From: Marvinrpoole@cs.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Ibogaine Docu/Film
Date: May 30, 2003 at 6:46:52 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: stevenanker@hotmail.com, daniel@breakingopenthehead.com, randy_hencken@yahoo.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hello list members,
I am looking for a couple heroin addicts who would like to undergo
ibogainetreatment for no money out of their own pocket. Theindividuals would need to spend roughly two to weeks with us and agree to
be filmed in exchange for the treatment. We are looking for heroin addicts from a cross section of society willing to undergo treatment in Mexico and after-care in California. Participants must have a desire to get and stay clean and be availabe from June 14th through the 28th. Therapy and medical supervision are included. All costs are provided in exchange for being filmed. More so, we would like to have at least one person who is African American. Please contact me off list if you are interested or if you know someone who is interested. Addicts will be treated with respect and dignity.
The director is a former junkie who successfully underwent ibogaine treatment. The writer is Bwiti initiate Daniel Pinchbeck, author of “Breaking Open the Head”.
Please note: If interested, tell us a little bit about yourself, your background, and explain why you would like to kick heroine addiction?
Best,
Marvin Poole
Co-producer “Iboga: Root of Revelation”
Marty@alliancegroupllc.com
Alliance Film Group
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] more from m. simon Re: GMfCL 2003 #32: Global Cannabis Wrap-up, 3rd
Date: May 29, 2003 at 11:00:19 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Cc: msimon@xta.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Dana
Thanks Dana but I was sure to include him and his
entire CC list in my reply. Odd, not a peep out of
him, I’ll CC him on this in case he forgot. I would
love to hear his reply and see those reports he speaks
of.
Brett
msimon@xta.com
CC: greenpartydrugsgroup@gn.apc.org,
dana@cures-not-wars.org, yerbanena@hotmail.com,
risto.mikkonen@auriamail.net, gov02@msn.com,
indianbud@wirefire.com, initiativ@act4cannabis.lu,
mojca@drogart.com, ezpz@telkomsa.net,
newagecitizen@aol.com, hromi@kyberia.sk,
tushona@hotmail.com, pariah_mob@yahoo.com,
jc0_66@yahoo.com, irena.krzan@kiss.uni-lj.si
— Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org> wrote:
Did you send this to M. Simon?
He’s not on this list, so if you didn’t, he didn’t
get to read what you
had to say.
Dana/cnw
Brett Calabrese wrote:
Ibogaine list and M. Simon
M. Simon has no clue what ibogaine does or is.
— Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org> wrote:
Some one should explain to this guy the
difference
between ibogaine
for withdrawal– and placebo!
Simon said;
Reports I have read (I’d have to look them up)
say
Please post links to the reports
that ibogaine is no
better than a placebo.]
So, let me tell you this thing called SEX, it is
really terrible, nasty stuff – do you believe
that?
Well, there are places you can go read how awful
sex
is and that you shouldn’t have any, there are also
places that will tell you how awful ibogaine is,
by
people who neither have sex or understand
ibogaine…
I have done ibogaine a number of times, it does in
fact, without any trace of doubt work. It is not
exactly some placebo, did it or didn’t work, it is
like a 100 megaton nuclear warhead hit your
addiction
– got that? So next time you actually want to know
about ibogaine, or sex, I suggest you speak to
someone
(like me) that actually did both, not just called
themselves experts by reading books about it…
If you go to Medline (do an internet search) you
will
find the national library of medicine. Plug in
ibogaine and over 200 peer reviewed papers will be
filed. Here I will make it easy for you (I know
things
like due diligence is a difficult task for the
un-informed)
oops, up to 226, things are picking up
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?CMD=Search&DB=PubMed
A certain number of people on drugs quit every
year
without therapy. About
About 10%
the same number quit with therapy. Let us not
Somewhat less actually, you know you are always an
addict, you have an incurable disease…
confuse this natural effect
with ibogaine or other therapeutic success. So
far
Seems you are confused.
there is no known
therapy that actually weans people from their
addictions any faster than
nature does.
M. Simon, you are talking with your head up your
ass –
as in you are an ASS…., someone who spews
bullshit
without even knowing what they are talking about.
Without a doubt and highly proven, even to rats
who
don’t give into easily to the placebo effect,
ibogaine
is near 100%. There is some common minor (about
10%)
withdrawal that happens in some people, some of
the
time. I know people who have detoxed from opiates
with
not so much as the slightest withdrawal symptom,
even
over 100mg of methadone, in 1 (count em 1) single
treatment. Tell me, how many times have you seen
ibogaine not work that you can speak?
Let me tell you something mr simon. Ibogaine saved
my
life, gave me peace and NO I could not have done
what
I have without it. I am very free, without any
desire,
calm, even in NYC at the conference (back “home”)
there was so much lack of any “drug activity”
going on
in my head that it was truely strange to look at
it,
this is not normal for an addict. Nada, nothing,
no
bad feelings, no good ones, no stray thoughts,
very
strange. I quit all drugs, alcohol, then nicotine,
for fun I stopped daily coffee (something about
being
healthy for you)… Take a dose of ibogaine, see
if
coffee, cigarettes, sweet stuff like candy or junk
tastes like, you will find it, like all bad
things,
taste bad after ibogaine. Ibogaine cannot be
understood from what is on paper, for the true
knowledge of ibogaine cannot be put on paper, it
must
be experienced (like sex).
It all depends. Is ibogaine good science or just
something to make
anti-junkies feel good?
THe science is there, obviously you have not read
it
(that means in total, not picking out pieces that
comply with what you want)
I don’t give a rats ass how the anti-junkies feel
but
they sure don’t seem to like anything about
ibogaine,
so where have you been?
Try reading this.
http://www.ibogainetreatment.net/observation.php
Brett
Simon
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Calendar – Free online calendar with sync to Outlook(TM).
http://calendar.yahoo.com
From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] more from m. simon Re: GMfCL 2003 #32: Global Cannabis Wrap-up, 3rd
Date: May 29, 2003 at 9:44:59 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Did you send this to M. Simon?
He’s not on this list, so if you didn’t, he didn’t get to read what you had to say.
Dana/cnw
Brett Calabrese wrote:
Ibogaine list and M. Simon
M. Simon has no clue what ibogaine does or is.
— Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org> wrote:
> Some one should explain to this guy the difference
> between ibogaine
> for withdrawal– and placebo!
>
Simon said;
> Reports I have read (I’d have to look them up) say
Please post links to the reports
> that ibogaine is no
> better than a placebo.]
So, let me tell you this thing called SEX, it is
really terrible, nasty stuff – do you believe that?
Well, there are places you can go read how awful sex
is and that you shouldn’t have any, there are also
places that will tell you how awful ibogaine is, by
people who neither have sex or understand ibogaine…
I have done ibogaine a number of times, it does in
fact, without any trace of doubt work. It is not
exactly some placebo, did it or didn’t work, it is
like a 100 megaton nuclear warhead hit your addiction
- got that? So next time you actually want to know
about ibogaine, or sex, I suggest you speak to someone
(like me) that actually did both, not just called
themselves experts by reading books about it…
If you go to Medline (do an internet search) you will
find the national library of medicine. Plug in
ibogaine and over 200 peer reviewed papers will be
filed. Here I will make it easy for you (I know things
like due diligence is a difficult task for the
un-informed)
oops, up to 226, things are picking up
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?CMD=Search&DB=PubMed
>
> A certain number of people on drugs quit every year
> without therapy. About
About 10%
> the same number quit with therapy. Let us not
Somewhat less actually, you know you are always an
addict, you have an incurable disease…
> confuse this natural effect
> with ibogaine or other therapeutic success. So far
Seems you are confused.
> there is no known
> therapy that actually weans people from their
> addictions any faster than
> nature does.
M. Simon, you are talking with your head up your ass –
as in you are an ASS…., someone who spews bullshit
without even knowing what they are talking about.
Without a doubt and highly proven, even to rats who
don’t give into easily to the placebo effect, ibogaine
is near 100%. There is some common minor (about 10%)
withdrawal that happens in some people, some of the
time. I know people who have detoxed from opiates with
not so much as the slightest withdrawal symptom, even
over 100mg of methadone, in 1 (count em 1) single
treatment. Tell me, how many times have you seen
ibogaine not work that you can speak?
Let me tell you something mr simon. Ibogaine saved my
life, gave me peace and NO I could not have done what
I have without it. I am very free, without any desire,
calm, even in NYC at the conference (back “home”)
there was so much lack of any “drug activity” going on
in my head that it was truely strange to look at it,
this is not normal for an addict. Nada, nothing, no
bad feelings, no good ones, no stray thoughts, very
strange. I quit all drugs, alcohol, then nicotine,
for fun I stopped daily coffee (something about being
healthy for you)… Take a dose of ibogaine, see if
coffee, cigarettes, sweet stuff like candy or junk
tastes like, you will find it, like all bad things,
taste bad after ibogaine. Ibogaine cannot be
understood from what is on paper, for the true
knowledge of ibogaine cannot be put on paper, it must
be experienced (like sex).
>
> It all depends. Is ibogaine good science or just
> something to make
> anti-junkies feel good?
THe science is there, obviously you have not read it
(that means in total, not picking out pieces that
comply with what you want)
I don’t give a rats ass how the anti-junkies feel but
they sure don’t seem to like anything about ibogaine,
so where have you been?
Try reading this.
http://www.ibogainetreatment.net/observation.php
Brett
>
> Simon
>
>
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] DEAD INMATE’S FAMILY SUES
Date: May 27, 2003 at 8:31:57 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Pubdate: Wed, 21 May 2003
Source: Orlando Sentinel (FL)
Copyright: 2003 Orlando Sentinel
Contact: insight@orlandosentinel.com
Website: http://www.orlandosentinel.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/325
Author: Doris Bloodsworth, Sentinel Staff Writer
Note: Henry Pierson Curtis contributed to this report.
DEAD INMATE’S FAMILY SUES
The three children of a woman who died from methadone withdrawal in the
Orange County Jail two years ago sued county and jail officials and
medical
workers Tuesday for more than $10 million.
Filed after negotiations between Karen Johnson’s family and the county
failed, the lawsuit claims the county caused the death of the 43-year-
old
Orlando woman and tried to cover it up.
“I feel these people murdered my mother, and the lawsuit is the only way
we
can get justice for her,” said Johnson’s 18-year-old daughter, Crystal
of
Winter Park. “I feel the county made changes just to avoid being sued.”
Johnson’s death in June 2001, after jail officials abruptly ended her
methadone treatment, prompted an intense, 10-month investigation by more
than two dozen community leaders who recommended more than 200 reforms.
URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v03.n750.a04.html
——————————
From: Jon Freedlander <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: [ibogaine] [DIV28SUPER] PSYCHOLOGIST NOT WANTED (sorry) (fwd)
Date: May 27, 2003 at 8:19:43 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, <maps-forum@maps.org>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Ooops. Sorry about that.
Still, it’s something of an odd synchronicity…
———- Forwarded message ———-
Date: Tue, 27 May 2003 08:15:28 -0400
From: ronald wood <ronald_wood@urmc.rochester.edu>
Reply-To: div28super <DIV28SUPER@LISTS.APA.ORG>
To: DIV28SUPER@LISTS.APA.ORG
Subject: [DIV28SUPER] PSYCHOLOGIST NOT WANTED (sorry)
The advertisement I just posted was a mistake on your listowner’s part.
I apologize…
(If you wanted to apply for it, you should have done so 3 years ago!)
___________________________________________________________
div28SUPER@lists.apa.org — An APA Division 28 distribution list
sent nonduplicatively to div28 and div28m [restricted to APA members]
set your subscriber options (NOMAIL, DIGEST, SIGNOFF) via those lists
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] more from m. simon Re: GMfCL 2003 #32: Global Cannabis Wrap-up, 3rd
Date: May 26, 2003 at 9:59:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com, msimon@xta.com
Cc: greenpartydrugsgroup@gn.apc.org, dana@cures-not-wars.org, yerbanena@hotmail.com, risto.mikkonen@auriamail.net, gov02@msn.com, indianbud@wirefire.com, initiativ@act4cannabis.lu, mojca@drogart.com, ezpz@telkomsa.net, newagecitizen@aol.com, hromi@kyberia.sk, tushona@hotmail.com, pariah_mob@yahoo.com, jc0_66@yahoo.com, irena.krzan@kiss.uni-lj.si
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Ibogaine list and M. Simon
M. Simon has no clue what ibogaine does or is.
— Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org> wrote:
Some one should explain to this guy the difference
between ibogaine
for withdrawal– and placebo!
Simon said;
Reports I have read (I’d have to look them up) say
Please post links to the reports
that ibogaine is no
better than a placebo.]
So, let me tell you this thing called SEX, it is
really terrible, nasty stuff – do you believe that?
Well, there are places you can go read how awful sex
is and that you shouldn’t have any, there are also
places that will tell you how awful ibogaine is, by
people who neither have sex or understand ibogaine…
I have done ibogaine a number of times, it does in
fact, without any trace of doubt work. It is not
exactly some placebo, did it or didn’t work, it is
like a 100 megaton nuclear warhead hit your addiction
– got that? So next time you actually want to know
about ibogaine, or sex, I suggest you speak to someone
(like me) that actually did both, not just called
themselves experts by reading books about it…
If you go to Medline (do an internet search) you will
find the national library of medicine. Plug in
ibogaine and over 200 peer reviewed papers will be
filed. Here I will make it easy for you (I know things
like due diligence is a difficult task for the
un-informed)
oops, up to 226, things are picking up
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/entrez/query.fcgi?CMD=Search&DB=PubMed
A certain number of people on drugs quit every year
without therapy. About
About 10%
the same number quit with therapy. Let us not
Somewhat less actually, you know you are always an
addict, you have an incurable disease…
confuse this natural effect
with ibogaine or other therapeutic success. So far
Seems you are confused.
there is no known
therapy that actually weans people from their
addictions any faster than
nature does.
M. Simon, you are talking with your head up your ass –
as in you are an ASS…., someone who spews bullshit
without even knowing what they are talking about.
Without a doubt and highly proven, even to rats who
don’t give into easily to the placebo effect, ibogaine
is near 100%. There is some common minor (about 10%)
withdrawal that happens in some people, some of the
time. I know people who have detoxed from opiates with
not so much as the slightest withdrawal symptom, even
over 100mg of methadone, in 1 (count em 1) single
treatment. Tell me, how many times have you seen
ibogaine not work that you can speak?
Let me tell you something mr simon. Ibogaine saved my
life, gave me peace and NO I could not have done what
I have without it. I am very free, without any desire,
calm, even in NYC at the conference (back “home”)
there was so much lack of any “drug activity” going on
in my head that it was truely strange to look at it,
this is not normal for an addict. Nada, nothing, no
bad feelings, no good ones, no stray thoughts, very
strange. I quit all drugs, alcohol, then nicotine,
for fun I stopped daily coffee (something about being
healthy for you)… Take a dose of ibogaine, see if
coffee, cigarettes, sweet stuff like candy or junk
tastes like, you will find it, like all bad things,
taste bad after ibogaine. Ibogaine cannot be
understood from what is on paper, for the true
knowledge of ibogaine cannot be put on paper, it must
be experienced (like sex).
It all depends. Is ibogaine good science or just
something to make
anti-junkies feel good?
THe science is there, obviously you have not read it
(that means in total, not picking out pieces that
comply with what you want)
I don’t give a rats ass how the anti-junkies feel but
they sure don’t seem to like anything about ibogaine,
so where have you been?
Try reading this.
http://www.ibogainetreatment.net/observation.php
Brett
Simon
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] more from m. simon
Date: May 26, 2003 at 12:29:00 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
He has to see with his own eyes to understand.
S.
—–Original Message—–
From: Dana Beal [mailto:dana@cures-not-wars.org]
Sent: maandag 26 mei 2003 3:00
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] more from m. simon
Some one should explain to this guy the difference between ibogaine
for withdrawal– and placebo!
Dana/cnw
From:
“M. Simon” <msimon@xta.com>
Subject:
Re: GMfCL 2003 #32: Global Cannabis Wrap-up, 3rd
edition; Join 19 2004!
CC:
<greenpartydrugsgroup@gn.apc.org>,
<dana@cures-not-wars.org>, <yerbanena@hotmail.com>,
<risto.mikkonen@auriamail.net>, <gov02@msn.com>,
<indianbud@wirefire.com>, <initiativ@act4cannabis.lu>,
<mojca@drogart.com>, <ezpz@telkomsa.net>,
<newagecitizen@aol.com>, <hromi@kyberia.sk>,
<tushona@hotmail.com>, <pariah_mob@yahoo.com>,
<jc0_66@yahoo.com>, <irena.krzan@kiss.uni-lj.si>,
In-Reply-To:
<006701c31982$1b843d40$ea2e8e0a@JohnPack>
References:
<5.2.0.9.0.20030513131512.01d98e20@xta.com>
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=”us-ascii”; format=flowed
X-Declude-Sender:
msimon@xta.com [209.83.111.66]
X-Note:
This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail
(www.declude.com) for spam.
At 01:00 PM 5/13/03 -0400, The Happy Hemptress wrote:
Personnally, I don’t see a problem…we fix things with drugs all the
time…
This is good. I have no problem fixing things with drugs. Let us be sure
that we actually know what we are fixing. And let us be sure it really
works.
Reports I have read (I’d have to look them up) say that ibogaine is no
better than a placebo.
A certain number of people on drugs quit every year without therapy.
About
the same number quit with therapy. Let us not confuse this natural
effect
with ibogaine or other therapeutic success. So far there is no known
therapy that actually weans people from their addictions any faster than
nature does.
methadone is a drug & far worse than ibogaine.
Drug chauvinism. Heroin would be better than methadone of course, but it
is
illegal.
There is nothing wrong with chronic drug use for those who need it. Even
heroin.
If that analogy is
used, people will understand. Even when I was addicted to nose spray
when I
was a kid, my Doctor gave me antihistamine pills to ween me off the
spray
till I could breath on my own.
Happy Hemptress
It all depends. Is ibogaine good science or just something to make
anti-junkies feel good?
Simon
From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] more from m. simon
Date: May 25, 2003 at 9:08:46 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
In a message dated 5/25/03 9:00:46 PM, dana@cures-not-wars.org writes:
At 01:00 PM 5/13/03 -0400, The Happy Hemptress wrote:
<< It all depends. Is ibogaine good science or just something to make
anti-junkies feel good? >>
ibogaine is something to make junkies feel good and good about themselves.
That is why they have pursued it for decades and demanded it of their
governments in the US and the Netherlands. To little avail needless to say. So who
are you to talk for the junkies?
Howard
From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] more from m. simon
Date: May 25, 2003 at 8:59:35 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Some one should explain to this guy the difference between ibogaine
for withdrawal– and placebo!
Dana/cnw
From:
“M. Simon” <msimon@xta.com>
Subject:
Re: GMfCL 2003 #32: Global Cannabis Wrap-up, 3rd
edition; Join 19 2004!
CC:
<greenpartydrugsgroup@gn.apc.org>,
<dana@cures-not-wars.org>, <yerbanena@hotmail.com>,
<risto.mikkonen@auriamail.net>, <gov02@msn.com>,
<indianbud@wirefire.com>, <initiativ@act4cannabis.lu>,
<mojca@drogart.com>, <ezpz@telkomsa.net>,
<newagecitizen@aol.com>, <hromi@kyberia.sk>,
<tushona@hotmail.com>, <pariah_mob@yahoo.com>,
<jc0_66@yahoo.com>, <irena.krzan@kiss.uni-lj.si>,
In-Reply-To:
<006701c31982$1b843d40$ea2e8e0a@JohnPack>
References:
<5.2.0.9.0.20030513131512.01d98e20@xta.com>
Mime-Version:
1.0
Content-Type:
text/plain; charset=”us-ascii”; format=flowed
X-Declude-Sender:
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X-Note:
This E-mail was scanned by Declude JunkMail
(www.declude.com) for spam.
At 01:00 PM 5/13/03 -0400, The Happy Hemptress wrote:
Personnally, I don’t see a problem…we fix things with drugs all the
time…
This is good. I have no problem fixing things with drugs. Let us be sure
that we actually know what we are fixing. And let us be sure it really works.
Reports I have read (I’d have to look them up) say that ibogaine is no
better than a placebo.
A certain number of people on drugs quit every year without therapy. About
the same number quit with therapy. Let us not confuse this natural effect
with ibogaine or other therapeutic success. So far there is no known
therapy that actually weans people from their addictions any faster than
nature does.
methadone is a drug & far worse than ibogaine.
Drug chauvinism. Heroin would be better than methadone of course, but it is
illegal.
There is nothing wrong with chronic drug use for those who need it. Even
heroin.
If that analogy is
used, people will understand. Even when I was addicted to nose spray when I
was a kid, my Doctor gave me antihistamine pills to ween me off the spray
till I could breath on my own.
Happy Hemptress
It all depends. Is ibogaine good science or just something to make
anti-junkies feel good?
Simon
From: “Joshua Tinnin” <krinklyfig@pacbell.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: MAPS: call for papers, Magic Journal
Date: May 25, 2003 at 5:40:09 PM EDT
To: “Ibogaine” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
—– Original Message —–
From: “dave evans” <achad13@hotmail.com>
This may fit in with the research areas of some subscribers to MAPS, for
example people studying shamanism and entheogen use
Call For Papers
The Journal for the Academic Study of Magic (JSM), a multidisciplinary,
peer-reviewed print publication, is seeking submissions for its second
annual edition, to be published in Spring 2004. Scholarly articles of up to
8000 words, written in English, plus shorter book reviews (up to 800 words)
and the like are welcomed. We aim to cover all areas of magic, witchcraft,
paganism etc; all geographical regions and all historical periods, and we
encourage articles from postgraduates, tenured academics and freelance
writers alike, using an academic style.
Submissions should be prepared according to the MHRA style guide (5th
edition). Please see their printed style guide (available in libraries and
bookshops) or their website http://www.mhra.org.uk/index.html, plus our own
guideline pages at http://www.sasm.co.uk/journal.html and
http://www.sasm.co.uk/chklist.html for style and content details. In light
of the breadth of submissions we received for Issue 1, we welcome early and
brief correspondence with authors to discuss intended articles and their
potential suitability for our journal- the above links also give guidelines
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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Perhaps you would like to reply to “M. Simon” <msimon@xta.com>
Date: May 25, 2003 at 3:06:15 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
From:
“M. Simon” <msimon@xta.com>
Subject:
Re: GMfCL 2003 #32: Global Cannabis Wrap-up, 3rd
edition; Join 19 2004!
CC:
yerbanena@hotmail.com,
risto.mikkonen@auriamail.net, “Ken Gorman” <gov02@msn.com>,
indianbud@wirefire.com, initiativ@act4cannabis.lu,
Mojca Straus <mojca@drogart.com>, ezpz@telkomsa.net,
newagecitizen@aol.com, hromi@kyberia.sk, “Terry
Mitchell” <tushona@hotmail.com>, pariah_mob@yahoo.com,
jc0_66@yahoo.com, “Irena”
<irena.krzan@kiss.uni-lj.si>, legalizemichigan@yahoo.com,
“Matthew Jorn” <matthewjorn@hotmail.com>,
The problem with Ibogaine is that it’s whole premise is that drugs cause
addiction.
If this is not the case (and modern brain science says it is not) then we
will have to cover a lot of ground given up to supporting the wrong theories.
Now it may be that ibogaine works on the amygdala where the fear/pain
memories responsible for addiction reside. But we have no evidence of that.
Until that evidence is there either anecdotally (to start) or
scientifically we are shooting ourselves in the foot.
Here are some good articles on modern brain science. It is time to get
modern. It is time to get scientific.
http://www.edge.org/documents/archive/edge6.html
http://www.edge.org/documents/archive/edge3.html
http://www.edge.org/documents/archive/edge105.html
Simon
[One has to ask, how can an inert substance “have a premise.” –Dana/cnw]
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 24, 2003 at 11:07:42 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
And there are other products, safflower or saffron
flower/safflower (MOCK saffron) used in cooking could
also be used to make MMDA, in fact a there is a whole
long list (nutmeg, dill, parsley seed, calamus,
crocus, saffron, vanilla beans, and sassafras…). I
have a jar of the shit I bought once in a Chinese
store thinking it might be saffron… looked a little
funny (I got beat!). I guess they don’t sell stuff
that cost more than gold for a few bucks a bag…
Technically I guess it is just if the government can
make up enough shit to make a case. If the kid thought
he was getting some (innocuous) sassafras root that
might give him an herbal BUZZ it is one thing (and he
is going to have to prove that), if he paid $25 for a
hit of it and it was 99/44 100th’s pure XTC… that is
another. My advice, hope he has no record, act dumb
and stupid, you didn’t know anything, it was suppose
to be like XTC only natural and “LEGAL”, there are
loads of those pills around (mostly
caffine/ephedrin…)… and if you have a list of
educational events (busts, are too “smart”), you are
fucked… time to pay your dues. FYI, you can in fact
get high on sassafras extract (from the saffrol), or
even maple syrup (from what I don’t know).
FWIW, yes I have heard of the term “sassafras extract”
used, there was even some product (GET HIGH PILL) on
the market once – that was really XTC or something
similar that was derived from sassafras and tweeked a
bit… The theme of sassafras extract and XTC go way
back, one claiming to be the other off and on at any
given time.
FYI
Herbal info on sassafras
(careful, high doses are cancer causing)
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/s/sassaf20.html
http://www.azarius.net/relax/sassafras.html
If anyone wants to buy safflower pills I can make you
plenty, cheap! Any other items you may want maybe
oregano in baggies or baking soda in small glassine
bags, feel free to ask (I even have instructions on
how to hyperventilate I will throw in at no extra
charge). Please send only cash in unidentifiable
envelopes.
Brett
— Joshua Tinnin <krinklyfig@pacbell.net> wrote:
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive
compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root
beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark,
however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the
US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for
other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it,
such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing
something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges,
although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more
serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a
similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would
also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a
state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is
lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it
was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only
tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be
analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client,
that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street
and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as
“Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is
now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check
with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation
connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help
this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson
and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the
District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 24, 2003 at 11:07:44 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
And there are other products, safflower or saffron
flower/safflower (MOCK saffron) used in cooking could
also be used to make MMDA, in fact a there is a whole
long list (nutmeg, dill, parsley seed, calamus,
crocus, saffron, vanilla beans, and sassafras…). I
have a jar of the shit I bought once in a Chinese
store thinking it might be saffron… looked a little
funny (I got beat!). I guess they don’t sell stuff
that cost more than gold for a few bucks a bag…
Technically I guess it is just if the government can
make up enough shit to make a case. If the kid thought
he was getting some (innocuous) sassafras root that
might give him an herbal BUZZ it is one thing (and he
is going to have to prove that), if he paid $25 for a
hit of it and it was 99/44 100th’s pure XTC… that is
another. My advice, hope he has no record, act dumb
and stupid, you didn’t know anything, it was suppose
to be like XTC only natural and “LEGAL”, there are
loads of those pills around (mostly
caffine/ephedrin…)… and if you have a list of
educational events (busts, are too “smart”), you are
fucked… time to pay your dues. FYI, you can in fact
get high on sassafras extract (from the saffrol), or
even maple syrup (from what I don’t know).
FWIW, yes I have heard of the term “sassafras extract”
used, there was even some product (GET HIGH PILL) on
the market once – that was really XTC or something
similar that was derived from sassafras and tweeked a
bit… The theme of sassafras extract and XTC go way
back, one claiming to be the other off and on at any
given time.
