Ibogaine List Archives – 2004-05

From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] ibogaine therapy
Date: May 31, 2004 at 10:44:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Bwiti, Gabon, very expensive.”

Not really, incl plane, initiation $2,000 and up. If you are going for spiritual reasons why not do it with the folk who do it for spiritual?  Much better. Probablly very tough for someone strung out to get there though…

best on your journey….

_________________________________________________________________
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From: Maryditton@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine therapy
Date: May 31, 2004 at 9:45:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Andy,

Try Eric Taub – do a search under his name.  Howard Lotsof once recommended him to me as being reputable.  Best of luck and give up on convincing your son to try iboga or ibogaine – all you can do is lead the horse to water.  I advise against offering to pay for his trip.  Let him ask you for a loan.

Sincerely,
MC

From: Ambeatty@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine therapy
Date: May 31, 2004 at 9:04:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have read the online information about many of the ibogaine therapy places,
all the ones I can find. They all sound really nice and offer a lot.
I can’t afford so much. Can’t save, and need to go this summer. I’m looking
into the Vancouver Iboga Therapy House. I wonder what else anyone can tell me.
I am not into heavy drugs and so am mainly concerned with the psycho-spiritual
effects. I think some places have eliminated that part (St. Kitts?). I don’t
know how expensive the place in Holland is. I can borrow money for a plane
ticket from US east coast, hotel, a little more because I want to contribute.
I am hoping my son will decide to take ibogaine so I have to try to pay for
that too. He might need more than one, but then maybe he can pay his own way
after the first. Thing is, multi-thousand dollar treatment is way beyond us.
Of course my fantasy trip is to the Bwiti, Gabon, very expensive.
And I need to go soon.
Andy

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From: Ambeatty@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 31, 2004 at 7:16:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

They say that ibogaine hits both the physiological and psychological aspects
of addiction.
And aren’t they actually inseparable in us? So as ibogaine cleanses the
neural transmitters or fatty places where heroin attaches it sets off all the
visuals and accompanying insights, in a wonderful cycle. Right? or maybe the other
way around.
There are documented experiments that affirm the ability of mind action to
alter the chemical balance of the body. Isn’t this how healing works? Laughter,
etc.
DNA stuff is relatively new, and we don’t know a lot still. There are levels
of genetic programming, not all inherited either; for instance, disabled
people, like retarded. And we see how different conditioning makes their lives more
or less interesting,  useful and loving.
What I’m getting at is that addiction probably isn’t just genetic. There are
so many subtle behaviors passed down in families. Not that any behaviors are
easy to change. Focusing on genetics seems to lean toward hopelessness and
determinism. Using your intelligence to try to change for the better may be the
best game around, win or lose.
I affirm free will.
Andy

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] free will.
Date: May 31, 2004 at 6:37:54 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As a treatment provider I sometimes send to this list short reports about people who I do Ibo.
Treatments with.

Here again is a report , not a medical  professional one but few things to think about.

At this moment I ‘m with an Heroin methadone addict who is already on 6th day treatment.

Everything goes as normal , some weak moments but  , the guy was afraid that if it will not work for him
He should have some Heroin with him, I told him that if he feels that bad he could take a small amount
And see how it feels, not straight after or during I’m talking about the 5th day, but he just didn’t care, he still have the same  little heroin with him but isn’t interested to use it, his fear was gone as he said to me after a long talk .
He is happy not to have the fear and I’m happy to see it is true.

Sara

From: Ambeatty@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 31, 2004 at 10:35:53 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am trying to listen to what my son says he wants.
Often he wants to quit heroin. He wants to use methadone as a prevention. He
was on it for about a week before he was arrested on an old warrant. His
personality had normalized. He was very happy. I drove him to the clinic most
mornings, 25 miles away (but it’s in the city where I work). The schedule we were
tied to was grueling. He was supposed to taper off within 2 years. From my
perspective, it didn’t seem to me that he was off anything. I was worried about
the extreme addictiveness of methadone. Now, on this list, I am hearing about a
sexual side effect that I don’t think he will like at all, but, of course, I
have also read about ways to deal with it. Ibogaine seems to offer a chance for
greater personal freedom and opportunities for choice.
Andy

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 31, 2004 at 10:34:52 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Various forms in various people”, how true.  I have been around family members with these problems all
my life.  Starting with my father, next a sister, husband (father of my three sons) and now my wonderful
kid.  All with individual personalities but with a common problem.

I don’t know how much people other than me think about the physiological side of addiction?  This is
why I have so much hope for the actions of Ibogaine on the nervous system.  If you stop to think about
it, the impact of Ibogaine on Howard’s nervous system was enough to bring about a big change even
tho that was not the effect he was seeking.  I don’t see how a try at embracing the Bwiti would be
wrong even tho the person trying it may not see the connection before trying it.  Few people that I know consider
this aspect (genetics) as being a part of this scene.  I am not discounting the talking therapies
but have watched many kinds of therapists working to the best of their ability to instill motivation
in the client with little success.

I have three adult sons and three grandsons (no little girls up in heaven when I put in my orders).  My
three grandsons have been diagnosed as Hyperactive and all three are taking medicines to help them
sit still and focus in school.  I recognized this problem in my three sons and went from therapist to
therapist asking about it.  I have been an avid reader all my life and had learned about ADDH.  We
tried every method suggested by the professionals from family group (role playing) to you name it.
Not many knew anything about this condition – none that I saw.  Minimal Brain Dysfunction was the
name it went by in the early days.  I found the book by Paul Wender and bought it, read it.  I still
have the book.

Forgive the long post… but I feel this is so important.

ann
think@francomm.com
—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 31, 2004 8:18 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help

Re:Ambeatty, I feel for your situation ma’am and I don’t think I have anything more insightful to say than what many others said except I do know there is no way keep somebody on a path. You can put them on a path to anywhere, but where they go from there,unfortunately is out of your control. I know this: at age 49, having used and abused every drug one can but falling in ecstatic love with smack, the only thing that helped me was therapy that used other drugs to replace the ones I was self medicating with. It’s so hard to fight this demon because it really does take various forms in various people.  I would say if your son is not too motivated for Ibogaine, go with Harm Reduction. Methadone, anti-depressants, vitamins, herbs, ANYTHING that will help him find his own path to not indulge.

I don’t want to sound mushy but I cried when I read your story because ….it was…it is my story. Though I have been on my own for many, many years, my mother has literally done anything and everything to help me stop getting high. You know what works best? It’s not an answer you wish to hear but when I decided it was time to stop, I stopped. But even then, I’ve been on methadone for 23+ years. I’m hoping like the majority of us that one day, I can afford to go to where the treatment is and hope and pray. If you and/or your son wish to further talk, please do, but this is a great site with alot of intelligent people. Keep reading and have your son read. You just never know what can happen!

My Very Best,
Julian

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 31, 2004 at 8:18:18 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Re:Ambeatty, I feel for your situation ma’am and I don’t think I have anything more insightful to say than what many others said except I do know there is no way keep somebody on a path. You can put them on a path to anywhere, but where they go from there,unfortunately is out of your control. I know this: at age 49, having used and abused every drug one can but falling in ecstatic love with smack, the only thing that helped me was therapy that used other drugs to replace the ones I was self medicating with. It’s so hard to fight this demon because it really does take various forms in various people.  I would say if your son is not too motivated for Ibogaine, go with Harm Reduction. Methadone, anti-depressants, vitamins, herbs, ANYTHING that will help him find his own path to not indulge.

I don’t want to sound mushy but I cried when I read your story because ….it was…it is my story. Though I have been on my own for many, many years, my mother has literally done anything and everything to help me stop getting high. You know what works best? It’s not an answer you wish to hear but when I decided it was time to stop, I stopped. But even then, I’ve been on methadone for 23+ years. I’m hoping like the majority of us that one day, I can afford to go to where the treatment is and hope and pray. If you and/or your son wish to further talk, please do, but this is a great site with alot of intelligent people. Keep reading and have your son read. You just never know what can happen!

My Very Best,
Julian

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 31, 2004 at 7:16:20 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all. When I sent my post out asking if anybody was out there I had just learned that my plans for Ibogaine treatments had just been nuked out of existance. I forgot my manners and didn’t thank Dave for the killer post he put up. Thanx Dave. Your writing was just what I needed to see. I’m going to have to start saving money for a trip to Holland or Mexico if I want to get treatments before September. I guess I’m in very good company with Callie in starting an Ibogaine savings. Anything worth doing is worth waiting for. Matter of fact, I think my treatments will mean more to me if I have to do some more saving and creative thinking to get where I need to be. Acceptance is the key. The powers behind Ibogaine know what I need to go through to make this stick so I have to accept this and go on and work harder to get it. Thank you all for being here and showing me the way. One day I will be able to post this 11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111 and really know what it means.

Randy

From: “Tommy” <tgoodson7@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] urine testing
Date: May 30, 2004 at 4:58:35 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It seems to me that some time ago, maybe a couple of years ago, I remember the subject of drug test for Ibogaine came up.  It seems that there was no specific test of any kind, urine or otherwise, available to test
for IBOGAINE.  If you think back can anyone remember any arrest for possession of IBOGAINE.  It seems that there was ONE BIG arrest at one time for possession of Ibogaine.

I do not remember when, where, who, or any particular details concerning the bust.  I remember that Howard Lotsoff was relieved of a stash of Ibogaine by some smart aleck D.E.A. boys back in the 60’s.

Now my memory aint what it used to be; I am 80 years old now.  You people may not want to rely on my account but I have seen no other account so
you might be stuck with my story; you gotta admit it is better than none at
all!!!

I think Howard Lotsoff can probably come up with something better than
my version; how about it, Howard???  And then there is Patrick Kroupa and Preston Peet, both of whom always seem to well informed.

Well have fun with it!!!

Tommy Goodson
—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, May 29, 2004 9:50 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] urine testing

In a message dated 5/29/2004 4:06:57 PM Central Daylight Time, dave@phantom.com writes:

Otherwise, I
understand urine tests cost some $.

you can buy a drug test for urine at Walgreens. It checks for routine drugs that are usually screened for.
Callie

From: NoahPotter@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] wow…ibogaine in Israel….
Date: May 29, 2004 at 11:12:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I don’t think anyone mentioned the paper’s name. For those interested,
Hebrew-readers or otherwise, it’s the weekend edition of Yedioth Aharanoth. The
article is in the insert called Sheva Yomim on page 20.

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] urine testing
Date: May 29, 2004 at 10:50:40 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/29/2004 4:06:57 PM Central Daylight Time, dave@phantom.com writes:

Otherwise, I
understand urine tests cost some $.

you can buy a drug test for urine at Walgreens. It checks for routine drugs that are usually screened for.
Callie

From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] urine testing
Date: May 29, 2004 at 5:04:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well, that demonstrates dedication of ibogaine takers.  But, does not
respond
to the question of whether ibogaine will show cross positive for other
substances in a standard urine test.  That is the information I am looking
for.
Thanks.

Howard

well, one way to find out… drop a test dose and have your urine tested
for the standard drug screening to check for cross-positives. Applying
for a job that does drug screening would be the free route. Otherwise, I
understand urine tests cost some $.

of course that test dose would have to be done outside of USA borders…
:^)

-dh

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From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 29, 2004 at 2:44:47 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“What I forgot to mention before is thus: Ibogaine is just the begining.”

: )

—–Original Message—–
From: D H [mailto:dave@phantom.com]

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From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] urine testing
Date: May 29, 2004 at 1:47:10 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/29/04 5:00:18 PM, dave@phantom.com writes:

<<

No. they dont look for Ibogaine in a standard test.

(BUT IF)

they will be happy to find it , extract it and use it for the next
patient,

we wouldnt need to go to Africa if we just could get it from each other

urine,

that is very ecological.

Sara

Providers… Save the Puke! you can extract Ibogaine (HCL) out of vomit

as well.

I blew chunks 2 hours into my first dose… and 740mgs of Ibo was

extracted out of it.

Which I re-ingested a week later.

yum!

Well, that demonstrates dedication of ibogaine takers.  But, does not
respond
to the question of whether ibogaine will show cross positive for other
substances in a standard urine test.  That is the information I am looking
for.
Thanks.

Howard

sorry , I dont have the answer.

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] urine testing
Date: May 29, 2004 at 1:41:23 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/29/04 5:00:18 PM, dave@phantom.com writes:

<<

No. they dont look for Ibogaine in a standard test.

(BUT IF)

they will be happy to find it , extract it and use it for the next patient,

we wouldnt need to go to Africa if we just could get it from each other

urine,

that is very ecological.

Sara

Providers… Save the Puke! you can extract Ibogaine (HCL) out of vomit

as well.

I blew chunks 2 hours into my first dose… and 740mgs of Ibo was

extracted out of it.

Which I re-ingested a week later.

yum!

Well, that demonstrates dedication of ibogaine takers.  But, does not respond
to the question of whether ibogaine will show cross positive for other
substances in a standard urine test.  That is the information I am looking for.
Thanks.

Howard

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From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] urine testing
Date: May 29, 2004 at 12:57:51 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

No. they dont look for Ibogaine in a standard test.
(BUT IF)
they will be happy to find it , extract it and use it for the next patient,
we wouldnt need to go to Africa if we just could get it from each other
urine,
that is very ecological.
Sara

Providers… Save the Puke! you can extract Ibogaine (HCL) out of vomit
as well.

I blew chunks 2 hours into my first dose… and 740mgs of Ibo was
extracted out of it.

Which I re-ingested a week later.

yum!

-DH

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From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 29, 2004 at 12:52:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On 5/29/2004, “Ambeatty@aol.com” <Ambeatty@aol.com> wrote:
I’m encouraged by DH’s description of the ibogaine trip. What helps the
recovery period? Vitamins, energy drinks, protein? Sleep? I have the summer off,
need to go back to work in the fall. How long is the recovery?

Recovery time varies from person to person… as Howard sez it is all a
very individual thing. Someone coming off years of Methadone compared to
someone quiting nicotine will most likely experience very different
“recovery” times.

What I forgot to mention before is thus: Ibogaine is just the begining.
What you do for yourself post-ibo is just as important, if not more!
Healthy Diet, Excercise, Sleep habits, social interaction; these are all
important areas to work on. Talk is great too, wether it is here or in a
therapists chair or with whomever will listen. If none of the above are
happening, writing is really good too. My personal experience has
benefited from aletrnative therapist/shaman work. Excercise is really
really important, especially for the opiate addicts, getting those
natural endorphins up and running helps TREMENDOUSLY. which is typically
Cardio work outs. If you have health issues consult a professional.

Having some time off post ibogaine… is great. Take advantage of that. A
lot of people do not have that luxury.

peace,
-DH

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From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] urine testing
Date: May 29, 2004 at 12:34:56 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Here is an interesting question.  Does ibogaine show up in a standard
urine
test and as what?  Patient and provider responses appreciated.

Howard

No. they dont look for Ibogaine in a standard test.
(BUT IF)
they will be happy to find it , extract it and use it for the next patient,
we wouldnt need to go to Africa if we just could get it from each other
urine,
that is very ecological.
Sara

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 29, 2004 at 10:46:19 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

**See below

Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help

In a message dated 5/29/04 9:35:42 AM, Ambeatty@aol.com writes:

<< I’m encouraged by DH’s description of the ibogaine trip. What helps the
recovery period? Vitamins, energy drinks, protein? Sleep? I have the
summer
off,
need to go back to work in the fall. How long is the recovery?
<snip>

Have recently found very encouraging info saying that most addicts quit on
their own, choose it, outgrow it (as you said). I want to encourage this
process
as much as possible.
Andy >>

Andy,

On recovery, it is a very individual thing.  And remember, recovery is not
only different for different people but, different for the same person
depending
on drugs used and state of health.  Whatever is good for you without
ibogaine
is good for you with ibogaine.  What is interesting is that the ibogaine
experience will allow you to understand what is good for you and what is
not.
That is one of the other things that makes it so interesting whether you
take
drugs or not.  If you take it and understand it, which is most likely, you
can
tell you son that it is one damn good drug…wow!  “Take it or not at your
discretion.” It is there. Drug users tend to listen to other drug users.
You should
realize that the majority of persons dependent on drugs will need a number
of
ibogaine treatments over time to benefit fully from its effects and that
time
period  is variable to the individual.  Ibogaine is good medicine but,
like
all medicine, shamanic or western, should be anticipated to provide
individual
responses between patients/initiates and even in the same person at
different
times though its ability to eliminate narcotic withdrawal can only be
described as awesome.

**You are the one person who has profitted by experience.  You weren’t
really
trying to “get off” of anything, only looking for the psychodelic experience
when
you took your first dose of ibogaine.  I can only say, thank God the dose
was
large enough to cause the optimal effect (serendipity at work?) and that you
were able to understand what must have happened and the intellectual
curiosity
to put it to the test over and over again.  Some things really do happen by
chance.

ann
think@francomm.com

On the growing out of it issue.  The answer is yes.  Addicts grow out of
it
but, some don’t and it can be a decades long process.

Regards,

Howard

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] urine testing
Date: May 29, 2004 at 9:58:30 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Here is an interesting question.  Does ibogaine show up in a standard urine
test and as what?  Patient and provider responses appreciated.

Howard

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 29, 2004 at 9:33:29 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/29/04 9:35:42 AM, Ambeatty@aol.com writes:

<< I’m encouraged by DH’s description of the ibogaine trip. What helps the
recovery period? Vitamins, energy drinks, protein? Sleep? I have the summer
off,
need to go back to work in the fall. How long is the recovery?
<snip>

Have recently found very encouraging info saying that most addicts quit on
their own, choose it, outgrow it (as you said). I want to encourage this
process
as much as possible.
Andy >>

Andy,

On recovery, it is a very individual thing.  And remember, recovery is not
only different for different people but, different for the same person depending
on drugs used and state of health.  Whatever is good for you without ibogaine
is good for you with ibogaine.  What is interesting is that the ibogaine
experience will allow you to understand what is good for you and what is not.
That is one of the other things that makes it so interesting whether you take
drugs or not.  If you take it and understand it, which is most likely, you can
tell you son that it is one damn good drug…wow!  “Take it or not at your
discretion.” It is there. Drug users tend to listen to other drug users. You should
realize that the majority of persons dependent on drugs will need a number of
ibogaine treatments over time to benefit fully from its effects and that time
period  is variable to the individual.  Ibogaine is good medicine but, like
all medicine, shamanic or western, should be anticipated to provide individual
responses between patients/initiates and even in the same person at different
times though its ability to eliminate narcotic withdrawal can only be
described as awesome.

On the growing out of it issue.  The answer is yes.  Addicts grow out of it
but, some don’t and it can be a decades long process.

Regards,

Howard

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From: Ambeatty@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 29, 2004 at 5:34:43 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you for the suggestion to lead by example and do ibogaine myself (as I
said I want to). I had been thinking that I have to take care of my son first.
Taking it myself is a way of doing something without verbal nagging.

I’m encouraged by DH’s description of the ibogaine trip. What helps the
recovery period? Vitamins, energy drinks, protein? Sleep? I have the summer off,
need to go back to work in the fall. How long is the recovery?

I love food too, and sex and marijuana (but I don’t know where to get it) and
gambling (definitely can’t afford it). Drinking, somewhat, but more than two
glasses of anything makes me sick, and now I am finding out that at least one
daily glass (small) is very good for us!?!
Son hates 12 step. He has been pushed into it by legal stuff. My research and
discovery of iboga has been driven by looking for alternatives to 12 step
programs. I know that community support is important, but there may be other
kinds of groups that aren’t so negative. Years ago when I was suffering with my
ex-husband’s alcoholic shit I began to look for help and started going to
esoteric/mystery school, very un-cult like classes instead of alanon. This lead into
bhuddist meditation. It’s very subtle and doesn’t mix well with the physical
drugs and pleasures of the flesh (well, sex is ok-tantra). Very powerful and
transcendent, what most of us want.

Have recently found very encouraging info saying that most addicts quit on
their own, choose it, outgrow it (as you said). I want to encourage this process
as much as possible.
Andy

He is working out in jail and intends to keep it up, so that should help, if
he does.

He is motivated to quit but goes back (ofcourse). He had a bad leg break and
the doctor wouldn’t give him pain meds after 3 weeks. He was already enjoying
street meds and people gave him oxycontin. From there to shooting.

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From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 29, 2004 at 3:28:22 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Very wise words you speak Sara, as always!
I am happy you work with addicts. Treatment needs more people with your
understanding.
If you don’t mind….are you an addict? Maybe a family member of an addict
or
both?
Callie

Hey Callie,

I have no drug addicts in my family ,all vegetarian non smokkers non
drinkers.
from my experience ,I agree with Dave H. ,for many people money is the
drive and not their health.
what is also possible to do , is change a bad habbit to a less bad habbit
by taking natural high, poppy tea better then shooting Heroin,
Kolanut is better then taking Methamphentamine or speed.
mushroom tea instead of lsd & alcohol.
the best one is to change from Heroin to sport.

Im addicted to some food, I have to keep under control,
dont buy me sushi, because I will eat it all before you start.
same with chocolate cream cake with cherries on top.
my addiction is to food , starting with the letter C .

Cheese , chocolate, cream, cherries,coconut,coffee,Cappucino,
Cannabis,coke,crab,cookies,
Start FA next to AA ,NA.
as food consumption is no.one killer today.

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From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 29, 2004 at 2:07:34 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Andy,

All you can do (as you are probably well aware) is make the suggestions.
As Sara pointed out, too often addicts attempt to get clean for the
wrong reasons (other than for themselves) and eventually, if not
immediately, return to using.

I wouldn’t judge the drinking and smoking too fast, I am a believer in
harm reduction, although there is something to be said for complete
abstinence (for a while, to clean out the tubes, anyway) although the 12
step approach often leaves the addict so consumed by guilt if he/she
does “relapse” that they tend to use even more to drown out the
shameful feelings (and I speak from personal experience here).

Statistically, the odds are pretty poor for 12 step recovery working
(less than 10%). I forget the numbers, but a decent amount of addicts
end up maturing out of their using in their 30’s. I also read that
statistics showed of those people who “matured” out of their using and
relapsed, used less and for shorter a time that those who relapsed out
of a 12 step recovery. Hmmm, don’t know how I got into the 12 step
stuff… Oh yeah, harm reduction: don’t worry about a flooded basement
when the roof is on fire! Put out the fire first, then deal with the
basement! Whatever it takes!

So Ibogaine… is without a doubt the most amazing experience of my life
(aside from being a new parent). Yes, it can be hard (exhausting) but
for me the rewards far outweighed and continue to outlast any physical
discomfort at the time of dosing. I was at one time an addict who
didn’t have any dreams or aspirations for my life after the age of 30,
for I firmly believed I would die before then.

There were certainly fun parts of the ibogaine experience (the visuals
were incredible), experiencing the plant spirit and collective
conscience is really something to behold. I did not have any ego
struggle like an LSD trip, it was all very loving and nurturing when I
took it in 1998 to get off methadone. Sure, I felt like death warmed
over afterwards, but I did not experience 90% of the withdrawls that I
would have cold turkey. -I had not been taking very good care of my body
during my addiction and a lot of my using was self medication after
breaking my back so it took some time for me to recover physically.
There was a lot of repetition in the experience, a lot of information
was pounded into my skull over and over by iboga both visually and
aurally, in that sense it was relentless. Then again I am a pretty
stubborn guy so I needed that. The Iboga spirit was also very humorous,
if not a full on prankster.

Essentially, Iboga was a remembering experience, re-teaching me my
spiritual identity in the universe. Everything I experienced I already
knew, it just needed the “splitting of my skull” to be released again.

I feel the best way for you is to lead by example, not words. If you
really want, try Iboga and see how it helps you. Your son may see this
and get interested (or not).

best of luck and peace,

-DH

On 5/28/2004, “Ambeatty@aol.com” <Ambeatty@aol.com> wrote:

Ok, here goes,

My son is clean, for now, because he’s in jail (minor possession, dui,
warrent default). He’ll be out in about a month and I am afraid – expecting –
preparing for a relapse. He thinks he’ll stay clean, but I’ve seen how persistant
heroin is. Also, he wants to drink and smoke and that’s probably an easy way to
break down.

I’ve suggested ibogaine, researched it, am ready to make arrangements. At
first, he said, sure, he’d take anything, do whatever. Now he says he doesn’t
like hallucinogens, doesn’t want a long, difficult trip….does like himself the
way he is, will maybe just do acid.
I’ve read the ibogaine experiences and it sounds alright to me. Is it really
long and difficult? Not sleeping for 36 hours? It sounds as though the best
part is after. Are there fun parts of the experience? or is it like taking your
medicine? It seems as though if it was pleasant it would tend to be addictive.

What can I say or do or not do? Leave him alone? I’m the mommy and he tends
to not do what I suggest or even to do the opposite.
What do you guys think?

Comments and suggestions very, very appreciated,
Andy

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 28, 2004 at 11:49:40 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Very wise words you speak Sara, as always!
I am happy you work with addicts. Treatment needs more people with your understanding.
If you don’t mind….are you an addict? Maybe a family member of an addict or both?
Callie

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 28, 2004 at 11:14:38 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

At least your son is clean now,that’s good.
He needs to be motivated from within.
If he has no intensions to stop using then you could be loosing your energy.
Trying to convince him , pay for his treatment,
But most of the time it will not work, with all the love and attention,as
many addicts have greed as a second addiction.
They have no sense of showing gratitude which is most of the time draining
for the parent.
I would say, give him the information to read, and then
It should be up to him to be …or not to be…

I have treated people who just done it to please their parents, or partner
(and job) but not because of self respect, and then they end up frustrated
and start using again, and most of the time they look for the reason of
relapse
Out side of them selves.

It is as always , finding out the balance of how much is it helpful to be
involved in someone’s consciousness.(If that’s possible).

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Ambeatty@aol.com [mailto:Ambeatty@aol.com]
Verzonden: vrijdag 28 mei 2004 23:20
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [ibogaine] ibogaine help

Ok, here goes,

My son is clean, for now, because he’s in jail (minor possession, dui,
warrent default). He’ll be out in about a month and I am afraid – expecting

preparing for a relapse. He thinks he’ll stay clean, but I’ve seen how
persistant
heroin is. Also, he wants to drink and smoke and that’s probably an easy way
to
break down.

I’ve suggested ibogaine, researched it, am ready to make arrangements. At
first, he said, sure, he’d take anything, do whatever. Now he says he
doesn’t
like hallucinogens, doesn’t want a long, difficult trip….does like himself
the
way he is, will maybe just do acid.
I’ve read the ibogaine experiences and it sounds alright to me. Is it really

long and difficult? Not sleeping for 36 hours? It sounds as though the best
part is after. Are there fun parts of the experience? or is it like taking
your
medicine? It seems as though if it was pleasant it would tend to be
addictive.

What can I say or do or not do? Leave him alone? I’m the mommy and he tends
to not do what I suggest or even to do the opposite.
What do you guys think?

Comments and suggestions very, very appreciated,
Andy

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 28, 2004 at 10:20:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/28/2004 9:07:54 PM Central Daylight Time, Ambeatty@aol.com writes:

He has always been so willing to
take different drugs, I don’t know why he would draw the line at ingesting
ibogaine.

He may be scared that it will work!
We addicts really LOVE our drugs or we wouldn’t be addicts!
I really grieved giving up the needle if you can believe that! There is a little flash of blood when you hit a vein and my heart would really get pumping when I seen that……sick, huh?
You are right about it running in the family. My childhood was pretty normal too. My parents made mistakes but who doesn’t as parents?! I was a terrible Mom and both my boys (22 and 25 y.o) do not drink, smoke cigarettes or do dope….so don’t blame yourself!
Hope to see you posting e-mails a lot.
I really enjoy when everyone has their say about everything. All the different ideas and feedback help me a LOT!
Peace, Callie

From: Ambeatty@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 28, 2004 at 10:07:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks, Callie, and you’re right that I have to keep from nagging.
He had been on methodone about a week when he was arrested while watching tv
at his grandmother’s. And he might choose methodone again. His dose was being
built up to stop the craving, and he would have begun withdrawal before too
long. It was supposed to last 1-2 years.
I’ve printed and mailed him the basic story of ibogaine. I would like him to
read some of the personal experiences, too. He has always been so willing to
take different drugs, I don’t know why he would draw the line at ingesting
ibogaine.
As for parenting, I’ve had to get over blaming myself for his problems. It
helps to analyze things and move on constructively. Truth be told, addiction
tendencies are in the family, so now i see it as something we’re all in
together….as a family and as society.
I want to take ibogaine too. I don’t do heroin but have a bunch of addiction
type habits that I have to push aside to keep them out of the way of my life.
Andy

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] wow…ibogaine in Israel….
Date: May 28, 2004 at 8:33:23 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Adam,

Thanks for the heads up on the Israel article.  I picked up a copy of the
newspaper in NYC and the US edition had the picture in black and white…too bad.
In any case the march goes on.

Regards as always,

Howard

In a message dated 5/28/04 5:38:15 PM, adamg@013.net.il writes:

<<

Is this list working….?

…so I’m leafing thru the weekend paper (here in Israel), when I suddenly
come

across a photo of a bunch of root branches and right away I guess- iboga..
who else..?

Caption reads- GOOD SHIT ( actually it’s ‘good stuff’ but you know what I
mean)

They recap the whole story while the ‘breaking news’ part is how clinical
testing will soon

be underway over here…. mazal friggin’ tov…

Howard, your picture made the leading papers’ weekend edition 🙂 congratz.. I
put it in

the corner so as to save on bandwidth…

And so did Boaz Wachtel, who’s been pushing for this for a very long time….

and Sara was interviewed as well….

Very cool article, very supportive… >>

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 28, 2004 at 7:38:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/28/2004 4:20:45 PM Central Daylight Time, Ambeatty@aol.com writes:

What can I say or do or not do? Leave him alone? I’m the mommy and he tends
to not do what I suggest or even to do the opposite.
What do you guys think?

Hi Andy, you really do sound like a great parent! I always felt bad for my folks. We think we are only hurting or affecting ourselves and it is not that way at all!

Heroin…..yes, it is a devil. I really hope that boy of yours won’t relapse when he gets out but chances are he can’t wait to get out and do a good shot. Sorry, but that is the nature of my beast when it is awake.
Has he ever tried Methadone?
I hope you keep encouraging the Ibogaine treatment. Can you get him on the puter to read what some of these good folks have to say?
I feel all you can really do is offer your help. Suggest altenatives as you have been doing but try not to nag or more important enable him. Man, I really feel for you parents with fucked up adult kids!
Keep loving him (I know that comes natural) and pray to whomever you choose to pray to. Prayer works for me.
Keep in touch and really try to get him to read some of the stuff on the web. Howard Lotsof has some great info in his Ibogaine Dossier which is first link below.
http://www.ibogaine.org/

http://www.ibeginagain.org/articles/index.shtml

http://www.oasas.state.ny.us/AdMed/meds/fyiibogaine.htm

http://ibogaine.co.uk/

Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] wow…ibogaine in Israel….
Date: May 28, 2004 at 7:22:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

very cool! Way ahead of us here in the States!
All anyone seems to think about here is that damn war in Iraq and worrying about terrorist attacks. So very sad…….
You begin to feel hopeful about your future and you look around you and the whole world seems to be going to shit!
Why can’t everyone just get along?! You know it really is that simple!
Is peace not meant to be?
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 7:17:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/28/2004 2:48:10 PM Central Daylight Time, dave@phantom.com writes:

Dear Bisquit Boy…

I dreamt last night that Actor Kevin Bacon was a salesman in a music
store and was very reluctant to give me any customer service – as a
matter of fact he ws a total asshole. Finally after a long delay he
began assisting me with a keyboard synthesizer and I started playing
music that sounded quite good even tho I don’t play the keyboards.

Then all of a sudden, the store was closed and I was all alone and unable
to move from the piano bench because I might trigger the alarm system
and the paranoia of being a dopefiend in a room filled with expensive
musical equipment with the alarm turned on set in and I craved a shot of
dope. I was sure the police would arrive at any moment.

Light began to stream out from under a smoky closet door in the back of
the store and I allowed my mind to wander into the closet. It was a
stark white room with black holes drilled into the back wall, peering
through one hole I saw myself as a newborn, covered in blood and
amniotic fluid, dripping and making a terrible mess. I looked down and
my hands were covered in the mess, and I began to smear the fluid over
my face screaming this can’t be real, this can’t be real – but it was.

I peered into another hole in the wall and I saw a series of puppets,
each controling the strings to the next succeeding puppet, in an endless
chain of family dysfunctionality continuing thru the ages until finally
one puppet broke loose and became his own person.

Another hole revealed an alien planet covered with magnificent and
bizarre life forms, all striving for one-ness. The last hole I peer into
I saw the orginal man, becoming self aware right after manifesting
himself, his outer layer of skin removed, exposing all of his muscles
and blood vessels and tendons and fascia, freaking out at his
self-awareness. I realize that this original man is me and I am still
freaking out at my own self-awareness.

I am dreaming but I can’t wake up. Then the gnashing teeth started to
close in on me and I jumped back. Piercing shreeks from the alarm system
penetrated my marrow and I started to disinigrate… the teeth tearing
me to shreds. I watched as my body parts were swallowed by the floor as
an annoying itching started to dominate my attention… which turned out
to be the curtain above my bed blowing in the breeze against my forehead.

Oh my! I hate weird dreams like that! That would’ve really fightened me!  I have never had one that scary or at least I didn’t remember it!
Wonder what in the world that dream meant?

And Preston, if I ever had a trip like that I would never trip again! Glad I haven’t cause i love hallucinogenics every now and then! 😉
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] another record Afghan opium crop
Date: May 28, 2004 at 6:58:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://feeds.bignewsnetwork.com/?sid=3e3ca05e4816f1b4

Saturday 29th May, 2004

Afghanistan Heading For Record Opium Crops
Big News Network.com     Friday 28th May, 2004

The United Nations counter-narcotics chief is heading this weekend to Afghanistan, where concern is growing that the 2004 opium crop may reach record levels, topping last year’s 3,600 tons produced.

‘Unfortunately, there is no easy way of solving Afghanistan’s opium problem. In countries like Thailand, Pakistan and Turkey, where the problem was as severe, it took a generation to reverse the trend, and put an end to it,’ Antonio Maria Costa, Executive Director of the UN Office on Drugs and Crime (UNODC), said Thursday as he prepared for his eight-day tour, which starts Saturday.

While in Afghanistan, Mr. Costa will review the situation on the ground and urge a more effective implementation of the National Drug Control Strategy. On his way to the capital Kabul, he will visit some opium producing provinces, meeting with key governors, police chiefs and military commanders, as well as some opium-growing farmers.

In 2003, opium production in Afghanistan reached an estimated 3,600 tons, a 6 per cent increase over the previous year, generating $1 billion in income for farmers and $1.3 billion for traffickers – the equivalent of 52 per cent of the gross domestic product (GDP). Recent UNODC surveys indicate the likelihood of a further increase in production.

‘The opium economy will continue to grow as long as drug production and trafficking are conducted without risk of retribution or the incentive to do something else. It is urgent to redress this risk-reward imbalance, making engagement in illicit activities legally and economically unattractive,’ Mr. Costa said, appealing to the international community to give more help to Afghan farmers to switch from opium cultivation to legal activities.

Before travelling to Afghanistan, Mr. Costa had visited Uzbekistan, Kyrgyzstan and Tajikistan, where the availability of opium has increased the lure of drug abuse. A rise in the number of people injecting heroin is causing a dramatic spike in the incidence of HIV/AIDS, according to UNODC. Narcotics money also provides resources to organized crime and terrorist groups.

Meeting with leaders of several Central Asian countries, Mr. Costa discussed the implementation of the Good Neighbourly Relations Declaration on Narcotics Control and of the Paris Pact initiative, which involves countries on the Afghan opium trafficking routes.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 5:32:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Man this stuff is rough. Maybe I should find some aloe juice and put it in a Iso 2  machine………….

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 5:26:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara, cool link! Do you think you could get those Loonies to play the intro song in Z flat so I can put a harmonica lead in it ? Z flat is the only key harp that I have and those guys sure can rip. I just gotta cop those licks! I just can’t get these damn cob webs off of my face long enough to get anything done. Maybe 100 grit sandpaper……………

From: Ambeatty@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine help
Date: May 28, 2004 at 5:19:40 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ok, here goes,

My son is clean, for now, because he’s in jail (minor possession, dui,
warrent default). He’ll be out in about a month and I am afraid – expecting –
preparing for a relapse. He thinks he’ll stay clean, but I’ve seen how persistant
heroin is. Also, he wants to drink and smoke and that’s probably an easy way to
break down.

I’ve suggested ibogaine, researched it, am ready to make arrangements. At
first, he said, sure, he’d take anything, do whatever. Now he says he doesn’t
like hallucinogens, doesn’t want a long, difficult trip….does like himself the
way he is, will maybe just do acid.
I’ve read the ibogaine experiences and it sounds alright to me. Is it really
long and difficult? Not sleeping for 36 hours? It sounds as though the best
part is after. Are there fun parts of the experience? or is it like taking your
medicine? It seems as though if it was pleasant it would tend to be addictive.

What can I say or do or not do? Leave him alone? I’m the mommy and he tends
to not do what I suggest or even to do the opposite.
What do you guys think?

Comments and suggestions very, very appreciated,
Andy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “booker w” <swbooker@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 5:10:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Man, that’s a hell of a dream…no wonder you’re an artist.  I just wondered if the anxiety level in the dream was as high as it feels to be when reading it… seems like I can dream stuff like that but it doesn’t feel as fearful while I’m dreaming it, as it sounds in the telling.  On the other hand, sometimes it is.
Best, Sandy

>From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>

>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP

>Date: 28 May 2004 19:45:49 -0000

>

>

>Dear Bisquit Boy…

>

>I dreamt last night that Actor Kevin Bacon was a salesman in a music

>store and was very reluctant to give me any customer service – as a

>matter of fact he ws a total asshole. Finally after a long delay he

>began assisting me with a keyboard synthesizer and I started playing

>music that sounded quite good even tho I don’t play the keyboards.

>

>Then all of a sudden, the store was closed and I was all alone and unable

>to move from the piano bench because I might trigger the alarm system

>and the paranoia of being a dopefiend in a room filled with expensive

>musical equipment with the alarm turned on set in and I craved a shot of

>dope. I was sure the police would arrive at any moment.

>

>Light began to stream out from under a smoky closet door in the back of

>the store and I allowed my mind to wander into the closet. It was a

>stark white room with black holes drilled into the back wall, peering

>through one hole I saw myself as a newborn, covered in blood and

>amniotic fluid, dripping and making a terrible mess. I looked down and

>my hands were covered in the mess, and I began to smear the fluid over

>my face screaming this can’t be real, this can’t be real – but it was.

>

>I peered into another hole in the wall and I saw a series of puppets,

>each controling the strings to the next succeeding puppet, in an endless

>chain of family dysfunctionality continuing thru the ages until finally

>one puppet broke loose and became his own person.

>

>Another hole revealed an alien planet covered with magnificent and

>bizarre life forms, all striving for one-ness. The last hole I peer into

>I saw the orginal man, becoming self aware right after manifesting

>himself, his outer layer of skin removed, exposing all of his muscles

>and blood vessels and tendons and fascia, freaking out at his

>self-awareness. I realize that this original man is me and I am still

>freaking out at my own self-awareness.

>

>I am dreaming but I can’t wake up. Then the gnashing teeth started to

>close in on me and I jumped back. Piercing shreeks from the alarm system

>penetrated my marrow and I started to disinigrate… the teeth tearing

>me to shreds. I watched as my body parts were swallowed by the floor as

>an annoying itching started to dominate my attention… which turned out

>to be the curtain above my bed blowing in the breeze against my forehead.

>

>_.dh

>

>On 5/28/2004, “BiscuitBoy714@aol.com” <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:

>

> >Is there anybody out there ? Just smile if you can hear me. I don’t know

> >whats up. No one has anything to say and I can’t handle this shit. Please won’t

> >some body start raising hell so that I won’t keep thinking I’m the last one

> >left.The shadow people are all ways here, but I need to see words from those who

> >split open the head, took a look, those who know. Is there cob webs on my face?

> >

> >

> >

>

>   /]=———————————————————————=[\

>  [%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]

>   \]=———————————————————————=[/

>

>

FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar – get it now! /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 4:38:05 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m sorry, this is now two pithy replies in a row and I don’t usually like
to do this, but I would like to say, Wow, this was a cool read. Thanks for
writing/posting this, I enjoyed the imagery. Felt like I was tripping there
for a moment or three.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 3:45 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP

Dear Bisquit Boy…

I dreamt last night that Actor Kevin Bacon was a salesman in a music
store and was very reluctant to give me any customer service – as a
matter of fact he ws a total asshole. Finally after a long delay he
began assisting me with a keyboard synthesizer and I started playing
music that sounded quite good even tho I don’t play the keyboards.

Then all of a sudden, the store was closed and I was all alone and unable
to move from the piano bench because I might trigger the alarm system
and the paranoia of being a dopefiend in a room filled with expensive
musical equipment with the alarm turned on set in and I craved a shot of
dope. I was sure the police would arrive at any moment.

Light began to stream out from under a smoky closet door in the back of
the store and I allowed my mind to wander into the closet. It was a
stark white room with black holes drilled into the back wall, peering
through one hole I saw myself as a newborn, covered in blood and
amniotic fluid, dripping and making a terrible mess. I looked down and
my hands were covered in the mess, and I began to smear the fluid over
my face screaming this can’t be real, this can’t be real – but it was.

I peered into another hole in the wall and I saw a series of puppets,
each controling the strings to the next succeeding puppet, in an endless
chain of family dysfunctionality continuing thru the ages until finally
one puppet broke loose and became his own person.

Another hole revealed an alien planet covered with magnificent and
bizarre life forms, all striving for one-ness. The last hole I peer into
I saw the orginal man, becoming self aware right after manifesting
himself, his outer layer of skin removed, exposing all of his muscles
and blood vessels and tendons and fascia, freaking out at his
self-awareness. I realize that this original man is me and I am still
freaking out at my own self-awareness.

I am dreaming but I can’t wake up. Then the gnashing teeth started to
close in on me and I jumped back. Piercing shreeks from the alarm system
penetrated my marrow and I started to disinigrate… the teeth tearing
me to shreds. I watched as my body parts were swallowed by the floor as
an annoying itching started to dominate my attention… which turned out
to be the curtain above my bed blowing in the breeze against my forehead.

_.dh

On 5/28/2004, “BiscuitBoy714@aol.com” <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:

Is there anybody out there ? Just smile if you can hear me. I don’t know
whats up. No one has anything to say and I can’t handle this shit. Please
won’t
some body start raising hell so that I won’t keep thinking I’m the last one
left.The shadow people are all ways here, but I need to see words from
those who
split open the head, took a look, those who know. Is there cob webs on my
face?

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 4:30:28 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is there cob webs on my face?<

Yes.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 1:31 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP

Is there anybody out there ? Just smile if you can hear me. I don’t know
whats up. No one has anything to say and I can’t handle this shit. Please
won’t some body start raising hell so that I won’t keep thinking I’m the
last one left.The shadow people are all ways here, but I need to see words
from those who split open the head, took a look, those who know. Is there
cob webs on my face?

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 3:45:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Bisquit Boy…

I dreamt last night that Actor Kevin Bacon was a salesman in a music
store and was very reluctant to give me any customer service – as a
matter of fact he ws a total asshole. Finally after a long delay he
began assisting me with a keyboard synthesizer and I started playing
music that sounded quite good even tho I don’t play the keyboards.

Then all of a sudden, the store was closed and I was all alone and unable
to move from the piano bench because I might trigger the alarm system
and the paranoia of being a dopefiend in a room filled with expensive
musical equipment with the alarm turned on set in and I craved a shot of
dope. I was sure the police would arrive at any moment.

Light began to stream out from under a smoky closet door in the back of
the store and I allowed my mind to wander into the closet. It was a
stark white room with black holes drilled into the back wall, peering
through one hole I saw myself as a newborn, covered in blood and
amniotic fluid, dripping and making a terrible mess. I looked down and
my hands were covered in the mess, and I began to smear the fluid over
my face screaming this can’t be real, this can’t be real – but it was.

I peered into another hole in the wall and I saw a series of puppets,
each controling the strings to the next succeeding puppet, in an endless
chain of family dysfunctionality continuing thru the ages until finally
one puppet broke loose and became his own person.

Another hole revealed an alien planet covered with magnificent and
bizarre life forms, all striving for one-ness. The last hole I peer into
I saw the orginal man, becoming self aware right after manifesting
himself, his outer layer of skin removed, exposing all of his muscles
and blood vessels and tendons and fascia, freaking out at his
self-awareness. I realize that this original man is me and I am still
freaking out at my own self-awareness.

I am dreaming but I can’t wake up. Then the gnashing teeth started to
close in on me and I jumped back. Piercing shreeks from the alarm system
penetrated my marrow and I started to disinigrate… the teeth tearing
me to shreds. I watched as my body parts were swallowed by the floor as
an annoying itching started to dominate my attention… which turned out
to be the curtain above my bed blowing in the breeze against my forehead.

_.dh

On 5/28/2004, “BiscuitBoy714@aol.com” <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:

Is there anybody out there ? Just smile if you can hear me. I don’t know
whats up. No one has anything to say and I can’t handle this shit. Please won’t
some body start raising hell so that I won’t keep thinking I’m the last one
left.The shadow people are all ways here, but I need to see words from those who
split open the head, took a look, those who know. Is there cob webs on my face?

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 2:21:16 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So, why not join the loonie clan

http://www.theloonies.tk/

and have more fun.

Sara
Van: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Verzonden: vrijdag 28 mei 2004 19:32
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP

Is there anybody out there ? Just smile if you can hear me. I don’t know whats up. No one has anything to say and I can’t handle this shit. Please won’t some body start raising hell so that I won’t keep thinking I’m the last one left.The shadow people are all ways here, but I need to see words from those who split open the head, took a look, those who know. Is there cob webs on my face?

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 3:10:03 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yeah Patrick, could you plug us back in..?

—– Original Message
—–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 28, 2004 7:31 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP

Is there anybody out there ? Just smile if you can hear me. I don’t know whats up. No one has anything to say and I can’t handle this shit. Please won’t some body start raising hell so that I won’t keep thinking I’m the last one left.The shadow people are all ways here, but I need to see words from those who split open the head, took a look, those who know. Is there cob webs on my face?

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: [ibogaine] wow…ibogaine in Israel….
Date: May 28, 2004 at 2:34:16 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is this list working….?

…so I’m leafing thru the weekend paper (here in Israel), when I suddenly come
across a photo of a bunch of root branches and right away I guess- iboga.. who else..?

Caption reads- GOOD SHIT ( actually it’s ‘good stuff’ but you know what I mean)

They recap the whole story while the ‘breaking news’ part is how clinical testing will soon
be underway over here…. mazal friggin’ tov…

Howard, your picture made the leading papers’ weekend edition 🙂 congratz.. I put it in
the corner so as to save on bandwidth…

And so did Boaz Wachtel, who’s been pushing for this for a very long time….
and Sara was interviewed as well….

Very cool article, very supportive…

all the best,
AG

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 28, 2004 at 1:31:56 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is there anybody out there ? Just smile if you can hear me. I don’t know whats up. No one has anything to say and I can’t handle this shit. Please won’t some body start raising hell so that I won’t keep thinking I’m the last one left.The shadow people are all ways here, but I need to see words from those who split open the head, took a look, those who know. Is there cob webs on my face?

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com
Date: May 26, 2004 at 7:06:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I cant begin to tell you how great that advice sounds to me since I had already decided to remain on it longer. Thanks  Callie .

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] re: CSI & Ibogaine episode
Date: May 25, 2004 at 11:45:21 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

> but there was one short scene that flashed to a bwiti (i presume) ritual – was that “real” ->staged? because it looked so fucking spot on to me (not that ive experienced iboga in that >context – so Nick/Adam etc correct me if im wrong –

> (on for my 3rd ibogaine trip soon – i will get it “right” this time around – not that theres any “wrong”!)

Hey Paul,  A big ‘buckaroo bonzai’ on your 3rd ibo-voyage across the 8th dimension; you got it right *already*….

CSI— I’ve been tv-free almost 6 years now …so I thought of downloading the csi episode when it made all that hoopla back then, but then I realized — I couldn’t care less if iboga featured in ‘Tales from the Crypt’ or in some off-broadway musical… so I never did… the more the merrier says I and it’s all good…. in fact, I’d support staging protests to keep this mysterious african-voodoo-rebirth plant off the streets….

Speaking for myself, the only authentic thing was the iboga itself, thru which I experienced a state of enlightment(1)… and from that vantage point I couldn’t but laugh at what was transpiring around me, like stumbling into some elementary-school stage-production of the nativity scene- except one where they actually casted the real baby jesus -that would be us initiates in the manger…. and you look back at the audience and you know that this *     * is inherent/dormant in us all, and that all the rest, including the trance-conducive music is ‘theatre’… good production, bad production, benevolent shaman or charlatan, siskel or ebert, it’s all good, just lift the veil….

all the best,
AG

(1) like my namesake, waking up to discover I’m back to my normal self, albeit glowing and all, was like being expelled from the garden of eden- it hurt like HELL… still a bit sore….

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] re: CSI & Ibogaine episode
Date: May 25, 2004 at 5:52:45 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/25/04 5:29:43 PM, nick227@tiscali.co.uk writes:

<< I missed the programme, though someone told me about it. Sounded pretty

negative from what I heard. I’ve heard BBC1 will show David Scott’s film on

his ibogaine experience shortly. I think 8th June is planned. This should be

a biggie. >>

I watch CSI on a regular basis.  The ibogaine program was the most boring of
any CSI I have seen. What a waste of video tape.  Let’s hope David did a
better job than CSI.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] re: CSI & Ibogaine episode
Date: May 25, 2004 at 1:28:51 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I missed the programme, though someone told me about it. Sounded pretty
negative from what I heard. I’ve heard BBC1 will show David Scott’s film on
his ibogaine experience shortly. I think 8th June is planned. This should be
a biggie.

Nick

—– Original Message —–
From: “paul harvey ” <pauljackamo@lycos.co.uk>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 25, 2004 6:25 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] re: CSI & Ibogaine episode

hi everyone

the CSI episode was aired over here in the UK last week – I read Dana’s
comments with interest and agree with
most of what he says, the whole tone of the programme seemed to be along
the lines of:

dont fuck with that crazy voodoo shit pushed by evil psychedelic xjunkies

but! >> there was one short scene that flashed to a bwiti (i presume)
ritual – was that “real” ? staged? –
because it looked so fucking spot on to me (not that ive experienced iboga
in that context – so Nick/Adam etc
correct me if im wrong – it just had that feel of authenticity – so :
anyone know about that scene – copyrite
aside, it would be good to steal  (or get it cleared) that short scene &
throw it on mindvox/ibogaine.org or
co.uk  as it was beautiful – “reality”/simulation aside.

over to you……
take care everyone – good to be back 😉

paulx

(on for my 3rd ibogaine trip soon – i will get it “right” this time
around – not that theres any “wrong”!)

Capital One Classic
Mastercard
60 second
response online.  http://mocda.com/1/c/681064/117934/307081/307081

AOL users go here
http://mocda.com/1/c/681064/117934/307081/307081

—————————————————————————-
—-

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “paul harvey ” <pauljackamo@lycos.co.uk>
Subject: [ibogaine] re: CSI & Ibogaine episode
Date: May 25, 2004 at 1:25:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi everyone

the CSI episode was aired over here in the UK last week – I read Dana’s comments with interest and agree with
most of what he says, the whole tone of the programme seemed to be along the lines of:

dont fuck with that crazy voodoo shit pushed by evil psychedelic xjunkies

but! >> there was one short scene that flashed to a bwiti (i presume) ritual – was that “real” ? staged? –
because it looked so fucking spot on to me (not that ive experienced iboga in that context – so Nick/Adam etc
correct me if im wrong – it just had that feel of authenticity – so : anyone know about that scene – copyrite
aside, it would be good to steal  (or get it cleared) that short scene & throw it on mindvox/ibogaine.org or
co.uk  as it was beautiful – “reality”/simulation aside.

over to you……
take care everyone – good to be back 😉

paulx

(on for my 3rd ibogaine trip soon – i will get it “right” this time around – not that theres any “wrong”!)

Capital One Classic
Mastercard
60 second
response online.  http://mocda.com/1/c/681064/117934/307081/307081

AOL users go here
http://mocda.com/1/c/681064/117934/307081/307081

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] May I speak to your Manager?
Date: May 25, 2004 at 9:32:18 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If you are interested in forging a business relationship with our company, please contact us via email or letter:

Turner Broadcasting System, Inc.
Strategic Sourcing Department
101 Marietta St., NW, 16th Fl.
Atlanta, GA 30303-2774

Strategic.Sourcing@turner.com

© 2001 Turner Broadcasting System,Inc. a Time Warner company.

————————————————————————————–
From: CNN <cnnstoryideas@turner.com>
Thank you for this submission. Public Information reviews and summarizes story ideas, and distributes them to appropriate news divisions for consideration. If it is decided the story is something of interest that can be developed for on-air reporting, you may be contacted for more information.
Because of the volume of story suggestions we receive, we are unable to reply with information on whether or not it will be used.
Thank you again for sending it our way. 
CNN Public Information

11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

Wrote CNN again about my limited experience with Iboga.

I sent it to

http://www.cnn.com/feedback/forms/form11b.html?1

I would assume they would be more receptive to a story on Iboga if more I’s suggested it, who knows…

I wonder who makes their auto-responder software….
/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] willTheRealCNNcontactNFOpLEASEsTANDuP
Date: May 25, 2004 at 9:48:35 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What is the mailing address for TBS, Inc.’s headquarters?
One CNN Center
P.O. Box 105366
Atlanta, Georgia 30348
or…

From:  http://turner.com/community/community.html
Community Initiatives
As part of its business practices, TBS, Inc. encourages educational activities and community involvement. Among its special initiatives are Turner Learning and CNN Student News. Click here to learn more. 

Contributions and Grants
TBS, Inc. is committed to good corporate citizenship and contributes to non-profit organizations in three focus areas: arts and culture, education and the environment. The company is also home to four foundations dedicated to improving the communities where our employees live and work. For information on these foundations, as well as information on applying for a grant, please click here.
or could become a counter agent : )lol….
http://www.turner.com/jobs/
/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: earth on back heart beat seqc040524@1600
Date: May 24, 2004 at 9:01:05 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Thank YOU Dr.”
:  )

Wrote CNN again about my limited experience with Iboga.

I sent it to

http://www.cnn.com/feedback/forms/form11b.html?1

I would assume they would be more receptive to a story on Iboga if more I’s suggested it, who knows…

I wonder who makes their auto-responder software….

Dana,

Perhaps both could be done?  My step dad is a Dem delegate this year, the convention in Houston is coming up soon, he knows my story first hand….good seed?

How can I & I better work together to achieve common objectives?

Jason Bursey
http://iboga.wmatrix.net
(any suggestions are more then welcome, for real; I am not in a position to pass up opportunities or even potential opportunities…and I don’t want to taint others lifelong work through my own ignorance, so staying teachable and a ‘adapt and overcome’ outlook appears to be paramount.)

—– Original Message —–
From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: 24 May 04, 4:49 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] a better place to spend you time if you want to write some one
Instead of writing republican senators, maybe everyone on this list should deluge the policy staff pictured at this page. You can get their emails by calling the John Kerry offices in D.C at 202 712-3000. Brian Levine was unresponsive and downright suspicious, so maybe you should try the other two.

The objections regarding Ibogaine can be countered with that observation that 18-MC, the system’s own candidate to replace Ibogaine, can only be introduced via White House decision over-ruling NIDA.

Dana/cnw

Doug Green wrote:

http://www.johnkerry.com/communities/young/campaign.html

 

Look at the bottom left pic on this page . . . this is the team your contact needs to connect us with.

Doug/cnw

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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] a better place to spend you time if you want to write some one
Date: May 24, 2004 at 7:49:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Instead of writing republican senators, maybe everyone on this list should deluge the policy staff pictured at this page. You can get their emails by calling the John Kerry offices in D.C at 202 712-3000. Brian Levine was unresponsive and downright suspicious, so maybe you should try the other two.

The objections regarding Ibogaine can be countered with that observation that 18-MC, the system’s own candidate to replace Ibogaine, can only be introduced via White House decision over-ruling NIDA.

Dana/cnw

Doug Green wrote:

http://www.johnkerry.com/communities/young/campaign.html

 

Look at the bottom left pic on this page . . . this is the team your contact needs to connect us with.

