Ibogaine List Archives – 2005-05

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: June 1, 2005 at 12:16:24 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thankyou for that clarity.  We never would’ve figured it out. :]
tink(sick fux inc)

On 5/31/05, Schmoolyboy@aol.com <Schmoolyboy@aol.com> wrote:
The Fang are also not tweeked sick junkies who abused their bodies with
crack and speed and a shit load of psych drugs that interact with ibogaine.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 31, 2005 at 11:28:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The Fang are also not tweeked sick junkies who abused their bodies with crack and speed and a shit load of psych drugs that interact with ibogaine.

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Bwiti Practices
Date: May 31, 2005 at 11:27:45 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

some of you guys reallydon’t know what you are talking about. Ibogaine lowers blood pressure and slows pulse.

It was used as a B.P. med in france years ago. It has a load of very complex cardiac side effects and if you have 20 or so years of medical education, you could understand it.

From: Fire3456@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] so here’s a question I need answered sooner than later, if it …
Date: May 31, 2005 at 10:35:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Tink,

The same happened to me.  Dropping from 16 to 2 didn’t seem to hard.  From 2 down to 1 mg per day was a lot harder and took more time than I expected.  I’m going to a DR to get some meds to assist with the final w/d’s I will be having.

What kind of schedule do you have to taper down from the 2mgs your at now?

My plan is to taper off in 3 weeks.  Then try and stay clean.  And then take vacation from work.  I’m going to try a maintenance dose of Ibogaine at that time.  After I’ve been off the Sub for at least 3 weeks.

Good luck!

In a message dated 05/31/2005 12:27:52 PM Central Daylight Time, tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com writes:
I was on 20 and dropped to 8 in two weeks, and it took my body and
brain about another 2 weeks to catch up with me  I was down to 2 mgs,
and it sucks far more at the lower dose when it comes to withdrawal.
It’s always those last few mgs that kick my ass.  it takes about 4
days to really feel the effect of the kick form it, or at least for
me.  yucka.
love tink
thax howard/fire3456

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] trickster points and laughs—bless your heart
Date: May 31, 2005 at 9:54:29 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

That was out of line. It’s Jason’s usual plea for attention like
constantly snipping at Dana Beal.

He’s trolling.

Maybe he had a worse then usual day.

I’m not the most mature person, I post off topic, guilty as charged but
that was more like the spirit of a prison rape, then ibogaine.

Jason I really don’t care how wise you are in your own mind, how much
methadone you’ve been on, what drugs you’ve done. I haven’t wasted my
whole life like you, it must suck, I’m sorry for you. In case you don’t
get it, none of that makes you cool, it makes you a socially retarded
dumbass.

I know you aren’t here for anyone but yourself and don’t owe anyone
anything like you like to say all the time (what about all the people
who spent their time treating you and getting you off methadone?).

Maybe you need to do more ibogaine or light a candle for yourself. That
was pathetic.

.:vector:.

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
OK, thats it, I can’t take this shit without sayin’ sumpin’. Is this

some kind of attempt at starting a useless thread about absolutely
nothing? OK I’m game. Let’s figure out what the Inuits are getting
high on. Think about it. These people are sitting on ice and they
look higher than a rats ass on Kilimanjaro. Just what the hell are
they doing for a buzz?  Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Make Yahoo! your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] trickster points and laughs—bless your heart
Date: May 31, 2005 at 9:34:27 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The sun drips slowly down the edges of the mountains, lighting the
bark of the tree that sits lonely at the edge of the cliff.  As the
light refracts back on stone, a seam in the rock wall pulses a dull
blue, as if beckoning me to enter.  I feel along the edges, and feel
nothing but cold roughness.  I still can’t figure out what these
Inuits are doing when they slip out of the igloo, but they won’t quit
giggling, and it’s beginning to piss me off.   I lean against the rock
wall, and suddenly am engulfed.  I don’t slpi through, I don’t fall
in, I am simply engulfed.  It’s dark and moist and pulsating, and i
can feel the tingle rippling through my body, but I am definately not
giggling yet.  Fuckin Inuits…

On 5/31/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
OK, thats it, I can’t take this shit without sayin’ sumpin’. Is this some
kind of attempt at starting a useless thread about absolutely nothing? OK
I’m game. Let’s figure out what the Inuits are getting high on. Think about
it. These people are sitting on ice and they look higher than a rats ass on
Kilimanjaro. Just what the hell are they doing for a buzz?  Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] trickster points and laughs—bless your heart
Date: May 31, 2005 at 9:26:44 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

OK, thats it, I can’t take this shit without sayin’ sumpin’. Is this some kind of attempt at starting a useless thread about absolutely nothing? OK I’m game. Let’s figure out what the Inuits are getting high on. Think about it. These people are sitting on ice and they look higher than a rats ass on Kilimanjaro. Just what the hell are they doing for a buzz?  Randy

From: “basel novo” <baselnovo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 31, 2005 at 8:59:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: “Rick Strcat” <rickstrcat@hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: Tue, 31 May 2005 05:31:07 +0000

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 08:48:08 -0700

This sort of protocol has not been discussed much. I think that
someone in Holland was selling low-dose capsules for this purpose,
but as far as I remember no one who actually did it did it told
their story here.

Probably the dose would be adjusted for the individual. If I were
to do it, I’d try 1 to 2 mg/kg to start with, allowing a few hours
free of distraction to observe the effect, then adjust up or down.
I haven’t been substance-addicted, but have used doses around .1
mg/kg a few times a week for a month or so at a time. It wore me
down physically but helped me let go of some unreasonable
expectations about life.

Thanks very much for the info.  If you could describe the effects at that low dosage, especially changes in blood pressure and pulse rate (if any), that would be really helpful.

Btw, the reason I’m asking is that I’m still trying to figure out whether the medical concerns about iboga self-treatment essentially go away at the dosage levels you describe.  Comments on this from anyone are welcome.  Thanks.

Thanks.

The value of any ibogaine treatment is likely to be enhanced by
therapy, and low doses are easier to integrate with the pace of
normal personal growth. I believe that what iboga is usually
helping to fix is patterns that keep/protect us from connecting
with each other.

I think part of the appeal of the big-dose experience for personal
change is that it is seen as solitary, allowing the belief that the
ego will somehow retain its isolation. But in the end deep change
is probably necessary for those of us who seek iboga, and in my
experience that takes time. It may be that the big-dose experience
is economically optimal for addiction treatment.

In any case, beware: ibogaine resets tolerance for opiates, so
there is a danger of overdosing with them after ibogaine.

On Fri, 20 May 2005 17:24:04 -0700 Rick Strcat
<rickstrcat@hotmail.com> wrote:
>I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
>have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
>Any responses would be really welcome.
>
>Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
>addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
>take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
>If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
>low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really
>serious
>withdrawals but lots of craving.
>
>Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several
>days
>for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone
>with
>experience with this, especially with self-treatment.
>
>Thanks.
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today –
>it’s FREE!
>http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
>
>
>
>  /]=————————————————————–

>——-=[\r
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>  ]=—————————————————————

>——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar – get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] trickster points and laughs—bless your heart
Date: May 31, 2005 at 7:34:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What a charming and witty person you are, I’m sure you have many
friends and are a big hit with the ladies.

Trickster may be a aspiration, but no need to flatter yourself. From
what I’ve read here from you, you’ve made it as far as village idiot.
If that was your goal, congratulations.

KV

On 5/31/05, Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com> wrote:

I am power tripping and acting like
egomaniac

Carla never talks to anyone directly and looks like she isn’t living any of
advice she keeps giving.

I need to get laid more.  I will go pee on myself now.
Carla B

(this won’t make Dana or Ben’s newletter)

I consider Carla therapy  a total luxury really, having someone be
interested in all the little
dramas of my life, I think it’s fucking great.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: PSYTOPIA PSYCHEDELIC FESTIVAL
Date: May 31, 2005 at 6:41:47 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This looks like a lot of fun- too bad I can’t afford a trip to Jamaica. I’d go simply to see Ozric Tenticles and My Life with the Thrill Kill Kult.
And for the beaches and to experience Jamaica itself, since I’ve never been. Ah well, nEXt time of course, once I’m rolling in lots of money from all those best sellers I’m cranking out (not to mention starring roles in all those amazingly great films I’m gonna be starring in sooner than later) in my lifetime.
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.
—– Original Message —–
From: webmaster@hightimes.com
To: thmq@hightimes.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2005 3:54 PM
Subject: PSYTOPIA PSYCHEDELIC FESTIVAL

PSYTOPIA PSYCHEDELIC FESTIVAL

August 17-23, 2005

HIGH TIMES is proud to announce we will be a sponsor of an amazing event this summer called Psytopia (http://www.psytopia.org) — a 7 day psychedelic festival in Jamaica at the Hedonism III & Breezer Bay Resorts on Aug 17-23, 2005. Psytopia will be a 24/7 event unlike anything you’ve ever experienced before, including live music, speakers and presenters brought together from around the globe to help raise money for some high-minded charities. This year’s event will benefit NORML, MAPS, The Albert Hofmann Foundation and The Drug Policy Alliance.

FOR MORE INFORMATION & TO SIGN UP VISIT:
http://www.psytopia.org/

SCHEDULED TO APPEAR:
Alex Grey
Art Fusion Experiment (Feat. Paul Booth, Guy Aitchison, & Filip Leu)
Arj, Doug, and Tony from Marijuana Logues
Brothers Past
Doug Stanhope of the Manshow
Conspirator (Feat. Marc and Aaron of the Disco Biscuits)
Erowid
Ozric Tentacles
Eat Static
My Life With The Thrill Kill Kult
Laser’s by GeminiTV (Who has also worked with Jimi Hendrix, the Who and Pink Floyd)
The Church of Subgenius
Jamaican Xotic Mushrooms
…and much more

Best of all the one ticket price covers your hotel, all you can eat, all you can drink and 24/7 worth of entertainment. Also included: Snorkeling, scuba diving, sailing, and circus school.

There are still limited tickets available, including some with ocean front rooms. There’s even a simple payment plan to make it affordable for everyone.

So won’t you join us in Jamaica for what I’m sure will be one amazing trip!
Click here to be removed from this list.

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] trickster points and laughs—bless your heart
Date: May 31, 2005 at 3:42:51 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com> wrote:
I am power tripping and acting like
egomaniac

Carla never talks to anyone directly and looks like she isn’t living any of
advice she keeps giving.

I need to get laid more.  I will go pee on myself now.
Carla B
(this won’t make Dana or Ben’s newletter)
> I consider Carla therapy  a total luxury really, having someone be
> interested in all the little
> dramas of my life, I think it’s fucking great.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] for hackers
Date: May 31, 2005 at 3:35:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

fyi, start looking over your shoulder like yesterday,

EVERYthing is recorded ; )

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] crusty hippo
Date: May 31, 2005 at 3:34:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

how’s is your musium coming along Dana?

Bless your heart.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] so here’s a question I need answered sooner than later, if it so pleases the list…
Date: May 31, 2005 at 1:27:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was on 20 and dropped to 8 in two weeks, and it took my body and
brain about another 2 weeks to catch up with me  I was down to 2 mgs,
and it sucks far more at the lower dose when it comes to withdrawal.
It’s always those last few mgs that kick my ass.  it takes about 4
days to really feel the effect of the kick form it, or at least for
me.  yucka.
love tink
thax howard/fire3456

On 5/31/05, fire3456@aol.com <fire3456@aol.com> wrote:

Hi Howard/Tink,

From what I have read, and from what people who have had used/1st hand
experience with Bup/Sub, a fast taper is much better.  4 or 5 weeks.  People
who have used Sub seem to agree that faster tapper is better than a gradual
long taper.  The w/d are actually said to be less with a fast taper for some
reason.

Also, does anyone have any advice on switching from Bup back to something
else.  My Sub DR just lost his license and I have finally found a DR that
will help but can’t prescribe Sub.  So I may have to switch.  Although I am
going to try an even faster taper with the Sub I have left (maybe 2 weeks
worth left) I’m down to 1mg/day and having difficulty going lower without
w/ds beginning.

PS:  I was on Sub, but obviously wasn’t off it long enough, when I tried
Ibogaine.  It did reset some of my receptors where I was able to get along
with a lot less Sub.  I think a maintenance dose of Ibo would have done the
trick, had I had enough for a couple of weeks or so.

—–Original Message—–
From: HSLotsof@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Mon, 30 May 2005 20:32:25 EDT
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] so here’s a question I need answered sooner than
later, if it so pleases the list…

The Naloxone was added to stop people from shooting buprenorphine. It is
virtually inactive when taken sublingually but, will put you into immediate
withdrawal if taken IV.

Responses to switching to buprenorphine (agonist/antagonist) to a full
agonist (hydrocodone/vicodin) will depend on the dose of vicodin and
individual
responses.

The general procedure for switching from a full agonist to buprenorphine is
to let yourself go into withdrawal before you take the buprenorphine. It is
really a crap shoot. Some patients have to take buprenorphine for a few days
before they feel better and may even feel worse on day one.

There is nothing wrong with returning to buprenorphine either as a
maintenance drug or to assist you in tapering. When it comes to tapering
from
opioids,
slower is better, particularly when you are dealing with school and home
issues.

Howard

In a message dated 5/30/05 11:42:24 AM, tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com writes:

Not having much knowledge about the induction of subutex( straight
buprenorphine), I was wondering if any one knew what would happen if I
were to take one after not taking them since Friday am, havin switched
over to -ugh-vicodin. i know that you aren’t supposed to take the
suboxone because of the naloxone in it, but my knowledge is impaired
when it comes to this other stuff. basically, I feel like holy hell,
have no idea if i even have a reason to have switched off the shit
anymore, and have to function here at home, as well as finish up my
school work, and i have no more of anything else. So, does anyone
know if it’ll cause more withdrwawl like the other shit if you take it
after you’ve had soemthing with an opiate base?
Heeeeeeeellllllllllllppppppppp!!!!!!!!
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Fw: What’s Love?
Date: May 31, 2005 at 10:04:16 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LOL,
Right on Randy, right on.

Peace and love,
Preston

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com ; drugwar@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 31, 2005 5:07 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Fw: What’s Love?

Hey Preston, how bout this?       Love is that feeling you get after you come out of an Ibogaine session for all the friends that you have and and all the ones you haven’t met yet. I love you brother.       Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] FW: [Seth and Jane Roberts] image of our consciouness
Date: May 31, 2005 at 8:25:49 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

 

>
>Cosmic Cookie
>
> Every Human Baby that is born is inhabited
> by a Human Mind or Consciousness.
> The Baby grows up… lives a bit… and dies.
> The Human Mind however never dies.
> The Human Mind has been born thousands of times
> but the Human Body is brand new every time.
> Not only is the Body new every time
> but every time the Body is more evolved.
> The Human-Mind-Creator has learned to create
> better Human Bodies for better Human Minds.
> We are learning Creators.
>
> OUR MATTER BODY IS THE IMAGE OF OUR CONSCIOUSNESS
>
>
>
>
>Seagulls Fly High and Observe the World,,,,,,,,,,
>Dolphins Swimm and Chatter Wisely,,,,,,,,,
>Whales Dive Deep and Sing the Song of the Earth

Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy. /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 31, 2005 at 5:32:36 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/30/2005 11:36:45 PM Eastern Standard Time, Tink wrote
It’s different everywhere, but the more rural the area, I’m
>> discovering, the more the lack of resources
Tink, I love you by the way, but you gotta know about what is happening in KY. There is a public clinic (as in sliding scale, most pay a dollar a day) in Lexington, run by a very good friend of mine. The waiting list is over 2 years for that one. There are also 8 other pay clinics as we call them, in strategic places all over KY. All of them have a waiting list too. I can’t really say how long. Too fucking long if you ask me. Anyway, in my jaded and uneducated opinion we need to let Doctors deal with more of these patients. I conned my way into it, or should I say that I found a couple of Doctors who actually cared about my health and gave me Methadone for “pain issues”. Pain, as in “fuck me, I can’t take this shit anymore please help me. I can’t fight Hep C and fight my way into the clinic every day. I aint got the energy. I’m finding that a lot of addicts are becoming middle age and we have legitamit pain issues as well as being addicted. Family DR’s should be allowed to help these people. Not 30 at a time. As many of their patients that need it. Methadone or bup. or whatever is best for the patient.          Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Fw: What’s Love?
Date: May 31, 2005 at 5:07:43 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Preston, how bout this?       Love is that feeling you get after you come out of an Ibogaine session for all the friends that you have and and all the ones you haven’t met yet. I love you brother.       Randy

From: “Rick Strcat” <rickstrcat@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 31, 2005 at 1:31:07 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: Thu, 26 May 2005 08:48:08 -0700

This sort of protocol has not been discussed much. I think that
someone in Holland was selling low-dose capsules for this purpose,
but as far as I remember no one who actually did it did it told
their story here.

Probably the dose would be adjusted for the individual. If I were
to do it, I’d try 1 to 2 mg/kg to start with, allowing a few hours
free of distraction to observe the effect, then adjust up or down.
I haven’t been substance-addicted, but have used doses around .1
mg/kg a few times a week for a month or so at a time. It wore me
down physically but helped me let go of some unreasonable
expectations about life.

Thanks very much for the info.  If you could describe the effects at that low dosage, especially changes in blood pressure and pulse rate (if any), that would be really helpful.

Thanks.

The value of any ibogaine treatment is likely to be enhanced by
therapy, and low doses are easier to integrate with the pace of
normal personal growth. I believe that what iboga is usually
helping to fix is patterns that keep/protect us from connecting
with each other.

I think part of the appeal of the big-dose experience for personal
change is that it is seen as solitary, allowing the belief that the
ego will somehow retain its isolation. But in the end deep change
is probably necessary for those of us who seek iboga, and in my
experience that takes time. It may be that the big-dose experience
is economically optimal for addiction treatment.

In any case, beware: ibogaine resets tolerance for opiates, so
there is a danger of overdosing with them after ibogaine.

On Fri, 20 May 2005 17:24:04 -0700 Rick Strcat
<rickstrcat@hotmail.com> wrote:
>I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
>have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
>Any responses would be really welcome.
>
>Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
>addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
>take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
>If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
>low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really
>serious
>withdrawals but lots of craving.
>
>Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several
>days
>for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone
>with
>experience with this, especially with self-treatment.
>
>Thanks.
>
>_________________________________________________________________
>Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today –
>it’s FREE!
>http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/
>
>
>
>  /]=————————————————————–

>——-=[\r
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>  ]=—————————————————————

>——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar – get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: fire3456@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] so here’s a question I need answered sooner than later, if it so pleases the list…
Date: May 31, 2005 at 12:21:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Howard/Tink,

From what I have read, and from what people who have had used/1st hand experience with Bup/Sub, a fast taper is much better.  4 or 5 weeks.  People who have used Sub seem to agree that faster tapper is better than a gradual long taper.  The w/d are actually said to be less with a fast taper for some reason.

Also, does anyone have any advice on switching from Bup back to something else.  My Sub DR just lost his license and I have finally found a DR that will help but can’t prescribe Sub.  So I may have to switch.  Although I am going to try an even faster taper with the Sub I have left (maybe 2 weeks worth left) I’m down to 1mg/day and having difficulty going lower without w/ds beginning.

PS:  I was on Sub, but obviously wasn’t off it long enough, when I tried Ibogaine.  It did reset some of my receptors where I was able to get along with a lot less Sub.  I think a maintenance dose of Ibo would have done the trick, had I had enough for a couple of weeks or so.

—–Original Message—–
From: HSLotsof@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Mon, 30 May 2005 20:32:25 EDT
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] so here’s a question I need answered sooner than later, if it so pleases the list…

The Naloxone was added to stop people from shooting buprenorphine. It is
virtually inactive when taken sublingually but, will put you into immediate
withdrawal if taken IV.

Responses to switching to buprenorphine (agonist/antagonist) to a full
agonist (hydrocodone/vicodin) will depend on the dose of vicodin and individual
responses.

The general procedure for switching from a full agonist to buprenorphine is
to let yourself go into withdrawal before you take the buprenorphine. It is
really a crap shoot. Some patients have to take buprenorphine for a few days
before they feel better and may even feel worse on day one.

There is nothing wrong with returning to buprenorphine either as a
maintenance drug or to assist you in tapering. When it comes to tapering from
opioids,
slower is better, particularly when you are dealing with school and home
issues.

Howard

In a message dated 5/30/05 11:42:24 AM, tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com writes:

>Not having much knowledge about the induction of subutex( straight
>buprenorphine), I was wondering if any one knew what would happen if I
>were to take one after not taking them since Friday am, havin switched
>over to -ugh-vicodin. i know that you aren’t supposed to take the
>suboxone because of the naloxone in it, but my knowledge is impaired
>when it comes to this other stuff. basically, I feel like holy hell,
>have no idea if i even have a reason to have switched off the shit
>anymore, and have to function here at home, as well as finish up my
>school work, and i have no more of anything else. So, does anyone
>know if it’ll cause more withdrwawl like the other shit if you take it
>after you’ve had soemthing with an opiate base?
>Heeeeeeeellllllllllllppppppppp!!!!!!!!
>tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] so here’s a question I need answered sooner than later, if it so pleases the list…
Date: May 31, 2005 at 12:03:34 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thank you again.  i took 2 mgs and was okay.  Almost done here, but
what a drag..
tink

On 5/30/05, HSLotsof@aol.com <HSLotsof@aol.com> wrote:
The Naloxone was added to stop people from shooting buprenorphine.  It is
virtually inactive when taken sublingually but, will put you into immediate
withdrawal if taken IV.

Responses to switching to buprenorphine (agonist/antagonist) to a full
agonist (hydrocodone/vicodin) will depend on the dose of vicodin and individual
responses.

The general procedure for switching from a full agonist to buprenorphine is
to let yourself go into withdrawal before you take the buprenorphine.  It is
really a crap shoot. Some patients have to take buprenorphine for a few days
before they feel better and may even feel worse on day one.

There is nothing wrong with returning to buprenorphine either as a
maintenance drug or to assist you in tapering.  When it comes to tapering from opioids,
slower is better, particularly when you are dealing with school and home
issues.

Howard

In a message dated 5/30/05 11:42:24 AM, tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com writes:

Not having much knowledge about the induction of subutex( straight
buprenorphine), I was wondering if any one knew what would happen if I
were to take one after not taking them since Friday am, havin switched
over to -ugh-vicodin.  i know that you aren’t supposed to take the
suboxone because of the naloxone in it, but my knowledge is impaired
when it comes to this other stuff.  basically, I feel like holy hell,
have no idea if i even have a reason to have switched off the shit
anymore, and have to function here at home, as well as finish up my
school work, and i have no more  of anything else.  So, does anyone
know if it’ll cause more withdrwawl like the other shit if you take it
after you’ve had soemthing with an opiate base?
Heeeeeeeellllllllllllppppppppp!!!!!!!!
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 11:36:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dana, you sent Denny here, and I have never got one cent for his
treatment, he stayed for 10 days no one else would have treated him with
the physical problems he has and beside Denny broke a 300$ glas pipe,
I never got that refunded too.
talking about sociopaths… I think it is time to pay back Dana, You may
not think that way but I’m a human too.now you got my help when you needed
it but there is nothing in return.And Denny is not into Ibogaine, beside
he got Iboga and not Ibogaine.
he wouldn’t have came if he knew you were NOT going to pay for sending him
here after you promissed. You got me…  Good cheating trick.
Sara

Vermont is a special case. I had problems with Howard Dean on account
of this medical marijuana position, but his stance on treatment on
demand for addicts was even more reprehensible. There’s no sign that
his vetoing methadone presaged a preference for more enlightened
treatment options. His attitude, for a doctor, was more prosecutorial
than medical when it came to treatment for addicts that was no
thinly-veiled punishment. No wonder democrats keep on losing; on drugs
they’re indistinguishable from republicans.

So far as I know there were two people in Vermont who were into
ibogaine, and one of them just left. He had the cable show in
Burlington; moved back to Chicago. The other, Denny Lane, lives way the
fuck out at the end of a country road a couple of hours from
Burlington. He’s a chronic pain patient who got iboga at Sara’s. Can’t
do much.

Still, there’s a lot of potential in Vermont, especially if we can open
up the clinic in Montreal.

Dana/cnw

On May 30, 2005, at 10:32 AM, tink wrote:

I have had this problem as of late with my therapist, in that I’ve
stated very clearly what my needs and problems are and have been, and
continue to be, and he hasnt said more than, “Mmm-hmm, that’s great.
Here’s your prescription.  Please stay in compliance with the rules
and keep your insurance updated. Have a nice day, and see you in a
month.”  I don’t thiink I’ve actually spoken to him for longer than 10
minutes in the past 7 months.  When I said something about that, and
the fact that I didn’t want to be on these lovely little pills
anymore(suboxone), he had an “emergency” meeting, in which he got the
other two who ‘lead’ our group therapy and they sat in a semi circle,
informing me that I’ll never make it without the aid of some form of
opiate agonist/antagonist in me, and was I not thinking clearly about
my decision to want to get off of the stuff?
Unfortunately, in the area I live in currently, they’re still at the
point where there is no problem, for if you don’t acknowledge the
elephant in the living room, it’ll go away, right?  it makes the
availablity of care extremely limited and spots for these doctors who
DO provide buprenorphine and methadone are hotly contested. There are
only 150 slots, in THE WHOLE STATE, available for methadone, and each
doctor per practice, not each doctor individually, can prescribe
suboxone for only 30 people.  The waiting list is as long as 8 months,
and the only other options available are to join a clinic in
Massachussets, use, or move.  My mother was told that i would be
better off on the streets of Miami, or NYC (where ever I was at the
moment) because there simply wasn’t anything anyone here could do.
When I finally did come home, I transferred clinics from miami to
here, but when I got here and went in to see them, they informed me
they would only host dose me for 2 weeks, and then it was up to me to
figure it out, but they would gladly put my name on list.  This is
after 3 months of arrangements being made between my doctor in Florida
and the people here, as well as all of the calling and arranging I was
fortunate enough to have done for me by my parents.
It’s different everywhere, but the more rural the area, I’m
discovering, the more the lack of resources.  Oh, they do want to open
a born again christian faith based rehab, but they’re currently trying
to expunge what few resources there are, saying they cause more
problems due to the relapse rate of addicts.
I found a little sticker that I put on the fridge the other day, and
it says, “Religion is for people who are afraid of going to hell;
spirituality is for those of us who have been there.”
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Fw: What’s Love?
Date: May 30, 2005 at 9:42:43 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
This it totally off topic, but I thought I’d share it anyway.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Vanessa Cleary
To: Preston Peet
Sent: Monday, May 30, 2005 4:58 PM
Subject: Fw: What’s Love?

—– Original Message —– From: maria monaco
To: walt wimer ; Vanessa Cleary ; rick monaco ; mary mc gee ; linda grotenstein ; lee clark ; jason cameron ; Jan Pike ; James Smith ; irene hancox ; fran huelse ; eyeknit2@adelphia.net ; Elizabeth Tice ; carol harmon
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2005 6:26 PM
Subject: Fw: What’s Love?

MUST READ! THESE ARE PRICELESS!
M
—– Original Message —– From: Dana LaScala
To: Vern ; Treacy Dunigan ; Tracy McSweeney ; Theresa Bray ; Susan Haas ; Racioppi, Victor ; Nora Smeltzer ; nicole reichard ; Natalie Pepe ; Maria Monaco ; Liz Dunigan ; Kim Cirlin ; katie mulvey ; Jesus Navarro ; Jessica Bleakley ; Eric Deutch ; Dad COMCAST ; Casey Davison ; Carolynn O’Brien ; Carol DiGirolamo ; Brandi ; Auntie Angela ; Aunt RaeAnn
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2005 6:07 PM
Subject: What’s Love?

A group of professional people posed this question to
a group of 4 to 8 year-olds, “What does love mean?”

The answers they got were broader and deeper than
anyone could have imagined. See what you think:

————————————————————————
——–

“When my grandmother got arthritis, she couldn’t bend
over and paint her toenails anymore.

So my grandfather does it for her all the time, even
when his hands got arthritis too. That’s love.”

Rebecca- age 8

————————————————————————
——–

“When someone loves you, the way they say your name is different.

You just know that your name is safe in their mouth.”

Billy – age 4

———————————————————— ————
——–

“Love is when a girl puts on perfume and a boy puts on
shaving cologne and they go out and smell each other.”

Karl – age 5

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is when you go out to eat and give somebody most
of your French fries without making them give you any
of theirs.”

Chrissy – age 6

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is what makes you smile when you’re tired.”

Terri – age 4

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is when my mommy makes coffee for my daddy and
she takes a sip before giving it to him, to make sure
the taste is OK.”

Danny – age 7

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is when you kiss all the time. Then when you get
tired of kissing, you still want to be together and
you talk more.
My Mommy and Daddy are like that. They look gross when
they kiss”

Emily – age 8

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is what’s in the room with you at Christmas if
you stop opening presents and listen.”

Bobby – age 7 (Wow!)

————————————————————————
——–

“If you want to learn to love better, you should start
with a friend who you hate,”

Nikka – age 6
(we need a few million more Nikka’s on this planet)

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is when you tell a guy you like his shirt, then
he wears it everyday.”

Noelle – age 7

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is like a little old woman and a little old man
who are still friends even after they know each other
so well.”

Tommy – age 6

————————————————————————
——–

“During my piano recital, I was on a stage and I was
scared. I looked at all the people watching me and saw
my daddy waving and smiling.

He was the only one doing that. I wasn’t scared
anymore.”

Cindy – age 8

———————————————————————— ——–

“My mommy loves me more than anybody .

You don’t see anyone else kissing me to sleep at
night.”

Clare – age 6

———————————————————————— ——–

“Love is when Mommy gives Daddy the best piece of
chicken.”

Elaine-age 5

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is when Mommy sees Daddy smelly and sweaty and
still says he is handsomer than Robert Redford.”

Chris – age 7

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is when your puppy licks your face even after
you left him alone all day.”

Mary Ann – age 4

————————————————————————
——–

“I know my older sister loves me because she gives me
all her old clothes and has to go out and buy new
ones.”

Lauren – age 4

—————————— ——————————————
——–

“When you love somebody, your eyelashes go up and down
and little stars come out of you.” (what an image)

Karen – age 7

————————————————————————
——–

“Love is when Mommy sees Daddy on the toilet and she
doesn’t think it’s gross.”

Mark – age 6

————————————————————————
——–

“You really shouldn’t say ‘I love you’ unless you mean
it. But if you mean it, you should say it a lot.
People forget.”

Jessica – age 8

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 9:26:59 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well, aint it the same as school? When I had teachers who were great and helpful and , well  were actually real people trying to teach people (not “kids:” in the form of control, make submissive ach tung baby) I learnt so much more and exams were a breeze.   It’;s the same with therapists.  Until we find the one who can help us, we won’t learn, or can’t be helped.
Going thru that with friends
Kirk

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, 31 May 2005 2:17 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn

Nick, your right. When I finally wanted help and found a good therapist I actually got better. Or should I say I became more focused on what I wanted to achieve.       Randy

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] so here’s a question I need answered sooner than later, if it so pleases the list…
Date: May 30, 2005 at 8:32:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The Naloxone was added to stop people from shooting buprenorphine.  It is
virtually inactive when taken sublingually but, will put you into immediate
withdrawal if taken IV.

Responses to switching to buprenorphine (agonist/antagonist) to a full
agonist (hydrocodone/vicodin) will depend on the dose of vicodin and individual
responses.

The general procedure for switching from a full agonist to buprenorphine is
to let yourself go into withdrawal before you take the buprenorphine.  It is
really a crap shoot. Some patients have to take buprenorphine for a few days
before they feel better and may even feel worse on day one.

There is nothing wrong with returning to buprenorphine either as a
maintenance drug or to assist you in tapering.  When it comes to tapering from opioids,
slower is better, particularly when you are dealing with school and home
issues.

Howard

In a message dated 5/30/05 11:42:24 AM, tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com writes:

Not having much knowledge about the induction of subutex( straight
buprenorphine), I was wondering if any one knew what would happen if I
were to take one after not taking them since Friday am, havin switched
over to -ugh-vicodin.  i know that you aren’t supposed to take the
suboxone because of the naloxone in it, but my knowledge is impaired
when it comes to this other stuff.  basically, I feel like holy hell,
have no idea if i even have a reason to have switched off the shit
anymore, and have to function here at home, as well as finish up my
school work, and i have no more  of anything else.  So, does anyone
know if it’ll cause more withdrwawl like the other shit if you take it
after you’ve had soemthing with an opiate base?
Heeeeeeeellllllllllllppppppppp!!!!!!!!
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] fwd fwd reality creation
Date: May 30, 2005 at 7:46:36 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

And……We’re not human remembering to be Spirit, We are spirit trying to be human.  Juss gotta ‘member Hehheh, um, that which I um, forgot…….
urhhhh
From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, 31 May 2005 11:21 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] fwd fwd reality creation

>                      Do not think for one Minute that you have a Soul.
>                            On the Contrary… your Soul has you.
>                      The Human Form or Instrument is created by Spirit
>                          in order to experience the Plane of Earth.
>                              You are only visiting this Plane.
>                     This Plane of Existence is an enormous Movie Theater
>                        into which you are born and live for a while.
>                           Since you know nothing but this Theater
>                       you think that this is the only Thing there is.
>                          The Movie you’re watching is but a Dream.
>                       Please wake up and discover who you really are.
> 
>                             YOU CAN NEVER OWN A PLACE YOU VISIT
>
Namaste
Matthew
Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] fwd fwd reality creation
Date: May 30, 2005 at 7:20:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

>                      Do not think for one Minute that you have a Soul.
>                            On the Contrary… your Soul has you.
>                      The Human Form or Instrument is created by Spirit
>                          in order to experience the Plane of Earth.
>                              You are only visiting this Plane.
>                     This Plane of Existence is an enormous Movie Theater
>                        into which you are born and live for a while.
>                           Since you know nothing but this Theater
>                       you think that this is the only Thing there is.
>                          The Movie you’re watching is but a Dream.
>                       Please wake up and discover who you really are.
>
>                             YOU CAN NEVER OWN A PLACE YOU VISIT
>

Namaste
Matthew

Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 4:11:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i have gone after my recovery with all of everything that i have
inside.  I have participated in getting  funding for rehabs, i have
spoken to our senate and legisators about the needs out here for more
accessiblity.  I do take responsibility for all of my actions, and
while not necessarily 100%, have put as much into this as i did
getting high.
I made it off methadone, almost off of buprenorphine, and back to
school in under 4 months.  It’s not a matter of me waiting for someone
to fix me, it’s general frustration that help isn’t readily available.
i have had the luxury-and it IS a luxury- of much support from my
family, without whom i wouldn’t have made it this far.  Not everyone
has that, and my frustration stems from the lacksidaisical(sp?)
attitude and the, “well, their only addicts” attitude that is always
in place.  I think you’ve misunderstood what I meant. and i don’t mean
to come off like I’m attacking, but at the same time, there are alot
of very difficult choices to be made when you do live in an area where
they won’t even admit that there IS a problem.
tink
On 5/30/05, Nick Sandberg <nick227@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: 30 May 2005 15:32
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn

I have had this problem as of late with my therapist, in that I’ve
stated very clearly what my needs and problems are and have been, and
continue to be, and he hasnt said more than, “Mmm-hmm, that’s great.
Here’s your prescription.  Please stay in compliance with the rules
and keep your insurance updated. Have a nice day, and see you in a
month.”  I don’t thiink I’ve actually spoken to him for longer than 10
minutes in the past 7 months.  When I said something about that, and
the fact that I didn’t want to be on these lovely little pills
anymore(suboxone), he had an “emergency” meeting, in which he got the
other two who ‘lead’ our group therapy and they sat in a semi circle,
informing me that I’ll never make it without the aid of some form of
opiate agonist/antagonist in me, and was I not thinking clearly about
my decision to want to get off of the stuff?
Unfortunately, in the area I live in currently, they’re still at the
point where there is no problem, for if you don’t acknowledge the
elephant in the living room, it’ll go away, right?  it makes the
availablity of care extremely limited and spots for these doctors who
DO provide buprenorphine and methadone are hotly contested. There are
only 150 slots, in THE WHOLE STATE, available for methadone, and each
doctor per practice, not each doctor individually, can prescribe
suboxone for only 30 people.  The waiting list is as long as 8 months,
and the only other options available are to join a clinic in
Massachussets, use, or move.  My mother was told that i would be
better off on the streets of Miami, or NYC (where ever I was at the
moment) because there simply wasn’t anything anyone here could do.
When I finally did come home, I transferred clinics from miami to
here, but when I got here and went in to see them, they informed me
they would only host dose me for 2 weeks, and then it was up to me to
figure it out, but they would gladly put my name on list.  This is
after 3 months of arrangements being made between my doctor in Florida
and the people here, as well as all of the calling and arranging I was
fortunate enough to have done for me by my parents.
It’s different everywhere, but the more rural the area, I’m
discovering, the more the lack of resources.  Oh, they do want to open
a born again christian faith based rehab, but they’re currently trying
to expunge what few resources there are, saying they cause more
problems due to the relapse rate of addicts.
I found a little sticker that I put on the fridge the other day, and
it says, “Religion is for people who are afraid of going to hell;
spirituality is for those of us who have been there.”
tink

The way I see it, at some point you have to empower YOURself to make the
change. If you keep the onus on other people to change you, then you’re just
disempowering yourself. You have to let go of this whole “Yes, but….”
attitude. Where you live and the social setting doesn’t matter. The whole
issue with change has ultimately nothing to do with outside circumstances,
and ultimately everything to do with your attitude. When you start to take
full personal responsibility for everything that happens in your life, then
change is gonna come pretty fast. It’s not so cool to not be able to blame
others, it’s a bit of a drag, really. It takes a lot of maturity and I
wouldn’t personally claim to be there by a long shot myself. But it does
work. We always have a choice, each of us, every instant we’re alive, to
stick with the “Yes, but…” or to take it on ourselves.

Nick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 4:07:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nick and Matthew, both of you gave great comments that
are close to home for me. I don’t think I am in any
way unique with having had really bad experiences with
both doctors and therapists. Then moving towards the
more open ended and not western oriented ‘shamanic’
types, almost without exception I’ve found a lot of
new age people power tripping and acting like
egomaniacs about ‘spirituality’ and ‘shamanism’ they
could go off about spirit and integration, god, going
down to the depths and integrating all day long, but
when you take a look at who they are and their own
lives, it never looked like they were living any of
the great advice they kept giving.

I’m with matthew and if anybody knows someone
channeling the spirit of Jung, please let me in on it.
The closest thing I’ve found to true shamanism and
real knowledge of drugs and addiction, is mindvox. If
there is a mindvox therapist I still haven’t found
them at least not handing out business cards with the
word ‘shaman’ on them 😉

What has worked for me and still works, are group
settings. Like this one and in person, even if the
group isn’t perfect and really what group is, or
something happens that bothers me, if I get upset or
into a argument then sometimes it is only because
someone else is being an ass, but sometimes it does
help to make me aware of my own response and problems,
its like watching myself, but feeling safe and ok to
do that. Whatever the exact group dynamic, I usually
feel better afterwards, like a load was lifted, even
if I feel worse for a while getting to the good part
🙂

Carla B

— Nick Sandberg <nick227@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

I consider therapy bloody great, within the context
it operates in. It’s
like a total luxury really, having someone be
interested in all the little
dramas of my life, I think it’s fucking great.
Shamanism I think is also
great and I have been in quite a few sweat lodges
and soul retrieval
sessions, all this new age stuff. Though my
experience is that a lot of
shamen really lack social skills and real humanistic
awareness. They’re
acting out a bit of a healer trip really, getting
off on this whole
spiritual drama they can create. Which is also OK as
they can also give a
lot.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: matthew zielinski
[mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com]
Sent: 30 May 2005 12:26
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed
Conn

Hi

that was very interesting…..however i can attest
to spilling my llllife
to “experienced therapists”
psychologists,hypntotists whatever with
disastrous results….it might be i havent fuond the
right one(if the spirit
of Jung is still conducting treatments pls drop me a
line)….

therapists when they hit a dead end are
mostly….”hmmm maybe we should
try another route………hmm how about something
for anxiety,
insomnia,depresion and if u are really bothering me
and hanging on my neck
i’ll prescribe some opiates too just so the next
time u come back u wont
keep talking all the time”…..

well that was my experience with whoever i saw so
i basicaly give up
…however seeing a shaman does sound like a really
good idea

…..i would love to read peoples experiences with
“therapists” thatt
actualy got them somewhere….love to all u my
people

Namaste
Matthew

—————————————————————————-

Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN
Premium: Join now and get
the first two months FREE*

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business – Try our new Resources site
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 4:08:34 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Vermont is a special case. I had problems with Howard Dean on account of this medical marijuana position, but his stance on treatment on demand for addicts was even more reprehensible. There’s no sign that his vetoing methadone presaged a preference for more enlightened treatment options. His attitude, for a doctor, was more prosecutorial than medical when it came to treatment for addicts that was no thinly-veiled punishment. No wonder democrats keep on losing; on drugs they’re indistinguishable from republicans.

So far as I know there were two people in Vermont who were into ibogaine, and one of them just left. He had the cable show in Burlington; moved back to Chicago. The other, Denny Lane, lives way the fuck out at the end of a country road a couple of hours from Burlington. He’s a chronic pain patient who got iboga at Sara’s. Can’t do much.

Still, there’s a lot of potential in Vermont, especially if we can open up the clinic in Montreal.

Dana/cnw

On May 30, 2005, at 10:32 AM, tink wrote:

I have had this problem as of late with my therapist, in that I’ve
stated very clearly what my needs and problems are and have been, and
continue to be, and he hasnt said more than, “Mmm-hmm, that’s great.
Here’s your prescription.  Please stay in compliance with the rules
and keep your insurance updated. Have a nice day, and see you in a
month.”  I don’t thiink I’ve actually spoken to him for longer than 10
minutes in the past 7 months.  When I said something about that, and
the fact that I didn’t want to be on these lovely little pills
anymore(suboxone), he had an “emergency” meeting, in which he got the
other two who ‘lead’ our group therapy and they sat in a semi circle,
informing me that I’ll never make it without the aid of some form of
opiate agonist/antagonist in me, and was I not thinking clearly about
my decision to want to get off of the stuff?
Unfortunately, in the area I live in currently, they’re still at the
point where there is no problem, for if you don’t acknowledge the
elephant in the living room, it’ll go away, right?  it makes the
availablity of care extremely limited and spots for these doctors who
DO provide buprenorphine and methadone are hotly contested. There are
only 150 slots, in THE WHOLE STATE, available for methadone, and each
doctor per practice, not each doctor individually, can prescribe
suboxone for only 30 people.  The waiting list is as long as 8 months,
and the only other options available are to join a clinic in
Massachussets, use, or move.  My mother was told that i would be
better off on the streets of Miami, or NYC (where ever I was at the
moment) because there simply wasn’t anything anyone here could do.
When I finally did come home, I transferred clinics from miami to
here, but when I got here and went in to see them, they informed me
they would only host dose me for 2 weeks, and then it was up to me to
figure it out, but they would gladly put my name on list.  This is
after 3 months of arrangements being made between my doctor in Florida
and the people here, as well as all of the calling and arranging I was
fortunate enough to have done for me by my parents.
It’s different everywhere, but the more rural the area, I’m
discovering, the more the lack of resources.  Oh, they do want to open
a born again christian faith based rehab, but they’re currently trying
to expunge what few resources there are, saying they cause more
problems due to the relapse rate of addicts.
I found a little sticker that I put on the fridge the other day, and
it says, “Religion is for people who are afraid of going to hell;
spirituality is for those of us who have been there.”
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 3:55:50 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: 30 May 2005 15:32
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn

I have had this problem as of late with my therapist, in that I’ve
stated very clearly what my needs and problems are and have been, and
continue to be, and he hasnt said more than, “Mmm-hmm, that’s great.
Here’s your prescription.  Please stay in compliance with the rules
and keep your insurance updated. Have a nice day, and see you in a
month.”  I don’t thiink I’ve actually spoken to him for longer than 10
minutes in the past 7 months.  When I said something about that, and
the fact that I didn’t want to be on these lovely little pills
anymore(suboxone), he had an “emergency” meeting, in which he got the
other two who ‘lead’ our group therapy and they sat in a semi circle,
informing me that I’ll never make it without the aid of some form of
opiate agonist/antagonist in me, and was I not thinking clearly about
my decision to want to get off of the stuff?
Unfortunately, in the area I live in currently, they’re still at the
point where there is no problem, for if you don’t acknowledge the
elephant in the living room, it’ll go away, right?  it makes the
availablity of care extremely limited and spots for these doctors who
DO provide buprenorphine and methadone are hotly contested. There are
only 150 slots, in THE WHOLE STATE, available for methadone, and each
doctor per practice, not each doctor individually, can prescribe
suboxone for only 30 people.  The waiting list is as long as 8 months,
and the only other options available are to join a clinic in
Massachussets, use, or move.  My mother was told that i would be
better off on the streets of Miami, or NYC (where ever I was at the
moment) because there simply wasn’t anything anyone here could do.
When I finally did come home, I transferred clinics from miami to
here, but when I got here and went in to see them, they informed me
they would only host dose me for 2 weeks, and then it was up to me to
figure it out, but they would gladly put my name on list.  This is
after 3 months of arrangements being made between my doctor in Florida
and the people here, as well as all of the calling and arranging I was
fortunate enough to have done for me by my parents.
It’s different everywhere, but the more rural the area, I’m
discovering, the more the lack of resources.  Oh, they do want to open
a born again christian faith based rehab, but they’re currently trying
to expunge what few resources there are, saying they cause more
problems due to the relapse rate of addicts.
I found a little sticker that I put on the fridge the other day, and
it says, “Religion is for people who are afraid of going to hell;
spirituality is for those of us who have been there.”
tink

The way I see it, at some point you have to empower YOURself to make the
change. If you keep the onus on other people to change you, then you’re just
disempowering yourself. You have to let go of this whole “Yes, but….”
attitude. Where you live and the social setting doesn’t matter. The whole
issue with change has ultimately nothing to do with outside circumstances,
and ultimately everything to do with your attitude. When you start to take
full personal responsibility for everything that happens in your life, then
change is gonna come pretty fast. It’s not so cool to not be able to blame
others, it’s a bit of a drag, really. It takes a lot of maturity and I
wouldn’t personally claim to be there by a long shot myself. But it does
work. We always have a choice, each of us, every instant we’re alive, to
stick with the “Yes, but…” or to take it on ourselves.

Nick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Help for a friend in England
Date: May 30, 2005 at 3:27:07 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think there are some guys selling rootbark mail order over here, but I’d recommend more ordering from one of the two first places I list at www.ibogaine.co.uk/options.htm

Nick
—–Original Message—–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com]
Sent: 30 May 2005 20:01
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Help for a friend in England

I have a friend in London that asked me the easiest way to get Ibogaine over there. Can’t you just order it in the mail in England? I’m not sure so I thought maybe Nick or somebody else in the UK could help me with some info. Any help appreciated.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Help for a friend in England
Date: May 30, 2005 at 3:00:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have a friend in London that asked me the easiest way to get Ibogaine over there. Can’t you just order it in the mail in England? I’m not sure so I thought maybe Nick or somebody else in the UK could help me with some info. Any help appreciated.    Randy

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] thought for the day
Date: May 30, 2005 at 12:33:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“the greatest good is like water
Which benefits all things
And yet it does not contend
It stays in places that others disdain
And therefore is close to the way of truth”
-Eighth chapter of the Tao te Ching

luv tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] so here’s a question I need answered sooner than later, if it so pleases the list…
Date: May 30, 2005 at 11:42:06 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Not having much knowledge about the induction of subutex( straight
buprenorphine), I was wondering if any one knew what would happen if I
were to take one after not taking them since Friday am, havin switched
over to -ugh-vicodin.  i know that you aren’t supposed to take the
suboxone because of the naloxone in it, but my knowledge is impaired
when it comes to this other stuff.  basically, I feel like holy hell,
have no idea if i even have a reason to have switched off the shit
anymore, and have to function here at home, as well as finish up my
school work, and i have no more  of anything else.  So, does anyone
know if it’ll cause more withdrwawl like the other shit if you take it
after you’ve had soemthing with an opiate base?
Heeeeeeeellllllllllllppppppppp!!!!!!!!
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 10:32:07 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have had this problem as of late with my therapist, in that I’ve
stated very clearly what my needs and problems are and have been, and
continue to be, and he hasnt said more than, “Mmm-hmm, that’s great.
Here’s your prescription.  Please stay in compliance with the rules
and keep your insurance updated. Have a nice day, and see you in a
month.”  I don’t thiink I’ve actually spoken to him for longer than 10
minutes in the past 7 months.  When I said something about that, and
the fact that I didn’t want to be on these lovely little pills
anymore(suboxone), he had an “emergency” meeting, in which he got the
other two who ‘lead’ our group therapy and they sat in a semi circle,
informing me that I’ll never make it without the aid of some form of
opiate agonist/antagonist in me, and was I not thinking clearly about
my decision to want to get off of the stuff?
Unfortunately, in the area I live in currently, they’re still at the
point where there is no problem, for if you don’t acknowledge the
elephant in the living room, it’ll go away, right?  it makes the
availablity of care extremely limited and spots for these doctors who
DO provide buprenorphine and methadone are hotly contested. There are
only 150 slots, in THE WHOLE STATE, available for methadone, and each
doctor per practice, not each doctor individually, can prescribe
suboxone for only 30 people.  The waiting list is as long as 8 months,
and the only other options available are to join a clinic in
Massachussets, use, or move.  My mother was told that i would be
better off on the streets of Miami, or NYC (where ever I was at the
moment) because there simply wasn’t anything anyone here could do.
When I finally did come home, I transferred clinics from miami to
here, but when I got here and went in to see them, they informed me
they would only host dose me for 2 weeks, and then it was up to me to
figure it out, but they would gladly put my name on list.  This is
after 3 months of arrangements being made between my doctor in Florida
and the people here, as well as all of the calling and arranging I was
fortunate enough to have done for me by my parents.
It’s different everywhere, but the more rural the area, I’m
discovering, the more the lack of resources.  Oh, they do want to open
a born again christian faith based rehab, but they’re currently trying
to expunge what few resources there are, saying they cause more
problems due to the relapse rate of addicts.
I found a little sticker that I put on the fridge the other day, and
it says, “Religion is for people who are afraid of going to hell;
spirituality is for those of us who have been there.”
tink
On 5/30/05, Nick Sandberg <nick227@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

I think with a therapist it’s good to be realistic about what you want to
achieve. “I feel disconnected from people, I have trouble making friends,
I’m addicted to sex, I’m scared of intimacy, I want to stop using drugs” –
if you have clearly stated objectives it helps. If you are going to therapy
because the state or family are co-ercing then of course it’s not likely to
work so well. If you are going with the attitude “You! Fix me!” then of
course you are playing victim and putting it all on someone else to sort it
out, then for sure, again, it’s not likely to work.

I consider therapy bloody great, within the context it operates in. It’s
like a total luxury really, having someone be interested in all the little
dramas of my life, I think it’s fucking great. Shamanism I think is also
great and I have been in quite a few sweat lodges and soul retrieval
sessions, all this new age stuff. Though my experience is that a lot of
shamen really lack social skills and real humanistic awareness. They’re
acting out a bit of a healer trip really, getting off on this whole
spiritual drama they can create. Which is also OK as they can also give a
lot.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com]
Sent: 30 May 2005 12:26
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn

Hi

that was very interesting…..however i can attest to spilling my llllife to
“experienced therapists” psychologists,hypntotists whatever with disastrous
results….it might be i havent fuond the right one(if the spirit of Jung is
still conducting treatments pls drop me a line)….

therapists when they hit a dead end are mostly….”hmmm maybe we should try
another route………hmm how about something for anxiety,
insomnia,depresion and if u are really bothering me and hanging on my neck
i’ll prescribe some opiates too just so the next time u come back u wont
keep talking all the time”…..

well that was my experience with whoever i saw so i basicaly give up
…however seeing a shaman does sound like a really good idea

…..i would love to read peoples experiences with “therapists” thatt
actualy got them somewhere….love to all u my people

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get
the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 10:16:47 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nick, your right. When I finally wanted help and found a good therapist I actually got better. Or should I say I became more focused on what I wanted to achieve.       Randy

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 9:59:33 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think with a therapist it’s good to be realistic about what you want to achieve. “I feel disconnected from people, I have trouble making friends, I’m addicted to sex, I’m scared of intimacy, I want to stop using drugs” – if you have clearly stated objectives it helps. If you are going to therapy because the state or family are co-ercing then of course it’s not likely to work so well. If you are going with the attitude “You! Fix me!” then of course you are playing victim and putting it all on someone else to sort it out, then for sure, again, it’s not likely to work.

I consider therapy bloody great, within the context it operates in. It’s like a total luxury really, having someone be interested in all the little dramas of my life, I think it’s fucking great. Shamanism I think is also great and I have been in quite a few sweat lodges and soul retrieval sessions, all this new age stuff. Though my experience is that a lot of shamen really lack social skills and real humanistic awareness. They’re acting out a bit of a healer trip really, getting off on this whole spiritual drama they can create. Which is also OK as they can also give a lot.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com]
Sent: 30 May 2005 12:26
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn

Hi
that was very interesting…..however i can attest to spilling my llllife to “experienced therapists” psychologists,hypntotists whatever with disastrous results….it might be i havent fuond the right one(if the spirit of Jung is still conducting treatments pls drop me a line)….
therapists when they hit a dead end are mostly….”hmmm maybe we should try another route………hmm how about something for anxiety, insomnia,depresion and if u are really bothering me and hanging on my neck i’ll prescribe some opiates too just so the next time u come back u wont keep talking all the time”…..
well that was my experience with whoever i saw so i basicaly give up …however seeing a shaman does sound like a really good idea
…..i would love to read peoples experiences with “therapists” thatt actualy got them somewhere….love to all u my people

Namaste
Matthew

Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 30, 2005 at 9:49:21 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks to the medical community being turned into a type of insurance
scam, i don’t think anyone is in any less danger than the average trip
to the er, at, say, beth israel where i was once told that i wasn’t
sick enough and to come back after my fever hit over 104.  I walked
out the door and passed out, and they charged me for an ambulance ride
to get my body back into the little cubicle i had just walked from.
My friends wife went to get her thyroid checked, and was told she was
fine, no more tests required, but would she stay the night for
observation.  The next day, she was given an extremely high dose of
radiation, due to a chart mix up, and died a half hour after she was
released from the hospital.  There really IS danger in everything, and
it’s a choice not made lightly, to do iboga.  well, by most.  Rapid
detox kills, on average, 2-3 people a month, and THAT’s safe and
legal? I agree that info should be made available to all, but things
really ARE SHITTY AND FUCKED UP.  Like, everywhere!! I know for a fact
that addicts have been guinea pigged on, becasue who’s going to
believe a junky?  I rant, i rave, but i still don’t feel any better
about the state of affairs.
eh.
coffee and a cigarette
luv tink

On 5/30/05, Nick Sandberg <nick227@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

—–Original Message—–
From: sara119@xs4all.nl [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl]
Sent: 28 May 2005 15:16
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment

Nick wrote “There does seem to be something about ibogaine which
attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few. Then again,
who am I to talk?!”.

Nick

Then don’t say it. who cares?
well, there are sociopaths everywhere and in all levels.
they are sick people who need help,alright?  they hope ibogaine can help
them  and maybe it does help with some people.
Sara

Well, it’s true that I am gossiping a bit. But what I would also like to say
is that, on this list, so many people take the position that because other
things aren’t perfect it’s OK that things with ibogaine are a bit fucked up
too. Like, ibogaine is dangerous but because the other options are too it
doesn’t matter that we don’t tell it. Or that some people treating with
ibogaine are doing it from dubious motivations but this is also OK because
there are dodgy people in the White House or something. I just wanna say
that this is NOT my position and I find it just totally a fear position.
Anyone doing this, my view as a therapist, they are doing it because they
fear their own position with ibogaine is untenable. They have to justify a
lot of fuck-ups to not examine themselves.

If there are more deaths this should be publicized so that people are aware
and can make a better informed choice. If there are dodgy characters it’s ok
to talk and look a bit. That’s what I think.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Sent: 26 May 2005 16:48
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment

This sort of protocol has not been discussed much. I think that
someone in Holland was selling low-dose capsules for this purpose,
but as far as I remember no one who actually did it did it told
their story here.

A guy by the name of Chiel Coen, if I remember correctly, was
selling this
stuff at www.iboga.nl. I think he said they were from the Gabon and used
to
make a few big claims. I heard he had a alcohol problem and had
died a few
years back. Not sure if this was true.

There does seem to be something about ibogaine which attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few.
Then again,
who am I to talk?!

Nick

Probably the dose would be adjusted for the individual. If I were
to do it, I’d try 1 to 2 mg/kg to start with, allowing a few hours
free of distraction to observe the effect, then adjust up or down.
I haven’t been substance-addicted, but have used doses around .1
mg/kg a few times a week for a month or so at a time. It wore me
down physically but helped me let go of some unreasonable
expectations about life.

The value of any ibogaine treatment is likely to be enhanced by
therapy, and low doses are easier to integrate with the pace of
normal personal growth. I believe that what iboga is usually
helping to fix is patterns that keep/protect us from connecting
with each other.

I think part of the appeal of the big-dose experience for personal
change is that it is seen as solitary, allowing the belief that the
ego will somehow retain its isolation. But in the end deep change
is probably necessary for those of us who seek iboga, and in my
experience that takes time. It may be that the big-dose experience
is economically optimal for addiction treatment.

In any case, beware: ibogaine resets tolerance for opiates, so
there is a danger of overdosing with them after ibogaine.

On Fri, 20 May 2005 17:24:04 -0700 Rick Strcat
<rickstrcat@hotmail.com> wrote:
I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
Any responses would be really welcome.

Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really
serious
withdrawals but lots of craving.

Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several
days
for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone
with
experience with this, especially with self-treatment.

Thanks.

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today –
it’s FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine OT don’t read this
Date: May 30, 2005 at 9:38:28 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

and you said you were going to deal with your teeth :]
yeah, bushes were frequently visited by me in the not so distant past.
Dumpsters, when not full, work well for hiding, too, but you have to
be selective about which one you jump into.  Especially in warmer
climates.  Ewwwwwwww.
woke up feeling like a live wire was up my ass, shaking and twitching wee ha!
somebody shoot me, por favor.
til later
aloha
tink
hi biscuit boy’s mom!!!  You ROCK!!!

On 5/30/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
I’m crouched behind a big bush watching the cops go by the party I was just
having fun at. Mother fuckers screw up a good thing every time. How was I to
know that Mr. Wrong was having a bad day. He must have run out of Chivas or
something. Shit when the party was going good he was leading the rhumba
line. We should have let him in on the coke we were snorting. Anyway, that
doesn’t explain the rocks I have in my hand. These damn cops need to learn a
lesson. My buddy Fuzzy lets the first one fly. Wham, direct hit. I can’t
believe how bright those lights are when they hit ’em and put the car in
reverse. Dumb asses, we’re already two streets over from where they sit with
the lights on and we’re laughin’ like hyena’s. We know every back yard cut
through and drainage ditch in the ‘hood’. No way they can catch us. More
later

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 9:14:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt, you are reading my mind. I’ve been therapized since 1972, (big surprize huh) and most if not all of them were…….how can I put this nicely?………….fuck it, they were dumber than a bag of hammers. PHD, QHD, DPH what the fuck ever those dudes,(and one woman) gave me a cornicopia of ups, downs, side ways, but never opiates. I could tell these people anything and they would believe it. Then tell my mother what I said. Good way to establish trust, huh? I played those assholes like a violin. That’s why I’m so emotionally grounded now aint it? I gotta go, the devil is telling me to kill all the orange lizards in the woods. I got work to do. Anybody have any Torfinil? I seem to be running low. Damn, I wish these cob webs would stay off of my face.               Randy

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 30, 2005 at 7:26:24 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi
that was very interesting…..however i can attest to spilling my llllife to “experienced therapists” psychologists,hypntotists whatever with disastrous results….it might be i havent fuond the right one(if the spirit of Jung is still conducting treatments pls drop me a line)….
therapists when they hit a dead end are mostly….”hmmm maybe we should try another route………hmm how about something for anxiety, insomnia,depresion and if u are really bothering me and hanging on my neck i’ll prescribe some opiates too just so the next time u come back u wont keep talking all the time”…..
well that was my experience with whoever i saw so i basicaly give up …however seeing a shaman does sound like a really good idea
…..i would love to read peoples experiences with “therapists” thatt actualy got them somewhere….love to all u my people

Namaste
Matthew

Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine OT don’t read this
Date: May 30, 2005 at 7:13:32 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi brother
Keep em coming man…..good shit

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 30, 2005 at 7:05:40 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Original Message—–
From: sara119@xs4all.nl [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl]
Sent: 28 May 2005 15:16
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment

Nick wrote “There does seem to be something about ibogaine which
attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few. Then again,
who am I to talk?!”.

Nick

Then don’t say it. who cares?
well, there are sociopaths everywhere and in all levels.
they are sick people who need help,alright?  they hope ibogaine can help
them  and maybe it does help with some people.
Sara

Well, it’s true that I am gossiping a bit. But what I would also like to say
is that, on this list, so many people take the position that because other
things aren’t perfect it’s OK that things with ibogaine are a bit fucked up
too. Like, ibogaine is dangerous but because the other options are too it
doesn’t matter that we don’t tell it. Or that some people treating with
ibogaine are doing it from dubious motivations but this is also OK because
there are dodgy people in the White House or something. I just wanna say
that this is NOT my position and I find it just totally a fear position.
Anyone doing this, my view as a therapist, they are doing it because they
fear their own position with ibogaine is untenable. They have to justify a
lot of fuck-ups to not examine themselves.

If there are more deaths this should be publicized so that people are aware
and can make a better informed choice. If there are dodgy characters it’s ok
to talk and look a bit. That’s what I think.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Sent: 26 May 2005 16:48
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment

This sort of protocol has not been discussed much. I think that
someone in Holland was selling low-dose capsules for this purpose,
but as far as I remember no one who actually did it did it told
their story here.

A guy by the name of Chiel Coen, if I remember correctly, was
selling this
stuff at www.iboga.nl. I think he said they were from the Gabon and used
to
make a few big claims. I heard he had a alcohol problem and had
died a few
years back. Not sure if this was true.

There does seem to be something about ibogaine which attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few.
Then again,
who am I to talk?!

Nick

Probably the dose would be adjusted for the individual. If I were
to do it, I’d try 1 to 2 mg/kg to start with, allowing a few hours
free of distraction to observe the effect, then adjust up or down.
I haven’t been substance-addicted, but have used doses around .1
mg/kg a few times a week for a month or so at a time. It wore me
down physically but helped me let go of some unreasonable
expectations about life.

The value of any ibogaine treatment is likely to be enhanced by
therapy, and low doses are easier to integrate with the pace of
normal personal growth. I believe that what iboga is usually
helping to fix is patterns that keep/protect us from connecting
with each other.

I think part of the appeal of the big-dose experience for personal
change is that it is seen as solitary, allowing the belief that the
ego will somehow retain its isolation. But in the end deep change
is probably necessary for those of us who seek iboga, and in my
experience that takes time. It may be that the big-dose experience
is economically optimal for addiction treatment.

In any case, beware: ibogaine resets tolerance for opiates, so
there is a danger of overdosing with them after ibogaine.

On Fri, 20 May 2005 17:24:04 -0700 Rick Strcat
<rickstrcat@hotmail.com> wrote:
I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
Any responses would be really welcome.

Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really
serious
withdrawals but lots of craving.

Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several
days
for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone
with
experience with this, especially with self-treatment.

Thanks.

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today –
it’s FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine OT don’t read this
Date: May 30, 2005 at 6:43:46 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

When is the movie coming out???
:o) (seruoussly)  (and tinks….)
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Sent: Monday, 30 May 2005 5:37 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine OT don’t read this

I’m crouched behind a big bush watching the cops go by the party I was just having fun at. Mother fuckers screw up a good thing every time. How was I to know that Mr. Wrong was having a bad day. He must have run out of Chivas or something. Shit when the party was going good he was leading the rhumba line. We should have let him in on the coke we were snorting. Anyway, that doesn’t explain the rocks I have in my hand. These damn cops need to learn a lesson. My buddy Fuzzy lets the first one fly. Wham, direct hit. I can’t believe how bright those lights are when they hit ’em and put the car in reverse. Dumb asses, we’re already two streets over from where they sit with the lights on and we’re laughin’ like hyena’s. We know every back yard cut through and drainage ditch in the ‘hood’. No way they can catch us. More later

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: [Ibogaine OT don’t read this
Date: May 30, 2005 at 1:37:27 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m crouched behind a big bush watching the cops go by the party I was just having fun at. Mother fuckers screw up a good thing every time. How was I to know that Mr. Wrong was having a bad day. He must have run out of Chivas or something. Shit when the party was going good he was leading the rhumba line. We should have let him in on the coke we were snorting. Anyway, that doesn’t explain the rocks I have in my hand. These damn cops need to learn a lesson. My buddy Fuzzy lets the first one fly. Wham, direct hit. I can’t believe how bright those lights are when they hit ’em and put the car in reverse. Dumb asses, we’re already two streets over from where they sit with the lights on and we’re laughin’ like hyena’s. We know every back yard cut through and drainage ditch in the ‘hood’. No way they can catch us. More later

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] that fucking dangling carrot
Date: May 29, 2005 at 7:47:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So I survived the weekend, as I inevitably do.  I made it back to home
sweet home, and am hiding in my room, trying not to listen to the
ridiculous snippets from “ocean’s 12” that keep coming in from the
living room.  Groovy soundtrack, though.  Way groovy.
I had to give a talk on the evils of heroin and the impossibilities of
receiving decent care, and used it as an opportunity to open some eyes
to the daily struggles and bigger issues of recovery.  It was
incredibly aggrevating to hear myself spouting the wonders of a
treatment that I can’t seem to get my hot little fingers wrapped
around.  the response was wonderful, though, and it was nice to be
able to be honest about my shit and not feel the burn of the neon
junky sign that’s hung above my head for the last 18 or so years.  I
could’ve done without the whole Q & A session about what bags look
like, do you have to use a spoon, how much is this, how did you do
THAT, WHY did you do that, and you can’t be serious, those aren’t
really ALL track marks;I didn’t know there were veins in your (fill in
the blank), and do they ever fade away more than that?  Good
question-do they ever stop being angry purpley red pits, snakes,  and
chasms of despair?  I haven’t used anything involving needles in a
while, and my body still looks like I skipped naked through a mine
field.  I don’t know if there’s that much cocoa butter in the world.
Some cuban guy in south beach was trying to convince me to bathe in my
own urine, occasionally drinking it to rid myself of them.  i dunno
about THAT…
I can barely keep my eyes open, I’m out of subutex, and, except a
teeny little joint, haven’t the means to push through this with
assistance.  Fun with a capitol F U!!!!  That’s how i’m feeling, true
believers.  fucked.  but this too shall pass, and i leave you to your
own (de)vices.  Have I mentioned it’s officially black fly season?
love you all for putting up with me
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Sjonnygee .” <sjonnygee@msn.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] sociopath/trickster – Ed Conn
Date: May 29, 2005 at 10:48:46 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The trickster/sociopath comment made by Nick is very relevant and deserves greater attention to detail. It is an accurate observation and one that effectively goes unanswered. What I guess you are saying is that providers of ibogaine tend to present or as you experience it have this aspect prevalent to their personalities. In some cases yes and in others no. The key to understnading this is in understanding developmental psychology and the formulation of personality constructs or expressions, and especially artound the area of ‘alternative’ health practioners shall we say. But even of that it is a sub set, and therefore we need to look more closely. Why certain ones and not others.

How this is traditionally explained is that as the consiousness is opened to more subtle or intrinsic levels of understanding, or information, some would say higher levels of consciousness, it causes arousal within the psyche. The consideration within this is the effect it has on the ego. The ego or central aspect of the personality as a result can shift, and infact shifting is in some cases what we want. It is in fact why in some cases people using ibogaine are lifted out of depression; the area of their psyche in which their core being was residing has been shifted. The danger is that this shift is not stabilised or grounded, that is maintained so that it can settle into a normal form of stasis. If it does not what we experience is what is called distortion. The distortion is expressed in the actions, language and expressions of that individual. It is the result of non integration of aroused material. It is why these practices of psychological arousal are always traditionally done in relation to a outside steadying figure, who has been through the changes themselves, understands the processes and has integrated and developed the ability to do it themselves. They know the terrain in other words. Historically this individual is called a shaman, in our modern times it is more often a psychotherapist; someone who has ascended and descended many many times under supervision and is effectively also a part of a community – a registered and maintained profession. The whole key to this is integration. The distortions are elements of unresolved material which therefore get acted out in social dynamics. Or get picked up on as Nick has done here. We are sensitive to these things as human beings.

The integration of aspects of personilites is often the journey into pain, it is through pain that the frozen aspects of personlity that have evolved through out a lifetime dissolve and thaw. The
persoanlity then shifts and becomes more archetypal – it is integrated. Integration is the pathway of growth, once integrated one advances toward being able to use this aspect of personality at will for expression, without its distortions. It has therefore become a facet, the more it is used the more it becomes polished. Think of people like psychological performers, where the trickster is present but the aspect of the sociopath has diminished, take it a step further and you have the saint – but again there is often a sense of comedy, but probably or maybe not so pointed. It is effectively then an evolutionary  curve of growth and development.

The trickster is an archetypal persoanlity that exists in many cultures, it is the sociopath which suggests the presence on unresolved material or not having gone dep enough into persoanl material. The myth being that the use of entheogenic substances alone can do this, it can start the process of arousal of awareness but that is only the start. The peripheral areas of this being that it becomes a trap within itself pregnant with all sorts of allusions to therapy and the seeking of higher consciousness. It equally becomes a form of repression itself and the avoidance of pain. Arthur Janov makes this plainly clear when he says the desire in such behaviour is to chase the high, this therefore is no different to chasing the first hit of crack. It is chasing an experience in memory and idea rather than the engaging of relationship to life itself and the history of pain and rejection. Thus to do therapy properly it requires the curtailment of all drug usage, and that is the journey, freedom from the ghosts and phantoms of the psyche and all those things which prevent us from being who we can become.

As for the medical entrepreneur…well that’s another story.

Ed Conn.
/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Fe…
Date: May 29, 2005 at 9:44:48 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rach, when I was in Taos, New Mexico I met some for real back to living off
the land dudes. They were most defenitly into being self sufficiant. Taos has a
feel all of it’s own. At one point after eating an awsome breakfast burrito
(all veggie) we went next door to the pawn shop and looked at guns, they were
all well oiled and in good shape. All the guitars were in tune and they even
had a resinator slide guitar tuned to open G that played like a bitch. I wanted
it bad. Taos is a great place to be. I’d like to live there sometime.
Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Capt Kirk” <captkirk@free.net.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] parents and school and detoxing, oh my!
Date: May 28, 2005 at 10:01:19 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

And the beat goes on…
any happy thoughts would be greatly appreciated if sent this way.
luv
tink

*%)()(WEIRD WILD AND WHACKY HAPPY LAUGHY GIGGLY CHUCKLY SMILEY THOUGHTS TO
TINK”:&%&##%%@))))

LUFF KIRK

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Vivienne Elanta <vivienneelanta@yahoo.com.au>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 28, 2005 at 6:42:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If it does help then I can’t help but mention it might help to give ibogaine to
everyone in the white house in the united states, maybe all politicos in all
countries. Nearly all of them show strong signs of having the disease of
sociopathy.

Blessed be
Vivienne Elanta

— sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Nick wrote “There does seem to be something about ibogaine which

attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few. Then
again,
who am I to talk?!”.

Nick

Then don’t say it. who cares?
well, there are sociopaths everywhere and in all levels.
they are sick people who need help,alright?  they hope ibogaine can help
them  and maybe it does help with some people.
Sara

—–Original Message—–
From: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Sent: 26 May 2005 16:48
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment

This sort of protocol has not been discussed much. I think that
someone in Holland was selling low-dose capsules for this purpose,
but as far as I remember no one who actually did it did it told
their story here.

A guy by the name of Chiel Coen, if I remember correctly, was
selling this
stuff at www.iboga.nl. I think he said they were from the Gabon and
used
to
make a few big claims. I heard he had a alcohol problem and had
died a few
years back. Not sure if this was true.

There does seem to be something about ibogaine which attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few. Then
again,
who am I to talk?!

Nick

Probably the dose would be adjusted for the individual. If I were
to do it, I’d try 1 to 2 mg/kg to start with, allowing a few hours
free of distraction to observe the effect, then adjust up or down.
I haven’t been substance-addicted, but have used doses around .1
mg/kg a few times a week for a month or so at a time. It wore me
down physically but helped me let go of some unreasonable
expectations about life.

The value of any ibogaine treatment is likely to be enhanced by
therapy, and low doses are easier to integrate with the pace of
normal personal growth. I believe that what iboga is usually
helping to fix is patterns that keep/protect us from connecting
with each other.

I think part of the appeal of the big-dose experience for personal
change is that it is seen as solitary, allowing the belief that the
ego will somehow retain its isolation. But in the end deep change
is probably necessary for those of us who seek iboga, and in my
experience that takes time. It may be that the big-dose experience
is economically optimal for addiction treatment.

In any case, beware: ibogaine resets tolerance for opiates, so
there is a danger of overdosing with them after ibogaine.

On Fri, 20 May 2005 17:24:04 -0700 Rick Strcat
<rickstrcat@hotmail.com> wrote:

I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
Any responses would be really welcome.

Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really
serious
withdrawals but lots of craving.

Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several
days
for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone
with
experience with this, especially with self-treatment.

Thanks.

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today –
it’s FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]
=———————————————————————
=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]
=———————————————————————
=[/

/]
=———————————————————————
=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]
=———————————————————————
=[/

Find local movie times and trailers on Yahoo! Movies.
http://au.movies.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] something a little less, well, depressing…
Date: May 28, 2005 at 5:02:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This Is a Perfect Moment

It’s a perfect moment for many reasons, but especially because you and
I are waking up from our sleepwalking thumbsucking dumbclucking
collusion with the masters of illusion and destruction.

Thanks to them, from whom the painful blessings flow, we are waking up.

Their wars and tortures,
their crimes against nature,

extinctions of species
and brand new diseases.

Their spying and lying
in the name of the father,
sterilizing seeds and
trademarking water.

Molestations of god,
celebrations of shame,
stealing our dreams and
changing our names.

Their ingenious commercials
and bloodsucking hustles,
their endless rehearsals
for the end of the world.

Thanks to them, from whom the painful blessings flow, we are waking up.

*

Their painful blessings are cracking open more and more gashes in the
shrunken and crippled mass hallucination that is mistakenly called
“reality.” And through the fractures, ripe eternity is flooding in;
news of the soul’s true home is pouring in; our allies from the other
side of the veil are swarming in: inspiring us to become smarter and
wilder and kinder and trickier.

We are waking up.

As heaven and earth come together, as the dreamtime and daytime merge,
we register the shockingly exhilarating fact that we are in
charge–you and I are in charge–of creating a brand new world. Not in
some distant time or faraway place, but right here and right now.

*

As we stand on this brink, as we dance on this verge, we can’t let the
ruling fools of the dying world sustain their curses. We have to rise
up and fight their insane logic; defy, resist, and prevent their
tragic magic; unleash our sacred rage and supercharge it.

But overthrowing the living dead is not enough. Protesting the
well-dressed monsters is not enough. We can’t afford to be consumed
with our anger; can’t be obsessed and possessed with their danger. Our
sweet animal bodies need love and fertility. Our imaginations crave
tastes of infinity.

In the New World that we are creating, we’ve got to be steeped in
lusty compassion and ecstatic duty, ingenious love and insurrectionary
beauty. We need radical curiosity and reverent pranks, voracious
listening and ferocious thanks.

*

So I’m curious, my fellow creators. Since you and I are in charge of
making a brand New World, where do we begin? What wild truths do we
want at the heart of our transformations? What fresh codes and stories
will be our oracles? What crafty questions and uplifting desires will
be our inspirations?

Here’s where I want to begin: with pronoia. Pronoia is the opposite of
paranoia–the antidote for paranoia.

Pronoia is the true theory that all of creation is conspiring to
shower you with blessings.

Pronoia is the guarantee that life always gives you exactly what you
need, exactly when you need it.

Pronoia says that everything alive is working very hard to liberate
you from ignorance and transform you into the gift of love you were
born to be.

*

I am allergic to dogma. I thrive on questions, and don’t trust any
idea that tempts me to believe in it absolutely. There are very few
perceptions or theories about which I am totally certain.

But I am absolutely certain that pronoia describes the way the world
actually is. Pronoia is wetter than water, truer than the facts, and
stronger than death. It smells like cedar smoke in early spring rain,
and if you close your eyes right now, you can feel it shimmering like
the aurora borealis in your soft, warm animal body.

Some Buddhists say the inherent nature of existence is suffering; they
long to escape into nirvana. Many Catholics say the inherent nature of
life is sinful; they long for the purified peace of heaven. But
pronoia assures us that the inherent nature of life is to liberate us.

Being born on the earth is the highest honor and greatest privilege.
To be alive as human beings gives us the chance to pull off exquisite
and Herculean feats of magic that are not possible in nirvana or
heaven or any other so-called paradise, higher dimension, or better
place.

I’m not exaggerating or indulging in poetic metaphor when I say this.
Visualize it if you dare.

The sweet stuff that quenches all of our longing is not far away in
some other time and place. It’s right here and right now.

As Elizabeth Barrett Browning knew, “Earth is crammed with heaven.”

*

-Rob Brezny
(from his Free Will Astrology site)

I am a mess, but I thank you all again for bearing with me as i slowly
drive myself in and out of the doldrums.
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] parents and school and detoxing, oh my!
Date: May 28, 2005 at 4:27:27 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m at school, working on that story I’ve been writing,and having the
worse day.  I made the switch from subutex to, well, other things, and
am living on the power of positive thinking, trying not to freak out
because I have no idea which way any of this will go now.  Back to
feeling like everything is spiralling because I have no control over
the actions of others, whatever the intent might have been.  Lost and
floating, and smiling at The Mommy Memoir Club as they escape their
families for some scholastic fun and heavy drinking.  It’s hard to
focus on anything when there’s so much being made of things that I
just don’t understand.  Pressure and pain are pressure and pain, but
my world won’t collapse if I haven’t finished a book annotation, and
these people are crying about it.  Perspective check, tink.
I’m just tired and scared and have no one to sit across from right now
who understands anything at all about what i’m going through.  i live
in a pretty isolated area, and even at school, what is considered a
‘big city’ here is more along the lines of a small suburb to me.  At
least I ave the opportunity to go to school right now, though it’s
largely due to some hard core grant and scholarship investigation.
The school isn’t exactly first rate, but I do have a good adviser,
although he keeps looking at me like I’m an alien, freshly sprung from
the stomach of urban decay.  They have no common reference point from
which to relate with me, and I have a big problem considering
pedicures a major event.
And the beat goes on…
any happy thoughts would be greatly appreciated if sent this way.
luv
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 28, 2005 at 10:16:17 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nick wrote “There does seem to be something about ibogaine which
attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few. Then again,
who am I to talk?!”.

Nick

Then don’t say it. who cares?
well, there are sociopaths everywhere and in all levels.
they are sick people who need help,alright?  they hope ibogaine can help
them  and maybe it does help with some people.
Sara

—–Original Message—–
From: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Sent: 26 May 2005 16:48
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment

This sort of protocol has not been discussed much. I think that
someone in Holland was selling low-dose capsules for this purpose,
but as far as I remember no one who actually did it did it told
their story here.

A guy by the name of Chiel Coen, if I remember correctly, was selling this
stuff at www.iboga.nl. I think he said they were from the Gabon and used
to
make a few big claims. I heard he had a alcohol problem and had died a few
years back. Not sure if this was true.

There does seem to be something about ibogaine which attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few. Then again,
who am I to talk?!

Nick

Probably the dose would be adjusted for the individual. If I were
to do it, I’d try 1 to 2 mg/kg to start with, allowing a few hours
free of distraction to observe the effect, then adjust up or down.
I haven’t been substance-addicted, but have used doses around .1
mg/kg a few times a week for a month or so at a time. It wore me
down physically but helped me let go of some unreasonable
expectations about life.

The value of any ibogaine treatment is likely to be enhanced by
therapy, and low doses are easier to integrate with the pace of
normal personal growth. I believe that what iboga is usually
helping to fix is patterns that keep/protect us from connecting
with each other.

I think part of the appeal of the big-dose experience for personal
change is that it is seen as solitary, allowing the belief that the
ego will somehow retain its isolation. But in the end deep change
is probably necessary for those of us who seek iboga, and in my
experience that takes time. It may be that the big-dose experience
is economically optimal for addiction treatment.

In any case, beware: ibogaine resets tolerance for opiates, so
there is a danger of overdosing with them after ibogaine.

On Fri, 20 May 2005 17:24:04 -0700 Rick Strcat
<rickstrcat@hotmail.com> wrote:
I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
Any responses would be really welcome.

Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really
serious
withdrawals but lots of craving.

Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several
days
for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone
with
experience with this, especially with self-treatment.

Thanks.

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today –
it’s FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 27, 2005 at 2:50:46 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Original Message—–
From: slowone@hush.ai [mailto:slowone@hush.ai]
Sent: 26 May 2005 16:48
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment

This sort of protocol has not been discussed much. I think that
someone in Holland was selling low-dose capsules for this purpose,
but as far as I remember no one who actually did it did it told
their story here.

A guy by the name of Chiel Coen, if I remember correctly, was selling this
stuff at www.iboga.nl. I think he said they were from the Gabon and used to
make a few big claims. I heard he had a alcohol problem and had died a few
years back. Not sure if this was true.

There does seem to be something about ibogaine which attracts the
trickster-sociopath type, if Chiel did fit this category. Or “medical
entrepreneur”, as Peter Cohen puts it. There have been a few. Then again,
who am I to talk?!

Nick

Probably the dose would be adjusted for the individual. If I were
to do it, I’d try 1 to 2 mg/kg to start with, allowing a few hours
free of distraction to observe the effect, then adjust up or down.
I haven’t been substance-addicted, but have used doses around .1
mg/kg a few times a week for a month or so at a time. It wore me
down physically but helped me let go of some unreasonable
expectations about life.

The value of any ibogaine treatment is likely to be enhanced by
therapy, and low doses are easier to integrate with the pace of
normal personal growth. I believe that what iboga is usually
helping to fix is patterns that keep/protect us from connecting
with each other.

I think part of the appeal of the big-dose experience for personal
change is that it is seen as solitary, allowing the belief that the
ego will somehow retain its isolation. But in the end deep change
is probably necessary for those of us who seek iboga, and in my
experience that takes time. It may be that the big-dose experience
is economically optimal for addiction treatment.

In any case, beware: ibogaine resets tolerance for opiates, so
there is a danger of overdosing with them after ibogaine.

On Fri, 20 May 2005 17:24:04 -0700 Rick Strcat
<rickstrcat@hotmail.com> wrote:
I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
Any responses would be really welcome.

Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really
serious
withdrawals but lots of craving.

Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several
days
for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone
with
experience with this, especially with self-treatment.

Thanks.

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today –
it’s FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Eye of the Bhogi <freedomroot@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Feb 26 2004)
Date: May 27, 2005 at 1:16:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Fantastico plot analysis and breakdown, Father Beal.  Especially
enjoyed the multiple imaginations triggered by the professed authorial
attempt to be “true to the Root.”  An interesting philosophical field
to try to inhabit.

I saw the word “woe” the other day and laughed, because at one point
in his recovery, Jeff was so dang depressed he was all “Woe is me,”
for real, in the most poignant & profound way.  I remember in his
post-treatment days, that he really wanted me to cut up this
pineapple, and he got so sad thinking I was never going to get it for
him.  Our time matrices were quite different in that after-care
period.  He wanted to eat lots of funky foods, and requested
unexpected beverages at unexpected times.  18 hours after his “flood”
I was feeding him cold meats and some kind of odd-flavored juice.  We
trusted that he knew what was best for him.

Now more than 6 months out of his methadone detox, he’s lost his taste
for sugar & dropped some serious pounds (and pants size), even if
he’ll now join his Irish bride in a few more of her pints than he used
to.  It’s really something.  Thanks y’all for doing what you do and
projecting the healing vibe.

Saw a fun movie in Santa Cruz the other night, “off the map,” about a
back-to-the-land family near Taos, NM told mostly from the
coming-of-age transition of the 12-year old daughter.  Sam Elliot
plays a guy who in a profound depression, & Joan Allen his gorgeous
earthmama “granddaughter of a Hopi woman” (??? although I won’t
question that too deeply ), and more cast & great landscape & New
Mexico energy.

It’s not just the Root, or a root, its a freedom root.  Ambivalence
indeed about an illogically scheduled “drug” medicine like that.
Profound ambivalence.

Speaking of t.v., saw the 2nd or 3rd episode of “The West Wing,” where
the Chief of Staff starts attending the Vice President’s
hyperanonymous Meeting filled with powerful men.  When is it going to
be a GOOD thing for all of us to have a recovering leader in the White
House????  When, Mr. President?????!

w/foggy love from the Pacific, rachel

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] The Poppies of Afghanistan
Date: May 27, 2005 at 10:47:57 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

since summer 2002 – after the taliban had vanished – berlin is flooded with cheap and good heroin from afghanistan. bush did a good job for the junkies here.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] The Poppies of Afghanistan
Date: May 27, 2005 at 10:11:54 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The Poppies of Afghanistan

Published: May 27, 2005
It requires breathtaking audacity for United States officials to complain that efforts to curb opium poppy production in Afghanistan have been lagging because President Hamid Karzai “has been unwilling to assert strong leadership.” Washington waited almost two and a half years to heed Mr. Karzai’s calls for help on this problem.
Even now, the Bush administration is disproportionately concentrating on the most visible, but least effective approach, forcible crop eradication, which merely moves the problem around and enriches traffickers by raising the price of their opium holdings. It is also creating turmoil in rural areas during the run-up to this year’s crucial parliamentary elections.
Mr. Karzai was right to use his just-completed four-day visit to the United States to press for coordinating eradication with the crop substitution, agricultural credit and alternative development programs that would provide Afghanistan’s rural population with better ways to feed their families. The money that Washington has promised for those broader efforts has been lagging behind, and the planning that will be required to spend that money wisely has barely begun.
snip-
more at above URL

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Richard Harris <richardh_2003@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ibogaine maintenence
Date: May 27, 2005 at 3:42:11 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Patrick, killer article. First thing I’ve read in a
long time that isn’t just repeating the same thing yet
again, great summary of low dosing and effects, much
appreciate all you do.

What I appreciate more then anything is that you did
not disrespect those who need narcotcs. Round of
applause for that one. You don’t ever judge anyone, at
least this is what I take from reading all of your
words, but a big problem and maybe it is only in my
head but I know I can’t be the only one, is disrespect
and a condescending attitude to people who really need
pain meds.

Most of this from people who don’t know anything about
either chronic pain management problems, or drug
addiction. “I used to drink too much or smoke
cigarettes” Whatev, fuck off.

Newsflash, but pain medications exist for a reason
other then getting high. Some of us are not going to
be off them and we are not all in denial and just
waiting for someone with a holier then thou attitude
to show us the light.

Maybe it is only me but the overall attitude I find
here is disrespect to anyone who needs pain meds. No
ifs and or buts. You’re using, you’re dirty, we’re
better then you. You didn’t understand what ibogaine
gave you, only I understand.

The only gripe I have and it is one I have with the
MindVox site too, is even using the cateogry “clean”
and “dirty” and yes I know you put them in quotes
Patrick, no hard feelings but I do want to point it
out.

If we can accept people who “western society” as you
put it Patrick, would say belong in a psych ward,
talking about demonic possession, their spiritual
journies and entities, then it should not be some huge
stretch to also be accepted as human beings not human
dirt.

“People are human beings, not the summation of their
symptomology” that’s one of your quotes Patrick.
Here’s another, “I am a human being and should be
judged by my actions, not what metabolites I’m
excreting in my urine”. That’s yours’ too.

Peace

Rich

— Dave Clark <rfdavec@gmail.com> wrote:
Dear Patrick, thank you! My name is Dave and I’ve
been through alot to
say the least…I’m 45, I work as an electronic tech
programming and
troubleshooting…My wife is quite ill and stays in
bed most of the
time, she fades omre every day. presently I’m going
to a methadone
clinic in New Orleans La. and have been for almost
two years…I’m
just tired of this I do my work etc and am clean all
the time but this
meth I want to get off of it. To tell the truth I
miss my old self, I
miss the old Dave who was full of spiritualism,
happy all the time and
into a walk with God.
I miss my old self and someday want him back. I
don’t know if I will
ever do this because the road for me that led to
methadone didn’t
start with heroin and even at this late stage in the
game, I’ve not
done heroin more then twice and when I did it was
because my meds
weren’t doing the trick any longer and I missed all
the hoo haw ya’ll
dopefiends write about, to me it was another drug
that I tried, then
tried again when I thought the first time was bad
dope or some such,
but it did not work for me. I don’t know if that’s a
sad statement to
how high my tolerence is but the crux for me is I am
a pain management
person. I took a fall in my early 20’s and had the
roof of a building
I was wiring up fall on top of me. Long story short,
6 broken bones,
spinal injury, 3 years physical therapy,
acupuncture, no help.
I work sitting in a chair these days not because I
have to because my
disability pays more then enough of the bills, but
if I didn’t do
something I’d have gone stark raving bonkers long
ago.
I found your writings years ago, that led me to
mindvox, saw ya’all at
new orleans and you give a great show. You’re a big
inspiration, but
not one I thought had any use to my old self because
being clean is
not something I think can be done in my case, over
and out.
This here article is something I’ve never heard
about at all and
whatever does happen in the end, it is something I
want to try, your
ibogaine maintence with opiates at the same time is
something brand
new. When I thought I’ve heard about every miracle
ibogaine can do,
there’s a new one. I have a lot of questions, a lot
of thoughts, lot
of thinking to do but tonight you have given me
something I have not
had in a long time, hope. So maybe this might be for
me.
‘God bless you Patrick and God’s love to all the
freaks you’ve
gathered here, feels like a rainbow tribe gathering
online some of the
time, brings me back to happier times. I enjoy
reading ya’all, take
care
Dave

/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business – Try our new Resources site
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Marcus <aktionman@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Patrick thank you!
Date: May 27, 2005 at 2:03:58 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanx kv!!!!!

On 5/26/2005, “Krista Vaughan” <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:

I was reading through mindvox, it’s in the articles section. I don’t
know what the url is for the pdf, but it’s here

Articles

The pdf is much easier to read, the html version uses the same style
MAPS does, which is tiny little letters on a beige background, very
hard to read or maybe it is my monitor.

Its the second article from the top, digital & epoptica Ibogaine in
the 21st Century:
Boosters, Tune-ups and Maintenance. I don’t know how long its been
there but it was not online last week.

KV

On 5/19/05, Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:
I’m sorry I don’t know where it is online? I read the magazine MAPS
publishes, they have copies at a acupuncture center here.

KV

On 19 May 2005 04:56:22 -0000, Marcus <aktionman@phantom.com> wrote:

could i getta link to this article?
thanx
marcus
On 5/19/2005, “Krista Vaughan” <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:

Patrick I wanted to apologize profusely, I had opportunity to read the
new issue of MAPS. Brilliant article! Thank you from the bottom of my
heart, this answered the questions I’ve been pestering you about for
months!

I am so very sorry to have been rude but you do know had you written
back one sentence saying your talk and so much more would be published
in the near future, I wouldn’t have carried on so!

Thank you, in one article I think you covered a hundred messages of
debate here about low dose and “maintenance” and you did answer with
great clarity about “dirty maintenance”. Thank you so much cutie,
you’re a brilliant young man and wrote something that hasn’t ever been
written about ibogaine before.

For the fifth or sixth time in this message, I am very sorry for being
rude before, there is so much anger here sometimes it’s easy to lose
sight of how much you are doing. Thank you!

To post one more point relevant to the last days here, MAPS did write
that the clinic in Mexico was shut down. They did not say why or
mention the death.

KV

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

p,l,&u
marcus

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx…. to the group
Date: May 27, 2005 at 2:10:35 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and Ibogain is
very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly
“normal”.
I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody but
specialy
Sara and Howard

Best Regards
Mustafa Izgi from Turkey

Hi Mustafa,
thanks for writing,
it’s good to know you are still clean,I wish you all the best.
be well,

Sara Glatt,

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Dave Clark <rfdavec@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] ibogaine maintenence
Date: May 27, 2005 at 1:28:49 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Patrick, thank you! My name is Dave and I’ve been through alot to
say the least…I’m 45, I work as an electronic tech programming and
troubleshooting…My wife is quite ill and stays in bed most of the
time, she fades omre every day. presently I’m going to a methadone
clinic in New Orleans La. and have been for almost two years…I’m
just tired of this I do my work etc and am clean all the time but this
meth I want to get off of it. To tell the truth I miss my old self, I
miss the old Dave who was full of spiritualism, happy all the time and
into a walk with God.
I miss my old self and someday want him back. I don’t know if I will
ever do this because the road for me that led to methadone didn’t
start with heroin and even at this late stage in the game, I’ve not
done heroin more then twice and when I did it was because my meds
weren’t doing the trick any longer and I missed all the hoo haw ya’ll
dopefiends write about, to me it was another drug that I tried, then
tried again when I thought the first time was bad dope or some such,
but it did not work for me. I don’t know if that’s a sad statement to
how high my tolerence is but the crux for me is I am a pain management
person. I took a fall in my early 20’s and had the roof of a building
I was wiring up fall on top of me. Long story short, 6 broken bones,
spinal injury, 3 years physical therapy, acupuncture, no help.
I work sitting in a chair these days not because I have to because my
disability pays more then enough of the bills, but if I didn’t do
something I’d have gone stark raving bonkers long ago.
I found your writings years ago, that led me to mindvox, saw ya’all at
new orleans and you give a great show. You’re a big inspiration, but
not one I thought had any use to my old self because being clean is
not something I think can be done in my case, over and out.
This here article is something I’ve never heard about at all and
whatever does happen in the end, it is something I want to try, your
ibogaine maintence with opiates at the same time is something brand
new. When I thought I’ve heard about every miracle ibogaine can do,
there’s a new one. I have a lot of questions, a lot of thoughts, lot
of thinking to do but tonight you have given me something I have not
had in a long time, hope. So maybe this might be for me.
‘God bless you Patrick and God’s love to all the freaks you’ve
gathered here, feels like a rainbow tribe gathering online some of the
time, brings me back to happier times. I enjoy reading ya’all, take
care
Dave

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ROCKYM CARAVELLI <rockymcaravelli@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Rite of passage question
Date: May 27, 2005 at 1:28:46 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ben can you please send the information to obtain another copy of the dvd it was a wonderful job and we would like to share it with freinds. thanx    rocky

Ben De Loenen <daluna@mindvox.com> wrote:

Dear Shelley,

The format for the US is NTSC and the format for Europ is PAL. In
Australia for example it’s PAL too,…
For an overview, look at:

http://www.barrel-of-monkeys.com/graphics/prod/dvdplayers/tvideostds.html

Best Regards,

Ben De Loenen
Director/Producer

Op 26/5/2005 schreef “shelley krupa” :

>Good Day all you ibonauts, hey Im trying to buy the ib video ,but there are two formatsto choose form ,pal & ntsc ,does anyone know what that means?,humbly shell
>
>Fakeplacebo wrote:Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and Ibogain is
>very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly “normal”.
>I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody but specialy
>Sara and Howard
>
>Best Regards
>Mustafa Izgi from Turkey
>
>
>/]=———————————————————————=[\
>[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business – Try our new Resources site!

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx…. to the group
Date: May 26, 2005 at 9:27:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Mustafa,

So good to hear from you and so glad things are working out.

Howard

In a message dated 5/26/05 9:13:51 AM, fakeplacebo@hotmail.com writes:

Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and Ibogain
is very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly
“normal”.
I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody but specialy
Sara and Howard

Best Regards
Mustafa Izgi from Turkey

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Patrick thank you!
Date: May 26, 2005 at 6:39:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was reading through mindvox, it’s in the articles section. I don’t
know what the url is for the pdf, but it’s here

Articles

The pdf is much easier to read, the html version uses the same style
MAPS does, which is tiny little letters on a beige background, very
hard to read or maybe it is my monitor.

Its the second article from the top, digital & epoptica Ibogaine in
the 21st Century:
Boosters, Tune-ups and Maintenance. I don’t know how long its been
there but it was not online last week.

KV

On 5/19/05, Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:
I’m sorry I don’t know where it is online? I read the magazine MAPS
publishes, they have copies at a acupuncture center here.

KV

On 19 May 2005 04:56:22 -0000, Marcus <aktionman@phantom.com> wrote:

could i getta link to this article?
thanx
marcus
On 5/19/2005, “Krista Vaughan” <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:

Patrick I wanted to apologize profusely, I had opportunity to read the
new issue of MAPS. Brilliant article! Thank you from the bottom of my
heart, this answered the questions I’ve been pestering you about for
months!

I am so very sorry to have been rude but you do know had you written
back one sentence saying your talk and so much more would be published
in the near future, I wouldn’t have carried on so!

Thank you, in one article I think you covered a hundred messages of
debate here about low dose and “maintenance” and you did answer with
great clarity about “dirty maintenance”. Thank you so much cutie,
you’re a brilliant young man and wrote something that hasn’t ever been
written about ibogaine before.

For the fifth or sixth time in this message, I am very sorry for being
rude before, there is so much anger here sometimes it’s easy to lose
sight of how much you are doing. Thank you!

To post one more point relevant to the last days here, MAPS did write
that the clinic in Mexico was shut down. They did not say why or
mention the death.

KV

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Feb 26 2004)
Date: May 26, 2005 at 12:05:57 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Dana. I obviously missed the discussion before.
As far as I remember the drug pusher ends up being pinned for the crime on the premise that getting people off drugs would be bad for his business. I guess they got that part right. Lee

Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com> wrote:
Lee Albert wrote:
> I happened to see on TV last night a CSI episode here is Spain where
> part of the plot included a treatment house for addiction using iboga
> plus a murder where somehow iboga was involved. C.S.I. normally has
> two plots and is based on F.B.I. reports of true crimes.
>
> I didn’t understand it all but the parts I did went something like:
>
> 1. A drug user Ed (former addict turned provider), is cruising around
> in his car hallucinating on iboga and picks up this girl – Mindy. I
> think he gives her iboga too. He is later found dead.

Your one-time viewing seems to have you collapsing the story-lines of
two different characters here. Ed is looking for Mindy, who’s relapsed
alright–but he himself isn’t on ibogaine. He has some for Mindy (never
mind that any one doing what he’s doing wouldn’t have had their
ibogaine along for the ride–what’s he going to do, find her and
administer it on the spot?–or that when Stahl was writing this, the
predominant paradigm was people from his 12 step groups coming back
from treatments at Rosarita, so any actual ibogaine was never in the US
at all!).

You’re confusing Ed with Jamal the thief, who (it’s implied) finds the
ibogaine after Ed’s killed and gets into a car accident after injecting
it and starting to trip while driving. Injecting multiplies the impact
of ibo on the system something like 50 times, so that aspect would hold
up–except that the substance pictured is supposed to be Indra, which
can’t be injected. But the ibogaine physically has to be in the car
for the CSI folk to find it, or the somewhat valid premise that iboga
would be a mystery substance to most police departments doesn’t have a
chance to unfold. The clear clue that Jamal is supposed to have lost
his coordination on iboga is when Brass says “What drug is he on?” and
the hipper Black cop replies “Whatever it is, either he took too much
or not enough.”

>  2. The investigator reflects and says: “swopping one addiction for
> another,” referring to the taking of iboga. Perhaps referring to Ed?

It’s supposed to sound like the mission ex-addicts are on to get other
addicts off drugs is the equivalent taking iboga, but the context–Ed
bringing iboga down from the Mountain and pushing it on
everyone–makes it clear the actual critique is that “getting
religious about it” and prosyletizing ibogaine is just another
replacement for chemical addiction.

>  3. A female drug addict (Mindy) in custody (the one who was with Ed
> in the car) says something about the spirits telling her something.
> She was questioned as to her motive for doing something and that was
> her reply.

No, she is threatened with murder charges and says the spirits (Bwiti)
will protect her. It’s meant to show that the ideational impact of an
initiation or treatment persists for months, even after a person
relapses and starts using smack again. (And isn’t the stuff in Vegas
mainly black tar, not white powder? Inconsistencies abound.)

> Anyway I only happened to see part of it and didn’t really understand
> it properly.

Hope this helps.

>  Maybe someone else has seen this episode. I understand its the
> current episode.
>
> Some extracts from plot:
>
> http://members.aol.com/NATPE1/csi-season4a.htm#top
>
> – Underneath a highway overpass, people gather, doing drugs. Some are
> hooking, and a car glides by. The driver keeps going, asking
> questions, until he finds what he wants. He’s young, good-looking and
> drives a BMW. He gets out and starts walking.. Next thing you know,
> he’s dead on the ground, the CSI looking over his body. Watch, wallet
> and shoes are all gone and there’s blood on him.
> – Warrick finds a small bag of something on the car floor. Greg gets
> it and runs tests on the substance. He doesn’t know what it is.
> Grissom checks the microscope. It’s something new.
> – They’ve identified the strange substance, which is, in layman’s
> term, a substance that can cure physical addiction. Its intended use
> is as a hallucingen used by a tribe in South Africa, from the Iboga
> tree and is called Ibogaine. It’s not legal in the U.S. Brass says
> Burnell was a dealer, no matter how you look at it.

“Intended use” is all relative. In North America it’s intended use to
interrupt drug addiction–and that the hallucinogenesis is a side
effect. It’s from the bark of the root, not the tree as it says in the
dialog. And they never point out that it’s legal in Canada and Mexico,
and that in real life, you don’t have to travel long by car to get to
Rosarita. But that would undermine the premise of Ed even being under
the freeway looking for Mindy–with the ibogaine on him.

> – At a halfway house, Grissom and Brass talk to Jake Sinclair, the guy
> who runs it. They don’t give out illegal drugs. A young woman, Mindy,
> is leaving, as the place reminds her too much of Ed. Ed got her clean.
> They’re shown a video of what she looked like two months ago. A real
> mess. When Ed first arrived, he was an asset, but they he got
> ‘religious’ about it. He brought the Ibogaine with him and in effect,
> became a pusher of sorts, peddling his cure.

Harm reduction and abstinence-based therapy are conveniently mixed up
here, but Jake seems to be saying that if some one has been dosed with
Ibogaine he’ll let the trip run its course, even though the standard
reaction would probably be to treat it like acid and send out for
thorazine. Jake actually gives a pretty good understanding of what ibo
does and it limitations. But Stahl is hallucinating what he think a
provider would be like. Where is the intake protocol? I know of no one
who’s willing to give ibo now without at least a EKG, not to mention
EEG and liver panel. What kind of a pusher sends out for medical tests?

> – Brass and Grissom arrive at a rundown house that has certainly seen
> better days. It’s a crackhouse and they’re looking for Mindy Dupont. A
> man answers. Grissom looks inside, spotting drug material on the
> floor. Since “it’s a free county,” both he and Brass just enter and
> find Mindy on the floor, hardly cleaned up anymore. She’s back to
> drugs, despite Ed’s best efforts. He gave her the ibagain, which made
> her high. Grissom spots a bloody knife near her. “Did you come here to
> remember, or to forget?” he asks.

The person who wrote this actually screwed up, in that the ibo DIDN’T
make her high. She’s high all right, but her response–“Ed gave me
ibogaine”–is intended to divert the two cops from the fact that she’s
obviously just done the massive dose of smack Riley gave her after they
fucked. Grissom rejoins “…and then you didn’t want to get high any
more.” And her cry is meant to convey that she went back to smack
because she missed it, when all was said and done: “I never wanted to
feel.”

> – Mindy has been brought in, but she looks and sounds horrible. Brass
> points out she’s up for a murder rap. Grissom points out evidence also
> shows she’s been high for a while, and think that Burnell was looking
> for her, as he knew she was using. Brass arrests her.
> – Warrick and Nick are going over Mindy’s ragged underwear. Sad. No
> sign of blood, however. But, Greg comes in with a skin sample that
> doesn’t belong to Belongs to Riley Renaldo, the man who answered the
> door. He was the landlord, who let her pay her rent in sex.
> – The police arrive at the wreck of a house, and Renaldo is already
> having sex with another junkie. However, they police realize that if
> Ed cleaned up addicts, it would be bad for Renaldo’s business. He gave
> her drugs, and then he went out and murdered Burnell. DNA evidence
> proves his guilt.As the female junkie sags down the hall, Grissom
> doesn’t see the need to take her to lockup. “She’s already there,” he
> says, grimly, of the woman’s own self-created prison.

Not so much bad for his business, as bad for his sex life. It’s also
kind of implied that Burnell may have strayed from ethical practice in
becoming involved with Mindy himself, so there’s a jealousy
undercurrent.

> Comment:
>
> I am curious as to what this episode is trying to say about iboga?

That it’s extremely emotionally conflicting for police to crack down on
a Schedule I drug (non-maintenance) that stops drug addiction and is
not used at raves.

> Anyone seen it in English and understood it properly?

I can send you a duplicate, but its NTSC VHS, not-playable in Europe
unless you have U.S. equipment.

> Apparently these episodes are based on true F.B.I. reports?
>
> Lee
>

They draw on current cases. The Indra part comes from LAPD finding a
body of an opiate OD together with both Indra and opiates, for
instance. And as I said, Stahl got the idea from people he met at group
who’d come back from Mexico. He told people he was going to be “true to
the root.”

Understand that we had to go into our protest at CBS national
headquarters (the Black Rock) blind. We knew there would be some kind
of inaccuracy involving some one driving on Ibo, but what we were
really upset about was that CBS, instead of treating this as a serious
documentary subject a la Ben DeLoenen, was exploiting ibogaine and
pandering to the drug war stereotype of Burnell as just another pusher,
and ibogaine just another drug. Were I able to do it over, well, in the
office here we have a picture of Bozo the Clown with a red ‘banned’
crossed circle super-imposed, and the words “No Clowning Around With
Ibogaine!”

I don’t think it’s respectful to compare Bwiti religious ceremony with
clowns and mimes, even if the Fang do use face paint.

All that being said, the episode has aired four times here, and
millions have at least heard about ibogaine as a result. That’s why I
pestered the Kerry campaign with it–in addition to other, much more
scientific stuff. To let them know that Ibo is now a mass phenomena
that can’t just be ignored.

Still think it’s a good idea to send Theresa Heinz the new video, too.

Dana/cnw

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 26, 2005 at 11:48:08 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This sort of protocol has not been discussed much. I think that
someone in Holland was selling low-dose capsules for this purpose,
but as far as I remember no one who actually did it did it told
their story here.

Probably the dose would be adjusted for the individual. If I were
to do it, I’d try 1 to 2 mg/kg to start with, allowing a few hours
free of distraction to observe the effect, then adjust up or down.
I haven’t been substance-addicted, but have used doses around .1
mg/kg a few times a week for a month or so at a time. It wore me
down physically but helped me let go of some unreasonable
expectations about life.

The value of any ibogaine treatment is likely to be enhanced by
therapy, and low doses are easier to integrate with the pace of
normal personal growth. I believe that what iboga is usually
helping to fix is patterns that keep/protect us from connecting
with each other.

I think part of the appeal of the big-dose experience for personal
change is that it is seen as solitary, allowing the belief that the
ego will somehow retain its isolation. But in the end deep change
is probably necessary for those of us who seek iboga, and in my
experience that takes time. It may be that the big-dose experience
is economically optimal for addiction treatment.

In any case, beware: ibogaine resets tolerance for opiates, so
there is a danger of overdosing with them after ibogaine.

On Fri, 20 May 2005 17:24:04 -0700 Rick Strcat
<rickstrcat@hotmail.com> wrote:
I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
Any responses would be really welcome.

Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really
serious
withdrawals but lots of craving.

Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several
days
for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone
with
experience with this, especially with self-treatment.

Thanks.

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today –
it’s FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx…. to the group
Date: May 26, 2005 at 10:53:25 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Mustafa,

I’m sure that others remember you too. It’s good to hear that
you’re doing well.

On Thu, 26 May 2005 06:13:06 -0700 Fakeplacebo
<fakeplacebo@hotmail.com> wrote:
Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and
Ibogain is
very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly
“normal”.
I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody
but specialy
Sara and Howard

Best Regards
Mustafa Izgi from Turkey

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Daniel Trivin” <iam@dtrivin.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Rite of passage question
Date: May 26, 2005 at 10:18:19 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Generally, PAL is for Europe and NTSC is for the US, Canada, and Japan.
Check your video player’s manual to be sure.
Daniel

—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Thursday, May 26, 2005 9:54 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Rite of passage question

Good Day all you ibonauts, hey Im trying to buy the ib video ,but there are two formatsto choose form ,pal & ntsc ,does anyone know what that means?,humbly shell

Fakeplacebo <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com> wrote:
Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and Ibogain is
very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly “normal”.
I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody but specialy
Sara and Howard

Best Regards
Mustafa Izgi from Turkey

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Ben De Loenen” <daluna@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Rite of passage question
Date: May 26, 2005 at 9:55:13 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Shelley,

The format for the US is NTSC and the format for Europ is PAL. In
Australia for example it’s PAL too,…
For an overview, look at:

http://www.barrel-of-monkeys.com/graphics/prod/dvdplayers/tvideostds.html

Best Regards,

Ben De Loenen
Director/Producer

Op 26/5/2005 schreef “shelley krupa” <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>:

Good Day all you ibonauts, hey Im trying to buy the ib video ,but there are two formatsto choose form ,pal & ntsc ,does anyone know what that means?,humbly shell

Fakeplacebo <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com> wrote:Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and Ibogain is
very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly “normal”.
I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody but specialy
Sara and Howard

Best Regards
Mustafa Izgi from Turkey

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: darkmattersfo@comcast.net
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Rite of passage question
Date: May 26, 2005 at 10:08:51 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

PAL is a format used in Europe, NTSC is a format used in the US.

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Rite of passage question
Date: May 26, 2005 at 9:54:17 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Good Day all you ibonauts, hey Im trying to buy the ib video ,but there are two formatsto choose form ,pal & ntsc ,does anyone know what that means?,humbly shell

Fakeplacebo <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com> wrote:
Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and Ibogain is
very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly “normal”.
I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody but specialy
Sara and Howard

Best Regards
Mustafa Izgi from Turkey

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Rite of passage question
Date: May 26, 2005 at 9:53:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Good Day all you ibonauts, hey Im trying to buy the ib video ,but there are two formatsto choose form ,pal & ntsc ,does anyone know what that means?,humbly shell

Fakeplacebo <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com> wrote:
Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and Ibogain is
very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly “normal”.
I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody but specialy
Sara and Howard

Best Regards
Mustafa Izgi from Turkey

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Fakeplacebo” <fakeplacebo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Thanx…. to the group
Date: May 26, 2005 at 9:13:06 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Is there anybody still remember me in here? I’m still clean and Ibogain is very powerfull tool. But it’s very strong tool. My life is totaly “normal”. I’m working, smoking joint and I’m very happy. Thanks everybody but specialy Sara and Howard

Best Regards
Mustafa Izgi from Turkey

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] words for the day
Date: May 25, 2005 at 9:25:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“…is to attempt seeing Truth without Falsehood.  It is the attempt
to see light without knowing Darkness.  It cannot be.”
-from “Manual of Muad ‘Dib” by Princess Irulan in “Dune”
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Feb 26 2004)
Date: May 25, 2005 at 8:39:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I would love a copy of it, it you have it
tink

On 5/25/05, Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com> wrote:
Lee Albert wrote:
I happened to see on TV last night a CSI episode here is Spain where
part of the plot included a treatment house for addiction using iboga
plus a murder where somehow iboga was involved. C.S.I. normally has
two plots and is based on F.B.I. reports of true crimes.

I didn’t understand it all but the parts I did went something like:

1. A drug user Ed (former addict turned provider), is cruising around
in his car hallucinating on iboga and picks up this girl – Mindy. I
think he gives her iboga too. He is later found dead.

Your one-time viewing seems to have you collapsing the story-lines of
two different characters here. Ed is looking for Mindy, who’s relapsed
alright–but he himself isn’t on ibogaine. He has some for Mindy (never
mind that any one doing what he’s doing wouldn’t have had their
ibogaine along for the ride–what’s he going to do, find her and
administer it on the spot?–or that when Stahl was writing this, the
predominant paradigm was people from his 12 step groups coming back
from treatments at Rosarita, so any actual ibogaine was never in the US
at all!).

You’re confusing Ed with Jamal the thief, who (it’s implied) finds the
ibogaine after Ed’s killed and gets into a car accident after injecting
it and starting to trip while driving. Injecting multiplies the impact
of ibo on the system something like 50 times, so that aspect would hold
up–except that the substance pictured is supposed to be Indra, which
can’t be injected. But the ibogaine physically  has to be in the car
for the CSI folk to find it, or the somewhat valid premise that iboga
would be a mystery substance to most police departments doesn’t have a
chance to unfold. The clear clue that Jamal is supposed to have lost
his coordination on iboga is when Brass says “What drug is he on?” and
the hipper Black cop replies “Whatever it is, either he took too much
or not enough.”

2. The investigator reflects and says: “swopping one addiction for
another,” referring to the taking of iboga. Perhaps referring to Ed?

It’s supposed to sound like the mission ex-addicts are on to get other
addicts off drugs is the equivalent taking iboga, but the context–Ed
bringing iboga down from  the Mountain and pushing it on
everyone–makes it clear the actual critique is that  “getting
religious about it” and prosyletizing ibogaine is just another
replacement for chemical addiction.

3. A female drugaddict (Mindy) in custody (the one who was with Ed
in the car) says something about the spirits telling her something.
She was questioned as to her motive for doing something and that was
her reply.

No, she is threatened with murder charges and says the spirits (Bwiti)
will protect her. It’s meant to show that the ideational  impact of an
initiation or treatment persists for months, even after a person
relapses and starts using smack again. (And isn’t the stuff in Vegas
mainly black tar, not white powder? Inconsistencies abound.)

Anyway I only happened to see part of it and didn’t really understand
it properly.

Hope this helps.

Maybe someone else has seen this episode. I understand its the
current episode.

Some extracts from plot:

http://members.aol.com/NATPE1/csi-season4a.htm#top

– Underneath a highway overpass, people gather, doing drugs. Some are
hooking, and a car glides by. The driver keeps going, asking
questions, until he finds what he wants. He’s young, good-looking and
drives a BMW. He gets out and starts walking.. Next thing you know,
he’s dead on the ground, the CSI looking over his body. Watch, wallet
and shoes are all gone and there’s blood on him.
– Warrick finds a small bag of something on the car floor. Greg gets
it and runs tests on the substance. He doesn’t know what it is.
Grissom checks the microscope. It’s something new.
– They’ve identified the strange substance, which is, in layman’s
term, a substance that can cure physical addiction. Its intended use
is as a hallucingen used by a tribe in South Africa, from the Iboga
tree and is called Ibogaine. It’s not legal in the U.S. Brass says
Burnell was a dealer, no matter how you look at it.

“Intended use” is all relative. In North America it’s intended use to
interrupt drug addiction–and that the hallucinogenesis is a side
effect. It’s from the bark of the root, not the tree as it says in the
dialog. And they never point  out that it’s legal in Canada and Mexico,
and that in real life, you don’t have to travel long by car to get to
Rosarita. But that would undermine the premise of Ed even being under
the freeway looking for Mindy–with the ibogaine on him.

– At a halfway house, Grissom and Brass talk to Jake Sinclair, the guy
who runs it. They don’t give out illegal drugs. A young woman, Mindy,
is leaving, as the place reminds her too much of Ed. Ed got her clean.
They’re shown a video of what she looked like two months ago. A real
mess. When Ed first arrived, he was an asset, but they he got
‘religious’ about it. He brought the Ibogaine with him and in effect,
became a pusher of sorts, peddling his cure.

Harm reduction and abstinence-based therapy are conveniently  mixed up
here, but Jake seems to be saying that if some one has been dosed with
Ibogaine he’ll let the trip run its course, even though the standard
reaction would probably be to treat it like acid and send out for
thorazine. Jake actually gives a pretty good understanding of what ibo
does and it limitations. But Stahl is hallucinating what he think a
provider would be like. Where is the intake protocol? I know of no one
who’s willing to give ibo now without at least a EKG, not to mention
EEG and liver panel. What kind of a pusher sends out for medical tests?

– Brass and Grissom arrive at a rundown house that has certainly seen
better days. It’s a crackhouse and they’re looking for Mindy Dupont. A
man answers. Grissom looks inside, spotting drug material on the
floor. Since “it’s a free county,” both he and Brass just enter and
find Mindy on the floor, hardly cleaned up anymore. She’s back to
drugs, despite Ed’s best efforts. He gave her the ibagain, which made
her high. Grissom spots a bloody knife near her. “Did you come here to
remember, or to forget?” he asks.

The person who wrote this actually screwed up, in that the ibo DIDN’T
make her high. She’s high all right, but her response–“Ed gave me
ibogaine”–is intended to divert the two cops from the fact that she’s
obviously just done the massive dose of smack Riley gave her after they
fucked. Grissom rejoins “…and then you didn’t want to get high any
more.” And her cry is meant to convey that she went back to smack
because she missed it, when all was said and done: “I never wanted to
feel.”

– Mindy has been brought in, but she looks and sounds horrible. Brass
points out she’s up for a murder rap. Grissom points out evidence also
shows she’s been high for a while, and think that Burnell was looking
for her, as he knew she was using. Brass arrests her.
– Warrick and Nick are going over Mindy’s ragged underwear. Sad. No
sign of blood, however. But, Greg comes in with a skin sample that
doesn’t belong to Belongs to Riley Renaldo, the man who answered the
door. He was the landlord, who let her pay her rent in sex.
– The police arrive at the wreck of a house, and Renaldo is already
having sex with another junkie. However, they police realize that if
Ed cleaned up addicts, it would be bad for Renaldo’s business. He gave
her drugs, and then he went out and murdered Burnell. DNA evidence
proves his guilt.As the female junkie sags down the hall, Grissom
doesn’t see the need to take her to lockup. “She’s already there,” he
says, grimly, of the woman’s own self-created prison.

Not so much bad for his business, as bad for his sex life. It’s also
kind of implied that Burnell may have strayed from ethical practice in
becoming involved with Mindy himself, so there’s a jealousy
undercurrent.

Comment:

I am curious as to what this episode is trying to say about iboga?

That it’s extremely emotionally conflicting for police to crack down on
a Schedule I drug (non-maintenance) that stops drug addiction and is
not used at raves.

Anyone seen it in English and understood it properly?

I can send you a duplicate, but its NTSC VHS, not-playable in Europe
unless you have U.S. equipment.

Apparently these episodes are based on true F.B.I. reports?

Lee

They draw on current cases. The Indra part comes from LAPD finding a
body of an opiate OD together with both Indra and opiates, for
instance. And as I said, Stahl got the idea from people he met at group
who’d come back from Mexico. He told people he was going to be “true to
the root.”

Understand that we had to go into our protest at CBS national
headquarters (the Black Rock)  blind. We knew there would be some kind
of inaccuracy involving some one driving on Ibo, but what we were
really upset about was that CBS, instead of treating this as a serious
documentary subject a la Ben DeLoenen, was exploiting ibogaine and
pandering to the drug war stereotype of Burnell as just another pusher,
and ibogaine just another drug. Were I able to do it over, well, in the
office here we have a picture of Bozo the Clown with a red ‘banned’
crossed circle super-imposed, and the words “No Clowning Around With
Ibogaine!”

I don’t think it’s respectful to compare Bwiti religious ceremony with
clowns and mimes, even if the Fang do use face paint.

All that being said, the episode has aired four times here, and
millions have at least heard about ibogaine as a result. That’s why I
pestered the Kerry campaign with it–in addition to other, much more
scientific stuff. To let them know that Ibo is now a mass phenomena
that can’t just be ignored.

Still think it’s a good idea to send Theresa Heinz the new video, too.

Dana/cnw

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Feb 26 2004)
Date: May 25, 2005 at 7:30:24 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee Albert wrote:
I happened to see on TV last night a CSI episode here is Spain where part of the plot included a treatment house for addiction using iboga plus a murder where somehow iboga was involved. C.S.I. normally has two plots and is based on F.B.I. reports of true crimes.

I didn’t understand it all but the parts I did went something like:

1. A drug user Ed (former addict turned provider), is cruising around in his car hallucinating on iboga and picks up this girl – Mindy. I think he gives her iboga too. He is later found dead.

Your one-time viewing seems to have you collapsing the story-lines of two different characters here. Ed is looking for Mindy, who’s relapsed alright–but he himself isn’t on ibogaine. He has some for Mindy (never mind that any one doing what he’s doing wouldn’t have had their ibogaine along for the ride–what’s he going to do, find her and administer it on the spot?–or that when Stahl was writing this, the predominant paradigm was people from his 12 step groups coming back from treatments at Rosarita, so any actual ibogaine was never in the US at all!).

You’re confusing Ed with Jamal the thief, who (it’s implied) finds the ibogaine after Ed’s killed and gets into a car accident after injecting it and starting to trip while driving. Injecting multiplies the impact of ibo on the system something like 50 times, so that aspect would hold up–except that the substance pictured is supposed to be Indra, which can’t be injected. But the ibogaine physically  has to be in the car for the CSI folk to find it, or the somewhat valid premise that iboga would be a mystery substance to most police departments doesn’t have a chance to unfold. The clear clue that Jamal is supposed to have lost his coordination on iboga is when Brass says “What drug is he on?” and the hipper Black cop replies “Whatever it is, either he took too much or not enough.”

2. The investigator reflects and says: “swopping one addiction for another,” referring to the taking of iboga. Perhaps referring to Ed?

It’s supposed to sound like the mission ex-addicts are on to get other addicts off drugs is the equivalent taking iboga, but the context–Ed bringing iboga down from  the Mountain and pushing it on everyone–makes it clear the actual critique is that  “getting religious about it” and prosyletizing ibogaine is just another replacement for chemical addiction.

3. A female drug addict (Mindy) in custody (the one who was with Ed in the car) says something about the spirits telling her something. She was questioned as to her motive for doing something and that was her reply.

No, she is threatened with murder charges and says the spirits (Bwiti) will protect her. It’s meant to show that the ideational  impact of an initiation or treatment persists for months, even after a person relapses and starts using smack again. (And isn’t the stuff in Vegas mainly black tar, not white powder? Inconsistencies abound.)

Anyway I only happened to see part of it and didn’t really understand it properly.

Hope this helps.

Maybe someone else has seen this episode. I understand its the current episode.

Some extracts from plot:

http://members.aol.com/NATPE1/csi-season4a.htm#top

– Underneath a highway overpass, people gather, doing drugs. Some are hooking, and a car glides by. The driver keeps going, asking questions, until he finds what he wants. He’s young, good-looking and drives a BMW. He gets out and starts walking.. Next thing you know, he’s dead on the ground, the CSI looking over his body. Watch, wallet and shoes are all gone and there’s blood on him.
– Warrick finds a small bag of something on the car floor. Greg gets it and runs tests on the substance. He doesn’t know what it is. Grissom checks the microscope. It’s something new.
– They’ve identified the strange substance, which is, in layman’s term, a substance that can cure physical addiction. Its intended use is as a hallucingen used by a tribe in South Africa, from the Iboga tree and is called Ibogaine. It’s not legal in the U.S. Brass says Burnell was a dealer, no matter how you look at it.

“Intended use” is all relative. In North America it’s intended use to interrupt drug addiction–and that the hallucinogenesis is a side effect. It’s from the bark of the root, not the tree as it says in the dialog. And they never point  out that it’s legal in Canada and Mexico, and that in real life, you don’t have to travel long by car to get to Rosarita. But that would undermine the premise of Ed even being under the freeway looking for Mindy–with the ibogaine on him.

– At a halfway house, Grissom and Brass talk to Jake Sinclair, the guy who runs it. They don’t give out illegal drugs. A young woman, Mindy, is leaving, as the place reminds her too much of Ed. Ed got her clean. They’re shown a video of what she looked like two months ago. A real mess. When Ed first arrived, he was an asset, but they he got ‘religious’ about it. He brought the Ibogaine with him and in effect, became a pusher of sorts, peddling his cure.

Harm reduction and abstinence-based therapy are conveniently  mixed up here, but Jake seems to be saying that if some one has been dosed with Ibogaine he’ll let the trip run its course, even though the standard reaction would probably be to treat it like acid and send out for thorazine. Jake actually gives a pretty good understanding of what ibo does and it limitations. But Stahl is hallucinating what he think a provider would be like. Where is the intake protocol? I know of no one who’s willing to give ibo now without at least a EKG, not to mention EEG and liver panel. What kind of a pusher sends out for medical tests?

– Brass and Grissom arrive at a rundown house that has certainly seen better days. It’s a crackhouse and they’re looking for Mindy Dupont. A man answers. Grissom looks inside, spotting drug material on the floor. Since “it’s a free county,” both he and Brass just enter and find Mindy on the floor, hardly cleaned up anymore. She’s back to drugs, despite Ed’s best efforts. He gave her the ibagain, which made her high. Grissom spots a bloody knife near her. “Did you come here to remember, or to forget?” he asks.

The person who wrote this actually screwed up, in that the ibo DIDN’T make her high. She’s high all right, but her response–“Ed gave me ibogaine”–is intended to divert the two cops from the fact that she’s obviously just done the massive dose of smack Riley gave her after they fucked. Grissom rejoins “…and then you didn’t want to get high any more.” And her cry is meant to convey that she went back to smack because she missed it, when all was said and done: “I never wanted to feel.”

– Mindy has been brought in, but she looks and sounds horrible. Brass points out she’s up for a murder rap. Grissom points out evidence also shows she’s been high for a while, and think that Burnell was looking for her, as he knew she was using. Brass arrests her.
– Warrick and Nick are going over Mindy’s ragged underwear. Sad. No sign of blood, however. But, Greg comes in with a skin sample that doesn’t belong to Belongs to Riley Renaldo, the man who answered the door. He was the landlord, who let her pay her rent in sex.
– The police arrive at the wreck of a house, and Renaldo is already having sex with another junkie. However, they police realize that if Ed cleaned up addicts, it would be bad for Renaldo’s business. He gave her drugs, and then he went out and murdered Burnell. DNA evidence proves his guilt.As the female junkie sags down the hall, Grissom doesn’t see the need to take her to lockup. “She’s already there,” he says, grimly, of the woman’s own self-created prison.

Not so much bad for his business, as bad for his sex life. It’s also kind of implied that Burnell may have strayed from ethical practice in becoming involved with Mindy himself, so there’s a jealousy undercurrent.

Comment:

I am curious as to what this episode is trying to say about iboga?

That it’s extremely emotionally conflicting for police to crack down on a Schedule I drug (non-maintenance) that stops drug addiction and is not used at raves.

Anyone seen it in English and understood it properly?

I can send you a duplicate, but its NTSC VHS, not-playable in Europe unless you have U.S. equipment.

Apparently these episodes are based on true F.B.I. reports?

Lee
They draw on current cases. The Indra part comes from LAPD finding a body of an opiate OD together with both Indra and opiates, for instance. And as I said, Stahl got the idea from people he met at group who’d come back from Mexico. He told people he was going to be “true to the root.”

Understand that we had to go into our protest at CBS national headquarters (the Black Rock)  blind. We knew there would be some kind of inaccuracy involving some one driving on Ibo, but what we were really upset about was that CBS, instead of treating this as a serious documentary subject a la Ben DeLoenen, was exploiting ibogaine and pandering to the drug war stereotype of Burnell as just another pusher, and ibogaine just another drug. Were I able to do it over, well, in the office here we have a picture of Bozo the Clown with a red ‘banned’ crossed circle super-imposed, and the words “No Clowning Around With Ibogaine!”

I don’t think it’s respectful to compare Bwiti religious ceremony with clowns and mimes, even if the Fang do use face paint.

All that being said, the episode has aired four times here, and millions have at least heard about ibogaine as a result. That’s why I pestered the Kerry campaign with it–in addition to other, much more scientific stuff. To let them know that Ibo is now a mass phenomena that can’t just be ignored.

Still think it’s a good idea to send Theresa Heinz the new video, too.

Dana/cnw

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Feb 26 2004)
Date: May 25, 2005 at 4:01:57 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There were at least 200 messages here back and forth
about this before, during and after it aired. The
director whose story it is based on, goes to the same
12 step group with jerry stahl who wrote it, Dana Beal
protested it, then reposted all of it into the John
Kerry presidential site.

Carla B

— Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com> wrote:

Love the part about “cruising around in his car.”  I
know on iboga, I couldn’t WALK, much less drive!
Jane

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:I happened to
see on TV last night a CSI episode here is Spain
where part of the plot included a treatment house
for addiction using iboga plus a murder where
somehow iboga was involved. C.S.I. normally has two
plots and is based on F.B.I. reports of true crimes.

I didn’t understand it all but the parts I did went
something like:

1. A drug user Ed (former addict turned provider),
is cruising around in his car hallucinating on iboga
and picks up this girl – Mindy. I think he gives her
iboga too. He is later found dead.

2. The investigator reflects and says: “swopping one
addiction for another,” referring to the taking of
iboga. Perhaps referring to Ed?

3. A female drug addict (Mindy) in custody (the one
who was with Ed in the car) says something about the
spirits telling her something. She was questioned as
to her motive for doing something and that was her
reply.

Anyway I only happened to see part of it and didn’t
really understand it properly.

Maybe someone else has seen this episode. I
understand its the current episode.

Some extracts from plot:

http://members.aol.com/NATPE1/csi-season4a.htm#top

– Underneath a highway overpass, people gather,
doing drugs. Some are hooking, and a car glides by.
The driver keeps going, asking questions, until he
finds what he wants. He’s young, good-looking and
drives a BMW. He gets out and starts walking.. Next
thing you know, he’s dead on the ground, the CSI
looking over his body. Watch, wallet and shoes are
all gone and there’s blood on him.

– Warrick finds a small bag of something on the car
floor. Greg gets it and runs tests on the substance.
He doesn’t know what it is. Grissom checks the
microscope. It’s something new.

– They’ve identified the strange substance, which
is, in layman’s term, a substance that can cure
physical addiction. Its intended use is as a
hallucingen used by a tribe in South Africa, from
the Iboga tree and is called Ibogaine. It’s not
legal in the U.S. Brass says Burnell was a dealer,
no matter how you look at it.

– At a halfway house, Grissom and Brass talk to Jake
Sinclair, the guy who runs it. They don’t give out
illegal drugs. A young woman, Mindy, is leaving, as
the place reminds her too much of Ed. Ed got her
clean. They’re shown a video of what she looked like
two months ago. A real mess. When Ed first arrived,
he was an asset, but they he got ‘religious’ about
it. He brought the Ibogaine with him and in effect,
became a pusher of sorts, peddling his cure.

– Brass and Grissom arrive at a rundown house that
has certainly seen better days. It’s a crackhouse
and they’re looking for Mindy Dupont. A man answers.
Grissom looks inside, spotting drug material on the
floor. Since “it’s a free county,” both he and Brass
just enter and find Mindy on the floor, hardly
cleaned up anymore. She’s back to drugs, despite
Ed’s best efforts. He gave her the ibagain, which
made her high. Grissom spots a bloody knife near
her. “Did you come here to remember, or to forget?”
he asks.

– Mindy has been brought in, but she looks and
sounds horrible. Brass points out she’s up for a
murder rap. Grissom points out evidence also shows
she’s been high for a while, and think that Burnell
was looking for her, as he knew she was using. Brass
arrests her.

– Warrick and Nick are going over Mindy’s ragged
underwear. Sad. No sign of blood, however. But, Greg
comes in with a skin sample that doesn’t belong to
Belongs to Riley Renaldo, the man who answered the
door. He was the landlord, who let her pay her rent
in sex.

– The police arrive at the wreck of a house, and
Renaldo is already having sex with another junkie.
However, they police realize that if Ed cleaned up
addicts, it would be bad for Renaldo’s business. He
gave her drugs, and then he went out and murdered
Burnell. DNA evidence proves his guilt.As the female
junkie sags down the hall, Grissom doesn’t see the
need to take her to lockup. “She’s already there,”
he says, grimly, of the woman’s own self-created
prison.

Comment:

I am curious as to what this episode is trying to
say about iboga?

Anyone seen it in English and understood it
properly?

Apparently these episodes are based on true F.B.I.
reports?

Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of
eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes
section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance
and spiritual interpretation of the eboga
experience. Includes a mailing list for those
already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Small Business – Try our new Resources site
http://smallbusiness.yahoo.com/resources/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Feb 26 2004)
Date: May 25, 2005 at 1:11:26 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Love the part about “cruising around in his car.”  I know on iboga, I couldn’t WALK, much less drive!  Jane

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
I happened to see on TV last night a CSI episode here is Spain where part of the plot included a treatment house for addiction using iboga plus a murder where somehow iboga was involved. C.S.I. normally has two plots and is based on F.B.I. reports of true crimes.

I didn’t understand it all but the parts I did went something like:

1. A drug user Ed (former addict turned provider), is cruising around in his car hallucinating on iboga and picks up this girl – Mindy. I think he gives her iboga too. He is later found dead.

2. The investigator reflects and says: “swopping one addiction for another,” referring to the taking of iboga. Perhaps referring to Ed?

3. A female drug addict (Mindy) in custody (the one who was with Ed in the car) says something about the spirits telling her something. She was questioned as to her motive for doing something and that was her reply.

Anyway I only happened to see part of it and didn’t really understand it properly.

Maybe someone else has seen this episode. I understand its the current episode.

Some extracts from plot:

http://members.aol.com/NATPE1/csi-season4a.htm#top

– Underneath a highway overpass, people gather, doing drugs. Some are hooking, and a car glides by. The driver keeps going, asking questions, until he finds what he wants. He’s young, good-looking and drives a BMW. He gets out and starts walking.. Next thing you know, he’s dead on the ground, the CSI looking over his body. Watch, wallet and shoes are all gone and there’s blood on him.
– Warrick finds a small bag of something on the car floor. Greg gets it and runs tests on the substance. He doesn’t know what it is. Grissom checks the microscope. It’s something new.
– They’ve identified the strange substance, which is, in layman’s term, a substance that can cure physical addiction. Its intended use is as a hallucingen used by a tribe in South Africa, from the Iboga tree and is called Ibogaine. It’s not legal in the U.S. Brass says Burnell was a dealer, no matter how you look at it.
– At a halfway house, Grissom and Brass talk to Jake Sinclair, the guy who runs it. They don’t give out illegal drugs. A young woman, Mindy, is leaving, as the place reminds her too much of Ed. Ed got her clean. They’re shown a video of what she looked like two months ago. A real mess. When Ed first arrived, he was an asset, but they he got ‘religious’ about it. He brought the Ibogaine with him and in effect, became a pusher of sorts, peddling his cure.
– Brass and Grissom arrive at a rundown house that has certainly seen better days. It’s a crackhouse and they’re looking for Mindy Dupont. A man answers. Grissom looks inside, spotting drug material on the floor. Since “it’s a free county,” both he and Brass just enter and find Mindy on the floor, hardly cleaned up anymore. She’s back to drugs, despite Ed’s best efforts. He gave her the ibagain, which made her high. Grissom spots a bloody knife near her. “Did you come here to remember, or to forget?” he asks.

– Mindy has been brought in, but she looks and sounds horrible. Brass points out she’s up for a murder rap. Grissom points out evidence also shows she’s been high for a while, and think that Burnell was looking for her, as he knew she was using. Brass arrests her.
– Warrick and Nick are going over Mindy’s ragged underwear. Sad. No sign of blood, however. But, Greg comes in with a skin sample that doesn’t belong to Belongs to Riley Renaldo, the man who answered the door. He was the landlord, who let her pay her rent in sex.
– The police arrive at the wreck of a house, and Renaldo is already having sex with another junkie. However, they police realize that if Ed cleaned up addicts, it would be bad for Renaldo’s business. He gave her drugs, and then he went out and murdered Burnell. DNA evidence proves his guilt.As the female junkie sags down the hall, Grissom doesn’t see the need to take her to lockup. “She’s already there,” he says, grimly, of the woman’s own self-created prison.

Comment:

I am curious as to what this episode is trying to say about iboga?

Anyone seen it in English and understood it properly?

Apparently these episodes are based on true F.B.I. reports?

Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] what the fuck.
Date: May 24, 2005 at 8:38:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So. My mom is at war with the neighbors and they are in the process of
calling the cops on said neighbors for driving a four wheeler up and
down the road.  I give up entirely on th eprocess of trying to get
along with them on  all of this.  I don’t need this shit keeping me up
and away from what my main focus is.  I can’t stadn triviality,
especially at this level. Like there aren’t major things happening in
the world other than this.  I give.  I need a gun.  I don’t know.
I need OUT!!!!!!!
help…
there aren’t enough pills to calm me throuhg the tumult of bullshit
that goes on here, anad here  is where I have to stay if I want to
stay clean.  Cleeeeeeeeeeeeeean.  This has to be my focus.  I don’t
know. What the fuck.   There talkng baout calling the staties.  i have
warrants.  This is SO not good.
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: [Ibogaine] emails mk ppl stupid coz they R worse than smking pot
Date: May 24, 2005 at 10:12:23 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

-“THE regular use of text messages and e-mails can lower the IQ more than twice as much as smoking marijuana.”-snip

http://technology.timesonline.co.uk/article/0,,20409-1580833,00.html

i guess i´ll be offline for the rest of the day…maybe i should get some weed…

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Feb 26 2004)
Date: May 24, 2005 at 6:13:07 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

this episode was written by jerry stahl, junky celebrity, who wrote “permanent midnight”. it´s his autobiography that deals mainly with his heavy heroin habit. it´s written very well and has a twisted humor. it was filmed starring ben stiller. grab the movie and some popcorn.
he also wrote for the “Alf” “Moonlighting” and “Thirtysomething”  in the 80ties and recently part of “bad boys II”.

i don´t think the episode is based on true FBI reports and i don´t think stahl nows much about ibogaine. haven´t seen it though, but heard about it a while ago.

-ekkkki

Am 24.05.2005 um 11:42 schrieb Lee Albert:

I happened to see on TV last night a CSI episode here is Spain where part of the plot included a treatment house for addiction using iboga plus a murder where somehow iboga was involved. C.S.I. normally has two plots and is based on F.B.I. reports of true crimes.

I didn’t understand it all but the parts I did went something like:

1. A drug user Ed (former addict turned provider), is cruising around in his car hallucinating on iboga and picks up this girl – Mindy. I think he gives her iboga too. He is later found dead.

2. The investigator reflects and says: “swopping one addiction for another,” referring to the taking of iboga. Perhaps referring to Ed?

3. A female drug addict (Mindy) in custody (the one who was with Ed in the car) says something about the spirits telling her something. She was questioned as to her motive for doing something and that was her reply.

Anyway I only happened to see part of it and didn’t really understand it properly.

Maybe someone else has seen this episode. I understand its the current episode.

Some extracts from plot:

http://members.aol.com/NATPE1/csi-season4a.htm#top

– Underneath a highway overpass, people gather, doing drugs. Some are hooking, and a car glides by. The driver keeps going, asking questions, until he finds what he wants. He’s young, good-looking and drives a BMW. He gets out and starts walking.. Next thing you know, he’s dead on the ground, the CSI looking over his body. Watch, wallet and shoes are all gone and there’s blood on him.
– Warrick finds a small bag of something on the car floor. Greg gets it and runs tests on the substance. He doesn’t know what it is. Grissom checks the microscope. It’s something new.
– They’ve identified the strange substance, which is, in layman’s term, a substance that can cure physical addiction. Its intended use is as a hallucingen used by a tribe in South Africa, from the Iboga tree and is called Ibogaine. It’s not legal in the U.S. Brass says Burnell was a dealer, no matter how you look at it.
– At a halfway house, Grissom and Brass talk to Jake Sinclair, the guy who runs it. They don’t give out illegal drugs. A young woman, Mindy, is leaving, as the place reminds her too much of Ed. Ed got her clean. They’re shown a video of what she looked like two months ago. A real mess. When Ed first arrived, he was an asset, but they he got ‘religious’ about it. He brought the Ibogaine with him and in effect, became a pusher of sorts, peddling his cure.
– Brass and Grissom arrive at a rundown house that has certainly seen better days. It’s a crackhouse and they’re looking for Mindy Dupont. A man answers. Grissom looks inside, spotting drug material on the floor. Since “it’s a free county,” both he and Brass just enter and find Mindy on the floor, hardly cleaned up anymore. She’s back to drugs, despite Ed’s best efforts. He gave her the ibagain, which made her high. Grissom spots a bloody knife near her. “Did you come here to remember, or to forget?” he asks.

– Mindy has been brought in, but she looks and sounds horrible. Brass points out she’s up for a murder rap. Grissom points out evidence also shows she’s been high for a while, and think that Burnell was looking for her, as he knew she was using. Brass arrests her.
– Warrick and Nick are going over Mindy’s ragged underwear. Sad. No sign of blood, however. But, Greg comes in with a skin sample that doesn’t belong to Belongs to Riley Renaldo, the man who answered the door. He was the landlord, who let her pay her rent in sex.
– The police arrive at the wreck of a house, and Renaldo is already having sex with another junkie. However, they police realize that if Ed cleaned up addicts, it would be bad for Renaldo’s business. He gave her drugs, and then he went out and murdered Burnell. DNA evidence proves his guilt.As the female junkie sags down the hall, Grissom doesn’t see the need to take her to lockup. “She’s already there,” he says, grimly, of the woman’s own self-created prison.

Comment:

I am curious as to what this episode is trying to say about iboga?

Anyone seen it in English and understood it properly?

Apparently these episodes are based on true F.B.I. reports?

Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Bwiti Practices
Date: May 24, 2005 at 5:46:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Arlo,

Just curious. Is this based on personal observation or from reports you have seen?

Lee

orangesun Barrel <kaliorangemist710@hotmail.com> wrote:
concerning the deaths in africa due to iboga ingestion many Fang believe it
to be the result of evil gypsies or people possessed by spirits. usually the
elders decide if the initiate is able to take eboga the night before with
the otunga tree practice, in which they rip out a certain tree from the
earth and if it uproots with ease then the ancestors are in favor of the
ebin’s (initiate) partarking in the engosie. They also (sometimes) eat small
amounts of eboga themselves the night before to consult the ancestors for
assurance. The Mitsogho consider the Fang to be far less scrupulous overall
with the taking precautionary measures concerning the aptitude of the
initiate.
Arlo-Oorrannge B.
>From:
>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>To:
>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
>Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 10:22:35 -0700
>
>People do die in Africa. It is viewed as due to a flaw in the
>person, perhaps due to an unconfessed sin. Fang Bwiti are said take
>higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
>the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have originally
>gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer deaths.
>
>The Fang are a vigorous people. Life has a different value in
>Africa, in that death at all ages is more common.
>
>On Wed, 18 May 2005 10:02:49 -0700 Preston Peet
>wrote:
> >>I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the
>
> >benefit
> >>of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that
> >have l! ost
> >>loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts<
> >
> >RAther rushed and busy this end of the internet, but Shelly, I
> >just wanted
> >to write and say “thank you” for posting this comment.
> >I wrote some more, haughty and slightly angry stuff here but
> >deleted it, it
> >isn’t important. The important part is that you hit the nail on
> >the head-
> >yes, there may very well be some risks with ibogaine, but if the
> >natives can
> >take it without doctors and heartmonitors why can’t we? I’m
> >curious as to
> >whether the natives in Gabon ever have any deaths?
> >Peace and love,
> >Preston Peet
> >
> >”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
>
> >often
> >mistaken for madness”
> >Richard Davenport-Hines
> >
> >ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> >Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> >Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> >Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
> >Civilizations,
> >Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> >Cont. High Times mag/.com
> >Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> >Columnist New York Waste
> >Etc.
> >
> >—– Original Message —–
> >From: shelley krupa
> >To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> >Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 10:30 AM
> >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
> >
> >
> >Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I
> >detoxed
> >twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that
> >time ,the MD
> >said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I
> >remember
> >being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in
> >mexico,I figure
> >the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the
> >ones I
> >work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get
> >free
> >anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never
> >experienced
> >before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical
> >kinda
> >setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to
> >inquire about
> >another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from
> >ibogaine , &
> >that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last
> >detox I did
> >was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3
> >times
> >before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best
> >results
> >ever psychologically &am! p; spiritually, (3 months clean this
> >time &
> >counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very
> >mild
> >,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw
> >up at my
> >hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole
> >ends up
> >carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances
> >to
> >consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the
> >quintessential risk
> >taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug
> >just able to
> >cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV
> >insanity, so I’d
> >risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of
>
> >doing
> >ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have
> >easily done
> >that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly
> >elevated even,
> >with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those
> >african folks
> >do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely
>
> >no
> >disresect to those that have l! ost loved ones ,or that help
> >others, just my
> >thoughts ,love shell
> >
> >Morning Wood wrote:
> >
> >I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
> >you find the time.
> >
> >be well mr semi colon,
> >j
> >
> >— Marko wrote:
> >> Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
> >> He took IBO in the
> >> evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
> >> to have a harder impact
> >> when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
> >> enough!) and he constantly
> >> felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
> >> of enormous blood
> >> pressure.
> >>
> >> He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
> >> night), and his pulse and
> >> blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
> >> heighten, but within normal.
> >> During these measurements he felt as before, and
> >> complained to the doctor
> >> all the time. When the doctor told him that his
> >> pulse and ! blood pressure
> >> are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
> >> normal. All the pressure
> >> was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
> >> physical plane – at
> >> all!!)
> >>
> >> He was taken back home, and had some divine
> >> experience afterwards ;-))
> >>
> >> This case was obviously a psychological one.
> >>
> >> I know from experience that very high pulse is
> >> possible; but its duration
> >> isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
> >> waves.
> >>
> >> Marko
> >>
> >> On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
> >>
> >> > In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
> >> Standard Time,
> >> > my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
> >> > Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
> >> medical
> >> > supervision to counteract the potential side
> >> effects
> >> > of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
> >> pulse
> >> > (amo! ng other things). This is rather easy to do
> >> with
> >> > drugs such as Inderal and the like
> >> > Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
> >> pressure or pulse for that matter
> >> > went up much at all. My mother could tell you
> >> better than me. She’s a nurse
> >> > practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
> >> took my blood pressure once
> >> > and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
> >> wasn’t ever much of a change. I
> >> > think this just goes to show that no two
> >> treatments will ever be alike with
> >> > something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
> >> provider checked on me, he
> >> > could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
> >> This thing bothers me a lot.
> >> > I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
> >> and taken the treatment.
> >> > I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
> >> give me some time and
> >&g! t; > consideration after I cornered them at the
> >> conference, or wherever I could find them. I
> >> > was never put off by the way, everyone was very
> >> nice and treated me with
> >> > respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
> >> these people it was that they all
> >> > cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
> >> everyone pointing fingers at
> >> > someone who they know deep down was devastated by
> >> the death occurring during
> >> > the treatment? It happens in the states, it
> >> happens in Europe, and it happens in
> >> > Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
> >> calculated risk. So is
> >> > driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
> >> scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
> >> > I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
> >> down home, but there is so
> >> > much more to learn about it that I have come to
> >> the realization that! it is
> >> > going to take an enormous amount of money, and
> >> research, to ever completely
> >> > figure it out. Back to square one again.
> >> Randy
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >/]=—————————————————————-
>
> >—–=[\r
> >> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> >> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> >>
> >>
> >]=—————————————————————–
>
> >—-=[/
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >__________________________________
> >Yahoo! Mail Mobile
> >Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
> >http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail
> >
> >
> >/]=—————————————————————-
>
> >—–=[\r
> >[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> >http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> >[%]
> >]=—————————————————————–
>
> >—-=[/
> >
> >
> >
> > /]=————————————————————–
>
> >——-=[\r
> > [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> >http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> > ]=—————————————————————
>
> >——=[/
>
>
>
>Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
>secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
>
>Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
>http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434
>
>Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
>http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
>
>
>
>
>/]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>[%]
>
>\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] C.S.I. T.V. Drama & iboga – Episode #416 – GETTING OFF (Feb 26 2004)
Date: May 24, 2005 at 5:42:20 AM EDT
To: Ibogaine List <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I happened to see on TV last night a CSI episode here is Spain where part of the plot included a treatment house for addiction using iboga plus a murder where somehow iboga was involved. C.S.I. normally has two plots and is based on F.B.I. reports of true crimes.