FYI
Herbal info on sassafras
(careful, high doses are cancer causing)
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/s/sassaf20.html
http://www.azarius.net/relax/sassafras.html
If anyone wants to buy safflower pills I can make you
plenty, cheap! Any other items you may want maybe
oregano in baggies or baking soda in small glassine
bags, feel free to ask (I even have instructions on
how to hyperventilate I will throw in at no extra
charge). Please send only cash in unidentifiable
envelopes.
Brett
— Joshua Tinnin <krinklyfig@pacbell.net> wrote:
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive
compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root
beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark,
however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the
US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for
other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it,
such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing
something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges,
although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more
serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a
similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would
also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a
state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is
lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it
was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only
tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be
analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client,
that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street
and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as
“Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is
now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check
with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation
connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help
this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson
and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the
District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 24, 2003 at 11:07:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
And there are other products, safflower or saffron
flower/safflower (MOCK saffron) used in cooking could
also be used to make MMDA, in fact a there is a whole
long list (nutmeg, dill, parsley seed, calamus,
crocus, saffron, vanilla beans, and sassafras…). I
have a jar of the shit I bought once in a Chinese
store thinking it might be saffron… looked a little
funny (I got beat!). I guess they don’t sell stuff
that cost more than gold for a few bucks a bag…
Technically I guess it is just if the government can
make up enough shit to make a case. If the kid thought
he was getting some (innocuous) sassafras root that
might give him an herbal BUZZ it is one thing (and he
is going to have to prove that), if he paid $25 for a
hit of it and it was 99/44 100th’s pure XTC… that is
another. My advice, hope he has no record, act dumb
and stupid, you didn’t know anything, it was suppose
to be like XTC only natural and “LEGAL”, there are
loads of those pills around (mostly
caffine/ephedrin…)… and if you have a list of
educational events (busts, are too “smart”), you are
fucked… time to pay your dues. FYI, you can in fact
get high on sassafras extract (from the saffrol), or
even maple syrup (from what I don’t know).
FWIW, yes I have heard of the term “sassafras extract”
used, there was even some product (GET HIGH PILL) on
the market once – that was really XTC or something
similar that was derived from sassafras and tweeked a
bit… The theme of sassafras extract and XTC go way
back, one claiming to be the other off and on at any
given time.
FYI
Herbal info on sassafras
(careful, high doses are cancer causing)
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/s/sassaf20.html
http://www.azarius.net/relax/sassafras.html
If anyone wants to buy safflower pills I can make you
plenty, cheap! Any other items you may want maybe
oregano in baggies or baking soda in small glassine
bags, feel free to ask (I even have instructions on
how to hyperventilate I will throw in at no extra
charge). Please send only cash in unidentifiable
envelopes.
Brett
— Joshua Tinnin <krinklyfig@pacbell.net> wrote:
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive
compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root
beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark,
however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the
US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for
other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it,
such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing
something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges,
although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more
serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a
similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would
also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a
state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is
lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it
was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only
tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be
analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client,
that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street
and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as
“Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is
now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check
with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation
connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help
this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson
and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the
District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 24, 2003 at 11:07:38 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
And there are other products, safflower or saffron
flower/safflower (MOCK saffron) used in cooking could
also be used to make MMDA, in fact a there is a whole
long list (nutmeg, dill, parsley seed, calamus,
crocus, saffron, vanilla beans, and sassafras…). I
have a jar of the shit I bought once in a Chinese
store thinking it might be saffron… looked a little
funny (I got beat!). I guess they don’t sell stuff
that cost more than gold for a few bucks a bag…
Technically I guess it is just if the government can
make up enough shit to make a case. If the kid thought
he was getting some (innocuous) sassafras root that
might give him an herbal BUZZ it is one thing (and he
is going to have to prove that), if he paid $25 for a
hit of it and it was 99/44 100th’s pure XTC… that is
another. My advice, hope he has no record, act dumb
and stupid, you didn’t know anything, it was suppose
to be like XTC only natural and “LEGAL”, there are
loads of those pills around (mostly
caffine/ephedrin…)… and if you have a list of
educational events (busts, are too “smart”), you are
fucked… time to pay your dues. FYI, you can in fact
get high on sassafras extract (from the saffrol), or
even maple syrup (from what I don’t know).
FWIW, yes I have heard of the term “sassafras extract”
used, there was even some product (GET HIGH PILL) on
the market once – that was really XTC or something
similar that was derived from sassafras and tweeked a
bit… The theme of sassafras extract and XTC go way
back, one claiming to be the other off and on at any
given time.
FYI
Herbal info on sassafras
(careful, high doses are cancer causing)
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/s/sassaf20.html
http://www.azarius.net/relax/sassafras.html
If anyone wants to buy safflower pills I can make you
plenty, cheap! Any other items you may want maybe
oregano in baggies or baking soda in small glassine
bags, feel free to ask (I even have instructions on
how to hyperventilate I will throw in at no extra
charge). Please send only cash in unidentifiable
envelopes.
Brett
— Joshua Tinnin <krinklyfig@pacbell.net> wrote:
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive
compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root
beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark,
however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the
US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for
other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it,
such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing
something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges,
although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more
serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a
similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would
also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a
state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is
lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it
was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only
tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be
analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client,
that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street
and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as
“Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is
now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check
with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation
connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help
this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson
and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the
District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 24, 2003 at 11:07:39 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
And there are other products, safflower or saffron
flower/safflower (MOCK saffron) used in cooking could
also be used to make MMDA, in fact a there is a whole
long list (nutmeg, dill, parsley seed, calamus,
crocus, saffron, vanilla beans, and sassafras…). I
have a jar of the shit I bought once in a Chinese
store thinking it might be saffron… looked a little
funny (I got beat!). I guess they don’t sell stuff
that cost more than gold for a few bucks a bag…
Technically I guess it is just if the government can
make up enough shit to make a case. If the kid thought
he was getting some (innocuous) sassafras root that
might give him an herbal BUZZ it is one thing (and he
is going to have to prove that), if he paid $25 for a
hit of it and it was 99/44 100th’s pure XTC… that is
another. My advice, hope he has no record, act dumb
and stupid, you didn’t know anything, it was suppose
to be like XTC only natural and “LEGAL”, there are
loads of those pills around (mostly
caffine/ephedrin…)… and if you have a list of
educational events (busts, are too “smart”), you are
fucked… time to pay your dues. FYI, you can in fact
get high on sassafras extract (from the saffrol), or
even maple syrup (from what I don’t know).
FWIW, yes I have heard of the term “sassafras extract”
used, there was even some product (GET HIGH PILL) on
the market once – that was really XTC or something
similar that was derived from sassafras and tweeked a
bit… The theme of sassafras extract and XTC go way
back, one claiming to be the other off and on at any
given time.
FYI
Herbal info on sassafras
(careful, high doses are cancer causing)
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/s/sassaf20.html
http://www.azarius.net/relax/sassafras.html
If anyone wants to buy safflower pills I can make you
plenty, cheap! Any other items you may want maybe
oregano in baggies or baking soda in small glassine
bags, feel free to ask (I even have instructions on
how to hyperventilate I will throw in at no extra
charge). Please send only cash in unidentifiable
envelopes.
Brett
— Joshua Tinnin <krinklyfig@pacbell.net> wrote:
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive
compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root
beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark,
however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the
US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for
other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it,
such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing
something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges,
although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more
serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a
similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would
also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a
state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is
lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it
was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only
tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be
analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client,
that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street
and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as
“Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is
now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check
with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation
connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help
this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson
and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the
District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 24, 2003 at 11:07:35 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
And there are other products, safflower or saffron
flower/safflower (MOCK saffron) used in cooking could
also be used to make MMDA, in fact a there is a whole
long list (nutmeg, dill, parsley seed, calamus,
crocus, saffron, vanilla beans, and sassafras…). I
have a jar of the shit I bought once in a Chinese
store thinking it might be saffron… looked a little
funny (I got beat!). I guess they don’t sell stuff
that cost more than gold for a few bucks a bag…
Technically I guess it is just if the government can
make up enough shit to make a case. If the kid thought
he was getting some (innocuous) sassafras root that
might give him an herbal BUZZ it is one thing (and he
is going to have to prove that), if he paid $25 for a
hit of it and it was 99/44 100th’s pure XTC… that is
another. My advice, hope he has no record, act dumb
and stupid, you didn’t know anything, it was suppose
to be like XTC only natural and “LEGAL”, there are
loads of those pills around (mostly
caffine/ephedrin…)… and if you have a list of
educational events (busts, are too “smart”), you are
fucked… time to pay your dues. FYI, you can in fact
get high on sassafras extract (from the saffrol), or
even maple syrup (from what I don’t know).
FWIW, yes I have heard of the term “sassafras extract”
used, there was even some product (GET HIGH PILL) on
the market once – that was really XTC or something
similar that was derived from sassafras and tweeked a
bit… The theme of sassafras extract and XTC go way
back, one claiming to be the other off and on at any
given time.
FYI
Herbal info on sassafras
(careful, high doses are cancer causing)
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/s/sassaf20.html
http://www.azarius.net/relax/sassafras.html
If anyone wants to buy safflower pills I can make you
plenty, cheap! Any other items you may want maybe
oregano in baggies or baking soda in small glassine
bags, feel free to ask (I even have instructions on
how to hyperventilate I will throw in at no extra
charge). Please send only cash in unidentifiable
envelopes.
Brett
— Joshua Tinnin <krinklyfig@pacbell.net> wrote:
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive
compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root
beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark,
however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the
US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for
other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it,
such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing
something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges,
although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more
serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a
similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would
also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a
state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is
lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it
was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only
tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be
analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client,
that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street
and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as
“Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is
now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check
with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation
connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help
this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson
and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the
District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 24, 2003 at 11:07:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
And there are other products, safflower or saffron
flower/safflower (MOCK saffron) used in cooking could
also be used to make MMDA, in fact a there is a whole
long list (nutmeg, dill, parsley seed, calamus,
crocus, saffron, vanilla beans, and sassafras…). I
have a jar of the shit I bought once in a Chinese
store thinking it might be saffron… looked a little
funny (I got beat!). I guess they don’t sell stuff
that cost more than gold for a few bucks a bag…
Technically I guess it is just if the government can
make up enough shit to make a case. If the kid thought
he was getting some (innocuous) sassafras root that
might give him an herbal BUZZ it is one thing (and he
is going to have to prove that), if he paid $25 for a
hit of it and it was 99/44 100th’s pure XTC… that is
another. My advice, hope he has no record, act dumb
and stupid, you didn’t know anything, it was suppose
to be like XTC only natural and “LEGAL”, there are
loads of those pills around (mostly
caffine/ephedrin…)… and if you have a list of
educational events (busts, are too “smart”), you are
fucked… time to pay your dues. FYI, you can in fact
get high on sassafras extract (from the saffrol), or
even maple syrup (from what I don’t know).
FWIW, yes I have heard of the term “sassafras extract”
used, there was even some product (GET HIGH PILL) on
the market once – that was really XTC or something
similar that was derived from sassafras and tweeked a
bit… The theme of sassafras extract and XTC go way
back, one claiming to be the other off and on at any
given time.
FYI
Herbal info on sassafras
(careful, high doses are cancer causing)
http://www.botanical.com/botanical/mgmh/s/sassaf20.html
http://www.azarius.net/relax/sassafras.html
If anyone wants to buy safflower pills I can make you
plenty, cheap! Any other items you may want maybe
oregano in baggies or baking soda in small glassine
bags, feel free to ask (I even have instructions on
how to hyperventilate I will throw in at no extra
charge). Please send only cash in unidentifiable
envelopes.
Brett
— Joshua Tinnin <krinklyfig@pacbell.net> wrote:
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive
compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root
beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark,
however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the
US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for
other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it,
such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing
something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges,
although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more
serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a
similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would
also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a
state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is
lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it
was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only
tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be
analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client,
that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street
and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as
“Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is
now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check
with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation
connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help
this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson
and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the
District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] news after NY conference
Date: May 24, 2003 at 4:59:30 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
—–Original Message—– From: laurent sazy [mailto:laurentsazy@free.fr] Sent: vrijdag 23 mei 2003 22:18 To: ibogaine@mindvox.com Subject: Re: [ibogaine] news after NY conference
On 22/05/03 20:17, “Ustanova Iboga” <Iboga@guest.arnes.si> wrote:
Hi Laurent,
I’m taking this opportunity to tell my experience with Dana.
Dana said that he will refound my ticket (from Ljubljana, Slovenija) and that I can stay at 9 Bleecker during the IBO conference in NY. He gave me money for the ticket (around 450 US$ I think), I shared a large bed (which was occupied by David Crocket Williams until I came – Thank you David!) with another person <male 🙁 > , I don’t remember if the bed smelled of cat urine because I got used to that smell very fast, that was the best solution in a house where so many cats live. Dana also paid food for everyone there (quite a bunch of people), and to be short – he took a good care of me. At least from my point of view.
I don’t know Dana’s daughter and haven’t done anything for her, for Dana, or for anyone related to him. But I met his son (when he came home and saw me in his bed, and Dana calmed him down), and Alice (from upstairs – Hi Alice!) is responsible for me being on this list; she has put me on a list of free receivers of Overthrow some 20 years ago, so I could read the first public article on Ibogaine and something in my head could make “click – that’s it”….
I was in trouble many times and I think I’ll be in trouble some more sometimes =) but the weel of luck keeps turning and I’m sure you’ll get your money back.
And yes, I don’t think Dana took IBO; we have discussed this issue on this list a few months ago ;-))
Bright up, life is SO beautiful and unique!
=)
Marko
At 09:17 22.5.2003, you wrote:
Hello,
My name is laurent sazy. i’m a photographer and i was invited for the NY ibogaine conference by Dana Beal After he came in Paris Last december.
I did a lot for his daughter when she was in Paris for 6 months.
THe deal for the conference was that Dana (cures not wars) took Malendi and my plane ticket expenses. I paid from Paris 750 euros and now i’m still waiting that Dana give me back the money. He just escape before my departure with shame on him.
Just for information i slept on a bed smelling pipi cat on 9 bleeker street!
Is that hospitallity when you invite people to speak at the conference.
i just write now this few words because now i’m on trouble with my bank( i have to put back 750 euros on my bank account and i can’t) and that will put me on trouble for my rent and my foods for next month.
How can a guy who is talking and writing on Iboga & ibogaine can do that(maybe Dana never took iboga) .
I sent dana e-mails now every day, NO ANSWER.
What do i have to think?
All the best
laurent
Dear Marko ,
Thank you for your testimony.
I received an another from Sara Glatt whose still waiting money for treatments she did.
I sent also e-mail to H. Lotsof .
I called dana , he told me that they are waiting the Police to be expulsed from 9 bleeker street so he can’t go outside the building!!!!
I think that I’m fuck or maybe it is again Dana new argument.
The problem is that 750 euros is a lot of money !
Yes , probably the wheel turn but one day you have to face yours problems,
Yes I didn’t think I will be swindle by organisers in coming to an ibogaine conference in New york!
I know by my experience that is possible like in Albania !!
In the Bwiti , it is the confession..and if you did bad things before, your visions will be terrifics.
All the best
laurent
Thanks you Laurent ,
“In the Bwiti , it is the confession..and if you did bad things before, your visions will be terrifics.”
Most people don’t have that level of understanding or inspiration around them,
EVEN after they have taken Iboga .
Evil is contagious, especially when it is hiding behind a sacrament.
Just remember “you can take the Blue pill or you can take the Red one”.
But what would you do if you have colour blindness?
Good is unique!
S.
From: “Joshua Tinnin” <krinklyfig@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 23, 2003 at 9:56:20 PM EDT
To: “Ibogaine” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Of course that should be spelled “psychoactive.” Not normally anal about
typos, but that one just looked funky …
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Joshua Tinnin” <krinklyfig@pacbell.net>
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark, however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it, such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges, although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client, that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as “Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
From: “Joshua Tinnin” <krinklyfig@pacbell.net>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 23, 2003 at 9:55:10 PM EDT
To: “Ibogaine” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Safrole, a precursor of MDMA and a spychoactive compound in its own right,
is found in sassafras root (used to make real root beer), and so is
therefore illegal in the US. Sassafras root bark, however, may be sold
legally. Sassafras does grow wild in parts of the US, and apparently it’s
only illegal when the root is sold for consumption.
http://www.shamanshop.net/store/proddetail.cfm/ItemID/7550.0/CategoryID/8500.0/SubCatID/0.0/file.htm
http://leda.lycaeum.org/Documents/MDMA_Synthesis:_Bromosafrole_Method.10588.shtml
This really is unfortunate, as it is useful for other things than the
production of MDMA. But there are ways around it, such as harvesting it
wild. IANAL, but I would think someone purchasing something different than
what he got might not be up for the same charges, although the charges for
purchasing a precursor of MDMA might be more serious. Again, IANAL, and I
don’t personally know anyone who has been through a similar situation, so
it’s best to ask da law speaking person … it would also depend on where
the offense took place, and whether or not it’s a state or fed charge. I
would hope sanity wins the day and the judge is lenient, considering the
lack of priors and the nature of the buy, i.e. it was something different
than what was purported, or perhaps their test only tested for safrole-
related compounds, in which case it should be analyzed again, if indeed
it’s not MDMA and is only sassafras root.
– jt
—– Original Message —–
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client, that purchased what he
thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street and was arrested and
jailed for what the crime lab reported back as “Extascy”. The “offender” is
age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is now facing a felony
conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check with my Internet
connections to see if there is any documentation connecting the two chemical
compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help this young man, I think
that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson and does not need to be
left to “The System” as another notch on the District Attorney’s campaign
contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Demon Kings, Revisited and partially annotated
Date: May 23, 2003 at 7:57:46 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Thanks for the annotated update Korvus.
.:vector:.
— korvusc@hushmail.com wrote:
Behold what Siren horrors yet
On Saturns day doth hold;
As Five and twenty bring what May
Whilst lies of state from Neptunes lips are told.
(May 25)
Two men, once Kings, by steely gaze
Oer field of battle, eyes of war are met:
West and North stands one times eight,
Gaeas angry neutered mate,
Though little more than Menkar—bound and chained.
(Clinton)
East and South is once by four,
Wretched son of Juno,
Rebellious child of blood and war.
As Diphda, by his own hand,
Overthrown;
Tossed down;
Reaches yet for starry crown.
Man of intrigue;
Dragons pawn;
He tears away Aguilas wings;
Fiery
Accursed angel fell
now stands he there upon the shore of the sea.
(GHWB)
Neptune rides his watery goat;
Capricorn his steed;
Fathered by the beast of War,
Brings violence to the earth and sea.
(GWB)
The Coastlands!
The Coastlands!
Cassiopia didst vainly cry,
Whilst daughter fair, Andromeda,
Mutely chained to rocks by foaming sea
and Cetus rising there.
Thence Perseus,
Child of Light, with Gorgons head held high,
Thru stoney-eyed Medusan gaze
Krakens might was wrought to stone
Whilst Atlas
Frozen;
Powerless;
stood and gazed nearby.
(Atlas Mountains)
Selah
By Neptunes rage, thereby, didst Mars,
God of War and Death conspire;
Thru intrigue and the nightly hunt of Luna
Sets the chained Cetus free.
Away!
Away!
Once tethered fishes quickly swam;
But Futile hope;
By chance?
By fate?
Empty wish and vain attempt;
Straining to escape the coming horrors:
Neptunes Kraken come to flesh;
Rising head above the waves;
Once again to terrorize the coastlands and the sea.
At hours 1st, yet still at 10,
Orion, wounded, watched and wept;
Aguilas,
The Sacred Eagles wings were torn;
From Gibraltars heights,
Though toward the East,
Unto the oceans raging foam, and Neptunes hand, she fell,
(East of Gibraltar)
At last came Hathor to celebrate his feast in Hell.
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: “ARON KAY” <pieman@pieman.org>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] news after NY conference
Date: May 23, 2003 at 4:23:03 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
thank you marko, i recall that conference…everybody was taken care of by dana who was hosting the meeting….in fact, i have to thank you for giving me taxi faRE due to problems i have with my legs.
ARON KAY-
DROP BONGS NOT BOMBS!
http://www.pieman.org/
bush and asscroft are promoting the latest version of
kristallnacht..we culture freex must rise to defend our diverse cultures of race, rap, rock, rainbow
and reggae music, art and dance from the jaws of the fascist machine-which is attempting to perpetrate a a nation of blind obedience.
we must make sure they get the glitches in their machine so the people will prevail
—– Original Message —–
From: laurent sazy
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 23, 2003 4:18 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] news after NY conference
On 22/05/03 20:17, “Ustanova Iboga” <Iboga@guest.arnes.si> wrote:
Hi Laurent,
I’m taking this opportunity to tell my experience with Dana.
Dana said that he will refound my ticket (from Ljubljana, Slovenija) and that I can stay at 9 Bleecker during the IBO conference in NY. He gave me money for the ticket (around 450 US$ I think), I shared a large bed (which was occupied by David Crocket Williams until I came – Thank you David!) with another person <male 🙁 > , I don’t remember if the bed smelled of cat urine because I got used to that smell very fast, that was the best solution in a house where so many cats live. Dana also paid food for everyone there (quite a bunch of people), and to be short – he took a good care of me. At least from my point of view.
I don’t know Dana’s daughter and haven’t done anything for her, for Dana, or for anyone related to him. But I met his son (when he came home and saw me in his bed, and Dana calmed him down), and Alice (from upstairs – Hi Alice!) is responsible for me being on this list; she has put me on a list of free receivers of Overthrow some 20 years ago, so I could read the first public article on Ibogaine and something in my head could make “click – that’s it”….
I was in trouble many times and I think I’ll be in trouble some more sometimes =) but the weel of luck keeps turning and I’m sure you’ll get your money back.
And yes, I don’t think Dana took IBO; we have discussed this issue on this list a few months ago ;-))
Bright up, life is SO beautiful and unique!
=)
Marko
At 09:17 22.5.2003, you wrote:
Hello,
My name is laurent sazy. i’m a photographer and i was invited for the NY ibogaine conference by Dana Beal After he came in Paris Last december.
I did a lot for his daughter when she was in Paris for 6 months.
THe deal for the conference was that Dana (cures not wars) took Malendi and my plane ticket expenses. I paid from Paris 750 euros and now i’m still waiting that Dana give me back the money. He just escape before my departure with shame on him.
Just for information i slept on a bed smelling pipi cat on 9 bleeker street!
Is that hospitallity when you invite people to speak at the conference.
i just write now this few words because now i’m on trouble with my bank( i have to put back 750 euros on my bank account and i can’t) and that will put me on trouble for my rent and my foods for next month.
How can a guy who is talking and writing on Iboga & ibogaine can do that(maybe Dana never took iboga) .
I sent dana e-mails now every day, NO ANSWER.
What do i have to think?
All the best
laurent
Dear Marko ,
Thank you for your testimony.
I received an another from Sara Glatt whose still waiting money for treatments she did.
I sent also e-mail to H. Lotsof .
I called dana , he told me that they are waiting the Police to be expulsed from 9 bleeker street so he can稚 go outside the building!!!!
I think that I知 fuck or maybe it is again Dana new argument.
The problem is that 750 euros is a lot of money !
Yes , probably the wheel turn but one day you have to face yours problems,
Yes I didn稚 think I will be swindle by organisers in coming to an ibogaine conference in New york!
I know by my experience that is possible like in Albania !!
In the Bwiti , it is the confession..and if you did bad things before, your visions will be terrifics.
All the best
laurent
From: laurent sazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] news after NY conference
Date: May 23, 2003 at 4:18:06 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
On 22/05/03 20:17, “Ustanova Iboga” <Iboga@guest.arnes.si> wrote:
Hi Laurent,
I’m taking this opportunity to tell my experience with Dana.
Dana said that he will refound my ticket (from Ljubljana, Slovenija) and that I can stay at 9 Bleecker during the IBO conference in NY. He gave me money for the ticket (around 450 US$ I think), I shared a large bed (which was occupied by David Crocket Williams until I came – Thank you David!) with another person <male 🙁 > , I don’t remember if the bed smelled of cat urine because I got used to that smell very fast, that was the best solution in a house where so many cats live. Dana also paid food for everyone there (quite a bunch of people), and to be short – he took a good care of me. At least from my point of view.
I don’t know Dana’s daughter and haven’t done anything for her, for Dana, or for anyone related to him. But I met his son (when he came home and saw me in his bed, and Dana calmed him down), and Alice (from upstairs – Hi Alice!) is responsible for me being on this list; she has put me on a list of free receivers of Overthrow some 20 years ago, so I could read the first public article on Ibogaine and something in my head could make “click – that’s it”….
I was in trouble many times and I think I’ll be in trouble some more sometimes =) but the weel of luck keeps turning and I’m sure you’ll get your money back.
And yes, I don’t think Dana took IBO; we have discussed this issue on this list a few months ago ;-))
Bright up, life is SO beautiful and unique!
=)
Marko
At 09:17 22.5.2003, you wrote:
Hello,
My name is laurent sazy. i’m a photographer and i was invited for the NY ibogaine conference by Dana Beal After he came in Paris Last december.
I did a lot for his daughter when she was in Paris for 6 months.
THe deal for the conference was that Dana (cures not wars) took Malendi and my plane ticket expenses. I paid from Paris 750 euros and now i’m still waiting that Dana give me back the money. He just escape before my departure with shame on him.
Just for information i slept on a bed smelling pipi cat on 9 bleeker street!
Is that hospitallity when you invite people to speak at the conference.
i just write now this few words because now i’m on trouble with my bank( i have to put back 750 euros on my bank account and i can’t) and that will put me on trouble for my rent and my foods for next month.
How can a guy who is talking and writing on Iboga & ibogaine can do that(maybe Dana never took iboga) .
I sent dana e-mails now every day, NO ANSWER.
What do i have to think?
All the best
laurent
Dear Marko ,
Thank you for your testimony.
I received an another from Sara Glatt whose still waiting money for treatments she did.
I sent also e-mail to H. Lotsof .
I called dana , he told me that they are waiting the Police to be expulsed from 9 bleeker street so he can’t go outside the building!!!!
I think that I’m fuck or maybe it is again Dana new argument.
The problem is that 750 euros is a lot of money !
Yes , probably the wheel turn but one day you have to face yours problems,
Yes I didn’t think I will be swindle by organisers in coming to an ibogaine conference in New york!
I know by my experience that is possible like in Albania !!
In the Bwiti , it is the confession..and if you did bad things before, your visions will be terrifics.
All the best
laurent
From: <korvusc@hushmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Demon Kings, Revisited and partially annotated
Date: May 23, 2003 at 11:40:08 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Behold what Siren horrors yet
On Saturns day doth hold;
As Five and twenty bring what May
Whilst lies of state from Neptunes lips are told.
(May 25)
Two men, once Kings, by steely gaze
Oer field of battle, eyes of war are met:
West and North stands one times eight,
Gaeas angry neutered mate,
Though little more than Menkar—bound and chained.
(Clinton)
East and South is once by four,
Wretched son of Juno,
Rebellious child of blood and war.
As Diphda, by his own hand,
Overthrown;
Tossed down;
Reaches yet for starry crown.
Man of intrigue;
Dragons pawn;
He tears away Aguilas wings;
Fiery
Accursed angel fell
now stands he there upon the shore of the sea.
