think that I actually almost turned back and went
home.
When I first came over(across the other side of the WORLD),I started to
panic,..Sh t,
This is it”,,I DON’T KNOW IF I can do this.

But Sara was wonderful,I was put at ease,took the Iboga,first dose 1 gram.
A couple of hours later,another 1.8,then a little after that ,say,..2 to
3
hours later
5 grams.Then it really booted in.

I felt as if I was being wobbled, like I had 7 or 8 tribes men, either
side
of me,holding me on a rug,
,they were standing and the rug was a few feet of the floor and they were
wobbling me.

Vibrated,..as if my cells were vibrating with the melody of the
wobbling,roking,uhmmmm  uhmmmmm.

No vomiting. No nausea,…

Risdules,yes  but I tell you ,..NO ORBLEM.up to 15%,but it was not the
same
sick energy,

It seems to flow,up down,up down,relaxed

EGO,is not a,dirty word.
Ego is not dirty   dirty word.

WoW you really have to let it Go.
I tell you what?my ego was very strong.

I feel mentally exhausted.

I will right again. Saras cooking breakfeast for me,
Downstairsgo
um, Gotta go.

Smiles Jasen         🙂

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones/randy
Date: November 22, 2004 at 9:27:54 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy, Randy, Randy,
I believe people frequently attract in others or seek in others(opposite sex especially) that which they need to perpetuate their dysfunctional state (emotionally speaking specifically) and sense of failure(with relationships) and being abandoned or abandoning once again.  That is when they are not in a healthy place.  It’s not the women per se that is truly the problem here.  They are just a manifistation that you can see the drama of what’s really going on with you.
The real secret to not being hurt so bad in relationships is to give love “unconditionally”.  That means you give love and expect nothing in return.  Expecting nothing in return is not coming from a place of “i”m not worthy”, Loving without condition.  Romance is frequently an illusion.  You are illuding yourself to her actions and thoughts and she yours as much of this stuff is either unspoken and assumed or spoken without complete honesty. (either tell them what they want to hear because you’re digging on them at first and what the hell , it’s not that much of a concession.  But concession after concession and then the regrett and the fantasy fades and life sets in on top of all that bullshit.  When things are done up front and unconditionally the whole scenario changes.  That way when it ends and doesn’t work out you are not in such emotional pain.  That is the same way one should give to others as well.  Being able to give and do from an unconditional, unselfish, with out motives or thinking you deserve anything from them back, is the ultimate gift from God.  Let the universe take care of you and that whole what goes around comes around, cause and effect thing will kick in on it’s own.  Giving and receiving is a universal circle.
Maybe if you recognized your whole culpability in those failed relationships, you could forgive them and yourself for where you were and LET IT GO. Truly from your heart not just your brain, take a deep breathe and let it go.  That way you won’t be women bashing.  You don’t hear me man bashing and 15 years ago I could have wrote the book in capital letters.
Don’t be in such a rush to think a serious relationship is what you need on your plate right now.  And after a little while passes and you’re open to it, it is more likely to come your way.  If you’re open to things they get sent your way.  And it’s too late for you to have another “unhealthy relationship”, not a healthy one!  A sweet guy like you, Randy don’t make me laugh.
Once again I thank you for the acknowledgment.  Truthfully I’d been feeling a little down yesterday and this morning and seeing that and your letter was very uplifting.  The opportunity to respond to you has given me great pleasure and a lift of my spirits that you wouldn’t believe.  And this is coming from my heart, not my ego.
I am so thrilled to hear you are getting on with things.
I close with Love,
]                                                                        Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 22, 2004 2:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones

Preston, I admire your honesty. V seems like quite a find. Best of all she loves you. I personally ran from or ran off several women. I feel like it’s too late for me to have a healthy relationship, whatever that is. Just about every time I relapsed it was over a woman. But, God I miss sleeping with my best friend and I don’t see women who can’t be my friend first. Not anymore. I’m trying not to joke here and it is hard given my sick mind but suffice to say I think you and V were made for each other. See I talked about relationships and women and didn’t make one snide comment. I think I’ll go outside and burst now.     Randy    PS I’m still sick but I’m trying.

From: Lee Albert <myeboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] [On List] Healing & Spirituality (List & Ron)
Date: November 22, 2004 at 7:28:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List & Ron,

I won’t say, hope you are all keeping well, because I know many of you are not. I have been reading the posts continuously (glancing). I mostly skip over the prescription stuff, which I might add impresses me a great deal as to the high level of pharmaceutical knowledge on the list.

I have also learned a deeper appreciation of the US and its many varieties of people during the Presidential campaign. Its reassuring to know that many millions of Americans do actually care. As for the drug addiction syndrom, apart from the drug usage itself, I see much similarity in what I went through in dealing with childhood abuse. Behind each drug habit there is a story. Thats the real issue – not the drugs.

I do not consider myself properly versed to advise on drug interruption treatment and I also do not believe that is my area. Yet my heart goes out to Ron and his cries for help. From what I have read on the list, one can taper off Benzo’s substituting with heroin rather than methadone and then use ibogaine to come off the heroin.

But it is not just about the addiction is it? Addiction is like the scab on the wound. Once the wound is opened it begins to flow. I know as I have battled for the past 6 years to stop smoking and have continueously relapsed. I am off now and hope to stay off. But there is no point to beat ourselves up, just because we seek pain relief. Thats highly normal. We need to take a kinder view on our behaviour. Addiction is the expression of our unhealed state which ooses pain.

Anyone who has kicked dope in one session needs to realise they have just put one foot on the path and the path may be very long – in fact, out of sight. Unless you wake up to reality, you are going to live in a carefully orchestrated fantasy. So to use a term that Jason Bursey uses, it is vital to, Keep it Real.

Therapy on its own won’t work. Therapy is only ever a support but not a cure. The reality is this: continuous dosing over a period of years to uncover the issues and heal them. In this context a good therapeutic support is useful as is a healthy attitude that turns away from the desire to abuse oneself and others and sees the light in what love has to offer.

So I understand why Ron is so frustrated as the list gets seriously sidetracked and even if he does get your attention, what do you tell him? Is it enough? Or is it that the list is simple there to enable people to have their first ibogaine experience and then relapse for the lack of any real vision as to where to go with ibogaine & therapy?

Healing and spirituality are entertwined. How else could it be? Pain reaches down into the very core of our being – the soul. So if you are to be healed what branch of psychology covers soul healing? None that I am aware of except perhaps Transpersonal Psychology or Rebirthing. So the soul can only be healed by a spirit or spirits working to remove the negative spirits that occupy it. In our case here this spirit is the Eboga spirit – carried by a serpent but not the serpent. Therefore a commitment to heal becomes a commitment to your spirtual growth also.

Supply is the problem. However, as I write I note Brazil is lifting the crimilization of addiction. Maybe supply could come from there one day. Africa is very problematic.

My vision is one of Network (primarily low dose treatment) – one to some – leading to a discreet group of people who pass on the healing to those closest to them, who in turn do the same. In time I believe huge affordable sources of supply will be needed. That thought is with me these days. My initial enthusiasm for healing centers has given way to a simpler and more discreet program of “friends helping friends” in their own homes. Here today, gone tomorrow.

So to Ron I say this. I have been where you are and nothing makes it better. Death seems an easy option – one I often prayed for. Yet death is not an option at all. It only hurts the soul more and then all of that still has to be worked out in the next life. I am very sorry for your situation and pray to God and the Goddess that you will recieve the help you need.

Whenever I was in your position my way to cope was this. I would indulge my deepest despair until I could not depress myself any further. Then I would set myself a goal that inspired me and filled my mind with images of light and well being. With that and the well of despair thoroughly drunk from, I would rise again and move to the next stage of my path. If you keep your eye on the light, you won’t get lost in the dark.

Forgive me if I mention a word on prayer. Prayer for me is when I feel and sense God’s or the Goddess’s or both  presence, and I imagine that he or she or both, hear what I am saying, and then I say: please help me and thank you for all your help so far. (I also look on them as parents.) And I mean what I say. I mention this because when we were children we were taught to pray. And that was more to do with position of hands and string of words. We were never taught how to pray from our souls. And that kind of prayer is the prayer with the best chance of success. What is the soul? Its whats left when you take away all the pretense.

It’s worth reflecting on this:
“Truly I say to you, whoever does not receive the kingdom of God like a child shall not enter it.” Mark 10:15
– as this is the state which ibogaine brings us to and where we meet God and the Goddess.
I made it from hell to heaven (mostly for now). It is possible but don’t fool yourself about how difficult it is. You do yourself a great disservice if you do.

Love & Blessings,

Lee

P.S. I have upgraded the web site and added an eboga spiritual healing network. A lot more to do but I hit a brick wall in the  last few months. Waiting for a new surge of inspiration.

http://www.my-eboga.com

Free copies of Amazing Grace by Lee Albert for members of the media available here:

www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones
Date: November 22, 2004 at 7:00:48 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy, don’t give up on having a relationship , you just got clean a year from now you will probably feel totally different ,
I will suggest that you go to a naturopath , keep good diet and some exercise and you tell me a year from now that you have a relationship.
your body can be rejuvenated and your way of thinking too.
I think you’ll come visit  us with your new girlfriend by then.

Sara

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2004 8:57
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones

Preston, I admire your honesty. V seems like quite a find. Best of all she loves you. I personally ran from or ran off several women. I feel like it’s too late for me to have a healthy relationship, whatever that is. Just about every time I relapsed it was over a woman. But, God I miss sleeping with my best friend and I don’t see women who can’t be my friend first. Not anymore. I’m trying not to joke here and it is hard given my sick mind but suffice to say I think you and V were made for each other. See I talked about relationships and women and didn’t make one snide comment. I think I’ll go outside and burst now.     Randy    PS I’m still sick but I’m trying.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 22, 2004 at 6:32:12 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen you freakin’  ROCKKK. See. It’s the only way, huh. Tell us more when you can. How long are you going to be there? I’d stay as long as I could if I were you. Everybody was right about aftercare. It sure makes me feel better about everything.     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Martee&Dana
Date: November 22, 2004 at 5:21:19 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee, this is the third time I have tried to send this out. I keep clicking on the wrong icons. So here goes. I was reading some stuff I have saved that inspire me and I came across some notes from you. I want to thank you for your help. I need all the intelligent input on my twisted life I can get. This list has saved me time and again. You guys have convinced me to slow down and do some work on myself. I’m in Erie Pa. and hooked up with AA (very important for me), got a sponsor who is a musician I can’t bullshit, found some work, am set up for therapy and I have been playing out some. Things change fast for the good when I do the ground work. Tell the Ibogaine people slash miracle workers I’ll call soon if you see them if you don’t mind. Dana if you see this please relay the message that I really appreciate the help to the Ibo people. Thanx          Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 22, 2004 at 4:19:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara, you are beautiful. That was so well said. Tell Jasen I said hi and I’m wishing I was there. Some day.                   Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re;JASEN AT SARA’S PLACE.
Date: November 22, 2004 at 4:16:09 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear group.
Hey Guys,

I am here at Sara’s place and it is day 8.

Wonderful experience.To think that I actually almost turned back and went home.
When I first came over(across the other side of the WORLD),I started to panic,..Sh t,
This is it”,,I DON’T KNOW IF I can do this.

But Sara was wonderful,I was put at ease,took the Iboga,first dose 1 gram.
A couple of hours later,another 1.8,then a little after that ,say,..2 to 3 hours later
5 grams.Then it really booted in.

I felt as if I was being wobbled, like I had 7 or 8 tribes men, either side of me,holding me on a rug,
,they were standing and the rug was a few feet of the floor and they were wobbling me.

Vibrated,..as if my cells were vibrating with the melody of the wobbling,roking,uhmmmm  uhmmmmm.

No vomiting. No nausea,…..

Risdules,yes  but I tell you ,..NO ORBLEM.up to 15%,but it was not the same sick energy,

It seems to flow,up down,up down,relaxed

EGO,is not a,dirty word.
Ego is not dirty   dirty word.

WoW you really have to let it Go.
I tell you what?my ego was very strong.

I feel mentally exhausted.

I will right again. Saras cooking breakfeast for me,
Downstairsgo
um, Gotta go.

Smiles Jasen         J

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: [NEWSROOM-L] Experts tell Congress Internet porn causes ad…
Date: November 22, 2004 at 4:05:25 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Man I have to read Burroughs again. I was pretty well out of it when I went through that reading phase. I’m sure it will be completely different now. If I can read Hemingway and Bukowski without drinkin’ I can read Burroughs without shootin’ dope.      Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]from ron to jim and schmooly with thanks
Date: November 22, 2004 at 3:57:40 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

no argument with either of you.  i can’t keep it up forever, but  man i have a lot on my plate. dying father, holiday blues and a jones that could kill me, a mother to worry about and more cases than one can imagine.  i stand between severalmpeople and lethal injection and it is an over whelming task, especially since i i have painted myself n this corner.  can’t leave work b/c no one else qualified in office.  it’s gonna be a ride, but i think i found a benzo wise doc that lives. quite a ways from me.. most docs, all in this town eschew tapering because they think the user is trying to hang on and take the easy way out.  they are idiots as i was when i signed on.  one treatment center treats benzos with darvon for a 2 week detox, that’s the best in town. another prominent addiction guy went thru a short dilaudid / coke phase, was never on the streets and makes a killing here.  i started on the streets, did every drug imaginable, and got straight. but for surrgery, i w/n be here now.  i d/n go looking to get high.  i have to find that right doc, who will trust me on a taper and i worry. c/n score any more on the net, too risky.  god help me b/c i c/n help my self. rwd. these guys in my town will kill me if i let them. i’ve researched and the taper, ashton and variations seem to be the only way.  man it hit at a bad time.  peace friends on everyones journey. non are easy
—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 5:31 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron

Tapering slowly is the only way i know of kicking benzo’s.

And Scmooleyboy has a point.

Taking responsibility for yourself is generally a pre-requisite for overcoming any sort of addiction.

then comes the action part, the “doing”.

You’re only ready when you are truly ready.

On Saturday, November 20, 2004, at 07:12 AM, Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:

Ron,
You keep blameing everyone but youyrself. Yes, most doctors suck. But there are good king knowlegable people out there who will help you. If you know what is right for you, why don’t you just do it. You can buy valium or any other benzo on the web without vere seeing a doc.

Do the teper, get a program, deal with the posy acute withdrawal that will last 3-6 months and alas—- you get your life back.

Get off the pity pot, it’s sounding old. I know this is really hard but on some level no matter how you do it, you must pay the piper.

I kinbow numerous folks who are benzo clean because they really wanted it. wanted more then anything else. They did exactly what they where told to do by qualified detox experts who had a proven track record and they made it. was it hell?–yes to some degree. was it worth it? they always say yes.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones
Date: November 22, 2004 at 2:57:28 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, I admire your honesty. V seems like quite a find. Best of all she loves you. I personally ran from or ran off several women. I feel like it’s too late for me to have a healthy relationship, whatever that is. Just about every time I relapsed it was over a woman. But, God I miss sleeping with my best friend and I don’t see women who can’t be my friend first. Not anymore. I’m trying not to joke here and it is hard given my sick mind but suffice to say I think you and V were made for each other. See I talked about relationships and women and didn’t make one snide comment. I think I’ll go outside and burst now.     Randy    PS I’m still sick but I’m trying.

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 22, 2004 at 2:28:21 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Francis,

It isn’t so that they don’t take it seriously, they are so blinded
By their ego, that all they can feel is “I want, and fuck the rest”.
They don’t know what is love and how to love, their greed is their security.
They are sick in the mind and in their heart, and they don’t even know it.
There is no medicine for selfishness, egotism and greed , it is not even
recognized as a sickness, that is why it is not taken seriously.
They think that if they get a way with it, that means god chose them to see
the bliss.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: maandag 22 november 2004 4:50
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god

Beautiful experience

” as you ,Father are in me and I am in you, may they be also in us…
The glory that you have give me I have given them,
so that they may be one, I in them and you in me .
John 17:20, 22 23

“I came that they have divine life and have it abundently ” John10:10

To bad people dont take this seriously .
God Bless
Francis

—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 7:33 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] an experience of god

Here’s an experience that might be of interest:

http://www.luciddreamer.com/pages/2/index.htm

It’s a personal experience of encountering god which is consistent
with my own in that it revolves around “I AM”. Plus I like a
quotation at the end that reflects on the debate about Faith’s
presence on this list:

The Lazy Man’s Guide to Enlightenment

by Thaddeus Golas

Quote of passages from chapter ten:

..The very people we now see as vulgar, unenlightened, stupid, rip-
offs, insane-these people, when we learn to love them and all our
feelings about them, are our tickets to paradise. And that is all
we need to do-love them.   …We must see them and love them as
they are now, for we cannot deny them the freedom to be what they
are, just as we must love ourselves as we are now.

..If we always stand facing the higher light, like looking into
the sun, our vision of the people around us will be distorted. But
if we have the light coming over our shoulders, shining through us,
we will see the beauty of others, we will be open to the light
coming through all forms, and know the glory of the creation.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 21, 2004 at 10:49:34 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Beautiful experience

” as you ,Father are in me and I am in you, may they be also in us…
The glory that you have give me I have given them,
so that they may be one, I in them and you in me .
John 17:20, 22 23

“I came that they have divine life and have it abundently ” John10:10

To bad people dont take this seriously .
God Bless
Francis

—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 7:33 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] an experience of god

Here’s an experience that might be of interest:

http://www.luciddreamer.com/pages/2/index.htm

It’s a personal experience of encountering god which is consistent
with my own in that it revolves around “I AM”. Plus I like a
quotation at the end that reflects on the debate about Faith’s
presence on this list:

The Lazy Man’s Guide to Enlightenment

by Thaddeus Golas

Quote of passages from chapter ten:

..The very people we now see as vulgar, unenlightened, stupid, rip-
offs, insane-these people, when we learn to love them and all our
feelings about them, are our tickets to paradise. And that is all
we need to do-love them.   …We must see them and love them as
they are now, for we cannot deny them the freedom to be what they
are, just as we must love ourselves as we are now.

..If we always stand facing the higher light, like looking into
the sun, our vision of the people around us will be distorted. But
if we have the light coming over our shoulders, shining through us,
we will see the beauty of others, we will be open to the light
coming through all forms, and know the glory of the creation.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [NEWSROOM-L] Experts tell Congress Internet porn causes addiction to brain’s opiods
Date: November 21, 2004 at 10:38:25 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi again all,
This is the article (below) the last note was referencing, the one that is equating porn with drug use.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Mark Kernes” <markkernes@AVN.COM>
To: <NEWSROOM-L@LISTS.NETSPACE.ORG>
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 2:50 PM
Subject: Re: [NEWSROOM-L] Experts tell Congress Internet porn causes addiction to brain’s opiods

on 11/19/04 9:00 PM, Jules Siegel wrote:

<http://www.wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,65772,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_4>
Internet Porn: Worse than Crack?

By Ryan Singel

11:00 AM Nov. 19, 2004 PT

These people are NOT experts!

And then there’s my take on the subject, which can be found here:

http://www.avn.com/index.php?Primary_Navigation=Articles&Action=View_Article
&Content_ID=206762

Excerpt:

U.S. Senate Committee Hears Bad Science
By: Mark Kernes

WASHINGTON –

The Senate Committee on Commerce, Science, and Transportation quietly held a
hearing Thursday on “The Science Behind Pornography Addiction.” While notice
of the hearing had been posted in the Congressional Register, no one in the
adult entertainment industry had been notified of it by committee staff, and
only four witnesses testified, all of whom have solid credentials as
anti-porn activists — as do several of the committee members.

Arizona Sen. John McCain, who stumped for President Bush on the campaign
trail, chairs the committee, but among the more high-profile members are
Republicans Sam Brownback (Kan.) and Trent Lott (Miss.) who are frequently
lauded by pro-censorship groups like the American Family Assn. and Concerned
Women for America, and in the right-wing religious press.

At least two of the witnesses are similarly distinguished. Though Dr. Judith
Reisman’s official bio neglects to mention her testimony in front of the
Meese Commission on her study of cartoons in adult magazines, it does
include her stint as a prosecution witness for the state of Ohio when it
attempted to remove photos by Robert Mapplethorpe from Cincinnati’s
Contemporary Arts Center — the move failed, thanks to attorney H. Louis
Sirkin — and her institute’s amicus brief against Stephen Knox, who was
convicted in federal court of child pornography for videotaping children
with a focus on their (clothed) groin areas.

Dr. Jeffrey Satinover made his anti-sex bones through a series of books,
lectures — he spoke, for instance, at the 2004 Conservative Political
Action Conference — and testimony in which he¹s denied that there¹s a
controlling genetic component to sexual orientation — in other words,
homosexuality, he claims, is a choice.

While not as well-known as Reisman and Satinover, Dr. Mary Anne Layden has a
history of being an anti-porn witness. For instance, in 1999 testimony
before another Senate Commerce Committee panel, she falsely claimed that in
a study, “Five hours of pornographic videos produced a belief in these 18
year-old subjects that 24 million Americans are having sex with Fido,” and
that, “In 14 years I have not treated one case of sexual violence that did
not involve pornography. In every case of sibling incest that I have
treated, the kind of pornography involved has been soft-core nonviolent
pornography. Exposing children to pornography meets the criteria for
childhood sexual abuse.”

(more)

Mark Kernes, Sr. Ed., AVN

NetSpace LISTSERV(R) software donated by L-Soft, Inc.   http://www.lsoft.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [NEWSROOM-L] Experts tell Congress Internet porn causes addiction to brain’s opiods
Date: November 21, 2004 at 10:36:55 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Re: Experts tell Congress Internet porn causes
Hi all,
This was posted on Jules Siegel’s always informative and interesting Newsroom-L news list.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Otto Steinmayer
To: NEWSROOM-L@LISTS.NETSPACE.ORG
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 8:20 PM
Subject: Re: [NEWSROOM-L] Experts tell Congress Internet porn causes addiction to brain’s opiods

What alarms me about this is not the up-front issue on the minds of the reactionaries, namely that “porn is wicked and must be banned,” but the statement that “the brain becomes addicted to its own opioids.”  Okay, are we also going to tested by the Drug Agencies for unauthorized production in our adrenals of cortisol in excess of Federal Standards?  Will those who suffer from Cushing’s Syndrome be busted and thrown in the slammer?  Shall the judge thunder in righteous indignation?  Shades of Erewhon!!

Endorphins are in us for a reason.  A healthy level of endorphins results in the condition known as “feeling good.”  I have read speculation that depression can result from too-low levels of endorphins, and I suspect something like this may be operating in my case, for those periods when I feel, blue and pleasure-less, and at the same time have an increased sensitivity to pain.  Sex does perk me up, when available.  Porn—if anybody would call what I fancy “porn”; for in my opinion what gets me pleased is to almost all porn out there as a crumb of zweiback to a Bavarian creme bombe—does help the juices.  Physical activity moves up the juices too; many people joggers or work out much harder in order to feel that warm endorphin glow after effort.  By definition you can’t get “addicted” to endorphins; or perhaps we ARE all addicted.  I understand that if you give a powerful opioid-antagonist to a normal person unhabituated to external opioids you will bring on painful symptoms resembling withdrawal.

Will it come to the 1984 government project of abolishing the orgasm?  To get really extreme about it, I cite Wm. S. Burroughs, whose comment [in The Western Lands] on that passage was that the 1984 vision of “a boot smashing the human face forever” could not be stood by any animal, such as ourselves, and so the aim of that gov’t was not eternal domination but extermination.

Otto

Otto Steinmayer
P.O. Box 13
94500 Lundu, Sarawak
Malaysia
tel: 082-320205
h/p: 019-837-9017

website: http://www.ikanlundu.com
NetSpace LISTSERV(R) software donated by L-Soft, Inc. http://www.lsoft.com

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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones
Date: November 21, 2004 at 8:48:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Three Cheers for you, it is always better to be straight forward with our
loved ones.  But it can be down right scarey to tell them something you know
will upset them.  It takes bravery…..I bet you feel much better?
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 21, 2004 4:48 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones

Hey all,
Not sure why I’m telling you all this, but I feel like I kinda have
to.
I went ahead and opened up to V this morning. It was just getting too
freakin’ hard to hide it, knowing she knew something was up already and
not
really buying my denials. It was causing me and her both way too much
stress
and hardship, my keeping it bottled up and denying it constantly. I want
to
live with this woman the rest of my life, so as hard as it is to admit to
her I can be and often still am a weak-willed (or whatever we might want
to
call it) individual at time, as humiliating as it is to admit I don’t have
total control over myself when it comes to my drug use still, well, it’s a
drag- but I decided it was more a drag not talking to her about it. She’s
my
best friend, so I did it.
Anyway, sitting here with a pounding headache and a heavy but somewhat
relieved heart (she and I are best friends, so it came out better than I’d
been setting myself up to fear, of course, as it usually does when I just
talk to her), and wanted to let you all know I’m not a complete jerk, that
I
do respect and admire V to the upmost degress and felt like crap hiding it
from her.
So, I guess I’m going to make another attempt at “improvement” since
that old expression about “if at first we don’t succeed…” does ring
true.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] re: loved ones
Date: November 21, 2004 at 7:48:55 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey all,
Not sure why I’m telling you all this, but I feel like I kinda have to.
I went ahead and opened up to V this morning. It was just getting too freakin’ hard to hide it, knowing she knew something was up already and not really buying my denials. It was causing me and her both way too much stress and hardship, my keeping it bottled up and denying it constantly. I want to live with this woman the rest of my life, so as hard as it is to admit to her I can be and often still am a weak-willed (or whatever we might want to call it) individual at time, as humiliating as it is to admit I don’t have total control over myself when it comes to my drug use still, well, it’s a drag- but I decided it was more a drag not talking to her about it. She’s my best friend, so I did it.
Anyway, sitting here with a pounding headache and a heavy but somewhat relieved heart (she and I are best friends, so it came out better than I’d been setting myself up to fear, of course, as it usually does when I just talk to her), and wanted to let you all know I’m not a complete jerk, that I do respect and admire V to the upmost degress and felt like crap hiding it from her.
So, I guess I’m going to make another attempt at “improvement” since that old expression about “if at first we don’t succeed…” does ring true.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: [Ibogaine] an experience of god
Date: November 21, 2004 at 7:33:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Here’s an experience that might be of interest:

http://www.luciddreamer.com/pages/2/index.htm

It’s a personal experience of encountering god which is consistent
with my own in that it revolves around “I AM”. Plus I like a
quotation at the end that reflects on the debate about Faith’s
presence on this list:

The Lazy Man’s Guide to Enlightenment

by Thaddeus Golas

Quote of passages from chapter ten:

..The very people we now see as vulgar, unenlightened, stupid, rip-
offs, insane葉hese people, when we learn to love them and all our
feelings about them, are our tickets to paradise. And that is all
we need to do様ove them.   …We must see them and love them as
they are now, for we cannot deny them the freedom to be what they
are, just as we must love ourselves as we are now.

..If we always stand facing the higher light, like looking into
the sun, our vision of the people around us will be distorted. But
if we have the light coming over our shoulders, shining through us,
we will see the beauty of others, we will be open to the light
coming through all forms, and know the glory of the creation.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] God Wants George W as president – it a miracle
Date: November 21, 2004 at 6:54:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County, Ohio,

reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters –

at least 93,136 extra votes total ….
The Republicans are so BUSTED.

This is also on the web dated as early as Nov 11, 2004. There is
much detailed commentary by conservatives indicating that the
numbers on the page are the result of bad reporting and/or
misinterpreted; certainly the overall result on the page is 2:1 for
Kerry. Also it is not mentioned as valid in an article dated 11/20
on a heavyweight lawsuit over Cuyahoga’s election:

http://www.verifiedvoting.org/article.php?id=5324

On Sun, 21 Nov 2004 07:49:36 -0800 Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Hi All,

It’s a miracle, maybe we should call him Saint George.

93,136 EXTRA Votes
Found In ONE Ohio County
From Teed Rockwell
Philosophy Department
Sonoma State University
11-19-4

You may have seen the associated press story about the precinct in

Cuyahoga county that had less than 1,000 voters, and gave Bush
almost 4,000 extra votes.

But that turns out to be only the tip of a very ugly iceberg. The
evidence discovered by some remarkably careful sleuthing would
convince any reasonable court to invalidate the entire Ohio
election.

In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County, Ohio,

reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters –

at least 93,136 extra votes total. And the numbers are right there

on the official Cuyahoga County Board of Elections website:

Bay Village – 13,710 registered voters / 18,663 ballots cast
Beachwood – 9,943 registered voters / 13,939 ballots cast
Bedford – 9,942 registered voters / 14,465 ballots cast
Bedford Heights – 8,142 registered voters / 13,512 ballots cast
Brooklyn – 8,016 registered voters / 12,303 ballots cast
Brooklyn Heights – 1,144 registered voters / 1,869 ballots cast
Chagrin Falls Village – 3,557 registered voters / 4,860 ballots
cast
Cuyahoga Heights – 570 registered voters / 1,382 ballots cast
Fairview Park – 13,342 registered voters / 18,472 ballots cast
Highland Hills Village – 760 registered voters / 8,822 ballots
cast
Independence – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
Mayfield Village – 2,764 registered voters / 3,145 ballots cast
Middleburg Heights – 12,173 registered voters / 14,854 ballots
cast
Moreland Hills Village – 2,990 registered voters / 4,616 ballots
cast
North Olmstead – 25,794 registered voters / 25,887 ballots cast
Olmstead Falls – 6,538 registered voters / 7,328 ballots cast
Pepper Pike – 5,131 registered voters / 6,479 ballots cast
Rocky River – 16,600 registered voters / 20,070 ballots cast
Solon (WD6) – 2,292 registered voters / 4,300 ballots cast
South Euclid – 16,902 registered voters / 16,917 ballots cast
Strongsville (WD3) – 7,806 registered voters / 12,108 ballots cast

University Heights – 10,072 registered voters / 11,982 ballots
cast
Valley View Village – 1,787 registered voters / 3,409 ballots cast

Warrensville Heights – 10,562 registered voters / 15,039 ballots
cast
Woodmere Village – 558 registered voters / 8,854 ballots cast
Bedford (CSD) – 22,777 registered voters / 27,856 ballots cast
Independence (LSD) – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
Orange (CSD) – 11,640 registered voters / 22,931 ballots cast
Warrensville (CSD) – 12,218 registered voters / 15,822 ballots
cast

The Republicans are so BUSTED.

http://boe.cuyahogacounty.us/BOE/results/currentresults1.htm#top

Is the official website of the Cuyahoga county election board,
providing irrefutable evidence that the vote was off by at least
93,000.

Kerry lost Ohio by approximately 130,000, so this is not an
insignificant figure that can be ignored, particularly when there
are numerous other indications of voter fraud in Ohio and
elsewhere. I think the only possible alternative is to invalidate
the entire Ohio election, if not the entire national election.

I’d say the game’s up .America, it looks pretty much like you’ve
been had.

Sincerely,

Teed Rockwell
Philosophy Department
Sonoma State University

———————————
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Meet the all-new My Yahoo! &#150; Try it today!

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] A Chronology of Selected Abstracts
Date: November 21, 2004 at 6:44:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I tried sending this yesterday but apparently it did not make it through
cyberspace.  So here goes again.

http://www.ibogaine.org/whatsnew.html

The Ibogaine Dossier has been given permission by Addiction Research
Institute, Inc., a leading ibogaine development corporation to provide A Chronology of
Selected Abstracts, Ibogaine: Rapid Method for the Interruption of the
Narcotic Addiction Syndrome. The Chronology is an excellent collection of abstracts
relating to the use of ibogaine in the treatment of narcotic dependence as
well as, addressing safety issues. The document was originally presented at the
20th conference of the American Association for the Treatment of Opioid
Dependence (AATOD) held in Orlando in October 2004. It is also available as a
downloadable PDF document file. PDF files require an Adobe Reader. I you don’t have
one, a free version may be obtained from Adobe. Just check
http://www.ibogaine.org/whatsnew.html for the Chronology.

Howard

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From: “CURL” <chris@curl.me.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] taking ibogaine alone
Date: November 21, 2004 at 6:25:52 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi. I am a new poster to this group. I am considering taking ibogaine in an
attempt to come off of a heroin addiction.

Brief using history. I have been using heroin for 3 to 4 years. At present I
smoke around a gram a day (down from about twice that ammount that I was
taking 4 months ago). I have had 3 attempts at detoxifying over the past 2
months and have managed only 3 or 4 days – through the point of absolute
physical and mental horror but not much further.

I recently joined a local drugs project and attend meetings and activities
plus have a drugs worker who is giving me alot of time and support. I had a
brief discussion with him about ibogaine and he was open to the idea but I
dont know whether professionally he can support me (watch over me etc) if I
choose to take it.

I interested if anyone has any advice about taking ibogaine alone: any
personal experiences, dosages, warnings etc.

Is it a feasable idea? Or are the risks too great?

Any help would be very welcome.

Best wishes Chris

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] God Wants George W as president – it a miracle
Date: November 21, 2004 at 10:49:36 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi All,

It’s a miracle, maybe we should call him Saint George.

93,136 EXTRA Votes
Found In ONE Ohio County
From Teed Rockwell
Philosophy Department
Sonoma State University
11-19-4

You may have seen the associated press story about the precinct in Cuyahoga county that had less than 1,000 voters, and gave Bush almost 4,000 extra votes.

But that turns out to be only the tip of a very ugly iceberg. The evidence discovered by some remarkably careful sleuthing would convince any reasonable court to invalidate the entire Ohio election.

In last Tuesday’s election, 29 precincts in Cuyahoga County, Ohio, reported votes cast IN EXCESS of the number of registered voters – at least 93,136 extra votes total. And the numbers are right there on the official Cuyahoga County Board of Elections website:

Bay Village – 13,710 registered voters / 18,663 ballots cast
Beachwood – 9,943 registered voters / 13,939 ballots cast
Bedford – 9,942 registered voters / 14,465 ballots cast
Bedford Heights – 8,142 registered voters / 13,512 ballots cast
Brooklyn – 8,016 registered voters / 12,303 ballots cast
Brooklyn Heights – 1,144 registered voters / 1,869 ballots cast
Chagrin Falls Village – 3,557 registered voters / 4,860 ballots cast
Cuyahoga Heights – 570 registered voters / 1,382 ballots cast
Fairview Park – 13,342 registered voters / 18,472 ballots cast
Highland Hills Village – 760 registered voters / 8,822 ballots cast
Independence – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
Mayfield Village – 2,764 registered voters / 3,145 ballots cast
Middleburg Heights – 12,173 registered voters / 14,854 ballots cast
Moreland Hills Village – 2,990 registered voters / 4,616 ballots cast
North Olmstead – 25,794 registered voters / 25,887 ballots cast
Olmstead Falls – 6,538 registered voters / 7,328 ballots cast
Pepper Pike – 5,131 registered voters / 6,479 ballots cast
Rocky River – 16,600 registered voters / 20,070 ballots cast
Solon (WD6) – 2,292 registered voters / 4,300 ballots cast
South Euclid – 16,902 registered voters / 16,917 ballots cast
Strongsville (WD3) – 7,806 registered voters / 12,108 ballots cast
University Heights – 10,072 registered voters / 11,982 ballots cast
Valley View Village – 1,787 registered voters / 3,409 ballots cast
Warrensville Heights – 10,562 registered voters / 15,039 ballots cast
Woodmere Village – 558 registered voters / 8,854 ballots cast
Bedford (CSD) – 22,777 registered voters / 27,856 ballots cast
Independence (LSD) – 5,735 registered voters / 6,226 ballots cast
Orange (CSD) – 11,640 registered voters / 22,931 ballots cast
Warrensville (CSD) – 12,218 registered voters / 15,822 ballots cast

The Republicans are so BUSTED.

http://boe.cuyahogacounty.us/BOE/results/currentresults1.htm#top

Is the official website of the Cuyahoga county election board, providing irrefutable evidence that the vote was off by at least 93,000.

Kerry lost Ohio by approximately 130,000, so this is not an insignificant figure that can be ignored, particularly when there are numerous other indications of voter fraud in Ohio and elsewhere. I think the only possible alternative is to invalidate the entire Ohio election, if not the entire national election.

I’d say the game’s up .America, it looks pretty much like you’ve been had.

Sincerely,

Teed Rockwell
Philosophy Department
Sonoma State University

Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: [mmj4cp] Re: Danger in THC -NOT
Date: November 21, 2004 at 10:06:07 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Shcmooly boy. I had Dr.’s tell me that marinol is not anywhere near as effective as herb. Good Dr.’s. They told me to smoke when I went through the Hep C protocol. I t helped a lot for the nausea and malaise that comes with the interferon and Rebotrol. Another gift from God.      Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive
Date: November 21, 2004 at 9:26:28 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, I might be wrong but I think Marvin Gay was kicking a coke addiction when he wrote sexual healing. If he didn’t it is still a cool coincidence. I love that song so much I down loaded it so as to not forget it. I”ve been thinking about all my ex’s. Kinda funny one of them fell right in my lap. er…… So to speak. HeHe     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer
Date: November 21, 2004 at 9:17:36 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Paula, nurses are a gift from God too. You keep right on being a nurse. I trust nurses way more than Dr.’s. Most of you do it because you love people. God knows it’s not the money.   Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine dosage etc
Date: November 21, 2004 at 9:08:53 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel&Jeff, this the hard part. This too will pass. It’s still way better than detoxing without Ibogaine. You have to figure, is this worth it? Yes, it is. Look at the alternatives. Methadone for life or a few bad days? I know the bad days suck but I swear it won’t last long. Smoke a joint, have sex or do whatever you have to do to get through it. I recommend both. It will pass. It gets a whole lot better, fast. Hang tuff.            Randy

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: [mmj4cp] Re: Danger in THC -NOT
Date: November 21, 2004 at 2:43:30 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Does marinol get you high? and if it does, how does it compare to smoking Herb?

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [mmj4cp] Re: Danger in THC -NOT
Date: November 20, 2004 at 11:14:48 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “Michael Krawitz” <miguet@infionline.net>
To: “Ardys DeLu” <firedeer@copper.net>; <mmj4cp@lists.riseup.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:00 PM
Subject: [mmj4cp] Re: Danger in THC -NOT

At 07:34 PM 11/20/2004, Ardys DeLu wrote:
I heard about THC overdose from someone I consider intelligent and educated.  Is this true?  She said that it can cause people to stop breathing, and hearts to stop beating.  As I write this I wonder why I believed her at all.  But I would like some references to show.
Thanks,

Ardys of Berkeley

Cannabis “overdose” is similar to Marinol “overdose”. They don’t
mention death when taken as a pill.

The short description of Cannabis “overdose” is a panic attack.

See Marinol “overdose” in the PDR:

WARNINGS

Patients receiving treatment with MARINOL® Capsules should be specifically
warned not to drive, operate machinery, or engage in any hazardous activity
until it is established that they are able to tolerate the drug and to
perform such tasks safely.

OVERDOSAGE

Signs and symptoms following MILD MARINOL® (Dronabinol) Capsules
intoxication include drowsiness, euphoria, heightened sensory awareness,
altered time perception, reddened conjunctiva, dry mouth and tachycardia;
following MODERATE intoxication include memory impairment,
depersonalization, mood alteration, urinary retention, and reduced bowel
motility; and following SEVERE intoxication include decreased motor
coordination, lethargy, slurred speech, and postural hypotension.
Apprehensive patients may experience panic reactions and seizures may occur
in patients with existing seizure disorders.

Michael

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 9:18:43 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

He has been a member of the ibogaine lists for a long time, his
site is linked by mindvox, and as far as I remember nothing bad
has ever been said about him.

[on the ibogaine lists] By which I mean that I expect there are
many satisfied customers.

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 9:04:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

He has been a member of the ibogaine lists for a long time, his
site is linked by mindvox, and as far as I remember nothing bad has
ever been said about him.

http://sacrament.kibla.si/

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 14:35:02 -0800 The Garden
<GardenRestaurant@comcast.net> wrote:
A guy called Marko, provider of Ibo

The musictherapy site? Just what is on the web page. Try
searching
on their names. Once I sent an email to see if they had more
music,
but never got a reply.

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 12:01:58 -0800 The Garden
<GardenRestaurant@comcast.net> wrote:
Who are the guys in Austria ? Do you have any informations.

—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 07:45:32 -0800 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 11/20/04 10:34:18 AM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
writes:

(it was hard enough to tell you all, considering I’ve been

to

at

least one or two people a shining ibo “success” story

Preston,

You are a shining ibo success story.  The problem is that
ibogaine

is so amazing that people expect it to be more amazing than
it
is.

People expect it to cure everything and last forever.

And yes, I would be in the group saying to take ibogaine
again.

Preston, you are a shining example exactly because you are
posting
the down as well as the up. Congratulations for your courage.
Did
you get into therapy or some other aftercare? I would be in
the
group suggesting this.

I believe iboga shows us what can be achieved if we work on
ourselves – it doesn’t replace the work. Better to go after
your
stuff before it wakes up and comes after you. Redosing sounds
good
in addition. I recommend that anyone taking iboga for help
with
a
problem commit to a year of therapy or equivalent, minimum.
This
list is turning out well that way too, but something in-
person,
be
it an individual or group can really be key. Another bit of
random
advice: be cautious with drama, the mundane is your friend
post-
ibo.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [mmj4cp] Danger in THC
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:55:03 PM EST
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “Myke” <myke@compassionatecoalition.org>
To: “Ardys DeLu” <firedeer@copper.net>
Cc: <mmj4cp@lists.riseup.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 8:17 PM
Subject: Re: [mmj4cp] Danger in THC

First, a reference:
http://www.worldofmolecules.com/drugs/thc.htm
According to that, the LD50 (The level where 50% of the test subjects die) is so large for THC, and the parts of the brain that control vital functions such as respiration do not have many receptors, so are relatively unaffected even by doses larger than could ever be ingested under any normal conditions.  (i.e., If you’re not shooting up laboratory grade THC in extremely high doses in an extremely short period of time, it’s not going to happen.)
LD50 is 1270 mg/kg in male rats, and 730 mg/kg in female rats.
On the other hand, if you were to consume about three quarts of water or more all at once, you would suffer from water intoxication, and this is even serious enough to require medical treatment.
Marijuana, it’s safer than water (Dr. Fry even quoted me at the Rally at the state capitol a couple years ago, I was sitting behind her when she gave her speech about how it’s safer than aspirin, and I yelled out “It’s safer than water” and she used it in her speech.  =) )
Tell this person to go do some more research before spreading rumors about cannabis and THC..  Or to quote drug-overdose.com:
http://www.drug-overdose.com/marijuana.htm

The Drug Awareness Warning Network Annual Report, published by the US federal government contains a statistical compilation of all drug deaths which occur in the United States. According to this report, there has never been a death recorded from the use of marijuana by natural causes. Unlike opiates, barbiturates or amphetamines, there seems to be little risk from the use of large amounts of marijuana. When a person smokes too much they feel very tired and lie down. When people swallow large amounts of hashish, occasionally they get sick to their stomach.
Marijuana’s effect on the user depends on the strength or potency of the THC it contains. THC potency has increased since the 1970s but has been about the same since the mid-1980s. The strength of the drug is measured by the average amount of THC in test samples confiscated by law enforcement agencies. THC is the chemical in marijuana which makes you feel “high” (which means experiencing a change in mood and seeing or feeling things differently). Certain parts of the plant contain higher levels of THC. The flowers or buds have more THC than the stems or leaves
-Myke
myke@compassionatecoalition.org
Ardys DeLu wrote:
I heard about THC overdose from someone I consider intelligent and educated.  Is this true?  She said that it can cause people to stop breathing, and hearts to stop beating.  As I write this I wonder why I believed her at all.  But I would like some references to show.
Thanks,

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:41:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the elucidation. Sounds like good advice. I hope your
friend turns up ok.

I think there is no hard and fast rule here.
I just think that if you take Ibo to get clean, it is a good idea
to abstain from all mind altering chemical
for a while and let the body and mind heal.

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 15:05:04 -0800 Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
I have several friends who where mainly opiate addicts but some
did other
drugs too like coc and alcohol. They all got clean on Ibo. Thay
did Hausca
through Santo Daime Church ( sic) about one month post Ibo and
relapsed several
days later with dope. One of those friends is the daughter of
preists of the
Hausca Church and she has been taking that scrament since she was

a child.
Still, her addiction took her to hell and back and I lost touch
with  her. I hope
she found her way back home. The word Shaman has shame in it.

I know Huichol peyote shaman who would hit bottom periodically
with booze
only to have a friend rescue then again and take them on Wirikuta
( sacred
peyote walk) so they could get grounded again.

I think there is no hard and fast rule here. I just think that if
you take
Ibo to get clean, it is a good idea to abstain from all mind
altering chemical
for a while and let the body and mind heal.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:10:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well said sara.

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 7:40:46 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 14:32:14 -0800 Hannah Clay
<hannah.clay@ntlworld.com> wrote:
Is it true that St John’s wort can interfere with the
contraceptive pill?  I also heard you shouldn’t take it if
you’re asthmatic?  Is it an MAOI?  I really need to know cuz
I’m on Effexor (antidepressant) and it must not be
mixed with MAOI’s.

A person in a therapy group said her doctor said to take St. John’s
Wort while waiting for her Prozac to kick in. There are varieties
of MAOI’s, including reversible/irreversible and A/B. I would stay
away from pharma MAOI’s for sure. If Effexor is working for you,
why
even think of taking St. John’s Wort? My experience of its effects
include 1) mild antidepressive action, 2) very mild stimulant, less
than green tea, 3) a tendency to buffer the downside of marijuana,
and 4) most importantly it seems to help fight off colds/flu about
2/3 of the time.

I went to buy some multivitamins yesterday but then there’s so
many different types that I ended up buying none cuz it was too
confusing.  They do general multivit and minerals and then
separately Kava kava and Gingko and stuff.  What should I take?
Any ideas?  I’m 23, vegetarian

I suggest a vitamin-enriched food yeast if you can find it. I think
it has the best price generally for what you get. The taste is like
Marmite, which might also be a good supplement. Whatever you get,
make sure it has B12.

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Rachel
Date: November 20, 2004 at 7:35:48 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh Julie…

Thanks!  Thanks!!  It’s so hard for him and he’s
having a heck of time finding the motivation to do
much.

The booster yesterday has put him back a bit — time
is moving so slowly again, and tonight he feels very
emotional.  We had a good Indian meal out, but his
skin felt so heavy to him he could barely sit up at
the table.  Poor guy.

Anyway, I keep trying to encourage him on the exercise
thing and am going to clear off the living room floor
right now to see if I can persuade him to try some
yoga after I get home from my Al-Anon meeting this
evening.

We’ve been chowing on the B12. Is the ginger tea for
your tummy?  He’s not had any nausea or problems with
his appetite.  Au contraire – he is often complaining
of feeling empty.

Anyway, I am stuffed now from dinner.  Glad to hear
from you and that your sex life is so wonderful as a
result.  More on ours later.

much love,

rachel
— Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:

Tell Jeff not to worry- it’s going to get
substantially better in due time.  Also, keep in
mind
how long the ‘done stays in your body- I was
positive
for it 25 days after my treatment.  IMHO, you can’t
even BEGIN to start feeling better until all that
shite is out of your system.

Because he was such a long term user, it might take
a
bit longer to normalize all his brain chemicals, and
to completely excrete all the meth out of his
system.
If possible, tell him to stay off as many meds/drugs
as long as possible- they made my situation worse.

Carrot, apple, ginger juice has been making me feel
SO
good…Ginger tea with honey, also…B12 vitamins
seem
to help with energy.  The lack of energy is gone
now,
but it took about 3 full weeks to get over it.  Tell
him to get as much exercise as possible, even though
the motivation may not be there.  Take him to a
movie,
or out for dinner…anything to distract him from
how
he’s feeling.

And oh yeah: give him a lot of love and affection…

love Julie

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 6:49:08 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It is very good that we can share opinions here. I do see that mind alerting can be air.
As there is no rule there shouldn’t be any judgement what is given by our creator should be respected as a sacrament,
Only some people feel that a Shaman should be like this… or that…
When a shaman doesn’t work with his/her heart in the right place  we know it will turn against him/ her ,
When we honour to serve a sacrament then we have connection to the meaning of our existents, looking at it from a point of view of a shaman,
It is each and every individual and their path. And each path on what level it is or just seems to be can only be corrected by that individual soul searching and not an
Outsider . it is spirit above matter that does the healing if you let go of your judgement …how a things should be looking like , let go of that… we don’t have a contract with our creator  we live now and we struggle now and we have joy now try to make the best of it now that’s all,
There are no perfect people there are no perfect shamans and we all just have to live in the same world, there is no magic formula of perfect human being so
Just be yourself and try to love the people around you and make a better day for them your kindness and acceptance of others will give you an kick every day again.
A better kick then any drug can give but you only can discover it by an act of kindness everyday again, serving a sacrament is an act of kindness to me
Especially when I see how it can improve the understanding of a person of his own soul searching and by that finding comfort in their path.
[sorry if my English is not perfect)L

Sara

Van: Schmoolyboy@aol.com [mailto:Schmoolyboy@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zondag 21 november 2004 0:05
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions

I have several friends who where mainly opiate addicts but some did other drugs too like coc and alcohol. They all got clean on Ibo. Thay did Hausca through Santo Daime Church ( sic) about one month post Ibo and relapsed several days later with dope. One of those friends is the daughter of preists of the Hausca Church and she has been taking that scrament since she was a child. Still, her addiction took her to hell and back and I lost touch with her. I hope she found her way back home. The word Shaman has shame in it.

I know Huichol peyote shaman who would hit bottom periodically with booze only to have a friend rescue then again and take them on Wirikuta ( sacred peyote walk) so they could get grounded again.

I think there is no hard and fast rule here. I just think that if you take Ibo to get clean, it is a good idea to abstain from all mind altering chemical for a while and let the body and mind heal.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Chronology of Selected Abstracts – Ibogaine/Opioids
Date: November 20, 2004 at 6:45:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The Ibogaine Dossier has been given permission by Addiction Research
Institute, Inc., a leading ibogaine development corporation to provide A Chronology of
Selected Abstracts, Ibogaine: Rapid Method for the Interruption of the
Narcotic Addiction Syndrome. The Chronology is an excellent collection of abstracts
relating to the use of ibogaine in the treatment of narcotic dependence as
well as, addressing safety issues. The document was originally presented at the
20th conference of the American Association for the Treatment of Opioid
Dependence (AATOD) held in Orlando in October 2004. It is also available as a
downloadable PDF document file. PDF files require an Adobe Reader. I you don’t have
one, a free version may be obtained from Adobe. Just check
http://www.ibogaine.org/whatsnew.html for the Chronology.

Howard

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 6:40:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Saturday, November 20, 2004, at 12:32 PM, Hannah Clay wrote:

Is it true that St John’s wort can interfere with the contraceptive pill?  I
also heard you shouldn’t take it if you’re asthmatic?  Is it an MAOI?  I
really need to know cuz I’m on Effexor (antidepressant) and it must not be
mixed with MAOI’s.

I don’t know about all that but I tried St. Johns while I was still on methadone and it cut the methadone half life in half, my dose usually held me for about 20-24 hours but with St Johns I was in withdrawal at like 12 hours. This went for almost a week before I realized it was the St.Johns making me ill.

-DH

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Testing 1, 2, 3, testing, testing, testing (I can’t hear a thing)
Date: November 20, 2004 at 6:37:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: bcalabrese@yahoo.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you are coming thru loud and clear.

and yes, we have been talking about you. or actually it was me, asking if you’d been heard from. I sent you an offlist email months ago but no response… just making sure you still have a pulse, buddy. glad to see you do.

hope all is well.

peace,
-Dave

On Saturday, November 20, 2004, at 09:56 AM, Brett Calabrese wrote:

Patrick

Sending to “ibogaine-help@mindvox.com,  <ibogaine@mindvox.com>,  patrick@phantom.com, bcalabrese@yahoo.com”. I get no replies from ibogaine-help, a “test” post to the ibogaine@mindvox.com, subscribing or unsubscribing, I get nothing. BUT I do get some (but not all) of the ibogaine posts. I seem to miss the first post more often than not and get mostly  “RE:” posts, but not all of them, far as I can tell. I get nothing, no errors, they are not being caught in one of my filters, if so they should land in my TRASH folder or Yahoo flags them as SPAM they sometimes wind up in BULK, but nothing is here.

So, can you check to see if this email gets to you and ibogaine@mindvox.com, or ibogaine-help@mindvox.com and then if it is sending something out to bcalabrese@yahoo.com OR you could give me a shell account with read permissions to the important stuff and I will find it/debug <g>?

If this gets to the ibogaine list, someone send me a reply please.

Grrrrrrrrrr………

Brett

<image.tiff>

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The all-new My Yahoo! ñ Get yours free!

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron
Date: November 20, 2004 at 6:31:17 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tapering slowly is the only way i know of kicking benzo’s.

And Scmooleyboy has a point.

Taking responsibility for yourself is generally a pre-requisite for overcoming any sort of addiction.

then comes the action part, the “doing”.

You’re only ready when you are truly ready.

On Saturday, November 20, 2004, at 07:12 AM, Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:

Ron,
You keep blameing everyone but youyrself. Yes, most doctors suck. But there are good king knowlegable people out there who will help you. If you know what is right for you, why don’t you just do it. You can buy valium or any other benzo on the web without vere seeing a doc.

Do the teper, get a program, deal with the posy acute withdrawal that will last 3-6 months and alas—- you get your life back.

Get off the pity pot, it’s sounding old. I know this is really hard but on some level no matter how you do it, you must pay the piper.

I kinbow numerous folks who are benzo clean because they really wanted it. wanted more then anything else. They did exactly what they where told to do by qualified detox experts who had a proven track record and they made it. was it hell?–yes to some degree. was it worth it? they always say yes.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 6:20:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

MAO inhibitors were discovered to be “psychic energizers” when anti TB compounds like isoniasid ( which had MAOI properties) where noted to elevate mood in TB patients. They were then widly used to treat depression till there occassional but serious interactions with a variety of foods and drugs reduced their popularity.

MAO is an important enzyme in the degredation of catecholamines( epinephrine and nor epinephron) and indolethylamines. When the enzyme is inhibited, catechlolamines ande seretonin concentrations are increased. Increased catecholamines causes psychostimulation.

MAO inhibitors can cause severe hypertensive reactions with encephalopathy and cardiovascular events.

This hypertensive crisis occurs when people on MAO-I’s consume sympathomometic drugs( stimulants) and dietary catecholamine precursors.

Examples are nasal sprays and decongestants, cocaine, wine and cheese.

Any foods that contain the amini acid, Tyramine will cause this reaction. Chianti wines are notorious for this.

Thus these drugs need to be used very carefully and are rarely prescribed these days. St Johns is a very week MAO inhibitor but addicts do a strange thing,,,,, they take more then the recommended dosage. Thus, you see the problem.

Consumer reports did a study of the top 10 St Johns products and found the dosage listed on the bottle to be anywhere from 5%less to 250% higher then stated.

Hope this helps.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 6:07:43 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

likewise Hannah, thinking well for you, but the “I’m 23” thing is a bit depressing. Oh how I wish for 23 again.

But then, I wouldn’t be where I am now, I’d be on the streets smoking crack, and that sucked for me at 23, so I guess 23 again isn’t such a great idea for me.

;-))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 5:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions

Is it true that St John’s wort can interfere with the contraceptive pill? I
also heard you shouldn’t take it if you’re asthmatic?  Is it an MAOI?  I
really need to know cuz I’m on Effexor (antidepressant) and it must not be
mixed with MAOI’s.

I went to buy some multivitamins yesterday but then there’s so many
different types that I ended up buying none cuz it was too confusing. They
do general multivit and minerals and then separately Kava kava and Gingko
and stuff.  What should I take?  Any ideas?  I’m 23, vegetarian with a
terrible diet (chocolate and ice-cream but I’m trying to change Martee ;-))
I’m on the above mentioned AD as well as Subutex.  I have severe problems
with sleeping all the time (and I mean ALL the time-once I go to sleep
(which can take hours) I then sleep for days!  I have little energy and
suffer from anxiety as well as depression.  I know I’ve gotta change my diet
but I’ve had eating problems since I was a kid and can’t bear to put on
weight.  I can’t eat big meals cuz then I just want to be sick.  I hate the
feeling of being full!  So I just have a few snacks of chocolate and only
really eat meals when I’m out with my mum and she forces me to.  I do eat
meals like once every 2 days but then its takeaway-chips or something that
takes as little effort!  I realise I’ve got to sort this out but could
anyone advise what Vits I should take?

Sorry to be so general and useless!  I’m just so indecisive and then I get
stressed cuz I can’t make a decision so I give up and don’t get anything!

Love to everyone,  in particular Jason-I hope you’re happy and healing, and
Preston-I feel for you and am sending positive vibes across the water to you
🙂

Hannah x
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 6:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions

Schmooly, are you sure that mild reversible MAOI’s like St. John’s
Wort have such interactions? It is commonly reported that ayahuasca
doesn’t interact (tho people also warn on principle about that).
The only side effect I know is the photosensitivity, plus as I
mentioned before, enough St. John’s (like harmala alkaloids) will
stop acid production in the stomach, which is uncomfortable if you
have food digesting.

Earlier you wrote that ayahuasca within 90 days of ibogaine seemed
to trigger relapse in users of … methamphetamine, methadone, I
forget which. Can you say how many cases, and which substance?

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 16:46:24 -0800 Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
>St Johns Wart is a natural mild natural form of an MAO inhibitor
>drug.  These
>are old antodepressants that doc used 20 years ago and have a lot
>of nasty
>side effects and interactions w/ certain amino acids found
>commonly in cheese
>and wine etc.. I don’r recommend them. They do nothing for  sleep.

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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 6:05:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have several friends who where mainly opiate addicts but some did other drugs too like coc and alcohol. They all got clean on Ibo. Thay did Hausca through Santo Daime Church ( sic) about one month post Ibo and relapsed several days later with dope. One of those friends is the daughter of preists of the Hausca Church and she has been taking that scrament since she was a child. Still, her addiction took her to hell and back and I lost touch with her. I hope she found her way back home. The word Shaman has shame in it.

I know Huichol peyote shaman who would hit bottom periodically with booze only to have a friend rescue then again and take them on Wirikuta ( sacred peyote walk) so they could get grounded again.

I think there is no hard and fast rule here. I just think that if you take Ibo to get clean, it is a good idea to abstain from all mind altering chemical for a while and let the body and mind heal.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 5:58:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

getting clean is not about good intentions or wil power. Hijacked brain by chemical terrorist.
Pray for the willingness and get a good comfortable detox. If you are not dependant and still want to boot up, then maybe you have to hit a bottom. Yet, the elevator stop at many floors. You don’t have to take it to the basement.

hang in there man. Just throw it away again. keep trying one day at a time. program or no program. Each time you don’t use even though you want to, the urge will leave quicker and you will get your personal power back.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for schmooly from ron
Date: November 20, 2004 at 5:52:54 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry for your loss and I now understand more. I am sure you are fixable. We will speak again soon. hang in there. Tough times don’t last-tough people do. If you have the willingness, then you can do it. The right Doc, right detox protocol, right aftercare and a little room left for G-d to work a miracle.

If you pray to G-d to help you dig a hole,,, you better bring a shovel

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 5:35:02 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A guy called Marko, provider of Ibo

The musictherapy site? Just what is on the web page. Try searching
on their names. Once I sent an email to see if they had more music,
but never got a reply.

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 12:01:58 -0800 The Garden
<GardenRestaurant@comcast.net> wrote:
Who are the guys in Austria ? Do you have any informations.

—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 07:45:32 -0800 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 11/20/04 10:34:18 AM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
writes:

(it was hard enough to tell you all, considering I’ve been to

at

least one or two people a shining ibo “success” story

Preston,

You are a shining ibo success story.  The problem is that
ibogaine

is so amazing that people expect it to be more amazing than it
is.

People expect it to cure everything and last forever.

And yes, I would be in the group saying to take ibogaine again.

Preston, you are a shining example exactly because you are
posting
the down as well as the up. Congratulations for your courage.
Did
you get into therapy or some other aftercare? I would be in the
group suggesting this.

I believe iboga shows us what can be achieved if we work on
ourselves – it doesn’t replace the work. Better to go after your
stuff before it wakes up and comes after you. Redosing sounds
good
in addition. I recommend that anyone taking iboga for help with
a
problem commit to a year of therapy or equivalent, minimum. This
list is turning out well that way too, but something in-person,
be
it an individual or group can really be key. Another bit of
random
advice: be cautious with drama, the mundane is your friend post-
ibo.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 5:32:14 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is it true that St John’s wort can interfere with the contraceptive pill?  I
also heard you shouldn’t take it if you’re asthmatic?  Is it an MAOI?  I
really need to know cuz I’m on Effexor (antidepressant) and it must not be
mixed with MAOI’s.

I went to buy some multivitamins yesterday but then there’s so many
different types that I ended up buying none cuz it was too confusing.  They
do general multivit and minerals and then separately Kava kava and Gingko
and stuff.  What should I take?  Any ideas?  I’m 23, vegetarian with a
terrible diet (chocolate and ice-cream but I’m trying to change Martee ;-))
I’m on the above mentioned AD as well as Subutex.  I have severe problems
with sleeping all the time (and I mean ALL the time-once I go to sleep
(which can take hours) I then sleep for days!  I have little energy and
suffer from anxiety as well as depression.  I know I’ve gotta change my diet
but I’ve had eating problems since I was a kid and can’t bear to put on
weight.  I can’t eat big meals cuz then I just want to be sick.  I hate the
feeling of being full!  So I just have a few snacks of chocolate and only
really eat meals when I’m out with my mum and she forces me to.  I do eat
meals like once every 2 days but then its takeaway-chips or something that
takes as little effort!  I realise I’ve got to sort this out but could
anyone advise what Vits I should take?

Sorry to be so general and useless!  I’m just so indecisive and then I get
stressed cuz I can’t make a decision so I give up and don’t get anything!

Love to everyone,  in particular Jason-I hope you’re happy and healing, and
Preston-I feel for you and am sending positive vibes across the water to you
🙂

Hannah x
—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 6:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions

Schmooly, are you sure that mild reversible MAOI’s like St. John’s
Wort have such interactions? It is commonly reported that ayahuasca
doesn’t interact (tho people also warn on principle about that).
The only side effect I know is the photosensitivity, plus as I
mentioned before, enough St. John’s (like harmala alkaloids) will
stop acid production in the stomach, which is uncomfortable if you
have food digesting.

Earlier you wrote that ayahuasca within 90 days of ibogaine seemed
to trigger relapse in users of … methamphetamine, methadone, I
forget which. Can you say how many cases, and which substance?

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 16:46:24 -0800 Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
St Johns Wart is a natural mild natural form of an MAO inhibitor
drug.  These
are old antodepressants that doc used 20 years ago and have a lot
of nasty
side effects and interactions w/ certain amino acids found
commonly in cheese
and wine etc.. I don’r recommend them. They do nothing for  sleep.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Preston, re:cigs
Date: November 20, 2004 at 5:23:36 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

He can take a small dose of Iboga on an empty stomach in the morning,
That can help his craving a lot if not totally.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Verzonden: zaterdag 20 november 2004 22:53
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] Preston, re:cigs

Preston,

My boyfriend just quit smoking with Zyban, and a lot
of willpower…It’s been 5 weeks, and he’s still
having cravings.  God, do they ever go away???

I wish you the best of luck in your journey.

luv Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Sara + Jasen
Date: November 20, 2004 at 5:21:00 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie,

We doing fine around here, just had a dose of Colombian mushrooms together
with Jason, he feels great and he send his love to you,
he wanted to post earlier but can get yahoo to work for him right.
We both understand “spirit above matter” that all that it takes,
Don’t put Iboga into dogmas it just can do this or that…it is only
chemistry that goes like this or that …
There is more to it then just a spirit in a bag of bones.
But an realization is an individual thing.

Thank you so much for keeping us in your mind and heart,
We do that too, there is “spirit above Matter”.

Love to all from Jason and me,
Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Verzonden: zaterdag 20 november 2004 14:59
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] Sara + Jasen

Hi Sara and Jasen,

I have been thinking about both of you, and am glad to
hear you are well, Jasen.  Please post whenever you
feel up to it..

love Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive
Date: November 20, 2004 at 5:12:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

Isn’t it great?  While on meth, I was lucky if I had
the ‘urge’ once a week…now, it’s every day, several
times…

Sexual healing is amazing… hook up with your ex if
you can.  Make it special for her, and you’ll both be
in heaven…

Anyone know of any effective natural aphrodisiacs- I
want to keep this sensation going and going and
going…ad infinitum…

love Julie

__________________________________
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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Rachel
Date: November 20, 2004 at 5:04:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tell Jeff not to worry- it’s going to get
substantially better in due time.  Also, keep in mind
how long the ‘done stays in your body- I was positive
for it 25 days after my treatment.  IMHO, you can’t
even BEGIN to start feeling better until all that
shite is out of your system.

Because he was such a long term user, it might take a
bit longer to normalize all his brain chemicals, and
to completely excrete all the meth out of his system.
If possible, tell him to stay off as many meds/drugs
as long as possible- they made my situation worse.

Carrot, apple, ginger juice has been making me feel SO
good…Ginger tea with honey, also…B12 vitamins seem
to help with energy.  The lack of energy is gone now,
but it took about 3 full weeks to get over it.  Tell
him to get as much exercise as possible, even though
the motivation may not be there.  Take him to a movie,
or out for dinner…anything to distract him from how
he’s feeling.

And oh yeah: give him a lot of love and affection…

love Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Preston, re:cigs
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:52:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston,

My boyfriend just quit smoking with Zyban, and a lot
of willpower…It’s been 5 weeks, and he’s still
having cravings.  God, do they ever go away???

I wish you the best of luck in your journey.

luv Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:31:58 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston,

Thanks for posting this-at least I know I’m not alone in this madness!  I
don’t have any advise but don’t feel alone.  I can totally sympathise with
everything you’re saying including the guilt from lying to our loved ones.
You’re not alone, I’m right there with you, at least know that your post
helped me.  If you find the answer, let me know!

Lots of love,
Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 3:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

Life Rocks and you help it along nicely.<

Thanks Randy, and Martee, and the others who wrote off-list and on.
It’s that age-old addict thing. Kicking myself in the head trying to
figure
out the whys, why I’m basically going through the whole “self-sabotage”
thing yet again.
I feel very torn between the “damn it, if I could just use in the
fashion I ‘desire’ without worry about being ‘in trouble’ for it,
regardless
of who it is I’d be in trouble with, I’d be fine,” and the “why are you
doing this again, and why can’t you simply stop right now?” thing. I mean,
I
keep going through the whole, “ok, just this once,” (and if I hear even
one
“I told you so” I’m going to seriously regret having opened up here), on
to
“ok, I’ve thrown the rig away, and I won’t do it again,” to “V isn’t home,
I
can do it now without getting ‘caught'” to “shit, this is stupid, why am I
doing this again?” to “I wish I could just figure out how to get my meds
in
the way I like best without guilt or fear or stress,” to “I hate myself,”
to
“why am I beating myself up over this, I should just be open about it,” to
etc, etc.
I used a rig a couple times in the past few days, alternating between
eating and banging my meds, then got up early yesterday morning, saying,
“ok, I don’t want to do this anymore again,” and threw it away (wrapping
it
up with newspaper in a plastic bag to disguise it) then realized V was
going
out to dj last night so I could use the rig “safely” so I ran downstairs
while she was napping to dig the rig out of the trash, then as I was
climbing the stairs I accidentally tossed the rig out the hallway window
(honest, it was an accident, although I suspect that ol’ subconsciousness
was acting up again), so I didn’t use a rig afterall.
I got up today, took my first dose as prescribed, but when I needed to
redose hours later this morning, after V was asleep, I ran out and bought
another freakin’ rig.
I feel schizophrenic. I’m hiding this, even after having already been
“caught” by V once since ibo and having gone through the whole
conversation
I’m sure most everyone here has had at least once. What I really, really
want to do is just tell her, because I don’t feel like I can go on like
this
much longer, pretending everything is super cool when there this niggling
little issue in the background which isn’t that far in the background as
the
days go by. But I’m scared to death to do so (it was hard enough to tell
you
all, considering I’ve been to at least one or two people a shining ibo
“success” story and it’s embarrassing and a bit humiliating admitting I’m
not el-superdude- if anyone really thought that anyway), not wanting to go
through that stress and pain and anguish either. So I keep telling myself,
“ok, I’m stopping and everything will be cool and she doesn’t have to know
because I’m going to get back on top of this and won’t fuck it up anymore
so
she doesn’t have to know, right?” But I can’t seem to stop myself- like
with
the stinkin’ fucking cig as a matter of fact- both are causing me problems
but I haven’t been able to find the right key to stop myself. I mean, this
is getting ridiculous. In the mean time, I keep going back and forth,
getting lonelier and lonlier feeling, considering all sorts of black and
horrid actions in my mind when getting overly depressed and worked up over
this, and feeling worse and worse, all the while pretending everything is
cool.
Argh.
I’m not even sure why I’m telling you all this. I know some are going
to
say, “take ibo again, and stop taking opiates,” and others are going to
suggest vitamines and excercise, some are going to say “rat yourself out,”
and others are going to tell me other things, all well meaning and with
the
very best of intentions. And I’m going to have heard them all. So what’s
the
freakin’ point of discussing it anyway?
But this time I’m not hitting delete instead of send. As a matter of fact,
I’m going to hit send because I’ve got to get this into the open, even if
it’s just here for now. It’s driving me out of my fucking mind and I’m not
enjoying it at all. Yet, still, I’m having trouble simply stopping.
Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

Preston, remember that song by Soundgarden the Superunknown? A line in it
says “first it steals your mind and then it steals your soul.” Wonder what
they are talking about? They’re in Seattle at the time so I have to
assume.
I woke up thinking about you and your situation, put on some tunes and
that
song by Soundgarden hit me right between the eyes. Think I’ll keep it in
the
90’s and go for Alice in Chains next. Man I wish that guy had found the
Ibogaine before it was too late. Life Rocks and you help it along nicely.

Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:21:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/20/04 3:52:30 PM Eastern Standard Time, slowone@hush.ai writes:
Rachel, I assume this is mg/kg? That’s an heroic course
Jeff here
yes MG/kg my weight     being at that time 227 lbs or just a bit more than 100 kg (i think)
anyway thanks for the kind thoughs baby steps indeed
Jeff

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:20:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The musictherapy site? Just what is on the web page. Try searching
on their names. Once I sent an email to see if they had more music,
but never got a reply.

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 12:01:58 -0800 The Garden
<GardenRestaurant@comcast.net> wrote:
Who are the guys in Austria ? Do you have any informations.

—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 07:45:32 -0800 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 11/20/04 10:34:18 AM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
writes:

(it was hard enough to tell you all, considering I’ve been to

at

least one or two people a shining ibo “success” story

Preston,

You are a shining ibo success story.  The problem is that
ibogaine

is so amazing that people expect it to be more amazing than it
is.

People expect it to cure everything and last forever.

And yes, I would be in the group saying to take ibogaine again.

Preston, you are a shining example exactly because you are
posting
the down as well as the up. Congratulations for your courage.
Did
you get into therapy or some other aftercare? I would be in the
group suggesting this.

I believe iboga shows us what can be achieved if we work on
ourselves – it doesn’t replace the work. Better to go after your
stuff before it wakes up and comes after you. Redosing sounds
good
in addition. I recommend that anyone taking iboga for help with
a
problem commit to a year of therapy or equivalent, minimum. This
list is turning out well that way too, but something in-person,
be
it an individual or group can really be key. Another bit of
random
advice: be cautious with drama, the mundane is your friend post-
ibo.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate
Program:
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Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:18:05 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The other thing I think being a nurse, is what about protecting against blood clots,  there was a place in the literature for a guy that did very well then collapsed and died two days later. was it a clot?  There are ted stocking for sale in the pharmacies, maybe a good investment. You stay still for so long, most hospitals have the surgical patients put them on and walk to the surgical place.  Might also be a low tech way of ensuring safe treatment…oh god I am such a nurse…noway of changing that behavior.. but remember the young girl 23 or 24 that died she flew on the discount airline and died of a blood clot in her legs it was in the news….as ever Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:10 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer

If that thing works that would be great for treatment. Gotta try this now. Someone probably has.             Randy

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 3:52:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel, I assume this is mg/kg? That’s an heroic course.
Congratulations to Jeff and all helpers. To Jeff: let yourself take
baby steps. It may seem like iboga is gone, but the spirit is still
with you, and you can find it if you want, in small changes of
perspective that might yield deeper insights. Now could be a good
time to draw pictures of what you encountered and are feeling, both
to have it for memory and to explore in the moment, and maybe take
your mind off your symptoms. 🙂

Cold gray November rain ain’t helping the mood.

I wonder if this music would help:

http://www.musictherapyworld.de/modules/mmmagazine/showarticle.php?a
rticletoshow=63&language=en

Dose 1, 3 mg, c. 8 p.m., Friday, 11/5
Dose 2, 2 mg, c. 12 midnight., Saturday, 11/6
Dose 3, 2 mg, c. 9:00 a.m., Saturday
..
TOTAL > 32.2 mg in a little less than five day period.

Dose 13/Booster 2, 3 mg (?), at 5:45 a.m., Fri, 11/19
Dose 14/Booster 3, 3 mg (?), at 6:50 a.m., Fri, 11/19

He’s pretty down again, like a “setback” from feeling
the withdrawals he did Thursday night — runny nose,
watery eyes, yawning — and after feeling somewhat
better Wednesday with the sunny warm day.  Cold gray
November rain ain’t helping the mood.

Lots of love, Rachel

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Testing 1, 2, 3, testing, testing, testing (I can’t hear a thing)
Date: November 20, 2004 at 3:09:43 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, ibogaine-help@mindvox.com, patrick@phantom.com, bcalabrese@yahoo.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Brett, I see it and your other post. I haven’t been
able to keep up with all the messages here in the last
weeks but I also have the same thing where a lot of
the messages yahoo puts into bulk and some of them
never get sent but the sending isn’t to the list, it’s
email to friends. yahoo has been like for for more
then a month, I mentioned it before, their help
doesn’t solve anything.

Carla B

— Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com> wrote:

If this gets to the ibogaine list, someone send me a
reply please.

Grrrrrrrrrr………

Brett

———————————
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 3:01:58 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Who are the guys in Austria ? Do you have any informations.

—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 07:45:32 -0800 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 11/20/04 10:34:18 AM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

(it was hard enough to tell you all, considering I’ve been to at

least one or two people a shining ibo “success” story

Preston,

You are a shining ibo success story.  The problem is that ibogaine

is so amazing that people expect it to be more amazing than it is.

People expect it to cure everything and last forever.

And yes, I would be in the group saying to take ibogaine again.

Preston, you are a shining example exactly because you are posting
the down as well as the up. Congratulations for your courage.  Did
you get into therapy or some other aftercare? I would be in the
group suggesting this.

I believe iboga shows us what can be achieved if we work on
ourselves – it doesn’t replace the work. Better to go after your
stuff before it wakes up and comes after you. Redosing sounds good
in addition. I recommend that anyone taking iboga for help with a
problem commit to a year of therapy or equivalent, minimum. This
list is turning out well that way too, but something in-person, be
it an individual or group can really be key. Another bit of random
advice: be cautious with drama, the mundane is your friend post-
ibo.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

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From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Testing 1, 2, 3, testing, testing, testing (I can’t hear a thing)
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:56:17 PM EST
To: ibogaine-help@mindvox.com, ibogaine@mindvox.com, patrick@phantom.com, bcalabrese@yahoo.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Patrick

Sending to “ibogaine-help@mindvox.com,  <ibogaine@mindvox.com>,  patrick@phantom.com, bcalabrese@yahoo.com”. I get no replies from ibogaine-help, a “test” post to the ibogaine@mindvox.com, subscribing or unsubscribing, I get nothing. BUT I do get some (but not all) of the ibogaine posts. I seem to miss the first post more often than not and get mostly  “RE:” posts, but not all of them, far as I can tell. I get nothing, no errors, they are not being caught in one of my filters, if so they should land in my TRASH folder or Yahoo flags them as SPAM they sometimes wind up in BULK, but nothing is here.

So, can you check to see if this email gets to you and ibogaine@mindvox.com, or ibogaine-help@mindvox.com and then if it is sending something out to bcalabrese@yahoo.com OR you could give me a shell account with read permissions to the important stuff and I will find it/debug <g>?

If this gets to the ibogaine list, someone send me a reply please.

Grrrrrrrrrr………

Brett

Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!

From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ibogaine dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:53:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi List,

I’m hoping Jeff will post his own feelings about the
process soon as he’s felt up and down about expecting
to feel “better” than he does right now.  We got him
some wheatgrass juice this afternoon and are trying
for a massage tomorrow.

Anyone who is thinking about or pursuing treatment —
please try to listen to and HEAR Howard and everyone
who is saying the initial “detox” is only part of your
solution.  Now comes recovery:  feeling everything
that’s been anaesthetized over the years, lots of
fatigue, depression, and other after-effects that are
perhaps to be expected after a run like he had and
given his age.  BUT which he de-emphasized in his
enthusiasm for finding a miraculous way to get
un-handcuffed.

Several recent treatees have reported being up and
around within 2 weeks; that has not been his
experience although he is not “pushing” himself
particularly hard given the levels of exhaustion.

In terms of the experimental process, which must vary
according to how one responds to the medicine, I’ll
report Jeff’s dosing over the last two weeks, which
was “stepped” over time based on an estimated body
weight of 100 kilos.  (He weighed 227 or 229 lbs. in
street clothes).

FYI, He had been on 50 mg methadone for the previous 3
years, and on 80 mg methadone for about five or six
years before that.  Previous to stabilizing on MMT he
had a heroin & cocaine habit that ranged in intensity
over a fifteen or so year period.  I think he smoked
heroin for the first time when he was 18 and finally
detoxed at age 45.  Last methadone, Thursday, November
4th, at 1:00 p.m.

Dose 1, 3 mg, c. 8 p.m., Friday, 11/5
Dose 2, 2 mg, c. 12 midnight., Saturday, 11/6
Dose 3, 2 mg, c. 9:00 a.m., Saturday
Dose 4, 2 mg, c. 4:44 p.m., Saturday
Dose 5, 2 mg, c. 7:15 p.m., Saturday

At this stage he had had 11 mg and was starting to get
a bit anxious about the process.  The provider-angels
weren’t sure he had pushed out all the methadone at
that point, but decided to go ahead with “the flood.”

Doses 6, 7, 8, & 9 for a total of 13.3 mg were given
over an hour between 10:50 p.m. and 11:44 p.m.
Saturday
*I think he must have taken an anti-nausea med around
10 p.m., and kept the doses down until 1:34 a.m. when
he vomited some and then “took off,” including
intoning this whole Gyoto monk-like thing after the
vibes of his puking.  I think these were broken up as
something like 2, 3.3, 4 & 4 mg each.

We meant to give him his follow-up dose earlier in the
day on Monday but everyone was sleeping and he wasn’t
hurting, so eventually he got

Dose 10, 2 mg, at 4:10 p.m, Monday, 11/8
*with a valium (he was not psyched about reentering
the fuzzy-sand-hard feeling of being with the Eboga)
after he experienced residual withdrawals.

Dose 11, 2.9 mg, at 7:10 p.m., Monday, 11/8

Dose 12/Booster 1, 3 mg, at 1:13 p.m., Wednesday,
11/10

TOTAL > 32.2 mg in a little less than five day period.

About four or five days later, he still felt
physically uncomfortable, so we obtained two more
booster doses which were supposed to be 3 mg. each.
He put off taking these for a few more days as he was
averse to renentering an intense entheogenic “place

Dose 13/Booster 2, 3 mg (?), at 5:45 a.m., Fri, 11/19
Dose 14/Booster 3, 3 mg (?), at 6:50 a.m., Fri, 11/19

He’s a bit unclear about this (or questioning it)
because by the time he finally did take the boosters
— yesterday, Friday, two weeks after the whole course
of treatment began — he had nothing near the reaction
or sensations he did with the initial dosing.  I mean
he was sitting up, talking to me, cuddling me, having
conversations, etc. — not quiet or internal at all.
So he’s wondering why it did not affect him as much at
all.

His stomach was empty as it was morning.  I believe he
took Zoloft for three days prior to the last boosters
– 25 mg. Tues, 50 mg. Wed, and 50 mg Thurs. morning
around 10 a.m., so 19 hours prior to his boost.

He’s pretty down again, like a “setback” from feeling
the withdrawals he did Thursday night — runny nose,
watery eyes, yawning — and after feeling somewhat
better Wednesday with the sunny warm day.  Cold gray
November rain ain’t helping the mood.

Lots of love, Rachel

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:30:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Sat, 20 Nov 2004 07:45:32 -0800 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 11/20/04 10:34:18 AM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

(it was hard enough to tell you all, considering I’ve been to at

least one or two people a shining ibo “success” story

Preston,

You are a shining ibo success story.  The problem is that ibogaine

is so amazing that people expect it to be more amazing than it is.

People expect it to cure everything and last forever.

And yes, I would be in the group saying to take ibogaine again.

Preston, you are a shining example exactly because you are posting
the down as well as the up. Congratulations for your courage.  Did
you get into therapy or some other aftercare? I would be in the
group suggesting this.

I believe iboga shows us what can be achieved if we work on
ourselves – it doesn’t replace the work. Better to go after your
stuff before it wakes up and comes after you. Redosing sounds good
in addition. I recommend that anyone taking iboga for help with a
problem commit to a year of therapy or equivalent, minimum. This
list is turning out well that way too, but something in-person, be
it an individual or group can really be key. Another bit of random
advice: be cautious with drama, the mundane is your friend post-
ibo.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:17:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

O yea, I forgot to say, I tried wellbutrin after Ibogaine and I felt worse. I think I took it too early. Glad I did because now I’m not on any anti depression stuff and feel pretty good. Libido off the charts. I think I like this.     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:14:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, it hit me like that and it hasn’t gone away too. Cool huh? I’m in another town and I just ran into an old girlfriend. Hmmmmmmm.        Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:10:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If that thing works that would be great for treatment. Gotta try this now. Someone probably has.             Randy

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] To Martee from Francis
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:07:57 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Martee !!
I heard very good things about your brother, people love
him here and some love the facts that he was an hippi too 🙂
You know I was reading your E-mail and I will not change a comma from what
you wrote : I agree on everything.
When I was writing about : peace, ” humility, patience, compansion and
understanding ”  this was about Love. Sometimes I am afraid to use this word
because I am afraid of the reaction of people. I believe in Angels and I own
them my life. In Venezuela I went throught a real miracle that saved my
life. I know it was a miracle because I was in an extreme danger of death
and I had to make very fast decisions in order to save my skin. Great peace
came upon me, everything went in slow motion and I had all the time in the
world to control the trajectorie of my car. This was in the Andes, at on a
small road at 2000 feets. I was passing a huge Mack truck when suddently I
found myself in front of another Mack comming out of a curve at the top of
the mountain. As I told you, I could control my wheels according to the
tunnel of wind when I was in beetween the two trucks; left, right, left,
right, seconds pass like minutes. I didnt realize that this was a miracle
until many years later. I thought it was some phenomena of the brain in
extreme circumstances
I’ve seen evil too, when I grow up in Africa, I witnessed
multiple possessions, just like in the freaking hollywood movies. I was so
shock at the time ( I was sixteen ) that I couldn’t talk about the
experience for years.
Skinny, little women groaning and eating  red-burning coal; They were
rolling on the flooor and showing incredible strength!!
I was scared to death:-)
In Madagascar they have a name for this type of possession  ( tchoumba ) and
it’s part of the realities of their life.
In Africa evil show is face, here he don’t have too: he own the place.
Even after been through experiences of this type, I was still in
denial until God brought me on my knees. Finally reading a book I had  a
spritual awakening, fears left me and peace came.

I gave up the fight against my addictions and completely surrendered to Him.
When you surrender you win 🙂 as simple as this…..
Faith and Grace, even in great amount are nothing without works.
Actualy I am turning my life around  to be able to help on a full time
basis.

God Bless you

Francis
P.S. Sorry for the spelling but English is not my first language.

About Hypoglycemia from a study 95 % of the alcoholics suffers from this
disease the rest are pre diabetic or diabetic.
I add this problem too

—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.

Interesting info.  I also know and have conservative friends and
family.
I
usually don’t do politics as a rule, however, avoid it completely with
certain people.  I am interested if you can give me info where to learn
more
on the whole collective consciousness  for healing.  It sounds exactly
like
something I would tap into.  I had lunch yesterday with a mutual
aquaintance.  My brother is also your local southernmost holyman!  Any
info
would be appreciated.       Martee
—- Original Message —–
From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 11:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives

I found this study at
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/07/22_politics.shtml

very interesting:
Four researchers who culled through 50 years of research literature
about
the psychology of conservatism report that at the core of political
conservatism is the resistance to change and a tolerance for
inequality,
and
that some of the common psychological factors linked to political
conservatism include:

a.. Fear and aggression

b.. Dogmatism and intolerance of ambiguity

c.. Uncertainty avoidance

d.. Need for cognitive closure

e.. Terror management
They really have a different view of the world. Most of the people
that
we
reconize as great contribuitors to our history and planet, from
Lao-tse,
Buddha, Socrate,  Jesus, Leonardo da Vinci ,Edison, Einstein. You
name
it,
where not consevative. I think conservatives are from a different
planet
:-). I have a very good friend who are conservatives, but I avoid
many
subjects with them. They will never change, it’s behond my
understanding.
I
think behind their lack of compassion and comprehension, most of the
time
you will find fears.
Faith :It’s like anger, check inside your anger and you will probably
find
a secret fear within .
francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state

Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost so many lives.
To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to be done with
occupation,
After all war is not an answer when money talks.
I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many more who will
have
part
of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has no weapon in his
hand
to
fight evil.
Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself talk on the TV.
Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
At least he has a hands he can shake with, some people don’t and
they
are
only 20 years old kids.

Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it doesn’t look
like
it
on
TV.

If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war. He would be a
friend
with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand that working
together
Is better then killing each other.

It is just shame that people want to save a life of an addict with
Ibogaine
treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a silly war game of
some
rich
people.
And those rich people will get their ways anyways as they are
corrupted
by
power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.

It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants to be at war
time.

The enemy is in your head. People always can be friends, just like
they
did
before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God, then God he
should
pray
to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are lost thanks to
his
policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more of his and
other
citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be
deleted
form

the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats
okay
I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but
found
this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay
brain
understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for
the
day
ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make
it
out
of

here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest
files.
what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know
diddley
about

computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i
figure
with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones
worries.
thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them
but
don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that
noticed
in
the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic
tool
for
onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to
treatment
I
would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the
ability
to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp
sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my
dreams,
feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have
experienced
twice
the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including
5
years
worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as
well
as
the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring
everything
I
needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I
never
ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week
I
had
one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually
doing
something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high
we
all
fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when
you’ve
done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.
It
was
NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some
pot
I
had

in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were
rolled
too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall
marijuana
high.

I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol
for
12
years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a
mexican
restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3
oz.
and
it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much
I
liked

it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still
experiencing
the

combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural
process
of
what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing
for
right
now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about
their
dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk
we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have
little
to
no
meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if
we
can
understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in
those
books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has
their
own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain
that’s
different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have
any
technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently
I’ll
let
you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from
McAfeeR
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 1:49:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Schmooly, are you sure that mild reversible MAOI’s like St. John’s
Wort have such interactions? It is commonly reported that ayahuasca
doesn’t interact (tho people also warn on principle about that).
The only side effect I know is the photosensitivity, plus as I
mentioned before, enough St. John’s (like harmala alkaloids) will
stop acid production in the stomach, which is uncomfortable if you
have food digesting.

Earlier you wrote that ayahuasca within 90 days of ibogaine seemed
to trigger relapse in users of … methamphetamine, methadone, I
forget which. Can you say how many cases, and which substance?

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 16:46:24 -0800 Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
St Johns Wart is a natural mild natural form of an MAO inhibitor
drug.  These
are old antodepressants that doc used 20 years ago and have a lot
of nasty
side effects and interactions w/ certain amino acids found
commonly in cheese
and wine etc.. I don’r recommend them. They do nothing for  sleep.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 1:40:32 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you’re sort of in my turf, stay clear, ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 9:32 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

>Life Rocks and you help it along nicely.<

Thanks Randy, and Martee, and the others who wrote off-list and on.
It’s that age-old addict thing. Kicking myself in the head trying to figure out the whys, why I’m basically going through the whole “self-sabotage” thing yet again.
I feel very torn between the “damn it, if I could just use in the fashion I ‘desire’ without worry about being ‘in trouble’ for it, regardless of who it is I’d be in trouble with, I’d be fine,” and the “why are you doing this again, and why can’t you simply stop right now?” thing. I mean, I keep going through the whole, “ok, just this once,” (and if I hear even one “I told you so” I’m going to seriously regret having opened up here), on to “ok, I’ve thrown the rig away, and I won’t do it again,” to “V isn’t home, I can do it now without getting ‘caught'” to “shit, this is stupid, why am I doing this again?” to “I wish I could just figure out how to get my meds in the way I like best without guilt or fear or stress,” to “I hate myself,” to “why am I beating myself up over this, I should just be open about it,” to etc, etc.
I used a rig a couple times in the past few days, alternating between eating and banging my meds, then got up early yesterday morning, saying, “ok, I don’t want to do this anymore again,” and threw it away (wrapping it up with newspaper in a plastic bag to disguise it) then realized V was going out to dj last night so I could use the rig “safely” so I ran downstairs while she was napping to dig the rig out of the trash, then as I was climbing the stairs I accidentally tossed the rig out the hallway window (honest, it was an accident, although I suspect that ol’ subconsciousness was acting up again), so I didn’t use a rig afterall.
I got up today, took my first dose as prescribed, but when I needed to redose hours later this morning, after V was asleep, I ran out and bought another freakin’ rig.
I feel schizophrenic. I’m hiding this, even after having already been “caught” by V once since ibo and having gone through the whole conversation I’m sure most everyone here has had at least once. What I really, really want to do is just tell her, because I don’t feel like I can go on like this much longer, pretending everything is super cool when there this niggling little issue in the background which isn’t that far in the background as the days go by. But I’m scared to death to do so (it was hard enough to tell you all, considering I’ve been to at least one or two people a shining ibo “success” story and it’s embarrassing and a bit humiliating admitting I’m not el-superdude- if anyone really thought that anyway), not wanting to go through that stress and pain and anguish either. So I keep telling myself, “ok, I’m stopping and everything will be cool and she doesn’t have to know because I’m going to get back on top of this and won’t fuck it up anymore so she doesn’t have to know, right?” But I can’t seem to stop myself- like with the stinkin’ fucking cig as a matter of fact- both are causing me problems but I haven’t been able to find the right key to stop myself. I mean, this is getting ridiculous. In the mean time, I keep going back and forth, getting lonelier and lonlier feeling, considering all sorts of black and horrid actions in my mind when getting overly depressed and worked up over this, and feeling worse and worse, all the while pretending everything is cool.
Argh.
I’m not even sure why I’m telling you all this. I know some are going to say, “take ibo again, and stop taking opiates,” and others are going to suggest vitamines and excercise, some are going to say “rat yourself out,” and others are going to tell me other things, all well meaning and with the very best of intentions. And I’m going to have heard them all. So what’s the freakin’ point of discussing it anyway?
But this time I’m not hitting delete instead of send. As a matter of fact, I’m going to hit send because I’ve got to get this into the open, even if it’s just here for now. It’s driving me out of my fucking mind and I’m not enjoying it at all. Yet, still, I’m having trouble simply stopping.
Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

Preston, remember that song by Soundgarden the Superunknown? A line in it says “first it steals your mind and then it steals your soul.” Wonder what they are talking about? They’re in Seattle at the time so I have to assume. I woke up thinking about you and your situation, put on some tunes and that song by Soundgarden hit me right between the eyes. Think I’ll keep it in the 90’s and go for Alice in Chains next. Man I wish that guy had found the Ibogaine before it was too late. Life Rocks and you help it along nicely. Randy

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779
Date: November 20, 2004 at 1:34:44 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

maybe it’s the format , server wont take it all in one piece and i d/n have the skills to change  the amount of info it will download. thanks
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779

Ron, it sounds as if your email provider may be chopping your
digest of the list short. Maybe it is seeing it as spam. Anyway,
the general public can’t help, so you may want to email

ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com

It is odd that this is the ‘From’ address in your mail. So maybe
there’s a misconfiguration in the list server.

On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 05:45:05 -0800 Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
c/n download…got the key?
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 9:29 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779
Date: November 20, 2004 at 1:33:06 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

and i’m the computer moron
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779

Ron, it sounds as if your email provider may be chopping your
digest of the list short. Maybe it is seeing it as spam. Anyway,
the general public can’t help, so you may want to email

ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com

It is odd that this is the ‘From’ address in your mail. So maybe
there’s a misconfiguration in the list server.

On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 05:45:05 -0800 Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
c/n download…got the key?
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 9:29 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for schmooly from ron
Date: November 20, 2004 at 1:32:07 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

does not negate  knowledge, i seldomn use spellcheck when it was designed with me in mind.  after gore invented the net
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:31 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron

soryy for the awful spelling. I dont type and the leters on my key board are worn out on my antiquated laptop. My apologies.

The ADD has got me on the run

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for schmooly from ron
Date: November 20, 2004 at 1:28:11 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Schmooly, you’re correct and i respect your opinions.  i’m tapering, a little tough  due to father’s iminent death over holidays, no siblings or wife or g/f or close relatives.  i totally agree and hopefully when i see the one doc that has indicated he/she understands chemistry, my dosage will be lowered so he/she  can ethically switch me over, trust me in what i tell him/her and not question my sincerity for recovery.  i’m scared to death right now, avoiding net like the plaque for outsourcing. i got my self here, i’ll need help getting out and i guess the great spirit will give me the strength. never had a parent go on me, holidays are a bitch but i c/n change that and appreciate the reality check. i operate on the assumption that people who care about my recovery will give me good advice and i never , especially w/ chemicals in me, defend my position as i know it is distorted. i spent yesterday doing wills, trusts with a man i’ve known 54 yrs who could barely write his name.  gd it’s hard. rwd really need that doc before xmas for accountabilty and to get on with this.  won’t make it to new year.
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron

Ron,
You keep blameing everyone but youyrself. Yes, most doctors suck. But there are good king knowlegable people out there who will help you. If you know what is right for you, why don’t you just do it. You can buy valium or any other benzo on the web without vere seeing a doc.

Do the teper, get a program, deal with the posy acute withdrawal that will last 3-6 months and alas—- you get your life back.

Get off the pity pot, it’s sounding old. I know this is really hard but on some level no matter how you do it, you must pay the piper.

I kinbow numerous folks who are benzo clean because they really wanted it. wanted more then anything else. They did exactly what they where told to do by qualified detox experts who had a proven track record and they made it. was it hell?–yes to some degree. was it worth it? they always say yes.

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 20, 2004 at 1:00:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Emma, there are maybe 30 people posting email to the group
through the ibogaine mailing list, plus lots more who receive but
don’t post themselves. If it gets too much, you can unsubscribe
through

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 07:43:27 -0800 SLau848@aol.com wrote:
who r u im emma

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:48:01 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I spontaneously stopped cannabis use for two years after a low-dose
ibogaine session (maybe 5 mg/kg) on top of reduced food for two
weeks and fasting for 24 hours.

During the first year I encountered and struggled with my inner
trauma, overwhelmed by it. Then ayahuasca showed me that I can
build a new life in the present without first dealing with the
trauma (“when you have solved it, you will let it go – why not let
it go now, let God handle it”). A year later I tentatively tried
marijuana again and once again felt like an ok person deep down
inside (in spite of bad reaction to the burnt material). Now I see
how it can allow me to tolerate things that maybe should be
addressed, as well as things that maybe can’t. Life goes by while
you are stoned. What are you missing? I would suggest that anyone
who has gotten stoned most days in a week for the last year try to
take two weeks off, and watch your feelings without judging
negatively if you fail. As with anything else that is good but
difficult, find your edge and learn what is there.

God bless us all.

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 06:18:42 -0800 Rachel Radhakrishna
<rachelradha@yahoo.com> wrote: …
plenty of people who call themselves Marijuana
Addicts.  Not outsiders labeling “others” as deviant.
But potheads who saw their lives and dreams go up in
smoke.  Herb was their best friend, and then it turned
on them.  Instead of a pleasant buzz, they got
paranoid.  Instead of “high”, they just got “low.”

I know it ain’t crack, but “bongaholics”  have their
own struggles.  Please don’t diminish them by
ideologically refusing to acknowledge that
high-powered strains of the Wisdom Weed can hook some
kinds of brains.  It does hurt some people.

You know damned well that not using cannabis has
no “withdrawal” symptoms.  Its no different from
stopping the consumption of ice cream, or broccoli,
or
any other food, except you are not getting a buzz,
which people who DO know about cannabis know full
well
is just harmless fun, and hurts nobody.iction

__________________________________
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The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:31:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

soryy for the awful spelling. I dont type and the leters on my key board are worn out on my antiquated laptop. My apologies.

The ADD has got me on the run

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:28:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

25 mgs IM of benedryl 1 houyr prior to ibo ingestion will stop the nausea. It works!!!

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:27:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Homones come alive after getting clean , Thus the high incidence of the 13th step around 12 step programs. Welbrutrin can increase anxiety and insomnia but is not a true labido inhancer. Seems to help stimulant addicts and add types.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:17:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ibo was offered to Alice in Chains group and they where afraid to leave US because of pending possession charges. WEhat a shame . another dead who could have been saved had Ibo been available in Bush land

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clarification
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:17:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Fri, 19 Nov 2004 01:22:49 -0800 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
You want to control the topic? get a fucking therapist, I did.

Randy

🙂

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:12:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron,
You keep blameing everyone but youyrself. Yes, most doctors suck. But there are good king knowlegable people out there who will help you. If you know what is right for you, why don’t you just do it. You can buy valium or any other benzo on the web without vere seeing a doc.

Do the teper, get a program, deal with the posy acute withdrawal that will last 3-6 months and alas—- you get your life back.

Get off the pity pot, it’s sounding old. I know this is really hard but on some level no matter how you do it, you must pay the piper.

I kinbow numerous folks who are benzo clean because they really wanted it. wanted more then anything else. They did exactly what they where told to do by qualified detox experts who had a proven track record and they made it. was it hell?–yes to some degree. was it worth it? they always say yes.

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:09:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, it sounds as if your email provider may be chopping your
digest of the list short. Maybe it is seeing it as spam. Anyway,
the general public can’t help, so you may want to email

ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com

It is odd that this is the ‘From’ address in your mail. So maybe
there’s a misconfiguration in the list server.

On Thu, 18 Nov 2004 05:45:05 -0800 Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
c/n download…got the key?
—– Original Message —–
From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 9:29 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer
Date: November 20, 2004 at 11:54:27 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I just a little while ago saw this add.  I also wonder about the device that Jerry
Lewis advocates – an implant that blocks the pain signal to the brain and
turns it into a “mild tingle”.  Do these things work?  Wouldn’t it be nice?
Has anyone here had any experience with them?

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —– From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer

In a message dated 11/20/04 10:54:53 AM, paulab@shaw.ca writes:

FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer would this
cool item help during ibogaine therapy..Paula

Hi Paula,

Saw the same add for the Hammacher Schlemmer electronic watch anti nausea
device and thought mmmm, is this the answer to ibogaine nausea?  The treatment
provider community should evaluate this device and report back to the list.

Howard

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive
Date: November 20, 2004 at 11:48:32 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

lol,
it’s probably a combination, although I don’t know much about Wellbutrin at all. But you may be eating better these days too off opiates. There’s probably a lot going on. Enjoy it anyway, which I’m sure you are.

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 11:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive

Hi group,

This is a bit off topic, but I’m wondering if anyone
else has experienced increased libido after starting
on a regimen of Wellbutrin.  Or is it just that I
suppressed my sex drive for so long by using and
abusing opiates??

I have been so, er, horny recently that I can barely
contain myself, not that my dude is complaining or
anything.  Do you think it’s just a chemical result of
the Wellbutrin, or is my body in overdrive due to
rebound effect of not being on opiates anymore?

love Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] OT_Wellbutrin + Sex Drive
Date: November 20, 2004 at 11:16:21 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi group,

This is a bit off topic, but I’m wondering if anyone
else has experienced increased libido after starting
on a regimen of Wellbutrin.  Or is it just that I
suppressed my sex drive for so long by using and
abusing opiates??

I have been so, er, horny recently that I can barely
contain myself, not that my dude is complaining or
anything.  Do you think it’s just a chemical result of
the Wellbutrin, or is my body in overdrive due to
rebound effect of not being on opiates anymore?

love Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer
Date: November 20, 2004 at 11:11:41 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/20/04 10:54:53 AM, paulab@shaw.ca writes:

FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer would this
cool item help during ibogaine therapy..Paula

Hi Paula,

Saw the same add for the Hammacher Schlemmer electronic watch anti nausea
device and thought mmmm, is this the answer to ibogaine nausea?  The treatment
provider community should evaluate this device and report back to the list.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] OT ron to paula
Date: November 20, 2004 at 11:07:08 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

benzo ravings, i’d give anything to be back at the opiate level, then i would have a way out. apologies for discord
—– Original Message —– From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 6:23 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

Ron none of my business.  But there just needs to be hope at the end of the
tunnel for anyone.  If you need all these verbal trappings to get there go
for it.  Words are’nt the only thing to measure a man by .  Cut some slack
for everyone and it will only get better…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 9:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

addiction is the psychological need to controll the drug ingested once
ingested and the inablity to do so.  it can occur at the time or weeks
later, e.g. binge drinkers
dependance refers to withdrawals as i read the literature.  but i’m on my
way out so disregard all this.  we have rights, but with those come
duties.
we live in herds and are obligated to contribute to the herd, i.e. give it
our best game. if ones recreational habits keep her from giving us her
best
game , she has neglected her duty which is concurrent w/ her rights.
americans tend to think that way, it’s my right, but they never talk about
the duty that goes with it.  rwd,, burning out quickly, been a pd too
long,
20 yrs, heard all the stories, excuses , blame game, etc.  been a junkie
using those same stories. now i’m just screwed and listen to those that
know
much more than me as a result of the forum..hope i didn’t start a topic
and
break protocol, but you guys can relax, i’ve been kicked out of nicer
places.  peace to all—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:33 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

> “What is happening is that the government is using a
> condition they created out of thin air, non-existent,
> called “addiction”, to justify its fascistic
> prohibitionist actions to the world in an attempt to
> demonize and stigmatise cannabis consumers.  Ask your
> neighborhood fascist what the “symptoms” of addiction
> are.  He either won’t be able to tell you, or he’ll
> tell you some nonesense which is a blow by blow
> repetition of prohibitionist propaganda statements
> found on their advertising.  This is to scare ignorant
> non-consumers of cannabis into supporting the
> fascistic and illegal crushing of democratic rights of
> cannabis consumers.
>    You know damned well that not using cannabis has
> no “withdrawal” symptoms.  Its no different from
> stopping the consumption of ice cream, or broccoli, or
> any other food, except you are not getting a buzz,
> which people who DO know about cannabis know full well
> is just harmless fun, and hurts nobody.
>    So stop playing the innocent.  Those folks you
> complain about are trying to murder and torture you
> for purposes that have absolutely nothing to do with
> your health, safety, welfare, or anyone else’s.  Quit
> playing their game, and get on with the reality of
> cannabis consumption and the law.  We are all being
> preyed on by evil fascist murderers, and we need to
> start defending ourselves.”
>
> From my friend…
>
> Greetings crookedeye,
>
> Sara
>
>
>
> —–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
> Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
> Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 4:46
> Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
>
> Thanks for the suggestion, but being a fond lover of smoking herb with
or
> without cigarettes, and having actually tried that before to no avail,
I’m
> afraid that ain’t gonna cut it either.
> I’ve also tried substuting clove cigs for tobacco, but that really,
really
> didn’t cut it either.
> It’s been quite some time I’ve been discussing this here, and it sounds
> the
> same as always, like I’m a weak ass git who can’t find self-control.
>    Sorry, I’m feeling a bit off-balance and angry at myself for this > and
> that reason. I can’t seem to find it in myself to open up much about it
> (having tried a number of time to do so here but ending up deleting the
> message before hitting send), finding myself embarrassed and hateful > and
> sad, but this is about as far as I feel like taking it publicly. > Suffice
> it
> to say, I’m going to take ibogaine again at some point, as I believe
I’ve
> recently noted, but wonder- will this, as with every other freakin’
> fucking
> “treatment” I’ve ever tried turn into one of these stupid, “oh well,
> nuther
> failed effort” things? Am I weak? Or am I simply supposed to be taking
my
> drugs in the most effective manner possible and should just tell the
rest
> of
>
> the world to fuck the hell off? I mean, I seem to be doing fairly well
for
> the most part, other than for this irritating, complicating love of > drug
> effects, foreign molecules, and other socially unacceptable things and
> behaviors. And even with those I’m doing fairly well, besides having to
> deal
>
> with the complications of trying to do my substances in the way I find
> most
> effective without feeling too guilty and fucked up about it- and worst
of
> all, finding myself hiding it from the people I care most about in the
> entire world because, well, most of you (with some possible exceptions
who
> will remain unnamed by me for now) understand what I’m talking about > and
> where I’m coming from.
>    Anyway, love to you all.
> (How can life suck so bad at the same time things are going so fucking
> well?)
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is > often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
> To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
> Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:49 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
>
>
>>I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some
ganja
>>instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive,
>>physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke.
>>Maybe herb could help…
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
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>
>
>
>
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron
Date: November 20, 2004 at 11:01:00 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

jim, at my dosage he would call teh cops.  also, don’t won’t info in insurance info computer.  follows you like your ss#
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron

Hi Ron,

I don’t know how you would feel about this but you may want to give it a try.  Go to a doc and tell him that you had two seziures and want to know what the hell to do.  When he ask if you taking any drugs tell him yea Xanax.  Let him tell you that might be causeing the seziures and maybe he may taper you off.  Docs are all different, you may run into a good one who cares and will taper you off.  If you have insurance go doctor shopping sooner or later you will find one who cares.  Just a suggestion, hope I helped

Best of Luck,

– JIM

knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Try finding Florida’s Complaint form, I have found
that most doctors want to avoid the paperwork.
Conversation goes like this:
doc, I’d like to taper off my xanexanexSorry can’t do
that.

I’m not a doctor but can’t you like have seizers and
stuff if not tapered off?
*Yes. but you are asking for a controlled substance.

Hypothetically speaking, is their a complaint process
because no offense but your dicidecisionms
inhuinhumaned where do I go for this process.
*(the doc I saw said): DEA DEAl-lolck mate)

So your telling me that thietheir’t a state agency
that overoversee’s prescription writing practices of
doctors?
*well uhh.uhh
etc…
——
If that doesn’t work, some craccrackheadkie could find
some for you. BenzBenzo’s a bitch to kick mahnmahn
hope you can find a way to taper. I don’t think you
have to suffer unless you feel you have to. Good
luck.

— Ron Davis wrote:
> as an aside, no help from any local
addiaddictionologistfor benzbenzosd’smd’sten 25
seconds, then set up a
> treatment protocol. they follow the book.
i’mi’mscrewed on the benzbenzoser. must suffer,
we’ewe’er
> people you know. i’vei’veen them the lancet,
> ashtashtonu name it, it’s thiethierway or the
> highway. ronron>
>

___________________________________________________________
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778
Date: November 20, 2004 at 10:57:37 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

can you tell me how to open these files?
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FWD New Scientist article
Date: November 20, 2004 at 10:56:19 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

they don’t make enough of wany intoxicant to satisisfy my urges once i’ve ingetested one.  tis leads to incredible problems.
—– Original Message —– From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 10:41 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] FWD New Scientist article

Forwarded article

New Scientist

November 13, 2004

HEADLINE: The intoxication instinct;

From alcohol and cannabis to cocaine and LSD, it seems there are no limits to

our appetite for mind-altering substances. What is it about human nature that

drives us to get out of our heads, ask Helen Phillips and Graham Lawton

Helen Phillips, Graham Lawton

IN THE Smoke Shack, a “head shop” in Nelson, British Columbia, the air is
thick

with marijuana and the atmosphere is mellow as the staff stage a demo of their

dope-related paraphernalia. The clients range from tourists and business types

to the dreadlocked and dishevelled. All walks of life are welcome.

Over the border in the US, the police call to the man in the car for the last

time. If he doesn’t step out they will shoot. He stays put – maybe because
he’s

embarrassed about being caught naked from the waist down, clearly aroused. Or

maybe he’s just too high on methamphetamine to care.

High up in the mountains of Peru the men brew coca leaves into a tea. While
they

don’t approve of the habit of snorting the powdered extract, the tea gives
them

a mild buzz that helps fight the headaches and nausea of altitude sickness. Up

here, cocaine is part of life.

Lounging in a restaurant, two old friends share a second bottle of wine,
sinking

lower in their seats as they enjoy the numbing haze and warmth it creates.
Later

they’ll order brandy. The bartender pours himself a cup of coffee. It’s going
to

be a long shift.

As diverse as these episodes are, there is a clear common thread running
through

them: the pursuit of intoxication. Since prehistoric times, humans have been

seeking out and using intoxicating substances. Most people who have ever lived

have experienced a chemically induced altered state of consciousness, and the

same is true of people alive today. That’s not to say that everybody is

constantly fighting the urge to get high, nor that intoxication is somehow a

normal state of consciousness. But how many of us can claim never to have

experienced an altered state, whether it be a caffeine kick to help us get
going

in the morning, a relaxing beer after work, a few puffs on a joint at a party
or

the euphoric high of ecstasy?

In the present prohibitionist climate it is difficult to talk about the use of

psychoactive, literally “mind-altering”, substances without focusing on their

harmful and habit-forming properties. And it’s true that excessive use of

consciousness-altering drugs, both legal and illegal, is bad for individuals
and

bad for society. People who seek intoxication are taking risks with their
health

and flirting with addiction. Drugs can lead to crime, violence, accidents,

family disintegration and social decay.

Nonetheless, intoxicants remain a part of most people’s lives . And indeed
most

of us are able to consume them in moderation without spiralling into abuse and

addiction. Take alcohol, for example. Its potent psychoactive properties and

potential for wreaking havoc are well known, yet the majority of people still

drink and enjoy it without becoming alcoholics. There’s also ample evidence

that, despite public health campaigns and the threat of severe penalties,

millions of people every year join the legions who have experimented with

illegal substances, from cannabis and cocaine to ecstasy, amphetamines and LSD

(for a guide to the most commonly used psychoactive drugs, ).

It seems that intoxication in one form or another is universal, a part of who
we

are. “It’s a natural part of consciousness to change one’s consciousness,”

argues Rick Doblin, who runs the not-for-profit Multidisciplinary Association

for Psychedelic Studies in Sarasota, Florida. But why is it that we choose to

alter our state of consciousness by dosing our brains with chemicals?

The answer is straightforward. We seek intoxication for a simple reason that
we

are almost too scared to admit – we like it. Intoxication can be fun,
sociable,

memorable, therapeutic, even mind-expanding. Saying as much in the present

climate is not easy, but an increasing number of researchers now argue that

unless we’re prepared to look beyond the “drug problem” and acknowledge the

positive aspects of intoxication, we are only seeing half the story – like

researching sex while pretending it isn’t fun.

A full understanding of intoxication, and the quest to achieve it, could have

numerous pay-offs. For one thing there is the prospect of better ways to
tackle

abuse and addiction. There are also good reasons for studying intoxication as
a

phenomenon in its own right. What is it about psychoactive substances that we

like? What do they tell us about who we are? Is there a way to get the good

without the bad? Some researchers believe that such enquiries will lead to a
new

understanding of the human mind, including the mysteries of consciousness , or

new treatments for mental illness. Others go as far as to argue that it is
time

for society to accept that intoxication is an inextricable part of human
nature,

and find a way to let us explore it openly.

The quest to understand intoxication wasn’t always so constrained. Back in the

1950s, 60s and early 70s, many scientists took a very personal interest in it.

In those more liberal days, researchers such as physician Andrew Weil,
latterly

of the National Institute for Mental Health in Maryland, and ethnobotanist

Terrence McKenna charted the effects of many drugs, tested them in the lab and

in the field, explored their mind-altering qualities first-hand, documented

their use in different cultures, and suggested that many of the compounds had

medicinal benefits.

Many of these pioneering researchers came to the conclusion that seeking

intoxication was programmed into human nature. As Weil pointed out in his 1973

book The Natural Mind , from an early age children experiment with spinning

around or hyperventilating to experience mind-altering giddiness. He suggested

that when we get older, this quest to alter our feelings stays with us but we

pursue it chemically as well as physically.

The spirit of personal research, however, was largely quashed in the late 70s

and 80s as a US-led “war on drugs” took hold. Drug research became dominated
by

the “addiction paradigm”, with pleasure and benefits strictly off-limits. “It

was so controversial it had to be shut down altogether,” says Charles Grob,

director of the child and adolescent psychiatry department at Harbor-UCLA

Medical Center in Torrance, California, whose interests lie with the potential

medical use of psychedelics.

But some researchers carried on regardless. Ronald Siegel, now a

psychopharmacologist at the University of California, Los Angeles, was one of

them. As a psychology graduate student in the 60s he busied himself with

studying pigeon memory. One day, a fellow student was arrested for marijuana

possession, and his lawyer asked Siegel what he knew about the drug’s effects.

Not much, as it happened, so he brewed up an extract and watched what happened

when a pigeon got stoned.

Ever since, he has been fascinated by intoxication, what it is and why we and

other animals seek it. He managed to keep studying “controlled substances”
such

as LSD, mescaline, PCP, cocaine and psilocybin in his clinic, in animals and
in

volunteers, all legal and above board. He’s passed out, thrown up, been
attacked

by intoxicated animals, and even been shot at by drugs barons – all in the
name

of research. And he has gained a unique perspective, spelled out in his 1989

book Intoxication: Life in pursuit of artificial paradise , which is being

reissued next April by Park Street Press of Rochester, Vermont.

Siegel believes there is a strong biological drive to seek intoxication. “It’s

the fourth drive,” he says. “After hunger, thirst and sex, there is

intoxication.” Whether we are seeking pleasure, stimulation, pain relief or

escape, at the root of this drive, he says, is the motivation to feel
“different

from normal” – what has sometimes been called “a holiday from reality”. Some

people reach this state through travel, books, art, roller coasters, sport,

religion, exploration, love, social contact or power. Others use intoxicants.

“It’s the same motivation,” says Siegel. “We wouldn’t live if we didn’t seek
to

feel different.”

One of the main “different” feelings we want to experience is pleasure.

Pleasure, neuroscientists believe, is the brain’s way of telling us that we
are

doing something that is good for survival, such as eating and sex. The
circuits

that create the feeling are driven by natural opioids and cannabinoids. No

surprise, then, that we have a penchant for putting versions of these
chemicals

into our brains.

But the equation is not quite as simple as chemical in, pleasure out. At last

month’s Society for Neuroscience meeting in San Diego, California,

neuroscientist Kent Berridge of the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor

described preliminary work showing that rats given a natural cannabinoid,

anandamide, seemed to become unusually partial to sweet tastes. Rats primed
with

anandamide had higher pleasure responses to sugar than unprimed rats. It seems

that the cannabinoid may not just be pleasurable in its own right, but also

enhances other pleasurable experiences, making the world seem a generally more

likeable place. Perhaps this is one aspect of the well-known “munchies” effect

of marijuana, they conclude.

A related idea is that some people take psychoactive substances to suppress

“negative pleasure”. George Koob, a neuroscientist and addiction specialist at

the Scripps Research Institute in La Jolla, California, has proposed that the

brain has a natural system for limiting the amount of pleasure we can feel. He

argues that pleasure has to be transient or humans and other animals would get

so absorbed in it that they would succumb to the next predator that came
along.

Koob thinks that the brain has a way of bringing us down – a kind of

“anti-pleasure” mechanism if you like. What if this system goes into
overdrive?

“Some people seek excessive pleasure because they are born with too much

anti-pleasure,” he says. “They may take drugs to feel normal.”

But there is more to intoxication than simply massaging our pleasure circuits.

Some altered states, Siegel believes, have a utilitarian value. Just as many

animals naturally seek medicinal plants such as antibiotics or emetics, we
seek

to medicate our minds. When we are agitated or in pain, emotionally as well as

physically, we seek substances that tranquillise and sedate. When tired or

depressed, we seek stimulants. According to some researchers, including Grob,

this medicinal use is an underlying thread running through all forms of

intoxication.

The drive to medicate mood is pervasive throughout the animal kingdom, Siegel

says, and he and his colleagues have documented thousands of examples.

Elephants, for instance, enjoy the taste of fermented fruit. They will usually

just browse it, but if they lose their mate (elephants usually mate for life)

they may seek oblivion in an alcoholic fruit binge, even drinking neat ethanol

if researchers provide it. It’s hard not to conclude that, like humans, they
are

drowning their sorrows. Stress can also lead animals to take intoxicants as a

form of escape. When stressed by overcrowding, elephants are more motivated to

seek alcohol. And fear can take its toll too. During the Vietnam war, Siegel
and

his team filmed water buffalo grazing on opium poppies to the point of

addiction. And animals don’t just take downers: there are numerous reports of

goats guzzling stimulants such as coffee beans and the herbal amphetamine
khat.

Medication with uppers and downers may be fairly easy to understand, but there

are other intoxicants whose attractions are harder to fathom. These are the

hallucinogens, which can’t easily be explained in purely survivalist terms.
Most

animals actively avoid this category of intoxicant.

Despite this, some researchers believe that psychedelics can have a medicinal

effect in humans. Doblin, for example, argues that the drastically altered

states they induce can play a role in maintaining mental health.
Hallucinogens –

and to some extent cannabis and MDMA – allow us to escape, temporarily, from a

reality ruled by logic, ego and time, and explore other aspects of our

consciousness. “The brain functions best when it has access to altered
states,”

he says.

This might sound like hippy mumbo-jumbo, but there is plenty of evidence in
the

medical literature that hallucinogens are effective against mental illness,

including anxiety, post-traumatic stress disorder, alcoholism and heroin

addiction. Most of this research was done in the 1950s, but the field is now

showing signs of a revival. Grob recently received approval to test psilocybin

as a treatment for severe anxiety in terminally ill cancer patients, and there

are ongoing studies in the use of psilocybin for otherwise untreatable cases
of

obsessive compulsive disorder, and MDMA for serious post-traumatic stress

disorder.

Medicinal properties notwithstanding, there are other ideas to explain why

people take psychedelics. Siegel found that he could persuade monkeys to

voluntarily smoke the hallucinogen DMT when they were in a situation of severe

sensory deprivation. He had already trained three rhesus monkeys to smoke for
a

reward, to study the effects of nicotine. When he laced their smoking tubes
with

DMT, they briefly tried it, then avoided it. But after several days in
darkness,

with no stimulation, the monkeys began to smoke DMT voluntarily. They ended up

grasping at and chasing non-existent objects and hiding from invisible
dangers.

“This was the first demonstration of a non-human primate voluntarily taking a

hallucinogenic drug,” Siegel says. “We share the same motivation to light up
our

lives with chemical glimpses of another world.” Boredom it seems, will drive

animals to experiment, even when the experience is not altogether pleasurable.

The same drive to seek novelty or stave off boredom could explain why people

take drugs that have overwhelmingly negative effects. PCP, for example, which

some consider to be the most dangerous illegal drug, is a “dissociative” .
Among

its myriad effects are numbness, loss of coordination, paranoia,
hallucinations,

acute anxiety, mood swings and psychosis. But for some people the altered
state

is clearly worth it – PCP was hugely popular in the US in the 1970s. “People

seem to say they liked feeling different or funny,” says Siegel. “When there’s

nothing else to do, people will take anything to feel different.”

In some ways novelty-seeking is a basic behavioural drive. Literature on child

development reveals that once infants are no longer sleepy, hungry or thirsty,

they will explore and seek new experiences. They wriggle their limbs, put
things

in their mouths, touch things, taste things and bash things together. Without

this drive, they wouldn’t learn anything about the world around them. Perhaps

this spirit of exploration simply continues into adulthood in a different
form.

There’s another drive, too, that probably plays a role: risk-taking. For some

people taking risks is itself pleasurable. According to Koob this might come

from a slightly different brain system to the pleasure circuits. For animals

that forage, there is always the risk of being attacked by a predator. In
other

words there is a conflict between seeking new foraging sites, or novelty, and

risk. Evolution has got around this conundrum by making novelty rewarding and

pleasurable in its own right.

Pleasure, excitement, therapy, novelty: seen in this light, the pursuit of

intoxication looks very different from its standard portrayal as a
pathological

drive that must be suppressed before it leads to harm, addiction and squalor.

Yet the mainstream debate on drugs, alcohol and tobacco seems unable to

acknowledge that there is anything positive at all to say about intoxication.

Instead it is locked into a sterile argument between prohibitionists and those

who want to reduce the harmful effects by, for example, making heroin
available

on prescription. Both groups start from the belief that psychoactive
substances

are inherently harmful but disagree on what to do about it.

Some activists, however, are starting to argue for an entirely different

attitude to intoxication. One prominent critic of the debate is Richard Glen

Boire, director of the Center for Cognitive Liberty and Ethics in Davis,

California. He believes that intoxication is not just a part of human nature,
it

is a basic human right. “Why should it be illegal to alter your style of

thinking?” he says. “As long as you don’t do any harm to anyone else, what you

do in your own mind is as private as what you do in your own bedroom.” Boire

advocates changes to the law that would allow people to experiment with

psychoactive substances at home or in designated public places. “It’s the
right

of people to explore the full range of consciousness, and our duty as a
society

to accommodate that,” he says.

Some scientists are moving in the same direction, arguing that instead of

suppressing, medicalising and criminalising our basic drive to experience

altered states we should apply ourselves to making it safer, healthier and
less

squalid – in short, to taking the “toxic” out of intoxication.

The approach favoured by Siegel is to tweak existing drugs to make them
better,

with shorter effects and no addictive potential. “What it would be like,” he

says, “if we had a drug like alcohol, which didn’t lead to violence, fetal

damage, liver failure, that was safe, wouldn’t lead to drink driving and never

gave you a hangover. What would be wrong with it medically? Maybe we’d even

prescribe this alcohol substitute to help people relax.” We could even design

entirely new chemicals that allow us to experience all the pleasures, thrills

and adventures of intoxication without the downsides. “This is not science

fiction,” says Siegel. “Civilisation will eventually take this direction.”

Perhaps this would be the greatest contribution a full understanding of the

intoxication instinct could offer – a spur for society to move beyond the

irrational position of sanctioning caffeine, alcohol and tobacco while
fighting

a “war” against other psychoactive substances. David Lenson, a social theorist

at the University of Massachusetts in Amhurst and author of the 1995 book On

Drugs , makes this point by comparing the war on drugs with efforts to
eradicate

homosexuality: both are based on an incomplete understanding of human nature.

Siegel, too, sees an analogy with sex. “We can’t be expected to solve the AIDS

problem by outlawing sex,” he says. “We have to make drugs safe and healthy,

because people are not going to be able to say no.”

A window on the mind

Helen Phillips Graham Lawton

DRUGS provide some of the best evidence we have that the mind is the brain;
that

our thoughts, beliefs and perceptions are created by chemistry. Take a drug,

particularly a hallucinogen, and any of these can change. This means these
drugs

can be scary and need to be taken with great care and respect. But it also me
ans

they have the potential to reveal some of the deepest secrets about our minds

and consciousness.

A century ago, psychologist William James experimented with the anaesthetic

nitrous oxide. Our normal rational consciousness, he said, is just one special

type of consciousness, while all around it, “parted from it by the filmiest of

screens”, are other entirely different forms of consciousness, always
available

if the requisite stimulus is applied.

Others meticulously described the effects of inhaling ether, chloroform and

cannabis, and the strange distortions of time, perception and sense of humour

they induced. More curiously, they also described changes in belief, and even
in

philosophy. When Humphry Davy took nitrous oxide in 1799 he ended up
exclaiming

that “nothing exists but thoughts”. Others made similar observations and found

their views profoundly shifted by even brief forays to the other side of that

filmy screen.

This raises the peculiar question of whether what James called “our normal

rational consciousness” is necessarily the best state for understanding the

world. After all, if one’s view of the world can change so dramatically with
the

aid of a simple molecule, how can we be sure that our normal brain chemistry
is

the one most suited to doing science and philosophy? What if our brain
chemistry

evolved to help us survive at the cost of giving us false beliefs about the

world? If so, it is possible that mind-altering drugs might in fact give us a

better, not worse, insight than we have in our so-called normal state.

Take the common hallucinogenic experience of losing our separate self, or

becoming one with the universe. This may seem, to some, like mystical hogwash,

but in fact it fits far better with a scientific understanding of the world
than

our normal dualist view. Most of us feel, most of the time, that we are some

kind of separate self who inhabits our body like a driver in a car or a pilot
in

a plane. Throughout history many people have believed in a soul or spirit. Yet

science has long known that this cannot be so. There is just a brain that is

made of exactly the same kind of stuff as the world around it. We really are
one

with the universe.

This means that the psychedelic sense of self may actually be truer than the

dualist view. So although our normal state is better for surviving and

reproducing, it may not always be best for understanding who and what we are.

Perhaps we ought to try doing science in some of these intoxicated states.

This was just what psychologist Charles Tart of the University of California,

Davis, suggested in 1972, in the journal Science . He likened different states

of consciousness to different paradigms in science and proposed creating
“state

specific sciences”, new sciences which would be done by scientists working and

communicating in altered states. These new sciences might only have limited

application but this makes the point that our normal state may not be the only

way to try to understand the universe.

Since Tart’s work, most psychedelic drugs have become prohibited and research

has largely been stifled. Perhaps one day, when prohibition is abandoned,

scientists may once again take up the promise offered by those tiny little

chemicals that can tell us who and what we are.

Under the influence

Helen Phillips Graham Lawton

HOW common is the use of mind-altering substances? Accurate figures are hard
to

come by, largely because most psychoactive drugs are illegal and the task of

keeping tabs on the legal ones is monumental. But it’s safe to say from the

available figures that the use of mind-altering substances is a widespread –
if

not near-universal – human experience.

According to the latest drug data from the United Nations (World Drug Report

2004 ), about 185 million people worldwide have used an illicit substance in
the

past 12 months. That’s around 1 in 20 of the adult population. With 146
million

users, cannabis is by far the most popular, followed by amphetamines (30

million), cocaine (13 million) and ecstasy (8 million). Despite
prohibitionists’

best efforts, these figures have remained unchanged since the first World Drug

Report in 1997.

Illicit drug use in western countries is higher than the global average.

According to the 2003 US National Survey on Drug Use and Health, 19.5 million

Americans had taken at least one drug, mainly cannabis, in the 30 days before

the survey. That’s about 1 in 12 of the “adult” population (aged 12 plus). An

even higher proportion report having taken illicit drugs at some point in
their

lives. According to a recent survey, 77 million Americans, a third of all

adults, have used drugs at least once (Human Psychopharmacology: Clinical and

Experimental , vol 17, p 140).

And illegal drugs are just the tip of the iceberg. The World Health
Organization

estimates that there are 1.3 billion tobacco smokers worldwide, 30 per cent of

the adult population (World Health Report, 2003). Alcohol use is even more

prevalent. In the US, a relatively sober country, just over 50 per cent of

adults have had at least one alcoholic drink in the past month. In the UK, 88

per cent of people drink at least once a month and 48 per cent drink at least

twice a week. Outside the Islamic world very few people abstain completely.
The

figure is 20 per cent in Canada, 9 per cent in Germany, and as low as 4 per
cent

in some Nordic countries.

Of all the world’s psychoactive substances, however, none can match the reach
of

caffeine, the only universally sanctioned drug both legally and culturally.
Its

main source, coffee, is immensely popular, with 79 per cent of the US adult

population drinking it regularly, according to the US National Coffee

Association. Add to that all the tea, chocolate and caffeinated soft drinks

consumed in the world, and it’s fair to say that caffeine is the most widely

consumed psychoactive substance on Earth. The majority of us are probably
under

the influence of caffeine most of the time.

Overall, it’s hard not to conclude that the vast majority of people are
current

or former users of psychoactive substances. The clinching figure, of course,

would be one for “lifetime abstinence”, the percentage of people who have
never,

ever taken anything that alters their consciousness. But it appears that no
one

has ever worked out such a figure, perhaps because, to all intents and
purposes,

it is zero.

Out of it: A cultural history of intoxication by Stuart Walton, Penguin Books

(2001); Street Drugs by Andrew Tyler, Hodder & Stoughton (1995)

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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] FDA-Cleared Device for Motion Sickness at Hammacher Schlemmer
Date: November 20, 2004 at 10:52:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

would this cool item help during ibogaine therapy..Paula

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (ron to faith)
Date: November 20, 2004 at 10:47:29 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ibo d/n work on benzos, not even close.
—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 11:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

Ron, for the recore, I’m a book reader–very little TV–but do like to watch forensic science.  But, getting to you, I think Eric Taub in your state (Fl) is who you need to speak to.  His site is Ibeginagian.  The Ibogaine is not something you would get addicted to, or want to.  As I understand, you take it once, then again in about 6 months if needed, and then another 6 months later.  I think it would be worth trying.  You sound like you’re ready to get clean.  Faith

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 11:26:22 -0600

SHE HAS AGOOD HEART, JUST TOO MUCH TV AND NOT ENOUGH BOOKS.  ALAN GINSBURG, FOR THOSE OF YOU OLD ENOUGH TO REMEMBER THE BEAT GENERATION ONCE SAID” HIP MEANS TOLERANCE”…EVERYBODY HIP?  OR TRAGICALLY COOL? CAN’T BE BOTH. RON
—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 11:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

I personally think that Faith is either a computer  program (no sense of humor, no deviation even within the mindset, ) or a “plant.”   Even though I know people like that do exist.    Just a fleeting observation.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 8:34 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

>What are you talking about Faith?<

– I think we’re all wondering that same thing,
Preston…

I mean, Faith, what are you contributing here on the
ibogaine list at all
beside rancor, unease, and dissension? Are you
intentionally going out of
your way to prove my own views of Republican-minded
types?

– hear hear….

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 10:45:32 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/20/04 10:34:18 AM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

(it was hard enough to tell you
all, considering I’ve been to at least one or two people a shining ibo
“success” story

Preston,

You are a shining ibo success story.  The problem is that ibogaine is so
amazing that people expect it to be more amazing than it is.  People expect it to
cure everything and last forever.

And yes, I would be in the group saying to take ibogaine again.  Most likely
500mg would do the trick as you are  not seeking to stop medicating with
opioids for pain.  Dosing regimens are so experimental.  Wish ibogaine was an
approved medication so dose regimens could be easily designed just for you as an
individual and of course that would require a bit of experimentation.

Howard

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 10:32:46 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Life Rocks and you help it along nicely.<

Thanks Randy, and Martee, and the others who wrote off-list and on.
It’s that age-old addict thing. Kicking myself in the head trying to figure out the whys, why I’m basically going through the whole “self-sabotage” thing yet again.
I feel very torn between the “damn it, if I could just use in the fashion I ‘desire’ without worry about being ‘in trouble’ for it, regardless of who it is I’d be in trouble with, I’d be fine,” and the “why are you doing this again, and why can’t you simply stop right now?” thing. I mean, I keep going through the whole, “ok, just this once,” (and if I hear even one “I told you so” I’m going to seriously regret having opened up here), on to “ok, I’ve thrown the rig away, and I won’t do it again,” to “V isn’t home, I can do it now without getting ‘caught'” to “shit, this is stupid, why am I doing this again?” to “I wish I could just figure out how to get my meds in the way I like best without guilt or fear or stress,” to “I hate myself,” to “why am I beating myself up over this, I should just be open about it,” to etc, etc.
I used a rig a couple times in the past few days, alternating between eating and banging my meds, then got up early yesterday morning, saying, “ok, I don’t want to do this anymore again,” and threw it away (wrapping it up with newspaper in a plastic bag to disguise it) then realized V was going out to dj last night so I could use the rig “safely” so I ran downstairs while she was napping to dig the rig out of the trash, then as I was climbing the stairs I accidentally tossed the rig out the hallway window (honest, it was an accident, although I suspect that ol’ subconsciousness was acting up again), so I didn’t use a rig afterall.
I got up today, took my first dose as prescribed, but when I needed to redose hours later this morning, after V was asleep, I ran out and bought another freakin’ rig.
I feel schizophrenic. I’m hiding this, even after having already been “caught” by V once since ibo and having gone through the whole conversation I’m sure most everyone here has had at least once. What I really, really want to do is just tell her, because I don’t feel like I can go on like this much longer, pretending everything is super cool when there this niggling little issue in the background which isn’t that far in the background as the days go by. But I’m scared to death to do so (it was hard enough to tell you all, considering I’ve been to at least one or two people a shining ibo “success” story and it’s embarrassing and a bit humiliating admitting I’m not el-superdude- if anyone really thought that anyway), not wanting to go through that stress and pain and anguish either. So I keep telling myself, “ok, I’m stopping and everything will be cool and she doesn’t have to know because I’m going to get back on top of this and won’t fuck it up anymore so she doesn’t have to know, right?” But I can’t seem to stop myself- like with the stinkin’ fucking cig as a matter of fact- both are causing me problems but I haven’t been able to find the right key to stop myself. I mean, this is getting ridiculous. In the mean time, I keep going back and forth, getting lonelier and lonlier feeling, considering all sorts of black and horrid actions in my mind when getting overly depressed and worked up over this, and feeling worse and worse, all the while pretending everything is cool.
Argh.
I’m not even sure why I’m telling you all this. I know some are going to say, “take ibo again, and stop taking opiates,” and others are going to suggest vitamines and excercise, some are going to say “rat yourself out,” and others are going to tell me other things, all well meaning and with the very best of intentions. And I’m going to have heard them all. So what’s the freakin’ point of discussing it anyway?
But this time I’m not hitting delete instead of send. As a matter of fact, I’m going to hit send because I’ve got to get this into the open, even if it’s just here for now. It’s driving me out of my fucking mind and I’m not enjoying it at all. Yet, still, I’m having trouble simply stopping.
Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 8:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc

Preston, remember that song by Soundgarden the Superunknown? A line in it says “first it steals your mind and then it steals your soul.” Wonder what they are talking about? They’re in Seattle at the time so I have to assume. I woke up thinking about you and your situation, put on some tunes and that song by Soundgarden hit me right between the eyes. Think I’ll keep it in the 90’s and go for Alice in Chains next. Man I wish that guy had found the Ibogaine before it was too late. Life Rocks and you help it along nicely. Randy

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep
Date: November 20, 2004 at 9:01:19 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi:

Doxylamine Succinate.

love,
mama
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 20, 2004 7:26 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep

Jim, I took Valerian, sublingual meletonin, and the other over the counter sleep aid that is not diphenhydramine. I can’t think of the name but it starts with doxy something.    Randy

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sara + Jasen
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:59:06 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Sara and Jasen,

I have been thinking about both of you, and am glad to
hear you are well, Jasen.  Please post whenever you
feel up to it..

love Julie

__________________________________
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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FWD New Scientist article
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:52:57 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,

That was a VERY COOL article…Thank you for posting
this!

Julie

__________________________________
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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:51:31 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, remember that song by Soundgarden the Superunknown? A line in it says “first it steals your mind and then it steals your soul.” Wonder what they are talking about? They’re in Seattle at the time so I have to assume. I woke up thinking about you and your situation, put on some tunes and that song by Soundgarden hit me right between the eyes. Think I’ll keep it in the 90’s and go for Alice in Chains next. Man I wish that guy had found the Ibogaine before it was too late. Life Rocks and you help it along nicely.      Randy

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:44:25 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/20/04 4:21:42 AM, captkirk@free.net.nz writes:

Also…. For experienced Ibo-ers out there…. Could someone post possible
dosage, amount, regularlity, etc etc. I have been drinking poppy seed tea
for years now and want to get off.  I have studied ibogaine on the net
for about 5 years now, and it IS for me, I just feel it”!!

Suggest you check the dose sections in http://www.ibogaine.org/manual.html as
well as, reviewing http://www.ibogaine.org/clin-perpectives.html

The third edition of the Manual for Ibogaine Therapy that will be published
in some months will include additional dose regimen information but, you will
have to wait on that.  Every patient will respond somewhat differently to dose
and regimen.  Please be aware of that.

Howard

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:40:28 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kirsty, it is a slippery path we trod. Ibogaine is illegal in the US which is about the stupidest thing I ever …. I won’t rant. It’s getting cheaper all the time. Maybe you could make a deal with one of the providers out of the states, Call them. There is a link to most of them on the Mindvox homepage. All of them are good. Keep trying. It took me a year. Your lucky, things are changing fast. Ibogaine will fall in your lap if you keep looking.         Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: low blood sugar
Date: November 20, 2004 at 8:27:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I too am hypoglycemic. My mom saw that in me early. I am so glad she has been vindicated. She was right about so many things when I was a kid. All the things she diagnosed about me are true. She was ahead of the medical establishment by light years. She still is. She found Ibogaine for me too. ‘Course I took the ibogaine subject and ran with it. She saved me. AGAIN               Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep
Date: November 20, 2004 at 7:50:45 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Greetings from Jason,
He slept from 22:00pm until 7:30 AM . had a big breakfast now we will start with lunch chicken and soup .

Jason is happy, we are going to get some mushrooms, Jim. Talk soon.

Sara
Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zaterdag 20 november 2004 13:26
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep

Jim, I took Valerian, sublingual meletonin, and the other over the counter sleep aid that is not diphenhydramine. I can’t think of the name but it starts with doxy something.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep
Date: November 20, 2004 at 7:26:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jim, I took Valerian, sublingual meletonin, and the other over the counter sleep aid that is not diphenhydramine. I can’t think of the name but it starts with doxy something.    Randy

From: SLau848@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:
Date: November 20, 2004 at 7:02:20 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ho r u im emma 67 years old do not e-mail me plz

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:38:26 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It is a methadone + benzo’s detox. therapy where I live. I help people to come five different drugs In one treatment which took long time, and it is much harder
Treatment then if someone is only on H. but there is way.
I don’t know if you saw my CD-r. but on it there is one guy and one lady who both came addicted to methadone heroine and xanex, the guy was not pretending
To be on xanex , him/and his wife didn’t have any seizures coming off. But he did have a seizure on the subway NYC  few days before coming here, which made him think that he had to come off, so he did, and you can ask him.If anyone has a benzo +methadone + heroine + tobacco+ Alcohol problem then they can come where I live, but it takes few weeks to do it and it is not a piece of cake but it is possible if the person is willing to work with me.

Like this guy I had more people who got benzo medication with Methadone, sure it is not a recognized treatment for Benzo’s because people use
Ibogaine HCL  one single dose as a treatment , this will not do it for Benzo,
In that sense you can say it is not a Benzo detox. therapy.