I didn’t understand it all but the parts I did went something like:

1. A drug user Ed (former addict turned provider), is cruising around in his car hallucinating on iboga and picks up this girl – Mindy. I think he gives her iboga too. He is later found dead.

2. The investigator reflects and says: “swopping one addiction for another,” referring to the taking of iboga. Perhaps referring to Ed?

3. A female drug addict (Mindy) in custody (the one who was with Ed in the car) says something about the spirits telling her something. She was questioned as to her motive for doing something and that was her reply.

Anyway I only happened to see part of it and didn’t really understand it properly.

Maybe someone else has seen this episode. I understand its the current episode.

Some extracts from plot:

http://members.aol.com/NATPE1/csi-season4a.htm#top

– Underneath a highway overpass, people gather, doing drugs. Some are hooking, and a car glides by. The driver keeps going, asking questions, until he finds what he wants. He’s young, good-looking and drives a BMW. He gets out and starts walking.. Next thing you know, he’s dead on the ground, the CSI looking over his body. Watch, wallet and shoes are all gone and there’s blood on him.
– Warrick finds a small bag of something on the car floor. Greg gets it and runs tests on the substance. He doesn’t know what it is. Grissom checks the microscope. It’s something new.
– They’ve identified the strange substance, which is, in layman’s term, a substance that can cure physical addiction. Its intended use is as a hallucingen used by a tribe in South Africa, from the Iboga tree and is called Ibogaine. It’s not legal in the U.S. Brass says Burnell was a dealer, no matter how you look at it.
– At a halfway house, Grissom and Brass talk to Jake Sinclair, the guy who runs it. They don’t give out illegal drugs. A young woman, Mindy, is leaving, as the place reminds her too much of Ed. Ed got her clean. They’re shown a video of what she looked like two months ago. A real mess. When Ed first arrived, he was an asset, but they he got ‘religious’ about it. He brought the Ibogaine with him and in effect, became a pusher of sorts, peddling his cure.
– Brass and Grissom arrive at a rundown house that has certainly seen better days. It’s a crackhouse and they’re looking for Mindy Dupont. A man answers. Grissom looks inside, spotting drug material on the floor. Since “it’s a free county,” both he and Brass just enter and find Mindy on the floor, hardly cleaned up anymore. She’s back to drugs, despite Ed’s best efforts. He gave her the ibagain, which made her high. Grissom spots a bloody knife near her. “Did you come here to remember, or to forget?” he asks.

– Mindy has been brought in, but she looks and sounds horrible. Brass points out she’s up for a murder rap. Grissom points out evidence also shows she’s been high for a while, and think that Burnell was looking for her, as he knew she was using. Brass arrests her.
– Warrick and Nick are going over Mindy’s ragged underwear. Sad. No sign of blood, however. But, Greg comes in with a skin sample that doesn’t belong to Belongs to Riley Renaldo, the man who answered the door. He was the landlord, who let her pay her rent in sex.
– The police arrive at the wreck of a house, and Renaldo is already having sex with another junkie. However, they police realize that if Ed cleaned up addicts, it would be bad for Renaldo’s business. He gave her drugs, and then he went out and murdered Burnell. DNA evidence proves his guilt.As the female junkie sags down the hall, Grissom doesn’t see the need to take her to lockup. “She’s already there,” he says, grimly, of the woman’s own self-created prison.

Comment:

I am curious as to what this episode is trying to say about iboga?

Anyone seen it in English and understood it properly?

Apparently these episodes are based on true F.B.I. reports?

Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “orangesun Barrel” <kaliorangemist710@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 23, 2005 at 6:50:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

concerning the deaths in africa due to iboga ingestion many Fang believe it to be the result of evil gypsies or people possessed by spirits. usually the elders decide if the initiate is able to take eboga the night before with the otunga tree practice, in which they rip out a certain tree from the earth and if it uproots with ease then the ancestors are in favor of the ebin’s (initiate) partarking in the engosie. They also (sometimes) eat small amounts of eboga themselves the night before to consult the ancestors for assurance. The Mitsogho consider the Fang to be far less scrupulous overall with the taking precautionary measures concerning the aptitude of the initiate.
Arlo-Oorrannge B.
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 10:22:35 -0700

People do die in Africa. It is viewed as due to a flaw in the
person, perhaps due to an unconfessed sin. Fang Bwiti are said take
higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have originally
gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer deaths.

The Fang are a vigorous people. Life has a different value in
Africa, in that death at all ages is more common.

On Wed, 18 May 2005 10:02:49 -0700 Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
wrote:
>>I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the

>benefit
>>of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that
>have l! ost
>>loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts<
>
>RAther rushed and busy this end of the internet, but Shelly, I
>just wanted
>to write and say “thank you” for posting this comment.
>I wrote some more, haughty and slightly angry stuff here but
>deleted it, it
>isn’t important. The important part is that you hit the nail on
>the head-
>yes, there may very well be some risks with ibogaine, but if the
>natives can
>take it without doctors and heartmonitors why can’t we? I’m
>curious as to
>whether the natives in Gabon ever have any deaths?
>Peace and love,
>Preston Peet
>
>”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is

>often
>mistaken for madness”
>Richard Davenport-Hines
>
>ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
>Civilizations,
>Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>Cont. High Times mag/.com
>Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>Columnist New York Waste
>Etc.
>
>—– Original Message —–
>From: shelley krupa
>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 10:30 AM
>Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
>
>
>Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I
>detoxed
>twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that
>time ,the MD
>said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I
>remember
>being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in
>mexico,I figure
>the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the
>ones I
>work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get
>free
>anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never
>experienced
>before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical
>kinda
>setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to
>inquire about
>another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from
>ibogaine , &
>that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last
>detox I did
>was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3
>times
>before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best
>results
>ever psychologically &am! p; spiritually, (3 months clean this
>time &
>counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very
>mild
>,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw
>up at my
>hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole
>ends up
>carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances
>to
>consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the
>quintessential risk
>taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug
>just able to
>cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV
>insanity, so I’d
>risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of

>doing
>ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have
>easily done
>that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly
>elevated even,
>with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those
>african folks
>do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely

>no
>disresect to those that have l! ost loved ones ,or that help
>others, just my
>thoughts ,love shell
>
>Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
>you find the time.
>
>be well mr semi colon,
>j
>
>— Marko wrote:
>> Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
>> He took IBO in the
>> evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
>> to have a harder impact
>> when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
>> enough!) and he constantly
>> felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
>> of enormous blood
>> pressure.
>>
>> He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
>> night), and his pulse and
>> blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
>> heighten, but within normal.
>> During these measurements he felt as before, and
>> complained to the doctor
>> all the time. When the doctor told him that his
>> pulse and ! blood pressure
>> are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
>> normal. All the pressure
>> was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
>> physical plane – at
>> all!!)
>>
>> He was taken back home, and had some divine
>> experience afterwards ;-))
>>
>> This case was obviously a psychological one.
>>
>> I know from experience that very high pulse is
>> possible; but its duration
>> isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
>> waves.
>>
>> Marko
>>
>> On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
>>
>> > In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
>> Standard Time,
>> > my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
>> > Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
>> medical
>> > supervision to counteract the potential side
>> effects
>> > of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
>> pulse
>> > (amo! ng other things). This is rather easy to do
>> with
>> > drugs such as Inderal and the like
>> > Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
>> pressure or pulse for that matter
>> > went up much at all. My mother could tell you
>> better than me. She’s a nurse
>> > practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
>> took my blood pressure once
>> > and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
>> wasn’t ever much of a change. I
>> > think this just goes to show that no two
>> treatments will ever be alike with
>> > something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
>> provider checked on me, he
>> > could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
>> This thing bothers me a lot.
>> > I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
>> and taken the treatment.
>> > I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
>> give me some time and
>&g! t; > consideration after I cornered them at the
>> conference, or wherever I could find them. I
>> > was never put off by the way, everyone was very
>> nice and treated me with
>> > respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
>> these people it was that they all
>> > cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
>> everyone pointing fingers at
>> > someone who they know deep down was devastated by
>> the death occurring during
>> > the treatment? It happens in the states, it
>> happens in Europe, and it happens in
>> > Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
>> calculated risk. So is
>> > driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
>> scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
>> > I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
>> down home, but there is so
>> > much more to learn about it that I have come to
>> the realization that! it is
>> > going to take an enormous amount of money, and
>> research, to ever completely
>> > figure it out. Back to square one again.
>> Randy
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>/]=—————————————————————-

>—–=[\r
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>
>>
>]=—————————————————————–

>—-=[/
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>
>__________________________________
>Yahoo! Mail Mobile
>Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
>http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail
>
>
>/]=—————————————————————-

>—–=[\r
>[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>[%]
>]=—————————————————————–

>—-=[/
>
>
>
>  /]=————————————————————–

>——-=[\r
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>  ]=—————————————————————

>——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Ben De Loenen” <daluna@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] LunArt Productions Newsletter May 2005
Date: May 23, 2005 at 6:28:32 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LunArt Productions Newsletter May 2005

What’s new?

1 Website is launched

2 DVD’s ‘IBOGAINE-Rite of passage’ for sale

3 Future screenings ‘IBOGAINE-Rite of Passage’

4 New Project ‘Between Body&Soul. Call for funds.

____________________________________________________________________________

1. Finally, after being under construction for a while, the new site of
Lunart Productions is launched (www.lunartproductions.com). From now on
you can also access the Ibogaine pages by going to www.ibogainefilm.com.

2. DVD’s of ‘IBOGAINE-Rite of Passage’ are for sale in the onlineshop of
the website. For the US DVD’s are 16,99 and for Europe 19,99 euros.
Sending costs are 3 euros. The paypal shopping cart is on and fully
functional.

3. On Saturday May 28, the Belgian première of ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of
Passage’ takes place at the Filmmuseum in Antwerp (Waalsekaai 4, 2000
Antwerpen). The screening starts at 16.00h. Afterwards there is a small
reception. If you want to attend at this event, send a mail to
info@lunartproductions.com with your name(s). This is a free event.

From May 21-23, ‘Entheogenesis’ takes place in Vancouver.
IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage will be screened at this event..

4. LunArt Productions is producing a new documentary project, ‘Between
Body & Soul’,It is a film about the influence of faith on the healing
process of people with HIV. The film will follow 4 inhabitants of Sao
Paulo, Brazil, who are HIV positive and part of the Pentacostal Church.
For them their faith is the only thing they have to hold on to. We still
need financial support for the realization of this project. Visit the
website for all the details about the project. Donations for this
project are more than welcome.

For more info visit www.lunartproductions.com or email to
info@lunartproductions.com

If you don’t want to receive any mails from LunArt Productions in the
future,
send an email to unsubscribe@lunartproductions.com.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] I let it go and it finally came back
Date: May 23, 2005 at 4:33:35 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have nothing but love for all of you on this list for putting up
with my morbid ramblings.  It’s amazing how quickly one can do a
complete turn around when you think that there’s nothing else to be
done.  I guess the lesson today, folks, is that simple one I can never
seem to see, much like the forest and those proverbial trees.
I let it go.  Completely.  It came back.  There is love and hope after
all.  There always was, it just hides sometimes, when it seems I need
it most.  I don’t understand exactly how it all works, but I suppose
it has something to do with the releasing of control over my own
destiny and the things that’ll either happen or won’t.  Not to sound
like a 12 stepper, but admitting I was powerless did me a world of
good today.  I don’t think I’ll ever get past that “defects of
character” thing, though.  Too many are intrinsic to my nature at this
point. It’s a matter of using my powers for good, instead of evil,
now. :]
The force remains strong in me and in us all, whether we realise it or
not, and internal infighting will get none of us anywhere, except back
to the same brick wall upon which to smash our heads, over and over
again.
Well.  Enough of me.
Love to all, and many thanks for all of evrything you all do to keep
us all going.
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Jeff Gallop <jeffgallop@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] rainy days and mondays still getting me down
Date: May 23, 2005 at 3:33:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Wow great post !
HangTuff lil Tink!
Freak Freely! and Forever…
Jeff

On 5/23/05, tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
I am having an extremely difficult time concentrating on anything for
longer than about five minutes today, and it’s beginning to drive me
more insane than usual.  The distractions that are almost always there
seem far more amplified, and the lack of faith in those around me
seems to be growing at an alarming rate, as the last two weeks merge
into one solid block of depression and anger, of hurt and fear.  I am
having a very difficult time keeping myself grounded in the moment,
and my inability to fix myself, and those I love and care about on
every level, is almost overwhelming today, and I have no idea how to
slip out of this funk.
My adviser at school challenged me to write a rhyming sonnet in iambic
pentameter about the forest and /or Walmart, and everything is coming
out contrived.  It all seems so, well, forced.  Forced jocularity,
forced work, forced best face forward.  This is not the Force I wanted
to reside within me.
I suppose I still have dreams of capturing that childish, delightful
spark that once lived within me, and  the aggravation of failure, and
the pain of loss has stifled my best attempts at resurrection.  So
far.  This month.  I have such a fire within, and I feel the heat of
inspiration moving through me, but it is not  a consistent heat, and
the ability to internalize has made me a semi lethal bomb, waiting for
detonation.  My failure as a friend, as a daughter, as a wife, as a
mother, has been weighing heavily on me as of late.  Even though I can
see in vivid technicolour the advances I’ve made, and in such a short
amount of time, it almost feels as though it’s too little, too late.
I know that the mechanisms of my mind are being deeply effected by the
detoxing off of this shit, this subutex; this, this, nicer way of
saying you’re fucked because you’re still dependent upon another
substance.  I know that I have no control over the actions of others,
and barely over my own.  I know this; I KNOW THIS, but it doesn’t seem
to penetrate this thick skull I’ve developed as of late. I can’t help
but start the would’ve-could’ve-should’ve lists. I can’t help but
think about the fact that I missed some important clue, lost some
pertinent opportunity to help, to change something, that would’ve made
a difference somewhere.  I feel like I’ve lost some battle I didn’t
even realise I was fighting.
It is a rare moment that I feel the trust necessary to allow anyone to
impact me.  It’s an even fewer and farther between event for me to
connect and want to root that some one on, and to feel like I have
become a part of something.  To have that minimalistic trust shattered
time and again makes it all the harder for me to try to crawl out of
the hole of suspicion and doubt that I dig for myself, and my fear of
losing another someone to something I know that I have absolutely no
control over becomes just that much deeper and ingrained.  I don’t
want to feel this way any more.  I don’t want to allow my actions of
the past to rule my future, and I’m sick to death of losing.
Anything.  Anyone.
It’s not that I’m a control freak, though I suspect I have definitive
tendencies, I just don’t have the heart for more disappointment.  They
say if you love something, you’re to let it go, and if it was meant to
be, it’ll come back to you in due time, in due course.  It’s the
letting go of what little hope I have left, of that dream I am
determined to have once again, that I’m having a hard time with,
perhaps.  How do you let go?  And does it ever come back?
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] rainy days and mondays still getting me down
Date: May 23, 2005 at 1:54:55 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am having an extremely difficult time concentrating on anything for
longer than about five minutes today, and it’s beginning to drive me
more insane than usual.  The distractions that are almost always there
seem far more amplified, and the lack of faith in those around me
seems to be growing at an alarming rate, as the last two weeks merge
into one solid block of depression and anger, of hurt and fear.  I am
having a very difficult time keeping myself grounded in the moment,
and my inability to fix myself, and those I love and care about on
every level, is almost overwhelming today, and I have no idea how to
slip out of this funk.
My adviser at school challenged me to write a rhyming sonnet in iambic
pentameter about the forest and /or Walmart, and everything is coming
out contrived.  It all seems so, well, forced.  Forced jocularity,
forced work, forced best face forward.  This is not the Force I wanted
to reside within me.
I suppose I still have dreams of capturing that childish, delightful
spark that once lived within me, and  the aggravation of failure, and
the pain of loss has stifled my best attempts at resurrection.  So
far.  This month.  I have such a fire within, and I feel the heat of
inspiration moving through me, but it is not  a consistent heat, and
the ability to internalize has made me a semi lethal bomb, waiting for
detonation.  My failure as a friend, as a daughter, as a wife, as a
mother, has been weighing heavily on me as of late.  Even though I can
see in vivid technicolour the advances I’ve made, and in such a short
amount of time, it almost feels as though it’s too little, too late.
I know that the mechanisms of my mind are being deeply effected by the
detoxing off of this shit, this subutex; this, this, nicer way of
saying you’re fucked because you’re still dependent upon another
substance.  I know that I have no control over the actions of others,
and barely over my own.  I know this; I KNOW THIS, but it doesn’t seem
to penetrate this thick skull I’ve developed as of late. I can’t help
but start the would’ve-could’ve-should’ve lists. I can’t help but
think about the fact that I missed some important clue, lost some
pertinent opportunity to help, to change something, that would’ve made
a difference somewhere.  I feel like I’ve lost some battle I didn’t
even realise I was fighting.
It is a rare moment that I feel the trust necessary to allow anyone to
impact me.  It’s an even fewer and farther between event for me to
connect and want to root that some one on, and to feel like I have
become a part of something.  To have that minimalistic trust shattered
time and again makes it all the harder for me to try to crawl out of
the hole of suspicion and doubt that I dig for myself, and my fear of
losing another someone to something I know that I have absolutely no
control over becomes just that much deeper and ingrained.  I don’t
want to feel this way any more.  I don’t want to allow my actions of
the past to rule my future, and I’m sick to death of losing.
Anything.  Anyone.
It’s not that I’m a control freak, though I suspect I have definitive
tendencies, I just don’t have the heart for more disappointment.  They
say if you love something, you’re to let it go, and if it was meant to
be, it’ll come back to you in due time, in due course.  It’s the
letting go of what little hope I have left, of that dream I am
determined to have once again, that I’m having a hard time with,
perhaps.  How do you let go?  And does it ever come back?
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: pnina.ruth@att.net
Subject: [Ibogaine] change e-mail address
Date: May 23, 2005 at 1:23:55 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

old e address
pnina.ruth@att.net

NEW E ADDRESS

chem.anoint@att.net

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] then you turn yourself around
Date: May 22, 2005 at 7:46:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think Dr. Mash has found something more profitable and interesting
to patent then ibogaine, without any of the stigma of drug addiction.

http://www.miami.com/mld/miamiherald/living/health/11600123.htm

Could a botanist have the answer to Alzheimer’s?

KV

On 5/22/05, HSLotsof@aol.com <HSLotsof@aol.com> wrote:

In a message dated 5/21/05 5:37:01 PM, reelectbushcheney2008@yahoo.ca writes:

that’s what it’s all about

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=patent+lotsof&btnG=Google+Search

http://www.cures-not-wars.org/scam2.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY
Date: May 22, 2005 at 6:33:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Chris
I will try to get the name of the author……and i will try to get the full article…..peace out brother

Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] sunday cheer
Date: May 22, 2005 at 3:21:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Darkness surrounds me, a cloaking of ink
Coaxing, beguiling, inviting me to sink
Within these warm pools of languid sedation
Escape emblematic, the ultimate vacation
But deep do these sinkholes of timelessness run
As I sink toward the bottom, coming undone
And fragments of self float loose through this sea
Of anger, of fear, a denial of me
A refusal to open these eyes of mine wide
To sift through the pain in which I reside
So I drift in the murk, as I float ever deeper
Silently wishing for a price that was cheaper
Than the sum of my soul, the purity of thought
And I wonder again at how easily I bought
Into lies and deceit, for escape, from my grief
And how none of it brought the slightest relief
Yet still I am sinking, still I am drowning
Not one alarm raised, not a rescue bell sounding
And I open these eyes, and see naught before me
Which could help me to surface, or bring me to glory
So I drink deeply and quickly, filling my soul
And continue the fastest slow ride down my hole

luv
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Chris Hunter” <abductmeplease@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY
Date: May 22, 2005 at 2:41:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi MAT

Thats a great article, I wonder do you have any further info on who wrote it? Its nice to read something that sits next to ones own thoughts.

Much Love

Chris

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY
Date: Sat, 21 May 2005 06:43:56 -0400

_________________________________________________________________
Want to block unwanted pop-ups? Download the free MSN Toolbar now!  http://toolbar.msn.co.uk/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY
Date: May 21, 2005 at 6:43:56 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Just Say Yes: Drugs and Human Consciousness
>
> Many point out the apparent hypocrisy of society s banning certain
drugs while allowing other potent mind-altering substances – nicotine
and alcohol, for example – to be sold in every corner store.
Comparing the statistics between the devastating effects of alcohol –
lost productivity, drunken driving, broken families, and so on –
versus the minimal social effects of marijuana, why then does society
permit one and ban the other?
>
> For the capitalist system to function, the ruling class needs a
large pool of complacent, uncomplaining workers who willingly
sacrifice their own fulfillment and family life in order to serve the
system by performing repetitive, mindless tasks. The present system
could not survive in a culture of conscious individuals whose highest
priorities were relationships, meaningful work, and personal growth.
The system persists only because so many willingly work as drones in
order to achieve a baseline level of comfort and security.
>
> Alcohol is a depressant; it dulls the mind and body. It prevents
clear thought, purposeful action, and introspective searching. In
short, it is the perfect drug to offer in unlimited quantities to
workers whose minds must be dulled from thinking too clearly and
sharply about their condition and the system in which they are
trapped. The custom of heading straight from work for the bar is the
ruling class s dream routine: for rather than protesting the inhuman
nature of the work they do, workers drown the cries from their
anguished souls in the quick poison of a shot glass. The system also
subtly encourages the use of alcohol as a symbol of rebellion among
the young and disenfranchised, for what true rebellion can grow from
a sedated, comatose populace?
>
> Mushrooms, peyote, LSD, Ecstasy, ayahuasca: now these are truly
dangerous drugs! They lift the mind above the mundane everyday world
into realms of greater wisdom and awareness; they expose the lie of
separation on which the system is built; they restore a sense of life
purpose loftier than owning a home; they foster direct experience of
the unity of all life; they encourage the user to pursue spiritual
growth and loving relationships as higher goals than economic
stability; they offer glimpses of eternal life after physical death.
>
> What threats to the system! What would happen to the economic
juggernaut paving over the earth if suddenly everyone placed family,
enlightenment, and personal growth as higher priorities than making a
living? If everyone understood the unity of all life and protested
the destruction of the natural world as the necessary price
of “progress”? If everyone dropped their tribal and national
allegiances and bonded in one global family?
>
> The system allows drugs which fracture, sedate, and suppress
consciousness. It bans drugs which enhance, stimulate, and expand
consciousness. That is the sole criterion.
>
> (by Alexander as channeled by Ramón Stevens)
> ——————————————————–

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] then you turn yourself around
Date: May 22, 2005 at 9:51:49 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/21/05 5:37:01 PM, reelectbushcheney2008@yahoo.ca writes:

that’s what it’s all about

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=patent+lotsof&btnG=Google+Search

http://www.cures-not-wars.org/scam2.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] then you turn yourself around OT
Date: May 21, 2005 at 11:05:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

this isn’t going to be easy…
Refuse to Spy? Get 2 Years
by mataliandy
Wed May 18th, 2005 at 22:14:54 PDT

[Adapted from email from the Drug Policy Alliance. Emphasis mine.
This was covered in a diary last Friday, but it looks like it disappeared
before it got any attention.]

Congressman F. James Sensenbrenner, Jr. has introduced a nasty bill with
(surprise) an Orwellian name: Defending America’s Most Vulnerable: Safe
Access to Drug Treatment and Child Protection Act of 2005 (H.R. 1528).

If you remember Operation TIPS and Total Information Awarenss, you’ll be
concerned to learn of a particularly nasty aspect of this bill:

If you “witness” certain drug offenses taking place or “learn” that they
took place you would have to report the offense to law enforcement within
24 hours and provide “full assistance” in the investigation, apprehension,
and prosecution of the people involved. Failure to do so would be a crime
punishable by a mandatory two year prison sentence.

Diaries :: mataliandy’s diary :: :: Trackback ::

This bill would have serious consequences for our democracy, requiring you
to spy on all your neighbors, including going undercover and wearing a
wire if needed. Refusing to become a spy for the government would be
punishable by a mandatory prison sentence of at least two years.

Here are some examples of offenses you would have to report to the police
within 24 hours:

* You see someone you know pass a joint to a 20-year old college student.

* Your cousin mentions that he bought Ecstasy for some of his college
friends.

* You find out that your brother, who has kids, recently bought a
small amount of marijuana to share with his wife.

* Your substance-abusing daughter recently begged her boyfriend to
find her some drugs even though they’re both in drug treatment.

In each of these cases you face jail time if you don’t call the police
within 24 hours. It doesn’t matter if the offender is your friend or
relative. It also doesn’t matter if you need 48 hours to think about it.
You have to report the person to the government within 24 hours or go to
jail.

You also have to assist the government in every way, including wearing a
wire if needed. Refusing to cooperate would cost you at least two years in
prison (possibly up to ten). In addition to turning family member against
family member, the legislation could also put many Americans into
dangerous situations by forcing them to go undercover to gain evidence
against strangers.

This is what we’re up against in Congress and, as I told you last week,
it’s not going to be easy. Sensenbrenner, the chair of the powerful
Judiciary Committee, usually gets what he wants. Lots of people are afraid
to challenge him. But we have a duty to our children to stop our country
from turning into a police state. I’m sure you feel this duty, as well.

Act!
There is more to this bill.  It is deeply, deeply flawed. Read the full
text of HR 1528 and learn more.

The bill has made it out of subcommittee and is working its way through
committee.  Don’t let it become law.

* E-mail or call your member of Congress

* Send creative ideas to DrugPolicy.org. They need ideas for getting
people to take action to defeat this bill.

* Donate. Every dollar counts.

* Send a letter-to-the-editor to your local paper urging your member
of Congress to oppose the bill.

* Get the word out to everyone you know.

That’s what it’s all about,

be well,

s

that’s what it’s all about

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=patent+lotsof&btnG=Google+Search

“You must let go of that which you fear to
lose
the most.”
-Yoda

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the
tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

______________________________________________________________________
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Re-Elect Bush/Cheney 08 Or Else <reelectbushcheney2008@yahoo.ca>
Subject: [Ibogaine] then you turn yourself around
Date: May 21, 2005 at 5:08:23 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

that’s what it’s all about

http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&q=patent+lotsof&btnG=Google+Search

“You must let go of that which you fear to
lose
the most.”
-Yoda

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the
tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

______________________________________________________________________
Post your free ad now! http://personals.yahoo.ca

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Clean Water <clean_wtr@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] TAR WARS
Date: May 21, 2005 at 5:04:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

TAR WARS

“You must let go of that which you fear to lose
the most.”
-Yoda

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT
Date: May 21, 2005 at 4:42:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://www.answers.com/mirror

Dana; could not immediately be reached for comment;

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=——————————–

————————————-=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] OT career of a talking penis.
Date: May 21, 2005 at 12:29:56 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Michigan court says talking penis on TV is indecent
Reuters UK ^ | May 12, 2005

Posted on 05/14/2005 2:07:25 AM PDT by beaversmom

DETROIT (Reuters) – A Michigan court apparently has ended the television
career of a talking penis.

A three-judge panel of the Michigan Court of Appeals declared that the
talking penis, nicknamed Dick Smart, telling “purportedly humorous” jokes on a Grand
Rapids, Michigan, public access cable television channel constituted indecent
exposure.

The court let stand a one-day jail sentence already served by the show’s
creator, Timothy Huffman.

Wednesday’s ruling contained a transcript of the three-minute segment that
aired twice in 2000, including the voice-over lines delivered in the style of
the late comedian Rodney Dangerfield: “Hi, I’m Dick Smart. I am a comedian,
yeah, stand up, ha.”

Huffman could not immediately be reached for comment but he told the Detroit
Free Press newspaper he planned to appeal in defence of his right to freedom
of speech.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] suicide to randy from ron
Date: May 21, 2005 at 12:18:25 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy:
I’ve lost more former associates thru suicide than i can count on both hands in my 55 yrs. of messin’ with this crap.  permanet solution to a temporary problem.  i’ve come so close so often.  it’s a reality.  sorry for your loss. ron
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2005 1:12 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Randy – Acceptance of ibogaine – Correction

Lee, I wasn’t talking about Patrick’s death, I think we know that there wasn’t any kind of cover up when it happened in almost real time on the list. I was talking about other supposed deaths, such as Mexico or wherever. Anywhere. My point was that I couldn’t believe that anyone would give out Ibogaine without regard to the risk. Not anyone I have met anyway. This is just my limited experience. I am loyal to my last breath. Maybe it’s a southern thing. One of the worse things that ever happened to me happened because I was taking up for a friend. Not even a very good friend. Just a friend. Another point I would like to make now is, all this talk just might be upsetting the family’s of those who passed away. I’d say some of them still read the list. I know I wouldn’t want to see that everyday. I care about people. Feelings and all. Also I have been smacked around orally before about this, maybe I’m gettin’ gun shy or something. I had fully intended to say that I’m sorry for being human and acting like an ass yesterday. So, I’m sorry for being human and acting like ass yesterday. Hell, I’m sorry for acting like an ass in the future too. I know I’ll do it again. But I do it now because I love everybody I come in contact with. I can’t help it. I did Ibogaine. I love you too, Lee. I know that your intentions are good. That doesn’t mean I have to agree with ya.             Randy

From: “Xavier Crepin” <crepin@onetel.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY-Rectification adress
Date: May 21, 2005 at 9:26:18 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Matthew,
Sorry, 1 of the website adress had an mistake. It’s not renki.com but:
www.conspiration.cc  located in Canada (French part=Quebec, so it’s in French, but a lot of videos are in English)
Any problem, contact me!
Xavier
—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 11:43 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY

Just Say Yes: Drugs and Human Consciousness
>
> Many point out the apparent hypocrisy of society s banning certain
drugs while allowing other potent mind-altering substances – nicotine
and alcohol, for example – to be sold in every corner store.
Comparing the statistics between the devastating effects of alcohol –
lost productivity, drunken driving, broken families, and so on –
versus the minimal social effects of marijuana, why then does society
permit one and ban the other?
>
> For the capitalist system to function, the ruling class needs a
large pool of complacent, uncomplaining workers who willingly
sacrifice their own fulfillment and family life in order to serve the
system by performing repetitive, mindless tasks. The present system
could not survive in a culture of conscious individuals whose highest
priorities were relationships, meaningful work, and personal growth.
The system persists only because so many willingly work as drones in
order to achieve a baseline level of comfort and security.
>
> Alcohol is a depressant; it dulls the mind and body. It prevents
clear thought, purposeful action, and introspective searching. In
short, it is the perfect drug to offer in unlimited quantities to
workers whose minds must be dulled from thinking too clearly and
sharply about their condition and the system in which they are
trapped. The custom of heading straight from work for the bar is the
ruling class s dream routine: for rather than protesting the inhuman
nature of the work they do, workers drown the cries from their
anguished souls in the quick poison of a shot glass. The system also
subtly encourages the use of alcohol as a symbol of rebellion among
the young and disenfranchised, for what true rebellion can grow from
a sedated, comatose populace?
>
> Mushrooms, peyote, LSD, Ecstasy, ayahuasca: now these are truly
dangerous drugs! They lift the mind above the mundane everyday world
into realms of greater wisdom and awareness; they expose the lie of
separation on which the system is built; they restore a sense of life
purpose loftier than owning a home; they foster direct experience of
the unity of all life; they encourage the user to pursue spiritual
growth and loving relationships as higher goals than economic
stability; they offer glimpses of eternal life after physical death.
>
> What threats to the system! What would happen to the economic
juggernaut paving over the earth if suddenly everyone placed family,
enlightenment, and personal growth as higher priorities than making a
living? If everyone understood the unity of all life and protested
the destruction of the natural world as the necessary price
of “progress”? If everyone dropped their tribal and national
allegiances and bonded in one global family?
>
> The system allows drugs which fracture, sedate, and suppress
consciousness. It bans drugs which enhance, stimulate, and expand
consciousness. That is the sole criterion.
>
> (by Alexander as channeled by Ramón Stevens)
> ——————————————————–

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Xavier Crepin” <crepin@onetel.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY- Comments
Date: May 21, 2005 at 9:04:16 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well done Matthew, and good analysis of the drugs social aspect already noticed by authors like Aldous Huxley, Thimoty Leary, to name just a few. I give you 2 websites adresses which could interest you in others fields = Mind expansion for ex. Here they are:
www.wingmakers.com
www.nenki.com
Have a nice day, the door is just opening.
Xavier
Digital artist & music composer
www.xaviercrepin.co.uk

—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 11:43 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY

Just Say Yes: Drugs and Human Consciousness
>
> Many point out the apparent hypocrisy of society s banning certain
drugs while allowing other potent mind-altering substances – nicotine
and alcohol, for example – to be sold in every corner store.
Comparing the statistics between the devastating effects of alcohol –
lost productivity, drunken driving, broken families, and so on –
versus the minimal social effects of marijuana, why then does society
permit one and ban the other?
>
> For the capitalist system to function, the ruling class needs a
large pool of complacent, uncomplaining workers who willingly
sacrifice their own fulfillment and family life in order to serve the
system by performing repetitive, mindless tasks. The present system
could not survive in a culture of conscious individuals whose highest
priorities were relationships, meaningful work, and personal growth.
The system persists only because so many willingly work as drones in
order to achieve a baseline level of comfort and security.
>
> Alcohol is a depressant; it dulls the mind and body. It prevents
clear thought, purposeful action, and introspective searching. In
short, it is the perfect drug to offer in unlimited quantities to
workers whose minds must be dulled from thinking too clearly and
sharply about their condition and the system in which they are
trapped. The custom of heading straight from work for the bar is the
ruling class s dream routine: for rather than protesting the inhuman
nature of the work they do, workers drown the cries from their
anguished souls in the quick poison of a shot glass. The system also
subtly encourages the use of alcohol as a symbol of rebellion among
the young and disenfranchised, for what true rebellion can grow from
a sedated, comatose populace?
>
> Mushrooms, peyote, LSD, Ecstasy, ayahuasca: now these are truly
dangerous drugs! They lift the mind above the mundane everyday world
into realms of greater wisdom and awareness; they expose the lie of
separation on which the system is built; they restore a sense of life
purpose loftier than owning a home; they foster direct experience of
the unity of all life; they encourage the user to pursue spiritual
growth and loving relationships as higher goals than economic
stability; they offer glimpses of eternal life after physical death.
>
> What threats to the system! What would happen to the economic
juggernaut paving over the earth if suddenly everyone placed family,
enlightenment, and personal growth as higher priorities than making a
living? If everyone understood the unity of all life and protested
the destruction of the natural world as the necessary price
of “progress”? If everyone dropped their tribal and national
allegiances and bonded in one global family?
>
> The system allows drugs which fracture, sedate, and suppress
consciousness. It bans drugs which enhance, stimulate, and expand
consciousness. That is the sole criterion.
>
> (by Alexander as channeled by Ramón Stevens)
> ——————————————————–

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “ekki” <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] kudzu cuts binge drinking?
Date: May 21, 2005 at 7:43:20 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hallo randy, i have capsules with 300mg extrakt of kudzu beans. it says 3*2
a day but i take 3 in the morning for a few days and then 2 whenever i feel
like having a cigarette. i ordered 300 capsules a year ago for 20euro
through ebay and still have some.

kudzu is rather soft and it takes more to stop smoking. personally i like
sports and especially sauna and most important is that i know i feel better
without, so it´s not a loss or a fight against myself. what also helps
-except a big dose of ibogaine- is to ingest the tip of a knife of iboHCl in
the morning for a few days. but that may be a problem in the states.
good luck ekki

— Ursprüngliche Nachricht —
Von: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
An: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Betreff: Re: [Ibogaine] kudzu cuts binge drinking?
Datum: Sat, 21 May 2005 06:29:30 EDT

Ekki, how much kudzu do you take, and how often, for trying to help a
person
stop smoking?      Randy


5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX – die erste Adresse für Mail, Message, More +++

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble
Date: May 21, 2005 at 6:57:39 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,

Thanks for that. Most interesting. You certainly have an eye for detail. I think I speed read a bit too much sometimes.

The general statement itself:

>Before
>giving large amounts of eboga to initiates Metsogo test them out
>with small amounts first “to see if they can support the drug or if
>they have evil spirits which will use the drug as an excuse to kill
>their host.”

regardless of whether or not it was a practise among the Mitsogo, does indicate that this was an issue that someone thought about – whoever. For me that is the most interesting part of the statement. Apart from anything it has such a good feel to it in terms of level headed treatment. Its sounds like very wise advice.

I had forgotten your charts that you posted some months back. Very useful. One of the problems of course is the variability of ibogaine levels within an extract which is not a major problem under observation. That said the extract is a lot smoother experience for initial use. (Now I find HCL very smooth but not in the beginning. I also prefer it for various reasons I discussed before for psycho-spiritual use). Perhaps for addiction treatment a whole alkaloid compound would be less traumatic on the body for initial exposure to eboga thus improving safety. Also as your graphs suggest the action of the extract appears to be more spread out. The fact is the HCL for someone who has never taken it before is like a bull in a china shop and thats hard on the body.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/20/05 2:07:09 PM, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:

>Howard,

>Are you saying (in case i am not getting the point properly) that the early
>work of Fernandez dose not have sufficient evidence to reflect the position
>as it was then?

Hi Lee,

I am not saying that “Fernandez dose not have sufficient evidence to reflect
the position as it was then” in his writing. What I am saying is that a
specific statement concerning the Fang is not responded to by a general statement
attributed to the Mitsogo. Fernandez reports this general statement without
citation specificity in his text from chapter 18 of Bwiti: An Ethnography of
the Religious Imagination in Africa. You will notice in the text that follows
below from that chapter that Fernandez after offering the statement attributed
to the Mitsogo provides a counterpoint concerning the watchfulness of the
mother and father of eboga among the Fang Bwiti. What I did not say about
Fernandez is that I consider him a great ethnographer and his book is just fantastic
and amazing in its academic standards.

>On another point I have heard through conversation that Dr Mash use to
>dislike step dosing as the build up of nor-ibogaine levels was not considered
>safe. Which leaves me to ask does step dosing require overall higher doses?
>If not what is behind this report in terms of the danger of nor ibogaine
>levels?

Dr. Mash dislikes a lot of things and if she had any data on step dosing she
ought to publish it. I will defer to a statement provided by former NIDA
director Alan Leshner. I don’t know if it is original to Leshner. I doubt it. I
think I have heard Mash quote it and I certainly have quoted it: “In god we
trust. All others present data.” And additionally, I would say, that the
Bwiti ngangas (Fang and Mitsogo) appear have little interest in noribogaine as
they all step dose in a linear fashion: one spoon after the next. Just teasing
a bit. Step dosing is also quite common among ibogaine providers outside of
Africa as well.

IBOGAINE: FORMS AND DOSE REGIMENS
http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/ibogaine_forms_dose_regimen.ppt

Thanks for some interesting discussion.

Howard

>If you have any insight I would be very interested to know.

>As far as medical doctors go you make a valid point.

>Lee

>HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
>
>Hi Lee,
>I don’t question the value of dose escalation. I would however be
>appreciative of accurate reports rather than broad ranging claims as to
>either the Fang or Mitsogo. What we need is a new generation of ethnologists
to walk in
>the footsteps of Fernandez, Gollnhofer, Barabe, etc. and let us know what are
>the skills and practices of various ngangas in different chapels and sects.
>And I realize I am asking a lot. Who rates the skills of medical doctors in
the
>cities in which we live?

>Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] DRUGS AND SOCIETY
Date: May 21, 2005 at 6:43:56 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Just Say Yes: Drugs and Human Consciousness
>
> Many point out the apparent hypocrisy of society s banning certain
drugs while allowing other potent mind-altering substances – nicotine
and alcohol, for example – to be sold in every corner store.
Comparing the statistics between the devastating effects of alcohol –
lost productivity, drunken driving, broken families, and so on –
versus the minimal social effects of marijuana, why then does society
permit one and ban the other?
>
> For the capitalist system to function, the ruling class needs a
large pool of complacent, uncomplaining workers who willingly
sacrifice their own fulfillment and family life in order to serve the
system by performing repetitive, mindless tasks. The present system
could not survive in a culture of conscious individuals whose highest
priorities were relationships, meaningful work, and personal growth.
The system persists only because so many willingly work as drones in
order to achieve a baseline level of comfort and security.
>
> Alcohol is a depressant; it dulls the mind and body. It prevents
clear thought, purposeful action, and introspective searching. In
short, it is the perfect drug to offer in unlimited quantities to
workers whose minds must be dulled from thinking too clearly and
sharply about their condition and the system in which they are
trapped. The custom of heading straight from work for the bar is the
ruling class s dream routine: for rather than protesting the inhuman
nature of the work they do, workers drown the cries from their
anguished souls in the quick poison of a shot glass. The system also
subtly encourages the use of alcohol as a symbol of rebellion among
the young and disenfranchised, for what true rebellion can grow from
a sedated, comatose populace?
>
> Mushrooms, peyote, LSD, Ecstasy, ayahuasca: now these are truly
dangerous drugs! They lift the mind above the mundane everyday world
into realms of greater wisdom and awareness; they expose the lie of
separation on which the system is built; they restore a sense of life
purpose loftier than owning a home; they foster direct experience of
the unity of all life; they encourage the user to pursue spiritual
growth and loving relationships as higher goals than economic
stability; they offer glimpses of eternal life after physical death.
>
> What threats to the system! What would happen to the economic
juggernaut paving over the earth if suddenly everyone placed family,
enlightenment, and personal growth as higher priorities than making a
living? If everyone understood the unity of all life and protested
the destruction of the natural world as the necessary price
of “progress”? If everyone dropped their tribal and national
allegiances and bonded in one global family?
>
> The system allows drugs which fracture, sedate, and suppress
consciousness. It bans drugs which enhance, stimulate, and expand
consciousness. That is the sole criterion.
>
> (by Alexander as channeled by Ramón Stevens)
> ——————————————————–

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] kudzu cuts binge drinking?
Date: May 21, 2005 at 6:29:30 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ekki, how much kudzu do you take, and how often, for trying to help a person stop smoking?      Randy

From: “ekki” <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] kudzu cuts binge drinking?
Date: May 21, 2005 at 3:31:34 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

kudzu also works against hangovers but it´s best for stopping cigarettes, in
my experience. recently i picked up smoking again and stopped once again a
few days ago. i just swallowed a few kudzu´s this morning. -ekki


5 GB Mailbox, 50 FreeSMS http://www.gmx.net/de/go/promail
+++ GMX – die erste Adresse für Mail, Message, More +++

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble
Date: May 21, 2005 at 1:02:24 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard is right. I was step dosed for Methadone. My provider would step over to me and shove ’em down my throat. I couldn’t help it. Seriously I was step dosed. I’m not exactly sure how many doses I took. I think it was 4 for about, shit I don’t know how long it was. More than 24 hours, than I took a 16 mg kg flood dose. I want 20 mg when I do it for cigarettes, hopefully some time this summer.       Randy

From: “Carlton B” <carltonb@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble
Date: May 20, 2005 at 8:33:21 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Slightly off-topic… I see that there is no detailed information about
Bwiti, Fang, or Mitsogo on Wikipedia… if there is anyone who can share
detailed knowledge on these subjects, you would be doing a service to add
the information to Wikipedia:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bwiti

—–Original Message—–
From: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 9:11 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble

In a message dated 5/20/05 2:07:09 PM, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:

Howard,

Are you saying (in case i am not getting the point properly)
that the early
work of Fernandez dose not have sufficient evidence to reflect
the position
as it was then?

Hi Lee,

I am not saying that “Fernandez dose not have sufficient evidence
to reflect
the position as it was then” in his writing.  What I am saying  is that a
specific statement concerning the Fang is not responded to by a
general statement
attributed to the Mitsogo.  Fernandez reports this general
statement without
citation specificity in his text from chapter 18 of Bwiti: An
Ethnography of
the Religious Imagination in Africa.  You will notice in the text
that follows
below from that chapter that Fernandez after offering the
statement attributed
to the Mitsogo provides a counterpoint concerning the watchfulness of the
mother and father of eboga among the Fang Bwiti.  What I did not
say about
Fernandez is that I consider him a great ethnographer and his
book is just fantastic
and amazing in its academic standards.

On another point I have heard through conversation that Dr Mash use to
dislike step dosing as the build up of nor-ibogaine levels was
not considered
safe. Which leaves me to ask does step dosing require overall
higher doses?
If not what is behind this report in terms of the danger of nor ibogaine
levels?

Dr. Mash dislikes a lot of things and if she had any data on step
dosing she
ought to publish it.  I will defer to a statement provided by former NIDA
director Alan Leshner.  I don’t know if it is original to
Leshner.  I doubt it. I
think I have heard Mash quote it and I certainly have quoted it:
“In god we
trust.  All others present data.”  And additionally, I would say,
that the
Bwiti ngangas (Fang and Mitsogo) appear have little interest in
noribogaine as
they all step dose in a linear fashion:  one spoon after the
next.  Just teasing
a bit.  Step dosing is also quite common among ibogaine providers
outside of
Africa as well.

IBOGAINE: FORMS AND DOSE REGIMENS
http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/ibogaine_forms_dose_regimen.ppt

Thanks for some interesting discussion.

Howard

If you have any insight I would be very interested to know.

As far as medical doctors go you make a valid point.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

Hi Lee,
I don’t question the value of dose escalation. I would however be
appreciative of accurate reports rather than broad ranging claims as to
either the Fang or Mitsogo. What we need is a new generation of
ethnologists
to walk in
the footsteps of Fernandez, Gollnhofer, Barabe, etc. and let us
know what are
the skills and practices of various ngangas in different chapels
and sects.
And I realize I am asking a lot. Who rates the skills of medical
doctors in
the
cities in which we live?

Howard

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[
/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Rick Strcat” <rickstrcat@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Low dosage self treatment
Date: May 20, 2005 at 8:24:04 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve been having trouble finding answers to some questions I would
have thought would be in a FAQ somewhere, so I’ll try them here.
Any responses would be really welcome.

Suppose someone wanted to try to self-treat with ibogaine for
addiction interruption:  is there a dosage that’s safe enough
take by oneself, but strong enough to still have some benefit?
If so, how would you calculate the dosage?  This would be for a
low-level addiction (opiates, alcohol, cocaine) – no really serious
withdrawals but lots of craving.

Has anyone actually tried doing a low-dosage regime over several days
for addiction interruption?  I’d really like to hear from anyone with
experience with this, especially with self-treatment.

Thanks.

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble
Date: May 20, 2005 at 8:10:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/20/05 2:07:09 PM, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:

Howard,

Are you saying (in case i am not getting the point properly) that the early
work of Fernandez dose not have sufficient evidence to reflect the position
as it was then?

Hi Lee,

I am not saying that “Fernandez dose not have sufficient evidence to reflect
the position as it was then” in his writing.  What I am saying  is that a
specific statement concerning the Fang is not responded to by a general statement
attributed to the Mitsogo.  Fernandez reports this general statement without
citation specificity in his text from chapter 18 of Bwiti: An Ethnography of
the Religious Imagination in Africa.  You will notice in the text that follows
below from that chapter that Fernandez after offering the statement attributed
to the Mitsogo provides a counterpoint concerning the watchfulness of the
mother and father of eboga among the Fang Bwiti.  What I did not say about
Fernandez is that I consider him a great ethnographer and his book is just fantastic
and amazing in its academic standards.

On another point I have heard through conversation that Dr Mash use to
dislike step dosing as the build up of nor-ibogaine levels was not considered
safe. Which leaves me to ask does step dosing require overall higher doses?
If not what is behind this report in terms of the danger of nor ibogaine
levels?

Dr. Mash dislikes a lot of things and if she had any data on step dosing she
ought to publish it.  I will defer to a statement provided by former NIDA
director Alan Leshner.  I don’t know if it is original to Leshner.  I doubt it. I
think I have heard Mash quote it and I certainly have quoted it:  “In god we
trust.  All others present data.”  And additionally, I would say, that the
Bwiti ngangas (Fang and Mitsogo) appear have little interest in noribogaine as
they all step dose in a linear fashion:  one spoon after the next.  Just teasing
a bit.  Step dosing is also quite common among ibogaine providers outside of
Africa as well.

IBOGAINE: FORMS AND DOSE REGIMENS
http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/ibogaine_forms_dose_regimen.ppt

Thanks for some interesting discussion.

Howard

If you have any insight I would be very interested to know.

As far as medical doctors go you make a valid point.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

Hi Lee,
I don’t question the value of dose escalation. I would however be
appreciative of accurate reports rather than broad ranging claims as to
either the Fang or Mitsogo. What we need is a new generation of ethnologists
to walk in
the footsteps of Fernandez, Gollnhofer, Barabe, etc. and let us know what are
the skills and practices of various ngangas in different chapels and sects.
And I realize I am asking a lot. Who rates the skills of medical doctors in
the
cities in which we live?

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: You are strong.
Date: May 20, 2005 at 7:20:12 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Randy,

Thats all the love I keep sending you my brother. Don’t you remember the agreement we all made in heaven,
…your friend does, and he’s waiting for you,..they all are…….

with love, Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, May 21, 2005 2:04 AM
Subject: Spam Alert: Re: [Ibogaine] J

Jasen, like it or not, you get right in my head sometimes. Quit it. No don’t. Yea do. No don’t. Thanx                 Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT You don’t have to read this
Date: May 20, 2005 at 6:50:56 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rach, thanx for the hug through hyperspace. I could feel it. I’ve kinda calmed down a little now. Your mention of a meeting made me smile. I don’t know why but it made me think of a time I was in detox. I’m sittin’ there in pajama’s and this very proper looking old lady walks in the TV room. I’m thinkin’ great, somebody’s grandmother snuck in here. Well, she primly smoothed out her skirt, looked me dead in the eye and said, ” AINT THIS A BITCH? YOU DON’T HAVE TO DO THIS ANYMORE,” so loud that it brought the crack dude out of his benzo stupor the nurses so kindly put him in. I’ll never forget that. She had one of the best AA leads I ever heard. I was mesmerized. But I’m in here for Oxy’s and Heroin I told her. “Honey, it’s all the same,” she told me. Hold on I got a message from somebody. It’s Jeff, good timing. You guys are great. This is starting to look like a set up. LOL  I’m going for my infusion now so you take care out in Cali, and be careful wherever you are. Love and one hits.             Randy

From: Eye of the Bhogi <freedomroot@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT You don’t have to read this
Date: May 20, 2005 at 4:53:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear Randy,

Thanks for mentioning the beating up of hippies in your drugstore
cowboy post.  It reminded me to do some work, sitting out here in
sunny Cal-i-for-nia.

Visiting my sister and niece, and even the joy of an 18-month old
toddler blowing me kisses and smiling so freakin’ cute its insane
doesn’t seem to crack open my heart at the moment.  Trying to stay
light, but I don’t seem to breathe too well without hubby in my orbit.
It’s weird that way… codependence or whatever.  I think I need a
meeting.  Or a book party.  Or a green-crossed Medical Marijuana
infusion.

This story on ebay poppy commerce caught my eye last week, and thought
it might ring some other bells:
http://www.gtweekly.com/cover/story.2005-05-11.2926465392

2005 is a good year to be alive.  I’m glad you’ve survived this far.
We got your back, buddy.  We got your back… love, rachel

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] sex and drugs question(s)
Date: May 20, 2005 at 2:28:51 PM EDT
To: “Newsroom-L” <newsroom-l@lists.netspace.org>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

To everyone (please excuse the cross post):

What drugs did/do you take to enjoy sex, and which drugs do you/did you take that hampered your enjoyment of sex? Is there any drug or drugs that you always enjoyed taking during sex or to have sex while under the influence of? I have to write an article about Sex and Drugs and want to read some other opinions, stories, anecdotes, etc. on the topic from other people. Please be aware I may use quotes from any material posted on the topic, so please make note if you prefer not to have your name used, or how you’d prefer I label you if and when I use any quotes.
I’m still not even sure what I’m writing on this topic, but do know I need more personal viewpoints than just my own please, and don’t want to rely on simply reading off the internet and books- I want it to have a bit of umph to it, and that will be by having others’ viewpoints and experiences included. I already got some hilarious quotes from a director friend of mine out in California, but I could use a few more interesting takes on the topic please.
Thanks to any who would care to share, on or off list. Thanks.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT You don’t have to read this
Date: May 20, 2005 at 2:23:02 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

STOP THIS RIGHT NOW RANDY.
You’re making my keyboard all slobbery and slimey from the drool rolling from outta my slightly gaping mouthhole, you freak you.
Seriously, very sorry to hear about your friend, it’s a bummer when we lose people unexpectedly, particularly by their own hand out of the blue.
It’s ok to reminisce obvious, I do it all the time, but damn, do you have to make it sound so…errr…exciting? Appealing? Tempting?

I can’t believe the dope he got. Everything. Morphine, Dilaudid, Pantapon’s. liquid Demerol, clinical Coke, everything. So many hits of speed that I think people are still awake over that shit. SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, we proceed to evolve into country boy speedballs. 2 number 4 Dilaudids, about an eighth of a gram of clinical coke, and all the liquid Demerol you can get in the fit and leave room to pull up a little air and shake it. My ears are still ringing<

Egad. I gave up some drugs?
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 8:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT You don’t have to read this

It’s 1975. I’m 18 years old. The motor in my 67 Mustang is trying it’s best to be civil as I sit at the light. Fuck it, I rev it a little. Those 351 heads really make it breath a lot better. Sounds killer. I still can’t understand why Ricky shot himself. DAMNNNNNNNNNN, and lived through it. 12 gauge right to the head. I’m goin’ to the party anyway. I aint got no dope, but I know before the night is out I’ll have some, (I’m thinking). Boy was I right. The acceleration and sound that comes from the 289 motor I built hits me like a shot of coke when I kick it down Broadway. Party time. Drink, and get that bad shit outta your head. OK, I can do that. Somehow the booze just doesn’t cut it this time. When I get to the party I’m not in a good mood. Why is everybody blaming Mike for something that Ricky did at home by himself? Mike was just jokin’ when he said it was better to put the gun your mouth when you try and kill yourself. That LSD we were doing at the time thought that suicide was funny. That LSD thought everything was funny though. I get to the party just in time to see two football jocks about to kick Mike in his hippy ass. I’m drunk enough to not give a fuck, and I get outta my car with a pair of nunchucks in my hand and dare these red neck mother fuckers to come my way. At this point I wish someone would hit me. They don’t. Pussy’s When Mike gets in the car he says “we need some tequila”. I agree, we need lots of tequila. As were going to the liquor store he starts telling me about this drug store he has been looking at. It’s a cherry man, never been hit. 4 doctors offices and a pharmacy. We’ll hit ’em all. What the fuck, I’m up for anything at this point. What else do I do with all this adrenaline? “Let’s do it” I say and then interject, “we gotta go get Mark. he’s been waitin’ all night for me to come over”.”OK, go get him, he can help”. At this point I’m thinkin”, (help?) what kinda shit you got me into anyway, but I don’t say anything. We got Mark (he’s dead now too) and we’re heading up the interstate towards the point of no return, I’m wishin’ the cops would try and chase me, they don’t. Pussy’s again. I wish somebody would grow a dick or something. We get to bum fucked KY, and I try like hell not to make any noise as we roll through the town. The 4 speed I put in the car comes in handy as we come to the hill that leads up to the complex with the Dr’s offices in it. Down shit to second and creep. Man it’s quiet. My car sounds like a rocket trying to get outta the atmosphere without somebody noticing. We circle and park. “Well, whatcha gonna do bro?” “SIT, and don’t leave unless you hear the cops coming” he say’s. OK……………..that was the longest 5 minutes I ever experienced. He comes back and say’s “I want you to come and watch, if the cops come just whistle”. I’m 20 feet up a tree when I see the lights coming, I’m trying like hell to whistle. I just can’t make myself make that noise, so I scream like the intro to Sympathy for the Devil, (I still laugh about that) and hope for the best. I hit the ground runnin’ and dive in the car as quick as I can get there. Pussy again. Half an hour later Mike arrives all cool with a garbage bag in his hand and a look on his face like he just fucked the queen or something. “GO”, he say’s very quietly and as I’m hitting third down the road. I can’t believe the dope he got. Everything. Morphine, Dilaudid, Pantapon’s. liquid Demerol, clinical Coke, everything. So many hits of speed that I think people are still awake over that shit. SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, we proceed to evolve into country boy speedballs. 2 number 4 Dilaudids, about an eighth of a gram of clinical coke, and all the liquid Demerol you can get in the fit and leave room to pull up a little air and shake it. My ears are still ringing…………………………………….I’m still runnin’ from pain. I just can’t go fast enough. Anybody got a super charger for a 5.0 motor?         Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble
Date: May 20, 2005 at 1:58:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,

Are you saying (in case i am not getting the point properly) that the early work of Fernandez dose not have sufficient evidence to reflect the position as it was then?

On another point I have heard through conversation that Dr Mash use to dislike step dosing as the build up of nor-ibogaine levels was not considered safe. Which leaves me to ask does step dosing require overall higher doses? If not what is behind this report in terms of the danger of nor ibogaine levels?

If you have any insight I would be very interested to know.

As far as medical doctors go you make a valid point.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
Hi Lee,

I don’t question the value of dose escalation. I would however be
appreciative of accurate reports rather than broad ranging claims as to either the Fang
or Mitsogo. What we need is a new generation of ethnologists to walk in the
footsteps of Fernandez, Gollnhofer, Barabe, etc. and let us know what are the
skills and practices of various ngangas in different chapels and sects. And I
realize I am asking a lot. Who rates the skills of medical doctors in the
cities in which we live?

Howard

In a message dated 5/19/05 10:51:32 AM, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:

<< Howard,

You are probably right that matters today are somewhat different but I do
find it interesting that there may be a historical precedent set by the older of
the two groups (the Mitsoga) towards the idea of starting on low doses. Their
reasons for this may be 2 fold: spiritual information advising this and
secondly practical experience. However, I have no direct evidence to support this
other than what I am experiencing for myself.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

Well, usually you can’t get better than Fernandez in his observations.

However, there are a number of issues in the citation below as they are not

observations but, general statements attributed to the Mitsogo, an indigenous
people

concerning the Fang, another indigenous people, who represent a competing
sect

of Bwiti. From reports of persons on this list who have gone to Africa for

Bwiti initiations, there are reports of intense competition between the
chapels

for initiates. While Fernandez disagreed with my perception that the Mitsogo

and Fang may represent orthodox and reformed sects respectively, I think that

lends some understanding to the attitude that may be reflected by each

sect/people towards the other. The quotation below concerning the casual use
of

eboga by the Fang, may relate to the fact that they allow the initiation of

women, though all of my knowledge is with significant distance to
observations and

time. I also think it must be understood that Fernandez’s observations were

from the 1970s and things do change in twenty-five or thirty years. I think

these questions concerning African practice might be better answered by some
of

the persons on the list with extensive African experience and hope that they

may add to this discussion.

Howard

In a message dated 5/18/05 5:15:46 PM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

<< >Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the

>difference between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.

“Eboga was the psychotropic drug of choice in Metsogo Bwiti whereas

in the Fang ancestral cult, Bieri, two different drugs were

employed: malan (Alchornea floribunda) and ayang beyem

(Elaeophorbia drupifera).(#2) We have seen how Bwiti origin legends

credit the discovery of eboga either to the Pygmies (they may

actually be the source of the drug for all equatorial peoples), or

to the intervention of the ancestors, or the great gods. In point

of fact the extensive use of eboga in Fang Bwiti diffused to them

from the Metsogo.

“The Metsogo claim to be surprised by the casual use of eboga by

Fang and are not surprised to hear that death results. Before

giving large amounts of eboga to initiates Metsogo test them out

with small amounts first “to see if they can support the drug or if

they have evil spirits which will use the drug as an excuse to kill

their host.” Metsogo also claim to watch over the initiate much

more closely in the process of initiation. But in Fang Bwiti, the

mother and father of eboga (roles, it appears, taken over from

Metsogo) provide very close supervision.(#3) ”

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/fernandez.html >>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] It’s been a rough day
Date: May 20, 2005 at 12:49:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I love you, BiscuitBoy!!! I hope t hear from you later, but wanted to
send you some love…
tink

On 5/20/05, Clean Water <clean_wtr@yahoo.com> wrote:
hi Randy,
sorry to hear about your friends.
cheers,
-j
— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Well, here you go. I’ve had a real tough day. In the
midst of me being in the
discussion here a friend of mine killed himself. I
got the news today about 5
PM. I don’t know what to say other than I feel
responsible somehow. I know it
seems like it is too much of a coincidence because
of what has been said, but
another friend of mine has died. Another one. I
can’t take this shit too much
longer. See, I told you that I wasn’t gonna wait to
hear about another friend
going to the grave. But what choice do I have? I’m
tryin’,  I swear to God.
He took a gun, and he blew his brains out. Gotta
respect that. No, you don’t. I
can’t believe this. He was addicted. Oxy’s and
Vicodin. Booze, weed, speed,
whatever, he was addicted. Mostly opiates. Always
opiates. His wife left him
about 6 months ago. I’m so sick, I thought about
stealing her from him, but I
didn’t. (I hope he gets the joke, I think he will) I
don’t know how to deal with
this one. It came from such an unexpected place.
Right when I think I can
relax, I hear about something like this. I think
that maybe I should take a long
look at what I’m trying to get done, and see if I
really can take all the pain
that comes with it. Here I am feeling all this pain,
can you imagine what his
family is feeling right now? I’m going to Erie, PA.
I didn’t know why I felt
the urgency to go until now. I guess he felt like he
had no other choice.
Raise your hand if you think he had one that he
didn’t know about.        Randy

Discover Yahoo!
Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS
Date: May 20, 2005 at 12:45:22 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you guys still rock!!

On 5/19/05, Jasen Chamoun <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
Hey Tink,

The force is most definatley still with you.

love, Jasen
—– Original Message —–
From: “tink” <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 5:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS

the movie was pretty good to :]
tired, cranky, and electric
but here’s hoping the force is still with me
love tink

On 5/19/05, Kirsty Sutherland <captkirk@kol.co.nz> wrote:
Yehhh, good words girl, good words, Ka Pai.
Kia ora
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 19 May 2005 6:52 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS

“You must let go of that which you fear to lose the most.”
-Yoda
Revenge of the Syth
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] J
Date: May 20, 2005 at 12:04:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen, like it or not, you get right in my head sometimes. Quit it. No don’t. Yea do. No don’t. Thanx                 Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Randy
Date: May 20, 2005 at 11:54:16 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Shell, what the fuck is sober? Is that some place in India? How did you know I been drinkin’? I’m kidding, but I’m not. How many people do I have to see die? Violently. I’m afraid to try and count the people that have died because of drugs, just the ones that I know. It’s hard to believe that I’m the one that is left. Maybe there is a reason for this. Please help me figure out what it is.                Randy

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Randy
Date: May 20, 2005 at 11:33:52 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Randy, sorry to hear about your losses, makes me aware how fortunate we are to have to have the opportunity it use ibogaine & have a list , also how tender we are as humans, lets stay sober!,love shell

darkmattersfo@comcast.net wrote:
I used Kudzu to reduce drinking cravings years ago and it seemed to help. Weed helped better though, I would smoke a little, get sleepy, and fall asleep. Beer just didn’t the right elemetns to make them munchi quality food,

> http://www.truthout.org/issues_05/051905HB.shtml
>
> Binge Drinking Urge Suppressed by Taking the Herb Kudzu
> Medical News Today
> Tuesday 18 May 2005
> Researchers have found that the herb, kudzu, reduces one’s desire and
> urge to binge drink. Two groups of young adult drinkers, all volunteers,
> were observed while they watched TV for an hour-and-a-half. They had an
> unlimited supply of beer.
> One group had taken pills made from the herb kudzu, while the other took
> a placebo. The ‘kudzu’ group seemed to lose the desire to binge on booze.
> The placebo group drank three-and-a-half beers, on average, during the
> 90 minute session. The kudzu group drank just 1.8 beers.
> The volunteers were all in their early twenties. Researchers said it was
> quite easy to gather the volunteers.
> snip-
>
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston Peet
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
>
>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] ot – putting baseball cards on wings
Date: May 20, 2005 at 11:26:51 AM EDT
To: MorningWood@googlegroups.com, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oftentimes in the  omitted,

Random harp
is
body of 72,
with
spirit
pool
wind
mill
flow

enhance
72 petri dishes
with
growing

(musicians and instruments of the future)

no one  sound
natural
Milk & Honey
Monk

unusual Wind
shapes
comes from
harmonic
which generate atmospheres  >

memories spinning layers
and

mutating

gee

key
,

and several thousand frogs

connect poo.
one organized
poo tour:
connect
poo tour:

____________

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: darkmattersfo@comcast.net
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] kudzu cuts binge drinking?
Date: May 20, 2005 at 11:20:13 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I used Kudzu to reduce drinking cravings years ago and it seemed to help. Weed helped better though, I would smoke a little, get sleepy, and fall asleep. Beer just didn’t the right elemetns to make them munchi quality food,

http://www.truthout.org/issues_05/051905HB.shtml

Binge Drinking Urge Suppressed by Taking the Herb Kudzu
Medical News Today
Tuesday 18 May 2005
Researchers have found that the herb, kudzu, reduces one’s desire and
urge to binge drink. Two groups of young adult drinkers, all volunteers,
were observed while they watched TV for an hour-and-a-half. They had an
unlimited supply of beer.
One group had taken pills made from the herb kudzu, while the other took
a placebo. The ‘kudzu’ group seemed to lose the desire to binge on booze.
The placebo group drank three-and-a-half beers, on average, during the
90 minute session. The kudzu group drank just 1.8 beers.
The volunteers were all in their early twenties. Researchers said it was
quite easy to gather the volunteers.
snip-

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Fw: Drug-Watch: The Legislation of Morality
Date: May 20, 2005 at 9:00:52 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In Kings X, London, a man called Tony, of Tony’s Hemp Corner fame, swears by drinking his ibo-urine. Least he did about 3 years ago when I last saw him. I think he reckons it extends the trip by days.

Nick
—–Original Message—–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com]
Sent: 12 May 2005 20:40
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: Drug-Watch: The Legislation of Morality

Preston, you have made me come up with an idea I have been bouncing around in my head. Now, I say this in jest but there could be something to it. As far as I know urine is the only source of noribogaine that there is. Maybe Ms. Mash knows something we don’t, but until she releases her findings, I think that I’m right. Get where I’m going with this yet? We take the pee from our Ibogaine treatments and dehydrate it and put it in capsules. I know when I did my treatment last year my provider said that some people were drinking the pee. I looked him in the eye and asked him, “Do they ever get rid of that taste in their mouth?” EVER? Freeze dried noribogaine piss. Get it while it’s hot! I hope this doesn’t piss anybody off. But I guess that’s better than getting pissed on. LOL I’m feeling full of piss and vinegar. I’ll never grow up.            Randy

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Randy
Date: May 20, 2005 at 8:36:57 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy,

You are right. I was out of line here. I reacted out of my anger. Sorry. Hopefully my apologies covered this and that I learned something from this discussion regarding the way I handle my anger.

Sorry to hear about your troubles.

Lee

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 5/17/2005 5:05:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:
Here, here! I think the people keeping these secrets need to take more ibogaine and discover the light within. Then maybe they will know what they are actually dealing with. Lee
That’s what pissed me off.        Randy

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT You don’t have to read this
Date: May 20, 2005 at 8:00:36 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’s 1975. I’m 18 years old. The motor in my 67 Mustang is trying it’s best to be civil as I sit at the light. Fuck it, I rev it a little. Those 351 heads really make it breath a lot better. Sounds killer. I still can’t understand why Ricky shot himself. DAMNNNNNNNNNN, and lived through it. 12 gauge right to the head. I’m goin’ to the party anyway. I aint got no dope, but I know before the night is out I’ll have some, (I’m thinking). Boy was I right. The acceleration and sound that comes from the 289 motor I built hits me like a shot of coke when I kick it down Broadway. Party time. Drink, and get that bad shit outta your head. OK, I can do that. Somehow the booze just doesn’t cut it this time. When I get to the party I’m not in a good mood. Why is everybody blaming Mike for something that Ricky did at home by himself? Mike was just jokin’ when he said it was better to put the gun your mouth when you try and kill yourself. That LSD we were doing at the time thought that suicide was funny. That LSD thought everything was funny though. I get to the party just in time to see two football jocks about to kick Mike in his hippy ass. I’m drunk enough to not give a fuck, and I get outta my car with a pair of nunchucks in my hand and dare these red neck mother fuckers to come my way. At this point I wish someone would hit me. They don’t. Pussy’s When Mike gets in the car he says “we need some tequila”. I agree, we need lots of tequila. As were going to the liquor store he starts telling me about this drug store he has been looking at. It’s a cherry man, never been hit. 4 doctors offices and a pharmacy. We’ll hit ’em all. What the fuck, I’m up for anything at this point. What else do I do with all this adrenaline? “Let’s do it” I say and then interject, “we gotta go get Mark. he’s been waitin’ all night for me to come over”.”OK, go get him, he can help”. At this point I’m thinkin”, (help?) what kinda shit you got me into anyway, but I don’t say anything. We got Mark (he’s dead now too) and we’re heading up the interstate towards the point of no return, I’m wishin’ the cops would try and chase me, they don’t. Pussy’s again. I wish somebody would grow a dick or something. We get to bum fucked KY, and I try like hell not to make any noise as we roll through the town. The 4 speed I put in the car comes in handy as we come to the hill that leads up to the complex with the Dr’s offices in it. Down shit to second and creep. Man it’s quiet. My car sounds like a rocket trying to get outta the atmosphere without somebody noticing. We circle and park. “Well, whatcha gonna do bro?” “SIT, and don’t leave unless you hear the cops coming” he say’s. OK……………..that was the longest 5 minutes I ever experienced. He comes back and say’s “I want you to come and watch, if the cops come just whistle”. I’m 20 feet up a tree when I see the lights coming, I’m trying like hell to whistle. I just can’t make myself make that noise, so I scream like the intro to Sympathy for the Devil, (I still laugh about that) and hope for the best. I hit the ground runnin’ and dive in the car as quick as I can get there. Pussy again. Half an hour later Mike arrives all cool with a garbage bag in his hand and a look on his face like he just fucked the queen or something. “GO”, he say’s very quietly and as I’m hitting third down the road. I can’t believe the dope he got. Everything. Morphine, Dilaudid, Pantapon’s. liquid Demerol, clinical Coke, everything. So many hits of speed that I think people are still awake over that shit. SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO, we proceed to evolve into country boy speedballs. 2 number 4 Dilaudids, about an eighth of a gram of clinical coke, and all the liquid Demerol you can get in the fit and leave room to pull up a little air and shake it. My ears are still ringing…………………………………….I’m still runnin’ from pain. I just can’t go fast enough. Anybody got a super charger for a 5.0 motor?         Randy

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Randy – Acceptance of ibogaine – Carla
Date: May 20, 2005 at 7:23:42 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi carla,

What I said is that the number of deaths should be reported. This came out of a discussion on safety.

I never said that the names of providers should be released. I included that point in case I had given a different impression and also because I realise that if I were a provider I might feel threatened by my call for the discloure of deaths. In any case arguments develop.

Further you are not privy to off list conversations which may have come my way regarding my views and which may have then feed into a defense for what I was saying. Hence part of my apologies. The rest of my apologies were aimed at the way I reacted to the news of deaths.

I am trying to make a difference and if that puts me in the firing squad due to heated discussions so be it. I am sure it will not be the last time. It certainly isn’t the first time. Its a risk you take when you feel passionately about something and try to effect the status quo.

BTW I am not asking to be in charge of anything. In fact I am quite happy to see others stepping forward. I am just trying to go in the direction I feel drawn and mainly that is the psycho-spiritual work and the acceptance of ibogaine and working to deal with whatever threatens that.

You state:

So far you’ve
changed your position from anger, to apology, to no
secrets should be allowed, to secrets should be
allowed but someone should keep track of the secrets,
elected yourself to keep track of the secrets, then
went back to the start again 😉

Carla, Sorry but this statement is blatantly not true.

Humbly yours,

Lee

Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi Randy 🙂 I think what Lee is really saying is that
he’s surprised and angry to find out ibogaine might be
less safe then he thought it was. So far you’ve
changed your position from anger, to apology, to no
secrets should be allowed, to secrets should be
allowed but someone should keep track of the secrets,
elected yourself to keep track of the secrets, then
went back to the start again 😉

Ithink that what is healthy is open and free
conversation without fear of being censored, even if
some people use that chance to do nothing except be
obnoxious, it’s easy to type delete.

There have been sooo many people through the years who
have shown up, decided they want to organize
everything, always with themselves in charge of course
😉 and been ignored.

Randy, amybe other people read your messages in
different ways, having been reading you for more then
a year, I didn’t get any sense of anything from your
messages expect your feelings and your sense of humor
🙂

Love

Carla B

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
> Lee, I wasn’t talking about Patrick’s death, I think
> we know that there
> wasn’t any kind of cover up when it happened in
> almost real time on the list. I was
> talking about other supposed deaths, such as Mexico
> or wherever. Anywhere. My
> point was that I couldn’t believe that anyone would
> give out Ibogaine without
> regard to the risk. Not anyone I have met anyway.
> This is just my limited
> experience. I am loyal to my last breath. Maybe it’s
> a southern thing. One of the
> worse things that ever happened to me happened
> because I was taking up for a
> friend. Not even a very good friend. Just a friend.
> Another point I would like
> to make now is, all this talk just might be
> upsetting the family’s of those
> who passed away. I’d say some of them still read the
> list. I know I wouldn’t
> want to see that everyday. I care about people.
> Feelings and all. Also I have
> been smacked around orally before about this, maybe
> I’m gettin’ gun shy or
> something. I had fully intended to say that I’m
> sorry for being human and acting
> like an ass yesterday. So, I’m sorry for being human
> and acting like ass
> yesterday. Hell, I’m sorry for acting like an ass in
> the future too. I know I’ll do
> it again. But I do it now because I love everybody I
> come in contact with. I
> can’t help it. I did Ibogaine. I love you too, Lee.
> I know that your intentions
> are good. That doesn’t mean I have to agree with ya.
> Randy
>

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] It’s been a rough day
Date: May 20, 2005 at 6:45:07 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey brother
I m really sorry to hear of your friends passing.  I wish you peace of mind in the next weeks to come.
In moments like these my brother do everything to stay away from the tempatation to use.  You know you have a mission to complete and wont acomplish anything by using.  Stay strong.  You are in my thoughts and so is your friend.  Love you bro

Namaste
Matthew

Open your e-mail without having to worry about viruses with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Clean Water <clean_wtr@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] It’s been a rough day
Date: May 20, 2005 at 6:20:49 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi Randy,
sorry to hear about your friends.
cheers,
-j
— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Well, here you go. I’ve had a real tough day. In the
midst of me being in the
discussion here a friend of mine killed himself. I
got the news today about 5
PM. I don’t know what to say other than I feel
responsible somehow. I know it
seems like it is too much of a coincidence because
of what has been said, but
another friend of mine has died. Another one. I
can’t take this shit too much
longer. See, I told you that I wasn’t gonna wait to
hear about another friend
going to the grave. But what choice do I have? I’m
tryin’,  I swear to God.
He took a gun, and he blew his brains out. Gotta
respect that. No, you don’t. I
can’t believe this. He was addicted. Oxy’s and
Vicodin. Booze, weed, speed,
whatever, he was addicted. Mostly opiates. Always
opiates. His wife left him
about 6 months ago. I’m so sick, I thought about
stealing her from him, but I
didn’t. (I hope he gets the joke, I think he will) I
don’t know how to deal with
this one. It came from such an unexpected place.
Right when I think I can
relax, I hear about something like this. I think
that maybe I should take a long
look at what I’m trying to get done, and see if I
really can take all the pain
that comes with it. Here I am feeling all this pain,
can you imagine what his
family is feeling right now? I’m going to Erie, PA.
I didn’t know why I felt
the urgency to go until now. I guess he felt like he
had no other choice.
Raise your hand if you think he had one that he
didn’t know about.        Randy

Discover Yahoo!
Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] It’s been a rough day
Date: May 20, 2005 at 5:30:29 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m so sorry to hear about your mate.   I hate to  think what he was going thru to have to block it so much, and to make that final decision.  It’s such a hard thing to get your head around,  the woulda coulda shoulda’s, but if someone is serious, they’re going to do it.
I understand your guilt, but you know in your heart…..there was far more to it….and you never did what you thought about doing.
He’ll get the joke, I feel him smiling now, and I know he’s sorry to everyone he left behind….but when pain gets to great for some of us, we can’t stay here any longer.  Please try to understand.
Love,  hugs, light and laughter……………

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com [mailto:BiscuitBoy714@aol.com] 
Sent: Friday, 20 May 2005 3:28 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] It’s been a rough day

Well, here you go. I’ve had a real tough day. In the midst of me being in the discussion here a friend of mine killed himself. I got the news today about 5 PM. I don’t know what to say other than I feel responsible somehow. I know it seems like it is too much of a coincidence because of what has been said, but another friend of mine has died. Another one. I can’t take this shit too much longer. See, I told you that I wasn’t gonna wait to hear about another friend going to the grave. But what choice do I have? I’m tryin’,  I swear to God. He took a gun, and he blew his brains out. Gotta respect that. No, you don’t. I can’t believe this. He was addicted. Oxy’s and Vicodin. Booze, weed, speed, whatever, he was addicted. Mostly opiates. Always opiates. His wife left him about 6 months ago. I’m so sick, I thought about stealing her from him, but I didn’t. (I hope he gets the joke, I think he will) I don’t know how to deal with this one. It came from such an unexpected place. Right when I think I can relax, I hear about something like this. I think that maybe I should take a long look at what I’m trying to get done, and see if I really can take all the pain that comes with it. Here I am feeling all this pain, can you imagine what his family is feeling right now? I’m going to Erie, PA. I didn’t know why I felt the urgency to go until now. I guess he felt like he had no other choice. Raise your hand if you think he had one that he didn’t know about.        Randy

From: Marko <marko@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] NMR spectrum of Ibogaine HCl
Date: May 20, 2005 at 3:54:23 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,

there are some new pictures at the Images section of

http://sacrament.kibla.si/

One of them is the NMR spectrum of Ibogaine HCl, which is (as far as I
know) the first such research in the world.

I’d like to thank the two German enthusiasts who made this possible ;-))

Marko

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] kudzu cuts binge drinking?
Date: May 19, 2005 at 11:58:36 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://www.truthout.org/issues_05/051905HB.shtml

Binge Drinking Urge Suppressed by Taking the Herb Kudzu
Medical News Today
Tuesday 18 May 2005
Researchers have found that the herb, kudzu, reduces one’s desire and urge to binge drink. Two groups of young adult drinkers, all volunteers, were observed while they watched TV for an hour-and-a-half. They had an unlimited supply of beer.
One group had taken pills made from the herb kudzu, while the other took a placebo. The ‘kudzu’ group seemed to lose the desire to binge on booze.
The placebo group drank three-and-a-half beers, on average, during the 90 minute session. The kudzu group drank just 1.8 beers.
The volunteers were all in their early twenties. Researchers said it was quite easy to gather the volunteers.
snip-

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] It’s been a rough day
Date: May 19, 2005 at 11:28:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well, here you go. I’ve had a real tough day. In the midst of me being in the discussion here a friend of mine killed himself. I got the news today about 5 PM. I don’t know what to say other than I feel responsible somehow. I know it seems like it is too much of a coincidence because of what has been said, but another friend of mine has died. Another one. I can’t take this shit too much longer. See, I told you that I wasn’t gonna wait to hear about another friend going to the grave. But what choice do I have? I’m tryin’,  I swear to God. He took a gun, and he blew his brains out. Gotta respect that. No, you don’t. I can’t believe this. He was addicted. Oxy’s and Vicodin. Booze, weed, speed, whatever, he was addicted. Mostly opiates. Always opiates. His wife left him about 6 months ago. I’m so sick, I thought about stealing her from him, but I didn’t. (I hope he gets the joke, I think he will) I don’t know how to deal with this one. It came from such an unexpected place. Right when I think I can relax, I hear about something like this. I think that maybe I should take a long look at what I’m trying to get done, and see if I really can take all the pain that comes with it. Here I am feeling all this pain, can you imagine what his family is feeling right now? I’m going to Erie, PA. I didn’t know why I felt the urgency to go until now. I guess he felt like he had no other choice. Raise your hand if you think he had one that he didn’t know about.        Randy

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Your a funny guy
Date: May 19, 2005 at 10:43:01 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Randy,

One year later and you are still making me laugh. : )

love ya Randy.
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx Carla…….I think?

Carla, for some reason I’m not getting all the messages from the list, and I just read yours on inbox that I don’t usually use. I think I know what you are saying but, I just want to clarify something here. I didn’t say anything about keeping records of the treatments, that was Lee’s idea, not mine. I do think we need to compile data. And I don’t believe I changed my position once. So that said, thanx for what you said, really all I ever do is talk about my feelings and try and make people laugh. I try and be informative when I can, but there are better minds than mine here, so I let them talk the details. It’s helped keep me where I want to be so far. I speak my mind. Good or bad. I also feel very strongly about what’s going on in the US with Ibogaine. I’m hittin’ the road again soon, so yall have a good ‘un. I’ll be back.        Randy

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS
Date: May 19, 2005 at 10:40:46 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Tink,

The force is most definatley still with you.

love, Jasen
—– Original Message —– From: “tink” <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, May 20, 2005 5:53 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS

the movie was pretty good to :]
tired, cranky, and electric
but here’s hoping the force is still with me
love tink

On 5/19/05, Kirsty Sutherland <captkirk@kol.co.nz> wrote:
Yehhh, good words girl, good words, Ka Pai.
Kia ora
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 19 May 2005 6:52 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS

“You must let go of that which you fear to lose the most.”
-Yoda
Revenge of the Syth
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble
Date: May 19, 2005 at 10:23:05 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Lee,

I don’t question the value of dose escalation.  I would however be
appreciative of accurate reports rather than broad ranging claims as to either the Fang
or Mitsogo.  What we need is a new generation of ethnologists to walk in the
footsteps of Fernandez, Gollnhofer, Barabe, etc. and let us know what are the
skills and practices of various ngangas in different chapels and sects.  And I
realize I am asking a lot.  Who rates the skills of medical doctors in the
cities in which we live?

Howard

In a message dated 5/19/05 10:51:32 AM, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:

<< Howard,

You are probably right that matters today are somewhat different but I do
find it interesting that there may be a historical precedent set by the older of
the two groups (the Mitsoga) towards the idea of starting on low doses. Their
reasons for this may be 2 fold: spiritual information advising this and
secondly practical experience. However, I have no direct evidence to support this
other than what I am experiencing for myself.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

Well, usually you can’t get better than Fernandez in his observations.

However, there are a number of issues in the citation below as they are not

observations but, general statements attributed to the Mitsogo, an indigenous
people

concerning the Fang, another indigenous people, who represent a competing
sect

of Bwiti. From reports of persons on this list who have gone to Africa for

Bwiti initiations, there are reports of intense competition between the
chapels

for initiates. While Fernandez disagreed with my perception that the Mitsogo

and Fang may represent orthodox and reformed sects respectively, I think that

lends some understanding to the attitude that may be reflected by each

sect/people towards the other. The quotation below concerning the casual use
of

eboga by the Fang, may relate to the fact that they allow the initiation of

women, though all of my knowledge is with significant distance to
observations and

time. I also think it must be understood that Fernandez’s observations were

from the 1970s and things do change in twenty-five or thirty years. I think

these questions concerning African practice might be better answered by some
of

the persons on the list with extensive African experience and hope that they

may add to this discussion.

Howard

In a message dated 5/18/05 5:15:46 PM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

<< >Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the

difference between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.

“Eboga was the psychotropic drug of choice in Metsogo Bwiti whereas

in the Fang ancestral cult, Bieri, two different drugs were

employed: malan (Alchornea floribunda) and ayang beyem

(Elaeophorbia drupifera).(#2) We have seen how Bwiti origin legends

credit the discovery of eboga either to the Pygmies (they may

actually be the source of the drug for all equatorial peoples), or

to the intervention of the ancestors, or the great gods. In point

of fact the extensive use of eboga in Fang Bwiti diffused to them

from the Metsogo.

“The Metsogo claim to be surprised by the casual use of eboga by

Fang and are not surprised to hear that death results. Before

giving large amounts of eboga to initiates Metsogo test them out

with small amounts first “to see if they can support the drug or if

they have evil spirits which will use the drug as an excuse to kill

their host.” Metsogo also claim to watch over the initiate much

more closely in the process of initiation. But in Fang Bwiti, the

mother and father of eboga (roles, it appears, taken over from

Metsogo) provide very close supervision.(#3) ”

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/fernandez.html >>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] RE: [List going to junk mail
Date: May 19, 2005 at 9:59:36 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Carla,
I don’t use a webmail system, but download it straight into Outlook Express,
and everynow and then the list plus drug war ends up there!!  It’s really
pissing me off cos I make rules and it should not happen!!  What’s the point
of that I ask?? Lol
Anyone know what’s going on with this??
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: Carla Barnes [mailto:carlambarnes@yahoo.com]
Sent: Friday, 20 May 2005 11:46 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx Carla…….I think?

Hi Randy, noooo, that was Lee with the secret list,
not secret list, not you! All I really said was I
appreciated your sense of humor and having you here
🙂

Yahoo does the same thing, I’ve marked the list not
spam so many times but every few weeks the entire list
is moved into the bulk folder anyway.

Maybe a better way to say everything is it’s very
upsetting to know that at least 2 more people have
died just in this year.

Carla B

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Carla, for some reason I’m not getting all the
messages from the list, and I
just read yours on inbox that I don’t usually use. I
think I know what you are
saying but, I just want to clarify something here. I
didn’t say anything
about keeping records of the treatments, that was
Lee’s idea, not mine. I do think
we need to compile data. And I don’t believe I
changed my position once. So
that said, thanx for what you said, really all I
ever do is talk about my
feelings and try and make people laugh. I try and be
informative when I can, but
there are better minds than mine here, so I let them
talk the details. It’s
helped keep me where I want to be so far. I speak my
mind. Good or bad. I also
feel very strongly about what’s going on in the US
with Ibogaine. I’m hittin’ the
road again soon, so yall have a good ‘un. I’ll be
back.        Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Find what you need with new enhanced search.
http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx Carla…….I think?
Date: May 19, 2005 at 7:45:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy, noooo, that was Lee with the secret list,
not secret list, not you! All I really said was I
appreciated your sense of humor and having you here
🙂

Yahoo does the same thing, I’ve marked the list not
spam so many times but every few weeks the entire list
is moved into the bulk folder anyway.

Maybe a better way to say everything is it’s very
upsetting to know that at least 2 more people have
died just in this year.

Carla B

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Carla, for some reason I’m not getting all the
messages from the list, and I
just read yours on inbox that I don’t usually use. I
think I know what you are
saying but, I just want to clarify something here. I
didn’t say anything
about keeping records of the treatments, that was
Lee’s idea, not mine. I do think
we need to compile data. And I don’t believe I
changed my position once. So
that said, thanx for what you said, really all I
ever do is talk about my
feelings and try and make people laugh. I try and be
informative when I can, but
there are better minds than mine here, so I let them
talk the details. It’s
helped keep me where I want to be so far. I speak my
mind. Good or bad. I also
feel very strongly about what’s going on in the US
with Ibogaine. I’m hittin’ the
road again soon, so yall have a good ‘un. I’ll be
back.        Randy

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Find what you need with new enhanced search.
http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx Carla…….I think?
Date: May 19, 2005 at 5:58:28 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

safe journey Randy.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, May 19, 2005 5:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx Carla…….I think?

Carla, for some reason I’m not getting all the messages from the list, and I just read yours on inbox that I don’t usually use. I think I know what you are saying but, I just want to clarify something here. I didn’t say anything about keeping records of the treatments, that was Lee’s idea, not mine. I do think we need to compile data. And I don’t believe I changed my position once. So that said, thanx for what you said, really all I ever do is talk about my feelings and try and make people laugh. I try and be informative when I can, but there are better minds than mine here, so I let them talk the details. It’s helped keep me where I want to be so far. I speak my mind. Good or bad. I also feel very strongly about what’s going on in the US with Ibogaine. I’m hittin’ the road again soon, so yall have a good ‘un. I’ll be back.        Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanx Carla…….I think?
Date: May 19, 2005 at 5:15:26 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Carla, for some reason I’m not getting all the messages from the list, and I just read yours on inbox that I don’t usually use. I think I know what you are saying but, I just want to clarify something here. I didn’t say anything about keeping records of the treatments, that was Lee’s idea, not mine. I do think we need to compile data. And I don’t believe I changed my position once. So that said, thanx for what you said, really all I ever do is talk about my feelings and try and make people laugh. I try and be informative when I can, but there are better minds than mine here, so I let them talk the details. It’s helped keep me where I want to be so far. I speak my mind. Good or bad. I also feel very strongly about what’s going on in the US with Ibogaine. I’m hittin’ the road again soon, so yall have a good ‘un. I’ll be back.        Randy

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’
Date: May 19, 2005 at 5:08:51 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Let he without sin cast the first stone…

On 5/19/05, Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com> wrote:
Sure Ben, I’ve heard so much about your film and hope
to have the chance to see it soon 🙂

There are always angry people here, I think we all
take turns 😉 There are also a lot of people here who
I don’t personally know and for all I know they might
be 40, but they act like they’re 10, never had a job
and are still living in their parent’s basement for
free while filling up messages here trying to get
attention.

Love

Carla B

— Ben De Loenen <daluna@mindvox.com> wrote:

People of the list,

How the situation is now:

We are finalizing the website this weekend, so
monday morning it will be
launched.

Thanks Carla for reacting on that mail about copying
the DVD. I still
have debts from making this film, which was a full
time investment
during about 1,5 years. Before that the
preproduction also took more
than a year, so if then people just would start
copying your work, it
would not be very stimulating to go on with
presenting the film,
promoting it in the media,…I know it all has taken
much more time than
I wanted, but unfortunately that’s how it goes when
you are dependent
on the goodwill of others. Anyway, me too I wish my
film will make a
difference for the global status of Ibogaine.

Peace,

Ben De Loenen

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS
Date: May 19, 2005 at 3:53:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

the movie was pretty good to :]
tired, cranky, and electric
but here’s hoping the force is still with me
love tink

On 5/19/05, Kirsty Sutherland <captkirk@kol.co.nz> wrote:
Yehhh, good words girl, good words, Ka Pai.
Kia ora
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 19 May 2005 6:52 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS

“You must let go of that which you fear to lose the most.”
-Yoda
Revenge of the Syth
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Randy – Acceptance of ibogaine – Correction
Date: May 19, 2005 at 3:32:58 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

And I love you too :-).
I don’t think anyone would give it out with regard to the risk and maybe I am out of line to suggest that maybe not everyone is scrupulous about it 100% of the time. I have some fears. Even the best make mistakes.
I remember once someone telling me its wrong to put temptation in the way of a person. I use to think that I should be able to leave valuables lying around when people came into my home. Thats something I try not to do any more. So even if I trust someone I still will not put temptation their way. We are all human and sometimes we may not act to the best of our own standards. Thats why it benefits everyone imo to put as many safeguards in place as is possible. Its only fair on all involved.
I apologise to the family of Patrick if this discussion has been upsetting. Hopefully what has come out of it has served a greater good.
Btw thank God you have a mind of your own.
A big hug to ya,
Lee

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Lee, I wasn’t talking about Patrick’s death, I think we know that there wasn’t any kind of cover up when it happened in almost real time on the list. I was talking about other supposed deaths, such as Mexico or wherever. Anywhere. My point was that I couldn’t believe that anyone would give out Ibogaine without regard to the risk. Not anyone I have met anyway. This is just my limited experience. I am loyal to my last breath. Maybe it’s a southern thing. One of the worse things that ever happened to me happened because I was taking up for a friend. Not even a very good friend. Just a friend. Another point I would like to make now is, all this talk just might be upsetting the family’s of those who passed away. I’d say some of them still read the list. I know I wouldn’t want to see that everyday. I care about people. Feelings and all. Also I have been smacked around orally before about this, maybe I’m gettin’ gun shy or something. I had fully intended to say that I’m sorry for being human and acting like an ass yesterday. So, I’m sorry for being human and acting like ass yesterday. Hell, I’m sorry for acting like an ass in the future too. I know I’ll do it again. But I do it now because I love everybody I come in contact with. I can’t help it. I did Ibogaine. I love you too, Lee. I know that your intentions are good. That doesn’t mean I have to agree with ya.             Randy

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’
Date: May 19, 2005 at 3:32:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sure Ben, I’ve heard so much about your film and hope
to have the chance to see it soon 🙂

There are always angry people here, I think we all
take turns 😉 There are also a lot of people here who
I don’t personally know and for all I know they might
be 40, but they act like they’re 10, never had a job
and are still living in their parent’s basement for
free while filling up messages here trying to get
attention.

Love

Carla B

— Ben De Loenen <daluna@mindvox.com> wrote:

People of the list,

How the situation is now:

We are finalizing the website this weekend, so
monday morning it will be
launched.

Thanks Carla for reacting on that mail about copying
the DVD. I still
have debts from making this film, which was a full
time investment
during about 1,5 years. Before that the
preproduction also took more
than a year, so if then people just would start
copying your work, it
would not be very stimulating to go on with
presenting the film,
promoting it in the media,…I know it all has taken
much more time than
I wanted, but unfortunately that’s how it goes when
you are dependent
on the goodwill of others. Anyway, me too I wish my
film will make a
difference for the global status of Ibogaine.

Peace,

Ben De Loenen

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Randy – Acceptance of ibogaine – Correction
Date: May 19, 2005 at 3:26:58 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy 🙂 I think what Lee is really saying is that
he’s surprised and angry to find out ibogaine might be
less safe then he thought it was. So far you’ve
changed your position from anger, to apology, to no
secrets should be allowed, to secrets should be
allowed but someone should keep track of the secrets,
elected yourself to keep track of the secrets, then
went back to the start again 😉

Ithink that what is healthy is open and free
conversation without fear of being censored, even if
some people use that chance to do nothing except be
obnoxious, it’s easy to type delete.

There have been sooo many people through the years who
have shown up, decided they want to organize
everything, always with themselves in charge of course
😉 and been ignored.

Randy, amybe other people read your messages in
different ways, having been reading you for more then
a year, I didn’t get any sense of anything from your
messages expect your feelings and your sense of humor
🙂

Love

Carla B

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Lee, I wasn’t talking about Patrick’s death, I think
we know that there
wasn’t any kind of cover up when it happened in
almost real time on the list. I was
talking about other supposed deaths, such as Mexico
or wherever. Anywhere. My
point was that I couldn’t believe that anyone would
give out Ibogaine without
regard to the risk. Not anyone I have met anyway.
This is just my limited
experience. I am loyal to my last breath. Maybe it’s
a southern thing. One of the
worse things that ever happened to me happened
because I was taking up for a
friend. Not even a very good friend. Just a friend.
Another point I would like
to make now is, all this talk just might be
upsetting the family’s of those
who passed away. I’d say some of them still read the
list. I know I wouldn’t
want to see that everyday. I care about people.
Feelings and all. Also I have
been smacked around orally before about this, maybe
I’m gettin’ gun shy or
something. I had fully intended to say that I’m
sorry for being human and acting
like an ass yesterday. So, I’m sorry for being human
and acting like ass
yesterday. Hell, I’m sorry for acting like an ass in
the future too. I know I’ll do
it again. But I do it now because I love everybody I
come in contact with. I
can’t help it. I did Ibogaine. I love you too, Lee.
I know that your intentions
are good. That doesn’t mean I have to agree with ya.
Randy

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 19, 2005 at 3:08:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/17/2005 5:05:11 PM Eastern Standard Time, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:
Here, here! I think the people keeping these secrets need to take more ibogaine and discover the light within. Then maybe they will know what they are actually dealing with. Lee
That’s what pissed me off.        Randy

From: “Chris Hunter” <abductmeplease@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] fwd…fwd..what we become
Date: May 19, 2005 at 3:01:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Mat

hey I like that thought – did you think it yourself or was in already thought of  by someone else- either way its part of the collective consciousness and made me smile.

Much Love

Chris

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] fwd…fwd..what we become
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 13:26:41 -0400

_________________________________________________________________
Be the first to hear what’s new at MSN – sign up to our free newsletters! http://www.msn.co.uk/newsletters

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] fwd…fwd..what we become
Date: May 18, 2005 at 1:26:41 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Cosmic Cookie

                           Consciousness is the Creative Source.
                                 We are this Consciousness.
                                We are this Creative Source.
                          Consciousness is the Enabler of Thought.
                              Thought is the Almighty Creator.

                                      The World of Man
                            is Thought converted into Activity.
                          The Universe is Expressed Consciousness.
                           Reality is the Expression of our Mind.
                                   What we see around us
                           is the Mirror Image of Mankind’s Mind.

                           WHAT WE THINK… IS… WHAT WE BECOME
Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Randy – Acceptance of ibogaine – Correction
Date: May 19, 2005 at 2:12:42 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee, I wasn’t talking about Patrick’s death, I think we know that there wasn’t any kind of cover up when it happened in almost real time on the list. I was talking about other supposed deaths, such as Mexico or wherever. Anywhere. My point was that I couldn’t believe that anyone would give out Ibogaine without regard to the risk. Not anyone I have met anyway. This is just my limited experience. I am loyal to my last breath. Maybe it’s a southern thing. One of the worse things that ever happened to me happened because I was taking up for a friend. Not even a very good friend. Just a friend. Another point I would like to make now is, all this talk just might be upsetting the family’s of those who passed away. I’d say some of them still read the list. I know I wouldn’t want to see that everyday. I care about people. Feelings and all. Also I have been smacked around orally before about this, maybe I’m gettin’ gun shy or something. I had fully intended to say that I’m sorry for being human and acting like an ass yesterday. So, I’m sorry for being human and acting like ass yesterday. Hell, I’m sorry for acting like an ass in the future too. I know I’ll do it again. But I do it now because I love everybody I come in contact with. I can’t help it. I did Ibogaine. I love you too, Lee. I know that your intentions are good. That doesn’t mean I have to agree with ya.             Randy

From: “Ben De Loenen” <daluna@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’
Date: May 19, 2005 at 11:12:31 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

People of the list,

How the situation is now:

We are finalizing the website this weekend, so monday morning it will be
launched.

Thanks Carla for reacting on that mail about copying the DVD. I still
have debts from making this film, which was a full time investment
during about 1,5 years. Before that the preproduction also took more
than a year, so if then people just would start copying your work, it
would not be very stimulating to go on with presenting the film,
promoting it in the media,…I know it all has taken much more time than
I wanted, but unfortunately that’s how it goes when you are dependent
on the goodwill of others. Anyway, me too I wish my film will make a
difference for the global status of Ibogaine.

Peace,

Ben De Loenen

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble
Date: May 19, 2005 at 10:25:01 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,

You are probably right that matters today are somewhat different but I do find it interesting that there may be a historical precedent set by the older of the two groups (the Mitsoga) towards the idea of starting on low doses. Their reasons for this may be 2 fold: spiritual information advising this and secondly practical experience. However, I have no direct evidence to support this other than what I am experiencing for myself.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
Well, usually you can’t get better than Fernandez in his observations.
However, there are a number of issues in the citation below as they are not
observations but, general statements attributed to the Mitsogo, an indigenous people
concerning the Fang, another indigenous people, who represent a competing sect
of Bwiti. From reports of persons on this list who have gone to Africa for
Bwiti initiations, there are reports of intense competition between the chapels
for initiates. While Fernandez disagreed with my perception that the Mitsogo
and Fang may represent orthodox and reformed sects respectively, I think that
lends some understanding to the attitude that may be reflected by each
sect/people towards the other. The quotation below concerning the casual use of
eboga by the Fang, may relate to the fact that they allow the initiation of
women, though all of my knowledge is with significant distance to observations and
time. I also think it must be understood that Fernandez’s observations were
from the 1970s and things do change in twenty-five or thirty years. I think
these questions concerning African practice might be better answered by some of
the persons on the list with extensive African experience and hope that they
may add to this discussion.

Howard

In a message dated 5/18/05 5:15:46 PM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

<< >Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the
>difference between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.

“Eboga was the psychotropic drug of choice in Metsogo Bwiti whereas
in the Fang ancestral cult, Bieri, two different drugs were
employed: malan (Alchornea floribunda) and ayang beyem
(Elaeophorbia drupifera).(#2) We have seen how Bwiti origin legends
credit the discovery of eboga either to the Pygmies (they may
actually be the source of the drug for all equatorial peoples), or
to the intervention of the ancestors, or the great gods. In point
of fact the extensive use of eboga in Fang Bwiti diffused to them
from the Metsogo.

“The Metsogo claim to be surprised by the casual use of eboga by
Fang and are not surprised to hear that death results. Before
giving large amounts of eboga to initiates Metsogo test them out
with small amounts first “to see if they can support the drug or if
they have evil spirits which will use the drug as an excuse to kill
their host.” Metsogo also claim to watch over the initiate much
more closely in the process of initiation. But in Fang Bwiti, the
mother and father of eboga (roles, it appears, taken over from
Metsogo) provide very close supervision.(#3) ”

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/fernandez.html

On Wed, 18 May 2005 12:58:31 -0700 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
>In a message dated 5/18/05 3:20:52 PM, slowone@hush.ai writes:
>
><< Fang Bwiti are said take
>higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
>the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have originally
>gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer
>deaths.
> >>
>
>Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the
>difference
>between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.
>
>Thanks
>
>Howard >>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Randy – Acceptance of ibogaine – Correction
Date: May 19, 2005 at 7:35:04 AM EDT
To: Ibogaine List <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy,

Sorry I just realised that there was mention of deaths in particular locations that may not be getting reported. Perhaps that is what upset you? I don’t know.

Lee

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi randy,

I think its fair to say that you are taking this thing way out of context.

Nobody and I mean nobody has pointed a finger at anyone. Please feel free to post evidence to the contrary. What came out in the heat of discussion was the way deaths may be getting covered up and the opinion that that in the long run does not serve the cause of ibogaine well plus a realisation that ones physical condition apart from tests is very important before treatment. Thank God I realise that now. Maybe I can give out better safety advice.

There has not been a single word of blame pointed at any provider who may have been sitting for the person except to say there may be some providers who are not as scrupulous as they could be and are unaccountable as there is no agreed set of standards people have to sign up to. But that has zilch to do with Patrick’s death. If you have cross connected two ideas in your own mind and concluded this debate is an attack on a particular person then thats not the fault of the discussion. None of us even know who the provider was or the circumstances so how can we even do that? Personally my heart goes out to whoever was providing for Patrick as I am sure that person must be devastated. Whoever you are I do hope you can find a way to accept that you were giving someone a last chance who probably had no other chance left to them. And for Patrick, if from his death this discussion has prompted a review of the way things are handled then his death will have served a higher purpose apart from whatever other good may result from it. Do you want to stand in the way of that?

Forgive me if I say but maybe you are feeling a little sensitive on this issue but that doesn’t mean the rest of us are a bunch of bastards for discussing it. With all due respects but maybe this is a personal issue for you that has nothing to do with this discussion or with us discussing it?

Re: reporting of deaths and causes. I don’t believe any report should include the providers name particularly if there is a strict protocol being followed that has been agreed upon by all involved. The naming of a provider would be counterproductive and most unfair. Providers need to be protected. But someone somewhere needs to keep records.

It seems to me that ibogaine is not killing people. Its simply a case of a calculated risk that one is entitled to take. That said, if the process is properly recorded (pre-questionaires on lifestyle, post-mortem etc) the evidence should show that the person died due to a weakened system and took ibogaine as a last resort to save their life. (The same person would probably die from a 100 yard sprint). If however no records are kept and all we have to go on are exposees which say so many people have died after taking ibogaine tell me how that promotes the long term acceptance of ibogaine? All it does is unfairly point the finger at ibogaine for lack of proper records.

For me that is the issue and in case you didn’t realise by now my long term goal is the use and acceptance of ibogaine by millions of people for psycho-spiritual purposes. You and I are just a couple of fish in a big pond.

Bring on the charter!

Lee

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Todd, let me spell it out for you. And by the way, I wasn’t at all singling you out for anything, I was just using your post as a starting point to rant a little. I keep forgetting that you must continually state the obvious here. Someone died in Mexico. I never said anything about it because I didn’t think it was my job to spread a rumor. I heard about it but I had no data and really all I could have ever done is help someone gossip about it. The provider there at the time MUST have been devastated, and it was my perception that some people were coming down on the guy pretty hard. I don’t think it was his idea for the person that died to take the Ibogaine. That person came to him. And here we go with a rumor again, but I can imagine the person was pretty pushy about being treated. Casting disparaging remarks his way probably hurts him pretty bad at this point. I truly care about people. Even people I don’t really know very well. It’s my nature, my Momma raised me that way, and the first mother fucker that says anything about my mother…………………. here I go again. Sorry. I try and be honest, that leaves me wide open for abuse from the intellectual giants here on the list. I guess ego’s need something to feed on. I could change my style and wax philosophically about the state of Ibogaine, and what needs to be done…………………NAAAAAAAA I’d rather shake my dick at them, and not be afraid to get my hands dirty, and actually try and do something about it. If that sets me up for sarcasm, or any other type of verbal shot, then I guess I did my good deed for the day. At least someone else won’t be getting fucked with by them. It’s kind of like, (analogy time), here I’ll pop some smoke and put up a screen while you guys go around the other side and keep working. I took this upon my self, and I am completely and utterly delusional, just ask Elvis, he’ll tell ya. Soon enough, I’ll be silent too.  Randy

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – low dose treatment Shelley
Date: May 19, 2005 at 7:26:29 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Shelley,

You are right there are all kinds of interesting issues here. There is so much one can learn from ongoing ibogaine use. There is also so much we can learn at an ego/emotional level on lower doses.

BTW What do you mean by the flood? Is it the sudden hit that comes from a high dose of ibogaine?

I think the priority in treating addiction to begin with should be to simply interrupt it. The whole breaking open the head thing is secondary imo. But a follow up treatment is a possibility when the person is in better health. Maybe a program of interruption over a period of time followed by the major session at a physically appropriate date.

That said I would opt for step dosing using the minimum dose and keep someone in observation should they need more dosing from withdrawals. One reason I say this is because I had a message in one of my sessions about 3 years ago which I didn’t understand and it was this: Beginners, give low. Now I think its starting to make a lot more sense to me.

The body does adjust to the presence of ibogaine in my experience. So if one starts with a series of low doses by the time one takes a higher dose the adverse effects are lessened and ones lifestyle is better able to support the physical duress of the session – i.e. the risks have been halfed if not quartered or eighted. It would be interesting to draw up a Harm Reduction Program for ibogaine based on minimum doses.

Gently does it.

Lee

shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi Lee, I agree theres nothing like the flood for spiritual lift ,but regardless , i had a great experience with the gradual ,I dont think its usually done gradualiy  for short acting opiates ,but It was intense enough anyway ,vomit & all! It was alot quicker recovery time for me . I dont know how much the hep c interplays with the whatchacallit enzyme that lets noribogaine process ,or my overall sensitivity.I do believe low dose given at intervals like I had worked the best ever.It provides another option for those unwilling to be flooded, Ive heard discussions like “how important is the flood in overall picture for a detox?” Maybe it is safer as well as youre not processing as much at one time. But keep in mind that I was treated in Mexico ,they use 13-14 mg / kg for women, which is kinda low, so I had residual withdrawal then & that enters into my overall assessment of how effective it all is . Who knows how much timing plays in as well. Interesting issues huh?I wouldnt trade my experiences with the flood for anything, but eventually the noribogaine wears off & for me, the intense spiritual aha’s wane,then ,the real work begins,for which I’m better prepared & willing to be focused on this time. The best I did was my third, which I had stayed off opiates for 48 hours ,had a very brief slip/habit ,so I was cleaner overall- now that was awesome!I’d be interested in others take on this stuff,love shell

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Shelley,

I am really curious. You say you did a low dose regiem over a number of days. Was there any reason why you didn’t do that in the first place? Is there a minimum level of dose one can take to remain effective? It seems to me that different providers work in different ways. Some give the full dose and others step dose. Spiritually the two can be quite different imo but from the point of view of addiction treatment does the step dose regiem prove any less effective than the full dose or does it depend on the level of addiction? Seems to me it can be a lot easier on the person.

Lee

shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I detoxed twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that time ,the MD said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I remember being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in mexico,I figure the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the ones I work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get free anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never experienced before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical kinda setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to inquire about another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from ibogaine , & that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last detox I did was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3 times before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best results ever psychologically & spiritually, (3 months clean this time & counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very mild ,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw up at my hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole ends up carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances to consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the quintessential risk taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug just able to cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV insanity, so I’d risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of doing ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have easily done that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly elevated even, with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that have lost loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts ,love shell

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko wrote:
> Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
> He took IBO in the
> evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
> to have a harder impact
> when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
> enough!) and he constantly
> felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
> of enormous blood
> pressure.
>
> He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
> night), and his pulse and
> blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
> heighten, but within normal.
> During these measurements he felt as before, and
> complained to the doctor
> all the time. When the doctor told him that his
> pulse and blood pressure
> are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
> normal. All the pressure
> was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
> physical plane – at
> all!!)
>
> He was taken back home, and had some divine
> experience afterwards ;-))
>
> This case was obviously a psychological one.
>
> I know from experience that very high pulse is
> possible; but its duration
> isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
> waves.
>
> Marko
>
> On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
> Standard Time,
> > my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
> > Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
> medical
> > supervision to counteract the potential side
> effects
> > of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
> pulse
> > (among other things). This is rather easy to do
> with
> > drugs such as Inderal and the like
> > Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
> pressure or pulse for that matter
> > went up much at all. My mother could tell you
> better than me. She’s a nurse
> > practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
> took my blood pressure once
> > and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
> wasn’t ever much of a change. I
> > think this just goes to show that no two
> treatments will ever be alike with
> > something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
> provider checked on me, he
> > could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
> This thing bothers me a lot.
> > I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
> and taken the treatment.
> > I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
> give me some time and
> > consideration after I cornered them at the
> conference, or wherever I could find them. I
> > was never put off by the way, everyone was very
> nice and treated me with
> > respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
> these people it was that they all
> > cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
> everyone pointing fingers at
> > someone who they know deep down was devastated by
> the death occurring during
> > the treatment? It happens in the states, it
> happens in Europe, and it happens in
> > Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
> calculated risk. So is
> > driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
> scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
> > I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
> down home, but there is so
> > much more to learn about it that I have come to
> the realization that it is
> > going to take an enormous amount of money, and
> research, to ever completely
> > figure it out. Back to square one again.
> Randy
> >
>
>
>
>
>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>
>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – Randy – Acceptance of ibogaine
Date: May 19, 2005 at 7:05:21 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi randy,

I think its fair to say that you are taking this thing way out of context.

Nobody and I mean nobody has pointed a finger at anyone. Please feel free to post evidence to the contrary. What came out in the heat of discussion was the way deaths may be getting covered up and the opinion that that in the long run does not serve the cause of ibogaine well plus a realisation that ones physical condition apart from tests is very important before treatment. Thank God I realise that now. Maybe I can give out better safety advice.

There has not been a single word of blame pointed at any provider who may have been sitting for the person except to say there may be some providers who are not as scrupulous as they could be and are unaccountable as there is no agreed set of standards people have to sign up to. But that has zilch to do with Patrick’s death. If you have cross connected two ideas in your own mind and concluded this debate is an attack on a particular person then thats not the fault of the discussion. None of us even know who the provider was or the circumstances so how can we even do that? Personally my heart goes out to whoever was providing for Patrick as I am sure that person must be devastated. Whoever you are I do hope you can find a way to accept that you were giving someone a last chance who probably had no other chance left to them. And for Patrick, if from his death this discussion has prompted a review of the way things are handled then his death will have served a higher purpose apart from whatever other good may result from it. Do you want to stand in the way of that?

Forgive me if I say but maybe you are feeling a little sensitive on this issue but that doesn’t mean the rest of us are a bunch of bastards for discussing it. With all due respects but maybe this is a personal issue for you that has nothing to do with this discussion or with us discussing it?

Re: reporting of deaths and causes. I don’t believe any report should include the providers name particularly if there is a strict protocol being followed that has been agreed upon by all involved. The naming of a provider would be counterproductive and most unfair. Providers need to be protected. But someone somewhere needs to keep records.

It seems to me that ibogaine is not killing people. Its simply a case of a calculated risk that one is entitled to take. That said, if the process is properly recorded (pre-questionaires on lifestyle, post-mortem etc) the evidence should show that the person died due to a weakened system and took ibogaine as a last resort to save their life. (The same person would probably die from a 100 yard sprint). If however no records are kept and all we have to go on are exposees which say so many people have died after taking ibogaine tell me how that promotes the long term acceptance of ibogaine? All it does is unfairly point the finger at ibogaine for lack of proper records.

For me that is the issue and in case you didn’t realise by now my long term goal is the use and acceptance of ibogaine by millions of people for psycho-spiritual purposes. You and I are just a couple of fish in a big pond.

Bring on the charter!

Lee

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Todd, let me spell it out for you. And by the way, I wasn’t at all singling you out for anything, I was just using your post as a starting point to rant a little. I keep forgetting that you must continually state the obvious here. Someone died in Mexico. I never said anything about it because I didn’t think it was my job to spread a rumor. I heard about it but I had no data and really all I could have ever done is help someone gossip about it. The provider there at the time MUST have been devastated, and it was my perception that some people were coming down on the guy pretty hard. I don’t think it was his idea for the person that died to take the Ibogaine. That person came to him. And here we go with a rumor again, but I can imagine the person was pretty pushy about being treated. Casting disparaging remarks his way probably hurts him pretty bad at this point. I truly care about people. Even people I don’t really know very well. It’s my nature, my Momma raised me that way, and the first mother fucker that says anything about my mother…………………. here I go again. Sorry. I try and be honest, that leaves me wide open for abuse from the intellectual giants here on the list. I guess ego’s need something to feed on. I could change my style and wax philosophically about the state of Ibogaine, and what needs to be done…………………NAAAAAAAA I’d rather shake my dick at them, and not be afraid to get my hands dirty, and actually try and do something about it. If that sets me up for sarcasm, or any other type of verbal shot, then I guess I did my good deed for the day. At least someone else won’t be getting fucked with by them. It’s kind of like, (analogy time), here I’ll pop some smoke and put up a screen while you guys go around the other side and keep working. I took this upon my self, and I am completely and utterly delusional, just ask Elvis, he’ll tell ya. Soon enough, I’ll be silent too.  Randy

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS
Date: May 19, 2005 at 6:13:58 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yehhh, good words girl, good words, Ka Pai.
Kia ora
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 19 May 2005 6:52 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS

“You must let go of that which you fear to lose the most.”
-Yoda
Revenge of the Syth
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Marcus <aktionman@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Patrick thank you! (now let us innonnitt)
Date: May 19, 2005 at 3:17:34 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On 5/19/2005, “Krista Vaughan” <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:

I’m sorry I don’t know where it is online? I read the magazine MAPS
publishes, they have copies at a acupuncture center here.

yo….loadijjj,
cough it up & tell us where we can read this insightfullll dizzzcorse!!!!!

p,l,&u
marcus

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] STAR WARS
Date: May 19, 2005 at 2:51:31 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“You must let go of that which you fear to lose the most.”
-Yoda
Revenge of the Syth
love
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Patrick thank you!
Date: May 19, 2005 at 1:30:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m sorry I don’t know where it is online? I read the magazine MAPS
publishes, they have copies at a acupuncture center here.

KV

On 19 May 2005 04:56:22 -0000, Marcus <aktionman@phantom.com> wrote:

could i getta link to this article?
thanx
marcus
On 5/19/2005, “Krista Vaughan” <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:

Patrick I wanted to apologize profusely, I had opportunity to read the
new issue of MAPS. Brilliant article! Thank you from the bottom of my
heart, this answered the questions I’ve been pestering you about for
months!

I am so very sorry to have been rude but you do know had you written
back one sentence saying your talk and so much more would be published
in the near future, I wouldn’t have carried on so!

Thank you, in one article I think you covered a hundred messages of
debate here about low dose and “maintenance” and you did answer with
great clarity about “dirty maintenance”. Thank you so much cutie,
you’re a brilliant young man and wrote something that hasn’t ever been
written about ibogaine before.

For the fifth or sixth time in this message, I am very sorry for being
rude before, there is so much anger here sometimes it’s easy to lose
sight of how much you are doing. Thank you!

To post one more point relevant to the last days here, MAPS did write
that the clinic in Mexico was shut down. They did not say why or
mention the death.

KV

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Cheryl” <cherylca@myway.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] For Patrick thank you!
Date: May 19, 2005 at 1:22:23 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I can’t find this online, where can I download please.

Thank you.

— On Wed 05/18, Krista Vaughan < krista.vaughan@gmail.com > wrote:
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Wed, 18 May 2005 22:30:53 -0400
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Patrick thank you!

Patrick I wanted to apologize profusely, I had opportunity to read the<br>new issue of MAPS. Brilliant article! Thank you from the bottom of my<br>heart, this answered the questions I’ve been pestering you about for<br>months!<br><br>I am so very sorry to have been rude but you do know had you written<br>back one sentence saying your talk and so much more would be published<br>in the near future, I wouldn’t have carried on so!<br><br>Thank you, in one article I think you covered a hundred messages of<br>debate here about low dose and “maintenance” and you did answer with<br>great clarity about “dirty maintenance”. Thank you so much cutie,<br>you’re a brilliant young man and wrote something that hasn’t ever been<br>written about ibogaine before.<br><br>For the fifth or sixth time in this message, I am very sorry for being<br>rude before, there is so much anger here sometimes it’s easy to lose<br>sight of how much you are doing. Thank you!<br><br>To post one more point relevant
to the last days here, MAPS did write<br>that the clinic in Mexico was shut down. They did not say why or<br>mention the death.<br><br>KV<br><br><br>   /] <br>=——————————————————————— <br>=[\<br>  [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/ <br>IbogaineList.html [%]<br>   \] <br>=——————————————————————— <br>=[/<br><br><br><br><br>

_______________________________________________
No banners. No pop-ups. No kidding.
Make My Way  your home on the Web – http://www.myway.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Marcus <aktionman@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For Patrick thank you!
Date: May 19, 2005 at 12:56:22 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

could i getta link to this article?
thanx
marcus
On 5/19/2005, “Krista Vaughan” <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:

Patrick I wanted to apologize profusely, I had opportunity to read the
new issue of MAPS. Brilliant article! Thank you from the bottom of my
heart, this answered the questions I’ve been pestering you about for
months!

I am so very sorry to have been rude but you do know had you written
back one sentence saying your talk and so much more would be published
in the near future, I wouldn’t have carried on so!

Thank you, in one article I think you covered a hundred messages of
debate here about low dose and “maintenance” and you did answer with
great clarity about “dirty maintenance”. Thank you so much cutie,
you’re a brilliant young man and wrote something that hasn’t ever been
written about ibogaine before.

For the fifth or sixth time in this message, I am very sorry for being
rude before, there is so much anger here sometimes it’s easy to lose
sight of how much you are doing. Thank you!

To post one more point relevant to the last days here, MAPS did write
that the clinic in Mexico was shut down. They did not say why or
mention the death.

KV

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] For Patrick thank you!
Date: May 18, 2005 at 10:30:53 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Patrick I wanted to apologize profusely, I had opportunity to read the
new issue of MAPS. Brilliant article! Thank you from the bottom of my
heart, this answered the questions I’ve been pestering you about for
months!

I am so very sorry to have been rude but you do know had you written
back one sentence saying your talk and so much more would be published
in the near future, I wouldn’t have carried on so!

Thank you, in one article I think you covered a hundred messages of
debate here about low dose and “maintenance” and you did answer with
great clarity about “dirty maintenance”. Thank you so much cutie,
you’re a brilliant young man and wrote something that hasn’t ever been
written about ibogaine before.

For the fifth or sixth time in this message, I am very sorry for being
rude before, there is so much anger here sometimes it’s easy to lose
sight of how much you are doing. Thank you!

To post one more point relevant to the last days here, MAPS did write
that the clinic in Mexico was shut down. They did not say why or
mention the death.

KV

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Clean Water <clean_wtr@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 10:03:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://images.google.com/images?q=%22rubber+duck%22&hl=en

-jason

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] A step back – a touch of reality
Date: May 18, 2005 at 9:24:33 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well, I don’t think you need to apologize, to putting forth your thoughts and ideas (I’ve yet to feel they attacked anyone?)……..I for one am paying attention to anyone with knowledge and thoughts about this, and lower dosing is looking quite good from my angle now…….
You can keep some of the people happy some of the time, but not all of the people all of the time…..or sumfink like that.
Keep the ideas coming, it’s all for the higher good right?
Kirk
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk] 
Sent: Wednesday, 18 May 2005 11:07 p.m.
To: Ibogaine List
Subject: [Ibogaine] A step back – a touch of reality

Dear List,

I think maybe we are losing the thread of reality here – well me at least.

There are all kinds of extenuating circumstances that none of us are aware of that don’t come out on this list.

I am sorry if my posts seem to be attacking particular people – thats not what I meant. The whole issue got me going I am afraid. The work that is being done is being done under difficult circumstances and I for one do not want to make it any more difficult than it is which is why I am truely sorry if that is the effect my posts have had. Its work which while not perfect is definitely way better than none at all.

So I realise this discussion is perhaps not having the effect I hoped it would have, i.e., it’s backfiring. For that I apologise and say sorry from the bottom of my heart to anyone who feels I undermined their good work. Indeed I apologise to anyone who has had the unfortunate experience of tragedy in treatment and did the best they could under difficult circumstances. Nobody should point a finger their way. Once again if I came across like that I deeply apologise. That was not my intention. I have to admit that while I try to be completely motivated by the best intentions there are times when I get carried away. I need to work on my ego a little more.

Unfortunately here in Europe we are out of the loop and we really do not know what is going on.

While this list is a great place for discussions it is lacking the personal contact needed to put things into a real perspective. Personally I would like to come over to the US and get more acquainted with the reality on the ground.

Once again sorry and I ask anyone who feels that things are not right to realise its not those who are providing the service that are not right but the system that has pushed them into that situation. I think we should all give 100% support to everyone doing the best they can to lift people out of their suffering. And if there are concerns to try and deal with them constructively.

Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Todd Morgan <sovntm@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 6:41:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

Rant on brotha!

I don’t follow the nuances and personalities of this
board very closely.  After my treatment I tend to
delete 9/10 of posts.  This is not because I’m not
interested it’s because I just don’t have time to read
them all.  The topic of “Vascular Trouble,” caught my
attention.

I obviously stepped into pre-existing conversation.

My bad.

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

Todd, let me spell it out for you. And by the way, I
wasn’t at all singling
you out for anything, I was just using your post as
a starting point to rant a
little. I keep forgetting that you must continually
state the obvious here.
Someone died in Mexico. I never said anything about
it because I didn’t think it
was my job to spread a rumor. I heard about it but I
had no data and really
all I could have ever done is help someone gossip
about it. The provider there
at the time MUST have been devastated, and it was my
perception that some
people were coming down on the guy pretty hard. I
don’t think it was his idea for
the person that died to take the Ibogaine. That
person came to him. And here
we go with a rumor again, but I can imagine the
person was pretty pushy about
being treated. Casting disparaging remarks his way
probably hurts him pretty
bad at this point. I truly care about people. Even
people I don’t really know
very well. It’s my nature, my Momma raised me that
way, and the first mother
fucker that says anything about my
mother…………………. here I go again.
Sorry. I try and be honest, that leaves me wide open
for abuse from the
intellectual giants here on the list. I guess ego’s
need something to feed on. I
could change my style and wax philosophically about
the state of Ibogaine, and
what needs to be done…………………NAAAAAAAA
I’d rather shake my dick at
them, and not be afraid to get my hands dirty, and
actually try and do
something about it. If that sets me up for sarcasm,
or any other type of verbal shot,
then I guess I did my good deed for the day. At
least someone else won’t be
getting fucked with by them. It’s kind of like,
(analogy time), here I’ll pop
some smoke and put up a screen while you guys go
around the other side and keep
working. I took this upon my self, and I am
completely and utterly
delusional, just ask Elvis, he’ll tell ya. Soon
enough, I’ll be silent too.  Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 6:28:34 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Mine was on the low side, very low, actually, and I didn’t have the
puking thing happen either.  I also spent 5 hours in severe twitch
out, complete with the full team of dr’s trying everything from reiche
healing to holding me down, but I think that that had a lot to do with
the fact that i got treated from a very large dose of methadone.  Any
one else have the severe twitchouts?
tink

On 5/18/05, Jasen Chamoun <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au> wrote:

Hello Randy,

Concerning blood pressure whilst under the effect of Iboga/Ibogaine, mine
seemed to be very low. Most definatley not high.

love, Jasen.

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 7:39 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under medical
supervision to counteract the potential side effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps) pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood pressure or pulse for that matter
went up much at all. My mother could tell you better than me. She’s a nurse
practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she took my blood pressure
once and checked my pulse a couple of times but there wasn’t ever much of a
change. I think this just goes to show that no two treatments will ever be
alike with something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My provider
checked on me, he could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig? This
thing bothers me a lot. I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
and taken the treatment. I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to give
me some time and consideration after I cornered them at the conference, or
wherever I could find them. I was never put off by the way, everyone was
very nice and treated me with respect. If I got one feeling from every one
of these people it was that they all cared very much about what they were
doing. Why is everyone pointing fingers at someone who they know deep down
was devastated by the death occurring during the treatment? It happens in
the states, it happens in Europe, and it happens in Africa. Clinical setting
or not, it is a risk. A calculated risk. So is driving a car. I don’t know
shit, really, in the scheme of things, about Ibogaine. I’ve studied on it
good, long, and hard, as we say down home, but there is so much more to
learn about it that I have come to the realization that it is going to take
an enormous amount of money, and research, to ever completely figure it out.
Back to square one again.       Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Africa/was/Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 6:19:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well, usually you can’t get better than Fernandez in his observations.
However, there are a number of issues in the citation below as they are not
observations but, general statements attributed to the Mitsogo, an indigenous people
concerning the Fang, another indigenous people, who represent a competing sect
of Bwiti.  From reports of persons on this list who have gone to Africa for
Bwiti initiations, there are reports of intense competition between the chapels
for initiates.  While Fernandez disagreed with my perception that the Mitsogo
and Fang may represent orthodox and reformed sects respectively, I think that
lends some understanding to the attitude that may be reflected by each
sect/people towards the other.  The quotation below concerning the casual use of
eboga by the Fang, may relate to the fact that they allow the initiation of
women, though all of my knowledge is with significant distance to observations and
time.  I also think it must be understood that Fernandez’s observations were
from the 1970s and things do change in twenty-five or thirty years.  I think
these questions concerning African practice might be better answered by some of
the persons on the list with extensive African experience and hope that they
may add to this discussion.

Howard

In a message dated 5/18/05 5:15:46 PM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

<< >Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the
difference between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.

“Eboga was the psychotropic drug of choice in Metsogo Bwiti whereas
in the Fang ancestral cult, Bieri, two different drugs were
employed: malan (Alchornea floribunda) and ayang beyem
(Elaeophorbia drupifera).(#2) We have seen how Bwiti origin legends
credit the discovery of eboga either to the Pygmies (they may
actually be the source of the drug for all equatorial peoples), or
to the intervention of the ancestors, or the great gods. In point
of fact the extensive use of eboga in Fang Bwiti diffused to them
from the Metsogo.

“The Metsogo claim to be surprised by the casual use of eboga by
Fang and are not surprised to hear that death results. Before
giving large amounts of eboga to initiates Metsogo test them out
with small amounts first “to see if they can support the drug or if
they have evil spirits which will use the drug as an excuse to kill
their host.” Metsogo also claim to watch over the initiate much
more closely in the process of initiation. But in Fang Bwiti, the
mother and father of eboga (roles, it appears, taken over from
Metsogo) provide very close supervision.(#3) ”

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/fernandez.html

On Wed, 18 May 2005 12:58:31 -0700 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 5/18/05 3:20:52 PM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

<< Fang Bwiti are said take
higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have originally
gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer
deaths.

Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the
difference
between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.

Thanks

Howard >>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 5:48:51 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Todd, let me spell it out for you. And by the way, I wasn’t at all singling you out for anything, I was just using your post as a starting point to rant a little. I keep forgetting that you must continually state the obvious here. Someone died in Mexico. I never said anything about it because I didn’t think it was my job to spread a rumor. I heard about it but I had no data and really all I could have ever done is help someone gossip about it. The provider there at the time MUST have been devastated, and it was my perception that some people were coming down on the guy pretty hard. I don’t think it was his idea for the person that died to take the Ibogaine. That person came to him. And here we go with a rumor again, but I can imagine the person was pretty pushy about being treated. Casting disparaging remarks his way probably hurts him pretty bad at this point. I truly care about people. Even people I don’t really know very well. It’s my nature, my Momma raised me that way, and the first mother fucker that says anything about my mother…………………. here I go again. Sorry. I try and be honest, that leaves me wide open for abuse from the intellectual giants here on the list. I guess ego’s need something to feed on. I could change my style and wax philosophically about the state of Ibogaine, and what needs to be done…………………NAAAAAAAA I’d rather shake my dick at them, and not be afraid to get my hands dirty, and actually try and do something about it. If that sets me up for sarcasm, or any other type of verbal shot, then I guess I did my good deed for the day. At least someone else won’t be getting fucked with by them. It’s kind of like, (analogy time), here I’ll pop some smoke and put up a screen while you guys go around the other side and keep working. I took this upon my self, and I am completely and utterly delusional, just ask Elvis, he’ll tell ya. Soon enough, I’ll be silent too.  Randy

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: [Ibogaine] More Fernandez
Date: May 18, 2005 at 5:44:35 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Reading on..

“In general, women’s accounts of their visions are much shorter
than men’s accounts though there is no belief in Bwiti that women
have shorter excursions than men. It appears that women’s primary
objective is to make contact with a dead relative, very often a
dead child, and when this is accomplished the vision experience is
fulfilled. Men are more elaborative. They also confess to being,
initially, more skeptical, and their visions tend as a consequence
to be more exploratory, as if the very richness of what they
discover overcomes their skepticism. ”

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 5:15:23 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the
difference between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.

“Eboga was the psychotropic drug of choice in Metsogo Bwiti whereas
in the Fang ancestral cult, Bieri, two different drugs were
employed: malan (Alchornea floribunda) and ayang beyem
(Elaeophorbia drupifera).(#2) We have seen how Bwiti origin legends
credit the discovery of eboga either to the Pygmies (they may
actually be the source of the drug for all equatorial peoples), or
to the intervention of the ancestors, or the great gods. In point
of fact the extensive use of eboga in Fang Bwiti diffused to them
from the Metsogo.

“The Metsogo claim to be surprised by the casual use of eboga by
Fang and are not surprised to hear that death results. Before
giving large amounts of eboga to initiates Metsogo test them out
with small amounts first “to see if they can support the drug or if
they have evil spirits which will use the drug as an excuse to kill
their host.” Metsogo also claim to watch over the initiate much
more closely in the process of initiation. But in Fang Bwiti, the
mother and father of eboga (roles, it appears, taken over from
Metsogo) provide very close supervision.(#3) ”

http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/fernandez.html

On Wed, 18 May 2005 12:58:31 -0700 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 5/18/05 3:20:52 PM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

<< Fang Bwiti are said take
higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have originally
gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer
deaths.

Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the
difference
between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.

Thanks

Howard

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 5:00:01 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://www.answers.com/puppet

— ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de> wrote:

Am 18.05.2005 um 22:43 schrieb ekki:
now -being clear and post-ibo- its back to normal.

i meant clean, not clear

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 4:54:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Am 18.05.2005 um 22:43 schrieb ekki:
now -being clear and post-ibo- its back to normal.

i meant clean, not clear

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 4:43:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

when i overdosed my blood pressure was incredibly low (the lower value couldn´t be measured any more) while my heart was pumping >190bpm. so maybe high pulse rate and low blood pressure go well together. btw i had very high blood pressure for years, now -being clear and post-ibo- its back to normal.
cheers ekki

Am 18.05.2005 um 22:34 schrieb Jasen Chamoun:

Hello Randy,

Concerning blood pressure whilst under the effect of Iboga/Ibogaine, mine seemed to be very low. Most definatley not high.

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Time travel and PKD
Date: May 18, 2005 at 4:34:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hey, thanks for that one. i already wondered where the PKD discussions promised in the list commands went.
my personal favorite is “a scanner darkly”. very funny and sad at the same time and touches themes on politics, addiction, therapy,spirituality, and so on, amazing plot, great stoner dialogues
valis is more mystic though, i found it a bit confusing in the end, but a great read anywayz.
wasn´t he a long-term amphetamine addict? -ekki

Am 18.05.2005 um 21:18 schrieb <tomo7@starband.net>:

So Tink, what about PKD and this list really gets you? He is a cult hero
now for even people who havent heard of Ibogaine. Read VALIS and you have
to wonder if he ever took Ibo.

Maybe his consciousness naturally parallel processed between dimensions
similar to how the ibogaine seems to influence some peoples minds. For a
seminal sci fi author, he sure portrays a post ibo clarity in his
plotlines and protagonists. The final speech of the dying lead bad guy in
Blade Runner, played by Rutger Hauer, was a haunting voice of the sensory
enhanced android. It could have been a direct Bwiti quote, seemed to me.

I think the time travel you already have, if you work it well between this
entheogen and your own already charged mind. Ibo time travel isnt like a
bus trip, point A to B over time, more like an opening to non sequential
moments in memory and dream that dont require time to elapse for their
experience.

Many of PKDs stories model this one foot in our time, the other stepping
about without time reference. Maybe he did access some ibogaine, I dont
know.  Any social historians among you have info on that?  I sure wish
Earth would hurry and create several more genius writers of the PKD
flavor. What an intellectual tall cool drink of water that would be for
us!

Dr. Tom

So I’m doing a search for the NY Times Magazine article that i was
invovled in about a million years ago(can’t remember which year.  Or who
the damned interviewer was. Nice, eh?) and of all things to come popping
up was a whole link to a Philip K Dick site.
All I need now is the time travel…
luv
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 4:34:33 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hello Randy,

Concerning blood pressure whilst under the effect of Iboga/Ibogaine, mine seemed to be very low. Most definatley not high.

love, Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 7:39 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under medical
supervision to counteract the potential side effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps) pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood pressure or pulse for that matter went up much at all. My mother could tell you better than me. She’s a nurse practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she took my blood pressure once and checked my pulse a couple of times but there wasn’t ever much of a change. I think this just goes to show that no two treatments will ever be alike with something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My provider checked on me, he could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig? This thing bothers me a lot. I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects, and taken the treatment. I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to give me some time and consideration after I cornered them at the conference, or wherever I could find them. I was never put off by the way, everyone was very nice and treated me with respect. If I got one feeling from every one of these people it was that they all cared very much about what they were doing. Why is everyone pointing fingers at someone who they know deep down was devastated by the death occurring during the treatment? It happens in the states, it happens in Europe, and it happens in Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A calculated risk. So is driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the scheme of things, about Ibogaine. I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say down home, but there is so much more to learn about it that I have come to the realization that it is going to take an enormous amount of money, and research, to ever completely figure it out. Back to square one again.       Randy

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 3:58:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/18/05 3:20:52 PM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

<< Fang Bwiti are said take
higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have originally
gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer deaths.

Just curious as to the source of your information concerning the difference
between Fang and Mitsogo doses of iboga.

Thanks

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 3:33:45 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I can imagine that you would doubt something that you haven’t seen,
but from what I’ve read and seen on film, the Fang are a big-boned
and boisterous group. Death is more common in Africa because of
climate and lower average income. When people die more often, my
impression is that the survivors dwell on it less and focus on
living in the moment more.

In any case, I have heard that the Europeans seem weak to the Fang
(‘oops, who would have thought that dose would kill someone?’)

On Wed, 18 May 2005 12:03:01 -0700 Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
wrote:
The Fang are a vigorous people. Life has a different value in
Africa, in that death at all ages is more common.<

I guess I don’t doubt the assertion that they have deaths from
ibogaine in
Africa, but somehow seem to doubt that they’re more “vigorous”
than the
average non-African jane/joe, or that death at all ages is more
common there
than here. I mean, I don’t really know either way, but it seems to

me that’s
a pretty broad statement. Life might have a different value, but
I’m unsure
it equals “less” value than we hold it in here.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is

often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 1:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

People do die in Africa. It is viewed as due to a flaw in the
person, perhaps due to an unconfessed sin. Fang Bwiti are said
take
higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have
originally
gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer
deaths.

The Fang are a vigorous people. Life has a different value in
Africa, in that death at all ages is more common.

On Wed, 18 May 2005 10:02:49 -0700 Preston Peet
<ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
wrote:
I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without
the

benefit
of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that
have l! ost
loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts<

RAther rushed and busy this end of the internet, but Shelly, I
just wanted
to write and say “thank you” for posting this comment.
I wrote some more, haughty and slightly angry stuff here but
deleted it, it
isn’t important. The important part is that you hit the nail on
the head-
yes, there may very well be some risks with ibogaine, but if the
natives can
take it without doctors and heartmonitors why can’t we? I’m
curious as to
whether the natives in Gabon ever have any deaths?
Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment
is

often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: shelley krupa
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I
detoxed
twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that
time ,the MD
said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no
doubt.I
remember
being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in
mexico,I figure
the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then
the
ones I
work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get
free
anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never
experienced
before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical
kinda
setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to
inquire about
another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from
ibogaine , &
that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last
detox I did
was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3
times
before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best
results
ever psychologically &am! p; spiritually, (3 months clean this
time &
counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was
very
mild
,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw
up at my
hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole
ends up
carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances
to
consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the
quintessential risk
taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug
just able to
cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV
insanity, so I’d
risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out
of

doing
ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have
easily done
that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly
elevated even,
with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those
african folks
do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean
absolutely

no
disresect to those that have l! ost loved ones ,or that help
others, just my
thoughts ,love shell

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko wrote:
Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
He took IBO in the
evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
to have a harder impact
when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
enough!) and he constantly
felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
of enormous blood
pressure.

He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
night), and his pulse and
blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
heighten, but within normal.
During these measurements he felt as before, and
complained to the doctor
all the time. When the doctor told him that his
pulse and ! blood pressure
are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
normal. All the pressure
was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
physical plane – at
all!!)

He was taken back home, and had some divine
experience afterwards ;-))

This case was obviously a psychological one.

I know from experience that very high pulse is
possible; but its duration
isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
waves.

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
medical
supervision to counteract the potential side
effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
pulse
(amo! ng other things). This is rather easy to do
with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
pressure or pulse for that matter
went up much at all. My mother could tell you
better than me. She’s a nurse
practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
took my blood pressure once
and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
wasn’t ever much of a change. I
think this just goes to show that no two
treatments will ever be alike with
something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
provider checked on me, he
could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
This thing bothers me a lot.
I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
and taken the treatment.
I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
give me some time and
&g! t; > consideration after I cornered them at the
conference, or wherever I could find them. I
was never put off by the way, everyone was very
nice and treated me with
respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
these people it was that they all
cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
everyone pointing fingers at
someone who they know deep down was devastated by
the death occurring during
the treatment? It happens in the states, it
happens in Europe, and it happens in
Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
calculated risk. So is
driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
down home, but there is so
much more to learn about it that I have come to
the realization that! it is
going to take an enormous amount of money, and
research, to ever completely
figure it out. Back to square one again.
Randy

/]=————————————————————–

—–=[

[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

]=—————————————————————

—-=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=————————————————————–

—–=[

[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
]=—————————————————————

—-=[/

/]=————————————————————

——-=[

[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=————————————————————-

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate
Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

]=—————————————————————

——=[/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <tomo7@starband.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Time travel and PKD
Date: May 18, 2005 at 3:18:46 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So Tink, what about PKD and this list really gets you? He is a cult hero
now for even people who havent heard of Ibogaine. Read VALIS and you have
to wonder if he ever took Ibo.

Maybe his consciousness naturally parallel processed between dimensions
similar to how the ibogaine seems to influence some peoples minds. For a
seminal sci fi author, he sure portrays a post ibo clarity in his
plotlines and protagonists. The final speech of the dying lead bad guy in
Blade Runner, played by Rutger Hauer, was a haunting voice of the sensory
enhanced android. It could have been a direct Bwiti quote, seemed to me.

I think the time travel you already have, if you work it well between this
entheogen and your own already charged mind. Ibo time travel isnt like a
bus trip, point A to B over time, more like an opening to non sequential
moments in memory and dream that dont require time to elapse for their
experience.

Many of PKDs stories model this one foot in our time, the other stepping
about without time reference. Maybe he did access some ibogaine, I dont
know.  Any social historians among you have info on that?  I sure wish
Earth would hurry and create several more genius writers of the PKD
flavor. What an intellectual tall cool drink of water that would be for
us!

Dr. Tom

So I’m doing a search for the NY Times Magazine article that i was
invovled in about a million years ago(can’t remember which year.  Or who
the damned interviewer was. Nice, eh?) and of all things to come popping
up was a whole link to a Philip K Dick site.
All I need now is the time travel…
luv
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fwd: [FWD] YOU’ve Been Drafted
Date: May 18, 2005 at 3:16:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: Richard Lake <rlake@mapinc.org>
Subject: [FWD] YOU’ve Been Drafted
Date: May 18, 2005 at 2:28:53 PM EDT
To: DPFT-L@listserv.tamu.edu, drctalk@drcnet.org, hemp-talk@hemp.net, va-dpr@drcnet.org, drugwar@mindvox.com

YOU’VE BEEN DRAFTED

UNCLE SAM WANTS YOU FOR THE WAR ON DRUGS

I want to thank the over 4,400 people who have sent emails to their Representatives opposing Congressman Sensenbrenner’s draconian mandatory minimum sentencing bill. This bill is now garnering national attention.

This bill would have serious consequences for our democracy, requiring you to spy on all your neighbors, including going undercover and wearing a wire if needed. Refusing to become a spy for the government would be punishable by a mandatory prison sentence of at least two years.

We need your help to fight this bill, including your ideas.

We alerted you last week ( http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/ctt.asp?u=1876&l=93541 ) to the bill, entitled “Defending America’s Most Vulnerable: Safe Access to Drug Treatment and Child Protection Act of 2005” (H.R. 1528). Thousands of you have faxed Congress in opposition to the bill and we’ve already raised $2,000 online to fight it. Thank you!

We already told you about many of the terrible provisions in this legislation, but we are especially concerned about a section of the bill that turns every American into an agent of the state. Here’s how it works:

If you “witness” certain drug offenses taking place or “learn” that they took place you would have to report the offense to law enforcement within 24 hours and provide “full assistance” in the investigation, apprehension, and prosecution of the people involved. Failure to do so would be a crime punishable by a mandatory two year prison sentence.

Here are some examples of offenses you would have to report to the police within 24 hours:

–You see someone you know pass a joint to a 20-year old college student.

–Your cousin mentions that he bought Ecstasy for some of his college friends.

–You find out that your brother, who has kids, recently bought a small amount of marijuana to share with his wife.

–Your substance-abusing daughter recently begged her boyfriend to find her some drugs even though they’re both in drug treatment.

In each of these cases you face jail time if you don’t call the police within 24 hours. It doesn’t matter if the offender is your friend or relative. It also doesn’t matter if you need 48 hours to think about it. You have to report the person to the government within 24 hours or go to jail. You also have to assist the government in every way, including wearing a wire if needed. Refusing to cooperate would cost you at least two years in prison (possibly up to ten).   In addition to turning family member against family member, the legislation could also put many Americans into dangerous situations by forcing them to go undercover to gain evidence against strangers.

This is what we’re up against in Congress and, as I told you last week, it’s not going to be easy. Sensenbrenner, the chair of the powerful Judiciary Committee, usually gets what he wants. Lots of people are afraid to challenge him. But we have a duty to our children to stop our country from turning into a police state. I’m sure you feel this duty, as well.

Here’s what you can do:

–If you haven’t already, please e-mail your member of Congress: http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/ctt.asp?u=1876&l=93541

–Send us your creative ideas. How can we galvanize the American people against this bill? Email actionfeedback@drugpolicy.org .

–If you didn’t give money last week, please give today: http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/ctt.asp?u=1876&l=93555 . Even $25 goes a long way (for instance, $25 will allow 100 voters to fax their members of Congress in opposition to this bill.)

–Submit a letter-to-the-editor ( http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/ctt.asp?u=1876&l=93557 ) to your local paper urging your member of Congress to oppose the bill.

–Send this email to everyone you know. Unless tens of thousands of Americans speak up this bill could become law. It’s already passed out of subcommittee. The sponsor is now trying to line up the votes he needs to get it out of the full committee. From there it goes to the floor for a full House vote.

The provision that would turn Americans into spies is not the only thing wrong with this bill. Visit http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/ctt.asp?u=1876&l=93543 to read the full text of HR 1528 and learn more.

Sincerely,

Bill Piper
Director of National Affairs
Drug Policy Alliance

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: You’ve Been Drafted
Date: May 18, 2005 at 3:06:42 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A very pertinent message for those on these lists, about how if we US citizens know of or hear about a drug crime being committed, or having been committed, we’re to report it or be in trouble:

—– Original Message —– From: Bill Piper, DPAlliance
To: ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 2:07 PM
Subject: You’ve Been Drafted

May 18, 2005manage my subscription | text version

You’ve Been Drafted
Uncle Sam Wants You For the War On Drugs

Dear Preston,
I want to thank the over 4,400 people who have sent emails to their Representatives opposing Congressman Sensenbrenner’s draconian mandatory minimum sentencing bill. This bill is now garnering national attention.
This bill would have serious consequences for our democracy, requiring you to spy on all your neighbors, including going undercover and wearing a wire if needed. Refusing to become a spy for the government would be punishable by a mandatory prison sentence of at least two years.
We need your help to fight this bill, including your ideas.
We alerted you last week to the bill, entitled “Defending America’s Most Vulnerable: Safe Access to Drug Treatment and Child Protection Act of 2005” (H.R. 1528). Thousands of you have faxed Congress in opposition to the bill and we’ve already raised $2,000 online to fight it. Thank you!
We already told you about many of the terrible provisions in this legislation, but we are especially concerned about a section of the bill that turns every American into an agent of the state. Here’s how it works:
If you “witness” certain drug offenses taking place or “learn” that they took place you would have to report the offense to law enforcement within 24 hours and provide “full assistance” in the investigation, apprehension, and prosecution of the people involved. Failure to do so would be a crime punishable by a mandatory two year prison sentence.
Here are some examples of offenses you would have to report to the police within 24 hours:
–You see someone you know pass a joint to a 20-year old college student.
–Your cousin mentions that he bought Ecstasy for some of his college friends.
–You find out that your brother, who has kids, recently bought a small amount of marijuana to share with his wife.
–Your substance-abusing daughter recently begged her boyfriend to find her some drugs even though they’re both in drug treatment.
In each of these cases you face jail time if you don’t call the police within 24 hours. It doesn’t matter if the offender is your friend or relative. It also doesn’t matter if you need 48 hours to think about it. You have to report the person to the government within 24 hours or go to jail. You also have to assist the government in every way, including wearing a wire if needed. Refusing to cooperate would cost you at least two years in prison (possibly up to ten).   In addition to turning family member against family member, the legislation could also put many Americans into dangerous situations by forcing them to go undercover to gain evidence against strangers.
This is what we’re up against in Congress and, as I told you last week, it’s not going to be easy. Sensenbrenner, the chair of the powerful Judiciary Committee, usually gets what he wants. Lots of people are afraid to challenge him. But we have a duty to our children to stop our country from turning into a police state. I’m sure you feel this duty, as well.
Here’s what you can do:
–If you haven’t already, please e-mail your member of Congress.
–Send us your creative ideas. How can we galvanize the American people against this bill? Email us.
–If you didn’t give money last week, please give today. Even $25 goes a long way (for instance, $25 will allow 100 voters to fax their members of Congress in opposition to this bill.)
–Submit a letter-to-the-editor to your local paper urging your member of Congress to oppose the bill.
–Send this email to everyone you know. Unless tens of thousands of Americans speak up this bill could become law. It’s already passed out of subcommittee. The sponsor is now trying to line up the votes he needs to get it out of the full committee. From there it goes to the floor for a full House vote.
The provision that would turn Americans into spies is not the only thing wrong with this bill. Click here to read the full text of HR 1528 and learn more.
Sincerely,
Bill Piper
Director of National Affairs
Drug Policy Alliance

Learn More

Contact the Drug Policy Alliance:

Drug Policy Alliance
70 West 36th Street, 16th Floor
New York, NY 10018

For subscription problems please contact
Jeanette Irwin, Director, Internet Communications
jirwin@drugpolicy.org | 202.216.0035

In this Alliance Action Network Alert we need you to:

To view other actions, see actions you’ve completed, or edit your profile please visit the Alliance Personal Action Center

DrugPolicy.org | Take Action | Donate | Privacy Policy

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++
You received this message because ptpeet@nyc.rr.com is a member of the mailing list originating from alerts@actioncenter.drugpolicy.org.