(GHWB)
Neptune rides his watery goat;
Capricorn his steed;
Fathered by the beast of War,
Brings violence to the earth and sea.
(GWB)
The Coastlands!
The Coastlands!
Cassiopia didst vainly cry,
Whilst daughter fair, Andromeda,
Mutely chained to rocks by foaming sea
and Cetus rising there.
Thence Perseus,
Child of Light, with Gorgons head held high,
Thru stoney-eyed Medusan gaze
Krakens might was wrought to stone
Whilst Atlas
Frozen;
Powerless;
stood and gazed nearby.
(Atlas Mountains)
Selah
By Neptunes rage, thereby, didst Mars,
God of War and Death conspire;
Thru intrigue and the nightly hunt of Luna
Sets the chained Cetus free.
Away!
Away!
Once tethered fishes quickly swam;
But Futile hope;
By chance?
By fate?
Empty wish and vain attempt;
Straining to escape the coming horrors:
Neptunes Kraken come to flesh;
Rising head above the waves;
Once again to terrorize the coastlands and the sea.
At hours 1st, yet still at 10,
Orion, wounded, watched and wept;
Aguilas,
The Sacred Eagles wings were torn;
From Gibraltars heights,
Though toward the East,
Unto the oceans raging foam, and Neptunes hand, she fell,
(East of Gibraltar)
At last came Hathor to celebrate his feast in Hell.
Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
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From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Sassafras Defense
Date: May 22, 2003 at 8:42:09 PM EDT
To: <ADDICT-L@LISTSERV.KENT.EDU>
Cc: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Greetings:
I have an attorney friend, representing a client, that purchased what he thought was “Sassafras Root” extract on the street and was arrested and jailed for what the crime lab reported back as “Extascy”. The “offender” is age 23, has never been arrested in his life, and is now facing a felony conviction. My attorney friend has asked me to check with my Internet connections to see if there is any documentation connecting the two chemical compounds. (One is legal, and the other is not).
If anyone is aware of any research that could help this young man, I think that he has already learned a hard, valuable lesson and does not need to be left to “The System” as another notch on the District Attorney’s campaign contribution trail…
Please advise,
Les
____________________________________________________
IncrediMail – Email has finally evolved – Click Here
From: Ustanova Iboga <Iboga@guest.arnes.si>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] news after NY conference
Date: May 22, 2003 at 2:17:08 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi Laurent,
I’m taking this opportunity to tell my experience with Dana.
Dana said that he will refound my ticket (from Ljubljana, Slovenija) and that I can stay at 9 Bleecker during the IBO conference in NY. He gave me money for the ticket (around 450 US$ I think), I shared a large bed (which was occupied by David Crocket Williams until I came – Thank you David!) with another person <male 🙁 > , I don’t remember if the bed smelled of cat urine because I got used to that smell very fast, that was the best solution in a house where so many cats live. Dana also paid food for everyone there (quite a bunch of people), and to be short – he took a good care of me. At least from my point of view.
I don’t know Dana’s daughter and haven’t done anything for her, for Dana, or for anyone related to him. But I met his son (when he came home and saw me in his bed, and Dana calmed him down), and Alice (from upstairs – Hi Alice!) is responsible for me being on this list; she has put me on a list of free receivers of Overthrow some 20 years ago, so I could read the first public article on Ibogaine and something in my head could make “click – that’s it”….
I was in trouble many times and I think I’ll be in trouble some more sometimes =) but the weel of luck keeps turning and I’m sure you’ll get your money back.
And yes, I don’t think Dana took IBO; we have discussed this issue on this list a few months ago ;-))
Bright up, life is SO beautiful and unique!
=)
Marko
At 09:17 22.5.2003, you wrote:
Hello,
My name is laurent sazy. i’m a photographer and i was invited for the NY ibogaine conference by Dana Beal After he came in Paris Last december.
I did a lot for his daughter when she was in Paris for 6 months.
THe deal for the conference was that Dana (cures not wars) took Malendi and my plane ticket expenses. I paid from Paris 750 euros and now i’m still waiting that Dana give me back the money. He just escape before my departure with shame on him.
Just for information i slept on a bed smelling pipi cat on 9 bleeker street!
Is that hospitallity when you invite people to speak at the conference.
i just write now this few words because now i’m on trouble with my bank( i have to put back 750 euros on my bank account and i can’t) and that will put me on trouble for my rent and my foods for next month.
How can a guy who is talking and writing on Iboga & ibogaine can do that(maybe Dana never took iboga) .
I sent dana e-mails now every day, NO ANSWER.
What do i have to think?
All the best
laurent
From: laurentsazy <laurentsazy@free.fr>
Subject: [ibogaine] news after NY conference
Date: May 22, 2003 at 3:17:59 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hello,
My name is laurent sazy. i’m a photographer and i was invited for the NY ibogaine conference by Dana Beal After he came in Paris Last december.
I did a lot for his daughter when she was in Paris for 6 months.
THe deal for the conference was that Dana (cures not wars) took Malendi and my plane ticket expenses. I paid from Paris 750 euros and now i’m still waiting that Dana give me back the money. He just escape before my departure with shame on him.
Just for information i slept on a bed smelling pipi cat on 9 bleeker street!
Is that hospitallity when you invite people to speak at the conference.
i just write now this few words because now i’m on trouble with my bank( i have to put back 750 euros on my bank account and i can’t) and that will put me on trouble for my rent and my foods for next month.
How can a guy who is talking and writing on Iboga & ibogaine can do that(maybe Dana never took iboga) .
I sent dana e-mails now every day, NO ANSWER.
What do i have to think?
All the best
laurent
From: “Allison Senepart” <aa.senepart@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment on ibogaine
Date: May 21, 2003 at 9:35:15 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I am obviously way out of touch in the back boonies of NZ. Are you supposed
to dress to go with your car or if you are a junkie or ex-junkie. Do people
with alcoholism have special clothes??? or any other people you want to
fit into little squares. How ridiculous. Thats like saying Hippies can’t
wear suits or something equally stupid. Sounds very like a woman I know who
judges her potential boyfriends on what they wear. ie: “I could never go
out with a man who wears … etc. etc.” Perhaps being that shallow is why
she still lives on her own. She obviously hasn’t found a guy that drives a
mercedes and dresses appropriately, whatever that is. Whatever, I must have
missed all that cos I just put on what I feel like and bugger what anyone
else thinks.
Allison
—– Original Message —–
From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 4:03 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment
on ibogaine
I agree, it was a good show. Lot of coverage and a lot of time. Great
job Marc! 🙂
Bro, the rest was very not necessary. Dr. Mash is always going to say
what she’s going to say, the lady isn’t bothering you personally and
it isn’t like anyone is making you give her $12000. Like you said, you
went somewhere else. So what’s the problem?
Bagging on Patrick was very not necessary either. He’s just sitting there
bro, he didn’t even say anything. If he looks good while sitting there,
likes to dress in faded shirts and drive a Mercedes, I don’t see the
need to take it personally.
Patrick, sorry bro, you really do take a lot of shit for nothing. Almost
everyone on this list does at one time or another, but when I think about,
you run a forum for free and then people use it to attack you for
nothing.
You may have anger management issues 🙂 but you also have a lot of
patience.
Peace out,
Curtis
On Tue, 20 May 2003 20:17:58 -0700 miracle3@hushmail.com wrote:
Thanks for the link.
Not bad. Marc you come across very well, I like Iboga Therapy House.
Mash has the same tired bullshit to say. Give me $12000 or die.
How many
times have I heard that. Oh yes, every time I’ve ever called asking
about
treatment before going somewhere else.
Patrick……………. You look mahvelous. Nice bod dog. A little
piece
of free advice, grunge is dead now. You don’t look like a junkie
dressed
that way anyway. You look like you ran off a Indiana Jones movie.
You
drive a Mercedes, go buy a shirt that isn’t pre shredded and ultra
faded.
They cost $20. Or $500 if you want to go to Saks for it.
Not a bad piece at all. Nice show Marc.
On Tue, 20 May 2003 17:08:21 -0700 MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca> wrote:
Here’s the link
http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-1977.html
on that Ibogaine show
now on Pot-tv.net
Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
https://www.hushmail.com/services.php?subloc=messenger&l=434
Big $$$ to be made with the HushMail Affiliate Program:
https://www.hushmail.com/about.php?subloc=affiliate&l=427
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] (still OT) Re: Patrick and cog people gear
Date: May 21, 2003 at 6:45:52 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
You
drive a Mercedes, go buy a shirt that isn’t pre shredded and ultra faded.<
On another note related to the above and having nothing whatsoever I can
think of to do with Ibogaine or drugs at all, (Sorry, I’m just a bit taken
aback that someone on the ibogaine list can think so…so…so, oh, how to
say it, shallowly? Establishment-like? Status-quo addled? Not sure exactly,
but you may get the drift of what I’m trying to say.) you know, or don’t
know I take it, that in Norway at least, my ex-wife’s brother was a cabbie.
He drove two different taxis on a regular basis- one being a Mercedes, and
the other a BMW. This was not an unusual thing either- every cabbie in
Bergen drove the same kinds of taxis, usually Mercedes, slightly less often
BMWs.
And, what do you know, they even quite often wore faded clothing if not
actually ripped up.
Peace,
Preston
—– Original Message —–
From: preston peet
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 21, 2003 6:12 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] (OT) Re: Patrick and cog people gear
A little piece
of free advice, grunge is dead now. You don’t look like a junkie dressed
that way anyway. You look like you ran off a Indiana Jones movie. You
drive a Mercedes, go buy a shirt that isn’t pre shredded and ultra faded.
They cost $20. Or $500 if you want to go to Saks for it.<
I see this is passed in a light hearted manner, and I’m glad. Otherwise I’d
have to ask, “You’ve got to be kidding, right?” You’re riffing on Patrick
cause of his clothing? (LOL, who wants to shop at Saks for their cog people
gear? Or wants to wear someone else’s idea of the “right” cog people gear?)
I mean, maybe Patrick would, but somehow I don’t see Patrick really caring
all that much either way, whether he fits someone else’s idea of how someone
who drives a Mercedes should dress or not. What a silly idea in the first
place, “you drive a Mercedes, so look like it…” ummm, yeah, right.’;-)))
That said, I don’t drive a Mercedes and perhaps some might say I don’t
look like I drive one either…but then again….
Peace,
Preston
—– Original Message —–
From: miracle3@hushmail.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 11:17 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment
on ibogaine
Thanks for the link.
Not bad. Marc you come across very well, I like Iboga Therapy House.
Mash has the same tired bullshit to say. Give me $12000 or die. How many
times have I heard that. Oh yes, every time I’ve ever called asking about
treatment before going somewhere else.
Patrick……………. You look mahvelous. Nice bod dog. A little piece
of free advice, grunge is dead now. You don’t look like a junkie dressed
that way anyway. You look like you ran off a Indiana Jones movie. You
drive a Mercedes, go buy a shirt that isn’t pre shredded and ultra faded.
They cost $20. Or $500 if you want to go to Saks for it.
Not a bad piece at all. Nice show Marc.
On Tue, 20 May 2003 17:08:21 -0700 MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca> wrote:
Here’s the link
http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-1977.html
on that Ibogaine show
now on Pot-tv.net
Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
https://www.hushmail.com/services.php?subloc=messenger&l=434
Big $$$ to be made with the HushMail Affiliate Program:
https://www.hushmail.com/about.php?subloc=affiliate&l=427
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] (OT) Re: Patrick and cog people gear
Date: May 21, 2003 at 6:12:27 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
A little piece
of free advice, grunge is dead now. You don’t look like a junkie dressed
that way anyway. You look like you ran off a Indiana Jones movie. You
drive a Mercedes, go buy a shirt that isn’t pre shredded and ultra faded.
They cost $20. Or $500 if you want to go to Saks for it.<
I see this is passed in a light hearted manner, and I’m glad. Otherwise I’d
have to ask, “You’ve got to be kidding, right?” You’re riffing on Patrick
cause of his clothing? (LOL, who wants to shop at Saks for their cog people
gear? Or wants to wear someone else’s idea of the “right” cog people gear?)
I mean, maybe Patrick would, but somehow I don’t see Patrick really caring
all that much either way, whether he fits someone else’s idea of how someone
who drives a Mercedes should dress or not. What a silly idea in the first
place, “you drive a Mercedes, so look like it…” ummm, yeah, right.’;-)))
That said, I don’t drive a Mercedes and perhaps some might say I don’t
look like I drive one either…but then again….
Peace,
Preston
—– Original Message —–
From: miracle3@hushmail.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Tuesday, May 20, 2003 11:17 PM
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment
on ibogaine
Thanks for the link.
Not bad. Marc you come across very well, I like Iboga Therapy House.
Mash has the same tired bullshit to say. Give me $12000 or die. How many
times have I heard that. Oh yes, every time I’ve ever called asking about
treatment before going somewhere else.
Patrick……………. You look mahvelous. Nice bod dog. A little piece
of free advice, grunge is dead now. You don’t look like a junkie dressed
that way anyway. You look like you ran off a Indiana Jones movie. You
drive a Mercedes, go buy a shirt that isn’t pre shredded and ultra faded.
They cost $20. Or $500 if you want to go to Saks for it.
Not a bad piece at all. Nice show Marc.
On Tue, 20 May 2003 17:08:21 -0700 MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca> wrote:
Here’s the link
http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-1977.html
on that Ibogaine show
now on Pot-tv.net
Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
https://www.hushmail.com/services.php?subloc=messenger&l=434
Big $$$ to be made with the HushMail Affiliate Program:
https://www.hushmail.com/about.php?subloc=affiliate&l=427
From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment on ibogaine
Date: May 21, 2003 at 12:03:06 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I agree, it was a good show. Lot of coverage and a lot of time. Great
job Marc! 🙂
Bro, the rest was very not necessary. Dr. Mash is always going to say
what she’s going to say, the lady isn’t bothering you personally and
it isn’t like anyone is making you give her $12000. Like you said, you
went somewhere else. So what’s the problem?
Bagging on Patrick was very not necessary either. He’s just sitting there
bro, he didn’t even say anything. If he looks good while sitting there,
likes to dress in faded shirts and drive a Mercedes, I don’t see the
need to take it personally.
Patrick, sorry bro, you really do take a lot of shit for nothing. Almost
everyone on this list does at one time or another, but when I think about,
you run a forum for free and then people use it to attack you for nothing.
You may have anger management issues 🙂 but you also have a lot of patience.
Peace out,
Curtis
On Tue, 20 May 2003 20:17:58 -0700 miracle3@hushmail.com wrote:
Thanks for the link.
Not bad. Marc you come across very well, I like Iboga Therapy House.
Mash has the same tired bullshit to say. Give me $12000 or die.
How many
times have I heard that. Oh yes, every time I’ve ever called asking
about
treatment before going somewhere else.
Patrick……………. You look mahvelous. Nice bod dog. A little
piece
of free advice, grunge is dead now. You don’t look like a junkie
dressed
that way anyway. You look like you ran off a Indiana Jones movie.
You
drive a Mercedes, go buy a shirt that isn’t pre shredded and ultra
faded.
They cost $20. Or $500 if you want to go to Saks for it.
Not a bad piece at all. Nice show Marc.
On Tue, 20 May 2003 17:08:21 -0700 MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca> wrote:
Here’s the link
http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-1977.html
on that Ibogaine show
now on Pot-tv.net
Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
https://www.hushmail.com/services.php?subloc=messenger&l=434
Big $$$ to be made with the HushMail Affiliate Program:
https://www.hushmail.com/about.php?subloc=affiliate&l=427
From: <miracle3@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment on ibogaine
Date: May 20, 2003 at 11:17:58 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Thanks for the link.
Not bad. Marc you come across very well, I like Iboga Therapy House.
Mash has the same tired bullshit to say. Give me $12000 or die. How many
times have I heard that. Oh yes, every time I’ve ever called asking about
treatment before going somewhere else.
Patrick……………. You look mahvelous. Nice bod dog. A little piece
of free advice, grunge is dead now. You don’t look like a junkie dressed
that way anyway. You look like you ran off a Indiana Jones movie. You
drive a Mercedes, go buy a shirt that isn’t pre shredded and ultra faded.
They cost $20. Or $500 if you want to go to Saks for it.
Not a bad piece at all. Nice show Marc.
On Tue, 20 May 2003 17:08:21 -0700 MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca> wrote:
Here’s the link
http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-1977.html
on that Ibogaine show
now on Pot-tv.net
Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
Free, ultra-private instant messaging with Hush Messenger
https://www.hushmail.com/services.php?subloc=messenger&l=434
Big $$$ to be made with the HushMail Affiliate Program:
https://www.hushmail.com/about.php?subloc=affiliate&l=427
From: MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment on ibogaine
Date: May 20, 2003 at 8:08:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Here’s the link
http://www.pot-tv.net/archive/shows/pottvshowse-1977.html
on that Ibogaine show
now on Pot-tv.net
From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment on ibogaine
Date: May 20, 2003 at 7:32:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Marc this link doesn’t work for me at all. All I get is a story about
mad cow disease and then some sports.
When you put it on Pot TV please post the link!
.:vector:.
— MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca> wrote:
Last night, Canada’s television national news, the CBC network,
broadcast a
14 minute segment about Marc Emery & the Iboga Therapy House. I
thought it
was fine. Watch it here.
http://www.cbc.ca/newscast.html
Click on newscast and go to the middle, it starts at the 30 minute
mark of
the hour long broadcast. Will only be on the site for about 6 more
hours,
though it will be up on POT-TV.net later today.
Marc Emery
__________________________________
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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Topamax & drinking
Date: May 20, 2003 at 7:32:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hey I was just getting started! 🙂
.:vector:.
— HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
To turn off the internet:
http://www.turnofftheinternet.com/
Howard
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From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment on ibogaine
Date: May 20, 2003 at 6:20:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
This link works for me
http://www.cbc.ca/news/video_console/thenational.html
— MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca> wrote:
Last night, Canada’s television national news, the
CBC network, broadcast a
14 minute segment about Marc Emery & the Iboga
Therapy House. I thought it
was fine. Watch it here.
http://www.cbc.ca/newscast.html
Click on newscast and go to the middle, it starts at
the 30 minute mark of
the hour long broadcast. Will only be on the site
for about 6 more hours,
though it will be up on POT-TV.net later today.
Marc Emery
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From: MARC <marc420emery@shaw.ca>
Subject: [ibogaine] CBC- Canadian National News does 14 minute segment on ibogaine
Date: May 20, 2003 at 3:24:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Last night, Canada’s television national news, the CBC network, broadcast a
14 minute segment about Marc Emery & the Iboga Therapy House. I thought it
was fine. Watch it here.
http://www.cbc.ca/newscast.html
Click on newscast and go to the middle, it starts at the 30 minute mark of
the hour long broadcast. Will only be on the site for about 6 more hours,
though it will be up on POT-TV.net later today.
Marc Emery
From: Heathen34@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Unsubscribe me please
Date: May 20, 2003 at 1:45:40 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
From: “Les Smith” <leesmithjr@prodigy.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Hallucinogen May Help Treat Alcoholism
Date: May 20, 2003 at 1:36:42 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
A neurobiologist at the University of Minnesota wants to conduct a study to test the effectiveness of using exotic hallucinogenic plants to treat alcohol addiction, the Minnesota Daily reported May 8.
Dennis McKenna said he got the idea for the study after a 1993 trip to Brazil with an international consortium of scientists, who investigated an Amazonian medicinal drink called ayahuasca.
The scientists found that the drink, which contained two indigenous hallucinogenic plants, helped to treat alcohol and other drug addiction, violent tendencies, and suicidal thoughts in a number of Brazilian church members.
”You have a group of people who were basically dysfunctional,” McKenna said. “They’re addicted, they have suicidal problems, they join the church, they start taking ayahuasca, the biochemical profile is reversed, and the behavioral profile greatly improves.”
The scientific team found that long-term users of ayahuasca had more brain receptors for serotonin, a neurotransmitter that helps regulate moods, than nonusers.
”There was a greater density of these things in the membranes of the neurons,” McKenna said. “And that was kind of a head-scratcher in the first place. There were no other drugs recorded or known to do this.”
Previous studies have shown a link between low densities of serotonin receptors and alcoholism, severe depression, and violent behavior.
McKenna has approached the National Institutes of Health for funding to research ayahuasca’s effectiveness to treat alcoholism. He expects a response in October.
Because ayahuasca is a controlled substance, McKenna also needs the approval to conduct research on human subjects from the U.S. Food and Drug Administration, the Drug Enforcement Agency, and the University of Minnesota Institutional Review Board.
http://www.jointogether.org/sa/news/summaries/reader/0%2C1854%2C563333%2C00.html
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From: “Randy Hencken” <randyhencken@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Needle Exchange Workers?
Date: May 19, 2003 at 3:31:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Is there anyone on this list who works for a needle exchange and has active contact with current heroin users?
Randy
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From: “Randy Hencken” <randyhencken@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] sound and vision
Date: May 19, 2003 at 2:16:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
anything by african head charge (what an appropriate name) infact, most music on the label on-u-sounds records – creation rebel,dub syndicate,new age steppers, dr pablo (again appropriate!), mark stewart & the maffia….etc
get on kazza etc and download
anyone else got any sounds that reflect the sonic shock of ibogaine?
TOOL,off the most recent album Lateralus – Lateralus, Disposition, Reflection & Triad.
Having been a tool fan for years now, I’ve enjoyed a great change and growth in thier music. I project that during their earlier albums the band was doing dope. Sometime after Aenima they ate Iboga and drank Ayahuasca (Alex Grey did the most recent Album cover as well as thier backdrops for the latest tour. Plus they had large replicas of his Sacred Mirrors unfold from the rafters during the finalies of thier shows.) and created Lateralus, an Album about healing, psychedelic introspection, communication, positivity…. Buy the Album.
Peace,
Randy
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From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] questions….
Date: May 19, 2003 at 1:35:27 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi all,
Are there any reliable figures anywhere that can be quoted and/or cited
that may tell me:
1- how many people have been treated for drug addiction with ibogaine,, in
the US (which I guess would be kinda hard to come up with as it’s illegal)
and world wide? (or does anyone have guestimates they’d like to throw out
for me?)
2- How many people called/call their treatment successful?
3- How long does the average person stay “clean” after an ibogaine session?
4- How many sessions would be considered the norm for getting someone
un-sprung? More than one? Two?
5- Anyone want to tell me a personal story about their using ibogaine to get
clean here on list, or send me a private note at
ptpeet@nyc.rr.com? Thanks if so. If I use a quote or two from the story, at
your discretion I can either stick to your first name or full name, as you
wish. But these are for an article due as soon as I can turn it in, so any
help with these will be much appreciated.
Peace,
Preston
From: “paul jackamo” <pauljackamo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] sound and vision
Date: May 17, 2003 at 10:57:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I would have loved to have a playback of my ibogaine visions. It seemed at the time as though every sensory impression that had ever been recorded on my retina was played back to me in montage form at 24 frames per second.
While very little external imagery resonates with me (gamma’s pictures and african art aside) – music is a different story –
digeridoo by aphex twin seems to capture the sonic dimensions perfectlly.
anything by african head charge (what an appropriate name) infact, most music on the label on-u-sounds records – creation rebel,dub syndicate,new age steppers, dr pablo (again appropriate!), mark stewart & the maffia….etc
get on kazza etc and download
anyone else got any sounds that reflect the sonic shock of ibogaine?
the only sound that seemed to approximate the beta-carboline/tryptamine carrier wave as it spirals into infinity was a series of recordings by an english guy called harry oldfield who generated sounds from crystals – really captures the pitch shift as ibospace unfolds.
paul.
From: Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] visualization
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 18:55:23 -0700 (PDT)
Interesting. I always wanted to make an iboga “movie,” but then realized it would be so personal, who but me would want to see it, and in fact, wouldnt it be too much my vision, hampering perhaps others? Still, love your insights. Jane
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From: “paul jackamo” <pauljackamo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] sound and vision
Date: May 17, 2003 at 10:56:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I would have loved to have a playback of my ibogaine visions. It seemed at the time as though every sensory impression that had ever been recorded on my retina was played back to me in montage form at 24 frames per second.
While very little external imagery resonates with me (gamma’s pictures and african art aside) – music is a different story –
digeridoo by aphex twin seems to capture the sonic dimensions perfectlly.
anything by african head charge (what an appropriate name) infact, most music on the label on-u-sounds records – creation rebel,dub syndicate,new age steppers, dr pablo (again appropriate!), mark stewart & the maffia….etc
get on kazza etc and download
anyone else got any sounds that reflect the sonic shock of ibogaine?
the only sound that seemed to approximate the beta-carboline/tryptamine carrier wave as it spirals into infinity was a series of recordings by an english guy called harry oldfield who generated sounds from crystals – really captures the pitch shift as ibospace unfolds.
paul.
From: Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] visualization
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 18:55:23 -0700 (PDT)
Interesting. I always wanted to make an iboga “movie,” but then realized it would be so personal, who but me would want to see it, and in fact, wouldnt it be too much my vision, hampering perhaps others? Still, love your insights. Jane
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From: Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] visualization
Date: May 17, 2003 at 9:55:23 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Interesting. I always wanted to make an iboga “movie,” but then realized it would be so personal, who but me would want to see it, and in fact, wouldnt it be too much my vision, hampering perhaps others? Still, love your insights. Jane
Do you Yahoo!?
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From: “paul jackamo” <pauljackamo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] visualization
Date: May 17, 2003 at 8:53:13 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
My experiences on ibogaine and dmt confirm my tentative belief that the form and content of animation and film in general is a deep message from the universe signalling to us : “this is how it is!!!” – (at one level of reality) – with ibogaine,specifically, it was the colours – deep almost garish colours – the colours of childhood and kitsch catholic art – deep purples,pinks,colbalt blues,electric greens –
is it an accident that the minds who tune into cartoons instinctively are children ? – perhaps they have memories of the hologram that as adults are erased?
disneyland anamnesis?
😉
paul.
like the link howard.
From: Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] visualization
Date: Sat, 17 May 2003 15:22:06 -0700 (PDT)
Thanks, Howard. I really appreciate this gallery. I had some “cartoons” too with ibogaine, but in my case, they tended to be “scene-changers” who rolled cartoons of earths and other planets being moved across the sky before a “new movie” began. This may have something to do with the fact that I never liked animated cartoons much, even as a child, and always preferred longer, deeper, more emotionally rewarding shows.
Best wishes to you, Jane
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From: Jellking <jellking@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] visualization
Date: May 17, 2003 at 6:22:06 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Thanks, Howard. I really appreciate this gallery. I had some “cartoons” too with ibogaine, but in my case, they tended to be “scene-changers” who rolled cartoons of earths and other planets being moved across the sky before a “new movie” began. This may have something to do with the fact that I never liked animated cartoons much, even as a child, and always preferred longer, deeper, more emotionally rewarding shows.
Best wishes to you, Jane
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] visualization
Date: May 17, 2003 at 6:07:05 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Thought you might find this interesting.
The Art Gallery of the Ibogaine Dossier has recently added an acquisition of
an animated gif presenting an image similar in type to that experienced both
with eyes open and closed. The presentation is interesting both in the forms
it takes and its cartoonlike nature. The transformation of one image into
another and the cartoonlike nature of the image are not uncommon to the
ibogaine experience.
http://ibogaine.org/faces.html
Comments welcome.
Howard
From: jon ludlam <seraphina@compuserve.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] The Demon King
Date: May 17, 2003 at 6:00:14 PM EDT
To: “INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Message text written by INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com
korvusc@hushmail.com<
Dear korvusc,
Help me out here on this one as I must have missed a previous post.