Sara

Van: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net] 
Verzonden: zaterdag 20 november 2004 8:13
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

this i know and thanks.
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 6:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

Ron, Ibo is not a benzo detox therapy!

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:23:58 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Also, can cause photo sensitivity, but some people have found relief with st john’s.  Everybodies different I guess…
Kirk

St Johns Wart is a natural mild natural form of an MAO inhibitor drug. These are old antodepressants that doc used 20 years ago and have a lot of nasty side effects and interactions w/ certain amino acids found commonly in cheese and wine etc.. I don’r recommend them. They do nothing for sleep.

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: Ibogaine availablity, dosage etc
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:20:56 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Re,: purchasing Ibogaine.
A couple of us have asked, but no body has come forth with any usefull info on reliable ibo sources. The Indra site seems to best I have seen lately, but won’t ship to the states, and other countries. NZ is ok, for now. I want to get it as quick as poss incase this changes.
Also…. For experienced Ibo-ers out there…. Could someone post possible dosage, amount, regularlity, etc etc. I have been drinking poppy seed tea for years now and want to get off.  I have studied ibogaine on the net for about 5 years now, and it IS for me, I just feel it”!!
Thanks everyone
Kirsty
From: Jim Hadey [mailto:jimhadey3@yahoo.com] 
Sent: Saturday, 20 November 2004 8:56 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Do they sell Ibo in Canada in the health food stores

HI Julie,

Could you tell me if they sell Ibo in health food stores in Canada.  I know it is legal there but where would one go to get it.  I live in Detroit and would have no trouble going to Windsor to get it.  If I went to Canada where would I look to find it?  If you could point me in the right direction it would be appreciated.  If I am not mistaken you said it took awhile before you started feeling better, like you had minor w/d symptoms, is that right?

Also, is there much difference between the HCL and extract.  Does one work better than the other or do they both make ya sick and lose your lunch?

I am so glad you made it.  As far as Faith goes, I think she is a couple of can short of a six pack.  She does not contribute anything or say anything intelligent and really don’t make any kind on sense.  I really think she likes to argue.  I mean there are many places on the great big web where she would fit in.  In a way I think it is kind of funny.

Like I said on the forum, I am glad you got rid of the liquid handcuffs.  Me, I am afraid I will need another treatment with a booster about 5 days later.  When I took the Ibo my back pain was gone for 5 days, then it got cold and rainy and I could no longer stand the pain and had to take the lortabs.  A word of warning Lortabs are VERY addicting as in Tylenol #4 with codeine.  I have been on them since a work accident in the mid 70’s and am now on complete disability.  If you know of a place in Canada that sells Ibo please pass it on since I have a P.O. Box in Windsor.  It is at a Mail Box Ect and the person may think he is sending to a house or business.  But it will close soon since it is costing me $62 per quarter year.

Thanks in advance for any help you can point me to.

Sincerely,

– JIM

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep
Date: November 20, 2004 at 4:17:21 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

For sleep and anxiety stuff as well… Valerian Tincture is very good too. I
used it during one of my many detox’s and it gave me a blessed couple of
hours sleep, doesn’t sound much, but as many of you will know, a couple of
hours can be heaven whilst in detox.  Taken thru out the day it chills you
out too. Luverly stuff, although personally I prefer the benzos for dealing
out the detox symptoms, because I seem lucky in that I have never been
addicted, or want to be addicted to them, bluddy handy, means I can use em
when they’re needed.’
Man, I didn’t realise this list was so full on! It’s awesome, like a Daily
Soap!
You all sound  like really fascinating people who I’d love to meet one day.
Aroha to you all.
Kirsty

—–Original Message—–
From: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, 20 November 2004 7:34 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep

Jim,

Try melatonin, or passionflower tincture.

Julie

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:13:13 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

this i know and thanks.
—– Original Message —–
From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 6:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

Ron, Ibo is not a benzo detox therapy!

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron
Date: November 20, 2004 at 2:11:50 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

worth a shot, thanks
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron

Hi Ron,

I don’t know how you would feel about this but you may want to give it a try.  Go to a doc and tell him that you had two seziures and want to know what the hell to do.  When he ask if you taking any drugs tell him yea Xanax.  Let him tell you that might be causeing the seziures and maybe he may taper you off.  Docs are all different, you may run into a good one who cares and will taper you off.  If you have insurance go doctor shopping sooner or later you will find one who cares.  Just a suggestion, hope I helped

Best of Luck,

– JIM

knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Try finding Florida’s Complaint form, I have found
that most doctors want to avoid the paperwork.
Conversation goes like this:
doc, I’d like to taper off my xanexanexSorry can’t do
that.

I’m not a doctor but can’t you like have seizers and
stuff if not tapered off?
*Yes. but you are asking for a controlled substance.

Hypothetically speaking, is their a complaint process
because no offense but your dicidecisionms
inhuinhumaned where do I go for this process.
*(the doc I saw said): DEA DEAl-lolck mate)

So your telling me that thietheir’t a state agency
that overoversee’s prescription writing practices of
doctors?
*well uhh.uhh
etc…
——
If that doesn’t work, some craccrackheadkie could find
some for you. BenzBenzo’s a bitch to kick mahnmahn
hope you can find a way to taper. I don’t think you
have to suffer unless you feel you have to. Good
luck.

— Ron Davis wrote:
> as an aside, no help from any local
addiaddictionologistfor benzbenzosd’smd’sten 25
seconds, then set up a
> treatment protocol. they follow the book.
i’mi’mscrewed on the benzbenzoser. must suffer,
we’ewe’er
> people you know. i’vei’veen them the lancet,
> ashtashtonu name it, it’s thiethierway or the
> highway. ronron>
>

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: science article
Date: November 20, 2004 at 1:25:02 AM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There are a lot of points in this article, that could make you point counterpoint  the content.  What I’d like clarifications on is the comment,”throughout history many people have believed in a soul or spirit.  Yet science has long known that this cannot be so.” ???   Unless I’m missing something here in or out of context ,which isn’t that uncommon for me,  I don’t get how you can vasilate about what the mind is or isn’t or what is or isn’t mans quest to change his conciousness ,and then get so  black and white statement about the soul or spirit.  Is it because it can’t be seen, charted, or because you can’t get a grant to study it, that science thinks it doesn’t exist.  I was real close to thinking maybe everything metaphysical has a scientific explanation in some form… but this could put that rotton taste back in.  I’ll admit I didn’t read much furthur than this, it’s like when you realize the pamphlet you’re reading is religious fodder even if the first line or two was profound, you throw it away.
So what’s the deal here Howard?  Splain to me!
Respectfully,
Martee

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.
Date: November 20, 2004 at 12:54:13 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Francis,
Didn’t mean to put you on the spot I just thought I remembered reading a post that mentioned this, I couldn’t find that particular post so I just brought it up.  My approach to life as well as healing is and has only been successful when I am in tune with the positive force thats the be all of what I perceive my existence and my ability to create .  I believe that’s where my true inutitive sense comes from.  I so do believe in angels.  How couldn’t I. I used a whole flock of them just to get me to this point in this life.  The whole healing  thing is something I am adding to always. Teaching and healing is a calling. You are correct. Healers are a conduit of the energy that exists and transmits it to their subject.  Your mention of peace, humility, patience, compansion and understanding could not be more right on, but above all love.  That is the purest of pure, and the most healing ingredient in all of existance.
I do so appreciate your response as acknowledgment is always a rush for me.
My brother is Rabbi Finman at the newly built synagogue at Royal and Union.  He is an orthodox rabbi with a conservative congregation as well as having hippi roots that go real deep.  He possesses all those qualities we mentioned are good for healers and more, as well as a beautiful sense of humor and a magnificent open mind. He’s either in Israel just now or about to return. He also has much experience with drug rehab issues.  He does not discriminate against people that are not of his faith.
My visits there this year were absolutely memorable.  I would like to experience that clean.  Looking forward to it and to meeting with you.
Sincerely,
Martee

—– Original Message —– From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 9:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.

Martee !
I always enjoy your posting and it’s a real pleasure to try to respond your
question:

You wrote :

: ” I am interested if you can give me info where to learn more
on the whole collective consciousness  for healing.”

I have no idea about the whole collective consciousness, sincerly. I grow up
in Africa, and Europe spend years in South America and in the Carribean .
The consciousness seems generaly cultural with common trait on  certain
beliefs regarding evil and good forces, spirit, ghost, entities, Angels ,
demons and the spirit of Ancestors , not forgetting heroes defing laws of
nature.and mens .
Honestly I am the wrong person to answer this question.

In my humble opinion healing can be achieve only throught spirituality .
and the Healer should be only a kind of facilitator tapping in what is best
and noble  in mankind
Each one of us had is on battle to win to be a better man and can get help
from any one that went throught the pain before himself,  here or anywhere
else….
I think that peace, humility and patience are the ways.
That all I have .. not much, really 🙂

I believe that compassion and understanding are the best tool of the ”
medecine man ”  I have seen in this group and incredible amount of the last
two.Nothing is more beautiful than to help.In africa the healer teaches is
patient to be an healer then is not anymore a patient : is cured and is now
a healer and he can start to help .. I think it’s what will happen with a
lot of addicts throught a wonderful and mysterious metamorphosis with the
help of Ibogaine and… God 🙂 of course.

Martee , I am getting to F#@# serious !! I have to stop !! Help me  ! I cant
shut up !!

God Bless you
Francis

About Hypoglycemia from a study 95 % of the alcoholics suffers from this
disease the rest are pre diabetic or diabetic.
I add this problem too

—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.

Interesting info.  I also know and have conservative friends and family.
I
usually don’t do politics as a rule, however, avoid it completely with
certain people.  I am interested if you can give me info where to learn
more
on the whole collective consciousness  for healing.  It sounds exactly
like
something I would tap into.  I had lunch yesterday with a mutual
aquaintance.  My brother is also your local southernmost holyman!  Any
info
would be appreciated.       Martee
—- Original Message —– From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 11:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives

> I found this study at
> http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/07/22_politics.shtml
>
> very interesting:
> Four researchers who culled through 50 years of research literature
about
> the psychology of conservatism report that at the core of political
> conservatism is the resistance to change and a tolerance for > inequality,
> and
> that some of the common psychological factors linked to political
> conservatism include:
>
>  a.. Fear and aggression
>
>  b.. Dogmatism and intolerance of ambiguity
>
>  c.. Uncertainty avoidance
>
>  d.. Need for cognitive closure
>
>  e.. Terror management
> They really have a different view of the world. Most of the people that
we
> reconize as great contribuitors to our history and planet, from > Lao-tse,
> Buddha, Socrate,  Jesus, Leonardo da Vinci ,Edison, Einstein. You name
it,
> where not consevative. I think conservatives are from a different > planet
> :-). I have a very good friend who are conservatives, but I avoid many
> subjects with them. They will never change, it’s behond my
understanding.
> I
> think behind their lack of compassion and comprehension, most of the
time
> you will find fears.
> Faith :It’s like anger, check inside your anger and you will probably
find
> a secret fear within .
> francis
>
>
> —– Original Message —– > From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
> To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
> Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:37 PM
> Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state
>
>
>> Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
>> Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost so many lives.
>> To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to be done with
> occupation,
>> After all war is not an answer when money talks.
>> I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many more who will  have
>> part
>> of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has no weapon in his
hand
> to
>> fight evil.
>> Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself talk on the TV.
>> Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
>> At least he has a hands he can shake with, some people don’t and they
are
>> only 20 years old kids.
>>
>> Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it doesn’t look like
it
> on
>> TV.
>>
>> If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war. He would be a
friend
>> with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand that working
together
>> Is better then killing each other.
>>
>> It is just shame that people want to save a life of an addict with
> Ibogaine
>> treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a silly war game of >> some
> rich
>> people.
>> And those rich people will get their ways anyways as they are >> corrupted
>> by
>> power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.
>>
>> It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants to be at war >> time.
>>
>> The enemy is in your head. People always can be friends, just like >> they
> did
>> before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God, then God he should
>> pray
>> to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are lost thanks to >> his
>> policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more of his and other
>> citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> —–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
>> Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
>> Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
>> Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>> Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
>>
>> I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be >> deleted
> form
>>
>> the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats
okay
>> I
>> had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but
found
>> this is just another hate site against our president in war time.
>>
>> >From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
>> >Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>> >To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
>> >Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600
>> >
>> >i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay
brain
>> >understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for >> >the
> day
>> >ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it
out
> of
>>
>> >here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
>> >concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest >> >files.
>> >what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley
> about
>>
>> >computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i
>> >figure
>> >with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones
worries.
>> >thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them
but
>> >don’t know how, ron
>> >   —– Original Message —–
>> >   From: m.finman
>> >   To: ibo
>> >   Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
>> >   Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
>> >
>> >
>> >   I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed
in
>> >the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool
>> >for
>> >onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment >> >I
>> >would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the
>> >ability
>> >to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
>> >        After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory
>> >experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my
dreams,
>> >feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced
> twice
>> >the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5
> years
>> >worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as >> >well
>> >as
>> >the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything >> >I
>> >needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I
never
>> >ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I
had
>> >one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
>> >something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we
all
>> >fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when
> you’ve
>> >done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher. >> >It
> was
>> >NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot
I
> had
>>
>> >in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were
rolled
>> >too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana
> high.
>>
>> >I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for
12
>> >years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican
>> >restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz.
>> >and
>> >it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I
> liked
>>
>> >it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still
experiencing
> the
>>
>> >combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
>> >experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process
of
>> >what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for
> right
>> >now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
>> >         So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about
their
>> >dream state.
>> >   I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk >> > we
>> >hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little
to
> no
>> >meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if >> >we
> can
>> >understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in
those
>> >books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has
their
>> >own perceptions.
>> >        Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain
> that’s
>> >different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have >> >any
>> >technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
>> >                 In advance I thank you,                Martee
>> >     Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll
>> > let
>> >you know.
>>
>> _________________________________________________________________
>> Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from >> McAfeeR
>> Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
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>>
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] FWD New Scientist article
Date: November 19, 2004 at 11:41:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Forwarded article

New Scientist

November 13, 2004

HEADLINE: The intoxication instinct;

From alcohol and cannabis to cocaine and LSD, it seems there are no limits to

our appetite for mind-altering substances. What is it about human nature that

drives us to get out of our heads, ask Helen Phillips and Graham Lawton

Helen Phillips, Graham Lawton

IN THE Smoke Shack, a “head shop” in Nelson, British Columbia, the air is
thick

with marijuana and the atmosphere is mellow as the staff stage a demo of their

dope-related paraphernalia. The clients range from tourists and business types

to the dreadlocked and dishevelled. All walks of life are welcome.

Over the border in the US, the police call to the man in the car for the last

time. If he doesn’t step out they will shoot. He stays put – maybe because
he’s

embarrassed about being caught naked from the waist down, clearly aroused. Or

maybe he’s just too high on methamphetamine to care.

High up in the mountains of Peru the men brew coca leaves into a tea. While
they

don’t approve of the habit of snorting the powdered extract, the tea gives
them

a mild buzz that helps fight the headaches and nausea of altitude sickness. Up

here, cocaine is part of life.

Lounging in a restaurant, two old friends share a second bottle of wine,
sinking

lower in their seats as they enjoy the numbing haze and warmth it creates.
Later

they’ll order brandy. The bartender pours himself a cup of coffee. It’s going
to

be a long shift.

As diverse as these episodes are, there is a clear common thread running
through

them: the pursuit of intoxication. Since prehistoric times, humans have been

seeking out and using intoxicating substances. Most people who have ever lived

have experienced a chemically induced altered state of consciousness, and the

same is true of people alive today. That’s not to say that everybody is

constantly fighting the urge to get high, nor that intoxication is somehow a

normal state of consciousness. But how many of us can claim never to have

experienced an altered state, whether it be a caffeine kick to help us get
going

in the morning, a relaxing beer after work, a few puffs on a joint at a party
or

the euphoric high of ecstasy?

In the present prohibitionist climate it is difficult to talk about the use of

psychoactive, literally “mind-altering”, substances without focusing on their

harmful and habit-forming properties. And it’s true that excessive use of

consciousness-altering drugs, both legal and illegal, is bad for individuals
and

bad for society. People who seek intoxication are taking risks with their
health

and flirting with addiction. Drugs can lead to crime, violence, accidents,

family disintegration and social decay.

Nonetheless, intoxicants remain a part of most people’s lives . And indeed
most

of us are able to consume them in moderation without spiralling into abuse and

addiction. Take alcohol, for example. Its potent psychoactive properties and

potential for wreaking havoc are well known, yet the majority of people still

drink and enjoy it without becoming alcoholics. There’s also ample evidence

that, despite public health campaigns and the threat of severe penalties,

millions of people every year join the legions who have experimented with

illegal substances, from cannabis and cocaine to ecstasy, amphetamines and LSD

(for a guide to the most commonly used psychoactive drugs, ).

It seems that intoxication in one form or another is universal, a part of who
we

are. “It’s a natural part of consciousness to change one’s consciousness,”

argues Rick Doblin, who runs the not-for-profit Multidisciplinary Association

for Psychedelic Studies in Sarasota, Florida. But why is it that we choose to

alter our state of consciousness by dosing our brains with chemicals?

The answer is straightforward. We seek intoxication for a simple reason that
we

are almost too scared to admit – we like it. Intoxication can be fun,
sociable,

memorable, therapeutic, even mind-expanding. Saying as much in the present

climate is not easy, but an increasing number of researchers now argue that

unless we’re prepared to look beyond the “drug problem” and acknowledge the

positive aspects of intoxication, we are only seeing half the story – like

researching sex while pretending it isn’t fun.

A full understanding of intoxication, and the quest to achieve it, could have

numerous pay-offs. For one thing there is the prospect of better ways to
tackle

abuse and addiction. There are also good reasons for studying intoxication as
a

phenomenon in its own right. What is it about psychoactive substances that we

like? What do they tell us about who we are? Is there a way to get the good

without the bad? Some researchers believe that such enquiries will lead to a
new

understanding of the human mind, including the mysteries of consciousness , or

new treatments for mental illness. Others go as far as to argue that it is
time

for society to accept that intoxication is an inextricable part of human
nature,

and find a way to let us explore it openly.

The quest to understand intoxication wasn’t always so constrained. Back in the

1950s, 60s and early 70s, many scientists took a very personal interest in it.

In those more liberal days, researchers such as physician Andrew Weil,
latterly

of the National Institute for Mental Health in Maryland, and ethnobotanist

Terrence McKenna charted the effects of many drugs, tested them in the lab and

in the field, explored their mind-altering qualities first-hand, documented

their use in different cultures, and suggested that many of the compounds had

medicinal benefits.

Many of these pioneering researchers came to the conclusion that seeking

intoxication was programmed into human nature. As Weil pointed out in his 1973

book The Natural Mind , from an early age children experiment with spinning

around or hyperventilating to experience mind-altering giddiness. He suggested

that when we get older, this quest to alter our feelings stays with us but we

pursue it chemically as well as physically.

The spirit of personal research, however, was largely quashed in the late 70s

and 80s as a US-led “war on drugs” took hold. Drug research became dominated
by

the “addiction paradigm”, with pleasure and benefits strictly off-limits. “It

was so controversial it had to be shut down altogether,” says Charles Grob,

director of the child and adolescent psychiatry department at Harbor-UCLA

Medical Center in Torrance, California, whose interests lie with the potential

medical use of psychedelics.

But some researchers carried on regardless. Ronald Siegel, now a

psychopharmacologist at the University of California, Los Angeles, was one of

them. As a psychology graduate student in the 60s he busied himself with

studying pigeon memory. One day, a fellow student was arrested for marijuana

possession, and his lawyer asked Siegel what he knew about the drug’s effects.

Not much, as it happened, so he brewed up an extract and watched what happened

when a pigeon got stoned.

Ever since, he has been fascinated by intoxication, what it is and why we and

other animals seek it. He managed to keep studying “controlled substances”
such

as LSD, mescaline, PCP, cocaine and psilocybin in his clinic, in animals and
in

volunteers, all legal and above board. He’s passed out, thrown up, been
attacked

by intoxicated animals, and even been shot at by drugs barons – all in the
name

of research. And he has gained a unique perspective, spelled out in his 1989

book Intoxication: Life in pursuit of artificial paradise , which is being

reissued next April by Park Street Press of Rochester, Vermont.

Siegel believes there is a strong biological drive to seek intoxication. “It’s

the fourth drive,” he says. “After hunger, thirst and sex, there is

intoxication.” Whether we are seeking pleasure, stimulation, pain relief or

escape, at the root of this drive, he says, is the motivation to feel
“different

from normal” – what has sometimes been called “a holiday from reality”. Some

people reach this state through travel, books, art, roller coasters, sport,

religion, exploration, love, social contact or power. Others use intoxicants.

“It’s the same motivation,” says Siegel. “We wouldn’t live if we didn’t seek
to

feel different.”

One of the main “different” feelings we want to experience is pleasure.

Pleasure, neuroscientists believe, is the brain’s way of telling us that we
are

doing something that is good for survival, such as eating and sex. The
circuits

that create the feeling are driven by natural opioids and cannabinoids. No

surprise, then, that we have a penchant for putting versions of these
chemicals

into our brains.

But the equation is not quite as simple as chemical in, pleasure out. At last

month’s Society for Neuroscience meeting in San Diego, California,

neuroscientist Kent Berridge of the University of Michigan in Ann Arbor

described preliminary work showing that rats given a natural cannabinoid,

anandamide, seemed to become unusually partial to sweet tastes. Rats primed
with

anandamide had higher pleasure responses to sugar than unprimed rats. It seems

that the cannabinoid may not just be pleasurable in its own right, but also

enhances other pleasurable experiences, making the world seem a generally more

likeable place. Perhaps this is one aspect of the well-known “munchies” effect

of marijuana, they conclude.

A related idea is that some people take psychoactive substances to suppress

“negative pleasure”. George Koob, a neuroscientist and addiction specialist at

the Scripps Research Institute in La Jolla, California, has proposed that the

brain has a natural system for limiting the amount of pleasure we can feel. He

argues that pleasure has to be transient or humans and other animals would get

so absorbed in it that they would succumb to the next predator that came
along.

Koob thinks that the brain has a way of bringing us down – a kind of

“anti-pleasure” mechanism if you like. What if this system goes into
overdrive?

“Some people seek excessive pleasure because they are born with too much

anti-pleasure,” he says. “They may take drugs to feel normal.”

But there is more to intoxication than simply massaging our pleasure circuits.

Some altered states, Siegel believes, have a utilitarian value. Just as many

animals naturally seek medicinal plants such as antibiotics or emetics, we
seek

to medicate our minds. When we are agitated or in pain, emotionally as well as

physically, we seek substances that tranquillise and sedate. When tired or

depressed, we seek stimulants. According to some researchers, including Grob,

this medicinal use is an underlying thread running through all forms of

intoxication.

The drive to medicate mood is pervasive throughout the animal kingdom, Siegel

says, and he and his colleagues have documented thousands of examples.

Elephants, for instance, enjoy the taste of fermented fruit. They will usually

just browse it, but if they lose their mate (elephants usually mate for life)

they may seek oblivion in an alcoholic fruit binge, even drinking neat ethanol

if researchers provide it. It’s hard not to conclude that, like humans, they
are

drowning their sorrows. Stress can also lead animals to take intoxicants as a

form of escape. When stressed by overcrowding, elephants are more motivated to

seek alcohol. And fear can take its toll too. During the Vietnam war, Siegel
and

his team filmed water buffalo grazing on opium poppies to the point of

addiction. And animals don’t just take downers: there are numerous reports of

goats guzzling stimulants such as coffee beans and the herbal amphetamine
khat.

Medication with uppers and downers may be fairly easy to understand, but there

are other intoxicants whose attractions are harder to fathom. These are the

hallucinogens, which can’t easily be explained in purely survivalist terms.
Most

animals actively avoid this category of intoxicant.

Despite this, some researchers believe that psychedelics can have a medicinal

effect in humans. Doblin, for example, argues that the drastically altered

states they induce can play a role in maintaining mental health.
Hallucinogens –

and to some extent cannabis and MDMA – allow us to escape, temporarily, from a

reality ruled by logic, ego and time, and explore other aspects of our

consciousness. “The brain functions best when it has access to altered
states,”

he says.

This might sound like hippy mumbo-jumbo, but there is plenty of evidence in
the

medical literature that hallucinogens are effective against mental illness,

including anxiety, post-traumatic stress disorder, alcoholism and heroin

addiction. Most of this research was done in the 1950s, but the field is now

showing signs of a revival. Grob recently received approval to test psilocybin

as a treatment for severe anxiety in terminally ill cancer patients, and there

are ongoing studies in the use of psilocybin for otherwise untreatable cases
of

obsessive compulsive disorder, and MDMA for serious post-traumatic stress

disorder.

Medicinal properties notwithstanding, there are other ideas to explain why

people take psychedelics. Siegel found that he could persuade monkeys to

voluntarily smoke the hallucinogen DMT when they were in a situation of severe

sensory deprivation. He had already trained three rhesus monkeys to smoke for
a

reward, to study the effects of nicotine. When he laced their smoking tubes
with

DMT, they briefly tried it, then avoided it. But after several days in
darkness,

with no stimulation, the monkeys began to smoke DMT voluntarily. They ended up

grasping at and chasing non-existent objects and hiding from invisible
dangers.

“This was the first demonstration of a non-human primate voluntarily taking a

hallucinogenic drug,” Siegel says. “We share the same motivation to light up
our

lives with chemical glimpses of another world.” Boredom it seems, will drive

animals to experiment, even when the experience is not altogether pleasurable.

The same drive to seek novelty or stave off boredom could explain why people

take drugs that have overwhelmingly negative effects. PCP, for example, which

some consider to be the most dangerous illegal drug, is a “dissociative” .
Among

its myriad effects are numbness, loss of coordination, paranoia,
hallucinations,

acute anxiety, mood swings and psychosis. But for some people the altered
state

is clearly worth it – PCP was hugely popular in the US in the 1970s. “People

seem to say they liked feeling different or funny,” says Siegel. “When there’s

nothing else to do, people will take anything to feel different.”

In some ways novelty-seeking is a basic behavioural drive. Literature on child

development reveals that once infants are no longer sleepy, hungry or thirsty,

they will explore and seek new experiences. They wriggle their limbs, put
things

in their mouths, touch things, taste things and bash things together. Without

this drive, they wouldn’t learn anything about the world around them. Perhaps

this spirit of exploration simply continues into adulthood in a different
form.

There’s another drive, too, that probably plays a role: risk-taking. For some

people taking risks is itself pleasurable. According to Koob this might come

from a slightly different brain system to the pleasure circuits. For animals

that forage, there is always the risk of being attacked by a predator. In
other

words there is a conflict between seeking new foraging sites, or novelty, and

risk. Evolution has got around this conundrum by making novelty rewarding and

pleasurable in its own right.

Pleasure, excitement, therapy, novelty: seen in this light, the pursuit of

intoxication looks very different from its standard portrayal as a
pathological

drive that must be suppressed before it leads to harm, addiction and squalor.

Yet the mainstream debate on drugs, alcohol and tobacco seems unable to

acknowledge that there is anything positive at all to say about intoxication.

Instead it is locked into a sterile argument between prohibitionists and those

who want to reduce the harmful effects by, for example, making heroin
available

on prescription. Both groups start from the belief that psychoactive
substances

are inherently harmful but disagree on what to do about it.

Some activists, however, are starting to argue for an entirely different

attitude to intoxication. One prominent critic of the debate is Richard Glen

Boire, director of the Center for Cognitive Liberty and Ethics in Davis,

California. He believes that intoxication is not just a part of human nature,
it

is a basic human right. “Why should it be illegal to alter your style of

thinking?” he says. “As long as you don’t do any harm to anyone else, what you

do in your own mind is as private as what you do in your own bedroom.” Boire

advocates changes to the law that would allow people to experiment with

psychoactive substances at home or in designated public places. “It’s the
right

of people to explore the full range of consciousness, and our duty as a
society

to accommodate that,” he says.

Some scientists are moving in the same direction, arguing that instead of

suppressing, medicalising and criminalising our basic drive to experience

altered states we should apply ourselves to making it safer, healthier and
less

squalid – in short, to taking the “toxic” out of intoxication.

The approach favoured by Siegel is to tweak existing drugs to make them
better,

with shorter effects and no addictive potential. “What it would be like,” he

says, “if we had a drug like alcohol, which didn’t lead to violence, fetal

damage, liver failure, that was safe, wouldn’t lead to drink driving and never

gave you a hangover. What would be wrong with it medically? Maybe we’d even

prescribe this alcohol substitute to help people relax.” We could even design

entirely new chemicals that allow us to experience all the pleasures, thrills

and adventures of intoxication without the downsides. “This is not science

fiction,” says Siegel. “Civilisation will eventually take this direction.”

Perhaps this would be the greatest contribution a full understanding of the

intoxication instinct could offer – a spur for society to move beyond the

irrational position of sanctioning caffeine, alcohol and tobacco while
fighting

a “war” against other psychoactive substances. David Lenson, a social theorist

at the University of Massachusetts in Amhurst and author of the 1995 book On

Drugs , makes this point by comparing the war on drugs with efforts to
eradicate

homosexuality: both are based on an incomplete understanding of human nature.

Siegel, too, sees an analogy with sex. “We can’t be expected to solve the AIDS

problem by outlawing sex,” he says. “We have to make drugs safe and healthy,

because people are not going to be able to say no.”

A window on the mind

Helen Phillips Graham Lawton

DRUGS provide some of the best evidence we have that the mind is the brain;
that

our thoughts, beliefs and perceptions are created by chemistry. Take a drug,

particularly a hallucinogen, and any of these can change. This means these
drugs

can be scary and need to be taken with great care and respect. But it also me
ans

they have the potential to reveal some of the deepest secrets about our minds

and consciousness.

A century ago, psychologist William James experimented with the anaesthetic

nitrous oxide. Our normal rational consciousness, he said, is just one special

type of consciousness, while all around it, “parted from it by the filmiest of

screens”, are other entirely different forms of consciousness, always
available

if the requisite stimulus is applied.

Others meticulously described the effects of inhaling ether, chloroform and

cannabis, and the strange distortions of time, perception and sense of humour

they induced. More curiously, they also described changes in belief, and even
in

philosophy. When Humphry Davy took nitrous oxide in 1799 he ended up
exclaiming

that “nothing exists but thoughts”. Others made similar observations and found

their views profoundly shifted by even brief forays to the other side of that

filmy screen.

This raises the peculiar question of whether what James called “our normal

rational consciousness” is necessarily the best state for understanding the

world. After all, if one’s view of the world can change so dramatically with
the

aid of a simple molecule, how can we be sure that our normal brain chemistry
is

the one most suited to doing science and philosophy? What if our brain
chemistry

evolved to help us survive at the cost of giving us false beliefs about the

world? If so, it is possible that mind-altering drugs might in fact give us a

better, not worse, insight than we have in our so-called normal state.

Take the common hallucinogenic experience of losing our separate self, or

becoming one with the universe. This may seem, to some, like mystical hogwash,

but in fact it fits far better with a scientific understanding of the world
than

our normal dualist view. Most of us feel, most of the time, that we are some

kind of separate self who inhabits our body like a driver in a car or a pilot
in

a plane. Throughout history many people have believed in a soul or spirit. Yet

science has long known that this cannot be so. There is just a brain that is

made of exactly the same kind of stuff as the world around it. We really are
one

with the universe.

This means that the psychedelic sense of self may actually be truer than the

dualist view. So although our normal state is better for surviving and

reproducing, it may not always be best for understanding who and what we are.

Perhaps we ought to try doing science in some of these intoxicated states.

This was just what psychologist Charles Tart of the University of California,

Davis, suggested in 1972, in the journal Science . He likened different states

of consciousness to different paradigms in science and proposed creating
“state

specific sciences”, new sciences which would be done by scientists working and

communicating in altered states. These new sciences might only have limited

application but this makes the point that our normal state may not be the only

way to try to understand the universe.

Since Tart’s work, most psychedelic drugs have become prohibited and research

has largely been stifled. Perhaps one day, when prohibition is abandoned,

scientists may once again take up the promise offered by those tiny little

chemicals that can tell us who and what we are.

Under the influence

Helen Phillips Graham Lawton

HOW common is the use of mind-altering substances? Accurate figures are hard
to

come by, largely because most psychoactive drugs are illegal and the task of

keeping tabs on the legal ones is monumental. But it’s safe to say from the

available figures that the use of mind-altering substances is a widespread –
if

not near-universal – human experience.

According to the latest drug data from the United Nations (World Drug Report

2004 ), about 185 million people worldwide have used an illicit substance in
the

past 12 months. That’s around 1 in 20 of the adult population. With 146
million

users, cannabis is by far the most popular, followed by amphetamines (30

million), cocaine (13 million) and ecstasy (8 million). Despite
prohibitionists’

best efforts, these figures have remained unchanged since the first World Drug

Report in 1997.

Illicit drug use in western countries is higher than the global average.

According to the 2003 US National Survey on Drug Use and Health, 19.5 million

Americans had taken at least one drug, mainly cannabis, in the 30 days before

the survey. That’s about 1 in 12 of the “adult” population (aged 12 plus). An

even higher proportion report having taken illicit drugs at some point in
their

lives. According to a recent survey, 77 million Americans, a third of all

adults, have used drugs at least once (Human Psychopharmacology: Clinical and

Experimental , vol 17, p 140).

And illegal drugs are just the tip of the iceberg. The World Health
Organization

estimates that there are 1.3 billion tobacco smokers worldwide, 30 per cent of

the adult population (World Health Report, 2003). Alcohol use is even more

prevalent. In the US, a relatively sober country, just over 50 per cent of

adults have had at least one alcoholic drink in the past month. In the UK, 88

per cent of people drink at least once a month and 48 per cent drink at least

twice a week. Outside the Islamic world very few people abstain completely.
The

figure is 20 per cent in Canada, 9 per cent in Germany, and as low as 4 per
cent

in some Nordic countries.

Of all the world’s psychoactive substances, however, none can match the reach
of

caffeine, the only universally sanctioned drug both legally and culturally.
Its

main source, coffee, is immensely popular, with 79 per cent of the US adult

population drinking it regularly, according to the US National Coffee

Association. Add to that all the tea, chocolate and caffeinated soft drinks

consumed in the world, and it’s fair to say that caffeine is the most widely

consumed psychoactive substance on Earth. The majority of us are probably
under

the influence of caffeine most of the time.

Overall, it’s hard not to conclude that the vast majority of people are
current

or former users of psychoactive substances. The clinching figure, of course,

would be one for “lifetime abstinence”, the percentage of people who have
never,

ever taken anything that alters their consciousness. But it appears that no
one

has ever worked out such a figure, perhaps because, to all intents and
purposes,

it is zero.

Out of it: A cultural history of intoxication by Stuart Walton, Penguin Books

(2001); Street Drugs by Andrew Tyler, Hodder & Stoughton (1995)

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.
Date: November 19, 2004 at 9:52:24 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee

My brother is also your local southernmost holyman 🙂

Which one ? we have a lot of holyman here !! 😉
Don’t forget to come to visit me if you come in this holytown !!

—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.

Interesting info.  I also know and have conservative friends and family.
I
usually don’t do politics as a rule, however, avoid it completely with
certain people.  I am interested if you can give me info where to learn
more
on the whole collective consciousness  for healing.  It sounds exactly
like
something I would tap into.  I had lunch yesterday with a mutual
aquaintance.  My brother is also your local southernmost holyman!  Any
info
would be appreciated.       Martee
—- Original Message —–
From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 11:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives

I found this study at
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/07/22_politics.shtml

very interesting:
Four researchers who culled through 50 years of research literature
about
the psychology of conservatism report that at the core of political
conservatism is the resistance to change and a tolerance for inequality,
and
that some of the common psychological factors linked to political
conservatism include:

a.. Fear and aggression

b.. Dogmatism and intolerance of ambiguity

c.. Uncertainty avoidance

d.. Need for cognitive closure

e.. Terror management
They really have a different view of the world. Most of the people that
we
reconize as great contribuitors to our history and planet, from Lao-tse,
Buddha, Socrate,  Jesus, Leonardo da Vinci ,Edison, Einstein. You name
it,
where not consevative. I think conservatives are from a different planet
:-). I have a very good friend who are conservatives, but I avoid many
subjects with them. They will never change, it’s behond my
understanding.
I
think behind their lack of compassion and comprehension, most of the
time
you will find fears.
Faith :It’s like anger, check inside your anger and you will probably
find
a secret fear within .
francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state

Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost so many lives.
To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to be done with
occupation,
After all war is not an answer when money talks.
I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many more who will  have
part
of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has no weapon in his
hand
to
fight evil.
Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself talk on the TV.
Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
At least he has a hands he can shake with, some people don’t and they
are
only 20 years old kids.

Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it doesn’t look like
it
on
TV.

If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war. He would be a
friend
with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand that working
together
Is better then killing each other.

It is just shame that people want to save a life of an addict with
Ibogaine
treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a silly war game of some
rich
people.
And those rich people will get their ways anyways as they are corrupted
by
power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.

It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants to be at war time.

The enemy is in your head. People always can be friends, just like they
did
before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God, then God he should
pray
to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are lost thanks to his
policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more of his and other
citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted
form

the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats
okay
I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but
found
this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay
brain
understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the
day
ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it
out
of

here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.
what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley
about

computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i
figure
with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones
worries.
thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them
but
don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed
in
the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool
for
onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I
would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the
ability
to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my
dreams,
feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced
twice
the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5
years
worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well
as
the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I
needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I
never
ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I
had
one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we
all
fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when
you’ve
done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It
was
NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot
I
had

in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were
rolled
too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana
high.

I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for
12
years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican
restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz.
and
it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I
liked

it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still
experiencing
the

combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process
of
what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for
right
now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about
their
dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little
to
no
meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we
can
understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in
those
books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has
their
own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain
that’s
different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any
technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll
let
you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfeeR
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.
Date: November 19, 2004 at 9:33:49 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee !
I always enjoy your posting and it’s a real pleasure to try to respond your
question:

You wrote :

: ” I am interested if you can give me info where to learn more
on the whole collective consciousness  for healing.”

I have no idea about the whole collective consciousness, sincerly. I grow up
in Africa, and Europe spend years in South America and in the Carribean .
The consciousness seems generaly cultural with common trait on  certain
beliefs regarding evil and good forces, spirit, ghost, entities, Angels ,
demons and the spirit of Ancestors , not forgetting heroes defing laws of
nature.and mens .
Honestly I am the wrong person to answer this question.

In my humble opinion healing can be achieve only throught spirituality .
and the Healer should be only a kind of facilitator tapping in what is best
and noble  in mankind
Each one of us had is on battle to win to be a better man and can get help
from any one that went throught the pain before himself,  here or anywhere
else….
I think that peace, humility and patience are the ways.
That all I have .. not much, really 🙂

I believe that compassion and understanding are the best tool of the ”
medecine man ”  I have seen in this group and incredible amount of the last
two.Nothing is more beautiful than to help.In africa the healer teaches is
patient to be an healer then is not anymore a patient : is cured and is now
a healer and he can start to help .. I think it’s what will happen with a
lot of addicts throught a wonderful and mysterious metamorphosis with the
help of Ibogaine and… God 🙂 of course.

Martee , I am getting to F#@# serious !! I have to stop !! Help me  ! I cant
shut up !!

God Bless you
Francis

About Hypoglycemia from a study 95 % of the alcoholics suffers from this
disease the rest are pre diabetic or diabetic.
I add this problem too

—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 5:47 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.

Interesting info.  I also know and have conservative friends and family.
I
usually don’t do politics as a rule, however, avoid it completely with
certain people.  I am interested if you can give me info where to learn
more
on the whole collective consciousness  for healing.  It sounds exactly
like
something I would tap into.  I had lunch yesterday with a mutual
aquaintance.  My brother is also your local southernmost holyman!  Any
info
would be appreciated.       Martee
—- Original Message —–
From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 11:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives

I found this study at
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/07/22_politics.shtml

very interesting:
Four researchers who culled through 50 years of research literature
about
the psychology of conservatism report that at the core of political
conservatism is the resistance to change and a tolerance for inequality,
and
that some of the common psychological factors linked to political
conservatism include:

a.. Fear and aggression

b.. Dogmatism and intolerance of ambiguity

c.. Uncertainty avoidance

d.. Need for cognitive closure

e.. Terror management
They really have a different view of the world. Most of the people that
we
reconize as great contribuitors to our history and planet, from Lao-tse,
Buddha, Socrate,  Jesus, Leonardo da Vinci ,Edison, Einstein. You name
it,
where not consevative. I think conservatives are from a different planet
:-). I have a very good friend who are conservatives, but I avoid many
subjects with them. They will never change, it’s behond my
understanding.
I
think behind their lack of compassion and comprehension, most of the
time
you will find fears.
Faith :It’s like anger, check inside your anger and you will probably
find
a secret fear within .
francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state

Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost so many lives.
To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to be done with
occupation,
After all war is not an answer when money talks.
I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many more who will  have
part
of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has no weapon in his
hand
to
fight evil.
Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself talk on the TV.
Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
At least he has a hands he can shake with, some people don’t and they
are
only 20 years old kids.

Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it doesn’t look like
it
on
TV.

If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war. He would be a
friend
with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand that working
together
Is better then killing each other.

It is just shame that people want to save a life of an addict with
Ibogaine
treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a silly war game of some
rich
people.
And those rich people will get their ways anyways as they are corrupted
by
power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.

It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants to be at war time.

The enemy is in your head. People always can be friends, just like they
did
before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God, then God he should
pray
to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are lost thanks to his
policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more of his and other
citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted
form

the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats
okay
I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but
found
this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay
brain
understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the
day
ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it
out
of

here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.
what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley
about

computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i
figure
with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones
worries.
thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them
but
don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed
in
the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool
for
onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I
would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the
ability
to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my
dreams,
feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced
twice
the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5
years
worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well
as
the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I
needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I
never
ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I
had
one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we
all
fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when
you’ve
done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It
was
NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot
I
had

in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were
rolled
too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana
high.

I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for
12
years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican
restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz.
and
it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I
liked

it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still
experiencing
the

combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process
of
what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for
right
now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about
their
dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little
to
no
meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we
can
understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in
those
books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has
their
own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain
that’s
different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any
technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll
let
you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfeeR
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 8:54:47 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston,
I was never able to stop the cigs until the ibogaine got the opiates out of my brain.  For me I went in with the intention of no more cigs as I saw them as big a problem.  I felt it in my breathing and couldn’t do my sisters 4th floor walk up without a break.  Being in the health and empowerment field, smoking is definitley counterindicated!  It was as much a struggle for me as the opiates.  Today I do bum cigs when I get to NYC and do have some tolerable cravings.  I have no dope cravings at all, to put it in perspective how NOT trivia the whole smoking thing is.  Not to mention the list of 100 different chemicals that are in the cigarettes to furthur addict us.
I’m sorry but I can’t apply you’re being weak or acknowledge it’s all about self-control as a way to come to terms with your dilema. If that was the case how was I able to not smoke pot for 20 years after doing it for 20. Or not drink alcohol for 12 when everyone is constantly insisting and trying to shove it down your throat,but was bringing myself to the verge of total destruction and death while everything else seemed to be going so well? You exhibit the self control necessary to sit down and get your writing done. I’m sure if you gave yourself a minute you could come up with 10 different ways you exhibit self control in your life. Strength,  come on Preston, you couldn’t have survived what you have so far without more strength than some 20 people could muster up.  You posses an aire about you that comes so naturally and with confidence,  that excuse me if I mistook it for strength.
So another ibogaine is a good plan.  It’s not uncommon to need more than one.  Intellectually you know this. Emotionally don’t beat yourself up because of it. Everyother type of “treatment” had about as much affect on me as trying to put out a fire by spitting on it! Whether you remained “activity” free for 1 week or 2-3 mos, it seems your gut and your heart seems to be telling you to do the ibogaine again. Let these same instincts come up with a different plan for the progress you truly want.
As far as your suppossed to be “efficiently” remaining as is: I seem to be doing fairly well, is a far cry from I am doing well.  I also couldn’t help but zone in on words like irritating, complicating, socially unacceptable things and behavior, being guilty and having to hide from those you care about.  I think you answered your own question.  It’s no lie when they say you can talk yourself into anything. So stop talking and thinking that way about yourself please.
As far as telling the world to go fuck themselves.  Hey there’s always plenty of reason to do that!  In a whole list of topics that don’t involve hampering your own personal evolution.
I’m not going to go furthur as I don’t want to cross the line from being respectfully concerned to this girls gone to far,  So I close.  My email has been posted and you can get my # from common aquaintances if you so wish.
With Soo much respect,
Martee

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 10:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Thanks for the suggestion, but being a fond lover of smoking herb with or without cigarettes, and having actually tried that before to no avail, I’m afraid that ain’t gonna cut it either.
I’ve also tried substuting clove cigs for tobacco, but that really, really didn’t cut it either.
It’s been quite some time I’ve been discussing this here, and it sounds the same as always, like I’m a weak ass git who can’t find self-control.
Sorry, I’m feeling a bit off-balance and angry at myself for this and that reason. I can’t seem to find it in myself to open up much about it (having tried a number of time to do so here but ending up deleting the message before hitting send), finding myself embarrassed and hateful and sad, but this is about as far as I feel like taking it publicly. Suffice it to say, I’m going to take ibogaine again at some point, as I believe I’ve recently noted, but wonder- will this, as with every other freakin’ fucking “treatment” I’ve ever tried turn into one of these stupid, “oh well, nuther failed effort” things? Am I weak? Or am I simply supposed to be taking my drugs in the most effective manner possible and should just tell the rest of the world to fuck the hell off? I mean, I seem to be doing fairly well for the most part, other than for this irritating, complicating love of drug effects, foreign molecules, and other socially unacceptable things and behaviors. And even with those I’m doing fairly well, besides having to deal with the complications of trying to do my substances in the way I find most effective without feeling too guilty and fucked up about it- and worst of all, finding myself hiding it from the people I care most about in the entire world because, well, most of you (with some possible exceptions who will remain unnamed by me for now) understand what I’m talking about and where I’m coming from.
Anyway, love to you all.
(How can life suck so bad at the same time things are going so fucking well?)

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some ganja instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive, physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke. Maybe herb could help…

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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:46:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

St Johns Wart is a natural mild natural form of an MAO inhibitor drug. These are old antodepressants that doc used 20 years ago and have a lot of nasty side effects and interactions w/ certain amino acids found commonly in cheese and wine etc.. I don’r recommend them. They do nothing for sleep.

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: slowone: delayed response
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:47:46 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Friday, November 19, 2004, at 01:31 PM, m.finman wrote:

I hate to bring this up again, however, for me personally, when my blood sugar is in a too low state,especially too frequently due to lack of protein and fat and too much ingestion of sugar and refined carbs, I go what can only be described as WHACKO! I don’t know if that’s a medical term! Emotionally blood sugar dipping (hypoglycemia) can bring on inability to concentrate, confusion, pull around the eyes(these are the tamer more mild onset of symptoms for me) and then finally rage, anger, tears, self loathing, and a downward spiral that used to (before I formed a spiritual sense) lead to constant suicidal thoughts.

I suffer from the same thing. If i skip a meal or stray from a proper diet… i become an instant asshole, cannot think straight, become short tempered and life as i know it basically goes into a downward spiral until I get something decent into my stomach.

Hypoglycemia sucks, and I have a feeling many ex-addicts suffer from this.

_.dh

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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:44:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

High dose Kava realy works. You just have to take an lot

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:43:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, Ibo is not a benzo detox therapy!

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] the intoxication instinct
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:40:25 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

After I read this link, I remembered watching 3 crows in Victoria B.C. they
were harvesting the chinese plums that where so ripe they had probably
converted the sugar to alcohol. they acted just like drunks at a party.
Staggering and cawing it was very amusing to watch.  Only thing missing was
the lampshades and some disco music…..Thanks for the memory…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 12:46 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] the intoxication instinct

http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v04/n1636/a11.html?999

UK: The Intoxication Instinct
URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v04/n1636/a11.html
Newshawk: End Marijuana Prohibition: www.mpp.org
Votes: 0
Pubdate: Sat, 13 Nov 2004
Source: New Scientist (UK)
Copyright: New Scientist, RBI Limited 2004
Contact: letters@newscientist.com
Website: http://www.newscientist.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/294
Author: Helen Phillips, Graham Lawton

THE INTOXICATION INSTINCT

From alcohol and cannabis to cocaine and LSD, it seems there are no limits
to our appetite for mind-altering substances.  What is it about human
nature
that drives us to get out of our heads, ask Helen Phillips and Graham
Lawton

Smoke Shack, a “head shop” in Nelson, British Columbia, the air is thick
with marijuana and the atmosphere is mellow as the staff stage a demo of
their dope-related paraphernalia.  The clients range from tourists and
business types to the dreadlocked and dishevelled.  All walks of life are
welcome.

Over the border in the US, the police call to the man in the car for the
last time.  If he doesn’t step out they will shoot.

He stays put – maybe because he’s embarrassed about being caught naked
from
the waist down, clearly aroused.  Or maybe he’s just too high on
methamphetamine to care.

High up in the mountains of Peru the men brew coca leaves into a tea.
While
they don’t approve of the habit of snorting the powdered extract, the tea
gives them a mild buzz that helps fight the headaches and nausea of
altitude
sickness.

Up here, cocaine is part of life.

Lounging in a restaurant, two old friends share a second bottle of wine,
sinking lower in their seats as they enjoy the numbing haze and warmth it
creates.  Later they’ll order brandy.

The bartender pours himself a cup of coffee.

It’s going to be a long shift.

As diverse as these episodes are, there is a clear common thread running
through them: the pursuit of intoxication.  Since prehistoric times,
humans
have been seeking out and using intoxicating substances.  Most people who
have ever lived have experienced a chemically induced altered state of
consciousness, and the same is true of people alive today.  That’s not to
say that everybody is constantly fighting the urge to get high, nor that
intoxication is somehow a normal state of consciousness.  But how many of
us
can claim never to have experienced an altered state, whether it be a
caffeine kick to help us get going in the morning, a relaxing beer after
work, a few puffs on a joint at a party or the euphoric high of ecstasy?

In the present prohibitionist climate it is difficult to talk about the
use
of psychoactive, literally “mind-altering”, substances without focusing on
their harmful and habit-forming properties.  And it’s true that excessive
use of consciousness-altering drugs, both legal and illegal, is bad for
individuals and bad for society.

People who seek intoxication are taking risks with their health and
flirting
with addiction.

Drugs can lead to crime, violence, accidents, family disintegration and
social decay.

Nonetheless, intoxicants remain a part of most people’s lives .  And
indeed
most of us are able to consume them in moderation without spiralling into
abuse and addiction.

Take alcohol, for example.

Its potent psychoactive properties and potential for wreaking havoc are
well
known, yet the majority of people still drink and enjoy it without
becoming
alcoholics.  There’s also ample evidence that, despite public health
campaigns and the threat of severe penalties, millions of people every
year
join the legions who have experimented with illegal substances, from
cannabis and cocaine to ecstasy, amphetamines and LSD ( for a guide to the
most commonly used psychoactive drugs, ).

It seems that intoxication in one form or another is universal, a part of
who we are.  “It’s a natural part of consciousness to change one’s
consciousness,” argues Rick Doblin, who runs the not-for-profit
Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies in Sarasota,
Florida.
But why is it that we choose to alter our state of consciousness by dosing
our brains with chemicals?

The answer is straightforward.  We seek intoxication for a simple reason
that we are almost too scared to admit – we like it.  Intoxication can be
fun, sociable, memorable, therapeutic, even mind-expanding.  Saying as
much
in the present climate is not easy, but an increasing number of
researchers
now argue that unless we’re prepared to look beyond the “drug problem” and
acknowledge the positive aspects of intoxication, we are only seeing half
the story – like researching sex while pretending it isn’t fun.

full understanding of intoxication, and the quest to achieve it, could
have
numerous pay-offs.  For one thing there is the prospect of better ways to
tackle abuse and addiction.

There are also good reasons for studying intoxication as a phenomenon in
its
own right.

What is it about psychoactive substances that we like? What do they tell
us
about who we are? Is there a way to get the good without the bad? Some
researchers believe that such enquiries will lead to a new understanding
of
the human mind, including the mysteries of consciousness , or new
treatments
for mental illness.

Others go as far as to argue that it is time for society to accept that
intoxication is an inextricable part of human nature, and find a way to
let
us explore it openly.
snip-

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:23:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron none of my business.  But there just needs to be hope at the end of the
tunnel for anyone.  If you need all these verbal trappings to get there go
for it.  Words are’nt the only thing to measure a man by .  Cut some slack
for everyone and it will only get better…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 9:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

addiction is the psychological need to controll the drug ingested once
ingested and the inablity to do so.  it can occur at the time or weeks
later, e.g. binge drinkers
dependance refers to withdrawals as i read the literature.  but i’m on my
way out so disregard all this.  we have rights, but with those come
duties.
we live in herds and are obligated to contribute to the herd, i.e. give it
our best game. if ones recreational habits keep her from giving us her
best
game , she has neglected her duty which is concurrent w/ her rights.
americans tend to think that way, it’s my right, but they never talk about
the duty that goes with it.  rwd,, burning out quickly, been a pd too
long,
20 yrs, heard all the stories, excuses , blame game, etc.  been a junkie
using those same stories. now i’m just screwed and listen to those that
know
much more than me as a result of the forum..hope i didn’t start a topic
and
break protocol, but you guys can relax, i’ve been kicked out of nicer
places.  peace to all—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:33 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

“What is happening is that the government is using a
condition they created out of thin air, non-existent,
called “addiction”, to justify its fascistic
prohibitionist actions to the world in an attempt to
demonize and stigmatise cannabis consumers.  Ask your
neighborhood fascist what the “symptoms” of addiction
are.  He either won’t be able to tell you, or he’ll
tell you some nonesense which is a blow by blow
repetition of prohibitionist propaganda statements
found on their advertising.  This is to scare ignorant
non-consumers of cannabis into supporting the
fascistic and illegal crushing of democratic rights of
cannabis consumers.
You know damned well that not using cannabis has
no “withdrawal” symptoms.  Its no different from
stopping the consumption of ice cream, or broccoli, or
any other food, except you are not getting a buzz,
which people who DO know about cannabis know full well
is just harmless fun, and hurts nobody.
So stop playing the innocent.  Those folks you
complain about are trying to murder and torture you
for purposes that have absolutely nothing to do with
your health, safety, welfare, or anyone else’s.  Quit
playing their game, and get on with the reality of
cannabis consumption and the law.  We are all being
preyed on by evil fascist murderers, and we need to
start defending ourselves.”

From my friend…

Greetings crookedeye,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 4:46
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Thanks for the suggestion, but being a fond lover of smoking herb with
or
without cigarettes, and having actually tried that before to no avail,
I’m
afraid that ain’t gonna cut it either.
I’ve also tried substuting clove cigs for tobacco, but that really,
really
didn’t cut it either.
It’s been quite some time I’ve been discussing this here, and it sounds
the
same as always, like I’m a weak ass git who can’t find self-control.
Sorry, I’m feeling a bit off-balance and angry at myself for this and
that reason. I can’t seem to find it in myself to open up much about it
(having tried a number of time to do so here but ending up deleting the
message before hitting send), finding myself embarrassed and hateful and
sad, but this is about as far as I feel like taking it publicly. Suffice
it
to say, I’m going to take ibogaine again at some point, as I believe
I’ve
recently noted, but wonder- will this, as with every other freakin’
fucking
“treatment” I’ve ever tried turn into one of these stupid, “oh well,
nuther
failed effort” things? Am I weak? Or am I simply supposed to be taking
my
drugs in the most effective manner possible and should just tell the
rest
of

the world to fuck the hell off? I mean, I seem to be doing fairly well
for
the most part, other than for this irritating, complicating love of drug
effects, foreign molecules, and other socially unacceptable things and
behaviors. And even with those I’m doing fairly well, besides having to
deal

with the complications of trying to do my substances in the way I find
most
effective without feeling too guilty and fucked up about it- and worst
of
all, finding myself hiding it from the people I care most about in the
entire world because, well, most of you (with some possible exceptions
who
will remain unnamed by me for now) understand what I’m talking about and
where I’m coming from.
Anyway, love to you all.
(How can life suck so bad at the same time things are going so fucking
well?)

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some
ganja
instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive,
physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke.
Maybe herb could help…

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] R Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:05:01 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: slowone: delayed response
Date: November 19, 2004 at 6:31:17 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hannah,
I hate to bring this up again, however, for me personally, when my blood sugar is in a too low state,especially too frequently due to lack of protein and fat and too much ingestion of sugar and refined carbs, I go what can only be described as WHACKO! I don’t know if that’s a medical term! Emotionally blood sugar dipping (hypoglycemia) can bring on inability to concentrate, confusion, pull around the eyes(these are the tamer more mild onset of symptoms for me) and then finally rage, anger, tears, self loathing, and a downward spiral that used to (before I formed a spiritual sense) lead to constant suicidal thoughts.  I haven’t been there in a very very long time.  A lot of people become hypoglycemic because of abusing the diet and eating too many(or living on) sugar laden refined foods.  It’s one of those cause and affect things.  I used to feel I could be driven to do physical violence or vehicular homicide,  thank God for my non violent core, formed at a very young age.  My condition was diagnosed after a 6 hour glucose tolerance test 20 years ago as “borderline.”  I was so stunned.  I thought if I’m borderline what’s the real deal about.  One of my clients I believe is closer to that condition as she experiences blackouts without food or enough protein.
Yes there’s a lot of issues to deal with on an emotional, and psychological level here, to come to terms with and confront and let go of. But first get the whacko part out of the way so you know what you’re dealing with isn’t blown out of perportion by the demon sugar!   With food you will notice a difference in minutes, hours,days as the physical response is immediate.   I also found taking chromium piccolinate at intervals during the day helped keep the blood sugar more level and helped with cravings. Since I’ve been doing my cacoa drink, for the first time in 30 years I no longer need the chromium and am actually tolerating the whole carbs. Still using caution and indulging at what I feel are appropriate intervals.
Let me know what you need in more detail or explained differently.  I would be glad to help.
I’m so glad to hear your boyfriend has so many good qualities.  Consider the possibility that anything going on in your house or relationship that is frustrating you or not serving you, that you somehow set up or pacifly accepted those dynamics that manifest that condition to persist.   I sense there are areas you need to be a more active participant in that which affects you.  It’s once again seeing peoples behavior or habits that are lacking and not the person themselves.  If you vocally  personalize the affect of that behavior on yourself, and acknowledge what good hearted, kind people they are, but could they give a little here….. you should get the proper response.  The tone to set is not aggressive, not condecending,not submissive.  We’re looking for more of a well rooted, hold your own, with a compasionate soft tone thrown in.  This is how I see it anyway.  Know what you want going in and don’t let them tell you to piss off, even in a nice way.  Nothing like a good comeback!
I also smoked endlessly on opiates but couldnt stand the smell otherwise.( By the way I did stop cigaretees on ibogaine, but it was my agenda going in. ) It’s childlike for someone to tell you, well you do it! Not justification enough for you to back down.  We’re not in the 5th grade and in certain circumstances we’re not all on even ground.  Do you realize you’re one up here?
Let me stop.  I wish for you strength, grounding, feeling worthy,all the insight you’ll ever need and above all Love,     Martee

—– Original Message —– From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 3:41 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: slowone: delayed response

Thanks for this post Martee.  I seem to be having a real problem with anger
at the moment which isn’t normal for me-everything gets me stressed and I
end up feeling like I want to smash the room up or attack someone
physically.  I’ve been really horrible to my close friends (everyone else
I’ve stayed away from) and I’m really lucky that they’ve been understanding
about it.  I just feel like I’m gonna explode over the silliest things!
You’re post really helped-I’ve got to step back and look at it
rationally-what I can and cannot control.  Keep posting.  I particularly
liked the difference between being assertive and being aggressive.  My ‘life
coach’ is getting me to do visualisation which I used to find easy but for
some reason is really difficult for me right now.  “Think of a time you were
feeling self-confident”  I just can’t seem to find a time when I felt like
that!  I need to spend less time raging over things I have no control over
and more time cultivating ‘inner peace’ if you know what I mean.  Thanks
anyway,
love Hannah

—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 2:02 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: slowone: delayed response

I was trying to clear out my inbox and reread this quite a few times.  I
believe the goal is to not hold on to any negative emotion.  That is what
causes illness in the body.  An alternative to anger as you see it I
believe
would be to have an understanding of the difference between being
aggressive
and being assertive.  Being assertive comes from a place of strength,
empowerment,confidence and control.  Being aggressive comes from a wounded
ego based place. Getting caught up in aanger and rage is actually a form
of
being manipulated and giving your power away.  Much in the same way that
when a person looking for a fight eggs someone else into one, even though
the challenged person thinks they are exhibiting strength they are being
controlled and manipulated by the bully.  I am not saying the emotions you
feel are  not to be ignored, just put into a more healthy context.
There are 2 things one should never get angry or stressed with.  One
is
things you can actually do something about.  The other is things you have
no
control over.  The last time I raged at something(which was my first day
back to work after ibogaine and 1 month off) it took all of 2 seconds
before
I stopped and realized I was more upset at myself for raging than I was at
what I was raging about.  I remedied the situation later that day by
telling
the responsible party that i had something to tell them, I wasn’t going to
bring it up again or repeat myself and I didn’t want a response just then
but that I definitly expected the situation resolved.  It worked. No hard
feelings anywhere. and I came out ahead situation wise all the way around.
One of your observations, which is a big part of not raging is what
you
said about attacking the behavior and not the person.  You call someone a
fucking idiot and no matter what once the situation has been resolved
there’s reasons for bad feelings.  This is the same criticizing behavior
that perpetuates wounds and I can’t help but think in some instances it’s
a
tape playing in ones head of possibly how they were dealt with.  Learned
behavior.  Speaking on the behavior exhibited comes from a whole different
place.  It comes more from a place of strength . I had this exact same
conversation with one of my clients who is getting a divorce.  She told me
she called him a stupid fucking idiot because of stuff he was doing way
out
of character.  I told her that to not tear him down furthur than he
already
is ,as after their 11 years there must still be concern for his well being
and to remember he is the father of her daughter she needed to have more
tact and just comment on the behavior.  She later told me this was a hugh
help to her.
Choosing your battles is a good one.  Once you are able to get at the
source of things it will be a lot easier just to let things go.  I have
experienced personally with guilt and i’m sure it’s the same with anger,
people can’t make you anything , YOU have to personally own it.
I’ll tell you honestly, I was doing victim /abuse workshops for 10
years . It took a full year or more before I really got some of the stuff
I
was talking about.  It’s like you can understand something intellectually
and take a while for the clarity to set in. A lot of the stuff I’ve done
may
have been for others but it was just as much for my own healing.   I’m
just
passing on a little insight that did wonders for me.  Believe me there are
still times when my immediate unvocalized reaction comes from that
“street”
place in me.  It’s just less frequently these days.  We are human
afterall.
With respect and
sincerity,

Martee
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list

> More on the apparent ability of P. harmala extract to lessen the
> stress of iboga on the gut, which oddly no one responded to. If you
> take such an extract (w/out iboga) and then make an effort to yak
> it up an hour or so later, you’ll notice that there is no acidity
> in what comes up.
>
>>  Anger is a tough one for me, still learning how to be with it.
>
> A thought after sleeping on it – the goal seems to be to be able to
> hold anger without burying it, choosing to display it when it can
> help you achieve your goal. A therapist friend described properly-
> used anger as a sword that you whip out and bring to the other
> person’s throat, and just knowing you have it at your side makes
> for a different posture in the world. Maybe holding anger without
> expressing it in the situation requires expressing it somewhere
> else to someone who is equipped to hear it and understand.
>
> One big subtlety I’ve noticed is that one can say “I’m angry about .
> .” and this is a whole different conversation from “You fucking
> idiot …” which is what I’d feel like saying and then shut down
> because of inability to be impolite.
>
> The other day someone said I just need to develop my adult self,
> and when this is done my wounded child will feel safe enough to
> come out and heal. This reminds me of something Nick wrote a while
> ago:
>
>> Generally it’s my opinion that the ego needs multiple “staging
>> posts” on it’s long journey toward true self-recognition. Even
>> though ultimately it’s merely a journey from here to here this
>> doesn’t seem to lessen the impact of the experience.
>
> In this context the ego would be the parental self. So just acting
> as mature as possible, understanding that the reason is to build
> oneself up rather than conform, choosing the right battles, biding
> one’s time as necessary, could be a program 🙂
>
> I’m also reminded of this from ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com:
>
>> I don’t believe we have to polish our egos to the point of
> getting
>> an “A”. I think a C+ will do. The universe is not so fucking
>> relentless as to require any sembance of perfection. A C+ will do
>
>> and then “we” can get out of the way.
>>  Relax at that point and the separate sense will automatically
> burn.
>
> By the way, I’m angry about the US election results. Probably that
> is already obvious 🙂
>
>
>
>
>
> Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
> secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
>
> Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
> http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434
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>
>
>
>
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives/collective consc.
Date: November 19, 2004 at 5:47:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Interesting info.  I also know and have conservative friends and family.  I usually don’t do politics as a rule, however, avoid it completely with certain people.  I am interested if you can give me info where to learn more on the whole collective consciousness  for healing.  It sounds exactly like something I would tap into.  I had lunch yesterday with a mutual aquaintance.  My brother is also your local southernmost holyman!  Any info would be appreciated.       Martee
—- Original Message —– From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 11:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives

I found this study at
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/07/22_politics.shtml

very interesting:
Four researchers who culled through 50 years of research literature about
the psychology of conservatism report that at the core of political
conservatism is the resistance to change and a tolerance for inequality, and
that some of the common psychological factors linked to political
conservatism include:

a.. Fear and aggression

b.. Dogmatism and intolerance of ambiguity

c.. Uncertainty avoidance

d.. Need for cognitive closure

e.. Terror management
They really have a different view of the world. Most of the people that we
reconize as great contribuitors to our history and planet, from Lao-tse,
Buddha, Socrate,  Jesus, Leonardo da Vinci ,Edison, Einstein. You name it,
where not consevative. I think conservatives are from a different planet
:-). I have a very good friend who are conservatives, but I avoid many
subjects with them. They will never change, it’s behond my understanding. I
think behind their lack of compassion and comprehension, most of the time
you will find fears.
Faith :It’s like anger, check inside your anger and you will probably find
a secret fear within .
francis

—– Original Message —– From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state

Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost so many lives.
To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to be done with
occupation,
After all war is not an answer when money talks.
I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many more who will  have part
of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has no weapon in his hand
to
fight evil.
Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself talk on the TV.
Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
At least he has a hands he can shake with, some people don’t and they are
only 20 years old kids.

Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it doesn’t look like it
on
TV.

If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war. He would be a friend
with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand that working together
Is better then killing each other.

It is just shame that people want to save a life of an addict with
Ibogaine
treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a silly war game of some
rich
people.
And those rich people will get their ways anyways as they are corrupted by
power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.

It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants to be at war time.

The enemy is in your head. People always can be friends, just like they
did
before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God, then God he should pray
to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are lost thanks to his
policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more of his and other
citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted
form

the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats okay I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found
this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

>From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
>Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600
>
>i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain
>understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the
day
>ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out
of

>here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
>concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.
>what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley
about

>computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i >figure
>with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.
>thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but
>don’t know how, ron
>   —– Original Message —–
>   From: m.finman
>   To: ibo
>   Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
>   Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
>
>
>   I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in
>the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool >for
>onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I
>would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the >ability
>to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
>        After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory
>experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams,
>feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced
twice
>the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5
years
>worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well >as
>the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I
>needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never
>ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had
>one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
>something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all
>fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when
you’ve
>done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It
was
>NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I
had

>in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled
>too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana
high.

>I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12
>years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican
>restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. >and
>it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I
liked

>it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing
the

>combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
>experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of
>what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for
right
>now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
>         So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their
>dream state.
>   I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we
>hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to
no
>meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we
can
>understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those
>books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their
>own perceptions.
>        Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain
that’s
>different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any
>technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
>                 In advance I thank you,                Martee
>     Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll > let
>you know.

_________________________________________________________________
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee/ Julie
Date: November 19, 2004 at 5:15:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,
I always thought email addresses were attatched to the post. Some of mine seem to come up that way sometimes.  Anyway I’m mafinman@optonline.net
After being confined to the house for 4 days over the weekend, I was just finally out carousing or at work.  I didn’t work today but felt it necessary to spend the afternoon sleeping.    I’m still slightly under the weather and don’t want to be down for the count for thanksgiving.
You’re sounding very chipper and positive these days. It’s very refreshing.
I would welcome an email from you anytime.
All the best,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 6:14 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee

I accidentally erased all my messages, and I didn’t get the chance to reply to your post.  Please send me your email address, and I’ll drop you a line…

Julie
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: herbs
Date: November 19, 2004 at 5:13:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie,

I will give them a try.  I am on Lortab and do H off and on, about 3 times per week and 8 Lortab per day.  I haven’t been on methadone in 15 years.  I would die before going on it.  Like you when I get down to 20 mg per day I can not get off.  Everytime I used it I had to use H to get off of it.

I was surprised to see that you had it in your urine almost 4 weeks later.  I guess working with a private doc was much better than the methadone clinic.  I really don’t think the methadone clinic wants you to get off.  Here in the states they get paid for it.  I will never forget the time I saw a girl crying because they were cutting her off because she did not have money to pay her bill.  She was pleading, just give me one more week, PLEASE.  They gave her two take homes and out the door she went.  If I had the money I would of paid for one week, it really hurt me to see that.

Also, if you smoke a joint they call that a dirty urine and take away your take home priviliges and you must go every day.  That can be rough if your without a car in the winter time.  The methadone clinics in the US are very bad.  They treat you like scum.

I am glad you got free and hope you can stay that way.

Keep in touch,

– JIM
Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:
Jim,

Yes, St. Johns Wart has been used for depression.
Kava Kava seems to be useful for anxiety. There have
been mixed reviews and opinions about the
effectiveness of both, but don’t let that deter you.
Give them a try, and see if they work for you.

Valerian root tincture put me to sleep within 25-40
minutes of using 8-10 drops in water. You can also
use it sublingually. Melatonin was suggested to me by
a very kind person on this forum, and I found it
useful too…

BTW, how are you feeling these days? Are you off
methadone completely?

Cheers,
Julie

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] the intoxication instinct
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:46:34 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v04/n1636/a11.html?999

UK: The Intoxication Instinct
URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v04/n1636/a11.html
Newshawk: End Marijuana Prohibition: www.mpp.org
Votes: 0
Pubdate: Sat, 13 Nov 2004
Source: New Scientist (UK)
Copyright: New Scientist, RBI Limited 2004
Contact: letters@newscientist.com
Website: http://www.newscientist.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/294
Author: Helen Phillips, Graham Lawton

THE INTOXICATION INSTINCT

From alcohol and cannabis to cocaine and LSD, it seems there are no limits to our appetite for mind-altering substances.  What is it about human nature that drives us to get out of our heads, ask Helen Phillips and Graham Lawton

Smoke Shack, a “head shop” in Nelson, British Columbia, the air is thick with marijuana and the atmosphere is mellow as the staff stage a demo of their dope-related paraphernalia.  The clients range from tourists and business types to the dreadlocked and dishevelled.  All walks of life are welcome.

Over the border in the US, the police call to the man in the car for the last time.  If he doesn’t step out they will shoot.

He stays put – maybe because he’s embarrassed about being caught naked from the waist down, clearly aroused.  Or maybe he’s just too high on methamphetamine to care.

High up in the mountains of Peru the men brew coca leaves into a tea.  While they don’t approve of the habit of snorting the powdered extract, the tea gives them a mild buzz that helps fight the headaches and nausea of altitude sickness.

Up here, cocaine is part of life.

Lounging in a restaurant, two old friends share a second bottle of wine, sinking lower in their seats as they enjoy the numbing haze and warmth it creates.  Later they’ll order brandy.

The bartender pours himself a cup of coffee.

It’s going to be a long shift.

As diverse as these episodes are, there is a clear common thread running through them: the pursuit of intoxication.  Since prehistoric times, humans have been seeking out and using intoxicating substances.  Most people who have ever lived have experienced a chemically induced altered state of consciousness, and the same is true of people alive today.  That’s not to say that everybody is constantly fighting the urge to get high, nor that intoxication is somehow a normal state of consciousness.  But how many of us can claim never to have experienced an altered state, whether it be a caffeine kick to help us get going in the morning, a relaxing beer after work, a few puffs on a joint at a party or the euphoric high of ecstasy?

In the present prohibitionist climate it is difficult to talk about the use of psychoactive, literally “mind-altering”, substances without focusing on their harmful and habit-forming properties.  And it’s true that excessive use of consciousness-altering drugs, both legal and illegal, is bad for individuals and bad for society.

People who seek intoxication are taking risks with their health and flirting with addiction.

Drugs can lead to crime, violence, accidents, family disintegration and social decay.

Nonetheless, intoxicants remain a part of most people’s lives .  And indeed most of us are able to consume them in moderation without spiralling into abuse and addiction.

Take alcohol, for example.

Its potent psychoactive properties and potential for wreaking havoc are well known, yet the majority of people still drink and enjoy it without becoming alcoholics.  There’s also ample evidence that, despite public health campaigns and the threat of severe penalties, millions of people every year join the legions who have experimented with illegal substances, from cannabis and cocaine to ecstasy, amphetamines and LSD ( for a guide to the most commonly used psychoactive drugs, ).

It seems that intoxication in one form or another is universal, a part of who we are.  “It’s a natural part of consciousness to change one’s consciousness,” argues Rick Doblin, who runs the not-for-profit Multidisciplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies in Sarasota, Florida. But why is it that we choose to alter our state of consciousness by dosing our brains with chemicals?

The answer is straightforward.  We seek intoxication for a simple reason that we are almost too scared to admit – we like it.  Intoxication can be fun, sociable, memorable, therapeutic, even mind-expanding.  Saying as much in the present climate is not easy, but an increasing number of researchers now argue that unless we’re prepared to look beyond the “drug problem” and acknowledge the positive aspects of intoxication, we are only seeing half the story – like researching sex while pretending it isn’t fun.

full understanding of intoxication, and the quest to achieve it, could have numerous pay-offs.  For one thing there is the prospect of better ways to tackle abuse and addiction.

There are also good reasons for studying intoxication as a phenomenon in its own right.

What is it about psychoactive substances that we like? What do they tell us about who we are? Is there a way to get the good without the bad? Some researchers believe that such enquiries will lead to a new understanding of the human mind, including the mysteries of consciousness , or new treatments for mental illness.

Others go as far as to argue that it is time for society to accept that intoxication is an inextricable part of human nature, and find a way to let us explore it openly.
snip-

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: slowone: delayed response
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:41:24 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for this post Martee.  I seem to be having a real problem with anger
at the moment which isn’t normal for me-everything gets me stressed and I
end up feeling like I want to smash the room up or attack someone
physically.  I’ve been really horrible to my close friends (everyone else
I’ve stayed away from) and I’m really lucky that they’ve been understanding
about it.  I just feel like I’m gonna explode over the silliest things!
You’re post really helped-I’ve got to step back and look at it
rationally-what I can and cannot control.  Keep posting.  I particularly
liked the difference between being assertive and being aggressive.  My ‘life
coach’ is getting me to do visualisation which I used to find easy but for
some reason is really difficult for me right now.  “Think of a time you were
feeling self-confident”  I just can’t seem to find a time when I felt like
that!  I need to spend less time raging over things I have no control over
and more time cultivating ‘inner peace’ if you know what I mean.  Thanks
anyway,
love Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 2:02 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: slowone: delayed response

I was trying to clear out my inbox and reread this quite a few times.  I
believe the goal is to not hold on to any negative emotion.  That is what
causes illness in the body.  An alternative to anger as you see it I
believe
would be to have an understanding of the difference between being
aggressive
and being assertive.  Being assertive comes from a place of strength,
empowerment,confidence and control.  Being aggressive comes from a wounded
ego based place. Getting caught up in aanger and rage is actually a form
of
being manipulated and giving your power away.  Much in the same way that
when a person looking for a fight eggs someone else into one, even though
the challenged person thinks they are exhibiting strength they are being
controlled and manipulated by the bully.  I am not saying the emotions you
feel are  not to be ignored, just put into a more healthy context.
There are 2 things one should never get angry or stressed with.  One
is
things you can actually do something about.  The other is things you have
no
control over.  The last time I raged at something(which was my first day
back to work after ibogaine and 1 month off) it took all of 2 seconds
before
I stopped and realized I was more upset at myself for raging than I was at
what I was raging about.  I remedied the situation later that day by
telling
the responsible party that i had something to tell them, I wasn’t going to
bring it up again or repeat myself and I didn’t want a response just then
but that I definitly expected the situation resolved.  It worked. No hard
feelings anywhere. and I came out ahead situation wise all the way around.
One of your observations, which is a big part of not raging is what
you
said about attacking the behavior and not the person.  You call someone a
fucking idiot and no matter what once the situation has been resolved
there’s reasons for bad feelings.  This is the same criticizing behavior
that perpetuates wounds and I can’t help but think in some instances it’s
a
tape playing in ones head of possibly how they were dealt with.  Learned
behavior.  Speaking on the behavior exhibited comes from a whole different
place.  It comes more from a place of strength . I had this exact same
conversation with one of my clients who is getting a divorce.  She told me
she called him a stupid fucking idiot because of stuff he was doing way
out
of character.  I told her that to not tear him down furthur than he
already
is ,as after their 11 years there must still be concern for his well being
and to remember he is the father of her daughter she needed to have more
tact and just comment on the behavior.  She later told me this was a hugh
help to her.
Choosing your battles is a good one.  Once you are able to get at the
source of things it will be a lot easier just to let things go.  I have
experienced personally with guilt and i’m sure it’s the same with anger,
people can’t make you anything , YOU have to personally own it.
I’ll tell you honestly, I was doing victim /abuse workshops for 10
years . It took a full year or more before I really got some of the stuff
I
was talking about.  It’s like you can understand something intellectually
and take a while for the clarity to set in. A lot of the stuff I’ve done
may
have been for others but it was just as much for my own healing.   I’m
just
passing on a little insight that did wonders for me.  Believe me there are
still times when my immediate unvocalized reaction comes from that
“street”
place in me.  It’s just less frequently these days.  We are human
afterall.
With respect and
sincerity,

Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list

More on the apparent ability of P. harmala extract to lessen the
stress of iboga on the gut, which oddly no one responded to. If you
take such an extract (w/out iboga) and then make an effort to yak
it up an hour or so later, you’ll notice that there is no acidity
in what comes up.

Anger is a tough one for me, still learning how to be with it.

A thought after sleeping on it – the goal seems to be to be able to
hold anger without burying it, choosing to display it when it can
help you achieve your goal. A therapist friend described properly-
used anger as a sword that you whip out and bring to the other
person’s throat, and just knowing you have it at your side makes
for a different posture in the world. Maybe holding anger without
expressing it in the situation requires expressing it somewhere
else to someone who is equipped to hear it and understand.

One big subtlety I’ve noticed is that one can say “I’m angry about .
.” and this is a whole different conversation from “You fucking
idiot …” which is what I’d feel like saying and then shut down
because of inability to be impolite.

The other day someone said I just need to develop my adult self,
and when this is done my wounded child will feel safe enough to
come out and heal. This reminds me of something Nick wrote a while
ago:

Generally it’s my opinion that the ego needs multiple “staging
posts” on it’s long journey toward true self-recognition. Even
though ultimately it’s merely a journey from here to here this
doesn’t seem to lessen the impact of the experience.

In this context the ego would be the parental self. So just acting
as mature as possible, understanding that the reason is to build
oneself up rather than conform, choosing the right battles, biding
one’s time as necessary, could be a program 🙂

I’m also reminded of this from ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com:

I don’t believe we have to polish our egos to the point of
getting
an “A”. I think a C+ will do. The universe is not so fucking
relentless as to require any sembance of perfection. A C+ will do

and then “we” can get out of the way.
Relax at that point and the separate sense will automatically
burn.

By the way, I’m angry about the US election results. Probably that
is already obvious 🙂

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron Jim to Ron
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:24:43 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Ron,

I don’t know how you would feel about this but you may want to give it a try.  Go to a doc and tell him that you had two seziures and want to know what the hell to do.  When he ask if you taking any drugs tell him yea Xanax.  Let him tell you that might be causeing the seziures and maybe he may taper you off.  Docs are all different, you may run into a good one who cares and will taper you off.  If you have insurance go doctor shopping sooner or later you will find one who cares.  Just a suggestion, hope I helped

Best of Luck,

– JIM

knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Try finding Florida’s Complaint form, I have found
that most doctors want to avoid the paperwork.
Conversation goes like this:
doc, I’d like to taper off my xanexanexSorry can’t do
that.

I’m not a doctor but can’t you like have seizers and
stuff if not tapered off?
*Yes. but you are asking for a controlled substance.

Hypothetically speaking, is their a complaint process
because no offense but your dicidecisionms
inhuinhumaned where do I go for this process.
*(the doc I saw said): DEA DEAl-lolck mate)

So your telling me that thietheir’t a state agency
that overoversee’s prescription writing practices of
doctors?
*well uhh.uhh
etc…
——
If that doesn’t work, some craccrackheadkie could find
some for you. BenzBenzo’s a bitch to kick mahnmahn
hope you can find a way to taper. I don’t think you
have to suffer unless you feel you have to. Good
luck.

— Ron Davis wrote:
> as an aside, no help from any local
addiaddictionologistfor benzbenzosd’smd’sten 25
seconds, then set up a
> treatment protocol. they follow the book.
i’mi’mscrewed on the benzbenzoser. must suffer,
we’ewe’er
> people you know. i’vei’veen them the lancet,
> ashtashtonu name it, it’s thiethierway or the
> highway. ronron>
>

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: herbs
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:01:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jim,

Yes, St. Johns Wart has been used for depression.
Kava Kava seems to be useful for anxiety.  There have
been mixed reviews and opinions about the
effectiveness of both, but don’t let that deter you.
Give them a try, and see if they work for you.

Valerian root tincture put me to sleep within 25-40
minutes of using 8-10 drops in water.  You can also
use it sublingually.  Melatonin was suggested to me by
a very kind person on this forum, and I found it
useful too…

BTW, how are you feeling these days?  Are you off
methadone completely?

Cheers,
Julie

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Do they sell Ibo in Canada in the health food stores
Date: November 19, 2004 at 2:55:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI Julie,

Could you tell me if they sell Ibo in health food stores in Canada.  I know it is legal there but where would one go to get it.  I live in Detroit and would have no trouble going to Windsor to get it.  If I went to Canada where would I look to find it?  If you could point me in the right direction it would be appreciated.  If I am not mistaken you said it took awhile before you started feeling better, like you had minor w/d symptoms, is that right?

Also, is there much difference between the HCL and extract.  Does one work better than the other or do they both make ya sick and lose your lunch?

I am so glad you made it.  As far as Faith goes, I think she is a couple of can short of a six pack.  She does not contribute anything or say anything intelligent and really don’t make any kind on sense.  I really think she likes to argue.  I mean there are many places on the great big web where she would fit in.  In a way I think it is kind of funny.

Like I said on the forum, I am glad you got rid of the liquid handcuffs.  Me, I am afraid I will need another treatment with a booster about 5 days later.  When I took the Ibo my back pain was gone for 5 days, then it got cold and rainy and I could no longer stand the pain and had to take the lortabs.  A word of warning Lortabs are VERY addicting as in Tylenol #4 with codeine.  I have been on them since a work accident in the mid 70’s and am now on complete disability.  If you know of a place in Canada that sells Ibo please pass it on since I have a P.O. Box in Windsor.  It is at a Mail Box Ect and the person may think he is sending to a house or business.  But it will close soon since it is costing me $62 per quarter year.

Thanks in advance for any help you can point me to.

Sincerely,

– JIM

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 19, 2004 at 2:22:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie,

Thanks for the help in sleep herbs.  Since you seem knowledgeable about herbs is it St. Johns Wart that people take for depression?

As far as Faith saying they were giving out free drugs for those who voted democrat, do you believe that one person on this forum believes that.  Hell, I voted democrat if I write to them do you think they will still send them to me – LOL.

I understand your point of view, why would a minority person go to a KKK meeting?  I am sure there are many republican places or places like The Savage Nation, Pat Robinson,  or Rush Lumbar that would be more in line with her points of view.  I guess sometimes people think their point of view is the right one and everyone else is wrong.  If everybody else is wrong don’t tell them for they will not believe you.  Sometimes people like to go to places where they know their opinion is not welcome and start shit and get people mad and pissed off just like you say.  They don’t debate or offer facts they just start shit.  Some people like rock stars, some football or baseball players and I guess some politicians.  Yep, it is a strange world.

Thank you for the information and thanks for not taking my comments the wrong way.  You seemed to help a lot of people on this forum and I for one am glad your here.  I am also glad you got rid of your liquid handcuffs.  I hope you can stay clean and enjoy what is left of your life.  After all we are only on this planet for a short time.

Best to ya Julie, please take care,

– JIM
Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:
Jim,

My problem with Faith is that she contributes nothing
but dissent and tension to this list. Everyone is
entitled to their own opinion, but honestly, I can’t
imagine why someone who held views so contrary to a
group they belonged to would choose to remain in that
group. It’s not like she is going to make friends or
identify with a community. You would never catch me
spouting my left-wing, socialist propaganda on a
Republican or capitalist forum- that is, unless my
intention was just to inflame and piss people off.

Have you read some of the things she has posted? She
said the Democrats were giving drugs to people in
order to enlist their vote. It would be laughable if
it wasn’t so sad. She also bashed the ACLU, which,
the last time I checked, had the best interests of
their fellow man in mind.

She doesn’t talk about Ibogaine; she doesn’t post her
own ORIGINAL topics; she simply flames and trolls a
list dedicated to helping people, harm reduction, and
alternate lifestyles.

She needs to learn to pick battles that are actually
achievable…

Julie

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep
Date: November 19, 2004 at 1:34:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

try Valerian root tincture also

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep
Date: November 19, 2004 at 1:33:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jim,

Try melatonin, or passionflower tincture.

Julie

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jim, re: Faith’s opinions
Date: November 19, 2004 at 1:32:01 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jim,

My problem with Faith is that she contributes nothing
but dissent and tension to this list.  Everyone is
entitled to their own opinion, but honestly, I can’t
imagine why someone who held views so contrary to a
group they belonged to would choose to remain in that
group.  It’s not like she is going to make friends or
identify with a community.  You would never catch me
spouting my left-wing, socialist propaganda on a
Republican or capitalist forum- that is, unless my
intention was just to inflame and piss people off.

Have you read some of the things she has posted?  She
said the Democrats were giving drugs to people in
order to enlist their vote.  It would be laughable if
it wasn’t so sad.  She also bashed the ACLU, which,
the last time I checked, had the best interests of
their fellow man in mind.

She doesn’t talk about Ibogaine; she doesn’t post her
own ORIGINAL topics; she simply flames and trolls a
list dedicated to helping people, harm reduction, and
alternate lifestyles.

She needs to learn to pick battles that are actually
achievable…

Julie

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jim to Randy – What did you take to help you sleep
Date: November 19, 2004 at 1:14:47 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

Could you give me the name of the stuff that you took that finally let you get some sleep.
I believe you got if from a health food store.

Thanks in advance,

– JIM

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
I know for me I had no cravings for cigs after Ibogaine, I think I could have walked away from them too. Maybe I didn’t wait long enough to see if I would withdrawal from cigs too. I started smoking again to have something to do with the 21 hours I was up every day for a while. I wish I hadn’t now. I’ll quit cigs when I go see Sara.      Randy
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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military
Date: November 19, 2004 at 1:07:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston,

Police said he was selling pot, can they prove it?  If not possession is just a misdemeanor.  Remember, they ruled the shooting was justified.  Why don’t they put robbers and murderers in the military, you know someone with more experience.  I remember thay used to do that back in the 60s and send them to Vietnam.  Damn, for weed wouldn’t a fine be punishment enough, maybe even probation.  Would you by any chance know what state this happened in.  In some states, unless they changed the law, possession of a one joint was a felony.  Guess they will have to keep building new jails and wasting the taxpayers money.  I believe you know that America, home of the free, puts more of it citizens in jail than any other country including Russia and China and the Axis of Evil.  I can’t help but feel that there is something wrong here, maybe it is just me.

Hey, isn’t that cruel and unusual punishment?

Best to everyone,

– JIM

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
there’s no such thing as a draft in this country remember.
What in the world this judge is thinking- telling this pot smoker he must
now go serve in jail, where the threat of rape is very real, or to go kill
other people, all due to his smoking pot and defending his home- is beyond
me, other than for the fact it’s sheer evil what he’s doing.

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Bill Weinberg”
To:
Cc: ; ;
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:25 AM
Subject: Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military

> Sure wish I was still doing Highwire…
>
>>–
>>Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military
>>http://www.kron.com/Global/story.asp?S=2579902
>>Email to a Friend
>> Printer Friendly Version
>>
>>
>>
>>Posted: November 17, 2004 at 12:38 p.m.
>>
>> SALINAS, Calif. (AP) — A Salinas man will have to choose between
>>going to jail or joining the military as his punishment for
>>possession of marijuana.
>>
>> A judge surprised both the prosecution and defense yesterday when he
>>told Brian Barr that he could avoid a jail term by enlisting in the
>>military.
>>
>> The 24-year-old Barr was charged with marijuana possession after
>>shooting a would-be robber who had entered his apartment with two
>>others.
>>
>> Police say Barr sold marijuana from his home, and that the three men
>>were searching for money and marijuana.
>>
>> In giving Barr a choice of sentence, Monterey County Judge Robert
>>Moody said that the shooting was justified.
>>
>> Barr is scheduled to return to court next month.
>>
>> (Copyright 2004 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>*************************************************************
>>http://worldwar3report.com/
>>Vigilant, Independent Sentry of Truth in the War on Terrorism
>>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> *************************************************************
> http://www.worldwar3report.com/
> Vigilant, Independent Sentry of Truth in the War on Terrorism
>
>

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] R Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:55:47 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

To Faith
Check this one , maybee you will understand  ( as a christian ) why this war
had to stop now.

http://www.zeitun-eg.org/assiut.htm

God bless

Francis

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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:51:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, for the recore, I’m a book reader–very little TV–but do like to watch forensic science.  But, getting to you, I think Eric Taub in your state (Fl) is who you need to speak to.  His site is Ibeginagian.  The Ibogaine is not something you would get addicted to, or want to.  As I understand, you take it once, then again in about 6 months if needed, and then another 6 months later.  I think it would be worth trying.  You sound like you’re ready to get clean.  Faith

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: Fri, 19 Nov 2004 11:26:22 -0600

SHE HAS AGOOD HEART, JUST TOO MUCH TV AND NOT ENOUGH BOOKS.  ALAN GINSBURG, FOR THOSE OF YOU OLD ENOUGH TO REMEMBER THE BEAT GENERATION ONCE SAID” HIP MEANS TOLERANCE”…EVERYBODY HIP?  OR TRAGICALLY COOL? CAN’T BE BOTH. RON
—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 11:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

I personally think that Faith is either a computer  program (no sense of humor, no deviation even within the mindset, ) or a “plant.”   Even though I know people like that do exist.    Just a fleeting observation.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 8:34 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

>What are you talking about Faith?<

– I think we’re all wondering that same thing,
Preston…

I mean, Faith, what are you contributing here on the
ibogaine list at all
beside rancor, unease, and dissension? Are you
intentionally going out of
your way to prove my own views of Republican-minded
types?

– hear hear….

__________________________________
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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:47:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie,

As far as Faith goes she has the right to her opinion.  Unless it is connected to using or stopping drugs or maybe mind control stuff I can’t see why it should be discussed on this forum.  Please do not take this as disrespect for I do not mean it to be.  In all reality there is really no difference between the Rep or Dem.  As one guy put it: “They are all on the same buss, going to the same place, to do the same thing.  The only difference is they sit in different seats.  It really does not matter if a candidate is a Rep or Dem, before they are in office they are owned by the oil companies or special interest groups or this pac or that pac.  They are bought and paid for many times over.

Yes, they all give lip service to what their gonna do, then they do what they are told by the NWO people.  You can not win an election without millions of dollars for those TV ads where they knock their opponent in 3 or 4 sentences that are half-truthes, lies, twisted facts etc.  When someone comes over here from Cuba or Russia or some other country they vote for the person they think will do the best job.  We Americans vote for who is the less likely to screw up.  A reporter was talking to Kerry and asked him if he would of went into Iraq and he said yes.  I respected Kerry for his stance against Vietnam.  After all what did Vietnam do to us?  They did not commit an act of terrorism, their land is of little value and it is a very poor country.  Why spend millions of dollars and drop napalm on them or shoot them?  What we need is a president who minds his own business and looks out for America by keeping them out of harms way.  The best way to protect our country is to put troops at our borders not half way around the world.  After all what country would invade America?  It would be like invading Russia in the winter time, a bad idea as Napolian and Hitler found out.

All during the cold war war Russia and the US were at each other throats, one push of the button away from total destruction as we know it, why?  I don’t hate people from Russia and since they don’t know most of us I doubt if the average Russian hated us.  There have been several close calls and computer errors that showed we were being attacked and vice versa.  It never made it’s way into the main stream media.  Twenty-five years after the Cuban Missile Crises they had people from both sides tell what was happening and how close we were to a full scale nuclear war.  As another man said the world will not end with a bang but with a whimper.

Man has been killing man and having wars since the begining of time, it sometimes makes me depressed to think about it.  When is it going to stop?  Just my opinion and like I said before I mean no disrespect, there is enough hate in the world.

Best to ya,

– JIM
Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:
>What are you talking about Faith?<

– I think we’re all wondering that same thing,
Preston…

> I mean, Faith, what are you contributing here on the
> ibogaine list at all
> beside rancor, unease, and dissension? Are you
> intentionally going out of
> your way to prove my own views of Republican-minded
> types?

– hear hear….

__________________________________
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:26:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

SHE HAS AGOOD HEART, JUST TOO MUCH TV AND NOT ENOUGH BOOKS.  ALAN GINSBURG, FOR THOSE OF YOU OLD ENOUGH TO REMEMBER THE BEAT GENERATION ONCE SAID” HIP MEANS TOLERANCE”…EVERYBODY HIP?  OR TRAGICALLY COOL? CAN’T BE BOTH. RON
—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 11:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

I personally think that Faith is either a computer  program (no sense of humor, no deviation even within the mindset, ) or a “plant.”   Even though I know people like that do exist.    Just a fleeting observation.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 8:34 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

>What are you talking about Faith?<

– I think we’re all wondering that same thing,
Preston…

I mean, Faith, what are you contributing here on the
ibogaine list at all
beside rancor, unease, and dissension? Are you
intentionally going out of
your way to prove my own views of Republican-minded
types?

– hear hear….

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Jason is sleeping
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:23:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara,
Good move with the kava kava and passionflower.  It makes me feel that things can be right with the world when I hear some know how to problem solve and function without pharmaceutical drugs.  Please give my best to Jason.
Sending him a green and violet flame of healing energy.
Much love also,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 7:24 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jason is sleeping

It is only 20 minutes later and Jason is sleeping on the couch, while the music is on.
he had kava kava and passionflower for relaxation.

Sara
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Off topic- Protest rally in Ottawa for George W’s arrival
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:22:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry folks,

I know this is off topic, but I wanted to let any
Canadians( and interested Americans) on the list know
about this….

J.

MASS DEMONSTRATION AGAINST BUSH AND FOR JUSTICE,
FREEDOM AND
EQUALITY
Rallying point
Confederation Park, Ottawa
(Corner of Elgin and Laurier)
12:00pm
Tuesday, November 30

MASS DEMONSTRATION AGAINST WAR
Rallying point
With candles
Parliament Hill
5:00pm
Tuesday, November 30

***************************
Paul Martin announced yesterday that George W. Bush
will be
in Ottawa
for a state visit from November 30 to December
1–just two
weeks
away! This will be Bush’s first international visit
since his

‘re-election’ as president two weeks ago (only 28%
of
voting-age
Americans voted for Bush while 98 million Americans
didn’t
vote at
all).

Activists from across the country will be descending
on
Ottawa to
give Bush the welcome he deserves. The Toronto
Coalition to
Stop the
War is organising buses to send activists from
Toronto to
Ottawa to
participate in the mass actions against the Bush
agenda.
Details of
the demonstrations in Ottawa are listed below, in
the
call-out from
the “No to Bush” committee in Ottawa.

For more information or to book a seat on one of our
buses,
please contact us:
E-mail: stopthewar@sympatico.ca
Phone: 416-795-5863

Because this will be Bush’s first trip outside the
U.S. since
his
election, it will be important for us to build the
biggest
possible
mobilisation to show our opposition in Canada. We
want to
send a
message of support to the people of Iraq and all
oppressed
people
around the world: we stand in solidarity with you.
And to our
sisters
and brothers in the American anti-war movement: the
world
still says
no to the Bush agenda.

To that end, the Toronto Coalition to Stop the War
is calling
an
emergency general meeting for next Monday where all
those
interested
in going to Ottawa can discuss how we’re building
our
mobilisation.
The details of the meeting are as follows:

Emergency General Meeting
Monday, November 22
7:00pm
Metro Hall
55 John Street
Room number to be posted in lobby

Information about buses–time and date of departure
and
return,
pick-up and drop-off locations, ticket costs,
etc.–will be
ready
within a day or so. As soon as our bookings are
confirmed,
all
information will be circulated on this list and
posted on our

website: www.nowar.ca.

Don’t wait to book your seats! Let us know you’re
interested
now!

Toronto Coalition to Stop the War

www.nowar.ca  stopthewar@sympatico.ca  416-795-5863

__________________________________
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Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:18:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee!!

I’ve been trying to get a hold of you…Did you get
the email I sent?  I think there was some kind of lag
on the forum, but it seems to be better now…

Let’s talk more…

J.

__________________________________
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Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:07:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I personally think that Faith is either a computer  program (no sense of humor, no deviation even within the mindset, ) or a “plant.”   Even though I know people like that do exist.    Just a fleeting observation.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 8:34 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

>What are you talking about Faith?<

– I think we’re all wondering that same thing,
Preston…

I mean, Faith, what are you contributing here on the
ibogaine list at all
beside rancor, unease, and dissension? Are you
intentionally going out of
your way to prove my own views of Republican-minded
types?

– hear hear….

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:04:18 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

addiction is the psychological need to controll the drug ingested once ingested and the inablity to do so.  it can occur at the time or weeks later, e.g. binge drinkers
dependance refers to withdrawals as i read the literature.  but i’m on my way out so disregard all this.  we have rights, but with those come duties. we live in herds and are obligated to contribute to the herd, i.e. give it our best game. if ones recreational habits keep her from giving us her best game , she has neglected her duty which is concurrent w/ her rights. americans tend to think that way, it’s my right, but they never talk about the duty that goes with it.  rwd,, burning out quickly, been a pd too long, 20 yrs, heard all the stories, excuses , blame game, etc.  been a junkie using those same stories. now i’m just screwed and listen to those that know much more than me as a result of the forum..hope i didn’t start a topic and break protocol, but you guys can relax, i’ve been kicked out of nicer places.  peace to all—– Original Message —– From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:33 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

“What is happening is that the government is using a
condition they created out of thin air, non-existent,
called “addiction”, to justify its fascistic
prohibitionist actions to the world in an attempt to
demonize and stigmatise cannabis consumers.  Ask your
neighborhood fascist what the “symptoms” of addiction
are.  He either won’t be able to tell you, or he’ll
tell you some nonesense which is a blow by blow
repetition of prohibitionist propaganda statements
found on their advertising.  This is to scare ignorant
non-consumers of cannabis into supporting the
fascistic and illegal crushing of democratic rights of
cannabis consumers.
You know damned well that not using cannabis has
no “withdrawal” symptoms.  Its no different from
stopping the consumption of ice cream, or broccoli, or
any other food, except you are not getting a buzz,
which people who DO know about cannabis know full well
is just harmless fun, and hurts nobody.
So stop playing the innocent.  Those folks you
complain about are trying to murder and torture you
for purposes that have absolutely nothing to do with
your health, safety, welfare, or anyone else’s.  Quit
playing their game, and get on with the reality of
cannabis consumption and the law.  We are all being
preyed on by evil fascist murderers, and we need to
start defending ourselves.”

From my friend…

Greetings crookedeye,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 4:46
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Thanks for the suggestion, but being a fond lover of smoking herb with or
without cigarettes, and having actually tried that before to no avail, I’m
afraid that ain’t gonna cut it either.
I’ve also tried substuting clove cigs for tobacco, but that really, really
didn’t cut it either.
It’s been quite some time I’ve been discussing this here, and it sounds the
same as always, like I’m a weak ass git who can’t find self-control.
Sorry, I’m feeling a bit off-balance and angry at myself for this and
that reason. I can’t seem to find it in myself to open up much about it
(having tried a number of time to do so here but ending up deleting the
message before hitting send), finding myself embarrassed and hateful and
sad, but this is about as far as I feel like taking it publicly. Suffice it
to say, I’m going to take ibogaine again at some point, as I believe I’ve
recently noted, but wonder- will this, as with every other freakin’ fucking
“treatment” I’ve ever tried turn into one of these stupid, “oh well, nuther
failed effort” things? Am I weak? Or am I simply supposed to be taking my
drugs in the most effective manner possible and should just tell the rest of

the world to fuck the hell off? I mean, I seem to be doing fairly well for
the most part, other than for this irritating, complicating love of drug
effects, foreign molecules, and other socially unacceptable things and
behaviors. And even with those I’m doing fairly well, besides having to deal

with the complications of trying to do my substances in the way I find most
effective without feeling too guilty and fucked up about it- and worst of
all, finding myself hiding it from the people I care most about in the
entire world because, well, most of you (with some possible exceptions who
will remain unnamed by me for now) understand what I’m talking about and
where I’m coming from.
Anyway, love to you all.
(How can life suck so bad at the same time things are going so fucking
well?)

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some ganja
instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive,
physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke.
Maybe herb could help…

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clarification
Date: November 19, 2004 at 11:53:16 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i d/n give a rat’s ass about the topic anymore, just trying to live.  maybe i can assist you when atf kicks your door in and it’s randy against the US govt.  make sure your paperwork’s in order, cuz it’s gonna hurt.fed law has some little known stingers that make people who think they are legal with guns illegal.  friends again.  pick your topic, especially if you can help me get well.
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 10:20 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clarification

that’s my man, email #5
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 3:22 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clarification

Ask Patrick. Better yet, read what it says on the Homepage and pay attention. You want to control the topic? get a fucking therapist, I did.          Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 18 Nov 2004 19:27:04 -0000 Issue 780
Date: November 19, 2004 at 11:45:38 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

perhaps i’m not destined to read the digest.
—– Original Message —– From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 10:53 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 18 Nov 2004 19:27:04 -0000 Issue 780

still looks the same to me, blank, ron
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:27 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 18 Nov 2004 19:27:04 -0000 Issue 780

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military
Date: November 19, 2004 at 11:42:12 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i did a yr. in 70 for possession of less than 5grams and was glad to get it. they gave people in w’s home state life back then. ron  suppose i could’ve gone to nam and been point man for a day in a platoon of draftees.  life expectancy low.
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 8:03 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military

there’s no such thing as a draft in this country remember.
What in the world this judge is thinking- telling this pot smoker he must now go serve in jail, where the threat of rape is very real, or to go kill other people, all due to his smoking pot and defending his home- is beyond me, other than for the fact it’s sheer evil what he’s doing.

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Bill Weinberg” <billw@echonyc.com>
To: <bloom@hightimes.com>
Cc: <peterg9@yahoo.com>; <wishnia@rcn.com>; <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:25 AM
Subject: Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military

Sure wish I was still doing Highwire…


Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military
http://www.kron.com/Global/story.asp?S=2579902
Email to a Friend
Printer Friendly Version

Posted: November 17, 2004 at 12:38 p.m.

SALINAS, Calif. (AP) — A Salinas man will have to choose between
going to jail or joining the military as his punishment for
possession of marijuana.

A judge surprised both the prosecution and defense yesterday when he
told Brian Barr that he could avoid a jail term by enlisting in the
military.

The 24-year-old Barr was charged with marijuana possession after
shooting a would-be robber who had entered his apartment with two
others.

Police say Barr sold marijuana from his home, and that the three men
were searching for money and marijuana.

In giving Barr a choice of sentence, Monterey County Judge Robert
Moody said that the shooting was justified.

Barr is scheduled to return to court next month.

(Copyright 2004 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.

*************************************************************
http://worldwar3report.com/
Vigilant, Independent Sentry of Truth in the War on Terrorism

*************************************************************
http://www.worldwar3report.com/
Vigilant, Independent Sentry of Truth in the War on Terrorism

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clarification
Date: November 19, 2004 at 11:20:27 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

that’s my man, email #5
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 3:22 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clarification

Ask Patrick. Better yet, read what it says on the Homepage and pay attention. You want to control the topic? get a fucking therapist, I did.          Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 19, 2004 at 11:18:10 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

u r correct, however i am at critical mass, not unlike many others.  holidays, job, and dying father  coupled w/ post hurricane stress and benzo meltdown got me screwed.  i view all you guys as good people, hopefully we’re on the same map,  i can’t wait to read the rest of the 45 emails  i’ve yet to open.  shooting straight, it’s hard to lighten up  with this benzo crap, run it thru the forum, see if there is any one who has truly kicked a 2 1/2 yr. xanex habit at ultra high dosages.  it ain’t the same randy, been thru all of them.  ibo won’t do it…i’ve done my home work… i’m fucked for months if i get out in one piece.   got a 10 ga. that i’ll let you shoot once.  after emt puts your shoulder back together , you can shoot it again.  got a seal buddy that runs from it.—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:08 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states

Ron, I found this site, studied and looked for Ibogaine and found it, set up treament and did it, all with the help of the people here. We talk about all kinds of shit here. I did the same thing you just did by being indigent about treatment and not getting what I want over the list. Carla spanked me for it. I digress from the list topic. Shoot me. HeHe George Bush fucked up the topic by being elected.  Thats how all this got started. No Patrick started it, yea that’s the ticket, it was Patricks fault LOL there’s a link to Glock on the list. I’ll try and refrain though from talking about anything not pertaining to Ibogaine. Speaking of which, ever see the fire from a 458 Winchester magnum at night while on Ibogaine?,,,,, It’s a joke damn it, laugh! Lighten up Beavis.              Randy

From: SLau848@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clarification
Date: November 19, 2004 at 10:46:16 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ho r u im emma not ho u think i am

From: SLau848@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Off-topic- George W appeared on my grilled cheese sandwich!
Date: November 19, 2004 at 10:44:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ho r u im emma im not who u think i am

From: SLau848@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 10:43:27 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

who r u im emma

From: SLau848@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state- for Jasen
Date: November 19, 2004 at 10:42:38 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

im not julie who r u

From: SLau848@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Nuclear Kitties Need Adoption!
Date: November 19, 2004 at 10:40:28 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

im a amimal lover im mad about and i love cats but i have 2 so my grandad wont let me have any more im realy sorry outherwise i would have them

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 9:36:58 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry about that Preston,

“plus is safer and less addictive”.that why…

It is not less addictive but non- addictive.
It is proven not to be addictive.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 15:30
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

I’m not sure who you are responding to Sara, and I think that once again
that language barrier thing has confused the message I wrote.
My described turmoil hasn’t anything to do with my or anyone else’s
cannabis use. My initial problem in this note was with my use and addiction
to cigarettes, then I moved on to my serious, severe current, reoccuring
issue with banging my drugs again, not to be too open about it on a public
list or anything.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 3:33 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

“What is happening is that the government is using a
condition they created out of thin air, non-existent,
called “addiction”, to justify its fascistic
prohibitionist actions to the world in an attempt to
demonize and stigmatise cannabis consumers.  Ask your
neighborhood fascist what the “symptoms” of addiction
are.  He either won’t be able to tell you, or he’ll
tell you some nonesense which is a blow by blow
repetition of prohibitionist propaganda statements
found on their advertising.  This is to scare ignorant
non-consumers of cannabis into supporting the
fascistic and illegal crushing of democratic rights of
cannabis consumers.
You know damned well that not using cannabis has
no “withdrawal” symptoms.  Its no different from
stopping the consumption of ice cream, or broccoli, or
any other food, except you are not getting a buzz,
which people who DO know about cannabis know full well
is just harmless fun, and hurts nobody.
So stop playing the innocent.  Those folks you
complain about are trying to murder and torture you
for purposes that have absolutely nothing to do with
your health, safety, welfare, or anyone else’s.  Quit
playing their game, and get on with the reality of
cannabis consumption and the law.  We are all being
preyed on by evil fascist murderers, and we need to
start defending ourselves.”

From my friend…

Greetings crookedeye,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 4:46
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Thanks for the suggestion, but being a fond lover of smoking herb with or
without cigarettes, and having actually tried that before to no avail, I’m
afraid that ain’t gonna cut it either.
I’ve also tried substuting clove cigs for tobacco, but that really, really
didn’t cut it either.
It’s been quite some time I’ve been discussing this here, and it sounds
the
same as always, like I’m a weak ass git who can’t find self-control.
Sorry, I’m feeling a bit off-balance and angry at myself for this and
that reason. I can’t seem to find it in myself to open up much about it
(having tried a number of time to do so here but ending up deleting the
message before hitting send), finding myself embarrassed and hateful and
sad, but this is about as far as I feel like taking it publicly. Suffice
it
to say, I’m going to take ibogaine again at some point, as I believe I’ve
recently noted, but wonder- will this, as with every other freakin’
fucking
“treatment” I’ve ever tried turn into one of these stupid, “oh well,
nuther
failed effort” things? Am I weak? Or am I simply supposed to be taking my
drugs in the most effective manner possible and should just tell the rest
of

the world to fuck the hell off? I mean, I seem to be doing fairly well for
the most part, other than for this irritating, complicating love of drug
effects, foreign molecules, and other socially unacceptable things and
behaviors. And even with those I’m doing fairly well, besides having to
deal

with the complications of trying to do my substances in the way I find
most
effective without feeling too guilty and fucked up about it- and worst of
all, finding myself hiding it from the people I care most about in the
entire world because, well, most of you (with some possible exceptions who
will remain unnamed by me for now) understand what I’m talking about and
where I’m coming from.
Anyway, love to you all.
(How can life suck so bad at the same time things are going so fucking
well?)

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some ganja
instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive,
physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke.
Maybe herb could help…

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 9:30:08 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m not sure who you are responding to Sara, and I think that once again that language barrier thing has confused the message I wrote.
My described turmoil hasn’t anything to do with my or anyone else’s cannabis use. My initial problem in this note was with my use and addiction to cigarettes, then I moved on to my serious, severe current, reoccuring issue with banging my drugs again, not to be too open about it on a public list or anything.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 3:33 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction

“What is happening is that the government is using a
condition they created out of thin air, non-existent,
called “addiction”, to justify its fascistic
prohibitionist actions to the world in an attempt to
demonize and stigmatise cannabis consumers.  Ask your
neighborhood fascist what the “symptoms” of addiction
are.  He either won’t be able to tell you, or he’ll
tell you some nonesense which is a blow by blow
repetition of prohibitionist propaganda statements
found on their advertising.  This is to scare ignorant
non-consumers of cannabis into supporting the
fascistic and illegal crushing of democratic rights of
cannabis consumers.
You know damned well that not using cannabis has
no “withdrawal” symptoms.  Its no different from
stopping the consumption of ice cream, or broccoli, or
any other food, except you are not getting a buzz,
which people who DO know about cannabis know full well
is just harmless fun, and hurts nobody.
So stop playing the innocent.  Those folks you
complain about are trying to murder and torture you
for purposes that have absolutely nothing to do with
your health, safety, welfare, or anyone else’s.  Quit
playing their game, and get on with the reality of
cannabis consumption and the law.  We are all being
preyed on by evil fascist murderers, and we need to
start defending ourselves.”

From my friend…

Greetings crookedeye,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 4:46
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Thanks for the suggestion, but being a fond lover of smoking herb with or
without cigarettes, and having actually tried that before to no avail, I’m
afraid that ain’t gonna cut it either.
I’ve also tried substuting clove cigs for tobacco, but that really, really
didn’t cut it either.
It’s been quite some time I’ve been discussing this here, and it sounds the
same as always, like I’m a weak ass git who can’t find self-control.
Sorry, I’m feeling a bit off-balance and angry at myself for this and
that reason. I can’t seem to find it in myself to open up much about it
(having tried a number of time to do so here but ending up deleting the
message before hitting send), finding myself embarrassed and hateful and
sad, but this is about as far as I feel like taking it publicly. Suffice it
to say, I’m going to take ibogaine again at some point, as I believe I’ve
recently noted, but wonder- will this, as with every other freakin’ fucking
“treatment” I’ve ever tried turn into one of these stupid, “oh well, nuther
failed effort” things? Am I weak? Or am I simply supposed to be taking my
drugs in the most effective manner possible and should just tell the rest of

the world to fuck the hell off? I mean, I seem to be doing fairly well for
the most part, other than for this irritating, complicating love of drug
effects, foreign molecules, and other socially unacceptable things and
behaviors. And even with those I’m doing fairly well, besides having to deal

with the complications of trying to do my substances in the way I find most
effective without feeling too guilty and fucked up about it- and worst of
all, finding myself hiding it from the people I care most about in the
entire world because, well, most of you (with some possible exceptions who
will remain unnamed by me for now) understand what I’m talking about and
where I’m coming from.
Anyway, love to you all.
(How can life suck so bad at the same time things are going so fucking
well?)

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some ganja
instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive,
physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke.
Maybe herb could help…

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 9:18:42 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I used to believe cannabis was non-addictive.  But I
have met far too many people in the recovery rooms who
experienced physical symptoms from discontinuing The
Pot — anxiety, weakness, aching, nausea, vomiting,
restlessness, sleeplessness, depression etc. — and
plenty of people who call themselves Marijuana
Addicts.  Not outsiders labeling “others” as deviant.
But potheads who saw their lives and dreams go up in
smoke.  Herb was their best friend, and then it turned
on them.  Instead of a pleasant buzz, they got
paranoid.  Instead of “high”, they just got “low.”

I know it ain’t crack, but “bongaholics”  have their
own struggles.  Please don’t diminish them by
ideologically refusing to acknowledge that
high-powered strains of the Wisdom Weed can hook some
kinds of brains.  It does hurt some people.

You know damned well that not using cannabis has
no “withdrawal” symptoms.  Its no different from
stopping the consumption of ice cream, or broccoli,
or
any other food, except you are not getting a buzz,
which people who DO know about cannabis know full
well
is just harmless fun, and hurts nobody.iction

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:
Date: November 19, 2004 at 9:14:40 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Great Question Jim:

Here’s Cletus Nelson’s (the author of the new report at DrugWar.com) reply:
—-

Hi Preston,

Jim asked a provocative question that I’ve been thinking about for some
time.

From what I’ve learned about the pharmacotherapy drugs in development,
if the individual was inoculated with a compound containing receptor
blockers (which seems to be one of the more promising anti-drug
agents),  than he or she would be impervious to opiates as these
medications are designed to permanently cripple the body’s opioid
receptor sites.

Thus, regardless of whether the individual was given Codeine, Morphine,
or Oxycontin, the body would be resistant to any type of opium-based
painkiller. Obviously there are a few non-opiate painkillers on the
market but according to many chronic pain patients they aren’t quite as
effective and the individual would needlessly suffer.

This is an issue I hope that health officials will take into
consideration before they start applying the drugs on a wider scale.

Jacob Sullum doesn’t believe the state will mandate that adolescents be
inoculated. However, he speculates that “social pressure” and a bizarre
belief that this would be the “right thing to do” may compel parents to
have their children “immunized”…

Scary stuff.

Best,

Cletus

http://www.pointsofdeparture.blogspot.com

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 6:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:

Hi Preston,

Tell me, if you know, if someone was to vaccinated for opiates let’s say at 15 years old, then at 16 years old get in a terriable accident like burns over 50% of their body or something should happen that causes severe pain, would they be able to give them anything for pain that would work?  Just wondering, it is something to think about.

Best to all

– JIM

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
HI all,
With the recent news breaking about vaccinating druggies to stop them
from even being able to get high in the first place, I post this excerpt
from DrugWar.com’s latest expose, posted this morning, (Nov. 16, 2004).
Long-time contributor to DrugWar.com and a contributor to Under the
Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs, Cletus Nelson has painted an
ugly picture of the strides being made to not only tell us what we can and
can’t do with our minds, but the efforts to physically alter our brains and
bodies to insure we comply with prohibitionist insanities.
Peace and love to all,
Preston

http://www.drugwar.com/cpandora.shtm
Opening Pandora’s Box:
Anti-Drug Vaccines Gather Momentum
by Cletus Nelson
for DrugWar.com
Nov. 16, 2004

Back in 2002, DrugWar.com addressed a disturbing new strategy in the war ! on
drugs: The development of anti-drug “vaccines” capable of permanently
blunting the effects of mind-altering substances. The article
(“Headshrinking the American Addict”), discussed how the National Institute
on Drug Abuse (NIDA) in partnership with various corporate and public
entities was spending millions developing this supposed “cure” for the
“disease” of addiction. The sheer scope of this neuro-political endeavor,
which sounds like something out of a futuristic science fiction thriller,
generated more than a few incredulous responses from skeptical readers. Yet
some two years later, this far flung experiment in social control is gaining
traction among prohibitionists.
SOUNDING THE ALARM
Over the past year, the anti-drug agents, or “pharmacotherapy” drugs, have
drawn the attention of the Northern California-based Center for Cognitive
Liberty and Ethics (CCLE). This spring, the Center distilled their research
into! a compelling 52-page report that makes for some truly disturbing
reading. Titled Threats to Cognitive Liberty: Pharmacotherapy and the Future
of the Drug War,” the well researched position paper comes to the unsettling
conclusion that within the next decade this once speculative venture is
destined to become a reality. Indeed, the report predicts that the
medically-based approach to countering drug abuse will “tremendously impact”
the strategic focus of both American and International drug control
strategies. Moreover, the CCLE warn that this ominous development will
engender a “striking expansion of the state’s policing mechanism on at least
two fronts: 1) from external policing to internal policing; and 2) from
restraining a person’s body and behavior, to directly restraining a person’s
thoughts and thought processes.” (p. 41)
These aren’t the ruminations of a crew of stoners swapping conspiracy
theories over bong hits in t! he back of a van, but the opinion of a
nationally recognized organization of experts in such diverse fields as
science, law, ethics, and medicine. While it is hoped that the Center’s
learned observations will engender greater public debate about the vaccines,
this authoritative document is also invaluable as it explores the underlying
motivations behind this backdoor attempt by government officials to claim
ownership to our minds.

NEW WEAPONS, SAME WAR
The CCLE identify three types of vaccines currently in development; Receptor
Blockers, Molecule Binders, and Metabolism Modifiers. Most Americans are
familiar with the latter group as they include anti-drinking medications
such as the highly popular Antabuse which is often prescribed for
alcoholism. The goal of these compounds is merely to induce intense
discomfort when an individual imbibes a particular substance in order to
discourage its further use. Anyone who has viewed S! tanley Kubrick’s A
Clockwork Orange is familiar with this form of negative conditioning.
However, Receptor Blockers are far more drastic as the compounds directly
enter the bloodstream to short circuit the addictive process by using
“antagonists” and other agents to permanently neutralize and/or inhibit the
ability of the brain’s receptor sites to process psychoactive drugs.
Similarly, Molecule Binders are designed to bind like antibodies to the
molecules of illegal substances rendering them incapable of penetrating the
blood-brain barrier.
The study places great emphasis on the fact that pharmacotherapy medications
have the potential to significantly alter both how the drug war is perceived
and how prohibition efforts will be conducted in the near future. In
essence, the new approach “expands the battlefield from the Colombian coca
farms and Middle-Eastern poppy fields to a new terrain directly inside the
bodies and brains of! drug users.” (p.6) [emphasis in the original]
The reason for this dramatic shift in strategy isn’t difficult to fathom:
The drug war is a colossal failure. Citing recent statistics from the
Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration (SAMSHA), the
Center notes that an estimated 19 million Americans (age 12 and above)
ingest some type of illegal drug each month. Thus, the federal government,
which has long relied on punitive measures ranging from imprisonment to
asset forfeiture in order to reduce demand for illicit drugs, is seeking to
retake the offensive in this losing war by reprogramming the brains of
alleged substance abusers.
snip-
Read complete article at above URL

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the In! fluence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military
Date: November 19, 2004 at 9:03:14 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

there’s no such thing as a draft in this country remember.
What in the world this judge is thinking- telling this pot smoker he must now go serve in jail, where the threat of rape is very real, or to go kill other people, all due to his smoking pot and defending his home- is beyond me, other than for the fact it’s sheer evil what he’s doing.

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Bill Weinberg” <billw@echonyc.com>
To: <bloom@hightimes.com>
Cc: <peterg9@yahoo.com>; <wishnia@rcn.com>; <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 2:25 AM
Subject: Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military

Sure wish I was still doing Highwire…


Man With Pot Given Choice: Jail or Military
http://www.kron.com/Global/story.asp?S=2579902
Email to a Friend
Printer Friendly Version

Posted: November 17, 2004 at 12:38 p.m.

SALINAS, Calif. (AP) — A Salinas man will have to choose between
going to jail or joining the military as his punishment for
possession of marijuana.

A judge surprised both the prosecution and defense yesterday when he
told Brian Barr that he could avoid a jail term by enlisting in the
military.

The 24-year-old Barr was charged with marijuana possession after
shooting a would-be robber who had entered his apartment with two
others.

Police say Barr sold marijuana from his home, and that the three men
were searching for money and marijuana.

In giving Barr a choice of sentence, Monterey County Judge Robert
Moody said that the shooting was justified.

Barr is scheduled to return to court next month.

(Copyright 2004 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved.

*************************************************************
http://worldwar3report.com/
Vigilant, Independent Sentry of Truth in the War on Terrorism

*************************************************************
http://www.worldwar3report.com/
Vigilant, Independent Sentry of Truth in the War on Terrorism

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,
Date: November 19, 2004 at 8:47:39 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

MMMMMMMM, that sounded really good, Sara…Please give
him my love.

Also, I would like to come see you next Spring…I’ll
email you offlist…

love Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 19, 2004 at 8:34:33 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What are you talking about Faith?<

– I think we’re all wondering that same thing,
Preston…

I mean, Faith, what are you contributing here on the
ibogaine list at all
beside rancor, unease, and dissension? Are you
intentionally going out of
your way to prove my own views of Republican-minded
types?

– hear hear….

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:
Date: November 19, 2004 at 8:28:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The vaccines are too weird. Keep em on the shelf.. It’s a Brave New World Horatio

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:
Date: November 19, 2004 at 8:25:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You could get a spinalblock. You can also give enough opiates to over ride the vaccine. There would be only a certain amount of antobody sites to fill till the drug ( coc or dope) would work. This is a problem, as doppers will try to override the vaccine and have heart attacks and respiratory depression from the opiates.
This issue is one of the main concerns holding vback the release of the vaccines which have been proven to work. The other main issue is the ethiocal issue. Do we vaccinate all newborns or employees against crack , etc..?

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 19, 2004 at 8:20:36 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Okay, The right to arm bears

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 19, 2004 at 8:19:56 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There are low content protein powders available. Check out MOTHERSOY on the web

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jason is sleeping
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:24:11 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It is only 20 minutes later and Jason is sleeping on the couch, while the music is on.
he had kava kava and passionflower for relaxation.

Sara
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,
Date: November 19, 2004 at 7:09:11 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

After having a big breakfast, Jason had a big lunch , 1 cup of thee of fresh squeezed lemon with real raw honey,
2 hamburgers with mash potatoes spinach a la cream and beetroot salad and one slice of dark bread.
He is sitting listening to a meditation music. Waiting for the time to pass, and the time goes so slow.

Sara
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 5:15:54 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, you guy, are one of the big reasons I stay here. I know a little about your situation and you know I know about addiction from experience but, I for once, am almost at a lost for words. I want to tell you to do what you have to when dealing with pain but your so talented I don’t want you to dull yourself. I put myself in your shoes and I really don’t know what I would do. The Ibogaine sure as hell ‘aint gonna hurt the situation any though. You know what your in for there. I hate to see you go through any pain emotionally or physically, we as addicts, or just users, don’t deal with that very well. We try to hide it from the ones we love but they always know what’s up or they wouldn’t be the ones we love. You keep looking for the answer and a way will be found.              Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,
Date: November 19, 2004 at 5:13:11 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy,

Yes ,his had two eggs two cheese toast, one kiwi and some grapes and a cup of herbal thee for breakfast, and plenty of all kind of supplements.
he was going through hell from not being able to sleep. But he got some sleep that’s for sure. He is watching a film with half eye open.
And Thanks Randy.

Sara

Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 9:47
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,

Sara, tell Jasen I’m thinking about him. I’ve been trying to keep up with what you are doing over there. He should be through his big one by now right? Maybe still in it about now. I wish I was there. I’m coming sometime. You do a great service to mankind. I’m talking to someone else about coming to see you from KY.        Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clarification
Date: November 19, 2004 at 4:22:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ask Patrick. Better yet, read what it says on the Homepage and pay attention. You want to control the topic? get a fucking therapist, I did.          Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Faith
Date: November 19, 2004 at 4:13:22 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That is it!! You be done got my cunty boy dander up. What are you trying to imply? What the fuck does a scum bag like me want with the ACLU? I would like to see Michael Moore get behind Ibogaine. That should be pursued in a big way. (See disclaimer) As for you. Blow…. no …..Eat……no……Kiss…… no, I just can’t do it. I try and be nice when I can. Why isn’t your son here trying to help himself? I really don’t give a fuck about you unless you are really the one addicted and using that as a front. Bottom line for me is trying to help those who need it. Same as it was for me.        Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:46:58 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara, tell Jasen I’m thinking about him. I’ve been trying to keep up with what you are doing over there. He should be through his big one by now right? Maybe still in it about now. I wish I was there. I’m coming sometime. You do a great service to mankind. I’m talking to someone else about coming to see you from KY.        Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Off-topic- George W appeared on my grilled cheese sandwich!
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:39:55 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, doesn’t Ibogaine rule? Kinda opens the head up doesn’t it. Perception is everything. Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Disclaimer
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:35:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

These are the idle rantings of a recovering drug addict after having his brain rewired by Ibogaine. Please disregard what doesn’t pertain to you or better yet take that dull ass needle and sharpen it again on the matchbox striker and………I can’t say that. From now on I will refer to the disclaimer when I feel a brain seizure coming or just can’t keep my fingers from writing sarcastic shit like this.          Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs/Pot and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:33:05 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“What is happening is that the government is using a
condition they created out of thin air, non-existent,
called “addiction”, to justify its fascistic
prohibitionist actions to the world in an attempt to
demonize and stigmatise cannabis consumers.  Ask your
neighborhood fascist what the “symptoms” of addiction
are.  He either won’t be able to tell you, or he’ll
tell you some nonesense which is a blow by blow
repetition of prohibitionist propaganda statements
found on their advertising.  This is to scare ignorant
non-consumers of cannabis into supporting the
fascistic and illegal crushing of democratic rights of
cannabis consumers.
You know damned well that not using cannabis has
no “withdrawal” symptoms.  Its no different from
stopping the consumption of ice cream, or broccoli, or
any other food, except you are not getting a buzz,
which people who DO know about cannabis know full well
is just harmless fun, and hurts nobody.
So stop playing the innocent.  Those folks you
complain about are trying to murder and torture you
for purposes that have absolutely nothing to do with
your health, safety, welfare, or anyone else’s.  Quit
playing their game, and get on with the reality of
cannabis consumption and the law.  We are all being
preyed on by evil fascist murderers, and we need to
start defending ourselves.”

From my friend…

Greetings crookedeye,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 4:46
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Thanks for the suggestion, but being a fond lover of smoking herb with or
without cigarettes, and having actually tried that before to no avail, I’m
afraid that ain’t gonna cut it either.
I’ve also tried substuting clove cigs for tobacco, but that really, really
didn’t cut it either.
It’s been quite some time I’ve been discussing this here, and it sounds the
same as always, like I’m a weak ass git who can’t find self-control.
Sorry, I’m feeling a bit off-balance and angry at myself for this and
that reason. I can’t seem to find it in myself to open up much about it
(having tried a number of time to do so here but ending up deleting the
message before hitting send), finding myself embarrassed and hateful and
sad, but this is about as far as I feel like taking it publicly. Suffice it
to say, I’m going to take ibogaine again at some point, as I believe I’ve
recently noted, but wonder- will this, as with every other freakin’ fucking
“treatment” I’ve ever tried turn into one of these stupid, “oh well, nuther
failed effort” things? Am I weak? Or am I simply supposed to be taking my
drugs in the most effective manner possible and should just tell the rest of

the world to fuck the hell off? I mean, I seem to be doing fairly well for
the most part, other than for this irritating, complicating love of drug
effects, foreign molecules, and other socially unacceptable things and
behaviors. And even with those I’m doing fairly well, besides having to deal

with the complications of trying to do my substances in the way I find most
effective without feeling too guilty and fucked up about it- and worst of
all, finding myself hiding it from the people I care most about in the
entire world because, well, most of you (with some possible exceptions who
will remain unnamed by me for now) understand what I’m talking about and
where I’m coming from.
Anyway, love to you all.
(How can life suck so bad at the same time things are going so fucking
well?)

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some ganja
instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive,
physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke.
Maybe herb could help…

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:16:53 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I know for me I had no cravings for cigs after Ibogaine, I think I could have walked away from them too. Maybe I didn’t wait long enough to see if I would withdrawal from cigs too. I started smoking again to have something to do with the 21 hours I was up every day for a while. I wish I hadn’t now. I’ll quit cigs when I go see Sara.      Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 19, 2004 at 3:08:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, I found this site, studied and looked for Ibogaine and found it, set up treament and did it, all with the help of the people here. We talk about all kinds of shit here. I did the same thing you just did by being indigent about treatment and not getting what I want over the list. Carla spanked me for it. I digress from the list topic. Shoot me. HeHe George Bush fucked up the topic by being elected.  Thats how all this got started. No Patrick started it, yea that’s the ticket, it was Patricks fault LOL there’s a link to Glock on the list. I’ll try and refrain though from talking about anything not pertaining to Ibogaine. Speaking of which, ever see the fire from a 458 Winchester magnum at night while on Ibogaine?,,,,, It’s a joke damn it, laugh! Lighten up Beavis.              Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: OFF LIST Re: [Ibogaine] clarification
Date: November 19, 2004 at 2:07:17 AM EST
To: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Cc: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

still doing benzo ibo research, receptors not even close to each other.  i’d like ibo and love travel and  shows but am i right for ibo? benzos screw people for life , i kicked every jones i had in jail, no meds, no sleep, sleeping with killers.  100mg methadone, getting off on h 5 times a day, jugs of injectables, but i’m 54 now young blood and i help people as a profession and avocation.  i’m not looking for the cure de jure, i want the real thing and to be able to be a citizen of the world whenits done, not a zealot like 12 steppers.  so far the ibo heads have not impreesed me nor i them. thats cool, thats why we have fords and chevys.  but my friend, this cheeseball babble do grow old to a guy who’s days are numbered. i appreciate the invitation and will chime in when i can help.  but fuck gun control, politics and flirting  when i’m dying. ron
—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: Ron Davis
Sent: Friday, November 19, 2004 12:35 AM
Subject: OFF LIST Re: [Ibogaine] clarification

judging by your posts, id say you’re in the right place alright.

this list is kinda like the combination of the following: the smoking lounge of a treatment center, the lobby during 1/2 time of a grateful dead show, un-fettered group therapy, ethnobotanical freaks international, a strange consortium of molecular research specialists, computer geeks and hackerz, a convention of conspiracy theorists, activists, junkies and various government agencies (that ARE subscribed to this list with various domain names with three letters ending with .gov … for reals).

The question is… are you going to give Ibogaine a shot? then this list is like the collective conscience clearing house of how to proceed from here, with daily ramblings of people much like yourself that are somewhere in the process of putting their lives back together, more or less.

If Iboga sounds like your path, then the question is what is the next step?

If not, you might want decide if you want to continue to deal with the random postings traffic of this list. There are nuggets of informAtion to be gleaned if that is your purpose. If not then the choice is clear.

my question for you is… where do you live? the traveling iboga underground treatment crew may be visiting a city near you in the near future. are you game?

I can very much relate to your history, me being a homeless junkie not all that long ago and all. Ibogaine saved my “flecko” ass from imminent destruction, or from being pickled at the local methadone clinic.

peace,
-Dave

On Thursday, November 18, 2004, at 06:50 PM, Ron Davis wrote:

forum:
does this exist to promote ibo as a means to w/d and subsequently lead chemically free live or is it here to promote ibo  use and other incidental drugs? not critizing, just want to know. myself, after 54 yrs of getting the hell beat out of me, losing to dope in any form, liqour, h , methadone, reefer, you name it, glue, nose inhalers and everything else under the stars, i’ve decided i want to be free of all  this crap that keeps me from living the good life, which i did for 15 yrs. i heard politics, guns, romantic stories of dope use and i wonder if  i’m in the right place.  someone care to clue me in?  hate to be wasting you guys’ time  with my quest. thanks, persoonally , i thing drugs suck.  i d/n want to be at the mercy of  some doc, drug, snitch , or bottle.  not a moral issue, just my feelings about me..
everyone’s got an opinion. this shit has destroyed my life , family and possibly carreer and stripped me of every shred of dignity i ever possessed. perhaps many of you have not had the same experience.  god bless you for it. i hope it doesn’t strike. i’m just an ex-con who got lucky and made it thru the 60’s and 70’s and then law school.  then i got bit by the snake again and life sucks.let me know if i’m at the right place, please.  if not, i’ll bail and you guys can have at it.
rwd , trying to stay alive, thanks

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: OFF LIST Re: [Ibogaine] clarification
Date: November 19, 2004 at 1:35:52 AM EST
To: Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net>

judging by your posts, id say you’re in the right place alright.

this list is kinda like the combination of the following: the smoking lounge of a treatment center, the lobby during 1/2 time of a grateful dead show, un-fettered group therapy, ethnobotanical freaks international, a strange consortium of molecular research specialists, computer geeks and hackerz, a convention of conspiracy theorists, activists, junkies and various government agencies (that ARE subscribed to this list with various domain names with three letters ending with .gov … for reals).

The question is… are you going to give Ibogaine a shot? then this list is like the collective conscience clearing house of how to proceed from here, with daily ramblings of people much like yourself that are somewhere in the process of putting their lives back together, more or less.

If Iboga sounds like your path, then the question is what is the next step?

If not, you might want decide if you want to continue to deal with the random postings traffic of this list.  There are nuggets of informAtion to be gleaned if that is your purpose. If not then the choice is clear.

my question for you is… where do you live? the traveling iboga underground treatment crew may be visiting a city near you in the near future. are you game?

I can very much relate to your history, me being a homeless junkie not all that long ago and all. Ibogaine saved my “flecko” ass from imminent destruction, or from being pickled at the local methadone clinic.

peace,
-Dave

On Thursday, November 18, 2004, at 06:50 PM, Ron Davis wrote:

forum:
does this exist to promote ibo as a means to w/d and subsequently lead chemically free live or is it here to promote ibo  use and other incidental drugs? not critizing, just want to know. myself, after 54 yrs of getting the hell beat out of me, losing to dope in any form, liqour, h , methadone, reefer, you name it, glue, nose inhalers and everything else under the stars, i’ve decided i want to be free of all  this crap that keeps me from living the good life, which i did for 15 yrs. i heard politics, guns, romantic stories of dope use and i wonder if  i’m in the right place.  someone care to clue me in?  hate to be wasting you guys’ time  with my quest. thanks, persoonally , i thing drugs suck.  i d/n want to be at the mercy of  some doc, drug, snitch , or bottle.  not a moral issue, just my feelings about me..
everyone’s got an opinion. this shit has destroyed my life , family and possibly carreer and stripped me of every shred of dignity i ever possessed. perhaps many of you have not had the same experience.  god bless you for it. i hope it doesn’t strike. i’m just an ex-con who got lucky and made it thru the 60’s and 70’s and then law school.  then i got bit by the snake again and life sucks.let me know if i’m at the right place, please.  if not, i’ll bail and you guys can have at it.
rwd , trying to stay alive, thanks

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: APSAD Annual Conference – day 2. Prisons, pharmacotherapies, stimulants, naltrexone, alcohol and more.
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:21:02 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 10:21 PM
Subject: APSAD Annual Conference – day 2. Prisons, pharmacotherapies, stimulants, naltrexone, alcohol and more.

APSAD Conference, Fremantle, WA. Tuesday 16th November 2004.

Dear Colleagues,

The second formal day of proceedings had an emphasis on prisons and law enforcement. Michael Farrell’s talk was entitled “Tackling problem drug users before, during and after prison. Dealing with a high risk environment”. He reminded us of the problems of suicides in jail as well as deaths in recently released prisoners, citing numerous studies showing the greatly increased risks of overdose in the days after release. It was for this reason that methadone was introduced into all prisons in New South Wales almost 2 decades ago. It appears that methadone treatment is still not routine in British jails and indeed, most other countries’ jails, despite the evident need and benefits.

Next we heard from Heino Stover on drug use in German prisons. He quoted numerous trials of needle/syringe availability, which is known to reduce rates of blood borne diseases. None of the trials had been associated with reported problems such as prisoners threatening other inmates or staff with officially provided syringes. Since one cannot stop drugs entering jails, it would seem illogical to ban needle/syringe provision for their safer use.

Brian Watters launched the new ANCD (Australian National Council on Drugs) compilation of the research on custodial matters. He was remarkably frank about the value of harm reduction measures of all kinds in the prison system, including needle/syringe programs. Copies were available for delegates.

The meeting then split into 6 streams of which I was involved in ‘pharmacotherapies’.

Tim Mitchell spoke on the potential advantages of using the active enantiomer (‘R’) of methadone in preference to the cheaper racemic version (‘RS’) generally available. He had searched the literature, especially from Germany where this has been used in clinical practice for many years for historical reasons. While there were some negative effects noted from the inactive form, these appeared mild in most people, except at high dose levels. It was shown that the metabolism of the two forms could be quite different and one might induce the metabolism of the other. The best information might be obtained from those who have transferred regularly from the German program to other European locations where doses have to be doubled to yield the same agonist effect.

Ian Kronborg gave in interesting talk on sleep disturbances in methadone maintained patients, pointing out how complex this field has become. There are dozens of specific sleep pathologies recognised and now, a particular one associated with opioid maintenance. All practitioners should remind those with insomnia about regular ‘sleep hygiene’ as some methadone patients were found to require only simple advice to improve disturbed sleep patterns.