Doug/cnw

From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fwd: back to earth
Date: May 24, 2004 at 12:36:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nice one… Thanks!

_.dh

Oh Great Spirit…
Let me greet each day with reverence.
Teaching me the giving of my elders…
The honor and pride
of the warrior…
And the joy of our little ones…
Help me to walk with grace, balance and dignity…
Let me make a difference on our journey…
Back to the Earth…

Written by K. Whitehorse Wright

So glad that you had a good visit and were able to make it to the wedding and the family reunion!!!

Love,
L

iboga@ziplip.com wrote:

Thank you for helping me get to where I needed to be.
With Love,
Jason
P(ost)S(cript):
What was on your T-shirt again? : )

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] new source of ibogaine
Date: May 24, 2004 at 10:00:13 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LOVE IT!
Can’t wait to see it on the shelves at Walgreens! 😉
Your name ‘Lotsof’ is perfect too! Coincidence? I think not!
Peace to all this lovely Monday morning!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] good timing!
Date: May 24, 2004 at 12:29:11 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I got this e-mail from a friend today and as you will see it was right on time!
Callie

Excuse this rather harsh title,

Keep Your Mouth Shut

A preacher, a politician and an engineer were led to the guillotine. The preacher was asked if he wanted to be face up or face down when he met his fate. The preacher said that he would like to lie face up so he would be looking toward heaven when he died. The blade of the guillotine was raised and released. It came speeding down and suddenly stopped, just inches from his neck. The authorities took this as divine intervention and released the preacher.

Next, the politician came to the guillotine, and he also decided to die facing up, hoping he would be as fortunate as the preacher. So the blade of the guillotine was raised again and released. It came speeding down and suddenly stopped just inches from his neck, so he was released as well.

The engineer was next, and he too decided to die facing up. The executioner slowly raised the blade of the guillotine, when suddenly the engineer said, “Hey, I see what the problem is…”

Another reminder that we need to learn when to keep our mouths shut.
As much as we may be anxious to share with people just how much we know, sometimes things are better left unsaid!
Rarely will keeping quiet get us into trouble (though it can happen), but often do we find ourselves getting into trouble by saying something that should have gone unsaid.

One of my favorite proverbs is found in Proverbs 17:28: “Even a fool is counted wise when he holds his peace; when he shuts his lips, he is considered perceptive.”
Very similar to the more recent saying: “Better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt.” Lest you open your mouth today and say something you may later regret, stop for a moment before you speak and make sure it’s the wise thing to do.

From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fwd: back to earth
Date: May 23, 2004 at 10:57:50 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

 

Sent: 23 May 04, 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: Thank you

Oh Great Spirit…
Let me greet each day with reverence.
Teaching me the giving of my elders…
The honor and pride 
of the warrior…
And the joy of our little ones…
Help me to walk with grace, balance and dignity…
Let me make a difference on our journey…
Back to the Earth…

Written by K. Whitehorse Wright

So glad that you had a good visit and were able to make it to the wedding and the family reunion!!!

Love,
L


iboga@ziplip.com wrote:
Thank you for helping me get to where I needed to be.
With Love,
Jason
P(ost)S(cript):
What was on your T-shirt again? : )

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From: Daniel McGuire <mindmesh@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Ibogaine near Salt Lake City?
Date: May 23, 2004 at 10:49:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m new to this list.   If any of you are near SLC, can we chat?  I am
seeking a source of Ibogaine for my father, an heroin addict of several
decades currently on methadone.  We learned of the substance a few months
ago in the “Salt Lake City Weekly”, where ibogaine was its cover story.
Thank you,
Daniel

__________________________________
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Yahoo! Domains – Claim yours for only $14.70/year
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From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what this list means to me
Date: May 23, 2004 at 10:08:32 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That was really well said bro. Simple and true.

I’ll take the hope 🙂

Peace out,
Curtis

On Sun, 23 May 2004 15:16:53 -0700 “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
wrote:
So … when they hit that stage — whatever moments in time, cause
it to
arrive — you at least know about ibogaine; so do your best to align
their
Brief Moment of Clarity, with an escape route, that could actually
work.

Perhaps they’ll cop a epiphany and come back to Earth highly rearranged.
More likely they’ll glow for a while, and then fall on their ass.
It may
take a few more times to own all that shit and realize: okay, this
is the
part where the magic ends, and I have to exert effort, change things,

and
do the rest.

No matter what happens, at least they’ve got a piece of hope, which
anchors them to something that worked.

Glimmers of possibility, really beat the fuck out of methadone maintenance
or a UROD.  All you walk away with, from the latter experiences,
is a
strong reaffirmation that you’re totally damned and never getting
out of
the fucking pit you’re sunk in.

Patrick

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] knowledge vs. propaganda$illiene$$
Date: May 23, 2004 at 9:53:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think I prefer hope over the form letter 😉

That’s depressing. Who votes for these people?

.:vector:.

— deartheo@ziplip.com wrote:
“this is the
part where the magic ends, and I have to exert effort, change things,
and
do the rest.
No matter what happens, at least got a piece of hope, which
anchors to something that worked.”  (Mindvox.com)
1111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

VS….

From United States Senate (Kay Bailey Hutchison [R]) April 28th
2004:

Dear Mr. Bursey,

Thank you for contacting me regarding H.R. 685, which
modifies the Higher Education Act of 1998.  I welcome your thoughts
and comments on this issue.

Congressman Barney Frank of Massachusetts introduced H.R.
685, which would repeal the prohibition on persons convicted of drug
offenses from receiving student financial assistance.  No similar
legislation has been introduced in the Senate.

Under current law, an individual convicted of a drug
offense is ineligible to receive federal educational financial aid
for at least on e year, depending on the number and severity of
convictions.  However, a student can regain eligibility after
participating in a drug rehabilitation program approved by the
Department of Education.

Education is the key to success, and I strongly agree the
government at all levels should continue to make higher education
accessible to all Americans.  However, with the scourge of illegal
drug use, especially among our youth, I am committed to using the
strongest possible measures to fight against drug use and
distribution.

To reduce the flow of drugs crossing our borders, I led
the effort to bolster border security and increase the number of
Border Patrol agents by 1,000 each year.  In addition, I have worked
aggressively to increase the resources available to prevent drug use,
chiefly through education programs such as the Safe and Drug Free
Schools and Communities Program, as well as drug treatment programs
administered by the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services
Administration (SAMHSA).

There are many challenges ahead, but federal, state and
local governments amust work together to ensure that our children
understand the profound dangers associated with drug use, as well as
the legal consequences.

I appreciate hearing from you and hope you will not
hesitate to keep in touch on any issue of concern to you.

Sincerely,
Kay Bailey Hutchison

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Domains – Claim yours for only $14.70/year
http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer

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From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] knowledge vs. propaganda$illiene$$
Date: May 23, 2004 at 9:04:09 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“this is the       
part where the magic ends, and I have to exert effort, change things, and       
do the rest.
No matter what happens, at least got a piece of hope, which
anchors to something that worked.”  (Mindvox.com)
1111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

VS….

From United States Senate (Kay Bailey Hutchison [R]) April 28th 2004:

Dear Mr. Bursey,

Thank you for contacting me regarding H.R. 685, which modifies the Higher Education Act of 1998.  I welcome your thoughts and comments on this issue.

Congressman Barney Frank of Massachusetts introduced H.R. 685, which would repeal the prohibition on persons convicted of drug offenses from receiving student financial assistance.  No similar legislation has been introduced in the Senate.

Under current law, an individual convicted of a drug offense is ineligible to receive federal educational financial aid for at least on e year, depending on the number and severity of convictions.  However, a student can regain eligibility after participating in a drug rehabilitation program approved by the Department of Education.

Education is the key to success, and I strongly agree the government at all levels should continue to make higher education accessible to all Americans.  However, with the scourge of illegal drug use, especially among our youth, I am committed to using the strongest possible measures to fight against drug use and distribution.

To reduce the flow of drugs crossing our borders, I led the effort to bolster border security and increase the number of Border Patrol agents by 1,000 each year.  In addition, I have worked aggressively to increase the resources available to prevent drug use, chiefly through education programs such as the Safe and Drug Free Schools and Communities Program, as well as drug treatment programs administered by the Substance Abuse and Mental Health Services Administration (SAMHSA).

There are many challenges ahead, but federal, state and local governments amust work together to ensure that our children understand the profound dangers associated with drug use, as well as the legal consequences.

I appreciate hearing from you and hope you will not hesitate to keep in touch on any issue of concern to you.

Sincerely,
Kay Bailey Hutchison

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what this list means to me
Date: May 23, 2004 at 6:16:53 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Sat, May 22, 2004 at 10:05:30AM -0400], [Ann B. Mullikin] wrote:

| Hiya;
|
| I understand you (probably, nothing is absolute) as well
| as anybody here since I am a mother too.  Well said!!! 🙂
|
| ann
| think@francomm.com

| —– Original Message —–
| From: “Veronica Nuemann” <veranuemann@yahoo.com>
| To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
| Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2004 1:53 AM
| Subject: [ibogaine] what this list means to me
|
| > ways that are without the recovery talk that I can’t
| > get my kids to listen to.
| > I can’t get my kids to listen to any talk is the
| > problem, I hate to think so but I’ve almost given up
| > on trying to reach them until they start getting
| > arrested. I don’t know how else to help someone who
| > doesn’t want help.

I wouldn’t give up on trying to reach them…  It’s more like accepting
that whatever it is you want them to hear; probably won’t get heard for a
while … and maybe not ever.

It can take a while for somebody to hit the point where they admit to
themselves that sumthin’ is way-fucked.  Usually people amass a collection
of these moments where they kinda slam headfirst into a brick wall, go
“do’H, that hurT! … Let’S do it agaiN!@#!@!!!” and slowly, over time,
shit kinda piles up until it reaches a stage where they wanna make some
kinda attempt to rISe uP and do sumthin’ ’bout all that.

So … when they hit that stage — whatever moments in time, cause it to
arrive — you at least know about ibogaine; so do your best to align their
Brief Moment of Clarity, with an escape route, that could actually work.

Perhaps they’ll cop a epiphany and come back to Earth highly rearranged.
More likely they’ll glow for a while, and then fall on their ass.  It may
take a few more times to own all that shit and realize: okay, this is the
part where the magic ends, and I have to exert effort, change things, and
do the rest.

No matter what happens, at least they’ve got a piece of hope, which
anchors them to something that worked.

Glimmers of possibility, really beat the fuck out of methadone maintenance
or a UROD.  All you walk away with, from the latter experiences, is a
strong reaffirmation that you’re totally damned and never getting out of
the fucking pit you’re sunk in.

These are just my subjective opinions.  Like I’ve said before, I know
people who have cleaned up — and stayed clean — usin’ both the
afore-mentioned methodologies (even though, they totally suck).

Patrick

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what this list means to me
Date: May 23, 2004 at 6:13:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Sat, May 22, 2004 at 10:05:30AM -0400], [Ann B. Mullikin] wrote:

| Hiya;
|
| I understand you (probably, nothing is absolute) as well
| as anybody here since I am a mother too.  Well said!!! 🙂
|
| ann
| think@francomm.com

| —– Original Message —–
| From: “Veronica Nuemann” <veranuemann@yahoo.com>
| To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
| Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2004 1:53 AM
| Subject: [ibogaine] what this list means to me
|
| > ways that are without the recovery talk that I can’t
| > get my kids to listen to.
| > I can’t get my kids to listen to any talk is the
| > problem, I hate to think so but I’ve almost given up
| > on trying to reach them until they start getting
| > arrested. I don’t know how else to help someone who
| > doesn’t want help.

I wouldn’t give up on trying to reach them…  It’s more like accepting
that whatever it is you want them to hear; probably won’t get heard for a
while … and maybe not ever.

It can take a while to for somebody to hit the point where they admit to
themselves that sumthin’ is way-fucked.  Usually people amass a collection
of these moments where they kinda slam headfirst into a brick wall, go
“do’H, that hurT! … Let’S do it agaiN!@#!@!!!” and slowly, over time,
shit kinda piles up until they reach a stage where they wanna make some
kinda attempt to rISe uP and do sumthin’ ’bout all that.

So … when they hit that stage — whatever moments in time, cause it to
arrive — you at least know about ibogaine; so do your best to align their
Brief Moment of Clarity, with an escape route, that could actually work.

Perhaps they’ll cop a epiphany and come back to Earth highly rearranged.
More likely they’ll glow for a while, and then fall on their ass.  It may
take a few more times to own all that shit and realize: okay, this is the
part where the magic ends, and I have to exert effort, change things, and
do the rest.

No matter what happens, at least they’ve got a piece of hope, which
anchors them to something that worked.

Glimmers of possibility, really beat the fuck out of methadone maintenance
or a UROD.  All you walk away with, from the latter experiences, is a
strong reaffirmation that you’re totally damned and never getting out of
the fucking pit you’re sunk in.

These are just my subjective opinions.  Like I’ve said before, I know
people who have cleaned up — and stayed clean — usin’ both the
afore-mentioned methodologies (even though, they totally suck).

Patrick

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] new source of ibogaine
Date: May 23, 2004 at 5:10:19 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hilarious… had me wetting my lips in anticipation…

all the best,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 23, 2004 8:41 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] new source of ibogaine

For alternate source of ibogaine check out

http://www.ibogaine.org/drlotsof.html

Enjoy.

Howard

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] new source of ibogaine
Date: May 23, 2004 at 2:41:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

For alternate source of ibogaine check out

http://www.ibogaine.org/drlotsof.html

Enjoy.

Howard

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] guided ibogaine studies
Date: May 23, 2004 at 2:40:44 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The guided ibogaine studies presented in the Tours seciton of the ibogaine
dossier have been revised.  Please see http://www.ibogaine.org/tours.html

Howard

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] web page of note
Date: May 23, 2004 at 10:57:36 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Those of you who are new to ibogaine or iboga may not be aware of the work of
the late Dan Lieberman, a photo ethnographer to whom I provided Bwiti
contacts.

Dan was initiated and went on to precipitate the initiation of others.  His
web page is maintained on The Lycaeum and can be found at the url below.  Be
sure to check out all the sections.

http://ibogaine.lycaeum.org/

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com
Date: May 23, 2004 at 6:56:00 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] OASAS ibogaine page
Date: May 22, 2004 at 11:14:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was quite surprised to find the New York State Office of Alcohol and
Substance Abuse Services has an ibogaine page on the web site.

http://www.oasas.state.ny.us/AdMed/meds/fyiibogaine.htm

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net

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From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] what this list means to me
Date: May 22, 2004 at 10:05:30 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hiya;

I understand you (probably, nothing is absolute) as well
as anybody here since I am a mother too.  Well said!!! 🙂

ann
think@francomm.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Veronica Nuemann” <veranuemann@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2004 1:53 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] what this list means to me

I’ve wanted to say something for some time so I
thought now was as good a time as any.
I’ve been reading this list for a few months and want
to thank all of you who participate here. I’m a mother
with two grown children, both are having problems with
drugs that are only getting worse and I don’t know how
to reach them anymore.
I think all of you give me a lot of insight into
addiction and some of the regular posters here give me
hope. I don’t understand what all the rest of mindvox
is but it’s very beautiful and looks like it took a
lot of effort to make it.
Like Jon I very much love reading Patrick’s posts,
Howard’s and all of you really. I am very interested
in ibogaine but I think I’m learning more then making
any plans because those I’d like to have try it are
much more hostile to me then anyone on this list ever
is. You have explosions but somehow calm down and stop
without anyone outside of you making you stop. I think
it’s the first example I’ve seen of the inmates
running the asylum that works better then the other
way around and please don’t take offense I am grateful
to all of you. Patrick thank you also, you are
brilliant at communicating. Someone said this months
ago and it stuck with me, you say ideas in different
ways that are without the recovery talk that I can’t
get my kids to listen to.
I can’t get my kids to listen to any talk is the
problem, I hate to think so but I’ve almost given up
on trying to reach them until they start getting
arrested. I don’t know how else to help someone who
doesn’t want help.
veronica

__________________________________
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Yahoo! Domains – Claim yours for only $14.70/year
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com
Date: May 22, 2004 at 8:18:44 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Maybe I should stay on methadone, but I get confused…….I would like
feedback because I just don’t know. (by the way, I broke my hip, me femur
bone in 2 places, both feet and ankles smashed to powder and my posterior
collar bone.)<

Hi Julian,
I too apologize for my snippy replies to your initial posts. I too can
allow my own personal life situations to influence my writing, particularly
to strangers online.
Concerning your methadone use and motorcycle accident- I spent about 5
years on methadone, and also suffered a fairly serious motorcycle accident
years ago, so I can empathize with much of what you are going through.
Do not let anyone else tell you you must get off methadone. If you are
doing well on it, stay on it. If it is keeping some semblance of normalcy
and stability in your life, by all means, enjoy it. Many people do not ever
find that. Methadone also should help somewhat with your pain, although if
you’ve been on it awhile, you may not notice the pain help due to tolerance
of your current dose.
Anyway, I’m mainly writing to offer support and good will.
Strong thoughts your direction.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Sent: Saturday, May 22, 2004 7:10 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com

It was nice of you to accept my apology for I was very malevolent. The thing
is, all any of us really have is one another. I started taking pills at ten,
never knowing what  they were but remembering my mother giving them to me
for ceratin ailments and remembering what they looked like and how they made
me feel.Upon reflection, L now know they were valium, tuinal, dexedrine,
daprisal, talwin and demerol. At 14, I began to smole pot and take anything
that got me stoned., but it wasn’t until the age of 15, when I first lined
smack, I knew what real love was. I would say I was a garbage head but
heroin was king and queen. Every drug I ingested, I got addicted to whether
phsysiological or psychological but for me the psychological was always the
worst.I had done every type of treatment but nothing ever remained…EXCEPT
METHADONE!! For the first time in my life I was unshackled from the
handcuffs and prison bars of my life. All I ever heard from junkies was how
bad it was for you, but I also realized if they got stoned from it, they
would have loved meth. They weren’t sick, but they weren’t stoned either.

I have 2 daughters who think the world of me, and believe
it or not, in-laws who think more of me than my exwife.We all get along and
my life has never been better, but I wonder, since my motorcycle accident, a
head on collission with a car, I”m just now relearning how to walk again and
the pain is intense. Maybe I should stay on methadone, but I get
confused…….I would like feedback because I just don’t know. (by the way,
I broke my hip, me femur bone in 2 places, both feet and ankles smashed to
powder and my posterior collar bone.)

I have a bad habit of being mean and nasty so I can’t be
hurt first, I don’t want this but you’ll understand when you see my picture.
Thank You again for the chance to explain things and I hope we will remain
friends…..good friends at that…..!

love and thanks,
Julian L. Robinson JR.

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com
Date: May 22, 2004 at 7:10:10 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It was nice of you to accept my apology for I was very malevolent. The thing is, all any of us really have is one another. I started taking pills at ten, never knowing what  they were but remembering my mother giving them to me for ceratin ailments and remembering what they looked like and how they made me feel.Upon reflection, L now know they were valium, tuinal, dexedrine, daprisal, talwin and demerol. At 14, I began to smole pot and take anything that got me stoned., but it wasn’t until the age of 15, when I first lined smack, I knew what real love was. I would say I was a garbage head but heroin was king and queen. Every drug I ingested, I got addicted to whether phsysiological or psychological but for me the psychological was always the worst.I had done every type of treatment but nothing ever remained…EXCEPT METHADONE!! For the first time in my life I was unshackled from the handcuffs and prison bars of my life. All I ever heard from junkies was how bad it was for you, but I also realized if they got stoned from it, they would have loved meth. They weren’t sick, but they weren’t stoned either.

I have 2 daughters who think the world of me, and believe it or not, in-laws who think more of me than my exwife.We all get along and my life has never been better, but I wonder, since my motorcycle accident, a head on collission with a car, I”m just now relearning how to walk again and the pain is intense. Maybe I should stay on methadone, but I get confused…….I would like feedback because I just don’t know. (by the way, I broke my hip, me femur bone in 2 places, both feet and ankles smashed to powder and my posterior collar bone.)

I have a bad habit of being mean and nasty so I can’t be hurt first, I don’t want this but you’ll understand when you see my picture. Thank You again for the chance to explain things and I hope we will remain friends…..good friends at that…..!

love and thanks,
Julian L. Robinson JR.

 

From: Veronica Nuemann <veranuemann@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] what this list means to me
Date: May 22, 2004 at 1:53:03 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve wanted to say something for some time so I
thought now was as good a time as any.
I’ve been reading this list for a few months and want
to thank all of you who participate here. I’m a mother
with two grown children, both are having problems with
drugs that are only getting worse and I don’t know how
to reach them anymore.
I think all of you give me a lot of insight into
addiction and some of the regular posters here give me
hope. I don’t understand what all the rest of mindvox
is but it’s very beautiful and looks like it took a
lot of effort to make it.
Like Jon I very much love reading Patrick’s posts,
Howard’s and all of you really. I am very interested
in ibogaine but I think I’m learning more then making
any plans because those I’d like to have try it are
much more hostile to me then anyone on this list ever
is. You have explosions but somehow calm down and stop
without anyone outside of you making you stop. I think
it’s the first example I’ve seen of the inmates
running the asylum that works better then the other
way around and please don’t take offense I am grateful
to all of you. Patrick thank you also, you are
brilliant at communicating. Someone said this months
ago and it stuck with me, you say ideas in different
ways that are without the recovery talk that I can’t
get my kids to listen to.
I can’t get my kids to listen to any talk is the
problem, I hate to think so but I’ve almost given up
on trying to reach them until they start getting
arrested. I don’t know how else to help someone who
doesn’t want help.
veronica

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Domains – Claim yours for only $14.70/year
http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:35:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julian, You know I said that something good always comes from everything. I think I mentioned to you that I stay very busy here and can’t correspond as much as I would like.
I care for my boyfriend of 12 years, Charlie. In 1999, he was in an auto accident that left him a quadriplegic. He has movement in his arms and some in his hands but they are very weak. Since all 4 extremities are affected he is considered a quad. He has no movement of legs and depends on a foley catheter to drain urine and I help him with bowel program for elimination. I am telling you this since you said you were injured in motorcycle accident. Please tell me more about yourself.
I have been on methadone 7 years now and I am quite happy with it. It is the only ‘normalcy’ I have known. I started smoking weed about 14 years old and immediately began experimenting with everything. I was able to not become physically addicted until my 20’s! lol! Opiates were my favorites and believe it or not I would take a lifetime of Tussionex cough syrup if offered! It was my drug of choice. Dilaudids were my needle addiction. I really got tired of chasing pills though. Methadone literally saved my life!
Where do you live? Married? Children?
I will write more later.
Do not be angry please if it takes me a while to answer.
Also, don’t leave the list. EVERYBODY has shown their ass there at least once!
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:33:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julian, I accept your apology. As far as I am concerned it was a spat and is now water under the bridge.
Sorry about your withdrawals.
Don’t leave. There is a lot folks have to offer here.
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:31:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julian, You know I said that something good always comes from everything. I think I mentioned to you that I stay very busy here and can’t correspond as much as I would like.
I care for my boyfriend of 12 years, Charlie. In 1999, he was in an auto accident that left him a quadriplegic. He has movement in his arms and some in his hands but they are very weak. Since all 4 extremities are affected he is considered a quad. He has no movement of legs and depends on a foley catheter to drain urine and I help him with bowel program for elimination. I am telling you this since you said you were injured in motorcycle accident. Please tell me more about yourself.
I have been on methadone 7 years now and I am quite happy with it. It is the only ‘normalcy’ I have known. I started smoking weed about 14 years old and immediately began experimenting with everything. I was able to not become physically addicted until my 20’s! lol! Opiates were my favorites and believe it or not I would take a lifetime of Tussionex cough syrup if offered! It was my drug of choice. Dilaudids were my needle addiction. I really got tired of chasing pills though. Methadone literally saved my life!
Where do you live? Married? Children?
I will write more later.
Do not be angry please if it takes me a while to answer.
Also, don’t leave the list. EVERYBODY has shown their ass there at least once!
Callie

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:26:50 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well said Julian.

Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com

You know, it really did upset me that I was essentially ‘hated’ by so many.
I would never have left the site but I had decided to never talk again.
Callie, I hate deragotory words as “nigger” or spic etc., etc. for they are
only symbols of ignorance. I’m not even sure what went wrong except when I
asked for help about getting off methadone via Iboga, I received a letter I
now know was not from you. Of course at the time, I had no idea who it was
from. Though, it might be nice to be liked by everyone, I am too old and too
experienced to care about that. I just wanted to be part of a site that
could actually could do some good…….for other people as well as myself!
Who knows, maybe it still can.

I will say for my part and responsibility, I’ve been going
through withdrawal on the meth and am this close to going back to the
needle. I was hoping for a miracle with Iboga, but as with everything else
in life, NO$, NO SHIT!!! (this is not a sob story, but I was a severe
motorcycle accident back in October and haven’t worked since. You know how
long lawsuits take so……….) Anyway, I’m sorry for any negative attitude
on my part; it will not happen again!!)

Love and my
apologies,
Julian L.
Robinson Jr.

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:07:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am sorry for anything I have said . I am not going to blame it on anything but myself. I am going through a painful withdrawal from methadone and I thought there would be relief at the site. There was none and I became angry. I also received a bizarre letter about bitches, and niggers and I also don’t take kindly to that. I felt my pain was being minimized and made light of. I can’t take much more of this so I was angry. Unfortunately there’s nothing any of you can do for me but that gives me no right to take it out on you. I truly, truly am sorry. I had expected someone to help me immediately but that’s my unrealistic expectations! Thanks for being there anyway.

Love and Thanks,
Julian L. Robinson Jr.

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Callie Mimosa @aol.com
Date: May 21, 2004 at 6:54:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You know, it really did upset me that I was essentially ‘hated’ by so many. I would never have left the site but I had decided to never talk again. Callie, I hate deragotory words as “nigger” or spic etc., etc. for they are only symbols of ignorance. I’m not even sure what went wrong except when I asked for help about getting off methadone via Iboga, I received a letter I now know was not from you. Of course at the time, I had no idea who it was from. Though, it might be nice to be liked by everyone, I am too old and too experienced to care about that. I just wanted to be part of a site that could actually could do some good…….for other people as well as myself! Who knows, maybe it still can.

I will say for my part and responsibility, I’ve been going through withdrawal on the meth and am this close to going back to the needle. I was hoping for a miracle with Iboga, but as with everything else in life, NO$, NO SHIT!!! (this is not a sob story, but I was a severe motorcycle accident back in October and haven’t worked since. You know how long lawsuits take so……….) Anyway, I’m sorry for any negative attitude on my part; it will not happen again!!)

Love and my apologies,
Julian L. Robinson Jr.

From: Jon Ludlam <seraphina@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 5:31:09 PM EDT
To: “INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

RE:     Re: [ibogaine] list options
seraphina- mellow out . Go to Iraq or something if you are so angry.

Dear Schmoolyboy,
I believe that you have mistaken my reply to Callie with something that was
written
by Sapphiredust, to which I responded that a strong message would follow
from Callie’s
response, which was F/U.
I was not angry then, nor am I angry now.
If you do not agree with what I am writing please copy to me what you
believe that I wrote
so that I may respond.

While on the subject, I believe the best response that was posted on this
subject came from
Sara Glatt, who showed compassion for someone who was obviously hurting.

(Sara you are the Light)

If I had it to do over again, I would have asked what I could do to help
Saffiredust instead of
responding that a strong message  would follow, which is an old joke. If
you don’t recall the
joke it is F/U strong message to follow. I read Mindvox IBO posts daily,
because I have a deep
concern for all who have been enslaved by drugs.

Most importantly, I read these posts because it gives me a better
understanding of the problem,
and I feel I am better able to fight Satan by doing so. Lastly, I read
these posts because I
LOVE reading Patrick’s, Howard’s, Sara’s and Brett’s posts, as thay have
been helpful in understanding what both
of my children are going through.

Respectfully Yours,

Jon Ludlam (Seraphina)

Date:   5/21/04  7:42 AM

RE:     Re: [ibogaine] list options

seraphina- mellow out . Go to Iraq or something if you are so angry.

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Adam
Date: May 21, 2004 at 5:17:01 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeah, I guess I could have been clearer. I was not trying to anger him though. Hell, up to that point I had been enjoying Julians perspective on the subjects that were being discussed on list.
As far as I am concerned it is over. I am sorry the entire argument took place. Something good is always learned when something bad happens. Guess I have learned to be more direct.
Peace, Callie

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Adam
Date: May 21, 2004 at 4:58:55 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Last time I got into some dumbass shit was pretty embarassing… someone on this list replied in this off-hand manner to someone else, names don’t matter, and I took ‘real’ offense, misreading him completely and coupled with how I got out of the wrong side of the hammock that morning, I dissed him. But this guy just pulled me aside, ie off-list, and confronted me about it- and of course he was right, I was wrong- and that was a very smarting lesson I got that day. Thanks dude, still smarts.

Point is, Callie, you did ‘slight’ or ‘snub’ the guy, if not ‘diss’, with that parting remark and it set him off, big time. You didn’t say, ‘Please don’t use the N word, even in jest, as it offends me’.

But hey, you’re in good company, flames are like vaccines, you’re gonna get some every so often- unless you’re a mute PC prude or somethin’…

And even so, my diatribe was mostly aimed at the re-christianing tournament that followed- that came from people I know, respect and like and I thought – ‘Schmoolyboy, et tu, Schmoolyboy?’  Jus’ kidding there, but there’s some truth to it, it wasn’t cool…

As for AOL, that’s just a spoof rant for ventertainment purposes only.

GUR

…y’all waiting for me to take off my fire-retardant super-suit, arentcha….

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 21, 2004 7:17 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Adam

Adam,
Sorry but I can’t keep this to myself as you suggested we do. I have to defend myself. Julians response was way inappropriate to what I posted. In hindsight, he should’ve replied that this was a e-mail he received when he asked for help or info on Ibogaine.
I was not personally diss’ing him. I HATE the word nigger or niggah! Sorry, but I will always speak up if I hear or see anyone use that word inappropriately. (any use of the word is uncalled for in my opinion)
I hope Julian is not gone from the list forever. Everyone does not have to ‘get along’ in order for learning to take place.
I was subservient and passive for too many years. I will follow the rules but will not be verbally abused or tolerate the ‘n’ word.
Sorry if my AOL offends you but I like AOL.
Callie

Yo! ‘sup Yo? Ya’ll punkinout my man! Wusup withchall Yawll whiteys keep fgintuo fot us real soldierboys. You ain’t no real nigguh, mah n igguh! Aways comes down to duh reel b oyz, yo?! Igotta bone da bitcjhdonow so on duh latuh.

Da makoytuhlatuh,

Dah man in dah wet,

Peenut juice
my reply……

???I must’ve missed a post or two somewhere!??
I could’ve accidentally hit the delete button….wished I would’ve hit it on this one!

Callie

his very, very angry reply…..

Callie, you remind me of a newspaper journalist trying to make a name for herself without having all the facts! This was an E-mail text I received from a group I had heard about nearthe Tex-Mex Border. So far you have sent two e-mails that are more than negative but quite indicative if your naivete and chemical/euphoric ignorance. It is nice that you at least have the motivation to learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go before you earn the rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and boys.

Callie has been around much longer than I and she probably has quite a bit to offer, but cerebral knowledge compares NOTHING with EMPIRICAL as well as CEREBRAL. So this is the deal littlr girl, if you have a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare sit on your hands and make value judgements on subjects you know SHIT about!! Your ‘middle class’ values and judgements leave alot to be desired and are best kept to yourself. It is the very people as yourself that have poisoned this once great society and culture all in the name of  educating and teaching the poor and           mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far better than you ever could have!!!

Why don’t you back to your small town college and obtain your “MSW” so you can ‘help’ people  become part of this ‘great’ culturte that you have created  ….poisoned and destroyed. GOODBYE CALLIE…..it’s been real!!!!!

From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] CSI: QUIT CLOWNING AROUND WITH IBOGAINE!
Date: May 21, 2004 at 2:06:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

gboy@hush.com wrote:
Dana how do you think all of this relates to the CSI episode on ibogaine?
.g

Well, I think the obvious relation is that like the addicts in the episode, this guy  Sapphire is having a hard time getting it. Like MIndy says– “Go where”

I decided to comment because some one just sent me this neat summary of the whole episode, including clowns–
http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/story.cgi?show=15&story=6326&limit=all&sort=
Protest Sign should read: QUIT CLOWNING AROUND WITH IBOGAINE!

Of course, we didn’t think of it until after the protest. Hadn’t seen the actual episode yet, even though our basic objection was painfully obvious ahead of time: They were going to have to find Ibogaine at the murder scene to introduce it into the plot, and that’s simply inconsistent with the practice of almost all the providers I know of, who DO NOT bring ibo into the U.S. Like the man says: We DON”T give out illegal drugs, and especially, don’t go cruising around underpasses looking for a particular recently relapsed female with Indra extract in the car!

What was Jerry Stahl thinking? That you’re going to give Ibogaine on the spot to Mindy and bring her back to the halfway house before she starts really tripping? Before she gets sleep paralysis and motion-sickness? Triggering possible bradycardia? Who is going to risk it, when you can give Ibogaine nice and legal in a facility in Montreal to some one who’s already safely inside, away from the street.
Other inconsistencies (and they abound) include the implication that Jamal the thief dipped into the ibogaine, and that’s how he got into his accident. (In the literature, it says that some people on ibogaine find people and things look like “cartoons”–something a scriptwriter would hang on to.) Problem is, the ibogaine they find in the car is meant to be Indra, since it’s brown and HCl is white. Problem is Jamal couldn’t have shot INDRA, since it’s not a salt but a kind of “instant tea.” And Jamal is a stone needle-freak, who wouldn’t do it unless he could shoot it. And unless he shot it he couldn’t  get the effect–too much to drive, not enough to break his addiction–for him to end up in the next scene, in pain and still obviously addicted.

Forget about the fact that Bwiti is a religion, not a tribe (200 tribes is more like it), or that ibogaine’s from the bark of the root, not of the tree. The real substantive charge is that pushing Ibogaine on addicts is a new form of addiction in itself, a kind of religious fanaticism a la Jim Jones. They’re taking the very real fact that propagating the word of ibogaine is effective in keeping ex-addicts clean every bit as much as the 12 steps and trying to make an issue of their view that their 12 steps is better than our Bwiti.

As for the clowns, at least the ending of the episode makes oblique commentary on the rightness of our cause: “If you found something that got you off, you’d keep it–right?”

How can they take it away?  Contact me about treatments in Montreal. 212-677-4899.

Dana/cnw

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Adam
Date: May 21, 2004 at 1:17:57 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Adam,
Sorry but I can’t keep this to myself as you suggested we do. I have to defend myself. Julians response was way inappropriate to what I posted. In hindsight, he should’ve replied that this was a e-mail he received when he asked for help or info on Ibogaine.
I was not personally diss’ing him. I HATE the word nigger or niggah! Sorry, but I will always speak up if I hear or see anyone use that word inappropriately. (any use of the word is uncalled for in my opinion)
I hope Julian is not gone from the list forever. Everyone does not have to ‘get along’ in order for learning to take place.
I was subservient and passive for too many years. I will follow the rules but will not be verbally abused or tolerate the ‘n’ word.
Sorry if my AOL offends you but I like AOL.
Callie

Yo! ‘sup Yo? Ya’ll punkinout my man! Wusup withchall Yawll whiteys keep fgintuo fot us real soldierboys. You ain’t no real nigguh, mah n igguh! Aways comes down to duh reel b oyz, yo?! Igotta bone da bitcjhdonow so on duh latuh.

Da makoytuhlatuh,

Dah man in dah wet,

Peenut juice
my reply……

???I must’ve missed a post or two somewhere!??
I could’ve accidentally hit the delete button….wished I would’ve hit it on this one!

Callie

his very, very angry reply…..

Callie, you remind me of a newspaper journalist trying to make a name for herself without having all the facts! This was an E-mail text I received from a group I had heard about nearthe Tex-Mex Border. So far you have sent two e-mails that are more than negative but quite indicative if your naivete and chemical/euphoric ignorance. It is nice that you at least have the motivation to learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go before you earn the rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and boys.

Callie has been around much longer than I and she probably has quite a bit to offer, but cerebral knowledge compares NOTHING with EMPIRICAL as well as CEREBRAL. So this is the deal littlr girl, if you have a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare sit on your hands and make value judgements on subjects you know SHIT about!! Your ‘middle class’ values and judgements leave alot to be desired and are best kept to yourself. It is the very people as yourself that have poisoned this once great society and culture all in the name of  educating and teaching the poor and           mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far better than you ever could have!!!

Why don’t you back to your small town college and obtain your “MSW” so you can ‘help’ people  become part of this ‘great’ culturte that you have created  ….poisoned and destroyed. GOODBYE CALLIE…..it’s been real!!!!!

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 1:19:01 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It seemed to me that trolling, goadin, and baiting was all that he was
doing…

Here’s his post if you care to look it over, he later wrote that it’s a
verbatim email he got from someone else (Peenut juice?) in response to his
ibogaine inquiry …  frankly he hasn’t been coherent enough to be deemed a
troller etc…

GUR

——————

Yo! ‘sup Yo? Ya’ll punkinout my man! Wusup withchall Yawll whiteys keep
fgintuo fot us real soldierboys. You ain’t no real nigguh, mah n igguh!
Aways comes down to duh reel b oyz, yo?! Igotta bone da bitcjhdonow so on
duh latuh.

Da
makoytuhlatuh,

Dah man in
dah wet,

Pe
enut juice

——————-

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 11:53:03 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes, I know, how droll indeed. And you wonder why the guy went ballistic.
Next thing you know it’s a verbal fuck-fest on the guy’s handle (dude, it
really sucks tho’) and we’re all hi-fiving ourselves for chasing away a
meth-head who was not trolling or goading or baiting anyone on this list.
Bra-fuckin-Vo.

It seemed to me that trolling, goadin, and baiting was all that he was
doing…

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From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 12:49:46 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Geez, WTF people, this list is starting to resemble Lord of the Flies meets Abu Ghraib…. a little perspective perhaps? And please, pretty please with a popped cherry on top, enuf with the hypocrisy, ok?

Callie dissed this person, that’s what brought on his angry response- to paraphrase her initial comment-  “uhh, I don’t understand this… uhh, maybe I accidently deleted previous posts…uhh -wish I accidently deleted this one!”
Yes, I know, how droll indeed. And you wonder why the guy went ballistic. Next thing you know it’s a verbal fuck-fest on the guy’s handle (dude, it really sucks tho’) and we’re all hi-fiving ourselves for chasing away a meth-head who was not trolling or goading or baiting anyone on this list. Bra-fuckin-Vo.

So next time round, whether it’s “ah’lan-wa-sah’lan” or “mushi-mushi” or “w’sup ni-ggah”; either respond in kind or keep it to your-ROTF-self.

GUR

And another thing, since I already donned my fire-retardant super-suit… All you people on AOL, I just wanna squish your puny little labrat brains. You all look like stuffed turkey pies on a conveyer belt funneled onto some fenced-up, handicap-designated playpen for corporate monitoring purposes- it stands for Airheads On Leashes and I’d love nothing more than to slam training wheels into your ears and- HEY- I’m just kidding -AHAHHAHAHAAHAHAHHAHAHA – see?

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:34:08 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

3 cheeers for Callie Hip hippy  hurray

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Would you use ibogaine?
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:31:52 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

good post and article H.W.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:31:14 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

seraphina- mellow out . Go to Iraq or something if you are so angry.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 21, 2004 at 7:30:08 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Right on Callie . You go girl

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Breaking it all down! ;>)
Date: May 20, 2004 at 6:56:40 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LMAO 🙂 Thanks Callie, I haven’t read the list
instructions lateley 😉

Patrick that was brilliantly twisted. It’s also a
great way of describing this whole list in a positive
way 🙂 Thank you, you’re a really weird combination
of being beautiful person who is psychotic some of the
time and has a huge amount of patience the rest 😉

Hi Saphirestardust, welcome to the utopian society of
the ibogaine list 😉

Carla B

— CallieMimosa@aol.com wrote:

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Ex-FBI Lab Worker Guilty, Falsified DNA
Date: May 20, 2004 at 6:35:32 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

://www.sanluisobispo.com/mld/sanluisobispo/news/politics/8697344.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp
Ex-FBI Lab Worker Guilty, Falsified DNA

CURT ANDERSON
Associated Press

WASHINGTON – A former biologist in the FBI laboratory pleaded guilty Tuesday to submitting falsified DNA analysis reports in over 100 cases.

Jacqueline A. Blake, 40, of Upper Marlboro, Md., pleaded guilty in U.S. District Court in Washington to a single count of making false statements on official government reports she prepared. Blake faces a maximum penalty of a year in prison and a $100,000 fine at sentencing scheduled for Sept. 20.

Blake admitted that from August 1999 to June 2002 she wrote and submitted more than 100 reports containing false statements about her DNA analysis work. In particular, she falsely certified that she had performed certain control tests designed to ensure the reliability of the DNA analysis.

DNA evidence has increasingly become crucial in prosecuting criminal cases and in appeals of old criminal convictions that occurred before the sophisticated analysis techniques were used. Attorney General John Ashcroft has launched a project to create a national DNA database for law enforcement to use.

The Associated Press reported in April 2003 that Blake had resigned from the FBI amid a probe questioning her work on 103 cases. Blake worked for the FBI as a DNA biologist from 1988 until she quit in June 2002, according to court documents.

According to her plea agreement, Blake knew her certifications were false and submitted them even though she knew her work might be used in criminal investigations and in trial testimony. It was unclear Tuesday, based on the court documents, whether any of those cases were compromised.

The case is part of a broader investigation by Glenn A. Fine, the Justice Department inspector general, into the FBI lab unit in which Blake worked. A Justice Department statement said Fine’s findings and conclusions will be issued “in the near future.”

The current FBI lab director, Dwight Adams, has said changes have been put in place in the DNA section to address past problems and ensure that quality analysis is done. The FBI’s DNA database has helped law enforcement officials solve more than 11,000 cases in the past few years, officials say.

ON THE NET

Justice Department: http://www.usdoj.gov

© 2004 AP Wire and wire service sources. All Rights Reserved.
http://www.sanluisobispo.com

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] [clear@harmreduction.org: Write to the NIH regarding the Souder letter]
Date: May 20, 2004 at 6:11:10 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: “Allan Clear” <clear@harmreduction.org>
Subject: Write to the NIH regarding the Souder letter
Date: May 20, 2004 at 4:48:17 PM EDT
To: digital@phantom.com

Everyone:
Late last month Congressman Mark Souder sent a letter to the Director of the NIH addressing his concerns about harm reduction. His fanciful, inflammatory and inaccurate letter is posted below. Underneath his letter is HRC’s response. To view more responses see the Drug Policy Alliance’s website http://www.drugpolicy.org/relatedTextsMore.cfm?contentTypeID=131&keywordIDList=51,998&prevSectionID=16
For some more background on Souder also check out http://www.drugpolicy.org/news/05_11_04souder.cfm
His opinions on drugs especially medical marijuana http://souder.house.gov/Issues/Issue/?IssueID=678
His excitement over that major drug dealer Peter Jennings http://www.gopusa.com/news/2004/april/0406_souder_jennings_ecstasy.shtml
and a more balanced view of the same program http://www.indystar.com/articles/1/145763-4201-109.html
His ACLU report card http://archive.aclu.org/vote-guide/396.html
Paul Sedita who’s a staff person at HRC also said ” I know of him is because he championed replacing Franklin Roosevelt on the dime with Ronald Reagan. When Democrats pointed out the connection between FDR’s polio and support for the March of Dimes, Souder claimed, “It is particularly fitting to honor the freedom president on this particular piece of coinage” because Reagan was “wounded under the left arm by a bullet that had ricocheted and flattened to the size of a dime.” Nancy Reagan opposed the change.” I can’t vouch for Paul’s recollection but he can bear my children.
I’m sending this message out to encourage you to write to Dr. Zerhouni. I think it would be helpful for him to hear from the wider community. We can also look at this as an opportunity to have the science around syringe exchange looked at and to raise the issue again of lifting the Federal ban on the funding of syringe exchange. However be aware that it is not in Dr. Zerhouni’s power to lift the ban. Feel free to pillage or replicate HRC’s letter and use the other responses as background sources. Please be polite because this is not Dr. Zerhouni’s fault. Be respectful of Souder even if you do think he’s a total bastard.
Allan

April 27, 2004
Honorable Elias A. Zerhouni, M.D.
Director
National Institutes of Health
9000 Rockville Pike
Bethesda, Maryland 20892
Dear Dr. Zerhouni:
As you know, “harm reduction” is an ideological position that assumes individuals cannot or will not make healthy decisions.  Advocates of this position hold that dangerous behaviors, such as drug abuse, should be accepted by society and those who choose such lifestyles — or become trapped in them — should be enabled to continue these behaviors in a less harmful manner.  Often, however, these lifestyles are the result of addiction, mental illness of other conditions that should and can be treated rather than accepted as normative, healthy behaviors.  Sadly, harm reduction largely ignores these realities and programs driven by this ideological position have not been adequately reviewed with unbiased, scientific rigor.
I am concerned that harm reduction programs that sustain continued drug abuse, such as injection rooms and needle distributions, likely weaken drug abusers’ defenses against infection, sustain drug abusers’ long term risk for disease, and minimize the benefits of the available treatments for HIV disease.
These dangers seem to have received insufficient attention by some federal health agencies.  Yet, peer-reviewed scientific and anecdotal evidence appear to support this assertion.
Needle exchange is the most visible harm reduction program for injection drug users (IDUs).  The first needle exchange programs (NEPs) in the United States were established in Tacoma, Portland, San Francisco, and New York City in the late 1980s in an effort to prevent HIV infection among IDUs.  By 1997, there were 113 such programs in more than 30 states.
Vancouver, British Columbia, administers the largest NEP in North America, distributing nearly three million needles every year.  The city has a publicly sanctioned site specifically designated for addicts to inject under medical supervision absent of law enforcement.  The results of this approach have been horrific.  When the Vancouver NEP was established in the late 1980s, the estimated HIV prevalence in Vancouver was 1 to 2 percent among the city’s population of 6,000 to 10,000 IDUs.  While the expectation was for needle exchange to decrease HIV rates, the opposite has occurred.  Both HIV and Hepatitis C have reached “saturation” among the injection drug using population, meaning few if any of those who are not already infected are left to become newly infected, according to the Vancouver Drug Use Epidemiology report published by the city in July 2003.  The HIV prevalence among the Vancouver Injection Drug User Study (VIDUS) cohort is 35 percent with “one of the highest incidence rates reported worldwide,” according to the 2003 Vancouver Drug Use Epidemiology report.  The VIDUS has an astounding 82 percent prevalence of Hepatitis C.
While both HIV and Hepatitis C rates have increased in Vancouver since the establishment of the NEP, research has directly linked the NEP to this trend.  A study published in the journal AIDS in 1997 found that “frequent NEP attendance” was actually one of the “independent predictors of HIV-serostatus” among IDUs.  The study found that HIV-positive IDUs were more likely to have attended NEP and to attend NEP on a more regular basis compared with HIV-negative IDUs.  Of those IDUs observed who became HIV infected during the course of the study, about 80 percent said they had no difficulty accessing syringes.  And with only one lone exception, the NEP was the main source of syringes for all of those who became infected.  Needle sharing by IDUs in Vancouver is normative, and quite widespread.  VIDUS data published in 1997 found 76 percent of HIV-positive IDUs studied admitted to borrowing used needles as did 67 percent of HIV-negative IDUs.  Thirty-nine percent of HIV-positive IDUs lent used needles (Strathdee S.A., et. al.  “Needle exchange is not enough: lessons from the Vancouver injecting drug use study.”  AIDS. 1997; 8: F56-65).
The failure of harm reduction to control infectious disease is not limited to Vancouver. Researchers in Montreal studied nearly 1,600 needle-exchange participants for an average of 21.7 months.  The study revealed seroconversion probability of 33 percent among needle exchange users and 13 percent among non-users.  The case-control study suggested that consistent needle exchange use continued to be associated with HIV seroconversions during follow-up.  Despite adjustments for confounders, the researchers noted that HIV risk elevations related to needle exchange remained both substantial and consistent in their cohort of intravenous drug users (Bruneau J., et. al.  “High rates of HIV infection among injection drug users in needle exchange programs in Montreal: results of a cohort
study.”  Am J Epidermal. 1997; 146: 904-1002).
A study of needle exchange programs in Seattle found no protective effect of needle/syringe exchange on the transmission of Hepatitis B or Hepatitis C among participants.  The highest incidence of infection with both viruses occurred among current users of the exchange (Hagan H, et. al. “Syringe exchange and risk of infection with Hepatitis B and C viruses.”  Am J Epidermal.  1999; 149: 203-218).
Needle exchanges focus almost exclusively upon a single mode of transmission among IDUs-sharing of contaminated needles-and largely ignore other important factors such as the individual, the behaviors that cause risk taking, the impact of the substance on the individual and the substance being abused itself.
Studies are increasingly finding these factors play significant harm to IDUs that cannot be reduced by merely providing an unlimited supply of clean needles. A 10-year study published in the Archives of Internal Medicine found that the biggest predictor of HIV infection for both male and female IDUs is high-risk sexual behavior, not sharing needles used to inject drugs.  High-risk homosexual activity was the most important factor in HIV transmission for men; high-risk heterosexual activity was most significant for women.  Risky drug-use behaviors also were strong predictors of HIV transmission for men but were less significant for women, the study found.
“In the past, we assumed that IDUs who were HIV-positive had been infected with the virus through needle-sharing,” noted Dr. Steffanie Strathdee of the Johns Hopkins University Bloomberg School of Public Health in Baltimore, who conducted the study.  “Our analysis indicates that sexual behaviors, which we thought were less important among IDUs, really carry a heavy weight in terms of risks for HIV seroconversion for both men and women.”  (Strathdee, S.A., et al. “Sex differences in risk factors for HIV seroconversion among injection drug users.”  Archives of Internal Medicine 161:1281-1288, 2001)
Another recent study has found that drug abuse reduces the benefits of AIDS therapy.  “There is evidence that HIV-positive injecting drug users benefit less than other risk groups from highly active antiretroviral therapy that has been available since 1996,” according to a study published in the European Journal of Public Health (“Limited effect of highly active antiretroviral therapy among HIV-positive injecting drug users on the population level.”  European Journal of Public Health, 2003;13(4):347-349).
Previous research has also demonstrated that “club drugs” can adversely affect AIDS treatment outcomes, both through drug interactions and by affecting adherence to HIV drugs.  Methamphetamines and MDMA have a potential interaction with all of the protease inhibitors and delavirdine used to treat HIV infection.  Both GHB and marijuana have also demonstrated potential interaction with AIDS medications.
Recently, there has also been some discussion about the possibility that continued drug abuse by those being treated for HIV infection could potentially spawn drug resistant strains of HIV.  This could result from the negative impact of illegal drugs on the body’s natural defenses and from insufficient adherence to drug taking regimens by those under the influence of controlled substances.
Now investigators at the McLean Hospital Alcohol and Drug Abuse Research Center in Belmont, Massachusetts, have found that cocaine itself has a direct biological effect that may decrease an abuser’s ability to fight off infections.
“This research suggests a link between cocaine use and compromised immune response and could help explain the high incidence of infectious disease among drug abusers,” observes Dr. Steven Grant of NIDA’s Division of Treatment Research and Development (Halpern, J. H., et al. “Diminished interleukin-6 response to proinflammatory challenge in men and women after intravenous cocaine administration.”  Journal of Clinical Endocrinology and Metabolism 88(3):1188-1193, 2003).
Research has demonstrated that MDMA is immunosuppressive (Connor, T.J., Methylenedioxymethamphetamine (MDMA, ‘Ecstasy’): a stressor on the immune system.” Immunology 111(4):357- 367, April 2004) and there is a relationship between meth abuse and immune dysfunction (Qianli, Y., et. al.  “Heart disease, methamphetamine and AIDS.”  Life Sciences 73(2):129-140, May 2003).
This scientific and anecdotal evidence appears to indicate that harm reduction programs have failed to provide a prevention panacea for drug abusers against the dangers of HIV, hepatitis and other health risks.
Please provide a summary of the available scientific data demonstrating:
1. The impact of drug abuse on the body’s immune system;
2. Impaired decision making that increases HIV risk as a result of drug intoxication;
3. HIV risk by drug users attributable to risky sexual behavior in exchange for drugs and drug money;
4. Cultural or normative needle sharing behaviors by drug using populations; and
5. Inferior health outcomes among those being treated for HIV infection.
The finding that continued drug abuse may impair treatment benefits of those infected with HIV while further damaging the immune system raises the alarming possibility that sustained drug abuse may incubate resistant strains of HIV. Have there been or are there any studies, ongoing or planned, examining the possibility that continued drug abuse by those being treated for HIV infection could contribute to the development of drug resistant strains of the virus?
Thank you for your assistance with this request.  Please provide a response by September 1, 2004.
Sincerely,
Mark E. Souder
Chairman, Subcommittee on Criminal Justice,
Drug Policy and Human Resources

5/7/2004

Honorable Elias A. Zerhouni, M.D.
Director
National Institutes of Health
9000 Rockville Pike
Bethesda, Maryland 20892

Dear Dr. Zerhouni:

As you know, the application of public health in the United States is sometimes inhibited by ideological positions that are fashioned by personal belief systems rather than science. Congressman Souder’s letter of April 27th regarding the value of harm reduction programs for substance users offers a selective review and distorted interpretation of the wealth of available research on the subject. I would like to address eight inaccurate assertions by Congressman Souder about harm reduction programs and the science evaluating those programs.

1. “…’harm reduction’ is an ideological position that assumes individuals cannot or will not make healthy decisions.”

The harm reduction model asserts that individuals will make healthy choices if provided with accurate information and with access to tangible resources such as injection equipment, drug treatment and other health services. Harm reduction is not a deficit model.

2.  “Advocates of this position hold that dangerous behaviors, such as drug abuse, should be accepted by society and those who choose such lifestyles – or become trapped in them – should be enabled to continue these behaviors in a less harmful manner.”

Implicit in the term harm reduction is the belief that drugs can cause real harms. However, these harms are not an inevitable consequence of drug use, and can be prevented or ameliorated through a range of strategies that include but do not invariably require complete cessation from all drug use.  Indeed, history suggests that narrowly focusing health promotion and disease
prevention efforts on eliminating the use of all psychoactive substances would be neither feasible or effective.  Therefore harm reduction posits that reducing damage from consumption of drugs (including alcohol and nicotine) is a more realistic and pragmatic approach. In many cases, reducing drug-related harm entails reduction of drug consumption, through interventions that include prevention of initiating drug use, abstinence, maintenance and substitution therapies, and substance abuse treatment.  Harm reduction practice in fact encompasses the promotion of all of these interventions, tailored to meet individual needs and circumstances.  Yet the harm reduction model also recognizes that cessation of drug use can be extremely difficult and can take multiple

attempts, with recurring cycles of reduced consumption and relapse.  Therefore individuals caught in these cycles need support to stave off unnecessary death and disease and other social harms during periods of active drug use.  Congressman Souder mischaracterizes harm reduction practice by constructing a false dichotomy between harm reduction and abstinence-oriented approaches, when in fact these strategies would be more accurately described as overlapping elements within a continuum of care.

3. “These lifestyles are the result of addiction, mental illness of other conditions that should and can be treated rather than accepted as normative, healthy behaviors.  Sadly, harm reduction largely ignores these realities…”

On the contrary, harm reduction workers are perhaps the only people effectively addressing these conditions among the majority of drug users not currently receiving treatment. Indeed, harm reduction takes on all the greater urgency for this population given the limited success of alternate strategies in the United States.  The harms and risks of addiction and mental illness are too often compounded by policies that respond to drug use through incarceration, expulsion from public housing, exclusion from shelter, discrimination and structural barriers to accessing medical care and social services, permanent removal of children, and denial of public welfare and other benefits and financial assistance programs. Harm reduction practitioners recognize and respond to addiction and mental illness as critical health problems that develop and function within an array of cultural contexts and social forces that cannot be reduced or responded to solely through medical models.  Harm reduction attempts to promote and facilitate access to care for addiction and mental illness while recognizing the impact of structural impediments to effective and appropriate treatment.

4. “Sadly, harm reduction largely ignores these realities and programs driven by this ideological position have not been adequately reviewed with unbiased, scientific rigor.”