Respectfully,
Jon Ludlam
From: <korvusc@hushmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] The Demon King
Date: May 17, 2003 at 4:55:50 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
For those who doubt the name of the one who killed JFK
Twas the first of May, twenty O three;
I watched in anger;
burning within, the rage of my fury;
A vomitous filth erupted from the sea.
His carriage, wet with blood of subjects who knew not what they served,
The god-of-war erupted from the ocean and drove his chariot toward heaven.
Drops of crimson fell to earth to mingle with the salty sea;
This is the blood of those sacrificed to Molech.
The voices of the dead who cry out beneath the altar.
Neptune, his herald, stood to the North and to the West,
facing South and East,
Somehow thinking he could lighten a darkened way;
He spoke the lies of peace;
Mothers and widows grieve the loss of murdered sons and love,
Whilst the demon-king mocks the power of heaven
By holding three of his fingers high.
An angel of darkness, he parades a robe of light;
But those with eyes to see cannot be mocked or fooled.
He stood aboard a ship of war, and mocked the blindness of all who watched.
Anchors crossing behind his left,
The Ecliptic and the Capricorn.
Neptune, who rides atop the watery goat,
Gazed on from 36 degrees;
Standing here,
in heaven he believe himself to stand,
wearing backwards 7s as his horns.
In the heavens, so it was on earth.
Are you still so blind?
Have you been made so dumb, that hearing you hear not, and seeing you
see not?
Behold what comes to pass in days to come,
Two kings standing in a circle
The one to the North and West
Menkar is his name
for he is bound and chained
By the King who watches from the South and East
The angle being 32 degrees.
and all the blinded people who see can see not.
They sit and watch the cars go round.
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Topamax & drinking
Date: May 16, 2003 at 10:48:29 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To turn off the internet:
http://www.turnofftheinternet.com/
Howard
From: “Randy Hencken” <randyhencken@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Topamax & drinking
Date: May 16, 2003 at 3:31:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
News release from the University of Texas. Release yesterday.
Seizure drug improves abstinence from drinking, study shows
Patients taking oral topiramate were 6 times more likely to be
alcohol-free for
a month during trial
San Antonio, Texas, U.S.A. (May 15) Hailed as a landmark discovery
that is
likely to change the direction of clinical alcoholism treatment,
researchers at
The University of Texas Health Science Center at San Antonio today
announced
that topiramate, a derivative of the naturally occurring sugar
monosaccharide D-
fructose, is effective at promoting abstinence among alcohol-dependent
individuals.
Reported in the May 17 issue of The Lancet, this study conducted by
Professor
Bankole A. Johnson, M.D., Ph.D., and colleagues was carried out at the
Health
Science Center’s dynamic South Texas Addiction Research & Technology
(START)
Center, where more than 100 professionals develop new medications for
treating
alcohol and drug dependence. Dr. Johnson is the William and Marguerite
Wurzbach
Distinguished Professor at the Health Science Center, professor of
psychiatry
and pharmacology, deputy chairman for research in the department of
psychiatry,
chief of the division of alcohol and drug addiction, and START Center
director.
“Remarkably, all 150 patients were enrolled into this clinical trial
while they
were still drinking heavily (defined as more than five standard drinks
a day
for men and more than four for women),” Professor Johnson said. “Next,
these
patients were randomized to receive either oral topiramate (up to 300
milligrams a day) or the placebo for three months along with a minimum
intervention behavioral treatment. Patients who took topiramate were
six times
more likely than those who received placebo to be continuously
abstinent for at
least one month during the three-month trial. Over the same period,
those
taking the placebo were four times more likely to drink heavily for an
entire
month during the trial.”
Alcohol-dependent patients frequently have liver disease, one indicator
of
which is a rise in the plasma level of the enzyme gamma glutamyl
transferase
(GGT). “It is of considerable clinical importance that topiramate was
superior
to placebo at significantly reducing the plasma GGT levels during the
trial,”
Professor Johnson said. “Further, topiramate was shown to be effective
treatment for all types of alcohol-dependent patients.” Topiramate
already is
an approved anti-seizure drug.
Leading researchers in the field welcomed the news. “Professor Bankole
Johnson
and colleagues have made a landmark discovery by demonstrating the
utility of
topiramate in the treatment of alcohol dependence,” said Domenic
Ciraulo, M.D.,
professor and chairman of the department of psychiatry at Boston
University. “This finding is a major scientific advance in the
treatment of
alcoholism, and considerably increases our understanding of the
neurobiology of
the alcoholism disease process. The research design used, which
enrolled
drinking patients who plan to become abstinent, affords the practical
innovation of delivering immediate help to those in crisis. The results
of this
remarkable study open up new and exciting directions for the
pharmacological
treatment of alcohol dependence.”
“The strength of their findings is likely to change the direction of
clinical
alcoholism treatment and will be welcome news for practitioners,” said
Robert
Malcolm, M.D., of the Center for Drug and Alcohol Programs at the
Medical
University of South Carolina, where he is associate dean and professor
of
psychiatry and family medicine. He said “the results of Professor
Johnson’s
study suggest that topiramate, even in low doses early in treatment,
has the
capacity to ameliorate the turbulence of anxiety and mood instability
that
accompanies cessation from alcohol. Topiramate also produced a robust
effect on
improving maintenance of abstinence and reduced alcohol use. A single
pharmacologic agent that enhances early abstinence, stabilizes mood and
anxiety
symptoms, and promotes long-term abstinence with only modest
psychosocial
intervention is indeed a remarkable treatment advance.”
R. Adron Harris, Ph.D., the M. June and J. Virgil Waggoner Professor
and
director of the Waggoner Center for Alcohol and Addiction Research at
The
University of Texas at Austin, said topiramate is from a different
class of
drug than those previously used in the treatment of alcoholism. “It
offers a
new choice for alcoholism,” he said. “Certainly not every patient will
benefit
from this drug or others, but because it is a different kind of drug
than what
is currently approved or in trials, it offers the possibility of
bringing
benefits to patients for whom other drugs are not successful. If this
were
a ‘me-too’ drug, or a variation on an existing drug, it would not be as
important as a new class of drug being applied in this way.”
Otto Michael Lesch, M.D., Ph.D., secretary of the European Society of
Biomedical Research on Alcoholism, said scientists should confirm the
finding
in an American-European-Australian trial. He said “this study is much
better
than other studies,” but noted that further clinical trials are needed
to
identify the optimum dosage of topiramate in the treatment of alcohol
dependence.
“Although at present we have few pharmacologic agents to treat
alcoholism,
research groups such as Professor Johnson’s are working hard to provide
new
treatment alternatives,” said Raye Z. Litten, Ph.D., chief, Treatment
Research
Branch, National Institute on Alcohol Abuse and Alcoholism (NIAAA). “If
this
promising finding is replicated and topiramate is approved by the FDA
(U.S.
Food and Drug Administration), it should bring new hope to many who
struggle
with this devastating disorder.”
Charles L. Bowden, M.D., professor of psychiatry and pharmacology and
the Nancy
Ullman Karren Chair in Psychiatry at the Health Science Center, said
“the
evidence of topiramate’s benefits on cessation of alcohol dependence is
noteworthy on two intriguing accounts. Not only was self-reported
drinking
reduced, but a strictly objective lab test measure for evidence of
recent
alcohol use (plasma GGT) showed the benefit of topiramate.”
The investigation team included Nassima Ait-Daoud, M.D.; Professor
Bowden; John
D. Roache, Ph.D.; Kevin Lawson, Ph.D.; Martin A. Javors, Ph.D.; and
Jennie Z.
Ma, Ph.D., all of the START Center at the UT Health Science Center, and
Carlo
C. DiClemente, Ph.D., professor and chairman of psychology at the
University of
Maryland.
Nearly 14 million Americans 1 in every 13 adults abuse alcohol or
are
alcoholic, according to the NIAAA. Several million more adults engage
in risky
drinking that could lead to alcohol problems. This behavior includes
binge
drinking and heavy drinking on a regular basis. In addition, 53 percent
of men
and women in the United States report drinking problems in close
relatives.
Alcohol-related problems cost society about $185 billion per year, the
NIAAA
estimates.
###
Read news from The University of Texas Health Science Center at San
Antonio at
http://www.uthscsa.edu/opa/releases.
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From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fwd: Decriminalization Yeah or Nay — Not
Date: May 15, 2003 at 8:58:32 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@ibogaine.org, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Vote on a marijuana survey anyone?
B-
— John French <john.french@VERIZON.NET> wrote:
The form of the social struggle over
decriminalization of marijuana has
many faces. Bill O’Reilly is running a survey on his
web site
<http://billoreilly.com/index.jsp> that asks simply,
“Should marijuana be
decriminalized in the United States? — Yes No”
There is actually web traffic (at least to me and
others I know) urging
people to vote and discussing the potential meaning
of results, given
O’Reilly’s political bent and who his site is
expected to attract.
My own opinion is that it would not be an issue if
we just remember that
the drug outlawed by the US is NOT marijuana, but
rather is marihuana!! See
<http://www.usdoj.gov/dea/pubs/scheduling.html>.
Only recently did the DEA add the other spelling to
the list. The history
of marihuana is very different than the history of
marijuana, as shown below.
Marihuana: Came into prominence less than a century
ago, dangerous, leads
to heroin addiction, causes men’s breasts to
enlarge, possibly as high a
kill rate as tobacco, smashes chromosomes, fries
brains, and just generally
wreaks havoc. Has no medical value.
Marijuana: Has been around since dirt, provider of
the four H’s: happiness,
hunger, horniness, and… um, oh yes, horrible
memory. Makes one laugh at
terrible ethnic jokes, mutter peace slogans, drive
sloooowly, and start to
look like George Carlin or Bob Marley. Widely used
to alleviate symptoms of
nausea, PMS, toothaches, and boredom.
In fact, the US government had usually used the “h”
way back when, but
decided formally to require it circa 1970. Suddenly
all NIDA grantee and
contractor reports that spelled it with a “j” were
returned for correction.
I remember well my argument with the Project
Officer. He even cited the
Shakespearian naming convention.
Possibly thanks to the US influence, marijuana is
one of the more
frequently misspelled words in Spanish language
publications internationally.
Our list is definitely NOT the place to argue
politics, but it is
interesting to reflect on how politics can polarize
our views of drugs. And
besides, a little drug free humour (spelling changed
in deference to our
kind neighbors of the north) goes a long way.
John French
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From: “Maggie Scattini” <scattini@tpg.com.au>
Subject: [ibogaine] Ibogaine from my local Ervetamia [ Tabonaymontana orientalis?]
Date: May 15, 2003 at 4:20:03 AM EDT
To: “To:” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I seem to have stumbled apon a very rare treat .Namely a native to the S.E. Queensland rainforest .I have done an acid/base xtract .Smoked a little last night and had a little insomnia, so i think there is activity .Will orally ingest soon . Such luck to have ibo source .Does enyone know how ervetamias rate for indole levels ?
From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Earth to Patrick again
Date: May 14, 2003 at 10:23:43 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
— crownofthorns@hushmail.com wrote:
That is a great ego trip I am sure but you have not _one_ piece of
your
own ibogaine writing online your own site. Just putting it online
would
have ibogaine seen by more people in a month or two then the NY Times
running a single piece that gets buried.
Why don’t you just do that?
Because everyone involved with Mindvox is differently abled and
brilliantly dysfunctional *hiding* 🙂
The other question is if your partner is Bruce Fancher, then why
don’t
you guys get a ibogaine story in the Village Voice. Since his dad
owns
it I can’t see how it would be that hard.
No complaints bro, only asking!
That’s easy I think. Because Bruce’s dad started the Voice.
http://www.villagevoice.com/aboutus/
But it’s been owned by Rupert Murdoch or the Hearst corporation for at
least 10 years now I think.
Patrick youre a amazing writer dog, but the greatest thing you’ve ever
written is this
http://www.mindvox.com/cgi-bin/WebObjects/MindVoxUI.woa/wa/staticpage%3fpagename=Sacred/Resurrection.html
It’s painfully honest 🙂 And from the year 2000. I guess the important
thing is to at least know yourself 🙂 This is my favorite part of it.
—
Guys, uhm, this is great and all, but why don’t we just reboot it? I
mean it’s there, it works for the most part, it would take minimal
effort to just make it work 99% of the time and–
Dude, what’s up with the software?
Okay, it’s running Server8 as the back-end, WebObjects in the middle,
it is multithreaded, multitasking, and completely integrated with
encapsulated instantiations of fully motile and self-replicating
Objects, which dance around at night and are rearranged by elves,
CONTROLLED BY DAEMONS, and plugs-inTO the Power Computer every morning
at 3:13am. You can connect with browsers, telnets, ssh, it is fully
themeable, highly unstable, completely Open Source, and FLYING out of
Everything.
That’s EXACTLY what we need. When will it all work?
By next Tuesday for sure.
Uhm, hello? Are you hearing yourselves, why am I struck with this weird
feeling of deja-vu. This is nuts, it’s a terrible idea, and I still
think we should go with the fiber-optic cameras. Failing all that, JUST
REBOOT THE FUCKING THING. It’s all sitting right there, what are you,
completely fucking stupid?
Sorry, what? I wasn’t listening.
Fully excellent, so we are in absolute agreement.
Of course.
In conclusion, what have we learned from our past mistakes?
Nothing.
What mistakes?
Uhm, absolutely nothing. I didn’t make any mistakes, I am afflicted
with the Mysterious Disease of Addiction and cannot be held accountable
for… anything, ever, actually… And everything else was the fault of
THOSE PEOPLE.
Well obviously.
Okay, let’s get high and go catch Charlie’s Angels 2000 and then hit
some bars — I meant to say, go to some meetings and complain a lot
about not being high– err, I meant to say: SHARE!
MindVox
A “Frustrating Mess with Tremendous Potential”
Just waiting for half an excuse,
to self-destruct in a REALLY BIG way!
—
At least your still on schedule. The original deadline for Mindvox was
to reopen before they found the monolith on the moon and Guns N Roses
went on tour again and released a new CD.
They haven’t found the monolith. GNR booked 3 world tours and then
cancelled every single one of them. Out of 700 dates they played 2
before Axl threw a fit and went home instead. Chinese Democracy still
hasn’t been released. It’s 13 years late now.
Still right on schedule 🙂
I think Mindvox, GNR and Ibogaine are all on the same timetable 🙂
.:vector:.
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The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
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From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Earth to Patrick again
Date: May 14, 2003 at 9:59:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Patrick, bro a message that you should at least try to think about one
of these days.
I understand that the NY Times cut you and Dana mentioning ibogaine out
of it. Except this is what I get from only the first page of hits when
I enter a search:
http://www.billstclair.com/blog/stories/
http://www.billstclair.com/blog/stories/ibogaine.html
http://www.billstclair.com/blog/stories/ibogaine2.html
http://www.billstclair.com/blog/stories/addiction1.html
http://heroinhelper.com/meta_site/tos.shtml
http://www.ibogaine.org/experience-mindvox.html
http://www.ibogainetreatment.com/index2german.html
http://www.herointimes.com/
Your ibogaine writing is on every ibogaine site, it’s translated into
different languages, it’s on the Libertarian party list where some guy
who is not a addict has started to collect your letters, you are in every
heroin publication online, you are now two or three articles in every
issue of Heroin Times where the publisher keeps recycling your writing.
Not including any of the hacker material or Mindvox, only related to
ibogaine. You are all over everything.
I know you are doing a real book, not because you ever reply to email
I can measure your response time by the seasons changing, but because
Dr. Mash replies within a day. I am not saying that you should do any
extra work I understand and know that you are very overloaded bro.
Except, every few months someone mentions why don’t you just take all
of _your_ ibogaine writing and put it together in one place on Mindvox.
It’s already done. It’s already online all over the place. It doesn’t
require any more work except to enter the files into a directory.
Because bro, Mindvox keeps getting hammered. Even if none of you ever
get around to really opening it, your psychedelic temple is way past
na, aa, every ibogaine site, every drug site except erowid, every recovery
site, pot tv, you name it and look it up and alexa, Mindvox is hitting
higher.
That is a great ego trip I am sure but you have not _one_ piece of your
own ibogaine writing online your own site. Just putting it online would
have ibogaine seen by more people in a month or two then the NY Times
running a single piece that gets buried.
Why don’t you just do that?
The other question is if your partner is Bruce Fancher, then why don’t
you guys get a ibogaine story in the Village Voice. Since his dad owns
it I can’t see how it would be that hard.
No complaints bro, only asking!
Peace out,
Curtis
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From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] hats off to Noel Redding
Date: May 14, 2003 at 9:13:08 PM EDT
To: “NewsRoom-L” <NEWSROOM-L@LISTS.NETSPACE.ORG>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
—– Original Message —–
From: preston peet
To: drugwar@mindvox.com
Sent: Wednesday, May 14, 2003 9:05 PM
Subject: [drugwar] hats off to Noel Redding
HI all,
Christmas before last, I bought V the boxed set of the Jimi Hendrix
Experience, purple velvet boxed 9 record LP set. After dinner at her Dad’s
in Connecticut, we returned to our teeny but interestingly full of neato
stuff to look at apartment, turned down the lights, and ate another gift
from a friend that year- a quarter ounce of the fattest, cleanest, most
lovely shrooms imaginable (which aren’t something I have lying about the
house- they were a One Time Gift). She ate about a gram and I ate the rest,
cleaned
the bag out. As she proceeded to play all 18 sides of the set, one after the
other from beginning to end, I lay on the bed with her between her jumping
up to change the records, with the lights turned low, (and red buld in the
overhead) the incence burning, the bowl packed, and I had one of those
completely “break out of the ego” sorta trips, during which I decided that
Jimi Hendrix personified the light side, by that I mean he embodied
physically whatever force in nature is the positve, creative, constructive
side, the side the blue meanies hate with a passion and do things like wage
Drug Wars specifically with their eradication in mind.
Sooo, with that blessed, beautiful all nighter in mind- where I had
tears running down my face more than once for no other reason than that I
felt literally one with everything physically and spirtually and the shrooms
made me cry, happy tears but lots of ’em, where I kept thinking “how do I
bring this back with me…I want to show my parents what this is all about,”
everything made sense, etc, etc, all the incredible visuals, etc, etc-
anyway…
Noel Redding, bassist with Hendrix has died. Hats off to Noel Redding
wherever his spirit may be tonight, may he be jamming with the best on the
best equipment available forever and always, if that’s what he wants to do
with the rest of eternity. Bless him, he rocked, and though he didn’t know
it, so far as I know, he was part of one of the very best, most trippiful,
beautiful, peaceful, stress free trips I ever had the pleasure of taking.
Peace,
Preston
(P.S. and Alex, call me, let’s jam.)
http://www.plastic.com/article.html;sid=03/05/14/10222735
‘Scuse Me, While I Kiss The Sky’: Noel Redding Dead
Noel Redding the Bassist for the Jimi Hendrix Experience has died. No
explanation was given as to the cause of his death.
In the 1960’s Jimi hendrix, Noel Redding and Mitch Mitchell were the trio
that made up The Jimi Hendrix Experience. The Album Are You Experienced? was
a commercial success for the band. With hit songs like Purple Haze the band
was suddenly on the map. Noel Redding’s contributions to the Jimi Hendrix
music was significant….
snip-
<]=———————————————————————–=[
[ Moderated by: Preston Peet |
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From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Neuro-Alchemy: Beta-Carbolines as Potentiating Agents
Date: May 14, 2003 at 8:59:49 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
This is from the Vox list I think, but it’s very cool news. Deoxy is
back up again and finally got a update.
This is a good article:
http://deoxy.org/neuroalchemy.htm
Peace out,
Curtis
Neuro-Alchemy: Beta-Carbolines as Potentiating Agents
by J.B. Fleming
“I began to get high-and then the whole fucking Cosmos broke loose around
me” 輸llen Ginsberg
During the nineteen twenties, ethnographers returning from the Amazon
jungle gave strange accounts of tribal shamans who used a telepathy-increasing
plant drug to direct the course of their societies. The drug was a hallucinogenic
drink which had several different native names including Ayahuasca, Yage,
Caapi, and Natema. It was brewed from a species of woody vine called
Banisteriopsis along with various admixtures which commonly included
the leaves of Banisteriopsis rusbyana, Psychotria viridis, and Brugmansia.
Native users of ayahuasca were reported to experience collective hallucinations
of jaguars, snakes, and jeweled birds. These visions were often accompanied
by contact with dead ancestors, the ability to see future events, and
telepathic communication among tribal members. Secondary effects included
heightened sexual responses, vomiting and diarrhea. Ayahuasca’s purgative
effects also made it useful as a general medicine to stimulate health
and fight diseases.
Toxicologists were fascinated by the drug and soon extracted the active
compound from the Banisteriopsis vine, naming it Telepathine. However,
in the nineteen thirties, research interest in ethnopharmacology faded
and the matter was left to rest. The case on ayahuasca was reopened in
1957 when researchers discovered that Telepathine was actually Harmine,
one of several compounds from the beta-carboline family of hallucinogens.
Secondary alkaloids called Harmaline and Tetrahydroharmine were also
identified.
The beta-carbolines were first isolated in 1841 from the seeds of Peganum
harmala, a small, bushy herb known as Syrian Rue which grows along the
Mediterranean and throughout Central Asia. It is also reported to have
escaped cultivation and can now be found throughout the American southwest.
Middle Eastern people have long used Syrian Rue as a folk medicine and
for the unique red dye in Turkish and Persian rugs. Egyptians employed
the seeds as an aphrodisiac and the plant has been considered as a possible
(although unlikely) candidate for the mysterious Soma described in the
Rig-Veda. Beta-carbolines have since been identified in several more
plants including Passionflower (Passiflora incarnata), Tobacco (Nicotiana
rustica), and even within the human pineal gland.
The beta-carbolines are members of the indole family of alkaloids which
includes the highly illegal drugs LSD, Psilocybin, DMT, Bufotenin, and
Ibogaine. Interestingly, the beta-carbolines have never been scheduled
as illegal substances. All of the indoles possess a structural similarity
to the neurotransmitters serotonin and dopamine. However, the beta-carbolines
have a unique quality called MAO inhibition that sets them apart from
other psychedelics.
Monoamine oxidase (MAO) is an enzyme produced in the human body which
serves several regulatory functions. Within the nerve terminals of norepinephrine,
dopamine, and serotonin neurons MAO acts to modulate the amount of neurotransmitter
present. MAO bonds with the transmitters and deactivates them preventing
the build up of excessive neurotransmitters at the nerve synapses. MAO
is also responsible for deactivating many of the toxins that are present
in the foods that we eat. Tyramine is an example of a toxin found in
many common foods including aged cheese, red wine, pickled herring, figs,
and yeast. Without the presence of MAO to inactivate it the consumption
of tyramine would be followed by a severe, and possibly life-threatening
increase in blood pressure.
In addition to the beta-carbolines psychoactive effects they are also
powerful, short-term, MAO inhibitors. For the six to eight hours that
the beta-carboline trip lasts MAO activity is suppressed, allowing serotonin
to build up at the neuron synapses. This action may be responsible for
some of their mental effects. It also means that the body is vulnerable
to any toxins that might be consumed.
The South-American indians learned to take advantage of this condition
by adding DMT containing plants to the ayahuasca mixture. Normally DMT
is inactive when taken orally. Up to a gram of this powerful psychedelic
can be consumed with no noticeable effect. However, when combined with
beta-carbolines, DMT is absorbed through the stomach and its normally
short action is extended for several hours. Although the principles of
MAO inhibition were not described by Western science until the nineteen
fifties the indians have exploited it for hundreds of years.
Western Experiments with Beta-Carbolines
In the 1960s Chilean psychiatrist Claudio Naranjo carried out a series
of experiments using pure harmaline taken intravenously. He reported
its effect in his book The Healing Journey as producing vivid mental
imagery which took the form of dreamlike sequences accompanied by physical
sedation and nausea. His subjects, all drawn from an urban background,
often described the same jungle imagery of snakes, vines, jaguars and
birds that native ayahuasca users reported. Other researchers since Naranjo
have concluded that the beta-carbolines when taken orally do not produce
a psychedelic state except at near toxic doses. Instead they seem to
create a hazy, dreamy mental state along with an uncomfortable lethargic
condition closer in effect to tranquilizers than psychedelics.
It appears that the real value of the beta-carbolines lies not in their
psychoactive effects but in their ability to potentiate other psychedelic
substances. Over the years there have been numerous accounts of this
potentiating quality from underground sources. In Terence and Dennis
McKenna’s book The Invisible Landscape and its companion book True Hallucinations
by Terence McKenna the effects of a Banisteriopsis and Psilocybe cubensis
combination are described. In a series of events that culminated in what
they called “The Experiment at La Chorrera” the brothers drank an infusion
of boiled Banisteriopsis vine and consumed Psilocybe mushrooms supplemented
by smoking dried shavings of Banisteriopsis. What resulted was a spectacular,
month long experience of an extremely bizarre nature best left up to
the McKenna’s to recount.
Another set of experiments using beta-carbolines to synergize DMT was
carried out by “Gracie and Zarkov”. Their collection of samizdat reports
titled Notes from the Underground detail their use of beta-carbolines
to prolong and intensify the effects of synthetic DMT, Psilocybin and
LSD. Their procedure was to extract beta-carbolines from Banisteriopsis
vines, Passionflower, and Syrian Rue seeds. After drying the extracts
were smoked and followed by DMT or other indole psychedelics. The effects
of the beta-carboline extracts when taken by themselves are described
as “…not particularly psychedelic or hallucinogenic. One feels calm.
..At higher doses, dizziness and nausea sets in with very little increase
in the high. Closed eye imagery is at best hypnagogic.”
Jim DeKorne in his book Psychedelic Shamanism also looks into the potentiating
action of beta-carbolines. Working with “Mushroom Ayahuasca”, a combination
of Syrian Rue extract with Psilocybe cubensis, DeKorne describes its
effects as; “This is in no way a ‘recreational’ compound… One is quite
simply ‘flattened’ by the mixture. Like most authentic ayahuasca experiences,
some gastrointestinal upset is par for the course, but by then one’s
consciousness is so profoundly transformed, that nausea and vomiting
are somehow beside the point.”
There is a possibility that ayahuasca “analogues” can be created using
plants found in North America. The goal is to render the DMT found in
certain plants orally active by combining them with threshold doses of
short-term MAO inhibitors such as the beta-carbolines. Jonathan Ott provides
a wealth of information on experimental ayahuasca mixtures in his books
Pharmacotheon and Ayahuasca Analogues. Ott’s detailed experiments using
harmine extracted from Syrian Rue seeds and DMT clearly show that DMT
can be rendered orally active when combined with low doses of beta-carbolines.
However, a suitable source for pure DMT is problematic. Much research
must still be done in this area.
Given time, underground researchers will find an easily obtained and
legal plant which contains DMT. This will enable home users to create
what Dennis McKenna calls Ayahuasca borealis, the North American equivalent
of the legendary Amazonian ayahuasca brew. Once this technique is perfected
it will possible for anyone to explore the psychedelic experience free
from the stigma of criminal activity and profiteering drug dealers.
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Presentations – NYC Forum on Iboga and Ibogaine
Date: May 14, 2003 at 6:39:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
A review of the Agenda and some full presentations are now available for the
Ibogaine Working Group’s New York City Forum on Iboga and Ibogaine. The
Forum reviewed both ethnobotanical information and the use of ibogaine and
iboga in treating chemical dependence. http://www.ibogaine.org/nyc.html
Presentations include:
Laurent Sazy, Photojournalist, Bwiti ritual photographs.