Lula Kamal gave a disturbing account of the reasons English patients had left maintenance treatment in past episodes. Methadone doses had been ‘too low’ with ‘cravings’, ‘withdrawals’ and ‘continued heroin use’ given as the reasons in many of her confidential questionnaire subjects in London. A question from the audience confirmed that poor quality treatment appears to be rife in London with little patient involvement in decision making about dose levels. It is still a mystery why the mean methadone dose in England remains reportedly below 40mg (where it probably should be double this for optimising benefits) … and no wonder that as a consequence methadone has a bad name amongst patients, doctors, journalists and the community generally. It is most surprising that the major Addiction journals, Colleges, NAC and NHS have not conceded the existence of this parlous state of affairs, nor have they done anything to rectify it. Comparisons with other European countries show an ongoing spate of adverse consequences from overdoses to HIV and hepatitis. The matter is so grave that even quite conservative people are now calling for heroin prescription for addicts.

Richard Hallinan from our own surgery then presented evidence of hypogonadism and sexual dysfunction in opioid treated men. He recommended that practitioners include these issues in clinical assessments and in monitoring of on-going opioid replacement treatment.

In a second paper, Dr Hallinan then described the use of receiver operating characteristic (ROC) analysis to define statistically optimal thresholds for methadone dose and plasma concentrations (100mg daily; 250ng/ml R-methadone; 300-400ng/ml for racemic methadone) in relation to continuing heroin use in MMT. Measuring plasma concentrations apparently did not help to predict continuing heroin use in MMT.

Dr Comer spoke about her work with long acting depot naltrexone for heroin relapse prevention. Her own study from Columbia University used ~200mg and ~400mg doses, measuring blood levels and responses to injected heroin in the 6 weeks following (yes, an American heroin trial!). Some developed skin irritation at the naltrexone injection site and one attempted suicide during the trial. This is consistent with Miotto and Ling’s findings and might be associated with an accompanying depression although Comer said that it was not thought to be a result of the treatment.

After lunch we heard a series of speakers on the increasing problems with psychostimulants. Robert Ali implied that following an epidemic of stimulant popularity, there may have been some reductions of late, with some high quality heroin ‘flooding’ back onto the market. He had done the ground work for a trial of treatment for amphetamine psychosis but now there seemed to be fewer presentations for this diagnosis at the two centres proposed for the trial. Drugs such as benzodiazepines and anti-psychotics were discussed, along with their various advantages and disadvantages including the stigma of a ‘schizophrenia’ diagnosis and the addictive nature of the ‘minor’ tranquillizers.

Parallel sessions then addressed alcohol use in the older person, prison issues, general practice, youth and cannabis law reform.

The James Rankin oration was given this year by Jason White in the presence of Professor Rankin himself. We were given a succinct but detailed overview of the subcellular neural mechanisms for the actions of many of the substances people use as well as the treatments we institute. We then heard from Dr Comer again on naltrexone in relapse prevention using the long acting depot form.

Finally, Frank Hansen from the NSW Drug Squad gave the constabulary’s view of the stimulant epidemic, followed by the police approach to harm minimization and some difficulties which can arise.

It is impossible to get a completely fair overview of such a large meeting and my apologies to all those who contributed who I have not mentioned. There was a camaraderie in all of the coffee and meal breaks in which sometimes quite disparate people found common ground and enjoyed each others’ company. While the company was superlative, the conference dinner was not really worth $75 (food review on application). However, I approve of the prinicple of individual bar service rather than ‘unlimited poor quality grog’ which has sometimes been the case in the past.

Comments by Andrew Byrne ..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dr Andrew Byrne MB BS (SYD) FAChAM (RACP)
Dependency Medicine,
75 Redfern Street, Redfern,
New South Wales, 2016, Australia
Email – ajbyrneATozemail.com.au
Tel (61 – 2) 9319 5524 Fax 9318 0631
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
My grandfather Harry Gracie’s letters from 1924 trip to Mayo Clinic:
http://bpresent.com/harry/code/mayo.htm

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: APSAD Annual Conference – day 1. Excellent papers, great venue, etc.
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:06:48 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks, rwd
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 5:37 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: APSAD Annual Conference – day 1. Excellent papers, great venue, etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 11:07 PM
Subject: APSAD Annual Conference – day 1. Excellent papers, great venue, etc.

APSAD Conference, Perth. Monday 15th November 2004.

Dear Colleagues,

Health Minister McGinty, despite being the local member for Fremantle, was not able to attend to open the conference so his upper house Parliamentary Secretary said a few brief but very pertinent words in his absence as she declared the conference open.

Aboriginal elder Mr Wilkes spoke about his Nunga people and their land as well as some negative interactions with drugs and alcohol. His grandson, also Mr Wilkes, then played the didgeridoo, albeit with permission from the traditional owners of the pipe far to the north. Both were widely appreciated and complimented by the first key-note speaker Dr Tracy Westerman. She spoke eloquently and effectively about the cultural differences with Koori/Nunga and other indigenous family structures from the European. Her talk came as a breathe of fresh air from a caring, insightful and productive professional who spoke her part with conviction – minus ‘attitude’. She also had a team of like-minded psychologists who were involved in spreading the word about interventions, local control and the use of beneficial, self sustaining programs to address drug and alcohol abuse in indigenous communities across the country.

Next the drug professor from London Michael Farrell revealed some worrying but sadly unsurprising statistics from London. He showed some slides of depressed neighbourhoods in his once great city. Sorry inhabitants, poor living conditions and the availability of very cheap alcohol were a shock to some in the audience. He gave some figures for tobacco, alcohol and illicit drug use amongst such folk. Despite being worldly and knowledgeable about the field, he stopped short of definitive advice on how to address the multiple problems he described.

The day progressed with 6 ‘strands’ of parallel lectures/workshops covering a multitude of topics.

Initially I heard Robyn Richmond speak about her randomised controlled trial of smoking interventions in schizophrenic patients. Her rigorous evaluation showed significant benefits in the early phase but with waning effects by 12 months. She also addressed smoking in prison populations in another session and described the outcomes of the new GP anti-smoking guidelines. There were also talks on hepatitis C rates and injecting behaviours, indigenous issues, rehabilitation and peer support, co-morbidity and South-east Asian perspectives.

In the afternoon we heard from Dr Tim Mitchell about a new titanium canister being trialled in London to dispense methadone take-away doses by remote control. The tamper-proof unit has an electronic dispenser which only responds to an optical recognition such as a finger-print. The pharmacist would also have a ‘key’ using finger prints as well to refill the thing. He pointed out that it only monitors methadone usage and does not prevent the patient on-selling or injecting the drug. I am still surprised as to why we use liquid methadone for take-away doses rather than tablets. Liquids can be an invitation to injecting for some unstable or unhappy patients. This would seem like an English response to their situation, being unable to address the abysmal quality of MMT. But there is a risk that this system could stigmatize our patients even more than they are already.

Pier Paolo Pani from Italy went to some trouble next to document his efforts to define which patients are more likely to do well with methadone and (pure) buprenorphine respectively. Even from their wide experience in Italy and his close attention to numerous clinical factors, it still came down to personal preference or trial and error in most cases. Leslie Amass repeated some of her figures from the Sunday meeting, emphasising the bio-equivalence of Suboxone and Subutex and the obvious advantages of take-home doses. I was surprised that despite an enormous experience in the US over the past few years (up to 50,000 individual patients) that there have been no further published studies to support the continuing safety and effectiveness of the combination product, especially whether it can be diverted to the black or ‘grey’ markets. Professor Walter Ling spoke about opioids and pain, alluding to the possible development of non-addictive drugs which were still effective for pain management. This has long been a ‘wish’ for those in the field and each drug company claim of a lower addiction potential has been followed by disappointment (including heroin itself!). He cited evidence for the existence and relevance of the ‘orphan’ receptor which may compliment the mu and other opioid receptors in the brain.

Don Weatherburn gave a talk about reduced detected crime amongst those in the criminal justice system who chose to go onto methadone treatment. The reductions did not seem dramatic but he assured us that they were significant, elaborating details of unreported crimes and low clear-up rates as low as 6% for some types.

Michael Tedeschi gave a fascinating talk on his findings in a survey of patients and prescribers on their reasons for preferring buprenorphine or methadone. Doctors were more impressed with the safety angle while patients were more interested in the convenience of a longer acting drug which is more flexible that methadone in some respects. Some also cited the illusory ‘less addictive’ nature of buprenorphine, despite a lack of evidence that it is more likely to result in abstinence than methadone or traditional detoxification from heroin. Side effects seem less with buprenorphine in a proportion of those who responded.

Jane Maxwell spoke of her experience with mortality in methadone patients in Texas.

Sue Hailstone described a NSW Health Department initiative aimed at detecting and dealing with doctors who prescribed more than the ‘guideline’ maximum 4 take-away doses weekly from an audit conducted in May 2001. While the follow-up audit showed better compliance, there was still no attempt to determine if actual clinical practice had improved as a result of the audit. I understand that some experienced doctors left the field at the time, possibly partly as a result of the intrusive nature of this intervention.

A senior Victorian doctor questioned the whole subject when ‘guidelines’ are ‘just that’. ‘Mandatory guidelines’ is something of an oxymoron. The NSW authorities no longer have the means to vet individual clinical requests to go outside these maximums and doctors are caught in the uncomfortable position of either giving inappropriate treatment or breaking these rules in their patients’ interests. It is gratifying that the new draft guidelines do not apply the same restrictions to those taking less than 40mg daily.

Many areas are still sadly lacking in on-going education for front-line health workers to raise the standard of care of patients with alcohol and drug problems.

Next we heard from Suzanne Fraser and Kylie Valentine on their new project comparing the take-away policies in Australia’s two most populous states. Their pilot interviews quoted many interesting views from patients on the (obvious) benefits of dispensed doses. One went along the lines: “Urgh … I might not trust myself with doses for a whole week, but a few days of take-aways make all the difference!” The Victorian and NSW studies will make interesting reading in due course.

All in all a fascinating and productive day hosted by the Perth-based APSAD team.

Comments by Andrew Byrne ..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dr Andrew Byrne MB BS (SYD) FAChAM (RACP)
Dependency Medicine,
75 Redfern Street, Redfern,
New South Wales, 2016, Australia
Email – ajbyrneATozemail.com.au
Tel (61 – 2) 9319 5524 Fax 9318 0631
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
My grandfather Harry Gracie’s letters from 1924 trip to Mayo Clinic:
http://bpresent.com/harry/code/mayo.htm

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:
Date: November 19, 2004 at 12:02:25 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Quote:
– Just because you do not take an interest in politics doesn’t mean
politics won’t take an interest in you. – Pericles

they take your kid from school and vaccinate him/her and tell you how good and safe it is
and how bad drugs are, and after few years everyone all over the Globe will need to be vaccinated to be able to go
to a public school or find a job.

Van: Jim Hadey [mailto:jimhadey3@yahoo.com] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 19 november 2004 0:29
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:

Hi Preston,

Tell me, if you know, if someone was to vaccinated for opiates let’s say at 15 years old, then at 16 years old get in a terriable accident like burns over 50% of their body or something should happen that causes severe pain, would they be able to give them anything for pain that would work?  Just wondering, it is something to think about.

Best to all

– JIM

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
HI all,
With the recent news breaking about vaccinating druggies to stop them 
from even being able to get high in the first place, I post this excerpt 
from DrugWar.com’s latest expose, posted this morning, (Nov. 16, 2004). 
Long-time contributor to DrugWar.com and a contributor to Under the 
Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs, Cletus Nelson has painted an 
ugly picture of the strides being made to not only tell us what we can and 
can’t do with our minds, but the efforts to physically alter our brains and 
bodies to insure we comply with prohibitionist insanities.
Peace and love to all,
Preston

http://www.drugwar.com/cpandora.shtm
Opening Pandora’s Box:
Anti-Drug Vaccines Gather Momentum
by Cletus Nelson
for DrugWar.com
Nov. 16, 2004

Back in 2002, DrugWar.com addressed a disturbing new strategy in the war on 
drugs: The development of anti-drug “vaccines” capable of permanently 
blunting the effects of mind-altering substances. The article 
(“Headshrinking the American Addict”), discussed how the National Institute 
on Drug Abuse (NIDA) in partnership with various corporate and public 
entities was spending millions developing this supposed “cure” for the 
”disease” of addiction. The sheer scope of this neuro-political endeavor, 
which sounds like something out of a futuristic science fiction thriller, 
generated more than a few incredulous responses from skeptical readers. Yet 
some two years later, this far flung experiment in social control is gaining 
traction among prohibitionists.
SOUNDING THE ALARM
Over the past year, the anti-drug agents, or “pharmacotherapy” drugs, have 
drawn the attention of the Northern California-based Center for Cognitive 
Liberty and Ethics (CCLE). This spring, the Center distilled their research 
into a compelling 52-page report that makes for some truly disturbing 
reading. Titled Threats to Cognitive Liberty: Pharmacotherapy and the Future 
of the Drug War,” the well researched position paper comes to the unsettling 
conclusion that within the next decade this once speculative venture is 
destined to become a reality. Indeed, the report predicts that the 
medically-based approach to countering drug abuse will “tremendously impact” 
the strategic focus of both American and International drug control 
strategies. Moreover, the CCLE warn that this ominous development will 
engender a “striking expansion of the state’s policing mechanism on at least 
two fronts: 1) from external policing to internal policing; and 2) from 
restraining a person’s body and behavior, to directly restraining a person’s 
thoughts and thought processes.” (p. 41)
These aren’t the ruminations of a crew of stoners swapping conspiracy 
theories over bong hits in the back of a van, but the opinion of a 
nationally recognized organization of experts in such diverse fields as 
science, law, ethics, and medicine. While it is hoped that the Center’s 
learned observations will engender greater public debate about the vaccines, 
this authoritative document is also invaluable as it explores the underlying 
motivations behind this backdoor attempt by government officials to claim 
ownership to our minds.

NEW WEAPONS, SAME WAR
The CCLE identify three types of vaccines currently in development; Receptor 
Blockers, Molecule Binders, and Metabolism Modifiers. Most Americans are 
familiar with the latter group as they include anti-drinking medications 
such as the highly popular Antabuse which is often prescribed for 
alcoholism. The goal of these compounds is merely to induce intense 
discomfort when an individual imbibes a particular substance in order to 
discourage its further use. Anyone who has viewed Stanley Kubrick’s A 
Clockwork Orange is familiar with this form of negative conditioning. 
However, Receptor Blockers are far more drastic as the compounds directly 
enter the bloodstream to short circuit the addictive process by using 
”antagonists” and other agents to permanently neutralize and/or inhibit the 
ability of the brain’s receptor sites to process psychoactive drugs. 
Similarly, Molecule Binders are designed to bind like antibodies to the 
molecules of illegal substances rendering them incapable of penetrating the 
blood-brain barrier.
The study places great emphasis on the fact that pharmacotherapy medications 
have the potential to significantly alter both how the drug war is perceived 
and how prohibition efforts will be conducted in the near future. In 
essence, the new approach “expands the battlefield from the Colombian coca 
farms and Middle-Eastern poppy fields to a new terrain directly inside the 
bodies and brains of drug users.” (p.6) [emphasis in the original]
The reason for this dramatic shift in strategy isn’t difficult to fathom: 
The drug war is a colossal failure. Citing recent statistics from the 
Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration (SAMSHA), the 
Center notes that an estimated 19 million Americans (age 12 and above) 
ingest some type of illegal drug each month. Thus, the federal government, 
which has long relied on punitive measures ranging from imprisonment to 
asset forfeiture in order to reduce demand for illicit drugs, is seeking to 
retake the offensive in this losing war by reprogramming the brains of 
alleged substance abusers.
snip-
Read complete article at above URL


Peace and love,
Preston Peet

”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often 
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc. 



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Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo!  Get yours free!

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Brazil To Decriminalize Drug Use On November 24
Date: November 18, 2004 at 11:55:57 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

and then there’s bush
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 5:21 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Brazil To Decriminalize Drug Use On November 24

Hi All,

Thought this would be of interest.

Brazil To Decriminalize Drug
Use On November 24
President Lula To Sign Drug Decriminalization Decree
From Alberto M. Giordano
narconews@hotmail.com
11-17-4

Weeks after some punishing setbacks for the government of Brazilian President Lula da Silva, with his Worker’s Party losing three of the flagship cities in the world for Harm Reduction policies toward drug users (São Paulo, Porto Alegre, and Curitiba), the Lula administration has finally decided to make the groundbreaking local policies go national.

According to a report in today’s Folha de São Paulo (subscription only), Lula’s government of has reached a “consensus” to step forward into a bold new era of drug policy: decriminalizing the drug user nationwide, and opening 250 safe drug use centers across the country during the year 2005.

Lula is expected to sign an executive decree on November 24, taking drug enforcement responsibilities away from police agencies, and placing the problems of drug use under the jurisdiction of the Health Ministry, which will be charged with supporting the safe drug-use centers and make Harm Reduction – a policy to reduce the harms associated with drug use – the law of the land.

Here is an excerpt from today’s report from Brazil’s largest daily newspaper:

“Policy proposal considers drug consumption as a public health problem, and no longer one for the police. The government wants to create centers for drug use.”

“By Luciana Constantino and Luri Dantas Folha de São Paulo – Brasília Bureau

“After a series of internal disagreements about drug policy, the federal government is preparing a realignment of national policy to define drug consumption as a public health problem, and not one for the police as it is today.

“There will be a presidential order creating rules for treating drug dependents, with emphasis on Harm Reduction…”

To read more of the translation, and comment on this exciting new development, head toward The Narcosphere:

http://narcosphere.narconews.com/story/2004/11/15/94326/676

From somewhere in a country called América,

Al Giordano Publisher The Narco News Bulletin http://www.narconews.com/ new email: narconews@gmail.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 18 Nov 2004 19:27:04 -0000 Issue 780
Date: November 18, 2004 at 11:53:23 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

still looks the same to me, blank, ron
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:27 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 18 Nov 2004 19:27:04 -0000 Issue 780

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] clarification
Date: November 18, 2004 at 11:50:02 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

forum:
does this exist to promote ibo as a means to w/d and subsequently lead chemically free live or is it here to promote ibo  use and other incidental drugs? not critizing, just want to know. myself, after 54 yrs of getting the hell beat out of me, losing to dope in any form, liqour, h , methadone, reefer, you name it, glue, nose inhalers and everything else under the stars, i’ve decided i want to be free of all  this crap that keeps me from living the good life, which i did for 15 yrs. i heard politics, guns, romantic stories of dope use and i wonder if  i’m in the right place.  someone care to clue me in?  hate to be wasting you guys’ time  with my quest. thanks, persoonally , i thing drugs suck.  i d/n want to be at the mercy of  some doc, drug, snitch , or bottle.  not a moral issue, just my feelings about me..
everyone’s got an opinion. this shit has destroyed my life , family and possibly carreer and stripped me of every shred of dignity i ever possessed. perhaps many of you have not had the same experience.  god bless you for it. i hope it doesn’t strike. i’m just an ex-con who got lucky and made it thru the 60’s and 70’s and then law school.  then i got bit by the snake again and life sucks.let me know if i’m at the right place, please.  if not, i’ll bail and you guys can have at it.
rwd , trying to stay alive, thanks

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 18, 2004 at 10:45:58 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the suggestion, but being a fond lover of smoking herb with or without cigarettes, and having actually tried that before to no avail, I’m afraid that ain’t gonna cut it either.
I’ve also tried substuting clove cigs for tobacco, but that really, really didn’t cut it either.
It’s been quite some time I’ve been discussing this here, and it sounds the same as always, like I’m a weak ass git who can’t find self-control.
Sorry, I’m feeling a bit off-balance and angry at myself for this and that reason. I can’t seem to find it in myself to open up much about it (having tried a number of time to do so here but ending up deleting the message before hitting send), finding myself embarrassed and hateful and sad, but this is about as far as I feel like taking it publicly. Suffice it to say, I’m going to take ibogaine again at some point, as I believe I’ve recently noted, but wonder- will this, as with every other freakin’ fucking “treatment” I’ve ever tried turn into one of these stupid, “oh well, nuther failed effort” things? Am I weak? Or am I simply supposed to be taking my drugs in the most effective manner possible and should just tell the rest of the world to fuck the hell off? I mean, I seem to be doing fairly well for the most part, other than for this irritating, complicating love of drug effects, foreign molecules, and other socially unacceptable things and behaviors. And even with those I’m doing fairly well, besides having to deal with the complications of trying to do my substances in the way I find most effective without feeling too guilty and fucked up about it- and worst of all, finding myself hiding it from the people I care most about in the entire world because, well, most of you (with some possible exceptions who will remain unnamed by me for now) understand what I’m talking about and where I’m coming from.
Anyway, love to you all.
(How can life suck so bad at the same time things are going so fucking well?)

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 1:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some ganja instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive, physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke. Maybe herb could help…

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (WAY OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 18, 2004 at 10:25:15 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith wrote to Randy very publicly here on the ibogaine list:

Randy, you need to hook up with Michael Moore or someone from the ACLU.<

Faith-
What, out of curiosity, does this comment have to do with A: Drugs, B: addiction, C: getting off drugs, D: ibogaine, E: anything at all that I personally (as that’s the only one I can really talk about with any knowlege) might be interested in or care about?
I don’t mind the off topic stuff, being highly guilty of posting it constantly, but I usually add that “OT” in the heading, so others will know they aren’t reading anything remotely pertaining to the list topics.
What are you talking about Faith?
I mean, Faith, what are you contributing here on the ibogaine list at all beside rancor, unease, and dissension? Are you intentionally going out of your way to prove my own views of Republican-minded types?

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 10:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

Randy, you need to hook up with Michael Moore or someone from the ACLU. Faith

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2004 07:15:52 EST

Man I was asleep at the wheel. Free drugs? What kinda drugs? They got any
DMT? Hook us up Faith.             Randy

_________________________________________________________________
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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,
Date: November 18, 2004 at 8:32:30 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston,

I meant ” that to this point nothing unexpected has yet happened,
Thanks for the update.”

Thanks for the correction,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: donderdag 18 november 2004 21:44
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,

nothing unexpected until now.<

Hi Sara,
I suspect this is one of the language difference things, but what do you

mean by “until now”? Do you mean something unexpected is happening, or that
to this point nothing unexpected has yet happened?
Thanks for the update.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 5:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,

Greetings from Jason and me, all is well around here, nothing unexpected
until now.

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:
Date: November 18, 2004 at 6:28:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston,

Tell me, if you know, if someone was to vaccinated for opiates let’s say at 15 years old, then at 16 years old get in a terriable accident like burns over 50% of their body or something should happen that causes severe pain, would they be able to give them anything for pain that would work?  Just wondering, it is something to think about.

Best to all

– JIM

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
HI all,
With the recent news breaking about vaccinating druggies to stop them
from even being able to get high in the first place, I post this excerpt
from DrugWar.com’s latest expose, posted this morning, (Nov. 16, 2004).
Long-time contributor to DrugWar.com and a contributor to Under the
Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs, Cletus Nelson has painted an
ugly picture of the strides being made to not only tell us what we can and
can’t do with our minds, but the efforts to physically alter our brains and
bodies to insure we comply with prohibitionist insanities.
Peace and love to all,
Preston

http://www.drugwar.com/cpandora.shtm
Opening Pandora’s Box:
Anti-Drug Vaccines Gather Momentum
by Cletus Nelson
for DrugWar.com
Nov. 16, 2004

Back in 2002, DrugWar.com addressed a disturbing new strategy in the war on
drugs: The development of anti-drug “vaccines” capable of permanently
blunting the effects of mind-altering substances. The article
(“Headshrinking the American Addict”), discussed how the National Institute
on Drug Abuse (NIDA) in partnership with various corporate and public
entities was spending millions developing this supposed “cure” for the
“disease” of addiction. The sheer scope of this neuro-political endeavor,
which sounds like something out of a futuristic science fiction thriller,
generated more than a few incredulous responses from skeptical readers. Yet
some two years later, this far flung experiment in social control is gaining
traction among prohibitionists.
SOUNDING THE ALARM
Over the past year, the anti-drug agents, or “pharmacotherapy” drugs, have
drawn the attention of the Northern California-based Center for Cognitive
Liberty and Ethics (CCLE). This spring, the Center distilled their research
into a compelling 52-page report that makes for some truly disturbing
reading. Titled Threats to Cognitive Liberty: Pharmacotherapy and the Future
of the Drug War,” the well researched position paper comes to the unsettling
conclusion that within the next decade this once speculative venture is
destined to become a reality. Indeed, the report predicts that the
medically-based approach to countering drug abuse will “tremendously impact”
the strategic focus of both American and International drug control
strategies. Moreover, the CCLE warn that this ominous development will
engender a “striking expansion of the state’s policing mechanism on at least
two fronts: 1) from external policing to internal policing; and 2) from
restraining a person’s body and behavior, to directly restraining a person’s
thoughts and thought processes.” (p. 41)
These aren’t the ruminations of a crew of stoners swapping conspiracy
theories over bong hits in the back of a van, but the opinion of a
nationally recognized organization of experts in such diverse fields as
science, law, ethics, and medicine. While it is hoped that the Center’s
learned observations will engender greater public debate about the vaccines,
this authoritative document is also invaluable as it explores the underlying
motivations behind this backdoor attempt by government officials to claim
ownership to our minds.

NEW WEAPONS, SAME WAR
The CCLE identify three types of vaccines currently in development; Receptor
Blockers, Molecule Binders, and Metabolism Modifiers. Most Americans are
familiar with the latter group as they include anti-drinking medications
such as the highly popular Antabuse which is often prescribed for
alcoholism. The goal of these compounds is merely to induce intense
discomfort when an individual imbibes a particular substance in order to
discourage its further use. Anyone who has viewed Stanley Kubrick’s A
Clockwork Orange is familiar with this form of negative conditioning.
However, Receptor Blockers are far more drastic as the compounds directly
enter the bloodstream to short circuit the addictive process by using
“antagonists” and other agents to permanently neutralize and/or inhibit the
ability of the brain’s receptor sites to process psychoactive drugs.
Similarly, Molecule Binders are designed to bind like antibodies to the
molecules of illegal substances rendering them incapable of penetrating the
blood-brain barrier.
The study places great emphasis on the fact that pharmacotherapy medications
have the potential to significantly alter both how the drug war is perceived
and how prohibition efforts will be conducted in the near future. In
essence, the new approach “expands the battlefield from the Colombian coca
farms and Middle-Eastern poppy fields to a new terrain directly inside the
bodies and brains of drug users.” (p.6) [emphasis in the original]
The reason for this dramatic shift in strategy isn’t difficult to fathom:
The drug war is a colossal failure. Citing recent statistics from the
Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration (SAMSHA), the
Center notes that an estimated 19 million Americans (age 12 and above)
ingest some type of illegal drug each month. Thus, the federal government,
which has long relied on punitive measures ranging from imprisonment to
asset forfeiture in order to reduce demand for illicit drugs, is seeking to
retake the offensive in this losing war by reprogramming the brains of
alleged substance abusers.
snip-
Read complete article at above URL

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Brazil To Decriminalize Drug Use On November 24
Date: November 18, 2004 at 6:21:01 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi All,

Thought this would be of interest.

Brazil To Decriminalize Drug
Use On November 24
President Lula To Sign Drug Decriminalization Decree
From Alberto M. Giordano
narconews@hotmail.com
11-17-4

Weeks after some punishing setbacks for the government of Brazilian President Lula da Silva, with his Worker’s Party losing three of the flagship cities in the world for Harm Reduction policies toward drug users (São Paulo, Porto Alegre, and Curitiba), the Lula administration has finally decided to make the groundbreaking local policies go national.

According to a report in today’s Folha de São Paulo (subscription only), Lula’s government of has reached a “consensus” to step forward into a bold new era of drug policy: decriminalizing the drug user nationwide, and opening 250 safe drug use centers across the country during the year 2005.

Lula is expected to sign an executive decree on November 24, taking drug enforcement responsibilities away from police agencies, and placing the problems of drug use under the jurisdiction of the Health Ministry, which will be charged with supporting the safe drug-use centers and make Harm Reduction – a policy to reduce the harms associated with drug use – the law of the land.

Here is an excerpt from today’s report from Brazil’s largest daily newspaper:

“Policy proposal considers drug consumption as a public health problem, and no longer one for the police. The government wants to create centers for drug use.”

“By Luciana Constantino and Luri Dantas Folha de São Paulo – Brasília Bureau

“After a series of internal disagreements about drug policy, the federal government is preparing a realignment of national policy to define drug consumption as a public health problem, and not one for the police as it is today.

“There will be a presidential order creating rules for treating drug dependents, with emphasis on Harm Reduction…”

To read more of the translation, and comment on this exciting new development, head toward The Narcosphere:

http://narcosphere.narconews.com/story/2004/11/15/94326/676

From somewhere in a country called América,

Al Giordano Publisher The Narco News Bulletin http://www.narconews.com/ new email: narconews@gmail.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
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http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 18, 2004 at 6:09:09 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Everyone,

If you want to read a GREAT book that talks about reincarnation and other things I would suggest “There is a River”.  It is a book about Edgar Casey.  The A.R.E. (Association for Research and Enlightenment) has a web page you may want to check out.  In my opinion reincarnation can never be proven or disproven, it is just something you believe or don’t believe or openminded or closeminded about.  Regardless of if there is or is not reincarnation does not necessary mean that there is life after death or not.  Some people believe in heaven and hell without believeing in reincarnation.  I have talked with this with people and in a way it does not really matter for there is nothing you can do about it one way or the other.  I will say the book is one of my all time favorites.  You can even get it to read for free at the library.  If you are interested in the subject you will love the book.

Best to all,

– JIM
Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
Hi Julie, Francis, Andy, Preston, Hannah and all,

Time to light a candle, Jasen is doing fine, he will be getting the bigger
dose tonight, But he has no withdrawals and he is day dreaming on the test
dose.

Greetings from Jasen to everyone.
You are a great supportive group of people,
Thanks,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: maandag 15 november 2004 19:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

You wrote :
I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable. Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Here you will find some proof:.

http://www.childpastlives.org/stevenson.htm

Its interesting to note that the first Christians used to believe in
reincarnation and A.D. 250 to 553 the contreversy raged. You can investigate
the Gnostics too that had several gospels older than ours gospel and where
discover in 1945.The mystical school of the Sufism for the Musulmans. The
secret Mystical Chabbalist school of the Jews The Bouddhist, Hinduist ect..
most of the planet believe in reincarnation.

Dr. Stevenson investigates more than 3000 cases of reincarnations and wrote
several books on the subject.
I have been doing past-life regression for several years. My clients are not
surprised when they find out who they where and their lives start to make
sense in the light of their new knowledge. We are here to progress, and we
can relax and enjoy the adventure, no rush 🙂 Did I make make sense?/!

God bless
Francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga”
To:
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

> Martee,
>
> I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
> literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic. Dreams
> of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
> body’s metaphoric release from addiction. Dreams of
> my childhood town could be the expression of my
> body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
> state.
>
> I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
> romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable. Part of me
> wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
> mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
> skeptical part of me resists.
>
> Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
> your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
> physical/psychological state- in other words, the
> message we need WHEN we need it…
>
> my 2 cents,
> Julie
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
> www.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
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>

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 18, 2004 at 5:11:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You were talking about rural gun owners. What the stats on that. They DO NOT shoot what is not a threat period. These people live with firearms. I’m not talking about someone in the city who never shoots and only got a permit to keep a gun around. I’m talking about people like me. We practice. A lot. We make sure of our backdrop and we teach our kids and our family how to defend themselves. Times have always been tough. Sooner or later even supposed NRA guys like Bush will go for gun ownership. Power and control they want to take away from a free society.     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Randy
Date: November 18, 2004 at 5:02:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, I know I was being cheeky too. Half the shit I say here is spost to be funny, or at least it makes me laugh. You don’t have to worry about us, your in our hearts too.  Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] guns??
Date: November 18, 2004 at 4:56:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, I’m southern and try to be a gentleman when I can. I just think any guy who would do something like that ought to be shot. Maybe not killed but shoot his ass in the ……….. well, you know what I mean. I’m into martial arts too and think that women would be letting the attacker get too close for hand to hand combat. But all training would be for the good. Guns  sounds like a drastic act but something drastic should be done.    Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 18, 2004 at 4:25:48 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi  Hedwig,

I will write to you email.

Groeten

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: hedwig [mailto:hokkerman@wanadoo.nl]
Verzonden: donderdag 18 november 2004 10:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Hello,
I am hedwig and looking for ibogaine-treatment in Holland
I heard from Ben de Loenen that Sara Glatt is the one I should ask.
and now I see your name on this ibogaine-list
can you contact me please ,sara?
greetings from Holland

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From: “sarah” <sarah@room1.fsnet.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,
Date: November 18, 2004 at 3:43:52 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If you have any questions just email me … Kind Regards
—– Original Message —–
From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 10:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,

Greetings from Jason and me, all is well around here, nothing unexpected until now.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,
Date: November 18, 2004 at 3:43:33 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

nothing unexpected until now.<

Hi Sara,
I suspect this is one of the language difference things, but what do you mean by “until now”? Do you mean something unexpected is happening, or that to this point nothing unexpected has yet happened?
Thanks for the update.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 18, 2004 5:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,

Greetings from Jason and me, all is well around here, nothing unexpected until now.

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Off-topic- George W appeared on my grilled cheese sandwich!
Date: November 18, 2004 at 12:16:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The bids are currently at $6,000 and rising!! Enjoy
the face of the quote-unquote Leader of the Free
World, immortalized on bread and cheese!!

ha!

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Meet the all-new My Yahoo! – Try it today!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: CrookedEye420@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 18, 2004 at 1:57:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Never hurt me to quit, but after a few days without smoking, if I buy a pack and start up again, or if I bum a few smokes, they now irritate my throat.  I do get edgy sometimes, but Cannabis relieves my urge to smoke cigs and it helps calm my nerves.

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From: CrookedEye420@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 18, 2004 at 1:49:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I found that when I get the urge to smoke a cig, I just fire up some ganja instead and it relieves the urge, plus is safer and less addictive, physically.  I only want a cigarette when I don’t have herb to smoke.  Maybe herb could help…

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From: “sarah” <sarah@room1.fsnet.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee
Date: November 18, 2004 at 11:37:15 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It was just to let you know that www.iboga.co.uk is up for sale with www.sedo.com .
Regards
—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 11:14 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee

I accidentally erased all my messages, and I didn’t get the chance to reply to your post.  Please send me your email address, and I’ll drop you a line…

Julie
__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778
Date: November 18, 2004 at 11:10:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, your messages about downloading and secret handshakes are
unintelligible. If I may guess, the benzos may not be your friend
here.. it’s all pretty open, no big secrets that I know of (and
I’ve been around for a few years). Take care.

On Wed, 17 Nov 2004 20:26:42 -0800 Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
cannot download. how was my “probe”? thought it felt stimulating,
but maybe
that was just benzos.
—– Original Message —–
From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778

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secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 18, 2004 at 10:52:03 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy, you need to hook up with Michael Moore or someone from the ACLU.  Faith

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: Wed, 17 Nov 2004 07:15:52 EST

Man I was asleep at the wheel. Free drugs? What kinda drugs? They got any
DMT? Hook us up Faith.             Randy

_________________________________________________________________
Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 18, 2004 at 9:49:15 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I will, Honey.

Love to Jasen and my boy and every other boy making this fantastic trip!!

Mama
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 7:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Mama, light a candle for Jasen for me. Please.  Your son.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Judge Questions Long Sentence in Drug Case
Date: November 18, 2004 at 9:04:00 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

republican guidelines from a guy who fights them everyday. god help those on the bottom of the food chain.  high rollers w/ big time connections walk, users don’t b/c they d/n know the high rollers to snitch on.  federal judges have lifetime appointments to the tune of about 160k a yr.  resignation in protest may be a nice gesture, but it’s easier to send someone to prison for 55yrs than give up the country club membership. all opinions expressed are those of an elf who has taken over my legal mind and d/n necessarily reflect any criticism from professional stand. wait til the mext 4 yrs finishes with the supreme court.  might as well use your copy of the bill of rights for toilet paper.  they start with a conclusion they want and have their clerk’s work backwards to justify the argument for the changes.it will be bush’s every lasting legacy, think it’s bad now?  just wait rwd—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 6:03 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Judge Questions Long Sentence in Drug Case

Judge Questions Long Sentence in Drug Case

By NICK MADIGAN

Published: November 17, 2004

ALT LAKE CITY, Nov. 16 – In a case that has spurred intense soul-searching in legal circles, a 25-year-old convicted drug dealer, who was arrested two years ago for selling small bags of marijuana to a police informant, was sentenced on Tuesday to 55 years in prison.
The judge who sentenced him, Paul G. Cassell of the United States District Court here, said that he pronounced the sentence “reluctantly” but that his hands were tied by a mandatory-minimum law that required the imposition of 55 years on Weldon H. Angelos because he had a gun during at least two of the drug transactions.

“I have no choice,” Judge Cassell said to Mr. Angelos, who seemed frozen in place as the extent of the sentence became apparent.

The judge then urged Mr. Angelos’s lawyer, Jerome H. Mooney, not only to appeal his decision but to ask President Bush for clemency once all appeals were exhausted. He also urged Congress to set aside the law that made the sentence mandatory.

Judge Cassell said that sentencing Mr. Angelos to prison until he is 70 years old was “unjust, cruel and even irrational,” but that the law that forced him to do so had not proved to be unconstitutional and thus had to stand. The sentence was all the more ironic, he said, because only two hours earlier he had been legally able to impose a sentence of 22 years on a man convicted of aggravated second-degree murder for beating an elderly woman to death with a log. That crime, he argued, was far more serious.

Mr. Angelos’s wife, Zandrah, who sat in court with the couple’s two boys, aged 5 and 7, began crying. “He might as well have killed someone,” she said bitterly, wiping her eyes, referring to her husband. “He should have done worse than he did if he was going to get 55 years.”

snip-

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 18, 2004 at 8:50:20 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

‘splains my behavior, ron
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 12:56:17 -0800 “Ann B. Mullikin”
<think@francomm.com> wrote:
There’s a recent study showing that soybeans double the chance
of dementia in older men, presumably because they contain an
analogue of estrogen. Younger men weren’t studied.

I’m not familiar with that study, would love to see it.  I will do

a search.

It was done in Hawaii.

It just happens that all men have estrogen in their bodies.  All
women have testosterone in their bodies.

Yes, it’s all a question of quantity. Thanks for the added details
about metabolic pathways etc.

Dr. Barry Sears (The Zone Diet) wrote a book entitled, “The Soy
Zone.” He is a PhD Biochemist.  He wrote this book to help
vegetarians
follow his Zone Diet.  He considers Soy a complete protein.

My understanding was that soy is not complete protein, needs a
grain to complement it, and that non-meat diets require a source

of
B12 which means vitamin pills or brewer’s yeast. This was based
on ”
Diet for a Small Planet,” which summed up research 30 years ago.

I have both the books, “Diet for a Small Planet and Recipes for a
Small Planet” On page 159 of “Diet For a Small Plalnet:  “Myth No.
4…..The usability of egg and milk protein is greater than that
of meat ,
and the usability of soy protein is about equal to that of meat.”

Other kinds of beans are not as good a source of protein

According to my memory of Lappe, the best beans are adukis, the
next are garbanzos or mung, and soybeans follow somewhere after
that. For me in later years, garbanzos have the best combination of
digestibility and protein.

but by adding grains or milk, etc.  a complete protein is formed
with
some carbs left over.

I believe that grains were claimed to be the far superior
complement to beans, and that the ratio for a balanced protein was
on the order of 3:2 grain:beans. I have been following this for
about 30 years now, although after 20 years I began eating meat
again sometimes for convenience.

Lately I have read that quinoa is the best grain for acid/alkali
balance, and have begun eating it as well as brown rice.

Nowadays I also minimize spice, sugar and salt intake as these are
said to interfere with ayahuasca.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] guns??
Date: November 18, 2004 at 8:46:38 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

color me a benign sniper, well equipped for bush’s urban assault, rwd
—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 2:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] guns??

Instead of giving guns out to women, why not make martial arts/self-defense training mandatory(and free!) to all girls aged 7 and over?  That way, by the time they hit 13-14, and the guys start sniffing around, they will be well equipped to kick their asses, if needs be.

I love the fact that people can’t pack heat(legally) here in Canada, with the exceptions of shotguns, 303’s and 30-ought-6’s, for the hunting contingency, which is strictly regulated.

J.

Do you Yahoo!?
Discover all that’s new in My Yahoo!

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779
Date: November 18, 2004 at 8:45:05 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

c/n download…got the key?
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 9:29 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 15:29:37 -0000 Issue 779

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [Ibogaine] RE: Jasen,
Date: November 18, 2004 at 5:16:28 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Greetings from Jason and me, all is well around here, nothing unexpected until now.

From: “hedwig” <hokkerman@wanadoo.nl>
Subject: [Ibogaine] suscribe
Date: November 18, 2004 at 5:03:37 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I want to receive the mindvox mailing list
because yesterday i subscribed

From: “hedwig” <hokkerman@wanadoo.nl>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 18, 2004 at 4:02:48 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello,
I am hedwig and looking for ibogaine-treatment in Holland
I heard from Ben de Loenen that Sara Glatt is the one I should ask.
and now I see your name on this ibogaine-list
can you contact me please ,sara?
greetings from Holland

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778
Date: November 17, 2004 at 11:26:42 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

cannot download. how was my “probe”? thought it felt stimulating, but maybe that was just benzos.
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee
Date: November 17, 2004 at 6:14:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I accidentally erased all my messages, and I didn’t get the chance to reply to your post.  Please send me your email address, and I’ll drop you a line…

Julie
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778
Date: November 17, 2004 at 3:46:06 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

c/n download. is there a secret handshake?
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 17, 2004 at 3:44:13 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i am the proud educated , non hunting(nowadays) of several preban weapons that are all legal and safely stored away from my home. i keep a cheap greasy .22 pistol that is worthless to a pawn broker or crack dealer in a place that a burglar or home invader will not find but i certainly will. in thru the ring finger , out thru the knee.  wonderful round. torso shot of course. am i on point randy?  you seem to be in the know. rd
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 17, 2004 12:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 05:32:30 -0800 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
I can’t figure out what rural gun owners have to do with homeland
security.

Possibly that was a demographic that voted for Bush? (No time to re-
read the editorial now, sorry.)

Are you implying that all rural gun owners are uneducated and
uninformed?

I’m not saying everything in the editorial, mainly quoting it
because it points out that the states at least risk (and getting
the most defense money) have turned out the more vulnerable ones to
the wolves by confirming Bush’s make-more-terrorists policy.

Being
from the South I can state most emphatically that this is just not

true. I
grew up hunting and I think everyone should have some gun safety
training. When
you live on a farm firearms are tools you use. That will never
change. Nobody
gets home invaded “down home.” And (and this will surely piss
someone off) I
think every women who is not insane or convicted of violet crime
should
automatically get a concealed to carry license. Wonder what that
would do to rape
stats?    Randy

The stats on gun ownership are that mainly people close to the
owner get killed. Maybe it’s more the case in the cities where a
gun has fewer everyday uses and so is more like a totemic object
from the tv set that magically solves problems.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 17, 2004 at 3:42:40 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

love that stuff. like red beans and rice, everything nice.

bisquits and gravy, too!

:^) _.dh

On Tuesday, November 16, 2004, at 10:52 AM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

What’s wrong with chicken and cornbread?       Randy

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Randy
Date: November 17, 2004 at 3:14:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

Please don’t take what I said about cornbred and fried chicken as a slight against you.    I was being a bit cheeky, as the news report really pissed me off.  Stereotyping is an ugly thing to do, but so easy when you’re angry.  I only have the greatest respect for you and your mom…

luv Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 17, 2004 at 3:12:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

<Last I heard, nicotine is the most addictive substance known. There 
are some reports of people unexpectedly quitting smoking after 
iboga. >
I used to smoke casually while on opiates.  After doing Ibogaine, I simply can not fathom putting that shite to my lips EVER AGAIN.
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] guns??
Date: November 17, 2004 at 3:09:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Instead of giving guns out to women, why not make martial arts/self-defense training mandatory(and free!) to all girls aged 7 and over?  That way, by the time they hit 13-14, and the guys start sniffing around, they will be well equipped to kick their asses, if needs be.

I love the fact that people can’t pack heat(legally) here in Canada, with the exceptions of shotguns, 303’s and 30-ought-6’s, for the hunting contingency, which is strictly regulated.

J.

Do you Yahoo!?
Discover all that’s new in My Yahoo!

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] also missing in action
Date: November 17, 2004 at 2:03:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hey, howz about anyone heard from Brett C lately? haven’t heard a peep from him in many months.

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 17, 2004 at 2:00:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

aw shucks. thanks :^)
_.dh

p.s. for whatever its worth, i also drank a glass of water every time i craved a smoke. not only did this help the craving, but it helped start to flush that crap outta my body.

On Wednesday, November 17, 2004, at 02:25 AM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

Dave, I gotta get some licorice sticks. I could have quit smoking after Ibo but pretty much started again to give me something to do in idle times (Beavis you dumb ass, don’t make me smack you). I will quit though. Guys like you are an inspiration to me. I was checking out your art the other day(again) and it is amazing. I can’t make a stick man look right.    Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 17, 2004 at 1:49:28 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

All is well around here. Jason had  some back pain around his kidneys,
He got some special thee. And a little while later he was ok.
He sends his love to all of you who make a wish for him.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: woensdag 17 november 2004 1:36
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

go Jasen, go Sara.
I’ll play some good music for Jasen tonight while dj’ing.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 8:30 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Hi Julie, Francis, Andy, Preston, Hannah and all,

Time to light a candle, Jasen is doing fine, he will be getting the bigger
dose tonight, But he has no withdrawals and he is day dreaming on the test
dose.

Greetings from Jasen to everyone.
You are a great supportive group of people,
Thanks,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: maandag 15 november 2004 19:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

You wrote :
I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Here you will find  some  proof:.

http://www.childpastlives.org/stevenson.htm

Its interesting to note that the first Christians used to believe in
reincarnation and A.D. 250 to 553 the contreversy raged. You can
investigate
the Gnostics too that had several gospels older than ours gospel and where
discover in 1945.The mystical school of the Sufism for the Musulmans. The
secret Mystical Chabbalist school of the Jews The Bouddhist, Hinduist
ect..
most of the planet believe in reincarnation.

Dr. Stevenson investigates more than 3000 cases of reincarnations and
wrote
several books on the subject.
I have been doing past-life regression for several years. My clients are
not
surprised when they find out who they where and their lives start to make
sense in the light of their new knowledge. We are here to progress, and we
can relax and enjoy the adventure, no rush 🙂  Did I make make sense?/!

God bless
Francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 17, 2004 at 1:40:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I read that cigarettes
and heroin share the
same brain receptors.  So can we say, intensity, not
to be taken lightly or
shrugged at.

I have respect for those that have been able to pulled
it off and those struggling w/ it.

Just wondering about some of the factors that make it
so difficult.

That’s interesting about the brain receptors.

<__ newports and back scratches : )_>

I quit when on methadone.  Stopped inhaling cigs
except for the first part; at first: half, then
quarter, etc.
I stayed at 1-2 inhales for about 6 months, then no
inhales when ‘bumming’ during social settings where
the urge seemed to increase.
I eventually decided the hassle, cost, and health
effects (and lots o’ chemicals) weren’t worth (to me
what seemed to be) not getting high, a little more
relaxed, but when on benzo’s and methadone while
smoking cannabis like tobacco, I didn’t seem to mind
as much.

Is ibogaine as effective for cig addiction as H
addiciton, since the receptor action is common?

___________________________________________________________
ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun! http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 17, 2004 at 11:24:06 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 14:15:52 -0800 Hannah Clay
<hannah.clay@ntlworld.com> wrote:
Yeh where’s Callie and Sean?

I second that – maybe they got dropped over mail bouncing? Yoohoo
guys.. you still here?

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FAITH
Date: November 17, 2004 at 11:20:45 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Tue, 16 Nov 2004 13:46:11 -0800 Hannah Clay
<hannah.clay@ntlworld.com> wrote:
Oh for Godsake-this is a newsgroup about IBOGAINE.

Most come to talk/learn about ibogaine, many stay for the
conversation 🙂

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 17, 2004 at 11:04:24 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 12:56:17 -0800 “Ann B. Mullikin”
<think@francomm.com> wrote:
There’s a recent study showing that soybeans double the chance
of dementia in older men, presumably because they contain an
analogue of estrogen. Younger men weren’t studied.

I’m not familiar with that study, would love to see it.  I will do

a search.

It was done in Hawaii.

It just happens that all men have estrogen in their bodies.  All
women have testosterone in their bodies.

Yes, it’s all a question of quantity. Thanks for the added details
about metabolic pathways etc.

Dr. Barry Sears (The Zone Diet) wrote a book entitled, “The Soy
Zone.” He is a PhD Biochemist.  He wrote this book to help
vegetarians
follow his Zone Diet.  He considers Soy a complete protein.

My understanding was that soy is not complete protein, needs a
grain to complement it, and that non-meat diets require a source

of
B12 which means vitamin pills or brewer’s yeast. This was based
on ”
Diet for a Small Planet,” which summed up research 30 years ago.

I have both the books, “Diet for a Small Planet and Recipes for a
Small Planet” On page 159 of “Diet For a Small Plalnet:  “Myth No.
4…..The usability of egg and milk protein is greater than that
of meat ,
and the usability of soy protein is about equal to that of meat.”

Other kinds of beans are not as good a source of protein

According to my memory of Lappe, the best beans are adukis, the
next are garbanzos or mung, and soybeans follow somewhere after
that. For me in later years, garbanzos have the best combination of
digestibility and protein.

but by adding grains or milk, etc.  a complete protein is formed
with
some carbs left over.

I believe that grains were claimed to be the far superior
complement to beans, and that the ratio for a balanced protein was
on the order of 3:2 grain:beans. I have been following this for
about 30 years now, although after 20 years I began eating meat
again sometimes for convenience.

Lately I have read that quinoa is the best grain for acid/alkali
balance, and have begun eating it as well as brown rice.

Nowadays I also minimize spice, sugar and salt intake as these are
said to interfere with ayahuasca.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 17, 2004 at 10:43:12 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 08:14:52 -0800 Faith Bowling
<bchloej@hotmail.com> wrote:
Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to addicts to vote,
and underwear to homeless. (peoplw without rent or house payments)

in exchange for their vote.

Faith, do you have a source for this information? Bear in mind that
people who would not vote otherwise would have to be enticed to
register in advance of the election, then be located again on the
day of election.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream/Booker
Date: November 17, 2004 at 10:40:43 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Just wanted to acknowledge your post and let you know that you are one of many I have heard that same scenario about not being born jewish.  My brother has this belief that jewish souls are always jewish(he’s a rabbi). Personally I haven’t taken that one to heart.  But his theory is that after the holocust there did not exist the jewish families for all these souls to go to.  I’m just sayin! But I do believe in the resonance of past life experiences that carry over into this one.
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: booker w
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 3:27 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Hi.  Very interesting about the holocaust stuff.  I’ve often felt I was in the holocaust as well.  As a kid I was intensely interested in reading about concentration camps and was always “fascinated” with the jewish religion – I remember being very disappointed that I wasn’t born jewish.  Top that off with my first real panic attack occured while reading QBVII – a book about the holocaust and trials later.  I’m a baby- boomer too…
My dreams after ibogaine were so incredibly intense and vivid and as tho I was “experiencing” them in a much more direct manner than normal.  But also, I felt that even before taking the substance I experienced vivid dreams, just knowing ibo was going to come into my life.  Upon making the decision each time, I would experience very synchronistic events and dreams.  In fact it was several dreams that led and convinced me to try ibogaine as well.  Makes me believe that the chemical part of ibo isn’t really all of it.  I think there is so much more to the experience than just the chemistry… as probably with many things – one reason I think it is such an utter waste of time to test it on animals.  We seem to focus so much just on the physical.  I also have always had the impression that ibo is just a sort of “gate” to a more accurate realm of existence, which is where healing and things outside of time can take place.  Like seeing a dead relative, the future, or various forms of healing.  Hence the “restart.”
Anyway, that’s my ramble – whatever happened to Callie?
Best to Julie and Jasen.  Fakeplacebo too.  Hope you get to where you want to be.
Sandy

>      I believe your dream sounded a lot like holocaust stuff.  I have always felt I was in the holocaust as does my sister and brother in law.  I have had this confirmed but not by my own regression.  My theory is that  a lot of the baby boomers were holocaust victims that were taken out before their time.As a kid I had dreams of being hunted by nazis,gas and thinking I’d be better off blonde.  This could also be generational stuff that kids pick up on. I believe the dream about visiting where you grew up and those long journeys are what is referred to as astral visits.

>      I think dreams are a way to reveal stuff, release stuff, get prayers across and answered.  You know the brain is kind of a new frontier.  One of the ongoing conversations I’ve had with my nephew since he was 6 was, What do you think we could do if we had full use of our brain?  I believe our actual usage is less than 15%.  I could be wrong and that may not be exact but it’s something I’ve heard repeatedly.  Again no reference note available.  I personally believe we can heal ourselves from anything, replicate damage organs and regenerate damaged limbs.  If a reptile can do it….

>     The whole purpose of the past life regression is not just to have a look see, but to acknowledge the source of todays pain which enables one to release it easier.

>      I’m done rambling for now.  Thanks for the response.

>                                                                     Martee

>

>   —– Original Message —–

>   From: Ms Iboga

>   To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>   Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:40 AM

>   Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

>

>

>   Martee,

>

>   I’m 26, but I alternate between 18 and 50, depending on the circumstances…I think my circadian rhythm is still screwed up, and this is why I have such vivid recollections of my dreams.  I can get to the deep sleep, but when the cycle starts again, and I return to lighter levels, my body automatically wakes up

>

>   Last night I dreamed I was a prisoner in an internment camp, nested between two huge mountains.  I had a daughter that was at least my own age(I have no kids), and a husband that was imprisoned in the male section.  Anyone trying to escape was shot either through the heart or the neck with a flaming arrow.  My last memory of the dream, before I awoke, was of running furiously, out the front gate of the prison; running so fast I could feel and smell the perspiration on my skin!  Has anyone else experienced vivid smells, colours, etc..?  I’ve heard we only dream in black and white, but I don’t believe this at all.

>

>   Martee, do you practice hypnosis?  I would love to chat more with you about dreams/past life regressions.  I think this is a very cool topic, and thanks for bringing it up….

>

>   Julie

>

>

>   __________________________________________________

>   Do You Yahoo!?

>   Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around

>   http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778
Date: November 17, 2004 at 10:02:24 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

can’t open, ron  help?
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 17 Nov 2004 01:51:41 -0000 Issue 778

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FAITH
Date: November 17, 2004 at 9:59:36 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

your right hannah, let them watch fox news
—– Original Message —– From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 3:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FAITH

Oh for Godsake-this is a newsgroup about IBOGAINE.

It is also INTERNATIONAL

Us people across the water are TERRIFIED by the results of your election and
couldn’t imagine how it happened!  Thanks to your posts and the info on the
Black Boxes I’m starting to understand.

Your president CREATED this wartime.

If you really wanted to help your son and discuss drug addiction then shut
up about Bush-I’m sure even you have realised by now how WE ALL feel on
this-stop antagonising us!

Either leave or show some interest in DRUG ADDICTION!

Sincerely,
Hannah Clay
UK
—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted
form
the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats okay I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found
this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

>From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
>Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600
>
>i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain
>understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the
day
>ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out
of
>here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
>concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.
>what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley
about
>computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i >figure
>with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.
>thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but
>don’t know how, ron
>   —– Original Message —–
>   From: m.finman
>   To: ibo
>   Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
>   Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
>
>
>   I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in
>the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool >for
>onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I
>would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the >ability
>to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
>        After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory
>experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams,
>feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced
twice
>the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5
years
>worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well >as
>the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I
>needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never
>ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had
>one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
>something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all
>fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when
you’ve
>done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It
was
>NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I
had
>in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled
>too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana
high.
>I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12
>years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican
>restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. >and
>it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I
liked
>it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing
the
>combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
>experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of
>what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for
right
>now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
>         So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their
>dream state.
>   I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we
>hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to
no
>meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we
can
>understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those
>books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their
>own perceptions.
>        Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain
that’s
>different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any
>technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
>                 In advance I thank you,                Martee
>     Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll > let
>you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee®
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 17, 2004 at 9:47:29 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hey guys :
discuss thias stuff w/ guns on pvt. email.  ist, the moderators , which may be one of you , can read every thing, secondly, big brudder flocks to these forums.  nsa has an 11 sq. mile mainframe that’ll smoke anything you can think of, the patriot  ansd homeland security act are in gfll swing and we have 4 more yrs. of a bush baby  mandate.  there are spies in the sky.  i n my line of work, we’ve caught them in the act.  be cool, don’t turn this thing into the watergate tapes. rwd..the dea has listening devices that can p/u a conversation from inside a concrete room from the outside.  .22 is a lady killer, greasy little round, goes in your hand and comes out your foot and easy to handle.  i speak  from experience. if the ibo  path is to enlightenment and to get us clean and off the man’s dope so we can think again, we have to stay current. just one ex- junkie’s educated opinion.  some may have other ideas and think i’m whacko.  i am.
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 3:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states

Martee, I agree 100 per cent on what you say about will and intent and also about being trained. I think anyone who gets the carry permit should be trained and have to prove they can hit what comes their way, under stress. Also about being chosen because the weak are the easiest target. All women should read the Art of War too. The translated Chinese version. Being trained and educated about defense builds confidence and maybe some of this terrible stuff that befalls women will finally stop.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 17, 2004 at 7:44:06 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Mama, light a candle for Jasen for me. Please.  Your son.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] new orleans
Date: November 17, 2004 at 7:40:06 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard, I will not miss the next Ibogaine free for all.”Believe dat”. Please tell us you heard some awesome blues and jazz while you were there. I know. Have an Ibogaine conference in Amsterdam. We are there dude. Wont burn any guitars but will burn…………never mind.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 17, 2004 at 7:30:40 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve sent Callie a couple of notes over the past few months. No reply. I pray she’s all right. We need all the strong intelligent women we can get down south.     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 17, 2004 at 7:25:45 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dave, I gotta get some licorice sticks. I could have quit smoking after Ibo but pretty much started again to give me something to do in idle times (Beavis you dumb ass, don’t make me smack you). I will quit though. Guys like you are an inspiration to me. I was checking out your art the other day(again) and it is amazing. I can’t make a stick man look right.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 17, 2004 at 7:15:52 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Man I was asleep at the wheel. Free drugs? What kinda drugs? They got any DMT? Hook us up Faith.             Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Judge Questions Long Sentence in Drug Case
Date: November 17, 2004 at 7:03:35 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Judge Questions Long Sentence in Drug Case

By NICK MADIGAN

Published: November 17, 2004

ALT LAKE CITY, Nov. 16 – In a case that has spurred intense soul-searching in legal circles, a 25-year-old convicted drug dealer, who was arrested two years ago for selling small bags of marijuana to a police informant, was sentenced on Tuesday to 55 years in prison.
The judge who sentenced him, Paul G. Cassell of the United States District Court here, said that he pronounced the sentence “reluctantly” but that his hands were tied by a mandatory-minimum law that required the imposition of 55 years on Weldon H. Angelos because he had a gun during at least two of the drug transactions.

“I have no choice,” Judge Cassell said to Mr. Angelos, who seemed frozen in place as the extent of the sentence became apparent.

The judge then urged Mr. Angelos’s lawyer, Jerome H. Mooney, not only to appeal his decision but to ask President Bush for clemency once all appeals were exhausted. He also urged Congress to set aside the law that made the sentence mandatory.

Judge Cassell said that sentencing Mr. Angelos to prison until he is 70 years old was “unjust, cruel and even irrational,” but that the law that forced him to do so had not proved to be unconstitutional and thus had to stand. The sentence was all the more ironic, he said, because only two hours earlier he had been legally able to impose a sentence of 22 years on a man convicted of aggravated second-degree murder for beating an elderly woman to death with a log. That crime, he argued, was far more serious.

Mr. Angelos’s wife, Zandrah, who sat in court with the couple’s two boys, aged 5 and 7, began crying. “He might as well have killed someone,” she said bitterly, wiping her eyes, referring to her husband. “He should have done worse than he did if he was going to get 55 years.”

snip-

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Hitting the Week Two Wall
Date: November 17, 2004 at 6:36:45 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

R, I’m gonna say what Marc said to me. Tell Jeff to RELAXXXXXXXXXX it goes away. Course you couldn’t tell me that. I’ve had some conversation with your guy and he is a way strong and intelligent person. More than me at any rate. On Monday in week two for me I was ready to get buprenorphine and the doc was out of town. Thursday that same week I was in NYC having the time of my life and he was there. It all seemed to stop as soon as I got out and quit obsessing about how I felt. The gods kept me from doing something stupid and Jeff helped me learn to be a New Yorker. I’m gonna send you the number where I am and you can tell Jeff to call me if he wants. I’m doing follow up aftercare and I feel abso freakin’ lutely great.    Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: APSAD Annual Conference – day 1. Excellent papers, great venue, etc.
Date: November 17, 2004 at 6:37:15 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 11:07 PM
Subject: APSAD Annual Conference – day 1. Excellent papers, great venue, etc.

APSAD Conference, Perth. Monday 15th November 2004.

Dear Colleagues,

Health Minister McGinty, despite being the local member for Fremantle, was not able to attend to open the conference so his upper house Parliamentary Secretary said a few brief but very pertinent words in his absence as she declared the conference open.

Aboriginal elder Mr Wilkes spoke about his Nunga people and their land as well as some negative interactions with drugs and alcohol. His grandson, also Mr Wilkes, then played the didgeridoo, albeit with permission from the traditional owners of the pipe far to the north. Both were widely appreciated and complimented by the first key-note speaker Dr Tracy Westerman. She spoke eloquently and effectively about the cultural differences with Koori/Nunga and other indigenous family structures from the European. Her talk came as a breathe of fresh air from a caring, insightful and productive professional who spoke her part with conviction – minus ‘attitude’. She also had a team of like-minded psychologists who were involved in spreading the word about interventions, local control and the use of beneficial, self sustaining programs to address drug and alcohol abuse in indigenous communities across the country.

Next the drug professor from London Michael Farrell revealed some worrying but sadly unsurprising statistics from London. He showed some slides of depressed neighbourhoods in his once great city. Sorry inhabitants, poor living conditions and the availability of very cheap alcohol were a shock to some in the audience. He gave some figures for tobacco, alcohol and illicit drug use amongst such folk. Despite being worldly and knowledgeable about the field, he stopped short of definitive advice on how to address the multiple problems he described.

The day progressed with 6 ‘strands’ of parallel lectures/workshops covering a multitude of topics.

Initially I heard Robyn Richmond speak about her randomised controlled trial of smoking interventions in schizophrenic patients. Her rigorous evaluation showed significant benefits in the early phase but with waning effects by 12 months. She also addressed smoking in prison populations in another session and described the outcomes of the new GP anti-smoking guidelines. There were also talks on hepatitis C rates and injecting behaviours, indigenous issues, rehabilitation and peer support, co-morbidity and South-east Asian perspectives.

In the afternoon we heard from Dr Tim Mitchell about a new titanium canister being trialled in London to dispense methadone take-away doses by remote control. The tamper-proof unit has an electronic dispenser which only responds to an optical recognition such as a finger-print. The pharmacist would also have a ‘key’ using finger prints as well to refill the thing. He pointed out that it only monitors methadone usage and does not prevent the patient on-selling or injecting the drug. I am still surprised as to why we use liquid methadone for take-away doses rather than tablets. Liquids can be an invitation to injecting for some unstable or unhappy patients. This would seem like an English response to their situation, being unable to address the abysmal quality of MMT. But there is a risk that this system could stigmatize our patients even more than they are already.

Pier Paolo Pani from Italy went to some trouble next to document his efforts to define which patients are more likely to do well with methadone and (pure) buprenorphine respectively. Even from their wide experience in Italy and his close attention to numerous clinical factors, it still came down to personal preference or trial and error in most cases. Leslie Amass repeated some of her figures from the Sunday meeting, emphasising the bio-equivalence of Suboxone and Subutex and the obvious advantages of take-home doses. I was surprised that despite an enormous experience in the US over the past few years (up to 50,000 individual patients) that there have been no further published studies to support the continuing safety and effectiveness of the combination product, especially whether it can be diverted to the black or ‘grey’ markets. Professor Walter Ling spoke about opioids and pain, alluding to the possible development of non-addictive drugs which were still effective for pain management. This has long been a ‘wish’ for those in the field and each drug company claim of a lower addiction potential has been followed by disappointment (including heroin itself!). He cited evidence for the existence and relevance of the ‘orphan’ receptor which may compliment the mu and other opioid receptors in the brain.

Don Weatherburn gave a talk about reduced detected crime amongst those in the criminal justice system who chose to go onto methadone treatment. The reductions did not seem dramatic but he assured us that they were significant, elaborating details of unreported crimes and low clear-up rates as low as 6% for some types.

Michael Tedeschi gave a fascinating talk on his findings in a survey of patients and prescribers on their reasons for preferring buprenorphine or methadone. Doctors were more impressed with the safety angle while patients were more interested in the convenience of a longer acting drug which is more flexible that methadone in some respects. Some also cited the illusory ‘less addictive’ nature of buprenorphine, despite a lack of evidence that it is more likely to result in abstinence than methadone or traditional detoxification from heroin. Side effects seem less with buprenorphine in a proportion of those who responded.

Jane Maxwell spoke of her experience with mortality in methadone patients in Texas.

Sue Hailstone described a NSW Health Department initiative aimed at detecting and dealing with doctors who prescribed more than the ‘guideline’ maximum 4 take-away doses weekly from an audit conducted in May 2001. While the follow-up audit showed better compliance, there was still no attempt to determine if actual clinical practice had improved as a result of the audit. I understand that some experienced doctors left the field at the time, possibly partly as a result of the intrusive nature of this intervention.

A senior Victorian doctor questioned the whole subject when ‘guidelines’ are ‘just that’. ‘Mandatory guidelines’ is something of an oxymoron. The NSW authorities no longer have the means to vet individual clinical requests to go outside these maximums and doctors are caught in the uncomfortable position of either giving inappropriate treatment or breaking these rules in their patients’ interests. It is gratifying that the new draft guidelines do not apply the same restrictions to those taking less than 40mg daily.

Many areas are still sadly lacking in on-going education for front-line health workers to raise the standard of care of patients with alcohol and drug problems.

Next we heard from Suzanne Fraser and Kylie Valentine on their new project comparing the take-away policies in Australia’s two most populous states. Their pilot interviews quoted many interesting views from patients on the (obvious) benefits of dispensed doses. One went along the lines: “Urgh … I might not trust myself with doses for a whole week, but a few days of take-aways make all the difference!” The Victorian and NSW studies will make interesting reading in due course.

All in all a fascinating and productive day hosted by the Perth-based APSAD team.

Comments by Andrew Byrne ..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dr Andrew Byrne MB BS (SYD) FAChAM (RACP)
Dependency Medicine,
75 Redfern Street, Redfern,
New South Wales, 2016, Australia
Email – ajbyrneATozemail.com.au
Tel (61 – 2) 9319 5524 Fax 9318 0631
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
My grandfather Harry Gracie’s letters from 1924 trip to Mayo Clinic:
http://bpresent.com/harry/code/mayo.htm

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 17, 2004 at 6:24:28 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

what do you mean “social thing?” I mean, I smoke in private just as much if not more than I do in public, especially when sitting here typing or engaged in some other activity that involves concentration.
I do find it somewhat painful when I try to stop smoking, literally in a variety of ways.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “knowone knowwhere” <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 2:06 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Do most people find it physically hurts to stop cigs?
Or is it more of a social thing?

___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 17, 2004 at 3:43:47 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Try this one,

“Subject: The Passion Of The Reefer…WIN A POUND OF BC BUTTER BUDS!

Comments: \’Hello\’ =
I am forwarding this link to lightly and effectively bring home the
significant difference between the US and Canada/the rest of the world: Gone
Hollywood Pictures is giving away ONE POUND OF BC MARIJUANA to the winner of
their Make-My-Marijuana-Commercial contest to promote the release of their
new movie, The Passion Of The Reefer.

http://thepassionofthereefer.blogspot.com

Full disclosure, I am the foreign markets licensor for Gone Hollywood
Pictures, the producers of the film.

Surely.”

You may apply.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: knowone knowwhere [mailto:kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk]
Verzonden: dinsdag 16 november 2004 19:47
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

Who do I contact if I didn’t get mine?

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

— Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.com> wrote:

Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to
addicts to vote

where? when? what drugs? sounds like FOX propaganda
to me.

_.dh

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to make your dream a reality.
Get Yahoo! Mail www.yahoo.co.uk/10k

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state- for Jasen
Date: November 17, 2004 at 3:32:14 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie,

I told Jason he has so many loving people all over the world thinking of him and wishing well,
He smiled and when back to his dream. he didn’t vomit and the only thing he was complaining about is
Some discomfort , so I gave him some more Iboga around 6 am, he seems to be doing fine.

Love& greetings,

From Jason and Sara

Van: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com] 
Verzonden: dinsdag 16 november 2004 22:01
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state- for Jasen

Sara,

Please give him a hug from me, and let him know his purple candle is blazing away….

love Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo!  Get yours free!

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 17, 2004 at 1:46:37 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Last I heard, nicotine is the most addictive substance known. There
are some reports of people unexpectedly quitting smoking after
iboga.

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 06:57:30 -0800 Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
wrote:
“The withdrawal from tobacco is as difficult and painful as the
withdrawal
from alcohol and heroin. Acute withdrawal of nicotine results in
severe
disruptions to the nervous system, including tremors, agitation
and abnormal
heart rhythms. People withdrawing from nicotine cannot properly
digest their
food, nor pass waste. They cannot concentrate and their fine-motor

function
is impaired.”

Hi all,
As someone who currently is battling the psychological
ramifications of
just WANTING to quit smoking, not even actually doing more than
cutting down
slightly at this point, I read the following article, from which
the above
quote is culled, and find myself wondering once again at the
insanity of a
society that locks up people for using SOME highly addictive
substances (and
some, like pot for instance, that aren’t), yet not for others,
others which
are in reality the most damaging, most destructive, least friendly

and
wonderful of all the substances we could be using.
Anyway, I thought I’d pass this one to the rest of you.

http://www.marinij.com/Stories/0,1413,234~24409~2536223,00.html
Breathing life into the Smokeout
snip-
This Thursday is the annual Great American Smokeout, the day on
which
smokers attempt to go 24 hours without using tobacco. Some
nonsmokers will
ask, “So what’s the big deal?”
The big deal is about addiction. Regardless of how offensive
tobacco use is
to some people, we nonsmokers must remember that tobacco use is
truly an
addiction. According to the American Cancer Society, there are an
estimated
46 million smokers in the United States.
An addiction is more than just a strong craving, with additional
negative
connotations superimposed by one’s society. The presence of
addiction
implies a physical dependence. This is as true for nicotine as it
is for
heroin or alcohol.
Once a person has been using tobacco steadily for a short time,
nicotine
begins to affect the nervous system, the part of the body that
controls all
of our thoughts and functions. Nicotine becomes a
neurotransmitter; that is,
it acts as one of the many chemicals that transmit signals through

the
nervous system.
In the presence of nicotine, a body shuts down the production of
its own
endogenous neurotransmitters, which have become redundant and not
useful.
Nicotine then controls the processes of digestion and cardiac
function, to
name just a few.
The withdrawal from tobacco is as difficult and painful as the
withdrawal
from alcohol and heroin. Acute withdrawal of nicotine results in
severe
disruptions to the nervous system, including tremors, agitation
and abnormal
heart rhythms. People withdrawing from nicotine cannot properly
digest their
food, nor pass waste. They cannot concentrate and their fine-motor

function
is impaired.
The Great American Smokeout is not a day just for smokers. I ask
all
nonsmokers to take a day off from ostracizing smokers for their
habit, no
matter if it offends you or not. Give a measure of support for
those whom
you know are attempting to quit. [and to those who really want to
quit but
can’t seem to find the strength to do so…hint nudge to the love
of my
life- Preston]
snip-

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is

often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 17, 2004 at 1:44:19 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 05:32:30 -0800 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
I can’t figure out what rural gun owners have to do with homeland
security.

Possibly that was a demographic that voted for Bush? (No time to re-
read the editorial now, sorry.)

Are you implying that all rural gun owners are uneducated and
uninformed?

I’m not saying everything in the editorial, mainly quoting it
because it points out that the states at least risk (and getting
the most defense money) have turned out the more vulnerable ones to
the wolves by confirming Bush’s make-more-terrorists policy.

Being
from the South I can state most emphatically that this is just not

true. I
grew up hunting and I think everyone should have some gun safety
training. When
you live on a farm firearms are tools you use. That will never
change. Nobody
gets home invaded “down home.” And (and this will surely piss
someone off) I
think every women who is not insane or convicted of violet crime
should
automatically get a concealed to carry license. Wonder what that
would do to rape
stats?    Randy

The stats on gun ownership are that mainly people close to the
owner get killed. Maybe it’s more the case in the cities where a
gun has fewer everyday uses and so is more like a totemic object
from the tv set that magically solves problems.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: Patrick K. Kroupa <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] new orleans
Date: November 16, 2004 at 11:48:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Nov 16, 2004, at 10:29 PM, Vector Vector wrote:

Thanks Howard! Everybody was doing drugs, had sex, there wasn’t a fight
but if Dana was yelling at Dr. Cohen we can always hope he punched him
later.  Did the hotel burn down or only burn? 🙂 Enquiring minds want
to know!

Good job Patrick good job. I expect no less from you 🙂 Every person
I’ve talked to who has ever been at a ibogaine conference in the last 3
years says it’s 20 people in a empty room. Patrick your higher power is
working for you, you’re in charge of chaos 🙂 Any photos of you
chain-smoking during the opening plenary? 🙂 🙂 🙂

.:vector:.

It wuz all Jon Freedlander…  Jeff and I were both very jealous of him.  He just radiates raw animal magnetism.  The hotel couldn’t handle it.  Riots broke out, fires were set, the line to get inside the room stretched around the block.  Howard wept, but Norma consoled him.  Dana was so frustrated he beat up Peter Cohen … or not; harsh words were exchanged, prolly some sorta difference of opinion.  Who can say.  The seXual tension of crowds is way-cool.

I feel so cheap and used.

Cool

Patrick

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] y0…
Date: November 16, 2004 at 10:32:30 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard print this and you’re done. Thanks Jon that was it.

.:vector:.

— jon <jfreed1@umbc.edu> wrote:

i just wanted to thank everyone who came to the conference.. i had a
completely fucking brilliant time.

i’m going to sleep for the next three weeks, i think.. =)

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The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] new orleans
Date: November 16, 2004 at 10:29:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Howard! Everybody was doing drugs, had sex, there wasn’t a fight
but if Dana was yelling at Dr. Cohen we can always hope he punched him
later.  Did the hotel burn down or only burn? 🙂 Enquiring minds want
to know!

Good job Patrick good job. I expect no less from you 🙂 Every person
I’ve talked to who has ever been at a ibogaine conference in the last 3
years says it’s 20 people in a empty room. Patrick your higher power is
working for you, you’re in charge of chaos 🙂 Any photos of you
chain-smoking during the opening plenary? 🙂 🙂 🙂

.:vector:.

— HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 11/16/04 2:28:30 AM, vector620022002@yahoo.com
writes:

Howard you’re back from New Orleans! We want all the dirt, did
Patrick
set fire to his guitar, did he tongue kiss on stage with Dr. Mash?
Did
everyone do ibogaine and have a group orgy? Details! Howard it’s
all up
to you, patrick stopped writing anything so if you’re covering what
happened at the conference in case you weren’t sure we don’t care
about
the boring stuff, we want all the dirt! 🙂 🙂 🙂 Who had sex, who
did
drugs, who got in a fight! That’s the least I expect from something
moderated by Patrick, don’t let us down.

I’ll work on the boring stuff later for a full report but, here are
the
answers you were looking for. Patrick didn’t burn his guitar but,
someone set the
hotel on fire.  Photographs will follow.  Mash didn’t show.  It was
rumored she
was afraid of Jon Freedlander’s science.  Whatever she and Patrick
may
have
done they did it in Miami.  I think everyone had sex.  Someone stole

the film
so I can’t be sure. Everyone did drugs. No one got in a fight.  I
think
everyone did ibogaine and no one moved much at all so it must have
been
ibogaine.
Doses were in the 15mg/kg range.  The ibogaine session was wall to
wall
people,
standing, on the floor and out the door.  Really packed and a very
hot
session.  Jeff Kamlet was spectacular.  So was I.  How is that for
self
promotion.

More later I have a lot of catching up to do.  Others who were there

feel
free to post the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.  I

was told
Dana yelled at peter cohen but, I was not there at the time.  Some of

what I
have said is true and some is not.  Good luck determining what is
what.
It is
the effect of being in New Orleans.

Howard

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 16, 2004 at 10:03:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My experience is not one of physical pain, but of “intense” cravings that seem to wear on your nerves to the 100th degree.  I was never able to stop smoking before the ibogaine.  I read that cigarettes and heroin share the same brain receptors.  So can we say, intensity, not to be taken lightly or shrugged at.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “knowone knowwhere” <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 2:06 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Do most people find it physically hurts to stop cigs?
Or is it more of a social thing?

___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Nuclear Kitties Need Adoption!
Date: November 16, 2004 at 9:01:40 PM EST
To: cowsmanaut <cowsmanaut@shaw.ca>
Cc: “PetitePaws=^..^=” <petitepaws@shaw.ca>, Neo Iboga <neo_iboga@yahoo.co.uk>, Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>, mike campbell <caribbeanman@shaw.ca>, Linda Menzies <Linda.Menzies@ed.ac.uk>, Li Junping <asiafirst001@hotmail.com>, ibogaine@mindvox.com, Forseachange@aol.com, Andrea Plementos <aplementos@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nuclear Kitties Need Adoption!
I recently received this from a friend of mine:
I’m desperately searching for an animal lover, trying to help out a friend get rid of the last 3 of a litter of kittens. She lives close to the Seabrook nuclear power plant. Please look and see if any of these little guys touch your heart. We really need to find a good home for them.
If you can help any of the three below, please reply!!

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: [Ibogaine] y0…
Date: November 16, 2004 at 8:52:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i just wanted to thank everyone who came to the conference.. i had a
completely fucking brilliant time.

i’m going to sleep for the next three weeks, i think.. =)

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 16, 2004 at 7:36:02 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

go Jasen, go Sara.
I’ll play some good music for Jasen tonight while dj’ing.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 8:30 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Hi Julie, Francis, Andy, Preston, Hannah and all,

Time to light a candle, Jasen is doing fine, he will be getting the bigger
dose tonight, But he has no withdrawals and he is day dreaming on the test
dose.

Greetings from Jasen to everyone.
You are a great supportive group of people,
Thanks,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: maandag 15 november 2004 19:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

You wrote :
I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Here you will find  some  proof:.

http://www.childpastlives.org/stevenson.htm

Its interesting to note that the first Christians used to believe in
reincarnation and A.D. 250 to 553 the contreversy raged. You can investigate
the Gnostics too that had several gospels older than ours gospel and where
discover in 1945.The mystical school of the Sufism for the Musulmans. The
secret Mystical Chabbalist school of the Jews The Bouddhist, Hinduist ect..
most of the planet believe in reincarnation.

Dr. Stevenson investigates more than 3000 cases of reincarnations and wrote
several books on the subject.
I have been doing past-life regression for several years. My clients are not
surprised when they find out who they where and their lives start to make
sense in the light of their new knowledge. We are here to progress, and we
can relax and enjoy the adventure, no rush 🙂  Did I make make sense?/!

God bless
Francis

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 16, 2004 at 5:54:18 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Please give Jason my love and let him know we can’t wait to hear his report
when he’s able.  My candles are starting to form an altar!  I’m sending lots
of love and positive vibes his way.

Love Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 1:30 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Hi Julie, Francis, Andy, Preston, Hannah and all,

Time to light a candle, Jasen is doing fine, he will be getting the bigger
dose tonight, But he has no withdrawals and he is day dreaming on the test
dose.

Greetings from Jasen to everyone.
You are a great supportive group of people,
Thanks,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: maandag 15 november 2004 19:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

You wrote :
I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Here you will find  some  proof:.

http://www.childpastlives.org/stevenson.htm

Its interesting to note that the first Christians used to believe in
reincarnation and A.D. 250 to 553 the contreversy raged. You can
investigate
the Gnostics too that had several gospels older than ours gospel and where
discover in 1945.The mystical school of the Sufism for the Musulmans. The
secret Mystical Chabbalist school of the Jews The Bouddhist, Hinduist
ect..
most of the planet believe in reincarnation.

Dr. Stevenson investigates more than 3000 cases of reincarnations and
wrote
several books on the subject.
I have been doing past-life regression for several years. My clients are
not
surprised when they find out who they where and their lives start to make
sense in the light of their new knowledge. We are here to progress, and we
can relax and enjoy the adventure, no rush 🙂  Did I make make sense?/!

God bless
Francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] new orleans
Date: November 16, 2004 at 5:35:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/16/04 2:28:30 AM, vector620022002@yahoo.com writes:

Howard you’re back from New Orleans! We want all the dirt, did Patrick
set fire to his guitar, did he tongue kiss on stage with Dr. Mash? Did
everyone do ibogaine and have a group orgy? Details! Howard it’s all up
to you, patrick stopped writing anything so if you’re covering what
happened at the conference in case you weren’t sure we don’t care about
the boring stuff, we want all the dirt! 🙂 🙂 🙂 Who had sex, who did
drugs, who got in a fight! That’s the least I expect from something
moderated by Patrick, don’t let us down.

I’ll work on the boring stuff later for a full report but, here are the
answers you were looking for. Patrick didn’t burn his guitar but, someone set the
hotel on fire.  Photographs will follow.  Mash didn’t show.  It was rumored she
was afraid of Jon Freedlander’s science.  Whatever she and Patrick may have
done they did it in Miami.  I think everyone had sex.  Someone stole the film
so I can’t be sure. Everyone did drugs. No one got in a fight.  I think
everyone did ibogaine and no one moved much at all so it must have been ibogaine.
Doses were in the 15mg/kg range.  The ibogaine session was wall to wall people,
standing, on the floor and out the door.  Really packed and a very hot
session.  Jeff Kamlet was spectacular.  So was I.  How is that for self promotion.

More later I have a lot of catching up to do.  Others who were there feel
free to post the truth, the whole truth and nothing but the truth.  I was told
Dana yelled at peter cohen but, I was not there at the time.  Some of what I
have said is true and some is not.  Good luck determining what is what.  It is
the effect of being in New Orleans.

Howard

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 16, 2004 at 5:15:52 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeh where’s Callie and Sean?

—– Original Message —–
From: booker w
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 8:27 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Hi.  Very interesting about the holocaust stuff.  I’ve often felt I was in the holocaust as well.  As a kid I was intensely interested in reading about concentration camps and was always “fascinated” with the jewish religion – I remember being very disappointed that I wasn’t born jewish.  Top that off with my first real panic attack occured while reading QBVII – a book about the holocaust and trials later.  I’m a baby- boomer too…
My dreams after ibogaine were so incredibly intense and vivid and as tho I was “experiencing” them in a much more direct manner than normal.  But also, I felt that even before taking the substance I experienced vivid dreams, just knowing ibo was going to come into my life.  Upon making the decision each time, I would experience very synchronistic events and dreams.  In fact it was several dreams that led and convinced me to try ibogaine as well.  Makes me believe that the chemical part of ibo isn’t really all of it.  I think there is so much more to the experience than just the chemistry… as probably with many things – one reason I think it is such an utter waste of time to test it on animals.  We seem to focus so much just on the physical.  I also have always had the impression that ibo is just a sort of “gate” to a more accurate realm of existence, which is where healing and things outside of time can take place.  Like seeing a dead relative, the future, or various forms of healing.  Hence the “restart.”
Anyway, that’s my ramble – whatever happened to Callie?
Best to Julie and Jasen.  Fakeplacebo too.  Hope you get to where you want to be.
Sandy

>      I believe your dream sounded a lot like holocaust stuff.  I have always felt I was in the holocaust as does my sister and brother in law.  I have had this confirmed but not by my own regression.  My theory is that  a lot of the baby boomers were holocaust victims that were taken out before their time.As a kid I had dreams of being hunted by nazis,gas and thinking I’d be better off blonde.  This could also be generational stuff that kids pick up on. I believe the dream about visiting where you grew up and those long journeys are what is referred to as astral visits.

>      I think dreams are a way to reveal stuff, release stuff, get prayers across and answered.  You know the brain is kind of a new frontier.  One of the ongoing conversations I’ve had with my nephew since he was 6 was, What do you think we could do if we had full use of our brain?  I believe our actual usage is less than 15%.  I could be wrong and that may not be exact but it’s something I’ve heard repeatedly.  Again no reference note available.  I personally believe we can heal ourselves from anything, replicate damage organs and regenerate damaged limbs.  If a reptile can do it….

>     The whole purpose of the past life regression is not just to have a look see, but to acknowledge the source of todays pain which enables one to release it easier.

>      I’m done rambling for now.  Thanks for the response.

>                                                                     Martee

>

>   —– Original Message —–

>   From: Ms Iboga

>   To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>   Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:40 AM

>   Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

>

>

>   Martee,

>

>   I’m 26, but I alternate between 18 and 50, depending on the circumstances…I think my circadian rhythm is still screwed up, and this is why I have such vivid recollections of my dreams.  I can get to the deep sleep, but when the cycle starts again, and I return to lighter levels, my body automatically wakes up

>

>   Last night I dreamed I was a prisoner in an internment camp, nested between two huge mountains.  I had a daughter that was at least my own age(I have no kids), and a husband that was imprisoned in the male section.  Anyone trying to escape was shot either through the heart or the neck with a flaming arrow.  My last memory of the dream, before I awoke, was of running furiously, out the front gate of the prison; running so fast I could feel and smell the perspiration on my skin!  Has anyone else experienced vivid smells, colours, etc..?  I’ve heard we only dream in black and white, but I don’t believe this at all.

>

>   Martee, do you practice hypnosis?  I would love to chat more with you about dreams/past life regressions.  I think this is a very cool topic, and thanks for bringing it up….

>

>   Julie

>

>

>   __________________________________________________

>   Do You Yahoo!?

>   Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around

>   http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] hannah
Date: November 16, 2004 at 5:06:56 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My boyfriend has been a real angel in so many ways over the pst 3yrs we’ve
been together.  He’s put up with SO much (he has never been into H)
Obviously he can be a git too!  But always he shows me the kind of person
I’d like to be.  He always seems interested in everything, he’s always up
for stuff and is generally always kind and generous.

We are having lots of problems though.  Mainly because we said we’d put up a
couple of mates briefly and one of them DOES MY HEAD IN and we just can’t
get rid of him (the other one is ok)

When I’m not doing H I can’t stand the smell of smoke or the passive smoking
involved (even though I chain-smoke when I’m on H).  Unfortunatelty people
are always smoking in our flat and me complaining makes me out to be the
evil one-they’re all stoners so I just seem like a Nazi!

Oh I could moan forever!

Lotsa love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 2:27 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] hannah

Hannah,
Your observations and instincts are on the right tract.  As I reread
your writing I get you know what you need to escape as you put it.  Also
the
description of your boyfriend does not speak for his decisions being for
your best interests,just his.  Maybe you should consider adding one more
thing to your escape list?    Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 4:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

I was Vegan for 5yrs from age 15 to 20 and when I eventually went back to
eating milk products I was pig-sick for 2 whole weeks-mainly diarrhoea
but
also vomiting.  I’m sure our bodies don’t want much of that shit inside
us!

Sadly I gave in to pressure and returned to Vegetarism and have never
been
strong enough since to return to being Vegan.  Hell, I wanna escape all
this
crap-‘drugs’, sugar, fags, caffeine, milk products etc.  Unfortunately
my
heavily dope smoking boyf doesn’t like the idea (except there’ll be more
chocolate for him!)

I just want to feel healthy and have ENERGY! 😉

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 2:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] FAITH
Date: November 16, 2004 at 4:46:11 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh for Godsake-this is a newsgroup about IBOGAINE.

It is also INTERNATIONAL

Us people across the water are TERRIFIED by the results of your election and
couldn’t imagine how it happened!  Thanks to your posts and the info on the
Black Boxes I’m starting to understand.

Your president CREATED this wartime.

If you really wanted to help your son and discuss drug addiction then shut
up about Bush-I’m sure even you have realised by now how WE ALL feel on
this-stop antagonising us!

Either leave or show some interest in DRUG ADDICTION!

Sincerely,
Hannah Clay
UK
—– Original Message —–
From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted
form
the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats okay I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found
this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain
understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the
day
ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out
of
here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.
what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley
about
computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure
with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.
thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but
don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in
the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for
onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I
would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability
to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams,
feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced
twice
the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5
years
worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as
the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I
needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never
ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had
one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all
fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when
you’ve
done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It
was
NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I
had
in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled
too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana
high.
I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12
years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican
restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and
it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I
liked
it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing
the
combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of
what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for
right
now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their
dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to
no
meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we
can
understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those
books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their
own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain
that’s
different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any
technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let
you know.

_________________________________________________________________
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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 16, 2004 at 4:20:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee, I agree 100 per cent on what you say about will and intent and also about being trained. I think anyone who gets the carry permit should be trained and have to prove they can hit what comes their way, under stress. Also about being chosen because the weak are the easiest target. All women should read the Art of War too. The translated Chinese version. Being trained and educated about defense builds confidence and maybe some of this terrible stuff that befalls women will finally stop.    Randy

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state- for Jasen
Date: November 16, 2004 at 4:01:11 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara,

Please give him a hug from me, and let him know his purple candle is blazing away….

love Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 16, 2004 at 3:59:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bravo Preston!!!!!!!   Now that you say it he does appear to be whacked to the gills some time, and I am a raging alcoholic with lots of experience drinking but never shot no dope like these here sicko’s, nope not the kid…he he      Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 16, 2004 at 3:52:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What’s wrong with chicken and cornbread?       Randy

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 16, 2004 at 3:28:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Tuesday, November 16, 2004, at 09:06 AM, knowone knowwhere wrote:

Do most people find it physically hurts to stop cigs?
Or is it more of a social thing?

I wouldn’t say it hurts physically, for me it was more of a mental craving… as nicotine gave me brief windows of clarity.

As we all know it also blended fabulously well with the opiate euphoria.

nervousness and twitching fingers when i was in nicotine withdrawal was about as physical as it got.

The social thing was a factor, altho now that I’m stopped social situations where smoking is a factor generally turns me off.

Unless I am under a large amount of stress or am emotional, then it is attractive.

what helped me [to quit] was getting raw licorice twigs from a health food store and chewing them when I had cravings. it also seemed to satisfy the hand-to-mouth habit. Licorice is also very helpful in clearing the lungs.

_.dh

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 16, 2004 at 3:22:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think Faith is holding out on us.

On Tuesday, November 16, 2004, at 08:46 AM, knowone knowwhere wrote:

Who do I contact if I didn’t get mine?

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

— Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.com> wrote:

Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to
addicts to vote

where? when? what drugs? sounds like FOX propaganda
to me.

_.dh

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 16, 2004 at 3:13:38 PM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,
Sorry if this is redundant, but I sent this to you at 4pm yesterday and haven’t found it anywhere but in my sent box?  I don’t know.  Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 4:08 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Julie,
You could very well be right. What struck me with your internment camp dream was the husband, the kid, the complete scenario that existed there. I guess it’s one thing to believe in God and then another to try to figure out what that means.  I don’t believe the whole worm food, this is all there is stuff personally, or that there is only on go around.  I think a big turning point for me was when my nephew was born 12 years ago and I just got the scense that he didn’t start fresh at birth. We have an amazing closeness that didn’t come from just one life. I’ll tell you my addiction release dream that happened 2 weeks after my iboga session.  I was sitting in what I can only describe as a courtyard outside some open structure. There were plenty of other people sitting around as well. On my lap I had a big book thing that when I opened up was full of ornate pins and jewelry. Standing in front of me was a guy who was familiar to me, but not particularly well liked.  He pulled a knife on me and told me to give me the jewelry.  I stood up and told him to watch his shit or I would do to him what I’ve taught women and children to do to attackers.  He then pulls 2 knifes on me, to my throat.  I then put my hands on his head, somehow calmed him and got him to sit down in a chair without his knifes. The guy and the activity and myself were the only real prominent things in this dream. Everything else was there but not sharp.  Myself and two others thought this was me standing up to my addiction.  I’ve heard that Jesus taught about reincarnation.  It was the local powers that be that did away with that teaching because it’s how you control a population to make them think this is all there is, so watch your shit or we’ll take it away.  Humans, like animals have a survival instinct. People that need tactile proof won’t even be sure of that life everlasting, heaven type thing. So they go under the thumb and remain controled.  My proof besides what I feel instinctively and the many many conversations I’ve had with many many people who don’t bullshit me is what has helped form my belief system.  Be open to the possibility, it’s like when you get a red car. All of a sudden you never noticed how very many red cars are on the road! Is that scientific?
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 16, 2004 at 2:06:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Do most people find it physically hurts to stop cigs?
Or is it more of a social thing?

___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 16, 2004 at 1:46:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Who do I contact if I didn’t get mine?

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

— Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.com> wrote:

Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to
addicts to vote

where? when? what drugs? sounds like FOX propaganda
to me.

_.dh

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] The Three Stooges
Date: November 16, 2004 at 1:01:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hahaha…enjoy

__________________________________
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The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Opening Pandora’s Box:
Date: November 16, 2004 at 10:05:35 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
With the recent news breaking about vaccinating druggies to stop them from even being able to get high in the first place, I post this excerpt from DrugWar.com’s latest expose, posted this morning, (Nov. 16, 2004). Long-time contributor to DrugWar.com and a contributor to Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs, Cletus Nelson has painted an ugly picture of the strides being made to not only tell us what we can and can’t do with our minds, but the efforts to physically alter our brains and bodies to insure we comply with prohibitionist insanities.
Peace and love to all,
Preston

http://www.drugwar.com/cpandora.shtm
Opening Pandora’s Box:
Anti-Drug Vaccines Gather Momentum
by Cletus Nelson
for DrugWar.com
Nov. 16, 2004

Back in 2002, DrugWar.com addressed a disturbing new strategy in the war on drugs: The development of anti-drug “vaccines” capable of permanently blunting the effects of mind-altering substances. The article (“Headshrinking the American Addict”), discussed how the National Institute on Drug Abuse (NIDA) in partnership with various corporate and public entities was spending millions developing this supposed “cure” for the “disease” of addiction. The sheer scope of this neuro-political endeavor, which sounds like something out of a futuristic science fiction thriller, generated more than a few incredulous responses from skeptical readers. Yet some two years later, this far flung experiment in social control is gaining traction among prohibitionists.
SOUNDING THE ALARM
Over the past year, the anti-drug agents, or “pharmacotherapy” drugs, have drawn the attention of the Northern California-based Center for Cognitive Liberty and Ethics (CCLE). This spring, the Center distilled their research into a compelling 52-page report that makes for some truly disturbing reading. Titled Threats to Cognitive Liberty: Pharmacotherapy and the Future of the Drug War,” the well researched position paper comes to the unsettling conclusion that within the next decade this once speculative venture is destined to become a reality. Indeed, the report predicts that the medically-based approach to countering drug abuse will “tremendously impact” the strategic focus of both American and International drug control strategies. Moreover, the CCLE warn that this ominous development will engender a “striking expansion of the state’s policing mechanism on at least two fronts: 1) from external policing to internal policing; and 2) from restraining a person’s body and behavior, to directly restraining a person’s thoughts and thought processes.” (p. 41)
These aren’t the ruminations of a crew of stoners swapping conspiracy theories over bong hits in the back of a van, but the opinion of a nationally recognized organization of experts in such diverse fields as science, law, ethics, and medicine. While it is hoped that the Center’s learned observations will engender greater public debate about the vaccines, this authoritative document is also invaluable as it explores the underlying motivations behind this backdoor attempt by government officials to claim ownership to our minds.

NEW WEAPONS, SAME WAR
The CCLE identify three types of vaccines currently in development; Receptor Blockers, Molecule Binders, and Metabolism Modifiers. Most Americans are familiar with the latter group as they include anti-drinking medications such as the highly popular Antabuse which is often prescribed for alcoholism. The goal of these compounds is merely to induce intense discomfort when an individual imbibes a particular substance in order to discourage its further use. Anyone who has viewed Stanley Kubrick’s A Clockwork Orange is familiar with this form of negative conditioning. However, Receptor Blockers are far more drastic as the compounds directly enter the bloodstream to short circuit the addictive process by using “antagonists” and other agents to permanently neutralize and/or inhibit the ability of the brain’s receptor sites to process psychoactive drugs. Similarly, Molecule Binders are designed to bind like antibodies to the molecules of illegal substances rendering them incapable of penetrating the blood-brain barrier.
The study places great emphasis on the fact that pharmacotherapy medications have the potential to significantly alter both how the drug war is perceived and how prohibition efforts will be conducted in the near future. In essence, the new approach “expands the battlefield from the Colombian coca farms and Middle-Eastern poppy fields to a new terrain directly inside the bodies and brains of drug users.” (p.6) [emphasis in the original]
The reason for this dramatic shift in strategy isn’t difficult to fathom: The drug war is a colossal failure. Citing recent statistics from the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration (SAMSHA), the Center notes that an estimated 19 million Americans (age 12 and above) ingest some type of illegal drug each month. Thus, the federal government, which has long relied on punitive measures ranging from imprisonment to asset forfeiture in order to reduce demand for illicit drugs, is seeking to retake the offensive in this losing war by reprogramming the brains of alleged substance abusers.
snip-
Read complete article at above URL

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 16, 2004 at 8:30:30 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie, Francis, Andy, Preston, Hannah and all,

Time to light a candle, Jasen is doing fine, he will be getting the bigger
dose tonight, But he has no withdrawals and he is day dreaming on the test
dose.

Greetings from Jasen to everyone.
You are a great supportive group of people,
Thanks,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: maandag 15 november 2004 19:04
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

You wrote :
I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Here you will find  some  proof:.

http://www.childpastlives.org/stevenson.htm

Its interesting to note that the first Christians used to believe in
reincarnation and A.D. 250 to 553 the contreversy raged. You can investigate
the Gnostics too that had several gospels older than ours gospel and where
discover in 1945.The mystical school of the Sufism for the Musulmans. The
secret Mystical Chabbalist school of the Jews The Bouddhist, Hinduist ect..
most of the planet believe in reincarnation.

Dr. Stevenson investigates more than 3000 cases of reincarnations and wrote
several books on the subject.
I have been doing past-life regression for several years. My clients are not
surprised when they find out who they where and their lives start to make
sense in the light of their new knowledge. We are here to progress, and we
can relax and enjoy the adventure, no rush 🙂  Did I make make sense?/!

God bless
Francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: ASPAD conference in Fremantle, WA. “Beyond the Drug”.
Date: November 16, 2004 at 7:31:36 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Tuesday, November 16, 2004 2:11 AM
Subject: ASPAD conference in Fremantle, WA. “Beyond the Drug”.

APSAD Conference, Perth. Sunday 14th November 2004.

Prior to the APSAD conference proper the Reckitt Benckiser drug company had booked the conference centre for a symposium on buprenorphine. For the entire Sunday afternoon those attending discussed, learned, absorbed and almost ‘breathed’ partial agonists.

Leslie Amass PhD gave a talk on Suboxone versus Subutex, quoting initially from Fudala’s NEJM paper from 2003. She showed some outcome markers, including the percentage of clear urine screens at ~22% for the pure drug versus ~18% for the combination with ~6% for ‘controls’ (actually ‘placebo’ cases!). While Amass stated that there was ‘no difference’, someone in the audience pointed to the apparently better results in the pure buprenorphine subjects (I said it looked like a ‘trend’). We were told that this difference was not significant, yet such a trend would be consistent with other research presented by Dr Bell regarding the need for higher doses in the combination cases.

All delegates were given copies of the excellent pilot study by Professor James Bell and colleagues from Sydney published in D&A Review. In an expansive presentation he described the 17 stable consenting patients who were transferred from Subutex to Suboxone and also moved from daily to weekly attendance schedules. Most outcome results were gratifying (self report, urine toxicology weekly) as in other trials of stable folk given increased take-home doses (termed ‘medical maintenance’ in the US). Bell alluded to the random call-back provisions of his trial to count tablets for compliance. It would have been good if we had heard further details of 4 out of 17 who declined to attend when requested, and of the patient who had a stroke during the Suboxone trial, both mentioned in the accompanying published paper. The fact that 4 ‘stable’ patients (25%) could not account for their remaining medication constitutes prima facie evidence of diversion. Professor Bell also told us that one patient “squirreled away” medication for up to 6 months. This is also a form of ‘diversion’ to my mind as the drug was clearly not taken as prescribed in the trial protocol. I recall an intriguing reference of measures to protect the good standing of a ‘new drug’, which ideally might have been discussed in more detail. There seemed to be an inconsistency between a projected slide showing dose increases averaging 50%, and the reference to a “slight” increase (needed in those who transferred from pure buprenorphine to the combination product, Suboxone).

As part of the same study, next we had Professor Bell’s colleague, Amanda Morris, who spoke about the qualitative effects of changing daily attendances for stable, employed long-term folk into once per week or even fortnight attendances with the combination buprenorphine product. Unsurprisingly, the patients were uniformly grateful. They were almost grovelling in their praise for the new system, rather damning the previous daily attendance. We were shown dozens of quotes in which patients were almost religious in their support for the change wrought upon them. The staff also found it gratifying to have patients attending less often. No real surprises here to my mind. People were given treatment which was almost a ‘cruel and unusual punishment’ (daily attendance) and then moved to a liberal and tolerable management regimen so there is little surprise that everyone was pleased about it. The exact same would probably have happened using methadone or pure buprenorphine, simply by following established take-away schedules.

Andrea Gordon then spoke about buprenorphine in pregnancy, describing over 40 cases of controls and methadone patients followed from about 19 weeks gestation. She compared these with comparable numbers of women taking the combination product. There were no miscarriages in the methadone or control groups but 3 in the buprenorphine group. She stated that these were ‘not significant’ without qualifying herself. Even though this was a study in progress, I think more needs to be sought about the miscarriages. Other studies of buprenorphine in pregnancy have mostly be reassuring and many physicians now believe that it is safe to use in pregnancy. I still believe it should be a second line drug, albeit but an excellent one at that.

Andrea Gordon’s other figures from Adelaide showed that methadone and buprenorphine patients had slightly smaller babies who were delivered slightly earlier but with few other differences. Some buprenorphine figures appeared to be slightly better on trend regarding neonatal withdrawals. Although buprenorphine is not yet approved for use in pregnancy it appears that some of these women were prescribed the drug as their choice and for others, their doctor’s choice.

Walter Ling gave his usual witty and insightful talk, describing pain syndromes versus dependency diagnosis and the intersection of the two. He also covered the very practical subject of what to do for opioid maintained patients with severe pain, acute and chronic. He started by describing simple manoeuvres such as paracetamol and anti-inflammatories to additional methadone/buprenorphine (eg. one sixth dose increase as a start) or a simple addition of morphine which he said was practical and simple, even in inpatients having operations, transferring straight back to the maintenance medication afterwards.

Next (in Italian) we heard Dr Claudio Leonardi speak about the Roman and Neapolitan experience with buprenorphine (pure). He was gregarious and beautifully spoken with a broadly positive impression of their experience. He appeared to be supportive of the use of buprenorphine in preference to methadone in some cases or even more widely but did not give his reasons. He did however quote a paper he heard in Paris recently in which 5000 women on buprenorphine delivered babies apparently with safety. He stated that his group routinely transfers people on as much as 80mg methadone to buprenorphine. He alluded to the use of anti-diarrhoeals, anti-spasmodics and sedatives in such patients who I presume were in-patients. Our experience with high dose (up to 50mg) transfers has been uniformly unpleasant. I was unable to reconcile the difference as the first buprenorphine dose was given at least 24 hours after the last dose of methadone in all cases. Dr Leonardi did make the point that they never given more than 2mg to such high dose transfer cases on the first day, but afterwards they rack up the dose very quickly (eg. 8mg, 12mg, 16mg). He also mentioned much higher doses in some cases as high as 48 or 56mg which would present something of a challenge to consume just because of its bulk, not to mention the extremely high cost.

Fremantle is beautiful at this time of year and we are fortunate thus far to have clear, warm weather also blessed by the afternoon Indian Ocean “doctor” sea breeze each afternoon. The conference venue is the Fremantle Esplanade which is a large old rambling hotel which has been rebuilt with large, modern facilities maintaining the charming old façade facing the park, Norfolk pines, etc. It is a short stroll to the port, station and restaurant area.

comments by Andrew Byrne ..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dr Andrew Byrne MB BS (Syd) FAChAM (RACP)
Dependency Medicine,
75 Redfern Street, Redfern,
New South Wales, 2016, Australia
Email – ajbyrneATozemail.com.au
Tel (61 – 2) 9319 5524 Fax 9318 0631
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre
Date: November 16, 2004 at 12:04:33 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Paula !
I just check The ancestor syndrome and I just remember that I have a friend
who is doing that in the south of France .( Dominique )  It’s very
fascinating.
She told me that she have very good result  even on cancer. In fact she
travel all year round  giving conferences on the subject  Now that you
mention it : I need to investigate more about it.
Thank you.
Francis
—– Original Message —–
From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 7:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre

None of my business but Rupert Sheldrake believes that there is a
collective
memorie of the human race a pool of knowing. We all can access this and it
explains why each generation gets faster and smarter.  We don’t retain
this
but like the internet we can access it when we have need. This is for all
life, this expains why when they grow a crystal in a lab in another lab
the
results start to get faster as if the crystals had a blueprint, this is
why
birds that don’t migrate can learn a new behavior in a small town and have
that behavior suddenly start in other countries.  These are documented
cases…he feels there is a field that we can’t yet measure that provides
us
and all animals with a resource of knowledge.  And there is also a book
called The ancestor syndrome, transgeneration pscholtherapy for problems
that seem to crop up in generations that you might be interested
in…..Take
a look what will it hurt?  Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 10:09 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre

How bizzarrrrre 🙂

The lives of President Kennedy and President Lincoln had so many
parallels
that it cannot be dismissed as pure coincidence. To my mind, these
parallels
are evidence of history repeating itself and evidence of reincarnation.
To
me, these parallels may be circumstantial evidence that President
Kennedy
was the reincarnation of President Lincoln.  You decide for yourself.

Both were elected to Congress in ’46.  Both were elected President in
’60.
Both had the legality of their elections contested.  Both were directly
involved with black civil rights.  Both lost a son while serving as
President.  Both were killed while serving as President.

Lincoln’s staffer, whose name was Kennedy, advised him not to go to the
theater.  Kennedy’s secretary, whose name was Lincoln, advised him not
to
go
to Dallas.  Lincoln was fond of Monroe, Maryland (He had visited it a
week
before he was shot).  Kennedy was fond of Marilyn Monroe.

Both were shot on a Friday.  Both were shot in the head from behind.
Both
were shot in the presence of their wives.  Both were shot while sitting
with
another couple.

Both were shot with another member of their entourage being injured, but
not
fatally.  Lincoln was shot in Ford’s Theater. Kennedy was shot in a Ford
Lincoln.

Both assassins were born in ’39.  Both were Southerners favoring
extremist
views.  Both are known by their first, middle and last names.   Booth
ran
from the theater and was captured in a warehouse.  Oswald ran from the
warehouse and was captured in a theater.  Both were themselves
assassinated
before their trials.

Both President’s successors were Southern Democrats.  Both successors
had
the last name of Johnson.  Both successors were Vice-Presidents.  Both
successors were born in ’08.  Both successors were former senators.

Both President’s caskets were carried in death on the same caisson.

God Bless

F.

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:56:06 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you Paula, I will look for some informations on : The ancestor
syndrome ,it never hurt to learnt something new 🙂
God Bless
F
—– Original Message —–
From: “Paula” <paulab@shaw.ca>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 7:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre

None of my business but Rupert Sheldrake believes that there is a
collective
memorie of the human race a pool of knowing. We all can access this and it
explains why each generation gets faster and smarter.  We don’t retain
this
but like the internet we can access it when we have need. This is for all
life, this expains why when they grow a crystal in a lab in another lab
the
results start to get faster as if the crystals had a blueprint, this is
why
birds that don’t migrate can learn a new behavior in a small town and have
that behavior suddenly start in other countries.  These are documented
cases…he feels there is a field that we can’t yet measure that provides
us
and all animals with a resource of knowledge.  And there is also a book
called The ancestor syndrome, transgeneration pscholtherapy for problems
that seem to crop up in generations that you might be interested
in…..Take
a look what will it hurt?  Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 10:09 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre

How bizzarrrrre 🙂

The lives of President Kennedy and President Lincoln had so many
parallels
that it cannot be dismissed as pure coincidence. To my mind, these
parallels
are evidence of history repeating itself and evidence of reincarnation.
To
me, these parallels may be circumstantial evidence that President
Kennedy
was the reincarnation of President Lincoln.  You decide for yourself.

Both were elected to Congress in ’46.  Both were elected President in
’60.
Both had the legality of their elections contested.  Both were directly
involved with black civil rights.  Both lost a son while serving as
President.  Both were killed while serving as President.

Lincoln’s staffer, whose name was Kennedy, advised him not to go to the
theater.  Kennedy’s secretary, whose name was Lincoln, advised him not
to
go
to Dallas.  Lincoln was fond of Monroe, Maryland (He had visited it a
week
before he was shot).  Kennedy was fond of Marilyn Monroe.

Both were shot on a Friday.  Both were shot in the head from behind.
Both
were shot in the presence of their wives.  Both were shot while sitting
with
another couple.

Both were shot with another member of their entourage being injured, but
not
fatally.  Lincoln was shot in Ford’s Theater. Kennedy was shot in a Ford
Lincoln.

Both assassins were born in ’39.  Both were Southerners favoring
extremist
views.  Both are known by their first, middle and last names.   Booth
ran
from the theater and was captured in a warehouse.  Oswald ran from the
warehouse and was captured in a theater.  Both were themselves
assassinated
before their trials.

Both President’s successors were Southern Democrats.  Both successors
had
the last name of Johnson.  Both successors were Vice-Presidents.  Both
successors were born in ’08.  Both successors were former senators.

Both President’s caskets were carried in death on the same caisson.

God Bless

F.

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] new orleans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:17:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard you’re back from New Orleans! We want all the dirt, did Patrick
set fire to his guitar, did he tongue kiss on stage with Dr. Mash? Did
everyone do ibogaine and have a group orgy? Details! Howard it’s all up
to you, patrick stopped writing anything so if you’re covering what
happened at the conference in case you weren’t sure we don’t care about
the boring stuff, we want all the dirt! 🙂 🙂 🙂 Who had sex, who did
drugs, who got in a fight! That’s the least I expect from something
moderated by Patrick, don’t let us down.

.:vector:.

— HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 11/15/04 9:29:26 PM, rachelradha@yahoo.com writes:

Also, can anyone recommend which scientific literature
on the Ibogaine Dossier I could /should bring with me
to familiarize the psychopharmacologist with Eboga’s
neurochemistry?

http://www.ibogaine.org/alkaloids.html

Howard

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Hitting the Week Two Wall
Date: November 15, 2004 at 10:53:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/15/04 9:29:26 PM, rachelradha@yahoo.com writes:

Also, can anyone recommend which scientific literature
on the Ibogaine Dossier I could /should bring with me
to familiarize the psychopharmacologist with Eboga’s
neurochemistry?

http://www.ibogaine.org/alkaloids.html

Howard

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 10:07:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

big brudder
—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Ron, for some reason, your mail to the Ibogaine group is coming to my address at hotmail and I’m not sure it is going to the ibogaine mailbox. don’t know how this happened, but I got the “bounce and probe” letter also, and don’t know what it means.  Faith

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the day ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out of here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files. what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley about computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.  thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for right now. I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we can understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 9:58:54 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

could’ve used some extras, where were these angels? rwd
—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 5:39 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

— Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.com> wrote:

Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to
addicts to vote

where? when? what drugs? sounds like FOX propaganda to me.

_.dh

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?
Date: November 15, 2004 at 9:48:40 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

barbarism is not confined to the middle east—- From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 6:50 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?

Hi Ron,
Haven’t done the Milford track yet although my mother and sister have, it
sounds truly awesome. One day…
Not sure what is used for benzo’s, we got the Methadone monkey and that’s
about it.  Heard of people just being taken off just like that, met a woman
recently who it happened to after 6 years on benzo’s, poor girl, didn’t
understand that she had a habit and she was going thru detox.  She thought
NA was for “hard drugs”. Would like to meet her doc and do unspeakable
things to him.
KD

—–Original Message—–
From: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net]
Sent: Tuesday, 16 November 2004 3:02 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?

i love your country. hiked the milford track  2 times.  can’t say much about

ibo as i’v e got a benzo jones.  what do docs down ther use to detox people
on benzos? rd
—– Original Message —– From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 3:48 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?

Hello all from New Zealand
I am new to this list and am looking forward to receiving emails from this
list.
I am planning on doing Ibogaine (again, first one was just a crude form of
Iboga) soon and found this website:- http://www.indra.dk/
I don’t know how reliable it is, but it seems to sell better quality than
the last site I bought from (can’t remember name).
Any advice on this would be great.
Thanks
Kirsty


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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 15, 2004 at 9:22:31 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“am quitting smoking cigs.  It’s not even that hard…I always say, if I can quit heroin and methadone, cigs don’t even compare…”

Not to sound short tempered or anything but good for you. I’m not the same.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <CrookedEye420@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 3:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

Well, I quit heroin and methadone with Iboga but kept on smoking cigarettes.  Now that I am fully recovered(been about 6-7 months), I am quitting smoking cigs.  It’s not even that hard.  If I buy a pack, I’ll smoke 20 in a day, but if I don’t buy them I may smoke one or two.  I haven’t had a cigarette in two days, and it’s not even bothering me, unless someone around me smokes, then I want one.  Other than that it is pretty easy to quit cigs for me.  I always say, if I can quit heroin and methadone, cigs don’t even compare…

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Enzyme/Brain Receptor Switches Addiction On & Off
Date: November 15, 2004 at 8:58:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://www.news.utoronto.ca/bin5/040120b.asp

cheers,
Julie

— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:

is there a link to this online please?

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for
enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation
Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 10:12 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Enzyme/Brain Receptor Switches
Addiction On & Off

Brain receptor switches addiction on, off: study
Findings suggest that enzyme may be manipulated
pharmacologically to control brain receptor

by Jessica Whiteside

The discovery of a molecular “addiction switch” in
the
mammalian brain has the potential to control the
addiction process in drug addicts, say U of T
researchers.

A study published Jan. 18 in the online edition of
Nature Neuroscience finds that a region of the
brain
called the VTA contains receptors that, when
exposed
to a certain enzyme, can control the switch from
an
addicted to non-addicted state and back again.
This
goes against previous ideas that viewed drug
addiction
as a permanent change in the brain, says lead
author
Steven Laviolette who conducted the research while
a
PhD student at U of T’s Department of Anatomy and
Cell
Biology with senior author Professor Derek van der
Kooy.

“Our findings suggest that instead of a permanent
alteration in the brain, there’s actually a switch
that goes on between two separate systems (one
that
mediates the brain’s response to drugs while not
yet
addicted and the other that mediates response once
addicted),” says Laviolette. “They also suggest we
may
be able to manipulate that switch
pharmacologically to
take drug addicts back to a non-addicted state in
a
relatively short period of time so they do not
crave
the drug.”

The switch is a brain receptor known as GABA-A; an
enzyme – carbonic anhydrase – produced by the body
controls how the receptor behaves. In studies with
rats, the researchers were able to manipulate the
enzyme with a drug to control whether it turned
this
switch on or off. Without such intervention, the
brain
can switch back to a non-addicted state following
a
period of withdrawal from drugs – a process often
measured in weeks. By manipulating the enzyme
pharmacologically, however, that return to a
non-addicted state in rats has been reduced to a
matter of hours, says Laviolette, now a
post-doctoral
fellow at the University of Pittsburgh.

“The same anatomical pathways that we’re
manipulating
in rats also exist in humans so we hope that this
will
be applicable to human drug addiction as well,” he
says.

Collaborators on the study, funded by the Canadian
Institutes of Health Research, included Roger
Gallegos
and Steven Henriksen of the Scripps Research
Institute
in California.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?
Date: November 15, 2004 at 7:50:21 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Ron,
Haven’t done the Milford track yet although my mother and sister have, it
sounds truly awesome. One day…
Not sure what is used for benzo’s, we got the Methadone monkey and that’s
about it.  Heard of people just being taken off just like that, met a woman
recently who it happened to after 6 years on benzo’s, poor girl, didn’t
understand that she had a habit and she was going thru detox.  She thought
NA was for “hard drugs”. Would like to meet her doc and do unspeakable
things to him.
KD

—–Original Message—–
From: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net]
Sent: Tuesday, 16 November 2004 3:02 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?

i love your country. hiked the milford track  2 times.  can’t say much about

ibo as i’v e got a benzo jones.  what do docs down ther use to detox people
on benzos? rd
—– Original Message —–
From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 3:48 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?

Hello all from New Zealand
I am new to this list and am looking forward to receiving emails from this
list.
I am planning on doing Ibogaine (again, first one was just a crude form of
Iboga) soon and found this website:- http://www.indra.dk/
I don’t know how reliable it is, but it seems to sell better quality than
the last site I bought from (can’t remember name).
Any advice on this would be great.
Thanks
Kirsty


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
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Version: 6.0.791 / Virus Database: 535 – Release Date: 11/08/2004

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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre
Date: November 15, 2004 at 7:38:31 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

None of my business but Rupert Sheldrake believes that there is a collective
memorie of the human race a pool of knowing. We all can access this and it
explains why each generation gets faster and smarter.  We don’t retain this
but like the internet we can access it when we have need. This is for all
life, this expains why when they grow a crystal in a lab in another lab the
results start to get faster as if the crystals had a blueprint, this is why
birds that don’t migrate can learn a new behavior in a small town and have
that behavior suddenly start in other countries.  These are documented
cases…he feels there is a field that we can’t yet measure that provides us
and all animals with a resource of knowledge.  And there is also a book
called The ancestor syndrome, transgeneration pscholtherapy for problems
that seem to crop up in generations that you might be interested in…..Take
a look what will it hurt?  Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 10:09 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre

How bizzarrrrre 🙂

The lives of President Kennedy and President Lincoln had so many parallels
that it cannot be dismissed as pure coincidence. To my mind, these
parallels
are evidence of history repeating itself and evidence of reincarnation. To
me, these parallels may be circumstantial evidence that President Kennedy
was the reincarnation of President Lincoln.  You decide for yourself.

Both were elected to Congress in ’46.  Both were elected President in ’60.
Both had the legality of their elections contested.  Both were directly
involved with black civil rights.  Both lost a son while serving as
President.  Both were killed while serving as President.

Lincoln’s staffer, whose name was Kennedy, advised him not to go to the
theater.  Kennedy’s secretary, whose name was Lincoln, advised him not to
go
to Dallas.  Lincoln was fond of Monroe, Maryland (He had visited it a week
before he was shot).  Kennedy was fond of Marilyn Monroe.

Both were shot on a Friday.  Both were shot in the head from behind.  Both
were shot in the presence of their wives.  Both were shot while sitting
with
another couple.

Both were shot with another member of their entourage being injured, but
not
fatally.  Lincoln was shot in Ford’s Theater. Kennedy was shot in a Ford
Lincoln.

Both assassins were born in ’39.  Both were Southerners favoring extremist
views.  Both are known by their first, middle and last names.   Booth ran
from the theater and was captured in a warehouse.  Oswald ran from the
warehouse and was captured in a theater.  Both were themselves
assassinated
before their trials.

Both President’s successors were Southern Democrats.  Both successors had
the last name of Johnson.  Both successors were Vice-Presidents.  Both
successors were born in ’08.  Both successors were former senators.

Both President’s caskets were carried in death on the same caisson.

God Bless

F.

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Hitting the Week Two Wall
Date: November 15, 2004 at 7:15:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen & Sara, we are thinking of you.  I have a red
candle to light tonight when I get back from my
meeting.

Glad to here N’awlins session was so well attended.

Here Jeff’s hitting his post-treatment week two “wuss”
wall, I guess like you Randy.  Would like to think it
is the Mars in Scorpio opening up a can of whoopass on
his astrological tendencies.  But cranky & surly is
the man.  Phew. I liked it a little better when he was
teary/sad raw instead of angry/pissed off raw, but
that’s my reactive codependent stuff.

If you’re new on the list, he detoxed last weekend
from 50 mg of methadone, after about a 27 year run
that ended with a pretty stable 9 yrs at The Clinic.
Now he’s craving red meat and pineapple.  So much
freaking pineapple!!!  Taking lots of baths.  Smoking
a little ganja, but not much.

We’re looking at one more booster, and then I think
he’s headed back onto the Zoloft he was taking until
August when he decided to taper off in prep for
treatment.  We have no benzos besides Ambien, which
seemed to link to his current mood, so I’m hoping that
his clinic’s aftercare doc will prescribe him the
combo you described, Julie.

Schmoolyboy, you said wait 48 hours post-Ibo, right?
And augment with maybe 25 mg Seroquel for the first
week or two until the Zoloft kicks in?  What was the
alternative dosing with the “natural” anti-D SAM-E?
Sorry to ask for a repeat, but my inbox is so full of
ibogaine list messages I can’t find that information.

Also, can anyone recommend which scientific literature
on the Ibogaine Dossier I could /should bring with me
to familiarize the psychopharmacologist with Eboga’s
neurochemistry?

One “weird” detox note — Jeff woke up this morning
with a sienna orange “dyed” look to the tip of his
thumb and first two fingers, on both hands. It didn’t
go away in the bath but faded later in the morning. We
both had similar detox marks in the summer when “our
guru” was around… I got them on my toes and a few
spots on my palms.  Funky, but maybe someone more
scientifically minded has an alternate theory.

Lots of Love,
Rachel

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 6:39:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

— Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.com> wrote:

Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to
addicts to vote

where? when? what drugs? sounds like FOX propaganda to me.

_.dh

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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 15, 2004 at 6:19:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Anti seizure drugs have not been shown to prevent alcohol and or benzo withdrawal seizures. the literature is exact on this. Yet, they are still given.with the attiotude that “Wll it cant hurt” most antoconvulsants are also mood stabilizers and help with anxiety , sleep and bipolar wierdness.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 15, 2004 at 6:17:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Just cause somepatients don’t have seizures does nnot mean a rapid benzo taper is safe. It is not and it is cruel. Taper slowly.

From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 15, 2004 at 5:27:21 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I don’t eat very much soy either not being a vegan.

Hi Ann,
Yes , people do use soy as a replacement for their protein intake. If you’re feeling grounded and don’t have notice any physical annoyances after eating it, that’s good. My personal relationship with soy is I have always intuitively stayed away from it. I don’t freak out over the tofu in my hot and sour take out soup but it is one of those common allergin foods and way overused in the health food industry.  It’s become the new wheat. Soy cheese, soy yogurt,soycrackers,chips,pudding,milk,etc the list is endless. The quickest way to get a sensitivity to a food is by eating it to often. The same food idealy should only be consumed 2x a week. Or eat a food for a while and then give it a break.  That’s actually what eating foods in season are supposed to do for us if we followed nature. Hemp seeds are 35% protein. rice and beans are supposed to combine to form a complete  protein.
If it works for you that’s what its all about. Thanks for the imput since it is not one of my sources I sometimes forget to mention it.
Martee
> in meat.

SNIP

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 5:19:10 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

BYW, I do believe our President Bush is
an alcoholic, and quit dirnlking.  Perthaps you would be interested in
learning how he did it.<

He substituted pretzals for alcohol? He was arrested and forced into mandatory treatment? Oh, wait, I know, oooh, oooh me, me! I know this one!
He found GOD! “As he understands him” I’m not sure about (i.e.12-step-type outlooks of that godthing), but I’ve heard tell it’s god that did him right, and not just any god either, but the almight god along with his good and only son jesus christ, saved his soul taught him the true path to love and tolerance and acceptance and a sober way of dealing with life. never uses any drugs nowadays, not with the god/jesus substitution…unless we of course take into consideration those times when Bush’s eyes have been ever so glassy, vague and distant, his words mumbled and slurred, his face bruised, his stories absur…oh, hold on, that would be alcoholic behavior (behavior I myself wouldn’t have any idea the feeling of, seeing as I’ve never had a problem with alcohol, I just used illegal hard drugs instead, so I wouldn’t know anything about making up stories and otherwise alcoholic like behavior, nope, not me, I wouldn’t know one when I see one, nuh-uh)
Or do I have this wrong Faith? Was it something else? Please clue me in. (I don’t have anything against Bush being a drinker or an alcoholic Faith, I would appreciate him being straight with us though, seeing as he didn’t ever have to do any time or mandated treatment I’m aware of, yet he is continuing with the same tired anti-drug policies everyone before him has supported, and he should know better, espeically if the cocaine allegations and other drugs too are true.)

Me, suprised to be caught discussing
Bush’s possible methods of geting
clean with my good buddy Sam,
since gone on to places with more
slower mice and better catnip.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 11:14 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to addicts to vote, and underwear to homeless. (peoplw without rent or house payments)  in exchange for their vote.  And, by the way I’m not addicted to anything, have never conned a Dr. to get drugs, never stolen, wrote a bad check, don’t lie, cheat or steal.  I am interested in ibogaine as a way to help my son who’s an addict.  BTW, he blames no person for this.  He wasn’t born addicted, he chose this addiction.  But in his words when the subject or females choosing to end another persons life “One of those people may have been the person who came up with a cure for AIDS.”  BYW, I do believe our President Bush is an alcoholic, and quit dirnlking.  Perthaps you would be interested in learning how he did it.

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2004 05:11:13 -0800 (PST)

I was watching a news special about the cozy
relationship between Fundamentalists and Right-Wing
Politics( did you know some churches were signing up
voters????), and a thought occurred to me: the “red”
states seem to be populated by people who want to
meddle in other people’s lives…I mean, what is it to
you personally if two men(or women) decide to form a
civil union??  How does it affect your life in any
noticeable way?

I have decided to boycott all things Republican, and
have found a website-in development- that lists
companies who contributed to the Republican campaign.
http://www.boycottrepublican.org/

I am sick of individuals who feel it is their
God-given right to meddle in other people’s affairs.
Why don’t they get off their fat, cornbred, fried
chicken asses and fix some of their own social,
cultural, and economic problems, and leave the rest of
us alone…

Fuckers…

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Enzyme/Brain Receptor Switches Addiction On & Off
Date: November 15, 2004 at 4:32:24 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

is there a link to this online please?

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 10:12 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Enzyme/Brain Receptor Switches Addiction On & Off

Brain receptor switches addiction on, off: study
Findings suggest that enzyme may be manipulated
pharmacologically to control brain receptor

by Jessica Whiteside

The discovery of a molecular “addiction switch” in the
mammalian brain has the potential to control the
addiction process in drug addicts, say U of T
researchers.

A study published Jan. 18 in the online edition of
Nature Neuroscience finds that a region of the brain
called the VTA contains receptors that, when exposed
to a certain enzyme, can control the switch from an
addicted to non-addicted state and back again. This
goes against previous ideas that viewed drug addiction
as a permanent change in the brain, says lead author
Steven Laviolette who conducted the research while a
PhD student at U of T’s Department of Anatomy and Cell
Biology with senior author Professor Derek van der
Kooy.

“Our findings suggest that instead of a permanent
alteration in the brain, there’s actually a switch
that goes on between two separate systems (one that
mediates the brain’s response to drugs while not yet
addicted and the other that mediates response once
addicted),” says Laviolette. “They also suggest we may
be able to manipulate that switch pharmacologically to
take drug addicts back to a non-addicted state in a
relatively short period of time so they do not crave
the drug.”

The switch is a brain receptor known as GABA-A; an
enzyme – carbonic anhydrase – produced by the body
controls how the receptor behaves. In studies with
rats, the researchers were able to manipulate the
enzyme with a drug to control whether it turned this
switch on or off. Without such intervention, the brain
can switch back to a non-addicted state following a
period of withdrawal from drugs – a process often
measured in weeks. By manipulating the enzyme
pharmacologically, however, that return to a
non-addicted state in rats has been reduced to a
matter of hours, says Laviolette, now a post-doctoral
fellow at the University of Pittsburgh.

“The same anatomical pathways that we’re manipulating
in rats also exist in humans so we hope that this will
be applicable to human drug addiction as well,” he
says.

Collaborators on the study, funded by the Canadian
Institutes of Health Research, included Roger Gallegos
and Steven Henriksen of the Scripps Research Institute
in California.

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 4:08:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,
You could very well be right. What struck me with your internment camp dream was the husband, the kid, the complete scenario that existed there.  I guess it’s one thing to believe in God and then another to try to figure out what that means.  I don’t believe the whole worm food, this is all there is stuff personally, or that there is only on go around.  I think a big turning point for me was when my nephew was born 12 years ago and I just got the scense that he didn’t start fresh at birth. We have an amazing closeness that didn’t come from just one life. I’ll tell you my addiction release dream that happened 2 weeks after my iboga session.  I was sitting in what I can only describe as a courtyard outside some open structure. There were plenty of other people sitting around as well. On my lap I had a big book thing that when I opened up was full of ornate pins and jewelry. Standing in front of me was a guy who was familiar to me, but not particularly well liked.  He pulled a knife on me and told me to give me the jewelry.  I stood up and told him to watch his shit or I would do to him what I’ve taught women and children to do to attackers.  He then pulls 2 knifes on me, to my throat.  I then put my hands on his head, somehow calmed him and got him to sit down in a chair without his knifes. The guy and the activity and myself were the only real prominent things in this dream. Everything else was there but not sharp.  Myself and two others thought this was me standing up to my addiction.  I’ve heard that Jesus taught about reincarnation.  It was the local powers that be that did away with that teaching because it’s how you control a population to make them think this is all there is, so watch your shit or we’ll take it away.  Humans, like animals have a survival instinct. People that need tactile proof won’t even be sure of that life everlasting, heaven type thing. So they go under the thumb and remain controled.  My proof besides what I feel instinctively and the many many conversations I’ve had with many many people who don’t bullshit me is what has helped form my belief system.  Be open to the possibility, it’s like when you get a red car.  All of a sudden you never noticed how very many red cars are on the road!  Is that scientific?
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 4:07:00 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith,

Church and State must be SEPARATE- an quick
examination of history will reveal that.  Giving
sandwiches out would qualify more as a charitable,
merciful act, and you as a Christian should be down
with that.

I never insinuated you were an addict; therefore,
please don’t assume I’m an alcoholic, as I have never
been dependant on the stuff.  In fact, post-Ibo, I
find alcohol revolting….

I just don’t understand the motivations of people who
choose to vote Republican.  Guess I never will.

Julie

— Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.com> wrote:

Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to
addicts to vote, and
underwear to homeless. (peoplw without rent or house
payments)  in exchange
for their vote.  And, by the way I’m not addicted to
anything, have never
conned a Dr. to get drugs, never stolen, wrote a bad
check, don’t lie, cheat
or steal.  I am interested in ibogaine as a way to
help my son who’s an
addict.  BTW, he blames no person for this.  He
wasn’t born addicted, he
chose this addiction.  But in his words when the
subject or females choosing
to end another persons life “One of those people may
have been the person
who came up with a cure for AIDS.”  BYW, I do
believe our President Bush is
an alcoholic, and quit dirnlking.  Perthaps you
would be interested in
learning how he did it.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The all-new My Yahoo! – Get yours free!
http://my.yahoo.com

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 15, 2004 at 3:56:17 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There’s a recent study showing that soybeans double the chance of
dementia in older men, presumably because they contain an analogue
of estrogen. Younger men weren’t studied.

I’m not familiar with that study, would love to see it.  I will do a search.

It just happens that all men have estrogen in their bodies.  All women
have testosterone in their bodies.  In fact, all estrogen produced in
the adrenals starts as a molecule of testesterone.  There is a cascade
wherein starting with a molecule of cholesterol and the action of
enzymes along this metabolic pathway hormones are produced.  The
first step results in pregnenolone followed by DHEA, etc. This hormonal
cascade is shone in most endocrine texts if anyone cares to look it up.
Then, one must take into consideration the body cells and their receptors.
There is a diferent mix of receptors in the female than the male.  A long
complicated story 🙂

Dr. Barry Sears (The Zone Diet) wrote a book entitled, “The Soy Zone.”
He is a PhD Biochemist.  He wrote this book to help vegetarians
follow his Zone Diet.  He considers Soy a complete protein.

My understanding was that soy is not complete protein, needs a
grain to complement it, and that non-meat diets require a source of
B12 which means vitamin pills or brewer’s yeast. This was based on ”
Diet for a Small Planet,” which summed up research 30 years ago.

I have both the books, “Diet for a Small Planet and Recipes for a
Small Planet” On page 159 of “Diet For a Small Plalnet:  “Myth No.
4…..The usability of egg and milk protein is greater than that of meat ,
and the usability of soy protein is about equal to that of meat.”

Other kinds of beans are not as good a source of protein but by adding
grains or milk, etc.  a complete protein is formed with some carbs left
over.The most worrisome fact for me is that vegan diets have no B12.
Unless that dieter supplements with B12 their bodies suffer from this
deficiency.

Just my two cents worth…..  This is an old War and nobody wins.  The
protein consumers usually go right eating it and the vegan go right on
not eating it.  “A man (woman) convinced against his will is of the same
opinion still”  🙂

Cheers

ann
think@francom.com

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 05:11:13 -0800 “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@
francomm.com> wrote:
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Some of us don’t do well on a vegan/vegetarian diet because of
the lact of protein and/or fat.  Soy is the only plant I know of
that
can substitute for animal protein.  Soy has all the amino acids
contained
in meat.  There is a product called Tempeh which is made from soy.
This is available at a lot of grocery stores.  It comes in a firm
oblong
piece and lots of things can be made with it.  It does not have a
strong flavor and can be flavored any way you want.  It works
really
well in spaghetti, lasgne for instance.  I grate it, saute it in
olive oil
and use it in the place of ground meat.  Works well.

Best regards

ann
think@francomm.com

I was Vegan for 5yrs from age 15 to 20 and when I eventually went

back to
eating milk products I was pig-sick for 2 whole weeks-mainly
diarrhoea but
also vomiting.  I’m sure our bodies don’t want much of that shit

inside
us!

Sadly I gave in to pressure and returned to Vegetarism and have
never been
strong enough since to return to being Vegan.  Hell, I wanna
escape all
this
crap-‘drugs’, sugar, fags, caffeine, milk products etc.
Unfortunately my
heavily dope smoking boyf doesn’t like the idea (except there’ll

be more
chocolate for him!)

I just want to feel healthy and have ENERGY! 😉

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 2:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

__________________________________
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From: CrookedEye420@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 15, 2004 at 3:02:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well, I quit heroin and methadone with Iboga but kept on smoking cigarettes.  Now that I am fully recovered(been about 6-7 months), I am quitting smoking cigs.  It’s not even that hard.  If I buy a pack, I’ll smoke 20 in a day, but if I don’t buy them I may smoke one or two.  I haven’t had a cigarette in two days, and it’s not even bothering me, unless someone around me smokes, then I want one.  Other than that it is pretty easy to quit cigs for me.  I always say, if I can quit heroin and methadone, cigs don’t even compare…

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 15, 2004 at 1:42:34 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank’s Preston
Do you have any informations, stories on Ibo and nicotine
God bless
F
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:57 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction

“The withdrawal from tobacco is as difficult and painful as the withdrawal
from alcohol and heroin. Acute withdrawal of nicotine results in severe
disruptions to the nervous system, including tremors, agitation and
abnormal
heart rhythms. People withdrawing from nicotine cannot properly digest
their
food, nor pass waste. They cannot concentrate and their fine-motor
function
is impaired.”

Hi all,
As someone who currently is battling the psychological ramifications
of
just WANTING to quit smoking, not even actually doing more than cutting
down
slightly at this point, I read the following article, from which the above
quote is culled, and find myself wondering once again at the insanity of a
society that locks up people for using SOME highly addictive substances
(and
some, like pot for instance, that aren’t), yet not for others, others
which
are in reality the most damaging, most destructive, least friendly and
wonderful of all the substances we could be using.
Anyway, I thought I’d pass this one to the rest of you.

http://www.marinij.com/Stories/0,1413,234~24409~2536223,00.html
Breathing life into the Smokeout
snip-
This Thursday is the annual Great American Smokeout, the day on which
smokers attempt to go 24 hours without using tobacco. Some nonsmokers will
ask, “So what’s the big deal?”
The big deal is about addiction. Regardless of how offensive tobacco use
is
to some people, we nonsmokers must remember that tobacco use is truly an
addiction. According to the American Cancer Society, there are an
estimated
46 million smokers in the United States.
An addiction is more than just a strong craving, with additional negative
connotations superimposed by one’s society. The presence of addiction
implies a physical dependence. This is as true for nicotine as it is for
heroin or alcohol.
Once a person has been using tobacco steadily for a short time, nicotine
begins to affect the nervous system, the part of the body that controls
all
of our thoughts and functions. Nicotine becomes a neurotransmitter; that
is,
it acts as one of the many chemicals that transmit signals through the
nervous system.
In the presence of nicotine, a body shuts down the production of its own
endogenous neurotransmitters, which have become redundant and not useful.
Nicotine then controls the processes of digestion and cardiac function, to
name just a few.
The withdrawal from tobacco is as difficult and painful as the withdrawal
from alcohol and heroin. Acute withdrawal of nicotine results in severe
disruptions to the nervous system, including tremors, agitation and
abnormal
heart rhythms. People withdrawing from nicotine cannot properly digest
their
food, nor pass waste. They cannot concentrate and their fine-motor
function
is impaired.
The Great American Smokeout is not a day just for smokers. I ask all
nonsmokers to take a day off from ostracizing smokers for their habit, no
matter if it offends you or not. Give a measure of support for those whom
you know are attempting to quit. [and to those who really want to quit but
can’t seem to find the strength to do so…hint nudge to the love of my
life- Preston]
snip-

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Reincarnation : Bizzarrrrre
Date: November 15, 2004 at 1:09:25 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

How bizzarrrrre 🙂

The lives of President Kennedy and President Lincoln had so many parallels
that it cannot be dismissed as pure coincidence. To my mind, these parallels
are evidence of history repeating itself and evidence of reincarnation. To
me, these parallels may be circumstantial evidence that President Kennedy
was the reincarnation of President Lincoln.  You decide for yourself.

Both were elected to Congress in ’46.  Both were elected President in ’60.
Both had the legality of their elections contested.  Both were directly
involved with black civil rights.  Both lost a son while serving as
President.  Both were killed while serving as President.