Congressman Souder’s contention is insupportable.  The most cursory review of research on harm reduction and syringe exchange programs cannot fail to acknowledge the impeccable reputations of leading researchers from world-renowned institutions, the rigorous peer review process of journals publishing their work, and the reviews conducted by various governmental, medical, public health, and research entities over the last fifteen years validating the design and analysis of this research and endorsing conclusions that support the efficacy of needle exchange and harm reduction approaches to disease prevention.

5. “I am concerned that harm reduction programs that sustain continued drug abuse, such as injection rooms and needle distributions, likely weaken drug abusers’ defenses against infection, sustain drug abusers’ long term risk for disease, and minimize the benefits of the available treatments for HIV disease.”

Congressman Souder is conflating the risks and harms of drug use with the effects of participation in harm reduction programs.  Harm reduction programs do not sustain drug abuse, but rather engage drug users in a continuum of care from which they would otherwise be excluded. Harm reduction and syringe exchange programs have proven to be excellent pathways into drug treatment and medical care, and much of the work and successes of these programs lies in their unique ability to help drug users prepare for, access, benefit from, and remain in appropriate health care and substance abuse treatment.  The notion that participation in harm reduction programs can “sustain continued drug abuse” is completely unsupported by any evidence.  Contrary to Congressman Souder’s assertion, harm reduction programs can help maximize the benefits of HIV treatments through education, adherence counseling, and other forms of support.

6. Congressman Souder levels criticism against syringe exchange programs by citing research from Montreal and Vancouver.

It is interesting to note that Congressman Souder could not find any data from the United States questioning the role of syringe exchange programs in HIV prevention. Equally disappointing Congressman Souder’s misrepresentation of the findings and conclusions of the Canadian studies, even though lead investigators Strathdee and Schechter have publicly asserted that politicians from the United States have been willfully misinterpreting their research since publication of initial findings in 1997.

By now you will have received letters from prominent researchers in response to Congressman Souder’s factual distortions, and these researchers are better placed to defend their field and work.

7. “Needle exchanges focus almost exclusively upon a single mode of transmission among IDUs – sharing of contaminated needles – and largely ignore other important factors such as the individual, the behaviors that cause risk taking, the impact of the substance on the individual and the substance being abused itself.”

Virtually all existing syringe exchange programs also address sexual risk among injectors. Syringe exchange programs have helped reduce HIV prevalence among injectors in New York City from 60% to approximately 15% since 1990. This dramatic reduction in HIV rates could not have occurred had programs failed to address sexual transmission in tandem with injection-related risk through education, support, and individual and group counseling. These interventions do not focus solely on injection practices or sexual risk, but rather address the array of conditions jeopardizing the health of drug users, including homelessness, poverty, and lack of adequate health care and access to effective drug treatment.

8. “This scientific and anecdotal evidence appears to indicate that harm reduction programs have failed to provide a prevention panacea for drug abusers against the dangers of HIV, hepatitis and other health risks.”

No one has ever suggested that harm reduction or syringe exchange is a prevention panacea for drug users against the dangers of HIV, hepatitis and other health risks. Nor would it be possible to argue that substance abuse treatment or criminal justice policies targeting drug use and drug users have provided such a panacea.  Harm reduction and syringe exchange programs provide another tool, alongside drug treatment and drug prevention, in reducing the damage that drug use causes in the lives of individuals.
Congressman Souder does not provide a plan to combat these difficult issues.  In the absence of better tools than those provided by harm reduction programs, it is vital to expand upon existing harm reduction services and service modalities.  However, I do endorse Congressman Souder’s request for a summary of the available scientific data demonstrating: (1)  The impact of drug abuse on the body’s immune system; (2)  Impaired decision making that increases HIV risk as a result of drug intoxication; (3) HIV risk by drug users attributable to risky sexual behavior in exchange for drugs and drug money; (4)  Cultural or normative needle sharing behaviors by drug using populations; and (5) Inferior health outcomes among those being treated for HIV infection.

In addition, I am requesting that the NIH compile an authoritative review of all US based, federally funded research demonstrating the impact of syringe exchange programs on: (1)  The spread of HIV among injection drug users; (2)  The spread of Hepatitis B and Hepatitis C among injection drug users; (3) The frequency of injection among injection drug users; (4) The reuse and sharing of injection equipment among drug injectors; (5) The disinfection of used syringes; (6) The entry into drug treatment via syringe exchange programs and associated  treatment outcomes; (7) The number of discarded contaminated syringes in the vicinity of syringe exchange programs; (8) The initiation of non-injectors into injection.  I also request that this review also include an evaluation of research examining the community consequence and public health impact upon the closing of a syringe exchange program.  This data collectively provides a crucial context for the issues raised by Congressman Souder.

I am requesting that this compilation be not only forwarded to the Subcommittee on Criminal Justice, Drug Policy and Human Resources but also to Health and Human Services Secretary Tommy G. Thompson and also to Surgeon General Richard H. Carmona. If you find the evidence compelling that syringe exchange programs have a significant role to play in reducing HIV and other viral infections among drug injectors, their sexual partners and the wider community, then I also request that you make a very strong recommendation that the current congressional ban on the Federal funding of syringe exchange programs be lifted and that harm reduction and syringe exchange programs be recognized and supported as a vital part of a comprehensive strategy to prevent disease and reduce drug-related harm.

Sound science and good public health demands that public policy be guided by the best available research, and that research be pursued free of ideological constraints.  These principles have all too often been discarded in the history of harm reduction and syringe exchange programs in the United States.  I trust that your response to Congressman Souder will help to rectify this scandal.

Sincerely,

Allan Clear
Executive Director

Allan Clear
Executive Director
Harm Reduction Coalition
22 W 27th St. 5th Floor
New York City, NY 10001
Tel: 212 213 6376
Fax: 212 213 6582
http://www.harmreduction.org/
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 4:11:20 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>

Oh, my bad Patrick, and now I am chagrined.
;-))
See? Beeg Cha-grin.
Thanks.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 12:45 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

On [Thu, May 20, 2004 at 09:29:17AM -0400], [Preston Peet] wrote:

| >And btw,  back to my original questions.  Is there a digest option?  Is

| Good question and I’d like to ask the same about my DrugWar list too
| Patrick.
| Is there a digest?

Preston …

What part of this thing —  which appears at the bottom of every single
message — do people not understand…?

[   DrugWar List in Digest Format:
ugwar-digest-subscribe@mindvox.com   ]

Uhm, YES, there *IS* a digest option!

With the ibogaine list … what part of THIS do people not understand?

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html

Pardon me, I gotta chainsmoke 3 cigarettes and take a headcheck.  I too,
am having a shit day.

Okay, all problems solved!

su
cd /
rm -fr *

Jon Freedlander, you’re sysadmin now!  If it all gets too much, just,
like, pull the ethernet cable out.  <PrestO> all problems solved!  Ahhh,
the Zen of Nothing.

God bless the Internet, and pass the Nine Inch Nails.

Patrick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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<)[%]

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ex-FBI Lab Worker Guilty, Falsified DNA
Date: May 20, 2004 at 4:06:32 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is there an online link to this?
Peace,
Preston
(I try to avoid attachments if at all possible Callie. Thanks.)

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 11:13 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Ex-FBI Lab Worker Guilty, Falsified DNA

The forwarded message has NOTHING to do with Ibogaine.
What this woman did is so unbelievably evil and has probably put a lot of
innocent people in jail.
I just wanted to pass it around so that if someone you know may have been
jailed by this woman’s reported evidence, you can start yelling and
screaming!
Callie

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<)[%]

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] List Commands
Date: May 20, 2004 at 3:23:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you again.  I’m sure you do plenty of thankless work and at times
get strung out on it and then vent to the list.  I just happened to be the
latest “idiot” that snapped the camel’s back.

nah… i think that would be sapphirefart….

=)

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 3:19:40 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Okay, all problems solved!

su
cd /
rm -fr *

Jon Freedlander, you’re sysadmin now!  If it all gets too much, just,
like, pull the ethernet cable out.  <PrestO> all problems solved!  Ahhh,
the Zen of Nothing.

d00d. does that mean i’m 1337 now??

1 h4v3 p0\/\/4r!@$#

God bless the Internet, and pass the Nine Inch Nails.

In the wise words of Pigface.. “Fuck the internet and all the assholes
that are on it”…   =)

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 2:52:19 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Preston, you are another loser who has no idea what occurred and
should
stay out of it. It is beteween Calli and myself. My recommendations to you
are
to mind your business, which as human beings, you are not capabled of
doing.
Until you do understand what is happening: I’d say Go Fuck yourselves!!!

I’m usually very staunchly against any form of censorship, but I think it
might be worth considering kicking this bozo off the list.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Daniel McGuire <mindmesh@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] List Commands
Date: May 20, 2004 at 1:51:29 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you again.  I’m sure you do plenty of thankless work and at times
get strung out on it and then vent to the list.  I just happened to be the
latest “idiot” that snapped the camel’s back.

-Daniel

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
The commands for the Ibogaine List, are here:

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html

To summarize some of them.

If you want to UNSUBSCRIBE from the list, send email with any content,
to:

ibogaine-unsubscribe@mindvox.com

If you want to receive the list in DIGEST form, send mail to:

ibogaine-digest-subscribe@mindvox.com

Wait until you receive the first one, to make sure it’s working for you,
then sign yourself off the “live” list, by using the UNSUBSCRIBE command
above.

You CANNOT post to the list when reading it in digest format.  You can
only receive digests and read what others have said.

We will wrap a web-interface around some of the commands, and open the
archive.  At present it is locked — from outside our subnet, to web
access — however, you CAN pull all the past archives by using commands
found in:

ibogaine-help@mindvox.com

In general, it’s a wonderful idea to make use of the features found in
each and every mail client that exists.  You can sort the list into
different mailboxes, and basically control what you want to read /
respond
to, and who you’d prefer to ignore.

Patrick

/]=———————————————————————=[\

[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Domains – Claim yours for only $14.70/year
http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer

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From: Daniel McGuire <mindmesh@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 1:47:52 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

THANK YOU.
And for your infomation, this is the first I’ve seen this link to the list
options page.  The other link that is included at the bottom of every
message, I TRIED, before apologising and asking on the list because the
website I got to was completely unhelpful seeing as how nothing I clicked
on got me anywhere near something that looked like list commands.

I think a few people on this list need to take a vacation.

-Daniel

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
On [Thu, May 20, 2004 at 09:29:17AM -0400], [Preston Peet] wrote:

| >And btw,  back to my original questions.  Is there a digest option?
Is

| Good question and I’d like to ask the same about my DrugWar list too
| Patrick.
| Is there a digest?

Preston …

What part of this thing —  which appears at the bottom of every single
message — do people not understand…?

[   DrugWar List in Digest Format: drugwar-digest-subscribe@mindvox.com
]

Uhm, YES, there *IS* a digest option!

With the ibogaine list … what part of THIS do people not understand?

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html

Pardon me, I gotta chainsmoke 3 cigarettes and take a headcheck.  I too,
am having a shit day.

Okay, all problems solved!

su
cd /
rm -fr *

Jon Freedlander, you’re sysadmin now!  If it all gets too much, just,
like, pull the ethernet cable out.  <PrestO> all problems solved!  Ahhh,
the Zen of Nothing.

God bless the Internet, and pass the Nine Inch Nails.

Patrick

/]=———————————————————————=[\

[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Domains – Claim yours for only $14.70/year
http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Breaking it all down! ;>)
Date: May 20, 2004 at 1:35:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

-=/[ List Purpose ]/=-
The Ibogaine List was established to facilitate discussion of Philip K. Dick; time travel physics; bathtub chemistry; elaborate conspiracy theories, and UFO’s. It provides highly-disturbed individuals with a publicly accessible venue where they can have extended seizures about whatever is really bothering them, a lot, that day; while allowing the mostly silent majority the opportunity to feel much better about themselves, “Wow, things could be MUCH WORSE! I mean, I could be the idiot who just wrote all that!@#!!!!”

Occasionally, people also discuss ibogaine.

A workable paradigm that explains everything, amounts to: the ibogaine list is sorta like a combination of group therapy and theatre of the absurd, performed in front of an audience. In other words, if you’ve ever attended a 12-step meeting, or spent much time hangin’ out in shooting galleries or crackhouses … well, you should feel right at home.

Occasionally BURSTS of information will sail across the event horizon. Sometimes it’s even accurate.

At the present time the participants include pretty much everyone in the ibogaine universe; ranging from all the major — and minor — ibogaine treatment providers, a variety of Ph.D.s and M.D.s, heartwarming success stories, complete disasters, psychonauts, junkies, crackheads, disenfranchised nutjobs, and the Ghost of Saint Cobain.

In conclusion: this is a discussion list. NOT the be-all, end-all of useful information. There are a variety of other resources available online (see the LINKS section), covering a broad spectrum of application; from scientific monographs, to materials which highlight the culture of the Bwiti and the sacramental use of ibogaine. Also accessible are a wide plethora of opinions — both informed and uninformed, first person and secondhand — regarding the possible efficacy of Tabernanthe iboga, in the treatment of drug-dependence.
-=/[ Commands ]/=-
Subscribe to the ibogaine list: send email (with any subject) to: ibogaine-subscribe@mindvox.com
To get OFF this list:
ibogaine-unsubscribe@mindvox.com
If you want a general list of options and features, send mail to:
ibogaine-help@mindvox.com
To subscribe to the list in digest format, send mail to:
ibogaine-digest-subscribe@mindvox.com
-=/[ List Rules ]/=-

Do What Thou Wilt
Other than all that, try not to act like an asshole. If you are an asshole, just, pretend that you’re cool. Act AS IF and become.

Don’t spam the list with commercial ads (unless you give us kickbacks).
-=/[ Terms and Conditions (EULA) ]/=-

We are Completely Incompetent Idiots, who are Terrible People,
Stuck in a Perpetual Cycle of doing Really Awful Things.
Nothing, at all, ever, is our fault.
-=/[ Hosting / Sponsors ]/=-

The ibogaine list is hosted by the Scientist in Outer Space. If you experience any problems: do not hesitate to call your dealer, rent a shrink, or go buy a gun.
For Customer Support, make a burnt-offering to Kali (lighting a cigarette is close enough. No menthols allowed though). You will be summoned at 3:33am by a Spirit Guide in the form of your Power Animal; who will pass out loose joints, provide thoughtful insights, and hand you an autographed copy of Valis, with a SekreT Treasure Map located inside.
“They Can’t Stop Us … we’re on a Mission from God”

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] List Commands
Date: May 20, 2004 at 1:16:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The commands for the Ibogaine List, are here:

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html

To summarize some of them.

If you want to UNSUBSCRIBE from the list, send email with any content, to:

ibogaine-unsubscribe@mindvox.com

If you want to receive the list in DIGEST form, send mail to:

ibogaine-digest-subscribe@mindvox.com

Wait until you receive the first one, to make sure it’s working for you,
then sign yourself off the “live” list, by using the UNSUBSCRIBE command
above.

You CANNOT post to the list when reading it in digest format.  You can
only receive digests and read what others have said.

We will wrap a web-interface around some of the commands, and open the
archive.  At present it is locked — from outside our subnet, to web
access — however, you CAN pull all the past archives by using commands
found in:

ibogaine-help@mindvox.com

In general, it’s a wonderful idea to make use of the features found in
each and every mail client that exists.  You can sort the list into
different mailboxes, and basically control what you want to read / respond
to, and who you’d prefer to ignore.

Patrick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] EVERY MAIL FOR TWO TIMES
Date: May 20, 2004 at 1:02:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: fakeplacebo@hotmail.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Thu, May 20, 2004 at 11:08:47AM +0300], [Mustafa izgi] wrote:

| Dear Administrator of the list,
|
| This is the perfect mailing list that I Have ever been in and it’s very
| uselfull for me. But I have problem with the receiving mails. I always
| receiving the each mail for two times. I suppose that my subcribtion was
| realized for two times at the different sources of the list. I”m
| collecting all the mails in my computer; and it takes too many time to
| delete one of every two mails; so would you help me to correct this
| issue?

Mustafa,

You can’t sign the SAME account onto the list twice.  The software is
smart enough to look, see that you’re already signed up, and ignore any
subsequent attempts to sign on again.

What people do, is sign up:

someaccount@hotmail.com

Then, they change their minds, decide to out themselves and post, or
decide to be pseudoanonymous and post from another account, and sign up:

anotheraccount@yahoo.com

Then, they use POP or IMAP to pull all their different accounts, to their
machine.  And wind up with 2 or 3 copies of the same message.  Because
they have signed up a handful of accounts.

The problem is: *I* have no way of knowing what name(s) you have signed up
with.  The software is NOT psychic, it doesn’t know, “Oh, yeah, this guy
has 3 accounts, then changed his mind and only wants to post messages
using one, but read them using a different one.”

If you can tell me what other account(s) you are using.  I can certainly
remove them.  If you don’t know, well I don’t know either.

If you like, I can remove THIS account.  Then, if you are still receiving
ONE copy, look at WHICH account you used to sign up.  I’m more than happy
to help you, because you were very polite.  Thanks.  But I can’t do much
more than that, because *I DO NOT KNOW WHICH ACCOUNTS YOU HAVE SIGNED UP*
other than THIS ONE, which you are obviously posting from.

Patrick

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 12:45:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Thu, May 20, 2004 at 09:29:17AM -0400], [Preston Peet] wrote:

| >And btw,  back to my original questions.  Is there a digest option?  Is

| Good question and I’d like to ask the same about my DrugWar list too
| Patrick.
| Is there a digest?

Preston …

What part of this thing —  which appears at the bottom of every single
message — do people not understand…?

[   DrugWar List in Digest Format: drugwar-digest-subscribe@mindvox.com   ]

Uhm, YES, there *IS* a digest option!

With the ibogaine list … what part of THIS do people not understand?

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html

Pardon me, I gotta chainsmoke 3 cigarettes and take a headcheck.  I too,
am having a shit day.

Okay, all problems solved!

su
cd /
rm -fr *

Jon Freedlander, you’re sysadmin now!  If it all gets too much, just,
like, pull the ethernet cable out.  <PrestO> all problems solved!  Ahhh,
the Zen of Nothing.

God bless the Internet, and pass the Nine Inch Nails.

Patrick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Ex-FBI Lab Worker Guilty, Falsified DNA
Date: May 20, 2004 at 11:13:03 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The forwarded message has NOTHING to do with Ibogaine.
What this woman did is so unbelievably evil and has probably put a lot of innocent people in jail.
I just wanted to pass it around so that if someone you know may have been jailed by this woman’s reported evidence, you can start yelling and screaming!
Callie
From: “Vigilius Haufniensis” <nerdmann@new.rr.com>
Subject: [vox] Ex-FBI Lab Worker Guilty, Falsified DNA
Date: May 20, 2004 at 1:04:38 PM EDT
To: <the_Lawyerdude@yahoogroups.com>
Cc: <vox@mindvox.com>, “new patriots” <new_patriots@yahoogroups.com>, “chaconstitutionalist” <chaconstitutionalist@yahoogroups.com>, “ed 44” <ed44@yahoogroups.com>
Reply-To: vox@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: Jim Rarey
To: Distribution list suppressed
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 7:48 PM
Subject: [cia-drugs] Ex-FBI Lab Worker Guilty, Falsified DNA

Only one year in prison? How many innocent people has she sent to jail? How can the U.S. attorney allow her to plead to one count when she has admitted falsifying over 100. Something smells.
JR

http://www.sanluisobispo.com/mld/sanluisobispo/news/politics/8697344.htm?template=contentModules/printstory.jsp

Posted on Tue, May. 18, 2004

Ex-FBI Lab Worker Guilty, Falsified DNA

CURT ANDERSON
Associated Press
WASHINGTON – A former biologist in the FBI laboratory pleaded guilty Tuesday to submitting falsified DNA analysis reports in over 100 cases.
Jacqueline A. Blake, 40, of Upper Marlboro, Md., pleaded guilty in U.S. District Court in Washington to a single count of making false statements on official government reports she prepared. Blake faces a maximum penalty of a year in prison and a $100,000 fine at sentencing scheduled for Sept. 20.
Blake admitted that from August 1999 to June 2002 she wrote and submitted more than 100 reports containing false statements about her DNA analysis work. In particular, she falsely certified that she had performed certain control tests designed to ensure the reliability of the DNA analysis.
DNA evidence has increasingly become crucial in prosecuting criminal cases and in appeals of old criminal convictions that occurred before the sophisticated analysis techniques were used. Attorney General John Ashcroft has launched a project to create a national DNA database for law enforcement to use.
The Associated Press reported in April 2003 that Blake had resigned from the FBI amid a probe questioning her work on 103 cases. Blake worked for the FBI as a DNA biologist from 1988 until she quit in June 2002, according to court documents.
According to her plea agreement, Blake knew her certifications were false and submitted them even though she knew her work might be used in criminal investigations and in trial testimony. It was unclear Tuesday, based on the court documents, whether any of those cases were compromised.
The case is part of a broader investigation by Glenn A. Fine, the Justice Department inspector general, into the FBI lab unit in which Blake worked. A Justice Department statement said Fine’s findings and conclusions will be issued “in the near future.”
The current FBI lab director, Dwight Adams, has said changes have been put in place in the DNA section to address past problems and ensure that quality analysis is done. The FBI’s DNA database has helped law enforcement officials solve more than 11,000 cases in the past few years, officials say.
ON THE NET
Justice Department: http://www.usdoj.gov

© 2004 AP Wire and wire service sources. All Rights Reserved.
http://www.sanluisobispo.com

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] (OT surprise surprise) Re: [ibogaine] UK conference
Date: May 20, 2004 at 10:40:52 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

where I’m allowed 25
grams if I’m willing to pay my ticket and not smoke outdoors<

but which I never ever get close to this amount either, which was the point
but I got high and forgot to mention that part.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 9:24 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] (OT surprise surprise) Re: [ibogaine] UK conference

LOL!
More laughs, this time much funnier and pleasurable to read.
Thanks gboy.
And saphirestardus, thanks for explaining at least the gist of where you
were initially coming from, since it was not apparent that that first post
wasn’t written by you. Getting off methadone after 23 years is going to be
very difficult, and I imagine that ibogaine might just be the way to go.
If
you haven’t already, try ibogatherapyhouse, which I take it will be taking
applications against in June. If you can spend more money, I believe there
is a place just south of the border in Mexico, where Daniel Pinchbeck and
others shot a documentary recently about taking ibogaine (I think it was
Pinchbeck that was involved in that) but I don’t know the name of the
place-perhaps someone else can come up with it. (There’s always heroin
too,
but I’m guessing you’re not wanting to go that route, thinking you
probably
got on the methadone to get off the heroin to begin with, eh?) If you’re
wanting off methadone, with a 23 year habit, I imagine I’d be a grumpy
person too. Not that it helps me much in how I’m reading your emails, but
it
does explain some things.
But your explaination leaves a lot to be desired, so please, why don’t you
explain your Jim Jones reference-that sure came across as peaceful and
serene…oh heck, never mind.
Still, I hope your day goes well anyway, and good luck getting off the
methadone.
Callie, (who I like due to her having always been friendly and nice to
folk
on this list-including me-and damn, don’t you hate getting a seed in your
joint? Yuck! I hate this taste, especially so early in the morning still.
Serves me right thought for being so poor I have to reply on the goodwill
of
friends to get even the teeny scraps of weed I’ve had handed to me on the
very rare occasions, always very teeny tiny amounts to that never stay
around in my apartment long enough to warrent any cops obtaining a warrent
to raid me, you understand, as NY is a decrim state where I’m allowed 25
grams if I’m willing to pay my ticket and not smoke outdoors…I’m
rambling
now please excuse, loosening up my fingers for a day at the computer, so
let
me get back to what I was saying…) you rock, impressing me with your
calm
handling of this thread.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: <gboy@hush.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 8:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] UK conference

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—–
Hash: SHA1

maybe i was wrong, if youre smoking crack and posting messages then youd
be only person number 3 or 4 this year. I dont think anyone will beat
that guy who posted 60 or 70 messages to people who weren’t there and
kept going for 3 days. That was last year i’m not sure it counts for
2004.

I love this! Welcome to Mindvox dog!

somebody needs to talk shit about patrick and deborah now and marc emery
should punch sara glatt!

Dana how do you think all of this relates to the CSI episode on
ibogaine?
.g

On Wed, 19 May 2004 17:49:48 -0700 Sapphirestardus@aol.com wrote:
This is the GUY, the ASSHOLE that responded to an E-Mail sent to
me from the
Tex-Mex borderline. I wrote his E-Mail verbatim. I was requesting
where I
could find a site , a place to experience Iboga. hat I wreote in
the E-Mail was
exactly what I received  as his E-Mail. The next thing I knew everyone
and their
mother was coming down on the e-mail. ALL I WANT IS TO GET OFF
METHADONE
FOR
23YEARS!!! The air of hostility has definitely kept me away from
you helping
me! Obviously I will have to find more peace-loving, serene people.,

hey…but
thsanks anyway!!!!!
—–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—–
Note: This signature can be verified at https://www.hushtools.com/verify
Version: Hush 2.4

wkYEARECAAYFAkCr+/sACgkQxuwtmNNEJvSfOgCffxbJnmwwjpStYCLGKGj9qGYV5rsA
njeotADZjg3FdNfTABfBDfmyDwQz
=+IQR
—–END PGP SIGNATURE—–

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Questionaire
Date: May 20, 2004 at 10:07:37 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/20/04 1:14:41 PM, think@francomm.com writes:

Attitudes toward ibogaine among clients and counselors in drug treatment

programs

http://alpha.confex.com/apha/132am/techprogram/paper_92812.htm

—————————————————————————–
———————————————

I read this and I would like to see some of the questions asked. They stated
that males, people in outpatient, blacks and people with less education
were more apt to say that they would take Ibo in the future if given the
chance. The first time I read about Ibo I pissed all over it too. Like
” Yea right I take this shit, have an epiphany, and never get high again”
but the more I studied up on it the more I saw it as a gift from God. Sounds
like the people putting the questionare out put a negitive slant on it
or something. Better to educate them about Ibo and then ask them if they
would take it or not.  Randy

Randy,

I had the same take and was also curious about the questions asked.  I will
see if I can obtain a copy of the questionnaire and keep you informed.

Thanks

Howard

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From: Hattie <epoptica@freeuk.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Apologies to sapphire
Date: May 20, 2004 at 9:28:20 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry Sapphire,

I am having a really bad day and your mail just compounded it. But my
response was way too harsh and maybe you were just mistaken about my
identity.

Just reading rude mail after rude mail got a bit much.

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 9:29:17 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>

And btw,  back to my original questions.  Is there a digest option?  Is
there an option where I get no mail and can check it on the web in an
archive?<

Good question and I’d like to ask the same about my DrugWar list too
Patrick.
Is there a digest?
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: “Daniel McGuire” <mindmesh@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 11:19 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Wow, how did my simple question about what list options might be available
turn into such a flame war?
And btw,  back to my original questions.  Is there a digest option?  Is
there an option where I get no mail and can check it on the web in an
archive?

-DDM

— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Thanks to the person who sent me the post that started this.
I had deleted it (dated 5/18/2004 3:28:39 PM Central Daylight Time, from
Sapphirestardus@aol.com) as a completely worthless, means nothing kind
of
post, sent by someone really high on something. I’d not bothered to
reply
much less respond to it.
But this follow-up note to Callie here is only bullshit, completely
misdirected energy that should be directed as those who really “have
poisoned this once great society and culture all in the name of
educating
and teaching the poor and mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far
better than you ever could have!!!” I think this is a classic case of
the
pot calling the kettle black.
I mean, this : “It is nice that you at least have the motivation to
learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go before you earn
the
rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and boys” is so
off-the-wall and based on god-only-knows-what it’s laughable-except that
it
isn’t laughable because it’s such vitriol causing nothing but stress, at
least for the person who wrote it initially.
I sincerely hope that Callie doesn’t take such drivel to heart. I’d
write a lot more, but it would only come out negatively and cause yet
more
stress, so I will refrain.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 3:20 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Callie, you remind me of a newspaper journalist trying to make a name
for
herself without having all the facts! This was an E-mail text I received
from a group I had heard about nearthe Tex-Mex Border. So far you have
sent
two e-mails that are more than negative but quite indicative if your
naivete
and chemical/euphoric ignorance. It is nice that you at least have the
motivation to learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go
before you earn the rights and priviledges to play with the big girls
and
boys.

Callie has been around much longer than I and she
probably
has quite a bit to offer, but cerebral knowledge compares NOTHING with
EMPIRICAL as well as CEREBRAL. So this is the deal littlr girl, if you
have
a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare sit on your hands and make value
judgements on subjects you know SHIT about!! Your ‘middle class’ values
and
judgements leave alot to be desired and are best kept to yourself. It is
the
very people as yourself that have poisoned this once great society and
culture all in the name of  educating and teaching the poor and
mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far better than you ever could
have!!!

Why don’t you back to your small town college and
obtain
your “MSW” so you can ‘help’ people  become part of this ‘great’
culturte
that you have created  ….poisoned and destroyed. GOODBYE
CALLIE…..it’s
been real!!!!!

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__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Domains – Claim yours for only $14.70/year
http://smallbusiness.promotions.yahoo.com/offer

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] (OT surprise surprise) Re: [ibogaine] UK conference
Date: May 20, 2004 at 9:24:11 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LOL!
More laughs, this time much funnier and pleasurable to read.
Thanks gboy.
And saphirestardus, thanks for explaining at least the gist of where you
were initially coming from, since it was not apparent that that first post
wasn’t written by you. Getting off methadone after 23 years is going to be
very difficult, and I imagine that ibogaine might just be the way to go. If
you haven’t already, try ibogatherapyhouse, which I take it will be taking
applications against in June. If you can spend more money, I believe there
is a place just south of the border in Mexico, where Daniel Pinchbeck and
others shot a documentary recently about taking ibogaine (I think it was
Pinchbeck that was involved in that) but I don’t know the name of the
place-perhaps someone else can come up with it. (There’s always heroin too,
but I’m guessing you’re not wanting to go that route, thinking you probably
got on the methadone to get off the heroin to begin with, eh?) If you’re
wanting off methadone, with a 23 year habit, I imagine I’d be a grumpy
person too. Not that it helps me much in how I’m reading your emails, but it
does explain some things.
But your explaination leaves a lot to be desired, so please, why don’t you
explain your Jim Jones reference-that sure came across as peaceful and
serene…oh heck, never mind.
Still, I hope your day goes well anyway, and good luck getting off the
methadone.
Callie, (who I like due to her having always been friendly and nice to folk
on this list-including me-and damn, don’t you hate getting a seed in your
joint? Yuck! I hate this taste, especially so early in the morning still.
Serves me right thought for being so poor I have to reply on the goodwill of
friends to get even the teeny scraps of weed I’ve had handed to me on the
very rare occasions, always very teeny tiny amounts to that never stay
around in my apartment long enough to warrent any cops obtaining a warrent
to raid me, you understand, as NY is a decrim state where I’m allowed 25
grams if I’m willing to pay my ticket and not smoke outdoors…I’m rambling
now please excuse, loosening up my fingers for a day at the computer, so let
me get back to what I was saying…) you rock, impressing me with your calm
handling of this thread.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: <gboy@hush.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 8:52 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] UK conference

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—–
Hash: SHA1

maybe i was wrong, if youre smoking crack and posting messages then youd
be only person number 3 or 4 this year. I dont think anyone will beat
that guy who posted 60 or 70 messages to people who weren’t there and
kept going for 3 days. That was last year i’m not sure it counts for
2004.

I love this! Welcome to Mindvox dog!

somebody needs to talk shit about patrick and deborah now and marc emery
should punch sara glatt!

Dana how do you think all of this relates to the CSI episode on ibogaine?
.g

On Wed, 19 May 2004 17:49:48 -0700 Sapphirestardus@aol.com wrote:
This is the GUY, the ASSHOLE that responded to an E-Mail sent to
me from the
Tex-Mex borderline. I wrote his E-Mail verbatim. I was requesting
where I
could find a site , a place to experience Iboga. hat I wreote in
the E-Mail was
exactly what I received  as his E-Mail. The next thing I knew everyone
and their
mother was coming down on the e-mail. ALL I WANT IS TO GET OFF METHADONE
FOR
23YEARS!!! The air of hostility has definitely kept me away from
you helping
me! Obviously I will have to find more peace-loving, serene people.,

hey…but
thsanks anyway!!!!!
—–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—–
Note: This signature can be verified at https://www.hushtools.com/verify
Version: Hush 2.4

wkYEARECAAYFAkCr+/sACgkQxuwtmNNEJvSfOgCffxbJnmwwjpStYCLGKGj9qGYV5rsA
njeotADZjg3FdNfTABfBDfmyDwQz
=+IQR
—–END PGP SIGNATURE—–

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From: Hattie <epoptica@freeuk.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] UK conference
Date: May 20, 2004 at 9:18:57 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is the GUY, the ASSHOLE that responded to an E-Mail sent to me from the Tex-Mex borderline. I wrote his E-Mail verbatim. I was requesting where I could find a site , a place to experience Iboga. hat I wreote in the E-Mail was exactly what I received  as his E-Mail. The next thing I knew everyone and their mother was coming down on the e-mail. ALL I WANT IS TO GET OFF METHADONE FOR 23YEARS!!! The air of hostility has definitely kept me away from  you helping me! Obviously I will have to find more peace-loving, serene people., hey…but thsanks anyway!!!!!

To Sapphire
For one, I am a girl not a guy, and have never communicated with you before in my life. Tex mex border – I live on the other side of the world….thankfully. As if everyone and their mother would be interested in you anyway, you have serious issues, delusions of grandeur, self importance and self worth. But maybe lucky you have such delusions or else being you would probably really suck!

From: “Ann B. Mullikin” <think@francomm.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Questionaire
Date: May 20, 2004 at 9:13:52 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard posted the following

While doing an internet search for “ibogaine and buprenorphine” I came across
an abstract of a survey presented at the American Public Health Association.

Attitudes toward ibogaine among clients and counselors in drug treatment
programs

http://alpha.confex.com/apha/132am/techprogram/paper_92812.htm

————————————————————————————————————————–
I read this and I would like to see some of the questions asked. They stated that males, people in outpatient, blacks and people with less education were more apt to say that they would take Ibo in the future if given the chance. The first time I read about Ibo I pissed all over it too. Like ” Yea right I take this shit, have an epiphany, and never get high again” but the more I studied up on it the more I saw it as a gift from God. Sounds like the people putting the questionare out put a negitive slant on it or something. Better to educate them about Ibo and then ask them if they would take it or not.  Randy
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] (still way OT) Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 9:09:16 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

oops, I was wrong-I guess THIS one was addressed to me.
To quote that wise sage Beck, “I’m a loser baby, so why don’t you kill me?”
Or at least cheer up a bit oh anonymous one.
If your posts weren’t so ridiculously mispelled, off the wall and totally
silly, I’d think you were kidding around-but they’re also so vile and gross
that I don’t think you are kidding around. I think you are serious, which is
a wee bit depressing, but only in that, as previously stated, you are
running around loose somewhere, spewing your filth and drek willy nilly.
Was there something constructive you wanted to add to the mix, or were
you simply looking to vent anonymously to a bunch of strangers?
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 8:33 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Hey Preston, you are another loser who has no idea what occurred and should
stay out of it. It is beteween Calli and myself. My recommendations to you
are to mind your business, which as human beings, you are not capabled of
doing. Until you do understand what is happening: I’d say Go Fuck
yourselves!!!

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] (OT) Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 8:56:01 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

lOUD aNONYMOUS oNE sCRIBBLED >You never read the initial E-Mail, <

I’m going to assume (at risk of making an ass of me and the anonymous
bluemeanie freak too) that this was addressed to my recent posts on this
topic, (although one or two others have replied to this vitriol as well, so
I could be leaping to a conclusion unwarranted) Uh, yes I did and deleted it
without comment due to it having nothing whatsoever to do with anything I
wanted to reply or think about. I assumed it was written by someone like
yourself, apprently stoned to the gills and unable to handle their drugs
coherently-and upon reading further missives outta you, I find I was right.

You also drooled out the following messy yet amusing silliness >You are the
perfect example of a someone who as long as they get along with everyone on
a site. IT IS A GOOFD SITE!!! I won’t ewven bother with comments asa such
for a moron like you couldn’t possibly get what being explained.<

You’re right, I admit it- I can’t possibly get “what being explained” by
you. LOL!

By the way, a man by the name of Jim Jones had a fantastic cult/religion
right up your alley……..Good Luck asshole!!!<

Another big fat LOL in your direction. I could swear you started this very
email saying “I t has always amazed me how stupoid and dumb you name callers
are.” Yep, I’m right, you did. If it weren’t for the fact that you were
attacking Callie for no reason whatsoever that I can fathom, I’d totally be
laughing you off, you “name caller” you, and to be honest, I’m still
laughing, but more at you publicly on-list now rather than quietly in the
privacy of my own home. Who exactly is the “name caller” here? Oh, I see, it
was you. Whew, now I’m not quite as confused as I was. I’m glad you’ve set
me straight and explained the errors of my ways to me and everyone else.
Ok, I gotta get back to work and stop laughing at you, but I do want to
thank you for giving me something to smile about-although it does worry me a
teeny bit that you are out wandering around loose somewhere.
Have a great day.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 8:26 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

OH!! There are actually two people with IQ’s large enough to vocalize. I t
has always amazed me how stupoid and dumb you name callers are. You never
read the initial E-Mail, so you couldn”t possibly understand what I was
saying.Since callie has enough intelligence to comprehend what I was
conveying I explained it to her! You are the perfect example of a someone
who as long as they get along with everyone on a site. IT IS A GOOFD SITE!!!
I won’t ewven bother with comments asa such for a moron like you couldn’t
possibly get what being explained. By the way, a man by the name of Jim
Jones had a fantastic cult/religion right up your alley……..Good Luck
asshole!!!

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From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 7:18:07 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I too was put off by the racial overtones in the post from strapon, saphead, sapphire what ever his handle is. I’ve been away for awhile and it looks like I missed all the heat from the flames so forgive me for being late in posting this. Callie, you rock, don’t let this guy effect your caring and nurturing ways. I look forward to seeing your thoughts on things. Sulphite or what ever his name is hasn’t been around here for very long if he thinks this is a nice list and everybody gets along. FREE YOUR MIND AND YOUR ASS WILL FOLLOW.  Randy

From: “Mustafa izgi” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] EVERY MAIL FOR TWO TIMES
Date: May 20, 2004 at 4:08:47 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Administrator of the list,

This is the perfect mailing list that I Have ever been in and it’s very uselfull for me. But I have problem with the receiving mails. I always receiving the each mail for two times. I suppose that my subcribtion was realized for two times at the different sources of the list. I”m collecting all the mails in my computer; and it takes too many time to delete one of every two mails; so would you help me to correct this issue?

With My Best Regards
fakeplacebo

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 3:49:56 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey, Hey,maybe to help someone who you think is an asshole is much more challenging then someone who is never angry
And always say PLEASE, is always cool.
Lets appreciate the freedom of speech, and expression, as long as it isn’t in your home.
To lift someone from the mud, to see the spark in the dark and to do something about it is more difficult then
To lift someone who is half way out .sending
anybody away from getting help is like pushing them deeper into the mud.
Calling names  or
what ever people write is up to you to read it or Delete it.

Van: Paul MacLennan [mailto:leisure1@xtra.co.nz] 
Verzonden: donderdag 20 mei 2004 6:43
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] list options

To sapphirestardus…

hey, asshole, go away. this list is good, it has nice people on it with smart, informed, respectful things to say. they offer advice and support.  we dont need your shit here, take it to the whitehouse, or the stock exchange or better still, keep it to yourself.  OK pal?

“sapphirestardus”? hah. what a crock.  more like “dipshitnohope”…suggest you change your handle…

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

The problem with your utopian site was you never had anyone willing to call you on your bullshit! Do ytou think because you were raised “poor” that you possessed not middle class values? Because no one called you cards before I showed up, this was such a pleasant site. It’s nice to have pleasing sites , BUT THAT’S NOT WHAT EVOLUTIONARY, REVOLUTIONARY SITES are about little teenybopper. I asked you a long time ago if I may write to you about your knowledge re:Iboga. You were the only one who did not respond to my request which showed me your typical self absorbed, self centered mannerisms. I t also was quite indicative that you didn’t know what the hell you were talking about. 

                  Callie, you’ve got two choices:, continue to listen to my “shit” or get off the site! Your call. BUT, MAYBE, JUST MAYBE, IF YOU OPEN YOUR BIG FAT MOUTH AND OPEN YOU TINY FUCKING EARS, YOU JUST MIGHT LEARN SOMETHING. I WILL DO THE SAME……..

From: “Paul MacLennan” <leisure1@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 12:46:09 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey dipshitnohope, preston is not a loser, I’ve read his posts for a few months and he is a smart, funny, nice guy.  whereas you appear to be…see previous message, i couldnt be bothered saying it again.  however, for the sake of this fine site/group, i will say again – fuck off dork brain.  take it elsewhere.

please.

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 12:33 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Hey Preston, you are another loser who has no idea what occurred and should stay out of it. It is beteween Calli and myself. My recommendations to you are to mind your business, which as human beings, you are not capabled of doing. Until you do understand what is happening: I’d say Go Fuck yourselves!!!

From: “Paul MacLennan” <leisure1@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 20, 2004 at 12:43:23 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

To sapphirestardus…

hey, asshole, go away. this list is good, it has nice people on it with smart, informed, respectful things to say. they offer advice and support.  we dont need your shit here, take it to the whitehouse, or the stock exchange or better still, keep it to yourself.  OK pal?

“sapphirestardus”? hah. what a crock.  more like “dipshitnohope”…suggest you change your handle…

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Sent: Thursday, May 20, 2004 12:12 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

The problem with your utopian site was you never had anyone willing to call you on your bullshit! Do ytou think because you were raised “poor” that you possessed not middle class values? Because no one called you cards before I showed up, this was such a pleasant site. It’s nice to have pleasing sites , BUT THAT’S NOT WHAT EVOLUTIONARY, REVOLUTIONARY SITES are about little teenybopper. I asked you a long time ago if I may write to you about your knowledge re:Iboga. You were the only one who did not respond to my request which showed me your typical self absorbed, self centered mannerisms. I t also was quite indicative that you didn’t know what the hell you were talking about.

Callie, you’ve got two choices:, continue to listen to my “shit” or get off the site! Your call. BUT, MAYBE, JUST MAYBE, IF YOU OPEN YOUR BIG FAT MOUTH AND OPEN YOU TINY FUCKING EARS, YOU JUST MIGHT LEARN SOMETHING. I WILL DO THE SAME……..

From: <tomo7@starband.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Douse the flames
Date: May 20, 2004 at 12:25:37 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Ibo list,

Who needs this Sapphirestardus@aol.com flamer bullshit? Just make a filter
on your email program and spare yourselves the filth. It’s a big world,
they can work through whatever they need to somewhere else.

I know a great medicine that would really power them through a hall of
mirrors, but you probably do too.

Dr. Tom

…The problem with your utopian site was you never had anyone willing to
call  you on your bullshit! Do ytou think because you were raised “poor”…

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From: “Christina Thibeau” <thibechris@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 11:31:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I had a very close and dear friend that passed away of a cocaine addiction. He wanted to try ibogaine. I thought that by joining this “forum” would help me, but to be honest this is completely bullshit especially when I see posts from an idiot like saphirestardus@aol.com. Is there reallt and need to curse and swear and at like a damn manaic and be so fucking dramatic? If I really wanted to hear shit like that I would watch a soap opera. If there is a way to remove me from this forum than please remove me. Its people like this dumb ass who make me not want to read all the posts.

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: Wed, 19 May 2004 20:26:03 EDT

OH!! There are actually two people with IQ’s large enough to vocalize. I t
has always amazed me how stupoid and dumb you name callers are. You never read
the initial E-Mail, so you couldn”t possibly understand what I was saying.Since
callie has enough intelligence to comprehend what I was conveying I explained
it to her! You are the perfect example of a someone who as long as they get
along with everyone on a site. IT IS A GOOFD SITE!!! I won’t ewven bother with
comments asa such for a moron like you couldn’t possibly get what being
explained. By the way, a man by the name of Jim Jones had a fantastic cult/religion
right up your alley……..Good Luck asshole!!!

_________________________________________________________________
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From: Daniel McGuire <mindmesh@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 11:19:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Wow, how did my simple question about what list options might be available
turn into such a flame war?
And btw,  back to my original questions.  Is there a digest option?  Is
there an option where I get no mail and can check it on the web in an
archive?

-DDM

— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Thanks to the person who sent me the post that started this.
I had deleted it (dated 5/18/2004 3:28:39 PM Central Daylight Time, from
Sapphirestardus@aol.com) as a completely worthless, means nothing kind
of
post, sent by someone really high on something. I’d not bothered to
reply
much less respond to it.
But this follow-up note to Callie here is only bullshit, completely
misdirected energy that should be directed as those who really “have
poisoned this once great society and culture all in the name of
educating
and teaching the poor and mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far
better than you ever could have!!!” I think this is a classic case of
the
pot calling the kettle black.
I mean, this : “It is nice that you at least have the motivation to
learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go before you earn
the
rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and boys” is so
off-the-wall and based on god-only-knows-what it’s laughable-except that
it
isn’t laughable because it’s such vitriol causing nothing but stress, at
least for the person who wrote it initially.
I sincerely hope that Callie doesn’t take such drivel to heart. I’d
write a lot more, but it would only come out negatively and cause yet
more
stress, so I will refrain.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 3:20 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Callie, you remind me of a newspaper journalist trying to make a name
for
herself without having all the facts! This was an E-mail text I received
from a group I had heard about nearthe Tex-Mex Border. So far you have
sent
two e-mails that are more than negative but quite indicative if your
naivete
and chemical/euphoric ignorance. It is nice that you at least have the
motivation to learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go
before you earn the rights and priviledges to play with the big girls
and
boys.

Callie has been around much longer than I and she
probably
has quite a bit to offer, but cerebral knowledge compares NOTHING with
EMPIRICAL as well as CEREBRAL. So this is the deal littlr girl, if you
have
a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare sit on your hands and make value
judgements on subjects you know SHIT about!! Your ‘middle class’ values
and
judgements leave alot to be desired and are best kept to yourself. It is
the
very people as yourself that have poisoned this once great society and
culture all in the name of  educating and teaching the poor and
mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far better than you ever could
have!!!

Why don’t you back to your small town college and
obtain
your “MSW” so you can ‘help’ people  become part of this ‘great’
culturte
that you have created  ….poisoned and destroyed. GOODBYE
CALLIE…..it’s
been real!!!!!

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<)[%]

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__________________________________
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Yahoo! Domains – Claim yours for only $14.70/year
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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Would you use ibogaine?
Date: May 19, 2004 at 10:43:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard, Will you be attending this week with the APHA?
Is the session on Thursday 11-6-04 the only session that talks about any treatment approach or do you know?
Thanks for the post….would love to see entire survey.
Callie

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] UK conference
Date: May 19, 2004 at 9:05:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/19/2004 8:02:40 PM Central Daylight Time, gboy@hush.com writes:

somebody needs to talk shit about patrick and deborah now and marc emery
should punch sara glatt!

Dana how do you think all of this relates to the CSI episode on ibogaine?
.g

LMAO!
Callie

From: <gboy@hush.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] UK conference
Date: May 19, 2004 at 8:52:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—–
Hash: SHA1

maybe i was wrong, if youre smoking crack and posting messages then youd
be only person number 3 or 4 this year. I dont think anyone will beat
that guy who posted 60 or 70 messages to people who weren’t there and
kept going for 3 days. That was last year i’m not sure it counts for
2004.

I love this! Welcome to Mindvox dog!

somebody needs to talk shit about patrick and deborah now and marc emery
should punch sara glatt!

Dana how do you think all of this relates to the CSI episode on ibogaine?
.g

On Wed, 19 May 2004 17:49:48 -0700 Sapphirestardus@aol.com wrote:
This is the GUY, the ASSHOLE that responded to an E-Mail sent to
me from the
Tex-Mex borderline. I wrote his E-Mail verbatim. I was requesting
where I
could find a site , a place to experience Iboga. hat I wreote in
the E-Mail was
exactly what I received  as his E-Mail. The next thing I knew everyone
and their
mother was coming down on the e-mail. ALL I WANT IS TO GET OFF METHADONE
FOR
23YEARS!!! The air of hostility has definitely kept me away from
you helping
me! Obviously I will have to find more peace-loving, serene people.,

hey…but
thsanks anyway!!!!!
—–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—–
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Version: Hush 2.4

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=+IQR
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/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] UK conference
Date: May 19, 2004 at 8:49:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is the GUY, the ASSHOLE that responded to an E-Mail sent to me from the Tex-Mex borderline. I wrote his E-Mail verbatim. I was requesting where I could find a site , a place to experience Iboga. hat I wreote in the E-Mail was exactly what I received  as his E-Mail. The next thing I knew everyone and their mother was coming down on the e-mail. ALL I WANT IS TO GET OFF METHADONE FOR 23YEARS!!! The air of hostility has definitely kept me away from  you helping me! Obviously I will have to find more peace-loving, serene people., hey…but thsanks anyway!!!!!

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 8:46:36 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/20/04 12:35:29 AM, Sapphirestardus@aol.com writes:

<< Hey Preston, you are another loser who has no idea what occurred and
should
stay out of it. It is between Calli and myself. My recommendations to you are
to mind your business, which as human beings, you are not capable of doing.
Until you do understand what is happening: I’d say Go Fuck yourselves!!! >>

Sapphirestardus,

Why did you post the original email that you indicated in a follow-up post
was written by someone else?  I don’t want to second guess you or misread your
intent.  As for my interest you posted these message to a list. Thanks.

Howard

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From: <gboy@hush.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 8:35:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—–
Hash: SHA1

what utopian site are you talking about?

Mindvox?

How many drugs are u on

Your being a angry asshole, congrats that makes you person # 30 this
year so far.

Only difference is that I don’t understand who you’re talking to or why.
Callie? I can’t find what she said that set you off. If she didn’t say
anything to you about iboga its because I think she hasn’t taken it but
is planning to.

whatev dog, don’t mean to steal your specialness but welcome to Mindvox
you’re about normal for here. A asshole who is smarter then average and
has drug problems and personality disorders. Take away the smarter then
average part and you have every drug group I’ve ever read.

.g

On Wed, 19 May 2004 17:12:49 -0700 Sapphirestardus@aol.com wrote:
The problem with your utopian site was you never had anyone willing
to call
you on your bullshit! Do ytou think because you were raised “poor”
that you
possessed not middle class values? Because no one called you cards
before I
showed up, this was such a pleasant site. It’s nice to have pleasing
sites , BUT
THAT’S NOT WHAT EVOLUTIONARY, REVOLUTIONARY SITES are about little
teenybopper.
I asked you a long time ago if I may write to you about your knowledge

re:Iboga. You were the only one who did not respond to my request
which showed me
your typical self absorbed, self centered mannerisms. I t also was
quite
indicative that you didn’t know what the hell you were talking about.

Callie, you’ve got two choices:, continue to
listen to my
“shit” or get off the site! Your call. BUT, MAYBE, JUST MAYBE, IF
YOU OPEN
YOUR BIG FAT MOUTH AND OPEN YOU TINY FUCKING EARS, YOU JUST MIGHT
LEARN
SOMETHING. I WILL DO THE SAME……..
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Version: Hush 2.4

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=6rbx
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Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 8:33:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Preston, you are another loser who has no idea what occurred and should stay out of it. It is beteween Calli and myself. My recommendations to you are to mind your business, which as human beings, you are not capabled of doing. Until you do understand what is happening: I’d say Go Fuck yourselves!!!

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 8:31:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/19/2004 7:13:45 PM Central Daylight Time, Sapphirestardus@aol.com writes:

I asked you a long time ago if I may write to you about your knowledge re:Iboga. You were the only one who did not respond to my request which showed me your typical self absorbed, self centered mannerisms. I t also was quite indicative that you didn’t know what the hell you were talking about.

Callie, you’ve got two choices:, continue to listen to my “shit” or get off the site! Your call. BUT, MAYBE, JUST MAYBE, IF YOU OPEN YOUR BIG FAT MOUTH AND OPEN YOU TINY FUCKING EARS, YOU JUST MIGHT LEARN SOMETHING. I WILL DO THE SAME……..

I am going to reply only to let you know where I stand as far as Ibogaine is concerned.
I joined this list to learn. I am an addict…..have been addicted to opiates my entire adult life. I am on Methadone. I know NOTHING about Ibogaione except what I have read here and what has been recommended to me to read.
I read with hope about others experiences. I have nothing to offer as far as knowledge of Ibogaine. That is why I did not write you back. That is the reason plus I have many things here at my home that prevent me from corresponding as much as I would like to.
You have a very nasty attitude towards me. I hardly ever post negatively. I try to live positively and not make fun or speak down to people…especially people I know nothing about.
Please do not ever address me again. Even if you have been having a bad day today…I don’t care why you are so angry. But, I choose to not associate or even converse with people who spout off like you do.
Have a nice life,
Callie

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 8:26:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

OH!! There are actually two people with IQ’s large enough to vocalize. I t has always amazed me how stupoid and dumb you name callers are. You never read the initial E-Mail, so you couldn”t possibly understand what I was saying.Since callie has enough intelligence to comprehend what I was conveying I explained it to her! You are the perfect example of a someone who as long as they get along with everyone on a site. IT IS A GOOFD SITE!!! I won’t ewven bother with comments asa such for a moron like you couldn’t possibly get what being explained. By the way, a man by the name of Jim Jones had a fantastic cult/religion right up your alley……..Good Luck asshole!!!

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 8:12:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The problem with your utopian site was you never had anyone willing to call you on your bullshit! Do ytou think because you were raised “poor” that you possessed not middle class values? Because no one called you cards before I showed up, this was such a pleasant site. It’s nice to have pleasing sites , BUT THAT’S NOT WHAT EVOLUTIONARY, REVOLUTIONARY SITES are about little teenybopper. I asked you a long time ago if I may write to you about your knowledge re:Iboga. You were the only one who did not respond to my request which showed me your typical self absorbed, self centered mannerisms. I t also was quite indicative that you didn’t know what the hell you were talking about.

Callie, you’ve got two choices:, continue to listen to my “shit” or get off the site! Your call. BUT, MAYBE, JUST MAYBE, IF YOU OPEN YOUR BIG FAT MOUTH AND OPEN YOU TINY FUCKING EARS, YOU JUST MIGHT LEARN SOMETHING. I WILL DO THE SAME……..

From: Hattie <epoptica@freeuk.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] UK conference
Date: May 19, 2004 at 7:17:41 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

For those of you interested this should be an interesting event.
URL
http://www.exploringconsciousness.org.uk/exploringconsciousnessconference/in
dex.html

I will be speaking about ibogaine and discussing the ibogaine sessions I
have been doing over the last three years.

Lots of very interesting speakers on board including the Shulgins, Rick
Doblin (MAPS), Erik Davies, Christian Raetsch and Claudia Muller Ebelling.
A whole range of entheogens are covered.

Hope some of you can make it

Hattie

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From: “AMON” <amon@wetnightmare.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 7:16:15 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

First I’d just like to thank all persons who read and responded to the article
about my son Chris. Every kind word is a balm to my still aching heart. I guess
my purpose in sharing his story, is to ensure that all of you who provide
information, moral support, and encouragement to each other realize that you are
truly providing an immeasurable service- you may not even know the effect this
has on another person, but I know that you make a difference in people’s lives.
Because of you, Chris had hope in the face of hopelessness,
acceptance,nojudgemental advice- he was so excited about the potential of
ibogaine- You are lifelines- don’t ever lose sight of that! In spite of the
cyclical spewing of venom which often appears, don’t take it personally- it is
to be expected from such a diverse group of people- especially Callie, know that
you are cared for and your messages are appreciated,and don’t let yourself be
troubled by such viciousness- I don’t have much to offer this forum, just to
remind you how important you are and to thank you again for caring about each
other- don’t stop! Sue

On Wed, 19 May 2004 17:49:12 -0400, “Preston Peet” wrote:

I’m still missing something.
Could someone please, PLEASE repost whatever it was this guy (Not Jon Ludlum
but the rude guy) is responding to?
Thanks.
Peace,
Preston (I don’t want to reply to the almost laughably rude, off-the-wall
post at Callie without first seeing what ever it was he was replying to. I
can say it stuck me as really silly and just plain mean and
completely…well, I think you all get my drift, but I’d still like to see
what he was responding to…Who is this person?)