Daniel Pinchbeck, Author, Experience with Iboga in Gabon.
Carl M Anderson PhD, Harvard, Cerebellar Doorways to Trauma, Addiction,
Hallucinogenesis and REM Sleep.
Jonathan Freedlander, Review: 18-methoxycoronaridine.
Rick Doblin, PhD, MAPS, Non-profit development of ibogaine.
Howard S. Lotsof, Patient Medication Acceptability and Treatment Options:
Ibogaine, Methadone and Buprenorphine
Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
46 Oxford Place
Staten Island, NY 10301
USA
tel, 718 442-2754
fax, 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org
From: HSL123@aol.com
Subject: [IBOGAINE] Presentations – NYC Forum on Iboga and Ibogaine
Date: May 14, 2003 at 6:30:26 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@lists.calyx.nl
Reply-To: ibogaine@lists.calyx.nl
A review of the Agenda and some full presentations are now available for the
Ibogaine Working Group’s New York City Forum on Iboga and Ibogaine. The
Forum reviewed both ethnobotanical information and the use of ibogaine and
iboga in treating chemical dependence. http://www.ibogaine.org/nyc.html
Presentations include:
Laurent Sazy, Photojournalist, Bwiti ritual photographs.
Daniel Pinchbeck, Author, Experience with Iboga in Gabon.
Carl M Anderson PhD, Harvard, Cerebellar Doorways to Trauma, Addiction,
Hallucinogenesis and REM Sleep.
Jonathan Freedlander, Review: 18-methoxycoronaridine.
Rick Doblin, PhD, MAPS, Non-profit development of ibogaine.
Howard S. Lotsof, Patient Medication Acceptability and Treatment Options:
Ibogaine, Methadone and Buprenorphine
Howard S. Lotsof
President
Dora Weiner Foundation
46 Oxford Place
Staten Island, NY 10301
USA
tel, 718 442-2754
fax, 718 442-1957
email, dwf123@earthlink.net
http://www.doraweiner.org
_______________________________________________
This list hosted in The Netherlands by
Calyx Internet B.V. http://www.calyx.nl
_______________________________________________
_______________________________________________
ibogaine mailing list
ibogaine@lists.calyx.nl
https://lists.calyx.nl/lists/listinfo/ibogaine
From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] my testimony friday to lentol, etc.
Date: May 13, 2003 at 10:46:09 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I thought this was a good question. What exactly prevents all the
second generation ibogaine drugs from being scheduled right into I from
the analogs act?
Someone, anyone?
.:vector:.
— crownofthorns@hushmail.com wrote:
Dana this is a well written piece. What I found interesting was the
mention
of the analogs act. I hadn’t thought through the process of the
second
generation ibogaine derivitive drugs like 18-mc and nor-ibogaine. But
would they not fall under the analogs act?
This is all hypothetical bro, I am really not holding my breath and
counting
minutes until I see nor or 18-mc available to treat addiction. I have
this feeling Mash and Glick will both be dead or senior citizens
before
that ever happens.
Peace out,
Curtis
On Sun, 11 May 2003 13:52:48 -0700 Dana Beal
<dana@cures-not-wars.org>
wrote:
8. Product Formulation and the Analogs Act
Iboga-based medications now include Ibogaine HCl, Des-methylated
(or
“nor”) ibogaine, the experimental drug 18-methoxycoronaridine, and
various whole plant alkaloid extracts. Among researchers and
treatment professionals, each has its adherents.
Ibogaine HCl (or sulphate) is the principle alkaloid of Iboga
Tabernanthe purified in a salt form. It is the most studied–and
the
only one ever approved by FDA to go into humans. The full-blown
experience consists of a) the visualization, or waking dream phase,
followed by b) the “clear” deep concentration phase, followed by
the
c) insomnia phase. Since ibogaine is de-methylated in its first
pass
thru the liver into “nor-ibogaine,” the second phase (b) may be
thought of as the nor-ibogaine phase, characterized by heightened
serotonin level and very week opioid activity at the mu and delta
opiate receptors.
Within the last few years, various “free-base extracts” (Indra,
Ethnogarden) have become available that contain all the alkaloids
of
the plant in a non-salt form. Besides being better-tolerated by
knowledgeable addicts who reported that whole plant iboga extract
is
“less boring,” the non-salt formulation seems to come on and drop
off
more gradually, lessening the risk of bradycardia during initial
onset.
In the case of nor-ibogaine and 18-MC, patent-holders developed
their
compound explicitly to satisfy various safety concerns of the FDA
and
NIDA. They believe that their compounds, unlike Ibogaine HCl or
the
whole plant extracts, are sufficiently different that they do not
fall under the CSA. However, since the molecular structure of all
iboga congeners is virtually identical, and the mechanism of action
is substantially the same, it is difficult to see how they would
not
fall under the purview the 1986 federal Analog Act if the
classifying
agency (DEA or Justice Dept.) chose to schedule them.
The only way that would happen is if they had a substantially
different, and non-psychedelic, subjective effect. Therefore, it
is
in the interest of research into safer congeners of Ibogaine to
re-schedule the parent plant and principal molecule in a less
restrictive category.
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From: Vector Vector <vector620022002@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Pfizer Launches Zoloft for everything ad campagin 🙂
Date: May 13, 2003 at 10:48:31 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
This is really funny 🙂
http://www.theonion.com/onion3918/pfizer_launches.html
.:vector:.
NEW YORK着eeking to broaden the customer base of the popular drug,
Pfizer announced the launch of a $40 million “Zoloft For Everything”
advertising campaign Monday.
Above: One of the new Zoloft ads.
“Zoloft is most commonly prescribed for the treatment of depression and
anxiety disorders, but it would be ridiculous to limit such a
multi-functional drug to these few uses,” Pfizer spokesman Jon Pugh
said. “We feel doctors need to stop asking their patients if anything
is wrong and start asking if anything could be more right.”
Continued Pugh: “How many millions of people out there are suffering
under the strain of a deadline at work or pre-date jitters, but don’t
realize there’s a drug that could provide relief? Zoloft isn’t just for
severe anxiety or depression. Got the Monday blues? Kids driving you
nuts? Let Zoloft help. Zoloft.”
Zoloft (sertraline hydrochloride) was originally introduced as a means
of treating depression, post-traumatic stress disorder, panic disorder,
and obsessive-compulsive disorder. In January of this year, however,
Pfizer won FDA approval for use of Zoloft to treat premenstrual
dysphoric disorder, as well as social-anxiety disorder, or “social
phobia.”
Last week, the FDA okayed Zoloft for treatment of “the entire range of
unpleasant or otherwise negative social, physical, and mental feelings
that an individual may experience in the course of a human life.”
“At first, Zoloft was only used to treat depression,” Pugh said. “But
what is depression, really? Who died and gave doctors the authority to
dictate who is and isn’t depressed? One man’s hangnail could be another
man’s darkest depths of despair. Isn’t medication a tool to help people
lead better, happier lives? Access to drugs should not be restricted to
those the medical community officially deems ‘sick.'”
Pfizer president James Vernon said the “Zoloft For Everything” campaign
will employ print and TV ads to inform potential users about the
“literally thousands” of new applications for Zoloft. Among the
conditions the drug can be used to treat: anxiety associated with
summer swimsuit season, insecurity over sexual potency and performance,
feelings of shame over taking an antidepressant, and a sense of
hollowness stemming from losing an online auction.
Above: A Zoloft ad slated to run in next week’s issue of People.
In today’s fast-paced world, Vernon said, people don’t have time to
deal with mood changes.
“Zoloft has always helped clinically depressed people modulate
serotonin levels and other chemical imbalances that make life unlivable
for them,” Vernon said. “But now, Zoloft can also help anyone who needs
their emotions leveled off. Do you find yourself feeling excited or
sad? No one should have to suffer through those harrowing peaks and
valleys.”
Anita White of Yuma, AZ, sought out Zoloft after seeing one of the new
commercials.
“I was sitting on the couch, just watching TV, and, for the life of me,
I couldn’t motivate myself to go down to the basement to do the
laundry,” White said. “Luckily, a Zoloft ad came on right at that
moment. I went to their web site and, sure enough, one of the ‘Is
Zoloft Right For You?’ quiz questions was, ‘Are you unable to motivate
yourself to go down to the basement to do the laundry?’ That’s when I
knew.”
Other pharmaceutical companies are following Pfizer’s lead. On Tuesday,
Paxil manufacturer GlaxoSmithKline unveiled its new ad slogan,
“Paxil… Give It A Try.” Eli Lilly, maker of Prozac, is slated to
launch a similar campaign built around the slogan, “Pot Roast Burnt?
Husband Home With The Flu? You’re Having One Of Those Prozac Days.”
“We are letting consumers know that if they suspect Zoloft might
improve the quality of their lives, they should contact their doctor,”
Pugh said. “And remember, you’ll need to take Zoloft for at least eight
weeks to make sure it’s working.”
Pugh warned that Zoloft use may cause side effects such as agitation,
erratic behavior, restlessness, difficulty speaking, or shaking of
hands and fingers. He added that Zoloft can help those suffering from
agitation, erratic behavior, restlessness, difficulty speaking, and
shaking of hands and fingers.
__________________________________
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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] melatonin@memory
Date: May 12, 2003 at 9:30:05 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Effect of chronic treatment of melatonin on learning,
memory and oxidative deficiencies induced by
intracerebroventricular streptozotocin in rats
by
Sharma M, Gupta YK.
Neuropharmacology Laboratory,
Department of Pharmacology,
All India Institute of Medical Sciences,
110029, New Delhi, India
Pharmacol Biochem Behav 2001 Oct;70(2-3):325-31
ABSTRACT
Intracerebroventricular (ICV) streptozotocin (STZ) has been shown to
cause cognitive
impairment, which is associated with free radical generation in the
brain of rats. Melatonin is
a potent free radical scavenger and antioxidant. In the present
study, the effect of
melatonin was investigated against ICV STZ induced cognitive
impairment and oxidative
stress in rats. Adult male Wistar rats were injected with ICV STZ (3
mg/kg) bilaterally. The
rats were treated with STZ twice, on days 1 and 3. The learning and
memory behavior was
assessed using passive avoidance paradigms, elevated plus maze and
the closed field
activity while the parameters of oxidative stress assessed were
malondialdehyde (MDA) and
glutathione. The rats were treated chronically with melatonin for 21
days starting from day 1
of STZ injection. The learning and memory behavior was evaluated on
days 17, 18 and 19
and the rats were sacrificed on day 21 for estimation of MDA and
glutathione. The rats
treated with melatonin showed significantly less cognitive
impairment. There was also
insignificant increase in brain MDA and decrease in glutathione
levels in melatonin-treated
ICV STZ rats as compared to the vehicle-treated ICV STZ animals. The
study demonstrates
the effectiveness of melatonin in preventing the cognitive deficits
as well as the oxidative
stress caused by ICV STZ in rats and suggests it’s potential in age
and age-related
neurodegenerative disorders where oxidative stress and cognitive
impairment are involved.
From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] Says he’s sorry he missed out
Date: May 12, 2003 at 8:31:39 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
From: “Frank David” <frank.david@sympatico.ca>
To: <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Greetings
Sorry but I forgot all about it
Keep me informed and the next one
And how did the Ibogaine forum May 4, 5 at Walker stage in manhattan go!
Thank you
Frank David
Why doesn’t some one tell him how it went?
Dana/cnw
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] ibogaine meeting photographs
Date: May 12, 2003 at 6:51:34 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi Howard,
Once I finally do get around to posting a report, yes, but most of the
photos didn’t seem to come out all that well. In the meantime though, here’s
one attached that did come out pretty good.
Could you forward it to Ric Dobblin too, if you’ve got his email? Or
better, send it to me so I can send it to him directly? Thanks if you can
help.
Peace,
Preston
—– Original Message —–
From: HSLotsof@aol.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 5:46 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine meeting photographs
Hi Preston,
Are you going to post the ibogaine meeting photographs you took?
Howard
From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] ibogaine meeting photographs
Date: May 12, 2003 at 5:46:09 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi Preston,
Are you going to post the ibogaine meeting photographs you took?
Howard
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: rescheduling ibogaine in new york state
Date: May 12, 2003 at 4:24:04 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, “Dana Beal” <dana@cures-not-wars.org>, <drkanya9@hotmail.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
paul jackamo wrote >I hope those that attended the NYC conference had a good
time and I
look forward to reading a report soon<
Hey all,
This is the beginnings of a report on the NYC conference, one I need to
add some stuff to before I put it up at DrugWar.com, but haven’t gotten
around to it yet. It was initially written with limited publishing space in
mind for somewhere other than DrugWar.com, but now it appears I can write it
a bit longer and more detailed than I’d first thought.
Peace,
Preston
A New Respect for Ibogaine?
by Preston Peet
May 6, 2003
Ibogaine, a still little known root from Gabon, West Africa, may hold a key
to helping hardcore heroin and opiate addicts break out of their addictive
cycles. Still an illegal Schedule 1 drug here in the US, researchers and
medical treatment professionals around the world are having miraculous
results in large percentages of addicts they treat with Ibogaine.
This weekend in NYC, May 4 and 5, 2003, there was a conference hosted by
Cures-Not-Wars, bringing together many of the leading ibogaine researchers
from around the globe to discuss the science, to detail how people suspect
this
plant might work- as no one is still really sure. Also heard were the
experiences
of some addicts who successfully kicked their habits using
ibogaine and of those who helped them do it by treating them with ibogaine.
Detailed too were the political troubles in getting research ok’d here in
the US.
With articles recently detailing ibogaine in a positive light being
published in such influential journals as Discover, New Scientist and the
Journal of the American Medical Association (JAMA), scientists and treatment
providers are taking a serious second look at the possibilities in this
plant for revolutionary treatment of addiction.
“Development of this plant must be done in a non-profit manner,” said Ric
Dobblin, founder of the Multidisciplinary Association of Psychedelic
Studies.
Brian Mariana, an Italian treatment provider using ibogaine to treat addicts
in
the Czechoslovakian Republic, says that “I’d like to get ibogaine officially
registered as a treatment modality, by accepted clinical protocals and by
European Standards, so I can the show US officials that it does work, and
should be legalized in the states for treatment purposes.”
—– Original Message —–
From: Dana Beal
To: drkanya9@hotmail.com
Cc: Richard Lake ; dansmith@clark.net ; lensman@stardrive.org ;
hward@wineshopper.com ; DDanforbes@aol.com ; daniel@breakingopenthehead.com
; Mark@k-dunn.freeserve.co.uk ; IMDJam@cs.com ; gbekkum@mediaone.net ;
Gary@osborn-day.freeserve.co.uk ; gschwart@u.arizona.edu ; e-merrill2@ti.com
; Bob Ezergailis ; cynthia ford ; G. G. Ford ; brumac@compuserve.com ;
yokatta@oxy.edu ; kklingon@cwcom.net ; cyrano@aqua.ocn.ne.jp ; Adrian ;
dewatson@sunflower.com ; CloudRider@aol.com ; JagdishM@aol.com ;
phylegyas@hotmail.com ; schwann@webtrance.co.za ; ibogalab@hotmail.com ;
zentarot@hotmail.com ; Paul DeRienzo ; Stews@radiks.net ;
foozleman@worldnet.att.net ; bmasel@tds.net ; heff01@email.msn.com ;
kingfelix@mediaone.net ; luxefair@bellsouth.net ; cardboard_dada@yahoo.com ;
prophets@maui.net ; m.pilkington@virgin.net ; PCLARK@JJHILL.ORG ;
delaneyw@shasta.com ; Edward Jahn ; derlock@mailexcite.com ; Andre Welling ;
Mitchel Cohen ; MUTANEX Command HAWAI’I ; Nick Sandberg ; George Clayton
Johnson ; axiom@greatmystery.org ; dancegroove@nyc.rr.com ;
warcry@indymedia.org ; Jay Statzer ; preston peet
Sent: Monday, May 12, 2003 12:21 PM
Subject: rescheduling ibogaine in new york state
At 3:05 AM +0100 5/11/03, paul jackamo wrote:
I hope those that attended the NYC conference had a good time and I
look forward to reading a report soon. Dana mentioned some video was
taken. It would be good to make that available to people interested in
ibogaine here in England and elsewhere.
As per the consensus at the end of the conference, I took my case to
the New York State Assembly, which was holding a hearing on the
heroin crisis. Drs. Drucker and Neuman were there and were testifying
before me; Joe Lentol who with assemblyman Dinowitz were the two
members physically present asking questions on behalf of that august
body. Lentol, previously briefed by us, asked Neuman about Ibogaine,
and to his credit (or perhaps more due to the work of Lotsof in
NAMA), Neuman took no potshots, but repeated the mantra that the
widest menu of treatments must be available, since “one size does not
fit all.” My presentation, below, was followed by a couple of
remarks, i.e., about the incompatabiliy of AIDS drugs with methadone,
and about the fact that maintenance might be much more acceptable,
both to the addict or the community, if clients first had a chance to
try ibo and fail a number of times before going onto longterm
methadone.
Afterwards I talked with Health committee head Dick Gottfried’s aide
Mike Rabinowitz, and he said it was good I’d involved this particular
taskforce, since they had more staff time to deal with it.
He also said he would try to make the July 7 meeting with Gottfried.
Dana/cnw
-remainder snipped
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] photos of NYC MMM march
Date: May 12, 2003 at 2:48:47 PM EDT
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi all,
My High Times report on the NYC march has been reposted at DrugWar.com
(see link just below) with a bunch of here-to-fore unseen photos of the
day’s proceedings.
Enjoy.
Peace,
Preston
http://www.drugwar.com/mmm03.shtm
From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] “using drugs to treat addiction”
Date: May 12, 2003 at 10:55:33 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Pubdate: Tus, 6 May 2003
Source: Hartford Courant (CT)
Copyright: 2003 The Hartford Courant
Contact: letters@courant.com
Website: http://www.ctnow.com/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/183
Author: Shari Roan
Bookmark: http://www.mapinc.org/coke.htm (Cocaine)
PRESCRIPTION ADDICTION
Medications designed for one purpose often end up as treatments for other
conditions. That’s not unusual. What is surprising is the number of older
drugs that have suddenly become good candidates for treating cocaine addiction.
Researchers at the National Institute on Drug Abuse are studying whether a
half-dozen medications used for such conditions as narcolepsy and influenza
can help people trying to abstain from cocaine and other addictive drugs.
Traditional therapy for cocaine addiction, which affects an estimated 1.5
million Americans, has centered on psychological counseling and behavioral
therapy.
But scientists are increasingly using drugs to treat drug dependence, an
effort stemming from an increased understanding of the brain’s natural
chemicals and how foreign substances affect the brain.
URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v03.n673.a07.html
——————————
From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] that ayahuasca death
Date: May 12, 2003 at 10:26:41 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Pubdate: Wed, 30 Apr 2003
Source: Manitoulin Expositor (CN ON)
Copyright: 2003 The Manitoulin Expositor.
Contact: expos_ed@etown.net
Website: http://www.manitoulin.on.ca/
Details: http://www.mapinc.org/media/2429
THE NEED FOR A SPIRIT OF HEALING CRIES OUT TO US
The sentencing of Juan and Edgar Uyunkar on charges stemming from the death
of Jane Maiangowi has come to pass, leaving the younger of the two
Ecuadorian medicine men free to return home to his family, while keeping
the father in Canada for yet another year. Their interpreter, Maria Ventura
has had all charges against her dropped, and she must now struggle to undo
the economic damage the charges have dealt to her.
The wake of those tragic events on that mid-October evening in Wikwemikong
a year and a half ago has left both a deep sadness and a division on the
preferred fate of Indigenous traditional healing practices, in both the
Native and non-native communities.
Unlike the divisions which have occurred in the past, these new divisions
are based on philosophy and beliefs in the efficacy of, and right to chose
one’s own path of healing, rather along lines of race or culture, bringing
members of both communities together in defence of their chosen side.
URL: http://www.mapinc.org/drugnews/v03.n659.a02.html
——————————
From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] my testimony friday to lentol, etc.
Date: May 11, 2003 at 10:26:41 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Dana this is a well written piece. What I found interesting was the mention
of the analogs act. I hadn’t thought through the process of the second
generation ibogaine derivitive drugs like 18-mc and nor-ibogaine. But
would they not fall under the analogs act?
This is all hypothetical bro, I am really not holding my breath and counting
minutes until I see nor or 18-mc available to treat addiction. I have
this feeling Mash and Glick will both be dead or senior citizens before
that ever happens.
Peace out,
Curtis
On Sun, 11 May 2003 13:52:48 -0700 Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
wrote:
8. Product Formulation and the Analogs Act
Iboga-based medications now include Ibogaine HCl, Des-methylated
(or
“nor”) ibogaine, the experimental drug 18-methoxycoronaridine, and
various whole plant alkaloid extracts. Among researchers and
treatment professionals, each has its adherents.
Ibogaine HCl (or sulphate) is the principle alkaloid of Iboga
Tabernanthe purified in a salt form. It is the most studied–and
the
only one ever approved by FDA to go into humans. The full-blown
experience consists of a) the visualization, or waking dream phase,
followed by b) the “clear” deep concentration phase, followed by
the
c) insomnia phase. Since ibogaine is de-methylated in its first
pass
thru the liver into “nor-ibogaine,” the second phase (b) may be
thought of as the nor-ibogaine phase, characterized by heightened
serotonin level and very week opioid activity at the mu and delta
opiate receptors.
Within the last few years, various “free-base extracts” (Indra,
Ethnogarden) have become available that contain all the alkaloids
of
the plant in a non-salt form. Besides being better-tolerated by
knowledgeable addicts who reported that whole plant iboga extract
is
“less boring,” the non-salt formulation seems to come on and drop
off
more gradually, lessening the risk of bradycardia during initial
onset.
In the case of nor-ibogaine and 18-MC, patent-holders developed
their
compound explicitly to satisfy various safety concerns of the FDA
and
NIDA. They believe that their compounds, unlike Ibogaine HCl or
the
whole plant extracts, are sufficiently different that they do not
fall under the CSA. However, since the molecular structure of all
iboga congeners is virtually identical, and the mechanism of action
is substantially the same, it is difficult to see how they would
not
fall under the purview the 1986 federal Analog Act if the classifying
agency (DEA or Justice Dept.) chose to schedule them.
The only way that would happen is if they had a substantially
different, and non-psychedelic, subjective effect. Therefore, it
is
in the interest of research into safer congeners of Ibogaine to
re-schedule the parent plant and principal molecule in a less
restrictive category.
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From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: [ibogaine] my testimony friday to lentol, etc.
Date: May 11, 2003 at 4:52:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Testimony to the Joint Assembly Taskforce on the Heroin Crisis:
IBOGAINE AND TREATMENT OF HEROIN DEPENDENCY
This month new articles about the use of Ibogaine in the treatment of addiction are appearing in DISCOVER, The New Scientist, the L.A. TIMES, the GUARDIAN of London, and DETAILS magazine. Yet even after dozens of articles in the press and scientific journals, most people are not aware that a treatment exists which can get people off drugs overnight–painlessly.
This rainforest alkaloid has been reported to act as an addiction interrupter across a wide spectrum of abused substances, legal and illegal, in more more than 200 peer-reviewed scientific papers. A unique effect is the simultaneous loss of multiple addictions–for example opiates, meth-amphetamine, crack, alcohol and cigarettes–after as little as a single treatment.
In the last few years, through the work of John Stuen of the National AIDS Brigade, it’s become clear that most of the heroin in the Northeast United States has been re-processed with lidocaine and novocaine for a “speedball” effect in order to “punch through” methadone. In 12 samples turned into the NYPD, the stimulant content ranged from .05 to 20%. The immediate effect in addicts is that they need more injections, share more needles, spread more HIV and hepatitis C. And the Gold Standard of current treatment–methadone–is rendered worthless.
Ibogaine, on the other hand, is the first pharmacotherapy where, when the treatment wears off, addicts are free of both physical withdrawal and psychological craving. Methadone has a significant problem of deaths due to diversion. There is also a significant history of deaths with Ultra Rapid Opiate Detox, the procedure where naltrexone is injected after sedation with valium-like drugs. Dr Lance Gooberman of New Jersey was fined and lost his medical licence because he had 4 deaths out of 2350 procedures. And where opioid maintenance (methadone, buprenorphin) or blockers (naltrexone) fail to address the underlying dopaminergic disorder (craving), re-treatment with Ibogaine (should uncontrollable cravings re-cur, or in the event or relapse) is safe and easy.
With Ibogaine, the acute phase that requires bed-rest takes just two days. Even with a period to keep patients under observation in case you have to administer another, smaller dose after 4 to 6 days for residual cravings, folks can be back at work in just under two weeks. With 15 to 40% of treated subjects [depending on drug of abuse] remaining drug free for long periods of time after just one treatment, and more definitive resolution of the most refractory cases being acheived with two to four treatments over a two year period, it is difficult to understand why Ibogaine is not more accessible to the addicted population of New York state.
The problem is that Ibogaine was misclassified as a Schedule 1 drug at the end of the 1960’s–a status which it has only in the United States, Belgium and Switzerland. It is legal everywhere else in the world. Efforts to change the status of Ibogaine by channeling it through the FDA approval process have foundered because no sponsor is willing step up the bat because of the stigma associated with a schedule 1 drug. The stumbling block, as always, is funding–plus lack of the support Ibogaine would have if more people realized it’s not some far-off possibility in the distant future, but an option already available just over the border in Canada and Mexico.
Cures not Wars recommends that the State Legislature of New York seriously investigate re-scheduling Ibogaine down from Schedule 1 to Schedule 3, so that it can be given in most cases by nurse-practicianers. While it is a very powerful medicine that ought to be administered only after screening for heart, liver and seizure disorders, 99 out of 100 cases do not require a hospital stay or supervision by a medical doctor. I am attaching a memorandum laying out the arguments for and problems surrounding re-scheduling at the state level and the probable effect of state action on Ibogaine’s status under federal law.
Memo: Re-Scheduling Ibogaine Via the Legislature
Rescheduling Petition to move Ibogaine from Schedule I down to Schedule III.
1. Current Status
Rescheduling Ibogaine from Schedule I to Schedule III. Ibogaine currently is a Schedule I drug under the Controlled Substance Act (“CSA”). As Such, it has been stigmatized as purportedly having (a) a high potential for abuse; (b) no currently accepted medial use in treatment; and (C) lack of accepted safety for use under medical supervision.
Schedule I designation presents numerous difficulties for potential researchers and investigators. It serves to inhibit research, limit public funding, and discourage private investment capital needed for development of this promising anti-addictive medication.
2. The Need to Reschedule
A petition or other action to reschedule Ibogaine will be necessary sooner or later. Given the current state of scientific knowledge regarding Ibogaine and its use in the treatment of opioid dependence, a downward rescheduling to Schedule III, a restrictive level for items with broad medical use with some paperwork and distribution requirements, would be an appropriate placement.
The question therefore is whether we should proceed sooner rather than later. Since the rescheduling process is lengthy,
taking months and sometimes years to achieve, we should undertake an initiative to reschedule as soon as practical, perhaps in conjunction with an application for Orphan Drug Status.