Please visit http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/unsubscribe to unsubscribe from all lists. Visit http://actioncenter.drugpolicy.org/managesubscription.asp to learn about other lists you can subscribe to.

For problems, please contact Jeanette Irwin at jirwin@drugpolicy.org.

Please consider joining the Drug Policy Alliance: http://www.drugpolicy.org/join

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 3:03:01 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The Fang are a vigorous people. Life has a different value in
Africa, in that death at all ages is more common.<

I guess I don’t doubt the assertion that they have deaths from ibogaine in Africa, but somehow seem to doubt that they’re more “vigorous” than the average non-African jane/joe, or that death at all ages is more common there than here. I mean, I don’t really know either way, but it seems to me that’s a pretty broad statement. Life might have a different value, but I’m unsure it equals “less” value than we hold it in here.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 1:22 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

People do die in Africa. It is viewed as due to a flaw in the
person, perhaps due to an unconfessed sin. Fang Bwiti are said take
higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have originally
gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer deaths.

The Fang are a vigorous people. Life has a different value in
Africa, in that death at all ages is more common.

On Wed, 18 May 2005 10:02:49 -0700 Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
wrote:
I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the

benefit
of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that
have l! ost
loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts<

RAther rushed and busy this end of the internet, but Shelly, I
just wanted
to write and say “thank you” for posting this comment.
I wrote some more, haughty and slightly angry stuff here but
deleted it, it
isn’t important. The important part is that you hit the nail on
the head-
yes, there may very well be some risks with ibogaine, but if the
natives can
take it without doctors and heartmonitors why can’t we? I’m
curious as to
whether the natives in Gabon ever have any deaths?
Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is

often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: shelley krupa
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I
detoxed
twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that
time ,the MD
said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I
remember
being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in
mexico,I figure
the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the
ones I
work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get
free
anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never
experienced
before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical
kinda
setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to
inquire about
another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from
ibogaine , &
that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last
detox I did
was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3
times
before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best
results
ever psychologically &am! p; spiritually, (3 months clean this
time &
counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very
mild
,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw
up at my
hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole
ends up
carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances
to
consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the
quintessential risk
taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug
just able to
cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV
insanity, so I’d
risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of

doing
ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have
easily done
that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly
elevated even,
with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those
african folks
do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely

no
disresect to those that have l! ost loved ones ,or that help
others, just my
thoughts ,love shell

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko wrote:
Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
He took IBO in the
evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
to have a harder impact
when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
enough!) and he constantly
felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
of enormous blood
pressure.

He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
night), and his pulse and
blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
heighten, but within normal.
During these measurements he felt as before, and
complained to the doctor
all the time. When the doctor told him that his
pulse and ! blood pressure
are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
normal. All the pressure
was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
physical plane – at
all!!)

He was taken back home, and had some divine
experience afterwards ;-))

This case was obviously a psychological one.

I know from experience that very high pulse is
possible; but its duration
isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
waves.

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
Standard Time,
> my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
> Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
medical
> supervision to counteract the potential side
effects
> of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
pulse
> (amo! ng other things). This is rather easy to do
with
> drugs such as Inderal and the like
> Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
pressure or pulse for that matter
> went up much at all. My mother could tell you
better than me. She’s a nurse
> practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
took my blood pressure once
> and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
wasn’t ever much of a change. I
> think this just goes to show that no two
treatments will ever be alike with
> something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
provider checked on me, he
> could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
This thing bothers me a lot.
> I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
and taken the treatment.
> I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
give me some time and
&g! t; > consideration after I cornered them at the
conference, or wherever I could find them. I
> was never put off by the way, everyone was very
nice and treated me with
> respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
these people it was that they all
> cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
everyone pointing fingers at
> someone who they know deep down was devastated by
the death occurring during
> the treatment? It happens in the states, it
happens in Europe, and it happens in
> Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
calculated risk. So is
> driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
> I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
down home, but there is so
> much more to learn about it that I have come to
the realization that! it is
> going to take an enormous amount of money, and
research, to ever completely
> figure it out. Back to square one again.
Randy
>

/]=—————————————————————-

—–=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

]=—————————————————————–

—-=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=—————————————————————-

—–=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
]=—————————————————————–

—-=[/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Philip K Dick
Date: May 18, 2005 at 2:25:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So I’m doing a search for the NY Times Magazine article that i was
invovled in about a million years ago(can’t remember which year.  Or
who the damned interviewer was. Nice, eh?) and of all things to come
popping up was a whole link to a Philip K Dick site.
All I need now is the time travel…
luv
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – low dose treatment Shelley
Date: May 18, 2005 at 2:03:34 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Lee, I agree theres nothing like the flood for spiritual lift ,but regardless , i had a great experience with the gradual ,I dont think its usually done gradualiy  for short acting opiates ,but It was intense enough anyway ,vomit & all! It was alot quicker recovery time for me . I dont know how much the hep c interplays with the whatchacallit enzyme that lets noribogaine process ,or my overall sensitivity.I do believe low dose given at intervals like I had worked the best ever.It provides another option for those unwilling to be flooded, Ive heard discussions like “how important is the flood in overall picture for a detox?” Maybe it is safer as well as youre not processing as much at one time. But keep in mind that I was treated in Mexico ,they use 13-14 mg / kg for women, which is kinda low, so I had residual withdrawal then & that enters into my overall assessment of how effective it all is . Who knows how much timing plays in as well. Interesting issues huh?I wouldnt trade my experiences with the flood for anything, but eventually the noribogaine wears off & for me, the intense spiritual aha’s wane,then ,the real work begins,for which I’m better prepared & willing to be focused on this time. The best I did was my third, which I had stayed off opiates for 48 hours ,had a very brief slip/habit ,so I was cleaner overall- now that was awesome!I’d be interested in others take on this stuff,love shell

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Shelley,

I am really curious. You say you did a low dose regiem over a number of days. Was there any reason why you didn’t do that in the first place? Is there a minimum level of dose one can take to remain effective? It seems to me that different providers work in different ways. Some give the full dose and others step dose. Spiritually the two can be quite different imo but from the point of view of addiction treatment does the step dose regiem prove any less effective than the full dose or does it depend on the level of addiction? Seems to me it can be a lot easier on the person.

Lee

shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I detoxed twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that time ,the MD said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I remember being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in mexico,I figure the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the ones I work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get free anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never experienced before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical kinda setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to inquire about another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from ibogaine , & that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last detox I did was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3 times before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best results ever psychologically & spiritually, (3 months clean this time & counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very mild ,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw up at my hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole ends up carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances to consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the quintessential risk taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug just able to cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV insanity, so I’d risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of doing ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have easily done that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly elevated even, with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that have lost loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts ,love shell

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko wrote:
> Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
> He took IBO in the
> evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
> to have a harder impact
> when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
> enough!) and he constantly
> felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
> of enormous blood
> pressure.
>
> He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
> night), and his pulse and
> blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
> heighten, but within normal.
> During these measurements he felt as before, and
> complained to the doctor
> all the time. When the doctor told him that his
> pulse and blood pressure
> are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
> normal. All the pressure
> was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
> physical plane – at
> all!!)
>
> He was taken back home, and had some divine
> experience afterwards ;-))
>
> This case was obviously a psychological one.
>
> I know from experience that very high pulse is
> possible; but its duration
> isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
> waves.
>
> Marko
>
> On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
> Standard Time,
> > my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
> > Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
> medical
> > supervision to counteract the potential side
> effects
> > of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
> pulse
> > (among other things). This is rather easy to do
> with
> > drugs such as Inderal and the like
> > Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
> pressure or pulse for that matter
> > went up much at all. My mother could tell you
> better than me. She’s a nurse
> > practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
> took my blood pressure once
> > and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
> wasn’t ever much of a change. I
> > think this just goes to show that no two
> treatments will ever be alike with
> > something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
> provider checked on me, he
> > could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
> This thing bothers me a lot.
> > I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
> and taken the treatment.
> > I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
> give me some time and
> > consideration after I cornered them at the
> conference, or wherever I could find them. I
> > was never put off by the way, everyone was very
> nice and treated me with
> > respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
> these people it was that they all
> > cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
> everyone pointing fingers at
> > someone who they know deep down was devastated by
> the death occurring during
> > the treatment? It happens in the states, it
> happens in Europe, and it happens in
> > Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
> calculated risk. So is
> > driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
> scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
> > I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
> down home, but there is so
> > much more to learn about it that I have come to
> the realization that it is
> > going to take an enormous amount of money, and
> research, to ever completely
> > figure it out. Back to square one again.
> Randy
> >
>
>
>
>
>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>
>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 1:38:44 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well since they have seen death they are not afraid of death….its the rebirth cycle that is scary….heh…

Namaste
Matthew

Powerful parental controls improve your peace of mind with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] fwd…fwd..what we become
Date: May 18, 2005 at 1:26:41 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Cosmic Cookie

                           Consciousness is the Creative Source.
                                 We are this Consciousness.
                                We are this Creative Source.
                          Consciousness is the Enabler of Thought.
                              Thought is the Almighty Creator.

                                      The World of Man
                            is Thought converted into Activity.
                          The Universe is Expressed Consciousness.
                           Reality is the Expression of our Mind.
                                   What we see around us
                           is the Mirror Image of Mankind’s Mind.

                           WHAT WE THINK… IS… WHAT WE BECOME
Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 1:22:35 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

People do die in Africa. It is viewed as due to a flaw in the
person, perhaps due to an unconfessed sin. Fang Bwiti are said take
higher doses and approach the point of the heart stopping, while
the older Mitsogo Bwiti church (the tribe said to have originally
gotten it from the Pygmies) take lower doses and have fewer deaths.

The Fang are a vigorous people. Life has a different value in
Africa, in that death at all ages is more common.

On Wed, 18 May 2005 10:02:49 -0700 Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
wrote:
I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the

benefit
of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that
have l! ost
loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts<

RAther rushed and busy this end of the internet, but Shelly, I
just wanted
to write and say “thank you” for posting this comment.
I wrote some more, haughty and slightly angry stuff here but
deleted it, it
isn’t important. The important part is that you hit the nail on
the head-
yes, there may very well be some risks with ibogaine, but if the
natives can
take it without doctors and heartmonitors why can’t we? I’m
curious as to
whether the natives in Gabon ever have any deaths?
Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is

often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: shelley krupa
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I
detoxed
twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that
time ,the MD
said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I
remember
being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in
mexico,I figure
the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the
ones I
work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get
free
anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never
experienced
before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical
kinda
setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to
inquire about
another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from
ibogaine , &
that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last
detox I did
was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3
times
before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best
results
ever psychologically &am! p; spiritually, (3 months clean this
time &
counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very
mild
,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw
up at my
hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole
ends up
carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances
to
consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the
quintessential risk
taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug
just able to
cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV
insanity, so I’d
risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of

doing
ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have
easily done
that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly
elevated even,
with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those
african folks
do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely

no
disresect to those that have l! ost loved ones ,or that help
others, just my
thoughts ,love shell

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko wrote:
Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
He took IBO in the
evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
to have a harder impact
when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
enough!) and he constantly
felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
of enormous blood
pressure.

He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
night), and his pulse and
blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
heighten, but within normal.
During these measurements he felt as before, and
complained to the doctor
all the time. When the doctor told him that his
pulse and ! blood pressure
are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
normal. All the pressure
was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
physical plane – at
all!!)

He was taken back home, and had some divine
experience afterwards ;-))

This case was obviously a psychological one.

I know from experience that very high pulse is
possible; but its duration
isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
waves.

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
medical
supervision to counteract the potential side
effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
pulse
(amo! ng other things). This is rather easy to do
with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
pressure or pulse for that matter
went up much at all. My mother could tell you
better than me. She’s a nurse
practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
took my blood pressure once
and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
wasn’t ever much of a change. I
think this just goes to show that no two
treatments will ever be alike with
something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
provider checked on me, he
could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
This thing bothers me a lot.
I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
and taken the treatment.
I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
give me some time and
&g! t; > consideration after I cornered them at the
conference, or wherever I could find them. I
was never put off by the way, everyone was very
nice and treated me with
respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
these people it was that they all
cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
everyone pointing fingers at
someone who they know deep down was devastated by
the death occurring during
the treatment? It happens in the states, it
happens in Europe, and it happens in
Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
calculated risk. So is
driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
down home, but there is so
much more to learn about it that I have come to
the realization that! it is
going to take an enormous amount of money, and
research, to ever completely
figure it out. Back to square one again.
Randy

/]=—————————————————————-

—–=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

]=—————————————————————–

—-=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=—————————————————————-

—–=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
]=—————————————————————–

—-=[/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 1:02:49 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that have l! ost loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts<

RAther rushed and busy this end of the internet, but Shelly, I just wanted to write and say “thank you” for posting this comment.
I wrote some more, haughty and slightly angry stuff here but deleted it, it isn’t important. The important part is that you hit the nail on the head- yes, there may very well be some risks with ibogaine, but if the natives can take it without doctors and heartmonitors why can’t we? I’m curious as to whether the natives in Gabon ever have any deaths?
Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: shelley krupa
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 10:30 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I detoxed twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that time ,the MD said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I remember being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in mexico,I figure the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the ones I work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get free anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never experienced before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical kinda setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to inquire about another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from ibogaine , & that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last detox I did was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3 times before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best results ever psychologically &am! p; spiritually, (3 months clean this time & counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very mild ,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw up at my hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole ends up carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances to consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the quintessential risk taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug just able to cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV insanity, so I’d risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of doing ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have easily done that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly elevated even, with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that have l! ost loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts ,love shell

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko wrote:
Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
He took IBO in the
evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
to have a harder impact
when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
enough!) and he constantly
felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
of enormous blood
pressure.

He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
night), and his pulse and
blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
heighten, but within normal.
During these measurements he felt as before, and
complained to the doctor
all the time. When the doctor told him that his
pulse and ! blood pressure
are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
normal. All the pressure
was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
physical plane – at
all!!)

He was taken back home, and had some divine
experience afterwards ;-))

This case was obviously a psychological one.

I know from experience that very high pulse is
possible; but its duration
isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
waves.

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

> In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
Standard Time,
> my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
> Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
medical
> supervision to counteract the potential side
effects
> of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
pulse
> (amo! ng other things). This is rather easy to do
with
> drugs such as Inderal and the like
> Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
pressure or pulse for that matter
> went up much at all. My mother could tell you
better than me. She’s a nurse
> practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
took my blood pressure once
> and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
wasn’t ever much of a change. I
> think this just goes to show that no two
treatments will ever be alike with
> something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
provider checked on me, he
> could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
This thing bothers me a lot.
> I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
and taken the treatment.
> I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
give me some time and
&g! t; > consideration after I cornered them at the
conference, or wherever I could find them. I
> was never put off by the way, everyone was very
nice and treated me with
> respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
these people it was that they all
> cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
everyone pointing fingers at
> someone who they know deep down was devastated by
the death occurring during
> the treatment? It happens in the states, it
happens in Europe, and it happens in
> Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
calculated risk. So is
> driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
> I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
down home, but there is so
> much more to learn about it that I have come to
the realization that! it is
> going to take an enormous amount of money, and
research, to ever completely
> figure it out. Back to square one again.
Randy
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Todd Morgan <sovntm@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 12:13:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy,

I’m not sure what you mean when you say “Why is
everyone pointing fingers at someone who they know
deep down was devastated by the death occurring during

the treatment?”

I’m certainly not pointing anything at anyone.  As I
alluded to in my post yesterday I had just read
yesterday in post that referenced someone who had
passed on while using Ibo.  And as I said yesterday
… my sincere condolences go out to that persons
loved ones.  I mean that.

Other than that I was simply trying to share with the
group a pharmaceutical solution to what I perceive to
be one of Ibo’s dangerous side effects.  That’s all.

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under medical
supervision to counteract the potential side effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps) pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood pressure
or pulse for that matter
went up much at all. My mother could tell you better
than me. She’s a nurse
practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
took my blood pressure once
and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
wasn’t ever much of a change. I
think this just goes to show that no two treatments
will ever be alike with
something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
provider checked on me, he
could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
This thing bothers me a lot.
I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
and taken the treatment.
I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to give
me some time and
consideration after I cornered them at the
conference, or wherever I could find them. I
was never put off by the way, everyone was very nice
and treated me with
respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
these people it was that they all
cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
everyone pointing fingers at
someone who they know deep down was devastated by
the death occurring during
the treatment? It happens in the states, it happens
in Europe, and it happens in
Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
calculated risk. So is
driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
down home, but there is so
much more to learn about it that I have come to the
realization that it is
going to take an enormous amount of money, and
research, to ever completely
figure it out. Back to square one again.       Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble – low dose treatment Shelley
Date: May 18, 2005 at 12:01:19 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Shelley,

I am really curious. You say you did a low dose regiem over a number of days. Was there any reason why you didn’t do that in the first place? Is there a minimum level of dose one can take to remain effective? It seems to me that different providers work in different ways. Some give the full dose and others step dose. Spiritually the two can be quite different imo but from the point of view of addiction treatment does the step dose regiem prove any less effective than the full dose or does it depend on the level of addiction? Seems to me it can be a lot easier on the person.

Lee

shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I detoxed twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that time ,the MD said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I remember being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in mexico,I figure the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the ones I work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get free anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never experienced before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical kinda setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to inquire about another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from ibogaine , & that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last detox I did was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3 times before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best results ever psychologically & spiritually, (3 months clean this time & counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very mild ,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw up at my hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole ends up carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances to consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the quintessential risk taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug just able to cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV insanity, so I’d risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of doing ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have easily done that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly elevated even, with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that have lost loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts ,love shell

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko wrote:
> Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
> He took IBO in the
> evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
> to have a harder impact
> when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
> enough!) and he constantly
> felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
> of enormous blood
> pressure.
>
> He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
> night), and his pulse and
> blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
> heighten, but within normal.
> During these measurements he felt as before, and
> complained to the doctor
> all the time. When the doctor told him that his
> pulse and blood pressure
> are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
> normal. All the pressure
> was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
> physical plane – at
> all!!)
>
> He was taken back home, and had some divine
> experience afterwards ;-))
>
> This case was obviously a psychological one.
>
> I know from experience that very high pulse is
> possible; but its duration
> isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
> waves.
>
> Marko
>
> On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
> Standard Time,
> > my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
> > Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
> medical
> > supervision to counteract the potential side
> effects
> > of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
> pulse
> > (among other things). This is rather easy to do
> with
> > drugs such as Inderal and the like
> > Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
> pressure or pulse for that matter
> > went up much at all. My mother could tell you
> better than me. She’s a nurse
> > practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
> took my blood pressure once
> > and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
> wasn’t ever much of a change. I
> > think this just goes to show that no two
> treatments will ever be alike with
> > something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
> provider checked on me, he
> > could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
> This thing bothers me a lot.
> > I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
> and taken the treatment.
> > I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
> give me some time and
> > consideration after I cornered them at the
> conference, or wherever I could find them. I
> > was never put off by the way, everyone was very
> nice and treated me with
> > respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
> these people it was that they all
> > cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
> everyone pointing fingers at
> > someone who they know deep down was devastated by
> the death occurring during
> > the treatment? It happens in the states, it
> happens in Europe, and it happens in
> > Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
> calculated risk. So is
> > driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
> scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
> > I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
> down home, but there is so
> > much more to learn about it that I have come to
> the realization that it is
> > going to take an enormous amount of money, and
> research, to ever completely
> > figure it out. Back to square one again.
> Randy
> >
>
>
>
>
>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>
>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 10:30:34 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi All,interesting discussion! Regarding the clinic in Mexico, I detoxed twice there.I remember being informed about the risks & at that time ,the MD said no deaths have occured ,perhaps that has changed ,no doubt.I remember being told very clearly that it was a research drug there in mexico,I figure the “rules” governing research drugs are kinda different then the ones I work with as a nurse here.I knew the risks, but i chose to get free anyway.They were VERY attentive & caring,like Ive never experienced before.Ive done iboga two more times since then,in non medical kinda setting, but i remember calling Randy Hencken the last time to inquire about another round ,he said youve learned about all you can from ibogaine , & that turned out to not be the case,I’m happy to say. The last detox I did was a low dose regimen over 2-3 days,since I had had the flood 3 times before I didnt feel like I was missing out,but i’ve had the best results ever psychologically & spiritually, (3 months clean this time & counting!)I did the booster a week ago & even thought it was very mild ,great results as well!! I’m reminded of how when theres a screw up at my hospital job ,the nurse ,or the person lowest on the totem pole ends up carrying the blame ,even thought there are so many circumstances to consider.I feel like I ( and probably others ) am the quintessential risk taker with my health & survival,doing highest dose of any drug just able to cheat death & thinking that was fun,not to mention the IV insanity, so I’d risk it all for ibogaine for sure.I was scared I’d be ruled out of doing ibogaine each time as I have hep c & my liver enzymes could have easily done that ,but I am blessed ,each time the enzymes were so mildly elevated even, with all the tylenol I was taking .I also wonder how all those african folks do ibogaine without the benefit of halters & cpr?I mean absolutely no disresect to those that have lost loved ones ,or that help others, just my thoughts ,love shell

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko wrote:
> Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
> He took IBO in the
> evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
> to have a harder impact
> when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
> enough!) and he constantly
> felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
> of enormous blood
> pressure.
>
> He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
> night), and his pulse and
> blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
> heighten, but within normal.
> During these measurements he felt as before, and
> complained to the doctor
> all the time. When the doctor told him that his
> pulse and blood pressure
> are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
> normal. All the pressure
> was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
> physical plane – at
> all!!)
>
> He was taken back home, and had some divine
> experience afterwards ;-))
>
> This case was obviously a psychological one.
>
> I know from experience that very high pulse is
> possible; but its duration
> isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
> waves.
>
> Marko
>
> On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
>
> > In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
> Standard Time,
> > my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
> > Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
> medical
> > supervision to counteract the potential side
> effects
> > of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
> pulse
> > (among other things). This is rather easy to do
> with
> > drugs such as Inderal and the like
> > Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
> pressure or pulse for that matter
> > went up much at all. My mother could tell you
> better than me. She’s a nurse
> > practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
> took my blood pressure once
> > and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
> wasn’t ever much of a change. I
> > think this just goes to show that no two
> treatments will ever be alike with
> > something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
> provider checked on me, he
> > could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
> This thing bothers me a lot.
> > I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
> and taken the treatment.
> > I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
> give me some time and
> > consideration after I cornered them at the
> conference, or wherever I could find them. I
> > was never put off by the way, everyone was very
> nice and treated me with
> > respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
> these people it was that they all
> > cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
> everyone pointing fingers at
> > someone who they know deep down was devastated by
> the death occurring during
> > the treatment? It happens in the states, it
> happens in Europe, and it happens in
> > Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
> calculated risk. So is
> > driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
> scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
> > I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
> down home, but there is so
> > much more to learn about it that I have come to
> the realization that it is
> > going to take an enormous amount of money, and
> research, to ever completely
> > figure it out. Back to square one again.
> Randy
> >
>
>
>
>
>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>
>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 10:26:23 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes, something that has to be appreciated before anyone talks about heart
stuff and ibogaine is the difference between what is subjectively
experienced and what a machine hooked up to your body will tell you. My
experience is that it is pretty much normal for people taking ibo to
experience that their heart is beating faster, more powerfully, whatever.
This is one of a range of physical sensations, which usually includes
pulsings and all sorts of weird rhythms, frequently African sounding, which
come on in the body. Doesn’t mean it is actually happening in your physical
body.

The drug will crank you up to a new frequency basically. And there can be a
lot of anxiety around this process, a lot of fear. If you’re not careful it
can just go round and round in the mind and, before you know it, you’ve
convinced yourself all sorts of crazy shit is happening to you. Maybe this
fear will even create physical problems that lead to actual arhythmia or
whatever. Who knows? For sure it’s possible. You have to keep your feet on
the ground with this drug. You can still fly but you need to keep you feet
on the ground.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: Marko [mailto:marko@mindvox.com]
Sent: 18 May 2005 11:36
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s. He took IBO in the
evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems to have a harder impact
when taken at night, and IBO is already strong enough!) and he constantly
felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode of enormous blood
pressure.

He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the night), and his pulse and
blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit heighten, but within normal.
During these measurements he felt as before, and complained to the doctor
all the time. When the doctor told him that his pulse and blood pressure
are normal, all his perceiving of them went to normal. All the pressure
was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the physical plane – at
all!!)

He was taken back home, and had some divine experience afterwards ;-))

This case was obviously a psychological one.

I know from experience that very high pulse is possible; but its duration
isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in waves.

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under medical
supervision to counteract the potential side effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps) pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood pressure or pulse
for that matter
went up much at all. My mother could tell you better than me.
She’s a nurse
practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she took my blood
pressure once
and checked my pulse a couple of times but there wasn’t ever
much of a change. I
think this just goes to show that no two treatments will ever
be alike with
something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My provider
checked on me, he
could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig? This thing
bothers me a lot.
I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects, and taken
the treatment.
I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to give me some time and
consideration after I cornered them at the conference, or
wherever I could find them. I
was never put off by the way, everyone was very nice and
treated me with
respect. If I got one feeling from every one of these people it
was that they all
cared very much about what they were doing. Why is everyone
pointing fingers at
someone who they know deep down was devastated by the death
occurring during
the treatment? It happens in the states, it happens in Europe,
and it happens in
Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A calculated risk. So is
driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the scheme of
things, about Ibogaine.
I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say down home,
but there is so
much more to learn about it that I have come to the realization
that it is
going to take an enormous amount of money, and research, to
ever completely
figure it out. Back to square one again.       Randy

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT….. Do Bears shit in the woods?
Date: May 18, 2005 at 9:13:11 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

J, see, ya gotta get personal don’t ya. Seems like the last time this came up you AND Steve Anker fucked with me. I just know that Steve is going to show up soon. We can hope.   Randy

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT….. Do Bears shit in the woods?
Date: May 18, 2005 at 8:18:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Guys,

I think we need to all cool down. I understand your anger Randy and once again I apologise.

We all have different things going on here.

Its difficult all round and for my own reasons I got into a discussion that I felt needed airing. Sorry if my surprise at the facts got the better of my more diplomatic side and I did not take some of the reality into account. But maybe its a discussion that was needed?

I am really sorry for the offense caused. I think you are a great guy and I hope we meet so we can all better understand where we are coming from.

Things get screwed up on the list. It’s not a perfect medium.

We need to step back and realise we are all on the same side and we are not living in a perfect world but maybe we can do something to make things better?

Lee

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:
Those days are kinda…………………fuzzy.

like your “research”

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
> Let me tell you, bears most definitely shit in the
> woods. At least they do in
> Catskill New York. We had one come to the house
> about 4 or 5 days ago but we
> didn’t know for sure what it was. After last night
> we know. It ate all the
> bird feeders, generally created a ruckus, and then
> took a dump right on the trail
> we walk on every day. From the looks of it it was a
> BIG bear. You know
> looking at the bears behavior it wasn’t much
> different from me on a good drunk, or
> after about 500 mgs of Tuinal or something. I don’t
> think I ever shit in
> someone’s driveway, but I can’t swear to it. Those
> days are
> kinda…………………fuzzy. Randy
>

Discover Yahoo!
Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Marko <marko@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 7:56:50 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Truth? Check for yourself. Connect to 33rd dimension, it’s there.

(Days of the New, http://sacrament.kibla.si/)

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005, Morning Wood wrote:

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko <marko@mindvox.com> wrote:
Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
He took IBO in the
evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
to have a harder impact
when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
enough!) and he constantly
felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
of enormous blood
pressure.

He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
night), and his pulse and
blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
heighten, but within normal.
During these measurements he felt as before, and
complained to the doctor
all the time. When the doctor told him that his
pulse and blood pressure
are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
normal. All the pressure
was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
physical plane – at
all!!)

He was taken back home, and had some divine
experience afterwards ;-))

This case was obviously a psychological one.

I know from experience that very high pulse is
possible; but its duration
isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
waves.

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
medical
supervision to counteract the potential side
effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do
with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
pressure or pulse for that matter
went up much at all. My mother could tell you
better than me. She’s a nurse
practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
took my blood pressure once
and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
wasn’t ever much of a change. I
think this just goes to show that no two
treatments will ever be alike with
something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
provider checked on me, he
could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
This thing bothers me a lot.
I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
and taken the treatment.
I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
give me some time and
consideration after I cornered them at the
conference, or wherever I could find them. I
was never put off by the way, everyone was very
nice and treated me with
respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
these people it was that they all
cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
everyone pointing fingers at
someone who they know deep down was devastated by
the death occurring during
the treatment? It happens in the states, it
happens in Europe, and it happens in
Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
calculated risk. So is
driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
down home, but there is so
much more to learn about it that I have come to
the realization that it is
going to take an enormous amount of money, and
research, to ever completely
figure it out. Back to square one again.
Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] link from mindvox
Date: May 18, 2005 at 8:00:47 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://action.eff.org/site/PageServer?pagename=ADV_homepage

Discover Yahoo!
Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT….. Do Bears shit in the woods?
Date: May 18, 2005 at 7:59:00 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Those days are kinda…………………fuzzy.

like your “research”

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Let me tell you, bears most definitely shit in the
woods. At least they do in
Catskill New York. We had one come to the house
about 4 or 5 days ago but we
didn’t know for sure what it was. After last night
we know. It ate all the
bird feeders, generally created a ruckus, and then
took a dump right on the trail
we walk on every day. From the looks of it it was a
BIG bear. You know
looking at the bears behavior it wasn’t much
different from me on a good drunk, or
after about 500 mgs of Tuinal or something. I don’t
think I ever shit in
someone’s driveway, but I can’t swear to it. Those
days are
kinda…………………fuzzy.    Randy

Discover Yahoo!
Have fun online with music videos, cool games, IM and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/online.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 7:56:53 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m curious what you might have to say about truth, if
you find the time.

be well mr semi colon,
j

— Marko <marko@mindvox.com> wrote:
Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s.
He took IBO in the
evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems
to have a harder impact
when taken at night, and IBO is already strong
enough!) and he constantly
felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode
of enormous blood
pressure.

He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the
night), and his pulse and
blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit
heighten, but within normal.
During these measurements he felt as before, and
complained to the doctor
all the time. When the doctor told him that his
pulse and blood pressure
are normal, all his perceiving of them went to
normal. All the pressure
was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the
physical plane – at
all!!)

He was taken back home, and had some divine
experience afterwards ;-))

This case was obviously a psychological one.

I know from experience that very high pulse is
possible; but its duration
isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in
waves.

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern
Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under
medical
supervision to counteract the potential side
effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps)
pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do
with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood
pressure or pulse for that matter
went up much at all. My mother could tell you
better than me. She’s a nurse
practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she
took my blood pressure once
and checked my pulse a couple of times but there
wasn’t ever much of a change. I
think this just goes to show that no two
treatments will ever be alike with
something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My
provider checked on me, he
could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig?
This thing bothers me a lot.
I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects,
and taken the treatment.
I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to
give me some time and
consideration after I cornered them at the
conference, or wherever I could find them. I
was never put off by the way, everyone was very
nice and treated me with
respect. If I got one feeling from every one of
these people it was that they all
cared very much about what they were doing. Why is
everyone pointing fingers at
someone who they know deep down was devastated by
the death occurring during
the treatment? It happens in the states, it
happens in Europe, and it happens in
Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A
calculated risk. So is
driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the
scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say
down home, but there is so
much more to learn about it that I have come to
the realization that it is
going to take an enormous amount of money, and
research, to ever completely
figure it out. Back to square one again.
Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] OT….. Do Bears shit in the woods?
Date: May 18, 2005 at 7:54:29 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Let me tell you, bears most definitely shit in the woods. At least they do in Catskill New York. We had one come to the house about 4 or 5 days ago but we didn’t know for sure what it was. After last night we know. It ate all the bird feeders, generally created a ruckus, and then took a dump right on the trail we walk on every day. From the looks of it it was a BIG bear. You know looking at the bears behavior it wasn’t much different from me on a good drunk, or after about 500 mgs of Tuinal or something. I don’t think I ever shit in someone’s driveway, but I can’t swear to it. Those days are kinda…………………fuzzy.    Randy

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] A step back – a touch of reality
Date: May 18, 2005 at 7:07:16 AM EDT
To: Ibogaine List <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,

I think maybe we are losing the thread of reality here – well me at least.

There are all kinds of extenuating circumstances that none of us are aware of that don’t come out on this list.

I am sorry if my posts seem to be attacking particular people – thats not what I meant. The whole issue got me going I am afraid. The work that is being done is being done under difficult circumstances and I for one do not want to make it any more difficult than it is which is why I am truely sorry if that is the effect my posts have had. Its work which while not perfect is definitely way better than none at all.

So I realise this discussion is perhaps not having the effect I hoped it would have, i.e., it’s backfiring. For that I apologise and say sorry from the bottom of my heart to anyone who feels I undermined their good work. Indeed I apologise to anyone who has had the unfortunate experience of tragedy in treatment and did the best they could under difficult circumstances. Nobody should point a finger their way. Once again if I came across like that I deeply apologise. That was not my intention. I have to admit that while I try to be completely motivated by the best intentions there are times when I get carried away. I need to work on my ego a little more.

Unfortunately here in Europe we are out of the loop and we really do not know what is going on.

While this list is a great place for discussions it is lacking the personal contact needed to put things into a real perspective. Personally I would like to come over to the US and get more acquainted with the reality on the ground.

Once again sorry and I ask anyone who feels that things are not right to realise its not those who are providing the service that are not right but the system that has pushed them into that situation. I think we should all give 100% support to everyone doing the best they can to lift people out of their suffering. And if there are concerns to try and deal with them constructively.

Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Marko <marko@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 6:35:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Years ago, I received a report from male in his 20s. He took IBO in the
evening (what I see as a mistake; every drug seems to have a harder impact
when taken at night, and IBO is already strong enough!) and he constantly
felt like his hearth and blood vessels would explode of enormous blood
pressure.

He was taken to the doctor (in the middle of the night), and his pulse and
blood pressure were measured. Both were a bit heighten, but within normal.
During these measurements he felt as before, and complained to the doctor
all the time. When the doctor told him that his pulse and blood pressure
are normal, all his perceiving of them went to normal. All the pressure
was gone in an instant (and, there was none – in the physical plane – at
all!!)

He was taken back home, and had some divine experience afterwards ;-))

This case was obviously a psychological one.

I know from experience that very high pulse is possible; but its duration
isn’t constant for hours, it comes and goes in waves.

Marko

On Wed, 18 May 2005 BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under medical
supervision to counteract the potential side effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps) pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood pressure or pulse for that matter
went up much at all. My mother could tell you better than me. She’s a nurse
practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she took my blood pressure once
and checked my pulse a couple of times but there wasn’t ever much of a change. I
think this just goes to show that no two treatments will ever be alike with
something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My provider checked on me, he
could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig? This thing bothers me a lot.
I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects, and taken the treatment.
I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to give me some time and
consideration after I cornered them at the conference, or wherever I could find them. I
was never put off by the way, everyone was very nice and treated me with
respect. If I got one feeling from every one of these people it was that they all
cared very much about what they were doing. Why is everyone pointing fingers at
someone who they know deep down was devastated by the death occurring during
the treatment? It happens in the states, it happens in Europe, and it happens in
Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A calculated risk. So is
driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the scheme of things, about Ibogaine.
I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say down home, but there is so
much more to learn about it that I have come to the realization that it is
going to take an enormous amount of money, and research, to ever completely
figure it out. Back to square one again.       Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 18, 2005 at 6:29:39 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Carlton,

First I want to apologise if I am being a dick. I don’t mean to be. Sometimes my ego gets the better of me.

There are a lot of good people involved doing amazing work.

I really do apologise and all I am trying to say is that maybe there is a need to look at this thing in another way. All i am asking is to try and maybe get a better handle on things.

Really sorry if I have come across the wrong way.

Lee

Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Lee, I see what you’re saying but maybe we want to take a step back here and make sure we’re attributing the right statements to the right people.  I doubt there are any providers out there fertilizing their backyard iboga bush with the rotting corpses of dead junkies.   I just see a discussion list where a small number people are so fervent about this treatment that they’re willing to ignore or trivialize the potential risks and costs.  Fortunately, I don’t think those are the people who are in the driver’s seat… we also see some reputable providers operating as prudently as possible with the information that is known, and having some success.   (A little pricey for my tastes, but we’ve been around that block before).  No doubt there are a number who fall between the two poles.   Your point seems valid but let’s be careful not paint everyone with the same brush.
—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 6:04 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s

My point is this. Its not about the number of deaths as opposed to deaths by other forms such as od, car accidents, aspirin. It’s about operating in a way that says we are with you all the way and that means we give you the whole picture before hand, we tell you the chances of survival and we note your death with dignity if it occurs. This is the human way that treats the body as a temple and respects the sanctity of the person. It’s also an out in the open way of operating that does not carry a dark shadow over it.

How does it harm anyone to LOOK at another WAY?

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “Carlton B” <carltonb@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 18, 2005 at 6:12:53 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee, I see what you’re saying but maybe we want to take a step back here and make sure we’re attributing the right statements to the right people.  I doubt there are any providers out there fertilizing their backyard iboga bush with the rotting corpses of dead junkies.   I just see a discussion list where a small number people are so fervent about this treatment that they’re willing to ignore or trivialize the potential risks and costs.  Fortunately, I don’t think those are the people who are in the driver’s seat… we also see some reputable providers operating as prudently as possible with the information that is known, and having some success.   (A little pricey for my tastes, but we’ve been around that block before).  No doubt there are a number who fall between the two poles.   Your point seems valid but let’s be careful not paint everyone with the same brush.
—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 6:04 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s

My point is this. Its not about the number of deaths as opposed to deaths by other forms such as od, car accidents, aspirin. It’s about operating in a way that says we are with you all the way and that means we give you the whole picture before hand, we tell you the chances of survival and we note your death with dignity if it occurs. This is the human way that treats the body as a temple and respects the sanctity of the person. It’s also an out in the open way of operating that does not carry a dark shadow over it.

How does it harm anyone to LOOK at another WAY?

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 5:39:55 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/18/2005 4:32:46 AM Eastern Standard Time, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk sent,
Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under medical
supervision to counteract the potential side effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps) pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do with
drugs such as Inderal and the like
Todd, I honestly don’t think that my blood pressure or pulse for that matter went up much at all. My mother could tell you better than me. She’s a nurse practitioner and saw the whole thing, I think she took my blood pressure once and checked my pulse a couple of times but there wasn’t ever much of a change. I think this just goes to show that no two treatments will ever be alike with something like Ibogaine. Too many invariables. My provider checked on me, he could tell ya, but I aint saying who he was. Dig? This thing bothers me a lot. I’ve immersed myself in Ibogaine and it’s effects, and taken the treatment. I’ve talked to everyone who was nice enough to give me some time and consideration after I cornered them at the conference, or wherever I could find them. I was never put off by the way, everyone was very nice and treated me with respect. If I got one feeling from every one of these people it was that they all cared very much about what they were doing. Why is everyone pointing fingers at someone who they know deep down was devastated by the death occurring during the treatment? It happens in the states, it happens in Europe, and it happens in Africa. Clinical setting or not, it is a risk. A calculated risk. So is driving a car. I don’t know shit, really, in the scheme of things, about Ibogaine. I’ve studied on it good, long, and hard, as we say down home, but there is so much more to learn about it that I have come to the realization that it is going to take an enormous amount of money, and research, to ever completely figure it out. Back to square one again.       Randy

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 18, 2005 at 5:04:03 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The question I am asking myself is this: is the one dose system simply asking too much of ibogaine? Maybe its not meant to be used that way?

Long term low dose use in a “normal” adult I believe offers very little risk and amazing benefits. Even a high dose in a “normal” person under the proper circumstances is low risk. But the way it is being administered for chronic addiction is like fighting a bush fire. You win some, you lose some. God help us that the situation is so desperate that it has to be this way – its like a war but at least in a war the soldier is pronounced dead and given a proper burial. Also clinics working off a long term rehabilitation program might not find it profitable to exist. Anyway, low dose treatments I believe could be carried out as an out-patient program in conjunction with an adviser – i.e. a knowledgeable provider.

Perhaps a proper program that is monitored over a year of low-dose therapy prior to full dose could be implemented giving the person time to rebuild their health as well as lower the effects of a subsequent high dose as repeated use of ibogaine leads to a lowering of its harmful effects in my experience. Maybe that is not practical to someone in a dire situation ………………..

Don’t get me wrong. i think everyone has a right to chose and if a high dose were my only choice I would probably make the same choice.

My point is this. Its not about the number of deaths as opposed to deaths by other forms such as od, car accidents, aspirin. It’s about operating in a way that says we are with you all the way and that means we give you the whole picture before hand, we tell you the chances of survival and we note your death with dignity if it occurs. This is the human way that treats the body as a temple and respects the sanctity of the person. It’s also an out in the open way of operating that does not carry a dark shadow over it.

How does it harm anyone to LOOK at another WAY?

As Nick said acting in subterfuge is not doing anyone any good imo and also feeds into a very murky modus operandus imo which is open to abuse by the unscrupulous and there are unscrupulous people out there who are hiding under the fear of the rest of the movement who want to keep the facts hidden – thats how these things happen. There is no regulation that separates the good from the bad. Have we no right to ask for an improvement in standards or should we all shut up and do what we are told by the self appointed?

On a note: much respect to all those out there putting themselves at risk to give treatments in the best way they know how. I have a lot of respect and love for you guys.

Lee

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
>How many dead bodies are there from
heroin and crack, lot more.<

Or as previously noted, Rapid Detox, or from getting raped and murdered in
prison for taking/buying/selling drugs in the first place, or being shot by
cops arresting you/your dealer/your innocent neighbor during an “oops, wrong
house drug raid,” or from taking some legal drug, like Aspirin, that they
unknowingly have an allergy to, or…ummm, well, this list could probably go
on a long time.
For some people to get angry because a very few people have died after
taking ibogaine is to me really ridiculous, considering the current
dangerous, ant-drug hysteria we live under these days.
BTW, I called NYC’s Stop Smoking hotline (311) and got a big box of free
nicotine patches the other day, and plan on beginning soon, tomorrow morning
most probably, with putting them on me instead of lighting up first thing in
the morning. Wish me luck please.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Carla Barnes”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 2:52 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s

>
> This is a weird attitude to have, that someone who
> spends more then 2 years of their time making a film
> which I’m sure cost a lot of money is obligated to
> give it away to you for free and then you can steal
> more copies of it and give them away.
>
> I haven’t seen the film yet and did complain about the
> old website not having any place to order, but thats
> got nothing to do with someone making a film and you
> feeling they owe you something. what do you do except
> post mp3s of belching and throwing up noises.
>
> So there are dead bodies, whatev happened at mexico is
> their problem and if they choose to handle it by
> pretending it didn’t happen then what does that prove
> except ibogaine with doctors isn’t any safer then the
> underground. How many dead bodies are there from
> heroin and crack, lot more. I think anyone who is
> going to take ibogaine has the right to know the risks
> but then its their choice and I dont think anyone has
> ever said its perfectly safe, every ibogaine article
> i’ve ever read online always comes with warnings. I
> know when I did it I was desperate, so i can die, so
> what, how’s that different then my life every day was
> as a junkie?
>
> Carla B
>
> — Morning Wood wrote:
>> if public relations is really the concern, it would
>> be availible on-line at no cost.
>>
>> if you want me to show it to doctors, send me a
>> copy,
>> and I will
>> burn lots of copies and give them away.
>>
>>
>> if public relations is really the concern, in the
>> interest of making ibogaine or it’s derivitives
>> availible to the people who need them (which is
>> obviouslly a worthy goal)
>>
>> just thoughts.
>>
>>
>> — BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
>> > Tink, I think we should all be showing our DR’s
>> the
>> > movie Ben shot, and
>> > giving them all the info we can get. We get enough
>> > of those guys behind us it might
>> > make a difference in how Ibogaine is scheduled.
>> Who
>> > knows? Couldn’t hoit.”
>> > Meanwhile I’m floating nicely at home in the
>> > Catskills. Thanx for askin.’
>> > Randy
>> >
>>
>>
>>
>> __________________________________
>> Yahoo! Mail Mobile
>> Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your
>> mobile phone.
>> http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail
>>
>>
>>
>>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>
>>
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>>
>
> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
> http://mail.yahoo.com
>
>
>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> [%]
>
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 4:24:14 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In my experience these effects decrease significantly with repeated use. Hence a regiem of low dose therapy can have safety effects for the subsequent higher doses imo. Lee

Todd Morgan <sovntm@yahoo.com> wrote:
Pardon me, but I didn’t see the post or read about the
poor chap that passed.

My sincere condolences

I will say that (some) of the harmful effects of Ibo,
namely the heart tachycardia and extremely high blood
pressure associated with an Ibo experience can be
ameliorated with the right supervision and medication.

Personally, I had a very pleasant physical supervisor.
And I will say that I had done my due diligence and I
knew the risks and dangers that Ibo posed for a guy
like me and I had prepared myself for the experience
both mentally and pharmacologically.

Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under medical
supervision to counteract the potential side effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps) pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do with
drugs such as Inderal and the like.

I’m no physician.

Please research and seek for thy self.

Best

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

> I have an observation here. The death that occurred
> that brought on this
> conversation happened in almost real time right on
> this list. Matter of fact there
> have been a couple of treatments happen and the list
> get a play by play.
> These all happened in the US where it is illegal. I
> don’t see that happening from
> anywhere else. So I’m assuming that you all are
> talking about what has been
> talked about here before. I read about the death in
> a clinical setting before I
> did my treatment. I read about the body in LA, and a
> couple of deaths in
> Europe, questionable exactly what happened. This is
> not new. The problem is the
> resistance we are getting to a treatment that is no
> game, taxing to the body, and
> should be done under the safest conditions possible,
> but works for some like
> nothing else. Some. If you could make a weapon from
> Ibogaine we would have all
> the facts we need and this conversation would be
> mute. Know what I mean Vern?
> The problem is Ibogaine’s legitimacy to the medical
> community. This should be
> an option to be discussed with your DR. for sure. We
> don’t have that option.
> Back to square one again. I know I had waited long
> enough to get my treatment.
> Randy
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] crystal clear for carla
Date: May 18, 2005 at 4:08:26 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

let me be very clear about something:

no body owes me anything.

and

I don’t owe anybody anything.

carla, you are still my favorite ibo yenta.

-jason

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 3:25:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Kirk,

thanks, yes sure, not all is bad! not all people are bad,my client from
last year who was shooting speedballs, is clean 11 months and expecting a
baby soon, sure there are wonderful people and things too,
but hiding the truth is a bad thing to do!
if that lady who died called me to say she didn’t have a good recovery place
I would have helped her, but she wanted to be with her friend at the
homeless shelter. when she left the house I knew she wasn’t going to make
it, because she was too confused, where to go and what to do?
I told her she could stay longer but she didn’t want to, she was clean when
she left and was going to take care of her stuff, and if there was any
problem she was supposed to call me. but she didn’t, because she didn’t
get the money together for the treatment.she was an addict from age of 13
and became 34 years old, which is a miracle that she was still alive then.
she noded out on a burning heater when it was winter, her back was burned
black, then she knew she had to stop using, there was no recovering place
for her and for so many others.

Sara

Hugs 2 You Sara
May your cynicism find it’s peace.
It’s not all bad, we’re not all bad, I refuse to think that.
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: sara119@xs4all.nl [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl]
Sent: Wednesday, 18 May 2005 6:18 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

Ethical ? not when money counts first.
if that clinic in Mexico had treated 350 people how come no one person
is around here to speak up about their experience?
I’m still waiting for plenty of people to pay me back for treatment done
5 years ago until last month.it just shows you what humans are like,people
are here to get 99% of the times, not to give 1% back. not with knowledge
, not with care, not with their promisses,or anything else. so when
humanity is so F**** most people would think who gives a shjt about few
dead bodies, there is nothing to get
there, is it?  and also they would think I rather do it cheap and take 80%
more risk of dying, but if I will stay alive then I can spend it on…
other shjt.
money speaks in all kinds of ways. you can give Donation to an
organization and lie to them but they will not say a thing about the well
known truth and publish those lies,so
they may get some more Donations next year. you can just let people hear
what they want to hear, write it on the internet and make it easier for
people who can’t think for themselves. make them think the jacuzzi and the
TV will give them a better feeling, when the truth is shjt.

and since people are just a piece of shjt most of the times, you’ll never
get to know the truth. what is the use to go to a conference and hear
lies?
sure, you can make a manipulated reseach just to show what you think is
right in your eyes, to blow up the ego.as if anything else is not
right,HUH?
“my way is the only way” even when they never experience “MY WAY” they
would convince everyone they know Better, they got the PHd after all;-)
they will not tell you take chamomille tea, they will tell you take
white pill that’s the best you can do, the reseach even proved it.

anyways, my client lady died last weekend from over dose is a homeless
shelter in Amsterdam, where I have told her many time , not to go to.
she took a treatment 4 weeks before because she didn’t have anywhere to
go.
that was the second time she didn’t pay a cent for staying almost two
weeks
at my home, not that I’m rich or anything like it, but she promissed to
pay back a week later. then she didn’t call until someone else called to
say she was found dead.
so thanks very much for the info. I believe things only when I see them
with my own eyes. and the rest is just BLA BLA BLA…

so I’m done here, have a happy day!

Sara

You would need to ask the people who had deaths, I didn’t know there
were more deaths much less this many.

It is a little strange, I haven’t looked at any of the sites in a long
time but Randy Hencken did vanish, there is no mention of him at all on
Mexico’s site.

http://www.detoxnaturally.com

His job is now being done by someone named Nathan.

You look up Randy on the internet and he was the person who took in all
the patients

http://www.google.com/search?q=randy+hencken

He used to post here all the time I thought he was busy but he does
look like he was removed not like he moved on to something else but
like he never existed at Mexico at all.

How do you plan to give a seminar when the people who supposedly know
aren’t saying anything, what’s the title of it, ‘there are more
ibogaine deaths we think’. Who, what person, when?

It doesn’t look like it’s much news to people posting to this list
either, I guess a lot of people do know. Including MAPS who posts that
they’re working with the clinic and then the clinic closed, when it’s
not closed.

http://www.maps.org/ibogaine

Everybody lied and covered something up. So much for ethical
psychedelic research.

.:vector:.

— Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement
that promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a
little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high
risk at least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may
one day erupt and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior

to treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their
own risks and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference)
on this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open

including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they
don’t care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of
not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted
anywhere
but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it.
right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers,

lots of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to
everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I
quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in
writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the
Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a

new site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine
Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and

then he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more
money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay
someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick
on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people

who all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told
to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not

much of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on
where to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very >
informative .I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People
have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever
wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings
in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have

heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure

FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over

a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for
those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Discover Yahoo!
Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 2:51:40 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hugs 2 You Sara
May your cynicism find it’s peace.
It’s not all bad, we’re not all bad, I refuse to think that.
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: sara119@xs4all.nl [mailto:sara119@xs4all.nl]
Sent: Wednesday, 18 May 2005 6:18 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

Ethical ? not when money counts first.
if that clinic in Mexico had treated 350 people how come no one person
is around here to speak up about their experience?
I’m still waiting for plenty of people to pay me back for treatment done
5 years ago until last month.it just shows you what humans are like,people
are here to get 99% of the times, not to give 1% back. not with knowledge
, not with care, not with their promisses,or anything else. so when
humanity is so F**** most people would think who gives a shjt about few
dead bodies, there is nothing to get
there, is it?  and also they would think I rather do it cheap and take 80%
more risk of dying, but if I will stay alive then I can spend it on…
other shjt.
money speaks in all kinds of ways. you can give Donation to an
organization and lie to them but they will not say a thing about the well
known truth and publish those lies,so
they may get some more Donations next year. you can just let people hear
what they want to hear, write it on the internet and make it easier for
people who can’t think for themselves. make them think the jacuzzi and the
TV will give them a better feeling, when the truth is shjt.

and since people are just a piece of shjt most of the times, you’ll never
get to know the truth. what is the use to go to a conference and hear
lies?
sure, you can make a manipulated reseach just to show what you think is
right in your eyes, to blow up the ego.as if anything else is not
right,HUH?
“my way is the only way” even when they never experience “MY WAY” they
would convince everyone they know Better, they got the PHd after all;-)
they will not tell you take chamomille tea, they will tell you take
white pill that’s the best you can do, the reseach even proved it.

anyways, my client lady died last weekend from over dose is a homeless
shelter in Amsterdam, where I have told her many time , not to go to.
she took a treatment 4 weeks before because she didn’t have anywhere to go.
that was the second time she didn’t pay a cent for staying almost two weeks
at my home, not that I’m rich or anything like it, but she promissed to
pay back a week later. then she didn’t call until someone else called to
say she was found dead.
so thanks very much for the info. I believe things only when I see them
with my own eyes. and the rest is just BLA BLA BLA…

so I’m done here, have a happy day!

Sara

You would need to ask the people who had deaths, I didn’t know there
were more deaths much less this many.

It is a little strange, I haven’t looked at any of the sites in a long
time but Randy Hencken did vanish, there is no mention of him at all on
Mexico’s site.

http://www.detoxnaturally.com

His job is now being done by someone named Nathan.

You look up Randy on the internet and he was the person who took in all
the patients

http://www.google.com/search?q=randy+hencken

He used to post here all the time I thought he was busy but he does
look like he was removed not like he moved on to something else but
like he never existed at Mexico at all.

How do you plan to give a seminar when the people who supposedly know
aren’t saying anything, what’s the title of it, ‘there are more
ibogaine deaths we think’. Who, what person, when?

It doesn’t look like it’s much news to people posting to this list
either, I guess a lot of people do know. Including MAPS who posts that
they’re working with the clinic and then the clinic closed, when it’s
not closed.

http://www.maps.org/ibogaine

Everybody lied and covered something up. So much for ethical
psychedelic research.

.:vector:.

— Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement
that promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a
little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high
risk at least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may
one day erupt and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior

to treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their
own risks and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference)
on this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open

including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they
don’t care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of
not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted
anywhere
but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it.
right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers,

lots of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to
everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I
quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in
writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the
Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a

new site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine
Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and

then he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more
money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay
someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick
on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people

who all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told
to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not

much of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on
where to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very >
informative .I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People
have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever
wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings
in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have

heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure

FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over

a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for
those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Discover Yahoo!
Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 18, 2005 at 2:18:11 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ethical ? not when money counts first.
if that clinic in Mexico had treated 350 people how come no one person
is around here to speak up about their experience?
I’m still waiting for plenty of people to pay me back for treatment done
5 years ago until last month.it just shows you what humans are like,people
are here to get 99% of the times, not to give 1% back. not with knowledge
, not with care, not with their promisses,or anything else. so when
humanity is so F**** most people would think who gives a shjt about few
dead bodies, there is nothing to get
there, is it?  and also they would think I rather do it cheap and take 80%
more risk of dying, but if I will stay alive then I can spend it on…
other shjt.
money speaks in all kinds of ways. you can give Donation to an
organization and lie to them but they will not say a thing about the well
known truth and publish those lies,so
they may get some more Donations next year. you can just let people hear
what they want to hear, write it on the internet and make it easier for
people who can’t think for themselves. make them think the jacuzzi and the
TV will give them a better feeling, when the truth is shjt.

and since people are just a piece of shjt most of the times, you’ll never
get to know the truth. what is the use to go to a conference and hear
lies?
sure, you can make a manipulated reseach just to show what you think is
right in your eyes, to blow up the ego.as if anything else is not
right,HUH?
“my way is the only way” even when they never experience “MY WAY” they
would convince everyone they know Better, they got the PHd after all;-)
they will not tell you take chamomille tea, they will tell you take
white pill that’s the best you can do, the reseach even proved it.

anyways, my client lady died last weekend from over dose is a homeless
shelter in Amsterdam, where I have told her many time , not to go to.
she took a treatment 4 weeks before because she didn’t have anywhere to go.
that was the second time she didn’t pay a cent for staying almost two weeks
at my home, not that I’m rich or anything like it, but she promissed to
pay back a week later. then she didn’t call until someone else called to
say she was found dead.
so thanks very much for the info. I believe things only when I see them
with my own eyes. and the rest is just BLA BLA BLA…

so I’m done here, have a happy day!

Sara

You would need to ask the people who had deaths, I didn’t know there
were more deaths much less this many.

It is a little strange, I haven’t looked at any of the sites in a long
time but Randy Hencken did vanish, there is no mention of him at all on
Mexico’s site.

http://www.detoxnaturally.com

His job is now being done by someone named Nathan.

You look up Randy on the internet and he was the person who took in all
the patients

http://www.google.com/search?q=randy+hencken

He used to post here all the time I thought he was busy but he does
look like he was removed not like he moved on to something else but
like he never existed at Mexico at all.

How do you plan to give a seminar when the people who supposedly know
aren’t saying anything, what’s the title of it, ‘there are more
ibogaine deaths we think’. Who, what person, when?

It doesn’t look like it’s much news to people posting to this list
either, I guess a lot of people do know. Including MAPS who posts that
they’re working with the clinic and then the clinic closed, when it’s
not closed.

http://www.maps.org/ibogaine

Everybody lied and covered something up. So much for ethical
psychedelic research.

.:vector:.

— Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement
that promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a
little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high
risk at least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may
one day erupt and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior

to treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their
own risks and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference)
on this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open

including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they
don’t care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of
not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted
anywhere
but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it.
right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers,

lots of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to
everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I
quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in
writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the
Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a

new site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine
Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and

then he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more
money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay
someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick
on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people

who all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told
to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not

much of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on
where to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very >
informative .I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People
have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever
wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings
in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have

heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure

FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over

a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for
those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Discover Yahoo!
Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanks to you all
Date: May 17, 2005 at 10:04:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Me too, I agree with this.

I’ve heard different stories so many times, how does anyone know what
happened or didn’t happen. The deaths in clinical settings I’ve heard
about too but all the stories are different.

I think it would be nice if people were honest but I don’t think a
clinic is required to report what goes wrong to the ibogaine
community, I think a lot of places using ibogaine to detox are using
ibogaine to detox and aren’t part of any community except selling it
to people who want to buy it.

The only ibogaine community I’ve ever found is this one, where most
people are at least trying to help.

KV

On 5/17/05, Kirsty Sutherland <captkirk@kol.co.nz> wrote:

A big huge thanks to all of you who are currently debating and trying your
damndest to nut this out.

It’s people like me who benefit, and without people like you willing to give
up your time and knowledge etc, then I would remain in the dark.

So, once again, I thank you all.

A minutes silence to those who have passed thru Ibogaine use, lets ensure
they didn’t die for nothing.

Kia Kaha

Kirk

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Thanks to you all
Date: May 17, 2005 at 9:43:08 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

On 5/17/05, Kirsty Sutherland <captkirk@kol.co.nz> wrote:

A big huge thanks to all of you who are currently debating and trying your
damndest to nut this out.

It’s people like me who benefit, and without people like you willing to give
up your time and knowledge etc, then I would remain in the dark.

So, once again, I thank you all.

A minutes silence to those who have passed thru Ibogaine use, lets ensure
they didn’t die for nothing.

Kia Kaha

Kirk

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Thanks to you all
Date: May 17, 2005 at 9:33:16 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A big huge thanks to all of you who are currently debating and trying your damndest to nut this out.
It’s people like me who benefit, and without people like you willing to give up your time and knowledge etc, then I would remain in the dark.

So, once again, I thank you all.
A minutes silence to those who have passed thru Ibogaine use, lets ensure they didn’t die for nothing.
Kia Kaha
Kirk

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Here’s a question I couldn’t answer….
Date: May 17, 2005 at 9:28:37 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ahhh, normal, I know what that was like and I do want it again.
My imbalance is hormonal (as in estrogen etc) and I’ve been doing some
research on the net about it (ahh dog bless the net aye?) Seems there’s a
bunch of chemicals in certain products that contain estrogen mimicking
stuff, and thus why a lot of women get out of whack (more to it I’m sure,
but certainly not helping..) so I’m currently looking into a natural
progesterone cream to balance (and remove cyst from boob..) but I was
surprised to read that if I got “too happy” to reduce amount of cream being
used daily.  COOL!! I can get too happy??????????? LOL
Juss kidding.. I know what manic happiness is, there’s always a crash from
it…
Low dosing ibogaine is starting to sound pretty good…. specially if it can
also help with balancing system.
Thanks Msssss Tinky winky!! :o)
Koiky Woiky

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Wednesday, 18 May 2005 5:58 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Here’s a question I couldn’t answer….

Mr friend just brought up an excellent question that I couldn’t
answer, and i was hoping one of you might have some info:
If you have a chemical imbalance before you do ibogaine, and if the
low dose of suboxone you’re taking works well as an anti-depressant,
is the reset going to put you back to depression, or will it do
anything to help reset the imbalance you started out with?
Do you go back to your own personal normal or is it what we all wish
waas normal?
Thank you thank you thank you!
tink-in-hell and Vyvky

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 17, 2005 at 8:44:48 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

How many dead bodies are there from
heroin and crack, lot more.<

Or as previously noted, Rapid Detox, or from getting raped and murdered in prison for taking/buying/selling drugs in the first place, or being shot by cops arresting you/your dealer/your innocent neighbor during an “oops, wrong house drug raid,” or from taking some legal drug, like Aspirin, that they unknowingly have an allergy to, or…ummm, well, this list could probably go on a long time.
For some people to get angry because a very few people have died after taking ibogaine is to me really ridiculous, considering the current dangerous, ant-drug hysteria we live under these days.
BTW, I called NYC’s Stop Smoking hotline (311) and got a big box of free nicotine patches the other day, and plan on beginning soon, tomorrow morning most probably, with putting them on me instead of lighting up first thing in the morning. Wish me luck please.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Carla Barnes” <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 2:52 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s

This is a weird attitude to have, that someone who
spends more then 2 years of their time making a film
which I’m sure cost a lot of money is obligated to
give it away to you for free and then you can steal
more copies of it and give them away.

I haven’t seen the film yet and did complain about the
old website not having any place to order, but thats
got nothing to do with someone making a film and you
feeling they owe you something. what do you do except
post mp3s of belching and throwing up noises.

So there are dead bodies, whatev happened at mexico is
their problem and if they choose to handle it by
pretending it didn’t happen then what does that prove
except ibogaine with doctors isn’t any safer then the
underground. How many dead bodies are there from
heroin and crack, lot more. I think anyone who is
going to take ibogaine has the right to know the risks
but then its their choice and I dont think anyone has
ever said its perfectly safe, every ibogaine article
i’ve ever read online always comes with warnings. I
know when I did it I was desperate, so i can die, so
what, how’s that different then my life every day was
as a junkie?

Carla B

— Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:
if public relations is really the  concern, it would
be availible on-line at no cost.

if you want me to show it to doctors, send me a
copy,
and I will
burn lots of copies and give them away.

if public relations is really the concern, in the
interest of making ibogaine or it’s derivitives
availible to the people who need them (which is
obviouslly a worthy goal)

just thoughts.

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
> Tink, I think we should all be showing our DR’s
the
> movie Ben shot, and
> giving them all the info we can get. We get enough
> of those guys behind us it might
> make a difference in how Ibogaine is scheduled.
Who
> knows? Couldn’t hoit.”
> Meanwhile I’m floating nicely at home in the
> Catskills. Thanx for askin.’
>  Randy
>

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your
mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Ron Davis” <rwd3@cox.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’
Date: May 17, 2005 at 8:25:35 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

please count me in in this wasteland of the bible belt. ron, or what’s left of him.  peaceful path to all, including me
—– Original Message —–
From: shelley krupa
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 17, 2005 10:20 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’

Thanks Randy ,do you know if it is now available?,fondly shell

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/26/2005 1:15:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, daluna@mindvox.com writes:

Dear People of the List,

I just wanted to inform you about the following;

As the dollar is so low in comparison with the euro, I have been looking
for
a way to be able to offer the DVD’s of Ibogaine – Rite of Passage for a
better price for non-euro countries. We found a way to not pay tax on it,
so
the price we can offer the DVD’s for will be 16.99 euro’s. Sending costs
will still be 3 euro’s.

I hope to have the website up by next week, on which the Paypal shopping
cart will be functional. As soon as that’s done, you will receive a
newsletter.

Best Regards,

Ben De Loenen
Director/Producer

Op 21/4/2005 schreef “Ben De Loenen” <daluna@mindvox.com>:

>
>Dear people of the Ibogaine list,
>
>I am the director/producer of the Ibogaine documentary. THe current
>website of LunArt Productions is a big disaster, indeed. It’s not
>clear, no screenshots, no real online shop,… As I am totally not
>familiar with webdesign, I really chose the wrong webdesigner for this
>job in the first place. So at the moment I have another webdesigner,
>who’s really good and building a much more extendid, easy-to-use and
>complete website system and Paypal will be functional on this website.
>For this kind of website, I had to change server and move the domain,
>which I hope will be done in the next few days, so everything can be
>uploaded. Also next to the LunArt Productions site, there will be a
>website www.ibogainefilm.com, solely on the Ibogaine documentary,
>that’s linked to it. One thing is clear, all this webstuff makes me
>crazy! But very, very soon (and I’ve been saying this to people that
>sent me an ‘order video’ form before, but due to the whole
>reorganizing it didn’t work out), I will post another mail on this
>forum to tell everybody it’s FINALLY working.
>
>As for the DVD, the price is 20 euro’s and sending costs are 3 euro’s
>for sending it basically to the whole world. The DVD features subtitles
>in 5 languages (English, Spanish, French, Dutch and German), a surround
>theather and a stereo TV mix of the soundtrack, the trailer, info pages
>on the treatment centres that cooperated, organizations involved,…
>
>If there are people that wish to be added to the LunArt Productions
>mailing list, to be kept updated on future screenings and broadcast of
>the film and new projects, please send a message to
>info@lunartproductions.com. To be clear; I don’t give your email
>addresses to 3th parties or use them for other purposes and if you like
>to unsubscribe afterwards, you just send another message to ask it.
>All this info and much more will be on www.lunArtproductions.com soon…
>Thanks for the interest in, and appreciation of this 2,5 year project.
>
>Peace,
>
>Ben De Loenen
>
>PS: Preston, thanx for the kind words…
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Op 17/4/2005 schreef “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>:
>
>>It is an AWESOME video, the one by Ben de Loenen- I watched it as soon as I
>>could crawl from the bed to my x-box and put it in yesterday. Really was a
>>perfect video for me and V to watch after that travail.
>>
>>
>>Peace and love,
>>Preston
>>
>>
>>”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
>>mistaken for madness”
>>Richard Davenport-Hines
>>
>>ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
>>Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>>Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>Columnist New York Waste
>>Etc.
>>
>>—– Original Message —–
>>From: “Carla Barnes” <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
>>To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>>Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 6:04 PM
>>Subject: [Ibogaine] ibogaine video and good luck preston!!! and marc!
>>
>>
>>> Hi again Marc and good luck this time!
>>>
>>> Preston!!! sending you good energy!
>>>
>>> — mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Patrick, your comment on the Ibo DVD  when you
>>>> say that if you take it more than three times then
>>>> the problem is with you” well all I can say to that
>>>> is that of course the problem is with us which is
>>>> why we are all here in the first place. Iboga is a
>>>> tool nothing more. It gives you a chance to work
>>>> things out. Like Randy H. so eliquently put it, a
>>>> window. After that its up to us.
>>>
>>> That’s too funny 🙂 That’s one of the Dr. Mash quotes
>>> in every interview she’s ever done in the last 5 years
>>> 😉
>>>
>>> Where do I order the ibogaine video??? People come
>>> here and talk about seeing screenings or buying it
>>> somewhere but there is nothing at all on the website.
>>> No price, no way to pay. Nothing nothing nothing!
>>>
>>> Am I blind and missing it? All I can find is this
>>>
>>> http://lunartproductions.com/html/order.htm
>>>
>>> There is no price, no way to input a real order, there
>>> is only a email form. Is it still not released??
>>>
>>> Carla B
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________________________________
>>> Do you Yahoo!?
>>> Make Yahoo! your home page
>>> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>>> [%]
>>>
>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>  \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>  /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>  \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Todd Morgan <sovntm@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 7:38:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Pardon me, but I didn’t see the post or read about the
poor chap that passed.

My sincere condolences

I will say that (some) of the harmful effects of Ibo,
namely the heart tachycardia and extremely high blood
pressure associated with an Ibo experience can be
ameliorated with the right supervision and medication.

Personally, I had a very pleasant physical supervisor.
And I will say that I had done my due diligence and I
knew the risks and dangers that Ibo posed for a guy
like me and I had prepared myself for the experience
both mentally and pharmacologically.

Honestly (IMO), Ibo needs to be taken under medical
supervision to counteract the potential side effects
of an eight to twelve hour prolonged 170 (bps) pulse
(among other things). This is rather easy to do with
drugs such as Inderal and the like.

I’m no physician.

Please research and seek for thy self.

Best

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

I have an observation here. The death that occurred
that brought on this
conversation happened in almost real time right on
this list. Matter of fact there
have been a couple of treatments happen and the list
get a play by play.
These all happened in the US where it is illegal. I
don’t see that happening from
anywhere else. So I’m assuming that you all are
talking about what has been
talked about here before. I read about the death in
a clinical setting before I
did my treatment. I read about the body in LA, and a
couple of deaths in
Europe, questionable exactly what happened. This is
not new. The problem is the
resistance we are getting to a treatment that is no
game, taxing to the body, and
should be done under the safest conditions possible,
but works for some like
nothing else. Some. If you could make a weapon from
Ibogaine we would have all
the facts we need and this conversation would be
mute. Know what I mean Vern?
The problem is Ibogaine’s legitimacy to the medical
community. This should be
an option to be discussed with your DR. for sure. We
don’t have that option.
Back to square one again. I know I had waited long
enough to get my treatment.
Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 7:22:22 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

it all just sux

On 5/17/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
I have an observation here. The death that occurred that brought on this
conversation happened in almost real time right on this list. Matter of fact
there have been a couple of treatments happen and the list get a play by
play. These all happened in the US where it is illegal. I don’t see that
happening from anywhere else. So I’m assuming that you all are talking about
what has been talked about here before. I read about the death in a clinical
setting before I did my treatment. I read about the body in LA, and a couple
of deaths in Europe, questionable exactly what happened. This is not new.
The problem is the resistance we are getting to a treatment that is no game,
taxing to the body, and should be done under the safest conditions possible,
but works for some like nothing else. Some. If you could make a weapon from
Ibogaine we would have all the facts we need and this conversation would be
mute. Know what I mean Vern? The problem is Ibogaine’s legitimacy to the
medical community. This should be an option to be discussed with your DR.
for sure. We don’t have that option. Back to square one again. I know I had
waited long enough to get my treatment.          Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 6:55:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have an observation here. The death that occurred that brought on this conversation happened in almost real time right on this list. Matter of fact there have been a couple of treatments happen and the list get a play by play. These all happened in the US where it is illegal. I don’t see that happening from anywhere else. So I’m assuming that you all are talking about what has been talked about here before. I read about the death in a clinical setting before I did my treatment. I read about the body in LA, and a couple of deaths in Europe, questionable exactly what happened. This is not new. The problem is the resistance we are getting to a treatment that is no game, taxing to the body, and should be done under the safest conditions possible, but works for some like nothing else. Some. If you could make a weapon from Ibogaine we would have all the facts we need and this conversation would be mute. Know what I mean Vern? The problem is Ibogaine’s legitimacy to the medical community. This should be an option to be discussed with your DR. for sure. We don’t have that option. Back to square one again. I know I had waited long enough to get my treatment.          Randy

From: “Gary Press” <gary@bluemooncapital.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] HEART PROBLEMS
Date: May 17, 2005 at 5:41:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

READ ALL THE MEDICAL INFO, THATS WHY THEY(THE MD’S) TELL YOU TO GET LABS ,ECHO DOBBLERS , 24 HR HALTERS BEFOR YOU DO THE IBO. ITS FOR OUR BENEFIT NOT ONLY THEIR’S.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 5:03:58 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Here, here! I think the people keeping these secrets need to take more ibogaine and discover the light within. Then maybe they will know what they are actually dealing with. Lee

Nick wrote:

The basic action of ibogaine psychologically is to attempt to reveal a
person’s deeper truth to them. To keep a lot of secrets about this drug is
just a big fear trip at the end of the day and to me it’s totally delusional
to believe this can assist ibogaine’s emergence into our world. If it
happens, good or bad, it should be revealed. That’s my position.

Nick

Nick Sandberg <nick227@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:
Personally, I only know about the six recorded ibogaine-related deaths – all
around non-clinical settings I believe. But I strongly believe it’s pure
bullshit to withhold information about ibogaine related fatalities. I don’t
care about the excuses for not revealing – that it’s counter-productive to
the drug’s development; that there are so many people that die from heroin
or methadone that ibogaine is needed and this justifies not telling; that
there’s no total proof ibogaine caused the death; whatever. That’s all
bullshit to me. (That said, I will still keep confidences if I’m told
something on the premise I don’t publish it. I wouldn’t break my word.)

The basic action of ibogaine psychologically is to attempt to reveal a
person’s deeper truth to them. To keep a lot of secrets about this drug is
just a big fear trip at the end of the day and to me it’s totally delusional
to believe this can assist ibogaine’s emergence into our world. If it
happens, good or bad, it should be revealed. That’s my position.

Nick

> —–Original Message—–
> From: Vector Vector [mailto:vector620022002@yahoo.com]
> Sent: 17 May 2005 21:14
> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
>
>
>
> You would need to ask the people who had deaths, I didn’t know there
> were more deaths much less this many.
>
> It is a little strange, I haven’t looked at any of the sites in a long
> time but Randy Hencken did vanish, there is no mention of him at all on
> Mexico’s site.
>
> http://www.detoxnaturally.com
>
> His job is now being done by someone named Nathan.
>
> You look up Randy on the internet and he was the person who took in all
> the patients
>
> http://www.google.com/search?q=randy+hencken
>
> He used to post here all the time I thought he was busy but he does
> look like he was removed not like he moved on to something else but
> like he never existed at Mexico at all.
>
> How do you plan to give a seminar when the people who supposedly know
> aren’t saying anything, what’s the title of it, ‘there are more
> ibogaine deaths we think’. Who, what person, when?
>
> It doesn’t look like it’s much news to people posting to this list
> either, I guess a lot of people do know. Including MAPS who posts that
> they’re working with the clinic and then the clinic closed, when it’s
> not closed.
>
> http://www.maps.org/ibogaine
>
> Everybody lied and covered something up. So much for ethical
> psychedelic research.
>
> .:vector:.
>
> — Lee Albert wrote:
>
> > How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement
> > that promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a
> > little sick?
> >
> > A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high
> > risk at least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may
> > one day erupt and screw us all.
> >
> > I would not want that on my conscience.
> >
> > If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior
> >
> > to treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their
> > own risks and the death has been properly recorded.
> >
> > I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference)
> > on this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open
> >
> > including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
> > treatments.
> >
> > Lee
> >
> > sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:
> > >
> >
> >
> > Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they
> > don’t care.
> >
> > but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of
> > not
> > listening to their bodies, begging stop!
> > thanks for letting me know!
> >
> > Sara
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted
> > anywhere
> > > but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it.
> > right
> > > howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers,
> >
> > lots of
> > > the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to
> > everybody
> > > knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I
> > quote
> > > from MAPS.
> > >
> > > January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
> > > selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in
> > writing
> > > grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
> > > detoxification services to 20 people.
> > >
> > > January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the
> > Ibogaine
> > > Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a
> >
> > new site
> > > to restart data collection
> > >
> > > January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine
> > Association
> > >
> > > In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
> > > archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.
> > >
> > > The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and
> >
> > then he
> > > didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more
> > money.
> > >
> > > if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay
> > someone
> > > to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick
> > on
> > > patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people
> >
> > who all
> > > think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told
> > to the
> > > media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not
> >
> > much of
> > > a secret.
> > >
> > > — On Tue 05/17, wrote:
> > > From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
> > > To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> > > Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
> > > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
> > >
> > >> — shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on
> > where to
> > >> find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very >
> > informative .I
> > >> did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People
> > have died
> > >> even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever
> > wrote
> > >> this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings
> > in
> > >> connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have
> >
> > heard
> > >> of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure
> >
> > FREE
> > >> email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
> > messaging
> > >> with Hush
> > >> Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
> > >> security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
> > >> http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
> > >> /]
> >
> =———————————————————————
> >
> > =[\
> > >> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> > >> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> > >> \]
> >
> =———————————————————————
> >
> > =[/
> > >
> > > _______________________________________________
> > > Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
> > > The most personalized portal on the Web!
> > >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > /]
> >
> =———————————————————————
> >
> > =[\
> > [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
> > IbogaineList.html [%]
> > \]
> >
> =———————————————————————
> >
> > =[/
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over
> >
> > a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
> > www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
> > My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
> > interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for
> > those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.
>
>
>
>
> Discover Yahoo!
> Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out!
> http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html
>
>
>
> /]=—————————————————————
> ——=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>
> \]=—————————————————————
> ——=[/
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: b <bolasov@sonic.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 5:02:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee Albert wrote:
Hi b,

I have promoted the idea of beginners begin low for this very reason:

see http://www.my-eboga.com/safety.html
Seems totally reasonable to me.  Why would someone /not/ use this approach?  Are there some downsides to it that aren’t obvious?

and I had no idea there were this many deaths. I am pissed off that people think they can play God and leave the rest of us out in the dark. I will be revising my book to warn vulnerable people properly of the risks and perhaps suggest a better way.

Why can’t a person be slowly rehabilitated and have their health partially restored before a full dose? I am beginning to think that full dose therapy for chronic addiction is irresponsible and unethical.

Perhaps the way forward to is draw up proper guidelines and to get people to sign up to them. Then I can post on my web site the providers who are operating ethically.

If i were an investigative journalist with a bias against ibogaine I think this would be the perfect expose to write: get into the movement and find out the facts.

The time has come for a charter and for ethically minded providers to sign up.This situation could set back the cause of ibogaine for decades.

Vector: Perhaps the seminar should be:

An Ethical Approach to Treatment: The Provider’s Charter.

Lee

b <bolasov@sonic.net> wrote:
Isn’t there some “middle way” possible in ibogaine therapy?  I haven’t heard many people talking about starting off with low dosages to see how it goes.  Is there really a need to start immediately with potentially life-threatening doses?  Or is this just about economics – the time it would take for experimentation would end up costing too much?

[This from someone who’s never taken ibogaine.]

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:
Hey, I don’t think there is a cover up, but people don’t feel the need
to report, after they get their $5000 dollars they can feel good about
giving someone their last chance of getting clean, the pre treatment
condition of a person has nothing to do with getting his/her money or
their last chance.Don’t forget that for a mexican Doctor 5000$ is worth
taking the risk.

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement that

promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high risk at
least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may one day erupt
and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior to
treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their own risks
and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference) on
this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open
including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they don’t
care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted anywhere

but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it. right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers, lots
of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a new
site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and then
he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people who
all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not much
of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where
to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very > informative
.I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a
six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those
already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.12 – Release Date: 5/17/2005

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

No virus found in this incoming message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.12 – Release Date: 5/17/2005

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.12 – Release Date: 5/17/2005

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 4:58:27 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Personally, I only know about the six recorded ibogaine-related deaths – all
around non-clinical settings I believe. But I strongly believe it’s pure
bullshit to withhold information about ibogaine related fatalities. I don’t
care about the excuses for not revealing – that it’s counter-productive to
the drug’s development; that there are so many people that die from heroin
or methadone that ibogaine is needed and this justifies not telling; that
there’s no total proof ibogaine caused the death; whatever. That’s all
bullshit to me. (That said, I will still keep confidences if I’m told
something on the premise I don’t publish it. I wouldn’t break my word.)

The basic action of ibogaine psychologically is to attempt to reveal a
person’s deeper truth to them. To keep a lot of secrets about this drug is
just a big fear trip at the end of the day and to me it’s totally delusional
to believe this can assist ibogaine’s emergence into our world. If it
happens, good or bad, it should be revealed. That’s my position.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: Vector Vector [mailto:vector620022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: 17 May 2005 21:14
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

You would need to ask the people who had deaths, I didn’t know there
were more deaths much less this many.

It is a little strange, I haven’t looked at any of the sites in a long
time but Randy Hencken did vanish, there is no mention of him at all on
Mexico’s site.

http://www.detoxnaturally.com

His job is now being done by someone named Nathan.

You look up Randy on the internet and he was the person who took in all
the patients

http://www.google.com/search?q=randy+hencken

He used to post here all the time I thought he was busy but he does
look like he was removed not like he moved on to something else but
like he never existed at Mexico at all.

How do you plan to give a seminar when the people who supposedly know
aren’t saying anything, what’s the title of it, ‘there are more
ibogaine deaths we think’. Who, what person, when?

It doesn’t look like it’s much news to people posting to this list
either, I guess a lot of people do know. Including MAPS who posts that
they’re working with the clinic and then the clinic closed, when it’s
not closed.

http://www.maps.org/ibogaine

Everybody lied and covered something up. So much for ethical
psychedelic research.

.:vector:.

— Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement
that promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a
little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high
risk at least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may
one day erupt and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior

to treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their
own risks and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference)
on this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open

including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they
don’t care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of
not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted
anywhere
but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it.
right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers,

lots of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to
everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I
quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in
writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the
Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a

new site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine
Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and

then he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more
money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay
someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick
on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people

who all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told
to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not

much of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on
where to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very >
informative .I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People
have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever
wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings
in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have

heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure

FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over

a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for
those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Discover Yahoo!
Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 4:40:04 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi b,

I have promoted the idea of beginners begin low for this very reason:

see http://www.my-eboga.com/safety.html

and I had no idea there were this many deaths. I am pissed off that people think they can play God and leave the rest of us out in the dark. I will be revising my book to warn vulnerable people properly of the risks and perhaps suggest a better way.

Why can’t a person be slowly rehabilitated and have their health partially restored before a full dose? I am beginning to think that full dose therapy for chronic addiction is irresponsible and unethical.

Perhaps the way forward to is draw up proper guidelines and to get people to sign up to them. Then I can post on my web site the providers who are operating ethically.

If i were an investigative journalist with a bias against ibogaine I think this would be the perfect expose to write: get into the movement and find out the facts.

The time has come for a charter and for ethically minded providers to sign up.This situation could set back the cause of ibogaine for decades.

Vector: Perhaps the seminar should be:

An Ethical Approach to Treatment: The Provider’s Charter.

Lee

b <bolasov@sonic.net> wrote:
Isn’t there some “middle way” possible in ibogaine therapy?  I haven’t heard many people talking about starting off with low dosages to see how it goes.  Is there really a need to start immediately with potentially life-threatening doses?  Or is this just about economics – the time it would take for experimentation would end up costing too much?

[This from someone who’s never taken ibogaine.]

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:
Hey, I don’t think there is a cover up, but people don’t feel the need
to report, after they get their $5000 dollars they can feel good about
giving someone their last chance of getting clean, the pre treatment
condition of a person has nothing to do with getting his/her money or
their last chance.Don’t forget that for a mexican Doctor 5000$ is worth
taking the risk.

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement that

promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high risk at
least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may one day erupt
and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior to
treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their own risks
and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference) on
this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open
including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they don’t
care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted anywhere

but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it. right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers, lots
of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a new
site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and then
he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people who
all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not much
of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where
to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very > informative
.I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a
six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those
already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.12 – Release Date: 5/17/2005

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: b <bolasov@sonic.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 4:18:58 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Isn’t there some “middle way” possible in ibogaine therapy?  I haven’t heard many people talking about starting off with low dosages to see how it goes.  Is there really a need to start immediately with potentially life-threatening doses?  Or is this just about economics – the time it would take for experimentation would end up costing too much?

[This from someone who’s never taken ibogaine.]

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:
Hey, I don’t think there is a cover up, but people don’t feel the need
to report, after they get their $5000 dollars they can feel good about
giving someone their last chance of getting clean, the pre treatment
condition of a person has nothing to do with getting his/her money or
their last chance.Don’t forget that for a mexican Doctor 5000$ is worth
taking the risk.

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement that

promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high risk at
least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may one day erupt
and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior to
treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their own risks
and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference) on
this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open
including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they don’t
care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted anywhere

but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it. right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers, lots
of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a new
site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and then
he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people who
all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not much
of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where
to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very > informative
.I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a
six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those
already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

No virus found in this outgoing message.
Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.11.12 – Release Date: 5/17/2005

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 4:14:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

You would need to ask the people who had deaths, I didn’t know there
were more deaths much less this many.

It is a little strange, I haven’t looked at any of the sites in a long
time but Randy Hencken did vanish, there is no mention of him at all on
Mexico’s site.

http://www.detoxnaturally.com

His job is now being done by someone named Nathan.

You look up Randy on the internet and he was the person who took in all
the patients

http://www.google.com/search?q=randy+hencken

He used to post here all the time I thought he was busy but he does
look like he was removed not like he moved on to something else but
like he never existed at Mexico at all.

How do you plan to give a seminar when the people who supposedly know
aren’t saying anything, what’s the title of it, ‘there are more
ibogaine deaths we think’. Who, what person, when?

It doesn’t look like it’s much news to people posting to this list
either, I guess a lot of people do know. Including MAPS who posts that
they’re working with the clinic and then the clinic closed, when it’s
not closed.

http://www.maps.org/ibogaine

Everybody lied and covered something up. So much for ethical
psychedelic research.

.:vector:.

— Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement
that promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a
little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high
risk at least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may
one day erupt and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior

to treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their
own risks and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference)
on this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open

including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they
don’t care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of
not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted
anywhere
but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it.
right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers,

lots of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to
everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I
quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in
writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the
Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a

new site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine
Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and

then he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more
money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay
someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick
on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people

who all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told
to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not

much of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on
where to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very >
informative .I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People
have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever
wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings
in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have

heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure

FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over

a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for
those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Discover Yahoo!
Stay in touch with email, IM, photo sharing and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/stayintouch.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] from “The Onion”
Date: May 17, 2005 at 4:13:01 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

BUSH PROMISES MAKING OF PERFECT ROMANTIC COMEDY

WASHINGTON, DC—Making a bold statement of appeal to “the long-standing
spirit of entrepreneurial enterprise in this great nation” Monday,
President Bush challenged the U.S. entertainment industry to produce
the perfect romantic comedy by summer 2009.

Above: Bush urges Americans to do their part and “go west” to Hollywood.
“My fellow Americans, it’s time for another Sleepless In Seattle,”
Bush said in a special prime-time address to the nation. “America has
the technology. We have the market-research capacity. We have the
publicity engines, the screenwriting workshops, and the deal-making
power. If we all pull together, we can create the perfect romantic
comedy. And America will be able to hold its head high again.”

Bush said the U.S. is “prepped to win this.”

“By 2009, our best teen stars—potential giants like Lindsay Lohan and
that guy who played Stifler—will be at the exact right age to appeal
to the crucial 18-to-39 female demographic,” Bush said. “No other
nation approaches America’s resources and capabilities in the area of
romantic entertainment.”

According to White House officials, recent efforts to create the
ultimate romantic comedy, such as Fever Pitch, A Lot Like Love, and
Little Black Book, have failed to generate much public interest
domestically or internationally.

“It’s been 15 years since we had a film as charming as Pretty Woman,”
Bush said. “These troubled times call for another film with the power
to unite us. If we believe in ourselves and in the principles upon
which this great democracy rests, we can create, distribute, and
market a romantic comedy that will make us laugh and cry.”

“We built the first intercontinental railroad,” Bush continued. “We
invented the electric light bulb. We even split the atom. It’s time to
remind the world what we’re capable of: If we can put a man on the
moon, we can make a man and a woman who appear to dislike each other
intensely fall madly in love before the closing credits roll.”

Dubbing his romantic-comedy initiative “Operation Meet-Cute,” Bush
proposed that Congress earmark $20 billion to aid Hollywood in
creating the film. He called on studio heads to “put aside differences
and pull together for the common goal,” urging executives to “take the
long view, and think of the sequel.”

Bush proposed adding a special “romcom tax” to all movie tickets, in
order to allow all Americans to “do their part for Hollywood and for
their country.”

The president also urged all able-minded citizens to “join the fight”
by pitching ideas for humorous and touching scenarios.

Above: A scene from When Harry Met Sally, a quality romantic comedy
from America’s past.
“If you’re not in Hollywood already, go west, young man!” Bush said.
“We need you to dig in and create fresh plotlines in which celebrities
fall in love under unusual, entertaining circumstances.”

According to Will Greenberg, director of the White Knights, a
Harvard-based think tank that has volunteered their services,
fulfilling the commander in chief’s orders will require much work.

“We need to see a heartbroken male lead lose the girl at the end of
the second act, but maintain our sympathy, so we get the requisite
goose bumps when he wins her heart again at the end of the third,”
Greenberg said. “We need fast-paced, witty banter, and a few
well-executed sight gags.”

“We also need one wacky sister, saucy coworker, or gay neighbor in
whom the heroine can confide,” Greenberg continued. “To really do this
right, the secondary character needs to be slightly quirky, someone a
bit less conformist than the female lead.”

Via phone Tuesday, Bush offered additional words of encouragement.

“This may seem like an impossible dream, but it once seemed impossible
that Harry and Sally would end up together,” Bush said. “But they did.
How? With American hard work, know-how, and ingenuity.”

Added Bush: “Ben Stiller and Jennifer Aniston didn’t give up. Adam
Sandler and Drew Barrymore didn’t give up. The troops fighting for our
freedom in Iraq haven’t given up. Nora Ephron hasn’t given up. And
neither will this nation.”

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 4:02:55 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey, I don’t think there is a cover up, but people don’t feel the need
to report, after they get their $5000 dollars they can feel good about
giving someone their last chance of getting clean, the pre treatment
condition of a person has nothing to do with getting his/her money or
their last chance.Don’t forget that for a mexican Doctor 5000$ is worth
taking the risk.

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement that
promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high risk at
least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may one day erupt
and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior to
treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their own risks
and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference) on
this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open
including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground
treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they don’t
care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted anywhere
but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it. right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers, lots
of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a new
site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and then
he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people who
all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not much
of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17, wrote:
From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where
to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very > informative
.I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant
messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a
six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process:
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those
already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 3:32:04 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

How can anyone have it on their conscious to be part of a movement that promotes ibogaine and then covers up the deaths? Isn’t that a little sick?

A proper risk evaluation that shows that those who died where high risk at least sets the stage properly instead of a scandal that may one day erupt and screw us all.

I would not want that on my conscience.

If there is a 50/50 chance of death that should be established prior to treatment and noted and signed. Then the person is taking their own risks and the death has been properly recorded.

I think there should be a seminar (at the next ibogaine conference) on this whole area and get it properly dealt with and out in the open including evaluating the safety of clinical settings vs underground treatments.

Lee

sara119@xs4all.nl wrote:
>

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they don’t care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted anywhere
> but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it. right
> howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers, lots of
> the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to everybody
> knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I quote
> from MAPS.
>
> January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
> selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in writing
> grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
> detoxification services to 20 people.
>
> January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the Ibogaine
> Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a new site
> to restart data collection
>
> January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine Association
>
> In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
> archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.
>
> The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and then he
> didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more money.
>
> if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay someone
> to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick on
> patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people who all
> think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told to the
> media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not much of
> a secret.
>
> — On Tue 05/17, wrote:
> From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
>
>> — shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to
>> find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very > informative .I
>> did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People have died
>> even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever wrote
>> this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings in
>> connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have heard
>> of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure FREE
>> email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant messaging
>> with Hush
>> Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
>> security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
>> http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
> _______________________________________________
> Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
> The most personalized portal on the Web!
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 3:04:53 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matthew if you do ibogaine again, will you please have
your heart checked with a doctor? If you still have
chest pain when you even lay on it and have your heart
hurting when you take ibogaine, it would be a loss to
the world if the next death was you. Please find out
if there is anything wrong with your heart before
doing ibogaine again!

Love

Carla B

— matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
wrote:

———————————

yes people have died in clinical settings and
unfortunetly will keep on dying

Love

Namaste
Matthew

———————————
Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with
MSN Premium:     Join now and get the first two months
FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]  \]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 17, 2005 at 2:52:30 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is a weird attitude to have, that someone who
spends more then 2 years of their time making a film
which I’m sure cost a lot of money is obligated to
give it away to you for free and then you can steal
more copies of it and give them away.

I haven’t seen the film yet and did complain about the
old website not having any place to order, but thats
got nothing to do with someone making a film and you
feeling they owe you something. what do you do except
post mp3s of belching and throwing up noises.

So there are dead bodies, whatev happened at mexico is
their problem and if they choose to handle it by
pretending it didn’t happen then what does that prove
except ibogaine with doctors isn’t any safer then the
underground. How many dead bodies are there from
heroin and crack, lot more. I think anyone who is
going to take ibogaine has the right to know the risks
but then its their choice and I dont think anyone has
ever said its perfectly safe, every ibogaine article
i’ve ever read online always comes with warnings. I
know when I did it I was desperate, so i can die, so
what, how’s that different then my life every day was
as a junkie?

Carla B

— Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:
if public relations is really the  concern, it would
be availible on-line at no cost.

if you want me to show it to doctors, send me a
copy,
and I will
burn lots of copies and give them away.

if public relations is really the concern, in the
interest of making ibogaine or it’s derivitives
availible to the people who need them (which is
obviouslly a worthy goal)

just thoughts.

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Tink, I think we should all be showing our DR’s
the
movie Ben shot, and
giving them all the info we can get. We get enough
of those guys behind us it might
make a difference in how Ibogaine is scheduled.
Who
knows? Couldn’t hoit.”
Meanwhile I’m floating nicely at home in the
Catskills. Thanx for askin.’
Randy

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your
mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Here’s a question I couldn’t answer….
Date: May 17, 2005 at 2:15:11 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Mr friend just brought up an excellent question that I couldn’t
answer, and i was hoping one of you might have some info:
If you have a chemical imbalance before you do ibogaine, and if the
low dose of suboxone you’re taking works well as an anti-depressant,
is the reset going to put you back to depression, or will it do
anything to help reset the imbalance you started out with?
Do you go back to your own personal normal or is it what we all wish
waas normal?
Thank you thank you thank you!
tink-in-hell and Vyvky

everything is possible there is no rule, but what I have experieced
is that Iboga can teach you how to deal with depression.

depression , on what level?
normal is ups and downs, we no puppets here.

sure Iboga can reset the imbalance, what do you want to believe?.no one
can promiss you anything without knowing the person.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 2:09:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry to hear that, but no one informed me,probably because they don’t care.

but no one died here, some died few weeks or years after because of not
listening to their bodies, begging stop!
thanks for letting me know!

Sara

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted anywhere
but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it. right
howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers, lots of
the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to everybody
knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I quote
from MAPS.

January 28, 2005. Iboga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada
selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in writing
grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer
detoxification services to 20 people.

January 21, 2005.  Data collection prematurely ended at the Ibogaine
Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a new site
to restart data collection

January 10, 2005. Data collection begins at the Ibogaine Association

In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are
archived on archive.org or in google’s cache.

The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and then he
didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more money.

if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay someone
to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick on
patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people who all
think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told to the
media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not much of
a secret.

— On Tue 05/17,   wrote:
From:  [mailto: slowone@hush.ai]
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble

— shelley krupa wrote:> > > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to
find the > information about heart stuff ,that was very > informative .I
did look earlier but obviously not in > the right spot.People have died
even in clinical> setting, with ekg’s,etc.Shelley (or whoever wrote
this), are you saying that people have died in clinical settings in
connection with taking ibogaine? If so, this is the first I have heard
of it.Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to getsecure FREE
email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2Free, ultra-private instant messaging
with Hush
Messengerhttp://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434Promote
security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_______________________________________________
Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Here’s a question I couldn’t answer….
Date: May 17, 2005 at 1:58:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Mr friend just brought up an excellent question that I couldn’t
answer, and i was hoping one of you might have some info:
If you have a chemical imbalance before you do ibogaine, and if the
low dose of suboxone you’re taking works well as an anti-depressant,
is the reset going to put you back to depression, or will it do
anything to help reset the imbalance you started out with?
Do you go back to your own personal normal or is it what we all wish
waas normal?
Thank you thank you thank you!
tink-in-hell and Vyvky

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “geoff” <gdr1999@excite.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 1:33:22 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

that’s because half of what is really happening is never posted anywhere but its not like everybody who runs ibogaine doesn’t know it. right howard, patrick, dana, sara, eric, all the underground providers, lots of the patients. mexico has had at least 3 dead bodies, back to everybody knowing it they are still listed as closed on different sites. I quote from MAPS. January 28, 2005.營boga Therapy House (ITH), Vancouver, BC, Canada selected as new site for data collection. MAPS assists ITH in writing grant application to Health Canada for a pilot project to offer detoxification services to 20 people. January 21, 2005. Data collection prematurely ended at the Ibogaine Association due to clinic closing. We are currently looking for a new site to restart data collection January 10, 2005.燚ata collection begins at the Ibogaine Association In case someone wakes up and remembers to edit this, the pages are archived on archive.org or in google’s cache. The only thing that changed is randy hencken was there one day and then he didn’t exist anymore. business as usual, more money and more money. if mash has had any dead bodies then she has enough money to pay someone to make sure the hole is dug real deep, right patrick? not to pick on patrick, because he’s no different then this same group of people who all think they know what’s best for ibogaine and decide what is told to the media or not, because the media always talks to them but it’s not much of a secret. — On Tue 05/17, < slowone@hush.ai > wrote: From: [mailto: slowone@hush.ai] To: ibogaine@mindvox.com Date: Tue, 17 May 2005 09:48:19 -0700 Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble > — shelley krupa wrote:
>
> > Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to find the
> information about heart stuff ,that was very
> informative .I did look earlier but obviously not in
> the right spot.People have died even in clinical
> setting, with ekg’s,etc.

Shelley (or whoever wrote this), are you saying that people have
died in clinical settings in connection with taking ibogaine? If
so, this is the first I have heard of it.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Join Excite! – http://www.excite.com
The most personalized portal on the Web!

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 1:10:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yes, humans do that.

yes people have died in clinical settings and unfortunetly will keep on
dying
Love

Namaste MatthewSend junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with  MSN
Premium:     Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] flexible traditions
Date: May 17, 2005 at 1:08:23 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

of course scientific study is needed more.

the
problem  is when
the methodes used during scientific
study become tradition,

especially if other methodes
are discredited in the process.

As if one view is
somehow more “the way”
then anothers.

yes a system without bounderies is nothing, but the
framework should remain teachable and above all,
flexible.

http://tarot.com/oracle/images/hexagrams/pict27.jpeg

Discover Yahoo!
Get on-the-go sports scores, stock quotes, news and more. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/mobile.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 1:01:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yes people have died in clinical settings and unfortunetly will keep on dying
Love

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 17, 2005 at 1:00:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

if public relations is really the  concern, it would
be availible on-line at no cost.

if you want me to show it to doctors, send me a
copy,
and I will
burn lots of copies and give them away.

if public relations is really the concern, in the
interest of making ibogaine or it’s derivitives
availible to the people who need them (which is
obviouslly a worthy goal)

just thoughts.

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Tink, I think we should all be showing our DR’s the
movie Ben shot, and
giving them all the info we can get. We get enough
of those guys behind us it might
make a difference in how Ibogaine is scheduled. Who
knows? Couldn’t hoit.”
Meanwhile I’m floating nicely at home in the
Catskills. Thanx for askin.’
Randy

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 17, 2005 at 12:48:19 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

— shelley krupa wrote:

Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to find the
information about heart stuff ,that was very
informative .I did look earlier but obviously not in
the right spot.People have died even in clinical
setting, with ekg’s,etc.

Shelley (or whoever wrote this), are you saying that people have
died in clinical settings in connection with taking ibogaine? If
so, this is the first I have heard of it.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: MrPure@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease – Demonising Ibogaine – ibogaine did not caus…
Date: May 17, 2005 at 12:33:04 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

loved the email, if I had not done the ibogaine I would have ended up dead anyway!
have a good day.
peace to you all, long live dana beal…
James

From: darkmattersfo@comcast.net
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’
Date: May 17, 2005 at 11:50:20 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The website is still being redone and if you surf to it (http://www.lunartproductions.com/) you get an “under construction” display.

I’m checking it everyday! I can’t wait to see the DVD.

————– Original message ————–
Thanks Randy ,do you know if it is now available?,fondly shell

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/26/2005 1:15:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, daluna@mindvox.com writes:

Dear People of the List,

I just wanted to inform you about the following;

As the dollar is so low in comparison with the euro, I have been looking
for
a way to be able to offer the DVD’s of Ibogaine – Rite of Passage for a
better price for non-euro countries. We found a way to not pay tax on it,
so
the price we can offer the DVD’s for will be 16.99 euro’s. Sending costs
will still be 3 euro’s.

I hope to have the website up by next week, on which the Paypal shopping
cart will be functional. As soon as that’s done, you will receive a
newsletter.

Best Regards,

Ben De Loenen
Director/Producer

Op 21/4/2005 schreef “Ben De Loenen” <daluna@mindvox.com>:

>
>Dear people of the Ibogaine list,
>
>I am the director/producer of the Ibogaine documentary. THe current
>website of LunArt Productions is a big disaster, indeed. It’s not
>clear, no screenshots, no real online shop,… As I am totally not
>familiar with webdesign, I really chose the wrong webdesigner for this
>job in the first place. So at the moment I have another webdesigner,
>who’s really good and building a much more extendid, easy-to-use and
>complete website system and Paypal will be functional on this website.
>For this kind of website, I had to change server and move the domain,
>which I hope will be done in the next few days, so everything can be
>uploaded. Also next to the LunArt Productions site, there will be a
>website www.ibogainefilm.com, solely on the Ibogaine documentary,
>that’s linked to it. One thing is clear, all this webstuff makes me
>crazy! But very, very soon (and I’ve been saying this to people that
>sent me an ‘order video’ form before, but due to the whole
>reorganizing it didn’t work out), I will post another mail on this
>forum to tell everybody it’s FINALLY working.
>
>As for the DVD, the price is 20 euro’s and sending costs are 3 euro’s
>for sending it basically to the whole world. The DVD features subtitles
>in 5 languages (English, Spanish, French, Dutch and German), a surround
>theather and a stereo TV mix of the soundtrack, the trailer, info pages
>on the treatment centres that cooperated, organizations involved,…
>
>If there are people that wish to be added to the LunArt Productions
>mailing list, to be kept updated on future screenings and broadcast of
>the film and new projects, please send a message to
>info@lunartproductions.com. To be clear; I don’t give your email
>addresses to 3th parties or use them for other purposes and if you like
>to unsubscribe afterwards, you just send another message to ask it.
>All this info and much more will be on www.lunArtproductions.com soon…
>Thanks for the interest in, and appreciation of this 2,5 year project.
>
>Peace,
>
>Ben De Loenen
>
>PS: Preston, thanx for the kind words…
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Op 17/4/2005 schreef “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>:
>
>>It is an AWESOME video, the one by Ben de Loenen- I watched it as soon as I
>>could crawl from the bed to my x-box and put it in yesterday. Really was a
>>perfect video for me and V to watch after that travail.
>>
>>
>>Peace and love,
>>Preston
>>
>>
>>”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
>>mistaken for madness”
>>Richard Davenport-Hines
>>
>>ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
>>Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>>Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>Columnist New York Waste
>>Etc.
>>
>>—– Original Message —–
>>From: “Carla Barnes” <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
>>To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>>Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 6:04 PM
>>Subject: [Ibogaine] ibogaine video and good luck preston!!! and marc!
>>
>>
>>> Hi again Marc and good luck this time!
>>>
>>> Preston!!! sending you good energy!
>>>
>>> — mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Patrick, your comment on the Ibo DVD  when you
>>>> say that if you take it more than three times then
>>>> the problem is with you” well all I can say to that
>>>> is that of course the problem is with us which is
>>>> why we are all here in the first place. Iboga is a
>>>> tool nothing more. It gives you a chance to work
>>>> things out. Like Randy H. so eliquently put it, a
>>>> window. After that its up to us.
>>>
>>> That’s too funny 🙂 That’s one of the Dr. Mash quotes
>>> in every interview she’s ever done in the last 5 years
>>> 😉
>>>
>>> Where do I order the ibogaine video??? People come
>>> here and talk about seeing screenings or buying it
>>> somewhere but there is nothing at all on the website.
>>> No price, no way to pay. Nothing nothing nothing!
>>>
>>> Am I blind and missing it? All I can find is this
>>>
>>> http://lunartproductions.com/html/order.htm
>>>
>>> There is no price, no way to input a real order, there
>>> is only a email form. Is it still not released??
>>>
>>> Carla B
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________________________________
>>> Do you Yahoo!?
>>> Make Yahoo! your home page
>>> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>>> [%]
>>>
>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>  \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>  /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>  \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’
Date: May 17, 2005 at 11:38:27 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 4/21/2005 5:09:20 AM Eastern Standard Time, daluna@mindvox.com writes:
Sorry about the last one. The address is in  this message from Ben.   Randy

I am the director/producer of the Ibogaine documentary. THe current
website of LunArt Productions is a big disaster, indeed. It’s not
clear, no screenshots, no real online shop,… As I am totally not
familiar with webdesign, I really chose the wrong webdesigner for this
job in the first place. So at the moment I have another webdesigner,
who’s really good and building a much more extendid, easy-to-use and
complete website system and Paypal will be functional on this website.
For this kind of website, I had to change server and move the domain,
which I hope will be done in the next few days, so everything can be
uploaded. Also next to the LunArt Productions site, there will be a
website www.ibogainefilm.com, solely on the Ibogaine documentary,
that’s linked to it. One thing is clear, all this webstuff makes me
crazy! But very, very soon (and I’ve been saying this to people that
sent me an ‘order video’ form before, but due to the whole
reorganizing it didn’t work out), I will post another mail on this
forum to tell everybody it’s FINALLY working.

As for the DVD, the price is 20 euro’s and sending costs are 3 euro’s
for sending it basically to the whole world. The DVD features subtitles
in 5 languages (English, Spanish, French, Dutch and German), a surround
theather and a stereo TV mix of the soundtrack, the trailer, info pages
on the treatment centres that cooperated, organizations involved,…

If there are people that wish to be added to the LunArt Productions
mailing list, to be kept updated on future screenings and broadcast of
the film and new projects, please send a message to
info@lunartproductions.com. To be clear; I don’t give your email
addresses to 3th parties or use them for other purposes and if you like
to unsubscribe afterwards, you just send another message to ask it.
All this info and much more will be on www.lunArtproductions.com soon…
Thanks for the interest in, and appreciation of this 2,5 year project.

Peace,

Ben De Loenen

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’
Date: May 17, 2005 at 11:20:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks Randy ,do you know if it is now available?,fondly shell

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 4/26/2005 1:15:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, daluna@mindvox.com writes:

Dear People of the List,

I just wanted to inform you about the following;

As the dollar is so low in comparison with the euro, I have been looking
for
a way to be able to offer the DVD’s of Ibogaine – Rite of Passage for a
better price for non-euro countries. We found a way to not pay tax on it,
so
the price we can offer the DVD’s for will be 16.99 euro’s. Sending costs
will still be 3 euro’s.

I hope to have the website up by next week, on which the Paypal shopping
cart will be functional. As soon as that’s done, you will receive a
newsletter.

Best Regards,

Ben De Loenen
Director/Producer

Op 21/4/2005 schreef “Ben De Loenen” <daluna@mindvox.com>:

>
>Dear people of the Ibogaine list,
>
>I am the director/producer of the Ibogaine documentary. THe current
>website of LunArt Productions is a big disaster, indeed. It’s not
>clear, no screenshots, no real online shop,… As I am totally not
>familiar with webdesign, I really chose the wrong webdesigner for this
>job in the first place. So at the moment I have another webdesigner,
>who’s really good and building a much more extendid, easy-to-use and
>complete website system and Paypal will be functional on this website.
>For this kind of website, I had to change server and move the domain,
>which I hope will be done in the next few days, so everything can be
>uploaded. Also next to the LunArt Productions site, there will be a
>website www.ibogainefilm.com, solely on the Ibogaine documentary,
>that’s linked to it. One thing is clear, all this webstuff makes me
>crazy! But very, very soon (and I’ve been saying this to people that
>sent me an ‘order video’ form before, but due to the whole
>reorganizing it didn’t work out), I will post another mail on this
>forum to tell everybody it’s FINALLY working.
>
>As for the DVD, the price is 20 euro’s and sending costs are 3 euro’s
>for sending it basically to the whole world. The DVD features subtitles
>in 5 languages (English, Spanish, French, Dutch and German), a surround
>theather and a stereo TV mix of the soundtrack, the trailer, info pages
>on the treatment centres that cooperated, organizations involved,…
>
>If there are people that wish to be added to the LunArt Productions
>mailing list, to be kept updated on future screenings and broadcast of
>the film and new projects, please send a message to
>info@lunartproductions.com. To be clear; I don’t give your email
>addresses to 3th parties or use them for other purposes and if you like
>to unsubscribe afterwards, you just send another message to ask it.
>All this info and much more will be on www.lunArtproductions.com soon…
>Thanks for the interest in, and appreciation of this 2,5 year project.
>
>Peace,
>
>Ben De Loenen
>
>PS: Preston, thanx for the kind words…
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Op 17/4/2005 schreef “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>:
>
>>It is an AWESOME video, the one by Ben de Loenen- I watched it as soon as I
>>could crawl from the bed to my x-box and put it in yesterday. Really was a
>>perfect video for me and V to watch after that travail.
>>
>>
>>Peace and love,
>>Preston
>>
>>
>>”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
>>mistaken for madness”
>>Richard Davenport-Hines
>>
>>ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
>>Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>>Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>Columnist New York Waste
>>Etc.
>>
>>—– Original Message —–
>>From: “Carla Barnes” <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
>>To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>>Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 6:04 PM
>>Subject: [Ibogaine] ibogaine video and good luck preston!!! and marc!
>>
>>
>>> Hi again Marc and good luck this time!
>>>
>>> Preston!!! sending you good energy!
>>>
>>> — mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Patrick, your comment on the Ibo DVD  when you
>>>> say that if you take it more than three times then
>>>> the problem is with you” well all I can say to that
>>>> is that of course the problem is with us which is
>>>> why we are all here in the first place. Iboga is a
>>>> tool nothing more. It gives you a chance to work
>>>> things out. Like Randy H. so eliquently put it, a
>>>> window. After that its up to us.
>>>
>>> That’s too funny 🙂 That’s one of the Dr. Mash quotes
>>> in every interview she’s ever done in the last 5 years
>>> 😉
>>>
>>> Where do I order the ibogaine video??? People come
>>> here and talk about seeing screenings or buying it
>>> somewhere but there is nothing at all on the website.
>>> No price, no way to pay. Nothing nothing nothing!
>>>
>>> Am I blind and missing it? All I can find is this
>>>
>>> http://lunartproductions.com/html/order.htm
>>>
>>> There is no price, no way to input a real order, there
>>> is only a email form. Is it still not released??
>>>
>>> Carla B
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________________________________
>>> Do you Yahoo!?
>>> Make Yahoo! your home page
>>> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>>> [%]
>>>
>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>  \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>  /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>  \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] How to purchase ‘IBOGAINE – Rite of Passage’
Date: May 17, 2005 at 11:09:25 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 4/26/2005 1:15:05 PM Eastern Standard Time, daluna@mindvox.com writes:

Dear People of the List,

I just wanted to inform you about the following;

As the dollar is so low in comparison with the euro, I have been looking
for
a way to be able to offer the DVD’s of Ibogaine – Rite of Passage for a
better price for non-euro countries. We found a way to not pay tax on it,
so
the price we can offer the DVD’s for will be 16.99 euro’s. Sending costs
will still be 3 euro’s.

I hope to have the website up by next week, on which the Paypal shopping
cart will be functional. As soon as that’s done, you will receive a
newsletter.

Best Regards,

Ben De Loenen
Director/Producer

Op 21/4/2005 schreef “Ben De Loenen” <daluna@mindvox.com>:

>
>Dear people of the Ibogaine list,
>
>I am the director/producer of the Ibogaine documentary. THe current
>website of LunArt Productions is a big disaster, indeed. It’s not
>clear, no screenshots, no real online shop,… As I am totally not
>familiar with webdesign, I really chose the wrong webdesigner for this
>job in the first place. So at the moment I have another webdesigner,
>who’s really good and building a much more extendid, easy-to-use and
>complete website system and Paypal will be functional on this website.
>For this kind of website, I had to change server and move the domain,
>which I hope will be done in the next few days, so everything can be
>uploaded. Also next to the LunArt Productions site, there will be a
>website www.ibogainefilm.com, solely on the Ibogaine documentary,
>that’s linked to it. One thing is clear, all this webstuff makes me
>crazy! But very, very soon (and I’ve been saying this to people that
>sent me an ‘order video’ form before, but due to the whole
>reorganizing it didn’t work out), I will post another mail on this
>forum to tell everybody it’s FINALLY working.
>
>As for the DVD, the price is 20 euro’s and sending costs are 3 euro’s
>for sending it basically to the whole world. The DVD features subtitles
>in 5 languages (English, Spanish, French, Dutch and German), a surround
>theather and a stereo TV mix of the soundtrack, the trailer, info pages
>on the treatment centres that cooperated, organizations involved,…
>
>If there are people that wish to be added to the LunArt Productions
>mailing list, to be kept updated on future screenings and broadcast of
>the film and new projects, please send a message to
>info@lunartproductions.com. To be clear; I don’t give your email
>addresses to 3th parties or use them for other purposes and if you like
>to unsubscribe afterwards, you just send another message to ask it.
>All this info and much more will be on www.lunArtproductions.com soon…
>Thanks for the interest in, and appreciation of this 2,5 year project.
>
>Peace,
>
>Ben De Loenen
>
>PS: Preston, thanx for the kind words…
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>Op 17/4/2005 schreef “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>:
>
>>It is an AWESOME video, the one by Ben de Loenen- I watched it as soon as I
>>could crawl from the bed to my x-box and put it in yesterday. Really was a
>>perfect video for me and V to watch after that travail.
>>
>>
>>Peace and love,
>>Preston
>>
>>
>>”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
>>mistaken for madness”
>>Richard Davenport-Hines
>>
>>ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
>>Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>>Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>Columnist New York Waste
>>Etc.
>>
>>—– Original Message —–
>>From: “Carla Barnes” <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
>>To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
>>Sent: Thursday, April 14, 2005 6:04 PM
>>Subject: [Ibogaine] ibogaine video and good luck preston!!! and marc!
>>
>>
>>> Hi again Marc and good luck this time!
>>>
>>> Preston!!! sending you good energy!
>>>
>>> — mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
>>> Patrick, your comment on the Ibo DVD  when you
>>>> say that if you take it more than three times then
>>>> the problem is with you” well all I can say to that
>>>> is that of course the problem is with us which is
>>>> why we are all here in the first place. Iboga is a
>>>> tool nothing more. It gives you a chance to work
>>>> things out. Like Randy H. so eliquently put it, a
>>>> window. After that its up to us.
>>>
>>> That’s too funny 🙂 That’s one of the Dr. Mash quotes
>>> in every interview she’s ever done in the last 5 years
>>> 😉
>>>
>>> Where do I order the ibogaine video??? People come
>>> here and talk about seeing screenings or buying it
>>> somewhere but there is nothing at all on the website.
>>> No price, no way to pay. Nothing nothing nothing!
>>>
>>> Am I blind and missing it? All I can find is this
>>>
>>> http://lunartproductions.com/html/order.htm
>>>
>>> There is no price, no way to input a real order, there
>>> is only a email form. Is it still not released??
>>>
>>> Carla B
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> __________________________________
>>> Do you Yahoo!?
>>> Make Yahoo! your home page
>>> http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>>> [%]
>>>
>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>  /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>  \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>>
>>
>
>
>  /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>  \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 17, 2005 at 10:15:25 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey can I get the movie about ibogaine ,is it available? shell

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Tink, I think we should all be showing our DR’s the movie Ben shot, and giving them all the info we can get. We get enough of those guys behind us it might make a difference in how Ibogaine is scheduled. Who knows? Couldn’t hoit.” Meanwhile I’m floating nicely at home in the Catskills. Thanx for askin.’         Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 17, 2005 at 9:31:30 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tink, I think we should all be showing our DR’s the movie Ben shot, and giving them all the info we can get. We get enough of those guys behind us it might make a difference in how Ibogaine is scheduled. Who knows? Couldn’t hoit.” Meanwhile I’m floating nicely at home in the Catskills. Thanx for askin.’         Randy

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] intersting excersise
Date: May 17, 2005 at 8:45:14 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi List….here is something really helpfull on how to stay clean……….For anyone here not familliar with Jane Roberts i strongly recomend doing a basic search on the net…….
Exercise from Chapter 16, Nature Of Personal Reality by Jane Roberts
“First of all, you must realize that you are the
hypnotist. You must seize the initiative here as you
have in other positive aspects of your life.
Whatever the superficial reasons for your beliefs,
you must say

: For a certain amount of time I will
: momentarily suspend what I believe in this
: area, and willfully accept the belief I want.
: I will pretend that I am under hypnosis, with
: myself as hypnotist and subject. For that
: time desire and belief will be one. There
: will be no conflict because I do this
: willingly. For this period I will completely
: alter my old beliefs. Even though I sit
: quietly, in my mind I will act as if the
: belief I want were mine completely.

”At this point do not think of the future, but only
of the present. If you are overweight, insert the
weight that you think is ideal for you while you are
following this exercise. Imagine that you are
healthy if you have the belief that you are not. If
you are lonely, believe that you are filled with the
feeling of companionship instead. Realize that you
are exerting your initiative to imagine such
situations. Here there can be no comparison with
your normal situation. Use visual data, or words -
whatever is most natural to you. And again, no more
than ten minutes is required.

”If you do this faithfully, within a month you will
find the new conditions materializing in your
experience. Your neurological structure will respond
automatically. The unconscious will be aroused,
bringing its great powers to bear, bringing you the
new results. Do not try to overdo this, to go
through the entire day worrying about beliefs, for
example. This can only cause you to contrast what
you have with what you want. Forget the exercise
when it is completed. You will find yourself with
impulses that arrive in line with these newly
inserted beliefs, and then it is up to you to act on
these and not ignore them. The initiative must be
yours. You will never know unless you try the
exercise.”
Namaste
Matthew

Enjoy 25MB of inbox storage and 10MB per file attachment with MSN Premium. Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease – Demonising Ibogaine – ibogaine did not cause this death
Date: May 17, 2005 at 6:21:50 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Randy,

I am fully with you on that.

When I had my first session I sat with baited breath to see if my EKG would be acceptable. I wanted that session more than life itself and would have walked naked in the street if I had been told that was the preamble.In fact I actually thought I had a small heart problem and hoped it would not show up.

My post is not about excluding people from session nor is it about being unrealistic about the physical state some people are in when they come to do a session. It is about the public relations aspect of ibogaine and how it gets reported.

I think that a clear and understandable description of the risks need to be described so that when someone dies the first thought is not: Oh my God, ibogaine strikes again. We have to keep it banned.

If we are serious in promoting the healing aspects of ibogaine then we cannot at the same time have a reporting system that feeds into this shadowy image of ibogaine based on a lack of understanding. For instance if it had been assessed prior to Patrick’s treatment that he was at high risk due to his diet etc then the release of news of his death should have stated this and also stated that it is likely that this was the cause of his death – not saying things like he appeared to have reasonable results from his tests.

I don’t know if I am making my point properly. Except to say that when deaths due to a million other things occur such as playing football, hiking etc the shadow is not cast onto the activity. Hence why is the shadow being continually cast onto ibogaine if the actual dangers are identified and known? The cause of death in this instance is the choice made by the person to undergo treatment and not the treatment itself – ibogaine did not cause this death.

And I too like Patrick would have made the same decision and would have been very pissed if someone tried to stop me.

Lee

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 5/16/2005 11:32:13 AM Eastern Standard Time, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:
We also, I think, should consider the lifestyle of the person and their dietary habits – perhaps a dietary/exercise questionnaire. If they live an abused life then they should be warned that on a 1 to 10 they have a greater chance of post-session fatality.

Lee
Lee, I appreciate very much your concern. It seems to me that given the context of the situation most addicts are in, we all lived an abused life. I know that I did. At the point where we seek relief from the drugs that we do, and have become addicted to, we have pretty much lived on the edge for a while. We don’t want to stop because everything was great, it’s because everything sucked. Right down to what we eat and how much sleep we get. I know for me, if it hadn’t been for me being sick and my mother telling me to come home I may have just died anyway. No shit. Without the Ibogaine. Doing a months worth of Methadone in about a week, then kicking for 5 days, then shooting Oxy’s or scag till the next month of Methadone came around has to be a bigger risk than an Ibogaine session. I think I had the luck of the draw, or I would have died from the Hep C or blew a valve from the elevated blood pressure from kicking, or some damn thing. I know that all Ibogaine sessions aren’t for addiction, and I applaud you and others for your work, and the information you freely give out about your research. I’m coming from my experience with an addicts (ex addict now, I still can’t get over the fact that I am not addicted anymore) point of view. Ibogaine is a calculated risk, I knew the risk, I took it. I feel very bad about what happened to Patrick, but in the end he made his decision too, and I respect him for it.       Randy

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] off topic
Date: May 17, 2005 at 4:59:05 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://commtechlab.msu.edu/sites/aslweb/S/W3620.htm

http://moviewavs.com/TV_Shows/South_Park.shtml

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Make Yahoo! your home page
http://www.yahoo.com/r/hs

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease – Demonising Ibogaine
Date: May 16, 2005 at 8:21:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hmmm ,I eat very healthfully now ,but how many opiate addicts put much focus on their diet while in the throes of using?-shell

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Carlton,

Thanks for all the input. It certainly has put the subject into perspective for me. What you are saying in a way is that people will die from taking ibogaine in the same way as people will die from playing a game of football etc. Which is why i would like to see these incidents properly reported on ibogaine web sites for the general public.

It’s extremely sad that someone dies and the ibogaine community do not put together a balanced report for the general public to draw proper conclusions on. Instead we are left with this eary sense that ibogaine can strike you down even after the session for strange unknown reasons. I have never seen a report that blamed football for a person’s heart attack even though they died a few days later after playing a game. After all this discussion I have a mind to write up such a report and get it on my site – once it has been ok’ed by someone in the know.

I  wrote a post here before on demonising ibogaine and it is this I had in mind. Just because someone dies post-session from taking ibogaine does not make ibogaine unsafe per see. It just means that the person was not in good health from what I can make out. Is there any evidence to the contrary? Knowing this they could have avoided the session.

If we post reports on web sites saying that someone has died and do not put it into proper perspective we are contributing to a culture of demonising ibogaine which I find irritating and irresponsible to say the least as it is not supportive of ibogaine and seems to promote a hidden shadow psychological agenda that somehow ibogaine will kill you. Yes it will but mostly in the psychological sense.

I think we need to separate the risks into those within the session (such as the firing mechanism in the heart which by proper supervision does not have to become a fatality) and those post session such as death due to cardiovascular disease. We also, I think, should consider the lifestyle of the person and their dietary habits – perhaps a dietary/exercise questionaire. If they live an abused life then they should be warned that on a 1 to 10 they have a greater chance of post-session fatality.

Lee

Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Lee, there’s no magic bullet test to detect vascular heart disease, sorry.  Not as far as I know, at least.  An ECG might raise warning flag or it might not… there are several different kinds of vascular heart disease and we haven’t been told the specifics of this particular case.   Unless you know exactly what you’re looking for, it’s hard to test.

I had not noticed before that Pam had said the final diagnosis on her husband Patrick (not Pat Kroupa for those who are still confused) was vascular heart disease.  That is not related to the heart’s electrical signaling system, so in my own mind it is very possible that iboga was not a major factor here.  It could just be an unfortunate coincidence of a worn-out heart inside an abused body that couldn’t carry the weight anymore.

And I will not say any more on this subject unless there is a cardiologist present to call bullshit.
—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 6:32 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Krista,

Don’t worry about it.  What counts is what lies underneath and in this case your frustration towards the war on drugs which I completely empathise with.

I know how you feel and I myself find it very sad that we live in a world that seems to be getting more and more corrupt by the hour. Self interest seems to be the guiding force. Yet with eboga, amazing things can be achieved.

Regarding Patrick, if what I understand is right would not an ECG (as opposed to an EKG) have picked up his condition?

Lee

Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:
Lee, what I posted was a little out of frustration and if my tone was
off then I apologize for it. My frustration was at people never
answering their email and I shouldn’t have done that because about
that Carla was right, some of my questions are already answered if I
looked them up, I guess all of them have been answered on this list
already at different times and I was frustrated that nobody replies to
my email but everyone is very busy I guess and I don’t have any right
to expect anyone to do even more things, so very sorry for that from
the heart.

The real source of my anger is the war on drugs where something like
ibogaine that can help so many, is not being given in the safest way
possible and probably never will be. I go to protests, I sign
petitions, but somehow I have the feeling that it’s more a emotional
good feeling to do these things, but they don’t change anything. I’m
saying what I think everyone who has ever been addicted to drugs
already knows and there’s no reason to carry on about it.

No matter all of what is known about ibogaine or not, I don’t think
Pam’s patrick would have died if there was a doctor there, or he was
able to get ibogaine treatment legally.

KV

On 5/15/05, Lee Albert wrote:
> Hi Krista & Carla,
>
> I understand your frustration but I think in fairness to Carlton there has
> been no claim made on medical competance here by anyone. But what we have
> had is a discussion which points out that the EKG test is limited in its
> safety. And from what I know that is what the protocol recommends, i.e., the
> protocol is limited also due to no way of really knowing how to test for
> vascular disease.
>
> In the case of Patricks death I understand he had an EKG but he died from
> cadiovascular disease which it would not pick up, i.e, the protocol was
> being followed.
>
> Nobody is going to walk away from this discussion considering themselves
> medical experts but at least we are aware in a user friendly way of the
> limitations of the protocol and not to assume that having an EKG is the
> answer to potential heart problems.
>
> Don’t you think thats not worthwhile?
>
> Lee
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 16, 2005 at 5:33:11 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I hear ya brother and I feel your pain once again!  He was all flipped
out, and then I told him what i knew in the most technically and
medically geared manner.  I went to med school for a bit and am a
licensed EMT so i really lathered it on, but every word i spoke was
truth.  I showed him some of the other side, and I think it blew him
out of the water.  It was great.  He’ll never speak to me again :]  I
knew what I was talking about, and he couldn’t trip me up with his
ridiculous vocabulary quiz, trying to see if i had just memorised some
paragraph to parrot.  He wants literature and the movie to show his
clients.  But, they are saving a spot for me, just in case.  he can
fuck off with his just in case, and shove it up his narrow ass.
Ahem.
I digress easily these days.
Any hoo, glad the whole ickiness was mostly averted for you.  Are you
hame now? Or floating in never never Land with the Munchkins?
Love
tink
On 5/16/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Great news. I know that this has got to help your process. My doc wouldn’t
do it. “Nope can’t do that, but I’ll give ya methadone, you know that you
can never get off that stuff, right”? He knew about the Ibogaine too. Maybe
I should call him and tell him I still don’t need his dope. I found a better
doc by the way.           Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 16, 2005 at 5:13:15 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Great news. I know that this has got to help your process. My doc wouldn’t do it. “Nope can’t do that, but I’ll give ya methadone, you know that you can never get off that stuff, right”? He knew about the Ibogaine too. Maybe I should call him and tell him I still don’t need his dope. I found a better doc by the way.           Randy

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Just got back from the doc’s
Date: May 16, 2005 at 3:59:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HE DID IT!!!!!!!!!!!!
HE SWITCHED ME TO SUBUTEX!!!!!  I didn’t give  him the royal ass
reaminig he deserved for running away from me in the parking lot,
however.  I’ll wait till I’m done-done.
Love to you all, thanx and be back later
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] SUN IS SHINING :}
Date: May 16, 2005 at 2:48:27 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

spoken like a true thoroughbred.  It’s when you dont even bother to
clean the rig out and don’t even give a fuck what happens that is the
next step in the illogically ordered world os instant gratification…
Send me positive waves, people.  It’s of to the doctor’s I go, and
I’ll need all the help I can get…
luvya all
tink

On 5/16/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Matt, you know what? I don’t know if thoughts of that familiar escape ever
completely goes away. Would you want it too? I know that now when I think of
rigs, I can also think of the time I pulled one out of a beer bottle,
cleaned it with Clorox, sharpened it on a match book cover, and damn near
broke it off trying to hit that calloused ass vein I always used. I try and
think it through to it’s logical conclusion now. Ibogaine did that for me.
It gave me a reprieve from addiction long enough to think clearly. For once
in my life. Your are the man dude. Keep posting and enjoy the sunshine.
“It’s a good life, Too good to lose, and it’s a hard world, with the junky
blues” Ten Years After             Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] SUN IS SHINING :}
Date: May 16, 2005 at 2:32:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt, you know what? I don’t know if thoughts of that familiar escape ever completely goes away. Would you want it too? I know that now when I think of rigs, I can also think of the time I pulled one out of a beer bottle, cleaned it with Clorox, sharpened it on a match book cover, and damn near broke it off trying to hit that calloused ass vein I always used. I try and think it through to it’s logical conclusion now. Ibogaine did that for me. It gave me a reprieve from addiction long enough to think clearly. For once in my life. Your are the man dude. Keep posting and enjoy the sunshine.      “It’s a good life, Too good to lose, and it’s a hard world, with the junky blues” Ten Years After             Randy

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease – Demonising Ibogaine
Date: May 16, 2005 at 2:26:29 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thankyou Randy for that.  I wrote an email yesterday and was going to
post it, but thought it abit harsh, so I didn’t, but the gist fo it
was along the same lines.  I know for a fact that the risk of dying
from iboga, whether during or post treatment, was far more acceptable
to me, as well as family (who were instrumental in the payment portion
of the treatment) than the alternative.  As someone who has injected
strange and unreliable substances  directly into my bloodstream for
years, bought from people who most likely hated me, by the time I came
to the point of my iboga treatment, I would’ve taken a much higher
failure rate than the one offered.  Any risk was acceptable if it
meant me getting even a portion of myself back, and, as sad and
painful it is to lose someone, no matter how, he did what he thought
was right for him.  All treatments and detoxes have a risk factor; for
instance, doesn’t rapid detox, which is considered a “safe and
legal”procedure have an “acceptable loss” rate of something like 46
people per year, or roughly 2 people a month?  There are no
guarentees, anywhere, for anyone, about anything.  I just think that
he chose to do the treatment, fully aware of the risks, and whether or
not things were done, and whatever decisions were made or not made,
the final outcome remains the same.  I would prefer to think that,
although he has left us, he went out doing something he did not decide
to do lightly.  As I said before, I know from the bottom of my heart
that I would prefer to die in an ibogaine treatment, trying to do
something  GOOD, than in a back alley or rooftop with a needle
sticking out of my arm.  And what a spiritual journey he must be on
now!!  Perhaps he’ll become a guide for someone.  I don’t know.
Anything.  But I feel, and feel strongly and deeply that sometimes
it’s just time.
I’m not trying to piss anyone off, and this isn’t meant as rude or
reproachful, just a series of thoughts roaming around in my brain for
the past few days.
I have lost almost everyone and am not belittling that at all, either.
I’d just like to think that we all have another guardian angel out
there.
Love
tink
On 5/16/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:

In a message dated 5/16/2005 11:32:13 AM Eastern Standard Time,
my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:

We also, I think, should consider the lifestyle of the person and their
dietary habits – perhaps a dietary/exercise questionnaire. If they live an
abused life then they should be warned that on a 1 to 10 they have a greater
chance of post-session fatality.

Lee
Lee, I appreciate very much your concern. It seems to me that given the
context of the situation most addicts are in, we all lived an abused life. I
know that I did. At the point where we seek relief from the drugs that we
do, and have become addicted to, we have pretty much lived on the edge for a
while. We don’t want to stop because everything was great, it’s because
everything sucked. Right down to what we eat and how much sleep we get. I
know for me, if it hadn’t been for me being sick and my mother telling me to
come home I may have just died anyway. No shit. Without the Ibogaine. Doing
a months worth of Methadone in about a week, then kicking for 5 days, then
shooting Oxy’s or scag till the next month of Methadone came around has to
be a bigger risk than an Ibogaine session. I think I had the luck of the
draw, or I would have died from the Hep C or blew a valve from the elevated
blood pressure from kicking, or some damn thing. I know that all Ibogaine
sessions aren’t for addiction, and I applaud you and others for your work,
and the information you freely give out about your research. I’m coming from
my experience with an addicts (ex addict now, I still can’t get over the
fact that I am not addicted anymore) point of view. Ibogaine is a calculated
risk, I knew the risk, I took it. I feel very bad about what happened to
Patrick, but in the end he made his decision too, and I respect him for it.
Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease – Demonising Ibogaine
Date: May 16, 2005 at 2:06:06 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/16/2005 11:32:13 AM Eastern Standard Time, my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk writes:
We also, I think, should consider the lifestyle of the person and their dietary habits – perhaps a dietary/exercise questionnaire. If they live an abused life then they should be warned that on a 1 to 10 they have a greater chance of post-session fatality.

Lee
Lee, I appreciate very much your concern. It seems to me that given the context of the situation most addicts are in, we all lived an abused life. I know that I did. At the point where we seek relief from the drugs that we do, and have become addicted to, we have pretty much lived on the edge for a while. We don’t want to stop because everything was great, it’s because everything sucked. Right down to what we eat and how much sleep we get. I know for me, if it hadn’t been for me being sick and my mother telling me to come home I may have just died anyway. No shit. Without the Ibogaine. Doing a months worth of Methadone in about a week, then kicking for 5 days, then shooting Oxy’s or scag till the next month of Methadone came around has to be a bigger risk than an Ibogaine session. I think I had the luck of the draw, or I would have died from the Hep C or blew a valve from the elevated blood pressure from kicking, or some damn thing. I know that all Ibogaine sessions aren’t for addiction, and I applaud you and others for your work, and the information you freely give out about your research. I’m coming from my experience with an addicts (ex addict now, I still can’t get over the fact that I am not addicted anymore) point of view. Ibogaine is a calculated risk, I knew the risk, I took it. I feel very bad about what happened to Patrick, but in the end he made his decision too, and I respect him for it.       Randy

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease – Demonising Ibogaine
Date: May 16, 2005 at 11:23:37 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Carlton,

Thanks for all the input. It certainly has put the subject into perspective for me. What you are saying in a way is that people will die from taking ibogaine in the same way as people will die from playing a game of football etc. Which is why i would like to see these incidents properly reported on ibogaine web sites for the general public.

It’s extremely sad that someone dies and the ibogaine community do not put together a balanced report for the general public to draw proper conclusions on. Instead we are left with this eary sense that ibogaine can strike you down even after the session for strange unknown reasons. I have never seen a report that blamed football for a person’s heart attack even though they died a few days later after playing a game. After all this discussion I have a mind to write up such a report and get it on my site – once it has been ok’ed by someone in the know.

I  wrote a post here before on demonising ibogaine and it is this I had in mind. Just because someone dies post-session from taking ibogaine does not make ibogaine unsafe per see. It just means that the person was not in good health from what I can make out. Is there any evidence to the contrary? Knowing this they could have avoided the session.

If we post reports on web sites saying that someone has died and do not put it into proper perspective we are contributing to a culture of demonising ibogaine which I find irritating and irresponsible to say the least as it is not supportive of ibogaine and seems to promote a hidden shadow psychological agenda that somehow ibogaine will kill you. Yes it will but mostly in the psychological sense.

I think we need to separate the risks into those within the session (such as the firing mechanism in the heart which by proper supervision does not have to become a fatality) and those post session such as death due to cardiovascular disease. We also, I think, should consider the lifestyle of the person and their dietary habits – perhaps a dietary/exercise questionaire. If they live an abused life then they should be warned that on a 1 to 10 they have a greater chance of post-session fatality.

Lee

Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Lee, there’s no magic bullet test to detect vascular heart disease, sorry.  Not as far as I know, at least.  An ECG might raise warning flag or it might not… there are several different kinds of vascular heart disease and we haven’t been told the specifics of this particular case.   Unless you know exactly what you’re looking for, it’s hard to test.

I had not noticed before that Pam had said the final diagnosis on her husband Patrick (not Pat Kroupa for those who are still confused) was vascular heart disease.  That is not related to the heart’s electrical signaling system, so in my own mind it is very possible that iboga was not a major factor here.  It could just be an unfortunate coincidence of a worn-out heart inside an abused body that couldn’t carry the weight anymore.

And I will not say any more on this subject unless there is a cardiologist present to call bullshit.
—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 6:32 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Krista,

Don’t worry about it.  What counts is what lies underneath and in this case your frustration towards the war on drugs which I completely empathise with.

I know how you feel and I myself find it very sad that we live in a world that seems to be getting more and more corrupt by the hour. Self interest seems to be the guiding force. Yet with eboga, amazing things can be achieved.

Regarding Patrick, if what I understand is right would not an ECG (as opposed to an EKG) have picked up his condition?

Lee

Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:
Lee, what I posted was a little out of frustration and if my tone was
off then I apologize for it. My frustration was at people never
answering their email and I shouldn’t have done that because about
that Carla was right, some of my questions are already answered if I
looked them up, I guess all of them have been answered on this list
already at different times and I was frustrated that nobody replies to
my email but everyone is very busy I guess and I don’t have any right
to expect anyone to do even more things, so very sorry for that from
the heart.

The real source of my anger is the war on drugs where something like
ibogaine that can help so many, is not being given in the safest way
possible and probably never will be. I go to protests, I sign
petitions, but somehow I have the feeling that it’s more a emotional
good feeling to do these things, but they don’t change anything. I’m
saying what I think everyone who has ever been addicted to drugs
already knows and there’s no reason to carry on about it.

No matter all of what is known about ibogaine or not, I don’t think
Pam’s patrick would have died if there was a doctor there, or he was
able to get ibogaine treatment legally.

KV

On 5/15/05, Lee Albert wrote:
> Hi Krista & Carla,
>
> I understand your frustration but I think in fairness to Carlton there has
> been no claim made on medical competance here by anyone. But what we have
> had is a discussion which points out that the EKG test is limited in its
> safety. And from what I know that is what the protocol recommends, i.e., the
> protocol is limited also due to no way of really knowing how to test for
> vascular disease.
>
> In the case of Patricks death I understand he had an EKG but he died from
> cadiovascular disease which it would not pick up, i.e, the protocol was
> being followed.
>
> Nobody is going to walk away from this discussion considering themselves
> medical experts but at least we are aware in a user friendly way of the
> limitations of the protocol and not to assume that having an EKG is the
> answer to potential heart problems.
>
> Don’t you think thats not worthwhile?
>
> Lee
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Tsogo ozamboga sun shine a chance to cut is a chance to cure (matmos) CYP2D6
Date: May 16, 2005 at 8:56:19 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey cool shit :} thanks for sharing that…..how long did it take u to do that :]]
keep em coming:}

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] SUN IS SHINING :}
Date: May 16, 2005 at 8:27:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

YES finally the sun is shining and i m content with that sunshine…whorah!!!!! so glad i went through the bullshit again…
isnit funny when u decide to quit how u throw away all ur works etc only to be looking for them a few days laer when u really sick…i must have done that millions of times “thats it better throw it awy” and then fuck why did i throw it away i know i could have found something on that spoon to cook up….so glad i did it though……im on a home stretch now…..feeling good …cravings >?what cravings….yah right…..
life causes u so much pain
better take a rig and take it all away–umm better not cause it will only case more pain…..
ah a new day …Love !!!!

Namaste
Matthew

Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy. /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 16, 2005 at 7:19:05 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The fact is junkies are one of the most unhealthy people living on this planet……that said it is not suprising there are so many deaths….ibogaine is a serious medicine…..
getting back to the ekg,ecg etc who knows….i mean i went to the cardiologist after i my first ibo exp and they did an ultrasound, did the ekg while running on the tread mill, the holter monitor agai and it turned out fine supposedly yet to this day i cant lie on my chest and when i get a sudden pain in my chest it almost buckles my to the floor….it is 90% better but there is still someting fucked up…i cant get any straight answers and proapably never will….that said i done ibo second time and survivied YAY!!…now just let me survive the third time and i promise ill be a good boy
Tink hang inthere sis…….ur doctor sounds like he needs some therapy…..maybe  u should turn him on to iboga:} write me!!
love and laughter and peace and compasion

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Carlton B” <carltonb@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 16, 2005 at 6:47:45 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee, there’s no magic bullet test to detect vascular heart disease, sorry.  Not as far as I know, at least.  An ECG might raise warning flag or it might not… there are several different kinds of vascular heart disease and we haven’t been told the specifics of this particular case.   Unless you know exactly what you’re looking for, it’s hard to test.

I had not noticed before that Pam had said the final diagnosis on her husband Patrick (not Pat Kroupa for those who are still confused) was vascular heart disease.  That is not related to the heart’s electrical signaling system, so in my own mind it is very possible that iboga was not a major factor here.  It could just be an unfortunate coincidence of a worn-out heart inside an abused body that couldn’t carry the weight anymore.

And I will not say any more on this subject unless there is a cardiologist present to call bullshit.
—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: Monday, May 16, 2005 6:32 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Krista,

Don’t worry about it.  What counts is what lies underneath and in this case your frustration towards the war on drugs which I completely empathise with.

I know how you feel and I myself find it very sad that we live in a world that seems to be getting more and more corrupt by the hour. Self interest seems to be the guiding force. Yet with eboga, amazing things can be achieved.

Regarding Patrick, if what I understand is right would not an ECG (as opposed to an EKG) have picked up his condition?

Lee

Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:
Lee, what I posted was a little out of frustration and if my tone was
off then I apologize for it. My frustration was at people never
answering their email and I shouldn’t have done that because about
that Carla was right, some of my questions are already answered if I
looked them up, I guess all of them have been answered on this list
already at different times and I was frustrated that nobody replies to
my email but everyone is very busy I guess and I don’t have any right
to expect anyone to do even more things, so very sorry for that from
the heart.

The real source of my anger is the war on drugs where something like
ibogaine that can help so many, is not being given in the safest way
possible and probably never will be. I go to protests, I sign
petitions, but somehow I have the feeling that it’s more a emotional
good feeling to do these things, but they don’t change anything. I’m
saying what I think everyone who has ever been addicted to drugs
already knows and there’s no reason to carry on about it.

No matter all of what is known about ibogaine or not, I don’t think
Pam’s patrick would have died if there was a doctor there, or he was
able to get ibogaine treatment legally.

KV

On 5/15/05, Lee Albert wrote:
> Hi Krista & Carla,
>
> I understand your frustration but I think in fairness to Carlton there has
> been no claim made on medical competance here by anyone. But what we have
> had is a discussion which points out that the EKG test is limited in its
> safety. And from what I know that is what the protocol recommends, i.e., the
> protocol is limited also due to no way of really knowing how to test for
> vascular disease.
>
> In the case of Patricks death I understand he had an EKG but he died from
> cadiovascular disease which it would not pick up, i.e, the protocol was
> being followed.
>
> Nobody is going to walk away from this discussion considering themselves
> medical experts but at least we are aware in a user friendly way of the
> limitations of the protocol and not to assume that having an EKG is the
> answer to potential heart problems.
>
> Don’t you think thats not worthwhile?
>
> Lee
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 16, 2005 at 5:31:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Krista,

Don’t worry about it.  What counts is what lies underneath and in this case your frustration towards the war on drugs which I completely empathise with.

I know how you feel and I myself find it very sad that we live in a world that seems to be getting more and more corrupt by the hour. Self interest seems to be the guiding force. Yet with eboga, amazing things can be achieved.

Regarding Patrick, if what I understand is right would not an ECG (as opposed to an EKG) have picked up his condition?

Lee

Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com> wrote:
Lee, what I posted was a little out of frustration and if my tone was
off then I apologize for it. My frustration was at people never
answering their email and I shouldn’t have done that because about
that Carla was right, some of my questions are already answered if I
looked them up, I guess all of them have been answered on this list
already at different times and I was frustrated that nobody replies to
my email but everyone is very busy I guess and I don’t have any right
to expect anyone to do even more things, so very sorry for that from
the heart.

The real source of my anger is the war on drugs where something like
ibogaine that can help so many, is not being given in the safest way
possible and probably never will be. I go to protests, I sign
petitions, but somehow I have the feeling that it’s more a emotional
good feeling to do these things, but they don’t change anything. I’m
saying what I think everyone who has ever been addicted to drugs
already knows and there’s no reason to carry on about it.

No matter all of what is known about ibogaine or not, I don’t think
Pam’s patrick would have died if there was a doctor there, or he was
able to get ibogaine treatment legally.

KV

On 5/15/05, Lee Albert wrote:
> Hi Krista & Carla,
>
> I understand your frustration but I think in fairness to Carlton there has
> been no claim made on medical competance here by anyone. But what we have
> had is a discussion which points out that the EKG test is limited in its
> safety. And from what I know that is what the protocol recommends, i.e., the
> protocol is limited also due to no way of really knowing how to test for
> vascular disease.
>
> In the case of Patricks death I understand he had an EKG but he died from
> cadiovascular disease which it would not pick up, i.e, the protocol was
> being followed.
>
> Nobody is going to walk away from this discussion considering themselves
> medical experts but at least we are aware in a user friendly way of the
> limitations of the protocol and not to assume that having an EKG is the
> answer to potential heart problems.
>
> Don’t you think thats not worthwhile?
>
> Lee
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Tsogo ozamboga sun shine a chance to cut is a chance to cure (matmos) CYP2D6
Date: May 16, 2005 at 2:25:09 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/MorningWood/browse_thread/thread/f861d64fa01b477c/744b6d00fe9707f3#744b6d00fe9707f3

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] foudini says g’nite
Date: May 16, 2005 at 12:29:31 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m very much a cat   (PLEASE INSERT LOVER HERE LOL I am far less hairy,
well, just a bit…only a few hairballs nowadays Hehheh)
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, 16 May 2005 2:56 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] foudini says g’nite

“I don’t think that he is the one you were meant to protect,” the
stone cat said, and as he spoke, he began to grow shimmery, and I
could see the walls of the basement through his body.  “But there will
always be someone you are meant to protect..  There always is.  We
never knew we would have to protect the queen’s throat from the
queen’s own hand.”  He was wavering and shimering and I knew that he
would soon be gone, just as I knew he had come before, and when I
poened my eyes and was again awake, I would have forgotten his visit.
“Will you come again?”  He said he didn’t know.  He only came to good,
worthy cats, and he had come to me after I threw myself upon the head
of the woodchuck who had attacked my dog.  Did I remember?
I did.
_Foudidn M Cat’s Autobiography

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] foudini says g’nite
Date: May 15, 2005 at 11:49:13 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Gonna have to get that book…….sounds so cool.  I’m very much a cat
(well, pretty much all living things, which makes me a slow house painter
cos I continuously have to rehouse spiders……) but yes cats, always
rescuing them from abandonment or if they’ve simply run from the house they
were at…. they hear that I’m cool for cats and were lining up for a place
here til I had to put the message out that there was no room at the feline
inn, sadly.
Laterzzzz
Kirk

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Monday, 16 May 2005 2:56 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] foudini says g’nite

“I don’t think that he is the one you were meant to protect,” the
stone cat said, and as he spoke, he began to grow shimmery, and I
could see the walls of the basement through his body.  “But there will
always be someone you are meant to protect..  There always is.  We
never knew we would have to protect the queen’s throat from the
queen’s own hand.”  He was wavering and shimering and I knew that he
would soon be gone, just as I knew he had come before, and when I
poened my eyes and was again awake, I would have forgotten his visit.
“Will you come again?”  He said he didn’t know.  He only came to good,
worthy cats, and he had come to me after I threw myself upon the head
of the woodchuck who had attacked my dog.  Did I remember?
I did.
_Foudidn M Cat’s Autobiography

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] foudini says g’nite
Date: May 15, 2005 at 10:56:06 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“I don’t think that he is the one you were meant to protect,” the
stone cat said, and as he spoke, he began to grow shimmery, and I
could see the walls of the basement through his body.  “But there will
always be someone you are meant to protect..  There always is.  We
never knew we would have to protect the queen’s throat from the
queen’s own hand.”  He was wavering and shimering and I knew that he
would soon be gone, just as I knew he had come before, and when I
poened my eyes and was again awake, I would have forgotten his visit.
“Will you come again?”  He said he didn’t know.  He only came to good,
worthy cats, and he had come to me after I threw myself upon the head
of the woodchuck who had attacked my dog.  Did I remember?
I did.
_Foudidn M Cat’s Autobiography

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 15, 2005 at 10:43:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nothing, I vented a little about neither him or kamlet ever replying
to their email, which wasn’t deserved and I do apologize for it again.
He also has the same first name as pam’s husband.