—– Original Message —–
From: “Jon Ludlam” <seraphina@compuserve.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
FUCK YOU and your
intellectual bullshit and your racist post I replied too. Go back where
ever you were
hiding before you found this list asshole.
Usually peaceful and loving,
Callie
ps….use your spell checker so I can read your dumbass posts<

Dear Callie,
You forgot to tell him that a strong message will follow. I was going to
write something to him, but you did fine ALL BY YOURSELF!!!

Respectfully Yours,

Jon Ludlam

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<)[%]

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 6:32:12 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks to the person who sent me the post that started this.
I had deleted it (dated 5/18/2004 3:28:39 PM Central Daylight Time, from
Sapphirestardus@aol.com) as a completely worthless, means nothing kind of
post, sent by someone really high on something. I’d not bothered to reply
much less respond to it.
But this follow-up note to Callie here is only bullshit, completely
misdirected energy that should be directed as those who really “have
poisoned this once great society and culture all in the name of educating
and teaching the poor and mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far
better than you ever could have!!!” I think this is a classic case of the
pot calling the kettle black.
I mean, this : “It is nice that you at least have the motivation to
learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go before you earn the
rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and boys” is so
off-the-wall and based on god-only-knows-what it’s laughable-except that it
isn’t laughable because it’s such vitriol causing nothing but stress, at
least for the person who wrote it initially.
I sincerely hope that Callie doesn’t take such drivel to heart. I’d
write a lot more, but it would only come out negatively and cause yet more
stress, so I will refrain.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 3:20 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Callie, you remind me of a newspaper journalist trying to make a name for
herself without having all the facts! This was an E-mail text I received
from a group I had heard about nearthe Tex-Mex Border. So far you have sent
two e-mails that are more than negative but quite indicative if your naivete
and chemical/euphoric ignorance. It is nice that you at least have the
motivation to learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go
before you earn the rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and
boys.

Callie has been around much longer than I and she probably
has quite a bit to offer, but cerebral knowledge compares NOTHING with
EMPIRICAL as well as CEREBRAL. So this is the deal littlr girl, if you have
a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare sit on your hands and make value
judgements on subjects you know SHIT about!! Your ‘middle class’ values and
judgements leave alot to be desired and are best kept to yourself. It is the
very people as yourself that have poisoned this once great society and
culture all in the name of  educating and teaching the poor and
mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far better than you ever could
have!!!

Why don’t you back to your small town college and obtain
your “MSW” so you can ‘help’ people  become part of this ‘great’ culturte
that you have created  ….poisoned and destroyed. GOODBYE CALLIE…..it’s
been real!!!!!

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 5:49:12 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m still missing something.
Could someone please, PLEASE repost whatever it was this guy (Not Jon Ludlum
but the rude guy) is responding to?
Thanks.
Peace,
Preston (I don’t want to reply to the almost laughably rude, off-the-wall
post at Callie without first seeing what ever it was he was replying to. I
can say it stuck me as really silly and just plain mean and
completely…well, I think you all get my drift, but I’d still like to see
what he was responding to…Who is this person?)

—– Original Message —–
From: “Jon Ludlam” <seraphina@compuserve.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 1:11 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
FUCK YOU and your
intellectual bullshit and your racist post I replied too. Go back where
ever you were
hiding before you found this list asshole.
Usually peaceful and loving,
Callie
ps….use your spell checker so I can read your dumbass posts<

Dear Callie,
You forgot to tell him that a strong message will follow. I was going to
write something to him, but you did fine ALL BY YOURSELF!!!

Respectfully Yours,

Jon Ludlam

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<)[%]

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Would you use ibogaine?
Date: May 19, 2004 at 5:41:40 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

While doing an internet search for “ibogaine and buprenorphine” I came across
an abstract of a survey presented at the American Public Health Association.

Attitudes toward ibogaine among clients and counselors in drug treatment
programs

http://apha.confex.com/apha/132am/techprogram/paper_92812.htm

Just drawing it to your attention.  The author’s perception of ibogaine
claims are not accurate but, the survey was given to 1,461 persons.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 3:58:21 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I missed something here. Could I see what post of Callie’s you are replying
to with this?

Thank you.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 19, 2004 3:20 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

Callie, you remind me of a newspaper journalist trying to make a name for
herself without having all the facts! This was an E-mail text I received
from a group I had heard about nearthe Tex-Mex Border. So far you have sent
two e-mails that are more than negative but quite indicative if your naivete
and chemical/euphoric ignorance. It is nice that you at least have the
motivation to learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go
before you earn the rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and
boys.

Callie has been around much longer than I and she probably
has quite a bit to offer, but cerebral knowledge compares NOTHING with
EMPIRICAL as well as CEREBRAL. So this is the deal littlr girl, if you have
a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare sit on your hands and make value
judgements on subjects you know SHIT about!! Your ‘middle class’ values and
judgements leave alot to be desired and are best kept to yourself. It is the
very people as yourself that have poisoned this once great society and
culture all in the name of  educating and teaching the poor and
mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far better than you ever could
have!!!

Why don’t you back to your small town college and obtain
your “MSW” so you can ‘help’ people  become part of this ‘great’ culturte
that you have created  ….poisoned and destroyed. GOODBYE CALLIE…..it’s
been real!!!!!

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 19, 2004 at 3:42:21 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

And if you don’t want to wait, you could try Sara Glatt in the Nederlands,
who I also have heard lots of really good, nice things about.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 11:34 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine

In a message dated 5/19/04 2:42:52 AM, iboga@ziplip.com writes:

<< From http://ibogatherapyhouse.org/

“Due to a large volume of applications received over the last few months,
we
are no longer accepting new applications at this time. The next
application
period will begin in June 2004.”  >>

That’s next month.

Howard

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 19, 2004 at 3:37:10 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh, I didn’t know that they were so busy. What does that tell us?
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: <iboga@ziplip.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 10:37 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine

From http://ibogatherapyhouse.org/
“Due to a large volume of applications received over the last few months,
we are no longer accepting new applications at this time. The next
application period will begin in June 2004.”
—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004, 5:39 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine

ibogatherapyhouse, in canada. Google it. Marc Emory’s place.
I’ve heard mainly good stuff.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: <Ambeatty@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 5:43 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine

I’ve been looking at treatment options on the web, talked to someone
who
sounds real good. There was mention in one of the posts of a place
that
does free
treatments, but I haven’t come across that on the web (or not realized
it
was
free). Can anyone tell me where it is? Money is definitely an issue to
me.
Some of the programs are hugely expensive.
Thanks,
Andy

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From: Jon Ludlam <seraphina@compuserve.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 1:11:42 PM EDT
To: “INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
FUCK YOU and your
intellectual bullshit and your racist post I replied too. Go back where
ever you were
hiding before you found this list asshole.
Usually peaceful and loving,
Callie
ps….use your spell checker so I can read your dumbass posts<

Dear Callie,
You forgot to tell him that a strong message will follow. I was going to
write something to him, but you did fine ALL BY YOURSELF!!!

Respectfully Yours,

Jon Ludlam

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 11:42:37 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/19/2004 2:21:03 AM Central Daylight Time, Sapphirestardus@aol.com writes:

So this is the deal littlr girl, if you have a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare sit on your hands and make value judgements on subjects you know SHIT about!! Your ‘middle class’ values and judgements leave alot to be desired and are best kept to yourself. It is the very people as yourself that have poisoned this once great society and culture all in the name of  educating and teaching the poor and           mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far better than you ever could have!!!

Why don’t you back to your small town college and obtain your “MSW” so you can ‘help’ people  become part of this ‘great’ culturte that you have created  ….poisoned and destroyed. GOODBYE CALLIE…..it’s been real!!!!!

WOW! very unfair!
BTW, I am not middle class, I am a poor white lower class woman and I resent being thrown into middle class. I have not been to college…..I obtained my LPN in 1980 at a Vocational School. I had to surrender my license because I could not keep the narcotic box keys in my pocket and the needles out of my body.
Yep, I am angry……right now angry at you but most of the time angry at people like you who make assumptions before they have anywhere near all the information.
If I don’t want to ask questions I won’t. I will make whatever comments I want whether you like them or not.
I may change my mind later on but for now……..FUCK YOU and your intellectual bullshit and your racist post I replied too. Go back where ever you were hiding before you found this list asshole.
Usually peaceful and loving,
Callie
ps….use your spell checker so I can read your dumbass posts

From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] play fair options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 9:57:31 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Too often we discard seedling relationships before they reach their possiblilities.”
I think it would be a shame for all not to realize how much you have in common, to help find common understanding and access potential possiblities…
What are the limitations in assuming the results/reactions of those around me?
Am I, realistically, in a position to pass up opportunities, or even potiential opportunities?
Oh, and I’m all about finding honor and nobility in poverty, but just because someone is middle class or well off, doen’t automatically mean that they are bad people, just as if someone is poor doesn’t automatically mean they are good people.
Perhaps, one of these ‘rich folk’ can help you feed your people’s, why then assume that they are all bad and cut off access to that untapped potiential?
Perhaps, it is in our best interest to work together?  i.e. real and sinceer love and sinceer compassion in action seem to me to be the smartest most effective “hustle” and it is building, not taking.
I hope everyone finds the path they need to find….
Jason

—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: 19 May 04, 12:21 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
This was an E-mail to learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go before you earn the the facts. this is the deal, On subjects you know…you remind.  Who is not naivete? . It is nice that you at least have the   Callie,motivation text I received from a group I had heard about nearthe Tex-Mex Border. So far I have sent two e-mails that are like me and yet not like me. So this is the deal CEREBRAL,
if you have a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare (program) and sit on value judgements your hands SHIT
Who want’s to be part of a club that needs rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and boys? (This is iboga, not skull & bones.)  (When we point the finger we have 3 pointing back at us etc.)

                  Callie has been around much longer than I and she probably has quite a bit to offer, but cerebral assumptions that I have complete story,  yes, I assume…and I likely am not the only one…

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From: Ambeatty@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 19, 2004 at 6:00:05 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you for the links.
What  are the issues for ibogaine and asthma, which is on the list of
not-to-have for Iboga Therapy House. The person this is for is in jail (dui,
possession) and will come out clean. He had a developing heroin habit and had just
started methadone when he was arrested while watching tv at his grandmother’s.
His asthma is mild. He smokes, though, when not incarcerated.
There is a good article on addiction in Psychology Today, June 2004. The
theme of the issue is reinventing yourself.
Am learning a lot from the list.
Andy

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 19, 2004 at 3:20:14 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie, you remind me of a newspaper journalist trying to make a name for herself without having all the facts! This was an E-mail text I received from a group I had heard about nearthe Tex-Mex Border. So far you have sent two e-mails that are more than negative but quite indicative if your naivete and chemical/euphoric ignorance. It is nice that you at least have the motivation to learn and grow but you have quite a few years left to go before you earn the rights and priviledges to play with the big girls and boys.

Callie has been around much longer than I and she probably has quite a bit to offer, but cerebral knowledge compares NOTHING with EMPIRICAL as well as CEREBRAL. So this is the deal littlr girl, if you have a question, ASK IT! But don’t dare sit on your hands and make value judgements on subjects you know SHIT about!! Your ‘middle class’ values and judgements leave alot to be desired and are best kept to yourself. It is the very people as yourself that have poisoned this once great society and culture all in the name of  educating and teaching the poor and           mistrodden ‘tribes’ who understood it all far better than you ever could have!!!

Why don’t you back to your small town college and obtain your “MSW” so you can ‘help’ people  become part of this ‘great’ culturte that you have created  ….poisoned and destroyed. GOODBYE CALLIE…..it’s been real!!!!!

From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 18, 2004 at 11:36:56 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

1111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
That’s next month.

Howard
11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

: )

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 18, 2004 at 11:34:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/19/04 2:42:52 AM, iboga@ziplip.com writes:

<< From http://ibogatherapyhouse.org/

“Due to a large volume of applications received over the last few months, we
are no longer accepting new applications at this time. The next application
period will begin in June 2004.”  >>

That’s next month.

Howard

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From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 18, 2004 at 10:37:50 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From http://ibogatherapyhouse.org/
“Due to a large volume of applications received over the last few months, we are no longer accepting new applications at this time. The next application period will begin in June 2004.”
—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004, 5:39 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine

ibogatherapyhouse, in canada. Google it. Marc Emory’s place.
I’ve heard mainly good stuff.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: <Ambeatty@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 5:43 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine

I’ve been looking at treatment options on the web, talked to someone who
sounds real good. There was mention in one of the posts of a place that
does free
treatments, but I haven’t come across that on the web (or not realized it
was
free). Can anyone tell me where it is? Money is definitely an issue to me.
Some of the programs are hugely expensive.
Thanks,
Andy

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<)[%]

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From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] newspaper article
Date: May 18, 2004 at 9:16:41 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That’s so great congratulations to your friend.
Whenever I get a little or a lot bummed out I remember
what my life was like a few years ago. ibogaine does
work if you do the rest of it 🙂

Carla B

— Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
Recent friend of mine who was on 80 Mgs. Methadone a
day at the local slave
clinic. He was also benzo addicted for much longer.
He detoxed off benzo’s over
a two month period out patient with the help of a
local sympathetic addiction
MD and took 1100 mgs. Ibogaine HCl and has 5 weeks
clean now. He has no
opiate cravings but is somewhat dysthymic (Bummed
OUT) as the protracted benzo shit
lasts for months. IBO WORKS IF YOU WORK IT>
peace out

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! – Internet access at a great low price.
http://promo.yahoo.com/sbc/

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From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] newspaper article
Date: May 18, 2004 at 9:16:46 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That’s so great congratulations to your friend.
Whenever I get a little or a lot bummed out I remember
what my life was like a few years ago. ibogaine does
work if you do the rest of it 🙂

Carla B

— Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
Recent friend of mine who was on 80 Mgs. Methadone a
day at the local slave
clinic. He was also benzo addicted for much longer.
He detoxed off benzo’s over
a two month period out patient with the help of a
local sympathetic addiction
MD and took 1100 mgs. Ibogaine HCl and has 5 weeks
clean now. He has no
opiate cravings but is somewhat dysthymic (Bummed
OUT) as the protracted benzo shit
lasts for months. IBO WORKS IF YOU WORK IT>
peace out

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! – Internet access at a great low price.
http://promo.yahoo.com/sbc/

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From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] q 0 t Day *_* yaD t 0 q
Date: May 18, 2004 at 8:46:43 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Got to live it to feed it.

Got to be it to see it.

And if it cost blood and tears
to get it, so be it.

So I get mine,
Flip mine.
3 or 4 times.

No matter the forecast…
I’m going to get my shine.”

–Dedicated to the memory of those who lost their lives in Victoria, Texas trying to put food on the table.
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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 18, 2004 at 8:37:29 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ibogatherapyhouse, in canada. Google it. Marc Emory’s place.
I’ve heard mainly good stuff.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: <Ambeatty@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 18, 2004 5:43 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine

I’ve been looking at treatment options on the web, talked to someone who
sounds real good. There was mention in one of the posts of a place that
does free
treatments, but I haven’t come across that on the web (or not realized it
was
free). Can anyone tell me where it is? Money is definitely an issue to me.
Some of the programs are hugely expensive.
Thanks,
Andy

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<)[%]

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From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] newspaper article
Date: May 18, 2004 at 7:53:46 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Recent friend of mine who was on 80 Mgs. Methadone a day at the local slave clinic. He was also benzo addicted for much longer. He detoxed off benzo’s over a two month period out patient with the help of a local sympathetic addiction MD and took 1100 mgs. Ibogaine HCl and has 5 weeks clean now. He has no opiate cravings but is somewhat dysthymic (Bummed OUT) as the protracted benzo shit lasts for months. IBO WORKS IF YOU WORK IT>
peace out

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 18, 2004 at 6:55:34 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/18/2004 3:28:39 PM Central Daylight Time, Sapphirestardus@aol.com writes:

Yo! ‘sup Yo? Ya’ll punkinout my man! Wusup withchall Yawll whiteys keep fgintuo fot us real soldierboys. You ain’t no real nigguh, mah n igguh! Aways comes down to duh reel b oyz, yo?! Igotta bone da bitcjhdonow so on duh latuh.

Da makoytuhlatuh,

Dah man in dah wet,

Peenut juice

???I must’ve missed a post or two somewhere!??
I could’ve accidentally hit the delete button….wished I would’ve hit it on this one!

Callie

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 18, 2004 at 6:31:01 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/18/04 9:44:19 PM, Ambeatty@aol.com writes:

<< I’ve been looking at treatment options on the web, talked to someone who
sounds real good. There was mention in one of the posts of a place that does
free
treatments, but I haven’t come across that on the web (or not realized it was
free). Can anyone tell me where it is? Money is definitely an issue to me.
Some of the programs are hugely expensive. >>

Iboga Therapy House, Vancouver, BC

Howard

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From: Ambeatty@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine
Date: May 18, 2004 at 5:43:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve been looking at treatment options on the web, talked to someone who
sounds real good. There was mention in one of the posts of a place that does free
treatments, but I haven’t come across that on the web (or not realized it was
free). Can anyone tell me where it is? Money is definitely an issue to me.
Some of the programs are hugely expensive.
Thanks,
Andy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 18, 2004 at 4:27:45 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: Mrsnosnibor@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yo! ‘sup Yo? Ya’ll punkinout my man! Wusup withchall Yawll whiteys keep fgintuo fot us real soldierboys. You ain’t no real nigguh, mah n igguh! Aways comes down to duh reel b oyz, yo?! Igotta bone da bitcjhdonow so on duh latuh.

Da makoytuhlatuh,

Dah man in dah wet,

Peenut juice

From: Magnolia Martin <magnoliamartin@mac.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] please remove me from this list
Date: May 18, 2004 at 9:18:32 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

please remove me from this list

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From: “V” <viator77@verizon.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 18, 2004 at 3:51:40 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

dude,

I’m having trouble keeping my mailbox from being bombed/spammed with all
these ibogaine replies too.  i just wanted to join a forum and now I can’t
even figure out how to post on the mindvox forum.  just a bunch of dead
linkx and advertisements… but no forum.  what the hell’s going on here?
—– Original Message —–
From: “Daniel the darkpo3t” <darkpo3t@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 16, 2004 5:25 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options

REMOVE

Daniel McGuire wrote on 16/5/04, 11:28 AM:

Sorry for putting this message on the list but I can’t find the
options on
the website.  I usually like to check my mailing lists online so my box
doesn’t get filled up by them.  Is there a “no mail” option and an
archive
of messages to look at?  If not, if you could put me on a daily digest
option, that would be a little more manageable.  Thank you.

Daniel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! – Internet access at a great low price.
http://promo.yahoo.com/sbc/

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From: “V” <viator77@verizon.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Mindvox Forum Question
Date: May 18, 2004 at 12:21:09 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Cc: <help@minvox.com>, <sapphirestardus@aol.com>, <calliemimosa@aol.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

maybe I’m an idiot, or maybe I don’t have the “secret decoder ring” or
something along those lines, but I can’t figure out how to access the
forums.  All that happens is my mail box gets bomed with everyone else’s
replies.  any suggestions here?

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From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 17, 2004 at 12:58:30 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Alison
There’s a herb called ‘Tongkat Al’  from Indonesia that is quiet effective. I tried a few aphrodisiacs.  Yohimbe is supposed to be one of the more potent ones but it can have some
strong side effects which I didn’t like but I found the tongkat ali very good. I got mine from
‘www.iherb.com’ and you can get a little booklet free that has some interesting info on aphrodisiacs and some peoples experiences.

Luke

Thanks.  Any suggestions are received with thanks.  makes a change from
doctors handing out viagara scripts.  I guess its a bit ironic when people
who have shoved so much shit in their bodies look for other alternatives but
then again maybe we have done enough of that and are looking for different
solutions to things.   Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Saturday, 15 May 2004 3:42:19 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex

> testosterone shots.

Avena sativa (oat grass) green shoots contain a testosterone
analog. Apparently it’s the source of the phrase “sowing wild
oats” in refernce to sex. It can be bought in pill and tincture
form.

Bil

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.

_________________________________________________________________
STOP MORE SPAM with the new MSN 8 and get 2 months FREE* http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

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From: “Allison Senepart” <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 17, 2004 at 9:31:22 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for all the advice.  A bit off the ibogaine topic so appologies there,.  Told my partner about the oat grass.  Response kinda like.  “You  want to feed me oats.  Have you gone completely mad.  Im not a f***** horse. ”  At least if all else fails his reaction gave me a good laugh.  Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Sunday, 16 May 2004 1:50:31 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex

I was able to get around the lack of drive when on Methadone, it takes a little effort but it can be done, and with my exerience without prescription drugs, I’d try an herb or two first before I dove into the Viagra Possiblitliy of side effects at end of commercial….Bob Dole…yukky.
Anyways, the biggest problem I encountered while on methadone regarding drive is getting started, once I was started all was good, it took some time to learn with, now ex and I to realize this, and we were able to remedy the situation by starting things with shower together or orally etc.
But since off methadone : ) yeah, that’s not an issue,
“…when the wind blows” Eddie Murphey from 48 hours : )
J
—– Original Message —–
From: Allison Senepart <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: 15 May 04, 5:52 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
We went through all that sort of shit.  His reasoning is that the mind is willing but the body is not??Maybe we need to try some of your ideas.  The docs handed him out Viagara but I am a bit scared of that and what it does.  That probably sounds really daft from someone who has stuck all sorts of opiates etc. into them but thats the way I feel.  Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Saturday, 15 May 2004 1:34:39 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex

Alison, I had experienced this problem and my solution may not be a common one, but one doctor had noticed in a blood test my testosterone levels were low. Though any number of reasons could cause this and let’s face it, methadone being an analgesic will cause problems for many in this area. Anyway, after some tests to make sure it wasn’t a tumor or something else organic causing this, he put me on testosterone shots. You can also use a c rfeam, a dermal patch, pills but I’ve got to tell you, I’m like a new man. It’s unbelievable. I want to say one other thing to you. I’m not saying this is the case with you and your old man but through the years on meth, we often blame many problems we experience on the methadone, but often it may be us! We are getting older, we do suffer frim ailments (naturally) that others may not, if you understand me. I don’t know your total situation, but that’s why getting tested is always a good idea, at least to rule out what is NOT causing a problem. I hope I have helped a little.

Yours Truly
Julian
____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: “Allison Senepart” <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Good news!
Date: May 17, 2004 at 9:12:26 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thats so great to hear Callie.  Hopefully the result made the battle worth while & it might even help others in the future.  Am very pleased for you.  Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Sunday, 16 May 2004 3:25:45 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Good news!

Good Morning all!
I have been reading a LOT and posting very little so I would like to begin by saying hello and I hope this finds you all healthy and happy!
I have great news from the home front! My Methadone Maintenance has been picked back up by my insurance company and I will be reimbursed by my clinic as soon as they begin payment again!
Howard Lotsof really gave me great information and pointers on where and how to begin and I am very grateful! Thanks Howard……you rock!
Thanks to all you other nice folk for your thoughts and empathy. It really helps me along in this life to know that there are folk who take time to just say, “that sucks! I wish you well.” lol! Doesn’t take a whole lot of energy or time to say that but it does seem to fuel me in dire straits to have others to encourage me along. Being an addict, those encouragement’s haven’t been frequent. In fact, finding this list was a blessing to me. It has helped me to put things in perspective.
Well, gonna close for now. Hope everyone has a good weekend!
Hang in there! Good things do happen occasionally!
Callie
____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] OPIATEADDICTIONRX
Date: May 16, 2004 at 9:48:05 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This entire newsletter is good.
Hope the links work for you!
Callie

*********************************************************
O P I A T E A D D I C T I O N R X,
May 2004 Ref:123
**********************************************
Our ENews Update, typically global in nature, is dominated by US news in this month’s issue. This reflects the recent number of stories coming from the US; Our commitment to a worldwide focus remains unchanged.

————————————————————————————-
NEW RESOURCE AVAILABLE:
————————————————————————————-

BUPRENORPHINE: VOICES OF EXPERIENCE WEB CAST
NOW AVAILABLE – HEAR FROM A PANEL OF INTERNATIONAL EXPERTS & EARN CME CREDITS AS WELL
For more information: http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/whatsnew.asp?id=556

————————————————————————————–
US News Highlights:
————————————————————————————–

USA -VERMONT: METHADONE TREATMENT COVERAGE BY PRIVATE INSURERS

In Vermont, where methadone maintenance was illegal until very recently, “one of the state’s largest private health insurance companies[MVP] has agreed to cover methadone treatment for opiate addicts.”
For more information: http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/whatsnew.asp?id=559

USA: DIRECTOR OF NATIONAL INSTITUTE FOR
DRUG ABUSE (NIDA), DR. NORA VOLKOW, TESTIFIES BEFORE CONGRESSIONAL COMMITTEE

While the testimony was a good overall assessment of where America is in its fight against the problem of drug use, it is difficult to see what warrants the optimistic statement that “tremendous progress has been made in how we treat drug abuse and addiction.”  For more details: http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/whatsnew.asp?id=557

COMMENTS ON PROPOSED LEGISLATION TO ELIMINATE 30-PATIENT LIMIT FOR BUPRENORPHINE PRESCRIBING

Two bills (Senate 1887, House 3634) have been introduced to eliminate the current limit of 30 patients that can be treated by group practices with Buprenorphine. Neither would alter the 30-patient limit on any individual physician, whether practicing solo or in a group. Both limits – on the group practice and on the doctor – are without precedent, and would seem to reflect the bias of Government against the disease of addiction, the patient and the provider.
For the complete story: http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/expert/current.asp?id=336

MISINFORMATION LINGERS (AND SPREADS) REGARDING “METHADONE DEATHS”

The recently released International Narcotics Control Board report for 2003 refers to concern in USA over “methadone-related deaths and reported diversions of methadone by persons in substitution treatment . . .” As noted in the SAMHSA NEWS RELEASE of Feb. 6,2004, the US Government convened an expert panel that concluded unequivocally that patients being treated for opiate addiction were not the source of the medication involved in these deaths.

———————————————————————————
IMPORTANT NEWS FROM AROUND THE WORLD
———————————————————————————

LIVER TRANSPLANTS AND METHADONE TREATMENT

A comparative study of liver transplant outcomes for methadone maintenance patients and patients with no history of opioid dependence has been published. The bottom line: “Data do not support withholding the provision of liver transplantation to patients receiving MMT. . . ” For full report: Liver Transplantation, Vol. 10, No 1 (January) 2004  pp97-106. Author: Weinrieb, Un.Pennsylv.

GERMANY: 2004 ANNUAL REPORT ON THE STATE
OF THE DRUG PROBLEM JUST RELEASED

The Drug Commissioner of the German Government, Ms Marion Caspers-Merk, recently released her annual report for 2003. Drug deaths in Germany dropped to the lowest level since 1989, continuing a consistent three-year trend.
For more information: http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/whatsnew.asp?id=565

AUSTRALIA: THE 15th INT’L CONFERENCE OF THE
REDUCTION OF DRUG RELATED HARM WAS
RECENTLY HELD IN MELBOURNE
The conference held annually is a major venue for examination of policies relating to illicit drugs and strategies to prevent or minimize the harm associated with their use. This year the meeting attracted 1,100 people from over 40 countries. For more details and the presentation by Dr. Newman, ICAAT Director, click here: http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/whatsnew.asp?id=561

———————————————–
UPCOMING CONFERENCES:
———————————————–

International Symposium on HIV & Emerging Infectious Diseases
June 3-5, 2004
Toulon, France
http://www.avps.org/2003/hiv.htm

Ethnicity & Addiction
16th International Congress on Addiction
September 8 – 10
Vienna, Austria
http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/vienna.pdf

The Third International Conference on
Substitution Treatment and Rehabilitation
of Drug Addiction
September 28-30, 2004
Katowice, Poland   Web site coming soon

American Association of Treatment of
Opioid Dependence
October 16-20, 2004
Orlando, Florida, USA

AATOD Homepage

VI European Conference
European Opiate Addiction Treatment Association
November 1-3, 2004
Paris, France
http://www.europad.org

Fifth National Harm Reduction Conference
November 11-14, 2004
New Orleans, Louisiana, USA
http://www.harmreduction.org/conf2004

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Insurer will pay for methadone treatment
Date: May 16, 2004 at 9:45:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello all! I know this isn’t a Methadone list but some of you might find this interesting.
Forgive me if I am sending mail you don’t want to read!
Callie

Insurer will pay for methadone treatment – May. 4, 2004

MONTPELIER – One of the state’s largest private health insurance companies has agreed to cover methadone treatment for opiate addicts, becoming the first Vermont carrier to pay for such treatment. MVP Health Care in April signed a contract with the Howard Center for Human Services, Vermont’s only methadone clinic. Although MVP has no current members requiring methadone at the Burlington-based clinic that is associated with Fletcher Allen Health Care, the company agreed to pay for such services in the future, should treatment be needed. The move may now lead other health insurance providers to follow suit. Methadone is a liquid drug used to treat addicts hooked on opiates, including heroin. It is controversial because methadone does not cure addiction. Instead, it becomes a substitute for the addictive drug, often requiring the addict to use methadone indefinitely. The contract was hailed by substance abuse advocates and comes at a politically sensitive time. The Vermont Legislature is currently debating whether to expand methadone treatment beyond hospital-based clinics, which could lead to as many as three mobile clinics operating in various parts of the state. MVP officials said last month’s decision did not constitute a change in company policy. The Northeast-based insurance carrier that covers nearly 600,000 people in Vermont, New York, Massachusetts and Pennsylvania has long-standing contracts with at least three methadone clinics in other states, said Gary Hughes, a company spokesman. The Howard Center, which treats 105 addicts, opened just 18 months ago. Now that the clinic has a history that can be reviewed, MVP agreed to cover its program, which includes counseling, Hughes said. “We have made no changes to our policy, but there is now a provider in Vermont for us to deal with,” Hughes said. “Methadone has been proven to be effective. It is a covered benefit.” Hughes said MVP, which insures about 60,000 Vermonters, will evaluate other Vermont-based clinics should lawmakers expand methadone distribution. “We probably would look at each clinic individually and see if it improved access for our members,” Hughes said. Bob Bick, the Howard Center’s director of adult services, said the Burlington-based clinic now plans to approach Vermont’s two other major insurance carriers – Blue Cross Blue Shield of Vermont and CIGNA – to forge similar contracts. Officials at both companies, which insure a combined 225,000 Vermonters, said they would be receptive. “It’s really just a matter of working out the systems so they are able to bill us correctly,” said Lindsay Shearer, a spokeswoman for CIGNA’s New England division. “CIGNA believes methadone is a proven therapy for treatment of opiate addiction.” Methadone treatment at the Howard Center costs about $180 per week, Bick said. “We are making headway,” Bick said. Private insurance coverage “not only makes methadone more accessible for those who need it, but it will begin to erode some of the stigma that comes with heroin addiction. People who are insured are more likely to be ‘mainstream’ because they have not hit bottom and lost everything.” Dr. Paul Jarris, Vermont’s Health Commissioner, agreed. “For years treatment has been seen as a public responsibility, not a private responsibility,” Jarris said. “What this does is acknowledge opiate addiction is an equal opportunity disease that affects everyone across socioeconomic groups.” If the Legislature allows methadone treatment outside of hospital-based centers, Vermont eventually could establish as many as three additional free-standing or mobile clinics, Jarris said. Treatment is costly, so private coverage would free up state money to help additional people, he said. “It will increase the state’s ability to care for people who don’t have insurance,” Jarris said. Sen. James Leddy, D-Chittenden, chairman of the Senate Health and Welfare Committee, helped write the methadone-expansion bill that would not only establish additional clinics but allow patients to take the controversial medication home. He praised MVP for breaking new ground, and encouraged other insurance carriers to follow suit. “It only seems logical that other insurers will follow,” Leddy said. “I see this as one further, positive step in providing more treatment to those who need it, and help state funding go further.” The methadone bill passed the Senate earlier this year 27-2. The House Health and Welfare Committee will debate the measure this week. Contact John Zicconi at john.zicconi@rutlandherald.com.

From: “Daniel the darkpo3t” <darkpo3t@aol.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 16, 2004 at 5:25:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

REMOVE

Daniel McGuire wrote on 16/5/04, 11:28 AM:

Sorry for putting this message on the list but I can’t find the
options on
the website.  I usually like to check my mailing lists online so my box
doesn’t get filled up by them.  Is there a “no mail” option and an
archive
of messages to look at?  If not, if you could put me on a daily digest
option, that would be a little more manageable.  Thank you.

Daniel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! – Internet access at a great low price.
http://promo.yahoo.com/sbc/

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] quote of the Sun[Ra]day
Date: May 16, 2004 at 4:26:09 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On the money my man!!!

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointef people
Date: May 16, 2004 at 4:25:01 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You know I have mixed feelings about all this shit! We die more from the gov’t and our backwards culture keeping euphoria ‘criminal’ than from the actual drugs!! Those are the REAL facts. I am so very sorry for your loss, byt this is why “BLTC” is in existence!!! Not to eradicate drugs and their use, but to legalize them, manufacture them properly and for no negative side effects to exist. If you think this is not possible, then you have bought their “sales rhetoric”. Drugs, in the state they are presemtly in, can be quite dangerous. I swear to you, I swear on my life, if these huge manufacturers saw the profits in safeguarding ‘euphoric’ substances, they would be!!!.

From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] quote of the Sun[Ra]day
Date: May 16, 2004 at 4:11:09 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

(This is on an Orlaam Highlighter I found under my bed this morning)

“…Oral Solution (Warning: May be Habit forming.)”

4 hours sleep in 6 weeks.  “…May be Habit forming.”
“Warning” Symantics Propeganda:
“Opium has all the good of Dr Jeckyl and all the evil of Mr Hyde.  Marihuana is entirely the monster Hyde, the harmful effect of which cannot be measured.” — Harry J. Anslinger: Opening statement at the Marihuana Tax Act hearings, 1937

Yes, no doubt, to me at least, clinic’s are way better then no program at all, I’m curious to understand better the logic of those who don’t agree.
Depends what you compair it to, i guess……pro’s and con’s of Licenced Reliable Supply®
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From: Daniel McGuire <mindmesh@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] list options
Date: May 16, 2004 at 2:28:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry for putting this message on the list but I can’t find the options on
the website.  I usually like to check my mailing lists online so my box
doesn’t get filled up by them.  Is there a “no mail” option and an archive
of messages to look at?  If not, if you could put me on a daily digest
option, that would be a little more manageable.  Thank you.

Daniel

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
SBC Yahoo! – Internet access at a great low price.
http://promo.yahoo.com/sbc/

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From: “Brad Fisher” <brad.fisher@guaranty.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] newspaper article
Date: May 16, 2004 at 1:17:26 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thank you for sharing this very difficult memory and time.. I am a 52 yr.
old “dope-fiend” addict, much like Chris. I was lucky and survived, I have
been on Methadone 6 years now and my life has stabilized. Parents don’t know
what to do to help, and often there is little one can do to help. Certainly
our drug laws contribute to the problem. Until this use is out in the open
things will not get better. Perhaps you can take comfort knowing Chris is
home.
bf

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] newspaper article
Date: May 16, 2004 at 3:02:04 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Sue,

Thank you for sharing your grief, it may be a lesson for all of us.
I know that you have been  a loving mom to Chris, and still you are.
He is someone I will not forget. I like to wish you a lot of strength.
I guess you will never know the truth.

Blessing,

sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: AMON [mailto:amon@wetnightmare.com]
Verzonden: zondag 16 mei 2004 4:22
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [ibogaine] newspaper article

Hello group, I have attached a newspaper article which appeared in the local
newspaper a few weeks ago about the death of my son Chris, who had found
support
from this group a few months before his death, if anyone might be interested
in
reading it. Thanks for allowing me to share. Sue

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] newspaper article
Date: May 15, 2004 at 11:40:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am so sorry for your loss.
I used to hear in AA meetings or NA meetings the following……’It is sad but sometimes an addict or alcoholic dies so that another may live.’
I did not comprehend that at first. In fact, I thought it was the coldest most selfish statement I had about ever heard. As I live on with addiction and watch my friends who are addicts I have come to realize exactly what the statement means to me now.
Your determination and action you are taking because your son died may save the life of one or hopefully numerous others who are suffering in addiction.
Thank you for sharing that.
Callie

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointef people
Date: May 15, 2004 at 11:34:50 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Out of curiosity,
How do you know that for Callie it would be a “better life,” off
methadone?
And what do you mean, your daughter is getting of “it” the “hard way?”
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Ecd4889@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, May 15, 2004 8:59 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointef people

Callie

Not only is it possible, it is a much better life for you.

Imagine not being a slave to a mindless substance.

A Mom whose Daughter is getting off of it the hard way.

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From: “AMON” <amon@wetnightmare.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] newspaper article
Date: May 15, 2004 at 10:22:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello group, I have attached a newspaper article which appeared in the local
newspaper a few weeks ago about the death of my son Chris, who had found support
from this group a few months before his death, if anyone might be interested in
reading it. Thanks for allowing me to share. Sue  /]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
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From: Ecd4889@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointef people
Date: May 15, 2004 at 8:59:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie

Not only is it possible, it is a much better life for you.

Imagine not being a slave to a mindless substance.

A Mom whose Daughter is getting off of it the hard way.

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Disappointef people
Date: May 15, 2004 at 8:53:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What a thought provoking question!
A life without drug addiction is very frightening to me! Isn’t that pitiful? I cannot even picture waking every morning and going through my day without some sort of self medication. I have not done that happily since I was about 15 years old. So I really can’t even comprehend it that possibility.

Rationalization? yep.
Callie

From: “Brad Fisher” <brad.fisher@guaranty.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy
Date: May 15, 2004 at 4:22:52 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Original Message—–
From: booker w [mailto:swbooker@hotmail.com]
Sent: Monday, May 10, 2004 2:01 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy

Hi.  In relation to this study, just before I relapsed to opiates again I was talking to an MD that I knew thru 12 step meetings.  I could tell I was probably going to relapse soon and he told me that there were possiblilities of giving low doses of naltrexone to people (like 4 mgs. each night, he said) which would cause one’s brain to produce more endorphins in counteraction, helping to relieve the desire for opiates and boost natural painkillers in my wee brain.  I went to my own doc. and asked him if I could try this, but of course he was close-minded (which was very frustrating because it seemed so easy and simple.)  He said that it was all “experimental” and conjecture, and just try to learn to deal with headache pain (he gave me some fioricet – doesn’t he know that’s addicting?)  He told me that folks quitting cigarettes always desire to smoke (I don’t and I quit five years ago.)  Most doctors and non-addicts just DON’T GET IT, that when you get caught up in “white-knuckling,”  if it goes on too long, the drugs always win – at least in my case.
I hate drug-testing on animals, but I would sure like to try some more experimenting on humans regarding naltrexone uses.  I’m willing…
Interesting study, tho.
Sandy Watson
>From: HSLotsof@aol.com

>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>Subject: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy

>Date: Sat, 8 May 2004 16:26:30 EDT

>

>http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

>

>Ultra-Low Dose Naltrexone

>

>”Thus, ultra-low doses of naltrexone effectively prevented the decline of

>morphine effect observed over 7 days and inhibited the increase in morphine ED50

>value. Remarkably, naltrexone also reversed established morphine tolerance,

>restoring the antinociceptive effect of morphine to 70% of the original level

>and the morphine ED” — ‘Paradoxical Effects of the Opioid Antagonist Naltrexone

>on Morphine Analgesia, Tolerance, and Reward In Rats’ (Powell et. al. 2001)

>Ultra low dose naltrexone (ULDNTX, or ULD Naltrexone) therapy has been

>developed and utilized for the reduction and maintaince of opioid tolerance at the

>DTS. We present to you several pages devoted to our project, and our

>recommendations as to the appropriate dosages that should be administered. It is our

>belief that naltrexone is a safe and efficacious means of inhibiting the

>development of opioid tolerance.

>top

>

>A Primer

>

>It would be prudent to begin by highlighting that the use of naltrexone for

>this indication is experimental and as such, there may be unexpected

>consequences. Published content has been provided for educational use only and should

>not be taken as an endorsement of suitability or safety of the treatment

>protocol defined herein. With that taken care of, let us discuss the acquisition of

>naltrexone.

>Naltrexone is available in most areas of the world as a prescription only

>medicine. This would, of course, mean that you must see a registered

>practicitoner in order to acquire this drug. Some online pharmacies may offer naltrexone,

>albeit at an inflated price. As naltrexone is inherently a very expensive drug

>(a bottle of 30 x 50 mg Revia costs over $220 AUD), it may be desirable to

>acquire a prescription, if one can, for an approved usage such as the treatment

>of alcohol dependence. In many countries such a use is subsidised heavily by

>their respective governments.

>Obviously, the 50 mg tablets contain far too much naltrexone for this

>purpose; In fact, even one fifth of a tablet would precipitate opioid withdrawal in

>those who are dependent. The dilemma may be resolved by carefully preparing a

>dilution with a known quantity of solvent (ie: preserved saline.) If all this

>sounds confusing, don’t fret. The entire process is further explained elsewhere

>on this page.

>Once prepared, the solution must be decanted into a container and stored in a

>refrigerated environment. With the preparation complete, administration may

>commence. Initiation should preferrably take place at ~0.05 mg/day. Titration

>should be limited to a maximum deviation of 0.03 mg/day from the recommended

>dose. We have found that doses above 0.05 mg/day still produce desirable effects

>- doses as high as 0.15-0.2 mg/day have been found to still slightly augment

>opioid response, yet we feel that maximum efficacy is only reached at the

>lower end of this envelope.

>top

>

>The Possible Benefits

>

>Naltrexone was found to at least slow down, and even possibly inhibit the

>continuation of the development of tolerance to opioid agonists. However,

>naltrexone was only moderately successful in reversing opioid tolerance. In addition,

>naltrexone was found to selectively and completely reverse all the negative

>effects of opioid agonist use on sexual function and restore the individual’s

>libido to their opioid naive state. It was found that this effect was more

>prominent at lower doses of around 0.05 mg/day. A variety of mild side effects

>experienced shortly after onset, including pipillary constriction and light

>senstivity, dry mouth and urinary retention, appeared to be reduced or eliminated

>by the ultra-low-dose naltrexone.

>

>

>10998 hits since 06-Jan-2004.

>Last Modified: Saturday, 10-Jan-2004 at 02:08 PM

>http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

>

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From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 15, 2004 at 4:16:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If the difficulty is in achieving erection, the three things
I have seen mentioned are Viagra, Muira Puama, and Clavohuasca,
and no doubt there are others.

Bill

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Good news!
Date: May 15, 2004 at 3:24:22 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/15/04 7:02:28 PM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

I have great news from the home front! My Methadone Maintenance has been
picked back up by my insurance company and I will be reimbursed by my clinic
as soon as they begin payment again!<
Thanks for the update Callie.

It’s nice to hear good news every so often.
So, who’s got extra ibogaine they want to send me, along with a sitter?
I’ve been giving serious consideration of going back on methadone, due
to unrelenting pain and a serious fucking habit formed on opiate pain meds
again. Methadone is much cheaper and my pain doc has offered it, though
I’ve refused up to now.

I cannot keep on keeping on, but I don’t really know what to do, or at
least, have not yet decided what to do – I cannot afford to travel, and
blah, blah, blah, never mind.

But don’t anyone try to tell me legit pain patients don’t get physically
addicted to opiates, because I’ll laugh in your face. Especially considering
that I was introduced to opiates for treatment of pain way back when, which
started this course of my life I’ve been on and off of for years and years.
Anyway, Good to hear your good news Callie.
Congrats.
Peace,
Preston

Hi Preston,

Dosing with ibogaine and using methadone are not contradictory.  Ibogaine has
many benefits in opioid maintained, opioid tapered or naive subjects.

Howard

Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
POB 10032
Staten Island, NY 10301-0032
USA
dir tel, 1 718 442-2754
dir fax, 1 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net

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From: <tomo7@starband.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointed people.
Date: May 15, 2004 at 3:23:19 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julian,

I have enjoyed Nick and Sara’s responses to your questions about who to
trust. While certainly true that bad people and rip offs are seemingly
present everywhere, so is human nature and the energetics of this smart
plant iboga. If someone has experienced iboga and found it powerful and
relevant enough to fascilitate it for other troubled souls, they probably
get some basic karma cause and effect. I bet there is a lower risk of
psychic predators among this group. As Sara mentioned, no one getting
started on a fringe branch of the shamanic services industry would also be
likely to want disappointed clients killing their reputation.

From this point on, questions move into the touchy areas of your personal
responsibility. What is the cost of your present habitual behaviors in
terms of foods, medicines, drugs of dependence, lost time from business or
employment, trashed relationships, alienated families, destroyed credit,
legal records, shot careers, and blown out dreams, just to start the
ledger list.  So what is it worth to you in sheckles to unlock your
shackles, if you dare to dream that they can be?

Next, what are the costs your fascilitator faces in travel, materials,
medicines, and time?  Are they coming from this as a professional and
experienced in techniques of counseling and communication?  Or, is this a
recent midlife career shift? When you interview with your helper, come to
an understanding of these factors before the financial bidding begins. And
after you access the unique support of this incredible plant ally, don’t
forget to seed your future changes with a generous tip or partial funding
of another client. For all the vivid controversies we share in life, Bwiti
and most of us agree that what goes around, comes around.

Dr. Tom

Hi Julian,

It’s the same with the Bwiti. There is often a lot of rivalry and
dispute between groups. The nature of iboga is to bring up unresolved
conflicts, that through being brought to light they can be resolved. In
Bwiti terminology, anything that’s standing in the way of Dissumba must
be seen and integrated. Stuff that isn’t resolved in the session is
frequently acted out on others. Just watch this space, someone will
probably mail in and disagree! It doesn’t mean you can’t trust the
process. It’s just that this arguing and name-calling is part of it!

with love

Nick

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Good news!
Date: May 15, 2004 at 3:01:22 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have great news from the home front! My Methadone Maintenance has been
picked back up by my insurance company and I will be reimbursed by my clinic
as soon as they begin payment again!<

Thanks for the update Callie.
It’s nice to hear good news every so often.
So, who’s got extra ibogaine they want to send me, along with a sitter?
I’ve been giving serious consideration of going back on methadone, due to
unrelenting pain and a serious fucking habit formed on opiate pain meds
again. Methadone is much cheaper and my pain doc has offered it, though I’ve
refused up to now.
I cannot keep on keeping on, but I don’t really know what to do, or at
least, have not yet decided what to do – I cannot afford to travel, and
blah, blah, blah, never mind.
But don’t anyone try to tell me legit pain patients don’t get physically
addicted to opiates, because I’ll laugh in your face. Especially considering
that I was introduced to opiates for treatment of pain way back when, which
started this course of my life I’ve been on and off of for years and years.
Anyway, Good to hear your good news Callie.
Congrats.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, May 15, 2004 11:25 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Good news!

Good Morning all!
I have been reading a LOT and posting very little so I would like to begin
by saying hello and I hope this finds you all healthy and happy!
I have great news from the home front! My Methadone Maintenance has been
picked back up by my insurance company and I will be reimbursed by my clinic
as soon as they begin payment again!
Howard Lotsof really gave me great information and pointers on where and how
to begin and I am very grateful! Thanks Howard……you rock!
Thanks to all you other nice folk for your thoughts and empathy. It really
helps me along in this life to know that there are folk who take time to
just say, “that sucks! I wish you well.” lol! Doesn’t take a whole lot of
energy or time to say that but it does seem to fuel me in dire straits to
have others to encourage me along. Being an addict, those encouragement’s
haven’t been frequent. In fact, finding this list was a blessing to me. It
has helped me to put things in perspective.
Well, gonna close for now. Hope everyone has a good weekend!
Hang in there! Good things do happen occasionally!
Callie

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] FWD Dublin ENCOD Report
Date: May 15, 2004 at 2:58:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ORIGINAL MESSAGE FOLLOWS:

“Also some kind of dialogue took place with the United States government.

Its representative, called David Murray, already had been annoyed by the

lack of receptiveness among participants for his ideas about how the EU

should copy the succesfull approach of the US in drug law enforcement. But

when the ENCOD-representative challenged the success of the US drug war and

suggested that he was only defending it because that was his job, Mr.

Murray responded literally: “That is an insult, you son of a bitch”.”

Dear friends,

Please find herewith the report on the presence of ENCOD at the EU Summit

on Drugs in Dublin, Ireland.

Any comments or questions on this report are wellcome. You may also

distribute it as broadly as possible.

Best wishes,

Joep Oomen
EUROPEAN NGO COUNCIL ON DRUG POLICY
Lange Lozanastraat 14
2018 Antwerpen
Belgium
Tel. 00 32 (0)3 237 7436
Fax. 00 32 (0)3 237 0225
E-mail:encod@glo.be
Website: www.encod.org

THE HARD WAY FORWARD TO ANOTHER DRUG POLICY

The following is a summary of the experiences of a representative of the

European NGO Council on Drug Policy while attending the conference called

“The Way Forward”, on a new European Union strategy on illicit drugs, which

was held in the Hotel Conrad, Dublin, Ireland, on 10 and 11 May, 2004.

My presence at the Conference followed an invitation of the organisers

(Irish government, current EU-presidency together with the Dutch

government, the next EU -presidency) to inform about the position of

European NGO’s working on drugs issues. The result was that some

governments re-acted on this presence as if I had come to open the box of

Pandora…

The audience consisted of about 200 people: mostly civil servants from all

the 25 EU Member States, some from candidate countries Rumania, Bulgaria

and Turkey, some representatives of European Institutions (European

Commission, Europol, European Monitoring Centre on Drugs and Drug Addiction

EMCDDA, Council of Europe), some observers from third governments (Norway,

United States) and two NGO representatives (TNI and ENCOD).

The conference was meant to draw the first global guidelines for the next

EU Drug Strategy (2005 – 2012) and Action Plan (2005-2008) which has to be

designed during Autumn of 2004 and finally approved in the springtime of 2005.

I was asked to participate in a plenary panel session on Monday morning,

just after the opening speeches. This panel consisted of four people: one

representative of the UK police, two Irish doctors and me. I was the only

panel member to propose a fundamental change of logic in drug policy, with

which I referred to the need to start creating political ‘room for

manoevre’ for policies that are not based on prohibition. We all had about

6 minutes to speak during the entire panel session.

The panel discussion also contained the screening of a video film in which

8 people were interviewed. They were Tomas Zabranski (Czech expert), Andria

Efthimiou-Mordaunt (UK activist), Mike Trace (UK expert), Ian Oliver (UNDCP

consultant), Jan van der Tas (NL activist), David Liddell (UK harm

reduction), Danny Kushlick (UK activist) and Krzysztof Krajewski (Polish

expert). Every single person interviewed concluded with a call on the

audience to work towards a review of existing policies.

After this the floor was opened to discussions and the first three

governments to re-act (Belgium, Italy and Greece) immediately protested

against my presence. The Belgian government even used the word

“scandalised” to describe their feelings on my presentation and the content

of the video, accusing the organisers to be extremely biased in their

choice of speakers. They also felt scandalised by the fact that ENCOD had

dared to use the EU symbol in our flyer which can be seen at

http://encod.org/encod_lo-res.pdf

This incident influenced the entire conference. In the corridor,  a lot of

discussion was going on concerning the fact that our ideas had been allowed

to enter the conference room.

After lunch, in the workshops that followed the plenary session, it was

clear that some governments (especially Sweden, Italy, France and even

Germany) were quite outraged about the fact that the call for change in

drug policies had been at the center of attention in the morning. This

meant that in all the four workshops (Demand Reduction, Law Enforcement,

Information & Evaluation and International Co-operation) several

representatives acted with a high degree of Pavlov: every time the word

harm reduction was mentioned, they would fly up and state that this could

not be the objective of EU drug policy, which still had to be based on

reduction of drug consumption etc.

Meanwhile, several representatives came to me and said that on a personal

title, they agreed with lots of the things we were saying. Especially the

representatives of the new EU Member States were very positive, saying that

they did not agree with the Belgian representative. They said that from own

experience, they knew all too well how ‘civil society’ is treated by

authorities and that the future is ours.

Meanwhile the 100 copies of the statement I had with me (also presented on

www.encod.org/warsaw.htm ) disappeared quite quickly from the information

table. Also I had quite positive talks with delegates of the Irish, Dutch,

Slovenian, Czech, Finnish, Cypriote, Slovak, Bulgarian and Hungarian,

European Commission and Council of Europe delegations and even a

constructive conversation with someone from the Swedish Ministry of

Justice, who also said that he found the drug debate too dogmatic…

THE FIGHT FOR MONEY

What resulted clearly from the conference is that most governments are

aware that in the 1990s, there has been a shift in drug policies from

repression to harm reduction. They are of course aware that this shift has

not been enough to solve the problems, and that a second shift is needed

from harm reduction to legal regulation. But in order to do this, they need

to have the tools to question the current approach within the law

enforcement apparatus. And that is a problem, as the law enforcement lobby

is well established.

In the workshop there was a lot of talking about the need to investigate

and evaluate health related initiatives: prevention, treatment, new health

hazards concerning ATS (Amphetamine Type Stimulants) and cannabis (French

and Germany both highlighted the “increasing health problems of cannabis

consumption), harm reduction initiatives and so on.

The conclusion of these talks was usually that the European Commission

should invest more money, the EC then pointed at the EMCDDA, and the EMCDDA

pointed again at the member states. Conclusion: we want research but others

should pay for it.

This way, the participants escaped the real discussion: about the result of

current policies on drug consumption (according to a Dutch researcher,

there is virtually no impact at all from any kind of policies on drug

consumption), about ways to use each other’s research results (for instance

on heroin distribution in Switzerland, Germany, Holland and Spain) and

about other things that could be applied in order to save money in stead of

investing more etc.

But also, there was virtually no talking at all about the need to evaluate

law enforcement. Here the discussion went more in the direction of

enlarging co-operation between European police forces, supporting Europol,

and designing new action plans to “new threats” such as ATS production and

trafficking. Again this would create the need to use more money (see above).

In personal conversations, one could feel however that even repressive

governments (like Denmark and Sweden) do not have a real response to the

argument that more law enforcement on drugs means more money to organised

crime. They typically respond by saying that we do not have a proposal of

how to do things in a post-prohibition system, and as long as we do not

have answers to many questions on how such a system could function they

will never take us serious…

THE LACK OF DIALOGUE

For someone from civil society, representing a large contingent of tax

payers, it was quite astonishing to see that the participants at the event

were not able to reach any kind of clear consensus on even the most minimal

definitions on what should be considered as ideal outcomes of a new EU drug

strategy. This was perhaps partly because the organisers had been a bit too

ambitious in defining these objectives. Although it is remarkable to see

how a formulation like “Improving the effectiveness and sustainability of

drug prevention aimed at vulnerable young people and by increasing

awareness about drug related risks through the dissemination of reliable

information of high quality among young people in the age of 12 to 25” can

already be considered as “too ambitious”.

Mainly, the lack of results can be explained by the reluctance of certain

governments (especially Sweden, Italy, Belgium, France and and

interestingly enough, Germany) to enter in a real discussion. Their goal

seemed mainly to sabotise the debate, to make sure no mention was made that

would open the pandora box…

Of course this left a bitter aftertaste among all participants. In the

closing remarks, Europol and EMCDDA representatives could make a final call

for more money to do law enforcement and research. But the real question is

if there will be room for further dialogue with civil society on the drug

issue, as this dialogue seems to be the only way to close the box of

pandora, that is: to obtain a real view on the harms of drug prohibition

and start reducing them by reforming the policies.

But this dialogue is undoubtedly going to come. Especially the presence of

the new Member states is interesting in this aspect. Still they are

reluctant to join the discussion (as someone said: “they have taken a seat

in the bus but do not  try to come closer to the steering wheel”) also

because they are used to obey orders (first from Moscow, now from

Brussels), but if they do, it is quite sure that they will come with many

questions, as they are aware of the difficulties that prohibition is bringing.

Also some kind of dialogue took place with the United States government.

Its representative, called David Murray, already had been annoyed by the

lack of receptiveness among participants for his ideas about how the EU

should copy the succesfull approach of the US in drug law enforcement. But

when the ENCOD-representative challenged the success of the US drug war and

suggested that he was only defending it because that was his job, Mr.

Murray responded literally: “That is an insult, you son of a bitch”.

CONCLUSION

My conclusion of this conference is that the debate on drug policies is

arriving to the EU forum. Prohibitionist governments are slowly becoming

nervous at the direction the process is taking, and will do everything to

block it. But they are also aware that they do not have any responses to

some of our arguments, and some individual people among government

apparatus are increasingly aware that they need to go into debate with us

in order to find the true response.