3. Standing
The history of the litigation to re-schedule cannabis as a Schedule II drug makes it abundantly clear that the DEA’s own re-scheduling process defers unduly to the original listing of certain drugs as Schedule I by Congress when the Controlled Substances Act was enacted in 1970. Judge Clarence Thomas’s opinion in the U.S. vs the Oakland Buyer’s Club made it clear that the Judicial Branch currently feels that it is up to Congress–not doctors or judges–to determine which substances have medical uses. Yet however much the U.S. Supreme Court may invoke the doctrine of Congressional Supremacy, the fact that 9 states have approved medical use of marijuana has had an undeniable political impact on all levels of the Federal Government
Ibogaine was grandfathered into the Controlled Substances Act because of the World Health Organization’s 1968 classification of ibogaine with the hallucinogens as “a substance likely to cause dependency or endanger human health.” By virtue of being on that list, Ibogaine became schedule I when New York enacted its own version of the CSA. Therefore, the route of rescheduling Ibogaine through the state legislative process, while not perfect, may be the most practical way to proceed at this time–especially if pursued with a view to establishing a hearing record in tandem with the present effort in Congress.
4. Medical Use
Under Schedule I category, a drug is deemed to have no medically accepted use in treatment in the United States. Under
Schedule III the drug is deemed safe enough for general distribution, while maintaining record keeping and other regulations to prevent diversion. Schedule III is actually somewhat strict given that Ibogaine has no abuse potential, but we feel this level would offer the best compromise between full de-scheduling and the overly restrictive Schedule II (which includes cocaine and other dependence forming drugs). Ibogaine has no history as a “street drug” and its classification as a Hallucinogen is being questioned by scientific authorities.
When Ibogaine was first listed as a Schedule I substance, there was no known medical use. However, beginning in 1986, series of US patents were issued that disclosed new medical uses for Ibogaine for the first time. These included its use in the treatment of narcotic addiction (Lotsof, 1985); treatment for cocaine and amphetamine abuse (Lotsof, 1986), alcoholism (Lotsof, 1989), nicotine dependency (Lotsof, 1991); poly-drug dependency (Lotsof, 1992); reduction in excitotoxic brain damage (Olney, 1997); and for treatment of neuropathic pain (Olney, 1998). Other potential indications include treatment of Obsessive-Compulsive Disorder (OCD), as an additive to conventional drugs for drug-resistant tuberculosis, and in the resolution of cysts and the elimination of growths and cancers.
The rational for the medical use of Ibogaine in the treatment of addictive disorders is supported by scores of peer-review papers that indicate Ibogaine, among other things, ameliorates the withdrawal syndrome in opiate-dependent rats (Dzoljic, 1988; Glick, 1994), and alcohol (Rezvani, 1995) in the animal model.
In 1993, the FDA authorized the University of Miami researchers J. Sanchos Ramos and Deborah Mash to conduct a Phase 1 dose escalation study. But instead of completing that study, Dr. Mash moved the research to an off-shore location, where she and her colleagues conduct ongoing phase II studies on the island of St. Kitts, under the auspices of Healing Visions Institute for Addictions Recovery, Inc., a corporation doing business in the State of Florida.
According to a recent report in the Wall Street Journal by Naik (July 15, 2002), Dr. Mash supervised use of Ibogaine to treat about 300 drug-dependent patients. The patients, most of whom were American, paid an average of $10,000.00 for the treatment.
The fact is that a team of renown US doctors, pharmacologists, and addiction professionals have found the use of Ibogaine in the treatment drug dependency medically acceptable, but are compelled to administer it to US citizens in an offshore setting. This clearly demonstrates the pressing need to reschedule Ibogaine from a Schedule I to a Schedule III substance. Based upon the state of scientific knowledge at the present time, rescheduling is wholly appropriate.
In keeping with the language of Schedule III, which stipulates reporting and distribution restrictions regarding its prescription and medical uses, Ibogaine is intended to be administered in the treatment of opioid/stimulant detoxification under supervision of a registered nurse or equivalent treatment professional, with access to specific vital signs monitoring and certain emergency response equipment and procedures.
5. Potential for Abuse:
Schedule I, II and II stipulate that the drug has potential for abuse.
While we do not need to refute this notion in order to qualify for the downward reduction to schedule III status, it should be noted that the perception that Ibogaine has “a high potential for abuse” has not been born out by either science or statistics.
None of the consultants to NIDA in the 1995 Ibogaine Review Meeting identified the possible abuse of Ibogaine as a potential safety concern (Alper 2001). Ibogaine is reportedly neither rewarding nor aversive in the conditioned place preference paradigm (Parker, 1995).
Despite being a Schedule I substance for over 30 years, there has been no reports of Ibogaine abuse among drug users. There has never been a seizure of any consequence of Ibogaine reported by either the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) or local law enforcement anywhere in the United States, nor have there been any reports of street arrests for
possession or use of Ibogaine.
The only reported illicit use of Ibogaine consisted of anecdotal reports by or about addict self-help organizations and individuals who utilize the drug for purposes of detoxification. It should further be noted that those who have taken the drug report that it’s effects were not pleasant or enjoyable and that most show no desire to repeat the experience –chiefly because of the length: 1 to 3 days (conveniently congruent to the most acute phase of heroin withdrawal).
The available evidence does not appear to suggest that Ibogaine has significant potential for abuse. Nevertheless, Ibogaine is still controlled and scheduled as if it “has a high potential for abuse, and has no medical use or value”, both of which are totally untrue. Because of its current Scheduling we anticipate that the questions relating to possible diversion to the illicit market will be raised. Since Ibogaine is intended to be administered only in a controlled medical setting, the chance of diversion is minimal. Furthermore, there has been no reported street use of Ibogaine as a drug of abuse.
6. Safety Considerations
A Schedule I designation carries the supposition that there is a lack of accepted safety for the use of the drug.
Since being designated a Schedule I substance, multiple laboratories have evaluated Ibogaine for signs of neurotoxicity. While O’Hearn (1993) reported neurotoxic effects at a dose range of 100 mg/kg, Molinari (1996) found no neurotoxicity present at 40 mg/kg.
Xu (2000) reported that 25 mg/kg corresponds to a no-observable-adverse effect level (NOAEL). The dose range utilized in treatment of opioids withdrawal (15-25 mg/kg) falls within the NOAEL range. The LD50 of p.o. Ibogaine is reportedly 145 mg/kg i.p. in the rat and 175 mg/kg in mice.
Glick et al (1999) found no change in the resting heart rate or blood pressure at a dose of Ibogaine of 40 mg/kg i.p. Mash (1999) reported intensive cardiac monitoring in 39 human subjects dependent on cocaine and/or heroin who received fixed doses of Ibogaine (500, 600, 800 or 1,000 mg. ) No significant adverse effects were seen under study conditions.
Luciano (1998; 2000) reported results of EEGs administered before and after Ibogaine treatment where addicted patients received 20-25 mg/kg. No General medical or EEG abnormalities were seen. At 24 hours after treatment, all neurological examinations were normal, and patients did not have subjective or objective signs of withdrawal.
Mash (2001) reported she has evaluated the safety of Ibogaine in more than 150 patients receiving a dose within the reported therapeutic range (8, 10, 12 mg/kg) under open label conditions, and that a single dose of Ibogaine was well tolerated in drug dependent subjects. No significant adverse effects were seen under study conditions.
Ibogaine has been linked to several fatalities in Europe, and one in the United States. None of the reported deaths occurred under clinical conditions. Autopsy reports failed to establish that Ibogaine itself was the cause of death in any fatality, though several reports indicated Ibogaine could have been a contributing factor. The surreptitious use of heroin or other drugs has created a source of uncertainty regarding several reported fatalities. In the U.S., a death occurred in Florida within 30 days of an Ibogaine treatment administered abroad. Autopsy reports concluded that the death was due to natural causes and not related to Ibogaine.
7. Defining the Nature of Ibogaine
Ibogaine has been classified as a hallucinogen and as such, has been compared at times to LSD, also a schedule I drug. It should be noted that notwithstanding the comparison, Ibogaine has never shared the popularity of LSD, probably because it’s effects are reported as being not pleasurable and interrupting drug use.
The concept that Ibogaine is a hallucinogenic drug is no longer unanimous in scientific circles. According to French chemist Robert Goutarel, former director of the Natural Substances Division of the CNRS (French National Center for Scientific Research), the best classification is of the effects is as “oneiropherenic” rather than hallucinogenic. Others prefer the term “REMogenic” to define the psychological effects of Ibogaine.
Oneirorphrenia has been defined as “states produced by drugs that differ from hallucinogenic states by the absence of any psychotic symptoms while sharing with the hallucinogenic experience the pre-eminence of a primary thought process.” Mash (2001) reported that following the administration of Ibogaine, no episodes of psychosis or major affective disorder were detected. Luciano (1998) reported that in patients he observed receiving between 20 and 25 mg/kg, reality-testing remained normal in all cases, and there were no signs or symptoms of anxiety or thought disorder. These observations are consistent with the above definition of oneirophrenia.
Some, but not all, patients treated with Ibogaine experience visualizations during the dream-like state experienced at the initial onset of the drug. Luciano (1998) reported that only one of three patients receiving 20-25 mg/kg experienced visual Hallucinosis, and then, only when their eyes were cosec. Some have theorized that these are not hallucinations per se, but are visualizations of repressed memories revealed in a waking dream-like state. These visualizations appear to assist the patient in understanding his underlying psychopathology and bringing about cathartic change that supports the interruption of drug use.
Proponents of this theory sometimes refer to Ibogaine not as “hallucinogenic”, but as “REM-ogenic”, since it places the patient into a waking state or REM in which they experience the release of repressed memories visually, as if in a dream, albeit a “waking dream-like state”. Anecdotal reports mention having observed REM-like eye movements in awake patients during treatments. This is wholly consistent with ibogaine-specific activation of the inferior olive (a nucleus
in the brainstem) which projects to cerebellar vermis, an area of the brain found to have enhanced blood flow in PET imaging studies of normal REM sleep in humans and to coordinate rapid eye movements during dreaming.
Gouteral (1993) describes the psychological effects of Ibogaine as a state that involves a “dream phenomenon without loss of consciousness or change in the perception of the environment or any illusions or formal deterioration of thought and without depersonalization.” He states that Ibogaine has been “unjustly condemned as a hallucinogen”, and suggested that a REM-like state induced by Ibogaine corresponds to a window of heightened neural plasticity, with reprocessing of previously learned information and the formation of new associations. This process acts to modify the pathology of learned addiction, weakening thel links between drug-taking cues and responses.
8. Product Formulation and the Analogs Act
Iboga-based medications now include Ibogaine HCl, Des-methylated (or “nor”) ibogaine, the experimental drug 18-methoxycoronaridine, and various whole plant alkaloid extracts. Among researchers and treatment professionals, each has its adherents.
Ibogaine HCl (or sulphate) is the principle alkaloid of Iboga Tabernanthe purified in a salt form. It is the most studied–and the only one ever approved by FDA to go into humans. The full-blown experience consists of a) the visualization, or waking dream phase, followed by b) the “clear” deep concentration phase, followed by the c) insomnia phase. Since ibogaine is de-methylated in its first pass thru the liver into “nor-ibogaine,” the second phase (b) may be thought of as the nor-ibogaine phase, characterized by heightened serotonin level and very week opioid activity at the mu and delta opiate receptors.
Within the last few years, various “free-base extracts” (Indra, Ethnogarden) have become available that contain all the alkaloids of the plant in a non-salt form. Besides being better-tolerated by knowledgeable addicts who reported that whole plant iboga extract is “less boring,” the non-salt formulation seems to come on and drop off more gradually, lessening the risk of bradycardia during initial onset.
In the case of nor-ibogaine and 18-MC, patent-holders developed their compound explicitly to satisfy various safety concerns of the FDA and NIDA. They believe that their compounds, unlike Ibogaine HCl or the whole plant extracts, are sufficiently different that they do not fall under the CSA. However, since the molecular structure of all iboga congeners is virtually identical, and the mechanism of action is substantially the same, it is difficult to see how they would not fall under the purview the 1986 federal Analog Act if the classifying agency (DEA or Justice Dept.) chose to schedule them.
The only way that would happen is if they had a substantially different, and non-psychedelic, subjective effect. Therefore, it is in the interest of research into safer congeners of Ibogaine to re-schedule the parent plant and principal molecule in a less restrictive category.
9. Comments from interested parties
In response to any action to reschedule Ibogaine, there will no doubt be many comments by interested parties addressed to the Drug Enforcement Administration (DEA) regarding this matter. Some will favor rescheduling, others might be against it. We can anticipate comments will be submitted from such parties as: National Institute of Drug Abuse (NIDA) and their Medications Development Division (MDD); Department of Health and Human Services (DHHS); Food and Drug Administration (FDA); College of Problems of Drug Dependence (CPDD); American Association for the Treatment of Opoid Dependence (AATOD); American Psychiatric Association (APA); American Society of Addiction Medicine (ASAM); the National Alliance of Methadone Advocates (NAMA); and others.
We can probably anticipate public hearings, as the development of Ibogaine as a medical treatment for addiction has become a matter of great public interest. NIDA and FDA meetings relating to Ibogaine have always attracted public participation and generated interest from the media.
10. Effect of Rescheduling
The practical effect of rescheduling Ibogaine from Schedule I down to Schedule III will be to permit easier access to researchers and investigators to pursue Ibogaine research. If the reports up to the present of Ibogaine’s reportedly high success rate with heroin and other addictions, we can expect Ibogaine to become the premiere treatment/ detox method allowing users to avoid most if not all withdrawal symptoms, while facilitating rapid psychological self assessment, reflection and ultimately a life experience free of both physical and emotional drug cravings. The cost savings provided by this method, as opposed to methadone maintenance, long term rehab, and prison, will be in the many billions of dollars annually. And this will happen with out posing any risk of illicit diversion or abuse.
References:
Aceto, M.D., Bowman, E., Harris, L.S., “Dependence Studies of New Compounds in the Rhesus Monkey, Rat, and Mouse,” NIDA Research Monograph Series Problems of Drug Dependence 1989, 96:607 (1990)
Aceto, M.D., Bowman, E., Harris, L.S., “Dependence Studies of New Compounds in the Rhesus Monkey, Rat, and Mouse,” NIDA Research Monograph Series Problems of Drug Dependence 1991, 119: 519 (1992)”
Alper, K. “Ibogaine: A Review’ The Alkaloids 56: 1-38 (2001)
Braun, A.R. et al. “Dissociated Pattern of Activity in Visual Cortices and Their Projections During Human Rapid Eye Movement Sleep,” Science 279, 91-95 (1998)
Cappendijk, S,L,T, Dzolijic, M.R. “Inhibitory Effects of Ibogaine on Cocaine Self-Administration in Rats” Eur. J of Pharmacology 241:261-265 (1993)
Dzoljic, E.D., Kaplan, C.D., Dzoljic, M.R.”Effects of Ibogaine on nalozone-percipitated withdrawal syndrome on chronic morphine-dependant rats”, Archives of Intl. Pharmacodynamics 294, 64-70 (1988)
Goutarel, R., Golnhoffer, N., Sillans, R. “Pharmacodynamics and the Therapeutic Applications Iboga and Ibogaine” Psychedelic Monographs and Essays 6: 71-111 (1993)
Glick, S.D., Rossman, K., Steinddorf, S., Maisonneuve, I.M., Carlson, J.N “Effects and Aftereffects of Ibogaine on Morphine Self-Administration in Rats” Eur J. of Pharmacology 195: 341-345 (1991)
Glick, S.D., Rossman, K., Steinddorf, S., Maisonneuve, I.M., Carlson, J.N “Effects of Ibogaine on Acute Signs of Morphine Withdrawal in Rats: Independence from Tremor”, Neuropharmacology 31 (5) 497-500 (1992)
Glick, S.D., Kuehne, M.E., Raucci, J., Wilson, T.E., Larson, E., Keller Jr., R..W., Carlson J.N., “Effects of Iboga Alkaloids on Morphine and Cocaine Self-Administration in Rate: Relationship to Tremorgenic effects and to effects on Dopamine Release in the Nucleus Accumbens and Striataum” Brain Research, 657: 14-22 (1994)
Glick, S.D., Maisonneauve, I.M., Kuehne, M.E., Bandaragem U.K. CNS Drug Review 5:27 (1999)
Lotsof, H.S., Rapid Method for Interrupting the Narcotic Addiction Syndrome, US Patent #4,499,096 (1985)
Lotsof, H.S., Rapid Method for Interrupting the Cocaine and Amphetamine Abuse Syndrome, US Patent #4,587,243 (1986)
Lotsof, H.S., Rapid Method for Attenuating the Alcohol Dependency Syndrome, US Patent #4,857,523 (1989)
Lotsof, H.S., Rapid Method for Interrupting or Attenuating the Nicotine/Tobacco Dependency Syndrom (1991)
Lotsof, H.S., Rapid Method for Interrupting the Poly-Drug Dependency Syndrome, US Patent #5,124,994 (1992)
Luciano, D. “Observations on Treatment with Ibogaine” Am. J. on Addictions (1998)
Luciano, D., Della Sera, E.A., Jethmal, E.G., Bull MAPS 9:27 (2000)
Mash, D.C, Kovera, C.A., Pablo, J., Tyndale, R., Ervin, F.R., Kamlet, J.D., Hearn, W.L., “Ibogaine in the treatment of Heroin Withdrawal” The Alkaloids, 56: 155-171 (2001)
Naik, G. “Array of New Drugs Shows Promise in Fighting Addictions”, Wall Street Journal, B1, July 15, 2002
Ohearn, E., Molliver, M.E., Degeneration of Purkinje cells in parasagittal zomes serebellara vermis after treatment with Ibogaine of Harmaline. Neuroscience 55:303-310 (1993)
Olney, J.W., Use of Ibogaine for Treating of Neuropathic Pain, US Patent #5,925,634 (1999)
Parker, L.A., Siegal, Ss., Luxton, T., Learning and Memory 3: 344 (1995)
Rezvani, A.H., Overstreet, D.H., Lee, Y.W. “Attenuation of Alcohol Intake by Ibogaine in Three Strains of Alcohol-Preferring Rats” Pharmacology, Biochemistry and Behavior, 52: (2) 615-620 (1995)
Xu, Z. Chang Jr., L.W., Slikker, W., Ali, S.F., Rountree, R.L., and Scallet, A.C. “Dose Response Study of Ibogaine Induced Neuropathology in the Rat Cerebellum” Topical. Sci 57:95-1001 (2000)
From: “davidbennet@ziplip.com” <davidbennet@ziplip.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] NY Times article: Earth Calling. Mr Kroupa and Mr Beal
Date: May 11, 2003 at 12:50:20 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Whatever happened it’s too bad if the goal was to get ibogaine mentioned. This article is now in the Herald Tribune which syndicated it internationally.
Could someone please give me the correct email addresses for Marc Brandl from the Libertarian Party and Patrick Kroupa. I have digital@phantom.com and digital@mindvox.com, neither is ever replied to. For Marc I have marcbrandl@hq.lp.org also no replies.
Thanks
-david
—–Original Message—–
From: preston peet [mailto:ptpeet@nyc.rr.com]
Sent: Sunday, May 11, 2003, 9:13 AM
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] NY Times article: Earth Calling. Mr Kroupa and Mr Beal
What happened? Neither one of you ever goes more then a few sentences
without mentioning entheogens, ibogaine or pot and PKD 😉 But all you
gave was a cyberpunk counterculture soundbite (Patrick) and Dana talks
about his building.
Both of you blew a great opportunity to get ibogaine in the NY Times.<
Not sure “blew a great opportunity” is actually exactly fair tot he
interviewees.
Though I was not actually there to hear what Dana and Patrick said to
the writer, I do seem to remember hearing from Patrick last night, if my
memory serves me correctly, that more was said about stuff like ibogaine but
it got cut from the published version. Not sure I’ve got that right, but it
seems about right to my somewhat exhausted memory yesterday.
Peace,
Preston
—– Original Message —–
From: crownofthorns@hushmail.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 2:32 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] NY Times article: Earth Calling. Mr Kroupa and Mr Beal
My only comment is, bro reality is much stranger then fiction. Patrick
you’re on some speaking tour with Dana, Grace Slick, Paul Krassner and
around Berkeley people have said that Robert Altman, Dennis Peron and
Hunter S. Thompson are added to it? Hunter S. Thompson! 🙂 Patrick,
Dana, go!!!!!
I understand that all of you are in the middle of a cloud of cannabis
smoke right now and will not be answering anything on this list. But
between the two of you Dana, Patrick, it’s the NY Times, you’re all in
it. This is as mainstream as it gets.
Not one word about ibogaine???
What happened? Neither one of you ever goes more then a few sentences
without mentioning entheogens, ibogaine or pot and PKD 😉 But all you
gave was a cyberpunk counterculture soundbite (Patrick) and Dana talks
about his building.
Both of you blew a great opportunity to get ibogaine in the NY Times.
This is the NY Times, we get it here even in San Francisco, what happened
guys? Did they cut it in some strange way? The Times is liberal enough
to run a 3 page story about you guys being nuts, but will not mention
ibogaine?
Peace out, smoke out
Curtis
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] hightimes links to mmm stories
Date: May 9, 2003 at 3:40:59 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi all,
Here’s the link to the High Times report of mine on the MMM here in NYC-
http://www.hightimes.com/htsite/news/content.php?page=news_03050856&tpage=1&
cmnt=1
and here’s the link to Peter Gorman’s wrap up of the events around the
globe-
http://www.hightimes.com/htsite/news/content.php?page=news_03050821&tpage=1&
cmnt=1
I’ll have much better photos to go with my report when I put it up at
DrugWar.com in the next day or so. I just finished scanning them in,
including a couple of the one sole arrestee. Kinda weird that the cop
decided to take her out of the park by way of the route he chose, directly
behind the stage where I and a bunch of other radical types just happened to
be sitting waiting to go up and so I therefore saw and captured the perp
walk on film.
Anyway, I’ll be sure to let you know when the photos go up at
DrugWar.com.
Peace,
Preston
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Off line for a while mail may bounce
Date: May 9, 2003 at 10:00:42 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@ibogaine.org, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I have to reload and restore, which usually takes
several tries (with MS products…). My mailbox may
fill (again) and bounce, sorry.
Brett
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
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From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: Cultural Baggage to Primetime
Date: May 8, 2003 at 11:58:50 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
—– Original Message —–
From: Dean Becker
To: houstonnorml@yahoogroups.com ; DPFT-L@listserv.tamu.edu
Sent: Thursday, May 08, 2003 11:58 PM
Subject: Cultural Baggage to Primetime
Please help me get a weekly, prime-time slot for my one hour radio show:
Cultural Baggage – The Unvarnished Truth about the Drug War
airs now on 2nd and 4th Fridays at midnight on KPFT, Houston, 90.1 FM and
live on the net at http://www.kpft.org
Although I have the daily 4:20 Drug War News spots each afternoon, I think
it important that Cultural Baggage reach a larger audience with guests like
DA Terence Hallinan, Dr. Tom O’Connell, Judge Gray, Senator Nolin and
Laureate Milton Friedman.
Please write a quick message to the station manager and the program director
to let them know you would appreciate a weekly Cultural Baggage with a
better time slot.
Duane Bradley, General Manager, dbradley@kpft.org
Otis Maclay, Program Director, otie@kpft.org
To listen to prior weeks shows, please visit:
http://www.cultural-baggage.com/kpft.htm
Please forward this message!
Thanks for any help you can give.
Dean Becker
11215 Oak Spring
Houston, Tx. 77043
281-752-9198
Please include email: dean@unvarnishedtruth.org
Reverend, Church of God’s Evident Truth; Reporter, KPFT Radio, Houston
President, Houston NORML; Community Liaison, Drug Policy Forum of Texas
Author: Century of Lies, Declaration of Evident Truth; Publisher: Drug
Truth
Liaison, New York Times Drug Policy Forum; Producer: Cannabis Odyssey I-IV
From: “Sara Glatt” <sara119@xs4all.nl>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] Tripping De-Light Fantastic
Date: May 8, 2003 at 6:15:11 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Are psychedelic drug good for you ?
Just like anything for some people it is a medicine and for others it
can be poison,
Sara
From: “paul jackamo” <pauljackamo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] New member….
Date: May 8, 2003 at 4:24:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Yes Angie. It is “legal” in the Uk as its classified as an “unlisenced” medicine.
I am however, concerned that your therapist suggested ibogaine as a possible treatment modality for alcohol dependency and yet knew of no treatment providers, nor where to obtain ibogaine.
A good idea would be to thoroughly explore the contents of:
www.ibogaine.org
www.ibogaine.co.uk
before considering anything further. I have no direct knowledge of ibogaine for the treatment of alcohol dependency but I am sure others on the list can provide info/citations.
As a fellow “brit” I wish you the best of luck and I suggest you tell the therapist to research ibogaine him/her self before offering it as a treatment option for others.
paul
From: “Angie” <angie.sadler1@ntlworld.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] New member….
Date: Thu, 8 May 2003 12:18:04 +0100
Hi,
I am a new member living in the UK. My partner and I are both alcohol dependent, and it is ruining our relationship.
My partner was told to check out Ibogaine by his therapist, but she did not know where he could obtain either Ibogaine treatment or Ibogaine for home therapy.
Can you BUY it legally in the UK?
Angie Sadler.
_________________________________________________________________
It’s fast, it’s easy and it’s free. Get MSN Messenger today! http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger
From: “Joshua Tinnin” <krinklyfig@pacbell.net>
Subject: [ibogaine] Tripping De-Light Fantastic
Date: May 8, 2003 at 3:52:53 PM EDT
To: “Ibogaine” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/news/horgan2.htm
Tripping De-Light Fantastic
Are psychedelic drugs good for you?
By John Horgan copyright Slate Magazine May 7, 2003
A year ago, hoping to dispel the postpartum gloom that had gripped me after
I finished writing a book, I hiked into a forest near my home and pitched a
tent under some pine trees. I spent that day and evening listening to the
forest, scribbling in my journal, and thinking-all while under the influence
of a psychedelic drug. The next morning I returned to my wife and children
feeling better than I had in months.
What I did that day should not be illegal. Adults seeking solace or insight
ought to be allowed to consume psychedelics such as LSD, psilocybin, and
mescaline. U.S. laws now classify them as Schedule 1 drugs, banned for all
purposes because of their health risks. But recent studies have shown that
psychedelics-which more than 20 million Americans have ingested-can be
harmless and even beneficial when taken under appropriate circumstances.
Citing this research, some scholars and scientists are proposing that the
prohibitions against psychedelics-or entheogens, “God engenderers,” as
believers in their spiritual benefits prefer to call them-should be
reconsidered. This legal issue has recently been brought to a head by a
religious sect in New Mexico that is suing the United States for the right
to drink a hallucinogenic tea called ayahuasca in its ceremonies. A federal
court is expected to rule on the potentially momentous case any day now.
“There is no doubt that hallucinogens can be used unwisely,” says Charles
Grob, a psychiatrist at the UCLA-Harbor Medical Center, who testified in the
ayahuasca case and is a leader of the effort to rehabilitate the reputation
of these substances. “But these studies show that they can be used safely
within certain parameters.”
After LSD’s astonishing effects were discovered by the Swiss chemist Albert
Hofmann 60 years ago, many psychiatrists considered it and similar compounds
potential treatments for psychological ailments. That is why the
psychiatrist Humphrey Osmond called the drugs “psychedelic,” from the Greek
root for “mind-revealing.” By the mid-1960s, medical journals had published
more than 1,000 papers describing the treatment with psychedelics of some
40,000 patients afflicted with disorders ranging from schizophrenia to
alcoholism.