KV

On 5/15/05, shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Huh<i dont get it,what did patrick k have to do with the topic??Must have
missed that,shell

badri maliwal <bmali@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Shelly how could Carla not post especially when it is
to defend P.Krupa’s honor 🙂

— shelley krupa wrote:

Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to find the
information about heart stuff ,that was very
informative .I did look earlier but obviously not in
the right spot.People have died even in clinical
setting, with ekg’s,etc.I’m not real sure what your
post meant about people ranting & not looking facts
up , I do know my inquisitiveness is about an intent
to learn and to be helpful.No doubt Mash has the
safest setup of all I know of.I dont pretend to be
an expert about ibogaine administration,just a
curious fellow travellor.Seems like some people post
here all their random thoughts ,even to include drug
euphoria/idealization ,how can it hurt to ask
questions in the spirit of knowing more?humbly
shelley

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 15, 2005 at 10:16:53 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh by the way Badri ,I’m the krupa ,patrick is the kroupa,ha! : )

shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Huh<i dont get it,what did patrick k have to do with the topic??Must have missed that,shell

badri maliwal <bmali@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Shelly how could Carla not post especially when it is
to defend P.Krupa’s honor 🙂

— shelley krupa wrote:

> Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to find the
information about heart stuff ,that was very
informative .I did look earlier but obviously not in
the right spot.People have died even in clinical
setting, with ekg’s,etc.I’m not real sure what your
post meant about people ranting & not looking facts
up , I do know my inquisitiveness is about an intent
to learn and to be helpful.No doubt Mash has the
safest setup of all I know of.I dont pretend to be
an expert about ibogaine administration,just a
curious fellow travellor.Seems like some people post
here all their random thoughts ,even to include drug
euphoria/idealization ,how can it hurt to ask
questions in the spirit of knowing more?humbly
> shelley

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 15, 2005 at 10:10:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Huh<i dont get it,what did patrick k have to do with the topic??Must have missed that,shell

badri maliwal <bmali@sbcglobal.net> wrote:
Shelly how could Carla not post especially when it is
to defend P.Krupa’s honor 🙂

— shelley krupa wrote:

> Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to find the
information about heart stuff ,that was very
informative .I did look earlier but obviously not in
the right spot.People have died even in clinical
setting, with ekg’s,etc.I’m not real sure what your
post meant about people ranting & not looking facts
up , I do know my inquisitiveness is about an intent
to learn and to be helpful.No doubt Mash has the
safest setup of all I know of.I dont pretend to be
an expert about ibogaine administration,just a
curious fellow travellor.Seems like some people post
here all their random thoughts ,even to include drug
euphoria/idealization ,how can it hurt to ask
questions in the spirit of knowing more?humbly
> shelley

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] brains powered by lemon juice
Date: May 15, 2005 at 10:03:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Just saw Hitchhiker’s Guide to the Galaxy.
Most excellent!
smoking a bowl, and going to bed now, I hope.  Braking up my dose into
2mg increments every 8 hours to see what’ll happen.  Supposed to meet
with the good doc and switch to subutex now.  Fingers and toes duly
crossed.  Ohpleaseohpleaseohplease!  Still sewriously weirded out by
my doc running from me in the parking lot by his office.  Little
fucker.
I’m going to take all of the left over suboxnes I’ve saved up from
this detox and glue them in a pretty orange beehive fashion over the
inside of his assistant’s coffee mug(that I am still holding for
ransom) and then clear coat it so he has to look at the freakin things
everytime he looks at his coffee mug, but he can still use it.  They
were not amused with the ransom demand return letter posted in
response to his ill will upon all of me and mine for generations to
come notice he posted in the group therapy room.
It keeps me busy, for a while.  I mean, come on!  he CHALLENGED me to
take it from his office.  What’s a girl to do?
Thinking about what sleeping meds I ave stashed, and hope I have some
weed left.  I need the rest, especially if I have to meet with him
tomorrow.  Both of them!  Yergh.
Wishing I could join the dolphins.
luvtink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] A breaking open of the head of a different sort.
Date: May 15, 2005 at 7:15:57 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m going to the lawyer tomorrow and he’s gonna send me to his doctor. I’m so gald I’m not strung out dealing with this shit. I have a feeling I’m gonna be feeling better in a few days and its more like taking a big hit in football than a major accident but it sucks right now. Hey at least I’ll probably get some money out of it. ;o) -<

DEFINITELY CALL A LAWYER FIRST THING IN THE MORNING MARK! DO NOT WAIT ONE MORE DAY!
;-0)
Thanks btw for going by Slipper Room Friday and visiting V- I told you she’d be more than happy to see you and I was right. She was very happy you’d stopped by as we’ve not seen you other than me that one night recently for scant minutes. I’ll call you either very late tonight or tomorrow. I’ve got some stuff to ask you and discuss.
Love to you Mark, strictly platonic heterosexual love, but love none-the-less.
Ok, gotta run out and do the door tonight at some blues show at Slipper Room, speaking of Slipper Room, so later all.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] A breaking open of the head of a different sort.

Friday night at about 3:00 am I got into a cab to take me back to brooklyn. As soon as I got in I knew that this guy was driving a little nuts. For any of you familiar with NY, the guys who are all break and gas, cutting in and out. Anyway, were doing about 50 down Bway and I’m bouncing from one side of the car to the other when all of a sudden I knew that he had lost control of the car and we go slamming into a parked truck. I hit my head and crack the plexiglass and end up on the floor. Both cars are so totalled that they have to be towed. EMS gets me out of the car but other than the egg sized lump on my head and slight dizzyness I’m cool so they let me go after about 30 minutes after taking the report. Both the cops and EMS tell me to call a lawyer. So I go home and go to bed and when I wake up my back hurts so much It takes me 15 minutes to pull myself out of bed. I go to the hospital and they say that there is no bone damage but obvious muscle and t! issue damage. They give me a shot of torodol (great med. non narcotic) and it helped a bit. Went home smoked and slept straight through the evening and woke up this morning hurting even more. I’m going to the lawyer tomorrow and he’s gonna send me to his doctor. I’m so gald I’m not strung out dealing with this shit. I have a feeling I’m gonna be feeling better in a few days and its more like taking a big hit in football than a major accident but it sucks right now. Hey at least I’ll probably get some money out of it. ;o) -m.

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
I wrote >I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under
Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU, but
gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major political
party, that would have done the trick.<

But what I actually I meant to write was “…or any other “Republican”
things areN’T going to change in the WOSDU…”
Sorry about that.
;-0)

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 6:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

>none of this is going to change until
the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
change never.<

And under Clinton (a Democrat) things sure were looking up there for a
while, right?
Sorry, couldn’t resist that. I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under
Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU,
but gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major
political party, that would have done the trick.
I realize this hasn’t much to do with your main point address in your
email, but it sorta jumped out at me this particular! comment at this early
hour and I responded, because under Clinton things were just as awful, and
exploded – remember the HUGE jump in prison population numbers under
Clinton, and Plan Colombia, and handing Kosovo to the KLA, a heroin/drug
funded army?
I’m certainly not defending Bush here, but I am pointing out that Bush
is no better and NO worse than any of his recent predecesors when it comes
to waging this stinkin’ war on some drugs and users.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due ou! t Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Krista Vaughan”
To:
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

This is something I find slightly or even a lot to be honest, confusing.

People talk and have conversations or give support and most of all I
think of here as a community which I don’t take part in as much as I’d
like to but I do read the messages. What confuses the shit out of me
is when people who don’t know what they’re talking about start to give
medical advice, with all the best intent I’m sure, but what is the
reason for giving advice when you don’t know, then someone follows it
and dies because they followed your advice?

Then there are the people on here who do know what they’re talking
about, but none of them ever answer anything. I’ve asked no less then
5 times if Patrick Kroupa would give out a written version of his talk
about low dosing ibogaine maintenance and low dosing while using
narcotics at the same time, every time I’ve written I’ve also asked
Jeffrey Kamlet if he’d do the same for his safety talk. Both of them
talked on science and medicine panels, not opinion or political
panels, neither one has ever answered one piece of email. Mash has all
this research, I don’t see Patrick having any questions about ibogaine
ever, I don’t think Kamlet who is the president of the society of
addiction medicine has any questions and I don’t ever see Howard
Lotsoff asking these questions either. What I remember of Kamlet’s
talk, all patients at St. Kitts have some 24 hour hear! t stress test
before a halter or holter monitor however it is called.

Then to top it all off Patrick dying (Pam’s husband, not Dr. Mash’s
son) wasn’t necessary at all and it’s not as if he died because of
some unknown cause or reason, because Howard has put all the safety
and medical tests into the ibogaine manual, which nobody followed.

Idont think there is a lack of research or knowledge, published or
unpublished, I think there is a lack of anybody following the safety
protocols so people die and then how do you expect anyone to follow
all that when they’re having a underground treatment with no doctor
present??

Every one of these problems I think which is only my opinion and yes I
find it frustrating, goes back to ibogaine being scheduled in the same
class as heroin and crack and none of this is going to change until
the war on drugs changes and ! with Bush in office I think that will
change never.

Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!

KV

On 5/14/05, Carlton B wrote:

Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect heart
disease,
they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride. Those are chemicals that
will clog up your heart or vascular system. If you have high cholesterol
in
&! gt;> your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your blood
vessels
or heart and cause disease.

So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start eating well,
it
is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have
advanced heart disease.

I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for dosing on
Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone in-session. The
big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
signaling system. If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to
tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
doesn’t pump.

—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol &
triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some
obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital
signs
,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration
,IV
,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run
in
with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what
a
trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick
,then
its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried
about my hear! t when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d
ever
come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski wrote:

LEE

make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with
bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is
1000
times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium:
Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 15, 2005 at 6:22:32 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I think it is Natures Sunshine that produces what used to be called LIV A, which me and my hep C ex used to help our poor ole livers…..docs impressed with rapid stabilisation of liver count (not sure how reliable these tests are though….) but I’ve only ever had symptoms once ……they’ve changed it’s name now, but I think it says “Formerly known as Prince”………………..no, hang on… “formerly known as Liv A” on the bottle.
Kirk
From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com] 
Sent: Sunday, 15 May 2005 10:27 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hey LEE
Good choice of vit c Lee…..after ibo i have been doing quite a bit of reaserach on vit minerals herbs etc and i found i get positive results….
that said to get the minimal chemicals in the procesing of vit/herbs etc— one thing —LIQUID….plus various brands are much more efficient in the way the process the shit…..ie NATURES SUNSHINE is the top manufucture of vit/herbs……if u look at their process of preparation u ll notice a difference that will surely affect ur health…….but homeopathy is the shit!!!!
Im doing much better thank u…..actually used up Jasons four hours of sleep yest which is undescribable :)…now on with the healing process via the Eboga route 🙂 …the faster the bettter…..i would say end of July the latest…….Love back ……..good weekend everybody…..
tinker the tweaker the thinker where u at girl….sleepin the sleep of angels……i love angels…..so cute and cuddly from the pictures we gathered from eye witnessed accounts ……..i once saw what looked like an angel but he was very ashen and thin with sunken cheekbones and a gun instead of a lyre….hmmmm….and no wings…..”death makes angels of us all and gives us wings where we had shoulders smooth as raven claws”–Morrison
Love You

Namaste
Matthew
Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] A breaking open of the head of a different sort.
Date: May 15, 2005 at 6:03:04 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Geez, that is pretty bad for a taxi driver!!  If that happened here, there’d be major stink in the media (cos we got nuffink else to report, we’re a boring little country lol)
But can relate, I’ve been in this steenkin’ little city for 4 and a bit years, have owned 3 cars, 4 people have crashed into me and one supposed friend crashed my car then conveniently disappeared not to be heard of since…….
The latest was a nose to tail (I call it Car Sodomy….. my poor baby….sniff) and me and my passenger became the Mitsubishi Meat in the Car Sandwich, shunted in to the car infront. I was holding on to the wheel so I had minor whiplash and seatbelt bruise but my poor passenger was turning his head to say “you’re fucking kidding me………..” when the car hit (cos he just finished fixing it from previous accident, it was PERSONAL) so he was real sore the next day.  Amazing how much of the impact the body absorbs and it’s not till the next day you feel the results of it.
Just waiting for the assessors to turn up and check over my mitsi, hopefully they’ll write it off, as much as I like the car, that’s two bangs and things tend to fall apart after them….
Hope you get lots of $$$ serve the driver right.
Kirk
From: mcorcoran [mailto:mcorcoran27@yahoo.com] 
Sent: Monday, 16 May 2005 3:21 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] A breaking open of the head of a different sort.

Friday night at about 3:00 am I got into a cab to take me back to brooklyn. As soon as I got in I knew that this guy was driving a little nuts. For any of you familiar with NY, the guys who are all break and gas, cutting in and out. Anyway, were doing about 50 down Bway and I’m bouncing from one side of the car to the other when all of a sudden I knew that he had lost control of the car and we go slamming into a parked truck. I hit my head and crack the plexiglass and end up on the floor. Both cars are so totalled that they have to be towed. EMS gets me out of the car but other than the egg sized lump on my head and slight dizzyness I’m cool so they let me go after about 30 minutes after taking the report. Both the cops and EMS tell me to call a lawyer. So I go home and go to bed and when I wake up my back hurts so much It takes me 15 minutes to pull myself out of bed. I go to the hospital and they say that there is no bone damage but obvious muscle and tissue damage. They give me a shot of torodol (great med. non narcotic) and it helped a bit. Went home smoked and slept straight through the evening and woke up this morning hurting even more. I’m going to the lawyer tomorrow and he’s gonna send me to his doctor. I’m so gald I’m not strung out dealing with this shit. I have a feeling I’m gonna be feeling better in a few days and its more like taking a big hit in football than a major accident but it sucks right now. Hey at least I’ll probably get some money out of it. ;o) -m.

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
I wrote >I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under
Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU, but
gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major political
party, that would have done the trick.<

But what I actually I meant to write was “…or any other “Republican” 
things areN’T going to change in the WOSDU…”
Sorry about that.
;-0)



Peace and love,
Preston Peet

”Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often 
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, 
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– 
From: “Preston Peet” 
To: 
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 6:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease


> >none of this is going to change until
> the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
> change never.<
>
> And under Clinton (a Democrat) things sure were looking up there for a 
> while, right?
> Sorry, couldn’t resist that. I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under 
> Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU, 
> but gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major 
> political party, that would have done the trick.
> I realize this hasn’t much to do with your main point address in your 
> email, but it sorta jumped out at me this particular comment at this early 
> hour and I responded, because under Clinton things were just as awful, and 
> exploded – remember the HUGE jump in prison population numbers under 
> Clinton, and Plan Colombia, and handing Kosovo to the KLA, a heroin/drug 
> funded army?
> I’m certainly not defending Bush here, but I am pointing out that Bush 
> is no better and NO worse than any of his recent predecesors when it comes 
> to waging this stinkin’ war on some drugs and users.
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often 
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, 
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
> —– Original Message —– 
> From: “Krista Vaughan” 
> To: 
> Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
>
>
> This is something I find slightly or even a lot to be honest, confusing.
>
> People talk and have conversations or give support and most of all I
> think of here as a community which I don’t take part in as much as I’d
> like to but I do read the messages. What confuses the shit out of me
> is when people who don’t know what they’re talking about start to give
> medical advice, with all the best intent I’m sure, but what is the
> reason for giving advice when you don’t know, then someone follows it
> and dies because they followed your advice?
>
> Then there are the people on here who do know what they’re talking
> about, but none of them ever answer anything. I’ve asked no less then
> 5 times if Patrick Kroupa would give out a written version of his talk
> about low dosing ibogaine maintenance and low dosing while using
> narcotics at the same time, every time I’ve written I’ve also asked
> Jeffrey Kamlet if he’d do the same for his safety talk. Both of them
> talked on science and medicine panels, not opinion or political
> panels, neither one has ever answered one piece of email. Mash has all
> this research, I don’t see Patrick having any questions about ibogaine
> ever, I don’t think Kamlet who is the president of the society of
> addiction medicine has any questions and I don’t ever see Howard
> Lotsoff asking these questions either. What I remember of Kamlet’s
> talk, all patients at St. Kitts have some 24 hour heart stress test
> before a halter or holter monitor however it is called.
>
> Then to top it all off Patrick dying (Pam’s husband, not Dr. Mash’s
> son) wasn’t necessary at all and it’s not as if he died because of
> some unknown cause or reason, because Howard has put all the safety
> and medical tests into the ibogaine manual, which nobody followed.
>
> Idont think there is a lack of research or knowledge, published or
> unpublished, I think there is a lack of anybody following the safety
> protocols so people die and then how do you expect anyone to follow
> all that when they’re having a underground treatment with no doctor
> present??
>
> Every one of these problems I think which is only my opinion and yes I
> find it frustrating, goes back to ibogaine being scheduled in the same
> class as heroin and crack and none of this is going to change until
> the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
> change never.
>
> Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
> talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
> that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
> need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
> representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
> talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
> prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!
>
> KV
>
> On 5/14/05, Carlton B wrote:
>>
>> Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect heart 
>> disease,
>> they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride. Those are chemicals that
>> will clog up your heart or vascular system. If you have high cholesterol 
>> in
>> your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your blood 
>> vessels
>> or heart and cause disease.
>>
>> So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start eating well, 
>> it
>> is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have
>> advanced heart disease.
>>
>> I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
>> vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for dosing on
>> Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone in-session. The
>> big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
>> signaling system. If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to
>> tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
>> doesn’t pump.
>>
>> —–Original Message—–
>> From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
>> Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
>> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>> Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
>>
>>
>> Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol &
>> triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some
>> obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital 
>> signs
>> ,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration 
>> ,IV
>> ,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run 
>> in
>> with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what 
>> a
>> trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick 
>> ,then
>> its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried
>> about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d 
>> ever
>> come back.Take care-shell
>> matthew zielinski wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> LEE
>>
>> make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with
>> bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 
>> 1000
>> times better….LOVE
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Namaste
>> Matthew
>> ________________________________
>> Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium:
>> Join now and get the first two months FREE*
>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
> 
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html 
> [%]
> 
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
> 
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html 
> [%]
> 
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
> 



/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 15, 2005 at 5:38:05 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee, what I posted was a little out of frustration and if my tone was
off then I apologize for it. My frustration was at people never
answering their email and I shouldn’t have done that because about
that Carla was right, some of my questions are already answered if I
looked them up, I guess all of them have been answered on this list
already at different times and I was frustrated that nobody replies to
my email but everyone is very busy I guess and I don’t have any right
to expect anyone to do even more things, so very sorry for that from
the heart.

The real source of my anger is the war on drugs where something like
ibogaine that can help so many, is not being given in the safest way
possible and probably never will be. I go to protests, I sign
petitions, but somehow I have the feeling that it’s more a emotional
good feeling to do these things, but they don’t change anything. I’m
saying what I think everyone who has ever been addicted to drugs
already knows and there’s no reason to carry on about it.

No matter all of what is known about ibogaine or not, I don’t think
Pam’s patrick would have died if there was a doctor there, or he was
able to get ibogaine treatment legally.

KV

On 5/15/05, Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Krista & Carla,

I understand your frustration but I think in fairness to Carlton there has
been no claim made on medical competance here by anyone. But what we have
had is a discussion which points out that the EKG test is limited in its
safety. And from what I know that is what the protocol recommends, i.e., the
protocol is limited also due to no way of really knowing how to test for
vascular disease.

In the case of Patricks death I understand he had an EKG but he died from
cadiovascular disease which it would not pick up, i.e, the protocol was
being followed.

Nobody is going to walk away from this discussion considering themselves
medical experts but at least we are aware in a user friendly way of the
limitations of the protocol and not to assume that having an EKG is the
answer to potential heart problems.

Don’t you think thats not worthwhile?

Lee

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Patrick’s condition -was- Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 5:08:19 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

nick – did you get to meet up with dana?

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Howard,
I recollect that Pam posted saying the post-mortem result came back as cardiovascular disease which is what then kicked off the outfield discussion on some publicity I picked up to sell supplements based on levels of lipoproteins in the blood supposedly to detect this type of condition…..
Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/15/05 3:47:43 AM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

>I notice that the protocol does not include a heart stress test, in
>which a person exercises while wearing a halter monitor. Perhaps
>this should be added in light of the recent death of Pam’s Patrick,
>if it would have revealed his condition.

I must have missed it. What was patrick’s condition?

Thanks

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] A breaking open of the head of a different sort.
Date: May 15, 2005 at 4:42:45 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i’m not thinking about what i might be able to buy and more who can i pay back first. but yeah your right i’m feeling lousy today but its so nice not to be worried about uping my dose or copping extra dope. Its so nice to be free and just feel lousy like the rest of humanity does.
Hope your doing well. Thanks

matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
Glad u are ok……..it would be nice if u got some $$…..just make sure ur health is in order before getting too mcuh concern with the mighty dollar :}

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Patrick’s condition -was- Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 4:14:53 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Howard,
I recollect that Pam posted saying the post-mortem result came back as cardiovascular disease which is what then kicked off the outfield discussion on some publicity I picked up to sell supplements based on levels of lipoproteins in the blood supposedly to detect this type of condition…..
Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/15/05 3:47:43 AM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

>I notice that the protocol does not include a heart stress test, in
>which a person exercises while wearing a halter monitor. Perhaps
>this should be added in light of the recent death of Pam’s Patrick,
>if it would have revealed his condition.

I must have missed it. What was patrick’s condition?

Thanks

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Patrick’s condition -was- Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 4:04:35 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What was patrick’s condition?

I didn’t save Pam’s emails, so this may bear some correction: going
in he was addicted to something in the opiate family and apparently
was rather opposed to healthy eating. He died suddenly three days
after taking ibogaine. An autopsy showed that the walls of his
heart were thin, and the discussion of whether this condition is
detectable has pointed toward stress testing the heart.

On Sun, 15 May 2005 06:59:06 -0700 HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 5/15/05 3:47:43 AM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

I notice that the protocol does not include a heart stress test,
in
which a person exercises while wearing a halter monitor. Perhaps
this should be added in light of the recent death of Pam’s
Patrick,
if it would have revealed his condition.

I must have missed it.  What was patrick’s condition?

Thanks

Howard

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: badri maliwal <bmali@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble
Date: May 15, 2005 at 3:38:09 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Shelly how could Carla not post especially when it is
to defend P.Krupa’s honor 🙂

— shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:

Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to find the
information about heart stuff ,that was very
informative .I did look earlier but obviously not in
the right spot.People have died even in clinical
setting, with ekg’s,etc.I’m not real sure what your
post meant about people ranting & not looking facts
up , I do know my inquisitiveness is about an intent
to learn and to be helpful.No doubt Mash has the
safest setup of all I know of.I dont pretend to be
an expert about ibogaine administration,just a
curious fellow travellor.Seems like some  people  post
here all their random thoughts ,even to include  drug
euphoria/idealization ,how can it hurt to ask
questions in the spirit of knowing more?humbly
shelley

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 3:31:17 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sorry, left off the ‘l’ at the end:

http://www.ibogaine.org/manual.html

On Sun, 15 May 2005 10:58:14 -0700 MrPure@aol.com wrote:
_www.ibogaine.org/manual.htm_ (http://www.ibogaine.org/manual.htm)

.   I just
tried to find this web page but am having no success, can anyone
help me  out?
thanks list.
peace, long live Dana Beal.
James.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] A breaking open of the head of a different sort.
Date: May 15, 2005 at 3:15:42 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Glad u are ok……..it would be nice if u got some $$…..just make sure ur health is in order before getting too mcuh concern with the mighty dollar :}

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 3:13:06 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi James
add an L to the end of the url…..LOVe

Namaste
Matthew

Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: MrPure@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 1:58:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

www.ibogaine.org/manual.htm.  I just tried to find this web page but am having no success, can anyone help me out?
thanks list.
peace, long live Dana Beal.
James.

 

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] world view
Date: May 15, 2005 at 1:16:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“We cats cannot contemplate anything-unless that thing is a possible
mouse-for very long.  Our attention leaps from this to that, from past
to present.  We look at the world and struggle to understand it, and
the struggle is so difficult, we go to sleep and take our famous naps.
And while we sleep, we dream our dreams of past lives and past
generations of cats, and sometimes when we waken, we have the answer
to the question that so exhausted us and caused us to close our eyes.”

_Foudini

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fwd: failure notice
Date: May 15, 2005 at 11:23:01 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

———- Forwarded message ———-
From: MAILER-DAEMON@serenity.mindvox.com <MAILER-DAEMON@serenity.mindvox.com>
Date: 15 May 2005 14:55:10 -0000
Subject: failure notice
To: tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com

Hi. This is the qmail-send program at serenity.mindvox.com.
I’m afraid I wasn’t able to deliver your message to the following addresses.
This is a permanent error; I’ve given up. Sorry it didn’t work out.

<ibogaine@mindvox.com>:
ezmlm-reject: fatal: Sorry, I don’t accept message with empty Subject (#5.7.0)

— Below this line is a copy of the message.

Return-Path: <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Received: (qmail 15494 invoked from network); 15 May 2005 14:55:10 -0000
Received: from rproxy.gmail.com (64.233.170.198)
by mindvox.com with SMTP; 15 May 2005 14:55:10 -0000
Received: by rproxy.gmail.com with SMTP id 1so119908rny
for <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; Sun, 15 May 2005 08:16:19 -0700 (PDT)
DomainKey-Signature: a=rsa-sha1; q=dns; c=nofws;
s=beta; d=gmail.com;
h=received:message-id:date:from:reply-to:to:subject:mime-version:content-type:content-transfer-encoding:content-disposition;
b=JofJJeF9fK9jfvGiFyodeRA50Tcq9pBs5YyfG7kCFPRvETkYR7GZO0AWz2UQSgavnud3szKQZBhu+FZAylHdY2LJ0Pl/lccDjzadUpcWfIuiJXsZK8rWqNfEGQ1Fj3c2LowUDGb8HIkVtBMwn99QDx6vSh2d4ijnOfNJWSDZyyw=
Received: by 10.38.8.8 with SMTP id 8mr103213rnh;
Sun, 15 May 2005 08:16:19 -0700 (PDT)
Received: by 10.38.8.61 with HTTP; Sun, 15 May 2005 08:16:19 -0700 (PDT)
Message-ID: <9f892df005051508165a6bdd5e@mail.gmail.com>
Date: Sun, 15 May 2005 11:16:19 -0400
From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Reply-To: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject:
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1
Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable
Content-Disposition: inline

“Cats are willful, stubborn creatures.  They do not like to learn
from experience.  They are optimists who say to themselves, “If the
world is not wonderful place today, tomorrow it will be transformed.=20
Tomorrow is another day!  What does tomorrow have to do with
yesterday?  Every day the entire world is created all over again.=20
This may be the day when all bad things are erased.  I cannot wait to
get out into this day and see if the world has been made over as I
wanted it to be.”
Then there are cats like me, the exceptions to the rule, the
pessimists.  Still, years of happiness have begun wearing my pessimism
away, and every year I shed more of it, as I shed my summer fur before
the winter.”

-from Foudini M Cat’s autobiography

So I had an evening that didn’t suck, and I managed to live
through prom night without having to bail any of my friends kids out
of jail or kick anyone’s ass.  I see myself in Allena, and want to
throttle her sometimes, but she’s got a good head on her shoulders,
and isn’t afraid to speak up when she has a serious question or
problem.  I’m just so glad that I’m not anywhere near the age of 16
any more.  Besides, it’s good to be the aunty, and the fact that i
have these 3 teenagers that will learn by example better than by
anything I could say helps to keep me focused and even more determined
to keep on the path I’ve chosen.  They know that I’ve been a junky,
and they see me going to school and coming off of the suboxone, and
their encouragement and support means more to me than I could ever
imagine.
It’s an honour, truly, to be trusted by these kids, and to have
them value (and occasionally even implement) some of the advice that
they ask me for.  The fact they even ASK me for my thoughts and
opinions makes me all mushy inside 🙂  Thank you, Vycky, for your
children!!
Ummm, mcorchoran (sp?), hope you’re doing better.  I felt something
was horribly awry, and even though I’ve never met you, it just goes to
prove that we Ibogahauts really are connected in the deepest spiritual
sense.  Sending you patience love and healing…
Than you all for your support and love while I go through this shit.=20
It’ll be over eventually, and I know for a fact that i wouldn’t be
able to do this without your help.  I’ve decided that once I’m clean,
and I sell my book, I’m going to fund the overthrowing of the powers
that be, and you are ALL invited!! 🙂
Rainy Sunday, chill in the air, feels like October, not May, b ut I
love weather like this.  It’s great for blunts and movies and chinese
food, or writing and caffeine and painting.  Or better yet, SLEEP!!
I spent the night at a friend’s, and had to smile and bullshit my way
through her parents coming home early.  Felt like I was 14 again,
hiding the red eyes and giggling, trying not to act stoned.  Her mom
and dad were Air Force, and are hard core right wing evangelical
christians, so, needless to say, we don’t discuss politics or
religion…I’ve learned an awful lot about Croatia, Slovinia, Turkey,
Yugolavia, that whole area where they were stationed for the majority
of my friends childhood.  I can’t imagine what it must’ve been like.=20
Maybe that’s why she’s so fucking christian.  Better that than other
things…
Well, I hear the beginnings of a major brother-sister rumble beginning
behind me, so I must away.
Love to you all, and Matt, I AM SO FREAKIN’ PROUD OF YOU!!!
Glad you gat some sleep finally! Don’t let your parents take away your
victory.  Just because you are changing your life, and evolving,
gaining a piece of your self back bit by hard won bit, doesn’t mean
that the people around you are, so try not to let it get you down.  I
know-WE know-how hard of a thing you just did, and we’re here for you,
especially when they aren’t.
May the force be with you..
tinkerhell

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] A breaking open of the head of a different sort.
Date: May 15, 2005 at 11:20:34 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Friday night at about 3:00 am I got into a cab to take me back to brooklyn. As soon as I got in I knew that this guy was driving a little nuts. For any of you familiar with NY, the guys who are all break and gas, cutting in and out. Anyway, were doing about 50 down Bway and I’m bouncing from one side of the car to the other when all of a sudden I knew that he had lost control of the car and we go slamming into a parked truck. I hit my head and crack the plexiglass and end up on the floor. Both cars are so totalled that they have to be towed. EMS gets me out of the car but other than the egg sized lump on my head and slight dizzyness I’m cool so they let me go after about 30 minutes after taking the report. Both the cops and EMS tell me to call a lawyer. So I go home and go to bed and when I wake up my back hurts so much It takes me 15 minutes to pull myself out of bed. I go to the hospital and they say that there is no bone damage but obvious muscle and tissue damage. They give me a shot of torodol (great med. non narcotic) and it helped a bit. Went home smoked and slept straight through the evening and woke up this morning hurting even more. I’m going to the lawyer tomorrow and he’s gonna send me to his doctor. I’m so gald I’m not strung out dealing with this shit. I have a feeling I’m gonna be feeling better in a few days and its more like taking a big hit in football than a major accident but it sucks right now. Hey at least I’ll probably get some money out of it. ;o) -m.

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
I wrote >I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under
Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU, but
gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major political
party, that would have done the trick.<

But what I actually I meant to write was “…or any other “Republican”
things areN’T going to change in the WOSDU…”
Sorry about that.
;-0)

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 6:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

> >none of this is going to change until
> the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
> change never.<
>
> And under Clinton (a Democrat) things sure were looking up there for a
> while, right?
> Sorry, couldn’t resist that. I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under
> Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU,
> but gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major
> political party, that would have done the trick.
> I realize this hasn’t much to do with your main point address in your
> email, but it sorta jumped out at me this particular comment at this early
> hour and I responded, because under Clinton things were just as awful, and
> exploded – remember the HUGE jump in prison population numbers under
> Clinton, and Plan Colombia, and handing Kosovo to the KLA, a heroin/drug
> funded army?
> I’m certainly not defending Bush here, but I am pointing out that Bush
> is no better and NO worse than any of his recent predecesors when it comes
> to waging this stinkin’ war on some drugs and users.
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Krista Vaughan”
> To:
> Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:56 PM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
>
>
> This is something I find slightly or even a lot to be honest, confusing.
>
> People talk and have conversations or give support and most of all I
> think of here as a community which I don’t take part in as much as I’d
> like to but I do read the messages. What confuses the shit out of me
> is when people who don’t know what they’re talking about start to give
> medical advice, with all the best intent I’m sure, but what is the
> reason for giving advice when you don’t know, then someone follows it
> and dies because they followed your advice?
>
> Then there are the people on here who do know what they’re talking
> about, but none of them ever answer anything. I’ve asked no less then
> 5 times if Patrick Kroupa would give out a written version of his talk
> about low dosing ibogaine maintenance and low dosing while using
> narcotics at the same time, every time I’ve written I’ve also asked
> Jeffrey Kamlet if he’d do the same for his safety talk. Both of them
> talked on science and medicine panels, not opinion or political
> panels, neither one has ever answered one piece of email. Mash has all
> this research, I don’t see Patrick having any questions about ibogaine
> ever, I don’t think Kamlet who is the president of the society of
> addiction medicine has any questions and I don’t ever see Howard
> Lotsoff asking these questions either. What I remember of Kamlet’s
> talk, all patients at St. Kitts have some 24 hour heart stress test
> before a halter or holter monitor however it is called.
>
> Then to top it all off Patrick dying (Pam’s husband, not Dr. Mash’s
> son) wasn’t necessary at all and it’s not as if he died because of
> some unknown cause or reason, because Howard has put all the safety
> and medical tests into the ibogaine manual, which nobody followed.
>
> Idont think there is a lack of research or knowledge, published or
> unpublished, I think there is a lack of anybody following the safety
> protocols so people die and then how do you expect anyone to follow
> all that when they’re having a underground treatment with no doctor
> present??
>
> Every one of these problems I think which is only my opinion and yes I
> find it frustrating, goes back to ibogaine being scheduled in the same
> class as heroin and crack and none of this is going to change until
> the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
> change never.
>
> Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
> talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
> that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
> need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
> representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
> talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
> prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!
>
> KV
>
> On 5/14/05, Carlton B wrote:
>>
>> Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect heart
>> disease,
>> they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride. Those are chemicals that
>> will clog up your heart or vascular system. If you have high cholesterol
>> in
>> your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your blood
>> vessels
>> or heart and cause disease.
>>
>> So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start eating well,
>> it
>> is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have
>> advanced heart disease.
>>
>> I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
>> vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for dosing on
>> Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone in-session. The
>> big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
>> signaling system. If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to
>> tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
>> doesn’t pump.
>>
>> —–Original Message—–
>> From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
>> Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
>> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>> Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
>>
>>
>> Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol &
>> triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some
>> obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital
>> signs
>> ,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration
>> ,IV
>> ,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run
>> in
>> with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what
>> a
>> trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick
>> ,then
>> its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried
>> about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d
>> ever
>> come back.Take care-shell
>> matthew zielinski wrote:
>>
>>
>>
>> LEE
>>
>> make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with
>> bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is
>> 1000
>> times better….LOVE
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Namaste
>> Matthew
>> ________________________________
>> Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium:
>> Join now and get the first two months FREE*
>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> [%]
>
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> [%]
>
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Patrick’s condition -was- Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 9:59:06 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/15/05 3:47:43 AM, slowone@hush.ai writes:

I notice that the protocol does not include a heart stress test, in
which a person exercises while wearing a halter monitor. Perhaps
this should be added in light of the recent death of Pam’s Patrick,
if it would have revealed his condition.

I must have missed it.  What was patrick’s condition?

Thanks

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 15, 2005 at 7:19:40 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I wrote >I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under
Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU, but
gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major political
party, that would have done the trick.<

But what I actually I meant to write was “…or any other “Republican” things areN’T going to change in the WOSDU…”
Sorry about that.
;-0)

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 6:44 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

>none of this is going to change until
the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
change never.<

And under Clinton (a Democrat) things sure were looking up there for a while, right?
Sorry, couldn’t resist that. I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU, but gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major political party, that would have done the trick.
I realize this hasn’t much to do with your main point address in your email, but it sorta jumped out at me this particular comment at this early hour and I responded, because under Clinton things were just as awful, and exploded – remember the HUGE jump in prison population numbers under Clinton, and Plan Colombia, and handing Kosovo to the KLA, a heroin/drug funded army?
I’m certainly not defending Bush here, but I am pointing out that Bush is no better and NO worse than any of his recent predecesors when it comes to waging this stinkin’ war on some drugs and users.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Krista Vaughan” <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

This is something I find slightly or even a lot to be honest, confusing.

People talk and have conversations or give support and most of all I
think of here as a community which I don’t take part in as much as I’d
like to but I do read the messages. What confuses the shit out of me
is when people who don’t know what they’re talking about start to give
medical advice, with all the best intent I’m sure, but what is the
reason for giving advice when you don’t know, then someone follows it
and dies because they followed your advice?

Then there are the people on here who do know what they’re talking
about, but none of them ever answer anything. I’ve asked no less then
5 times if Patrick Kroupa would give out a written version of his talk
about low dosing ibogaine maintenance and low dosing while using
narcotics at the same time, every time I’ve written I’ve also asked
Jeffrey Kamlet if he’d do the same for his safety talk. Both of them
talked on science and medicine panels, not opinion or political
panels, neither one has ever answered one piece of email. Mash has all
this research, I don’t see Patrick having any questions about ibogaine
ever, I don’t think Kamlet who is the president of the society of
addiction medicine has any questions and I don’t ever see Howard
Lotsoff asking these questions either. What I remember of Kamlet’s
talk, all patients at St. Kitts have some 24 hour heart stress test
before a halter or holter monitor however it is called.

Then to top it all off Patrick dying (Pam’s husband, not Dr. Mash’s
son) wasn’t necessary at all and it’s not as if he died because of
some unknown cause or reason, because Howard has put all the safety
and medical tests into the ibogaine manual, which nobody followed.

Idont think there is a lack of research or knowledge, published or
unpublished, I think there is a lack of anybody following the safety
protocols so people die and then how do you expect anyone to follow
all that when they’re having a underground treatment with no doctor
present??

Every one of these problems I think which is only my opinion and yes I
find it frustrating, goes back to ibogaine being scheduled in the same
class as heroin and crack and none of this is going to change until
the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
change never.

Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!

KV

On 5/14/05, Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:

Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect heart disease,
they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride.  Those are chemicals that
will clog up your heart or vascular system.  If you have high cholesterol in
your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your blood vessels
or heart and cause disease.

So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start eating well, it
is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have
advanced heart disease.

I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for dosing on
Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone in-session.   The
big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
signaling system.  If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to
tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
doesn’t pump.

—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol &
triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some
obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital signs
,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration ,IV
,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run in
with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what a
trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick ,then
its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried
about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d ever
come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

LEE

make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with
bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000
times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium:
Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 15, 2005 at 6:44:30 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

none of this is going to change until
the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
change never.<

And under Clinton (a Democrat) things sure were looking up there for a while, right?
Sorry, couldn’t resist that. I get kinda tired of hearing about how “under Bush” or any other “Republican” things are going to change in the WOSDU, but gee, if only “we’d” “elected” some other dufus of some other major political party, that would have done the trick.
I realize this hasn’t much to do with your main point address in your email, but it sorta jumped out at me this particular comment at this early hour and I responded, because under Clinton things were just as awful, and exploded – remember the HUGE jump in prison population numbers under Clinton, and Plan Colombia, and handing Kosovo to the KLA, a heroin/drug funded army?
I’m certainly not defending Bush here, but I am pointing out that Bush is no better and NO worse than any of his recent predecesors when it comes to waging this stinkin’ war on some drugs and users.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Krista Vaughan” <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:56 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

This is something I find slightly or even a lot to be honest, confusing.

People talk and have conversations or give support and most of all I
think of here as a community which I don’t take part in as much as I’d
like to but I do read the messages. What confuses the shit out of me
is when people who don’t know what they’re talking about start to give
medical advice, with all the best intent I’m sure, but what is the
reason for giving advice when you don’t know, then someone follows it
and dies because they followed your advice?

Then there are the people on here who do know what they’re talking
about, but none of them ever answer anything. I’ve asked no less then
5 times if Patrick Kroupa would give out a written version of his talk
about low dosing ibogaine maintenance and low dosing while using
narcotics at the same time, every time I’ve written I’ve also asked
Jeffrey Kamlet if he’d do the same for his safety talk. Both of them
talked on science and medicine panels, not opinion or political
panels, neither one has ever answered one piece of email. Mash has all
this research, I don’t see Patrick having any questions about ibogaine
ever, I don’t think Kamlet who is the president of the society of
addiction medicine has any questions and I don’t ever see Howard
Lotsoff asking these questions either. What I remember of Kamlet’s
talk, all patients at St. Kitts have some 24 hour heart stress test
before a halter or holter monitor however it is called.

Then to top it all off Patrick dying (Pam’s husband, not Dr. Mash’s
son) wasn’t necessary at all and it’s not as if he died because of
some unknown cause or reason, because Howard has put all the safety
and medical tests into the ibogaine manual, which nobody followed.

Idont think there is a lack of research or knowledge, published or
unpublished, I think there is a lack of anybody following the safety
protocols so people die and then how do you expect anyone to follow
all that when they’re having a underground treatment with no doctor
present??

Every one of these problems I think which is only my opinion and yes I
find it frustrating, goes back to ibogaine being scheduled in the same
class as heroin and crack and none of this is going to change until
the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
change never.

Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!

KV

On 5/14/05, Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:

Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect heart disease,
they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride.  Those are chemicals that
will clog up your heart or vascular system.  If you have high cholesterol in
your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your blood vessels
or heart and cause disease.

So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start eating well, it
is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have
advanced heart disease.

I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for dosing on
Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone in-session.   The
big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
signaling system.  If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to
tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
doesn’t pump.

—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol &
triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some
obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital signs
,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration ,IV
,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run in
with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what a
trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick ,then
its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried
about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d ever
come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

LEE

make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with
bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000
times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium:
Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 15, 2005 at 6:11:42 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Krista & Carla,

I understand your frustration but I think in fairness to Carlton there has been no claim made on medical competance here by anyone. But what we have had is a discussion which points out that the EKG test is limited in its safety. And from what I know that is what the protocol recommends, i.e., the protocol is limited also due to no way of really knowing how to test for vascular disease.

In the case of Patricks death I understand he had an EKG but he died from cadiovascular disease which it would not pick up, i.e, the protocol was being followed.

Nobody is going to walk away from this discussion considering themselves medical experts but at least we are aware in a user friendly way of the limitations of the protocol and not to assume that having an EKG is the answer to potential heart problems.

Don’t you think thats not worthwhile?

Lee

Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Krista, I only meant to point out that there is a false sense of security
from these “protocols” of the EKG. The fact is that the EKG test weeds out
only the obvious crashers… there are so many defects of the heart and
vascular system that an EKG won’t show. It’s better to have one than not
have one, of course, but I think the established providers would agree that
they are working “in the dark” to some extent regarding ibogaine safety.
Nobody knows exactly how it kills people or why it kills people. In fact,
because of its dubious legal status, we may not even know how many people
are actually dying in these treatments. The only way to learn that is
through formal study. I agree that unscheduling ibogaine would make it
easier to get the right kind of studies done, but it is sort of a
chicken-and-egg proposition… you need formal study to get it unscheduled.

> —–Original Message—–
> From: Krista Vaughan [mailto:krista.vaughan@gmail.com]
> Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 8:56 AM
> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
>
> Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
> talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
> that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
> need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
> representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
> talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
> prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!
>
> KV
>
> On 5/14/05, Carlton B wrote:
> >
> > Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect
> heart disease,
> > they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride. Those are chemicals that
> > will clog up your heart or vascular system. If you have high
> cholesterol in
> > your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your
> blood vessels
> > or heart and cause disease.
> >
> > So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start
> eating well, it
> > is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have
> > advanced heart disease.
> >
> > I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
> > vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for
> dosing on
> > Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone
> in-session. The
> > big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
> > signaling system. If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to
> > tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
> > doesn’t pump.
> >
> > —–Original Message—–
> > From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
> > Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
> > To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> > Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
> >
> >
> > Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol &
> > triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some
> > obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the
> old vital signs
> > ,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine
> administration ,IV
> > ,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess
> they’d run in
> > with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias,
> wow what a
> > trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is
> sick ,then
> > its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried
> > about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more
> if I’d ever
> > come back.Take care-shell
> > matthew zielinski wrote:
> >
> >
> >
> > LEE
> >
> > make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with
> > bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid
> anything is 1000
> > times better….LOVE
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Namaste
> > Matthew
> > ________________________________
> > Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium:
> > Join now and get the first two months FREE*
> >
> /]=—————————————————————
> ——=[\
> > [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> > http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> >
> \]=—————————————————————
> ——=[/
>
>
>
> /]=—————————————————————
> ——=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[
/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 15, 2005 at 5:50:28 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Which is why anyone sitting should at a minimum know how to perform cardiopulmonary resuscitation. There is a chart one can print off here under safety first:
http://www.sja-haltonhills.org/psa/2001posteradult.pdf
Thanks Lee

Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect heart disease, they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride.  Those are chemicals that will clog up your heart or vascular system.  If you have high cholesterol in your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your blood vessels or heart and cause disease.

So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start eating well, it is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have advanced heart disease.

I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for dosing on Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone in-session.   The big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical signaling system.  If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart doesn’t pump.
—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol & triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital signs ,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration ,IV ,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run in with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what a trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick ,then its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d ever come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
LEE
make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000 times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 3:47:23 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Looking at the ibogaine treatment manual again in light of the
current discussion,

http://www.ibogaine.org/manual.htm

I notice that the protocol does not include a heart stress test, in
which a person exercises while wearing a halter monitor. Perhaps
this should be added in light of the recent death of Pam’s Patrick,
if it would have revealed his condition.

On Sat, 14 May 2005 22:44:59 -0700 shelley krupa
<skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to find the information
about heart stuff ,that was very informative .I did look earlier
but obviously not in the right spot.People have died even in
clinical setting, with ekg’s,etc.I’m not real sure what your post
meant about people ranting & not looking facts up , I do know my
inquisitiveness is about an intent to learn and to be helpful.No
doubt Mash has the safest setup of all I know of.I dont pretend to

be an expert about ibogaine administration,just a curious fellow
travellor.Seems like some  people post here all their random
thoughts ,even to include drug euphoria/idealization ,how can it
hurt to ask questions in the spirit of knowing more?humbly shelley

Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi Kirsten, none of what you said is news it’s
happened here 300 times already and will probably keep
happening 😉

Patrick used to talk a long time ago, you could call
the medical school and get his office, or if he didn’t
answer Dr. Mash would talk. Note she’d gush about what
a genius patrick is, not list off her data 😉 Don’t
think she’s ever done that. That was a long time ago,
since years all I’ve ever got is a secretary and
nobody ever answers the phone even to say hi.

I think I know who Kamlet is on this list 😉 but he
does post, he always goes through at least two times a
month, answers questions and leaves. I think everyone
is just very busy.

It’s too bad but the rest of your message with the war
on drugs, I do agree with as I think do most here.
Another part I agree with is that nobody bothers to
read anything that has already been written and put
online.

From Howard Lotsof, posting exactly the heart
questions Kamlet answered before. I guess it’s more
fun to vent then bother looking anything up 😉

http://www.doraweiner.org/aatod_hrc.html

I think venting about Patrick, Jeffrey or Howard not
answering your questions the minute you ask when you
can’t go to yahoo or google and look it up, is your
own problem.

This is one of the messages from the last time this
went across when Patrick did say something when
someone else who starts their message by saying they
understand medicine then quotes a abstract and
explains the opposite of what it says 😉

Love to everyone, you especially right now Matthew and
Tink! 🙂

Patrick, Howard, Jeffrey thanks for all you do! 🙂

Carla B

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” wrote:

On Oct 28, 2004, at 1:48 AM, Vector Vector wrote:

You and Patrick cross talk with each other and do
male bonding 😉 Since
your doing it in public and on the list, could I
ask why you won’t use
your real name?

This, coming from someone who has been here for
years using the name
“Vector Vector” …?

You haven’t hidden who you are so why schmoolboy?

?… Why ask whY …?

.:vector:.

— Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:

Stop all HIV meds for at least 4 half lives of
the drug before taking

IBO

This message –>

On Oct 25, 2004, at 6:44 AM, Jamilah wrote:

Dear Sean,

Here are my thoughts on the issue, as I managed
the care of hundreds
of HIV and Hep C folks before I changed jobs. The
major side effects
we watch for when using HIV meds are lactic
acidosis (caused by
NRTI’s) and symptoms that result from combining
the protease
inhibitors with other drugs that are metabolized
using the cytocrome
P450 pathway.

Ibogaine has been studied to see if it uses this
pathway, and it
doesn’t seem to :

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?

cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=9698290

Sean asked a question, Jamilah gave an answer based
upon her opinion.
The conclusion she derived from reading that link up
there, is the
EXACT OPPOSITE of what the abstract she is quoting,
actually says.

“The primary metabolite arises via O-demethylation
at the 12-position
to yield 12-hydroxyibogamine. In this report,
evidence is presented
that the O-demethylation of ibogaine observed in
human hepatic
microsomes is catalyzed primarily by the
polymorphically expressed
cytochrome P-4502D6 (CYP2D6).”

“Thus, it is concluded that ibogaine O-demethylase
is catalyzed by
CYP2D6 and that this isoform is the predominant
enzyme of ibogaine
O-demethylation in humans.”

CYP2D6 is the PRIMARY pathway by which ibogaine is
metabolized, and
anything that competes, is not good.

PLEASE keep in mind that this is a discussion list.
Many people have
conversations, share their opinions, or just hang
out, interact, rant,
and communicate. This does not necessarily mean
that the answers which
are given are correct.

Over the years there are a variety of individuals
who have actually
written the monographs people are quoting — and
sometimes
misinterpreting — here, who answered questions
about their own work,
which has appeared in peer-reviewed journals. There
have been numerous
occasions where someone DID actually ANSWER A
QUESTION THAT WAS ASKED.
Directly and exactly.

For the most part what happens after that is someone
will say sumthin’
like, “But my brother’s, wife’s, cousin’s
next-door-neighbor once read
a book, which said something completely different.
I think…” And
then, the person who gave the correct answer will
land on, “Well, ya
know what, someone asked a question. I know the
answer. I gave the
answer. Instead of thank you I have half a dozen
idiots starting an
argument with me, so why don’t I just not bother. I
can certainly find
something more entertaining to do with my free
time.”

This is in reference to Yet Another CYP2D6
conversation which occured a
while back, not this one. Everybody has been polite
this time. Which
is very cool. Thank you.

The answer Mistah schmoolY gave is correct. He does
know exactly what
he’s talking about. Many of you pretty much know
who he is. Probably
he has reasons for not wanting to directly attach
his name to any
statement made here.

And please try to keep in mind, that there are many
people here who
could easily answer a variety of questions that are
posed. For the
most part, nearly all of them are M.D.s or Ph.D.s;
they are not
activists or participants in the Holy Crusade. They
are not being
compensated for their time. And probably they don’t
want to chat —
much less argue. So… Just be decent to each
other.

Thanks,

Patrick

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=—————————————————————-

—–=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————–

—-=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 15, 2005 at 1:44:59 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Carla ,thanks for your tip on where to find the information about heart stuff ,that was very informative .I did look earlier but obviously not in the right spot.People have died even in clinical setting, with ekg’s,etc.I’m not real sure what your post meant about people ranting & not looking facts up , I do know my inquisitiveness is about an intent to learn and to be helpful.No doubt Mash has the safest setup of all I know of.I dont pretend to be an expert about ibogaine administration,just a curious fellow travellor.Seems like some  people post here all their random thoughts ,even to include drug euphoria/idealization ,how can it hurt to ask questions in the spirit of knowing more?humbly shelley

Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com> wrote:

Hi Kirsten, none of what you said is news it’s
happened here 300 times already and will probably keep
happening 😉

Patrick used to talk a long time ago, you could call
the medical school and get his office, or if he didn’t
answer Dr. Mash would talk. Note she’d gush about what
a genius patrick is, not list off her data 😉 Don’t
think she’s ever done that. That was a long time ago,
since years all I’ve ever got is a secretary and
nobody ever answers the phone even to say hi.

I think I know who Kamlet is on this list 😉 but he
does post, he always goes through at least two times a
month, answers questions and leaves. I think everyone
is just very busy.

It’s too bad but the rest of your message with the war
on drugs, I do agree with as I think do most here.
Another part I agree with is that nobody bothers to
read anything that has already been written and put
online.

From Howard Lotsof, posting exactly the heart
questions Kamlet answered before. I guess it’s more
fun to vent then bother looking anything up 😉

http://www.doraweiner.org/aatod_hrc.html

I think venting about Patrick, Jeffrey or Howard not
answering your questions the minute you ask when you
can’t go to yahoo or google and look it up, is your
own problem.

This is one of the messages from the last time this
went across when Patrick did say something when
someone else who starts their message by saying they
understand medicine then quotes a abstract and
explains the opposite of what it says 😉

Love to everyone, you especially right now Matthew and
Tink! 🙂

Patrick, Howard, Jeffrey thanks for all you do! 🙂

Carla B

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” wrote:

> On Oct 28, 2004, at 1:48 AM, Vector Vector wrote:
>
> > You and Patrick cross talk with each other and do
> male bonding 😉 Since
> > your doing it in public and on the list, could I
> ask why you won’t use
> > your real name?
>
> This, coming from someone who has been here for
> years using the name
> “Vector Vector” …?
>
> > You haven’t hidden who you are so why schmoolboy?
>
> ?… Why ask whY …?
>
> >
> > .:vector:.
> >
> > — Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
> >
> >>
> >> Stop all HIV meds for at least 4 half lives of
> the drug before taking
> >>
> >> IBO
>
> This message –>
>
> On Oct 25, 2004, at 6:44 AM, Jamilah wrote:
>
> > Dear Sean,
> >
> > Here are my thoughts on the issue, as I managed
> the care of hundreds
> > of HIV and Hep C folks before I changed jobs. The
> major side effects
> > we watch for when using HIV meds are lactic
> acidosis (caused by
> > NRTI’s) and symptoms that result from combining
> the protease
> > inhibitors with other drugs that are metabolized
> using the cytocrome
> > P450 pathway.
> >
> > Ibogaine has been studied to see if it uses this
> pathway, and it
> > doesn’t seem to :
> >
> > http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?
> >
>
cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=9698290
>
> Sean asked a question, Jamilah gave an answer based
> upon her opinion.
> The conclusion she derived from reading that link up
> there, is the
> EXACT OPPOSITE of what the abstract she is quoting,
> actually says.
>
> …
>
> “The primary metabolite arises via O-demethylation
> at the 12-position
> to yield 12-hydroxyibogamine. In this report,
> evidence is presented
> that the O-demethylation of ibogaine observed in
> human hepatic
> microsomes is catalyzed primarily by the
> polymorphically expressed
> cytochrome P-4502D6 (CYP2D6).”
>
> …
>
> “Thus, it is concluded that ibogaine O-demethylase
> is catalyzed by
> CYP2D6 and that this isoform is the predominant
> enzyme of ibogaine
> O-demethylation in humans.”
>
> …
>
> CYP2D6 is the PRIMARY pathway by which ibogaine is
> metabolized, and
> anything that competes, is not good.
>
> PLEASE keep in mind that this is a discussion list.
> Many people have
> conversations, share their opinions, or just hang
> out, interact, rant,
> and communicate. This does not necessarily mean
> that the answers which
> are given are correct.
>
> Over the years there are a variety of individuals
> who have actually
> written the monographs people are quoting — and
> sometimes
> misinterpreting — here, who answered questions
> about their own work,
> which has appeared in peer-reviewed journals. There
> have been numerous
> occasions where someone DID actually ANSWER A
> QUESTION THAT WAS ASKED.
> Directly and exactly.
>
> For the most part what happens after that is someone
> will say sumthin’
> like, “But my brother’s, wife’s, cousin’s
> next-door-neighbor once read
> a book, which said something completely different.
> I think…” And
> then, the person who gave the correct answer will
> land on, “Well, ya
> know what, someone asked a question. I know the
> answer. I gave the
> answer. Instead of thank you I have half a dozen
> idiots starting an
> argument with me, so why don’t I just not bother. I
> can certainly find
> something more entertaining to do with my free
> time.”
>
> This is in reference to Yet Another CYP2D6
> conversation which occured a
> while back, not this one. Everybody has been polite
> this time. Which
> is very cool. Thank you.
>
> The answer Mistah schmoolY gave is correct. He does
> know exactly what
> he’s talking about. Many of you pretty much know
> who he is. Probably
> he has reasons for not wanting to directly attach
> his name to any
> statement made here.
>
> And please try to keep in mind, that there are many
> people here who
> could easily answer a variety of questions that are
> posed. For the
> most part, nearly all of them are M.D.s or Ph.D.s;
> they are not
> activists or participants in the Holy Crusade. They
> are not being
> compensated for their time. And probably they don’t
> want to chat —
> much less argue. So… Just be decent to each
> other.
>
> Thanks,
>
> Patrick
>

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Clean Water <clean_wtr@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] talking to 7 brave people
Date: May 14, 2005 at 9:51:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://collins.senate.gov/high/contactemail.htm

http://hagel.senate.gov/index.cfm?FuseAction=Offices.Contact

http://specter.senate.gov/index.cfm?FuseAction=ContactInfo.Home

http://warner.senate.gov/contact/offices.htm

http://dewine.senate.gov/contactinfo.htm

http://murkowski.senate.gov/contact.html

http://www.sununu.senate.gov/contact.html

http://www.sununu.senate.gov/webform.html

— slowone@hush.ai wrote:
In the shorter term, the Republicans in the U.S. are
poised to
eliminate the use of the filibuster for blocking
approval of
judges, which would mean that many radically
conservative judges
could be put in place for a long time to come.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050514/ap_on_go_co/filibuster_fight

http://news.yahoo.com/s/latimests/20050514/ts_latimes/juristspickedf
orshowdownonfilibuster

In the long term, due to increasing use of fossil
fuels we are
heading for major, irreversible climate change that
will likely
result in very different geography books as various
regions become
uninhabitable. The Bush administration is
responsible for blocking
efforts to avoid this outcome (the Kyoto accords).

http://www.newyorker.com/online/content/articles/050425on_onlineonly
01

On Sat, 14 May 2005 12:21:21 -0700 tink
<tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
Am I the only one who feels like something is
horribly wrong?
I’ve
felt this weirdo vibe for about two-three days now,
and I’m
beginning
to get nauseous from it.  It’s like somethiing is
in the process
of
happening or it did and I just am not aware of what
it is.
Is it just me?  Does anyone else happen to be
picking up on it, or
have I finally lost my mind completely?  I learned
to trust my
stomach
and it’s reactions while on the streets, and I
haven’t been wrong
yet,
but that and $3 will get you a cup of coffee…
Anyhoo, enough of my happy ass…
luv to you all
tink

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to
get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush
Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail
Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 14, 2005 at 9:37:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’m with you Carla. I’ve watched and verbally spewed here for about a year and a half now, and I have to say that the docs here post of their own free will, and they mean to help. Just like your own family doc, they all are different and have different opinions. If the US government would change things then maybe we could actually get something done. In the meantime, we are on our own. Those who chose to do Ibogaine without medical supervision do so at their own risk, and the risk of the provider, providing you have one. The data is out there. Just read it. Then make a decision. How many people OD’ed just today in the US? Do the math. I’m not waiting on Uncle Salty. I aint got time. Neither do the rest of the junkies in the world. I’m alive thanks to Ibogaine. Those who want to help, then help, those who don’t, get outta the way.              Randy

From: Vivienne Elanta <vivienneelanta@yahoo.com.au>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 9:09:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Unfortunately I think this is how your own country runs, you look like you have
the 4th reich rising in the united states, the civilized world is not so happy.

That is not to say that it is that much better anywhere else, I unfortunately
agree with the ibogaine rite of passage film, which is a beautiful film Mr.
Deloenen! Where Howard and Patrick say the same thing, ibogaine is never going
anywhere legally.

As bad as it might be, didn’t Patrick announce that the phase 1 clinical trials
with ibogaine at the university of miami are starting again right now?

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/index.html?News/2005COSM.html~mainFrame

There was some other story in the press, the url was posted here where Dr. Mash
announced she had received quarter million in private funding.

Blessed be.
Vivienne Elanta

— Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:

Krista, I only meant to point out that there is a false sense of
security
from these “protocols” of the EKG.  The fact is that the EKG test
weeds out
only the obvious crashers… there are so many defects of the heart and
vascular system that an EKG won’t show.  It’s better to have one than
not
have one, of course, but I think the established providers would
agree that
they are working “in the dark” to some extent regarding ibogaine safety.
Nobody knows exactly how it kills people or why it kills people.  In
fact,
because of its dubious legal status, we may not even know how many
people
are actually dying in these treatments.  The only way to learn that is
through formal study.  I agree that unscheduling ibogaine would make it
easier to get the right kind of studies done, but it is sort of a
chicken-and-egg proposition… you need formal study to get it
unscheduled.

—–Original Message—–
From: Krista Vaughan [mailto:krista.vaughan@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 8:56 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!

KV

On 5/14/05, Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:

Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect

heart disease,

they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride.  Those are
chemicals that
will clog up your heart or vascular system.  If you have high

cholesterol in

your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your

blood vessels

or heart and cause disease.

So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start

eating well, it

is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but
still have
advanced heart disease.

I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for

dosing on

Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone

in-session.   The

big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
signaling system.  If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the
ability to
tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
doesn’t pump.

—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad
cholesterol &
triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there
was some
obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the

old vital signs

,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine

administration ,IV

,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess

they’d run in

with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias,

wow what a

trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is

sick ,then

its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never
worried
about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more

if I’d ever

come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

LEE

make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones
with
bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid

anything is 1000

times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN
Premium:
Join now and get the first two months FREE*

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\

[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:

http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]
=———————————————————————=[
/

/]
=———————————————————————
=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]
=———————————————————————
=[/

Find local movie times and trailers on Yahoo! Movies.
http://au.movies.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Carlton B” <carltonb@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 8:52:48 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Krista, I only meant to point out that there is a false sense of security
from these “protocols” of the EKG.  The fact is that the EKG test weeds out
only the obvious crashers… there are so many defects of the heart and
vascular system that an EKG won’t show.  It’s better to have one than not
have one, of course, but I think the established providers would agree that
they are working “in the dark” to some extent regarding ibogaine safety.
Nobody knows exactly how it kills people or why it kills people.  In fact,
because of its dubious legal status, we may not even know how many people
are actually dying in these treatments.  The only way to learn that is
through formal study.  I agree that unscheduling ibogaine would make it
easier to get the right kind of studies done, but it is sort of a
chicken-and-egg proposition… you need formal study to get it unscheduled.

—–Original Message—–
From: Krista Vaughan [mailto:krista.vaughan@gmail.com]
Sent: Sunday, May 15, 2005 8:56 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!

KV

On 5/14/05, Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:

Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect
heart disease,
they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride.  Those are chemicals that
will clog up your heart or vascular system.  If you have high
cholesterol in
your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your
blood vessels
or heart and cause disease.

So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start
eating well, it
is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have
advanced heart disease.

I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for
dosing on
Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone
in-session.   The
big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
signaling system.  If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to
tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
doesn’t pump.

—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol &
triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some
obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the
old vital signs
,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine
administration ,IV
,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess
they’d run in
with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias,
wow what a
trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is
sick ,then
its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried
about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more
if I’d ever
come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

LEE

make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with
bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid
anything is 1000
times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium:
Join now and get the first two months FREE*

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[
/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Vascular Trouble Re: [Ibogaine] CYP2D6 HIV and Ibogaine
Date: May 14, 2005 at 8:37:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Kirsten, none of what you said is news it’s
happened here 300 times already and will probably keep
happening 😉

Patrick used to talk a long time ago, you could call
the medical school and get his office, or if he didn’t
answer Dr. Mash would talk. Note she’d gush about what
a genius patrick is, not list off her data 😉 Don’t
think she’s ever done that. That was a long time ago,
since years all I’ve ever got is a secretary and
nobody ever answers the phone even to say hi.

I think I know who Kamlet is on this list 😉 but he
does post, he always goes through at least two times a
month, answers questions and leaves. I think everyone
is just very busy.

It’s too bad but the rest of your message with the war
on drugs, I do agree with as I think do most here.
Another part I agree with is that nobody bothers to
read anything that has already been written and put
online.

From Howard Lotsof, posting exactly the heart
questions Kamlet answered before. I guess it’s more
fun to vent then bother looking anything up 😉

http://www.doraweiner.org/aatod_hrc.html

I think venting about Patrick, Jeffrey or Howard not
answering your questions the minute you ask when you
can’t go to yahoo or google and look it up, is your
own problem.

This is one of the messages from the last time this
went across when Patrick did say something when
someone else who starts their message by saying they
understand medicine then quotes a abstract and
explains the opposite of what it says 😉

Love to everyone, you especially right now Matthew and
Tink! 🙂

Patrick, Howard, Jeffrey thanks for all you do! 🙂

Carla B

— “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com> wrote:

On Oct 28, 2004, at 1:48 AM, Vector Vector wrote:

You and Patrick cross talk with each other and do
male bonding 😉 Since
your doing it in public and on the list, could I
ask why you won’t use
your real name?

This, coming from someone who has been here for
years using the name
“Vector Vector” …?  <Insert Emoticon>

You haven’t hidden who you are so why schmoolboy?

?… Why ask whY …?

.:vector:.

— Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:

Stop all HIV meds for at least 4 half lives of
the drug before taking

IBO

This message –>

On Oct 25, 2004, at 6:44 AM, Jamilah wrote:

Dear Sean,

Here are my thoughts on the issue, as I managed
the care of hundreds
of HIV and Hep C folks before I changed jobs. The
major side effects
we watch for when using HIV meds are lactic
acidosis (caused by
NRTI’s) and symptoms that result from combining
the protease
inhibitors with other drugs that are metabolized
using the cytocrome
P450 pathway.

Ibogaine has been studied to see if it uses this
pathway, and it
doesn’t seem to :

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?

cmd=Retrieve&db=pubmed&dopt=Abstract&list_uids=9698290

Sean asked a question, Jamilah gave an answer based
upon her opinion.
The conclusion she derived from reading that link up
there, is the
EXACT OPPOSITE of what the abstract she is quoting,
actually says.

“The primary metabolite arises via O-demethylation
at the 12-position
to yield 12-hydroxyibogamine. In this report,
evidence is presented
that the O-demethylation of ibogaine observed in
human hepatic
microsomes is catalyzed primarily by the
polymorphically expressed
cytochrome P-4502D6 (CYP2D6).”

“Thus, it is concluded that ibogaine O-demethylase
is catalyzed by
CYP2D6 and that this isoform is the predominant
enzyme of ibogaine
O-demethylation in humans.”

CYP2D6 is the PRIMARY pathway by which ibogaine is
metabolized, and
anything that competes, is not good.

PLEASE keep in mind that this is a discussion list.
Many people have
conversations, share their opinions, or just hang
out, interact, rant,
and communicate.  This does not necessarily mean
that the answers which
are given are correct.

Over the years there are a variety of individuals
who have actually
written the monographs people are quoting — and
sometimes
misinterpreting — here, who answered questions
about their own work,
which has appeared in peer-reviewed journals.  There
have been numerous
occasions where someone DID actually ANSWER A
QUESTION THAT WAS ASKED.
Directly and exactly.

For the most part what happens after that is someone
will say sumthin’
like, “But my brother’s, wife’s, cousin’s
next-door-neighbor once read
a book, which said something completely different.
I think…”  And
then, the person who gave the correct answer will
land on, “Well, ya
know what, someone asked a question.  I know the
answer.  I gave the
answer.  Instead of thank you I have half a dozen
idiots starting an
argument with me, so why don’t I just not bother.  I
can certainly find
something more entertaining to do with my free
time.”

This is in reference to Yet Another CYP2D6
conversation which occured a
while back, not this one.  Everybody has been polite
this time.  Which
is very cool.  Thank you.

The answer Mistah schmoolY gave is correct.  He does
know exactly what
he’s talking about.  Many of you pretty much know
who he is.  Probably
he has reasons for not wanting to directly attach
his name to any
statement made here.

And please try to keep in mind, that there are many
people here who
could easily answer a variety of questions that are
posed.  For the
most part, nearly all of them are M.D.s or Ph.D.s;
they are not
activists or participants in the Holy Crusade.  They
are not being
compensated for their time.  And probably they don’t
want to chat —
much less argue.  So…  Just be decent to each
other.

Thanks,

Patrick

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Krista Vaughan <krista.vaughan@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 7:56:19 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is something I find slightly or even a lot to be honest, confusing.

People talk and have conversations or give support and most of all I
think of here as a community which I don’t take part in as much as I’d
like to but I do read the messages. What confuses the shit out of me
is when people who don’t know what they’re talking about start to give
medical advice, with all the best intent I’m sure, but what is the
reason for giving advice when you don’t know, then someone follows it
and dies because they followed your advice?

Then there are the people on here who do know what they’re talking
about, but none of them ever answer anything. I’ve asked no less then
5 times if Patrick Kroupa would give out a written version of his talk
about low dosing ibogaine maintenance and low dosing while using
narcotics at the same time, every time I’ve written I’ve also asked
Jeffrey Kamlet if he’d do the same for his safety talk. Both of them
talked on science and medicine panels, not opinion or political
panels, neither one has ever answered one piece of email. Mash has all
this research, I don’t see Patrick having any questions about ibogaine
ever, I don’t think Kamlet who is the president of the society of
addiction medicine has any questions and I don’t ever see Howard
Lotsoff asking these questions either. What I remember of Kamlet’s
talk, all patients at St. Kitts have some 24 hour heart stress test
before a halter or holter monitor however it is called.

Then to top it all off Patrick dying (Pam’s husband, not Dr. Mash’s
son) wasn’t necessary at all and it’s not as if he died because of
some unknown cause or reason, because Howard has put all the safety
and medical tests into the ibogaine manual, which nobody followed.

Idont think there is a lack of research or knowledge, published or
unpublished, I think there is a lack of anybody following the safety
protocols so people die and then how do you expect anyone to follow
all that when they’re having a underground treatment with no doctor
present??

Every one of these problems I think which is only my opinion and yes I
find it frustrating, goes back to ibogaine being scheduled in the same
class as heroin and crack and none of this is going to change until
the war on drugs changes and with Bush in office I think that will
change never.

Didn’t mean to vent but reading the last days messages with people
talking about research that has already been done, safety protocls
that are already known and published and people dying when they don’t
need to, disgusts me and fills me with anger at our government who is
representing no one except the rich. With all respect I don’t think
talking about cholesterol levels and homeopathic vitamins is going to
prevent the next ibogaine death, getting it outof schedule one would!

KV

On 5/14/05, Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:

Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect heart disease,
they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride.  Those are chemicals that
will clog up your heart or vascular system.  If you have high cholesterol in
your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your blood vessels
or heart and cause disease.

So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start eating well, it
is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have
advanced heart disease.

I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think
vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for dosing on
Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone in-session.   The
big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical
signaling system.  If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to
tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart
doesn’t pump.

—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol &
triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some
obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital signs
,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration ,IV
,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run in
with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what a
trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick ,then
its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried
about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d ever
come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

LEE

make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with
bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000
times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium:
Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Carlton B” <carltonb@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 7:27:46 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Shelley, the cholesterol and triglyceride tests do not detect heart disease, they only detect cholesterol and triglyceride.  Those are chemicals that will clog up your heart or vascular system.  If you have high cholesterol in your blood for many years, eventually it will build up in your blood vessels or heart and cause disease.

So if you have a bad diet for many years and suddenly start eating well, it is possible to show a clean cholesterol/triglyceride test but still have advanced heart disease.

I am only mentioning this because Lee asked about it… I don’t think vascular problems like stroke or aneurysm are the main risk for dosing on Ibogaine, although I have never seen the EKG if someone in-session.   The big risk in my mind is to the Purkinje fibers, the heart’s electrical signaling system.  If the heart’s natural pacemakers lose the ability to tell all of its muscle fibers “everybody contract now” then the heart doesn’t pump.
—–Original Message—–
From: shelley krupa [mailto:skrupa20022002@yahoo.com]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 11:02 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol & triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital signs ,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration ,IV ,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run in with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what a trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick ,then its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d ever come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
LEE
make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000 times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSN. Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] weirdness abounding
Date: May 14, 2005 at 7:17:02 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In the shorter term, the Republicans in the U.S. are poised to
eliminate the use of the filibuster for blocking approval of
judges, which would mean that many radically conservative judges
could be put in place for a long time to come.

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20050514/ap_on_go_co/filibuster_fight

http://news.yahoo.com/s/latimests/20050514/ts_latimes/juristspickedf
orshowdownonfilibuster

In the long term, due to increasing use of fossil fuels we are
heading for major, irreversible climate change that will likely
result in very different geography books as various regions become
uninhabitable. The Bush administration is responsible for blocking
efforts to avoid this outcome (the Kyoto accords).

http://www.newyorker.com/online/content/articles/050425on_onlineonly
01

On Sat, 14 May 2005 12:21:21 -0700 tink
<tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
Am I the only one who feels like something is horribly wrong?
I’ve
felt this weirdo vibe for about two-three days now, and I’m
beginning
to get nauseous from it.  It’s like somethiing is in the process
of
happening or it did and I just am not aware of what  it is.
Is it just me?  Does anyone else happen to be picking up on it, or
have I finally lost my mind completely?  I learned to trust my
stomach
and it’s reactions while on the streets, and I haven’t been wrong
yet,
but that and $3 will get you a cup of coffee…
Anyhoo, enough of my happy ass…
luv to you all
tink

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 6:26:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey LEE
Good choice of vit c Lee…..after ibo i have been doing quite a bit of reaserach on vit minerals herbs etc and i found i get positive results….
that said to get the minimal chemicals in the procesing of vit/herbs etc— one thing —LIQUID….plus various brands are much more efficient in the way the process the shit…..ie NATURES SUNSHINE is the top manufucture of vit/herbs……if u look at their process of preparation u ll notice a difference that will surely affect ur health…….but homeopathy is the shit!!!!
Im doing much better thank u…..actually used up Jasons four hours of sleep yest which is undescribable :)…now on with the healing process via the Eboga route 🙂 …the faster the bettter…..i would say end of July the latest…….Love back ……..good weekend everybody…..
tinker the tweaker the thinker where u at girl….sleepin the sleep of angels……i love angels…..so cute and cuddly from the pictures we gathered from eye witnessed accounts ……..i once saw what looked like an angel but he was very ashen and thin with sunken cheekbones and a gun instead of a lyre….hmmmm….and no wings…..”death makes angels of us all and gives us wings where we had shoulders smooth as raven claws”–Morrison
Love You

Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] weirdness abounding
Date: May 14, 2005 at 3:21:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Am I the only one who feels like something is horribly wrong?  I’ve
felt this weirdo vibe for about two-three days now, and I’m beginning
to get nauseous from it.  It’s like somethiing is in the process of
happening or it did and I just am not aware of what  it is.
Is it just me?  Does anyone else happen to be picking up on it, or
have I finally lost my mind completely?  I learned to trust my stomach
and it’s reactions while on the streets, and I haven’t been wrong yet,
but that and $3 will get you a cup of coffee…
Anyhoo, enough of my happy ass…
luv to you all
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 3:07:22 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Matt,

How you doing soldier?
Well, I am taking a  natural vitc suppl which is like a nice soft sweet made from lots of diff flowers or something like that. Really nice.

The multivit. I am reluctant with that. Don’t like lots of chemical products running around my body. I do take a Ginsing/B Complex each day. Only started recently. In the past B Complex and C were my main stay followed by E. Not much minerals. Too heavy for my liking.

Big hug to you,

Lee

matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
LEE
make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000 times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSN® Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 3:03:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Carlton,
I reread this and realised you already answered the question I posted with Shelley’s reply.
In any case thank you very much for clarifying the problem to me. It had me confused. Now I feel I have a handle on it.
Thanks,
Lee

Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Well, I am not a doctor, just someone who has studied a lot of biology and physiology, so take that for what it is worth.

In general if you have a healthy and balanced diet then you aren’t going to need commercially produced supplements.  Somehow our ancestors survived without them, and we can too.   Nutritious food is the best possible supplement you can take.   But in reality, many of us lack the time or cooking ability or whatever to eat as well as we should.  That being the case, you need to be supplementing with a basic multi, but again, you can’t over-do them.   Vitamin C is a very important one not to miss, since it helps build the collagen that reinforces everything in your body… most importantly the blood vessels.  Your body can easily dump excess vitamin C, so extra doses of C aren’t going to hurt anything.   A number of vitamins aren’t safe to megadose, so don’t apply this to everything.

As far as EKG and vascular disease… I’m afraid the EKG won’t do much good in detecting vascular disease.  You can check the vascular health of the heart itself by using an ECG, but that won’t tell you anything about your vascular system in the other 99% of your body.   Outside of the heart, there is really no easy way to determine vascular disease until it causes a major problem.

—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:44 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

The only difference that article (I quoted) has made for me is to start taking a natural vitamin c supplement eash Day. Don’t think it can hurt. The other stuff is too much like chemistry for me. I use to be a freek on suppls but threw them to the wind after my first ibo session. Yet, they do have their place, sometimes. However, I don’t think it can be good for you to take something you don’t need!

Do you happen to know how vascular disease and EKG relate?

Lee
Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Ibogaine is a drug that works on the nervous system, and it seems primarily on a type of cell called the purkinje cell which is a type of nerve cell found in the cerebellum and the heart.  In the heart, this cell maintains a normal rhythm.  If it is disrupted, you have the potention for major or minor arrhythmias.   An EKG can’t predict what will happen to a heart under unforeseen conditions such as a punch to the chest or ibogaine dosage, it can just show whether you have the kind of heart that shouldn’t be meddled with.

Of course if you have chronic malnutrition and therefore weak blood vessels, and then you do something heart-intensive like sprinting (or perhaps an Iboga session?), you have a risk of causing yourself a stroke or aneurysm by having a blood vessel burst in your brain or perhaps even your heart.

This is why we really need formal scientific study of Iboga… it interferes with the basic operation of the heart, and there are some medical ways of making this safer if we know exactly how it interferes.   Or at least the doctor can be aware of extra things to check in the pre-examination.

As far as the rest of that article goes… it’s true that chronic malnutrition makes you more susceptible to vascular weakness and injury, mainly by way of Vitamin C but also in other ways.  Unfortunately it seems that a supplement pitchman is using this truth to prop up a bunch of other unlikely statements in order to hawk supplements to the self-medication movement.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 2:59:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Carlton & Shelley,
A bit like ER the way you describe it. That definitely impacts the energy big time.
What i don’t understand is this Carlton: Is vascular disease as big an issue as heart function and if so why are we not testing for it?
Or am I placing too much importance on vascular disease?
Lee
BTW Shelley, glad to hear you did make it back. I too would have thought that blood content should reveal whats going on in the body via markers of sorts.

shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol & triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital signs ,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration ,IV ,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run in with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what a trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick ,then its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d ever come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
LEE
make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000 times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSN® Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] alien HUGS and cat nip
Date: May 14, 2005 at 11:31:09 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

loveyou and keep emaailing-doing things with kids for a bit back in abit
luv shakytink

On 5/14/05, matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Hey babe

GLAD u slept all night……wicked shiat……..i have used the rest of
Jasons 2 hours so im out of sleep hours again…..anybody>?  Feeling better
much better………the whizinator LOL..that was hillarious…..lets smurf
on out of here again go score some ganja…..ganja smiles to all

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the
first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] alien HUGS and cat nip
Date: May 14, 2005 at 11:16:10 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey babe
GLAD u slept all night……wicked shiat……..i have used the rest of Jasons 2 hours so im out of sleep hours again…..anybody>?  Feeling better much better………the whizinator LOL..that was hillarious…..lets smurf on out of here again go score some ganja…..ganja smiles to all

Namaste
Matthew

Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] alien HUGS and cat nip
Date: May 14, 2005 at 10:41:58 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hey there
hope you got back to sleep and stayed that way.  I kncked myself the fuck OUT
look what the cat dragged in again. Fuckin drunk teeangers, another
night of it, THE PROM
Egads, I’m glad i’m just the evil aunty..time to find those chill
water balloons.  Payback’s a bitch if drew and his companions are
still sleeping,,,well, they all need a shower before they egt dressed
for the prom, so, it’s my JOB to help them out any way I can, and if I
can wake em up and introduce some cleanliness in one shot…
shuddershudder
it’s COLD.  and i need somesort of coffee
laters,
aloha and love
tink
On 5/14/05, matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

LOVE for the naughty tinker…..Be good u hear…..

do u belive in heaven above

do u belive in LOVE

dont tell lies dont be false and untrue

it all goes back to U

Well its 2 in the morn and finally some sleep after 5 days of
insomnia…..thank u jay for those four hours u send i used up half…saving
the rest for later…..Tinker where are ya….>?>?……btw is there a
bathtub there>?…….BE WELL sweatheart….stay strong and lets kick this
shit forever……bya …..im going for a smoke and to eat something….im
actually hungry so ill se ya in a bit…….

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy.
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] alien HUGS and cat nip
Date: May 14, 2005 at 10:35:35 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks…i slept for like hours.  I feel as though i’ve been flattened
by a steamshovel this mrning, but I made it through another night..
hugs back to you! and keep ’em coming…
love tink

On 5/14/05, Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/yoga_dispute

((((((((((((((((((((hyug 4 you
now))))))))))))))))))

luv (4)
tink

Discover Yahoo!
Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 10:02:11 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Lee & Carton ,I thought blood tests like your good/bad cholesterol & triglycerides help to detect heart disease, also I thoght there was some obscure marker as well , then we can always fall back on the old vital signs ,eh?I’m thinking of what I hear Mash uses during ibogaine administration ,IV ,constant heart telemetry,constant medical supervision,guess they’d run in with a crash cart if some poor devil started having arrythmias, wow what a trip that’d be ,better than dead for sure.Also if your heart is sick ,then its likely to include your vessels too I’d think.Funny, I never worried about my heart when I did ibogaine,my breathing maybe ,or more if I’d ever come back.Take care-shell
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
LEE
make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000 times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 9:04:36 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LEE
make sure if u are suplemnting ur self with vit c u take the ones with bioflavandis (sp) 100 times better absorption…and liquid anything is 1000 times better….LOVE

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Carlton B” <carltonb@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 7:14:14 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well, I am not a doctor, just someone who has studied a lot of biology and physiology, so take that for what it is worth.

In general if you have a healthy and balanced diet then you aren’t going to need commercially produced supplements.  Somehow our ancestors survived without them, and we can too.   Nutritious food is the best possible supplement you can take.   But in reality, many of us lack the time or cooking ability or whatever to eat as well as we should.  That being the case, you need to be supplementing with a basic multi, but again, you can’t over-do them.   Vitamin C is a very important one not to miss, since it helps build the collagen that reinforces everything in your body… most importantly the blood vessels.  Your body can easily dump excess vitamin C, so extra doses of C aren’t going to hurt anything.   A number of vitamins aren’t safe to megadose, so don’t apply this to everything.

As far as EKG and vascular disease… I’m afraid the EKG won’t do much good in detecting vascular disease.  You can check the vascular health of the heart itself by using an ECG, but that won’t tell you anything about your vascular system in the other 99% of your body.   Outside of the heart, there is really no easy way to determine vascular disease until it causes a major problem.

—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: Saturday, May 14, 2005 7:44 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease

The only difference that article (I quoted) has made for me is to start taking a natural vitamin c supplement eash Day. Don’t think it can hurt. The other stuff is too much like chemistry for me. I use to be a freek on suppls but threw them to the wind after my first ibo session. Yet, they do have their place, sometimes. However, I don’t think it can be good for you to take something you don’t need!

Do you happen to know how vascular disease and EKG relate?

Lee
Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Ibogaine is a drug that works on the nervous system, and it seems primarily on a type of cell called the purkinje cell which is a type of nerve cell found in the cerebellum and the heart.  In the heart, this cell maintains a normal rhythm.  If it is disrupted, you have the potention for major or minor arrhythmias.   An EKG can’t predict what will happen to a heart under unforeseen conditions such as a punch to the chest or ibogaine dosage, it can just show whether you have the kind of heart that shouldn’t be meddled with.

Of course if you have chronic malnutrition and therefore weak blood vessels, and then you do something heart-intensive like sprinting (or perhaps an Iboga session?), you have a risk of causing yourself a stroke or aneurysm by having a blood vessel burst in your brain or perhaps even your heart.

This is why we really need formal scientific study of Iboga… it interferes with the basic operation of the heart, and there are some medical ways of making this safer if we know exactly how it interferes.   Or at least the doctor can be aware of extra things to check in the pre-examination.

As far as the rest of that article goes… it’s true that chronic malnutrition makes you more susceptible to vascular weakness and injury, mainly by way of Vitamin C but also in other ways.  Unfortunately it seems that a supplement pitchman is using this truth to prop up a bunch of other unlikely statements in order to hawk supplements to the self-medication movement.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 14, 2005 at 6:43:44 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI Carla,

Thank you so very much for you reply. It has given me a lot of great insight. Thank you.

The only difference that article (I quoted) has made for me is to start taking a natural vitamin c supplement eash Day. Don’t think it can hurt. The other stuff is too much like chemistry for me. I use to be a freek on suppls but threw them to the wind after my first ibo session. Yet, they do have their place, sometimes. However, I don’t think it can be good for you to take something you don’t need!

Do you happen to know how vascular disease and EKG relate?

Lee
Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Ibogaine is a drug that works on the nervous system, and it seems primarily on a type of cell called the purkinje cell which is a type of nerve cell found in the cerebellum and the heart.  In the heart, this cell maintains a normal rhythm.  If it is disrupted, you have the potention for major or minor arrhythmias.   An EKG can’t predict what will happen to a heart under unforeseen conditions such as a punch to the chest or ibogaine dosage, it can just show whether you have the kind of heart that shouldn’t be meddled with.

Of course if you have chronic malnutrition and therefore weak blood vessels, and then you do something heart-intensive like sprinting (or perhaps an Iboga session?), you have a risk of causing yourself a stroke or aneurysm by having a blood vessel burst in your brain or perhaps even your heart.

This is why we really need formal scientific study of Iboga… it interferes with the basic operation of the heart, and there are some medical ways of making this safer if we know exactly how it interferes.   Or at least the doctor can be aware of extra things to check in the pre-examination.

As far as the rest of that article goes… it’s true that chronic malnutrition makes you more susceptible to vascular weakness and injury, mainly by way of Vitamin C but also in other ways.  Unfortunately it seems that a supplement pitchman is using this truth to prop up a bunch of other unlikely statements in order to hawk supplements to the self-medication movement.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: doing Ibo more than once….
Date: May 14, 2005 at 6:26:45 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt,
If I were in your shoes it would be down the gullet straight away. Of course you also have to consider your heart situation. If you are not meant to recieve anything you won’t get anything. So what is there to abuse?
Lee

Kirsty Sutherland <captkirk@kol.co.nz> wrote:
I don’t think it would work that way, cos from what I can gather, most Ibo experiences are full on and not many rush to repeat it that quickly, and the idea is that hopefully it won’t take loads of sessions to have a epiphany or whatever!!
But that’s just me…..or what I hope could happen for me?!!
Och well, bring it on!!
From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, 11 May 2005 9:16 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

i personaly feel that it would be too easy to take ibo everytime u fuck up becuase u would fuck up more often knowing there is that thing that can ease the wd etc …..i know i would  im positve….and the easy road is often the longest and hardest…thats just me i k now i cant do it again for that reason …it may sound stupid ignorant whatever……Love to all
Namaste
Matthew
Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] fwd……cosmic cookie
Date: May 14, 2005 at 2:08:57 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

.
Cosmic Cookie

? Are you… your Body ?

Your Body is an Instrument.
It is the Creation of your Soul.
Your Soul travels through Time and Space with it.

Your Body is a Spacesuit.

Don’t use it only as a Space to hang a Suit.
Use it to find out why you live in it.
It will astound you.

THE INFINITE SELF AS YOUR SOUL IS THE CREATOR

Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] alien HUGS and cat nip
Date: May 14, 2005 at 2:02:38 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

LOVE for the naughty tinker…..Be good u hear…..
do u belive in heaven above
do u belive in LOVE
dont tell lies dont be false and untrue
it all goes back to U
Well its 2 in the morn and finally some sleep after 5 days of insomnia…..thank u jay for those four hours u send i used up half…saving the rest for later…..Tinker where are ya….>?>?……btw is there a bathtub there>?…….BE WELL sweatheart….stay strong and lets kick this shit forever……bya …..im going for a smoke and to eat something….im actually hungry so ill se ya in a bit…….

Namaste
Matthew

Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy. /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] alien HUGS and cat nip
Date: May 14, 2005 at 1:48:28 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/yoga_dispute

((((((((((((((((((((hyug 4 you
now))))))))))))))))))

luv (4)
tink

Discover Yahoo!
Find restaurants, movies, travel and more fun for the weekend. Check it out!
http://discover.yahoo.com/weekend.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] put sumthin w/ sumthin & make sumthin
Date: May 14, 2005 at 1:30:56 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, oddioblender@hotmail.com, cultfunkhero@yahoo.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

<^> dot

I need a space to put up some ignorant noise
yesterday.  anyone got a space?

-j

“and everyday the boy would come and watch the
sculpter and everyday the sculpter would chip a little
bit at this big block of marble and the little boy was
so curious.  And eventually what came out of the
marble was

a great big lion.

the little boy went up to the scupltpter and asked:
hey mister, how did you know their was a lion in that
stone?

the sculpter replied:

their was a lion in my heart.  and it was the lion in
my heart that recognized the lion in the stone.”

“It’s a family of Aliens”

— Pikahsso Allen Poe <pikahsso@yahoo.com> wrote:
Date: Fri, 13 May 2005 16:28:06 -0700 (PDT)
From: Pikahsso Allen Poe <pikahsso@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: .[]_[].
To: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>,
me@pikahsso.com,
ibogaine@mindvox.com, djfish00@swbell.net

www.pikahsso.com log on become a member now

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

This is a email from Pikahsso Allen Poe The CEO of
Pikahsso.com, Pikmedia and Founder Of The Clayface
Movement if you want to no more about me and all
that I do log on to the official site of Pikahsso
http://www.pikahsso.com and register to become a
member it’s free. Also while your reading this take
a few minutes out of your time to listen to the
Celestial Sounds Of one of the most prolific,
ecclectic artist to ever emerge from DFW Pikahsso
Allen Poe

Click Here To  Listen To My Celestial Brain Phunk
Trust Me You Won’t Be Disapointed

(((VERB)))
Pikahsso allen Poe

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] hmm.
Date: May 13, 2005 at 11:40:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

There is a weird vibe in the air tonight, or is it just me?
I am succumbing to the idea that if i smoke enough weed and swallow
some ativan I might get some sleep tonight.  I hope I’m right about
this.  Well,I think i’m getting over that punishing mode of detoxing,
and have tried actually(gasp) to make myself rehydrate and not deny
the pills I got prescribed just for this.   Dont even know i do it 90%
of the time.
eh.
word of the day
love and rest
i sense a disturbance in the force and it has nothing to do with how i
feel.  Is everyone okay?
hmmm.
love to you all, and angels on your pillows
chances are i will be back, but i hope not.
love tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What the holy Fuck is going on up here!!!
Date: May 13, 2005 at 11:28:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

and so it begins…drunk teenagers with cell phones and 4 different
tvs on.  Im playing auntie sarah at my friends house, and the worse i
feel the more ridiculous the situation becomes.  At elast i have a bit
of weed, the sci fi channel and some ativan
i hate suboxone.  And your right, about checking back and seeing where
you were and where you are.  I read my journal from the brattlboro
retreat and  the methaodne kick, and its helping keep in it
perspective.  somewhat.
still freaked out by my doctors behavior in the parking lot.  He RAN
form me, and I was just saying hey.  what ever the fuck did he have to
RUN for??!
anyhoo, i am rough and sinking, but, eh. thats about all i can say
right now is eh.  enrgyless and typing is a chore but I’m not dropping
from 120 of methadrone to zero in four days either. it all sux
anyway.
sigh.
more like siiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiy SIGH!
luvya biscuitboy
tinkerhell

On 5/12/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Tink, please feel free to rant all you want to. I know I did when I was in
your shoes. I looked back at my post from that period and saw what I was
going through, and I tell you, I ranted about everything. I know I drove
these people nuts. But what the hell, I didn’t have to drive them very far.
(He He) Ranting is good for the soul esp. when you can look later at where
you were. Somebody should write a book about this shit. O yea, it’s being
done. Hurry up Patrick!!!!!!!!!                Dr. prescribes           Drug
store provides         Whoooooooooo’s gonna help him to kick it?(Rolling
Stones)    Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Fire3456@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Throwing-up….. Have you ever wondered…….
Date: May 13, 2005 at 10:25:58 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

What do you consider a high dose?

I’ve done Ibo twice and never felt nauseous at all.  I did lay perfectly still during the whole trip.  My doses were small (in my opinion).  1st was 18mg/kg and the 2nd was 20mg/kg..with several small doses after the main dose.  Never felt nauseous though.   Just major insomnia.

In a message dated 05/11/2005 1:18:36 PM Central Daylight Time, fforest12@hotmail.com writes:
For those of you here who have had the Ibogaine and experience and have also
experienced heavy vomiting during the experience…..Have you ever wondered
what this was about?……(Yes I know some people do not throw-up on
Ibogaine,but the majority of people do throw up at some point on a heavy
dose……..

During a normal vomit,like when you have drank to much or your really sick
you throw-up every thing in your stomach and then when there is nothing else
to throw-up you get dry heaves,which just as the name implies you your body
keeps trying to throw-up even when nothing is left to throw up…

But with Ibogaine I have  seen people vomit deeply seemingly  for hours with
not the slightest hint of dry heaves in sight…These people had also fasted
for 2 day before the Ibogaine session and only drank a little water…..Can
some  one explain how this seemingly impossible situation occurs ?….

I have a theory that on Ibogaine you are not throwing up from your stomach
so much but you are throwing-up energy from the Astral realm…..As you
transform negative astral energy it condenses into a kind of puke that you
vomit out….This is the only explanation I can think of for the incredible
amount of vomiting that can happen on Ibogaine….Any other theories on this
?………Thanks Kyle

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] and the beat goes on da dee dump dee da dada
Date: May 13, 2005 at 9:20:06 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So I got wicked stoned and found Battlestar Galactica.  Better than
the alternative.  It’s hard to detox when you have a pocket full of
suboxone.  Eh.  What is my primary malfunction.  I have a 15 year old
trying to kill me with a remote control hover craft.  It’s actually
really cool, but kind of like having a 4 ft june bug buzzing your
ears.  He shall pay when the sun first cones up.  It’s all about cold
water balloons.  I told him to do the dishes…
It’s good to be the aunty!!
Here comes the frelling hover craft.  I’m about to stick my foot up
his ass.  He loves it when i get stoned and come over so he can
torment me.  he doesn’t know it yet, but we’re about ot do a big
whacko kids garden, and create an alternate universe for the nifty
little duplex strip mall so the little runts will have something
better to do.  And it’ll keep my ass out of trouble.
Anyhow, here comes “i sing the body electric”  so i must lie down for
a sec, for I am muy nauseaus.
yerp
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Carlton B” <carltonb@mindspring.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 13, 2005 at 9:14:12 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ibogaine is a drug that works on the nervous system, and it seems primarily on a type of cell called the purkinje cell which is a type of nerve cell found in the cerebellum and the heart.  In the heart, this cell maintains a normal rhythm.  If it is disrupted, you have the potention for major or minor arrhythmias.   An EKG can’t predict what will happen to a heart under unforeseen conditions such as a punch to the chest or ibogaine dosage, it can just show whether you have the kind of heart that shouldn’t be meddled with.

Of course if you have chronic malnutrition and therefore weak blood vessels, and then you do something heart-intensive like sprinting (or perhaps an Iboga session?), you have a risk of causing yourself a stroke or aneurysm by having a blood vessel burst in your brain or perhaps even your heart.

This is why we really need formal scientific study of Iboga… it interferes with the basic operation of the heart, and there are some medical ways of making this safer if we know exactly how it interferes.   Or at least the doctor can be aware of extra things to check in the pre-examination.

As far as the rest of that article goes… it’s true that chronic malnutrition makes you more susceptible to vascular weakness and injury, mainly by way of Vitamin C but also in other ways.  Unfortunately it seems that a supplement pitchman is using this truth to prop up a bunch of other unlikely statements in order to hawk supplements to the self-medication movement.

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] my name is matt and im a drug addict–hi matt
Date: May 13, 2005 at 9:09:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Aloha nui loa!
Pakalolo savin my ass
luv
tink

On 5/13/05, Kirsty Sutherland <captkirk@kol.co.nz> wrote:

VALERIAN TINCTURE

Not a full nights sleep on full WD but relaxes u and I got some hours sleep.
Videos and puter kept me sane I remember……………thank fek fer dah puter and
you cyber freaks!!!! (not you freaks in particular, but some other freaks
wot made me laugh when I felt yuk and wore me out from yakkin’ thru
typing……etc……blah blah)

Well, lookie Matt, another……………….enter number of hours/days here……………….has
gone by!!!! All fekkin’ Rightyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy~~

Luff heaps

Koiky

________________________________

From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com]
Sent: Tuesday, 10 May 2005 9:22 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] my name is matt and im a drug addict–hi matt

:}}….love u all for real no joke:}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}

everything will be alright

evrything willturn out fine

at night i still cant sleep

but the voices pass with time

and i get no time to worry

no time for breaking down

NO TIME TO CRY in this motherfucken life………but at least i   have a
bathtub my new sanctuary.  love the bathtub…the best thing about this is
70 someethin g hours in wd the worst thing about this is only 70  hours in
wd…..those sneezing fits rock ur body so hard….fuck me…..ah whatever
its 5 now new day same shiht waiting for death to pass by–yeay!!i just want
to curl up and sleep at least an hour pls anybody can u spare an hour ofur
sleep for a poor fool who is doomed to fuck up over andover again…..this
shuderng pain….complete restlesness…weak body weak mind weak spirit…la
la la la la lalalala i LOVE THEH SMURFS especialy smurfete poor lonely soul
doesnt hve another female to talk to——i feel for u smurfete—–lets
hope in the future the writers will be more sympathtic—-the whole city
sleeps….the sleep of sleep…im going back to counting sheep i guess..last
count 1 500 435 no no my mistake 1 500 436…..good day all….love u
lots—i love sheep….when i get well im going to eat one i think…yah or
a goose but goose arre fatty i dont want to be fat now do i with my all 68
kg now…hm ribs are begeining to show again on this emeciated body…..and
for a while there i was looking prety good …..well signing off……yay 5
25 and its getting light outside whorah for a new luazy day

Namaste

Matthew

________________________________

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now
and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Just a little Somethin’-somethin’
Date: May 13, 2005 at 9:08:44 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hardcase-shmatza!!!
I simply did a lot of research for my book
🙂
tinkerhell

On 5/13/05, Kirsty Sutherland <captkirk@kol.co.nz> wrote:
Waving Hello to Tinkerbell,
I’ve been following your emails, geez you’re a hard case!!  Hope we meet up
one day!!!
Keep on smiling
Luff heapz
Cappen Koiky :o)

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 12 May 2005 9:22 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Just a little Somethin’-somethin’

I am currently reading a book I highly recommend to all.  “Life of Pi”
by Yann Martell.
Here’s a little thingie I found while tryimg to smoke a cigarette in
the rain, my book in the mailbox for safe keeping from the water, my
mother in the backround yelling,”When are you going to quit that
filthy habit!! I can still smell the smoke!  I could DIE form you
smoking that cigarette!! Are you sure your in the road and not
standing on my property??!!”.  I dont’ knwo if her mailbox counts as
her’s or federal, but my book was too good to put down, and I WILL NOT
STOP SMOKING WHILE I KICK THESE FUCKING BUPE’S!!! Not that it’s easy
to do, with it tasting like ass, and all, as the mucus builds in the
back of my throat and my sensitive gag reflex makes my stomach jump,
everytime I inhale.  I NEED to have one lousy habit right now.  It’s
legal, I’m WAY over 18, so FUCKING LEAVE ME ALONE ALREADY!!!!!
Any way, here’s a great little excerpt:

I was giving up.  I would have given up-if a voice hadn’t made itself
heard in my heart.  the voice said,   “I will not die.  I refuse it.
I will make it through this nightmare.  I will beat the odds , as
great as they are.  I have survived so far, miraculously.  Now I will
turn miracle into routine.  The amazing will be seen every day.  I
will put in all the hard work necessary. yes, so long as
God(Iboganauts) are with me, I will not die.  Amen.”
My face set to a grim and determined expression. I speak in all
modesty as I say this, but I discovered at that moment that I have a
fierce will to live.  It’s not something evident, in my experience.
Some of us give up on life with only a resigned sigh.  Others fight a
little, then lose hope.  Still others-and I am one of those-never give
up. We fight and fight and fight.  We fight no matter the cost of
battle, the losses we take, the improbabilty of success.  We fight to
the very end.  It’s not a question of courage.  It’s something
constitutional, an inability to let go.  It may be nothing more than
life-hungry stupidity.”

Off to the store for more cigarettes.
I love you all!
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] What the holy Fuck is going on up here!!!
Date: May 13, 2005 at 8:47:22 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes Daffodils in snow is a crazy sight!

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] namaste
Date: May 13, 2005 at 8:47:22 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Cool, I have this hanging on my wall, along with the “Just for Today…..etc”.
How ya doing Matt?
Not beating yourself up I hope!! Cos when you beat yourself up, you are beating all of us up as well.  And I know I’m not stupid/weak etc…. nor are you.  For whatever reason we’re having these experiences and I look forward to a time when I can put them to use for the GOOD OF MANKIND MUHAHAHAHAHAHAAAAAAAAAAAAA>
Juss kiddin’, got a bit carried away there, but if you laughed then my work here is done!!
:o)
kirk
From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com] 
Sent: Thursday, 12 May 2005 12:49 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] namaste

A translation of Namaste

NAMASTE 
I honor the place in you where the entire universe resides.
I honor the place in you, where lies your love, your light, your 
truth and your beauty.
I honor the place in you, where…if you are in that place in you…
and I am in that place in me…then there is only one of us

~  Leo Buscaglia (Author of “Love,” etc.)
Namaste
Matthew
Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy.
/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Just a little Somethin’-somethin’
Date: May 13, 2005 at 8:47:22 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Waving Hello to Tinkerbell,
I’ve been following your emails, geez you’re a hard case!!  Hope we meet up
one day!!!
Keep on smiling
Luff heapz
Cappen Koiky :o)

—–Original Message—–
From: tink [mailto:tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com]
Sent: Thursday, 12 May 2005 9:22 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] Just a little Somethin’-somethin’

I am currently reading a book I highly recommend to all.  “Life of Pi”
by Yann Martell.
Here’s a little thingie I found while tryimg to smoke a cigarette in
the rain, my book in the mailbox for safe keeping from the water, my
mother in the backround yelling,”When are you going to quit that
filthy habit!! I can still smell the smoke!  I could DIE form you
smoking that cigarette!! Are you sure your in the road and not
standing on my property??!!”.  I dont’ knwo if her mailbox counts as
her’s or federal, but my book was too good to put down, and I WILL NOT
STOP SMOKING WHILE I KICK THESE FUCKING BUPE’S!!! Not that it’s easy
to do, with it tasting like ass, and all, as the mucus builds in the
back of my throat and my sensitive gag reflex makes my stomach jump,
everytime I inhale.  I NEED to have one lousy habit right now.  It’s
legal, I’m WAY over 18, so FUCKING LEAVE ME ALONE ALREADY!!!!!
Any way, here’s a great little excerpt:

I was giving up.  I would have given up-if a voice hadn’t made itself
heard in my heart.  the voice said,   “I will not die.  I refuse it.
I will make it through this nightmare.  I will beat the odds , as
great as they are.  I have survived so far, miraculously.  Now I will
turn miracle into routine.  The amazing will be seen every day.  I
will put in all the hard work necessary. yes, so long as
God(Iboganauts) are with me, I will not die.  Amen.”
My face set to a grim and determined expression. I speak in all
modesty as I say this, but I discovered at that moment that I have a
fierce will to live.  It’s not something evident, in my experience.
Some of us give up on life with only a resigned sigh.  Others fight a
little, then lose hope.  Still others-and I am one of those-never give
up. We fight and fight and fight.  We fight no matter the cost of
battle, the losses we take, the improbabilty of success.  We fight to
the very end.  It’s not a question of courage.  It’s something
constitutional, an inability to let go.  It may be nothing more than
life-hungry stupidity.”

Off to the store for more cigarettes.
I love you all!
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] my name is matt and im a drug addict–hi matt
Date: May 13, 2005 at 8:47:22 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

VALERIAN TINCTURE
Not a full nights sleep on full WD but relaxes u and I got some hours sleep.  Videos and puter kept me sane I remember……………thank fek fer dah puter and you cyber freaks!!!! (not you freaks in particular, but some other freaks wot made me laugh when I felt yuk and wore me out from yakkin’ thru typing……etc……blah blah)
Well, lookie Matt, another……………….enter number of hours/days here……………….has gone by!!!! All fekkin’ Rightyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy~~
Luff heaps
Koiky
From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com] 
Sent: Tuesday, 10 May 2005 9:22 p.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] my name is matt and im a drug addict–hi matt

:}}….love u all for real no joke:}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
everything will be alright
evrything willturn out fine
at night i still cant sleep
but the voices pass with time
and i get no time to worry
no time for breaking down
NO TIME TO CRY in this motherfucken life………but at least i   have a bathtub my new sanctuary.  love the bathtub…the best thing about this is 70 someethin g hours in wd the worst thing about this is only 70  hours in wd…..those sneezing fits rock ur body so hard….fuck me…..ah whatever its 5 now new day same shiht waiting for death to pass by–yeay!!i just want to curl up and sleep at least an hour pls anybody can u spare an hour ofur sleep for a poor fool who is doomed to fuck up over andover again…..this shuderng pain….complete restlesness…weak body weak mind weak spirit…la la la la la lalalala i LOVE THEH SMURFS especialy smurfete poor lonely soul doesnt hve another female to talk to——i feel for u smurfete—–lets hope in the future the writers will be more sympathtic—-the whole city sleeps….the sleep of sleep…im going back to counting sheep i guess..last count 1 500 435 no no my mistake 1 500 436…..good day all….love u lots—i love sheep….when i get well im going to eat one i think…yah or a goose but goose arre fatty i dont want to be fat now do i with my all 68 kg now…hm ribs are begeining to show again on this emeciated body…..and for a while there i was looking prety good …..well signing off……yay 5 25 and its getting light outside whorah for a new luazy day

Namaste
Matthew
Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] tilidin, tramadol
Date: May 13, 2005 at 8:47:22 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Sounds similar to New Zealand, cept we do grow it cos there aint nuffink much else decent gets thru to us…..it is a relatively easy process, we use Acetic Acid Anhydryde (sp) (NOT Glacial.,..) to convert it closer to morph/heroin and the cooking up is to get rid of plant matter.   Heaps cheaper than Morph pills, and real easy to grow here cept only seasonal!!  So, end of Poppy season is a bad time to hook up on the methadone!! Lol
Um, guess that’s not helpful to someone in WD, sorry Matt!!  Horrible stuff, yukkity yuk!! Lol
Kirk:
Glad u like Poland its a great country:}…….in poland there are tons i mean tons of opiate addicts because there are poppy fields practicly eveywhere as u know and what they do is cook it up  and bang it..reletivly easy process..in poland its called “kompot” 





Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: doing Ibo more than once….
Date: May 13, 2005 at 8:47:22 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I don’t think it would work that way, cos from what I can gather, most Ibo experiences are full on and not many rush to repeat it that quickly, and the idea is that hopefully it won’t take loads of sessions to have a epiphany or whatever!!
But that’s just me…..or what I hope could happen for me?!!
Och well, bring it on!!
From: matthew zielinski [mailto:mattzielinski@hotmail.com] 
Sent: Wednesday, 11 May 2005 9:16 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

i personaly feel that it would be too easy to take ibo everytime u fuck up becuase u would fuck up more often knowing there is that thing that can ease the wd etc …..i know i would  im positve….and the easy road is often the longest and hardest…thats just me i k now i cant do it again for that reason …it may sound stupid ignorant whatever……Love to all
Namaste
Matthew
Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] another lesson from Foudini M Cat
Date: May 13, 2005 at 5:47:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“Oh, I said to myself, is this what life will be like?  A few happy
hours in a soft room with a soft floor, and then yanked away without
warning, put ion a box with a grating, and taken God knows where?  And
I heard my mother’s sorrowful voice saying, Kitten, life is hard and
full of disapoointments, but if you are careful, it can be a good
life, and we are so made that we forget the bad things that have
hapened to us, and when we find a warm piece of meat, or a patch of
catnip, we believe that the world has always been wonderful.  But we
must be careful always because the world is full of creatures who want
to eat us or worse, and the worst of these creatures is the dog.
I said,’Tell me about dogs,’ and my mother said, ‘You hear that
loud voice barking?That is the voice of a dog.  Some dogs are so big
that you can run between their legs and never brush against their
stomachs.  And they have big teeth!  Very big teeth!  Stay away from
dogs!’
‘Will they eat me up?’ I asked her.
‘If they can,’ she said.
But she would tell me no more about dogs.
‘You are a small cat’ she said,’and all small cats dream about dogs.
Your dreams will tell you all you need to know.’
But I had not yet had these dreams.
I thought, I will have to use my own judgement about this dog.”

luv
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fwd: Friday the 13th, 2029
Date: May 13, 2005 at 5:19:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, “EilleC@aol.com” <EilleC@aol.com>, Anne Parfitt <anne@gmavt.net>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

———- Forwarded message ———-
From: NASA Science News <snglist@snglist.msfc.nasa.gov>
Date: May 13, 2005 2:56 PM
Subject: Friday the 13th, 2029
To: NASA Science News <snglist@snglist.msfc.nasa.gov>

NASA Science News for May 13, 2005

Asteroid 2004 MN4 will come impressively close to Earth on April 13,
2029, so close that sky watchers can see the space rock without a
telescope, but it will not hit.

FULL STORY at

http://science.nasa.gov/headlines/y2005/13may_2004mn4.htm?list161661

The Science@NASA Podcast feed is available at
http://science.nasa.gov/podcast.xml.

You are currently subscribed to snglist as: tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com.

This is a free service.

To unsubscribe click here:
http://lyris.msfc.nasa.gov/u?id=161661J&n=T&l=snglist
or send a blank email to leave-snglist-161661J@lyris.msfc.nasa.gov

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 13, 2005 at 3:36:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Shell,
To be honest it sounds like you know more than me on heart disease. All I really know is that one needs a heart in reasonably good spec. Also from my own initial session I found the experience very demanding physically and it did feel like my heart could give out at any moment. It scared me at the time. My subjective experience was one of more work load on my heart even if the pulse lessened, i.e., it felt like more blood was pushing through at a slower pulse rate perhaps. Hence why I mentioned that the experience might compromise the heart further. Yet, I may be totally wrong on that. After a number of sessions the issue of the heart became a non-issue for me as I seemed to adapt to it.
Reading your post makes me aware of my own ignorance. I was hoping that maybe there was some further test that could be done apart from an EKG to catch what happened to Patrick (RIP). There was a report of a guy who died some time back after a session with the extract but no verdict was reported or perhaps no autopsy was performed. I wondered if the same had happened to him?
Sorry I cant enlighten you more. Maybe someone else can. Hopefully someone will enlighten us both.
Lee

shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com> wrote:
Hi Lee, I’m interested in how ibogaine could cause damage in cardio compromised patients as well. To the best of my understanding, I thought ibogaine lowers pulse rate & BP, so I’m uncertain how it could put more pressure of the heart valves. I am a nurse ,but my expertise is psychiatry, so I’m no hot shot ,cant read EKG’s well .However ,when I do ibogaine (4 times ),I feel like my pulse quickens,would sure like to know more.You undoubtedly have more experience than I do. If the blood clotting is off ,I would think a PT/PTT test would show that ,that’s what they do pre surgery to insure a patient doesnt bleed out.I know some about congestive heart failure,coronary heart disease ,at least more than a lay person,I am sure if a person were that progressed with heart disease ,he/she would be having symptoms already. I would think arrhythmias would more likely be the culprit,thus the EKG,wonder how much exhaustion plays a part too,enlighten me please,shell

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Dear List,

I am reposting this hoping for a bite somewhere. Basically what I understand from this (if it is real science) is that the stress of a session could put pressure on the heart valves, perhaps causing some minor tears where the person is not in good health, and the healing of the breaks, where someone is low on vitamin c etc (i.e., high lipoprotein levels/poor health), leads to increased clogging of the valves which in turn could lead to a heart attack post session if the valves are already compromised, i.e., it is possible to pass an EKG but deteriorate post-session. It would explain death after a session to me. That being the case a further test for lipoprotein levels would serve re: safeguarding against post session heart failure.

This would be of more importance to those of poor heath depending on an EKG than those whose health is “normal.”

Anybody care to comment or enlighten?

Lee

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Pam,

I read what you wrote and had a quick look on the web to see what it said about vascular disease. Then I lost your mail. Don’t know how that happened. Sorry.

I came across this:

… In the US, every other person will die of vascular heart disease. … More than
seven million Americans are living with vascular heart disease right now …
referring to the link to this site:

http://www.medical-library.net/sites/vitamin_c_and_vascular_disease.html

The article goes on to say:

<snip>
Our Distant Ancestors Lost the Ability to Produce Vitamin C
It long has been known that human beings do not produce ascorbic acid (vitamin C). Because vitamin C — which I shall refer to as “ascorbate” from here on out — is essential to life and because we cannot produce it, it is known as a vitamin in human metabolism. We are rare among species, because almost all mammals can make abundant supplies of ascorbate. There are only four species of mammals which do not make their own ascorbate. These are (1) humans, (2) gorillas, (3) guinea pigs and (4) fruit bats.
<end-snip>

followed by:

<snip>

Ice Ages, Scurvy, and Natural Selection
However, our common ancestors did not stay in Africa. They migrated to cover the entire earth. Then came the Ices Ages, one after another, each lasting around 10,000 years. We know from the archeological evidence that human beings lived through these ice ages in northern climates. They somehow toughed it out. Ascorbate, because it is made by plant food, is not easy to come by in an ice age. The old vegetable garden does not do so well under a thick layer of ice. These ancestors suffered from ascorbate deficiency, a disease called scurvy, a fact borne out by examination of their remains.
<end-snip>
Scurvy is marked by the breakdown of collagen tissue throughout the body and frequent infections. Collagen is the protein with which strong connective tissue is made throughout the body.
<snip>
<end-snip>
The same sort of thing happened to many of our ancestors who lived through the ice ages. Many of them bled to death because they had little or no ascorbate, and without ascorbate there is no collagen production or repair throughout the body. The wall of a blood vessel is made of collagen. Therefore, when you run out of ascorbate, it is only a matter of time until that wall of collagen breaks down, is not repaired, cracks open and you bleed to death.
<snip>
<end-snip>
<snip>
Risk Factors: Lipoprotein(a), LDL, Lipids, and Oxidized Cholesterol
However, not all our Ice Ages ancestors died of cracked open blood vessels. Many did, but some had the ability to repair leaky blood vessel walls without the assistance of ascorbate.
When a crack develops in a blood vessel wall due to a shortage of ascorbate, certain fat packages in the blood have the ability to plug the leak by forming a kind of plaster cast. These packages of fat are known as cholesterol, lipids, low density lipoproteins (LDL), and one especially effective leak plugger, lipoprotein(a), a special type of LDL.
<end-snip>
<snip>
The tumor, i.e., the proliferation of excess smooth muscle cells is not cancerous. Nevertheless, it can cause death by pushing this mass of plaque into the lumen (passage way) of the blood vessel in which this process is happening. This narrows the passage way through which blood passes and can eventually lead to heart attack, stroke and other problems, depending on where in the body it develops.<snip>
<end-snip>
<snip>
Lipoprotein(a) Is The Real Risk Factor for Vascular Disease
The bottom line is that lipoprotein(a) is the real risk factor in cardiovascular disease and that ascorbate and niacin are the only major lines of defense against high levels of lipoprotein(a). Cholesterol, even LDL cholesterol, can serve as a statistical risk factor only to the degree that it is correlated with the level of the real problem: the special type of LDL called lipoprotein(a).
The best test, by far, for risk of cardiovascular disease is the direct measurement of this special type of LDL, namely a lipoprotein(a) level. A lipoprotein(a) level is ten times more accurate and specific for prediction of vascular disease.
<end-snip>
<snip>
The presently accepted levels of lipoprotein(a) are the following.

0

20 mg./dl
low risk
20

40 mg./dl.
moderate risk
>      40 mg./dl.
high risk
<end-snip>
<snip>
1. Lipoprotein(a) levels are largely determined by inheritance.
2. Special diet does not influence lipoprotein(a) levels.
3. None of the available cholesterol lowering drugs lower lipoprotein(a) blood levels.
4. Ascorbate and niacin both lower lipoprotein(a) blood levels.
<un-snip>
<snip>
The Cost in Lives
Nevertheless, there is still a long way to go. In the U.S., every other person will die of vascular heart disease. Many more will die of stroke, another complication of vascular disease. Every year 1.5 million Americans die of heart attack, one fifth of them suddenly, before reaching the hospital or medical attention. Death is the first symptom of heart disease for forty percent of those who learn they have it. More than seven million Americans are living with vascular heart disease right now, and 2.5 million have cerebrovascular disease. Eight million Americans have arrhythmia: irregular heartbeat related to vascular disease.
<un-snip>
<snip>
Program for the Reversal of Heart Disease
If you have vascular disease, and if you want not to have it, there is a plan for you.
1. Get yourself into chelation therapy and stay the course. This is the fastest, most proven method of dealing with this life-threatening condition. The literature proving this is extensive, despite what uninformed doctors may tell you. Then, in consultation with a doctor who practices nutritional medicine, take the following steps: (All the following dosages may be adjusted by your doctor, based on his or her experience and medical opinion.)
2. Vitamin C to bowel tolerance — as much as you can take without diarrhea. For most people this will be in the range of five to ten grams (5,000-10,000 mg.) each day. Spread this amount into two equal doses 12 hours apart. (Vitamin C prevents further cracking of the blood vessel wall — the beginning of the disease.)
3. Co-enzyme Q10 90-180 mg. twice each day (strengthens the heart muscle).
4. L-carnitine 3 grams twice each day (also strengthens the heart muscle).
5. L-lysine 3 grams twice each day (acts to release lipoprotein(a) from plaque formation and prevent further deposition of same).
6. L-proline 3 grams twice each day (acts to release lipoprotein(a) from plaque formation and prevent further deposition of same).
7. Niacin decreases the production of lipoprotein(a) in the liver. Inositol hexaniacinate is a form of niacin which gives less of a problem with flushing and therefore allows for larger therapeutic doses. Begin with 250 mg. at lunch, 500 mg. at dinner and 500 mg. at bedtime the first day; then increase gradually over a few days until you reach four grams per day, or the highest dose under four grams you can tolerate. Be sure to aks your doctor for liver enzyme level tests every two months or less to be sure your liver is able to handle the dose you are taking.
8. Vitamin E (as Unique E) 800-2400 IU per day. (This inhibits the proliferation of smooth muscle cells in the walls of arteries undergoing the atherosclerotic changes.)
9. Stop smoking. (This decreases the free radical load on your body.)
10. Adopt a sensible diet with plenty of veggies and not so much fat. (The metabolism of fat decreases your body vitamin pool dramatically.)
11. Ask your doctor for a comprehensive stool analysis (Great Smokies Lab) to see if you are digesting well all that good food. Your diet does not matter much if it is not getting into your body.
12. Lower stress in your life however you can.
13. Adopt a sensible exercise program in collaboration with your doctor.
<un-snip>
I am wondering if anyone has any experience with this to comment, i.e., is this good science? How significant is this in determining fitness for an ibogaine session as opposed to an EKG test?
Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] damn, i sound bitchy..
Date: May 13, 2005 at 3:31:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tink, you do whatever it takes to get where you have to go. Most DR’s suck, not all but most. At this point in my life my doc’s are all like, DAMN, that Ibogaine stuff must do SOMETHING. I have two DR’s who will prescribe Methadone for my pain issues. Or should I say they know how to play the game right. They are amazed that I have gone this long. Both of them told me I could come back for my prescription if it doesn’t work out. It feels so good not to have to. Freedom RULES. Keep that kick ass attitude, it will get you through. Randy

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] words from a black cat on friday the 13th
Date: May 13, 2005 at 2:32:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, vcbursar@tui.edu
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“I remember an old cat who lived with us in my wall telling me
that human beings on the street where not to be trusted, but every
once and a while, one of them came along who understood cats, and then
the extremely fortunate cat-usually a kitten, he said sadly, almost
always a kitten-was taken to warm place where light shone both day and
night and where it was never, ever cold, and where the people existed
only to feed and  pet that cat, and that those cats didn’t sleep on
the floor at night.  No, they slept in soft beds upon pillows stuffed
with bird feathers, and they grew fat and happy and spent their days
dreaming dreams from the beginning of the history of cats, and so in
the end, they became the Learned Cats, the Wise Ones.  What an
enviable destiny that is, he said.
His bones poked through his fur, as my mother’s did, an dhis teeth
were brown and loose, and so he had trouble chewing his mice when he
caught them, and as a consequence was reduced to slitting open garbage
bags, as my mother was also doing, a shameful activity for a cat, he
said, but one which old age had driven him.  But while he lived with
us, my mother would chew his mouse for him, and then leave it between
his paws, and he would gnaw slowly on it.  In return, he would bring
my mother partially gnawed chicken bones and bits of fish still
attached to their skeletons.
I think of him often these days, and wonder if he was my father.”

from “The Autobiography of Foudini M.  Cat” by Susan Fromberg Schaeffer

May we all find our warm, light place, and continue to become Learned
Cats and Wise One’s

luv
tinnk

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] damn, i sound bitchy..
Date: May 13, 2005 at 2:10:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So I come into town and go to my group, and listen to the bitching and
sobbing, throwing in my own two cents worth here and there, like a
good little addict trying to gain favour should.  Who the fuck am I
kidding any way.  I leave, take care of what needs to be taken care of
for the day, and run into the good doc in the parking lot.  I call
out, “Hey Doc!”, knowing that I don’t have a scheduled app’t till
Monday, and he looks me dead in the eye, and runs with his tail tucked
beetween his uptight ass, the look on his face saying, “oh shit, here
comes that psycho woman who keeps tryting to convince all of my
medicaid patients that they don’t have to be on this shit for the rest
of there lives…”
Fucking jerk.  All I did was say hey, knowing that approaching him in
a parking lot was ytantamount to stalking him, in his mind.  he’ll
take all the moneyt he can get out of us, as long as he doesn’t have
to acknowledge that we exist.
I have completed the ransom note for the “guidance” counselor’s coffee
mug, and will be returning his precious cbalt blue “BUPRENORPHINE
SAMSA STUDY GROUP” mug as soon as I’m clean, or when they return our
monthly prescription to us.  He shouldn’t have said, “You want it, try
and take it.”
I had to.  It was personal.  At least i had enough temerity to leave
his car in the parking lot.  Did I mention he has “rush Limbaugh” on
in the backround every time I go there?  I asked him why, and he
says,” oh, it’s just backround noise.”  Righty-o.  No one CHOOSES Rush
for backround noise everyday.  I told him it was okay, because Rush
was a junky, anyway.
Way to get along with my care providers…
FUCK THEM AND FUCK THAT!!!!!!!!!!!!
I’m trying to psyche myself up for an evening of misery and twitching,
and a fuck you attitude never hurt, especially for the very shit I’m
pissed off at.  Better to be mad at the medicine than at myself for
taking it, and after i get through the detox, THEN move on within.
Whatever.
Did I mention it snowed here yesterday?
Happy Friday the 13th, and may the force be with you all.
I need some cosmicweirdoibogahug.
tinkerhell

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] what to do, what to do…
Date: May 11, 2005 at 2:09:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thatnk you for your reminder about my psychic kitty link!  I get lost
dealing with all of the bullshit around here, and this detox doesn’t
exactly make me the picture of patience and warmth.  Oh well.  They
can deal with it or go screw.  I’ve spent the last 15 years listening
(not really well, but hearing might be a better word..)to my family
plead with me to come home, and now that I’m here, they’re like,
ummmmm, when are you leaving?
Typical stuff.  Still sucks.
Trying to decide whether or not to drop my dose again today or
tomorrow. Dread dread dread…gotta do it.
AAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHH!!!!!!!!!!
Thanks for being here!!
Love
tink

On 5/11/05, Kiersten Leigh Johnson <kiers10@mac.com> wrote:
tink,
get a harnass not a leash it will choke her,  and take her walking with you. cats are very telepathic, so show her the picture that it is dangerous and that she must come back within the hour, or before sundown, etc. tell her in no uncertain terms not to go beyond the yard, etc.

say it out loud, but also think it in a picture, full of emotion, so that she gets it.

let her out, but stay with her in the yard and if she tries to run off, grab her and tell her to stay close. then show her the coyote in your head, chomping on her. she’ll get it.

and tell the dog to stop chasing the cat. NO! and give it a spank on the butt. it will chase the cat if it thinks the humans say its ok. the dog will protect the cat if the humans tell it to. dogs are like that. it’s not “natural” it is learned behavior and dogs are totally into pack mentality. the owner of the dog has to discipline the dog in this direction, too.

good luck,

kiersten
On Tuesday, May 10, 2005, at 12:33PM, tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:

So i live in the woods now, which freaks me out more than i thought
possible.  Stick me in Little Haiti in my underwear at 3am with no
money and a gun, and I can function.  Take me on a walk in the woods,
and I’m about to get eaten by the bear that I’ve seen that lives
behind the house.  Go figure…
Anyhoo.. about my cat. I got her in Miami, and she saved my life.  I
brought her all the way North with me, and she’s like my baby.  I got
her her shots and got her fixed, and technically, she could be an
outdoor cat.  I just KNOW that she’s going to get hit, eaten, lost,
stuck somewhere, attacked by any number of asshole dogs in the
neighborhood, that bear will find her snackly-licious, i don’t know,
but something will happen.  So, i let her out by accident, and now she
cries at the door, and looks at me like,”what the fuck is your
problem??! LET ME OUT!!!!!”.  My mom’s dog, half chihuahua, half
terrier, thinks it’s mighty fun to chase her, and I’ve seen her kill
small animals.  She does NOT like my cat (neither does my stepdad),
and when I was out with her, just seeing wht it would be like, the dog
is like,”KILLKILLKILL!!!”, and ny mom says, “Oh, Honey, it’s the most
natural thing in the world, a dog chasing a cat..” Yeah, but not when
it’s my cat.  Anyway, after that weirdo dream i had about her running
away and leaving me forever at the oytser bar for jackie o, all i can
see is her feeling like she’s in jail.  I can’t take that either.  How
many times have I said to myself that I would NEVER EVER EVER KEEP
ANYONE OR THING LOCKED UP(against their will), and here I am,
selfishly keeping my precious little Killer in jail.
I suppose I have to do it, don’t I?
I have to let her go, and see if she’ll come back, and it’s tearing me
up because she really did save my life in Miami.  I had a
responsibility, and it gave me a way to start back on the road home,
and here I am, so I have to be fair about it, and I’m losing my shit.
I can’t lose anyone else I love right now.  I’m not that strong.  My
step dad is like,”it’s just a cat…” so i said, “yeah,and my mom is
just your wife, and I’m just your daughter.”
sorry ’bout this.  Emotions run high when I first get up and i feel so
heavenly…i hate suboxone.
There’s no compromise.  It sux.  It’s not like I could put her in a
cage or run outside, ‘cuz it’s the same thing.  jail.
I need a shower and some coffee.
luv to you all, and thanks for listening.
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] mornin sunshine
Date: May 10, 2005 at 7:51:05 AM EDT
To: matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

slept for about 3 hours, then tossed like a coconut in a hurricane for
what seemed like ever.  My kittykat, Killer, knows i’m having a hard
time and was snuggly, which is just what I didn’t want.  I stayed put
and let her sleep on my belly for as long as i could take it.  I had
the most fucked up dreams…i was carrying all of my shit to the
subway, and waiting for the 6 at Astor, going uptown, but everytime i
got on the train, my suitcases would fall apart and my cat would
escape, and I’d end up freaking out and chasing her through the train,
just as we got to 42nd.  Then Killer would launch out of the train,
into Grand Central, and I’d end up running down to where you catch th
LIIR, and the same weird old lady who would be siitting at the Oyster
bar on the LIIR would take my cat away from me and challenge me to a
duel.  As soon as i was challenged to this duel with this freakin’
wackjob old lady in a Jackie O outfit, the scene would shift, and I’d
be back a t Astor, waiting fot the 6, only this time, the cat carry
would crumble and I’d chase her, etc etc and it kept going for like
evre and ever, and I never did get my beloved Killer back.  Or any of
my shit.  And the old lady was always dressed like jackie o .
huh.
I woke up terrified.
still shakin’ and twitch’, but that’s okay…
luv
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Friday the 13th
Date: May 13, 2005 at 11:25:54 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

good luck on your doctor visit- the anticipation of what the doc is/might gonna say is always frustrating and gives me the stomach jitters in a really bad way. I’ll spend hours sweating while playing out in my imagination the scene where I explain to my doc why I’m seeing him 5 days (or more at some points) early to get my meds and whether he’ll say yes or no or give me a hassle about it or simply write the prescription.
So again, best of luck today.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “tink” <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, May 13, 2005 5:02 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Friday the 13th

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYY PRESTON
PEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It was wonderful to start off my morning with an email that contained
some positive feedback, especially after a night of the electric leg
festival that i’ve just twitched my way through.  That good things are
happening is encouragement to continue on in the direction I’ve
chosen, and that good things are happening to you makes it an even
sweeter.
I’m about to wake up my mom and sister in law, hop in the car and
drive for about 2 hours to go see the fucking suboxone doc.  I have to
convince him to switch me to subutex, and I’m not do for a refill for
like two more weeks, so any psychic hotline shit all you out there in
ibogaville feel like sending this way would be greatly apprecciated.
It’s cold enough for sonw, and I’m avoiding looking out the window
right now, because I’m just not sure I want to know yet.  The idea of
coffee is appealing, but I know what it’ll do to me, and I’m NOT
willing to freak my system out just to go sit in the car with Ma and
Katie.  Then again, maybe that’ll be the key to my survival-drinking
enough coffee to keep up with my mother is no easy feat, since I
introduced her cordatitas, cubano-style.  She is drinking cuban
espresso by the pot now, true believers, and it’s almost more than I
can take, as she streaks through the house, faster than a speeding
train, able to leap over Capitol T in a single bound.  It’s comic in
it’s very nightmarish nature…Now if she would just take her fucking
Zoloft on a regular basis.  The neighbor’s dog is about ot get it with
her 22.  I really think she’s serious this time, and she had my step
dad actually BUY BULLETS.  It’s probably a good think I’m getting
dumped in Montpelier for the weekend.  I can let the carnage carry on
with out me for once.  Her idea to simply shoot the gun into the air
on the hour, all day and night, and scream, “GET THAT FUCKING DOG OUT
OF MY YARD(BLAM-BLAM)BEFORE I HAVE TO(BLAM-BLAM)GET SERIOUS ABOUT
THIS(BLAM-BLAM)AND DO SOMETHING DRASTIC!!!” has both me and my stepdad
more than a bit on the nervous side.  He’s off on business, and I’m
esacaping while the getting’s good.  The last thing I need right now
is to be extradited on an old warrant because the cops came all the
way up to the house thanks to my mom’s exuberence in ridding the
neighborhood of not only this pesky creature (and he did bark for a
minimum of 14 hours, all day and well into the night yesterday-I don’t
like tis dog any better, but let’s not go there, shall we?) but the
neighbor’s themselves, as more suburanites come into the “Hey! Let’s
move to Vermont and deforest some nice land!!” way of thinking.
Well, I can hear the steps down the hall from upstairs, so I suppose I
must either hide or caffeinate, and hope for the best, either way.
I wish I had bail money, just in case, for my mom…
Congrats, again, Preston!!
Thankyou all for being here and lovelovelove!
Tinkerhell…

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: shelley krupa <skrupa20022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 13, 2005 at 11:18:50 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Lee, I’m interested in how ibogaine could cause damage in cardio compromised patients as well. To the best of my understanding, I thought ibogaine lowers pulse rate & BP, so I’m uncertain how it could put more pressure of the heart valves. I am a nurse ,but my expertise is psychiatry, so I’m no hot shot ,cant read EKG’s well .However ,when I do ibogaine (4 times ),I feel like my pulse quickens,would sure like to know more.You undoubtedly have more experience than I do. If the blood clotting is off ,I would think a PT/PTT test would show that ,that’s what they do pre surgery to insure a patient doesnt bleed out.I know some about congestive heart failure,coronary heart disease ,at least more than a lay person,I am sure if a person were that progressed with heart disease ,he/she would be having symptoms already. I would think arrhythmias would more likely be the culprit,thus the EKG,wonder how much exhaustion plays a part too,enlighten me please,shell

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Dear List,

I am reposting this hoping for a bite somewhere. Basically what I understand from this (if it is real science) is that the stress of a session could put pressure on the heart valves, perhaps causing some minor tears where the person is not in good health, and the healing of the breaks, where someone is low on vitamin c etc (i.e., high lipoprotein levels/poor health), leads to increased clogging of the valves which in turn could lead to a heart attack post session if the valves are already compromised, i.e., it is possible to pass an EKG but deteriorate post-session. It would explain death after a session to me. That being the case a further test for lipoprotein levels would serve re: safeguarding against post session heart failure.

This would be of more importance to those of poor heath depending on an EKG than those whose health is “normal.”

Anybody care to comment or enlighten?

Lee

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Pam,

I read what you wrote and had a quick look on the web to see what it said about vascular disease. Then I lost your mail. Don’t know how that happened. Sorry.

I came across this:

… In the US, every other person will die of vascular heart disease. … More than
seven million Americans are living with vascular heart disease right now …
referring to the link to this site:

http://www.medical-library.net/sites/vitamin_c_and_vascular_disease.html

The article goes on to say:

<snip>
Our Distant Ancestors Lost the Ability to Produce Vitamin C
It long has been known that human beings do not produce ascorbic acid (vitamin C). Because vitamin C — which I shall refer to as “ascorbate” from here on out — is essential to life and because we cannot produce it, it is known as a vitamin in human metabolism. We are rare among species, because almost all mammals can make abundant supplies of ascorbate. There are only four species of mammals which do not make their own ascorbate. These are (1) humans, (2) gorillas, (3) guinea pigs and (4) fruit bats.
<end-snip>

followed by:

<snip>

Ice Ages, Scurvy, and Natural Selection
However, our common ancestors did not stay in Africa. They migrated to cover the entire earth. Then came the Ices Ages, one after another, each lasting around 10,000 years. We know from the archeological evidence that human beings lived through these ice ages in northern climates. They somehow toughed it out. Ascorbate, because it is made by plant food, is not easy to come by in an ice age. The old vegetable garden does not do so well under a thick layer of ice. These ancestors suffered from ascorbate deficiency, a disease called scurvy, a fact borne out by examination of their remains.
<end-snip>
Scurvy is marked by the breakdown of collagen tissue throughout the body and frequent infections. Collagen is the protein with which strong connective tissue is made throughout the body.
<snip>
<end-snip>
The same sort of thing happened to many of our ancestors who lived through the ice ages. Many of them bled to death because they had little or no ascorbate, and without ascorbate there is no collagen production or repair throughout the body. The wall of a blood vessel is made of collagen. Therefore, when you run out of ascorbate, it is only a matter of time until that wall of collagen breaks down, is not repaired, cracks open and you bleed to death.
<snip>
<end-snip>
<snip>
Risk Factors: Lipoprotein(a), LDL, Lipids, and Oxidized Cholesterol
However, not all our Ice Ages ancestors died of cracked open blood vessels. Many did, but some had the ability to repair leaky blood vessel walls without the assistance of ascorbate.
When a crack develops in a blood vessel wall due to a shortage of ascorbate, certain fat packages in the blood have the ability to plug the leak by forming a kind of plaster cast. These packages of fat are known as cholesterol, lipids, low density lipoproteins (LDL), and one especially effective leak plugger, lipoprotein(a), a special type of LDL.
<end-snip>
<snip>
The tumor, i.e., the proliferation of excess smooth muscle cells is not cancerous. Nevertheless, it can cause death by pushing this mass of plaque into the lumen (passage way) of the blood vessel in which this process is happening. This narrows the passage way through which blood passes and can eventually lead to heart attack, stroke and other problems, depending on where in the body it develops.<snip>
<end-snip>
<snip>
Lipoprotein(a) Is The Real Risk Factor for Vascular Disease
The bottom line is that lipoprotein(a) is the real risk factor in cardiovascular disease and that ascorbate and niacin are the only major lines of defense against high levels of lipoprotein(a). Cholesterol, even LDL cholesterol, can serve as a statistical risk factor only to the degree that it is correlated with the level of the real problem: the special type of LDL called lipoprotein(a).
The best test, by far, for risk of cardiovascular disease is the direct measurement of this special type of LDL, namely a lipoprotein(a) level. A lipoprotein(a) level is ten times more accurate and specific for prediction of vascular disease.
<end-snip>
<snip>
The presently accepted levels of lipoprotein(a) are the following.

0

20 mg./dl
low risk
20

40 mg./dl.
moderate risk
>      40 mg./dl.
high risk
<end-snip>
<snip>
1. Lipoprotein(a) levels are largely determined by inheritance.
2. Special diet does not influence lipoprotein(a) levels.
3. None of the available cholesterol lowering drugs lower lipoprotein(a) blood levels.
4. Ascorbate and niacin both lower lipoprotein(a) blood levels.
<un-snip>
<snip>
The Cost in Lives
Nevertheless, there is still a long way to go. In the U.S., every other person will die of vascular heart disease. Many more will die of stroke, another complication of vascular disease. Every year 1.5 million Americans die of heart attack, one fifth of them suddenly, before reaching the hospital or medical attention. Death is the first symptom of heart disease for forty percent of those who learn they have it. More than seven million Americans are living with vascular heart disease right now, and 2.5 million have cerebrovascular disease. Eight million Americans have arrhythmia: irregular heartbeat related to vascular disease.
<un-snip>
<snip>
Program for the Reversal of Heart Disease
If you have vascular disease, and if you want not to have it, there is a plan for you.
1. Get yourself into chelation therapy and stay the course. This is the fastest, most proven method of dealing with this life-threatening condition. The literature proving this is extensive, despite what uninformed doctors may tell you. Then, in consultation with a doctor who practices nutritional medicine, take the following steps: (All the following dosages may be adjusted by your doctor, based on his or her experience and medical opinion.)
2. Vitamin C to bowel tolerance — as much as you can take without diarrhea. For most people this will be in the range of five to ten grams (5,000-10,000 mg.) each day. Spread this amount into two equal doses 12 hours apart. (Vitamin C prevents further cracking of the blood vessel wall — the beginning of the disease.)
3. Co-enzyme Q10 90-180 mg. twice each day (strengthens the heart muscle).
4. L-carnitine 3 grams twice each day (also strengthens the heart muscle).
5. L-lysine 3 grams twice each day (acts to release lipoprotein(a) from plaque formation and prevent further deposition of same).
6. L-proline 3 grams twice each day (acts to release lipoprotein(a) from plaque formation and prevent further deposition of same).
7. Niacin decreases the production of lipoprotein(a) in the liver. Inositol hexaniacinate is a form of niacin which gives less of a problem with flushing and therefore allows for larger therapeutic doses. Begin with 250 mg. at lunch, 500 mg. at dinner and 500 mg. at bedtime the first day; then increase gradually over a few days until you reach four grams per day, or the highest dose under four grams you can tolerate. Be sure to aks your doctor for liver enzyme level tests every two months or less to be sure your liver is able to handle the dose you are taking.
8. Vitamin E (as Unique E) 800-2400 IU per day. (This inhibits the proliferation of smooth muscle cells in the walls of arteries undergoing the atherosclerotic changes.)
9. Stop smoking. (This decreases the free radical load on your body.)
10. Adopt a sensible diet with plenty of veggies and not so much fat. (The metabolism of fat decreases your body vitamin pool dramatically.)
11. Ask your doctor for a comprehensive stool analysis (Great Smokies Lab) to see if you are digesting well all that good food. Your diet does not matter much if it is not getting into your body.
12. Lower stress in your life however you can.
13. Adopt a sensible exercise program in collaboration with your doctor.
<un-snip>
I am wondering if anyone has any experience with this to comment, i.e., is this good science? How significant is this in determining fitness for an ibogaine session as opposed to an EKG test?
Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] I will be in London from noon Saturday til 5 pm Sunday
Date: May 13, 2005 at 11:18:03 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Nick, Lee, Hattie:

I will be speaking at Trafalgar Square, but will be reachable thru Chris 207-637-7467 or Andy 207 485 3337. (mobile:
07976825086), the organizers. They will know where I am. Bringing books and a few DVDs.

Dana/cnw

ic SouthLondon.co.uk, UK.
http://icsouthlondon.icnetwork.co.uk/0100news/0200southlondonheadlines/tm_objectid=15497034&method=full&siteid=50100&headline=cannabis-rally-gets-go-ahead-from-gla-name_page.html

Cannabis rally gets go-ahead from GLA May 10 2005

South London Press

PRO-CANNABIS campaigners banned from holding a festival in South London will rally in Trafalgar Square.

Thousands of people are expected to join the demonstration in central London, calling for the drug to be legalised.

Organisers were forced to look elsewhere in February when Lambeth council refused them permission to host the seventh Cannabis March and Festival in Brockwell Park, Herne Hill – alleging drug dealing had taken place at last year’s event.

But the Greater London Authority (GLA) has allowed the march and rally to go ahead on Sunday.

Organiser Shane Collins said: “I am pleased the march is going ahead in such a high-profile spot but disappointed that Lambeth is to lose out.”

The march will begin in Russell Square at 1pm and continue to Trafalgar Square, where speakers will lead the rally from 3pm to 7pm.

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 13, 2005 at 8:52:26 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Dear List,

I am reposting this hoping for a bite somewhere. Basically what I understand from this (if it is real science) is that the stress of a session could put pressure on the heart valves, perhaps causing some minor tears where the person is not in good health, and the healing of the breaks, where someone is low on vitamin c etc (i.e., high lipoprotein levels/poor health), leads to increased clogging of the valves which in turn could lead to a heart attack post session if the valves are already compromised, i.e., it is possible to pass an EKG but deteriorate post-session. It would explain death after a session to me. That being the case a further test for lipoprotein levels would serve re: safeguarding against post session heart failure.

This would be of more importance to those of poor heath depending on an EKG than those whose health is “normal.”

Anybody care to comment or enlighten?

Lee
Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Pam,

I read what you wrote and had a quick look on the web to see what it said about vascular disease. Then I lost your mail. Don’t know how that happened. Sorry.

I came across this:

… In the US, every other person will die of vascular heart disease. … More than
seven million Americans are living with vascular heart disease right now …
referring to the link to this site:

http://www.medical-library.net/sites/vitamin_c_and_vascular_disease.html

The article goes on to say:

<snip>
Our Distant Ancestors Lost the Ability to Produce Vitamin C
It long has been known that human beings do not produce ascorbic acid (vitamin C). Because vitamin C — which I shall refer to as “ascorbate” from here on out — is essential to life and because we cannot produce it, it is known as a vitamin in human metabolism. We are rare among species, because almost all mammals can make abundant supplies of ascorbate. There are only four species of mammals which do not make their own ascorbate. These are (1) humans, (2) gorillas, (3) guinea pigs and (4) fruit bats.
<end-snip>

followed by:

<snip>

Ice Ages, Scurvy, and Natural Selection
However, our common ancestors did not stay in Africa. They migrated to cover the entire earth. Then came the Ices Ages, one after another, each lasting around 10,000 years. We know from the archeological evidence that human beings lived through these ice ages in northern climates. They somehow toughed it out. Ascorbate, because it is made by plant food, is not easy to come by in an ice age. The old vegetable garden does not do so well under a thick layer of ice. These ancestors suffered from ascorbate deficiency, a disease called scurvy, a fact borne out by examination of their remains.
<end-snip>
Scurvy is marked by the breakdown of collagen tissue throughout the body and frequent infections. Collagen is the protein with which strong connective tissue is made throughout the body.
<snip>
<end-snip>
The same sort of thing happened to many of our ancestors who lived through the ice ages. Many of them bled to death because they had little or no ascorbate, and without ascorbate there is no collagen production or repair throughout the body. The wall of a blood vessel is made of collagen. Therefore, when you run out of ascorbate, it is only a matter of time until that wall of collagen breaks down, is not repaired, cracks open and you bleed to death.
<snip>
<end-snip>
<snip>
Risk Factors: Lipoprotein(a), LDL, Lipids, and Oxidized Cholesterol
However, not all our Ice Ages ancestors died of cracked open blood vessels. Many did, but some had the ability to repair leaky blood vessel walls without the assistance of ascorbate.
When a crack develops in a blood vessel wall due to a shortage of ascorbate, certain fat packages in the blood have the ability to plug the leak by forming a kind of plaster cast. These packages of fat are known as cholesterol, lipids, low density lipoproteins (LDL), and one especially effective leak plugger, lipoprotein(a), a special type of LDL.
<end-snip>
<snip>
The tumor, i.e., the proliferation of excess smooth muscle cells is not cancerous. Nevertheless, it can cause death by pushing this mass of plaque into the lumen (passage way) of the blood vessel in which this process is happening. This narrows the passage way through which blood passes and can eventually lead to heart attack, stroke and other problems, depending on where in the body it develops.<snip>
<end-snip>
<snip>
Lipoprotein(a) Is The Real Risk Factor for Vascular Disease
The bottom line is that lipoprotein(a) is the real risk factor in cardiovascular disease and that ascorbate and niacin are the only major lines of defense against high levels of lipoprotein(a). Cholesterol, even LDL cholesterol, can serve as a statistical risk factor only to the degree that it is correlated with the level of the real problem: the special type of LDL called lipoprotein(a).
The best test, by far, for risk of cardiovascular disease is the direct measurement of this special type of LDL, namely a lipoprotein(a) level. A lipoprotein(a) level is ten times more accurate and specific for prediction of vascular disease.
<end-snip>
<snip>
The presently accepted levels of lipoprotein(a) are the following.