It will now be very interesting to see how the reactions will be on the

results of the evaluation of the current EU Action Plan (to be published in

October 2004) and what the Dutch Presidency will do with those results in

order to design the guidelines for the new strategy, which has to be

concluded in December 2004. The first Action Plan 2005-2008 will then be

adopted in the springtime of 2005.

ENCOD will surely follow this process and perhaps, if we get funding,

organise an event to comment this EU strategic process with a broad range

of NGO’s from all around Europe.

EUROPEAN NGO COUNCIL ON DRUG POLICY

Lange Lozanastraat 14

2018 Antwerpen

Belgium

Tel. 00 32 (0)3 237 7436

Fax. 00 32 (0)3 237 0225

E-mail:encod@glo.be

Website: www.encod.org

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] disappointed people,
Date: May 15, 2004 at 2:05:37 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It is possible. As I see it, we are  learning from  one another all the time. Some time am the guide and sometime am guided.
Most of the people who came here where cool people. but to change an asshole to a human being that’s challenging .
very intense.

I have no agenda. It is remarkable that even without an agenda and working alone I get a constant flow of people coming
Which is possible for me to handle, no more no less.

I’m less familiar with the Iboga then the Iboga with me. It is strange to say it but that’s how it felt when I took it.

Sara

Van: Sapphirestardus@aol.com [mailto:Sapphirestardus@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zaterdag 15 mei 2004 18:55
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] disappointed people,

Sara, you seem to be familiar with Iboga and ibogaine in your life time. I woulbe very interested in learning more about it from you. Would you mind very nuch ifd we wrote to one another about this? I could eventually come down to your area and “learn” via discovery through through your guidance. What do you think? 

                                                            Love, 

                                                            Julian L. Robinson

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] disappointed people,
Date: May 15, 2004 at 12:54:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara, you seem to be familiar with Iboga and ibogaine in your life time. I woulbe very interested in learning more about it from you. Would you mind very nuch ifd we wrote to one another about this? I could eventually come down to your area and “learn” via discovery through through your guidance. What do you think?

Love,

Julian L. Robinson

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Good news!
Date: May 15, 2004 at 11:25:08 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Good Morning all!
I have been reading a LOT and posting very little so I would like to begin by saying hello and I hope this finds you all healthy and happy!
I have great news from the home front! My Methadone Maintenance has been picked back up by my insurance company and I will be reimbursed by my clinic as soon as they begin payment again!
Howard Lotsof really gave me great information and pointers on where and how to begin and I am very grateful! Thanks Howard……you rock!
Thanks to all you other nice folk for your thoughts and empathy. It really helps me along in this life to know that there are folk who take time to just say, “that sucks! I wish you well.” lol! Doesn’t take a whole lot of energy or time to say that but it does seem to fuel me in dire straits to have others to encourage me along. Being an addict, those encouragement’s haven’t been frequent. In fact, finding this list was a blessing to me. It has helped me to put things in perspective.
Well, gonna close for now. Hope everyone has a good weekend!
Hang in there! Good things do happen occasionally!
Callie

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] disappointed people,
Date: May 15, 2004 at 10:58:36 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julian , one more thing,

I have a disappointed initiate right now at my home,

The first dose of one and half gram of Iboga gave him a strong vision the next night he got three grams
And had only a physical detox. Not very pleasant.

He felt that if  he would
go home he will start using
again Methamphetamine and go
Weekend party .
he agreed to stay and have another go , because what is enough for one person isn’t enough
For another,so think about that too.

There are other treatment provider who also will give you more Ibogaine of  99%HCL if
you will not have a good reaction
On the first dose, Which is easy to see for an experienced guide. It isn’t so hard to find them.
Even at ITH they will give you a good treatment but since it is for free there is a long waiting list and the
Question is will they phone you back sooner or later ?how quick you will be arriving there ? How long they are going to hold your fee before giving you a date for your treatment?

This is what those who called me where talking about and not about the Ibogaine itself or the people who run it, only about their
Disappointment and if I could help, so I try and maybe it will help in some ways.I can’t keep everyone happy that is just
Impossible even if I try.

119

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 15, 2004 at 9:47:52 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was able to get around the lack of drive when on Methadone, it takes a little effort but it can be done, and with my exerience without prescription drugs, I’d try an herb or two first before I dove into the Viagra Possiblitliy of side effects at end of commercial….Bob Dole…yukky.
Anyways, the biggest problem I encountered while on methadone regarding drive is getting started, once I was started all was good, it took some time to learn with, now ex and I to realize this, and we were able to remedy the situation by starting things with shower together or orally etc.
But since off methadone : ) yeah, that’s not an issue,
“…when the wind blows” Eddie Murphey from 48 hours : )
J
—– Original Message —–
From: Allison Senepart <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: 15 May 04, 5:52 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
We went through all that sort of shit.  His reasoning is that the mind is willing but the body is not??Maybe we need to try some of your ideas.  The docs handed him out Viagara but I am a bit scared of that and what it does.  That probably sounds really daft from someone who has stuck all sorts of opiates etc. into them but thats the way I feel.  Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Saturday, 15 May 2004 1:34:39 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex

Alison, I had experienced this problem and my solution may not be a common one, but one doctor had noticed in a blood test my testosterone levels were low. Though any number of reasons could cause this and let’s face it, methadone being an analgesic will cause problems for many in this area. Anyway, after some tests to make sure it wasn’t a tumor or something else organic causing this, he put me on testosterone shots. You can also use a c rfeam, a dermal patch, pills but I’ve got to tell you, I’m like a new man. It’s unbelievable. I want to say one other thing to you. I’m not saying this is the case with you and your old man but through the years on meth, we often blame many problems we experience on the methadone, but often it may be us! We are getting older, we do suffer frim ailments (naturally) that others may not, if you understand me. I don’t know your total situation, but that’s why getting tested is always a good idea, at least to rule out what is NOT causing a problem. I hope I have helped a little.

Yours Truly
Julian
____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here
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From: “Allison Senepart” <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 15, 2004 at 8:58:39 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks.  Any suggestions are received with thanks.  makes a change from doctors handing out viagara scripts.  I guess its a bit ironic when people who have shoved so much shit in their bodies look for other alternatives but then again maybe we have done enough of that and are looking for different solutions to things.   Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Saturday, 15 May 2004 3:42:19 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex

> testosterone shots.

Avena sativa (oat grass) green shoots contain a testosterone
analog. Apparently it’s the source of the phrase “sowing wild
oats” in refernce to sex. It can be bought in pill and tincture
form.

Bil

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.

____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: “Allison Senepart” <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 15, 2004 at 8:50:35 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

We went through all that sort of shit.  His reasoning is that the mind is willing but the body is not??Maybe we need to try some of your ideas.  The docs handed him out Viagara but I am a bit scared of that and what it does.  That probably sounds really daft from someone who has stuck all sorts of opiates etc. into them but thats the way I feel.  Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Saturday, 15 May 2004 1:34:39 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex

Alison, I had experienced this problem and my solution may not be a common one, but one doctor had noticed in a blood test my testosterone levels were low. Though any number of reasons could cause this and let’s face it, methadone being an analgesic will cause problems for many in this area. Anyway, after some tests to make sure it wasn’t a tumor or something else organic causing this, he put me on testosterone shots. You can also use a c rfeam, a dermal patch, pills but I’ve got to tell you, I’m like a new man. It’s unbelievable. I want to say one other thing to you. I’m not saying this is the case with you and your old man but through the years on meth, we often blame many problems we experience on the methadone, but often it may be us! We are getting older, we do suffer frim ailments (naturally) that others may not, if you understand me. I don’t know your total situation, but that’s why getting tested is always a good idea, at least to rule out what is NOT causing a problem. I hope I have helped a little.

Yours Truly
Julian
____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Disappointed people.
Date: May 15, 2004 at 8:43:19 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Julian,

Make contact with one of the treatment providers and get to talk to them in person few times before making a decision.
If they don’t call you back then you know where you are at, and just try the next person on the list of providers.
If you like how they sound then take your chance .It must be the combination of  things that make a treatment work.
I don’t know everyone in person so I can’t say who you could trust.
BUT when people who earn their living from treatments they will try to give you a good treatment , that’s because of their reputation and they want to do it next year too and not be out of work with the out come that the Ibogaine doesn’t work.
So, that can be concluded but not a guarantee.

I didn’t write that there is no one that you can trust, but for sure each provider has it’s own setting and place.
So how far are you willing to travel ? how big is your passion to get clean? What support system do you have after?

Sara

Van: Sapphirestardus@aol.com [mailto:Sapphirestardus@aol.com] 
Verzonden: zaterdag 15 mei 2004 12:59
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointed people.

Sara, My name is Julian. I’ve seen your name on this site quite often which is why I come to you with this question. You appear knowledgeable so, let me ask you, “WHO THE HELL CAN WE TRUST?” If there is alot of this distrust existing, you know the end result will be ‘bathtub’ chemists brewing their own version of Iboga and though it could be very good, it could just as easily be quite ‘poor’!!! How do novices as myself with ‘urban’ or ‘street’ knowledge fair against theses rural or sub-urban  vampires? 

                                                                  Thanks for any help, 
                                                            Julian (PS-I am looking to this summer for 
                                                                            my first experience)

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointed people.
Date: May 15, 2004 at 8:08:03 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Julian,

It’s the same with the Bwiti. There is often a lot of rivalry and dispute between groups. The nature of iboga is to bring up unresolved conflicts, that through being brought to light they can be resolved. In Bwiti terminology, anything that’s standing in the way of Dissumba must be seen and integrated. Stuff that isn’t resolved in the session is frequently acted out on others. Just watch this space, someone will probably mail in and disagree! It doesn’t mean you can’t trust the process. It’s just that this arguing and name-calling is part of it!

with love

Nick
—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, May 15, 2004 11:58 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointed people.

Sara, My name is Julian. I’ve seen your name on this site quite often which is why I come to you with this question. You appear knowledgeable so, let me ask you, “WHO THE HELL CAN WE TRUST?” If there is alot of this distrust existing, you know the end result will be ‘bathtub’ chemists brewing their own version of Iboga and though it could be very good, it could just as easily be quite ‘poor’!!! How do novices as myself with ‘urban’ or ‘street’ knowledge fair against theses rural or sub-urban  vampires?

Thanks for any help,
Julian (PS-I am looking to this summer for
my first experience)

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 15, 2004 at 7:17:05 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am going to repeat what I’ve alreadt stated earlier. Often, methadone as with any (potent) analgesic will anesthetize the penis, as well as constrict blood vessels surrounding the genital area. This alone will DO IT! Most fiends I’ve hung with may appear to say they want, but the bottom line is, ‘they want NOTHING’. I know when I shot dope, death was what I was after. To feel nothing, to want for nothing, TO BE LEFT ALONE. DEATH, my friend and death is what you will receive.

What more should I say?

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Disappointed people.
Date: May 15, 2004 at 6:58:36 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sara, My name is Julian. I’ve seen your name on this site quite often which is why I come to you with this question. You appear knowledgeable so, let me ask you, “WHO THE HELL CAN WE TRUST?” If there is alot of this distrust existing, you know the end result will be ‘bathtub’ chemists brewing their own version of Iboga and though it could be very good, it could just as easily be quite ‘poor’!!! How do novices as myself with ‘urban’ or ‘street’ knowledge fair against theses rural or sub-urban  vampires?

Thanks for any help,
Julian (PS-I am looking to this summer for
my first experience)

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 15, 2004 at 6:40:16 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bill, you’ve been more thorough than I . I had also agreed with Bill re: benefits of Avena as well as a host of other substances (you mentioned a few) and there are still many more. This is why I recommend a doctor appt. where blood is drawn and analyzed for you must discover what is NOT causing the situation to begin with. As we both stated, a little (or alot) of research should be undertaken before determining  what may or may not be the cause. For all of those with POTENTIAL PROBLEMS, never ever accept blindly what so called”professionals” have declared as a/the PANACEA for a situation!! There may actrually be one, but I’ve never seen one and have certainly never witnessed one!!!

If you have a question, or some question, bring it up here and one of us will be more than happy to “guide” you to the right direction..

Love,
Julian

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] Disappointed people.
Date: May 15, 2004 at 3:37:15 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is the second step of the application to the ITH.

“An application fee of $50 CDN is required when making an application to the Iboga Therapy House. It is fully refundable upon arrival to the therapy house and should be in the form of a money order with the to: field left blank. It can be mailed to:

I ask myself why would people call me from Canada saying that they paid the fee and no one for months is not returning their fee or
No one is answering their repeated calls on the answering machine.
Maybe there is no one there, or it is a clever way to get rich.
if you never arrive there you are not going to get $50 dollars back. unless someone is going to wake up and start thinking straight.
Anyways it isn’t my business ,but most addicts are poor and then even  $50 dollars is much.

I have been asked to write this by some disappointed people who called me and came here.
No apologises or rude attacks are needed . only money back to those who paid the fee can NOT be treated in the near future.

Sara

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 14, 2004 at 7:55:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

where can you getAvena Sativa?

Try a web search, and local herbal shops. “Action Labs” makes a pill
that is compressed plant material. “Herb Pharm” makes a sweet-tasting
tincture. Both seemed ok when I tried them some years ago: the tincture
seemed higher quality on taste test (and more expensive) but both were
effective. There are other brands, & compounds with other herbs. I’d
be interested in Chinese herbology in this as other areas, since there
is long tradition there. One to stay away from that happens to be
related to ibogaine is Yohimbe.

From a quick google on [testosterone side effect]:

“… CANCER and HEART DISEASE.”
http://www.hghantiagingresources.com/Testosterone-Replacement-Side-Effects.html

“I was on deca and testosterone replacement therapy. My side
effect from that was severe testicular atrophy.”
http://www.thebody.com/Forums/AIDS/SideEffects/Archive/Impotence/Q7729.html

Note that anabolic steroids are derivatives of testosterone and the
risk profile may be related, e.g.

“AS may exert a profound adverse effect on the liver. This is
particularly true for orally administered AS.”
http://www.sportsci.org/encyc/anabstereff/anabstereff.html

Bill

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From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 14, 2004 at 7:23:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/14/04 5:13:41 PM, ross@cgl.ucsf.edu writes:

> Bill, you are absolutely right about Avena Sativa. I’ve used it and it does
> help. There are actually quite a few botanicals that would benefit, but a
> little research is in order.

bill……..where can you getAvena Sativa?
thanx
marcus

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 14, 2004 at 6:13:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bill, you are absolutely right about Avena Sativa. I’ve used it and it does
help. There are actually quite a few botanicals that would benefit, but a
little research is in order.

I believe that there can be problems with overuse of testosterone,
so best to read up on it before getting into regular use.. also,
since testosterone is the hormone that drives interest in sex for
both men women, A. sativa apparently works for both.

Other botanicals I’ve seen mention of include Muira Puama (male
erection, S. America), Damiana (both sexes, Mexico) and Clavohuasca
(both sexes, S. America).

I suggest http://www.rain-tree.com/ for info and purchase of
Amazonian herbs.

Bill

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] International Understanding/food shortage.
Date: May 14, 2004 at 5:44:19 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Sara119! I like that! You are good!!

Julian

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 14, 2004 at 5:41:24 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bill, you are absolutely right about Avena Sativa. I’ve used it and it does help. There are actually quite a few botanicals that would benefit, but a little research is in order.

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fw: calling for letter writing avalache
Date: May 14, 2004 at 1:07:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Even I wrote back on that one, not that anyone will probably care what
someone thinks from in NZ but still worth an effort I hope.     Hard to
believe that in this day and age there are still States in America that
don
t have needle exchange.  Hope lots of others put their 2 pennith worth in
and it makes some difference.   Youd think that they would see long term
benefits in looking after peoples health regardless of the nature.  I
don’t
see the govt banning fat people from McDonalds cos they might have heart
attacks etc.   & cause health problems???   Allison

Speaking needle exchanges and harm reduction…. from the Drug Policy
Alliance newsletter…

Congressman Without Scientific Background: Harm Reduction is Bad Science
Tuesday, May 11, 2004

Noted drug warrior Rep. Mark Souder (R-IN) recently used his post as chair
of a House subcommittee to demand evidence against harm reduction from the
National Institutes of Health. His letter claims harm reduction is an
“ideological position” not supported by science, and may actually increase
the risk of HIV/AIDS infection in drug users.

Souder has treated his chairmanship of the House Subcommittee on Criminal
Justice, Drug Policy and Human Resources as a bully pulpit to attack
injection drug users, supporters of marijuana decriminalization, and now
harm reduction.

Harm reduction does work. Experts in the field, including one whose
research Souder misinterpreted in his letter, have responded with their
own letters to the director of NIH. If you have a scientific background
and would like to share your views on harm reduction, please send a polite
letter to:

Honorable Elias A. Zerhouni, M.D.
Director
National Institutes of Health
9000 Rockville Pike
Bethesda, Maryland 20892

We would appreciate a copy of your letter to include on our website.

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] International Understanding/food shortage.
Date: May 14, 2004 at 12:41:16 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Last month, the UN conducted a worldwide survey. The only question asked was:

“Would you please give your honest opinion about solutions to the food shortage in the rest of the world?”

    The survey was a huge failure…
In Africa they didn’t know what “food” meant.
In Eastern Europe they didn’t know what “honest” meant.

In Western Europe they didn’t know what “shortage” meant.

In China they didn’t know what “opinion” meant.

In the Middle East they didn’t know what “solution” meant.

In South America they didn’t know what “please” meant.

And in the USA they didn’t know what “the rest of the world” meant.

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 14, 2004 at 11:42:10 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

testosterone shots.

Avena sativa (oat grass) green shoots contain a testosterone
analog. Apparently it’s the source of the phrase “sowing wild
oats” in refernce to sex. It can be bought in pill and tincture
form.

Bil

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Methadone and sex
Date: May 14, 2004 at 9:33:57 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Alison, I had experienced this problem and my solution may not be a common one, but one doctor had noticed in a blood test my testosterone levels were low. Though any number of reasons could cause this and let’s face it, methadone being an analgesic will cause problems for many in this area. Anyway, after some tests to make sure it wasn’t a tumor or something else organic causing this, he put me on testosterone shots. You can also use a c rfeam, a dermal patch, pills but I’ve got to tell you, I’m like a new man. It’s unbelievable. I want to say one other thing to you. I’m not saying this is the case with you and your old man but through the years on meth, we often blame many problems we experience on the methadone, but often it may be us! We are getting older, we do suffer frim ailments (naturally) that others may not, if you understand me. I don’t know your total situation, but that’s why getting tested is always a good idea, at least to rule out what is NOT causing a problem. I hope I have helped a little.

Yours Truly
Julian

From: “Allison Senepart” <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] sexual behavior
Date: May 14, 2004 at 7:55:35 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Methadone has also destroyed our sex life.  My partner has lost all interest since being on the programe.  I wish it were different but we go on and are best of mates which is OK but the bit extra would be nice.  Anyone have any solutions to this other than getting off Methadone which I cant see him doing anywhere in the forseeable future.  Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Wednesday, 12 May 2004 3:05:29 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] sexual behavior

>Has there been any report of changes in sexual behavior resulting from or following ibogaine treatment?

Aside from the obvious [methadone destroyed my sex drive] post-ibo sex
became a new experience, oppression from my childhood was lifted and I
was better able to be free sexually. Of course like anything else, there
was work/practice involved. A key component of my first ibo experience
did focus directly on sex, in particular my association with sexual
drive and the intensity of being a male in a world of many attractive
women [the message was like, dude, you are hard-wired at the dna level
to reproduce, this exists at the deepest root/animal instinct level, and
it is a SURVIVAL instinct = do not be ashamed of your sexual drive, it
is completely natural for a man to desire sex multiple times daily, its
how you approach that desire and how you channel it that matters ] (ie
don’t leave a wake of broken hearts and shattered relationships because
of my sex drive). {oh yeah and a thundering laugh from the ibo entity
concerning srtict christian up-bringing and sex – the entity’s comment
was something like, “leave it to man to fuck up the divine!”}

thats all from me…

_.dh

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.

____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here

From: “Allison Senepart” <paradisepaint@callsouth.net.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fw: calling for letter writing avalache
Date: May 14, 2004 at 7:47:32 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Even I wrote back on that one, not that anyone will probably care what someone thinks from in NZ but still worth an effort I hope.     Hard to believe that in this day and age there are still States in America that don’t have needle exchange.  Hope lots of others put their 2 pennith worth in and it makes some difference.   Youd think that they would see long term benefits in looking after peoples health regardless of the nature.  I don’t see the govt banning fat people from McDonalds cos they might have heart attacks etc.   & cause health problems???   Allison

——-Original Message——-

From: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Thursday, 13 May 2004 8:58:15 a.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com; drugwar@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: calling for letter writing avalache

Hi all,
I’m forwarding this note, but haven’t been able to find it online, so I
cannot supply a link.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Steven Fenichel
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2004 3:42 PM
Subject: calling for letter writing avalache

May 12, 2004
Atlantic County prosecutor says no to A.C. needle exchange
By PETE McALEER Statehouse Bureau, (609) 292-4935

Atlantic County Prosecutor Jeffrey S. Blitz has told Atlantic City officials
they do not have the authority to start the state’s first needle-exchange
program on their own.

Mayor Lorenzo Langford and his administration, which views needle exchange
as a way to combat the high rate of AIDS and hepatitis C in the city, appear
willing to contest the edict, even if it means a court battle.

“We’re still planning on moving forward,” Atlantic City Health and Human
Services Director Ron Cash said. “There are some legal challenges we need to
address.”

Blitz first learned of the city’s plans two weeks ago, after a report in The
Press of Atlantic City in which Cash confirmed discussions to start a
program that would allow heroin addicts to exchange used needles for clean
ones at city-run mobile health clinics. Cash said the city’s authority came
from a 1999 amendment that exempts governmental a! gencies from the section
of state law that criminalizes needle and syringe possession.

Blitz reviewed the law and determined it allows government agencies to
distribute needles and syringes only to those with a prescription.

“There is no authority for programs to place needles and syringes in the
hands of people addicted to heroin,” Blitz said Tuesday. “This is a program
that has to be considered by the Legislature.”

Blitz notified Atlantic City officials of his decision with a phone call and
a letter dated April 30. Both Blitz and Atlantic City Solicitor Beverly
Graham-Foy declined to release the letter; Graham-Foy would not even confirm
its receipt.

Blitz said his decision had nothing to do with the merits of needle-exchange
and declined to give his personal opinion on the issue.

“My job is to interpret the law,” Blitz said. “Clearly, it’s not authorized
by law.”

Needle-exchange supporters disagree. Temple University professor ! Scott
Burris, who has published more than a dozen articles on syringe- access law,
said the 1999 amendment clearly exempts local governments such as Atlantic
City.

“I’d be happy to be their lawyer,” Burris said. “You never know, 100
percent, what a court is going to do. But I think the city has an extremely
strong case.”

Burris advised the city of Philadelphia when it set up a needle-exchange
program under an emergency order from then-Mayor Ed Rendell. Pennsylvania
and New Jersey are two of five states that do not allow the sale of needles
or syringes without a prescription. All but New Jersey and Delaware allow
needle exchange in their cities.

Shared needles are the cause of more than half of the AIDS and HIV cases in
Atlantic City, where the HIV rate among black males is the highest in the
state. Across New Jersey, 46 percent of HIV infections stem from shared
needles, the third-highest percentage in the nation, according to the state
Health Department. The national average is 25 percent.

Most studies show – and m! ost experts agree – needle-exchange reduces the
spread of HIV and AIDS without leading to an increase in drug use.

Gov. James E. McGreevey expressed support for a hospital-based
needle-exchange program when he took office, but he kept silent last year
when a bill legalizing the sale and possession of needles was withdrawn amid
opposition from Attorney General Peter Harvey and state senators from Newark
and Ocean County.

Harvey said he was concerned about how such a program would be run. State
Sen. Ronald Rice, D-Newark, and State Sen. Leonard Connors, R-Ocean, said
the programs are not effective and send the wrong message in the war against
drugs.

Needle-exchange supporters are skeptical about the chances of getting
McGreevey to sign a needle-exchange law before the 2005 election.

To e-mail Pete McAleer at The Press:

PMcAleer@pressofac.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

.

From: Nik <goosebumpz2002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] soma one help this guy me too
Date: May 13, 2004 at 10:24:27 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well im not on the list and this is the last letter i got from the ibo site meraculusly some how i am off of methadone for 53 days today and i got to tell you that fuckin sucked elephant balls my jaw still hurts. Well so heres the deal i took suboxone for two weeks and i swear there is absolutly NO Withdrawl from Met. when yourf on the suboxone and actually it gave me a false sence of feeling good the day after i was off that the met withrdawl hit me like a freight train its not just about feeling boewg!!! its a thorough shattering of your mind body and soul and my nervous system is fucked and my intestines are fried but over the past fourteen days i have felt alot better! but man all i could think about was ibo not all but  man i thought i was selling myself short. But anywasy i am working on getting to some ibo.hcl outside of this country of course.I am considering a medium dose Lysergic session if anyone has any feedback let me know by the way does ibo keep your Ego in tact or does it completly dissolve it like LSD i am wondering these things and by the way lsd is not just another drug to me it is something special not to be overused it is a sacrement to me but thats just me im sure some people think thats a little flaky but i love corn flakes Peace and love to all my brothers and sisters!!!                     Nick!

Nik <goosebumpz2002@yahoo.com> wrote:
hey guys i live in ann arbor now and this town has become so commercial it makes me want to vomit starbucks! Is there anyone here that has ibogaine experience or soemone i can talk to. i really would appreciate anyone or anything you could help me with what organizations are still around here. i am a practicing buddhist and i am on methadone i am only at v35 mgs i was at 120mgs 3 months ago i did that with the help of cannibis.it helps with the withdrawl some but helps you keep this in perspective i feel Like ibogaine is the next logical step i am kinda poor manly cuz i pay $75 a week for the methadone and man i gotta tell ya part of me is screemin for some relief the wiothdrawl is bad i went down two mgs a day for a month then a mg a day till last week were i have stopped the detox to let my body recoupe i am so sick but i will not quit i am goin to get this pissed off two headed giant gorrila off my back but hey man is there anyone around i can talk to i have noone to relate to and thats the hardest part. but i think its great the stuff you have done and still do you have been an inspiration to many includiong me i almost didnt write this because of my ego/pride but fuck it i need help peace love caring and sharing                                                                      your    brother NIK!

Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org> wrote:
From: ndezine@yahoo.com

Hi Dana:

I’m Dr. Tom, a friend of Eric’s. I’m a naturopathic doctor and I practice in Arizona. I once spoke with you by phone, briefly, with the sad news of Brian Quig’s death last year. In that regard some of us were looking hard for evidence of foul play, since he had so many enemies who specialize in that. Where it seemed to go was nothing conclusive proving it, and since one of the kids driving the car that struck him was also injured, it could have been in the stupid tragic accident category. Big western cities are dangerous around the ongoing car wars here. I miss him.

I’m writing as I got your email from a yahoo group discussion involving Ibo particulars. I wonder if you could direct me toward the better discussions about the particulars of using this, in both addiction and shamanic situations. So far, I have learned alot with Eric in these regards, having facilitated several sessions, but I haven’t connected with medical professionals or researchers working with it.

Who would you recommend I learn from that is familiar with the current extracts or isolate combo forms and clinical results?  I would love to pop in on some of the conferences in New York and Europe that have looked at this, but that hasn’t been possible recently. The professionals I have been around are pretty nervous about its outlaw status, but the way things are going in this land of the Bush Gang…well, brain cells will become contraband pretty soon. Sorry, I digress.

Back in the Ming Dynasty I met you around the Hill St. house with the White Panthers in Ann Arbor. Friends of mine were residents there with John Sinclair and Leni, and I remember being all aflame about our rights to smoke dope. I was more into SDS and life as a young commie, tho. Nothing penetrated about the incredible Ibo experiences coming from Howard, you and the Black Panther Party experiences then. I thought I was so with it, but just missed it that time, really. I wonder if social changes triggered from this plant will penetrate farther this time around?

When you get a chance, some links, references or comments would be welcome.

“Power to the People”

(Man, that’s pulling from the back of the closet! ;->)

Dr. Tom

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online

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Yahoo! Movies – Buy advance tickets for ‘Shrek 2′

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] about monsters.
Date: May 13, 2004 at 5:04:27 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

By Robert Matthews Science Correspondent 
The Telegraph – UK
7-12-3

Multinational food companies have known for years of research that suggests many of their products trigger chemical reactions in the brain which lead people to overeat, The Telegraph can reveal. 

Scientists working for Nestle and Unilever have been quietly investigating how certain foods, such as chocolate biscuits, burgers and snacks, make people binge-eat, thereby fuelling obesity. The companies insist that there is no proof that the foods create bio-chemical reactions that make people eat too much. They are not yet prepared to issue consumer warnings or change the nature of the products. 

However, scientists working for the industry have said manufacturers fear they have created foods that undermine the body’s abilities to control intake and are battling to find a solution. “We have created a bio-chemical monster,” one said. 

The revelation will be seized on by those who allege that the food industry has been reckless. More than 300 million people worldwide are now deemed clinically obese, with an estimated 2.5 million dying each year as a result of being overweight. In Britain, more than one in five adults is obese – triple the figure of 20 years ago. 

Earlier this year America’s leading fast-food chains, including McDonald’s and Burger King, were warned of possible legal action from obese people following research on mice and rats suggesting that fast food could trigger overeating. It is now clear that the industry has known for years of similar results from research on humans. 

One scientist who acts as a consultant to food manufacturers said: “They are aware that they have been too successful in creating food that some people just can’t say no to. It’s an enormous problem.” 

The overeating effect is thought to be triggered by opioids, chemicals which produce a desire to eat more while reducing the “sated” feeling that normally kills appetite. 

Research being studied by the industry shows that although the effect is only short-lived, it can have a dramatic effect on food intake. According to a recent review of 20 years of research by scientists at the University of Sussex, when release of opioids was blocked using drugs, intake among human volunteers fell by 21 per cent. The effect was even larger among obese people, whose intake fell by 33 per cent. 

Further research also suggests that the opioids effect is strongest with products that involve combinations of foods which are typically high in fat and carbohydrates. These combinations are routinely used to boost the so-called palatability of products, with chocolate being added to cereals and biscuits, cheese added to savoury snacks, and buns with a high sugar content being used for hamburgers and cheeseburgers. 

The industry has long sought to drive up the palatability of its products. Now, however, it is becoming clear that palatability reflects the effect food has on the brain. 

Dr Martin Yeomans, of the University of Sussex, a leading authority on opioids, said: “I am confident that opioids play a role in food intake.” 

Dr Yeomans will present the latest evidence linking palatability to over-eating at a scientific meeting this week which is sponsored by leading food companies, including Nestle, the world’s largest, and Unilever. 

A spokesman for Nestle in Vevey, Switzerland, confirmed that the company has been studying the role of palatability and opioids in food intake for many years. He said: “We have projects currently running to investigate this and other aspects of obesity and the company will make all necessary changes when there is significant scientific evidence to support such action.” 

However, the company did not consider the evidence strong enough to require action: “We have to be certain that there are no unexpected negative aspects.” Unilever, which owns the Knorr, Birds Eye and Ragu brands, is also investigating the links. 

At this week’s conference in Groningen, Holland, scientists will present strategies for dealing with the issue, including greater consumer education and labelling. 

The findings about the effects of opioids were seized on yesterday by Prof John Banzhaf of George Washington University, Washington DC, who played a key role in the billion-dollar lawsuits against tobacco companies during the 1990s. 

During the 1990s, evidence emerged that the industry had manipulated cigarettes’ content to enhance their addictive nature. In 1998, the industry reached a settlement with 46 American state governments totalling $206 billion. 

Prof Banzhaf described the food industry’s knowledge of possible links between high-calorie food and over-eating by humans as “astounding”. “This would seem to constitute failure to disclose a material fact – information that might sway the decision of consumers, had they known about it,” he said. 

While there is no suggestion that the food industry knowingly manipulates its products to boost over-consumption, Prof Banzhaf said there were parallels with the case against the tobacco industry. “They said smokers smoke for the taste, and it had nothing to do with the brain. It sounds to me that we have something very similar here.” 

© Copyright of Telegraph Group Limited 2003.

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] Iboga/eating disorder.
Date: May 13, 2004 at 12:52:45 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Sara
First of all I’d like to say thank you so much for all your guidance and support last weekend.  You had the skill to provide just the right amount of input to allow for an individual process. It was a powerful experience and as you say, its effects are still revealing themselves. I had intended to write earlier but yes there were things I needed to do first.
My process seems quite simple: first to accept my own death and mortality, then to realise the implications of other people’s deaths and in particular that of my mother with whom I had put up severe emotional barriers for the past 30 years.  I spent the sunday night in Amsterdam but didn’t sleep –  I was crying all the time, and on the monday morning I drove straight from the airport in the UK to my mother’s house and spent the day with her, apologising for my actions and being honest about the past. It was a hugely important event for me – one of the most important things I have done in my whole life.  I realised that all this time I had been acting like a motherless child  – roaming the world and building my career in an intellectual way – avoiding what was really the most important thing to me.  It is a karmic thing – now I feel that my mother and I are almost soulmates, and I want to spend as much time with her as possible (she is old now and ! very weak at the moment.)
I notice other changes too.  The sick feeling in my stomach (from the iboga) changed into an ache in my solar plexus – signifying that some huge emotional ‘rewiring’ was going on in there. It felt open and vulnerable. Since then I feel – balanced, ‘in place’, normal, not driven or desperate any more. I feel more honest and truthful – I am able to talk to my family about personal things without having to hide them. My posture is different too, the way I walk, and I don’t have any huge urge to eat continuously. I am losing weight although it is not a major preoccupation in my mind any more anyway.   Also, I am acting >from my heart now, rather than from my intellect – as though I have been meditating a lot. Concentration is rather difficult still but I presume that will eventually get back to normal.
What helped me greatly to recognise and deal with these changes is the course I went on previously which I  had mentioned to you – of Michael Roads (www.roadsway.com), on which I had already done some work on emotions and on using heart rather than head.  There is a strong connection with that philosophy and I get the feeling that you might find it interesting too.
Liam
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >   _____
> > > >
> >
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: calling for letter writing avalache
Date: May 12, 2004 at 4:57:58 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
I’m forwarding this note, but haven’t been able to find it online, so I
cannot supply a link.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Steven Fenichel
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2004 3:42 PM
Subject: calling for letter writing avalache

May 12, 2004
Atlantic County prosecutor says no to A.C. needle exchange
By PETE McALEER Statehouse Bureau, (609) 292-4935

Atlantic County Prosecutor Jeffrey S. Blitz has told Atlantic City officials
they do not have the authority to start the state’s first needle-exchange
program on their own.

Mayor Lorenzo Langford and his administration, which views needle exchange
as a way to combat the high rate of AIDS and hepatitis C in the city, appear
willing to contest the edict, even if it means a court battle.

“We’re still planning on moving forward,” Atlantic City Health and Human
Services Director Ron Cash said. “There are some legal challenges we need to
address.”

Blitz first learned of the city’s plans two weeks ago, after a report in The
Press of Atlantic City in which Cash confirmed discussions to start a
program that would allow heroin addicts to exchange used needles for clean
ones at city-run mobile health clinics. Cash said the city’s authority came
from a 1999 amendment that exempts governmental a! gencies from the section
of state law that criminalizes needle and syringe possession.

Blitz reviewed the law and determined it allows government agencies to
distribute needles and syringes only to those with a prescription.

“There is no authority for programs to place needles and syringes in the
hands of people addicted to heroin,” Blitz said Tuesday. “This is a program
that has to be considered by the Legislature.”

Blitz notified Atlantic City officials of his decision with a phone call and
a letter dated April 30. Both Blitz and Atlantic City Solicitor Beverly
Graham-Foy declined to release the letter; Graham-Foy would not even confirm
its receipt.

Blitz said his decision had nothing to do with the merits of needle-exchange
and declined to give his personal opinion on the issue.

“My job is to interpret the law,” Blitz said. “Clearly, it’s not authorized
by law.”

Needle-exchange supporters disagree. Temple University professor ! Scott
Burris, who has published more than a dozen articles on syringe- access law,
said the 1999 amendment clearly exempts local governments such as Atlantic
City.

“I’d be happy to be their lawyer,” Burris said. “You never know, 100
percent, what a court is going to do. But I think the city has an extremely
strong case.”

Burris advised the city of Philadelphia when it set up a needle-exchange
program under an emergency order from then-Mayor Ed Rendell. Pennsylvania
and New Jersey are two of five states that do not allow the sale of needles
or syringes without a prescription. All but New Jersey and Delaware allow
needle exchange in their cities.

Shared needles are the cause of more than half of the AIDS and HIV cases in
Atlantic City, where the HIV rate among black males is the highest in the
state. Across New Jersey, 46 percent of HIV infections stem from shared
needles, the third-highest percentage in the nation, according to the state
Health Department. The national average is 25 percent.

Most studies show – and m! ost experts agree – needle-exchange reduces the
spread of HIV and AIDS without leading to an increase in drug use.

Gov. James E. McGreevey expressed support for a hospital-based
needle-exchange program when he took office, but he kept silent last year
when a bill legalizing the sale and possession of needles was withdrawn amid
opposition from Attorney General Peter Harvey and state senators from Newark
and Ocean County.

Harvey said he was concerned about how such a program would be run. State
Sen. Ronald Rice, D-Newark, and State Sen. Leonard Connors, R-Ocean, said
the programs are not effective and send the wrong message in the war against
drugs.

Needle-exchange supporters are skeptical about the chances of getting
McGreevey to sign a needle-exchange law before the 2005 election.

To e-mail Pete McAleer at The Press:

PMcAleer@pressofac.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Greg Douglass” <gregdouglass@covad.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone & Ibogaine
Date: May 12, 2004 at 12:10:00 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Julian:
I was on methadone for about 14 years. I took ibogaine at a Rosarito Beach facility  ( http://www.ibogaine-therapy.net/ ) in Mexico on March 2, 2003. I have remained drug-free since then and my life, as you might imagine, has changed greatly for the better. Methadone helped to stabilize me… I was no longer having to scam and steal to support my heroin habit…but ultimately I was still like a dog tied to a rope. Iboga awakened a belief system in me that I had always denied, and I think that lack of belief in life, or the cosmos, or whatever you want to call it, was a big factor in my becoming an addict (the old “what the fuck does it matter anyway, let’s shoot some dope” syndrome.) Ibogaine did what the 12 step program failed to do;  it literally showed me the existence of not just a higher power, but a network of higher powers within myself and all around me. Physically, it also made what would have been a devastating detox merely like a case of the flu…without the constant psychological drug cravings that one ordinarily obsesses about during a detox.
Do a slow detox from the methadone; Callie has the right idea. I got down to 20 mgs. If you decide to do the treatment, don’t expect it to be an automatic miracle cure. You have to really be ready to quit, and to change your way of life. You have to really take care of yourself post treatment; better food, more exercise, and, most important, therapy to deal with the issues that got you into taking drugs in the first place. My 13 months clean has been both exhiliarating and uncomfortable, but it’s been an amazing ride. I was addicted off & on for 30 years; if an old dog like me can do it, you certainly can. Good luck, and if you have any more questions, I’ll be happy to answer them.
Greg Douglass
PS: The Rosarito Beach facility is the shiznit. Check out their site; good people from top to bottom.
—– Original Message —–
From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 12, 2004 5:59 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone & Ibogaine

That was nice of you to write me Callie. When I fist came across Iboga and it’s ability to ‘undue’ (so to speak) the addiction opiates create, I was pretty excited. I don’t think I believed it completely but after doing alot of studying, I was amazed. Then, I recently came across this site,( I just got this computer 2 months ago) and now I feel I’m another step closer. Have you taken Ibogaine yet?

Sincerely,

Julian

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone & Ibogaine
Date: May 12, 2004 at 10:43:13 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Julian
No, I haven’t been treated with Ibogaine yet but I have started an ‘Ibogaine savings’ so hopefully at the end of year I can go for treatment.
I was also told that if I would decrease my methadone dose it would help. I am decreasing my dose 2 mgs a week. I am presently at about 98 mgs a day. It is a blind detox. I am trying not to keep up with how many milligrams I am on but it is hard not to think of it!
I am surprised you have not had any other replies! I feel you will have many other replies. Everyone must still be sleeping!
Have you read any articles online? Here is a good start of links! Happy reading!
Callie
http://www.ibeginagain.org/articles/index.shtml
http://www.ibogaine.org/manual.html

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone & Ibogaine
Date: May 12, 2004 at 8:59:17 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: DustAngel4Lv@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That was nice of you to write me Callie. When I fist came across Iboga and it’s ability to ‘undue’ (so to speak) the addiction opiates create, I was pretty excited. I don’t think I believed it completely but after doing alot of studying, I was amazed. Then, I recently came across this site,( I just got this computer 2 months ago) and now I feel I’m another step closer. Have you taken Ibogaine yet?

Sincerely,

Julian

From: D <disumba@yahoo.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 12, 2004 at 3:09:35 AM EDT
To: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Reply-To: D <disumba@yahoo.fr>

Hi Patrick,

I won’t write a long letter, because I don’t want to fill up your inbox.

But, basically: thank you.  I was a heroin addict for 16 years of my life
(14-30), and now have over 4 years clean because of ibogaine.

MindVox and the list are things I do, to try and give people a place to
talk with one another.  There is no cost to anyone.

If you have any links, images, writing, anything really, that you’d like
to add.  Please let me know.  I will do whatever I can to let you speak
for yourself/yourselves.

I am glad you’re here, and welcome.
Patrick

I’m happy to read your nice mail, very happy.
You offer that i can post more. Many people told me the same thing, but as
you see, my english is very poor and the subject of your list needs a very
good control of your language.
Do you know a translator ?
I think, with many modesty, that i can explain many things and especially
prevent many people about the danger to use ibogaine without precaution.
Also I would bring an other approach of this pathology.
When i read the posts, it’s clear for me that something very important is
untidy.
I only want to help people to understand where is the problem generally even
each man or woman needs a specific study. I think that anybody can’t use
drugs or ibogaine or iboga with the same results. But some basic precautions
must be analysed.
I live in Gabon since 13 years, in Africa since my birth. Every day, i see
traditionnal therapists. I’m initiate in bwiti and in some others rituals.
I only would to make a cultural bridge between us. It’s for me the begining.
Bests.
Issambo.

From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Methadone & Ibogaine
Date: May 11, 2004 at 10:25:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Welcome to the list!
I am also on Methadone Maintenance and had never heard of Ibogaine until a few months ago.
The folks that will reply to you are fantastic….at least they were in answering all my questions.
I am looking forward to getting you to know you better!
Callie

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fwd: Congressional Addiction Caucus Off to Strong Start
Date: May 11, 2004 at 8:12:26 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Congressional Addiction Caucus Off to Strong Start
5/7/2004
News Feature
By Bob Curley

A historic Congressional caucus built around the issue of addiction
treatment and recovery is off to a strong start, with 38 members of the
House of Representatives signed up and the group already holding briefings
for lawmakers’ staffers.

Rep. Jim Ramstad (R-Minn.), an outspoken advocate for addiction services and
in recovery himself, announced the formation of the Addiction, Treatment,
and Recovery Caucus in February during a meeting with the chairman’s council
of The Betty Ford Center. Ramstad described the caucus’ mission as educating
lawmakers on the problems of addiction and the need for expanded treatment
access. Observers say that the group could address a wide range of issues,
from treatment parity to discrimination to budgetary issues.

Co-chaired by Rep. Patrick Kennedy (D-R.I.) — another lawmaker who has
spoken openly about his own struggles with addiction — the bipartisan
caucus has attracted an impressive 36 members in a few short months. The
current roster includes Reps. Neil Abercrombie (D-Hawaii), Joe Baca
(D-Calif.) Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio), Ed Case (D-Hawaii), Tom Cole (R-Okla.),
Peter A. DeFazio (D-Ore.), James M. Hoeffel (D-Pa.), Dale Kildee (D-Mich.),
Jerry Kleczka (D-Wisc.), Ray LaHood (R-Ill.), James R Langevin (D-R.I.),
Robert T. Matsui (D-Calif.), Jim McDermott (D-Wash.), Jim McGovern
(D-Mass.), Michael H. Michaud (D-Maine), Bob Ney (R-Ohio), John Sullivan
(R-Okla.), Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.), Lynn Woolsey (D-Calif.), Delegate
Anibal Acevedo-Vila (D-P.R.), Bob Beauprez (R-Co.), Shelley Moore Capito
(R-W.V.), Delegate Donna M. Christensen (D-V.I.), Lincoln Davis (D-Tenn.),
Gene Green (D-Texas), Rush D. Holt (D-N.J.), Ron Kind (D-Wisc.), Tom Latham
(R-Iowa), Carolyn McCarthy (D-N.Y.), Michael R. McNulty (D-N.Y.), Alan B
Mollohan (D-W.V.), Mike Simpson (R-Idaho), Lee Terry (R-Neb.), and Henry
Waxman (D-Calif.).

“It’s definitely encouraging, but when you consider that one in 10 Americans
have people in their families with addictions, it’s not surprising,” said
Karin Hope, legislative aide on Ramstad’s staff. Nonetheless, she
acknowledged that the formation of the caucus is “a pretty big milestone”
for the addiction recovery movement.

“It’s a statement by Congress that this is a serious problem … and we also
hope it will help erase the stigma of trying to get help for this problem,”
she said.

Hope said the mission of the caucus is broad enough to attract members from
across the political spectrum, from liberals concerned about human suffering
to fiscal conservatives faced with an estimated $400 billion per year in
costs related to untreated addictions. She added that the visibility and
attention generated by the caucus could spur more interest in grassroots
recovery advocacy, even as advocates work to get more lawmakers to join the
caucus. “It’s a chicken-and-egg kind of thing,” Hope said.

Johnny Allem, president of the Johnson Institute, said the caucus is an
important forum that would help the recovery movement become more
sophisticated in its advocacy. “It has allowed a number of people concerned
about our issues to speak up,” he said. Howard Shapiro, director of the
State Associations of Addiction Services (SAAS), called the caucus “an
important effort that may serve as a focal point for reaching members of
Congress to support the resources needed to make positive changes for
alcohol and other drug abuse.”

“Everyone in the treatment and recovery field is extremely pleased that this
has come together,” added Shapiro.

Hope gave credit to groups like SAAS and Join Together for encouraging
people in the addiction field to contact their House members to ask them to
join the caucus. Join Together, for example, pointed the 20,000-plus members
of its online mailing lists to the Legislative Action Center on the Join
Together Online website, where they can quickly and easily contact their
local lawmakers about the caucus.

“We recognized this as a unique opportunity to mobilize people in the field
from a wide range of perspectives, because these issues are so bipartisan,”
said Eric Helmuth, director of Internet services for Join Together. “It
gives people an easy opportunity to have legislative contact that didn’t
involve opposing or supporting a bill. For legislators, it is a chance for
them not to be pressed on legislation, but to be told how important this
issue is and enable them to do something positive.”

Helmuth said that more than 700 readers responded to an appeal from Join
Together director David Rosenbloom, sending 1,150 messages to 330 members of
Congress — about 3/4 of the House of Representatives. “People wrote some of
the most eloquent, passionate letters we have seen,” said Helmuth.

For example, Paul Bergman, chairman of the Missouri Recovery Network, wrote
to Rep. Ike Skelton (D-Mo.). “I am an alcoholic and have been sober for
eight years, and had access to quality substance abuse treatment in 1996,”
said Bergman. “Today, that is not the case. Tens of thousands of Missourians
are unable to access treatment, and the tragedy of their addiction continues
to persist.

“Addiction is a treatable disease, and to deny treatment to Missourians is
essentially immoral,” Bergman continued. “The cost to the individual and our
communities is death, damage to families, escalating crime, loss of
productivity, and deteriorating communities. Please join this caucus and
support access to treatment for alcoholics and addicts.”

The caucus recently held its first informational meeting, bringing staff
from members’ offices together to hear a presentation on the
administration’s Access to Recovery program delivered by drug czar John
Walters, as well as an overview of the Ensuring Solutions to Alcohol
Problems project at the George Washington University Medical Center.

Advocates for treatment and recovery are currently working to create a
similar caucus in the Senate.

5/7/2004
News Feature
By Bob Curley

A historic Congressional caucus built around the issue of addiction
treatment and recovery is off to a strong start, with 38 members of the
House of Representatives signed up and the group already holding briefings
for lawmakers’ staffers.

Rep. Jim Ramstad (R-Minn.), an outspoken advocate for addiction services and
in recovery himself, announced the formation of the Addiction, Treatment,
and Recovery Caucus in February during a meeting with the chairman’s council
of The Betty Ford Center. Ramstad described the caucus’ mission as educating
lawmakers on the problems of addiction and the need for expanded treatment
access. Observers say that the group could address a wide range of issues,
from treatment parity to discrimination to budgetary issues.

Co-chaired by Rep. Patrick Kennedy (D-R.I.) — another lawmaker who has
spoken openly about his own struggles with addiction — the bipartisan
caucus has attracted an impressive 36 members in a few short months. The
current roster includes Reps. Neil Abercrombie (D-Hawaii), Joe Baca
(D-Calif.) Sherrod Brown (D-Ohio), Ed Case (D-Hawaii), Tom Cole (R-Okla.),
Peter A. DeFazio (D-Ore.), James M. Hoeffel (D-Pa.), Dale Kildee (D-Mich.),
Jerry Kleczka (D-Wisc.), Ray LaHood (R-Ill.), James R Langevin (D-R.I.),
Robert T. Matsui (D-Calif.), Jim McDermott (D-Wash.), Jim McGovern
(D-Mass.), Michael H. Michaud (D-Maine), Bob Ney (R-Ohio), John Sullivan
(R-Okla.), Chris Van Hollen (D-Md.), Lynn Woolsey (D-Calif.), Delegate
Anibal Acevedo-Vila (D-P.R.), Bob Beauprez (R-Co.), Shelley Moore Capito
(R-W.V.), Delegate Donna M. Christensen (D-V.I.), Lincoln Davis (D-Tenn.),
Gene Green (D-Texas), Rush D. Holt (D-N.J.), Ron Kind (D-Wisc.), Tom Latham
(R-Iowa), Carolyn McCarthy (D-N.Y.), Michael R. McNulty (D-N.Y.), Alan B
Mollohan (D-W.V.), Mike Simpson (R-Idaho), Lee Terry (R-Neb.), and Henry
Waxman (D-Calif.).

“It’s definitely encouraging, but when you consider that one in 10 Americans
have people in their families with addictions, it’s not surprising,” said
Karin Hope, legislative aide on Ramstad’s staff. Nonetheless, she
acknowledged that the formation of the caucus is “a pretty big milestone”
for the addiction recovery movement.

“It’s a statement by Congress that this is a serious problem … and we also
hope it will help erase the stigma of trying to get help for this problem,”
she said.

Hope said the mission of the caucus is broad enough to attract members from
across the political spectrum, from liberals concerned about human suffering
to fiscal conservatives faced with an estimated $400 billion per year in
costs related to untreated addictions. She added that the visibility and
attention generated by the caucus could spur more interest in grassroots
recovery advocacy, even as advocates work to get more lawmakers to join the
caucus. “It’s a chicken-and-egg kind of thing,” Hope said.

Johnny Allem, president of the Johnson Institute, said the caucus is an
important forum that would help the recovery movement become more
sophisticated in its advocacy. “It has allowed a number of people concerned
about our issues to speak up,” he said. Howard Shapiro, director of the
State Associations of Addiction Services (SAAS), called the caucus “an
important effort that may serve as a focal point for reaching members of
Congress to support the resources needed to make positive changes for
alcohol and other drug abuse.”

“Everyone in the treatment and recovery field is extremely pleased that this
has come together,” added Shapiro.

Hope gave credit to groups like SAAS and Join Together for encouraging
people in the addiction field to contact their House members to ask them to
join the caucus. Join Together, for example, pointed the 20,000-plus members
of its online mailing lists to the Legislative Action Center on the Join
Together Online website, where they can quickly and easily contact their
local lawmakers about the caucus.

“We recognized this as a unique opportunity to mobilize people in the field
from a wide range of perspectives, because these issues are so bipartisan,”
said Eric Helmuth, director of Internet services for Join Together. “It
gives people an easy opportunity to have legislative contact that didn’t
involve opposing or supporting a bill. For legislators, it is a chance for
them not to be pressed on legislation, but to be told how important this
issue is and enable them to do something positive.”

Helmuth said that more than 700 readers responded to an appeal from Join
Together director David Rosenbloom, sending 1,150 messages to 330 members of
Congress — about 3/4 of the House of Representatives. “People wrote some of
the most eloquent, passionate letters we have seen,” said Helmuth.

For example, Paul Bergman, chairman of the Missouri Recovery Network, wrote
to Rep. Ike Skelton (D-Mo.). “I am an alcoholic and have been sober for
eight years, and had access to quality substance abuse treatment in 1996,”
said Bergman. “Today, that is not the case. Tens of thousands of Missourians
are unable to access treatment, and the tragedy of their addiction continues
to persist.

“Addiction is a treatable disease, and to deny treatment to Missourians is
essentially immoral,” Bergman continued. “The cost to the individual and our
communities is death, damage to families, escalating crime, loss of
productivity, and deteriorating communities. Please join this caucus and
support access to treatment for alcoholics and addicts.”

The caucus recently held its first informational meeting, bringing staff
from members’ offices together to hear a presentation on the
administration’s Access to Recovery program delivered by drug czar John
Walters, as well as an overview of the Ensuring Solutions to Alcohol
Problems project at the George Washington University Medical Center.

Advocates for treatment and recovery are currently working to create a
similar caucus in the Senate.

Suzy

“Who would believe that a democratic government would pursue for eight
decades a failed policy that produced tens of millions of victims and
trillions of dollars of illicit profits for drug dealers, cost taxpayers
hundreds of billions of dollars, increased crime and destroyed inner cities,
fostered widespread corruption and violations of human rights – and all with
no success in achieving the stated and unattainable objective of a drug free
America?”
Milton Friedman,  winner of 1976 Nobel Memorial Prize for economic science

“You can get over an addiction but you can never get over a conviction.”
Jack Cole, Retired undercover police officer
www.dpft.org

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Methadone & Ibogaine
Date: May 11, 2004 at 11:35:09 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am relatively new to this site but was ecstatic when I came across it. I am curious about something. I have been taking Methadone for 23 years. Would Ibogaine be of use for me? Or rather,  assuming I want to get off meth, are my odds good with Ibogaine? The other question is getting  a couple of doses as well as a ‘guide'(?). Are there any institutions  or something in the US, in NYC? I would be able to go out of the country in the future, but presently I can not. Can anyone help me?

Thanks

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] sexual behavior
Date: May 11, 2004 at 11:27:57 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/11/04 3:05:55 PM, dave@phantom.com writes:

Has there been any report of changes in sexual behavior resulting from
or following ibogaine treatment?

Aside from the obvious [methadone destroyed my sex drive] post-ibo sex
became a new experience, oppression from my childhood was lifted and I
was better able to be free sexually. Of course like anything else, there
was work/practice involved. A key component of my first ibo experience
did focus directly on sex, in particular my association with sexual
drive and the intensity of being a male in a world of many attractive
women [the message was like, dude, you are hard-wired at the dna level
to reproduce, this exists at the deepest root/animal instinct level, and
it is a SURVIVAL instinct = do not be ashamed of your sexual drive, it
is completely natural for a man to desire sex multiple times daily, its
how you approach that desire and how you channel it that matters ] (ie
don’t leave a wake of broken hearts and shattered relationships because
of my sex drive).  {oh yeah and a thundering laugh from the ibo entity
concerning srtict christian up-bringing and sex – the entity’s comment
was something like, “leave it to man to fuck up the divine!”}

Dave,

One of the prime directives of one of my early ibogaine experiences was that
the basis of life is sexuality.

Howard

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From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] sexual behavior
Date: May 11, 2004 at 11:04:20 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Has there been any report of changes in sexual behavior resulting from or following ibogaine treatment?

Aside from the obvious [methadone destroyed my sex drive] post-ibo sex
became a new experience, oppression from my childhood was lifted and I
was better able to be free sexually. Of course like anything else, there
was work/practice involved. A key component of my first ibo experience
did focus directly on sex, in particular my association with sexual
drive and the intensity of being a male in a world of many attractive
women [the message was like, dude, you are hard-wired at the dna level
to reproduce, this exists at the deepest root/animal instinct level, and
it is a SURVIVAL instinct = do not be ashamed of your sexual drive, it
is completely natural for a man to desire sex multiple times daily, its
how you approach that desire and how you channel it that matters ] (ie
don’t leave a wake of broken hearts and shattered relationships because
of my sex drive).  {oh yeah and a thundering laugh from the ibo entity
concerning srtict christian up-bringing and sex – the entity’s comment
was something like, “leave it to man to fuck up the divine!”}

thats all from me…

_.dh

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] sexual behavior
Date: May 11, 2004 at 2:30:16 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Noah,

Yes, there it can help to change sexual behaviour.