One remarkable study from this period, known as the Good Friday experiment,
probed the capacity of psilocybin (the active ingredient of so-called magic
mushrooms) to trigger spiritual experiences. On Good Friday, 1962, the
Harvard psychiatrist Walter Pahnke dispensed psilocybin and placebos to a
group of 30 divinity students and professors assembled in a Boston church. A
majority of those who received psilocybin reported sensations of profound
awe and self-transcendence that had lasting positive effects.
By the early 1970s, the surging popularity of psychedelics among the
young-urged by Timothy Leary to “turn on, tune in, and drop out”-had
triggered a backlash. Psychedelics were outlawed, and virtually all research
on them was shut down amid rising concerns about their adverse social and
medical effects. In 1971, the Journal of the American Medical Association
warned that repeated consumption of psychedelics would usually result in
permanent “personality deterioration.”
Further research has shown these fears to be exaggerated, says John Halpern,
a psychiatrist at Harvard Medical School. To be sure, psychedelics can cause
acute and sometimes persistent psychopathology, especially in those
predisposed to mental illness. But Halpern maintains that these compounds
are usually harmless when ingested by healthy individuals in appropriate
settings.
As evidence, Halpern cites a five-year study he recently completed with a
Harvard colleague of members of the Native American Church, who are
permitted by U.S. law to consume the mescaline-containing cactus peyote as a
sacrament. Church members who had taken peyote at least 100 times showed no
adverse neurocognitive effects compared to a control group.
Similar results have emerged from a study of ayahuasca by UCLA psychiatrist
Grob and other scientists, results that Grob describes in the essay
collection Hallucinogens. Ayahuasca, a tea brewed from two Amazonian plants,
contains the potent psychedelic dimethyltryptamine, or DMT. Although the tea
often triggers nausea and diarrhea, Indian shamans have prized it for its
visionary properties for centuries, and since 1987 it has served as a legal
sacrament for several churches in Brazil. The largest is the Uniao Do
Vegetal, or UDV, which combines elements of Christianity with nature worship
and claims 8,000 members.
Grob and his colleagues found that UDV members were on average healthier
physiologically and psychologically than a control group. The UDV adherents
also had elevated receptors for the neurotransmitter serotonin, which has
been correlated with resistance to depression and other disorders. Many of
the UDV members told the scientists that ayahuasca had helped them overcome
alcoholism, drug addiction, and other self-destructive behaviors.
These findings emboldened UDV adherents based in New Mexico to sue the U.S.
Justice Department for the right to drink their sacrament. The case dates to
1999, when federal agents seized 30 gallons of ayahuasca that the UDV group
had imported from Brazil. Last August, a federal judge in Albuquerque ruled
in favor of the UDV worshippers. The judge contended that the Justice
Department had not shown that ayahuasca poses enough of a health risk to
warrant restricting the UDV members’ right to practice their religion. The
Justice Department lawyers appealed, and the case is now before the 10th
Circuit Court in Denver.
Of course, even advocates of entheogens admit that they pose risks.
Ayahuasca can cause cardiac irregularities and other dangerous side effects,
Grob notes, when combined with amphetamines, antidepressants, cheese, red
wine, and other common substances. Ayahuasca drinkers generally fast before
sessions to reduce the risks of these side effects.
In the new book The Antipodes of the Mind, an in-depth study of ayahuasca
visions, the Israeli psychologist Benny Shanon recalls that the tea
transformed him from a “devout atheist” into someone awestruck by the
wonders of nature and of human consciousness. But he warns that ayahuasca
can also be “the worst of liars,” leaving some users gripped by belief in
ghosts, telepathy, and other occult phenomena. Similarly, in Cleansing the
Doors of Perception, the eminent religious scholar Huston Smith recalls that
during the Good Friday experiment, in which he participated, one subject
became so agitated that he had to be injected with Thorazine. Smith
nonetheless contends that entheogens can serve a spiritual purpose, if used
with reverence; after all, mind-altering substances have played an
inspirational role in many religions, including Hinduism and the Eleusinian
cult of ancient Greece.
I have firsthand experience of the double-edged nature of entheogens, which
I’ve taken sporadically since my late teens. There have been moments of
vertiginous anxiety; one particularly bad trip in 1981 left me with
unsettling flashbacks for months. But overall the pros have outweighed the
cons. I usually end up feeling the way I did after my LSD sojourn last
summer: existentially refreshed, with a renewed appreciation of ordinary
existence.
Entheogens are far less addictive and toxic than alcohol or tobacco. Why
should we continue to be denied their benefits, in religious or
non-religious contexts? Risks could be minimized by making these substances
available only through licensed therapists, who can screen clients for
mental instability and advise them on how to make their experiences as
rewarding as possible. Some people might be prescribed entheogens for a
specific disorder, such as depression or alcoholism. And just as drugs such
as Prozac and Viagra are prescribed not just to heal the ill but also to
enhance the lives of the healthy, so might entheogens.
This scenario may not be so far-fetched, given last year’s court decision
favoring the UDV in New Mexico and other developments. A sanctioned study of
psilocybin’s capacity for treating obsessive-compulsive disorder is now
under way at the University of Arizona. And UCLA psychiatrist Grob recently
received FDA approval to investigate whether psilocybin can relieve anxiety
in late-stage cancer patients. Maybe those of us who enjoy an occasional
psychedelic sojourn will be able to do so without feeling like outlaws.
Wouldn’t that be a trip?
http://www.cognitiveliberty.org/proj_entheo.html
From: Dana Beal <dana@cures-not-wars.org>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] NYC CONFERENCE > ANY RECORDINGS BEEN DONE?
Date: May 8, 2003 at 11:17:31 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Good luck with the conference everyone!
Anyone recording any elements of the conference on any media?
If so, can they put up a notice on mindvox and/or calyx as soon as
the media is formatted etc.
Getting more actively involved in the emerging drug user
advocacy/movement over here in the UK and showing recordings etc of
the speakers would I feel catalyze and build on the work done by
Nick et al over the last few years.
enjoy yourselves!
paul.
We have video, but I haven’t had time to pursue it.
Dana/cnw
From: “Angie” <angie.sadler1@ntlworld.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] New member….
Date: May 8, 2003 at 7:18:04 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi,
I am a new member living in the UK. My partner and I are both alcohol dependent, and it is ruining our relationship.
My partner was told to check out Ibogaine by his therapist, but she did not know where he could obtain either Ibogaine treatment or Ibogaine for home therapy.
Can you BUY it legally in the UK?
Angie Sadler.
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Fw: Dr Vincent P. Dole turns 90. Happy birthday!
Date: May 7, 2003 at 9:07:41 PM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Regardless of one’s opinion of methadone (I for one do think that under
current prohibition policies it can and often does save lives. Anyway), just
the fact it’s about Dole makes it pertinent to the list.
Peace,
Preston
—– Original Message —–
From: Andrew Byrne
To: Andrew Byrne
Sent: Wednesday, May 07, 2003 7:42 PM
Subject: Dr Vincent P. Dole turns 90. Happy birthday!
Dear Friends and Colleagues,
This week marks the 90th birthday of Dr Vincent P. Dole, the co-
originator of methadone maintenance treatment for opiate
dependence. Even in the face of legal threats, Dr Dole and his team
persisted with their pioneering work which has now become
mainstream in most of the developed world.
I have had the privilege of knowing Dr Dole for the past decade,
meeting up with him each year at his Rockefeller University office
on New York’s east side. On aging, Dr Dole says that as when
very young, the elderly have to start learning again, this time, the
various ways of coping with deteriorations in the body. Despite
some arthritis, he is still mobile and uses his mental energies for
tasks beyond many half his age. One current interest is the benefit,
psychological and otherwise, of face masks in the SARS epidemic.
Dr Dole’s consistent view has been that methadone should be
treated like any other strong, effective medication, to be prescribed
with appropriate supports and safeguards by adequately trained
doctors. This principle has allowed its use around the world in
stemming the toll from opioid dependency. Adherence to such
normal therapeutic principles has facilitated the parallel use of
buprenorphine, LAAM and other drugs in appropriate situations.
Dr Dole’s views on detoxification are both pragmatic and
compassionate.
I know that all in our dependency community and beyond will join
with me in wishing this fine man well on his achievements.
Our best wishes to Dr Vincent P. Dole and wife Margaret on this
happy day!
sent by Andrew Byrne, Sydney dependency physician.
From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] FWD: joint book reading in NYC
Date: May 7, 2003 at 8:32:36 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
In a message dated 5/7/03 5:52:09 PM, jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:
<< ummm. so what was it you were going to say in your reply? >>
i wasn’t sayin’ ………i hit reply instead of delete……& it stuck.
From: Jon Freedlander <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] FWD: joint book reading in NYC
Date: May 7, 2003 at 6:51:42 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
On Wed, 7 May 2003 Aktionman22@aol.com wrote:
sorry…….my finger stuck to reply.
duh!!!!!!!!
ummm. so what was it you were going to say in your reply?
==========================================================================
| |
| League of Surrealist Discord – www.lsdrecords.com |
| |
| ‘Tis an ill wind that blows no minds… |
————————————————————————–
From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] FWD: joint book reading in NYC
Date: May 7, 2003 at 5:55:33 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
sorry…….my finger stuck to reply.
duh!!!!!!!!
From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] FWD: joint book reading in NYC
Date: May 7, 2003 at 5:44:46 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
In a message dated 5/7/03 2:38:02 PM, jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:
<< a >>
From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] FWD: joint book reading in NYC
Date: May 7, 2003 at 5:44:44 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
In a message dated 5/7/03 2:38:02 PM, jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:
<< a >>
From: Aktionman22@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] FWD: joint book reading in NYC
Date: May 7, 2003 at 5:44:41 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
In a message dated 5/7/03 2:38:02 PM, jfreed1@umbc.edu writes:
<< a >>
From: “paul jackamo” <pauljackamo@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: May 7, 2003 at 5:00:59 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I did ibogaine hcl (1000mg and 1500mg) for heroin/methadone and sporadic crack dependency. I relapsed after my first treatment simply because I didnt go through the window of opportunity.
Its been nearly 8 months since my second treatment and I am still clean. This is the longest period in over ten years.
Hope these replies help and remember the people on here represent a fraction of the people who have used ibogaine for chemical dependency.
Howard has mucho data on www.ibogaine.org and the study by e.bastians in amsterdam,once the results are in will provide an interesting adjunct to the data already collected. Also remember, many treatment providers have yet to generate long term studies for all sorts of reasons.
paul.
From: ITSONLYME333@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 18:22:44 EDT
I am just wondering how many people on this list have actually done ibo? If
you took it for an addiction, how long were you able to stay clean? I am just
looking for a short answer so I can try to gauge if this stuff is actually
helping large numbers of addicts, or is it just a few here and there? Only
first hand accounts please. Thanks to all who choose to participate!
Jeff
_________________________________________________________________
It’s fast, it’s easy and it’s free. Get MSN Messenger today! http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger
From: jon freedlander <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: [ibogaine] FWD: joint book reading in NYC
Date: May 7, 2003 at 3:30:48 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Since Daniel Pinchbeck was a presenter at the ibogaine conference this past
weekend, i thought the following might be of interest to some people on the
list…
===== Original Message From “Thomas Roberts” <P80TBR1@wpo.cso.niu.edu> =====
New York, NY…On Thursday May 15 at 7:00 PM, at the Housing Works
Used
Book Café, Daniel Pinchbeck, author of Breaking Open the Head, will
read
with John Horgan, author of Rational Mysticism. The authors will be
available to answer questions and sign books after the event.
About Pinchbeck:
In Breaking Open the Head (Broadway Books), Daniel Pinchbeck tells the
story of the trips-you can take that in both senses-that transformed
him
from bored cynic to true believer. Pinchbeck has taken a lot of drugs
in a
lot of places, from the desert camp of Burning Man to the jungle of
Ecuador; in Mexico, on DMT, he glimpsed the other side, and he has been
a
believer ever since. He’s not the first to travel this route, and he
salutes his trail guides, providing a thoughtful analysis of the
literature of psychedelic substances and s
anecdote with cultural criticism, Timothy Leary with Walter Benjamin,
Pinchbeck argues that the rationalist world view is a spiritual
roadblock,
but that drugs can sometimes clear the path . There’s another world,
and
he’s been there.
“Grippingly dramatic, powerfully moving, this is a classic of the
literature of ecstasy.”- Booklist (starred review)
Daniel Pinchbeck is a founding editor of Open City, and has written
for
Rolling Stone, Men’s Journal, and The Village Voice.
About Horgan:
In Rational Mysticism (Houghton Mifflin), John Horgan investigates the
rational basis of mystical experience with rigor-and candor. In
discussing
how mystical experiences such as trances and visions actually work,
Horgan
draws from chemistry, neuroscience, and anthropology, but also from
personal experience. Science writer Horgan is himself a spiritual
seeker
who has conducted his own drug-assisted explorations, and he is not
afraid
to talk about them. Neither a debunker nor an acolyte, Horgan is a
refreshingly even-handed guide to metaphysics ci
John Horgan is a former senior writer at Scientific American and the
author of the best-selling The End of Science.
Housing Works Used Book Café is located at 126 Crosby Street, one
block
east of Broadway between Houston and Prince, near the N/R, 6, and F
trains. Admission is free, but donated books are welcome and
encouraged.
For more information call 212 334 3324.
Housing Works Inc. is a minority-controlled, community-based,
not-for-profit organization that provides housing, health care,
advocacy
and support services to homeless men, women and children living with
HIV
and AIDS. Founded in 1990, Housing Works’ mission is to help people
living
with AIDS and HIV who are homeless or at risk of homelessness to gain
stability, security and independence so that they can live their lives
with hope and dignity.
All books and albums at the Used Book Café are donated by
organizations
and individuals, and all proceeds go to support Housing Works Inc.’s
core
programs.
From: Eaquinet@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Take home mmethadone.
Date: May 7, 2003 at 3:12:14 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi to Tara,
I tried to write you privately but the e-address wouldn’t “take”; so, sorry to others on this list. The name of the clinic I had changed to is: National Specialty Clinics. They are in Richmond, Indiana but have sister clinics other places. Look up that name on the internet, check the info at ATWatchdog or NAMA, or just call my clinic (765/962-8843) for other sites. good luck; you have a right to better treatment–hey, even the newer federal regs say so! eliana
From: Jon Freedlander <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: [ibogaine] thanks =)
Date: May 6, 2003 at 7:30:23 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I just wanted to thank everyone who came out to the conference this past
weekend, especially Dana, Howard, Brett, Patrick and Preston. It was my
first time meeting anyone from the ibogaine world, and also my first time
presenting information, and you all made me feel very welcome and
comfortable; not to mention providing me with a lot of interesting and
valuable information.
so….ummm, thanks =)
==========================================================================
| |
| League of Surrealist Discord – www.lsdrecords.com |
| |
| ‘Tis an ill wind that blows no minds… |
————————————————————————–
From: “Steven Anker” <stevenanker@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: May 6, 2003 at 12:00:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Took ibo 3x, relapsed a few times before the last time, basically clean for 6 months. Nothing else ever worked as well as ibo. Junky for twelve years.
From: ITSONLYME333@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 18:22:44 EDT
I am just wondering how many people on this list have actually done ibo? If
you took it for an addiction, how long were you able to stay clean? I am just
looking for a short answer so I can try to gauge if this stuff is actually
helping large numbers of addicts, or is it just a few here and there? Only
first hand accounts please. Thanks to all who choose to participate!
Jeff
_________________________________________________________________
Protect your PC – get McAfee.com VirusScan Online http://clinic.mcafee.com/clinic/ibuy/campaign.asp?cid=3963
From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Manual for Ibogaine Therapy, Second Revision
Date: May 6, 2003 at 8:11:06 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I am pleased to announce the publication of the Manual for Ibogaine Therapy,
Second Revision.
Enjoy.
http://www.ibogaine.org/manual.html
http://www.ibogaine.desk.nl/manual.html
Howard Lotsof
Dora Weiner Foundation
**********************
Manual for Ibogaine Therapy
Screening, Safety, Monitoring & Aftercare
Second Revision
by
Howard S. Lotsof & Boaz Wachtel
Contributing Authors
Marc Emery, Geerte Frenken, Sara Glatt
Brian Mariano, Karl Naeher
Martin Polanko, Marko Resinovic
Nick Sandberg, Eric Taub
Samuel Waizmann, Hattie Wells
© 2003
Table of Contents
Introduction to the Second Edition
Preface
Treatment
Intake and Safety Issues
Dose and Effect
Opioid Withdrawal
Opioid withdrawal tables
Post Ibogaine Treatment Therapy
Discussion
Overview
Inclusion Criteria
Exclusion Criteria
Treatment Regimen and Dose
Product Identity
Post Ibogaine Therapy
Invitation to Contributing Authors
Appendices
Selections NIDA Draft Ibogaine Protocol
Related Protocol Bibliography
Additional Document links
From: Cathe1etc@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: May 6, 2003 at 7:32:39 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
i have taken it 3 x and am clean 21 months also quit tobacco 11 1/2 months ago
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] mice, marijuana and madness- the shocking True Tail of science gone awry
Date: May 6, 2003 at 6:31:48 AM EDT
To: <drugwar@mindvox.com>, <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Cc: “CRRH” <restore@crrh.org>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
HI all,
Truely horrific experiementation, reminiscent of the worst Nazi
atrocities imaginable, have been going on right under our noses, so in the
interest of outing such dastardly “science” we at DrugWar.com are happy to
post this outrageous report from our friend in the fields, Dr. Jay
Cavanaugh, and thank him for his dedication towards bring such cruelty and
shame to all our attentions.
Peace,
Preston Peet
Editor http://www.drugwar.com
Editor at Large High Times mag/.com
http://www.drugwar.com/madmice.shtm
Mice, Marijuana, and Madness
Forwarded by
Jay R. Cavanaugh, PhD
May 1, 2003
posted at DrugWar.com
May 6, 2003
snip-
Las Flores is also the home of the Eva Peron Memorial Eugenics Institute
which specializes in murine (mice) experimentation. It is here that science
witnessed the birth of the first mice bred for cannabis experimentation
(Mota mice). Mota mice can either have normal cannabinoid receptors (Mota
N), have cannabinoid receptors removed in knock out experiments (Mota
Minus), or have enhanced receptors (Mota Mejor).
What this reporter found is difficult to describe so apologies are made in
advance for shocking any reader sensibilities and caution is made to not
allow small children to read further.
The first serious problems arose when lab workers were shocked to discover
that the Mota Minus mice not only failed to thrive but were completely nude
(photo below).
(image)
Researchers familiar with the 60’s in America would have known that there is
a direct relationship between the growing of hair and cannabis consumption.
Who can forget those long haired weirdo Haight Asbury pot heads? Obviously,
however, cannabis, natural or otherwise, is required not only for feeding
but for having decent levels of body hair. This research finding was
suppressed by the Institute at the urging of local DEA officials attached to
the Argentine military despite protests from some researchers who think
marijuana may cure baldness.
snip-
Read Complete Shocking Report at above URL
From: “booker w” <swbooker@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: May 6, 2003 at 1:02:12 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi Jeff: I took ibo three times, got clean the second time, and lasted two years. I’ve relapsed here and there due to medical conditions, but never have I resumed anything like the habit I had five years ago. Best wishes… Sandy
>From: ITSONLYME333@aol.com
>Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
>Subject: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
>Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 18:22:44 EDT
>
>I am just wondering how many people on this list have actually done ibo? If
>you took it for an addiction, how long were you able to stay clean? I am just
>looking for a short answer so I can try to gauge if this stuff is actually
>helping large numbers of addicts, or is it just a few here and there? Only
>first hand accounts please. Thanks to all who choose to participate!
>Jeff
From: “Randy Hencken” <randyhencken@hotmail.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: May 5, 2003 at 7:30:18 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I did Ibo almost two years ago and I have been off dope ever since.
Randy
From: ITSONLYME333@aol.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: Mon, 5 May 2003 18:22:44 EDT
I am just wondering how many people on this list have actually done ibo? If
you took it for an addiction, how long were you able to stay clean? I am just
looking for a short answer so I can try to gauge if this stuff is actually
helping large numbers of addicts, or is it just a few here and there? Only
first hand accounts please. Thanks to all who choose to participate!
Jeff
_________________________________________________________________
Add photos to your e-mail with MSN 8. Get 2 months FREE*. http://join.msn.com/?page=features/featuredemail
From: ITSONLYME333@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] To ALL: Please answer these 2 questions (informal Poll)
Date: May 5, 2003 at 6:22:44 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I am just wondering how many people on this list have actually done ibo? If you took it for an addiction, how long were you able to stay clean? I am just looking for a short answer so I can try to gauge if this stuff is actually helping large numbers of addicts, or is it just a few here and there? Only first hand accounts please. Thanks to all who choose to participate!
Jeff
From: Otter60@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] hi, I’m new
Date: May 4, 2003 at 6:24:56 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
In a message dated 5/2/03 11:52:42 PM Eastern Standard Time,
bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:
<< Ibo is very unpredictable, subject to changes in
effect from often subtle changes in setting, procedure
or environment. So, yes ibo is different than LSD, >>
Thanks for all the replies, they are helpful.
I am wondering, how is it for someone who suffers from depression or anxiety?
Could it make things worse or would it be dangerous?
Otter
From: “paul jackamo” <pauljackamo@hotmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] NYC CONFERENCE > ANY RECORDINGS BEEN DONE?
Date: May 3, 2003 at 3:54:56 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Good luck with the conference everyone!
Anyone recording any elements of the conference on any media?
If so, can they put up a notice on mindvox and/or calyx as soon as the media is formatted etc.
Getting more actively involved in the emerging drug user advocacy/movement over here in the UK and showing recordings etc of the speakers would I feel catalyze and build on the work done by Nick et al over the last few years.
enjoy yourselves!
paul.
_________________________________________________________________
Stay in touch with absent friends – get MSN Messenger http://www.msn.co.uk/messenger
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] NY Times article: Earth Calling. Mr Kroupa and Mr Beal
Date: May 3, 2003 at 11:36:19 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
What happened? Neither one of you ever goes more then a few sentences
without mentioning entheogens, ibogaine or pot and PKD 😉 But all you
gave was a cyberpunk counterculture soundbite (Patrick) and Dana talks
about his building.
Both of you blew a great opportunity to get ibogaine in the NY Times.<
Not sure “blew a great opportunity” is actually exactly fair tot he
interviewees.
Though I was not actually there to hear what Dana and Patrick said to
the writer, I do seem to remember hearing from Patrick last night, if my
memory serves me correctly, that more was said about stuff like ibogaine but
it got cut from the published version. Not sure I’ve got that right, but it
seems about right to my somewhat exhausted memory yesterday.
Peace,
Preston
—– Original Message —–
From: crownofthorns@hushmail.com
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Sent: Friday, May 02, 2003 2:32 PM
Subject: [ibogaine] NY Times article: Earth Calling. Mr Kroupa and Mr Beal
My only comment is, bro reality is much stranger then fiction. Patrick
you’re on some speaking tour with Dana, Grace Slick, Paul Krassner and
around Berkeley people have said that Robert Altman, Dennis Peron and
Hunter S. Thompson are added to it? Hunter S. Thompson! 🙂 Patrick,
Dana, go!!!!!
I understand that all of you are in the middle of a cloud of cannabis
smoke right now and will not be answering anything on this list. But
between the two of you Dana, Patrick, it’s the NY Times, you’re all in
it. This is as mainstream as it gets.
Not one word about ibogaine???
What happened? Neither one of you ever goes more then a few sentences
without mentioning entheogens, ibogaine or pot and PKD 😉 But all you
gave was a cyberpunk counterculture soundbite (Patrick) and Dana talks
about his building.
Both of you blew a great opportunity to get ibogaine in the NY Times.
This is the NY Times, we get it here even in San Francisco, what happened
guys? Did they cut it in some strange way? The Times is liberal enough
to run a 3 page story about you guys being nuts, but will not mention
ibogaine?
Peace out, smoke out
Curtis
Concerned about your privacy? Follow this link to get
FREE encrypted email: https://www.hushmail.com/?l=2
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From: “Allison Senepart” <aa.senepart@xtra.co.nz>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] families, marches, ibogaine, and perseverance
Date: May 3, 2003 at 8:32:29 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Amazing what mums can tolerate. My parents know that my partner and I have
been addicts. They don’t like it but have still given support. Its hard
for my Mum especially cos she was brought up real strict, church etc. etc.
and is older than a lot of my friends parents. Now when she rings up she
always asks. “Hows your health”??? which always makes me smile cos its such
a polite way of asking if I’m straight or not. Then if she has doubts, she
asks my daughter just to make sure. I bite my tongue a lot cos I know she
means well and we have had so many arguments and fights in earlier years.
Life is too short so I guess if she can get her head around me I can at
least grow up a bit and give her some respect too.
Allison
—– Original Message —–
From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>; <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Sent: Thursday, May 01, 2003 1:39 AM
Subject: [ibogaine] families, marches, ibogaine, and perseverance
Hi all,
Despite my comment yesterday, or maybe it was the day before, about
still trying but not yet succeeding to convince my family that the WOSDU
is
utterly stupid and failing and a waste of time, money and lives, it seems
I’ve come a long way with at least my mom, who “caught” me rolling up a
teeny piece of war hash with tobacco on the back patio chez ‘rents at
Christmas time. Telling me she was “not shocked, surprised, upset” when
she
realized what I was doing, she went on to say in a “Happy Easter” note to
me
today that-
I don’t want to get in trouble, I pretty much have come to share your
views
on the “dangers” of pot, but I am just too old to fight or demonstrate or
any of that.<
I never, ever seriously thought I’d hear or read such a view from one of
my
‘rents, (though obviously I dreamed about it happening) but it seems that
I’ve been able to convince at least one of them that things are not
exactly
what the prohibitionists make them out to be. I think my Dad is at about
the
same level, though he’s not come right out like this and said it.
So, no matter how bleak things look, giving up never gets me anywhere,
but perseverance sometimes does.
Happy Easter and Spring to you all.
For those in the NYC area, the annual Cures-Not-Wars marijuana march is
this
Saturday, and Sunday is a “big” ibogaine conference. (see below) Keep it
in
mind. There will be other cities around the world, nearly 200 as near as I
can tell, that will also be holding associated marches, but NYC will be
holding the only Ibogaine conference. So perhaps I’ll meet one or more of
you this weekend, right?
;-))))
Peace,
Preston
——
IBOGAINE FORUM SUNDAY, MONDAY..
The Walker Stage @ 75 Walker St. (at Broadway)
Sunday, May 4, 2003, Noon to 8 pm
12:00 noon – 12:45 pm
Registration $20
12:45 pm – 1:00 pm
Introductory Remarks
Rommel Washington, BENU
1:00 pm – 2:30 pm
Traditional Healing and Religious Practice
Suzanne Bellamy, ex-BPP
Laurent Sazy, Photoethnographer
Malendi, Bwiti Nganga
Awolowo Johnson, Nganga/sociologist
Discussion
2:30 pm – 3:30 pm
Break
3:30 pm – 5:30 pm
Treatment Providers Speak
Howard Lotsof
Linette Carriere, IbogaTherapyHouse
Patrick Kroupa, Ibogaine List
Adam Nodelman, INTASH
Brian Mariano, Czech Republic
Lynn Maner
Discussion
5:45 pm to 8 pm
Ibogaine and the Search for Lost Sacraments
Prof. Carl Ruck, PhD, author, “The Apples of Apollo”
Daniel Pinchbeck, author,
“Breaking Open the Head”
Charles Kater, Friends of Bishop Pike
Frank Morales, Episcopalian Priest
OTHERS, TBA
Discussion
Monday, May 5, 2003,
10 am to 6 pm
10:00 am – 10:30 am
Registration $20
10:30 am – 10:45 am
Introductory Remarks
H.S. Lotsof
10:45 am – 1:45 pm
Scientific Panel
Kenneth R. Alper, MD
Deborah C. Mash PhD
Emmanuel Onaivi, PhD
Carl M. Anderson, PhD
Jonathan Freedlander, BA
Discussion
1:45 pm – 3:00 PM
Lunch
3:00 pm – 5:15 pm
Politics and Availability
Dana Beal, co-author,
“The Ibogaine Story”
Vic Hernandez, Dr PH
Howard Lotsof
Bob Sisko Addiction Research Institute
Ric Doblin, MAPS
Discussion
5:15 pm – 6:00 pm
Final Wrap-up Panel
Rommel Washington, BENU
& Principal Panelists
The Monday session will be attended by representatives of various
city and state agencies.