Lincoln’s staffer, whose name was Kennedy, advised him not to go to the
theater.  Kennedy’s secretary, whose name was Lincoln, advised him not to go
to Dallas.  Lincoln was fond of Monroe, Maryland (He had visited it a week
before he was shot).  Kennedy was fond of Marilyn Monroe.

Both were shot on a Friday.  Both were shot in the head from behind.  Both
were shot in the presence of their wives.  Both were shot while sitting with
another couple.

Both were shot with another member of their entourage being injured, but not
fatally.  Lincoln was shot in Ford’s Theater. Kennedy was shot in a Ford
Lincoln.

Both assassins were born in ’39.  Both were Southerners favoring extremist
views.  Both are known by their first, middle and last names.   Booth ran
from the theater and was captured in a warehouse.  Oswald ran from the
warehouse and was captured in a theater.  Both were themselves assassinated
before their trials.

Both President’s successors were Southern Democrats.  Both successors had
the last name of Johnson.  Both successors were Vice-Presidents.  Both
successors were born in ’08.  Both successors were former senators.

Both President’s caskets were carried in death on the same caisson.

God Bless

F.

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 1:04:07 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You wrote :
I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Here you will find  some  proof:.

http://www.childpastlives.org/stevenson.htm

Its interesting to note that the first Christians used to believe in
reincarnation and A.D. 250 to 553 the contreversy raged. You can investigate
the Gnostics too that had several gospels older than ours gospel and where
discover in 1945.The mystical school of the Sufism for the Musulmans. The
secret Mystical Chabbalist school of the Jews The Bouddhist, Hinduist ect..
most of the planet believe in reincarnation.

Dr. Stevenson investigates more than 3000 cases of reincarnations and wrote
several books on the subject.
I have been doing past-life regression for several years. My clients are not
surprised when they find out who they where and their lives start to make
sense in the light of their new knowledge. We are here to progress, and we
can relax and enjoy the adventure, no rush 🙂  Did I make make sense?/!

God bless
Francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Vivienne Elanta <vivienneelanta@yahoo.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] loved conference so where do I get ibogaine?
Date: November 15, 2004 at 12:52:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I loved the conference too! Very inspirational!

I have the same question, where do I get ibogaine?

Blessed be
Vivienne Elanta

Find local movie times and trailers on Yahoo! Movies.
http://au.movies.yahoo.com

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 12:24:18 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You wrote :
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 9:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:58:15 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Randy,
I don’t have a problem with people owning guns, especially in rural areas where they are utilized as a way of life and yes, if I was some farmer out in the middle of nowhere there exists a possibility I would have some guns. That movie, In Cold Blood can really stick with a person!  As far as the red and blue states go.  If our shores were invaded as bin laden said only you can protect yourself, well all the people with guns are in land. Just an observation.
The gun and rape thing, well If someone has a gun they better have the mindset,knowledge and heart to use it.  Other wise the attacker will take it away from you and then you have armed your attacker!  Also if someone exhibited that kind of heart and strength they would not be chosen as a victim.  The profile of a predator is to hunt the weak. They can read body language and circumstances.  Did you ever see a documentary of the African lions gearing up to go out on a hunt?  They have before them 100,000s of Wildebeast before them.  They as predators have the ability to read the signs and pick up on the easy prey.  The weak the sick the young the lame.  They will get more food off of a big strong male wildebeast and the group may be able to take it down, however being that their success rate is only 1 in 5 they will go for the sure thing.    Same with human predators. They also have survival instincts. They know what they’re doing is wrong and they don’t want to be caught so they are not going to risk it by grapling, fighting with or trying to subdue someone that is not weak.   For all those other “what if” scenarios well people should have the skills to keep safe. And once again it all starts with intuition.     Sorry but you got my ire up with that rape comment.
I’m thinking in another day i’ll be well enough to get out of the house and leave the computer alone for awhile.
How’s the catskills this time of year?
Closing with much love and affection,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 8:32 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states

I can’t figure out what rural gun owners have to do with homeland security. Are you implying that all rural gun owners are uneducated and uninformed? Being from the South I can state most emphatically that this is just not true. I grew up hunting and I think everyone should have some gun safety training. When you live on a farm firearms are tools you use. That will never change. Nobody gets home invaded “down home.” And (and this will surely piss someone off) I think every women who is not insane or convicted of violet crime should automatically get a concealed to carry license. Wonder what that would do to rape stats?    Randy

From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:47:54 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, this message came to me, didn’t see it on the ibogaine list.  Thanks.  Faith

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2004 08:02:29 -0600

i love your country. hiked the milford track  2 times.  can’t say much about ibo as i’v e got a benzo jones.  what do docs down ther use to detox people on benzos? rd
—– Original Message —– From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 3:48 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?

Hello all from New Zealand
I am new to this list and am looking forward to receiving emails from this
list.
I am planning on doing Ibogaine (again, first one was just a crude form of
Iboga) soon and found this website:- http://www.indra.dk/
I don’t know how reliable it is, but it seems to sell better quality than
the last site I bought from (can’t remember name).
Any advice on this would be great.
Thanks
Kirsty


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.791 / Virus Database: 535 – Release Date: 11/08/2004

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (ot) Re: [Ibogaine] faith’s hate
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:39:42 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Cc: <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith wrote >Thats okay I had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found this is just another hate site against our president in war time.<

Faith,
Yes indeed, I cannot stand Bush nor his ilk. Yes indeed I am astounded that more of my fellow citizen do not seem to see what a flat out evil man he is nor that dropping bombs on other people is BAD. Living in Manhattan less than a mile from “ground zero” I can vouch for the awful horror that come with dropping bombs on cities, whether the bomb is in the form of an airplane as happened here or in the form of manufactured bombs as is happening in Iraq now, today. Therefore I will continue to speak out emphatically about my thoughts on the whole “some bombing good, some bombing bad” mentality, especially if I see notes supportive of Bush, and asserting that the person posting, such as yourself, is a representative of “decent people”- as though those of us opposed to prohibiton, bombing other people, warmongering, fear-instilling, hate-spreading, religious intolerance, sexual discrimination, and other flat out nasty behavior are not “decent”- popping up on the ibogaine list, a list dedicated to what I feel anyway is harm reduction. I can’t see what we’re doing in Iraq or much of anywhere for that matter as reducing any harms whatsoever, and if you or anyone else continues to insist on posting lauditory messages pro-Bush, I imagine you or whoever it is posting such messages will continue to reap the rewards of such posting. We have to be willing to take responsibility for our actions, including posting on the ibogaine list these what seem to me to be blatantly and willfully ignorant, uneducated, hateful, mystifying “I luv Bush, he can do no wrong and never has” notes.
With all this said though, it appears to me that you are not only supportive of Bush and his evil plots and plans and war for the sake of war, but you are also apparently being very selective in what you are reading here, as I myself have seen all sorts of messages come through since you made your appearance here on the ibogaine list, many of which deal specifically with drugs and addiction and how to combat the addictions or at least make life a bit better for those addicted and for those who live with and love the addicted.
So please, whether I disagree openly or not with your political views, stick around a while, as you may very well stumble across some information of the sort you really are seeking and need to find apparently. Come to think of it, I myself have yet to actually see you do more than briefly mention your son’s troubles with addiction- I’ve seen very few particulars from you, mainly just “oooo, everyone here is sooo hateful and disagrees with me” messages instead of “how do I get the help I feel my son needs” messages. I mean, you’ve even posted that your son has already taken ibogaine and didn’t get anything out of it, begging the next question- what exactly are you seeking here on the ibogaine list then, please? I hate to think you were scared off by my and others’ opposition politically. Addiction has no politics, and affects everyone no matter who they support for President, and no matter how many bombs they wish dropped on other people. (Karma though is something you may want to research more, come to think of it, as I am a firm believer in Karma, and I honestly feel that anyone who wishes death, pain and anguish on others is going to be dealing with some might horrific, hard-core karma in my opinion.)
Sorry, I couldn’t help that.
Anyway, please try to focus on exactly what it is you want here, and let me or all of us know, so we may be able to communicate with you on another level without being reminded how your (what seem to many of us here, as near as I can tell from the responses to your “I LUV that Bush” messages, as meanhearted, judgmental- not that I myself am doing any judging here or anything- and murderous) political views.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 11:09 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

hate’s a very strong word, Faith.

but if you expect support for a [p]resident of the likes of GWBush on a
list like this, well don’t hold yer breath.

On Sunday, November 14, 2004, at 11:03 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be  deleted form the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that  means.  Thats okay I had been interested in discussing ways to kick  drug addiction–but found this is just another hate site against our  president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay  brain understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge  for the day ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep,  assuming i make it out of here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said  my emails from the forum concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i  c/n open the digest files.  what does it mean, am i bugged by the  man, what’s up?  i know diddley about computers(was a pinball wizard,  pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure with all the bush babies on  the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.  thoughts? all accepted  w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed  in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic  tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to  treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also  had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my  dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have  experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my dope  dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in  addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past 3  mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence the  act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually did  anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one where I  was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing something  and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all  fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when  you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any  higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I  smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In  the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I  experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a month  out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and had a  carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was  entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked  it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still  experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want  to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder the  natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of my  whole food thing for right now. I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about  their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little  to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem  solving if we can understand our own representations.  I personally  don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it means  this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll  let you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from  McAfee® Security.  http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:38:57 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,
This last paragraph had me laughing more than the penguins.  I feel it’s quite possible the way the democrates got a lot of new voters out so did the republicans in those mid states.  However they got them out on the gay marriage thing.  Shows you how well fear motivates people.  It’s possible the mindset and perception of many of these people are that they are rallying to save their families, loved ones and all future unborn generations from the deviant activity of homosexuality which most don’t differentiate between that and pedophilia.  Throw a little fire and brimstone as you claim to be Gods messenger and it’s as good as a done deal.—– Original Message —–      I must say, I like your spunk! Martee
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 8:11 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans

I was watching a news special about the cozy
relationship between Fundamentalists and Right-Wing
Politics( did you know some churches were signing up
voters????), and a thought occurred to me: the “red”
states seem to be populated by people who want to
meddle in other people’s lives…I mean, what is it to
you personally if two men(or women) decide to form a
civil union??  How does it affect your life in any
noticeable way?

I have decided to boycott all things Republican, and
have found a website-in development- that lists
companies who contributed to the Republican campaign.
http://www.boycottrepublican.org/

I am sick of individuals who feel it is their
God-given right to meddle in other people’s affairs.
Why don’t they get off their fat, cornbred, fried
chicken asses and fix some of their own social,
cultural, and economic problems, and leave the rest of
us alone…

Fuckers…

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state- for Sara
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:37:19 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie ,

All is well on this side, a little nervous but that’s normal,
We are going to start tomorrow.

I will report.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Verzonden: maandag 15 november 2004 14:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state- for Sara

well said, Sara… BTW, how is Jasen??  Please say
hello to him…

love Julie
— Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:

Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost
so many lives.
To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to
be done with occupation,
After all war is not an answer when money talks.
I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many
more who will  have part
of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has
no weapon in his hand to
fight evil.
Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself
talk on the TV.
Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
At least he has a hands he can shake with, some
people don’t and they are
only 20 years old kids.

Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it
doesn’t look like it on
TV.

If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war.
He would be a friend
with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand
that working together
Is better then killing each other.

It is just shame that people want to save a life of
an addict with Ibogaine
treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a
silly war game of some rich
people.
And those rich people will get their ways anyways as
they are corrupted by
power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.

It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants
to be at war time.

The enemy is in your head. People always can be
friends, just like they did
before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God,
then God he should pray
to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are
lost thanks to his
policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more
of his and other
citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said
I would be deleted form

the list if messages got bounced again–whatever
that means.  Thats okay I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug
addiction–but found
this is just another hate site against our president
in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.
this, as my lay brain
understands it, is the time when we problem solve
and recharge for the day
ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep,
assuming i make it out of

here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails
from the forum
concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n
open the digest files.
what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s
up?  i know diddley about

computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m
in the dark. i figure
with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least
of anyones worries.
thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i
could open them but
don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and
after that noticed in
the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are
a therapeutic tool for
onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.
Prior to treatment I
would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.
I also had the ability
to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like
extremely sharp sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can
taste in my dreams,
feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and
have experienced twice
the state of being high.  In the past all my dope
dreams(including 5 years
worth after my first interuption in addiction from
ages 15-18) as well as
the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about
procuring everything I
needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my
apparatus.  I never
ever actually did anything in any of these many
dreams.  Last week I had
one where I was sitting in my mothers living room
and actually doing
something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t
the best high we all
fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this
buzz you get when you’ve
done too much not so good drugs and you’re not
getting any higher.  It was
NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago,
I smoked some pot I had

in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the
dream they were rolled
too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an
actuall marijuana high.

I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t
drank alcohol for 12
years until a month out of treatment I was with a
group in a mexican
restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I
got buzzed on 3 oz. and
it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I
realized how much I liked

it I decided not to induldge again while my brain
is still experiencing the

combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want
to muck up the
experience with anything that is going to hinder
the natural process of
what is happening.  This may explain part of my
whole food thing for right
now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share
anything about their
dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases
emotion and junk we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed
that have little to no
meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or
problem solving if we can
understand our own representations.  I personally
don’t believe in those
books that say if you see this symbol it means
this.  Everyone has their
own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve
noticed re your brain that’s
different would help.  Any of you phds or educated
types that have any
technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,
Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find
out differently I’ll let
you know.

_________________________________________________________________
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:28:37 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Ann,
Yes , people do use soy as a replacement for their protein intake. If you’re feeling grounded and don’t have notice any physical annoyances after eating it, that’s good. My personal relationship with soy is I have always intuitively stayed away from it. I don’t freak out over the tofu in my hot and sour take out soup but it is one of those common allergin foods and way overused in the health food industry.  It’s become the new wheat.  Soy cheese, soy yogurt,soycrackers,chips,pudding,milk,etc the list is endless. The quickest way to get a sensitivity to a food is by eating it to often. The same food idealy should only be consumed 2x a week. Or eat a food for a while and then give it a break.  That’s actually what eating foods in season are supposed to do for us if we followed nature. Hemp seeds are 35% protein. rice and beans are supposed to combine to form a complete  protein.
If it works for you that’s what its all about. Thanks for the imput since it is not one of my sources I sometimes forget to mention it.
Martee
> in meat. There is a product called Tempeh which is made from soy.
This is available at a lot of grocery stores.  It comes in a firm oblong
piece and lots of things can be made with it.  It does not have a
strong flavor and can be flavored any way you want.  It works really
well in spaghetti, lasgne for instance.  I grate it, saute it in olive oil
and use it in the place of ground meat.  Works well.

Best regards

ann
think@francomm.com

I was Vegan for 5yrs from age 15 to 20 and when I eventually went back to
eating milk products I was pig-sick for 2 whole weeks-mainly diarrhoea but
also vomiting.  I’m sure our bodies don’t want much of that shit inside us!

Sadly I gave in to pressure and returned to Vegetarism and have never been
strong enough since to return to being Vegan.  Hell, I wanna escape all this
crap-‘drugs’, sugar, fags, caffeine, milk products etc.  Unfortunately my
heavily dope smoking boyf doesn’t like the idea (except there’ll be more
chocolate for him!)

I just want to feel healthy and have ENERGY! 😉

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 2:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:14:52 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes, and the democrats were offfering drugs to addicts to vote, and underwear to homeless. (peoplw without rent or house payments)  in exchange for their vote.  And, by the way I’m not addicted to anything, have never conned a Dr. to get drugs, never stolen, wrote a bad check, don’t lie, cheat or steal.  I am interested in ibogaine as a way to help my son who’s an addict.  BTW, he blames no person for this.  He wasn’t born addicted, he chose this addiction.  But in his words when the subject or females choosing to end another persons life “One of those people may have been the person who came up with a cure for AIDS.”  BYW, I do believe our President Bush is an alcoholic, and quit dirnlking.  Perthaps you would be interested in learning how he did it.

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: Mon, 15 Nov 2004 05:11:13 -0800 (PST)

I was watching a news special about the cozy
relationship between Fundamentalists and Right-Wing
Politics( did you know some churches were signing up
voters????), and a thought occurred to me: the “red”
states seem to be populated by people who want to
meddle in other people’s lives…I mean, what is it to
you personally if two men(or women) decide to form a
civil union??  How does it affect your life in any
noticeable way?

I have decided to boycott all things Republican, and
have found a website-in development- that lists
companies who contributed to the Republican campaign.
http://www.boycottrepublican.org/

I am sick of individuals who feel it is their
God-given right to meddle in other people’s affairs.
Why don’t they get off their fat, cornbred, fried
chicken asses and fix some of their own social,
cultural, and economic problems, and leave the rest of
us alone…

Fuckers…

__________________________________
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www.yahoo.com

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:10:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

but if you expect support for a [p]resident of the likes of GWBush

on a list like this, well don’t hold yer breath.

I think Norris was speaking for Bush too.

Come to think of it, I think the list would probably be critical
and dismayed with any president.. unless perhaps s/he
decriminalised ibogaine 🙂

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 20:09:56 -0800 D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:
hate’s a very strong word, Faith.

but if you expect support for a [p]resident of the likes of GWBush

on a
list like this, well don’t hold yer breath.

On Sunday, November 14, 2004, at 11:03 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be

deleted form the list if messages got bounced again–whatever
that
means.  Thats okay I had been interested in discussing ways to
kick
drug addiction–but found this is just another hate site against

our
president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my
lay
brain understands it, is the time when we problem solve and
recharge
for the day ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep,
assuming i make it out of here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot,
said
my emails from the forum concerning the digest are bouncing
back.  i
c/n open the digest files.  what does it mean, am i bugged by
the
man, what’s up?  i know diddley about computers(was a pinball
wizard,
pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure with all the bush
babies on
the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.  thoughts? all
accepted
w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but don’t know how,

ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that
noticed
in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a
therapeutic
tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.
Prior to
treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.
I also
had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp
sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my

dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and
have
experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my
dope
dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in
addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past

3
mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence
the
act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually
did
anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one
where I
was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
something
and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all

fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get
when
you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting
any
higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days
ago, I
smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.

In
the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I

experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in

probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a
month
out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and

had a
carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was
entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I
liked
it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still
experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t
want
to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder

the
natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of

my
whole food thing for right now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything
about
their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and
junk we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have
little
to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem

solving if we can understand our own representations.  I
personally
don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it

means
this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your
brain
that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types

that
have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently

I’ll
let you know.

_________________________________________________________________

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: slowone: delayed response
Date: November 15, 2004 at 11:06:35 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 18:02:41 -0800 “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.
net> wrote:
I believe the goal is to not hold on to any negative emotion.

I meant hold it while it is there, versus throw it at others
reflexively or turn it inward. Emotions pass like the weather, and
if you hold it, you can let it go. Use it while it is there if it
serves you.

That is what causes illness in the body.

Yes, hanging on or ignoring it keeps it active in a dissociated
state.

An alternative to anger as you see it I believe
would be to have an understanding of the difference between being
aggressive and being assertive.  Being assertive comes from a
place of strength, empowerment,confidence and control.
Being aggressive comes from a wounded ego based place.
Getting caught up in aanger and rage is actually a form of
being manipulated and giving your power away.

Well put.

Much in the same
way that when a person looking for a fight eggs someone else
into one, even though the challenged person thinks they are
exhibiting strength they are being controlled and manipulated
by the bully.

This is Bush’s response to bin Laden – he took the hook, lashed out
aimlessly, and increased his enemies by a huge factor. Winner: bin
Laden.

All good stuff you’ve written below, thanks.

I am not saying the emotions you
feel are  not to be ignored, just put into a more healthy context.
There are 2 things one should never get angry or stressed with.

One is
things you can actually do something about.  The other is things
you have no
control over.  The last time I raged at something(which was my
first day
back to work after ibogaine and 1 month off) it took all of 2
seconds before
I stopped and realized I was more upset at myself for raging than
I was at
what I was raging about.  I remedied the situation later that day
by telling
the responsible party that i had something to tell them, I wasn’t
going to
bring it up again or repeat myself and I didn’t want a response
just then
but that I definitly expected the situation resolved.  It worked.
No hard
feelings anywhere. and I came out ahead situation wise all the way

around.
One of your observations, which is a big part of not raging
is what you
said about attacking the behavior and not the person.  You call
someone a
fucking idiot and no matter what once the situation has been
resolved
there’s reasons for bad feelings.  This is the same criticizing
behavior
that perpetuates wounds and I can’t help but think in some
instances it’s a
tape playing in ones head of possibly how they were dealt with.
Learned
behavior.  Speaking on the behavior exhibited comes from a whole
different
place.  It comes more from a place of strength . I had this exact
same
conversation with one of my clients who is getting a divorce.  She

told me
she called him a stupid fucking idiot because of stuff he was
doing way out
of character.  I told her that to not tear him down furthur than
he already
is ,as after their 11 years there must still be concern for his
well being
and to remember he is the father of her daughter she needed to
have more
tact and just comment on the behavior.  She later told me this was

a hugh
help to her.
Choosing your battles is a good one.  Once you are able to
get at the
source of things it will be a lot easier just to let things go.  I

have
experienced personally with guilt and i’m sure it’s the same with
anger,
people can’t make you anything , YOU have to personally own it.
I’ll tell you honestly, I was doing victim /abuse workshops
for 10
years . It took a full year or more before I really got some of
the stuff I
was talking about.  It’s like you can understand something
intellectually
and take a while for the clarity to set in. A lot of the stuff I’
ve done may
have been for others but it was just as much for my own healing.

I’m just
passing on a little insight that did wonders for me.  Believe me
there are
still times when my immediate unvocalized reaction comes from that

“street”
place in me.  It’s just less frequently these days.  We are human
afterall.
With
respect and
sincerity,

Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list

More on the apparent ability of P. harmala extract to lessen the
stress of iboga on the gut, which oddly no one responded to. If
you
take such an extract (w/out iboga) and then make an effort to
yak
it up an hour or so later, you’ll notice that there is no
acidity
in what comes up.

Anger is a tough one for me, still learning how to be with it.

A thought after sleeping on it – the goal seems to be to be able

to
hold anger without burying it, choosing to display it when it
can
help you achieve your goal. A therapist friend described
properly-
used anger as a sword that you whip out and bring to the other
person’s throat, and just knowing you have it at your side makes
for a different posture in the world. Maybe holding anger
without
expressing it in the situation requires expressing it somewhere
else to someone who is equipped to hear it and understand.

One big subtlety I’ve noticed is that one can say “I’m angry
about .
.” and this is a whole different conversation from “You fucking
idiot …” which is what I’d feel like saying and then shut down
because of inability to be impolite.

The other day someone said I just need to develop my adult self,
and when this is done my wounded child will feel safe enough to
come out and heal. This reminds me of something Nick wrote a
while
ago:

Generally it’s my opinion that the ego needs multiple “staging
posts” on it’s long journey toward true self-recognition. Even
though ultimately it’s merely a journey from here to here this
doesn’t seem to lessen the impact of the experience.

In this context the ego would be the parental self. So just
acting
as mature as possible, understanding that the reason is to build
oneself up rather than conform, choosing the right battles,
biding
one’s time as necessary, could be a program 🙂

I’m also reminded of this from ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com:

I don’t believe we have to polish our egos to the point of
getting
an “A”. I think a C+ will do. The universe is not so fucking
relentless as to require any sembance of perfection. A C+ will
do

and then “we” can get out of the way.
Relax at that point and the separate sense will automatically
burn.

By the way, I’m angry about the US election results. Probably
that
is already obvious 🙂

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 15, 2004 at 10:53:21 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There’s a recent study showing that soybeans double the chance of
dementia in older men, presumably because they contain an analogue
of estrogen. Younger men weren’t studied.

My understanding was that soy is not complete protein, needs a
grain to complement it, and that non-meat diets require a source of
B12 which means vitamin pills or brewer’s yeast. This was based on ”
Diet for a Small Planet,” which summed up research 30 years ago.

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 05:11:13 -0800 “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@
francomm.com> wrote:
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Some of us don’t do well on a vegan/vegetarian diet because of
the lact of protein and/or fat.  Soy is the only plant I know of
that
can substitute for animal protein.  Soy has all the amino acids
contained
in meat.  There is a product called Tempeh which is made from soy.
This is available at a lot of grocery stores.  It comes in a firm
oblong
piece and lots of things can be made with it.  It does not have a
strong flavor and can be flavored any way you want.  It works
really
well in spaghetti, lasgne for instance.  I grate it, saute it in
olive oil
and use it in the place of ground meat.  Works well.

Best regards

ann
think@francomm.com

I was Vegan for 5yrs from age 15 to 20 and when I eventually went

back to
eating milk products I was pig-sick for 2 whole weeks-mainly
diarrhoea but
also vomiting.  I’m sure our bodies don’t want much of that shit

inside
us!

Sadly I gave in to pressure and returned to Vegetarism and have
never been
strong enough since to return to being Vegan.  Hell, I wanna
escape all
this
crap-‘drugs’, sugar, fags, caffeine, milk products etc.
Unfortunately my
heavily dope smoking boyf doesn’t like the idea (except there’ll

be more
chocolate for him!)

I just want to feel healthy and have ENERGY! 😉

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 2:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

__________________________________
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 10:46:44 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Notice how some gave to both candidates:

bush      kerry
Goldman Sachs  $941,503   $1,490,514
Microsoft Corp $220,197     $480,864
Citigroup Inc  $274,254     $337,760
Morgan Stanley $390,300     $390,300

Stockbrokers and energy companies may be hard to boycott.

Interesting that a lot of Kerry’s donations seem to be from PACs,
which may mean aggregates of smaller donors.

On Mon, 15 Nov 2004 05:11:13 -0800 Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
wrote:
I was watching a news special about the cozy
relationship between Fundamentalists and Right-Wing
Politics( did you know some churches were signing up
voters????), and a thought occurred to me: the “red”
states seem to be populated by people who want to
meddle in other people’s lives…I mean, what is it to
you personally if two men(or women) decide to form a
civil union??  How does it affect your life in any
noticeable way?

I have decided to boycott all things Republican, and
have found a website-in development- that lists
companies who contributed to the Republican campaign.
http://www.boycottrepublican.org/

I am sick of individuals who feel it is their
God-given right to meddle in other people’s affairs.
Why don’t they get off their fat, cornbred, fried
chicken asses and fix some of their own social,
cultural, and economic problems, and leave the rest of
us alone…

Fuckers…

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Enzyme/Brain Receptor Switches Addiction On & Off
Date: November 15, 2004 at 10:12:44 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brain receptor switches addiction on, off: study
Findings suggest that enzyme may be manipulated
pharmacologically to control brain receptor

by Jessica Whiteside

The discovery of a molecular “addiction switch” in the
mammalian brain has the potential to control the
addiction process in drug addicts, say U of T
researchers.

A study published Jan. 18 in the online edition of
Nature Neuroscience finds that a region of the brain
called the VTA contains receptors that, when exposed
to a certain enzyme, can control the switch from an
addicted to non-addicted state and back again. This
goes against previous ideas that viewed drug addiction
as a permanent change in the brain, says lead author
Steven Laviolette who conducted the research while a
PhD student at U of T’s Department of Anatomy and Cell
Biology with senior author Professor Derek van der
Kooy.

“Our findings suggest that instead of a permanent
alteration in the brain, there’s actually a switch
that goes on between two separate systems (one that
mediates the brain’s response to drugs while not yet
addicted and the other that mediates response once
addicted),” says Laviolette. “They also suggest we may
be able to manipulate that switch pharmacologically to
take drug addicts back to a non-addicted state in a
relatively short period of time so they do not crave
the drug.”

The switch is a brain receptor known as GABA-A; an
enzyme – carbonic anhydrase – produced by the body
controls how the receptor behaves. In studies with
rats, the researchers were able to manipulate the
enzyme with a drug to control whether it turned this
switch on or off. Without such intervention, the brain
can switch back to a non-addicted state following a
period of withdrawal from drugs – a process often
measured in weeks. By manipulating the enzyme
pharmacologically, however, that return to a
non-addicted state in rats has been reduced to a
matter of hours, says Laviolette, now a post-doctoral
fellow at the University of Pittsburgh.

“The same anatomical pathways that we’re manipulating
in rats also exist in humans so we hope that this will
be applicable to human drug addiction as well,” he
says.

Collaborators on the study, funded by the Canadian
Institutes of Health Research, included Roger Gallegos
and Steven Henriksen of the Scripps Research Institute
in California.

__________________________________
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state/knowone/knowhere
Date: November 15, 2004 at 10:12:10 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I like the whole let happen what will happen thing and from what i’ve heard the music was a big influence in a lot of sessions.  Mine had none. Something I’d like to change in the next go around.
As far as the dream thing, I’m curious on anyones experience from anytime, however I am most curious about post post post ibogaine, as in 2 weeks, 1 month. 3 months, 6months 1 year, 2 years etc. It’s a combination of curiosity and window of opportunity.  Knowing my Cancerian approach to getting things done, I don’t want to let this get by me. Although the crab does have that get up and go sideway shuffle thing going on.
I’m actually doing really well, thank you for asking, aside from fighting the worst cold I’ve had since childhood.  I think that’s why I was the only one on the site saturday night.  I had two big things planned for saturday and that eve.  And so it goes.  I needed the rest I guess.
Is anything real?
I think it’s mostly all pretty much an illusion.  Kind of like my perception of the computer(which i really know nothing about) it’s this big screen and tons of stuff coming in but when all is said and done it boils down to a chip and some energy!
Hope your day goes well,       Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “knowone knowwhere” <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 1:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Thank you for the kind words Martee, H0wz you?
I didn’t try with the main dose, (I didn’t tell ibo
what to do, it guided me to look at photo’s before
booster).  It was a base I could hold onto when all
the questions came, nice to have when asking things
like “is anything real?”

Has anyone heard any reports from 5th yet?

___________________________________________________________
Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality.
Get Yahoo! Mail www.yahoo.co.uk/10k

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] smoking cigs and addiction
Date: November 15, 2004 at 9:57:30 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“The withdrawal from tobacco is as difficult and painful as the withdrawal from alcohol and heroin. Acute withdrawal of nicotine results in severe disruptions to the nervous system, including tremors, agitation and abnormal heart rhythms. People withdrawing from nicotine cannot properly digest their food, nor pass waste. They cannot concentrate and their fine-motor function is impaired.”

Hi all,
As someone who currently is battling the psychological ramifications of just WANTING to quit smoking, not even actually doing more than cutting down slightly at this point, I read the following article, from which the above quote is culled, and find myself wondering once again at the insanity of a society that locks up people for using SOME highly addictive substances (and some, like pot for instance, that aren’t), yet not for others, others which are in reality the most damaging, most destructive, least friendly and wonderful of all the substances we could be using.
Anyway, I thought I’d pass this one to the rest of you.

http://www.marinij.com/Stories/0,1413,234~24409~2536223,00.html
Breathing life into the Smokeout
snip-
This Thursday is the annual Great American Smokeout, the day on which smokers attempt to go 24 hours without using tobacco. Some nonsmokers will ask, “So what’s the big deal?”
The big deal is about addiction. Regardless of how offensive tobacco use is to some people, we nonsmokers must remember that tobacco use is truly an addiction. According to the American Cancer Society, there are an estimated 46 million smokers in the United States.
An addiction is more than just a strong craving, with additional negative connotations superimposed by one’s society. The presence of addiction implies a physical dependence. This is as true for nicotine as it is for heroin or alcohol.
Once a person has been using tobacco steadily for a short time, nicotine begins to affect the nervous system, the part of the body that controls all of our thoughts and functions. Nicotine becomes a neurotransmitter; that is, it acts as one of the many chemicals that transmit signals through the nervous system.
In the presence of nicotine, a body shuts down the production of its own endogenous neurotransmitters, which have become redundant and not useful. Nicotine then controls the processes of digestion and cardiac function, to name just a few.
The withdrawal from tobacco is as difficult and painful as the withdrawal from alcohol and heroin. Acute withdrawal of nicotine results in severe disruptions to the nervous system, including tremors, agitation and abnormal heart rhythms. People withdrawing from nicotine cannot properly digest their food, nor pass waste. They cannot concentrate and their fine-motor function is impaired.
The Great American Smokeout is not a day just for smokers. I ask all nonsmokers to take a day off from ostracizing smokers for their habit, no matter if it offends you or not. Give a measure of support for those whom you know are attempting to quit. [and to those who really want to quit but can’t seem to find the strength to do so…hint nudge to the love of my life- Preston]
snip-

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 14 Nov 2004 17:29:51 -0000 Issue 772
Date: November 15, 2004 at 9:08:31 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

can’t open
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 11:29 AM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 14 Nov 2004 17:29:51 -0000 Issue 772

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?
Date: November 15, 2004 at 9:02:29 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i love your country. hiked the milford track  2 times.  can’t say much about ibo as i’v e got a benzo jones.  what do docs down ther use to detox people on benzos? rd
—– Original Message —– From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 15, 2004 3:48 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?

Hello all from New Zealand
I am new to this list and am looking forward to receiving emails from this
list.
I am planning on doing Ibogaine (again, first one was just a crude form of
Iboga) soon and found this website:- http://www.indra.dk/
I don’t know how reliable it is, but it seems to sell better quality than
the last site I bought from (can’t remember name).
Any advice on this would be great.
Thanks
Kirsty


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.791 / Virus Database: 535 – Release Date: 11/08/2004

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 9:00:39 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee,

I have always viewed dreams as a mixture of the
literal, the metaphorical, and the symbolic.  Dreams
of escaping from an internment camp could also be my
body’s metaphoric release from addiction.  Dreams of
my childhood town could be the expression of my
body/mind’s desire to return to the pre-addiction
state.

I find the concept of past lives intriguing and highly
romantic, but ultimately, er, unproveable.  Part of me
wants to embrace the notion of past lives, as it would
mean the immortality of my soul, but the scientific,
skeptical part of me resists.

Perhaps dreams are a synthesis of the two: memories of
your past lives, that are appropriate to our present
physical/psychological state- in other words, the
message we need WHEN we need it…

my 2 cents,
Julie

__________________________________
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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 8:54:56 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith, this is the only list that I know of where love is freely given. Everybody speaks their mind. I for one disagree with Bush’s policies but I stand behind the 19 and 20 year old kids my own sons age that have to implement his fuck ups. HE HAD NO PLAN> he still doesn’t. How can you send fast moving troops with light armor to hold a piece of land indefinitely? These guys have had to weld armor and buy communication gear over the net. These things should have been worked out before they ever got on the boat or plane, whatever. That’s bullshit!!!    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 8:44:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, it’s been a month and a half for me now and I can sleep just about when I want to. I think Ibogaine somehow fixed some of the insomnia that I’ve had all my life. I know I was a complete wuss at week two but I can state that for me the worst was over in 3 weeks. It gets better. LOTS better. Methadone is a real bitch to kick.      Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 15, 2004 at 8:32:30 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I can’t figure out what rural gun owners have to do with homeland security. Are you implying that all rural gun owners are uneducated and uninformed? Being from the South I can state most emphatically that this is just not true. I grew up hunting and I think everyone should have some gun safety training. When you live on a farm firearms are tools you use. That will never change. Nobody gets home invaded “down home.” And (and this will surely piss someone off) I think every women who is not insane or convicted of violet crime should automatically get a concealed to carry license. Wonder what that would do to rape stats?    Randy

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives- Boycott Republicans
Date: November 15, 2004 at 8:11:13 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was watching a news special about the cozy
relationship between Fundamentalists and Right-Wing
Politics( did you know some churches were signing up
voters????), and a thought occurred to me: the “red”
states seem to be populated by people who want to
meddle in other people’s lives…I mean, what is it to
you personally if two men(or women) decide to form a
civil union??  How does it affect your life in any
noticeable way?

I have decided to boycott all things Republican, and
have found a website-in development- that lists
companies who contributed to the Republican campaign.
http://www.boycottrepublican.org/

I am sick of individuals who feel it is their
God-given right to meddle in other people’s affairs.
Why don’t they get off their fat, cornbred, fried
chicken asses and fix some of their own social,
cultural, and economic problems, and leave the rest of
us alone…

Fuckers…

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 15, 2004 at 8:11:13 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Some of us don’t do well on a vegan/vegetarian diet because of
the lact of protein and/or fat.  Soy is the only plant I know of that
can substitute for animal protein.  Soy has all the amino acids contained
in meat.  There is a product called Tempeh which is made from soy.
This is available at a lot of grocery stores.  It comes in a firm oblong
piece and lots of things can be made with it.  It does not have a
strong flavor and can be flavored any way you want.  It works really
well in spaghetti, lasgne for instance.  I grate it, saute it in olive oil
and use it in the place of ground meat.  Works well.

Best regards

ann
think@francomm.com

I was Vegan for 5yrs from age 15 to 20 and when I eventually went back to
eating milk products I was pig-sick for 2 whole weeks-mainly diarrhoea but
also vomiting.  I’m sure our bodies don’t want much of that shit inside us!

Sadly I gave in to pressure and returned to Vegetarism and have never been
strong enough since to return to being Vegan.  Hell, I wanna escape all this
crap-‘drugs’, sugar, fags, caffeine, milk products etc.  Unfortunately my
heavily dope smoking boyf doesn’t like the idea (except there’ll be more
chocolate for him!)

I just want to feel healthy and have ENERGY! 😉

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 2:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state- for Sara
Date: November 15, 2004 at 8:02:53 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

well said, Sara… BTW, how is Jasen??  Please say
hello to him…

love Julie
— Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:

Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost
so many lives.
To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to
be done with occupation,
After all war is not an answer when money talks.
I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many
more who will  have part
of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has
no weapon in his hand to
fight evil.
Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself
talk on the TV.
Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
At least he has a hands he can shake with, some
people don’t and they are
only 20 years old kids.

Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it
doesn’t look like it on
TV.

If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war.
He would be a friend
with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand
that working together
Is better then killing each other.

It is just shame that people want to save a life of
an addict with Ibogaine
treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a
silly war game of some rich
people.
And those rich people will get their ways anyways as
they are corrupted by
power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.

It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants
to be at war time.

The enemy is in your head. People always can be
friends, just like they did
before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God,
then God he should pray
to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are
lost thanks to his
policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more
of his and other
citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said
I would be deleted form

the list if messages got bounced again–whatever
that means.  Thats okay I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug
addiction–but found
this is just another hate site against our president
in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.
this, as my lay brain
understands it, is the time when we problem solve
and recharge for the day
ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep,
assuming i make it out of

here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails
from the forum
concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n
open the digest files.
what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s
up?  i know diddley about

computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m
in the dark. i figure
with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least
of anyones worries.
thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i
could open them but
don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and
after that noticed in
the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are
a therapeutic tool for
onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.
Prior to treatment I
would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.
I also had the ability
to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like
extremely sharp sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can
taste in my dreams,
feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and
have experienced twice
the state of being high.  In the past all my dope
dreams(including 5 years
worth after my first interuption in addiction from
ages 15-18) as well as
the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about
procuring everything I
needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my
apparatus.  I never
ever actually did anything in any of these many
dreams.  Last week I had
one where I was sitting in my mothers living room
and actually doing
something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t
the best high we all
fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this
buzz you get when you’ve
done too much not so good drugs and you’re not
getting any higher.  It was
NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago,
I smoked some pot I had

in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the
dream they were rolled
too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an
actuall marijuana high.

I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t
drank alcohol for 12
years until a month out of treatment I was with a
group in a mexican
restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I
got buzzed on 3 oz. and
it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I
realized how much I liked

it I decided not to induldge again while my brain
is still experiencing the

combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want
to muck up the
experience with anything that is going to hinder
the natural process of
what is happening.  This may explain part of my
whole food thing for right
now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share
anything about their
dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases
emotion and junk we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed
that have little to no
meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or
problem solving if we can
understand our own representations.  I personally
don’t believe in those
books that say if you see this symbol it means
this.  Everyone has their
own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve
noticed re your brain that’s
different would help.  Any of you phds or educated
types that have any
technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,
Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find
out differently I’ll let
you know.

_________________________________________________________________
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virus scan from McAfeeR
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From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: so where do I get ibogaine?
Date: November 15, 2004 at 4:48:01 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello all from New Zealand
I am new to this list and am looking forward to receiving emails from this
list.
I am planning on doing Ibogaine (again, first one was just a crude form of
Iboga) soon and found this website:- http://www.indra.dk/
I don’t know how reliable it is, but it seems to sell better quality than
the last site I bought from (can’t remember name).
Any advice on this would be great.
Thanks
Kirsty


Outgoing mail is certified Virus Free.
Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
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From: “booker w” <swbooker@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 3:27:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi.  Very interesting about the holocaust stuff.  I’ve often felt I was in the holocaust as well.  As a kid I was intensely interested in reading about concentration camps and was always “fascinated” with the jewish religion – I remember being very disappointed that I wasn’t born jewish.  Top that off with my first real panic attack occured while reading QBVII – a book about the holocaust and trials later.  I’m a baby- boomer too…
My dreams after ibogaine were so incredibly intense and vivid and as tho I was “experiencing” them in a much more direct manner than normal.  But also, I felt that even before taking the substance I experienced vivid dreams, just knowing ibo was going to come into my life.  Upon making the decision each time, I would experience very synchronistic events and dreams.  In fact it was several dreams that led and convinced me to try ibogaine as well.  Makes me believe that the chemical part of ibo isn’t really all of it.  I think there is so much more to the experience than just the chemistry… as probably with many things – one reason I think it is such an utter waste of time to test it on animals.  We seem to focus so much just on the physical.  I also have always had the impression that ibo is just a sort of “gate” to a more accurate realm of existence, which is where healing and things outside of time can take place.  Like seeing a dead relative, the future, or various forms of healing.  Hence the “restart.”
Anyway, that’s my ramble – whatever happened to Callie?
Best to Julie and Jasen.  Fakeplacebo too.  Hope you get to where you want to be.
Sandy

>      I believe your dream sounded a lot like holocaust stuff.  I have always felt I was in the holocaust as does my sister and brother in law.  I have had this confirmed but not by my own regression.  My theory is that  a lot of the baby boomers were holocaust victims that were taken out before their time.As a kid I had dreams of being hunted by nazis,gas and thinking I’d be better off blonde.  This could also be generational stuff that kids pick up on. I believe the dream about visiting where you grew up and those long journeys are what is referred to as astral visits.

>      I think dreams are a way to reveal stuff, release stuff, get prayers across and answered.  You know the brain is kind of a new frontier.  One of the ongoing conversations I’ve had with my nephew since he was 6 was, What do you think we could do if we had full use of our brain?  I believe our actual usage is less than 15%.  I could be wrong and that may not be exact but it’s something I’ve heard repeatedly.  Again no reference note available.  I personally believe we can heal ourselves from anything, replicate damage organs and regenerate damaged limbs.  If a reptile can do it….

>     The whole purpose of the past life regression is not just to have a look see, but to acknowledge the source of todays pain which enables one to release it easier.

>      I’m done rambling for now.  Thanks for the response.

>                                                                     Martee

>

>   —– Original Message —–

>   From: Ms Iboga

>   To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>   Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:40 AM

>   Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

>

>

>   Martee,

>

>   I’m 26, but I alternate between 18 and 50, depending on the circumstances…I think my circadian rhythm is still screwed up, and this is why I have such vivid recollections of my dreams.  I can get to the deep sleep, but when the cycle starts again, and I return to lighter levels, my body automatically wakes up

>

>   Last night I dreamed I was a prisoner in an internment camp, nested between two huge mountains.  I had a daughter that was at least my own age(I have no kids), and a husband that was imprisoned in the male section.  Anyone trying to escape was shot either through the heart or the neck with a flaming arrow.  My last memory of the dream, before I awoke, was of running furiously, out the front gate of the prison; running so fast I could feel and smell the perspiration on my skin!  Has anyone else experienced vivid smells, colours, etc..?  I’ve heard we only dream in black and white, but I don’t believe this at all.

>

>   Martee, do you practice hypnosis?  I would love to chat more with you about dreams/past life regressions.  I think this is a very cool topic, and thanks for bringing it up….

>

>   Julie

>

>

>   __________________________________________________

>   Do You Yahoo!?

>   Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around

>   http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: “Cheryl” <cherylca@myway.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] loved conference so where do I get ibogaine?
Date: November 15, 2004 at 2:31:43 AM EST
To: ibogaine@MindVox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I heard people talking about ibogaine but nothing like this weekend it was very exciting and thank you Patrick I wouldn’t have known about it if you didn’t talk at the opening plenary youre a big inspiration!

I checked the date of the ibogaine movie, there was a room filled with people there and no ibogaine movie. I went to the ibogaine session and I loved all of it this was the high point of everything for me! I loved the energy Patrick that was great except now I have the confusion!

You need bigger rooms, it gets tiring standing or sitting on the floor then waiting in the hall I understood you, got lost midway through your doctor friend’s talk because the talk went so fast and I don’t understand anything he was saying at the end, the underground railroad was great from Howard Lotsof, I loved the first part of Dana Beal’s talk but then don’t understand anything he was saying the second half, you had Dr. Cohen give up and get drowned out that’s a first one then you had Dana Beal and Dr. Cohen yelling at each other in the hallway louder then the speakers in the room, someone ran up and yelled fuck everybody after dana, that’s all I understood of his talk, I didn’t understand a word the bald girl said I didn’t understand what the boy with the long hair was talking about.

It was a great event and a lot of fun! Too many people and most of us sat there some of us on the ground and waited for a 3 hour long panel that didn’t end for over 4 hours with no breaks and then all the speakers ran out of the room without answering one question! If there was another movie or meeting in the ballrooms I didn’t find it or anyone. Every one of you vanished after the event!

It was exciting but you need bigger rooms! Thank you for helping me find ibogaine now where do I find ibogaine? Where do I get it? Thanks also for printing all those guidebooks or I woulnd’t know who anyone is without the front pages. I’ve also read 20 messages on this list today and don’t understand most of it so far.

_______________________________________________
No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding.
Make My Way your home on the Web – http://www.myway.com

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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 15, 2004 at 1:19:04 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you for the kind words Martee, H0wz you?
I didn’t try with the main dose, (I didn’t tell ibo
what to do, it guided me to look at photo’s before
booster).  It was a base I could hold onto when all
the questions came, nice to have when asking things
like “is anything real?”

Has anyone heard any reports from 5th yet?

___________________________________________________________
Moving house? Beach bar in Thailand? New Wardrobe? Win £10k with Yahoo! Mail to make your dream a reality.
Get Yahoo! Mail www.yahoo.co.uk/10k

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 11:23:15 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This grounding thing by looking at photos is, I believe, taking you in with an agenda, which is why it may work.  I’m thinking we have the ability to direct our dreams or set up the theme or get an answer or use dreams as a resource into our brains usually unavailable areas.  I’m thinking this could be my next hobby. But I definitley like the advice for my next attempt.  I do have a different agenda this time.  Thank you for your imput.    Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “knowone knowwhere” <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 3:56 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I found that looking at photographs of family before
dosing a booster helped ‘ground’ the experience, and
seemed to familierise dreams a bit.  In small stepped
doses dreams very vivid, and sleep during dream, deep
sleep, and eat Fresh Fruit lotsof spring water during.
etc…
So do the  ibo ‘waking dream’ and sleeping dreams
usually have a common theme?  They seem to be similar
in subjects?
-J

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 13, 2004, at 02:51 PM,
m.finman wrote:

> I think the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing,
that it is quite
> possible that you are  one of your own ancestors!

Yes, me too! I was all prepared to possibly see my
grandfather or great
grandfather, etc etc… but the faces (first hour&
1/2 of experience)
that floated thru my ‘field’ of vision i instantly
recognized as my own
past lives.

(begin twilight theme song and fade)

_.dh

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___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Conservatives
Date: November 14, 2004 at 11:18:20 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I found this study at
http://www.berkeley.edu/news/media/releases/2003/07/22_politics.shtml

very interesting:
Four researchers who culled through 50 years of research literature about
the psychology of conservatism report that at the core of political
conservatism is the resistance to change and a tolerance for inequality, and
that some of the common psychological factors linked to political
conservatism include:

a.. Fear and aggression

b.. Dogmatism and intolerance of ambiguity

c.. Uncertainty avoidance

d.. Need for cognitive closure

e.. Terror management
They really have a different view of the world. Most of the people that we
reconize as great contribuitors to our history and planet, from Lao-tse,
Buddha, Socrate,  Jesus, Leonardo da Vinci ,Edison, Einstein. You name it,
where not consevative. I think conservatives are from a different planet
:-). I have a very good friend who are conservatives, but I avoid many
subjects with them. They will never change, it’s behond my understanding. I
think behind their lack of compassion and comprehension, most of the time
you will find fears.
Faith :It’s like anger, check inside your anger and you will probably find
a secret fear within .
francis

—– Original Message —–
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:37 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state

Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost so many lives.
To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to be done with
occupation,
After all war is not an answer when money talks.
I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many more who will  have part
of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has no weapon in his hand
to
fight evil.
Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself talk on the TV.
Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
At least he has a hands he can shake with, some people don’t and they are
only 20 years old kids.

Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it doesn’t look like it
on
TV.

If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war. He would be a friend
with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand that working together
Is better then killing each other.

It is just shame that people want to save a life of an addict with
Ibogaine
treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a silly war game of some
rich
people.
And those rich people will get their ways anyways as they are corrupted by
power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.

It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants to be at war time.

The enemy is in your head. People always can be friends, just like they
did
before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God, then God he should pray
to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are lost thanks to his
policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more of his and other
citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted
form

the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats okay I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found
this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain
understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the
day
ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out
of

here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.
what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley
about

computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure
with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.
thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but
don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in
the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for
onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I
would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability
to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams,
feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced
twice
the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5
years
worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as
the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I
needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never
ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had
one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all
fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when
you’ve
done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It
was
NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I
had

in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled
too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana
high.

I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12
years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican
restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and
it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I
liked

it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing
the

combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of
what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for
right
now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their
dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to
no
meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we
can
understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those
books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their
own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain
that’s
different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any
technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let
you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfeeR
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 11:15:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Sunday, November 14, 2004, at 04:01 PM, Faith Bowling wrote:

but I got the “bounce and probe” letter also, and don’t know what it means.

it means PK is in ‘Nawlins, and wasn’t there to hit the switch, spool the mail or uncheck the thingamajiggy check-box.

all appears to be well now.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 11:09:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hate’s a very strong word, Faith.

but if you expect support for a [p]resident of the likes of GWBush on a list like this, well don’t hold yer breath.

On Sunday, November 14, 2004, at 11:03 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted form the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats okay I had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the day ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out of here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.  what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley about computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.  thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for right now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we can understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Dear Jasen- best of luck on your journey
Date: November 14, 2004 at 10:23:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The Garden <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net> wrote:
Good luck to you and let’us know
God bless
Francis
—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:29 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Dear Jasen- best of luck on your journey

Dear Jasen,

Your special day is at hand…how do you feel?  Are you scared, excited?  I have a beautiful purple candle that I selected just for you….

Please be well, and post as soon as you can…

love Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger

From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 14, 2004 at 10:21:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Saturday, 13 November 2004 6:21:07 a.m.
To: Summary
Subject: [Ibogaine] Two days left

Dear List,
I will start my Ibogain treatment 2-3 days later. I’m little stressed but I’m sure I will kick my addiction. Wish me Luck.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:37:09 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Maybe it is the president who makes war time,
Getting one man  like Saddam  doesn’t need to cost so many lives.
To find weapon of mass distraction doesn’t need to be done with occupation,
After all war is not an answer when money talks.
I think you got already 1000 man dead and so many more who will  have part
of their body missing or die from cancer, Bush has no weapon in his hand to
fight evil.
Bush is at home with his Barbie watching himself talk on the TV.
Shaking hand with Blair having a good laugh.
At least he has a hands he can shake with, some people don’t and they are
only 20 years old kids.

Power corrupts in all shapes and forms. Even when it doesn’t look like it on
TV.

If Bush was a good Christian he wouldn’t be in war. He would be a friend
with his enemy and try to make the enemy understand that working together
Is better then killing each other.

It is just shame that people want to save a life of an addict with Ibogaine
treatment but send “their son” to be killed in a silly war game of some rich
people.
And those rich people will get their ways anyways as they are corrupted by
power and money. Satan works in mysterious ways.

It is about “to be… or not to be…”and Bush wants to be at war time.

The enemy is in your head. People always can be friends, just like they did
before they become an enemy. Bush believes in God, then God he should pray
to God and ask forgiveness for all the lives who are lost thanks to his
policies, but no he will just see that tomorrow more of his and other
citizens  will be killed. While you are watching TV.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 14 november 2004 22:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted form

the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats okay I
had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found
this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain
understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the day
ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out of

here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum
concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.
what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley about

computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure
with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.
thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but
don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in
the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for
onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I
would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability
to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory
experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams,
feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced twice
the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5 years
worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as
the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I
needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never
ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had
one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing
something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all
fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when you’ve
done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It was
NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I had

in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled
too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana high.

I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12
years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican
restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and
it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked

it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing the

combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the
experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of
what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for right
now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their
dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we
hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to no
meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we can
understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those
books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their
own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s
different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any
technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let
you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfeeR
Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Faith
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:34:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith,
On this site you can get any discussion or info you seek.  Just put your differences aside for the greater good of your son.  Was it Ben Franklin who said,”I may disagree with what you have to say but I will fight to the death your right to say it.”  I believe this is the true meaning of freedom.  I don’t put out political stuff as a rule and I don’t get it back.  The delete button comes in handy also.  I may only get a response from a handfull of people but it’s a handfull more than I’d find on this topic and this mindset anywhere else.            Hope you reconsider,
Respectfully, Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 4:03 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted form the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats okay I had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the day ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out of here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files. what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley about computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.  thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for right now. I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we can understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let you know.

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfee® Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:34:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Could be a problem at comcast.net. Lack of email sophistication is
not stupid in any case. Best test msg I’ve ever seen, for starters.
🙂

On Sun, 14 Nov 2004 15:18:06 -0800 The Garden <GardenRestaurant@
comcast.net> wrote:
Test     TEST      TeSt       tEsT

[o}
My e-mails took all afternoon to get to the list, so I was
freaking out !
Stupid that I am 🙂

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:30:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

‘Bouncing’ means that mail sent to you ‘bounces back’ from the mail
server (hotmail in Faith’s case). Email lists get this all the time,
and typically delete membership automatically when it happens some
number of times in a row. A full mailbox or a problem with your
mail provider might trigger it.

Faith, there are people on this list from all around the world –
remember that most countries are aghast at current US policy and
its confirmation by the election. This war sparked the biggest
worldwide demonstrations in history. Also, please remember that
even US citizens are still permitted to criticise the president,
which paid off in the ending of the Viet Nam war.

Aside from starting a war that will likely continue beyond his
current term, with consequences that will last for generations,
Bush has been institutionalising torture. It is sad when a self-
professed Christian such as yourself does not find that worthy of
criticism.

Good luck with your son’s addiction, in any case.

Here’s a blog from a girl in Baghdad that gives some idea of how
successful the US has been in Iraq:

http://riverbendblog.blogspot.com/

A random item from it: “I was watching CNN this morning and I
couldn’t get the image of the hospital in Falloojeh being stormed
by Iraqi and American troops out of my head- the Iraqis being made
to lay face-down on the ground, hands behind their backs. Young men
and old men… and then the pictures of Abu Ghraib replay
themselves in my mind. I think people would rather die than be
taken prisoner by the Americans.”

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] hannah
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:27:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hannah,
Your observations and instincts are on the right tract.  As I reread your writing I get you know what you need to escape as you put it.  Also the description of your boyfriend does not speak for his decisions being for your best interests,just his.  Maybe you should consider adding one more thing to your escape list?    Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 4:26 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

I was Vegan for 5yrs from age 15 to 20 and when I eventually went back to
eating milk products I was pig-sick for 2 whole weeks-mainly diarrhoea but
also vomiting.  I’m sure our bodies don’t want much of that shit inside us!

Sadly I gave in to pressure and returned to Vegetarism and have never been
strong enough since to return to being Vegan.  Hell, I wanna escape all this
crap-‘drugs’, sugar, fags, caffeine, milk products etc.  Unfortunately my
heavily dope smoking boyf doesn’t like the idea (except there’ll be more
chocolate for him!)

I just want to feel healthy and have ENERGY! 😉

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 2:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:11:40 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hannah,
Bring on the freak and bring on the nuts!!!  If you have to be in a category, suits me fine, those stepford motherfuckers.  Do what’s best for you.  When all is said and done and the rats abandon ship that’s who you’re left with and need to be at peace with.                       God bless, Martee

—– Original Message —– From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 4:42 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Yeh-I was Vegan, not because I believed that eating animal by-products was
necessarily wrong but because I strongly disagree with modern intensive
farming methods.  Ofcourse everyone immediately assumes you’re just a
freaking nutcase….
—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 2:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Rachael and Julie,
Everyone seems to make the assumption that I am a vegetarian or a raw
foodist.  I am considering maybe next spring and summer when it’s warm
attempting all raw to see if I can do it as the point is the enzymes in
food
are killed once they are heated above 185 degrees.  I believe it is
possible
to get everything you need nutritionally but you first need to know what
your personal needs are and then know what’s in all the food you eat to
come
up with your formula.  I eat a lot of raw, as much organic as possible and
as many greens and veggies as I can.  I also eat every type of animal
protein around. My basic mindset is that I like the way the american
indians
approached killing animals. They took what they only needed, didn’t waste
anything and thanked the animal spirit and mother earth for providing.  I
also know these animals wouldn’t exist if they weren’t raised for food to
begin with.   As far as being vegetarian, again you need to have a good
understanding of the nutritional content and what you need.  As a group
most
people who become vegetarian without this knowledge become the biggest
sugar
addicts in existance, also to the point of not getting enough protein to
where their body is digesting it’s own muscle tissue.  The larger % of
products in the health food store are also laden with “healthy sugars”. I
prefer buying all my meats that are raised without hormones and
antibiotics.
Same with dairy.  I don’t overinduldge in dairy and I do best with goat or
sheep dairy but again no antibiotics or hormones.  I believe the hormones
in
the food is why you have 8 year olds that have developed way ahead of
their
years.  This has been confirmed by my dentist who says the teeth in many
children are also coming up ahead of schedule. My other prerequisite to
ingesting food is that there are no chemicals, perservatives and sugars(in
all it’s 50 different forms).  Food needs to be what i refer to as
“clean”.
Our food is supposed to be our medicine as well as our source of
nutrients.
The reason people eat too much is because our signal from our body when it
needs nutrients is hunger.   Our body is really saying, I need nutrients.
If you eat a meal with no detectable enzymes and nutrients then even
though
you get full, shortly thereafter your body is going, where is the
nutrients,
try again!  This country has more overweight undernourished people in all
of
existance.  Most people think if it’s for sale, it’s been deemed safe.
The
truth is that foods and chemicals are innocent until proven guilty.  Do
you
know when you walk down the household and cleaning product isle in the
supermarket(the chemical smell is so strong it gets in your throat) that
only less than 15% of those chemicals were ever really tested.  Lets talk
about when the fda or epa says that an item in question has “acceptable
levels” of some toxin.  I heard this once about baby pacifiers. Well if a
person is exposed to 100 things a day with acceptable levels there is an
accumulation and once again we have compromised immune function.  I think
I
just went off on a tangient.  You have to be your own detective.  Since
food
is for energy, your barometer is how you feel 30-60 minutes after you eat
to
see if it works, also how the day progresses in general and how you feel
when you wake up. Not to mention your mindset. Poor nutrition can make a
person and their dr. think they need antidepressants.    Raw when
possible,
tons of vegeatables, fruit to your bodies liking(not craving,liking)
whatever protien and healthy fats and oils. Don’t avoid avocados or nuts
because of their fat content. That is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever
heard.   Whole grains only. Plenty plenty plenty of water and do no harm.
Vegetable juices are probably one of the healthiest things a person can do
for themselves.  The greens especially, but I usually throw in 1/2 a
carrot
and 1/4 beet as that’s all I feel I can tolerate.  The juice is not high
sugar, being that its liquid your absorption does not depend on how well
chewed your food is(Another factor in absorbing nutrients). The
phytochemicals detox and cleanse but not too quickly to the point of
making
you ill.  The enzymes among other things will actually attack toxins in
the
body . They are a helper for the immune system.  The greens will also
alkalize your system as most people are to acidic.  All people with
serious
illness are acidic.  People that crave sugar tend to be too acidic.  This
refers to the PH balance in the body.  Just to give you a visual of this,
If you’ve ever had an aquarium and had to check the ph in the water to
keep
it balanced for the health and survivial of the fish.  The tester kit has
a
color scale going from yellow (totally acidic) to shades of green, blue
and
teal.  Depending on the color you get you add an acidic or alkaline
substance to balance it out.  Fish living in the wrong ph get fin rot, ich
and die!  You can actually buy a ph strip test for people.  Your proteins
and grains are basically acidic. Your greens, vegetables and most fruits
are
alkaline.  So in a way it makes common sense that people that are sick
don’t
get enough veggies.  There are variables as to what’s alkaline and acidic
but that’s the basics.  Anytime I feel I’m fighting anything physically my
mindset is to “green-up”.  rawfoods.com is an informative source and a
place
to order raw foods that are also organic.
Rachael I understand the whole craving thing after ibogaine and the
comfort factor in that. Unless the progresso soup is representative of a
time when a loved one prepared it for him, I personally would do some harm
reduction and whip up a batch of homemade and tell him to feel the love!
Maybe because detoxing is part of what i do professionally and personally
I
was hyperaware of the detoxing going on with the ibogaine.  I actually
could
smell powdered garlic powder coming through my skin on my forearms.  It
was
mandatory in my moms cooking and one of those lazy things I still did on
occasion.  It grossed me out and now I only use real garlic.  It makes you
wonder what else is the body holding and storing toxin wise.  I actually
can
answer that but I think I’ve said enough for now.
Hope this helps,   Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 3:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

> I’m feeling conflicted about this as well, being the
> caretaker who’s doing the shopping and the feeding.
> On the one hand I could just give him the raw fruit
> and the yogurt shakes I want to provide.  On the other
> hand, he’s just been through this journey and has a
> right to eat whatever he wants.  For example,
> yesterday he was hungry for roast beef.  So sliced
> dead cow it was.  And today he asked for Progresso
> canned soup.  In my ideal world, I’d cook up brown
> rice, detox tea, and veggie juice.  But the
> codependent comfort factor is running high.
>
> Lots of Love, Rachel
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> __________________________________
> Do you Yahoo!?
> Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
> www.yahoo.com
>
>
>
>
>
>
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: slowone: delayed response
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:02:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was trying to clear out my inbox and reread this quite a few times.  I believe the goal is to not hold on to any negative emotion.  That is what causes illness in the body.  An alternative to anger as you see it I believe would be to have an understanding of the difference between being aggressive and being assertive.  Being assertive comes from a place of strength, empowerment,confidence and control.  Being aggressive comes from a wounded ego based place. Getting caught up in aanger and rage is actually a form of being manipulated and giving your power away.  Much in the same way that when a person looking for a fight eggs someone else into one, even though the challenged person thinks they are exhibiting strength they are being controlled and manipulated by the bully.  I am not saying the emotions you feel are  not to be ignored, just put into a more healthy context.
There are 2 things one should never get angry or stressed with.  One is things you can actually do something about.  The other is things you have no control over.  The last time I raged at something(which was my first day back to work after ibogaine and 1 month off) it took all of 2 seconds before I stopped and realized I was more upset at myself for raging than I was at what I was raging about.  I remedied the situation later that day by telling the responsible party that i had something to tell them, I wasn’t going to bring it up again or repeat myself and I didn’t want a response just then but that I definitly expected the situation resolved.  It worked. No hard feelings anywhere. and I came out ahead situation wise all the way around.
One of your observations, which is a big part of not raging is what you said about attacking the behavior and not the person.  You call someone a fucking idiot and no matter what once the situation has been resolved there’s reasons for bad feelings.  This is the same criticizing behavior that perpetuates wounds and I can’t help but think in some instances it’s a tape playing in ones head of possibly how they were dealt with.  Learned behavior.  Speaking on the behavior exhibited comes from a whole different place.  It comes more from a place of strength . I had this exact same conversation with one of my clients who is getting a divorce.  She told me she called him a stupid fucking idiot because of stuff he was doing way out of character.  I told her that to not tear him down furthur than he already is ,as after their 11 years there must still be concern for his well being and to remember he is the father of her daughter she needed to have more tact and just comment on the behavior.  She later told me this was a hugh help to her.
Choosing your battles is a good one.  Once you are able to get at the source of things it will be a lot easier just to let things go.  I have experienced personally with guilt and i’m sure it’s the same with anger, people can’t make you anything , YOU have to personally own it.
I’ll tell you honestly, I was doing victim /abuse workshops for 10 years . It took a full year or more before I really got some of the stuff I was talking about.  It’s like you can understand something intellectually and take a while for the clarity to set in. A lot of the stuff I’ve done may have been for others but it was just as much for my own healing.   I’m just passing on a little insight that did wonders for me.  Believe me there are still times when my immediate unvocalized reaction comes from that “street” place in me.  It’s just less frequently these days.  We are human afterall.
With respect and sincerity,
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list

More on the apparent ability of P. harmala extract to lessen the
stress of iboga on the gut, which oddly no one responded to. If you
take such an extract (w/out iboga) and then make an effort to yak
it up an hour or so later, you’ll notice that there is no acidity
in what comes up.

Anger is a tough one for me, still learning how to be with it.

A thought after sleeping on it – the goal seems to be to be able to
hold anger without burying it, choosing to display it when it can
help you achieve your goal. A therapist friend described properly-
used anger as a sword that you whip out and bring to the other
person’s throat, and just knowing you have it at your side makes
for a different posture in the world. Maybe holding anger without
expressing it in the situation requires expressing it somewhere
else to someone who is equipped to hear it and understand.

One big subtlety I’ve noticed is that one can say “I’m angry about .
.” and this is a whole different conversation from “You fucking
idiot …” which is what I’d feel like saying and then shut down
because of inability to be impolite.

The other day someone said I just need to develop my adult self,
and when this is done my wounded child will feel safe enough to
come out and heal. This reminds me of something Nick wrote a while
ago:

Generally it’s my opinion that the ego needs multiple “staging
posts” on it’s long journey toward true self-recognition. Even
though ultimately it’s merely a journey from here to here this
doesn’t seem to lessen the impact of the experience.

In this context the ego would be the parental self. So just acting
as mature as possible, understanding that the reason is to build
oneself up rather than conform, choosing the right battles, biding
one’s time as necessary, could be a program 🙂

I’m also reminded of this from ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com:

I don’t believe we have to polish our egos to the point of
getting
an “A”. I think a C+ will do. The universe is not so fucking
relentless as to require any sembance of perfection. A C+ will do

and then “we” can get out of the way.
Relax at that point and the separate sense will automatically
burn.

By the way, I’m angry about the US election results. Probably that
is already obvious 🙂

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:01:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, for some reason, your mail to the Ibogaine group is coming to my address at hotmail and I’m not sure it is going to the ibogaine mailbox.  don’t know how this happened, but I got the “bounce and probe” letter also, and don’t know what it means.  Faith

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the day ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out of here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.  what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley about computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.  thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for right now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we can understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let you know.

_________________________________________________________________
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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why my E-mail was not published ?
Date: November 14, 2004 at 6:47:09 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There was a time lapse on this list today.  I sent two
emails, and they showed up hours later…

J.

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why my E-mail was not published ?
Date: November 14, 2004 at 6:41:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A problem with Comcast.net the E-mail where delayed. Sorry 🙂
—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 2:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why my E-mail was not published ?

you seem to be broadcasting just fine

(re” your email on past life regression/healing/etc)

On Sunday, November 14, 2004, at 08:51 AM, The Garden wrote:

 

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 6:18:06 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Test     TEST      TeSt       tEsT

[o}
My e-mails took all afternoon to get to the list, so I was freaking out !
Stupid that I am 🙂
From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 14, 2004 at 4:42:51 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeh-I was Vegan, not because I believed that eating animal by-products was
necessarily wrong but because I strongly disagree with modern intensive
farming methods.  Ofcourse everyone immediately assumes you’re just a
freaking nutcase….
—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 2:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Rachael and Julie,
Everyone seems to make the assumption that I am a vegetarian or a raw
foodist.  I am considering maybe next spring and summer when it’s warm
attempting all raw to see if I can do it as the point is the enzymes in
food
are killed once they are heated above 185 degrees.  I believe it is
possible
to get everything you need nutritionally but you first need to know what
your personal needs are and then know what’s in all the food you eat to
come
up with your formula.  I eat a lot of raw, as much organic as possible and
as many greens and veggies as I can.  I also eat every type of animal
protein around. My basic mindset is that I like the way the american
indians
approached killing animals. They took what they only needed, didn’t waste
anything and thanked the animal spirit and mother earth for providing.  I
also know these animals wouldn’t exist if they weren’t raised for food to
begin with.   As far as being vegetarian, again you need to have a good
understanding of the nutritional content and what you need.  As a group
most
people who become vegetarian without this knowledge become the biggest
sugar
addicts in existance, also to the point of not getting enough protein to
where their body is digesting it’s own muscle tissue.  The larger % of
products in the health food store are also laden with “healthy sugars”. I
prefer buying all my meats that are raised without hormones and
antibiotics.
Same with dairy.  I don’t overinduldge in dairy and I do best with goat or
sheep dairy but again no antibiotics or hormones.  I believe the hormones
in
the food is why you have 8 year olds that have developed way ahead of
their
years.  This has been confirmed by my dentist who says the teeth in many
children are also coming up ahead of schedule. My other prerequisite to
ingesting food is that there are no chemicals, perservatives and sugars(in
all it’s 50 different forms).  Food needs to be what i refer to as
“clean”.
Our food is supposed to be our medicine as well as our source of
nutrients.
The reason people eat too much is because our signal from our body when it
needs nutrients is hunger.   Our body is really saying, I need nutrients.
If you eat a meal with no detectable enzymes and nutrients then even
though
you get full, shortly thereafter your body is going, where is the
nutrients,
try again!  This country has more overweight undernourished people in all
of
existance.  Most people think if it’s for sale, it’s been deemed safe.
The
truth is that foods and chemicals are innocent until proven guilty.  Do
you
know when you walk down the household and cleaning product isle in the
supermarket(the chemical smell is so strong it gets in your throat) that
only less than 15% of those chemicals were ever really tested.  Lets talk
about when the fda or epa says that an item in question has “acceptable
levels” of some toxin.  I heard this once about baby pacifiers. Well if a
person is exposed to 100 things a day with acceptable levels there is an
accumulation and once again we have compromised immune function.  I think
I
just went off on a tangient.  You have to be your own detective.  Since
food
is for energy, your barometer is how you feel 30-60 minutes after you eat
to
see if it works, also how the day progresses in general and how you feel
when you wake up. Not to mention your mindset. Poor nutrition can make a
person and their dr. think they need antidepressants.    Raw when
possible,
tons of vegeatables, fruit to your bodies liking(not craving,liking)
whatever protien and healthy fats and oils. Don’t avoid avocados or nuts
because of their fat content. That is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever
heard.   Whole grains only. Plenty plenty plenty of water and do no harm.
Vegetable juices are probably one of the healthiest things a person can do
for themselves.  The greens especially, but I usually throw in 1/2 a
carrot
and 1/4 beet as that’s all I feel I can tolerate.  The juice is not high
sugar, being that its liquid your absorption does not depend on how well
chewed your food is(Another factor in absorbing nutrients). The
phytochemicals detox and cleanse but not too quickly to the point of
making
you ill.  The enzymes among other things will actually attack toxins in
the
body . They are a helper for the immune system.  The greens will also
alkalize your system as most people are to acidic.  All people with
serious
illness are acidic.  People that crave sugar tend to be too acidic.  This
refers to the PH balance in the body.  Just to give you a visual of this,
If you’ve ever had an aquarium and had to check the ph in the water to
keep
it balanced for the health and survivial of the fish.  The tester kit has
a
color scale going from yellow (totally acidic) to shades of green, blue
and
teal.  Depending on the color you get you add an acidic or alkaline
substance to balance it out.  Fish living in the wrong ph get fin rot, ich
and die!  You can actually buy a ph strip test for people.  Your proteins
and grains are basically acidic. Your greens, vegetables and most fruits
are
alkaline.  So in a way it makes common sense that people that are sick
don’t
get enough veggies.  There are variables as to what’s alkaline and acidic
but that’s the basics.  Anytime I feel I’m fighting anything physically my
mindset is to “green-up”.  rawfoods.com is an informative source and a
place
to order raw foods that are also organic.
Rachael I understand the whole craving thing after ibogaine and the
comfort factor in that. Unless the progresso soup is representative of a
time when a loved one prepared it for him, I personally would do some harm
reduction and whip up a batch of homemade and tell him to feel the love!
Maybe because detoxing is part of what i do professionally and personally
I
was hyperaware of the detoxing going on with the ibogaine.  I actually
could
smell powdered garlic powder coming through my skin on my forearms.  It
was
mandatory in my moms cooking and one of those lazy things I still did on
occasion.  It grossed me out and now I only use real garlic.  It makes you
wonder what else is the body holding and storing toxin wise.  I actually
can
answer that but I think I’ve said enough for now.
Hope this helps,   Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 3:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

I’m feeling conflicted about this as well, being the
caretaker who’s doing the shopping and the feeding.
On the one hand I could just give him the raw fruit
and the yogurt shakes I want to provide.  On the other
hand, he’s just been through this journey and has a
right to eat whatever he wants.  For example,
yesterday he was hungry for roast beef.  So sliced
dead cow it was.  And today he asked for Progresso
canned soup.  In my ideal world, I’d cook up brown
rice, detox tea, and veggie juice.  But the
codependent comfort factor is running high.

Lots of Love, Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 14, 2004 at 4:26:51 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was Vegan for 5yrs from age 15 to 20 and when I eventually went back to
eating milk products I was pig-sick for 2 whole weeks-mainly diarrhoea but
also vomiting.  I’m sure our bodies don’t want much of that shit inside us!

Sadly I gave in to pressure and returned to Vegetarism and have never been
strong enough since to return to being Vegan.  Hell, I wanna escape all this
crap-‘drugs’, sugar, fags, caffeine, milk products etc.  Unfortunately my
heavily dope smoking boyf doesn’t like the idea (except there’ll be more
chocolate for him!)

I just want to feel healthy and have ENERGY! 😉

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 2:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 4:11:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,
I was going to comment re: your age how you have your whole life ahead of you, but come to think of it so do I regardless of my age.  My last addictive stretch started when I was 30.  So I get what you mean.  I believe addiction retards the emotional growth process and some do need to do some catching up.
As far as your sleep cycle goes,and this isn’t scientific just my observation.  Your brain was rinsed, nice and clean like a shiny new penny.  Don’t expect to pick up exactly where you left off.  Getting back to normal has a whole different meaning now.    We don’t really know what normal is considering where we’ve been and what we just went through.  The sleep thing, I believe the intense colors(which I always experienced) and the “vivid sensations” (which are on my top ten list of the most awesome things I’ve ever experienced) are from the iboga or the rinse. The fact that I was getting the deep dream state after my treatment and waking up after 2 hours was, I felt, an equal and opposite reaction for the fact that I spent so much time before that in a nod, or as a non participant in my brain and in my life.  I expereienced my non dream time as completely functional.  Go with and try to work with what your brain and body is telling you.  It’s a gift that may never be again.  It’s only been a month that my sleep isn’t broken into segments.  There are some nights it still is. I can’t be more serious or more profound when I say”everything that was old is new again.  I don’t know if this is more apparent to me because the whole 21 years I’ve been back in the NY area it has been as an addict.  I left(ran for my life) after an addictive stint as a teenager.  Was out west in 3 different states for 12 years.  Came back addicted and stayed that way till 3 months ago.  I personally wouldn’t screw up a brand new brain with sleeping pills, unless you felt it was crucial to your sanity, but I believe most sleeping pills don’t get you into deep sleep.  As my mom used to say ,”If you can’t sleep, just rest”.
There are quite a few different relaxation techniques or a form of self hypnosis that can get you more rested or to sleep.  After a while it gets like that pavlovs dog response that your body knows what’s coming and just getting comfortable and thinking of a technique will sometimes get you where you need to be.  Meditation is another way to calm the mind and rest the body.  Even if you start with 10 minutes and don’t visualize anything in the beginning, sitting quiet and breathing all by itself has benefits.
I am definitley considering doing some past life work.  I think some good energy work and past life stuff can equal a lot of years of psychoanalytical stuff.  I’m going to be in an ibogaine group session starting in dec. so I think that covers my psychological requirements.  Instead of doing individual I think I can get more bang for my buck doing this other stuff.
I believe your dream sounded a lot like holocaust stuff.  I have always felt I was in the holocaust as does my sister and brother in law.  I have had this confirmed but not by my own regression.  My theory is that  a lot of the baby boomers were holocaust victims that were taken out before their time.As a kid I had dreams of being hunted by nazis,gas and thinking I’d be better off blonde.  This could also be generational stuff that kids pick up on. I believe the dream about visiting where you grew up and those long journeys are what is referred to as astral visits.
I think dreams are a way to reveal stuff, release stuff, get prayers across and answered.  You know the brain is kind of a new frontier.  One of the ongoing conversations I’ve had with my nephew since he was 6 was, What do you think we could do if we had full use of our brain?  I believe our actual usage is less than 15%.  I could be wrong and that may not be exact but it’s something I’ve heard repeatedly.  Again no reference note available.  I personally believe we can heal ourselves from anything, replicate damage organs and regenerate damaged limbs.  If a reptile can do it….
The whole purpose of the past life regression is not just to have a look see, but to acknowledge the source of todays pain which enables one to release it easier.
I’m done rambling for now.  Thanks for the response.
Martee

—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:40 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

I’m 26, but I alternate between 18 and 50, depending on the circumstances…I think my circadian rhythm is still screwed up, and this is why I have such vivid recollections of my dreams.  I can get to the deep sleep, but when the cycle starts again, and I return to lighter levels, my body automatically wakes up

Last night I dreamed I was a prisoner in an internment camp, nested between two huge mountains.  I had a daughter that was at least my own age(I have no kids), and a husband that was imprisoned in the male section.  Anyone trying to escape was shot either through the heart or the neck with a flaming arrow.  My last memory of the dream, before I awoke, was of running furiously, out the front gate of the prison; running so fast I could feel and smell the perspiration on my skin!  Has anyone else experienced vivid smells, colours, etc..?  I’ve heard we only dream in black and white, but I don’t believe this at all.

Martee, do you practice hypnosis?  I would love to chat more with you about dreams/past life regressions.  I think this is a very cool topic, and thanks for bringing it up….

Julie

__________________________________________________
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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Hannah/sugar
Date: November 14, 2004 at 4:17:30 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks so much Martee-I think I’m gonna have to do more research!  I’m vegetarian too by the way.  I’m just sick of eating junky rubbish-I live on breakfast cereal, chocolate and ice cream!  And I always feel tired and crappy (I also have problems feeling nauseous all the time)  I was planning to try and cut out sugar (though it sounds like I’m gonna have to start cooking-shock, horror!) and eat lots of fruit n veg.  Make that green veg now!  Thanks for trying to simplify it for me.  I’m trying to stop H and I’m just tired of sleeping all the time and having no energy.  Anyway, I’ll get back to you when I have further questions,
Thanks again 🙂
Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 5:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Hannah/sugar

Hannah,
A conversation on this subject usually involves a number of questions on both sides to get a more individualized plan.  I’ll try without going off on tangents which I am known to do.  Sugar cravings can come from eating sugar and too many starches because of how they digest with the insulin response.  Sugar digests immediately(mostly in the mouth) which is why sugar is looked at as quick energy. You get the energy and then it wears off leaving you with cravings for more, as well as lack of energy.  Coffee triggers the same insulin response.  Both tax your adrenals which is where the body draws it’s own energy.  When the body gets that from sugar and coffee the adrenals stop working as they should. You then rely on those substances to have any get up and go or drive to function.  Waking up tired means you can be hung over on what you ate the day before.  Basically carbs beget carbs. All this activity is also compromising your immune system as well as feeding yeast in the body. Yeast can also make you crave sugar as they want to be fed. Sugar also hits the same spot and mimics the same behavior as any other addictive substance in the brain.
It’s in everything because food mfgs know this.
When a person gets to this point all sugars can affect them adversly and set them craving and crashing including too much fruit.  All foods have a glycemic index.  That refers to the amount of sugar in them.  In fruits your berries are the lowest with bananas and grapes the highest.  I can react the same way to a bowl of grapes as I would to a bowl of hagen das.  Your vegeatables also have a glycemic index.  Greens are nonexistant while carrots and beets are high.  Drinking a carrot beet juice would not do me any good.everyone is different. Go by how you feel.
The five or six small meals or snacks is ideal.  Eating frequentlly keeps your blood sugar more level and maintains sanity and eliminates fatigue in some.  It’s also better for your digestion to not eat such large amounts at one time.  It can be an idea to cut out all sugar and refined white starches.  You need to read ingredients to be succesful with this as there can be a ton of sugar in some sauce that can set you off.  You can attempt some whole grains as long as they don’t set you off.  If they do then you need to cut them out initially till you get over the hump.  Or the other way is to eat only protein, fats and lot and lots of vegetables for 3 or 4 days and then slowly add in more whole grains to see what you can tolerate.  You usually have more energy and feel better after one day.  If you’re still craving after 3 days there are usually hidden sugars somewhere.  You’ll get your tastebuds back and you’ll notice how sweet vegetables taste.  Introduce fruit as a lone snack.  But the meal or snack before and after should have protein if needed.  You gauge by your energy level.  Artificial sweetners also set off the sugar cravings in the brain, as does that garbage sucralose.  The addictive aspect becomes real obvious when after not ingesting any sugar for a while(days,months,etc) and then you indulge one too many times, it triggers something in the brain that not only sets you off but in no time flat gets you back to the same mission you were on before you stopped.  I feel like this is not my best  as far as clarity and getting to the point  .  If you want more specifics give me an idea of what.   Martee— Original Message —–
From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 2:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanks Preston

“One is that if all sugars are stopped for 3-4 days the cravings go away.”

How would you go about cutting out ALL sugars?  Sorry if I sound brainless but doesn’t just about everything include Sugar?  Like is fruit sugar just as bad?  Would you have to cut out fruit too?

I would LOVE to escape my chocolate and ice cream addiction!

Thanks for all this info-I would never have known otherwise,
Love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 3:52 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Thanks Preston

Preston,
Thank you for acknowledging this info which so many people shrug off as no big deal (take note Marc, my love). Lick the Sugar Habit is an extremely informative book. I have noticed over the years in myself and many others that sugar is as addictive as heroin if not more so.  There are so many correlations between the two in the brain and the body that leaves no doubt for me.  One is that if all sugars are stopped for 3-4 days the cravings go away.  That includes artificial replacements that trigger same brain activity and promote cravings. The madness that makes one run to the store at midnight for Hagen Das is gone. It brings this uncanny sense of peace when you realize you have control. What most people mistake as lack of willpower when it comes to sugar and refined carbs,is really something going on in the brain as well as the insulin cycle that happens which makes you crash and crave as well.  Sure you need to get proper protein and fats (no insulin response) as well as healthy carbs at the same time.
The food co’s know that sugar and the chemicals they put in food is addictive.  Just as the tobacco co’s always knew nicotine was addictive.  No nutrients plus sugar and chemicals breaking down the immune function leads to diease and a whole lot of folks getting pharaceuticals from their drs. who are romanced by the drug co’s. (yes I know there are exceptions). These chemicals (drugs can furthur tear down immune function (side effects).  And so it goes and so it goes.
Nothing matastacizes cancer quicker than sugar.  Which my observation starts with overgrowth of yeast and fungus(systemic), also sugar related.
As much as it sounds like my thing is health and nutrition it really is about people being empowered and not kept or turned out as victims.
Yes Julie, listen to your body, trust your intuition and learn and perceive what you can.  Use that same intuition in knowing who to trustwhen you go for help.
Take what you like and leave the rest.  No ones right about everything.  And no one will know you and your body as you can.  Self-reliance is a rush.
DH excellent advice.  It all goes hand in hand.
Martee

From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 4:03:15 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m a Bush Babe and I got the same message.  It said I would be deleted form the list if messages got bounced again–whatever that means.  Thats okay I had been interested in discussing ways to kick drug addiction–but found this is just another hate site against our president in war time.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: Sun, 14 Nov 2004 09:15:19 -0600

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the day ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out of here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.  what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley about computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.  thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for right now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we can understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let you know.

_________________________________________________________________
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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Dear Jasen- best of luck on your journey
Date: November 14, 2004 at 2:50:23 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Good luck to you and let’us know
God bless
Francis
—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 9:29 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Dear Jasen- best of luck on your journey

Dear Jasen,

Your special day is at hand…how do you feel?  Are you scared, excited?  I have a beautiful purple candle that I selected just for you….

Please be well, and post as soon as you can…

love Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why my E-mail was not published ?
Date: November 14, 2004 at 2:15:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you seem to be broadcasting just fine

(re” your email on past life regression/healing/etc)

On Sunday, November 14, 2004, at 08:51 AM, The Garden wrote:

 

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 2:11:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Test        TeSt       tEsT

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Why my E-mail was not published ?
Date: November 14, 2004 at 1:51:05 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

 

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] test2
Date: November 14, 2004 at 1:31:31 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 11:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

On Saturday, November 13, 2004, at 02:51 PM, m.finman wrote:

I think the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing, that it is quite
possible that you are  one of your own ancestors!

Yes, me too! I was all prepared to possibly see my grandfather or great
grandfather, etc etc… but the faces (first hour& 1/2 of experience)
that floated thru my ‘field’ of vision i instantly recognized as my own
past lives.

(begin twilight theme song and fade)

_.dh

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 1:31:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Test     TEST      TeSt       tEsT

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: [Ibogaine] red and blue states
Date: November 14, 2004 at 1:25:33 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was struck by how the states at least risk from terrorism voted
the most from fear. Here’s an editorial from The New Yorker
magazine that touches on this, first the relevant quote then the
whole editorial.

“… Here in the big coastal cities, we have reason to fear for the
immediate safety of our lives and our families—more reason, it must
be said, than have the residents of the “heartland,” to which the
per-capita bulk of “homeland security” resources, along with extra
electoral votes, are distributed. It was deep-blue New York (which
went three to one for Kerry) and deep-blue Washington, D.C. (nine
to one Kerry), that were, and presumably remain, Al Qaeda’s targets
of choice. In the heartland, it is claimed, some view the coastal
cities as faintly un-American. The terrorists do not agree. They
see us as the very essence—the heart, if you like—of America. And,
difficult as it may be for some rural gun owners to appreciate,
many of us sincerely believe that President Bush’s policies have
put us in greater peril than we would be facing under a Kerry (or a
Gore) Administration. There is apprehension that the well-
documented failure to devote adequate resources to the protection
of our cities, seaports, and airports will not be remedied. There
is apprehension that the colossal incompetence and bad judgment—
accompanied by ideological hubris, diplomatic arrogance, and an
eagerness to ignore or suppress inconvenient evidence—that have
tied up our military might in the knots of Iraq will, having been
rewarded at the polls, continue. There is apprehension that the
anti-Bush sentiments that are manifest throughout much of the world
will now transmute into fully fledged anti-Americanism. The
governments of our estranged European allies, led by reality-based
statesmen, will do their best to accommodate the practical fact of
a second Bush term. But these are, after all, democratic countries,
and their publics may not be so patient or so sensible. ”

COMMENT
BLUES
Issue of 2004-11-15
Posted 2004-11-08
Here in the bluest borough of the bluest city of the bluest state
in all our red-white-and-blue American Union, it has not been a
happy week. A cocktail of emotions was being felt in these parts
after last week’s Presidential election, and the most potent
ingredient was sadness. We’ve got the blues, and we’ve got ’em bad.

The grief that so many felt at Senator Kerry’s defeat was quite
unexpected, and profound enough that, for the moment at least, it
held off bitterness and recrimination. On both sides, this was a
campaign that vast numbers of people threw their hearts into. There
was a huge volunteer outpouring for Kerry, from Bruce Springsteen
and George Soros on high to the hundreds of thousands, maybe
millions, who manned phone banks and travelled to “swing states”
and wrote the first political checks of their lives. To be sure,
something along these lines had happened before, in the campaigns
of Adlai Stevenson, Eugene McCarthy, Robert Kennedy, and George
McGovern on the Democratic side, and of Barry Goldwater on the
Republican. But this time the scale was larger and the yearning was
greater, because in contrast to the campaigns of 1952 and 1964 and
1968 and 1972, all of which had the quixotic quality of gallant but
doomed struggles, the chance of victory in 2004 seemed real,
especially as Election Day approached. And this time the stakes
felt higher—higher than in any election for at least three decades
and maybe longer.

During the campaign it was routinely remarked that the Democrats’
fervor was rooted much more in anti-Bush than in pro-Kerry
sentiments. That was certainly true at the beginning, when many
primary voters calculated that a decorated war hero, even one from
liberal Massachusetts, would be more “electable” than a volatile
Vermont doctor. It was far less true at the end. Grave and formal,
steady and decent, more emotionally accessible as Election Day
approached, John Kerry wore well. He earned the respect of his
supporters and had begun to earn their affection. (Perhaps that
will protect him from the kind of scapegoating to which Al Gore was
so relentlessly subjected.) All Kerry needed to become thoroughly
presidential was the Presidency. His supporters risked heartbreak,
and they found it.

Along with the sadness, there is puzzlement. Incumbents, especially
in time of war, have a built-in advantage. But this incumbent had
led the country into a war, the war in Iraq, that half the public
had come to see as a mistake, and had led the country down what
more than half the public saw, in pollster’s shorthand, as “the
wrong track.” The election’s outcome defies logic, and perhaps that
is the point. The early analyses credited Bush’s victory to
religious conservatives, particularly those in the evangelical
movement. In voting for Bush, as eighty per cent of them did, many
of these formerly nonvoting white evangelicals are remaining true
to their unworldliness. In voting for a party that wants to tax
work rather than wealth, that scorns thrift, that sees the natural
world not as a common inheritance but as an object of exploitation,
and that equates economic inequality with economic vitality, they
have voted against their own material (and, some might imagine,
spiritual) well-being. The moral values that stirred them seem not
to encompass botched wars or economic injustices or environmental
depredations; rather, moral values are about sexual behavior and
its various manifestations and outcomes, about family structures,
and about a particularly demonstrative brand of religious piety.
What was important to these voters, it appears, was not Bush’s
public record but what they conceived to be his private soul. He is
a good Christian, so his policy failures are forgivable. He is a
saved sinner, so the dissipations of his early and middle years are
not tokens of a weak character but testaments to the transformative
power of his faith. He relies on God for guidance, so his
intellectual laziness is not a danger.

What people on what might be called the cultural blue side, which
includes many who voted for Bush, find deeply unsettling about him
is not his religious faith—he is hardly the first devout President—
but the way he speaks of making decisions with his gut, which, he
has often suggested, takes its direction from God. In his second
term, given the validation he received on Election Day, he is
likely to be more confident—in himself, in his “instincts,” and in
Almighty Gut. He will be less inclined than ever to listen to his
earthly father, or to his earthly father’s earthly surrogates, such
as Colin Powell.

Along with the sadness and the puzzlement, there is apprehension.
Here in the big coastal cities, we have reason to fear for the
immediate safety of our lives and our families—more reason, it must
be said, than have the residents of the “heartland,” to which the
per-capita bulk of “homeland security” resources, along with extra
electoral votes, are distributed. It was deep-blue New York (which
went three to one for Kerry) and deep-blue Washington, D.C. (nine
to one Kerry), that were, and presumably remain, Al Qaeda’s targets
of choice. In the heartland, it is claimed, some view the coastal
cities as faintly un-American. The terrorists do not agree. They
see us as the very essence—the heart, if you like—of America. And,
difficult as it may be for some rural gun owners to appreciate,
many of us sincerely believe that President Bush’s policies have
put us in greater peril than we would be facing under a Kerry (or a
Gore) Administration. There is apprehension that the well-
documented failure to devote adequate resources to the protection
of our cities, seaports, and airports will not be remedied. There
is apprehension that the colossal incompetence and bad judgment—
accompanied by ideological hubris, diplomatic arrogance, and an
eagerness to ignore or suppress inconvenient evidence—that have
tied up our military might in the knots of Iraq will, having been
rewarded at the polls, continue. There is apprehension that the
anti-Bush sentiments that are manifest throughout much of the world
will now transmute into fully fledged anti-Americanism. The
governments of our estranged European allies, led by reality-based
statesmen, will do their best to accommodate the practical fact of
a second Bush term. But these are, after all, democratic countries,
and their publics may not be so patient or so sensible.

And there is apprehension about where this Administration will try
to take our society. In his victory statement on Wednesday Bush
spoke of “a new opportunity to reach out to the whole nation.” By
Thursday, at his postelection press conference, this had been
modified to “I’ll reach out to everyone who shares our goals.” One
of those goals is to revamp the tax system in ways that would shift
the burden further downward, including the permanent abolition of
the inheritance tax. Another is to privatize part of Social
Security, which by definition would mean a reduction in guaranteed
benefits for future retirees. Achieving the first of these goals
would impose the pitiless culture of winners and losers on the
beginning of life; achieving the second would impose it on life’s
end. Together they would constitute a fundamental revocation of an
American social contract that was hammered out seventy years ago
during the New Deal.

In Thursday’s Times, a front-page news analysis argued that “it is
impossible to read President Bush’s reëlection with larger
Republican majorities in both houses of Congress as anything other
than the clearest confirmation yet that this is a center-right
country—divided yes, but with an undisputed majority united behind
his leadership.” That is certainly true in institutional terms. But
it is not true in terms of people, of actual human beings. Though
the Republicans won nineteen of the thirty-four Senate seats that
were up for grabs last Tuesday, for a gain of four, the number of
voters who cast their ballots for Republican Senate candidates was
37.9 million, while 41.3 million voted for Democrats—almost exactly
Bush’s popular-vote margin over Kerry. When the new Congress
convenes in January, its fifty-five Republicans will be there on
account of the votes of 57.6 million people, while the forty-four
Democrats and one independent will be there on account of the votes
of 59.6 million people. As for the House, it is much harder to
aggregate vote totals meaningfully, because so many seats are
uncontested. But the Republicans’ gain of four seats was due
entirely to Tom DeLay’s precedent-breaking re-gerrymandering of the
Texas district lines.

The red-blue split has not changed since 2000. This is not a center-
right country. It is a center-right country and a center-left
country, but the center has not held. The winner-take-all aspects
of our system have converged into a perfect storm that has given
virtually all the political power to the right; conservative
Republicans will now control the Presidency, the House of
Representatives, and the Senate so firmly that the Supreme Court,
which is also in conservative hands, has abruptly become the most
moderate of the four centers of federal power. The system of checks
and balances has broken down, but the country remains divided—right
down the nonexistent, powerless middle.

— Hendrik Hertzberg

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Disregard Test
Date: November 14, 2004 at 1:21:10 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Julie,
Thank you so much for your reply.  I had one of my clients tell me
she
had a dream that took place in 1700’s that she conscously had no knowledge
of the specifics of that period.  She was wearing the clothes and in the
town etc.  I believe this was a past life recollection.  I also think that
guy you saw being beheaded with his soul (spirit) going up could quite
possibly have been past life for you.  It was common in the past that
people
were killed either with beheadings, hangings and strangulations.  I
believe
that’s why a lot of people have issues with wearing anything tight around
the neck.  I know I had until very recently a claustrophobic reaction
connected to my neck, feet and wrists.  If it took more than 1 second to
unbotton a shirtsleeve I would panic and loose the ability to breathe.  In
my last energy work session, A past life where I was in late 1700’s locked
up in an insane asylum for being “eccentric” (some things never change), I
was shackled around my neck, ankles and wrists.  Since this revelation I
have been ok going down into the subways without the panic feeling and
haven’t paniced when it took to long to take my watch off. I was also told
that the majority of my addiction issues are covering up pain from past
lives.   In my session I recollect a young 10 year old boy somewhere in
the
midwest around what I guessed to be the late 1800″s or very early 1900″s
talking to his father.  My impression that the young boy was me
previously.
Aside from what you’re seeing in the dream I was wondering about the
actual
sensations experienced as oppossed to viewing or just being there.  I
think
the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing, that it is quite possible that
you
are  one of your own ancestors!
I also am interested in the whole scientific explanation for what
happens.  I don’t discriminate. (much).
How’s your energy level coming.  What is your age?  Unless I’m mixing
you up with someone else I believe you said your usage was 4 years?
Anything you will share will be appreciated and used
hopefully for the greater good.
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

My dreams have been fantastic!  Very colourful, very
vivid. very exciting…I’m wondering if it’s the
influence of the Ibo, or perhaps juat the absence of
the dope.  I have been dreaming of long journeys,
large bodies of water, and the small town I grew up
in.  I have also been dreaming of fantastic sex with
alien gods(seriously!), and magical doorways on the
sides of mountains, that lead to strange and exotic
places.  So far, no dreams of using…And not one
single nightmare(knock on wood)…

Anyone else have any cool post-Ibo dreams they’d like
to share??

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Fw: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 1:18:13 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 12:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

My two cents …
When I was thirty, I read a book that changed my
life.
As soon I opened it, my heart started to race. I already knew the
contents.
The effect of the ” deja vu ” was so powerful that we had to call a doctor
who injected me with a strong tranquilizer. I thought I was dying, for
several years I still had attacks of tachycardia . I had a dream about my
past-life for years and years, seeking my Grand Father house in a small
village in the middle east before the first World War . One day , in a
dream
I found the house and discovered my familly. The tachycardia disappears.
During theses years of fears and despair  I have been researching
explanations and techniques, first to help myself and then to help others.
That brought me to study and use NLP, past life regression ect. With
incredible results, fast and clean, I could help people but never
satisfactory enought in my opinion
Something was missing; people will get ride of their
phobies ect. but will not change at a deeper level and will not find
peace.
A friend of mine who had been a missionary for ten years; he was convinced
that he was possessed by several evil entities. This man who had  been
living a virtuous life for years was now an addict, not only to substances
but to sex as well. He was contemplating the idea of suicide. He asked me
to
deliver him and gave me three books on depossession. The same week I
worked
on him in two long session of about 4 hours. Exausting and spooky. After
years of fight between treatment centers and relapses psychiatrist and
psycologist he finally felt at peace. Went back to is hometown and resume
is
studies.
That was my first experience with depossession . …

How bizzare and wonderful is life ?/!

Francis

P.S I know that some people will react strongly to this E-mail even
violently. I don’t want to start a flame, this is my humble experience.
Take
it as it is. For me addiction is a spiritual disease, and when I said
addiction   I am refering to  ” The condition of being habitually or
compulsively occupied with or or involved in something. ” …. to escape
realitie and the fear of self discovering. God bless  and God bless
particularly  ” the angels’  who  are helping people with Ibo.

—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Julie,
Thank you so much for your reply.  I had one of my clients tell me
she
had a dream that took place in 1700’s that she conscously had no
knowledge
of the specifics of that period.  She was wearing the clothes and in the
town etc.  I believe this was a past life recollection.  I also think
that
guy you saw being beheaded with his soul (spirit) going up could quite
possibly have been past life for you.  It was common in the past that
people
were killed either with beheadings, hangings and strangulations.  I
believe
that’s why a lot of people have issues with wearing anything tight
around
the neck.  I know I had until very recently a claustrophobic reaction
connected to my neck, feet and wrists.  If it took more than 1 second to
unbotton a shirtsleeve I would panic and loose the ability to breathe.
In
my last energy work session, A past life where I was in late 1700’s
locked
up in an insane asylum for being “eccentric” (some things never change),
I
was shackled around my neck, ankles and wrists.  Since this revelation I
have been ok going down into the subways without the panic feeling and
haven’t paniced when it took to long to take my watch off. I was also
told
that the majority of my addiction issues are covering up pain from past
lives.   In my session I recollect a young 10 year old boy somewhere in
the
midwest around what I guessed to be the late 1800″s or very early 1900″s
talking to his father.  My impression that the young boy was me
previously.
Aside from what you’re seeing in the dream I was wondering about the
actual
sensations experienced as oppossed to viewing or just being there.  I
think
the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing, that it is quite possible that
you
are  one of your own ancestors!
I also am interested in the whole scientific explanation for what
happens.  I don’t discriminate. (much).
How’s your energy level coming.  What is your age?  Unless I’m
mixing
you up with someone else I believe you said your usage was 4 years?
Anything you will share will be appreciated and used
hopefully for the greater good.
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

My dreams have been fantastic!  Very colourful, very
vivid. very exciting…I’m wondering if it’s the
influence of the Ibo, or perhaps juat the absence of
the dope.  I have been dreaming of long journeys,
large bodies of water, and the small town I grew up
in.  I have also been dreaming of fantastic sex with
alien gods(seriously!), and magical doorways on the
sides of mountains, that lead to strange and exotic
places.  So far, no dreams of using…And not one
single nightmare(knock on wood)…

Anyone else have any cool post-Ibo dreams they’d like
to share??

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ibogaine Digest 10 Nov 2004 22:08:03 -0000 Issue 764
Date: November 14, 2004 at 1:11:56 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

cannot open this or any of the others. purge me already? help me out, not your job log roller but i’m a bro, besides, d/n hurt to have a crimlaw atty on forum for questions.  the machines call.machines have no soul. you a machine ?
—– Original Message —– From: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 4:08 PM
Subject: ibogaine Digest 10 Nov 2004 22:08:03 -0000 Issue 764

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sorry, my mistake
Date: November 14, 2004 at 1:09:49 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This was for the list, sorry 🙁
—– Original Message —–
From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 12:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

My two cents …
When I was thirty, I read a book that changed my
life.
As soon I opened it, my heart started to race. I already knew the
contents.
The effect of the ” deja vu ” was so powerful that we had to call a doctor
who injected me with a strong tranquilizer. I thought I was dying, for
several years I still had attacks of tachycardia . I had a dream about my
past-life for years and years, seeking my Grand Father house in a small
village in the middle east before the first World War . One day , in a
dream
I found the house and discovered my familly. The tachycardia disappears.
During theses years of fears and despair  I have been researching
explanations and techniques, first to help myself and then to help others.
That brought me to study and use NLP, past life regression ect. With
incredible results, fast and clean, I could help people but never
satisfactory enought in my opinion
Something was missing; people will get ride of their
phobies ect. but will not change at a deeper level and will not find
peace.
A friend of mine who had been a missionary for ten years; he was convinced
that he was possessed by several evil entities. This man who had  been
living a virtuous life for years was now an addict, not only to substances
but to sex as well. He was contemplating the idea of suicide. He asked me
to
deliver him and gave me three books on depossession. The same week I
worked
on him in two long session of about 4 hours. Exausting and spooky. After
years of fight between treatment centers and relapses psychiatrist and
psycologist he finally felt at peace. Went back to is hometown and resume
is
studies.
That was my first experience with depossession . …

How bizzare and wonderful is life ?/!

Francis

P.S I know that some people will react strongly to this E-mail even
violently. I don’t want to start a flame, this is my humble experience.
Take
it as it is. For me addiction is a spiritual disease, and when I said
addiction   I am refering to  ” The condition of being habitually or
compulsively occupied with or or involved in something. ” …. to escape
realitie and the fear of self discovering. God bless  and God bless
particularly  ” the angels’  who  are helping people with Ibo.

—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Julie,
Thank you so much for your reply.  I had one of my clients tell me
she
had a dream that took place in 1700’s that she conscously had no
knowledge
of the specifics of that period.  She was wearing the clothes and in the
town etc.  I believe this was a past life recollection.  I also think
that
guy you saw being beheaded with his soul (spirit) going up could quite
possibly have been past life for you.  It was common in the past that
people
were killed either with beheadings, hangings and strangulations.  I
believe
that’s why a lot of people have issues with wearing anything tight
around
the neck.  I know I had until very recently a claustrophobic reaction
connected to my neck, feet and wrists.  If it took more than 1 second to
unbotton a shirtsleeve I would panic and loose the ability to breathe.
In
my last energy work session, A past life where I was in late 1700’s
locked
up in an insane asylum for being “eccentric” (some things never change),
I
was shackled around my neck, ankles and wrists.  Since this revelation I
have been ok going down into the subways without the panic feeling and
haven’t paniced when it took to long to take my watch off. I was also
told
that the majority of my addiction issues are covering up pain from past
lives.   In my session I recollect a young 10 year old boy somewhere in
the
midwest around what I guessed to be the late 1800″s or very early 1900″s
talking to his father.  My impression that the young boy was me
previously.
Aside from what you’re seeing in the dream I was wondering about the
actual
sensations experienced as oppossed to viewing or just being there.  I
think
the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing, that it is quite possible that
you
are  one of your own ancestors!
I also am interested in the whole scientific explanation for what
happens.  I don’t discriminate. (much).
How’s your energy level coming.  What is your age?  Unless I’m
mixing
you up with someone else I believe you said your usage was 4 years?
Anything you will share will be appreciated and used
hopefully for the greater good.
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

My dreams have been fantastic!  Very colourful, very
vivid. very exciting…I’m wondering if it’s the
influence of the Ibo, or perhaps juat the absence of
the dope.  I have been dreaming of long journeys,
large bodies of water, and the small town I grew up
in.  I have also been dreaming of fantastic sex with
alien gods(seriously!), and magical doorways on the
sides of mountains, that lead to strange and exotic
places.  So far, no dreams of using…And not one
single nightmare(knock on wood)…

Anyone else have any cool post-Ibo dreams they’d like
to share??

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 12:40:26 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My two cents …
When I was thirty, I read a book that changed my life.
As soon I opened it, my heart started to race. I already knew the contents.
The effect of the ” deja vu ” was so powerful that we had to call a doctor
who injected me with a strong tranquilizer. I thought I was dying, for
several years I still had attacks of tachycardia . I had a dream about my
past-life for years and years, seeking my Grand Father house in a small
village in the middle east before the first World War . One day , in a dream
I found the house and discovered my familly. The tachycardia disappears.
During theses years of fears and despair  I have been researching
explanations and techniques, first to help myself and then to help others.
That brought me to study and use NLP, past life regression ect. With
incredible results, fast and clean, I could help people but never
satisfactory enought in my opinion
Something was missing; people will get ride of their
phobies ect. but will not change at a deeper level and will not find peace.
A friend of mine who had been a missionary for ten years; he was convinced
that he was possessed by several evil entities. This man who had  been
living a virtuous life for years was now an addict, not only to substances
but to sex as well. He was contemplating the idea of suicide. He asked me to
deliver him and gave me three books on depossession. The same week I worked
on him in two long session of about 4 hours. Exausting and spooky. After
years of fight between treatment centers and relapses psychiatrist and
psycologist he finally felt at peace. Went back to is hometown and resume is
studies.
That was my first experience with depossession . …

How bizzare and wonderful is life ?/!

Francis

P.S I know that some people will react strongly to this E-mail even
violently. I don’t want to start a flame, this is my humble experience. Take
it as it is. For me addiction is a spiritual disease, and when I said
addiction   I am refering to  ” The condition of being habitually or
compulsively occupied with or or involved in something. ” …. to escape
realitie and the fear of self discovering. God bless  and God bless
particularly  ” the angels’  who  are helping people with Ibo.

—– Original Message —–
From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Julie,
Thank you so much for your reply.  I had one of my clients tell me
she
had a dream that took place in 1700’s that she conscously had no knowledge
of the specifics of that period.  She was wearing the clothes and in the
town etc.  I believe this was a past life recollection.  I also think that
guy you saw being beheaded with his soul (spirit) going up could quite
possibly have been past life for you.  It was common in the past that
people
were killed either with beheadings, hangings and strangulations.  I
believe
that’s why a lot of people have issues with wearing anything tight around
the neck.  I know I had until very recently a claustrophobic reaction
connected to my neck, feet and wrists.  If it took more than 1 second to
unbotton a shirtsleeve I would panic and loose the ability to breathe.  In
my last energy work session, A past life where I was in late 1700’s locked
up in an insane asylum for being “eccentric” (some things never change), I
was shackled around my neck, ankles and wrists.  Since this revelation I
have been ok going down into the subways without the panic feeling and
haven’t paniced when it took to long to take my watch off. I was also told
that the majority of my addiction issues are covering up pain from past
lives.   In my session I recollect a young 10 year old boy somewhere in
the
midwest around what I guessed to be the late 1800″s or very early 1900″s
talking to his father.  My impression that the young boy was me
previously.
Aside from what you’re seeing in the dream I was wondering about the
actual
sensations experienced as oppossed to viewing or just being there.  I
think
the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing, that it is quite possible that
you
are  one of your own ancestors!
I also am interested in the whole scientific explanation for what
happens.  I don’t discriminate. (much).
How’s your energy level coming.  What is your age?  Unless I’m mixing
you up with someone else I believe you said your usage was 4 years?
Anything you will share will be appreciated and used
hopefully for the greater good.
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

My dreams have been fantastic!  Very colourful, very
vivid. very exciting…I’m wondering if it’s the
influence of the Ibo, or perhaps juat the absence of
the dope.  I have been dreaming of long journeys,
large bodies of water, and the small town I grew up
in.  I have also been dreaming of fantastic sex with
alien gods(seriously!), and magical doorways on the
sides of mountains, that lead to strange and exotic
places.  So far, no dreams of using…And not one
single nightmare(knock on wood)…

Anyone else have any cool post-Ibo dreams they’d like
to share??

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine Sara
Date: November 14, 2004 at 12:18:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Sara, how’s my friend from Ausie land. I hope all is well in your part of the world. Let us know how things are going, I’d like to light a candle for him. Peace       Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: ezmlm warning
Date: November 14, 2004 at 12:16:27 PM EST
To: <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
Cc: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i d/n know what bounced means, i d/n know probes, i just know i cannot open the digest  email so i delete them.  please educate me as i do not want anyone in danger or myself.  if you catch my drift. rwd
i figure we’re living ‘brave new world w/o soma’ and everyone is a  “plant” thanks, i await your responses.   <ibogaine-digest-help@mindvox.com>
To: <rwd3@cox.net>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:55 PM
Subject: ezmlm warning

Hi! This is the ezmlm program. I’m managing the
ibogaine-digest@mindvox.com mailing list.

I’m working for my owner, who can be reached
at ibogaine-digest-owner@mindvox.com.

Messages to you from the ibogaine-digest mailing list seem to
have been bouncing. I’ve attached a copy of the first bounce
message I received.

If this message bounces too, I will send you a probe. If the probe bounces,
I will remove your address from the ibogaine-digest mailing list,
without further notice.

I’ve kept a list of which digests from the ibogaine-digest mailing list
have bounced from your address. For each digest you missed, I have
noted the number of the first message in the digest.

I do not archive the digests themselves, but you may be able to
get the messages from the main list archive.

To retrieve a set of messages 123-145 (a maximum of 100 per request),
send an empty message to:
<ibogaine-get.123_145@mindvox.com>

To receive a subject and author list for the last 100 or so messages,
send an empty message to:
<ibogaine-index@mindvox.com>

Here are the digest message numbers:

11710

— Enclosed is a copy of the bounce message I received.

Return-Path: <>
Received: (qmail 5754 invoked for bounce); 2 Nov 2004 02:44:34 -0000
Date: 2 Nov 2004 02:44:34 -0000
From: MAILER-DAEMON@serenity.mindvox.com
To: ibogaine-digest-return-11710-@mindvox.com
Subject: failure notice

Hi. This is the qmail-send program at serenity.mindvox.com.
I’m afraid I wasn’t able to deliver your message to the following addresses.
This is a permanent error; I’ve given up. Sorry it didn’t work out.

<rwd3@cox.net>:
68.1.17.3 failed after I sent the message.
Remote host said: 552 Message size exceeds fixed maximum message size: 5242880 bytes

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..
Date: November 14, 2004 at 10:17:43 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

won’t open for me.  any secret handshakes?
—– Original Message —–
From: Mauro Solorzano
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 1:05 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..

Hello Eric

“Sorry everybody” is a cool site. By the way, what date will you come up to NYC? I look foward to meeting you.

Mauro

Dear List,
Check out if you will    www.sorryeverybody.com
Eric

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 10:15:19 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i haven’t had rem sleep in yrs. thanks to benzos.  this, as my lay brain understands it, is the time when we problem solve and recharge for the day ahead.  . anyone w/ post benzo info on rem sleep, assuming i make it out of here are. oh, some dude/girl/ robot, said my emails from the forum concerning the digest are bouncing back.  i c/n open the digest files.  what does it mean, am i bugged by the man, what’s up?  i know diddley about computers(was a pinball wizard, pre pac man) so i’m in the dark. i figure with all the bush babies on the forum i’m the least of anyones worries.  thoughts? all accepted w/o being defensive.  wish i could open them but don’t know how, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 5:09 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for right now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we can understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let you know.

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:40:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee,

I’m 26, but I alternate between 18 and 50, depending on the circumstances…I think my circadian rhythm is still screwed up, and this is why I have such vivid recollections of my dreams.  I can get to the deep sleep, but when the cycle starts again, and I return to lighter levels, my body automatically wakes up

Last night I dreamed I was a prisoner in an internment camp, nested between two huge mountains.  I had a daughter that was at least my own age(I have no kids), and a husband that was imprisoned in the male section.  Anyone trying to escape was shot either through the heart or the neck with a flaming arrow.  My last memory of the dream, before I awoke, was of running furiously, out the front gate of the prison; running so fast I could feel and smell the perspiration on my skin!  Has anyone else experienced vivid smells, colours, etc..?  I’ve heard we only dream in black and white, but I don’t believe this at all.

Martee, do you practice hypnosis?  I would love to chat more with you about dreams/past life regressions.  I think this is a very cool topic, and thanks for bringing it up….

Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Dear Jasen- best of luck on your journey
Date: November 14, 2004 at 9:29:05 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Jasen,

Your special day is at hand…how do you feel?  Are you scared, excited?  I have a beautiful purple candle that I selected just for you….

Please be well, and post as soon as you can…

love Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “Allison Senepart” <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 14, 2004 at 4:42:18 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Best of luck and good wishes from New Zealand.   Will look forward to hearing how you get on.  Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Saturday, 13 November 2004 6:21:07 a.m.
To: Summary
Subject: [Ibogaine] Two days left

Dear List,
I will start my Ibogain treatment 2-3 days later. I’m little stressed but I’m sure I will kick my addiction. Wish me Luck.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 4:28:15 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Almost the whole Ibo experience for me centered on Africa. Even when I was in the spaceship it seems a pygmy was driving it. I want to go to Africa real bad. Always have. Now I don’t want to hunt Cape Buffalo, I have better reasons to go.   Randy  PS right before I woke up tonight I dreamed I shot an elk with an AK 47. 7.62X39 rounds aren’t bad but it is not elk fodder. Whats up with that? I would never go under gunned for any game. Ethics are everything for people who really are into hunting for the sake of being there.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 4:14:31 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee, I was all prepared to see my ancestors when I took the Ibo, which by the way was over 6 weeks ago, and I didn’t. I saw my son a bunch of times and he looks a lot like me so it may well have been me I don’t know. He was always smiling like he did when he was little and he seemed to have a halo around his head. I have always been a very lucid dreamer so It is hard to tell if Ibogaine changed any of that. When I was little, maybe 5 and 6 I had recurring dreams of nuclear war. My mother says I described it perfectly. Maybe I was at Hiroshima or something. They dropped that bomb on Aug. 6, I was born Aug. 7, 12 years later. I’ve had some real wild dreams since the Ibo (lots of sex dreams) that were absolutely very real at the time. When I wake up it is disappointing. I have read that smoking pot diminishes lucid dreaming so I may be missing out. The other day I dreamed that terrorist were using big Chinook helicopters to bomb Catskill, NY. I still see it in my head. Being opiate free roks like an ox though no matter the dreams. I’ve been thrilled or terrified at my dreams all my life.                           Randy

From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 3:56:39 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I found that looking at photographs of family before
dosing a booster helped ‘ground’ the experience, and
seemed to familierise dreams a bit.  In small stepped
doses dreams very vivid, and sleep during dream, deep
sleep, and eat Fresh Fruit lotsof spring water during.
etc…
So do the  ibo ‘waking dream’ and sleeping dreams
usually have a common theme?  They seem to be similar
in subjects?
-J

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

On Saturday, November 13, 2004, at 02:51 PM,
m.finman wrote:

I think the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing,
that it is quite
possible that you are  one of your own ancestors!

Yes, me too! I was all prepared to possibly see my
grandfather or great
grandfather, etc etc… but the faces (first hour&
1/2 of experience)
that floated thru my ‘field’ of vision i instantly
recognized as my own
past lives.

(begin twilight theme song and fade)

_.dh

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

___________________________________________________________
Win a castle for NYE with your mates and Yahoo! Messenger
http://uk.messenger.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 14, 2004 at 3:53:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

DH,
Thanks so much for the acknowledgment.  After I sent it I was wondering did I go a little too far this time as far as what I’m putting out there, but then I figured throw it up in the air and see what comes down.  Any insight personally or otherwise about the whole dream thing?       Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 11:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

On Saturday, November 13, 2004, at 02:51 PM, m.finman wrote:

I think the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing, that it is quite possible that you are  one of your own ancestors!

Yes, me too! I was all prepared to possibly see my grandfather or great grandfather, etc etc… but the faces (first hour& 1/2 of experience) that floated thru my ‘field’ of vision i instantly recognized as my own past lives.

(begin twilight theme song and fade)

_.dh

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: (Preston sent this to you V) Fw: Don’t you feel like doing…
Date: November 14, 2004 at 3:47:40 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston,
Thanx so much for that penguin thing.  It’s beyond hysterical.  Kind of slapstick like. Knowing how emperor penguins huddle together for warmth in the cold months and that they are aware of their proximity to another my guess is it was an intentional hit.  It’s like Pow,…Bitch!            Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Preston Peet
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 14, 2004 2:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: (Preston sent this to you V) Fw: Don’t you feel like doing…

Yeah, V and I both have been laughing all day over this one Randy, and I’m glad to read it gave pleasure to at least one other person.
I do wonder what in the world was going through the mind of the pushing penguin. Did s/he plan on doing that or was it an accident? Did it simply see an opportunity to play around or was it merely flexing its wing?
;-)))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com ; drugwar@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 9:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: (Preston sent this to you V) Fw: Don’t you feel like doing…

Preston, I am still rolling on the floor laughing.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: (Preston sent this to you V) Fw: Don’t you feel like doing…
Date: November 14, 2004 at 3:40:56 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, I think the pushy penguin was playing around. I bet he/she waited for an hour just to do that. Kinda reminds me of growing up with my brothers. We had a great time till I started taking drugs.             Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: (Preston sent this to you V) Fw: Don’t you feel like doing…
Date: November 14, 2004 at 2:15:47 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeah, V and I both have been laughing all day over this one Randy, and I’m glad to read it gave pleasure to at least one other person.
I do wonder what in the world was going through the mind of the pushing penguin. Did s/he plan on doing that or was it an accident? Did it simply see an opportunity to play around or was it merely flexing its wing?
;-)))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com ; drugwar@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 9:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: (Preston sent this to you V) Fw: Don’t you feel like doing…

Preston, I am still rolling on the floor laughing.    Randy

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 11:59:50 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

someone told me to store up my urine

http://skepdic.com/urine.html

“According to urninophiles, the medical establishment has conspired
to keep us ignorant of the wonder drug we all carry in our bladders.
One self-proclaimed expert on the subject claims

‘…the medical community has already been aware of [urine’s]
astounding efficacy for decades, and yet none of us has ever been
told about it. Why? Maybe they think it’s too controversial. Or
maybe, more accurately, there wasn’t any monetary reward for
telling people what scientists know about one of the most
extraordinary natural healing elements in the world.'”

Kind of like ibogaine – the next quantum leap 🙂

On Sat, 13 Nov 2004 13:03:04 -0800 Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
wrote:
someone told me to store up my urine immediately after taking the
ibogaine,
for at least a short while, as what I was pissing at that point
was “pure”
noribogaine, which I could then stick in my fridge and drink up
later-
needless to say (or so I hope it’s needless for me to say this) I
neglected
to take him up on the advised suggestion, feeling that would kinda

gross me
out way much more than any need for noribogaine I Mighta had at
that point
allowed.
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is

often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 1:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note

Speaking of that topic — and I for one am not
offended since any hetero / bi man who doesn’t study
linguistics has a lot to learn — I wonder if Eboga
hangs out in ejaculate?

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

I’ve got a song on the tip of my tongue. I wish
somebody could read it for
me. Tip of My Tongue by the Tubes, man that was a
cool song. “Never been too
cunning, I’m no linguist” what a great line. I could
quote more but I have
probably pissed off all the ladies on the list
already. Fee Waybill is the man. Now
that song is going to play in my head all day.” We
can lick this problem. We
can work it out.” I couldn’t help it.       Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=————————————————————–

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——-=[\
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IbogaineList.html [%]
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——-=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 13, 2004 at 11:38:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Saturday, November 13, 2004, at 02:51 PM, m.finman wrote:

I think the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing, that it is quite possible that you are  one of your own ancestors!

Yes, me too! I was all prepared to possibly see my grandfather or great grandfather, etc etc… but the faces (first hour& 1/2 of experience) that floated thru my ‘field’ of vision i instantly recognized as my own past lives.

(begin twilight theme song and fade)

_.dh

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: (Preston sent this to you V) Fw: Don’t you feel like doing…
Date: November 13, 2004 at 9:05:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, I am still rolling on the floor laughing.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 8:58:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, that someone told me that too. I had one question after he said that. How the hell do you get that taste out of your mouth? No Wayyyyyyyyyyy.    Randy

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 13, 2004 at 7:51:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,
Thank you so much for your reply.  I had one of my clients tell me she had a dream that took place in 1700’s that she conscously had no knowledge of the specifics of that period.  She was wearing the clothes and in the town etc.  I believe this was a past life recollection.  I also think that guy you saw being beheaded with his soul (spirit) going up could quite possibly have been past life for you.  It was common in the past that people were killed either with beheadings, hangings and strangulations.  I believe that’s why a lot of people have issues with wearing anything tight around the neck.  I know I had until very recently a claustrophobic reaction connected to my neck, feet and wrists.  If it took more than 1 second to unbotton a shirtsleeve I would panic and loose the ability to breathe.  In my last energy work session, A past life where I was in late 1700’s locked up in an insane asylum for being “eccentric” (some things never change), I was shackled around my neck, ankles and wrists.  Since this revelation I have been ok going down into the subways without the panic feeling and haven’t paniced when it took to long to take my watch off. I was also told that the majority of my addiction issues are covering up pain from past lives.   In my session I recollect a young 10 year old boy somewhere in the midwest around what I guessed to be the late 1800″s or very early 1900″s talking to his father.  My impression that the young boy was me previously. Aside from what you’re seeing in the dream I was wondering about the actual sensations experienced as oppossed to viewing or just being there.  I think the whole iboga meet your ancestor thing, that it is quite possible that you are  one of your own ancestors!
I also am interested in the whole scientific explanation for what happens.  I don’t discriminate. (much).
How’s your energy level coming.  What is your age?  Unless I’m mixing you up with someone else I believe you said your usage was 4 years?
Anything you will share will be appreciated and used hopefully for the greater good.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 7:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state

Martee,

My dreams have been fantastic!  Very colourful, very
vivid. very exciting…I’m wondering if it’s the
influence of the Ibo, or perhaps juat the absence of
the dope.  I have been dreaming of long journeys,
large bodies of water, and the small town I grew up
in.  I have also been dreaming of fantastic sex with
alien gods(seriously!), and magical doorways on the
sides of mountains, that lead to strange and exotic
places.  So far, no dreams of using…And not one
single nightmare(knock on wood)…

Anyone else have any cool post-Ibo dreams they’d like
to share??

Julie

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 13, 2004 at 7:05:31 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee,

My dreams have been fantastic!  Very colourful, very
vivid. very exciting…I’m wondering if it’s the
influence of the Ibo, or perhaps juat the absence of
the dope.  I have been dreaming of long journeys,
large bodies of water, and the small town I grew up
in.  I have also been dreaming of fantastic sex with
alien gods(seriously!), and magical doorways on the
sides of mountains, that lead to strange and exotic
places.  So far, no dreams of using…And not one
single nightmare(knock on wood)…

Anyone else have any cool post-Ibo dreams they’d like
to share??

Julie

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Post Ibo dream state
Date: November 13, 2004 at 6:09:19 PM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am curious what people immediate post ibo and after that noticed in the changes in their dreams.  I believe dreams are a therapeutic tool for onself. There’s that self reliance thing again.   Prior to treatment I would remember dreams, they were in 3D and color.  I also had the ability to remember years worth of dreams at one time.
After ibogaine I noticed things like extremely sharp sensory experiences.  I could smell in my dreams now, I can taste in my dreams, feel physical sensations(thanks george clooney),and have experienced twice the state of being high.  In the past all my dope dreams(including 5 years worth after my first interuption in addiction from ages 15-18) as well as the few I had in the past 3 mos, were all about procuring everything I needed to commence the act.  My 2 substances and my apparatus.  I never ever actually did anything in any of these many dreams.  Last week I had one where I was sitting in my mothers living room and actually doing something and experiencing the buzz.  Now it wasn’t the best high we all fantasized about everytime we scored, it was this buzz you get when you’ve done too much not so good drugs and you’re not getting any higher.  It was NOT pleasant.  The second one was about 3 days ago, I smoked some pot I had in my bag that someone had rolled for me.  In the dream they were rolled too loose and burned to fast, but I experienced an actuall marijuana high.  I haven’t smoked pot in probably 20 years.  Haven’t drank alcohol for 12 years until a month out of treatment I was with a group in a mexican restaurant and had a carona with lots of lime.  I got buzzed on 3 oz. and it was entertaining for everyone.  However’when I realized how much I liked it I decided not to induldge again while my brain is still experiencing the combination of ibogaine and reality.  I don’t want to muck up the experience with anything that is going to hinder the natural process of what is happening.  This may explain part of my whole food thing for right now.  I’m not always soooo strict.
So I’m really curious if anyone will share anything about their dream state.
I think some dreams are ways the brain releases emotion and junk we hold.  Some are just a mix of things we’ve observed that have little to no meaning, and some can be prophetic,or visits  or problem solving if we can understand our own representations.  I personally don’t believe in those books that say if you see this symbol it means this.  Everyone has their own perceptions.
Any feedback on dreams or what you’ve noticed re your brain that’s different would help.  Any of you phds or educated types that have any technical explanation I would welcome that as well.
In advance I thank you,                Martee
Julie:  I believe i did the HCL.  If i find out differently I’ll let you know.

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 5:26:44 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi rachel and jeff,
the weakness or fatique as i referred to it, lasted me a good part of a month and it was only about a few weeks ago that I notice i’m back to normalish.   After 4 days I got up and walked down the block and back with a cane for support and to lean on.
After 2 weeks I still had to take breaks to have enough energy to get breakfast.  I didn’t have a caretaker after the first week.  Between 10 days and 4 weeks I would venture out in the car to the book store and trader joes and just 2 hours of car to store and back was of major exhaustion.  But I saw some progress daily and definite progress from week to week.  I went back to work after 1 month at half time with breaks that I usually didn’t take, but before I was drug fueled.  I’m still finding out what’s normal for me.  My observation was (sorry to be repetitive, I get tired of hearing it myself) the healthier I ate the better.  Healing or coming back, is about your immune systems capacity to act.  Let him notice for himself what helps and what hinders.  My sister bought me hagen das and rice Krispies my first day out after fasting for 3 days during the session.My taste buds said yes but i tell you it wasn’t pretty for the people around me.  Once on my own and sooo overwhelmed by the fatigue I became more strict due to the cause and effect.   Even though the ibogaine does marvelous things in the brain, I believe your physical body in some has to pay the piper type of thing. I also look back and see the time as nothing to do but reflect, read, contemplate, listen to a lot of music, talk to anyone I could get on the phone. I put 4x the minutes on my cell, all those things some of us neglect I believe it is possible if you do a booster it will prolong the fatigue and sleeplessness. Jeff,  count your blessings, as they are abundant, and give yourself permission to heal at the pace it is happening.  Taking anything could make it worse. Which is only my observation and personal experience. No reference note available. Thank you for your phone number, I will call when i get my voice back. Maybe tommorrow.   Much Love, Martee

—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 3:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note

Oh I’ve tried!  🙂  Just don’t know what’s wishful
thinking and what’s possibly real since I seem to
psychosomatize what he’s going through anyway.  From
mother’s milk to daddy’s jism – wasn’t that a Diggers
street poem from the Sixties?

Jeff update – weak, emotionally raw, still seeing
trails and flashes of light.  “Silver-blue globules”
hanging off of things.  His last mini-booster (3 of
the total 32.2 HCL) was Wednesday 10 Nov. at 1:15 pm
EST.  So 74 hours ago.  He says he is not feeling any
withdrawals, but wondering aloud if the weakness is
just his body’s cellular adjustment post-methadone or
if he does need another booster.  Thanks Julie, for
reminding us that it took you 12 days to feel
“normal.”

He’s taken to calling me Nurse Ratched today since I’m
so “mean” about trying to get him to drink liquids.
I’ve been calling him “Weeble” (as in weebles wobble
but they don’t fall down, that 70s children’s toy)
which was funny until he lost his balance and cracked
his skull against the wall.  Ouch.

— slowone@hush.ai wrote:

Try it and see!

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: (Preston sent this to you V) Fw: Don’t you feel like doing this to at least one person a day??
Date: November 13, 2004 at 4:06:47 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
I hope everyone can see this short clip of these two penguins. Some might not and to those I humbly apologize- but this is just too damned funny not to post, even off topic though it is.
Peace and love,
Preston

snip-
To: Preston-Vanessa Peet-Cleary
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 5:05 AM
Subject: Don’t you feel like doing this to at least one person a day??

Don’t you feel like doing this to at least one person a day??

I had to pass this one on

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 4:03:04 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

someone told me to store up my urine immediately after taking the ibogaine, for at least a short while, as what I was pissing at that point was “pure” noribogaine, which I could then stick in my fridge and drink up later- needless to say (or so I hope it’s needless for me to say this) I neglected to take him up on the advised suggestion, feeling that would kinda gross me out way much more than any need for noribogaine I Mighta had at that point allowed.
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 1:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note

Speaking of that topic — and I for one am not
offended since any hetero / bi man who doesn’t study
linguistics has a lot to learn — I wonder if Eboga
hangs out in ejaculate?

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

I’ve got a song on the tip of my tongue. I wish
somebody could read it for
me. Tip of My Tongue by the Tubes, man that was a
cool song. “Never been too
cunning, I’m no linguist” what a great line. I could
quote more but I have
probably pissed off all the ladies on the list
already. Fee Waybill is the man. Now
that song is going to play in my head all day.” We
can lick this problem. We
can work it out.” I couldn’t help it.       Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 4:01:46 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel,

After 3.5 weeks of no methadone, I still tested
positive for it during my urinalysis- something to
think about.  The weakness eventually does get better-
tell him that low-impact exercise really seemed to
help a lot.  If he’s still too weak for that, tell him
to at least stretch.

How long has he been off methadone…a week?  How’s
his appetite?

Julie

__________________________________________________
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Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: Drug-Watch Funding for Relapse Research
Date: November 13, 2004 at 3:36:53 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “John” snip-
To: <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Sent: Saturday, November 13, 2004 10:58 AM
Subject: Drug-Watch Funding for Relapse Research

NIH to Fund Relapse Research  (From JoinTogether)
11/12/2004

The National Institutes of Health (NIH) is accepting applications for behavioral, cognitive,
neurobiological, and social cognitive research that examines the various facets of addiction
relapse, from causes to treatment.

Six to eight grants will be offered under the $2 million NIH program. The maximum grant amount
is $500,000 per year for direct costs; the maximum time period is five years. For-profit and
non-profit organizations, as well as state, local, and private institutions, are eligible to apply.

Visit the National Institutes of Health grants page for the full funding
announcement at:
http://grants.nih.gov/grants/guide/rfa-files/RFA-DA-05-004.html#SectionIV
GrantsInfo e-mail: grantsinfo@nih.gov; 301-435-0714

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 3:14:24 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh I’ve tried!  🙂  Just don’t know what’s wishful
thinking and what’s possibly real since I seem to
psychosomatize what he’s going through anyway.  From
mother’s milk to daddy’s jism – wasn’t that a Diggers
street poem from the Sixties?

Jeff update – weak, emotionally raw, still seeing
trails and flashes of light.  “Silver-blue globules”
hanging off of things.  His last mini-booster (3 of
the total 32.2 HCL) was Wednesday 10 Nov. at 1:15 pm
EST.  So 74 hours ago.  He says he is not feeling any
withdrawals, but wondering aloud if the weakness is
just his body’s cellular adjustment post-methadone or
if he does need another booster.  Thanks Julie, for
reminding us that it took you 12 days to feel
“normal.”

He’s taken to calling me Nurse Ratched today since I’m
so “mean” about trying to get him to drink liquids.
I’ve been calling him “Weeble” (as in weebles wobble
but they don’t fall down, that 70s children’s toy)
which was funny until he lost his balance and cracked
his skull against the wall.  Ouch.

— slowone@hush.ai wrote:

Try it and see!

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 2:21:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Try it and see!

Speaking of tongues:

http://www.thecunninglinguist.com/

On Sat, 13 Nov 2004 10:28:12 -0800 Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@
yahoo.com> wrote:
Speaking of that topic — and I for one am not
offended since any hetero / bi man who doesn’t study
linguistics has a lot to learn — I wonder if Eboga
hangs out in ejaculate?

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

I’ve got a song on the tip of my tongue. I wish
somebody could read it for
me. Tip of My Tongue by the Tubes, man that was a
cool song. “Never been too
cunning, I’m no linguist” what a great line. I could
quote more but I have
probably pissed off all the ladies on the list
already. Fee Waybill is the man. Now
that song is going to play in my head all day.” We
can lick this problem. We
can work it out.” I couldn’t help it.       Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: Mauro Solorzano <msolorza@mac.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..
Date: November 13, 2004 at 2:05:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Eric

“Sorry everybody” is a cool site. By the way, what date will you come up to NYC? I look foward to meeting you.

Mauro
Dear List,
Check out if you will    www.sorryeverybody.com
Eric
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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 1:28:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Speaking of that topic — and I for one am not
offended since any hetero / bi man who doesn’t study
linguistics has a lot to learn — I wonder if Eboga
hangs out in ejaculate?

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

I’ve got a song on the tip of my tongue. I wish
somebody could read it for
me. Tip of My Tongue by the Tubes, man that was a
cool song. “Never been too
cunning, I’m no linguist” what a great line. I could
quote more but I have
probably pissed off all the ladies on the list
already. Fee Waybill is the man. Now
that song is going to play in my head all day.” We
can lick this problem. We
can work it out.” I couldn’t help it.       Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Randy, go see Ray
Date: November 13, 2004 at 10:38:42 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I had no idea Jamie Foxx was a musician- that is so
cool!  He’s a pianist??

J.

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Randy, go see Ray
Date: November 13, 2004 at 10:08:03 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, Jamie Foxx is great. He is a boni-fide musician. It’s about time he got a good part. I’ll go see Ray as soon as I can. I hear he has a real good shot at getting an Oscar for it.    Randy

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Randy, go see Ray
Date: November 13, 2004 at 9:52:46 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

I went and saw Ray yesterday, and it was great!!  The
soundtrack is AMAZING- as a musician, I just know
you’ll love it…

Made me cry, laugh, the whole gamut…Go SEE RAY,
Randy….It’s a nice diversion.

Julie

__________________________________
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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]On another note
Date: November 13, 2004 at 3:44:32 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve got a song on the tip of my tongue. I wish somebody could read it for me. Tip of My Tongue by the Tubes, man that was a cool song. “Never been too cunning, I’m no linguist” what a great line. I could quote more but I have probably pissed off all the ladies on the list already. Fee Waybill is the man. Now that song is going to play in my head all day.” We can lick this problem. We can work it out.” I couldn’t help it.       Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 13, 2004 at 2:59:07 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

M, I am really glad for you. This could be the best thing that ever happened to you. Drink lots of water, LOTS from now until about 3 or 4 hours till you take the Ibogaine. Lay real still as much as you can and enjoy the ride. Don’t eat for at least 12 hours up until blastoff time. Have some Dramamine or anti motion sickness pills handy in case you are one of those who gets pretty sick. Take the nausea pills 30 to 45 minutes before you take the Ibogaine. I hope you take a test dose first then the big one. Are you taking indra or Hcl? Keep in touch cause I will worry about you until I hear from you again. I’m sorry for my negative attitude lately. I’ve been having a pity party and generally been acting addicted without any drugs. Thats over. Time to ROCK. Get on with my life. I wish I could be there but, you’ll be fine. Remember, if things get scary or you don’t like what you see blink or ask it to change. It worked for me real well. So well that I wish I could do it again for my own spirituality. I will someday but right now there are too many people who need it for addiction.   Randy   PS better have something handy to throw up in just in case.

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 13, 2004 at 12:40:51 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was stressed over all  the many preparations I had to do beforehand, which is normal.  However as far as what I was doing I was confident it was without a doubt the right thing.  I didn’t find this list till afterwards.  There must be some comfort for those that have doubts or fears. The support of all that wish for you the outcome you (we all) desire, is a gift to take with you. Those intentions will far surpass the need for luck.  Happy for you,  Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: FakePlacebo
To: Summary
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 12:20 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Two days left

Dear List,
I will start my Ibogain treatment 2-3 days later. I’m little stressed but I’m sure I will kick my addiction. Wish me Luck.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT, slightly) Dear Abbey or Not?
Date: November 12, 2004 at 9:54:53 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

of course, he’s compassionate, ron
—– Original Message —– From: <tomo7@starband.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT, slightly) Dear Abbey or Not?

Was this really sent to Dear Abbey? Truth is important to most of us
outside the White House. I can’t verify the source of this, it might be
from within the Pentagon, so easy to dismiss as Psy-ops propaganda, little
more than Fox News infotainment. You’ll have to decide for yourself(as
with everything important).

Dr. Tom

Dear Abby,

I am a crack dealer in Beaumont, Texas who has recently been diagnosed as
a carrier of HIV virus. My parents live in Fort Worth and one of my
sisters, who lives in Pflugerville, is married to a transvestite. My
father and mother have recently been arrested for selling heroin. They are
financially dependent on my other two sisters, who are prostitutes in
Dallas.

I have two brothers; one is currently serving a non-parole life sentence
at Huntsville for the murder of a teenage boy in 1994. My other brother is
currently in jail awaiting charges of sexual misconduct with his three
children.

I have recently become engaged to a former prostitute who lives in
Longview. She is a part time “working girl”. All things considered, my
problem is this. I love my fiance and look forward to bringing her into
the family. I certainly want to be totally open and honest with her.

Should I tell her about my cousin who still supports Bush?