I have treated a man who had sexual addiction,
He couldn’t stop thinking about it all day and had sex with everyone
In his mind. But after the treatment it was gone,
He could concentrate on other things.
He didn’t like to be lost in those day dreaming
And Iboga helped him.

S.

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: NoahPotter@aol.com [mailto:NoahPotter@aol.com]
Verzonden: maandag 10 mei 2004 23:31
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: [ibogaine] sexual behavior

I have a question for the list in light of the reference in Dr. Byrne’s
recent email to sex addiction as a subject of discussion at the conference
he attended.

Has there been any report of changes in sexual behavior resulting from or
following ibogaine treatment?

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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<)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] sexual behavior
Date: May 10, 2004 at 9:26:31 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m interested to see how people respond to your question…I would think that perhaps the objective behind using iboga/ine would be a factor ie “(opioid) junkie’s have no interest in sex or other people…except as suppliers of junk, none what so ever”(WSB)
So yeah, that of course changed when I kicked for sure, but I’m interested in non-opioid objectives w/ iboga/ine how that affected sex drive. You know?
It definately affected how I view it, for sure, or perhaps reinforced what I already knew deep in my heart.

Also, I’ve become allot more social since my last dose; yeah, still have to swim through the wanna be hustlers but I’ve been meeting good people as a result so that says something I suppose…..meeting new people is like planting different seeds that’s kind of plant will be revealed after it gets above ground.
…Yeah…their are good people out there for sure : ) and it appears the more good hearted people I meet, the easier they become to find…
the universal needs of all people seem a bit more obvious to me when meeting people now more then before, , we haved experienced laughter, we have all cried, we all experience sickness, we all want to feel our actions are worthwhile, we all want to explore but are at first afraid to trust what we do not know, we all assume, we all have a want to be understood, we all want to be heard, we all have loads on our backs, we all were born and will die(picture of music–_[ bass drum = birth ], [ snare drum = death ] LED calculater says “E” when large number beats per minute is requested to better express how vast life is ie so many I’s, so many I’s suffering beyond my comprehension, to call what I experience as ‘suffering’ when majority of world’s I’s bellies swell with hunger is like spitting in their face, stopped being about own personal security some time ago, “the goal is not to have a goal” says 40 minutes of John Cage diary playing at same time as androgynoid-strange dreamz mix v.2.0…….so much life experience lessons before now, so much untapped knowledge, inside the skull is as vast as outside the skull in all the I’s of the world? perhaps.
11111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

Jason
—–Original Message—–
From: NoahPotter@aol.com [mailto:NoahPotter@aol.com]
Sent: Monday, May 10, 2004, 3:15 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] sexual behavior

I have a question for the list in light of the reference in Dr. Byrne’s recent
email to sex addiction as a subject of discussion at the conference he
attended.

Has there been any report of changes in sexual behavior resulting from or
following ibogaine treatment?

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “booker w” <swbooker@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy
Date: May 10, 2004 at 6:04:51 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeah, I could be wrong about the dose my buddy told me about.  I just know it was about 1/5th of the usual dose to keep someone from “using.”
>From: HSLotsof@aol.com

>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy

>Date: Mon, 10 May 2004 17:33:09 EDT

>

>Sandy,

>

>Just one point.  The author the article whose web page is given indicates a

>dose of .05mg/day of naltrexone.  I am not sure if that is in error as it is

>1/20th of a mg.  You might go to the web page and see if you can spot an email

>address and ask for verification on the dose. http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

>

>Howard

>

>In a message dated 5/10/04 9:01:39 PM, swbooker@hotmail.com writes:

>

> ><div style=’background-color:’><DIV class=RTE>

> >Hi.  In relation to this study, just before I relapsed to opiates

> >again I was talking to an MD that I knew thru 12 step meetings.

> >I could tell I was probably going to relapse soon and he told me that there

> >were possiblilities of giving low doses of naltrexone to people (like 4

> >mgs. each night, he said) which would cause one’s brain to produce more

> >endorphins in counteraction, helping to relieve the desire for opiates

> >and boost natural painkillers in my wee brain.  I went to my own doc. and

> >asked him if I could try this, but of course he was close-minded (which

> >was very frustrating because it seemed so easy and simple.)

> >He said that it was all “experimental” and conjecture, and just

> >try to learn to deal with headache pain (he gave me some

> >fioricet – doesn’t he know that’s addicting?)  He told me that folks

> >quitting cigarettes always desire to smoke (I don’t and I quit five

> >years ago.)  Most doctors and non-addicts just DON’T GET IT, that

> >when you get caught up in “white-knuckling,”  if it goes on too long,

> >the drugs always win – at least in my case.

> >I hate drug-testing on animals, but I would sure like to try some more

> >experimenting on humans regarding naltrexone uses.  I’m willing…

> >Interesting study, tho.

> >Sandy Watson

> >>From: HSLotsof@aol.com </DIV>

> ><DIV></DIV>>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

> ><DIV></DIV>>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

> ><DIV></DIV>>Subject: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy

> ><DIV></DIV>>Date: Sat, 8 May 2004 16:26:30 EDT

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>Ultra-Low Dose Naltrexone

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>”Thus, ultra-low doses of naltrexone effectively prevented

> >the decline of

> ><DIV></DIV>>morphine effect observed over 7 days and inhibited the increase

> >in morphine ED50

> ><DIV></DIV>>value. Remarkably, naltrexone also reversed established

> >morphine tolerance,

> ><DIV></DIV>>restoring the antinociceptive effect of morphine to 70%

> >of the original level

> ><DIV></DIV>>and the morphine ED” — ‘Paradoxical Effects of the Opioid

> >Antagonist Naltrexone

> ><DIV></DIV>>on Morphine Analgesia, Tolerance, and Reward In Rats’ (Powell

> >et. al. 2001)

> ><DIV></DIV>>Ultra low dose naltrexone (ULDNTX, or ULD Naltrexone) therapy

> >has been

> ><DIV></DIV>>developed and utilized for the reduction and maintaince

> >of opioid tolerance at the

> ><DIV></DIV>>DTS. We present to you several pages devoted to our project,

> >and our

> ><DIV></DIV>>recommendations as to the appropriate dosages that should

> >be administered. It is our

> ><DIV></DIV>>belief that naltrexone is a safe and efficacious means of

> >inhibiting the

> ><DIV></DIV>>development of opioid tolerance.

> ><DIV></DIV>>top

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>A Primer

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>It would be prudent to begin by highlighting that the use

> >of naltrexone for

> ><DIV></DIV>>this indication is experimental and as such, there may be

> >unexpected

> ><DIV></DIV>>consequences. Published content has been provided for educational

> >use only and should

> ><DIV></DIV>>not be taken as an endorsement of suitability or safety

> >of the treatment

> ><DIV></DIV>>protocol defined herein. With that taken care of, let us

> >discuss the acquisition of

> ><DIV></DIV>>naltrexone.

> ><DIV></DIV>>Naltrexone is available in most areas of the world as a

> >prescription only

> ><DIV></DIV>>medicine. This would, of course, mean that you must see

> >a registered

> ><DIV></DIV>>practicitoner in order to acquire this drug. Some online

> >pharmacies may offer naltrexone,

> ><DIV></DIV>>albeit at an inflated price. As naltrexone is inherently

> >a very expensive drug

> ><DIV></DIV>>(a bottle of 30 x 50 mg Revia costs over $220 AUD), it may

> >be desirable to

> ><DIV></DIV>>acquire a prescription, if one can, for an approved usage

> >such as the treatment

> ><DIV></DIV>>of alcohol dependence. In many countries such a use is subsidised

> >heavily by

> ><DIV></DIV>>their respective governments.

> ><DIV></DIV>>Obviously, the 50 mg tablets contain far too much naltrexone

> >for this

> ><DIV></DIV>>purpose; In fact, even one fifth of a tablet would precipitate

> >opioid withdrawal in

> ><DIV></DIV>>those who are dependent. The dilemma may be resolved by

> >carefully preparing a

> ><DIV></DIV>>dilution with a known quantity of solvent (ie: preserved

> >saline.) If all this

> ><DIV></DIV>>sounds confusing, don’t fret. The entire process is further

> >explained elsewhere

> ><DIV></DIV>>on this page.

> ><DIV></DIV>>Once prepared, the solution must be decanted into a container

> >and stored in a

> ><DIV></DIV>>refrigerated environment. With the preparation complete,

> >administration may

> ><DIV></DIV>>commence. Initiation should preferrably take place at ~0.05

> >mg/day. Titration

> ><DIV></DIV>>should be limited to a maximum deviation of 0.03 mg/day

> >from the recommended

> ><DIV></DIV>>dose. We have found that doses above 0.05 mg/day still produce

> >desirable effects

> ><DIV></DIV>>- doses as high as 0.15-0.2 mg/day have been found to still

> >slightly augment

> ><DIV></DIV>>opioid response, yet we feel that maximum efficacy is only

> >reached at the

> ><DIV></DIV>>lower end of this envelope.

> ><DIV></DIV>>top

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>The Possible Benefits

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>Naltrexone was found to at least slow down, and even possibly

> >inhibit the

> ><DIV></DIV>>continuation of the development of tolerance to opioid agonists.

> >However,

> ><DIV></DIV>>naltrexone was only moderately successful in reversing opioid

> >tolerance. In addition,

> ><DIV></DIV>>naltrexone was found to selectively and completely reverse

> >all the negative

> ><DIV></DIV>>effects of opioid agonist use on sexual function and restore

> >the individual’s

> ><DIV></DIV>>libido to their opioid naive state. It was found that this

> >effect was more

> ><DIV></DIV>>prominent at lower doses of around 0.05 mg/day. A variety

> >of mild side effects

> ><DIV></DIV>>experienced shortly after onset, including pipillary constriction

> >and light

> ><DIV></DIV>>senstivity, dry mouth and urinary retention, appeared to

> >be reduced or eliminated

> ><DIV></DIV>>by the ultra-low-dose naltrexone.

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>

> ><DIV></DIV>>10998 hits since 06-Jan-2004.

> ><DIV></DIV>>Last Modified: Saturday, 10-Jan-2004 at 02:08 PM

> ><DIV></DIV>>http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

> ><DIV></DIV>>

>

>   /]=———————————————————————=[\

>  [%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]

>   \]=———————————————————————=[/

>

>

Best Restaurant Giveaway Ever! Vote for your favorites for a chance to win $1 million! /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%](> Further Information & List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy
Date: May 10, 2004 at 5:33:09 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sandy,

Just one point.  The author the article whose web page is given indicates a
dose of .05mg/day of naltrexone.  I am not sure if that is in error as it is
1/20th of a mg.  You might go to the web page and see if you can spot an email
address and ask for verification on the dose. http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

Howard

In a message dated 5/10/04 9:01:39 PM, swbooker@hotmail.com writes:

<div style=’background-color:’><DIV class=RTE>
Hi.  In relation to this study, just before I relapsed to opiates
again I was talking to an MD that I knew thru 12 step meetings.
I could tell I was probably going to relapse soon and he told me that there
were possiblilities of giving low doses of naltrexone to people (like 4
mgs. each night, he said) which would cause one’s brain to produce more
endorphins in counteraction, helping to relieve the desire for opiates
and boost natural painkillers in my wee brain.  I went to my own doc. and
asked him if I could try this, but of course he was close-minded (which
was very frustrating because it seemed so easy and simple.)
He said that it was all “experimental” and conjecture, and just
try to learn to deal with headache pain (he gave me some
fioricet – doesn’t he know that’s addicting?)  He told me that folks
quitting cigarettes always desire to smoke (I don’t and I quit five
years ago.)  Most doctors and non-addicts just DON’T GET IT, that
when you get caught up in “white-knuckling,”  if it goes on too long,
the drugs always win – at least in my case.
I hate drug-testing on animals, but I would sure like to try some more
experimenting on humans regarding naltrexone uses.  I’m willing…
Interesting study, tho.
Sandy Watson
From: HSLotsof@aol.com </DIV>
<DIV></DIV>>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
<DIV></DIV>>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
<DIV></DIV>>Subject: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy
<DIV></DIV>>Date: Sat, 8 May 2004 16:26:30 EDT
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>Ultra-Low Dose Naltrexone
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>”Thus, ultra-low doses of naltrexone effectively prevented
the decline of
<DIV></DIV>>morphine effect observed over 7 days and inhibited the increase
in morphine ED50
<DIV></DIV>>value. Remarkably, naltrexone also reversed established
morphine tolerance,
<DIV></DIV>>restoring the antinociceptive effect of morphine to 70%
of the original level
<DIV></DIV>>and the morphine ED” — ‘Paradoxical Effects of the Opioid
Antagonist Naltrexone
<DIV></DIV>>on Morphine Analgesia, Tolerance, and Reward In Rats’ (Powell
et. al. 2001)
<DIV></DIV>>Ultra low dose naltrexone (ULDNTX, or ULD Naltrexone) therapy
has been
<DIV></DIV>>developed and utilized for the reduction and maintaince
of opioid tolerance at the
<DIV></DIV>>DTS. We present to you several pages devoted to our project,
and our
<DIV></DIV>>recommendations as to the appropriate dosages that should
be administered. It is our
<DIV></DIV>>belief that naltrexone is a safe and efficacious means of
inhibiting the
<DIV></DIV>>development of opioid tolerance.
<DIV></DIV>>top
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>A Primer
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>It would be prudent to begin by highlighting that the use
of naltrexone for
<DIV></DIV>>this indication is experimental and as such, there may be
unexpected
<DIV></DIV>>consequences. Published content has been provided for educational
use only and should
<DIV></DIV>>not be taken as an endorsement of suitability or safety
of the treatment
<DIV></DIV>>protocol defined herein. With that taken care of, let us
discuss the acquisition of
<DIV></DIV>>naltrexone.
<DIV></DIV>>Naltrexone is available in most areas of the world as a
prescription only
<DIV></DIV>>medicine. This would, of course, mean that you must see
a registered
<DIV></DIV>>practicitoner in order to acquire this drug. Some online
pharmacies may offer naltrexone,
<DIV></DIV>>albeit at an inflated price. As naltrexone is inherently
a very expensive drug
<DIV></DIV>>(a bottle of 30 x 50 mg Revia costs over $220 AUD), it may
be desirable to
<DIV></DIV>>acquire a prescription, if one can, for an approved usage
such as the treatment
<DIV></DIV>>of alcohol dependence. In many countries such a use is subsidised
heavily by
<DIV></DIV>>their respective governments.
<DIV></DIV>>Obviously, the 50 mg tablets contain far too much naltrexone
for this
<DIV></DIV>>purpose; In fact, even one fifth of a tablet would precipitate
opioid withdrawal in
<DIV></DIV>>those who are dependent. The dilemma may be resolved by
carefully preparing a
<DIV></DIV>>dilution with a known quantity of solvent (ie: preserved
saline.) If all this
<DIV></DIV>>sounds confusing, don’t fret. The entire process is further
explained elsewhere
<DIV></DIV>>on this page.
<DIV></DIV>>Once prepared, the solution must be decanted into a container
and stored in a
<DIV></DIV>>refrigerated environment. With the preparation complete,
administration may
<DIV></DIV>>commence. Initiation should preferrably take place at ~0.05
mg/day. Titration
<DIV></DIV>>should be limited to a maximum deviation of 0.03 mg/day
from the recommended
<DIV></DIV>>dose. We have found that doses above 0.05 mg/day still produce
desirable effects
<DIV></DIV>>- doses as high as 0.15-0.2 mg/day have been found to still
slightly augment
<DIV></DIV>>opioid response, yet we feel that maximum efficacy is only
reached at the
<DIV></DIV>>lower end of this envelope.
<DIV></DIV>>top
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>The Possible Benefits
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>Naltrexone was found to at least slow down, and even possibly
inhibit the
<DIV></DIV>>continuation of the development of tolerance to opioid agonists.
However,
<DIV></DIV>>naltrexone was only moderately successful in reversing opioid
tolerance. In addition,
<DIV></DIV>>naltrexone was found to selectively and completely reverse
all the negative
<DIV></DIV>>effects of opioid agonist use on sexual function and restore
the individual’s
<DIV></DIV>>libido to their opioid naive state. It was found that this
effect was more
<DIV></DIV>>prominent at lower doses of around 0.05 mg/day. A variety
of mild side effects
<DIV></DIV>>experienced shortly after onset, including pipillary constriction
and light
<DIV></DIV>>senstivity, dry mouth and urinary retention, appeared to
be reduced or eliminated
<DIV></DIV>>by the ultra-low-dose naltrexone.
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>
<DIV></DIV>>10998 hits since 06-Jan-2004.
<DIV></DIV>>Last Modified: Saturday, 10-Jan-2004 at 02:08 PM
<DIV></DIV>>http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml
<DIV></DIV>>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: NoahPotter@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] sexual behavior
Date: May 10, 2004 at 5:30:45 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have a question for the list in light of the reference in Dr. Byrne’s recent email to sex addiction as a subject of discussion at the conference he attended.

Has there been any report of changes in sexual behavior resulting from or following ibogaine treatment?

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “booker w” <swbooker@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy
Date: May 10, 2004 at 5:00:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi.  In relation to this study, just before I relapsed to opiates again I was talking to an MD that I knew thru 12 step meetings.  I could tell I was probably going to relapse soon and he told me that there were possiblilities of giving low doses of naltrexone to people (like 4 mgs. each night, he said) which would cause one’s brain to produce more endorphins in counteraction, helping to relieve the desire for opiates and boost natural painkillers in my wee brain.  I went to my own doc. and asked him if I could try this, but of course he was close-minded (which was very frustrating because it seemed so easy and simple.)  He said that it was all “experimental” and conjecture, and just try to learn to deal with headache pain (he gave me some fioricet – doesn’t he know that’s addicting?)  He told me that folks quitting cigarettes always desire to smoke (I don’t and I quit five years ago.)  Most doctors and non-addicts just DON’T GET IT, that when you get caught up in “white-knuckling,”  if it goes on too long, the drugs always win – at least in my case.
I hate drug-testing on animals, but I would sure like to try some more experimenting on humans regarding naltrexone uses.  I’m willing…
Interesting study, tho.
Sandy Watson
>From: HSLotsof@aol.com

>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>Subject: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy

>Date: Sat, 8 May 2004 16:26:30 EDT

>

>http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

>

>Ultra-Low Dose Naltrexone

>

>”Thus, ultra-low doses of naltrexone effectively prevented the decline of

>morphine effect observed over 7 days and inhibited the increase in morphine ED50

>value. Remarkably, naltrexone also reversed established morphine tolerance,

>restoring the antinociceptive effect of morphine to 70% of the original level

>and the morphine ED” — ‘Paradoxical Effects of the Opioid Antagonist Naltrexone

>on Morphine Analgesia, Tolerance, and Reward In Rats’ (Powell et. al. 2001)

>Ultra low dose naltrexone (ULDNTX, or ULD Naltrexone) therapy has been

>developed and utilized for the reduction and maintaince of opioid tolerance at the

>DTS. We present to you several pages devoted to our project, and our

>recommendations as to the appropriate dosages that should be administered. It is our

>belief that naltrexone is a safe and efficacious means of inhibiting the

>development of opioid tolerance.

>top

>

>A Primer

>

>It would be prudent to begin by highlighting that the use of naltrexone for

>this indication is experimental and as such, there may be unexpected

>consequences. Published content has been provided for educational use only and should

>not be taken as an endorsement of suitability or safety of the treatment

>protocol defined herein. With that taken care of, let us discuss the acquisition of

>naltrexone.

>Naltrexone is available in most areas of the world as a prescription only

>medicine. This would, of course, mean that you must see a registered

>practicitoner in order to acquire this drug. Some online pharmacies may offer naltrexone,

>albeit at an inflated price. As naltrexone is inherently a very expensive drug

>(a bottle of 30 x 50 mg Revia costs over $220 AUD), it may be desirable to

>acquire a prescription, if one can, for an approved usage such as the treatment

>of alcohol dependence. In many countries such a use is subsidised heavily by

>their respective governments.

>Obviously, the 50 mg tablets contain far too much naltrexone for this

>purpose; In fact, even one fifth of a tablet would precipitate opioid withdrawal in

>those who are dependent. The dilemma may be resolved by carefully preparing a

>dilution with a known quantity of solvent (ie: preserved saline.) If all this

>sounds confusing, don’t fret. The entire process is further explained elsewhere

>on this page.

>Once prepared, the solution must be decanted into a container and stored in a

>refrigerated environment. With the preparation complete, administration may

>commence. Initiation should preferrably take place at ~0.05 mg/day. Titration

>should be limited to a maximum deviation of 0.03 mg/day from the recommended

>dose. We have found that doses above 0.05 mg/day still produce desirable effects

>- doses as high as 0.15-0.2 mg/day have been found to still slightly augment

>opioid response, yet we feel that maximum efficacy is only reached at the

>lower end of this envelope.

>top

>

>The Possible Benefits

>

>Naltrexone was found to at least slow down, and even possibly inhibit the

>continuation of the development of tolerance to opioid agonists. However,

>naltrexone was only moderately successful in reversing opioid tolerance. In addition,

>naltrexone was found to selectively and completely reverse all the negative

>effects of opioid agonist use on sexual function and restore the individual’s

>libido to their opioid naive state. It was found that this effect was more

>prominent at lower doses of around 0.05 mg/day. A variety of mild side effects

>experienced shortly after onset, including pipillary constriction and light

>senstivity, dry mouth and urinary retention, appeared to be reduced or eliminated

>by the ultra-low-dose naltrexone.

>

>

>10998 hits since 06-Jan-2004.

>Last Modified: Saturday, 10-Jan-2004 at 02:08 PM

>http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

>

>   /]=———————————————————————=[\

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>   \]=———————————————————————=[/

>

>

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From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fwd: Avenues for treating addictions
Date: May 10, 2004 at 1:29:10 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Going to have to write a letter on this one…Good old Dr.V….: )
J
—– Original Message —–
From: Suzanne Wills <suzwills@SWBELL.NET>
To: DPFT-L@listserv.tamu.edu
Sent: 10 May 04, 7:02 AM
Subject: Avenues for treating addictions
Newshawk: Suzy Wills
Pubdate: 10 May 2004
Source:  Dallas Morning News
Contact: letterstoeditor@dallasnews.com
Website: http://www.dallasnews.com/
Webpage:
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/news/healthscience/stories/051004dnlivaddiction.11423.html
*****************************************************
Avenues for treating addictions
Substance abuse often goes hand-in-hand with mental illness, psychiatrists say
05:29 PM CDT on Sunday, May 9, 2004
By KAREN PATTERSON / The Dallas Morning News

NEW YORK  Doctors treating substance abuse are looking to expand their impact.
Abuse of opiate painkillers, such as Vicodin and OxyContin, has risen substantially in the past five years, making this the nation’s highest-priority drug problem, says Dr. Nora Volkow.
Dr. Volkow, director of the National Institute on Drug Abuse, and other experts hope that they can better tackle substance abuse by integrating the latest research on addiction into psychiatric practice. To that end, addiction-related topics were featured last week at the American Psychiatric Association’s national meeting in New York City.
“To me it is very straightforward,” Dr. Volkow said during a news briefing at the meeting. “I’m a psychiatrist, and one of the things that was very frustrating to me … was the realization that most of psychiatric patients have substance abuse problems. And yet we were not really properly trained to actually solve these problems.”
People might first develop a mental disorder, then an addiction  perhaps as an attempt to self-medicate, she said. Or kids may first take drugs and then develop a mental illness. “Could the substance abuse in any way have made that kid more vulnerable?” she asked, adding that it’s a question for which researchers don’t yet know the answer.
The jump in prescription painkiller abuse is relatively new, so there is no epidemiological data yet to track its source, Dr. Volkow said. The increase probably has multiple causes, she said, including a relatively new phenomenon: sale of opiate painkillers on the Internet. Also, legal prescriptions of the drugs have increased dramatically in recent years.
“One of the things we saw in the ’90s was an attempt to improve prescribing for pain,” said Dr. Herbert Kleber, a psychiatrist and researcher at Columbia University. “And indeed it happened. You had lawsuits about physicians who did not adequately prescribe enough narcotics for pain.”
The increased availability has given not only legitimate patients a chance to abuse the drugs, but others as well. If you work with teens, Dr. Kleber said, you find that the first thing many baby sitters do is check the medicine cabinet.
Painkiller addiction is also a problem among the elderly, who are most likely to be prescribed opiate drugs, Dr. Volkow said. Sometimes faced with a number of pills to take, these patients could accidentally misuse them.
“That’s a new group of subjects that all of a sudden we’re facing,” she said.
Female patients have indicated they can find Vicodin or OxyContin by asking around at their beauty salons, where someone invariably has the drug or knows how to get it, Dr. Kleber said.
It’s not as if doctors and others haven’t made progress in the fight against substance abuse. Illegal drug use among teenagers is down 11 percent, Dr. Volkow noted. And cigarette smoking is at its lowest level in teens since 1979.
Rates of abuse of stimulants and a class of drugs known as benzodiazepines (including Valium) have held steady, Dr. Volkow noted, even though prescriptions for stimulants, mainly to treat attention-deficit/hyperactivity disorder, roughly double every five years.
Use of the club drug Ecstasy had been going up “exponentially,” but has dropped off recently, Dr. Kleber said. That may have been due in part to an extensive education campaign about the drug’s dangers  and kids seeing those dangers themselves. Use of GHB (gamma-hydroxybutyrate) and ketamine, known as date-rape drugs, may also be down slightly, he said.
Estimates about alcohol abuse have held steady for the past decade or so, said Dr. Shelly Greenfield, chair of the APA’s Council on Addiction Psychiatry.
About 14 percent of Americans will have a problem with alcohol sometime in their lives, she said. However, children  especially girls  are starting to experiment with it at younger ages.
“The age of initiation of use is now equivalent between boys and girls,” from 10 to 14, she said. “That goes for many other drugs of abuse as well.”
Addiction is a developmental brain disease that starts in adolescence, or sometimes even earlier, Dr. Volkow said. During adolescence, she said, the brain is particularly susceptible to the effects of addictive substances. “You are shattering your life from the beginning,” she said.
Besides psychiatrists, Dr. Volkow’s agency will press general practitioners  including pediatricians  to talk to their patients about substance use.
Often, patients are never even asked about a drug or alcohol problem, said Dr. Greenfield. It’s important for doctors to ask the questions and to make sure they and the patients have the same understanding of the issue, she said.
As many as half of all patients in any kind of doctor’s waiting room have a problem with abuse of alcohol, tobacco or other substances, Dr. Kleber said. “If you don’t ask, if you don’t look for it, you’re not going to see it.”
Psychiatrists and other doctors have an important message to spread, Dr. Greenfield added: “We have many effective treatments that are both behavioral and also pharmacologic that we can offer patients.”
E-mail kpatterson@dallasnews.com

For more information about substance abuse and how to seek help, visit www.nida.nih.gov.

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From: “D H” <dave@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] test [ignore]
Date: May 10, 2004 at 10:47:52 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

testing

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From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fwd: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 10, 2004 at 1:14:55 AM EDT
To: digital@phantom.com

sure dood………..hook me up. i was my own lab rat for yrs. y change now ?
can u give me : aktionman@phantom.com
& tell me how to retreeve mail.  i’m onna mac os X jag with a dsl line.
mind u ………i aint quite a geek but i can jam sum bluuz on here.
lets see if ur shit werkzzzzzz!
marcus

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: [drugwar] List
Date: May 9, 2004 at 11:13:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The same thing Libby said, no idea what all of it
meant but I love it when you get all technical 🙂
Thanks cutie 😉

Carla B

— Libby <baystatebar@yahoo.com> wrote:
Oh baby! I love when you talk like that Patrick and
someday I hope to actually understand what it all
means.

In any event, my messages are once again appearing
on
the drugwar list, if not instantly, within a
reasonably quick time frame and thanks a bunch for
all
the work you do to keep this discussion open.

You’re the best,

Kiss Kiss, Libby

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
Okay,

Things I need to bring up (this is for ibogaine
and
drugwar lists,
everybody else on the other lists pretty much
knows
what’s up and can
deal):

[01]: The mail system has been re-tuned, one more
time … we are now at
the point where all the lists live on their own
disk, using different
slices.  There’s software (the MTA, in this case
qmail; the list software;
in this case ezmlm; all the configuration files,
etc); there’s bandwidth
(which is actually beyond all-good right now);
there’s hardware (in this
case, the main box is a Sunfire 440r, and some Sun
Netras); and we have
just tuned I/O, i.e., hard disks are physical —
not
virtual — devices,
and the platters spin at a maximum RPM speed.  If
there are 15,000
simultaneous read/write requests taking place …
well, it’s a lot better
to balance them out over separate devices.  Which
we
just did.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] List
Date: May 9, 2004 at 6:56:01 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Sun, May 09, 2004 at 03:43:54PM -0700], [Vector Vector] wrote:

| I’m getting everything instantly or a few seconds later for the past
| few days. It won’t last because even if Mindvox is tuned, yahoo never
| stays that way longer then a week before sinking into mud again.

Shit happens.

| Patrick, thank you for all this! 🙂 Don’t think anyone ever says that.

No worries.  This seems to be our karma.  #$(*@#$!* karma…

| Is all of Mindvox Suns from when you were still a ISP? Open it again
| already and hire more people. I think all of you have a very expensive
| hobby which eats a lot of time right now. You could at least get paid

Depends how you define MindVox.  Pretty much everything that is talking to
the external world, in some relatively accessible way, is running Solaris.
One firewall is OpenBSD, the other is a Cisco pixbox, uhm … sum other
shit.  There’s a lot of stuff in the rack.  There’s a 1U Xserve, which is
really sexy, but nothing compiles on it out of the box; so it’s like, uhm,
maybe not …

http://www.apple.com/xserve/

It rocks, but … Dunno yet, the near-term future may be a few more Linux
netappliance type things, so typing vi Makefile ./configure ./make ./make
install, mostly Just Works; instead of requiring 8 hours of time every
other week when some piece of software has a revision level change by .1

The main rate-limiting factor is time.  And Solaris appears to be sitting
and spinning…  Total bummer.  It ain’t 1997 anymore.

| for it 🙂 🙂 🙂 And sell me email vector@mindvox.com please! 🙂 🙂 🙂
| I’m asking for the 200 time in 4 years 🙂 🙂

Ask 200 more times, eventually we’ll get around to doing that again.

Patrick

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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] List
Date: May 9, 2004 at 6:43:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m getting everything instantly or a few seconds later for the past
few days. It won’t last because even if Mindvox is tuned, yahoo never
stays that way longer then a week before sinking into mud again.

Patrick, thank you for all this! 🙂 Don’t think anyone ever says that.

Is all of Mindvox Suns from when you were still a ISP? Open it again
already and hire more people. I think all of you have a very expensive
hobby which eats a lot of time right now. You could at least get paid
for it 🙂 🙂 🙂 And sell me email vector@mindvox.com please! 🙂 🙂 🙂
I’m asking for the 200 time in 4 years 🙂 🙂

.:vector:.

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
Okay,

Things I need to bring up (this is for ibogaine and drugwar lists,
everybody else on the other lists pretty much knows what’s up and can
deal):

[01]: The mail system has been re-tuned, one more time … we are now
at
the point where all the lists live on their own disk, using different
slices.  There’s software (the MTA, in this case qmail; the list
software;
in this case ezmlm; all the configuration files, etc); there’s
bandwidth
(which is actually beyond all-good right now); there’s hardware (in
this
case, the main box is a Sunfire 440r, and some Sun Netras); and we
have
just tuned I/O, i.e., hard disks are physical — not virtual —
devices,
and the platters spin at a maximum RPM speed.  If there are 15,000
simultaneous read/write requests taking place … well, it’s a lot
better
to balance them out over separate devices.  Which we just did.

In other words: everything should be working pretty good right now.

Two variables I’m not sure about just yet, are –> time to die
settings,
and how long the queue retains outbound mail.  Basically, if anyone
here
is NOT getting their mail, or it’s taking a long time … Please
email:

voxadm@mindvox.com

And state the problem, along with the list name, and what’s happening

or not happening.  Do not expect a reply, but we’ll read it.

[02]: MANY of you here, are signed up with SomeRandomAccount.  So,
you’re
on the ibogaine list using: SomeName@myMailbox.com … then, you use
POP
or IMAP, to gather all your mailboxes together, into your MAIN email,
which is: SomeCompletelyDifferentName@anotherAddress.com

You click reply, and are trying to send email into the list, using an
account which is NOT signed up.

This means: I have to manually release the message as I sift through
the
queue.  The list is NOT open to non-subscribers.  And even if you are
signed up with one name, then try to post with another name … well,
the
system isn’t psychic yet … it has NO WAY of knowing, “Oh, yeah,
that’s
the same person!”

The queue looks a lot like this:

01: Get Cheap Viagra Online!
02: Buy Xanax, Vicodan, Soma!
03: Grow a Bigger Dick
04: Get Rich Quick.
05: My Grandfather has a Box with 95 million dollars inside in
Nigeria
06: Teen Sluts in Heat
07: A Brilliant Actual Message, which would Heal the World if anyone
saw it
08: Prescription medications by mail
09: Start saving now
10: Try the South beach diet

And that’s AFTER procmail has tossed the OBVIOUS crap into /dev/null
before I ever see it.  I have a lot of shit to do.  I do not sit
there and
carefully read each message.  I skim the first line or two; and if it
appears to have something to do with the list, I release it.
Sometimes,
if I’m sitting there holding down the [D]elete key through 150
message of
crap … I fuck it up.  Oh well, my bad.  Your message just
vaporized.

I CANNOT just “open” the list.  Then, instead of the occasional virus
that
flies through here, because someone who is actually signed up, is
infected
with the latest piece of shit that wedges itself into Outlook —
there
would be an absolute fucking avalanche of crap landing here.

Thusly, so everyone understands: If you are signed up with Account
[A],
and then try to post using Account [B].  The system DOES NOT KNOW
that.
It has NO WAY of knowing.

If you want to post from Some Given Account, then SIGN IT UP.

Otay, that’s it then,

<WhaM> <wHAM> <pardon me, I seem to be wedged in left-brain, gotta go
slam
my head into the wall a few times to escape.  Sanity is very
constricting,
I can’t function using that paradigm.  LoOK, it’s COMPLETELY OBVIOUS
to
me, everything should JUST WORK, perfectlY; the disks should move at
1nf!nIte speed, and id10tz should stop sending crap into our domainZ.
Thank ewe.>

Patrick

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Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] List
Date: May 9, 2004 at 6:32:51 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Okay,

Things I need to bring up (this is for ibogaine and drugwar lists,
everybody else on the other lists pretty much knows what’s up and can
deal):

[01]: The mail system has been re-tuned, one more time … we are now at
the point where all the lists live on their own disk, using different
slices.  There’s software (the MTA, in this case qmail; the list software;
in this case ezmlm; all the configuration files, etc); there’s bandwidth
(which is actually beyond all-good right now); there’s hardware (in this
case, the main box is a Sunfire 440r, and some Sun Netras); and we have
just tuned I/O, i.e., hard disks are physical — not virtual — devices,
and the platters spin at a maximum RPM speed.  If there are 15,000
simultaneous read/write requests taking place … well, it’s a lot better
to balance them out over separate devices.  Which we just did.

In other words: everything should be working pretty good right now.

Two variables I’m not sure about just yet, are –> time to die settings,
and how long the queue retains outbound mail.  Basically, if anyone here
is NOT getting their mail, or it’s taking a long time … Please email:

voxadm@mindvox.com

And state the problem, along with the list name, and what’s happening —
or not happening.  Do not expect a reply, but we’ll read it.

[02]: MANY of you here, are signed up with SomeRandomAccount.  So, you’re
on the ibogaine list using: SomeName@myMailbox.com … then, you use POP
or IMAP, to gather all your mailboxes together, into your MAIN email,
which is: SomeCompletelyDifferentName@anotherAddress.com

You click reply, and are trying to send email into the list, using an
account which is NOT signed up.

This means: I have to manually release the message as I sift through the
queue.  The list is NOT open to non-subscribers.  And even if you are
signed up with one name, then try to post with another name … well, the
system isn’t psychic yet … it has NO WAY of knowing, “Oh, yeah, that’s
the same person!”

The queue looks a lot like this:

01: Get Cheap Viagra Online!
02: Buy Xanax, Vicodan, Soma!
03: Grow a Bigger Dick
04: Get Rich Quick.
05: My Grandfather has a Box with 95 million dollars inside in Nigeria
06: Teen Sluts in Heat
07: A Brilliant Actual Message, which would Heal the World if anyone saw it
08: Prescription medications by mail
09: Start saving now
10: Try the South beach diet

And that’s AFTER procmail has tossed the OBVIOUS crap into /dev/null
before I ever see it.  I have a lot of shit to do.  I do not sit there and
carefully read each message.  I skim the first line or two; and if it
appears to have something to do with the list, I release it.  Sometimes,
if I’m sitting there holding down the [D]elete key through 150 message of
crap … I fuck it up.  Oh well, my bad.  Your message just vaporized.

I CANNOT just “open” the list.  Then, instead of the occasional virus that
flies through here, because someone who is actually signed up, is infected
with the latest piece of shit that wedges itself into Outlook — there
would be an absolute fucking avalanche of crap landing here.

Thusly, so everyone understands: If you are signed up with Account [A],
and then try to post using Account [B].  The system DOES NOT KNOW that.
It has NO WAY of knowing.

If you want to post from Some Given Account, then SIGN IT UP.

Otay, that’s it then,

<WhaM> <wHAM> <pardon me, I seem to be wedged in left-brain, gotta go slam
my head into the wall a few times to escape.  Sanity is very constricting,
I can’t function using that paradigm.  LoOK, it’s COMPLETELY OBVIOUS to
me, everything should JUST WORK, perfectlY; the disks should move at
1nf!nIte speed, and id10tz should stop sending crap into our domainZ.
Thank ewe.>

Patrick

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] and more
Date: May 9, 2004 at 5:01:18 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Logging threatens Pygmies’ forest life

Centuries-old traditions are disappearing

By Lucy Jones 
BBC Bangui reporter

A basket dangling from her head and a machete in hand, Bayanga’s bare-breasted traditional doctor scours the forest for the day’s medical and psychological needs.
“This is to help one girl find a husband,” says Tamara, 42, picking a bunch of strong-smelling leaves and throwing them into her basket.

People are seeing their habitat diminished by logging companies

Etienne Bemba, Park director
“Another woman is having problems desiring her husband, this is for her,” she adds, scraping bark off a tree.
Distracted from her search for cures by bees, she marks a tree, so she can later return to collect the honey.
Tamara is from the Ba’Aka tribe, a group of hunters and gatherers, also known as the “pygmies” because of their short stature.
`Exploitation’
There are around 20,000 members of the tribe inhabiting the rainforests of the south-westerly Dzanga Sangha national park in the Central African Republic.
So far they have resisted exploitation by other Central Africans, many of whom regard the Ba’Aka as sub-human.

Some believe bush meat has mystical powers
But an influx of loggers and poachers is threatening their centuries-old way of life.
“People are seeing their habitat diminished by logging companies, which is leading to a decline in animal populations, but the government wants to log and conserve at the same time,” says the park director, Etienne Bemba.
The Bayanga Wood Company is only permitted to fell selected trees but often removes large amounts of vegetation to build roads in order to retrieve the wood.
The Ba’Aka hunters now get lost in the forest because of a new network of roads.
Poaching
Although the company employs more than 500 people in a region with few job opportunities, and builds schools, the enterprise also attracts immigrants from Congo and Cameroon.
When the newcomers fail to find work, they turn to poaching, supplying Bangui’s bush meat markets with gorilla, elephant, gazelle and antelope, which are believed to have mystical powers.

“Some of the loggers have guns, and poach when out cutting down the trees. Loggers without guns hunt with the wire they use in felling,” adds Mr Bemba.
There are also groups who illegally remove timber, which is transported via unmapped roads to Cameroon to avoid taxation, which further reduces the Ba’Aka’s habitat.
Living without money, the Ba’Aka spend most of the year hunting game with nets.
Inhabiting houses made from leaves and branches, they move on when animal stocks dwindle, but now there are few places for them to go due to deforestation.
‘Systematic destruction’
Western environmentalists have arrived in huge numbers to study and conserve the area.
An estimated 6,000 elephants and 10,000 gorillas still inhabit the park and can be easy targets when they gather to drink salt water in the forest clearings.

When the Ba’Aka get money they go out and spend it on alcohol

Western employer
The poaching of thousands of elephants for their tusks to supply the flourishing illegal ivory trade means few Central Africans have ever seen a wild animal.
“We’ve seen the systematic destruction of our wildlife over the past two decades, a trend we’re trying to reverse,” says Jean Yamindou of the Worldwide Fund for Nature.
In an attempt to prevent the further killing of the animals, the organisation is teaching the Ba’Aka and the local Bantu people to breed fish and poultry.
A gorilla-tracking programme, modelled on successful projects in Rwanda, has been established to attract tourists and preserve the park’s gorilla population.
Social benefits
But although the environmentalists employ armed guards to patrol the park, poaching is still a regular occurrence.
“These people aren’t used to cultivating things. For centuries they’ve been used to getting up in the morning and killing an animal for that day’s requirements,” adds Mr Yamindou.

Many elephants are killed for their ivory
There have also been cases of poaching by guards and civil servants, say locals.
The Ba’Aka resent being told they can no longer hunt elephants, which they kill to eat, and some hunting still occurs.
But they have welcomed the decrease in poaching by outsiders, and social benefits which the environmentalists’ presence has brought.
“We now have a school with a metal roof, before we had a bamboo school,” says the chief of Yandoube village, Mark Mkoko.
Debt
But Bayanga has changed >from a village of just 200 residents in the 1980s to a boomtown of 6,000, with Lebanese shopkeepers, discotheques and Western missionaries.
Loan sharks have moved in, preying on Ba’Aka employees of the environmentalists and loggers, and some not used to having money easily fall into debt.

Age-old practices are under threat
“When the Ba’Aka get money they go out and spend it on alcohol… Sometimes in shops they don’t even know how much change to expect. We have set up a banking system for them,” said one Western employer.
Economic growth is bringing cultural changes.
Ba’Aka men have started taking several wives, a practice common among Central African men, but not previously known among the Ba’Aka.
There has been intermarriage between the newcomers and the traditional inhabitants.
Aids, which is the main cause of death among Central Africans, is now thought to be widespread in some Ba’Aka communities.
Missionaries have arrived and now some Ba’Aka go to church.
“The missionaries have told them their traditional music is tantamount to worshipping the devil,” says a Bayanga resident.
“Some of the young Ba’Aka don’t know how to collect honey… Some listen to pop music and drink alcohol. Not all change is for the better,” he adds.

From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: [ibogaine] Pygmies need protection
Date: May 9, 2004 at 4:55:28 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

DR Congo pygmies appeal to UN

The pygmies have been hunted like animals
Pygmy representatives have asked the United Nations to set up a court to try government and rebel fighters from the Democratic Republic of Congo for acts of cannibalism against their people.
Sinafasi Makelo, a representative of Mbuti pygmies, told the UN’s Indigenous People’s Forum that during the four-year civil war his people had been hunted down and eaten.
This is nothing more, nothing less, than a crime against humanity

Sinafasi Makelo
“In living memory, we have seen cruelty, massacres, and genocide, but we have never seen human beings hunted down as though they were game animals,” he said.
“Pygmies are being pursued in the forests. People have been eaten. This is nothing more, nothing less, than a crime against humanity.”
More than 600,000 pygmies are believed to live in the DR Congo’s vast forests, where they survive by hunting and gathering.
Both sides in the war regard them as “subhuman”, and some say their flesh can confer magical powers.
‘Genocide’
UN human rights activists reported this year that rebels had carried out acts of cannibalism.
Some of the worst atrocities allegedly took place when the rebel Movement for the Liberation of Congo (MLC) – which controls the northern DR Congo – tried to take the town of Mambasa from the rival Congolese Rally for Democracy last year.
Mr Makelo called on the forum to ask the UN Security Council to recognise cannibalism as a crime against humanity and an act of genocide.

The pygmies want justice
There have been allegations of cannibalism during the recent conflict between Hema and Lendu militia in the north-western Ituri region but a spokesman for the UN mission in Kinshasa said these were difficult to confirm.
At least 300 people are said to have died in the fighting.
A mass grave containing the remains of more than 30 men, women and children was found near the town of Bunia, UN officials said.
Church leaders and residents have accused Lendu militiamen of killing civilians, cutting open their chests, removing hearts, lungs and livers, and eating them.
UN investigation
Father Joseph Deneckere, a Belgian priest who has lived in the DR Congo since 1970, said that traditional superstitious beliefs, entrenched hatreds and attempts to settle old scores lay behind the atrocities, the Associated Press news agency reported.
“Some of the victims had their sexual organs missing after tribal fighters cut them off to use as charms,” he said.
Tribal fighters had also been seen wandering around the bush with human organs “draped from their weapons”.
UN officials have opened a formal investigation into the allegations.
From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 9, 2004 at 3:20:08 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi D,

Can you tell us more about yourselves. I’m very interested about what you
guys do.

all the best

Nick   www.ibogaine.co.uk

—– Original Message —–
From: “Flamboyant” <Flamboyant@ifrance.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 08, 2004 12:26 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?

Bouékayé Carla,

It’s nice to have you on the list. Are you in gabon?

Yes, we are cultural metis living in Gabon for Ever.
Thanks to care about us.

D.

___[ Pub ]____________________________________________________________
Inscrivez-vous gratuitement sur Tandaime, Le site de rencontres !
http://rencontre.rencontres.com/index.php?origine=4

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ultra-low dose naltrexone therapy
Date: May 8, 2004 at 4:26:30 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

Ultra-Low Dose Naltrexone

“Thus, ultra-low doses of naltrexone effectively prevented the decline of
morphine effect observed over 7 days and inhibited the increase in morphine ED50
value. Remarkably, naltrexone also reversed established morphine tolerance,
restoring the antinociceptive effect of morphine to 70% of the original level
and the morphine ED” — ‘Paradoxical Effects of the Opioid Antagonist Naltrexone
on Morphine Analgesia, Tolerance, and Reward In Rats’ (Powell et. al. 2001)
Ultra low dose naltrexone (ULDNTX, or ULD Naltrexone) therapy has been
developed and utilized for the reduction and maintaince of opioid tolerance at the
DTS. We present to you several pages devoted to our project, and our
recommendations as to the appropriate dosages that should be administered. It is our
belief that naltrexone is a safe and efficacious means of inhibiting the
development of opioid tolerance.
top

A Primer

It would be prudent to begin by highlighting that the use of naltrexone for
this indication is experimental and as such, there may be unexpected
consequences. Published content has been provided for educational use only and should
not be taken as an endorsement of suitability or safety of the treatment
protocol defined herein. With that taken care of, let us discuss the acquisition of
naltrexone.
Naltrexone is available in most areas of the world as a prescription only
medicine. This would, of course, mean that you must see a registered
practicitoner in order to acquire this drug. Some online pharmacies may offer naltrexone,
albeit at an inflated price. As naltrexone is inherently a very expensive drug
(a bottle of 30 x 50 mg Revia costs over $220 AUD), it may be desirable to
acquire a prescription, if one can, for an approved usage such as the treatment
of alcohol dependence. In many countries such a use is subsidised heavily by
their respective governments.
Obviously, the 50 mg tablets contain far too much naltrexone for this
purpose; In fact, even one fifth of a tablet would precipitate opioid withdrawal in
those who are dependent. The dilemma may be resolved by carefully preparing a
dilution with a known quantity of solvent (ie: preserved saline.) If all this
sounds confusing, don’t fret. The entire process is further explained elsewhere
on this page.
Once prepared, the solution must be decanted into a container and stored in a
refrigerated environment. With the preparation complete, administration may
commence. Initiation should preferrably take place at ~0.05 mg/day. Titration
should be limited to a maximum deviation of 0.03 mg/day from the recommended
dose. We have found that doses above 0.05 mg/day still produce desirable effects
– doses as high as 0.15-0.2 mg/day have been found to still slightly augment
opioid response, yet we feel that maximum efficacy is only reached at the
lower end of this envelope.
top

The Possible Benefits

Naltrexone was found to at least slow down, and even possibly inhibit the
continuation of the development of tolerance to opioid agonists. However,
naltrexone was only moderately successful in reversing opioid tolerance. In addition,
naltrexone was found to selectively and completely reverse all the negative
effects of opioid agonist use on sexual function and restore the individual’s
libido to their opioid naive state. It was found that this effect was more
prominent at lower doses of around 0.05 mg/day. A variety of mild side effects
experienced shortly after onset, including pipillary constriction and light
senstivity, dry mouth and urinary retention, appeared to be reduced or eliminated
by the ultra-low-dose naltrexone.
10998 hits since 06-Jan-2004.
Last Modified: Saturday, 10-Jan-2004 at 02:08 PM
http://dilaudid.net/uldntx.shtml

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From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 8, 2004 at 3:02:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It a pleasure to have you here! The Bwiti have arrived on Mindvox. Strangly
appropriate! 🙂

Thank you for your sacred plant, it has helped me in my life very much.
It is a honor to have you here to speak for yourselves instead of always
having someone else tell people what your culture is. No offense to Howard,
Dana and the rest.

Peace out and welcome,
Curtis

On Fri, 07 May 2004 03:03:21 -0700 D <disumba@yahoo.fr> wrote:
Sexual Healing…

His father is a woman !
Bearded, certainly, but a woman !
The mother of her lover is the Bwiti-fully good Disumba (Black Virgin)

Mamissoba.

It is not me !
She is my sister !
The Pure One is her brother.

One sees Mamissoba (Mamighoba) with the heart’s sight

So :     In Buendze or on Nzimbe.
In Mandaka or Gheliba.
That’s where we will tell you how the rebirthed kid
Ngenza
came and became quite Mamissoba.

– to be continued…
Tsengue Dibadi.

—–

Quinine Virgine et Transe Sexuelle !

Son père est une femme!
A barbe certes, mais une femme !
Et la mère de son amant, c’est la belle amère Dissumba
Celle qui aime les belles et bonnes choses.

Mamissoba.

Ce n’est pas moi
C’est donc ma soeur
Si ça nettoie, tu es mon frère !

On voit Mamissoba (Mamighoba) avec l’oeil du coeur.

Donc :      dans le Buendze comme dans le Nzimbe
dans le Mandaka comme dans le Gheliba
C’est là que nous pourrons te dire comment l’enfant
René
Ngenza
est venue et devenue petite Mamissoba.

– à suivre….
Tsengue Dibadi.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

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From: “Flamboyant” <Flamboyant@ifrance.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 8, 2004 at 7:26:08 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bouékayé Carla,

It’s nice to have you on the list. Are you in gabon?

Yes, we are cultural metis living in Gabon for Ever.
Thanks to care about us.

D.

___[ Pub ]____________________________________________________________
Inscrivez-vous gratuitement sur Tandaime, Le site de rencontres !
http://rencontre.rencontres.com/index.php?origine=4

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 7, 2004 at 8:56:08 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi, both went through!

It’s nice to have you on the list. Are you in gabon?

Carla B

— D <disumba@yahoo.fr> wrote:
Sorry second post. I don’t receive the first.

—————-
Sexual Healing…

His father is a woman !
Bearded, certainly, but a woman !
The mother of her lover is the Bwiti-fully good
Disumba (Black Virgin)

Mamissoba.

It is not me !
She is my sister !
The Pure One is her brother.

One sees Mamissoba (Mamighoba) with the heart’s
sight

So :     In Buendze or on Nzimbe.
In Mandaka or Gheliba.
That’s where we will tell you how the
rebirthed kid Ngenza
came and became quite Mamissoba.

– to be continued…
Tsengue Dibadi.

—–

Quinine Virgine et Transe Sexuelle !

Son père est une femme!
A barbe certes, mais une femme !
Et la mère de son amant, c’est la belle amère
Dissumba
Celle qui aime les belles et bonnes choses.

Mamissoba.

Ce n’est pas moi
C’est donc ma soeur
Si ça nettoie, tu es mon frère !

On voit Mamissoba (Mamighoba) avec l’oeil du coeur.

Donc :      dans le Buendze comme dans le Nzimbe
dans le Mandaka comme dans le
Gheliba
C’est là que nous pourrons te
dire comment l’enfant René
Ngenza
est venue et devenue petite
Mamissoba.

– à suivre….
Tsengue Dibadi.

/]=———————————————————————=[\

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http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

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From: D <disumba@yahoo.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 7, 2004 at 3:57:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry second post. I don’t receive the first.

—————-
Sexual Healing…

His father is a woman !
Bearded, certainly, but a woman !
The mother of her lover is the Bwiti-fully good Disumba (Black Virgin)

Mamissoba.

It is not me !
She is my sister !
The Pure One is her brother.

One sees Mamissoba (Mamighoba) with the heart’s sight

So :     In Buendze or on Nzimbe.
In Mandaka or Gheliba.
That’s where we will tell you how the rebirthed kid Ngenza
came and became quite Mamissoba.

– to be continued…
Tsengue Dibadi.

—–

Quinine Virgine et Transe Sexuelle !

Son père est une femme!
A barbe certes, mais une femme !
Et la mère de son amant, c’est la belle amère Dissumba
Celle qui aime les belles et bonnes choses.

Mamissoba.

Ce n’est pas moi
C’est donc ma soeur
Si ça nettoie, tu es mon frère !

On voit Mamissoba (Mamighoba) avec l’oeil du coeur.

Donc :      dans le Buendze comme dans le Nzimbe
dans le Mandaka comme dans le Gheliba
C’est là que nous pourrons te dire comment l’enfant René
Ngenza
est venue et devenue petite Mamissoba.

– à suivre….
Tsengue Dibadi.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine and opium tea?back at you
Date: May 7, 2004 at 3:04:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

<snip>
I don’t
see why opium tea is not available to addicts for free from the govt. as
IT IS
MORE BENIGN only because
it isn’t injected and every illegal drug gang selling heroin could be shut
down overnight
if addicts were given either opium tea or even heroin.This is obvious and
the
govt. must
know it so why continue the same failed policy.Discrimination?
Stigma?Politicians
wanting to look tough on crime?Ignorance? Claudia

In answer to your questions: Yes, yes, yes, and yes.

You have to remember that the main reason drugs were made illegal in the
US in the first place was to control and subvert immigrant populations…
opium for the Chinese, marijuana for the Mexicans, etc. Early last
century, the Chinese did a very good job of establishing themselves as a
major part of the industrial workforce, as the Mexicans did with the
agricultural workforce. Then came the Great Depression, and with the
scarcity of jobs around, white people needed an excuse to lock up the
Chinese and the Mexicans so they could take their jobs.

On top of that, alcohol prohibition had just ended, so you had all these
policemen who would have been out of work if they didn’t find other drugs
to demonise…

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: D <disumba@yahoo.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 7, 2004 at 6:03:21 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sexual Healing…

His father is a woman !
Bearded, certainly, but a woman !
The mother of her lover is the Bwiti-fully good Disumba (Black Virgin)

Mamissoba.

It is not me !
She is my sister !
The Pure One is her brother.

One sees Mamissoba (Mamighoba) with the heart’s sight

So :     In Buendze or on Nzimbe.
In Mandaka or Gheliba.
That’s where we will tell you how the rebirthed kid Ngenza
came and became quite Mamissoba.

– to be continued…
Tsengue Dibadi.

—–

Quinine Virgine et Transe Sexuelle !

Son père est une femme!
A barbe certes, mais une femme !
Et la mère de son amant, c’est la belle amère Dissumba
Celle qui aime les belles et bonnes choses.

Mamissoba.

Ce n’est pas moi
C’est donc ma soeur
Si ça nettoie, tu es mon frère !

On voit Mamissoba (Mamighoba) avec l’oeil du coeur.

Donc :      dans le Buendze comme dans le Nzimbe
dans le Mandaka comme dans le Gheliba
C’est là que nous pourrons te dire comment l’enfant René
Ngenza
est venue et devenue petite Mamissoba.

– à suivre….
Tsengue Dibadi.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: “Paul MacLennan” <leisure1@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: TesT
Date: May 6, 2004 at 7:35:57 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

or at least some anals.