0

20 mg./dl
low risk
20

40 mg./dl.
moderate risk
>      40 mg./dl.
high risk
<end-snip>
<snip>
1. Lipoprotein(a) levels are largely determined by inheritance.
2. Special diet does not influence lipoprotein(a) levels.
3. None of the available cholesterol lowering drugs lower lipoprotein(a) blood levels.
4. Ascorbate and niacin both lower lipoprotein(a) blood levels.
<un-snip>
<snip>
The Cost in Lives
Nevertheless, there is still a long way to go. In the U.S., every other person will die of vascular heart disease. Many more will die of stroke, another complication of vascular disease. Every year 1.5 million Americans die of heart attack, one fifth of them suddenly, before reaching the hospital or medical attention. Death is the first symptom of heart disease for forty percent of those who learn they have it. More than seven million Americans are living with vascular heart disease right now, and 2.5 million have cerebrovascular disease. Eight million Americans have arrhythmia: irregular heartbeat related to vascular disease.
<un-snip>
<snip>
Program for the Reversal of Heart Disease
If you have vascular disease, and if you want not to have it, there is a plan for you.
1. Get yourself into chelation therapy and stay the course. This is the fastest, most proven method of dealing with this life-threatening condition. The literature proving this is extensive, despite what uninformed doctors may tell you. Then, in consultation with a doctor who practices nutritional medicine, take the following steps: (All the following dosages may be adjusted by your doctor, based on his or her experience and medical opinion.)
2. Vitamin C to bowel tolerance — as much as you can take without diarrhea. For most people this will be in the range of five to ten grams (5,000-10,000 mg.) each day. Spread this amount into two equal doses 12 hours apart. (Vitamin C prevents further cracking of the blood vessel wall — the beginning of the disease.)
3. Co-enzyme Q10 90-180 mg. twice each day (strengthens the heart muscle).
4. L-carnitine 3 grams twice each day (also strengthens the heart muscle).
5. L-lysine 3 grams twice each day (acts to release lipoprotein(a) from plaque formation and prevent further deposition of same).
6. L-proline 3 grams twice each day (acts to release lipoprotein(a) from plaque formation and prevent further deposition of same).
7. Niacin decreases the production of lipoprotein(a) in the liver. Inositol hexaniacinate is a form of niacin which gives less of a problem with flushing and therefore allows for larger therapeutic doses. Begin with 250 mg. at lunch, 500 mg. at dinner and 500 mg. at bedtime the first day; then increase gradually over a few days until you reach four grams per day, or the highest dose under four grams you can tolerate. Be sure to aks your doctor for liver enzyme level tests every two months or less to be sure your liver is able to handle the dose you are taking.
8. Vitamin E (as Unique E) 800-2400 IU per day. (This inhibits the proliferation of smooth muscle cells in the walls of arteries undergoing the atherosclerotic changes.)
9. Stop smoking. (This decreases the free radical load on your body.)
10. Adopt a sensible diet with plenty of veggies and not so much fat. (The metabolism of fat decreases your body vitamin pool dramatically.)
11. Ask your doctor for a comprehensive stool analysis (Great Smokies Lab) to see if you are digesting well all that good food. Your diet does not matter much if it is not getting into your body.
12. Lower stress in your life however you can.
13. Adopt a sensible exercise program in collaboration with your doctor.
<un-snip>
I am wondering if anyone has any experience with this to comment, i.e., is this good science? How significant is this in determining fitness for an ibogaine session as opposed to an EKG test?
Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Friday the 13th
Date: May 13, 2005 at 5:02:20 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

YEEEEEEEEEEEEEAAAAAAAAAAAAYYYYYYYYY PRESTON
PEET!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
It was wonderful to start off my morning with an email that contained
some positive feedback, especially after a night of the electric leg
festival that i’ve just twitched my way through.  That good things are
happening is encouragement to continue on in the direction I’ve
chosen, and that good things are happening to you makes it an even
sweeter.
I’m about to wake up my mom and sister in law, hop in the car and
drive for about 2 hours to go see the fucking suboxone doc.  I have to
convince him to switch me to subutex, and I’m not do for a refill for
like two more weeks, so any psychic hotline shit all you out there in
ibogaville feel like sending this way would be greatly apprecciated.
It’s cold enough for sonw, and I’m avoiding looking out the window
right now, because I’m just not sure I want to know yet.  The idea of
coffee is appealing, but I know what it’ll do to me, and I’m NOT
willing to freak my system out just to go sit in the car with Ma and
Katie.  Then again, maybe that’ll be the key to my survival-drinking
enough coffee to keep up with my mother is no easy feat, since I
introduced her cordatitas, cubano-style.  She is drinking cuban
espresso by the pot now, true believers, and it’s almost more than I
can take, as she streaks through the house, faster than a speeding
train, able to leap over Capitol T in a single bound.  It’s comic in
it’s very nightmarish nature…Now if she would just take her fucking
Zoloft on a regular basis.  The neighbor’s dog is about ot get it with
her 22.  I really think she’s serious this time, and she had my step
dad actually BUY BULLETS.  It’s probably a good think I’m getting
dumped in Montpelier for the weekend.  I can let the carnage carry on
with out me for once.  Her idea to simply shoot the gun into the air
on the hour, all day and night, and scream, “GET THAT FUCKING DOG OUT
OF MY YARD(BLAM-BLAM)BEFORE I HAVE TO(BLAM-BLAM)GET SERIOUS ABOUT
THIS(BLAM-BLAM)AND DO SOMETHING DRASTIC!!!” has both me and my stepdad
more than a bit on the nervous side.  He’s off on business, and I’m
esacaping while the getting’s good.  The last thing I need right now
is to be extradited on an old warrant because the cops came all the
way up to the house thanks to my mom’s exuberence in ridding the
neighborhood of not only this pesky creature (and he did bark for a
minimum of 14 hours, all day and well into the night yesterday-I don’t
like tis dog any better, but let’s not go there, shall we?) but the
neighbor’s themselves, as more suburanites come into the “Hey! Let’s
move to Vermont and deforest some nice land!!” way of thinking.
Well, I can hear the steps down the hall from upstairs, so I suppose I
must either hide or caffeinate, and hope for the best, either way.
I wish I had bail money, just in case, for my mom…
Congrats, again, Preston!!
Thankyou all for being here and lovelovelove!
Tinkerhell…

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Fw: [PRUP] FBI nabs troops, officers in drug sting
Date: May 13, 2005 at 4:46:01 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

MY QUESTION
how come we dont hear this shit on the news>?…..fucken idiots!!!!!

Namaste
Matthew

Powerful parental controls improve your peace of mind with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] unbelieveable but WAY cool
Date: May 13, 2005 at 4:43:50 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

WAY COOOOL!!!!…..Best of luck brother and keep us posted……Ah 4 30 bath time

Love
matt

Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [PRUP] FBI nabs troops, officers in drug sting
Date: May 13, 2005 at 4:35:00 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

To: “‘Dean Becker'” <dean@cultural-baggage.com>; “‘Preston Peet'” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 7:20 PM
Subject: FW: [PRUP] FBI nabs troops, officers in drug sting

fyi

Paul Wright, Editor
Prison Legal News
972 Putney Rd. PMB 251
Brattleboro, VT 05301
(802) 257-1342
pwright@prisonlegalnews.org
www.prisonlegalnews.org
Seattle Office:
2400 NW 80th St. PMB 148
Seattle, WA 98117
(206) 246-1022

—–Original Message—–
From: PRUP@yahoogroups.com [mailto:PRUP@yahoogroups.com] On Behalf Of Shiloh
Media Relations
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 6:30 PM
To: Iron Cage
Cc: OutsideLookingIn4U@yahoogroups.com; Prup; fppp@yahoogroups.com; Texoma
PRUP
Subject: [PRUP] FBI nabs troops, officers in drug sting

FBI nabs troops, officers in drug sting

——————————————————————–

Posted on Thu, May. 12, 2005

FBI nabs troops, officers in drug sting

ARTHUR H. ROTSTEIN
Associated Press

TUCSON, Ariz. – FBI agents posing as cocaine traffickers in
Arizona caught 16 current and former U.S. soldiers and law enforcement
personnel who took about $220,000 in bribes to help move the drugs through
checkpoints, Justice Department officials said Thursday.

Those charged include a former Immigration and Naturalization
Service inspector, a former Army sergeant, a former federal prison guard,
current and former members of the Arizona Army National Guard and the state
corrections department, and a Nogales police officer, officials said.

“Many individuals charged were sworn personnel having the task
of protecting society and securing America’s borders. The importance of
these tasks cannot be overstated and we cannot tolerate, nor can the
American people afford, this type of corruption,” FBI agent Jana D. Monroe,
who directs the bureau’s operations in Arizona, said during a news
conference in Tucson.

All 16 have agreed to plead guilty to being part of a bribery
and extortion conspiracy, the result of the nearly 3 1/2-year FBI sting,
acting assistant attorney general John C. Richter and Monroe said. Officials
said more arrests are anticipated.

The single conspiracy count carries a maximum prison term of
five years and a fine of $250,000. The 16 defendants have not been arrested
and have agreed to cooperate with the ongoing investigation, officials said.

The FBI set up the phony trafficking organization in December
2001, then lured military and police personnel with money to help distribute
the cocaine or allow it to pass through checkpoints they were guarding,
officials said.

One defendant, John M. Castillo, 30, was on duty as an INS
inspector at a border checkpoint in Nogales in April 2002 when he twice
allowed a truck he believed was carrying at least 88 pounds of cocaine to
enter the country without being inspected, the Justice Department said.

In another instance, also in 2002, several of those charged met
an aircraft piloted by undercover FBI agents that was carrying 132 pounds of
cocaine at a remote desert airstrip, officials said. In full uniform, they
supervised the loading of the cocaine into two military Humvees assigned to
the National Guard and another government vehicle, then drove to a resort
hotel in Phoenix. There, another undercover agent posing as a trafficker
paid them off in cash, the Justice Department said.

The FBI used real cocaine seized in other operations, the
officials said. The 16 suspects transported more than 1,230 pounds of
cocaine and accepted more than $222,000 in bribes, the officials said. Each
escorted at least two shipments of cocaine to Phoenix, Las Vegas and other
locations, they said.

The cocaine, with a street value of nearly $18.5 million, never
ultimately left FBI possession, officials said.

Associated Press Writer Mark Sherman in Washington contributed
to this report.

ON THE NET

FBI: http://www.fbi.gov

—————————————————————————-
—-

C 2005 AP Wire and wire service sources. All Rights Reserved.
http://www.kansascity.com

[Non-text portions of this message have been removed]

———————— Yahoo! Groups Sponsor ——————–~–>
What would our lives be like without music, dance, and theater?
Donate or volunteer in the arts today at Network for Good!
http://us.click.yahoo.com/MCfFmA/SOnJAA/E2hLAA/1dTolB/TM
——————————————————————–~->

Our website is now located at www.prup.us
Yahoo! Groups Links

<*> To visit your group on the web, go to:
http://groups.yahoo.com/group/PRUP/

<*> To unsubscribe from this group, send an email to:
PRUP-unsubscribe@yahoogroups.com

<*> Your use of Yahoo! Groups is subject to:
http://docs.yahoo.com/info/terms/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] unbelieveable but WAY cool
Date: May 13, 2005 at 4:11:34 AM EDT
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all,
So, I’m busy as hell putting this second book to bed (almost done- hopefully tomorrow the final manuscript will be turned in by me) but got a call today, a last minute call, to go to an audition for another day-player part, but this time in a movie instead of a tv-pilot.
I kinda freak, because the audition is scheduled to be at 7PM, for shooting to be tomorrow done tomorrow…errrr, later today now, on Friday actually- a real last minute call thing- but I had already booked a featured background gig (where they use me to the utmost, fully close-up focusing on my face in full goth gear and goth makeup without giving me an upgrade to day player rolehood and pay scale) that was a 7PM call time- which I booked yesterday, so even though the audition this evening was for a real part (with one line but it’s still a part for which I’d get screen credit), I couldn’t cancel the already booked gig- so I somewhat frantically called the agency that booked today’s gig to see if I could come in a few minutes late, while the other agency called to see if I could get into an audition a little early.
Lo and behold the one said, sure, just get to the gig as soon as possible, and the audition folk said sure, come in half an hour early- so I went in full goth regalia, dressed for today’s gig which was perfect because they wanted a “punk” look for the audition.
I went, and discovered that the agency holding the auditions actually already knew who I was (having auditioned there I guess before- I’m not really sure how they knew me, but it was obvious they did, as they told my agency when they called about getting in early, “oh, you mean Preston Peet? We know him,” so I guess they know what they’re talking about) so I was immediately at ease and they did see me early enough to get to my already booked gig. But the shooting for the movie was supposed to be tomorrow, so I was supposed to hear tonight if I got the movie part.
I spent all night freezing my skinny ass off standing outside this stupid club, and as it got later and later with no call to my cell, both V and I began to assume I did not get the part. Especially since they were so nice- which usually means I did NOT get the part (when I booked the tv pilot, first thing I said to V when I got home was “I blew that audition” and then got the call an hour later telling me I booked it, but tonight they were nice, and I got excited, so it was easy to believe I did NOT get the booking.)
But when we got home (about 15 minutes ago, meaning I’ve been on set all night) there was a message on the machine, saying “Preston, this is so and so from The Fantastic Four production office, and you booked the part, which shoots on Saturday.”
Holy shit, I booked a (SMALL, one line) role in new The Fantastic Four movie being shot right now! How freakin’ cool is THAT one?!?! I ask you again, how cool is that? For all you comic book fans out there, I gotta tell you, I’m much more excited about this gig than I was about the one that flew me to LA and back last month. This is MUCH MORE COOL than that one, that’s for sure, and I’m NOT playing a junkie- it’s a completely different role with me looking VERY different, much more together and obviously NOT a junkie this time. Wow, can I say again in some other way how excited I am?
To tie this in somehow to drugs, I smoked a few bowls on set tonight, to medicate of course, in hopes that by doing so I was adding to the “let’s legalize medical marijuana” vibes going around the State of NY right now (our state government is thinking very strongly about doing so this session apparently, according to some of the local papers). And my opiate intake is still incredibly teeny, just taking enough to deal with the endless pain, which is WAY less than I was taking not so long ago– gee 3 weeks ago today was when I was last taking ibogaine voyages around the universe.
Anyway, so your DrugWar.com email list moderator is keeping busy. Please push positive thoughts my way, as it’s interesting that this is happening right about the same time the “fear of success” thread came back through the (ibogaine) list.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What the holy Fuck is going on up here!!!
Date: May 12, 2005 at 10:09:52 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thankyou as always, Biscuit Boy!  Rough day here at the Ponderosa, and
it doesn’t appear to be getting any better.  I’m the world’s biggest
baby right now, having dropped again.  Her I go, and aren’t I looking
forward to it!!  I just wish it was over already…
prepare for the onslaught…
love
tink

On 5/12/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Tink, please feel free to rant all you want to. I know I did when I was in
your shoes. I looked back at my post from that period and saw what I was
going through, and I tell you, I ranted about everything. I know I drove
these people nuts. But what the hell, I didn’t have to drive them very far.
(He He) Ranting is good for the soul esp. when you can look later at where
you were. Somebody should write a book about this shit. O yea, it’s being
done. Hurry up Patrick!!!!!!!!!                Dr. prescribes           Drug
store provides         Whoooooooooo’s gonna help him to kick it?(Rolling
Stones)    Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What the holy Fuck is going on up here!!!
Date: May 12, 2005 at 10:06:55 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you poor fool, stuck down in hurricane ville!!  I’ll send you a bus
ticket home!!  Took me 6 years to crawl out of Overtown on my belly,
with a rig in my ankle and a crack pipe up my ass.  Don’t stay if you
don’t have to!  You’re in my thoughts and what version of prayer I’ve
taken uo these days!
Miami and South Fla SUX!!
love
tink

On 5/12/05, marcus israel <vesch69@yahoo.com> wrote:
the grass is always greener soto speak tink
now i’m down here in toohotoppressiveheat south FL
and wish deeply to be in NY taking another go at
treatment,dig?
Oh to be in the great Northwoods where skins are pale
andfreedomflowz
M_
— tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
I woke this morning to-get this one- SNOW!!!!
Yes, fellow addicts and whackjobs, it was snowing in
the Northeast
Kingdom, and the daffodils looked mighty put out by
the whole affair.
As did the poor frogs, who are no where to be found
any more.  Poor
peepers!
As I realise it was a good choice to leave Miami, I
still am
questioning my sanity on moving so far north, and
days like this, when
I get a call from South Beach complaining of 68* f,
I want to reach
through the phone and strangle people.
Other than that, I am wobbly and electric, but
smiling.  I dropped
another couple miligrams, and know what I’ll be
feeling like on the
morrow.
At least this can be the absolute last time I do
this.  It really can.
I am beyond determined to be done with this shit,
and have this
mantra of “This is the last time…this is the last
time…this is the
last fucking time…” rumbling through my thick
skull at almost every
moment.
One thing is for certain, however; I would not, nay,
COULD not, do
this with out knowing that there are a passel of
people mere keystroke
away to help keep me sane.
I love you all, and am reborn by the moment as
support flies through
the wires and net for me, for all of us.
This weekend will be tough, so my deranged ranting
will probably be
all over the place. Just a heads up for those who
are sick of my

“whatthefucki’mgoingtodienoi’mnothelpowshudderAHHH!!!!”‘s.
The force remains strong within us, young Jedi
Knights.
(Is it really only 7 days till “Revenge”?
Yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaayyyyyyy!!!!!!!!)
Peace of mind and love of self to all, as well as my
deepest thanks,
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “orangesun Barrel” <kaliorangemist710@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fear of success and trembling over failure
Date: May 12, 2005 at 4:06:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

fear of success is almost as common as fear of failure …both of which lead people to the surrogate happiness/contentment found in opiate derivatives… with success comes responsibility and the acquisition of money and property..which are lead to covetousness and greed. If you have nothing there’s nothing to lose… accept your spirit which is more important than all the bullshit possetions we covet and find comfort in..yet there is no end to success and failure ..its the approach one takes in doing ones deeds for the ultimate good that will free him/her from fear and loss of focus on spiritual enlightenment along the way. We all succeed in our failures if we can learn from them..
Check out Soren Kierkegaard’s Fear and Trembling…the ultimate subjectiveness of experience is pondered along with the endlessness of freedom which ascends reason and  for one  to define such a broad concept as freedom would inhibit the essance of freedom itself.
either or -iboga has shown us that fear is learned through conditioning, maintained through learning ,and dispelled through restoration of our original state ….before the mindfuck of Euro-American Sensationalism and capitalist materilization destroyed the spirits of keen men and women….the rituals of our ancestors are drowned out by the reason of what is called rational consciousness.
-sorry for my unispired philosophical rambles …”anxiety and fear will fade with the realization that time and space are only instituions of conditioning forced upon us”..eboga has no need for them..do we?
orange baron
-unedited so excuse typos and mispellings/words usages(merely rambling)

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: Tue, 10 May 2005 16:48:29 -0400

Have to say I agree with you here Nick, more so than just about anything I’ve ever read from you. In this instance, I am one hundred percent completely with you on your assessment here.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 4:59 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] back in wd

When things are going good, I think this is usually the toughest time. To
really take on being successful, being good at something, this is much
tougher than a lot of people think. Just when things are really going well
for me, when it’s all coming together, I hear this little voice coming in my
ear, urging me to do something to fuck it all up, just so it can relax in
the knowledge that I’m still a bit fucked up and I don’t really have to take
life on totally. Being successful is quite a deal, usually you have to
really work at that for a while til you can allow it.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: 09 May 2005 15:26
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Matthew,
I feel for you brother, I honestly do. It’s amazing how fast it can
happen, right? One minutes we’re fine and loving life, the next
we’re trying
to kill any happiness we’ve attained.
I think some of us are doomed to never be completely happy,
ever- it’s
not possible. I always think some of us will enternally fuck
ourselves over
until we’re old and alone or dead of overdose, or some other horrific
disastor that we can then point to and say, “see, I told me life sucked,
didn’t I.”

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 8:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered
yesterday as
i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four
months ago
coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get
addicted
again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken
pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the
bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im
emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont
feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much
respect for it
to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper
session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars,
lying naked
on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken
right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium:
Join now and
get the first two months FREE*
/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[
/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Fw: Drug-Watch: The Legislation of Morality
Date: May 12, 2005 at 3:39:36 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Preston, you have made me come up with an idea I have been bouncing around in my head. Now, I say this in jest but there could be something to it. As far as I know urine is the only source of noribogaine that there is. Maybe Ms. Mash knows something we don’t, but until she releases her findings, I think that I’m right. Get where I’m going with this yet? We take the pee from our Ibogaine treatments and dehydrate it and put it in capsules. I know when I did my treatment last year my provider said that some people were drinking the pee. I looked him in the eye and asked him, “Do they ever get rid of that taste in their mouth?” EVER? Freeze dried noribogaine piss. Get it while it’s hot! I hope this doesn’t piss anybody off. But I guess that’s better than getting pissed on. LOL I’m feeling full of piss and vinegar. I’ll never grow up.            Randy

From: “orangesun Barrel” <kaliorangemist710@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] .
Date: May 12, 2005 at 3:24:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

that is the mos ridiculous assertion that i’ve heard in a while > clean time depending on march for weed. its laughable

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] .
Date: Sat, 7 May 2005 14:13:11 -0400

Try to make the march today, your clean time depends
on it.<

What in the heck are you talking about, our “clean time depends on it.” WHile I fully support the march and the idea behind it (though I didn’t climb outta bed until, oh, about 20 minutes ago so missed it entirely), I can’t believe anyone would actually assert my clean time depends upon going to a marijuana march.
It’s odd is all, and I’m wondering how much humor you put into this statement or how seriously you made it, one or the other.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Morning Wood” <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 8:59 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] .

Try to make the march today, your clean time depends
on it.

cures-not-wars.org

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_________________________________________________________________
Is your PC infected? Get a FREE online computer virus scan from McAfeeź Security. http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What the holy Fuck is going on up here!!!
Date: May 12, 2005 at 3:21:29 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tink, please feel free to rant all you want to. I know I did when I was in your shoes. I looked back at my post from that period and saw what I was going through, and I tell you, I ranted about everything. I know I drove these people nuts. But what the hell, I didn’t have to drive them very far. (He He) Ranting is good for the soul esp. when you can look later at where you were. Somebody should write a book about this shit. O yea, it’s being done. Hurry up Patrick!!!!!!!!!                Dr. prescribes           Drug store provides         Whoooooooooo’s gonna help him to kick it?(Rolling Stones)    Randy

From: marcus israel <vesch69@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What the holy Fuck is going on up here!!!
Date: May 12, 2005 at 2:55:36 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

the grass is always greener soto speak tink
now i’m down here in toohotoppressiveheat south FL
and wish deeply to be in NY taking another go at
treatment,dig?
Oh to be in the great Northwoods where skins are pale
andfreedomflowz
M_
— tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
I woke this morning to-get this one- SNOW!!!!
Yes, fellow addicts and whackjobs, it was snowing in
the Northeast
Kingdom, and the daffodils looked mighty put out by
the whole affair.
As did the poor frogs, who are no where to be found
any more.  Poor
peepers!
As I realise it was a good choice to leave Miami, I
still am
questioning my sanity on moving so far north, and
days like this, when
I get a call from South Beach complaining of 68* f,
I want to reach
through the phone and strangle people.
Other than that, I am wobbly and electric, but
smiling.  I dropped
another couple miligrams, and know what I’ll be
feeling like on the
morrow.
At least this can be the absolute last time I do
this.  It really can.
I am beyond determined to be done with this shit,
and have this
mantra of “This is the last time…this is the last
time…this is the
last fucking time…” rumbling through my thick
skull at almost every
moment.
One thing is for certain, however; I would not, nay,
COULD not, do
this with out knowing that there are a passel of
people mere keystroke
away to help keep me sane.
I love you all, and am reborn by the moment as
support flies through
the wires and net for me, for all of us.
This weekend will be tough, so my deranged ranting
will probably be
all over the place. Just a heads up for those who
are sick of my

“whatthefucki’mgoingtodienoi’mnothelpowshudderAHHH!!!!”‘s.
The force remains strong within us, young Jedi
Knights.
(Is it really only 7 days till “Revenge”?
Yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaayyyyyyy!!!!!!!!)
Peace of mind and love of self to all, as well as my
deepest thanks,
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Yahoo! Mail Mobile
Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone.
http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [DrugWar] Fw: Drug-Watch: The Legislation of Morality
Date: May 12, 2005 at 12:44:09 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: drugwar@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: “John French” <john.french@verizon.net>
To: <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 12, 2005 10:20 AM
Subject: Drug-Watch: The Legislation of Morality

Lawmakers Object To Fake Penis For Drug Tests
Thu May 12, 2005 09:11 AM ET

WASHINGTON (Reuters) – A life-like prosthetic penis called the Whizzinator and other products promising to help illegal drug users pass urine tests provoked U.S. lawmakers on Wednesday to take legal action with subpoenas of manufacturers.

Lawmakers objected to attempts to circumvent drug tests with products such as The Whizzinator, a fake penis that can provide a flow of clean urine “again and again, anytime, anywhere you need it!” according to the Web site www.whizzinator.com.
<snip>
___________________________
Not content with testing people’s urine to see if they are taking drugs which are prohibited because the drugs alter behavior (said alteration apparently not being sufficient enough to detect without chemical analysis), Congress is taking time away from such piddling [sic] activities as the National Debt, the non-War in Iraq, and our Social Security, to examine the marketing of false penises.

Meanwhile, not to be outdone in inventiveness by lawmakers, the entrepreneurs at Whizzinator have created whizzers in five different colors (white, tan, Latino, Brown, and Black). Apparently they do not offer a variety of sizes. Their site offers a device for women, as well, but without the graphics.

They even offer dehydrated human urine! This, in my less than (or is it more than) humble opinion, is a stroke [sic] of genius. Somewhere, untold numbers of drug-free people are peeing into recepticles designed to dehydrate and store (freeze?) dried urine. (Brrrr….) Of course, we do not know how many people are actually doing this; the numbers are untold. Come to think of it, there are also untold numbers whose job it is, day after day, to watch other people urinate.

The opportunities for legislation are endless. As is usually the case with newly proposed legislation, existing laws can adequately cover the activities. Certainly a fake penis, when used for purposes of evading drug laws, is paraphernalia. But why should this stop lawmakers.

It causes one to reflect, doesn’t it.

John French

<]=———————————————————————–=[>
[           Moderated by: Preston Peet | http://www.drugwar.com           ]
|          -=/[ To Subscribe: drugwar-subscribe@mindvox.com ]/=-          |
|             To Unsubscribe: drugwar-unsubscribe@mindvox.com             |
[   DrugWar List in Digest Format: drugwar-digest-subscribe@mindvox.com   ]
<]=———————————————————————–=[>

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] What the holy Fuck is going on up here!!!
Date: May 12, 2005 at 11:45:21 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I woke this morning to-get this one- SNOW!!!!
Yes, fellow addicts and whackjobs, it was snowing in the Northeast
Kingdom, and the daffodils looked mighty put out by the whole affair.
As did the poor frogs, who are no where to be found any more.  Poor
peepers!
As I realise it was a good choice to leave Miami, I still am
questioning my sanity on moving so far north, and days like this, when
I get a call from South Beach complaining of 68* f, I want to reach
through the phone and strangle people.
Other than that, I am wobbly and electric, but smiling.  I dropped
another couple miligrams, and know what I’ll be feeling like on the
morrow.
At least this can be the absolute last time I do this.  It really can.
I am beyond determined to be done with this shit, and have this
mantra of “This is the last time…this is the last time…this is the
last fucking time…” rumbling through my thick skull at almost every
moment.
One thing is for certain, however; I would not, nay, COULD not, do
this with out knowing that there are a passel of people mere keystroke
away to help keep me sane.
I love you all, and am reborn by the moment as support flies through
the wires and net for me, for all of us.
This weekend will be tough, so my deranged ranting will probably be
all over the place. Just a heads up for those who are sick of my
“whatthefucki’mgoingtodienoi’mnothelpowshudderAHHH!!!!”‘s.
The force remains strong within us, young Jedi Knights.
(Is it really only 7 days till “Revenge”? Yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaayyyyyyy!!!!!!!!)
Peace of mind and love of self to all, as well as my deepest thanks,
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] yes yes
Date: May 12, 2005 at 9:34:26 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

keep going keep going keep going!!!!!!!!!!!!
drink water(not that I am) take biscuit boys timely advice (HEY
Biscuit boy!!) and email me !!
Love you kiddo, almost there…
I dropped again.  Live wire up the ass, etc, but on a slightly lesser
scale.  Can’t wait for tonight yurp.  Oh, my kitty is called Killer.
🙂
lov e you all
tink

On 5/12/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Matt, seeeeeeeeee it’s getting better. Have you been taking any vitamins?
If it were me, I would most definitely be taking a good multi, extra B
complex and extra B 12. Don’t let your guard down dude. I know for me, I
would get to the point where you are and think, “shit, that was only 4 days,
that wasn’t that bad,” and then when I get to work I would cop. I’m not
wanting to sound like a preacher here or anything, I just want you to
succeed, and be happy. You ROCK, keep it up.              Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] yes yes
Date: May 12, 2005 at 9:13:51 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt, seeeeeeeeee it’s getting better. Have you been taking any vitamins? If it were me, I would most definitely be taking a good multi, extra B complex and extra B 12. Don’t let your guard down dude. I know for me, I would get to the point where you are and think, “shit, that was only 4 days, that wasn’t that bad,” and then when I get to work I would cop. I’m not wanting to sound like a preacher here or anything, I just want you to succeed, and be happy. You ROCK, keep it up.              Randy

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] yes yes
Date: May 12, 2005 at 5:40:24 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

well well 5 ocolcok again…..in 5 hours i will hit the 5 day mark……what is cool is i managed to hold down some food……didnt eat fuck all for 5 days…..Love is paradise because love multiplies…la lalala….hehe its funny with this day and night routine….
Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] time stands still
Date: May 12, 2005 at 12:53:53 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

its 1 and i think the time not only stands still but keeps going back a tick every 2 ticks…..YEs the nights are the hardest…..hmmmm 4hours and the whole fuckenworld will be waking up again….LOL……this is sureal shit…..LVOe and love and peace of mind

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: sara119@xs4all.nl
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] fwd…cosmic cookie
Date: May 12, 2005 at 12:37:55 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Please forward widely

URGENT: Shanmugam Murugesu, who was caught with one
kilo of marijuana in 2003, is due to be hanged for it
this Friday 13th in Singapore.  See:
http://www.thinkcentre.org/article.cfm?ArticleID=2585

Singapore enforces some of the world’s toughest drug
laws. Anyone aged 18 or over convicted of carrying
more than 500 grammes (17.6 ounces) of cannabis faces
mandatory execution by hanging.

The ‘Think Center’ in Singapore is organizing a vigil
for Murugesu on Thursday evening.

Last week, Amnesty International launched an urgent
appeal on his behalf.

Fancy going to the Singapore Embassy in London on
Thursday? The hanging is on Friday morning.

Please write to the president of Singapore now
requesting him to commute the death sentence of
Shanmugam Murugesu to imprisonment.

Please forward this email to anyone you think might
take immediate action.

SEND APPEALS TO:

The President
His Excellency S R Nathan
Office of the President
Istana, Orchard Road
Republic of Singapore 0922
Faxes: + 65 738 4673
Email: s_r_nathan@istana.gov.sg

http://www.istana.gov.sg/president.html

C.C. Copies to:

The Honourable Goh Chok Tong
Senior Minister
Office of the Senior Minister
Istana Annexe
Singapore 238823
Fax:+ 65 – 67324627
Email goh_chok_tong@pmo.gov.sg

The Honourable Lee Hsien Loong
Prime Minister
Office of the Prime Minister
Istana Annexe
Singapore 238823
Fax: + 65 – 63328983
Email lee_hsien_loong@pmo.gov.sg

Wong Kan Seng
Minister of Home Affairs
New Phoenix Park 28,
Irrawaddy Road
Singapore 329560
Fax: + 65 6734 4420
Email Wong_Kan_Seng@mha.gov.sg

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] fwd…cosmic cookie
Date: May 11, 2005 at 8:57:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’s a book I read after Ibogaine. It’s kinda hard to explain, but it is right in line with what you posted. Toltec spirituality is what it is about, but I found parallels between it and a lot of other stuff like, AA, RET therapy and just plain good sense. Find it and read it. I think you would like it.                     Randy

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] namaste
Date: May 11, 2005 at 8:48:36 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

A translation of Namaste

NAMASTE
I honor the place in you where the entire universe resides.
I honor the place in you, where lies your love, your light, your
truth and your beauty.
I honor the place in you, where…if you are in that place in you…
and I am in that place in me…then there is only one of us

~  Leo Buscaglia (Author of “Love,” etc.)

Namaste
Matthew

Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy. /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Just a little Somethin’-somethin’
Date: May 11, 2005 at 8:46:22 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

ay ay fighting creates a character
finally some fucken rain here thank u zues…..lets smurf on out of here and smoke a big J …….yes bath time again…….i just want to curl up and sleep……FUXXK!!!!!!! this is fucken pathetic….what is it with fucken opiates and sleep….i guess u pay for all that nodding all the time…..i found an empty capsule of dilauid a few hours ago…..when i saw it all my energy returned…a quick thought occured “yah yah i must of droped it and lost it in a dazed state pls pls let it be full—-thank god it wasnt///////////////\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\…….
ok 9 o clock and getting dark….12 hours or so till daylight yay!!! hmmmm im thinking maybe there should be a separte list for those in wd ….ah whatever …….
take away the wine for restlesness plauges me
i am assailed by a specter profounder than hatred and greed
or the sum of their hideous crimes
Love Laughter SEx and magick

Namaste
Matthew

Powerful parental controls improve your peace of mind with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] fwd…cosmic cookie
Date: May 11, 2005 at 8:33:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Randy i dont know what u mean brother…..wat are the 4 arguments>?  …..One love

Namaste
Matthew

Powerful parental controls improve your peace of mind with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] fwd…cosmic cookie
Date: May 11, 2005 at 8:32:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jay pls tell the story….id love to read it…..Respect

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: Drug czar’s office says MPP “conning” sick people
Date: May 11, 2005 at 6:43:26 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

MPP Sample HTML Template #3 (National Alert)
The hypocricy is so appalling I almost threw up on my keyboard- but then I remembered all the other lies and con jobs I’ve read outta the prohibitionist-minded maniacs, and felt bet…errr, well, not exactly better, but more like I was in the “normal” world again, or something.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: Rob Kampia
To: Preston T. Peet
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 5:14 PM
Subject: Drug czar’s office says MPP “conning” sick people

Marijuana Policy Project Alert   May 11, 2005

Drug czar’s office says MPP “conning” sick people
Dear Preston T. Peet:
“Tom Riley, a spokesman for the [drug czar’s] office, said advocacy groups such as the Marijuana Policy Project are actually pushing drug legalization and ‘cynically’ exploiting sick people who use pot. ‘There is a con going on here, and I am surprised that smart people continue to fall for it,’ he told us.”
-Washington Post, May 4, 2005
The people whom the drug czar’s office says MPP is “conning” are TV host Montel Williams and U.S. Representatives Sam Farr (D-CA), Barney Frank (D-MA), Maurice Hinchey (D-NY), Ron Paul (R-TX), and Dana Rohrabacher (R-CA), who participated last Wednesday in MPP’s most successful news conference ever.
Reporters and TV cameras mobbed MPP’s Capitol Hill event as Congressmen Farr, Frank, Hinchey, Paul, and Rohrabacher announced their introduction of a bipartisan bill to protect patients from arrest in states with medical marijuana laws.
The news conference was covered by dozens of newspapers and more than 130 TV stations nationwide, including CNN, Fox News Channel, CBS News, and the Associated Press. MPP also was featured in articles by the Washington Post, Washington Times, San Francisco Chronicle, Orange County Register, Philadelphia Inquirer, Roll Call , and more. You can see some of the coverage and watch a video clip of Montel’s emotional plea here.
Would you please support MPP’s hard-hitting, aggressive work by making a donation today?
Also last week, MPP led Montel and dozens of activists from around the country in lobbying members of Congress to protect medical marijuana patients – and we’re already seeing results. For instance, after MPP member Sylvia Etie met with freshman Representative Charlie Melancon (D-LA), she walked out with a pledge from the congressman to vote for legislation that is coming up for a vote on the House floor this summer.
MPP’s work is funded entirely by private donations from people like you. If you support MPP’s campaigns to end the government’s war on marijuana users, would you please make a donation of $10 or more today?
Sincerely,
Rob Kampia
Executive Director
Marijuana Policy Project
Washington, D.C.”It’s flat out wrong to penalize Americans whose doctors legally prescribed marijuana to them for the relief of intense pain. It’s an intrusion on patients’ rights and it’s an intrusion on states’ rights.”
-Congressman Maurice Hinchey

Help fund MPP’s projects
MPP hopes that each of the 121,000 subscribers on our national e-mail list will make at least one financial donation to MPP’s work in 2005. Please click here to donate now.
MPP will be able to tackle all of the projects in its 2005 strategic plan if you and other allies are generous enough to fund our work.
Lobby Congress now!
Ask your U.S. representative to support the bipartisan States’ Rights to Medical Marijuana Act.
Popular Links:
. MPP’s home page
. Prohibition facts
. State-by-state medical marijuana laws
. MPP news releases
. 2005 strategic plan
. Download hand-outs

MPP e-mail list options:
. Subscribe
. About the Marijuana Policy Project

Small Print .
You are receiving this e-mail because you subscribed to MPP’s e-mail alerts. To unsubscribe, click the link at the bottom of this message. Removal may take up to 48 hours. To contact MPP, please  click here or reply to this e-mail. Our mailing address is MPP, P.O. Box 77492, Capitol Hill, Washington, D.C. 20013.

To remove yourself from this mailing, please click here

To remove yourself from all mailings from Marijuana Policy Project, please click here

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Just a little Somethin’-somethin’
Date: May 11, 2005 at 5:22:04 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am currently reading a book I highly recommend to all.  “Life of Pi”
by Yann Martell.
Here’s a little thingie I found while tryimg to smoke a cigarette in
the rain, my book in the mailbox for safe keeping from the water, my
mother in the backround yelling,”When are you going to quit that
filthy habit!! I can still smell the smoke!  I could DIE form you
smoking that cigarette!! Are you sure your in the road and not
standing on my property??!!”.  I dont’ knwo if her mailbox counts as
her’s or federal, but my book was too good to put down, and I WILL NOT
STOP SMOKING WHILE I KICK THESE FUCKING BUPE’S!!! Not that it’s easy
to do, with it tasting like ass, and all, as the mucus builds in the
back of my throat and my sensitive gag reflex makes my stomach jump,
everytime I inhale.  I NEED to have one lousy habit right now.  It’s
legal, I’m WAY over 18, so FUCKING LEAVE ME ALONE ALREADY!!!!!
Any way, here’s a great little excerpt:

I was giving up.  I would have given up-if a voice hadn’t made itself
heard in my heart.  the voice said,   “I will not die.  I refuse it.
I will make it through this nightmare.  I will beat the odds , as
great as they are.  I have survived so far, miraculously.  Now I will
turn miracle into routine.  The amazing will be seen every day.  I
will put in all the hard work necessary. yes, so long as
God(Iboganauts) are with me, I will not die.  Amen.”
My face set to a grim and determined expression. I speak in all
modesty as I say this, but I discovered at that moment that I have a
fierce will to live.  It’s not something evident, in my experience.
Some of us give up on life with only a resigned sigh.  Others fight a
little, then lose hope.  Still others-and I am one of those-never give
up. We fight and fight and fight.  We fight no matter the cost of
battle, the losses we take, the improbabilty of success.  We fight to
the very end.  It’s not a question of courage.  It’s something
constitutional, an inability to let go.  It may be nothing more than
life-hungry stupidity.”

Off to the store for more cigarettes.
I love you all!
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Vascular Disease
Date: May 11, 2005 at 4:28:41 PM EDT
To: Ibogaine List <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Pam,

I read what you wrote and had a quick look on the web to see what it said about vascular disease. Then I lost your mail. Don’t know how that happened. Sorry.

I came across this:

… In the US, every other person will die of vascular heart disease. … More than
seven million Americans are living with vascular heart disease right now …
referring to the link to this site:

http://www.medical-library.net/sites/vitamin_c_and_vascular_disease.html

The article goes on to say:

<snip>
Our Distant Ancestors Lost the Ability to Produce Vitamin C
It long has been known that human beings do not produce ascorbic acid (vitamin C). Because vitamin C — which I shall refer to as “ascorbate” from here on out — is essential to life and because we cannot produce it, it is known as a vitamin in human metabolism. We are rare among species, because almost all mammals can make abundant supplies of ascorbate. There are only four species of mammals which do not make their own ascorbate. These are (1) humans, (2) gorillas, (3) guinea pigs and (4) fruit bats.
<end-snip>

followed by:

<snip>

Ice Ages, Scurvy, and Natural Selection
However, our common ancestors did not stay in Africa. They migrated to cover the entire earth. Then came the Ices Ages, one after another, each lasting around 10,000 years. We know from the archeological evidence that human beings lived through these ice ages in northern climates. They somehow toughed it out. Ascorbate, because it is made by plant food, is not easy to come by in an ice age. The old vegetable garden does not do so well under a thick layer of ice. These ancestors suffered from ascorbate deficiency, a disease called scurvy, a fact borne out by examination of their remains.
<end-snip>
Scurvy is marked by the breakdown of collagen tissue throughout the body and frequent infections. Collagen is the protein with which strong connective tissue is made throughout the body.
<snip>
<end-snip>
The same sort of thing happened to many of our ancestors who lived through the ice ages. Many of them bled to death because they had little or no ascorbate, and without ascorbate there is no collagen production or repair throughout the body. The wall of a blood vessel is made of collagen. Therefore, when you run out of ascorbate, it is only a matter of time until that wall of collagen breaks down, is not repaired, cracks open and you bleed to death.
<snip>
<end-snip>
<snip>
Risk Factors: Lipoprotein(a), LDL, Lipids, and Oxidized Cholesterol
However, not all our Ice Ages ancestors died of cracked open blood vessels. Many did, but some had the ability to repair leaky blood vessel walls without the assistance of ascorbate.
When a crack develops in a blood vessel wall due to a shortage of ascorbate, certain fat packages in the blood have the ability to plug the leak by forming a kind of plaster cast. These packages of fat are known as cholesterol, lipids, low density lipoproteins (LDL), and one especially effective leak plugger, lipoprotein(a), a special type of LDL.
<end-snip>
<snip>
The tumor, i.e., the proliferation of excess smooth muscle cells is not cancerous. Nevertheless, it can cause death by pushing this mass of plaque into the lumen (passage way) of the blood vessel in which this process is happening. This narrows the passage way through which blood passes and can eventually lead to heart attack, stroke and other problems, depending on where in the body it develops.<snip>
<end-snip>
<snip>
Lipoprotein(a) Is The Real Risk Factor for Vascular Disease
The bottom line is that lipoprotein(a) is the real risk factor in cardiovascular disease and that ascorbate and niacin are the only major lines of defense against high levels of lipoprotein(a). Cholesterol, even LDL cholesterol, can serve as a statistical risk factor only to the degree that it is correlated with the level of the real problem: the special type of LDL called lipoprotein(a).
The best test, by far, for risk of cardiovascular disease is the direct measurement of this special type of LDL, namely a lipoprotein(a) level. A lipoprotein(a) level is ten times more accurate and specific for prediction of vascular disease.
<end-snip>
<snip>
The presently accepted levels of lipoprotein(a) are the following.

0

20 mg./dl
low risk
20

40 mg./dl.
moderate risk
>      40 mg./dl.
high risk
<end-snip>
<snip>
1. Lipoprotein(a) levels are largely determined by inheritance.
2. Special diet does not influence lipoprotein(a) levels.
3. None of the available cholesterol lowering drugs lower lipoprotein(a) blood levels.
4. Ascorbate and niacin both lower lipoprotein(a) blood levels.
<un-snip>
<snip>
The Cost in Lives
Nevertheless, there is still a long way to go. In the U.S., every other person will die of vascular heart disease. Many more will die of stroke, another complication of vascular disease. Every year 1.5 million Americans die of heart attack, one fifth of them suddenly, before reaching the hospital or medical attention. Death is the first symptom of heart disease for forty percent of those who learn they have it. More than seven million Americans are living with vascular heart disease right now, and 2.5 million have cerebrovascular disease. Eight million Americans have arrhythmia: irregular heartbeat related to vascular disease.
<un-snip>
<snip>
Program for the Reversal of Heart Disease
If you have vascular disease, and if you want not to have it, there is a plan for you.
1. Get yourself into chelation therapy and stay the course. This is the fastest, most proven method of dealing with this life-threatening condition. The literature proving this is extensive, despite what uninformed doctors may tell you. Then, in consultation with a doctor who practices nutritional medicine, take the following steps: (All the following dosages may be adjusted by your doctor, based on his or her experience and medical opinion.)
2. Vitamin C to bowel tolerance — as much as you can take without diarrhea. For most people this will be in the range of five to ten grams (5,000-10,000 mg.) each day. Spread this amount into two equal doses 12 hours apart. (Vitamin C prevents further cracking of the blood vessel wall — the beginning of the disease.)
3. Co-enzyme Q10 90-180 mg. twice each day (strengthens the heart muscle).
4. L-carnitine 3 grams twice each day (also strengthens the heart muscle).
5. L-lysine 3 grams twice each day (acts to release lipoprotein(a) from plaque formation and prevent further deposition of same).
6. L-proline 3 grams twice each day (acts to release lipoprotein(a) from plaque formation and prevent further deposition of same).
7. Niacin decreases the production of lipoprotein(a) in the liver. Inositol hexaniacinate is a form of niacin which gives less of a problem with flushing and therefore allows for larger therapeutic doses. Begin with 250 mg. at lunch, 500 mg. at dinner and 500 mg. at bedtime the first day; then increase gradually over a few days until you reach four grams per day, or the highest dose under four grams you can tolerate. Be sure to aks your doctor for liver enzyme level tests every two months or less to be sure your liver is able to handle the dose you are taking.
8. Vitamin E (as Unique E) 800-2400 IU per day. (This inhibits the proliferation of smooth muscle cells in the walls of arteries undergoing the atherosclerotic changes.)
9. Stop smoking. (This decreases the free radical load on your body.)
10. Adopt a sensible diet with plenty of veggies and not so much fat. (The metabolism of fat decreases your body vitamin pool dramatically.)
11. Ask your doctor for a comprehensive stool analysis (Great Smokies Lab) to see if you are digesting well all that good food. Your diet does not matter much if it is not getting into your body.
12. Lower stress in your life however you can.
13. Adopt a sensible exercise program in collaboration with your doctor.
<un-snip>
I am wondering if anyone has any experience with this to comment, i.e., is this good science? How significant is this in determining fitness for an ibogaine session as opposed to an EKG test?
Lee

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] fwd…cosmic cookie
Date: May 11, 2005 at 4:25:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt, have you been reading the Four Agreements?              Randy

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] fwd…cosmic cookie
Date: May 11, 2005 at 3:47:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt,

You should ask Jason B. to tell you the story of the sculptor and the lion.

Lee

matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Cosmic Cookie

All Universal Phenomena are the Outer Reflections
of the Inner Processes of Consciousness.
The Inner creates the Outer and dwells within it.
The Inner and Outer are Equal and make up One Whole.
The Manifested Universe is the exact Equivalent
of the Inner Processes of Consciousness.
The Creative Source however does not necessarily
have to manifest itself in a Physical Form.
The Inner Source invents and enjoys its own Plays.
All Plays… Actors… Directors and Producers
are equal Aspects of the same Continuum.

I AM THE SHADOW OF THE LIGHT I AM

Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 3:40:01 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Heyo yayo ticker the sticker
Ups and downs and inbeetweens….RESTLESS INSIDE!!!!!!!
Ereubscent veil descends
psalmed sunset thus portends
and laid to rest
i now im blessed with this darkness—-forever more

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] fwd…cosmic cookie
Date: May 11, 2005 at 3:35:35 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Cosmic Cookie

All Universal Phenomena are the Outer Reflections
of the Inner Processes of Consciousness.
The Inner creates the Outer and dwells within it.
The Inner and Outer are Equal and make up One Whole.
The Manifested Universe is the exact Equivalent
of the Inner Processes of Consciousness.
The Creative Source however does not necessarily
have to manifest itself in a Physical Form.
The Inner Source invents and enjoys its own Plays.
All Plays… Actors… Directors and Producers
are equal Aspects of the same Continuum.

I AM THE SHADOW OF THE LIGHT I AM

Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Throwing-up….. Have you ever wondered…….
Date: May 11, 2005 at 2:34:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kyle, I don’t know about everyone else, but I know when I did Ibogaine I threw up till I had the dry heaves. It wasn’t for long, I just threw up what was in my stomach and heaved for a few minutes. I think I threw up after every dose probably about 2 hours after I took them. It sure didn’t stop me from being on the Holideck for quite a while. Whoa, did you see those snakes writing words? Purple ones with black designs. YEEEEEEEEEEE freakin’ HAAAAAAAAAAA But I digress. Maybe some people excrete a lot of saliva and that is what they are throwing up. I’d say that your body could make copious amounts of it, given the nausea that Ibogaine can cause.      Randy

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] yes yes yes
Date: May 11, 2005 at 2:23:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Onward, inward, forward, whatever…
love you all

I’m going to just go ahead
do the drop.
Fuck it.
luv
tink

On 5/11/05, tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
My drop in dose has left me weary, but it seems to
be at an end phase,
which means, folks, here we go again…yurp and
ugh and
ohmifuckinggawdwhy.
Thanks for your kttiy advice Pam- you are a
goddess!
Matt-how are you feeling about now?  Glad you got
some smokeables.
Wish I had some.  You’re great, you’re wonderful,
you’re home with us
nutty iboganuats!!
My mom has some sort of project lined up involving
50 lb bags of
manure and boxes, which I’m looking forward to
about as much as a trip
to the dentist.  Still, I’d rather load boxes than
drop my dose today.
It’s been, what, 5 days?  Ugh.  And AH-WAAAAAAY
WEEEE GOOOOO!!!!!!!!
Onward, inward, forward, whatever…
love you all
tink
On 5/11/05, matthew zielinski
<mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Pam…. Patrick would propably gone on with the
session no matter what his
heart condition——it will get easier…….i
know whats its like to loose
a loved one so i can definetly relate to ur
pain……Love back

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search:
Fast. Clear. Easy.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Kyle Portman” <fforest12@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Throwing-up….. Have you ever wondered…….
Date: May 11, 2005 at 2:17:42 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

For those of you here who have had the Ibogaine and experience and have also experienced heavy vomiting during the experience…..Have you ever wondered what this was about?……(Yes I know some people do not throw-up on Ibogaine,but the majority of people do throw up at some point on a heavy dose……..

During a normal vomit,like when you have drank to much or your really sick you throw-up every thing in your stomach and then when there is nothing else to throw-up you get dry heaves,which just as the name implies you your body keeps trying to throw-up even when nothing is left to throw up…

But with Ibogaine I have  seen people vomit deeply seemingly  for hours with not the slightest hint of dry heaves in sight…These people had also fasted for 2 day before the Ibogaine session and only drank a little water…..Can some  one explain how this seemingly impossible situation occurs ?….

I have a theory that on Ibogaine you are not throwing up from your stomach so much but you are throwing-up energy from the Astral realm…..As you transform negative astral energy it condenses into a kind of puke that you vomit out….This is the only explanation I can think of for the incredible amount of vomiting that can happen on Ibogaine….Any other theories on this ?………Thanks Kyle

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 1:28:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Pam…. Patrick would propably gone on with the session no matter what his heart condition——it will get easier…….i know whats its like to loose a loved one so i can definetly relate to ur pain……Love back

Namaste
Matthew

Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy. /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 2:12:34 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Pam and all..
Whooopsie, it wasn’t you who gave the kitty advice, but I have gotten
much from what you have written.  Again, thank you all for being here.
There may be an onslaught of babble in the near future, as I head into
the lava and ice again.  I’m going to just go ahead do the drop.
Fuck it.
luv
tink

On 5/11/05, tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
My drop in dose has left me weary, but it seems to be at an end phase,
which means, folks, here we go again…yurp and ugh and
ohmifuckinggawdwhy.
Thanks for your kttiy advice Pam- you are a goddess!
Matt-how are you feeling about now?  Glad you got some smokeables.
Wish I had some.  You’re great, you’re wonderful, you’re home with us
nutty iboganuats!!
My mom has some sort of project lined up involving 50 lb bags of
manure and boxes, which I’m looking forward to about as much as a trip
to the dentist.  Still, I’d rather load boxes than drop my dose today.
It’s been, what, 5 days?  Ugh.  And AH-WAAAAAAY WEEEE GOOOOO!!!!!!!!
Onward, inward, forward, whatever…
love you all
tink
On 5/11/05, matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Pam…. Patrick would propably gone on with the session no matter what his
heart condition——it will get easier…….i know whats its like to loose
a loved one so i can definetly relate to ur pain……Love back

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy.
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 2:04:38 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My drop in dose has left me weary, but it seems to be at an end phase,
which means, folks, here we go again…yurp and ugh and
ohmifuckinggawdwhy.
Thanks for your kttiy advice Pam- you are a goddess!
Matt-how are you feeling about now?  Glad you got some smokeables.
Wish I had some.  You’re great, you’re wonderful, you’re home with us
nutty iboganuats!!
My mom has some sort of project lined up involving 50 lb bags of
manure and boxes, which I’m looking forward to about as much as a trip
to the dentist.  Still, I’d rather load boxes than drop my dose today.
It’s been, what, 5 days?  Ugh.  And AH-WAAAAAAY WEEEE GOOOOO!!!!!!!!
Onward, inward, forward, whatever…
love you all
tink
On 5/11/05, matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Pam…. Patrick would propably gone on with the session no matter what his
heart condition——it will get easier…….i know whats its like to loose
a loved one so i can definetly relate to ur pain……Love back

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy.
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 1:28:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Pam…. Patrick would propably gone on with the session no matter what his heart condition——it will get easier…….i know whats its like to loose a loved one so i can definetly relate to ur pain……Love back

Namaste
Matthew

Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy. /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Kiersten Leigh Johnson <kiers10@mac.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] what to do, what to do…
Date: May 11, 2005 at 11:38:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

tink,
get a harnass not a leash it will choke her,  and take her walking with you. cats are very telepathic, so show her the picture that it is dangerous and that she must come back within the hour, or before sundown, etc. tell her in no uncertain terms not to go beyond the yard, etc.

say it out loud, but also think it in a picture, full of emotion, so that she gets it.

let her out, but stay with her in the yard and if she tries to run off, grab her and tell her to stay close. then show her the coyote in your head, chomping on her. she’ll get it.

and tell the dog to stop chasing the cat. NO! and give it a spank on the butt. it will chase the cat if it thinks the humans say its ok. the dog will protect the cat if the humans tell it to. dogs are like that. it’s not “natural” it is learned behavior and dogs are totally into pack mentality. the owner of the dog has to discipline the dog in this direction, too.

good luck,

kiersten
On Tuesday, May 10, 2005, at 12:33PM, tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:

So i live in the woods now, which freaks me out more than i thought
possible.  Stick me in Little Haiti in my underwear at 3am with no
money and a gun, and I can function.  Take me on a walk in the woods,
and I’m about to get eaten by the bear that I’ve seen that lives
behind the house.  Go figure…
Anyhoo.. about my cat. I got her in Miami, and she saved my life.  I
brought her all the way North with me, and she’s like my baby.  I got
her her shots and got her fixed, and technically, she could be an
outdoor cat.  I just KNOW that she’s going to get hit, eaten, lost,
stuck somewhere, attacked by any number of asshole dogs in the
neighborhood, that bear will find her snackly-licious, i don’t know,
but something will happen.  So, i let her out by accident, and now she
cries at the door, and looks at me like,”what the fuck is your
problem??! LET ME OUT!!!!!”.  My mom’s dog, half chihuahua, half
terrier, thinks it’s mighty fun to chase her, and I’ve seen her kill
small animals.  She does NOT like my cat (neither does my stepdad),
and when I was out with her, just seeing wht it would be like, the dog
is like,”KILLKILLKILL!!!”, and ny mom says, “Oh, Honey, it’s the most
natural thing in the world, a dog chasing a cat..” Yeah, but not when
it’s my cat.  Anyway, after that weirdo dream i had about her running
away and leaving me forever at the oytser bar for jackie o, all i can
see is her feeling like she’s in jail.  I can’t take that either.  How
many times have I said to myself that I would NEVER EVER EVER KEEP
ANYONE OR THING LOCKED UP(against their will), and here I am,
selfishly keeping my precious little Killer in jail.
I suppose I have to do it, don’t I?
I have to let her go, and see if she’ll come back, and it’s tearing me
up because she really did save my life in Miami.  I had a
responsibility, and it gave me a way to start back on the road home,
and here I am, so I have to be fair about it, and I’m losing my shit.
I can’t lose anyone else I love right now.  I’m not that strong.  My
step dad is like,”it’s just a cat…” so i said, “yeah,and my mom is
just your wife, and I’m just your daughter.”
sorry ’bout this.  Emotions run high when I first get up and i feel so
heavenly…i hate suboxone.
There’s no compromise.  It sux.  It’s not like I could put her in a
cage or run outside, ‘cuz it’s the same thing.  jail.
I need a shower and some coffee.
luv to you all, and thanks for listening.
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Pam Paperno” <pam@lviue.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 11:24:32 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I am with you in spirit–I don’t sleep either, nor can I eat.  I get shakes and chills and everything else.  Funny, I guess the emotional upheaval is the same whether you are withdrawing from a substance or the presence of a person.
By the way, Patrick’s official cause of death is Vascular Heart Disease.  Not something that would show up on a standard EKG, but had we had a stress test done we would have seen it.  Now I wish I had insisted on that–but, hindsight is always 20/20 isn’t it?
Love to you, Matt.  You must remember that YOU are worth all that you are suffering now.  You deserve much better than dope will ever give you.
Pam
—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 2:58 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day

well well another bleak sleepless night….at least i had some herb yest…..hmmmm…..i cant stand the beutiful sound of birds warbling in the morning whenim sick…..as the light starts to creep into the horizon the birds start to go crazy…lucky fuckers all rested and all ready for a new day…..im trully jelous…..its after 5 now i think……brrrrr cold, vry cold but with hot flashes….wtf is going on with my stomach iim wondering….i guess hes hungry but sorry buddy u have to stick this shit out for a bit longer…..ill have a big feast when im well….but thinking of food now isnot a good idea…..god dam it plus 15 c already…fucken weather chanel keeps changing their prognosis–rain/sun/cloudy—12/18/25 fuckers make up urmind…..time for another bath i guess….this is fuckne ridicoulous…..
i am corinthian light a snake in flowers atnight THE LAST TEMPATIOON OF CHRIST….ahh music i coudnt do it without music…..ah got to be strong….shit sneezing fit againi……grind me teeth and tough it out….the worst thing is i dont know what the fuck imdoing……what is it that im trying to acomplish with all this pain and suffering and constant dismay……ahh wed today thats right…..oh just got my watch 6 now ……fuck u 6 o clock…alright enough of this bullshit…..i wonder if anyone even reads this…..btw jason the four hours u offered are on tap now so in the near future if u cant sleep for some reason remember urs trully finally is :}  dont worry bro i wont use them all at the same time …..whatever happend to the smurfs……damm……..papa smurf wasa comunist and ruled with an iron fist but was still very likeable wasnthe>? i think so……
opa…..love and kissess everyone……
Namaste
Matthew

Open your e-mail without having to worry about viruses with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tilidin, tramadol
Date: May 11, 2005 at 10:06:04 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you probably mean brain, the MD. he is certainly a great guy. peter here was treated by him.
i doubt he´ll come over to have a cup of coffee with me though 🙂

Am 11.05.2005 um 15:42 schrieb BiscuitBoy714@aol.com:

Ekki, I do believe there is a guy in Prague, maybe he will meet up with you in Poland.    Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tilidin, tramadol
Date: May 11, 2005 at 9:42:44 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ekki, I do believe there is a guy in Prague, maybe he will meet up with you in Poland.    Randy

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 9:10:11 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks to the power of ativan,restoril,flexoril,and diclfenac, I
actually just woke up.  Un believable!!  Wish i hadn’t.  Mother Nature
is still having it out with my sinuses, and i’ve got a live wire up my
ass.  matt, I’m with ya in more ways than  one!!!  Almost done with
this shit.  Almost.  Then I get to drop AGAIN!!!  I think I’ll wait
one more day.  maybe two.  (shuddershudder) craving coffee but it’ll
send me to the moon.  WTF!!
Good day to be alive!
tink

On 5/11/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Matt, your doing good dude. Jokey smurf is my favorite. Ha he Ha he Ha he I
hope things kinda cool out for you today. Smoke weed, it helps. Always did
me anyway. I just watched the sun come up in the Catskills myself. I never
did sleep “normal” anyway. I sleep when I need to now. Sitting here writing
to you I got a cold chill like I was kickin’ too. We feel for you bro. It
will get better soon, I think you are over the worse part. I hope so anyway.
This list saved my ass time and again when I was in your position. Stay with
us.    Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tilidin, tramadol
Date: May 11, 2005 at 8:33:01 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

certainly a great terrain to iboganize a few people. like fishing a few new followers. i´ll be in/near warszawa in summer. are there any ibonauts living in poland on this list?

Am 11.05.2005 um 14:16 schrieb matthew zielinski:

Glad u like Poland its a great country:}…….in poland there are tons i mean tons of opiate addicts because there are poppy fields practicly eveywhere as u know and what they do is cook it up  and bang it..reletivly easy process..in poland its called “kompot”

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with  MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE*  /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]  \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tilidin, tramadol
Date: May 11, 2005 at 8:16:22 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Glad u like Poland its a great country:}…….in poland there are tons i mean tons of opiate addicts because there are poppy fields practicly eveywhere as u know and what they do is cook it up  and bang it..reletivly easy process..in poland its called “kompot”

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] tilidin, tramadol
Date: May 11, 2005 at 7:28:42 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

tramadol is some kind of synthetic codein, i think. i drank a few bottles, too, against heroin withdrawal. you can get it easily prescribed if you say you have some bad pain. chronic pain patients get it for years in large doses and then it really becomes a problem. people on high doses sometimes get epilepsy or grand mal fits.
like methadone in germany it is mixed with sugar or saccarine and flavor which makes it not suitable for shooting, except you manage to somehow extract it. but then, who wants to shoot that shit?

tallking of poland i really love it and have been there about 20 times. actually i know a guy there who grew opium himself in the late seventies and early eighties and made heroin out of it in a lab. he is more than 20 years clean but you still see his track marks. he is an authorised teacher of zen-meditation and koans now and very shining. so there is hope 😉

cheers ekki

Am 11.05.2005 um 12:55 schrieb matthew zielinski:

HI

When i was living in Poland i was taking tramadol and out there its considered tobe a powerful drug…experienced no wd and my cousin was using it for a long time without major problems….speaking of trmadol hmmmmm….i read somewhere on the net u can shoot them…intersting

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSN® Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE*  /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]  \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] tilidin, tramadol
Date: May 11, 2005 at 6:55:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI
When i was living in Poland i was taking tramadol and out there its considered tobe a powerful drug…experienced no wd and my cousin was using it for a long time without major problems….speaking of trmadol hmmmmm….i read somewhere on the net u can shoot them…intersting

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: ekki <ekkijdfg@gmx.de>
Subject: [Ibogaine] tilidin, tramadol
Date: May 11, 2005 at 6:41:31 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

has anyone experience with withdrawal from any of those 2 substances? and with ibo treatment? tilidin is usually taken with added naloxon as valoron which makes it maybe less addictive than tramadol. but i really don´t much about this stuff.

there are a lot of pain-patients (and some medical staff) who get hooked on one of those two in germany and some say that withdrawal after a few years needs like 4 weeks in a hospital.

thanks
ekki

hey matt, i feel for you,too

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 6:16:57 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt, your doing good dude. Jokey smurf is my favorite. Ha he Ha he Ha he I hope things kinda cool out for you today. Smoke weed, it helps. Always did me anyway. I just watched the sun come up in the Catskills myself. I never did sleep “normal” anyway. I sleep when I need to now. Sitting here writing to you I got a cold chill like I was kickin’ too. We feel for you bro. It will get better soon, I think you are over the worse part. I hope so anyway. This list saved my ass time and again when I was in your position. Stay with us.    Randy

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] whoarah for another day
Date: May 11, 2005 at 5:58:14 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

well well another bleak sleepless night….at least i had some herb yest…..hmmmm…..i cant stand the beutiful sound of birds warbling in the morning whenim sick…..as the light starts to creep into the horizon the birds start to go crazy…lucky fuckers all rested and all ready for a new day…..im trully jelous…..its after 5 now i think……brrrrr cold, vry cold but with hot flashes….wtf is going on with my stomach iim wondering….i guess hes hungry but sorry buddy u have to stick this shit out for a bit longer…..ill have a big feast when im well….but thinking of food now isnot a good idea…..god dam it plus 15 c already…fucken weather chanel keeps changing their prognosis–rain/sun/cloudy—12/18/25 fuckers make up urmind…..time for another bath i guess….this is fuckne ridicoulous…..
i am corinthian light a snake in flowers atnight THE LAST TEMPATIOON OF CHRIST….ahh music i coudnt do it without music…..ah got to be strong….shit sneezing fit againi……grind me teeth and tough it out….the worst thing is i dont know what the fuck imdoing……what is it that im trying to acomplish with all this pain and suffering and constant dismay……ahh wed today thats right…..oh just got my watch 6 now ……fuck u 6 o clock…alright enough of this bullshit…..i wonder if anyone even reads this…..btw jason the four hours u offered are on tap now so in the near future if u cant sleep for some reason remember urs trully finally is :}  dont worry bro i wont use them all at the same time …..whatever happend to the smurfs……damm……..papa smurf wasa comunist and ruled with an iron fist but was still very likeable wasnthe>? i think so……
opa…..love and kissess everyone……
Namaste
Matthew

Open your e-mail without having to worry about viruses with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Your name is Matthew and you are great–hi matt
Date: May 10, 2005 at 7:28:03 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Matthew,

I hope you aren’t wearing gumboots while loving those sheep.  ;).

You are welcome to 4 hours of my sleep. I will send them with
my email.

love,
Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 7:22 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] my name is matt and im a drug addict–hi matt

:}}….love u all for real no joke:}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
everything will be alright
evrything willturn out fine
at night i still cant sleep
but the voices pass with time
and i get no time to worry
no time for breaking down
NO TIME TO CRY in this motherfucken life………but at least i   have a bathtub my new sanctuary.  love the bathtub…the best thing about this is 70 someethin g hours in wd the worst thing about this is only 70  hours in wd…..those sneezing fits rock ur body so hard….fuck me…..ah whatever its 5 now new day same shiht waiting for death to pass by–yeay!!i just want to curl up and sleep at least an hour pls anybody can u spare an hour ofur sleep for a poor fool who is doomed to fuck up over andover again…..this shuderng pain….complete restlesness…weak body weak mind weak spirit…la la la la la lalalala i LOVE THEH SMURFS especialy smurfete poor lonely soul doesnt hve another female to talk to——i feel for u smurfete—–lets hope in the future the writers will be more sympathtic—-the whole city sleeps….the sleep of sleep…im going back to counting sheep i guess..last count 1 500 435 no no my mistake 1 500 436…..good day all….love u lots—i love sheep….when i get well im going to eat one i think…yah or a goose but goose arre fatty i dont want to be fat now do i with my all 68 kg now…hm ribs are begeining to show again on this emeciated body…..and for a while there i was looking prety good …..well signing off……yay 5 25 and its getting light outside whorah for a new luazy day

Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: The farmer and the horse.
Date: May 10, 2005 at 7:01:11 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey guys,

Just a little story many of you may have heard.

with love, Jasen

There was a farmer who owned only one horse. He depended on the horse
for everything; to pull the plow, to draw the wagon. One day a bee
stung the horse, and in fright the horse ran away into the mountains.
The farmer searched for him but couldn’t find him. His neighbors
said, “We are really sorry about your bad luck in losing your horse.”
But the old farmer shrugged and said, “Bad luck, good luck — who is
to say?”

A week later his horse came back, accompanied by twelve wild horses,
which he had obviously encountered, and the old farmer was able to
corral all these fine animals. News spread throughout the village,
and his neighbors came and said, “Congratulations on this bonanza out
of the sky.” To which the old man once again shrugged and said, “Good
luck, bad luck — who is to say?”

The only son of the farmer decided to make the most of this good
fortune, so he started to break the wild horses so they could be sold
and put to work in the fields. But as he attempted to do this, he got
thrown from one of the horses, and his leg was broken in three
places. When word of this accident spread through the village, again
the neighbors came saying, “We are sorry about the bad luck of your
son getting hurt.” The old man shrugged and said, “Bad luck, good
luck — who is to say?”

Two weeks later a war broke out among the provinces in China. The
army came through conscripting every able-bodied male under fifty.
Because the son was injured, he did not have to go, and it turned out
to save his life, for everyone in the village who was drafted was
killed in the battle.

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 2:54 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Matt, why suffer? Ibogaine is being touted for taking away withdrawals more than anything, I’d do it now if it were me. I read a Tai proverb here one time that said “things could be worse, your still breathing.” I’ve been through the self loathing thing you are doing so many times that I can instantly feel bad for you. We all aint the same but we are just alike. Obviously there is something about being addicted that you don’t like, or you wouldn’t be telling us this. How long did you shoot for this time? I mean, maybe it won’t be that bad. I’m with ya dude.                      Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 10, 2005 at 6:43:49 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

it may sound stupid ignorant whatever<

It doesn’t sound at all stupid or ignorant, but I myself cannot understand why NOT make things easier? If we know we keep fucking up no matter what we do, no matter what methods we’ve tried in the past, why for crying out loud would we not want to finally have something that for some of us can help, even if it means repeated doses over however long a span of time? If what I’ve read and heard and been told about ibogaine is true then it takes more than one, two or five or ten treatments or doses for some folk- and some folk might not ever stop no matter how many times they take ibogaine- but so what? If it can reduce the withdrawals from taking too many opiates and needing to stop quickly, then by golly I’m all for it! Sign me the heck up right away and let me to the front of the line.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 5:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

i personaly feel that it would be too easy to take ibo everytime u fuck up becuase u would fuck up more often knowing there is that thing that can ease the wd etc …..i know i would  im positve….and the easy road is often the longest and hardest…thats just me i k now i cant do it again for that reason …it may sound stupid ignorant whatever……Love to all

Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 10, 2005 at 6:33:06 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt, I didn’t know that you had heart problems. From a research point of view I have to say that it would be very dangerous for you to do Ibogaine by yourself. That’s just from my own research, and the consensus of just about everybody I know that is experienced with Ibogaine treatment. Give yourself a break man. We’re addicts. We relapse. Hell dude, I’m 47 years old and I only have quit for 8 months now. The thing is that I had to do what I did to get where I am. NA stuff or whatever, but I could beat myself up for not doing this sooner if I wanted to. God knows I lost everything before I saw a reason to want to stop. Hang with us dude, it’s day 3, it’ll be over soon. Send me a line if you want to talk.         Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 10, 2005 at 6:04:38 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

just as I do with any and all substances, still.<

no
no
no
no
no, that’s not what I meant at all- I meant, just like I WOULD DO were I still DOING SO these days, which I’m not, not beyond the legal stuff, got it which ever feds might be reading today?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 10, 2005 4:55 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Yeah, kinda surprised that you would feel like you should take ibogaine because you messed up. I too think that is precisely why we Westerners have been introduced to this substance- and I think anyone telling anyone else they shouldn’t do it more than – times is crazy.
Personally? I feel it should be available to anyone and everyone who feels the need for it- and that it be stressed that those people ARE RESPONSIBLE for whatever happens, and should therefore be extremely careful, just as they should be with any and all hard drugs they may take (though calling ibogaine a hard drug doesn’t quite feel right to me, although, really, in the end analysis, that’s what it is). I would like to be able to stock up on some and put it in my freezer for those times when I either want to expand my mind or decrease the amount of opiates I’m taking or for whatever the reason, just as I do with any and all substances, still.
But please keep in mind this is just me and my own opinion which might not be worth a damn to some of you. Who knows?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Chretien Schiffer” <junkyshaman@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 5:16 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] back in wd

“……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……”

i think iboga, in part, is here exactly to help us with our stupidity. and, perhaps you even thinking that is in itself showing great respect for iboga.

mucho amor bro

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 10, 2005 at 5:15:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i personaly feel that it would be too easy to take ibo everytime u fuck up becuase u would fuck up more often knowing there is that thing that can ease the wd etc …..i know i would  im positve….and the easy road is often the longest and hardest…thats just me i k now i cant do it again for that reason …it may sound stupid ignorant whatever……Love to all
Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 10, 2005 at 4:55:09 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeah, kinda surprised that you would feel like you should take ibogaine because you messed up. I too think that is precisely why we Westerners have been introduced to this substance- and I think anyone telling anyone else they shouldn’t do it more than – times is crazy.
Personally? I feel it should be available to anyone and everyone who feels the need for it- and that it be stressed that those people ARE RESPONSIBLE for whatever happens, and should therefore be extremely careful, just as they should be with any and all hard drugs they may take (though calling ibogaine a hard drug doesn’t quite feel right to me, although, really, in the end analysis, that’s what it is). I would like to be able to stock up on some and put it in my freezer for those times when I either want to expand my mind or decrease the amount of opiates I’m taking or for whatever the reason, just as I do with any and all substances, still.
But please keep in mind this is just me and my own opinion which might not be worth a damn to some of you. Who knows?

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Chretien Schiffer” <junkyshaman@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 5:16 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] back in wd

“……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……”

i think iboga, in part, is here exactly to help us with our stupidity. and, perhaps you even thinking that is in itself showing great respect for iboga.

mucho amor bro

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 10, 2005 at 4:48:29 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Have to say I agree with you here Nick, more so than just about anything I’ve ever read from you. In this instance, I am one hundred percent completely with you on your assessment here.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 4:59 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] back in wd

When things are going good, I think this is usually the toughest time. To
really take on being successful, being good at something, this is much
tougher than a lot of people think. Just when things are really going well
for me, when it’s all coming together, I hear this little voice coming in my
ear, urging me to do something to fuck it all up, just so it can relax in
the knowledge that I’m still a bit fucked up and I don’t really have to take
life on totally. Being successful is quite a deal, usually you have to
really work at that for a while til you can allow it.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: 09 May 2005 15:26
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Matthew,
I feel for you brother, I honestly do. It’s amazing how fast it can
happen, right? One minutes we’re fine and loving life, the next
we’re trying
to kill any happiness we’ve attained.
I think some of us are doomed to never be completely happy,
ever- it’s
not possible. I always think some of us will enternally fuck
ourselves over
until we’re old and alone or dead of overdose, or some other horrific
disastor that we can then point to and say, “see, I told me life sucked,
didn’t I.”

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 8:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered
yesterday as
i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four
months ago
coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get
addicted
again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken
pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the
bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im
emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont
feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much
respect for it
to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper
session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars,
lying naked
on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken
right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium:
Join now and
get the first two months FREE*
/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[
/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 10, 2005 at 4:22:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i love you, preston…
tink

On 5/9/05, Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Matthew,
I feel for you brother, I honestly do. It’s amazing how fast it can
happen, right? One minutes we’re fine and loving life, the next we’re trying
to kill any happiness we’ve attained.
I think some of us are doomed to never be completely happy, ever- it’s
not possible. I always think some of us will enternally fuck ourselves over
until we’re old and alone or dead of overdose, or some other horrific
disastor that we can then point to and say, “see, I told me life sucked,
didn’t I.”

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 8:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as
i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago
coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted
again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken
pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the
bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im
emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont
feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it
to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper
session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked
on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken
right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and
get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “orangesun Barrel” <kaliorangemist710@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Here’s a cool alternative browser to check out eboga-cybermates
Date: May 9, 2005 at 11:44:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://www.spreadfirefox.com/?q=user/register&r=91658
or maybe try google mozzilla firefox

its a real neat browser alot more simplistic than Explorer without the bugs too…

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: Mon, 9 May 2005 10:26:14 -0400

Matthew,
I feel for you brother, I honestly do. It’s amazing how fast it can happen, right? One minutes we’re fine and loving life, the next we’re trying to kill any happiness we’ve attained.
I think some of us are doomed to never be completely happy, ever- it’s not possible. I always think some of us will enternally fuck ourselves over until we’re old and alone or dead of overdose, or some other horrific disastor that we can then point to and say, “see, I told me life sucked, didn’t I.”

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 8:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] expandINg dots
Date: May 9, 2005 at 11:16:44 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, MorningWood@googlegroups.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

As of this moment the ‘wonderful electric grandmother’
moved in to the lives of children.
..She was all life
and all life is wondrous, quick, electrical like a
grandma.
I sing the body electric.
“Get away.  Old Junk.  Old Junk.,
‘this machine for example can
’
it’s ‘my’ voice, I heard ‘my’ voice’”
Manufacturer of cornered music instruments.
Rerun Twilight Zone Ray Brad Walt Wit Grits.

“you got to love the taste of sand to understand”

Blender

Create Temple Home Everywhere
Sacred Water

source
seems always misinterpreted
when assume path is path?
Any action beyond in-site?
If it is in benefit to forgive them
then perhaps this last year actions
have validated the realistic option of forgiving I as
well?
if not,  is it not in I&I benefit for I to forgive I?
then can ,in return, better forgive others?
which helps establish, at first cautious, mutual trust
when trying to build alliances?

Mythology of Anatomy and Physiology

“And the biggest problem is the way the problems
happen,
and consequently the ways to prevent them are
not fully understood.”
“I’d like to think of engineering
as an attempt at avoidance of failure.”
I can’t recall my ‘birth Number’

“It’s the heart I have to enter.
The child’s heart.
This is a deep place.
Difficult to reach.
But that soon will come.”

“You Make believe!! As if it were a game.  As if she
were real
”
, you’ll be surprised at what a machine can do
besides
”
‘ab (sun)ra (ca)ca (da)da (burning)bra

“Fable? or the truth?
But who’s to say at some distant moment
their might be an assembly line producing
a gentle product in the form of a grandmother
who’s stock and trade is Love.
Fable? Sure.  But who’s to say.”

“Because of  heroic delay of Isolating itself from the
grid,
it’s  generator suffered massive damage

and consequently 35 years later
wrong.”
“Put your (stars and?) stripes on!!!, time for
work!!!.”

“ ‘I know what we’ve been through.’
‘yes
. what WE’ve been through.’

Feel attached to community?
Feel community will harm ?

Depends how you define community?
Eviroment/set&setting/ritual/random/noise/visual/nothingnessN2somthingnesseed4oneAnother.
Giving without expectations?
a candle a day keeps the methadone Dr.’s away,
pro’s and con’s of accepting someone’s help.
Cornered self
on create own cross to bear
(bear vs. bull)
publishing software,
I corner self too often.
“I don’t understand you” says They Might be Giants
Insect blood Worthwhile?
Worthy of forgiveness?

Lets take a look at the report from last night.
Let’s take a look at the last year,
is ‘in-sight’ helping or causing me to talk in
gibberish
or both
or assumptions that it is multiple choice during essay
question.
Tired makes Red Liquid makes Tires meet the ground,
ground meet the tired of assuming that others will
Miss the point.

So “fan yourself” if too hot on the set and setting?

“I believe Dr. Rice will say ‘me no speak a english’”

Suggestions from Dr. Pookie.

May I speak to your manager path to 16784601056  fear
generator?
For what ‘ground gained’?

Here, hold the camera while they Rodney King.
I think their may be glass barrier/mute button between
Lab Coats and treated rat.

Puppet string glass house without telephone?

Engineers of can openers.

“A new high tech error prone system that runs the
same reliable Microsoft software that never crashes at
your home or Job.”

Take with grain of salt vs. “You see, it’s just like
the guy who sells it says.”

Investor?
Why do I Question Others motives so often?

dedicated to number sequence 6784601056
anticipate too?
Forget the name of the prison guard who desires to
roll for entertainmen

“Are you sure you want the full disclosure of human
ugliness?  So be it fool.  Guards you will press your
triggers if the prisoner pleas anything but guilty.”

Too much trustee definition memorization
Missed opportunities an opportunity?
Does it matter what loose ends to tie first?
“Poor excuse. Money please I get loose off of orange
juice”
“You can’t give understanding back
let go of the brainwashing
sprint at first sign of pattern?
Make quilt.
It wasn’t raining when Noah built the arc
“I work for mine, you, you’re freeloading like Kate O
KLin”

Click, Click, Click, Click, sound of fax machine
connection.
Sound of toilet flushing.
Wash hands with good soap,
efforts of so many to engineer underground water tap
system.
“I like your tie died shirts, where are you from
.was
it fun? (while rewind information sniper)

Grind Grid
Set Degree Diagonal Flexing Circular,
if you work  “it”
Is guilt working against I
& I and/or for I & I?
No animal eats everything.
Papaw.
One and all got to face reality

Lotus Birds eat bugs,
2 crane necks to make an 8
“I don’t know how he survived
.but he did.”
“I have twisted my ankle for God’s sake!!”
revolver “solution” seen and graduated from?

Control battery/microwave burn software
Can’t hold understanding back.

I don’t have a fish but I can learn to fish.

“For ensemble:

IT (IT is the title)

Think NOTHING
Wait until it is absolutely still within you
When you have attained this begin to play

As soon as you start to think, stop
And try to re-attain
The state of NON-THINKING
Then continue playing
-and so on
When we first played this text with our group, at a
music festival in Brussels, we purposely had not
played it before, and against all expectations, it
worked.” Page 120 (go back to keep reading)

“The Voice of the people are a voice inside of them,
and if you listen good you will know the right way.
Because there is a voice inside talking to everyone.
Seen?  Seen.”
So

Step 4 (rinse then repeat), moral inventory, whatever
that means.  Build some time.
Press Play on the box.

The insignificance started, numbers say, on 02101978.
Born Half Cajun, but with Jaundice, spinal tap, full
blood transfusion with blood from blood giving people.
So one narcissistic interpretation could perhaps be
the peoples blood runs now through I veins. Stand for
something but do not speak for people.  Fair to mother
who labored for an unhealthy baby?  She was only 17
when she wed because she thought it best for to be
less strain on family.  She was 20 when labored me,
children having children.
Too many mouths to feed to make more hunger (promotes
moral flexibility. soft machine),

Dr. Robert Temple, director of the F.D.A.’s office of
medical policy,
Said:

Do you realize how ridiculous your posts are?
There are many ways to learn in life.
write up how your the next jim morrison, to
shooting it all up and being a junkie living
on the street? transferring other irritations onto Get
a fucking life. unless
it is full of something positive. Discussion?
I guess there is in the background 😉 its too bad
your not that good at being
a person (wants a little
attention?) LOL, sounds familiar.
LOL, sounds familiar.
why do you keep reading and writing to a
drug oriented list with rock star charisma? Sorry, but
I don’t follow your logic.

I have never ever
read
anything at all BUT negative suicidal bullshit adds
nothing but irritation to my day(night/morning).  if
you freak every time, you’ll never make it.
even if it’s done in a very psycho and
confrontational way.
criticism and negativity exist.  I choose how I react
to it.

especially since Patrick is a friend of mine.  I think
people
have
mentioned that 100000000 times. into an alpha state.
Rest should follow.
I kinda like balance, You at least can be irritating
AND amusing AND seriously deep too-

Why are you so hostile?
Sorry about peeving you

The dark can only be dispelled by the light. Otherwise
it overtakes it.

Lets make this list a good place to be and not allow
negative forces drag it down.

Let the sun shine in!

especially once I realize it gets to the point that
you almost feel like you know and care about people Or
is that too damn positive?

you can
start
fresh.

*applause*

Dr. Fuzzy Lungs predictably Cuts static fear in
endless kicking cure sequence.

Until

Plucking Harmonics with Gold Teeth Coffin Drive By
Safe Lawyer for Electric Playground Microphone Forever
Reacting
Sonogram

Persistent Antithesis of Everything Perishable

Form in conjunction with connected perennial
consecutive continued endless

everlasting (p t nt) (h r  – n)  extended interminable
looped perpetual prolonged regular repeated aeon
stable unbroken
blue moon

An illustrated guide to dog’s age:

perpetuity abysmal

infinite abiding
amaranthine perdurable perpetual

Ample blanket

ecumenical global generic inclusive indiscriminate
infinite miscellaneous limitless overall panoramic in
the sweeping total of ubiquitous unconfined multi
universal with eight continuous worldwide unlimited
amaranthine enduring eternal illimitable immeasurable
(d   -s t l-môr f n )  incessant indeterminate
infinite interminable multitudinous self-perpetuating
(sp  r l)  ganglion
untold without end

CR Alder Wright (1844-1894)
C20H25N30

C17H17NO(C2H3O2)2 + C17H21NO4  (bl ng k t)
C23H31NO2
C21H27NO
C20H26N2O

Word Roots, Prefixes, Suffixes, and Combining forms:

a-, an- absence or lack   acardia, lack of a heart,
anaerobic, in the absence of oxygen

ab-  departing from, away from    abnormal, departing
from normal

acou- hearing   acoustics, the science of sound

ac-, acro-   extreme or extremity; peak
acrodermatitiis, inflammation of the skin of the
extremities

ad-  to or toward   adorbital, toward the orbit

aden-, adeno-  gland  adeniform, resembling a gland in
shape

adren-  toward the kidney   adrenal gland, adjacent to
the kidney

aero-  air   aerobic respiration, oxygen-requiring
metabolism

af-  toward afferent neurons, which carry impulses to
the central nervous system

agon-  contest    agonistic and antagonistic muscles,
which oppose each other

alb-  white   corpus albicans of the ovary, a white
scar tissue

ailment-  nourish   alimentary canal, or digestive
tract

allel-  of one another    alleles, alternative
expressions of a gene

amphi-  on both sides; of both kinds    amphibian, an
organism capable of living in water and on land

ana-  apart, up, again   anaphase of mitosis, when the
chromosomes separate

anastomos-  come together   arteriovenous anastomosis,
a connection between an artery and a vein

aneurysm  a widening   aortic aneurism, a weak spot
that causes enlargement of the blood vessel

angi-vessel   angiitis, inflammation of a lymph vessel
or blood vessel

angin-  choked    angina pectoris,  a choked feeling
in the chest due to dysfunction of the heart

ant-, anti-  opposed to; preventing or inhibiting
anticoagulant, a substance that prevents blood
coagulation

ante-  preceding; before   antecubital, in front of
the elbow

aort-  great artery   aorta

ap-, api-  tip, extremity   apex of the heart

append-  hang to    apendicular skeleton

aqua-, aque-  water   aqueous solutions

arbor  tree   arbor vitae of the cerebellum, the
treelike pattern of white matter

areola-  open space      areolar connective tissue, a
loose connective tissue

arrect-  upright   arrector pili muscles of the skin,
which make the hairs stand erect

arthr-, arthro-  joint    arthropathy, anyjoint
disease

artic-  joint   articular surfaces of bones, the
points of connection

atri-  vestibule   atria, upper chanbers of the heart

auscult-  listen    auscultatory method for measuring
blood pressure

aut-, auto-  self   autogenous, sef-generated

ax-, axi-, axo-  axis, axle    axial skeleton, axis of
vertebral column

azyg-   unpaired azygous vein,  an unpaired vessel

baro-  pressure     baroreceptors for monitoring blood
pressure

http://www.thecityofdallas.com/water/

2004.05.04@21.17

I went to federal building

I am very, very happy that I got back without being
arrested.  I had a terrible fear before going,
especially since I am going to work on first day
tomorrow, I, of course, didn’t want piss away that
opportunity.  I am under the impression I have
warrants in Grand Prairie, even though I sat out the
time in Denton, I need to contact lawyer about his
contact info.
The most powerful thing happened today
.children’s
eyes read my sign that said: Medicine Works Why
Illegal.  Also regarding spy vs. spy fear, Cop looked
over at me read sign, and I started to feel the fear,
then one person honked in support, then another honked
and another honked.  The police person heard the
honking
and then he drove off
unbelievable.
I didn’t have a video camera.

20041026Tue written on 20041027Wed 0555 (full lunar
eclipse)

Blood transfusion (jaundice) and spinal tap @ birth
Bio Dad leaves @ one
First day of school, didn’t want to go, lack
confidence
Adopted by Dad name change
Adopted Dad leaves &#61664;weekend Dad @ 12
Pete becomes Step Dad
Baseball fight
Water hose in face while penned after playfully
splashing during car wash
Overdose heart palpitations @ 15
3 years of NA brainwashing
17 move out (ignorant youth finds enablers of this
poor choice)
New Directions “Alternative” School
Meagan
Heroin&#61664;methadone&#61664;orlaam kick 4 hours
sleep in 6 weeks&#61664;genuine suicide attempts w/
shooting 90 unit heroin, coke and 120 xanex while
drinking, keep waking up
Drop 70-80 lsd, blacked out
No more cash for suicide&#61664;Methadone up to 263 to
stabilize, orlaam kick did some damage, trouble
keeping job after kick broke life essence in many
ways&#61664;no prescribed medication if arrested
No home No Erin all at once 9/11
No prescribed medication &#61664;experimental
hallucinogen medication
263 mg/day kick last year&#61664;over 60 days jail as
ibogaine aftercare for possession of joint
Drown (not on purpose), found face down in pool
resuscitated from no heartbeat&#61664;4 day coma do
not remember 4 days after wake up w/ pneumonia, brain
damage likely doctors said

Go to doctor for few things.  Back pain in mid back.
Headache when never got them before.  Wanted to follow
up on drown cause didn’t make other 4 follow ups.  And
Fatigue.

Doctor said this might be as good as I get.  Said I
can’t will myself to be better.  Trying not to throw
my hands up in the air.  Knowing Howard, Sean and
others deal with such a larger weight makes it hard to
feel sorry for self, but perhaps self loathing is a
poor replacement for self pity.

Hawaii
Warmth
Lessons

With electronic typewriters to type birth number
Where looks for hours at shoe
Of the same different.
Of mirrors and smoke and microchips and spirals
Beyond access of intellect, where sex breathes thus
life breeds.
Designed by agents of control overcome by a furry
panic
Cracks plush safe
Where ‘crack is whack’ is the phrase that pays.
In motion metamorphosis non-sense.
Where “wouldn’t you?” is injected
Where hippies can give and junkies can take.
Where you are.
That leads to somewhere.
Other then here
Where politicians talk about how dishonest politicians
are.
Where you are studied in ritual recreations of 1950’s
CIA Mind Control tests
Where clockwork has pulp.
Where eye contact is required
Where your screenplay will get read
Where your music will be heard
Where you are you and people like you
Without banishment
Without glory, but with glory holes.
That doesn’t manufacture results.
That doesn’t cherry pick anecdotal reports in any way.
With a therapist who charges less
Without diapers
Without dice
Measuring red handed
Without opioid withdrawal imagined or real
With food for children’s mouths

A place where bull runs after red slip trip trick
A place where prohibition makes sense.
A place where shouldn’t survive.
A place where all is lost in assumptions.
A place where worldview mirrors own misunderstanding.
A place where too much isn’t enough.
A place lost in fractal translation.
Like old lovers dialing telepathy.
If not then who is it?  Or what is it?
As if I can step back and separate
Loops shareware  connects dots for you now,
Don’t worry troll
Con will take care of you.
See what you want to see.
Be a student if you are one.
Busy.Honey bee scales and bunnies.
Care day.
“Oh, that wasn’t record.”
It’s red, push the button.

scribbles while text floats
This is a good example of seeing things that may or
may not be there.

I haven’t made up my mind because, well, it’s just
not that important.

If not listening, cool.  If listening, who cares?

flashes of light stunned me a bit more then should.
I didn’t anticipate a problem,
forever evolving.

“I hear G-d in these rooms” Advertising/marketing

Social Engineers irrigating Account Information
in Rehabilitation Database Pimp

Ritual Illusion from Pharmaceutical Illuminati

Answer 2 why?  Since why has no answer, asking it is a
form of escapism.  Could despair exist
without joy?

(Psst
? = avoidance)
Avoidance of what? Damn.
How do you mean? Shit
Grrr?? Yet–>?
(*with one eye)
morning breath film.
Guitar Center salesman.
Tech Support.
Bottled Air cushion
Learn to
Lots of
leftovers
in the
fridge
Which loose

Doesn’t
=

ends worth tying?
ll
Lee’s T-shirt.

Or a methadone counselor Or a sonogram

Audio wanted:  Microsoft Customer Support Quality
Monitoring Recordings of some version of me zonked out
of my head on Xanex.  Dosage amount 30-50mg/day easy,
over 100 mg on other days.  Also triple digit mg
methadone but that’s just to keep Sickness fed.

So what does this mean?  It means someone somewhere
has any Microsoft Software not work (that tends to
happen occasionally if you haven’t noticed), the MS
customer calls the Help Support Line stays on hold for
about 20 minutes and eventually gets me Blacked out of
reality in a Cubicle deep in the heart of system
giving Software Support advice that I have No idea
about.  I honestly have no idea what I came up with to
tell these people.  The supervisor has a nasty divorce
and an out of state family emergency, so my calls are
recorded but not listened to for several months if at
all.  That is one good thing that came out of my 12
cult training is the ‘fake it ‘till you make it’ meme.
In my limited experience that works well but is very
difficult to sustain.

Microsoft was where I worked when the dreaded Orlaam
flood came.
[][][][][][] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] []
[] []  [] []   []  []  []  []  []   [][] [] [] [] []
[]

Before care:

–What good will come out of the experience, if you
were Iboga would you give yourself a break or add to
pressure?

–Wash “set and setting”.  This can be a little vague,
due to the various levels.  Wash self, room, living
space.

–No cola or junk food.

–Have someone to talk to if you need it during the
experience, if doing alone be VERY careful and perhaps
writing a letter to self to help calm nerves etc. and
then hiding it to be found if anxiety gets too much.
Something in the theme of relax, forgive yourself now,
a list of good things about etc.

–Be aware of the season.  This can include actual
seasons as well as environmental seasons such as
political theater.

–Ask for advice, do research.

During Low dose:

–Limit amount of TV, if any.

–Keep in mind past “dreams” as the themes may be
expanded on.

–See yourself as you are.  Not what you should be or
what you are going to be, because you don’t know the
unknown factors that will effect how shyt turns out.
This should not be confused as justification to not
“push the envelope”, but you need an envelope first
before you can push it.

Who knows.

Brief Evaluations of My Favorite Mistake:

Pros:
Genuine Good hearted person
Perfect Smell
Perfect imperfections
Rare Find

Physically beautiful (Need Trophy?)
In Her Earth Eyes with shoulders forward Smiling Love
Smiles

Cons:
Security Risk by being Connected to someone Easily
taken advantage of due to (One plants seed
for the other)

Speaks and sees things in Absolutes (forever, eternity
etc..)

“Perfect”

Needy

Brings feelings of “She deserves someone who can take
care of her financially better”

Not comfortable having lives separate from one
another.

By the grace of G-d ibogaine was given to make me so
paranoid that I would never want to take the risks of
scoring Tar again.  Nope, not anymore.  Only pure, no
cut prescription kicks from now on.  It came on as a
suggestion to get on a anti-depressant or some ‘panic’
script with the now all to common anti-seizer
substitute for benzo’s, can’t remember which.  I don’t
care for either one, to put it nicely.  But must
explore this suggestion thoroughly to fully reject it.
So have to take pill.

Well
if taking a pharmacy pill daily for mood, might
as be one that works; where’s that xanex doc?

Well
Pharmacy has nice, legal, no cut, reliable doses,
but lets be honest, benzo’s are a far cry from a good
opioid, I’m tired of <enter residual withdrawal
symptom here>

But
the problem with methadone is it isn’t heroin
.and
it’s long acting and that they don’t give it if
arrested.  But mostly because it isn’t heroin.

But
the problem with heroin is umm
the problem with
heroin is

oh yeah that withdrawal thing that tends to
happen allot in non-pharmacy land.

Draining Gold Cotton &#61664;bar soap on bruised
arms.

But sure as fuck never needed anti-anxiety or
anti-depressants then, surfing that first naïve rush
to, well, you know.  Before Methadone.  Before Orlaam.

Before bullshit lullabies and greedy black holes of
cellular freezer burn.

How can ritual speedball bliss turn and drain with
such gravity?

Not only within the limits of the physical realm but
limitless psycho-spiritual?

Sometimes seems all that’s left is drain.  Waaaa
<bang> “next please.”

~papaw.*
~cenote.*

Can’t tell if falling
For Scan artist
Xeroxing Spirals
Process Scientific I-Ching
Another Reality
N Tired

Incorporating Inspiration

Create standard for advertisers to list
all charitable  donations
in all advertisements
, need to compress the information though

.consumers would be more aware
and thus more empowered.

Dear Oparahahaha,

“Explanation for ( -n m  -l )?”

I think that you are drawn to finding out about this.

I’m gonna repeat the hell out of that.

marijuana inside his firewood!”
marijuana inside his firewood!”
Floyd.> Did the FBI  come?”
one of my sources of joy
I love listening to birds, dogs, wind, frogs, etc.
gift of obvious

I am so sorry if I hurt you

I think that the pitch is again what feels good.
\has anyone noticed fundamental differences in the
experiences? who

wouldn’t mind comparing and contrasting the effects,
intensity and duration….
If you have this courage
you’ve gone
half the way to overcome your problems. In a symbolic
way, you have to
accept
the bitterness of life to really enjoy life.”
it is in its natural form is a proof of courage.
presented as interesting opinions,
not the one big truth. and the meaning is explained as
“Om and salutations to the remover of obstacles for
which Gum is the seed.” Hope this helps in the
“checking it out” phase. I am certain that there is a
lot to find out
deaf genie
PLEASE NOTE: This email is not intended to be spam.
what interests me is finding out how to make use of
the remover of all obstacles in a sound
Differnet “pwer animals”

Limits, we don’t choose them, we are forced into them,
during the hcl, the environment of the onearic part
was very hot on the set type energy.  Survival ment
adopting a paradigm to deal w/ it.  Their were many
types, the ‘da vision’ pict is the closest but not
near as detailed and the one I saw was allot less
animated looking, more like a new breed of information
bird clandestine.  Looking back on it now, I think I
tried to understand the other ones as best I could by
“picturing walking in their shoes” and in continuing
to hold on to the paradigm of “what are the limits of
(fill in the blank),

I experienced the

..<^>

.. of each through
accelerated life experience,  it was like fast
forwarding through the suffering of a lifetime, one
after another
very taxing.
I can’t recall the exact details anymore of the other
“spirit animals/creatures”, but still have a lingering
after feeling of the various energies involved.  Very
Alpha, most of them

Different goals,
Different intentions,
Different definitions
Different points in space-time
Different preferences in information mannerisms
Different past
Different politics
Different reaction
Different same.
Same different.

Shifting anyways,
Mr. Glue
Addicted to healing
Hitler wanted to ‘save the world’

Quickest way to “loose control” is to desire “control”

Spinal taps blood Transfusion
Jaundice Sun Flower

This cellular adjustment process extends across the
cortex, “editing” the frequency map so that a greater
area of the cortex processes important tones. One can
tell which frequencies are important to an animal
simply by determining the frequency organization of
its auditory cortex.
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa006&articleID=0007D716-71A1-1179-AF8683414B7F0000&pageNumber=3&catID=2

Jason radio ignored by commercial broadcasters because
of
government activity —
International propaganda broadcasts
from the likes of U.S.-backed Radio Free Iraq.

Jason radio, a more curious kind of
international station has been noted on the steam
stream.

Across the world, high-powered transmitters with
global reach are
broadcasting seemingly meaningless strings of numbers
or letters,
along with a lot of buzzing and beeping noises.

“numbers stations”
are operated by drug cartels run
by intelligence agencies, as tacitly acknowledged by
the
government, and accidentally by the abandoned
broadcasters in favor of
satellite and the internet, these curious stations
continue to
broadcast development listening technologies.

even listening to the signals
is illegal.

A subculture of obsessive listeners has built up
around the
stations they have hope.

decoding the signals

curiosity value oddball transmissions impact
conceptual government numbers station, but the
mystery and the stations
were not “intended for public consumption.”

The location was given away by the accidental
simulcasting of audio from Radio
genuine CIA disinformation

Number station signals suggest in-
the-field broadcasts by clandestine operatives.

powerful transmitters with global reach, requiring
massive
masts that are not easily hidden.

Spectrographic analysis of the signals has revealed
that modulated
data bursts are sometimes contained within the
transmissions, and
sub-audible noises are a regular occurrence.

E03A,
probably by MI6; and E25,
4625 KHz. buzzing
tone, repeated 25 times a minute  mast is located
Apart from the buzzing frequency
“it is a last-reserve frequency reserved for
just prior to the outbreak of
nuclear conflict.”

analyzing missiles numbers traffic
— possibly a editor of all sorts of odd
noises codes.
Listeners construct a plethora of stations.

signal characteristics never decipher but
can perform traffic analysis.”

calm center keeps one rooted in the moment, alert and
focused. Courage at such times springs from focused
attention
like the sun and the moon , shine on.
like the wind, spreading the spores.clarity 4all.
the wisdom of life itself.

_________________
“Creativity is God’s gift to you. What you do with it
is your gift to
God.”
B. Moawad

what is going to happen?
-j

http://www.tarot.com/tarot/sample-read.php?sa=&random_reading_id=6d39cf35ff162280f64bc9580726480d&subject=flow&upsell_position=&position_number=2&viewed=2&deck_ID=23&position=3&spreadNo=56&reading_type=main&picked_pieces%5B2%5D=75&picked_pieces%5B1%5D=42&picked_pieces%5B3%5D=58&deckOptions=23
Nine of Swords
Position: Challenges/ Opportunities
Main (positional) Meaning:
What brings sorrow may also give rise to feelings of
liberation.

The card in the Challenges/Opportunities position
reflects how you can use creativity and skill to turn
conflicts into harmonious understanding.

With the Nine of Swords in this position, you are
facing the paradox that what is cause for grief and
sorrow can also produce a great release. Sometimes the
catastrophe you fear the worst is actually the end of
an impossible situation; this may be one of those
times.

Consider the possibility that binding obligations to
an old situation are now ended. You are now free to
choose your own direction, to explore and grow beyond
circumstances that used to hold you in. The very fact
that this is happening indicates your readiness to
make this transition. Somewhere beneath the distress
and loss is a reserve of strength that has been
building for this kind of opportunity. Point yourself
toward healing, release from bondage, and freedom from
suffering. Focus on the positive. Collect visions and
ideas that will help you rise above feelings of
hopelessness.

The City of Garland is going to erect a 450 ft. tower
in the 500
Block of Rowlett Road,near the intersection of
Broadway.the new tower
is to go on air August 1,2005.This the answer to all
the dead spots

Garland’s old Police station in downtown Garland
will be used for backup.Also Garland’s old NexJen
system is now being
over hauled and is going to be a state of the art
Motorola MESS-NET
system with the same type PODS on poles and buildings
that the NexJen
system but hopefully better results.Motorola also says
that the City
needs to keep the SPRINT system that Garland has been
operating since
the NexJen system Crashed and burned so that the
POLICE/FIRE can have
coverage outside the city.Motorola has 7 of these
systems now up and
running in the U.S.A.

I live in
Richardson and listen to Garland quite a bit.
<http://www.motorola.com/governmentandenterprise/northamerica/en-us/public/functions/browsesolution/browsesolution.aspx?navigationpath=id_804i/id_2523i>
and listen to Garland quite a bit.

Jay

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2005 12:29:24  Help with locating a
frequency monitored not trunked all the
frequencies
used by X system in conventional mode and scanning
them to monitor conventionally.

The radio will always try its
“home”
channel first.

If you figure out the home channel and sit on it
you’ll
hear
all

If
the
home channel is busy then it works. That’s not to say
you
wouldn’t hear other folks since the same home channel
is going to be
assigned to many different users of a large system.

smart radio, dumb controller.

unlike list clear is provided

read a
radio which give
The
difficult part of you must know all the frequencies
and put them
in
the radio in the proper channels.

I’ve never seen a system that goes
1,2,3,4,5 etc but they always skip around.

Hopefully all that makes sense!!

Help with locating semantics….

easily understand the However, capable of receiving
all, it is an analog FM
signal.  Why wouldn’t one hear it if one were scanning
across the
frequency
on which the transmission occurred?

Maybe one couldn’t monitor it if an LTR transmitter
added noise that an
LTR
receiver could subtract out (quasi-encryption) or if
the system changed
frequencies every few seconds so that only a partial
sentence might be
heard on any one given frequency.

some unlikely conditions like the above supplied by
Comm-Net according to several
media
outlets. portions of this message have been removed

http://www.radioreference.com/modules.php?name=RR&mid=2

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

BCD396T receive
ND5Y
Garland’s New Tower

I’m screaming BCD396T receive

No.

listen to Garland quite a bit.

Is that an absolute “NO!” or a relative ‘no’?   Even a
Garland receives signal.  It just
can’t keep a conversational thread alive.  Could a
Garland
receive?

listen to Garland
portions of this message have been removed
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

New

just no
, but hell no. From what little I have read mesh
networks are some type of encrypted
spectrum spread in the 4.9.

that makes sense.  In essence, with a bit of work, you
could
“science out” a system for a target program
frequencies in the right order, and you’d have a
pseudo-system with a lot of probably
chance, but for a suppose, is a
hypothetical system in the morning.

receive
something
on a truth, I think, is wonder.
can receive encrypted “CAN receive” is not “IS
SUITABLE for listening to”.

The radio will always try its
“home”
channel first.

If you figure out the home channel and sit on it
you’ll
hear
all.

If
the
home channel is busy then it works.

I’ve never seen a system that goes
1,2,3,4,5 etc but they always skip around.

Hopefully all that makes sense!!
portions of this message have been removed

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Garland’s New Calm:*)

appears to be a data solution to replace the
illegal to manufacture and sell a device that
would allow unauthorized users to decode the
information in this data
network.  Sheep use BCD396T to listen to their
voice radio system, though.
HELP!!!!!!  Yes, I’m screaming!  Can BCD396T receive
Garland’s New Tower?

No.

listen to Garland

portions of this message have been removed

Garland’s New Tower Reading a little further, I do see
is possible,
but it sure is tactical communications
system do some pretty neat things (like use every
radio as a
networked repeater so that your network extends as
your personnel
deploy…).:

Calm :*)
appears to be a data solution It is not a illegal for
us to manufacture and sell a device
that would allow unauthorized users to decode the
information in this
data network to listen to HELP!!!!!!  Yes, I’m
screaming!

Mesh router
Intelli Access point
Enhanced gent Router
Vehicle Mounted Switching Controller

you’d have to
be wearing a laptop on your back… really feasible in
most situations.

this is probably just a new data transport
solution.
Yep, I agree. that makes sense.  pseudo-success, but
for a probably
do
well.  The moral of the story, I suppose, is that a
practical should do well with morning.

the discussion is somewhat
hypothetical.

However, whenever someone says you “can’t” receive
something, I wonder why not.  The truth, I think, is
“can” receive everything including encrypted and
digital
signals.

“CAN receive” is not “IS SUITABLE for listening to”.
clear provided you’ve
read a
radio

I’ve never seen a system that goes
1,2,3,4,5 etc but they always skip around.

Hopefully all that makes sense!!
semantics….
folks know that I have monitored
some of those have had no luck yet.”

can easily understand the capable of receiving all, it
is an analog FM
signal.

Why wouldn’t one hear it if one were scanning across
the
frequency
on which the transmission occurred?

transmitter added noise
receiver could subtract out (quasi-encryption) or if
the system
changed
frequencies every few seconds so that only a partial
sentence might be
heard on any one given frequency.

supplied by Comm-Net according to several
media
outlets. portions of this message have been removed

Isn’t this stuff in the 2.4 GHZ range, anyway??

And reading further still, I don’t see application in
their Product Line
site.  Enhanced Access Router
Switching Controller

While the system would allow VoId, you’d
have to
be wearing a laptop on your back.

vote goes back to enforcement situations.
“this is probably just a new data
transport
solution.”
messaging is
possible,
but it sure isn’t emphasized in the web site. I think
we’ll just
have
to wait and see if it is implemented.

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Sounds good will be changing there
numbers
soon there currently numbered as
1RescueEngine1
There new numbering will be 181
181
181
They are also set to receive a new rescue I think
sometime at
the end of this year and it will be called Rescue.
This is also federally funded and if the government
requests it, it
can be
sent anywhere they may need it.
Everyone that will be on it is
currently
being trained in Water Rescue and
Rescue Angel.  This new is all part of a group of
departments that got together they include
department will or receive a trailer that will be
pulled
with a Ford pickup.  They will be handling all the for

the
portions of dallas  have been removed

Color coded, but varying degrees and shades of colors.
Brown: could start off dog shit brown, then gradually
progress Lion dung and eventually G-d/ess poo.
Yellow: starts at Priest/ess Pee and ends in Gold
rush.  Orange is just Orange.

Or if have something against body “waste” colors,
could use color associations from various ‘meme’s’
(start with Bwiti sects and move from there? Red
ribbon etc..).

The trick is defining the titles.

Mix Tape projects (limit them to 10-20 for each Mix).
Each project should contain an Essay explaining as
best can, how it relates to various Visions.

It may need a few chapters(essays) at the beginning to
tie it together and give some foundation for flexing
concave conText.

Sara,
How are you?
Much real Love to you and your family,
J

Hi jason,
thanks you for asking.i’m fighting not to break down.
I’m getting better, I brought some one to the airport
today, his treatment
for
heroin went really good.

still I have to collect my energy to do something.next
week summer holidays
starting, I will have a little rest.my kids will be at
home.

I hope you will come soon,

much love,

Sara

From:    UUSEAN@aol.com  [Add | Block]    Show All
Headers
Date:    Mon, 21 Jun 2004 23:25:21 EDT
Subject:    Re: 111111111111111
To:    iboga@ziplip.com

——————————————————————————–

Hi Jason,

Thanks so much for your kind post.  And yes, I am
certain that your actions matter even when you are not
aware of it.

Pax,
Sean

US NH: New Support Group Tackles War On Drugs
by Susan Morse, (22 Jun 2004) Hampton Union New
Hampshire

SEABROOK – From an initiative started by former police
chief William Baker, the Seabrook Police Department is
starting a “Seabrook Drug Coalition of the Willing” to
help drug- and alcohol-addicted residents.

Sgt.  Michael Frost is coordinating the program under
the direction of acting Chief David Currier and acting
Deputy Chief Patrick Manthorn.  Frost is looking for
residents willing to sign on as volunteers to help
their neighbors and strangers overcome drug and
alcohol addiction.

Those willing are asked to call the police department
at 474-5200.

“How I envision it,” said Frost, “we’re looking for
resources, those who have been through NA ( Narcotics
Anonymous ), AA ( Alcoholics Anonymous ), the people
who’ve lived in Seabrook and dealt with addiction.
I’m not looking for experts.  I’m looking for people
who have compassion, looking to create a safety net.”

The specifics of the program and how the volunteers
will be employed have yet to be worked out.  It
depends on what residents are willing to take on, said
Frost.

The coalition’s aim is support rather than
enforcement, said Frost.  The drug war will continue
in the department, but the focus of the coalition is
on getting help to those who need it.

“This is not just kicking down doors and making
arrests,” Frost said.  “It’s about developing a
support network.”

Currier said the department, meanwhile, is targeting
drug dealers.  In most cases, dealers are users who
sell drugs to support their habit, said Currier.

“There are a lot of different tactics to take,”
Currier said.  “We really have to attack it at the
roots where the dealers are.  We know who some of the
people are.”

Investigations are lengthy, and it takes time to get
enough on a suspect to get probable cause in court, he
said.

Use of heroin in Seabrook has been called epidemic by
Sgt.  Ellen Arcieri of the state Narcotic
Investigations Unit.

Frost, who served for eight years as a consultant for
the federally initiated Northeast Regional Training
for Drug Free Schools and Communities, said Seabrook’s
problem, while bad, is no different than in cities and
towns throughout New England.

“I see the problem as epidemic, not just epidemic in
Seabrook,” Frost said.  “We have more opportunities
than threats.  Those opportunities are every citizen
who is willing to stand up and say, ‘I’m willing to
help someone, I’m willing to help a neighbor, an
addict, an alcoholic.'”

Frost had no figures on the number of families in town
affected by drugs.  Twenty-five percent of all
families nationwide are touched in some way by alcohol
or drug abuse, he said.

Seabrook’s close-knit community has been the subject
of ridicule from outsiders in the past.  This
closeness is a plus for the coalition, said Frost.
People know their neighbors.

“What’s publicized as a negative is a positive in an
informal network,” Frost said.

Last November, Currier went public on the heroin
problem, when he told the Board of Selectmen heroin
was cheap, potent and flowing into town.  Three months
after becoming chief in December, Baker held a
well-attended heroin forum and announced his intention
to coordinate a drug coalition.

Baker resigned last month, citing lack of support by
the majority of selectmen for his initiatives for the
department, including his proposal to send a Seabrook
officer to the Seacoast Drug Task Force.

The town has since applied to the state for the grant
money to send an officer to the task force.  The
Seabrook Police Department has yet to hear whether the
grant has been approved, said Currier.

——————————————————————————–
MAP posted-by: Larry Seguin

Pubdate: Tue, 22 Jun 2004
Source: Hampton Union, The (NH)
Copyright: 2004 Seacoast Online.
Contact: hamptonunion@seacoastonline.com
Website: http://www.seacoastonline.com/news/hampton/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/3146
Author: Susan Morse

Embryonic germ (EG) cells, derived during a slightly
later stage of development (five to nie weeks), come
from primordial germline cells in early fetal tissues.
Much less research has been done on EG cells, but
their potential to differentiate appears to be more
limited than that of ES (embryonic stem) cells.

In particular, many stem cell research projects are
targeting neurological problems.  For example:

Worldwide, more than 100 people with Parkinson’s
disease have received embryonic neuron trans plants.
Although some patients showed no change (presumably
because the new cells failed to produce enough
dopamine), others improved measurably.  Plans call for
transplants of more highly differentiated stem cells
as more reliable sources of the neurotransmitter.

Researchers at the Salk Institute in California
extracted brain cells from human cadavers and used
them to produce neural progenitor cells, the
precursors to adult brain cells.

Biologists at Thomas Jefferson University removed
human adult stem cells from bone marrow, bathed them
in growth factors and nutrients, and converted them in
to neuronlike cells.

Using ES cells from mice, researchers produced glial
cells that deposited myelin around spinal cord fibers
when injected into rats with multiple sclerosis.

Neuronal stem cells are known to migrate deep into
the brain to repair damaged tissue.  Scientists at the
Institute Pasteur in Paris are working to cure
multiple sclerosis by identifying the chemical signals
that regulate this process and developing stem cells
with an enhanced ability to migrate.

Scientists at Johns Hopkins induced a paralyzing
disorder in mice and rats similar to the human disease

amyotrophic
lateral sclerosis, then injected them with immature
human stem
cells that had been programmed to become neurons.

Three months later,   *although their movements were
jerky, all of the paralyzed animals were walking
again.

We must go forward to what we are, and no one has ever
been there.

Find out what you are, and try to be it.

Tragedy to us, however hysterical, is real.

We can be insulated against everything but death – in
fact, death is the very substance of our insulation.
But to be used by life we must be naked and to be
naked is to be hurt. But it is also to be alive.

I am enclosing the 7th Aire. Copy it into a permanent
note book along with any other rituals you intend to
use.

The inside and the outside must speak, the guts and
the blood and the skin; the penis and the vagina, as
well as the brain. We must have it all out, the fear
and the disgust, the hatred and cowardice, and the
beauty, tenderness and courage as well, and balance
all. Then we can get at the truth. The mind is an
instrument that measures itself with itself and as
such a contradiction – an impossibility. But out of
this abyss, as we know, we can make significance, but
to be cogent it must be significance for the entire
field.

The state in a proper working is indescribable but
unmistakable. It is essential that everything be
prepared and learned properly well in advance, since
when things start to happen much of the work will have
to go on automatically.

It is all strange and uncharted – nothing but truth
will serve us here, and it must be the truth of dream
and hallucination and frenzy equally with the truth of
science and dialectics and economics.

But these are also my truths – they are part of me –
part of the equipment of my cosmic laboratory wherein
I can begin an experiment in truth.

There can be no objectivity so long as there is
preference.

Comprehend the intolerable self – the vile, frightful
aspects of the mother that yet lifts up the upholding
hand in the immemorial gesture of – peace, child, all
is well.

Neurosis and initiation are the same thing, except
that neurosis stops short of apotheosis, and the
tremendous forces that mold all life are encysted –
short circuited and turned poisonous. Psychoanalysis
transforms the false ego symbols – it is a confusion
of conformity and cure in terms of group behavior. But
initiation must go on until the barrier is passed, the
misty bastions of infantile Trawenfells in to the
rocks and crags of eternity, the garden of Klingsor in
to the City of God beyond duality and causality, above
the abyss – and these in turn to the One that is
beyond speech and sight and knowledge..

You should have the plan in detail, order of rituals,
layout of temple, procedure etc. I will send you the
ritual of the Bornless One, probably in a small
Goetia, since it is rather long to copy. It is a very
ancient, potent & dangerous ritual, often used by bold
magicians in the Guardian Angel Working. It is useful
as a preliminary in almost any sort of work, causing a
tremendous concentration of force. It is, however,
liable to produce dangerous side phenomena and
sometimes permanent haunting in an area where it is
repeated, & is for this reason often avoided. Never do
it without banishing & opening the temple, then
closing and banishing again.

I’m tired from the trip and will myself close now.

Can’t find:  “I’m forever blowing bubbles” by Hermeto
Pascoal
But found other song sample:
http://www.pezzotti.ch/aves.ra

https://bookweb.kinokuniya.co.jp/guest/cgi-bin/booksea.cgi?ISBN=0192804960

&#61664;_&#61664;5th Step:
http://www.bodyworlds.co.uk/en/pages/koerperspende.asp

http://www.erowid.org/psychoactives/faqs/psychedelic_crisis_faq.shtml

“It can be very hard to relax in the middle of dying
or being pulled apart by demons,”
“Healthy process: Crises are a normal part of the
human psychological process and one way to engage them
is as a process of healing, not a ‘problem’ to be
fixed.”

“(if it seems appropriate and useful) you can prompt
them with very simple questions about their
experience…

“What color is it?” — “Are you sad?” — “How old are
you?”
It seems likely that the answers you will receive will
be metaphoric and not concrete. “All the colors” –
“I’m as old as the river”. Don’t expect to carry on a
normal conversation.

http://wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,65620,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_2

“The only side effect reported was an itching or
“fizzing” sensation around the scalp where the
electrode was attached.”
“It isn’t the first time doctors and scientists have
used electricity to modify the way the brain works.
Some historians believe Greek physicians as early as
the second century directed patients to apply a live
torpedo fish, a type of electric ray, to the forehead
as a cure for headaches.”

http://www.med.harvard.edu/AANLIB/cases/caseNA/pb9.htm

http://www.med.harvard.edu/AANLIB/hms2.html
Normal tissue
MR-T11
MR-T21
xray-CT2

dense bone dark dark bright
air dark dark dark
fat bright bright dark
water dark bright dark
brain “anatomic”3 interm. interm.
1. Bright means high signal intensity, dark means low,
and interm. means intermediate.
2. Bright means high density/high attenuation of
x-rays, dark means low.
3. Grey matter appears grey, white matter white.

PET, SPECT, fMRI, EEG, MEG, optical imaging and
neuroanatomical tools

http://www.med.harvard.edu/AANLIB/hms1.html
“When an additional magnetic field is superimposed,
one which is carefully varied in strength at different
points in space, each point in space has a unique
radio frequency at which the signal is received and
transmitted. This makes constructing an image
possible. It represents the spatial encoding of
frequency, just like a piano.”

http://www.med.harvard.edu/AANLIB/hms1.html
http://www.efns.org/guidelines/gl_5.pdf
http://www.rt-image.com/content=8004J05C4896908040B69C76448A88641
http://www.neuroimage.net/
http://wired.com/news/medtech/0,1286,65422,00.html?tw=wn_story_related
http://www.lumc.nl/1010/LKEBHome/english/research/Neuro/LKEBNIPMain.html
http://wired.com/news/medtech/0,1286,65560,00.html
http://wired.com/news/medtech/0,1286,65507,00.html

Hollywood Babylon
“we edited it”
“press play on the box”.
Time to turn the page when you hear

Am I right your into drugs?
Yeah you look it.
Druggie druggie druggie druggie
Am I right your into drugs?
Yeah you look it.
A bear had a chance to go to the big city.
Drown in synchronicity?
I don’t know what’s headed this way princess but it’s
shaking the place apart.
Avoidance becoming predictable.
Shame makes touch down
Perception cannot perceive itself.
Junk trash market value
Rip Lee green greed machine
Trick or treat.
U-R-O
*- (
So sad.
So fuck that.
Man or child?
Boom but he dropped dea
In force cyanide breath mint
Age Hence See
Ugg buys old houses.
Advertisements of higher
Is this all there is?
A cut mouth gum bus line
Picking cotton
No para is a para
Ah
Bothering you?
Tail evolves into fly swat air vanilla
Auto
Pil
Quiet static of short .vvav
Good listener.
Natural resources = vg ear under pillow, never sent.
Spent burnout fades away into damaged drunk tank over
crowded.
Pitiful genetic code bring pain to off spring.
Spring fall Un-sprung
Beta blockers rolling blocks 0 lease
Where does go?
Pass go yet?
Straight from jail to boardwalk
Die easy
Tie a tie How 2
Umbilical noose
Cancer father
Thumb grinder
Complaint depo, “I want to register a complaint”
(bang)
“next please”
We’ve come to the point in this album where those
listening on cassette or record will have to stand up
or sit down and turn over the record or tape.  In
fairness to those listeners we will now take a few
seconds before we begin side two.  Thank you.  Here’s
side two.

Escape artist ran and ran and ran (speed up to 45)
Repulsive, fit only for hatred, chapter 2 runs
hunting.
What I want to know is does he have a muscle arm.
Tough guy doesn’t = man.
Provider = man.
Got fruit?
Man doesn’t = child.
You may not like this but, I’m going to make somebody
mad no doubt.
Ever thought about how others might read?
Everything still remains the same.  I can’t do what 10
people tell me to do, sitting here resting my bones.
Or rather what’s left of them.
Btw, what IS left?
Where do we go from here/>?
Black meat White meat Hole
It’s a trap paravoidance.
Void shall hear
And a quart of beer
Explore the
sHit explodes .com bust
On the poor side of town.
Thank you for trying.
Born father less
Never knew my father so looked for spare change
Crank up your volume
Crank up your profits.
Nothing worthwhile is without risk
Depend how define worthwhile
Do you really think you can get away with quit while
your ahead?
Cult of VReid
WH0 = 0HM
2, do you remember?
Or forget pleas for help from sub
Slow motion is quick sand.
Stand up for anything?
Vulnerable artery, milky jugular
With or without map maker.
With or without compass maker.
The source of the energy and the vehicle, the
manifestation
Infested world is a ghetto
Hungry Hungry Homer
Could it be I’m falling in?
Pushed at the last step.
Check the door for heat
Scales blind set sun
Re: produce (fruits & vegetables)
Steaks of Hormone Injected Heart
Inside AND outside at the same time
Disk Compacted Watermark
Authentic poser sell out junkie fam
Stock and bonds
Hum of Bank
Air conditioner box
Electricity box
Home box
Punishment box
Christmas box
Industrial complex box
Feeding box
No longer command respect sweetest taboo.
Such a body talking
iLLz Need
my oh my what a wonderful day.
How do you do?
Isn’t that silly? I was afraid of nothing.
Most important thing is not to panic when you fall in
the water.
Effects
After After Care
Anti anti anti
Stone cutter
Stoned cutters
America needs this message,
Its good to have something to fall back on, that’s why
I became an electrician.
“could you move some of this shit”

I think I’m a few days, if not hours away.  My
strength is persistence and over feeling everything
works against that.  The only thing that even in
craving doesn’t sound good is the control of it.
If/when the shit goes down forced to kick circa WW2
junkies or at best 9/11 NY methadone patients.

I think it would calm my mind and nerves, because my
nerves are fucking shot.  I think it may be due to a
few factors (too many to list actually):
Multi-year xanex script expired.  Tamazepam script
runs out this month.  They aren’t shit compared to any
opiate/opioid, of course, but they either take care of
the anxiety a bit or black me out, one of the two.
They were a crutch of unreliable support when every
cell in my body screams for some twisted synthesis of
expanding black holes.

“Sickness inside the skull has no limits.  Physical
sickness is relentless but has to be attached to the
physical existence and thus is limited by a framework.
Addiction of the mind has no such limits.

T. hEr01n boga boogie mogne owtta heahg   Ding Dong
Ding Dong (stoned ranger (wally) ‘tis time.

http://www.tcbap.org/ContinuingEducation/ProvidersDallasFortWorthArea.htm
http://www.health.xq23.com/gravis_acerbus_dolore/Analgesics_.html
LCDC (Licensed Chemical Dependency Counselor), ADC
(Alcohol Drug Counselor), AAC (Advanced Addiction
Counselor), CCDS (Certified Chemical Dependency
Specialist), CCGC (Certified Compulsive Gambling
Counselor),CCS (Certified Clinical Supervisor), CPS
(Certified Prevention Specialist), or CSC (Certified
Supervisor Consultant) credentials. They may be used
for up to 30 (thirty) hours of the 40 (forty) hours
required for recredentialing every two years.

Our courses are also approved by NAADAC (Approved
Education Provider No. 452), and may be used toward
their national credentials.
http://www.aivl.org.au/files/UnlawfulDiscrimination.pdf
http://www.tcbap.org/
http://www.prc3.org/acro.htm
http://www.actoronto.ca/website/careteam.nsf/edb7eae66aeeced985256d33000d1523/21c731894ccc5c9385256d42006fce24/$FILE/Living.pdf
http://www.tdh.state.tx.us/hcqs/plc/lsw/lsw_default.htm
http://fn.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/abstract/89/1/F33?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&searchid=1094801838156_164&stored_search=&FIRSTINDEX=0&minscore=5000&journalcode=fetalneonatal

Is anything not absorbed in organized prohibition?
Make it a double.
Like bartenders giving drinks for AA chips.
Make you sick if you don’t wait and beg to buy my
shit.
Catching zzz’s while you’re feeling sick.
Pimps couldn’t hustle without you little bitch.
If your bank account’s dry, I need paper, sell your
home.
Syrup sipper’s might as well be sipping methadone.
All the smartest hustlers only stick to burning trees.
Pretty soon I’ll have you syrup sippers on your knees.
Back from rehab now saying that your clean?
Saying that you don’t need to buy shit from me?
Give me all your paper and I’ll make you feel serene.
By the way I cut your tar with tabs of morphine.
Quick sand for sale.
Iboga.
Sound of toilet flushing.
That dream wake.
Wake that dream.
Waking meditation focus memories of dreams.
To desire what we perceive as good to triumph over
what we perceive as evil.
Independent In Dependence.
Rooted in anything?
Is anything true?
Is anything unbiased?
Grays vs. Polarized
Vs. vs. Vs.
Spy vs. Spy.
As if not connected to one another.
Is my judgment sound?
Is my guard let down?
Stand for something but do not speak for people.
Listen.
Find common understanding.
Understand better.
Acts out of fear.
View felt attacked by different view.
Defense politics = anybody but him = rats racing
attack machine.
Lack of wanting to understand.
Make more obvious selfish benefits of listening and
trying to understand.
“How does it affect me” Mentality.
How does it infect me? Brutality.
Clicks.
“
Then we are nothing but the nerds they say we are.”
Tripe.
Tribe.
Gang.
Fraternity in cheeseburger country.
Washington’s view on political parties.
Fight for the rights we have left.
Not caring our country into nazi country.
Hustle.
Grind.
Sniper salesman for your own good.
Split our coalition like an atom.

Sucker punch you before you sucker punch me.
Hunger promotes moral flexibility.
Preemptive strikes to promote democracy.
Social security
Will determine your eligibility.
Come to school and learn to write legibly.
Come learn our version of history.
Amongst other things
Bore away your curiosity.
Like internal and external grasshopper morphology.
No more ‘save us’ mentality.
No more lack of accountability.
No more evacuations from Mile 3.
No more personification of that energy.
No more prisons built to lock up non-violent me.
No more rodeo with runaway war machines.
No more engines powered from steam
No more consciousness left to stream.
No more mechanical bull lee.
Mechanical breathe fog sacred mirror.
Robot hug.
Robot come.
Whipped robot cream (trademarked).
Random Number Generators connected like falling
dominos sequence.
(rinse then repeat)

“Functional magnetic resonance imaging
In 1990, Seiji Ogawa, a researcher at AT&T Bell Labs,
discovered that blood low in oxygen caused a slight
distortion as it flowed through a magnetic field,
while fully oxygenated blood did not…”

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.10/brain.html

Desperate People (off biscuits)
Got the nerve to want to be somebody and don’t got no
skills
Umm.. do anything but tear down? Can’t even
contemplate building?
Without security?
Got Security TM &#61664; well
you can imagine.
have more strength then give credit for.
No time for education?? “sounds familiar lol”

Inside the heart of an American Junkie.

When the messiah returns to earth, it is reasonable to
think they will return as a junkie.

It is hard to think that anything new could possibly
come out of such a tired topic as junk.  The very word
seems synonymous with trash and bad teeth.  Although
Jesus washed the feet of another, so why would he not
walk through junk sickness and speedball rush?  The
heroin cyber Beat Punk Hippie’s have ruined many lives
in the name of good business.  Leaving the term
‘revolution’ watered down by incorporation and
consumption.  But revolutionaries must trade and
communicate just as other people, as no one is an
island unto themselves.  Why is this so hard to see
until seen?  And  what are the pro’s and con’s of
“burned my credit cards for fuel” mentality?  Is
becoming more radical help or hinder understanding
from those outside our own paradigm?  Bridges make
unsustainable firewood supply.  Stubborn in a attempt
to justify such narcissism.

It is still amazing to me that these events shape my
own worldview in such profound ways even after
consumption of junk is discontinued.   Perhaps the
junkie worldview makes myself more vulnerable in some
ways and more skeptical in others.  There is little
doubt that surrounding self with hustlers seems to
diminish my faith in people.  But what makes a person
a junkie?  Would junkies exist without political and
socio-economic factors or is it the chemical itself
that makes a person a junkie?  Obviously the answer is
both and possibly more.  The two seem to feed off of
one another like oxygen and carbon dioxide, plants and
mammals.  Reminds me of the two snakes wrapping
themselves around western medical symbol.  Opioids and
Opiates are a rush of bliss and venom, the snake
charmer rather then the snake.  In this way a road of
nothing of significance can be understood by intellect
alone.  Junk is without direct memory and it is
without future but it is with a universal sexual
memory just underneath the skin like condensed
impulses of junk energy like some beautiful blood red
glow of some new undiscovered electricity.  Junk is
bleeding the eternal bug light zapper.

So why should a junkies life revolve around junk?
Perhaps this is done in avoidance in what would
naturally fill in the blank without junk.  The problem
lies in that in learning, it becomes a hypodermic
ritual quicksand lover who drains cotton and pushes
plungers at first sight of red.  I think junkies see
the game after a while, eventually the wizard behind
the curtain is seen and the inevitable question comes:
why have I invested so many of my numbered heartbeats
to that which demands so much but who’s assets seem to
emulate a diminishing return?  Tolerance is a rite of
passage into a hungry world.  Once depth of situation
is realized, it can be overwhelming for some to the
point that “fuck it” appears as the only reliable
security blanket defense mechanism.  Predictable
random can represent the same avoidance.  But are we
designed to live in a world of escapism.  Could faith
be considered a form of escapism?  Could lack of faith
be considered a form of escapism?  Is the method used
a sound method?

The stigma of junkie is seen to varying shades among
the usual suspects.  The supposed ‘winnable’ out of
sight out of mind mentality of what is called the
‘drug war’ is quite literally threatening the security
of every American by fueling the bank accounts of
terrorist.  When I say security I mean both in the
means of homeland security in the war against terror
and economic security.  Also it funds the Iraq
insurgents that are killing American Soldiers.  It
gives economic opportunities to America’s enemy’s.  If
prohibition had any results in drug use maybe one
could justify the rational, but several decades have
seen the issue become worse.  One has to consider the
possibility that prohibitionist may have an economic
interest in not winning.  How else could someone come
away with thinking it has worked and continue to
increase the funding that could otherwise go to things
that DO work.

Imagine if a diabetic’s insulin was outlawed.  In a
reasonably short amount of time, diabetic’s would be
showing up in jail more, surrounded with violent
criminals, and eventually becoming institutionalized
by the surroundings.  Methadone is one of the most
addictive drugs, more then heroin as methadone is long
acting (24 hours) and heroin short acting (4-6 hours).
But we see that the methadone patient has a reliable
supply and is much more likely to be able to hold a
job or complete school then the illegal heroin user.
This is not because methadone is less addicting, it is
because the unreliable supply of an illegal heroin
user’s heroin.  Heroin use is deadly due to the way
illegal heroin is supplied in varying potencies.  If
that heroin was prescribed, varying potencies wouldn’t
be an issue and thus heroin deaths would drop
dramatically.  I personally was on 263 mg/day of
methadone.  Because of the tolerance and reliable
supply and reliable dose, it made me feel normal, but
give my dose to someone without a habit and they would
likely die.  I believe that if drugs where prescribed
by a doctor, the glamour of drug use would cease.
Heroin is cool.  Methadone clinics are lame.  People
want what they can’t have so in a way, I blame the
scare tactic information policies of DARE.  Scare
tactics have to be used due to funds.  Which means the
stigma of illegal drug use is raised, and very vague
information is given, making most drugs appear equally
life destroying.   And there is never a contrast when
the consequences of the use of a specific drug.  There
is never a contrast between the consequences of use
when prescribed (such as methadone) and when illegal.
There are consequences to those who don’t get caught
using illegal drugs.  This may be why some get anxious
at first use of marijuana.  But those should not be
confused with the legal consequences which may, in
it’s good intentions, add to the obstacles of becoming
a productive member of society.  This is obviously in
everyone’s interest, prisoners don’t pay for
themselves.  And the users of illegal drugs probably
had enough trouble as it is from the drugs themselves
as we are all products of our environment to various
degrees.

It was McCoy.
2 gram Po Chai bottles C 17 H 17 NO (C2H3O2)2
Heinrich Dreser syringe fraternity rampant Morphinism
agents renamed Army units of the Kuomintang (KMT) and
various CIA involvement in Narcotics trade.

Daily intake
Required specific chemist
for operational efficiency.

Quantities of
Dr. John Hill
Dr. Samuel Crumpe
Dr. Samuel Johnson
Dr. John Freitag
Dr. John Jones
Robert Burton –>

Anatomy of Melancholy,

the problem of those who were insomniacs
‘by reason of their continual cares, fears, sorrows,
dry brains [which] is a symptom that much crucifies
melancholy men.’

Anointing the forehead upon retiring with an
opium-rosewater mixture and applying leeches behind
the ears then rubbing opium into their puncture marks.
Dr. Charles Hunter
***********Dr
Fordyce Barker***********

Two of these chains, the heavy (H) chains, are
identical to each other and contain approximately 400
amino acids each.  The other two chains, the
&#61664;light&#61663; (L) chains, are also identical
to each other, but only about half as long as each H
chain.  The four chains combined form a molecule,
called an anti-body monomer (mon ‘o-mer), with two
identical halves, each consisting of a heavy and light
chain.  The molecule as a whole is T or Y shaped.

Nine in the fourth place means:

“Yes but-“
“But nothing!  Think about it.  The Meaning of Life!
We get our fingers on that we can hold every shrink
in the Galaxy up to ransom, and that’s worth a bundle.
I owe mine a mint.”

on phantom overload because I am l8r0n if u want.

I did a fast edit.  I think I will place it under
Theoretical Macromolecular Modeling Bioinformatics
Immediate Availability of:

beginning in Holy Water, to help prevent any hydration
issues which
might otherwise arise during the course of your
visionary experience.

Us know Dr.
Pookie will feed you 4 bars of repeated as often as
necessary

If you have
not found God, The Aliens or the GOP’s Power Computer;
the Pimp fairy will visit soon to make it all better.

inject heroin (the
Special Kind that doesn’t cause withdrawal)
as needed.

Sp^ce k0k0

*_* [a(d)]just numbers :

Geyser Full Pure Water Spring
<boing>
Organic Manic
Titanic Flea & Tick Panic
Rehab Shtick
Click Pick Doblin Quick
Reversing Spirals Polar Rolls
Synthetic War Synthetic Warmth Synthetic Weather
Electric Coffin Buried Alive Therapy Tolls
Coughing
Enlightenment Under Ice Club Ride
Squeaking Treadmills

TM’s Cosmic Giggle
River Trickle
Cranberry and Sweet Pickle
Tummy Tickle
Blow Job for a Nickel
Beams Triple
Buttery Nipple
Super handi-tard cripple

please remember that I am still learning too, but I
will help as best I can : )
in an unbiased and teachable way
you ask me if I felt sick…that is a hard question.
I can say iboga isn’t a combination of LSD and
non-sickness methadone,
it can be a hard road of hope, natural endorphins etc
back up and running again,

it can be a hard road of hope, but it is hope,

don’t give prescribed methadone in jail

walk through what had to be walked through
expectations should be,

I do not feel it is a “cure” ie something that will do
everything for you

It is a window of opportunity
I can’t go through 263 mg kick both with and without
iboga to compare…but what I can do is compare it to
an Orlaam cold turkey kick I attempted in July of ’99,
and I was on the equivalent of about 60 or 70 mg of
methadone (I forget how much that made the Orlaam
dose, but I do remember clearly switching from 60-70mg
methadone to the equivalent dose of Orlaam)

things got really bad, indescribably bad…The
sickness was so intense and consistent and never
ending and will breaking…sickness was so intense I
slept only

4 hours in a total of 6 weeks never ending-ness broke
my will and I slid into the quicksand of hopelessness
resulting in a few stupid attempts, when I woke up the
next day over and over again, and didn’t have the
money to try any more, I said “fuck this shit, at
least I was productive before” by Dec 99 I was on
opioids again and once I made it back to the clinic
for the reliable supply, it took allot more for me to
be “stable”.

So….the 263 mg kick without iboga is simply
unimaginable and incomprehensible, it without a doubt
would have been the orlaam kick at least 3 to 4 times
over.

So with that limited experience as my map and compass,
I would say the iboga took at least 50% of the
sickness that would have been without it.
Everyone reacts different. the addiction interruption
qualities of iboga/ine vary from person to person, but
what seems to be universal in the experience is the
whole “ten years of therapy in one night” lessons, I
have not met one person yet who hasn’t felt that in
some way.

picture in your mind’s eye…a molecule (by the way
the dream like state is somewhere in between
imagination and dream, at least for me personally)

see in your minds eye a molecule, then you feel a tap
on your shoulder and your vision/perspective steps
back and broadens…

now you see a pattern/series of molecules, shoulder
tap, vision/perspective steps back and broadens…

now you see tree bark, shoulder tap,steps back and
broadens

…now a tree, shoulder tap, step back and broaden

…series of tree’s, shoulder tap, vision/perspective
steps back and broadens

…a forest.  The molecule you saw at the beginning is
still there, in forest, the forest is still there in
the molecule.

Does that make sense?

language is too restrictive to express certain lessons
learned from spirit.

, at risk of stating the obvious, “meditation in
action is always better then mediation in repose”.

you appear to be

Hope in the wind.

“good”/”bad” is pretty subjective and perhaps over
simplistic.
The line that “separates”  “good” from “bad” is in
every heart,
it’s the placement of the “line”
that seems to effect whether we over demonize or make
’em into saints.

Bottom line is, everyone’s got to eat, so I suppose
everyone is
parasitic to a point, but some appear to have
redeeming qualities that
can make balance that out a bit.

Re: tv or BP (brain pacifier) had a decent show on PBS
about secular
and non-secular points of view, mainly through the
eyes of Frued and
Lewis, not bad I guess. I wasn’t aware that Freud died
from on
purpose
opiate overdose.
After thinking about the question of ‘higher power’ I
seem to be rooted
in the belief that their is no question that their are
many powers in
nature that are much larger then I am.

What I don’t believe is
that this force is somehow working for ‘good’, be that
the good of all
people or is somehow working for me,

that seems to be control junkies
trying to control the uncontrollable.  It is what it
is.

How is it
not   chaos?

Re: therapy, if it leads to positive action then it is
worthwhile, if
it doesn’t, then it is a waste of time.

This has been my experience,
esp. w/ sound, but remember I know nothing.

good to see your book will get read, I’d like to see
the
t-shirt, retail activism indeed.

if they don’t enforce it why give our
government the option to enforce it if they want to?
Does freedom =  having bad laws but not enforcing
them?

sounds a little silly to me.

Hypothetically speaking of course, if someone had
experience to offer,
I wonder if they would feel comfortable sharing that
here.

Who knows.

“a good aftercare suggestion” lol riiight ;

pro’s and con’s of being  hypnotized by “ibo pimps”
and political lobbyz

“Stepping off the hamster wheel at the moment” can
sound like a
reasonable idea

rewind vox dogma

Just the thoughts of another ibogaine treated rat.

just parasitic.
Do you know how hard it can be to say
NO to H on day 3 of withdrawal? Oh wait, you probably
do.

If the dealer is a user him/herself, they are
generally
cooler people, cuz they
My regular supplier of
weed/E/other pharmis is a cool guy(he’s older) and a
pretty close friend, who has even offered to be a
silent partner in several business ventures.

plywood

keep fighting brother.

What is this day 18?Â

The road starts where my feet are
is where I am currently.

———————–=[/

September 17, 2004 9:49:
Thank you.  ‘Buddha in your mirror’ right before
hcl dose and picked it up periodically during the
journey.

Good luck on your project.

There’s a story about a thief who climbed over the
wall of
Buddha’s ashram and got away with some stuff until he
was caught by the
wall by a couple of disciples.  One of them was a monk
who had been
living with the teacher for 30 years, a disciple who
had the capacity
to remember hundreds of “his” past lives.  The
disciples brought the
thief to Buddha.  Upon seeing the teacher’s
continence, his immense
Presence/Clarity, the man immediately broke down and
surrendered. A  He
surrendered everything he imagined he was, and thought
he wasn’t in
that moment, and essentially stripped himself of every
vestige of
separateness, and completely and utterly died into
that Moment. A
Without
identifying with a separate self there is no longer
any personal
suffering. A  He became enlightened. A Â
          Â The master recognized what had
happened , assured
the man he
was worthy and confirmed it was the case.   The one
disciple who had
spent his lifetime acquiring knowledge about himself
lamented to his
teacher as to why, given his devotion to the teaching,
his discipline,
and all his supposed self-knowledge he hadn’t attained
to
enlightenment.  And Buddha’s reply?

Well, you can imagine, right?Â

Totality is the key.Â

In true intention

and readiness,

there’s a
Buddha
within every situation we find ourselves in.
                          Â
                          Â
                 Â
                          Â
                          Â
              Â
                       &n
bsp;Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â
                          Â
               Â
                          Â
                      Â
  Â

September 17, 2004 8:16:15 off topic whine to hak3rz
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I had insomnia like crazy last night.Â

I was really tired, not just
physically, but would just lay there getting
frustrated at my inability
to remember how to fall asleep.Â

I woke up a few hours ago and I feel
a
large weight…
Â

After trying to ask “what is trying to happen here”,

pool, no heartbeat or breathing for a few minutes,
friends CPRed
me back, but not conscious.  in coma for 4
days apparently allot bigger then I remembered.

I learned last night that the doctors were telling all
my
family
that chances of making it back were unlikely, and that
if I did, I would
likely have brain damage, etc.
When out of coma, I had tubes out of every hole and
tubes
in new holes they pricked. Â
Â

“it was a miracle, a real miracle.Â

charming and light hearted and seemed to be without
sickness” (opioid
sickness).Â

“But then something changed and it came back.”Â

said  with this heaviness, hard to explain.Â

“I thought it was
over
but, sigh, it came back” type look.
Â

I realized after thinking last night that they tell me
I was given
decent amounts of IV morphine when I came out but that
was cut off
after a couple of days.
Â

I have very little respect for myself in this state of
non-opioids.Â

I  feel weak without them.Â

I feel fatigued without them.Â

I feel  unreliable without them.Â

I don’t know what to expect without them.Â

I  don’t know how to act without them.
Â

I fucking hate this
Â

Yes, things are getting better, but it is happening
sooo ssslllooowwwly
that I sometimes wonder if I would be better off, you
know?
Â

Then, I think about the details of what opioids would
mean in our
current society (illegal heroin or “legal”
methadone).Â

And the human
manipulation that is attached to that.
Â

That is the paradox.Â

Damned if you do.Â
Damned if you don’t.Â
Â

I guess it comes down to faith in my own abilities
without opioids.
Â

Fatigue gets old, real old.
Â

How would you feel if people you cared about are
starving emotionally
because of your inability to be strong?
Â

I’m feeling a bit like a burnout right now.
Â

Anyways, thanks for reading me whine I guess.Â

I wonder if sending
this
is healthy or unhealthy.Â

Who knows.
Â

Re: questions (more I learn the less I know[so true]);
I’m reminded of
that fixx song ‘one thing leads to another’
Â

Re: aftercare?  why assume what is true for one is
true for all?
Â

Re: “wisdom” cut teeth?, umm yeah, that hurts.
Â

Re: right now?Â

I think I’m going to go new; going
with the chick who turned me on to heroin, but has
since kicked and is
going to school to be a nurse.Â

She is good people, and more
importantly, she is real people.
Â

Begin forwarded message:

From: Jason Bursey <jasonburseyiboga@yahoo.ca>
Date: September 16, 2004 12:10:57 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For n
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

nruhtra@dsskcorp.com

Beatriz Brasil <beatrizbrasil@netvigator.com> wrote:
I lost my emails of the last few days – and your
e-mail address with
them.
How are you doing today?
Beatriz
Â

Begin forward age:

Thinking of you.Â

Someone in dallas can relate to you, for real.Â
Â

spiral before I fuck up
& get a habit to find the
strength to stay clean

not trying to be a downer to yall
,Im just feeling real alone & need to
connect with my birds of a feather.
pattern repeating & fucking
stop it!Thanks for the ear,I love phantom Lotsof in
response uncertain shown lasting possibly
direct showing the
long lasting.

being
sequestered in
fat and converted to released.

Any clarification of this matter appreciated.

I dunno nuttin’ ’bout none o’ dat. C know eviL . here
No- oh nevermind.

But, uhm, to just SHARE my own personal subjective
observations… If
you have relatively low bodyfat levels, that NEAT
glowy feeling,
seems
to do an exit stage left, after a few days. Maybe a
week, 10 days
tops. And 10 days is stretching the boundaries of
Patrick.
Just my Wishful Thinking

take some action to interrupt the downward spiral

opiates,seems like cravings
are triggered by having opiates in your system,
semantics
craving now dental done wrote
scripts, literally asked to write out what I wanted,so
I wrote
junkie,the legal kind.

the truth is ,im back to that see what i can get
away with mentality,I hate that!

I get in trouble when I keep
stuff secret
so here I am fessing up!

no one can fix this but me

,Im not asking for redemption

,its just hard
to explain

take some action to interrupt the downward spiral &
need to
connect with my birds of a feather. pattern repeating
& want to love

Dr. Robert Temple, director of the F.D.A.’s office of
medical policy,
Said:
Â

Do you realize how ridiculous your posts are?

There are many ways to learn in life.

write up how your the next jim morrison, to

shooting it all up and being a junkie living
on the street?  transferring other irritations onto
Get a fucking life.
unless
it is full of something positive. Discussion?
I guess there is in the background 😉 its too bad
your not that good
at being
a person (wants a little
attention?) LOL, sounds familiar.
LOL, sounds familiar.
  why do you keep reading and writing to a
drug oriented list with rock star charisma? Sorry, but
I don’t follow
your logic.
Â
I have never ever
read
anything at all BUT negative suicidal bullshit adds
nothing but
irritation to my day(night/morning). Â  if you freak
every time, you’ll
never make it.
even if it’s done in a very psycho and
confrontational way
  criticism and negativity exist.   I choose how I
react to it.

Â

especially since Patrick is a friend of mine. Â  I
think people

have

mentioned that 100000000 times. into an alpha state.
Rest should
follow.

I kinda like balance, You at least can be irritating
AND amusing AND
seriously deep too-

Â

Why are you so hostile?

Sorry about peeving you

Â

The dark can only be dispelled by the light. Otherwise
it overtakes it.

Â

Lets make this list a good place to be and not allow
negative forces
drag it down.

Â

Let the sun shine in!

Â

especially once I realize it gets to the point that
you almost feel
like you know and care about people Or is that too
damn positive?

Â

Â

you can

start

fresh.

Â

*applause*

even more for following through with it.