Signed,

Worried About My Reputation

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 12, 2004 at 9:40:12 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

moi? ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 7:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left

You can do it, sweetness.  You can do it.  Let us know
so we can light a candle for you.  Helped Jeff a lot
to know there were well wishes coming from all over
the world.

What are you anxious about, if you don’t mind me
asking?

Much love, Rachel & Jeff

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 12, 2004 at 9:30:39 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

54 yrs. sara
—– Original Message —–
From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 10:44 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Yes, I’m sure, the lady was on it for 9 years  and age was then 47 years old. Here psychiatrist told her that it wasn’t possible. But what do they know?
She was fine after, some people quit four , five different drugs in one time but benzo’s are just one of them, people take small  booster doses for a little while.
And pot just for a week or so and you will not get a seizure that’s for sure.
You can  taper slowly, and just for quitting do a short treatment of one week, 10 days.
Few weeks ago I had a patient who came off 140 mg of methadone and 50mg of clonazepam , he was 34 years old and use from age of 22.
I didn’t have anyone your age yet.

Sara

Van: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 16:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

sara:  this is important:  this benzo stuff is life threatening.  i’ve done  c/t w/d’s from h,  methadone, dilaudid, demerol and alcohol.  are you certain of what you say?  thanks, ron
and how old was the patient?
—– Original Message —–
From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 1:08 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Jim,

Iboga prevent seizures, cannabis does that too, they both help physical pain, I help people to come off Valium 90mg a day without seizure.
People who are on this list from the start maybe still remember my reports.

Sara

Van: Jim Hadey [mailto:jimhadey3@yahoo.com] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 6:58
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Hi Ron

>>>. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? <<<

You would be far better off using dilantin than anything with phenobarb.  Phenobarb can leave you VERY depressed, with dilantin you don’t even know your taking it.  Just take a large glass of water or whatever with it or you may feel like your stomach is burning.  I am speaking from my own experience.  However, others have told me the same thing.  I have been taking Valium for over 25 years at 40 mg or more a day you can have seizures if you quit suddenly, I did anyway.  I really do not know how slow to taper.  I only take one or two a day so I doubt if it would be a problem now.

Hope I helped,

– JIM

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
BRO, I DON’T WANT NO FREAKING SEIZURES. VALIUM TAPER ELIMINATES THAT.  NO ALCOHOL IN THIS BODY FOR 25 YRS.  RON
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 9:25:36 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

faith, never called you stupid, i am.  h/s drop out, ged, honors in college, honors in law school.  i’m as dumb as they come and totally uninformed. you win the day, i quit, blessings and peace—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 9:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Ron, Bush is on the other spectrum of evil.    I’m not a puppet, and certainly not stupid.  Truly smart people hardly use that word in their vocab, and manage to make to whom their speaking feel smart, also.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2004 08:50:30 -0600

ron writes:  agreed, BUSH IS EVIL and the puppets that voted for him?  of course both candidates and running mates went running of to their respective retreats after months of spending millions of other people’s money..   my retreat is a brown bag over my head.  think of what it costs to just fire up one of those pvt. jets.  could/ve paid off my house.  we all lost.  look at what the ads said.  that should tell you something about how stupid most americans are
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told Bush what he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found someone who would.  Chaney is really the one running the country and when he dies from his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush is his puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write in order to clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911 today and it was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the most evil and corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy scout.  Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like Kissinger and Rumsfield.  Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he know about drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.  Ashcroft was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In fact his opponent died and got more votes than Ashcroft.  In other words the people of his state would rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.  However, his opponent’s wife ran in his place and won. They are all washed up has-beens some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know his dad, the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term president (the other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really elected president and only served about 2 years).  Like I said before this man is evil and I rarely will call someone evil.  And we all know is a liar and dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.  The look on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
> we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot Bush nominates
> Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
> Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
> international laws relating to prohibition of torture of prisoners of
> war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay detainees. Of
> course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is no
> “non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in the Geneva
> Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up that whole lie
> to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush rewards this
> war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-General, despite
> the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down the whole
> Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law. This shows
> Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention, international law,
> and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for torture as a
> legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as a war
> criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further violations of
> his.
> I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators regarding
> Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question the record of
> this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his nomination to the
> Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely unqualified, both
> on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message to the world
> that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as the top, or
> bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in the United
> States of America.
>
> =====
> End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
> b_jb2001
>
>
—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium, Death children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of irak, You will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

>
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_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! hthttp://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 12, 2004 at 8:24:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You can do it, sweetness.  You can do it.  Let us know
so we can light a candle for you.  Helped Jeff a lot
to know there were well wishes coming from all over
the world.

What are you anxious about, if you don’t mind me
asking?

Much love, Rachel & Jeff

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 12, 2004 at 6:47:30 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

best of luck to you from me and V both.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 3:40 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left

FakePlacebo,

Please kick some serious opiate ass…Good luck, and
blessings on your journey..

Julie  🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 6:24:03 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You absolutly right !
(the other spectrum of evil) Bush is still on the spectrum of evil not with
the same wavelenght, but in the spectrum with a different frequency: he
can’t be the angel of light !  🙂
Francis

Faith wrote :

Ron, Bush is on the other spectrum of evil.    I’m not a puppet, and
certainly not stupid.  Truly smart people hardly use that word in their
vocab, and manage to make to whom their speaking feel smart, also.

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From: “Jamilah” <jamilah@erols.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 12, 2004 at 5:19:27 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Good luck and many blessings on your Ibogaine venture.
Peace,
Jamilah
—– Original Message —–
From: FakePlacebo
To: Summary
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 12:20 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Two days left

Dear List,
I will start my Ibogain treatment 2-3 days later. I’m little stressed but I’m sure I will kick my addiction. Wish me Luck.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 12, 2004 at 3:40:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

FakePlacebo,

Please kick some serious opiate ass…Good luck, and
blessings on your journey..

Julie  🙂

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT, slightly) Dear Abbey or Not?
Date: November 12, 2004 at 2:25:30 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ROFLMAO!!!
On Friday, November 12, 2004, at 08:12 AM, <tomo7@starband.net> wrote:

Was this really sent to Dear Abbey? Truth is important to most of us
outside the White House. I can’t verify the source of this, it might be
from within the Pentagon, so easy to dismiss as Psy-ops propaganda, little
more than Fox News infotainment. You’ll have to decide for yourself(as
with everything important).

Dr. Tom

Dear Abby,

I am a crack dealer in Beaumont, Texas who has recently been diagnosed as
a carrier of HIV virus. My parents live in Fort Worth and one of my
sisters, who lives in Pflugerville, is married to a transvestite. My
father and mother have recently been arrested for selling heroin. They are
financially dependent on my other two sisters, who are prostitutes in
Dallas.

I have two brothers; one is currently serving a non-parole life sentence
at Huntsville for the murder of a teenage boy in 1994. My other brother is
currently in jail awaiting charges of sexual misconduct with his three
children.

I have recently become engaged to a former prostitute who lives in
Longview. She is a part time “working girl”. All things considered, my
problem is this. I love my fiance and look forward to bringing her into
the family. I certainly want to be totally open and honest with her.

Should I tell her about my cousin who still supports Bush?

Signed,

Worried About My Reputation

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From: <tomo7@starband.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT, slightly) Dear Abbey or Not?
Date: November 12, 2004 at 1:12:07 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Was this really sent to Dear Abbey? Truth is important to most of us
outside the White House. I can’t verify the source of this, it might be
from within the Pentagon, so easy to dismiss as Psy-ops propaganda, little
more than Fox News infotainment. You’ll have to decide for yourself(as
with everything important).

Dr. Tom

Dear Abby,

I am a crack dealer in Beaumont, Texas who has recently been diagnosed as
a carrier of HIV virus. My parents live in Fort Worth and one of my
sisters, who lives in Pflugerville, is married to a transvestite. My
father and mother have recently been arrested for selling heroin. They are
financially dependent on my other two sisters, who are prostitutes in
Dallas.

I have two brothers; one is currently serving a non-parole life sentence
at Huntsville for the murder of a teenage boy in 1994. My other brother is
currently in jail awaiting charges of sexual misconduct with his three
children.

I have recently become engaged to a former prostitute who lives in
Longview. She is a part time “working girl”. All things considered, my
problem is this. I love my fiance and look forward to bringing her into
the family. I certainly want to be totally open and honest with her.

Should I tell her about my cousin who still supports Bush?

Signed,

Worried About My Reputation

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 1:09:04 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The internet message boards and chat rooms are bursting with talk about
this. You can wait another couple days to hear about it in the mainstream
media, or you can read on.  Just remember where you heard it first.<

Corporate Mainstream media is now reporting on it too (can’t get too much more corporate mainstream than MSNBC):

FOCUS: MSNBC Vote Fraud Video (Must See) http://www.truthout.org/multimedia.htm

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 12:50 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Something BIG is about to happen

“This is not conspiracy theory.  This is not heresay.  There is evidence.
There are witnesses. There are investigations underway.”

Dear Friends,

When actress Susan Sarandon appeared on the Bill Maher show over the
weekend, he asked her what is the biggest issue we face as a nation.

Her reply was “voter fraud.”

The usually knowledgeable Maher had no idea what she was talking about.
When he asked, she replied:

“Something BIG is about to happen.”

What I’m about to tell you is going to be hard to swallow at first.  But if
you’re like most of us, once you start looking at the evidence, you’ll
scrape yourself off the ceiling, put your eyeballs back in their sockets,
and you’ll try to figure out what to do.

So here it is.

The highest crime in the history of our country took place on November 2nd.
The evidence is now mounting (into a HUGE mountain) that the election was
stolen.  There is already a congressional investigation underway and a
consumer investigation (headed by Ralph Nader).

Electronic voting machines that were manufactured by supporters of the
Republican Party were used to alter the will of the people.

The internet message boards and chat rooms are bursting with talk about
this. You can wait another couple days to hear about it in the mainstream
media, or you can read on.  Just remember where you heard it first.

I will outline the key points in this email and provide a link with much
more information at the bottom. More information is coming out literally by
the minute.

The election was stolen with not just one tactic, but with several.

Key points

.        “Black Box” Electronic Voting Machines: The key to it all was the
use of electronic voting machines, that produce no paper trail. These were
manufactured mainly by the two companies ESS and Diebold. Both of these
companies are big supporters of the Republican Party. Walden O’Dell, the
owner of Diebold, said in a 2003 fundraising letter that he is “committed to

helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president next year.”
Similarly, Chuck Hagel, the owner of ESS used his own machines to get
elected to the United States Senate in Nebraska. A bill was introduced in
the House and Senate to outlaw these machines and require a paper printout
of each vote so that they could be verified and/or recounted. The bill was
stalled by the Republican Party, led by Senate Majority Leader Tom DeLay,
and it was not allowed to come to vote. Shortly after the November 2rd
election, countless stories of problems with the machines began to surface.
Many people tried to vote for Kerry and said that when the final
confirmation screen came up it said they voted for Bush. In one precinct in
Ohio, 4,258 votes were given to Bush were there were only 638 registered
voters. Many more stories about the black box voting machines, their
problems, and the investigation into their tampering are circulating.

Blackboxvoting.org <http://blackboxvoting.org> is leading the way in

the investigation to proving the results were tampered with.

.        Exit Polls: Exit polls were taken in every state. In those states
that had verifiable paper trails for their ballots, the exit polls were
virtually the same as the real results. However, in the states where
electronic voting machines were used, the exit polls were mysteriously very
different from the final reported totals. You can view the exit poll data
directly yourself with the link at the bottom of this email.

.        Unusual Results: In the areas where computers were used to cast
votes or tally them, some very strange results have surfaced. Here is just
one example. In Baker County, Florida, there are 12,887 registered voters,
69.3% of them regsitered Democrats and 24.3% of them Republicans. The vote
was only 2,180 for Kerry and 7,738 for Bush. Are we supposed to believe that

5 out of every 7 registered Democrats voted for Bush??? This pattern repeats

itself in many Florida counties. You can view all the raw data for every
Florida county at the link at the bottom of this email

.        Shenanigans: In addition to the electronic voting machines, there
was widespread voter intimidation and disenfranchisement on election day. In

many democratic areas, people waited hours to vote, while Republicans
“challenged” voters’ rights to vote, forcing them to fill out a provisional
ballot instead of a real ballot. The provisional ballots were not counted on

election day and we may never know how many of them there were, or what
rules will be used to qualify them. Flyers were sent to democratic areas
with an array of false information on them. People were told their voting
precinct had changed, that their voter registration was not valid, or that
they would go to jail of they tried to vote. The list of shenanigans goes on

and on.  You can see the some of the flyers that were sent out and read
about more of the shenanigans at the link at the bottom of this email.

.        Investigations: This is not conspiracy theory.  This is not
heresay.  There is evidence.  There are witnesses. There are investigations
underway.  Three Congressmen have sent a letter to the General
Accountability Office requesting urgent action and an investigation. Ralph
Nader is leading a consumer investigation into voter fraud countrywide, and
has already filed an official challenge to the voting results in New
Hampshire.  You can read the letter to the GAO and more about Nader’s
efforts at the link below.

They will call us sore losers.  They will have their lawyers and computer
experts too.  They will refute the evidence.  But the truth is on our side
and we will prevail.

Here is the link to the information, if you would like to look into the
details and become more aware of the biggest story about to break.

www.solarbus.org/stealyourelection

What we need now is for the information to get out to more people.  The
mainstream media will bury this until it’s shoved down their throat.  So
please forward this email to your friends and family.  If every person tells

three other people, everyone will know before the media decides to wake up.

Peace,
Gary Beckwith

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net]
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 18:06
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

we all lost and those clowns who ran are still laughing all the way to the
bank.  you c/n rebut that.  i d/n care who you voted for or what party. look

at what they spent running.  gee, i know some folks who are living in tents
right now that could use what one prime time ad cost during the election.
it’s like professional sports.  the owner gets an entire community behind a
team, fans argue over a game and take sides, and the owner is in the
Caribbean having boat drinks on his/her yacht the whole time.  wanna do some

good W?  go to calcutta and take over a children’s hospital. kerry, wanna
help?  have your wife  give us back all the money  the govt gave your
husband’s campaign.  cheney, how about you give every one working in a tom
thumb a dollar an hr. raise.  you w/n miss it.  we all lost folks and will
continue to lose.  glad i can rely on social security when i retire.
that’ll help w and kerry make ends meet as well.  whoops,  they d/n draw it
as they have separate pensions than the rest of us.  more for us, that’ll
help.  i’m dumb, i don’t read, just surf the net and listen to the ads.
don’t read the congressional record either or do i?  just the unedited
version so i’m in the dark.     am i better of than i was 4 yrs. ago? sure,

working longer hrs. for less, health bennies cut to the bone, that 300
rebate sure made a difference.  now if i can just find that elusive surplus
of trillions that was guaranteed to be there. but wait!  we now have a huge
deficit, glad we had so many hurricanes in my st. this yr.  that’ll create
alot of jobs that will stimulate the economy.  but wait!  people lost
everything they owned and worked for as a result of this economic
stimulator.  i’m just a sore, uneducated loser, ticked b/c i don’t have a
retreat and jet, but i have hope. sorry for the diatribe, maybe i can get
straight between all this political stuff, which is why i’m here. god help
me, those guys can’t.  politics are interesting, i talk about them with a
closed mind, you can’t sway me and i know i c/n sway you..so it’s never a
discussion, it’s always an argument.  sad it divides us who share a common
cause of trying to get straight and lead healthy , productive lives.  i
apologize for falling into this trap.  hope you guys accept it. thanks,
on  —– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Faith, Gush is on the spectrum that is into legalised torture.

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 07:52:42 -0800 Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.
com> wrote:
Ron, Bush is on the other spectrum of evil.    I’m not a puppet,
and
certainly not stupid.  Truly smart people hardly use that word in
their
vocab, and manage to make to whom their speaking feel smart, also.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2004 08:50:30 -0600

ron writes:  agreed, BUSH IS EVIL and the puppets that voted for
him?  of
course both candidates and running mates went running of to their

respective retreats after months of spending millions of other
people’s
money..   my retreat is a brown bag over my head.  think of what
it costs
to just fire up one of those pvt. jets.  could/ve paid off my
house.  we
all lost.  look at what the ads said.  that should tell you
something about
how stupid most americans are
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told

Bush what
he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found
someone who
would.  Chaney is really the one running the country and when he
dies from
his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush
is his
puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write
in order to
clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911
today and it
was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the
most evil and
corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy
scout.
Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like
Kissinger
and Rumsfield.  Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon
administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he
know about
drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.

Ashcroft
was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In fact his opponent

died and
got more votes than Ashcroft.  In other words the people of his
state would
rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.
However, his
opponent’s wife ran in his place and won.  They are all washed up

has-beens
some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know
his dad,
the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term
president (the
other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really
elected
president and only served about 2 years).  Like I said before
this man is
evil and I rarely will call someone evil.  And we all know is a
liar and
dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.

The look
on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
> we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot
Bush
nominates
> Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
> Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
> international laws relating to prohibition of torture of
prisoners
of
> war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay
detainees. Of
> course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is
no
> “non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in
the Geneva
> Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up
that whole
lie
> to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush
rewards this
> war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-
General,
despite
> the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down
the whole
> Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law.
This shows
> Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention,
international
law,
> and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for
torture as
a
> legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as

a war
> criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further
violations of
> his.
> I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators
regarding
> Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question
the record
of
> this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his
nomination to the
> Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely
unqualified, both
> on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message
to the
world
> that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as
the top,
or
> bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in
the United
> States of America.
>
> =====
> End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
> b_jb2001
>
>
—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to
carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted
uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework
and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium,

Death
children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of
irak, You
will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

>

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>

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 12:50:09 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Something BIG is about to happen

“This is not conspiracy theory.  This is not heresay.  There is evidence.
There are witnesses. There are investigations underway.”

Dear Friends,

When actress Susan Sarandon appeared on the Bill Maher show over the
weekend, he asked her what is the biggest issue we face as a nation.

Her reply was “voter fraud.”

The usually knowledgeable Maher had no idea what she was talking about.
When he asked, she replied:

“Something BIG is about to happen.”

What I’m about to tell you is going to be hard to swallow at first.  But if
you’re like most of us, once you start looking at the evidence, you’ll
scrape yourself off the ceiling, put your eyeballs back in their sockets,
and you’ll try to figure out what to do.

So here it is.

The highest crime in the history of our country took place on November 2nd.
The evidence is now mounting (into a HUGE mountain) that the election was
stolen.  There is already a congressional investigation underway and a
consumer investigation (headed by Ralph Nader).

Electronic voting machines that were manufactured by supporters of the
Republican Party were used to alter the will of the people.

The internet message boards and chat rooms are bursting with talk about
this. You can wait another couple days to hear about it in the mainstream
media, or you can read on.  Just remember where you heard it first.

I will outline the key points in this email and provide a link with much
more information at the bottom. More information is coming out literally by
the minute.

The election was stolen with not just one tactic, but with several.

Key points

.        “Black Box” Electronic Voting Machines: The key to it all was the
use of electronic voting machines, that produce no paper trail. These were
manufactured mainly by the two companies ESS and Diebold. Both of these
companies are big supporters of the Republican Party. Walden O’Dell, the
owner of Diebold, said in a 2003 fundraising letter that he is “committed to

helping Ohio deliver its electoral votes to the president next year.”
Similarly, Chuck Hagel, the owner of ESS used his own machines to get
elected to the United States Senate in Nebraska. A bill was introduced in
the House and Senate to outlaw these machines and require a paper printout
of each vote so that they could be verified and/or recounted. The bill was
stalled by the Republican Party, led by Senate Majority Leader Tom DeLay,
and it was not allowed to come to vote. Shortly after the November 2rd
election, countless stories of problems with the machines began to surface.
Many people tried to vote for Kerry and said that when the final
confirmation screen came up it said they voted for Bush. In one precinct in
Ohio, 4,258 votes were given to Bush were there were only 638 registered
voters. Many more stories about the black box voting machines, their
problems, and the investigation into their tampering are circulating.

Blackboxvoting.org <http://blackboxvoting.org> is leading the way in

the investigation to proving the results were tampered with.

.        Exit Polls: Exit polls were taken in every state. In those states
that had verifiable paper trails for their ballots, the exit polls were
virtually the same as the real results. However, in the states where
electronic voting machines were used, the exit polls were mysteriously very
different from the final reported totals. You can view the exit poll data
directly yourself with the link at the bottom of this email.

.        Unusual Results: In the areas where computers were used to cast
votes or tally them, some very strange results have surfaced. Here is just
one example. In Baker County, Florida, there are 12,887 registered voters,
69.3% of them regsitered Democrats and 24.3% of them Republicans. The vote
was only 2,180 for Kerry and 7,738 for Bush. Are we supposed to believe that

5 out of every 7 registered Democrats voted for Bush??? This pattern repeats

itself in many Florida counties. You can view all the raw data for every
Florida county at the link at the bottom of this email

.        Shenanigans: In addition to the electronic voting machines, there
was widespread voter intimidation and disenfranchisement on election day. In

many democratic areas, people waited hours to vote, while Republicans
“challenged” voters’ rights to vote, forcing them to fill out a provisional
ballot instead of a real ballot. The provisional ballots were not counted on

election day and we may never know how many of them there were, or what
rules will be used to qualify them. Flyers were sent to democratic areas
with an array of false information on them. People were told their voting
precinct had changed, that their voter registration was not valid, or that
they would go to jail of they tried to vote. The list of shenanigans goes on

and on.  You can see the some of the flyers that were sent out and read
about more of the shenanigans at the link at the bottom of this email.

.        Investigations: This is not conspiracy theory.  This is not
heresay.  There is evidence.  There are witnesses. There are investigations
underway.  Three Congressmen have sent a letter to the General
Accountability Office requesting urgent action and an investigation. Ralph
Nader is leading a consumer investigation into voter fraud countrywide, and
has already filed an official challenge to the voting results in New
Hampshire.  You can read the letter to the GAO and more about Nader’s
efforts at the link below.

They will call us sore losers.  They will have their lawyers and computer
experts too.  They will refute the evidence.  But the truth is on our side
and we will prevail.

Here is the link to the information, if you would like to look into the
details and become more aware of the biggest story about to break.

www.solarbus.org/stealyourelection

What we need now is for the information to get out to more people.  The
mainstream media will bury this until it’s shoved down their throat.  So
please forward this email to your friends and family.  If every person tells

three other people, everyone will know before the media decides to wake up.

Peace,
Gary Beckwith

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net]
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 18:06
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

we all lost and those clowns who ran are still laughing all the way to the
bank.  you c/n rebut that.  i d/n care who you voted for or what party. look

at what they spent running.  gee, i know some folks who are living in tents
right now that could use what one prime time ad cost during the election.
it’s like professional sports.  the owner gets an entire community behind a
team, fans argue over a game and take sides, and the owner is in the
Caribbean having boat drinks on his/her yacht the whole time.  wanna do some

good W?  go to calcutta and take over a children’s hospital. kerry, wanna
help?  have your wife  give us back all the money  the govt gave your
husband’s campaign.  cheney, how about you give every one working in a tom
thumb a dollar an hr. raise.  you w/n miss it.  we all lost folks and will
continue to lose.  glad i can rely on social security when i retire.
that’ll help w and kerry make ends meet as well.  whoops,  they d/n draw it
as they have separate pensions than the rest of us.  more for us, that’ll
help.  i’m dumb, i don’t read, just surf the net and listen to the ads.
don’t read the congressional record either or do i?  just the unedited
version so i’m in the dark.     am i better of than i was 4 yrs. ago?  sure,

working longer hrs. for less, health bennies cut to the bone, that 300
rebate sure made a difference.  now if i can just find that elusive surplus
of trillions that was guaranteed to be there. but wait!  we now have a huge
deficit, glad we had so many hurricanes in my st. this yr.  that’ll create
alot of jobs that will stimulate the economy.  but wait!  people lost
everything they owned and worked for as a result of this economic
stimulator.  i’m just a sore, uneducated loser, ticked b/c i don’t have a
retreat and jet, but i have hope. sorry for the diatribe, maybe i can get
straight between all this political stuff, which is why i’m here. god help
me, those guys can’t.  politics are interesting, i talk about them with a
closed mind, you can’t sway me and i know i c/n sway you..so it’s never a
discussion, it’s always an argument.  sad it divides us who share a common
cause of trying to get straight and lead healthy , productive lives.  i
apologize for falling into this trap.  hope you guys accept it. thanks,
on  —– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Faith, Gush is on the spectrum that is into legalised torture.

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 07:52:42 -0800 Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.
com> wrote:
Ron, Bush is on the other spectrum of evil.    I’m not a puppet,
and
certainly not stupid.  Truly smart people hardly use that word in
their
vocab, and manage to make to whom their speaking feel smart, also.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2004 08:50:30 -0600

ron writes:  agreed, BUSH IS EVIL and the puppets that voted for
him?  of
course both candidates and running mates went running of to their

respective retreats after months of spending millions of other
people’s
money..   my retreat is a brown bag over my head.  think of what
it costs
to just fire up one of those pvt. jets.  could/ve paid off my
house.  we
all lost.  look at what the ads said.  that should tell you
something about
how stupid most americans are
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told

Bush what
he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found
someone who
would.  Chaney is really the one running the country and when he
dies from
his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush
is his
puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write
in order to
clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911
today and it
was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the
most evil and
corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy
scout.
Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like
Kissinger
and Rumsfield.  Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon
administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he
know about
drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.

Ashcroft
was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In fact his opponent

died and
got more votes than Ashcroft.  In other words the people of his
state would
rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.
However, his
opponent’s wife ran in his place and won.  They are all washed up

has-beens
some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know
his dad,
the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term
president (the
other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really
elected
president and only served about 2 years).  Like I said before
this man is
evil and I rarely will call someone evil.  And we all know is a
liar and
dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.

The look
on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot
Bush
nominates
Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
international laws relating to prohibition of torture of
prisoners
of
war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay
detainees. Of
course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is
no
“non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in
the Geneva
Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up
that whole
lie
to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush
rewards this
war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-
General,
despite
the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down
the whole
Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law.
This shows
Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention,
international
law,
and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for
torture as
a
legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as

a war
criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further
violations of
his.
I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators
regarding
Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question
the record
of
this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his
nomination to the
Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely
unqualified, both
on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message
to the
world
that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as
the top,
or
bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in
the United
States of America.

=====
End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
b_jb2001

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to
carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted
uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework
and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium,

Death
children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of
irak, You
will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’

s FREE!
hthttp://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

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From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Two days left
Date: November 12, 2004 at 12:20:00 PM EST
To: “Summary” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,
I will start my Ibogain treatment 2-3 days later. I’m little stressed but I’m sure I will kick my addiction. Wish me Luck.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 12:05:32 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

we all lost and those clowns who ran are still laughing all the way to the bank.  you c/n rebut that.  i d/n care who you voted for or what party. look at what they spent running.  gee, i know some folks who are living in tents right now that could use what one prime time ad cost during the election. it’s like professional sports.  the owner gets an entire community behind a team, fans argue over a game and take sides, and the owner is in the Caribbean having boat drinks on his/her yacht the whole time.  wanna do some good W?  go to calcutta and take over a children’s hospital. kerry, wanna help?  have your wife  give us back all the money  the govt gave your husband’s campaign.  cheney, how about you give every one working in a tom thumb a dollar an hr. raise.  you w/n miss it.  we all lost folks and will continue to lose.  glad i can rely on social security when i retire. that’ll help w and kerry make ends meet as well.  whoops,  they d/n draw it as they have separate pensions than the rest of us.  more for us, that’ll help.  i’m dumb, i don’t read, just surf the net and listen to the ads. don’t read the congressional record either or do i?  just the unedited version so i’m in the dark.     am i better of than i was 4 yrs. ago?  sure, working longer hrs. for less, health bennies cut to the bone, that 300 rebate sure made a difference.  now if i can just find that elusive surplus of trillions that was guaranteed to be there. but wait!  we now have a huge deficit, glad we had so many hurricanes in my st. this yr.  that’ll create alot of jobs that will stimulate the economy.  but wait!  people lost everything they owned and worked for as a result of this economic stimulator.  i’m just a sore, uneducated loser, ticked b/c i don’t have a retreat and jet, but i have hope. sorry for the diatribe, maybe i can get straight between all this political stuff, which is why i’m here. god help me, those guys can’t.  politics are interesting, i talk about them with a closed mind, you can’t sway me and i know i c/n sway you..so it’s never a discussion, it’s always an argument.  sad it divides us who share a common cause of trying to get straight and lead healthy , productive lives.  i apologize for falling into this trap.  hope you guys accept it. thanks, on  —– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 10:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Faith, Gush is on the spectrum that is into legalised torture.

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 07:52:42 -0800 Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.
com> wrote:
Ron, Bush is on the other spectrum of evil.    I’m not a puppet,
and
certainly not stupid.  Truly smart people hardly use that word in
their
vocab, and manage to make to whom their speaking feel smart, also.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2004 08:50:30 -0600

ron writes:  agreed, BUSH IS EVIL and the puppets that voted for
him?  of
course both candidates and running mates went running of to their

respective retreats after months of spending millions of other
people’s
money..   my retreat is a brown bag over my head.  think of what
it costs
to just fire up one of those pvt. jets.  could/ve paid off my
house.  we
all lost.  look at what the ads said.  that should tell you
something about
how stupid most americans are
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told

Bush what
he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found
someone who
would.  Chaney is really the one running the country and when he
dies from
his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush
is his
puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write
in order to
clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911
today and it
was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the
most evil and
corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy
scout.
Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like
Kissinger
and Rumsfield.  Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon
administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he
know about
drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.

Ashcroft
was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In fact his opponent

died and
got more votes than Ashcroft.  In other words the people of his
state would
rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.
However, his
opponent’s wife ran in his place and won.  They are all washed up

has-beens
some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know
his dad,
the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term
president (the
other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really
elected
president and only served about 2 years).  Like I said before
this man is
evil and I rarely will call someone evil.  And we all know is a
liar and
dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.

The look
on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
> we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot
Bush
nominates
> Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
> Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
> international laws relating to prohibition of torture of
prisoners
of
> war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay
detainees. Of
> course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is
no
> “non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in
the Geneva
> Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up
that whole
lie
> to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush
rewards this
> war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-
General,
despite
> the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down
the whole
> Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law.
This shows
> Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention,
international
law,
> and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for
torture as
a
> legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as

a war
> criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further
violations of
> his.
> I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators
regarding
> Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question
the record
of
> this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his
nomination to the
> Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely
unqualified, both
> on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message
to the
world
> that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as
the top,
or
> bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in
the United
> States of America.
>
> =====
> End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
> b_jb2001
>
>
—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to
carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted
uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework
and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium,

Death
children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of
irak, You
will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

>

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 12, 2004 at 11:44:10 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes, I’m sure, the lady was on it for 9 years  and age was then 47 years old. Here psychiatrist told her that it wasn’t possible. But what do they know?
She was fine after, some people quit four , five different drugs in one time but benzo’s are just one of them, people take small  booster doses for a little while.
And pot just for a week or so and you will not get a seizure that’s for sure.
You can  taper slowly, and just for quitting do a short treatment of one week, 10 days.
Few weeks ago I had a patient who came off 140 mg of methadone and 50mg of clonazepam , he was 34 years old and use from age of 22.
I didn’t have anyone your age yet.

Sara

Van: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 16:03
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

sara:  this is important:  this benzo stuff is life threatening.  i’ve done  c/t w/d’s from h,  methadone, dilaudid, demerol and alcohol.  are you certain of what you say?  thanks, ron
and how old was the patient?
—– Original Message —–
From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 1:08 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Jim,

Iboga prevent seizures, cannabis does that too, they both help physical pain, I help people to come off Valium 90mg a day without seizure.
People who are on this list from the start maybe still remember my reports.

Sara

Van: Jim Hadey [mailto:jimhadey3@yahoo.com] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 6:58
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Hi Ron

>>>. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? <<<

You would be far better off using dilantin than anything with phenobarb.  Phenobarb can leave you VERY depressed, with dilantin you don’t even know your taking it.  Just take a large glass of water or whatever with it or you may feel like your stomach is burning.  I am speaking from my own experience.  However, others have told me the same thing.  I have been taking Valium for over 25 years at 40 mg or more a day you can have seizures if you quit suddenly, I did anyway.  I really do not know how slow to taper.  I only take one or two a day so I doubt if it would be a problem now.

Hope I helped,

– JIM

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
BRO, I DON’T WANT NO FREAKING SEIZURES. VALIUM TAPER ELIMINATES THAT.  NO ALCOHOL IN THIS BODY FOR 25 YRS.  RON
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Testing positive for methadone after almost 4 weeks
Date: November 12, 2004 at 11:23:54 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,

How are ye all?  Just wanted to let you guys know a little something I have discovered about meth.  Dropped into my doc’s today, to have a chat about Ibo/detox, and to leave a clean urine in good faith.  I was surprised to learn that my urine test of Nov. 4 was POSITIVE for methadone- and this was after 3 weeks, 4 days of meth abstinence!  The morphine was long gone, but the methadone lingered.

I am quite surprised.  I knew meth was a long lasting substance, but had NO idea it would take almost a month to flush out of my body!  My doctor was thrilled with my clean urine and relative sanity-  apparently I am the first person to ever return clean to the clinic after detoxing.  He gave me a script for Trazadone(for insomnia), and referred me to a relapse-prevention counsellor.

To all the peeps still on methadone- YOU CAN BEAT THIS!!  Despite what the medical profession or your friends/family might say,  it IS do-able.  I wish you all the best of luck in your respective journeys…

love Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 11:04:24 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith, Gush is on the spectrum that is into legalised torture.

On Fri, 12 Nov 2004 07:52:42 -0800 Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.
com> wrote:
Ron, Bush is on the other spectrum of evil.    I’m not a puppet,
and
certainly not stupid.  Truly smart people hardly use that word in
their
vocab, and manage to make to whom their speaking feel smart, also.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2004 08:50:30 -0600

ron writes:  agreed, BUSH IS EVIL and the puppets that voted for
him?  of
course both candidates and running mates went running of to their

respective retreats after months of spending millions of other
people’s
money..   my retreat is a brown bag over my head.  think of what
it costs
to just fire up one of those pvt. jets.  could/ve paid off my
house.  we
all lost.  look at what the ads said.  that should tell you
something about
how stupid most americans are
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told

Bush what
he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found
someone who
would.  Chaney is really the one running the country and when he
dies from
his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush
is his
puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write
in order to
clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911
today and it
was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the
most evil and
corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy
scout.
Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like
Kissinger
and Rumsfield.  Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon
administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he
know about
drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.

Ashcroft
was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In fact his opponent

died and
got more votes than Ashcroft.  In other words the people of his
state would
rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.
However, his
opponent’s wife ran in his place and won.  They are all washed up

has-beens
some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know
his dad,
the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term
president (the
other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really
elected
president and only served about 2 years).  Like I said before
this man is
evil and I rarely will call someone evil.  And we all know is a
liar and
dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.

The look
on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot
Bush
nominates
Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
international laws relating to prohibition of torture of
prisoners
of
war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay
detainees. Of
course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is
no
“non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in
the Geneva
Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up
that whole
lie
to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush
rewards this
war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-
General,
despite
the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down
the whole
Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law.
This shows
Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention,
international
law,
and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for
torture as
a
legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as

a war
criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further
violations of
his.
I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators
regarding
Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question
the record
of
this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his
nomination to the
Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely
unqualified, both
on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message
to the
world
that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as
the top,
or
bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in
the United
States of America.

=====
End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
b_jb2001

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to
carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted
uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework
and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium,

Death
children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of
irak, You
will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

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Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’

s FREE!
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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 10:52:42 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, Bush is on the other spectrum of evil.    I’m not a puppet, and certainly not stupid.  Truly smart people hardly use that word in their vocab, and manage to make to whom their speaking feel smart, also.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: Fri, 12 Nov 2004 08:50:30 -0600

ron writes:  agreed, BUSH IS EVIL and the puppets that voted for him?  of course both candidates and running mates went running of to their respective retreats after months of spending millions of other people’s money..   my retreat is a brown bag over my head.  think of what it costs to just fire up one of those pvt. jets.  could/ve paid off my house.  we all lost.  look at what the ads said.  that should tell you something about how stupid most americans are
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told Bush what he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found someone who would.  Chaney is really the one running the country and when he dies from his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush is his puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write in order to clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911 today and it was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the most evil and corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy scout.  Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like Kissinger and Rumsfield.  Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he know about drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.  Ashcroft was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In fact his opponent died and got more votes than Ashcroft.  In other words the people of his state would rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.  However, his opponent’s wife ran in his place and won.  They are all washed up has-beens some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know his dad, the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term president (the other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really elected president and only served about 2 years).  Like I said before this man is evil and I rarely will call someone evil.  And we all know is a liar and dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.  The look on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
> we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot Bush nominates
> Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
> Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
> international laws relating to prohibition of torture of prisoners of
> war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay detainees. Of
> course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is no
> “non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in the Geneva
> Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up that whole lie
> to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush rewards this
> war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-General, despite
> the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down the whole
> Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law. This shows
> Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention, international law,
> and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for torture as a
> legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as a war
> criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further violations of
> his.
> I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators regarding
> Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question the record of
> this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his nomination to the
> Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely unqualified, both
> on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message to the world
> that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as the top, or
> bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in the United
> States of America.
>
> =====
> End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
> b_jb2001
>
>
—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium, Death children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of irak, You will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

>
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 12, 2004 at 10:02:31 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

sara:  this is important:  this benzo stuff is life threatening.  i’ve done  c/t w/d’s from h,  methadone, dilaudid, demerol and alcohol.  are you certain of what you say?  thanks, ron
and how old was the patient?
—– Original Message —–
From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 1:08 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Jim,

Iboga prevent seizures, cannabis does that too, they both help physical pain, I help people to come off Valium 90mg a day without seizure.
People who are on this list from the start maybe still remember my reports.

Sara

Van: Jim Hadey [mailto:jimhadey3@yahoo.com] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 6:58
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Hi Ron

>>>. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? <<<

You would be far better off using dilantin than anything with phenobarb.  Phenobarb can leave you VERY depressed, with dilantin you don’t even know your taking it.  Just take a large glass of water or whatever with it or you may feel like your stomach is burning.  I am speaking from my own experience.  However, others have told me the same thing.  I have been taking Valium for over 25 years at 40 mg or more a day you can have seizures if you quit suddenly, I did anyway.  I really do not know how slow to taper.  I only take one or two a day so I doubt if it would be a problem now.

Hope I helped,

– JIM

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
BRO, I DON’T WANT NO FREAKING SEIZURES. VALIUM TAPER ELIMINATES THAT.  NO ALCOHOL IN THIS BODY FOR 25 YRS.  RON
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 12, 2004 at 9:57:26 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks jim, tell me, how does one get valium?  forum: the only reason i ask is that it is the safest drug to use tapering from stronger benzos.  i’m not trying to con a doc or get recreational drugs.. this is about surviving benzos….i’ve sucessfully w/d from h, methadone and every other opiate pre ’79, always c/t in a jail cell, but i was a younger man.  i d/n want any mood or mind altering drugs in my body, got caught in a benzo thing and now i’m in trouble and the entire addiction industry is in the dark about the methods used in the uk and other progressive parts of the world. ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:58 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Hi Ron

>>>. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? <<<

You would be far better off using dilantin than anything with phenobarb.  Phenobarb can leave you VERY depressed, with dilantin you don’t even know your taking it.  Just take a large glass of water or whatever with it or you may feel like your stomach is burning.  I am speaking from my own experience.  However, others have told me the same thing.  I have been taking Valium for over 25 years at 40 mg or more a day you can have seizures if you quit suddenly, I did anyway.  I really do not know how slow to taper.  I only take one or two a day so I doubt if it would be a problem now.

Hope I helped,

– JIM

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
BRO, I DON’T WANT NO FREAKING SEIZURES. VALIUM TAPER ELIMINATES THAT.  NO ALCOHOL IN THIS BODY FOR 25 YRS.  RON
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 9:50:30 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ron writes:  agreed, BUSH IS EVIL and the puppets that voted for him?  of course both candidates and running mates went running of to their respective retreats after months of spending millions of other people’s money..   my retreat is a brown bag over my head.  think of what it costs to just fire up one of those pvt. jets.  could/ve paid off my house.  we all lost.  look at what the ads said.  that should tell you something about how stupid most americans are
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:41 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told Bush what he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found someone who would.  Chaney is really the one running the country and when he dies from his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush is his puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write in order to clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911 today and it was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the most evil and corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy scout.  Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like Kissinger and Rumsfield.  Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he know about drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.  Ashcroft was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In fact his opponent died and got more votes than Ashcroft.  In other words the people of his state would rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.  However, his opponent’s wife ran in his place and won.  They are all washed up has-beens some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know his dad, the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term president (the other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really elected president and only served about 2 years).  Like I said before this man is evil and I rarely will call someone evil.  And we all know is a liar and dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.  The look on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
> we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot Bush nominates
> Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
> Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
> international laws relating to prohibition of torture of prisoners of
> war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay detainees. Of
> course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is no
> “non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in the Geneva
> Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up that whole lie
> to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush rewards this
> war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-General, despite
> the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down the whole
> Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law. This shows
> Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention, international law,
> and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for torture as a
> legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as a war
> criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further violations of
> his.
> I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators regarding
> Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question the record of
> this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his nomination to the
> Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely unqualified, both
> on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message to the world
> that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as the top, or
> bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in the United
> States of America.
>
> =====
> End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
> b_jb2001
>
>
—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium, Death children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of irak, You will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

>
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Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) no faith in The Bush (or Nixon) Administrations
Date: November 12, 2004 at 9:15:06 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jim wrote rationally >Chaney is really the one running the country and when he dies from his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.<

I don’t think so Jim. While yes, I do agree that Cheney is probably a bit more powerful than Bush in some ways, I don’t think Bush is really as stupid as people seem to think he is. That said, I do think Cheney is a bit more connected in ways than is Bush and he probably will take a lot of blame if and when he dies, but I think there are others not named or actually even in government more in control even than Cheney. Sort of a “shadow government” if you will, which is really, really in “control” such as it is, and make Cheney seem just another puppet boy too.

The Bush regime is the most evil and corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy scout.<

I keep hearing this but cannot for the life of me figure out why people keep saying this. Other than for the Patriot Act of course. I mean, Nixon and Kissinger bombed the shit out of SouthEast Asia for a decade justified by lies, misinformation and just plain evil, causing directly and indirectly the deaths of over 3 million native inhabitants, not to mention the 58,000 US servicefolk killed (nor mentioning the victims of Agent Orange who didn’t die, and all the injured in so many other ways too). Nixon and Kissinger “secretly” bombed Laos and Cambodia for how long before admitting they were doing so? Read the latest Anthony Summers book about Nixon (The Arrogance of Power-the Secret World of Richard Nixon) for more on Nixon’s ties to the mob and more corruption too. These guys were not any less evil or fucked up than the Bush crew so far as I can tell. Remember COINTELPRO please. Distance in time makes it appear that Bush is worse, but I suspect (a personal suspicion for course) that Nixon and Kissinger et al were perhaps inspirational to the Bush crew but no less evil or out right anti-American and flat out bad.

When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.  The look on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.<

Personally? I think he knew exactly what to do and did it- sit tight and let the “new Pearl Harbor” happen. But this is just my own view of course, and I’ve no “proof” other than for this ikcy nasty feeling inside…and that PNAC report saying we really needed a “new Pearl Harbor” to get the sheeple behind warmongering plots and plans.

You also wrote >Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he know about drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.  Ashcroft was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In! fact his opponent died and got more votes than Ashcroft.<

To which I reply with the following essay I wrote about Ashcroft a few years ago, which not only contains a number of links embedded within it at the URL supplied, but is followed by a bunch more links to further info about the maniac self-anointer Ashcroft:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id755/pg1/

john ashcroft: an empty suit with the deepest pockets
by Preston Peet (ptpeet@nyc.rr.com) – January 17, 2001

The Anointed one will be cut off, and will have nothing. The people of the ruler will come, will destroy the city and the sanctuary. The end will come like a flood . . .
~ ~ Daniel 9:26 (quoted by Ken Friedman)

I’ve been really sad since I realized most peoples opposition to the nomination of John Ashcroft, former Governor of Missouri, former Missouri Senator, and now President-elect George W. Bush’s choice for US Attorney General, is due to his outspoken, repressive, self-described “Christian” values.

Ashcroft’s apparent feelings on certain other issues, such as his anti-gay, anti-civil liberties stance, and his pro-War Against Some Drugs view, have prompted many people to voice their concern about his nomination. But something that really bugs me, something that (probably) epitomizes his entire being: John Ashcroft anointed himself with Crisco cooking oil.

Ken Freidman posted an editorial recently to the alt.discuss.politics newsgroup, dissecting Ashcroft’s apparent belief that he is “ordained by God to blend politics and religion.”

In his book, Lessons From a Father to His Son (Thomas Nelson Publishers, 1998), Ashcroft writes of his anointing himself, before both terms as Missouri Governor. He felt that his successful 1995 Senate campaign was important enough to warrant using a bowl of Crisco. Friedman then pointed out a New York Times article, containing this comment about Ashcroft: “‘The act of anointing,’ he wrote in his largely autobiographical book, replicated the practice of ‘the ancient kings of Israel, David and Saul,’ who Ashcroft said ‘were anointed as they undertook their administrative duties.'”

Of course, neither David nor Saul anointed themselves, they were anointed by the Prophet Samuel, who did it under direct orders from god. But as Friedman so eloquently noted, “there is something entirely appropriate about Ashcroft anointing himself in Crisco.”

Friedman continues: “The Bible prescribes the specific formula of sacred anointing oil in Exodus 30:22-29. Sacred anointing oil is comprised of fine spices blended into olive oil. The spices include myrrh, cinnamon, fragrant cane, and cassia, all in a ‘fragrant blend, the work of a perfumer.’ (Exodus 30:25) John Ashcroft substituted supermarket cooking oil for sacred anointing oil. This seems appropriate for a senator distinguished for representing corporate interests.”

As Ralph Nader said at a campaign stop in St. Louis, Missouri (July 16, 2000), “Ashcroft not only seeks to retain his office with ‘pay-back’ campaign contributions from special interests, he also opposes any effort to clean up the legal bribery process.”

Nader pointed out that Ashcroft got caught taking $50,000 from Schering-Plough, makers of Claritin allergy medication, when he sat on the Senate Judiciary overseeing the patent extension, at a cost to the citizenry “of $7.3 billion in monopoly prices.”

Ashcroft voted to protect Health Management Organizations (HMOs) from liability for their insane medical coverage practices, and took $135,000 from insurance and health industries towards his Senate campaign (up to June 1, 2000).

According to Nader, Ashcroft took $26,000 from electric utilities, while voting to allow them to ship their nuclear waste to Yucca Mountain, exposing at least 50 million Americans across 43 states, over the course of 25 years, to “dangerous levels of radiation.”

Dan Forbes points out in a Salon article (January 12, 2001), not only was Ashcroft’s nephew, Alex Ashcroft, arrested in January 1992 for growing 50 marijuana plants in his basement with a friend, and got off with three years probation, but the Drug Czar that Ashcroft had appointed was fired. The reason? Recreational drug use.

Yet Ashcroft continues to call for stricter drug laws and penalties for use. Ashcroft introduced the recently defeated Methamphetemine Anti-Proliferation Act, that, besides vastly increasing penalties for getting caught with certain drugs, would have allowed the police to engage in warrentless searches and other nefarious activities in the name of the War Against Some Drugs. Many of my writings would have been illegal.

Ashcroft also helped craft legislation that would block federal aid to anyone convicted of a drug crime, and a bill to amend the Federal Disabilities Act to allow disabled kids to be treated the same as uncrippled kids when it comes to drugs. As DRCNet wrote, “just because a kid is crippled doesn’t mean we can’t get him on drug charges.”

Ashcroft accepted $44,500 from beer companies, including $20,000 from the local Missouri Anheuser-Busch, and Ashcroft “lauded the beer industry in a video tribute by the Beer Institute of America.” When asked by Mother Jones about his contradictory policy of opposing currently illicit drugs, and shilling for the beer industry, Ashcroft told them, “[beer] is a product that is in demand. And when it’s used responsibly it’s like other products.”

I just can’t forget that Ashcroft lost his Senate seat in November 2000 to a deceased candidate, Mel Carnahan, whose widow ran against Ashcroft in his place, and won with no political experience.
That isn’t saying much for the slimey John Ashcroft, who wants to tell us what “morals” are and “laws” stand for. He’s the perfect choice for our Un-Justice Department, unless people are expecting real justice.
—–

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 12:41 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told Bush what he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found someone who would. Chaney is really the one running the country and when he dies from his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush is his puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write in order to clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911 today and it was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the most evil and corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy scout.  Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like Kissinger and Rumsfield. Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he know about drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.  Ashcroft was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In! fact his opponent died and got more votes than Ashcroft. In other words the people of his state would rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.  However, his opponent’s wife ran in his place and won.  They are all washed up has-beens some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know his dad, the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term president (the other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really elected president and only served about 2 years). Like I said before this man is evil and I rarely will call someone evil. And we all know is a liar and dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.  The look on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot Bush nominates
Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
international laws relating to prohibition of torture of prisoners of
war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay detainees. Of
course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is no
“non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in the Geneva
Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up that whole lie
to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush rewards this
war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-General, despite
the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down the whole
Guantanamo memorandum as violat! ive of international law. This shows
Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention, international law,
and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for torture as a
legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as a war
criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further violations of
his.
I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators regarding
Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question the record of
this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his nomination to the
Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely unqualified, both
on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message to the world
that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as the top, or
bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in the United
States of America.

=====
End the oppression of cannabis an! d its consumers.
b_jb2001

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium, Death children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of irak, You will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

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/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

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From: Germán DC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..
Date: November 12, 2004 at 8:24:17 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

add the http stuff,

http://www.sorryeverybody.com/

gdc
—– Original Message —–
From: Ann B. Mullikin
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 10:02 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..

That didn’t work either.

ann

—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 7:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..

try copying the link and pasting into browser.

On Thursday, November 11, 2004, at 02:40 PM, Ann B. Mullikin wrote:

I tried but it didn’t work.

ann
think@francomm.com
—– Original Message —–
From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 7:12 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..

Dear List,
Check out if you will    www.sorryeverybody.com
Eric

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 12, 2004 at 8:09:35 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Randy,
You didn’t wake up dope sick.  You’re not in the process of scheming to scrape up money to go on that ridiculously time consuming run you used to do, exposing yourself to arrest and distancing yourself from your family and friends.  I’m sure you can add at least 10 more things to this list that will convince you why today is better.  You’re bound to have a few wavy days here and there.  Maybe a good workout to get your endorphines going!  I know… what’s that one album, cd, tape or song that can redirect  a downward spiral?  There’s nothing wrong with having those feelings just don’t let them consume you.  Cartoons works for some!  Go see a movie.  I hear Ray is outstanding. That’s a plan for a rainy day.  Pull back a while from that what is bothering you and try to see it from a different perspective.  The more I do this the less of a grasp stuff tends to have on me.  I vote for the movie.   Let me know how your day turns out.
Sending some grounding energy your way and above all, Love,      Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 12, 2004 6:43 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

I remember Sara. I have referred people to you for bezo’s, I don’t know if any of them ever followed through or not. I’m a mess but I still try to help. I’m clean but it is not real fun right now because of my personal situation. Today’s a new day, maybe this one will be better.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 12, 2004 at 6:43:55 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I remember Sara. I have referred people to you for bezo’s, I don’t know if any of them ever followed through or not. I’m a mess but I still try to help. I’m clean but it is not real fun right now because of my personal situation. Today’s a new day, maybe this one will be better.    Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 12, 2004 at 2:08:13 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jim,

Iboga prevent seizures, cannabis does that too, they both help physical pain, I help people to come off Valium 90mg a day without seizure.
People who are on this list from the start maybe still remember my reports.

Sara

Van: Jim Hadey [mailto:jimhadey3@yahoo.com] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 12 november 2004 6:58
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper

Hi Ron

>>>. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? <<<

You would be far better off using dilantin than anything with phenobarb.  Phenobarb can leave you VERY depressed, with dilantin you don’t even know your taking it.  Just take a large glass of water or whatever with it or you may feel like your stomach is burning.  I am speaking from my own experience.  However, others have told me the same thing.  I have been taking Valium for over 25 years at 40 mg or more a day you can have seizures if you quit suddenly, I did anyway.  I really do not know how slow to taper.  I only take one or two a day so I doubt if it would be a problem now.

Hope I helped,

– JIM

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
BRO, I DON’T WANT NO FREAKING SEIZURES. VALIUM TAPER ELIMINATES THAT.  NO ALCOHOL IN THIS BODY FOR 25 YRS.  RON
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol – Valium Taper
Date: November 12, 2004 at 12:58:28 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Ron

>>>. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? <<<

You would be far better off using dilantin than anything with phenobarb.  Phenobarb can leave you VERY depressed, with dilantin you don’t even know your taking it.  Just take a large glass of water or whatever with it or you may feel like your stomach is burning.  I am speaking from my own experience.  However, others have told me the same thing.  I have been taking Valium for over 25 years at 40 mg or more a day you can have seizures if you quit suddenly, I did anyway.  I really do not know how slow to taper.  I only take one or two a day so I doubt if it would be a problem now.

Hope I helped,

– JIM

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
BRO, I DON’T WANT NO FREAKING SEIZURES. VALIUM TAPER ELIMINATES THAT.  NO ALCOHOL IN THIS BODY FOR 25 YRS.  RON
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith – The Bush Administration
Date: November 12, 2004 at 12:41:05 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Sara,

Alberto Gonzales, wrote what Bush wanted him to write, he told Bush what he wanted to hear.  If he did not do it Bush would of found someone who would.  Chaney is really the one running the country and when he dies from his heart and health problems he will take all the blame.  Bush is his puppet as is Tony Blair.  He wrote what he was suppose to write in order to clime the political ladder.  I just watched Farentheight 911 today and it was a great movie, you would like it.  The Bush regime is the most evil and corrupt that America ever had.  They make Nixon look like a boy scout.  Speaking of Nixon, he is using a lot of his old has-beens like Kissinger and Rumsfield.  Rumsfield was head of the FDA under the Nixon administration, now he is not a doctor, what the hell does he know about drugs? Most people on this forum know more about drugs than him.  Ashcroft was a senator who could not get re-elected.  In fact his opponent died and got more votes than Ashcroft.  In other words the people of his state would rather vote for a dead guy than Ashcroft, I don’t blame them.  However, his opponent’s wife ran in his place and won.  They are all washed up has-beens some from the Nixon era and the rest from his dads era, you know his dad, the second president since Herbert Hoover to be a one term president (the other was Carter, not counting Ford since he was not really elected president and only served about 2 years).  Like I said before this man is evil and I rarely will call someone evil.  And we all know is a liar and dummy.  When the plane hit the tower Bush had no idea what to do.  The look on his face said it all, kind of a duhhh look.

Best to ya Sara,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
It never seems to end: just when you think “Yay!
> we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot Bush nominates
> Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
> Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
> international laws relating to prohibition of torture of prisoners of
> war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay detainees. Of
> course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well. There is no
> “non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in the Geneva
> Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up that whole lie
> to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well. Bush rewards this
> war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-General, despite
> the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down the whole
> Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law. This shows
> Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention, international law,
> and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for torture as a
> legitimate form of behavior. Bush can only be construed as a war
> criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further violations of
> his.
> I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators regarding
> Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question the record of
> this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his nomination to the
> Cabinet post of Attorney General. He is absolutely unqualified, both
> on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message to the world
> that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as the top, or
> bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in the United
> States of America.
>
> =====
> End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
> b_jb2001
>
>
—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war and the use of depleted uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy to do your homework and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium, Death children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq, privatisation of irak, You will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

>
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 11, 2004 at 10:06:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,
It’s entirely possible if that’s what you are drawn to that it may work for you.  A lot of people I know do 60-80% raw but with some cooked veggies and cooked protein.  They came to this conclusion after doing all raw and it didn’t work for them.  These are extremely knowledgable people, nutritionally speaking and resourcefull as well as coming up with variety. One commented it was too much carb for her and she needed cooked animal protein as well as some lighly cooked veggies.  She hasn’t had any sugar binges since she made this adjustment.  I applaude your observation on what you need.  You can also call 800-raw foods.  They can send you a catalogue and when you call the guys are very helpfull answering questions.  I had earlier in the week posted a recipe for a raw foods drink completely balanced with great cleansing abilities.  Those ingredients are available there.  I buy the coconut milk in cans at the health food or trader joe store. You may also be inspired by a raw foods cookbook.  My friend made me a cold soup in a blender of 3 cups raw spinach, 1 avocado, some parsley and lemon juice to taste.  Not only was it beyond delicious but since it’s 100% absorbable you get full with suprisingly little .
I’m so glad you are doing well. Personally it’s one of the most uncanny things as I look back that some other person was living some other life but it doesn’t feel like it was me!                              Here’s to you, Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 9:19 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 10:00:36 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi All,

Got the DVD Farenhight 911(sp) from the library, I knew a lot of what was on the DVD 6 months ago.  It gives a lot of info about the Bush family.  It was one of the best pics I have seen in years.  And to think I got it for free from the local library – unbelieveable but true.  The Bush family care about two things – money and themselves.

See the movie and make up your own mind.

BTW, rense.com often has David Icke on as a guest.  If your a member you can go back to the archives.  I find some of his stuff hard to believe, he also has his own web site lf I remember correctly

– JIM

D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:
preston,

that reminds me of a movie called : “They Live”. a cult classic.

On Wednesday, November 10, 2004, at 12:18 PM, Preston Peet wrote:

>> Dave:
> do you know David Icke, a british journalist?<
>
> LOL, lotsa love. Are you talking about the guy who thinks there really
> are lizards in people suits hanging about running things?
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston Peet
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
> often mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
>
> —– Original Message —– From: “Germán DC”
>
> To:
> Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:12 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
>
>
>> Dave:
>> do you know David Icke, a british journalist?
>> i have an almost complete interview with Credo Mutwa a Zulu Shaman,
>> talking
>> about the origins of our humanity.
>> I can shared it thru messenger or p2p program.
>> Is VERY WORTH IT.
>> 🙂
>> tell me if you like to get it.
>> germándc
>>
>>
>>
>> —– Original Message —– From: “D H”
>> To:
>> Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:46 AM
>> Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith
>>
>>
>>> Faith,
>>>
>>> You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you
>>> want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that
>>> accurate?
>>>
>>> Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem
>>> to
>>> “faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a
>>> treatment
>>> like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s
>>> anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white
>>> men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven
>>> by
>>> profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate
>>> conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their
>>> actions
>>> be-lie their words.
>>>
>>> You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the
>>> pharmaceutical
>>> industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant
>>> based
>>> medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1
>>> or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you
>>> can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for
>>> repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in
>>> maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms,
>>> unlike
>>> Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business
>>> for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These
>>> same
>>> companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to
>>> mention
>>> medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at
>>> wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on
>>> quarterly
>>> earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much
>>> Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?
>>>
>>> They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in
>>> need.
>>>
>>> They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or
>>> methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with
>>> narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.
>>>
>>> Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the
>>> billions.
>>>
>>> Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of
>>> the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history
>>> (whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall
>>> that?
>>> In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George
>>> senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
>>> what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number
>>> one
>>> not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues
>>> from? God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal
>>> friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s
>>> relationship
>>> with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for
>>> themselves
>>> when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not
>>> kill”?
>>> How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead
>>> American
>>> soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and
>>> counting?
>>> For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as
>>> killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals?
>>> Does that reflect compassion?
>>>
>>> Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or
>>> religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly
>>> affect
>>> each and everyone of us, sooner or later.
>>>
>>> I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled
>>> to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information
>>> as
>>> you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide
>>> funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need.
>>> He
>>> might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he
>>> promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops…
>>> oh
>>> wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons
>>> are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the
>>> weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little
>>> investment group known as Carlyle.
>>>
>>> In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction,
>>> wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.
>>>
>>> Peace,
>>> _.Dave
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 11, 2004 at 9:48:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachael and Julie,
Everyone seems to make the assumption that I am a vegetarian or a raw foodist.  I am considering maybe next spring and summer when it’s warm attempting all raw to see if I can do it as the point is the enzymes in food are killed once they are heated above 185 degrees.  I believe it is possible to get everything you need nutritionally but you first need to know what your personal needs are and then know what’s in all the food you eat to come up with your formula.  I eat a lot of raw, as much organic as possible and as many greens and veggies as I can.  I also eat every type of animal protein around. My basic mindset is that I like the way the american indians approached killing animals. They took what they only needed, didn’t waste anything and thanked the animal spirit and mother earth for providing.  I also know these animals wouldn’t exist if they weren’t raised for food to begin with.   As far as being vegetarian, again you need to have a good understanding of the nutritional content and what you need.  As a group most people who become vegetarian without this knowledge become the biggest sugar addicts in existance, also to the point of not getting enough protein to where their body is digesting it’s own muscle tissue.  The larger % of products in the health food store are also laden with “healthy sugars”. I prefer buying all my meats that are raised without hormones and antibiotics. Same with dairy.  I don’t overinduldge in dairy and I do best with goat or sheep dairy but again no antibiotics or hormones.  I believe the hormones in the food is why you have 8 year olds that have developed way ahead of their years.  This has been confirmed by my dentist who says the teeth in many children are also coming up ahead of schedule. My other prerequisite to ingesting food is that there are no chemicals, perservatives and sugars(in all it’s 50 different forms).  Food needs to be what i refer to as “clean”. Our food is supposed to be our medicine as well as our source of nutrients. The reason people eat too much is because our signal from our body when it needs nutrients is hunger.   Our body is really saying, I need nutrients. If you eat a meal with no detectable enzymes and nutrients then even though you get full, shortly thereafter your body is going, where is the nutrients, try again!  This country has more overweight undernourished people in all of existance.  Most people think if it’s for sale, it’s been deemed safe.  The truth is that foods and chemicals are innocent until proven guilty.  Do you know when you walk down the household and cleaning product isle in the supermarket(the chemical smell is so strong it gets in your throat) that only less than 15% of those chemicals were ever really tested.  Lets talk about when the fda or epa says that an item in question has “acceptable levels” of some toxin.  I heard this once about baby pacifiers. Well if a person is exposed to 100 things a day with acceptable levels there is an accumulation and once again we have compromised immune function.  I think I just went off on a tangient.  You have to be your own detective.  Since food is for energy, your barometer is how you feel 30-60 minutes after you eat to see if it works, also how the day progresses in general and how you feel when you wake up. Not to mention your mindset. Poor nutrition can make a person and their dr. think they need antidepressants.    Raw when possible, tons of vegeatables, fruit to your bodies liking(not craving,liking) whatever protien and healthy fats and oils. Don’t avoid avocados or nuts because of their fat content. That is the most ridiculous thing I’ve ever heard.   Whole grains only. Plenty plenty plenty of water and do no harm. Vegetable juices are probably one of the healthiest things a person can do for themselves.  The greens especially, but I usually throw in 1/2 a carrot and 1/4 beet as that’s all I feel I can tolerate.  The juice is not high sugar, being that its liquid your absorption does not depend on how well chewed your food is(Another factor in absorbing nutrients). The phytochemicals detox and cleanse but not too quickly to the point of making you ill.  The enzymes among other things will actually attack toxins in the body . They are a helper for the immune system.  The greens will also alkalize your system as most people are to acidic.  All people with serious illness are acidic.  People that crave sugar tend to be too acidic.  This refers to the PH balance in the body.  Just to give you a visual of this, If you’ve ever had an aquarium and had to check the ph in the water to keep it balanced for the health and survivial of the fish.  The tester kit has a color scale going from yellow (totally acidic) to shades of green, blue and teal.  Depending on the color you get you add an acidic or alkaline substance to balance it out.  Fish living in the wrong ph get fin rot, ich and die!  You can actually buy a ph strip test for people.  Your proteins and grains are basically acidic. Your greens, vegetables and most fruits are alkaline.  So in a way it makes common sense that people that are sick don’t get enough veggies.  There are variables as to what’s alkaline and acidic but that’s the basics.  Anytime I feel I’m fighting anything physically my mindset is to “green-up”.  rawfoods.com is an informative source and a place to order raw foods that are also organic.
Rachael I understand the whole craving thing after ibogaine and the comfort factor in that. Unless the progresso soup is representative of a time when a loved one prepared it for him, I personally would do some harm reduction and whip up a batch of homemade and tell him to feel the love! Maybe because detoxing is part of what i do professionally and personally I was hyperaware of the detoxing going on with the ibogaine.  I actually could smell powdered garlic powder coming through my skin on my forearms.  It was mandatory in my moms cooking and one of those lazy things I still did on occasion.  It grossed me out and now I only use real garlic.  It makes you wonder what else is the body holding and storing toxin wise.  I actually can answer that but I think I’ve said enough for now.
Hope this helps,   Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 3:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo

I’m feeling conflicted about this as well, being the
caretaker who’s doing the shopping and the feeding.
On the one hand I could just give him the raw fruit
and the yogurt shakes I want to provide.  On the other
hand, he’s just been through this journey and has a
right to eat whatever he wants.  For example,
yesterday he was hungry for roast beef.  So sliced
dead cow it was.  And today he asked for Progresso
canned soup.  In my ideal world, I’d cook up brown
rice, detox tea, and veggie juice.  But the
codependent comfort factor is running high.

Lots of Love, Rachel

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..
Date: November 11, 2004 at 8:02:07 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That didn’t work either.

ann

—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 7:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..

try copying the link and pasting into browser.

On Thursday, November 11, 2004, at 02:40 PM, Ann B. Mullikin wrote:

I tried but it didn’t work.

ann
think@francomm.com
—– Original Message —–
From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 7:12 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..

Dear List,
Check out if you will    www.sorryeverybody.com
Eric

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..
Date: November 11, 2004 at 7:45:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

try copying the link and pasting into browser.

On Thursday, November 11, 2004, at 02:40 PM, Ann B. Mullikin wrote:

I tried but it didn’t work.

ann
think@francomm.com
—– Original Message —–
From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 7:12 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..

Dear List,
Check out if you will    www.sorryeverybody.com
Eric

From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..
Date: November 11, 2004 at 7:40:11 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I tried but it didn’t work.

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 7:12 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..

Dear List,
Check out if you will    www.sorryeverybody.com
Eric

From: IBEGINAGAIN@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Sorry everybody..
Date: November 11, 2004 at 7:12:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,
Check out if you will    www.sorryeverybody.com
Eric

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Acomplia -New Diet/Anti-Smoking Pill
Date: November 11, 2004 at 6:56:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That was in paper yesterday, the new drug the french have made for weight loss right…but only works for as long as you take it no residual effects…..like Ibo      Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: Ann B. Mullikin
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 8:46 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Acomplia -New Diet/Anti-Smoking Pill

Anybody hear about this?  Sound familiar?

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/features/health/bal-te.superpill10nov10,0,633=
3232.story?coll=3Dsfla-news-health

It is the first diet drug aimed at blocking the “pleasure center” of the
brain and interfering with the cycle of craving and satisfaction that
drives many compulsive behaviors and addictions.

“Weight regulation is really kind of an addictive behavior,” said Dr.
Robert Eckel, an expert on metabolism from the University of Colorado
Health Sciences Center who had no role in the study.

Kinda interesting.

Best

ann

think@francomm.com

SNIP

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 6:23:50 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks preston, when its all said and done, methadone sucks as does every other chemical that has stripped me of every shred of dignity i possess and destroyed my family and may very well get my career and freedom. after 54 yrs. bro, it ain’t fun and you don’t bounce back. i can’t count the suicides on 2 hands much less the lengthy prison sentences, od’s and broken marriages of friends and associates over the yrs. peace, ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 4:05 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

i stand humbly corrected from my earlier post.<

Hi Ron,
No need to be humble at all, I’m not ragging on you or anything even remotely like it, I’m just throwing out info I’ve come across over the years. You continue posting to your heart’s content, and I’ll continue reading what you post. If I’ve got a comeback, correction, agreement, or comment you be sure I’ll post with it. Please don’t let that make you hesitate ever to post with anything- if you were thinking along those lines, which you may not have been anyway, so blah, blah, blah.
;-)))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

to both jon and preston< i stand humbly corrected from my earlier post. thanks for  the “complete history lesson”.
still a great drug , heah?  ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 6:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

Jon wrote >nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.<

Yep, yer right about that Adolphine thing too, except I’m not sure about the 1970s bit but really haven’t any reason to doubt that, but I am pretty sure that Amidon was the “code” name for Polamidon, what became known as Methadone eventually:

from my dossier “M is for Methadone”:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id838/pg1/

snip-
One very common misconception is that Dolophine, one of the very first trade names given to the drug, was derived from “Adolph”, in honor of the dictator himself by the Nazis, and that in Germany it was called “Adolophine.” The fact of the matter seems to be this name was not given the drug until after the war, by the Eli-Lilly pharmaceutical company in America, which was given control of the drug.
If there was any honoring of Hitler going on, it was by the Americans who invented this urban legend. Dolophine most likely derives from the French words “dolor” (pain), and “fin” (end).
snip-
—–
Jon also wrote >for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:<

And you can also check out my M is for Methadone, which is followed by a whole bunch of links to further info.

btw, the Dolophine name was one of the very first trade names for Methadone, and it was patented as Polamidon on, get this, my birthday (well, on the same date, only a few years before my own special day), September 11, 1941:

snip-

On September 11, 1941, Bockmuhl and Ehrhart filed a patent application for, and were formally credited with, the discovery of Hoechst 10820 (Polamidon), which eventually became known as Methadone.
In the Autumn of 1942, I.G. Farben handed over the drug, codenamed “Amidon”, to the German military for further testing.
The Nazis did not make any attempt to mass produce the drug, unlike Pethidine, which by 1944 was being produced at an annual rate of 1600 kg. One reason for this was given by Dr. K K Chen, an early American researcher, after the war. He said that a former employee of the I. G. Farben factory had written him, saying that the Germans had discontinued Polamidon use due to its side effects. Chen decided that the Nazis had been giving their test subject doses that were too high, causing nausea, overdose, etc….
snip-
Eli-Lilly, along with other companies in the US and Great Britain, began clinical trials of Dolophine, marketing the drug as a pain killer and cough suppressant. In 1947, Isabel et al, published their findings after experimenting on both animals and humans. After giving doses of up to 200mg., four times a day, they found that there was rapid tolerance, and euphoria. They also discovered that there were a bevy of adverse side effects, such as, “signs of toxicity . . . inflammation of the skin . . . deep narcosis and . . . a general clinical appearance of illness.” Once again, just like the Nazis, the scientists were giving doses that were far too high.
Morphine addicts responded well to Dolophine, but authorities decided that it was potentially highly addictive. As reports of Dolophine addicts started coming in, thedrug was taken of the market, only to resurface in the 1960s, now known as Methadone.
snip-

So please feel free to check out my M is for Methadone for more info on both methadone in general and my own take on the stuff, again, at:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id838/pg1/

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 12:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the
opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops,
and
so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese
were
allies.

yeah.. apparently the morphine shortage thing one of many myths
surrounding the creation of methadone. there WAS a morphine shortage
during among nazi germany during the war, but it had nothing to do with
the creation of methadone. methadone was invented with the intent of
creating a new anti-spasmotic drug, not a painkiller.. and it wasn’t used
as an analgesic till after the war ended.

nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.

for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:

http://www.indro-online.de/historymethadone.htm
http://www.ampainsoc.org/pub/bulletin/sep00/upda1.htm
http://www.drugtext.org/library/books/methandbook/history.htm

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Rachel- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 11, 2004 at 6:02:39 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sushi it is, Randy.  Hey, that’s raw?!?

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 5:05:11 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i stand humbly corrected from my earlier post.<

Hi Ron,
No need to be humble at all, I’m not ragging on you or anything even remotely like it, I’m just throwing out info I’ve come across over the years. You continue posting to your heart’s content, and I’ll continue reading what you post. If I’ve got a comeback, correction, agreement, or comment you be sure I’ll post with it. Please don’t let that make you hesitate ever to post with anything- if you were thinking along those lines, which you may not have been anyway, so blah, blah, blah.
;-)))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

to both jon and preston< i stand humbly corrected from my earlier post. thanks for  the “complete history lesson”.
still a great drug , heah?  ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 6:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

Jon wrote >nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.<

Yep, yer right about that Adolphine thing too, except I’m not sure about the 1970s bit but really haven’t any reason to doubt that, but I am pretty sure that Amidon was the “code” name for Polamidon, what became known as Methadone eventually:

from my dossier “M is for Methadone”:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id838/pg1/

snip-
One very common misconception is that Dolophine, one of the very first trade names given to the drug, was derived from “Adolph”, in honor of the dictator himself by the Nazis, and that in Germany it was called “Adolophine.” The fact of the matter seems to be this name was not given the drug until after the war, by the Eli-Lilly pharmaceutical company in America, which was given control of the drug.
If there was any honoring of Hitler going on, it was by the Americans who invented this urban legend. Dolophine most likely derives from the French words “dolor” (pain), and “fin” (end).
snip-
—–
Jon also wrote >for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:<

And you can also check out my M is for Methadone, which is followed by a whole bunch of links to further info.

btw, the Dolophine name was one of the very first trade names for Methadone, and it was patented as Polamidon on, get this, my birthday (well, on the same date, only a few years before my own special day), September 11, 1941:

snip-

On September 11, 1941, Bockmuhl and Ehrhart filed a patent application for, and were formally credited with, the discovery of Hoechst 10820 (Polamidon), which eventually became known as Methadone.
In the Autumn of 1942, I.G. Farben handed over the drug, codenamed “Amidon”, to the German military for further testing.
The Nazis did not make any attempt to mass produce the drug, unlike Pethidine, which by 1944 was being produced at an annual rate of 1600 kg. One reason for this was given by Dr. K K Chen, an early American researcher, after the war. He said that a former employee of the I. G. Farben factory had written him, saying that the Germans had discontinued Polamidon use due to its side effects. Chen decided that the Nazis had been giving their test subject doses that were too high, causing nausea, overdose, etc….
snip-
Eli-Lilly, along with other companies in the US and Great Britain, began clinical trials of Dolophine, marketing the drug as a pain killer and cough suppressant. In 1947, Isabel et al, published their findings after experimenting on both animals and humans. After giving doses of up to 200mg., four times a day, they found that there was rapid tolerance, and euphoria. They also discovered that there were a bevy of adverse side effects, such as, “signs of toxicity . . . inflammation of the skin . . . deep narcosis and . . . a general clinical appearance of illness.” Once again, just like the Nazis, the scientists were giving doses that were far too high.
Morphine addicts responded well to Dolophine, but authorities decided that it was potentially highly addictive. As reports of Dolophine addicts started coming in, thedrug was taken of the market, only to resurface in the 1960s, now known as Methadone.
snip-

So please feel free to check out my M is for Methadone for more info on both methadone in general and my own take on the stuff, again, at:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id838/pg1/

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 12:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the
opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops,
and
so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese
were
allies.

yeah.. apparently the morphine shortage thing one of many myths
surrounding the creation of methadone. there WAS a morphine shortage
during among nazi germany during the war, but it had nothing to do with
the creation of methadone. methadone was invented with the intent of
creating a new anti-spasmotic drug, not a painkiller.. and it wasn’t used
as an analgesic till after the war ended.

nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.

for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:

http://www.indro-online.de/historymethadone.htm
http://www.ampainsoc.org/pub/bulletin/sep00/upda1.htm
http://www.drugtext.org/library/books/methandbook/history.htm

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Rachel- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 11, 2004 at 4:14:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel, some of us just ain’t smart enough to eat cow food. Jeff is kinda like me. We work hard and sometimes the only thing that will do is a slaughtered animal. Goes back to the caveman days. You know I’m joking right? My taste for food changed a little after Ibo but I still wanted to eat meat and things deemed unhealthy. At this point he didn’t eat for 2 almost 3 days and it takes a while to get back to normal. Think about this. He’s a construction worker like me and when we eat lunch the fastest thing we can find is what we eat. Old eating habits are hard to break. LOL Get him some of the sushi we ate on the Frying Pan. That was a cool boat. And a cooler place to have a party.      Randy

From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 11, 2004 at 3:49:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m feeling conflicted about this as well, being the
caretaker who’s doing the shopping and the feeding.
On the one hand I could just give him the raw fruit
and the yogurt shakes I want to provide.  On the other
hand, he’s just been through this journey and has a
right to eat whatever he wants.  For example,
yesterday he was hungry for roast beef.  So sliced
dead cow it was.  And today he asked for Progresso
canned soup.  In my ideal world, I’d cook up brown
rice, detox tea, and veggie juice.  But the
codependent comfort factor is running high.

Lots of Love, Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine effects similar in some ways to EMDR?
Date: November 11, 2004 at 3:35:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Paula,

I can’t speak by experience to either modality.  But I
do know EMDR is a very valuable tool – very – for
integrating traumatic pasts.  It’s important to find a
well-trained therapist, and if possible one who has
had success in treating the issue you are focused on.
There is a Canadian national association which you’ve
probably already seen the page for,
http://www.emdrac.ca/

Hope your search for healing is improving.  I am
learning a lot about patience in this process –
trusting that the Eboga spirit moves at a cosmic pace
that my limited senses can’t perceive.

Much love, Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol
Date: November 11, 2004 at 12:35:14 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

randy:
i apppreciate your suggestions and apologize to all for my sarcastic responses.  i’m on a tight rope right now with dying father and not a benzo wise doc in sight.  the stress causes me to fire off things without thinking.  words have impact and influence those that hear them.  thanks for the thoughts, peace, ron
—– Original Message —–
From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

BRO, I DON’T WANT NO FREAKING SEIZURES. VALIUM TAPER ELIMINATES THAT.  NO ALCOHOL IN THIS BODY FOR 25 YRS.  RON
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 12:28:20 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

to both jon and preston< i stand humbly corrected from my earlier post. thanks for  the “complete history lesson”.
still a great drug , heah?  ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 6:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

Jon wrote >nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.<

Yep, yer right about that Adolphine thing too, except I’m not sure about the 1970s bit but really haven’t any reason to doubt that, but I am pretty sure that Amidon was the “code” name for Polamidon, what became known as Methadone eventually:

from my dossier “M is for Methadone”:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id838/pg1/

snip-
One very common misconception is that Dolophine, one of the very first trade names given to the drug, was derived from “Adolph”, in honor of the dictator himself by the Nazis, and that in Germany it was called “Adolophine.” The fact of the matter seems to be this name was not given the drug until after the war, by the Eli-Lilly pharmaceutical company in America, which was given control of the drug.
If there was any honoring of Hitler going on, it was by the Americans who invented this urban legend. Dolophine most likely derives from the French words “dolor” (pain), and “fin” (end).
snip-
—–
Jon also wrote >for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:<

And you can also check out my M is for Methadone, which is followed by a whole bunch of links to further info.

btw, the Dolophine name was one of the very first trade names for Methadone, and it was patented as Polamidon on, get this, my birthday (well, on the same date, only a few years before my own special day), September 11, 1941:

snip-

On September 11, 1941, Bockmuhl and Ehrhart filed a patent application for, and were formally credited with, the discovery of Hoechst 10820 (Polamidon), which eventually became known as Methadone.
In the Autumn of 1942, I.G. Farben handed over the drug, codenamed “Amidon”, to the German military for further testing.
The Nazis did not make any attempt to mass produce the drug, unlike Pethidine, which by 1944 was being produced at an annual rate of 1600 kg. One reason for this was given by Dr. K K Chen, an early American researcher, after the war. He said that a former employee of the I. G. Farben factory had written him, saying that the Germans had discontinued Polamidon use due to its side effects. Chen decided that the Nazis had been giving their test subject doses that were too high, causing nausea, overdose, etc….
snip-
Eli-Lilly, along with other companies in the US and Great Britain, began clinical trials of Dolophine, marketing the drug as a pain killer and cough suppressant. In 1947, Isabel et al, published their findings after experimenting on both animals and humans. After giving doses of up to 200mg., four times a day, they found that there was rapid tolerance, and euphoria. They also discovered that there were a bevy of adverse side effects, such as, “signs of toxicity . . . inflammation of the skin . . . deep narcosis and . . . a general clinical appearance of illness.” Once again, just like the Nazis, the scientists were giving doses that were far too high.
Morphine addicts responded well to Dolophine, but authorities decided that it was potentially highly addictive. As reports of Dolophine addicts started coming in, thedrug was taken of the market, only to resurface in the 1960s, now known as Methadone.
snip-

So please feel free to check out my M is for Methadone for more info on both methadone in general and my own take on the stuff, again, at:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id838/pg1/

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 12:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the
opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops,
and
so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese
were
allies.

yeah.. apparently the morphine shortage thing one of many myths
surrounding the creation of methadone. there WAS a morphine shortage
during among nazi germany during the war, but it had nothing to do with
the creation of methadone. methadone was invented with the intent of
creating a new anti-spasmotic drug, not a painkiller.. and it wasn’t used
as an analgesic till after the war ended.

nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.

for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:

http://www.indro-online.de/historymethadone.htm
http://www.ampainsoc.org/pub/bulletin/sep00/upda1.htm
http://www.drugtext.org/library/books/methandbook/history.htm

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From: Germán DC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] was For Faith- The Corporation
Date: November 11, 2004 at 12:07:14 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i saw the first part of the movie,
easy to watch, clear and simple.
i´m looking for the other two parts.(is in 3 parts)

gdc.
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 11:14 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] was For Faith- The Corporation

SlowOne, et al,

By any chance, have you read “The Corporation: The
Pathological Pursuit of Profit and Power”, by Joel
Bakan?  Seems pretty relevant to what you are speaking
about…

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Acomplia -New Diet/Anti-Smoking Pill
Date: November 11, 2004 at 11:46:36 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Anybody hear about this?  Sound familiar?

http://www.sun-sentinel.com/features/health/bal-te.superpill10nov10,0,633=
3232.story?coll=3Dsfla-news-health

It is the first diet drug aimed at blocking the “pleasure center” of the
brain and interfering with the cycle of craving and satisfaction that
drives many compulsive behaviors and addictions.

“Weight regulation is really kind of an addictive behavior,” said Dr.
Robert Eckel, an expert on metabolism from the University of Colorado
Health Sciences Center who had no role in the study.

Kinda interesting.

Best

ann

think@francomm.com

SNIP

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 11:27:38 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: phantom@digital.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Patrick?

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 22:53:56 -0800 =?Windows-1252?Q?Germ=E1n_DC?= <
gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar> wrote:
yes,
how?
gdc

—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 1:05 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

gdc, could you perhaps arrange with Patrick to put it on mindvox.

com?

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 17:16:57 -0800 =?iso-8859-1?Q?Germ=E1n_DC?= <

gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar> wrote:
yes, Preston
did you hear the interview with the Zulu Shaman?

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] was For Faith- The Corporation
Date: November 11, 2004 at 11:24:10 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I haven’t – there’s also the movie, which I’d like to see:

http://www.thecorporation.com/

On Thu, 11 Nov 2004 06:14:17 -0800 Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
wrote:
SlowOne, et al,

By any chance, have you read “The Corporation: The
Pathological Pursuit of Profit and Power”, by Joel
Bakan?  Seems pretty relevant to what you are speaking
about…

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron
Date: November 11, 2004 at 9:49:57 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

the rest goes, ” she’ll take care of you here at the counter”
it’s barbaric and everyone of these addiction bozo’s in my town refuse to follow the ashton method which has saved countless lives and careers in the uk and australia.  they laugh all the way to the bank.  i had a shrink i confided in, told him i had blue cross but was going to pay  so it would not go to the med. info computer.  it took him 15 mins to say he w/n help me…they say  i can’t which is dbl. speak. and instead of charging me the blue cross price which is discounted , tapped me for 300 for that 15 mins. sob should have his license lifted.,,  my best friend was a doc, a pathologist, the science of medicine. he’s dead now.  before he died he told me about the money md’s make and their fear of being sued.  ever hear a doc talk about the money she makes? they are ashamed of it. know any poor ones ? i don’t. thanks for the note ,ron
p.s. i d/n know what happened to that post i wrote b/c i w/n screwed up or high.  apologies to all.  d/n think i should be writing under the influence since this is a forum to save lives.  the members deserve our best game.
—– Original Message —– From: “knowone knowwhere” <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 9:43 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron

Try finding Florida’s Complaint form, I have found
that most doctors want to avoid the paperwork.
Conversation goes like this:
doc, I’d like to taper off my xanexanexSorry can’t do
that.

I’m not a doctor but can’t you like have seizers and
stuff if not tapered off?
*Yes. but you are asking for a controlled substance.

Hypothetically speaking, is their a complaint process
because no offense but your dicidecisionms
inhuinhumaned where do I go for this process.
*(the doc I saw said): DEA DEAl-lolck mate)

So your telling me that thietheir’t a state agency
that overoversee’s prescription writing practices of
doctors?
*well uhh.uhh
etc…
——
If that doesn’t work, some craccrackheadkie could find
some for you.  BenzBenzo’s a bitch to kick mahnmahn
hope you can find a way to taper.  I don’t think you
have to suffer unless you feel you have to.  Good
luck.

— Ron Davis <rwd3rwdx.net> wrote:
as an aside, no help from any local
addiaddictionologistfor benzbenzosd’smd’sten 25
seconds, then set up a
treatment protocol.  they follow the book.
i’mi’mscrewed on the benzbenzoser.  must suffer,
we’ewe’er
people you know.  i’vei’veen them the lancet,
ashtashtonu name it, it’s thiethierway or the
highway.  ronron>

___________________________________________________________
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: NSW methadone ‘census’ shows 70% receive take-aways, mean dose 75.5mg.
Date: November 11, 2004 at 9:49:00 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 10:53 PM
Subject: NSW methadone ‘census’ shows 70% receive take-aways, mean dose 75.5mg.

Dear Colleagues,

The NSW Health Department has released selected findings from a one-week ‘snap-shot’ survey from 2001 regarding methadone prescribing, dose levels, dispensed (take-away) doses and other demographics. I believe it is the first time such a ‘census’ of methadone prescribing has ever been done across an entire jurisdiction. See full text below.

When questioning the current rule on 4 take-away doses per week maximum with officers of the Health Department, I was encouraged to start a professional debate with colleagues on our experience with methadone and buprenorphine. In this way, using the available research literature we should be able to come to a consensus on best practice. In most states 2 and in several up to 5 take-away doses are permitted weekly for buprenorphine patients under appropriate conditions, parallel to methadone.

Congratulations to the NSW Centre for Drug and Alcohol for releasing this interim information. We look forward to more such information when it becomes available.

comments by Andrew Byrne ..

Dear Doctor,

Re: Methadone Takeaway Project.

You will recall that one of the initiatives of the 1999 NSW Drug Summit was the development of a project to monitor the takeaway prescribing practices of doctors. This became known as the methadone takeaway project. I am writing to thank you for your participation in the audit conducted as the first phase of this project, and to provide feedback on some of the findings.

The aim of the baseline study was to obtain comprehensive data on takeaway prescribing executed over a week in May 2001. I am pleased to report that 313 prescribers responded representing 93% of the eligible prescriber population with a total of 12,900 patients, not including methadone patients in the prison system. This is an excellent response rate and I am confident that the data provides a sound baseline from which to monitor and evaluate future patterns and trends in prescribing practices.

The main findings from the baseline study are:

Summary of the takeaway (TA) prescribing profile

No. of TA doses . . Patients (n) . . Patients (%) . . Average dose (mg)
0 _________________ 3861 _______ 29.8 ____________ 64.7
1 _________________ 630 ________ 4.9 _____________ 64.9
2 _________________ 1700 _______ 13.1 ____________ 66.3
3+ ________________ 6752 _______ 52.2 ___________ 74.2
All with TA doses __ 9082 _______ 70.2 ___________ 75.5
All on program _____ 12943 ______ 100.0 ___________ 73

77% of clients had a private prescriber and 23.3% had a public prescriber.

62% were male and 38% female, the average dose for males was 74.6mg and for females was 70.6mg.

An examination of dosing points indicates that 45% were dispensed at a pharmacy, 32% at a public clinic, and 23% at a private clinic.

As to be expected, the main days of takeaways were provided was Saturday and Sunday. The days of lowest use of takeaways were Monday and Friday.

Discussions with individual doctors regarding the prescribing of takeaways allowed the Department to further refine the NSW guidelines relating to the prescription of takeaways.

I appreciate that the drug treatment field can be a difficult and demanding area of professional practice and that your participation in the survey required demands of your time. I trust that the outcome has justified the effort and that the results are of interest to you.

I would again like to thank you for your cooperation in this important initiative to improve the quality of drug treatment in NSW.

Yours sincerely,

David McGrath,

Acting Director, Centre for Drug and Alcohol

October 2004.

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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] ibogaine effects similar in some ways to EMDR?
Date: November 11, 2004 at 9:42:00 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This am I was reading abstracts on Ibogaine, personal experiences etc. I have also been reading on EMDR and it’s use in Addictions, ptsd, etc.  There seem to be some similarities in activity/results. i.e. reduction in emotional response to childhood trama etc. Has anyone tried EMDR? Paula

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 9:35:40 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

jon, thanks for the history lesson.  it’s good to know where liquid hell comes from and to be histoically correct about it.  i stand corrected if your info is correct.  i got my info from a hardcopy journel, not the net so i may be wrong.  we all kmow the net is more reliable than written pubications. in any event, i’m here to learn .  it’s a wonderful drug isn’t it? ron
—– Original Message —– From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the
opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops,
and
so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese
were
allies.

yeah.. apparently the morphine shortage thing one of many myths
surrounding the creation of methadone. there WAS a morphine shortage
during among nazi germany during the war, but it had nothing to do with
the creation of methadone. methadone was invented with the intent of
creating a new anti-spasmotic drug, not a painkiller.. and it wasn’t used
as an analgesic till after the war ended.

nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.

for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:

http://www.indro-online.de/historymethadone.htm
http://www.ampainsoc.org/pub/bulletin/sep00/upda1.htm
http://www.drugtext.org/library/books/methandbook/history.htm

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] History of Methadone- Preston
Date: November 11, 2004 at 9:32:19 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Preston,

Thanks for the cool snippets- I really enjoy reading
the information that you post.

Please keep it coming…

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Martee- Raw Diet post-Ibo
Date: November 11, 2004 at 9:19:25 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Martee,

As usual, I enjoyed and agreed with your discussion of
sugar/insulin.  I am wondering if you have any
knowledge you would like to impart about Raw Diets.
For some reason, post-Ibo, I no longer have the same
nasty cravings for crappy substances: alcohol, coffee,
sugars, fast-food, and even excessive milk-products.
I want to heal my insides, and am wondering if a Raw
Diet would be a quick and effective means to achieve
this…

Thank you so much for your interesting and informative
input on this list…

Julie  🙂

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] was For Faith- The Corporation
Date: November 11, 2004 at 9:14:17 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

SlowOne, et al,

By any chance, have you read “The Corporation: The
Pathological Pursuit of Profit and Power”, by Joel
Bakan?  Seems pretty relevant to what you are speaking
about…

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Germán DC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith & PK
Date: November 11, 2004 at 8:30:22 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ok, Preston
that´s Icke.
and may say I mainly agree with you…

P A trick, some 279MB availables in mindvox?

gdc

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 9:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Icke is the one who writes that there are lizards in people suits really in control, right?
While I would personally never ever cite Icke as a source for a single thing I ever write ever, he is entertaining. He’s also one who insists that JFK’s driver shot him, if I’m remembering correctly, which is one of the sillier JFK assassination theories as far as I can tell.
Seems to me that Icke is one of the more dangerous researchers, in that he draws attention to serious issues and crimes, then completely denigrates any chance for serious concern or more research by others by bringing in the Lizards and more. I’ve always had a suspicion that folk like Icke are bought and paid for by the Lizards anyway, because the more silliness out there the more people say, “oh, that’s a silly conspiracy theory” when I myself mention things like CIA drug trafficking and the JFK assassination and the like. He seems to me to be more of an entertaining distraction from what could really be (and is) reported about the criminals in control.
But that said, every so often when tripping very hard, I’ve come to the conclusion that Icke is actually correct, that there’s just no way people could be as evil as they seem, that many of the talking heads and politicians and corporate crooks just HAVE to be lizards in people suits (I mean, take a look at Condoleeza Rice sometime- tell me she’s not a lizard in an ill-fitting people suit). Doesn’t make it true, and I’d not personally report that anywhere in seriousness, but still, I do wonder sometimes.
LOL!

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 8:15:56 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What interview with what Zula shaman? I’m sorry, I think I missed something.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Germán DC” <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 8:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

yes, Preston
did you hear the interview with the Zulu Shaman?
interesting thing to hear. 😉
gdc

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 7:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

>Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?<

LOL, lotsa love. Are you talking about the guy who thinks there really are lizards in people suits hanging about running things?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Germán DC” <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?
i have an almost complete interview with Credo Mutwa a Zulu Shaman, talking
about the origins of our humanity.
I can shared it thru messenger or p2p program.
Is VERY WORTH IT.
🙂
tell me if you like to get it.
germándc

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:46 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you
want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to
“faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment
like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s
anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white
men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by
profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate
conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions
be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical
industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based
medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1
or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you
can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for
repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in
maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike
Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business
for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same
companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention
medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at
wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly
earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much
Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or
methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with
narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the
billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of
the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history
(whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that?
In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one
not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues
from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal
friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship
with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves
when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”?
How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American
soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting?
For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as
killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals?
Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or
religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect
each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled
to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information as
you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide
funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need. He
might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he
promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops… oh
wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons
are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the
weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little
investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction,
wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (ot) Re: [Ibogaine] they live
Date: November 11, 2004 at 8:07:42 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

They Live has been playing on tv lately, late at night and in the weirder late afternoon hours too, on the higher up the scale channels. I saw that it the theater when it first came out as a teenager.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 5:24 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

preston,

that reminds me of a movie called : “They Live”. a cult classic.

On Wednesday, November 10, 2004, at 12:18 PM, Preston Peet wrote:

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?<

LOL, lotsa love. Are you talking about the guy who thinks there really are lizards in people suits hanging about running things?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is  often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Germán DC” <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?
i have an almost complete interview with Credo Mutwa a Zulu Shaman, talking
about the origins of our humanity.
I can shared it thru messenger or p2p program.
Is VERY WORTH IT.
🙂
tell me if you like to get it.
germándc

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:46 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you
want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that  accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem  to
“faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a  treatment
like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s
anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white
men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven  by
profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate
conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their  actions
be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the  pharmaceutical
industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant  based
medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1
or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you
can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for
repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in
maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms,  unlike
Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business
for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These  same
companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to  mention
medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at
wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on  quarterly
earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much
Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or
methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with
narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the
billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of
the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history
(whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall  that?
In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number  one
not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues
from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal
friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s  relationship
with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for  themselves
when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not  kill”?
How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead  American
soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and  counting?
For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as
killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals?
Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or
religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly  affect
each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled
to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information  as
you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide
funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need.  He
might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he
promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops…  oh
wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons
are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the
weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little
investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction,
wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 7:37:44 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Icke is the one who writes that there are lizards in people suits really in control, right?
While I would personally never ever cite Icke as a source for a single thing I ever write ever, he is entertaining. He’s also one who insists that JFK’s driver shot him, if I’m remembering correctly, which is one of the sillier JFK assassination theories as far as I can tell.
Seems to me that Icke is one of the more dangerous researchers, in that he draws attention to serious issues and crimes, then completely denigrates any chance for serious concern or more research by others by bringing in the Lizards and more. I’ve always had a suspicion that folk like Icke are bought and paid for by the Lizards anyway, because the more silliness out there the more people say, “oh, that’s a silly conspiracy theory” when I myself mention things like CIA drug trafficking and the JFK assassination and the like. He seems to me to be more of an entertaining distraction from what could really be (and is) reported about the criminals in control.
But that said, every so often when tripping very hard, I’ve come to the conclusion that Icke is actually correct, that there’s just no way people could be as evil as they seem, that many of the talking heads and politicians and corporate crooks just HAVE to be lizards in people suits (I mean, take a look at Condoleeza Rice sometime- tell me she’s not a lizard in an ill-fitting people suit). Doesn’t make it true, and I’d not personally report that anywhere in seriousness, but still, I do wonder sometimes.
LOL!

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Germán DC” <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?
i have an almost complete interview with Credo Mutwa a Zulu Shaman, talking
about the origins of our humanity.
I can shared it thru messenger or p2p program.
Is VERY WORTH IT.
🙂
tell me if you like to get it.
germándc

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:46 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you
want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to
“faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment
like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s
anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white
men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by
profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate
conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions
be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical
industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based
medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1
or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you
can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for
repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in
maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike
Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business
for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same
companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention
medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at
wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly
earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much
Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or
methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with
narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the
billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of
the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history
(whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that?
In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one
not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues
from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal
friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship
with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves
when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”?
How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American
soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting?
For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as
killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals?
Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or
religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect
each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled
to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information as
you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide
funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need. He
might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he
promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops… oh
wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons
are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the
weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little
investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction,
wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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[%]

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 7:12:47 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jon wrote >nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.<

Yep, yer right about that Adolphine thing too, except I’m not sure about the 1970s bit but really haven’t any reason to doubt that, but I am pretty sure that Amidon was the “code” name for Polamidon, what became known as Methadone eventually:

from my dossier “M is for Methadone”:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id838/pg1/

snip-
One very common misconception is that Dolophine, one of the very first trade names given to the drug, was derived from “Adolph”, in honor of the dictator himself by the Nazis, and that in Germany it was called “Adolophine.” The fact of the matter seems to be this name was not given the drug until after the war, by the Eli-Lilly pharmaceutical company in America, which was given control of the drug.
If there was any honoring of Hitler going on, it was by the Americans who invented this urban legend. Dolophine most likely derives from the French words “dolor” (pain), and “fin” (end).
snip-
—–
Jon also wrote >for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:<

And you can also check out my M is for Methadone, which is followed by a whole bunch of links to further info.

btw, the Dolophine name was one of the very first trade names for Methadone, and it was patented as Polamidon on, get this, my birthday (well, on the same date, only a few years before my own special day), September 11, 1941:

snip-

On September 11, 1941, Bockmuhl and Ehrhart filed a patent application for, and were formally credited with, the discovery of Hoechst 10820 (Polamidon), which eventually became known as Methadone.
In the Autumn of 1942, I.G. Farben handed over the drug, codenamed “Amidon”, to the German military for further testing.
The Nazis did not make any attempt to mass produce the drug, unlike Pethidine, which by 1944 was being produced at an annual rate of 1600 kg. One reason for this was given by Dr. K K Chen, an early American researcher, after the war. He said that a former employee of the I. G. Farben factory had written him, saying that the Germans had discontinued Polamidon use due to its side effects. Chen decided that the Nazis had been giving their test subject doses that were too high, causing nausea, overdose, etc….
snip-
Eli-Lilly, along with other companies in the US and Great Britain, began clinical trials of Dolophine, marketing the drug as a pain killer and cough suppressant. In 1947, Isabel et al, published their findings after experimenting on both animals and humans. After giving doses of up to 200mg., four times a day, they found that there was rapid tolerance, and euphoria. They also discovered that there were a bevy of adverse side effects, such as, “signs of toxicity . . . inflammation of the skin . . . deep narcosis and . . . a general clinical appearance of illness.” Once again, just like the Nazis, the scientists were giving doses that were far too high.
Morphine addicts responded well to Dolophine, but authorities decided that it was potentially highly addictive. As reports of Dolophine addicts started coming in, thedrug was taken of the market, only to resurface in the 1960s, now known as Methadone.
snip-

So please feel free to check out my M is for Methadone for more info on both methadone in general and my own take on the stuff, again, at:

http://www.disinfo.com/archive/pages/dossier/id838/pg1/

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 12:19 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the
opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops,
and
so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese
were
allies.

yeah.. apparently the morphine shortage thing one of many myths
surrounding the creation of methadone. there WAS a morphine shortage
during among nazi germany during the war, but it had nothing to do with
the creation of methadone. methadone was invented with the intent of
creating a new anti-spasmotic drug, not a painkiller.. and it wasn’t used
as an analgesic till after the war ended.

nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.

for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:

http://www.indro-online.de/historymethadone.htm
http://www.ampainsoc.org/pub/bulletin/sep00/upda1.htm
http://www.drugtext.org/library/books/methandbook/history.htm

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 11, 2004 at 2:14:36 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 23:21:45 -0800 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Eminem? … no this is just too ridiculous. …  Don’t just stand
there Dre
operate.          Randy

🙂

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Germán DC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 1:53:56 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yes,
how?
gdc

—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 11, 2004 1:05 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

gdc, could you perhaps arrange with Patrick to put it on mindvox.
com?

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 17:16:57 -0800 =?iso-8859-1?Q?Germ=E1n_DC?= <
gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar> wrote:
yes, Preston
did you hear the interview with the Zulu Shaman?

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] history of methadone. was: For Faith
Date: November 11, 2004 at 12:19:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the
opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops,
and
so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese
were
allies.

yeah.. apparently the morphine shortage thing one of many myths
surrounding the creation of methadone. there WAS a morphine shortage
during among nazi germany during the war, but it had nothing to do with
the creation of methadone. methadone was invented with the intent of
creating a new anti-spasmotic drug, not a painkiller.. and it wasn’t used
as an analgesic till after the war ended.

nother intersting tidbit i discovered just now… the name “Adolphine”
wasn’t coined until the 1970’s. Methadone was originally called Amidon by
the Nazis, and then in the late 40’s, Eli-Lilly pharmeceuticals gave it
the name “Dolophine”, not from Adolph, but from the Latin “dolor” for pain
and “fin” for end. which makes sense, seeing as Eli-Lilly is a US company.
It wasn’t till the 70’s that people in NYC started calling it “Adolphine”,
presumably to give it a negative connotation.

for futher reading on the history of methadone, check out:

http://www.indro-online.de/historymethadone.htm
http://www.ampainsoc.org/pub/bulletin/sep00/upda1.htm
http://www.drugtext.org/library/books/methandbook/history.htm

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Hannah/sugar
Date: November 11, 2004 at 12:00:38 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hannah,
A conversation on this subject usually involves a number of questions on both sides to get a more individualized plan.  I’ll try without going off on tangents which I am known to do.  Sugar cravings can come from eating sugar and too many starches because of how they digest with the insulin response.  Sugar digests immediately(mostly in the mouth) which is why sugar is looked at as quick energy. You get the energy and then it wears off leaving you with cravings for more, as well as lack of energy.  Coffee triggers the same insulin response.  Both tax your adrenals which is where the body draws it’s own energy.  When the body gets that from sugar and coffee the adrenals stop working as they should. You then rely on those substances to have any get up and go or drive to function.  Waking up tired means you can be hung over on what you ate the day before.  Basically carbs beget carbs. All this activity is also compromising your immune system as well as feeding yeast in the body. Yeast can also make you crave sugar as they want to be fed. Sugar also hits the same spot and mimics the same behavior as any other addictive substance in the brain.
It’s in everything because food mfgs know this.
When a person gets to this point all sugars can affect them adversly and set them craving and crashing including too much fruit.  All foods have a glycemic index.  That refers to the amount of sugar in them.  In fruits your berries are the lowest with bananas and grapes the highest.  I can react the same way to a bowl of grapes as I would to a bowl of hagen das.  Your vegeatables also have a glycemic index.  Greens are nonexistant while carrots and beets are high.  Drinking a carrot beet juice would not do me any good.everyone is different. Go by how you feel.
The five or six small meals or snacks is ideal.  Eating frequentlly keeps your blood sugar more level and maintains sanity and eliminates fatigue in some.  It’s also better for your digestion to not eat such large amounts at one time.  It can be an idea to cut out all sugar and refined white starches.  You need to read ingredients to be succesful with this as there can be a ton of sugar in some sauce that can set you off.  You can attempt some whole grains as long as they don’t set you off.  If they do then you need to cut them out initially till you get over the hump.  Or the other way is to eat only protein, fats and lot and lots of vegetables for 3 or 4 days and then slowly add in more whole grains to see what you can tolerate.  You usually have more energy and feel better after one day.  If you’re still craving after 3 days there are usually hidden sugars somewhere.  You’ll get your tastebuds back and you’ll notice how sweet vegetables taste.  Introduce fruit as a lone snack.  But the meal or snack before and after should have protein if needed.  You gauge by your energy level.  Artificial sweetners also set off the sugar cravings in the brain, as does that garbage sucralose.  The addictive aspect becomes real obvious when after not ingesting any sugar for a while(days,months,etc) and then you indulge one too many times, it triggers something in the brain that not only sets you off but in no time flat gets you back to the same mission you were on before you stopped.  I feel like this is not my best  as far as clarity and getting to the point  .  If you want more specifics give me an idea of what.   Martee— Original Message —–
From: Hannah Clay
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 2:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanks Preston

“One is that if all sugars are stopped for 3-4 days the cravings go away.”

How would you go about cutting out ALL sugars?  Sorry if I sound brainless but doesn’t just about everything include Sugar?  Like is fruit sugar just as bad?  Would you have to cut out fruit too?

I would LOVE to escape my chocolate and ice cream addiction!

Thanks for all this info-I would never have known otherwise,
Love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 3:52 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Thanks Preston

Preston,
Thank you for acknowledging this info which so many people shrug off as no big deal (take note Marc, my love). Lick the Sugar Habit is an extremely informative book. I have noticed over the years in myself and many others that sugar is as addictive as heroin if not more so.  There are so many correlations between the two in the brain and the body that leaves no doubt for me.  One is that if all sugars are stopped for 3-4 days the cravings go away.  That includes artificial replacements that trigger same brain activity and promote cravings. The madness that makes one run to the store at midnight for Hagen Das is gone. It brings this uncanny sense of peace when you realize you have control. What most people mistake as lack of willpower when it comes to sugar and refined carbs,is really something going on in the brain as well as the insulin cycle that happens which makes you crash and crave as well.  Sure you need to get proper protein and fats (no insulin response) as well as healthy carbs at the same time.
The food co’s know that sugar and the chemicals they put in food is addictive.  Just as the tobacco co’s always knew nicotine was addictive.  No nutrients plus sugar and chemicals breaking down the immune function leads to diease and a whole lot of folks getting pharaceuticals from their drs. who are romanced by the drug co’s. (yes I know there are exceptions). These chemicals (drugs can furthur tear down immune function (side effects).  And so it goes and so it goes.
Nothing matastacizes cancer quicker than sugar.  Which my observation starts with overgrowth of yeast and fungus(systemic), also sugar related.
As much as it sounds like my thing is health and nutrition it really is about people being empowered and not kept or turned out as victims.
Yes Julie, listen to your body, trust your intuition and learn and perceive what you can.  Use that same intuition in knowing who to trustwhen you go for help.
Take what you like and leave the rest.  No ones right about everything.  And no one will know you and your body as you can.  Self-reliance is a rush.
DH excellent advice.  It all goes hand in hand.
Martee

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 11:05:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

gdc, could you perhaps arrange with Patrick to put it on mindvox.
com?

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 17:16:57 -0800 =?iso-8859-1?Q?Germ=E1n_DC?= <
gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar> wrote:
yes, Preston
did you hear the interview with the Zulu Shaman?

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: November 10, 2004 at 11:03:05 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I agree it’s better to keep momentum, and would go on your gut
feeling about the person.

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 14:49:38 -0800 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
I guess I should quit trying to find a therapist who knows about
Ibogaine and
just get whomever and let them learn as I get better. I just can’t

believe
they don’t know or want to know about it.
Randy

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 10:50:31 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Wed, 10 Nov 2004 14:18:50 -0800 Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Are you talking about the guy who thinks there
really are lizards in people suits hanging about running things?

In a sense that’s what we all are – human beings built on mammals
built on reptiles. The “lizard brain” has to do with survival. Here’
s something interesting:

“Marking and guarding territory, establishing social hierarchy
through ritualistic displays of dominance, intraspecies fighting to
protect territory, hunting and hoarding, immediate retreat from or
attack against any foreign object. These are all common traits of
reptiles. They are also all too common business practices.” …

“The driving force of the pre-human brain is survival. Scarcity is
its eternal assumption; competition, its only rule. Almost all
behavior in the reptile brain is genetically programmed, single
response seeking air, food and water. There is pain and satiation,
but no pleasure. Aggression, but no anger. Waiting, but no patience.
Reptile brains don’t have options. They don’t change. They have no
past and no future. It is all now, in the moment. And they don’t
look out for anything but themselves.

Limbic (mammal) brains learn and have basic emotion. Survival is
still the paradigm and fear is the driving emotion. But they seek
more than food, air and water. Mammals can know some pleasure,
anger, loss. They usually have polar options in behavior–fight or
flight, nurture or abandon, obey or rebel. Limbic brains can do
some generalization, but they cannot do much with time. And these
brains cannot distort.

Human brain function (the frontal lobes) can distort, therefore it
can think about a future and alter past experiences into novel new
ideas. It can also create symbols (language) to represent reality.
So human brains can dream and fantasize. We can also worry. By
contrast, an antelope will not fear the lion that may show up
tomorrow. Humans can fantasize beasts that have never existed and
fret about it all day long.” [note that we are back where we
started :-]

http://www.alliesconsulting.com/resources/articles/reptilebiz.html

Kind of a relaxing picture of antelope psychology. I’m still
fretting about how hard we have it, tortured by imaginary futures.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 10:43:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Try finding Florida’s Complaint form, I have found
that most doctors want to avoid the paperwork.
Conversation goes like this:
doc, I’d like to taper off my xanexanexSorry can’t do
that.

I’m not a doctor but can’t you like have seizers and
stuff if not tapered off?
*Yes. but you are asking for a controlled substance.

Hypothetically speaking, is their a complaint process
because no offense but your dicidecisionms
inhuinhumaned where do I go for this process.
*(the doc I saw said): DEA DEAl-lolck mate)

So your telling me that thietheir’t a state agency
that overoversee’s prescription writing practices of
doctors?
*well uhh.uhh
etc…
——
If that doesn’t work, some craccrackheadkie could find
some for you.  BenzBenzo’s a bitch to kick mahnmahn
hope you can find a way to taper.  I don’t think you
have to suffer unless you feel you have to.  Good
luck.

— Ron Davis <rwd3rwdx.net> wrote:
as an aside, no help from any local
addiaddictionologistfor benzbenzosd’smd’sten 25
seconds, then set up a
treatment protocol.  they follow the book.
i’m
i’mscrewed on the benzbenzoser.  must suffer,
we’ewe’er
people you know.  i’vei’veen them the lancet,
ashtashtonu name it, it’s thiethierway or the
highway.  ron
ron>

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: November 10, 2004 at 10:31:00 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

tragically hip? ron
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 8:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare

I’ve been through therapy since 1977. Behavior Mod.. Gestalt, Ret,Rbt,12 step program for 10 years….. and so on. I’m doing this because I was told to. I’ll keep an open mind but I would say it will take 2 or 3 months to just get started and I won’t be around for very long, God willing and the creek don’t rise. I have to work on being angry at things that are inevitable. Can’t change objective reality. I can change what I think about it. I can avoid the major DICKS that come along in life. So I shall. Maybe I should be doing this in KY where they are big time into what Ibogaine has to offer. Hay seeds? Maybe. Big time open minded and intelligent? Yes. Wonder why they know about it in KY? All the methadone clinics have been so advised. I saw to it and they believe me. They are just waiting to see results. I AM NOT GOING TO USE!!!!! I would have by now. I had a great opportunity to do so and was sick at the thought of it. I lost my best friend in the world to stay clean. He saved my life but he’s using and he said shit to me I’ll never forget when I confronted him about it. I haven’t stayed clean this long since 95, and then I was forced to. I have Dr.’s from here to KY who will give me about what I want. Or used to want I should say.          Randy     PS I tried hypnosis too. I was hip mo dized. It didn’t work.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: November 10, 2004 at 10:05:48 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“I’m on a mission from God.” “Don’t you blaspheme in my house!” Aretha Franklin rules.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: November 10, 2004 at 10:01:19 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee, you did it again. I was just going through some rational self talk and came to the same conclusions. This guy tomorrow will be asked more questions then he will ask. And I am not afraid to say what is pertinent. Wish me luck.   Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: November 10, 2004 at 9:56:53 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve been through therapy since 1977. Behavior Mod.. Gestalt, Ret,Rbt,12 step program for 10 years….. and so on. I’m doing this because I was told to. I’ll keep an open mind but I would say it will take 2 or 3 months to just get started and I won’t be around for very long, God willing and the creek don’t rise. I have to work on being angry at things that are inevitable. Can’t change objective reality. I can change what I think about it. I can avoid the major DICKS that come along in life. So I shall. Maybe I should be doing this in KY where they are big time into what Ibogaine has to offer. Hay seeds? Maybe. Big time open minded and intelligent? Yes. Wonder why they know about it in KY? All the methadone clinics have been so advised. I saw to it and they believe me. They are just waiting to see results. I AM NOT GOING TO USE!!!!! I would have by now. I had a great opportunity to do so and was sick at the thought of it. I lost my best friend in the world to stay clean. He saved my life but he’s using and he said shit to me I’ll never forget when I confronted him about it. I haven’t stayed clean this long since 95, and then I was forced to. I have Dr.’s from here to KY who will give me about what I want. Or used to want I should say.          Randy     PS I tried hypnosis too. I was hip mo dized. It didn’t work.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 9:31:18 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i just want to be clean.  japs, nazis who cares
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 4:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

>methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the >opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops, and so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese were allies.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 12:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the opium crops.  the couldn’t make morphine so the came up with this wonderful drug. the best way to with draw from methadone is to use a heroin taper. unfortunately, most addicts can’t taper, myself included and our great gov’t has banned it’s use for ay medical purpose.  yet they allow methadone and oxycontin to be dispensed, both drugs being much more difficult to withdraw from than heroin.  methadone costs pennies a dose to make and is sold at clinics at a mark up  that would make the average consumer choke.   then of course there is the ama’s approach that any one seeking to come off drugs MUST SUFFER to some degree. got to pay for being “weak”.  addicts aren’t weak, they are strong, which is the problem. they keep using in face of incredible adversitiy lng after it has quit being fun. i sought ibo, which i will not use , to overcome a benzo dependence because no m.d. will detox me properly.   so far, i have only met one m.d. in my life who was not consumed with the fear of being sued and who would speak openly about the money he made.  m.d.’s are afraid to use ibo to treat opiate addiction b/c the fda and dea has not given the go ahead. they do not want to jeopordize the huge amount of money they make.  this is not to say that all are that way, i just have not met one.   the addictionologists i have met with are all afraid and all seem to follow the manual.  some are ex addicts, some are in it b/c it’s no work and easy dough.  they’ve picked my pocket time and time again, tried to farm me out to expensive rehab centers once they find out i’m a “professional”, and none of them has been willing to risk anything to help me. rwd, another weak link in the food chain
—– Original Message —– From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:22 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

I’m sorry Ibo didn’t seem to work for Marty, BUT- have you read all the glowing reports of Ibo success on this list?  I, for one, found Ibogaine extremely useful in kicking the habit.  You just have to be realistic- there is no single AMAZING CURE for narcotic addiction; there will inevitably be some suffering involved.  Ibo reduced my suffering by about 80-85%, in relation to what I have experienced previously.

There is no magic pill, no secret elixir, that will take away 100% of the symptoms, and believing otherwise is foolish and deluded.  In addition, taking Ibo unsupervised/on my own did NOTHING for me at all, except waste $425 dollars(Canadian).  I would highly recommend booking a treatment with someone experienced, compassionate and insightful.  There are many treatment providers throughout the world who could be of assistance to your son. Methadone is NOT the answer, but rather a temporary solution. It is more addictive than heroin, less fun, and completely numbing.  In retrospect, methadone made me feel like a zombie.

You are entitled to your own opinions politically and otherwise; however, to believe the government is actually going to approve Ibogaine for the treatment of narcotic addiction, is, quite simply, a foolish and misinformed notion.  Please do some research…

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] for Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 9:29:08 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

as an aside, no help from any local addictionologist for benzos.  md’s listen 25 seconds, then set up a treatment protocol.  they follow the book. i’m screwed on the benzos taper.  must suffer, we’er bad people you know.  i’ve given them the lancet, ashton, you name it, it’s thier or way or the highway.  ron
—– Original Message —–
From: knowone knowwhere
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 3:20 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] for Ron

Hi there Ron, I just wanted to let you know, I feel for you and what you wrote in the post.  I can only imagine the gravity of the situation post hurricane.  Peace to you and your family, -J

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: November 10, 2004 at 9:20:30 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,
Looking for a therapist for any reason at all can take you through 10 or 20 individuals before you find one that you feel can get to the meat of things for you. If they don’t want to know about the ibogaine or what you have been through, it sounds like lack of ability on their part.  Thank the universe for giving you the cues you need to not waste your precious time with an asshole! Don’t get discouraged. You give life to the negativity by acknowledging how much influence it has on your mindset.  Have faith that things are for right now as they should be and you are exactly where you need to be.  Have you tried someone that is an addiction specialist? Addiction, no matter what the substance or activity is mearly a symptom that is meant to numb,hide,disguise what’s really going on.  I would want someone who has some understanding of what goes on in the brain (technically) of an addict(or was willing to find out).  I would want someone that didn’t skeeve me out or give me doubts about my situation and had some apparent faith that they could work with me and were maybe even looking forward to it!
The bottom line is that you have the right to interview this person.  Maybe pose some questions to them that would give you some insight into their general take on things.  I believe a good therapist will help you to do the work to search within yourself what work you feel is needed rather than them having their own agenda of what and where you should be. They’re role would be to facilitate with just enough insight and imput.
Take a little time I’m sure you’ll come up with a brilliant set of questions to be able to determine if you’re on the right track and oh yeah, don’t forget about your gut!
There are tools and teachers everywhere. Be open to what the universe sends your way. I’ve stopped asking for things to come my way and instead have been in advance giving thanks for what is manifesting as I speak.  You’d be suprised how much more fruitful and productive your day can be with this mindset.
Randy I have the feeling that you are going to fare just fine. You got the POWER!
Martee

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 5:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare

I guess I should quit trying to find a therapist who knows about Ibogaine and just get whomever and let them learn as I get better. I just can’t believe they don’t know or want to know about it.                      Randy

From: “mark connors” <darkmattersfo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: November 10, 2004 at 8:17:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Though my treatment has been delayed I’ve continuted to develope my treatment team for both pre and post treatment care.  I am lucky in that some of the staff at the program I am going to know about Ibogaine and eagerly await to see how it turns out. At the same time, I’m finding that I have to do some education on the subject. To that end, I’ve copied articles, etc. to a CD that I can distribute to those who are really interested. Good luck on finding a good therapist. It helps to know a little about the different theoretical approaches so you can decide which one you want to try. I have  Jungian/Budhist therapist that is working out wonderfully, but I had to rotate through many before I found him.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: Wed, 10 Nov 2004 17:49:38 EST

I guess I should quit trying to find a therapist who knows about Ibogaine and
just get whomever and let them learn as I get better. I just can’t believe
they don’t know or want to know about it.                      Randy

_________________________________________________________________
Get ready for school! Find articles, homework help and more in the Back to School Guide! http://special.msn.com/network/04backtoschool.armx

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From: Germán DC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 8:16:57 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yes, Preston
did you hear the interview with the Zulu Shaman?
interesting thing to hear. 😉
gdc

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 7:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

>Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?<

LOL, lotsa love. Are you talking about the guy who thinks there really are lizards in people suits hanging about running things?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Germán DC” <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?
i have an almost complete interview with Credo Mutwa a Zulu Shaman, talking
about the origins of our humanity.
I can shared it thru messenger or p2p program.
Is VERY WORTH IT.
🙂
tell me if you like to get it.
germándc

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:46 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you
want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to
“faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment
like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s
anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white
men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by
profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate
conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions
be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical
industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based
medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1
or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you
can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for
repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in
maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike
Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business
for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same
companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention
medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at
wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly
earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much
Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or
methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with
narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the
billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of
the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history
(whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that?
In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one
not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues
from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal
friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship
with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves
when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”?
How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American
soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting?
For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as
killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals?
Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or
religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect
each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled
to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information as
you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide
funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need. He
might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he
promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops… oh
wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons
are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the
weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little
investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction,
wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Aftercare
Date: November 10, 2004 at 5:49:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I guess I should quit trying to find a therapist who knows about Ibogaine and just get whomever and let them learn as I get better. I just can’t believe they don’t know or want to know about it.                      Randy

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 5:46:15 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

well, logistically the production of methadone was easier, no importing to deal with, which was probably the main issue.

_.dh

On Wednesday, November 10, 2004, at 12:22 PM, Preston Peet wrote:

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops, and so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese were allies.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 5:24:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

preston,

that reminds me of a movie called : “They Live”. a cult classic.

On Wednesday, November 10, 2004, at 12:18 PM, Preston Peet wrote:

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?<

LOL, lotsa love. Are you talking about the guy who thinks there really are lizards in people suits hanging about running things?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Germán DC” <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?
i have an almost complete interview with Credo Mutwa a Zulu Shaman, talking
about the origins of our humanity.
I can shared it thru messenger or p2p program.
Is VERY WORTH IT.
🙂
tell me if you like to get it.
germándc

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:46 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you
want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to
“faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment
like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s
anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white
men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by
profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate
conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions
be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical
industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based
medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1
or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you
can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for
repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in
maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike
Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business
for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same
companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention
medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at
wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly
earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much
Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or
methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with
narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the
billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of
the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history
(whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that?
In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one
not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues
from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal
friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship
with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves
when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”?
How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American
soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting?
For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as
killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals?
Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or
religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect
each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled
to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information as
you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide
funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need. He
might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he
promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops… oh
wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons
are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the
weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little
investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction,
wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 5:22:53 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the opium crops.<

Wha?
Ummm, actually the Japanese controlled one hell of a lot of poppy crops, and so far as I remember from my history lessons, the Germans and Japanese were allies.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Ron Davis
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 12:53 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the opium crops.  the couldn’t make morphine so the came up with this wonderful drug. the best way to with draw from methadone is to use a heroin taper. unfortunately, most addicts can’t taper, myself included and our great gov’t has banned it’s use for ay medical purpose.  yet they allow methadone and oxycontin to be dispensed, both drugs being much more difficult to withdraw from than heroin.  methadone costs pennies a dose to make and is sold at clinics at a mark up  that would make the average consumer choke.   then of course there is the ama’s approach that any one seeking to come off drugs MUST SUFFER to some degree. got to pay for being “weak”.  addicts aren’t weak, they are strong, which is the problem. they keep using in face of incredible adversitiy lng after it has quit being fun. i sought ibo, which i will not use , to overcome a benzo dependence because no m.d. will detox me properly.   so far, i have only met one m.d. in my life who was not consumed with the fear of being sued and who would speak openly about the money he made.  m.d.’s are afraid to use ibo to treat opiate addiction b/c the fda and dea has not given the go ahead. they do not want to jeopordize the huge amount of money they make.  this is not to say that all are that way, i just have not met one.   the addictionologists i have met with are all afraid and all seem to follow the manual.  some are ex addicts, some are in it b/c it’s no work and easy dough.  they’ve picked my pocket time and time again, tried to farm me out to expensive rehab centers once they find out i’m a “professional”, and none of them has been willing to risk anything to help me. rwd, another weak link in the food chain
—– Original Message —– From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:22 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

I’m sorry Ibo didn’t seem to work for Marty, BUT- have you read all the glowing reports of Ibo success on this list?  I, for one, found Ibogaine extremely useful in kicking the habit.  You just have to be realistic- there is no single AMAZING CURE for narcotic addiction; there will inevitably be some suffering involved.  Ibo reduced my suffering by about 80-85%, in relation to what I have experienced previously.

There is no magic pill, no secret elixir, that will take away 100% of the symptoms, and believing otherwise is foolish and deluded.  In addition, taking Ibo unsupervised/on my own did NOTHING for me at all, except waste $425 dollars(Canadian).  I would highly recommend booking a treatment with someone experienced, compassionate and insightful.  There are many treatment providers throughout the world who could be of assistance to your son. Methadone is NOT the answer, but rather a temporary solution. It is more addictive than heroin, less fun, and completely numbing.  In retrospect, methadone made me feel like a zombie.

You are entitled to your own opinions politically and otherwise; however, to believe the government is actually going to approve Ibogaine for the treatment of narcotic addiction, is, quite simply, a foolish and misinformed notion.  Please do some research…

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 5:18:50 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?<

LOL, lotsa love. Are you talking about the guy who thinks there really are lizards in people suits hanging about running things?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Germán DC” <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:12 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?
i have an almost complete interview with Credo Mutwa a Zulu Shaman, talking
about the origins of our humanity.
I can shared it thru messenger or p2p program.
Is VERY WORTH IT.
🙂
tell me if you like to get it.
germándc

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:46 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you
want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to
“faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment
like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s
anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white
men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by
profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate
conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions
be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical
industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based
medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1
or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you
can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for
repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in
maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike
Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business
for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same
companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention
medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at
wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly
earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much
Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or
methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with
narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the
billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of
the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history
(whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that?
In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one
not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues
from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal
friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship
with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves
when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”?
How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American
soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting?
For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as
killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals?
Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or
religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect
each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled
to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information as
you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide
funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need. He
might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he
promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops… oh
wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons
are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the
weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little
investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction,
wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 4:25:54 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks for this, preston.

Drug smuggling is an age old practice, and reaches well beyond third world drug lords, ruthless smugglers and scoundrel dealers, it finds it’s way into private business as well as government and the worlds biggest banking corporations. Its roots in america was during the opium wars of the 1800’s (and the popularity of opiate based “cure-alls of that era) – altho the british are infamous for that one, a certain group of financiers & sea merchants based out of connecticut also had a huge hand in the opium import/export business. These same folks also founded the Skull & Bones Society, whose members take a pledge of death and destruction upon their initiation. And we know the current politicians (and corporate big-shots) who are members of that society.

A whole lot of ‘weapons for drugs’ covert ops happened in the 50’s in southeast asia (pre-Vietnam) as well.

_.dh

On Wednesday, November 10, 2004, at 04:48 AM, Preston Peet wrote:

In reply to which I post the following excerpt:

http://www.drugwar.com/pcatchintel.shtm

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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] for Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 4:20:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi there Ron, I just wanted to let you know, I feel for you and what you wrote in the post.  I can only imagine the gravity of the situation post hurricane.  Peace to you and your family, -J

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!

From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 10, 2004 at 3:58:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“I have no reason to hide” ; )
One thing that really amazed me was the conviction of people in Texas prison still supporting W.  Very difficult for me to understand.

Faith, I do agree that calling people ‘dumb’ or whatever doesn’t usually lead to changing hearts and minds, but I’m curious what you mean by ‘higher laws’.  Does one particular religion determine that?  I’ve been turning on Trinity Broadcasting Network to try to figure out where these people are coming from and it just really saddens my heart.  If those are the people we are putting faith in, then we are fucked.  They glamorise the Apocalypse (another word for jehad) in the same commercial as kid cartoons, literally.  And ‘faith’ seems to be directly related to pledging.  I had no idea that running mascara lady was still around but she is lol, absolutely amazing.  The point I had to turn it off in disgust was when the preacher said while turning in one place “look at me I’m turning, come turn with God today”.  Then the camera switches to the studio audience and they all turn in place too, like some evangelical hooky poky.
I went to a ‘christian’ school and live in Texas.  I have NO PROBLEM with people practising their faith, but when that faith teaches to go out and convert the world because what they believe is the only way, to me that is arrogant.  And what is even more arrogant then that is the attempt to convert those who are ‘evil’ through war.  War breeds war.  And who the hell gets to decide who is and isn’t ‘evil’? ‘God’?  Does that not sound just A LITTLE like OBL, who by the way we haven’t caught yet, but we are ‘kicking ass’ in Fallujah, like the ‘victory’ will win anything.  In Texas, the lines between the rich and poor are VERY obvious.  The Halliburton job fair ($100,000 for a year in Iraq) had lines around the building 4 days in a row, because, well, gotta eat right?  Dallas police, well, you probably already know ’bout that.  We have underfunded schools.  State social services are being cut at record levels.  I lost my already approved funding for college due to these cuts.  Where is the compassion in government saying it’s not my problem let the Church’s deal with it.  I’m picturing God saying “sorry, that’s not my department”.

And I’m curious how you know a person’s ‘true character’?  You may know God’s true character, but W’s?  Is asking difficult questions during ‘wartime’ (pssst…it’s war not designed to succeed) an act of evil?

“being good to evil people” is not what is trying to happen.  I believe very much in ‘learn thy enemy’.  Isn’t that the best way to ‘win’?  Or do you still think bombs and bullets can change the hearts and minds of people who obviously feel very strongly in their cause.

Do you think America can win on it’s own?

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!
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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 3:11:39 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It never seems to end:  just when you think “Yay!
we got rid of Ascroft as Attorney-general!”, the idiot Bush nominates
Alberto Gonzales to replace him.
Gonzales is the author of the memorandum that said the
international laws relating to prohibition of torture of prisoners of
war could be ignored in the case of the Guantanamo Bay detainees.  Of
course, this is pure nonsense, and evil as well.  There is no
“non-uniformed ” exception for the torture prohibition in the Geneva
Convention, and this guy Gonzales was purely making up that whole lie
to appease Ashcroft, and evidently Bush as well.  Bush rewards this
war crimes perpetrator by nominating him for Attorney-General, despite
the fact that a Federal Judge only last week struck down the whole
Guantanamo memorandum as violative of international law.  This shows
Bush’s absolute disdain for the Geneva Convention, international law,
and the federal judiciary, and his incredible support for torture as a
legitimate form of behavior.  Bush can only be construed as a war
criminal, and we must protect ourselves from further violations of
his.
I urge all of you to start contacting your Senators regarding
Gonzales, and directing them to both completely question the record of
this evil malefactor, and to absolutely oppose his nomination to the
Cabinet post of Attorney General.  He is absolutely unqualified, both
on legal and moral grounds, and we need to send a message to the world
that we do not tolerate people who are soft on torture as the top, or
bottom, prosecutors and head of the Justice Department in the United
States of America.

=====
End the oppression of cannabis and its consumers.
b_jb2001

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: The Garden [mailto:GardenRestaurant@comcast.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 16:54
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war  and  the use of depleted uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy  to do your homework and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium, Death children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq,  privatisation of irak, You will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:54:13 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

GOT IT , THANKS, RON
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron

Ron,

In case you haven’t already done so, I would advise
consulting the Ashton Manual, also on the link I sent
you…

J.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:50:46 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

BRO, I DON’T WANT NO FREAKING SEIZURES. VALIUM TAPER ELIMINATES THAT.  NO ALCOHOL IN THIS BODY FOR 25 YRS.  RON
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:26:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith, he will need firm resolve and all the help he can get. Ibogaine is the answer. Of course a person has to want to be clean for any mode to work. You can’t force someone to be clean, just ask my Mom. Took me 20 years. I’m glad I lived long enough, a lot of people don’t.      Randy

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:16:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron,

In case you haven’t already done so, I would advise
consulting the Ashton Manual, also on the link I sent
you…

J.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine]Ibogaine and alcohol
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:16:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I wish I had known about this when I quit drinking in 94. Detox from alcohol really sucked. I almost had full blown D.T.’s. I went from junkie to drunky to junkie again in the span of 3 years. Is there any data on Ibogaine and alcohol withdrawal? How ’bout using phenobarb and dilantin for the seizures if they come up? Pre Ibo of course. Keep a level and go for broke. Beats the hell out of being sprung on booze. Been there done that. I have a lot of friends in the recovery field who would like this kind of information.     Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 1:57:15 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’M ON IT . THANKS FOR THE THOUGHT.
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 12:45 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron

Ron,

I found a page that contains a number of medical
abstracts re: benzo detox and withdrawal.  There is
also a forum, in which you can post and speak with
other people who have already, or are planning to,
detox from benzos.

http://www.benzo.org.uk/abstracts.htm

Preliminary studies have suggested that GHB is
effective in the treatment of alcohol dependance, and
as far as I understand, there are some similarities
between alcohol withdrawal and benzo withdrawal.

I wish you the best of luck….

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 1:45:56 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron,

I found a page that contains a number of medical
abstracts re: benzo detox and withdrawal.  There is
also a forum, in which you can post and speak with
other people who have already, or are planning to,
detox from benzos.

http://www.benzo.org.uk/abstracts.htm

Preliminary studies have suggested that GHB is
effective in the treatment of alcohol dependance, and
as far as I understand, there are some similarities
between alcohol withdrawal and benzo withdrawal.

I wish you the best of luck….

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 1:42:24 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ALL PUBLIC RECORD, DON’T WANT TO GO BACK, SPENT 20 YRS. HELPING GUYS LIKE US BUT CAN’T HELP MYSELF. PM ME OFF FORUM AND I’LL SPEAK FREELY. MESSAGE COMING YOUR WAY
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 12:37 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Ron

Ron, I see you made it to the big house.              Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Ron
Date: November 10, 2004 at 1:37:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ron, I see you made it to the big house.              Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 1:34:15 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith, I kicked methadone in 93 without Ibogaine and I never did feel right. With it I had a chance. No addict in the world is going to stay sick for 3 months and thats how long it takes to feel better. Methadone is the hardest opiate in the world to kick. I waited and studied a year before I took the Ibo treatment. It was well worth it. By the time I studied for a year I was more than ready for the change.         Randy

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 12:53:51 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

methadone was made by the nazis in ww2 because the allies controlled the opium crops.  the couldn’t make morphine so the came up with this wonderful drug. the best way to with draw from methadone is to use a heroin taper.  unfortunately, most addicts can’t taper, myself included and our great gov’t has banned it’s use for ay medical purpose.  yet they allow methadone and oxycontin to be dispensed, both drugs being much more difficult to withdraw from than heroin.  methadone costs pennies a dose to make and is sold at clinics at a mark up  that would make the average consumer choke.   then of course there is the ama’s approach that any one seeking to come off drugs MUST SUFFER to some degree. got to pay for being “weak”.  addicts aren’t weak, they are strong, which is the problem. they keep using in face of incredible adversitiy lng after it has quit being fun. i sought ibo, which i will not use , to overcome a benzo dependence because no m.d. will detox me properly.   so far, i have only met one m.d. in my life who was not consumed with the fear of being sued and who would speak openly about the money he made.  m.d.’s are afraid to use ibo to treat opiate addiction b/c the fda and dea has not given the go ahead. they do not want to jeopordize the huge amount of money they make.  this is not to say that all are that way, i just have not met one.   the addictionologists i have met with are all afraid and all seem to follow the manual.  some are ex addicts, some are in it b/c it’s no work and easy dough.  they’ve picked my pocket time and time again, tried to farm me out to expensive rehab centers once they find out i’m a “professional”, and none of them has been willing to risk anything to help me. rwd, another weak link in the food chain
—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 11:22 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

I’m sorry Ibo didn’t seem to work for Marty, BUT- have you read all the glowing reports of Ibo success on this list?  I, for one, found Ibogaine extremely useful in kicking the habit.  You just have to be realistic- there is no single AMAZING CURE for narcotic addiction; there will inevitably be some suffering involved.  Ibo reduced my suffering by about 80-85%, in relation to what I have experienced previously.

There is no magic pill, no secret elixir, that will take away 100% of the symptoms, and believing otherwise is foolish and deluded.  In addition, taking Ibo unsupervised/on my own did NOTHING for me at all, except waste $425 dollars(Canadian).  I would highly recommend booking a treatment with someone experienced, compassionate and insightful.  There are many treatment providers throughout the world who could be of assistance to your son.  Methadone is NOT the answer, but rather a temporary solution. It is more addictive than heroin, less fun, and completely numbing.  In retrospect, methadone made me feel like a zombie.

You are entitled to your own opinions politically and otherwise; however, to believe the government is actually going to approve Ibogaine for the treatment of narcotic addiction, is, quite simply, a foolish and misinformed notion.  Please do some research…
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 12:22:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith,

I’m sorry Ibo didn’t seem to work for Marty, BUT- have you read all the glowing reports of Ibo success on this list?  I, for one, found Ibogaine extremely useful in kicking the habit.  You just have to be realistic- there is no single AMAZING CURE for narcotic addiction; there will inevitably be some suffering involved.  Ibo reduced my suffering by about 80-85%, in relation to what I have experienced previously.

There is no magic pill, no secret elixir, that will take away 100% of the symptoms, and believing otherwise is foolish and deluded.  In addition, taking Ibo unsupervised/on my own did NOTHING for me at all, except waste $425 dollars(Canadian).  I would highly recommend booking a treatment with someone experienced, compassionate and insightful.  There are many treatment providers throughout the world who could be of assistance to your son.  Methadone is NOT the answer, but rather a temporary solution. It is more addictive than heroin, less fun, and completely numbing.  In retrospect, methadone made me feel like a zombie.

You are entitled to your own opinions politically and otherwise; however, to believe the government is actually going to approve Ibogaine for the treatment of narcotic addiction, is, quite simply, a foolish and misinformed notion.  Please do some research…
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 12:16:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you nailed that one on the head. resolve, intention, determination and perhaps a gentle push from the iboga spirits.

Peace,
_.dh
On Wednesday, November 10, 2004, at 06:22 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

I think at some point, the addiction, if it’s ever kicked, will have to be done with no help other than for him to have a firm resolve within him that he’s going to stop.

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 12:04:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As i understand it, the hold-up is because there’s some type of
disagreement
to who has rights to Ibogaine.  Marty did use it once, and said it didn’t
help, except make him sick and have black clouds over him for a few days.
I’m not so sure, at this point, if the ONLY answer is just to stop with no
help.  He goes to the Methadone clinic, now, and believes that is the only
answer, but I’ve not seen that he’s got a good job, finising school, or
doing things that would help him be a better citizen.  I think at some
point, the addiction, if it’s ever kicked, will have to be done with no
help
other than for him to have a firm resolve within him that he’s going to
stop.   I know it’s legal in Canada and  other countries, but there’s
still
addiction.  Thanks for the info.  Faith

well.. it’s like the old lightbulb joke…

how many psychiatrists does it take to change a light bulb?

only one, but it takes a long time and the light bulb has to want to change.

ibogaine is considerably faster than psychotherapy, and some therapists
feel ibogaine could be used to speed up therapy, but in the end, it’s
still up to the individual’s motivations.