Nah, its cool. Funny and real and quite profound,

—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, May 07, 2004 3:14 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: TesT

Is a fuckingveryrathergoodoknotbadpassablepoorcrappyterrible

actually FANTASTIC poemletternotemessagefuckup<

This is a GREAT poem…I love it…I think it should go in some annals
somewhere.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Paul MacLennan
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2004 8:36 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: TesT

This….

Ahum … I would … like to take this moment, to read a p0em I wroted.
It is about melting universes, the top 1001 reasons I love heroin, and my
erection.

No, wait, nevermind.  I don’t get one of those when I dismantle brains.
That was a typo.  Shut up John.

not mE

Is a fuckingveryrathergoodoknotbadpassablepoorcrappyterrible

actually FANTASTIC poemletternotemessagefuckup

& i love it

Thanx patriCK even if its Not u

—– Original Message —–
From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@wiretap.com>
To: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Cc: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <digital@mindvox.com>; <root@phantom.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 4:48 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: TesT

On [Wed, May 05, 2004 at 12:53:26PM -0400], [Patrick K. Kroupa] wrote:

| bl1p

Ahum … I would … like to take this moment, to read a p0em I wroted.
It is about melting universes, the top 1001 reasons I love heroin, and
my
erection.

No, wait, nevermind.  I don’t get one of those when I dismantle brains.
That was a typo.  Shut up John.

not mE

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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] I meant…
Date: May 6, 2004 at 6:27:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

choking on a pretzel. Sorry.

d

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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Behind “Chocking on a Pretzel”
Date: May 6, 2004 at 6:05:15 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: walter storch <tbrnews@hotmail.com>
To: gear2000@lightspeed.net
Subject:    RE: Bush malady temporal lobe epilepsy ?
Date:    May 4, 2004 4:30 PM
Dear Mr. Williams:

TBR stands for The Barnes Review. This is a historical magazine. I started
this site to promote their historical books, but have branched out into
current history.

We have a source in the White House. Unsolicited. He is a reporter assigned
thereunto. If I give you his name, he will be toast. Every two or three
days, he sends me a page or two of high level gossip. Much of this I post.
We have had a livid screech from the White House about this. Sorry. I will
pray for them.

The Royal Malady could be Korsakoff’s Psychosis but we would have to scratch
the bottom of the Imperial foot to see the reaction. Could be Alzheimer’s
Disease. Could be tremporal lobe epilepsy or several other things. Bush was
a major league “substance abuser” when younger and having treated a number
of these earlier on in my life, I can attest that parts of their brains get
fried.

Not a professional diagnosis but so what?

That Bush has serious neurological problems should be obvious to anyone but
a frenzied religious zealot or a Republican intent on four more years of
proto-fascism. I number among my friends, several very well known
neuroligists and they have all said, watching Bush on television, that he
has a serius neurological problem. One agreed that it might be Alzheimer’s
while another held out for permanent, drug induced brain damage. One is a
Republican and the other a Democrat so partisan politics doesn’t seem to
play a part in their views.

What we have in command is a rather stupid person, and a dry drunk if you
will, who has had some kind of religious “conversion” (he fell off his couch
on the way to the lavatory and had a vision) to carry him along and this is
coupled with an obvious but undiagnosed neurological problem that manifests
itself with symptoms as noted. All of this contained in a frenzied religious
matrix.

I have had experience with these, too, and religious mania is not a
pleasant thing to deal with. Many who indluge in religious frenzies lose
bowel and bladder control.

I have no problem with our heroic Christian president being a religious man.
Carter was such a person and while I tended to view him as a bit of a prude,
nevertheless, Jimmy did not try to shove his beliefs down the throats of his
fellow Americans. This one does.

What is going on now in Iraq was completely predictable. I talked about
torture of Iraqi pows some long months ago but no one cared then. Now we
have some homoerotic snapshots floating around and suddenly the press has
discovered that the current military contains ghetto sweepings with no
discipline. We have the edifying spectacle of high ranking military
officials pointing at each other. Feces always flows downhill so a few
grunts will be gigged and the persons in command who are responsible will
get a nice job in Hawaii to keep them out of the public eye. Torture of
Prisoners of War is a clear-cut violation of the Geneva Convention to which
the United States was a signator.

I regret to say that the end in Iraq is entirely predictable. We will not
lose there…we already have. Think of the situation of the apolitical
German who did not support Hitler and you can see what direction foreign
public opinion is taking vis a vis Americans.

Bush suffers, among other things, from advanced hubris.

Woodrow Wilson had a similar problem but God solved it by giving him a
stroke in 1919 that removed him from command. Then all we had to contend
with was his wife and doctor running the country like a little girl’s tea
party with stuffed rabbits.

If you have any more questions, don’t hesitate to send them on.

Regards,

Walter Storch

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 6, 2004 at 1:51:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Unless the government has a HARD COPY of the work in question, printed on
REAL paper, AND you have a HARD COPY of the copyright registration on REAL
paper, for all intents and purposes, you DO NOT have a copyright.

In more detail:

http://copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html#hsc

HOW TO SECURE A COPYRIGHT
Copyright Secured Automatically upon Creation
The way in which copyright protection is secured is frequently
misunderstood. No publication or registration or other action in
the Copyright Office is required to secure copyright. (See following
Note.) There are, however, certain definite advantages to registration.
See “Copyright Registration.”

COPYRIGHT REGISTRATION
In general, copyright registration is a legal formality intended to
make a public record of the basic facts of a particular copyright.
However, registration is not a condition of copyright protection.
Even though registration is not a requirement for protection, the
copyright law provides several inducements or advantages to encourage
copyright owners to make registration. Among these advantages are the
following:

– Registration establishes a public record of the copyright claim.

– Before an infringement suit may be filed in court, registration
is necessary for works of U. S. origin.

– If made before or within 5 years of publication, registration
will establish prima facie evidence in court of the validity
of the copyright and of the facts stated in the certificate.

– If registration is made within 3 months after publication of
the work or prior to an infringement of the work, statutory
damages and attorney’s fees will be available to the copyright
owner in court actions. Otherwise, only an award of actual
damages and profits is available to the copyright owner.

– Registration allows the owner of the copyright to record the
registration with the U. S. Customs Service for protection against
the importation of infringing copies. For additional information,
request Publication No. 563 “How to Protect Your Intellectual
Property Right,” from: U.S. Customs Service, P.O. Box 7404,
Washington, D.C. 20044. See the U.S. Customs Service Website
at www.customs.gov for online publications.

Bill

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 6, 2004 at 11:35:01 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In the United States alone, someone checks their email every three
seconds… Steven Anker
Curtis, Bill and Patrick…

I would just feel easier posting (and infinitely more funny) if I knew my
shit would not go on national sites, I understand what you are saying, but
what is wrong with some sort of statement that what is written for the
list
stays on the list? We are also talking about very sensitive and personal
topics and I feel that not just me, but others would be more open about
their addictions and their hopes for staying clean without the threat of
personal information being plastered everywhere. I refuse to be anonymous,
yet I do feel the list should be somewhat confidential. Isn’t the point to
help people? And would people be more open and therefore helpful if there
was not this threat of exposure? You have to understand Dana’s postings
hurt
me professionally in many ways, when I get hired I’m in charge of millions
of dollars – and whatever people may say drug addicts are the scum of
society and are not trusted and hated.
<snip>

Working in the industry that (i think) you do (i vaguely remember hearing
that you work in TV or something), I would think you’d know the copyright
laws well enough to know that putting “Copyright 2004” at the end of an
email does virtually nothing to legally protect you.

To prove in court that you hold a copyright to something, you can’t just
slap a copyright label on it and think you’re good. You have to send a
HARD COPY of the work in question to the US Copyright Office.

Unless the government has a HARD COPY of the work in question, printed on
REAL paper, AND you have a HARD COPY of the copyright registration on REAL
paper, for all intents and purposes, you DO NOT have a copyright. If you
try to take someone to court for copyright violation on the basis of an
electronic “copyright”, the judge will dismiss the case, and probably
laugh at you a bit as well.

So please, give it a rest. If you are that concerned about other people
reprinting what you write, you have three options… either A> print out
every email you send, fill out the copyright registration forms, and send
it in to the copyright office; B> log on under an alias, as many people on
this list do; or C> be more selective about what you choose to post to a
public forum.

In either case, please stop whining to Patrick about it, as there ain’t
shit he can do.

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: [ibogaine] [Fwd: [DIV28] The Third National Clinical Conference on Cannabis Therapeutics]
Date: May 6, 2004 at 11:25:38 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I tried sending this a few days ago, but i think it got eaten by the
Mindvox internet gremlins…. =)

—————————- Original Message —————————-
Subject: [DIV28] The Third National Clinical Conference on Cannabis
Date:    Mon, May 3, 2004 7:21 pm
To:      DIV28@LISTS.APA.ORG
————————————————————————–

The Third National Clinical Conference on Cannabis Therapeutics
May 20-22, 2004 in Charlottesville,
VA
at The Omni Charlottesville Hotel
Presented by Patients Out of
Time
The Office of Continuing Medical
Education of the University of Virginia’s Health System will sponsor the
conference.
Co-presenters are the University of
Virginia School of Nursing, the Pain Management Center, Department of
Anesthesiology, the University of Virginia School of Medicine, the
Virginia Nurses Association and the University of Virginia School of Law.
The conference theme, “Cannabis Use
Throughout the Life Span”
Topics that will be examined and discussed by researchers and clinicians
from the United States, Canada, The Netherlands, Israel and the United
Kingdom.

Childhood use for behavioral problems
General pediatric applications
Use during pregnancy
Dependence and addiction risk
Traumatic brain injury treatment
Pain, movement disorder and other symptomatic treatments
Delivery modalities
Clinical trial reports
Hospice use and other medical and legal issues will all be addressed.

Registration and Conference Brochure available at:

Home


The Faculty:
Donald Abrams, MD.
Professor of Clinical Medicine and Head, Hematology-Oncology
Section, University of California, San Francisco.
David Bearman, MD.
Practicing Physician, Santa Barbara, CA.
Richard Bonnie, JD.
John S. Battle Professor of Law, University of Virginia School of
Law, Charlottesville. Planning Committee. Board of Advisors, Patients Out
of Time.
Al Byrne, Lcdr, USN,
(ret.). Co-founder, Secretary-Treasurer, Patients Out of Time,
Howardsville,VA. Planning Committee.
Valerie Corral.
Director,Wo/Men’s Alliance for Medical Marijuana, Santa Cruz,
CA.
Melanie Dreher, RN,
PhD, FAAN. Kelting Dean and Professor, College of Nursing,
University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA. Director, Patients Out of Time.
Jon Gettman, PhD.
Senior Fellow, George Mason University, Fairfax,VA. Planning
Committee.
Geoffrey Guy, MD.
Founder and Executive Chairman,GW Pharmaceuticals, plc.
Salisbury,Wiltshire, United Kingdom.
Debbie Jeffries.
Mother of ADHD Patient. Co-author, “Jeffrey’s Journey,” Rocklin,
CA.
Christopher Largen.
Co-author, Prescription Pot, Austin, TX.
Philippe Lucas.
Founder and Director Vancouver Island Compassion Society and
Director, Canadians for Safe Access.
Mary Lynn Mathre,
RN, MSN, CARN. Co-founder, President, Patients Out of Time,
Howardsville,VA.
Planning Committee.
Billy R. Martin,
PhD. Chair, Department of Pharmacology and Toxicity, Health
Science Center,Virginia Commonwealth University, Richmond.
Ann McCormick.
Mother of Childhood Cancer Survivor, Todd McCormick, Pawtucket,
RI.
George McMahon.
Federal Cannabis Patient, Frankston, TX. Director, Patients Out of Time.
Raphael Mechoulam,
PhD. Lionel Jacobson Professor of Medicinal Chemistry Endowed
Chair, Hebrew University, Jerusalem, Israel.
Robert Melamede,PhD.
Associate Professor and Biology Chairman, Biology Department,
University of Colorado, Colorado Springs.
Jim Miller.
Spouse of Cannabis MS Patient.
Richard Musty, PhD.
Professor of Psychology, University of Vermont, Burlington.
Mae Nutt.
Mother of Cancer Patient, Midland,MI. Director, Patients Out of
Time.
Thomas O’Connell,
MD. Practicing Physician, San Mateo, CA.
Denis Petro, MD.
Consulting Neurologist. Chief of Neurology, Malcom Grow Medical,
Andrews Air Force Base,VA. Director, Patients Out of Time.
Irvin Rosenfeld.
Federal Cannabis Patient, Lauderhill, FL. National Spokesperson,
Patients Out of Time.
John Rowlingson, MD.
Director, Pain Management Center, Department of Anesthesiology,
University of Virginia School of Medicine. Planning Committee. Board of
Advisors, Patients Out of Time.
Ethan Russo, MD.
Practicing Neurologist, Missoula, MT. Editor, Journal of
Cannabis Therapeutics. Board of Advisors, Patients Out of Time.
Juan Sanchez-Ramos,
PhD, MD. Professor of Neurology, Helen Ellis Endowed Chair.
Director of Movement Disorders, University of South Florida, Miami. Board
of Advisors, Patients Out of Time.
Patricia Skidmore,
RN, MSN, HNC. Mother of AIDS Patient, Practicing Nurse, New
Market, MD.
Audra Stinchcomb,
PhD. Assistant Professor, College of Pharmacy, University of
Kentucky.
Willem Scholten,
PharmD, MPA. Head, Office of Medical Cannabis, Ministry of
Health,Welfare and Sports, The Netherlands.
Arnold Trebach, PhD,
JD. Professor Emeritus,American University. President, The Trebach
Institute. Chair, Board of Advisors, International Antiprohibitionist
League. Founder and Past President, The Drug Policy Foundation.
Mark Ware, MSc,
MRCP. Practicing Physician, Assistant Professor of Anesthesia,
McGill University, Canada. Board of Advisors, Patients Out of Time.
Sandra P.Welch, PhD.
Professor of Pharmacology and Toxicology,Virginia Commonwealth
University, Richmond.
The Conference Agenda
Thursday, May 20
7:00pm Reception and Exhibits
Friday, May 21
7:30 Registration/Continental Breakfast
8:00 Opening Remarks, Byrne
8:10 The Cannabinoid System in Neuroprotection, Mechoulam,
PhD
9:00 Holistic Biochemistry: 600 Million Years of Cannabinoids,
Melamede, PhD
9:30 Overview of Cannabis Use and Pregnancy, Dreher PhD, RN
9:50 Break
10:10 A Cannabis Kid, Largen
10:30 Mothers Know Best, Nutt, Jeffries, Skidmore, McCormick
11:10 Pediatrics and Cannabis, Russo,MD
12:00 Lunch Buffet: Sublingual Dosage in the UK,
Guy, MD
1:30 Chronic Cannabis Use: An Opportunistic Study, O’Connell,
MD
1:50 Cannabis Efficacy in Treating ADD & ADHD,
Bearman,MD
2:10 Risk of Dependence, Martin, PhD & Dreher, PhD
3:00 Break
3:20 Risks and Benefits of Cannabis Products, Mathre, RN
3:50 Interactions Between Opiates and Cannabinoids, Welch,
PhD
4:20 U.S. Federal Patients and Pain, Rosenfeld, McMahon
4:40 Transdermal Cannabinoids, Stinchcomb, PhD
5:00 Adjourn for the day
6:30 Patients Out of Time’s Benefit Dinner
Live Entertainment and Auction
Saturday, May 22
7:30 Continental Breakfast
8:00 Opening Remarks, Byrne
8:10 Therapeutic Cannabis in The Netherlands, Scholten,
PharmD
8:50 British Columbia Patient Surveys, Lucas
9:20 Cannabis Research in Canada,Ware, MSc, MRCP
10:00 Break
10:20 Multiple Sclerosis and Cannabis, Petro, MD & Miller
10:50 Cannabis and Pain: Ongoing Clinical Trials, Abrams, MD
11:20 Psychological & Physical Health in Long-term Cannabis
Users, Musty, PhD
11:50 Movement Disorders and Cannabis, Sanchez-Ramos, PhD,
MD
12:15 Lunch (not provided)
1:15 Cannabis Use in a Hospice, Corral
1:45 DEA Rescheduling Petition Report, Gettman, PhD
2:15 A Humane Drug Control System, Trebach, PhD, JD
2:45 Break
3:00 Medical Ethics and Cannabis Prohibition, Bonnie, JD
3:30 Q&A Session, All Presenters
4:50 Closing & Evaluation

___________________________________________________________
APA division of psychopharmacology and substance abuse
div28@lists.apa.org        http://www.apa.org/divisions/div28
enough? send: ” SIGNOFF DIV28 ”    to    listserv@lists.apa.org
1 summary/day? “SET DIV28 DIGEST” .. Vacation?  “… NOMAIL”
___________________________________________________________

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From: “jon” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: fucking kill the q-supervise shit already (re: which slice?)
Date: May 6, 2004 at 11:22:00 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Uhm …
HeRro.  There are a LOT of you here…  Go figure.  As of yesterday
everything appears to be load-balanced, recompiled, and FLYING out of
everything, once more…
Everything that went in or out of here for the last coupla daze prior to
that.  Well … it may escape, it might not, it could very well spend the
next few days trying to wade out of the swamp that is the former
mailsystem.

We just tossed it altogether and recompiled with way, way, way higher
limits.

There are … a lot of you here.  What the hell is wrong with you anyway?

Just testing.

I need a lotta coffee.

Patrick

core dumped – going down on signal 15

Of course, you know the solution to all your problems is rm -rf /

=)

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: TesT
Date: May 6, 2004 at 11:14:27 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is a fuckingveryrathergoodoknotbadpassablepoorcrappyterrible

actually FANTASTIC poemletternotemessagefuckup<

This is a GREAT poem…I love it…I think it should go in some annals
somewhere.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Paul MacLennan
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2004 8:36 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: TesT

This….

Ahum … I would … like to take this moment, to read a p0em I wroted.
It is about melting universes, the top 1001 reasons I love heroin, and my
erection.

No, wait, nevermind.  I don’t get one of those when I dismantle brains.
That was a typo.  Shut up John.

not mE

Is a fuckingveryrathergoodoknotbadpassablepoorcrappyterrible

actually FANTASTIC poemletternotemessagefuckup

& i love it

Thanx patriCK even if its Not u

—– Original Message —–
From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@wiretap.com>
To: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Cc: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <digital@mindvox.com>; <root@phantom.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 4:48 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: TesT

On [Wed, May 05, 2004 at 12:53:26PM -0400], [Patrick K. Kroupa] wrote:

| bl1p

Ahum … I would … like to take this moment, to read a p0em I wroted.
It is about melting universes, the top 1001 reasons I love heroin, and my
erection.

No, wait, nevermind.  I don’t get one of those when I dismantle brains.
That was a typo.  Shut up John.

not mE

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From: “Paul MacLennan” <leisure1@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: TesT
Date: May 5, 2004 at 8:36:36 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This….

Ahum … I would … like to take this moment, to read a p0em I wroted.
It is about melting universes, the top 1001 reasons I love heroin, and my
erection.

No, wait, nevermind.  I don’t get one of those when I dismantle brains.
That was a typo.  Shut up John.

not mE

Is a fuckingveryrathergoodoknotbadpassablepoorcrappyterrible

actually FANTASTIC poemletternotemessagefuckup

& i love it

Thanx patriCK even if its Not u

—– Original Message —–
From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@wiretap.com>
To: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Cc: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <digital@mindvox.com>; <root@phantom.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 06, 2004 4:48 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: TesT

> On [Wed, May 05, 2004 at 12:53:26PM -0400], [Patrick K. Kroupa] wrote:
>
> | bl1p
>
> Ahum … I would … like to take this moment, to read a p0em I wroted.
> It is about melting universes, the top 1001 reasons I love heroin, and my
> erection.
>
> No, wait, nevermind.  I don’t get one of those when I dismantle brains.
> That was a typo.  Shut up John.
>
> not mE
>
>
>   /]=———————————————————————=[\
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>
>

From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 6, 2004 at 9:05:29 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am sorry if you felt my statements were obnoxious for I did not intend them to be perceived as such. The point though is There are always messages as such and this is a WEB-SITE, not therapy. There is not meant to be any ‘real’ privacy or secrecy. This is a place to share all data and info re: a subject. If you wish to further discuss this, I would be more than happy to.

From: Laurent Sazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 6, 2003 at 5:29:21 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Le 5/05/04 20:38, « Nick Sandberg » <nick227@tiscali.co.uk> a écrit :

—– Original Message —–
From: “Laurent Sazy” <laurentsazy@free.fr>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 10:14 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?

Le 2/05/04 15:43, « Wilderness Lover » <northstar@onewest.net> a écrit :

Greetings!

My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.

We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously
invited
to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like
to
go farther and get the full scale initiation.

Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such as
Easter).
I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few
tourists?
Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
doesn’t work out?

I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel tips
you folks might have.

Many Thanks,

Chris

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Dear Chris,

You can also visit bwiti.com
It is Mallendi Nganga web site.

Hi Laurent,

I checked this site but it came up that it didn’t exist. Is it the right
url.

Thanks for all your energy and knowledge

all the best

Nick

He will be in june -july in Gabon Near
Tchibanga city in south Gabon. He is doing Ngenza and Missoko-ngonde
initiation. Price is about 1200 euros for a full initiation Iboga and Edika
ceremony. I did myself.
I have publish a photo book “Ngenza, the knowledge ceremony”
Mallendi publish also a book guide with french writer Vincent ravalec about
initiation and ceremony, iboga&bwiti and ibogaine.
Sorry, books are in french for now maybe translate later….
If you need more information……..

Good luck
Laurent

If you need more information about me

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Dear Nick,

I don’t know what happens with Mallendi web site.
He is in Gabon for the Week.
I think it will work next week.

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From: Laurent Sazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 6, 2003 at 5:23:37 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Le 6/05/04 0:00, « D » <disumba@yahoo.fr> a écrit :

Dear Laurent,

You speak about Ngenza but you don’t know anything about him.
What’s NGENZA please ? The new name is Mamissoba ? Do you understand ?

You speak about Mallende/Mallendi but you don’t know anything about him.
Is he a master ? I can explain you that only masters could give Iboga in the
ritual.
You speak a ‘full initiation’ but what do you want to say ?

About ‘yours pictures’ please don’t forget to pay them or the actors and
owners 🙁
Africans are always on earth even if you only think of earning money 🙁
———–

Chris,
Initiation arrives only twice in a life, the day of the iboga and the

day of death.  I believe that it is enough important to be very

careful.

———–

Sorry for my very pitiful English and all my wishes with one of the readers
and soon on our lines for another. (oui, j’y suis)

———–

Issambo – from Gabon.

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Bokayé Issambo

Moi j’ai pas la pretention de m’appeler Dissumba pour mon E-mail. D’abord
c’est toi Dissumba ?
Si tu veux qu’on parle de Ngenza on peut en parler. C’est mon père dans le
Mangongo.
Quand a Mamissoba, jamais entendu parler. J’étais encore dans un buenze fin
fevrier et on est toujours dans le Ngenza.
Quand à mallendi, je le vois toute les semaines depuis 4ans.
Toi peut tu me dire qui est le Ngenza, ou est il arrivé quand et à quelle
occasion , qui a danser le premier,et qui a chanté la 1ere chanson….etc

Bokayé Issambo  (hello Issambo)

Me I don’t have the prétention to use for my e-mail, the name of “Dissumba”.
Are you Dissumba ?
If you want we can talk about the Ngenza. He is my father in the Mangongo
ritual!!
About Mamissoba, never heard .I was still in a “buenze”(private place for
talk for men in the Bwiti) in february 2004 and we were still in the Ngenza.
About mallendi, I know him since April 2000 and I saw him every week.
You want to meet him? He is a master !
Could you tell me who is the Ngenza, where and when did he arrive, in which
occasion, who dance the first, who sing the first…etc

If I did a book about the “Ngenza, the knowledge ceremony”, I can explain
all pages of the book!
And also I have autorisation From Ehoumou, Le Grand Itsa Manga.
Do you think It is possible to do photos without autorisation in the Bwiti?
And without be a Nganga!(in formation)

Kombo: KA

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From: “Bill Danielson” <danielsonw@charter.net>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 6, 2004 at 3:58:25 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Me too.  I followed the directions and want out as well.  I liked the
Alzheimer’s test though…

Bill Danielson
509-528-5144
http://webpages.charter.net/wdanielson

—–Original Message—–
From: BOBBYBREZZ@aol.com [mailto:BOBBYBREZZ@aol.com]
Sent: Wednesday, May 05, 2004 7:32 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy

I just want to have my email address removed from the list so
I can stop receiving all these emails. I’ve been trying to
locate where I can do this but I’ve been unsuccessful.
Please help.  You could remove me yourself if it’s not too
much trouble.  My email address is bobbybrezz@aol.com

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From: BOBBYBREZZ@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 5, 2004 at 10:32:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I just want to have my email address removed from the list so I can stop receiving all these emails.
I’ve been trying to locate where I can do this but I’ve been unsuccessful.  Please help.  You could remove me yourself if it’s not too much trouble.  My email address is bobbybrezz@aol.com

From: BOBBYBREZZ@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 5, 2004 at 10:26:41 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Please tell me what I need to do to take my email address of this list.

From: BOBBYBREZZ@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 5, 2004 at 10:10:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Please remove my email address, bobbybrezz@aol.com, from the list.  I no longer want to receive the ibogaine emails.

Thank you,

Bob

From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Fwd: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 5, 2004 at 9:25:19 PM EDT
To: digital@mindvox.com

—– Forwarded message from D <disumba@yahoo.fr> —–
Dear Laurent,

You speak about Ngenza but you don’t know anything about him.
What’s NGENZA please ? The new name is Mamissoba ? Do you understand
?

You speak about Mallende/Mallendi but you don’t know anything about him.
Is he a master ? I can explain you that only masters could give Iboga
in the
ritual.
You speak a ‘full initiation’ but what do you want to say ?

About ‘yours pictures’ please don’t forget to pay them or the actors
and
owners 🙁
Africans are always on earth even if you only think of earning money
🙁
———–

Chris,
Initiation arrives only twice in a life, the day of the iboga and the

day of death.  I believe that it is enough important to be very

careful.

———–

Sorry for my very pitiful English and all my wishes with one of the readers
and soon on our lines for another. (oui, j’y suis)

———–

Issambo – from Gabon.

/]=—————————————————————-
—–=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com
<)[%]
\]=—————————————————————-
—–=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
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From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 5, 2004 at 7:42:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This was a very obnoxious message and not very helpful
to anyone. I don’t know who you are and welcome to the
list if you haven’t been here long or hello if you’ve
never posted, but Steven is a really nice guy who
posts interesting messages and helpful ones. I don’t
think it’s right for someone to go off like that for
no reason.

I think all of this is about Dana Beal reprinting
Steven’s messages about CSI and putting them into the
John Kerry site. I agree with everything Steven said
which means that mostly I know this list isn’t private
and I’m sure we could ask Patrick to make a private
one, hi Patrick and thank you for all this! But it
feels more private because it’s mail, you have to find
the archives somehow and most people don’t know how,
it’s different somehow then putting it on the web and
letting anyone read it. I feel much more comfortable
here and yes I know privacy isn’t real but I like the
feeling I get here.

The whole problem I think is Dana being Dana and no
matter if there is a line written at the bottom that
each author has the rights to their own message, I
somehow don’t think it’s going to stop Dana. I don’t
know if Dana ever listens to anyone or if asking to
stop doing what he does will have any effect at all
🙁

Dana, could you agree to not reprint people’s messages
from this list if they ask you not to?

Carla B

— Sapphirestardus@aol.com wrote:
To all of those who wish PRIVACY re: their use and
consumption of God’s
Gifts: Don’t write on a site! GET IT? Keep it to
yourselves if you don’t have the
balls and strength to be open and proud about
yourself and what you do! If you
want secrecy, go to a psychologist or psychiatrist.
Go to a priest! All of
them will keep their mouths shut…..they have to by
law!!! Sites are not about
that. They are about sharing information with others
who are interested in the
same thing(s). SO STOP WHINING AND WASTING VALUABLE
“AIR” TIME WITH YOUR
CRYING!!!!!!!

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

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From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 5, 2004 at 3:38:33 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Laurent Sazy” <laurentsazy@free.fr>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 03, 2003 10:14 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?

Le 2/05/04 15:43, « Wilderness Lover » <northstar@onewest.net> a écrit :

Greetings!

My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.

We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously
invited
to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like
to
go farther and get the full scale initiation.

Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such as
Easter).
I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few
tourists?
Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
doesn’t work out?

I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel tips
you folks might have.

Many Thanks,

Chris

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Dear Chris,

You can also visit bwiti.com
It is Mallendi Nganga web site.

Hi Laurent,

I checked this site but it came up that it didn’t exist. Is it the right
url.

Thanks for all your energy and knowledge

all the best

Nick

He will be in june -july in Gabon Near
Tchibanga city in south Gabon. He is doing Ngenza and Missoko-ngonde
initiation. Price is about 1200 euros for a full initiation Iboga and Edika
ceremony. I did myself.
I have publish a photo book “Ngenza, the knowledge ceremony”
Mallendi publish also a book guide with french writer Vincent ravalec about
initiation and ceremony, iboga&bwiti and ibogaine.
Sorry, books are in french for now maybe translate later….
If you need more information……..

Good luck
Laurent

If you need more information about me

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From: Sapphirestardus@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 5, 2004 at 2:44:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

To all of those who wish PRIVACY re: their use and consumption of God’s Gifts: Don’t write on a site! GET IT? Keep it to yourselves if you don’t have the balls and strength to be open and proud about yourself and what you do! If you want secrecy, go to a psychologist or psychiatrist. Go to a priest! All of them will keep their mouths shut…..they have to by law!!! Sites are not about that. They are about sharing information with others who are interested in the same thing(s). SO STOP WHINING AND WASTING VALUABLE “AIR” TIME WITH YOUR CRYING!!!!!!!

From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fwd: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:57:29 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

sorry all………..as soon as i tried callies “f” test………..my puter went bonkers sendin out replys.
fuk aol
hey patrick………….can i get an address @phantom.com? i’ll dump these nazis.
luv
marcus

From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fwd: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:47:41 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fwd: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:47:29 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fwd: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:47:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fwd: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:47:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Fwd: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:47:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:46:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I would just feel easier posting (and infinitely more funny) if I knew my
shit would not go on national sites, I understand what you are saying, but
what is wrong with some sort of statement that what is written for the list
stays on the list? We are also talking about very sensitive and personal
topics and I feel that not just me, but others would be more open about
their addictions and their hopes for staying clean without the threat of
personal information being plastered everywhere.

I think that a toothless order not to propagate postings would
lead to a false sense of security.

I refuse to be anonymous,
yet I do feel the list should be somewhat confidential.

This could happen on a list where the membership was closed to
just anyone joining, but even then it would not be 100% ‘safe’.

It’s simple – I ain’t posting anything else until I feel a little more
comfortable and I will never use some cute name to hide who I am. I think
the list would be better if people would be open as to who they are and did
not feel the threat of exposure. What’s wrong with simple rules?

They do not solve the basic problem. People who think they
are above rules (believe me, there are a few on the net 🙂
will do what they want.

Bill

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Fwd: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:12:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Callie
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [vox] Alzheimers test
Date: May 5, 2004 at 12:56:08 PM EDT
To: vox@mindvox.com
Reply-To: vox@mindvox.com

Alzheimer’s Test-

Count the “F’s” in the following text:

FINISHED FILES ARE THE RE-
SULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTIF-
IC STUDY COMBINED WITH THE
EXPERIENCE OF YEARS… (see below)

Managed it ?
Scroll down only after you have counted them, okay?
Do you think there are three?
Wrong, there are 6 !!–no joke.
Read it again.
The reasoning behind it is further down.

The brain cannot process “OF”.
Incredible or what ? Go back and look again!!
Anyone who counts all 6 “F’s” on the first go is a genius.
Three is normal, four is quite rare.

Send this to your friends-it drives them crazy

Callie

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From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Copyright and privacy
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:00:26 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Curtis, Bill and Patrick…

I would just feel easier posting (and infinitely more funny) if I knew my shit would not go on national sites, I understand what you are saying, but what is wrong with some sort of statement that what is written for the list stays on the list? We are also talking about very sensitive and personal topics and I feel that not just me, but others would be more open about their addictions and their hopes for staying clean without the threat of personal information being plastered everywhere. I refuse to be anonymous, yet I do feel the list should be somewhat confidential. Isn’t the point to help people? And would people be more open and therefore helpful if there was not this threat of exposure? You have to understand Dana’s postings hurt me professionally in many ways, when I get hired I’m in charge of millions of dollars – and whatever people may say drug addicts are the scum of society and are not trusted and hated.

It’s simple – I ain’t posting anything else until I feel a little more comfortable and I will never use some cute name to hide who I am. I think the list would be better if people would be open as to who they are and did not feel the threat of exposure. What’s wrong with simple rules?

I think it would be great if we could all post openly and I would love to have the picture gallery on mindvox contain pictures of all the frequent contributors so we all know each other a little better.

I have simple goals in life: avoid excessive time in court or prison and to not die in a hospital. So it’s easy… Also, what is so tough about asking permission to use someone’s writing? I wouldn’t just take something you wrote and plaster all over the world. Manners are important.

One thing I would go to court for is to challenge the religious freedom of being a Bwiti in the states. This is a country founded on religious freedom and I think the only way iboga will ever be allowed is in a religious context. It is older that Christianity and the music and dancing is better so why not?

Oh yeah, to Mr. Sazy, your sweeping comments are typical of the arrogance of a colonial power. Really? All Bwiti believe that weed is mother? All Nganga’s like booze and smoking? This is really true? Or perhaps Mr. Mallende believes so, but is that true for all? How come the ones I talked with said no? They must be wrong I guess. Glad the French never are. Isn’t Mallande the one who does initiations in France as well. 27 initiates at one time I heard. McDonald’s would be impressed.

Best,

Steve

Copyright 2004, Steven Anker, all rights reserved

Putting that on every time seems silly.

From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: Tue,  4 May 2004 18:04:18 -0700

Bro, Bill wrote what I was going to say. I know that you were mad that
Dana reposted your posts into the Kerry site but why don’t you just put
a

Copyright 2004, Steven Anker, all rights reserved

At the start of your msg?

If patrick adds a notice into every page it will be annoying and accomplish
nothing more. If mostly what I get the feeling you want is for Dana to
not reprint your posts everywhere or for anyone else to either, it will
accomplish the same thing. Dana will ignore it and keep doing it.

Patrick please no paragraphs of copyright. It would be annoying and legally
not make much more difference.

Peace out,
Curtis

On Tue, 04 May 2004 12:37:07 -0700 Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu> wrote:
>> Patrick, when the fuck are you going to put a copyright notice
>on this site?
>> What I write is mine, and I’d really love to share more, but with
>the threat
>> of being plastered over the net, well…
>
>Copyright notice is not needed. From the US Copyright Office:
>
>    When is my work protected?
>    Your work is under copyright protection the moment it is created
>>
>    and fixed in a tangible form that it is perceptible either directly
>>
>    or with the aid of a machine or device.
>
>    http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html
>
>In any case, you could include your own copyright notice in
>whatever you write.
>
>Bill
>
>

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: fucking kill the q-supervise shit already (re: which slice?)
Date: May 5, 2004 at 1:06:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Tue, May 04, 2004 at 03:52:19PM -0400], [Evan Baer] wrote:

| Its all good. We’re at better than all good. It’s flying.
|
| I’m not sure about the older queue though, its enourmous – a du in
| /space3/qmail2/queue takes several mins to complete.  We’ll need to
| sort out
| how best to run qmail-send to work that queue down as well, without
| interfering in current (seemingly decent) qmail running.
| It is fucking enormous. tail -f the log, even with double bounce cut
| and spam tossed, nothing was realtime until yesterday.
| This feels like running a ISP again. I need a drink.
| On May 4, 2004, at 3:28 PM, Patrick K. Kroupa wrote:
|
| >doing 1001 things, bback.

Uhm …

HeRro.  There are a LOT of you here…  Go figure.  As of yesterday
everything appears to be load-balanced, recompiled, and FLYING out of
everything, once more…

Everything that went in or out of here for the last coupla daze prior to
that.  Well … it may escape, it might not, it could very well spend the
next few days trying to wade out of the swamp that is the former
mailsystem.

We just tossed it altogether and recompiled with way, way, way higher
limits.

There are … a lot of you here.  What the hell is wrong with you anyway?

Just testing.

I need a lotta coffee.

Patrick

core dumped – going down on signal 15

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@wiretap.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: TesT
Date: May 5, 2004 at 12:48:42 PM EDT
To: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Cc: ibogaine@mindvox.com, digital@mindvox.com, root@phantom.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Wed, May 05, 2004 at 12:53:26PM -0400], [Patrick K. Kroupa] wrote:

| bl1p

Ahum … I would … like to take this moment, to read a p0em I wroted.
It is about melting universes, the top 1001 reasons I love heroin, and my
erection.

No, wait, nevermind.  I don’t get one of those when I dismantle brains.
That was a typo.  Shut up John.

not mE

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] TesT
Date: May 5, 2004 at 12:53:26 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, digital@wiretap.com, digital@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

bl1p

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: “Going Too Far: When the Ordinary Becomes Addictive” New York conference summary.
Date: May 5, 2004 at 9:09:52 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
To: “Andrew Byrne” <ajbyrne@ozemail.com.au>
Sent: Tuesday, May 04, 2004 10:41 PM
Subject: “Going Too Far: When the Ordinary Becomes Addictive” New York
conference summary.

Dear Colleagues,
Below is my summary of a New York conference which may interest some
list members. Many knowledgeable Americans are well aware of the
non-workability of strict prohibition policies. Numerous moves are afoot
including the FDA’s approving general prescription of high-dose
buprenorphine for addiction treatment. Needle exchanges are now becoming
commonplace. Talk about ‘harm reduction’ is less hysterical and more
logical which is just common sense. There are serious efforts to reduce
the extent and effects of the New York State ‘Rockefeller laws’ which
have been so counter-productive. I have been welcomed by numerous
American colleagues and we have shared many experiences and views with
the usual cordial relations which occur between our countries. Some
discomfort over other recent events is inevitable but I have tried to
avoid politics!

“Going Too Far: When the Ordinary Becomes Addictive”.
New York State Psychological Association, Division on Addictions.
The conference was co-sponsored by the ‘Masters Program in Mental Health
and Substance Abuse of the New School University’ and was held at the
New School University on 5th Avenue at 15th Street, near Union Square.
Fri 23rd April 2004.

This conference was well attended with a series of august speakers and
interesting addiction related topic including eating and sex.

Andrew Tatarsky discussed recreational drug use and just what this
means. He pointed out that old fashioned immutable labels need to be
changed as we now know much more about drug users moving from dependent,
harmful and occasional use with OR without treatment. And people use a
variety of drugs at different times making labelling even more difficult.

Sippio Michael Small spoke of his work with drug affected youth in
central and east Harlem. He had many interesting anecdotes and
observations on addictions. He responded to various questions with
practical suggestions reflecting his wisdom and long work in the field.

Stanton Peele spoke eloquently about ‘Recreational drug use and the path
from pleasure to addiction’. He illustrated the talk with some crucial
figures on the public record but rarely reproduced about the incidence
of heroin addiction in Vietnam veterans. He said that about 60% of
heroin dependent servicemen (nearly all were male) used heroin at least
once back in America but only 10% of them were ever diagnosed as needing
treatment for dependency, although this was widely available to veterans
at the time.

Wendy Miller then spoke on eating disorders from her experience in a
Women’s Behavioural Treatment service. Her points about guilt, body
image, depression and food as a cure to many of life’s difficulties were
well made. She made some other very valid points about ‘perfectionism’
in eating disorders, bulimia and obesity. We were told that having spent
so long preparing her talk, in guilt over ignoring her pit-bull terrier
she fed it a bone filled with cream cheese!! I was not sure if she was
serious.

Julie Barnes started the afternoon sessions with ‘Psychiatric
medications: when use IS abuse’. She quoted alarming figures about the
proportion of Americans who have taken non-sanctioned, non-prescribed
drugs. The variety was broad from antibiotics to tranquillizers to
antidepressants to analgesics.

Bob Foreman was good enough to share his research on web sites offering
‘prescription-free’ drugs for home delivery. He pointed out that a
single web search for a particular drug yielded over 100 sites, most of
which turned out to be genuine. A few were non-existent when he tried to
contact them. However, others would consign various drugs including
strong, controlled drugs such as hydrocodone, morphine, methadone,
buprenorphine, etc in various manners and with various marketing
strategies. In one case a company offered to send the first 20 tablets
free and after these had been paid for 40, 60 and then 80 would be
consigned ‘on approval’ which is just the way street drugs are often
sold! We were told that such illicit operators can do their commerce
from a foreign address using a foreign bank, local post and all can be
changed overnight. Several web sites mention the very low probability of
postal packages being intercepted and that just by giving another
mailing address, they will send a second consignment free of charge.
Since at least half of my own spam mail has been for Viagara and other
drugs, I was interested to know just how it all works. It appears that

Dr Mark Green who is an addiction psychiatrist spoke on “Prescription
Opioids: New Formulation … Same Old Addiction”. Dr Green has recently
opened the first methadone treatment service in Vermont, previously a
‘dry’ state regarding methadone. He is also prescribing buprenorphine in
a ‘shared-care’ type of model utilising certain existing services.

He took over some points made by Stanton Peele in the morning sessions
which Dr Green termed ‘set and setting’ (after Norman Zinberg) in drug
use, abuse and dependency. Dr Green pointed out that a large proportion
of entrants to methadone treatment in some parts of the country were not
heroin users but were addicted to prescription opioids such as
Oxycontin, Viocodin, etc. Such patients may be true chronic pain
sufferers but most had tried opioids outside of the medical setting and
enjoyed the effect. As was emphasised several times during the day’s
talkfest, medical use of opioids only very rarely was associated with
continued opioid use and dependency (around 1 to 5%). We had a detailed
description of the drugs, their actions and specific case of Oxycontin
was aired. Treatment options and the principles of opioid maintenance
were broached, including the “therapeutic dance” (which might also be
termed ‘give and take’).

It was most instructive to me that among this broad audience of
psychologists and other addiction professionals, many or even most were
sympathetic to the harm reduction approach of dealing with
clients/consumers in a nonjudgmental way. Not one person voiced any
sympathy for punishment models, zero tolerance, etc although numerous
speakers and audience members mentioned historical moves away from such
out dated philosophies. [This is the state which tried more than
anywhere with the Rockefeller laws which have proven so
counter-productive in all respects.]

The later sessions were devoted to understanding and dealing with ‘sex
addiction’ and involved Marlene Reil, J.P. Cheuvront and Joseph Cohen.

Participants were encouraged to put in their own views at the break-out
session, discussing ‘labels’ or diagnostic categories. All in all a
satisfactory conference on a ‘hot topic’ with lots of lessons from
experienced clinicians.

comments by Andrew Byrne ..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dr Andrew Byrne,
Medical Practitioner, Dependency Medicine,
75 Redfern Street, Redfern,
New South Wales, 2016, Australia
Email – ajbyrneATozemail.com.au
Tel (61 – 2) 9319 5524 Fax 9318 0631
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
My grandfather Harry Gracie’s letters from 1924 trip to Mayo Clinic:
http://bpresent.com/harry/code/mayo.htm
For ‘opera reviews’ or ‘dependency briefings’: send email request.
Author of: “Addict in the Family” and
“Methadone in the Treatment of Narcotic Addiction”
http://www.csdp.org/addict/
http://www.drugpolicy.org/library/byrne_contents_methadone2.cfm
Photo (ugly):
http://www.opiateaddictionrx.info/aboutus/aboutus06.html#

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From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 4, 2004 at 9:04:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bro, Bill wrote what I was going to say. I know that you were mad that
Dana reposted your posts into the Kerry site but why don’t you just put
a

Copyright 2004, Steven Anker, all rights reserved

At the start of your msg?

If patrick adds a notice into every page it will be annoying and accomplish
nothing more. If mostly what I get the feeling you want is for Dana to
not reprint your posts everywhere or for anyone else to either, it will
accomplish the same thing. Dana will ignore it and keep doing it.

Patrick please no paragraphs of copyright. It would be annoying and legally
not make much more difference.

Peace out,
Curtis

On Tue, 04 May 2004 12:37:07 -0700 Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu> wrote:
Patrick, when the fuck are you going to put a copyright notice
on this site?
What I write is mine, and I’d really love to share more, but with
the threat
of being plastered over the net, well…

Copyright notice is not needed. From the US Copyright Office:

When is my work protected?
Your work is under copyright protection the moment it is created

and fixed in a tangible form that it is perceptible either directly

or with the aid of a machine or device.

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html

In any case, you could include your own copyright notice in
whatever you write.

Bill

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
https://www.hushmail.com/services.php?subloc=messenger&l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
https://www.hushmail.com/about.php?subloc=affiliate&l=427

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] junkie diet
Date: May 4, 2004 at 5:11:30 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Tue, May 04, 2004 at 12:25:54PM -0700], [iboga@ziplip.com] wrote:
| I have finally found a clinic in around town that will let me use there couciling services post-methadone, so that is good, will be working more in-depth with Texas Rehabiliation Commision with help with vocational services (I’m not in a position to pass up opportunities).  Talked with methadone clinic counsler today, they of course had  never heard of iboga so they will look on-line and learn, but when I brought up the fact of diet (especially folic acid) she agreed and seemed fairly confedent in it’s importence.
| Diet I’ve been on the last week and will keep up:
| Lots of Meat, chicken breast w/ rice and lots of fresh dark greens like spinich etc. w/ a bit of fruit, lots and lots of water with cranberry juice, tall glasses of milk, fish and cow are nice too (sorry to all the veg’s out there, no disrespect); as far as suppliments I started taking multi-vitmin, FOLIC ACID (800 3x’s a day), and spirilina (blue-green algea).  And a little herb for post dream like state meditation touch down re-evaluation find the lessons in etc helps too : ) at least for me….
| Using smoke of combo of rosemarry, basil and sage for set and setting, good well rounded safe energy.  “a temple without time and agents of force”
| Anyone have any other suggestions without going overboard let me know (keep in mind I’m operating on a former junkie budget–: ) , at least at this time, their is much work to be done, yes.
| much love to all,
| Jason
| ps “I want to put on my my my my my boogie shoes” is playing lol
|   /]=———————————————————————=[\
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From: Bill Ross <ross@cgl.ucsf.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 4, 2004 at 3:37:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Patrick, when the fuck are you going to put a copyright notice on this site?
What I write is mine, and I’d really love to share more, but with the threat
of being plastered over the net, well…

Copyright notice is not needed. From the US Copyright Office:

When is my work protected?
Your work is under copyright protection the moment it is created
and fixed in a tangible form that it is perceptible either directly
or with the aid of a machine or device.

http://www.copyright.gov/circs/circ1.html

In any case, you could include your own copyright notice in
whatever you write.

Bill

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] detroit article
Date: May 4, 2004 at 11:27:49 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Not sure this made it to the list on my first attempt.  It is a fair ibogaine
article appearing in a Detroit paper.  I believe I will begin to respond to
NIDA antiibogaine propaganda in future interviews.

<A HREF=”http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=6171″>
http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=6171</A>

Howard

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From: Andria Efthimiou-Mordaunt <AndriaEM@drugscope.org.uk>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] CN ON: Non-Medical Issues Relating to Addiction Tr eatment Now
Date: May 4, 2004 at 10:59:27 AM EDT
To: “‘ibogaine@mindvox.com'” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

PLEASE UNSUBSCRIBE ME
Thanks
—–Original Message—–
From: deartheo@ziplip.com [mailto:deartheo@ziplip.com]
Sent: 04 May 2004 13:42
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] CN ON: Non-Medical Issues Relating to Addiction Treatment Now

Subj: 003 CN ON: Non-Medical Issues Relating to Addiction Treatment Now
From: Tim Meehan
Date: Sun, 2 May 2004 19:10:58 -0700
Size: 99 lines   3604 bytes
File: v04.n667.a03
URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v04.n667.a03.html

Pubdate: Wed, 28 Apr 2004
Source: Peterborough This Week (CN ON)
Copyright: 2004 Peterborough This Week
Contact: newsroom@peterboroughthisweek.com
Website: http://www.peterboroughthisweek.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/1794
Author: Mike Lacey

NON-MEDICAL ISSUES RELATING TO ADDICTION TREATMENT NOW GETTING LONG OVERDUE
ATTENTION

A pilot program focusing on the non-medical side of addiction
treatment has seen a good response in Peterborough.

The program, officially running since the fall, is a pilot project of
the social services department. Eight other Ontario communities are
offering the same program.

The purpose, says Ontario Works (OW) manager Nancy Fischer , is to
focus on a variety of issues unrelated to the medical side of
addiction treatment.

The City’s employment counselor help clients in a number of ways,
perhaps simply walking them to a treatment centre or helping them look
for a new apartment to live in.
NOTICE: The information in this e-mail is confidential and may be legally privileged. It is intended solely for the addressee. If you are not the intended recipient, please be aware that any use, dissemination, forwarding, printing or copying of this e-mail is strictly prohibited. If you have received this e-mail in error, please contact the sender. Any views or opinions presented are solely those of the author and do not necessarily represent those of the organisation. Although this message and any attachments have been scanned for viruses, we do not accept any liability in respect of viruses that may have been transmitted

From: <deartheo@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] CN ON: Non-Medical Issues Relating to Addiction Treatment Now
Date: May 4, 2004 at 8:42:14 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Subj: 003 CN ON: Non-Medical Issues Relating to Addiction Treatment Now
From: Tim Meehan
Date: Sun, 2 May 2004 19:10:58 -0700
Size: 99 lines   3604 bytes
File: v04.n667.a03
URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v04.n667.a03.html

Pubdate: Wed, 28 Apr 2004
Source: Peterborough This Week (CN ON)
Copyright: 2004 Peterborough This Week
Contact: newsroom@peterboroughthisweek.com
Website: http://www.peterboroughthisweek.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/1794
Author: Mike Lacey

NON-MEDICAL ISSUES RELATING TO ADDICTION TREATMENT NOW GETTING LONG OVERDUE
ATTENTION

A pilot program focusing on the non-medical side of addiction
treatment has seen a good response in Peterborough.

The program, officially running since the fall, is a pilot project of
the social services department. Eight other Ontario communities are
offering the same program.

The purpose, says Ontario Works (OW) manager Nancy Fischer , is to
focus on a variety of issues unrelated to the medical side of
addiction treatment.

The City’s employment counselor help clients in a number of ways,
perhaps simply walking them to a treatment centre or helping them look
for a new apartment to live in.
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From: Laurent Sazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 4, 2003 at 4:46:49 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Le 3/05/04 18:00, « Steven Anker » <stevenanker@hotmail.com> a écrit :

Hey all,

Gabon is amazing. Ya’ll should go, just got back. Just get all your shots,
take your malarial pills, learn some French or go with a French speaking
friend. Plan on spending some time, meet with as many naganga’s as possible.
Go with the one who feels best for you, learn about all the different
branches. Myself I went with Mitshogo. Badass, you know. It is a myth that
the pygmies have been using it the longest, it’s the Mitshogo. Much like
this list the different factions shit-talk each other. The Bwiti are very
diverse.

The best contact in Gabon is Huege who is a cross between Mick and Keith, he
speaks English and can help you through the process of becoming an initiate.
For a small and reasonable fee he is your best bet as a guide. Contact him
at ibogabon@yahoo.fr

The treatment providers in particular would benifit greatly from initiation.

Dana, you are full of shit, the Bwiti do not believe weed is the mother and
iboga the father. As a matter of fact no weed smoking allowed before or
after initiation. The two big rules of the Bwiti are that you talk about
your experience only with another initiate, and you DON’T share the secrets
of the Bwiti with non-initiates. Watch it Buddy.

Anyone with a few weeks of time and a few grand should go. Remember you wont
be the same afterwards, it is a serious comitment.

Remember it is sacred for them, not a glorified Disneyland ride. Telling
them “Oh I’ve taken ibogaine!” Does not cut it with them. They view ibogaine
as white man’s evil.

Chris, everyone has to pay for initiation, Gabonese as well. It can cost
from $400 to $4000. It lasts 4 to 10 days. If you have more questions
contact me off-site and we can figure out a time to talk.

Patrick, when the fuck are you going to put a copyright notice on this site?
What I write is mine, and I’d really love to share more, but with the threat
of being plastered over the net, well…

Steve A.

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: Mon, 3 May 2004 12:03:37 +0200

Chris,

There’s someone from this list who set out for Gabon about a month ago and
last time I heard form him, was having a blast of a time (hey man, get in
touch awready!)…. so I’m cc-ing this to him with hope he’s somewhere with
internet access,

all the best,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “Wilderness Lover” <northstar@onewest.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2004 4:43 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?

Greetings!

My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.

We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously
invited
to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like
to
go farther and get the full scale initiation.

Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such
as
Easter).
I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few
tourists?
Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
doesn’t work out?

I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel
tips
you folks might have.

Many Thanks,

Chris

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_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar – get it now!
http://toolbar.msn.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/

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Dear friends,

Dana is right.iboga is the father and weed is the mother.
Weed is used in the Bwiti Missoko-gonde which is the Bwiti for consultation.
Because weed is good for consultation at some level! but weed is ying-yang
good and bad!
Also all ngangas are smokers, tobacco and weed! and they like alcool!
But during your initiation it is forbidden to smoke tobacco, weed and drink
alcool! and ngangas will be strict with you.
The only place where they smoke and drink is the “buenze” (the room before
the stage where you dress, make up, before going to the
temple(mbandja)(corps de garde).(to be accepted in the “buenze” you must be
initiated!)

Bye bye

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From: Laurent Sazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 4, 2003 at 4:30:23 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Le 3/05/04 15:34, « HSLotsof@aol.com » <HSLotsof@aol.com> a écrit :

In a message dated 5/3/04 12:01:27 PM, laurentsazy@free.fr writes:

You can also visit bwiti.com
It is Mallendi Nganga web site. He will be in june -july in Gabon Near
Tchibanga city in south Gabon. He is doing Ngenza and Missoko-ngonde
initiation. Price is about 1200 euros for a full initiation Iboga and Edika
ceremony. I did myself.

Laurent,

Bwiti.com appears to be down as of 10:30 NYC time May 3, 2004.  My link to
its english translation from ibogaine.org/links.html is also not working.

Howard

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Dear Howard,

I will tell you next week. Mallendi went to Gabon for the week to get some
iboga for iboga approach in France.
Did you get the text from the book?

I agree with you. Initiation is not free.(like that you don’t waste it!) A
whole village is participating for you during 3 days and more.

Christophe, the one in Goutarel picture is doing initiation with his family(
Mbeng-Ntame family) in PK 12 Libreville(12kms from central Libreville, on
the road to Lambarene).they have a web site.
It is very good and soft place for people who want to do iboga initiation
with love and don’t want to suffer in an african traditional village.
Christophe and his family are métis and they know to work with western
people.(you live in a normal house, with nice women, water and electricity,
you can take shower…..i mean a little confort. You don’t worry for your
money or others! It is the best place for iboga initiation.A good place for
women, adults,and people who doesn’t want to have problem.  (eating iboga at
initiation is already a challenge). For Bwiti it is different, it is better
to go in villages.

If you need more informations……..

All the best

Laurent

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine article out of detroit
Date: May 3, 2004 at 8:44:52 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A good article for cures-not-wars and ibogaine out of detroit.

<A HREF=”http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=6171″>
http://www.metrotimes.com/editorial/story.asp?id=6171</A>

Howard

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From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] “Alzheimers Test” (not really! but try it!)
Date: May 3, 2004 at 7:26:21 PM EDT
To: Hibthat@aol.com, wconnect@bellsouth.net, BobbieHallWood@aol.com, SandersMawMaw@aol.com, trip2paris@juno.com, MDYE@comcast.net, caustin1961@netzero.net, IAMACOMPBABE@yahoo.com, BubbaBob0013@aol.com, Cglassheart@aol.com, earljr75@bellsouth.net, halfbakedchick@hotmail.com, LRED1USA@aol.com, vox@mindvox.com, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is amazing! Tammy

Alzheimer’s Test-

Count the “F’s” in the following text:

FINISHED FILES ARE THE RE-
SULT OF YEARS OF SCIENTIF-
IC STUDY COMBINED WITH THE
EXPERIENCE OF YEARS… (see below)

Managed it ?
Scroll down only after you have counted them, okay?
Do you think there are three?
Wrong, there are 6 !!–no joke.
Read it again.
The reasoning behind it is further down.

The brain cannot process “OF”.
Incredible or what ? Go back and look again!!
Anyone who counts all 6 “F’s” on the first go is a genius.
Three is normal, four is quite rare.