I hope you feel dignity.
sept 11 = 11 days no dope – cant type

too
much,

just want all to know
cold turkey is still alive,
when does misery end?
<3 n.
ps. i love you all.

” As soon as you trust yourself, you will know how to
live.” Johann
Wolfgang von Goethe. This information is quoted from
the book “Internal
Family Systems Therapy” by Richard C. Schwartz ”
May the Schwartz Be w/th y0U,

Sounds like a good idea.Â

I believe that no human being is all one
thing, as in all junkie or all addict if you prefer.Â

now involves
looking at all the various parts, letting them talk,
letting them make peace with each other.Â

Currently I am encouraging
the part of me that wants to move on and leave the
dope (H) and coke
alone and move forward in my life.Â

That’s the part that sought out
this.

All is Lost?

Perhaps.

What are the limits of Love.

http://www.baylorhealth.com/webapps/nursery/babydetail.aspx?babyid=65133
Â

Birds in a cage flap wings in my perifial vision
while family
visits.Â

Out of the city, into the country,

visit horses.Â

Last “symbol” before
I left was clearly in reference to HCL .Â

It was an electric bug light
lol, how steriotypical lol

Hard to put into words but really helped finalize some
of the shyt,
which seems long overdue.
Â

Areas of work?Â

re-define “looking glass self” ie separating the
jason
from the junkie in my own mind and I find that one of
my main vices to
overcome is a lack of focus.Â

I am very, very scattered.Â

Have
trouble
focusing…Like I caught ADD or somtin.Â

Also, I am curious about when
“fatigue” becomes chronic.Â

Yes, in comparison to how I would have
felt walking through sick without ibo, much is way
better.Â

policies of methadone clinics, how patient rights are

not there and all the people that suffer as a result.Â

Let it go.Â

Play
your hand.  It is what it is.Â

Where do we go from here?

“Let go of all the brainwashing.”
Â

So 2 request?Â
 F
ocus.Â
Â
Stength.
Â
Focus.
Â
Stength.
Tar
zan
Education.
Learn Family, then families.
Focus.
Strength.
Focus.
A
Â
Â

“It’s real in the field.” http://www.tcbap.org/
 J
111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

1111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
Â
Â
Â
Â
Â
Â

From [ibogaine]

The Necessary Organ(s):
Reply-To: mindvox
Â

http://lansbury.bwh.harvard.edu/Useful_links.html

http://www.fastercures.org/sec/resources

F.Y.I.

Â

Their is plenty Marc wants people to write to, not
just him. Â

www.pot-tv.ca is covered with people to write.Â

For example:

Â

Write Irwin Cotler, tell him to Free Marc Emery and
Renovate Canadian
Cannabis Laws.

Â

Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada

284 Wellington Street

Ottawa, ON

K1A 0H8

Cotler.I@parl.gc.ca

Denise Rudnicki

Director of communications

Denise.Rudnicki@justice.gc.ca

Â

Mylene Dupere Press Secretary

Mylene.Dupere@justice.gc.ca

Â

main phone: 613 992 4621

Â

The Criminal Code gives the Minister of Justice the
power to review a
conviction to determine whether there may have been a
miscarriage of
justice. This power has been part of Canada’s justice
system since the
original Criminal Code of 1892. Today, the Minister’s
power to review
convictions is set out in sections 696.1-696.6 in Part
XXI.1 of the
Criminal Code.

Â

:

THE C(R)ASH.
Its not an easy road but were not alone in this and I
have to believe
that once the seed is planted it will continue to
guide you if you let
it.
God bless. -M.

   It helps more then it may appear.

Be Well,
Â

its been very
healing to be in the old haunts for the right reasons.
I believe, for
me everything that comes up, uncomfortable as it might
be at times,Â

is
an opportunity on some level to either make peace with
a certain
situation, or place, or feeling, or whatever, and then
move on.

I mean,
the thought is always there but having a choice and
making the best
decision at the time makes me feel stronger and
stronger or further and
further out the other end.Â

This is not me testing myself but more
reinforcing that my life can have a lot more purpose
than it ever has
in the past. I know longer need forÂ

my identity to be lost in chasing
junk and all that goes with it. Life has so much more
to offer if we
just let the process work.
Nothing however hasÂ

gotten to Â
me

seeing some of these
wonderful people
who I’ve met recently
go back out. Intellectually I
understand it completely

my heart still hurts when I seeÂ

that pain
first hand.Â

I guess from a selfish prospective maybe it reminds
me how
close I always am to giving it all back but I think
even moreÂ

it has
to
do with the idea that well it just breaks my heart to
see people come
so far and to lose it. Ugh! I’m still completely
unable to make peace
with that one yet.

Its not an easy road but were not alone in this

and I have to believe
that once the seed is planted
it will continue to guide you
if you let  it.
bless. -M.

I’m not going to copy/paste a couple of pages blindly
from a website
to help credit my point but ‘I believe’Â

I think you can draw your’ own conclusions from this
.

whatever.

stare into eyes
and the lights are on,

but

home.

I’m interested in hearing how successful combinations
of extract and
HCL are for addiction interruption objectives.Â

Â

Â

Â

“

What
Ails
thee?

”

Â

Â

Â

Â

increase the level of

 other ways and means, which is vital to brain cell
communication.

Â

risks involved in the ritual use of

stepped out in the Texas sunlight The cops all stood
around Old
Kilowatt ran 50 yards Then threw himself down on the
ground They might
as well just have laid The old man down And weʼre
gonna raze, raze the
prisons To the ground Help us raze, raze the prisons
To the ground ©
1971, 1972 Chandos Music (ASCAP)

Â

I think organizing is a wonderful idea.Â

Doing so without breeding
dogma will be tricky.Â

I think the boldest thing that could be done is to
open a church right
here in the US.Â

A real, certified and sincere church.Â

I think this
is
the most productive path, but I know little.Â

Who can deny iboga is a divine plant.

It is so great to hear about so much action.Â

‘Tis Inspiring.

Â

not so big pill
Reply-To: mindvox.com
Â
Â
Â

UFO dentists from planet anaesthesiaÂ

came to visit, had to write them
a
hot check just for them to look at me.Â

I think they put me under and
gang raped my jaw with and withoutÂ

their sadist dentist tools …then
they give script of 30 Watson’s for pain, which is a
fucking joke.
Â
Â

these damn Vic’s  are a fucking joke.Â
One a
day, who does that dose level work on really!!???,
cause it is a sugar pill
when I take just one, eventually I take just under the
acetaminophen
limit and feel the pain dull a very little bit,
obviously causing me to
run out quickly, so now I take gin and xanex, which
sucks ass as a pain
killer.Â

So if all my receptors and shit have been ‘re-set’ why
is this the
case?Â

Was it due to my methadone dose being so high that my
bio-chem’s
still aren’t up to par?Â

Shelly,
Â

I very much agree with Preston that taking the 12
step, “well all that
time is gone now” approach may not be the best.Â

The fact is, you
haveÂ

NOT used more then you have used for, did I hear
correctly 3
months?Â

Don’t let that shame/guilt or whatever bring you
down.Â

You
are where you are now, not yesterday or whatever.Â

Just learn from it
and let it go.Â

Know you aren’t alone.Â

And when I say that it isn’t
as
some slogan to put on a bumper sticker
Â
Sometimes, when I first stopped after iboga, I felt I
had to be perfect
because I felt like the iboga/ine salesman or
spokesman or whatever
(obviouslly an ego trip) and that prevented me from
looking at some of
the leftover stuff that I had to look at without
iboga/ine.Â

Everyone
is different though and I don’t want to project my
experience as
yours.Â

Find your own path.Â

And please Talk soon.
Â

You have merely
“slipped,”
you are not a loser, nor a bad person for having done
so.

We
are
all
or we used to be and
still
could be at the drop of a hat.

But one slip doesn’t make a “thrown
away” nor
should you dwell on the guilt and shame.

it’s ok

amazing
and
brilliant
keep your chin up
slip does not a bad person make
we
need
all perspectives

humbly

Letting off steam
Re:Q st
Patrick,
Â
overwhelmed by how much their is to do.
Â
Yes, I’m “Mr.263” but I got tired of hearing myself
say that, as it is
helping to define my present by the ‘fucked up-ness’
of the past.Â

Am I the one Marc gets excited about?Â

I seriouslly doubt it.Â

First
of all, I’m not female,
2nd of all, I was a little nervous about putting all
my
eggs in one basket, so to speak. Â

they find it more reliable.Â

I never relapsed back to methadone since my first dose
of extract late
June of 2003.Â
Â

So I’m the 263 guy, wish I heard of more high dose
methadone kicks Â
Â

cutting it.
Â

guess couldn’t handle the pressure.Â

“<shrug>”
Â

How’z yoU?Â

Find any interesting brains lately?
Â

For some reason I have suspended within my mind the
concept of
you and 263mgs of methadone. Are YOU the guy Marc
was always all
excited about over the phone…? i.e., are you the
person who kicked
that much methadone, using the Indra materials…?

If this is you… It would rock if you could write
some kinda
experience piece, thought-thing, collection of
experience; so we
could
place it online somewhere. See, nobody has ever
written any fucking
thing about Indra and using it to kick high-dose
methadone; ‘cept
like
random, mostly incoherent blips and bursts, from sum
of Sara’s
patients
who are still fLyIng, and haven’t touched back down
yet.

You haz…

Whut was it like…?

This would be a cool collection of experience to set
down, because
nobody else has ever done it.

Just my thoTs… \

perhaps this isn’t what you wanna do at all,
but I am
flipping
through a lot of ibogaine
material

right now; and this
particular series of moments suspended within time
don’t exist yet.

Patrick

Cock’s Liquors
Reply-To: mindvox
“…then we’re nothing but the nerds they say we are.”
Â

Here’s some interesting links I’m sure youÂ

have all seen before, but
just in case I’m not the only one here still learning.
Â

very interested in what they have
learned.Â
Â

http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Exhibit/2869/gabon.htmlÂ
(nice pics)
Â
————————————————————————

———————–
Regarding heroin vs. methadone.Â

if
heroin
was legal in a clinic setting, I’d say go for it.Â

But it’s not, and
so
black market “gee, hope this isn’t a hot shot”, spend
too much time
scoring or attempting to score, etc.Â

Plus, at least for me,
compulsion
seems allot harder to keep in control with heroin
rather then ‘done.Â

But you are right, heroin is a short acting and
methadone a long
acting.Â

So what.Â

Both can be kicked with ibo.Â

Especially if
starting
new business, why throw heroin into the mix?Â

And I am also curious,
why stop Methadone Maintenance  in the first place, do
you have a warrant or
something that means you must stop methadone this
moment or else?Â

I’m
curious why you don’t have the time to save for ibo
treatment.Â

At
least get your business footing on the ground first,
let it find it’s
legs first?Â

You would know better then me. Â

I think you know the
right
path, although, it may not be the easy one.Â

Or keep asking more
peope,
perhaps one will give youÂ

an answer you want them to give : )
Â

“We need a good chemist.”

Is Music good or bad post iboga?
So the issue comes up about whether music is a good
(defining good as adds benefits to individuals and
society)  or bad (detrimental to individual and/or
society).  And whether the intent of listening or
making sound influences the result of the objective
i.e. the reason for listening in the first place.

Does music help or harm, and how do we define music?

Obviously many objectives can be presented for sound.
In early human ritual, spiritual music, and in the
20th century in our secularized science world view,
psychology often fills the void that popular dogma too
often falls short for some who may prefer a different
spiritual approach to music then there local group
worship may not perceive as spiritual.  Who is to say
what sound is a secular sound and what is not?

So have we full explored the potential of sound as a
means to personal fulfillment, personal advancement
and even perhaps as a social tool?  Is the placebo
effect sometimes required?  How can we measure the
effects of set and setting when the very tools used to
measure may or may not disrupt or effect the result in
some way.  What are the limits of psychology’s world
view and is it simply biochemistries fill in until the
results come in?  Who will sponsor the research for
these “cures” to become available to the people who
need them, and what motivates them to do what they do?
What are the limits of evaluating something
objectively?  Can people heal
“emotionally:/spiritually from sound?  How much of a
significance should sound play in ones life?  Is it
adding or taking?  Is it delivering on it’s healing?
Is it worthwhile?

So here are two tapes one ambient, relax, reading
music, doing something else sound.
The other is various blank tape cut-ups of radio only,
made without the intention of anyone else ever hearing
it.  The objective was therapeutic, not entertainment.
It can express part of my iboga journeys that simply
cannot be expressed by other ways or medians.  I find
each way of expression has it’s own abilities to
express that which otherwise would have to remain
un-expressed.  And when I say this I mean not only
that expressed by humans, or animals, plants or
insects, but that which is the complex rhythmic
structure of two ends of a aluminum can blowing down a
street.  When these things are noticed, the direction
of the wind, the “higher” seems more accessible in our
thought patterns, providing a constant reminder of the
divinity and universal uniqueness of  everything.
Like schools of fish, birds coming with the seasons.

Also sometimes the best way to banish a negative is to
let it feedback until it pops, this can be dangerous
and I would only do as a last resort but if it gets
bad enough a roll of the dice can sometimes be better
if stuck in pattern.  I do think that the negative
expressed as best as what sounds are available and
then cut those expressions of negativity thus
releasing the individual from the control of that
negativity.  The trick is not confusing the map with
territory.  It means nothing without both intention
AND follow up, regarding actions.

Noise can be a good expression of negative.  In my own
experience radio frequency noise (when dial isn’t on a
station) express allot of the spy vs. spy energy
regarding ibogaine visions of molecular computers.  My
HCL vision was much more “scientific” then the iboga
plant extract which contains all the alkaloids of the
plant and to me personally seems more balanced.  I
would say the only way I could express the difference
is extract is like eating an orange, HCL was like
eating frozen orange juice concentrate out of the can.
Another way I might express the difference between
the two with me personally is extract was like a
volume knob, HCL was like an equalizer with one
frequency  turned up with the other frequencies down.

I read for about a year before my first dose.  And I
feel that it is likely that what I read and my
impressions very likely effect how my journeys turned
out and my reactions and my post journey evaluation.
The problem was a synthetic opioid.  I used a plant
cannabis as a sincere sacrament.  My first dose of
“ibo” was in the form extract.  The last thing I saw
before going to the building of where I was to be
dosed, was a small fragile iboga plant in the window
of Marc Emery’s BC Marijuana Party Building.  I was
given my treatment at no cost (at a time some charge
$10,000 for dose), and the thoughts and confusion of
why me?  The thought of some random act of compassion,
and what does it say about me that I suspect political
motives, because I didn’t see value in me, and didn’t
understand what he saw.  This is why I said nothing on
the way to the dose, even though, in any other
circumstance I would have been taking the opportunity
to learn as much as possible.
Their was allot of shame in excepting his offer, that
is another reason I said so little on the ride over,
he was nice enough to take the time to pick me up,
drive me, and assisted the dosing.  One of my favorite
memories of sound is hearing Marc strum the black
acoustic guitar in the “living room” of the apartment,
while I was in the “bedroom” just about to swallow a
handful of extract.  The pills of extract, probably
due to me throwing them up and them re-capping them
and giving back, seemed to come endlessly.  Like Marc
was that Grandfather that pulls quarters out of your
ear, he kept pulling iboga extract.  When he informed
me methadone wasn’t available and the only other way
to administer would be via enema I kept the pills down
after that.  But their was much shame in solidifying
how bad it had become, and knowing that I would
forever be indebted to this man.  Even if I paid back
the cost.

I wouldn’t have dosed me if I were him.
Bob Marley says “don’t let a politician lend you a
favor.”  But I so much didn’t understand why he would
basically save me from what I had cornered myself into
I had to assume that it was a misperception of some
kind and I didn’t want to ruin that misconception as
it was my only life raft from the police, who do not
give methadone in jail here.  I say misconception
because it was and perhaps is unfathomable that I have
something to offer, that I have worth.  My Orlaam kick
really did allot of damage to me and my faith in my
own abilities, the shame of not being able to “beat
it”, and as a result of the experience, it took a much
larger dose of methadone to “stabilize me” then
before.  Prior to Orlaam cold turkey kick I was around
double digits or at the most low hundreds.  But
afterward I can honestly say that stabilization (being
not sick) didn’t happen until I was on a 263 mg/day

Sat, 31 Jul 2004 13:19:46 -0700

New ment fresh Bush Tester

“Help Is On The Way”  lol!

Yeah, that check seems to be in the mail every 4 years

from both parties.

:  )

I can’t believe (oh wait, yes I can) that TV ‘news’
has ignored yet another vital story.  I had no idea
that the whole mandatory mental health testing thing
is actually already going through in someplace in
ILL., So Bush would just be taking a ‘working program’
to a national level, which isn’t so bad right?

I’m just so amazed that they can sell the idea without
even really hiding the corporate interests of it, what
concerns me more then that they are doing it is that
they don’t even feel like they should have to hide
that it’s all about profits regardless if good or bad
long term.  I had similar thoughts when I was in jail,
they don’t even PRETEND like they are there to make
people productive members of society again or to
rehabilitate in any way (someone put in jail for hot
checks isn’t given time/guidance/pointers on how to
keep checkbook balanced),  they don’t even pretend
like it’s not just about the money.  They don’t even
pretend.  The guards talk fairly openly about that.
They make a set amount of money for each head, not to
mention they have the people do everything (trustee
Labor) except guard the inmates.  Prison and War are
good business.  And I guess, “mental health” is too.

spr.org

Nosaj

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
7/31/2004 11:30:53 AM Central Daylight Time,
HSLotsof@aol.com writes:
I think that a great deal of concern should be voiced
towards the Bush administration’s concept of testing
Americans for mental
disorders.  The issue of Bush using antidepressants
being set aside.

I am very concerned about the concept of mandatory
mental health testing.
I have not worked a lot of psych but the work I have
done exposed me to many Doctors with many ideas and
concepts of diagnosing and treating mental illness.
There are some extreme cases of psychosis that must be
treated vigorously but there are also neurosis and
other less severe psychosis whose treatments vary with
each individual Doc and patient.
I am curious to see what they plan to do when they
decide you have a mental illness? Will you be branded
or tattooed so that everyone will know at a glance who
is sane and who is not (by government definition). Or,
will you be required to be medicated and be able to
prove you are indeed following ‘their’ outlined
treatment?
This shit really worries me! I just don’t think they
will test you and then not follow through if the
results are off the graph.
I for one am very happy that, “Help Is On The Way”
lol!

don’t yet know
isn’t the
whole ibogaine voyage/speaking with the spirits thing
kinda mumbo-jumbo in
and of itself?-
Either way you will find out in a few weeks : )  Is it
different for everyone?
It didn’t’ tell me anything I didn’t already know,
yet it confirmed and
solidified a solid,
for lack of a better word, vision.

Fine line between
visualization/imagination and visions.

Lots of various creatures, like
personifications of energy like visiting a spirit
animal zoo without cages.

It
is in my evaluation of these and comparing to where I
am now and where I would
like to be etc.

One thing I read people doing after dose is picking
up old
personality like out of habit like putting dirty
cloths back on.

A blank canvas
can be a scary thing.

Are their enough heartbeats in a lifetime?

Perhaps this is why people find multiple doses so
beneficial, because can
prepare better to get the most out of the experience,
which hopefully is good.
I think ‘insight’ or ‘dogma’ or whatever you want to
call it is very relative,
you will get out of it as much as you put into it,

it is
important to take a look at
if the ‘insight’ is a liability or an asset in the
long run.

What is your plan for pain management post ibogaine?

Where will you get your
energy from when it supposed to be over?

Will it take away all of sick?

How
much are you willing to walk through without it?

Are eggs all in one
basket case?

allot of John Cage’s Diary   RE:alistic
I probably wouldn’t be the best person to ask if
something is cool or not.

I do however think that it is really good and really
needed to see more of a religious instead of only
recreational tone that they generally take with herb.
We will see.  I see my role more and more as to be
there for people after they post-iboga (especially
visual and music) eventually.

now I have to start over on beginnings started with
school funding and with job, but I hope in the end it
will be worth it.

Better opportunities.

if they post-phone it again I’ll learn how to cut the
damn things out myself.

it would be really nice to come and see you.

will happen with good  time and good action.

who’s to say what does and does not really exist?

My son’s plant is going to be on the High times with
this tag on it.

I’m starting a treatment for H addiction on Friday,
poor guy will pay me the Iboga and one day stay.

Tuesday one Irish guy from Belfast will come for the
second time , also no money just covering cost

But then first week of august a lady will come from
Israel for Alcohol abuse.

Then I lost track, I have no agenda no paper work.

All that paper work make it complicated.

From Monday to Friday I have free, cleaning the house
and doing a lot of washing for the kids.

Next week two of my daughters are off or kids Camp,
school rush is starting two weeks from now.

Hey, don’t get depressed just know that it is a matter
of few days and will be sorted then your life start
new road.

I think of you, sending you good vibe.
Sara

I hope this finds you well and in good health and
spirits.

“Be Strong.         Love”

I’m curious to see reaction after the new beginning
that is coming, and then the reaction to the reaction
(re-evaluation of the journey

Remember you are not alone during such energy
shifting.

prescribed some barbiturates head was really swimming
will likely not take them again

It was good for the soul.

wash with warm water and sea salt

You will get your brain activated by feeling the pain
and your brain will reduce the pain by it self.

Don’t think about it too much ,
go to an acupuncturist after the treatment
, it will do you good to find new ways

Rotting from the inside
Over-incubated by the heat of fear and love
The self’s coagulated
Egg…
La la la la la la la
Boiling hard in euphemism
Slowly becoming part of the water
Like a frog who never knows
The jacuzzi’s getting hotter
How’d you know I was looking at you
If you weren’t looking at me?

A stagnant pale perfume
Conceived to block the pores
The clotting glands encroach
The endless comfort of a mom
Deep inside my tanning salon
Wishing life was poached
I can’t seem to differentiate
Between the yellow love you give and the white sex I
take
I just want to fertilize youThe cracks finally appear
Release cholesterol tears
The flooded cyst drains itself of pus
The lonely stomach chills unless it’s drunk
So as she drives she’ll close her eyes
Feel it warming up inside
Rotting from the inside
Over-incubated by the heat of fear and love
The self’s coagulated
Egg…
comes out of a chicken
Oh a chicken comes out of an egg

There’s no place like home…
Ohrm babby yeah.

Elm, the person who gave me my first joint and first
hit(s) of ‘cid, is at a make or break point, as it
seems most are at the moment.  It is a new moon but 2
weeks of political ads, so who knows when the time is
right.
Milk,
Bueno=BOO x’s 3
Thank you for the close callf
Howard the
can’t duck the question
Watch ya M0NT TransLvainYa
Leads to?  Bet your blood yet?
Sorry my blood was given to me after birth.
Damn, dna too?
Or do you “assume” that too?
In the only dispelled by the light.
Stop being shell shocked.
H-arvest Time.
Whatcha got?

Various Visual Ideas to put to on Film set to the
following Audio (Don’t forget to Play)

11mY twilight time Solo Piano edit
Visual starts with middle eastern man weeping Vincent
Gallo in bathroom style.  Like a bouncing ball edits
of Abu Garab  come in (fast blinking pictures start
slow, then get faster eventually blurring the two
times together.  Try blinking to the beat of a
bouncing ball and you’ll see; images include dogs
barking, hooded me, angry ‘end of the Graduate
wedding’ mouths, etc. eyes, before the edit gets fast,
911 plane hitting on odd numbers( 2: dog barking 3:
plane fly toward building 4: hooded prisoner 5: plane
fly closer 6: etc 7: closer  8 9 nose hits start of
explosion 10 11 (4 or 5 for plane impact, 8 or more
for before impact)_

After that,  Buddha burning should dominate as the
main reference point, time elapsed close up of flowers
blooming like Bad Religion’s Atomic Garden.  Mixed in
with time elapsed film of various animals decaying
(nin concert style)_ film of heroin being shot up as
well as film of women puking from heroin sick is
essential,  the burning Buddha dominates more and more
as Film of Various Bwiti Sects are edited in like the
beginning of DCD toward the within.  Edits of various
animals fucking, slow motion film of water dropping,
overlay and juxtapose water ripples, at 3 min 45 when
only Sine Waves, stay on picture of Cenote man in Pool
that Sara ask about.

1NESTA my Natural Mystic 1min
Underground, getting Spirit messages past agents of
control.  Easiest workable paradigm is agents of
control act similar to Software designed to define the
Beats Per Minute (BPM) number of a song.  It cannot
predict a cd skipping.  So if two or more individuals
take the same Spirit medicine with open heart they can
communicate using the Spirit(s) as a reference point
to help define what otherwise would appear as rambling
non-sense noise.

1Underwater Torch Sara the Iboga Spirit from Holland
School of Dolphins swimming in beautiful Blue Pacific
somewhere in Warm Polynesian Waters

7-dimensional space is controlled by so called
Superintelligence G-BETA, which is located in 7th
dimension.
13-dimensional space is controlled by
Superintelligence G-ALPHA, which is located in 13th
dimension.
33-dimensional space is controlled by
Superintelligence S-ALPHA, which is located in 33rd
dimension.

What are Superintelligences actually doing?
They control everythink and they take care of
everythink.
because it has insight into God – not his thoughts but
into his databases.
And yes, there’s still a lot concerning rays,
but unfortunately we won’t be able to discuss it all
because it exceeds frame of our conversation.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/jesus/jefferson.html

Jefferson omitted the words that he thought were
inauthentic and retained those he believed were
original. The resulting work is commonly known as
the
“Jefferson Bible.”

i read that book at the moment, tried to read it
before but never got
into it like now. this cuts of perceptions,
association lines and
visions are really alive. changed the way i walked
around outside
today, all the time the attention on something
different, cars move by,
a yellow curtain, gestures, different lines of
thinking, words and bits
of music in the sound, not really i mean, and so
on,
constantly cut up.
made things kind of clearer. a function also on
other levels i think.

burroughs was very choosy doing them actually,
cutting pages for hours
until he had a few bits that would relate images
of
dreams and visions,
like my secondary literature tells me. quality
cutting kind of,
randomness used for unrandom results.

is the reality film prerecorded?
maybe, prolly not though.
are your actions predetermined?
not as thought out as they should be no.
Predetermined?? by what?  probably more
impressionable
then predetermined.
is meat murder?
depends if their is a war or not
does my own judgment inhibit myself?
yes.
do others exist?
yes.
possibilities.
Am 02.05.2005 um 18:11 schrieb Morning Wood:
I’d rather feel the Earth
beneath my feet
yes I wood
if I only could
I surely wood
When I used to visit my father in san Francisco,
their
were plenty street music people, one group from
central america.
need new software…oh and food, but mostly
new
software
accidental feed vain art culinary specified
vague
gauge hydraulic hymn machine priest soft erect
may
pole ribbon weave love sunflower inanimate
becoming
animate caricature past spin mirror outward
direction
boomerang or simply boom
http://www.answers.com/topic/caricature?method=8
So my skin stopped being yellow.  I started, I am
told, to talk.  I am told I returned briefly to baby
talk after Father had to leave.
I was lucky in that almost all of my family worked for
airlines so were able to travel and see more then
would have otherwise.  “Old dad” in San Mateo (Bay
Area), go to see during summer.  Some of my fondest
memories are of being in Hawaii as a child, good
Polynesian energy.

Etc. who the fuck cares about the details.

What you done the last year?

Just banished some negativity?  Did I bother sowing
any seed?  Did I discard possibilities?  Write a “4th
step” while others bleed? Get down or lay down.
Everything is connected to it is connected to
Everything.  Assume it won’t effect who?  Have you
really thought this through?  Out of sage? Roll some
time/tyme, swat the flies, concave reflection of t.v.
in glass eyes while glow of computer screen?  stay
teachable.  CIA screen? It’s not just me.  Can’t hold
understanding back.

Date:    Fri, 19 Mar 2004 phantom scribble, in
fact
hmm lets see a couple of other ignorant cloned
virus’s, nothing ticking at your request have the
circuit board one, the rest are
schematic keys
I’ve seen <KaboOm!> before:
http://www2.aros.net/~lambo/ibogaine/ibogaine.htm

JPL and their whole entire, “Not
for Human Consumption!” catalog.
HCl *is* eaisier to drop dead
on than the extract, though, not exactly.
listen to a miX of pretty much everything
cool and abstract
Howard sent me a letter of encouragement and a book of
stamps and $10 bill–I was really touched by that, I
never asked him for anything

Know that you aren’t alone in your journey…and it
sounds like it will be a
productive one.

Remember we all look up at the same stars and sun
and breathe
the same air,
and act and react from
desire and fear,
what are the limitations
of (fill in the blank)?
Eventually leads to what are the limitations of asking
‘what are the limitations of (fill in the blank).
…i’ll puff some buddha
and exhale a blessing
Brooke Burgess >Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004, 7:27 PM
sounds like naturally bravery to me…you’re blessed

I’m a pretty fearful person, and hide behind myriad
masks.
behind each of them the nature of the tangled roots
that feed from soil.  garden
in sunlight.

“DON’T PANIC”, test dose
ease into the experience
some inner dialogue asking
why am i feeling anxious?
million different question/answer dialogue
an opportunity to find the root
reevaluate the situation from a different perspective

Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+
(defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as
was the experience a pleasant one or
not)
…I assume all journey’s have lessons
stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but
8 months of diarrhea isn’t fun either
vast unimaginable sick
mental reaction to what’s left of sick has changed;
like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable,
and iboga very much helps to not
let the persistence of sick get to me
and it gradually gets better,
exhausted as
fuck, but better.

“the only way around this shit is through”

isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to
exciting journey
yet perhaps harsh teacher,
, some reality just isn’t pretty
herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to
a non-smoker who
panic attacks and see

my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a
opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily
“iboga didn’t do it
dude, you did it!!”  I don’t think either one is
completely correct.  I’m not
sure which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just
happy the cracks are being
filled.  Not sure if either one could have done it
without the other.

Date:    Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:49:

“This is a great time to do iboga, just after the
Spring equinox,
traditionally a time when light overtakes dark, so all
the signs are most
auspicious. I’m going to do some myself later today.
Can’t wait!”
-Nick

http://www.nzz.ch/2004/01/24/english/page-synd4661691.html

“Ten years of heroin handouts fixes drug crime”; be
easier to kick then long lasting opioids?  Big moral
difference to some between short and long lasting I
guess.  Interesting harm reduction reading non the
less.

Didn’t Tim L. talk about wondering how much
information/reality the human mind can stand? How much
knowledge can the human brain/mind take before it is
overwhelmed?  Very serious stuff to consider I guess.

I’ve had bad/panic type experiences on LSD (the person
I dropped with was convinced that his was cut with
poison and a few hours later when I finally got
distance from them I started thinking “I took the same
thing they did” and bam, panic etc.  Yes, on LSD and
X;, but never on natural ones like shrooms or
mescal/peyote; iboga wasn’t like any of these, it
definitely has it’s own character and personality–.
To be honest, I was scarred shitless beforehand of
going through it. Sickness is bad enough by itself,
sick while tripping (takes me back to my Laam cold
turkey kick (4 hours of sleep in 6 weeks–beyond
unspeakable pain); so yeah, iboga lasting as long as
it does…disserves not fear but respect.  My biggest
fear with it is biting off more then can chew then
being stuck for so long in that harsh lesson; respect
it, learn it, but fear it? I haven’t felt ‘out of
control’ on iboga; Ego seems to be able to be present,
discarded or kept at your choice…too often we  put
back on our armor out of habit after the experience, i
went to jail afterwards and that definitely made shit
worse in that regard, more hardened, less
trusting…which is the direct opposite of what iboga
told me was the way……Sometimes a mind blinder is
just what was needed.  I am a little biased in this
but for me: lsd only scatters, iboga scatters then
re-focus’s; it was very spiritual, but remember when I
say this that the basics of Buddha:

1. All life is suffering

2. The cause of suffering is dukka (loosely trans. as
desire)

3. The way to graduate from suffering is through
compassion.

I would imagine a facilitator could give better
information on how often people just loose it; i’d bet
their aren’t many if everything is done in a
respectful, non-arrogant, and teachable way.

I got hit with a bombshell today…Few weeks back had
the roughest time I had yet and HAD to talk to
someone….so not being experienced in international
calls from Texas I call Sara (www.iboga.tk) and she
was compassionate enough to talk to me for…lets
see…(flipping through ‘war&piece’phone
bill)….about 149 minutes…I felt much better
afterwards and she didn’t make a dime off of talking
to me.  I had no idea…the phone bill came
today…..$750   Stuff like that will make me like
SdBarrett, not iboga : “The dark side of public floyd”
by Pink Enemy
In the ’60’s, there was much talk of a soldier gone
AWOL named private Floyd. Rumor had it that this
soldier learned how to grow marijuana in his armpits
,distill LSD in his bladder and harvest opium in his
nostrils. This resulted in a state of intoxication so
intense that individual parts of his body would
suddenly detach and launch themselves into orbit
around the sun. One night Pink Enemy, avid astronomers
that they are, noticed a new binary system consisting
of two kneecaps orbiting what appeared to be an
imploded human brain. Having divined that these were
indeed the mortal remnants of legendary private Floyd
,they wittily decided to name the system “public
floyd”, and in tribute composed this touching elegy.

“Sliding scale” clinics could be the way to go
I was handed notice at Methadone clinic last week that
my insurance has decided I do not need Methadone
Maintenance anymore. Reason given was “According to
the records your provider sent to us, our Doctor feels
Methadone Maintenance is no longer needed.”
I of course got angry…….then filed an appeal. I
asked her what she had in mind for ‘us’ to do

I don’t know his motives or any of that.

he did treated me FOR FREE (paging Dr. Mash) which
nobody  would have nor will they do.

I’m sure  you  have moral authority and high ground
on this issue.

Sometimes I think I’m the most selfish person in the
world, then I read
this list and feel much better.
A Bong is made  mostly of glass and a joint of
rolling papers.RIGHT?
is this a big deal or
something?
There is something unspeakably pure about hobo art,
like unnoticed colors of 3rd world sunsets.  I think
children and the insane are far more likely to make
good art.  No question about that.

( Resume Fake it ‘till you make it bullshit)

I . . . who took the money?
Who took the money away?
I,i,i . . . it’s always show time
Here at the edge of the stage.
I, i, i, wake up and wonder
What was the place?

What was the name?
We want to wait

but here we go again…

I . . . takes over slowly
But doesn’t last very long.

I,i,i . . . no need to worry
Everything’s under control.

O – u – t

but no hard feelings.
What do you know?

take you away.
We’re being taken for a ride again.
I got a girlfriend that’s better then that
She has the smoke in her eyes.
She’s moving up, going right through my heart
She’s going to give me surprise
Better than this,

know that it’s right.
I think you can if you like.
I got a girlfriend with bows in her hair
And nothing is better than that

(is it?)

Down, down in the basement
We hear the sound of machines.
I, i, i, i’m driving in circles.
Come to my senses sometimes.

Why, why, why, why start it over?
Nothing was lost, everything’s free.
I don’t care how impossible it seems.

Somebody calls you but you cannot hear
Get closer to be far away.
Only one look and that’s all that it takes
Maybe that’s all that we need.

All that it takes,

all that it takes
All that it takes,

all that it takes

I got a girlfriend that’s better than that
She goes wherever she likes.

(there she goes…)

Now everyone’s getting involved.

As we get older

And stop making sense

You won’t find her waiting long.

Stop making sense

Stop making sense

Stop making sense

Making sense

I got a girlfriend that’s better then that.

And nothing is better then this.

(or is it?)

From: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004, 5:33 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] getting ibogaine information out

I’m one of the few people who posts to newsgroups
about ibogaine and
deartheo@ziplip.com is one of the few people writing
government officials
about ibogaine.
-Howard

drugsverslaafde

camé

Drogenabhängiger

&#964;&#959;&#958;&#953;&#954;&#959;&#956;&#945;&#957;&#942;&#962;,
&#960;&#961;&#949;&#950;&#940;&#954;&#953;&#945;&#962;

droga, malato di (riferito a persona che ha un
esagerato interesse per qualcosa)

drogado (m), viciado (m)

&#1085;&#1072;&#1088;&#1082;&#1086;&#1084;&#1072;&#1085;,
&#1090;&#1086;&#1088;&#1075;&#1086;&#1074;&#1077;&#1094;
&#1085;&#1072;&#1088;&#1082;&#1086;&#1090;&#1080;&#1082;&#1072;&#1084;&#1080;,
&#1085;&#1080;&#1082;&#1091;&#1076;&#1072;
&#1085;&#1077;&#1075;&#1086;&#1076;&#1085;&#1099;&#1081;

drogadicto, toxicómano, traficante de drogas

sprutnarkoman, pundare

&#26377;&#27602;&#30270;&#32773;,
&#24223;&#26087;&#21697;&#21830;&#20154;

&#26377;&#27602;&#30318;&#32773;,
&#24290;&#33290;&#21697;&#21830;&#20154;

&#40635;&#34220;&#24120;&#32722;&#32773;,
&#12504;&#12525;&#12452;&#12531;&#24120;&#32722;&#32773;

&#8207;(&#1575;&#1604;&#1575;&#1587;&#1605;)
&#1576;&#1575;&#1574;&#1593;
&#1575;&#1604;&#1605;&#1582;&#1583;&#1585;&#1575;&#1578;
&#1608;&#1605;&#1583;&#1605;&#1606;&#1607;&#1575;&#8207;

&#8238;&#1502;&#1499;&#1493;&#1512;
&#1500;&#1505;&#1502;&#1497;&#1501;,
&#1504;&#1512;&#1511;&#1493;&#1502;

As of this moment the ‘wonderful electric grandmother’
moved in to the lives of children.
..She was all life
and all life is wondrous, quick, electrical like a
grandma.
I sing the body electric.
“Get away.  Old Junk.  Old Junk.,
‘this machine for example can
’
it’s ‘my’ voice, I heard ‘my’ voice’”
Manufacturer of cornered music instruments.
Rerun Twilight Zone Ray Brad Walt Wit Grits.

“you got to love the taste of sand to understand”

Blender

Create Temple Home Everywhere
Sacred Water

source
seems always misinterpreted
when assume path is path?
Any action beyond in-site?
If it is in benefit to forgive them
then perhaps this last year actions
have validated the realistic option of forgiving I as
well?
if not,  is it not in I&I benefit for I to forgive I?
then can ,in return, better forgive others?
which helps establish, at first cautious, mutual trust
when trying to build alliances?

Mythology of Anatomy and Physiology

“And the biggest problem is the way the problems
happen,
and consequently the ways to prevent them are
not fully understood.”
“I’d like to think of engineering
as an attempt at avoidance of failure.”
I can’t recall my ‘birth Number’

“It’s the heart I have to enter.
The child’s heart.
This is a deep place.
Difficult to reach.
But that soon will come.”

“You Make believe!! As if it were a game.  As if she
were real
”
, you’ll be surprised at what a machine can do
besides
”
‘ab (sun)ra (ca)ca (da)da (burning)bra

“Fable? or the truth?
But who’s to say at some distant moment
their might be an assembly line producing
a gentle product in the form of a grandmother
who’s stock and trade is Love.
Fable? Sure.  But who’s to say.”

“Because of  heroic delay of Isolating itself from the
grid,
it’s  generator suffered massive damage

and consequently 35 years later
wrong.”
“Put your (stars and?) stripes on!!!, time for
work!!!.”

“ ‘I know what we’ve been through.’
‘yes
. what WE’ve been through.’

Feel attached to community?
Feel community will harm ?

Depends how you define community?
Eviroment/set&setting/ritual/random/noise/visual/nothingnessN2somthingnesseed4oneAnother.
Giving without expectations?
a candle a day keeps the methadone Dr.’s away,
pro’s and con’s of accepting someone’s help.
Cornered self
on create own cross to bear
(bear vs. bull)
publishing software,
I corner self too often.
“I don’t understand you” says They Might be Giants
Insect blood Worthwhile?
Worthy of forgiveness?

Lets take a look at the report from last night.
Let’s take a look at the last year,
is ‘in-sight’ helping or causing me to talk in
gibberish
or both
or assumptions that it is multiple choice during essay
question.
Tired makes Red Liquid makes Tires meet the ground,
ground meet the tired of assuming that others will
Miss the point.

So “fan yourself” if too hot on the set and setting?

“I believe Dr. Rice will say ‘me no speak a english’”

Suggestions from Dr. Pookie.

May I speak to your manager path to 16784601056  fear
generator?
For what ‘ground gained’?

Here, hold the camera while they Rodney King.
I think their may be glass barrier/mute button between
Lab Coats and treated rat.

Puppet string glass house without telephone?

Engineers of can openers.

“A new high tech error prone system that runs the
same reliable Microsoft software that never crashes at
your home or Job.”

Take with grain of salt vs. “You see, it’s just like
the guy who sells it says.”

Investor?
Why do I Question Others motives so often?

dedicated to number sequence 6784601056
anticipate too?
Forget the name of the prison guard who desires to
roll for entertainmen

“Are you sure you want the full disclosure of human
ugliness?  So be it fool.  Guards you will press your
triggers if the prisoner pleas anything but guilty.”

Too much trustee definition memorization
Missed opportunities an opportunity?
Does it matter what loose ends to tie first?
“Poor excuse. Money please I get loose off of orange
juice”
“You can’t give understanding back
let go of the brainwashing
sprint at first sign of pattern?
Make quilt.
It wasn’t raining when Noah built the arc
“I work for mine, you, you’re freeloading like Kate O
KLin”

Click, Click, Click, Click, sound of fax machine
connection.
Sound of toilet flushing.
Wash hands with good soap,
efforts of so many to engineer underground water tap
system.
“I like your tie died shirts, where are you from
.was
it fun? (while rewind information sniper)

Grind Grid
Set Degree Diagonal Flexing Circular,
if you work  “it”
Is guilt working against I
& I and/or for I & I?
No animal eats everything.
Papaw.
One and all got to face reality

Lotus Birds eat bugs,
2 crane necks to make an 8
“I don’t know how he survived
.but he did.”
“I have twisted my ankle for God’s sake!!”
revolver “solution” seen and graduated from?

Control battery/microwave burn software
Can’t hold understanding back.

I don’t have a fish but I can learn to fish.

“For ensemble:

IT (IT is the title)

Think NOTHING
Wait until it is absolutely still within you
When you have attained this begin to play

As soon as you start to think, stop
And try to re-attain
The state of NON-THINKING
Then continue playing
-and so on
When we first played this text with our group, at a
music festival in Brussels, we purposely had not
played it before, and against all expectations, it
worked.” Page 120 (go back to keep reading)

“The Voice of the people are a voice inside of them,
and if you listen good you will know the right way.
Because there is a voice inside talking to everyone.
Seen?  Seen.”
So

Step 4 (rinse then repeat), moral inventory, whatever
that means.  Build some time.
Press Play on the box.

The insignificance started, numbers say, on 02101978.
Born Half Cajun, but with Jaundice, spinal tap, full
blood transfusion with blood from blood giving people.
So one narcissistic interpretation could perhaps be
the peoples blood runs now through I veins. Stand for
something but do not speak for people.  Fair to mother
who labored for an unhealthy baby?  She was only 17
when she wed because she thought it best for to be
less strain on family.  She was 20 when labored me,
children having children.
Too many mouths to feed to make more hunger (promotes
moral flexibility. soft machine),

Dr. Robert Temple, director of the F.D.A.’s office of
medical policy,
Said:

Do you realize how ridiculous your posts are?
There are many ways to learn in life.
write up how your the next jim morrison, to
shooting it all up and being a junkie living
on the street? transferring other irritations onto Get
a fucking life. unless
it is full of something positive. Discussion?
I guess there is in the background 😉 its too bad
your not that good at being
a person (wants a little
attention?) LOL, sounds familiar.
LOL, sounds familiar.
why do you keep reading and writing to a
drug oriented list with rock star charisma? Sorry, but
I don’t follow your logic.

I have never ever
read
anything at all BUT negative suicidal bullshit adds
nothing but irritation to my day(night/morning).  if
you freak every time, you’ll never make it.
even if it’s done in a very psycho and
confrontational way.
criticism and negativity exist.  I choose how I react
to it.

especially since Patrick is a friend of mine.  I think
people
have
mentioned that 100000000 times. into an alpha state.
Rest should follow.
I kinda like balance, You at least can be irritating
AND amusing AND seriously deep too-

Why are you so hostile?
Sorry about peeving you

The dark can only be dispelled by the light. Otherwise
it overtakes it.

Lets make this list a good place to be and not allow
negative forces drag it down.

Let the sun shine in!

especially once I realize it gets to the point that
you almost feel like you know and care about people Or
is that too damn positive?

you can
start
fresh.

*applause*

Dr. Fuzzy Lungs predictably Cuts static fear in
endless kicking cure sequence.

Until

Plucking Harmonics with Gold Teeth Coffin Drive By
Safe Lawyer for Electric Playground Microphone Forever
Reacting
Sonogram

Persistent Antithesis of Everything Perishable

Form in conjunction with connected perennial
consecutive continued endless

everlasting (p t nt) (h r  – n)  extended interminable
looped perpetual prolonged regular repeated aeon
stable unbroken
blue moon

An illustrated guide to dog’s age:

perpetuity abysmal

infinite abiding
amaranthine perdurable perpetual

Ample blanket

ecumenical global generic inclusive indiscriminate
infinite miscellaneous limitless overall panoramic in
the sweeping total of ubiquitous unconfined multi
universal with eight continuous worldwide unlimited
amaranthine enduring eternal illimitable immeasurable
(d   -s t l-môr f n )  incessant indeterminate
infinite interminable multitudinous self-perpetuating
(sp  r l)  ganglion
untold without end

CR Alder Wright (1844-1894)
C20H25N30

C17H17NO(C2H3O2)2 + C17H21NO4  (bl ng k t)
C23H31NO2
C21H27NO
C20H26N2O

Word Roots, Prefixes, Suffixes, and Combining forms:

a-, an- absence or lack   acardia, lack of a heart,
anaerobic, in the absence of oxygen

ab-  departing from, away from    abnormal, departing
from normal

acou- hearing   acoustics, the science of sound

ac-, acro-   extreme or extremity; peak
acrodermatitiis, inflammation of the skin of the
extremities

ad-  to or toward   adorbital, toward the orbit

aden-, adeno-  gland  adeniform, resembling a gland in
shape

adren-  toward the kidney   adrenal gland, adjacent to
the kidney

aero-  air   aerobic respiration, oxygen-requiring
metabolism

af-  toward afferent neurons, which carry impulses to
the central nervous system

agon-  contest    agonistic and antagonistic muscles,
which oppose each other

alb-  white   corpus albicans of the ovary, a white
scar tissue

ailment-  nourish   alimentary canal, or digestive
tract

allel-  of one another    alleles, alternative
expressions of a gene

amphi-  on both sides; of both kinds    amphibian, an
organism capable of living in water and on land

ana-  apart, up, again   anaphase of mitosis, when the
chromosomes separate

anastomos-  come together   arteriovenous anastomosis,
a connection between an artery and a vein

aneurysm  a widening   aortic aneurism, a weak spot
that causes enlargement of the blood vessel

angi-vessel   angiitis, inflammation of a lymph vessel
or blood vessel

angin-  choked    angina pectoris,  a choked feeling
in the chest due to dysfunction of the heart

ant-, anti-  opposed to; preventing or inhibiting
anticoagulant, a substance that prevents blood
coagulation

ante-  preceding; before   antecubital, in front of
the elbow

aort-  great artery   aorta

ap-, api-  tip, extremity   apex of the heart

append-  hang to    apendicular skeleton

aqua-, aque-  water   aqueous solutions

arbor  tree   arbor vitae of the cerebellum, the
treelike pattern of white matter

areola-  open space      areolar connective tissue, a
loose connective tissue

arrect-  upright   arrector pili muscles of the skin,
which make the hairs stand erect

arthr-, arthro-  joint    arthropathy, anyjoint
disease

artic-  joint   articular surfaces of bones, the
points of connection

atri-  vestibule   atria, upper chanbers of the heart

auscult-  listen    auscultatory method for measuring
blood pressure

aut-, auto-  self   autogenous, sef-generated

ax-, axi-, axo-  axis, axle    axial skeleton, axis of
vertebral column

azyg-   unpaired azygous vein,  an unpaired vessel

baro-  pressure     baroreceptors for monitoring blood
pressure

http://www.thecityofdallas.com/water/

2004.05.04@21.17

I went to federal building

I am very, very happy that I got back without being
arrested.  I had a terrible fear before going,
especially since I am going to work on first day
tomorrow, I, of course, didn’t want piss away that
opportunity.  I am under the impression I have
warrants in Grand Prairie, even though I sat out the
time in Denton, I need to contact lawyer about his
contact info.
The most powerful thing happened today
.children’s
eyes read my sign that said: Medicine Works Why
Illegal.  Also regarding spy vs. spy fear, Cop looked
over at me read sign, and I started to feel the fear,
then one person honked in support, then another honked
and another honked.  The police person heard the
honking
and then he drove off
unbelievable.
I didn’t have a video camera.

20041026Tue written on 20041027Wed 0555 (full lunar
eclipse)

Blood transfusion (jaundice) and spinal tap @ birth
Bio Dad leaves @ one
First day of school, didn’t want to go, lack
confidence
Adopted by Dad name change
Adopted Dad leaves &#61664;weekend Dad @ 12
Pete becomes Step Dad
Baseball fight
Water hose in face while penned after playfully
splashing during car wash
Overdose heart palpitations @ 15
3 years of NA brainwashing
17 move out (ignorant youth finds enablers of this
poor choice)
New Directions “Alternative” School
Meagan
Heroin&#61664;methadone&#61664;orlaam kick 4 hours
sleep in 6 weeks&#61664;genuine suicide attempts w/
shooting 90 unit heroin, coke and 120 xanex while
drinking, keep waking up
Drop 70-80 lsd, blacked out
No more cash for suicide&#61664;Methadone up to 263 to
stabilize, orlaam kick did some damage, trouble
keeping job after kick broke life essence in many
ways&#61664;no prescribed medication if arrested
No home No Erin all at once 9/11
No prescribed medication &#61664;experimental
hallucinogen medication
263 mg/day kick last year&#61664;over 60 days jail as
ibogaine aftercare for possession of joint
Drown (not on purpose), found face down in pool
resuscitated from no heartbeat&#61664;4 day coma do
not remember 4 days after wake up w/ pneumonia, brain
damage likely doctors said

Go to doctor for few things.  Back pain in mid back.
Headache when never got them before.  Wanted to follow
up on drown cause didn’t make other 4 follow ups.  And
Fatigue.

Doctor said this might be as good as I get.  Said I
can’t will myself to be better.  Trying not to throw
my hands up in the air.  Knowing Howard, Sean and
others deal with such a larger weight makes it hard to
feel sorry for self, but perhaps self loathing is a
poor replacement for self pity.

Hawaii
Warmth
Lessons

With electronic typewriters to type birth number
Where looks for hours at shoe
Of the same different.
Of mirrors and smoke and microchips and spirals
Beyond access of intellect, where sex breathes thus
life breeds.
Designed by agents of control overcome by a furry
panic
Cracks plush safe
Where ‘crack is whack’ is the phrase that pays.
In motion metamorphosis non-sense.
Where “wouldn’t you?” is injected
Where hippies can give and junkies can take.
Where you are.
That leads to somewhere.
Other then here
Where politicians talk about how dishonest politicians
are.
Where you are studied in ritual recreations of 1950’s
CIA Mind Control tests
Where clockwork has pulp.
Where eye contact is required
Where your screenplay will get read
Where your music will be heard
Where you are you and people like you
Without banishment
Without glory, but with glory holes.
That doesn’t manufacture results.
That doesn’t cherry pick anecdotal reports in any way.
With a therapist who charges less
Without diapers
Without dice
Measuring red handed
Without opioid withdrawal imagined or real
With food for children’s mouths

A place where bull runs after red slip trip trick
A place where prohibition makes sense.
A place where shouldn’t survive.
A place where all is lost in assumptions.
A place where worldview mirrors own misunderstanding.
A place where too much isn’t enough.
A place lost in fractal translation.
Like old lovers dialing telepathy.
If not then who is it?  Or what is it?
As if I can step back and separate
Loops shareware  connects dots for you now,
Don’t worry troll
Con will take care of you.
See what you want to see.
Be a student if you are one.
Busy.Honey bee scales and bunnies.
Care day.
“Oh, that wasn’t record.”
It’s red, push the button.

scribbles while text floats
This is a good example of seeing things that may or
may not be there.

I haven’t made up my mind because, well, it’s just
not that important.

If not listening, cool.  If listening, who cares?

flashes of light stunned me a bit more then should.
I didn’t anticipate a problem,
forever evolving.

“I hear G-d in these rooms” Advertising/marketing

Social Engineers irrigating Account Information
in Rehabilitation Database Pimp

Ritual Illusion from Pharmaceutical Illuminati

Answer 2 why?  Since why has no answer, asking it is a
form of escapism.  Could despair exist
without joy?

(Psst
? = avoidance)
Avoidance of what? Damn.
How do you mean? Shit
Grrr?? Yet–>?
(*with one eye)
morning breath film.
Guitar Center salesman.
Tech Support.
Bottled Air cushion
Learn to
Lots of
leftovers
in the
fridge
Which loose

Doesn’t
=

ends worth tying?
ll
Lee’s T-shirt.

Or a methadone counselor Or a sonogram

Audio wanted:  Microsoft Customer Support Quality
Monitoring Recordings of some version of me zonked out
of my head on Xanex.  Dosage amount 30-50mg/day easy,
over 100 mg on other days.  Also triple digit mg
methadone but that’s just to keep Sickness fed.

So what does this mean?  It means someone somewhere
has any Microsoft Software not work (that tends to
happen occasionally if you haven’t noticed), the MS
customer calls the Help Support Line stays on hold for
about 20 minutes and eventually gets me Blacked out of
reality in a Cubicle deep in the heart of system
giving Software Support advice that I have No idea
about.  I honestly have no idea what I came up with to
tell these people.  The supervisor has a nasty divorce
and an out of state family emergency, so my calls are
recorded but not listened to for several months if at
all.  That is one good thing that came out of my 12
cult training is the ‘fake it ‘till you make it’ meme.
In my limited experience that works well but is very
difficult to sustain.

Microsoft was where I worked when the dreaded Orlaam
flood came.
[][][][][][] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] [] []
[] []  [] []   []  []  []  []  []   [][] [] [] [] []
[]

Before care:

–What good will come out of the experience, if you
were Iboga would you give yourself a break or add to
pressure?

–Wash “set and setting”.  This can be a little vague,
due to the various levels.  Wash self, room, living
space.

–No cola or junk food.

–Have someone to talk to if you need it during the
experience, if doing alone be VERY careful and perhaps
writing a letter to self to help calm nerves etc. and
then hiding it to be found if anxiety gets too much.
Something in the theme of relax, forgive yourself now,
a list of good things about etc.

–Be aware of the season.  This can include actual
seasons as well as environmental seasons such as
political theater.

–Ask for advice, do research.

During Low dose:

–Limit amount of TV, if any.

–Keep in mind past “dreams” as the themes may be
expanded on.

–See yourself as you are.  Not what you should be or
what you are going to be, because you don’t know the
unknown factors that will effect how shyt turns out.
This should not be confused as justification to not
“push the envelope”, but you need an envelope first
before you can push it.

Who knows.

Brief Evaluations of My Favorite Mistake:

Pros:
Genuine Good hearted person
Perfect Smell
Perfect imperfections
Rare Find

Physically beautiful (Need Trophy?)
In Her Earth Eyes with shoulders forward Smiling Love
Smiles

Cons:
Security Risk by being Connected to someone Easily
taken advantage of due to (One plants seed
for the other)

Speaks and sees things in Absolutes (forever, eternity
etc..)

“Perfect”

Needy

Brings feelings of “She deserves someone who can take
care of her financially better”

Not comfortable having lives separate from one
another.

By the grace of G-d ibogaine was given to make me so
paranoid that I would never want to take the risks of
scoring Tar again.  Nope, not anymore.  Only pure, no
cut prescription kicks from now on.  It came on as a
suggestion to get on a anti-depressant or some ‘panic’
script with the now all to common anti-seizer
substitute for benzo’s, can’t remember which.  I don’t
care for either one, to put it nicely.  But must
explore this suggestion thoroughly to fully reject it.
So have to take pill.

Well
if taking a pharmacy pill daily for mood, might
as be one that works; where’s that xanex doc?

Well
Pharmacy has nice, legal, no cut, reliable doses,
but lets be honest, benzo’s are a far cry from a good
opioid, I’m tired of <enter residual withdrawal
symptom here>

But
the problem with methadone is it isn’t heroin
.and
it’s long acting and that they don’t give it if
arrested.  But mostly because it isn’t heroin.

But
the problem with heroin is umm
the problem with
heroin is

oh yeah that withdrawal thing that tends to
happen allot in non-pharmacy land.

Draining Gold Cotton &#61664;bar soap on bruised
arms.

But sure as fuck never needed anti-anxiety or
anti-depressants then, surfing that first naïve rush
to, well, you know.  Before Methadone.  Before Orlaam.

Before bullshit lullabies and greedy black holes of
cellular freezer burn.

How can ritual speedball bliss turn and drain with
such gravity?

Not only within the limits of the physical realm but
limitless psycho-spiritual?

Sometimes seems all that’s left is drain.  Waaaa
<bang> “next please.”

~papaw.*
~cenote.*

Can’t tell if falling
For Scan artist
Xeroxing Spirals
Process Scientific I-Ching
Another Reality
N Tired

Incorporating Inspiration

Create standard for advertisers to list
all charitable  donations
in all advertisements
, need to compress the information though

.consumers would be more aware
and thus more empowered.

Dear Oparahahaha,

“Explanation for ( -n m  -l )?”

I think that you are drawn to finding out about this.

I’m gonna repeat the hell out of that.

marijuana inside his firewood!”
marijuana inside his firewood!”
Floyd.> Did the FBI  come?”
one of my sources of joy
I love listening to birds, dogs, wind, frogs, etc.
gift of obvious

I am so sorry if I hurt you

I think that the pitch is again what feels good.
\has anyone noticed fundamental differences in the
experiences? who

wouldn’t mind comparing and contrasting the effects,
intensity and duration….
If you have this courage
you’ve gone
half the way to overcome your problems. In a symbolic
way, you have to
accept
the bitterness of life to really enjoy life.”
it is in its natural form is a proof of courage.
presented as interesting opinions,
not the one big truth. and the meaning is explained as
“Om and salutations to the remover of obstacles for
which Gum is the seed.” Hope this helps in the
“checking it out” phase. I am certain that there is a
lot to find out
deaf genie
PLEASE NOTE: This email is not intended to be spam.
what interests me is finding out how to make use of
the remover of all obstacles in a sound
Differnet “pwer animals”

Limits, we don’t choose them, we are forced into them,
during the hcl, the environment of the onearic part
was very hot on the set type energy.  Survival ment
adopting a paradigm to deal w/ it.  Their were many
types, the ‘da vision’ pict is the closest but not
near as detailed and the one I saw was allot less
animated looking, more like a new breed of information
bird clandestine.  Looking back on it now, I think I
tried to understand the other ones as best I could by
“picturing walking in their shoes” and in continuing
to hold on to the paradigm of “what are the limits of
(fill in the blank),

I experienced the

..<^>

.. of each through
accelerated life experience,  it was like fast
forwarding through the suffering of a lifetime, one
after another
very taxing.
I can’t recall the exact details anymore of the other
“spirit animals/creatures”, but still have a lingering
after feeling of the various energies involved.  Very
Alpha, most of them

Different goals,
Different intentions,
Different definitions
Different points in space-time
Different preferences in information mannerisms
Different past
Different politics
Different reaction
Different same.
Same different.

Shifting anyways,
Mr. Glue
Addicted to healing
Hitler wanted to ‘save the world’

Quickest way to “loose control” is to desire “control”

Spinal taps blood Transfusion
Jaundice Sun Flower

This cellular adjustment process extends across the
cortex, “editing” the frequency map so that a greater
area of the cortex processes important tones. One can
tell which frequencies are important to an animal
simply by determining the frequency organization of
its auditory cortex.
http://www.sciam.com/article.cfm?chanID=sa006&articleID=0007D716-71A1-1179-AF8683414B7F0000&pageNumber=3&catID=2

Jason radio ignored by commercial broadcasters because
of
government activity —
International propaganda broadcasts
from the likes of U.S.-backed Radio Free Iraq.

Jason radio, a more curious kind of
international station has been noted on the steam
stream.

Across the world, high-powered transmitters with
global reach are
broadcasting seemingly meaningless strings of numbers
or letters,
along with a lot of buzzing and beeping noises.

“numbers stations”
are operated by drug cartels run
by intelligence agencies, as tacitly acknowledged by
the
government, and accidentally by the abandoned
broadcasters in favor of
satellite and the internet, these curious stations
continue to
broadcast development listening technologies.

even listening to the signals
is illegal.

A subculture of obsessive listeners has built up
around the
stations they have hope.

decoding the signals

curiosity value oddball transmissions impact
conceptual government numbers station, but the
mystery and the stations
were not “intended for public consumption.”

The location was given away by the accidental
simulcasting of audio from Radio
genuine CIA disinformation

Number station signals suggest in-
the-field broadcasts by clandestine operatives.

powerful transmitters with global reach, requiring
massive
masts that are not easily hidden.

Spectrographic analysis of the signals has revealed
that modulated
data bursts are sometimes contained within the
transmissions, and
sub-audible noises are a regular occurrence.

E03A,
probably by MI6; and E25,
4625 KHz. buzzing
tone, repeated 25 times a minute  mast is located
Apart from the buzzing frequency
“it is a last-reserve frequency reserved for
just prior to the outbreak of
nuclear conflict.”

analyzing missiles numbers traffic
— possibly a editor of all sorts of odd
noises codes.
Listeners construct a plethora of stations.

signal characteristics never decipher but
can perform traffic analysis.”

calm center keeps one rooted in the moment, alert and
focused. Courage at such times springs from focused
attention
like the sun and the moon , shine on.
like the wind, spreading the spores.clarity 4all.
the wisdom of life itself.

_________________
“Creativity is God’s gift to you. What you do with it
is your gift to
God.”
B. Moawad

what is going to happen?
-j

http://www.tarot.com/tarot/sample-read.php?sa=&random_reading_id=6d39cf35ff162280f64bc9580726480d&subject=flow&upsell_position=&position_number=2&viewed=2&deck_ID=23&position=3&spreadNo=56&reading_type=main&picked_pieces%5B2%5D=75&picked_pieces%5B1%5D=42&picked_pieces%5B3%5D=58&deckOptions=23
Nine of Swords
Position: Challenges/ Opportunities
Main (positional) Meaning:
What brings sorrow may also give rise to feelings of
liberation.

The card in the Challenges/Opportunities position
reflects how you can use creativity and skill to turn
conflicts into harmonious understanding.

With the Nine of Swords in this position, you are
facing the paradox that what is cause for grief and
sorrow can also produce a great release. Sometimes the
catastrophe you fear the worst is actually the end of
an impossible situation; this may be one of those
times.

Consider the possibility that binding obligations to
an old situation are now ended. You are now free to
choose your own direction, to explore and grow beyond
circumstances that used to hold you in. The very fact
that this is happening indicates your readiness to
make this transition. Somewhere beneath the distress
and loss is a reserve of strength that has been
building for this kind of opportunity. Point yourself
toward healing, release from bondage, and freedom from
suffering. Focus on the positive. Collect visions and
ideas that will help you rise above feelings of
hopelessness.

The City of Garland is going to erect a 450 ft. tower
in the 500
Block of Rowlett Road,near the intersection of
Broadway.the new tower
is to go on air August 1,2005.This the answer to all
the dead spots

Garland’s old Police station in downtown Garland
will be used for backup.Also Garland’s old NexJen
system is now being
over hauled and is going to be a state of the art
Motorola MESS-NET
system with the same type PODS on poles and buildings
that the NexJen
system but hopefully better results.Motorola also says
that the City
needs to keep the SPRINT system that Garland has been
operating since
the NexJen system Crashed and burned so that the
POLICE/FIRE can have
coverage outside the city.Motorola has 7 of these
systems now up and
running in the U.S.A.

I live in
Richardson and listen to Garland quite a bit.
<http://www.motorola.com/governmentandenterprise/northamerica/en-us/public/functions/browsesolution/browsesolution.aspx?navigationpath=id_804i/id_2523i>
and listen to Garland quite a bit.

Jay

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________
Date: Tue, 26 Apr 2005 12:29:24  Help with locating a
frequency monitored not trunked all the
frequencies
used by X system in conventional mode and scanning
them to monitor conventionally.

The radio will always try its
“home”
channel first.

If you figure out the home channel and sit on it
you’ll
hear
all

If
the
home channel is busy then it works. That’s not to say
you
wouldn’t hear other folks since the same home channel
is going to be
assigned to many different users of a large system.

smart radio, dumb controller.

unlike list clear is provided

read a
radio which give
The
difficult part of you must know all the frequencies
and put them
in
the radio in the proper channels.

I’ve never seen a system that goes
1,2,3,4,5 etc but they always skip around.

Hopefully all that makes sense!!

Help with locating semantics….

easily understand the However, capable of receiving
all, it is an analog FM
signal.  Why wouldn’t one hear it if one were scanning
across the
frequency
on which the transmission occurred?

Maybe one couldn’t monitor it if an LTR transmitter
added noise that an
LTR
receiver could subtract out (quasi-encryption) or if
the system changed
frequencies every few seconds so that only a partial
sentence might be
heard on any one given frequency.

some unlikely conditions like the above supplied by
Comm-Net according to several
media
outlets. portions of this message have been removed

http://www.radioreference.com/modules.php?name=RR&mid=2

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

BCD396T receive
ND5Y
Garland’s New Tower

I’m screaming BCD396T receive

No.

listen to Garland quite a bit.

Is that an absolute “NO!” or a relative ‘no’?   Even a
Garland receives signal.  It just
can’t keep a conversational thread alive.  Could a
Garland
receive?

listen to Garland
portions of this message have been removed
________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

New

just no
, but hell no. From what little I have read mesh
networks are some type of encrypted
spectrum spread in the 4.9.

that makes sense.  In essence, with a bit of work, you
could
“science out” a system for a target program
frequencies in the right order, and you’d have a
pseudo-system with a lot of probably
chance, but for a suppose, is a
hypothetical system in the morning.

receive
something
on a truth, I think, is wonder.
can receive encrypted “CAN receive” is not “IS
SUITABLE for listening to”.

The radio will always try its
“home”
channel first.

If you figure out the home channel and sit on it
you’ll
hear
all.

If
the
home channel is busy then it works.

I’ve never seen a system that goes
1,2,3,4,5 etc but they always skip around.

Hopefully all that makes sense!!
portions of this message have been removed

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Garland’s New Calm:*)

appears to be a data solution to replace the
illegal to manufacture and sell a device that
would allow unauthorized users to decode the
information in this data
network.  Sheep use BCD396T to listen to their
voice radio system, though.
HELP!!!!!!  Yes, I’m screaming!  Can BCD396T receive
Garland’s New Tower?

No.

listen to Garland

portions of this message have been removed

Garland’s New Tower Reading a little further, I do see
is possible,
but it sure is tactical communications
system do some pretty neat things (like use every
radio as a
networked repeater so that your network extends as
your personnel
deploy…).:

Calm :*)
appears to be a data solution It is not a illegal for
us to manufacture and sell a device
that would allow unauthorized users to decode the
information in this
data network to listen to HELP!!!!!!  Yes, I’m
screaming!

Mesh router
Intelli Access point
Enhanced gent Router
Vehicle Mounted Switching Controller

you’d have to
be wearing a laptop on your back… really feasible in
most situations.

this is probably just a new data transport
solution.
Yep, I agree. that makes sense.  pseudo-success, but
for a probably
do
well.  The moral of the story, I suppose, is that a
practical should do well with morning.

the discussion is somewhat
hypothetical.

However, whenever someone says you “can’t” receive
something, I wonder why not.  The truth, I think, is
“can” receive everything including encrypted and
digital
signals.

“CAN receive” is not “IS SUITABLE for listening to”.
clear provided you’ve
read a
radio

I’ve never seen a system that goes
1,2,3,4,5 etc but they always skip around.

Hopefully all that makes sense!!
semantics….
folks know that I have monitored
some of those have had no luck yet.”

can easily understand the capable of receiving all, it
is an analog FM
signal.

Why wouldn’t one hear it if one were scanning across
the
frequency
on which the transmission occurred?

transmitter added noise
receiver could subtract out (quasi-encryption) or if
the system
changed
frequencies every few seconds so that only a partial
sentence might be
heard on any one given frequency.

supplied by Comm-Net according to several
media
outlets. portions of this message have been removed

Isn’t this stuff in the 2.4 GHZ range, anyway??

And reading further still, I don’t see application in
their Product Line
site.  Enhanced Access Router
Switching Controller

While the system would allow VoId, you’d
have to
be wearing a laptop on your back.

vote goes back to enforcement situations.
“this is probably just a new data
transport
solution.”
messaging is
possible,
but it sure isn’t emphasized in the web site. I think
we’ll just
have
to wait and see if it is implemented.

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Sounds good will be changing there
numbers
soon there currently numbered as
1RescueEngine1
There new numbering will be 181
181
181
They are also set to receive a new rescue I think
sometime at
the end of this year and it will be called Rescue.
This is also federally funded and if the government
requests it, it
can be
sent anywhere they may need it.
Everyone that will be on it is
currently
being trained in Water Rescue and
Rescue Angel.  This new is all part of a group of
departments that got together they include
department will or receive a trailer that will be
pulled
with a Ford pickup.  They will be handling all the for

the
portions of dallas  have been removed

Color coded, but varying degrees and shades of colors.
Brown: could start off dog shit brown, then gradually
progress Lion dung and eventually G-d/ess poo.
Yellow: starts at Priest/ess Pee and ends in Gold
rush.  Orange is just Orange.

Or if have something against body “waste” colors,
could use color associations from various ‘meme’s’
(start with Bwiti sects and move from there? Red
ribbon etc..).

The trick is defining the titles.

Mix Tape projects (limit them to 10-20 for each Mix).
Each project should contain an Essay explaining as
best can, how it relates to various Visions.

It may need a few chapters(essays) at the beginning to
tie it together and give some foundation for flexing
concave conText.

Sara,
How are you?
Much real Love to you and your family,
J

Hi jason,
thanks you for asking.i’m fighting not to break down.
I’m getting better, I brought some one to the airport
today, his treatment
for
heroin went really good.

still I have to collect my energy to do something.next
week summer holidays
starting, I will have a little rest.my kids will be at
home.

I hope you will come soon,

much love,

Sara

From:    UUSEAN@aol.com  [Add | Block]    Show All
Headers
Date:    Mon, 21 Jun 2004 23:25:21 EDT
Subject:    Re: 111111111111111
To:    iboga@ziplip.com

——————————————————————————–

Hi Jason,

Thanks so much for your kind post.  And yes, I am
certain that your actions matter even when you are not
aware of it.

Pax,
Sean

US NH: New Support Group Tackles War On Drugs
by Susan Morse, (22 Jun 2004) Hampton Union New
Hampshire

SEABROOK – From an initiative started by former police
chief William Baker, the Seabrook Police Department is
starting a “Seabrook Drug Coalition of the Willing” to
help drug- and alcohol-addicted residents.

Sgt.  Michael Frost is coordinating the program under
the direction of acting Chief David Currier and acting
Deputy Chief Patrick Manthorn.  Frost is looking for
residents willing to sign on as volunteers to help
their neighbors and strangers overcome drug and
alcohol addiction.

Those willing are asked to call the police department
at 474-5200.

“How I envision it,” said Frost, “we’re looking for
resources, those who have been through NA ( Narcotics
Anonymous ), AA ( Alcoholics Anonymous ), the people
who’ve lived in Seabrook and dealt with addiction.
I’m not looking for experts.  I’m looking for people
who have compassion, looking to create a safety net.”

The specifics of the program and how the volunteers
will be employed have yet to be worked out.  It
depends on what residents are willing to take on, said
Frost.

The coalition’s aim is support rather than
enforcement, said Frost.  The drug war will continue
in the department, but the focus of the coalition is
on getting help to those who need it.

“This is not just kicking down doors and making
arrests,” Frost said.  “It’s about developing a
support network.”

Currier said the department, meanwhile, is targeting
drug dealers.  In most cases, dealers are users who
sell drugs to support their habit, said Currier.

“There are a lot of different tactics to take,”
Currier said.  “We really have to attack it at the
roots where the dealers are.  We know who some of the
people are.”

Investigations are lengthy, and it takes time to get
enough on a suspect to get probable cause in court, he
said.

Use of heroin in Seabrook has been called epidemic by
Sgt.  Ellen Arcieri of the state Narcotic
Investigations Unit.

Frost, who served for eight years as a consultant for
the federally initiated Northeast Regional Training
for Drug Free Schools and Communities, said Seabrook’s
problem, while bad, is no different than in cities and
towns throughout New England.

“I see the problem as epidemic, not just epidemic in
Seabrook,” Frost said.  “We have more opportunities
than threats.  Those opportunities are every citizen
who is willing to stand up and say, ‘I’m willing to
help someone, I’m willing to help a neighbor, an
addict, an alcoholic.'”

Frost had no figures on the number of families in town
affected by drugs.  Twenty-five percent of all
families nationwide are touched in some way by alcohol
or drug abuse, he said.

Seabrook’s close-knit community has been the subject
of ridicule from outsiders in the past.  This
closeness is a plus for the coalition, said Frost.
People know their neighbors.

“What’s publicized as a negative is a positive in an
informal network,” Frost said.

Last November, Currier went public on the heroin
problem, when he told the Board of Selectmen heroin
was cheap, potent and flowing into town.  Three months
after becoming chief in December, Baker held a
well-attended heroin forum and announced his intention
to coordinate a drug coalition.

Baker resigned last month, citing lack of support by
the majority of selectmen for his initiatives for the
department, including his proposal to send a Seabrook
officer to the Seacoast Drug Task Force.

The town has since applied to the state for the grant
money to send an officer to the task force.  The
Seabrook Police Department has yet to hear whether the
grant has been approved, said Currier.

——————————————————————————–
MAP posted-by: Larry Seguin

Pubdate: Tue, 22 Jun 2004
Source: Hampton Union, The (NH)
Copyright: 2004 Seacoast Online.
Contact: hamptonunion@seacoastonline.com
Website: http://www.seacoastonline.com/news/hampton/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/3146
Author: Susan Morse

Embryonic germ (EG) cells, derived during a slightly
later stage of development (five to nie weeks), come
from primordial germline cells in early fetal tissues.
Much less research has been done on EG cells, but
their potential to differentiate appears to be more
limited than that of ES (embryonic stem) cells.

In particular, many stem cell research projects are
targeting neurological problems.  For example:

Worldwide, more than 100 people with Parkinson’s
disease have received embryonic neuron trans plants.
Although some patients showed no change (presumably
because the new cells failed to produce enough
dopamine), others improved measurably.  Plans call for
transplants of more highly differentiated stem cells
as more reliable sources of the neurotransmitter.

Researchers at the Salk Institute in California
extracted brain cells from human cadavers and used
them to produce neural progenitor cells, the
precursors to adult brain cells.

Biologists at Thomas Jefferson University removed
human adult stem cells from bone marrow, bathed them
in growth factors and nutrients, and converted them in
to neuronlike cells.

Using ES cells from mice, researchers produced glial
cells that deposited myelin around spinal cord fibers
when injected into rats with multiple sclerosis.

Neuronal stem cells are known to migrate deep into
the brain to repair damaged tissue.  Scientists at the
Institute Pasteur in Paris are working to cure
multiple sclerosis by identifying the chemical signals
that regulate this process and developing stem cells
with an enhanced ability to migrate.

Scientists at Johns Hopkins induced a paralyzing
disorder in mice and rats similar to the human disease

amyotrophic
lateral sclerosis, then injected them with immature
human stem
cells that had been programmed to become neurons.

Three months later,   *although their movements were
jerky, all of the paralyzed animals were walking
again.

We must go forward to what we are, and no one has ever
been there.

Find out what you are, and try to be it.

Tragedy to us, however hysterical, is real.

We can be insulated against everything but death – in
fact, death is the very substance of our insulation.
But to be used by life we must be naked and to be
naked is to be hurt. But it is also to be alive.

I am enclosing the 7th Aire. Copy it into a permanent
note book along with any other rituals you intend to
use.

The inside and the outside must speak, the guts and
the blood and the skin; the penis and the vagina, as
well as the brain. We must have it all out, the fear
and the disgust, the hatred and cowardice, and the
beauty, tenderness and courage as well, and balance
all. Then we can get at the truth. The mind is an
instrument that measures itself with itself and as
such a contradiction – an impossibility. But out of
this abyss, as we know, we can make significance, but
to be cogent it must be significance for the entire
field.

The state in a proper working is indescribable but
unmistakable. It is essential that everything be
prepared and learned properly well in advance, since
when things start to happen much of the work will have
to go on automatically.

It is all strange and uncharted – nothing but truth
will serve us here, and it must be the truth of dream
and hallucination and frenzy equally with the truth of
science and dialectics and economics.

But these are also my truths – they are part of me –
part of the equipment of my cosmic laboratory wherein
I can begin an experiment in truth.

There can be no objectivity so long as there is
preference.

Comprehend the intolerable self – the vile, frightful
aspects of the mother that yet lifts up the upholding
hand in the immemorial gesture of – peace, child, all
is well.

Neurosis and initiation are the same thing, except
that neurosis stops short of apotheosis, and the
tremendous forces that mold all life are encysted –
short circuited and turned poisonous. Psychoanalysis
transforms the false ego symbols – it is a confusion
of conformity and cure in terms of group behavior. But
initiation must go on until the barrier is passed, the
misty bastions of infantile Trawenfells in to the
rocks and crags of eternity, the garden of Klingsor in
to the City of God beyond duality and causality, above
the abyss – and these in turn to the One that is
beyond speech and sight and knowledge..

You should have the plan in detail, order of rituals,
layout of temple, procedure etc. I will send you the
ritual of the Bornless One, probably in a small
Goetia, since it is rather long to copy. It is a very
ancient, potent & dangerous ritual, often used by bold
magicians in the Guardian Angel Working. It is useful
as a preliminary in almost any sort of work, causing a
tremendous concentration of force. It is, however,
liable to produce dangerous side phenomena and
sometimes permanent haunting in an area where it is
repeated, & is for this reason often avoided. Never do
it without banishing & opening the temple, then
closing and banishing again.

I’m tired from the trip and will myself close now.

Can’t find:  “I’m forever blowing bubbles” by Hermeto
Pascoal
But found other song sample:
http://www.pezzotti.ch/aves.ra

https://bookweb.kinokuniya.co.jp/guest/cgi-bin/booksea.cgi?ISBN=0192804960

&#61664;_&#61664;5th Step:
http://www.bodyworlds.co.uk/en/pages/koerperspende.asp

http://www.erowid.org/psychoactives/faqs/psychedelic_crisis_faq.shtml

“It can be very hard to relax in the middle of dying
or being pulled apart by demons,”
“Healthy process: Crises are a normal part of the
human psychological process and one way to engage them
is as a process of healing, not a ‘problem’ to be
fixed.”

“(if it seems appropriate and useful) you can prompt
them with very simple questions about their
experience…

“What color is it?” — “Are you sad?” — “How old are
you?”
It seems likely that the answers you will receive will
be metaphoric and not concrete. “All the colors” –
“I’m as old as the river”. Don’t expect to carry on a
normal conversation.

http://wired.com/news/technology/0,1282,65620,00.html?tw=wn_tophead_2

“The only side effect reported was an itching or
“fizzing” sensation around the scalp where the
electrode was attached.”
“It isn’t the first time doctors and scientists have
used electricity to modify the way the brain works.
Some historians believe Greek physicians as early as
the second century directed patients to apply a live
torpedo fish, a type of electric ray, to the forehead
as a cure for headaches.”

http://www.med.harvard.edu/AANLIB/cases/caseNA/pb9.htm

http://www.med.harvard.edu/AANLIB/hms2.html
Normal tissue
MR-T11
MR-T21
xray-CT2

dense bone dark dark bright
air dark dark dark
fat bright bright dark
water dark bright dark
brain “anatomic”3 interm. interm.
1. Bright means high signal intensity, dark means low,
and interm. means intermediate.
2. Bright means high density/high attenuation of
x-rays, dark means low.
3. Grey matter appears grey, white matter white.

PET, SPECT, fMRI, EEG, MEG, optical imaging and
neuroanatomical tools

http://www.med.harvard.edu/AANLIB/hms1.html
“When an additional magnetic field is superimposed,
one which is carefully varied in strength at different
points in space, each point in space has a unique
radio frequency at which the signal is received and
transmitted. This makes constructing an image
possible. It represents the spatial encoding of
frequency, just like a piano.”

http://www.med.harvard.edu/AANLIB/hms1.html
http://www.efns.org/guidelines/gl_5.pdf
http://www.rt-image.com/content=8004J05C4896908040B69C76448A88641
http://www.neuroimage.net/
http://wired.com/news/medtech/0,1286,65422,00.html?tw=wn_story_related
http://www.lumc.nl/1010/LKEBHome/english/research/Neuro/LKEBNIPMain.html
http://wired.com/news/medtech/0,1286,65560,00.html
http://wired.com/news/medtech/0,1286,65507,00.html

Hollywood Babylon
“we edited it”
“press play on the box”.
Time to turn the page when you hear

Am I right your into drugs?
Yeah you look it.
Druggie druggie druggie druggie
Am I right your into drugs?
Yeah you look it.
A bear had a chance to go to the big city.
Drown in synchronicity?
I don’t know what’s headed this way princess but it’s
shaking the place apart.
Avoidance becoming predictable.
Shame makes touch down
Perception cannot perceive itself.
Junk trash market value
Rip Lee green greed machine
Trick or treat.
U-R-O
*- (
So sad.
So fuck that.
Man or child?
Boom but he dropped dea
In force cyanide breath mint
Age Hence See
Ugg buys old houses.
Advertisements of higher
Is this all there is?
A cut mouth gum bus line
Picking cotton
No para is a para
Ah
Bothering you?
Tail evolves into fly swat air vanilla
Auto
Pil
Quiet static of short .vvav
Good listener.
Natural resources = vg ear under pillow, never sent.
Spent burnout fades away into damaged drunk tank over
crowded.
Pitiful genetic code bring pain to off spring.
Spring fall Un-sprung
Beta blockers rolling blocks 0 lease
Where does go?
Pass go yet?
Straight from jail to boardwalk
Die easy
Tie a tie How 2
Umbilical noose
Cancer father
Thumb grinder
Complaint depo, “I want to register a complaint”
(bang)
“next please”
We’ve come to the point in this album where those
listening on cassette or record will have to stand up
or sit down and turn over the record or tape.  In
fairness to those listeners we will now take a few
seconds before we begin side two.  Thank you.  Here’s
side two.

Escape artist ran and ran and ran (speed up to 45)
Repulsive, fit only for hatred, chapter 2 runs
hunting.
What I want to know is does he have a muscle arm.
Tough guy doesn’t = man.
Provider = man.
Got fruit?
Man doesn’t = child.
You may not like this but, I’m going to make somebody
mad no doubt.
Ever thought about how others might read?
Everything still remains the same.  I can’t do what 10
people tell me to do, sitting here resting my bones.
Or rather what’s left of them.
Btw, what IS left?
Where do we go from here/>?
Black meat White meat Hole
It’s a trap paravoidance.
Void shall hear
And a quart of beer
Explore the
sHit explodes .com bust
On the poor side of town.
Thank you for trying.
Born father less
Never knew my father so looked for spare change
Crank up your volume
Crank up your profits.
Nothing worthwhile is without risk
Depend how define worthwhile
Do you really think you can get away with quit while
your ahead?
Cult of VReid
WH0 = 0HM
2, do you remember?
Or forget pleas for help from sub
Slow motion is quick sand.
Stand up for anything?
Vulnerable artery, milky jugular
With or without map maker.
With or without compass maker.
The source of the energy and the vehicle, the
manifestation
Infested world is a ghetto
Hungry Hungry Homer
Could it be I’m falling in?
Pushed at the last step.
Check the door for heat
Scales blind set sun
Re: produce (fruits & vegetables)
Steaks of Hormone Injected Heart
Inside AND outside at the same time
Disk Compacted Watermark
Authentic poser sell out junkie fam
Stock and bonds
Hum of Bank
Air conditioner box
Electricity box
Home box
Punishment box
Christmas box
Industrial complex box
Feeding box
No longer command respect sweetest taboo.
Such a body talking
iLLz Need
my oh my what a wonderful day.
How do you do?
Isn’t that silly? I was afraid of nothing.
Most important thing is not to panic when you fall in
the water.
Effects
After After Care
Anti anti anti
Stone cutter
Stoned cutters
America needs this message,
Its good to have something to fall back on, that’s why
I became an electrician.
“could you move some of this shit”

I think I’m a few days, if not hours away.  My
strength is persistence and over feeling everything
works against that.  The only thing that even in
craving doesn’t sound good is the control of it.
If/when the shit goes down forced to kick circa WW2
junkies or at best 9/11 NY methadone patients.

I think it would calm my mind and nerves, because my
nerves are fucking shot.  I think it may be due to a
few factors (too many to list actually):
Multi-year xanex script expired.  Tamazepam script
runs out this month.  They aren’t shit compared to any
opiate/opioid, of course, but they either take care of
the anxiety a bit or black me out, one of the two.
They were a crutch of unreliable support when every
cell in my body screams for some twisted synthesis of
expanding black holes.

“Sickness inside the skull has no limits.  Physical
sickness is relentless but has to be attached to the
physical existence and thus is limited by a framework.
Addiction of the mind has no such limits.

T. hEr01n boga boogie mogne owtta heahg   Ding Dong
Ding Dong (stoned ranger (wally) ‘tis time.

http://www.tcbap.org/ContinuingEducation/ProvidersDallasFortWorthArea.htm
http://www.health.xq23.com/gravis_acerbus_dolore/Analgesics_.html
LCDC (Licensed Chemical Dependency Counselor), ADC
(Alcohol Drug Counselor), AAC (Advanced Addiction
Counselor), CCDS (Certified Chemical Dependency
Specialist), CCGC (Certified Compulsive Gambling
Counselor),CCS (Certified Clinical Supervisor), CPS
(Certified Prevention Specialist), or CSC (Certified
Supervisor Consultant) credentials. They may be used
for up to 30 (thirty) hours of the 40 (forty) hours
required for recredentialing every two years.

Our courses are also approved by NAADAC (Approved
Education Provider No. 452), and may be used toward
their national credentials.
http://www.aivl.org.au/files/UnlawfulDiscrimination.pdf
http://www.tcbap.org/
http://www.prc3.org/acro.htm
http://www.actoronto.ca/website/careteam.nsf/edb7eae66aeeced985256d33000d1523/21c731894ccc5c9385256d42006fce24/$FILE/Living.pdf
http://www.tdh.state.tx.us/hcqs/plc/lsw/lsw_default.htm
http://fn.bmjjournals.com/cgi/content/abstract/89/1/F33?maxtoshow=&HITS=10&hits=10&RESULTFORMAT=&searchid=1094801838156_164&stored_search=&FIRSTINDEX=0&minscore=5000&journalcode=fetalneonatal

Is anything not absorbed in organized prohibition?
Make it a double.
Like bartenders giving drinks for AA chips.
Make you sick if you don’t wait and beg to buy my
shit.
Catching zzz’s while you’re feeling sick.
Pimps couldn’t hustle without you little bitch.
If your bank account’s dry, I need paper, sell your
home.
Syrup sipper’s might as well be sipping methadone.
All the smartest hustlers only stick to burning trees.
Pretty soon I’ll have you syrup sippers on your knees.
Back from rehab now saying that your clean?
Saying that you don’t need to buy shit from me?
Give me all your paper and I’ll make you feel serene.
By the way I cut your tar with tabs of morphine.
Quick sand for sale.
Iboga.
Sound of toilet flushing.
That dream wake.
Wake that dream.
Waking meditation focus memories of dreams.
To desire what we perceive as good to triumph over
what we perceive as evil.
Independent In Dependence.
Rooted in anything?
Is anything true?
Is anything unbiased?
Grays vs. Polarized
Vs. vs. Vs.
Spy vs. Spy.
As if not connected to one another.
Is my judgment sound?
Is my guard let down?
Stand for something but do not speak for people.
Listen.
Find common understanding.
Understand better.
Acts out of fear.
View felt attacked by different view.
Defense politics = anybody but him = rats racing
attack machine.
Lack of wanting to understand.
Make more obvious selfish benefits of listening and
trying to understand.
“How does it affect me” Mentality.
How does it infect me? Brutality.
Clicks.
“
Then we are nothing but the nerds they say we are.”
Tripe.
Tribe.
Gang.
Fraternity in cheeseburger country.
Washington’s view on political parties.
Fight for the rights we have left.
Not caring our country into nazi country.
Hustle.
Grind.
Sniper salesman for your own good.
Split our coalition like an atom.

Sucker punch you before you sucker punch me.
Hunger promotes moral flexibility.
Preemptive strikes to promote democracy.
Social security
Will determine your eligibility.
Come to school and learn to write legibly.
Come learn our version of history.
Amongst other things
Bore away your curiosity.
Like internal and external grasshopper morphology.
No more ‘save us’ mentality.
No more lack of accountability.
No more evacuations from Mile 3.
No more personification of that energy.
No more prisons built to lock up non-violent me.
No more rodeo with runaway war machines.
No more engines powered from steam
No more consciousness left to stream.
No more mechanical bull lee.
Mechanical breathe fog sacred mirror.
Robot hug.
Robot come.
Whipped robot cream (trademarked).
Random Number Generators connected like falling
dominos sequence.
(rinse then repeat)

“Functional magnetic resonance imaging
In 1990, Seiji Ogawa, a researcher at AT&T Bell Labs,
discovered that blood low in oxygen caused a slight
distortion as it flowed through a magnetic field,
while fully oxygenated blood did not…”

http://www.wired.com/wired/archive/12.10/brain.html

Desperate People (off biscuits)
Got the nerve to want to be somebody and don’t got no
skills
Umm.. do anything but tear down? Can’t even
contemplate building?
Without security?
Got Security TM &#61664; well
you can imagine.
have more strength then give credit for.
No time for education?? “sounds familiar lol”

Inside the heart of an American Junkie.

When the messiah returns to earth, it is reasonable to
think they will return as a junkie.

It is hard to think that anything new could possibly
come out of such a tired topic as junk.  The very word
seems synonymous with trash and bad teeth.  Although
Jesus washed the feet of another, so why would he not
walk through junk sickness and speedball rush?  The
heroin cyber Beat Punk Hippie’s have ruined many lives
in the name of good business.  Leaving the term
‘revolution’ watered down by incorporation and
consumption.  But revolutionaries must trade and
communicate just as other people, as no one is an
island unto themselves.  Why is this so hard to see
until seen?  And  what are the pro’s and con’s of
“burned my credit cards for fuel” mentality?  Is
becoming more radical help or hinder understanding
from those outside our own paradigm?  Bridges make
unsustainable firewood supply.  Stubborn in a attempt
to justify such narcissism.

It is still amazing to me that these events shape my
own worldview in such profound ways even after
consumption of junk is discontinued.   Perhaps the
junkie worldview makes myself more vulnerable in some
ways and more skeptical in others.  There is little
doubt that surrounding self with hustlers seems to
diminish my faith in people.  But what makes a person
a junkie?  Would junkies exist without political and
socio-economic factors or is it the chemical itself
that makes a person a junkie?  Obviously the answer is
both and possibly more.  The two seem to feed off of
one another like oxygen and carbon dioxide, plants and
mammals.  Reminds me of the two snakes wrapping
themselves around western medical symbol.  Opioids and
Opiates are a rush of bliss and venom, the snake
charmer rather then the snake.  In this way a road of
nothing of significance can be understood by intellect
alone.  Junk is without direct memory and it is
without future but it is with a universal sexual
memory just underneath the skin like condensed
impulses of junk energy like some beautiful blood red
glow of some new undiscovered electricity.  Junk is
bleeding the eternal bug light zapper.

So why should a junkies life revolve around junk?
Perhaps this is done in avoidance in what would
naturally fill in the blank without junk.  The problem
lies in that in learning, it becomes a hypodermic
ritual quicksand lover who drains cotton and pushes
plungers at first sight of red.  I think junkies see
the game after a while, eventually the wizard behind
the curtain is seen and the inevitable question comes:
why have I invested so many of my numbered heartbeats
to that which demands so much but who’s assets seem to
emulate a diminishing return?  Tolerance is a rite of
passage into a hungry world.  Once depth of situation
is realized, it can be overwhelming for some to the
point that “fuck it” appears as the only reliable
security blanket defense mechanism.  Predictable
random can represent the same avoidance.  But are we
designed to live in a world of escapism.  Could faith
be considered a form of escapism?  Could lack of faith
be considered a form of escapism?  Is the method used
a sound method?

The stigma of junkie is seen to varying shades among
the usual suspects.  The supposed ‘winnable’ out of
sight out of mind mentality of what is called the
‘drug war’ is quite literally threatening the security
of every American by fueling the bank accounts of
terrorist.  When I say security I mean both in the
means of homeland security in the war against terror
and economic security.  Also it funds the Iraq
insurgents that are killing American Soldiers.  It
gives economic opportunities to America’s enemy’s.  If
prohibition had any results in drug use maybe one
could justify the rational, but several decades have
seen the issue become worse.  One has to consider the
possibility that prohibitionist may have an economic
interest in not winning.  How else could someone come
away with thinking it has worked and continue to
increase the funding that could otherwise go to things
that DO work.

Imagine if a diabetic’s insulin was outlawed.  In a
reasonably short amount of time, diabetic’s would be
showing up in jail more, surrounded with violent
criminals, and eventually becoming institutionalized
by the surroundings.  Methadone is one of the most
addictive drugs, more then heroin as methadone is long
acting (24 hours) and heroin short acting (4-6 hours).
But we see that the methadone patient has a reliable
supply and is much more likely to be able to hold a
job or complete school then the illegal heroin user.
This is not because methadone is less addicting, it is
because the unreliable supply of an illegal heroin
user’s heroin.  Heroin use is deadly due to the way
illegal heroin is supplied in varying potencies.  If
that heroin was prescribed, varying potencies wouldn’t
be an issue and thus heroin deaths would drop
dramatically.  I personally was on 263 mg/day of
methadone.  Because of the tolerance and reliable
supply and reliable dose, it made me feel normal, but
give my dose to someone without a habit and they would
likely die.  I believe that if drugs where prescribed
by a doctor, the glamour of drug use would cease.
Heroin is cool.  Methadone clinics are lame.  People
want what they can’t have so in a way, I blame the
scare tactic information policies of DARE.  Scare
tactics have to be used due to funds.  Which means the
stigma of illegal drug use is raised, and very vague
information is given, making most drugs appear equally
life destroying.   And there is never a contrast when
the consequences of the use of a specific drug.  There
is never a contrast between the consequences of use
when prescribed (such as methadone) and when illegal.
There are consequences to those who don’t get caught
using illegal drugs.  This may be why some get anxious
at first use of marijuana.  But those should not be
confused with the legal consequences which may, in
it’s good intentions, add to the obstacles of becoming
a productive member of society.  This is obviously in
everyone’s interest, prisoners don’t pay for
themselves.  And the users of illegal drugs probably
had enough trouble as it is from the drugs themselves
as we are all products of our environment to various
degrees.

It was McCoy.
2 gram Po Chai bottles C 17 H 17 NO (C2H3O2)2
Heinrich Dreser syringe fraternity rampant Morphinism
agents renamed Army units of the Kuomintang (KMT) and
various CIA involvement in Narcotics trade.

Daily intake
Required specific chemist
for operational efficiency.

Quantities of
Dr. John Hill
Dr. Samuel Crumpe
Dr. Samuel Johnson
Dr. John Freitag
Dr. John Jones
Robert Burton –>

Anatomy of Melancholy,

the problem of those who were insomniacs
‘by reason of their continual cares, fears, sorrows,
dry brains [which] is a symptom that much crucifies
melancholy men.’

Anointing the forehead upon retiring with an
opium-rosewater mixture and applying leeches behind
the ears then rubbing opium into their puncture marks.
Dr. Charles Hunter
***********Dr
Fordyce Barker***********

Two of these chains, the heavy (H) chains, are
identical to each other and contain approximately 400
amino acids each.  The other two chains, the
&#61664;light&#61663; (L) chains, are also identical
to each other, but only about half as long as each H
chain.  The four chains combined form a molecule,
called an anti-body monomer (mon ‘o-mer), with two
identical halves, each consisting of a heavy and light
chain.  The molecule as a whole is T or Y shaped.

Nine in the fourth place means:

“Yes but-“
“But nothing!  Think about it.  The Meaning of Life!
We get our fingers on that we can hold every shrink
in the Galaxy up to ransom, and that’s worth a bundle.
I owe mine a mint.”

on phantom overload because I am l8r0n if u want.

I did a fast edit.  I think I will place it under
Theoretical Macromolecular Modeling Bioinformatics
Immediate Availability of:

beginning in Holy Water, to help prevent any hydration
issues which
might otherwise arise during the course of your
visionary experience.

Us know Dr.
Pookie will feed you 4 bars of repeated as often as
necessary

If you have
not found God, The Aliens or the GOP’s Power Computer;
the Pimp fairy will visit soon to make it all better.

inject heroin (the
Special Kind that doesn’t cause withdrawal)
as needed.

Sp^ce k0k0

*_* [a(d)]just numbers :

Geyser Full Pure Water Spring
<boing>
Organic Manic
Titanic Flea & Tick Panic
Rehab Shtick
Click Pick Doblin Quick
Reversing Spirals Polar Rolls
Synthetic War Synthetic Warmth Synthetic Weather
Electric Coffin Buried Alive Therapy Tolls
Coughing
Enlightenment Under Ice Club Ride
Squeaking Treadmills

TM’s Cosmic Giggle
River Trickle
Cranberry and Sweet Pickle
Tummy Tickle
Blow Job for a Nickel
Beams Triple
Buttery Nipple
Super handi-tard cripple

please remember that I am still learning too, but I
will help as best I can : )
in an unbiased and teachable way
you ask me if I felt sick…that is a hard question.
I can say iboga isn’t a combination of LSD and
non-sickness methadone,
it can be a hard road of hope, natural endorphins etc
back up and running again,

it can be a hard road of hope, but it is hope,

don’t give prescribed methadone in jail

walk through what had to be walked through
expectations should be,

I do not feel it is a “cure” ie something that will do
everything for you

It is a window of opportunity
I can’t go through 263 mg kick both with and without
iboga to compare…but what I can do is compare it to
an Orlaam cold turkey kick I attempted in July of ’99,
and I was on the equivalent of about 60 or 70 mg of
methadone (I forget how much that made the Orlaam
dose, but I do remember clearly switching from 60-70mg
methadone to the equivalent dose of Orlaam)

things got really bad, indescribably bad…The
sickness was so intense and consistent and never
ending and will breaking…sickness was so intense I
slept only

4 hours in a total of 6 weeks never ending-ness broke
my will and I slid into the quicksand of hopelessness
resulting in a few stupid attempts, when I woke up the
next day over and over again, and didn’t have the
money to try any more, I said “fuck this shit, at
least I was productive before” by Dec 99 I was on
opioids again and once I made it back to the clinic
for the reliable supply, it took allot more for me to
be “stable”.

So….the 263 mg kick without iboga is simply
unimaginable and incomprehensible, it without a doubt
would have been the orlaam kick at least 3 to 4 times
over.

So with that limited experience as my map and compass,
I would say the iboga took at least 50% of the
sickness that would have been without it.
Everyone reacts different. the addiction interruption
qualities of iboga/ine vary from person to person, but
what seems to be universal in the experience is the
whole “ten years of therapy in one night” lessons, I
have not met one person yet who hasn’t felt that in
some way.

picture in your mind’s eye…a molecule (by the way
the dream like state is somewhere in between
imagination and dream, at least for me personally)

see in your minds eye a molecule, then you feel a tap
on your shoulder and your vision/perspective steps
back and broadens…

now you see a pattern/series of molecules, shoulder
tap, vision/perspective steps back and broadens…

now you see tree bark, shoulder tap,steps back and
broadens

…now a tree, shoulder tap, step back and broaden

…series of tree’s, shoulder tap, vision/perspective
steps back and broadens

…a forest.  The molecule you saw at the beginning is
still there, in forest, the forest is still there in
the molecule.

Does that make sense?

language is too restrictive to express certain lessons
learned from spirit.

, at risk of stating the obvious, “meditation in
action is always better then mediation in repose”.

you appear to be

Hope in the wind.

“good”/”bad” is pretty subjective and perhaps over
simplistic.
The line that “separates”  “good” from “bad” is in
every heart,
it’s the placement of the “line”
that seems to effect whether we over demonize or make
’em into saints.

Bottom line is, everyone’s got to eat, so I suppose
everyone is
parasitic to a point, but some appear to have
redeeming qualities that
can make balance that out a bit.

Re: tv or BP (brain pacifier) had a decent show on PBS
about secular
and non-secular points of view, mainly through the
eyes of Frued and
Lewis, not bad I guess. I wasn’t aware that Freud died
from on
purpose
opiate overdose.
After thinking about the question of ‘higher power’ I
seem to be rooted
in the belief that their is no question that their are
many powers in
nature that are much larger then I am.

What I don’t believe is
that this force is somehow working for ‘good’, be that
the good of all
people or is somehow working for me,

that seems to be control junkies
trying to control the uncontrollable.  It is what it
is.

How is it
not   chaos?

Re: therapy, if it leads to positive action then it is
worthwhile, if
it doesn’t, then it is a waste of time.

This has been my experience,
esp. w/ sound, but remember I know nothing.

good to see your book will get read, I’d like to see
the
t-shirt, retail activism indeed.

if they don’t enforce it why give our
government the option to enforce it if they want to?
Does freedom =  having bad laws but not enforcing
them?

sounds a little silly to me.

Hypothetically speaking of course, if someone had
experience to offer,
I wonder if they would feel comfortable sharing that
here.

Who knows.

“a good aftercare suggestion” lol riiight ;

pro’s and con’s of being  hypnotized by “ibo pimps”
and political lobbyz

“Stepping off the hamster wheel at the moment” can
sound like a
reasonable idea

rewind vox dogma

Just the thoughts of another ibogaine treated rat.

just parasitic.
Do you know how hard it can be to say
NO to H on day 3 of withdrawal? Oh wait, you probably
do.

If the dealer is a user him/herself, they are
generally
cooler people, cuz they
My regular supplier of
weed/E/other pharmis is a cool guy(he’s older) and a
pretty close friend, who has even offered to be a
silent partner in several business ventures.

plywood

keep fighting brother.

What is this day 18?Â

The road starts where my feet are
is where I am currently.

———————–=[/

September 17, 2004 9:49:
Thank you.  ‘Buddha in your mirror’ right before
hcl dose and picked it up periodically during the
journey.

Good luck on your project.

There’s a story about a thief who climbed over the
wall of
Buddha’s ashram and got away with some stuff until he
was caught by the
wall by a couple of disciples.  One of them was a monk
who had been
living with the teacher for 30 years, a disciple who
had the capacity
to remember hundreds of “his” past lives.  The
disciples brought the
thief to Buddha.  Upon seeing the teacher’s
continence, his immense
Presence/Clarity, the man immediately broke down and
surrendered. A  He
surrendered everything he imagined he was, and thought
he wasn’t in
that moment, and essentially stripped himself of every
vestige of
separateness, and completely and utterly died into
that Moment. A
Without
identifying with a separate self there is no longer
any personal
suffering. A  He became enlightened. A Â
          Â The master recognized what had
happened , assured
the man he
was worthy and confirmed it was the case.   The one
disciple who had
spent his lifetime acquiring knowledge about himself
lamented to his
teacher as to why, given his devotion to the teaching,
his discipline,
and all his supposed self-knowledge he hadn’t attained
to
enlightenment.  And Buddha’s reply?

Well, you can imagine, right?Â

Totality is the key.Â

In true intention

and readiness,

there’s a
Buddha
within every situation we find ourselves in.
                          Â
                          Â
                 Â
                          Â
                          Â
              Â
                       &n
bsp;Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â Â
                          Â
               Â
                          Â
                      Â
  Â

September 17, 2004 8:16:15 off topic whine to hak3rz
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I had insomnia like crazy last night.Â

I was really tired, not just
physically, but would just lay there getting
frustrated at my inability
to remember how to fall asleep.Â

I woke up a few hours ago and I feel
a
large weight…
Â

After trying to ask “what is trying to happen here”,

pool, no heartbeat or breathing for a few minutes,
friends CPRed
me back, but not conscious.  in coma for 4
days apparently allot bigger then I remembered.

I learned last night that the doctors were telling all
my
family
that chances of making it back were unlikely, and that
if I did, I would
likely have brain damage, etc.
When out of coma, I had tubes out of every hole and
tubes
in new holes they pricked. Â
Â

“it was a miracle, a real miracle.Â

charming and light hearted and seemed to be without
sickness” (opioid
sickness).Â

“But then something changed and it came back.”Â

said  with this heaviness, hard to explain.Â

“I thought it was
over
but, sigh, it came back” type look.
Â

I realized after thinking last night that they tell me
I was given
decent amounts of IV morphine when I came out but that
was cut off
after a couple of days.
Â

I have very little respect for myself in this state of
non-opioids.Â

I  feel weak without them.Â

I feel fatigued without them.Â

I feel  unreliable without them.Â

I don’t know what to expect without them.Â

I  don’t know how to act without them.
Â

I fucking hate this
Â

Yes, things are getting better, but it is happening
sooo ssslllooowwwly
that I sometimes wonder if I would be better off, you
know?
Â

Then, I think about the details of what opioids would
mean in our
current society (illegal heroin or “legal”
methadone).Â

And the human
manipulation that is attached to that.
Â

That is the paradox.Â

Damned if you do.Â
Damned if you don’t.Â
Â

I guess it comes down to faith in my own abilities
without opioids.
Â

Fatigue gets old, real old.
Â

How would you feel if people you cared about are
starving emotionally
because of your inability to be strong?
Â

I’m feeling a bit like a burnout right now.
Â

Anyways, thanks for reading me whine I guess.Â

I wonder if sending
this
is healthy or unhealthy.Â

Who knows.
Â

Re: questions (more I learn the less I know[so true]);
I’m reminded of
that fixx song ‘one thing leads to another’
Â

Re: aftercare?  why assume what is true for one is
true for all?
Â

Re: “wisdom” cut teeth?, umm yeah, that hurts.
Â

Re: right now?Â

I think I’m going to go new; going
with the chick who turned me on to heroin, but has
since kicked and is
going to school to be a nurse.Â

She is good people, and more
importantly, she is real people.
Â

Begin forwarded message:

From: Jason Bursey <jasonburseyiboga@yahoo.ca>
Date: September 16, 2004 12:10:57 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] For n
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

nruhtra@dsskcorp.com

Beatriz Brasil <beatrizbrasil@netvigator.com> wrote:
I lost my emails of the last few days – and your
e-mail address with
them.
How are you doing today?
Beatriz
Â

Begin forward age:

Thinking of you.Â

Someone in dallas can relate to you, for real.Â
Â

spiral before I fuck up
& get a habit to find the
strength to stay clean

not trying to be a downer to yall
,Im just feeling real alone & need to
connect with my birds of a feather.
pattern repeating & fucking
stop it!Thanks for the ear,I love phantom Lotsof in
response uncertain shown lasting possibly
direct showing the
long lasting.

being
sequestered in
fat and converted to released.

Any clarification of this matter appreciated.

I dunno nuttin’ ’bout none o’ dat. C know eviL . here
No- oh nevermind.

But, uhm, to just SHARE my own personal subjective
observations… If
you have relatively low bodyfat levels, that NEAT
glowy feeling,
seems
to do an exit stage left, after a few days. Maybe a
week, 10 days
tops. And 10 days is stretching the boundaries of
Patrick.
Just my Wishful Thinking

take some action to interrupt the downward spiral

opiates,seems like cravings
are triggered by having opiates in your system,
semantics
craving now dental done wrote
scripts, literally asked to write out what I wanted,so
I wrote
junkie,the legal kind.

the truth is ,im back to that see what i can get
away with mentality,I hate that!

I get in trouble when I keep
stuff secret
so here I am fessing up!

no one can fix this but me

,Im not asking for redemption

,its just hard
to explain

take some action to interrupt the downward spiral &
need to
connect with my birds of a feather. pattern repeating
& want to love

Dr. Robert Temple, director of the F.D.A.’s office of
medical policy,
Said:
Â

Do you realize how ridiculous your posts are?

There are many ways to learn in life.

write up how your the next jim morrison, to

shooting it all up and being a junkie living
on the street?  transferring other irritations onto
Get a fucking life.
unless
it is full of something positive. Discussion?
I guess there is in the background 😉 its too bad
your not that good
at being
a person (wants a little
attention?) LOL, sounds familiar.
LOL, sounds familiar.
  why do you keep reading and writing to a
drug oriented list with rock star charisma? Sorry, but
I don’t follow
your logic.
Â
I have never ever
read
anything at all BUT negative suicidal bullshit adds
nothing but
irritation to my day(night/morning). Â  if you freak
every time, you’ll
never make it.
even if it’s done in a very psycho and
confrontational way
  criticism and negativity exist.   I choose how I
react to it.

Â

especially since Patrick is a friend of mine. Â  I
think people

have

mentioned that 100000000 times. into an alpha state.
Rest should
follow.

I kinda like balance, You at least can be irritating
AND amusing AND
seriously deep too-

Â

Why are you so hostile?

Sorry about peeving you

Â

The dark can only be dispelled by the light. Otherwise
it overtakes it.

Â

Lets make this list a good place to be and not allow
negative forces
drag it down.

Â

Let the sun shine in!

Â

especially once I realize it gets to the point that
you almost feel
like you know and care about people Or is that too
damn positive?

Â

Â

you can

start

fresh.

Â

*applause*

even more for following through with it.

I hope you feel dignity.
sept 11 = 11 days no dope – cant type

too
much,

just want all to know
cold turkey is still alive,
when does misery end?
<3 n.
ps. i love you all.

” As soon as you trust yourself, you will know how to
live.” Johann
Wolfgang von Goethe. This information is quoted from
the book “Internal
Family Systems Therapy” by Richard C. Schwartz ”
May the Schwartz Be w/th y0U,

Sounds like a good idea.Â

I believe that no human being is all one
thing, as in all junkie or all addict if you prefer.Â

now involves
looking at all the various parts, letting them talk,
letting them make peace with each other.Â

Currently I am encouraging
the part of me that wants to move on and leave the
dope (H) and coke
alone and move forward in my life.Â

That’s the part that sought out
this.

All is Lost?

Perhaps.

What are the limits of Love.

http://www.baylorhealth.com/webapps/nursery/babydetail.aspx?babyid=65133
Â

Birds in a cage flap wings in my perifial vision
while family
visits.Â

Out of the city, into the country,

visit horses.Â

Last “symbol” before
I left was clearly in reference to HCL .Â

It was an electric bug light
lol, how steriotypical lol

Hard to put into words but really helped finalize some
of the shyt,
which seems long overdue.
Â

Areas of work?Â

re-define “looking glass self” ie separating the
jason
from the junkie in my own mind and I find that one of
my main vices to
overcome is a lack of focus.Â

I am very, very scattered.Â

Have
trouble
focusing…Like I caught ADD or somtin.Â

Also, I am curious about when
“fatigue” becomes chronic.Â

Yes, in comparison to how I would have
felt walking through sick without ibo, much is way
better.Â

policies of methadone clinics, how patient rights are

not there and all the people that suffer as a result.Â

Let it go.Â

Play
your hand.  It is what it is.Â

Where do we go from here?

“Let go of all the brainwashing.”
Â

So 2 request?Â
 F
ocus.Â
Â
Stength.
Â
Focus.
Â
Stength.
Tar
zan
Education.
Learn Family, then families.
Focus.
Strength.
Focus.
A
Â
Â

“It’s real in the field.” http://www.tcbap.org/
 J
111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111

1111111111111111111111111111111111111111111111
Â
Â
Â
Â
Â
Â

From [ibogaine]

The Necessary Organ(s):
Reply-To: mindvox
Â

http://lansbury.bwh.harvard.edu/Useful_links.html

http://www.fastercures.org/sec/resources

F.Y.I.

Â

Their is plenty Marc wants people to write to, not
just him. Â

www.pot-tv.ca is covered with people to write.Â

For example:

Â

Write Irwin Cotler, tell him to Free Marc Emery and
Renovate Canadian
Cannabis Laws.

Â

Minister of Justice and Attorney General of Canada

284 Wellington Street

Ottawa, ON

K1A 0H8

Cotler.I@parl.gc.ca

Denise Rudnicki

Director of communications

Denise.Rudnicki@justice.gc.ca

Â

Mylene Dupere Press Secretary

Mylene.Dupere@justice.gc.ca

Â

main phone: 613 992 4621

Â

The Criminal Code gives the Minister of Justice the
power to review a
conviction to determine whether there may have been a
miscarriage of
justice. This power has been part of Canada’s justice
system since the
original Criminal Code of 1892. Today, the Minister’s
power to review
convictions is set out in sections 696.1-696.6 in Part
XXI.1 of the
Criminal Code.

Â

:

THE C(R)ASH.
Its not an easy road but were not alone in this and I
have to believe
that once the seed is planted it will continue to
guide you if you let
it.
God bless. -M.

   It helps more then it may appear.

Be Well,
Â

its been very
healing to be in the old haunts for the right reasons.
I believe, for
me everything that comes up, uncomfortable as it might
be at times,Â

is
an opportunity on some level to either make peace with
a certain
situation, or place, or feeling, or whatever, and then
move on.

I mean,
the thought is always there but having a choice and
making the best
decision at the time makes me feel stronger and
stronger or further and
further out the other end.Â

This is not me testing myself but more
reinforcing that my life can have a lot more purpose
than it ever has
in the past. I know longer need forÂ

my identity to be lost in chasing
junk and all that goes with it. Life has so much more
to offer if we
just let the process work.
Nothing however hasÂ

gotten to Â
me

seeing some of these
wonderful people
who I’ve met recently
go back out. Intellectually I
understand it completely

my heart still hurts when I seeÂ

that pain
first hand.Â

I guess from a selfish prospective maybe it reminds
me how
close I always am to giving it all back but I think
even moreÂ

it has
to
do with the idea that well it just breaks my heart to
see people come
so far and to lose it. Ugh! I’m still completely
unable to make peace
with that one yet.

Its not an easy road but were not alone in this

and I have to believe
that once the seed is planted
it will continue to guide you
if you let  it.
bless. -M.

I’m not going to copy/paste a couple of pages blindly
from a website
to help credit my point but ‘I believe’Â

I think you can draw your’ own conclusions from this
.

whatever.

stare into eyes
and the lights are on,

but

home.

I’m interested in hearing how successful combinations
of extract and
HCL are for addiction interruption objectives.Â

Â

Â

Â

“

What
Ails
thee?

”

Â

Â

Â

Â

increase the level of

 other ways and means, which is vital to brain cell
communication.

Â

risks involved in the ritual use of

stepped out in the Texas sunlight The cops all stood
around Old
Kilowatt ran 50 yards Then threw himself down on the
ground They might
as well just have laid The old man down And weʼre
gonna raze, raze the
prisons To the ground Help us raze, raze the prisons
To the ground ©
1971, 1972 Chandos Music (ASCAP)

Â

I think organizing is a wonderful idea.Â

Doing so without breeding
dogma will be tricky.Â

I think the boldest thing that could be done is to
open a church right
here in the US.Â

A real, certified and sincere church.Â

I think this
is
the most productive path, but I know little.Â

Who can deny iboga is a divine plant.

It is so great to hear about so much action.Â

‘Tis Inspiring.

Â

not so big pill
Reply-To: mindvox.com
Â
Â
Â

UFO dentists from planet anaesthesiaÂ

came to visit, had to write them
a
hot check just for them to look at me.Â

I think they put me under and
gang raped my jaw with and withoutÂ

their sadist dentist tools …then
they give script of 30 Watson’s for pain, which is a
fucking joke.
Â
Â

these damn Vic’s  are a fucking joke.Â
One a
day, who does that dose level work on really!!???,
cause it is a sugar pill
when I take just one, eventually I take just under the
acetaminophen
limit and feel the pain dull a very little bit,
obviously causing me to
run out quickly, so now I take gin and xanex, which
sucks ass as a pain
killer.Â

So if all my receptors and shit have been ‘re-set’ why
is this the
case?Â

Was it due to my methadone dose being so high that my
bio-chem’s
still aren’t up to par?Â

Shelly,
Â

I very much agree with Preston that taking the 12
step, “well all that
time is gone now” approach may not be the best.Â

The fact is, you
haveÂ

NOT used more then you have used for, did I hear
correctly 3
months?Â

Don’t let that shame/guilt or whatever bring you
down.Â

You
are where you are now, not yesterday or whatever.Â

Just learn from it
and let it go.Â

Know you aren’t alone.Â

And when I say that it isn’t
as
some slogan to put on a bumper sticker
Â
Sometimes, when I first stopped after iboga, I felt I
had to be perfect
because I felt like the iboga/ine salesman or
spokesman or whatever
(obviouslly an ego trip) and that prevented me from
looking at some of
the leftover stuff that I had to look at without
iboga/ine.Â

Everyone
is different though and I don’t want to project my
experience as
yours.Â

Find your own path.Â

And please Talk soon.
Â

You have merely
“slipped,”
you are not a loser, nor a bad person for having done
so.

We
are
all
or we used to be and
still
could be at the drop of a hat.

But one slip doesn’t make a “thrown
away” nor
should you dwell on the guilt and shame.

it’s ok

amazing
and
brilliant
keep your chin up
slip does not a bad person make
we
need
all perspectives

humbly

Letting off steam
Re:Q st
Patrick,
Â
overwhelmed by how much their is to do.
Â
Yes, I’m “Mr.263” but I got tired of hearing myself
say that, as it is
helping to define my present by the ‘fucked up-ness’
of the past.Â

Am I the one Marc gets excited about?Â

I seriouslly doubt it.Â

First
of all, I’m not female,
2nd of all, I was a little nervous about putting all
my
eggs in one basket, so to speak. Â

they find it more reliable.Â

I never relapsed back to methadone since my first dose
of extract late
June of 2003.Â
Â

So I’m the 263 guy, wish I heard of more high dose
methadone kicks Â
Â

cutting it.
Â

guess couldn’t handle the pressure.Â

“<shrug>”
Â

How’z yoU?Â

Find any interesting brains lately?
Â

For some reason I have suspended within my mind the
concept of
you and 263mgs of methadone. Are YOU the guy Marc
was always all
excited about over the phone…? i.e., are you the
person who kicked
that much methadone, using the Indra materials…?

If this is you… It would rock if you could write
some kinda
experience piece, thought-thing, collection of
experience; so we
could
place it online somewhere. See, nobody has ever
written any fucking
thing about Indra and using it to kick high-dose
methadone; ‘cept
like
random, mostly incoherent blips and bursts, from sum
of Sara’s
patients
who are still fLyIng, and haven’t touched back down
yet.

You haz…

Whut was it like…?

This would be a cool collection of experience to set
down, because
nobody else has ever done it.

Just my thoTs… \

perhaps this isn’t what you wanna do at all,
but I am
flipping
through a lot of ibogaine
material

right now; and this
particular series of moments suspended within time
don’t exist yet.

Patrick

Cock’s Liquors
Reply-To: mindvox
“…then we’re nothing but the nerds they say we are.”
Â

Here’s some interesting links I’m sure youÂ

have all seen before, but
just in case I’m not the only one here still learning.
Â

very interested in what they have
learned.Â
Â

http://www.geocities.com/SoHo/Exhibit/2869/gabon.htmlÂ
(nice pics)
Â
————————————————————————

———————–
Regarding heroin vs. methadone.Â

if
heroin
was legal in a clinic setting, I’d say go for it.Â

But it’s not, and
so
black market “gee, hope this isn’t a hot shot”, spend
too much time
scoring or attempting to score, etc.Â

Plus, at least for me,
compulsion
seems allot harder to keep in control with heroin
rather then ‘done.Â

But you are right, heroin is a short acting and
methadone a long
acting.Â

So what.Â

Both can be kicked with ibo.Â

Especially if
starting
new business, why throw heroin into the mix?Â

And I am also curious,
why stop Methadone Maintenance  in the first place, do
you have a warrant or
something that means you must stop methadone this
moment or else?Â

I’m
curious why you don’t have the time to save for ibo
treatment.Â

At
least get your business footing on the ground first,
let it find it’s
legs first?Â

You would know better then me. Â

I think you know the
right
path, although, it may not be the easy one.Â

Or keep asking more
peope,
perhaps one will give youÂ

an answer you want them to give : )
Â

“We need a good chemist.”

Is Music good or bad post iboga?
So the issue comes up about whether music is a good
(defining good as adds benefits to individuals and
society)  or bad (detrimental to individual and/or
society).  And whether the intent of listening or
making sound influences the result of the objective
i.e. the reason for listening in the first place.

Does music help or harm, and how do we define music?

Obviously many objectives can be presented for sound.
In early human ritual, spiritual music, and in the
20th century in our secularized science world view,
psychology often fills the void that popular dogma too
often falls short for some who may prefer a different
spiritual approach to music then there local group
worship may not perceive as spiritual.  Who is to say
what sound is a secular sound and what is not?

So have we full explored the potential of sound as a
means to personal fulfillment, personal advancement
and even perhaps as a social tool?  Is the placebo
effect sometimes required?  How can we measure the
effects of set and setting when the very tools used to
measure may or may not disrupt or effect the result in
some way.  What are the limits of psychology’s world
view and is it simply biochemistries fill in until the
results come in?  Who will sponsor the research for
these “cures” to become available to the people who
need them, and what motivates them to do what they do?
What are the limits of evaluating something
objectively?  Can people heal
“emotionally:/spiritually from sound?  How much of a
significance should sound play in ones life?  Is it
adding or taking?  Is it delivering on it’s healing?
Is it worthwhile?

So here are two tapes one ambient, relax, reading
music, doing something else sound.
The other is various blank tape cut-ups of radio only,
made without the intention of anyone else ever hearing
it.  The objective was therapeutic, not entertainment.
It can express part of my iboga journeys that simply
cannot be expressed by other ways or medians.  I find
each way of expression has it’s own abilities to
express that which otherwise would have to remain
un-expressed.  And when I say this I mean not only
that expressed by humans, or animals, plants or
insects, but that which is the complex rhythmic
structure of two ends of a aluminum can blowing down a
street.  When these things are noticed, the direction
of the wind, the “higher” seems more accessible in our
thought patterns, providing a constant reminder of the
divinity and universal uniqueness of  everything.
Like schools of fish, birds coming with the seasons.

Also sometimes the best way to banish a negative is to
let it feedback until it pops, this can be dangerous
and I would only do as a last resort but if it gets
bad enough a roll of the dice can sometimes be better
if stuck in pattern.  I do think that the negative
expressed as best as what sounds are available and
then cut those expressions of negativity thus
releasing the individual from the control of that
negativity.  The trick is not confusing the map with
territory.  It means nothing without both intention
AND follow up, regarding actions.

Noise can be a good expression of negative.  In my own
experience radio frequency noise (when dial isn’t on a
station) express allot of the spy vs. spy energy
regarding ibogaine visions of molecular computers.  My
HCL vision was much more “scientific” then the iboga
plant extract which contains all the alkaloids of the
plant and to me personally seems more balanced.  I
would say the only way I could express the difference
is extract is like eating an orange, HCL was like
eating frozen orange juice concentrate out of the can.
Another way I might express the difference between
the two with me personally is extract was like a
volume knob, HCL was like an equalizer with one
frequency  turned up with the other frequencies down.

I read for about a year before my first dose.  And I
feel that it is likely that what I read and my
impressions very likely effect how my journeys turned
out and my reactions and my post journey evaluation.
The problem was a synthetic opioid.  I used a plant
cannabis as a sincere sacrament.  My first dose of
“ibo” was in the form extract.  The last thing I saw
before going to the building of where I was to be
dosed, was a small fragile iboga plant in the window
of Marc Emery’s BC Marijuana Party Building.  I was
given my treatment at no cost (at a time some charge
$10,000 for dose), and the thoughts and confusion of
why me?  The thought of some random act of compassion,
and what does it say about me that I suspect political
motives, because I didn’t see value in me, and didn’t
understand what he saw.  This is why I said nothing on
the way to the dose, even though, in any other
circumstance I would have been taking the opportunity
to learn as much as possible.
Their was allot of shame in excepting his offer, that
is another reason I said so little on the ride over,
he was nice enough to take the time to pick me up,
drive me, and assisted the dosing.  One of my favorite
memories of sound is hearing Marc strum the black
acoustic guitar in the “living room” of the apartment,
while I was in the “bedroom” just about to swallow a
handful of extract.  The pills of extract, probably
due to me throwing them up and them re-capping them
and giving back, seemed to come endlessly.  Like Marc
was that Grandfather that pulls quarters out of your
ear, he kept pulling iboga extract.  When he informed
me methadone wasn’t available and the only other way
to administer would be via enema I kept the pills down
after that.  But their was much shame in solidifying
how bad it had become, and knowing that I would
forever be indebted to this man.  Even if I paid back
the cost.

I wouldn’t have dosed me if I were him.
Bob Marley says “don’t let a politician lend you a
favor.”  But I so much didn’t understand why he would
basically save me from what I had cornered myself into
I had to assume that it was a misperception of some
kind and I didn’t want to ruin that misconception as
it was my only life raft from the police, who do not
give methadone in jail here.  I say misconception
because it was and perhaps is unfathomable that I have
something to offer, that I have worth.  My Orlaam kick
really did allot of damage to me and my faith in my
own abilities, the shame of not being able to “beat
it”, and as a result of the experience, it took a much
larger dose of methadone to “stabilize me” then
before.  Prior to Orlaam cold turkey kick I was around
double digits or at the most low hundreds.  But
afterward I can honestly say that stabilization (being
not sick) didn’t happen until I was on a 263 mg/day

Sat, 31 Jul 2004 13:19:46 -0700

New ment fresh Bush Tester

“Help Is On The Way”  lol!

Yeah, that check seems to be in the mail every 4 years

from both parties.

:  )

I can’t believe (oh wait, yes I can) that TV ‘news’
has ignored yet another vital story.  I had no idea
that the whole mandatory mental health testing thing
is actually already going through in someplace in
ILL., So Bush would just be taking a ‘working program’
to a national level, which isn’t so bad right?

I’m just so amazed that they can sell the idea without
even really hiding the corporate interests of it, what
concerns me more then that they are doing it is that
they don’t even feel like they should have to hide
that it’s all about profits regardless if good or bad
long term.  I had similar thoughts when I was in jail,
they don’t even PRETEND like they are there to make
people productive members of society again or to
rehabilitate in any way (someone put in jail for hot
checks isn’t given time/guidance/pointers on how to
keep checkbook balanced),  they don’t even pretend
like it’s not just about the money.  They don’t even
pretend.  The guards talk fairly openly about that.
They make a set amount of money for each head, not to
mention they have the people do everything (trustee
Labor) except guard the inmates.  Prison and War are
good business.  And I guess, “mental health” is too.

spr.org

Nosaj

—– Original Message —–
From: CallieMimosa@aol.com
7/31/2004 11:30:53 AM Central Daylight Time,
HSLotsof@aol.com writes:
I think that a great deal of concern should be voiced
towards the Bush administration’s concept of testing
Americans for mental
disorders.  The issue of Bush using antidepressants
being set aside.

I am very concerned about the concept of mandatory
mental health testing.
I have not worked a lot of psych but the work I have
done exposed me to many Doctors with many ideas and
concepts of diagnosing and treating mental illness.
There are some extreme cases of psychosis that must be
treated vigorously but there are also neurosis and
other less severe psychosis whose treatments vary with
each individual Doc and patient.
I am curious to see what they plan to do when they
decide you have a mental illness? Will you be branded
or tattooed so that everyone will know at a glance who
is sane and who is not (by government definition). Or,
will you be required to be medicated and be able to
prove you are indeed following ‘their’ outlined
treatment?
This shit really worries me! I just don’t think they
will test you and then not follow through if the
results are off the graph.
I for one am very happy that, “Help Is On The Way”
lol!

don’t yet know
isn’t the
whole ibogaine voyage/speaking with the spirits thing
kinda mumbo-jumbo in
and of itself?-
Either way you will find out in a few weeks : )  Is it
different for everyone?
It didn’t’ tell me anything I didn’t already know,
yet it confirmed and
solidified a solid,
for lack of a better word, vision.

Fine line between
visualization/imagination and visions.

Lots of various creatures, like
personifications of energy like visiting a spirit
animal zoo without cages.

It
is in my evaluation of these and comparing to where I
am now and where I would
like to be etc.

One thing I read people doing after dose is picking
up old
personality like out of habit like putting dirty
cloths back on.

A blank canvas
can be a scary thing.

Are their enough heartbeats in a lifetime?

Perhaps this is why people find multiple doses so
beneficial, because can
prepare better to get the most out of the experience,
which hopefully is good.
I think ‘insight’ or ‘dogma’ or whatever you want to
call it is very relative,
you will get out of it as much as you put into it,

it is
important to take a look at
if the ‘insight’ is a liability or an asset in the
long run.

What is your plan for pain management post ibogaine?

Where will you get your
energy from when it supposed to be over?

Will it take away all of sick?

How
much are you willing to walk through without it?

Are eggs all in one
basket case?

allot of John Cage’s Diary   RE:alistic
I probably wouldn’t be the best person to ask if
something is cool or not.

I do however think that it is really good and really
needed to see more of a religious instead of only
recreational tone that they generally take with herb.
We will see.  I see my role more and more as to be
there for people after they post-iboga (especially
visual and music) eventually.

now I have to start over on beginnings started with
school funding and with job, but I hope in the end it
will be worth it.

Better opportunities.

if they post-phone it again I’ll learn how to cut the
damn things out myself.

it would be really nice to come and see you.

will happen with good  time and good action.

who’s to say what does and does not really exist?

My son’s plant is going to be on the High times with
this tag on it.

I’m starting a treatment for H addiction on Friday,
poor guy will pay me the Iboga and one day stay.

Tuesday one Irish guy from Belfast will come for the
second time , also no money just covering cost

But then first week of august a lady will come from
Israel for Alcohol abuse.

Then I lost track, I have no agenda no paper work.

All that paper work make it complicated.

From Monday to Friday I have free, cleaning the house
and doing a lot of washing for the kids.

Next week two of my daughters are off or kids Camp,
school rush is starting two weeks from now.

Hey, don’t get depressed just know that it is a matter
of few days and will be sorted then your life start
new road.

I think of you, sending you good vibe.
Sara

I hope this finds you well and in good health and
spirits.

“Be Strong.         Love”

I’m curious to see reaction after the new beginning
that is coming, and then the reaction to the reaction
(re-evaluation of the journey

Remember you are not alone during such energy
shifting.

prescribed some barbiturates head was really swimming
will likely not take them again

It was good for the soul.

wash with warm water and sea salt

You will get your brain activated by feeling the pain
and your brain will reduce the pain by it self.

Don’t think about it too much ,
go to an acupuncturist after the treatment
, it will do you good to find new ways

Rotting from the inside
Over-incubated by the heat of fear and love
The self’s coagulated
Egg…
La la la la la la la
Boiling hard in euphemism
Slowly becoming part of the water
Like a frog who never knows
The jacuzzi’s getting hotter
How’d you know I was looking at you
If you weren’t looking at me?

A stagnant pale perfume
Conceived to block the pores
The clotting glands encroach
The endless comfort of a mom
Deep inside my tanning salon
Wishing life was poached
I can’t seem to differentiate
Between the yellow love you give and the white sex I
take
I just want to fertilize youThe cracks finally appear
Release cholesterol tears
The flooded cyst drains itself of pus
The lonely stomach chills unless it’s drunk
So as she drives she’ll close her eyes
Feel it warming up inside
Rotting from the inside
Over-incubated by the heat of fear and love
The self’s coagulated
Egg…
comes out of a chicken
Oh a chicken comes out of an egg

There’s no place like home…
Ohrm babby yeah.

Elm, the person who gave me my first joint and first
hit(s) of ‘cid, is at a make or break point, as it
seems most are at the moment.  It is a new moon but 2
weeks of political ads, so who knows when the time is
right.
Milk,
Bueno=BOO x’s 3
Thank you for the close callf
Howard the
can’t duck the question
Watch ya M0NT TransLvainYa
Leads to?  Bet your blood yet?
Sorry my blood was given to me after birth.
Damn, dna too?
Or do you “assume” that too?
In the only dispelled by the light.
Stop being shell shocked.
H-arvest Time.
Whatcha got?

Various Visual Ideas to put to on Film set to the
following Audio (Don’t forget to Play)

11mY twilight time Solo Piano edit
Visual starts with middle eastern man weeping Vincent
Gallo in bathroom style.  Like a bouncing ball edits
of Abu Garab  come in (fast blinking pictures start
slow, then get faster eventually blurring the two
times together.  Try blinking to the beat of a
bouncing ball and you’ll see; images include dogs
barking, hooded me, angry ‘end of the Graduate
wedding’ mouths, etc. eyes, before the edit gets fast,
911 plane hitting on odd numbers( 2: dog barking 3:
plane fly toward building 4: hooded prisoner 5: plane
fly closer 6: etc 7: closer  8 9 nose hits start of
explosion 10 11 (4 or 5 for plane impact, 8 or more
for before impact)_

After that,  Buddha burning should dominate as the
main reference point, time elapsed close up of flowers
blooming like Bad Religion’s Atomic Garden.  Mixed in
with time elapsed film of various animals decaying
(nin concert style)_ film of heroin being shot up as
well as film of women puking from heroin sick is
essential,  the burning Buddha dominates more and more
as Film of Various Bwiti Sects are edited in like the
beginning of DCD toward the within.  Edits of various
animals fucking, slow motion film of water dropping,
overlay and juxtapose water ripples, at 3 min 45 when
only Sine Waves, stay on picture of Cenote man in Pool
that Sara ask about.

1NESTA my Natural Mystic 1min
Underground, getting Spirit messages past agents of
control.  Easiest workable paradigm is agents of
control act similar to Software designed to define the
Beats Per Minute (BPM) number of a song.  It cannot
predict a cd skipping.  So if two or more individuals
take the same Spirit medicine with open heart they can
communicate using the Spirit(s) as a reference point
to help define what otherwise would appear as rambling
non-sense noise.

1Underwater Torch Sara the Iboga Spirit from Holland
School of Dolphins swimming in beautiful Blue Pacific
somewhere in Warm Polynesian Waters

7-dimensional space is controlled by so called
Superintelligence G-BETA, which is located in 7th
dimension.
13-dimensional space is controlled by
Superintelligence G-ALPHA, which is located in 13th
dimension.
33-dimensional space is controlled by
Superintelligence S-ALPHA, which is located in 33rd
dimension.

What are Superintelligences actually doing?
They control everythink and they take care of
everythink.
because it has insight into God – not his thoughts but
into his databases.
And yes, there’s still a lot concerning rays,
but unfortunately we won’t be able to discuss it all
because it exceeds frame of our conversation.

http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/shows/religion/jesus/jefferson.html

Jefferson omitted the words that he thought were
inauthentic and retained those he believed were
original. The resulting work is commonly known as
the
“Jefferson Bible.”

i read that book at the moment, tried to read it
before but never got
into it like now. this cuts of perceptions,
association lines and
visions are really alive. changed the way i walked
around outside
today, all the time the attention on something
different, cars move by,
a yellow curtain, gestures, different lines of
thinking, words and bits
of music in the sound, not really i mean, and so
on,
constantly cut up.
made things kind of clearer. a function also on
other levels i think.

burroughs was very choosy doing them actually,
cutting pages for hours
until he had a few bits that would relate images
of
dreams and visions,
like my secondary literature tells me. quality
cutting kind of,
randomness used for unrandom results.

is the reality film prerecorded?
maybe, prolly not though.
are your actions predetermined?
not as thought out as they should be no.
Predetermined?? by what?  probably more
impressionable
then predetermined.
is meat murder?
depends if their is a war or not
does my own judgment inhibit myself?
yes.
do others exist?
yes.
possibilities.
Am 02.05.2005 um 18:11 schrieb Morning Wood:
I’d rather feel the Earth
beneath my feet
yes I wood
if I only could
I surely wood
When I used to visit my father in san Francisco,
their
were plenty street music people, one group from
central america.
need new software…oh and food, but mostly
new
software
accidental feed vain art culinary specified
vague
gauge hydraulic hymn machine priest soft erect
may
pole ribbon weave love sunflower inanimate
becoming
animate caricature past spin mirror outward
direction
boomerang or simply boom
http://www.answers.com/topic/caricature?method=8
So my skin stopped being yellow.  I started, I am
told, to talk.  I am told I returned briefly to baby
talk after Father had to leave.
I was lucky in that almost all of my family worked for
airlines so were able to travel and see more then
would have otherwise.  “Old dad” in San Mateo (Bay
Area), go to see during summer.  Some of my fondest
memories are of being in Hawaii as a child, good
Polynesian energy.

Etc. who the fuck cares about the details.

What you done the last year?

Just banished some negativity?  Did I bother sowing
any seed?  Did I discard possibilities?  Write a “4th
step” while others bleed? Get down or lay down.
Everything is connected to it is connected to
Everything.  Assume it won’t effect who?  Have you
really thought this through?  Out of sage? Roll some
time/tyme, swat the flies, concave reflection of t.v.
in glass eyes while glow of computer screen?  stay
teachable.  CIA screen? It’s not just me.  Can’t hold
understanding back.

Date:    Fri, 19 Mar 2004 phantom scribble, in
fact
hmm lets see a couple of other ignorant cloned
virus’s, nothing ticking at your request have the
circuit board one, the rest are
schematic keys
I’ve seen <KaboOm!> before:
http://www2.aros.net/~lambo/ibogaine/ibogaine.htm

JPL and their whole entire, “Not
for Human Consumption!” catalog.
HCl *is* eaisier to drop dead
on than the extract, though, not exactly.
listen to a miX of pretty much everything
cool and abstract
Howard sent me a letter of encouragement and a book of
stamps and $10 bill–I was really touched by that, I
never asked him for anything

Know that you aren’t alone in your journey…and it
sounds like it will be a
productive one.

Remember we all look up at the same stars and sun
and breathe
the same air,
and act and react from
desire and fear,
what are the limitations
of (fill in the blank)?
Eventually leads to what are the limitations of asking
‘what are the limitations of (fill in the blank).
…i’ll puff some buddha
and exhale a blessing
Brooke Burgess >Sent: Sunday, March 21, 2004, 7:27 PM
sounds like naturally bravery to me…you’re blessed

I’m a pretty fearful person, and hide behind myriad
masks.
behind each of them the nature of the tangled roots
that feed from soil.  garden
in sunlight.

“DON’T PANIC”, test dose
ease into the experience
some inner dialogue asking
why am i feeling anxious?
million different question/answer dialogue
an opportunity to find the root
reevaluate the situation from a different perspective

Many shades of grey between bad/- and good/+
(defining good and bad
not as did it ‘cure me’ but as
was the experience a pleasant one or
not)
…I assume all journey’s have lessons
stopped vomiting at 5 days after dose…but
8 months of diarrhea isn’t fun either
vast unimaginable sick
mental reaction to what’s left of sick has changed;
like unfocusing so I can refocus,
unstablizing so I can become stable,
and iboga very much helps to not
let the persistence of sick get to me
and it gradually gets better,
exhausted as
fuck, but better.

“the only way around this shit is through”

isn’t that difficult to switch to listening to
exciting journey
yet perhaps harsh teacher,
, some reality just isn’t pretty
herb can ,to
some, be a harsh teacher (give a high dose of herb to
a non-smoker who
panic attacks and see

my friend over heard me say “…yeah, i kicked a
opioid
addiction with iboga…” And he yells out angrily
“iboga didn’t do it
dude, you did it!!”  I don’t think either one is
completely correct.  I’m not
sure which is filling the other’s cracks, I’m just
happy the cracks are being
filled.  Not sure if either one could have done it
without the other.

Date:    Mon, 22 Mar 2004 07:49:

“This is a great time to do iboga, just after the
Spring equinox,
traditionally a time when light overtakes dark, so all
the signs are most
auspicious. I’m going to do some myself later today.
Can’t wait!”
-Nick

http://www.nzz.ch/2004/01/24/english/page-synd4661691.html

“Ten years of heroin handouts fixes drug crime”; be
easier to kick then long lasting opioids?  Big moral
difference to some between short and long lasting I
guess.  Interesting harm reduction reading non the
less.

Didn’t Tim L. talk about wondering how much
information/reality the human mind can stand? How much
knowledge can the human brain/mind take before it is
overwhelmed?  Very serious stuff to consider I guess.

I’ve had bad/panic type experiences on LSD (the person
I dropped with was convinced that his was cut with
poison and a few hours later when I finally got
distance from them I started thinking “I took the same
thing they did” and bam, panic etc.  Yes, on LSD and
X;, but never on natural ones like shrooms or
mescal/peyote; iboga wasn’t like any of these, it
definitely has it’s own character and personality–.
To be honest, I was scarred shitless beforehand of
going through it. Sickness is bad enough by itself,
sick while tripping (takes me back to my Laam cold
turkey kick (4 hours of sleep in 6 weeks–beyond
unspeakable pain); so yeah, iboga lasting as long as
it does…disserves not fear but respect.  My biggest
fear with it is biting off more then can chew then
being stuck for so long in that harsh lesson; respect
it, learn it, but fear it? I haven’t felt ‘out of
control’ on iboga; Ego seems to be able to be present,
discarded or kept at your choice…too often we  put
back on our armor out of habit after the experience, i
went to jail afterwards and that definitely made shit
worse in that regard, more hardened, less
trusting…which is the direct opposite of what iboga
told me was the way……Sometimes a mind blinder is
just what was needed.  I am a little biased in this
but for me: lsd only scatters, iboga scatters then
re-focus’s; it was very spiritual, but remember when I
say this that the basics of Buddha:

1. All life is suffering

2. The cause of suffering is dukka (loosely trans. as
desire)

3. The way to graduate from suffering is through
compassion.

I would imagine a facilitator could give better
information on how often people just loose it; i’d bet
their aren’t many if everything is done in a
respectful, non-arrogant, and teachable way.

I got hit with a bombshell today…Few weeks back had
the roughest time I had yet and HAD to talk to
someone….so not being experienced in international
calls from Texas I call Sara (www.iboga.tk) and she
was compassionate enough to talk to me for…lets
see…(flipping through ‘war&piece’phone
bill)….about 149 minutes…I felt much better
afterwards and she didn’t make a dime off of talking
to me.  I had no idea…the phone bill came
today…..$750   Stuff like that will make me like
SdBarrett, not iboga : “The dark side of public floyd”
by Pink Enemy
In the ’60’s, there was much talk of a soldier gone
AWOL named private Floyd. Rumor had it that this
soldier learned how to grow marijuana in his armpits
,distill LSD in his bladder and harvest opium in his
nostrils. This resulted in a state of intoxication so
intense that individual parts of his body would
suddenly detach and launch themselves into orbit
around the sun. One night Pink Enemy, avid astronomers
that they are, noticed a new binary system consisting
of two kneecaps orbiting what appeared to be an
imploded human brain. Having divined that these were
indeed the mortal remnants of legendary private Floyd
,they wittily decided to name the system “public
floyd”, and in tribute composed this touching elegy.

“Sliding scale” clinics could be the way to go
I was handed notice at Methadone clinic last week that
my insurance has decided I do not need Methadone
Maintenance anymore. Reason given was “According to
the records your provider sent to us, our Doctor feels
Methadone Maintenance is no longer needed.”
I of course got angry…….then filed an appeal. I
asked her what she had in mind for ‘us’ to do

I don’t know his motives or any of that.

he did treated me FOR FREE (paging Dr. Mash) which
nobody  would have nor will they do.

I’m sure  you  have moral authority and high ground
on this issue.

Sometimes I think I’m the most selfish person in the
world, then I read
this list and feel much better.
A Bong is made  mostly of glass and a joint of
rolling papers.RIGHT?
is this a big deal or
something?
There is something unspeakably pure about hobo art,
like unnoticed colors of 3rd world sunsets.  I think
children and the insane are far more likely to make
good art.  No question about that.

( Resume Fake it ‘till you make it bullshit)

I . . . who took the money?
Who took the money away?
I,i,i . . . it’s always show time
Here at the edge of the stage.
I, i, i, wake up and wonder
What was the place?

What was the name?
We want to wait

but here we go again…

I . . . takes over slowly
But doesn’t last very long.

I,i,i . . . no need to worry
Everything’s under control.

O – u – t

but no hard feelings.
What do you know?

take you away.
We’re being taken for a ride again.
I got a girlfriend that’s better then that
She has the smoke in her eyes.
She’s moving up, going right through my heart
She’s going to give me surprise
Better than this,

know that it’s right.
I think you can if you like.
I got a girlfriend with bows in her hair
And nothing is better than that

(is it?)

Down, down in the basement
We hear the sound of machines.
I, i, i, i’m driving in circles.
Come to my senses sometimes.

Why, why, why, why start it over?
Nothing was lost, everything’s free.
I don’t care how impossible it seems.

Somebody calls you but you cannot hear
Get closer to be far away.
Only one look and that’s all that it takes
Maybe that’s all that we need.

All that it takes,

all that it takes
All that it takes,

all that it takes

I got a girlfriend that’s better than that
She goes wherever she likes.

(there she goes…)

Now everyone’s getting involved.

As we get older

And stop making sense

You won’t find her waiting long.

Stop making sense

Stop making sense

Stop making sense

Making sense

I got a girlfriend that’s better then that.

And nothing is better then this.

(or is it?)

From: HSLotsof@aol.com [mailto:HSLotsof@aol.com]
Sent: Monday, March 29, 2004, 5:33 PM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] getting ibogaine information out

I’m one of the few people who posts to newsgroups
about ibogaine and
deartheo@ziplip.com is one of the few people writing
government officials
about ibogaine.
-Howard

correct situation
correct relationship
correct function

\ making a situation that could be outside normal

experience and usual definition of self.

/||||||||||||

it always is

=)

Regular periods of keeping still are an important
aspect of personal development and forward motion. The
most restful person may not be the one who sleeps
twelve hours a day, but the one able to grab catnaps
while cruising at 500 miles-per-hour at 35,000 ft.
Learning to act when it is time to act, and to keep
still when it is time to keep still, is the key to
obtaining the peace of mind which helps one stay
focused when clear focus is needed.

Consider the spine, which serves as a switchboard for
all the nerves of the body which mediate movement.
When the spine is kept flexible and healthy through
proper rest and relaxation, active movement can always
be undertaken without strain. When the spine is held
erect in a balanced sitting posture, the inner
balancing of meditation can take place.

Treat your innate spark of vitality as if it were a
candle in the wind – protecting it as though it were
your only light in a dark forest on a moonless night.
Avoid external conditions which threaten to snuff out
the flame, and be careful not to suffocate it with
your own ambitions and worries.

Time out. Relax, take your shoes off, and sit a spell.
Let go of thinking. Meditate.

A child dies every 15 seconds from a preventable
waterborne disease, higher than the rate of death from
HIV/AIDS.

More than half of the diseases in the world are caused

by unclean water.