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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 11:22:55 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As i understand it, the hold-up is because there’s some type of disagreement to who has rights to Ibogaine.  Marty did use it once, and said it didn’t help, except make him sick and have black clouds over him for a few days.  I’m not so sure, at this point, if the ONLY answer is just to stop with no help.  He goes to the Methadone clinic, now, and believes that is the only answer, but I’ve not seen that he’s got a good job, finising school, or doing things that would help him be a better citizen.  I think at some point, the addiction, if it’s ever kicked, will have to be done with no help other than for him to have a firm resolve within him that he’s going to stop.   I know it’s legal in Canada and  other countries, but there’s still addiction.  Thanks for the info.  Faith

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 18:46:49 -1000

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to “faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history (whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that? In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”? How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting? For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals? Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information as you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need. He might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops… oh wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction, wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

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From: Germán DC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 11:12:42 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dave:
do you know David Icke, a british journalist?
i have an almost complete interview with Credo Mutwa a Zulu Shaman, talking
about the origins of our humanity.
I can shared it thru messenger or p2p program.
Is VERY WORTH IT.
🙂
tell me if you like to get it.
germándc

—– Original Message —–
From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 10, 2004 1:46 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you
want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to
“faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment
like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s
anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white
men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by
profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate
conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions
be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical
industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based
medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1
or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you
can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for
repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in
maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike
Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business
for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same
companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention
medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at
wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly
earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much
Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or
methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with
narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the
billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of
the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history
(whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that?
In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one
not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues
from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal
friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship
with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves
when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”?
How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American
soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting?
For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as
killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals?
Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or
religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect
each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled
to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information as
you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide
funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need. He
might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he
promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops… oh
wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons
are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the
weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little
investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction,
wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

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From: “The Garden” <GardenRestaurant@comcast.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 10:54:22 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Faith

You have to be fully responsible for the name you choose to carry :
Faith.
I am a christian and I am not afraid to say : a catholic.

So in my mind as a Christian : war  and  the use of depleted uranium are
not an option.
In my humble opinion , you have realy  to do your homework and do some
research on Internet using words like : D U depleted uranium, Death children
irak ,UN sanction, Alliburton, Oil iraq,  privatisation of irak, You will be
amazed 😉

God bless you and all the members of this list
Francis

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 9:48:42 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

DH wrote in a valient attempt to pass on real knowlege to Faith, in hopes something finally breaks through and starts the thinking going, >Now don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world.<

In reply to which I post the following excerpt:

http://www.drugwar.com/pcatchintel.shtm

snip-

The CIA Practice of Recruiting Drug-Financed Armies
Prof. Peter Dale Scott also wrote a response to the HPSCI report, in which he wrote “this latest deception cannot be written off as an academic or historical matter. The CIA’s practice of recruiting drug-financed armies is an on-going matter.”[9]

(image)
Professor Peter Dale Scott; Peet

Scott, a Professor Emeritus at Berkeley campus, University of California, prolific author, and a former Canadian diplomat from 1957 to 1961, has spent years studying and reporting on drug-trafficking connections of the CIA and other US government agencies. Knowing that the HPSCI report is full of lies and misrepresentations, Scott is at a loss as to how this report could have been authorized for release by the Committee, and voiced serious concerns about the staff of the HPSCI. “Well, they were headed by this guy who just committed suicide, (Chief of Staff John Millis), who not only was ex-CIA, he’d actually been working with Gulbuddin Hekmatyer in Afghanistan, (as part of CIA covert operations assisting in the fight against the Soviets in the late 70s and early 80s, while Hekmatyar moved tons of opium and smack). He may not have known about the Contra-drug connections, but he certainly knew about some CIA-drugs ties. I don’t think it was an accident that they picked someone from that area to sit over the staff either. I mean, this was one of the most sensitive political threats that the CIA had ever faced.”[10] John Millis, a 19-year veteran of the CIA, was found dead of “suicide” in a dingy hotel room in Vienna, Virginia, just outside of Washington, DC, June 3, 2000, less than a month after the release of the HPSCI report.

The CIA released it’s own report in two parts, the Hitz Report, Vol. 1 in January, 1998, and Vol. 2, in October, 1998,[11] (within hours of the vote by Congress to hold impeachment hearings over Clinton’s lying about a blow job), which examined the allegations of CIA protecting and facilitating, and participating directly in drug trafficking. There were numerous examples contained therein, particularly in Vol. 2, of just how much the CIA really knew about the drug trafficking of its “assets,” and admitted to knowing. But by the time the report was released to the public, the major news outlets, “the regular villains,” as Scott calls them, had already denigrated the story for 2 years, attacking and vilifying Webb, instead of investigating the facts themselves.

“The Washington Post, the New York Times, and the Los Angeles Times, all insisted that the Contra-cocaine was minor, and could not be blamed for the crack epidemic. As the [Hitz/CIA, and DoJ] government investigations unfolded, however, it became clear that nearly every major cocaine smuggling network used the Contras in some way, and that the Contras were connected- directly or indirectly- with possibly the bulk of cocaine that flooded the United States in the 1980s,” wrote one journalist who has covered this story extensively, from the very start.[12]

“This has been the case since the beginning. The strategy of how to refute Webb is to claim that he said something that in fact he didn’t say. The Committee didn’t invent this kind of deflection away from the truth, they just followed in the footsteps of the New York Times, and the Washington Post, and they in turn may have been following in the footsteps of the CIA to begin with, but I don’t know,” said Scott.[13] “The Committee was originally created to exert Congressional checks and restraints on the intelligence community, in accordance with the spirit of the Constitution. For some time it has operated instead as a rubber-stamp, deflecting public concern rather than representing it.”[14]

CIA/DoJ Memorandum of Understanding

Saturday, October 10th, 1998, anyone watching CNN that morning might havecaught a brief mention of the release of the Hitz Report, Vol. 2. CNN reported that the CIA acknowledged it knew of at least 58 companies and individuals involved in bringing cocaine into the US, and selling cocaine to US citizens, to help fund the Contra war in Nicaragua, while they were working for the CIA in some capacity.

March 16, 1998, Fred Hitz, then-Inspector General of the CIA, had already told US Representatives at the sole Congressional hearing on the first half of this report, Hitz Vol. 1, that the CIA had worked with both companies, and different individuals that it knew were involved in the drug trade.[15] I.G. Hitz went on to say that the CIA knew that drugs were coming into the US along the same supply routes used for the Contras, and that the Agency did not attempt to report these traffickers in an expeditious manner, nor did the CIA sever it’s relationship with those Contra supporters who were also alleged traffickers.

One of the most important things Hitz testified to was that William Casey, Director of the CIA under President Ronald Reagan, and William F. Smith, US Attorney General at that time, in March 1982 signed a “Memorandum Of Understanding,” in which it was made clear that the CIA had no obligation to report the allegations of trafficking involving “non-employees.” Casey sent a private message to A.G. Smith on March 2, 1982, in which he stated that he had signed the “procedures,” saying that he believed the new regulations struck a “…proper balance between enforcement of the law and protection of intelligence sources and methods….”[16] This was in response to a letter from Smith to Casey on Feb. 11, 1982 regarding the new Executive Order of President Reagan’s that had recently been implemented, (E.O. 12333), issued in 1981, which required the reporting of drug crimes by US employees.[17]

With the MOU in place, the CIA, in cooperation with the Department of Justice, changed the CIA’s regulations in 1982, redefining the term “employee” to mean only full-time career CIA officials. The result of this was that suddenly there were thousands of people, contract agents, employees of the CIA, who were no longer called employees. Now they were people who were, “employed by, assigned to, or acting for an agency within the intelligence community.”[18] Non-employees, if you will.

According to a memo sent to Mark M. Richard, the Deputy Assistant Attorney General/Criminal Division, of the USA, on the subject of CIA reporting of Drug Offenses, dated February 8, 1985, this meant, as per the 1982 MOU, that the CIA really was under no obligation to report alleged drug violations by these “non-employees.”[19]

Juan Matta Ballesteros and SETCO

It is pure disinformation for the HPSCI to print, “CIA reporting to DoJ of information on Contra involvement in narcotics trafficking was inconsistent but in compliance with then-current policies and regulations. There is no evidence however that CIA officers in the field or at headquarters ever concealed narcotics trafficking information or allegations involving the Contras.”[20]

“On April 29, 1989, the DoJ requested that the Agency provide information regarding Juan Matta Ballesteros and 6 codefendants for use in prosecution. DoJ also requested information regarding SETCO, described as ‘a Honduran corporation set up by Juan Matta Ballesteros.’ The May 2 CIA memo to DoJ containing the results of Agency traces on Matta, his codefendants, and SETCO stated that following an ‘extensive search of the files and indices of the directorate of Operations …There are no records of a SETCO Air.'”[21] Matta, wanted by the DEA in connection with the brutal 30-hour torture and murder of one of their agents, Enrique Camarena, in Mexico in February 1985, and who Newsweek magazine described, May 15, 1985, as being responsible for up to a third of all cocaine entering the US,[22] was a very well known trafficker, so it is ludicrous to suggest that the CIA hasn’t covered-up evidence of drug trafficking by assets, even from their own investigators.

Juan Ramón Matta Ballesteros

“I mean, this is different than the MOU, which said the CIA was under no obligation to volunteer information to the DoJ,” said Scott. “It never said the CIA was allowed to withhold information from the DoJ. In the case of SETCO, they were asked for the information, and the CIA replied falsely that there was none. The Hitz people tried to find out how this could have happened, and one person said I just didn’t know about SETCO, but that is impossible. If people like me knew about SETCO, how could they not? Because the SETCO thing was a big thing.”[23] Matta’s SETCO airline was one of four companies that, although known by the US Government to be engaged in drug-trafficking, in 1986 were still awarded contracts by the US State Department with the Nicaraguan Humanitarian Assistance Organization, (NHAO). These companies were flying weapons and supplies in to the Contras, then drugs back to the US, on the same aircraft, with the knowledge of CIA officials. Matta was protected from prosecution until his usefulness to the Contra efforts came to an end. Then he was arrested, tried and convicted in 1989, the same year Manuel Noriega was removed from office in Panama by US troops, and arrested for trafficking.

The CIA Admits to Shipping a Ton of Cocaine to US Streets

The Contra-CIA drug trafficking was no anomaly, but rather normal operating procedure for US Intelligence, particularly the CIA, and for the US government, while they actively perpetuate the War on Some Drugs.

Rep. Maxine Waters, (D-CA), in a speech in the House of Representatives on March 18, 1997, outlined various reports of CIA drug trafficking complicity. Noting a New York Times article dated November 20, 1993, she stated that “the CIA anti-drug program in Venezuela shipped a ton of nearly pure cocaine into the USA in 1990. The CIA acknowledged that the drugs were sold on the streets of the USA….Not one CIA official has ever been indicted or prosecuted for this abuse of authority.” Rep. Waters continued, calling it a “cockamamie scheme.” She described how the CIA had approached the DEA, who has the authority over operations of this nature, and asked for their permission to go through with the operation, but the DEA said “No.” The CIA did it anyway, explaining later to investigators that this was the only way to get in good with the traffickers, so as to set them up for a bigger bust the next time.[24]

(image)
Rep. Maxine Waters (D-CA)

In late 1990, CIA Agent Mark McFarlin and Gen. Ramon Guillen Davila of the Venezuelan National Guard, sent an 800 pound shipment of cocaine to Florida, where it was intercepted by US Customs at Miami International Airport, which lead to the eventual indictment of Guillen in 1996 in Miami, FL, for trafficking 22 tons of cocaine into the city of Miami.[25] Gen. Guillen was the former chief Venezuelan anti-drug cop. “Speaking from his safe haven in Caracas, Guillen insisted that this was a joint CIA-Venezuelan operation aimed at the Cali cartel. Given that Guillen was a long time CIA employee, and that the drugs were stored in a Venezuelan warehouse owned by the CIA, the joint part of Guillen’s statement is almost certainly true, although the ‘aimed at’ part is almost certainly false.”[26]

“That is the case that has gone closest to the heart of the CIA, because the CIA actually admitted to the introduction of a ton [of cocaine onto US streets]. The man was indicted for 22 tons, and [some people said] that his defense was that the CIA approved all of it,” Scott said, recalling the audacity of the case.[27] For the very same Nov. 20, 1993 NYTimes article mentioned in Rep. Waters’ speech, “the spin the CIA gave the Times was that it was trying to sting Haiti’s National Intelligence Service (SIN) – which the CIA itself had created.”[28]

snip-

9- “Drug, Contras, and the CIA: Government Policies and the Cocaine Economy- An Analysis of Media and government Response to the Gary Webb Stories in the San Jose Mercury News, (1996-2000),” by Peter Dale Scott, Ph.D.. From The Wilderness Publications, June 2000, pg. 47

10- interview with Peter Dale Scott by Preston Peet, July 24, 2000

11- “Allegations of Connections Between CIA and the Contras in Cocaine Trafficking to the United States, (96-0143-IG), Volume 1: The California Story,” January 29, 1998, Office of the Inspector General, Central Intelligence Agency, (classified and unclassified versions), and “Allegations of Connections Between CIA and the Contras in cocaine Trafficking to the United States, (96-0143-IG), Volume II: The Contra Story,” October 8, 1998, Office of the Inspector General, Central Intelligence Agency, (classified and unclassified versions).

12- “Congress Puts Contra-Coke Secrets Behind Closed Doors,” by Robert Parry, IF Magazine, July/August 1999, pg. 19. Parry was instrumental in breaking the Contra-cocaine connections in the early 80s, including winning the George Polk award for Journalism in 1984 for reporting on the CIA assassination/torture manual given to the Contras, and wrote, along with Brian Barger, the very first published article on Oliver North’s connection to the secret Contra-supply operations on June 10, 1985, and the first story linking the Contra’s to drug running on Dec. 20, 1986, while working for the Associated Press.

13- op cite 10- Scott interview

14- op cite 9- “Drugs, Contras, and the CIA,” by Scott (emphasis added)

15- Testimony of CIA Inspector General Fredrick P. Hitz, Before the House Permanent Select Committee on Intelligence, On the CIA OIG Report of Investigation, (Hitz) “Vol 1: The California Story,” March 16, 1998

16- Memo to William French Smith, Attorney General, Department of Justice of the USA, from William J. Casey, Director of Central Intelligence, dated March 2, 1982, obtained at www.copvcia.com

17- Memo from William F. Smith, Attorney General, Department of Justice of the USA, to William Casey, Director of Central Intelligence, dated February 11, 1982, obtained at www.copvcia.com

18- As noted in the lawsuit Lyons vs. CIA, Class Action Lawsuit On Behalf of Victims of the Crack Cocaine Epidemic, filed March 15, 1999, in Oakland, and simultaneously in Los Angeles

19- Memo to Mark M. Richard, the Deputy Assistant Attorney General of theUSA, from A.R. Cinquegrana, the Deputy Counsel for Intelligence Policy, dated February 8, 1985, subject: CIA Reporting of Drug Offenses

20- op cite 1, HPSCI report, May, 2000, pg. pg. 42

21- “Selected Excerpts With Commentary” by Michael C. Ruppert, from “The Central Intelligence Agency Inspector General Report of Investigation, Allegations of Connections Between CIA and the Contras in Cocaine Trafficking to the United States- Vol. 2: The Contra Story (declassified version),” released October 8, 1998, published by From the Wilderness publications

22- op cite 9, “Drugs, Contras, and the CIA,” Scott, pg. 7

23- op cite 10- Scott interview. SETCO was the airline owned by known drug trafficker Juan Mattas Ballestaros, who Newsweek, on May 15, 1985, estimated was responsible for up to one third of all cocaine reaching the US at that time. SETCO was just one of the 58 companies and individuals mentioned by the Hitz report.

24- Speech of Representative Maxine Waters in the House of Representatives, March 18, 1997.. Was televised on C-Span, also see “Anti-drug Mission Turns Sour”, Adams, David, St. Petersburg Times, Jan. 26, 1997, p. A1

25- “Whiteout- The CIA, Drugs, and the Press,” by Alexander Cockburn, 1998, Verso Press, pg. 96

26- “Drug War- Covert Money, Power, and Policy,” by Dan Russell, 1999, Kalyx.com, pg. 450

27- op cite 10- Scott interview

28- op cite 26- “Drug War,” Russell, pg. 451

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 11:46 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to “faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history (whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that? In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”? How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting? For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals? Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

remainder snipped-

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 10, 2004 at 9:35:00 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

However, I have read that Ibo is an SSRI antagonistic.  The pills
like Paxil stop the reuptake of serotonin thus leaving more
serotonin for your brain to use.  I have read that Ibo is a
serotonin antagonist, I could be wrong.

I believe it increases serotonin, in any case. Which would explain
the feeling of well-being it leaves behind.

Do you by any chance take Paxil?  Maybe that is why you had some ”
really rough” times on Ibogaine.  We seem to be at odds in as much

as you think Ibo increases serotonin and I think it is a serotonin

antagonist.

Howard knows the studies.. Paxil was ok but left me unmotivated.

Ibogaine, like most psychedelics, is a partial serotonin agonist. It has
been found to increase serotonin levels in the nucleus accumbens and
striatum (Broderick, Phelan, Eng, and Wechsler, 1994; Ali et al, 1996),
and to reduce serotonin levels in the medial prefrontal cortex (Benwell et
al. 1996).

The nucleus accumbens is thought to be a primary site involved in the
pleasure-reward circuit, while the medial prefrontal cortex is thought to
be involved in planning, motivation, memory and fear, and acts as a relay
in the reward circuit.

Most addictive drugs reduce serotonin in the nucleus accumbens while
increasing dopamine; the opposite of actions of ibogaine.

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 10, 2004 at 8:07:36 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Ron,

I agree with you, it is a forum for survival.
You have to understand that you will need to take time out
From work to get over the benzo’s.
But If you are willing to do that I will try to help you as much as I can
And maybe there are people on this forum who could sponsor you on your
Survival Journey.

Don’t give up , here are more people who didn’t give up and now are happy
for it.

At least the sun is shining and it is warm where you are. Here it is
The cold we have to keep out the door.

All the best,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ron Davis [mailto:rwd3@cox.net]
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 6:36
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and
avarage IQ’s?

she has a good heart, but she’s a republican and bush baby. can’t help it.
this is not a political forum or maybe i’m in the wrong place.  i’m trying
to save my life. screw politicians…they are all on their estates or
ranches recovering from spending all that money.  i still d/n have phone
service from ivan  which hit in september.  and my hurricane deductible is
3200.00 us which will pay for 1/2 of my roof which is missing thanks to
jeb’s policy w/ the insurance companies in fla.  chump change for fat cat’s.

this is a forum for survival.  watch cross fire for the other stuff.  my
dad’s dying, i’m losing a career and i’ve got a benzo habit a mile long that

‘ll kill me when they cut me off.  get real folks and like me a freakin
candle cuz i have no way out. rwd3
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 9:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and
avarage IQ’s?

hahahahahahaha,  that was funny.  Faith, are you for
real????????????????  I mean, really……..R U 4
REAL!!!!!!!!!!

Julie 🙂

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 03:30 PM, Faith
Bowling wrote:

They are in accord with NBC, CBS,  ABC, Whoopi

mohahahahahahah! you mean those news agencies that
still somewhat honor
investigative reporting…

instead of neo-con slanted & opinion based “news”
like FNC?

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 10, 2004 at 4:04:16 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Who would party on Ibogaine? Yak fest 2004!!!!              Randy

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:52:22 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith, people who say deliberately provocative things on the net
are called trolls, because like mythical trolls (that live under
bridges), they try to draw people into fruitless arguments. You are
so unusual and apparently naive for this list that it is hard to
tell if you are for real. My impression is that you are for real,
and that you are really unable to think critically about the Bush
administration. Think of it this way – you represent a blind
acceptance of evil to many here, just as they might seem the same
to you. I tend to think you are well-intentioned, but sadly misled.
However you may be right in implying that the IQ stuff is bogus.

Folks, give her a break. If she’s for real the best hope is that
she’ll learn something if not under attack, and if she were a troll
better to ignore anyway.

On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 17:17:38 -0800 Faith Bowling <bchloej@hotmail.
com> wrote:
I have no reason to hide.

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results

and
avarage IQ’s?
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 15:31:04 -0500 (EST)

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web
right
after
the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a
high IQ and
a
low level of moral development.

isn’t there a bridge you should be hiding under?

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:35:32 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Maybe some of us are just sensitive to whatever – I can’t stomach
much alcohol since my 20’s, or caffeine. Pure ibo is the easiest on
the stomach, generally. The other alkaloids come in different
proportions depending on the root bark and the extraction method.

On Tue, 09 Nov 2004 05:59:15 -0800 Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Hi SlowOne,

You have raised a few interesting and relevant points.  My
boyfriend was my sitter, and he observed within me what appeared
to be constant abdominal muscular tension- twisting, discomfort,
nausea, and inevitably vomiting.  Of all the lingering sensations
post-Ibo, an upset stomach/digestive tract was the most noticeable;

in fact, my diet has changed tremendously to accomodate this
effect and hopefully improve upon it.  I used to enjoy 3-4 cups of

coffee per day whilst on opiates- now that I’m clean, I’m lucky if

I can stomach 1 cup, and even then it is not very enjoyable.

The same applies to alcohol- I just have NO desire to drink.  Just

thinking about imbibing is usually enough to give myself transient

nausea.  Not that I’m complaining or anything- it feels great not
to crave booze.

I’m wondering if the different types of Ibo preparations(HCL, root

bark, alkaloid extract) all have the same effect on the digestive
tract/stomach.  I think Howard once said that his best Ibo
experience came from the alkaloid extract- now why that is, I can’
t quite remember.

Julie

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:29:29 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 22:55:10 -0800 Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com> >
However, I have read that Ibo is an SSRI antagonistic.  The pills
like Paxil stop the reuptake of serotonin thus leaving more
serotonin for your brain to use.  I have read that Ibo is a
serotonin antagonist, I could be wrong.

I believe it increases serotonin, in any case. Which would explain
the feeling of well-being it leaves behind.

Do you by any chance take Paxil?  Maybe that is why you had some ”
really rough” times on Ibogaine.  We seem to be at odds in as much

as you think Ibo increases serotonin and I think it is a serotonin

antagonist.

Howard knows the studies.. Paxil was ok but left me unmotivated.

hope everything is going alright for you.

Yes, thanks – you too.

SlowOne

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:21:45 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Eminem? Just wait a minute here. He is undermining society? Eminem? He gots a good groove but, no this is just too ridiculous. Don’t you think he has put a concerted effort into appealing to teenage angst. Your kids are the ones who want to hear his music, whats that tell you.    Don’t just stand there Dre operate.          Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: Goofballs
Date: November 10, 2004 at 2:14:32 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Goofballs down home were speed and downers. Pennwalt made a mixture of biphetamine and Quaalude. The speed always hit the hardest. Got an A on a biology final once on one of those things. I wouldn’t have passed the course if I hadn’t. Anyone see that they just found out that kids are abusing Ritilin. DUHHHHHHHHHHHHH they have been doing that for years.                            Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 10, 2004 at 1:30:12 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy,

Ibogaine  will not do the trick for everyone who is an idiot, I have seen so many people who are just too stubborn, who think it is in their Horoscope
To be that way and their right to treat others (even their own kids ) like shit. They are arrogant and show no respect to anyone.
They will give Ibogaine as a party drug and have no idea about their egotistic way of life.
For some ibogaine is just another drug.

Be well,

Sara
Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Verzonden: woensdag 10 november 2004 1:10
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought

How much Ibogaine would it take to purge the idiocy from your average skull and crossbones guy? For Bush I’d say start with a 25mg. per kg. test dose and then give him ’bout 2 fitty per kg.           This is not a test it is a joke.      Why do I feel like someone is looking over my shoulder?      Randy

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 10, 2004 at 12:39:53 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Dave I want to say I love your art and you,
Patrick, Preston, are people who have always given me
a lot of inspiration and hope. I also want to say I
was disgusted by Faith’s messages about abortion and
the holier than thou morality is I don’t know what it
is, maybe he is normal for people who live in middle
america? Someone voted for Bush so who knows it
doesn’t make any sense to me.

What I have to disagree with is some of what you said,
Howard did patent a plant he filed a series of patents
on it. I don’t disagree with what you’ve written here
and yes obviously the war is about money and power,
that’s all.

What I don’t agree with is that it’s any better under
the democrats. Nobody cares about drug addicts at all,
except other drug addicts. I don’t think dragging in
god, halliburton or anything else changes that.

I’ve always found hope and inspiration here and now I
feel everyone is beating up on Faith who came here to
get help for his son. I think he is a horribly closed
minded pinhead who’s idea of morality makes me sick
but then he is here reading and writing to this list
because his son needs help.

Drug addiction the great equalizer, it doesn’t care
who your parents are or how you voted.

Only my opinions, I am physically sick at the thought
of what the country I live in is becoming, Nazi
germany does come to mind and it disgusts me more then
I can say that if there wasn’t fraud that more then
half the people in the country I live in buy this
bullshit or don’t care and only want to exploit the
whole world and get rich. I wouldn’t give Faith 5
minutes of my time but if I could help his son I still
would.

Carla B

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is
an addict and you
want to help him, where-ever that help may come
from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political
regime you seem to
“faithfully” support would never in a thousand years
allow a treatment
like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well
of it’s
anti-addictive and healing properties? You see,
these powerful white
men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or
there) are driven by
profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be
compassionate
conservatives and whole variety of other nice
things, but their actions
be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is
the pharmaceutical
industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not
interested in plant based
medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine
that treats with 1
or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their
medicines. But you
can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in
their clutches for
repeat business, for as long as possible. They are
interested in
maintenance medicines, which often times only mask
the symptoms, unlike
Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are
not in business
for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by
profit. These same
companies off-load proven harmful or expired
medicines (not to mention
medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third
world countries at
wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little
graphs on quarterly
earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I
wonder how much
Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the
dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or
cocaine or
methadone. They could care less about your son’s
struggles with
narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the
day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably
counted in the
billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush
resided over one of
the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling
rings in US history
(whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way).
Do you recall that?
In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now
don’t tell me George
senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows
quite a but about
what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he
was spook number one
not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W”
takes his cues
from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two
are close personal
friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to
God’s relationship
with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that
out for themselves
when the time comes. But didn’t God once say…
“Thou shall not kill”?
How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now?
1200 Dead American
soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and
children? and counting?
For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust]
war is the same as
killing her/him with your own hands. Does that
reflect high morals?
Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s
foriegn or domestic or
religious policies… or maybe it is, as those
policies directly affect
each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do,
however, feel compelled
to put some facts on the table and you may do with
this information as
you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking
him to provide
funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to
those in need. He
might even make you an automated promise to look
into it, like how he
promised to support the continued ban of assault
weapons. Oooops… oh
wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47
type assault weapons
are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his
mind that the
weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies
notorious little
investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief
from his addiction,
wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 10, 2004 at 12:35:58 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

she has a good heart, but she’s a republican and bush baby. can’t help it. this is not a political forum or maybe i’m in the wrong place.  i’m trying to save my life. screw politicians…they are all on their estates or ranches recovering from spending all that money.  i still d/n have phone service from ivan  which hit in september.  and my hurricane deductible is 3200.00 us which will pay for 1/2 of my roof which is missing thanks to jeb’s policy w/ the insurance companies in fla.  chump change for fat cat’s. this is a forum for survival.  watch cross fire for the other stuff.  my dad’s dying, i’m losing a career and i’ve got a benzo habit a mile long that ‘ll kill me when they cut me off.  get real folks and like me a freakin candle cuz i have no way out. rwd3
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 9:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?

hahahahahahaha,  that was funny.  Faith, are you for
real????????????????  I mean, really……..R U 4
REAL!!!!!!!!!!

Julie 🙂

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 03:30 PM, Faith
Bowling wrote:

> They are in accord with NBC, CBS,  ABC, Whoopi

mohahahahahahah! you mean those news agencies that
still somewhat honor
investigative reporting…

instead of neo-con slanted & opinion based “news”
like FNC?

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Faith
Date: November 9, 2004 at 11:46:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith,

You say you are here because you have a son who is an addict and you want to help him, where-ever that help may come from, is that accurate?

Have you considered for a moment that the political regime you seem to “faithfully” support would never in a thousand years allow a treatment like Ibogaine to become legalized? Knowing full well of it’s anti-addictive and healing properties? You see, these powerful white men (and a token non-white cabinet person here or there) are driven by profit, and nothing else. Oh, they claim to be compassionate conservatives and whole variety of other nice things, but their actions be-lie their words.

You see, one of the Bush regimes biggest backers is the pharmaceutical industry. The pharmaceutical industry is not interested in plant based medicinals, especially so a medicine like ibogaine that treats with 1 or 2 or 3 or 4 doses. They want patents on their medicines. But you can’t patent a plant! They want want consumers in their clutches for repeat business, for as long as possible. They are interested in maintenance medicines, which often times only mask the symptoms, unlike Ibogaine which illuminates the root causes. They are not in business for humanitarian reasons, they are driven purely by profit. These same companies off-load proven harmful or expired medicines (not to mention medicines that do not meet FDA standards) to third world countries at wholesale prices, which adds to their pretty little graphs on quarterly earnings reports for their share-holder meetings. I wonder how much Vioxx is being shipped offshore at this very moment?

They could care less for the well-being or the dignity of those in need.

They could care less for my addiction to heroin or cocaine or methadone. They could care less about your son’s struggles with narcotics or alcohol or whatever his flavor of the day is.

Their bottom line is the dollar bill. Preferably counted in the billions.

Remember, as vice-president to Reagan, Daddy Bush resided over one of the largest CIA run “Bullets for Blow” smuggling rings in US history (whom Mr Kerry fought hard to expose, by the way). Do you recall that? In the height of the 1980’s crack epidemic? Now don’t tell me George senior didn’t know about that one, Daddy Bush knows quite a but about what goes on in the cia-covert world. Remember, he was spook number one not that long ago. Now consider for a moment who “W” takes his cues from?  God? Karl Rove? James Baker? The latter two are close personal friends and fellow businessmen of Daddy Bush. As to God’s relationship with the Bush family, well, I’ll let them sort that out for themselves when the time comes. But didn’t God once say… “Thou shall not kill”? How many deaths has [p]resident W resided over now? 1200 Dead American soldiers? 10,000 innocent Iraqi men, women and children? and counting? For surely to send a soldier to die in [an unjust] war is the same as killing her/him with your own hands. Does that reflect high morals? Does that reflect compassion?

Perhaps this isn’t the best forum for BushCo’s foriegn or domestic or religious policies… or maybe it is, as those policies directly affect each and everyone of us, sooner or later.

I am not here to stir shit up with you, I do, however, feel compelled to put some facts on the table and you may do with this information as you wish. Maybe you ought to write W a letter asking him to provide funding and support legislation to bring Ibogaine to those in need. He might even make you an automated promise to look into it, like how he promised to support the continued ban of assault weapons. Oooops… oh wait, he let that one slip and now Uzi and AK-47 type assault weapons are available again. Gee, it must have slipped his mind that the weapons manufacturers are closely tied to Daddies notorious little investment group known as Carlyle.

In any event, I truly hope your son finds relief from his addiction, wether it is thru ibogaine or some other means.

Peace,
_.Dave

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From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 9, 2004 at 11:22:39 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 7:04 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

The girl who is running the study is I,m sure doing her best. Something that is privately funded by an individual who has alot of other projects, and dreams is a bit uncertain I suppose.  The girl was very good and seems determined to do the best she can, but ….I’ll just thought oh look something I can do, and then despite jumping through the hoops, finding a therapist, saving all my holidays, planning alternate activities I can do instead of looking at the bottom of a bottle every night.  Trying to fill every hole, cross every “T”.  The rules keep changing nothing is certain, the end is not in sight.  I grew up in that situation all those things bring back the despair. Can’t ever be good enough feeling yet again.   But I think that what they are doing is beneficial if they do manage to do a proper study it might help to get Ibogaine more available for more people….that would be a good thing….Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 3:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Paula,
Just another thought,  The AA group you went to sound like it can be counterproductive to quitting.  Maybe you should try a different group or redirect  the conversation to their non slip moments if that’s what you need to hear.  We’re all different. It doesn’t mean their story will be your story.  Don’t get hung up on statistics.  The human equation is left out.  Although if you wanted to, statistically speaking the odds are in your favor because in a group of 5 that have all relapsed, they are due for a success story and that would be you!   Also did the study group people cancel on you three times?  I would suggest making them accountable for their actions and holding them up against a wall(Figurativly) and letting them know (in a tactfull way) what this disruption means to you.  Especially when it is so important a plan for you to implement.  You never know what a little assertion will get you and if nothing else you have the facts, or could appeal to someone’s humanity that might get you what you need. At least you’re not harboring feelings of rejection and not being worthy that need to be drowned out by alcohol.   I may be telling one of my stories and not even close to yours, so don’t take offense if that’s the case. While a “study” can mean free or low cost it still doesn’t give someone the right  to reneg like that.
Stay strong, stay focused,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 7:19 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Hi everyone from Vancouver:  I was supposed to have done the ibogaine but due to changes to the structure of the study the date has moved to January now.  I’m becoming uncertain as to wether it will happen or not as this is the third time that something has changed and it seems that my proverbial bad luck keeps on going…so I am in a position of spinning my wheels yet again.  At the beginning I was so hopeful and arranged a counselor, started feldencrais classes, started taking fish oil capsules etc….well do I just go into the hospital and go thru detox there and hope it will hold until January ( if the study ever happens) or do I try to get a supply of the Ibogaine, figure out the guidelines, ensure I have people to monitor me etc.  I am only addicted to alcohol, but have a social anxiety disorder secondary to childhood abuse.  So life has so many triggers that would send me back to drinking to sooth myself.  Ibogaine offers me a chance to get over those past events and move on. I am a nurse so I do understand how to go about it and both of the family members are reliable and have some first aid experience.  My ECG and liver panel are OK, I’m fifty years old and general health is stable. Ibogaine is not illegal in Canada…and I can’t afford to go to another country to get a supervised clinical setting.  I went to a couple of AA meetings as there is a small group (5 people) of women that meet here, last week listening to the stories of repeat detox, repeat lapsed etc. made me feel very desparate thinking “Oh my god, I just want to move on and it sounds like talk therapy, will take forever with me detoxing and lapsing over and over, maybe better to just go back to being a closet alchoholic and give up……any help that can be offered would be appreciated……depressed in Vancouver (Paula)

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 10:42:10 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i dropped out of hs in the 10th grade,10 yrs. later i got a ged and went to the local community college.  i then went to law school. my father was a school bus driver and mother a secretary for 43 yrs.  i’m smarter than bush….why couldn’t i go to yale?
—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 7:19 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?

I should’ve known better than to even resond to anyone here.

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 11:01:05 -1000

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 10:00 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a low level of moral development.

hmmm. I’d say anyone who supports pre-emptive war for corporate profit has about the lowest morals possible.

Like maybe a president who has one of the lowest IQ’s of any president in US history, who graduated Yale with barely a C average, is an alcoholic, feels ordained by God to do as he will, and sends young men and women off to war to secure oil fields for his sponsors, those same young men and women facing death everyday in the Iraqi Dust, under the bullshit guise of bringing freedom and democracy to the middle east? The same president who failed in every business venture he got his grimy little paws on (except for his successful looting of Harkin)? Now he’s failing again (and again) but people like YOU JUST DON’T GET IT.

_.dh

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala- Martee
Date: November 9, 2004 at 10:38:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee,

May I ask what type of ibo preparation you took?  I am
wondering if the HCL is particularly rough on the
stomach, or perhaps I am just sensitive…

Either way, I am feeling pretty damn good now, with no
regrets and a sunny disposition…Thanks Ibogaine!

Julie

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 10:35:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hahahahahahaha,  that was funny.  Faith, are you for
real????????????????  I mean, really……..R U 4
REAL!!!!!!!!!!

Julie 🙂

— D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 03:30 PM, Faith
Bowling wrote:

They are in accord with NBC, CBS,  ABC, Whoopi

mohahahahahahah! you mean those news agencies that
still somewhat honor
investigative reporting…

instead of neo-con slanted & opinion based “news”
like FNC?

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 10:06:59 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 03:30 PM, Faith Bowling wrote:

They are in accord with NBC, CBS,  ABC, Whoopi

mohahahahahahah! you mean those news agencies that still somewhat honor investigative reporting…

instead of neo-con slanted & opinion based “news” like FNC?

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 9, 2004 at 9:53:25 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What a flash from the past!  I believe goofballs were Cibas and codeine(usually in the form of cought medicine  w/). Could be wrong.
—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Hadey
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 8:35 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought

Hi Randy,

I think he would rather have a litre of booze and a gram of coke.  I have heard that he is taking Prozac, of course we got to take things like that with a grain of salt (but not with pretzels).  Seriously, years ago wasn’t there something called goofballs, some kind of combination of drugs.  I think he took a few too many.  Now, at that cabinet meeting when he reportedly started speaking in tongues could it be he was just slurring his speach?  With 6 or 7 billion people on this Earth I think God would of chose someone else, but that is just my opinion.  Ya got to admit not everyone could get us into another Vietnam in the middle of a desert.  Last I heard we lost 1,000 good American troops, 10,000 civilians and billions of dollars of damage.  And that is what they admit to.  But look at the bright side Hallaburton is doing great.

Pray for Peace,

– JIM
BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
How much Ibogaine would it take to purge the idiocy from your average skull and crossbones guy? For Bush I’d say start with a 25mg. per kg. test dose and then give him ’bout 2 fitty per kg.           This is not a test it is a joke.      Why do I feel like someone is looking over my shoulder?      Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ciao, Howard!
Date: November 9, 2004 at 9:47:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Have a few beignets and cafe au laits for me @ Cafe du Monde, m’kay…

Exactly where we are heading.

Howard

oh, that reminds me.. there are a couple places i’d like to go while i’m
down there, and i thought they might be of interest to some of you who’re
going..

they are:

the New Orleans Pharmacy Museum
514 Chartres St.
“displays old apothecary items and medical equipment dating from the
1820’s …also has a collection of voodoo potions and a garden of
medicinal herbs.”

the Old Absinthe House
240 Bourbon St
“..became a barrom in 1826 and, except during prohibition, has remained
one.  …attained greater fame around 1870 when the absinthe frappe was
invented behind its marbled-topped bar.”

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 9:26:44 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jon,

One thing about Bush he is consistant, he has a low IQ AND low level of
moral development.  I think he is setting himself up for the pope’s job
next.

nah…  he shouldn’t go for pope.. the pope at least looks wise, whether
he actually is or not.

maybe it’s just cause he looks like yoda, i dunno.

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 9:19:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i should have known the allusion would have been lost on you.

what are you are doing, madame, is known as trolling…. posting
inflammatory things with no reedeming value whatsoever, and with no
purpose other than antagonising others and baiting them into petty
arguments.

I have no reason to hide.

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and
avarage IQ’s?
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 15:31:04 -0500 (EST)

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right
after
the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ
and
a
low level of moral development.

isn’t there a bridge you should be hiding under?

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 9, 2004 at 8:35:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy,

I think he would rather have a litre of booze and a gram of coke.  I have heard that he is taking Prozac, of course we got to take things like that with a grain of salt (but not with pretzels).  Seriously, years ago wasn’t there something called goofballs, some kind of combination of drugs.  I think he took a few too many.  Now, at that cabinet meeting when he reportedly started speaking in tongues could it be he was just slurring his speach?  With 6 or 7 billion people on this Earth I think God would of chose someone else, but that is just my opinion.  Ya got to admit not everyone could get us into another Vietnam in the middle of a desert.  Last I heard we lost 1,000 good American troops, 10,000 civilians and billions of dollars of damage.  And that is what they admit to.  But look at the bright side Hallaburton is doing great.

Pray for Peace,

– JIM
BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
How much Ibogaine would it take to purge the idiocy from your average skull and crossbones guy? For Bush I’d say start with a 25mg. per kg. test dose and then give him ’bout 2 fitty per kg.           This is not a test it is a joke.      Why do I feel like someone is looking over my shoulder?      Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 8:30:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There’s a definite kink between using crude language, calling people “dumb” and needing to critize those who live their lives by higher laws, and a person’s true character.  I won’t even respond to anyone on this list anymore.  They are in accord with NBC, CBS,  ABC, Whoopi, and Eminem to try to destroy an intelligent, kind, strong person.  A true coward is one who attacks people of thsi character (they know they’re safe in this world), and have the mentality that we should be good to evel people and maybe they won’t hurt us.

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 11:01:05 -1000

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 10:00 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a low level of moral development.

hmmm. I’d say anyone who supports pre-emptive war for corporate profit has about the lowest morals possible.

Like maybe a president who has one of the lowest IQ’s of any president in US history, who graduated Yale with barely a C average, is an alcoholic, feels ordained by God to do as he will, and sends young men and women off to war to secure oil fields for his sponsors, those same young men and women facing death everyday in the Iraqi Dust, under the bullshit guise of bringing freedom and democracy to the middle east? The same president who failed in every business venture he got his grimy little paws on (except for his successful looting of Harkin)? Now he’s failing again (and again) but people like YOU JUST DON’T GET IT.

_.dh

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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 8:19:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I should’ve known better than to even resond to anyone here.

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 11:01:05 -1000

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 10:00 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a low level of moral development.

hmmm. I’d say anyone who supports pre-emptive war for corporate profit has about the lowest morals possible.

Like maybe a president who has one of the lowest IQ’s of any president in US history, who graduated Yale with barely a C average, is an alcoholic, feels ordained by God to do as he will, and sends young men and women off to war to secure oil fields for his sponsors, those same young men and women facing death everyday in the Iraqi Dust, under the bullshit guise of bringing freedom and democracy to the middle east? The same president who failed in every business venture he got his grimy little paws on (except for his successful looting of Harkin)? Now he’s failing again (and again) but people like YOU JUST DON’T GET IT.

_.dh

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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 8:17:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have no reason to hide.

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and      avarage IQ’s?
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 15:31:04 -0500 (EST)

> Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after
> the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a
> low level of moral development.

isn’t there a bridge you should be hiding under?

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala
Date: November 9, 2004 at 7:59:10 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,
My experience during my session was no nausea at all, however I only had small sips of water and tiny tastes of melon.  What you are describing, I believe has more to do with the brain activity than with the digestive tract.  MY observation was that the ibogaine washed out anything one does to excess.  In my case that included not only the opiates and the cocaine but cigarettes, television, coffee and plain greek yogurt.  I was living on all of the above.  The yogurt was a convenient thing to eat when all your time and money went for the rest.  In my first month post ibogaine I only watched 1 hour of tv a week.  The few times I attempted more it was as if there was a hypnotic suggestion against it .  After 5 minutes I was compelled to turn it off.  Coffee wired me in 2 sips.  I couldn’t get past 1 spoonful of yogurt.  Today is 90 days for me and I’m watching a little more tv,however not to the point of it being a waste of my time.  I had a cup of yogurt for lunch.  I still don’t do well with coffee.  It’s your brain that’s not enjoying the food & coffee as well as your physical body.  My take  on all of this was to honor the process and go with what was happening.  Taking the path of least resistance.  Same for the drinking.  I also believe you can force anything back in.  It’s good that you are having these observations.
Everything that was old is new again!
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 8:59 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala

Hi SlowOne,

You have raised a few interesting and relevant points.  My boyfriend was my sitter, and he observed within me what appeared to be constant abdominal muscular tension- twisting, discomfort, nausea, and inevitably vomiting.  Of all the lingering sensations post-Ibo, an upset stomach/digestive tract was the most noticeable; in fact, my diet has changed tremendously to accomodate this effect and hopefully improve upon it.  I used to enjoy 3-4 cups of coffee per day whilst on opiates- now that I’m clean, I’m lucky if I can stomach 1 cup, and even then it is not very enjoyable.

The same applies to alcohol- I just have NO desire to drink.  Just thinking about imbibing is usually enough to give myself transient nausea.  Not that I’m complaining or anything- it feels great not to crave booze.

I’m wondering if the different types of Ibo preparations(HCL, root bark, alkaloid extract) all have the same effect on the digestive tract/stomach.  I think Howard once said that his best Ibo experience came from the alkaloid extract- now why that is, I can’t quite remember.

Julie

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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “suzanne corey” <pugsofcherryvalley@msn.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala
Date: November 9, 2004 at 7:39:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Folks!
I am new here and was refered from Rokki who will be at the
New Orleans Conference. I belong to the OpiateRecovery Group
along with Rokki and a lot of other very supportive Folks; I
am on Methadone but have been so very interested in Ibogaine
since I first learnt of it two years ago. Any and all info on
Ibogaine is very much appreciated; I have thought seriously about
doing this treatment as I would give anything to be off Methadone
and all Opiates. Opiates are my True Love but I need to put them
to rest and get on with my life.
I believe I would have to go to Mexico but I will need more info;
I live in N.H. in U.S.A.
Thank-You for any info!
“Viv”   (Suzanne)

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 9:17 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala

In a message dated 11/9/04 9:00:05 AM, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:

I’m wondering if the different types of Ibo preparations(HCL, root bark,
alkaloid extract) all have the same effect on the digestive
tract/stomach.
I think Howard once said that his best Ibo experience came from the
alkaloid
extract- now why that is, I can’t quite remember.

Hi Julie,

It was an ibogaine extract, not “the ibogaine extract.”  Ibogaine extracts
can be of various potencies and have different alkaloid constituents and,
possibly if I had tried another extraction I may have liked that better.
The
extract I think I spoke of was 90% ibogaine is only slightly less than
most of the
purified chemical ibogaine on the market. The available chemical products
usually run from 95% – 98% ibogaine.  And I don’t think it was the best
ibogaine
experience just the particular product that I liked.  Looking forward to
New
Orleans.  After the conference I will post as complete a report as I can
and
hopefully have some thrilling stuff for you all.  Cya upon my return.

Howard

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 9, 2004 at 7:26:42 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I hate to say this, but I very recently found out someone I have read many books by has taken ibogaine, but since he didn’t tell me I could tell anyone else, I can’t. But damn, it’s neat to find out just how far the ibogaine tenticles actually do reach nowadays.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 09, 2004 6:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought

Thats it. We start our own secret ritualistic society. We take Ibogaine and then…… wait we all ready did that. Then we have powerful people give us breaks. We conspire to take over the recovery field and brainwash all the addicts and go from there. Then we start an uncalled for war against assholes and idiots. Just because we can.    Randy

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 9, 2004 at 7:10:03 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

How much Ibogaine would it take to purge the idiocy from your average skull and crossbones guy? For Bush I’d say start with a 25mg. per kg. test dose and then give him ’bout 2 fitty per kg.           This is not a test it is a joke.      Why do I feel like someone is looking over my shoulder?      Randy

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 9, 2004 at 6:53:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 01:33 PM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

thats it. We start our own secret ritualistic society. We take Ibogaine and then…… wait we all ready did that.

complete with a secret handshake and identifying tattoos that grant us access to the holodeck.

Then we have powerful people give us breaks.

But first they must be de-contaminated, purified and indoctrinated. Then we will have control of their bank accounts.

We conspire to take over the recovery field and brainwash all the addicts and go from there.

and that’s just a start.

Then we start an uncalled for war against assholes and idiots. Just because we can.

except it will be a non-violent war of purging of their idiotic and asinine ways, mainly thru love, kindness and compassion, and a strict regimen of iboga therapy.

disclaimer: this is for entertainment purposes only. this is not a conspiracy.

we will consume mass quantities of commercial products and obey the scriptures as ordained by the holy corporate headquarters.

_.dh

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 9, 2004 at 6:33:37 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thats it. We start our own secret ritualistic society. We take Ibogaine and then…… wait we all ready did that. Then we have powerful people give us breaks. We conspire to take over the recovery field and brainwash all the addicts and go from there. Then we start an uncalled for war against assholes and idiots. Just because we can.    Randy

From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] attn MD’s a question pre treatment
Date: November 9, 2004 at 6:32:43 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jeff, (you too Sara),

Of all the places I have been on the web this site has the best info and there are many people with YEARS of experience using every kind of drug you can think of.  Also, everyone is glad to share what they know and help each other.  I can honestly say I have never seen a site like this.  Even when people disagree it is done in a respectful manner.  We all wish you the very best.

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
Hi Jeff,

From my experience,   you will most probably need few booster doses.
I would advise you to take a small booster dose few days after you got some sleep.

All the best wishes on your journey.

Sara

Van: Jeffgd1@aol.com [mailto:Jeffgd1@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zondag 24 oktober 2004 21:48
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] attn MD’s a question pre treatment

Hello Ibogaine list
I am lucky enough to be able to say that I am scheduled to do an ibogaine treatment in the very very near future.
I have a concern that I hope one of the knowledgeable medical people out there can look at and comment on….perhjaps off list if that is preferred.
I have had an EKG that looks normal and all my blood work pertaining to liver function looks fine as well.  The only thing that concerns me and may concern the provider is a very high tryglyceride count… I have been prescribed medication for this as part of an ongoing attempt to reduce this number but i have not started to take it yet as i do not want to introduce any other chemicals into myself before the ibogaine treatment. (not sure how smart that sounds *s*)
The exact level is approximately 600 and the norm is about 120 (sorry not sure of the units) in other words I am about 5X normal.
Is this something that should preclude me doing the treatment?
I am very very motivated now, I am on workers comp from a minor accident at work (I am an electrician on large new construction projects) and have the time. I am doing the treatment to be done with the Methadone that I am on now and have been on for 9 years at about 50 mgs I want to experience life without the opiated haze that I feel is stifling my emotional growth and more.
Thanks
And please understand I feel very awkward in looking for medical advice on the free ..if I am out of line here just say so. I just figured that here on this list  there may be people (DR’s/MD’s??) with medical knowledge along with access and understanding of this very specialized subject.
Thanks again
Freak Free!
Vote Free
Jeff

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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 9, 2004 at 6:27:47 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 12:57 PM, Jim Hadey wrote:

Hey, wait a minute… aren’t you suppose to be an “A” or at least “B” student before being accepted at Yale?

yes, but money talks. the men behind the curtains make all sorts of exceptions for those of the “order”.

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 6:08:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jon,

One thing about Bush he is consistant, he has a low IQ AND low level of moral development.  I think he is setting himself up for the pope’s job next.

– JIM

jon <jfreed1@umbc.edu> wrote:
> Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after
> the election? There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a
> low level of moral development.

isn’t there a bridge you should be hiding under?

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results – just a thought
Date: November 9, 2004 at 5:57:36 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi All,

Hmmm….  What would happen if China or Russia decided to do a pre-emptive strike against us?  The only reason Bush got a “C” average is because of his dad and connections.

Hey, wait a minute… aren’t you suppose to be an “A” or at least “B” student before being accepted at Yale?

– JIM

D H <dave@phantom.com> wrote:

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 10:00 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

> Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right
> after the election? There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a
> high IQ and a low level of moral development.

hmmm. I’d say anyone who supports pre-emptive war for corporate profit
has about the lowest morals possible.

Like maybe a president who has one of the lowest IQ’s of any president
in US history, who graduated Yale with barely a C average, is an
alcoholic, feels ordained by God to do as he will, and sends young men
and women off to war to secure oil fields for his sponsors, those same
young men and women facing death everyday in the Iraqi Dust, under the
bullshit guise of bringing freedom and democracy to the middle east?
The same president who failed in every business venture he got his
grimy little paws on (except for his successful looting of Harkin)? Now
he’s failing again (and again) but people like YOU JUST DON’T GET IT.

_.dh

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 4:18:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Low level of moral development? Wait a minute now your talkin’ bout my Mamma. I think my moral development has come along quite nicely. If not I could have never made it on the street. HeHe    Try fucking your fellow man on the street and see where that gets you. Moral development now thats kinda subjective isn’t it? Who’s morals are you comparing this with, Bush’s? Yea right. Here’s a dollar George, buy a plan.         Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 4:10:59 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Live and let live”!

Even if I’m from The Netherlands.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: dinsdag 9 november 2004 21:00
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and
avarage IQ’s?

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after
the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a
low level of moral development.

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage
IQ’s?
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 09:36:09 -1000

http://chrisevans3d.com/files/iq.htm

State Avg. IQ 2004
1 Connecticut 113 Kerry
2 Massachusetts 111 Kerry
3 New Jersey 111 Kerry
4 New York 109 Kerry
5 Rhode Island 107 Kerry
6 Hawaii 106 Kerry
7 Maryland 105 Kerry
8 New Hampshire 105 Kerry
9 Illinois 104 Kerry
10 Delaware 103 Kerry
11 Minnesota 102 Kerry
12 Vermont 102 Kerry
13 Washington 102 Kerry
14 California 101 Kerry
15 Pennsylvania 101 Kerry
16 Maine 100 Kerry
17 Virginia 100 Bush
18 Wisconsin 100 Kerry
19 Colorado 99 Bush
20 Iowa 99 Bush
21 Michigan 99 Kerry
22 Nevada 99 Bush
23 Ohio 99 Bush
24 Oregon 99 Kerry
25 Alaska 98 Bush
26 Florida 98 Bush
27 Missouri 98 Bush
28 Kansas 96 Bush
29 Nebraska 95 Bush
30 Arizona 94 Bush
31 Indiana 94 Bush
32 Tennessee 94 Bush
33 North Carolina 93 Bush
34 West Virginia 93 Bush
35 Arkansas 92 Bush
36 Georgia 92 Bush
37 Kentucky 92 Bush
38 New Mexico 92 Bush
39 North Dakota 92 Bush
40 Texas 92 Bush
41 Alabama 90 Bush
42 Louisiana 90 Bush
43 Montana 90 Bush
44 Oklahoma 90 Bush
45 South Dakota 90 Bush
46 South Carolina 89 Bush
47 Wyoming 89 Bush
48 Idaho 87 Bush
49 Utah 87 Bush
50 Mississippi 85 Bush

_________________________________________________________________
Check out Election 2004 for up-to-date election news, plus voter tools and
more! http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 4:01:05 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Tuesday, November 9, 2004, at 10:00 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a low level of moral development.

hmmm. I’d say anyone who supports pre-emptive war for corporate profit has about the lowest morals possible.

Like maybe a president who has one of the lowest IQ’s of any president in US history, who graduated Yale with barely a C average, is an alcoholic, feels ordained by God to do as he will, and sends young men and women off to war to secure oil fields for his sponsors, those same young men and women facing death everyday in the Iraqi Dust, under the bullshit guise of bringing freedom and democracy to the middle east? The same president who failed in every business venture he got his grimy little paws on (except for his successful looting of Harkin)? Now he’s failing again (and again) but people like YOU JUST DON’T GET IT.

_.dh

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 3:31:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after
the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a
low level of moral development.

isn’t there a bridge you should be hiding under?

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jeff says…
Date: November 9, 2004 at 3:27:18 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m back.

Rachel says…

Greetings from the hot bath scene.  Soaking, soaking,
soaking decades of junk out of the system.

Meant to clarify earlier that I meant “yakking” as a
synonym for vomiting rather than talking.  He really
only puked once, about two hours after the flood.
Complained a little bit about stomach cramping, but
doesn’t seem to remember that now.  I thought at the
time he was just “empty bellied” from not eating for a
few days.

It’s been 122 hours since he had methadone.

I’ll not impose my perceptions upon what Jeffy’s told
us so far about his “dreams.”

Much love,

Rachel

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From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 3:00:07 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Are people gullible enough to not see why this was on the web right after the  election?  There’s nothing more dangeroud than having a high IQ and a low level of moral development.

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: Tue, 9 Nov 2004 09:36:09 -1000

http://chrisevans3d.com/files/iq.htm

State Avg. IQ 2004
1 Connecticut 113 Kerry
2 Massachusetts 111 Kerry
3 New Jersey 111 Kerry
4 New York 109 Kerry
5 Rhode Island 107 Kerry
6 Hawaii 106 Kerry
7 Maryland 105 Kerry
8 New Hampshire 105 Kerry
9 Illinois 104 Kerry
10 Delaware 103 Kerry
11 Minnesota 102 Kerry
12 Vermont 102 Kerry
13 Washington 102 Kerry
14 California 101 Kerry
15 Pennsylvania 101 Kerry
16 Maine 100 Kerry
17 Virginia 100 Bush
18 Wisconsin 100 Kerry
19 Colorado 99 Bush
20 Iowa 99 Bush
21 Michigan 99 Kerry
22 Nevada 99 Bush
23 Ohio 99 Bush
24 Oregon 99 Kerry
25 Alaska 98 Bush
26 Florida 98 Bush
27 Missouri 98 Bush
28 Kansas 96 Bush
29 Nebraska 95 Bush
30 Arizona 94 Bush
31 Indiana 94 Bush
32 Tennessee 94 Bush
33 North Carolina 93 Bush
34 West Virginia 93 Bush
35 Arkansas 92 Bush
36 Georgia 92 Bush
37 Kentucky 92 Bush
38 New Mexico 92 Bush
39 North Dakota 92 Bush
40 Texas 92 Bush
41 Alabama 90 Bush
42 Louisiana 90 Bush
43 Montana 90 Bush
44 Oklahoma 90 Bush
45 South Dakota 90 Bush
46 South Carolina 89 Bush
47 Wyoming 89 Bush
48 Idaho 87 Bush
49 Utah 87 Bush
50 Mississippi 85 Bush

_________________________________________________________________
Check out Election 2004 for up-to-date election news, plus voter tools and more! http://special.msn.com/msn/election2004.armx

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] OT: a connection between election results and avarage IQ’s?
Date: November 9, 2004 at 2:36:09 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://chrisevans3d.com/files/iq.htm

State Avg. IQ 2004
1 Connecticut 113 Kerry
2 Massachusetts 111 Kerry
3 New Jersey 111 Kerry
4 New York 109 Kerry
5 Rhode Island 107 Kerry
6 Hawaii 106 Kerry
7 Maryland 105 Kerry
8 New Hampshire 105 Kerry
9 Illinois 104 Kerry
10 Delaware 103 Kerry
11 Minnesota 102 Kerry
12 Vermont 102 Kerry
13 Washington 102 Kerry
14 California 101 Kerry
15 Pennsylvania 101 Kerry
16 Maine 100 Kerry
17 Virginia 100 Bush
18 Wisconsin 100 Kerry
19 Colorado 99 Bush
20 Iowa 99 Bush
21 Michigan 99 Kerry
22 Nevada 99 Bush
23 Ohio 99 Bush
24 Oregon 99 Kerry
25 Alaska 98 Bush
26 Florida 98 Bush
27 Missouri 98 Bush
28 Kansas 96 Bush
29 Nebraska 95 Bush
30 Arizona 94 Bush
31 Indiana 94 Bush
32 Tennessee 94 Bush
33 North Carolina 93 Bush
34 West Virginia 93 Bush
35 Arkansas 92 Bush
36 Georgia 92 Bush
37 Kentucky 92 Bush
38 New Mexico 92 Bush
39 North Dakota 92 Bush
40 Texas 92 Bush
41 Alabama 90 Bush
42 Louisiana 90 Bush
43 Montana 90 Bush
44 Oklahoma 90 Bush
45 South Dakota 90 Bush
46 South Carolina 89 Bush
47 Wyoming 89 Bush
48 Idaho 87 Bush
49 Utah 87 Bush
50 Mississippi 85 Bush

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ciao, Howard!
Date: November 9, 2004 at 10:45:57 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/9/04 10:22:44 AM, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:

Have a few beignets and cafe au laits for me @ Cafe du Monde, m’kay…

Exactly where we are heading.

Howard

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] ciao, Howard!
Date: November 9, 2004 at 10:22:01 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Have a good time in the Big Easy….I’m so jealous.  I love N’awlins, especially the French Quarter(excluding Bourbon ST.).

Have a few beignets and cafe au laits for me @ Cafe du Monde, m’kay…

Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala
Date: November 9, 2004 at 9:17:24 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/9/04 9:00:05 AM, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:

I’m wondering if the different types of Ibo preparations(HCL, root bark,
alkaloid extract) all have the same effect on the digestive tract/stomach.
I think Howard once said that his best Ibo experience came from the alkaloid
extract- now why that is, I can’t quite remember.

Hi Julie,

It was an ibogaine extract, not “the ibogaine extract.”  Ibogaine extracts
can be of various potencies and have different alkaloid constituents and,
possibly if I had tried another extraction I may have liked that better.  The
extract I think I spoke of was 90% ibogaine is only slightly less than most of the
purified chemical ibogaine on the market. The available chemical products
usually run from 95% – 98% ibogaine.  And I don’t think it was the best ibogaine
experience just the particular product that I liked.  Looking forward to New
Orleans.  After the conference I will post as complete a report as I can and
hopefully have some thrilling stuff for you all.  Cya upon my return.

Howard

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala
Date: November 9, 2004 at 8:59:15 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi SlowOne,

You have raised a few interesting and relevant points.  My boyfriend was my sitter, and he observed within me what appeared to be constant abdominal muscular tension- twisting, discomfort, nausea, and inevitably vomiting.  Of all the lingering sensations post-Ibo, an upset stomach/digestive tract was the most noticeable; in fact, my diet has changed tremendously to accomodate this effect and hopefully improve upon it.  I used to enjoy 3-4 cups of coffee per day whilst on opiates- now that I’m clean, I’m lucky if I can stomach 1 cup, and even then it is not very enjoyable.

The same applies to alcohol- I just have NO desire to drink.  Just thinking about imbibing is usually enough to give myself transient nausea.  Not that I’m complaining or anything- it feels great not to crave booze.

I’m wondering if the different types of Ibo preparations(HCL, root bark, alkaloid extract) all have the same effect on the digestive tract/stomach.  I think Howard once said that his best Ibo experience came from the alkaloid extract- now why that is, I can’t quite remember.

Julie

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] eudemonic
Date: November 9, 2004 at 4:04:00 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

J, no way. I never get pissed at people here. LOL I’m just highly charged sometimes. Man I sure would love to be in the “Big Easy” this weekend, I just can’t afford to go. Priorities my friend, priorities. I hope some people wake up after Patrick is through with them. He kinda’ has that effect on people. Some of the guys in NYC are going, maybe I can stuff myself in the luggage.                            Randy

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala
Date: November 9, 2004 at 2:40:37 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Mon, 08 Nov 2004 10:24:28 -0800 “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.
net> wrote:
I’m assuming this is a homeopathic by the name.

No – P. harmala is the abbreviated Latin name for the plant Peganum
harmala, and the amount needed is way beyond homeopathic, although
less than people take when it is used as a substitute for the
ayahuasca vine (search for ‘ayahuasca analogues’).

The harmala alkaloids that were discovered in P. harmala are ‘
reversible monoamine oxidase inhibitors’ (MAOIs). My experience is
that both P. harmala and St. John’s Wort, another MAOI, seem to
neutralise and suppress production of stomach acids.

I’m also assuming that while you say gut ( usually refers to
the intestine, which is located below or thereabouts the belly
button.)

Digestive tract?

your description seems to indicate you’re
referring to the stomach and the nausea associated with the
ibogaine experience in some or the stress in the stomach area
(solar plexus, below the sternum) otherwise.

When I vomit ibogaine, what comes up seems more bitter and acidic
than normal stomach acid. When I drank my own root bark extract, my
stomach felt burned for a day or more afterward, like the feeling
of sunburn on the skin, even though I was able to keep it down for
less than 2 hours (I later estimated that dose to be 35 mg/kg HCl
equivalent). After lesser doses of indra extract and HCl (purified
ibogaine), as low as perhaps .1 mg/kg, both I and an uninformed
movement teacher have observed that the muscles attaching my
intestinal region to the rest of my body were stressed, I believe
in response to the irritation caused by iboga throughout the
digestive tract. The last time I took a full dose, I also
discovered that the act of vomiting can itself stress muscles such
as the psoas, enhancing and prolonging existing lower back problems.

When you say yak it up do you mean talk without
reflux type activity.

I was adopting Rachel’s term – I mean that if you induce vomiting
45 minutes after taking an extract of maybe 2 grams P. harmala
seeds, there should be no acidity, and the experience should be
relatively pleasant as such experiences go.

The only time I have been able to keep a dose as large as 12.5 mg/
kg of ibogaine down was with P. harmala. It was like bronco riding,
and probably was not worth it after some period of time, but I
never vomited.

I personally experienced a kind of anxiety in that solar
plexus area.

Sounds familiar 🙂

What worked for me and I used it for about a month was two
homeopathics. Ignatia Amara which is indicated for
hypersensitivity,nervousness due to everyday stress (what
constitutes everyday stress is so individual). This
one I’ve also seen in some sleep formulas.  The other one
isArgentum Nitrcum.  It is indicated for apprehension,stage
fright with aggitation.  I first used these about 6 months ago
when I had to take a puddle jumper to get to key west.  They
worked like a charm.  I would take anywhere from 3-5
of the little pellets each. They’re approx 1mm ea in size.  The
Bach flower Rescue Remedy also was useful.

I plan to try Rescue Remedy next time, for the fear.

Almost all physical stuff
has an emotional base.  So I believe if you don’t deal with the
emotional aspect of why you are ill or disfunctional (physically
and otherwise) it will just manifest again or elsewhere in the
body.

Yes, I wonder about this. I experience a place of violent trauma in
me that has so far kept me from letting go with iboga or ayahuasca.
Every time I go there, it is as if my ego has stumbled into an
operating room where my self is the patient on the table, and
doctors push me out forcefully, saying “you can play with your
false impression of who you are all you want, but don’t come in
here, because we’re keeping you alive.” WHich is profoundly
humbling. Another version of this is that I am in a room with blood
everywhere. Whatever else I see, I always conclude that my
ignorance is a bandage to keep my sanity, and I always work to
reinstate it on the way out of the experience.

So it may be that my abdominal experiences on ibogaine have
something to do with that trauma. However I can go to the same
place on ayahuasca, and whether or not I do (I have much more of a
choice), it has a rather pleasant tonifying effect afterwards.

Thanks for your observations and interest 🙂

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 9, 2004 at 2:18:22 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jon,

I know Zyprexa and Seroquel are not SSRIs.  In fact Seroquel is an SSRI   antagonist. I only took it for two days.  No nightmares, just a bad hang over.  Effexor  I would say is a partial SSRI since it works on serotonin and norepinepherine, I never hear of an SNRI before.  Your right, the least drugs you take on Ibo the better.  Like I told someone in a previous letter it is time to put it in the hospitals and find out what it reacts with and take the guessing out of it.  It is hard to believe it has been around for 40 years and very little study has been done on it.  I think it could be a very useful tool in treating addiction.  The US war on drugs and their way of fighting it is sad.  Even legal drugs, why must Americans pay more than Canadains?  I’m sure you know the story – greed.

Take care,

– JIM

jon <jfreed1@umbc.edu> wrote:
In the United States alone, someone checks their email every three
seconds… Jim Hadey
> Hi jon,
>
> Yea, I would go along with that. Valium and Klonopin are long lasting
> and have a long half life compared with Restoril and Xanax.
>
> Earlier, we talked about Zyprexa and Effexor. Both made me hallucinate
> and in a bad way. Also, they caused VERY bad dreams – VERY BAD. The
> Zyprexa was 10 mg and the Effexor was 37.5 mg. I was taking them for
> depression. Once a drug is approved they can use it for off the shelf
> use. In other words if a drug is approved for one thing they can use it
> for another. The kids who did the Columbine shootings were on some kind
> of SSRI drug, I think Celexia, but I’m not really sure. The lady in
> Houston who drownded her kids was also on SSRI drugs, if you read the
> whole story they were giving her many times the normal amount along with
> other drugs that should not of been taken with the ones they gave her.
> No, I am not sticking up for her, just giving you the facts.
>

I think i said this, but just to be clear, neither Zyprexa, Effexor, nor
Seroquel are SSRIs.

Zyprexa and Seroquel are both atypical anti-psychotics. They act primarily
as selective dopamine antagonists; they reduce the transmission of
dopamine. They’re called atypical because their action is more selective
than the older anti-psychotics, like thorazine and haldol. this means they
generally have less side effects; though serious reactions still do
happen, as with your experience.

Effexor is an SNRI, a serotonin norepinepherine reuptake inhibitor. It’s
like an SSRI, in that it blocks the reuptake of serotonin, but it also
blocks the reuptake of norepinepherine. It would probably be a pretty bad
idea to take ibogaine on top of an SNRI, for the same reason as with
SSRIs.
Effexor would be considerably more dangerous to mix with ibogaine than
Zyprexa or Seroquel.

But, in general, it would probably be best to mix ibogaine with as few
other things as possible. There aren’t really all that many people who’ve
ever done ibogaine, so there’s not much data on interactions and such. If
you mix ibogaine with something, odds are pretty good that you’ll be the
first one to try the combination, that is, you’ll be playing guinea pig.

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 9, 2004 at 1:55:10 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Slowone,

I appreciate you concern, SSRI’s have not been nice to me, that’s for sure.  On top of that I was taking the smallest dose you can take.  I did take Ibo and did not have much of a problem except for loseing my lunch 3 times 18, 19 and 20 hours later.  And then there is no sleep for a few days and no hunger.  But it beats the hell out of cold turkey.

However, I have read that Ibo is an SSRI antagonistic.  The pills like Paxil stop the reuptake of serotonin thus leaving more serotonin for your brain to use.  I have read that Ibo is a serotonin antagonist, I could be wrong.  From what a few people have told me they do not like to give Ibo to those taking SSRI.  Of course this is just what I have herad.  You know it really is time to take Ibo to the test phase in hospitals and offer it as an experimental drug for quitting.  I mean it has been around for 40 plus years and they still don’t know all that much about it.  It really can be a great tool in helping people stop addiction.  We all know methadone is a poor choice since it is almost impossible to taper off.

Seems funny, look at all the new SSRI drugs coming out on the market.  Prozac was one of the first ones that made it big.  Now that the patent has run out they are coming out with more and more.  Even giving them to kids and infants.  Like I said once before how in the hell can you tell if a 2 years is suffering from depression?  I think when it comes to money the drugs companies are just as bad as the oil companies.

Do you by any chance take Paxil?  Maybe that is why you had some “really rough” times on Ibogaine.  We seem to be at odds in as much as you think Ibo increases serotonin and I think it is a serotonin antagonist.  But like you, I am not a health care provider, just someone who like to read.  Your lucky you don’t have problems with the Paxil, I can guarantee you would not like them.  Like I said for some people they work great and for others they cause more problems.  Guess we all react different.

Thanks for writing, I always like to read your post,  hope everything is going alright for you.

Take care good buddy,

– JIM

slowone@hush.ai wrote:
Jim, if you ever take ibogaine I would suggest a slow stepping of
doses, giving yourself time to assess how it is acting at each step,

since it apparently increases serotonin and your reaction to SSRI’s
(which do the same) has been so negative. I am not a treater or
medical expert, just a person who has had some really rough
experiences on ibogaine (although no nightmares on Paxil, which is
an SSRI). Possibly very small doses could be useful if larger ones
are too difficult.

On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 21:21:18 -0800 Jim Hadey
wrote:
>Earlier, we talked about Zyprexa and Effexor. Both made me
>hallucinate and in a bad way. Also, they caused VERY bad dreams –

>VERY BAD. The Zyprexa was 10 mg and the Effexor was 37.5 mg. I
>was taking them for depression. Once a drug is approved they can
>use it for off the shelf use. In other words if a drug is
>approved for one thing they can use it for another. The kids who
>did the Columbine shootings were on some kind of SSRI drug, I
>think Celexia, but I’m not really sure.
>
> It was many months later that another doc gave me the Seroquel
>which knocked me on my ass and gave me a hang over. Guess I can
>not take SSRI or a SSRI antagonistic drugs.
> I will admit that while taking the SSRI I was
>buzzed in a very uncomfortable way. I mean talking to people who
>were not there, bumping into walls. And the dreams were
>nightmares that you would never want to experience. But that is
>just me. Other people have been helped.

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From: Jason Bursey <jasonburseyiboga@yahoo.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] eudemonic
Date: November 9, 2004 at 12:09:54 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy, I was curious if your going to try to make it to New Orl. this weekend.  Hope I didn’t like piss you off or something.  Take care,

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Thats what I said to the Shaman after I came out of it. U De Mon. Or U De Man  or something like that. OOOOOOOO  spooky        Randy
Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: Important and novel findings from Suboxone study in Sydney.
Date: November 8, 2004 at 9:41:09 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 5:38 PM
Subject: Important and novel findings from Suboxone study in Sydney.

A pilot study of buprenorphine-naloxone combination tablet (Suboxone®) in treatment of opioid dependence. Bell J, Byron G, Gibson A, Morris A. Drug Alcohol Rev (2004) 23;3:311-318

Dear Colleagues,

These researchers are to be congratulated on one of the first studies of its kind. They report on responses in 17 consenting ‘stable’ buprenorphine patients who were offered transfer to the combination product containing naloxone which, after the first week, was dispensed once weekly and taken by the patient unsupervised rather than daily dispensing as previously.

Most research I have read on buprenorphine employs the drug for new patients presenting for treatment, measuring illicit drug use and treatment retention. However, very useful clinical evidence is also derived from comparing existing practice with the experimental condition. The combination buprenorphine and naloxone product (‘Suboxone’) was approved for unsupervised use in the US over 2 years ago despite most of the existing research being on supervised dosing. We are told that the combination drug is equally effective and has theoretically less prospect for diversion as it contains an antagonist which if injected will cause withdrawals in those dependent on heroin or methadone.

The most surprising finding in this pilot study was that when transferred to the combination drug, nearly all patients required substantially higher doses of buprenorphine. Of the 15 successful cases, 4 needed double or more of the original dose of buprenorphine. One needed triple while the rest required more modest increases averaging about 50% at the transfer time.

“The switch from buprenorphine (SubutexTM) to the combination product (SuboxoneTM) was associated with mild withdrawal symptoms for 24 hours in the first subject. Thereafter, 13 subjects had about a 50% increase in dose when switching (from an average dose of 8.5 mg SubutexTM to day 1 SuboxoneTM average of 12.2 mg); in no cases were there complaints of either intoxication or withdrawal.”

The possible 10% quoted absorption of naloxone may be responsible for antagonising the opioid effects, at least temporarily. Three patients reported withdrawals when starting the combination product. One of them chose to withdraw from the study altogether rather than taking increased doses offered. Thus it would appear that the combination drug may not be bio-equivalent and therefore not ‘equally effective’ as pure buprenorphine, especially for high-dose patients since 32mg is the current maximum recommended dose. Another explanation might be that the subjects in this trial were originally taking inadequate doses of the pure drug. Yet, since they were ‘stable’ such doses must have been associated with positive outcomes at the time.

Those intent upon eventual abstinence may have been disappointed that after six months in these ‘stable’ patients the mean buprenorphine dose were still significantly higher than at the start of the trial (up from 9 to 11mg daily [22%]). Apart from the withdrawals, there were some major events with one patient suffering a stroke and another becoming pregnant despite the strict protocol (Suboxone is contraindicated in pregnancy). It must also be a concern that despite only enrolling stable, employed patients, by the end of the study four of the fifteen were unemployed. In spite of being chosen for their stability, there was still use of illicit drugs in about 6 patients according to urine toxicology reported. At least one patient was using such drugs frequently.

Since doses were dispensed unsupervised, in order to check for compliance, patients agreed to random call-back arrangements. Despite this, four patients (27%) failed to do so, claiming they had work committments. Yet it appears that they were still permitted to continue with unsupervised medication. This reported finding could mean that some of the four patients had already consumed or even on-sold their medication.

It is puzzling that these patients had not been receiving any take-home doses despite being long-term and ‘stable’. Nor do the authors address second daily administration of buprenorphine in these cases as recommended by the manufacturer. They write at length on the benefits of take-away doses and of the difficulties with daily attendance. Indeed, Australian Commonwealth guidelines on opioid maintenance point out that retention rates are reduced when take-away doses are not available. Even the original strict NSW buprenorphine prescribing guidelines allowed stable patients 2 take-away doses weekly with certain conditions. Most Australian jurisdictions now permit up to 5 take-away buprenorphine doses per week with few reports of problems. The use of strict 7-day dosing should be exceptional and dispensed doses used judiciously as an added incentive to normalise the dependent life style.

It is clear that opioid maintenance can be very successful with twice (or even once) weekly supervision. The researchers’ final statement is that ‘using access to unsupervised dosing to promote abstinence from heroin probably limits the potential benefits of unsupervised administration to a very small proportion of patients.’

comments by Andrew Byrne ..

Bell J, Byron G, Gibson A, Morris A. A pilot study of buprenorphine-naloxone combination tablet (Suboxone®) in treatment of opioid dependence. Drug Alcohol Rev (2004) 23;3:311-318

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dr Andrew Byrne MB BS (SYD) FAChAM (RACP)
Dependency Medicine,
75 Redfern Street, Redfern,
New South Wales, 2016, Australia
Email – ajbyrneATozemail.com.au
Tel (61 – 2) 9319 5524 Fax 9318 0631
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
My grandfather Harry Gracie’s letters from 1924 trip to Mayo Clinic:
http://bpresent.com/harry/code/mayo.htm

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] eudemonic
Date: November 8, 2004 at 5:49:18 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thats what I said to the Shaman after I came out of it. U De Mon. Or U De Man  or something like that. OOOOOOOO  spooky        Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Huh?
Date: November 8, 2004 at 5:46:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I went to Catskill to set up some counseling and got a look like a dog turning his head at something he doesn’t understand when I told them I had gotten clean with Ibogaine treatments. Never heard of it. This is incomprehensible to me. I guess the recovery community will find out, be it too slowly for my taste. They had to ask me twice to make sure that I didn’t have any court pressure or a wife who is forcing me to seek treatment. I had court pressure once, and a wife too but neither one kept me from getting high. 75 bucks for the intake. Looks like they should pay Howard for the information I am going to give them.                     Randy

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] eudemonic
Date: November 8, 2004 at 5:41:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I thought of y’all when I encountered this word, which, to me, is a parallel to ibogaine, and those who make room in their lives to bring us Iboga’s magic:

eudemon (you-da-mon)
n : (Greek) a benevolent spirit [syn: eudaemon, good spirit] [ant: cacodemon]

Source: WordNet ® 1.6, © 1997 Princeton University
—————————————————————

For the word, Eudemonic, dictionary.com says:
—————————————————————-
eudemonic (you-da-mon-ik)
adj : producing happiness and well-being [syn: eudaemonic]

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Rachael & Jeff
Date: November 8, 2004 at 5:29:03 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

RAchel wrote >Also interesting – lying down and putting my head on
his pillow was like a major contact buzz.<

V mentioned a similar sensation being with me during my voyage btw.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 1:21 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Rachael & Jeff

Julie and all,

No worries.  He slept through the night after taking
one puff, so all the rest of us got some rest too.

I woke up to the sound of him biting into a piece of
apple, and was so happy to see him sitting up.  He’s
tried a few times to rally towards the bath, but it’s
a bit much.

The landscapers were around in the morning, chewing up
leaves and grass with really, really, REALLY loud
machines, and that was a bit hard on him.  But hey,
it’s now been four days since he was opiated and he
feels like it is out of those woods.

I got myself to a step meeting last night and hadn’t
realized what a strain I was under until I got in the
car and started bawling.  With all the risks entailed
in the treatment I’d really been “stuffing” a lot of
my feelings.  I feel honored to be part of this
healing journey, yet aware of a lot of tension.  I
also feel like I’m somatizing some of his stuff too…
which makes sense.  I wake up dehydrated and
dry-mouthed when I forget to water the houseplants,
and this morning I realized they were watered and I
was feeling Jeff’s dryness.

Also interesting – lying down and putting my head on
his pillow was like a major contact buzz.

OK, more later.

Love, Rachel

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [DrugWar] “Supercoca”
Date: November 8, 2004 at 4:40:33 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Be sure to check this out at the URL supplied, as it comers with photos.
Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —– From: Vigilius Haufniensis
To: drugwar@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 1:18 PM
Subject: [DrugWar] “Supercoca”

—– Original Message —– From: Taylor, John (JH) (Solvents)
To: Millegan, Kris
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 1:45 AM
Subject: “Supercoca”

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.11/columbia.html?tw=wn_tophead_6

The Mystery of the Coca Plant That Wouldn’t Die
The war on Colombia’s drug lords is losing ground to an herbicide-resistant supershrub. Is it a freak of nature – or a genetically modified secret weapon?

By Joshua Davis

I’ve got 23 ziplock bags filled with coca leaves laid out on the rickety table in front of me. It’s been seven hours since the leaves were picked, and they’re already secreting the raw alkaloid that gives cocaine its kick. The smell is pungently woody, but that may just be the mold growing on the walls of this dingy hotel room in the southern Colombian jungle. Somewhere down the hall, a woman is moaning with increasing urgency. I’ve barricaded the door in case the paramilitaries arrive.

I drop half a milliliter of water into a plastic test tube and mash a piece of a leaf inside. As the water tints green, I notice that my hands are shaking. I haven’t slept for two days, and the Marxist guerrillas have this town encircled. But what’s really making me nervous is the green liquid in the tube.
Over the past three years, rumors of a new strain of coca have circulated in the Colombian military. The new plant, samples of which are spread out on this table, goes by different names: supercoca, la millonaria. Here in the southern region it’s known as Boliviana negra. The most impressive characteristic is not that it produces more leaves – though it does – but that it is resistant to glyphosate. The herbicide, known by its brand name, Roundup, is the key ingredient in the US-financed, billion-dollar aerial coca fumigation campaign that is a cornerstone of America’s war on drugs.
One possible explanation: The farmers of the region may have used selective breeding to develop a hardier strain of coca. If a plant happened to demonstrate herbicide resistance, it would be more widely cultivated, and clippings would be either sold or, in many cases, given away or even stolen by other farmers. Such a peer-to-peer network could, over time, result in a coca crop that can withstand large-scale aerial spraying campaigns.
But experts in herbicide resistance suspect that there is another, more intriguing possibility: The coca plant may have been genetically modified in a lab. The technology is fairly trivial. In 1996, Monsanto commercialized its patented Roundup Ready soybean – a genetically modified plant impervious to glyphosate. The innovation ushered in an era of hyperefficient soybean production: Farmers were able to spray entire fields, killing all the weeds and leaving behind a thriving soybean crop. The arrival of Roundup Ready coca would have a similar effect – except that in this case, it would be the US doing the weed killing for the drug lords.
Whether its resistance came from selective breeding or genetic modification, the new strain poses a significant foreign-policy challenge to the US. How Washington responds depends on how the plant became glyphosate resistant. That’s why I’m here in the jungle – to test for the new coca. I’ve brought along a mobile kit used to detect the presence of the Roundup Ready gene in soybean samples. If the tests are inconclusive, my backup plan is to smuggle the leaves to Colombia’s capital, Bogotá, and have their DNA sequenced in a lab.
In my hotel room, I put the swizzle stick-sized test strip into the tube filled with mashed Boliviana negra. The green water snakes up the strip. If the midsection turns red, I’ll know that the drug lords have genetically engineered the plant and beaten the US at its own game. If it doesn’t, it’ll mean that Colombia’s farmers have outwitted 21st-century technology with an agricultural technique that’s been around for 10,000 years.
I first learned about the possibility of herbicide-resistant cocaine eight weeks before I arrived in South America. I was having a quiet Sunday brunch at home in California with a few friends and their Colombian guest. It was a beautiful day; we sat on the deck and chatted about upcoming vacation plans over waffles and grapefruit juice.
The conversation changed when the guest began talking about how he’d spent three years working in the military intelligence branch of the Colombian army, which has been waging a civil war against the guerrillas for four decades. His main assignment was to prevent insurgents from importing weapons and military technology.
After the US helped the Colombian military dismantle the Medellín and Cali cocaine cartels in the ’90s, the guerrillas moved in and took over much of the drug trade. By the late ’90s, rebels controlled more than a third of the country and had the financial clout to intensify the war and protect their newfound position as narcotraffickers. It’s an extremely lucrative business. The coke habit in the US alone was worth $35 billion in 2000 – about $10 billion more than Microsoft brought in that year.
But the most intriguing development he mentioned was regular reports of Roundup Ready coca. “We started to hear about this plant three years ago,” he said. “We understood then that the spraying was not killing it, but nobody wants to talk about it because it might put an end to American aid money.”
US aid to Colombia totaled more than $750 million last year and has been flooding in since 2000, when Congress approved the Clinton administration’s Plan Colombia, a regional anti-narcotics package. About 20 percent of the money was devoted to maintaining a fleet of crop dusters and support planes that make almost daily sorties over the Colombian countryside. (The rest of the money went to economic support, military aid, and police training.) The crop dusters fly high, out of artillery range, until they reach a designated coca field, and then descend to spray the plants with a coating of Roundup. The concept is simple: Kill the coca and there will be no cocaine.
The day after our brunch, I looked up the Herbicide Resistance Action Committee and spoke with Ian Heap, the committee’s chair. Heap is a global herbicide watchdog. If a farmer in Thailand notes that a certain weed is surviving repeated herbicide applications, local scientists will collect a sample and ship it to Corvallis, Oregon, where Heap runs a private laboratory. He is funded primarily by herbicide manufacturers who want to know how effective their products are. I figured he would know something about the reported resistance in coca. “So they’ve finally done it,” he said with a breezy Australian accent. “I’ve been waiting for a call like this for a long time.”
Heap explained that few people knew how to genetically manipulate plants until the early ’90s. Then suddenly, even undergraduates were learning the techniques. At the same time, scientific papers were published that identified CP4, a gene responsible for glyphosate resistance. By the late ’90s, it’s easy to imagine the narcos hiring one unscrupulous scientist to tinker with coca. “Cocaine dealers have a lot of money to do the convincing,” Heap said. “Genetically modifying the coca plant is the most obvious defense against fumigation. If I were a drug lord, it’s what I would do.”
Heap suspects that the US government might keep such a development quiet. The herbicide would still be effective against older, more widely planted coca strains, and, for a while at least, Colombia’s eradication campaign would continue to show impressive results. But eventually, as the modified strain spread, coca cultivation would rise again, and spraying would have no effect. In the interim, farmers growing the new strain would get free weeding. “It’s critical for the war on drugs that this gets independently checked out,” Heap concluded. “But I’m sure as hell not going down there.”
To get another view, I called Jonathan Gressel, one of the world’s foremost experts on herbicide resistance and a professor of plant science at the Weizmann Institute of Science in Israel. “The only surprise is that the drug mafia didn’t do it sooner,” Gressel said when I told him about reports of glyphosate-resistant coca. “Privately, my colleagues and I have been predicting this for years.”
Another way to explain the reported resistance, he said, was that over time the plants developed it naturally after repeated exposure. But in the case of coca, he estimated that it would take 20 years of constant spraying before a naturally resistant strain of the plant would establish itself. It was possible that farmers beat the odds and got lucky in the four years of intensive spraying. “But the most reasonable explanation,” Gressel told me, “is that the illicit narcotics world has genetically engineered the coca plant to be resistant to glyphosate.”
The only way to know for sure was to find the plant and test it.
The early evening air at the El Dorado Airport in Bogotá is thin and rain-scrubbed fresh. Outside, at the curb along the arrivals exit, throngs of people silently hold signs with names on them, but in the murky light it’s hard to see. I file quickly past, heading for a line of taxis, until one sign makes me stop. It has my name on it.
Three days earlier, I’d placed a call to a Colombian geneticist. I explained that I was going to be arriving in Colombia in a few days and would like to talk to him about possible alterations to coca DNA. He cut the conversation short and asked for my flight information, saying he would meet me at the airport. I told him that wasn’t necessary, figuring I’d call him when I got settled in my hotel.
Now he steps out of the shadows and introduces himself. “In Colombia, it is always better to talk in person,” he says. He is a bookish, bespectacled man and seems distracted. “I’ll drive you into town and we can talk.”
We head for the city’s central district in his old, messy car. The streets are narrow, and some of the once-grand stuccoed buildings are graffitied over with guerrilla slogans. He’s either nervous or doesn’t know how to drive, because he keeps stalling at stop signs. The flak-jacketed police that stand on almost every corner swivel their automatic rifles toward us as we lurch past.
We come to a stop in a historic section of Bogotá, and the scientist leads me into an empty, cavelike bar. He chooses a table in the farthest corner. A soccer game plays on a small TV by the entrance. We get two beers, and the scientist waits for the barkeep to go back to the other end of the bar.
“I would prefer it if you don’t mention that we met,” he begins.
He then asks me what I know. I tell him I’m just trying to figure out if this resistant strain exists, and if so, how it came into being. The scientist pauses.
“Nine years ago,” he says, “a friend came to me. He told me that the traffickers wanted someone to modify the DNA. They wanted a glyphosate-resistant plant. The offer was 10 billion pesos. About $10 million.”
“That’s a lot of money,” I say. “Did you do it?”
He smiles wanly. “No, I did not do it. I didn’t want to invite that trouble into my life. These are not people you want to know. They are not good people. And if this fumigation benefits only them, I think that should be known.”
He takes a sip of his beer. “So listen to me. If you can get me samples of the plant, I will extract the DNA and tell you if they have gotten inside the genetic code. If there are no signs of manipulation, then we will know that the farmers have done it on their own.”
We look at each other for a second. It crosses my mind that he might be working for traffickers and will simply destroy the samples and lie about having done tests. If the local kingpins have created a Roundup Ready coca plant, they have a real interest in keeping that quiet. After all, they would be getting a guarantee that farmers will have no choice but to grow their new plant. The scientist’s eagerness to help me and his surprising appearance at the airport make me consider this possibility.
But my guess is that he’s genuinely curious to know the answer himself. I decide to trust him. I stick out my hand and we shake. Five minutes later, we leave the bar separately.
The next morning, I board a DeHavilland twin-engine plane for the two-hour flight into Putumayo province, the country’s main coca-growing region. Colombia produces two-thirds of the world’s cocaine, and most of it has historically come from this southern jungle. Over the past decade, tens of thousands of spraying missions have been flown here. US and Colombian officials insist that 92 percent of the plants sprayed in the region last year have now died. As a result, they say, the guerrillas have been weakened and will soon have to negotiate a surrender.
But the guerrillas aren’t ready to be counted out yet. Just before we board the plane, they announce a paro armado – an armed shutdown of the southern region. If anybody travels, they will likely be shot. It’s meant to be a show of force, a sign the guerrillas can still go on the offensive whenever they choose.
Our pilots don’t think much of it. Puerto Asís, the region’s capital, is heavily guarded by the military. Two years ago, the guerrillas laid siege to the town for nine months – everything had to be airlifted in, and the pilots became accustomed to running the blockade. Now, with the rebels pushed back into the jungle, our pilots calmly throttle up, and 90 minutes later we bounce to a stop on a jungle tarmac. A phalanx of heavily armed soldiers guards the perimeter, and two men with sawed-off shotguns stand beside a cagelike room that serves as the arrivals lounge.
The soldiers don’t hassle me; one of them unlocks the far side of the cage and lets me out onto a partially paved road. A group of men across the street stop talking and watch me until a stocky man with a lazy eye introduces himself as Campo, the driver I had arranged in Bogotá. We get into his bright-red Toyota pickup, and before accelerating out of town he touches a picture of the Virgin Mary glued to a shiny blank CD dangling from the rearview mirror. On the map at the Bogotá airport, Puerto Asís was the last dot at the end of the last road. I watch the town fade behind us as we enter the jungle.
We drive for an hour before we come across the first evidence of violence. An oil pipeline alongside the road has been bombed, and flaming black sludge oozes out of a twisted metal pipe, sending swirling cumulus clouds of smoke half a mile above the forest. The grass below sizzles loudly. Campo keeps the car in the middle of the road. The guerrillas may have booby-trapped the far side with mines – better to stay closer to the flames, which sting my face like a sunburn.
Our destination, La Hormiga, is a jungle outpost of 15,000. It was carved out of the forest 40 years ago to house oil workers but in the ’80s was transformed into a coca-farming boomtown. As we crest a ridge, the town appears below, bounded by a sharply defined line of trees that tower over ramshackle two-story cinder block and concrete buildings.
As we drive down the main drag, I see that one of those shoddy roofs covers a faux marble-floored, air-conditioned shopping palace selling imitation Versace jeans. A lady in red hot pants and a halter top window-shops pulling a pet lamb on a pink leash. A casino with rows of slot machines stands next to a dentist’s office that doubles as a jewelry shop. Over the din from a half-dozen roadside discos, a man with a 3-foot-long megaphone meanders down the middle of the road reading the local news – an amplified town crier.
I spend a sleepless night at the inappropriately named 5-Stars Hotel and rise early to meet Miguel Lucero (aka Don Miguel), the local leader of the National Association of Peasant Land Users, a large farmers union. Don Miguel is a short, quiet man with a distinguished, furrowed face. Before he became a peasant leader he farmed coca, and he knows the region’s farms well. I ask him if he has heard of Roundup-resistant coca.
“Yes,” he says simply. “It is called Boliviana negra.”
“Can you show me some?”
“Yes.”
“Right now?”
“Yes.”
We are hiking through the jungle. The path is narrow, overgrown, and muddy. The knee-high rubber boots I just bought keep getting stuck in the muck, and I have to pull them out with my hands. Don Miguel walks fast and confidently. He has assured me that we are well within the government-controlled territory. The guerrillas, he says, haven’t been here during daylight hours for at least a couple of years.
We come to a makeshift bridge. Two slender tree trunks are suspended over a flooding river the color of milky tea. Thin steel cables run above them to give you something to hold on to. Miguel says that the land on the far side belongs to a coca farmer who now grows Boliviana negra. “Everybody is planting negra now,” he says and steps catlike over the bridge.
I follow, trying not to slip into the river 5 feet below. After climbing a small incline, we come upon an arresting sight: 300 yards of devastation. An entire slope of hillside vegetation has disappeared. There’s only brown-gray dirt, a half-dead tree, and withered coca plants, which I recognize from photographs. “Peruviana blanca,” Don Miguel says, pointing at the dead plants. “Not resistant. This slope was sprayed last year.”
We hike up the ridge, and suddenly there are healthy coca plants stretching to the horizon. On one side of an imaginary line, devastation. On the other, billowing, neck-high coca plants dotting hillsides that are denuded of all other vegetation. “Boliviana negra,” Don Miguel says, pointing at the large bushes. “They were sprayed as well.”
Over a lunch of pounded chicken and french fries back in La Hormiga, Don Miguel tells me that Boliviana negra appeared in the region three years ago and is now spreading rapidly across the countryside – just as the herbicide experts told me it might. The new strain is disseminated via cuttings; farmers cut off stems and sell them. Some farmers, looking to make more money, travel with their cuttings and peddle them around the region. And once a farmer grows a new plant, he can sell his own cuttings. It’s file-swapping brought to the jungle – a highly efficient decentralized distribution chain.
Don Miguel doesn’t know where the strain originated. He has heard rumors of a group of mysterious agronomists who develop better coca plants for the traffickers, but he doesn’t know where they are or anything about them.
He does have a clear sense of how the new plant is affecting his region. At first, he says, the aerial spraying was successful, but now, with the arrival of Boliviana negra, it’s affecting only those who are growing lawful crops. “The truth is that the fumigation drives us to the one thing that will survive – and that is Boliviana negra,” he says. “Not bananas, not yucca, not maize.”
The Colombian and US governments want farmers to grow legal crops, he explains, and in the past have paid them to eradicate coca. But though American embassy officials insist that the spraying campaign is more than 99 percent accurate, Don Miguel says that almost all the farmers he knows and represents report that legal crops are sprayed as well. He says that his own tree farm was sprayed, pushing him to the edge of bankruptcy. If Boliviana negra will guarantee income for farmers, Don Miguel says, they will grow it and have less incentive to discuss eradication with the government.
Not to mention the financial benefits. One hectare of land in Putumayo will produce $100 of corn. The same plot will produce $1,000 of coca. Plus you don’t have to transport the coca – the guerrillas will come to your farm and collect it. So why would anyone grow corn? “Because if you grow coca,” Don Miguel says, “you deal with the guerrillas or the paramilitaries or both, and they kill whenever they want.”
Don Miguel has another fear. He doesn’t believe that the US will tolerate the existence of glyphosate-resistant coca. When the authorities find out that farmers are growing the new coca, he fears it will be only a matter of time before they switch to a new herbicide.
He has reason for concern. Last summer, documents show, anti-narcotics officials at the US embassy in Bogotá quietly approached Colombia’s president, Álvaro Uribe, and asked him if he’d consider switching from Roundup to Fusarium oxysporum, a plant-killing fungus classified as a mycoherbicide. Some species are known to attack coca; in the early ’90s, a natural Fusarium outbreak decimated the Peruvian coca crop.
But Fusarium is not a chemical – it’s a fungus, and it can live on in the soil. A proposal to consider using it in Florida in 1999 was rejected after the head of the state’s Department of Environmental Protection found that it was “difficult, if not impossible, to control [Fusarium’s] spread” and that the “mutated fungi can cause disease in a large number of crops, including tomatoes, peppers, flowers, corn, and vines.” A switch to Fusarium would, at the least, be an escalation in the herbicide war and a tacit acknowledgment of glyphosate’s failure. It could also turn out to be the A-bomb of herbicides.
Still, according to a letter sent from the State Department to Colombia’s US ambassador, Uribe was “ready to learn more.” The letter, dated October 3, 2003, laid out steps for moving this plan forward, but when I spoke to officials at the embassy, they vehemently denied they are considering a herbicide switch. They stated that they are thrilled with the success of Roundup.
Don Miguel admits that on one level, the spraying has been highly effective. Almost all the old strains of coca have been eradicated. What’s left are small plots of Boliviana negra, but these have become more productive, in part because the spraying has killed all the other plants competing for nutrients.
US officials point to the eradication results of the past three years and argue that the plant could not possibly be resistant. A high-ranking US anti-narcotics official who declined to be identified told me that she had never heard of Boliviana negra, la millonaria, or any Roundup Ready coca plant. Another American official began our conversation by saying, “So you’re here to talk about the nonexistent glyphosate-resistant coca?” And then, more forcefully, “These campesinos have zero education. They can’t be trusted to know whether a plant is resistant to glyphosate.” Nonetheless, I was assured that a helicopter would be dispatched to Putumayo to search for samples. Even amid increasing reports of resistant superstrains, officials have yet to find any evidence of them.
Perhaps they haven’t been to La Hormiga. Everyone I talk to here knows about the resistant plant. Three hours after leaving the coca fields, I attend a meeting of two dozen heads of local farmer cooperatives – they represent more than 5,000 farmers in Putumayo – and they nod knowingly when asked about the new breed. “Nobody listens to us because they think we are dumb farmers,” says one man. “The Americans are arrogant. They don’t talk to the people who live here. We are the ones who are sprayed. We are the ones who live with the plants.”
That evening, I meet Fabio Paz, the energetic mayor of La Hormiga, at his simple concrete house. Paz is 32 and excited to be mayor, despite the fact that in the past three years guerrillas have assassinated more than 30 mayors. He wears jeans and a baggy shirt and does not look like an important man. But two plainclothes guards stand outside while we talk, and his armor-plated SUV is parked in front of the window, presumably to deflect any gunfire or bomb blasts.
“Boliviana negra is like goaaaal for the coca farmers,” the mayor shouts, jumping to his feet and yelling “goal” like a crazed Latin American soccer announcer. “Maybe the narcos bought someone off at Monsanto. There would be poetic justice in that.”
Paz doesn’t know where the strain came from, though he assumes Bolivia, because of the name. He also believes that once refined, it produces a different high than older strains. Either way, he says, farmers are now planting only Boliviana negra: “You can’t give away the other types of coca now.”
When I tell him that I am having trouble getting more than a handful of negra samples because of the guerrilla clampdown, he calls in Chucky, one of his bodyguards. Chucky is short and baby-faced, with an emotionless gaze and a handgun tucked in the waistband of his jeans. The mayor tells me that his name isn’t really Chucky; they just started calling him that after they saw Child’s Play, the horror movie about a child’s doll possessed by a serial killer named Chucky. Paz pronounces it “Shooky.”
“Chucky can collect samples for you,” Paz offers.
Chucky stares at me blankly and nods. I ask if he can identify the strain, and he nods again. Chucky, the mayor explains, was a coca leaf picker before he became a bodyguard.
Twenty hours later, Chucky knocks on my hotel room door. From under his shirt, he pulls out a stack of ziplock bags filled with coca leaves. “Boliviana negra,” he says and points at some of the leaves that have yellow blotches on them. He says those were sprayed a couple of weeks ago. In some cases, he says, the leaves fall off and then regrow after spraying. In other plants, the leaves stay on. This is an important piece of information. A genetically modified plant would be impervious to glyphosate.
It takes me a few minutes to arrange a mobile laboratory on the simple wooden table in my room. When placed in water with macerated soybean and canola, a chemical in the plastic test strip will bond with CP4 ESPS, a protein produced by the Roundup Ready gene. If the protein is present, the chemical turns a section of the strip red.
The problem is, the strips were made specifically to test soybean and canola, not coca. I would rather not travel to Bogotá with a backpack full of coca leaves, but after a series of the tests fail to detect the gene, I realize I have no choice.
By the time I get back to the airport in Puerto Asís, the leaves are giving off a pungent odor of broken twigs even though they’re wrapped in a combination of dirty socks and ziplock bags at the bottom of my backpack. Security at the airstrip is almost nonexistent. A stout, mustachioed woman in olive-green fatigues rifles through my bag. No x-rays, metal detector, or even a pat-down. But at the last minute, she demands that my bag be placed in the hold underneath the plane to better balance the plane’s weight.
I am nervous about landing in Bogotá and dealing with internal customs agents. But before we reach the capital, the plane stops in a city called Neiva to pick up more passengers. While we’re sitting on the runway, the hold is opened and a group of soldiers with a German shepherd approaches. A wave of nausea hits me.
The dog puts two paws up on a trolley carrying the new passengers’ luggage. It sniffs around and then drops back down. I watch with terror as the soldiers stand around chatting for a few minutes. I imagine scenes from Midnight Express, where the dumb American drug smuggler wastes away in a Turkish prison. I promise myself that if I make it out of this, I’ll never smuggle anything again. The dog casually sniffs the wheels of the trolley, and then the group turns and walks away. The hold is closed and we take off again.
We land in Bogotá. There are no internal customs officers at the arrivals terminal. I catch a cab and sink into the backseat. The ride into town is blissful.
The next morning, I take a taxi to the laboratory of the scientist I met on my first night in Colombia. The leaves spent the night jammed among tiny bottles of Chivas Regal in my hotel minibar, and some have turned black. But the scientist assures me that this is not a problem. He smells them and his eyebrows go up. “Very good,” he says and locks the door to the lab. It will take him a month to complete the tests.
Four weeks later, the scientist sends me an email saying that he has completed the DNA analysis and found no evidence of modification. He tested specifically for the presence of CP4 – a telltale indicator of the Roundup Ready modification – as well as for the cauliflower mosaic virus, the gene most commonly used to insert foreign DNA into a plant. It is still possible that the plant has been genetically modified using other genes, but not likely. Discovering new methods of engineering glyphosate resistance would require the best scientific minds and years of organized research. And given that there is already a published methodology, there would be little reason to duplicate the effort.
Which points back to selective breeding. The implication is that the farmers’ decentralized system of disseminating coca cuttings has been amazingly effective – more so than genetic engineering could hope to be. When one plant somewhere in the country demonstrated tolerance to glyphosate, cuttings were made and passed on to dealers and farmers, who could sell them quickly to farmers hoping to withstand the spraying. The best of the next generation was once again used for cuttings and distributed.
This technique – applied over four years – is now the most likely explanation for the arrival of Boliviana negra. By spraying so much territory, the US significantly increased the odds of generating beneficial mutations. There are numerous species of coca, further increasing the diversity of possible mutations. And in the Amazonian region, nature is particularly adaptive and resilient.
“I thought it was unlikely,” says Gressel, the plant scientist at the Weizmann Institute. “But farmers aren’t dumb. They obviously spotted a lucky mutation and propagated the hell out of it.”
The effects of this are far-reaching for American policymakers: A new herbicide would work only for a limited time against such a simple but effective ad hoc network. The coca-growing community is clearly primed to take advantage of any mutations.
A genetic laboratory is not as nimble. A lab is limited by research that is publicly available. In the case of Fusarium, the coca-killing fungus and likely successor to glyphosate, there is no body of work discussing genetically induced resistance. If the government switched to Fusarium, a scientist would have to perform groundbreaking genetic research to fashion a Fusarium-resistant coca plant.
The reality is that a smoothly functioning selective-breeding system is a greater threat to US antidrug efforts. Certainly government agents can switch to Fusarium and enjoy some short-term results. But after a few years – during which legal crops could be devastated – a new strain of Fusarium-resistant coca would likely emerge, one just as robust as the glyphosate-resistant strain.
The drug war in Colombia presupposes that it’s eventually possible to destroy cocaine at its source. But the facts on the ground suggest this is no longer possible. In this war, it’s hard to beat technology developed 10,000 years ago.
Contributing editor Joshua Davis (jd@joshuadavis.net) wrote about wiring the apocalypse in issue 12.04.

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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tomorrow- on the subject of music during Ibonauting
Date: November 8, 2004 at 4:07:09 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

: ) I really enjoyed reading todays posts, thanks EVERYONE : )

Music for each journey was a bit different.  I think for me personally, the music is ok if it doesn’t dominate the experience ie distract from what ibo is trying to show.
First extract, no music seemed to be best at the time, even though I planned an elaborate cd mix, good journey, lots about seeing marionette strings on a stage.
2nd extract, music at beginning then stopped it when the ‘dream’ came, very taxing journey, I don’t think I was the only one blasting off and lots of travelling during winter, although I was able to get where it wanted me to be.
3rd dose hcl: craziness, just pure craziness lol, reminded me in a very harsh way that darkness is the absence of light, and…..well lots of sound of static and cia molecular flies on the wall etc
4th extract: process of breaking down doors of negativity (specifically ‘paranoia’ type energy); breaking free from sounds of air conditioner box (vacuum dust bag) and radio static that seemed to symbolise anxiety.  So took few days beforehand as before care (writing what I expected from the experience and playing devils adv a bit, to see if I would even allow myself to not fall back into anxiety, while knowing the only way around it is through.  So I try to face it head on, and purged by mixing various radio frequencies onto tape, before and during, trying to make the result a ‘temple’ without ‘agents of force’, I-Chinging the sound to prevent predictably, which seemed to work to purge, but not to build.  To build positivity, I had to come to the realisation that if random is used all the time, random becomes predictable.  Once this was realised, the fear seemed to lesson and a softer angle seemed better.  Their was no ‘dream’ this time, the message was, you’ve had enough neverland, like questions = avoidence.  That it was time to find answers instead of finding more new questions, at least at that point in time.

I think sound can be used outside the context of ‘escapism’ when I listen to ALL sound as music, letting the pieces fall where they please.

One of the best “songs” I’ve ever heard was walking dog on a windy day, birds in every tree singing in beyond stereo, then the wind blows this aluminium can down the street making the best ‘back beat’ that went just perfect with it.  When I hear sound like this, it seems universal to me, as it doesn’t cost money, but still provides joy and a sense of connection to a universal music.

I can’t find mp3:  “I’m forever blowing bubbles” by Hermeto Pascoal
but found other song sample: http://www.pezzotti.ch/aves.ra

Preston, any time ‘hot for teacher’ comes on the radio I start jamming an air guitar : )  What was the song you put w/ whole lotta love?

Todays posts just clicked w/ me today, for real, thank you for dat.

 

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tomorrow- on the subject of music during Ibonauting
Date: November 8, 2004 at 3:09:45 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Future Sound of London caused
me to trip my ass off, but in a startlingly dark
manner- I visualized monsters and decapitations.”

Weird, I remember listening to them when on Acid once and it led to a
similar experience-not very nice really!  I had to switch to something a
little more….uplifting?  Positive?  Light?!

Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 2:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tomorrow- on the subject of music during Ibonauting

Jeff,

YES, music during the Ibo experience was amazing!!  I
listened to mostly instrumental music- lyrics were a
bit too distracting.  Drone-like music was the best,
as was music that I had no “drug association” with.
The Icelandic band Mum worked very well, as did
‘Mumbai Theme’, on the Talvin Singh record.  ‘Soil
Festivities’, by Vangelis, was pretty cool too, as was
Transmissions from the Planet Dog- the ambient stuff
only, not the techno.  Future Sound of London caused
me to trip my ass off, but in a startlingly dark
manner- I visualized monsters and decapitations.

When the effects of Ibo wear off, try listening to
soothing, calming music.  Any instrumental music,
especially with accompanying nature sounds, gave my
body shivers during the post-Ibo phase.  It will relax
you, and make any residual withdrawal seem less
important.  Solitudes compilations are cheesy, but
effective, as was ‘Musica Poetica’ by Orff(from
Badlands soundtrack).

My first treatment was music-free, and was not nearly
as enlightening or effective as my second,
music-infused treatment.

Good luck, Jeff…If I can help with anything else,
please feel free to email me.

Julie
PS. The Nasa Voyager recording “Symphony of the
PLanets”, was pretty amazing.  It’s ‘music’ based on
magnetic fields, and other natural phenomena picked up
by Voyager during it’s journey: solar wind,
magnetospheres, electromagnetic fields, and more….

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From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala
Date: November 8, 2004 at 2:52:55 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Yall ,Im enjoying reading about your progress, Im about 5 months  post ibogaine treatment. What helped me alot was acupuncture treatments ,I fell in love with it so much so that Im now practising acupuncture myself ! Ibogaine opens alot of doors ,so glad yall are here to share it with me ,fondly -shell

“m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net> wrote:
Hi,
I’m assuming this is a homeopathic by the name. I’m also assuming that
while you say gut ( usually refers to the intestine, which is located below
or thereabouts the belly button.) your description seems to indicate you’re
referring to the stomach and the nausea associated with the ibogaine
experience in some or the stress in the stomach area (solar plexus, below
the sternum) otherwise. When you say yak it up do you mean talk without
reflux type activity. I would consider it a great find to know of a
homeopathic that helps with reflux type activity as a general resource.
I personally experienced a kind of anxiety in that solar plexus area.
What worked for me and I used it for about a month was two homeopathics.
Ignatia Amara which is indicated for hypersensitivity,nervousness due to
everyday stress (what constitutes everyday stress is so individual). This
one I’ve also seen in some sleep formulas. The other one isArgentum
Nitrcum. It is indicated for apprehension,stage fright with aggitation. I
first used these about 6 months ago when I had to take a puddle jumper to
get to key west. They worked like a charm. I would take anywhere from 3-5
of the little pellets each. They’re approx 1mm ea in size. The Bach flower
Rescue Remedy also was useful.
As far as not getting a response to your post I’ve noticed when some
are caught up in the moment of a hot topic on this list, other not relevant
to their moment info can be put off for later or not as pertinent. It may
be that innate tendancy towards the rush that someone tried to explain to me
about the human race!
I thank you for your reference. Almost all physical stuff has an
emotional base. So I believe if you don’t deal with the emotional aspect of
why you are ill or disfunctional (physically and otherwise) it will just
manifest again or elsewhere in the body. Any clarification would be
appreciated.
Respectfully,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From:
To:
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list

> More on the apparent ability of P. harmala extract to lessen the
> stress of iboga on the gut, which oddly no one responded to. If you
> take such an extract (w/out iboga) and then make an effort to yak
> it up an hour or so later, you’ll notice that there is no acidity
> in what comes up.
>
>> Anger is a tough one for me, still learning how to be with it.
>
> A thought after sleeping on it – the goal seems to be to be able to
> hold anger without burying it, choosing to display it when it can
> help you achieve your goal. A therapist friend described properly-
> used anger as a sword that you whip out and bring to the other
> person’s throat, and just knowing you have it at your side makes
> for a different posture in the world. Maybe holding anger without
> expressing it in the situation requires expressing it somewhere
> else to someone who is equipped to hear it and understand.
>
> One big subtlety I’ve noticed is that one can say “I’m angry about .
> .” and this is a whole different conversation from “You fucking
> idiot …” which is what I’d feel like saying and then shut down
> because of inability to be impolite.
>
> The other day someone said I just need to develop my adult self,
> and when this is done my wounded child will feel safe enough to
> come out and heal. This reminds me of something Nick wrote a while
> ago:
>
>> Generally it’s my opinion that the ego needs multiple “staging
>> posts” on it’s long journey toward true self-recognition. Even
>> though ultimately it’s merely a journey from here to here this
>> doesn’t seem to lessen the impact of the experience.
>
> In this context the ego would be the parental self. So just acting
> as mature as possible, understanding that the reason is to build
> oneself up rather than conform, choosing the right battles, biding
> one’s time as necessary, could be a program 🙂
>
> I’m also reminded of this from ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com:
>
>> I don’t believe we have to polish our egos to the point of
> getting
>> an “A”. I think a C+ will do. The universe is not so fucking
>> relentless as to require any sembance of perfection. A C+ will do
>
>> and then “we” can get out of the way.
>> Relax at that point and the separate sense will automatically
> burn.
>
> By the way, I’m angry about the US election results. Probably that
> is already obvious 🙂
>
>
>
>
>
> Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
> secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
>
> Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
> http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434
>
> Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
> http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
>
>
>
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>
>

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard
Date: November 8, 2004 at 2:44:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard, thank you for your input yesterday. It means a lot to me to have your advice. The intelligence and support that comes with this list is extraordinary. I don’t think I could made it this far without the help I have received here. It’s amazing how all the pieces fit together in my life today. EVERYONE has helped me without a thought of “what will it get me’? Ibogaine is the answer.           Randy

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanks Preston
Date: November 8, 2004 at 2:46:52 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“One is that if all sugars are stopped for 3-4 days the cravings go away.”

How would you go about cutting out ALL sugars?  Sorry if I sound brainless but doesn’t just about everything include Sugar?  Like is fruit sugar just as bad?  Would you have to cut out fruit too?

I would LOVE to escape my chocolate and ice cream addiction!

Thanks for all this info-I would never have known otherwise,
Love Hannah
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 3:52 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Thanks Preston

Preston,
Thank you for acknowledging this info which so many people shrug off as no big deal (take note Marc, my love). Lick the Sugar Habit is an extremely informative book. I have noticed over the years in myself and many others that sugar is as addictive as heroin if not more so.  There are so many correlations between the two in the brain and the body that leaves no doubt for me.  One is that if all sugars are stopped for 3-4 days the cravings go away.  That includes artificial replacements that trigger same brain activity and promote cravings. The madness that makes one run to the store at midnight for Hagen Das is gone. It brings this uncanny sense of peace when you realize you have control. What most people mistake as lack of willpower when it comes to sugar and refined carbs,is really something going on in the brain as well as the insulin cycle that happens which makes you crash and crave as well.  Sure you need to get proper protein and fats (no insulin response) as well as healthy carbs at the same time.
The food co’s know that sugar and the chemicals they put in food is addictive.  Just as the tobacco co’s always knew nicotine was addictive.  No nutrients plus sugar and chemicals breaking down the immune function leads to diease and a whole lot of folks getting pharaceuticals from their drs. who are romanced by the drug co’s. (yes I know there are exceptions). These chemicals (drugs can furthur tear down immune function (side effects).  And so it goes and so it goes.
Nothing matastacizes cancer quicker than sugar.  Which my observation starts with overgrowth of yeast and fungus(systemic), also sugar related.
As much as it sounds like my thing is health and nutrition it really is about people being empowered and not kept or turned out as victims.
Yes Julie, listen to your body, trust your intuition and learn and perceive what you can.  Use that same intuition in knowing who to trustwhen you go for help.
Take what you like and leave the rest.  No ones right about everything.  And no one will know you and your body as you can.  Self-reliance is a rush.
DHL,excellent advice.  It all goes hand in hand.
Martee

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] http://ibogaine.org/methadone2.html
Date: November 8, 2004 at 2:13:41 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks, Preston…It means a lot to receive your kind
words, and to have this awesome list’s support…

Julie  🙂

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Rachael & Jeff
Date: November 8, 2004 at 1:49:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel, yea weed, lots of weed. It was the only thing that really helped me. Having you there is very good thing for him. If I had had someone next to me I could have slept better. You are a queen and you both deserve the best.          Randy

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question about dopamine
Date: November 8, 2004 at 1:25:50 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is there any data on the effects of Ibogaine on the dopamine levels?
Before
and after. Does Ibogaine increase it in of itself or does it let the body
produce it better. Or does it do nothing to the level? If so would it help
people
with ADHD? How long would the effects lasts? Are there any claims about
Ibogaine helping people with ADHD? Any help welcomed.   Randy

ibogaine causes a decrease in extracellular dopamine in the nuclear
accumbens, presumably a result of increased dopaminergic activity, as it
increases concentrations of dopamine metabolites.

whether or not ibogaine has an effect on ADHD, it probably wouldn’t be
related to its dopaminergic activity. stimulants are believed to reduce
ADHD symptoms by increasing activity in the prefrontal cortex. the
prefrontal cortex is mainly responsible for the executive functions of the
mind… controlling attention and things like that… and that part of the
brain tends to be less active in people with ADHD.

i’m not sure if any studies have been done on ibogaine’s effect on
activity in the prefrontal cortex…

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list p.harmala
Date: November 8, 2004 at 1:24:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi,
I’m assuming this is a homeopathic by the name.  I’m also assuming that while you say gut ( usually refers to the intestine, which is located below or thereabouts the belly button.) your description seems to indicate you’re referring to the stomach and the nausea associated with the ibogaine experience in some or the stress in the stomach area (solar plexus, below the sternum) otherwise.  When you say yak it up do you mean talk without reflux type activity.  I would consider it a great find to know of a homeopathic that helps with reflux type activity as a general resource.
I personally experienced a kind of anxiety in that solar plexus area. What worked for me and I used it for about a month was two homeopathics. Ignatia Amara which is indicated for hypersensitivity,nervousness due to everyday stress (what constitutes everyday stress is so individual). This one I’ve also seen in some sleep formulas.  The other one isArgentum Nitrcum.  It is indicated for apprehension,stage fright with aggitation.  I first used these about 6 months ago when I had to take a puddle jumper to get to key west.  They worked like a charm.  I would take anywhere from 3-5 of the little pellets each. They’re approx 1mm ea in size.  The Bach flower Rescue Remedy also was useful.
As far as not getting a response to your post I’ve noticed when some are caught up in the moment of a hot topic on this list, other not relevant to their moment info can be put off for later or not as pertinent.  It may be that innate tendancy towards the rush that someone tried to explain to me about the human race!
I thank you for your reference.  Almost all physical stuff has an emotional base.  So I believe if you don’t deal with the emotional aspect of why you are ill or disfunctional (physically and otherwise) it will just manifest again or elsewhere in the body.   Any clarification would be appreciated.
Respectfully,
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 11:24 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list

More on the apparent ability of P. harmala extract to lessen the
stress of iboga on the gut, which oddly no one responded to. If you
take such an extract (w/out iboga) and then make an effort to yak
it up an hour or so later, you’ll notice that there is no acidity
in what comes up.

Anger is a tough one for me, still learning how to be with it.

A thought after sleeping on it – the goal seems to be to be able to
hold anger without burying it, choosing to display it when it can
help you achieve your goal. A therapist friend described properly-
used anger as a sword that you whip out and bring to the other
person’s throat, and just knowing you have it at your side makes
for a different posture in the world. Maybe holding anger without
expressing it in the situation requires expressing it somewhere
else to someone who is equipped to hear it and understand.

One big subtlety I’ve noticed is that one can say “I’m angry about .
.” and this is a whole different conversation from “You fucking
idiot …” which is what I’d feel like saying and then shut down
because of inability to be impolite.

The other day someone said I just need to develop my adult self,
and when this is done my wounded child will feel safe enough to
come out and heal. This reminds me of something Nick wrote a while
ago:

Generally it’s my opinion that the ego needs multiple “staging
posts” on it’s long journey toward true self-recognition. Even
though ultimately it’s merely a journey from here to here this
doesn’t seem to lessen the impact of the experience.

In this context the ego would be the parental self. So just acting
as mature as possible, understanding that the reason is to build
oneself up rather than conform, choosing the right battles, biding
one’s time as necessary, could be a program 🙂

I’m also reminded of this from ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com:

I don’t believe we have to polish our egos to the point of
getting
an “A”. I think a C+ will do. The universe is not so fucking
relentless as to require any sembance of perfection. A C+ will do

and then “we” can get out of the way.
Relax at that point and the separate sense will automatically
burn.

By the way, I’m angry about the US election results. Probably that
is already obvious 🙂

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Rachael & Jeff
Date: November 8, 2004 at 1:21:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie and all,

No worries.  He slept through the night after taking
one puff, so all the rest of us got some rest too.

I woke up to the sound of him biting into a piece of
apple, and was so happy to see him sitting up.  He’s
tried a few times to rally towards the bath, but it’s
a bit much.

The landscapers were around in the morning, chewing up
leaves and grass with really, really, REALLY loud
machines, and that was a bit hard on him.  But hey,
it’s now been four days since he was opiated and he
feels like it is out of those woods.

I got myself to a step meeting last night and hadn’t
realized what a strain I was under until I got in the
car and started bawling.  With all the risks entailed
in the treatment I’d really been “stuffing” a lot of
my feelings.  I feel honored to be part of this
healing journey, yet aware of a lot of tension.  I
also feel like I’m somatizing some of his stuff too…
which makes sense.  I wake up dehydrated and
dry-mouthed when I forget to water the houseplants,
and this morning I realized they were watered and I
was feeling Jeff’s dryness.

Also interesting – lying down and putting my head on
his pillow was like a major contact buzz.

OK, more later.

Love, Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Rachael & Jeff
Date: November 8, 2004 at 12:12:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Rachael and Jeff,

How are you both?  How are you feeling, Jeff?  We haven’t heard from you in a couple of days, and I’m a little worried.  Jeff, if it takes you a few days to get out of bed- don’t worry.  I think that’s pretty normal.  Eat and drink as much as you possibly can, and avoid unnecessary meds, as they can be stomach-unsettling.  Smoke weed- did wonders for me…

Please post soon…you can make it…

love Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard
Date: November 8, 2004 at 11:34:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

randy,

i’m sorry to hear people have been treating you this way.. i’m sure it’s
very frustrating.

i’ve never bought into the NA mentality, but i do think there are some
pearls of wisdom that can be found among the rest of the BS. one of them
that i think is especially true is that, to make a succcessfull recovery,
you have to change people, places, and things.

when you’re a junky, you’re entire world is constructed around junk..
everything you do relates to junk, everyone you interact with related to
junk.. like burroughs said “junkies aren’t interested in people, except as
suppliers of junk”..

if you want to move on from junk, you have to move on from that world. you
have to create yourself a new world, one that has nothing to do with
junk. and that means doing new things, going new places, and hanging out
with new people. it’s a difficult thing to do, to be sure… it can be
hard to let go of people and things that were so important  to you. but
it’s important to remember that they were so important to the junk you…
not the new you, who can be whatever you want him to be… but the
decisions you make from now on into the future will determine who that new
you is.

putting dope in front of you is an incredibly dickish thing to do. i think
howard is right when he says that they feel threatened… it  sounds like
they are acting out their own insecurities. it’s a perfectly natural thing
for them to do… but not especially constructive for you, to say the
least.. and probably not something you should be around right now..

good luck

jon

Howard, I will try and be as objective as I can. I have never had such a
clarity of mind so fast in recovery. It will take some getting used to.
I’m afraid
to trust my own intentions because everyone is telling me how sick I still
am
and have to do what this one or that one says to get anywhere. Now I’m
told
to get a counselor and get his opinion too. How am I to trust my own self
talk
if everyone is telling me how fucked up I am. There is plenty enough in my
head without me second guessing every move I make. I’m a lot more adamant
about
what I say and do now. I don’t think anyone really believes I’ll stay
clean to
follow through on what I’m talking about. Its one of those if you have to
ask,
you’ll never know things how Ibogaine has changed me. Except to you and
the
people on the list who have done the Ibogaine, its almost impossible to
explain
how much it has changed me. It takes first hand knowledge. I get angry now
but I don’t explode like I used to. I write tirades on the list but thats
healthy for me. Better than sticking a needle in my arm or kicking someone
ass or
getting beat on myself. Thats what I used to do with anger. Mostly
sticking
needles in my arm. Also I feel like the people that know me are afraid to
do
anything to knock me off of my recovery, or I should say care about me. I
had drugs
stuck in my face by people I thought care about me, just to see how I
would
react. Or so they say. I’m still learning and I’m still positive about
Ibogaine
and recovery. I just don’t like to be played with.             Randy

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 8, 2004 at 11:24:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

More on the apparent ability of P. harmala extract to lessen the
stress of iboga on the gut, which oddly no one responded to. If you
take such an extract (w/out iboga) and then make an effort to yak
it up an hour or so later, you’ll notice that there is no acidity
in what comes up.

Anger is a tough one for me, still learning how to be with it.

A thought after sleeping on it – the goal seems to be to be able to
hold anger without burying it, choosing to display it when it can
help you achieve your goal. A therapist friend described properly-
used anger as a sword that you whip out and bring to the other
person’s throat, and just knowing you have it at your side makes
for a different posture in the world. Maybe holding anger without
expressing it in the situation requires expressing it somewhere
else to someone who is equipped to hear it and understand.

One big subtlety I’ve noticed is that one can say “I’m angry about .
.” and this is a whole different conversation from “You fucking
idiot …” which is what I’d feel like saying and then shut down
because of inability to be impolite.

The other day someone said I just need to develop my adult self,
and when this is done my wounded child will feel safe enough to
come out and heal. This reminds me of something Nick wrote a while
ago:

Generally it’s my opinion that the ego needs multiple “staging
posts” on it’s long journey toward true self-recognition. Even
though ultimately it’s merely a journey from here to here this
doesn’t seem to lessen the impact of the experience.

In this context the ego would be the parental self. So just acting
as mature as possible, understanding that the reason is to build
oneself up rather than conform, choosing the right battles, biding
one’s time as necessary, could be a program 🙂

I’m also reminded of this from ibogaine@ibogaineproject.com:

I don’t believe we have to polish our egos to the point of
getting
an “A”. I think a C+ will do. The universe is not so fucking
relentless as to require any sembance of perfection. A C+ will do

and then “we” can get out of the way.
Relax at that point and the separate sense will automatically
burn.

By the way, I’m angry about the US election results. Probably that
is already obvious 🙂

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] http://ibogaine.org/methadone2.html
Date: November 8, 2004 at 11:10:33 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Strong thoughts your direction as well Julie.
It’s awesome to be reading so many messages lately from those folk just introduced to ibogaine’s wonders and freed from situations of addictive destructive behaviors, and seeing all the positive responses and determined positivity is heartening to say the least.
This is a beatiful thing folks, and a long time coming I’d say. Dana, Patrick, Howard (god, even what’s his name, Marc Emory) all of you and those who are just coming aboard, either to experience ibogaine or to simply learn more, all of you have my thanks and appreciation for working so long to get ibogaine into the public consciousness and into some of our hot little hands. My respect and even love for you all grows steadily day by day, for all those names and also those who I haven’t named here but are all doing in their own ways what they can to pass on this jewel and hope.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 8:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] http://ibogaine.org/methadone2.html

Hi,

It’s been 13 days since my treatment, and I am just now starting to feel much better.  Melatonin has put a serious dent in my insomnia- I started taking it yesterday, and within 20-40 minutes I am usually sleeping/dreaming.  It’s been 3.5 weeks since my last dose of methadone.

Most of the physical symptoms are gone, with the exception of sneezing, minor lethargy and a few chills/aches.  I have virtually NO cravings, which is brilliant, by my standards.

Thanks for asking,
Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Blessed be Iboga
Date: November 8, 2004 at 11:00:29 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

5 days to go for treatment,well,…until I leave Australia.
I will stop in Hong Kong for a couple of days and check
out some of their buildings,then to Holland on the 15th.<

I envy you your upcoming voyage Jasen. I’ve never been to Asia, nowhere near it (nor Australia for that matter), and I miss Holland fiercely at times. I know I’m personally going to need to go again through the ibogaine doorway, and would love to do it with Sara’s guidance and vibration when I do. We’ll see how that works out, no definite date in mind yet, but I do have this niggling little feeling that that might be a good idea for me next time. As much as I feel that doing it in my home is a good way to go, and might end up simply taking that route again anyway since it would be much, much, much cheaper for my extreme poverty lifestyle, I have a strong desire to visit with Sara and feel it might just be just enough different that it will click different ways in me and my mind, different and possibly substantial ways, ways that will be meaningful and needed and would be nice (or beneficial rather) to experience I think. Due to my physical troubles, home treatments are really best probably, but the change of location would be an important part of the session I do believe, even while feeling my location wasn’t something I personally had/have a problem with, contrary to some who’ve recently done treatments, or at least, contrary to what one of my “angels” thought and suggested.
So Jasen, while I don’t have any candles at the moment, I do have strong, positive, loving vibes being generated in my bright burning mind for you. Good luck and keep us updated.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Jasen Chamoun
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 4:23 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Blessed be Iboga

Hello Dear Randy,

This is fantastic,go  Randy go.
I appreciate your raw honesty,it is rare.
People like you are influencing people like myself(for the good)
that are about to do the treatment or are thinking about it.

I see your point about the change in you,but when you go
home not much else has changed.A couple of other
people made some good points about others not handling
your new refreshed state.

I know someone,about the only one I know now days
if I wanted to get on.(If I wanted to.)
This person,to feel better about themselves using and
being stuck in that “not nice” lifestyle will purposely
make sure they are seen by me,and go out of there
way to make an excuse to knock on my door with
some f….d up excuse. As they know odds are if I had them at
my door,I would break and use.

These people, in my opinion, want to feel better about
themselves so they want to get you into trouble
so as to feel better.

I once said to this person, “listen,I can’t see you any more”,
and they would say, ‘But we are friends, cant I come for a coffee
and chat sometimes. I would say,”you have to understand you
are the only person I know that can get on for me,and when
I see you,I might not be in a strong frame of mind,and use
you as an excuse to use.

I would say,”when I see you,you,..represent dope to me,
thats all.They are offended,but I think deep down they
understand.

Yes it all comes down to us and our decisions,however
I stand a better chance away from temptation.

5 days to go for treatment,well,…until I leave Australia.
I will stop in Hong Kong for a couple of days and check
out some of their buildings,then to Holland on the 15th.

Enough for now,I could write twice as much.
You are helping more than you know,Julie and the others.
With Smiles Jasen.
—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 5:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Blessed be Iboga

Amen brother. I had been conning DR’s since 85. They are the most consistent dealers in town. Play the game, pay ’em and walk with the dope. God I’m glad I found Ibogaine and I aint gotta’ do that no more. I’m starting to really like this.       Randy

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] http://ibogaine.org/methadone2.html
Date: November 8, 2004 at 8:53:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi,

It’s been 13 days since my treatment, and I am just now starting to feel much better.  Melatonin has put a serious dent in my insomnia- I started taking it yesterday, and within 20-40 minutes I am usually sleeping/dreaming.  It’s been 3.5 weeks since my last dose of methadone.

Most of the physical symptoms are gone, with the exception of sneezing, minor lethargy and a few chills/aches.  I have virtually NO cravings, which is brilliant, by my standards.

Thanks for asking,
Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 8, 2004 at 7:16:23 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jason,
Not babling at all.  In my book it is as reality based as one can get.  Nice to hear others have the same insight.  I don’t know your story, however I sense you will come out of this experience as best anyone can.  Stay strong, open and focused.  Here’s to all the faith you’ll ever need on this sojourn.
Much love and respect,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Jasen Chamoun
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2004 12:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

***I totaly agree,
I believe we know everything there is to know,we simply give up memeory of this when we come into the body.
I believe we are here to experience in body what we know to be conceptually true.For example;We all know what paraflying SEEMS like,but to
actually experience it in the flesh is different. We can see people on t.v. falling in love and can see it is wonderfull,but to experience it in the flesh is
a different thing.

So I believe(personal opinion and others opinion) that we are here to experience what we know to be conceptually true.When we get here we give up
memory of who we truly are so we can create ourselves anew and have different experiences. We try to remember who we truly are,and remember
what we all know,then react to that memory. Cause and effect. For every action there is a reaction.Every word thought and action has a conseqence
to what we bring forth to experience. Just my babling thoughts.

***  With smiles Jasen.

Dear Paula,

I greed with you but we have to say that as Jung said before “all mankind have shared memory. Jung calls it “shadow archetype” Iboga sessions prove it. Common visions including similiar visions about arkaik ancestors. I believe that our subconsciousness tells us many thing also says about our health conditions. Carl G. Jung is very very interesting psychiatrist but if you don’t know about him and hes “Shadow Archetype” you have to read him. Beacuse it’s impossible to tell you with my poor English skill.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Blessed be Iboga
Date: November 8, 2004 at 4:23:00 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Dear Randy,

This is fantastic,go  Randy go.
I appreciate your raw honesty,it is rare.
People like you are influencing people like myself(for the good)
that are about to do the treatment or are thinking about it.

I see your point about the change in you,but when you go
home not much else has changed.A couple of other
people made some good points about others not handling
your new refreshed state.

I know someone,about the only one I know now days
if I wanted to get on.(If I wanted to.)
This person,to feel better about themselves using and
being stuck in that “not nice” lifestyle will purposely
make sure they are seen by me,and go out of there
way to make an excuse to knock on my door with
some f….d up excuse. As they know odds are if I had them at
my door,I would break and use.

These people, in my opinion, want to feel better about
themselves so they want to get you into trouble
so as to feel better.

I once said to this person, “listen,I can’t see you any more”,
and they would say, ‘But we are friends, cant I come for a coffee
and chat sometimes. I would say,”you have to understand you
are the only person I know that can get on for me,and when
I see you,I might not be in a strong frame of mind,and use
you as an excuse to use.

I would say,”when I see you,you,..represent dope to me,
thats all.They are offended,but I think deep down they
understand.

Yes it all comes down to us and our decisions,however
I stand a better chance away from temptation.

5 days to go for treatment,well,…until I leave Australia.
I will stop in Hong Kong for a couple of days and check
out some of their buildings,then to Holland on the 15th.

Enough for now,I could write twice as much.
You are helping more than you know,Julie and the others.
With Smiles Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 08, 2004 5:32 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Blessed be Iboga

Amen brother. I had been conning DR’s since 85. They are the most consistent dealers in town. Play the game, pay ’em and walk with the dope. God I’m glad I found Ibogaine and I aint gotta’ do that no more. I’m starting to really like this.       Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] car crash- or how I came to love opiates
Date: November 8, 2004 at 3:00:07 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, you and I have a lot of parallels. I came to the same conclusion about living life as if it’s the only day you have after watching what happened in Nam and reading On The Beach and about 103 other books on nuclear warfare. I had a colostomy bag on me for about 6 months then did the surgery all over again to reconnect my colon. My son was 3 months old and almost lost his father. I don’t remember being in intensive care at all. I remember my little brother had this look on his face and at that point I started to worry whether or not I was going to make it. The peritonitis almost killed me. The doc said if I had been a day or two later with the surgery I would have died. I believe him. And the gas pains? I got switched from morphine to dilaudid because of them and the morphine quit working. I worked up Sister Morphine shortly there after. I swear when I do that song I feel high. Even now. I play that song every chance I get.               Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Blessed be Iboga
Date: November 8, 2004 at 2:32:25 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Amen brother. I had been conning DR’s since 85. They are the most consistent dealers in town. Play the game, pay ’em and walk with the dope. God I’m glad I found Ibogaine and I aint gotta’ do that no more. I’m starting to really like this.       Randy

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] car crash- or how I came to love opiates
Date: November 7, 2004 at 11:13:50 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

maybe I was naieve or just stupid, but my first 6 months of having a (smoking tar on foil) habit, I would either run out of dope or money and be sick a couple days, thinking it was just a flu and I could deal with it no problem. I had not been introduced to 16th and Mission or the bowels of the Tenderloin yet, but that soon followed. Then I found myself on tour with a band in Colorado in January (can you say 30 below) with no dope and I got really really really REALLY sick, a handful of percs from an understanding soul and it finally dawned on me that I had a pretty bad habit. I cold turkey’d it just once after that, only cause I was locked up in a treatment facility.

blessed be iboga to deliver us from the depths.

_.dh

On Sunday, November 7, 2004, at 05:09 PM, Preston Peet wrote:

But as noted, I wasn’t at all aware of getting high and opiates and addiction and withdrawals or any of that at the time of this particular story and photo, so wasn’t able to take advantage of anything.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] car crash- or how I came to love opiates
Date: November 7, 2004 at 10:09:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeah, while I wasn’t aware enough of the whole “getting high” thing at the time of my accident, having only to that point smoked one maybe two joints worth of pot in my whole life, by the time I hit Beth Israel, I was fully aware of how cool it was to have a ready-made insert into my vein, what with those cool IV thingies I could simply stick the rig into a boot without having to fight for a vein.
Of course, I blew the IV within one or two injections of cocaine here in NYC one time while hospitalized, but still, it was cool while it lasted.
;-))
But as noted, I wasn’t at all aware of getting high and opiates and addiction and withdrawals or any of that at the time of this particular story and photo, so wasn’t able to take advantage of anything.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 9:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] car crash- or how I came to love opiates

I had emergency colon surgery in 85. They gave dilaudid IV every 2 hours. Took about 2 minutes to figure out how to rig the IV to flow fast enough to give me a rush. I did that for 10 days till they caught me. Never missed a shot. After that well………………..   Randy

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Preston,thanx,re:choc.& superheroes
Date: November 7, 2004 at 9:35:37 PM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’s always an eye opener to see something in print that backs up something I’ve incorporated into my health regime.
Specifically re: “neuro-protective and neuro-regenerative effects” of an anti-oxidant in cocoa.
The big joke in this article is that the sugar and the milk once mixed with the chocolate make it more harmfull, than of any benefit at all.
The original bean, which I get organic,(we don’t want chemicals mucking up the results) are referred to as cacoa (cacow) beans .  It has been an aid in my ongoing detoxification and cleansing regime but in a really fun and practical way.
I was told it helps the serotonin levels in the brain and also regulates the pancreas (blood sugar issues).
I put together a beverage that I can take with me as well as drink in the am.
No sugar.  Starting with the Zone premise of 40% protein, 30% carbs and 30%fat which I adjusted to my own needs which is a little more protein dependent and a little less carb.   My protein is an egg white vanilla potein powder that is sweetened with stevia(natural healthy sugar substitute-it’s a plant( i usually dislike stevia but it works in this).  My carb  is unsweetened carob powder which is also healing .  My fat content is cocoanut milk (in a pinch unsweetened organic shredded cocoanut will work).  I ground up in what used to be my coffee grinder 1/4 c. or less of the cacoa beans.  Dump all of above into a blender with water and it tastes like a thick chocolate shake but has no sugar and is completely sustaining for energy if you can’t or don’t want to eat.  It, as I said is also part of why I think I feel so good aside from 10 other things I do on a regular basis.
I find continuing with the cleansing process the ibogaine started is happening all on it’s own.  I just work with what’s happening and help things along at a rate I am comfortable with.
By the way the article also brought to mind that movie “Jacobs Ladder”.
Was that based on a true story?   It’s completely believable.
Hope some will take this info and use it.
Martee

If you’re going to attempt this beverage don’t be fat phobic and cut out the fat.  It is as important in keeping you level and sane as is the protein.  Our brain is a large percentage of fat.  Personally one of my theories (conspiracy) is that the low fat, no fat diet (which meant higher sugar ingestion) was responsible for so many people of all ages going on antidepresants, as well as every other health problem of the last two decades.   I’ll stop now.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] car crash- or how I came to love opiates
Date: November 7, 2004 at 9:10:51 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I had emergency colon surgery in 85. They gave dilaudid IV every 2 hours. Took about 2 minutes to figure out how to rig the IV to flow fast enough to give me a rush. I did that for 10 days till they caught me. Never missed a shot. After that well………………..   Randy

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] car crash- or how I came to love opiates
Date: November 7, 2004 at 5:56:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

for me it was february 20th 1990, I flipped a van on black ice and broke my back on I-5 at the calif/oregon border. not that i hadn’t had plenty of chippin under my belt, but after 2/20/90 it was ON.