Send this to your friends-it drives them crazy

Callie

From: “jon f.” <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: [ibogaine] [DIV28] The Third National Clinical Conference on Cannabis Therapeutics (fwd)
Date: May 3, 2004 at 7:25:49 PM EDT
To: maps-forum@maps.org, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From the APA list…

———- Forwarded message ———-
Date: Mon, 3 May 2004 19:21:26 -0400
Reply-To: div28 <DIV28@LISTS.APA.ORG>
To: DIV28@LISTS.APA.ORG
Subject: [DIV28] The Third National Clinical Conference on Cannabis
Therapeutics

The Third National Clinical Conference on Cannabis Therapeutics
May 20-22, 2004 in Charlottesville, VA
at The Omni Charlottesville Hotel
Presented by Patients Out of Time

The Office of Continuing Medical Education of the University of Virginia’s Health System will sponsor the conference.
Co-presenters are the University of Virginia School of Nursing, the Pain Management Center, Department of
Anesthesiology, the University of Virginia School of Medicine, the Virginia Nurses Association and the University of
Virginia School of Law.

The conference theme, “Cannabis Use Throughout the Life Span”
Topics that will be examined and discussed by researchers and clinicians from the United States, Canada, The
Netherlands, Israel and the United Kingdom.
*  Childhood use for behavioral problems
*  General pediatric applications
*  Use during pregnancy
*  Dependence and addiction risk
*  Traumatic brain injury treatment
*  Pain, movement disorder and other symptomatic treatments
*  Delivery modalities
*  Clinical trial reports
*  Hospice use and other medical and legal issues will all be addressed.
Registration and Conference Brochure available at: http://www.medicalcannabis.com

The Faculty:

Donald Abrams, MD. Professor of Clinical Medicine and Head, Hematology-Oncology Section, University of California, San
Francisco.
David Bearman, MD. Practicing Physician, Santa Barbara, CA.
Richard Bonnie, JD. John S. Battle Professor of Law, University of Virginia School of Law, Charlottesville. Planning
Committee. Board of Advisors, Patients Out of Time.
Al Byrne, Lcdr, USN, (ret.). Co-founder, Secretary-Treasurer, Patients Out of Time, Howardsville,VA. Planning
Committee.
Valerie Corral. Director,Wo/Men’s Alliance for Medical Marijuana, Santa Cruz, CA.
Melanie Dreher, RN, PhD, FAAN. Kelting Dean and Professor, College of Nursing, University of Iowa, Iowa City, IA.
Director, Patients Out of Time.
Jon Gettman, PhD. Senior Fellow, George Mason University, Fairfax,VA. Planning Committee.
Geoffrey Guy, MD. Founder and Executive Chairman,GW Pharmaceuticals, plc. Salisbury,Wiltshire, United Kingdom.
Debbie Jeffries. Mother of ADHD Patient. Co-author, “Jeffrey’s Journey,” Rocklin, CA.
Christopher Largen. Co-author, Prescription Pot, Austin, TX.
Philippe Lucas. Founder and Director Vancouver Island Compassion Society and Director, Canadians for Safe Access.
Mary Lynn Mathre, RN, MSN, CARN. Co-founder, President, Patients Out of Time, Howardsville,VA.
Planning Committee.
Billy R. Martin, PhD. Chair, Department of Pharmacology and Toxicity, Health Science Center,Virginia Commonwealth
University, Richmond.
Ann McCormick. Mother of Childhood Cancer Survivor, Todd McCormick, Pawtucket, RI.
George McMahon. Federal Cannabis Patient, Frankston, TX. Director, Patients Out of Time.
Raphael Mechoulam, PhD. Lionel Jacobson Professor of Medicinal Chemistry Endowed Chair, Hebrew University, Jerusalem,
Israel.
Robert Melamede,PhD. Associate Professor and Biology Chairman, Biology Department, University of Colorado, Colorado
Springs.
Jim Miller. Spouse of Cannabis MS Patient.
Richard Musty, PhD. Professor of Psychology, University of Vermont, Burlington.
Mae Nutt. Mother of Cancer Patient, Midland,MI. Director, Patients Out of Time.
Thomas O’Connell, MD. Practicing Physician, San Mateo, CA.
Denis Petro, MD. Consulting Neurologist. Chief of Neurology, Malcom Grow Medical, Andrews Air Force Base,VA. Director,
Patients Out of Time.
Irvin Rosenfeld. Federal Cannabis Patient, Lauderhill, FL. National Spokesperson, Patients Out of Time.
John Rowlingson, MD. Director, Pain Management Center, Department of Anesthesiology, University of Virginia School of
Medicine. Planning Committee. Board of Advisors, Patients Out of Time.
Ethan Russo, MD. Practicing Neurologist, Missoula, MT. Editor, Journal of Cannabis Therapeutics. Board of Advisors,
Patients Out of Time.
Juan Sanchez-Ramos, PhD, MD. Professor of Neurology, Helen Ellis Endowed Chair. Director of Movement Disorders,
University of South Florida, Miami. Board of Advisors, Patients Out of Time.
Patricia Skidmore, RN, MSN, HNC. Mother of AIDS Patient, Practicing Nurse, New Market, MD.
Audra Stinchcomb, PhD. Assistant Professor, College of Pharmacy, University of Kentucky.
Willem Scholten, PharmD, MPA. Head, Office of Medical Cannabis, Ministry of Health,Welfare and Sports, The
Netherlands.
Arnold Trebach, PhD, JD. Professor Emeritus,American University. President, The Trebach Institute. Chair, Board of
Advisors, International Antiprohibitionist League. Founder and Past President, The Drug Policy Foundation.
Mark Ware, MSc, MRCP. Practicing Physician, Assistant Professor of Anesthesia, McGill University, Canada. Board of
Advisors, Patients Out of Time.
Sandra P.Welch, PhD. Professor of Pharmacology and Toxicology,Virginia Commonwealth University, Richmond.

The Conference Agenda

Thursday, May 20
7:00pm Reception and Exhibits
Friday, May 21
7:30 Registration/Continental Breakfast
8:00 Opening Remarks, Byrne
8:10 The Cannabinoid System in Neuroprotection, Mechoulam, PhD
9:00 Holistic Biochemistry: 600 Million Years of Cannabinoids, Melamede, PhD
9:30 Overview of Cannabis Use and Pregnancy, Dreher PhD, RN
9:50 Break
10:10 A Cannabis Kid, Largen
10:30 Mothers Know Best, Nutt, Jeffries, Skidmore, McCormick
11:10 Pediatrics and Cannabis, Russo,MD
12:00 Lunch Buffet: Sublingual Dosage in the UK, Guy, MD
1:30 Chronic Cannabis Use: An Opportunistic Study, O’Connell, MD
1:50 Cannabis Efficacy in Treating ADD & ADHD, Bearman,MD
2:10 Risk of Dependence, Martin, PhD & Dreher, PhD
3:00 Break
3:20 Risks and Benefits of Cannabis Products, Mathre, RN
3:50 Interactions Between Opiates and Cannabinoids, Welch, PhD
4:20 U.S. Federal Patients and Pain, Rosenfeld, McMahon
4:40 Transdermal Cannabinoids, Stinchcomb, PhD
5:00 Adjourn for the day
6:30 Patients Out of Time’s Benefit Dinner
Live Entertainment and Auction

Saturday, May 22
7:30 Continental Breakfast
8:00 Opening Remarks, Byrne
8:10 Therapeutic Cannabis in The Netherlands, Scholten, PharmD
8:50 British Columbia Patient Surveys, Lucas
9:20 Cannabis Research in Canada,Ware, MSc, MRCP
10:00 Break
10:20 Multiple Sclerosis and Cannabis, Petro, MD & Miller
10:50 Cannabis and Pain: Ongoing Clinical Trials, Abrams, MD
11:20 Psychological & Physical Health in Long-term Cannabis Users, Musty, PhD
11:50 Movement Disorders and Cannabis, Sanchez-Ramos, PhD, MD
12:15 Lunch (not provided)
1:15 Cannabis Use in a Hospice, Corral
1:45 DEA Rescheduling Petition Report, Gettman, PhD
2:15 A Humane Drug Control System, Trebach, PhD, JD
2:45 Break
3:00 Medical Ethics and Cannabis Prohibition, Bonnie, JD
3:30 Q&A Session, All Presenters
4:50 Closing & Evaluation

___________________________________________________________ APA division of psychopharmacology and substance abuse
div28@lists.apa.org http://www.apa.org/divisions/div28 enough? send: ” SIGNOFF DIV28 ” to listserv@lists.apa.org 1
summary/day? “SET DIV28 DIGEST” .. Vacation? “… NOMAIL” ___________________________________________________________

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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 3, 2004 at 2:04:10 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Mon, May 03, 2004 at 10:00:31AM -0700], [Steven Anker] wrote:

| Patrick, when the fuck are you going to put a copyright notice on this
| site? What I write is mine, and I’d really love to share more, but with the
| threat of being plastered over the net, well…

Steven,

Yo!  I’m really fuckin’ glad that your experience rocked the fuck out.  It
reaffirms my faith in all humanity!!!!

Patrick (C)(R)(TM)(SM)(Patent Pending)(Don’t you dare even think of
reprinting this message, or we will SUE you, your ancestors AND your
grandchildren.  Plus, also DDOS your fuckin’ soul off the face of the
astral planes.)

Okay, okay, okay … Other people keep asking for this too.  The SITE has
a copyright msg.  I hafta figure out how to wedge one into the trailer.
What’s a REAL SHORT way of saying, “you own your own words” …?  If I
dump a paragraph of legalize into the script, it’s gonna be sorta
annoying…

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 3, 2004 at 1:43:11 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/3/04 3:31:12 PM, sara119@xs4all.nl writes:

It is rather sharing your wealth with the tribe for your initiation then
paying for a ceremony.

Dear Sara,

That is a wonderful way of putting it.  Thank you.

Howard

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From: “Hannah Clay” <hannah.clay@ntlworld.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine
Date: May 3, 2004 at 1:35:29 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

.3 mg IM of Bupe is = to 10 mg Morphine IM <~~

so yes,your calculations are right!
—————————————————————————-
—-
Any help? 🙂

—– Original Message —–
From: “Carla Barnes” <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2004 2:07 AM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine

Hi Patrick 🙂 Thanks for writing that. You have a lot
of different writing styles but what I like most is
reading what you say when you explain what it feels
like and then explains the other sides of it. Your
like a walking encyclopedia of drug treatment failure
🙂

I was curious about this since everything you’ve said
has always been right and it was again, I looked up
Resnick also and he has 55 pages only on buprinorphene
on whatever the url is that links to pubmed, I can
never find it that way I always look on a search
engine.

What my question is, when I looked up what Patrick
wrote, what he rememberd was right, I don’t think they
sell the vials with injectible buprinorphene anymore
because they are all over the DEA website, but they
were .3 MG which is I think 300 MCG?

But my friend is on suboxone (whichever one is without
the naltrexone in it too, I forget if that’s suboxone
or subutex?) and only one tablet is 2mg. But when you
look up buprinorphene, it says that .3 is the same as
10MG of morphine. If Patrick was doing 10 or 12 at
once, that would be about right it would be 100 or
120MG of morphine, someone please tell me if I’m
wrong.

What I’m asking is, isn’t 2MG of buprenorphine in only
one tablet some huge amount? That would mean one
tablet of suboxone is like 80MG of morphine? I
understand what Patrick wrote was when all of this was
in trial phases and a long time before it was approved
in I think 2002.

I’m confused how the buprenex dosing went from 300MCG
which is being banned and has all these warnings, to
2MG which is being allowed everywhere. That’s what I’m
trying to say. Sorry rambling!

Carla B

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
On [Fri, Apr 30, 2004 at 02:24:06PM -0400],
[tomo7@starband.net] wrote:

| Could anyone on the list share their experience
with buprenorphine? What
| does it feel like, how does it work? Would it be a
helpful tool for
| breaking major addiction?  Or, a pharmaceutical
“choke chain” replacing
| the opiate high with another managed addiction
like methadone. It is
| presented as a method of easing the withdrawal
pains and helping people
| detox from addiction. Is that accurate?  All input
welcome,
| doctor/therapist speak to addled street rant if it
comes from experience.
| Thanks.

Personally I have nothing negative to say about
buprenorphine.  I don’t
really think it’s any more — or less — effective,
than any other
narcotic analgesic for use in “tapering down.”

In terms of maintenance, I’d definitely rate it much
higher than
methadone.

I’ve done methadone maintenance at three different
times in my life, the
longest run lasting about 2 years, and hitting a
ceiling of 200mg/day
before I dropped out of the program.

While I have seen methadone “work,” for many people,
and allow them to
stabilize and sorta reintegrate into society to some
extent.  Liquid
Handcuffs pretty much sums it all up.  There are a
lotta different sides
to alla this, but to summarize it: methadone
maintenance is extremely
dehumanizing.

The methadone CLINIC system, blows dead goats.  If
you want to travel it’s
a perpetual nightmare.  And personally, I
experienced a variety of
side-effects from methadone, which did not happen
for me with any other
narcotic analgesic.

I’ve done bup a few times, but the longest run
started around late 1994,
because I was seeing Richard Resnick then, and other
than being the guy
who started up with naltrexone; he was — for all
intent an purposes —
running buprenorphine maintenance on various people
who were involved in
his clinical trials.

Subutex and Suboxone did not exist; I wasn’t doing
naltrexone at the same
time either.  What it amounted to was, “Here are a
bunch of ampules.  Do
you know how to inject?  Of course you do.  Do you
know where to get
syringes?  Of course you do.  Try to wait 18 hours
before doing the first
dose.  IM it, don’t IV.  Here’s enough for a week,
so, try not to come
back sooner than 48 hours from now.  There is some
kind of theoretical
ceiling for when you will stop feeling it, even when
you keep increasing
dose.  So, if you can, please pick up a crayon or
something and jot down
some notes.  Let me know what happens, and when you
stop feeling it.”

Otay.

I was going from being sprung on heroin and
hydromorphone, I had a pretty
heavy habit at that point, but it wasn’t really
Godzilla-sized; couple of
grams a day of heroin.  I shot up buprenex roughly 3
hours after hitting
withdrawal.  Hum…  This shit is doing nothing.  It
sucks.  I shot up
again after about 5 hours.  Hum, this shit is doing
nothing, it sucks, and
I’m really fucking sick.

Somewhere around hour 8 I shot up and got, AHA!
*THAT’S IT!*  That’s what
I wanted!!!!  Stopped being dopesick, and switched
over to being sprung on
buprenex for the next 6 or 7 months.

I’ve never gotten annihilated on it, no matter how
much I did.  But you do
get nice downhead, especially mixed with Xanax.  I
experienced no physical
side-effects.  And, have nothing whatsoever negative
to say about the
experience.

It stabilized me.  The single negative about all
this — at the time —
was it came in these big-ass ampules which I think
were .3mg, so every
single shot, was breaking open ’bout a dozen of
these.  And, then, where
the fuck do I load this…?  The creative answer
being: a large-gauge
veterinary syringe.

I eventually dropped out of those trials, because I
just woke up one day,
realized, ya know … I’m still sprung.  That hasn’t
changed.  I’m not
“clean.”  And for the amount of cash I’m spending on
this shit, and the
doctor’s bills; I could just have a habit.  I like
heroin a lot more than
buprenex, therefore … fuck this.

Summary: if someone is going to be doing
maintenance; in my subjective
experience — having been on every single form of
substitution therapy
that exists, ‘cept heroin maintenance, dammit!!!
THAT’S that ONE I
WANTED!!! — buprenex is by far the lesser of all
evils.

Laters,

Patrick

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

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From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 3, 2004 at 1:00:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey all,

Gabon is amazing. Ya’ll should go, just got back. Just get all your shots, take your malarial pills, learn some French or go with a French speaking friend. Plan on spending some time, meet with as many naganga’s as possible. Go with the one who feels best for you, learn about all the different branches. Myself I went with Mitshogo. Badass, you know. It is a myth that the pygmies have been using it the longest, it’s the Mitshogo. Much like this list the different factions shit-talk each other. The Bwiti are very diverse.

The best contact in Gabon is Huege who is a cross between Mick and Keith, he speaks English and can help you through the process of becoming an initiate. For a small and reasonable fee he is your best bet as a guide. Contact him at ibogabon@yahoo.fr

The treatment providers in particular would benifit greatly from initiation.

Dana, you are full of shit, the Bwiti do not believe weed is the mother and iboga the father. As a matter of fact no weed smoking allowed before or after initiation. The two big rules of the Bwiti are that you talk about your experience only with another initiate, and you DON’T share the secrets of the Bwiti with non-initiates. Watch it Buddy.

Anyone with a few weeks of time and a few grand should go. Remember you wont be the same afterwards, it is a serious comitment.

Remember it is sacred for them, not a glorified Disneyland ride. Telling them “Oh I’ve taken ibogaine!” Does not cut it with them. They view ibogaine as white man’s evil.

Chris, everyone has to pay for initiation, Gabonese as well. It can cost
from $400 to $4000. It lasts 4 to 10 days. If you have more questions
contact me off-site and we can figure out a time to talk.

Patrick, when the fuck are you going to put a copyright notice on this site? What I write is mine, and I’d really love to share more, but with the threat of being plastered over the net, well…

Steve A.

From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: Mon, 3 May 2004 12:03:37 +0200

Chris,

There’s someone from this list who set out for Gabon about a month ago and
last time I heard form him, was having a blast of a time (hey man, get in
touch awready!)…. so I’m cc-ing this to him with hope he’s somewhere with
internet access,

all the best,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “Wilderness Lover” <northstar@onewest.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2004 4:43 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?

>
> Greetings!
>
> My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
> desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.
>
> We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously
invited
> to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like
to
> go farther and get the full scale initiation.
>
> Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such as
> Easter).
> I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
> rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few
tourists?
> Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
> doesn’t work out?
>
> I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel tips
> you folks might have.
>
> Many Thanks,
>
> Chris
>
>
>
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>
>

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 3, 2004 at 10:34:52 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/3/04 12:01:27 PM, laurentsazy@free.fr writes:

You can also visit bwiti.com
It is Mallendi Nganga web site. He will be in june -july in Gabon Near
Tchibanga city in south Gabon. He is doing Ngenza and Missoko-ngonde
initiation. Price is about 1200 euros for a full initiation Iboga and Edika
ceremony. I did myself.

Laurent,

Bwiti.com appears to be down as of 10:30 NYC time May 3, 2004.  My link to
its english translation from ibogaine.org/links.html is also not working.

Howard

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From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine
Date: May 3, 2004 at 7:36:47 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Carla wrote >I
understand what Patrick wrote was when all of this was
in trial phases and a long time before it was approved
in I think 2002.<

Andrew Byrne wrote in another post elsewhere (Byrne is speaking this week at
the old Lindesmith Center here in Manhattah) >It is worrying that the
American FDA has approved the marketing of the combination product even
before research of this nature had been established. One wonders if they
have different standards for drugs used in the treatment of addiction.<

This is Byrne’s note about Buprenorphine:

Pharmacokinetics of high-dose buprenorphine following single
administration of sublingual tablet formulations in opioid naïve healthy
male volunteers under a naltrexone block. McAleer SD, Mills RJ, Polack
T, Hussain T, Rolan PE, Gibbs AD, Mullins FGP, Hussein Z. Drug Alc
Depend (2003) 72; 1:75-83

Dear Colleagues,
At last we have some real data on buprenorphine half lives, absorption
and effects from healthy volunteer studies. These researchers, who were
working for the manufacturers, have taken 35 healthy males and given
substantial doses of buprenorphine after 50 -150mg naltrexone ‘block’.
They then measured clinical and blood parameters at regular intervals
for up to 3 days in an in-patient setting. Techniques for measuring
blood levels of buprenorphine are still being developed and are not
generally available in clinical practice. This makes patient history and
clinical observation even more important than otherwise. A liquid
chromatographic tandem mass spectrometric (LC-MS/MS) assay was developed
by these researchers and it was validated for the measurement of
buprenorphine and nor-buprenorphine, its metabolite, in blood.

Mean half life was found to be 26 hours with a wide range from 9 to 69.
Interestingly, these authors have confirmed some observations in
clinical practice including highly variable half lives and the
‘bi-exponential’ decay sometimes reported by patients. Some had a
‘secondary peak’ at about 10 hours from dosing. The authors report that
some had higher levels following meals and propose ‘entero-hepatic
recirculation’ in some cases. Maximum or ‘peak’ levels occurred between
30 minutes and 3 hours.

The addition of naloxone in the sublingual preparation made no
difference to blood levels. The time taken for the tablets to dissolve
were similar for all dose levels from 2 to 16mg (range 6-12 min) and
were no different for the combination product. It is worrying that the
American FDA has approved the marketing of the combination product even
before research of this nature had been established. One wonders if they
have different standards for drugs used in the treatment of addiction.

A weakness of the study was that it did not examine levels in on-going
treatment, but just individual single doses. Thus is it more relevant to
the initiation period, which is still a major problem for some patients.
There were no opioid effects using the naltrexone block at between 50
and 150mg doses prior to opioid administration.

comments by Andrew Byrne ..

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Dr Andrew Byrne,
Medical Practitioner, Dependency Medicine,
75 Redfern Street, Redfern,
New South Wales, 2016, Australia
Email – ajbyrneATozemail.com.au
Tel (61 – 2) 9319 5524 Fax 9318 0631

—– Original Message —–
From: “Carla Barnes” <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 01, 2004 9:07 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine

Hi Patrick 🙂 Thanks for writing that. You have a lot
of different writing styles but what I like most is
reading what you say when you explain what it feels
like and then explains the other sides of it. Your
like a walking encyclopedia of drug treatment failure
🙂

I was curious about this since everything you’ve said
has always been right and it was again, I looked up
Resnick also and he has 55 pages only on buprinorphene
on whatever the url is that links to pubmed, I can
never find it that way I always look on a search
engine.

What my question is, when I looked up what Patrick
wrote, what he rememberd was right, I don’t think they
sell the vials with injectible buprinorphene anymore
because they are all over the DEA website, but they
were .3 MG which is I think 300 MCG?

But my friend is on suboxone (whichever one is without
the naltrexone in it too, I forget if that’s suboxone
or subutex?) and only one tablet is 2mg. But when you
look up buprinorphene, it says that .3 is the same as
10MG of morphine. If Patrick was doing 10 or 12 at
once, that would be about right it would be 100 or
120MG of morphine, someone please tell me if I’m
wrong.

What I’m asking is, isn’t 2MG of buprenorphine in only
one tablet some huge amount? That would mean one
tablet of suboxone is like 80MG of morphine? I
understand what Patrick wrote was when all of this was
in trial phases and a long time before it was approved
in I think 2002.

I’m confused how the buprenex dosing went from 300MCG
which is being banned and has all these warnings, to
2MG which is being allowed everywhere. That’s what I’m
trying to say. Sorry rambling!

Carla B

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
On [Fri, Apr 30, 2004 at 02:24:06PM -0400],
[tomo7@starband.net] wrote:

| Could anyone on the list share their experience
with buprenorphine? What
| does it feel like, how does it work? Would it be a
helpful tool for
| breaking major addiction?  Or, a pharmaceutical
“choke chain” replacing
| the opiate high with another managed addiction
like methadone. It is
| presented as a method of easing the withdrawal
pains and helping people
| detox from addiction. Is that accurate?  All input
welcome,
| doctor/therapist speak to addled street rant if it
comes from experience.
| Thanks.

Personally I have nothing negative to say about
buprenorphine.  I don’t
really think it’s any more — or less — effective,
than any other
narcotic analgesic for use in “tapering down.”

In terms of maintenance, I’d definitely rate it much
higher than
methadone.

I’ve done methadone maintenance at three different
times in my life, the
longest run lasting about 2 years, and hitting a
ceiling of 200mg/day
before I dropped out of the program.

While I have seen methadone “work,” for many people,
and allow them to
stabilize and sorta reintegrate into society to some
extent.  Liquid
Handcuffs pretty much sums it all up.  There are a
lotta different sides
to alla this, but to summarize it: methadone
maintenance is extremely
dehumanizing.

The methadone CLINIC system, blows dead goats.  If
you want to travel it’s
a perpetual nightmare.  And personally, I
experienced a variety of
side-effects from methadone, which did not happen
for me with any other
narcotic analgesic.

I’ve done bup a few times, but the longest run
started around late 1994,
because I was seeing Richard Resnick then, and other
than being the guy
who started up with naltrexone; he was — for all
intent an purposes —
running buprenorphine maintenance on various people
who were involved in
his clinical trials.

Subutex and Suboxone did not exist; I wasn’t doing
naltrexone at the same
time either.  What it amounted to was, “Here are a
bunch of ampules.  Do
you know how to inject?  Of course you do.  Do you
know where to get
syringes?  Of course you do.  Try to wait 18 hours
before doing the first
dose.  IM it, don’t IV.  Here’s enough for a week,
so, try not to come
back sooner than 48 hours from now.  There is some
kind of theoretical
ceiling for when you will stop feeling it, even when
you keep increasing
dose.  So, if you can, please pick up a crayon or
something and jot down
some notes.  Let me know what happens, and when you
stop feeling it.”

Otay.

I was going from being sprung on heroin and
hydromorphone, I had a pretty
heavy habit at that point, but it wasn’t really
Godzilla-sized; couple of
grams a day of heroin.  I shot up buprenex roughly 3
hours after hitting
withdrawal.  Hum…  This shit is doing nothing.  It
sucks.  I shot up
again after about 5 hours.  Hum, this shit is doing
nothing, it sucks, and
I’m really fucking sick.

Somewhere around hour 8 I shot up and got, AHA!
*THAT’S IT!*  That’s what
I wanted!!!!  Stopped being dopesick, and switched
over to being sprung on
buprenex for the next 6 or 7 months.

I’ve never gotten annihilated on it, no matter how
much I did.  But you do
get nice downhead, especially mixed with Xanax.  I
experienced no physical
side-effects.  And, have nothing whatsoever negative
to say about the
experience.

It stabilized me.  The single negative about all
this — at the time —
was it came in these big-ass ampules which I think
were .3mg, so every
single shot, was breaking open ’bout a dozen of
these.  And, then, where
the fuck do I load this…?  The creative answer
being: a large-gauge
veterinary syringe.

I eventually dropped out of those trials, because I
just woke up one day,
realized, ya know … I’m still sprung.  That hasn’t
changed.  I’m not
“clean.”  And for the amount of cash I’m spending on
this shit, and the
doctor’s bills; I could just have a habit.  I like
heroin a lot more than
buprenex, therefore … fuck this.

Summary: if someone is going to be doing
maintenance; in my subjective
experience — having been on every single form of
substitution therapy
that exists, ‘cept heroin maintenance, dammit!!!
THAT’S that ONE I
WANTED!!! — buprenex is by far the lesser of all
evils.

Laters,

Patrick

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 3, 2004 at 7:31:41 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,

It is rather sharing your wealth with the tribe for your initiation then
paying for a ceremony.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Verzonden: zondag 2 mei 2004 22:47
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?

In a message dated 5/2/04 6:14:51 PM, northstar@onewest.net writes:

Greetings!

My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.

We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously invited
to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like
to go farther and get the full scale initiation.

Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such
as Easter).

I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few
tourists?
Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
doesn’t work out?

I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel tips
you folks might have.

My understanding is everyone is expected to pay money, tourist or not.  It
appears  costs cover iboga, supplies used in the cerimony, labor and food
and
drink for the chapel members who will assist in the rites.  You should view
costs a similar to a wedding or bar mitzva.  Something for the priest or
rabbi,
cost of the hall and catering. As your friends were well received you should
ask
them for contacts. You can also check out the Bwiti web pages at
<http://www.ibogaine.org/links.html>.  Go where you feel comfortable.

Howard

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From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 3, 2004 at 6:03:37 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Chris,

There’s someone from this list who set out for Gabon about a month ago and
last time I heard form him, was having a blast of a time (hey man, get in
touch awready!)…. so I’m cc-ing this to him with hope he’s somewhere with
internet access,

all the best,
Adam

—– Original Message —–
From: “Wilderness Lover” <northstar@onewest.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 02, 2004 4:43 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?

Greetings!

My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.

We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously
invited
to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like
to
go farther and get the full scale initiation.

Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such as
Easter).
I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few
tourists?
Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
doesn’t work out?

I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel tips
you folks might have.

Many Thanks,

Chris

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From: Laurent Sazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 3, 2003 at 5:14:06 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Le 2/05/04 15:43, « Wilderness Lover » <northstar@onewest.net> a écrit :

Greetings!

My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.

We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously invited
to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like to
go farther and get the full scale initiation.

Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such as
Easter).
I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few tourists?
Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
doesn’t work out?

I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel tips
you folks might have.

Many Thanks,

Chris

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Dear Chris,

You can also visit bwiti.com
It is Mallendi Nganga web site. He will be in june -july in Gabon Near
Tchibanga city in south Gabon. He is doing Ngenza and Missoko-ngonde
initiation. Price is about 1200 euros for a full initiation Iboga and Edika
ceremony. I did myself.
I have publish a photo book “Ngenza, the knowledge ceremony”
Mallendi publish also a book guide with french writer Vincent ravalec about
initiation and ceremony, iboga&bwiti and ibogaine.
Sorry, books are in french for now maybe translate later….
If you need more information……..

Good luck
Laurent

If you need more information about me

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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 2, 2004 at 4:47:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/2/04 6:14:51 PM, northstar@onewest.net writes:

Greetings!

My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.

We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously invited
to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like
to go farther and get the full scale initiation.

Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such
as Easter).

I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few tourists?
Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
doesn’t work out?

I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel tips
you folks might have.

My understanding is everyone is expected to pay money, tourist or not.  It
appears  costs cover iboga, supplies used in the cerimony, labor and food and
drink for the chapel members who will assist in the rites.  You should view
costs a similar to a wedding or bar mitzva.  Something for the priest or rabbi,
cost of the hall and catering. As your friends were well received you should ask
them for contacts. You can also check out the Bwiti web pages at
<http://www.ibogaine.org/links.html>.  Go where you feel comfortable.

Howard

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From: “Wilderness Lover” <northstar@onewest.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Gabon Advice?
Date: May 2, 2004 at 10:43:25 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Greetings!

My SO and I are going to visit Gabon this June.  While there, my fondest
desire is to receive an Iboga initiation into the Bwiti.

We had friends who were well received around Makokou and graciously invited
to drink a bit of Iboga tea and observe an all  night meeting.  I’d like to
go farther and get the full scale initiation.

Does anyone know if initiations are only given at specific times? (such as
Easter).
I expect an outsider will be expected to pay money…  What is the going
rate for in initiation in a waaaaaay out of the way place with few tourists?
Can anyone suggest other places and people in Gabon to contact if this
doesn’t work out?

I appreciate any advice on obtaining an initiation and budget travel tips
you folks might have.

Many Thanks,

Chris

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From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] bwiti is protecting
Date: May 2, 2004 at 7:47:21 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Another thing, if you’ve been carrying about your person a death-wish or otherwise a strong >desire to leave this plane of existence, stay away from iboga, because that door will be wide open >and it’s very tempting and extremely easy to just not come back….

I used to think I had a death wish.  I used to drink sh*t loads of alcohol and cusume drugs and quite a few times felt like I wanted to end it. After expriencing ibogaine thought my feelings have changed. I anything now I feel afraid of dying.  I don’t want to cusume drugs or things damaging to my health like I used to.  It’s my opinion that nobody really wants to die.  It’s that they are suffering with something painfull inside that sometimes makes them feel that maybe it would be easier to die.  That’s just my opinion of the majority of people.  To me life seems much more precious now and the last thing I’d like to do is to leave.  I want to live a fullfilling healthy life for as long as I can.  I certainly thought about death alot after and during ibogaine.  It really made me feel just how powerless we are in that sense. It’s something we all have to face at some stage in our lives.

Other than that, my personal message is; there’s nothing out there that you need to be protected from, k?
If it’s any good it’ll be a pretty rough ride, so take a chill pill if you have to, get an understanding as to what can potentially take place and keep an open mind and your wits about you at all times. And good luck to all you buckaroos,

Adam Gur
-the one, the only and, apparently, the all.

_________________________________________________________________
Tired of spam? Get advanced junk mail protection with MSN 8. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

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From: CrossanJaipur@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] bwiti is protecting
Date: May 2, 2004 at 6:49:04 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

remove me please

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] It’s a Protest, Not a Pot-Fest- MMM 2004
Date: May 2, 2004 at 3:17:23 AM EDT
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, “Newsroom-L” <newsroom-l@lists.netspace.org>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
Please feel free to forward as you will. And please, excuse the cross
post.
I’ve got some good photos in this, of Ed particularly. The camera likes
you Ed, so it must be what you say that keeps you outta the mainstream
attention far more often than we’d like.
Peace,
Preston

http://www.drugwar.com/mmm2004.shtm

It’s a Protest, Not a Pot-Fest-
MMM 2004
By Preston Peet-
for DrugWar.com
May 2, 2004

(image)
Ed “NJWeedman” Forchion and
DrugWar.com editor Preston Peet

May 1 was a beautiful Spring day, perfect to spend outside in Battery Park
at the lower end of Manhattan in New York City, where an estimated one to
three thousand people attended the 2004 Million Marijuana March and rally in
support of medical marijuana and Drug War reforms.
snip-
Read Report at above URL

—–

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From: “AG” <adamg@013.net.il>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] bwiti is protecting
Date: May 2, 2004 at 3:54:06 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

..errr sorry, but at last count the Bwiti are a people residing in the Cameroon-Gabon area and are not, I repeat, are not a superhero defense league for distraught psychedelic-wayfarers… You don’t hear anyone going, ‘the Ammish will save you’, or ‘let a Bedouin into your heart’, right…  So please, before any newbie thinks he’s gonna encounter a benevolent 8 foot tall enlightened race in the jungle wearing spandex and shouting ‘here I come to save the daaaaay!’, let’s drop the whole Bwiti-fanclub-adulation, it’s iboga or eboka, a sacred plant/cleanser/healer/teacher -(and ‘mankind’s liberator’, to paraphrase the Bwiti)- used by various indigenous inhabitants of the area, not the least being the forerunning pygmy tribes.

Another thing, if you’ve been carrying about your person a death-wish or otherwise a strong desire to leave this plane of existence, stay away from iboga, because that door will be wide open and it’s very tempting and extremely easy to just not come back….

Other than that, my personal message is; there’s nothing out there that you need to be protected from, k?
If it’s any good it’ll be a pretty rough ride, so take a chill pill if you have to, get an understanding as to what can potentially take place and keep an open mind and your wits about you at all times. And good luck to all you buckaroos,

Adam Gur
-the one, the only and, apparently, the all.
From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] 5% of my HCL journey
Date: May 2, 2004 at 1:29:25 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“…they had more broadcasting power then we did. They called for a race war and announced where I was and that the war would begin with the mutilation of me that would trigger it after tearing I to pieces. I preyed as the mob started to clime the building that all of human sin die with me, that perhaps if they personified evil enough in me they could channel it into me without realizing it and bury that dukka with me.”
http://www.cannabisculture.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Board=conspire&Number=847569&Main=845064#Post847569
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From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine
Date: May 1, 2004 at 5:23:42 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Resent-From: digital@phantom.com
Resent-To: carlambarnes@yahoo.com, digital@wiretap.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On [Fri, Apr 30, 2004 at 02:24:06PM -0400], [tomo7@starband.net] wrote:

| Could anyone on the list share their experience with buprenorphine? What
| does it feel like, how does it work? Would it be a helpful tool for
| breaking major addiction?  Or, a pharmaceutical “choke chain” replacing
| the opiate high with another managed addiction like methadone. It is
| presented as a method of easing the withdrawal pains and helping people
| detox from addiction. Is that accurate?  All input welcome,
| doctor/therapist speak to addled street rant if it comes from experience.
| Thanks.

Personally I have nothing negative to say about buprenorphine.  I don’t
really think it’s any more — or less — effective, than any other
narcotic analgesic for use in “tapering down.”

In terms of maintenance, I’d definitely rate it much higher than
methadone.

I’ve done methadone maintenance at three different times in my life, the
longest run lasting about 2 years, and hitting a ceiling of 200mg/day
before I dropped out of the program.

While I have seen methadone “work,” for many people, and allow them to
stabilize and sorta reintegrate into society to some extent.  Liquid
Handcuffs pretty much sums it all up.  There are a lotta different sides
to alla this, but to summarize it: methadone maintenance is extremely
dehumanizing.

The methadone CLINIC system, blows dead goats.  If you want to travel it’s
a perpetual nightmare.  And personally, I experienced a variety of
side-effects from methadone, which did not happen for me with any other
narcotic analgesic.

I’ve done bup a few times, but the longest run started around late 1994,
because I was seeing Richard Resnick then, and other than being the guy
who started up with naltrexone; he was — for all intent an purposes —
running buprenorphine maintenance on various people who were involved in
his clinical trials.

Subutex and Suboxone did not exist; I wasn’t doing naltrexone at the same
time either.  What it amounted to was, “Here are a bunch of ampules.  Do
you know how to inject?  Of course you do.  Do you know where to get
syringes?  Of course you do.  Try to wait 18 hours before doing the first
dose.  IM it, don’t IV.  Here’s enough for a week, so, try not to come
back sooner than 48 hours from now.  There is some kind of theoretical
ceiling for when you will stop feeling it, even when you keep increasing
dose.  So, if you can, please pick up a crayon or something and jot down
some notes.  Let me know what happens, and when you stop feeling it.”

Otay.

I was going from being sprung on heroin and hydromorphone, I had a pretty
heavy habit at that point, but it wasn’t really Godzilla-sized; couple of
grams a day of heroin.  I shot up buprenex roughly 3 hours after hitting
withdrawal.  Hum…  This shit is doing nothing.  It sucks.  I shot up
again after about 5 hours.  Hum, this shit is doing nothing, it sucks, and
I’m really fucking sick.

Somewhere around hour 8 I shot up and got, AHA!  *THAT’S IT!*  That’s what
I wanted!!!!  Stopped being dopesick, and switched over to being sprung on
buprenex for the next 6 or 7 months.

I’ve never gotten annihilated on it, no matter how much I did.  But you do
get nice downhead, especially mixed with Xanax.  I experienced no physical
side-effects.  And, have nothing whatsoever negative to say about the
experience.

It stabilized me.  The single negative about all this — at the time —
was it came in these big-ass ampules which I think were .3mg, so every
single shot, was breaking open ’bout a dozen of these.  And, then, where
the fuck do I load this…?  The creative answer being: a large-gauge
veterinary syringe.

I eventually dropped out of those trials, because I just woke up one day,
realized, ya know … I’m still sprung.  That hasn’t changed.  I’m not
“clean.”  And for the amount of cash I’m spending on this shit, and the
doctor’s bills; I could just have a habit.  I like heroin a lot more than
buprenex, therefore … fuck this.

Summary: if someone is going to be doing maintenance; in my subjective
experience — having been on every single form of substitution therapy
that exists, ‘cept heroin maintenance, dammit!!!  THAT’S that ONE I
WANTED!!! — buprenex is by far the lesser of all evils.

Laters,

Patrick

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From: Cvolchkovaa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: Methadone clinics blow goats
Date: May 1, 2004 at 10:42:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Re- Patrick @Phantom
I agree the methadone clinic system is screwed.I’ve always felt dehumanized and treated like a criminal there.In NY there is now a bill pending to allow a month of take-homes
which is certainly an improved situation.Anyone else can get their prescriptions from a pharmacy,even IF THEY”RE ABUSING THEM.I’m so tired of jumping through hoops I’m detoxing now.I wonder if the multi-$$$ treatment industry is behind keeping addicts
>from having normal everyday access to pharmacy dispensing?Loving us to death.
Pharmaceutically sophisticated from Claudia

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Buprenorphine
Date: May 1, 2004 at 9:07:40 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Patrick 🙂 Thanks for writing that. You have a lot
of different writing styles but what I like most is
reading what you say when you explain what it feels
like and then explains the other sides of it. Your
like a walking encyclopedia of drug treatment failure
🙂

I was curious about this since everything you’ve said
has always been right and it was again, I looked up
Resnick also and he has 55 pages only on buprinorphene
on whatever the url is that links to pubmed, I can
never find it that way I always look on a search
engine.

What my question is, when I looked up what Patrick
wrote, what he rememberd was right, I don’t think they
sell the vials with injectible buprinorphene anymore
because they are all over the DEA website, but they
were .3 MG which is I think 300 MCG?

But my friend is on suboxone (whichever one is without
the naltrexone in it too, I forget if that’s suboxone
or subutex?) and only one tablet is 2mg. But when you
look up buprinorphene, it says that .3 is the same as
10MG of morphine. If Patrick was doing 10 or 12 at
once, that would be about right it would be 100 or
120MG of morphine, someone please tell me if I’m
wrong.

What I’m asking is, isn’t 2MG of buprenorphine in only
one tablet some huge amount? That would mean one
tablet of suboxone is like 80MG of morphine? I
understand what Patrick wrote was when all of this was
in trial phases and a long time before it was approved
in I think 2002.

I’m confused how the buprenex dosing went from 300MCG
which is being banned and has all these warnings, to
2MG which is being allowed everywhere. That’s what I’m
trying to say. Sorry rambling!

Carla B

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:
On [Fri, Apr 30, 2004 at 02:24:06PM -0400],
[tomo7@starband.net] wrote:

| Could anyone on the list share their experience
with buprenorphine? What
| does it feel like, how does it work? Would it be a
helpful tool for
| breaking major addiction?  Or, a pharmaceutical
“choke chain” replacing
| the opiate high with another managed addiction
like methadone. It is
| presented as a method of easing the withdrawal
pains and helping people
| detox from addiction. Is that accurate?  All input
welcome,
| doctor/therapist speak to addled street rant if it
comes from experience.
| Thanks.

Personally I have nothing negative to say about
buprenorphine.  I don’t
really think it’s any more — or less — effective,
than any other
narcotic analgesic for use in “tapering down.”

In terms of maintenance, I’d definitely rate it much
higher than
methadone.

I’ve done methadone maintenance at three different
times in my life, the
longest run lasting about 2 years, and hitting a
ceiling of 200mg/day
before I dropped out of the program.

While I have seen methadone “work,” for many people,
and allow them to
stabilize and sorta reintegrate into society to some
extent.  Liquid
Handcuffs pretty much sums it all up.  There are a
lotta different sides
to alla this, but to summarize it: methadone
maintenance is extremely
dehumanizing.

The methadone CLINIC system, blows dead goats.  If
you want to travel it’s
a perpetual nightmare.  And personally, I
experienced a variety of
side-effects from methadone, which did not happen
for me with any other
narcotic analgesic.

I’ve done bup a few times, but the longest run
started around late 1994,
because I was seeing Richard Resnick then, and other
than being the guy
who started up with naltrexone; he was — for all
intent an purposes —
running buprenorphine maintenance on various people
who were involved in
his clinical trials.

Subutex and Suboxone did not exist; I wasn’t doing
naltrexone at the same
time either.  What it amounted to was, “Here are a
bunch of ampules.  Do
you know how to inject?  Of course you do.  Do you
know where to get
syringes?  Of course you do.  Try to wait 18 hours
before doing the first
dose.  IM it, don’t IV.  Here’s enough for a week,
so, try not to come
back sooner than 48 hours from now.  There is some
kind of theoretical
ceiling for when you will stop feeling it, even when
you keep increasing
dose.  So, if you can, please pick up a crayon or
something and jot down
some notes.  Let me know what happens, and when you
stop feeling it.”

Otay.

I was going from being sprung on heroin and
hydromorphone, I had a pretty
heavy habit at that point, but it wasn’t really
Godzilla-sized; couple of
grams a day of heroin.  I shot up buprenex roughly 3
hours after hitting
withdrawal.  Hum…  This shit is doing nothing.  It
sucks.  I shot up
again after about 5 hours.  Hum, this shit is doing
nothing, it sucks, and
I’m really fucking sick.

Somewhere around hour 8 I shot up and got, AHA!
*THAT’S IT!*  That’s what
I wanted!!!!  Stopped being dopesick, and switched
over to being sprung on
buprenex for the next 6 or 7 months.

I’ve never gotten annihilated on it, no matter how
much I did.  But you do
get nice downhead, especially mixed with Xanax.  I
experienced no physical
side-effects.  And, have nothing whatsoever negative
to say about the
experience.

It stabilized me.  The single negative about all
this — at the time —
was it came in these big-ass ampules which I think
were .3mg, so every
single shot, was breaking open ’bout a dozen of
these.  And, then, where
the fuck do I load this…?  The creative answer
being: a large-gauge
veterinary syringe.

I eventually dropped out of those trials, because I
just woke up one day,
realized, ya know … I’m still sprung.  That hasn’t
changed.  I’m not
“clean.”  And for the amount of cash I’m spending on
this shit, and the
doctor’s bills; I could just have a habit.  I like
heroin a lot more than
buprenex, therefore … fuck this.

Summary: if someone is going to be doing
maintenance; in my subjective
experience — having been on every single form of
substitution therapy
that exists, ‘cept heroin maintenance, dammit!!!
THAT’S that ONE I
WANTED!!! — buprenex is by far the lesser of all
evils.

Laters,

Patrick

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Win a $20,000 Career Makeover at Yahoo! HotJobs
http://hotjobs.sweepstakes.yahoo.com/careermakeover

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From: “Luke Christoffersen” <lchristoffersen@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] bwiti is protecting
Date: May 1, 2004 at 6:00:52 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Everybody,
Cool, that’s a interesting since I was just going to share my most recent ibogaine experience.  Well it didn’t actually take place.
I was going to to a lower dose experience this week. 10mg/kg.  My previose experiences were mostly in the 20/kg range.  I was feeling quite good and confident about it but after the test dose of 150mg took effect I started to have second thoughts. It felt stronger than before. I wonder dose ibogaine have a stronger effect after a few sessions.  I did several close together but my last was nearly a year ago. It could be that my lifestyle is generaly healtier and most of the alcohol is gone and my mind is clearing because it almost feels like my body is priming itself to release very deep tension or emotionaly blocks.
I felt quite nauseas most of the night after the test dose whereas before I wouldn’t have much effect from it.  I had what felt somewhat like a strong current through the center of my body from below to the center of my mind.   It reminded me of just how intense and grueling ibogaine is but at the same time I felt that some of the deeper issues I’ve been avoiding would be faced, some major blocked emotion that’s preventing me from lliving a truely fulfilling life of love and free emotional expression.  I can only guess that it would be extreemly liberating.
I think I was just very afraid, probably afraid that I would die or not come back. I don’t think I every experience that ‘splitting of the head’. I felt more afraid than I was before even though the dose was a lot less.  I’d really like to release all that tension inside.  I don’t think it’s posible to rationaly yourself that feeling of death than can be felt.  Anyway I just thought I’d share this.
Luke

From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] bwiti is protecting
Date: Sat, 1 May 2004 09:26:06 -0700 (PDT)

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
(all is [one) is all]
You could come and learn , you can do treatments with me.
You can do it , and don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you. You have a
good heart and you got the message .
The spirit of the plant is calling you to help , so be it. It is hard but
worth it.
Love,
s
_____
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
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_________________________________________________________________
The new MSN 8: smart spam protection and 2 months FREE*  http://join.msn.com/?page=features/junkmail

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From: “Hannah Clay” <spaglet@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] The poop on bupe (buprenorphine)
Date: May 1, 2004 at 12:58:54 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi,

I’ve been on Buprenorphine (Suboxone or Subutex) for a couple of months now.
I would be happy to answer any questions you have.  I also use an Opiate
Detox Forum which is a great source of both support and friendship as well
as brilliant information-I recommend you take a look as the people there
have first hand experience and are always willing to help answer questions.

http://64.226.201.78/Forum/default.asp

I would actually recommend this site to everyone who has an opiate
addiction.  Its the only forum I’ve found where I feel like the people
genuinely care!  They’re not judgemental or self-righteous but supportive,
friendly and open to anybody’s experiences.  I’ve made some true friends
there!

If I’d just relied on the information my Doctor had given me?!….

Personally I don’t get any ‘high’ from Bup but some people do.  One thing
about Bup is that IT IS ADDICTIVE!!!  My Doctor still maintains that it
isn’t n this is where the medical profession really lost my trust.  It
appears to be different with different people but some have said its a bad
as an H detox-something to bear in mind when considering maintenance!
Unfortunately Doctors don’t take this into account when prescribing it!

Also its vital to know that Bup is a very powerful drug-alot stronger than
Heroin and it is very important that you don’t take too much!  The ‘usual’
dose is anywhere up to 16mg and more is not normally needed-the mantra is
LESS IS MORE!  If you take too much you will get nausea adn headaches from
too much.  I have detoxed twice using it – the first time I needed 12 mg for
the frist few days and the second time just 8mg.  And you can quickly taper
easy.  However I’ve found that it doesn’t block the effects of H at a lower
dose so bear this in mind.

Sorry I could go on for ever!  Please check out the forum,its vital that the
medical profession learn more about this drug-too often we’ve found people
being given totally the wrong dose!  Their Doctor keeps telling them to take
more because they’re sick but in actual fact they’re being sick because
thay’ve taken too much and the Doc’s advise just makes it worse n worse!

Ofcourse its dead important that  you NEVER take Bup with opiates in your
system.  My clinic advises to wait 12 hours since your last hit.  Basically
you don’t have to wait til your in full blown WD,just moderately sck.  If
you take it too soon you will be VERY VERY ill-it will sling you straight
into full WD.

You can take H AFTER Bup but the effects will be blocked so theres no point.
Benzo’s should also be avoided as combined with Bup they can cause breathing
difficulties.

Please feel free to ask further questions and please check out the
site-there’s TONNES of info there! 🙂

I think its a great alternative to Meth and can be used for a quick detox or
maintenance.  It takes my WDs away totally.

Hannah

—– Original Message —–
From: <tomo7@starband.net>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 7:24 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] The poop on bupe (buprenorphine)

Could anyone on the list share their experience with buprenorphine? What
does it feel like, how does it work? Would it be a helpful tool for
breaking major addiction?  Or, a pharmaceutical “choke chain” replacing
the opiate high with another managed addiction like methadone. It is
presented as a method of easing the withdrawal pains and helping people
detox from addiction. Is that accurate?  All input welcome,
doctor/therapist speak to addled street rant if it comes from experience.
Thanks.

Dr. Tom

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<)[%]

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From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Ibogaine and opium tea?back at you
Date: May 1, 2004 at 3:09:14 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I agree with you Preston, But as long as there are people there are drugs
and wars.
So why not make war on chocolate coffee and Mc Donald’s , there are so many
other things we can make war on and just imagine that the police
Come for a house search because your seen with a chocolate cake& a
cappuccino.
People used to be conditioned that they should be against something and
Should fight for something and that they should pay taxes for something
As long as they believe that,that something is real, they have got the need
to be conditioned in all kind of institutions.
Some animals use drugs too,(EVEN Ibogaroot)Do those animals get to be locked
up?

No, because they don’t have the money to pay a lawyer and they don’t pay
taxes.

Drink your tea if you feel that’s the right thing for you ,it is for sure
better then most Heroin or other pharmaceutical.

Sara

—–Oorspronkelijk bericht—–
Van: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Verzonden: zaterdag 1 mei 2004 14:12
Aan: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Onderwerp: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine and opium tea?back at you

This is obvious and the govt. must
know it so why continue the same failed policy.Discrimination?
Stigma?Politicians
wanting to look tough on crime?Ignorance?<

Because too many certain folk are making too much money the way things are
now today. “They” don’t give a hoot in hell about ending drug abuse or drug
problems.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Cvolchkovaa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 10:25 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine and opium tea?back at you

several people have now said mixing opium tea with ibo isnt safe,I never
meant at the
same time!!I I meant AFTER you had taken ibo and were thoroughly recovered
from
the experience,and may have lingering or even severe withdrawal
symptoms,either
temporary (for some maintenance may be permanent or long term.) I know the
‘per-
manent altering of brain chemistry’ is still controversial but since some
people can
seem to almost never get off opiates this is perhaps true for some.I don’t
see why opium tea is not available to addicts for free from the govt. as IT
IS MORE BENIGN only because
it isn’t injected and every illegal drug gang selling heroin could be shut
down overnight
if addicts were given either opium tea or even heroin.This is obvious and
the govt. must
know it so why continue the same failed policy.Discrimination?
Stigma?Politicians
wanting to look tough on crime?Ignorance? Claudia

/]=———————————————————————=[\
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<)[%]

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From: Cvolchkovaa@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: The poop on (buprenorphine),abnormal psychological effect
Date: May 1, 2004 at 2:29:30 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: Cvolchkovaa@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In re- of the story about bup pills that contain some naltrexone.I had naltrexone for a
week and it had a severe abnormal psychological effect on me,making me like a
zombie,uncaring and losing my mind.Once I stopped taking it it took 3 days to come out
of my system to where I could feel normal.Terrible stuff.I feel it’s really an anti-libertarian
idea to put nal in a bupe pill.Nal is a blocker,something prohibitionists can’t get enough
of because they love the idea of blocking the feeling of getting high.Anyone that fails the treatment simply confirms to them what they already feel about most users or addicts.
That they are ‘lacking’ somehow,degraded.For the record,The 3 days it took …nal to come out of my system I did heroin and though I could not feel the high it DEFINITELY took the
sickness away.I have been off heroin 6 years and since the world sucks and prohibition does not seem to be end in sight I have become more radically libertarian,rejecting ideas
of sobriety for every human as profoundly wrong-headed religious propaganda.Religion
of the western sort is afraid of ecstacy.I actually LIKE opium tea on sunday mornings
and if anyone disagrees,FU.  Claudia (there’s nothing wrong with me)

From: iboga@ziplip.com <iboga@ziplip.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] bwiti is protecting
Date: May 1, 2004 at 12:26:06 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
(all is [one) is all]
You could come and learn , you can do treatments with me.

You can do it , and don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you. You have a

good heart and you got the message .

The spirit of the plant is calling you to help , so be it. It is hard but

worth it.

Love,

s

_____

don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
don’t be afraid the bwiti is protecting you
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] The poop on bupe (buprenorphine)
Date: May 1, 2004 at 9:14:24 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Bup is a narcotic and a narc antaginizer all rolled into one. I tried to switch from methadone to it a while back. I couldn’t get used to it probably becouse of the naltrexone in it. they make it in 2mg. buprenorphine and .5 naltrexone and 8 mg. bup. 2mg. naltrexone pills. You have to dissolve it under your tongue to keep the naltrexone from effecting you or so it was explained to me.I suspect that I didn’t detox off of the meth long enough to keep the naltrex from making me sick. I detoxed off of the meth for 4 days before I tried to start the bup. I took it for about 2 weeks and never felt anything but sick. I do know that you can get high from it because there is already a market for it. I have talked to people in Erie Pa. that get high off of it but not from my experience. I took one 2 days after I stopped once and went into withdrawl on the spot. So if you have a jones on meth or other narcotic you definitly need to detox enough to start the treatment and give it a chance. I studied up on the subject before I started and read alot of good things about it. It may be a very good alternitive, I just didn’t detox from methadone long enough or I am real sensative to the naltrexone I really don’t know.          I hope this helps. Good Luck!

Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine and opium tea?back at you
Date: May 1, 2004 at 8:11:59 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is obvious and the govt. must
know it so why continue the same failed policy.Discrimination?
Stigma?Politicians
wanting to look tough on crime?Ignorance?<

Because too many certain folk are making too much money the way things are
now today. “They” don’t give a hoot in hell about ending drug abuse or drug
problems.
Peace,
Preston

—– Original Message —–
From: Cvolchkovaa@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, April 30, 2004 10:25 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Ibogaine and opium tea?back at you

several people have now said mixing opium tea with ibo isnt safe,I never
meant at the
same time!!I I meant AFTER you had taken ibo and were thoroughly recovered
from
the experience,and may have lingering or even severe withdrawal
symptoms,either
temporary (for some maintenance may be permanent or long term.) I know the
‘per-
manent altering of brain chemistry’ is still controversial but since some
people can
seem to almost never get off opiates this is perhaps true for some.I don’t
see why opium tea is not available to addicts for free from the govt. as IT
IS MORE BENIGN only because
it isn’t injected and every illegal drug gang selling heroin could be shut
down overnight
if addicts were given either opium tea or even heroin.This is obvious and
the govt. must
know it so why continue the same failed policy.Discrimination?
Stigma?Politicians
wanting to look tough on crime?Ignorance? Claudia

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%](> Further Information & List Commands:  http://ibogaine.mindvox.com <)[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

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