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] my name is matt and im a drug addict–hi matt
Date: May 10, 2005 at 5:22:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

:}}….love u all for real no joke:}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}}
everything will be alright
evrything willturn out fine
at night i still cant sleep
but the voices pass with time
and i get no time to worry
no time for breaking down
NO TIME TO CRY in this motherfucken life………but at least i   have a bathtub my new sanctuary.  love the bathtub…the best thing about this is 70 someethin g hours in wd the worst thing about this is only 70  hours in wd…..those sneezing fits rock ur body so hard….fuck me…..ah whatever its 5 now new day same shiht waiting for death to pass by–yeay!!i just want to curl up and sleep at least an hour pls anybody can u spare an hour ofur sleep for a poor fool who is doomed to fuck up over andover again…..this shuderng pain….complete restlesness…weak body weak mind weak spirit…la la la la la lalalala i LOVE THEH SMURFS especialy smurfete poor lonely soul doesnt hve another female to talk to——i feel for u smurfete—–lets hope in the future the writers will be more sympathtic—-the whole city sleeps….the sleep of sleep…im going back to counting sheep i guess..last count 1 500 435 no no my mistake 1 500 436…..good day all….love u lots—i love sheep….when i get well im going to eat one i think…yah or a goose but goose arre fatty i dont want to be fat now do i with my all 68 kg now…hm ribs are begeining to show again on this emeciated body…..and for a while there i was looking prety good …..well signing off……yay 5 25 and its getting light outside whorah for a new luazy day

Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Chretien Schiffer” <junkyshaman@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 5:16:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

“……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……”

i think iboga, in part, is here exactly to help us with our stupidity. and, perhaps you even thinking that is in itself showing great respect for iboga.

mucho amor bro

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 10, 2005 at 3:55:56 AM EDT
To: my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/MorningWood/msg/b21b03204687ff5b?hl=en

— Lee Albert <> wrote:
Hi Jason,

I would be really interested to know what you mean
by:

i had difficult hcl, perhaps that was a reason
why.

triggered paranoid experience, inexperienced  (some
asleep while I was freeking, and incourage me to not
bother them), I for sure got in touch with some
different energies

Can you explain the background to this, i.e.,
dosage,

around 20 mg/kg, I had taken extract twice in the year
prior to that.  The doses were staggered, the staff
was inexperienced and simply didn’t know.  I think it
is worth asking someone considering taking ibogaine to
ask if they have ever had bad experience with
anti-depressents because I would consider some of my
reaction similar to that.  I have not tried a total
alkaloid hcl to see but would assume I wouldn’t have
trouble with it since I seem to not have any problem
with extract in my personal experience.

state prior to taking (drug free?)
just out of prison as iboga aftercare, pretty ruff
on-guard type energy, one of my goals prior to dosing
the hcl was to let go of some of the defense
mechanisms I picked up during my time there.

Yes I have been drug free for 2 years.

and
aftereffects, i.e., how did you feel within 36 hours
of taking it,

it wasn’t all in one dose, it was staggered and the
staff hadn’t done that before, I prefer to stagger and
listen to the energy to see what dose is right,

where you in pain or did you feel fine
after 36 hours?

wasn’t physical pain.

What exactly was difficult about it that you did not
experience on the extract? Where the difficulties
within the session or after? What kind of
difficulties?

here read this cliff note version from 8 or so days
after dosing w/ hcl if I can go more indebth in a
certain part let me know:

http://www.cannabisculture.com/forums/showflat.php?Cat=&Number=845064&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1
john henry is me.

this was posted recently and is a cut up from stuff
from last year:

http://groups-beta.google.com/group/MorningWood/browse_thread/thread/40dcabb443cc6f8b/6f6e4061f4cefa29?hl=en#6f6e4061f4cefa29

If you have time I would be very interested to know.

Cheer,

Lee

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:
I have terrible reactions to anti-depressents and
maoi’s

i had difficult hcl, perhaps that was a reason why.

i did not have anything like that reaction with
extract.

the reason I bring it up, other then to infurate
control junkies, is that I think using extract in
low
doses afterwards can be of benifit to the issue of
“add”

I do think medical science is too quick to label
things that they simple do a terrible job treating.

my question anytime a “bi-polar” or “a.d.d.” comes
up is what are the characteristics that led them to
that diagnosis, (is it something that shows up on a
test or just a hunch)

9 times out of 10 they seem to just say you have
something, and if the medication works then it’s
like
verification…if it doesn’t work, well at least you
know you don’t have “it”.

not that anyone would reply, but has anyone ever
taking the medication that they treat people with
‘a.d.d.’ after dosing with ibogaine?

so to summerize, if your having trouble with that,
maybe contacting other providers to see if they can
help might be an option, (just to clearify, I am not
assuming your provider is irresponsible, just the
more
options and diversity of information the better.

Interesting thing about language…sow mol ia and Ru
Wand Da have one single unifies langage and see
great
suffering from war.
Cameroon has over 150 languages and has peace.

I have peace.

Later.
jason bursey
— HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/3/05 11:56:48 AM,
ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

Gotta say I’ve had the exact opposite reaction to
ibogaine, with nary a
single ADD issue raising it’s head.
Thank goodness.

To the best of my recollections things got a bit
fuzzy during the first few
days post ibogaine (possibly fuzzy is an
understatement) and then everything
got real clear. But, then there is the ever
present
issue of diverse effects
common to virtually everything including
medications/drugs.

Howard

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Chretien Schiffer” <junkyshaman@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 9, 2005 at 5:08:53 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Here’s a report i wrote up after my amanita experience:

Liquid Excretions
by C.S.

Winter Solstice 2003

Amanita muscaria
15 grams

A brother of mine who loves this mushroom had a bunch and i was interested having never done them before and always hearing that they were poisonous. It is a super-attractive plant, more or less screaming “look at me!”, and I’m sure that our relationship with it goes way back.

I was with another bro who had also never done them before. We hadn’t ate anything since the night before. We were told to take 30 grams dried mushrooms and shred ’em up with hands, put ’em in a pot, add enough water, add some spiderweb and bring to a simmer (170-190 f) or so for about 30 minutes. We prayed with attention and respect. The scent of dank mushroom filled the house. After about 30 minutes we were left with two cups of stew. Probably should have added more water, but being our first time we were ok with stew over a danty tea, and besides it felt more berserker-like with mugs of steaming mushroom gruel.

We cleared our spots and brought in the pillows, we cleansed the house with good vibrations and some sage. My friends house that we were tripping at was great, datura, salvia, and peruvian torch surrounded us with pleasant plant energy. We brought in some amanita toys of which our western culture has many. We toasted the gods and drank. Not bad really, but certainly not a casual drink. plus with very little water it was alot of chewing. Mmm, yum… amanita. Got it all down, loaded the bong, and prepared to settle in for the journey.

After about 20 minutes started to feel slightly disorriented, started sweating a little bit, salivation started increasing, and took a big piss.

At around the 40 minute i was feeling more and more disorriented, started sweating profusely, and drooling like crazy. I had to pee every 10 minutes. It was crazy, I started pouring out water, outta every pore and orifice. I was like a wet rag being rungout.

After this, time became a blur, my vision felt outta focus, and I would drift of into delirious dream trances off and on inbetween cleaning the drool of my face, wiping sweat of my body, and taking a piss. I also took several hot showers in my dilerium because i would get very cold.

My goddess, the water faucet wouldn’t turn off. I drooled more, sweated more, peed more. I was drenched, all my clothes were soaked. The pillows were soaked, I was creating a lake. It must have looked hilarious, a kodak moment for sure. Seriously, I never could have imagined that much liquid excreting from all exits of my body. No joking, several gallons, it was craziness. My friend was sweating alot too but not nearly on the level I was.

As far as mental stuff goes I mostly felt a little out of it, I was in a calm state of mind in a delirious kinda fashion. No visuals, full on body high (or down).

Lasted about 8 hours overall. I was encouraged by our amanita-lovin’ brother to extend the trip by drinking some of my magic pee, but 8 hours was long enough for me, so I left the magic pee in the fridge for the next lucky customer. I went home and went to bed.

The next morning I felt great. It felt like I had been through several sweat lodges. Purged of all toxins, I felt energized and ready for the drive down to Mexico.

Last notes. Either this mushroom is very specific to certain brain chemistry or it’s very variable in itself. My brother swears by it, he loves it, it’s his plant ally. Apparently he gets visuals and the whole works. But for me this experience was not psychedelic or hallucinogenic by any means. Entheogenic, sure. But for someone that’s thinking a psilocybin-style shroom, definitely no (though they might like it anyway). The only thing I liked about this was that I felt purged and cleansed and ready to go the next day. But over all the sweat lodge route would have felt more pleasurable. Would I try it again? Yes. Because I’m curious and persistent and think I have 9 lives, haha.

_________________________________________________________________
FREE pop-up blocking with the new MSN Toolbar – get it now! http://toolbar.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200415ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 6:52:24 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey
im glad u had more succes this time lets hope everyhing will work out:}……..the reason i dont want to do ibo now is because of my heart and becasue i made a comitment to my self not to do ibo for detox because knowing my self it would be too easy to fuck up later on and on and on……..plus i want to have a full blwon journey and i know i need time in between doses……i took ibo twice in four months……….much love to u and everybody else here …thank u all ……words thoughts have an amzing power on everyhign around us………what we have now is what generations before us have created through their thoughts and ideas….taht is fucken beutifull……grrrrrrrrrrrrr so restless inside…..

Namaste
Matthew

Help protect your PC with Virus Guard from MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 10, 2005 at 2:14:42 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Do you know where that amanita was from?

On Sun, 08 May 2005 19:52:53 -0700 Chretien Schiffer
<junkyshaman@hotmail.com> wrote:
two very different things in my opinion, not comparable.

my amanita journey was like bieng in a alien sweat lodge for 8
hours
straight. i was pouring liquid outta every orifice, it was crazy.
seriously,
i’m talking several gallons, mind-boggling amounts, and it
probably didn’t
look too pretty. it wasn’t uncomfortable and certainly wasn’t
comfortable,
drooling around in a limbo space. but the next day i felt good,
like
cleansed, it felt like the muscamole toxin(?) pushed out all these

other
toxins that were hanging out in my body. superclean, but then it
was an 8
hour supershower.

some describe amanita like a classic psychedelic experience, who
knows,
lotsa variables to look into. amanitas are in a catagory all to
themselves.
the muscarine, ibotenic acid, and muscamole look nothing like the
structure
of ibogaine which is home to the tryptamine family of things and
has many
relatives.

mucho amor,
chretien

Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind
of
experience compared to ibo.
Namaste Matt

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it’s

FREE!
http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=————————————————————–

——-=[\r
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————

——=[/

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 10, 2005 at 2:12:26 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered
yesterday as i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went
through
hell four months ago coming off all that shit i promoisded my self
i
wouldnt never get addicted again ….so much for promises…..is
ignorance bliss>?

Dunno..

Did you get any help/therapy after coming off? If you study the
reasons for the tripups, they can gradually lose their sting.

I agree that 30 mg/kg sounds like a lot, best to allow a month or
more to get over it (baby steps at first). The more help you can
accept, the better you are doing.

On Mon, 09 May 2005 11:57:19 -0700 Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
wrote:
30 does sounds a lot and I am inclined to think that after a
certain dose (depending on why you are taking it) any extra just
gets in the way particularly if you are clean taking it. A better
use imo is to split the dose and keep 9 or 10 for a booster a
couple of weeks later for instance.
The higher the dose does not always equal a better or deeper
experience as the action of the eboga is governed by 2 things in
my experience: how much you are able to be ripped open if that is
the nature of the session you are up for and 2. how much the
spirit will come to life within you and that it choses to do as it

sees fit. It doesn’t obey doses but it does need a dose to do its
work. Its possible to take 20mg/kg and lie back and just bliss out

for a few hours. If you are looking to have a max experience all
you can do is chose a max dose that will facilitate it but there
is no gaurantee that it will happen. Taken it clean I would say a
max dose is probably about 20 based on personal experience.
Lee

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
First of all what happened to you is probably the most natural
thing in the world, thats what we do! But I hear you about being
emotionally unbalanced in WD thats par for the course and some are

better than others when it comes to dealing with it. but me myself

I’m the biggest pussy on earth when I start to feel that pain. I
can certainly relate to crying when I looked at my arms.
Just out of curiosity, how many times have you taken Ibogaine?
I’m not quite sure why you would be resistant to another session.
Having respect for it is one thing and I can’t imagine too many
people who’ve been to taken to that place not having a tremendous
amount of respect for it but multiple sessions are not the
exception to the rule and is way more the norm when it comes to
this. You put 4 months together if I’m correct and thats a fuckin
miracle. How many times have any of us been able to do that
conventionally?
I had 4 months and then spent 3 months in hell and was just
retreated 5 weeks ago and I have to tell you I feel so different
this time around than I did the last. I got so much more out of it

and I was way more open to what it was showing me and what its
STILL showing me.
Also, and I have a big problem with this myself, don’t get so hung

up on the numbers. I took 18 mg/kg my first time around with
3mg/kg boosters after for 5 days and this time around I took
25mg/kg all at once but if you’ve just recently caught another
habit (chip) 15 mg/kg might be fine. Not to mention 30mg/kg all at

once in the woods might be a little dangerous. Some might disagree

but why take that risk?
But hang in there man and if you have access to Ibogaine try and
make that happen as soon as possible. My own feeling is that its
even more “disrespectful” to not take it again. It’ll show you and

give you just what you need. As long as you have the right
intentions your not abusing it, your seeking guidance from an ally

who showed you a way out once before and will again if you let it.

Good luck and my thoughts are with you. -M.

matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered
yesterday as i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went
through hell four months ago coming off all that shit i promoisded

my self i wouldnt never get addicted again ….so much for
promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken pointless i
think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the bathtub

i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im
emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but

i dont feel right about using it for this again……i feel too
much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get
well illl have a full proper session in the woods, nothing under
30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked on the ground with the
energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken right—-ok time
for a bath again

There be days when i stray,

i may appear to be constantly out of reach

i give in

to sin

because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode

What bunch of bullshit or is it>?

Namaste
Matthew

———————————
Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium:
Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=——————–

————————————————-=[ [%] Ibogaine
List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————–

—-=[/

———————————
Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine
over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing
Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual
interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list
for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 5:07:49 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Lee is totally right imo. You can’t sledgehammer yourself into straightness, it’s just not the same principle at work. If you take more than you need you just get spaced out all over the place till it leaves your system. That’s my experience. Maybe you get to know how insects felt on some distant galaxy a few zillion lightyears away (one of several useless memories I now have from taking excess iboga) but it’s not really so meaningful day-to-day.

Nick
—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: 09 May 2005 19:57
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

30 does sounds a lot and I am inclined to think that after a certain dose (depending on why you are taking it) any extra just gets in the way particularly if you are clean taking it. A better use imo is to split the dose and keep 9 or 10 for a booster a couple of weeks later for instance.
The higher the dose does not always equal a better or deeper experience as the action of the eboga is governed by 2 things in my experience: how much you are able to be ripped open if that is the nature of the session you are up for and 2. how much the spirit will come to life within you and that it choses to do as it sees fit. It doesn’t obey doses but it does need a dose to do its work. Its possible to take 20mg/kg and lie back and just bliss out for a few hours. If you are looking to have a max experience all you can do is chose a max dose that will facilitate it but there is no gaurantee that it will happen. Taken it clean I would say a max dose is probably about 20 based on personal experience.
Lee

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
First of all what happened to you is probably the most natural thing in the world, thats what we do! But I hear you about being emotionally unbalanced in WD thats par for the course and some are better than others when it comes to dealing with it. but me myself I’m the biggest pussy on earth when I start to feel that pain. I can certainly relate to crying when I looked at my arms.
Just out of curiosity, how many times have you taken Ibogaine?
I’m not quite sure why you would be resistant to another session. Having respect for it is one thing and I can’t imagine too many people who’ve been to taken to that place not having a tremendous amount of respect for it but multiple sessions are not the exception to the rule and is way more the norm when it comes to this. You put 4 months together if I’m correct and thats a fuckin miracle. How many times have any of us been able to do that conventionally?
I had 4 months and then spent 3 months in hell and was just retreated 5 weeks ago and I have to tell you I feel so different this time around than I did the last. I got so much more out of it and I was way more open to what it was showing me and what its STILL showing me.
Also, and I have a big problem with this myself, don’t get so hung up on the numbers. I took 18 mg/kg my first time around with 3mg/kg boosters after for 5 days and this time around I took 25mg/kg all at once but if you’ve just recently caught another habit (chip) 15 mg/kg might be fine. Not to mention 30mg/kg all at once in the woods might be a little dangerous. Some might disagree but why take that risk?
But hang in there man and if you have access to Ibogaine try and make that happen as soon as possible. My own feeling is that its even more “disrespectful” to not take it again. It’ll show you and give you just what you need. As long as you have the right intentions your not abusing it, your seeking guidance from an ally who showed you a way out once before and will again if you let it. Good luck and my thoughts are with you. -M.
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 4:59:11 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

When things are going good, I think this is usually the toughest time. To
really take on being successful, being good at something, this is much
tougher than a lot of people think. Just when things are really going well
for me, when it’s all coming together, I hear this little voice coming in my
ear, urging me to do something to fuck it all up, just so it can relax in
the knowledge that I’m still a bit fucked up and I don’t really have to take
life on totally. Being successful is quite a deal, usually you have to
really work at that for a while til you can allow it.

Nick

—–Original Message—–
From: Preston Peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: 09 May 2005 15:26
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Matthew,
I feel for you brother, I honestly do. It’s amazing how fast it can
happen, right? One minutes we’re fine and loving life, the next
we’re trying
to kill any happiness we’ve attained.
I think some of us are doomed to never be completely happy,
ever- it’s
not possible. I always think some of us will enternally fuck
ourselves over
until we’re old and alone or dead of overdose, or some other horrific
disastor that we can then point to and say, “see, I told me life sucked,
didn’t I.”

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 8:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered
yesterday as
i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four
months ago
coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get
addicted
again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken
pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the
bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im
emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont
feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much
respect for it
to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper
session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars,
lying naked
on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken
right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium:
Join now and
get the first two months FREE*
/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=—————————————————————
——=[/

/]=—————————————————————
——=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[
/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] what to do, what to do…
Date: May 10, 2005 at 8:48:34 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So i live in the woods now, which freaks me out more than i thought
possible.  Stick me in Little Haiti in my underwear at 3am with no
money and a gun, and I can function.  Take me on a walk in the woods,
and I’m about to get eaten by the bear that I’ve seen that lives
behind the house.  Go figure…
Anyhoo.. about my cat. I got her in Miami, and she saved my life.  I
brought her all the way North with me, and she’s like my baby.  I got
her her shots and got her fixed, and technically, she could be an
outdoor cat.  I just KNOW that she’s going to get hit, eaten, lost,
stuck somewhere, attacked by any number of asshole dogs in the
neighborhood, that bear will find her snackly-licious, i don’t know,
but something will happen.  So, i let her out by accident, and now she
cries at the door, and looks at me like,”what the fuck is your
problem??! LET ME OUT!!!!!”.  My mom’s dog, half chihuahua, half
terrier, thinks it’s mighty fun to chase her, and I’ve seen her kill
small animals.  She does NOT like my cat (neither does my stepdad),
and when I was out with her, just seeing wht it would be like, the dog
is like,”KILLKILLKILL!!!”, and ny mom says, “Oh, Honey, it’s the most
natural thing in the world, a dog chasing a cat..” Yeah, but not when
it’s my cat.  Anyway, after that weirdo dream i had about her running
away and leaving me forever at the oytser bar for jackie o, all i can
see is her feeling like she’s in jail.  I can’t take that either.  How
many times have I said to myself that I would NEVER EVER EVER KEEP
ANYONE OR THING LOCKED UP(against their will), and here I am,
selfishly keeping my precious little Killer in jail.
I suppose I have to do it, don’t I?
I have to let her go, and see if she’ll come back, and it’s tearing me
up because she really did save my life in Miami.  I had a
responsibility, and it gave me a way to start back on the road home,
and here I am, so I have to be fair about it, and I’m losing my shit.
I can’t lose anyone else I love right now.  I’m not that strong.  My
step dad is like,”it’s just a cat…” so i said, “yeah,and my mom is
just your wife, and I’m just your daughter.”
sorry ’bout this.  Emotions run high when I first get up and i feel so
heavenly…i hate suboxone.
There’s no compromise.  It sux.  It’s not like I could put her in a
cage or run outside, ‘cuz it’s the same thing.  jail.
I need a shower and some coffee.
luv to you all, and thanks for listening.
tink

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: nruhtra@dsskcorp.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] wuzup wit dis?
Date: May 10, 2005 at 1:45:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

— nruhtra@dsskcorp.com wrote:
phantom.com
mindvox.com

Copyright © 2005 Advanced Health Transitions, Inc. All Rights
Reserved

damn noriega what be this

n$

I think its a ‘disturbance in the force’ where the 700 other sites
mindvox is running go across the front page 😉 Or when whatever
webobjects does, it’s turned off. Never understood the difference
between that and using php, but mindvox lives in a different universe.

http://www.apple.com/webobjects/

This is all inside MindVox/Wiretap/Interscape whatever else lives in
that rack. This is only the ibogaine sites I know about using whois.sc,
netcraft and netsol.com

http://www.ibogaine-amsterdam.com/
http://www.ibogaine-caribbean.com/
http://www.ibogaine-costarica.com/
http://www.ibogaine-england.com/
http://www.ibogaine-uk.com/
http://www.ibogaine-ibiza.com/
http://www.ibogaine-mexico.net/
http://www.ibogaine-juarez.com/
http://www.ibogaine-london.com/
http://www.ibogaine-netherlands.com/
http://www.ibogaine-prague.com/
http://www.ibogaine-spain.com/

http://www.ibogaine-research.org/
http://www.ibogaine-research.com/
http://www.ibogaine-research.net/
http://www.ibogaineresearch.com/

http://www.ibogaine.net/
http://www.healingvisions.com/
http://www.ibogaine-stkitts.com/
http://www.ibogaine-stkitts.net/
http://www.ibogaine-stkitts.org/
http://www.noribogaine.com/
http://www.noribogaine.net/
http://www.noribogaine.org/

There isn’t anything on Advanced Health Transitions in google. With
quotes it comes up with 0 hits, without quotes there is no ibogaine
anything. But the register lists

http://advancedhealthtransitions.com/
http://advancedhealthtransitions.net/

Organization:
Phantom Access Technologies, Inc.
Patrick Kroupa
1133 Broadway
New York, NY 10101
US
Phone: 212.824.9930
Email: digital@mindvox.com

Registrar Name….: Register.com
Registrar Whois…: whois.register.com
Registrar Homepage: http://www.register.com

Domain Name: ADVANCEDHEALTHTRANSITIONS.COM

Created on…………..: Tue, Jan 11, 2005
Expires on…………..: Wed, Jan 11, 2006
Record last updated on..: Tue, Jan 11, 2005

Administrative Contact:
Phantom Access Technologies, Inc.
Patrick Kroupa
1133 Broadway
New York, NY 10101
US
Phone: 212.824.9930
Email: digital@mindvox.com

My favorite two sites are

http://www.phantom.com/~digital/
http://na.mindvox.com/

😉

😉 indeed
thanks vec for the mass info

ph4nt0m should hire you to be the official fan that can build the mindvox
(tm)(r)(!) streetteam. you can like, pass out flyers and staple them to
hookers asses. and stuff.

.:vector:.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 2:57:19 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

30 does sounds a lot and I am inclined to think that after a certain dose (depending on why you are taking it) any extra just gets in the way particularly if you are clean taking it. A better use imo is to split the dose and keep 9 or 10 for a booster a couple of weeks later for instance.
The higher the dose does not always equal a better or deeper experience as the action of the eboga is governed by 2 things in my experience: how much you are able to be ripped open if that is the nature of the session you are up for and 2. how much the spirit will come to life within you and that it choses to do as it sees fit. It doesn’t obey doses but it does need a dose to do its work. Its possible to take 20mg/kg and lie back and just bliss out for a few hours. If you are looking to have a max experience all you can do is chose a max dose that will facilitate it but there is no gaurantee that it will happen. Taken it clean I would say a max dose is probably about 20 based on personal experience.
Lee

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
First of all what happened to you is probably the most natural thing in the world, thats what we do! But I hear you about being emotionally unbalanced in WD thats par for the course and some are better than others when it comes to dealing with it. but me myself I’m the biggest pussy on earth when I start to feel that pain. I can certainly relate to crying when I looked at my arms.
Just out of curiosity, how many times have you taken Ibogaine?
I’m not quite sure why you would be resistant to another session. Having respect for it is one thing and I can’t imagine too many people who’ve been to taken to that place not having a tremendous amount of respect for it but multiple sessions are not the exception to the rule and is way more the norm when it comes to this. You put 4 months together if I’m correct and thats a fuckin miracle. How many times have any of us been able to do that conventionally?
I had 4 months and then spent 3 months in hell and was just retreated 5 weeks ago and I have to tell you I feel so different this time around than I did the last. I got so much more out of it and I was way more open to what it was showing me and what its STILL showing me.
Also, and I have a big problem with this myself, don’t get so hung up on the numbers. I took 18 mg/kg my first time around with 3mg/kg boosters after for 5 days and this time around I took 25mg/kg all at once but if you’ve just recently caught another habit (chip) 15 mg/kg might be fine. Not to mention 30mg/kg all at once in the woods might be a little dangerous. Some might disagree but why take that risk?
But hang in there man and if you have access to Ibogaine try and make that happen as soon as possible. My own feeling is that its even more “disrespectful” to not take it again. It’ll show you and give you just what you need. As long as you have the right intentions your not abusing it, your seeking guidance from an ally who showed you a way out once before and will again if you let it. Good luck and my thoughts are with you. -M.
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. Includes section on the Eboga Healing Process: www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html.
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com.

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 2:13:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh yeah-that too!!  About another treatment-
Don’t beat yourself up, and don’t go punishing yourself more than is
necessary, which is something I’m the Queen of.  Ibogaine is to be
respected for sure, but it is also respectful, and as long as you’re
doing whta you need to be doing, another treatment could be just the
answer.
I did it once, and failed, but will try again.  There are no
guarantees, except for the one that says, “if you don’t pick up, you
ctay clean” and the opnly wya I’ve found that that holds true is to
surrender to the necessity of doing absolutely everything and ANYTHING
it takes to get and stay clean.
Iboga is a gift that keeps on giving, but you have to be willing to
receive it.  You are a beautiful, deserving person, and are loved, by
us all, and we’re all here for you, no matter what your choices are.
I highly recommend giving yourself a chance, even though it’s fucking
hard as hell.  It wsn’t until I had the support and love I found here
that I grew a pair big enough to allow me to start the whole detox
process, and as much as I feel like shit, I’ve never felt better.
You are loved, and will keep on being loved, no matter what.
Give yourself a chance!
tink
On 5/9/05, mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:

First of all what happened to you is probably the most natural thing in the
world, thats what we do! But I hear you about being emotionally unbalanced
in WD thats par for the course and some are better than others when it comes
to dealing with it. but me myself I’m the biggest pussy on earth when I
start to feel that pain. I can certainly relate to crying when I looked at
my arms.
Just out of curiosity, how many times have you taken Ibogaine?
I’m not quite sure why you would be resistant to another session. Having
respect for it is one thing and I can’t imagine too many people who’ve been
to taken to that place not having a tremendous amount of respect for it but
multiple sessions are not the exception to the rule and is way more the norm
when it comes to this. You put 4 months together if I’m correct and thats a
fuckin miracle. How many times have any of us been able to do that
conventionally?
I had 4 months and then spent 3 months in hell and was just retreated 5
weeks ago and I have to tell you I feel so different this time around than I
did the last. I got so much more out of it and I was way more open to what
it was showing me and what its STILL showing me.
Also, and I have a big problem with this myself, don’t get so hung up on the
numbers. I took 18 mg/kg my first time around with 3mg/kg boosters after for
5 days and this time around I took 25mg/kg all at once but if you’ve just
recently caught another habit (chip) 15 mg/kg might be fine. Not to mention
30mg/kg all at once in the woods might be a little dangerous. Some might
disagree but why take that risk?
But hang in there man and if you have access to Ibogaine try and make that
happen as soon as possible. My own feeling is that its even more
“disrespectful” to not take it again. It’ll show you and give you just what
you need. As long as you have the right intentions your not abusing it, your
seeking guidance from an ally who showed you a way out once before and will
again if you let it. Good luck and my thoughts are with you. -M.

matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as
i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago
coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted
again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken
pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the
bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im
emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont
feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it
to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper
session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked
on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken
right—-ok time for a bath again

There be days when i stray,

i may appear to be constantly out of reach

i give in

to sin

because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode

What bunch of bullshit or is it>?

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now
and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

________________________________
Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 2:03:36 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey, this is Tinkerbell(aka tink- duh)
So here’s the deal with suboxone.  I’m in the process of detoxing off
of it now, and though it’s a lot easier than methadone, in some
respects, it still is far from my favorite thing in the world.
because it’s got narcane in it, when you decrease, the opiate recptors
are screaming out for help, and then the naloxone (nice way of saying
pain and agony) kicks everything up a notch, and has me in fits and
rages, crying, giggling, screaming and whimpering.  It comes and goes,
and as much as I want to take more, and have more to take, I’m trying
to refuse this shit to win the battle.  Heeeelllllppp!!!!
Email me direct if you’d like some more info, and it’s yours for the
taking.  I’m in VT, and have to go out to smoke, too, and although the
sun continues to shine, I can feel very little warmth.  It’s not my
arms that are all fucked up, it’s my legs,a nd I don’t think I’ll ever
be able to wear short anything again with out looks of revulsion and
“Waht the fuck kind of accident does THAT to you??!!” kind of stares.
I blew out the arms eons ago, and even to this day, the people who
have to draw blood don’t do abything but shake their heads as they
flip me upside down to draw from my nearly blown out neck.
Ironically, I promised a dr. at Beth Israel that I’d leave ONE vein
for the paramedics ( I have my own suite in the detox there…) and
these same medical professionals have managed to do more damage than I
ever could.  And I tried, believe me!!
I’m attaching a poem I wrote for you.  i hope it helps.  I’m here if
you need me, and have the luxury of working on my computer today, so
keep the dialogue going if you want and /or need to.  I know that I
feel about a bazillion times better having someone to cry and laugh
with as I go through the same thing, at the same time.  This place,
and all of the people here have saved my life more than once in the
past few days/weeks, and I would be honoured to share this
misadventure with you.  now if I could just come and use your tub…
Love and hugs and love and serenity and love and love and love…
you (and I) are doing the right thing, and we know it, so let’s keep going.
Keep emailing or I’ll worry
luv
tink(erbell)

On 5/9/05, matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Fucken shit eh…….its funny cause its 20 plus here and the weather is
fucken beutifull and im outside in three dozen tshirts hodies and a winter
coat……..ashen as a ghost again……when i go out for a smoke outside
people look me up and down…ah how i envy all those in their shorts and
short sleve t shirts…….i dont remember the last time i wore a short
sleve shirt and i think i never will considering my old track marks havent
disepeared one iota……i heard about that sub shit…..it just got aproved
here in canada a few months ago……..i dont know what it is but i guess
its just like meth another barless prison………it must be fucken hell for
u bro…..how many days now>?  the worst thing for me i sthe fucken insomnia
and no amount of benzos will take it away…god knows i tried to stuff my
face with flurazepam diazepam and bromazepam with no avail only to get more
weaker to the point of fainting…….bullshit game this is……..Preston u
are right in saying some of us will never learn…..i hope that i will be
exllucded from that equation i have to learn……stupid fool that i am i
could be enjoying this beutiful weather….lost my job that i just got a few
weeks ago because i cant function again……never ending story…….not
answering phones or anyting …….pray to god none of my freinds or familly
finds out…….that would be too much….after all those promises after
ibogaine and kisses and hugs and plans for the futre >LOL

btw music for me during wd is fucken bliss……i can even listen to shit i
wouldnt normally touch with a ten foot pole……but this shit will
end……

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r) Calendar. MSN Premium: Join
now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 1:30:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

First of all what happened to you is probably the most natural thing in the world, thats what we do! But I hear you about being emotionally unbalanced in WD thats par for the course and some are better than others when it comes to dealing with it. but me myself I’m the biggest pussy on earth when I start to feel that pain. I can certainly relate to crying when I looked at my arms.
Just out of curiosity, how many times have you taken Ibogaine?
I’m not quite sure why you would be resistant to another session. Having respect for it is one thing and I can’t imagine too many people who’ve been to taken to that place not having a tremendous amount of respect for it but multiple sessions are not the exception to the rule and is way more the norm when it comes to this. You put 4 months together if I’m correct and thats a fuckin miracle. How many times have any of us been able to do that conventionally?
I had 4 months and then spent 3 months in hell and was just retreated 5 weeks ago and I have to tell you I feel so different this time around than I did the last. I got so much more out of it and I was way more open to what it was showing me and what its STILL showing me.
Also, and I have a big problem with this myself, don’t get so hung up on the numbers. I took 18 mg/kg my first time around with 3mg/kg boosters after for 5 days and this time around I took 25mg/kg all at once but if you’ve just recently caught another habit (chip) 15 mg/kg might be fine. Not to mention 30mg/kg all at once in the woods might be a little dangerous. Some might disagree but why take that risk?
But hang in there man and if you have access to Ibogaine try and make that happen as soon as possible. My own feeling is that its even more “disrespectful” to not take it again. It’ll show you and give you just what you need. As long as you have the right intentions your not abusing it, your seeking guidance from an ally who showed you a way out once before and will again if you let it. Good luck and my thoughts are with you. -M.
matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…Thanx Patrick
Date: May 9, 2005 at 12:55:24 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Pam remember u are still in my thoughts as is Patrick and ur whole familly…….Much love
Namaste
Matthew

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 12:54:02 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt, why suffer? Ibogaine is being touted for taking away withdrawals more than anything, I’d do it now if it were me. I read a Tai proverb here one time that said “things could be worse, your still breathing.” I’ve been through the self loathing thing you are doing so many times that I can instantly feel bad for you. We all aint the same but we are just alike. Obviously there is something about being addicted that you don’t like, or you wouldn’t be telling us this. How long did you shoot for this time? I mean, maybe it won’t be that bad. I’m with ya dude.                      Randy

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 12:50:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Fucken shit eh…….its funny cause its 20 plus here and the weather is fucken beutifull and im outside in three dozen tshirts hodies and a winter coat……..ashen as a ghost again……when i go out for a smoke outside people look me up and down…ah how i envy all those in their shorts and short sleve t shirts…….i dont remember the last time i wore a short sleve shirt and i think i never will considering my old track marks havent disepeared one iota……i heard about that sub shit…..it just got aproved here in canada a few months ago……..i dont know what it is but i guess its just like meth another barless prison………it must be fucken hell for u bro…..how many days now>?  the worst thing for me i sthe fucken insomnia and no amount of benzos will take it away…god knows i tried to stuff my face with flurazepam diazepam and bromazepam with no avail only to get more weaker to the point of fainting…….bullshit game this is……..Preston u are right in saying some of us will never learn…..i hope that i will be exllucded from that equation i have to learn……stupid fool that i am i could be enjoying this beutiful weather….lost my job that i just got a few weeks ago because i cant function again……never ending story…….not answering phones or anyting …….pray to god none of my freinds or familly finds out…….that would be too much….after all those promises after ibogaine and kisses and hugs and plans for the futre >LOL
btw music for me during wd is fucken bliss……i can even listen to shit i wouldnt normally touch with a ten foot pole……but this shit will end……

Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Pam Paperno” <pam@lviue.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…Thanx Patrick
Date: May 9, 2005 at 11:48:47 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey, I have been clean eight years and still have to deal with peiodic suspicion.
Just two weeks ago I lost my beloved Patrick, so of course I don’t sound like myself.  I sound distracted, plugged up and confused, so naturally my mother asks me if I’m back on drugs.
Remember, we programmed the people around us to expect us to fuck up.  It is going to take time for them to learn to trust us.
Meanwhile, I trust you.
Pam
—– Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 4:09 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…Thanx Patrick

Hey Randy. fuck the ten dollar bag i did it for both of us. Its a lie. The worst thing you could possibly do and I assure you in a week you’d be doing 6 of them and you’ll be back to not feeling them at all. They dont kill that kinda pain.

On another note list its begining to piss me off that no one in my life trusts me. its like there expecting me to fuck up and I’m having a very hard time explaing to them how different it is this time and HOW DIFFERNT THE IBOGAINE WAS THIS TIME! They just don’t want to hear it. And then I get so offended  and I have to catch myself and remember that I was on my back just 30 days ago and 31 days I was in hell and its only natual that they’d feel like this. But it still sucks. I just have to show them. -m.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Oh Yea, that reminds me. Thanx again Patrick. This list continues to keep me insane. Don’t want to change everything, just the shit that kills me. Nard Tingledick is alive and well, and guarding a herd of river otters on the Hudson.          Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more.

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] NY1 coverage of march included ibogaine
Date: May 9, 2005 at 11:04:19 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yupp…but it could be me..I’m not so good with this thing yet.  is it
mac compatible?
ugh. Coffee..

On 5/9/05, matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

i cant open any of these….any one having problems>?

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Powerful parental controls improve your peace of mind with MSN Premium: Join
now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 10:56:45 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I hear ya brother and i feeeeeeeeeeeeeel yur pain!!!
Eye’s leaking, shuddershudder,and I’m no way near done yet.  And we
have no tub.  @!$#@!#@!%  I do have this palce, and you, and everyone
here, and It’s keeping my from completely blowing my top.
No new trax here, but suboxone’s a bitch…whatthefuck’s up with this
and why why why did i think it was a good idea…
Keep typing and dunking yourself in that tub(lucky) and we’re all here
for you.  Wait ’til tonight, when I start to feel REALLY great. I’m
all over the place here.
Sending you love and hugs and quietness of mind
tink

On 5/9/05, matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as
i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago
coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted
again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken
pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the
bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im
emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont
feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it
to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper
session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked
on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken
right—-ok time for a bath again

There be days when i stray,

i may appear to be constantly out of reach

i give in

to sin

because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode

What bunch of bullshit or is it>?

Namaste
Matthew
________________________________
Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and
get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 10:26:14 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matthew,
I feel for you brother, I honestly do. It’s amazing how fast it can happen, right? One minutes we’re fine and loving life, the next we’re trying to kill any happiness we’ve attained.
I think some of us are doomed to never be completely happy, ever- it’s not possible. I always think some of us will enternally fuck ourselves over until we’re old and alone or dead of overdose, or some other horrific disastor that we can then point to and say, “see, I told me life sucked, didn’t I.”

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 09, 2005 8:16 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] back in wd

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 9, 2005 at 10:13:40 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey
its weird because from what i read there are two diff experiences….some either love it or hate it….fucken weird…..i think u really have to take alot like an ounce to have a good trip…..how much did u take>?
i read a few accounts of people having a full blown rebirth exp …..i know amanita muscaria have been used for centuries so it should be interesting………

Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] NY1 coverage of march included ibogaine
Date: May 9, 2005 at 8:41:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

i cant open any of these….any one having problems>?

Namaste
Matthew

Powerful parental controls improve your peace of mind with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] back in wd
Date: May 9, 2005 at 8:16:36 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Well back in wd again….how the fuck did it happen i wondered yesterday as i couldnt sleep fuck all again…..when i went through hell four months ago coming off all that shit i promoisded my self i wouldnt never get addicted again ….so much for promises…..is ignorance bliss>?  its fucken pointless i think….looking at my fresh track marks yestaerday in the bathtub i just broke down and started to cry…….when im in wd im emotionaly unbalanced or finally balanced>?  i could ibo again but i dont feel right about using it for this again……i feel too much respect for it to misuse it for my stpudity……when i get well illl have a full proper session in the woods, nothing under 30mg/kg —-under the stars, lying naked on the ground with the energy of the earth uunder neath me—–fucken right—-ok time for a bath again
There be days when i stray,
i may appear to be constantly out of reach
i give in
to sin
because i like to praticse what i preach————-Depeche Mode
What bunch of bullshit or is it>?
Namaste
Matthew

Send junk mail straight into your Recycle Bin with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Monkey Escapes From Island Laboratory
Date: May 9, 2005 at 12:45:53 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

http://news.yahoo.com/news?tmpl=story&u=/ap/20050508/ap_on_fe_st/monkey_island_escape

<snip>
Morgan Island houses primates used in government
research.

Alpha Genesis officials said they can’t explain how
the monkey managed to leave the island laboratory and
make its way across Parrot Creek.

“I have been here eight years and this is the first
(escape) I can remember in the area,” said Greg
Westergaard, president and chief executive officer of
Alpha Genesis. “I’m at a loss at how it got over
there. They probably can swim a little bit, but it
really is a long way over there.”

The monkeys have been on the island since 1979 and are
the property of the
Food and Drug Administration. They are used in defense
and vaccine development studies.

The escaped monkey was caught Tuesday, Westergaard
said. “I’m sure he wanted to get back but couldn’t
figure out how,” he said.

But the escapee won’t be going back to the 400-acres
colony on Morgan Island. Instead, he’ll probably be
taken to one of two breeding facilities in Yemassee or
Early Branch, Westergaard said.

Westergaard said it was unlikely the monkey would have
a disease because the research performed on the
animals isn’t done at the island. The monkeys also go
through physical examinations four times a year to
make sure they are healthy and carry no diseases, he
said.

“This monkey’s in great shape,” he said.

He said there are no artificial barriers keeping the
monkeys on the island other than the water surrounding
it, as they tend to be social creatures and stay with
other monkeys.

“I don’t know what happened to this guy,” Westergaard said.

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Read only the mail you want – Yahoo! Mail SpamGuard.
http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Chretien Schiffer” <junkyshaman@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 8, 2005 at 10:52:53 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

two very different things in my opinion, not comparable.

my amanita journey was like bieng in a alien sweat lodge for 8 hours straight. i was pouring liquid outta every orifice, it was crazy. seriously, i’m talking several gallons, mind-boggling amounts, and it probably didn’t look too pretty. it wasn’t uncomfortable and certainly wasn’t comfortable, drooling around in a limbo space. but the next day i felt good, like cleansed, it felt like the muscamole toxin(?) pushed out all these other toxins that were hanging out in my body. superclean, but then it was an 8 hour supershower.

some describe amanita like a classic psychedelic experience, who knows, lotsa variables to look into. amanitas are in a catagory all to themselves. the muscarine, ibotenic acid, and muscamole look nothing like the structure of ibogaine which is home to the tryptamine family of things and has many relatives.

mucho amor,
chretien

Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of
experience compared to ibo.
Namaste Matt

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] NY1 coverage of march included ibogaine
Date: May 8, 2005 at 5:47:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From: tents444@yahoo.com

There are dialup and broadband RealPlayer video links with this article below:
http://real.ny1.com:8080/ramgen/real3/0010F148_050508_45710lo.rm and
http://real.ny1.com:8080/ramgen/real3/0010F148_050508_45710hi.rm

———–

NY1 News. NYC’s 24-hour Newschannel On The Web.
http://www.ny1.com/ny1/content/index.jsp?stid=1&aid=50699

Top Stories

Worldwide Protests Call For Legalizing Medicinal Marijuana

May 08, 2005

A group rallied in Lower Manhattan Saturday to call for the legalization of marijuana for medical purposes.

“Cures not Wars” is urging lawmakers to allow hemp to be used with a prescription.

“If alcohol is socially acceptable, then I see no reason why marijuana can’t be,” said Audrey Silk, a Libertarian candidate for mayor, who joined the demonstration. “And medical marijuana to me is a total no-brainer. There is no reason to deny people who say it works fot them the ability to use it.”

The group is also touting the new drug ibogaine, which it says helps cure addiction.

“Basically with every other drug you take for drug addiction, like methadone, when the methadone wears off, you’re back in withdrawal,” said Dana Beal, another protestor. “When the ibogaine wears off there is no withdrawal.”

Similar demonstrations took place in nearly 200 cities around the world, including Prague, Kiev and Tel Aviv.

—————–

From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] System Notice: READ ME
Date: May 8, 2005 at 5:28:30 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Patrick

MindVox Transcendental Enlightenment Temple / Heroin Maintenance Clinic

Ok ok where do I find this maintenance clinic?????  Sounds jess great!!!!
Lol
Kirk

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 8, 2005 at 4:55:24 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was “fortunate” hopefully to have been able to get what i need for prolonged abstinence (forever) in only 10 months but it took 3 sessions. -hardhead.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
Have to find them and the data is kinda old. Howard do you have anything?

Basically what I have states that 10% of people treated with Ibogaine one time are clean after 2 years and just about the same amount (10%) go back to getting high within two weeks of treatment. The rest of us (me) fall into a catagory of people 80% that put roughly 3 to 6 months together and then need to be retreated. Usually after mulitiple sessions over the course of 18  to 24 months prolonged periods of abistnance can be established.
But I could be wrong. -M.

Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
Can Moroccan tell me where he got those statistics about Ibogaine’s success.

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

Discover Yahoo!
Use Yahoo! to plan a weekend, have fun online & more. Check it out!

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 8, 2005 at 4:28:07 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

had no sense
whatsoever of anything like iboga, and they seemed much much less
psychedelic than say psilocybin mushrooms. <

I’ve heard from various people completely opposite descriptions, with some saying, “oh my gosh, amanita were the best things ever- I not only spoke to god and s/he me, I WAS/AM god now” to “boy did those suck, they did nothing for me except block up my digestive tract (see message below to which I’m responding).
So considering who I’ve heard from who seemed to like ’em, and those who didn’t, I’ve pretty much been of the opinion that I am completely uninterested in trying Amanita Muscaria shrooms even were they in front of me, offered for ingestion free of charge. I too have heard more than not that they aren’t nearly as “psychedelic” as “regular” psilocybins.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <slowone@hush.ai>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 08, 2005 12:23 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria

They can make you sleep, note the flies and other bugs sleeping
around them in the field. Apparently the toxic dose is not so far
from the enjoyable one. I’m not sure, but it seemed that they set
back my digestive system muscles that move things out the other end
(for months), so after minimal experimentation I gave up on them.
There are supposedly different strains with varying effects and
toxicities, so be careful if you try them. I had no sense
whatsoever of anything like iboga, and they seemed much much less
psychedelic than say psilocybin mushrooms.

On Mon, 02 May 2005 07:09:41 -0700 matthew zielinski
<mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
Hi

Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of
experience compared to ibo.
Namaste Matt

————————-
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN® Calendar. MSN
Premium:[1] Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=—————————————————————-

—–=[
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————–

—-=[/

Links:
——
[1] http://g.msn.com/8HMAENCA/2740??PS=47575

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 8, 2005 at 12:33:53 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Have to find them and the data is kinda old. Howard do you have anything?

Basically what I have states that 10% of people treated with Ibogaine one time are clean after 2 years and just about the same amount (10%) go back to getting high within two weeks of treatment. The rest of us (me) fall into a catagory of people 80% that put roughly 3 to 6 months together and then need to be retreated. Usually after mulitiple sessions over the course of 18  to 24 months prolonged periods of abistnance can be established.
But I could be wrong. -M.

Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
Can Moroccan tell me where he got those statistics about Ibogaine’s success.

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour

From: <slowone@hush.ai>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 8, 2005 at 12:23:53 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

They can make you sleep, note the flies and other bugs sleeping
around them in the field. Apparently the toxic dose is not so far
from the enjoyable one. I’m not sure, but it seemed that they set
back my digestive system muscles that move things out the other end
(for months), so after minimal experimentation I gave up on them.
There are supposedly different strains with varying effects and
toxicities, so be careful if you try them. I had no sense
whatsoever of anything like iboga, and they seemed much much less
psychedelic than say psilocybin mushrooms.

On Mon, 02 May 2005 07:09:41 -0700 matthew zielinski
<mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:
Hi

Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of
experience compared to ibo.
Namaste Matt

————————-
Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN
Premium:[1] Join now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=—————————————————————-

—–=[
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
]=—————————————————————–

—-=[/

Links:
——
[1] http://g.msn.com/8HMAENCA/2740??PS=47575

Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
secure FREE email: http://www.hushmail.com/?l=2

Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
http://www.hushmail.com/services-messenger?l=434

Promote security and make money with the Hushmail Affiliate Program:
http://www.hushmail.com/about-affiliate?l=427

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: darkmattersfo@comcast.net
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] System Notice: READ ME
Date: May 8, 2005 at 10:40:15 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the heads up Patrick.

For anyone concerned: All systems must be eventually upgraded or rebuilt over time or they just won’t survive software and hardware changes that occur in the market. There are usually problems when the systems first come back up (as Patrick points out) but they are eventually resolved.

Good luck with a smooth upgrade Patrick!

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—–
Hash: SHA1

On May 8, 2005, at 7:51 AM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

Wait a minute, you can’t change the list, Omygod, please, what will
we do if it doesn’t work? Just when I think I can relax, a meteor
flies through the window and hits me in the head.
Fuck ……..where did that come from? (HeHe) Do the do man, just
make sure that when we hit send, that we don’t reach critical mass
and blow ourselves into the Golden Triangle.
Randy

heY lunatic.  It’s gonna be otay.  It’ll be running on another box in
a parallel universe, prior to us flipping everything over.  If it
doesn’t work right — and it won’t, the first 25 times, because there
is a staggeringly huge amount of stuff for it to digest — we’ll do
sumthin’ crazy and … Make it Go.  The backups have backups which
have backups.  If it breaks, we’ll fix it; just like the last 300 times.

In the interim, hum…  You seem to be experiencing feelings of
malaise and ennui…  You are GUILTY of displaying feelings of an
almost human nature.  This will not do.  No, wait, somebody already
said that, nevermind.

<wriTing ewe a skripT> Here, do at least 20MG/KG and call me in a
week.  Down the hatch and into the flood again.

I’m gonna, like, go to sleep or sumthin’  It’s 9 in the morning.

Patrick

MindVox Transcendental Enlightenment Temple / Heroin Maintenance Clinic

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—–
Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin)

iD8DBQFCfhIy5L/G7WgR2WYRAvyVAKDSEVhpCjcO8LAk8mhvri7lkXJeawCfa1ik
Quo68okKUcBwAkIorkaKibM=
=iS5L
—–END PGP SIGNATURE—–

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] System Notice: READ ME
Date: May 8, 2005 at 9:20:50 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE—–
Hash: SHA1

On May 8, 2005, at 7:51 AM, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

Wait a minute, you can’t change the list, Omygod, please, what will we do if it doesn’t work? Just when I think I can relax, a meteor flies through the window and hits me in the head. Fuck ……..where did that come from? (HeHe) Do the do man, just make sure that when we hit send, that we don’t reach critical mass and blow ourselves into the Golden Triangle.                      Randy

heY lunatic.  It’s gonna be otay.  It’ll be running on another box in a parallel universe, prior to us flipping everything over.  If it doesn’t work right — and it won’t, the first 25 times, because there is a staggeringly huge amount of stuff for it to digest — we’ll do sumthin’ crazy and … Make it Go.  The backups have backups which have backups.  If it breaks, we’ll fix it; just like the last 300 times.

In the interim, hum…  You seem to be experiencing feelings of malaise and ennui…  You are GUILTY of displaying feelings of an almost human nature.  This will not do.  No, wait, somebody already said that, nevermind.

<wriTing ewe a skripT> Here, do at least 20MG/KG and call me in a week.  Down the hatch and into the flood again.

I’m gonna, like, go to sleep or sumthin’  It’s 9 in the morning.

Patrick

MindVox Transcendental Enlightenment Temple / Heroin Maintenance Clinic

—–BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE—–
Version: GnuPG v1.4.1 (Darwin)

iD8DBQFCfhIy5L/G7WgR2WYRAvyVAKDSEVhpCjcO8LAk8mhvri7lkXJeawCfa1ik
Quo68okKUcBwAkIorkaKibM=
=iS5L
—–END PGP SIGNATURE—–

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: [DrugWar] Re: [Ibogaine] System Notice: READ ME
Date: May 8, 2005 at 7:51:05 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, apocalypsenow@mindvox.com
Cc: drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: drugwar@mindvox.com

Wait a minute, you can’t change the list, Omygod, please, what will we do if it doesn’t work? Just when I think I can relax, a meteor flies through the window and hits me in the head. Fuck ……..where did that come from? (HeHe) Do the do man, just make sure that when we hit send, that we don’t reach critical mass and blow ourselves into the Golden Triangle.                      Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] mucho gusto
Date: May 8, 2005 at 7:08:14 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Ola’. Welcome to the list for the tragically fried. Sit down, take yer shoes off, and get withit. Do I have cob webs on my face?              Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 8, 2005 at 6:57:45 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Marc didn’t just make up those stats. I read them when I first started doing research. I think it may come from the Dora Wiener foundation but I’m not sure. I think the point that he was trying to make was that it may take more than one treatment for success. I know I feel like I need a booster or something, it’s been almost 8 months now for me, and I have had some cravings. At this point I just feel a strange urge to get the fuck out and do something, anything. Anything but a bundle of dope, or a shit load of 80’s, or everybody’s take homes, and I mean everybody’s, or………. you get the drift here, right? I’m blessed. I have my family’s support, and I can get the fuck outta the city anytime I want, well almost, but when I’m there I feel the drugs in that town. I didn’t used to feel quite this way. It’s like it’s calling me. I was sitting in the lower east side, and this guy walks by and gives me a nod, you know what I mean, that I got the hook up nod, and I started my car up and got the fuck out. As I was leaving NYC and calculating the yield from a tactical nuke, I finally got far enough away from the blast radius to relax a little, it occurred to me that the dude was just being nice and I was the one looking at him in that got the hook up way.( I’m jokin’ about the nuke, kinda) Anyway, action to a reaction is driving me right now. When does this change? Maybe never, but I know I’m not sprung, and if I get sprung, it’s my fault now. I guess I’m dumping my feelings and thoughts here, I hope nobody holds it against me, but what the fuck, take a risk, grab a handle, and ride the fucking zip cord to the ground, and scream loud when you do it. They can kill me, but they can’t eat me, I’m poison.       Randy

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 8, 2005 at 2:00:28 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have seen much work out, and some really sad and preventable
tragedies, though the repeatetive reapplication seems to be the
ticket. What’s the success rate of the average heroin addict? 1%?  I
know that the forces that be tend to need the numbers, but I also know
that it works if you work it so work it you’re worth it, and that has
ZERO to do with NA.
I’ve watched people go under for the 3rd time and crash and burn, and
some go once, and come out brand spankin’ new.  It’s a choice.  We
have to make it.  Progress not perfection, and all that cliched crap,
which means there’s some merit to it after all…
Anyhoo, as much as I’ve pointed the fingers and fists elsewhere, it
always comes back to what I’ve decided, and the only way , in my
experience, has been to be honest with everybody about everything,
regardless of the built up horrendous imagined and real outcomes from
speaking your mind.  The only reason I can stand on my own two
feet(occasionally) and not spit at the reflection in the mirror is
because i choose to allow myself the mixed bag you get when you hit
the point that you really will do anything to stay clean. I’m far from
the person to use as a shining example, but I cam sometimes sleep now,
because I know that i am harboring as little shit as possible.
I’m on my way there, as we all are, in one form or another, and as
much as we have the same story, they’re all completely, psychotically
different.  That’s what keeps me going.  All of us, somewhere,
somehow, really have done that, been there, gotten the t-shirt,
laughed, cried, fallen down, peed their pants, and changed their life.
The one thing that keeps me sane is the insanity, and I wouldn’t have
it any other way.
“There is nothing like the theraputic quality of one addict helping
another…” as spoken by those who fancy the 12 step route, and I
don’t disagree with alot of it.  I just tend to be contrary, so, what
can I do but utilize everything that is offered up, to the best of my
ability, and send it back out to see what happens.
Statistics were meant to break, and this is the only way in how many
years that I’ve found that actually works.
Without Ibogaine, I’d’ve been dead quite some time ago.
I was okay, then not okay, and I still have my moments.  But that’s
what they are.  Moments.  They pass. And they get further and further
apart in episodic nature.  It’s nice to notice the forest as well as
the trees, every now and then.
You will not find any other place in the universe better than where
you are right now, because, hey, guess what, that’s exactly where you
are.  It’s what you choose to do with it that’s the scary fucked up
part.  It’s also the most beautiful thing in the world.
Enough of me, and on to the next.
You all save my life on an hourly basis, because I know you’re here.
Love to all
tink

On 5/8/05, Vivienne Elanta <vivienneelanta@yahoo.com.au> wrote:
I would say the same thing. I understand you’re in a tough place and struggling
to remain free of addiction and the community and support here is a marvel to
see. I do think that there is a difference between positive thinking and making
up “facts” that don’t relate to any statistics I have ever seen after ibogaine.

I see people get chanches and some have fewer problems to deal with then
others, but those who stay clean for the long haul are most definitely the
exception and I’ve never seen it happen without a lot of work.

“the majority of patients remain clean for three to six months” bears no
relation to anything I have ever seen.

Writing these things to yourself to help yourself are one thing. Making those
statements to others about ibogaine and calling your opinion data and
statistics, is called lying. I don’t mean to use a harsh word and I do think
you are only trying to convince yourself, but if you go around telling people
that, you’re giving them unrealistic expectations.

I think Ibogaine is enough of a gift without having to say things about it that
are patently untrue. Without veiling the language in “data and statistics” why
don’t you take a look at ten people you know who have done ibogaine and tell me
that again. You’ll find it’s not true.

Blessed be.
Vivienne Elanta

— Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
Can Moroccan tell me where he got those statistics about Ibogaine’s
success.

Find local movie times and trailers on Yahoo! Movies.
http://au.movies.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Vivienne Elanta <vivienneelanta@yahoo.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 8, 2005 at 12:34:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I would say the same thing. I understand you’re in a tough place and struggling
to remain free of addiction and the community and support here is a marvel to
see. I do think that there is a difference between positive thinking and making
up “facts” that don’t relate to any statistics I have ever seen after ibogaine.

I see people get chanches and some have fewer problems to deal with then
others, but those who stay clean for the long haul are most definitely the
exception and I’ve never seen it happen without a lot of work.

“the majority of patients remain clean for three to six months” bears no
relation to anything I have ever seen.

Writing these things to yourself to help yourself are one thing. Making those
statements to others about ibogaine and calling your opinion data and
statistics, is called lying. I don’t mean to use a harsh word and I do think
you are only trying to convince yourself, but if you go around telling people
that, you’re giving them unrealistic expectations.

I think Ibogaine is enough of a gift without having to say things about it that
are patently untrue. Without veiling the language in “data and statistics” why
don’t you take a look at ten people you know who have done ibogaine and tell me
that again. You’ll find it’s not true.

Blessed be.
Vivienne Elanta

— Schmoolyboy@aol.com wrote:
Can Moroccan tell me where he got those statistics about Ibogaine’s
success.

Find local movie times and trailers on Yahoo! Movies.
http://au.movies.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Schmoolyboy@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 7, 2005 at 11:20:34 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Can Moroccan tell me where he got those statistics about Ibogaine’s success.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] @!$%%$*&^#@$#!$#$#$*^*%$#!!!!!!!!!!
Date: May 7, 2005 at 11:13:59 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I can’t believe I missed them when the
whole “Just Because” thing happened.  Typical Tink Maneuver…I once
missed Crystal Method  Fat Boy Slim and The Chemical Brothers on a
South Beach they had covered with snow because I had eaten too many
jagged speedy triple stack Melody rolls.<

It’s weird how the drugs we (or I at least) take at various times, or have taken at various times, to more enjoy myself, or further my fun, have wound up having the exact opposite effect, causing me to miss out on much fun. I almost didn’t get to see Jane’s on their last tour (but did, twice) due to overdoing my drugs- but somehow managed to pull through and see/hear/dance to them anyway

(one Jane’s show is reported on here, and I may have already posted this link on the ibogaine list but even if I did, you probably haven’t seen it Tink, so think of it as a present just for you, I write with a big smile-

http://www.drugwar.com/pshroomshows.shtm
A Simple Experiment Goes Well
Butthole Surfers are a better Shroom Band than Jane’s Addiction
By Preston Peet (Originally published in the New York Waste, Nov. 2001)

I feel like I and so many of my fellow “addicts” are living a huge, vast experiment, since our current fashion of prohibition is relatively new and no one really knows what causes some of us to act like “addicts” and some not. You’re struggling with suboxone and whatever else, and how many others are suffering through their own addictions and crap without real empathy or sympathy from those who’ve banned “illegal” drugs to save us from ourselves- prohibitionist maniacs who then invent even more strongly addictive drugs for us addicts to ingest and become strung out on.

In the song, “The Hand That Feeds,” Trent Reznor<

I just picked up this single last week, with a few remixes on it, and play it when dj’ing here in Manhattan. Great song actually, I think anyway, but heard yesterday that the record itself ain’t that great- I know it’s not been released, but apparently a friend of mine has heard it already somehow, and wasn’t overly impressed.

Martinis do NOt help, by the way.<

I’ve tried Screwdrivers, tall glasses of vodka with a bit of orange juice for coloring more than once when kicking cold turkey, and while it might not have “helped” me feel “better” it did at least get me really fucked up while feeling like shit too. Good plan that one. I still couldn’t sleep but was incredibly drunk and miserable.
So anyway Tink, I have no idea who you are, how old you are (but I’m imagining about my age if you’re quoting Nothing Shocking), what you look like, or anything at all about you except that you are suffering through the same sort of shit I and so many others here have suffered through- and some have survived and some not. Please be careful, take good care of yourself, and I just thought of something- try a lot of very hot baths full of good smelling scents and oils. I usually don’t like the feeling of water on my kicking suffering skin, but you might find it useful and helpful. Just a suggestion that you can take or leave as you wish.
All the best to you.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “tink” <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 4:49 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] @!$%%$*&^#@$#!$#$#$*^*%$#!!!!!!!!!!

Thanks for the suggestion.  I can’t believe I missed them when the
whole “Just Because” thing happened.  Typical Tink Maneuver…I once
missed Crystal Method  Fat Boy Slim and The Chemical Brothers on a
South Beach they had covered with snow because I had eaten too many
jagged speedy triple stack Melody rolls.  (If I take one more, I think
my spine might straighten…) Yeesh…glad I’m done with THAT.  My cat
is Killer, and she hates my stepdad.  And here we go again…my hands
are starting to shake, but what can I do but twitch it out.  Fuckin’
naloxone shit.
In honor of May Day, I must go herbally remedy myself…

“I’m just living on nerves and feelings with a weak and a lazy mind-
coming to people’s parties, fumbling deaf dumb and blind”
-Joni Mitchell

On 5/7/05, Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Another Perry Ferrel (peripheral-always loved that choice of stage name- we
named our large-nosed feral cat Perry too, in honor of the dude) fan.
Welcome, although I’ve heard here on this list not to long ago that he has
NOT taken ibogaine- but then, how would we really know that without he
himself telling us, right?
;-))
But rock on, Perry rules. Check out his solo CD by the way, it’s brilliant,
though the title escapes me right now…hold on…Song Yet To Be Sung, one
of my all time favorite CDs, which I discovered immediately after my first
ibogaine session. But then, I love everything he ever recorded, with the
VERY serious exception of his first band Psi Com, which totally and
completely sucked without any question.

Peace and love,
Preston \

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “tink” <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 2:14 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] @!$%%$*&^#@$#!$#$#$*^*%$#!!!!!!!!!!

Listening to Jane’s, Nothing’s Shocking, feeling the decrease, I HATE
SUBOXONE!!!!! This naloxone-narcane whatthefuck….ohmigod, Perry’s
confirming the fact that I’m home.  Drunk and kicking, and BABYSITTING
TEENAGERS!!! Wish I was ocean size.  Oh boy, here we go….
Okay.  Three(?) weeks and waiting.  I can do this.  Martinis do NOt
help, by the way.  Crawling into a bottle of muscle relaxers.  Hope
I’m “keepin’ it green” enough.  What the FUCK!!  I don’t know whether
to laugh or cry, so it’s a little of both.  Shaman13, I love you.  I’m
not going to listen to Lotsof tonight.  i want off. i want done.  if I
can take a 120mg to 0mg methadone drop and survive, whatever. Right?
ohpleaseberight…purtypleasewithsugarontop.  Is Perry an iboganaut?
he does an awful lot of talking and listening to the mountains and
sea.  Wow.  Welcome to my nervous breakdown, or what?  If you see my
dad, tell him my brothers have all gone mad their beating on each
other, yaddayyadda i have that funny feeling that god is dead.  Any
one else got junky parents?  You should see that family get together
thing.  Woohoo, and a bottle of vodka.  I don’t even usually drink,
not since that jagermeister/wild turkey/cab driver/upper east side
incident when I was punk as fuck…everybodies so full of
shit….everybodyeverybodyeverybody……
laughing now.   I’m out of weed. ouch.
Okay.  So I wasn’t thinking about the fact that I was kicking hard as
hell until lostof-whoops-lotsof-reminded me.  matbe i’m going a little
fast, but i’d rather get it over with.  Kurt will email you the full
story.  I’n currently incapable of anything but trying to distinguish
sepserate keys and not go postal. typo-shmypo.i know 20nmgs of this
suboxone shit to 8 in lke a week or two is basically suicide for those
not into self flaggelation, but, hell, read Brezny’s libra horoscope
for this week.  wuzza….hang on, I’ll include it…
Libra horoscope for the week of May 5, 2005
“The proverb warns that ‘You should not bite the hand that feeds you.’
But maybe you should, if it prevents you from feeding yourself.” So
said the critic of psychiatry, Thomas Szasz. He was urging us to think
about how our dependence on seemingly benevolent providers might
paralyze our free will and interfere with our ability to take care of
ourselves. In the song, “The Hand That Feeds,” Trent Reznor of the
band Nine Inch Nails expresses a further doubt about the proverb. He
suggests the hand that feeds us may supply us with stuff that doesn’t
really nourish us and that is tainted by the supplier’s questionable
motivations. “Will you stay down on your knees,” he sings, or “will
you bite the hand that feeds you?” I present these views for your
consideration, Libra. It’s a good time to re-evaluate your
relationship with authorities who purport to be helping you.
ho-kay?
I can see the signs, and feel all of you out there, and that’s the
only reason I’m not driving really fast thru conneticut, bypassing
Methuen-lowel-lawrence, and going straight to nyc.  Even thouhgt about
old chopshops for 5 millimicroseconds.  Yurp.
(shudder here-I am)
okay.  I need gatorade.  and something, ugh, chocolate?  again?  i
hate chocolateilovechocolateiHATECHOCOLATEiloveit,rightaboutnow.  Ask
me in about three hours.weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
So off to my muscle relaxers and gatorade i go.  At least I’m not in
the Annex in Miami.  Whatchoo doin’ in my projects, white girl?  never
agin wil i do the miami-dade-county-kick.  Much better doing it here,
where i can talk to you all while i swipe the snot from my nose and
try to think about everythingnothinganythingwhatthefuckin the
summertimeand it rolls……sing it perry.  shudderagainbye
and thanx
i didn’t use
me and my girlfriend….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Patrick K. Kroupa” <digital@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] System Notice: READ ME
Date: May 7, 2005 at 10:48:51 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, apocalypsenow@mindvox.com
Cc: drugwar@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

If you have a $hell account on mindvox.  Please get all your stuff OUT OF IT.  Sometime very soon.

If you have an email account, please grab all your email and move it to your own local machine.  If you do not know how to do this, send me email saying, “Huh!?!?  I don’t understand.”  And I will email you the contents of your entire account in a .tar, .sit, or .zip (tell me which.  If you don’t understand that either, just tell me what computer you’re sitting in front of).

If you have a POPs or IMAP account @mindvox or @phantom.  The mailhost and your login pw, will change.

If we are hosting a web site for you: REMIND ME of this.

We are jettisoning the current primary Vox Box and relighting on mo’ bettah bigger faster shinier n3w hardware.  EVERYTHING moves (the hardware and where the connections go).  The current system will no longer exist in the very near future.

This will have no effect on the lists, forums or web sites.  They may, however, flicker in and out of existence for whatever length of time it takes your DNS to refresh (roughly 12 hours, at most, if you are in the middle of fucking nowhere).

Consider this 48 hours notice.  48 hours may not arrive for another 2 weeks, but there might not be another notification: MOVE YOUR STUFF.  Download it.  Get it off our machines.

There may be a smooth transition with many notices … on the flipside, it’s more likely what’ll happen is, “It’s 3AM…  Nobody can sleep.  Fuck it, everything moves tonight.  Apocalypse now!”

This will have NO EFFECT on the lists.  Everything will remain the same — on the surface.  The software running everything will be revised, and the hardware backend will change completely; but this will not change any of the addresses, or your subscriptions.

Danke Schoen,

Patrick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] so here’s what came flying out of my brain this evening…
Date: May 7, 2005 at 7:48:35 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

From somewhere far, far away, I think I can hear words, but
everything is sounds like it’s being yelled to me down a deep hole,
and I must be sitting at the very bottom of it.  It’s nice and dark,
and sort of like swimming through mud as I try to reach the top of
this hole I’m in.  I stop trying and let the darkness take over.
Time is a strange and wonderful thing when you have absolutely no
sense of it whatsoever.  In and out of nothingness and murk.  It’s not
scaring me the way I thought it might.  I kind of really like it this
far in.  That probably isn’t the best of things to be thinking at this
moment, but the fact that I actually am thinking must be good.  I have
no idea, nor do I want to, yet I know that this, too, shall pass.
Or maybe not. Wait a minute.
I can hear the words again, and they are sudden and louder than
before.  I am beginning to sense that there is a basic super-structure
that surrounds the peripheral edges of this mushy dark place, and I
think that it may even be attached to me in some way, but my eyes
aren’t budging.  Part of me wants to attempt another swim to the
surface, but that little part that is resistant is perilously close to
winning.  Somewhere in the back of my mind, I know that I can’t stay
here forever, and I try again to reach the top of this well of warm
mud and silence, urged on by the repetition of this Code Blue.  I
wonder briefly it this call is for me, and start concentrating on the
rise through the murk.  It’s no use.  I’m simply not ready to make the
transition from safety, hidden in the dark, or the ghastly light that
lies on the other side of this awful swim.
I can feel something like flesh-eating virus creeping through my
body, ripping me into a million pieces of sparkling and bloodied
confetti.  That whole sickly taste of copper I get in the back of my
throat, that makes me gag, and keeps me from smoking when I think I
really need to, is slowly winding itself through the creepy-crawlies,
and suddenly, I’m coming undone at every point that air hits my body.
And it is a body, I’m realizing, regretfully. With this much pain, it
can only be my body, and no one else’s.
I don’t want to minimize pain in any form.  Pain is pain is pain is
pain, and no matter whether you stub your toe or slam through a
windshield, it still hurts.  I still wouldn’t wish this on anyone I
didn’t really have it out for, and even then, I kind of wonder about
the karmic return on THAT whole thing.  Then again, there is the
whole,”Yeah, that sucked, but listen to THIS” brownie points I can
earn, providing that I keep it all with in.  I decide to go the route
of the masochist, and suck it up.  Then I let it go.
Boy, shit howdy, does it come back.  Must love me.
Dear god, there’s light, and I want to scream like the Wicked
Witch of the West, “I’m melting!! I’m melllttiiiiiiiiing…..”, but
there’s just no going back at this point.  What on this whacky doomed
earth made me think that light was the right choice, but I know that
it is, and I try to stop fighting it.  No point, anymore.  Decision
made, move executed, and away we go.  I’m thinking that I’d like to
share the misery at this point, but quickly end that line of thought,
not wanting to make it worse, yet begging for it to kill me.
Helluva way to start the day.
The light is sharp and intensely painful, but I can tell that my
eyes aren’t open.  The blipping and bleeping is seriously making me
want to reconsider my choice of location, but, again and again, I
fight the urge to flee.  Is there nothing that I can do at this point,
other than break?  Voices mingle with the electronics, and briefly,
hysterically, I’m transported back to the club scene.  I want  OUT!
Oh, for christ’s sake, let me go or get on with it, already.  Enough
is a-freaking-nuff, and I’m ready for it when it comes this time.  I
feel like I’m being born into razor blades and lemon juice, but I’m
being born, and all of a sudden, I am here.
‘What the fuck was that all about?’ and, ‘where the hell am I?’
are the only thoughts that move through my head, like a mantra for the
damned.  I finally am beginning to understand religion, in a sort of
bizarre, way-out-in-left-field kind of way, and can’t wait to tell
this to the first person who will listen.
I try out my voice, and find that there are about three large
sewer pipes rammed down my throat.  I’d have had an easier time
winning the lotto, but that’s sort of what this is, I think.  I’ve won
some sort of lucky lottery, and get another chance to try and wreck it
all, or something like that.  I am so thirtsy.
I almost panic, having these things wedged between oxygen, water,
and me, and it takes me a minute, but I realize that there is a
certain amount of air involved with the pipes in my throat.  I can’t
do the whole “Take a deep breath and relax” thing, and start to panic
again, this time losing this battle.
The murkiness is not quite so welcome this time.
And the silence is deafening.

Love,
tink

From: Eye of the Bhogi <freedomroot@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] .
Date: May 7, 2005 at 4:49:52 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Standing on a street corner, talking to the police & the preaching to
the choir.
Stick it to ’em Iboganauts!

Decide for your self
IBOGAINE
African Freedom Root

IBOGAINE
TREATMENT
WORKS!!!

IBOGAINE
The Jungle Un-Jones

with love, rachel

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] @!$%%$*&^#@$#!$#$#$*^*%$#!!!!!!!!!!
Date: May 7, 2005 at 4:49:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the suggestion.  I can’t believe I missed them when the
whole “Just Because” thing happened.  Typical Tink Maneuver…I once
missed Crystal Method  Fat Boy Slim and The Chemical Brothers on a
South Beach they had covered with snow because I had eaten too many
jagged speedy triple stack Melody rolls.  (If I take one more, I think
my spine might straighten…) Yeesh…glad I’m done with THAT.  My cat
is Killer, and she hates my stepdad.  And here we go again…my hands
are starting to shake, but what can I do but twitch it out.  Fuckin’
naloxone shit.
In honor of May Day, I must go herbally remedy myself…

“I’m just living on nerves and feelings with a weak and a lazy mind-
coming to people’s parties, fumbling deaf dumb and blind”
-Joni Mitchell

On 5/7/05, Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Another Perry Ferrel (peripheral-always loved that choice of stage name- we
named our large-nosed feral cat Perry too, in honor of the dude) fan.
Welcome, although I’ve heard here on this list not to long ago that he has
NOT taken ibogaine- but then, how would we really know that without he
himself telling us, right?
;-))
But rock on, Perry rules. Check out his solo CD by the way, it’s brilliant,
though the title escapes me right now…hold on…Song Yet To Be Sung, one
of my all time favorite CDs, which I discovered immediately after my first
ibogaine session. But then, I love everything he ever recorded, with the
VERY serious exception of his first band Psi Com, which totally and
completely sucked without any question.

Peace and love,
Preston \

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: “tink” <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 2:14 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] @!$%%$*&^#@$#!$#$#$*^*%$#!!!!!!!!!!

Listening to Jane’s, Nothing’s Shocking, feeling the decrease, I HATE
SUBOXONE!!!!! This naloxone-narcane whatthefuck….ohmigod, Perry’s
confirming the fact that I’m home.  Drunk and kicking, and BABYSITTING
TEENAGERS!!! Wish I was ocean size.  Oh boy, here we go….
Okay.  Three(?) weeks and waiting.  I can do this.  Martinis do NOt
help, by the way.  Crawling into a bottle of muscle relaxers.  Hope
I’m “keepin’ it green” enough.  What the FUCK!!  I don’t know whether
to laugh or cry, so it’s a little of both.  Shaman13, I love you.  I’m
not going to listen to Lotsof tonight.  i want off. i want done.  if I
can take a 120mg to 0mg methadone drop and survive, whatever. Right?
ohpleaseberight…purtypleasewithsugarontop.  Is Perry an iboganaut?
he does an awful lot of talking and listening to the mountains and
sea.  Wow.  Welcome to my nervous breakdown, or what?  If you see my
dad, tell him my brothers have all gone mad their beating on each
other, yaddayyadda i have that funny feeling that god is dead.  Any
one else got junky parents?  You should see that family get together
thing.  Woohoo, and a bottle of vodka.  I don’t even usually drink,
not since that jagermeister/wild turkey/cab driver/upper east side
incident when I was punk as fuck…everybodies so full of
shit….everybodyeverybodyeverybody……
laughing now.   I’m out of weed. ouch.
Okay.  So I wasn’t thinking about the fact that I was kicking hard as
hell until lostof-whoops-lotsof-reminded me.  matbe i’m going a little
fast, but i’d rather get it over with.  Kurt will email you the full
story.  I’n currently incapable of anything but trying to distinguish
sepserate keys and not go postal. typo-shmypo.i know 20nmgs of this
suboxone shit to 8 in lke a week or two is basically suicide for those
not into self flaggelation, but, hell, read Brezny’s libra horoscope
for this week.  wuzza….hang on, I’ll include it…
Libra horoscope for the week of May 5, 2005
“The proverb warns that ‘You should not bite the hand that feeds you.’
But maybe you should, if it prevents you from feeding yourself.” So
said the critic of psychiatry, Thomas Szasz. He was urging us to think
about how our dependence on seemingly benevolent providers might
paralyze our free will and interfere with our ability to take care of
ourselves. In the song, “The Hand That Feeds,” Trent Reznor of the
band Nine Inch Nails expresses a further doubt about the proverb. He
suggests the hand that feeds us may supply us with stuff that doesn’t
really nourish us and that is tainted by the supplier’s questionable
motivations. “Will you stay down on your knees,” he sings, or “will
you bite the hand that feeds you?” I present these views for your
consideration, Libra. It’s a good time to re-evaluate your
relationship with authorities who purport to be helping you.
ho-kay?
I can see the signs, and feel all of you out there, and that’s the
only reason I’m not driving really fast thru conneticut, bypassing
Methuen-lowel-lawrence, and going straight to nyc.  Even thouhgt about
old chopshops for 5 millimicroseconds.  Yurp.
(shudder here-I am)
okay.  I need gatorade.  and something, ugh, chocolate?  again?  i
hate chocolateilovechocolateiHATECHOCOLATEiloveit,rightaboutnow.  Ask
me in about three hours.weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
So off to my muscle relaxers and gatorade i go.  At least I’m not in
the Annex in Miami.  Whatchoo doin’ in my projects, white girl?  never
agin wil i do the miami-dade-county-kick.  Much better doing it here,
where i can talk to you all while i swipe the snot from my nose and
try to think about everythingnothinganythingwhatthefuckin the
summertimeand it rolls……sing it perry.  shudderagainbye
and thanx
i didn’t use
me and my girlfriend….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] mucho gusto
Date: May 7, 2005 at 4:41:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Welcome and welcome and welcome….
I have an aquaintence that hed a restaurant in Oaxaca and shot dope in
San Fransico, ’bout -eeep-12 years ago.  Has that much time really
passed?
Anyhoo, glad you made it.  I just barely did myself.
luv and may the force be with you
tink

On 5/7/05, Chretien Schiffer <junkyshaman@hotmail.com> wrote:
pleased to meet you all. i just found out that all email from this list was
going right into my junk email folder since i joined a few months ago.

a short intro… i’m 35, living in oaxaca, mexico, i was a 9 year heroin
junkie, took ibogaine about 1 1/2 years ago, and i love life 😉

once again, pleased to meet you all, it’s nice to be on the list finally.

mucho amor,
chretien

_________________________________________________________________
Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search!
http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Chretien Schiffer” <junkyshaman@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] mucho gusto
Date: May 7, 2005 at 3:19:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

pleased to meet you all. i just found out that all email from this list was going right into my junk email folder since i joined a few months ago.

a short intro… i’m 35, living in oaxaca, mexico, i was a 9 year heroin junkie, took ibogaine about 1 1/2 years ago, and i love life 😉

once again, pleased to meet you all, it’s nice to be on the list finally.

mucho amor,
chretien

_________________________________________________________________
Don’t just search. Find. Check out the new MSN Search! http://search.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200636ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] @!$%%$*&^#@$#!$#$#$*^*%$#!!!!!!!!!!
Date: May 7, 2005 at 2:30:05 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Another Perry Ferrel (peripheral-always loved that choice of stage name- we named our large-nosed feral cat Perry too, in honor of the dude) fan. Welcome, although I’ve heard here on this list not to long ago that he has NOT taken ibogaine- but then, how would we really know that without he himself telling us, right?
;-))
But rock on, Perry rules. Check out his solo CD by the way, it’s brilliant, though the title escapes me right now…hold on…Song Yet To Be Sung, one of my all time favorite CDs, which I discovered immediately after my first ibogaine session. But then, I love everything he ever recorded, with the VERY serious exception of his first band Psi Com, which totally and completely sucked without any question.

Peace and love,
Preston \

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “tink” <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 2:14 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] @!$%%$*&^#@$#!$#$#$*^*%$#!!!!!!!!!!

Listening to Jane’s, Nothing’s Shocking, feeling the decrease, I HATE
SUBOXONE!!!!! This naloxone-narcane whatthefuck….ohmigod, Perry’s
confirming the fact that I’m home.  Drunk and kicking, and BABYSITTING
TEENAGERS!!! Wish I was ocean size.  Oh boy, here we go….
Okay.  Three(?) weeks and waiting.  I can do this.  Martinis do NOt
help, by the way.  Crawling into a bottle of muscle relaxers.  Hope
I’m “keepin’ it green” enough.  What the FUCK!!  I don’t know whether
to laugh or cry, so it’s a little of both.  Shaman13, I love you.  I’m
not going to listen to Lotsof tonight.  i want off. i want done.  if I
can take a 120mg to 0mg methadone drop and survive, whatever. Right?
ohpleaseberight…purtypleasewithsugarontop.  Is Perry an iboganaut?
he does an awful lot of talking and listening to the mountains and
sea.  Wow.  Welcome to my nervous breakdown, or what?  If you see my
dad, tell him my brothers have all gone mad their beating on each
other, yaddayyadda i have that funny feeling that god is dead.  Any
one else got junky parents?  You should see that family get together
thing.  Woohoo, and a bottle of vodka.  I don’t even usually drink,
not since that jagermeister/wild turkey/cab driver/upper east side
incident when I was punk as fuck…everybodies so full of
shit….everybodyeverybodyeverybody……
laughing now.   I’m out of weed. ouch.
Okay.  So I wasn’t thinking about the fact that I was kicking hard as
hell until lostof-whoops-lotsof-reminded me.  matbe i’m going a little
fast, but i’d rather get it over with.  Kurt will email you the full
story.  I’n currently incapable of anything but trying to distinguish
sepserate keys and not go postal. typo-shmypo.i know 20nmgs of this
suboxone shit to 8 in lke a week or two is basically suicide for those
not into self flaggelation, but, hell, read Brezny’s libra horoscope
for this week.  wuzza….hang on, I’ll include it…
Libra horoscope for the week of May 5, 2005
“The proverb warns that ‘You should not bite the hand that feeds you.’
But maybe you should, if it prevents you from feeding yourself.” So
said the critic of psychiatry, Thomas Szasz. He was urging us to think
about how our dependence on seemingly benevolent providers might
paralyze our free will and interfere with our ability to take care of
ourselves. In the song, “The Hand That Feeds,” Trent Reznor of the
band Nine Inch Nails expresses a further doubt about the proverb. He
suggests the hand that feeds us may supply us with stuff that doesn’t
really nourish us and that is tainted by the supplier’s questionable
motivations. “Will you stay down on your knees,” he sings, or “will
you bite the hand that feeds you?” I present these views for your
consideration, Libra. It’s a good time to re-evaluate your
relationship with authorities who purport to be helping you.
ho-kay?
I can see the signs, and feel all of you out there, and that’s the
only reason I’m not driving really fast thru conneticut, bypassing
Methuen-lowel-lawrence, and going straight to nyc.  Even thouhgt about
old chopshops for 5 millimicroseconds.  Yurp.
(shudder here-I am)
okay.  I need gatorade.  and something, ugh, chocolate?  again?  i
hate chocolateilovechocolateiHATECHOCOLATEiloveit,rightaboutnow.  Ask
me in about three hours.weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
So off to my muscle relaxers and gatorade i go.  At least I’m not in
the Annex in Miami.  Whatchoo doin’ in my projects, white girl?  never
agin wil i do the miami-dade-county-kick.  Much better doing it here,
where i can talk to you all while i swipe the snot from my nose and
try to think about everythingnothinganythingwhatthefuckin the
summertimeand it rolls……sing it perry.  shudderagainbye
and thanx
i didn’t use
me and my girlfriend….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] .
Date: May 7, 2005 at 2:13:11 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Try to make the march today, your clean time depends
on it.<

What in the heck are you talking about, our “clean time depends on it.” WHile I fully support the march and the idea behind it (though I didn’t climb outta bed until, oh, about 20 minutes ago so missed it entirely), I can’t believe anyone would actually assert my clean time depends upon going to a marijuana march.
It’s odd is all, and I’m wondering how much humor you put into this statement or how seriously you made it, one or the other.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Morning Wood” <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, May 07, 2005 8:59 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] .

Try to make the march today, your clean time depends
on it.

cures-not-wars.org

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…
Date: May 7, 2005 at 12:55:03 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I just want to thank you all who knew somehow what a shitty ass night
I was having and included me in that cosmic iboganaut hug that helped
me get through the worst of it.  The ripple in the fabric that holds
us together is stronger than ever, and, even after almost 7 years, I
can still tune in to you all.  Can’t wait for trip numero two… I
didn’t use anything but what was prescribed by my doc(who’s been
there, got the t-shirt-won’t give me opiates, but knows I need to
sleep while I do this-LOVE YA DR SIROIS!!)and, okay, I took like 2 mgs
of my suboxone at about 4 am.  Hard night, but a beautiful night.  For
the first time in a long time I didn’t feel alone in this weird and
wonderful world.  Still dropping, switching to subutex instead of
suboxone.  Holding at 8mgs for a couple more days, but will march
ahead, allbeit itensely.  Only really miserable late at night, but who
isn’t? Counting the weeks, but I’m okay with that, because I HAVE A
DATE!!!  There will be an end, and it is in sight, and the end is only
the beginning, and I’m PSYCHED!!!!!!  Couldn’t do this with out y’all.
ALL HAIL THE CRAZY ASSED US!!!!
And hey, it’s MAY DAY!!!(okay, not technically the first of the month,
but you know what I mean.  Now if I could only find a ride to
Burlington…)
May the force be with you, Jedi Knights.
It remains strong in me, because of all of you.
LOVE!
tink
(Keep clapping…I’ll come back to life eventually)
On 5/6/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Tink, you are most definitly in the right place. This is the last exit for
the damned. Just ask Patrick, he’ll tell ya. YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA     Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…
Date: May 7, 2005 at 9:02:08 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

this is a breath of fresh air

— tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
twicty legs but muscle relaxers kickin in a little
…my eys are
closing…sleeepee
love you look f or mr in tyhe tonorrow
you hero,you.  Crazy ass hero.  i have a goal ands a
date.  I have
stregnth to do it and support.  and i’m so clsoe.
you help me more
than i cans y, but ai don’t ahve to.  gawd.  bed
manana
aquii
ciao, bella
luv peas force angels and most of all pillows…
tink

On 5/7/05, tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
thanks as i sit here and try to get this awful
suboxone out of my
system.  I was fine till i got an email from
lotsof telling me i
wasn’t.  Ok, so I’m going fast, but I WANT OFF and
tahnk you for being
here while i need to type instead of scream.  Kurt
says you’re carzy
ass, so that’s a thumbs up in my book.  martinis
and detoxing STILL
don’t mix.  WTF?  Means alot i know i can down
load and it’s saving my
ASS…
angels on your pillows.  amy the force be with you
can’t type gotta puke
yurp
On 5/6/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
<BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Tink, you are most definitly in the right
place. This is the last exit for
the damned. Just ask Patrick, he’ll tell ya.
YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA     Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] .
Date: May 7, 2005 at 8:59:25 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Try to make the march today, your clean time depends
on it.

cures-not-wars.org

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…
Date: May 7, 2005 at 4:27:46 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

twicty legs but muscle relaxers kickin in a little …my eys are
closing…sleeepee
love you look f or mr in tyhe tonorrow
you hero,you.  Crazy ass hero.  i have a goal ands a date.  I have
stregnth to do it and support.  and i’m so clsoe.  you help me more
than i cans y, but ai don’t ahve to.  gawd.  bed
manana
aquii
ciao, bella
luv peas force angels and most of all pillows…
tink

On 5/7/05, tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:
thanks as i sit here and try to get this awful suboxone out of my
system.  I was fine till i got an email from lotsof telling me i
wasn’t.  Ok, so I’m going fast, but I WANT OFF and tahnk you for being
here while i need to type instead of scream.  Kurt says you’re carzy
ass, so that’s a thumbs up in my book.  martinis and detoxing STILL
don’t mix.  WTF?  Means alot i know i can down load and it’s saving my
ASS…
angels on your pillows.  amy the force be with you
can’t type gotta puke
yurp
On 5/6/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Tink, you are most definitly in the right place. This is the last exit for
the damned. Just ask Patrick, he’ll tell ya. YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA     Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…
Date: May 7, 2005 at 2:54:49 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks as i sit here and try to get this awful suboxone out of my
system.  I was fine till i got an email from lotsof telling me i
wasn’t.  Ok, so I’m going fast, but I WANT OFF and tahnk you for being
here while i need to type instead of scream.  Kurt says you’re carzy
ass, so that’s a thumbs up in my book.  martinis and detoxing STILL
don’t mix.  WTF?  Means alot i know i can down load and it’s saving my
ASS…
angels on your pillows.  amy the force be with you
can’t type gotta puke
yurp
On 5/6/05, BiscuitBoy714@aol.com <BiscuitBoy714@aol.com> wrote:
Tink, you are most definitly in the right place. This is the last exit for
the damned. Just ask Patrick, he’ll tell ya. YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE
HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA     Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] okay so i’m just gonna type for a awhile
Date: May 7, 2005 at 2:45:21 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

So I’m of two minds now.  I have the fucking suboxone, and I am now
feeling above and beyond the edge of punished for my actions, yet THIS
IS ALL MY OWN DOING!!!  I am willingly falling into that old
school(and not so new school)IF YOU MUST DETOX, YOU MUST SUFFER!!!!!!!
frame of mind  leave a  message I’ll call you back leave it by the bed
some people should die that’s unconcious knowledge because the bigger
you get the wider you spread  you gotta depend on me now your vision
is dead  the more your dream is dead….it’s a sorry for myself but
fuckl that pussy shit i’ve been thru worse than this, but i’m not
going to make it easy on myself, so i’ll listen to jane’s and not
drink water even though my skin is crawling off to some nether region
of hell and it doesn’t have to be this bad but it does if what the
fuck i DON”T have to torture myself it’s only about three hours from
the time i take my morning dose sso i’ll take 4 mgs of this suboxone
shit aand save the other four for when i CAN find my ass with both
ahnds andthen do ita llover again hey why not and wonder HOW the fuck
they convinced me it was a good idea to take something that makes me
feel sicker than when i’m dope siclk and expect me to COOPERTATE AND
SMILE LIKE A GOOD LITTLE GUINEE PIG now say cheese,so we can pass that
photo along to the good folk’s in the law business in
floridamassachusettessandiego, woops, better not go back to hawaii,
dids some one say stop over point from THAILAND!!! weee.. ow okay i
took the fuckin four mgs and will deal wioth it later cuz muscle
relaxers don’t WORK with this narcane shit in my system, better tie
her down she’s a fighter but i get it PRESCRIPTION eepyurp kind of
night.
I have to go puke

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] @!$%%$*&^#@$#!$#$#$*^*%$#!!!!!!!!!!
Date: May 7, 2005 at 2:14:26 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Listening to Jane’s, Nothing’s Shocking, feeling the decrease, I HATE
SUBOXONE!!!!! This naloxone-narcane whatthefuck….ohmigod, Perry’s
confirming the fact that I’m home.  Drunk and kicking, and BABYSITTING
TEENAGERS!!! Wish I was ocean size.  Oh boy, here we go….
Okay.  Three(?) weeks and waiting.  I can do this.  Martinis do NOt
help, by the way.  Crawling into a bottle of muscle relaxers.  Hope
I’m “keepin’ it green” enough.  What the FUCK!!  I don’t know whether
to laugh or cry, so it’s a little of both.  Shaman13, I love you.  I’m
not going to listen to Lotsof tonight.  i want off. i want done.  if I
can take a 120mg to 0mg methadone drop and survive, whatever. Right?
ohpleaseberight…purtypleasewithsugarontop.  Is Perry an iboganaut?
he does an awful lot of talking and listening to the mountains and
sea.  Wow.  Welcome to my nervous breakdown, or what?  If you see my
dad, tell him my brothers have all gone mad their beating on each
other, yaddayyadda i have that funny feeling that god is dead.  Any
one else got junky parents?  You should see that family get together
thing.  Woohoo, and a bottle of vodka.  I don’t even usually drink,
not since that jagermeister/wild turkey/cab driver/upper east side
incident when I was punk as fuck…everybodies so full of
shit….everybodyeverybodyeverybody……
laughing now.   I’m out of weed. ouch.
Okay.  So I wasn’t thinking about the fact that I was kicking hard as
hell until lostof-whoops-lotsof-reminded me.  matbe i’m going a little
fast, but i’d rather get it over with.  Kurt will email you the full
story.  I’n currently incapable of anything but trying to distinguish
sepserate keys and not go postal. typo-shmypo.i know 20nmgs of this
suboxone shit to 8 in lke a week or two is basically suicide for those
not into self flaggelation, but, hell, read Brezny’s libra horoscope
for this week.  wuzza….hang on, I’ll include it…
Libra horoscope for the week of May 5, 2005
“The proverb warns that ‘You should not bite the hand that feeds you.’
But maybe you should, if it prevents you from feeding yourself.” So
said the critic of psychiatry, Thomas Szasz. He was urging us to think
about how our dependence on seemingly benevolent providers might
paralyze our free will and interfere with our ability to take care of
ourselves. In the song, “The Hand That Feeds,” Trent Reznor of the
band Nine Inch Nails expresses a further doubt about the proverb. He
suggests the hand that feeds us may supply us with stuff that doesn’t
really nourish us and that is tainted by the supplier’s questionable
motivations. “Will you stay down on your knees,” he sings, or “will
you bite the hand that feeds you?” I present these views for your
consideration, Libra. It’s a good time to re-evaluate your
relationship with authorities who purport to be helping you.
ho-kay?
I can see the signs, and feel all of you out there, and that’s the
only reason I’m not driving really fast thru conneticut, bypassing
Methuen-lowel-lawrence, and going straight to nyc.  Even thouhgt about
old chopshops for 5 millimicroseconds.  Yurp.
(shudder here-I am)
okay.  I need gatorade.  and something, ugh, chocolate?  again?  i
hate chocolateilovechocolateiHATECHOCOLATEiloveit,rightaboutnow.  Ask
me in about three hours.weeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee!
So off to my muscle relaxers and gatorade i go.  At least I’m not in
the Annex in Miami.  Whatchoo doin’ in my projects, white girl?  never
agin wil i do the miami-dade-county-kick.  Much better doing it here,
where i can talk to you all while i swipe the snot from my nose and
try to think about everythingnothinganythingwhatthefuckin the
summertimeand it rolls……sing it perry.  shudderagainbye
and thanx
i didn’t use
me and my girlfriend….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…
Date: May 7, 2005 at 1:23:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Now Baby,
I told You this is the “spot”,
I love You and all the other twisted freaks in this space, (twisted freaks
is a term of endearment)
So say what You will , cause We wouldn’t have it any other way.
Welcome Home,
Love Kurt

—– Original Message —–
From: “tink” <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 5:54 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…

Hey there Hi there Ho there, and aren’t I more than bursting with joy
at finally having found my fellow iboganauts!!  I’m not exactly sure
how this all works, but, providing I can get my freakin’ computer to
understand me, I’m hoping that this will get to someone,
somewhere…Ummmmmmm….well.  I was skf28 in St Kitts, one of the
Mash-onian Iboganuats, from about six years ago.  We were the easter
Resurrection Group.  Holy FUCK!!  My eyes changed color, I can still
talk to plants and animals, and I got off of 120mgs of that ever
popular liquid handcuff, metha-drone.  I also came back Hep C negative
and no longer test positive for HIV(I HAVE THE BLOODWORK IF IT IS
NEEDED).  Haven’t for close to 6 years. Thanks to Deb C, Craig, Judy,
and crew(Thankyou Dr Kamlet!!), I managed to keep it moderately
together until I allowed the fabulous streets of Overtown in
Miami(wassup, my niggas) to suck me back into that blackholiest of
holes once again.  C’est la voie…I’m now detoxing from suboxone(what
the FUCK is THAT about, anyway!!?)and will hopefully go for round two,
if I can ever get ahold of my favorite shaman13.
Soooooooooo….I escaped from Miami, and am stuck, happily(sort of-I
dunno-sometimes?whatever)on the side of a mountain with my parents.
Eeep and yurp and HELP!!!Thank gawd you all are here.  My scalp was
tingling from the beginning, after I figured out that mindbox and
mindvox were 2 seperate thingies(I couldn’t for the life of me figure
out what artificially intelligent banking systems had to do with an
iboga list. Holy corporate amerikkka, batman!!)  Rantraverantrave…
So I offer up this little achoo of self to whomever might find it, and
if anyone can tell me anything about ibogaine and epileptic pregnant
women newly diagnosed with cancer, I’d very much appreciate it.  I
have a friend(really, i do have a friend, it’s not me in disguise)that
is looking for a way off of subutex etc et al. and told her I would
throw it out there and see what happens.  We read the thingie about
epilepsie and light, etc, and it doesn’t look good, from what I’ve
gleened so far, but it can’t hurt to ask.  Right? Right.
Okay.  I have run myself out at this point, and have to go get
something with caffeine in it, or I might not make it.
THANK YOU FOR HAVING THIS PLACE!!!  It’s like seeing all of my
thoughts, and thoughts of thoughts , and wish I’d have thoughts, and
maybe will thinks available in scroll-friendly form.  It’s like coming
home.
May the force be with you,
tink
if this is the wrong place to send stuff, or whatever, please tell me…

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…marc
Date: May 6, 2005 at 7:53:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Marc,
I gotta say you impressed the hell out of me the other day!  I saw an underlying calm, focus and intrespection I had never recognized before.
I gotta say that the sayings “burn me once etc.” and “talk is cheap” holds more strength amongst a group of junkies or ex-junkies than any other group.
The key thing here is you said “people in your life” which means you still have interaction with them and are not kicked to the curb.  So like you say just show them but most of all show yourself and be at peace.   I’ll stop now.
Love ya,
Martee

—– Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 7:09 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…Thanx Patrick

Hey Randy. fuck the ten dollar bag i did it for both of us. Its a lie. The worst thing you could possibly do and I assure you in a week you’d be doing 6 of them and you’ll be back to not feeling them at all. They dont kill that kinda pain.

On another note list its begining to piss me off that no one in my life trusts me. its like there expecting me to fuck up and I’m having a very hard time explaing to them how different it is this time and HOW DIFFERNT THE IBOGAINE WAS THIS TIME! They just don’t want to hear it. And then I get so offended  and I have to catch myself and remember that I was on my back just 30 days ago and 31 days I was in hell and its only natual that they’d feel like this. But it still sucks. I just have to show them. -m.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Oh Yea, that reminds me. Thanx again Patrick. This list continues to keep me insane. Don’t want to change everything, just the shit that kills me. Nard Tingledick is alive and well, and guarding a herd of river otters on the Hudson.          Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more.

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…Thanx Patrick
Date: May 6, 2005 at 7:09:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Randy. fuck the ten dollar bag i did it for both of us. Its a lie. The worst thing you could possibly do and I assure you in a week you’d be doing 6 of them and you’ll be back to not feeling them at all. They dont kill that kinda pain.

On another note list its begining to piss me off that no one in my life trusts me. its like there expecting me to fuck up and I’m having a very hard time explaing to them how different it is this time and HOW DIFFERNT THE IBOGAINE WAS THIS TIME! They just don’t want to hear it. And then I get so offended  and I have to catch myself and remember that I was on my back just 30 days ago and 31 days I was in hell and its only natual that they’d feel like this. But it still sucks. I just have to show them. -m.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Oh Yea, that reminds me. Thanx again Patrick. This list continues to keep me insane. Don’t want to change everything, just the shit that kills me. Nard Tingledick is alive and well, and guarding a herd of river otters on the Hudson.          Randy

Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Find what you need with new enhanced search. Learn more.

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…Thanx Patrick
Date: May 6, 2005 at 6:55:22 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Oh Yea, that reminds me. Thanx again Patrick. This list continues to keep me insane. Don’t want to change everything, just the shit that kills me. Nard Tingledick is alive and well, and guarding a herd of river otters on the Hudson.          Randy

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…
Date: May 6, 2005 at 6:49:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Tink, you are most definitly in the right place. This is the last exit for the damned. Just ask Patrick, he’ll tell ya. YEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEE HAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA     Randy

From: Carla Barnes <carlambarnes@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…
Date: May 6, 2005 at 6:43:24 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I don’t think there is a wrong place 😉 Welcome home,
you’ll fit right in 🙂

Carla B

— tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com> wrote:

THANK YOU FOR HAVING THIS PLACE!!!  It’s like seeing
all of my
thoughts, and thoughts of thoughts , and wish I’d
have thoughts, and
maybe will thinks available in scroll-friendly form.
It’s like coming
home.
May the force be with you,
tink
if this is the wrong place to send stuff, or
whatever, please tell me…

Yahoo! Mail
Stay connected, organized, and protected. Take the tour:
http://tour.mail.yahoo.com/mailtour.html

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: tink <tinkerbell.sarah@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] There’s no place like home…
Date: May 6, 2005 at 5:54:29 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey there Hi there Ho there, and aren’t I more than bursting with joy
at finally having found my fellow iboganauts!!  I’m not exactly sure
how this all works, but, providing I can get my freakin’ computer to
understand me, I’m hoping that this will get to someone,
somewhere…Ummmmmmm….well.  I was skf28 in St Kitts, one of the
Mash-onian Iboganuats, from about six years ago.  We were the easter
Resurrection Group.  Holy FUCK!!  My eyes changed color, I can still
talk to plants and animals, and I got off of 120mgs of that ever
popular liquid handcuff, metha-drone.  I also came back Hep C negative
and no longer test positive for HIV(I HAVE THE BLOODWORK IF IT IS
NEEDED).  Haven’t for close to 6 years. Thanks to Deb C, Craig, Judy,
and crew(Thankyou Dr Kamlet!!), I managed to keep it moderately
together until I allowed the fabulous streets of Overtown in
Miami(wassup, my niggas) to suck me back into that blackholiest of
holes once again.  C’est la voie…I’m now detoxing from suboxone(what
the FUCK is THAT about, anyway!!?)and will hopefully go for round two,
if I can ever get ahold of my favorite shaman13.
Soooooooooo….I escaped from Miami, and am stuck, happily(sort of-I
dunno-sometimes?whatever)on the side of a mountain with my parents.
Eeep and yurp and HELP!!!Thank gawd you all are here.  My scalp was
tingling from the beginning, after I figured out that mindbox and
mindvox were 2 seperate thingies(I couldn’t for the life of me figure
out what artificially intelligent banking systems had to do with an
iboga list. Holy corporate amerikkka, batman!!)  Rantraverantrave…
So I offer up this little achoo of self to whomever might find it, and
if anyone can tell me anything about ibogaine and epileptic pregnant
women newly diagnosed with cancer, I’d very much appreciate it.  I
have a friend(really, i do have a friend, it’s not me in disguise)that
is looking for a way off of subutex etc et al. and told her I would
throw it out there and see what happens.  We read the thingie about
epilepsie and light, etc, and it doesn’t look good, from what I’ve
gleened so far, but it can’t hurt to ask.  Right? Right.
Okay.  I have run myself out at this point, and have to go get
something with caffeine in it, or I might not make it.
THANK YOU FOR HAVING THIS PLACE!!!  It’s like seeing all of my
thoughts, and thoughts of thoughts , and wish I’d have thoughts, and
maybe will thinks available in scroll-friendly form.  It’s like coming
home.
May the force be with you,
tink
if this is the wrong place to send stuff, or whatever, please tell me…

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sleeping
Date: May 6, 2005 at 3:57:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jane,
The first thought that came to my mind was Joga. With muscle stretching we can get huge relief from old injuries etc and a marked increase in lifestyle. Yet if we stop the old muscular conditions can return (not always if a whole program of physical/spiritual work has been entered into), i.e., somewhere deep down there is the seed of disease in the body linked to its corresponding psycho/spiritual correspondent.
I imagine that perhaps beneath your condition lies psycho-spiritual issues that are in part healed during an ibogaine session but with time the stuff underneath that, which still has not been healed (within the Shadow), emerges into the freed up space of your psyche and so the seed of your condition is perhaps given impetus to grow and manifest again as time goes by.
I would imagine that if you continue to work with eboga in a way that you sought to integrate your Shadow this condition might eventually disappear.
In that sense this condition is a form of feedback to indicate where you are at and as such can be viewed as your friend.
Just some speculative thoughts to throw into the mix 🙂
Lee
Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com> wrote:
Thanks for the feedback.  There are other things, I believe, that ibo resets in the body.  I, for instance, although I didn’t know it, had pretty severe diabetic neuropathy.  I didn’t know I was diabetic, and I thoought it was fibromyalgia.  After ibogaine, I had no more pain, though I can’t really explain this.  It felt really, really good.  D.N. CAN be eliminated with good blood sugar control, and also with a combo of alpha-lipoic acid and n-acetyl carnitine, but that isn’t what was happening.  Is it possible that ibo causes the cells to uptake glucose better?  The other possibility is just that there were lifestyle changes that eliminated my glucose swings.  I certainly had a lot less anxiety, for starters, and could meditate at the drop of a hat! More significantly, I think I was sleeping better (as I said previously) and exercising more. Unfortunately, the pain came back years later, and I took a second dose, pain gone again, though it lasted not quite as long that time.
Jane
Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Jane,

I found that very interesting also. Myself I find I like to sleep during the day when I feel my energy drop and then wake refreshed. Mediterranean siesta has a lot to offer. It’s like 2 days in one. After an ibogaine session I will sometimes sleep the sleep of a baby during the day. Yet I do go for the night time sleep. Ibogaine resets in many ways – why not back to a more natural sleep cycle which of course we can lose as we readapt to the “normal” sleep cycle.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
Hi Jane,

Very well put. We all do function on wake/sleep cycles for which we are
societally trained from kindergarten on. Possibly, ibogaine does return us to
natural cycles. Very interesting!

Howard

In a message dated 5/1/05 8:01:56 PM, jellking@yahoo.com writes:

>Hi iboga-mates. I haven’t posted here in donkey years, but I wanted to
>share an insight re the sleep thing. Won’t help everyone, might not help
>anyone, but here it is: After ibogaine, I was WIDE awake, partly I think,
>on a really simple level, ibo had just upset my sleep cycle. But I decided
>to trust its “wisdom,” and I was fortunate enough to be in a situation
>where I didn’t have to do a 9 to 5. At the time, I was teaching a class
>from 8 am to 11 every day, and then had about 4-infinity hours of prep
>and grading. All activities for which it is necessary to be alert. I
>made a decision to allow myself (other than during the actual commute and
>classroom hours) to just sleep when I wanted to, and not sleep when I didn’t
>want to. Of course, I was single, no children, so I wasn’t needing to
>attend to others. What happened really surprised me, though. For about
>3-4 months, I wanted to sleep (once I gave myself the privilege of listening
>to the ol’ bod’s desires) very early at
> night. I was usually asleep by 9 pm. I wouild sleep for like 4 or 5 or
>6 hours, then wake up. OK at 3-6 am I did all the prep and grading work
>(and quite well, actually) that I used to do in the afternoons and evenings.
> Then would go teach, then come home, eat lunch, and often take a nap of
>very high quality for 2-3 hours. The point here, though, isn’t my schedule
>at all; this worked for me, but the point was, I just for the first time
>since probably infancy said, “sleep when you’re tired, and don’t when you
>aren’t.” Regardless, ya know? never slept better, never felt more awake
>when awake.
>
>I think Ibo experiences may help set your circadian rhythms back to what
>they want to be.
>We live in this 9-5 world, but we aren’t all “set” that way. For me, it
>felt really good to take away the anxiety of sleeping or not sleeping by
>just telling myself, at least for now, not to have any pressure or stress
>about it. Sleep when you’re sleepy; don’t when you’re not. Of course,
>eventually I became more “normally” emplyed and had to adjust. But by
>then the “ibo sleepless” crisis was really gone. I still employ this
>however. If I awaken at 2 and don’t feel sleepy, I don’t sleep. It might
>mean I drag my very large ass around for a day, but you bet I’m ready to
>sleep when I next “should.” In short, ibogaine helped me adjust from a
>lifetime of insomnia to a more realistic attitude re sleep.
>
>The other thing was the dreams, wow and wow again. I never dreamed so
>brilliantly and significantly, or remembered them so well, as the immediate
>post-ibo time. I imagine others have experience that too. And I think
>that when we dream to capacity, the need for sleep is lessened. I don’t
>base this on scientific discoveries, it’s just my personal observation.
> It’s like sleeping was waking, with rest. I coiuldn’t wait to go to
sleep….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com

From: Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sleeping
Date: May 6, 2005 at 2:11:55 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks for the feedback.  There are other things, I believe, that ibo resets in the body.  I, for instance, although I didn’t know it, had pretty severe diabetic neuropathy.  I didn’t know I was diabetic, and I thoought it was fibromyalgia.  After ibogaine, I had no more pain, though I can’t really explain this.  It felt really, really good.  D.N. CAN be eliminated with good blood sugar control, and also with a combo of alpha-lipoic acid and n-acetyl carnitine, but that isn’t what was happening.  Is it possible that ibo causes the cells to uptake glucose better?  The other possibility is just that there were lifestyle changes that eliminated my glucose swings.  I certainly had a lot less anxiety, for starters, and could meditate at the drop of a hat! More significantly, I think I was sleeping better (as I said previously) and exercising more. Unfortunately, the pain came back years later, and I took a second dose, pain gone again, though it lasted not quite as long that time.
Jane
Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Jane,

I found that very interesting also. Myself I find I like to sleep during the day when I feel my energy drop and then wake refreshed. Mediterranean siesta has a lot to offer. It’s like 2 days in one. After an ibogaine session I will sometimes sleep the sleep of a baby during the day. Yet I do go for the night time sleep. Ibogaine resets in many ways – why not back to a more natural sleep cycle which of course we can lose as we readapt to the “normal” sleep cycle.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
Hi Jane,

Very well put. We all do function on wake/sleep cycles for which we are
societally trained from kindergarten on. Possibly, ibogaine does return us to
natural cycles. Very interesting!

Howard

In a message dated 5/1/05 8:01:56 PM, jellking@yahoo.com writes:

>Hi iboga-mates. I haven’t posted here in donkey years, but I wanted to
>share an insight re the sleep thing. Won’t help everyone, might not help
>anyone, but here it is: After ibogaine, I was WIDE awake, partly I think,
>on a really simple level, ibo had just upset my sleep cycle. But I decided
>to trust its “wisdom,” and I was fortunate enough to be in a situation
>where I didn’t have to do a 9 to 5. At the time, I was teaching a class
>from 8 am to 11 every day, and then had about 4-infinity hours of prep
>and grading. All activities for which it is necessary to be alert. I
>made a decision to allow myself (other than during the actual commute and
>classroom hours) to just sleep when I wanted to, and not sleep when I didn’t
>want to. Of course, I was single, no children, so I wasn’t needing to
>attend to others. What happened really surprised me, though. For about
>3-4 months, I wanted to sleep (once I gave myself the privilege of listening
>to the ol’ bod’s desires) very early at
> night. I was usually asleep by 9 pm. I wouild sleep for like 4 or 5 or
>6 hours, then wake up. OK at 3-6 am I did all the prep and grading work
>(and quite well, actually) that I used to do in the afternoons and evenings.
> Then would go teach, then come home, eat lunch, and often take a nap of
>very high quality for 2-3 hours. The point here, though, isn’t my schedule
>at all; this worked for me, but the point was, I just for the first time
>since probably infancy said, “sleep when you’re tired, and don’t when you
>aren’t.” Regardless, ya know? never slept better, never felt more awake
>when awake.
>
>I think Ibo experiences may help set your circadian rhythms back to what
>they want to be.
>We live in this 9-5 world, but we aren’t all “set” that way. For me, it
>felt really good to take away the anxiety of sleeping or not sleeping by
>just telling myself, at least for now, not to have any pressure or stress
>about it. Sleep when you’re sleepy; don’t when you’re not. Of course,
>eventually I became more “normally” emplyed and had to adjust. But by
>then the “ibo sleepless” crisis was really gone. I still employ this
>however. If I awaken at 2 and don’t feel sleepy, I don’t sleep. It might
>mean I drag my very large ass around for a day, but you bet I’m ready to
>sleep when I next “should.” In short, ibogaine helped me adjust from a
>lifetime of insomnia to a more realistic attitude re sleep.
>
>The other thing was the dreams, wow and wow again. I never dreamed so
>brilliantly and significantly, or remembered them so well, as the immediate
>post-ibo time. I imagine others have experience that too. And I think
>that when we dream to capacity, the need for sleep is lessened. I don’t
>base this on scientific discoveries, it’s just my personal observation.
> It’s like sleeping was waking, with rest. I coiuldn’t wait to go to
sleep….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 6, 2005 at 12:50:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jason,

I would be really interested to know what you mean by:

> i had difficult hcl, perhaps that was a reason why.

Can you explain the background to this, i.e., dosage, state prior to taking (drug free?) and aftereffects, i.e., how did you feel within 36 hours of taking it, where you in pain or did you feel fine after 36 hours?

What exactly was difficult about it that you did not experience on the extract? Where the difficulties within the session or after? What kind of difficulties?

If you have time I would be very interested to know.

Cheer,

Lee

Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:
I have terrible reactions to anti-depressents and
maoi’s

i had difficult hcl, perhaps that was a reason why.

i did not have anything like that reaction with
extract.

the reason I bring it up, other then to infurate
control junkies, is that I think using extract in low
doses afterwards can be of benifit to the issue of
“add”

I do think medical science is too quick to label
things that they simple do a terrible job treating.

my question anytime a “bi-polar” or “a.d.d.” comes
up is what are the characteristics that led them to
that diagnosis, (is it something that shows up on a
test or just a hunch)

9 times out of 10 they seem to just say you have
something, and if the medication works then it’s like
verification…if it doesn’t work, well at least you
know you don’t have “it”.

not that anyone would reply, but has anyone ever
taking the medication that they treat people with
‘a.d.d.’ after dosing with ibogaine?

so to summerize, if your having trouble with that,
maybe contacting other providers to see if they can
help might be an option, (just to clearify, I am not
assuming your provider is irresponsible, just the more
options and diversity of information the better.

Interesting thing about language…sow mol ia and Ru
Wand Da have one single unifies langage and see great
suffering from war.
Cameroon has over 150 languages and has peace.

I have peace.

Later.
jason bursey
— HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
>
> In a message dated 5/3/05 11:56:48 AM,
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:
>
> >Gotta say I’ve had the exact opposite reaction to
> ibogaine, with nary a
> >single ADD issue raising it’s head.
> >Thank goodness.
>
>
> To the best of my recollections things got a bit
> fuzzy during the first few
> days post ibogaine (possibly fuzzy is an
> understatement) and then everything
> got real clear. But, then there is the ever present
> issue of diverse effects
> common to virtually everything including
> medications/drugs.
>
> Howard
>
>
>
>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>
>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com

From: Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] And now–that PC is no longer on the list–this comes
Date: May 6, 2005 at 11:30:27 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Vatican issues first new exorcism ritual since 1614

Rites seeks to bring church up to date with science

VATICAN CITY (CNN) — Blaming Satan for many of today’s ills, the Vatican on
Tuesday unveiled updated exorcism rules, along with a caution not to mistake
psychiatric problems for diabolic possession.

The Vatican’s first updated ritual for exorcism since 1614 tries to bring
the church up to date with modern science and, for the first time, urges
church-approved exorcists to consult modern medicine where needed. However,
officials made clear at a news conference that the traditional belief in the
devil was not optional for today’s Roman Catholics.

“The existence of the devil isn’t an opinion, something to take or leave as
you wish,” said Cardinal Jorge Medina Estevez, a Vatican official, adding
that belief in Satan is a tenet of Catholic faith.

The devil “deceives men, making them believe that you find happiness in
money, in power, in carnal desire,” Medina said in presenting the revised
rules. “He fools men by persuading them that they do not need God and that
they are self-sufficient.”

Rules urge consultations with physicians

Except for some new formulas for priests, authorized by bishops, to read
during exorcisms, the text is essentially unchanged. Instead the novelty
appears largely in the cautions for determining if exorcism is warranted.

“The exorcist will decide with prudence” after consulting with spiritual
experts and “if considered opportune, with experts in medical and
psychiatric science,” the new rules stress.

“First of all, he must not assume that those who are suffering from some
illness, particularly psychological, are vexed by the demon,” the guide
says.

It says signs that a person is under the influence of the devil include
speaking unknown languages and having physical strength disproportionate to
a person’s age or body.

The ritual of exorcism itself, outlined in detail in the booklet, includes
prayers, the blessing and sprinkling of holy water, the laying of hands on
the possessed and making the sign of the cross. It continues with appeals to
Christ, the Holy Spirit and the saints of the church.

Actual formula largely unchanged

Then, the actual formula of exorcism begins.

The first is the “imploring formula,” in which the evils of the devil are
listed and God is entreated to free the possessed.

The second, more intense formula, is the “imperative formula” in which the
devil is ordered to leave the possessed.

The imperative formula begins: “I order you, Satan …” It then goes on to
denounce Satan as “prince of the world” and “enemy of human salvation.” It
ends: “Therefore, Go Back, Satan.”

The new text, an 84-page Latin-language book known as the Roman Ritual, is
not yet available in other languages, but Cardinal Estevez said that was not
a problem.

“The new manual comes into effect today in its Latin version,” he said. “An
exorcist can use the Latin version tonight if he wants because the devil
understands Latin.”

Number of exorcisms performed unclear

Vatican officials said they had no figures on how many exorcisms are
performed, but major dioceses have their own exorcists. Estevez said he
believed the number of true possessions today was “not that great, rather
scarce,” but that the amount of evil in the world left no doubt the devil
was on the job.

Pope John Paul II has made it clear several times in his 20- year papacy
that he believes in the existence of the devil. During a trip to Germany in
1987, the pope said the horrors of World War II, including the Nazi death
camps, were proof that the devil was still at work.

The pope himself once performed an exorcism during his papacy, according to
the memoirs of Cardinal Jacques Martin, the former prefect of the pontifical
household.

Quoting the late cardinal’s book, “My Six Popes,” the Italian news agency
ANSA said John Paul carried out the rite in 1982, driving out the devil from
a woman who was brought to him, writhing on the ground.

The Associated Press and Reuters contributed to this report

From: Eye of the Bhogi <freedomroot@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 6, 2005 at 9:01:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Brooklyn AND Queens suck for midnight foodies, Marc!  Except for
diners, and the 24 hour Bagel Oasis on the LIE service road between
Utopia and 188th Street.

Per your statement — the likely need for multiple treatments to
effect full abstinence seems to me to then, in market terms, to shift
the pricing structure for offshore dosing.  At least in my ethical
world.

love from the outer boroughs, rachel

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 6, 2005 at 8:31:33 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

sorry to hear about the girlfriend and the ibogaine assessment seems about right to me too.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.
—– Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 06, 2005 3:51 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????

INTRODUCTION
Ibogaine is not a substitute for narcotics or stimulants, is not addicting and is given in a single administration modality (SAM). It is a chemical dependence interrupter. Retreatment may occasionally be needed until the person being treated with Ibogaine is able to extinguish certain conditioned responses related to drugs they abuse. Early data suggests that a period of approximately two years of intermittent treatments may be required to attain the goal of long-term abstinence from narcotics and stimulants for many patients. The majority of patients treated with Ibogaine remain free from chemical dependence for a period of three to six months after a single dose. Approximately ten percent of patients treated with Ibogaine remain free of chemical dependence for two or more years from a single treatment and an equal percentage return to drug use within two weeks after treatment. Multiple administrations of Ibogaine over a period of time are generally more effective in ext! ending periods of abstinence.
what are peoples assessment of this statement? makes me feel a lot better.
girlfriend broke up with me in an unuallaly fucked up manner this afternoon and we’ve been though a whole lot in the past 6 months but instead of beign brokenhearteted and I am to some extent but instead I can’t help but think back on this type of situation a year ago or two years ago and think back to how I would have reacted vs. the way I’m dealing with thing today. Ibogaine is something else. I am bored, and kinda sad, kinda hungry(brooklyn sucks for food in the middle of the night) but I still have peace, I’m not sick or waiting for sickness to come and I feel great.
Insomnia is back. 4:00 am in NYC and I just got home but I’m can’t sleep. back to that only want to only be outside thing again. When does this go away again?
girlfriend broke up with me in an unuallaly fucked up manner this afternoon and we’ve been though a whole lot in the past 6 months but instead of being brokenhearteted, and I am to some extent, but instead I can’t help but think back on this type of situation a year ago or two years ago and think back to how I would have reacted vs. the way I’m dealing with thing today. Ibogaine is something else. I am bored, and kinda sad, kinda hungry(brooklyn sucks for food in the middle of the night) but I still have peace, I’m not sick or waiting for sickness to come so as shitty as I feel right now it could be a MILLION times worse.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
Strangely enough I went deeper or I should say I had more of a visual experience on 9 than I did in Mexico on 18. Weird right? Maybe not so weird cuz I was basically clean but yeah no sleep disturbance other than that first night obviously. Its weird though and I’ve mentioned this to people but I found that after the 9mg/kg it was almost like I wanted to get high even more after.  I saw a bunch of shit that was very profound in a global or worldly sense but nothing much that had to do with me personally and when I came to that next day I knew I didn’t get that “reset” I got the first time and certainly not even close to what I got this time. I think my first words were ” I don’t think it worked this time”. So my opinion is keep at least 15 just to be sure and if you don’t need it you don’t need it. I know it takes you a lot to go deep (hard head;o) so make sure you have enough cuz there is nothing worse than not enough ibogaine even if it is preventative instead of! for a detox.
And between me and you I think after a road trip like yours everyone should be forced to do a big booster. So good to see you doing so well. -M.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
I took 9 mg/kg in the middle after two “slips” and I had no insomnia. 24 on the other hand will keep ya up for a while. ;o) Hey Randy -m.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Hey fellow Ibofreaks, I’ve got a question. Or should I say I need some advice? Anyway, I’ve been thinking of taking a booster dose of Ibogaine and was wondering at what point in the dosage range dose Ibogaine give you the insomnia side effect? I would say that it depends on the individual, but that is just a guess, I have no data to go on. I would think that if you take enough to see the trails, and hear the hum, that you probably are going to have some insomnia afterwards, but does it have to last for 2 or 3 weeks? When I did my session in September I took a shit load for a couple of days because it was Methadone I came off of, so that is the only experience I have personally with doing it. It’s been a while now. I think I need it. I feel good, and I want to continue what I am doing, so I don’t want to fuck this up but something tells me that this is a good idea. What do yall think? I’m plann! ing on doing a whole session sometime late summer to try and quit smoking cigs but I still think I need this.              Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

Do you Yahoo!?
Make Yahoo! your home page

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 6, 2005 at 4:37:22 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey M, I’m glad you posted that. I needed to see it this morning. I can’t figure out why I’m having these feelings right now. Maybe it’s hanging out in NYC and knowing those 10 dollar bags are still there. I haven’t copped any, but I’ve thought about it. I’m going to be sitting idle more than usual, and I know how my head works, so I think I need to do a booster. I refuse to fuck this up. Looks like I may have to wait for a while tho, so fuck it, on with the show. Hope to see you at the march.             Randy

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question ??????????????????????????????
Date: May 6, 2005 at 3:51:22 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

INTRODUCTION
Ibogaine is not a substitute for narcotics or stimulants, is not addicting and is given in a single administration modality (SAM). It is a chemical dependence interrupter. Retreatment may occasionally be needed until the person being treated with Ibogaine is able to extinguish certain conditioned responses related to drugs they abuse. Early data suggests that a period of approximately two years of intermittent treatments may be required to attain the goal of long-term abstinence from narcotics and stimulants for many patients. The majority of patients treated with Ibogaine remain free from chemical dependence for a period of three to six months after a single dose. Approximately ten percent of patients treated with Ibogaine remain free of chemical dependence for two or more years from a single treatment and an equal percentage return to drug use within two weeks after treatment. Multiple administrations of Ibogaine over a period of time are generally more effective in extending periods of abstinence.
what are peoples assessment of this statement? makes me feel a lot better.
girlfriend broke up with me in an unuallaly fucked up manner this afternoon and we’ve been though a whole lot in the past 6 months but instead of beign brokenhearteted and I am to some extent but instead I can’t help but think back on this type of situation a year ago or two years ago and think back to how I would have reacted vs. the way I’m dealing with thing today. Ibogaine is something else. I am bored, and kinda sad, kinda hungry(brooklyn sucks for food in the middle of the night) but I still have peace, I’m not sick or waiting for sickness to come and I feel great.
Insomnia is back. 4:00 am in NYC and I just got home but I’m can’t sleep. back to that only want to only be outside thing again. When does this go away again?
girlfriend broke up with me in an unuallaly fucked up manner this afternoon and we’ve been though a whole lot in the past 6 months but instead of being brokenhearteted, and I am to some extent, but instead I can’t help but think back on this type of situation a year ago or two years ago and think back to how I would have reacted vs. the way I’m dealing with thing today. Ibogaine is something else. I am bored, and kinda sad, kinda hungry(brooklyn sucks for food in the middle of the night) but I still have peace, I’m not sick or waiting for sickness to come so as shitty as I feel right now it could be a MILLION times worse.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
Strangely enough I went deeper or I should say I had more of a visual experience on 9 than I did in Mexico on 18. Weird right? Maybe not so weird cuz I was basically clean but yeah no sleep disturbance other than that first night obviously. Its weird though and I’ve mentioned this to people but I found that after the 9mg/kg it was almost like I wanted to get high even more after.  I saw a bunch of shit that was very profound in a global or worldly sense but nothing much that had to do with me personally and when I came to that next day I knew I didn’t get that “reset” I got the first time and certainly not even close to what I got this time. I think my first words were ” I don’t think it worked this time”. So my opinion is keep at least 15 just to be sure and if you don’t need it you don’t need it. I know it takes you a lot to go deep (hard head;o) so make sure you have enough cuz there is nothing worse than not enough ibogaine even if it is preventative instead of for a detox.
And between me and you I think after a road trip like yours everyone should be forced to do a big booster. So good to see you doing so well. -M.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
I took 9 mg/kg in the middle after two “slips” and I had no insomnia. 24 on the other hand will keep ya up for a while. ;o) Hey Randy -m.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Hey fellow Ibofreaks, I’ve got a question. Or should I say I need some advice? Anyway, I’ve been thinking of taking a booster dose of Ibogaine and was wondering at what point in the dosage range dose Ibogaine give you the insomnia side effect? I would say that it depends on the individual, but that is just a guess, I have no data to go on. I would think that if you take enough to see the trails, and hear the hum, that you probably are going to have some insomnia afterwards, but does it have to last for 2 or 3 weeks? When I did my session in September I took a shit load for a couple of days because it was Methadone I came off of, so that is the only experience I have personally with doing it. It’s been a while now. I think I need it. I feel good, and I want to continue what I am doing, so I don’t want to fuck this up but something tells me that this is a good idea. What do yall think? I’m planning on doing a whole session sometime late summer to try and quit smoking cigs but I still think I need this.              Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

Do you Yahoo!?
Make Yahoo! your home page

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question
Date: May 5, 2005 at 9:08:35 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Randy,

As you know I have only taken Iboga once. I would assume that sleep would not be as big a problem now that the Methadone is out of our system (most of).

This will be very interesting to see how the next dose will affect you as far as sleep is concerened. I too would like to have another session to see how the Iboga’
affects me with out the Methadone to work on.

Rock on Bro’
with love, Jasen.

—– Original Message —–
From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, May 05, 2005 9:16 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question

Hey fellow Ibofreaks, I’ve got a question. Or should I say I need some advice? Anyway, I’ve been thinking of taking a booster dose of Ibogaine and was wondering at what point in the dosage range dose Ibogaine give you the insomnia side effect? I would say that it depends on the individual, but that is just a guess, I have no data to go on. I would think that if you take enough to see the trails, and hear the hum, that you probably are going to have some insomnia afterwards, but does it have to last for 2 or 3 weeks? When I did my session in September I took a shit load for a couple of days because it was Methadone I came off of, so that is the only experience I have personally with doing it. It’s been a while now. I think I need it. I feel good, and I want to continue what I am doing, so I don’t want to fuck this up but something tells me that this is a good idea. What do yall think? I’m planning on doing a whole session sometime late summer to try and quit smoking cigs but I still think I need this.              Randy

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Question
Date: May 5, 2005 at 4:50:10 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve found low doses to be more profound than higher, personally. I’m more together with the lower doses and can take more in. I’ve taken a massive (50+mg/kg) dose in the Cameroun and been totally out of it for over 6 days but would consider a session I did last year with approx 0.5g of rootbark (0.5mg/kg) to have been more profound. Sometimes all you need is a little glimpse behind the mask when you’re still just about straight, it does more. For sure you may need to have done the big dose first to break the head open.

Nick
—–Original Message—–
From: mcorcoran [mailto:mcorcoran27@yahoo.com]
Sent: 05 May 2005 13:14
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question

Strangely enough I went deeper or I should say I had more of a visual experience on 9 than I did in Mexico on 18. Weird right? Maybe not so weird cuz I was basically clean but yeah no sleep disturbance other than that first night obviously. Its weird though and I’ve mentioned this to people but I found that after the 9mg/kg it was almost like I wanted to get high even more after.  I saw a bunch of shit that was very profound in a global or worldly sense but nothing much that had to do with me personally and when I came to that next day I knew I didn’t get that “reset” I got the first time and certainly not even close to what I got this time. I think my first words were ” I don’t think it worked this time”. So my opinion is keep at least 15 just to be sure and if you don’t need it you don’t need it. I know it takes you a lot to go deep (hard head;o) so make sure you have enough cuz there is nothing worse than not enough ibogaine even if it is preventative instead of for a detox.
And between me and you I think after a road trip like yours everyone should be forced to do a big booster. So good to see you doing so well. -M.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
I took 9 mg/kg in the middle after two “slips” and I had no insomnia. 24 on the other hand will keep ya up for a while. ;o) Hey Randy -m.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Hey fellow Ibofreaks, I’ve got a question. Or should I say I need some advice? Anyway, I’ve been thinking of taking a booster dose of Ibogaine and was wondering at what point in the dosage range dose Ibogaine give you the insomnia side effect? I would say that it depends on the individual, but that is just a guess, I have no data to go on. I would think that if you take enough to see the trails, and hear the hum, that you probably are going to have some insomnia afterwards, but does it have to last for 2 or 3 weeks? When I did my session in September I took a shit load for a couple of days because it was Methadone I came off of, so that is the only experience I have personally with doing it. It’s been a while now. I think I need it. I feel good, and I want to continue what I am doing, so I don’t want to fuck this up but something tells me that this is a good idea. What do yall think? I’m planning on doing a whole session sometime late summer to try and quit smoking cigs but I still think I need this.              Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] aftercare for poor people
Date: May 5, 2005 at 2:03:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

been thinking about Aftercare for poor people, maybe
it will help,maybe not…

–invest in a bag of Bird seed, and take at least 30
minutes listening each day, notice how when they flap
their wings it looks like iboga spirit

–Contact all available services, if unsure where to
start call a methadone clinic and ask a staff member
for how to best find social service information,(in
texas call 211 and ask for what services you qualify
for)

–Keep up good water habits,, drink at least 8oz an
hour, take shower/bath in morning AND evening, think
of underground tap system, and the efforts of those
who built and maintain this Source.

–Exercise in small increasing amounts everyday. if
too tired to exercise, at least stretch to increase
blood flow.

–*MEET AT LEAST 30 NEW PEOPLE IN THE MONTHS FOLLOWING
DOSING, this is very important and shouldn’t go
overlooked.
if not good at meeting new people, research new
methodes after asking what looking for in a friend and
what have to offer as a friend.  Church, 12 steps,
clubs, college, walk a dog are easy enough ways to
meet new people.
I’m not saying you have to let all old friends go,
but at least balance them out a bit

–sex sex and more sex, preferably with someone who
you love and who loves you back

–beware of defining self by past, find a way to
forgive self, find self worth, let go of shame etc…

–beware of arrogence and bitterness

–make something new

–follow your heart

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Why Bush’s Brain was not Fried by Drugs…
Date: May 5, 2005 at 1:56:58 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hey dana, have you dosed yet?

faker.

— Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com> wrote:
—– Original Message —–
From: “J Markes” <santor420@hotmail.com>
To: “John Markes” <santor420@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 10:54 AM
Subject: Strange and Disturbing…

I found this DEA agent post over at the DEAWatch
website….
“Our esteemed ONDCP director is hitting the public
circuit today with
news
and info that using dangerous drugs causes severe
mental handicaps
later in
life. However, when asked to explain why George W.
Bush, having
habitually
abused marijuana, cocaine and alcohol continues to
be the mental giant
he
is, Waters claims that Mr. Bush used a type of weed
and coke of an
earlier
year which posed no serious threat to one’s mental
stability.

Yeah… right!!!

But to counter the question that Mr. Bush, being a
mortal just like
everyone
else, could not possibly escape the brain damage and
deterioration
Waters
claims the rest of humankind is susceptible to by
dangerous drug use…
Walters claims that Mr. Bush used illegal drugs at a
much older age,
35,…
thereby escaping the damaging effects of repeated
marijuana and cocaine
use
his scientific data confirms people under 35 (will)
suffer from.

When asked if other adults who use illegal drugs can
also, like Mr.
Bush, be
worry-free of dangerous side-effects and diminished
mental capacity, Mr.
Waters replied, “No.”… because George Bush was
personally selected by
The One True God to be our world’s savior, only
George W. Bush, alone,
has
been rendered immune to all of the psychological and
neurological
dangers we
mere mortals succumb to from illegal drug use.

Our thanks go out to Dir. Waters for relieving our
minds of any worry
that
the war in Iraq, social problems, economic misery,
needless deaths and
hopelessness caused since Mr. Bush was (s)elected
are solely the fault
of
other drug users whose diminished mental capacities
have caused them to
disagree with God’s appointed, George Bush.”

You can find it here:
http://members.aol.com/deawatch/daily.htm

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Mail – Find what you need with new enhanced search.
http://info.mail.yahoo.com/mail_250

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question
Date: May 5, 2005 at 8:13:37 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Strangely enough I went deeper or I should say I had more of a visual experience on 9 than I did in Mexico on 18. Weird right? Maybe not so weird cuz I was basically clean but yeah no sleep disturbance other than that first night obviously. Its weird though and I’ve mentioned this to people but I found that after the 9mg/kg it was almost like I wanted to get high even more after.  I saw a bunch of shit that was very profound in a global or worldly sense but nothing much that had to do with me personally and when I came to that next day I knew I didn’t get that “reset” I got the first time and certainly not even close to what I got this time. I think my first words were ” I don’t think it worked this time”. So my opinion is keep at least 15 just to be sure and if you don’t need it you don’t need it. I know it takes you a lot to go deep (hard head;o) so make sure you have enough cuz there is nothing worse than not enough ibogaine even if it is preventative instead of for a detox.
And between me and you I think after a road trip like yours everyone should be forced to do a big booster. So good to see you doing so well. -M.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
I took 9 mg/kg in the middle after two “slips” and I had no insomnia. 24 on the other hand will keep ya up for a while. ;o) Hey Randy -m.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Hey fellow Ibofreaks, I’ve got a question. Or should I say I need some advice? Anyway, I’ve been thinking of taking a booster dose of Ibogaine and was wondering at what point in the dosage range dose Ibogaine give you the insomnia side effect? I would say that it depends on the individual, but that is just a guess, I have no data to go on. I would think that if you take enough to see the trails, and hear the hum, that you probably are going to have some insomnia afterwards, but does it have to last for 2 or 3 weeks? When I did my session in September I took a shit load for a couple of days because it was Methadone I came off of, so that is the only experience I have personally with doing it. It’s been a while now. I think I need it. I feel good, and I want to continue what I am doing, so I don’t want to fuck this up but something tells me that this is a good idea. What do yall think? I’m planning on doing a whole session sometime late summer to try and quit smoking cigs but I still think I need this.              Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question
Date: May 5, 2005 at 8:08:20 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I would say go for it. What have you got to lose and
all to gain imo. Don’t confuse the stigma of taking
other drugs with taking ibogaine. It’s not the same
thing as you know but I repeat it for the sake of
clarity.
I think everyones response to sleep loss is different.
I never had a great problem with it. In fact I could
get quite lazy at times.
I think it may be more of an issue coming off specific
chemical dependencies and the mental readjustment,
than it is if you are already clean. If you are
running on a cocktail of dependence then the after
effects of an ibogaine session is going to be more
profound on ones mental state and I would imagine by
implication sleep.
Just my tuppence worth on this.
Lee

— BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:

Hey fellow Ibofreaks, I’ve got a question. Or should
I say I need some
advice? Anyway, I’ve been thinking of taking a
booster dose of Ibogaine and was
wondering at what point in the dosage range dose
Ibogaine give you the insomnia
side effect? I would say that it depends on the
individual, but that is just a
guess, I have no data to go on. I would think that
if you take enough to see
the trails, and hear the hum, that you probably are
going to have some insomnia
afterwards, but does it have to last for 2 or 3
weeks? When I did my session
in September I took a shit load for a couple of days
because it was Methadone I
came off of, so that is the only experience I have
personally with doing it.
It’s been a while now. I think I need it. I feel
good, and I want to continue
what I am doing, so I don’t want to fuck this up but
something tells me that
this is a good idea. What do yall think? I’m
planning on doing a whole session
sometime late summer to try and quit smoking cigs
but I still think I need
this.              Randy

Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.

www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Dana Beal <dana@phantom.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Why Bush’s Brain was not Fried by Drugs…
Date: May 5, 2005 at 10:00:22 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “J Markes” <santor420@hotmail.com>
To: “John Markes” <santor420@hotmail.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 10:54 AM
Subject: Strange and Disturbing…

I found this DEA agent post over at the DEAWatch website….
“Our esteemed ONDCP director is hitting the public circuit today with news
and info that using dangerous drugs causes severe mental handicaps later in
life. However, when asked to explain why George W. Bush, having habitually
abused marijuana, cocaine and alcohol continues to be the mental giant he
is, Waters claims that Mr. Bush used a type of weed and coke of an earlier
year which posed no serious threat to one’s mental stability.

Yeah… right!!!

But to counter the question that Mr. Bush, being a mortal just like everyone
else, could not possibly escape the brain damage and deterioration Waters
claims the rest of humankind is susceptible to by dangerous drug use…
Walters claims that Mr. Bush used illegal drugs at a much older age, 35,…
thereby escaping the damaging effects of repeated marijuana and cocaine use
his scientific data confirms people under 35 (will) suffer from.

When asked if other adults who use illegal drugs can also, like Mr. Bush, be
worry-free of dangerous side-effects and diminished mental capacity, Mr.
Waters replied, “No.”… because George Bush was personally selected by
The One True God to be our world’s savior, only George W. Bush, alone, has
been rendered immune to all of the psychological and neurological dangers we
mere mortals succumb to from illegal drug use.

Our thanks go out to Dir. Waters for relieving our minds of any worry that
the war in Iraq, social problems, economic misery, needless deaths and
hopelessness caused since Mr. Bush was (s)elected are solely the fault of
other drug users whose diminished mental capacities have caused them to
disagree with God’s appointed, George Bush.”

You can find it here: http://members.aol.com/deawatch/daily.htm

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] new glick paper/reduce morphine dependence?
Date: May 5, 2005 at 9:22:26 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Eur J Pharmacol. 2005 Apr 25;513(3):207-18. Epub 2005 Apr 14.   Links

Is antagonism of alpha3beta4 nicotinic receptors a strategy to reduce
morphine dependence?

Taraschenko OD, Panchal V, Maisonneuve IM, Glick SD.

Center for Neuropharmacology and Neuroscience MC-136, Albany Medical College,
47 New Scotland Avenue, Albany, NY 12208, USA.

18-Methoxycoronaridine, a synthetic iboga alkaloid congener, has been
previously shown to attenuate several signs of morphine withdrawal in rats. The
recently discovered action of 18-methoxycoronaridine to block alpha3beta4 nicotinic
receptors may be responsible for this effect. To test this hypothesis the
effects of non-selective alpha3beta4 receptor antagonists, dextromethorphan,
mecamylamine, bupropion, and their combinations, were assessed on of acute
naltrexone-precipitated (1 mg/kg i.p.) morphine withdrawal in rats. Dextromethorphan
(5-40 mg/kg, s.c.), mecamylamine (0.25-4 mg/kg, i.p.) and bupropion (10-30
mg/kg, i.p.) alone produced variable effects on signs of withdrawal. However, two
low-dose combinations, i.e., dextromethorphan (5 mg/kg, s.c.) and
mecamylamine (0.25 mg/kg, i.p.), mecamylamine (0.25 mg/kg, i.p.) and bupropion (10 mg/kg,
i.p.) as well as the three-drug combination significantly attenuated diarrhea
and weight loss; none of the agents administered alone had these effects. The
results of the present study provide evidence that alpha3beta4 nicotinic
receptors are involved in the expression of at least two signs of opioid
withdrawal.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question
Date: May 5, 2005 at 7:58:59 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I took 9 mg/kg in the middle after two “slips” and I had no insomnia. 24 on the other hand will keep ya up for a while. ;o) Hey Randy -m.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Hey fellow Ibofreaks, I’ve got a question. Or should I say I need some advice? Anyway, I’ve been thinking of taking a booster dose of Ibogaine and was wondering at what point in the dosage range dose Ibogaine give you the insomnia side effect? I would say that it depends on the individual, but that is just a guess, I have no data to go on. I would think that if you take enough to see the trails, and hear the hum, that you probably are going to have some insomnia afterwards, but does it have to last for 2 or 3 weeks? When I did my session in September I took a shit load for a couple of days because it was Methadone I came off of, so that is the only experience I have personally with doing it. It’s been a while now. I think I need it. I feel good, and I want to continue what I am doing, so I don’t want to fuck this up but something tells me that this is a good idea. What do yall think? I’m planning on doing a whole session sometime late summer to try and quit smoking cigs but I still think I need this.              Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????
Date: May 5, 2005 at 7:37:23 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

marcus! so glad to hear all is well.  we known eachother now for at least 10 years from down on those streets? We’ve both wasted enough years. sending good thoughts your way. -m.

marcus israel <vesch69@yahoo.com> wrote:
In the best of worlds (?!) Root causes , go back
speculate a little further man who knowz what if where
from howwhy to what degree
have fun
M-
— Preston Peet wrote:
> Right on Howard, in an ideal world. Why is it so
> freakin’ obvious to people
> like you, and Kurt, and Patrick, Rachel and Jeff,
> etc, etc (sorry if I
> didn’t name everyone here- there’s too many of you
> to do so, but you are all
> included) to see this but not so obvious for the
> prohibitionist type?
> This is almost a rhetorical question, as I know
> there’s no real all
> encompassing answer that makes much sense
> But your comment made me salivate and drop into
> a waking dream,
> picturing such an ideal world as this. Sigh, then
> puff, puff.
> ;-))
> Gotta medicate in some fashion darn it.
>
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for
> enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation
> Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to
> Ancient Civilizations,
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out
> Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From:
> To:
> Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 1:00 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????
>
>
> >
> > In a message dated 5/1/05 12:55:23 AM,
> shaman13@optonline.net writes:
> >
> >>I used, I walked away from 30 mg. of methadone 36
> days ago and I used
> >>today.
> >>7 tc’s, 4 rehabs,twice with the tube down My
> throat under anesthetic,
> > naltraxone,bupernorphine
> >>countless cold turkeys I thought I took the pain
> and I had gotten away
> >>clean and now with everything in the balance I
> fucking use. I don’t even
> >>have to post here, everyone who saw Me or talked
> to Me today knew and the
> >>dope fiend in My tried to lie about it.
> >>
> >>Thank’s Marc Dimitr and Eric and everyone on the
> list . If I use
> >>tomorrow
> >>it’s off to the races. But tomorrow is another day
> so I’m praying for a
> >>miracle.
> >>
> >>Peas and Love Kurt
> >
> > In the best of worlds you would just pop into a
> hospital or a doctors
> > office
> > and get an intermediat dose of ibogaine/iboga to
> give you another running
> > chance.
> >
> > Howard
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> > [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> > [%]
> >
> >
>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>
>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Question
Date: May 5, 2005 at 7:16:06 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey fellow Ibofreaks, I’ve got a question. Or should I say I need some advice? Anyway, I’ve been thinking of taking a booster dose of Ibogaine and was wondering at what point in the dosage range dose Ibogaine give you the insomnia side effect? I would say that it depends on the individual, but that is just a guess, I have no data to go on. I would think that if you take enough to see the trails, and hear the hum, that you probably are going to have some insomnia afterwards, but does it have to last for 2 or 3 weeks? When I did my session in September I took a shit load for a couple of days because it was Methadone I came off of, so that is the only experience I have personally with doing it. It’s been a while now. I think I need it. I feel good, and I want to continue what I am doing, so I don’t want to fuck this up but something tells me that this is a good idea. What do yall think? I’m planning on doing a whole session sometime late summer to try and quit smoking cigs but I still think I need this.              Randy

From: “Pam Paperno” <pam@lviue.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] using
Date: May 4, 2005 at 8:14:01 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Please, please, please, do not think of yourself as a junky.  You are not junk, and you are not comprised of it.  Perhaps you needed to find out first hand that you have a choice.  You can choose to stay clean, or you can choose to become readdicted.
Addiction is founded on self-hatred and self-loathing.  Love is the only reality, and with the tiniest bit of self-love, you can resist.
I love you for the time you took for my Patrick, and for the beauty of the spirit you showed.
Pam
—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 7:03 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] using

Hi
this weekend i also used…..was cooking up speedballs through the whole weekend…….i wish that warm feeling would just go away….after my first ibo exp i was persuading my self tothink that heroin and everything is pure nonsense….i wanted desperetly to believe that the rush is nothing and partly suceseded because i used once after that and didnt like it…..but now after this weekend well i have a different opinion once again…thank god its all opinions but i dont know………im sick and weak from this condition………..i realize that now its only will power and nothing else because im not physicaly depended yet–thank god—but give it a week of daily debucheries and the demon starts to plead……come to think of it since i woke up the only thing on my mind is shooting up—–im ashamed to admit it but it is——-its really fucken difuclt when all u know to do really well is how to use, how to be a junky, i better get my ass up and go to work.
Namaste

Matt

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Pam Paperno” <pam@lviue.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ot
Date: May 4, 2005 at 8:08:54 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hold on to this–Love is the only reality, all else is illusion.  Fear,
hatred, anger–including directed toward self ARE NOT REAL.  We are real,
and, frundamentally, we are motivated by love.
I don’t even know you, but I love you as fellow traveller.
Pam
—– Original Message —–
From: “Morning Wood” <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 10:56 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] ot

nonsense rush is sick and weak from this condition
because the demon starts to plead junky but i dont
know………im ………..i realize that now its only
not physicaly depended yet– — give a realize of
daily starts to come to think of it since i woke up
mind is   really all well when to know is how to do
really well , how to be  better

———————————
Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with
MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months
FREE*

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Pam Paperno” <pam@lviue.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….
Date: May 4, 2005 at 8:05:34 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Much love to you, and congratulations.  Seven months is an eternity to most
of us, no?  Remember, there will be times in your life when you will want to
use so badly you can taste it, I know I have them.  Understand this, a
craving is only an invitation, not an obligation.
Pam
—– Original Message —–
From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 12:57 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….

hi everyone,

just wanted to say hi to all my old buddies, and hi to
the new folks.  Been away for a little while.  7
months and counting!!  I feel great, and my health &
disposition are through the ceiling.

Ibogaine DOES work…it got me off methadone…and it
can work for you too…

good luck,

Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: marcus israel <vesch69@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????
Date: May 4, 2005 at 11:14:36 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In the best of worlds (?!) Root causes , go back
speculate a little further man who knowz what if where
from howwhy to what degree
have fun
M-
— Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
Right on Howard, in an ideal world. Why is it so
freakin’ obvious to people
like you, and Kurt, and Patrick, Rachel and Jeff,
etc, etc (sorry if I
didn’t name everyone here- there’s too many of you
to do so, but you are all
included) to see this but not so obvious for the
prohibitionist type?
This is almost a rhetorical question, as I know
there’s no real all
encompassing answer that makes much sense
But your comment made me salivate and drop into
a waking dream,
picturing such an ideal world as this. Sigh, then
puff, puff.
;-))
Gotta medicate in some fashion darn it.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for
enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation
Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to
Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out
Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 1:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????

In a message dated 5/1/05 12:55:23 AM,
shaman13@optonline.net writes:

I used, I walked away from 30 mg. of methadone 36
days ago and I used
today.
7 tc’s, 4 rehabs,twice with the tube down My
throat under anesthetic,
naltraxone,bupernorphine
countless cold turkeys I thought I took the pain
and I had gotten away
clean and now with everything in the balance I
fucking use. I don’t even
have to post here, everyone who saw Me or talked
to Me today knew and the
dope fiend in My tried to lie about it.