On Sunday, November 7, 2004, at 09:51 AM, Preston Peet wrote:

HI all,
So I’m sitting here loading up links for today’s news updates at DrugWar.com, and realized that today is Nov. 7. I’m thinking, why is this date significant to me? It didn’t take that long to remember. Here’s why (and how I became introduced to morphine too).

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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] http://ibogaine.org/methadone2.html
Date: November 7, 2004 at 4:36:47 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Julie, I’m curious how you are feeling afterwards, I’m sorry if you already sent a report, but I can’t locate it.  Hope your doing good.

Post your free ad now! Yahoo! Canada Personals

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: [NEWSROOM-L] Sci-Fi Superheroes
Date: November 7, 2004 at 3:40:25 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

At the same time, the Air Force Research Laboratory’s Warfighter

Fatigue Countermeasure program is looking into a drug known as
Modafinil which can reportedly keep people awake for up to 88
hours without sleep;

http://www.modafinil.com/article/uk.html

You can order it from the net. A much cheaper variety of the same
class of drugs is Adrafinil, which I have tried. It is not an
enjoyable form of awakeness, just slightly better than caffeine.

http://www.erowid.org/smarts/adrafinil/
http://www.erowid.org/smarts/modafinil/modafinil.shtml
http://www.antiaging-systems.net/adrafinil-modafinil.htm

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] car crash- or how I came to love opiates
Date: November 7, 2004 at 2:51:05 PM EST
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
So I’m sitting here loading up links for today’s news updates at DrugWar.com, and realized that today is Nov. 7. I’m thinking, why is this date significant to me? It didn’t take that long to remember. Here’s why (and how I became introduced to morphine too).
—-

Chapter 7-

Car Crash- or How I Came to Love Opiates (A Flashback)

“Come on guys, we’ll go to my girlfriend’s place, down on Siesta Key. It’ll be a blast!”

Big Mark comes up with the idea of where to go, and the rest of us are all game. Siesta Key is a long way to drive to have a couple of beers and act like grown-ups. We’re all teenaged Boy Scouts, all but one of us Eagle Scouts, itching to spread our wings, to try out new-found freedoms, to experiment and play with life as much as we can.

We’d all worked together the previous summer on the Camp Flying Eagle staff, running the camp and pretending to be adults, and now we’re out here again, training other scouts their wilderness skills. Teaching younger boys the skills to survive in the woods, or swim, or any of the other skills taught during camp has a manly feel to it. Being out in the woods adds to the feeling, the adventure, getting the testosterone flowing, leading us to think of ourselves as more grown-up than we really are.

Feeling the camaraderie, I don’t want to back out, to be chicken, because for the first time in my life I feel on equal footing to my peers, and don’t want them to think me a pussy. When Mark suggests driving 40 miles round trip, to go out drinking, I don’t raise any objections, I just follow the herd.

Mark’s girlfriend lives on Siesta Key, off the coast of Sarasota, Florida, with her parents. Some type of medical doctor, who I can see must be doing very well as their home is huge. To reach it, we must drive down a long, winding, private road I’ve never known existed, even though I’ve been raised in Sarasota and my own grandmother lives here on the island too. After one or two wrong turns, we get it right, pulling into the driveway in front of this grand, ultra-modern monstrosity of a three story, white, cubic house.

Inside, Mark immediately takes the lead, telling us to follow. Mary, his girlfriend, is surprised to see the six of us trooping in behind Mark, but doesn’t mind. She’s happy to party with us. Mark walk to a bookcase against one wall, takes out a book, and reaching into the gap left where the book was, pushed a button. There’s an audible “click,” then a segment of the bookcase swings out an inch or so. Mark grabs the edges of the now-ajar bookshelf and pulls it back to reveal a room right out of some Allen Quartermain novel.

This room is amazing, at least two stories tall with a loft and a bar both upstairs and downstairs. There are three rugs made from the skins of different animals lying on the floor-a zebra, a bear and a tiger skin, as well as a fully stuffed lion standing in the corner. Scores of big-game fish are mounted about the walls, above the numerous glass cases inside of which are mounted a huge assortment of intricate, ornately decorated handguns and rifles.

I’ve never seen such grandeur in a private home before, and am a bit awed. Mark breaks out the Schlitz Malt Liquor and we begin to play quarters on the glass table in front of the big projection tv, under the loft. We play repeated rounds, slamming glass after glass of the cheapest of cheap beers down ourselves. No one wants to be considered a lightweight, so everyone tries to drink as much as possible, but I hate drinking, so don’t get as plastered as the rest of the guys.

It doesn’t take too long before a couple of the others are getting sick, racing to throw up in the toilet as Mary shrieks, “Make it! Don’t throw up on Father’s dead animals!” Finally only Mark and I are awake, with the rest passed out in a variety of odd positions around the room.

We watch a movie, then begin to wake the other guys so we can get back to Flying Eagle before dawn, so as not to get busted for having snuck out of the camp without telling anyone we were leaving. We’d pushed the car all the way up the camp drive to the highway so as to avoid waking any of the Scout Masters and other adults at the camp, and we’d like to get back in without alerting anyone as well.

I’ve got a bad feeling as we all climb back into the car, what with a drunk guy driving, but I don’t really consider the implications and do not speak up about it. Nobody does. We’re all young, most just 16, a couple a whole 17 years of age.

The roads at this early morning hour are empty, and Mark pushed the pedal to the floor, racing to get back before the sun rises. At times reaching speeds of 100 or more miles an hour, Mark and I are both exhilarated by the speed and wind, the feeling of being young and possibly in trouble. The guys in the back of the car are not exhilarated at all, they’re all either asleep or sick and trying not to spew in the back of Mark’s car. One or two came close to alcohol poisoning tonight.

Luckily for them all, they make it back to Flying Eagle in one piece, the camp still dark and sleeping when they arrive, coasting to a stop in the same spot they’d pushed the car away from the night before.

My dad is also the scoutmaster of my Boy Scout troop, Troop 24. So if I gets caught by my scoutmaster, I’m really going to be in real trouble, but I make it into my tent and sleeping bag without alerting a single soul I’m up. I’m asleep almost as soon as my head hits the ground. It seems like only minutes later, because it is only minutes later, when I hear the other campers around me stirring. The morning is spent gathering up all belongings and saying goodbye to all the friends from other cities around the area. I can’t shake the bad feeling I had climbing into the car out on Siesta Key earlier that morning, but I put it down to fatigue. I’ve only had nearly an hour of sleep. Even at 16 I need more than that to feel rested. My dad finally says it’s time to go. I ask if I may drive the car home.

I’ve only had my driver’s license for 2 months. I’m very much in love with driving, asking incessantly for the privilege of driving any time I’m in the car with dad. He usually does let me too. This morning he hesitates, but relents when I ask once more for the keys.

We climb into the car, I start the engine, turn on the stereo and blast the local classic rock station, and Dad turns it down, then I hit the gas and spin the tires in the dirt as I pull the car out and onto the drive heading out of camp. A new Toyota, it’s a light car and easy to make fly. “Slow it down a bit,” says my Dad, trying to sound stern, but he can’t quite pull it off.

I turn out of camp onto the Upper Manatee River Road. This road goes on for miles, a long, two-lane country road through endless orange groves and pastures. I’ve been traveling this road all my life, every summer going to and from camp and camping at Flying Eagle on other occasions throughout the years. I feel confident, safe while driving this road. The November morning air is crisp and cool, the sky utterly azure blue without a single cloud to be found. I’m lulled into a complacent space, and not paying too much attention to my driving when we finally reach the big turn South towards Sarasota, the one wide, curving turn on the whole road.

My fingers are loosely holding the wheel, so loosely that I allow the car to drift, just a tiny little bit. It’s enough to make a disaster though. When the tires cross the first of two flattened spots in the road, the centifrigual force throws the car off the road to the right, into a two and a half foot deep rut that runs alongside the road. This acts as a rail, directing the car back onto the road and across the centerline. I try to fix the swerving of the car but overcompensate, taking the car into an uncontrollable slide back and forth across the centerline. I just miss the first car in a line of three, swerving out of its way just before impact. Back into our own lane we go, then back across into oncoming traffic, this time out of luck.

I see my Dad out of the corner of my eye, raising his arms before his face, screaming out loud at the same time, a stomach curdling sound I’ve never heard before. I can hear the scream going on and on, watching as the oncoming radiator gets larger and larger in slow motion, out of a nightmare I cannot awake from. All I can see is this grill racing towards us at 55 miles an hour, matching our 45 mph, and hear my Dad screaming and screaming-then impact erases all thought, all sensation, all terror and fear, all of it gone in an instant, there’s just darkness and a vast nothing at all. The scream is finally over.

There’s nothingness for some while, filled with dreams I can’t quite remember but are nonetheless extremely vivid and real. Confused, I’m suddenly aware there is someone leaning over me, blocking out the bright sunlight I’d not until then been aware was burning into my eyes. What does this person want? There seems to be a lot of commotion behind the guy, something is happening but I can’t figure it out. The man leaning over him speaking to him again, but I don’t understand him. I force myself to pay attention, wondering at the same time what I’m doing lying flat on my back on the road, staring up into such a beautiful blue sky.

“I’m going to have to cut your shirt off,” says the man to me, “ok?”

I’m wearing my favorite shirt but don’t feel up to arguing with the guy. It feels like important, that this guy wants to cut his shirt off, but the fog settles over me again, taking me away.

The next thing I’m aware of is the tube stuck down my throat, forcing me to breath at a steady pace, and the pain. Pain is all encompassing, everywhere, I cannot escape it. I would like to scream myself, to drown out the again reverberating scream out of my Dad, because it is accentuating my pain, giving it a keening feel, almost a pitch that hurts my ears along with everything else, but I can’t because this tube is blocking my doing anything of the kind. Bright white light is all I can see, unable to make out a single detail to break up the white monotony, but I never feel I am dead. The pain doesn’t allow for that. When I try to move there’s no reactions at all from my muscles. I cannot lift even a finger, I find out later due to the drugs I’ve been given which are keeping me paralyzed so I don’t move around and open up any of my now stitched wounds. All I can get to move are my eyeballs and even they aren’t working so well. All the while I’m trying to force this or that limb to twitch, there’s this irritating, painful tube shoved into my mouth and down my throat, forcing air into my lungs in the most unnatural, evenly spaced breathing I’ve ever done. I can’t sigh, I can’t gasp, I can’t hold my breath, I can only feel my lung as they fill and deflate over and over again.

Next time I open my eyes, my Mom is standing next to my bed with her friend Joel, my old piano teacher and friend of the family. I try to speak but still can’t with my lungs being pumped at their steady rhythm. I still can’t move any muscles either, except those in the fingers of my right hand. Not ever realizing consciously that I’m paralyzed, I just go about the task of making myself understood. I can’t speak, I can’t communicate with anything other than my fingers, so I’m forced to play a bizarre game of charades with them. Joel somehow picks up on what I want right away, bringing me a pad and pen, bracing the pad for me as I try to scribble out questions.

“Is that the same machine they have on Star Trek,” is my first question, about the pinging machine next to my bed, the heart monitor. I don’t realize how messed up I am yet. But my next question goes right to the point.

“Is Dad ok? How is he?” Somewhere in my mind I know there’s been a serious accident but I’m unclear as to the particulars. “Where is he?”

Mom tries to explain things to me, telling me that Dad is in a different hospital and that his injuries are very different than those I’ve suffered, but I don’t get what she’s saying. All I grasp is that Dad is alive and that soothes me somewhat.

It’s a couple more weeks before I’m moved out of Intensive Care and into the Progressive Intensive Unit. My doctor starts me on a diet of clear liquids, my first intake of any food at all since the accident. My good friend Jim calls on the room phone to tell me he’s going to visit, and I ask him to smuggle in a couple of Sprites. I’m only allowed clear broth still, but in the pain wracked, morphine addled state I’m in, I don’t consider there to be any danger, especially since Sprite is also a clear liquid.

I wake a few hours later to the sound of Jim laughing at me, as I’ve fallen asleep while hanging onto the trapeze over the bed that’s there to help me pull myself around and adjust my position. There’s a pin through my right shin bone holding my leg to take the weight off my shattered femur. Jim makes up for laughing at me by placing two ice cold Sprites on the bed table next to me.

“Oh shit Jim, thanks so much,” I tell him as I crack the first can. Pouring it into a cup, I down it all one swallow after another. I don’t want to get caught with the sodas, so I do the same to the second, slamming it down as fast as I can swallow. “That was good, again, thanks man.”

Later that afternoon, I begin to suffer excruciating stomach pains. As the hours pass the pain grows steadily worse and worse, driving me into a panic. I tell the nurses it’s gas, and they take me at my word, but are unable to do much for me. I don’t tell them about the Sprites. After trying everything they can think of, they resort to shoving a tube up my nose and down my throat to try and draw the gas out manually, but to no avail. So they give a call to my surgeon, who is on call but doesn’t show up for a couple more hours. In the meantime, my family doctor drops by for a visit, just to say hello, and as soon as he sees me, he turns and pretty much runs to the nurses station.

“That boy has to get to surgery right now!” he almost yells telling them in no uncertain terms that I have to have surgery right away or I am going to die as I have peritonitis, the same thing that happens when an appendix bursts, and I’m rapidly sinking into death.

I’ve had parts of both my large and small intestines already removed. Apparently some leaking holes in both were missed by the surgeons first time around but easily found by the clear liquid, so now those holes are leaking Sprite and broth into my abdomen, poisoning me to death’s door.

In the course of the next four month hospital stay, I go through a number of trips to emergency surgery, my stomach and intestines refusing to bond, to close and heal. For most of that time I’m not able to eat or drink anything, to put nothing in my mouth but ice chips. I fixate on television commercials for food. I stare out the window at the yacht club I can see on the waterfront outside, dreaming of entering upon my release from the hospital to order a large frosty orange juice.

I’m given a shot of morphine every two and a half hours for the first couple of months, directly into my IV drip, then the shots are moved back to an every four hour schedule, intramuscularly. I get very strung out on dope. At one point the surgeon has the gall to ask my Mom if I have a drug problem as my wounds are simply refusing to heal, ignoring all the morphine he’s pumping into me.

When finally released from Manatee Memorial Hospital, I am taken home have dinner with my family, then go right back to another hospital for another two week stay. There is yet more surgery conducted the following Summer after I have more complications and have to be rushed to the hospital again.

My Dad has his own troubles related to the accident. He has to remain in the hospital for three months himself, then go through months of excruciating physical therapy to get his right arm and mouth working again. His arm was smashed along with his skull, which necessitated much surgery on both.

This is a seminal event in my life, this crash, my boy to manhood initiation. I do a lot of thinking while lying in my hospital bed, often lying in the dark, stoned out of my mind on morphine in agony still, running the realities of life around in my mind as I interpret them. Live as though it’s the last day of life becomes my credo. I reach no other conclusions than that it’s not safe to be sure of anything in life, that it could all end in an instant. And that I love morphine.
—–

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 7, 2004 at 2:41:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Wow Randy, it’s great to see how quickly you’re figuring out stuff
and integrating it, and how supportive the list has been. My
experience (not addiction-related) is that healing takes time, for
individuals and often for relationships, when it is possible. Anger
is a tough one for me, still learning how to be with it. Keep up
the good work!

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 17:08:09 -0800 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
OK Randy,

That all makes sense now.  I couldn’t understand what was going on

with your
friends until you described them as having a philosophical
construct where
their own existence is based on how they think you should be
responding.  Their
own well being is based on a different world view.  What you say
and represent
threatens their belief system and hence there existence.

I am not saying these people were not your friends but, they were
your
friends based on a common belief system.  Anything that threatens
a belief system
frightens people. You threatened that belief system.

Howard

In a message dated 11/6/04 6:03:02 PM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
writes:

Well, I didn’t want to bore anyone with triviata but here goes. I

have
a
friend who came to Lexington KY and pulled me up and dusted me
off and
took me to
his house in Erie Pa. He told me I didn’t have to work, just keep

an eye
on
the kids. At this point no one including my mother wanted
anything to do
with
me. My brothers avoided me like the plague. I really don’t
remember much
about
the last couple of months I was in KY. This guy is going through
some tough

times so I went to Erie to try and help. Before anyone takes what

I say
out of
context “AGAIN” I want to say I didn’t use, I’m not going to use,

I just
got
kinda depressed at the state of what used to be my best friend. I’

m hooked
into
the recovery people in Erie so I went to get my old job back and
set up

therapy. I went to AA meetings and got out to see my clean
friends. Well,
people who
knew me drugged don’t seem comfortable with me clean. I feel like

I’m not

allowed to talk about Ibogaine or anything else for that matter
till I
jump
through hoops and act subservient and let everyone kick me in the

balls
emotionally.
Fuck that. I’m clean I’m going to stay clean and the longer
people fuck
with
my program the more people die in KY from addiction or direct
results
therein.

Some else goes to KY and I’ll quit worrying about it. I think I
know everyone

in the underground and no one has any intent on going there.
These people
are
committing crime against each other and dying by the day. Fuck a
bunch
of
hillbillies huh. I’m angry. I’m real fucking angry. I have to let

people
who
don’t know me make decisions about my life and my recovery based
on
assumptions.

It seems that when I’m fucked up I let people push me around and
put me
where I
belong in the scheme of things. Clean I have no intentions of
letting any
one
push me around or getting in way of my goals. I have tried to be
clean
for so
long I get the feeling people around me are just waiting for
everything
to
get back to normal and I’m nodding off at the supper table. If I
act
confident

about anything people in recovery say I should just sit listen
and not
say
anything. I talk too much. I sat in the rooms of AA for two
fucking years
and
didn’t say anything. I think it’s all about ego. There’s and mine.

But
since I
just got clean 6 weeks ago I have nothing worthy to say. The
people in
the music
scene are used to me playing and letting loud ass guitar players
cut over
my
harp leads or sax or letting some dude sing who is a legend in
his tone
deaf
mind. No fucking more. Stay in the mix and learn your parts like
I did
or get
out of the fucking way.       Randy

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [NEWSROOM-L] Sci-Fi Superheroes
Date: November 7, 2004 at 2:40:21 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The following was posted by Leigh Meyers on Jules Siegel’s Newsroom-L journalism list, and I thought the rest of you might be interested in reading it.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

—– Original Message —– From: “Leigh Meyers” <leighcmeyers@YAHOO.COM>
To: <NEWSROOM-L@LISTS.NETSPACE.ORG>
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 10:22 AM
Subject: [NEWSROOM-L] Sci-Fi Superheroes

OT: The story I read about Karl Rove’s father stated that he was an
engineer working for the company(s) that designed the concentration
camps… I have not tried to verify this. Also, parents *do* have a lot of
influence on the belief systems of their children, even when separated
at birth. I have empirical evidence, and studies that are taught in SOC1
*and* PSYCH1 expound in detail on this topic, but that is for
another post.
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

I was chewed out somewhere along the line for suggesting that a commentator
suggested that 40% +- combat troops are on anti-deppresants and “speed”.
Maybe not right now… but sooner than later.
Read on….

I think I’ve said this somewhere along
the line, but not quite as eloquently:
~~
“During the Vietnam War, massive amounts of money, firepower, and high-tech
weaponry proved unable to stamp out an enemy that regularly used punji sticks
(sharpened bamboo) as a weapon. Today in Iraq, billions upon billions of
dollars
in military and intelligence spending for satellites, state-of-the-art
surveillance devices, stealth bombers, fighter jets, tanks, Bradley Fighting
Vehicles, Humvees, heavy weapons, night-vision devices, high tech drones,
experimental weaponry and all the trappings of Technowar, though capable of
killing large numbers of people, are again unable to stop resistance fighters
who lack heavy armor, airpower, spy satellites, body armor, or high-tech gear
and fight with AK-47s – a rifle designed in the 1940s – pickup trucks, and
bombs
detonated by garage-door openers.”

Sci-Fi Superheroes
By Nicholas Turse, Tomdispatch.com
Posted on October 16, 2004
http://www.alternet.org/story/20201/
http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/20201
Even if you never read the comic book or watched the hopelessly
low-production-value 1960s cartoon, chances are you’ve at least seen the image
of Captain America – the slightly ridiculous looking superhero in a
form-fitting, star-spangled bodysuit. If you’re still hazy on “Cap,” he was
Steve Rogers, a 4-F weakling during World War II who, through the miracle of
“modern science” (a “super soldier serum”) became an Axis-smashing powerhouse –
the pinnacle of human physical perfection and the ultimate American
fighting-man.

In the 1940s comic, Rogers had taken part in a super-soldier experiment, thanks
to the interventions of an Army general and a scientist in a secret government
laboratory. He was to be the first of many American super-soldiers, but due to
poor note-keeping methods and the efforts of a Nazi assassin, he became the
sole
recipient of the serum. Today, however, the dream of Captain America turns out
to be alive and well – and lodged in the Pentagon. The U.S. military aims to
succeed where those in the four-color comic book world failed. By using high
technology and cutting edge biomedicine, the military hopes to create an entire
army of Captain Americas – a fighting force devoid of “Steve Rogers” or any
other “Joe Average,” and made up instead of super-soldiers whose human-ness
has been all but banished.

24-Hour Soldiers
The military has long been interested in creating an always-on, 24-hour
fighting
man. During the Vietnam War, the Army undertook extensive studies on the
effects
of sleep deprivation. At the time, however, all the military could offer was
copious amounts of amphetamines to keep men wired for combat.

As in the Vietnam era, the military is again stretched thin and, with National
Guard recruiting having fallen 12 percent below goal in the first three
quarters
of 2004, in need of troops. What better way to forestall future manpower crises
than by creating two-for-the-price-of-one soldiers who never need to sleep?

To this end, the Department of Defense’s blue-skies research outfit, the
Defense
Advanced Research Projects Agency (DARPA), currently has a “Preventing Sleep
Deprivation Program.” Its aim is to work on ways to enable a pilot “to fly
continuously for 30 hours,” Green Berets to carry out 48-72 hours of sustained
activity, or “advancing ground troops [to] engage in weeks of combat operations
with only 3 hours of sleep per night” – all without suffering from cognitive or
psychomotor impairments.

Scientists in the military-industrial-academic complex are hard at work for
DARPA on this line of research. At Wake Forest University, for instance,
researchers are studying a class of medicines known as “Ampakines” which are
thought to be protective against the cognitive deficits ordinarily associated
with sleep deprivation. At Columbia University, new imaging technologies are
being employed as part of a program to study the “neuro-protective and
neuro-regenerative effects” of an anti-oxidant found in cocoa. (In low-tech
World War II, they just gave the grunts chocolate bars.) Who’s conducting this
line of research for DARPA? Why, researchers at the Salk Institute and also at
that all-chocolate-all-the-time company Mars Inc. – yes, the folks who bring
you
M&M’s and Snickers!

At the same time, the Air Force Research Laboratory’s Warfighter Fatigue
Countermeasure program is looking into a drug known as Modafinil which can
reportedly keep people awake for up to 88 hours without sleep; while […]
http://www.alternet.org/story/20201/
http://www.alternet.org/module/printversion/20201

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Jasen
Date: November 7, 2004 at 12:54:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you for the kind words, and please know that I already have a nice candle ready for your treatment- purple, the colour of mysticism and spirituality.  Please remind me of when you have that scheduled….

hugs,
Julie
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Anyone from New Orleans here?
Date: November 7, 2004 at 12:41:08 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As you know there will be an ibogaine roundtable at the harm reduction
conference in New Orleans. Anyone from New Orleans on this list?

Howard

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard /Randy
Date: November 7, 2004 at 8:13:15 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,  Thank you for such a warm acknowledgment.   Keep the faith.  Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 6:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard /Randy

Martee, I’ve been sending E mail all night and I was saving yours till last. You have a way of getting right to my heart. How do you do that? You brought tears to my eyes. AGAIN. Words of encouragement, or stern words of wisdom, you know just what to say to me. I needed to hear what you said. I got beat up emotionally pretty bad over the past week and I am way to highly strung for that. I have to learn to avoid the pitfalls. I’m just too honest, and true to my southern heritage, I am loyal to a fault. People have used these traits against me all my life. But I am learning fast. I am proud to be in a group of people who aren’t afraid to do whats necessary to stay clean and to pick themselves up if they fall. Ibogaine is the answer to a lot of problems. I’ll be in the city soon. I hope I see you. Thanx for being here.  Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from T…
Date: November 7, 2004 at 7:43:19 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara, I don’t have to worry about me in the army but my son is 19 and extremely athletic and they take one look at him and he’s in Iraq. He is very smart, thinks quick on his feet and has the hand eye coordination of a cat. I think I’ll send him to Canada tomorrow. I pray they don’t start a draft.    Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: November 7, 2004 at 7:26:35 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Shelley,

You can eamil me , that will not be a problem, I have no agenda for the next year.

Sara
Van: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 5 november 2004 3:58
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas

Hi Sara ,Im gonna be bold & break up the political talk ,hey Sara Id like to come get an ibogaine treatment ,(not to interrupt addiction but for spiritual growth )next year ,should i email you for details?Shelley

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
I’m Glad not to be an American, and not to live in the US.

200,000 people die each year in the US from getting the wrong medication ,
wrong treatment. People die all the time everywhere, but you got the mater
to disaster as a president.

I just hope that those American who promised to pay me back for treatments
will do that, what goes around comes around. disastrous people with no
dignity.

Sara









—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai] 
Verzonden: donderdag 4 november 2004 17:36
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist
dictator from Texas

>> But, I do have a tendency to believe the “Purple 
>> Heart” stories about Kerry are true. 

Very sad – you could research the facts, but that would contradict 
what you want to believe.

>> And, also to shoot a wounded, running, man is the back is 
>> something I would have a problem with, even in 
>> war.

But ok to dodge the war, use others to lie about your opponent’s 
heroism, hide from danger rather than lead after 9/11, alienate 
your allies, start a war on false pretences that creates 
innumerable new enemies, and not take care of your troops. Versus 
killing someone in the heat of battle who was about to kill you and 
your men and might still be a threat, following an act of heroism 
totally at odds with Bush’s champion party-going stature during 
that period of history.

In electing Bush, the US has put its head in the sand and offered 
its behind to the most cynically self-interested group to come 
along in our lifetime. They are intent on shredding the 
constitution and enriching themselves. The increase in terrorism 
that they are cultivating will only help keep them in power. The 
democrats will likely be forced to play the same game because that 
is what the people want. Osama is fully succeeding in baiting the 
US into bankrupting itself. Here’s the full text of his recent 
address to the people of the US:

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/79C6AF22-98FB-4A1C-B21F-
2BC36E87F61F.htm




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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] hovering
Date: November 7, 2004 at 7:20:18 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara, D the Greek Freak say, “I love you!!!!”  His
hair   is growing in nice, by the way (says me).<

Hair? Hair? D has hair now? LOL, I don’t believe it.
Please tell him hello from me as well. I should call. I’ve been slacking off on keeping close personal contact with certain folk. I can’t explain why, ’cause I don’t know the answer to that. But for some reason I’ve been feeling I need a drastic change somewhere in some way, and so I’ve been sorta staying outta the loop if you will, shirking even my ibonaut friends, I must admit. It’s not that I don’t love them because I do, I just have felt an overpowering need to withdraw a little bit.
Everyone keep your fingers crossed as I’m trying to land another book deal, and must garner a couple contributors before the publisher will commit fully- but I think I landed the one they named specifically as needing before committing yesterday, so things are looking up, I might say at risk of jinxing myself- which ain’t gonna happen anywho, right?
;-))
Still best to you and Jefrf Rachel.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Rachel Radhakrishna” <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 1:41 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] hovering

This is intense — peaceful but intense.

Jeff flooded about an hour and a half ago.  He was
getting a bit anxious in the build-up, but seemed to
surrender into it when it came time to take a bigger
bite.  He’s very quiet, lets out a little whimper
every now and then.  But lucid when asked.

Its hard being the “S.O” in this – I’ve been hovering
a bit, unsure of when my presence is needed, trying
not to impose my stuff into his process.  He reacts
more  emotionally to me about his fear(s) than the
neutrality of others.  But it’s weird letting someone
else hold a basin for yakking.  He kept the big dose
down for at least 90 minutes before though.

Sara, D the Greek Freak say, “I love you!!!!”  His
hair   is growing in nice, by the way (says me).

Thanks for all the prayers.  We feel ’em.

love Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] hovering
Date: November 7, 2004 at 7:02:26 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Rachel,

I say , Yasu, Yasu!

All the best,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Rachel Radhakrishna [mailto:rachelradha@yahoo.com]
Verzonden: zondag 7 november 2004 7:42
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] hovering

This is intense — peaceful but intense.

Jeff flooded about an hour and a half ago.  He was
getting a bit anxious in the build-up, but seemed to
surrender into it when it came time to take a bigger
bite.  He’s very quiet, lets out a little whimper
every now and then.  But lucid when asked.

Its hard being the “S.O” in this – I’ve been hovering
a bit, unsure of when my presence is needed, trying
not to impose my stuff into his process.  He reacts
more  emotionally to me about his fear(s) than the
neutrality of others.  But it’s weird letting someone
else hold a basin for yakking.  He kept the big dose
down for at least 90 minutes before though.

Sara, D the Greek Freak say, “I love you!!!!”  His
hair   is growing in nice, by the way (says me).

Thanks for all the prayers.  We feel ’em.

love Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard /Randy
Date: November 7, 2004 at 6:57:52 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee, I’ve been sending E mail all night and I was saving yours till last. You have a way of getting right to my heart. How do you do that? You brought tears to my eyes. AGAIN. Words of encouragement, or stern words of wisdom, you know just what to say to me. I needed to hear what you said. I got beat up emotionally pretty bad over the past week and I am way to highly strung for that. I have to learn to avoid the pitfalls. I’m just too honest, and true to my southern heritage, I am loyal to a fault. People have used these traits against me all my life. But I am learning fast. I am proud to be in a group of people who aren’t afraid to do whats necessary to stay clean and to pick themselves up if they fall. Ibogaine is the answer to a lot of problems. I’ll be in the city soon. I hope I see you. Thanx for being here.  Randy

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question about dopamine
Date: November 7, 2004 at 6:30:00 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Biscuit boy: HI, just type in Ibogaine,dopamine levels you should get about 8 hits on your question. Happy reading
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 3:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question about dopamine

Is there any data on the effects of Ibogaine on the dopamine levels? Before and after. Does Ibogaine increase it in of itself or does it let the body produce it better. Or does it do nothing to the level? If so would it help people with ADHD? How long would the effects lasts? Are there any claims about Ibogaine helping people with ADHD? Any help welcomed.   Randy

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard /Randy
Date: November 7, 2004 at 6:28:51 AM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: m.finman
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 6:09 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard randy

Randy,
I sent this last night at 10:44, but it would up in my delete box and my sent box, Excuse me if it is a double.  Just wanted you to have it even though you are getting great stuff from others.  Wanted you to know I was still thinking of you.                          Much Love,  Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2004 10:44 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard

Randy,
My experience over the years is that anyone in the drug rehab community that feels you are not doing or accepting of their methods will tell you that you are in denial or not accepting responsibility.  I laughed at them then in my drug fog and I dismiss all that bullshit from my ibogaine induced clarity.  None of those people have had the advantage of the physical, neurological, spiritual, insightful head start we got on the process.  People fear or are jealous of that which they don’t have or don’t understand.  It rains on their parade,  it shorts out their circuits, it won’t compute,  it fucks up their shit!  You are one of the chosen few.  The lost tribe of Iboga!  Stand tall brother and let your heart and your gut instincts guide you.  Intuition is that which you KNOW at an instant, before you factor in other peoples opinions and the fears they try to lay at your feet.
I understand you thought you would be accepted as a shining example (which you are) but….refer to above paragraph.
You’re a musician.  If all else fails, put it in a song.
With much love and admiration for how far you have come,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2004 7:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard

Howard, I will try and be as objective as I can. I have never had such a clarity of mind so fast in recovery. It will take some getting used to. I’m afraid to trust my own intentions because everyone is telling me how sick I still am and have to do what this one or that one says to get anywhere. Now I’m told to get a counselor and get his opinion too. How am I to trust my own self talk if everyone is telling me how fucked up I am. There is plenty enough in my head without me second guessing every move I make. I’m a lot more adamant about what I say and do now. I don’t think anyone really believes I’ll stay clean to follow through on what I’m talking about. Its one of those if you have to ask, you’ll never know things how Ibogaine has changed me. Except to you and the people on the list who have done the Ibogaine, its almost impossible to explain how much it has changed me. It takes first hand knowledge. I get angry now but I don’t explode like I used to. I write tirades on the list but thats healthy for me. Better than sticking a needle in my arm or kicking someone ass or getting beat on myself. Thats what I used to do with anger. Mostly sticking needles in my arm. Also I feel like the people that know me are afraid to do anything to knock me off of my recovery, or I should say care about me. I had drugs stuck in my face by people I thought care about me, just to see how I would react. Or so they say. I’m still learning and I’m still positive about Ibogaine and recovery. I just don’t like to be played with.             Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question about dopamine
Date: November 7, 2004 at 6:16:32 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is there any data on the effects of Ibogaine on the dopamine levels? Before and after. Does Ibogaine increase it in of itself or does it let the body produce it better. Or does it do nothing to the level? If so would it help people with ADHD? How long would the effects lasts? Are there any claims about Ibogaine helping people with ADHD? Any help welcomed.   Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] after 5 weeks
Date: November 7, 2004 at 6:07:04 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve never felt so good about being clean. EVER. I’m old and I have tried to be clean a time or two.               Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 7, 2004 at 5:57:41 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nick, acceptance is the key. You are absolutely right and I am planning as I type. I never planned anything before other than the con I was running to get high. I’ve done a lot of thinking in the past 24 hours. I’m willing to change anything to stay clean. I’ve got clean friends in the city and I’ll keep to myself and a therapist up here in the Catskills. AA rooms are everywhere to keep my armor on with. I’ll work, record, and wait for my chance. Thanx for your help.        Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] hovering
Date: November 7, 2004 at 4:08:13 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel, you are great to be so supportive. I hope Jeff gets as much from it as I have. I’ve got to come back to the city soon to see him after. I saw him before so I’d like to see if you really can see it in someone’s face. I was told you can see change in mine. You guys have everything going in your favor. “Ain’t” this great? I’ve never seen so much positive growth in a group of addicts or alcoholics in my life. Ibogaine is truly a miracle.     Randy   PS I can’t wait to hear what he saw. It’s incredible.

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 7, 2004 at 3:52:03 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sounds like you need some new friends. If people can’t handle you straight
then I don’t think you need to be around those people anymore. Acceptance
can be really a gift.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: Sara Glatt [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl]
Sent: 06 November 2004 20:26
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] list

Randy, I don’t have the magic answer to your problem, but I guess,
That after such an election day everyone is pissed off and act irrational.
Beside, you should be glad you don’t need to go to the army.
sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Verzonden: zaterdag 6 november 2004 20:19
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] list

Randy, people can get upset when others change. But they can also
get used to it over time, as they get to know the new you. I
suspect that if you stay there, some will adapt, others won’t, and
you may make some friends in unexpected places. Also in time you
may get some insights into their reactions. Humans have so many
facets!

It’s great to read about your experiences. Like Howard I’m curious
to know more details about this, if you want to tell us.

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 06:53:47 -0800 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Hey list, I went on the road to check out some options and had a
hell of a
ride. Seems I have gone through a big change and everything else
stayed the
same. My friends don’t know what to do with me clean. When I was
all fucked up
people treated me better or so it seemed. I don’t know what to do
now. I don’t
even want to play any music, seems that musical abilities make
some people
nervous and others just get pissy with me about it. Thats all I
have. I’ve lost
everything but one guitar and my ability to play. At least I still

have my grand
daddy’s sax. Maybe I should find another town, AGAIN, or lose
myself in NYC.
Randy

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] hovering
Date: November 7, 2004 at 1:41:45 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is intense — peaceful but intense.

Jeff flooded about an hour and a half ago.  He was
getting a bit anxious in the build-up, but seemed to
surrender into it when it came time to take a bigger
bite.  He’s very quiet, lets out a little whimper
every now and then.  But lucid when asked.

Its hard being the “S.O” in this – I’ve been hovering
a bit, unsure of when my presence is needed, trying
not to impose my stuff into his process.  He reacts
more  emotionally to me about his fear(s) than the
neutrality of others.  But it’s weird letting someone
else hold a basin for yakking.  He kept the big dose
down for at least 90 minutes before though.

Sara, D the Greek Freak say, “I love you!!!!”  His
hair   is growing in nice, by the way (says me).

Thanks for all the prayers.  We feel ’em.

love Rachel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard
Date: November 6, 2004 at 11:23:02 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

It sounds to me like you are doing OK.  Trust your instincts until there is
something that tells you not to.  As for not liking to be played with?  Well
stop hanging around with people who play with you.  You don’t need people
sticking dope under your nose and if you feel OK you don’t need others telling you
how to proceed in your recovered state.

Howard

In a message dated 11/6/04 8:59:46 PM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com writes:

Howard, I will try and be as objective as I can. I have never had such
a
clarity of mind so fast in recovery. It will take some getting used to.
I’m afraid
to trust my own intentions because everyone is telling me how sick I still
am
and have to do what this one or that one says to get anywhere. Now I’m
told
to get a counselor and get his opinion too. How am I to trust my own self
talk
if everyone is telling me how fucked up I am. There is plenty enough in
my
head without me second guessing every move I make. I’m a lot more adamant
about
what I say and do now. I don’t think anyone really believes I’ll stay clean
to
follow through on what I’m talking about. Its one of those if you have
to ask,
you’ll never know things how Ibogaine has changed me. Except to you and
the
people on the list who have done the Ibogaine, its almost impossible to
explain
how much it has changed me. It takes first hand knowledge. I get angry
now
but I don’t explode like I used to. I write tirades on the list but thats

healthy for me. Better than sticking a needle in my arm or kicking someone
ass or
getting beat on myself. Thats what I used to do with anger. Mostly sticking

needles in my arm. Also I feel like the people that know me are afraid
to do
anything to knock me off of my recovery, or I should say care about me.
I had drugs
stuck in my face by people I thought care about me, just to see how I would

react. Or so they say. I’m still learning and I’m still positive about
Ibogaine
and recovery. I just don’t like to be played with.

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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard
Date: November 6, 2004 at 10:44:20 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,
My experience over the years is that anyone in the drug rehab community that feels you are not doing or accepting of their methods will tell you that you are in denial or not accepting responsibility.  I laughed at them then in my drug fog and I dismiss all that bullshit from my ibogaine induced clarity.  None of those people have had the advantage of the physical, neurological, spiritual, insightful head start we got on the process.  People fear or are jealous of that which they don’t have or don’t understand.  It rains on their parade,  it shorts out their circuits, it won’t compute,  it fucks up their shit!  You are one of the chosen few.  The lost tribe of Iboga!  Stand tall brother and let your heart and your gut instincts guide you.  Intuition is that which you KNOW at an instant, before you factor in other peoples opinions and the fears they try to lay at your feet.
I understand you thought you would be accepted as a shining example (which you are) but….refer to above paragraph.
You’re a musician.  If all else fails, put it in a song.
With much love and admiration for how far you have come,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2004 7:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard

Howard, I will try and be as objective as I can. I have never had such a clarity of mind so fast in recovery. It will take some getting used to. I’m afraid to trust my own intentions because everyone is telling me how sick I still am and have to do what this one or that one says to get anywhere. Now I’m told to get a counselor and get his opinion too. How am I to trust my own self talk if everyone is telling me how fucked up I am. There is plenty enough in my head without me second guessing every move I make. I’m a lot more adamant about what I say and do now. I don’t think anyone really believes I’ll stay clean to follow through on what I’m talking about. Its one of those if you have to ask, you’ll never know things how Ibogaine has changed me. Except to you and the people on the list who have done the Ibogaine, its almost impossible to explain how much it has changed me. It takes first hand knowledge. I get angry now but I don’t explode like I used to. I write tirades on the list but thats healthy for me. Better than sticking a needle in my arm or kicking someone ass or getting beat on myself. Thats what I used to do with anger. Mostly sticking needles in my arm. Also I feel like the people that know me are afraid to do anything to knock me off of my recovery, or I should say care about me. I had drugs stuck in my face by people I thought care about me, just to see how I would react. Or so they say. I’m still learning and I’m still positive about Ibogaine and recovery. I just don’t like to be played with.             Randy

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Randy
Date: November 6, 2004 at 9:39:30 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Wow,Julie,
Very well put.
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, November 07, 2004 9:33 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Randy

Randy,

Maybe opiates were just filtering out aspects of
certain people’s personalities.  When I was strung
out, I could hang out with people who were clearly
incompatible with my personality, my beliefs…I could
also nod out in front of the tv for eight hours, not
to mention partake in dubious activities to finance my
‘needs’.  Opiates made me more tolerant of situations,
more comfortable in my boredom and malaise.  They made
me NUMB.

Now, I feel like my perceptions, senses, and emotions
are coming to life again.  Do you feel the same way?
Perhaps opiates ARE the quintessential ‘rose coloured
glasses’; I have heard that the poppy was referred to
as ‘the joy plant’ by a particular culture, that I
can’t- for the life of me- remember.

We need to find natural ways to recreate opiate bliss.
Sorry I’m rambling on, but I can relate to what
you’re saying.  Try new things, new sensations; meet
new people…Start anew.  And remember, your body is
re-regulating itself, so you might now feel/perceive
things the same way in a few months, weeks, daze.

Hugs,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 6, 2004 at 8:08:09 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

OK Randy,

That all makes sense now.  I couldn’t understand what was going on with your
friends until you described them as having a philosophical construct where
their own existence is based on how they think you should be responding.  Their
own well being is based on a different world view.  What you say and represent
threatens their belief system and hence there existence.

I am not saying these people were not your friends but, they were your
friends based on a common belief system.  Anything that threatens a belief system
frightens people. You threatened that belief system.

Howard

In a message dated 11/6/04 6:03:02 PM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com writes:

Well, I didn’t want to bore anyone with triviata but here goes. I have
a
friend who came to Lexington KY and pulled me up and dusted me off and
took me to
his house in Erie Pa. He told me I didn’t have to work, just keep an eye
on
the kids. At this point no one including my mother wanted anything to do
with
me. My brothers avoided me like the plague. I really don’t remember much
about
the last couple of months I was in KY. This guy is going through some tough

times so I went to Erie to try and help. Before anyone takes what I say
out of
context “AGAIN” I want to say I didn’t use, I’m not going to use, I just
got
kinda depressed at the state of what used to be my best friend. I’m hooked
into
the recovery people in Erie so I went to get my old job back and set up

therapy. I went to AA meetings and got out to see my clean friends. Well,
people who
knew me drugged don’t seem comfortable with me clean. I feel like I’m not

allowed to talk about Ibogaine or anything else for that matter till I
jump
through hoops and act subservient and let everyone kick me in the balls
emotionally.
Fuck that. I’m clean I’m going to stay clean and the longer people fuck
with
my program the more people die in KY from addiction or direct results
therein.

Some else goes to KY and I’ll quit worrying about it. I think I know everyone

in the underground and no one has any intent on going there. These people
are
committing crime against each other and dying by the day. Fuck a bunch
of
hillbillies huh. I’m angry. I’m real fucking angry. I have to let people
who
don’t know me make decisions about my life and my recovery based on
assumptions.

It seems that when I’m fucked up I let people push me around and put me
where I
belong in the scheme of things. Clean I have no intentions of letting any
one
push me around or getting in way of my goals. I have tried to be clean
for so
long I get the feeling people around me are just waiting for everything
to
get back to normal and I’m nodding off at the supper table. If I act
confident

about anything people in recovery say I should just sit listen and not
say
anything. I talk too much. I sat in the rooms of AA for two fucking years
and
didn’t say anything. I think it’s all about ego. There’s and mine. But
since I
just got clean 6 weeks ago I have nothing worthy to say. The people in
the music
scene are used to me playing and letting loud ass guitar players cut over
my
harp leads or sax or letting some dude sing who is a legend in his tone
deaf
mind. No fucking more. Stay in the mix and learn your parts like I did
or get
out of the fucking way.       Randy

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Howard
Date: November 6, 2004 at 7:50:33 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard, I will try and be as objective as I can. I have never had such a clarity of mind so fast in recovery. It will take some getting used to. I’m afraid to trust my own intentions because everyone is telling me how sick I still am and have to do what this one or that one says to get anywhere. Now I’m told to get a counselor and get his opinion too. How am I to trust my own self talk if everyone is telling me how fucked up I am. There is plenty enough in my head without me second guessing every move I make. I’m a lot more adamant about what I say and do now. I don’t think anyone really believes I’ll stay clean to follow through on what I’m talking about. Its one of those if you have to ask, you’ll never know things how Ibogaine has changed me. Except to you and the people on the list who have done the Ibogaine, its almost impossible to explain how much it has changed me. It takes first hand knowledge. I get angry now but I don’t explode like I used to. I write tirades on the list but thats healthy for me. Better than sticking a needle in my arm or kicking someone ass or getting beat on myself. Thats what I used to do with anger. Mostly sticking needles in my arm. Also I feel like the people that know me are afraid to do anything to knock me off of my recovery, or I should say care about me. I had drugs stuck in my face by people I thought care about me, just to see how I would react. Or so they say. I’m still learning and I’m still positive about Ibogaine and recovery. I just don’t like to be played with.             Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Randy
Date: November 6, 2004 at 7:13:15 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, thanx so much. I was just pondering my situation and an old AA slogan came to mind. SOBER stands for Son Of a Bitch Everything is Real. It took at least a year for my mind to clear when I got clean of booze and Methadone in 94. Ibogaine gave me that instantaneously. Or as soon as the trails and buzz went away. I’m way grateful I didn’t have to battle booze again. Its almost as bad as methadone. The fears they talk about in the big book are very real. I experienced them in detox. You and I are definitely on the same page. I had just sat and thought about all this and came to a lot of the same conclusions that you did. In retrospect going back there was a big mistake. I can’t expect the rest of the world to change and react because I have changed. Its classic RET. All I can do is change my thoughts about the reality I perceive if I want to change my emotions about it. Because you cannot change objective reality. Looks good on paper. Its the period of cognitive dissonance that goes along with forcing yourself to change your thoughts that I don’t like to deal with so therefore I ignore this tool. You are right. I need to try new things and change friends completely. This guy is like a brother to me. His kids are closer to me than they are him. Thats his fault. One things for sure. I can’t stop playing music. Be it in bars or whatever. I tried to stop playing when I was battling alcohol on the advice of a sponsor and I never went for more than a month or so without drinking. When I found the sponsor I stayed with, (who was an awesome keyboard/singer dude) he taught me how to play sober and how cool it was to be in control of your licks I pretty much quit drinking for good. Won’t make that mistake again. Thanx for your kind words of encouragement.        Randy

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Randy
Date: November 6, 2004 at 6:33:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

Maybe opiates were just filtering out aspects of
certain people’s personalities.  When I was strung
out, I could hang out with people who were clearly
incompatible with my personality, my beliefs…I could
also nod out in front of the tv for eight hours, not
to mention partake in dubious activities to finance my
‘needs’.  Opiates made me more tolerant of situations,
more comfortable in my boredom and malaise.  They made
me NUMB.

Now, I feel like my perceptions, senses, and emotions
are coming to life again.  Do you feel the same way?
Perhaps opiates ARE the quintessential ‘rose coloured
glasses’; I have heard that the poppy was referred to
as ‘the joy plant’ by a particular culture, that I
can’t- for the life of me- remember.

We need to find natural ways to recreate opiate bliss.
Sorry I’m rambling on, but I can relate to what
you’re saying.  Try new things, new sensations; meet
new people…Start anew.  And remember, your body is
re-regulating itself, so you might now feel/perceive
things the same way in a few months, weeks, daze.

Hugs,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 6, 2004 at 6:01:52 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well, I didn’t want to bore anyone with triviata but here goes. I have a friend who came to Lexington KY and pulled me up and dusted me off and took me to his house in Erie Pa. He told me I didn’t have to work, just keep an eye on the kids. At this point no one including my mother wanted anything to do with me. My brothers avoided me like the plague. I really don’t remember much about the last couple of months I was in KY. This guy is going through some tough times so I went to Erie to try and help. Before anyone takes what I say out of context “AGAIN” I want to say I didn’t use, I’m not going to use, I just got kinda depressed at the state of what used to be my best friend. I’m hooked into the recovery people in Erie so I went to get my old job back and set up therapy. I went to AA meetings and got out to see my clean friends. Well, people who knew me drugged don’t seem comfortable with me clean. I feel like I’m not allowed to talk about Ibogaine or anything else for that matter till I jump through hoops and act subservient and let everyone kick me in the balls emotionally. Fuck that. I’m clean I’m going to stay clean and the longer people fuck with my program the more people die in KY from addiction or direct results therein. Some else goes to KY and I’ll quit worrying about it. I think I know everyone in the underground and no one has any intent on going there. These people are committing crime against each other and dying by the day. Fuck a bunch of hillbillies huh. I’m angry. I’m real fucking angry. I have to let people who don’t know me make decisions about my life and my recovery based on assumptions. It seems that when I’m fucked up I let people push me around and put me where I belong in the scheme of things. Clean I have no intentions of letting any one push me around or getting in way of my goals. I have tried to be clean for so long I get the feeling people around me are just waiting for everything to get back to normal and I’m nodding off at the supper table. If I act confident about anything people in recovery say I should just sit listen and not say anything. I talk too much. I sat in the rooms of AA for two fucking years and didn’t say anything. I think it’s all about ego. There’s and mine. But since I just got clean 6 weeks ago I have nothing worthy to say. The people in the music scene are used to me playing and letting loud ass guitar players cut over my harp leads or sax or letting some dude sing who is a legend in his tone deaf mind. No fucking more. Stay in the mix and learn your parts like I did or get out of the fucking way.       Randy

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 6, 2004 at 3:25:39 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy, I don’t have the magic answer to your problem, but I guess,
That after such an election day everyone is pissed off and act irrational.
Beside, you should be glad you don’t need to go to the army.
sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Verzonden: zaterdag 6 november 2004 20:19
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] list

Randy, people can get upset when others change. But they can also
get used to it over time, as they get to know the new you. I
suspect that if you stay there, some will adapt, others won’t, and
you may make some friends in unexpected places. Also in time you
may get some insights into their reactions. Humans have so many
facets!

It’s great to read about your experiences. Like Howard I’m curious
to know more details about this, if you want to tell us.

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 06:53:47 -0800 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Hey list, I went on the road to check out some options and had a
hell of a
ride. Seems I have gone through a big change and everything else
stayed the
same. My friends don’t know what to do with me clean. When I was
all fucked up
people treated me better or so it seemed. I don’t know what to do
now. I don’t
even want to play any music, seems that musical abilities make
some people
nervous and others just get pissy with me about it. Thats all I
have. I’ve lost
everything but one guitar and my ability to play. At least I still

have my grand
daddy’s sax. Maybe I should find another town, AGAIN, or lose
myself in NYC.
Randy

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

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http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator
Date: November 6, 2004 at 3:04:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Thu, 04 Nov 2004 16:02:48 -0800 Charliedog43@aol.com wrote:
“They are intent on shredding the constitution and enriching
themselves.”
You don’t do much research yourself, do you? Just write down what
you believe to be true, and it is. How nice.

Here’s some more info – I just don’t always have it handy 🙂

I was frightened by Bush’s emphasis on strength though unity in his
victory speech: he seemed to momentarily lose himself in the idea.
As you may know, Bush has said he feels he was chosen by God to
reorder the world:

http://observer.guardian.co.uk/international/story/0,6903,1075950,
00.html

He already has achieved the power to remove a person’s
constitutional protection by declaring them a terrorist. The Abu
Graib abuses were a direct result of the legal and policy efforts
that have been made in this direction. Bush nominated the person
who laid the legal foundation for stripping a person’s human rights
(William Haynes) as a lifetime federal appeals court judge:

http://www.pfaw.org/pfaw/general/default.aspx?oid=15431

“But now it has emerged that Haynes, the Pentagon’s top lawyer,
oversaw a working group that provided the Bush administration with
a report promoting unsettling policies on torture. Haynes’ group
actually argues that President Bush, in exercising his powers as
commander in chief during times of war, is under no obligation to
adhere to any rule of law – international or domestic – that bars
the use of torture.

You read that correctly. Despite the U.S. Constitution’s plain
language that laws passed by Congress and treaties ratified by the
United States are the “supreme law of the land” and that the
President is obligated under the Constitution to “take care that
the laws be faithfully executed,” Haynes’ group believes that such
laws and treaties – including the 1984 Convention Against Torture,
to which the U.S. was a party – in no way restrict George Bush’s
right to order torture.”

http://www.pfaw.org/pfaw/general/default.aspx?oid=15747

“Haynes has been an architect and defender of administration
policies that flout the rule of law, reject meaningful judicial
oversight for American enemy combatants, and reject any redress at
all for foreign detainees held at Guantanamo Bay. Someone whose
record reflects such disdain for constitutional principles and
American values should not be given the power to make decisions
about our constitutional rights and liberties for decades to come.”

Here’s an example of how, once there is a category of people you
can do anything to, there is a slippery slope towards designating
anyone who is in your way as being in that category:

http://www.cnn.com/2004/EDUCATION/02/23/paige.terrorist.nea/

Today it is a slip of the tongue, tomorrow an implied threat? What
is it they say about absolute power?

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 6, 2004 at 2:55:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In the United States alone, someone checks their email every three
seconds… Jim Hadey
Hi jon,

Yea, I would go along with that.  Valium and  Klonopin  are long lasting
and have a long half life compared with Restoril and Xanax.

Earlier, we talked about  Zyprexa and Effexor.  Both made me hallucinate
and in a bad way.  Also, they caused VERY bad dreams – VERY BAD.  The
Zyprexa was 10 mg and the Effexor was 37.5 mg.  I was taking them for
depression.  Once a drug is approved they can use it for off the shelf
use.  In other words if a drug is approved for one thing they can use it
for another.  The kids who did the Columbine shootings were on some kind
of SSRI drug, I think Celexia, but I’m not really sure.  The lady in
Houston who drownded her kids was also on SSRI drugs, if you read the
whole story they were giving her many times the normal amount along with
other drugs that should not of been taken with the ones they gave her.
No, I am not sticking up for her, just giving you the facts.

<snip>

I think i said this, but just to be clear, neither Zyprexa, Effexor, nor
Seroquel are SSRIs.

Zyprexa and Seroquel are both atypical anti-psychotics. They act primarily
as selective dopamine antagonists; they reduce the transmission of
dopamine.   They’re called atypical because their action is more selective
than the older anti-psychotics, like thorazine and haldol. this means they
generally have less side effects; though serious reactions still do
happen, as with your experience.

Effexor is an SNRI, a serotonin norepinepherine reuptake inhibitor. It’s
like an SSRI, in that it blocks the reuptake of serotonin, but it also
blocks the reuptake of norepinepherine. It would probably be a pretty bad
idea to take ibogaine on top of an SNRI, for  the same reason as with
SSRIs.
Effexor would be considerably more dangerous to mix with ibogaine than
Zyprexa or Seroquel.

But, in general, it would probably be best to mix ibogaine with as few
other things as possible. There aren’t really all that many people who’ve
ever done ibogaine, so there’s not much data on interactions and such. If
you mix ibogaine with something, odds are pretty good that you’ll be the
first one to try the combination, that is, you’ll be playing guinea pig.

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 6, 2004 at 2:35:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jim, if you ever take ibogaine I would suggest a slow stepping of
doses, giving yourself time to assess how it is acting at each step,

since it apparently increases serotonin and your reaction to SSRI’s
(which do the same) has been so negative. I am not a treater or
medical expert, just a person who has had some really rough
experiences on ibogaine (although no nightmares on Paxil, which is
an SSRI). Possibly very small doses could be useful if larger ones
are too difficult.

On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 21:21:18 -0800 Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
wrote:
Earlier, we talked about  Zyprexa and Effexor.  Both made me
hallucinate and in a bad way.  Also, they caused VERY bad dreams –

VERY BAD.  The Zyprexa was 10 mg and the Effexor was 37.5 mg.  I
was taking them for depression.  Once a drug is approved they can
use it for off the shelf use.  In other words if a drug is
approved for one thing they can use it for another.  The kids who
did the Columbine shootings were on some kind of SSRI drug, I
think Celexia, but I’m not really sure.

It was many months later that another doc gave me the Seroquel
which knocked me on my ass and gave me a hang over.  Guess I can
not take SSRI or a SSRI antagonistic drugs.
I will admit that while taking the SSRI I was
buzzed in a very uncomfortable way.  I mean talking to people who
were not there, bumping into walls.  And the dreams were
nightmares that you would never want to experience.  But that is
just me.  Other people have been helped.

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 6, 2004 at 2:19:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy, people can get upset when others change. But they can also
get used to it over time, as they get to know the new you. I
suspect that if you stay there, some will adapt, others won’t, and
you may make some friends in unexpected places. Also in time you
may get some insights into their reactions. Humans have so many
facets!

It’s great to read about your experiences. Like Howard I’m curious
to know more details about this, if you want to tell us.

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 06:53:47 -0800 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Hey list, I went on the road to check out some options and had a
hell of a
ride. Seems I have gone through a big change and everything else
stayed the
same. My friends don’t know what to do with me clean. When I was
all fucked up
people treated me better or so it seemed. I don’t know what to do
now. I don’t
even want to play any music, seems that musical abilities make
some people
nervous and others just get pissy with me about it. Thats all I
have. I’ve lost
everything but one guitar and my ability to play. At least I still

have my grand
daddy’s sax. Maybe I should find another town, AGAIN, or lose
myself in NYC.
Randy

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 6, 2004 at 2:10:36 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Candle is lit. Indeed it is hard.

On Sat, 06 Nov 2004 07:45:14 -0800 Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@
yahoo.com> wrote:
Message to pass on:  “Be nice to your Mom, Randy!”
Are you back there now or still traveling?

Jeff’s doin’ good – in a very internal place.  He said
“This is hard,” and I asked him if he thought it
wouldn’t be. “No I guess people talked about it, I
just didn’t pay attention to that part of it.” He’s
coming off methadone so taking a series of boosters —
to  “flood” late tonight.

Beautiful blue sky day.  I think I’m gonna go find the
Angels some breakfast food.  Thanks for all the love,

Rachel

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] insomnia, stress, et al.
Date: November 6, 2004 at 2:03:45 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The descriptions are interesting, but I couldn’t find any samples
to listen to.

On Fri, 05 Nov 2004 06:50:10 -0800 Paula <paulab@shaw.ca> wrote:
http://www.themusicalrainbow.com/

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 6, 2004 at 12:37:05 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think it is very good and admirable to start work on oneself in
advance of iboga.

From my limited experience, the principle of Feldenkrais is to
gently (without pain) tense muscles that hold tension (in spasm),
then relax as slowly as possible to release both intentional and
unintentional tension. The more close attention paid to the process,
the better it works. It can be an interesting challenge to find
the edge between letting go and holding: what is your smallest
increment of relaxation? Like iboga, it helps release useless
patterns held in the body, however in a much gentler way. I suspect
Feldenkrais could be useful in relaxing out of the stress that
iboga can leave in the muscles of the gut. (Small amounts of
Peganum harmala extract taken before the iboga seem to help prevent
this as well.)

The techniques of Feldenkrais seem to have been adopted by the
physical therapy community over the last 10 years or so.

I wonder – are any iboganauts doing yoga? I think it could be
really good, but I can’t seem to get around to it 🙂

On Thu, 04 Nov 2004 17:16:11 -0800 Paula <paulab@shaw.ca> wrote:
My understanding is that we humans have two brains the rational
and the primitive they are interconnected but sometimes the
emotive brain acts without the rational brain’s control. ie
irrational behavior.  Feldendrais helps to balance the two brains
by retraining the emotive brain through movement.  These are small

movements and if childhood issues have given me this response
level to strangers, maybe working with the emotive brain will help

my rational brain have control again in these situations.  He was
an mechanical engineer and developed this program thru working
with brain damaged people who wanted to get better. The papers on
ibogaine state that people that had childhood trama have
unbalanced brains one side is more dominant than that of another
and after ibogaine there is more balance.  I’m thinking that
Feldenkrais might start the process I’m trying to change and
Ibogaine can only make it better or vice versa.  Try a class its
usually about 10.00 for a trial(Canadian)  I do feel better and
more relaxed after, but there is always a placebo effect. There
are a couple of site with more info.  And you can get a book for
home excercises. Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: Fosterwash14@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 6:54 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

hi
I’m new to learning about I bogaine, but I read these mindvox
emails and I have learned alot about ibogaine. I am curious about
what feldencrais is ?

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 6, 2004 at 10:52:39 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/6/04 9:54:53 AM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com writes:

<< Hey list, I went on the road to check out some options and had a hell of a
ride. Seems I have gone through a big change and everything else stayed the
same. My friends don’t know what to do with me clean. When I was all fucked
up
people treated me better or so it seemed. I don’t know what to do now. I
don’t
even want to play any music, seems that musical abilities make some people
nervous and others just get pissy with me about it. Thats all I have. I’ve
lost
everything but one guitar and my ability to play. At least I still have my
grand
daddy’s sax. Maybe I should find another town, AGAIN, or lose myself in NYC.

I would greatly appreciate if you could be more specific in the changes that
have occurred in yourself and the differences in how your friends treat you?
What in you makes people nervous? I am very interested in the changes you
discuss in your post above.

Thanks

Howard

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From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 6, 2004 at 10:45:14 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Message to pass on:  “Be nice to your Mom, Randy!”
Are you back there now or still traveling?

Jeff’s doin’ good – in a very internal place.  He said
“This is hard,” and I asked him if he thought it
wouldn’t be. “No I guess people talked about it, I
just didn’t pay attention to that part of it.” He’s
coming off methadone so taking a series of boosters —
to  “flood” late tonight.

Beautiful blue sky day.  I think I’m gonna go find the
Angels some breakfast food.  Thanks for all the love,

Rachel

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] list
Date: November 6, 2004 at 9:53:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey list, I went on the road to check out some options and had a hell of a ride. Seems I have gone through a big change and everything else stayed the same. My friends don’t know what to do with me clean. When I was all fucked up people treated me better or so it seemed. I don’t know what to do now. I don’t even want to play any music, seems that musical abilities make some people nervous and others just get pissy with me about it. Thats all I have. I’ve lost everything but one guitar and my ability to play. At least I still have my grand daddy’s sax. Maybe I should find another town, AGAIN, or lose myself in NYC.         Randy

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine on the subject of music during Ibonauting]
Date: November 6, 2004 at 6:47:41 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There is a Canadian Female who has some music that helps activate alpha and
delta waves at the same time. I spoke to her on the phone after looking at
her website. It can be found at www.themusicalrainbow.com  She has had
studies done with animals and autistic children might help with the
flight…..one tape/cd is for inner child work which I thought was part of
the iboga experience for some..Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 8:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine on the subject of music during
Ibonauting]

so, the album Current 93 presents Harry Oldfield ‘Crystal’ is a
recording
of that; 18 tracks of different kinds of crystals. the sounds are
entirely
pleasant, but soothing in an odd sort of way..

oopps… that shouldve said the sounds AREN’T enitrely pleasant….ehehe

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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Kerry wins
Date: November 6, 2004 at 6:41:04 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Clever Julie! I liked that alberta was bushian…All those ranchers…Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 11:50 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Kerry wins

thought some of you might like this….

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 6, 2004 at 12:21:18 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi jon,

Yea, I would go along with that.  Valium and  Klonopin  are long lasting and have a long half life compared with Restoril and Xanax.

Earlier, we talked about  Zyprexa and Effexor.  Both made me hallucinate and in a bad way.  Also, they caused VERY bad dreams – VERY BAD.  The Zyprexa was 10 mg and the Effexor was 37.5 mg.  I was taking them for depression.  Once a drug is approved they can use it for off the shelf use.  In other words if a drug is approved for one thing they can use it for another.  The kids who did the Columbine shootings were on some kind of SSRI drug, I think Celexia, but I’m not really sure.  The lady in Houston who drownded her kids was also on SSRI drugs, if you read the whole story they were giving her many times the normal amount along with other drugs that should not of been taken with the ones they gave her.  No, I am not sticking up for her, just giving you the facts.

England passed a law prohibiting SSRI drugs from being given to those under 18 years of age, the only exception is Prozac.

It was many months later that another doc gave me the Seroquel which knocked me on my ass and gave me a hang over.  Guess I can not take SSRI or a SSRI antagonistic drugs.  Also, these drugs can take a long time to leave the body completely.  I would venture to guess a month or more.  But that is just a guess.  If you know about antidepressents you know it can take 6 weeks to start working.  It is just my opinion, a Laymens opinion at that, that a person should wait a long time before taking undergoing Ibo treatment while taking SSRI drugs of any kind.  Of course this is just my opinion.  Also, unless you have VERY bad depression I would stay away from the SSRI drugs, they are finding out they are not as great as the drug companies make them out to be.
In a double blind study they found that a placebo can work just as good in many cases.  I will admit that while taking the SSRI I was buzzed in a very uncomfortable way.  I mean talking to people who were not there, bumping into walls.  And the dreams were nightmares that you would never want to experience.  But that is just me.  Other people have been helped.  I heard they are going to put a warning on them saying something on the order of  “If this medication makes you feel like suciede check with your doctor or pharmacist.”  The doctors seem to give themout like candy.  They won’t give you a sleeping pill or Valium but they will give you Zolft and other SSRI’s by the handful.

But I feel use whatever works for you.  But before taking the Ibo while taking the SSRIs, I would STRONGLY suggest asking questions and mentioning it to the one who will be giving it to you as well as the sitter.  For what it is worth – I am not a doc or nurse, just someone who likes to read.

Best to all,

– JIM

jon <jfreed1@umbc.edu> wrote:

> I have been using benzos for years. Valium and Restoril. If one is
> taking a large amount of Valium and then quite abruptly they may
> experience seziures. It takes 10 days before withdrawal from benzos
> starts – my doc told me this.

How long it takes before benzo withdrawal kicks in depends on what
particular benzo you’re talking about.

Longer acting ones like klonopin and valium could take that long, but
shorter acting ones like xanax and ativan would only take a couple days.

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Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 6, 2004 at 12:18:39 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

***I totaly agree,
I believe we know everything there is to know,we simply give up memeory of this when we come into the body.
I believe we are here to experience in body what we know to be conceptually true.For example;We all know what paraflying SEEMS like,but to
actually experience it in the flesh is different. We can see people on t.v. falling in love and can see it is wonderfull,but to experience it in the flesh is
a different thing.

So I believe(personal opinion and others opinion) that we are here to experience what we know to be conceptually true.When we get here we give up
memory of who we truly are so we can create ourselves anew and have different experiences. We try to remember who we truly are,and remember
what we all know,then react to that memory. Cause and effect. For every action there is a reaction.Every word thought and action has a conseqence
to what we bring forth to experience. Just my babling thoughts.

***  With smiles Jasen.

Dear Paula,

I greed with you but we have to say that as Jung said before “all mankind have shared memory. Jung calls it “shadow archetype” Iboga sessions prove it. Common visions including similiar visions about arkaik ancestors. I believe that our subconsciousness tells us many thing also says about our health conditions. Carl G. Jung is very very interesting psychiatrist but if you don’t know about him and hes “Shadow Archetype” you have to read him. Beacuse it’s impossible to tell you with my poor English skill.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] now it is today….
Date: November 6, 2004 at 12:02:07 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Jeff,

I lit a candle for you,
it is lit as I type.

Happy journeys. Smiles Jasen.

From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] now it is today….
Date: November 5, 2004 at 10:40:36 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jeff,
a blue candle is lit for you now.
Here’s to a productive journey.
111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
our Ibogaine angels and I am home  I am okay but okay. So please truly understand in your heart  I will be grateful as I am grateful for finding this list. someday…well that day is finally here…..

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] now it is today….
Date: November 5, 2004 at 10:28:57 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

lots of love for you Jeff, for you and Rachel too.
Good luck.

Peace and love,
Preston
“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 6:43 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] now it is today….

Well
Rachel just left to pick up our Ibogaine angels and I am home about 30 hours away from my last dose of Methadone. I am surprisingly okay a little bit chilly and a little bit nervous but okay. So please all you mindvoxians…the only group of people I know who as a group truly understand hat I am about to embark on…so all of you please keep me in your hearts tonight and the next few days. I will be grateful as I am grateful for finding this list. Also please keep Rachel and our providers there too it cant be easy for her I know.
It has been a wild ride reading about this miracle plant and how it comes and goes form peoples life.
I first heard about Ibogaine many many years ago and I KNEW then that this would be the way to put this whole opiated haze behind me someday…well that day is finally here…..
Love,
Jeff
I will try to post an update in the next day or so if not me than i am sure Rachel will

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] now it is today….
Date: November 5, 2004 at 9:03:14 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/5/04 7:17:50 PM, Jeffgd1@aol.com writes:

<<  Rachel just left to pick up our Ibogaine angels and I am home about 30
hours
away from my last dose of Methadone. I am surprisingly okay a little bit
chilly and a little bit nervous but okay. So please all you mindvoxians…the
only
group of people I know who as a group truly understand hat I am about to
embark on…so all of you please keep me in your hearts tonight and the next
few
days. >>

Jeff,

Have fun.  Enjoy the experience.  It is amazing.

Howard

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From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] now it is today….
Date: November 5, 2004 at 7:44:44 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Jeff,

I will be thinking of you both,you Will be in my heart.
I will go out now and buy more candles.
The candle I lit for Julie burned for 3 days and 2 nights.

I hope you achieve all that you are setting out to achieve.
Smiles Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, November 06, 2004 9:43 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] now it is today….

Well
Rachel just left to pick up our Ibogaine angels and I am home about 30 hours away from my last dose of Methadone. I am surprisingly okay a little bit chilly and a little bit nervous but okay. So please all you mindvoxians…the only group of people I know who as a group truly understand hat I am about to embark on…so all of you please keep me in your hearts tonight and the next few days. I will be grateful as I am grateful for finding this list. Also please keep Rachel and our providers there too it cant be easy for her I know.
It has been a wild ride reading about this miracle plant and how it comes and goes form peoples life.
I first heard about Ibogaine many many years ago and I KNEW then that this would be the way to put this whole opiated haze behind me someday…well that day is finally here…..
Love,
Jeff
I will try to post an update in the next day or so if not me than i am sure Rachel will

From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] now it is today….
Date: November 5, 2004 at 6:43:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well
Rachel just left to pick up our Ibogaine angels and I am home about 30 hours away from my last dose of Methadone. I am surprisingly okay a little bit chilly and a little bit nervous but okay. So please all you mindvoxians…the only group of people I know who as a group truly understand hat I am about to embark on…so all of you please keep me in your hearts tonight and the next few days. I will be grateful as I am grateful for finding this list. Also please keep Rachel and our providers there too it cant be easy for her I know.
It has been a wild ride reading about this miracle plant and how it comes and goes form peoples life.
I first heard about Ibogaine many many years ago and I KNEW then that this would be the way to put this whole opiated haze behind me someday…well that day is finally here…..
Love,
Jeff
I will try to post an update in the next day or so if not me than i am sure Rachel will

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Kerry wins
Date: November 5, 2004 at 2:50:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thought some of you might like this….

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] `Cosmetic neurology’ drugs can elevate brain power
Date: November 5, 2004 at 12:33:56 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
so, could ibogaine be considered one of these “cosmetic neurology” drugs?

—–
http://www.kansascity.com/mld/kansascity/news/nation/10107486.htm?1c
`Cosmetic neurology’ drugs can elevate brain power

BY LAURA BEIL

The Dallas Morning News

DALLAS – (KRT) – In the future, reality shows may have names such as “Extreme Makeover: Brain Edition” or “Sharp Eye for the Dumb Guy.”
At the beginning of each episode, viewers could learn about one hapless soul’s lifelong struggles with algebra and another’s desire to not be a worrywart. By the end of the hour, the transformed contestants would be winning chess matches and prancing carefree through fields of daisies. Don’t check the TV listings just yet, but the idea is not all fantasy.
Some neurologists have recently wondered whether their field is the next frontier in elective medicine. The specialty now tries to protect ailing brains from conditions such as Parkinson’s disease or migraine headaches. But doctors’ efforts may one day extend to normal brains.
“This is coming, and we need to know it’s coming,” says Dr. Anjan Chatterjee of the University of Pennsylvania.
There’s even a name for the field: cosmetic neurology.
As he envisions it, cosmetic neurology could one day mean not just sharpening intelligence, but also elevating other dictates of the brain – reflexes, attention, mood and memory. Studying for the SAT? Take this drug to retain more of those pesky facts. About to report for duty at the fire station? These pills will improve your reflexes. Here’s the 800 number. Ask your doctor.
These are not just theoretical musings. Last month in the journal Neurology, Chatterjee pointed out that drugs already exist that may have many of these effects. In one study, for example, emergency room patients given a memory-altering drug appeared to be spared some symptoms of post-traumatic stress. Another small study of pilots in flight simulators suggested that those taking Alzheimer’s disease medications performed better, particularly under emergency conditions.
Chatterjee reserves opinion but says the idea speaks to the basic purpose of medical practice.
“I’m not arguing that this is a bad thing, and I’m not arguing it’s a good thing.” Before doctors are caught by surprise, he says, they need to be prepared. “What I’m hoping to do with this is get people talking.”
They are. Since the journal’s publication, he has fielded steady e-mails. Some neurologists say they’ve already had patients asking about such medications for the mind.
Not all of Chatterjee’s colleagues, though, agree that cosmetic neurology is inevitable, even if mind-improving drugs become safe and available. “There are certainly pressures that are going to push us that way,” says Dr. Richard Dees of the University of Rochester. Doctors have the power, however, to shape the future of their profession regardless.
Writing in the journal, Dees argues “as neurologists and as citizens, we can collectively control our own destinies, if we choose and if we have the will to act.”
Another of his colleagues has a different take. Dr. Stephen Hauser of the University of California, San Francisco, wrote that “advances in neuroscience carry with them the likelihood, intended or otherwise, of medical applications that go well beyond the traditional goals to prevent, diagnose and treat disease.”
snip-

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] in an ideal world…
Date: November 5, 2004 at 12:04:39 PM EST
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all,
In an ideal world, this proposal would be the obvious course of action, to simply supply those addict who need/want to continue using with the drugs they need so they can get back to the process of living again without the overpowering need to do all sorts of unseemly things to obtain the drugs they do desperately need. That way, those who want to use ibogaine to stop using would have no fears of legal repurcussions, those who want to continue using wouldn’t have to worry about being turned in by well meaning “friends” trying to protect them and others or with that endless race to score or even with silly selfish unthinking demands that they “stop using drugs right now,” police could begin focusing on real cri…oh, heck, what am I doing? You all know this.
Still, I’m forwarding this fantastic article from the UK’s Guardian Unlimited newspaper. The complete article is at this URL.
Enjoy, and for those I’ve close copied this to, please talk to your friends about this sort of thing. We spend way too much money and waste way too many lives on this pursuit of “total abstinence from some drugs” that hasn’t and never will work.
—–

http://www.guardian.co.uk/Columnists/Column/0,5673,1342103,00.html

In the war on drugs, Europe must make a separate peace

Give addicts a prescription and end the crime wave destroying our cities

Polly Toynbee
Wednesday November 3, 2004
The Guardian

Waiting to see who has won the most important US election for decades, the world has been an anguished bystander, pressing up against the window of the superpower. So much depends on America – from climate change to terms of global trade and haphazard forays into global policing.
But one policy on which the US has always had an iron grip was not mentioned at all – because both candidates would agree on it. Both would say the global “war on drugs” must go on. Since 1961 the US has strong-armed most countries into signing UN conventions to join this futile and destructive battle. Drug prohibition has torn apart poor drug-producing countries and wreaked drug-fuelled terror on the streets of every city in the world. It has created crazed addicts lurking in dark streets everywhere from Rio to Russia.
“A drugs-free world – we can do it!” is the slogan of the UN Office on Drugs and Crime. It is, it says daftly, “on target to reach its goals”. What goals? To eradicate drug abuse and the cultivation of coca, cannabis and opium by the year 2008. Yes, in just four years.
Prohibition not only hasn’t worked, it makes things ever worse. If ever there was a good example of a policy where Europe needs to make its own way, this is it. The former Interpol chief (and now its honorary secretary general) Raymond Kendall has broken official silence in Europe over this.
Writing in Le Monde, in a preview of a key lecture later this month, he declared the drugs war lost and said that enforcement policies had failed to protect the world from drugs. It was time for “harm reduction” instead of the UN’s “obsolete international conventions”. He called for Europe to take the lead in an international movement to reform policy when the UN’s drug conventions come up for renewal in 2008.
Under the conventions, all countries are obliged to pursue growers, dealers and users in an expensive attempt to hold back an unstoppable tide. Prohibition has bred crime on an unimaginable global scale. Bravely, most countries have to pretend that they are winning – when it is painfully obvious there are only losers.
Look at the absurdity of our own Home Office’s five-year plan, published this summer. Here are its drug targets: “We aim to increase the proportion of heroin seized from 10% in 2003 to 16% in 2006 and cocaine from 12% to 26%. We will make the UK a more hostile environment for organised drugs trafficking.”
These figures are almost touchingly barmy. The Home Office has no idea what proportion of any drug it is seizing. If it does seize more, it may only be a bad sign that there is more on the streets.
The Home Office appears not to have read the prime minister’s strategy unit report (unpublished), which found that UK police enforcement had failed to have any meaningful impact on illegal drug supply. Sadly, this report took fright at the logic of its own findings, and ended up calling for mandatory treatment for heroin addicts – now expected in the Queen’s Speech. Evidence suggests forced treatment rarely works: even the results for voluntary treatment are not always brilliant.
snip-
—–

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [DrugWar] Liquefied Heroin Discovered In Fruit Juice Boxes In Florida
Date: November 5, 2004 at 11:42:47 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: Vigilius Haufniensis
To: drugwar@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 12:10 PM
Subject: [DrugWar] Liquefied Heroin Discovered In Fruit Juice Boxes In Florida

http://www.local6.com/news/3888839/detail.html
Liquefied Heroin Discovered In Fruit Juice Boxes In Florida
POSTED: 2:27 am EST November 4, 2004
UPDATED: 1:44 pm EST November 4, 2004
MIAMI — Nearly 100 fruit juice boxes containing liquid heroin were intercepted Wednesday in a shipment from Colombia, federal officials said.

The juice boxes were part of a private shipment that wasn’t destined for the United States food supply, Immigration and Customs Enforcement agents said. The juice would be deadly if consumed.

The 6-ounce boxes, labeled “Hit Fruit Drink,” contained a total of 38 kilograms, or about 84 pounds, of heroin worth $1.7 million.

Customs agents said the juice was initially bought from a grocery store in Colombia, then emptied and refilled with heroin. The shipment was relabeled and five pallets of boxes were shipped alongside pallets of legitimate juice boxes, the agents said.

The pallets were intercepted at an undisclosed location in Miami and federal agents are working to track the drug dealers responsible, customs agents said.

In 1990, a 25-year-old man died after drinking a cocaine-laced Colombian soft drink that was part of a drug smuggling scheme. It went awry when burglars broke into a warehouse, stole cases of the drink not knowing what they contained, and sold them to local grocers.

The FBI discovered at least 45 contaminated bottles of Pony Malta, some on store shelves.

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine on the subject of music during Ibonauting]
Date: November 5, 2004 at 11:28:55 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

so, the album Current 93 presents Harry Oldfield ‘Crystal’ is a recording
of that; 18 tracks of different kinds of crystals. the sounds are entirely
pleasant, but soothing in an odd sort of way..

oopps… that shouldve said the sounds AREN’T enitrely pleasant….ehehe

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from T..
Date: November 5, 2004 at 11:15:41 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Thu, 04 Nov 2004 16:02:48 -0800 Charliedog43@aol.com wrote:
“They are intent on shredding the constitution and enriching
themselves.”
You don’t do much research yourself, do you? Just write down what
you believe to be true, and it is. How nice.

Touche 🙂 But hasn’t the info to support this already been posted
to the list? Admittedly one can only infer motivation from actions,
but the fact that people can now be held indefinitely without
informing anyone and that citizens can be spied on without a
warrant, plus various other provisions of the Patriot Act and
attempted follow-on legislation should suffice for the shredding of
the constitution (abrogating the Geneva Convention is also in this
spirit). The no-bid contracts with Halliburton and the oil angle
and bandwidth giveaways to the media and loosening of environmental
regulations for the energy industry point to a pattern of
enrichment as well.

Here’s something on the Patriot Act:

http://www.eff.org/Privacy/Surveillance/Terrorism/PATRIOT/

Something on the proposed ‘Patriot II’:

http://www.aclu.org/SafeandFree/SafeandFree.cfm?ID=14000&c=206

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine on the subject of music during Ibonauting]
Date: November 5, 2004 at 11:15:31 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thought some of you might be interested in this for iboga (or other
psychedelic) music…

current 93, a band that usually does dark folk and noisy industrial type
stuff, did one album with a guy named Harry Oldfield, who does
‘electro-crystal therapy’.

apparently, if you take crystals, submerge them in a saline solution, and
run an electric charge through them, they vibrate audibly at specific
frequencies for each type of crystal.

so, the album Current 93 presents Harry Oldfield ‘Crystal’ is a recording
of that; 18 tracks of different kinds of crystals. the sounds are entirely
pleasant, but soothing in an odd sort of way..

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Legalize Marijuana
Date: November 5, 2004 at 11:01:32 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yep..

one of the main endorsers of the original marijuana (and therefore hemp)
prohibition in the US was the newspaper tycoon William Randolph Hearst..
who, sheerly by coincidince of course, happened to be heavily invested in
lumber..

MONEY,IT’S AS SIMPLE AND COMPLICATED AS THAT.
—– Original Message —–
I grew up on a small tobacco and dairy farm that once grew hemp. I can’t
figure out why they haven’t started a hemp program to replace the
tobacco program. You can use it for anything or sell it overseas, the
rest of the world still uses the hell out of hemp.   Randy

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 5, 2004 at 11:00:34 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Thu, 04 Nov 2004 15:58:49 -0800 Charliedog43@aol.com wrote:
Fair enough. Here’s another “simple” google search on his kill
totals. http://www.moreorless.au.com/killers/hussein.htm

And the estimate there of the numbers gassed is.. not millions, not
hundreds of thousands, not even tens of thousands, … there is no
estimate of the total, just an estimate that 5000 may have been
gassed in the incident my link discussed.

The original issue was not the total killed by Hussein, but your
mention that it was hundreds of thousands or even millions. The
total number of Iraqis the site above estimates he killed is 150k-
340k, so again this makes your claim that he might have killed
millions of Iraqis with gas absurd.

You could do a hundred searches and come up with 100 different
estimates of people killed.

You need to correlate information, and guard against your biases.
It is not easy work.

But betwwen Kurds, Iranians, Iraqi
people and a few other nationalities, no one would argure probably

he’s responseable for 500,000 deaths during his reign of terror,
and
that’s a very low estimate. No one will ever know
the exact number, but it’s a lot of dead people. A lot.

It certainly is. He had an awful reign. Still nowhere nearly as bad
as North Korea, which actually poses a threat to us, which Iraq
didn’t.

Iraq had no connection to Al-Qaeda. It just has the second-largest
petroleum reserves in the world. Saudi Arabia is the home of Al-
Qaeda, and has the largest petroleum reserves in the world. However
the Saudi royal family has long connection with the Bush family,
and funded our current president’s early business career (see the
movie 9/11). The administration flew all the members of the bin
Laden family out of the country on 9/12 when all other flights were
grounded, compromising the investigation into 9/11. Of course
Hussein was awful, but that was the administration excuse, not its
reason for the invasion and occupation.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] insomnia, stress, et al.
Date: November 5, 2004 at 9:50:10 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

 

http://www.themusicalrainbow.com/
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From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 5, 2004 at 9:26:39 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yes would like to chat with you. how do I send off list?
—– Original Message —–
From: Ms Iboga
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 4:57 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Dear Fake Placebo and Paula,

I’m not sure if you have already read it, but “Memories, Dreams, Reflections”, by Jung, is a great intro to his life and his philosophies.

Paula, I have done Ibo two times now: once on my own, and once with a therapist.  I would highly recommend NOT doing it on your own- so many potential problems may arise.  When I self-treated, I basically screwed up the process, and ended up wasting $425 dollars(Ibo HCL is not cheap), not to mention the fact that I had to get right back on methadone, which was a real piss-off. The second time around, I paid about $1000(which put a dent in my pocketbook, but was worth it!) for my treatment, and I have been clean of all opiates for 10 days now.  I can’t tell you how liberating it feels to be off the ‘done- I feel like I’m coming back to life, like I have been reborn.

If you would like to chat, send me an email offlist, and I can (hopefully) answer some questions for you..There are many people on this list who are more knowledgeable/experienced than I, but I will help to the best of my abilities.

Cheers,
Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com</a

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tomorrow- on the subject of music during Ibonauting
Date: November 5, 2004 at 9:22:44 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jeff,

YES, music during the Ibo experience was amazing!!  I
listened to mostly instrumental music- lyrics were a
bit too distracting.  Drone-like music was the best,
as was music that I had no “drug association” with.
The Icelandic band Mum worked very well, as did
‘Mumbai Theme’, on the Talvin Singh record.  ‘Soil
Festivities’, by Vangelis, was pretty cool too, as was
Transmissions from the Planet Dog- the ambient stuff
only, not the techno.  Future Sound of London caused
me to trip my ass off, but in a startlingly dark
manner- I visualized monsters and decapitations.

When the effects of Ibo wear off, try listening to
soothing, calming music.  Any instrumental music,
especially with accompanying nature sounds, gave my
body shivers during the post-Ibo phase.  It will relax
you, and make any residual withdrawal seem less
important.  Solitudes compilations are cheesy, but
effective, as was ‘Musica Poetica’ by Orff(from
Badlands soundtrack).

My first treatment was music-free, and was not nearly
as enlightening or effective as my second,
music-infused treatment.

Good luck, Jeff…If I can help with anything else,
please feel free to email me.

Julie
PS. The Nasa Voyager recording “Symphony of the
PLanets”, was pretty amazing.  It’s ‘music’ based on
magnetic fields, and other natural phenomena picked up
by Voyager during it’s journey: solar wind,
magnetospheres, electromagnetic fields, and more….

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tomorrow
Date: November 5, 2004 at 9:02:07 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel, he’s going to be fine. That guy is perfect for Ibogaine. Intelligent, strong, and experienced in the ways. I can’t wait till he posts about his experience. I’d like to see his call on the treatment.              Randy

From: Jeffgd1@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tomorrow
Date: November 5, 2004 at 8:19:16 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/5/04 7:50:39 AM Eastern Standard Time, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:
…listening to soothing/spiritual/introspective/calming music while Ibonauting was nothing short of a miracle, and did wonders for anxiety.

Take care, and may the spirit of iboga embrace you to It’s bosom…
Jeff here…
Why thank so much. Does this mean you listened to music during the Ibo experience itself or do you mean the days after?? I was wondering about this. Thanks again
Jeff

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 5, 2004 at 8:00:11 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I also believe in Sheldrake’s view of morphic resonance having an affect on us, there is a good few articles by him on the web.  One that talks about the tourism being a replacement for pilgrimage, and how to increase our comfort as a species if we view our travels as a pilgrimage…very interesting fellow  Your english skills seem o.k. to me…what is your mother tongue?
—– Original Message —–
From: FakePlacebo
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 2:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Dear Paula,

I greed with you but we have to say that as Jung said before “all mankind have shared memory. Jung calls it “shadow archetype” Iboga sessions prove it. Common visions including similiar visions about arkaik ancestors. I believe that our subconsciousness tells us many thing also says about our health conditions. Carl G. Jung is very very interesting psychiatrist but if you don’t know about him and hes “Shadow Archetype” you have to read him. Beacuse it’s impossible to tell you with my poor English skill.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 3:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

My understanding is that we humans have two brains the rational and the primitive they are interconnected but sometimes the emotive brain acts without the rational brain’s control. ie irrational behavior.  Feldendrais helps to balance the two brains by retraining the emotive brain through movement.  These are small movements and if childhood issues have given me this response level to strangers, maybe working with the emotive brain will help my rational brain have control again in these situations.  He was an mechanical engineer and developed this program thru working with brain damaged people who wanted to get better. The papers on ibogaine state that people that had childhood trama have unbalanced brains one side is more dominant than that of another and after ibogaine there is more balance.  I’m thinking that Feldenkrais might start the process I’m trying to change and Ibogaine can only make it better or vice versa.  Try a class its usually about 10.00 for a trial(Canadian)  I do feel better and more relaxed after, but there is always a placebo effect. There are a couple of site with more info.  And you can get a book for home excercises. Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: Fosterwash14@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 6:54 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

hi
I’m new to learning about I bogaine, but I read these mindvox emails and I have learned alot about ibogaine. I am curious about what feldencrais is ?

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 5, 2004 at 7:57:34 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Fake Placebo and Paula,

I’m not sure if you have already read it, but “Memories, Dreams, Reflections”, by Jung, is a great intro to his life and his philosophies.

Paula, I have done Ibo two times now: once on my own, and once with a therapist.  I would highly recommend NOT doing it on your own- so many potential problems may arise.  When I self-treated, I basically screwed up the process, and ended up wasting $425 dollars(Ibo HCL is not cheap), not to mention the fact that I had to get right back on methadone, which was a real piss-off. The second time around, I paid about $1000(which put a dent in my pocketbook, but was worth it!) for my treatment, and I have been clean of all opiates for 10 days now.  I can’t tell you how liberating it feels to be off the ‘done- I feel like I’m coming back to life, like I have been reborn.

If you would like to chat, send me an email offlist, and I can (hopefully) answer some questions for you..There are many people on this list who are more knowledgeable/experienced than I, but I will help to the best of my abilities.

Cheers,
Julie

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tomorrow
Date: November 5, 2004 at 7:46:49 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Rachael and Jeff,

Wow, that’s great!  I wish you both the best of luck- I’m sure you’ll find what you’re looking for.

You might want to have a couple cans of meal replacement on hand, as you won’t be able to eat anything substantial for at least 12-24 hours after ingesting Ibo, and believe me, you will feel your stomach rumbling.  For some reason, strawberry flavour was the most appealing to me whilst on Ibo.  Saltines were also well tolerated by my stomach.  Avoid coffee, sugar, nicotine and unnecessary meds for as long as you can possibly bear during the post-Ibo phase.  Sweet Leaf worked wonders for me; if you enjoy it’s effects, pick up a bag- of all the substances, vitamins, remedies and potions I ingested over the past 10 days, sweet leaf was by far the most therapeutic.

As soon as you can, begin a vitamin/exercise regimen, and read a lot of books/articles- watching TV did NOTHING for me, but reading actually served as a natural ‘tranquilizer’.  And music, sweet music…listening to soothing/spiritual/introspective/calming music while Ibonauting was nothing short of a miracle, and did wonders for anxiety.

Take care, and may the spirit of iboga embrace you to It’s bosom…

love Julie

PS. During your treatment on an astrologically significant date is fortuitous, and highly recommended.

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 5, 2004 at 5:48:14 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Paula,

I greed with you but we have to say that as Jung said before “all mankind have shared memory. Jung calls it “shadow archetype” Iboga sessions prove it. Common visions including similiar visions about arkaik ancestors. I believe that our subconsciousness tells us many thing also says about our health conditions. Carl G. Jung is very very interesting psychiatrist but if you don’t know about him and hes “Shadow Archetype” you have to read him. Beacuse it’s impossible to tell you with my poor English skill.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 3:16 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

My understanding is that we humans have two brains the rational and the primitive they are interconnected but sometimes the emotive brain acts without the rational brain’s control. ie irrational behavior.  Feldendrais helps to balance the two brains by retraining the emotive brain through movement.  These are small movements and if childhood issues have given me this response level to strangers, maybe working with the emotive brain will help my rational brain have control again in these situations.  He was an mechanical engineer and developed this program thru working with brain damaged people who wanted to get better. The papers on ibogaine state that people that had childhood trama have unbalanced brains one side is more dominant than that of another and after ibogaine there is more balance.  I’m thinking that Feldenkrais might start the process I’m trying to change and Ibogaine can only make it better or vice versa.  Try a class its usually about 10.00 for a trial(Canadian)  I do feel better and more relaxed after, but there is always a placebo effect. There are a couple of site with more info.  And you can get a book for home excercises. Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: Fosterwash14@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 6:54 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

hi
I’m new to learning about I bogaine, but I read these mindvox emails and I have learned alot about ibogaine. I am curious about what feldencrais is ?

From: Fosterwash14@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 5, 2004 at 2:41:01 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

paula
i’m trying to learn the ropes toward methadone detox  and i would love to have more answers , i”m interested in Ibogaine as that vehicle, i appreciate the reply about feldencrais

From: Rachel Radhakrishna <rachelradha@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] tomorrow
Date: November 4, 2004 at 10:30:54 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Venus and Jupiter are conjunct within 1 degree in the
morning, perhaps now in Netherlands.  It’s supposed to
be a grand sight astronomically, and astrologically
beneficent as well. Hope it’s clear skies wherever you
are to look.

I think Jeff’s tx is planned for the eve since he had
his last bottle today at one.  I couldn’t watch him
drink it, and also checked out in a four hour nap for
some mental downtime.  Alternating between stress and
peace about it all, some of which is my anxious
nature, but also perhaps codependence, attachment, and
natural caution.  He’s drinking lots of water and
taking B50s  and eating his veggies.

My latest mood about it is like he’s renewing his
driver’s license, somatically speaking.  Although I am
also pouring out libations of red wine to the
Goddesses  and dusting off crystals.

Thanks for all the love and support.  Rachy (& JeffG)

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

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From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Legalize Marijuana
Date: November 4, 2004 at 10:06:06 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

MONEY,IT’S AS SIMPLE AND COMPLICATED AS THAT.
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, November 05, 2004 1:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Legalize Marijuana

I grew up on a small tobacco and dairy farm that once grew hemp. I can’t figure out why they haven’t started a hemp program to replace the tobacco program. You can use it for anything or sell it overseas, the rest of the world still uses the hell out of hemp.   Randy

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: November 4, 2004 at 9:58:21 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Sara ,Im gonna be bold & break up the political talk ,hey Sara Id like to come get an ibogaine treatment ,(not to interrupt addiction but for spiritual growth )next year ,should i email you for details?Shelley

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:

I’m Glad not to be an American, and not to live in the US.

200,000 people die each year in the US from getting the wrong medication ,
wrong treatment. People die all the time everywhere, but you got the mater
to disaster as a president.

I just hope that those American who promised to pay me back for treatments
will do that, what goes around comes around. disastrous people with no
dignity.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Verzonden: donderdag 4 november 2004 17:36
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist
dictator from Texas

>> But, I do have a tendency to believe the “Purple
>> Heart” stories about Kerry are true.

Very sad – you could research the facts, but that would contradict
what you want to believe.

>> And, also to shoot a wounded, running, man is the back is
>> something I would have a problem with, even in
>> war.

But ok to dodge the war, use others to lie about your opponent’s
heroism, hide from danger rather than lead after 9/11, alienate
your allies, start a war on false pretences that creates
innumerable new enemies, and not take care of your troops. Versus
killing someone in the heat of battle who was about to kill you and
your men and might still be a threat, following an act of heroism
totally at odds with Bush’s champion party-going stature during
that period of history.

In electing Bush, the US has put its head in the sand and offered
its behind to the most cynically self-interested group to come
along in our lifetime. They are intent on shredding the
constitution and enriching themselves. The increase in terrorism
that they are cultivating will only help keep them in power. The
democrats will likely be forced to play the same game because that
is what the people want. Osama is fully succeeding in baiting the
US into bankrupting itself. Here’s the full text of his recent
address to the people of the US:

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/79C6AF22-98FB-4A1C-B21F-
2BC36E87F61F.htm

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

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From: knowone knowwhere <kn0m0n3@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] [ot] paper & pencil vs. evanga666 owned voting machines
Date: November 4, 2004 at 8:36:23 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Where does Nixon’s silent majority keep the safe?

Wednesday November 3, 2004 – Evangelical Re-elects CIA child will protect.

Kerry may be regretting activism after the Vietnam war due to the emotional wounds it re-opened which combined with homophobia marketing, fogged American voter logic to the point of choosing the looser of 3 debates.  One of the first leaders to put their opinion in for Bush was Putin from the former Soviet Union.  This is a guy that has taken Bush’s lead on terrorism and uses it to undo any progress made in the 1990’s.  The stage is set for untapped investment potential of the business of spy vs. spy.

I may sound like an alarmist, but I am unsure how to have a logical conversation with evangelical ‘faith’/brainwashing which by definition avoids logic.  But just in case I’m wrong, here’s a few things that concern me about Bush:

The willingness to use ‘low yield nuclear weapons’ more liberally in conventional warfare.  This has two visible sides.  Against say America’s behaviors are the example of what America sets as what is and isn’t acceptable regarding use of nuclear weapons in “conventional warfare”.  The rational for the use are the need to break up underground tunnels in the middle east.  The ‘low yield’ nukes would disrupt the tunnels, but what about afterwards and the issue of contaminated drinking water.  “So many things can happen with a good water system and so many things don’t happen when a good water source is not available.”

One also has to consider the pro’s and con’s of attempting to legislate morality.  What are the pro’s and con’s of not taking the worlds opinion in consideration, or at least attempting to appear like the opinions of other countries matter.  Is re-electing unilateralism help or hinder our abilities to affectively “fight terror”.  Business’s are seeing the profits of “providing security”, no doubt.  And once in motion, the snowball effect must be considered.

I am convinced that no matter how much sense repealing prohibition would make, it will not pass public scrutiny due to arguments due to an inability of the radical right to handle the obvious, out of sight out of mind mentality.  More people will go to jail to help the growth and profits of the prison industrial complex.  Violent crime and non-violent crime will be called ‘crime’, and politicians promise to be tough on it.  It can seem like America’s economy has been hijacked and propped up by prohibition.  Who can deny OBL was funded by the economic opportunities prohibition creates just as Al Capon was.  How can this make sense?  If we do not separate terrorism from prohibition, we are sealing our own fate.  We simply cannot afford anymore to pretend that the enforcement side of prohibition is having any progress at all, if not making things worse.  Does it not make sense to use these officers for the war on terror, instead of “a war neither likely nor designed to succeed”?  Groups like law enforcement against prohibition will grow in their influence when prohibition falls under the weight of it’s own hypocrisy.  ‘Treatment over incarceration’?  Sure.  By the way what does treatment mean?

Where is Nixon’s safe?  The answer may be in the techniques of evangelical hypnosis.  Televised ritual is what they are worshiping when they talk about the sacred satellite dish.  Greed has reared beyond the Ugly American.  So in the spirit of all this narcissism “let me talk about me me me me (666)” while Mrs. Edwards deals with breast cancer.  Sinclair is actually taking some heat for it’s misplaced use of broadcasting power, but with the re-election of Ashcroft who knows.
The I-ching seems to be the sequence.  My desk is up and running and that feels good.  I am intrigued by a few books from the library, books on Dali and  “Leonardo’s cross-sectional rendering of a man’s right leg is the first known example of a technique still widely used for the study of anatomy.  Although Leonardo numbered various parts of one segment of the leg got reference, his notes identifying them have not been found “
“How It Is Necessary To Know the Inner Structure of Man”

Anatomical drawing of a skull facing left, 1489
“Leonardo’s cross section of the interior of the skull was the first in the history of anatomy.  His notes refer to “the confluence of all the senses” at the intersection of the diagonal and vertical lines-mistakenly, he believed that all sensations, especially the “emanations” of vision, converged here.”

“Perhaps the most famous of Leonardo’s anatomical drawings is this one of a fetus inside the womb.  Faulty as it is in some respects, in others-notably the position of the fetus and umbilical cord—iit is so accurate and so expertly drawn that it can still be used as an example in medical textbooks today.”
–The World of Leonardo 1452-1519

“The youngest needles to grind up for DNA” (genetic make up of slash pine needles study at University of Miami)

I wonder how the D.O.C. took the news of 4 more years of W.

“The last night of a damned soul” works both ways.

Environmental treaty may mean more then it appear.

Polyhedron, Fra Luca Pacili’s On Divine Proportion.  “not only…in numbers and measurements but also in sounds, weights, positions and in whatsoever power there may be.”                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                             &n bsp;

ALL-NEW Yahoo! Messenger – all new features – even more fun!

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 4, 2004 at 8:16:11 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My understanding is that we humans have two brains the rational and the primitive they are interconnected but sometimes the emotive brain acts without the rational brain’s control. ie irrational behavior.  Feldendrais helps to balance the two brains by retraining the emotive brain through movement.  These are small movements and if childhood issues have given me this response level to strangers, maybe working with the emotive brain will help my rational brain have control again in these situations.  He was an mechanical engineer and developed this program thru working with brain damaged people who wanted to get better. The papers on ibogaine state that people that had childhood trama have unbalanced brains one side is more dominant than that of another and after ibogaine there is more balance.  I’m thinking that Feldenkrais might start the process I’m trying to change and Ibogaine can only make it better or vice versa.  Try a class its usually about 10.00 for a trial(Canadian)  I do feel better and more relaxed after, but there is always a placebo effect. There are a couple of site with more info.  And you can get a book for home excercises. Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: Fosterwash14@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 6:54 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

hi
I’m new to learning about I bogaine, but I read these mindvox emails and I have learned alot about ibogaine. I am curious about what feldencrais is ?

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from T..
Date: November 4, 2004 at 7:35:19 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I actually heard Rudi Giulani’s name bandied about today- that is one hell of a scary thought.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 7:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from T..

I’m not sure who the “they” are that you’re refering to, but if it is
the BushAdmin, then this is exactly what they are accomplishing.

On another note, I read online today (truthout.org) that AssKKKroft may
be resigning. But then again he’ll probably be replaced by an even
scarier figure.

hopefully he’ll be replaced by someone who could beat a dead guy in an
election, at least…

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: November 4, 2004 at 7:25:32 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m Glad not to be an American, and not to live in the US.

200,000 people die each year in the US from getting the wrong medication ,
wrong treatment. People die all the time everywhere, but you got the mater
to disaster as a president.

I just hope that those American who promised to pay me back for treatments
will do that, what goes around comes around. disastrous people with no
dignity.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Verzonden: donderdag 4 november 2004 17:36
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist
dictator from Texas

But, I do have a tendency to believe the “Purple
Heart” stories about Kerry are true.

Very sad – you could research the facts, but that would contradict
what you want to believe.

And, also to shoot a wounded, running, man is the back is
something I would have a problem with, even in
war.

But ok to dodge the war, use others to lie about your opponent’s
heroism, hide from danger rather than lead after 9/11, alienate
your allies, start a war on false pretences that creates
innumerable new enemies, and not take care of your troops. Versus
killing someone in the heat of battle who was about to kill you and
your men and might still be a threat, following an act of heroism
totally at odds with Bush’s champion party-going stature during
that period of history.

In electing Bush, the US has put its head in the sand and offered
its behind to the most cynically self-interested group to come
along in our lifetime. They are intent on shredding the
constitution and enriching themselves. The increase in terrorism
that they are cultivating will only help keep them in power. The
democrats will likely be forced to play the same game because that
is what the people want. Osama is fully succeeding in baiting the
US into bankrupting itself. Here’s the full text of his recent
address to the people of the US:

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/79C6AF22-98FB-4A1C-B21F-
2BC36E87F61F.htm

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from T..
Date: November 4, 2004 at 7:14:32 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m not sure who the “they” are that you’re refering to, but if it is
the BushAdmin, then this is exactly what they are accomplishing.

On another note, I read online today (truthout.org) that AssKKKroft may
be resigning. But then again he’ll probably be replaced by an even
scarier figure.

hopefully he’ll be replaced by someone who could beat a dead guy in an
election, at least…

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from T..
Date: November 4, 2004 at 7:11:30 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m not sure who the “they” are that you’re refering to, but if it is the BushAdmin, then this is exactly what they are accomplishing.

On another note, I read online today (truthout.org) that AssKKKroft may be resigning. But then again he’ll probably be replaced by an even scarier figure.

On Thursday, November 4, 2004, at 02:02 PM, Charliedog43@aol.com wrote:

“They are intent on shredding the
constitution and enriching themselves.”
You don’t do much research yourself, do you? Just write down what you believe to be true, and it is. How nice.

From: Charliedog43@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from T..
Date: November 4, 2004 at 7:02:48 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“They are intent on shredding the
constitution and enriching themselves.”
You don’t do much research yourself, do you? Just write down what you believe to be true, and it is. How nice.

From: Charliedog43@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 4, 2004 at 6:58:49 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Fair enough. Here’s another “simple” google search on his kill totals.
http://www.moreorless.au.com/killers/hussein.htm

You could do a hundred searches and come up with 100 different estimates of people killed. But betwwen Kurds, Iranians, Iraqi people and a few other nationalities, no one would argure probably he’s responseable for 500,000 deaths during his reign of terror, and that’s a very low estimate. No one will ever know the exact number, but it’s a lot of dead people. A lot.

From: Dana <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [Ibogaine] [Fwd: Valis is Valid / Psychedelic Bolsheviks / Re: valis vs. ubik]
Date: November 4, 2004 at 4:59:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

——– Original Message ——–
Subject: Valis is Valid / Psychedelic Bolsheviks / Re: valis vs. ubik
Date: Thu, 4 Nov 2004 16:45:44 -0400
From: Petros Evdokas <petros@cyprus-org.net>
To: kali_kantzaros@yahoo.com <kali_kantzaros@yahoo.com>

* Friends:
The exchange below, takes as its point of departure a discussion about the entity named Valis, referred to by the author  Philip K. Dick in a small number of books he wrote close to the end of his life.
One does not need to have read any of the books to follow what’s being discussed here – within a few  lines, the meaning of the material is entirely obvious. -Petros

Dana Beal (sort of) wrote:
“…You could say I represented the VALIS faction…
That is to say, I think VALIS not just autobiographical, but really happening. And I think I figured out the key to all …because it has to do with the subject matter, and not the literal texts of Philip K. Dick’s books.”

Dana/cnw
—————
Hello Dana,

This excerpt above from your previous letter, contains all the reasons why I joined this email group ( philipkdick@yahoogroups.com ), and also the reasons why I live and work the way I do, including my path in life through political and spiritually- motivated activism, work in healthcare, and worship.
During the course of about a year, through a difficult mental- emotional process I slowly and reluntantly woke up to the reality of Valis which you mentioned above. That  year was around 1988/89 and I’ve been ….blown away by its immensity ever since. I feel that for people who are  plugged into the context of the radical and alternative community as political activists, or even better, as spiritually motivated radical activists, as class- warrior servants of the Spirit { Psychedelic Bolsheviks, so to speak } it might be a little easier to comprehend the unbearable immensity of what you wrote.
It’s easy to go crazy and to “loose it all” when a person who is isolated, or who is active mostly as an individual, cut off from collectivity, becomes aware that the Vast Intelligence is not science fiction but an Active Living entity, a feature of reality sprung directly from the core of the Divine. A single isolated human being, especially in today’s modern world which glorifies the cult of individualism through an obsessive fetishism of the spectacle at the marketplace, is very vulnerable to losing ones’ mind and becoming entirely dysfunctional if/when exposed to the bare truth of Valis.

Valis is Valid, and Vast

Collectives, tribal entities, co-op households, radical unions, music bands, long- term affinity groups, polyamorous relationship webs, intentional families, pantheist and pagan congregations or covens, politically engaged spiritual assemblies of mystics from the genuine esoteric branches of the judaeo- chrictian- islamic- bahai traditions, and other similar politico- spiritual and/ or sexual group entities, are able to provide a loving embrace and practical opportunities for an individual to merge with the wider entity to some degree, in a manner similar to Communion with Valis, and to cultivate a harmonious relationship to the Divine in this way, expanding the limits of  comprehension at a comfortable pace, slowly, healthily, and with reverence for the Object of that sacred union.

Otherwise, our human awareness, being as it is an industrial product no different than sausages spewed out by modern factories, an awareness born of a shallow educational system, television, and of (mostly) dysfunctional nuclear families, is unable to loosen up its barriers in an appropriate manner to unite as a single individual consciousness with the Vast Cosciousness of Cosmic proportions which the Living Light, Valis, constitutes. The rigid, unprepared (or individualist) person’s fate is then condemned to be that of the butterfly of the night, the moth: as moths to a flame, we seek to unite with the All, and get burned.
Another, indispensible part of the relationship with Valis, is the need to process the experiences of Union, to process the emotions and information and healing potential which gets stirred up by such encounters. Always, the burning questions remain “What to do with all of this”? All of the information, instructions, revelations, directives, gifts of Grace from the Divine which are bestowed on us by contact with Valis, need a conduit to transmit them, a fertile soil to seed, a machinery to fuel: single individuals cut off from a collective social process are unfortunately only as good as a cauldron trying to contain a nuclear bomb. As vessels made of living matter, even when we’ve had a lifetime of attunenment and cultivation of our abilities, we are too small to contain even a sliver of the grand and penultimate awareness which stems directly from the Source of time, gravity, light, and matter. Collective entities such as the ones named above, if organized and operating well
, are small social organisms within whose embrace we become more able to process our experiences of sacramental Union with Valis and/or with other emanations of the Divine, and …survine! Not only that, but with our colleagues, comrades, lovers, friends, fellow travellers, to find pathways to actualize – put into action – the knowledge or information or emotional wisdom we access by contact with the Vast Intelligence.

I’ve been very reluctant to accept these truths, and I still struggle with them. But every day brings more – unbearable! signs – subtle and mindblowing reminders of intergalactic wisdom permeating everything I get involved with. At some point or another, I must find a way to accept that even at best, I’m only an instrument of an Intelligence of Cosmic dimensions, which, has gracefully allowed me the freedom to choose whether to be such an instrument or not. And then of course, there’s the constant burning questions “What to do with all this”?

Some relevant reading, grouped by themes:

Tripping the Sour Singularity Oneness
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Entheogens/message/1914

Fingerprints of the Gods – “pre-tribal” structures
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Entheogens/message/970

Re: Fingerprints of the Gods – “pre-tribal” / Joseph
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Entheogens/message/1063

Re: [Entheogens] Fingerprints of the Gods – “pre-tribal” structures  / Glenn
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Entheogens/message/980

Eleusinian Mysteries?
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Entheogens/message/889

On the nature of Reality; the underlying structure of the Universe / Dana
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Entheogens/message/575

fetishizing the substance / Glenn
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Entheogens/message/87

The Body
http://www.burleehost.net/cyprus/the_body.htm

Petros
http://petros-Evdokas.cyprus-org.net/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Niacin and ginger tea
Date: November 4, 2004 at 1:34:26 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Niacin at low dosages is okay. At high amounts it can cause drug induced
hepatitis. It can exacerbate anxiety and make you tjink you are having a
heart
attack nif you are not orepared for the hot flush that follows shortly
after
ingestion. Taking Ibuprofen 400 mgs 1/2 hour prior to niacin makes it a
little
more mellow. Good luck.

niacin induced liver does occur, but it’s not especially common, and in
most cases is not serious (though there have been a couple deaths).  it’s
most often caused by sustained release niacin preparations, not
crystalline (regular) niacin.

sustained release niacin doesn’t generally elicit the flushing effects of
crystalline niacin.

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 4, 2004 at 1:24:47 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As for Zyprexa and and Seroquel.  Zyprexa made me Halucinate, I was to
take one pill for a week then move up to two pills a week (37.5 mg).
Before the first week I was halucinateing and talking to people who were
not there and using the walls to help me walk.  I believe Zyprexa is an
SSRI drug.  Ibo is an SSRI antagonist – IMHO do not mix.

A few months ago a doc gave me Seroquel which is a SSRI antagonist, that
didn’t work for me either.  These SSRI drugs can last a long time in the
brain.  I would NEVER think of mixing the two drugs with Ibo.  But what do
I know, it is just my opinion.  Thought I would pass it on.

Sorry for responding  to this  in two parts… but….

as Shelly said, Zyprexa and Seroquel are both antipsychotics, or
neuroleptics as they’re sometimes called. They both are belived to work by
acting as dopamine antagonists. They are both “atypical” neuroleptics,
meaning that they are more selective in their dopamine antagonism, and
hence have less side effects, than the older “typical” neuroleptics, like
thorazine and haldol.

Ibogaine is not a SSRI antagonist*, it is a partial serotonin agonist**,
among other things. The reason it isn’t safe to take SSRIs and ibogaine
together is because of the risk of serotonin overload, or “serotonin
syndrome” as it’s called.

*it doesn’t really mean anything to say “SSRI antagonist”. when you’re
talking about agonism and antagonism, you’re talking about increasing or
decreasing transmission of neurotransmitters. An SSRI is a drug that
blocks the reuptake of serotonin (and therefore is a serotonin agonist).

**studies on ibogaine’s effects on serotonin have yielded some conflicting
results.. but it seems to have affinity for some, but not all, of the
serotonin receptors.

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 4, 2004 at 12:58:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have been using benzos for years.  Valium and Restoril.  If one is
taking a large amount of Valium and then quite abruptly they may
experience seziures.  It takes 10 days before withdrawal from benzos
starts – my doc told me this.

How long it takes before benzo withdrawal kicks in depends on what
particular benzo you’re talking about.

Longer acting ones like klonopin and valium could take that long, but
shorter acting ones like xanax and ativan would only take a couple days.

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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 4, 2004 at 12:01:13 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

No offense Julie, but the death toll of this war
does not even compare to the hundreds of thousands
(some say millions) of innocent
Kurds and others this mad man gassed to death

I’m not sure that the gassings extended even to tens of thousands –
you might want to check facts. Some may say millions because they
want people to stop thinking. This article from a simple google
search (iraq gassing kurds) might give one pause for example:

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article1148.htm

One interesting statement in that article, which is by a former CIA
analyst who covered that area:

“Thus America could alter the destiny of the Middle East in a way
that probably could not be challenged for decades — not solely by
controlling Iraq’s oil, but by controlling its water.”

There is so much useful information, so easily available, that can
help one estimate what the truth is, that it’s really sad to see
how most of the US wants to ignore it and buy deeper into future
pain for the illusory protection of Bush’s fear-mongering.

I wonder if the sanctions may have killed more Iraqis than Saddam,
and certainly a lot of Kurds and Shiites he killed were those who
attacked him when the US promised its support to them during the
1st Iraqi war -and then abandoned them to their fate until
belatedly setting up no-fly zones.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: November 4, 2004 at 11:35:45 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

But, I do have a tendency to believe the “Purple
Heart” stories about Kerry are true.

Very sad – you could research the facts, but that would contradict
what you want to believe.

And, also to shoot a wounded, running, man is the back is
something I would have a problem with, even in
war.

But ok to dodge the war, use others to lie about your opponent’s
heroism, hide from danger rather than lead after 9/11, alienate
your allies, start a war on false pretences that creates
innumerable new enemies, and not take care of your troops. Versus
killing someone in the heat of battle who was about to kill you and
your men and might still be a threat, following an act of heroism
totally at odds with Bush’s champion party-going stature during
that period of history.

In electing Bush, the US has put its head in the sand and offered
its behind to the most cynically self-interested group to come
along in our lifetime. They are intent on shredding the
constitution and enriching themselves. The increase in terrorism
that they are cultivating will only help keep them in power. The
democrats will likely be forced to play the same game because that
is what the people want. Osama is fully succeeding in baiting the
US into bankrupting itself. Here’s the full text of his recent
address to the people of the US:

http://english.aljazeera.net/NR/exeres/79C6AF22-98FB-4A1C-B21F-
2BC36E87F61F.htm

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
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From: Germán DC <gcaldelas@fibertel.com.ar>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Legalize Marijuana
Date: November 4, 2004 at 11:25:47 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

the Elkhorn Manifesto

http://www.sumeria.net/politics/shadv3.html

gdc.
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 12:28 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Legalize Marijuana

I grew up on a small tobacco and dairy farm that once grew hemp. I can’t figure out why they haven’t started a hemp program to replace the tobacco program. You can use it for anything or sell it overseas, the rest of the world still uses the hell out of hemp.   Randy

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT!) more on killing innocents
Date: November 4, 2004 at 11:14:02 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Note that the sanctions against Iraq drove up infant mortality due
to lack of medicines etc. I wonder how many of the guys who lost a
baby fought or are now fighting the occupation. There was a big
article in Harper’s a couple of years ago on how appalled other UN
bureacrats were by US twisting of the sanctions to deny basic
necessities that were not military. In effect the US targeted the
unborn and very young as revenge for the Iraqi people allowing
Saddam to remain in power. He and his sons were hard to unseat
because of the apparatus of dictatorship (secret police, torture,
etc), so the Iraqi people were caught between a rock and a hard
place. Then as now.

Earlier I read that aside from being despotic, Saddam did improve
living conditions in Iraq before the sanctions.

On Mon, 01 Nov 2004 17:34:32 -0800 Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
wrote:
So this one is really mostly for Faith and her ilk, who seem to
feel that
unborn embryos are more special and deserving of safety and
protection than
those already born and alive.
Like all these women and children being killed by our forces today

in Iraq.
Hmmm. So, is it ok that these hundred thousand plus are murdered
by us,
because we’ve stopped the murdering by Saddam of the very same
people? Is
our murding somehow less deadly or permenant than Saddams?
Sigh.
—–
(from another list I’m on- subscribe info at the bottom here.)

‘The Lancet’ — the journal of the British Medical Association,
and one of
the most widely-read medical journals in the world, has just
published a
scientific research study documenting the massive slaughter of
civilians in
Iraq following the USA-led Iraq-Attack in March 2003.  Moreover,
the study
documents that MOST of the fatalities have been women and children,

largely
killed in air strikes by the USA and its ‘coalition’ members.

The address below gets you to the intro pages of the two pieces
with further
links — users may need to register (which is free and easy):

http://www.thelancet.com/journal/vol364/iss9445/early_online_
publication
_ _ _

Richard Horton, the editor of the Lancet was interviewed Friday
morning on
the BBC radio program ‘Today’.  He said he was confident the
figures in the
article documented below were an accurate reflection of reality.

Medical research depends upon statistics, and most papers
published in the
Lancet, and all other international medical journals, use
statistics to
arrive at conclusions.

Britain’s Channel 4 TV news Friday evening was quoting the Prime
Minister’s
office and other sources as ‘rubbishing’ the statistical strength
based upon
numbers sampled, and whether those sampled are representative of
the whole
population.  They even said the 100,000 figure was an
extrapolation of the
sample figures — well yes, they would be, wouldn’t they?  Short
of
interviewing the entire population, they would have to be an
extrapolation
of a smaller number.

The editorial staff of the Lancet cannot publish any paper without

analyzing
the paper’s validity based substantially upon on its statistical
rigor.
Research doctors and journal editors understand statistics as well

as any
other discipline might (apart I suppose than statisticians).  That

is not to
say no one ever gets it wrong …

In other words Richard Horton is very publicly putting his
reputation on the
line over this paper.

[Above comments by Dr. Peter Hall on list JUSTWATCH-L]
_ _ _

The study is titled:

Mortality Before and After the 2003 Invasion of Iraq: Cluster
Sample Survey
by Les Roberts, Riyadh Lafta, Richard Garfield, Jamal Khudhairi,
and Gilbert
Burnham

Summary

Background

In March, 2003, military forces, mainly from the USA and the UK,
invaded
Iraq.  We did a survey to compare mortality during the period of
14-16
months before the invasion with the 17-18 months after it.

Methods

A cluster sample survey was undertaken throughout Iraq during
September,
2004.  33 clusters of 30 households each were interviewed about
household
composition, births, and deaths since January, 2002.  In those
households
reporting deaths, the date, cause, and circumstances of violent
deaths were
recorded.  We assessed the relative risk of death associated with
the 2003
invasion and occupation by comparing mortality in the 17ท8 months
after the
invasion with the 14ท6-month period preceding it.

Findings

The risk of death was estimated to be 2.5-fold (95% CI 1ท6-4ท2)
higher after
the invasion when compared with the pre-invasion period.  Two-
thirds of all
violent deaths were reported in one cluster in the city of
Fallujah.  If we
exclude the Fallujah data, the risk of death is 1.5-fold (1ท1-2ท3)

higher
after the invasion.  We estimate that 98,000 more deaths than
expected
(8,000-194,000) happened after the invasion outside of Fallujah,
and far
more if the outlier Fallujah cluster is included.  The major
causes of death
before the invasion were myocardial infarction, cerebrovascular
accidents,
and other chronic disorders, whereas after the invasion violence
was the
primary cause of death.  Violent deaths were widespread, reported
in 15 of
33 clusters, and were mainly attributed to coalition forces.  Most

individuals reportedly killed by coalition forces were women and
children.
The risk of death from violence in the period after the invasion
was 58
times higher (95% CI 8ท1-41!
9) tha
n in the period before the war.

Interpretation

Making conservative assumptions, we think that about 100,000
excess deaths,
or more, have happened since the 2003 invasion of Iraq.  Violence
accounted
for most of the excess deaths and air strikes from coalition
forces
accounted for most violent deaths.  We have shown that collection
of
public-health information is possible even during periods of
extreme
violence.  Our results need further verification and should lead
to changes
to reduce non-combatant deaths from air strikes.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _

100,000 Iraqi Deaths
by Emma Ross
[Associated Press Medical Writer]

London — A survey of deaths in Iraqi households estimates that as

many as
100,000 more people may have died throughout the country in the 18

months
after the U.S. invasion than would be expected based on the death
rate
before the war.

There is no official figure for the number of Iraqis killed since
the
conflict began, but some non-governmental estimates range from 10,
000 to
30,000.  As of Wednesday, 1,081 U.S. servicemen had been killed,
according
to the U.S. Defense Department.

The scientists who wrote the report concede that the data they
based their
projections on were of “limited precision,” because the quality of

the
information depends on the accuracy of the household interviews
used for the
study.  The interviewers were Iraqi, most of them doctors.

Designed and conducted by researchers at Johns Hopkins University,

Columbia
University and the Al-Mustansiriya University in Baghdad, the
study is being
published Thursday on the web site of The Lancet medical journal.

The survey indicated violence accounted for most of the extra
deaths seen
since the invasion, and air strikes from coalition forces caused
most of the
violent deaths, the researchers wrote in the British-based journal.

“Most individuals reportedly killed by coalition forces were women

and
children,” they said.

The report was released just days before the U.S. presidential
election, and
the lead researcher said he wanted it that way.  The Lancet
routinely
publishes papers on the Web before they appear in print,
particularly if it
considers the findings of urgent public health interest.

Those reports then appear later in the print issue of the journal.

The
journal’s spokesmen said they were uncertain which print issue the

Iraqi
report would appear in, and said it was too late to make Friday’s
issue …
and possibly too late for the November 5 edition.

Les Roberts, the lead researcher from Johns Hopkins, said the
article’s
timing was up to him.

“I emailed it in on September 30 under the condition that it came
out before
the election,” Roberts told The Asocciated Press.  “My motive in
doing that
was not to skew the election.  My motive was that if this came out

during
the campaign, both candidates would be forced to pledge to protect

civilian
lives in Iraq.

“I was opposed to the war and I still think that the war was a bad

idea, but
I think that our science has transcended our perspectives,”
Roberts said.
“As an American, I am really, really sorry to be reporting this.”

Richard Peto, an expert on study methods who was not involved with

the
research, said the approach the scientists took is a reasonable
one to
investigate the Iraq death toll.

However, it’s possible that they may have zoned in on hotspots
that might
not be representative of the death toll across Iraq, said Peto, a
professor
of medical statistics at Oxford University in England.

To conduct the survey, investigators visited 33 neighborhoods
spread evenly
across the country in September, randomly selecting clusters of 30

households to sample.  Of the 988 households visited, 808,
consisting of
7,868 people, agreed to participate in the survey.  At each one,
they asked
how many people lived in the home, and how many births and deaths
there had
been since January 2002.

The scientists then compared death rates in the 15 months before
the
invasion with those that occurred during the 18 months after the
attack, and
adjusted those numbers to account for the different time periods.

Even though the sample size appears small, this type of survey is
considered
accurate and acceptable by scientists, and was used to calculate
war deaths
in Kosovo in the late 1990s.

The investigators worked in teams of three.  Five of the six Iraqi

interviewers were doctors, and all six were fluent in English and
Arabic.

In the households reporting deaths, the person who died had to be
living
there at the time of the death and for more than two months before

to be
counted.  In an attempt at firmer confirmation, the interviewers
asked for
death certificates in 78 households and were provided them 63
times.

There were 46 deaths in the surveyed households before the war.
After the
invasion, there were 142 deaths.  That is an increase from 5
deaths per
1,000 people per year to 12.3 per 1,000 people per year — more
than double.

However, more than a third of the post-invasion deaths were
reported in one
cluster of households in the city of Fallujah, where fighting has
been most
intense recently.  Because the fighting was so severe there, the
numbers
from that location may have exaggerated the overall picture.

When the researchers recalculated the effect of the war without
the
statistics from Fallujah, the deaths end up at 7.9 per 1,000
people per year
.. still 1.5 times higher than before the war.

Even with Fallujah factored out, the survey “indicates that the
death toll
associated with the invasion and occupation of Iraq is more likely

than not
about 100,000 people, and may be much higher,” the report said.

The most common causes of death before the invasion of Iraq were
heart
attacks, strokes and other chronic diseases.  However, after the
invasion,
violence was recorded as the primary cause of death, and was
mainly
attributed to coalition forces … with about 95 percent of those
deaths
caused by bombs or fire from helicopter gunships.

Violent deaths defined as those brought about by the intentional
act of
others were reported in 15 of the 33 clusters.  The chances of a
violent
death were 58 times higher after the invasion than before it, the
researchers said.

Twelve of the 73 violent deaths were not attributed to coalition
forces.
The researchers said 28 children were killed by coalition forces
in the
survey households.  Infant mortality rose from 29 deaths per 1,000

live
births before the war to 57 deaths per 1,000 afterward.

The researchers estimated the nationwide death toll due to the
conflict by
multiplying the difference between the two death rates by the
estimated
population of Iraq 24.4 million at the start of the war.  The
result was
then multiplied by 18 months, the average period between the
invasion and
the survey interviews.

“We estimate that there were 98,000 extra deaths during the
postwar period
in the 97 percent of Iraq represented by all the clusters except
Falluja,”
the researchers said in the journal.

“This isn’t about individual soldiers doing bad things.  This
appears to be
a problem with the approach to occupation in Iraq,” Roberts said.

The researchers called for further confirmation by an independent
body such
as the International Committee of the Red Cross, or the World
Health
Organization.

The study was funded by the Center for International Emergency
Disaster and
Refugee Studies at Johns Hopkins University and by the Small Arms
Survey in
Geneva, Switzerland, a research project based at the Graduate
Institute of
International Studies in Geneva.

http://www.thelancet.com

==================================
CERJ@igc.org            wilmerding@earthlink.net
——————————————-
John Wilmerding, Convener and List Manager
Coalition for Equity-Restorative Justice (CERJ)
217 High Street, Brattleboro, VT, USA
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often
mistaken for madness”
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ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Niacin and ginger tea
Date: November 4, 2004 at 10:54:13 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry for the poor spelling, but rushing off to airport.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 4, 2004 at 10:51:01 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jim. Many of your facts may be wrong. Benzo withdrawal starts much earlier and depends on the half life of the benzo you are taking. Seizures are peaked at 48-72 hours but can occur at any time. Nor IBO actually increases serotonin and acts like super sticky long acting prozac that won’t go away. I believe they think it may affect serotonin transport protein.

Low dose zyprexa or seroquel is what I am talking about and I did not suggest to give it post IBO. All IBO candidates should be off Benzo’s for at least 7 days prior to taking IBO. Seroquel and zyprexa can help get you off Benzo’s and also should not be taken for at least 7 days prior to IBO ingestion.

It can be started at low dosages 48 hours after IBO if needed but I think drug free is better. Many post IBO people start back on there SSRI after IBO w/ out any problems. Seroquel and Zyprexa are not SSRI at all. They are a completely different class of chemicals.

I am off to Spain for a week to visit friends so I may not be able to follow the group.

Peace to all of you.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Niacin and ginger tea
Date: November 4, 2004 at 10:42:07 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Niacin at low dosages is okay. At high amounts it can cause drug induced hepatitis. It can exacerbate anxiety and make you tjink you are having a heart attack nif you are not orepared for the hot flush that follows shortly after ingestion. Taking Ibuprofen 400 mgs 1/2 hour prior to niacin makes it a little more mellow. Good luck.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Legalize Marijuana
Date: November 4, 2004 at 10:28:25 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I grew up on a small tobacco and dairy farm that once grew hemp. I can’t figure out why they haven’t started a hemp program to replace the tobacco program. You can use it for anything or sell it overseas, the rest of the world still uses the hell out of hemp.   Randy

From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Legalize Marijuana
Date: November 4, 2004 at 8:49:28 AM EST
To: “Summary” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,

USA  prohibited Marijuana by the pressure of cotton producer. Big farm owners pressed to the goverment for prohibiton.  Big Press started making news about Marijuana and crime. Specialy racist, subjectif stories started about black people, crime and Marijuana. And than Canabise prohibited. They did same pressure to the other countries and Marijuana prohibited nearly all around the world.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

From: Fosterwash14@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 4, 2004 at 9:54:45 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi
I’m new to learning about I bogaine, but I read these mindvox emails and I have learned alot about ibogaine. I am curious about what feldencrais is ?

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 4, 2004 at 8:04:45 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The girl who is running the study is I,m sure doing her best. Something that is privately funded by an individual who has alot of other projects, and dreams is a bit uncertain I suppose.  The girl was very good and seems determined to do the best she can, but ….I’ll just thought oh look something I can do, and then despite jumping through the hoops, finding a therapist, saving all my holidays, planning alternate activities I can do instead of looking at the bottom of a bottle every night.  Trying to fill every hole, cross every “T”.  The rules keep changing nothing is certain, the end is not in sight.  I grew up in that situation all those things bring back the despair. Can’t ever be good enough feeling yet again.   But I think that what they are doing is beneficial if they do manage to do a proper study it might help to get Ibogaine more available for more people….that would be a good thing….Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, November 04, 2004 3:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Paula,
Just another thought,  The AA group you went to sound like it can be counterproductive to quitting.  Maybe you should try a different group or redirect  the conversation to their non slip moments if that’s what you need to hear.  We’re all different. It doesn’t mean their story will be your story.  Don’t get hung up on statistics.  The human equation is left out.  Although if you wanted to, statistically speaking the odds are in your favor because in a group of 5 that have all relapsed, they are due for a success story and that would be you!   Also did the study group people cancel on you three times?  I would suggest making them accountable for their actions and holding them up against a wall(Figurativly) and letting them know (in a tactfull way) what this disruption means to you.  Especially when it is so important a plan for you to implement.  You never know what a little assertion will get you and if nothing else you have the facts, or could appeal to someone’s humanity that might get you what you need. At least you’re not harboring feelings of rejection and not being worthy that need to be drowned out by alcohol.   I may be telling one of my stories and not even close to yours, so don’t take offense if that’s the case. While a “study” can mean free or low cost it still doesn’t give someone the right  to reneg like that.
Stay strong, stay focused,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 7:19 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Hi everyone from Vancouver:  I was supposed to have done the ibogaine but due to changes to the structure of the study the date has moved to January now.  I’m becoming uncertain as to wether it will happen or not as this is the third time that something has changed and it seems that my proverbial bad luck keeps on going…so I am in a position of spinning my wheels yet again.  At the beginning I was so hopeful and arranged a counselor, started feldencrais classes, started taking fish oil capsules etc….well do I just go into the hospital and go thru detox there and hope it will hold until January ( if the study ever happens) or do I try to get a supply of the Ibogaine, figure out the guidelines, ensure I have people to monitor me etc.  I am only addicted to alcohol, but have a social anxiety disorder secondary to childhood abuse.  So life has so many triggers that would send me back to drinking to sooth myself.  Ibogaine offers me a chance to get over those past events and move on. I am a nurse so I do understand how to go about it and both of the family members are reliable and have some first aid experience.  My ECG and liver panel are OK, I’m fifty years old and general health is stable. Ibogaine is not illegal in Canada…and I can’t afford to go to another country to get a supervised clinical setting.  I went to a couple of AA meetings as there is a small group (5 people) of women that meet here, last week listening to the stories of repeat detox, repeat lapsed etc. made me feel very desparate thinking “Oh my god, I just want to move on and it sounds like talk therapy, will take forever with me detoxing and lapsing over and over, maybe better to just go back to being a closet alchoholic and give up……any help that can be offered would be appreciated……depressed in Vancouver (Paula)

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 4, 2004 at 7:53:30 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The study is something privately funded, I applied in may and  have been hoping hoping since then first it was august then maybe september, then maybe october, now it is maybe Jan. or maybe not.  Because they are funded by private money.  No money, No study.  By legal I mean you can import it, unlike usa.  I have a social anxiety disorder a large one, I function because I must, I am not doing so well, although I try.  I thought about going to somewhere else Mexico perhaps, I was hoping that there was somewhere nearer in Canada but the only one is the one that seems unable to get off the ground.  I go out to work, and attend a small group for women.  Even just that amount of interaction has me exhausted when I come home.  I can manage groups of up to 5or6 more than that and all the anxiety symptoms go through the roof,   I know that all this stuff is irrational but my emotional brain does not seem to agree, I thought that with the ibgoa I would be able to review the blurs I have from my childhood clearly and make sense of them and therefore the alcohol would be not needed I would be able to move on, I was hoping some of you might have done it on your own.  I’m not suicidal and am quite rational in non social settings.  Talk therapy means my rational mind knows there is a problem and I can discuss it til the day I die, but that doe’nt change the fear reaction that is not affected by rational thought.  First time I have a rough week or something happens I ‘ll be back to the bottle in a flat instance, after all it worked for me for a number of years albeit not well  MY thought here is Ibogaine will help rebalance my brain from the inside out, the outside in stuff therapy etc isn’t working But maybe from both sides out and in I can help heal myself….I’m really tired of being in a state of hyperarousal looking for non existant danger because of abuse in my childhood…..Thanks for responding it helps Paula
—– Original Message —–
From: Jasen Chamoun
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 5:51 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Hello Dear Paula,

What study are you talking about?
As you said “Ibogaine” is LEGAL in Canada,why can’t you do  it in Canada?
If it is due to finances,can you get a loan from the bank or a broker,surely family can help,..no?

I had to go to the bank for a loan,I have my treatment scheduled for the 15th of November.
If I didn’t go to the bank,I don’t think I could have done it(booked in and paid for flights).

When you say,”I am only addicted to alcohol”I think it can be just as tough as opiates,if
not tougher as it is legal,and on every corner,it is also a hard slog.

I hope it all falls into place for you,Alcohol is also a very tough addiction,most of us
understand.As are opiates,Coke,methamphetamines and hey…even sugar.
However,YOU CAN DO IT!

You are much more than you think you are.You are
PAULA.

Sending you a breath of fresh air to inflate the depression.

You are not alone.
Smiles Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 10:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Hi everyone from Vancouver:  I was supposed to have done the ibogaine but due to changes to the structure of the study the date has moved to January now.  I’m becoming uncertain as to wether it will happen or not as this is the third time that something has changed and it seems that my proverbial bad luck keeps on going…so I am in a position of spinning my wheels yet again.  At the beginning I was so hopeful and arranged a counselor, started feldencrais classes, started taking fish oil capsules etc….well do I just go into the hospital and go thru detox there and hope it will hold until January ( if the study ever happens) or do I try to get a supply of the Ibogaine, figure out the guidelines, ensure I have people to monitor me etc.  I am only addicted to alcohol, but have a social anxiety disorder secondary to childhood abuse.  So life has so many triggers that would send me back to drinking to sooth myself.  Ibogaine offers me a chance to get over those past events and move on. I am a nurse so I do understand how to go about it and both of the family members are reliable and have some first aid experience.  My ECG and liver panel are OK, I’m fifty years old and general health is stable. Ibogaine is not illegal in Canada…and I can’t afford to go to another country to get a supervised clinical setting.  I went to a couple of AA meetings as there is a small group (5 people) of women that meet here, last week listening to the stories of repeat detox, repeat lapsed etc. made me feel very desparate thinking “Oh my god, I just want to move on and it sounds like talk therapy, will take forever with me detoxing and lapsing over and over, maybe better to just go back to being a closet alchoholic and give up……any help that can be offered would be appreciated……depressed in Vancouver (Paula)

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 4, 2004 at 6:48:23 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Paula,
Just another thought,  The AA group you went to sound like it can be counterproductive to quitting.  Maybe you should try a different group or redirect  the conversation to their non slip moments if that’s what you need to hear.  We’re all different. It doesn’t mean their story will be your story.  Don’t get hung up on statistics.  The human equation is left out.  Although if you wanted to, statistically speaking the odds are in your favor because in a group of 5 that have all relapsed, they are due for a success story and that would be you!   Also did the study group people cancel on you three times?  I would suggest making them accountable for their actions and holding them up against a wall(Figurativly) and letting them know (in a tactfull way) what this disruption means to you.  Especially when it is so important a plan for you to implement.  You never know what a little assertion will get you and if nothing else you have the facts, or could appeal to someone’s humanity that might get you what you need. At least you’re not harboring feelings of rejection and not being worthy that need to be drowned out by alcohol.   I may be telling one of my stories and not even close to yours, so don’t take offense if that’s the case. While a “study” can mean free or low cost it still doesn’t give someone the right  to reneg like that.
Stay strong, stay focused,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 7:19 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Hi everyone from Vancouver:  I was supposed to have done the ibogaine but due to changes to the structure of the study the date has moved to January now.  I’m becoming uncertain as to wether it will happen or not as this is the third time that something has changed and it seems that my proverbial bad luck keeps on going…so I am in a position of spinning my wheels yet again.  At the beginning I was so hopeful and arranged a counselor, started feldencrais classes, started taking fish oil capsules etc….well do I just go into the hospital and go thru detox there and hope it will hold until January ( if the study ever happens) or do I try to get a supply of the Ibogaine, figure out the guidelines, ensure I have people to monitor me etc.  I am only addicted to alcohol, but have a social anxiety disorder secondary to childhood abuse.  So life has so many triggers that would send me back to drinking to sooth myself.  Ibogaine offers me a chance to get over those past events and move on. I am a nurse so I do understand how to go about it and both of the family members are reliable and have some first aid experience.  My ECG and liver panel are OK, I’m fifty years old and general health is stable. Ibogaine is not illegal in Canada…and I can’t afford to go to another country to get a supervised clinical setting.  I went to a couple of AA meetings as there is a small group (5 people) of women that meet here, last week listening to the stories of repeat detox, repeat lapsed etc. made me feel very desparate thinking “Oh my god, I just want to move on and it sounds like talk therapy, will take forever with me detoxing and lapsing over and over, maybe better to just go back to being a closet alchoholic and give up……any help that can be offered would be appreciated……depressed in Vancouver (Paula)

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 3, 2004 at 11:58:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jim ,Im a psych nurse ,hate to differ but zyprexa & seroquel are both used as antipsychotics & work on dopamine rather than serotonin.SSRI’s build up the available serotonin in the brain to help with anxiety & depression,wish you the best -shell

Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi All,

I have been using benzos for years.  Valium and Restoril.  If one is taking a large amount of Valium and then quite abruptly they may experience seziures.  It takes 10 days before withdrawal from benzos starts – my doc told me this.