Dana/cnw
From: Brett Calabrese
To: ibogaine@lists.calyx.nl, ibogaine@mindvox.com
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: [IBOGAINE] New Scientist ibogaine article
Status:
I tried to find it, found this instead.
http://uk.news.yahoo.com/030425/103/dyjiw.html
Friday April 25, 12:49 PM
African shrub may help drug withdrawal
US scientists are investigating derivatives of a
compound from an African shrub that is said to cure
drug addicts of their habit, reports New Scientist
magazine.
Ibogaine is a compound that comes from the root of the
plant Tabernanthe iboga, found in Gabon, West Africa.
Followers of the Bwiti religion use it in ceremonies
for its vision-giving properties. But in the early
1960s, ibogaine became associated with reducing drug
cravings among heroin addicts attempting to withdraw.
Although banned in the US as a schedule 1 drug – it is
classed alongside heroin – some researchers say that
ibogaine is “worth investigating” as an alternative to
methadone to help heroin addicts avoid the effects of
withdrawal.
snip-
But Frank Vocci, from the US National Institute on
Drug Abuse in Maryland, told New Scientist that while
there were “striking stories” of drug addicts who have
been helped by ibogaine, there were other anecdotes
describing people who did not quit their habit and
even died while taking the compound.
© HMG Worldwide Ltd 2003
—–
and as Howard Lotsoff wrote in reply to Vocci’s point-
Frank could say the same thing about methadone, LAAM and burprenorphine.
Now, why didn’t he do that?<
(Well said Howard and a great point.)
I’ll send the March info in another email.
Peace again,
Preston
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] hi, I’m new
Date: May 3, 2003 at 12:51:50 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
more…ummm…well, its longer for one; but its,
maybe more reflective?
someone, help me out =)
During ibo sessions people go into a lucid dreaming
state, very much like REM sleep where someone dreams
but are awake. This is where the “visions” typically
happen, the main theme generally being pictures,
events, times, places and things long forgotten that
are meaningful to you. You get showed things,
sometimes directly, sometimes in parable, often from a
greatly expanded perspective that would include others
of importance. It is as if you are there, do you
understand? It is like going to sleep, take ibo, sit
back, close your eyes and (after relaxing into said
sleep), you dream – you don’t just shut your eyes and
dream, same with ibo. Someone makes a noise, POOF, you
are out of dream (as in very instantly) and go on to
start a new one. These dreams I guess last, well, I
don’t know under a minute, a few minutes at most, go
from one to another.
But you don’t have to have them or can do other
things, like have an out of body experience, you can
look at the room (yes with your eyes closed, what fun
is it opened anyone can do that), talk to the various
beings that you encounter, maybe you are into JC and
now is your opportunity to have a chat. So these
dreams happen one after the other, for hours,
sometimes many hours. Depending, for a full
anti-addictive dose 5+, but could be 16 or longer for
that matter.
Then the dialogs start and the visions tend to end
very abruptly (but softly), like they just stop.
Actually there is some mix of visions and dialog going
on but the overt visions that are dream like end.
People run through stuff, this issue, that event,
unsettled thoughts and events come up and are often
settled. Like a Karma settling party going on in your
head.
It is generally about STUFF. Any STUFF that is
serious, that you have been thinking about, that
bothers you, that effects or interests you, that you
may need to be (warned) shown… tends to come up.
Sometimes other stuff comes up, archetype images,
sometimes sounds (I heard drumbs), the Bwiti, some say
the future (or one future…). And that goes on for
another maybe 6 hours, or maybe 16, or 26, 36? Well,
you will find out when you get there (LOL).
And then you kind of have this head of jello with all
this shit swimming around, so is your belly (no sudden
turns), it feels shitt, like sick, disgusting, YUCK,
it is hard to move, there is residual nausea,
sometimes these wild visual artifacts (like magnesium
flare tracers and other stuff that goes on for a
while, days typically from a full anti-addictive dose.
And then… (think it is old here, you should see it
from the other side) the glow sets in, you go from
YUCK to on pink cloud #9. Life and energy, hope and
happiness, hey or maybe some more shit and depression
(lots depends on who is taking ibo, what kind, how
much, why…). Like getting hit with LIFE FORCE… Now
for me, the super-glow lasts 3-4 days or so where it
is just way to fucking much (too much is the general
theme of ibogaine, about 1/5th would be pleasant). The
superglow is a period of time, when the glow first
hits that you can do anything. It is when you really
need to be in a good environment. It is like you are
super-silly, all those wires got all unplugged inside
you and now is when they start getting plugged back
in. This period of time is where you are
super-plastic, where you can be molded and take many
take direction very well – those that don’t do less
well.
Now, over the next several weeks people settle down a
bit, the glow calms down, I find myself at my best
thinking/functioning from about 2 weeks to at least 4
months after. Meanwhile stuff is still happening,
changes are still happening, shit is sometimes
bubbling up (not fun, necessary sometimes).
Ibo is very unpredictable, subject to changes in
effect from often subtle changes in setting, procedure
or environment. So, yes ibo is different than LSD, ibo
is also different than IBO which is different than
(you got it) IBO, and that is different than IBO. Each
and every ibo experience will be different than each
and every other one. It is also a very different event
being an addict or not, what form of toxicity you may
have or not. The cleaner you are, seems the easier it
is – or the more toxic/shit you have the more
scrubbing the ibo needs to do, the harder it is on
you.
Reflective with perspective – anyone got another word
to add? Know what, it is like you are going through
life, someone comes along and rips you (your spirit,
your soul, your being) from you, shakes you, shows you
YOU, loves you, chats for a while. Then after hearing
the words “don’t forget” you get shoved back in your
body. After a time, people tend to forget but it stays
with you, to draw on. It is very much un”like” anthing
I ever took or could have imageined existed, like
peace, spirituality, ZEN in a pill. Take a stone cold
junkie, dose em and in a few days or so, POOF, he/she
will often look like they glow, I mean happy, content,
healthy, with a smile, at peace… Ibo is like cocaine
backwards, first you have the crash, then you get high
with all the opposit things that go along with it
(reverse of peeking out the peep hole kind of thing –
as in all that other made-up stuff that doesn’t
matter, yup, you find out it does not matter).
MILEAGE VARIES!!!!!
Have a good night.
__________________________________
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The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
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From: Jon Freedlander <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] hi, I’m new
Date: May 2, 2003 at 10:56:37 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
On Fri, 2 May 2003 Otter60@aol.com wrote:
Hi, I actually subscribed to this list to get info for my daughter who is on
MMT and keeeps relapsing on benzos. She doesn’t have internet access. I
used to do LSD and other psychedleics and am wondering, from decriptions I
have read, how ibugaine is different, or is it. Was it unknown in the
sixties?
Otter
Ibogaine is different for a number of reasons. Particularly with opiates
(I’m assuming MMT is methadone maintenance?), because it stops withdrawal
symptoms.
But for any drug, it’s different because unlike most psychedelics, it
affects the neural pathways that are thought to be involved in addiction.
The trip is also qualitatively different than something like LSD….its
more…ummm…well, its longer for one; but its, maybe more reflective?
someone, help me out =)
From: Nick Labus <goosebumpz2002@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] hi, I’m new2
Date: May 2, 2003 at 9:39:41 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
OTTER are You FROM A2 MI
well actually if you take maybe 400mics of good LAD25 and set the setting onto wich you want to look at your life and sit there completely alone you can do some DEEP DEEP soul searching! period! before i believed i was a drug addict or had even used a needle for the first time LAD25 and a little weed helped me make some serious life changes that are still with me today i remember almost95% of everything of that trip i learned about relationships i was in with family friends and basically Everything! i decided to quit drugs the next day or not the next day but right then and it worked for 2 months but i didnt follow up with anything slowly i crept back into marhiuana then slowly back intoi drugs and eventually heroinaddiction BUT, i still try to be a nicer person this day directly due to that 1 particular trip. but yes on the other hand ther was another 2 or 300 times more of tripping that wernt to earth shattering and i have taken 23 hits of cid at once well actually 13 then 10 more 2 hours later {FRIED my brain was} and Kurt blow did over 30 but i have not taken IBO so IDO nt KnOw bROw signed, DREDNOT
Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com> wrote:
Otter,
Welcome
> used to do LSD and other psychedleics and am
> wondering, from decriptions I
> have read, how ibugaine is different, or is it.
IMO, yes it is and very different. One thing that you
need to understand about the effects is it is can
effect people very differently, on the outside it
looks pretty much the same. So, you will have the odd
“it was like acid times a million”, to me it is
nothing like acid. Acid and alike are mind candy, a
toy, something to have fun with, a joy ride… not
that they don’t have their own mind expanding positive
properties and all that. ibogaine is not a toy and
certainly no joy ride unless you think stuff like 18
hours in a roller coaster is fun. Ibo is not like
tripping out, it is nothing for parties, the “high”
sucks, open eye visuals are not cool for long. Ibo in
large doses is big-time YUCK overall and very long and
arduous with nausea, vomiting, ataxia, sometimes
slight headaches, hot/cold body fluctuations, tremor,
abominal discomfort (some symptoms similar to
withdrawal), photphoobia, extreme sensitivy to sound
and absolutely intense waves of nausea brought about
by movement. Full large doses can require several days
(or longer) to recover, there are several phases to
having taken ibo that GO ON FOR WEEKS AND MONTHS. A
long acting metabolite (nor-ibogaine) installs itself
in (fat and brain tissue) in people who have taken
ibogaine and stays there for months, I have felt ibo
in me 11 months after dosing. Basically it is
something like “you ain’t in Kansas any more” in a
dose vs dose comparison. Ibo does stuff like having
your soul lifted (ok ripped from your body,
happens…)by the hand of GOD and brushed off and
kissed by the Angels, to be given the understanding of
total knowledge of what it is you did and who it is
you are – no blindfolds – you see everything. Sumthin
like that… Now maybe eat a sheet of acid and it will
do the trick but you will have to ask Patrick about
that.
Ibo is all about you and you are in complete control –
even if you don’t know it (that is the trick, isn’t
it?????????). This is some soul rocking shit, no
matter how much acid I did, it didn’t make me happy,
didn’t make me use less drugs (or consider such a
thing), didn’t tell me much that I remembered when it
was over. With ibo, the lessons stay with you, are a
part of you, not some ideas that vanish when it is
over. Ibo is (or can be) like years on the couch –
well, for some a good hit of acid… I hear you and
yeah, I will give it that but ibo is far far better,
least for me.
Good luck
Brett
> it unknown in the
> sixties?
> Otter
>
>
__________________________________
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From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] NYC ibogaine confernce Sunday May 4 & Monday May 5
Date: May 2, 2003 at 9:22:28 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Dear list,
I will be presenting on Patient Medication Acceptability and Treatment
Options: Ibogaine, Methadone and Buprenorphine during the NYC IBOGAINE FORUM
on Sunday May 4 and Monday May 5.
I would look forward to seeing any of you who can make it.
Howard
IBOGAINE FORUM SUNDAY, MONDAY..
The Walker Stage @ 56 Walker St. (at Broadway)
Sunday, May 4, 2003, Noon to 8 pm
12:00 noon – 12:45 pm
Registration $20
12:45 pm – 1:00 pm
Introductory Remarks
Rommel Washington, BENU
1:00 pm – 2:30 pm
Traditional Healing and Religious Practice
Suzanne Bellamy, ex-BPP (moderator)
Laurent Sazy, Photoethnographer
Malendi, Bwiti Nganga (visa not granted) we are all deprived
Awolowo Johnson, Nganga/sociologist
Discussion
2:30 pm – 3:30 pm
Break
3:30 pm – 5:30 pm
Treatment Providers Speak
Howard Lotsof (Panel Moderator)
Linette Carriere, IbogaTherapyHouse, Vancouver, BC
Patrick Kroupa, Ibogaine List, Miami
Adam Nodelman, International Coalition for Addict Self-Help
Brian Mariano, Czech Republic
Discussion
5:45 pm to 8 pm
Ibogaine and the Search for Lost Sacraments
Prof. Carl Ruck, PhD, author, “The Apples of Apollo”
Daniel Pinchbeck, author, “Breaking Open the Head”
Charles Kater, Friends of Bishop Pike
Frank Morales, Episcopalian Priest
OTHERS, TBA
Discussion
Monday, May 5, 2003,
10 am to 6 pm
10:00 am – 10:30 am
Registration $20
10:30 am – 10:45 am
Introductory Remarks
H.S. Lotsof
10:45 am – 1:45 pm
Scientific Panel
Kenneth R. Alper, MD, NYU School of Mediciner
Deborah C. Mash PhDm University of Miami
Emmanuel Onaivi, PhD, William Paterson University
Carl M. Anderson, PhD, Harvard University
Jonathan Freedlander, BA
Discussion
1:45 pm – 3:00 PM
Lunch
3:00 pm – 5:15 pm
Politics and Availability
Dana Beal, co-author,
“The Ibogaine Story”
Vic Hernandez, PhD, formerly with Dupont
Howard Lotsof, President, Dora Weiner Foundation
Bob Sisko, Addiction Research Institute
Ric Doblin, Muldisplinary Association for Psychedelic Studies
Discussion
5:15 pm – 6:00 pm
Final Wrap-up Panel
Rommel Washington, BENU
& Principal Panelists
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] hi, I’m new
Date: May 2, 2003 at 8:49:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Otter,
Welcome
used to do LSD and other psychedleics and am
wondering, from decriptions I
have read, how ibugaine is different, or is it.
IMO, yes it is and very different. One thing that you
need to understand about the effects is it is can
effect people very differently, on the outside it
looks pretty much the same. So, you will have the odd
“it was like acid times a million”, to me it is
nothing like acid. Acid and alike are mind candy, a
toy, something to have fun with, a joy ride… not
that they don’t have their own mind expanding positive
properties and all that. ibogaine is not a toy and
certainly no joy ride unless you think stuff like 18
hours in a roller coaster is fun. Ibo is not like
tripping out, it is nothing for parties, the “high”
sucks, open eye visuals are not cool for long. Ibo in
large doses is big-time YUCK overall and very long and
arduous with nausea, vomiting, ataxia, sometimes
slight headaches, hot/cold body fluctuations, tremor,
abominal discomfort (some symptoms similar to
withdrawal), photphoobia, extreme sensitivy to sound
and absolutely intense waves of nausea brought about
by movement. Full large doses can require several days
(or longer) to recover, there are several phases to
having taken ibo that GO ON FOR WEEKS AND MONTHS. A
long acting metabolite (nor-ibogaine) installs itself
in (fat and brain tissue) in people who have taken
ibogaine and stays there for months, I have felt ibo
in me 11 months after dosing. Basically it is
something like “you ain’t in Kansas any more” in a
dose vs dose comparison. Ibo does stuff like having
your soul lifted (ok ripped from your body,
happens…)by the hand of GOD and brushed off and
kissed by the Angels, to be given the understanding of
total knowledge of what it is you did and who it is
you are – no blindfolds – you see everything. Sumthin
like that… Now maybe eat a sheet of acid and it will
do the trick but you will have to ask Patrick about
that.
Ibo is all about you and you are in complete control –
even if you don’t know it (that is the trick, isn’t
it?????????). This is some soul rocking shit, no
matter how much acid I did, it didn’t make me happy,
didn’t make me use less drugs (or consider such a
thing), didn’t tell me much that I remembered when it
was over. With ibo, the lessons stay with you, are a
part of you, not some ideas that vanish when it is
over. Ibo is (or can be) like years on the couch –
well, for some a good hit of acid… I hear you and
yeah, I will give it that but ibo is far far better,
least for me.
Good luck
Brett
it unknown in the
sixties?
Otter
__________________________________
Do you Yahoo!?
The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Gamma <gammalyte9000@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: [IBOGAINE] antidote
Date: May 2, 2003 at 7:21:52 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
“(I somehow thought it was scopalamine)”
This was my toasted Purkinge cells. I mistakingly remembered scopalamine in
place of Atropine. I am not suggesting anyone take ANY amount of scopalamine
under any circumstances, whatsoever!
< R E P E A T >
I am not suggesting anyone take ANY amount of scopalamine under any
circumstances, whatsoever!
< / R E P E A T >
The person I am referring to did in fact take a test dose of atropine to
counter the “psychoactive” effects of Ibogaine, what doseage of atropine or
what doseage of ibogaine he had ingested escapes me.
— HSLotsof@aol.com wrote:
In a message dated 5/2/03 1:04:04 PM, gammalyte9000@yahoo.com writes:
I know a kind soul who assisted in ibo treatments who took it upon himself
to
test atropine (I somehow thought it was scopalamine) for effectiveness
in its
antidotal qualities with Ibogaine. he said it worked, but it was a VERY
uncomfortable experience, and in hindsight he wasn’t sure he would suggest
using atropine, it was probably easier to go through with the Ibo
experience.
I still don’t understand what antidotal qualities are being discussed? And,
what dose of scopalomine? Under no circumstances should the doses used in
preclinical (animal model studies) be used. Most likely not more than a
total dose of 1mg. My preference for the least side effects in this family
of drugs is hyoscyamine that I believe is also known as levo atropine. As to
its utility concerning ibogaine I have no knowledge whatsover.
Howard
__________________________________
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The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
http://search.yahoo.com
From: Otter60@aol.com
Subject: [ibogaine] hi, I’m new
Date: May 2, 2003 at 6:56:32 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hi, I actually subscribed to this list to get info for my daughter who is on
MMT and keeeps relapsing on benzos. She doesn’t have internet access. I
used to do LSD and other psychedleics and am wondering, from decriptions I
have read, how ibugaine is different, or is it. Was it unknown in the
sixties?
Otter
From: HSLotsof@aol.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] Re: [IBOGAINE] antidote
Date: May 2, 2003 at 3:34:00 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
In a message dated 5/2/03 1:04:04 PM, gammalyte9000@yahoo.com writes:
I know a kind soul who assisted in ibo treatments who took it upon himself
to
test atropine (I somehow thought it was scopalamine) for effectiveness
in its
antidotal qualities with Ibogaine. he said it worked, but it was a VERY
uncomfortable experience, and in hindsight he wasn’t sure he would suggest
using atropine, it was probably easier to go through with the Ibo experience.
I still don’t understand what antidotal qualities are being discussed? And,
what dose of scopalomine? Under no circumstances should the doses used in
preclinical (animal model studies) be used. Most likely not more than a
total dose of 1mg. My preference for the least side effects in this family
of drugs is hyoscyamine that I believe is also known as levo atropine. As to
its utility concerning ibogaine I have no knowledge whatsover.
Howard
From: <crownofthorns@hushmail.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] NY Times article: Earth Calling. Mr Kroupa and Mr Beal
Date: May 2, 2003 at 2:32:21 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
My only comment is, bro reality is much stranger then fiction. Patrick
you’re on some speaking tour with Dana, Grace Slick, Paul Krassner and
around Berkeley people have said that Robert Altman, Dennis Peron and
Hunter S. Thompson are added to it? Hunter S. Thompson! 🙂 Patrick,
Dana, go!!!!!
I understand that all of you are in the middle of a cloud of cannabis
smoke right now and will not be answering anything on this list. But
between the two of you Dana, Patrick, it’s the NY Times, you’re all in
it. This is as mainstream as it gets.
Not one word about ibogaine???
What happened? Neither one of you ever goes more then a few sentences
without mentioning entheogens, ibogaine or pot and PKD 😉 But all you
gave was a cyberpunk counterculture soundbite (Patrick) and Dana talks
about his building.
Both of you blew a great opportunity to get ibogaine in the NY Times.
This is the NY Times, we get it here even in San Francisco, what happened
guys? Did they cut it in some strange way? The Times is liberal enough
to run a 3 page story about you guys being nuts, but will not mention
ibogaine?
Peace out, smoke out
Curtis
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From: Gamma <gammalyte9000@yahoo.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] Re: [IBOGAINE] antidote
Date: May 2, 2003 at 1:03:22 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@lists.calyx.nl
Cc: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
I know a kind soul who assisted in ibo treatments who took it upon himself to
test atropine (I somehow thought it was scopalamine) for effectiveness in its
antidotal qualities with Ibogaine. he said it worked, but it was a VERY
uncomfortable experience, and in hindsight he wasn’t sure he would suggest
using atropine, it was probably easier to go through with the Ibo experience.
~d
— Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com> wrote:
Atropine works for removing signs of ibogaine
intoxication IN RATS but does not reduce toxicity. To
what extent/usefullness it would be in humans I have
no idea, I do not know of anyone who has tried it. The
thought of (something like)
ibogaine-atropine-glutethimide comes to mind for an
ibogaine treatment with fewer of those nasty side
effects like hallucinations – the glutethimide to
speed metabolization to nor-ibogaine and atropine to
suppress the intoxication… Just a thought. If you
follow protocol and are in good health there should be
no serious complications.
Here is one antidote I can give you. If you get the
opportunity to leave or come back, come back…
Set and setting, dark, quiet, peaceful, comfortable
(got it?) place. Slow deep breathing will calm, ginger
tea (with a little lemon and honey) helps with nausea,
yes a benzo (maybe skip it if you are a pill head…)
can help though most of the anxiety will pass once you
level off (stop going UP), this happens mostly from
ibogaine HCL. Anti-emetics (not compazine) can also
help but DO NOT MOVE is the very best thing you can do
for comfort. Mostly, be still and look inside.
Brett
— deniz-mu@popmail.com wrote:
dear list members,
i’m going to take some ibogaine and i asked my
father who is a doctor to help me with it but as he
is right with it maybe, he wanted to know what he
can use as an antidote if there occurs any
complication. it would be nice if you can help me on
that, thanks.
………………………………
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From: “preston peet” <ptpeet@nyc.rr.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] 16mm MARIJUANA Sony Bono Drug War Lies
Date: May 2, 2003 at 10:00:09 AM EDT
To: <ibogaine@mindvox.com>, <drugwar@mindvox.com>
Cc: “CRRH” <restore@crrh.org>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hey all,
Richard Metzger at Disinfo.com just wrote me to alert me to this classic
looking film. If someone gets their hands on it, I want a copy, please.
Peace,
Preston
http://cgi.ebay.com.au/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=3324216968&category=14
77
16mm MARIJUANA Sony Bono Drug War Lies
Sony Bono at his worst,
prevaricating for the federalies.
An incredible amount of untruth & disinformation
No Head, scratches but a great film.
From: jon freedlander <jfreed1@umbc.edu>
Subject: RE: [ibogaine] IN LOVE W/THE PROBLEM
Date: May 1, 2003 at 3:38:54 PM EDT
To: ibogaine <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
===== Original Message From Vittivatti@cs.com =====
Please kick me off because unsubscribe does not work on this forum for some
reason.
If I use profanities, will a moderator PLEASE throw me out ?
Talking about addiction, this forum is like a pest.
Pot, meet kettle….
From: Vittivatti@cs.com
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] IN LOVE W/THE PROBLEM
Date: May 1, 2003 at 3:36:16 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Please kick me off because unsubscribe does not work on this forum for some reason.
If I use profanities, will a moderator PLEASE throw me out ?
Talking about addiction, this forum is like a pest.
From: Brett Calabrese <bcalabrese@yahoo.com>
Subject: Re: [ibogaine] IN LOVE W/THE PROBLEM
Date: May 1, 2003 at 2:46:47 PM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Vittivatti
Hey Brett, have you tried getting off the list?
If you mean “unsubscribe”, yes.
Maybe you love being an ass.
Only in the moment.
I did not intend it to be taken so seriously “> > I am
completely innocent of doing such a thing…”, just
poking fun. I was also replying in the “spirit” of
your post…
Brett
In a message dated 4/26/2003 2:44:51 PM Eastern
Standard Time,
bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:
So why are you posting to the list/telling me,
then
unsubscribe. The instructions have been posted So
why are you posting to
the list/telling me, then
unsubscribe. The instructions have been posted ad
nauseum over and over and are included in every
email
from the list (see the header info). That is what
I
mean about people being So why are you posting to
the list/telling me, then
unsubscribe. The instructions have been posted ad
nauseum over and over and are included in every
email
from the list (see the header info). That is what
I
mean about people being in love with the problem,
the
solution is right there in front of them, tell
them
over and over but they still complain as if they
heard/read/understood nothing that was said. Of
course
I am completely innocent of doing such a thing…
Brett , the
solution is right there in front of them, tell
them
over and over but they still complain as if they
heard/read/understood nothing that was said. Of
course
I am completely innocent of doing such a thing…
Brett over and over and are included in every
email
from the list (see the header info). That is
what I
mean about people being in love with the problem,
the
solution is right there in front of them, tell
them
over and over but they still complain as if they
heard/read/understood nothing that was said. Of
course
I am completely innocent of doing such a thing…
Brett
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The New Yahoo! Search – Faster. Easier. Bingo.
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From: Jon Ludlam <seraphina@compuserve.com>
Subject: [ibogaine] IN LOVE W/THE PROBLEM
Date: May 1, 2003 at 1:41:53 PM EDT
To: “INTERNET:ibogaine@mindvox.com” <ibogaine@mindvox.com>
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Dear Vittivatti@cs.com
Brett helps people here ALL the time, lighten up a little, and I hope you
can get off the list OK, or stay on if you so decide.
Respectfully Yours,
Jon Ludlam
From: Vittivatti@cs.com
Subject: [ibogaine] IN LOVE W/THE PROBLEM
Date: May 1, 2003 at 9:53:17 AM EDT
To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Reply-To: ibogaine@mindvox.com
Hey Brett, have you tried getting off the list? Maybe you love being an ass.
In a message dated 4/26/2003 2:44:51 PM Eastern Standard Time, bcalabrese@yahoo.com writes:
So why are you posting to the list/telling me, then
unsubscribe. The instructions have been posted So why are you posting to the list/telling me, then
unsubscribe. The instructions have been posted ad
nauseum over and over and are included in every email
>from the list (see the header info). That is what I
mean about people being So why are you posting to the list/telling me, then
unsubscribe. The instructions have been posted ad
nauseum over and over and are included in every email
>from the list (see the header info). That is what I
mean about people being in love with the problem, the
solution is right there in front of them, tell them
over and over but they still complain as if they
heard/read/understood nothing that was said. Of course
I am completely innocent of doing such a thing…
Brett , the
solution is right there in front of them, tell them
over and over but they still complain as if they
heard/read/understood nothing that was said. Of course
I am completely innocent of doing such a thing…
Brett over and over and are included in every email
>from the list (see the header info). That is what I
mean about people being in love with the problem, the
solution is right there in front of them, tell them
over and over but they still complain as if they
heard/read/understood nothing that was said. Of course
I am completely innocent of doing such a thing…
Brett