Thank’s Marc Dimitr  and  Eric and everyone on the
list . If I use
tomorrow
it’s off to the races. But tomorrow is another day
so I’m praying for a
miracle.

Peas and Love Kurt

In the best of worlds you would just pop into a
hospital or a doctors
office
and get an intermediat dose of ibogaine/iboga to
give you another running
chance.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 4, 2005 at 8:17:09 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Kurt,
Thanks for posting that. You couldn’t point me to an mp3 of the song?
Lee

KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net> wrote:
Hey Now Lee,
1 session 5 years ago. and Yes this time through friends it will be easy.
I wanted to share the lyrics of a song by Warren Haynes ” Scared and lonley, tough as nails. We open our hearts when all else fails, Wear the veil and the trojan horse smile. Looking back on yesteryear,seems like Maybe You missed Your calling, and hindgsight is very clear when lonleieness is falling and You have fallen down, down from the heavens,  You have fallen down from heaven. Stuck out in the desert.Amazing grace such a lonley place for Heros like You and Me, fallen down just like a shooting star, like a fallen angel standing there to carry You away.
Target pratice with other peoples lives, Hit a few right between the eyes, But most of the time We’re wounded by the richochet. Play to win boys never play to lose,  as long as Your playin boy Your bullet proof Yeah think about it Your playin to death anyway.
Looking back on yesteryear It seems like maybe You missed Your calling.And You have fallen down Down from the heavens Amazing grace such a lonley place for Heros like You and Me. Fallen down just like a shooting star or a fallen angel standing  by to carry You away, Oh angel take of Mercy take pity on a fool
Rich without pleasure Respected without love Drinking poison from a golden cup
You have fallen down  Down from the heavens Fallen down Amazing grace such a lonley place for Heros Like You and Me, fallen down……………………
peas and love Kurt
—– Original Message —–
From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Hi Kurt,
I am curious how many sessions have you had?
Also, with the help of a friend it should be reasonably easy for you to have another session as you have already been there. Ibogaine becomes much, much safer with repeated us imo. Why not spend a couple of hundred bucks on another private (own organised)  session that will leave you on a high (possibly giving you insight into what the major issue is with you right now) rather than putting your money into trash that poisons the body?
Matt has a contact for ibogaine I believe in Toronto (which he mentioned before on this list or another).
I know if I were in your shoes I would be right out the door looking to cop some ibo and not more shit.
Lee

“m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net> wrote:
Kurt,
I understand the isolation thing as part of ones addiction, however it seems you didn’t do that.  Instead you went around to your support system cause you knew they would see the obvious.
My take on your not taking the free one and going out to cop is not the choice of danger over ease, but a noncomittal act over taking the free one “first”. That in a way is a commitment to set up a buy/sell scenario that would have a future. You didn’t do that.
Then you posted here.   So I believe that’s 3 for 3….all good.
A pebble in the road.  It’s behind you.  Your path ahead.
Considering the circumstance by which you stopped 36 days ago I think you have amazing strength and resolve.
A new beginning can start in a second, an hour or a day.  It’s all good.
You are a hero.
Eboga, Eboga,Eboga, Love,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: KURT BRECHTER
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 2:04 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Not only that,
On day 30 like clock work the dealer I haven’t herad from in 3 years (who’s kids I put through parochiol school) calls. “the first ones free”
I resist for 6 days. Needless to say alot of heavy shit came down on Me and once again ‘I DESERVED it”    WHAT KINDA shit is that?I deserve a bag of death???? Well the sick mother fucker I am I say “Yeah You Do”???????????
So, I don’t even take the free shit, I put Myself at all kinda risk to go “COP”.
Like I said I’m sick.
I get High, I take a look on the mirror a couple of hours later and there HE is. That same scheming mother fucker I hate.
Now with the (O.D.) overdone it and regretful headache I sit here trying to understand just a small fraction.
I even told another dope fiend,”yeah I fucked up but I only had a half an opium supository?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck??????????????????
I can’t do this to Myself again, But My track record sucks.
I think I’m finished for tonight, But You never know
peas and love  Kurt

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clinic handcuffs, who’s got the key(s)?
Date: May 4, 2005 at 7:48:37 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

SLAVERY!!!

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
Rachel you have brought back some memories. I used to get up at 4 in the morning to get to Lexington by 5 so that I could get on the early list and get in and out in less then an hour at the clinic. Daily for a while. Get on the list then wait for an hour and a half then go to the clinic and get my juice praying that I didn’t get a piss test, then drive like hell to be on time for work. I spent 3 hours a day getting Methadone. Or more sometimes. Talk about a slave to the grind. Freedom rules.                 Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] clinic handcuffs, who’s got the key(s)?
Date: May 4, 2005 at 7:45:10 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Rachel you have brought back some memories. I used to get up at 4 in the morning to get to Lexington by 5 so that I could get on the early list and get in and out in less then an hour at the clinic. Daily for a while. Get on the list then wait for an hour and a half then go to the clinic and get my juice praying that I didn’t get a piss test, then drive like hell to be on time for work. I spent 3 hours a day getting Methadone. Or more sometimes. Talk about a slave to the grind. Freedom rules.                 Randy

From: Eye of the Bhogi <freedomroot@gmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] clinic handcuffs, who’s got the key(s)?
Date: May 4, 2005 at 7:28:57 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

We took a different way to work this morning, and went by a methadone
clinic at 6:30 a.m. with two dozen folks, mostly men, lined up outside
waiting for their juice.  Jeff, who sometimes wishes he didn’t feel
all these weird aches and pains in his body, and sometimes forgets the
various inconveniences and stresses of getting to his clinic (in a
different part of town) for a weekly pickup, and sometimes says “It
wasn’t so bad….” reached over and grabbed me with both hands (I was
driving), and let out this wail of recognition and thanksgiving and
relief to not be chained up with his old gang.  It’s been six months
since his last swig.  Let freedom ring.  love, rachel

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc
Date: May 4, 2005 at 4:29:05 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Thanks kindly. I have the dvd, but could not for the life of me remember the guy’s name. Rex-Kwan Do, brilliant.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “orangesun Barrel” <kaliorangemist710@hotmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 10:09 PM
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc

The karatee character in Napolean is REX-KWAN-DOE

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc
Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2005 13:43:45 -0400

>However, what I sense would be helpful for you personally would be if >you
would find a reputable dojo.<

Pretty far off topic here, but have you Martee, or anyone else for that matter here, seen Napolean Dynamite yet? Shoot, the character’s name just flew right outta my head as I was about to write it, but there’s a great, and hilarious scene in it when Napolean and his brother Kip go to check out a dojo.
;-))
Great flick if you haven’t yet seen it- I think it can still be rented on pay-per-view, but if not, I highly recommend renting it. It’s a very silly and innocent-kinda film, no cursing at all (other than one lines when someone tell someone else to go “eat a decroded [sic] piece of crap.”
Great movie and again I highly recommend it for an afternoon/evening of sheer fun and pleasure to distract you from your daily grind. Well worth the rental fee that’s for sure.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 9:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc

Hey Hey,
Your apearance once again is heart warming.  I’ve personally been lurking, going through a no need to comment stage.  However, what I sense would be helpful for you personally would be if you would find a reputable dojo.  It could possibly serve you in areas of being more grounded, disciplined and calm.  Also an outlet for that puppy energy you have that needs to be collected and directed.
You’ll notice I didn’t suggest yoga….
love you just the way you are,
Martee

Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.

brownies were a life saver in mexico but my gas isn’t being turned on unitl tomorrow. unitl then i’ll just have to smoke but i actually got 7 hours last night so i think i might be on the other end of it.  Actually I feel pretty damn great. Thanks. -M.

Jasen Chamoun <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
Hey M,

As well as the other things you mentioned, I found that eating pot helped me to sleep and relax more. More so than smoking, although I did both. As I am sure you
are aware you have to eat more than you would smoke.

You are sleeping soon.

love, Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 2:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sorry to keep bitchin abouth is but….

I’m still not sleeping! Actually last night was one of my worst 1 and a half hours 17 days out.
Last time it got gradiually better but this time it seems to be getting worse again and this time around was abusing a much shorter acting opiate.
This is beginning to drive me a little nuts. I have no desire to use but I don’t think I’d turn down a Xanax. Nah I’m not gonna take any Xanax but I’m open to sugestions. And yeah I’ve done the Melitonin and the valerian and smoking an hour before I go to sleep. But nothings working. Except maybe the ibogaine. -m.

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
yeah, a very close friend of mine said that often, since i have no personal
experiences. he said to have many spikes,, rigs on stand by as one gropes
and clogs and coagulates searching for the impossible, dumb guy never
learned either, kept trying the impossible, getting off took on a whole new
meaning, no quickie in the enco station or your friend’s bathroom. then
there was the panic as the realization of failure set in. oxys d/n do well
im i’m told..a lot of plastic molecules
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

> >in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
> bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load.<
> OOOWWUCH!
>
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston Peet
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Ron Davis”
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 9:39 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>
>
>> in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
>> bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load. i promise you ,
>> there will not be a visible vein on your body. not that i ever tried it,
>> story is purely anecdotal, ron
>> —– Original Message —–
>> From: “Preston Peet”
>> To:
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:33 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>
>>
>>> Veins? Veins? LOL, I Have capilaries and a few viens (I admit, they do
>>> come back, sorta, after a break of some years) but they rapidly go,
>>> “Hey, Preston, Fuck You. We’re going back into hiding,” leaving me
>>> whimpering in the bathroom as I try desperately to get well.
>>> Or at least, that’s where I was once again not too long ago.
>>> ;-))
>>> But then, two days ago climbing outta the bathtub, what should pop up on
>>> my foreleg but a HUGE vein I haven’t seen in years, looking whole and
>>> hungry too- it’s the DEVIL I tell you- “Hey Look Preston, a huge willing
>>> vein, and that drugstore where you can legally buy .75 cent rigs is just
>>> around the corner, RUN!
>>> But I resisted. Weird shit ibogaine, how it somehow allows me to step
>>> back, for the most part, and think things through first, again, for the
>>> most part.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Peace and love,
>>> Preston Peet
>>>
>>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
>>> mistaken for madness”
>>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>>
>>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
>>> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>> Columnist New York Waste
>>> Etc.
>>>
>>> —– Original Message —–
>>> From: “Ron Davis”
>>> To:
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:43 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>
>>>
>>>> you have veins after all these yrs? lucky, i haven’t seen one in
>>>> decades. dilaudids cooked up nicely in the 70’s before the generics
>>>> came out. i recently had knee surgery and the doc was compassionate w/
>>>> scripts. i ate 25 4mg. to get off, glad insurance paid, knee hurt like
>>>> hell for a month till he filled again. it all sucks, maybe my day will
>>>> come soon, well wishes , ron—– Original Message —–
>>>> From: “Preston Peet”
>>>> To:
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:01 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Never considered banging it, and don’t think I would- and I used to
>>>>> band ANYTHING I could melt into a needle too once upon a time- but
>>>>> that’s been years (for instance, I get ms-contins along with my
>>>>> dilaudids, but never shot them- but did add water to one once, on the
>>>>> off chance it would work somehow- LOL, I do NOT inject jelly into my
>>>>> veins, no matter how desperate for a “fix” (i.e. needle in my vein,
>>>>> which is such a HUGE part of my addictive problems, that whole
>>>>> ritualistic needle thing, which is one reason why I’m trying new
>>>>> streches to my new Tai Chi video, and still plan on trying yoga, as
>>>>> soon as I can get up early enough on either this Wed or Fri to attend
>>>>> a class a few blocks from my home.
>>>>> Carry on all.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Peace and love,
>>>>> Preston Peet
>>>>>
>>>>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
>>>>> often mistaken for madness”
>>>>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>>>>
>>>>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>>>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>>>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>>>> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
>>>>> Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out
>>>>> Sept. 2005)
>>>>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>>>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>>>> Columnist New York Waste
>>>>> Etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> —– Original Message —–
>>>>> From: “Carlton B”
>>>>> To:
>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 6:43 PM
>>>>> Subject: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Just listening to this talk about gagging gullets and emptying bowels
>>>>>> makes
>>>>>> me ask a question: has anyone ever explored taking it as an
>>>>>> injection? No
>>>>>> loss of product, etc. I wouldn’t want to be the first one to try
>>>>>> it. On
>>>>>> second thought, maybe it’s not such a good idea to bypass the body’s
>>>>>> main
>>>>>> safeguard to OD….
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>>
>>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>
>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>
>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>> [%]
>>
>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> [%]
>
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD
Date: May 4, 2005 at 12:26:24 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

well whadda ya know just what the witch doctor ordered. good seeing you preston.

Preston Peet <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com> wrote:
I’ve heard very very small doses of mushrooms actually do help SOME people
with AADD. I know someone personally who regularly doses with extremely
small doses of mushrooms and finds that they are more grounded and able to
concentrate better. I was surprised to hear it at first, but in small doses
I suppose it makes sense.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 7:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD

Due to my obviously severe case of ADD I was unable to stay focused enough
to bother with things like spelling or punctuation. ;O)

mcorcoran wrote:
Today was way better. Forced myself a bit but felt really good after I put
in a full day.
I’m not going to speculate on what I might or might not take because quite
frankly having to take a drug other than Prilosec everyday is not something
I want to have to do.
it would however be nice to speak with a Dr. that understands Ibogaine so
they’d have a bit more understanding of where I’m at and take it from there.
I have an idea on who to speak with but cash is an issue for the next couple
of weeks and I know from experince that these weeks are crutial.
Alot of it is on me too though. being somewhat responsable and doing what I
need to do is all part of it and when I start going into this “I can’t do
this” shit, I might not be headed in the right direction. I’m not saying I’m
ready to go above and beyond yet but taking care of business concentrating
when I know I need to is gonna make it that much easier in the long run on
all levels. Could I use some help in that dept., yeah absolutely. which is
why I’d like to talk to someone who could prescribe something if they
understood and thought thats whats best but I’m not looking to be on
medication I’m just open to sugestion.
As for low doses of indra, I’m a big fan of ibogaine and will consider a
phyco spritual in the future but taking it everyday might make me a little
crazy. Thats just me personally. -M.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
2004? Really? That means there is 80 mg’s of Methadone waiting for me in a
cup behind the computer, let me go get it…………….. Wait a minute,
somebody is taking my drugs, I gotta go. Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: “Vigilius Haufniensis” <thehatefulnerd@sbcglobal.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 4, 2005 at 1:22:28 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: “Day Brown” <daybrown@hypertech.net>
To: <vox@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 04, 2005 12:25 PM
Subject: Re: [Vox] Amanita Muscaria

I’ve used A. Muscaria for shamantic purposes. I know of no such
purpose for ibo, so I’ve not tried it.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “orangesun Barrel” <kaliorangemist710@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc
Date: May 3, 2005 at 10:09:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The karatee character in Napolean is REX-KWAN-DOE

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc
Date: Sat, 30 Apr 2005 13:43:45 -0400

>However, what I sense would be helpful for you personally would be if you would find a reputable dojo.<

Pretty far off topic here, but have you Martee, or anyone else for that matter here, seen Napolean Dynamite yet? Shoot, the character’s name just flew right outta my head as I was about to write it, but there’s a great, and hilarious scene in it when Napolean and his brother Kip go to check out a dojo.
;-))
Great flick if you haven’t yet seen it- I think it can still be rented on pay-per-view, but if not, I highly recommend renting it. It’s a very silly and innocent-kinda film, no cursing at all (other than one lines when someone tell someone else to go “eat a decroded [sic] piece of crap.”
Great movie and again I highly recommend it for an afternoon/evening of sheer fun and pleasure to distract you from your daily grind. Well worth the rental fee that’s for sure.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 9:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc

Hey Hey,
Your apearance once again is heart warming.  I’ve personally been lurking, going through a no need to comment stage.  However, what I sense would be helpful for you personally would be if you would find a reputable dojo.  It could possibly serve you in areas of being more grounded, disciplined and calm.  Also an outlet for that puppy energy you have that needs to be collected and directed.
You’ll notice I didn’t suggest yoga….
love you just the way you are,
Martee

Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.

brownies were a life saver in mexico but my gas isn’t being turned on unitl tomorrow. unitl then i’ll just have to smoke but i actually got 7 hours last night so i think i might be on the other end of it.  Actually I feel pretty damn great. Thanks. -M.

Jasen Chamoun <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
Hey M,

As well as the other things you mentioned, I found that eating pot helped me to sleep and relax more. More so than smoking, although I did both. As I am sure you
are aware you have to eat more than you would smoke.

You are sleeping soon.

love, Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 2:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sorry to keep bitchin abouth is but….

I’m still not sleeping! Actually last night was one of my worst 1 and a half hours 17 days out.
Last time it got gradiually better but this time it seems to be getting worse again and this time around was abusing a much shorter acting opiate.
This is beginning to drive me a little nuts. I have no desire to use but I don’t think I’d turn down a Xanax. Nah I’m not gonna take any Xanax but I’m open to sugestions. And yeah I’ve done the Melitonin and the valerian and smoking an hour before I go to sleep. But nothings working. Except maybe the ibogaine. -m.

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
yeah, a very close friend of mine said that often, since i have no personal
experiences. he said to have many spikes,, rigs on stand by as one gropes
and clogs and coagulates searching for the impossible, dumb guy never
learned either, kept trying the impossible, getting off took on a whole new
meaning, no quickie in the enco station or your friend’s bathroom. then
there was the panic as the realization of failure set in. oxys d/n do well
im i’m told..a lot of plastic molecules
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

> >in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
> bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load.<
> OOOWWUCH!
>
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston Peet
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Ron Davis”
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 9:39 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>
>
>> in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
>> bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load. i promise you ,
>> there will not be a visible vein on your body. not that i ever tried it,
>> story is purely anecdotal, ron
>> —– Original Message —–
>> From: “Preston Peet”
>> To:
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:33 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>
>>
>>> Veins? Veins? LOL, I Have capilaries and a few viens (I admit, they do
>>> come back, sorta, after a break of some years) but they rapidly go,
>>> “Hey, Preston, Fuck You. We’re going back into hiding,” leaving me
>>> whimpering in the bathroom as I try desperately to get well.
>>> Or at least, that’s where I was once again not too long ago.
>>> ;-))
>>> But then, two days ago climbing outta the bathtub, what should pop up on
>>> my foreleg but a HUGE vein I haven’t seen in years, looking whole and
>>> hungry too- it’s the DEVIL I tell you- “Hey Look Preston, a huge willing
>>> vein, and that drugstore where you can legally buy .75 cent rigs is just
>>> around the corner, RUN!
>>> But I resisted. Weird shit ibogaine, how it somehow allows me to step
>>> back, for the most part, and think things through first, again, for the
>>> most part.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Peace and love,
>>> Preston Peet
>>>
>>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
>>> mistaken for madness”
>>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>>
>>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
>>> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>> Columnist New York Waste
>>> Etc.
>>>
>>> —– Original Message —–
>>> From: “Ron Davis”
>>> To:
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:43 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>
>>>
>>>> you have veins after all these yrs? lucky, i haven’t seen one in
>>>> decades. dilaudids cooked up nicely in the 70’s before the generics
>>>> came out. i recently had knee surgery and the doc was compassionate w/
>>>> scripts. i ate 25 4mg. to get off, glad insurance paid, knee hurt like
>>>> hell for a month till he filled again. it all sucks, maybe my day will
>>>> come soon, well wishes , ron—– Original Message —–
>>>> From: “Preston Peet”
>>>> To:
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:01 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Never considered banging it, and don’t think I would- and I used to
>>>>> band ANYTHING I could melt into a needle too once upon a time- but
>>>>> that’s been years (for instance, I get ms-contins along with my
>>>>> dilaudids, but never shot them- but did add water to one once, on the
>>>>> off chance it would work somehow- LOL, I do NOT inject jelly into my
>>>>> veins, no matter how desperate for a “fix” (i.e. needle in my vein,
>>>>> which is such a HUGE part of my addictive problems, that whole
>>>>> ritualistic needle thing, which is one reason why I’m trying new
>>>>> streches to my new Tai Chi video, and still plan on trying yoga, as
>>>>> soon as I can get up early enough on either this Wed or Fri to attend
>>>>> a class a few blocks from my home.
>>>>> Carry on all.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Peace and love,
>>>>> Preston Peet
>>>>>
>>>>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
>>>>> often mistaken for madness”
>>>>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>>>>
>>>>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>>>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>>>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>>>> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
>>>>> Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out
>>>>> Sept. 2005)
>>>>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>>>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>>>> Columnist New York Waste
>>>>> Etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> —– Original Message —–
>>>>> From: “Carlton B”
>>>>> To:
>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 6:43 PM
>>>>> Subject: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Just listening to this talk about gagging gullets and emptying bowels
>>>>>> makes
>>>>>> me ask a question: has anyone ever explored taking it as an
>>>>>> injection? No
>>>>>> loss of product, etc. I wouldn’t want to be the first one to try
>>>>>> it. On
>>>>>> second thought, maybe it’s not such a good idea to bypass the body’s
>>>>>> main
>>>>>> safeguard to OD….
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>>
>>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>
>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>
>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>> [%]
>>
>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> [%]
>
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD
Date: May 3, 2005 at 7:36:13 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve heard very very small doses of mushrooms actually do help SOME people with AADD. I know someone personally who regularly doses with extremely small doses of mushrooms and finds that they are more grounded and able to concentrate better. I was surprised to hear it at first, but in small doses I suppose it makes sense.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 7:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD

Due to my obviously severe case of ADD I was unable to stay focused enough to bother with things like spelling or punctuation. ;O)

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
Today was way better. Forced myself a bit but felt really good after I put in a full day.
I’m not going to  speculate on what I might or might not take because quite frankly having to take a drug other than Prilosec everyday is not something I want to have to do.
it would however be nice to speak with a Dr. that understands Ibogaine so they’d have a bit more understanding of where I’m at and take it from there.
I have an idea on who to speak with but cash is an issue for the next couple of weeks and I know from experince that these weeks are crutial.
Alot of it is on me too though.  being somewhat responsable and doing what I need to do is all part of it and when I start going into this “I can’t do this” shit, I might not be headed in the right direction. I’m not saying I’m ready to go above and beyond yet but taking care of business concentrating when I know I need to is gonna make it that much easier in the long run on all levels. Could I use some help in that dept., yeah absolutely. which is why I’d like to talk to someone who could prescribe something if they understood and thought thats whats best but I’m not looking to be on medication I’m just open to sugestion.
As for low doses of indra, I’m a big fan of ibogaine and will consider a phyco spritual in the future but taking it everyday might make me a little crazy. Thats just me personally. -M.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
2004?  Really?  That means there is 80 mg’s of Methadone waiting for me in a cup behind the computer, let me go get it…………….. Wait a minute, somebody is taking my drugs, I gotta go.         Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD
Date: May 3, 2005 at 7:14:02 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Due to my obviously severe case of ADD I was unable to stay focused enough to bother with things like spelling or punctuation. ;O)

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
Today was way better. Forced myself a bit but felt really good after I put in a full day.
I’m not going to  speculate on what I might or might not take because quite frankly having to take a drug other than Prilosec everyday is not something I want to have to do.
it would however be nice to speak with a Dr. that understands Ibogaine so they’d have a bit more understanding of where I’m at and take it from there.
I have an idea on who to speak with but cash is an issue for the next couple of weeks and I know from experince that these weeks are crutial.
Alot of it is on me too though.  being somewhat responsable and doing what I need to do is all part of it and when I start going into this “I can’t do this” shit, I might not be headed in the right direction. I’m not saying I’m ready to go above and beyond yet but taking care of business concentrating when I know I need to is gonna make it that much easier in the long run on all levels. Could I use some help in that dept., yeah absolutely. which is why I’d like to talk to someone who could prescribe something if they understood and thought thats whats best but I’m not looking to be on medication I’m just open to sugestion.
As for low doses of indra, I’m a big fan of ibogaine and will consider a phyco spritual in the future but taking it everyday might make me a little crazy. Thats just me personally. -M.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
2004?  Really?  That means there is 80 mg’s of Methadone waiting for me in a cup behind the computer, let me go get it…………….. Wait a minute, somebody is taking my drugs, I gotta go.         Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD
Date: May 3, 2005 at 6:44:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Today was way better. Forced myself a bit but felt really good after I put in a full day.
I’m not going to  speculate on what I might or might not take because quite frankly having to take a drug other than Prilosec everyday is not something I want to have to do.
it would however be nice to speak with a Dr. that understands Ibogaine so they’d have a bit more understanding of where I’m at and take it from there.
I have an idea on who to speak with but cash is an issue for the next couple of weeks and I know from experince that these weeks are crutial.
Alot of it is on me too though.  being somewhat responsable and doing what I need to do is all part of it and when I start going into this “I can’t do this” shit, I might not be headed in the right direction. I’m not saying I’m ready to go above and beyond yet but taking care of business concentrating when I know I need to is gonna make it that much easier in the long run on all levels. Could I use some help in that dept., yeah absolutely. which is why I’d like to talk to someone who could prescribe something if they understood and thought thats whats best but I’m not looking to be on medication I’m just open to sugestion.
As for low doses of indra, I’m a big fan of ibogaine and will consider a phyco spritual in the future but taking it everyday might make me a little crazy. Thats just me personally. -M.

BiscuitBoy714@aol.com wrote:
2004?  Really?  That means there is 80 mg’s of Methadone waiting for me in a cup behind the computer, let me go get it…………….. Wait a minute, somebody is taking my drugs, I gotta go.         Randy
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What year is it?
Date: May 3, 2005 at 5:46:13 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I was kidding Randy, it’s really 2005.
Sorry to set you up like that, there’s no methadone and no one taking your drugs.
;-))
Hope to see you soon.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 3:46 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What year is it?

2004?  Really?  That means there is 80 mg’s of Methadone waiting for me in a cup behind the computer, let me go get it…………….. Wait a minute, somebody is taking my drugs, I gotta go.         Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] illusion/reality
Date: May 3, 2005 at 4:46:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

HI all
Another intersting tid bit….well i hope uall find it intersting
What really comprises illusion? Does illusion have
> any
>   identifying characteristics? Can it be
> definned?..Does
>   it cause any effects?…Well certainly you say…
> It
>   appears like this and that and it manifests itself
>   like this and that…and it can cause this and
> that…
> 
>   What’s my point?! anything that has identifying
>   characteristics, can be clearly defined and causes
>   effects has reality and is real.
> 
>   In the truest sence reality and illusion are the
> same
>   thing metaphysically speaking. And not only that
> but
>   people react equally to both and do so out of the
>   purest intent. Now all aspects of consciousnes do
> not
>   share the same perspective and thus
> Ilussion/Reality
>   value judgements vary. Her favorite color is red
> and
>   his is blue so what else is new? This is the
> nature of
>   “Reality” as seen and experienced on the dual
> plane.
> 
>   Ekhart Tolle spoke in his book “The Power of Now”
> of
>   the difficulty of putting into words the
> trascendental
>   types of experience and knowledge. And he
> reccomended
>   that we not get hung up on the words but endeavor
> to
>   follow them as sign posts to what they imply or
>   inspire. He is very correct in this. Reality and
>   illusion are two very separate things. That can
> easily
>   be deduced by their different spellings and
> general
>   definitions. But to the one that has truly
> transcended
>   and crossed over these two words have an entirely
>   different understanding. To this one the entire
>   concrete world is an ilussion. He is like Winston
>   descibed as being his “Real Self” with no desire
>   unattainable,no limitation. In my oppinion these
>   beings don’t stay here very long because they seek
>   futher growth in other dimentions or worlds. At
> great
>   sacrifice these Masters endeavor through word and
>   example to expand the awareness of uniniciated
> humans
>   to these potencialities in consciousness. Mostly
> they
>   try to instill in them a desire to experience the
>   beauty of these realms. However they have to be at
> the
>   right point in their evolution to embrace them.
> These
>   humans may live mostly out of ther “lower” vehicle
> but
>   they are by no means less valued or worse than
> they
>   that work out of the “Real Self”. Ascendancy does
> not
>   dictate superiority. This world is very real to
> them
>   as is their struggle to evolve beyond it. We as
> the
>   trascendant,if that be the case, need display our
>   “reality” as fellow workers with them in elvating
> the
>   consciousness of the planet as equals not as
>   iilusitory
>   figures exonerating Self adgrandizement.
> 
> 
>                  The Vendantist
Namaste
Matthew

Don’t just Search. Find! The new MSN Search: Fast. Clear. Easy. /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What year is it?
Date: May 3, 2005 at 3:46:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

2004?  Really?  That means there is 80 mg’s of Methadone waiting for me in a cup behind the computer, let me go get it…………….. Wait a minute, somebody is taking my drugs, I gotta go.         Randy

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What year is it?
Date: May 3, 2005 at 2:49:01 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’s still last year you freak. Wake up.
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 12:57 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What year is it?

Hey, I woke up this morning and got my coffee and did a one hit and looked at the list and there were the same people that were there this time last year. Most of whom are my friends now. No matter what, we conitinue the fight. Ibogaine has been the weirdest thing I have ever done. It ROCKS. It is so good to be able to communicate with my friends this way and maybe help someone on the way. I am grateful to the point of tears for the people who helped me thru some real tough shit. It’s getting warm now, I think those who can make it ought to get together in the park for shits and giggle’s sometime. Ibonauts unite.    Randy

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 3, 2005 at 2:48:20 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

oh my god, the first few hours I was fuzzy each time, but then I got super freakin’ clear headed- mark all the writing I seem to do immediately after an ibo session.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 12:14 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine

In a message dated 5/3/05 11:56:48 AM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

Gotta say I’ve had the exact opposite reaction to ibogaine, with nary a
single ADD issue raising it’s head.
Thank goodness.

To the best of my recollections things got a bit fuzzy during the first few
days post ibogaine (possibly fuzzy is an understatement) and then everything
got real clear.  But, then there is the ever present issue of diverse effects
common to virtually everything including medications/drugs.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 3, 2005 at 2:15:12 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I have terrible reactions to anti-depressents and
maoi’s

i had difficult hcl, perhaps that was a reason why.

i did not have anything like that reaction with
extract.

the reason I bring it up, other then to infurate
control junkies, is that I think using extract in low
doses afterwards can be of benifit to the issue of
“add”

I do think medical science is too quick to label
things that they simple do a terrible job treating.

my question anytime a “bi-polar” or “a.d.d.” comes
up is what are the characteristics that led them to
that diagnosis, (is it something that shows up on a
test or just a hunch)

9 times out of 10 they seem to just say you have
something, and if the medication works then it’s like
verification…if it doesn’t work, well at least you
know you don’t have “it”.

not that anyone would reply, but has anyone ever
taking the medication that they treat people with
‘a.d.d.’ after dosing with ibogaine?

so to summerize, if your having trouble with that,
maybe contacting other providers to see if they can
help might be an option, (just to clearify, I am not
assuming your provider is irresponsible, just the more
options and diversity of information the better.

Interesting thing about language…sow mol ia and Ru
Wand Da have one single unifies langage and see great
suffering from war.
Cameroon has over 150 languages and has peace.

I have peace.

Later.
jason bursey
— HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/3/05 11:56:48 AM,
ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

Gotta say I’ve had the exact opposite reaction to
ibogaine, with nary a
single ADD issue raising it’s head.
Thank goodness.

To the best of my recollections things got a bit
fuzzy during the first few
days post ibogaine (possibly fuzzy is an
understatement) and then everything
got real clear.  But, then there is the ever present
issue of diverse effects
common to virtually everything including
medications/drugs.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….
Date: May 3, 2005 at 1:40:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hey Marteea and everyone else,

nice to speak with you again, and hope you are well…The Key Thing for me is NOT USING DOPE.  There’s nothing like 7 months of opiate-clean-time to realign body and mind.  It’s weird, but I don’t even get cravings anymore.  I still smoke pot like a fiend, but I realize it is medicinal (in my case, at least).

I eat very well now- no more potato chips and whatnot.  and yes, that has been a huge factor in my physical recovery, as has having an amazing partner.  LOVE is another key thing in the recovery process.

Can’t wait to catch up with all you folks,

love J.

Do you Yahoo!?
Make Yahoo! your home page

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] What year is it?
Date: May 3, 2005 at 12:57:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey, I woke up this morning and got my coffee and did a one hit and looked at the list and there were the same people that were there this time last year. Most of whom are my friends now. No matter what, we conitinue the fight. Ibogaine has been the weirdest thing I have ever done. It ROCKS. It is so good to be able to communicate with my friends this way and maybe help someone on the way. I am grateful to the point of tears for the people who helped me thru some real tough shit. It’s getting warm now, I think those who can make it ought to get together in the park for shits and giggle’s sometime. Ibonauts unite.    Randy

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 3, 2005 at 12:14:19 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/3/05 11:56:48 AM, ptpeet@nyc.rr.com writes:

Gotta say I’ve had the exact opposite reaction to ibogaine, with nary a
single ADD issue raising it’s head.
Thank goodness.

To the best of my recollections things got a bit fuzzy during the first few
days post ibogaine (possibly fuzzy is an understatement) and then everything
got real clear.  But, then there is the ever present issue of diverse effects
common to virtually everything including medications/drugs.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 3, 2005 at 11:56:14 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Gotta say I’ve had the exact opposite reaction to ibogaine, with nary a single ADD issue raising it’s head.
Thank goodness.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 1:38 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine

In a message dated 5/2/05 1:35:24 PM, mcorcoran27@yahoo.com writes:

I’ve joked with many people familiar with Ibogaine in the past year about
ADD being one of the side affects of post treatment and although its kinda
funny I’m getting to the point where I might need some serious help with
this. I’m making a concerted effort to sit with my thoughts and not be
on any kind of “mission” what-so-ever this time around but I’m still having
such a hard time focusing on anything I don’t really feel like doing
especially
work. Its like I become paralyzed. I know I could and have blamed that
on being totally exhausted for the past three weeks from lack of sleep
and getting my head broken open once again but now I’m sleeping again and
I’m not all that tired at least in comparison to how I was a week or so
ago. I just don’t know what to do with myself. I certainly don’t feel like
using or anything but my life can go to shit almost as fast if I don’t
figure this one out.
Howard, I might have mentioned this to you but I was diagnosed with ADD
as a kid and never treated (you know, M.D. father who refused to put a
label like that on his kid) Anyway I was wondering what you think about
someone being treated with medication for something like that post Ibo
or should I just try to ride this out? -m.

Hi Mark,

I think medication issues are personal issues and we each have to decide what
is best for us.  I know this is not very purist but, …what the hell.  If
you go with medication, observe your responses and then determine if you have
made correct decisions.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: BiscuitBoy714@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 3, 2005 at 11:24:02 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Marc, what were you thinking of taking to help the ADD? I hate to be the one to say this but, ya gotta look out for the buzz factor. Adderal is Dexedrine, and buzzes me hard. Ritilin is a lot milder but you can speed on it. Straterra makes your nads tingle, (I had to put that in there) and has some other sexual side effects that don’t quite sound as much fun. If we could find something that really works for this, that we don’t end up shooting, it may be a whole lot of help to our community. I was diagnosed ADD too. I would guess that most of us are. My friend is ADHD and DislExSik and he wants to take Ibogaine to see if it helps. He told me that the Straterra helps some, but that the side effects were too disconcerting to deal with, for him personally. I don’t know, tingling nads sounds kinda fun to me.         Randy

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 3, 2005 at 7:43:56 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

thanks for a perfect howard response. hey i was thinking would you like a report on my other 2 treatments ? if so i’ll try and get you something by the weekend. thanks again howard.

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:

In a message dated 5/2/05 1:35:24 PM, mcorcoran27@yahoo.com writes:

>I’ve joked with many people familiar with Ibogaine in the past year about
>ADD being one of the side affects of post treatment and although its kinda
>funny I’m getting to the point where I might need some serious help with
>this. I’m making a concerted effort to sit with my thoughts and not be
>on any kind of “mission” what-so-ever this time around but I’m still having
>such a hard time focusing on anything I don’t really feel like doing
especially
>work. Its like I become paralyzed. I know I could and have blamed that
>on being totally exhausted for the past three weeks from lack of sleep
>and getting my head broken open once again but now I’m sleeping again and
>I’m not all that tired at least in comparison to how I was a week or so
>ago. I just don’t know what to do with myself. I certainly don’t feel like
>using or anything but my life can go to shit almost as fast if I don’t
>figure this one out.
>Howard, I might have mentioned this to you but I was diagnosed with ADD
>as a kid and never treated (you know, M.D. father who refused to put a
>label like that on his kid) Anyway I was wondering what you think about
>someone being treated with medication for something like that post Ibo
>or should I just try to ride this out? -m.

Hi Mark,

I think medication issues are personal issues and we each have to decide what
is best for us. I know this is not very purist but, …what the hell. If
you go with medication, observe your responses and then determine if you have
made correct decisions.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Bring it on.
Date: May 3, 2005 at 5:15:28 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

` Hi Martee,

Mind,….WOW, I am so happy that you can use something I said and that it makes that much sense to you. I dont mind if my whole name is used at all. I mean
hey,…you can even tell them what town I live in.  : ).

Your kind words over those couple of months gave me energy, I am glad I could give back. I am also glad your still in my corner,..my opponent will not even get back
up  as I knock him straight down again. I am a good boxer. Some of my training I also received from this list.

Love,…I stand strong and firm, I can stand all you can muster,..bring it on baby.  You make me smile Martee.

much love, from Jasen.

—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 03, 2005 11:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey jasen…….

Jasen,
Thanks so much.  I actually have something to tell you.  I interviewed for the second time on an ibogaine documentary(first time 4 days after session).  Now 9 mos. later to see how things turned out.   I hope you don’t mind but I brought you up (first name and country only)  in reference to something you posted that I hold near and dear as a daily reminder. It is on my top ten list of reasons why I’m doing so well.
“Spirit of heroin/opiates have been extracted.  If I use again I let her back in, then she will cry for company again and naw at me at a soul level.  I am strong.”
For me this has completely and immediatley stops any chatter about using.
For me it sums up the way we barter and mindf*ck ourselves to give in to our turmoil rather than face it.  It sums up the nature of addiction.
Again I want to thank you.   I think of you daily.  In your corner rooting for you.
I close with as much love as you can possibly stand,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Jasen Chamoun
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 7:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey martee………

Hey Martee,

“Love you just the way you are” What a healing thing to hear from people. This alone could heal the world.

I have missed you.

with love,
Jasen.
From: “Kirsty Sutherland” <captkirk@kol.co.nz>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….
Date: May 3, 2005 at 4:12:09 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yayyyy I like good news like this!!
I’ll be you soon…..
Or similar Hehheh
Kirsty Dawn

—–Original Message—–
From: Ms Iboga [mailto:ms_iboga@yahoo.com]
Sent: Tuesday, 3 May 2005 7:57 a.m.
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….

hi everyone,

just wanted to say hi to all my old buddies, and hi to
the new folks.  Been away for a little while.  7
months and counting!!  I feel great, and my health &
disposition are through the ceiling.

Ibogaine DOES work…it got me off methadone…and it
can work for you too…

good luck,

Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 3, 2005 at 1:38:28 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/2/05 1:35:24 PM, mcorcoran27@yahoo.com writes:

I’ve joked with many people familiar with Ibogaine in the past year about
ADD being one of the side affects of post treatment and although its kinda
funny I’m getting to the point where I might need some serious help with
this. I’m making a concerted effort to sit with my thoughts and not be
on any kind of “mission” what-so-ever this time around but I’m still having
such a hard time focusing on anything I don’t really feel like doing
especially
work. Its like I become paralyzed. I know I could and have blamed that
on being totally exhausted for the past three weeks from lack of sleep
and getting my head broken open once again but now I’m sleeping again and
I’m not all that tired at least in comparison to how I was a week or so
ago. I just don’t know what to do with myself. I certainly don’t feel like
using or anything but my life can go to shit almost as fast if I don’t
figure this one out.
Howard, I might have mentioned this to you but I was diagnosed with ADD
as a kid and never treated (you know, M.D. father who refused to put a
label like that on his kid) Anyway I was wondering what you think about
someone being treated with medication for something like that post Ibo
or should I just try to ride this out? -m.

Hi Mark,

I think medication issues are personal issues and we each have to decide what
is best for us.  I know this is not very purist but, …what the hell.  If
you go with medication, observe your responses and then determine if you have
made correct decisions.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Pam Paperno” <pam@lviue.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] using
Date: May 3, 2005 at 12:18:16 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Matt,
Please–don’t think of yourself as a junkie.  You are NOT junk.  You are a human being with issues with chemicals.Those chemicals do not define you as a human being, or limit your value on this earth.
If you need someone to talk to, call me:  Pam 702)985-9134
Love yourself–you are worth it.
Pam
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 7:00 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] using

Hey Matt,
Re: your not knowing how to do anything well other than using and being a junkie.
There are an amazing amount of skills that you use to be a junkie.  It’s about realizing exactly what those skills are and using them elsewhere.
Someone that runs production for a company making jewelry can just as easy use those same skills working at a company that makes toothpicks.
I wish for you the realization of that which you already know.
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 10:03 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] using

Hi
this weekend i also used…..was cooking up speedballs through the whole weekend…….i wish that warm feeling would just go away….after my first ibo exp i was persuading my self tothink that heroin and everything is pure nonsense….i wanted desperetly to believe that the rush is nothing and partly suceseded because i used once after that and didnt like it…..but now after this weekend well i have a different opinion once again…thank god its all opinions but i dont know………im sick and weak from this condition………..i realize that now its only will power and nothing else because im not physicaly depended yet–thank god—but give it a week of daily debucheries and the demon starts to plead……come to think of it since i woke up the only thing on my mind is shooting up—–im ashamed to admit it but it is——-its really fucken difuclt when all u know to do really well is how to use, how to be a junky, i better get my ass up and go to work.
Namaste

Matt

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] using
Date: May 2, 2005 at 10:00:07 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Matt,
Re: your not knowing how to do anything well other than using and being a junkie.
There are an amazing amount of skills that you use to be a junkie.  It’s about realizing exactly what those skills are and using them elsewhere.
Someone that runs production for a company making jewelry can just as easy use those same skills working at a company that makes toothpicks.
I wish for you the realization of that which you already know.
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: matthew zielinski
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 10:03 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] using

Hi
this weekend i also used…..was cooking up speedballs through the whole weekend…….i wish that warm feeling would just go away….after my first ibo exp i was persuading my self tothink that heroin and everything is pure nonsense….i wanted desperetly to believe that the rush is nothing and partly suceseded because i used once after that and didnt like it…..but now after this weekend well i have a different opinion once again…thank god its all opinions but i dont know………im sick and weak from this condition………..i realize that now its only will power and nothing else because im not physicaly depended yet–thank god—but give it a week of daily debucheries and the demon starts to plead……come to think of it since i woke up the only thing on my mind is shooting up—–im ashamed to admit it but it is——-its really fucken difuclt when all u know to do really well is how to use, how to be a junky, i better get my ass up and go to work.
Namaste

Matt

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….
Date: May 2, 2005 at 9:31:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Julie,
I’m just curious and maybe for those that are still struggling,  What would you say are some of the key things that you attribute to your health and disposition being through the ceiling?  And would your dispositiion be in such a good place if you didn’t give a certain amount of attention to your health?  and versa visa or is that visa versa??
So glad to hear from you again. I was wondering how things were with you.
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: “Ms Iboga” <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 3:57 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….

hi everyone,

just wanted to say hi to all my old buddies, and hi to
the new folks.  Been away for a little while.  7
months and counting!!  I feel great, and my health &
disposition are through the ceiling.

Ibogaine DOES work…it got me off methadone…and it
can work for you too…

good luck,

Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey jasen…….
Date: May 2, 2005 at 9:13:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Jasen,
Thanks so much.  I actually have something to tell you.  I interviewed for the second time on an ibogaine documentary(first time 4 days after session).  Now 9 mos. later to see how things turned out.   I hope you don’t mind but I brought you up (first name and country only)  in reference to something you posted that I hold near and dear as a daily reminder. It is on my top ten list of reasons why I’m doing so well.
“Spirit of heroin/opiates have been extracted.  If I use again I let her back in, then she will cry for company again and naw at me at a soul level.  I am strong.”
For me this has completely and immediatley stops any chatter about using.
For me it sums up the way we barter and mindf*ck ourselves to give in to our turmoil rather than face it.  It sums up the nature of addiction.
Again I want to thank you.   I think of you daily.  In your corner rooting for you.
I close with as much love as you can possibly stand,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: Jasen Chamoun
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 7:01 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey martee………

Hey Martee,

“Love you just the way you are” What a healing thing to hear from people. This alone could heal the world.

I have missed you.

with love,
Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc

Hey Hey,
Your apearance once again is heart warming.  I’ve personally been lurking, going through a no need to comment stage.  However, what I sense would be helpful for you personally would be if you would find a reputable dojo.  It could possibly serve you in areas of being more grounded, disciplined and calm.  Also an outlet for that puppy energy you have that needs to be collected and directed.
You’ll notice I didn’t suggest yoga….
love you just the way you are,
Martee

Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.

brownies were a life saver in mexico but my gas isn’t being turned on unitl tomorrow. unitl then i’ll just have to smoke but i actually got 7 hours last night so i think i might be on the other end of it.  Actually I feel pretty damn great. Thanks. -M.

Jasen Chamoun <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
Hey M,

As well as the other things you mentioned, I found that eating pot helped me to sleep and relax more. More so than smoking, although I did both. As I am sure you
are aware you have to eat more than you would smoke.

You are sleeping soon.

love, Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 2:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sorry to keep bitchin abouth is but….

I’m still not sleeping! Actually last night was one of my worst 1 and a half hours 17 days out.
Last time it got gradiually better but this time it seems to be getting worse again and this time around was abusing a much shorter acting opiate.
This is beginning to drive me a little nuts. I have no desire to use but I don’t think I’d turn down a Xanax. Nah I’m not gonna take any Xanax but I’m open to sugestions. And yeah I’ve done the Melitonin and the valerian and smoking an hour before I go to sleep. But nothings working. Except maybe the ibogaine. -m.

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
yeah, a very close friend of mine said that often, since i have no personal
experiences. he said to have many spikes,, rigs on stand by as one gropes
and clogs and coagulates searching for the impossible, dumb guy never
learned either, kept trying the impossible, getting off took on a whole new
meaning, no quickie in the enco station or your friend’s bathroom. then
there was the panic as the realization of failure set in. oxys d/n do well
im i’m told..a lot of plastic molecules
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

> >in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
> bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load.<
> OOOWWUCH!
>
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston Peet
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Ron Davis”
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 9:39 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>
>
>> in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
>> bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load. i promise you ,
>> there will not be a visible vein on your body. not that i ever tried it,
>> story is purely anecdotal, ron
>> —– Original Message —–
>> From: “Preston Peet”
>> To:
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:33 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>
>>
>>> Veins? Veins? LOL, I Have capilaries and a few viens (I admit, they do
>>> come back, sorta, after a break of some years) but they rapidly go,
>>> “Hey, Preston, Fuck You. We’re going back into hiding,” leaving me
>>> whimpering in the bathroom as I try desperately to get well.
>>> Or at least, that’s where I was once again not too long ago.
>>> ;-))
>>> But then, two days ago climbing outta the bathtub, what should pop up on
>>> my foreleg but a HUGE vein I haven’t seen in years, looking whole and
>>> hungry too- it’s the DEVIL I tell you- “Hey Look Preston, a huge willing
>>> vein, and that drugstore where you can legally buy .75 cent rigs is just
>>> around the corner, RUN!
>>> But I resisted. Weird shit ibogaine, how it somehow allows me to step
>>> back, for the most part, and think things through first, again, for the
>>> most part.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Peace and love,
>>> Preston Peet
>>>
>>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
>>> mistaken for madness”
>>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>>
>>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
>>> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>> Columnist New York Waste
>>> Etc.
>>>
>>> —– Original Message —–
>>> From: “Ron Davis”
>>> To:
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:43 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>
>>>
>>>> you have veins after all these yrs? lucky, i haven’t seen one in
>>>> decades. dilaudids cooked up nicely in the 70’s before the generics
>>>> came out. i recently had knee surgery and the doc was compassionate w/
>>>> scripts. i ate 25 4mg. to get off, glad insurance paid, knee hurt like
>>>> hell for a month till he filled again. it all sucks, maybe my day will
>>>> come soon, well wishes , ron—– Original Message —–
>>>> From: “Preston Peet”
>>>> To:
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:01 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Never considered banging it, and don’t think I would- and I used to
>>>>> band ANYTHING I could melt into a needle too once upon a time- but
>>>>> that’s been years (for instance, I get ms-contins along with my
>>>>> dilaudids, but never shot them- but did add water to one once, on the
>>>>> off chance it would work somehow- LOL, I do NOT inject jelly into my
>>>>> veins, no matter how desperate for a “fix” (i.e. needle in my vein,
>>>>> which is such a HUGE part of my addictive problems, that whole
>>>>> ritualistic needle thing, which is one reason why I’m trying new
>>>>> streches to my new Tai Chi video, and still plan on trying yoga, as
>>>>> soon as I can get up early enough on either this Wed or Fri to attend
>>>>> a class a few blocks from my home.
>>>>> Carry on all.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Peace and love,
>>>>> Preston Peet
>>>>>
>>>>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
>>>>> often mistaken for madness”
>>>>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>>>>
>>>>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>>>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>>>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>>>> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
>>>>> Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out
>>>>> Sept. 2005)
>>>>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>>>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>>>> Columnist New York Waste
>>>>> Etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> —– Original Message —–
>>>>> From: “Carlton B”
>>>>> To:
>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 6:43 PM
>>>>> Subject: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Just listening to this talk about gagging gullets and emptying bowels
>>>>>> makes
>>>>>> me ask a question: has anyone ever explored taking it as an
>>>>>> injection? No
>>>>>> loss of product, etc. I wouldn’t want to be the first one to try
>>>>>> it. On
>>>>>> second thought, maybe it’s not such a good idea to bypass the body’s
>>>>>> main
>>>>>> safeguard to OD….
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>>
>>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>
>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>
>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>> [%]
>>
>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> [%]
>
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] fwd…illusion
Date: May 2, 2005 at 7:33:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

This is very interseting…check it out yoall

I would like to discuss illusion.  The You in
Oneness and the you in duality seem to be
vastly different.  Yet they are not.  You might
view duality as a series of Chinese boxes.  The
greatest of the boxes is the Oneness.  Within
that Oneness is the world of illusion you have
created from Oneness.  Within the world of
illusion is the duality.  It is not hopeless.  Your
world is not opposed to Oneness.  It is
embraced by it.

The lenses of your human experience have
altered themselves to the minds demand, to
fear’s preoccupation, to the child’s education.
There is another lens available to you, which
sees even your moments of greatest stress,
greatest division and fragmentation as simply
part of the Oneness.

I am held in suspicion at times by my channel
when I address all things disguised as tragedies
as opportunities to choose love.  One might say,
”Why, Emmanuel would walk through the very
gates of hell itself and say that was an opening
to love!”  Yes, I would.  The moment you choose
love, hell vanishes.  It becomes just another
remarkable structure in fear’s domain.

It is not required that you alter your world one
iota.  What will bring you peace is to
alter your perceptions.

…

You have become caught in the illusion
that your identity
rests with your capacity to struggle.
It does not.

Your true identity
is awaiting you
beyond effort.

The key to remembering
is to remind the self
not to be afraid of anything
anywhere
anytime
ever.

Illusion cannot destroy reality.
Can a shadow on the wall
hurt you?

Death cannot kill You.
Pain cannot hurt You.
Disease cannot make You ill.
Years cannot age You.
Fear cannot touch You.
Welcome Home.
…………By Rick
Namaste
Matthew

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 2, 2005 at 7:07:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Now Lee,
1 session 5 years ago. and Yes this time through friends it will be easy.
I wanted to share the lyrics of a song by Warren Haynes ” Scared and lonley, tough as nails. We open our hearts when all else fails, Wear the veil and the trojan horse smile. Looking back on yesteryear,seems like Maybe You missed Your calling, and hindgsight is very clear when lonleieness is falling and You have fallen down, down from the heavens,  You have fallen down from heaven. Stuck out in the desert.Amazing grace such a lonley place for Heros like You and Me, fallen down just like a shooting star, like a fallen angel standing there to carry You away.
Target pratice with other peoples lives, Hit a few right between the eyes, But most of the time We’re wounded by the richochet. Play to win boys never play to lose,  as long as Your playin boy Your bullet proof Yeah think about it Your playin to death anyway.
Looking back on yesteryear It seems like maybe You missed Your calling.And You have fallen down Down from the heavens Amazing grace such a lonley place for Heros like You and Me. Fallen down just like a shooting star or a fallen angel standing  by to carry You away, Oh angel take of Mercy take pity on a fool
Rich without pleasure Respected without love Drinking poison from a golden cup
You have fallen down  Down from the heavens Fallen down Amazing grace such a lonley place for Heros Like You and Me, fallen down……………………
peas and love Kurt
—– Original Message —–
From: Lee Albert
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 02, 2005 7:15 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Hi Kurt,
I am curious how many sessions have you had?
Also, with the help of a friend it should be reasonably easy for you to have another session as you have already been there. Ibogaine becomes much, much safer with repeated us imo. Why not spend a couple of hundred bucks on another private (own organised)  session that will leave you on a high (possibly giving you insight into what the major issue is with you right now) rather than putting your money into trash that poisons the body?
Matt has a contact for ibogaine I believe in Toronto (which he mentioned before on this list or another).
I know if I were in your shoes I would be right out the door looking to cop some ibo and not more shit.
Lee

“m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net> wrote:
Kurt,
I understand the isolation thing as part of ones addiction, however it seems you didn’t do that.  Instead you went around to your support system cause you knew they would see the obvious.
My take on your not taking the free one and going out to cop is not the choice of danger over ease, but a noncomittal act over taking the free one “first”. That in a way is a commitment to set up a buy/sell scenario that would have a future. You didn’t do that.
Then you posted here.   So I believe that’s 3 for 3….all good.
A pebble in the road.  It’s behind you.  Your path ahead.
Considering the circumstance by which you stopped 36 days ago I think you have amazing strength and resolve.
A new beginning can start in a second, an hour or a day.  It’s all good.
You are a hero.
Eboga, Eboga,Eboga, Love,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: KURT BRECHTER
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 2:04 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Not only that,
On day 30 like clock work the dealer I haven’t herad from in 3 years (who’s kids I put through parochiol school) calls. “the first ones free”
I resist for 6 days. Needless to say alot of heavy shit came down on Me and once again ‘I DESERVED it”    WHAT KINDA shit is that?I deserve a bag of death???? Well the sick mother fucker I am I say “Yeah You Do”???????????
So, I don’t even take the free shit, I put Myself at all kinda risk to go “COP”.
Like I said I’m sick.
I get High, I take a look on the mirror a couple of hours later and there HE is. That same scheming mother fucker I hate.
Now with the (O.D.) overdone it and regretful headache I sit here trying to understand just a small fraction.
I even told another dope fiend,”yeah I fucked up but I only had a half an opium supository?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck??????????????????
I can’t do this to Myself again, But My track record sucks.
I think I’m finished for tonight, But You never know
peas and love  Kurt

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: “Jasen Chamoun” <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey martee………
Date: May 2, 2005 at 7:01:34 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hey Martee,

“Love you just the way you are” What a healing thing to hear from people. This alone could heal the world.

I have missed you.

with love,
Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 11:20 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc

Hey Hey,
Your apearance once again is heart warming.  I’ve personally been lurking, going through a no need to comment stage.  However, what I sense would be helpful for you personally would be if you would find a reputable dojo.  It could possibly serve you in areas of being more grounded, disciplined and calm.  Also an outlet for that puppy energy you have that needs to be collected and directed.
You’ll notice I didn’t suggest yoga….
love you just the way you are,
Martee

Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.

brownies were a life saver in mexico but my gas isn’t being turned on unitl tomorrow. unitl then i’ll just have to smoke but i actually got 7 hours last night so i think i might be on the other end of it.  Actually I feel pretty damn great. Thanks. -M.

Jasen Chamoun <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
Hey M,

As well as the other things you mentioned, I found that eating pot helped me to sleep and relax more. More so than smoking, although I did both. As I am sure you
are aware you have to eat more than you would smoke.

You are sleeping soon.

love, Jasen.
—– Original Message —–
From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 2:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sorry to keep bitchin abouth is but….

I’m still not sleeping! Actually last night was one of my worst 1 and a half hours 17 days out.
Last time it got gradiually better but this time it seems to be getting worse again and this time around was abusing a much shorter acting opiate.
This is beginning to drive me a little nuts. I have no desire to use but I don’t think I’d turn down a Xanax. Nah I’m not gonna take any Xanax but I’m open to sugestions. And yeah I’ve done the Melitonin and the valerian and smoking an hour before I go to sleep. But nothings working. Except maybe the ibogaine. -m.

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
yeah, a very close friend of mine said that often, since i have no personal
experiences. he said to have many spikes,, rigs on stand by as one gropes
and clogs and coagulates searching for the impossible, dumb guy never
learned either, kept trying the impossible, getting off took on a whole new
meaning, no quickie in the enco station or your friend’s bathroom. then
there was the panic as the realization of failure set in. oxys d/n do well
im i’m told..a lot of plastic molecules
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

> >in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
> bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load.<
> OOOWWUCH!
>
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston Peet
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: “Ron Davis”
> To:
> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 9:39 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>
>
>> in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
>> bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load. i promise you ,
>> there will not be a visible vein on your body. not that i ever tried it,
>> story is purely anecdotal, ron
>> —– Original Message —–
>> From: “Preston Peet”
>> To:
>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:33 AM
>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>
>>
>>> Veins? Veins? LOL, I Have capilaries and a few viens (I admit, they do
>>> come back, sorta, after a break of some years) but they rapidly go,
>>> “Hey, Preston, Fuck You. We’re going back into hiding,” leaving me
>>> whimpering in the bathroom as I try desperately to get well.
>>> Or at least, that’s where I was once again not too long ago.
>>> ;-))
>>> But then, two days ago climbing outta the bathtub, what should pop up on
>>> my foreleg but a HUGE vein I haven’t seen in years, looking whole and
>>> hungry too- it’s the DEVIL I tell you- “Hey Look Preston, a huge willing
>>> vein, and that drugstore where you can legally buy .75 cent rigs is just
>>> around the corner, RUN!
>>> But I resisted. Weird shit ibogaine, how it somehow allows me to step
>>> back, for the most part, and think things through first, again, for the
>>> most part.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Peace and love,
>>> Preston Peet
>>>
>>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
>>> mistaken for madness”
>>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>>
>>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
>>> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
>>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>> Columnist New York Waste
>>> Etc.
>>>
>>> —– Original Message —–
>>> From: “Ron Davis”
>>> To:
>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:43 AM
>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>
>>>
>>>> you have veins after all these yrs? lucky, i haven’t seen one in
>>>> decades. dilaudids cooked up nicely in the 70’s before the generics
>>>> came out. i recently had knee surgery and the doc was compassionate w/
>>>> scripts. i ate 25 4mg. to get off, glad insurance paid, knee hurt like
>>>> hell for a month till he filled again. it all sucks, maybe my day will
>>>> come soon, well wishes , ron—– Original Message —–
>>>> From: “Preston Peet”
>>>> To:
>>>> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:01 AM
>>>> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> Never considered banging it, and don’t think I would- and I used to
>>>>> band ANYTHING I could melt into a needle too once upon a time- but
>>>>> that’s been years (for instance, I get ms-contins along with my
>>>>> dilaudids, but never shot them- but did add water to one once, on the
>>>>> off chance it would work somehow- LOL, I do NOT inject jelly into my
>>>>> veins, no matter how desperate for a “fix” (i.e. needle in my vein,
>>>>> which is such a HUGE part of my addictive problems, that whole
>>>>> ritualistic needle thing, which is one reason why I’m trying new
>>>>> streches to my new Tai Chi video, and still plan on trying yoga, as
>>>>> soon as I can get up early enough on either this Wed or Fri to attend
>>>>> a class a few blocks from my home.
>>>>> Carry on all.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> Peace and love,
>>>>> Preston Peet
>>>>>
>>>>> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
>>>>> often mistaken for madness”
>>>>> Richard Davenport-Hines
>>>>>
>>>>> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
>>>>> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
>>>>> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
>>>>> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
>>>>> Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out
>>>>> Sept. 2005)
>>>>> Cont. High Times mag/.com
>>>>> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
>>>>> Columnist New York Waste
>>>>> Etc.
>>>>>
>>>>> —– Original Message —–
>>>>> From: “Carlton B”
>>>>> To:
>>>>> Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 6:43 PM
>>>>> Subject: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> Just listening to this talk about gagging gullets and emptying bowels
>>>>>> makes
>>>>>> me ask a question: has anyone ever explored taking it as an
>>>>>> injection? No
>>>>>> loss of product, etc. I wouldn’t want to be the first one to try
>>>>>> it. On
>>>>>> second thought, maybe it’s not such a good idea to bypass the body’s
>>>>>> main
>>>>>> safeguard to OD….
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>>
>>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>>
>>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
>>> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
>>>
>>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> /]=———————————————————————=[\
>> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
>> [%]
>>
>> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>>
>>
>
>
>
>
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> [%]
>
> \]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….
Date: May 2, 2005 at 6:27:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Juliie
Good to hear from you and im proud of you :}

Namaste

Matt

>From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com> >Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com >To: ibogaine@mindvox.com >Subject: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting…. >Date: Mon, 2 May 2005 12:57:10 -0700 (PDT) > >hi everyone, > >just wanted to say hi to all my old buddies, and hi to >the new folks. Been away for a little while. 7 >months and counting!! I feel great, and my health & >disposition are through the ceiling. > >Ibogaine DOES work…it got me off methadone…and it >can work for you too… > >good luck, > >Julie > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com > > > /]=———————————————————————=[\ > [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] > \]=———————————————————————=[/ > >

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Nick Sandberg” <nick227@tiscali.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 2, 2005 at 5:34:56 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—–Original Message—–
From: Lee Albert [mailto:my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk]
Sent: 02 May 2005 20:03
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine

Hi there,

I have noticed sometimes after a low dose session that I cannot bring myself to do anything work wise that requires theoretical thought. It’s like this form of thinking is an assault on the mind and I think that has to do with becoming more sensitive at the way you use your thinking mind, i.e., in the past when trying to repress problems the mind can spend a lot of time calculating ways to pass time or working on ventures and plans etc. – being in the HEAD! All of that is abnormal activity for the mind in my opinion as it is working more than it would do if there were no underlying problems.

Hence, after a session I think the ability to abuse one’s mind with concieving projects (theoretical work) other than what the mind itself wants to think about, is quite difficult as one is in a kind of state of mental rest from the mental actouts – a reset of sorts (as opposed to the mental activity one has due to trying to deal with rising pain), i.e., a more balanced mental state seeking a better equilibrium between left and right brain activity.

This I think can be confused with ADD but in my opinion its not necessarily the same thing. (I am no expert on ADD – I assume you are refering to attention deficiency syndrom.)

If one continues working with eboga to deal with the core issues then this phenomenon lessens and indeed reverses as one has over a period of years working with eboga slowly let go of the mental actouts or mental addictions and moved to a use of the mind which is actually in keeping with your soul – balanced. This is due to the healing of the hidden or repressed material (in the Shadow).

I would be very weary of medication for any condition which emerges as a result of an ibogaine session as it is quite likely a healing phenomenon which may not fit conveniently into what one expects of oneself 9 to 5.

Lee

Yeah, just mindlessly trying to find something that will “let me get some fucking sleep” is something we all do when dealing with sleeplessness. But basically it is never going to really get anyone anywhere, except perhaps back into medication. You have to look what it is that is trying to move. Sleeplessness is an attempt by the core of the psyche to break down an overly rigid mental perspective, because when you can’t sleep you can’t control so much and the real you, shitty bits and all, starts to come out, and this is healing. The blocks in the body’s energy system move. Best thing is to not bother with all that St john’s wort stuff and just move your body until you can really feel it again. Run on the spot with both arms kept in the air shouting for 1 hour straight. If you can do this, you are not going to have a problem sleeping because you will step up the energy flow in your body so much it will just blast blocks out the way. Learn the bio-energetic bow position for the body and scream like fuck whilst in it. This also will move things. You can also get some pure tobacco, soak it in a very little water, then take the thick brown liquid and syringe it up both nostrils fast, followed by shaking and emotional release. These are just a few techniques I’ve learned from different guys and worked with. They will all break sleeplessness very quickly if done 100%. You have to recognize your own resistance and be prepared to go through it. One way or the other, you have to step up the energy flow in the body to sufficient a level such that the block which is causing the sleeplessness can move. Then you will sleep like a baby.

Nick

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
I’ve joked with many people familiar with Ibogaine in the past year about ADD being one of the side affects of post treatment and although its kinda funny I’m getting to the point where I might need some serious help with this. I’m making a concerted effort to sit with my thoughts and not be on any kind of “mission” what-so-ever this time around but I’m still having such a hard time focusing on anything I don’t really feel like doing especially work. Its like I become paralyzed. I know I could and have blamed that on being totally exhausted for the past three weeks from lack of sleep and getting my head broken open once again but now I’m sleeping again and I’m not all that tired at least in comparison to how I was a week or so ago. I just don’t know what to do with myself. I certainly don’t feel like using or anything but my life can go to shit almost as fast if I don’t figure this one out.
Howard, I might have mentioned this to you but I was diagnosed with ADD as a kid and never treated (you know, M.D. father who refused to put a label like that on his kid) Anyway I was wondering what you think about someone being treated with medication for something like that post Ibo or should I just try to ride this out? -m.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
nice trip for some hell ride for most. nothing like ibogaine.

Max Vogel <somethinginternational@gmail.com> wrote:
My dog ate one of those and has been mellow ever since.

On 5/2/05, matthew zielinski wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Hi
>
> Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of experience
> compared to ibo.
>
> Namaste
> Matt
>
>
> ________________________________
> Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r) Calendar. MSN Premium: Join
> now and get the first two months FREE*
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 2, 2005 at 5:26:23 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi
Can you explain pls>?

Warmest Regards

Matt

>From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> >Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com >To: ibogaine@mindvox.com >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria >Date: Mon, 2 May 2005 10:12:16 -0700 (PDT) > >nice trip for some hell ride for most. nothing like ibogaine. > >Max Vogel <somethinginternational@gmail.com> wrote:My dog ate one of those and has been mellow ever since. > >On 5/2/05, matthew zielinski wrote: > > > > > > > > > > Hi > > > > Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of experience > > compared to ibo. > > > > Namaste > > Matt > > > > > > ________________________________ > > Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r) Calendar. MSN Premium: Join > > now and get the first two months FREE* > > /]=———————————————————————=[\ > > [%] Ibogaine List Commands: > > http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] > > \]=———————————————————————=[/ > > >/]=———————————————————————=[\ >[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] >\]=———————————————————————=[/ > > > > >__________________________________________________ >Do You Yahoo!? >Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around >http://mail.yahoo.com

Share a single photo or an entire slide show right inside your e-mail with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Ms Iboga <ms_iboga@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] 7 months clean time and counting….
Date: May 2, 2005 at 3:57:10 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi everyone,

just wanted to say hi to all my old buddies, and hi to
the new folks.  Been away for a little while.  7
months and counting!!  I feel great, and my health &
disposition are through the ceiling.

Ibogaine DOES work…it got me off methadone…and it
can work for you too…

good luck,

Julie

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] using
Date: May 2, 2005 at 3:36:24 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Matt,

To me you are a hero and will get there. It was never going to be an easy journey, was it?

Lee

Chris Hunter <abductmeplease@hotmail.com> wrote:
Hi Mat

Hey I’m sorry to read about your lapse man. I guess I’d like to say that
This is your journey Mat, for good for bad, it is where you are. I think
one of the important things that you are doing is trying to organise your
thoughts into a positive future where H won’t be a problem for you. The H
wheel keeps on turning for you and many others, its a strong program that
has connected with many parts of your psyche. All of your experiences,
especially your clean time which projected so much positivity and support
for others on the list are no less relevant and than they were before this
liaison with H.

For me thoughts are everything, keep them moving in the right direction Mat
they will change things for you as they have done before.

I wonder what led to your initial use? what did you do differently? Can you
identify some things over the last few weeks where the path back into the
forest became brighter and more inviting?

What would be a good first step on the path back out of the forest? any
songs that have helped over the last few months?

You’ll get there Mat

Much Love

Chris

>From: “matthew zielinski”
>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>Subject: [Ibogaine] using
>Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 10:03:53 -0400
>

_________________________________________________________________
Use MSN Messenger to send music and pics to your friends
http://messenger.msn.co.uk
From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 10:03:53 -0400
Subject: [Ibogaine] using

Hi
this weekend i also used…..was cooking up speedballs through the whole weekend…….i wish that warm feeling would just go away….after my first ibo exp i was persuading my self tothink that heroin and everything is pure nonsense….i wanted desperetly to believe that the rush is nothing and partly suceseded because i used once after that and didnt like it…..but now after this weekend well i have a different opinion once again…thank god its all opinions but i dont know………im sick and weak from this condition………..i realize that now its only will power and nothing else because im not physicaly depended yet–thank god—but give it a week of daily debucheries and the demon starts to plead……come to think of it since i woke up the only thing on my mind is shooting up—–im ashamed to admit it but it is——-its really fucken difuclt when all u know to do really well is how to use, how to be a junky, i better get my ass up and go to work.
Namaste

Matt

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 2, 2005 at 3:33:51 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Kurt,

It occured to me that my last post may not have come across as very sympathetic to your situation. I guess I was annoyed with the way the shit brings us down. Believe me it saddens me deeply to see anyone on this list going through their moments of need to use and all the confusion and lonliness that brings. I know what it is like in my own way. Like the blind man who sees and then once more loses his sight and is reminded of all the sadness once again that that brings.

I was never an addict per see apart from huge nicotine cravings and a fondness for marijuana/hash. Yet I shared many of the same experiences that people talk about here in terms of quality of life and the endless need for a fix. In my case it manifested in behaviour patterns etc. and incredible lonliness. Its the same pain.

I have become very comfortable with the use of ibogaine as I know deeply how healing it is and I do recommend that people on the list going for treatment get real and stock up on ibogaine and make arrangements for ongoing treatment. In my own case I have charted a course through my shit and ibogaine has been the engine fuel. Rock on eboga!!!!!!!!!!!!

It’s a journey and one session or even 3 is unlikely to be enough. However due to the need for integration there comes a point where full dose sessions are inappropriate and the gradual work that can be done on low doses is more appropriate. Of course if you drop back into your addiction the full dose is required.
It does work.

with love,

Lee

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi Kurt,
I am curious how many sessions have you had?
Also, with the help of a friend it should be reasonably easy for you to have another session as you have already been there. Ibogaine becomes much, much safer with repeated us imo. Why not spend a couple of hundred bucks on another private (own organised)  session that will leave you on a high (possibly giving you insight into what the major issue is with you right now) rather than putting your money into trash that poisons the body?
Matt has a contact for ibogaine I believe in Toronto (which he mentioned before on this list or another).
I know if I were in your shoes I would be right out the door looking to cop some ibo and not more shit.
Lee

“m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net> wrote:
Kurt,
I understand the isolation thing as part of ones addiction, however it seems you didn’t do that.  Instead you went around to your support system cause you knew they would see the obvious.
My take on your not taking the free one and going out to cop is not the choice of danger over ease, but a noncomittal act over taking the free one “first”. That in a way is a commitment to set up a buy/sell scenario that would have a future. You didn’t do that.
Then you posted here.   So I believe that’s 3 for 3….all good.
A pebble in the road.  It’s behind you.  Your path ahead.
Considering the circumstance by which you stopped 36 days ago I think you have amazing strength and resolve.
A new beginning can start in a second, an hour or a day.  It’s all good.
You are a hero.
Eboga, Eboga,Eboga, Love,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: KURT BRECHTER
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 2:04 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Not only that,
On day 30 like clock work the dealer I haven’t herad from in 3 years (who’s kids I put through parochiol school) calls. “the first ones free”
I resist for 6 days. Needless to say alot of heavy shit came down on Me and once again ‘I DESERVED it”    WHAT KINDA shit is that?I deserve a bag of death???? Well the sick mother fucker I am I say “Yeah You Do”???????????
So, I don’t even take the free shit, I put Myself at all kinda risk to go “COP”.
Like I said I’m sick.
I get High, I take a look on the mirror a couple of hours later and there HE is. That same scheming mother fucker I hate.
Now with the (O.D.) overdone it and regretful headache I sit here trying to understand just a small fraction.
I even told another dope fiend,”yeah I fucked up but I only had a half an opium supository?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck??????????????????
I can’t do this to Myself again, But My track record sucks.
I think I’m finished for tonight, But You never know
peas and love  Kurt

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: “Chris Hunter” <abductmeplease@hotmail.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] using
Date: May 2, 2005 at 3:33:25 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Mat

Hey I’m sorry to read about your lapse man. I guess I’d like to say that This is your journey Mat, for good for bad, it is where you are.  I think one of the important things that you are doing is trying to organise your thoughts into a positive future where H won’t be a problem for you. The H wheel keeps on turning for you and many others, its a strong program that has connected with many parts of your psyche. All of your experiences, especially your clean time which projected so much positivity and support for others on the list are no less relevant and than they were before this liaison with H.

For me thoughts are everything, keep them moving in the right direction Mat they will change things for you as they have done before.

I wonder what led to your initial use? what did you do differently?  Can you identify some things over the last few weeks where the path back into the forest became brighter and more inviting?

What would be a good first step on the path back out of the forest? any songs that have helped over the last few months?

You’ll get there Mat

Much Love

Chris

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [Ibogaine] using
Date: Mon, 02 May 2005 10:03:53 -0400

_________________________________________________________________
Use MSN Messenger to send music and pics to your friends http://messenger.msn.co.uk

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] using
Date: May 2, 2005 at 10:03:53 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi
this weekend i also used…..was cooking up speedballs through the whole weekend…….i wish that warm feeling would just go away….after my first ibo exp i was persuading my self tothink that heroin and everything is pure nonsense….i wanted desperetly to believe that the rush is nothing and partly suceseded because i used once after that and didnt like it…..but now after this weekend well i have a different opinion once again…thank god its all opinions but i dont know………im sick and weak from this condition………..i realize that now its only will power and nothing else because im not physicaly depended yet–thank god—but give it a week of daily debucheries and the demon starts to plead……come to think of it since i woke up the only thing on my mind is shooting up—–im ashamed to admit it but it is——-its really fucken difuclt when all u know to do really well is how to use, how to be a junky, i better get my ass up and go to work.
Namaste

Matt

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 2, 2005 at 3:14:17 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My previous session was actually a pretty high dose 24mg/kg and the ability to concentrate is just as bad or even worse than after 6 or 8mg/kg. I don’t know what to think because I’ve always done everything medicated and if I’m dealing with my “real self” right now then I’d better look into it because in some respcts I’m less functional than ever. Again I can’t stress enough there are no thoughts of using to remedy this (what a joke that would be) but somethings gotta give here. Thanks for the input lee. -m.

Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> wrote:
Hi there,

I have noticed sometimes after a low dose session that I cannot bring myself to do anything work wise that requires theoretical thought. It’s like this form of thinking is an assault on the mind and I think that has to do with becoming more sensitive at the way you use your thinking mind, i.e., in the past when trying to repress problems the mind can spend a lot of time calculating ways to pass time or working on ventures and plans etc. – being in the HEAD! All of that is abnormal activity for the mind in my opinion as it is working more than it would do if there were no underlying problems.

Hence, after a session I think the ability to abuse one’s mind with concieving projects (theoretical work) other than what the mind itself wants to think about, is quite difficult as one is in a kind of state of mental rest from the mental actouts – a reset of sorts (as opposed to the mental activity one has due to trying to deal with rising pain), i.e., a more balanced mental state seeking a better equilibrium between left and right brain activity.

This I think can be confused with ADD but in my opinion its not necessarily the same thing. (I am no expert on ADD – I assume you are refering to attention deficiency syndrom.)

If one continues working with eboga to deal with the core issues then this phenomenon lessens and indeed reverses as one has over a period of years working with eboga slowly let go of the mental actouts or mental addictions and moved to a use of the mind which is actually in keeping with your soul – balanced. This is due to the healing of the hidden or repressed material (in the Shadow).

I would be very weary of medication for any condition which emerges as a result of an ibogaine session as it is quite likely a healing phenomenon which may not fit conveniently into what one expects of oneself 9 to 5.

Lee

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
I’ve joked with many people familiar with Ibogaine in the past year about ADD being one of the side affects of post treatment and although its kinda funny I’m getting to the point where I might need some serious help with this. I’m making a concerted effort to sit with my thoughts and not be on any kind of “mission” what-so-ever this time around but I’m still having such a hard time focusing on anything I don’t really feel like doing especially work. Its like I become paralyzed. I know I could and have blamed that on being totally exhausted for the past three weeks from lack of sleep and getting my head broken open once again but now I’m sleeping again and I’m not all that tired at least in comparison to how I was a week or so ago. I just don’t know what to do with myself. I certainly don’t feel like using or anything but my life can go to shit almost as fast if I don’t figure this one out.
Howard, I might have mentioned this to you but I was diagnosed with ADD as a kid and never treated (you know, M.D. father who refused to put a label like that on his kid) Anyway I was wondering what you think about someone being treated with medication for something like that post Ibo or should I just try to ride this out? -m.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
nice trip for some hell ride for most. nothing like ibogaine.

Max Vogel <somethinginternational@gmail.com> wrote:
My dog ate one of those and has been mellow ever since.

On 5/2/05, matthew zielinski wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Hi
>
> Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of experience
> compared to ibo.
>
> Namaste
> Matt
>
>
> ________________________________
> Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r) Calendar. MSN Premium: Join
> now and get the first two months FREE*
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 2, 2005 at 3:02:32 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi there,

I have noticed sometimes after a low dose session that I cannot bring myself to do anything work wise that requires theoretical thought. It’s like this form of thinking is an assault on the mind and I think that has to do with becoming more sensitive at the way you use your thinking mind, i.e., in the past when trying to repress problems the mind can spend a lot of time calculating ways to pass time or working on ventures and plans etc. – being in the HEAD! All of that is abnormal activity for the mind in my opinion as it is working more than it would do if there were no underlying problems.

Hence, after a session I think the ability to abuse one’s mind with concieving projects (theoretical work) other than what the mind itself wants to think about, is quite difficult as one is in a kind of state of mental rest from the mental actouts – a reset of sorts (as opposed to the mental activity one has due to trying to deal with rising pain), i.e., a more balanced mental state seeking a better equilibrium between left and right brain activity.

This I think can be confused with ADD but in my opinion its not necessarily the same thing. (I am no expert on ADD – I assume you are refering to attention deficiency syndrom.)

If one continues working with eboga to deal with the core issues then this phenomenon lessens and indeed reverses as one has over a period of years working with eboga slowly let go of the mental actouts or mental addictions and moved to a use of the mind which is actually in keeping with your soul – balanced. This is due to the healing of the hidden or repressed material (in the Shadow).

I would be very weary of medication for any condition which emerges as a result of an ibogaine session as it is quite likely a healing phenomenon which may not fit conveniently into what one expects of oneself 9 to 5.

Lee

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
I’ve joked with many people familiar with Ibogaine in the past year about ADD being one of the side affects of post treatment and although its kinda funny I’m getting to the point where I might need some serious help with this. I’m making a concerted effort to sit with my thoughts and not be on any kind of “mission” what-so-ever this time around but I’m still having such a hard time focusing on anything I don’t really feel like doing especially work. Its like I become paralyzed. I know I could and have blamed that on being totally exhausted for the past three weeks from lack of sleep and getting my head broken open once again but now I’m sleeping again and I’m not all that tired at least in comparison to how I was a week or so ago. I just don’t know what to do with myself. I certainly don’t feel like using or anything but my life can go to shit almost as fast if I don’t figure this one out.
Howard, I might have mentioned this to you but I was diagnosed with ADD as a kid and never treated (you know, M.D. father who refused to put a label like that on his kid) Anyway I was wondering what you think about someone being treated with medication for something like that post Ibo or should I just try to ride this out? -m.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
nice trip for some hell ride for most. nothing like ibogaine.

Max Vogel <somethinginternational@gmail.com> wrote:
My dog ate one of those and has been mellow ever since.

On 5/2/05, matthew zielinski wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Hi
>
> Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of experience
> compared to ibo.
>
> Namaste
> Matt
>
>
> ________________________________
> Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r) Calendar. MSN Premium: Join
> now and get the first two months FREE*
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: Re-Elect Bush/Cheney 08 Or Else <reelectbushcheney2008@yahoo.ca>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ot
Date: May 2, 2005 at 2:05:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

wood morning retarted is

off fuck he should

http://www.answers.com/topic/caricature?method=8

— Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com> wrote:

nonsense rush is sick and weak from this condition
because the demon starts to plead junky but i dont
know………im ………..i realize that now its
only
not physicaly depended yet– — give a realize of
daily starts to come to think of it since i woke up
mind is   really all well when to know is how to do
really well , how to be  better

———————————
Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with
MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months
FREE*

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] ot
Date: May 2, 2005 at 1:56:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

nonsense rush is sick and weak from this condition
because the demon starts to plead junky but i dont
know………im ………..i realize that now its only
not physicaly depended yet– — give a realize of
daily starts to come to think of it since i woke up
mind is   really all well when to know is how to do
really well , how to be  better

———————————
Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with
MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months
FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]  \]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 2, 2005 at 1:36:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

wonder what is trying to happen?

— mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
I’ve joked with many people familiar with Ibogaine
in the past year about ADD being one of the side
affects of post treatment and although its kinda
funny I’m getting to the point where I might need
some serious help with this. I’m making a concerted
effort to sit with my thoughts and not be on any
kind of “mission” what-so-ever this time around but
I’m still having such a hard time focusing on
anything I don’t really feel like doing especially
work. Its like I become paralyzed. I know I could
and have blamed that on being totally exhausted for
the past three weeks from lack of sleep and getting
my head broken open once again but now I’m sleeping
again and I’m not all that tired at least in
comparison to how I was a week or so ago. I just
don’t know what to do with myself. I certainly don’t
feel like using or anything but my life can go to
shit almost as fast if I don’t figure this one out.
Howard, I might have mentioned this to you but I was
diagnosed with ADD as a kid and never treated (you
know, M.D. father who refused to put a label like
that on his kid) Anyway I was wondering what you
think about someone being treated with medication
for something like that post Ibo or should I just
try to ride this out? -m.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
nice trip for some hell ride for most. nothing like
ibogaine.

Max Vogel <somethinginternational@gmail.com> wrote:
My dog ate one of those and has been mellow ever
since.

On 5/2/05, matthew zielinski wrote:

Hi

Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies
and what kind of experience
compared to ibo.

Namaste
Matt

________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r)
Calendar. MSN Premium: Join
now and get the first two months FREE*

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam
protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] -ot- Instant Karma
Date: May 2, 2005 at 1:34:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

12:03 AM CDT on Saturday, April 30, 2005

From Staff Reports

A Dallas police officer accidentally shocked himself
with a Taser on
Friday morning but was not injured. After chasing a
suspect in a
stolen vehicle, a southeast patrol senior corporal was
attempting to
put his Taser gun back into his holster when it went
off and sent a
jolt of electricity through his body, knocking him to
the ground.
Police declined to release the eight-year veteran’s
name. The car
theft suspect was captured.

by Tanya Eiserer

________________________________________________________________________
________________________________________________________________________

Message: 2
Date: Sun, 01 May 2005 18:39:17 -0500
From: Don Teague <me@donteague.com>
Subject: Re: Police Officer Accidentally Uses Taser on
Himself

WFAA had video on this. Friday night, if I’m not
mistaken.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ADD and Ibogaine
Date: May 2, 2005 at 1:34:23 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I’ve joked with many people familiar with Ibogaine in the past year about ADD being one of the side affects of post treatment and although its kinda funny I’m getting to the point where I might need some serious help with this. I’m making a concerted effort to sit with my thoughts and not be on any kind of “mission” what-so-ever this time around but I’m still having such a hard time focusing on anything I don’t really feel like doing especially work. Its like I become paralyzed. I know I could and have blamed that on being totally exhausted for the past three weeks from lack of sleep and getting my head broken open once again but now I’m sleeping again and I’m not all that tired at least in comparison to how I was a week or so ago. I just don’t know what to do with myself. I certainly don’t feel like using or anything but my life can go to shit almost as fast if I don’t figure this one out.
Howard, I might have mentioned this to you but I was diagnosed with ADD as a kid and never treated (you know, M.D. father who refused to put a label like that on his kid) Anyway I was wondering what you think about someone being treated with medication for something like that post Ibo or should I just try to ride this out? -m.

mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com> wrote:
nice trip for some hell ride for most. nothing like ibogaine.

Max Vogel <somethinginternational@gmail.com> wrote:
My dog ate one of those and has been mellow ever since.

On 5/2/05, matthew zielinski wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Hi
>
> Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of experience
> compared to ibo.
>
> Namaste
> Matt
>
>
> ________________________________
> Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r) Calendar. MSN Premium: Join
> now and get the first two months FREE*
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 2, 2005 at 1:12:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

nice trip for some hell ride for most. nothing like ibogaine.

Max Vogel <somethinginternational@gmail.com> wrote:
My dog ate one of those and has been mellow ever since.

On 5/2/05, matthew zielinski wrote:
>
>
>
>
> Hi
>
> Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of experience
> compared to ibo.
>
> Namaste
> Matt
>
>
> ________________________________
> Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r) Calendar. MSN Premium: Join
> now and get the first two months FREE*
> /]=———————————————————————=[\
> [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> \]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Max Vogel <somethinginternational@gmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 2, 2005 at 11:00:07 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

My dog ate one of those and has been mellow ever since.

On 5/2/05, matthew zielinski <mattzielinski@hotmail.com> wrote:

Hi

Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of experience
compared to ibo.

Namaste
Matt

________________________________
Take the effort out of being organized with MSN(r) Calendar. MSN Premium: Join
now and get the first two months FREE*
/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Amanita Muscaria
Date: May 2, 2005 at 10:09:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi
Was wondering if anyone here taken these puppies and what kind of experience compared to ibo.
Namaste
Matt

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] using
Date: May 2, 2005 at 10:03:53 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi
this weekend i also used…..was cooking up speedballs through the whole weekend…….i wish that warm feeling would just go away….after my first ibo exp i was persuading my self tothink that heroin and everything is pure nonsense….i wanted desperetly to believe that the rush is nothing and partly suceseded because i used once after that and didnt like it…..but now after this weekend well i have a different opinion once again…thank god its all opinions but i dont know………im sick and weak from this condition………..i realize that now its only will power and nothing else because im not physicaly depended yet–thank god—but give it a week of daily debucheries and the demon starts to plead……come to think of it since i woke up the only thing on my mind is shooting up—–im ashamed to admit it but it is——-its really fucken difuclt when all u know to do really well is how to use, how to be a junky, i better get my ass up and go to work.
Namaste

Matt

Free yourself from those irritating pop-up ads with MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “matthew zielinski” <mattzielinski@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sleeping
Date: May 2, 2005 at 9:53:21 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi all

The sleeping issue  was very different for me  The first 15 days or so after ibo i didint sleep an hour and was exhausested all the time.  all i wanted to do is sleep a mere hour, half hour but no, the Eboga spirit had other plans for me…….”now you will think about your past mistakes and better learn from them u fool” thats what it felt like ……….but no matter what time i tried to go to bed morning afternoon night etc no sleep woud come…..then after more than 2 weeks i began to sleep regularly for no more than 2 hours….. i would go to bed at around 9 at night wake up usually 11……and that was that for about month then slowly very slowly back to normal…..it was pure hell no matter how much i persuaded my self to think i needed it…..
Namaste
matthew

>From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk> >Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com >To: ibogaine@mindvox.com >Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sleeping >Date: Mon, 2 May 2005 12:08:22 +0100 (BST) > >Hi Jane, > >I found that very interesting also. Myself I find I like to sleep during the day when I feel my energy drop and then wake refreshed. Mediterranean siesta has a lot to offer. It’s like 2 days in one. After an ibogaine session I will sometimes sleep the sleep of a baby during the day. Yet I do go for the night time sleep. Ibogaine resets in many ways – why not back to a more natural sleep cycle which of course we can lose as we readapt to the “normal” sleep cycle. > >Lee > >HSLotsof@aol.com wrote: >Hi Jane, > >Very well put. We all do function on wake/sleep cycles for which we are >societally trained from kindergarten on. Possibly, ibogaine does return us to >natural cycles. Very interesting! > >Howard > >In a message dated 5/1/05 8:01:56 PM, jellking@yahoo.com writes: > > >Hi iboga-mates. I haven’t posted here in donkey years, but I wanted to > >share an insight re the sleep thing. Won’t help everyone, might not help > >anyone, but here it is: After ibogaine, I was WIDE awake, partly I think, > >on a really simple level, ibo had just upset my sleep cycle. But I decided > >to trust its “wisdom,” and I was fortunate enough to be in a situation > >where I didn’t have to do a 9 to 5. At the time, I was teaching a class > >from 8 am to 11 every day, and then had about 4-infinity hours of prep > >and grading. All activities for which it is necessary to be alert. I > >made a decision to allow myself (other than during the actual commute and > >classroom hours) to just sleep when I wanted to, and not sleep when I didn’t > >want to. Of course, I was single, no children, so I wasn’t needing to > >attend to others. What happened really surprised me, though. For about > >3-4 months, I wanted to sleep (once I gave myself the privilege of listening > >to the ol’ bod’s desires) very early at > > night. I was usually asleep by 9 pm. I wouild sleep for like 4 or 5 or > >6 hours, then wake up. OK at 3-6 am I did all the prep and grading work > >(and quite well, actually) that I used to do in the afternoons and evenings. > > Then would go teach, then come home, eat lunch, and often take a nap of > >very high quality for 2-3 hours. The point here, though, isn’t my schedule > >at all; this worked for me, but the point was, I just for the first time > >since probably infancy said, “sleep when you’re tired, and don’t when you > >aren’t.” Regardless, ya know? never slept better, never felt more awake > >when awake. > > > >I think Ibo experiences may help set your circadian rhythms back to what > >they want to be. > >We live in this 9-5 world, but we aren’t all “set” that way. For me, it > >felt really good to take away the anxiety of sleeping or not sleeping by > >just telling myself, at least for now, not to have any pressure or stress > >about it. Sleep when you’re sleepy; don’t when you’re not. Of course, > >eventually I became more “normally” emplyed and had to adjust. But by > >then the “ibo sleepless” crisis was really gone. I still employ this > >however. If I awaken at 2 and don’t feel sleepy, I don’t sleep. It might > >mean I drag my very large ass around for a day, but you bet I’m ready to > >sleep when I next “should.” In short, ibogaine helped me adjust from a > >lifetime of insomnia to a more realistic attitude re sleep. > > > >The other thing was the dreams, wow and wow again. I never dreamed so > >brilliantly and significantly, or remembered them so well, as the immediate > >post-ibo time. I imagine others have experience that too. And I think > >that when we dream to capacity, the need for sleep is lessened. I don’t > >base this on scientific discoveries, it’s just my personal observation. > > It’s like sleeping was waking, with rest. I coiuldn’t wait to go to >sleep…. > > >/]=———————————————————————=[\ >[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] >\]=———————————————————————=[/ > > > > >My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com >Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period. > > >www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html >Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc: >www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

Take the effort out of being organized with MSNŪ Calendar. MSN Premium: Join now and get the first two months FREE* /]=———————————————————————=[\ [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%] \]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 2, 2005 at 7:15:37 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Kurt,
I am curious how many sessions have you had?
Also, with the help of a friend it should be reasonably easy for you to have another session as you have already been there. Ibogaine becomes much, much safer with repeated us imo. Why not spend a couple of hundred bucks on another private (own organised)  session that will leave you on a high (possibly giving you insight into what the major issue is with you right now) rather than putting your money into trash that poisons the body?
Matt has a contact for ibogaine I believe in Toronto (which he mentioned before on this list or another).
I know if I were in your shoes I would be right out the door looking to cop some ibo and not more shit.
Lee

“m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net> wrote:
Kurt,
I understand the isolation thing as part of ones addiction, however it seems you didn’t do that.  Instead you went around to your support system cause you knew they would see the obvious.
My take on your not taking the free one and going out to cop is not the choice of danger over ease, but a noncomittal act over taking the free one “first”. That in a way is a commitment to set up a buy/sell scenario that would have a future. You didn’t do that.
Then you posted here.   So I believe that’s 3 for 3….all good.
A pebble in the road.  It’s behind you.  Your path ahead.
Considering the circumstance by which you stopped 36 days ago I think you have amazing strength and resolve.
A new beginning can start in a second, an hour or a day.  It’s all good.
You are a hero.
Eboga, Eboga,Eboga, Love,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: KURT BRECHTER
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 2:04 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Not only that,
On day 30 like clock work the dealer I haven’t herad from in 3 years (who’s kids I put through parochiol school) calls. “the first ones free”
I resist for 6 days. Needless to say alot of heavy shit came down on Me and once again ‘I DESERVED it”    WHAT KINDA shit is that?I deserve a bag of death???? Well the sick mother fucker I am I say “Yeah You Do”???????????
So, I don’t even take the free shit, I put Myself at all kinda risk to go “COP”.
Like I said I’m sick.
I get High, I take a look on the mirror a couple of hours later and there HE is. That same scheming mother fucker I hate.
Now with the (O.D.) overdone it and regretful headache I sit here trying to understand just a small fraction.
I even told another dope fiend,”yeah I fucked up but I only had a half an opium supository?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck??????????????????
I can’t do this to Myself again, But My track record sucks.
I think I’m finished for tonight, But You never know
peas and love  Kurt

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: Lee Albert <my-eboga@yahoo.co.uk>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sleeping
Date: May 2, 2005 at 7:08:22 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jane,

I found that very interesting also. Myself I find I like to sleep during the day when I feel my energy drop and then wake refreshed. Mediterranean siesta has a lot to offer. It’s like 2 days in one. After an ibogaine session I will sometimes sleep the sleep of a baby during the day. Yet I do go for the night time sleep. Ibogaine resets in many ways – why not back to a more natural sleep cycle which of course we can lose as we readapt to the “normal” sleep cycle.

Lee

HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
Hi Jane,

Very well put. We all do function on wake/sleep cycles for which we are
societally trained from kindergarten on. Possibly, ibogaine does return us to
natural cycles. Very interesting!

Howard

In a message dated 5/1/05 8:01:56 PM, jellking@yahoo.com writes:

>Hi iboga-mates. I haven’t posted here in donkey years, but I wanted to
>share an insight re the sleep thing. Won’t help everyone, might not help
>anyone, but here it is: After ibogaine, I was WIDE awake, partly I think,
>on a really simple level, ibo had just upset my sleep cycle. But I decided
>to trust its “wisdom,” and I was fortunate enough to be in a situation
>where I didn’t have to do a 9 to 5. At the time, I was teaching a class
>from 8 am to 11 every day, and then had about 4-infinity hours of prep
>and grading. All activities for which it is necessary to be alert. I
>made a decision to allow myself (other than during the actual commute and
>classroom hours) to just sleep when I wanted to, and not sleep when I didn’t
>want to. Of course, I was single, no children, so I wasn’t needing to
>attend to others. What happened really surprised me, though. For about
>3-4 months, I wanted to sleep (once I gave myself the privilege of listening
>to the ol’ bod’s desires) very early at
> night. I was usually asleep by 9 pm. I wouild sleep for like 4 or 5 or
>6 hours, then wake up. OK at 3-6 am I did all the prep and grading work
>(and quite well, actually) that I used to do in the afternoons and evenings.
> Then would go teach, then come home, eat lunch, and often take a nap of
>very high quality for 2-3 hours. The point here, though, isn’t my schedule
>at all; this worked for me, but the point was, I just for the first time
>since probably infancy said, “sleep when you’re tired, and don’t when you
>aren’t.” Regardless, ya know? never slept better, never felt more awake
>when awake.
>
>I think Ibo experiences may help set your circadian rhythms back to what
>they want to be.
>We live in this 9-5 world, but we aren’t all “set” that way. For me, it
>felt really good to take away the anxiety of sleeping or not sleeping by
>just telling myself, at least for now, not to have any pressure or stress
>about it. Sleep when you’re sleepy; don’t when you’re not. Of course,
>eventually I became more “normally” emplyed and had to adjust. But by
>then the “ibo sleepless” crisis was really gone. I still employ this
>however. If I awaken at 2 and don’t feel sleepy, I don’t sleep. It might
>mean I drag my very large ass around for a day, but you bet I’m ready to
>sleep when I next “should.” In short, ibogaine helped me adjust from a
>lifetime of insomnia to a more realistic attitude re sleep.
>
>The other thing was the dreams, wow and wow again. I never dreamed so
>brilliantly and significantly, or remembered them so well, as the immediate
>post-ibo time. I imagine others have experience that too. And I think
>that when we dream to capacity, the need for sleep is lessened. I don’t
>base this on scientific discoveries, it’s just my personal observation.
> It’s like sleeping was waking, with rest. I coiuldn’t wait to go to
sleep….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

My Eboga: A website dedicated to practical guidance and spiritual interpretation of the eboga experience. Includes a mailing list for those already initiated into eboga: www.my-eboga.com
Amazing Grace: A true story based on the use of eboga / ibogaine over a six year period.
www.my-eboga.com/amazinggrace.html
Free copies of Amazing Grace available here for members of the media / librarians etc:
www.my-eboga.com/freecopy.html

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Speaking of….
Date: May 2, 2005 at 1:43:08 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

He hasn’t said much of anything in a year or more, he used to write
here, so did a lot of h4xors. I think around 2003 they realized
everything was about ibogaine and drugs now and gave up on Mindvox ever
reopening again as the  hacker underground stronghold.

He posts announcements and updates but doesn’t talk here too much
anymore. Patrick come home 🙂

.:vector:.

— Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com> wrote:
Does Pat Kroupa still post on this list?   Knew him in passing from
the BBS a long time ago, wondering if he’s managing to stay clean.

/]

=———————————————————————

=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/
IbogaineList.html [%]
\]

=———————————————————————

=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Carlton B <carltonb@mindspring.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Speaking of….
Date: May 2, 2005 at 1:00:18 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Does Pat Kroupa still post on this list?   Knew him in passing from the BBS a long time ago, wondering if he’s managing to stay clean.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “orangesun Barrel” <kaliorangemist710@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Patrick and crutches!
Date: May 2, 2005 at 12:43:35 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Pam i don’t know who you are or who patrick was but i offer my sincere condolences to you and i believe that you will see him again …..

arlo

“men spend their days in big houses, and big cars trying to forget about birth and death”
Keroooouac

From: “Pam Paperno” <pam@lviue.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Patrick and crutches!
Date: Thu, 28 Apr 2005 08:52:50 -0700

It is wrong that lives are lost in the quest for freedom–from drugs, from
ignorance, from oppression, especially when so many of them could (and
should) be prevented.
Patrick had seven near death experiences in his life.  He had been through
the Door many times, and always came back.  I have to believe he thought he
would this time, too, but it slammed shut behind him.
Preston, I, too thank God you didn’t die.  You give much to many, and are
greatly loved.  Perhaps you have never realized that being someone to love
can be as important as being someone who loves.  Think on that.
Pam
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 10:40 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Patrick and crutches!

> Pam wrote in understandable frustration (it seems like frustration at
least
> and I cannot even begin to question it at all) >If his passing provides
> information that saves someone else’s life down the
> line, he would be pleased.  I will still be pissed off, but would at least
> be able to say SOMETHING good came of it.<
>
> I for one am pretty freaked out by this as is V, and both of us continue
to
> send you our love Pam.
>
> All who have taken ibogaine to kick or whatever the reason have been
> conducting a nifty little experiement, because as was pointed out
yesterday
> by someone here, the FDA and US gov won’t do it for us. So we’ve all been
> “willing” test subjects. (What is the rate of death from taking ibogaine
in
> original form amongst the Gabonese? Did I spell that right?) Were the FDA
> doing the experimenting, we’d be getting paid rather than scraping and
> saving and suffering to pay our own substantial fees-with the risk of
dying
> involved. Yes, I know shooting drugs also kills, as does simply walking
out
> of their apartment in Manhattan in some people’s cases, but jesus fucking
> christ this is terrible.
>
> Patrick apparently wasn’t dying (or maybe he was and we just don’t yet
know
> it- considering the messages about kitchen table surgeries and the diet
and
> the like it does sound like he was not being exactly healthy-living guy)
up
> until day before yesterday, he was simply medicating (granted in not that
> neat and tidy a fashion) and being made a criminal because of it. Because
he
> had been told all his life that it was the WRONG fucking thing to do, he
> felt it necessary to take a drug we all know has some serious risks to it,
> to “free” himself from the OTHER fucking drugs. I am so pissed off,
> frustrated, extremely sad, angry, and amazingly enough, I just toasted V
> this second with the words,
>
> “Thank god I didn’t die.”
>
> Then I heard myself saying this and was honestly shocked, in that I’ve
> always kinda thought in the very back, deepest undiscussed parts of my
mind
> that is what I’ve long wanted, to die, but I guess not.
>
> So again Pam, I am saddened to find this out, and am grateful for having
had
> the opportunity to actualy hear his voice. V too is feeling shaken by this
> turn of events, feeling a wide assortment of emotions too over this, many
of
> the same ones I myself listed above, and we’re both of us thinking a lot
> about you.
>
> Peace and love,
> Preston
>
> “Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
> mistaken for madness”
> Richard Davenport-Hines
>
> ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
> Editor http://www.drugwar.com
> Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
> Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
> Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
> Cont. High Times mag/.com
> Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
> Columnist New York Waste
> Etc.
>
> —– Original Message —–
> From: <darkmattersfo@comcast.net>
> To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 1:31 AM
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Patrick and crutches!
>
>
> > Pam, I don’t know you are your husband but my heart reaches out to you.
I
> > am so sorry for your loss. I wish I had some way to make this easier. –
> > Mark
> >
> >
> >> I am so sorry to say that it is true.  We don’t know at this point
> >> exactly
> >> what caused it.  The coroner’s office has agree to provide me with a
copy
> >> of
> >> their report, when it becomes available.  I will certainly share their
> >> findings.
> >> Know this:  Early yesterday morning, Patrick was exhausted, but did
speak
> >> to
> >> me to say, “I know I’m finally free.  I don’t have to use again.  I
love
> >> you, and I’m sorry I’m just too tired to talk.”
> >> I am angry that he’s gone, but I will say this.  I know him better than
> >> anyone else, and I know he would far rather have died a free man than
> >> lived
> >> a slave.
> >> If his passing provides information that saves someone else’s life down
> >> the
> >> line, he would be pleased.  I will still be pissed off, but would at
> >> least
> >> be able to say SOMETHING good came of it.
> >> Pam
> >> —– Original Message —–
> >> From: “Carlton B” <carltonb@mindspring.com>
> >> To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
> >> Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 5:58 PM
> >> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Patrick and crutches!
> >>
> >>
> >> > I guess I am trying to process this, waiting for someone to say “just
> >> kidding” or something…
> >> > Do you really mean to tell us your husband died 3 days after taking
> >> > ibo?
> >> I’m sorry even to question it; I hope you understand that on the
internet
> >> there are a lot of people who would perpetuate cruel hoaxes like this,
> >> just
> >> to wind up people who post in good faith.  So when I hear news like
this,
> >> I
> >> hope it isn’t true, and my first reaction is to disbelieve it.  And
again
> >> I
> >> apologize for that.
> >> >
> >> > If it’s indeed true, I offer my deepest condolences.    I don’t know
if
> >> iboga was responsible, honestly, but the circumstances do give cause
for
> >> wondering.   What I do know is that there is a risk in experimentation,
> >> and
> >> because the FDA shirks its responsibility in testing innovative
> >> treatments,
> >> that burden of risk must be taken on by people like you and me.    It
is
> >> small comfort to you, but it’s possible that in the discovery process
you
> >> will discover information that could prevent this happening to someone
> >> else.
> >> I hope you’ll consider sharing any new knowledge that you uncover.
> >> >
> >> > Regards,
> >> > Carlton
> >> >
> >> > —–Original Message—–
> >> > From: Pam Paperno <pam@lviue.com>
> >> > Sent: Apr 27, 2005 8:56 AM
> >> > To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> >> > Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Re: Patrick and crutches!
> >> >
> >> > Sadly, Patrick passed away yesterday.  It was very sudden, and we
won’t
> >> > really know what happened until the coroner’s report is ready in 6-8
> >> weeks.
> >> > Pam
> >> > —– Original Message —–
> >> > From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
> >> > To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
> >> > Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 6:16 AM
> >> > Subject: [Ibogaine] Re: Patrick and crutches!
> >> >
> >> >
> >> > > By the way, Patrick sitting upright yet, or is he still prostrate?
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> >> >  [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> >> > http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> >> [%]
> >> >
> >>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
> >> >
> >> >
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> >>  [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
> >> http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
> >>
> >>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
> >
> >
/]=———————————————————————=[\
> > [%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
> > [%]
> >
> >
\]=———————————————————————=[/
> >
> >
>
>
>
>
/]=———————————————————————=[\
>  [%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]
>
\]=———————————————————————=[/
>
>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

_________________________________________________________________
Express yourself instantly with MSN Messenger! Download today – it’s FREE! http://messenger.msn.click-url.com/go/onm00200471ave/direct/01/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 1, 2005 at 10:57:35 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yeah martee,
I”ve come to a couple of realizations (while trying not to think too much) It was a moment, it’s over,theres another coming and I’m going to try and stay in it. No more counting days, It’s a pitfall for Me. Ibeginagain….Heros all
peas and love Kurt
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 10:33 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Kurt,
I understand the isolation thing as part of ones addiction, however it seems you didn’t do that.  Instead you went around to your support system cause you knew they would see the obvious.
My take on your not taking the free one and going out to cop is not the choice of danger over ease, but a noncomittal act over taking the free one “first”. That in a way is a commitment to set up a buy/sell scenario that would have a future. You didn’t do that.
Then you posted here.   So I believe that’s 3 for 3….all good.
A pebble in the road.  It’s behind you.  Your path ahead.
Considering the circumstance by which you stopped 36 days ago I think you have amazing strength and resolve.
A new beginning can start in a second, an hour or a day.  It’s all good.
You are a hero.
Eboga, Eboga,Eboga, Love,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: KURT BRECHTER
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 2:04 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Not only that,
On day 30 like clock work the dealer I haven’t herad from in 3 years (who’s kids I put through parochiol school) calls. “the first ones free”
I resist for 6 days. Needless to say alot of heavy shit came down on Me and once again ‘I DESERVED it”    WHAT KINDA shit is that?I deserve a bag of death???? Well the sick mother fucker I am I say “Yeah You Do”???????????
So, I don’t even take the free shit, I put Myself at all kinda risk to go “COP”.
Like I said I’m sick.
I get High, I take a look on the mirror a couple of hours later and there HE is. That same scheming mother fucker I hate.
Now with the (O.D.) overdone it and regretful headache I sit here trying to understand just a small fraction.
I even told another dope fiend,”yeah I fucked up but I only had a half an opium supository?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck??????????????????
I can’t do this to Myself again, But My track record sucks.
I think I’m finished for tonight, But You never know
peas and love  Kurt

From: “m.finman” <mafinman@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 1, 2005 at 10:33:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Kurt,
I understand the isolation thing as part of ones addiction, however it seems you didn’t do that.  Instead you went around to your support system cause you knew they would see the obvious.
My take on your not taking the free one and going out to cop is not the choice of danger over ease, but a noncomittal act over taking the free one “first”. That in a way is a commitment to set up a buy/sell scenario that would have a future. You didn’t do that.
Then you posted here.   So I believe that’s 3 for 3….all good.
A pebble in the road.  It’s behind you.  Your path ahead.
Considering the circumstance by which you stopped 36 days ago I think you have amazing strength and resolve.
A new beginning can start in a second, an hour or a day.  It’s all good.
You are a hero.
Eboga, Eboga,Eboga, Love,
Martee
—– Original Message —–
From: KURT BRECHTER
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 2:04 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Not only that………

Not only that,
On day 30 like clock work the dealer I haven’t herad from in 3 years (who’s kids I put through parochiol school) calls. “the first ones free”
I resist for 6 days. Needless to say alot of heavy shit came down on Me and once again ‘I DESERVED it”    WHAT KINDA shit is that?I deserve a bag of death???? Well the sick mother fucker I am I say “Yeah You Do”???????????
So, I don’t even take the free shit, I put Myself at all kinda risk to go “COP”.
Like I said I’m sick.
I get High, I take a look on the mirror a couple of hours later and there HE is. That same scheming mother fucker I hate.
Now with the (O.D.) overdone it and regretful headache I sit here trying to understand just a small fraction.
I even told another dope fiend,”yeah I fucked up but I only had a half an opium supository?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck??????????????????
I can’t do this to Myself again, But My track record sucks.
I think I’m finished for tonight, But You never know
peas and love  Kurt

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sleeping
Date: May 1, 2005 at 9:21:45 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi Jane,

Very well put.  We all do function on wake/sleep cycles for which we are
societally trained from kindergarten on.  Possibly, ibogaine does return us to
natural cycles.  Very interesting!

Howard

In a message dated 5/1/05 8:01:56 PM, jellking@yahoo.com writes:

Hi iboga-mates.  I haven’t posted here in donkey years, but I wanted to
share an insight re the sleep thing.  Won’t help everyone, might not help
anyone, but here it is:  After ibogaine, I was WIDE awake, partly I think,
on a really simple level, ibo had just upset my sleep cycle.  But I decided
to trust its “wisdom,” and I was fortunate enough to be in a situation
where I didn’t have to do a 9 to 5.  At the time, I was teaching a class
from 8 am to 11 every day, and then had about 4-infinity hours of prep
and grading.  All activities for which it is necessary to be alert.  I
made a decision to allow myself (other than during the actual commute and
classroom hours) to just sleep when I wanted to, and not sleep when I didn’t
want to.  Of course, I was single, no children, so I wasn’t needing to
attend to others.  What happened really surprised me, though.  For about
3-4 months, I wanted to sleep (once I gave myself the privilege of listening
to the ol’ bod’s desires) very early at
night. I was usually asleep by 9 pm.  I wouild sleep for like 4 or 5 or
6 hours, then wake up.  OK at 3-6 am I did all the prep and grading work
(and quite well, actually) that I used to do in the afternoons and evenings.
Then would go teach, then come home, eat lunch, and often take a nap of
very high quality for 2-3 hours.  The point here, though, isn’t my schedule
at all; this worked for me, but the point was, I just for the first time
since probably infancy said, “sleep when you’re tired, and don’t when you
aren’t.”  Regardless, ya know?  never slept better, never felt more awake
when awake.

I think Ibo experiences may help set your circadian rhythms back to what
they want to be.
We live in this 9-5 world, but we aren’t all “set” that way.  For me, it
felt really good to take away the anxiety of sleeping or not sleeping by
just telling myself, at least for now, not to have any pressure or stress
about it.  Sleep when you’re sleepy; don’t when you’re not.  Of course,
eventually I became more “normally” emplyed and had to adjust.  But by
then the “ibo sleepless” crisis was really gone.  I still employ this
however.  If I awaken at 2 and don’t feel sleepy, I don’t sleep.  It might
mean I drag my very large ass around for a day, but you bet I’m ready to
sleep when I next “should.”  In short, ibogaine helped me adjust from a
lifetime of insomnia to a more realistic attitude re sleep.

The other thing was the dreams, wow and wow again.  I never dreamed so
brilliantly and significantly, or remembered them so well, as the immediate
post-ibo time.  I imagine others have experience that too.  And I think
that when we dream to capacity, the need for sleep is lessened.  I don’t
base this on scientific discoveries, it’s just my personal observation.
It’s like sleeping was waking, with rest.  I coiuldn’t wait to go to
sleep….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: Dr Jay Cavanaugh
Date: May 1, 2005 at 8:12:48 PM EDT
To: “Newsroom-L” <newsroom-l@lists.netspace.org>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —– From: JCavana857@aol.com
To: ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 10:16 AM
Subject: Dr Jay Cavanaugh

COME CELEBRATE
THE LIFE OF DR. JAY R. CAVANAUGH
It is with great joy that my family  invites you to celebrate the  life of our Dr. Jay . Come one and all, May 7th -8th  to the home of Judy and Lynn Osburn. A life celebration in the Irish tradition with friends, family, music, good food and drink but most importantly an honest celebration of life, liberty, strength, courage and compassion. Please RSVP (we want to be able to feed everyone!) to either myself or my mom by calling (818) 346-4493 or my cell at (818) 635-1008 or e-mail to jcavana857@aol.com.
Thank you to everyone for your love and support.
Jp

Directions below
From Santa Maria:

From Hwy. 101 about 2 miles north of Santa Maria
Take Hwy 166 east.  Travel about 70 miles to Hwy. 33.
Turn right on Hwy 33 (towards Ojai).
Drive about 25 miles south on Hwy 33.
Turn left on Lockwood Valley Road at the green “to Lockwood Valley” and “to Interstate 5” sign.
Our driveway is 3.5 miles on the left (north) side of the road, under the Scheideck Lodge sign (directly across the street from the turn-off to Scheideck Lodge and Reyes Creek Campground).   The gravel driveway leads the 1/4 mile through an aluminum gate to our tan 2-story house.

If you’re coming from Ventura, Hwy 33 is still closed north of Ojai, so you will need to take Hwy 126 east to Intersate 5 North.

Directions from Los Angeles (Interstate 5):
Take Interstate 5 North

Take Frazier Park exit (about 3 miles north of  Gorman, the road goes only west,
called Frazier Mt. Way).

Go west about 6 miles to Lockwood Valley Road, turn left (look for green
sign on right “To Lockwood Valley”) on Lockwood Valley Road (west).

Our dirt driveway is located on Lockwood Valley Road about 26 miles from the Frazier Mt. Way turnoff. It’s on the north side (right) of Lockwood Valley Road at mileage marker 3.51,* directly across from the Reyes Creek Campground/Scheideck Lodge turnoff. The sign to Scheideck Lodge is next to our driveway. Turn right, the driveway becomes gravel once through aluminum gate. Follow the gravel road straight to our two-story tan house.

*(The mileage markers are on some of the white reflectors along the road,
labeled at the top either VEN or VC once in Ventura County, with a vertical
two-decimal-point mileage.)

Lockwood Valley Road ends at Hwy. 33, just 3.5 miles west of us, so if you
miss our driveway you only have to backtrack the 3.5 miles.

If you’re coming from the north on Interstate 5 you can either take the Frazier Park exit from Interstate 5 (above), or you can come through Maricopa:
Take Hwy 119 exit toward Taft,
Turn left on Old River Road (toward Maricopa)
At end of Old River Road turn right onto Hwy 166 (west)
Hwy 166 west joins with Hwy 33 south for 15 miles beginning at Maricopa (more or less, miles are a complete guess for this route).
Turn left onto Hwy 33 at the green sign “to Ojai.” (where Hwy 33 splits from 166).
Drive about 25 miles south on 33.
Turn left on Lockwood Valley Road at the green “to Lockwood Valley” and “to Interstate 5” sign.
Our driveway is 3.5 miles on the left (north) side of the road under the Scheideck Lodge sign.

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com>
Subject: RE: [Ibogaine] Sleeping
Date: May 1, 2005 at 8:00:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Hi iboga-mates.  I haven’t posted here in donkey years, but I wanted to share an insight re the sleep thing.  Won’t help everyone, might not help anyone, but here it is:  After ibogaine, I was WIDE awake, partly I think, on a really simple level, ibo had just upset my sleep cycle.  But I decided to trust its “wisdom,” and I was fortunate enough to be in a situation where I didn’t have to do a 9 to 5.  At the time, I was teaching a class from 8 am to 11 every day, and then had about 4-infinity hours of prep and grading.  All activities for which it is necessary to be alert.  I made a decision to allow myself (other than during the actual commute and classroom hours) to just sleep when I wanted to, and not sleep when I didn’t want to.  Of course, I was single, no children, so I wasn’t needing to attend to others.  What happened really surprised me, though.  For about 3-4 months, I wanted to sleep (once I gave myself the privilege of listening to the ol’ bod’s desires) very early at night. I was usually asleep by 9 pm.  I wouild sleep for like 4 or 5 or 6 hours, then wake up.  OK at 3-6 am I did all the prep and grading work (and quite well, actually) that I used to do in the afternoons and evenings.  Then would go teach, then come home, eat lunch, and often take a nap of very high quality for 2-3 hours.  The point here, though, isn’t my schedule at all; this worked for me, but the point was, I just for the first time since probably infancy said, “sleep when you’re tired, and don’t when you aren’t.”  Regardless, ya know?  never slept better, never felt more awake when awake.

I think Ibo experiences may help set your circadian rhythms back to what they want to be.
We live in this 9-5 world, but we aren’t all “set” that way.  For me, it felt really good to take away the anxiety of sleeping or not sleeping by just telling myself, at least for now, not to have any pressure or stress about it.  Sleep when you’re sleepy; don’t when you’re not.  Of course, eventually I became more “normally” emplyed and had to adjust.  But by then the “ibo sleepless” crisis was really gone.  I still employ this  however.  If I awaken at 2 and don’t feel sleepy, I don’t sleep.  It might mean I drag my very large ass around for a day, but you bet I’m ready to sleep when I next “should.”  In short, ibogaine helped me adjust from a lifetime of insomnia to a more realistic attitude re sleep.

The other thing was the dreams, wow and wow again.  I never dreamed so brilliantly and significantly, or remembered them so well, as the immediate post-ibo time.  I imagine others have experience that too.  And I think that when we dream to capacity, the need for sleep is lessened.  I don’t base this on scientific discoveries, it’s just my personal observation.  It’s like sleeping was waking, with rest.  I coiuldn’t wait to go to sleep….

Love to all you Transformers, Jane

Nick Sandberg <nick227@tiscali.co.uk> wrote:

> —–Original Message—–
> From: Carla Barnes [mailto:carlambarnes@yahoo.com]
> Sent: 29 April 2005 18:23
> To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
> Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Sleeping
>
>
> Hi again Mark, I haven’t read the list lately and saw
> your sleeping messages. I think having trouble getting
> to sleep after ibogaine happens to nearly everyone, it
> drove me crazy at the time. I have a message from last
> fall which I’m forwarding in this, but this isn’t the
> one I read, it was another one Patrick wrote I think
> in 2003, I’ll try to find it, I have a “sleep!” folder
> 🙂
>
> I’m not sure if what’s in this one is the same as the
> other one, but the first one is what worked for me.
> I’ve been clean more then 2 years now and use
> melatonin every night, I smoke pot 🙂 I sometimes use
> unisom.
>
> Love to everyone here!
>
> Carla B
>

Hi everybody,

Personally, it’s my opinion that if you can’t sleep after ibogaine then
probably the drug isn’t really finished with you yet. What I see is that
when people can’t sleep it’s usually because, at a deeper level, something
is trying to shift – some unconscious pattern, some repressed feelings, an
inner child that wants its voice heard, whatever. The time has come when it
wants to move and depriving you of sleep is one of the ways it has to try
and break you down and let the feelings come through.

In group therapy, we keep people up all night – partying, doing emotional
release, bioenergetics, other stuff – sometimes for nights on end. It helps
things move. You don’t actually need to sleep – the physical body has no
need of it, that’s my opinion and the opinion of others I trust. It’s just
that stuff starts to rise and one way to switch it off is to feel tired and
pass out. If you keep the body moving, then feelings keep processing and
awareness rises. If you let it switch off and sleep then the processing
stops.

If I were running iboga sessions I would be putting people straight into the
group room pretty much as soon as they’ve come down – screaming, shouting,
dancing, running around, acting like kids – Bwiti style. The drug will
always try and rebirth you, try to leave you all shiny and new and feeling
like a little newborn baby and this is a very precious space, too good to
waste. If you watch the African guys they are moving all the time. They
don’t stop, maybe for days on end. That’s what I saw in the Cameroun. If you
stop you lose it and I figure the sleeplessness kicks in to try and drag you
back.

Nick

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????
Date: May 1, 2005 at 6:00:05 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

yes preston one day one moment…..
You are right My brother and I value Your council as well as All I have
received from everyone Here.
No beatings of any Kind. Kindness to Myself and others is the only true way.
peas and love   Kurt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 5:45 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????

It’s one day Kurt.
Don’t tell yourself “it’s off to the races” just like that please, I write
with opinionated firmness. Even if you do use again, or “fuck up” as I
like
to call it when I do similar things, it’s still just one more day, and can
still be stopped at any point. Each time is one, alone, only “real” that
one
moment, then it’s gone and you=;r already a different Kurt than the one
who
used just moments before- especially, as you told me yourself, after being
initiated by ibogaine, we’re never the same again, so use that thought to
your advenatage if possible.
But again, as I noted earlier today elsewere, and hear you say it to,
“no beating youself up over it,” ok?
Thanks. and you know for you, if I hear you on the machine and I’m here I
will pick up, always, as I do with a very, very fselect few others. You’re
on my list, so please feel free to call me any time, any hour, and if I
hear
you I will pick up, cell pone or home phone, either one.
Be safe, and I’ll talk to and see you tomorrow I’m assuming.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —–
From: KURT BRECHTER
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 12:54 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] ?????????

I used, I walked away from 30 mg. of methadone 36 days ago and I used
today.
7 tc’s, 4 rehabs,twice with the tube down My throat under anesthetic,
naltraxone,bupernorphine countless cold turkeys I thought I took the pain
and I had gotten away clean and now with everything in the balance I
fucking
use. I don’t even have to post here, everyone who saw Me or talked to Me
today knew and the dope fiend in My tried to lie about it.
Thank’s Marc Dimitr  and  Eric and everyone on the list . If I use
tomorrow
it’s off to the races. But tomorrow is another day so I’m praying for a
miracle.
Peas and Love Kurt

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????
Date: May 1, 2005 at 5:47:54 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Right on Howard, in an ideal world. Why is it so freakin’ obvious to people like you, and Kurt, and Patrick, Rachel and Jeff, etc, etc (sorry if I didn’t name everyone here- there’s too many of you to do so, but you are all included) to see this but not so obvious for the prohibitionist type?
This is almost a rhetorical question, as I know there’s no real all encompassing answer that makes much sense
But your comment made me salivate and drop into a waking dream, picturing such an ideal world as this. Sigh, then puff, puff.
;-))
Gotta medicate in some fashion darn it.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 1:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????

In a message dated 5/1/05 12:55:23 AM, shaman13@optonline.net writes:

I used, I walked away from 30 mg. of methadone 36 days ago and I used today.
7 tc’s, 4 rehabs,twice with the tube down My throat under anesthetic,
naltraxone,bupernorphine
countless cold turkeys I thought I took the pain and I had gotten away
clean and now with everything in the balance I fucking use. I don’t even
have to post here, everyone who saw Me or talked to Me today knew and the
dope fiend in My tried to lie about it.

Thank’s Marc Dimitr  and  Eric and everyone on the list . If I use tomorrow
it’s off to the races. But tomorrow is another day so I’m praying for a
miracle.

Peas and Love Kurt

In the best of worlds you would just pop into a hospital or a doctors office
and get an intermediat dose of ibogaine/iboga to give you another running
chance.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????
Date: May 1, 2005 at 5:45:09 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

It’s one day Kurt.
Don’t tell yourself “it’s off to the races” just like that please, I write with opinionated firmness. Even if you do use again, or “fuck up” as I like to call it when I do similar things, it’s still just one more day, and can still be stopped at any point. Each time is one, alone, only “real” that one moment, then it’s gone and you=;r already a different Kurt than the one who used just moments before- especially, as you told me yourself, after being initiated by ibogaine, we’re never the same again, so use that thought to your advenatage if possible.
But again, as I noted earlier today elsewere, and hear you say it to, “no beating youself up over it,” ok?
Thanks. and you know for you, if I hear you on the machine and I’m here I will pick up, always, as I do with a very, very fselect few others. You’re on my list, so please feel free to call me any time, any hour, and if I hear you I will pick up, cell pone or home phone, either one.
Be safe, and I’ll talk to and see you tomorrow I’m assuming.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: KURT BRECHTER
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 12:54 AM
Subject: [Ibogaine] ?????????

I used, I walked away from 30 mg. of methadone 36 days ago and I used today. 7 tc’s, 4 rehabs,twice with the tube down My throat under anesthetic, naltraxone,bupernorphine countless cold turkeys I thought I took the pain and I had gotten away clean and now with everything in the balance I fucking use. I don’t even have to post here, everyone who saw Me or talked to Me today knew and the dope fiend in My tried to lie about it.
Thank’s Marc Dimitr  and  Eric and everyone on the list . If I use tomorrow it’s off to the races. But tomorrow is another day so I’m praying for a miracle.
Peas and Love Kurt

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc
Date: May 1, 2005 at 4:54:35 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Martee wrote >Re: going to a dojo being far off topic, well I believe it could be as on topic as one can possible get.  All the talk about aftercare, and I read one query re: what do you need to do after to insure success. The responses mostly had to do with being properly hydrated and diet which any who knows me I can’t stress enough.<

I meant that the reference to the “dojo” in Napolean Dynamite (another hilarious, clean fun film well worth renting, as I’ve mentioned already a few times), not that going to a dojo in and of itself was “off topic” Martee, just to clear that up.
;-))

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: m.finman
To: ibo
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 8:50 PM
Subject: Fw: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc

Preston,
Have not yet seen this film but thanks for the recommendation.  Movies and film are on of my all time favorite pastimes.  Sheer fun sounds good.
Re: going to a dojo being far off topic, well I believe it could be as on topic as one can possible get.  All the talk about aftercare, and I read one query re: what do you need to do after to insure success.  The responses mostly had to do with being properly hydrated and diet which any who knows me I can’t stress enough.
There’s a saying that goes, “When you do what you did, you get what you got.” This falls under the Ibogaine not being the magic bullet and there is for most other avenues that need to be explored, issues realized and confronted and redirection of certain behaviors, energies which could include reactions, thought patterns, and how one processes the ongoing absurdities and rituals we call daily life.
There can be many ways to approach all this and the lucky few will figure out the ones that can work for them.  For that fact I have, in all my years in nyc, witnessed people who successfully stopped drugs and changed little else in their life and were able to stay clean.   I am not one of those.  I sense neither are many others.  Otherwise why would so many require multiple attempts at detox and  Ibogaine.  Preston I am not referring to your situation as it is pretty unique. I work hard at my sobriety but I will say it is a JOY.
What I said to Marc in my previous post was not from a place of knowing anything or being critical.  It was from my heart because this is what I “sense” might be useful to him in particular and above all I pray for him to have what I have.
Peace of mind,contentment,  love of self,  and a feeling of being grounded that I have never experienced before.   What I have been doing could mean little to nothing for his or anyone elses sobriety.  It was just a suggestion to someone I wish well.
Glad to see you are up and about and in your usual good spirits,
Martee
—– Original Message —– From: Preston Peet
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 1:43 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] (OT) Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc

However, what I sense would be helpful for you personally would be if you would find a reputable dojo.<

Pretty far off topic here, but have you Martee, or anyone else for that matter here, seen Napolean Dynamite yet? Shoot, the character’s name just flew right outta my head as I was about to write it, but there’s a great, and hilarious scene in it when Napolean and his brother Kip go to check out a dojo.
;-))
Great flick if you haven’t yet seen it- I think it can still be rented on pay-per-view, but if not, I highly recommend renting it. It’s a very silly and innocent-kinda film, no cursing at all (other than one lines when someone tell someone else to go “eat a decroded [sic] piece of crap.”
Great movie and again I highly recommend it for an afternoon/evening of sheer fun and pleasure to distract you from your daily grind. Well worth the rental fee that’s for sure.

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: m.finman
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, April 29, 2005 9:20 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.hey marc

Hey Hey,
Your apearance once again is heart warming.  I’ve personally been lurking, going through a no need to comment stage.  However, what I sense would be helpful for you personally would be if you would find a reputable dojo.  It could possibly serve you in areas of being more grounded, disciplined and calm.  Also an outlet for that puppy energy you have that needs to be collected and directed.
You’ll notice I didn’t suggest yoga….
love you just the way you are,
Martee

Original Message —– From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Thursday, April 28, 2005 6:54 PM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sleeeeep.

brownies were a life saver in mexico but my gas isn’t being turned on unitl tomorrow. unitl then i’ll just have to smoke but i actually got 7 hours last night so i think i might be on the other end of it.  Actually I feel pretty damn great. Thanks. -M.

Jasen Chamoun <jasenhappy@optusnet.com.au> wrote:
Hey M,

As well as the other things you mentioned, I found that eating pot helped me to sleep and relax more. More so than smoking, although I did both. As I am sure you
are aware you have to eat more than you would smoke.

You are sleeping soon.

love, Jasen.
—– Original Message —– From: mcorcoran
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, April 27, 2005 2:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] sorry to keep bitchin abouth is but….

I’m still not sleeping! Actually last night was one of my worst 1 and a half hours 17 days out.
Last time it got gradiually better but this time it seems to be getting worse again and this time around was abusing a much shorter acting opiate.
This is beginning to drive me a little nuts. I have no desire to use but I don’t think I’d turn down a Xanax. Nah I’m not gonna take any Xanax but I’m open to sugestions. And yeah I’ve done the Melitonin and the valerian and smoking an hour before I go to sleep. But nothings working. Except maybe the ibogaine. -m.

Ron Davis <rwd3@cox.net> wrote:
yeah, a very close friend of mine said that often, since i have no personal
experiences. he said to have many spikes,, rigs on stand by as one gropes
and clogs and coagulates searching for the impossible, dumb guy never
learned either, kept trying the impossible, getting off took on a whole new
meaning, no quickie in the enco station or your friend’s bathroom. then
there was the panic as the realization of failure set in. oxys d/n do well
im i’m told..a lot of plastic molecules
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:48 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

>in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load.<
OOOWWUCH!

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Ron Davis”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 9:39 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

in the south there is no h at least in the bible belt. an 80 oxy runs 60
bucks. melt 4 of those and you have a 240 dollar load. i promise you ,
there will not be a visible vein on your body. not that i ever tried it,
story is purely anecdotal, ron
—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:33 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

Veins? Veins? LOL, I Have capilaries and a few viens (I admit, they do
come back, sorta, after a break of some years) but they rapidly go,
“Hey, Preston, Fuck You. We’re going back into hiding,” leaving me
whimpering in the bathroom as I try desperately to get well.
Or at least, that’s where I was once again not too long ago.
;-))
But then, two days ago climbing outta the bathtub, what should pop up on
my foreleg but a HUGE vein I haven’t seen in years, looking whole and
hungry too- it’s the DEVIL I tell you- “Hey Look Preston, a huge willing
vein, and that drugstore where you can legally buy .75 cent rigs is just
around the corner, RUN!
But I resisted. Weird shit ibogaine, how it somehow allows me to step
back, for the most part, and think things through first, again, for the
most part.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often
mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations,
Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Ron Davis”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 8:43 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

you have veins after all these yrs? lucky, i haven’t seen one in
decades. dilaudids cooked up nicely in the 70’s before the generics
came out. i recently had knee surgery and the doc was compassionate w/
scripts. i ate 25 4mg. to get off, glad insurance paid, knee hurt like
hell for a month till he filled again. it all sucks, maybe my day will
come soon, well wishes , ron—– Original Message —– From: “Preston Peet”
To:
Sent: Tuesday, April 26, 2005 7:01 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

Never considered banging it, and don’t think I would- and I used to
band ANYTHING I could melt into a needle too once upon a time- but
that’s been years (for instance, I get ms-contins along with my
dilaudids, but never shot them- but did add water to one once, on the
off chance it would work somehow- LOL, I do NOT inject jelly into my
veins, no matter how desperate for a “fix” (i.e. needle in my vein,
which is such a HUGE part of my addictive problems, that whole
ritualistic needle thing, which is one reason why I’m trying new
streches to my new Tai Chi video, and still plan on trying yoga, as
soon as I can get up early enough on either this Wed or Fri to attend
a class a few blocks from my home.
Carry on all.

Peace and love,
Preston Peet

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is
often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient
Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out
Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Carlton B”
To:
Sent: Monday, April 25, 2005 6:43 PM
Subject: [Ibogaine] Iboga introduction routes

Just listening to this talk about gagging gullets and emptying bowels
makes
me ask a question: has anyone ever explored taking it as an
injection? No
loss of product, etc. I wouldn’t want to be the first one to try
it. On
second thought, maybe it’s not such a good idea to bypass the body’s
main
safeguard to OD….

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands:
http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: Congress to impose 5 years in prison for passing a Joint
Date: May 1, 2005 at 3:31:16 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

—– Original Message —–
From: FourTwenty.com
To: rob@420times.com
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 4:07 PM
Subject: Congress to impose 5 years in prison for passing a Joint

Take action! Urge your U.S. representative and two U.S. senators to oppose harsh new mandatory minimum sentences.

Your immediate help is needed to defeat harsh new mandatory minimum sentences for nonviolent drug offenses.

The U.S. House Judiciary Committee will soon consider a bill that would create draconian mandatory minimum sentences for a variety of nonviolent drug offenses, including marijuana. If this bill becomes law, anyone convicted in federal court of the crime of “enticing” someone “who has previously been enrolled in a drug treatment program” to “possess” marijuana will receive a five-year mandatory minimum sentence.

That’s right: Passing a joint to someone who used to be in drug treatment will land you in federal prison for a minimum of five years.

Please visit www.mpp.org/MM to e-mail your U.S. representative and two U.S. senators today. It only takes a minute to send one of our pre-written e-mails urging them to stop this bill in its tracks.

In addition to the shocking joint-passing provision described above, the bill would also create a 10-year mandatory minimum sentence for a first-time conviction of distributing a small amount of marijuana to a person under 18 years of age … and a 10-year sentence for a second offense of distributing marijuana to a person under 21. By comparison, the average time served by convicted rapists in this country is about seven years.

MPP does not condone the distribution of marijuana to minors, nor do we advocate the use of marijuana by people recovering from substance abuse problems. But we do believe that judges should have the discretion to determine whether or not offenders in these circumstances deserve to be imprisoned for sentences as long as five or 10 years. If these mandatory minimum sentences are enacted, judges’ hands will be tied.

This bill has traction because it also contains a section that serves as the House Republican leadership’s response to a recent U.S. Supreme Court ruling that made the Federal Sentencing Guidelines advisory, rather than mandatory.* The Republican leadership is highly motivated to pass this bill – and with it, the harsh new penalties related to marijuana.

The “Defending America’s Most Vulnerable: Safe Access to Drug Treatment and Child Protection Act of 2005” (H.R. 1528) was introduced by House Judiciary Committee Chairman James Sensenbrenner (R-WI) on April 6, and it has already passed out of the House Judiciary Subcommittee on Crime, Terrorism, and Homeland Security.

The bill will now be debated and voted on by the full House Judiciary Committee and – if the committee passes the bill – the full House will then vote on it.

http://www.420times.com/forums/showthread.php?t=38438

Greenest Regards,
Rob Smith

Creating Cannabis Awareness Since 1993
http://www.420Times.com

Please help support 420Times.com and our mission to create Cannabis awareness.

For as little as $50.00 a month, you can advertise to our thousands of daily visitors on any one of these sites..

http://www.420Times.com
http://www.420Girls.com
http://www.FourTwenty.com

Ad rates start at $100.00 a month.
50% discount and FREE banner design in exchange for pre-paying a full year. ($50.00 a month)

All banner ads go into a rotation and are given the same exact amount of exposures.

Add your site to our FREE links section
http://www.420times.com/links/

Reciprocal links are most appreciated.

Please contact me with any questions, ideas, comments, etc.

Greenest Regards,
Rob Smith

Creating Cannabis Awareness Since 1993
http://www.FourTwenty.com

* You are receiving this message because either you or someone else subscribed to our list to receive newsletters. To unsubscribe, respond to this message with “unsubscribe” in the subject line. Thank you for supporting our mission to create cannabis awareness.

From: “Preston Peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Fw: [DrugWar] a real stickler, this kid.
Date: May 1, 2005 at 3:26:08 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

very weird and pretty much off topic, but I had to share this one.
(See below.)

Peace and love,
Preston

“Madness is not enlightenment, but the search for enlightenment is often mistaken for madness”
Richard Davenport-Hines

ptpeet@nyc.rr.com
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor “Under the Influence- the Disinformation Guide to Drugs”
Editor “Underground- The Disinformation Guide to Ancient Civilizations, Astonishing Archeology and Hidden History” (due out Sept. 2005)
Cont. High Times mag/.com
Cont. Editor http://www.disinfo.com
Columnist New York Waste
Etc.

—– Original Message —– From: “Anntelope” <Anntelope@worldnet.att.net>
To: “drug war mailing list” <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 30, 2005 3:31 PM
Subject: [DrugWar] a real stickler, this kid.

PHILADELPHIA – A third-grade student has been suspended after she swiped her
mother’s diabetes blood-testing needle and stuck 19 classmates with it. The
8-year-old stuck her Taylor Elementary schoolmates during breakfast, lunch
and in the classroom, using a 1/3 inch long needle. One of the
pricked students tested positive for HIV on a preliminary test, however,
health officials said that the preliminary test can yield false positives.
The girl was suspended and will most likely be moved to another school.
School officials were not sure why the girl did it.

<]=———————————————————————–=[>
[           Moderated by: Preston Peet | .drugwar.com           ]
|          -=/[ To Subscribe: drugwar-subscribe@mindvox.com ]/=- |
|             To Unsubscribe: drugwar-unsubscribe@mindvox.com |
[   DrugWar List in Digest Format: ugwar-digest-subscribe@mindvox.com   ]
<]=———————————————————————–=[>

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] thanks for your support………..
Date: May 1, 2005 at 2:26:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Just a quick thanks, Thanks for not leaving Me alone…….
Lot’s of info and I can feel the vibes…..
mixed up confusion Man it’s a killing Me…(dylan)re
As always You are My Heros
Peas and love Kurt

From: Morning Wood <morning_wood263@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 1, 2005 at 2:19:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

hi there,

lots of people try a taste afterwards, that’s ok,
it’s what you do with that expereince that is
important.

You have enough in you to make it work.

Try not to fall into the quicksand of self pity and
shame, that would be too easy.

It may seem like you are covered in the quicksand
already, but if you stop and listen good, I think you
may or may not be in quicksand as much as as it seems.

in quicksand, movement works against you, like
chinese handcuffs that eventually leed to liquid
‘cuffs due to that wonderful drug war thingy.  I
wouldn’t mind liquid cuffs but the “moralists” who
just cut medicaid funding in the house won’t give if
arrested.

If you’re totally bored or whatever, the GOP is
making a major major push  if you havent noticed.
That whole social security prime time was a
distraction tactic.  Take a look at the budget and
see.

I’ll try to do the most with what I have if you do
too,,,, actually, I’ll do it anyway.

be productive whatever ends up happening.

take care Bro,
J
http://ibogain.de/mornigwood.html

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: mcorcoran <mcorcoran27@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 1, 2005 at 10:29:56 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

you used yesterday 1 day out of 36 and thats pretty miraclous in itself. so dont use today try and learn from other peoples mistakes and try to work something out to set up a session if thats what you feel you need. But TRUST ME speaking from experince in a situation like this if you continue to pick up your gonna find that the ibogaine becomes less and less of a reality and we both know we never know when or how that run may end or how much irrepable damage we might do on the way.
Hang in there. -m.

KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net> wrote:
Not only that,
On day 30 like clock work the dealer I haven’t herad from in 3 years (who’s kids I put through parochiol school) calls. “the first ones free”
I resist for 6 days. Needless to say alot of heavy shit came down on Me and once again ‘I DESERVED it”    WHAT KINDA shit is that?I deserve a bag of death???? Well the sick mother fucker I am I say “Yeah You Do”???????????
So, I don’t even take the free shit, I put Myself at all kinda risk to go “COP”.
Like I said I’m sick.
I get High, I take a look on the mirror a couple of hours later and there HE is. That same scheming mother fucker I hate.
Now with the (O.D.) overdone it and regretful headache I sit here trying to understand just a small fraction.
I even told another dope fiend,”yeah I fucked up but I only had a half an opium supository?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck??????????????????
I can’t do this to Myself again, But My track record sucks.
I think I’m finished for tonight, But You never know
peas and love  Kurt
__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam? Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around 
http://mail.yahoo.com

From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [Ibogaine] [ot] Addiction defined
Date: May 1, 2005 at 7:41:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

The lines for the Star Wars premiere have already started.

It opens in 3 weeks.

http://movies.yahoo.com/mv/news/va/20050430/111492198000.html

.:vector:.

Star Wars ‘Stand-A-Thon’ Kicks Off in New York
Saturday April 30 9:33 PM ET

A black-clad Darth Vader and storm troopers in white armor flanked a
Jedi knight with an angelic smile as die-hard “Star War” fans on
Saturday launched a marathon “stand-a-thon” countdown to the opening of
the final film of George Lucas’ intergalactic science fiction saga.

With 19 days to go before the film’s first public showing, the
around-the-clock line debuted to the beat of Star War tunes from a
boombox swung by Bobafett, a bounty-hunter character in an outfit
sprayed with silvery chrome.

“We all know what it’s like to go through this insanity even though
its temporary,” said Steve Lorenzo, 39, a technical writer for a
software company. “It’s like a class or family reunion even though it’s
not.”

Yet the pack’s eager anticipation over “Star Wars: Episode III Revenge
of the Sith” was tinged with sadness that the new film would be the
last silver screen glimpse into a parallel universe of space-fought
intrigue played out over six films.

“It’s kind of bittersweet; it’s the last one which makes it more
emotional,” said Chris Bergoch, one of the 300 people signed for the
line. “You want to look forward to the movie, but then again you almost
don’t want since there won’t be another one again.”

The event follows another nonstop street-side countdown kicked off by
fervid Star War fans on April 2 across the country in Hollywood.

Opening on May 19, “Episode III” completes a trilogy which is a
prequel to the original three films. The series has generated nearly
$3.4 billion in global box office and an estimated $9 billion in retail
sales since the first film appeared in 1977.

Registering for the stand-a-thon outside the Ziegfeld, New York’s
largest stand-alone movie theater, were fans drawn from 22 U.S. states
and nine foreign countries, mainly West European but also including
Japan, Peru and Brazil.

An idealistic sheen to the waiting game is that time spent on the line
is money that goes to a charity for severely ill children, Starlight
Starbright. Benefactors contribute a sum to the charity for every hour
that each participant stands on line.

About $33,000 was raised in similar lines formed in New York before
“Star War” movie premieres in 1999 and 2002. Those events produced
friendships, including a few which blossomed into marriages.

SPOILERS VS. NON-SPOILERS

Victor Lundberg, 27, from Gothenburg, Sweden, said he met his wife
Emily Schildt, of Seward, Nebraska, in the first “stand-a-thon” formed
before the 1999 premiere of “Episode I: The Phantom Menace.”

“I told him not to propose to me in the second line” which formed in
2002 for “Episode II: Attack of the Clones,” recalled Schildt, smiling
at the remembrance.

Openly admitting to a conflict, the two say they are in opposite Star
War camps: the Spoilers vs. the non-Spoilers.

The first wants to know as much as possible about the movie,
characters and plot, the second doesn’t want to know anything or as
little as can be possible amid the marketing blitz preceding the movie,
which includes the launch of dozens of toys based on movie characters.

In Los Angeles, the spoilers’ group dynamic is more complex, with
three color coded levels for fans gathered a few feet away from
Grauman’s Chinese Theatre amid the hustle and bustle of Hollywood’s
tourist trade.

Red is for would-be know-nothings. Blue indicates they will look at
official information and movie trailers, but don’t want to hear about
plot and story issues. A green spoiler wants to know everything.

What makes it easy to recognize each person’s spoiler level is their
official laminated badges, which happen to glow in the dark.

The Hollywood group is also linked online to the Starlight Starbright
charity. (Additional reporting by Michael Kardos in Los Angeles)

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Tired of spam?  Yahoo! Mail has the best spam protection around
http://mail.yahoo.com

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] Not only that………
Date: May 1, 2005 at 2:04:44 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Not only that,
On day 30 like clock work the dealer I haven’t herad from in 3 years (who’s kids I put through parochiol school) calls. “the first ones free”
I resist for 6 days. Needless to say alot of heavy shit came down on Me and once again ‘I DESERVED it”    WHAT KINDA shit is that?I deserve a bag of death???? Well the sick mother fucker I am I say “Yeah You Do”???????????
So, I don’t even take the free shit, I put Myself at all kinda risk to go “COP”.
Like I said I’m sick.
I get High, I take a look on the mirror a couple of hours later and there HE is. That same scheming mother fucker I hate.
Now with the (O.D.) overdone it and regretful headache I sit here trying to understand just a small fraction.
I even told another dope fiend,”yeah I fucked up but I only had a half an opium supository?????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????????
What the fuck??????????????????
I can’t do this to Myself again, But My track record sucks.
I think I’m finished for tonight, But You never know
peas and love  Kurt

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] ?????
Date: May 1, 2005 at 1:38:30 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

P.s . I am really grateful for this list and all the  people on it. Also all of the people I have recently come in contact with, One thing I never had before was a community. Isolation with My addiction was allways one of My biggest enemies (right after Myself). I’m realitvly certain that there is a light for Me somewhere.
Thank You all,You are My heros
peas and love Kurt

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????
Date: May 1, 2005 at 1:17:39 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

Yes Howard,
Do You have the Map to the best of worlds,
I was resistent while I was detoxing. Now that I have started the retox I
feel I need to be reset.
I have a healthy respect and some fear of Ibogaine (fear is a good thing, it
gives man humility) however it is the only thing that has ever given Me a
fighting chance to do the work I need to do on Myself.
In all honesty I don’t really “want” to take it again but I really feel in
My heart that if I don’t that the psychic repairs I need to pursue will
allways remain just out of reach..
peas and love   Kurt
—– Original Message —–
From: <HSLotsof@aol.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Sunday, May 01, 2005 1:00 AM
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????

In a message dated 5/1/05 12:55:23 AM, shaman13@optonline.net writes:

I used, I walked away from 30 mg. of methadone 36 days ago and I used
today.
7 tc’s, 4 rehabs,twice with the tube down My throat under anesthetic,
naltraxone,bupernorphine
countless cold turkeys I thought I took the pain and I had gotten away
clean and now with everything in the balance I fucking use. I don’t even
have to post here, everyone who saw Me or talked to Me today knew and the
dope fiend in My tried to lie about it.

Thank’s Marc Dimitr  and  Eric and everyone on the list . If I use
tomorrow
it’s off to the races. But tomorrow is another day so I’m praying for a
miracle.

Peas and Love Kurt

In the best of worlds you would just pop into a hospital or a doctors
office
and get an intermediat dose of ibogaine/iboga to give you another running
chance.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html
[%]

\]=———————————————————————=[/

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [Ibogaine] ?????????
Date: May 1, 2005 at 1:00:23 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

In a message dated 5/1/05 12:55:23 AM, shaman13@optonline.net writes:

I used, I walked away from 30 mg. of methadone 36 days ago and I used today.
7 tc’s, 4 rehabs,twice with the tube down My throat under anesthetic,
naltraxone,bupernorphine
countless cold turkeys I thought I took the pain and I had gotten away
clean and now with everything in the balance I fucking use. I don’t even
have to post here, everyone who saw Me or talked to Me today knew and the
dope fiend in My tried to lie about it.

Thank’s Marc Dimitr  and  Eric and everyone on the list . If I use tomorrow
it’s off to the races. But tomorrow is another day so I’m praying for a
miracle.

Peas and Love Kurt

In the best of worlds you would just pop into a hospital or a doctors office
and get an intermediat dose of ibogaine/iboga to give you another running
chance.

Howard

/]=———————————————————————=[\
[%] Ibogaine List Commands: http://ibogaine.mindvox.com/IbogaineList.html [%]
\]=———————————————————————=[/

From: KURT BRECHTER <shaman13@optonline.net>
Subject: [Ibogaine] ?????????
Date: May 1, 2005 at 12:54:25 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com

I used, I walked away from 30 mg. of methadone 36 days ago and I used today. 7 tc’s, 4 rehabs,twice with the tube down My throat under anesthetic, naltraxone,bupernorphine countless cold turkeys I thought I took the pain and I had gotten away clean and now with everything in the balance I fucking use. I don’t even have to post here, everyone who saw Me or talked to Me today knew and the dope fiend in My tried to lie about it.
Thank’s Marc Dimitr  and  Eric and everyone on the list . If I use tomorrow it’s off to the races. But tomorrow is another day so I’m praying for a miracle.
Peas and Love Kurt

Print Friendly, PDF & Email

Comments are closed.