As for Zyprexa and and Seroquel.  Zyprexa made me Halucinate, I was to take one pill for a week then move up to two pills a week (37.5 mg).  Before the first week I was halucinateing and talking to people who were not there and using the walls to help me walk.  I believe Zyprexa is an SSRI drug.  Ibo is an SSRI antagonist – IMHO do not mix.

A few months ago a doc gave me Seroquel which is a SSRI antagonist, that didn’t work for me either.  These SSRI drugs can last a long time in the brain.  I would NEVER think of mixing the two drugs with Ibo.  But what do I know, it is just my opinion.  Thought I would pass it on.

Best to everyone,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
Ibogaine may no work for benzo’s,  I never had anyone getting a seizure coming off benzo’s,
I guess no one did research about the working of the other alkaloids of the iboga,I normally give very small doses after which seems to help most of the time.
I agree with you about people being more anxious and dysphoric getting off benzo’s after Ibo.

Van: Schmoolyboy@aol.com [mailto:Schmoolyboy@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 3:12
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos

IBO absolutely does not work for Benzo’s. The Benzo GABA system is different then other drugs and IBO doesn’t seem to get the GABA receptors. There is always a risk of seizures coming off Benzo’s acutely and benzo people seem to be more anxious and very dysphoric after IBO. I have seen this happen a lot.

I suggest doing a slow benzo detox. Be off Benzo’s at least 10 days prior to IBO. Even if the opiates have to be increase to get off the Benzo’s, then so be it.

There are many new psychiatric meds that work well for benzo — post acute withdrawal syndrome (which can last for months and make you think you are going crazy). I.E.; Zyprexa, Seroquel and others. These however cannot be taken before IBO but can be started 24-48 hours after IBO experience is over. They really help, but the dosage and timing of intake of these meds  is crucial.

Typical neuroleptics that will stop a bad LSD trip make IBO patients who are dysphoric after treatment WORSE. If someone id flipping out after IBO, ask them to get honest about the Benzo’s. A small dose of valium will chill them out (at least temporarily) till a better plan can be worked out.

Plane old benedryl seems to allow these people to get at least some sleep and doesn’t interact adversely w/ IBO.

Hope everyone suceeds on their journey for freedom and truth.

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com< blockquote>

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] red counties
Date: November 3, 2004 at 11:49:58 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

where does this data come from?

On Wednesday, November 3, 2004, at 04:41 PM, <CuranderoUSA@hotmail.com> wrote:

<image.tiff>

From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos
Date: November 3, 2004 at 11:20:30 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi All,

I have been using benzos for years.  Valium and Restoril.  If one is taking a large amount of Valium and then quite abruptly they may experience seziures.  It takes 10 days before withdrawal from benzos starts – my doc told me this.

As for Zyprexa and and Seroquel.  Zyprexa made me Halucinate, I was to take one pill for a week then move up to two pills a week (37.5 mg).  Before the first week I was halucinateing and talking to people who were not there and using the walls to help me walk.  I believe Zyprexa is an SSRI drug.  Ibo is an SSRI antagonist – IMHO do not mix.

A few months ago a doc gave me Seroquel which is a SSRI antagonist, that didn’t work for me either.  These SSRI drugs can last a long time in the brain.  I would NEVER think of mixing the two drugs with Ibo.  But what do I know, it is just my opinion.  Thought I would pass it on.

Best to everyone,

– JIM

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
Ibogaine may no work for benzo’s,  I never had anyone getting a seizure coming off benzo’s,
I guess no one did research about the working of the other alkaloids of the iboga,I normally give very small doses after which seems to help most of the time.
I agree with you about people being more anxious and dysphoric getting off benzo’s after Ibo.

Van: Schmoolyboy@aol.com [mailto:Schmoolyboy@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 3:12
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: IBO and Benzos

IBO absolutely does not work for Benzo’s. The Benzo GABA system is different then other drugs and IBO doesn’t seem to get the GABA receptors. There is always a risk of seizures coming off Benzo’s acutely and benzo people seem to be more anxious and very dysphoric after IBO. I have seen this happen a lot.

I suggest doing a slow benzo detox. Be off Benzo’s at least 10 days prior to IBO. Even if the opiates have to be increase to get off the Benzo’s, then so be it.

There are many new psychiatric meds that work well for benzo — post acute withdrawal syndrome (which can last for months and make you think you are going crazy). I.E.; Zyprexa, Seroquel and others. These however cannot be taken before IBO but can be started 24-48 hours after IBO experience is over. They really help, but the dosage and timing of intake of these meds  is crucial.

Typical neuroleptics that will stop a bad LSD trip make IBO patients who are dysphoric after treatment WORSE. If someone id flipping out after IBO, ask them to get honest about the Benzo’s. A small dose of valium will chill them out (at least temporarily) till a better plan can be worked out.

Plane old benedryl seems to allow these people to get at least some sleep and doesn’t interact adversely w/ IBO.

Hope everyone suceeds on their journey for freedom and truth.

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sugar and other drugs
Date: November 3, 2004 at 11:17:18 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On Wednesday, November 3, 2004, at 05:26 PM, Jim Hadey wrote:

Hi Randy,

You know, we have been wondering since the 60’s why in the hell don’t they legalize marijuana.  They could sell a pack of Pall Mall pots for like $20 a pack.  And work it something like this Tax $10, wholesale price to 7-11 or any party store or gas station $5 and they sell to the ultimate consumer for $20 a pack.  Everybody makes money, including the government. Hasn’t happened yet, don’t know why.

Because Cannabis promotes free thought, creativity and individualism. We can’t have that running amok amongst the masses now can we?

Prohibit and Suppress!

Consume and Obey!

Besides that, the PharmCo’s have plenty of other patented meds to take the place of pot. Thats why the majority of Lobbyists who were against marijuana in the 30’s were being paid by the pharmCo and Petro-chemical companies(<all those synthetic fibers were being developed at that time). Read: The Emperor Has No Clothes

As far as the Ibo goes, it seems that if a company can make money selling asprin to weight loss pills they could make money off Ibo.  However, since the government is the one who brings the H into the country like during the Vietnam War, I mean conflict, that may take some time.  In the meantime, people are dying, no big deal, the government doesn’t really care.  If they cared they would not send people into battle without proper equipment or in a Humvee without the proper armor.  Some of them are like a regular car, no protection at all.  Any gun like a .357 handgun to a rifle like 30-30 or .3006 or what ever can go right through the windows or doors.  Hmmm, if I know that how come Bush doesn’t know that?  To make matters worse – 4 more years – maybe less if a nuclear war breaks out.

Unfortunately there is quite a surplus of heroin to be consumed these days now that the Afghani WarLords are back in business thanks to you know who. I’m afraid that seriously undercuts any possibility of Ibogaine becoming available as a treatment (officially).

From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 3, 2004 at 10:51:06 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Sara,

Or top secret information to people like Johnathon Pollard or the Walker spy family.

Sara Glatt <sara119@xs4all.nl> wrote:
Yes, but the enemy always can sell it to the Russians, that are not that stupid. they will pay an American spy to get the knowledge.
Someone like James Bond, or Rambo.
Van: Charliedog43@aol.com [mailto:Charliedog43@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 23:39
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

We sell weapons to our ally’s everyday. 10 years they are your enemy. Got to make sure you have he dominant weapons and the best pilots,trainers, and ways to incompacitate the weapons you sold if need be. And spare parts. Billion dollar weapons ain’t worth squat without the right technology or spare part.

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sugar and other drugs
Date: November 3, 2004 at 10:48:00 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have an idea. We pay 500  bucks for a pot stamp to the gov. and that gives us the right to grow 10 plants at any time. Add up all those 500’s. What the hell is the problem. There are all kinds of things they could do.      Randy

From: Jim Hadey <jimhadey3@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sugar and other drugs
Date: November 3, 2004 at 10:26:22 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy,

You know, we have been wondering since the 60’s why in the hell don’t they legalize marijuana.  They could sell a pack of Pall Mall pots for like $20 a pack.  And work it something like this Tax $10, wholesale price to 7-11 or any party store or gas station $5 and they sell to the ultimate consumer for $20 a pack.  Everybody makes money, including the government. Hasn’t happened yet, don’t know why.

As far as the Ibo goes, it seems that if a company can make money selling asprin to weight loss pills they could make money off Ibo.  However, since the government is the one who brings the H into the country like during the Vietnam War, I mean conflict, that may take some time.  In the meantime, people are dying, no big deal, the government doesn’t really care.  If they cared they would not send people into battle without proper equipment or in a Humvee without the proper armor.  Some of them are like a regular car, no protection at all.  Any gun like a .357 handgun to a rifle like 30-30 or .3006 or what ever can go right through the windows or doors.  Hmmm, if I know that how come Bush doesn’t know that?  To make matters worse – 4 more years – maybe less if a nuclear war breaks out.

Be a rebellious sum bitch, right on.  It was the bebellious sum of a bitches that finally ended the Vietnam War, I mean Vietnam conflict, or police action.

Best to ya,

– JIM

– JIM

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
The answer to this obvious to me. Its the same for Ibogaine. They can’t (they being the government) can’t make any money by doing anything about white sugar or pot or anything else the government isn’t set up to make money on. Wouldn’t be cost effective. So what if we want it. So what if alcohol is 100 times more caustic to the body and society. They gots to have they monies. It SUCKS. I guess I’ll continue being the rebellious sum bitch that I am. I never did what Uncle Salty wanted anyway. Maybe we can spike Bush’s drink with some Ibogaine and give him some perspective.       Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page. www.yahoo.com

From: <CuranderoUSA@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] red counties
Date: November 3, 2004 at 9:41:25 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 3, 2004 at 8:51:43 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Dear Paula,

What study are you talking about?
As you said “Ibogaine” is LEGAL in Canada,why can’t you do  it in Canada?
If it is due to finances,can you get a loan from the bank or a broker,surely family can help,..no?

I had to go to the bank for a loan,I have my treatment scheduled for the 15th of November.
If I didn’t go to the bank,I don’t think I could have done it(booked in and paid for flights).

When you say,”I am only addicted to alcohol”I think it can be just as tough as opiates,if
not tougher as it is legal,and on every corner,it is also a hard slog.

I hope it all falls into place for you,Alcohol is also a very tough addiction,most of us
understand.As are opiates,Coke,methamphetamines and hey…even sugar.
However,YOU CAN DO IT!

You are much more than you think you are.You are
PAULA.

Sending you a breath of fresh air to inflate the depression.

You are not alone.
Smiles Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 10:19 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Hi everyone from Vancouver:  I was supposed to have done the ibogaine but due to changes to the structure of the study the date has moved to January now.  I’m becoming uncertain as to wether it will happen or not as this is the third time that something has changed and it seems that my proverbial bad luck keeps on going…so I am in a position of spinning my wheels yet again.  At the beginning I was so hopeful and arranged a counselor, started feldencrais classes, started taking fish oil capsules etc….well do I just go into the hospital and go thru detox there and hope it will hold until January ( if the study ever happens) or do I try to get a supply of the Ibogaine, figure out the guidelines, ensure I have people to monitor me etc.  I am only addicted to alcohol, but have a social anxiety disorder secondary to childhood abuse.  So life has so many triggers that would send me back to drinking to sooth myself.  Ibogaine offers me a chance to get over those past events and move on. I am a nurse so I do understand how to go about it and both of the family members are reliable and have some first aid experience.  My ECG and liver panel are OK, I’m fifty years old and general health is stable. Ibogaine is not illegal in Canada…and I can’t afford to go to another country to get a supervised clinical setting.  I went to a couple of AA meetings as there is a small group (5 people) of women that meet here, last week listening to the stories of repeat detox, repeat lapsed etc. made me feel very desparate thinking “Oh my god, I just want to move on and it sounds like talk therapy, will take forever with me detoxing and lapsing over and over, maybe better to just go back to being a closet alchoholic and give up……any help that can be offered would be appreciated……depressed in Vancouver (Paula)

From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 3, 2004 at 8:03:27 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“my idea of a good meal was a couple cinnamon rolls, a pint of Hagendaz ice cream and several twix bars…”

Are you saying there’s something wrong with my diet?  That’s basically my diet though you left out cornflakes (I prefer Frosties but can kid myself Cornflakes are healthier…even though I coat them in sugar anyway!)

Hannah x
—– Original Message —–
From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 7:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy

first of all, congratulations. seven days is awesome.

when i came off of methadone in 98 I experienced the same symptoms which made me uncomfortable, but they were entirely tolerable when i weighed them against what I’d be feeling from a cold-turkey kick.

some things that worked for me:

~get exercise in the early morning daylight, even a 15 minute walk helps.
~eat balanced, healthy meals (avoid greasy/fatty foods)
~drink LOTS of water (take your body weight, divide it in half and drink that many ounces in a day, minimum)
~take long hot bath/showers as much as you can/like
~have sex and/or masturbate. a quick way to generate endorphins.
~if you can’t sleep, pretend to. even lying still for several hours will help restore you.
~watch movies, read books… distraction helps tremendously.
~do something kind for someone else, anonymously if possible.
~cut yourself some slack and love yourself.

there are a lot of good suggestions in the “getting clean” section of http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/

How long will the symptoms last? that varies from person to person. That may depend on how long, how much and what sort of opiates you were using.

I thought I felt pretty good at 2 weeks out, then when i was 4 weeks out i felt even better, etc. This went on until 9 months later I really truly felt 100%. Then again That was at the end of a pretty hellacious 10 year run, the last 4 a slightly turbulent but mostly tame methadone maintenence @80mgs, but my health was pretty shot, my teeth were crumbling, I weighed 145lbs, I had the pallor of a cement block and my idea of a good meal was a couple cinnamon rolls, a pint of Hagendaz ice cream and several twix bars…

_.dh

On Tuesday, November 2, 2004, at 08:52 AM, m.finman wrote:

Hi group,

Today is day 7 post-opiates, and I’m still not feeling
100%. The symptoms seem to get worse at nighttime-
much worse; however, the days are almost bearable.

It’s been four years since I’ve been clean, and I’m
wondering how much longer I am going to have to endure
these symptoms: insomnia, hot/cold tingles, extreme
lethargy and weakness, and grumpiness/depression.

Randy, how are you feeling now? How many days/weeks
has it been since you were treated? Do you have any
secrets to share with me?

Cheers,
Julie

-Dave Hunter
Web & Print Design
808.823.1342
dave@zoltron.com

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [Ibogaine] new from google news alerts
Date: November 3, 2004 at 6:59:31 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

All Press Releases for November 3, 2004

 

A Drug Rehab and Alcohol Rehab Addiction Treatment Story

 

This is the story of a young man, who hit rock bottom by being involved in the drug scene and gradually, with the help of his family and a drug rehab and treatment program was able to recover and live a normal and full life. More information can be found at http://www.drugrehabcenter.com and http://www.helpaddicts.com

(PRWEB) November 3, 2004 — This is the story of a young man, who hit rock bottom by being involved in the drug scene and gradually, with the help of his family and a drug rehab and treatment program was able to recover and live a normal and full life. More information can be found at http://www.drugrehabcenter.com and http://www.helpaddicts.com

“You have one of two choices you either take 10% of your savings account and go take that last hit you need to kill yourself or you go into a drug treatment program because we don’t want to worry about you anymore.” Said my father with a somber face surrounded by my mother and siblings.

“What about the rest of my money?” I asked.

“Well, we’ll use that for your funeral, because if you continue this way, that’s what is going to happen.” He replied.

Hmmm, who woulda thought that paper Mache could possibly get me here? I know this is out of context, so let me start from the beginningŠ..

Spinning, spinning, spinning, vomit, drop. I did it again; I was the last man standing on the school yard- just as it should be. Let me explain. I was around 4 and a few of us in art class had discovered that if we got real close to the paper Mache piñatas we were making and inhaled very deeply, we got the most amazing light headed feeling we’d ever felt. This feeling was enhanced by spinning around, usually in snow angel form, to keep balance. Now why did I vomit? Because I was the toughest guy in the group, while the others had decided to cop out, I kept turning until I couldn’t take it anymore. It’s crazy when I think about it- it’s very possible that paper Mache spurred my descent down the wrong street, well in addition to a few other factors.

My older sister was pretty near genius status and try though I may, I was never up to par with her intelligence wise, or so I thought. I mean, I always felt kinda intimidated by all the smart kids aroundŠso I guess that’s why I had to be class clown, the funny guy, that way people would like me. I found another way to get approval around the age of 16, when my tall awkward frame made it possible for me to help my new “friends”. See, I started going into town on the weekends with some friend’s I’d made. The cool thing of course, was to drink and being that I was so much taller than everyone else, I was able to convince people to actually sell me alcohol. That stuff was great! I felt totally free to do and say whatever I wanted. Things got even better when my new friends introduced me to a nice girl called Mary Jane.

My introduction to marijuana totally blew all those rumors I’d been told about how bad drugs were. I mean the commercials on TV showed people who hadn’t showered for a week living in these run down housesŠ.in real life drugs weren’t like that all! In fact, I thought the whole thing was rather sophisticated. So, in an effort to show how wrong these adults and educators were who had been lying to me all these years, I made it my duty, to try every possible drug there was. THAT would show them- lying to us kids and keeping all the good stuff to themselves- what nerve!

Some of the friends that I made got into a bind and I, being the good person that I am, decided to come to the rescue. So, I started doing my best to supply them with whatever drugs they needed and wanted. I wasn’t a drug dealer; I was just helping out some buddies. They loved me for it and so did the ladies. They thought I was the coolest guy and gave me tons of attention- it was great. The best part about this whole deal was I knew I wasn’t addicted; in fact, I was starting to believe there was no such thing as addiction. After all, heroin made me feel great. Truth was heroin was really a good substance- it made me feel more like myself than anything else. I even noticed it took away that pinching sensation in my shoulders that came every time I went a few days without taking a hit. Things were going great- I had tons of friends, a job, and I was in school. Then the drought hitŠ.

“Are you s-s-s-sur-r-re you can-n-‘t get mee any?” I asked my usual heroin dealer. Apparently not. I suddenly couldn’t get any heroin from any of my suppliers and it was starting to affect me. I was shaking, I couldn’t sleep and finally, I woke up in my own vomitŠit was reminiscent of my schoolyard days. It was the first time I had gone into withdrawal and I didn’t even know it was happening. I had lost my job because I missed so much work and I was moving back into my parent’s house. I was able to stop using cold turkey and I was fine. Well, at least for the first few months. In fact, over the 4 year period I tried to stop using in this manner, I relapsed 13 times. I had developed a pattern- just when my friends and family stopped worrying about me, just when they thought they could breathe easy, I would get what money I could and disappear for a few days and show up again having totally destroyed whatever progress I had made. It was fine with me if things continued this way forever, even after 2 of my friends died from overdoses; I saw no reason to stop.

That’s around the time that my father, fully backed by the rest of my family, gave me the little speech you read in the beginning. I think I picked addiction treatment, not even because I was so concerned with my own life, but because of where my father told me I would be going for treatment. First, I was off to the island of St. Kitts where I was going to receive Ibogaine treatment and the second half of my treatment would be on the sunny beaches of South Florida. I was getting a vacation out of this thing!!! How much better could it get?

I ended up at this treatment center called the Holistic Addiction Treatment Center. This wasn’t exactly a vacation, but it turned my life around. I absolutely loved the program. I got back into karate, regularly visited a spa and really enjoyed group therapyŠthey were using this procedure they called transformational therapy and it worked great. I worked through a lot of the issues I had with my family and grieved for the friends that had passed away. Now, a year later I’m doing great and happy living a normal life, with normal dilemma’sŠfor instance, Chinese or Indian food for dinner?

For more information call 800-559-9503 anytime day or night or click on any of the following links.
Drug Rehab and Alcohol Rehab
Alcoholism Recovery and Treatment
Drug Rehabilitation
Drug Rehabiliation and Addiction Treatment
Alcoholism Treatment and Drug Detoxification

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Niacin and ginger tea
Date: November 3, 2004 at 4:45:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Julia:

You might find 300 mg or 400 mg of niacin equal in beneficial effect and
somewhat less intense than the 500 mg you have taken.  As to the intensity of the
experience…you bet.

Howard

In a message dated 11/3/04 3:33:06 PM, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:

I think I may have found a remedy for the cold
tingles- Niacin.  I just took 500ml about 30 minutes
ago, and my body is suffused with warmth, and my skin
looks flushed and healthy; however, it is a little
itchy also.

Niacin is a vasodilator, that not only increases blood
flow, but also lowers cholesterol rate.  I would
highly recommend it to anyone in the post-acute
withdrawal phase(post-five/seven days); I myself have
spent the last week chilled to the bone, but Niacin
seems to have remedied my situation…I can’t believe
how powerful the Niacin rush is!

Sara, the ginger tea recommendation was fab!  It’s
doing wonders for my stomach and my constitution.
Thank you very much!

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Niacin and ginger tea
Date: November 3, 2004 at 3:31:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear list,

I think I may have found a remedy for the cold
tingles- Niacin.  I just took 500ml about 30 minutes
ago, and my body is suffused with warmth, and my skin
looks flushed and healthy; however, it is a little
itchy also.

Niacin is a vasodilator, that not only increases blood
flow, but also lowers cholesterol rate.  I would
highly recommend it to anyone in the post-acute
withdrawal phase(post-five/seven days); I myself have
spent the last week chilled to the bone, but Niacin
seems to have remedied my situation…I can’t believe
how powerful the Niacin rush is!

Sara, the ginger tea recommendation was fab!  It’s
doing wonders for my stomach and my constitution.
Thank you very much!

cheers,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sugar and other drugs
Date: November 3, 2004 at 12:41:30 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The answer to this obvious to me. Its the same for Ibogaine. They can’t (they being the government) can’t make any money by doing anything about white sugar or pot or anything else the government isn’t set up to make money on. Wouldn’t be cost effective. So what if we want it. So what if alcohol is 100 times more caustic to the body and society. They gots to have they monies. It SUCKS. I guess I’ll continue being the rebellious sum bitch that I am. I never did what Uncle Salty wanted anyway. Maybe we can spike Bush’s drink with some Ibogaine and give him some perspective.       Randy

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 3, 2004 at 12:38:57 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Paula,
Sounds like you have a couple of prospects going for you there.  You’re way ahead of some that have no prospects and no hope.  I sense hope.  Don’t let other peoples misgivings let you into that downward spiral.  The fact that you have family and have set up things to do to be supportive of the process is hugh.  I believe those that do better are doing more than detoxing.  Look to your strengths and don’t give your FEARS LIFE BY DWELLING ON THEM. Personally I was doing “work ” on myself for the last 14 years.  I see the ibogaine as the icing on the cake. But I came with the cake.  You have substance, strength, skills.  Look at all the skills it takes to be a functional addict.  One success story I read was a book by James Frey (i believe)”One Million Little Pieces”  It’s his detox and recovery story without ibogaine.  One of his substances was alcohol, so it may have an impact for you in that regard.   It’s a quick read.  Make your decision without a fear and anxt. based mentality and don’t put too much into other peoples opinions, if it conflicts with what your gut tells you.  You may wind up doing both or one. They both acturally sound like good plans. Just go in with no expectations only good intentions.   You are guilty of nothing and need forgiving for nothing.  Follow your heart and carry on as you know you can. I wish for you onlly good luck( which is more easily manifested by not acknowledging or owning bad luck), calm and the ability to have a deeper understanding of your true sense of self. rather than what your circumstances have constructed for you.
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Paula
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 7:19 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own

Hi everyone from Vancouver:  I was supposed to have done the ibogaine but due to changes to the structure of the study the date has moved to January now.  I’m becoming uncertain as to wether it will happen or not as this is the third time that something has changed and it seems that my proverbial bad luck keeps on going…so I am in a position of spinning my wheels yet again.  At the beginning I was so hopeful and arranged a counselor, started feldencrais classes, started taking fish oil capsules etc….well do I just go into the hospital and go thru detox there and hope it will hold until January ( if the study ever happens) or do I try to get a supply of the Ibogaine, figure out the guidelines, ensure I have people to monitor me etc.  I am only addicted to alcohol, but have a social anxiety disorder secondary to childhood abuse.  So life has so many triggers that would send me back to drinking to sooth myself.  Ibogaine offers me a chance to get over those past events and move on. I am a nurse so I do understand how to go about it and both of the family members are reliable and have some first aid experience.  My ECG and liver panel are OK, I’m fifty years old and general health is stable. Ibogaine is not illegal in Canada…and I can’t afford to go to another country to get a supervised clinical setting.  I went to a couple of AA meetings as there is a small group (5 people) of women that meet here, last week listening to the stories of repeat detox, repeat lapsed etc. made me feel very desparate thinking “Oh my god, I just want to move on and it sounds like talk therapy, will take forever with me detoxing and lapsing over and over, maybe better to just go back to being a closet alchoholic and give up……any help that can be offered would be appreciated……depressed in Vancouver (Paula)

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Nixon also won; but
Date: November 3, 2004 at 12:23:24 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you. I too had this in mind last night, voicing this thought to V and to others too while dj’ing at an election party last night.
Nixon was elected in a landslide, despite the growing anti-war movement in this country- “growing?” What am I talking about- the already huge anti-war movement in this country.
We unfortunately I am constantly reminded, living in a facistic, white-bread, straight, protestant/fundementalist, fearmongering warpig ruled society, and while here in LES Manhattan things seem kinda ok, what with cool people and being able to be myself, I imagine things must be much different outside NYC, as Bush was reelected despite all the bullshit lies and murdering he’s been doing, not to mention all that profiteering off all that murder.
Even though Nixon was reelected, we did manage to muddle through, (and hell, Nixon got the boot half way through his second term, so we can hope, right?- although the Republicans picked up yet more seats in Congress, which means Bush will have even less trouble getting his crap passed.
Sigh, what a depressing notion, that this many of my fellow citizens think Bush is hunky dory for us and the world.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 11:18 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Nixon also won; but

This reminds me of when Nixon ran against (i think) Mcgovern.   I was in Berkley,Calif. at the time and at this same time of the a.m the day after election day there was this same somberness I feel from this website.  It’s like a form of death.  Grief.  However look how things turned out for Nixon.
Just a thought,
There’s always hope,
Martee

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Nixon also won; but
Date: November 3, 2004 at 11:18:46 AM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This reminds me of when Nixon ran against (i think) Mcgovern.   I was in Berkley,Calif. at the time and at this same time of the a.m the day after election day there was this same somberness I feel from this website.  It’s like a form of death.  Grief.  However look how things turned out for Nixon.
Just a thought,
There’s always hope,
Martee

From: Paula <paulab@shaw.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] need input: trying it on my own
Date: November 3, 2004 at 7:19:27 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi everyone from Vancouver:  I was supposed to have done the ibogaine but due to changes to the structure of the study the date has moved to January now.  I’m becoming uncertain as to wether it will happen or not as this is the third time that something has changed and it seems that my proverbial bad luck keeps on going…so I am in a position of spinning my wheels yet again.  At the beginning I was so hopeful and arranged a counselor, started feldencrais classes, started taking fish oil capsules etc….well do I just go into the hospital and go thru detox there and hope it will hold until January ( if the study ever happens) or do I try to get a supply of the Ibogaine, figure out the guidelines, ensure I have people to monitor me etc.  I am only addicted to alcohol, but have a social anxiety disorder secondary to childhood abuse.  So life has so many triggers that would send me back to drinking to sooth myself.  Ibogaine offers me a chance to get over those past events and move on. I am a nurse so I do understand how to go about it and both of the family members are reliable and have some first aid experience.  My ECG and liver panel are OK, I’m fifty years old and general health is stable. Ibogaine is not illegal in Canada…and I can’t afford to go to another country to get a supervised clinical setting.  I went to a couple of AA meetings as there is a small group (5 people) of women that meet here, last week listening to the stories of repeat detox, repeat lapsed etc. made me feel very desparate thinking “Oh my god, I just want to move on and it sounds like talk therapy, will take forever with me detoxing and lapsing over and over, maybe better to just go back to being a closet alchoholic and give up……any help that can be offered would be appreciated……depressed in Vancouver (Paula)

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Thanks Preston
Date: November 2, 2004 at 10:52:41 PM EST
To: ibo <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston,
Thank you for acknowledging this info which so many people shrug off as no big deal (take note Marc, my love). Lick the Sugar Habit is an extremely informative book. I have noticed over the years in myself and many others that sugar is as addictive as heroin if not more so.  There are so many correlations between the two in the brain and the body that leaves no doubt for me.  One is that if all sugars are stopped for 3-4 days the cravings go away.  That includes artificial replacements that trigger same brain activity and promote cravings. The madness that makes one run to the store at midnight for Hagen Das is gone. It brings this uncanny sense of peace when you realize you have control. What most people mistake as lack of willpower when it comes to sugar and refined carbs,is really something going on in the brain as well as the insulin cycle that happens which makes you crash and crave as well.  Sure you need to get proper protein and fats (no insulin response) as well as healthy carbs at the same time.
The food co’s know that sugar and the chemicals they put in food is addictive.  Just as the tobacco co’s always knew nicotine was addictive.  No nutrients plus sugar and chemicals breaking down the immune function leads to diease and a whole lot of folks getting pharaceuticals from their drs. who are romanced by the drug co’s. (yes I know there are exceptions). These chemicals (drugs can furthur tear down immune function (side effects).  And so it goes and so it goes.
Nothing matastacizes cancer quicker than sugar.  Which my observation starts with overgrowth of yeast and fungus(systemic), also sugar related.
As much as it sounds like my thing is health and nutrition it really is about people being empowered and not kept or turned out as victims.
Yes Julie, listen to your body, trust your intuition and learn and perceive what you can.  Use that same intuition in knowing who to trustwhen you go for help.
Take what you like and leave the rest.  No ones right about everything.  And no one will know you and your body as you can.  Self-reliance is a rush.
DHL,excellent advice.  It all goes hand in hand.
Martee

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 10:22:21 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

WOW.This info’ is AMAZING.Thankyou.

“The minerals needed to digest sugar-chromium, manganese, cobalt, copper, zinc, and magnesium-have been stripped away in the refining process,” explains nutrition counselor Nancy Appleton, author of Lick the Sugar Habit. “The body has to deplete its own mineral reserves to use the refined sugar.”[ii]

Your body’s troubles are only beginning at that point.

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From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat
Date: November 2, 2004 at 10:07:47 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks mate,
I accept it.
Kick backs are automatic in this game aren’t they?
You have the right to rant, as you, voted.

I can’t believe that I once posted,”who is Kerry”.

Here in Australia,we HAVE to vote,it is compulsory,
if we don’t we get fined.

All in all,we both live in some of the best countries you
can live in.
With Smiles.Jasen.

It’s yours Jasen,
But you gotta pay me kickbacks you understand, and let me plant a peacecorp there.
So, I admit it, as nasty as it felt to do, I voted for Kerry.
Hopefully, that one vote will make the difference and put him in the White House instead of Bush, so we can then rail and rant about a Democrat not giving me exactly what I want all the time.
Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 9:56:44 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, Howard nailed it as usual. I forgot to mention that he said the same thing to me and he was right. I got to looking at post Ibogains symptoms and a lot of them could look like withdrawal. I couldn’t drink coffee or eat sugar till about a week ago. I still don’t react to sugar very well. Martee helped me a lot too. A lot. Keep posting and stay with us.   Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 9:43:28 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

O yea, I felt much better in a day less than 2 weeks and I had the same withdrawals as you.     Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 9:38:42 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, you probably don’t want to hear this but the secret is my withdrawals were mostly in my head. I would try and stay as busy as I could when you are awake. I had a few benzo’s the first week but I really didn’t need them until well into the second week. Can you get a 3mg. per kg. booster? You are in Canada right? Say what you feel on the list. You did see what a baby I was about it didn’t you. The people here pulled me through. I was frantic ready to get Subutex on a Tues., and in NYC 2 days later having a great time. The difference was my perspective. A friend of mine lost her father and Marc pretty much spanked me online and I did what Ibogaine has given me and I changed my own mind about it. I know it’s hard and some of the withdrawals are very real but think about how bad it is without the Ibogaine. At this point we are the lucky ones, we got Ibo when we needed it. Hang in there. I’m in Erie PA now and a lot is going on so I haven’t posted as much but I will try everyday to see my mail and answer when it’s right. I have thought about how you were doing every day since I left NY. I was ready to do a whole Journey again but it all went away except for the non sleep issue. Have you read “For Whom The Bell Tolls? Hemingway got me through a detox one time without Ibogaine. Anything GOOD that will draw you in and keep you reading should help. Go out and find “Women” or “Ham On Rye by Charles Bukowski just ignore the drinking and carousing and appreciate how good the guy can write. If I can think of anything else that helped me I will put it out for you, but I have to go I’m going out to play some music tonight. I wish I had some magic for you but I don’t. I just know that it is way better with Ibogaine than without. I’ve done it both ways. Use your intelligence and stay tuff.   Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 8:27:17 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

About sugar, from Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs, come the following excerpts from Mickey Z’s article Sugar, How Sweet it Ain’t- if you find any typos, ignore them please, this is an old piece and they probably got fixed (and if not they’re going to in the second printing darn it.):
—–
snip-

When observing the tenacity with which America’s law enforcement agencies pursue those who allegedly partake in illegal drugs, one might wonder why so little attention is paid to more pervasive and often more dangerous “drugs” like alcohol, pharmaceuticals, food additives, television, computers, etc. For example, with all the focus on cocaine and its derivatives (i.e. crack), what about the most insidious white powder of all, sugar?

The United States Department of Agriculture reports that the average American consumes over 130 pounds of sugar (and sweeteners) each year. For those of you scoring at home, that’s 10 pounds a month, more than 4 cups a week, and over 30 teaspoonfuls per day[i] of a substance the body would rather not ingest.

“The minerals needed to digest sugar-chromium, manganese, cobalt, copper, zinc, and magnesium-have been stripped away in the refining process,” explains nutrition counselor Nancy Appleton, author of Lick the Sugar Habit. “The body has to deplete its own mineral reserves to use the refined sugar.”[ii]

Your body’s troubles are only beginning at that point.

“The average person loses more than 90% of their immune function within 15 minutes of indulging in this poisonous substance,” says Walt Stoll, M.D., a physician with a background in orthodox and complementary medicine. “This deficiency lasts for about two hours after the stress occurs.”[iii]

It also leaves you wanting more…a lot more.

“Sugar evokes a brain chemical called beta endorphin, the same chemical affected by morphine and heroin,” explains Kathleen DesMaisons Ph.D., author of The Sugar Addict’s Total Recovery Program. “The sugar creates a wonderful feeling of euphoria and well-being, but when it wears off, you feel edgy, irritable and cranky-this is actual withdrawal. If you use the drug [sugar] again, it relieves the symptoms, so you get caught in a cycle of needing it.”[iv]

[i] Nancy Appleton. Lick the Sugar Habit (Avery Publishing Group, 1988), p.
7; Conversely, the Sugar Association says: “Americans consume less sugar
than reported. Of the total amount that is in the food supply, less than half is actually eaten” (www.sugar.org). But this is more semantics than science, as demonstrated by this Sugar Association statement: “There is virtually no sugar in soft drinks. Soft drinks and other fruit drinks are sweetened with high fructose corn syrup.”

[ii] Appleton, Lick the Sugar Habit, p. 9.

[iii] http://askwaltstollmd.com

[iv] http://www.bupa.co.uk/health_information

snip-

“Sugar is grown from the earth and nourished by the sun, soil and American family farmers who love the land and have tended crops for generations,” notes the Sugar Association website.[i] “And, sugar is the same carbohydrate that is part of an apple, pear, a potato, or rice. While your taste buds and eyes may know the difference, your body does not and handles table sugar the same way it does the sucrose contained in any fruit or vegetable.”

“Sugar dysfunction is the primary threat to human health today,” says Majid Ali, M.D..[ii]
“The best way to preserve the integrity of carbohydrate metabolism is to protect it from large and sudden sugar overloads.”

“To utilize refined carbohydrates, the body must rob healthy cells of nutrients they need to survive,” explains health and nutrition journalist, Gary Null. “Indeed, the body leeches precious vitamins and minerals from itself in the process of digesting sugar, inducing a crisis state.”[iii]

The most important gland of the human immune system may be the thymus which, among many other things, is responsible for the production of T lymphocytes, a vital breed of white blood cell needed for cell-mediated immunity. Naturopathic doctors, Michael Murray and Joseph Pizzorno define cell-mediated immunity as “immune mechanisms not controlled or mediated by antibodies.” The ingestion of just 75 grams of glucose has been shown to depress lymphocyte activity.[iv]

Also playing a crucial role in the immune system are neutrophils: white blood cells that phagocytise (engulf and destroy) bacteria, tumor cells, and dead particulate matter. This delicate dance of self-defense can be severely compromised by the introduction of sugar. According to Murray and Pizzorno, the ingestion of 100 grams of sugar “significantly reduced the ability of neutrophils to engulf and destroy bacteria…these effects started less than 30 minutes after ingestion and lasted for over five hours. Typically there was at least a 50% reduction in neutrophil activity two hours after ingestion.”[v] Since neutrophils make up 60-70% of the total circulating white blood cells, impairment of their activity can lead to a severely compromised immune system and, eventually, chronic immune deficiency.

The deleterious effect of sugar consumption upon our immune system also manifests itself in the presence of excess glucose in the bloodstream. Vitamin C and glucose compete for the same membrane transport sites into the white blood cells…and vitamin C and glucose have opposite effects on the body’s immunity. Once the consumption of sugar has served to weaken our immune system, a wide variety of sugar-related illnesses can take advantage, e.g. diabetes, tooth decay, hypoglycemia, food allergies, cancer, heart
disease, obesity, gastrointestinal disorders, and mycotoxicosis. While each is worthy of a book-length study, let’s examine a few of these often life-threatening disorders.

[i] http://www.sugar.org

[ii] http://www.majidali.com

[iii] Gary Null. The 90s Healthy Body Book: How to overcome the effects of
pollution and cleanse toxins from your body (Health Communications, Inc.,
1994), p. 74.

[iv] Michael Murray and Joseph Pizzorno. Encyclopedia of Natural Medicine
(Prima Publishing, 1991), p. 63.

[v] Murray and Pizzorno, Encyclopedia of Natural Medicine, p. 63.

snip-

Since animal-based research is hardly reliable[i], the study’s conclusion must be taken with a grain of, uh, sugar: “Repeated, excessive intake of sugar created a state in which an opioid antagonist caused behavioral and neurochemical signs of opioid withdrawal. The indices of anxiety and DA/ACh imbalance were qualitatively similar to withdrawal from morphine or nicotine, suggesting that the rats had become sugar-dependent.”[ii]

Physicians operating on a more holistic plane have long understood the addictive powers of sugar and are not waiting around for the results of faulty and immoral animal tests to speak out. Majid Ali, M.D., is one such health professional. “Sudden rises in blood sugar evoke sudden insulin responses,” he says. “Bursts of insulin drive the blood sugar down to hypoglycemic levels and trigger the release of adrenaline and related chemicals. This causes apprehension, light-headedness, mood swings, heart palpitations, and other signals that call out the body’s need for more quick energy. The person reaches for more sugary snacks and repeats the whole cycle of the molecular roller coaster.”[iii]

[BLOCK QUOTE] “In one of the most despicable marketing gambits, Pepsi, Dr. Pepper, and Seven-Up encourage feeding soft drinks to babies by licensing their logos to a major maker of baby bottles, Munchkin Bottling, Inc.”-Michael Jacobson, the author of Liquid Candy, a 1999 study by the Center for Science in the Public Interest[iv] [END BLOCK QUOTE]

Whether or not you choose to label your sugar craving an addiction or a “molecular roller coaster” matters little to the hacks being paid to market it. One of the major sugar pushers is the beverage industry. A January 1999 trade magazine article stated baldly: “Influencing elementary school students is very important to soft drink marketers because children are still establishing their tastes and habits.”[v]

[i] http://www.animalresearch.org

[ii] More specifically, this is what the study found: “Naloxone (20 mg/kg
intraperitoneally) caused somatic signs, such as teeth chattering, forepaw
tremor, and head shakes. Food deprivation for 24 hours caused spontaneous
withdrawal signs, such as teeth chattering. Naloxone (3 mg/kg
subcutaneously) caused reduced time on the exposed arm of an elevated plus
maze, where again significant teeth chattering was recorded. The plus maze
anxiety effect was replicated with four control groups for comparison.
Accumbens microdialysis revealed that naloxone (10 and 20 mg/kg
intraperitoneally) decreased extracellular dopamine (DA), while
dose-dependently increasing acetylcholine (ACh). The naloxone-induced DA/ACh
imbalance was replicated with 10% sucrose and 3 mg/kg naloxone
subcutaneously.”

[iii] http://www.majidali.com/obesity.htm
[iv] Eric Schlosser. Fast Food Nation; The Dark Side of the All-American
Meal, (Houghton Mifflin Company, 2001), p.54.

[v] Schlosser, Fast Food Nation, p. 54.


SIDEBAR:

[SUBHEAD] I’m So Excited

For those of you smirking as you reach for that NutraSweet, you should know that artificial sweeteners aren’t much better than the sugar they’re replacing. Designed to reduce sugar intake, what these substances actually do is trick the brain into thinking a large amount of energy (sugar) is on the way. Thus, the brain instructs the liver to not produce glucose for a while and go into “storage mode.” Within a half-hour, when the expected energy (sugar) hasn’t arrived, the brain and liver panic and demand food. This, of course, results in overeating and obesity and explains why you see so many overweight people drinking diet sodas.

Besides the irony of promoting obesity, there are many health-related concerns about artificial sweeteners. For example, aspartame, found in more than 9,000 products, has been suspected in a wide range of medical problems-from migraines to joint pain to mood swings and behavioral issues in children. Neurosurgeon Russell L. Blaylock labels aspartame an “excitotoxin” because studies indicate it “can literally excite brain cells
to death.”[i]

[i] http://www.additivesout.org.uk/

snip-

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 7:18 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy

You are so right about the sugar,it affects me the same way.
—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 4:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy

Hi Julie,
I went through similar stuff for about 2 weeks after.  However once I figured out the chills and all only lasted briefly I relaxed .  I did notice however that anytime I attempted anything chemical (valium) for sleep my symptoms got worse.  I also noticed i felt worse when consuming sugar(way worse, don’t mock me people). From your post post ibogaine you mentioned a whole list of drugs that were perscriped for every possible symptom.  I believe if i was taking that stuff it would make my symptoms worse.  I did some homeopathics for sleep on occassion. Although I noticed nothing worked more than 2 times in a row.  My waking time was mostly functional once I calmed down, and ate my vegetables and fruits like a good girl.   At a month I was able to go back to work. The sometime and not bad withdrawls lasted about 10 days with sneezes lasting a month. I thought I took longer than most because of my age 51, and years of nonstop addiction 22.
I also noticed not just my opiate receptors were brand new but so was my whole body.  I was now sensitive and could not tolerate caffeine, which I drank 4 mega strong containers daily prior to treatment.  Tea also.  My body did not even want a lot of the healthy supplements I used to take. All I took was a probiotic and my greens.  They are both immune boosting. Healing is about supporting your immune system (good healthy food) and not tearing it down(sugar and chemicals).   There are some days I FEEL SO GOOD I CAN’T STAND IT.
Don’t mean to ramble, hope this helps.
If ever there was a good fight, this is it. Be strong
Martee

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat
Date: November 2, 2004 at 8:12:21 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’s yours Jasen,
But you gotta pay me kickbacks you understand, and let me plant a peacecorp there.
So, I admit it, as nasty as it felt to do, I voted for Kerry.
Hopefully, that one vote will make the difference and put him in the White House instead of Bush, so we can then rail and rant about a Democrat not giving me exactly what I want all the time.
Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 7:07 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat

Ok, I want Kuwait
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 11:39 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat

I’ve decided I want to be President.
Write me in and I’ll give you lots of stuff when I win.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet
(Preston For President! He’ll Give you Stuff!)

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Charliedog43@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 5:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

I’m done with the politics.  I can talk that anywhere. Just vote. I don’t give a rat’s ass for whom. Just do the American thing and vote. Hell, i voted for a democratic governor last race. I’m not stuck on any party, although i’m a registered Republican. They are all not the same. Same as all Democrats aren’t either. Neither candidate can give you every thing you want. But I will say, Republican or Democrat, most are overpaid, spoiled crooks, who want power. And will say anything or do anything to get it. Greed and power. Always been that way, always will be. But we get to elect the greediest, most powerful bastard, anyway. Well, kind of.

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From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 7:18:33 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You are so right about the sugar,it affects me the same way.
—– Original Message —– From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, November 03, 2004 4:52 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy

Hi Julie,
I went through similar stuff for about 2 weeks after.  However once I figured out the chills and all only lasted briefly I relaxed .  I did notice however that anytime I attempted anything chemical (valium) for sleep my symptoms got worse.  I also noticed i felt worse when consuming sugar(way worse, don’t mock me people). From your post post ibogaine you mentioned a whole list of drugs that were perscriped for every possible symptom.  I believe if i was taking that stuff it would make my symptoms worse.  I did some homeopathics for sleep on occassion.  Although I noticed nothing worked more than 2 times in a row.  My waking time was mostly functional once I calmed down, and ate my vegetables and fruits like a good girl.   At a month I was able to go back to work. The sometime and not bad withdrawls lasted about 10 days with sneezes lasting a month. I thought I took longer than most because of my age 51, and years of nonstop addiction 22.
I also noticed not just my opiate receptors were brand new but so was my whole body.  I was now sensitive and could not tolerate caffeine, which I drank 4 mega strong containers daily prior to treatment.  Tea also.  My body did not even want a lot of the healthy supplements I used to take. All I took was a probiotic and my greens.  They are both immune boosting. Healing is about supporting your immune system (good healthy food) and not tearing it down(sugar and chemicals).   There are some days I FEEL SO GOOD I CAN’T STAND IT.
Don’t mean to ramble, hope this helps.
If ever there was a good fight, this is it. Be strong
Martee

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From: “Jasen Chamoun” <JasenHappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat
Date: November 2, 2004 at 7:07:01 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ok, I want Kuwait
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 11:39 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat

I’ve decided I want to be President.
Write me in and I’ll give you lots of stuff when I win.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet
(Preston For President! He’ll Give you Stuff!)

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Charliedog43@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 5:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

I’m done with the politics.  I can talk that anywhere. Just vote. I don’t give a rat’s ass for whom. Just do the American thing and vote. Hell, i voted for a democratic governor last race. I’m not stuck on any party, although i’m a registered Republican. They are all not the same. Same as all Democrats aren’t either. Neither candidate can give you every thing you want. But I will say, Republican or Democrat, most are overpaid, spoiled crooks, who want power. And will say anything or do anything to get it. Greed and power. Always been that way, always will be. But we get to elect the greediest, most powerful bastard, anyway. Well, kind of.

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 3:36:38 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the kind words, Dave et al….You have
helped to brighten an otherwise dismal, cloudy day.

Does Niacin help with the lethargy?  I know it’s a
vasodilator, so I’m assuming I could possibly ?? get
more oxygen into my system this way.  I have been
dreaming of wearing an oxygen mask, as I keep on
yawning uncontrollably.

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Get Up off Your Ass and VOTE (for SOMEBODY)
Date: November 2, 2004 at 3:25:04 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So I just voted for the 3rd time in my life. can’t say politrix did much for me when i wuz strung to the bone.

no harrassment at the polling place, altho i did see several local notorious Bush Supporters eyeing people as they entered.

but

i couldn’t help

but think

as i placed my ballot

in the

collecting machine

that it resembled

an

industrial strength

paper shredder.

hmmmm.

_.dh

Dear Patrick,

Here too, my best friends and I are libertarians.
Happy voting day!

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Patrick K. Kroupa [mailto:digital@phantom.com]
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 22:45
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] Get Up off Your Ass and VOTE (for SOMEBODY)

I unnerstan’ that this is a highly charged up time with that election
thing happening.  But turning this place into the Kerry vs. Bush debate
is probably not going to solve or change, much of anything.  Which is,
okay.  Everyone can say whatever they want.

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Dear Martee
Date: November 2, 2004 at 3:21:55 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie,

Please try the ginger tea. I know it will do you good.
Be well,

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Verzonden: dinsdag 2 november 2004 20:10
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] Dear Martee

Dear Martee,

Thanks for the very kind and informative post.  I
believe you are absolutely right- the meds were
screwing with my stomach AND accentuating the
withdrawal symptoms; thus, I have discontinued all of
them.  And yes, caffeine seems to wreck havoc on my
acutely sensitive system. The only thing I am using
now is Sweet Leaf, which seems to work wonders.  I luv
bud…

I have been sneezing like crazy, too- I guess my
system is flooded with histamines.  I feel like I have
woken from cryogenic stasis, and I have to re-learn
the way in which my body and senses operate.
Sometimes just one sip of stawverry juice tastes so,
urr, ‘alive’ that I can barely stand it, and my senses
go into overload.  IT HURTS TO EAT, sometimes.  The
most ridiculous commercial can bring tears to my eyes.

I guess I am being reborn, so to speak.  Beautiful,
yet terrifying…………..

Much love to you and to this list,
Julie

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Get Up off Your Ass and VOTE (for SOMEBODY)
Date: November 2, 2004 at 3:16:23 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Patrick,

Here too, my best friends and I are libertarians.
Happy voting day!

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Patrick K. Kroupa [mailto:digital@phantom.com]
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 22:45
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] Get Up off Your Ass and VOTE (for SOMEBODY)

I unnerstan’ that this is a highly charged up time with that election
thing happening.  But turning this place into the Kerry vs. Bush debate
is probably not going to solve or change, much of anything.  Which is,
okay.  Everyone can say whatever they want.

However…  On election day, get up off your ass and VOTE.  For
somebody.

This is the first time in my entire life that I am actually registered
to vote.  I am neither a Democrat nor Republican, I’m a Libertarian.

My partner in MindVox, and one of my best friends since we were little
kids — Bruce Fancher — is also a Libertarian.  We basically share the
same beliefs.  Somewhere near the very top is the absolute conviction
that a government that seeks to imprison me for the “crime” of altering
my state of consciousness against its wishes, is pretty much a textbook
definition of fascism.

By which I mean to say, that “War on Drugs” thing…  It’s really just
not working out.  Having been at the receiving end of it for most of my
life, it’s hard not to take it personally.

I am voting against Bush.  Since the basic core of being a Libertarian
is pragmatism, this means I will be voting for Kerry.

Bruce will be voting for Bush — again, for the second time.  He’s a
very smart, dysfunctional, human being, who doesn’t watch Fox News and
has no interest in the abortion issue (as far as I know, we haven’t
discussed it at length).  <Shrug>

Whatever it is that you believe, and whomever you support: ranting
about it will not affect change.  VOTING — and kickbacks to Diebold —
sure will!

So, GET UP OFF YOUR ASS AND VOTE.

On Oct 31, 2004, at 4:12 PM, Faith Bowling wrote:

Ron, I have never used drugs, or even smoked a cigarette for that
matter.   My son was addicted to Oxycontin and I’m one to find a cure,
rather than a treatment.  Thst’s why I’m interested in Iboga.   But,
I’m not hearing alot about addicts overcoming they’re addiction.

Faith (or Ray?): ibogaine isn’t a “cure.”  Cure implies magic wand,
something outside of you, which will somehow make everything totally
different, without any effort on your part.

This doesn’t exist.

Ibogaine absolutely WILL detox your son, and bring him back — or
pretty damn close — to a pre-addiction modality.  He will not be
“detoxed” and still dopesick or fiending.  He will be reset, his
physical dependence will no longer exist.  Period.

After this — depending on what your son’s other issues happen to be —
he’s going to need to do SOMETHING.  What exactly that something is, I
can’t possibly tell you without knowing your son; but if he does
ibogaine, goes back to whatever life he is living now, and changes
nothing.  The odds are extremely high that what he will be doing in the
near future is more oxy.

Patrick

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 2:16:27 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

first of all, congratulations. seven days is awesome.

when i came off of methadone in 98 I experienced the same symptoms which made me uncomfortable, but they were entirely tolerable when i weighed them against what I’d be feeling from a cold-turkey kick.

some things that worked for me:

~get exercise in the early morning daylight, even a 15 minute walk helps.
~eat balanced, healthy meals (avoid greasy/fatty foods)
~drink LOTS of water (take your body weight, divide it in half and drink that many ounces in a day, minimum)
~take long hot bath/showers as much as you can/like
~have sex and/or masturbate. a quick way to generate endorphins.
~if you can’t sleep, pretend to. even lying still for several hours will help restore you.
~watch movies, read books… distraction helps tremendously.
~do something kind for someone else, anonymously if possible.
~cut yourself some slack and love yourself.

there are a lot of good suggestions in the “getting clean” section of http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/

How long will the symptoms last? that varies from person to person. That may depend on how long, how much and what sort of opiates you were using.

I thought I felt pretty good at 2 weeks out, then when i was 4 weeks out i felt even better, etc. This went on until 9 months later I really truly felt 100%. Then again That was at the end of a pretty hellacious 10 year run, the last 4 a slightly turbulent but mostly tame methadone maintenence @80mgs, but my health was pretty shot, my teeth were crumbling, I weighed 145lbs, I had the pallor of a cement block and my idea of a good meal was a couple cinnamon rolls, a pint of Hagendaz ice cream and several twix bars…

_.dh

On Tuesday, November 2, 2004, at 08:52 AM, m.finman wrote:

Hi group,

Today is day 7 post-opiates, and I’m still not feeling
100%.  The symptoms seem to get worse at nighttime-
much worse; however, the days are almost bearable.

It’s been four years since I’ve been clean, and I’m
wondering how much longer I am going to have to endure
these symptoms: insomnia, hot/cold tingles, extreme
lethargy and weakness, and grumpiness/depression.

Randy, how are you feeling now?  How many days/weeks
has it been since you were treated?  Do you have any
secrets to share with me?

Cheers,
Julie

-Dave Hunter
Web & Print Design
808.823.1342
dave@zoltron.com

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Dear Martee
Date: November 2, 2004 at 2:10:12 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Martee,

Thanks for the very kind and informative post.  I
believe you are absolutely right- the meds were
screwing with my stomach AND accentuating the
withdrawal symptoms; thus, I have discontinued all of
them.  And yes, caffeine seems to wreck havoc on my
acutely sensitive system. The only thing I am using
now is Sweet Leaf, which seems to work wonders.  I luv
bud…

I have been sneezing like crazy, too- I guess my
system is flooded with histamines.  I feel like I have
woken from cryogenic stasis, and I have to re-learn
the way in which my body and senses operate.
Sometimes just one sip of stawverry juice tastes so,
urr, ‘alive’ that I can barely stand it, and my senses
go into overload.  IT HURTS TO EAT, sometimes.  The
most ridiculous commercial can bring tears to my eyes.

I guess I am being reborn, so to speak.  Beautiful,
yet terrifying…………..

Much love to you and to this list,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
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From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 1:52:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie,
I went through similar stuff for about 2 weeks after.  However once I figured out the chills and all only lasted briefly I relaxed .  I did notice however that anytime I attempted anything chemical (valium) for sleep my symptoms got worse.  I also noticed i felt worse when consuming sugar(way worse, don’t mock me people). From your post post ibogaine you mentioned a whole list of drugs that were perscriped for every possible symptom.  I believe if i was taking that stuff it would make my symptoms worse.  I did some homeopathics for sleep on occassion.  Although I noticed nothing worked more than 2 times in a row.  My waking time was mostly functional once I calmed down, and ate my vegetables and fruits like a good girl.   At a month I was able to go back to work. The sometime and not bad withdrawls lasted about 10 days with sneezes lasting a month.  I thought I took longer than most because of my age 51, and years of nonstop addiction 22.
I also noticed not just my opiate receptors were brand new but so was my whole body.  I was now sensitive and could not tolerate caffeine, which I drank 4 mega strong containers daily prior to treatment.  Tea also.  My body did not even want a lot of the healthy supplements I used to take.  All I took was a probiotic and my greens.  They are both immune boosting.  Healing is about supporting your immune system (good healthy food) and not tearing it down(sugar and chemicals).   There are some days I FEEL SO GOOD I CAN’T STAND IT.
Don’t mean to ramble, hope this helps.
If ever there was a good fight, this is it. Be strong
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 10:09 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy

Hi group,

Today is day 7 post-opiates, and I’m still not feeling
100%.  The symptoms seem to get worse at nighttime-
much worse; however, the days are almost bearable.

It’s been four years since I’ve been clean, and I’m
wondering how much longer I am going to have to endure
these symptoms: insomnia, hot/cold tingles, extreme
lethargy and weakness, and grumpiness/depression.

Randy, how are you feeling now?  How many days/weeks
has it been since you were treated?  Do you have any
secrets to share with me?

Cheers,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: November 2, 2004 at 12:46:16 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The vast majority of soldiers in the USArmy come from poor backgrounds without much chance for a decent education or job. So they join the army or marines or air force with illusions of grandeur to entice them. TRAVEL THE WORLD. LEARN EXCITING NEW TECHNOLOGIES. GET EDUCATED. BE ALL YOU CAN BE. KILL INNOCENT WOMEN AND CHILDREN. TORTURE & HUMILIATE POWs. BE THE PAWN THAT YOU ALREADY ARE.

On Tuesday, November 2, 2004, at 07:31 AM, Sara Glatt wrote:

What a smell, it’s like living in a petrol station. How can that not kill? It’s like sniffing glue. Those soldiers will be brain dead sooner or later,

Or maybe they are brain dead already and that’s why they are there.

 

<image.tiff>

Van:D H [mailto:dave@phantom.com]
Verzonden: dinsdag 2 november 2004 18:20
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good

 

The intent of the Bush Adminsitration in Iraq was to control Iraq’s oil.

just look where 80% of the soldiers are… at the oil fields and pipelines.

end of story.

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: November 2, 2004 at 12:31:22 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What a smell, it’s like living in a petrol station. How can that not kill? It’s like sniffing glue. Those soldiers will be brain dead sooner or later,
Or maybe they are brain dead already and that’s why they are there.
Van: D H [mailto:dave@phantom.com] 
Verzonden: dinsdag 2 november 2004 18:20
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good

The intent of the Bush Adminsitration in Iraq was to control Iraq’s oil.

just look where 80% of the soldiers are… at the oil fields and pipelines.

end of story.


On Monday, November 1, 2004, at 07:12 PM, Faith Bowling wrote:
There’s a difference in thought and intent of heart. We intend to kill only the terriorists, but some innocent people will get killed in the process. I have never studied Catholism, but saw, on TV, a priest saying the same thing I feel–about abortion. It’s premediated, deliberate murder. But, I have friends that believe the way most of you feel, so I probably need to try to keep my beliefs to myself–especially when it’s clear that it won’t do any good to voice them.
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2004 18:39:30 -0500
You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth,
by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they
will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant
they can’t see it.<

Yes Faith,
Thank Goodness for Bush, who according to the above sentence is just like all other prohibitionist, fearmongering, warprofiteering maniacs. I’d hate to be against someone who has my better interests in mind, even if I’m unaware of what they are.
I understand you aren’t going to change your mind, but Bush is dropping bombs on people who had not attacked us nor had not only no plans to but no way to do so, at least not that would be stopped by invading their country. How in the heck that is “moral” is beyond me. How people can so willingly support ever more murder is just stupid to me- especially when his supporters throw in such commentary as:
Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a
terriorist. The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s
womb.<

So, partial birth abortion is not cool, but dropping bombs on fully developed, innocent adult and children ferriners IS cool? How in the hell does this equate in your mind?
Egad.

Peace and love,
Preston

”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.


—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he won’t sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear to get a vote. You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant they can’t see it. Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a terriorist. The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree. We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck. Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush). There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham. He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual. Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie




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808.823.1342
dave@zoltron.com

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: November 2, 2004 at 12:20:29 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The intent of the Bush Adminsitration in Iraq was to control Iraq’s oil.

just look where 80% of the soldiers are… at the oil fields and pipelines.

end of story.

On Monday, November 1, 2004, at 07:12 PM, Faith Bowling wrote:

There’s a difference in thought and intent of heart.  We intend to kill only the terriorists, but some innocent people will get killed in the process.  I have never studied Catholism, but saw, on TV, a priest saying the same thing I feel–about abortion.  It’s premediated, deliberate murder. But, I have friends that believe the way most of you feel, so I probably need to try to keep my beliefs to myself–especially when it’s clear that it won’t do any good to voice them.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2004 18:39:30 -0500

You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth,
by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they
will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant
they can’t see it.<

Yes Faith,
Thank Goodness for Bush, who according to the above sentence is just like all other prohibitionist, fearmongering, warprofiteering maniacs. I’d hate to be against someone who has my better interests in mind, even if I’m unaware of what they are.
I understand you aren’t going to change your mind, but Bush is dropping bombs on people who had not attacked us nor had not only no plans to but no way to do so, at least not that would be stopped by invading their country. How in the heck that is “moral” is beyond me. How people can so willingly support ever more murder is just stupid to me- especially when his supporters throw in such commentary as:

Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a
terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s
womb.<

So, partial birth abortion is not cool, but dropping bombs on fully developed, innocent adult and children ferriners IS cool? How in the hell does this equate in your mind?
Egad.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas

I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he won’t sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear to get a vote.  You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant they can’t see it.  Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree.  We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck.  Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush).  There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham.  He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual.  Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie

__________________________________
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Web & Print Design
808.823.1342
dave@zoltron.com

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 11:57:33 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 11/2/04 10:11:07 AM, ms_iboga@yahoo.com writes:

Today is day 7 post-opiates, and I’m still not feeling
100%.  The symptoms seem to get worse at nighttime-
much worse; however, the days are almost bearable.

It’s been four years since I’ve been clean, and I’m
wondering how much longer I am going to have to endure
these symptoms: insomnia, hot/cold tingles, extreme
lethargy and weakness, and grumpiness/depression.

While the effects of ibogaine are very distinct to any individual patient,
diminished need for sleep is common to opioid dependent and non-opioid dependent
ibogaine treated patients alike.  It may last from a week to a month usually.

All of your other symptoms may or may not be related to ibogaine or
withdrawal.  Regardless of what medical condition, that symptoms get worse at night is
not uncommon.

In my miracle ibogaine center we would have a modern hospital to figure out
what is going on with you and Sara to keep them on there toes as she may be
setting your dose regimens for ibogaine and other exotic medications.

Howard

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Preston, what’s your book’s ISBN number?
Date: November 2, 2004 at 11:22:06 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

isbn:
1-932857-00-1

Enjoy the read, if “enjoy” is exactly the word I want here Julie.
Yeah, Enjoy will work.
;-0))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 9:11 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Preston, what’s your book’s ISBN number?

Hi Preston,

I’d like to pick up a copy of your book…Can you
forward your ISBN number to me?

Thanks,

Julie

__________________________________
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From: “Brad Fisher” <brad.fisher@guaranty.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 10:21:07 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julie, good job, hang in, this was always the critical time for me. You are
on a road to freedom and past 7 of the most challenging nights you will have
to get through. Slowly you will feel better and better, and then one morning
you will realize you just (woke-up) and did get a little sleep. I am happy
for you, and envious.
bf

Hi group,

Today is day 7 post-opiates, and I’m still not feeling
100%.  The symptoms seem to get worse at nighttime-
much worse; however, the days are almost bearable.

It’s been four years since I’ve been clean, and I’m
wondering how much longer I am going to have to endure
these symptoms: insomnia, hot/cold tingles, extreme
lethargy and weakness, and grumpiness/depression.

Randy, how are you feeling now?  How many days/weeks
has it been since you were treated?  Do you have any
secrets to share with me?

Cheers,
Julie

__________________________________
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From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 10:20:47 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julie, happy youre clean! It seems like about at 2 weeks I started to see the light of day as far as withdrawl goes, & at a month i could feel my own endorphins coming back real well, Im sure everyone is diff ,Im sure methadone takes longer, wish you the best sister! Hey List ,Ive finally got thru the dreaded post ibogaine slump Ive hit for the third time! That period where the noribogaine wears off ,urges get stronger & some small slips occur,I did it and no desire to get the ball & chain back! YES!!!We rock!!-shell

Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi group,

Today is day 7 post-opiates, and I’m still not feeling
100%. The symptoms seem to get worse at nighttime-
much worse; however, the days are almost bearable.

It’s been four years since I’ve been clean, and I’m
wondering how much longer I am going to have to endure
these symptoms: insomnia, hot/cold tingles, extreme
lethargy and weakness, and grumpiness/depression.

Randy, how are you feeling now? How many days/weeks
has it been since you were treated? Do you have any
secrets to share with me?

Cheers,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] life post-opiates & question for Randy
Date: November 2, 2004 at 10:09:25 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi group,

Today is day 7 post-opiates, and I’m still not feeling
100%.  The symptoms seem to get worse at nighttime-
much worse; however, the days are almost bearable.

It’s been four years since I’ve been clean, and I’m
wondering how much longer I am going to have to endure
these symptoms: insomnia, hot/cold tingles, extreme
lethargy and weakness, and grumpiness/depression.

Randy, how are you feeling now?  How many days/weeks
has it been since you were treated?  Do you have any
secrets to share with me?

Cheers,
Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
www.yahoo.com

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From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Preston, what’s your book’s ISBN number?
Date: November 2, 2004 at 9:11:31 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Preston,

I’d like to pick up a copy of your book…Can you
forward your ISBN number to me?

Thanks,

Julie

__________________________________
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www.yahoo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) quote for Faith on no criticism of the President
Date: November 2, 2004 at 8:18:05 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
At the top of the article at this link, titled Bush and bin-Laden, I found this quote by Theodore Roosevelt, and thought it too synchronistic in timing not to post it in reply to Faith’s recent incredible- basically un-American and anti-Constitutional as I understand the definitions of American (in this particular case) and US Constitution- assertion that by criticizing the President we’re only giving ammo to terrorists.

http://www.truthout.org/docs_04/110204E.shtml

To announce that there must be no criticism of the President, or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong, is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable to the American public.
– Theodore Roosevelt, May 7, 1918

So, again, I couldn’t resist posting this off topic post. I hope those not in the US can bare with with my blatant politicizing (and those apolitical types in the US too for that matter) and ranting about political things and such on Election Day and at least for another day or two. It’s a very highly charged atmosphere here for those of us, or for me anyway as I can only speak for myself, who are paying attention to politics and public affairs and the wars and such. There really seems to be a vibration in the air here, an electricity that I can feel, that makes my hair stand and my skin tingle (and it’s not withdrawals darn it, or thank gosh and ibo I mean) when walking about town. We really are at war, my country is, not only on druggies but now much of the rest of the world and our own citizenry it seems, and that is reflected in the very air around me I sometimes feel, with things having an sharp almost painful edge to them all the time that I wasn’t feeling a few years ago. Maybe I’m being mumbo-jumbo here by describing somewhat non-tangible sensations in the air around me, but I do feel that this election, whether it really matter in the longrun in terms of who is really running the country, is a very important one in what it will say to the rest of the world, about whether we here not in politics do support war on everyone else or not, if we support the tearing up of treaty after treaty, the disappearing of prisoners into a void of military control and the hands of “friendly” countries which allow torture, the destruction of the environment, etc, etc. Will we continue onwards towards some final destruction, some big huge conflageration of world-wide war and terror for everyone, or will we change direction again and move back towards at least some semblence of sanity, compassion and empathy again? I don’t think Kerry will move us too far in that direction, but I’ve come to the conclusion that I don’t mind if people vote for him at all and might just do so myself (can you believe I’m still “undecided” and will be until I walk into the polling booth across the street from my apartment at the elementary school where kids come out every morning screaming and hollaring on the oldest playground in Manhattan…ummm, scuse me, got off topic there, gosh darn that wake and bake mentality of mine…) because I hate the idea of four more years getting screwed by Bush and his murderous, thieving ilk.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (still somewhat ot) Re: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: November 2, 2004 at 6:56:01 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith wrote >so I probably need to try to
keep my beliefs to myself–especially when it’s clear that it won’t do any
good to voice them.<

Ahhh, first thing in the morning, and I feel somewhat like a heel.
Please don’t ever keep your opinions to yourself Faith, even if someone like me gets irate and irritable with you over your opinions. It’s not “right” to let me or anyone shut you up because we don’t agree with you. But then, if you or I do voice our opinions, I suppose we both must be prepared for the repurcussions.
So with that in mind, I must say I can’t understand how accidental murder is any better than on purpose murder. What do you suppose the police would say if I shot some innocent bystander when trying to shoot the person actually attacking (or not as the case may be) me? That it was ok because I didn’t mean to kill the innocent bystander? Isn’t that called “manslaughter?”
And how you can think by bombing cities and residential neighborhoods our military is only trying to kill terrorists is puzzling to me, and I will continue to wonder how that makes the murders of innocent civilians, paid for with your and my tax dollars ok with you. I mean really, “a difference in thought and intent of heart” changes nothing Faith- the innocent people in Iraq (not to mention Afghanistan) are still dead, killed forever with weapons you and I paid for (along with all the other taxpayers), murdered with tons upon tons of bombs dropped (as well as all the other weapons fired) on the strength of lies we know were told us to justify this current state of affairs (you know, war, war, war all the time, war and death and hate and destruction and machismo, instead of the much more beneficial peace and construction and kindness and helpfulness and love)- murdered by the military that takes so much of our money while telling us it’s damned socialism to want universal health care of something, while meanwhile falling asleep (umm, well, MAYBE falling asleep, and maybe allowing that much desired by some “new Pearl Harbor” to take place) during the most horrific mass murder to happen here in my city, as well as on the seat of US military power too.
Personally? I’m a little tired of all the support of death and hate, even if it’s justified by some lofty notions of “accidental murder is ok, really, if our President says it’s ok.”
Remember the defense of those Nazis and “good” Germans Faith? They were only following orders, and the state was telling them it was ok to kill “others” too. But it wasn’t, according to the US government, the “winners” of that war, WWII in case you miss what I’m talking about.
Again, you are displaying what seems to me such a common attitude on the part of right-to-lifers: Safe the unborn children, screw those already alive and trying to survive.
But whatever your political views, I’m glad you are here at least seeking something to help your addicted child. Ibogaine is NOT a cure, but it is a very helpful substance in changing perspectives about using drugs- sometimes.
In my own very humble opinion.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 12:12 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good

There’s a difference in thought and intent of heart.  We intend to kill only the terriorists, but some innocent people will get killed in the process.  I have never studied Catholism, but saw, on TV, a priest saying the same thing I feel–about abortion.  It’s premediated, deliberate murder. But, I have friends that believe the way most of you feel, so I probably need to try to keep my beliefs to myself–especially when it’s clear that it won’t do any good to voice them.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2004 18:39:30 -0500

You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth,
by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they
will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant
they can’t see it.<

Yes Faith,
Thank Goodness for Bush, who according to the above sentence is just like all other prohibitionist, fearmongering, warprofiteering maniacs. I’d hate to be against someone who has my better interests in mind, even if I’m unaware of what they are.
I understand you aren’t going to change your mind, but Bush is dropping bombs on people who had not attacked us nor had not only no plans to but no way to do so, at least not that would be stopped by invading their country. How in the heck that is “moral” is beyond me. How people can so willingly support ever more murder is just stupid to me- especially when his supporters throw in such commentary as:

Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a
terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s
womb.<

So, partial birth abortion is not cool, but dropping bombs on fully developed, innocent adult and children ferriners IS cool? How in the hell does this equate in your mind?
Egad.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas

I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he won’t sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear to get a vote.  You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant they can’t see it.  Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree.  We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck.  Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush).  There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham.  He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual.  Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie

__________________________________
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From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: November 2, 2004 at 5:53:10 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey C’mon,
Accidentaly killing  “some inocent people”; for example Doing experiment on
weak nuclear bombs on American soldiers. Did you ever heard about so many
USA soldiers get cought cancer beacuse of this “experimental things”. Would
you tell me that is there any reasonable evidence between 11/9 and Iraq?

This is same dictator that USA supported Saddam while war againest Iran. Is
this same guy? Would you tell me: when USA bombed and killed whole peoples
in a town in afghanistan paid 100$ for each. Same USA  paid  to 11/9 plane
victims for each million dollars. Are they same humans are they equal?

In here my country USA supported by the hand of CIA military dictators and
same dictators killed so many Kurds and Turks only for their thinking.
Military used USA made weapons. Was it “accidentaly”?

What a dirty game…

Best Regards
FakePlacebo

—– Original Message —–
From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, November 02, 2004 7:12 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good

There’s a difference in thought and intent of heart.  We intend to kill
only
the terriorists, but some innocent people will get killed in the process.
I
have never studied Catholism, but saw, on TV, a priest saying the same
thing
I feel–about abortion.  It’s premediated, deliberate murder. But, I have
friends that believe the way most of you feel, so I probably need to try
to
keep my beliefs to myself–especially when it’s clear that it won’t do any
good to voice them.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2004 18:39:30 -0500

You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth,
by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how
they
will do the right things for people even though those people are so
ignorant
they can’t see it.<

Yes Faith,
Thank Goodness for Bush, who according to the above sentence is just like
all other prohibitionist, fearmongering, warprofiteering maniacs. I’d
hate
to be against someone who has my better interests in mind, even if I’m
unaware of what they are.
I understand you aren’t going to change your mind, but Bush is dropping
bombs on people who had not attacked us nor had not only no plans to but
no
way to do so, at least not that would be stopped by invading their
country.
How in the heck that is “moral” is beyond me. How people can so willingly
support ever more murder is just stupid to me- especially when his
supporters throw in such commentary as:

Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a
terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s
Maother’s
womb.<

So, partial birth abortion is not cool, but dropping bombs on fully
developed, innocent adult and children ferriners IS cool? How in the hell
does this equate in your mind?
Egad.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist
dictator from Texas

I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he
won’t
sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear
to get a vote.  You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and

worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves,
and
how they will do the right things for people even though those people
are
so ignorant they can’t see it.  Anyone who will vote for partial-birth
abortion is a terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should
be
it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist
dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree.  We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck.  Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush).  There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham.  He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual.  Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] charliedog post a url next time! please!
Date: November 2, 2004 at 4:36:36 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Charliedog you sent a 4 meg attachment to what’s I think over 5,000
people. Instead of posting a 1 line url you spammed the whole list and
crashed anyone who has limited mailbox space. If anyone is using dial
up you made them also hate you.

Patrick this is the only time you ever ask anyone not to do something,
you alive?

.:vector:.

__________________________________
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Check out the new Yahoo! Front Page.
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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: November 2, 2004 at 3:11:01 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I don’t think anybody would do an abortion for fun.
There must be a reason when people decide they can’t have
A baby. I think having business of selling babies is emotionally worst.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Faith Bowling [mailto:bchloej@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: dinsdag 2 november 2004 6:13
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good

There’s a difference in thought and intent of heart.  We intend to kill only

the terriorists, but some innocent people will get killed in the process.  I

have never studied Catholism, but saw, on TV, a priest saying the same thing

I feel–about abortion.  It’s premediated, deliberate murder. But, I have
friends that believe the way most of you feel, so I probably need to try to
keep my beliefs to myself–especially when it’s clear that it won’t do any
good to voice them.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2004 18:39:30 -0500

You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth,
by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how
they
will do the right things for people even though those people are so
ignorant
they can’t see it.<

Yes Faith,
Thank Goodness for Bush, who according to the above sentence is just like
all other prohibitionist, fearmongering, warprofiteering maniacs. I’d hate
to be against someone who has my better interests in mind, even if I’m
unaware of what they are.
I understand you aren’t going to change your mind, but Bush is dropping
bombs on people who had not attacked us nor had not only no plans to but no

way to do so, at least not that would be stopped by invading their country.

How in the heck that is “moral” is beyond me. How people can so willingly
support ever more murder is just stupid to me- especially when his
supporters throw in such commentary as:

Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a
terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s
womb.<

So, partial birth abortion is not cool, but dropping bombs on fully
developed, innocent adult and children ferriners IS cool? How in the hell
does this equate in your mind?
Egad.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist
dictator from Texas

I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he won’t

sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear
to get a vote.  You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and
worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and

how they will do the right things for people even though those people are
so ignorant they can’t see it.  Anyone who will vote for partial-birth
abortion is a terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be

it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist
dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree.  We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck.  Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush).  There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham.  He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual.  Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie

__________________________________
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Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat
Date: November 2, 2004 at 3:06:17 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston,

I wish I could vote for you!

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: dinsdag 2 november 2004 2:39
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat

I’ve decided I want to be President.
Write me in and I’ll give you lots of stuff when I win.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet
(Preston For President! He’ll Give you Stuff!)

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: Charliedog43@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 5:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

I’m done with the politics.  I can talk that anywhere. Just vote. I don’t
give a rat’s ass for whom. Just do the American thing and vote. Hell, i
voted for a democratic governor last race. I’m not stuck on any party,
although i’m a registered Republican. They are all not the same. Same as all

Democrats aren’t either. Neither candidate can give you every thing you
want. But I will say, Republican or Democrat, most are overpaid, spoiled
crooks, who want power. And will say anything or do anything to get it.
Greed and power. Always been that way, always will be. But we get to elect
the greediest, most powerful bastard, anyway. Well, kind of.

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From: UUSEAN@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Does anyone know if ibogaine is contraindicated in Hepatitis C…
Date: November 2, 2004 at 2:27:58 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello,

Just one person’s experience, but I am HIV poz and have hepC. My numbers improved post ibo on both counts. I have heard nothing of last that would suggest contra indication, but a recent liver workup is suggested often before treatment.

My enzymes went form 400 to 15 post ibo.

Peace,
Sean

From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: November 2, 2004 at 12:12:48 AM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There’s a difference in thought and intent of heart.  We intend to kill only the terriorists, but some innocent people will get killed in the process.  I have never studied Catholism, but saw, on TV, a priest saying the same thing I feel–about abortion.  It’s premediated, deliberate murder. But, I have friends that believe the way most of you feel, so I probably need to try to keep my beliefs to myself–especially when it’s clear that it won’t do any good to voice them.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: Mon, 1 Nov 2004 18:39:30 -0500

You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth,
by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they
will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant
they can’t see it.<

Yes Faith,
Thank Goodness for Bush, who according to the above sentence is just like all other prohibitionist, fearmongering, warprofiteering maniacs. I’d hate to be against someone who has my better interests in mind, even if I’m unaware of what they are.
I understand you aren’t going to change your mind, but Bush is dropping bombs on people who had not attacked us nor had not only no plans to but no way to do so, at least not that would be stopped by invading their country. How in the heck that is “moral” is beyond me. How people can so willingly support ever more murder is just stupid to me- especially when his supporters throw in such commentary as:

Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a
terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s
womb.<

So, partial birth abortion is not cool, but dropping bombs on fully developed, innocent adult and children ferriners IS cool? How in the hell does this equate in your mind?
Egad.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas

I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he won’t sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear to get a vote.  You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant they can’t see it.  Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree.  We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck.  Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush).  There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham.  He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual.  Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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From: Charliedog43@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fwd: Choose between the two
Date: November 1, 2004 at 9:28:34 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: “Hank” <hburleson2702@charter.net>
Subject: Choose between the two
Date: October 31, 2004 at 10:53:22 PM EST
To: “Scott” <charliedog43@aol.com>, “S. Bradford” <esbradfo@bellsouth.net>, “Oscar” <EDWKOW@aol.com>, “mark.treloar” <mark.treloar@delphi.com>, “Marie&Robbie” <thsballar2005@charter.net>, “kenneth.hinz” <kenneth.hinz@delphi.com>, “Janet” <jhburl@aol.com>, “Jack” <jackbradford@comcast.net>, “Duck” <dwr@direcway.com>, “Clay, Nora H” <Nora.H.Clay@msfc.nasa.gov>

 

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 1, 2004 at 8:58:24 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

and also in reply to Charlie and the assertion that Russia et al were selling arms to Iraq,
That’s not really in question per se, but I do want to remind Charlie and all that the US has a long and colorful history of selling foreign arms to the “armies” (read: Terrorists)  we the taxpayers support around the globe, like in the Village Voice article last week that quoted some soldier the US armed, with AK-47s. Hmmm.
(Can’t remember which article this was, nor what conflict it was reporting on, but it was in last week’s issue.)

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 4:43 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

Yes, but the enemy always can sell it to the Russians, that are not that stupid. they will pay an American spy to get the knowledge.
Someone like James Bond, or Rambo.

Van: Charliedog43@aol.com [mailto:Charliedog43@aol.com]
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 23:39
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

We sell weapons to our ally’s everyday. 10 years they are your enemy. Got to make sure you have he dominant weapons and the best pilots,trainers, and ways to incompacitate the weapons you sold if need be. And spare parts. Billion dollar weapons ain’t worth squat without the right technology or spare part.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: throwing in the hat
Date: November 1, 2004 at 8:39:04 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve decided I want to be President.
Write me in and I’ll give you lots of stuff when I win.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet
(Preston For President! He’ll Give you Stuff!)

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Charliedog43@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 5:50 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

I’m done with the politics.  I can talk that anywhere. Just vote. I don’t give a rat’s ass for whom. Just do the American thing and vote. Hell, i voted for a democratic governor last race. I’m not stuck on any party, although i’m a registered Republican. They are all not the same. Same as all Democrats aren’t either. Neither candidate can give you every thing you want. But I will say, Republican or Democrat, most are overpaid, spoiled crooks, who want power. And will say anything or do anything to get it. Greed and power. Always been that way, always will be. But we get to elect the greediest, most powerful bastard, anyway. Well, kind of.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]
Date: November 1, 2004 at 8:36:01 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

and Texas gave us Gibby Haines too, along with the rest of the Butthole Surfers.
Go Texas!
Didn’t they also give us Janis Joplin?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 5:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]

Texas gave us Billy Gibbons too!!!      Randy

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] OT!) more on killing innocents
Date: November 1, 2004 at 8:34:32 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So this one is really mostly for Faith and her ilk, who seem to feel that unborn embryos are more special and deserving of safety and protection than those already born and alive.
Like all these women and children being killed by our forces today in Iraq.
Hmmm. So, is it ok that these hundred thousand plus are murdered by us, because we’ve stopped the murdering by Saddam of the very same people? Is our murding somehow less deadly or permenant than Saddams?
Sigh.
—–
(from another list I’m on- subscribe info at the bottom here.)

‘The Lancet’ — the journal of the British Medical Association, and one of the most widely-read medical journals in the world, has just published a scientific research study documenting the massive slaughter of civilians in Iraq following the USA-led Iraq-Attack in March 2003.  Moreover, the study documents that MOST of the fatalities have been women and children, largely killed in air strikes by the USA and its ‘coalition’ members.

The address below gets you to the intro pages of the two pieces with further links — users may need to register (which is free and easy):

http://www.thelancet.com/journal/vol364/iss9445/early_online_publication
_ _ _

Richard Horton, the editor of the Lancet was interviewed Friday morning on the BBC radio program ‘Today’.  He said he was confident the figures in the article documented below were an accurate reflection of reality.

Medical research depends upon statistics, and most papers published in the Lancet, and all other international medical journals, use statistics to arrive at conclusions.

Britain’s Channel 4 TV news Friday evening was quoting the Prime Minister’s office and other sources as ‘rubbishing’ the statistical strength based upon numbers sampled, and whether those sampled are representative of the whole population.  They even said the 100,000 figure was an extrapolation of the sample figures — well yes, they would be, wouldn’t they?  Short of interviewing the entire population, they would have to be an extrapolation of a smaller number.

The editorial staff of the Lancet cannot publish any paper without analyzing the paper’s validity based substantially upon on its statistical rigor. Research doctors and journal editors understand statistics as well as any other discipline might (apart I suppose than statisticians).  That is not to say no one ever gets it wrong …

In other words Richard Horton is very publicly putting his reputation on the line over this paper.

[Above comments by Dr. Peter Hall on list JUSTWATCH-L]
_ _ _

The study is titled:

Mortality Before and After the 2003 Invasion of Iraq: Cluster Sample Survey
by Les Roberts, Riyadh Lafta, Richard Garfield, Jamal Khudhairi, and Gilbert Burnham

Summary

Background

In March, 2003, military forces, mainly from the USA and the UK, invaded Iraq.  We did a survey to compare mortality during the period of 14-16 months before the invasion with the 17-18 months after it.

Methods

A cluster sample survey was undertaken throughout Iraq during September, 2004.  33 clusters of 30 households each were interviewed about household composition, births, and deaths since January, 2002.  In those households reporting deaths, the date, cause, and circumstances of violent deaths were recorded.  We assessed the relative risk of death associated with the 2003 invasion and occupation by comparing mortality in the 17·8 months after the invasion with the 14·6-month period preceding it.

Findings

The risk of death was estimated to be 2.5-fold (95% CI 1·6-4·2) higher after the invasion when compared with the pre-invasion period.  Two-thirds of all violent deaths were reported in one cluster in the city of Fallujah.  If we exclude the Fallujah data, the risk of death is 1.5-fold (1·1-2·3) higher after the invasion.  We estimate that 98,000 more deaths than expected (8,000-194,000) happened after the invasion outside of Fallujah, and far more if the outlier Fallujah cluster is included.  The major causes of death before the invasion were myocardial infarction, cerebrovascular accidents, and other chronic disorders, whereas after the invasion violence was the primary cause of death.  Violent deaths were widespread, reported in 15 of 33 clusters, and were mainly attributed to coalition forces.  Most individuals reportedly killed by coalition forces were women and children. The risk of death from violence in the period after the invasion was 58 times higher (95% CI 8·1-41!
9) tha
n in the period before the war.

Interpretation

Making conservative assumptions, we think that about 100,000 excess deaths, or more, have happened since the 2003 invasion of Iraq.  Violence accounted for most of the excess deaths and air strikes from coalition forces accounted for most violent deaths.  We have shown that collection of public-health information is possible even during periods of extreme violence.  Our results need further verification and should lead to changes to reduce non-combatant deaths from air strikes.
_ _ _ _ _ _ _

100,000 Iraqi Deaths
by Emma Ross
[Associated Press Medical Writer]

London — A survey of deaths in Iraqi households estimates that as many as 100,000 more people may have died throughout the country in the 18 months after the U.S. invasion than would be expected based on the death rate before the war.

There is no official figure for the number of Iraqis killed since the conflict began, but some non-governmental estimates range from 10,000 to 30,000.  As of Wednesday, 1,081 U.S. servicemen had been killed, according to the U.S. Defense Department.

The scientists who wrote the report concede that the data they based their projections on were of “limited precision,” because the quality of the information depends on the accuracy of the household interviews used for the study.  The interviewers were Iraqi, most of them doctors.

Designed and conducted by researchers at Johns Hopkins University, Columbia University and the Al-Mustansiriya University in Baghdad, the study is being published Thursday on the web site of The Lancet medical journal.

The survey indicated violence accounted for most of the extra deaths seen since the invasion, and air strikes from coalition forces caused most of the violent deaths, the researchers wrote in the British-based journal.

“Most individuals reportedly killed by coalition forces were women and children,” they said.

The report was released just days before the U.S. presidential election, and the lead researcher said he wanted it that way.  The Lancet routinely publishes papers on the Web before they appear in print, particularly if it considers the findings of urgent public health interest.

Those reports then appear later in the print issue of the journal.  The journal’s spokesmen said they were uncertain which print issue the Iraqi report would appear in, and said it was too late to make Friday’s issue … and possibly too late for the November 5 edition.

Les Roberts, the lead researcher from Johns Hopkins, said the article’s timing was up to him.

“I emailed it in on September 30 under the condition that it came out before the election,” Roberts told The Asocciated Press.  “My motive in doing that was not to skew the election.  My motive was that if this came out during the campaign, both candidates would be forced to pledge to protect civilian lives in Iraq.

“I was opposed to the war and I still think that the war was a bad idea, but I think that our science has transcended our perspectives,” Roberts said. “As an American, I am really, really sorry to be reporting this.”

Richard Peto, an expert on study methods who was not involved with the research, said the approach the scientists took is a reasonable one to investigate the Iraq death toll.

However, it’s possible that they may have zoned in on hotspots that might not be representative of the death toll across Iraq, said Peto, a professor of medical statistics at Oxford University in England.

To conduct the survey, investigators visited 33 neighborhoods spread evenly across the country in September, randomly selecting clusters of 30 households to sample.  Of the 988 households visited, 808, consisting of 7,868 people, agreed to participate in the survey.  At each one, they asked how many people lived in the home, and how many births and deaths there had been since January 2002.

The scientists then compared death rates in the 15 months before the invasion with those that occurred during the 18 months after the attack, and adjusted those numbers to account for the different time periods.

Even though the sample size appears small, this type of survey is considered accurate and acceptable by scientists, and was used to calculate war deaths in Kosovo in the late 1990s.

The investigators worked in teams of three.  Five of the six Iraqi interviewers were doctors, and all six were fluent in English and Arabic.

In the households reporting deaths, the person who died had to be living there at the time of the death and for more than two months before to be counted.  In an attempt at firmer confirmation, the interviewers asked for death certificates in 78 households and were provided them 63 times.

There were 46 deaths in the surveyed households before the war.  After the invasion, there were 142 deaths.  That is an increase from 5 deaths per 1,000 people per year to 12.3 per 1,000 people per year — more than double.

However, more than a third of the post-invasion deaths were reported in one cluster of households in the city of Fallujah, where fighting has been most intense recently.  Because the fighting was so severe there, the numbers from that location may have exaggerated the overall picture.

When the researchers recalculated the effect of the war without the statistics from Fallujah, the deaths end up at 7.9 per 1,000 people per year … still 1.5 times higher than before the war.

Even with Fallujah factored out, the survey “indicates that the death toll associated with the invasion and occupation of Iraq is more likely than not about 100,000 people, and may be much higher,” the report said.

The most common causes of death before the invasion of Iraq were heart attacks, strokes and other chronic diseases.  However, after the invasion, violence was recorded as the primary cause of death, and was mainly attributed to coalition forces … with about 95 percent of those deaths caused by bombs or fire from helicopter gunships.

Violent deaths defined as those brought about by the intentional act of others were reported in 15 of the 33 clusters.  The chances of a violent death were 58 times higher after the invasion than before it, the researchers said.

Twelve of the 73 violent deaths were not attributed to coalition forces. The researchers said 28 children were killed by coalition forces in the survey households.  Infant mortality rose from 29 deaths per 1,000 live births before the war to 57 deaths per 1,000 afterward.

The researchers estimated the nationwide death toll due to the conflict by multiplying the difference between the two death rates by the estimated population of Iraq 24.4 million at the start of the war.  The result was then multiplied by 18 months, the average period between the invasion and the survey interviews.

“We estimate that there were 98,000 extra deaths during the postwar period in the 97 percent of Iraq represented by all the clusters except Falluja,” the researchers said in the journal.

“This isn’t about individual soldiers doing bad things.  This appears to be a problem with the approach to occupation in Iraq,” Roberts said.

The researchers called for further confirmation by an independent body such as the International Committee of the Red Cross, or the World Health Organization.

The study was funded by the Center for International Emergency Disaster and Refugee Studies at Johns Hopkins University and by the Small Arms Survey in Geneva, Switzerland, a research project based at the Graduate Institute of International Studies in Geneva.

http://www.thelancet.com

==================================
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217 High Street, Brattleboro, VT, USA
ZIP: 05301-6073         Phone: 1-802-254-2826
CERJ was founded in New York in May, 1997.
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“Work together to reinvent justice using methods
that are fair; that conserve, restore, and even
create harmony, equity and good will in society.”
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To join (or leave) the CERJ email list, kindly send
me an email message at wilmerding@earthlink.net
or at cerj@igc.org.  I’ll need your first & last name,
your email address, and your state, province or
country of residence.  Thank you!  — John W.
==================================

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: November 1, 2004 at 8:26:43 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Carla, that’s all propoganda.  I don’t know the truth about this issue, so
I’ll keep my mouth shut.<

Oh my GOD!
Shown easily researched and verifiable facts, that’s “propaganda” but the stories about Kerry’s purple hearts, no, they’re genuine. (Let’s see, Bush dodged actual combat, while Kerry, who I personally don’t like at all either, actually did his “duty” and went to war. Yet, to Bush supporters, the actual warrior who did his duty is somehow suspect, while the pampered son of a former Head of the CIA, well, he’s totally believable. What is going on here? How and when exactly did it become so fashionable to stop using ones brain?)
Do you read what you write before hitting send? You’re getting more and more ridiculous as you dig deeper Faith.
I am stunned that there are such people in my country- not suprised at all, but still stunned when I see such commentary as what you are posting Faith. I’m trying to stay polite, firmly believing that it doesn’t help change minds to point out in anger how stupid and brainless I feel whoever I’m arguing with is being, but in this case I’m having a lot of trouble remaining polite in the face of such non-thinking in support of a warmongering, Constitution-shredding liar like Bush.
Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 4:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas

Carla, that’s all propoganda.  I don’t know the truth about this issue, so I’ll keep my mouth shut.  But, I do have a tendency to believe the “Purple Heart” stories about Kerry are true.  And, also to shoot a wounded, running, man is the back is something I would have a problem with, even in war.

From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 10:08:30 -1000

Very Funny!

High Morals and Ethics?

Does that include using influence to avoid Vietnam, then turning around and attempting to smear someone WHO ACTUALLY SERVED?

Does that include cashing out from Harkin with a tidy profit DAYS  BEFORE HARKIN WENT BELLY UP? (leaving employees and shareholders empty  handed!)

Does that include the Bush family legacy of profiteering from oil and Munitions manufacture? (munitions used to de-stabilize countries who  just so happen to have LOTS of oil under their soil)

Does that include having the notorious reputation of residing over the highest amount of state executions (150) while he was Gov of Texas?  (more than any other Gov in the history of the US!)

Does that include deceiving a Nation into going to war? and shifting rhyme and reason each time their rational is exposed to be false? All  the while thumbing his nose at our long-standing Allies?

Does that include turning a blind eye to the Bin Laden family (and  other “sensitive” Saudi’s) being allowed to leave the country only  hours after 9-11 when the rest of the country is under a no-fly order?

Does that include stomping on Afghanistan and quickly departing to get Saddams oil, leaving the afghan war lords largely in charge to grow  their Poppies so they can put more heroin on the streets of Europe and  the Eastern US than has been seen in years?

Does that include the fact that Bush and everyone in his administration are corporate crooks and lobbyists with only one goal: to fill their greedy little small minded pockets with the payola of their mega corporation sponsors? Who also are hell-bent on removing Democracy from the table of America?

Describe to me the “Morals and High Ethics” at Guantanamo and Abu  Grahib? (or the legal counsel Bush sought to exonerate himself and  cabinet members from torture accountability – before the detainees  arrived???)

Does that include opening up the countries last remaining nature preserves to Lumber and Fossil Fuel exploitation?

Refusing to sign the Kyoto agreement?

If so, I suppose “Morals and High Ethics” has taken on a whole new meaning

I am pro-choice. and given that the worlds population is about to  double in the next 10 years, birth control and abortion aren’t such a  bad thing. Oh wait, of course the ultra right corpo’s don’t want  abortions! that means less consumers, which means less profits! Less  cattle to consume twinkies and FOX News. Less disillusioned youth who  will eventually stick a needle in their arm. we can’t have that!  MORE  is better!

Consume!

Reproduce!

Obey!

_.dh

On Sunday, October 31, 2004, at 04:53 AM, Faith Bowling wrote:

I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he won’t sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear to get a vote.  You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take  up for themselves, and how they will do the right things for people  even though those people are so ignorant they can’t see it.  Anyone  who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a terriorist.  The safest  place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree.  We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck.  Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush).  There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham.  He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual.  Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie

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Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Faith’s protection
Date: November 1, 2004 at 7:59:23 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Faith wrote >I love everyone and would
do my best to help anyone, but I’ve always had a strong sense of justice,
and do have a problem with hearing President Bush treated so badly by those
who he has taken so much heat to protect.   But, If Kerry wins, I will not
say a harsh word against him, because he would be my President, and any
criticism is fuel to terriorists fire and empowers them to kill more of our
troops.<

Last try, but I know it’s useless.
(To start with, to revisit the “abortion bad, murder ferriners good”, why is it that right-to-lifers are always so up in arms to protect the unborn, but to the same maniacs, the already born don’t ever deserve such consideration or genuine protections? The version of freedom you’re promoting here sucks Faith.)
Faith, we’re not any safer- remember, Bush was already President when we suffered the biggest, deadliest attack on our soil less than a mile from my apartment

(http://www.wizardsofaz.com/freedomnewsnetwork/wtc-preston.html),

the one I smelled the results of for weeks, the burning wires, the blood and debris, and heard the screams that resulted all around the city as the buildings fell, and saw the thousands upon thousands of wide-eyed, panic-striken, debris laden pedestrians stream past my building all day fleeing the bloody destuction downtown- how anyone in their right mind would want to do this to other people leaves me sick to my stomach, especially after having lived through it personally, and makes me wonder about the sanity of those who wish to do this to other people and actually seem to think killing others is going to fix anything or make us any safer rather than piss of a lot of people who will as a result want to do us further harms. Plus, remember that Bush had myriad warnings prior to Sept. 11 2001, yet did nothing  to stop the attacks whatsoever:

(http://www.drugwar.com/pprewtcwarnings.shtm)

After watching those towers fall with m y own eyes, I’m thoroughly sickened whenever any of my fellow citizens try and tell me that doing this to others can be rationalized or justified. It’s never ever justified, dropping bombs on innocent civilians, ever, whether the bomb comes in the form of a jetliner or many couple-hundred pound bombs. There’s no difference, and to support its being done to others to make you (or me) safer is sick, perverted and evil. Your safety is the only important safety? Our streets are the only ones that should be without war, I mean, it’s better on their streets than on ours? Yuck.
Plus, for you to bite your tongue because our President “deserves” no questioning leaves me feeling like you’ve dropped right outta 1984 or something, or Nazi Germany or Communist Russia or Saddam’s Iraq. “Never question our leaders, that’s off limits- freedom of speech only goes so far, remember?”

any criticism is fuel to terriorists fire and empowers them to kill more of our
troops.<

But dropping bombs on them won’t? Egad, where’s your thinking cap? Please, go find it and come back with something rational, please.
Oh yeah, I forget, you’re supporting Bush still, even after all his lies, his blatant lying and murdering, because he’s “protecting us,” so I don’t suppose your thinking cap gets much usage.
I don’t know why I’m bothering with all these facts in your direction, as it’s obviously you aren’t engaged in thinking but rather in supporting wanton murder no matter what, so long as you feel safer.
How depressing.

Peace and love and genuine exasperation,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 4:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas

Ron, I have never used drugs, or even smoked a cigarette for that matter. My son was addicted to Oxycontin and I’m one to find a cure, rather than a treatment.  Thst’s why I’m interested in Iboga.   But, I’m not hearing alot about addicts overcoming they’re addiction.  So, is it taken for granted that all addicts are for Kerry?  My son is not.  I love everyone and would do my best to help anyone, but I’ve always had a strong sense of justice, and do have a problem with hearing President Bush treated so badly by those who he has taken so much heat to protect.   But, If Kerry wins, I will not say a harsh word against him, because he would be my President, and any criticism is fuel to terriorists fire and empowers them to kill more of our troops.

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 13:40:45 -0600

faith: were you a junkie or addict?  or are you just another republican who has infiltrated the opposition the way fbi agents did with what’s left of organized crime and the peace movement under the j. edgar hoover reign? rwd

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 8:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas

I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he won’t sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear to get a vote.  You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant they can’t see it.  Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree.  We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck.  Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush).  There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham.  He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual.  Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Helps protect you from nasty viruses.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: sub
Date: November 1, 2004 at 7:59:15 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The great thing about Ibogaine Ron is that it gives us hope.  How long have
you been on the Bup?  Check out the detox forum I mentioned.  If you post
your details there like how much you take and for how long there’s people
there who can give you first hand advice on tapering the Bup if you need it,
or just support.  Do remember that they ain’t Doctors though, the best thing
they say is ‘let your body guide you’.  Good luck with your taper-remember
to take it one day at a time.  What’s your career?  Do you enjoy it?

Love Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:34 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: sub

thanks hannah, i think i’m screwed. been on bup im 1.2 mg per day..liquid
amps.  i’m trying to taper that and benzos.  i’ll probably lose my career
and everything else before it’s over.  i’m in my 50’s now and drugs quit
being fun when i was in my 20’s.  addiction is a powerful thing. ron
—– Original Message —–
From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 30, 2004 9:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: sub

Hi Ron,

So far I’ve never been off my Sub apart from when I was using so I can’t
answer that.  I’ve been on it 9 months though so I’m not looking forward
to
it.  My Doctor etc here in the UK all say that Sub is not addictive and
that
you should not suffer at all as long as you taper off it.  However I’ve
heard plenty of tales that disagree.  I guess I’ll have to wait and see.
How long have you been taking it?  What’s your dosage?  There’s an
opiate-detox forum with a bit all about Buprenorphine so you could go
there
and read people’s posts for info.  (There’s a Bup forum and an info one
that
I think has some details too)  But I’ve never got a solid answer out of
it.
Look for a guy called ‘Bup4pain’ if he’s still about-he really knows
what
he’s talking about.

http://64.226.201.78/Forum/default.asp

I’m no Doctor but surely you have to deal with one addiction at a time?
Benzos or Sub?  I feel for you with the benzo WD.

Have you read up on Ibogaine?  If not definately check out The ibogaine
Dossier for info.  The others will know better-can you use Ibo to knock
both
Sub and Benzos on the head?  I’m hoping to do Ibogaine very very soon so
I’ll let you know how it works with the sub.

Love Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, October 30, 2004 2:47 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: sub

any problem coming off sub?
—– Original Message —–
From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 2:30 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Little ol’ me

I take 4mg when I feel I really need to.  I had stabilised on 4mg back
before.  Today and yesterday I took 12mg.  I expect to be back down
to
4mg
by the end of the week but I’ll see how it goes.

I hear what you’re saying about my friend.  Can’t we just both try
harder?
I really could never leave him on th street-then he’d be straight
back
into
it.  I have got meaner with him and told him he CANNOT keep doing it
at
my
flat and must have respect for my efforts.  I’m just as bad as he is
though-before its been him that did well and ME who fucked things up
for
HIM.  Give us a couple of weeks an see.  He needs to sort out a place
anyway-he will just get more depressed if he doesn’t start working
towards
a
goal.  I will be stronger.  I’m sorry everyone-I know it looks simple
to
you
but I’d rather be a junkie for the rest of my life than be
responsible
for
hurting anyone else.  And I really think throwing him out would
really
hurt
him.

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, October 29, 2004 8:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Little ol’ me

Sorry Hannah, but it is you or your friend.  Your call.

What dose of subutex are you taking?

Howard

In a message dated 10/29/04 1:04:25 PM, hannah.clay@ntlworld.com
writes:

Hi everyone,

I’m feeling sorry for myself so I thought I’d write.  I’ve really
messed
up.
I was a H addict for 4yrs doing a bit of evrything else too at times.
I

tried to detoc lots of times.  Then I was put on Subutex and was
clean
for

like a month (the longest I’;ve ever been clean) I keep trying
though.
Then

my old partner in crime got chucked out onto the streets so I said he
could

stay with me.  But we’re etrrible influences on each other-if one’s
being

good then the other always seems to want to be bad.  Anyway recenty
we
got

into Snowballs (H&Crack IV) which I’ve done lots before but never
regularly.

I love that high.  I wish I could feel like that all the time!  Now
detoxing

and just staying on my Subbies is even harder.  They don’t make me
feel

better anymore.  I can’t tell anyone cuz they’ll chuck me off my
script.
I

had got my life back a bit and now I’m losing what little I gained
cuz
I’m

always sick.  Todays only Day 2 (again) with just Subbies and I feel
so

awful 🙁  I’ve mainly slept for the past 48hrs I can’t stop shaking
and

crying.  I’m not being sick or needing the loo too much which is a
godsend

(I do try to feel grateful for that) but I just feel so CRAP!  My
friend
is

being good too though he keeps moaning and begging me to score (does
he

think I’m made of cash?  I spent over £200 on H and rock on tues and
wed

easy) And my dealers won’t stop ringing me.  My phones on silent now
cuz
I

don’t feel like talking to anyone.  Sorry if my spellings bad but my
hands

won’t stop shaking.  Even if I scored I wouldn’t be able to get
myself-my

hands are so sore and swollen from missing.

Ok That’s my moaning out the way.  I guess I’ll just go back to bed.
I
just

wanna feel good.  I never did Snowballs in company cuz I like to
really
FEEL

it.  My n my friend meditate on it breathing deeply ooooh…… stop

talking.  I’ve been clean before though n life was boring.

I’m not really expecting replies I just wanted to vent.  Basically
just

feeling sorry for myself.  I just feel like this will never end.
I’ll
never

feel good again without drugs of one sort or nother.

I’ll stop now.  I’m gonna make a hot sweet cup of tea.  I’d have a
shower

but I think i’d collapse.  Now I think about it I haven’t eaten since

Wednesday anyway n hardly drtunk anything.  That’s probably why I
feel
so

weak!  I’ll try eat some soup or summat easily digestable.

Thanks for listening.

Hannah

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 1, 2004 at 7:41:12 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Charlie wrote >No offense Julie, but the death toll of this war does not even compare to the hundreds of thousands (some say millions) of innocent Kurds and others this mad man gassed to death.<

Well,
That’s actually very debatable too Charlie. (Besides, when does murder of innocent people actually become ok anyway)?
First of all, it appears that so far, thanks to our invasion, over 100,000 Iraqis have died:

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/6354133/
Study: 100,000 Iraqis died in war, aftermath
Science journal say coalition caused majority of violent deaths
—-

and the allegation that Saddam gassed his own people is one, not something that our own government is unfamiliar with doing to its own people (though granted it was under Clinton this particular incident I report on below happened, but still…):
—-

http://www.drugwar.com/waco.shtm
snip-
“No forensic pathologist who has examined the evidence has found any indication that the teargas killed any Davidian,” notes the Report, “except Dr. Uwe Heinrich, who concluded if people couldn’t leave a room, ‘there is a distinct possibility that this kind of CS exposure can significantly contribute to or even cause death.'” The FBI used 48-hours worth of cs-gas in less than 6 hours, and had to request more. Autopsies found no smoke in many Davidian children’s lungs, proving they’d died before the fire began. Danforth asserts, “some Davidians…could have experienced mild irritation, dizziness, and decreased responsiveness to visual and auditory signals from methylene chloride,” the chemical mixed with CS to spray it in from the tanks. “Many Davidians moved away from exposed rooms…protecting themselves with gas masks and wet towels wrapped around their faces.” As Doyle noted in his 1995 Congressional testimony, water increases the burning from CS. Perhaps if one completely blocks access to all skin with a wet towel it is possible to avoid the worst of the chemical’s effects, but that would necessitate covering one’s eyes, making it hard to escape the fire. The Davidian children had no gasmasks that fit to protect them, so received the full brunt of the gassing.
snip-
—–
and Two, the whole story about Saddam gassing his own people was denied by the US Army War College some years ago:
—–
http://quixote-quest.org/resources/national_international/IraqGasKurds_OilH2O_013103.html
snip-
And the story gets murkier: immediately after the battle the United States Defense Intelligence Agency investigated and produced a classified report, which it circulated within the intelligence community on a need-to-know basis. That study asserted that it was Iranian gas that killed the Kurds, not Iraqi gas.
The agency did find that each side used gas against the other in the battle around Halabja. The condition of the dead Kurds’ bodies, however, indicated they had been killed with a blood agent – that is, a cyanide-based gas – which Iran was known to use. The Iraqis, who are thought to have used mustard gas in the battle, are not known to have possessed blood agents at the time.
snip-
—–

So even that rational for invading Iraq isn’t quite as strong as we’ve been told.
The fact that Saddam wasn’t a nice guy isn’t debatable- but the fact that our govenment and taxes propped him up for years seems to me to make it imperative that we also invade and arrest and try all those, like Rumsfeld, who went and shook hands with Saddam AFTER the allegations of gassing had been made by some (http://www2.gwu.edu/~nsarchiv/NSAEBB/NSAEBB82/), those who supported him over the years, along with all the other despots and maniacs we support(ed) over the years (like Vladimir Montesinos for one other glaring example, of Peru, who isn’t any longer in power but collected over 10 million from US taxpayers over the years, as he armed FARC, the very same guerillas we’ve been paying the Colombian government to wage war on. Neat trick that- arm our enemies then pay to wage war on them- gotta love that market support system). Why haven’t we invaded everywhere else with dictators terrorizing their peoples? I’ll tell you why- because Iraq has oil.
;-((
Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Charliedog43@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 3:55 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

No offense Julie, but the death toll of this war does not even compare to the hundreds of thousands (some say millions) of innocent Kurds and others this mad man gassed to death. Not counting Kuwait, either. Not counting starving his own people while he had a palace on every block. And look who was poised to take over. His mad dog animal sons, who raped women and killed their husbands for fun. And I do believe there are a lot more people than you think that are glad we are there. I think i’d choose free elections and democracy anyday. Get rid of the pockets of insurgents, which will happen, and it will go smoother. We’re better off, they are better off, all of the region is better off. I hope Osama is right behind him rotting in hell. I’ll admit he’s been lucky so far. But his luck will run out, too.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]
Date: November 1, 2004 at 6:42:55 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Mr. Bush is try his radioactive weapon, were else can he try them?<

Did anyone else watch 60 Minutes last night, where they were showing US troops talking about raiding Iraqi tank “graveyards” for armor for their unarmored vehicles?
First thing that popped into my mind was DU. What in the hell is going on here? First we bomb the shit out of innocent Iraqis with depleted uranium, then we send out own poor, undereducated youth to occupy the bombed into shit country, forcing our own troops to scavange for depleted uranium infected armor for their “protection”? EGAD!
Good plan Bush and his stupid supporters.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 10:38 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]

Mr. Bush is try his radioactive weapon, were else can he try them? And on
who? he had to create an enemy to be able to check out the affectivity of
His weapons and his army, and to invest more money into defense and new war
technologies.
You see, mr. Izgy it is an huge industry and they do need the petrol to fly
f-16 and drive those war machines they don’t happened to work on solar
energy.

Bush wants to show the rest of the world his military power, and so he did,
but
Shame on what and who’s account. His own soldiers are suffering from the
same radioactive weapon they are using against their “enemies”.
The whole region is going to die of cancer sooner or later and all the
people who went to Irak will suffer for it too.
This is not a war with sticks this is a war which leaves traces years after
it will be finished.
Mr. bush is suffering from brain damage so he doesn’t even understand
himself, what the hell he is doing in Irak.
If you need to get one man why would you need to have so many soldiers.
For sure the Israelis could trace his phone calls to his wife who is in
Lebanon. That wasn’t too difficult for them to do. They don’t need an army
For that.they don’t need an army to find weapon for mass distraction
Because there was no one who could work this kind of weapon in Irak, without
the
American knowledge who sold it to Sadam in the first place.
Just as well as the pilots terrorist who learn how to fly into the w.t.c
Learn that in the US. how come they didn’t learn to land. what kind of
flying lessons they got?
selling a weapon of mass distraction to a dictator but without instruction
how to use it, and then regret of selling it to him, and go bankruptcy to
get that back.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: FakePlacebo [mailto:fakeplacebo@hotmail.com]
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 15:36
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]

Some Facts about USA:
%3 of worlds population lives in USA but consuming %40 of world wealth,
producing %25 of polutions. There is no mass distraction of weapons in Irak.
Do you think Marins are fighting for USA’s safety? Do you realy believe
this. Is there anyone who can tell me what’s Mr. Bush doing in Irak.
Best Regards
FakePlacebo

—– Original Message —–
From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 3:18 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]

If you consider George Bush a decent human being… maybe you ought to
take a serious look at his track record.

Do you by chance watch FOX News or something?

On Saturday, October 30, 2004, at 02:14 PM, Faith Bowling wrote:

> Our creator, and the decent people in the US are getting very fed up
> of the attacks against the decent.  The weakest, most despicible
> beings there are  are those who feel so safe attacking the good,
> decent people who will stand for the rights of the people who are too
> tiny to vote, those that believe that every human freedom of choice to
> live or die, and has the moxie to fight against terriorism, when it’s
> so unpopular.  No, George Bush speech comes from the heart, and he
> gets emotional.  John Kerry really doesn’t care, sounds like it’s
> memorized.  You had to hear him say that he would use OUR tax money to
> give to some female “being” to murder another human.  I would rather
> not work, than to let any of my money go for this terriorist act,  tha
> John Kerry supports.
>
>> From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
>> Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>> Subject: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]
>> Date: Sat, 30 Oct 2004 11:22:53 -1000
>>
>> He’s been America’s most unorthodox political commentator for more
>> than 30 years. But for Dr Hunter S Thompson the Bush presidency is
>> evil beyond belief – and judgement is nigh
>>
>>
>> 28 October 2004
>>
>>
>> The genetically vicious nature of presidential campaigns in America
>> is too obvious to argue with, but some people call it fun, and I am
>> one of them. Election day – especially when it’s a presidential
>> election – is always a wild and terrifying time for politics junkies,
>> and I am one of those, too. We look forward to major election days
>> like sex addicts look forward to orgies. We are slaves to them.
>>
>> Which is not a bad thing, all in all, for the winners. They are not
>> the ones who bitch and whine about slavery when the votes are finally
>> counted and the losers are forced to get down on their knees. No. The
>> slaves who emerge victorious from these drastic public decisions go
>> crazy with joy and plunge each other into deep tubs of chilled
>> Cristal champagne with naked strangers who want to be close to a
>> winner.
>>
>> That is how it works in the victory business. You see it every time.
>> The weak suck up to the strong, for fear of losing their jobs and
>> money and all the fickle power they wielded only 24 hours ago. It is
>> like suddenly losing your wife and your home in a vagrant poker game,
>> then having to go on the road with whoremongers and beg for your
>> dinner in public. Nobody wants to hire a loser. Right? They stink of
>> doom and defeat.
>>
>> “What is that horrible smell in the office, Tex? It’s making me sick.”
>>
>> “That is the smell of a loser, senator. He came in to apply for a
>> job, but we tossed him out immediately. Sgt Sloat took him down to
>> the parking lot and taught him a lesson he will never forget.”
>>
>> “Good work, Tex. And how are you coming with my new enemies list? I
>> want them all locked up. They are scum.”
>>
>> “We will punish them brutally. They are terrorist sympathisers, and
>> most of them voted against you. I hate those bastards.”
>>
>> “Thank you, Sloat. You are a faithful servant. Come over here and
>> kneel down. I want to reward you.”
>>
>> That is the nature of high-risk politics. Veni, vidi, vici,
>> especially among Republicans. It’s like the ancient Bedouin saying:
>> “As the camel falls to its knees, more knives are drawn.”
>>
>> Presidential politics is a vicious business, even for rich white men,
>> and anybody who gets into it should be prepared to grapple with the
>> meanest of the mean. The White House has never been seized by timid
>> warriors. There are no rules, and the roadside is littered with
>> wreckage. That is why they call it the passing lane. Just ask any
>> candidate who ever ran against George Bush – Al Gore, Ann Richards,
>> John McCain – all of them ambushed and vanquished by lies and dirty
>> tricks. And all of them still whining about it.
>>
>> That is why George W Bush is President of the United States, and Al
>> Gore is not. Bush simply wanted it more, and he was willing to
>> demolish anything that got in his way, including the US Supreme
>> Court. It is not by accident that the Bush White House (read: Dick
>> Cheney & Halliburton Inc) controls all three branches of our federal
>> government today. They are powerful thugs who would far rather die
>> than lose the election in November.
>>
>> The Republican establishment is haunted by painful memories of what
>> happened to Old Man Bush in 1992. He peaked too early, and he had no
>> response to “It’s the economy, stupid.” Which has always been the
>> case. Every GOP administration since 1952 has let the
>> Military-Industrial Complex loot the Treasury and plunge the nation
>> into debt on the excuse of a wartime economic emergency. Richard
>> Nixon comes quickly to mind, along with Ronald Reagan and his
>> ridiculous “trickle-down” theory of US economic policy. If the rich
>> get richer, the theory goes, before long their pots will overflow and

>> somehow “trickle down” to the poor, who would rather eat scraps off
>> the Bush family plates than eat nothing at all. Republicans have
>> never approved of democracy, and they never will. It goes back to
>> pre-industrial America, when only white male property owners could
>> vote.
>>
>> Things haven’t changed much where George W Bush comes from. Houston
>> is a cruel, crazy town on a filthy river in East Texas with no zoning
>> laws and a culture of sex, money and violence. It’s a shabby,
>> sprawling metropolis ruled by brazen women, crooked cops and
>> super-rich pansexual cowboys who live by the code of the West – which
>> can mean just about anything you need it to mean, in a pinch.
>>
>> Houston is also the unnatural home of two out of the last three
>> presidents of the United States of America, for good or ill. The
>> other one was a handsome, sex-crazed boy from next-door Arkansas,
>> which has no laws against any deviant practice not specifically
>> forbidden in the New Testament, including anal incest and public
>> cunnilingus with farm animals.
>>
>> Back in 1948, during his first race for the US Senate, Lyndon Johnson
>> was running about 10 points behind, with only nine days to go. He was
>> desperate. And it was just before noon on a Monday, they say, when he
>> called his equally depressed campaign manager and told him to call a
>> press conference for just before lunch on a slow news day and accuse
>> his high-riding opponent, a pig farmer, of having routine carnal
>> knowledge of his sows, despite the pleas of his wife and children.
>>
>> His campaign manager was shocked. “We can’t say that, Lyndon,” he
>> supposedly said. “You know that it isn’t true.”
>>
>> “Of course it’s not!” Johnson barked. “But let’s make the bastard
>> deny it!”
>>
>> Johnson – a Democrat, like Bill Clinton – won that election by fewer
>> than 100 votes, and after that he was home free. He went on to rule
>> Texas and the US Senate for 20 years and to be the most powerful vice
>> president in the history of the United States. Until now.
>>
>> Armageddon came early for George Bush this year, and he was not ready
>> for it. His long-awaited showdowns with John Kerry turned into a
>> series of embarrassments that broke his nerve and demoralised his
>> closest campaign advisers. They knew he would never recover, no
>> matter how many votes they could steal for him in Florida, where the
>> presidential debates were closely watched and widely celebrated by
>> millions of Kerry supporters who suddenly had reason to feel like
>> winners.
>>
>> Kerry came into October as a five-point underdog with almost no
>> chance of winning three out of three rigged confrontations with a
>> treacherous little freak like George Bush. But the debates are over
>> now, and the victor was John Kerry every time. He steamrollered Bush
>> and left him for roadkill.
>>
>> Did you see Bush on TV, trying to debate? Jesus, he talked like a
>> donkey with no brains at all. The tide turned early, in Coral Gables,
>> when Bush went belly up less than halfway through his first bout with
>> Kerry, who hammered poor George into jelly. It was pitiful… I
>> almost felt sorry for him, until I heard someone call him “Mister
>> President”, and then I felt ashamed.
>>
>> Karl Rove, the President’s political wizard, felt even worse. There
>> is angst in the heart of Texas today, and panic in the bowels of the
>> White House. Rove has a nasty little problem, and its name is George
>> Bush. The president failed miserably from the instant he got onstage
>> with John Kerry. He looked weak and dumb. Kerry beat him like a gong
>> in Coral Gables, then again in St Louis and Tempe. That is Rove’s
>> problem. His candidate is a weak-minded frat boy who cracks under
>> pressure in front of 60 million voters.
>>
>> Bush signed his own death warrant in the opening round, when he
>> finally had to speak without his teleprompter. It was a Cinderella
>> story brought up to date in Florida that night – except this time,
>> the false prince turned back into a frog.
>>
>> Immediately after the first debate ended, I called Muhammad Ali at
>> his home in Michigan, but whoever answered said the champ was
>> laughing so hard that he couldn’t come to the phone. “The debate
>> really cracked him up,” he chuckled. “The champ loves a good
>> ass-whuppin’. He says Bush looked so scared to fight, he finally just
>> quit and laid down.”
>>
>> This year’s first presidential debate was such a disaster for George
>> Bush that his handlers had to be crazy to let him get in the ring
>> with John Kerry again. Yet Karl Rove let it happen, and we can only
>> wonder why. But there is no doubt that the president has lost his
>> nerve, and his career in the White House is finished. No mas.
>>
>> Indeed. The numbers are weird today, and so is this dangerous
>> election. The time has come to rumble, to inject a bit of fun into
>> politics. That’s exactly what the debates did. John Kerry looked like
>> a winner, and it energised his troops. Voting for Kerry is starting
>> to look like serious fun for everyone except poor George, who now
>> looks like a loser. That is fatal in a presidential election.
>>
>> I look at elections with the cool and dispassionate gaze of a
>> professional gambler, especially when I’m betting real money on the
>> outcome. Contrary to most conventional wisdom, I see Kerry with five
>> points as a recommended risk. Kerry will win this election, if it
>> happens, by a bigger margin than Bush finally gouged out of Florida
>> in 2000. That was about 46 per cent, plus five points for owning the
>> US Supreme Court – which seemed to equal 51 per cent. Nobody really
>> believed that, but George W Bush moved into the White House anyway.
>>
>> It was the most brutal seizure of power since Hitler burned the
>> Reichstag in 1933 and declared himself the new boss of Germany. Karl
>> Rove is no stranger to Nazi strategy, if only because it worked for a
>> while, and it was sure fun for Hitler. But not for long. He ran out
>> of oil, the whole world hated him, and he liked to gobble pure
>> crystal biphetamine and stay awake for eight days in a row with his
>> maps and bombers and his dope-addled general staff.
>>
>> They all loved the whiff. It is the perfect drug for war, as long as
>> you are winning, and Hitler thought he was king of the hill forever.
>> He had created a new master race, and every one of them worshipped
>> him. They were fanatics. That was 66 years ago, and things are not
>> much different today. We still love war.
>>
>> George Bush certainly does. In four short years he has turned our
>> country from a prosperous nation at peace into a desperately indebted
>> nation at war. But so what? He is the President of the United States,
>> and you’re not. Love it or leave it.
>>
>> BULLETIN: KERRY WINS GONZO ENDORSEMENT; DR THOMPSON JOINS DEMOCRAT IN
>> CALLING BUSH “THE SYPHILIS PRESIDENT”.
>>
>> “Four more years of George Bush will be like four more years of
>> syphilis,” the famed author said yesterday at a hastily called press
>> conference near his home in Woody Creek, Colorado.
>>
>> “Only a fool or a sucker would vote for a dangerous loser like Bush.
>> He hates everything we stand for, and he knows we will vote against
>> him in November.” Thompson, well known for the eerie accuracy of his
>> political instincts, went on to denounce Ralph Nader as “a worthless
>> Judas goat with no moral compass.”
>>
>> “I endorsed John Kerry a long time ago,” he said, “and I will do
>> everything in my power, short of roaming the streets with a meat
>> hammer, to help him be the next president of the United States.”
>>
>> Which is true. I said all those things, and I will say them again. Of
>> course I will vote for John Kerry. I have known him for 30 years as a
>> good man with a brave heart – which is more than even the President’s
>> friends will tell you about George W Bush, who is also an old
>> acquaintance from the white-knuckle days of yesteryear. He is hated
>> all over the world, including large parts of Texas, and he is taking
>> us all down with him. Bush is a natural-born loser with a filthy-rich
>> daddy who pimped his son out to rich oil-mongers. He hates music,
>> football and sex, and he is no fun at all.
>>
>> I voted for Ralph Nader in 2000, but I won’t make that mistake again.
>> The joke is over for Nader. He was funny once, but now he belongs to
>> the dead. Nader is a fool, as is anybody who votes for him in
>> November – with the obvious exception of professional Republicans who
>> have paid big money to turn him into a world-famous Judas goat. Nader
>> is so desperate that he’s paying homeless people to gather signatures
>> to get him on the ballot. In Pennsylvania, the petitions he submitted
>> contained tens of thousands of phoney signatures, including Fred
>> Flintstone, Mickey Mouse and John Kerry. A judge dumped Ralph from
>> the ballot there, calling it “the most deceitful and fraudulent
>> exercise ever perpetrated upon this court”.
>>
>> But they will keep his name on the ballot in the long-suffering
>> Hurricane State, which is ruled by the President’s younger brother,
>> Jeb, who also wants to be the next president of the United States. In
>> 2000, when they sent Jim Baker to Florida, I knew it was all over. In
>> that election, 97,488 people voted for Nader in Florida, and Gore
>> lost the state by 537 votes. You don’t have to be from Texas to
>> understand the moral of that story. It’s like being out-coached in
>> the Super Bowl. Only losers play fair, and all winners have blood on
>> their hands.
>>
>> Back in June, when John Kerry was beginning to feel like a winner, we
>> had a quick rendezvous on a rain-soaked runway in Aspen, Colorado,
>> where he was scheduled to meet a harem of wealthy campaign
>> contributors. I told him that Bush’s vicious goons in the White House
>> are perfectly capable of assassinating Nader and blaming it on him.
>> His staff laughed, but the Secret Service men didn’t. Kerry suggested
>> I might make a good running mate, and we reminisced about trying to
>> end the Vietnam War in 1972.
>>
>> That was the year I first met him, at a riot on that elegant little
>> street in front of the White House. He was yelling into a bullhorn
>> and I was trying to throw a dead rat over a black-spike fence and on
>> to the President’s lawn. We were angry and righteous in those days,
>> and there were millions of us. We kicked two chief executives out
>> because they were stupid warmongers. We conquered Lyndon Johnson and
>> we stomped on Richard Nixon – which wise people said was impossible,
>> but so what? It was fun. We were warriors then, and our tribe was
>> strong like a river. That river is still running. All we have to do
>> is get out and vote, while it’s still legal, and we will wash those
>> crooked warmongers out of the White House.
>>
>>
>
> _________________________________________________________________
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT!) Re: abortion bad, bombing good
Date: November 1, 2004 at 6:39:30 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth,
by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they
will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant
they can’t see it.<

Yes Faith,
Thank Goodness for Bush, who according to the above sentence is just like all other prohibitionist, fearmongering, warprofiteering maniacs. I’d hate to be against someone who has my better interests in mind, even if I’m unaware of what they are.
I understand you aren’t going to change your mind, but Bush is dropping bombs on people who had not attacked us nor had not only no plans to but no way to do so, at least not that would be stopped by invading their country. How in the heck that is “moral” is beyond me. How people can so willingly support ever more murder is just stupid to me- especially when his supporters throw in such commentary as:

Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a
terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s
womb.<

So, partial birth abortion is not cool, but dropping bombs on fully developed, innocent adult and children ferriners IS cool? How in the hell does this equate in your mind?
Egad.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Faith Bowling” <bchloej@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 9:53 AM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas

I a can tell you why.
Because George Bush is strong and has high morals and ethics, and he won’t sink to the level to “talk purdy” and say whatever someone wants to hear to get a vote.  You can tell a person’s level of moral development, and worth, by how they take up for those who can’t take up for themselves, and how they will do the right things for people even though those people are so ignorant they can’t see it.  Anyone who will vote for partial-birth abortion is a terriorist.  The safest place for a human on earth should be it’s Maother’s womb.
From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Carla, re: George Bush, the fascist capitalist dictator from Texas
Date: Sun, 31 Oct 2004 06:30:09 -0800 (PST)

Carla,

I agree.  We Canadians are avidly following the
election, because we also fear another four years with
that inbred, uncultured redneck.  Personally, I can’t
imagine why any intelligent person would cast a vote
for that wanker(Bush).  There will be street parties
in Toronto if Kerry takes the election.

George Bush is a LIAR, a MANIPULATOR, and a complete
and utter sham.  He and Cheney need to stick to the
skin bars, and leave the decision making to a more
competent individual.  Kerry may not be perfect, but
at least his main concern isn’t enriching his fat cat
prick friends.

Faith, have you seen Fahrenheit 9/11?

Julie

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]
Date: November 1, 2004 at 6:16:29 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ahhh,
Personal perspective rears its lovely head.
Again personally, I was spritually moved, not to mention highly inspired, by HST’s writing, always was and still find myself moved occasionally by current HST writing too, occasionally.
If it weren’t for HST, I  might nota ever realized that I too could do a lot of drugs and travel, write about it, and make a living doing so.
So, I guess it depends upon what one’s view of “spiritual” is.
;l0)))
Just sayin.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 12:38 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]

I never found anything spiritual about the way HST did or wrote about acid. He belittled a holy sacrament with alcohol and other dark molecules and let a whole generation to beleive that is was cool to take acid a act like a dick head.

Shiva dances and Hunter prances

Ibo trances

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]
Date: November 1, 2004 at 6:12:30 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Just a…”

Personally? I don’t think HST is Every going to be “Just” anything.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 12:31 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]

HST is now just a rich bald dude living the mega rich life in Aspen

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]
Date: November 1, 2004 at 6:11:30 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lets all take ibogaine and go dancing.<

Everybody come dancin’, it’s only natural.
;-0)))
To coin a phrase.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: D H
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, October 30, 2004 11:23 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] H.S.Thompson [OT]

Screw Herman Munster (Kerry) and the infamous Hunter S. Thompson. Just exercising my rights. Carry on.

I’d rather not screw either one even though I highly respect Mr Thompson for decades of excellent writing. Although reading Fear & Loathing at age 11 gave me a twisted outlook, it sure beat the puritanical/hypocritical/Fear Based view my parents offered (kind of like the view that Bushco broadcasts… FEAR, HIPPOCRACY AND FAITH-BASED POLITICS (and some good-old (white) boy corporate back scratching). – I can’t imagine anything worse to control all 3 branches of government.

I am leary of ALL politicians, most especially those from Texas.

random thoughts:

I think Kerry looks more like Lurch.

A vote for Bush is a vote for Fascism.

Lets all take ibogaine and go dancing.

_.dh

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From: D H <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 1, 2004 at 2:24:35 PM EST
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Fake Placebo,

The united states is the leading manufacturer of weapons of mass destruction. General Electric has many patents on devices of destruction, with new and exciting ways to reap death and destruction on the drawing board. Remember GE’s Mantra: “GE we bring good things to living, we bring good things to life”?.  How sickly in- appropriate.

Most missiles built today in the USA are made of armor/bunker piercing heavy metals like Depleted Uranium. Relatively benign in solid form, DU’s toxicity is released when the bomb explodes, incinerating itself into the air, water and soil for generations to come. I am sad for the generations to come that inherit this deathly legacy, not only the Iraqi people but also the Afghanis, the Chechnians and all of the soldier pawns in the elite’s modern game of chess.

They have also developed a weapon to use on the citizens of the united states. It is a weapon of mass distraction called FOX News. Investigative reporting is a foreign concept to these pundits who spin the ultra-right agenda, all wrapped up and packaged with stunning graphics as “Fair & Balanced”. The scary thing is how effective this weapon is on people who refuse to think for themselves or question what is offered as truth. There are still FOX viewers who believe Saddam was behind the attacks on 9-11. (to see the reach of Fox’s Tentacles, see: http://www.cjr.org/tools/owners/newscorp.asp)

The Bush Administration operates under the cloak of bringing democracy to the middle east, yet ignores democracy on its own soil, in its never ending quest for the control of oil.

_.dh

On Monday, November 1, 2004, at 08:41 AM, FakePlacebo wrote:

I did not mean this; I asked where is the weapons of mass dist.. now. Reason of USA. Where is the democracy. Is there any chemical weapons in USA? Did USA use chemical weapons in Wietnam? Who developed chemical weapons and let Saddam use it againest Iran. (not only kurds)

What about the USA soldiers dying because of Sabot nuclear weapons. One nation killing own soldiers why??? for what? For freedom? I don’t believe this.

What is the connection Enron, Bush family, Iraq. Why peoples dying for money?

—– Original Message —–
From: Charliedog43@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 12:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

 

France and Russia

Iraq did most of its killing using Russian-made MiG and Sukhoi aircraft equipped with chemical sprayers. In addition, Saddam used French-made artillery and helicopters to dump gas on the Iranians and his own people.

The 155mm shell found outside of Baghdad airport was made for Iraq’s arsenal of French made artillery. Clearly, the shell was designed to meet French military standards to fire and used advanced safety techniques to protect Iraqi gunners.

It was that safety technique, of separating the nerve gas into two inert chemicals, and placing them in two chambers inside the shell, that foiled the terrorist attack. The “binary” chemical weapons design has a metal or plastic diaphragm designed to keep the two inert chemicals apart until the massive force or shock of firing it down a cannon bursts the wall, allowing the chemicals to mix.

Ironically, the binary weapons design originated inside the former Soviet Union. Saddam Hussein rose to power backed by Russian weapons and Russian money. Saddam still owes Moscow over $8 billion for the arms he purchased from Russia.

The primary Iraqi chemical weapons are nerve gas and mustard gas, a blistering agent, standard equipment for the 1980s Soviet era military machine.

According to “Russian Military Power” published in 1982, “It is known that the Soviets maintain stocks of CW (chemical weapons) agents.” The two primary Russian chemical weapons in the 1982 Soviet inventory were “nerve” gas and “blistering agents – developments of mustard gas used so effectively in World War I.”

Iraq obtained Russian chemical delivery systems and the same inventory of Russian made chemical weapons at the same time. Iraqi SU-22 Fitter attack jets have been armed with Warsaw Pact designed bombs filled with chemical weapons.

Iraq used these Russian jet fighters to drop chemical weapons on Iranian troops during the Iran/Iraq war. Iraq tried to use these SU-22 jets during the 1991 Gulf war and was foiled by the allied air superiority.

From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 1, 2004 at 1:41:53 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I did not mean this; I asked where is the weapons of mass dist.. now. Reason of USA. Where is the democracy. Is there any chemical weapons in USA? Did USA use chemical weapons in Wietnam? Who developed chemical weapons and let Saddam use it againest Iran. (not only kurds)

What about the USA soldiers dying because of Sabot nuclear weapons. One nation killing own soldiers why??? for what? For freedom? I don’t believe this.

What is the connection Enron, Bush family, Iraq. Why peoples dying for money?
—– Original Message —–
From: Charliedog43@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, November 01, 2004 12:28 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

France and Russia
Iraq did most of its killing using Russian-made MiG and Sukhoi aircraft equipped with chemical sprayers. In addition, Saddam used French-made artillery and helicopters to dump gas on the Iranians and his own people.
The 155mm shell found outside of Baghdad airport was made for Iraq’s arsenal of French made artillery. Clearly, the shell was designed to meet French military standards to fire and used advanced safety techniques to protect Iraqi gunners.
It was that safety technique, of separating the nerve gas into two inert chemicals, and placing them in two chambers inside the shell, that foiled the terrorist attack. The “binary” chemical weapons design has a metal or plastic diaphragm designed to keep the two inert chemicals apart until the massive force or shock of firing it down a cannon bursts the wall, allowing the chemicals to mix.
Ironically, the binary weapons design originated inside the former Soviet Union. Saddam Hussein rose to power backed by Russian weapons and Russian money. Saddam still owes Moscow over $8 billion for the arms he purchased from Russia.
The primary Iraqi chemical weapons are nerve gas and mustard gas, a blistering agent, standard equipment for the 1980s Soviet era military machine.
According to “Russian Military Power” published in 1982, “It is known that the Soviets maintain stocks of CW (chemical weapons) agents.” The two primary Russian chemical weapons in the 1982 Soviet inventory were “nerve” gas and “blistering agents – developments of mustard gas used so effectively in World War I.”
Iraq obtained Russian chemical delivery systems and the same inventory of Russian made chemical weapons at the same time. Iraqi SU-22 Fitter attack jets have been armed with Warsaw Pact designed bombs filled with chemical weapons.
Iraq used these Russian jet fighters to drop chemical weapons on Iranian troops during the Iran/Iraq war. Iraq tried to use these SU-22 jets during the 1991 Gulf war and was foiled by the allied air superiority.

From: “FakePlacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 1, 2004 at 12:40:18 PM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you Sara; You said what’s in my heart.

Best Regards
FakePlacebo
—– Original Message —–
From: Sara Glatt
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, October 31, 2004 8:40 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

Ok. But in India 2,000,000 women get raped buy police officers each year when they come to ask for help.
after getting the dowry many are killed by the own new husband.
Many women sleep on a small cloth on the streets, breast feed on the street, beg for food and have no health care or education.
They are sold to prostitution houses. And get bitten by their owner.
in Ethiopia woman die after being circumcised with rusty razor blades, people are barbaric towards women all over the world,
They always have been, even in the Netherlands. it all come down to sex, abuse, and  men who like to think of themselves as superior to women.

Van: Charliedog43@aol.com [mailto:Charliedog43@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 19:10
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

Yes sir, what opportunities for women abound in IRAQ.
After the 1991 Gulf War and economic embargos were applied, living conditions for women in Iraq began to deteriorate. The declining economy caused many women to lose their jobs and abandon their education. Girls and women today are now facing a major learning gap and there has been a sharp decline in adult female literacy. Many women in Iraq now focus all their efforts in search of food and clean water to ensure their family’s survival. Some women have even resorted to prostitution to provide for their children and families.
Current Status of Women in Iraq
The movement for women in Iraw has greatly suffered due to sanctions and anti-women legislation imposed by Hussein’s regime since the mid-90s. Under Islamic law, the punishment for a women who commits adultery is death. But women in Iraq are also being murdered for fighting with their husbands, having a relationship with a man outside marriage, and for being raped, because this brings shame on the family. Women have been stoned to death in public, disabled, disfigured and/or kidnapped. Women have even been kept hostage in their own homes.
According to the Iraq Foundation Web site “The rights of women in Iraq are going down the drain, along with everything else … In 1998, Saddam ordered all women secretaries working in government agencies be dismissed. Now there are new laws barring women from work altogether.”

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?
Date: November 1, 2004 at 4:43:49 AM EST
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes, but the enemy always can sell it to the Russians, that are not that stupid. they will pay an American spy to get the knowledge.
Someone like James Bond, or Rambo.
Van: Charliedog43@aol.com [mailto:Charliedog43@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zondag 31 oktober 2004 23:39
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [Ibogaine] Why wasn’t this is the news?

We sell weapons to our ally’s everyday. 10 years they are your enemy. Got to make sure you have he dominant weapons and the best pilots,trainers, and ways to incompacitate the weapons you sold if need be. And spare parts. Billion dollar weapons ain’t worth squat without the right technology or spare part.

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